diff --git "a/clean/10M/bnc_spoken.txt" "b/clean/10M/bnc_spoken.txt" --- "a/clean/10M/bnc_spoken.txt" +++ "b/clean/10M/bnc_spoken.txt" @@ -11,7 +11,7 @@ one thing that has not been taken up very thoroughly at this stage is the questi so many children can be put off mathematics at the primary level, and it's important this doesn't happen. it's also important that erm children at primary level do learn something of calculators and the technology of mathematics. they see them at home, it's all around them, but the use of calculators for example has not really been built yet widely into the curriculum for primary schools, so that is an area that we shall be having a look at. -and you're not worried that the use of calculators at too early a stage would make a child quite incapable of understanding what addition and multiplication and so forth is +and you're not worried that the use of calculators at too early a stage would make a child quite incapable of understanding what addition and multiplication and so forth is well of course there, there is this worry, and, and they have to be used erm properly and in a helpful way. i think erm certainly for a child to rely entirely on a calculator for all mathematical operations would be a disastrous thing. on the other hand, used aright, it can help very much in the understanding of mathematical operations, because far more many and widespread examples can be dealt with very quickly, and they can for example erm get a feel of the result of multiplying or dividing or whatever it, it is, numbers of quite different sizes. @@ -22,7 +22,7 @@ and this is terrible. what about the skills which are very important but don't come as a formal part of any subject, the so-called communication skills? are you thinking about those at all? yes. -i, i'm sorry to keep saying ‘yes’ to everything that you're, you're suggesting, but yes, we are thinking about communication skills, particularly the encouraging and helping children to learn to write properly, i don't mean calligraphy, i mean actually write and express themselves on paper, oral communication, and things of this kind are things that we do want to pay attention to. +i, i'm sorry to keep saying ‘yes’ to everything that you're, you're suggesting, but yes, we are thinking about communication skills, particularly the encouraging and helping children to learn to write properly, i don't mean calligraphy, i mean actually write and express themselves on paper, oral communication, and things of this kind are things that we do want to pay attention to. i should perhaps explain in the context of your various questions when i say that erm we do want to become involved in these things, that, at this stage, and we've only held two meetings, we have just identified themes and general areas in which we want to work, and not precise projects or activities. that will be the next stage we shall be working on over the next half-year or so, and what we do want to do is to seek the help of all the local authorities and teachers in this work, because one should perhaps put things into context, we're a committee of twenty-two people, we have a staff, which when they're all fully employed they'll be about fifty, we have a budget of two million, but we have got to communicate with something like four hundred to five hundred thousand teachers, something like erm five thousand secondary schools and twenty-six thousand primary schools. so it is a major problem, this communication, and so we do have to work with local authorities, with teacher organisations, anyone who can help us in this task. @@ -58,7 +58,7 @@ in fact, we do run a project which looks at the ways science can be taught in th for most young children in that age group, the world's a magic place and we traditionally like to teach them nature study and flowers and cuddly hamsters and rabbits in school, and that's the nature table syndrome, and that's great and i'm not knocking that at all. there is so much opportunity for children to look at the nature of the physical world around them which isn't taken advantage of, and which could be, and i think that may have something to do with the attitude of teachers as much as the attitude of children. but erm they're tremendously curious about the nature of the world around them and they're certainly capable of, if not understanding why, exploring what. -i took my godson, dominic robinson, round my laboratory the other day, which is a physics laboratory, and he enjoyed it immensely and asked a number of questions, and was absolutely intrigued and fascinated by the various bits of wires and plugs and so on like that, and he asked me the sort of questions that i don't think i would expect sometimes my undergraduates to ask. +i took my godson, dominic robinson, round my laboratory the other day, which is a physics laboratory, and he enjoyed it immensely and asked a number of questions, and was absolutely intrigued and fascinated by the various bits of wires and plugs and so on like that, and he asked me the sort of questions that i don't think i would expect sometimes my undergraduates to ask. they were perhaps stemmed from innocence, but they were very searching and very real questions, and he was obviously very excited to ask them and to listen to some of the answers. do you think we perhaps put kids off an interest in science by our sort of insistence that they have to have a solid understanding of newton's laws and all sorts of principles, and we lose the magic too early? yes, i'm sure we do, and i think that's to do with our notions of what science is. @@ -72,7 +72,7 @@ the problem, of course, is most of us couldn't give a sensible reply to the very that's not the children's mistake, that's ours, because we couldn't actually for the best part respond in a meaningful way. and in another sense what we don't do often is to actually recognize the significance of the child's question because of the language he puts it in. he asks something which, you know, i mean the way they do, what is life, and you wouldn't know — unless you're perhaps trained or awake to the significance of what the child is actually asking — you wouldn't know how to respond to that, so you tend to put it off. -you mentioned that schools are quite good at biology, that they have guinea pigs and they have growing plants and so forth, and i think you hinted at the fact that they perhaps are not quite so good at maybe the harder sciences, we might call them, of physics and chemistry. +you mentioned that schools are quite good at biology, that they have guinea pigs and they have growing plants and so forth, and i think you hinted at the fact that they perhaps are not quite so good at maybe the harder sciences, we might call them, of physics and chemistry. is that the case and, if so, what can we do about it at an early stage? i believe that is the case, and i believe that again is a reflection of us as adults erm and not an indictment of teachers. they show great pedagogic skills in almost every aspect of school life. @@ -85,7 +85,7 @@ at sussex we actually make a third of the time they spend on the university comp our own experience from several of the projects that we've been looking at which are in-service type projects, is that when we do train teachers and when we do put an investment in it, we see the pay-off in the schools that physical science does get done in schools, it is fun and it is exciting. it's when the teachers think this is a boring, mundane, difficult thing to do, then that tends to be put over to the children and of course the disaster is that the children will believe it, and it if the children will believe it then we grow up in a highly technological society producing very few technologists or scientists. what you describe does sound a little bit like a chicken and egg situation from the point of view that i think you were saying that erm many teachers are ill-equipped, actually, to teach erm physics, perhaps, and chemistry, whereas they are a little bit better able to get across fundamental ideas in biology, and in a sense because of this they are going to produce another generation who perhaps have very ill-founded ideas of these basic sciences and so on and so forth, and somehow one's got to cut into this cycle and actually improve it, improve the output somehow. -yes, the chicken and egg syndrome is interesting because and i agree it is a viscious circle, but in fact you don't make new omelettes unless you do break some eggs, and i think the time has come to break some eggs and i think that's what i'm advocating is that it will come from the teacher because the teacher is the guiding light of what happens in the classroom, and if the teacher has it in the back of their mind there will be no science, then there will be no science. +yes, the chicken and egg syndrome is interesting because and i agree it is a viscious circle, but in fact you don't make new omelettes unless you do break some eggs, and i think the time has come to break some eggs and i think that's what i'm advocating is that it will come from the teacher because the teacher is the guiding light of what happens in the classroom, and if the teacher has it in the back of their mind there will be no science, then there will be no science. if, on the other hand, the teacher has it in the back of their mind always to be aware of the possibility of bringing into the work that's going on in the classroom and bringing all they're usually very excellent pedagogic skills to bear on it, aspects of the physical sciences, so that the children can get an early and meaningful introduction to it, then it will happen. the question is how do you break into the cycle and make that happen, and i think the answer is, as i said, in two ways — one by making teachers more aware during their period of initial training, either at college or at university or polytechnic, and secondly by looking very carefully at the amount and type of in-service training erm that goes on for teachers once they've left college and are in the schools. essentially what you're saying is that a teacher who's actually teaching you ought to be able to say to that teacher ‘look, here's a package, if you like, that you can insert into your range of skills, and these are of things that you can do with children which are worthwhile doing and fairly easily for you to acquire skills yourself, and they will be very good and helpful for the children’. @@ -96,13 +96,13 @@ christmas is coming up and there are chemistry sets in the shops. do these make good gifts from a scientific point of view? well they're a lot of fun and kids love them. as i commented a little earlier to somebody, i still haven't quite forgiven my mother-in-law for the chemistry set she bought my seven-year-old. -he is absolutely amazed by it and spends lots of time in a garage at the back, which actually means that i spend an awful lot of time in that garage in the cold too! -yes, they are good sets and they do they are exciting for children. +he is absolutely amazed by it and spends lots of time in a garage at the back, which actually means that i spend an awful lot of time in that garage in the cold too! +yes, they are good sets and they do they are exciting for children. they do enjoy them and they do make good use of them. quite often they need a lot of erm time spent by the parent with the child, and if the parent's happy with that they're fine. none of them, or very few of them, if you buy a good quality one is dangerous. it's very important, i think, that erm you match the age of the child to the age which is written on the box, because then the child will actually be handling materials that he can physically handle and ideas that he can physically cope with or intellectually cope with. -so they are probably very useful erm toys, educational toys, to have in the home, but i think for the child to get the maximum from them they do he often does require an adult with him. +so they are probably very useful erm toys, educational toys, to have in the home, but i think for the child to get the maximum from them they do he often does require an adult with him. how about electronic kits and circuits? are they worthwhile, would you say? yes, they are; they are very much. @@ -129,7 +129,7 @@ yes, if i could just extend it a little. i feel that it shows itself in the contrast between the child's — we're talking about children for the moment, although obviously there are dyslexic adults — it shows itself in the contrast between the person's ability to express him or herself in words and their ability to put it down on paper and to read it off paper, and it's this contrast which often arouses one's suspicions that there might be some problem and, having gone into it a little, we find that it stems from a failure of the sensory motor system — the brain isn't processing the information it's receiving through the ear and eye. how would you both respond to a common allegation that dyslexia is a middle class disease? i think that's a very unfair kind of criticism. -i've not had the experience perhaps of teaching so many dyslexic children to be able to comment on this, but certainly when i was making the videotape at brickwall school and i asked the headmaster about that and he pointed to the fact that they certainly have a very wide intake, a complete social mix, and professor miles at bangor university says that in his experience of dealing with dyslexic children they come from all walks of life, and it's really quite inaccurate — i suppose there's a sense in which, if we've got to use these phrases, that middle class people have always been very concerned about the education of their children and so they may be the parents who will ask questions about their children's lack of development, but i think it's only, you know, more significant in middle class terms because of that. +i've not had the experience perhaps of teaching so many dyslexic children to be able to comment on this, but certainly when i was making the videotape at brickwall school and i asked the headmaster about that and he pointed to the fact that they certainly have a very wide intake, a complete social mix, and professor miles at bangor university says that in his experience of dealing with dyslexic children they come from all walks of life, and it's really quite inaccurate — i suppose there's a sense in which, if we've got to use these phrases, that middle class people have always been very concerned about the education of their children and so they may be the parents who will ask questions about their children's lack of development, but i think it's only, you know, more significant in middle class terms because of that. dave, what's your response? yes, i agree absolutely with reg there. i've come across, and still regularly do come across, people of all ages, both sexes and all social classes, who have this kind of problem. @@ -144,7 +144,7 @@ no, i'm afraid i didn't. the p g c is a difficult course to fill, really, for the people who are organising it, because although it's called a one-year course, in fact it lasts eight months in practice, and there are so many aspects that have to be fitted in something has to go. it's difficult enough, i think, to fit enough work on ordinary reading, if you like, let alone specific problems. i went into dyslexia because when i did that course we had the opportunity to do a special study of a subject of our own choice and i spent a lot of time on dyslexia because i was already interested in it before i started. -but suppose now suppose i were a middle-aged to elderly teacher who had never come across dyslexia until recently and was now aware that he or she had dyslexic pupils, the first thing to do, i think, is to inform yourself. +but suppose now suppose i were a middle-aged to elderly teacher who had never come across dyslexia until recently and was now aware that he or she had dyslexic pupils, the first thing to do, i think, is to inform yourself. there are courses that one can do, extra post-experience courses once can follow. the dyslexia institute is a mine of information. local dyslexia associations are also full of information, and there are by now quite a lot of books which have been published which are — both for parents and teachers — which are veyr easy to follow and don't necessarily involve one in many evenings and weekends of cudgelling the brain. @@ -177,16 +177,16 @@ they may be seeing hs, or backwards s backwards h, or backwards h backwards s reg, can you add to any practical teaching suggestions? one point i'd just like to add to what david was just saying there was that when you were talking about those orientation problems, when we were making the film of the children at brickwall, what was brought home to me very strongly was that these sort of problems can arise in mathematics, as well as in reading. if you think about the problems that there are with mathematics, whereby it's not just a question of scanning print from left to right, but that you were involved in processes where sometimes you're moving from left to right and sometimes from right to left, sometimes vertically. -dyslexic children can have difficulties as far as of mathematics as well as reading. +dyslexic children can have difficulties as far as of mathematics as well as reading. what changes in the teacher training curriculum would you both like to see in order to improve teacher recognition of learning difficulties? the first thing to do is to have a major component of the reading section to include dyslexia, with erm instruction of trainee teachers, not only in how to recognise the problem, but also how to do something about it, and how to use the education system to bring support for parents and pupils. yes, i think that as david said one of the things that we've been working at very hard in recent years in teacher training is to try to improve the quality and the content of reading courses generally, and then i think it is also necessary to draw attention to teachers of this problem of dyslexia. i favour the notion that it often should be more detailed work on dyslexia as probably can be done in the postexperience courses. -i think that teachers need to know people that they can turn to for further advice, but that they could familiarize themselves much more with what, as it were, they can do in the first instance by screening children, by using there are number of published materials, learning inventories, that can be used to discover whether a child has some difficulties that might point in this direction of dyslexia. +i think that teachers need to know people that they can turn to for further advice, but that they could familiarize themselves much more with what, as it were, they can do in the first instance by screening children, by using there are number of published materials, learning inventories, that can be used to discover whether a child has some difficulties that might point in this direction of dyslexia. for example, aston university have published some very helpful materials to help teachers in the classroom identify these difficulties. now i've used that as an illustration because i think these are some of the best materials that have been produced in this country, but there are other learning inventories and tests which can be used to help teachers find out whether they think that children have got these dyslexic difficulties. could i just add something also there, that training of teachers, after they've done their initial training is becoming increasingly cut, of course, by the government. -it is all very well for us to sit here and tell teachers to go on extra courses, but they're finding that there aren't any left, so the next thing that they can turn to the next person they can turn to is the educational psychologist. +it is all very well for us to sit here and tell teachers to go on extra courses, but they're finding that there aren't any left, so the next thing that they can turn to the next person they can turn to is the educational psychologist. there is one for every school, of course, and this psychologist should have had more training in perceptual handicaps than an ordinary classroom teacher, and should be available to help assess the child and give advice to teachers and parents about how to help them. many thanks to reg james and dave pollock. next week on ideas in action we'll discuss some of the options open to the parents of dyslexic children. @@ -268,7 +268,7 @@ last week, for example we were looking at the mind boggling distances that we en today we travel to the other extreme and enter the microscopic world of the atom and its nucleus. jim byrne is a physicist who work as the university. i recently asked him how large an atom is. -well, of course, there are big atoms and small atoms hydrogen is a very small atom, uranium is a big atom — but something of the order of ten to the minus eight of a centimetre. +well, of course, there are big atoms and small atoms hydrogen is a very small atom, uranium is a big atom — but something of the order of ten to the minus eight of a centimetre. roughly a hundred million atoms per centimetre. so that means if you could line up a hundred million atoms you'd just reach one centimetre? just about one centimetre for relatively small atoms, yes. @@ -318,7 +318,7 @@ somehow or other your miond analyzes the light that it receives from these bodie in a sense you can do the same thing, of course, with erm elementary particles like neutrons and protons, but the process of interpretation is much more complicated. continuing our journey to ever smaller particles, can we break up the pye meson into anything smaller? well you don't actually have to do that with the pye meson because if it erm if you have a pye meson it just breaks up itself. -if erm, for example, i were to produce a beam of pye mesons, which i can do by taking very high energy protons and making them collide with ordinary hydrogen, then the pyon will come out and it will not live for very long, and i think the lifetime of a pyon is something of the order of ten to the minus eight of a second, which means that pyons only live for about one hundred millionth of a second, and these things then decay into othe particles and these other particles are called muons and they decay into not only do they produce muons, but they produce things called neutrinos and the muons themselves do not live for very long — a muon lives for about two microseconds, which is two millionths of a second — and it decays also into an electron and another neutral particle called a neutrionor, and these neutrinors just are there, they exist very but they are the end products of these decay processes. +if erm, for example, i were to produce a beam of pye mesons, which i can do by taking very high energy protons and making them collide with ordinary hydrogen, then the pyon will come out and it will not live for very long, and i think the lifetime of a pyon is something of the order of ten to the minus eight of a second, which means that pyons only live for about one hundred millionth of a second, and these things then decay into othe particles and these other particles are called muons and they decay into not only do they produce muons, but they produce things called neutrinos and the muons themselves do not live for very long — a muon lives for about two microseconds, which is two millionths of a second — and it decays also into an electron and another neutral particle called a neutrionor, and these neutrinors just are there, they exist very but they are the end products of these decay processes. you mentioned, very straightforwardly, experiments to find these particles — in fact aren't the experiments rather complicated and requiring big, expensive bits of equipment? to produce things like pyons, yes, they are. you see the thing is produce something like a pyon you have to create enough energy to make it, and in order to create enough energy the you have to produce particles colliding at very high speeds, and in order to produce these particles you have to accelerate them. @@ -350,7 +350,7 @@ that's a matter of guesswork. i don't think anybody knows the answer to that. i imagine that we will. i mean in the past in has always turned out that what people have thought to be elementary turns out never to be elementary. -i mean at one stage we go back a hundred years — back to dalton he thought of his atoms as being fundamental entities that could never be broken up, whereas now we know that an atom is a very complicated structure and we can measure things about atoms, we can measure the distribution, we can where the electrons and so on are. +i mean at one stage we go back a hundred years — back to dalton he thought of his atoms as being fundamental entities that could never be broken up, whereas now we know that an atom is a very complicated structure and we can measure things about atoms, we can measure the distribution, we can where the electrons and so on are. nuclei — there's been a tremendous amount of work done on nuclei. we know the shapes of nuclei. we know there are round ones, there are long thin ones, there are cigar shaped ones, there are disc shaped ones. @@ -415,7 +415,7 @@ yes, that's right. it would be very difficult even to to get to the nearest start. it would take many thousands of years. now light, presumably erm one of the reasons one chooses a light year as a unit or a distance is because it's a convenient number, but also presumably because it doesn't change very much with any physical factor. -i mean light is travels at a pretty constant speed, doesn't it? +i mean light is travels at a pretty constant speed, doesn't it? that's right. in fact the speed of light is now defined to be a constant. so that's a good starting point. @@ -457,7 +457,7 @@ so the distance makes something look rather fainter, and similarly if you have s what happens, robert, if the stars aren't actually fixed distance, but they're actually moving, either towards us or away from us. doesn't that mess up you approach? it does, but the stars, although they're moving fast by terrestrial standards, are moving very slowly by comparison with the vast distances we're talking about, and they don't change their distances by very much in the time that we're watching. -so what about the things that we occasionally hear of colour shifts and so on— is that relevant to what we're talking about at the moment? +so what about the things that we occasionally hear of colour shifts and so on— is that relevant to what we're talking about at the moment? that is a way of measuring the speeds at which stars and galaxies are moving away from us. the effect here is similar to listening to a train whistle. as the train goes past erm you get a note that goes . @@ -466,7 +466,7 @@ do we actually have blue shift stars? i've heard of red shifts. oh yes. we have both do we? -stars near the sun have both well some have blue shifts and some have red shifts, so they're moving in all directions relative to the sun. +stars near the sun have both well some have blue shifts and some have red shifts, so they're moving in all directions relative to the sun. all right, now we've got pretty well way out — have we been able to reach the furthest objects in space by these methods, or are we stil stuck for a method? well, by an extension of the this standard light bulb method you can get most of the way into the universe. the nearby galaxies you can reach using a kind of special variable star. @@ -485,7 +485,7 @@ would you ever reach an end? would you ever reach a boundary? that's disputed at the moment. erm i think the consensus is that you wouldn't — that either space is infinite, or at the very least it it's finite it has no edge, so if you went in one direction for long enough you would come back in the other direction. -robert, the mind literally boggles at those distances mine does, anyway. +robert, the mind literally boggles at those distances mine does, anyway. so does mine. thank you very much. i'd love to talk to you more about this, but i'm afraid that's all that we have time for today. @@ -525,11 +525,11 @@ are there occasions when there are other opportunities for kids to meet universi well again the science area as a whole puts out a very large list of lecture titles, which it is prepared to deliver in schools. now this is very much a voluntary activity on the part of those who give the lectures, but neverthless we have an extremely large list, right across the science area, of lecture titles and lecturers, people who are prepared to go out and do this in schools, and of course they get an opportunity to meet teachers and students in schools in this way. you talk about a large list erm how many possible lectures are there on the list? -oh, i should say of the four science schools on average we've got maybe thirty or forty titles from each, so that's about well certainly well over a hundred titles altogether. +oh, i should say of the four science schools on average we've got maybe thirty or forty titles from each, so that's about well certainly well over a hundred titles altogether. and how many schools avail themselves of this opportunity each year? it's a little bit variable, i think, from our own science school — one science school to another — and from year to year, but i would say maybe twenty or thirty for each science school. and any school can get a lecturer to come out, subject to availability of course, to give one of these? -well we generally aim to have i suppose most of our lectures at an a level standard, but we have a significant number for those doing o level, indeed some lectures which can be tailored for either, so anybody very mucg below o level we probably couldn't cater for — i think probably because we wouldn't feel competent, rather than because we don't want to do it. +well we generally aim to have i suppose most of our lectures at an a level standard, but we have a significant number for those doing o level, indeed some lectures which can be tailored for either, so anybody very mucg below o level we probably couldn't cater for — i think probably because we wouldn't feel competent, rather than because we don't want to do it. so some of the lectures are actually aimed at a level students. certainly, yes. others at o level students. @@ -612,7 +612,7 @@ well, the studies that i've been involved in, the computer has performed certain it sounds to me as if it could be a bit worrying to think that when you went to see your doctor you'd be faced by a machine instead of a human being the other side of desk. well there are two answers to that i suppose. one is that we're certainly nowhere near that. -all of the uses that i know of diagnostic computers are involve the doctor talking to the patient, looking at the patient, taking symptoms and then going and using the computer in a similar way that we perhaps might go and ask for an x-ray. +all of the uses that i know of diagnostic computers are involve the doctor talking to the patient, looking at the patient, taking symptoms and then going and using the computer in a similar way that we perhaps might go and ask for an x-ray. the other answer is that erm certainly some trials have been done with patients not being diagnosed by a computer, but by giving initial information like their age, their date of birth, erm where the pain is, etc. erm actually interacting themselves with the computer, and studies have shown curiously that patients actually prefer to use a computer rather than to give this information to a doctor. now why this should be, i don't know. whether it's because they feel they're not taking up the valuable time of a doctor, they can go at their own pace, who knows? @@ -620,7 +620,7 @@ but certainly it may even be that people might, in the future, even prefer to ta that sounds absolutely fascinating. i suppose one advantage of a computer is that it can store and remember a great deal of information. yes. -the if i can talk perhaps a little bit about the particular system that i'm interested in, the way it works is that it well it diagnoses abdominal pain; if you go into the erm particular casualty department — in the fact the royal sussex county hospital at the moment — with back pain in your abdomen, lower abdomen, then the symptoms will be taken by a doctor and he will then go to the diagnostic computer and feed these symptoms in. +the if i can talk perhaps a little bit about the particular system that i'm interested in, the way it works is that it well it diagnoses abdominal pain; if you go into the erm particular casualty department — in the fact the royal sussex county hospital at the moment — with back pain in your abdomen, lower abdomen, then the symptoms will be taken by a doctor and he will then go to the diagnostic computer and feed these symptoms in. these cover a large range of things, like the patient's age, the patient's sex, where the pain is, where it started, how quickly it came on, and so on and so forth, and essentially within the computer has a large table, and this table contains, how shall i put it, the frequency with which this particular symptom was associated with a particular disease over the last few hundred patients that have been seen at that hospital. it's very limited. it only deals with the acute abdomen. @@ -635,7 +635,7 @@ is there anything special about this sort of computer? is it an ordinary digital computer of the sort that's used in commerce and industry, or is it a special type of computer. is it the program or is it the computer that's specific? it's the program that's very specific to this problem. -erm the one at the royal sussex is perhaps interesting, in that in fact it's the computer is based on a microprocessor, so it really is using the latest erm in advanced microtechnology. +erm the one at the royal sussex is perhaps interesting, in that in fact it's the computer is based on a microprocessor, so it really is using the latest erm in advanced microtechnology. the computer itself is a box, oh what, a foot and a half by a foot by two feet, very small. erm but it's the program, yes, it's the application of complex programs to thee very sophisticated but very small computers, i think, which is of interest in this particular case. mhm and how many places in this country are computers actually used in diagnosis? @@ -650,21 +650,21 @@ yes, certainly, the erm place where such diagnostic systems came from, i think, you do this research in collaboration with the royal sussex hospital. is that where the idea came from originally? the original idea came from a doctor dedombar in leeds. -this his system was implemented in one or two places, including edinburgh, and our current ideas essentially came from edinburgh, from bangor hospital near edinburgh. +this his system was implemented in one or two places, including edinburgh, and our current ideas essentially came from edinburgh, from bangor hospital near edinburgh. the consultant down here who got interested is a mr philip somerville, who's a senior consultant at the royal sussex. he visited edinburgh, saw what they were doing there, liked it and decided to see whether it could be done at sussex and approached the university through the bi-medical engineering group, of which i'm a member, and i was interested. -we did a lot of talking, of course, and then it was decided that we could possibly raise some money by going to the league of friends, which we did, and they very generously provided well in fact the whole total is about five thousand pounds, of which three and a half thousands represents the computer, and we're about to go live, as it were , in a week or two. +we did a lot of talking, of course, and then it was decided that we could possibly raise some money by going to the league of friends, which we did, and they very generously provided well in fact the whole total is about five thousand pounds, of which three and a half thousands represents the computer, and we're about to go live, as it were , in a week or two. so far we've only had particular doctors using it to run it in, as it were, but in the very near future we hope that all of the doctors in the accident department will be using this system. do you have a medical background at all? none whatsoever. so you do have to rely very heavily on collaboration with the local doctors? oh indeed. -this is one very good aspect of such projects, i think, that the interesting work is to be done at the interface between one discipline — medicine in this case and another discipline — computer science — where both people just have to learn to talk to each other in their own language. +this is one very good aspect of such projects, i think, that the interesting work is to be done at the interface between one discipline — medicine in this case and another discipline — computer science — where both people just have to learn to talk to each other in their own language. that's part of the problem in doing such research, certainly. do you think that it could ever be true that they would be sufficiently inexpensive that they could be used in most doctors' surgeries, or is it going to be something which is only used in one or two important hospitals? oh no. i think expense certainly won't be a problem. -i can very well see such prices going down and down and down well certainly to several hundred pounds. +i can very well see such prices going down and down and down well certainly to several hundred pounds. in particular, if one started to make such systems much more, how shall i put it,tailor the electronics to the purpose, then the cost could be quite low. at the moment we're dealing with a general purpose system, which is designed for all sorts of applications, and one pays for having a thing general purpose by costing more money. certainly it's feasible to have them in g ps surgeries. @@ -681,7 +681,7 @@ if i see this and if i see that, then that means something else, and that someth this is the way that people think, people reason. this isn't the way that the current system reasons, and i would certainly like to take the current system and push it in this direction of being more expert in a human sense. i think one of the great areas of such as system is in teaching young doctors, in training people, and an expert who can't tell a tutee why he has given a certain answer isn't really much good as a teacher. -i think to be a good teaching aid something has to say ‘well i think this because’ and, as it were, retrace the chain of reasoning that i've just the sort of chain that i've given you. +i think to be a good teaching aid something has to say ‘well i think this because’ and, as it were, retrace the chain of reasoning that i've just the sort of chain that i've given you. so that, i think, is where this research ought to go, into truly expert systems rather than in statistical machines, which is what it is at the moment. so what you would see is the machine, as it were, engaging the patient in a much more perhaps conversational mode and with much more feedback and response to the way in which the patient is answering the questions or behaving, rather than just, as it were , a machine which elicits information from the patient and compares it with a statistical set of data. yes, whether one would ever actually get such a system interacting with a patient is difficult to foresee. @@ -696,16 +696,16 @@ that being so, the only way to get more computing power to attack any given prob a particular research project that i and two colleagues, keith baker and erin sloman, have a grant from the science research council for is to look first of all at the problems of getting such as system with, well at the moment three but possibly up to twelve computers, working on a given existing artificial intelligence problem to see how to take this big program — it's called popeye — it's a research project to study various areas of visual perception, as you say — to see how to break this down and have it running simultaneously on a number of much smaller computers, rather than on the single big computer that it's running on at the moment. the second half of the project is concerned really with how on earth we get such program to work, such programs are very complicated, they interact in various odd ways, and getting the bugs out, getting the problems out or debugging as the jargon has it, is a really serious problem and we hope to make some advance on the problem of erm developing programs for such distributed multi-processor systems. thank you very much, jim, for talking about this research. -however, we're going to examine quite a different area how computer can help librarians to make better use of their stock. +however, we're going to examine quite a different area how computer can help librarians to make better use of their stock. peter stone is a librarian at the university. peter, how useful have you found the computer in our library? well, first of all i suppose one should say that we don't just use one computer, we, like lots of other libraries, have got access to a large number of computers, and indeed you'll find these computers being used elsewhere for the same sort of work. probably most people have seen displays of prestel, even in television rental shops, which is a system running through the post office network, accessing large amounts of mainly factual information — things like telephone directories, like timetables, like oh a lot of business information. -that's very effective if you're dealing with factual information which is changing fairly rapidly, and i think we'll see quite a growth of that in the next few years, but libraries aren't just stores of factual information, they store a large number of books and articles and they need access to that too, and probably the most typical external use of a computer in libraries in a university library, or academic library, these days is to access the huge stores of information on scientific publishing. +that's very effective if you're dealing with factual information which is changing fairly rapidly, and i think we'll see quite a growth of that in the next few years, but libraries aren't just stores of factual information, they store a large number of books and articles and they need access to that too, and probably the most typical external use of a computer in libraries in a university library, or academic library, these days is to access the huge stores of information on scientific publishing. there's one gigantic computer in california, which has got access to a hundred databases there called the stores of information, compiled mainly by the publishers of journals. it's got thirty million articles in it and you can find information, pull out articles relevant to your needs by looking for authors, looking for words in the text, and you can look at the summary of the article very quickly. in both prestel and those sorts of things as you use the system you pay, and you pay for the telecommunications cost, you pay for the computer cost and you pay for the information that you receive, and that sort of worthwhile sharing of information, i am sure, is going to grow. -however, my own interest, perhaps, is more in what a library, a typical library — not just a university library can do with its own computer, and most of our readers, most of the people who use libraries, expect to find books in those libraries and expect to find them when they want them, and our interests have been angled very much towards improving that sort of service. +however, my own interest, perhaps, is more in what a library, a typical library — not just a university library can do with its own computer, and most of our readers, most of the people who use libraries, expect to find books in those libraries and expect to find them when they want them, and our interests have been angled very much towards improving that sort of service. so there's a sense in which you use a computer for all sorts of different purposes. you use a computer when books are issued, for example? yes. @@ -727,7 +727,7 @@ we've chosen to go it alone, but the net result is the same, that the computer s mhm and i suppose in the old days if you actually wanted to know which books were popular and which books were not used at all you had to send a librarian to painstakingly look through the shelves, perhaps, and look at the date stamps or something like that, whereas now it's presumably just a question of pressing a few buttons and the information comes. well right. in the old days we simply couldn't afford to do that. -we're not dealing with a thousand items, we're dealing with four hundred and fifty thousand items, and for anyone to go and collect that information on a larger scale even sampling it would have been almost unthinkable. +we're not dealing with a thousand items, we're dealing with four hundred and fifty thousand items, and for anyone to go and collect that information on a larger scale even sampling it would have been almost unthinkable. now the computer can collect this sort of information as people borrow the books, as a sort of by-product if you like. the book is lent, it needs to be known when it's gone out, when it's due back, but the computer can clock up one. that bit of information adds to other bits of information, all within the central store. @@ -763,7 +763,7 @@ orders came in, and that helped the warehouse unpack the boxes and despatch them the information got fed back to the editor to tell him what the sales were. it was a continuous process, and all of the people tended to see the computer as working very much for them rather than for the other department next door. and presumably if you wanted to revise a book at all and you had the book on your floppy disk or in your computer in some form, you could again use your word processor to bring it up to date in a revised version? -well that is i think everyone who's ever worked on computers, editing or word processing, has been very fascinated by the change of attitude that they've had, that somehow it isn't finished, it's never finished. +well that is i think everyone who's ever worked on computers, editing or word processing, has been very fascinated by the change of attitude that they've had, that somehow it isn't finished, it's never finished. previously you could ask someone to type up first draft, second draft, maybe a third draft, but how far can you drive your secretary — and now they can be wholly in charge of this. they can change the layout of it as much as the words within it. they can ask colleagues to come in and comment and you can add a little bit. @@ -777,7 +777,7 @@ hello. in our ideas in action programme i shall be talking to dr mike king about teaching science to very young children in schools. i shall be asking him questions such as‘is it a good idea for parents to encourage their children to become interested in science by buying them toys, such as a chemistry sets, for christmas’. well they're a lot of fun and kids love them, and as i commented a little earlier to somebody i still haven't quite forgiven my mother-in-law for the chemistry set she bought my seven year old. -he is absolutely amazed by it and spends lots of time in the garage and the back, which actually means that i spend an awful lot of time in that garage in the cold too. +he is absolutely amazed by it and spends lots of time in the garage and the back, which actually means that i spend an awful lot of time in that garage in the cold too. there is an exhibition of science carried out by children in first schools in brighton and hove at the booth museum, dyke road, this week. it's open to the public on tuesday, wednesday, and friday. hello. @@ -794,7 +794,7 @@ in fact, we do run a project which looks at the ways science can be taught in th for most young children in that age group, the world's a magic place and we traditionally like to teach them nature study and flowers and cuddly hamsters and rabbits in school, and that's the nature table syndrome, and that's great and i'm not knocking that at all. there is so much opportunity for children to look at the nature of the physical world around them which isn't taken advantage of, and which could be, and i think that may have something to do with the attitude of teachers as much as the attitude of children. but erm they're tremendously curious about the nature of the world around them and they're certainly capable of, if not understanding why, exploring what. -i took my godson, dominic robinson, round my laboratory the other day, which is a physics laboratory, and he enjoyed it immensely and asked a number of questions, and was absolutely intrigued and fascinated by the various bits of wires and plugs and so on like that, and he asked me the sort of questions that i don't think i would expect sometimes my undergraduates to ask. +i took my godson, dominic robinson, round my laboratory the other day, which is a physics laboratory, and he enjoyed it immensely and asked a number of questions, and was absolutely intrigued and fascinated by the various bits of wires and plugs and so on like that, and he asked me the sort of questions that i don't think i would expect sometimes my undergraduates to ask. they were perhaps stemmed from innocence, but they were very searching and very real questions, and he was obviously very excited to ask them and to listen to some of the answers. do you think we perhaps put kids off an interest in science by our sort of insistence that they have to have a solid understanding of newton's laws and all sorts of principles, and we lose the magic too early? yes, i'm sure we do, and i think that's to do with our notions of what science is. @@ -808,7 +808,7 @@ the problem, of course, is most of us couldn't give a sensible reply to the very that's not the children's mistake, that's ours, because we couldn't actually for the best part respond in a meaningful way. and in another sense what we don't do often is to actually recognize the significance of the child's question because of the language he puts it in. he asks something which, you know, i mean the way they do, what is life, and you wouldn't know — unless you're perhaps trained or awake to the significance of what the child is actually asking — you wouldn't know how to respond to that, so you tend to put it off. -you mentioned that schools are quite good at biology, that they have guinea pigs and they have growing plants and so forth, and i think you hinted at the fact that they perhaps are not quite so good at maybe the harder sciences, we might call them, of physics and chemistry. +you mentioned that schools are quite good at biology, that they have guinea pigs and they have growing plants and so forth, and i think you hinted at the fact that they perhaps are not quite so good at maybe the harder sciences, we might call them, of physics and chemistry. is that the case and, if so, what can we do about it at an early stage? i believe that is the case, and i believe that again is a reflection of us as adults erm and not an indictment of teachers. they show great pedagogic skills in almost every aspect of school life. @@ -821,7 +821,7 @@ at sussex we actually make a third of the time they spend on the university comp our own experience from several of the projects that we've been looking at which are in-service type projects, is that when we do train teachers and when we do put an investment in it, we see the pay-off in the schools that physical science does get done in schools, it is fun and it is exciting. it's when the teachers think this is a boring, mundane, difficult thing to do, then that tends to be put over to the children and of course the disaster is that the children will believe it, and it if the children will believe it then we grow up in a highly technological society producing very few technologists or scientists. what you describe does sound a little bit like a chicken and egg situation from the point of view that i think you were saying that erm many teachers are ill-equipped, actually, to teach erm physics, perhaps, and chemistry, whereas they are a little bit better able to get across fundamental ideas in biology, and in a sense because of this they are going to produce another generation who perhaps have very ill-founded ideas of these basic sciences and so on and so forth, and somehow one's got to cut into this cycle and actually improve it, improve the output somehow. -yes, the chicken and egg syndrome is interesting because and i agree it is a vicious circle, but in fact you don't make new omelettes unless you do break some eggs, and i think the time has come to break some eggs and i think that's what i'm advocating is that it will come from the teacher because the teacher is the guiding light of what happens in the classroom, and if the teacher has it in the back of their mind there will be no science, then there will be no science. +yes, the chicken and egg syndrome is interesting because and i agree it is a vicious circle, but in fact you don't make new omelettes unless you do break some eggs, and i think the time has come to break some eggs and i think that's what i'm advocating is that it will come from the teacher because the teacher is the guiding light of what happens in the classroom, and if the teacher has it in the back of their mind there will be no science, then there will be no science. if, on the other hand, the teacher has it in the back of their mind always to be aware of the possibility of bringing into the work that's going on in the classroom and bringing all they're usually very excellent pedagogic skills to bear on it, aspects of the physical sciences, so that the children can get an early and meaningful introduction to it, then it will happen. the question is how do you break into the cycle and make that happen, and i think the answer is, as i said, in two ways — one by making teachers more aware during their period of initial training, either at college or at university or polytechnic, and secondly by looking very carefully at the amount and type of in-service training erm that goes on for teachers once they've left college and are in the schools. essentially what you're saying is that a teacher who's actually teaching you ought to be able to say to that teacher ‘look, here's a package, if you like, that you can insert into your range of skills, and these are of things that you can do with children which are worthwhile doing and fairly easily for you to acquire skills yourself, and they will be very good and helpful for the children’. @@ -832,13 +832,13 @@ christmas is coming up and there are chemistry sets in the shops. do these make good gifts from a scientific point of view? well they're a lot of fun and kids love them. as i commented a little earlier to somebody, i still haven't quite forgiven my mother-in-law for the chemistry set she bought my seven-year-old. -he is absolutely amazed by it and spends lots of time in a garage at the back, which actually means that i spend an awful lot of time in that garage in the cold too! -yes, they are good sets and they do they are exciting for children. +he is absolutely amazed by it and spends lots of time in a garage at the back, which actually means that i spend an awful lot of time in that garage in the cold too! +yes, they are good sets and they do they are exciting for children. they do enjoy them and they do make good use of them. quite often they need a lot of erm time spent by the parent with the child, and if the parent's happy with that they're fine. none of them, or very few of them, if you buy a good quality one is dangerous. it's very important, i think, that erm you match the age of the child to the age which is written on the box, because then the child will actually be handling materials that he can physically handle and ideas that he can physically cope with or intellectually cope with. -so they are probably very useful erm toys, educational toys, to have in the home, but i think for the child to get the maximum from them they do he often does require an adult with him. +so they are probably very useful erm toys, educational toys, to have in the home, but i think for the child to get the maximum from them they do he often does require an adult with him. how about electronic kits and circuits? are they worthwhile, would you say? yes, they are; they are very much. @@ -876,11 +876,11 @@ can a school be a democratic organisation in any real sense? well i'm probably regarded as being of a point just to the right of ghengis khan on these matters. erm a great deal is talked about democracy in schools and you very often have all kinds of organisations allegedly which take democratic decisions. in fact, if anything goes wrong at portslade community college it's my fault, and therefore i'm not going to be in a position where i don't feel able to take responsibility for any decision made. -any true democracy of the sort that you might have in a university, if you do, is really impossible in schools and that one reason because of what the law says, the other reason of course is the age of the people you're dealing with. +any true democracy of the sort that you might have in a university, if you do, is really impossible in schools and that one reason because of what the law says, the other reason of course is the age of the people you're dealing with. in the old days, life was simple in schools in the sense that if pupils didn't do what they were supposed to do you thrashed them, or made them stand in the corner, or expelled them. how do you actually make pupils do things? well i think i must take issue with you when you talk about the old days. -erm i doubt if it really was like that come on! +erm i doubt if it really was like that come on! and i think that the question of making people do things, that's something in all societies which doesn't change too much. there's a question of how much force you use and how much persuasion you use. i remember when my school opened, or just before it did, erm i got the staff together for a conference for a day, and got another east sussex head, james quinn, who came along and talked to them, and one of the things he said was now for the next week or two, whatever john werner says goes. @@ -893,7 +893,7 @@ but nevertheless, quietly, the community is getting more and more involved and h when you come to internal democracy and how much, say, the pupils have, i agree with bob that is a very tricky one and certainly you can't just transplant erm democracy onto what is really a rather authoritarian system, you'd have to prepare and train pupils much more than we do and what i think is the most dangerous thing is playing at democracy which i am sure we should not do in schools. i think that some people may not realise fully too is that in order to make a decision you have to be full informed, and teachers are very busy people and a teacher really is spending nearly every moment of his day either teaching or preparing to teach, and it's impossible, therefore, to establish in a school or a community college the faculty committee structure that one might have in a university, where people do probably spend some time informing themselves before debate. erm it's a very great problem. -one would like very often to have more erm people involved in decision making, but they simply don't have the time to inform themselves and one or two experiments in the kind of democracy you might brian might have had in mind, came to horrible grief where decisions were taken simply uninformed and where the small number of people present who were informed weren't able to persuade the majority and the history of education is littered with them most unfortunate examples of this. +one would like very often to have more erm people involved in decision making, but they simply don't have the time to inform themselves and one or two experiments in the kind of democracy you might brian might have had in mind, came to horrible grief where decisions were taken simply uninformed and where the small number of people present who were informed weren't able to persuade the majority and the history of education is littered with them most unfortunate examples of this. i think the approach of parents is very often really quite a simple one erm that they have a number of very well defined expectations of the school and that is as far as one individual parent is concerned, that the parents wants the child to go to the school, he wants that child properly controlled, provided that it's done in the way in which he particularly approves, and if you have fifteen hundred different parents there might be fourteen hundred and eighty five different techniques at work here, and then he wants the child simultaneously to be successful and happy. and traditionally, i find, british parents tend to erm say on the one hand we'll let the school get on and do their professional job — i find it quite depressing they don't ask for more say in the organisation, but they do demand, quite rightly, the right to criticise when things go wrong. now this may be because we're on the way from one position to another, or it may be a traditional british approach, but i find this personally a great source of pressure because on the one hand i recognise as a parent myself one's going to have a crucial interest in the education of one's child, on the other hand how one reconciles those hundreds of different philosophies and then superimposes upon it a professional approach is, i suppose, the greatest single source of strain i find running a large secondary school, particularly, as i said before, in the end the responsibility in law is mine. @@ -905,11 +905,11 @@ equally, i think we like to set up experiments first before plunging for somethi on the other hand, there are many places which are moving far more cautiously. but at least people feel secure in those places and move gradually towards something. so i think we could be too pessimistic about this. -i also feel, brian, we may be avoiding the question that or the part of this question which some of our listeners may be particularly interest in, and bob did touch upon it, which is have things changed much in democracy in the classroom, is there a change? +i also feel, brian, we may be avoiding the question that or the part of this question which some of our listeners may be particularly interest in, and bob did touch upon it, which is have things changed much in democracy in the classroom, is there a change? i think there are some significant ones. michael marland has talked about the disappearance of deference and i think that's the biggest change really that the kind of instant erm response to authority has gone and that has good and bad sides in it, so more is demanded of the teacher because his authority has to be earned, much more even than in the past i think. so if you handle it well, we'll move forward. -if we don't learn how to handle that particularly well, we won't, but i think we should assure reassure parents that schools are full of good disciplinarians and that, democracy or no democracy, classrooms are in control. +if we don't learn how to handle that particularly well, we won't, but i think we should assure reassure parents that schools are full of good disciplinarians and that, democracy or no democracy, classrooms are in control. i think you've always got to be aware too that what goes on in schools does, and should, reflect what's going on out of schools. one of the things that i think is most unfortunate is that parents sometimes say to their youngsters ‘you need to go to school in order to learn how to behave’. i would respond with some vigour that they need to go home to learn how to behave, so that the present themselves at school in the situation where we can exercise our professional job of teaching them. @@ -922,12 +922,12 @@ that's all that we have time for today. thank you very much, gentlemen. michael, you're interested in evaluation in education. what do you mean by evaluation? -well i think of evaluation as the process by which a person or a group of people have a fairly careful look at something they're doing in order to try and decide whether it's going well or badly, whether there are things in it they might wish to improve, and how valuable they think it is whether they might want to make changes in it in any way. +well i think of evaluation as the process by which a person or a group of people have a fairly careful look at something they're doing in order to try and decide whether it's going well or badly, whether there are things in it they might wish to improve, and how valuable they think it is whether they might want to make changes in it in any way. so you're interested in, for example, teaching of subjects such as history or mathematics in schools and the evaluation in a total sense of this? yes, well i don't particularly limit the area of what i'm interested, but if someone who was particularly interested in seeing how history was going over in this school, then i'd be very happy in discussing with them how they might try and find out how successful history teaching was in that school for example. or perhaps one might just narrow it a bit further than that and say well let's see how history is going in the first two years, or the o level history course, or something like that, and we would discuss well given that all these different people are involved in history or have a stake in it in some way, or are interested in it, and given that you're only going to have a very limited amount of time to do anything in, how can you do something that would be genuinely useful to the school in looking at the history teaching and something that would have the support of the people involved so that it wasn't threatening anybody but they felt there was something being genuinely helpful. could you give me an example of one or two erm evaluation exercises you're engaged in at the moment? -well i get involved in it in so many different ways erm this is a difficult one, but one of the things that happens is that a number of teachers, both from the area and elsewhere, erm do advanced courses at the university and as part of these courses we have a unit on evaluation, and for this they will choose some area of their school work which they and their colleagues — and i emphasise that this is something they do have to involve their colleagues back at school in very much — erm feel it would be useful to look at and then they try and discuss with their colleagues what aspects of it are important and significant and what ought to be seen, and they bring this discussion back and we all discuss together there'll be different teachers working on different problems the different ways in which they could approach this problem and how they might most usefully be able to do it and at the end of the exercise they will have found out quite a lot about this particular area of teaching and very often we find that the people they've consulted have themselves got quite interested in it and begun to realize that it's not being done in a way that's there to threaten them, they're not sending a report to the headmaster or the chief education officer or anything like that — it's for the benefit of the people doing the work themselves. +well i get involved in it in so many different ways erm this is a difficult one, but one of the things that happens is that a number of teachers, both from the area and elsewhere, erm do advanced courses at the university and as part of these courses we have a unit on evaluation, and for this they will choose some area of their school work which they and their colleagues — and i emphasise that this is something they do have to involve their colleagues back at school in very much — erm feel it would be useful to look at and then they try and discuss with their colleagues what aspects of it are important and significant and what ought to be seen, and they bring this discussion back and we all discuss together there'll be different teachers working on different problems the different ways in which they could approach this problem and how they might most usefully be able to do it and at the end of the exercise they will have found out quite a lot about this particular area of teaching and very often we find that the people they've consulted have themselves got quite interested in it and begun to realize that it's not being done in a way that's there to threaten them, they're not sending a report to the headmaster or the chief education officer or anything like that — it's for the benefit of the people doing the work themselves. and very often erm discussions take place, changes may happen in the school as a result of this work. so although they also may submit it to us as part of their assessment for a project, i mean we're at least as interested in the work being useful to the schools and to the students involved. so that's one major area of involvement. @@ -935,7 +935,7 @@ the other one erm is within the university itself because we do have a support o so we get involved quite a lot in looking at teaching in various parts of the university where people want us to, very often involving the students as well as the other teachers in looking at a particular course and seeing if there are ways in which perhaps it might be taught differently or in a way that worked better. so when you're setting about setting up an evaluation project you consider it very important to get the co-operation of the teachers and staff involved. i think this absolutely vital because in my mind the object of doing an evaluation is to create some kind of improvement in the situation that is being evaluated. -those i'm not interested in producing reports and publications out of evaluation studies, i'm interested in affecting the situation and affecting it to the mutual satisfaction of the people involved in it, and in fact when we're when i'm working with people on an evaluation, or discussing evaluation in general, one of the major items of our discussion always is how can you consult other people, how can you get them involved? +those i'm not interested in producing reports and publications out of evaluation studies, i'm interested in affecting the situation and affecting it to the mutual satisfaction of the people involved in it, and in fact when we're when i'm working with people on an evaluation, or discussing evaluation in general, one of the major items of our discussion always is how can you consult other people, how can you get them involved? and i say to them ‘look, don't start planning this whole thing on your own from the beginning, go round and talk to the various people you know that are interested and say to them ‘look, i'm planning to try and do this work, or we agreed at such and such a meeting that i would do this work, but i don't just want to do this on my own, i want to take into account other people's views. now for example if i'm looking at o level history, what sort of things do you think might be important, or what kinds of evidence do you think i ought to collect, or what issues do you think i ought to take into account?’. so one tries to build up a kind of agenda of all the things that different people involved think might be important before one tries to produce a plan as to how one's going to work, and even then there may be a chance for you actually to discuss the plan with various people as well. @@ -967,26 +967,26 @@ well there are two sides to that. i mean i think the first is that the kind of evidence one picks up, none of it on its own can be considered, i think, to be totally objective or totally valid, but what it does is it builds up a part of a picture and gradually different sorts of evidence build up a rather more complicated, rather more perhaps accurate picture of a situation, and it's really the cross-checking of different kinds of evidence that in the end gives the thing some kind of validity. the other aspect of the question you raised is really that do you change a situation by the very fact that you're doing an evaluation? do people sort of artificially put on their best behaviour, as it were, or something like that, and thereby give a sort of rather distorted impression as to what's really going on. -now obviously this can happen a bit, but i don't think, on the whole it happens very much, at least certainly not in a way that matters erm i don't think it does matter if people change things a little bit, because erm but on the whole people are doing things in the way that they're doing them erm because they've got accustomed to doing them that way and that's the way that they've planned it, and that's the way that it comes out as a result of all of those pressures that there are on them. +now obviously this can happen a bit, but i don't think, on the whole it happens very much, at least certainly not in a way that matters erm i don't think it does matter if people change things a little bit, because erm but on the whole people are doing things in the way that they're doing them erm because they've got accustomed to doing them that way and that's the way that they've planned it, and that's the way that it comes out as a result of all of those pressures that there are on them. most professional people are subject to an enormous range of presses and constraints. even in a school one has to think of a very large number of different pupils with their own different characteristics and strengths and weaknesses, and one has to operate in a classroom and to a timetable and with given resources, and so on and so forth, and the combination of all these pressures and the ways that one has got used to handling them, on the whole, is what makes a person teach the way they do. that, combined with their own personality. and they're not really going to change this very much because someone says well we're involved in an evaluation now. -i don't think it's it's not going to change the situation that much. -supposing you have taken part in an evaluation exercise and some conclusions have been mutually agreed, do you find that on the whole people are prepared to change their habits presumably in some cases habits built up over many years? +i don't think it's it's not going to change the situation that much. +supposing you have taken part in an evaluation exercise and some conclusions have been mutually agreed, do you find that on the whole people are prepared to change their habits presumably in some cases habits built up over many years? ah well that's a difficult question. i mean there are obviously some aspects of a school's policy that are relatively easily changed. -there are other things that emerge from evaluation that perhaps suggest that at least, not necessarily universally, but for that particular school, with those particular children, with those particular aims, if they want to achieve what they're trying to achieve, then they're going to have to make some rather more or at least some of the people are going to have to make some rather more fundamental changes in the way that they, say, handle children in the classroom, than might otherwise be the case. -now if you get a situation like that i mean the key question is do people actually want to change in this kind of way, or would they at least like to sort of experiment a little bit in the way they handle a group of children? +there are other things that emerge from evaluation that perhaps suggest that at least, not necessarily universally, but for that particular school, with those particular children, with those particular aims, if they want to achieve what they're trying to achieve, then they're going to have to make some rather more or at least some of the people are going to have to make some rather more fundamental changes in the way that they, say, handle children in the classroom, than might otherwise be the case. +now if you get a situation like that i mean the key question is do people actually want to change in this kind of way, or would they at least like to sort of experiment a little bit in the way they handle a group of children? and this is a very, very difficult thing to do because a teacher, i think, sort of maintains control in a classroom and is able to handle the situation because they've developed working routines over a period of years. in a sense this is what it is to become and experienced teacher rather than a novice. one has to develop routines to cope with the situation because it is far too complicated a situation to be handled in any other way. -you just cannot pay attention continuously to all the different variables in a situation and remain sane at the end of the day, you have to develop routines and techniques for handling it. -now if anyone asks if you feel for any sense that perhaps some of these routines have perhaps got a bit of become inappropriate in some way, perhaps because you're teaching a different type of child, or perhaps because you've got rather different educational aims, they've changed for some reason, then it's like asking someone to go back to being a novice again in some senses to change. +you just cannot pay attention continuously to all the different variables in a situation and remain sane at the end of the day, you have to develop routines and techniques for handling it. +now if anyone asks if you feel for any sense that perhaps some of these routines have perhaps got a bit of become inappropriate in some way, perhaps because you're teaching a different type of child, or perhaps because you've got rather different educational aims, they've changed for some reason, then it's like asking someone to go back to being a novice again in some senses to change. now this is a very, very difficult thing to ask anyone to do. now i think it says a lot for teachers as a profession that i think many of them are in fact prepared to have a go at this. but it's something that i think someone can only have a go at if they have a great deal of support and a chance to experiment in a way that still gives them the option erm not to change if they feel that they can't handle it any other way erm so i think there are a lot of difficulties associated with this kind of problem. -now i mean i am interested in this problem, and i have been involved in situations where teachers have sought help in trying to change their teaching style in the classroom, but in all these cases this help the initiative has been very much from the teachers themselves and they've wanted to do it, they've wanted to experiment with it and have been given a lot of support and help with it. +now i mean i am interested in this problem, and i have been involved in situations where teachers have sought help in trying to change their teaching style in the classroom, but in all these cases this help the initiative has been very much from the teachers themselves and they've wanted to do it, they've wanted to experiment with it and have been given a lot of support and help with it. but i think i would be giving you the wrong impression if i suggested that most of the evaluation studies with which i've been concerned have involved this kind of conclusion, or this kind of result. most of them it's been questions of rather less fundamental changes in the actual teaching style in the classroom and sometimes it's been a question of concentrating on rather different kinds of things or giving more time to one kind of activity than another, or changing the pattern of assignments that they gave children, or things that were still well within the capacity of teachers to change without involving sort of fundamental changes in teaching style. so i wouldn't like to give the impression that there aren't very many improvements that can sometimes be found erm that don't involve that kind of fundamental change, i mean i think there many improvements of that kind. @@ -1006,7 +1006,7 @@ i think that the issue really is erm are there ways in which perhaps they could now my concern is not really with trying to erm get outside people or people in universities to sort of be involved in evaluations necessarily, it's with helping people within schools to acquire more skills in the area of evaluation, so that schools, whenever they feel it would be useful to them, have got enough professional expertise among their own members to be able to perhaps rather more the quality of their evaluation and to see that it gets put perhaps to rather more purpose. in other words to see that they get more benefit for the effort that they put into it. another aspect of it, i think, is that a lot of evaluation is very intuitive and instinctive. -i think this is rightly so, but there is an advantage to knowing to being slightly more explicit about how you're doing it, and i think that if a lot of the evaluation that already went on in schools became a little bit more explicit and a little bit more open, it would be much easier for people outside the schools to realize the extent at which schools were themselves already engaging in evaluation. +i think this is rightly so, but there is an advantage to knowing to being slightly more explicit about how you're doing it, and i think that if a lot of the evaluation that already went on in schools became a little bit more explicit and a little bit more open, it would be much easier for people outside the schools to realize the extent at which schools were themselves already engaging in evaluation. i think a lot of the current concern about schools being accountable is partly because things that in fact are being done are not being seen to be done, and i think if many of the things that we already done were more obviously being seen to be done, and perhaps also thought through rather more carefully as to how they were being done, the public would feel generally erm happier about what was going on in their schools than perhaps they are at the moment. michael, thank you very much. ladies and gentlemen, good evening. @@ -1021,9 +1021,9 @@ personally, i sincerely hope that we will be able to continue with these open le in the meantime, it is very pleasant, and indeed it's salutary, to remind ourselves, as we are doing this evening, of what a university is actually about. among other things, the examination of the nature and impact of scientific theories and research, and to engage in a re-assessment of the status of these theories and the status of their creators in the light of new knowledge and a new climate of thinking and feeling. now we had no doubt about the inclusion of charles darwin's centenary in this series at this point; certainly one of the half dozen most influential figures of the modern world, in reshaping our perceptions of ourselves and of the rest of the world. -we couldn't get the centenary of the origin of species into our programme — that was nineteen fifty nine and we hadn't started then — but i did persuade tonight's speaker to deliver one of our early centenary lectures on the subject of darwin's subsequent book, that is the book on the descent of man, which appeared in eighteen seventy one, and i am sure that those of you who were there on that occasion in december eighteen seventy one will remember it as a stimulating and +we couldn't get the centenary of the origin of species into our programme — that was nineteen fifty nine and we hadn't started then — but i did persuade tonight's speaker to deliver one of our early centenary lectures on the subject of darwin's subsequent book, that is the book on the descent of man, which appeared in eighteen seventy one, and i am sure that those of you who were there on that occasion in december eighteen seventy one will remember it as a stimulating and lecture. -none of seems to have grown much older +none of seems to have grown much older and i'm certainly show that few of us have grown any wiser in the intervening decade. in the light of all that, ladies and gentlemen, the choice of a speaker for the charles darwin centenary was not difficult, and indeed i know that he welcomed the opportunity to give this lecture, not least i'm sure because of the controversies and the general noise that have erupted once again over the issues of evolution, both in the academies of the civilized western world, and even in deepest arkensaw john maynard-smith is our professor of biology. @@ -1038,7 +1038,7 @@ i'm delighted that he has accepted the invitation to return after a decade to le john maynard-smith. just over a year ago, over a thousand biologists gathered at an international meeting in vancouver. it was, in fact, the second international conference on evolutionary biology, not that it's anything to do with what i'm now saying, but the next one is actually going to be right here in 1985 and that'll be nice. -but anyway, this was the first we have such a conference every five years, but over a thousand of us sat around for a week and talked about evolution, and there was one rather curious fact about vancouver, or the media of vancouver, during that week. +but anyway, this was the first we have such a conference every five years, but over a thousand of us sat around for a week and talked about evolution, and there was one rather curious fact about vancouver, or the media of vancouver, during that week. i watched the newspapers with a good deal of interest. i could discover no mention whatever of the fact that this conference was going on in its city erm but there was one mention of evolution. there was a full page article announcing darwinism is dead, which turned out as a matter of fact to be a reprint of an article which had appeared some months earlier in the sunday times of this country, erm which in fact was based very largely on some work by a young man called steele, which none of us, i think, believed at the time, and which was since turned out clearly to have been mistaken. @@ -1048,7 +1048,7 @@ let me give another very recent example while these rather alarming, in some way now the times has never asked me to write a leading article announcing that i have some doubts about the quantum theory and i do have such doubts but, being a modest person as you know i have always put it down to my ability to understand the subject -erm but no such modesty erm it's just another illustration of the same thing. +erm but no such modesty erm it's just another illustration of the same thing. if somebody can be persuaded to say something which is critical of darwin he can get his name in the papers or on the box. now erm in some ways actually this makes it rather nice to be an evolutionist because it means that people care, you know, people are actually interested in what you're doing and that's fun. people clearly are interested in what darwin had to say erm and they mind about whether he was right or not, and i think that many people, i dare say many people in this room, have a wish which they may be conscious of and they may not, sometimes quite a strong wish, that he'll turn out to be wrong. @@ -1062,7 +1062,7 @@ i mean okay so we're here, but so are elephants and fruit flies and centipedes a people expect of a theory of origins that in some way or other it gives them some quite privileged and special position, and they feel undermined and threatened by a theory of origin which doesn't say something really rather special about them. and it's for this reason, i think, that people quite properly are interested in darwin's theory of evolution, are worried about it and so on. now, having started in that light, i may be going to disappoint you by saying that i'm not in fact going to spend the next erm fifty minutes or so talking about the moral, political, philosophical implications of darwinism. -i mean i could do i think they're fascinating and important — but i would prefer instead actually to talk about darwinism darwin as a biologist, rather than darwin as a philosopher or as a influencer of morals and religious beliefs and so on. +i mean i could do i think they're fascinating and important — but i would prefer instead actually to talk about darwinism darwin as a biologist, rather than darwin as a philosopher or as a influencer of morals and religious beliefs and so on. erm and i want, in fact, to ask, you know, is there in fact a challenge to darwinism among scientists today — among serious scientists today, i mean scientists who actually know something about the subject — and the answer to that question is yes there is. what's the nature of this challenge? erm what's the evidence for and against it? what's it's likely fate? @@ -1072,19 +1072,19 @@ i mean to give an earlier example, when at the beginning of this century, mendel i mean in retrospect, looking back on it, it seems crazy — since they were clearly both right, what were they arguing about? erm but it took a lot of time to see that these two sets of views could, in fact, be made compatible as we now think they can be. well what's the nature, then, of the challenge to darwin today. there are a number of such challenges, but the interesting and i think significant one comes from a group of palaeontologists, of whom stephen gould, now of eldridge, erm and stephen stanley are probably the best know. -who had stephen gould has asserted that, as a result of the work of this group and others, a new, as he calls it, paradigm of evolutionary biology is in the making and the so-called near-darwinist paradigm in which i was raised, and in which my students are raised i suppose if i'm honest is, you know, due for the dustbin. +who had stephen gould has asserted that, as a result of the work of this group and others, a new, as he calls it, paradigm of evolutionary biology is in the making and the so-called near-darwinist paradigm in which i was raised, and in which my students are raised i suppose if i'm honest is, you know, due for the dustbin. erm well, what is it that this new paradigm attacks first of all? essentially it attacks darwin's view that evolution is in its essence a gradual process. -erm in a very interested book called darwin on man recently by a psychologist called gruber, gruber has argued that darwin had a conviction which could be expressed by saying that things which are natural are necessarily gradual, and things which are sudden are miraculous and not natural, that he had this equation in his mind erm long before he erm became and evolutionist, long before he abandoned his belief in religion which he largely did later, and gruber traces it back, interestingly enough, to the arguments of a theologian, sumner, who later became an archbishop, who darwin took notes on his ideas when he was a student at cambridge erm which are still extent, and what sumner had argued, among other things, was that a good argument for believing in the divinity of christ, that christ was divine rather than simply being a gifted teacher, was the suddenness with which the beliefs of the ancient world were transformed by christ's teaching. +erm in a very interested book called darwin on man recently by a psychologist called gruber, gruber has argued that darwin had a conviction which could be expressed by saying that things which are natural are necessarily gradual, and things which are sudden are miraculous and not natural, that he had this equation in his mind erm long before he erm became and evolutionist, long before he abandoned his belief in religion which he largely did later, and gruber traces it back, interestingly enough, to the arguments of a theologian, sumner, who later became an archbishop, who darwin took notes on his ideas when he was a student at cambridge erm which are still extent, and what sumner had argued, among other things, was that a good argument for believing in the divinity of christ, that christ was divine rather than simply being a gifted teacher, was the suddenness with which the beliefs of the ancient world were transformed by christ's teaching. now darwin got from this this idea that somehow sudden things are miraculous, are natural, erm but admittedly they may happen but i mean there is a miraculous element about sudden things, whereas things that are natural should happen gradually, and he retained this view in spite of changing his ideas about all sorts of other things, and let us now see why the gradualism was so important a component of his theory of evolution. i mean we're all, i'm sure, basically family with what darwin's theory of evolution is, and i don't really want to labour you by reminding you of it, but i think it's important to appreciate first of all what his problem was erm and i think that it's fair to say that for darwin the problem was that as a naturalist he was aware of the fact that animals and plants are adapted to a quite extraordinary degree to their particular ways of life, and indeed many of his books on orchids and earthworms and so on have a great deal to say about the details of these adaptations. his explanation of adaptation in a sense was that it occurred as a result, as he said, of the natural selection of variations which were in their origin non-adapted in some sense, random. and he felt that it would be in a sense a miracle to produce a detailed adaptation to a particular way of life, a kind of adaptation to being fertilized by bees that you see in an orchid, by a single a large jump. -if i can use erm an analogy of my own rather than of his, to produce erm a detailed adaptation of an organism to a specific way of life, if only large steps, large mutational changes were possible, would be a little like trying a surgeon trying to remove erm an appendix with a scalpel mounted on some kind of trolley clamp with the rule that he couldn't move it less than a foot at a time. +if i can use erm an analogy of my own rather than of his, to produce erm a detailed adaptation of an organism to a specific way of life, if only large steps, large mutational changes were possible, would be a little like trying a surgeon trying to remove erm an appendix with a scalpel mounted on some kind of trolley clamp with the rule that he couldn't move it less than a foot at a time. i mean he might occasionally want to move it a foot, but there would be no way he'd be able to make the nice adjustments in that way. erm let me introduce you to — perhaps in a rather more quantitative way — let me introduce what is the sort of hoariest paradox about evolution. it's one that, you know, comes up year after year. -it is indeed actually the paradox that fred hoyle has just rediscovered erm which is for those of us who have been teaching it to our undergraduates for thirty years. +it is indeed actually the paradox that fred hoyle has just rediscovered erm which is for those of us who have been teaching it to our undergraduates for thirty years. but the paradox goes like this — i mean any form of it is as follows: proteins, as most of you know, are strings of amino acids and we make a whole series of quite specific proteins. imagine a rather short one, a small one, a hundred amino acids long. there are twenty possible kinds of amino acid, so the number of different proteins a hundred amino acids long is twenty raised to the power of a hundred. @@ -1099,16 +1099,16 @@ if you just make random proteins a hundred amino acids they have some kind of ca we think evolution took place not by sort of hitting in one bang the right answer — that would be like the surgeon moving his scalpel a foot and hitting the right point, but by successive changes, changing one amino acid at a time, each change being a slight improvement on what was there before. and then if you do the sums there's no difficulty whatsoever in imagining the evolution of a specific optimal protein, one amino acid at a time, not in millions of years but even in thousands of years — it's not a serious mathematical problem. but it's essentially, therefore, that natural selection is only going to produce adaptations if it can do so gradually, that's basically the guts of darwin's position. -erm now what then is the position what is the nature of the criticism or the claims being made by the group of palaeontologists whom i'm going to refer to, for reasons that will become apparent, as the punctuations — because i mean they would call themselves punctuations. +erm now what then is the position what is the nature of the criticism or the claims being made by the group of palaeontologists whom i'm going to refer to, for reasons that will become apparent, as the punctuations — because i mean they would call themselves punctuations. in effect, they are making two claims, one of which i want to call the minor and the major claim, which are not logically necessarily following one from the other. -the minor claim is simply that if you it's an empirical claim it says if you look at the fossil record, and you look in detail at the changes in the fossils, what you observe is not continuous steady change, but you see what they call stasis — that is nothing much happening for long periods of time, perhaps for millions of years, and then rather suddenly changes taking place. +the minor claim is simply that if you it's an empirical claim it says if you look at the fossil record, and you look in detail at the changes in the fossils, what you observe is not continuous steady change, but you see what they call stasis — that is nothing much happening for long periods of time, perhaps for millions of years, and then rather suddenly changes taking place. erm whether that's true or not, i'll discuss the data on that in a moment, but that's a claim about what you actually see if you look at the fossil record. stasis and then sudden change, which for reasons which do slightly defeat me, are called punctuational changes. the major claim is a claim which has been expressed as the claim of de-coupling. the claim is that because of this feature of the fossil record the major features of evolution, the sort of trends that you see over hundreds of millions of years, are not merely a kind of adding together of the changes which go on by natural selection within populations and which we can study today, but that some quite different kind of process must be responsible for the major features of evolution, other than natural selection of variants within populations. erm that then is the minor and the major claim being made erm let's now discuss whether there's any evidence for it erm or any evidence against it. erm let me consider first of all the minor claim, and here i think it's only fair to tell you that i'm not a palaeotologist. -what i know about palaeotology isn't too much i mean i obviously have to try and know a bit, but it's not my field — erm in order to test the minor claim, you have to be able to get your hands on some rock which actually consists of continuous sedimentation over long periods of time. +what i know about palaeotology isn't too much i mean i obviously have to try and know a bit, but it's not my field — erm in order to test the minor claim, you have to be able to get your hands on some rock which actually consists of continuous sedimentation over long periods of time. you don't want a bit of sedimentation and then a gap when nothing was being laid down and then a bit more being sedimented, because, you know, you don't know then whether the jumps you see in the record are simply there because there was a gap in deposition, or whether they really reflect the sudden change in the population. erm the best candidate for that kind of deposit are deep see cores — i mean there's a continuous rain of stuff falling from the surface of the sea to the bottom of the sea and forming a great sort of ooze on the bottom and gradually compacting down into rock — cores of this stuff are now available and palaeontologists can look and see what happens. the fossils that they can see in such cores are mainly the fossils of single celled organisms, radiolarians,blobigurina , things of that kind, and the data i've seen published on this actually are pretty gradualist in their interpretation. @@ -1126,30 +1126,30 @@ erm he, although it's twenty one, fifteen do really damn all. i mean they are more or less the same at the end as they were at the beginning. you certainly wouldn't want to put them in a different species, at least as far as you can judge from their shells. of course that's all you can see. -and they certainly demonstrate . +and they certainly demonstrate . the other six species erm all simultaneously show at one point in the record really rather sudden change. what seems to have happened is that at that moment the water table in the rift valley fell, lake tocarno became isolated from the rest of the rift. probably conditions in the lake changed, which is reasonable that they should have done. anyway, whether that's the reason or not, over a depth of about a metre of deposit there is really quite rapid changes in these populations. -erm at the end of a metre is difficult to be sure, but it's somewhere between ten thousand years and fifty thousand years in these deposits, to give you a rough idea of the kind of length of time we're talking about. +erm at the end of a metre is difficult to be sure, but it's somewhere between ten thousand years and fifty thousand years in these deposits, to give you a rough idea of the kind of length of time we're talking about. and at the end of that fifty thousand years, if that's what it is, the populations are sufficiently different that i'd think you'd want to put them into a different species if — i mean how are you to know, but i mean it's a reasonable judgement. erm then they stopped changing. a little later erm the erm level of the lake rose again, became continuous with the rest of the rift, and almost instantaneously these new forms disappear and are replaced by the original form. all that means is that the original form was present in the rest of the rift valley during this period, never went extinct, and has now come into the lake again and has either made extinct, or in some other way swamped out the local form. -now this is a very clear case of punctuation. +now this is a very clear case of punctuation. nothing happening and then something happening, really pretty rapidly. so it's admirable evidence for what i call the minor claim of the punctuationalist school, of the empirical claim. it doesn't prove that it's always true, but it's a jolly good case where it clearly, i think, is true. erm i cannot see, and this is where i part company with peter williamson to some extent, i cannot see any reason why his data should be regarded as showing that when the sudden change did take place it took place for any reason other than natural selection within a single population. -it's important that, for those of you sort of who are more into the sort of detailed arguments that are going on, it's significant that whatever else was the case, this did not happen as a result of a single major mutation which was then established by selection, because williamson's got lots of intermediate populations. -he's got the original population, then he's got a whole series of intermediates, then he's got an end population, so there is nothing there are no hopeful monsters about. +it's important that, for those of you sort of who are more into the sort of detailed arguments that are going on, it's significant that whatever else was the case, this did not happen as a result of a single major mutation which was then established by selection, because williamson's got lots of intermediate populations. +he's got the original population, then he's got a whole series of intermediates, then he's got an end population, so there is nothing there are no hopeful monsters about. i'll talk about monsters in a minute. secondly, there's no reason to suppose it happened in a small population. indeed it cannot have done if he can lay his hands on enough fossils just in a single surface exposure erm to be able to erm measure the properties of populations, it's clear there must have been millions of specimens of these beasts present at any one time in the lake. so we're not talking about small population either. -so it seems to me that what williamson has shown in one particular case is clear evidence of punctuation, but no reasons at all that i can see for supposing that the mechanism of change was any other which darwin described over a hundred years ago. +so it seems to me that what williamson has shown in one particular case is clear evidence of punctuation, but no reasons at all that i can see for supposing that the mechanism of change was any other which darwin described over a hundred years ago. erm just a word or two about the erm question of erm changes of rate and what was darwin's attitude himself towards this issue. -erm darwin says in the origin, and i'm sorry i can't read it to you, but i was desperately looking for the quotation in the origin before i can and i couldn't find it but i assure you it's there erm in which he remarks that in all probability the periods of time during which species are not changing is probably very large compared with those periods when change is taking place. +erm darwin says in the origin, and i'm sorry i can't read it to you, but i was desperately looking for the quotation in the origin before i can and i couldn't find it but i assure you it's there erm in which he remarks that in all probability the periods of time during which species are not changing is probably very large compared with those periods when change is taking place. in other words, hopefully,expects punctuation to be the case anyway. so there's particularly undarwinian about this finding. erm what would be undarwinian would be if there was, so to speak, a sudden break between one species and another, without any intermediate having existed. @@ -1170,11 +1170,11 @@ so, geographical variation doesn't lead one to have any kind of impression that if you stay in the same place then the whole process of sexual reproduction means that indeed there are uniform populations which are hybridizing with one another and then barriers to other hybridizing population, but not if you move about. and one of the most ironic features of the present debate as a matter of fact is that steve gould, who's been the most vocal exponent of the punctuationist view, and indeed of the view that there's something really quite special about the specification of them, his own field work is concerned with a mollusc snail called serin erm from the west indies, which, when it was first described by anatomists, was classified into several genera and several hundreds of different species. that's what you'd think about it if you look at it as a piece of morphology, the shell shape — it turns out to be all one species with gene flow, hybridization right across the lot. -now how a man who works on can think there's anything funny about species i just can't understand erm but there it is. erm well, suppose, however, that in my view wrongly one did suppose that there was something erm in this sort of idea of the decoupling between the processes which we observed in single populations and erm the sort of mechanisms leading to large scale evolution, what kinds of processes are held to be important when it comes to large scale evolution events? +now how a man who works on can think there's anything funny about species i just can't understand erm but there it is. erm well, suppose, however, that in my view wrongly one did suppose that there was something erm in this sort of idea of the decoupling between the processes which we observed in single populations and erm the sort of mechanisms leading to large scale evolution, what kinds of processes are held to be important when it comes to large scale evolution events? well i want, very briefly, to mention three. and first i want to discuss this idea of hopeful monsters, which is a phrase which goes back to richard goldsmith, the geneticist, who argued that occasionally a single — well he was vague about what kind of mutation he had in mind, because he had really rather odd ideas about what genes were and so on but he held occasionally that some genetic change gave rise in some sense in a single dialectical leap to organisms strikingly different from their parents and that speciation consisted of the establishment of such hopeful monsters or macro mutations. he didn't say all large mutations were hopeful, but that just occasionally one would be. -erm i must confess i've always had rather a soft spot for macro mutations, i don't know why, it may have had something to do with goldsmith's prose, which is sort of rather moving when you get into it, erm and partly, and this is an interesting comment as an aside, that i knew as an undergraduate that to argue in favour of goldsmith would make my teachers in general, and professor j b s halldane in particular , exceedingly angry and making one's teachers angry is, after all, one of the activities into which undergraduates should occasionally go. +erm i must confess i've always had rather a soft spot for macro mutations, i don't know why, it may have had something to do with goldsmith's prose, which is sort of rather moving when you get into it, erm and partly, and this is an interesting comment as an aside, that i knew as an undergraduate that to argue in favour of goldsmith would make my teachers in general, and professor j b s halldane in particular , exceedingly angry and making one's teachers angry is, after all, one of the activities into which undergraduates should occasionally go. so i used to support goldsmith's views, perhaps rather more strongly than i actually should of done. anyway, i've always had a soft spot for this, there's no problem about the existence of large morphological changes due to a single mutation. i mean any visit to a gesopholar laboratory will persuade you some very, very striking differences, you know, like having four wings instead of two, or even four legs instead of six i've had in the lab — you know, really quite striking differences can be due to a single mendelising gene, no problem about that. @@ -1186,7 +1186,7 @@ so there's nothing erm sorry,i mean, i wouldn't regard erm, you know, the accept the question is does it actually happen? and that's, of course, very hard to decide. the only way i can think of, or i think as far as anyone else can think of, deciding whether it has in fact been important in speciation, is to look for pairs of closely related species which differ in some striking morphological trait, but are still sufficiently similar genetically for you to be able to carry out a genetic analysis, i.e. to cross them, to get offspring, to get f two's and it's then possible, it's obviously not — i'm not going to explain the details of the technique to you now — but it's possible to work out whether the difference is due largely, or in part, to some single large gene, or whether it's on the whole due to quite a lot of small ones. -and when species differ in colour pattern, for example, it not at all infrequently turns out that it's just one gene, or perhaps a couple erm i mean trituris marmaratis , which is rather a nice green newt,christatus , which is rather a nice black and yellow spotted newt, you can hybridize them and the difference is due to a single gene as far as the colour is concerned gene. +and when species differ in colour pattern, for example, it not at all infrequently turns out that it's just one gene, or perhaps a couple erm i mean trituris marmaratis , which is rather a nice green newt,christatus , which is rather a nice black and yellow spotted newt, you can hybridize them and the difference is due to a single gene as far as the colour is concerned gene. but when you're thinking about an morphological traits, shapes, characters and so on, what evidence we have — and it's nothing like enough, it would be nice to have more — what evidence we have suggests that, as a matter of fact, the differences are not due to hopeful monsters. the nice investigation recently of a erm pair of species of gesophola , these are hawaiian gesophola , in which one species, the males, have sort of eyes like crabs stuck out almost on stalks. i don't want you to imagine a great big long stalk, you know, but i mean they really do have a big projection from the side of the head in gesophola hetroinura , whereas in the known ancestor of that,gesopholis ulvestris , it's head is just the same shape as any other sensible fruit fly. @@ -1194,10 +1194,10 @@ erm you can hybridize these two, you can second generations, backcrosses and so but of course one case doesn't prove anything; we'd like more. erm secondly, i want to say just a word about an idea that gould, in particular, and stanley had been fond of, namely the idea of species selection. erm the idea of species selection is basically this. -the idea is that species originate by the sudden events, whatever they may be, and they have new characteristics, which randomly related to the characteristics of their ancestral species. +the idea is that species originate by the sudden events, whatever they may be, and they have new characteristics, which randomly related to the characteristics of their ancestral species. erm they're rather like sort of mutations are randomly related to the gene from which the mutation took place, but now we're talking about a whole species suddenly arising with a new randomly arranged set of traits, and then the wholesale direction of evolution erm is determined by selection favouring some species in competition with other species. so the unit of evolution ceases to be the individual who survives and reproduces in competition with another individual that becomes a species as a whole which survives in competition with other species. -erm i think that this is unlikely both on quantisation and actually also on curiously enough actually on logical grounds. +erm i think that this is unlikely both on quantisation and actually also on curiously enough actually on logical grounds. let's consider first of all the quantitative ground, erm and let's talk about one of the major transitions, one of the major origins about which we have some information, and that is the origin of the mammals from the reptiles. erm we have quite a lot of fossils erm erm from the permian up to the triassic erm of mammals and their reptilian ancestors, and we know pretty well what went on. erm some of the changes that took place were concerned with learning to chew. you see mammals can chew and reptiles can't, erm we can chump away, you know? erm and let me just list some of the changes that took place which help us to chew. @@ -1207,21 +1207,21 @@ they have both the reptilian one and the mammalian one, both sort of functional. erm at the same time, the bones on the side of the skull got sort of gradually disappeared, so that when you clench your jaws there's got somewhere for the muscles out to bulge out to, supposing you've got big muscles. then, very important for people like me, we developed a secondary palette, who's function is to allow you to eat and talk at the same time but it also enables to you to eat and breathe at the same time. -you see you can't go chewing away, it unless you've got a bony ridge between the bit you're chewing and where the air pipe is, which a reptile doesn't have — most reptiles don't, crocodiles do. +you see you can't go chewing away, it unless you've got a bony ridge between the bit you're chewing and where the air pipe is, which a reptile doesn't have — most reptiles don't, crocodiles do. then we evolved a single tooth replacement, so that first of all you have milk teeth and then you have adult teeth, instead of them dropping out all the time. that's bad when you run out of teeth, like me, but but it's erm it does mean that you can, so to speak, design your teeth as a sort of decent engineering job and make them fit with one another and slide over one another and grind and so on. -so, along with single tooth replacement, you get differentiation of the tooth rap , so that you get canines and incisors and molars and all sorts of different nicely and complicated teeth. -then there are a lot of changes that went place took place in locomotion. erm mammals, in other words, learnt to gallop and their elbows rotated backwards and their knees rotated forwards. +so, along with single tooth replacement, you get differentiation of the tooth rap , so that you get canines and incisors and molars and all sorts of different nicely and complicated teeth. +then there are a lot of changes that went place took place in locomotion. erm mammals, in other words, learnt to gallop and their elbows rotated backwards and their knees rotated forwards. their backbone changed so that it would bend in a vertical plane erm the limb girdles changes and a whole number of other things changed associated with locomotion. then a number of things we can't follow in the fossil record, but we know must have happened. they became homoiothermic, erm warm blooded, the developed hair and so on. they developed a double circulation — they changed the method of circulating the blood round the body. erm some of us, but not all of us, started lactating -and feeding our young that way, and some of us but again not all of us, became volviferous and actually brought forth our young alive. +and feeding our young that way, and some of us but again not all of us, became volviferous and actually brought forth our young alive. all those changes must have been happening in parallel with these other ones. now that's a lot of changes. -if you try to do the sums and ask could you do all those changes simply by sort of species going one way and the other relative to these changes erm in their origins and then those species which happen to be in the right direction being selection by some kind of species selection, i think the answer is you just can't make the sums add up right. +if you try to do the sums and ask could you do all those changes simply by sort of species going one way and the other relative to these changes erm in their origins and then those species which happen to be in the right direction being selection by some kind of species selection, i think the answer is you just can't make the sums add up right. i mean there just weren't enough species extinctions to enable you to produce that number of changes and a number of independent traits in that length of time. quantitative arguments of that kind are always hard to pin down solidly, but i don't think it's numerically plausible that you could produce a set of changes of that kind by species selection. also, it sort of there's something wrong with it logically. @@ -1229,23 +1229,23 @@ ask yourself who chews, who gallops? a species does not chew or gallop. the species horse doesn't chew or gallop or jump or bring forth its young alive. individual horses chew, gallop, etc. -if anybody if anything survives because it can chew better or gallop better or bring forth it's young alive or has a better circulation, it's not the species. +if anybody if anything survives because it can chew better or gallop better or bring forth it's young alive or has a better circulation, it's not the species. i mean it's the individual animals that have these properties are the ones that survive. i mean there is a real sense in which species selection just doesn't make sense in this kind of context. now, as a matter fact i do think that there are contexts in which species selection does make sense. i mean let me mention one — the chairman mentioned that i was a rash enough to write a book on the evolution of sex. -now one of the things that sex one of the consequences of sex is that a population which reproduces sexually can evolve more rapidly than a population erm which reproduces asexually. +now one of the things that sex one of the consequences of sex is that a population which reproduces sexually can evolve more rapidly than a population erm which reproduces asexually. now that trait could well be favoured by species selection, because what is it that evolves — individuals do not evolve — we are born and we die, but we don't evolve. populations and species evolve. so sex and the capacity to evolve rapidly is a property of the species, not of an individual erm and consequently once can visualize erm species selection being responsible for it's evolution, so i don't actually have much taste for species selection. i can't see the point. -the last set of ideas which i want to discuss, which is not which are only partly related as a matter of fact to the erm ideas of the punctuationists, are the ideas, which, as a matter of fact my colleagues here brian goodwin and gerry webster have been particularly clear and eloquent advocates, which say in effect that if you really want to understand evolution, merely thinking about the adaptation of organisms to some kind of environment is not really an adequate way of thinking about it, because when you look at organisms, look at vertebrates for example, you'll find an astonishing range of kinds of ways of life. +the last set of ideas which i want to discuss, which is not which are only partly related as a matter of fact to the erm ideas of the punctuationists, are the ideas, which, as a matter of fact my colleagues here brian goodwin and gerry webster have been particularly clear and eloquent advocates, which say in effect that if you really want to understand evolution, merely thinking about the adaptation of organisms to some kind of environment is not really an adequate way of thinking about it, because when you look at organisms, look at vertebrates for example, you'll find an astonishing range of kinds of ways of life. they have an underlying community of pattern. -erm the i mean we have a pentadactyl limb, whether we climb or run or fly or swim, you can recognise an obvious deep anatomical resemblance between the limbs of organisms behaving as differently as that, and therefore that if we really want to understand evolution we have to understand these erm, i don't know whether one wants to call them plans or archetypes, or structures, call them what you will. +erm the i mean we have a pentadactyl limb, whether we climb or run or fly or swim, you can recognise an obvious deep anatomical resemblance between the limbs of organisms behaving as differently as that, and therefore that if we really want to understand evolution we have to understand these erm, i don't know whether one wants to call them plans or archetypes, or structures, call them what you will. and the theory of evolution which doesn't properly understand the nature of these structures is really a jolly incomplete theory. -now, let me say there's one component of what brian and gerry have been saying, which i most passionately agree with as it happens — get that bit off my chest first — and that is that until we have a clear understanding of the mechanisms and processes of development, the processes whereby an egg turns into an adult, our theory of evolution will, indeed, be very imperfect, and we do not have such a theory, erm it's exceedingly important that we should work on such a theory, and such a theory it isn't sufficient simply to say ‘oh well, there's a genetic programme for development’ and imagine that in other ways actually said something, because you actually haven't. +now, let me say there's one component of what brian and gerry have been saying, which i most passionately agree with as it happens — get that bit off my chest first — and that is that until we have a clear understanding of the mechanisms and processes of development, the processes whereby an egg turns into an adult, our theory of evolution will, indeed, be very imperfect, and we do not have such a theory, erm it's exceedingly important that we should work on such a theory, and such a theory it isn't sufficient simply to say ‘oh well, there's a genetic programme for development’ and imagine that in other ways actually said something, because you actually haven't. you haven't said anything very useful anyhow. -erm however, what about these ? erm let me read you what darwin had to say erm about and this in fact is erm erm the end of chapter six of the origin of species. +erm however, what about these ? erm let me read you what darwin had to say erm about and this in fact is erm erm the end of chapter six of the origin of species. he wrote ‘it is generally acknowledged that all organic beings have been formed on two great lines, unity of type and the conditions of existence. by unity of type is meant that fundamental agreement in structure which we see in organic beings of the same class, and which is quite independent of their habits of life. on my theory, unity of type is explained by unity of dissent. @@ -1253,14 +1253,14 @@ the expression of conditions of existence, so often insisted on by the illustrio for natural selection acts by either now adapting the various parts of each being to its conditions of life, or by having adapted them during long past periods of time’. and he finishes ‘hence, in fact, the law of the conditions of existence is the higher law, as it includes, through the inheritance of former adaptations, that of unity of type’. now it's jolly difficult to follow an argument of that time when it's read — i appreciate that — but what i think darwin is actually saying is this, that it's true that vertebrates, for example— all vertebrates, from fish to ourselves — have a common pattern of a rigid rod down the middle of the back, segmented muscles either side of it, a mouth at the front, a hollow nerve chord on top, two pairs of fins or legs derived from them, but not three pairs or one pair, but two pairs and so on . -it's true that that is a common feature really from the time of for the last five hundred million years, from the time of the earliest fish to ourselves and to the birds and everybody else, but it's like that not because there is some kind of profound law of form, which says that's the kind of organism which is in permitted by the laws of development to arise, erm i mean the law form would be something like erm a law of physics which says that if objects move round the sun they're going to do so in ellipses with the sun at one focus. +it's true that that is a common feature really from the time of for the last five hundred million years, from the time of the earliest fish to ourselves and to the birds and everybody else, but it's like that not because there is some kind of profound law of form, which says that's the kind of organism which is in permitted by the laws of development to arise, erm i mean the law form would be something like erm a law of physics which says that if objects move round the sun they're going to do so in ellipses with the sun at one focus. that's a kind of law of the form of movement of planets. now, could there be comparable laws which say certain kinds of organisms are possible? erm and among those possible kinds of organisms are organisms built on this vertebrae pattern. and there are other kinds of organisms which really just aren't possible, and that's why you don't find them. darwin's in effect in this passage is saying no, i don't think that's so at all, i think that this common pattern that all vertebrates have is simple the adaptive features of the common ancestor of the vertebrates, and i think he's got a jolly good case. i mean why do you want to have a rigid rod down the middle of your back and segmented muscles down either side? well every biologist knows why you want to do that, it's so you can swim sinusoidally like a fish. -you may say i don't swim sinusoidally like a fish — you're quite right, but it's not why you have them, it's why your ancestors had them. +you may say i don't swim sinusoidally like a fish — you're quite right, but it's not why you have them, it's why your ancestors had them. and you may say well why do i have two pairs of fins, you know, one in front and one behind, instead of, say, three pairs of fins, or one pair of fins, or eight pairs of fins — why do we all have two? again perfectly good adaptive reasons — they have two pairs of fins for the same reason that sensible aeroplanes, i.e. the aeroplanes that i used to design before people went crazy, have a wing in the front and a tailplane behind, and basically they do so because two surfaces — one in front of the other like that — is the minimum number of surfaces needed if you want to produce a vertical force through any point along your body. you can't do it with one, it's too few, and you don't need three, so you do it with two. @@ -1271,25 +1271,25 @@ it's simply that six legs is the smallest number of legs you can have such that and if you look at an insect walking, that's exactly what it does. it's not clever like us, falling over all the time. i mean when we're walking we are actually falling the whole time, but insects are not like that, they don't stand on three and pick up the other three. -when i first thought of that i suddenly got in an absolute panic — nothing to do with darwin, but, you know never mind — and i thought what about those erm , preying mantises and things, which who have adopted their front legs for sort of seizing prey like that they've even got four legs to walk on — what do the poor things do? -so i went rushing round to a friend of mine who fortunately had some and i said i want to see your walking, and i was much comforted to discover that they do actually use all six legs. +when i first thought of that i suddenly got in an absolute panic — nothing to do with darwin, but, you know never mind — and i thought what about those erm , preying mantises and things, which who have adopted their front legs for sort of seizing prey like that they've even got four legs to walk on — what do the poor things do? +so i went rushing round to a friend of mine who fortunately had some and i said i want to see your walking, and i was much comforted to discover that they do actually use all six legs. they walk on their knees and the front legs like this, so they stand on a knee and then those two legs, and then that knee and these two legs, so they the basic point i am making is i, you know, and this is quite unfair. -next week we must have brian or gerry telling you why i'm wrong and they'd be as persuasive, or more persuasive than i'm being, but i can't see the case for such a thing as a law of form. +next week we must have brian or gerry telling you why i'm wrong and they'd be as persuasive, or more persuasive than i'm being, but i can't see the case for such a thing as a law of form. i think that animal forms could be almost infinitely varied and the actual forms you see are the forms which darwin led us to see, namely the forms which are adapted to particular and specific ways of life. of course it leaves a problem unsolved. -it leaves it unsolved, but all right, given that our ancestors had this because they wanted to swim sinusoidally and eat, you know, filter feed and do things like that, we don't swim sinusoidally and filter feed why on earth do we are we so conservative? +it leaves it unsolved, but all right, given that our ancestors had this because they wanted to swim sinusoidally and eat, you know, filter feed and do things like that, we don't swim sinusoidally and filter feed why on earth do we are we so conservative? and i've no doubt at all that the answer to that question has to lie in an understanding of the mechanics of development. if it wasn't that we had to develop from an egg in every generation, i don't think that kind of conservatism would be observed. so i do think the development at that level has something pretty profound to say. -erm i'm conscious of the fact that i've been going on for perhaps too long and i may not have said quite enough about darwin, but let me just finish by saying this that it's not possible today, i believe, to discuss any important problem in biology without darwin's thought being absolutely central to what you're saying all the time. +erm i'm conscious of the fact that i've been going on for perhaps too long and i may not have said quite enough about darwin, but let me just finish by saying this that it's not possible today, i believe, to discuss any important problem in biology without darwin's thought being absolutely central to what you're saying all the time. i mean biologists , when they're talking to one another, are, by and large , talking about darwin and that's what i've been trying to do. well, ladies and gentlemen, i think you'll agree that some of john maynard-smith's early engineering training showed through, as it were, in reverse order, if that's not too heretical a statement to make in this context, in the gentle good natured demolition job that he did on the main current critical attacks on darwin's mechanism, and particularly on the rhythms of change that darwin adumbrated within his own time scale. i think that with john maynard-smith around — and i hope he'll be around for some time yet in the university of sussex, and i hope the university of sussex will be too in these circumstances i think that darwin can rest quietly in his grave, that is to say of the acidulous palaeontologists haven't already been trying to dig him up to prove something. as john maynard-smith knows, i've always been, in a less expert way than he, a darwinist and i've always felt, and you exemplified that tonight, i think, john, the beauty if the situation was that these profound theories corresponded with what a man of good sense, rationality, unswayed by prejudice and emotion, would be bound to belief when faced with the evidence. and i think as far as the critics are concerned, john maynard-smith may allow me to adapt erm the critical misjudgement of all time, which was made by a dublin professor when the origin of species first came out, which you will remember no doubt -when she said when she said that what was new in the theory was false, and what was true was old. +when she said when she said that what was new in the theory was false, and what was true was old. i think that john has suggested that much of what the critics are now getting up to, where it's new it's false, and where it is true, it's already subsumed in darwin's theory as modified by john maynard-smith. thank you very much, john. hello. @@ -1306,11 +1306,11 @@ she travels in every saturday morning. the parents bring her in, and the catchment are horsham, worth abbey, crawley, oldbourne. going eastwards into east sussex, not so far out, mainly lewes, newhaven, brighton area. and they are put forward by the schools themselves? -they are put forward by the schools through the local authorities, except that of course there are a large number of independent schools in east and west sussex, and these schools have i wrote to these ones asking if they had any children that they wanted to nominate. +they are put forward by the schools through the local authorities, except that of course there are a large number of independent schools in east and west sussex, and these schools have i wrote to these ones asking if they had any children that they wanted to nominate. roughly speaking, there are thirty six children in the class — what is it, it's thirteenish from east sussex, thirteenish from west sussex and nine from the independent sector spread across the county. and what are you trying to do with these children? quite simply, give them an exciting perspective of what the ideas of physics are. -we're trying to do things which on many occasions we're actually doing things which are done at university with them, in a simplified form, of course, but just to give them this perspective, this view of physics. +we're trying to do things which on many occasions we're actually doing things which are done at university with them, in a simplified form, of course, but just to give them this perspective, this view of physics. it happens that what we've done is we've taken it and hung it on the starlight, the magic of starlight — how wonderful it is, how much you can tell from just looking at a star through a telescope and measuring the light that comes out of it, and this takes us into realms of why a star shines; what do you mean by time when you go back millions of years into the universe lifetime; what do you mean, why do stars shine with different colours. these kinds of things. it's not an obvious cumulative line through o level, it's more an impression of probably things that they will come across over the next seven years just to transmit the fun and the excitement. @@ -1340,14 +1340,14 @@ the great egg race experiment was something to break into the midlands, somethin you carry on learning, and somewhere somebody knows the answer to it so you learn how they go the answer to it, and then perhaps later on you have a chance to have an opinion in science. we thought it would be a good idea to give them a chance straight off to have an opinion, and we set them a nice problem, which was that they put a marble into something and another marble comes out thirty seconds later. they had a large box of miscellaneous bit and pieces of sticky tape and straws and wood and drawing pins and all sorts of things, and we essentially just left them for two weeks to do this — and they came up with some superb ideas. -there was some problem that one of them went back and talked to, presumably dad, perhaps mum though, erm and came back with a lovely engineered solution, but that didn't matter — they had fun doing it and they had fun trying these things and, believe me, the answer were ever so close to what the design i was amazed with what they produced. +there was some problem that one of them went back and talked to, presumably dad, perhaps mum though, erm and came back with a lovely engineered solution, but that didn't matter — they had fun doing it and they had fun trying these things and, believe me, the answer were ever so close to what the design i was amazed with what they produced. yes, i was there erm and saw them working, and i think you were looking fairly amazed that the answer came out to be almost the correct answer on several occasions, with quite different bits of apparatus. quite, it's amazing. it hadn't thought. -i had honestly not thought how you would solve that problem in advance, and i'm glad i did because my amazement certainly i wanted it to show with the kids when i said ‘goodness, what, you know, how on earth are you going to do it that way?’. -it really was i was quite astonished to see some of the solutions. -one of the nice aspects of a task such as that is that i think we, as professional physicists — and i'm a physicist too erm we, as professional physicists, feel there's a right way of doing something because it's the way we learnt and we've got used to, and we tend to instil this idea into other people. -and i think it was really rather refreshing to see the kids not know what was the right idea and actually dream up all sorts of fantasies for themselves, many of which were had their own validity. +i had honestly not thought how you would solve that problem in advance, and i'm glad i did because my amazement certainly i wanted it to show with the kids when i said ‘goodness, what, you know, how on earth are you going to do it that way?’. +it really was i was quite astonished to see some of the solutions. +one of the nice aspects of a task such as that is that i think we, as professional physicists — and i'm a physicist too erm we, as professional physicists, feel there's a right way of doing something because it's the way we learnt and we've got used to, and we tend to instil this idea into other people. +and i think it was really rather refreshing to see the kids not know what was the right idea and actually dream up all sorts of fantasies for themselves, many of which were had their own validity. they really did. i think this is an extremely important point in the teaching. i think one of the difficulties of science — you talked at the beginning of switching people off science — is there are some golden opportunities when you can argue science, you can argue politics, you can argue english literature with your teacher — it's very hard to argue mathematics with your teacher. @@ -1367,14 +1367,14 @@ further down the line the rot may have set in. these are people who are enthusiastic about science that we're transferring more enthusiasm to, to reinforce their interest in science. i am a bit worried about the ones further down the line, how we influence them. sandy, what's going to happen to these kids when they go back to their dull, boring school laboratories and classes after having seen the vision of your course and what physics can possibly be in the future? -well we know, from talking to some of the school teachers involved, they go back and the kids go back and talk to the other kids in the form. +well we know, from talking to some of the school teachers involved, they go back and the kids go back and talk to the other kids in the form. they may have a slight perturbation on the behaviour of the school teachers, because they're going to come back with some ideas which the school teachers will find slightly foreign to them. for instance, in one of the lectures we were talking about how you know how heavy an atom is, and my colleague, mike pendlebury, was describing how you can actually do this by weighing a crystal and counting the number of atoms in it, erm this is certainly not the traditional way, it's a way that's been developed over the last few years. it's a beautiful, simple way of doing it. it's not at all in the general knowledge of the sixth form science teacher, or certainly not of the o level science teacher. some of them are going to have to puzzle a little bit hard. i do worry slightly that if some child answers this in an o level exam paper in, what, let's see, two years time, that they may get marked down. -i don't think that's a serious problem, but it nonetheless is the fact that this is now the method of measuring of weighing atoms. +i don't think that's a serious problem, but it nonetheless is the fact that this is now the method of measuring of weighing atoms. you don't hurl them through space and put them through an electric field and a magnetic field and the rest of it. the accuracy comes from literally counting the number of atoms in a single crystal of silicone and weighing it. sandy, this is the first of these courses that you've run, and i deliberately said first of these courses — do you have any plans for running future courses? @@ -1382,7 +1382,7 @@ it seems a great idea and it's a shame only to have one of them. i think that'll depend on where the money comes from. it always looms large. these courses are funded by shell, and we're very grateful for their help. -they're quite expensive at the outset because what we've got to do is pay the lecturers to put a lot of work in on those lectures — it's not a simple thing writing this lecture for a thirteen year old and we also pay the school teachers for coming along and helping the lecturers. +they're quite expensive at the outset because what we've got to do is pay the lecturers to put a lot of work in on those lectures — it's not a simple thing writing this lecture for a thirteen year old and we also pay the school teachers for coming along and helping the lecturers. provided shell were willing, we probably would go ahead next year, although the question you could ask is, having helped a group of thirty six kids in sussex this year, shouldn't shell, if they were going to run these master classes, help a group of kids in westmorland next year, rather than another group down in sussex next year. it's very much up in the air about the continuation of these classes. remember this is the very first class. @@ -1395,7 +1395,7 @@ actor, film maker, entrepreneur, he's a many of many parts, including, for examp i think it was oh what a lovely war that i first remember seeing you round about the university. was that your first contact with us? yes, it was. -what i can't actually remember is whether lovely war preceded my son and daughter came to sussex. +what i can't actually remember is whether lovely war preceded my son and daughter came to sussex. i remember michael. and i can't remember — i think michael must have come after a lovely war, or maybe contemporary with it, i'm not sure. but it was about then — you're absolutely right — about that time, about nineteen sixty nine, nineteen seventy. @@ -1415,10 +1415,10 @@ mhm it's up now — did you know that? it's well i gather it is, yes. -the awful thing is that the movies that i've been involved with in the last erm few years have entailed my being abroad a great deal, and i was made in new york entirely and i was there for six or seven months, and the difficulty is that when you then make the movie and you take it round the world, you're away for another three or four months and so you end up being out of the country for quite a long time, so i've been nothing like as active with the university. +the awful thing is that the movies that i've been involved with in the last erm few years have entailed my being abroad a great deal, and i was made in new york entirely and i was there for six or seven months, and the difficulty is that when you then make the movie and you take it round the world, you're away for another three or four months and so you end up being out of the country for quite a long time, so i've been nothing like as active with the university. i'm rather ashamed. i'm a very absentee pro-chancellor i'm afraid. -that was aisa, too, i might say, who persuaded me into that quite strange position for an old ham actor to be in, but erm +that was aisa, too, i might say, who persuaded me into that quite strange position for an old ham actor to be in, but erm well you may be an old ham actor, but i note you've picked up about five or six, i think, honourary degrees now. erm have i? yes, well, yes. @@ -1429,7 +1429,7 @@ it's unique, there's no question about that. i don't know any university that's quite like it. i think it's disciplines are extremely interesting. i love them. -the whole concept of the various courses here and schools here, i think they work marvellously and i think they're stimulating and i think, from my own point of view, admirable in this breadth of examination and erm investigation and enlightenment, which personally i think is desperately erm important in our current erm communities and that to specialising too soon erm really can be almost counter-productive. +the whole concept of the various courses here and schools here, i think they work marvellously and i think they're stimulating and i think, from my own point of view, admirable in this breadth of examination and erm investigation and enlightenment, which personally i think is desperately erm important in our current erm communities and that to specialising too soon erm really can be almost counter-productive. i think that sussex in a way perhaps isn't quite as identifiable as it was and i think this doesn't necessarily cause by any particular circumstance or group of individuals or individual or whatever. i think to a large degree fashion has something to do with it — the innovatory concept of sussex was very exciting in the sixties, it's a bit old had not. i think sussex has got to find a new, new hat, and got to express itself and demonstrate that it is in no sense relying on twenty five years of erm of erm fairly high reputation that the next twenty five years and the next twenty five years after that are just as challenging, perhaps even more so. @@ -1445,16 +1445,16 @@ i get very emotional when i see it. i don't think i can still yet watch it without weeping — it's such a powerful film of a powerful time, and a terrible time really. yes. i was bitterly disappointed. -i saw it erm i ran it — i can't remember why i was running it, oh i think i wanted to look at an actor erm, oh no, it was at a festival and i had to sit through it and i was very disappointed in it, i found it slow and rather obvious and erm a little lacking in bite. +i saw it erm i ran it — i can't remember why i was running it, oh i think i wanted to look at an actor erm, oh no, it was at a festival and i had to sit through it and i was very disappointed in it, i found it slow and rather obvious and erm a little lacking in bite. on the other hand its subject matter i found overwhelming. one or two sequences worked quite well, but i hope i'm a better director now than i was then. -oh some marvellous performances in it, but really it was joan littlewood's intrinsic concept which was miraculous really, that's and really i don't know whether the movie lost a lot as against the play — i think it lost something — the important thing was that millions of people who would never have seen it, had it remained purely as a theatre production, did see what joan littlewood had to say, saw her perceptions, her wit, her humanity, and therefore i think it was well worth making. +oh some marvellous performances in it, but really it was joan littlewood's intrinsic concept which was miraculous really, that's and really i don't know whether the movie lost a lot as against the play — i think it lost something — the important thing was that millions of people who would never have seen it, had it remained purely as a theatre production, did see what joan littlewood had to say, saw her perceptions, her wit, her humanity, and therefore i think it was well worth making. and of course ghandi was your big success, so far, in a sense. i mean you got every award going in the universe, just about, for that one. how do you feel about that now looking back, are you beginning to get a little bit critical of yourself. i hope so, yes. ghandi came at the right time, you know. -there was a we need another feeling now, it seems to me. +there was a we need another feeling now, it seems to me. i'm so sickened by the erm cynicism and scepticism and terrible jingoism that emanates to a large degree from the united states. it seems to me that our leaders somehow or another have simply got to be persuaded that we are prepared to sacrifice a very great deal erm to secure erm a new attitude. that it is inconceivable that after this number of centuries man still believes that ultimately the only way in which problems are solved is by blowing the other chap's head off, which is so lunatic now. @@ -1462,8 +1462,8 @@ we've only seen what we've seen just recently in russia, mhm but i'm digressing. ghandi, i think, in the early eighties epitomised, to a large degree, and attitude of concern about erm violence, and i think that in some large measure the sort of recognition that it gained, particularly in the awards and so on, had a lot to do with its subject matter as against it's actual execution, and i think that if it had been at another time, or if the subject matter hadn't been erm quite as powerful as that old genius's life was, i don't think it would have won the awards. -i think it was a combination of it was an okay movie, but it was also a wonderful subject, a wonderful subject. -i was a very good movie too, i must say. +i think it was a combination of it was an okay movie, but it was also a wonderful subject, a wonderful subject. +i was a very good movie too, i must say. those two movies had messages, very clear messages coming through. now how about a chorus line? it was a challenge. @@ -1489,7 +1489,7 @@ lunatic really, yes. my whole family background has been responsible, in a way, for, by virtue of the example of my parents, for my distress at witnessing prejudice, whether it be colour, or religious, or whatever, and intolerance, and so on, and i've wanted to do a subject about south africa for a long time, and this was enhanced erm obviously when i made ghandi because, as you know, the first twenty odd years of ghandi's life indeed. adult life was spent in south africa, and erm i found a couple of years ago two books written by a remarkable while english-speaking south african called donald woods, who was a newspaper editor, who befriended and then championed a remarkable young black south african called steve beeko, who was killed in police detention. -and the movie is the story of their friendship and donald woods' conversion, in a way, to the erm cause that erm called black consciousness which steve beeko erm promoted and so on, and it ends up with a sort of james bond escape from south africa in a way, in that donald and his wife and his five children, harassed and threatened by the erm south african government, finally escape. +and the movie is the story of their friendship and donald woods' conversion, in a way, to the erm cause that erm called black consciousness which steve beeko erm promoted and so on, and it ends up with a sort of james bond escape from south africa in a way, in that donald and his wife and his five children, harassed and threatened by the erm south african government, finally escape. it's an unequivocal condemnation of the obscenity of apartheid. the great problem we face is that obviously the authorities in south africa don't want the picture to be made, and we're shooting it in zimbabwe, where we've been made very welcome, and erm the difficulties is the creation of south africa in zimbabwe, which means you have to go all over the place. it's a very costly business, you know, but it must ring true because of course the actuality's on our televisions screens every other night and if it doesn't have an authentic ring to it then people won't accept what the picture has to say. @@ -1498,7 +1498,7 @@ and film maker, and associated very much with this university i'm glad to say thank you. and long may it last. thank you very much for talking to me dickie. -oh it's a pleasure, brian. +oh it's a pleasure, brian. lovely to see you again. once again, good evening ladies and gentlemen, and once again i'd like to offer an especially warm welcome to this centenary lecture to those of you who've come from outside the university. if you were with us at the last occasion of this sort, the last centenary lecture on gerter , given by professor corby, you will remember on that occasion erm he provided a focus of illumination in a period of power cuts, economic gloom and all the rest of it. @@ -1521,12 +1521,12 @@ we know more about milton, his personal concerns and his literary plans than we for instance, at the age of twenty one, milton wrote a latin poem, sixth of his latin elegies and it's therefore just called elegia sexta. he wrote it to his friend, charles diodati and it's an answer, in latin verse, to a letter from diodati apologizing that his poems were not as good as usual because he was leading too much social life. milton replies with a twofold statement. -he begins: ‘i, with my empty belly, send you good health, which you, whose belly is bulging, may perhaps need ’ and then the falls into two halves. +he begins: ‘i, with my empty belly, send you good health, which you, whose belly is bulging, may perhaps need ’ and then the falls into two halves. the first half is in praise of feasting and drinking. -bacchus song loves bacchus and bacchus loves songs, says milton, and he gives us a whole stream of classical precedents, ovid,anacreon , pinder, the whole lot to show that a poet naturally will love the good life. +bacchus song loves bacchus and bacchus loves songs, says milton, and he gives us a whole stream of classical precedents, ovid,anacreon , pinder, the whole lot to show that a poet naturally will love the good life. it includes a good bit of flattery of diodati and a celebration of the erotic lyric. then he says ‘but he who tells of wars and heaven, under the sway of grown up jupiter, of pious heroes and semi-divine leaders, who at one moment things of the holy assemblies of the gods on high and then of those deep kingdoms where a fierce dog barks, let him live in the frugal manner of pythagoras and let herbs provide his harmless diet ’. -and then of course he gives classical precedence for this tireseus, orpheus, those poets who had magical powers, homer, who suggests not only frugal diet, but chastity will be the best preparation for the poet who has this task in hand. +and then of course he gives classical precedence for this tireseus, orpheus, those poets who had magical powers, homer, who suggests not only frugal diet, but chastity will be the best preparation for the poet who has this task in hand. it's quite clear of course that though diodati may belong to the first class, milton belongs to the second. he is the poet dedicated from the beginning to a high heroic task. hence that opening line. @@ -1549,7 +1549,7 @@ what happened instead was that milton got caught up in politics and when the civ well in a way it's not surprising that none of this got done, if you reflect how common it is that poetic plans don't get fulfilled. but of course it did in a sense get done, but when milton did write his great poem, as we'll see, it came out very differently. why have i begun with this story? -well, of course, because i want in talking about milton i want to stress his dedication. +well, of course, because i want in talking about milton i want to stress his dedication. indeed, i suppose, i even want to raise in passing the thought how single-minded should a poet be. do we think of the young poets with the young literary man? this is not a purely historical question. @@ -1569,7 +1569,7 @@ his self defence, and i now read from actually only a paragraph or so earlier th next, if i were wise only to my own ends, i would certainly take such a subject as of itself might catch a clause, whereas this’— he is of course writing about the vexed question of erm church government and the possible disappearance of episcopy —‘whereas this hath all the disadvantages on the contrary, and such a subject as the publishing whereof might be delayed at pleasure and time enough to pencil it over with the curious touches of art, even to the perfection of a faultless picture, whereas in this argument the not deferring it is of great moment to the good speeding. that, if solidity have leisure to do her office, art cannot have much. lastly, i should not choose this manner of writing, wherein knowing myself inferior to myself, led by the genial power of nature to another task, i have the use as i may account that of my left hand.’ -the reasons he feels uneasy at the task he's given himself, of pamphleteering, are first that he's not he's had to interrupt his studies and is not get learned enough for his poem, though you will have noticed he considers himself quite learned enough for ecclesiastical politics. +the reasons he feels uneasy at the task he's given himself, of pamphleteering, are first that he's not he's had to interrupt his studies and is not get learned enough for his poem, though you will have noticed he considers himself quite learned enough for ecclesiastical politics. second, that he objects to the topicality of the subject that he's chosen, and finally that he's not, of course, at home writing prose. but i also began by raising the question of milton's sense of dedication because i want to talk a little bit about the egoism of creation. you might feel, you perhaps did feel, is it not astonishingly self-centred, is it not even offensively self-centred, this concern with his own greatness, his own importance, what i am writing now, what i shall achieve. @@ -1577,7 +1577,7 @@ his passages do, after all, occur, many of them, in political tracts, in which h of course he's answering accusations when he stops and defends himself. of course we can talk about the standard of controversy in the seventeenth century and habits of erm arguing ad hominem more than, i suppose, would normally be acceptable today. all the same, what would you think of these reasons for inserting a piece of autobiography into the second defence of the english people, a defence of course for cutting off the head of charles the first. -but in which he says that he's talking about himself ‘that so many good and learned men among the neighbouring nations who read my works may not be induced by this fellow's calumnies to alter the favourable opinion they have formed of me, followed by the assertion that the people of england whom fate, or duty, or their own virtues have incited me to defend may be convinced from the purity and integrity of my life that my defence, if it do not redown to their honour, can never be considered as their disgrace.’ +but in which he says that he's talking about himself ‘that so many good and learned men among the neighbouring nations who read my works may not be induced by this fellow's calumnies to alter the favourable opinion they have formed of me, followed by the assertion that the people of england whom fate, or duty, or their own virtues have incited me to defend may be convinced from the purity and integrity of my life that my defence, if it do not redown to their honour, can never be considered as their disgrace.’ well i have to establish my own virtue and distinction. why? because i am, after all, the defender of the english people. @@ -1605,7 +1605,7 @@ he knew himself to sing and build the lofty rhyme. he must not float upon his watery bier unwept and welter to the parching wind without the mead of some melodious tear.’ it is in a way saying the same thing as the preface to the reason of church government. ‘reluctant as i am, i must lay aside other tasks and do this one.’ -i presume that the before the mellowing year, the premature moment at which he's dedicating himself is of course a personal reference concerning his own youth. +i presume that the before the mellowing year, the premature moment at which he's dedicating himself is of course a personal reference concerning his own youth. but the difference is that the degree to which milton is speaking in his own person seems so much less in the poem, doesn't it? it's almost a kind of professional remark. he's writing as the poet. @@ -1613,7 +1613,7 @@ if i do it for edward king, somebody will do it for me. indeed, it's not only the writer who is depersonalised, but also the subject. it's not edward king, the man who was actually drowned and whom, as it happens, milton hardly knew, it's lucidas, the figure of the young poet, priest, put to some extent on a classical model that he is writing about. lucidas, i suppose, more than any other poem of milton's, and indeed i suppose more than any other poem in english, lucidas shows us that there doesn't have to be a conflict between personal involvement and formal rhetoric. -though the very fact that it is so traditional and so formal a poem in the pastoral tradition, held in the tightness of all the conventions that it employs, not only allows, but in some strange way makes possible, the intensity of personal feeling that it contains. +though the very fact that it is so traditional and so formal a poem in the pastoral tradition, held in the tightness of all the conventions that it employs, not only allows, but in some strange way makes possible, the intensity of personal feeling that it contains. for instance, erm when he speaks the fact that the young man was cut off in his prime, perhaps the most famous passage of the lot ‘alas what boots it with incessant care to tend the homely slighted shepherd's trade and strictly meditate the thankless muse. were it not better done as other use to sport with amaryllis in the shade, or with the tangles of nayera's hair.’ writing poetry is presented in the wholly artificial diction of tending the shepherd's trade, or in a latinism that is not even correct, colloquial, normal english in meditating the thankless muse. @@ -1631,14 +1631,14 @@ erm i suppose the very extreme of such self-satisfaction is in the epilogue to p i must be proud to see men not afraid of god afraid of me.’ hence rhyme, you can see, is a two-edged weapon in the hands of a poet. now, as i say, poetic boasting is, in a way, something that is common to both pope and milton. -i think once more, but now for the last time, i'm going to turn back again to the preface to the reason of church government and whoops and read you one more sentence erm in which he is apologizing once more for having entered the fray, the political fray ‘but although a poet, soaring in the high region of his fancies, with his garland and singing robes about him, might without apology speak more of himself than i mean to do, yet for me, sitting here below in the cool element of prose, a mortal thing among many readers of no imperial conceit, to venture and divulge unusual things of myself, i shall petition to the gentler sort it may not be envy to me.’ +i think once more, but now for the last time, i'm going to turn back again to the preface to the reason of church government and whoops and read you one more sentence erm in which he is apologizing once more for having entered the fray, the political fray ‘but although a poet, soaring in the high region of his fancies, with his garland and singing robes about him, might without apology speak more of himself than i mean to do, yet for me, sitting here below in the cool element of prose, a mortal thing among many readers of no imperial conceit, to venture and divulge unusual things of myself, i shall petition to the gentler sort it may not be envy to me.’ and he then actually goes on and writes the passage i began by reading of straight autobiography. well you'll see that in that apology milton appears to be conscious of the very point that i am trying to make, that is to say it might be considered out of place in this prose work to speak of myself in direct factual terms, although a poet — a poet intending to write of things unattempted yet in prose or rhyme — a poet soaring in the high region of his fancies, with his garland and singing robes about him, in other words where we can't or aren't really invited to make out his individual identity very clearly because it is his role as poet that concerns us, there he clearly feels it would be proper. when he came to write paradise lost, milton on four occasions deliberately spoke in his own person in a way very close to the opening of lucidas, or to the programme which that last sentence suggests to us. these are the four exordia or openings to books one, three, seven and nine. the most is the invocation to light in book three, in which milton speaks out of his blindness, uses that to place himself in a tradition, and again without foregoing his intensity of personal involvement. indeed, i think that probably is the rival to lucidas as the demonstration of how the depersonalizing is compatible with the most intense personal involvement. -but i'm going to read you something much shorter from one of the from i suppose the least well known of the exordia, that is the one to book seven. +but i'm going to read you something much shorter from one of the from i suppose the least well known of the exordia, that is the one to book seven. erm the ostensible subject of this passage is that he's now finished with hell and heaven as the setting for his poems, and he's coming down to earth for what is left. ‘standing on earth, not wrapped above the pole, more safe i sing, withe moral voice unchanged to horse or mute, though fallen on evil days, on evil days though fallen and evil towns, in darkness and with dangers compassed round and solitude. yet not alone while though visits my slumbers nightly, or when morn purples the east. @@ -1661,7 +1661,7 @@ and it was the right subject — he got there in the end — because it enabled for instance, it enabled him to use the very struggle for a subject, which had occupied so much of his line, since we can partly see that struggle as a struggle within milton over his own humanist heritage. that is the struggle between milton the poet and milton the puritan. this is a constant dilemma. -suppose somebody read to you, without telling you the author, but telling you the date — the early seventeenth century lines like this ‘but let my due feet never fail to walk the studious cloisters pale and love the high embowered rough with antique pillars and and storeyed windows richly dyked, casting a dim religious light, there let the pealing organ blow to the full-voiced choir below in service high and anthems clear, as may with sweetness through mine ear dissolve me into ecstasies and bring all heaven before my eyes. +suppose somebody read to you, without telling you the author, but telling you the date — the early seventeenth century lines like this ‘but let my due feet never fail to walk the studious cloisters pale and love the high embowered rough with antique pillars and and storeyed windows richly dyked, casting a dim religious light, there let the pealing organ blow to the full-voiced choir below in service high and anthems clear, as may with sweetness through mine ear dissolve me into ecstasies and bring all heaven before my eyes. and may at last my weary age find out the peaceful hermitage, the hairy gown and mossy sill where i may sit and rightly spell of every star that heaven doth show, and every herb that sips the dew, till old experience do attain to something like prophetic strain.’ well, you would say attractive poet, fertile imagination, lover of the sense, likes organ music, likes stained glass windows, is sympathetic to the idea of monasticism retiring into a hermitage, probably a roman catholic. and you were then told that he was the great propagandist of those who went around a dozen years or so later breaking down these storeyed windows, richly dykes, because it was of course profane and idolatrous to have that dim religious light in your churches. @@ -1688,8 +1688,8 @@ he is throwing away for it a lifetime's dedication to classical studies. it is my little pet theory about religious poetry that the greatest religious poetry is an act of renunciation and therefore what you have to do is put in what you're giving away. you write the same poem over and over again and tell us what you're no longer going to do. ‘nothing in this marvellous list’ says milton ‘was as fine as eden’and of course it hurts him to say it, and i don't think it's far fetched to detect that hurt and pain of that great sacrifice that john milton is making in the rhythm when we read ‘might with this paradise of eden strive’, or in the fact that he can't stop there, because i didn't — as you will have realized from bentley's comment — i didn't read you the whole passage. -he goes on ‘nor that niceanile girt with the river triton, where old cham , whom gentiles annan call and libian jove , his and his florid son, young bacchus’, sorry ‘hid’— gracious me, there's a misprint. -milton ‘where old old cham , whom gentiles annan call and libian jove , hid and her florid son, young bacchus from his stepday maria's eye, nor where abasin kings there issue guard mount amara, though this by some suppose true paradise under the ethiope line by head enclosed with shining rock a whole day's journey high, but wide remote from this asyrian garden where the fiend saw undelighted or delight.’ +he goes on ‘nor that niceanile girt with the river triton, where old cham , whom gentiles annan call and libian jove , his and his florid son, young bacchus’, sorry ‘hid’— gracious me, there's a misprint. +milton ‘where old old cham , whom gentiles annan call and libian jove , hid and her florid son, young bacchus from his stepday maria's eye, nor where abasin kings there issue guard mount amara, though this by some suppose true paradise under the ethiope line by head enclosed with shining rock a whole day's journey high, but wide remote from this asyrian garden where the fiend saw undelighted or delight.’ you can see milton can't stop. he's got to go on for another ten lines, piling on more and more out of the way references to classical paradises so that he can give it all away for god. so far from being, as you might at first glance suspect, a wanton display of milton's monstrous learning, it's a piece of triumphant relevance. @@ -1701,7 +1701,7 @@ that would be a gesture of supreme eloquence by milton, the humanist. that would be an extravagance of classicallly based compliment and then milton the puritan comes along and says to himself that won't do, we need a footnote, and in goes the footnote if true here only — don't forget that these classical legends are all lies. paradise lost, like colmris is a poem with a thesis, but the counter position of the thesis is so powerful that the poem, both these poems, have to be described as the enactment of a conflict, rather than the giving us of the result. the thesis, of course, is quite simple. -the poem sets out to justify the ways of god to men, and what little time is left me will be devoted to justifying the ways of god to men, and we must begin this, sorry we must begin this by a word on on the fall — the way of god the ways of god to men of course are punishing men for the fall. +the poem sets out to justify the ways of god to men, and what little time is left me will be devoted to justifying the ways of god to men, and we must begin this, sorry we must begin this by a word on on the fall — the way of god the ways of god to men of course are punishing men for the fall. if the circumstances of this crime — that is the eating of the apple — are duly considered, it will be acknowledged to have been a most heinous offence and a transgression of the whole law. for what sin can be named which was not included in this one act. it comprehended at once distrust in the divine voracity and a proportionate credulity in the assurances of satan, unbelief, side b graditude , disobedience, gluttony, ‘in the man excessive uxoriousness, in the woman a want of proper regard for her husband, in both an insensibility to the welfare of their offspring and that offspring the whole human race. @@ -1711,17 +1711,17 @@ it clearly implies a world order in which the prime virtue is obedience, not a w obedience is, of course, to god and not to man. well, i am alas going to have to leave out my discussion of god in paradise lost, the question of whether, by presenting the obedience to god you can somehow make it more palatable to the readers' tastes than you could if it was entirely thought of as a secular morality. and the answer of course is that it depends how much you make god like yourself, and that's a test that milton doesn't come altogether well out of. -but i want really, in conclusion, to jump straight to the central part of the poem in which the ways of god to man,got to me are most clearly justification's most clearly involved, and that is the actual process of the fall. +but i want really, in conclusion, to jump straight to the central part of the poem in which the ways of god to man,got to me are most clearly justification's most clearly involved, and that is the actual process of the fall. milton's task, of course, is to convince us of the sin involved. just to convince us that all these things that he tells us about are somehow present, to convince us of the heinousness of what he's done. in a word, i suppose i think he succeeds better with eve than he does with adam. but i'm going to put the evidence in front of you and ask you to decide for yourselves. immediately after the climax of the poem — the tremendous lines in which no so saying ‘a rash hand in evil hour forth reaching to the fruit she plucked, she ate’. -immediately after this big moment the earth is convulsed with horror we have eve's first speech, presumably after the fall the first speech in a state of sin, and this is it ‘oh sovereign virtuous, precious of all trees in paradise, of operation blest to sapinense hitherto obscured in famed and thy fair fruit let hang as to not end created, but henceforth my early care not without song each morning and dew/due pray shall tend thee and the fertile burden ease of thy full branches offered free to all. +immediately after this big moment the earth is convulsed with horror we have eve's first speech, presumably after the fall the first speech in a state of sin, and this is it ‘oh sovereign virtuous, precious of all trees in paradise, of operation blest to sapinense hitherto obscured in famed and thy fair fruit let hang as to not end created, but henceforth my early care not without song each morning and dew/due pray shall tend thee and the fertile burden ease of thy full branches offered free to all. till dieted by thee i grow mature in knowledge, as the gods who all things know. though others envy what they cannot give, for had the gift been theirs it had not here thus grown. experience next to thee i owe, best guide, not following thee i have remained ignorance. -thou openest wisdom's way and gives no secret she retire. +thou openest wisdom's way and gives no secret she retire. and i perhaps am secret. heaven is high, high and remote to see from thence distinct each thing on earth. another care perhaps may have diverted from continual watch our great forbidder safe with all his spies about him. @@ -1739,7 +1739,7 @@ and, indeed, as befits someone who's hovering on the edge of idolatry, even her now the others she's referring to there must be god, but she cannot immediately go on and so bluntly say, in the very next line anyway, you know, it was only the serpent who showed it to me, god is going to be envious of me. so it's this kind of vague offstage ‘others’ who seem to have the power in that case. well, you'll also have noticed i am sure that as she went on touches of uneasiness began to appear. -for instance, after she had said i would have remained in ignorance, the tree opens wisdoms way though secret she retire, the word secret catches up almost by a mechanical verbal train of association the thought and on it perhaps secret and then all these uneasy feelings that perhaps god's so far away, or he wasn't watching, or in some way or other he didn't actually see. +for instance, after she had said i would have remained in ignorance, the tree opens wisdoms way though secret she retire, the word secret catches up almost by a mechanical verbal train of association the thought and on it perhaps secret and then all these uneasy feelings that perhaps god's so far away, or he wasn't watching, or in some way or other he didn't actually see. erm then when it comes to adam, the first thought in relation to adam is of course that she's improved her own position, isn't it? it's only after that that once again she begins to be worried at possible consequences ‘what if god hath seen and death ensue, then i shall be no more and adam wedded to another eve’ and therefore, of course, ‘adam shall share with me in bliss or woe’. c s lewis, a little unkindly, describes this as murder @@ -1748,7 +1748,7 @@ whether she is consciously twisting logic, or just, poor girl, confused, i'm not now i think this is a brilliant speech, but i have to admit that it is a speech which, in showing the egoism, the confusion and the self-deception of eve, assumes a valid order which is being destroyed. that is to say, it assumes the hierarchical erm conception of god's world and the ethic of obedience, which, as we saw from that prose passage, underlies the conception of the fall as the central sin. and this point is even more clear-cut with adam. -the last passage i'm going to have time to read comes in the erm speech of adam erm, not actually speech, the inward soliloquy to adam, the first thing that he says he says his case is not yet fallen when he sees eve. +the last passage i'm going to have time to read comes in the erm speech of adam erm, not actually speech, the inward soliloquy to adam, the first thing that he says he says his case is not yet fallen when he sees eve. eve comes to him and tells him what she's done. ‘oh fairest of creation, last and best of all god's works, creature in whom excelled whatever can to sight or thought be formed, wholly divine, good, amiable or sweet, how art thou lost? how on a sudden lost, defaced, deflowered and now to death devote, rather how has thou yielded to transgress the strict forbiddance, how to violate the sacred fruit forbidden. @@ -1792,7 +1792,7 @@ i think there are many functions that it serves. do children develop at roughly the same rate? can you say that all three year olds are roughly the same? you can say that three year olds are more like other three year olds than, say, thirty year olds would be like other thirty year olds, and the younger the child the more true that is, so that would be much more true at age a year, assuming that there aren't any physical defects or mental defects, than say at three. -so by three, yes, there is some variation, but they are certainly there is less variation than you would get at the end of the secondary school or university. +so by three, yes, there is some variation, but they are certainly there is less variation than you would get at the end of the secondary school or university. and are there quite specific stages that one can recognise perhaps as a developmental psychologist which take place at roughly particular times in a child's development? very broadly. could you give me some idea of what these might be in the very early years perhaps? @@ -1801,9 +1801,9 @@ i feel that once parents begin to become too aware of norms, they worry, and the if there is no speech by three, indeed if there is no speech earlier than that, it might be very important to check that the child is not deaf. i think also you would expect children who are really quite young, well before the first year, to be showing social interest in other adults around, and if they're not it might be worth checking that there isn't some problem with the child. but generally speaking i'm not very happy about norms. -oh well we won't press you on that particular point then. +oh well we won't press you on that particular point then. there's been a lot of publicity recently about parents teaching their own children, rather formal things. -there have been one or two stories about youngsters who've become reached a very high level in mathematics, for example. +there have been one or two stories about youngsters who've become reached a very high level in mathematics, for example. are you in favour of parents teaching their own children? well can i come to that in a minute, because you said something i'd like to pick up. you said the child may not be developing in the way the parent expects the child to develop, and i think that it's very important for parents to check out their expectations. @@ -1834,11 +1834,11 @@ if parents really want to help their children, with reading specifically, i feel for instance, they don't understand, as she quotes in her book, what somebody is doing when they're reading a newspaper, or what it means when the postman looks at a envelope. now if parents, through playing games with their children that are based on words, could alert the child to the fact that print is a convention and that we can translate print into reality, obviously not as abstract as that, but just get the child used to knowing what print is, knowing what reading is, so that perhaps when they go to school they may well know this is a skill that they don't have, like they don't know, perhaps, how to ride a bike, they may not know how to swim, they certainly don't know how to drive a car, but they do know what sort of a thing driving a car is. in that way, i think they'd be much more prepared for learning the skill than if they go completely unprepared and see children looking at books and saying things and it makes no sense to them. -my last question is is really again about making children do things, as opposed to encouraging or helping them to do things. +my last question is is really again about making children do things, as opposed to encouraging or helping them to do things. you say that so far as you're concerned, it's all right for children to learn if in fact they're enjoying it and if in fact they want to and they're not being coerced. surely that makes the transition between home and school a rather traumatic one? having worked and been around the brighton first schools for many years, i would very much hope that the transition is not traumatic. -certainly, the most of the infant teachers i know take great pains to make sure that it is not traumatic and that the move from home to school is as easy as possible. +certainly, the most of the infant teachers i know take great pains to make sure that it is not traumatic and that the move from home to school is as easy as possible. now having said that, often the trauma, which goes back to my original remark, is the sheer number of children, the sort of social impact that a reception class can have. now if a parent can have introduced the child via nursery school to that amount of other children, then i think there should be very little trauma, but that isn't to say that as the child gets older they don't have to do things. but if a child has to do something because they can understand the end a which they're aiming, in the way that a footballer has to train, or a boxer has to train, then it becomes easier to do the equivalent of training. @@ -1893,7 +1893,7 @@ it's always an assumption that intelligence goes hand in hand with benevolence a i think there's probably a strong argument against that in human history, and i think we shouldn't naively expect these very intelligence creatures to be benevolently disposed towards us. another interesting idea that has been suggested is that there are extra terrestrials who are very intelligent. they haven't revealed their presence because our solar system is being treated rather like a nature reserve — that they don't want to interpose themselves and spoil a very classic example of study of a lesser civilization growing up. -but i think this is it's very close to science fiction — it's very hard to think of any biological argument which makes the probability of intelligent life evolving high. +but i think this is it's very close to science fiction — it's very hard to think of any biological argument which makes the probability of intelligent life evolving high. astronomers tend to always think the probability is high because they think there are so many sites on which life could develop, but the biologists take completely the opposite view, that there are so many evolutionary pathways that lead to biological dead ends, that this outweighs the number of sites on which life could develop. so i think the biologists would tend to say no, there is no advanced intelligent life probably in our galaxy. astronomers probably lean towards the idea that yes there is, and there are currently searches, i believe, in the united states erm beaming signals with characteristic wavelengths, erm in the hope that extra terrestrials will see them. @@ -1919,11 +1919,11 @@ some might be tempted to say in touch with reality, but i think i'd prefer on th and we hope that the influence and the benefits are reciprocal. now as part of all this, the centre is responsible for almost all the public lectures in the university, and we have been glad to make the open to the public at large, and therefore a very special welcome to those of you who have come in from outside. now in planning the series of centenary lectures for this session, i was very delighted to discover that this was james joyce's centenary year, and therefore had the chance at last to promote a lecture on him. -personally i can almost almost remember the days when erm ulysses was a bound book only to be read in plain cover after having been smuggled through the customs at folkestone, dover or newhaven. +personally i can almost almost remember the days when erm ulysses was a bound book only to be read in plain cover after having been smuggled through the customs at folkestone, dover or newhaven. these, you might say, were the days of innocence, hypocrisy and prejudice. i don't know whether they've gone. -i can even remember when finnegans wake was thought to be incomprehensible and the gentleman sitting on my right, george craig, is almost, but not quite, my contemporary at this university and i was genuinely delighted when he agreed to take on the herculean task of giving a lecture a centenary lecture on james joyce. -george, not unlike his subject, has spent about half his life in ireland west, north and south he tells me i said why not dublin and he says that's what i meant +i can even remember when finnegans wake was thought to be incomprehensible and the gentleman sitting on my right, george craig, is almost, but not quite, my contemporary at this university and i was genuinely delighted when he agreed to take on the herculean task of giving a lecture a centenary lecture on james joyce. +george, not unlike his subject, has spent about half his life in ireland west, north and south he tells me i said why not dublin and he says that's what i meant and the rest of his life in france and england, although i'm not sure whether what drove him from ireland was like that which drove his subjects from ireland — no doubt we shall see. he has taught in schools and universities in ireland and in france, and is now reader in french in this university, having been here since nineteen sixty six. i have it on unimpeachable authority that his abiding interest is the human voice — whether the one we hear when we speak, or the one that informs and sustains us whatever we read. @@ -1947,7 +1947,7 @@ and finally we would come to finnegans wake, apparently mocking our very attempt if then we have uneasy feelings about modern art, it looks as if joyce must confirm them a thousandfold. yet, even here, there is a puzzle, a strange, unplaceable something which doesn't quite fit with that account of the gradual driving out of the reader and the suggestion of a steady shift towards the rare and the difficult, for i would guess that anyone not put off in advance by suspicion or hearsay, anyone that is who has got as far as dipping into ulysses, say, will have come hard up against things that are startlingly, even discomfortingly, recognisable. words, of course, phrases, images, sequences, which connect with the very core of our inner experience, whether at its humblest or at its grandest. -and then again if agonisings about modern are seem to take us in one direction, the banning of books as reminded us, takes us in quite another, and we have to remember that for all practical purposes it was indeed a banned book for nearly fifteen years, from the twenties into the thirties. +and then again if agonisings about modern are seem to take us in one direction, the banning of books as reminded us, takes us in quite another, and we have to remember that for all practical purposes it was indeed a banned book for nearly fifteen years, from the twenties into the thirties. we are not, we think, so easily shocked now by the naming of the ways of need and desire, and that label too will be a poor guide to the kaleidoscopic experience which ulysses draws us into. here it would be tempting to assume, whether modestly or angrily, that there is another group of readers — the sophisticated, the expert, the professional, for whom such problems simply don't exist, or have long since been left behind. these readers, the assumption might run, are at ease with the complexities of rhythm and vision, pattern and play, and united by this ease are free to discriminate more and more finally the detail of the smallest fragment or the structure or the entire work. @@ -1973,7 +1973,7 @@ but because it is a writer who is giving us this, and a writer at the beginning and again and again in the stories comes the hint of separateness, of difference, as if to confirm this. say, from the first story, the sisters, a little moment like this one ‘it's bad for children’ said old cotter ‘because their minds are so impressionable. when children see things like that, you know, it has an affect.’ -i crammed my mouth with for fear i might give utterance to my anger. +i crammed my mouth with for fear i might give utterance to my anger. tiresome old red-nosed imbecile.’ or again that difference seen the other way round, as in these lines from the last great story, the dead. ‘he stretched himself cautiously along under the sheets and lay down beside his wife. @@ -2016,11 +2016,11 @@ strawberry jam? have you got any butter erm, no i haven't, claire has, nick some of hers. yeah. -i've got some marmite, and i'm just +i've got some marmite, and i'm just do you want some jam? claire's got some vitalite, i think. anything will do. -mike organized it, for me to go over there and then i didn't need to be there at all, cos noth nobody turned up. +mike organized it, for me to go over there and then i didn't need to be there at all, cos noth nobody turned up. ah. so i've er i'm sure they're really grateful for you @@ -2040,14 +2040,14 @@ so he'll need to go down there with his associates and had to evacuate the leisu oh, really? they just found this bomb and they were going to have a controlled explosion at the car park oh. -so, that made the day a bit more interesting, but he's been stuck with er, all these upper class councillors that telling him what his job is, and +so, that made the day a bit more interesting, but he's been stuck with er, all these upper class councillors that telling him what his job is, and don't go down very well. -he said, he's not impressed, and er, i think the idea that go at a meeting today, -yeah, turn that power off before you do any more to that it's silly isn't it ? +he said, he's not impressed, and er, i think the idea that go at a meeting today, +yeah, turn that power off before you do any more to that it's silly isn't it ? erm. yeah. -oh, buggery bollocks you take yours anyway,get on -erm, so like all their ideas, on the erm, you know the ideas they were putting +oh, buggery bollocks you take yours anyway,get on +erm, so like all their ideas, on the erm, you know the ideas they were putting yeah. were that in, in the borough there's lots of like fallen land, like, you know, esher common and things like that, yeah. @@ -2068,7 +2068,7 @@ yeah, no, that's doesn't bother her at all. i mean, they've been on their own for weeks, so. you know, at the w they like to spend their weekends with everybody. yeah, they don't want to section themselves off, obviously. -i mean, mike was like, you gonna stay down and i was, i haven't seen anybody at college all week, so i think i'd better go back, actually. +i mean, mike was like, you gonna stay down and i was, i haven't seen anybody at college all week, so i think i'd better go back, actually. but erm, i did tell maryanne if she wanted to go shopping tomorrow, i shall be around. oh, god, yeah, i've forgot abo mind you emily's coming back tomorrow, isn't she? possibly. @@ -2091,7 +2091,7 @@ now you know why you eat so many of 'em. i wanted to get the wholemeal ones, bloody out in tescos. the only thing, their bread's a bit crap in there. yeah. -never get, you know, as big a selection as i'd like to get in there. +never get, you know, as big a selection as i'd like to get in there. but, still beggars can't be choosers, they are cheap, they had loads of offers on them. mm. tins of baked beans, fourteen p. @@ -2100,7 +2100,7 @@ well, i should imagine they're just the same as their normal ones, and they've s i haven't tasted them yet. julia's had them and she said they were fine. erm, well, rice pudding. -only +only i don't like anything like that. i, i wouldn't buy it, but, emily eats it for breakfast. @@ -2117,21 +2117,21 @@ mm. yoghurts are expensive, aren't they? they are, that's why i got that offer for three big ones. actually, they did have six for fifty nine p in iceland, but the date was up on them like, sunday, and i thought, i won't get through all the them. -once they start going off it's not really worth having them, so. +once they start going off it's not really worth having them, so. bought me trusted cottage cheese. some parsnips, some carrots, cucumber, onion, apples. -didn't get the plates, i'm gonna get them tomorrow, it's too awkward to carry but i generally get nothing exciting. +didn't get the plates, i'm gonna get them tomorrow, it's too awkward to carry but i generally get nothing exciting. just the bare essentials. i've got masses. really. like, i've got half a pepper, and a piece of cheese and some, some kind of sp spread. spreads. erm, a loaf of bread i'm sharing with teresa. -two packets of cuppa soup, but i'm not sure that it wasn't cuppa soup, cos i've said to thomas, i'm not at the moment. +two packets of cuppa soup, but i'm not sure that it wasn't cuppa soup, cos i've said to thomas, i'm not at the moment. really? erm, so cheese on toast, and cuppa soup for you, then. probably be nothing, actually. -i eat, i went, when i went round to maryanne and my baked bread next door, i like i went down, i went in there before, before i went upstairs into the flat, and bought a, a roll for twelve p. +i eat, i went, when i went round to maryanne and my baked bread next door, i like i went down, i went in there before, before i went upstairs into the flat, and bought a, a roll for twelve p. oh, yeah, that was good. mm. soft roll, and then erm, i had a viennese whirl with it, and i sat and had that with my can of diet coke that dad bought a can of drink on the train this morning and never drank. @@ -2164,11 +2164,11 @@ really? they're just so big, it's incredible. you just can't envisage, you know, why and how they managed to afford such extravagant graves, and it's like on two sides of a road, on one side you can only go in, and if you're on a guided tour, erm, otherwise you've got to, be like, somebody to do with the grave. really? -you know er personally attached to the grave, or go on a guided tour, and er, like you've got to wear certain bits of clothing, you gotta be like, you gotta be properly dressed, er, you're not allowed to eat or drink in there, there's all these things, like, you know, really +you know er personally attached to the grave, or go on a guided tour, and er, like you've got to wear certain bits of clothing, you gotta be like, you gotta be properly dressed, er, you're not allowed to eat or drink in there, there's all these things, like, you know, really into that. yeah? but it looks fantastic. -it looks, you know, i mean, it's to say that, it sounds really weird, but it +it looks, you know, i mean, it's to say that, it sounds really weird, but it yeah. so mysterious and strange in there, that it would be really interesting been in there. @@ -2201,8 +2201,8 @@ and er oh that was nice. then he's gone off to coventry, and then over to manchester. so er, -it's quite to get on with your bruv . -yeah, because you know, we're always messing about, or around, or, you know, never like you know, together, really +it's quite to get on with your bruv . +yeah, because you know, we're always messing about, or around, or, you know, never like you know, together, really yeah. because even when i go up to his place, like it's always been, like dropping him off, always being in a hurry. i mean, i sat in his room, had a coffee today, it was like, i actually sat here and relaxed and always being on the move, you know. @@ -2210,7 +2210,7 @@ yeah, yeah, always moving around. i said, you know, i really appreciate it, i mean, the house is gorgeous, but you know, at the end of the day, it's so nice, he's so lucky. is it? and er, you know the people there. -the lady that he, he works for,sorry, the erm, she's, have i told you she does outside catering? +the lady that he, he works for,sorry, the erm, she's, have i told you she does outside catering? yes. and she's doing the outside catering for the world champion, world chess championships. oh. @@ -2230,7 +2230,7 @@ she's been doing it for twenty days. really? and they were all very impressed because she'd done twenty different dinners, in twenty days. really? -they were given a different meal every day so erm, she was pleased with herself. +they were given a different meal every day so erm, she was pleased with herself. is she married, they got, was there a husband there? oh, yeah. he's a london taxi driver. @@ -2241,19 +2241,19 @@ so mark said they were out celebrating after he cam and he's working for them ne yeah. and er, he's got to do the drinks. oh, that's good, isn't it? -so he gets twenty five pound for the for the night, and he hasn't got to start until about nine o'clock anyway so erm that's, that's something for him to do, isn't it? +so he gets twenty five pound for the for the night, and he hasn't got to start until about nine o'clock anyway so erm that's, that's something for him to do, isn't it? oh, that's really good. yep. -erm, jay's sister, tamsin it's her twenty first on monday, so he was, like, write out her birthday card, right, and he was like, trying to write something funny, so he was constructing this thing, like reading it out to me, and half an hour when i first got there. +erm, jay's sister, tamsin it's her twenty first on monday, so he was, like, write out her birthday card, right, and he was like, trying to write something funny, so he was constructing this thing, like reading it out to me, and half an hour when i first got there. yeah. and er, it was very amusing, but repeatable, half the things he wrote in it, and erm, it's very, it was very good, but, he is quite good at that when he sets his mind to it, it usually takes him about three days to do it, but he does like to er, write messages in people's cards. and er he's a laugh, your brother. -he's a nut-case. up to him seems a it's mark, i couldn't believe it. -it was like, get on to those bloody phone people, he said, i was on the phone to them for half an hour, yesterday, he said haven't turned up, he said, and i organized m i work around and everything. +he's a nut-case. up to him seems a it's mark, i couldn't believe it. +it was like, get on to those bloody phone people, he said, i was on the phone to them for half an hour, yesterday, he said haven't turned up, he said, and i organized m i work around and everything. he said, and then i got you to come along, he said, and it's all for nothing. it's always the bloody way, innit? -and i said, well go and pick the phone up oh, yes, we have got a phone, actually +and i said, well go and pick the phone up oh, yes, we have got a phone, actually before you start whacking your breasts. mm. i haven't had a phone all week. @@ -2263,22 +2263,22 @@ i mean, erm, you know, at least we're all sort of easy walking distance of one a like we council with our daily contacts through college, but that's true. like, you know, everyone's far away from them. -exactly, they +exactly, they quite a distance, haven't they?especially for emergencies. it's worrying, mm. isn't it to think that yeah. someone can't get hold of you. -right, okay,my boudoir, i've just seen a few things together. +right, okay,my boudoir, i've just seen a few things together. i should get changed, really, but i'll, no. -what i'll do, is i'll if i give you my clean shirt, you take it round to yours. +what i'll do, is i'll if i give you my clean shirt, you take it round to yours. if i want to change, i'll put it, the only thing is, if we do go up the bar, i think i'll be a bit warm, in something like this won't i? yeah, that's the trouble isn't it? but it's so cold out there. -i know, it's a bloody, it's such a pain in the arse, because you freeze to death, bloody getting up there, and then when you get in there, it's so bloody hot. -so start with what the hell which is really quite aggravating really. +i know, it's a bloody, it's such a pain in the arse, because you freeze to death, bloody getting up there, and then when you get in there, it's so bloody hot. +so start with what the hell which is really quite aggravating really. sorry? it's quite aggravating, innit? mm. @@ -2286,7 +2286,7 @@ right, she did take that book with her, didn't she? yeah. was she supposed to then? right, lipstick, lipstick, lipstick. -lipstick on your collar told a tale on you +lipstick on your collar told a tale on you really. oops you need some more curtain hooks. @@ -2295,19 +2295,19 @@ no. is that how many there were up there? yeah . or have they nicked some? -they they tended to spread them out a bit, about the house, you know, just willy-nilly, where they were wanted. +they they tended to spread them out a bit, about the house, you know, just willy-nilly, where they were wanted. they're just normal ones, aren't they? oh, i expect so. i know, does look a bit silly, doesn't it? -they shouldn't be like that, we should, like, be able to pull cords and curtains as well gathering them a bit. +they shouldn't be like that, we should, like, be able to pull cords and curtains as well gathering them a bit. they are gathered even now. you probably can do in that, i just haven't mucked around with it. -it just needs somebody to have a look at it, but i just can't be bothered. +it just needs somebody to have a look at it, but i just can't be bothered. time, right, okay. right, if i can just give this shirt to you, annette. i'll get you a bag for it. -my hairbrush in there as well hmm, sort my life out for me. +my hairbrush in there as well hmm, sort my life out for me. what else do i, i don't need anything else, do i? it's not raining out there, is it raining? it's dry. @@ -2318,17 +2318,17 @@ probably start raining soon, erm do you want to go and sit in the lounge, joanna? yeah, okay. sorry, er, -this is general, got me, got me microphone. +this is general, got me, got me microphone. micro what you done ? wrecking me house. wrecking our house, sorry, yeah, i don't mean to exclude you. so did you what is it? -oh what to record our conversation. +oh what to record our conversation. this is, this is the micro yeah. this is the whatsit. -oh, no doing that. +oh, no doing that. oh, don't be stupid, some of us have done it before. erm, it's like nobody turned up. @@ -2401,7 +2401,7 @@ no, not a scrapbook . a word. it was, well it is, you, you stick in pieces of articles, into a book, you're collecting them. just any articles? -well, they have to correspond to the lecture, so the lecture this week was, world population. +well, they have to correspond to the lecture, so the lecture this week was, world population. had to so it. like the world, and business? @@ -2413,13 +2413,13 @@ i don't know where i'm gonna get them from. and then world in it, it gets a bit easier, because they go on to like health, age, i know i'll be able to find loads to stuff on age, won't i? -world population, erm probably what i'm gonna have to do is, although they, they said you can't do it don't get any ideas about doing it with because it's not possible. +world population, erm probably what i'm gonna have to do is, although they, they said you can't do it don't get any ideas about doing it with because it's not possible. it is possible mm. -cos if i find that i can't find something, i'll just have to look like +cos if i find that i can't find something, i'll just have to look like keep looking as you're going along yeah, do you know what i mean? -so, that's what is. +so, that's what is. and it's just like, and they want you to make some comment on what you've worked out, which is no problem really, is it? do you know that newspaper that they brought out, the european, and it's like, just to, just to yeah. @@ -2437,16 +2437,16 @@ no. is it really sick? mm. not really, it's a bit rude, i suppose. -it's of erm,photo coloured photograph of, it's either a bloke or a woman, you can't tell, from there to about there, so you can see all the hair and everything it's got on the skin h i v positive. +it's of erm,photo coloured photograph of, it's either a bloke or a woman, you can't tell, from there to about there, so you can see all the hair and everything it's got on the skin h i v positive. oh, i think i have seen it. ah, that's terrible. they're just out to shock, aren't they? yeah, i think it's a good way, and, cos it makes people go, bloody hell. and then they take note of what the issue is, yeah. realize, don't they, yeah. -so i've got all ready, for me aids cos i used to just think oh i don't really, i could just go and get some leaflets on ban on +so i've got all ready, for me aids cos i used to just think oh i don't really, i could just go and get some leaflets on ban on true. -well, i must ad i'll probably end up going down there, and getting the +well, i must ad i'll probably end up going down there, and getting the our local chemist at home. yeah, they've, they've always got this good stand, haven't they? all this stuff, loads of stuff down there about pregnancy, and measles. @@ -2458,7 +2458,7 @@ i like this girl, cos she's welsh, just, i can't do her accent, but she kept say he'd obviously taken time over building up this little booklet explaining the stuff. she just destroyed it in one go. really? -like he, he was like saying, it's got to be a the word book, will eventually he was really getting into it and really going into about, you know, how it's really gonna be jam- packed with important information, and she just said,so it's just like a scrapbook really you know, when if you've filled all that up +like he, he was like saying, it's got to be a the word book, will eventually he was really getting into it and really going into about, you know, how it's really gonna be jam- packed with important information, and she just said,so it's just like a scrapbook really you know, when if you've filled all that up yeah. and somebody said that. it's like, oh yeah, thanks. @@ -2469,21 +2469,21 @@ he was really pissed off . oh, you're gonna go down well. yeah. yeah. -but yeah, it's alright, it's okay but not a lot's going on, really, i haven't been in any activities for ages. +but yeah, it's alright, it's okay but not a lot's going on, really, i haven't been in any activities for ages. there's quite a few erm, posters up, asking you to go along to join, the netball fiasco you're not exactly erm, -no it's changed the er they've got quite a few plays going on, they've got chess going on +no it's changed the er they've got quite a few plays going on, they've got chess going on really? -with er, what d'ya call it, barbara you know? +with er, what d'ya call it, barbara you know? oh, right, the musical. -have you seen about +have you seen about er, barbara dickson and elaine paige. yeah, yeah that one. they've got that one going on. have they. that should be quite good to watch. -and er, and they've they're out doing the rocky horror show as well. -surely erm, what's her face, er, jane was it jane? +and er, and they've they're out doing the rocky horror show as well. +surely erm, what's her face, er, jane was it jane? no, she hasn't. yeah, i don't know why. how's she getting on with her drama, do you know? @@ -2512,7 +2512,7 @@ is he?take a year out. really? start a new job as well, yeah. -like he doesn't know if he's going on a bit at the moment, he's just wandering about, +like he doesn't know if he's going on a bit at the moment, he's just wandering about, yeah. we'll see. but i don't know what she's gonna do. @@ -2545,7 +2545,7 @@ oh no, so what happens then? so, security guard came over, and if you go up to the next stop,bus, you could come in with them. so we got on that bus, and he didn't like it, this bus driver,oh, you're not supposed to be on here what, because you hadn't parked your cars there first? -yeah, but the thing is, we're not from college, so that means their students are gonna be, like, pushed out. +yeah, but the thing is, we're not from college, so that means their students are gonna be, like, pushed out. yeah. so anyway, we got on, and he well, that's their problem, they should get more bloody buses. @@ -2574,7 +2574,7 @@ so i can't drive there said you can't get on the bus either . no. that's what i said. -well, the good thing is, where southlands is, which is on the south which is a very nice area. +well, the good thing is, where southlands is, which is on the south which is a very nice area. well, it's not that nice, but there's a hell of a lot of little roads, all around it, it's not a like roundtree is, is it? it's just on a little main road, but it's situated almost in this housing estate. they must say, god they must get pissed off with it, so i've already looked around, and there's loads of parking places, @@ -2582,21 +2582,21 @@ mm. there's no yellow lines, there's loads of little roads. that's true. i mean, i could park it there, if nicole didn't want to drive. -but the, the bus, the erm staggered. +but the, the bus, the erm staggered. you got a bus at eight fifteen, and you got another bus at one o'clock, and you got another bus at three o'clock, and another bus at six you serious? and, and if you wanna come home, there's supposed to be a bus at half past four, and our lecture finished at quarter to four, so you like, three quarters of an hour to get to the bus, right, and then it didn't turn up. so we had to wait for the next bus, which was six o'clock. oh no. it's a long time. -we were sitting like this, sitting on the pavement, with our umbrellas up +we were sitting like this, sitting on the pavement, with our umbrellas up imagine what it'd be like, when it's really cold. and i thought to myself, oh gosh, just drive up there, yeah. it's only a ten minute drive. yeah. i picked the right time. -see that's the thing, if i wanna go and do my studying, i can't just go, i have to and, and dinner starts at erm, if i've got a lecture, my lecture is sort of one o'clock. +see that's the thing, if i wanna go and do my studying, i can't just go, i have to and, and dinner starts at erm, if i've got a lecture, my lecture is sort of one o'clock. just before one o'clock and the bus goes at five past one. so i haven't got time to get any dinner. no. @@ -2622,7 +2622,7 @@ fifteen to southlands to whiteland. it's all round in a circle, it's not like then, i don't know why. how peculiar. yeah, it is a bit of a pain. -but the people who q t s course, have got a lot of work. +but the people who q t s course, have got a lot of work. have they? mm, much more than me. i'm glad i'm not doing that. @@ -2635,7 +2635,7 @@ really? i mean, ann finished lectures, ann's finished lectures yesterday, she's a secondary teacher and she doesn't have a lecture again until after christmas. really? and she's got another two weeks off now, until she goes into schools and then she's in the schools full-time, but even so, she won't have, she didn't have exams. -she had exams last january, didn't she, and she hasn't had exams since last january, she won't have until next during june. +she had exams last january, didn't she, and she hasn't had exams since last january, she won't have until next during june. really? and like, she has, like, although she's doing secondary teaching, she has it easier than anybody. mm. @@ -2644,18 +2644,18 @@ i mean, it'll probably get harder. i wouldn't mind doing that, if there was, if i could do secondary teaching. really? mm. -but i wouldn't wanna do primary or junior, just +but i wouldn't wanna do primary or junior, just well do, would you be, is it t t s, secondary, t t s, weren't it? -no, but +no, but primary well, in t t s t t s they can't do secondary. only do primary and junior. oh, no in, in our college they're doing secondary. -cos i asked them about it, and they said i'd much rather be doing that. +cos i asked them about it, and they said i'd much rather be doing that. mm, yeah i would really. small ones, i just don't think there's much, get much out of it get much, getting much out of it. -i mean, some, some people at our section which is four and five year olds. +i mean, some, some people at our section which is four and five year olds. it's not bad. it's like being in a play-group, innit? yeah. @@ -2672,14 +2672,14 @@ that's when you said. you've got to have one in november. surely they did have one last year, didn't they their outing. kerry would have had one. -well, i looked at my list and it says february, and i've got a list of my lectures for every week. +well, i looked at my list and it says february, and i've got a list of my lectures for every week. really? yeah. that sounds odd though, surely. -does have one? +does have one? next term's a long term as well. is it? -we did agree to meet, but i don't same time tomorrow. +we did agree to meet, but i don't same time tomorrow. and i asked him i said, what does this reading week mean, and he went, oh, just do what you want, really. cos i've got a reading week in three we two weeks, two weeks. i don't know when it is. @@ -2705,7 +2705,7 @@ yours is on eight. you got an eight week term. yeah, we've got an eight week term, the last term's eight weeks. so long to christmas. -cos your the last ones aren't you? +cos your the last ones aren't you? mm. what was i saying? seems odd, i'm sure he showed me, he showed me a reading week before christmas. @@ -2714,7 +2714,7 @@ tight. i'm sure we should. mind you i'll ask him, cos he'll know. -perhaps i i should. +perhaps i i should. yeah, it is due, i'm sure it's due. yeah. yeah. @@ -2730,22 +2730,22 @@ oh, that's alright. half my year's gonna be gone, and i'm sort of, going for the third year, and it's really heavy. oh. it's going so quick. -but erm i'm sure you're right. +but erm i'm sure you're right. maybe i have done, maybe it's just not printing it. they normally have one a year, they probably just haven't edited up. we had two though, didn't we? didn't we have one la in the second year,or something, i'm sure we did. we didn't rebecca. -oh, didn't we oh, that's what it is, then, you get yours in february. +oh, didn't we oh, that's what it is, then, you get yours in february. that's what i'm saying to you. -ah, bit silly though, innit, starting +ah, bit silly though, innit, starting i'm sure we had another reading week. oh, shit, you're just like me, you are. -i swear blue in the face that i'm right, and then somebody comes on and goes oh yeah. +i swear blue in the face that i'm right, and then somebody comes on and goes oh yeah. well, put it this way, if it isn't on sunday, it's a bit of a long time, because i come back january the fourteenth, fourteenth, and i've had all christmas off, haven't i? -so i'm gonna be back, like a week, you think they'd make it a bit more so i've done most of -no, i know what i'm thinking of, i'm, if ever, i'm thinking of revision week, cos that was a week, we wasn't it? +so i'm gonna be back, like a week, you think they'd make it a bit more so i've done most of +no, i know what i'm thinking of, i'm, if ever, i'm thinking of revision week, cos that was a week, we wasn't it? yeah. and then we had another revision week in june. see , there's two revision weeks, and a reading week. @@ -2762,7 +2762,7 @@ suppose to be a reading week. i know, i know, i'm gonna be in it. i've got so much bloody reading to do. i've got loads -has miss gone +has miss gone she's coming back either tonight or, she gone home already. she's gone home, yeah. @@ -2803,21 +2803,21 @@ i said, yeah, tell her that i got the message, and that you know, it's all fine. okay then, right, see you later. bye. i spoke to him last night as well. -i mean, when i think i was with my bags and things and he went,jo, the message has gone through, everything's fine i went,your sister, i relayed that little message which i thought was which i thought was rather comical, you see, and i said, oh did you, and he said yeah. +i mean, when i think i was with my bags and things and he went,jo, the message has gone through, everything's fine i went,your sister, i relayed that little message which i thought was which i thought was rather comical, you see, and i said, oh did you, and he said yeah. he said, everything's okay, she's got measles. he's a nice bloke. yeah. he seems like fluid poems. -her and kate will come and see me at four o'clock and her and kate will come and visit you. +her and kate will come and see me at four o'clock and her and kate will come and visit you. they will not be coming to the cinema, and i was like, what time are they gonna come, and he was like, hang on, i haven't finished yet. -four o'clock, and he was like read it and he oh,only fed ten p in and i got all the information that i needed to know. +four o'clock, and he was like read it and he oh,only fed ten p in and i got all the information that i needed to know. yeah, i've written it all out in block. mm. he was only seventeen, wasn't he? mm. is he really? yeah, i think he was bored with this. -how can you go to our while you're only seventeen. +how can you go to our while you're only seventeen. that's illegal isn't it? to be eighteen. he's just turned eighteen. @@ -2853,25 +2853,25 @@ he said, whereas my mum over there in the corner, he said, if she had a bash i h and i'd go, yeah. it's like yeah. he said, yeah, i like being home with the family. -he said, but i'm only going back out there another he said, so it won't be too long. +he said, but i'm only going back out there another he said, so it won't be too long. i said, yeah. it's not. -fancy jane going and having a bust-up down the +fancy jane going and having a bust-up down the i'm not surprised, christ. she's relaying all marital problems, to everyone, wouldn't she. they're alike though, ain't they? did you see her when she busting out of her dress. -erm, your, i think it was dwayne or was it, it's either dwayne, or erm, er bob knocked a glass over, and er,jane was like erm, trying to like, she was like going edward move away, i'm trying to sh i'm trying, look, i'm trying to stop people dancing round here, and like, these, all this, this er, glass on the floor, right, jane was standing there going like this, dancing round all this glass, and like she was going like this, and everyone that walked past, she was going,broken glass and she was saying, and she was, she kept on going broken glass, they done it. +erm, your, i think it was dwayne or was it, it's either dwayne, or erm, er bob knocked a glass over, and er,jane was like erm, trying to like, she was like going edward move away, i'm trying to sh i'm trying, look, i'm trying to stop people dancing round here, and like, these, all this, this er, glass on the floor, right, jane was standing there going like this, dancing round all this glass, and like she was going like this, and everyone that walked past, she was going,broken glass and she was saying, and she was, she kept on going broken glass, they done it. and she's still dancing, it's really funny . -she's ain't she? +she's ain't she? oh dear. -she started crying one +she started crying one yeah, i know she did, i saw her. shouldn't keep smoking and fighting in the middle of the front room. she was crying in the pub. -talking about how much she hated -the bloke +talking about how much she hated +the bloke he's so drunk, he don't . she goes,piss off . yeah. @@ -2882,7 +2882,7 @@ she was pretty upset, though, weren't she? well, she upsets herself. yeah. she's a bit like that. -bit +bit ain't she? someone walked past her, and spilt all the drink down her front, that didn't go down very well. trip. @@ -2893,11 +2893,11 @@ he was just, oh, it was funny. he deliberately, i was standing next to him,he was just leaning on me. that's dwayne. just leaning on me. -you know that they all disgust me, and er, john went yeah, that's the sort of woman i like. -comes carrying a load of in her hand. +you know that they all disgust me, and er, john went yeah, that's the sort of woman i like. +comes carrying a load of in her hand. it was like, shut up. he's a real prat, ain't he? -i was sitting there going,ha ha ha got a stuck. +i was sitting there going,ha ha ha got a stuck. i tell oh, lord. that's a pint glass gone. @@ -2920,11 +2920,11 @@ where do you get that then? oh you think he bought the glass like it. yeah, it's, it's just the same as that. do you think he bought the glass like it? -no, i don't think +no, i don't think yeah, but how could jim do that? it's just a stick-on thing. oh. -i knew before. +i knew before. mm. i think that's good, that is. good laugh. @@ -2940,7 +2940,7 @@ haven't you? no. ah really erm, food. -it's something like it's called. +it's something like it's called. it's not have a shave. i know it's not called have a shave . oh, i saw a poster like that. @@ -2967,7 +2967,7 @@ erm, so i think we're going to that crap. i don't care really. right on. the drink's, the drink's cheap, ain't it? -well, it's not it's right i suppose. +well, it's not it's right i suppose. it's not really cheap is it? it's not at our place, though, is it? isn't it? @@ -2976,9 +2976,9 @@ else's is more, more subsidized than our, though. yeah, ours is bad. but it's still cheaper than a pub. yeah, yeah. -so we'll have a couple of drinks and that's it for tonight. +so we'll have a couple of drinks and that's it for tonight. mhm. -jane said that last week, cos i thought it was a disco, cos when it first described it me, it was real crap, and there was this colour guy and his friend, and all they wanted to play was black, they looked like they got no bones when they were dancing. +jane said that last week, cos i thought it was a disco, cos when it first described it me, it was real crap, and there was this colour guy and his friend, and all they wanted to play was black, they looked like they got no bones when they were dancing. you know like, dislocated themselves. it's really really, oh no. @@ -2990,22 +2990,22 @@ yeah, he really did, and the record would end, and then he'd plonk back. so they were just playing the music that they liked. it was only those two dancing all night. oh, what. -that's what made it so obvious, because it was, he would put the records on, and then come out and start dancing, and i thought i'm not going that no, they played that,sh what's it, shake, shake, shake the room, +that's what made it so obvious, because it was, he would put the records on, and then come out and start dancing, and i thought i'm not going that no, they played that,sh what's it, shake, shake, shake the room, bought that. oh, she didn't, oh remember the other day,take that. i didn't ask. oh. -i didn't even supposed +i didn't even supposed would it? she said, yeah. -ought to see lounge, she's got take that disco, and take that +ought to see lounge, she's got take that disco, and take that oh, jesus, she's driving us up the wall. she's trying to go out and get tickets to see 'em. is she? she's got tickets. that's the trouble, but we got a note through the door this morning from our friend kerry. don't buy the take that tickets. -i'll explain later,and she's last night . +i'll explain later,and she's last night . oh no. i think it's really funny, cos it's thirty quid she's spent on two tickets, and she's telling us, she's got no money. she's spent fifteen quid on her tickets for the concert. @@ -3032,10 +3032,10 @@ that's true. too true. does kerry like take that any more, or has she gone off them? i don't know really. -trouble is +trouble is you don't communicate any more, do you? no, she's a bit odd, kerry, listening to the rolling stones and u b forty. -bit out her ain't she? +bit out her ain't she? especially at the volume she listens to it. i know. listens phworgh. @@ -3049,21 +3049,21 @@ you have to go and knock on her door, cos she can't hear you shouting. is it loud ? yeah. she's got to, to, i mean, she could have it that loud at ten o'clock at night, she just doesn't, she doesn't think. -she doesn't realize that everyone else is in bed asleep. -and, and the telly on as well, cos every night i come everything going. -including the hairdryer, just +she doesn't realize that everyone else is in bed asleep. +and, and the telly on as well, cos every night i come everything going. +including the hairdryer, just oh dear. -she didn't look very happy at your party did she? +she didn't look very happy at your party did she? no. great big coat on, must have been sweating her eyeballs out. -i kept telling her to take it off +i kept telling her to take it off she said it was new, so but she said, i can't be bothered. she's this massive big coat on, and i said to her,sh i said, she said, i said you alright, kerry -she's too much yeah. +she's too much yeah. big ain't it. -makes her look even -it's really massive innit. +makes her look even +it's really massive innit. yeah. lisa had one of them for a little while. yeah. @@ -3075,14 +3075,14 @@ i suppose so. it's all the fashion, innit? yeah. rather be spivvy. -on the back of his it's just so sad. +on the back of his it's just so sad. cut as well, innit? i know. my brother, oh, it's sad. my brother's got this mate at school, called victor. he's got a pair of shearing scissors and he's been doing like, this boy's african, so he's got, you know, afro hair, which you can do curly-wurly signs on the back of him, it looks pretty neat. but ryan decided that he'd have his head shaved at the back of his head, so he got this boy to write his name on. -it shows you how thick this boy is, he wrote on his name, he spelt it r i e n . +it shows you how thick this boy is, he wrote on his name, he spelt it r i e n . rien. and this is really sad, and he told me mum that he'd been to a hairdressers and done it. oh, did he? @@ -3091,14 +3091,14 @@ how did you know it was his friend done it? cos of nat cos natalie, she's a right little squealer, she is. i don't, natalie's samantha's sister. erm, she, she at school with ryan, -i don't suppose the hairdresser +i don't suppose the hairdresser in the same year. well, my brother had a smack, cos natalie tells her what ryan's been up cos she's a bit like that, erm, likes to sort of erm, squeal, you know. she said, have you seen ryan's hair. i said, yeah, and she went ah, she went, victor did that. -i went what ? +i went what ? i went, is this this well hard bloke from brixton, cos ryan keeps going on about it, like we i said, is he do, i said, oh, we went to oxford street today, and he went, is that anywhere near brixton? -i went i don't think so, ryan, and he went, ah, cos i wanna go up there, it's well hard up there. +i went i don't think so, ryan, and he went, ah, cos i wanna go up there, it's well hard up there. i thought, why he's saying that, and then i looked, and victor comes through now, and he went, yeah, i wan he goes, i wanna go up london and get some clothes, get some really stylish stuff up london, i was like, yeah, ryan. i said, you only get a bigger selection, that's about it. he said, no you don't. @@ -3106,13 +3106,13 @@ victor says. and i thought like ah, and then mum sa i told mum, and she went you bastard, he told me that he gone and went to the hairdressers and done that. she went, right i'll get him, and i went, oh don't mum, i said, don't embarrass him. do you know what she said, she went, what, i'm gonna bloody see that victor. -i went,no you're not i said, don't do that, it's not nice, mum. +i went,no you're not i said, don't do that, it's not nice, mum. i said, you wouldn't like it. she went, oh, she went oh i won't, i'll just wind him up. -and ryan came in and she went oh, she went, i just learned who did er, your er little bit of hairstyling there ryan. +and ryan came in and she went oh, she went, i just learned who did er, your er little bit of hairstyling there ryan. she went, he's pretty good with a pair clippers, ain't he, old victor. -well, i went ha ha ha and she went, yes, i have heard, and he went, yeah, well, well, well, i mean, he just didn't how to spell my name. -and she went, you wait,mu my mum went +well, i went ha ha ha and she went, yes, i have heard, and he went, yeah, well, well, well, i mean, he just didn't how to spell my name. +and she went, you wait,mu my mum went she gobbled him up with it. yeah. my mum went, you wait till i see victor, she said, i'm gonna bloody have him. @@ -3145,12 +3145,12 @@ he's made a right mess of it. he shaved up the back, hasn't he? it's odd and even. yeah, but, yeah -and you get this, this bit here +and you get this, this bit here he's all shaved, his hair come back over it. see like, long hair here, so it's hanging down, scraggily,so you've got like a shaved head, with all these bits here ain't ya? so it covers it up a little bit, but it looks like he's gone bald. no. -because he's like, long bits of hair, like this thick, hanging over, a shaved head,and you know, you know tina, you know tina turner, you know her husband kept on going like this all the time yeah mine does that all the time yeah, i go oh pack it in. +because he's like, long bits of hair, like this thick, hanging over, a shaved head,and you know, you know tina, you know tina turner, you know her husband kept on going like this all the time yeah mine does that all the time yeah, i go oh pack it in. like peter, you know, he does all this, like he keeps going, oh show it to me, i can't i'm trying to grow it. i'm trying it down, like, so it's round here. do you think it'd be good like that, and i went, yes ryan it'd look much better. @@ -3158,13 +3158,13 @@ cos he keeps growing his hair, to sort of there, and then he has it cut off, don cos he has to have it undercut, cos that's hard. he's full of being hard, isn't he, ryan? he is, ain't he, just full of it. -oh i've got something, erm, peter's in prison, +oh i've got something, erm, peter's in prison, oh no, really? three years. you're joking. no. really? -i when i went, you know when i went down, do you remember i told you that i got caught up with him? +i when i went, you know when i went down, do you remember i told you that i got caught up with him? yeah. and like i went down for that one monday. yeah. @@ -3175,7 +3175,7 @@ really? and it's taken all this time to come round. yeah, yeah, and now it's come round three years. -three years er three years, five years if he misbehaves, and clayton,you say, eighteen. +three years er three years, five years if he misbehaves, and clayton,you say, eighteen. yeah two years if he's good. bloody hell. @@ -3204,7 +3204,7 @@ yeah, but he don't know that, does he? i know. he thinks his, you know, he thinks his i wonder how julia's bearing up, even though it's all broken up. -yeah, he does, he thinks it's another just that he has a little drink now and then. +yeah, he does, he thinks it's another just that he has a little drink now and then. now and then. just a few, yeah. just a few, just a tipple. @@ -3215,17 +3215,17 @@ no, why's that? you know what he's like. big mouth? yeah. -he'd be on about it. +he'd be on about it. he won't find out, will he? no, i know. but it's just ryan really, anybody that's in any shit, ryan really aspires to. oh yeah. -like cos he was asking me about shane +like cos he was asking me about shane was shane good at school? -did he, did he used to be naughty and i was like, i don't ryan, and you got, i bet he did. +did he, did he used to be naughty and i was like, i don't ryan, and you got, i bet he did. you know, anybody, and like, he sees, if he sees erm, who else does he relief fund. -there's a poster up in erm, and these two people that are drug addicts, and said like,did you see that i'd drawn a pair of ears on one of them, turned around and seen shane and he's like his mate was the other one, weren't it? +there's a poster up in erm, and these two people that are drug addicts, and said like,did you see that i'd drawn a pair of ears on one of them, turned around and seen shane and he's like his mate was the other one, weren't it? ryan loved that . have you seen that poster. holy communion. @@ -3233,11 +3233,11 @@ poor boy. don't tell him blue eyes oh dear. i know that's not funny, but, it is funny. -it is +it is ryan just revels in anybody who's been naughty, he think he really is spite which i think is a bit frightening in a child, really. -it is because he'll be +it is because he'll be yeah -looks to just led into +looks to just led into yeah, he is, he's very easily led, ryan, you know, and he's very into, you know, getting on with the gang. which is really sad. but erm, he's a little shit. @@ -3250,17 +3250,17 @@ yeah. but the sad thing is, he's got he's got quite a bit of brain, ain't he, to come out, you know, little things like, although they're rude, he's obviously aware, but he's wasting it all, ain't he? i know. quite intelligent. -it's like, what was he, he was going, oh that's right,he keeps going, i can't, but they're cold now but he was like, at the dinner table once, right, and ryan and gran argue continuously, and he was going erm, and he went, gran, and gran went, yeah, and he went, do you know what you are, and gran went no, and he went, well, i can't remember what it's called, he goes, they're this, i think it's a hybrid, he goes, you're a hybrid. -he goes, do you know what one of them is, he goes, it's just sort of like evolutionary thing between the ape and man, and he goes, it's sort of part way between, and it's sort of like some sort of creature, and it's half like an ape and half like a human, and he goes, and you're one of them he goes, you're one of them gran, he goes, you've got a brain like one of them, as well, and gran just like went oh shut up ryan. +it's like, what was he, he was going, oh that's right,he keeps going, i can't, but they're cold now but he was like, at the dinner table once, right, and ryan and gran argue continuously, and he was going erm, and he went, gran, and gran went, yeah, and he went, do you know what you are, and gran went no, and he went, well, i can't remember what it's called, he goes, they're this, i think it's a hybrid, he goes, you're a hybrid. +he goes, do you know what one of them is, he goes, it's just sort of like evolutionary thing between the ape and man, and he goes, it's sort of part way between, and it's sort of like some sort of creature, and it's half like an ape and half like a human, and he goes, and you're one of them he goes, you're one of them gran, he goes, you've got a brain like one of them, as well, and gran just like went oh shut up ryan. she doesn't really know what to say. oh, shut up ryan, and then he sits there for a bit,and she goes, yeah well, you used to wear national health spectacles. -ha ha ha and ryan goes, oh shut up gran. +ha ha ha and ryan goes, oh shut up gran. but he's like, when they think they can get any little thing they can think of to wind each other up. it was so amusing. but it just go ryan is, you know, he's a bright boy. yeah, i know, it's sad ain't it? -but like,mi miss said to me, when i went up there, she said, ah i know, she said, you hear a lot of bad stuff about ryan, she said, but he's a nice, he's a nice little boy really, and she said, he's very polite, he's very polite, he can be very polite to you. -she said, and a lot of the time, she said, he's a, he's a little sod, she said, but you know, she said, i mean, it's not all bad things about him, and i said, i've been hearing things about you from miss , and she oh, what she's been bloody saying, i bet she's been saying i'm crap at english. +but like,mi miss said to me, when i went up there, she said, ah i know, she said, you hear a lot of bad stuff about ryan, she said, but he's a nice, he's a nice little boy really, and she said, he's very polite, he's very polite, he can be very polite to you. +she said, and a lot of the time, she said, he's a, he's a little sod, she said, but you know, she said, i mean, it's not all bad things about him, and i said, i've been hearing things about you from miss , and she oh, what she's been bloody saying, i bet she's been saying i'm crap at english. yeah well . i said, actually ryan, she had some good bloody things to say about ya. he sort of went, ha ha, and shut up. @@ -3273,7 +3273,7 @@ like, what if i opened the door, right, he didn't know i was coming home, he wen i thought, yeah, yeah. i mean, he's all, i mean he walked in the door, he was, i'm coming down the garden, and erm, he walked down the garden and he'd seen me, and he started really smiling. ah. -you alright, and ryan was giving it,janna, what's he the janna, the janna, +you alright, and ryan was giving it,janna, what's he the janna, the janna, the janna's here. the janna's here. my janna. @@ -3298,7 +3298,7 @@ because there's so many. she keeps on about all the time, every time i'm there. where you going now. whose house are you going to. -it's almost like i'm a refugee i felt right i'm like, you know, +it's almost like i'm a refugee i felt right i'm like, you know, when you go home now, to which house? where are you going. we were walk walking to erm the, down the high street and a plane went over, and erm, i think mum must have been saying to her about aunty jill being on holiday, and she went, ah, there's aunty jill in the plane going to the city. @@ -3309,9 +3309,9 @@ and then she said to me, and then, when i was going, she went to me, would you l mum says cos it costs lots of pennies, she went ah, another day, we'll go another day. it's really funny. she's got no concept of time. -no, she hasn't age, because she thinks she's she's been a big girl, and she's now a little girl. +no, she hasn't age, because she thinks she's she's been a big girl, and she's now a little girl. that's right, yeah. -she thinks she's er, when i was like you, when i was a big girl, +she thinks she's er, when i was like you, when i was a big girl, yeah. i did things like that. yeah. @@ -3327,14 +3327,14 @@ i had one of them yeah. when i was a big girl. yeah. -i had some like that. +i had some like that. like, like little lies, sort of, you know, she sort of pretends, that's her pretend role. yeah. well, yeah, i suppose it, yeah. yeah she, she does that, don't she? she's got this erm, dinosaur, that she like, tied a, a la a bootlace round, this luminous bootlace round it. she dragged it, drags it around, and it's called, erm, little frog, what is it called? -little froglet dog, little my little froglet dog, that's it. +little froglet dog, little my little froglet dog, that's it. froglet doggie, it's called or something. i think that's what it's called, something really funny. and she calls it my froglet doggie. @@ -3357,7 +3357,7 @@ you put my light off, i don't like that, you put my off. my mummy doesn't like that. that, yeah. i tell my mummy of you. -mummy bit of a squealer. +mummy bit of a squealer. yeah, i suppose she has to be with ryan ryan tried to push her down, and get her to fall downstairs the other day. no. @@ -3372,16 +3372,16 @@ yeah. so, like ryan's, what, nearly ten, ten years older than her. mm. yeah, i'm sorry, yeah. -well, ryan's not +well, ryan's not he just gets stressed out with her. he does, he does. niggles now and then. yeah, she, she. -like i've him at, watched him a few times, she goes,get off he says,what +like i've him at, watched him a few times, she goes,get off he says,what yeah. -he's old enough to carry it off,but me mum says to her, now erm, she says like what, what do you do marie, if he's annoying you, and she goes like that she goes ryan's +he's old enough to carry it off,but me mum says to her, now erm, she says like what, what do you do marie, if he's annoying you, and she goes like that she goes ryan's yeah. -he's like,no i don't she's like +he's like,no i don't she's like leave her alone. do you want to go and get something to eat, then. i know you're all hungry. @@ -3413,77 +3413,77 @@ yeah, which was good. ah. so erm, that was quite good. because it didn't last very long. -but it was after so it wasn't really +but it was after so it wasn't really yeah, too taxing. no, it wasn't too taxing on the old brain. mm. so no, no, it was alright. erm, got back here about quarter past nine, which was great, cos it meant i could watch one foot in the grave. -and that +and that that one really annoyed me last night, that did. did it? i can't stand it, i felt sorry for him. -i end up feeling sorry for him every time i watch it +i end up feeling sorry for him every time i watch it yeah, i do. do you watch that clive? -no, i don't +no, i don't oh, it is good. what about absolutely fabulous. did you see that? yeah. -and do your exams on the first of our work in june. +and do your exams on the first of our work in june. bells! -usually write about, the best thing, now if you call the register erm here. +usually write about, the best thing, now if you call the register erm here. in the classroom? classroom. actually it's behind liz. yeah, it's here. yeah me. okay. -cairan -so, but we've gotta find it out. +cairan +so, but we've gotta find it out. why? so erm it's intact. okay. -further announcement is that due to popular demand there are four extra tickets for the winter's tale. -so, if you didn't get your act together last week and you want to go to the matinee performance of winter's tale on the third of november . +further announcement is that due to popular demand there are four extra tickets for the winter's tale. +so, if you didn't get your act together last week and you want to go to the matinee performance of winter's tale on the third of november . erm -the tickets were so they want tickets but they haven't actually sent any money, so if you get in before them erm, you can have the tickets. +the tickets were so they want tickets but they haven't actually sent any money, so if you get in before them erm, you can have the tickets. especially whoever pays their money first. -it's five pounds thursday the third of november, a matinee performance of a winter's tale. -there's er already about twenty people going. -erm i have the other . -erm if you want to come along to it's a black comedy. +it's five pounds thursday the third of november, a matinee performance of a winter's tale. +there's er already about twenty people going. +erm i have the other . +erm if you want to come along to it's a black comedy. ya. mhm. cairan? yes? difficult aren't they? aha. -that's why i'm gonna say now why? -what makes reading johnson so difficult? +that's why i'm gonna say now why? +what makes reading johnson so difficult? the language. okay. i don't know what, we can just talk about the language you have to look up every second word. okay. well i guess, look at every second word. -what what bothers you? +what what bothers you? it's just, it's just so erm specialized. right. okay. cos it's specialized. and by that, you mean? -well just well if, because it's all a lot of it's to do with this alca alchemical +well just well if, because it's all a lot of it's to do with this alca alchemical okay. alchemal whatever it's called. specialized. the process. mm. -which i'd know nothing about, er but just highly specialized in itself. +which i'd know nothing about, er but just highly specialized in itself. yeah. -and every, every word that i stumbled on +and every, every word that i stumbled on mm mm. and when i looked it up it had about six other words to go with it. yeah. @@ -3493,9 +3493,9 @@ yep. which is ridiculous. anybody had this experience? -erm okay, the first word was erm it talked about alchemy. +erm okay, the first word was erm it talked about alchemy. any other problems with the language? -either other areas where it's very specialized and you had to look up words, or other difficulties with the +either other areas where it's very specialized and you had to look up words, or other difficulties with the yeah. language? it's not everyday english. @@ -3504,23 +3504,23 @@ what at the moment, at th right, so a lot of, erm yeah. ah but that is a good distinction. stereo. -erm ahead in the sense that +erm ahead in the sense that yeah. we're used to a lot of shakespeare's archaisms because he was studying them at a level and shakespeare's got so a special sort of band of them that he uses. -even so, i they can go and look up that lot of words in shakespeare. -but johnson they're often old words that are totally out of use erm and we're not even used to johnson's vocabulary because +even so, i they can go and look up that lot of words in shakespeare. +but johnson they're often old words that are totally out of use erm and we're not even used to johnson's vocabulary because it's not taught in schools. -at least not part the mainstream part of our culture. +at least not part the mainstream part of our culture. any other reasons for the language difficulty? or that the speech is difficult or the, any, any reason that there's a, a page that's difficult to read? er, it strikes me with the, with the comedy, he's trying to be so funny that he shoots off at all these angles and not having aha. left, sort of boundaries. okay. -so erm well, you might like to say that +so erm well, you might like to say that mm mm mm mm. -he's very fast er, deduced comedy. -there's a lot going on at a very fast speed. +he's very fast er, deduced comedy. +there's a lot going on at a very fast speed. which makes well i thought it was quite farce like. sorry? @@ -3530,41 +3530,41 @@ yeah. like okay. but -this is rather what what it, makes it difficult is that i had a copy as well farce right, but don't say farcical. +this is rather what what it, makes it difficult is that i had a copy as well farce right, but don't say farcical. that's got different meanings. -er, like farce okay? +er, like farce okay? as in this. -any other things that made it made it difficult for you to read? +any other things that made it made it difficult for you to read? so it's only the language? the language, if it had been translated in modern language there'd be no, no problem? were there are any reasons? it's supposed to be a play, i suppose you have to watch it. -when we were reading it i found that i was just reading it as a book and the and that all the coming about you forget who's in, who's there and who's not there. +when we were reading it i found that i was just reading it as a book and the and that all the coming about you forget who's in, who's there and who's not there. yeah. right? yeah. more, again, much more by the shape of it, an intensely visual dramatic play, that relies on you being able to see -spatially in terms of space on the stage. +spatially in terms of space on the stage. people knocking on doors, people hiding behind things, people coming on in costume. -you know, on the page you can't work out why erm,is suddenly called erm nuns, somebody called the captain, you know, you, you, you think these are three different characters. +you know, on the page you can't work out why erm,is suddenly called erm nuns, somebody called the captain, you know, you, you, you think these are three different characters. on the stage you wouldn't make that mistake, you'd be able to keep track of the identity. -so, another reason that just adds that is the element of disguise. -in shakespeare you know, you haven't got that many disguises going on. +so, another reason that just adds that is the element of disguise. +in shakespeare you know, you haven't got that many disguises going on. and, you'd be able to get one laugh, that's the idea. -it's a modern gag idea that you know, violet dressed as man or but in, johnson ha there have numerous kinds of disguises, each +it's a modern gag idea that you know, violet dressed as man or but in, johnson ha there have numerous kinds of disguises, each mm. to different effect. each calling different people. okay? right. we've got some idea as to why, why we found it difficult to read. -which also help us understand the kind of comedy altogether, erm that . -let's see if we can refine those like us looking at the first two lines of the play. +which also help us understand the kind of comedy altogether, erm that . +let's see if we can refine those like us looking at the first two lines of the play. erm okay. -we'll read them through and pause for a while and try to think of the, also in terms of the physical, you know, erm staging. -erm okay, who's gonna be face? -i'll have jo as face i'll have monica as sottle, and we'll have mia as don. +we'll read them through and pause for a while and try to think of the, also in terms of the physical, you know, erm staging. +erm okay, who's gonna be face? +i'll have jo as face i'll have monica as sottle, and we'll have mia as don. okay? just the first mhm. @@ -3577,7 +3577,7 @@ oh don't be ridiculous! what to do, a little bit of pantomime. ro rode out of the woods tonight. no don't keep suffering . -forever while she breathes i'll go and see and fetch some water, will you come? +forever while she breathes i'll go and see and fetch some water, will you come? will you have the ?betrayal. hark! i hear somebody. @@ -3591,23 +3591,23 @@ who am i? i'll tell you, since you know about yourself. did you know ? yes she belongs to time not long past. -the good honest that kept your master's worship house when he requires . +the good honest that kept your master's worship house when he requires . will you please go out? -since translated so that i'll be the captain. +since translated so that i'll be the captain. by your needs such as those . -with the amount of my money all this must . +with the amount of my money all this must . . okay, we'll sto stop there. -now even in that had a fairly dry reading through. +now even in that had a fairly dry reading through. are there any things you want to add to that list, just looking at that? di different language and er, and what's going on. yeah. -in i think the people were speaking faster. +in i think the people were speaking faster. alright. you, looking through it and almost laughing at the . right. -i think that almost , we've got another aspect of erm comedy, comedy it's really on the basis of arguments, fighting complication between people. -which, as you quite rightly say you really need to hear, hear the voices going on. +i think that almost , we've got another aspect of erm comedy, comedy it's really on the basis of arguments, fighting complication between people. +which, as you quite rightly say you really need to hear, hear the voices going on. and i'll get some people along the middle in a moment and, and do it. any, any other things? @@ -3619,61 +3619,61 @@ i mean i grinned at farts. good! okay. -brunt, and a bit of a at the moment. +brunt, and a bit of a at the moment. erm i mean shakespeare did not, correct me if i'm wrong, use words like fart and, certainly doesn't use words like fuel gauge, have a leg over things like that, and things like, okay? so it's rude language. which is funny. i mean, we are all er very sympathetic at the end of the twentieth century, but, you know, we can still laugh when somebody says fart on stage. -erm there are other examples of that. -you'll be glad to know that in line four and five,what to do? -lick figs out of my he's actually saying lick piles from my and, you know the audience replies fig fig . +erm there are other examples of that. +you'll be glad to know that in line four and five,what to do? +lick figs out of my he's actually saying lick piles from my and, you know the audience replies fig fig . and the actor could, you know, draw attention the part of the anatomy he's talking about. i mean, this is not this is not his sense of humour but it is visual, it involves the audience. -like, if you break off a line like, lick figs out of my something, you're getting the audience going because the audience is supplying the rude bits. +like, if you break off a line like, lick figs out of my something, you're getting the audience going because the audience is supplying the rude bits. okay? -any other things that were a problem about that clip? +any other things that were a problem about that clip? okay. forget that funniness. why is it different from shakespeare? -what's the difference between that opening scene and say the opening scene in twelfth night or winter's tale? +what's the difference between that opening scene and say the opening scene in twelfth night or winter's tale? were they di different? -there's no asides view. +there's no asides view. right. that's another problem actually i hadn't thought of that. -it's all but everybody's erm everybody's involved from the word go, so and the structure the so think about that point. +it's all but everybody's erm everybody's involved from the word go, so and the structure the so think about that point. no, are no asides. -erm i suppose there are later on in the play er th characters speak to each other and say very good that stupid berk over there kind of aside, but what you don't get is any structures of characters as such. -you never get told what different characters are like in th er by somebody else. -you don't get introduced to characters, you don't plunge straight in. -er yeah, i have thought of a very different one. +erm i suppose there are later on in the play er th characters speak to each other and say very good that stupid berk over there kind of aside, but what you don't get is any structures of characters as such. +you never get told what different characters are like in th er by somebody else. +you don't get introduced to characters, you don't plunge straight in. +er yeah, i have thought of a very different one. i mean they don't, er, in the middle of things. you're not really given any background either. yeah. so -shakespeare always usually gives you a bit of you know, you just got the two gentleman speaking clear and . +shakespeare always usually gives you a bit of you know, you just got the two gentleman speaking clear and . yeah. exactly. and we accept those things. you know, give us a chance to get into the play and get comfortable on our feet and we'll have a go, well, johnson doesn't give you that option does he? -it's straight in there there's a fight between three, two men and a woman, you don't know what's going on, they're just abusing each other and and the picture +it's straight in there there's a fight between three, two men and a woman, you don't know what's going on, they're just abusing each other and and the picture is there. now johnson it brilliant for doing abuse. -there's this wonderful put down. -i'll have please. -. erm okay. -so in a very different world to that of shakespearean comedy, a must harsher abrasive world erm again th that bit where she's ge get , do i get the impression that most of you found yours much more difficult to get into +there's this wonderful put down. +i'll have please. +. erm okay. +so in a very different world to that of shakespearean comedy, a must harsher abrasive world erm again th that bit where she's ge get , do i get the impression that most of you found yours much more difficult to get into yeah. than shakespeare? yeah. mm mm. yeah? -does anybody have this ? +does anybody have this ? er, mm erm, i found it was like reading shakespeare when i first started reading shakespeare. yeah. -cos it's i think, different types. +cos it's i think, different types. yeah. you get used to shakespeare. yeah. @@ -3682,16 +3682,16 @@ okay, i think, i think that is, that is a point. again, that came up this morning as well. that shakespeare's so central to our heritage i you learn him at o level, you learn him at a level, you get used to him. -erm he's part of our language and, and therefore, you know, to go on to johnson it's very different. +erm he's part of our language and, and therefore, you know, to go on to johnson it's very different. like you say, it takes much more time to get into it. but i think johnson does make it harder for us. -there are no characters to get involved with as the there are in in shakespeare. -we can't really imagine ourselves you don't really have sympathy for any of the characters in the . -they're all fairly sort of silly characters. +there are no characters to get involved with as the there are in in shakespeare. +we can't really imagine ourselves you don't really have sympathy for any of the characters in the . +they're all fairly sort of silly characters. whereas in, in twelfth night or whatever, we might actually feel involved within the, the people in the play. certainly . okay, well i'll leave all those up there. -erm can you look at scene, act four, scene five in my edition. +erm can you look at scene, act four, scene five in my edition. now i discovered this morning there is actually act four scene three in some people's editions. okay? erm, so act fi act four, scene five. @@ -3703,26 +3703,26 @@ can you divide yourself up into groups of four first of all please? i'll do it for you if you, you want? and leave a bit of space. right. -for those who aren't totally sort of in control of the plot and i probably should include myself as one of them, what's happening in this scene i want you to act out. +for those who aren't totally sort of in control of the plot and i probably should include myself as one of them, what's happening in this scene i want you to act out. what's happening in this scene? -doll is a prostitute, okay? +doll is a prostitute, okay? first things first. -who is working with sottle who's planning to be the alchemist, okay? -so he's probably fiddled a lot of things to get money from people. -the alchemist is getting money, i'm sorry, for people who know this inside out, but i'll just explain it. -erm the alchemist is conning people promising them that he'll turn base metals into gold. -one of the people he's conning is sir epicure manhom who wants a life of ease and luxury and has been giving the alchemist loads of money in order to tu to, to perfect this and funny enough the alchemist hasn't managed, hasn't managed to do this, to get the person's money. +who is working with sottle who's planning to be the alchemist, okay? +so he's probably fiddled a lot of things to get money from people. +the alchemist is getting money, i'm sorry, for people who know this inside out, but i'll just explain it. +erm the alchemist is conning people promising them that he'll turn base metals into gold. +one of the people he's conning is sir epicure manhom who wants a life of ease and luxury and has been giving the alchemist loads of money in order to tu to, to perfect this and funny enough the alchemist hasn't managed, hasn't managed to do this, to get the person's money. okay. so that's who epicure manhom is. -one day, when he is, somewhere back in act two, one day he is visiting the alchemist he catches sight of this woman, doll, quite obviously a prostitute, probably an a an absolutely erm catches sight of her and says, i must quickly think up some reason why this woman is, is in the house cos sir epicure manhom thinks the alchemist is a pure, homely er priest-like creature yet in fact, he's running a whorehouse. +one day, when he is, somewhere back in act two, one day he is visiting the alchemist he catches sight of this woman, doll, quite obviously a prostitute, probably an a an absolutely erm catches sight of her and says, i must quickly think up some reason why this woman is, is in the house cos sir epicure manhom thinks the alchemist is a pure, homely er priest-like creature yet in fact, he's running a whorehouse. okay? so,has it's worse than neighbours . -erm, think erm so he's sort of bluffing, okay? +erm, think erm so he's sort of bluffing, okay? i'll just find a scene where he does this. -er er in act two, scene three okay? -er erm quite a long way, there's that, that line erm two twenty. +er er in act two, scene three okay? +er erm quite a long way, there's that, that line erm two twenty. okay? -face had just realized that sir epicure manhom has erm seen doll, which he shouldn't have done, and manhom calls face out and says stay lungs. +face had just realized that sir epicure manhom has erm seen doll, which he shouldn't have done, and manhom calls face out and says stay lungs. that's what face is called at the moment. i dare not sir. say man what is she ? @@ -3739,36 +3739,36 @@ sir, to be cured . you know, he's, he's thinking on his feet. he's trying to find reasons for this, this woman to be in the house. meanwhile sottle off stage is more, is calling why rascal? -and face low you hear sir ? +and face low you hear sir ? he's going out to spend some . okay. manhom believes that, believes what basically? -they look, er round that line, two three five two three six and face is saying you're very right sir. -she is a very rare scholar +they look, er round that line, two three five two three six and face is saying you're very right sir. +she is a very rare scholar describing doll collan here, a whore who is seen wandering around the stage most of the time,she is the most rare scholar and has gone mad with studying brampton's works. -and here but name a word such in a hebrew she falls in her fit and will discourse her learned genealogies as you would run mad too to to hear her sir . -now, so, face is trying to sort of put off sir epicure manhom by saying, you know, this a mad woman who's done too much learning nice little attack on women here by johnson, who, who is one of the biggest misogynists in the world, erm a woman who's gone crazy with learning and who knows nothing because er she's just a prostitute and therefore she's thick. +and here but name a word such in a hebrew she falls in her fit and will discourse her learned genealogies as you would run mad too to to hear her sir . +now, so, face is trying to sort of put off sir epicure manhom by saying, you know, this a mad woman who's done too much learning nice little attack on women here by johnson, who, who is one of the biggest misogynists in the world, erm a woman who's gone crazy with learning and who knows nothing because er she's just a prostitute and therefore she's thick. okay? that's the joke. -but th again, the funny thing is, even funnier, is that manhom lusts after her, gets distracted from this idea of getting all this money and sa saying,how am i going to have conference with her, lungs ? -erm and face said,oh! -for a mad woman acceptance of her . +but th again, the funny thing is, even funnier, is that manhom lusts after her, gets distracted from this idea of getting all this money and sa saying,how am i going to have conference with her, lungs ? +erm and face said,oh! +for a mad woman acceptance of her . okay? -so, face promises to get an introduction to this woman who manhom fancies and erm and manhom, okay. +so, face promises to get an introduction to this woman who manhom fancies and erm and manhom, okay. that is the background. -next time we see them they, they have met and and face sends them off to have a private conference. +next time we see them they, they have met and and face sends them off to have a private conference. okay? so you now have act four, scene five. enter doll and th they're talking. -will you please try and act it out like we did the twelfth night the bit with mrs , and see whether you can revive your idea of why johnson, what is the nature of, of johnson's comic art. +will you please try and act it out like we did the twelfth night the bit with mrs , and see whether you can revive your idea of why johnson, what is the nature of, of johnson's comic art. okay. -but hear guffaws within minutes. +but hear guffaws within minutes. right. do you want me to divide you up? -are you,do you want class . +are you,do you want class . you ne need four in a group. there's gonna be one over so somebody be the walking around peasant. -i don't mind right now. +i don't mind right now. just move my mike. i think one of you lot's gonna have to go over and join these three over here. yeah. @@ -3791,7 +3791,7 @@ i've put in act four, scene five. oh yeah. the bit where doll and manhom comes in. the bit after alexandra . -okay i'll be doll. +okay i'll be doll. yes. okay. i'll possibly . @@ -3801,15 +3801,15 @@ i'll be doll. alright, i'll be manhom as well. but after alexandra sorry? -can we do are we doing act four, scene five? -er that'll be act five. +can we do are we doing act four, scene five? +er that'll be act five. you're the clever one. -i only see it as that i don't understand her bit, i think she's just out to take the piss. +i only see it as that i don't understand her bit, i think she's just out to take the piss. i do i'm, you know, i'm learning enough,ancient greek. sorry. or whatever it is. it must be some . -erm don't know, sorry. +erm don't know, sorry. and er, i don't know, i think it's all about skivers isn't it? cos as soon as they go it's all gone a bit when i saw it i didn't think it was that funny. @@ -3827,7 +3827,7 @@ no it's the wrong person. oh my god! oh. all that sort of thing. -you know, it's like, real sort of like you know, a farce. +you know, it's like, real sort of like you know, a farce. it's weird. yeah. it's just like the people really. @@ -3848,22 +3848,22 @@ we've read the whole scene, but you've read the whole scene. right. can't remember much. -erm what what, what stage of deciphering are you at ? +erm what what, what stage of deciphering are you at ? have you got to ? . okay. -erm have you got -tricky too. +erm have you got +tricky too. what, what sottle is doing when he comes in on the scene? no. -isn't he trying to make him feel guilty manhom and this woman? +isn't he trying to make him feel guilty manhom and this woman? yes. but he's er yeah. his lust for a whore. yeah. yeah. -and that's why, and then erm he's trying to put, they try and blame manhom that er when the er furnace thing stops he, that's all his fault is what +and that's why, and then erm he's trying to put, they try and blame manhom that er when the er furnace thing stops he, that's all his fault is what yeah. we thought. yeah. @@ -3872,36 +3872,36 @@ yeah. and like, and they were going, oh it's th the funniest play ever written! yeah. and all this lot. -and i went to see it and, you know, it was very slick they said, oh +and i went to see it and, you know, it was very slick they said, oh yeah. who's at the door? no it's someone else. -oh quick, put a +oh quick, put a yeah. on. yeah. -but i, i never really thought it was rip-roaringly funny. -perhaps if you don't really like farce as a as a kind of comedy then +but i, i never really thought it was rip-roaringly funny. +perhaps if you don't really like farce as a as a kind of comedy then i suppose, yeah i'm not really in on them. yeah. -cos even when i, i've been to see like, you know ones i just sit there and tend to go, yeah. +cos even when i, i've been to see like, you know ones i just sit there and tend to go, yeah. yeah. yeah. but you've gotta either be really in them or sort of out sort of back seat? yeah. yeah. -very different kind of humour where no, i, i, unfortunately i agree with you. +very different kind of humour where no, i, i, unfortunately i agree with you. yeah. -but i, i'm hating , but i mean yeah i could see its cleverness. +but i, i'm hating , but i mean yeah i could see its cleverness. and yeah. -real physical cleverness. +real physical cleverness. yeah. the staging was just brilliant! yeah, it's really visual. -it's -it's like when they did the erm you know when she comes on as a fairy +it's +it's like when they did the erm you know when she comes on as a fairy mm. kingpin fairy, she sat on someone's head and she had this massive gown all over her, and that was really visual. erm @@ -3913,7 +3913,7 @@ it's really hard, yeah. you cannot visualize something taking place. it's really wordy isn't it? it's really sort of. -and also, i mean, so many of the, the jokes just are very +and also, i mean, so many of the, the jokes just are very quick jokes. yeah. they're based on maybe one word in a sentence but if you miss that, you've missed it. @@ -3921,18 +3921,18 @@ and that doesn't really matter in the theatre because you carry on yeah. along by the visual gags, so neither of them when yeah. -you're reading it, you feel you've got to you've got to follow the follow the script. -and the other thing about visual things, let's, let's say there is a reference to somebody having piles, but they make it a visual gag +you're reading it, you feel you've got to you've got to follow the follow the script. +and the other thing about visual things, let's, let's say there is a reference to somebody having piles, but they make it a visual gag yeah. yeah. -whereas on the page it is you know +whereas on the page it is you know yeah. schoolboy humour. yeah. you know? yeah. -erm i mean, nevertheless, obviously it's just somebody on the scene is a bit -and that free way of talking about pain. +erm i mean, nevertheless, obviously it's just somebody on the scene is a bit +and that free way of talking about pain. and wrote it like that and published it like that. something that shakespeare never did. he didn't take anything and take it to the publishers, there you go. @@ -3968,7 +3968,7 @@ is there a video of it? i don't, oh apparently not, but erm yeah. -there may be, i just i went into one video shop and i asked the le erm, some people here. +there may be, i just i went into one video shop and i asked the le erm, some people here. have you tried the library? no. no. @@ -3982,7 +3982,7 @@ is it? oh! yeah, so join up. thanks john. -commission . +commission . plug, plug there. yeah. no it's really good, you can have them for like two days and it's only a pound, it's really good. @@ -3992,11 +3992,11 @@ well i'll look into that one. i think i this could be fairly crucial that you actually see it. erm if i could have your attention for a minute. -what, any other things that you'd got, but i talked to each group individually, erm but if you want to share any of your thoughts with everybody else i'm standing in the way. -any illustrations for the scene we've just been doing and the things we've already been talking about, or any new ideas. +what, any other things that you'd got, but i talked to each group individually, erm but if you want to share any of your thoughts with everybody else i'm standing in the way. +any illustrations for the scene we've just been doing and the things we've already been talking about, or any new ideas. johnson's way of doing comedy. no,, you got anything extra to say? -er er only we the bit about how they both +er er only we the bit about how they both the way she to oh melissa i'm guess what i was watching down there, ah p o r k y s @@ -4019,7 +4019,7 @@ oh yeah and he stuck his dingaling through and the woman grabbed it and she put his foot against the wall and started stretching it, and he's going aaagh i've seen it and that and is oh sugar plum -i forgot, i got carried away sorry about that missus +i forgot, i got carried away sorry about that missus i forgot this erm microphone was on, sorry students, i am very, very sorry, please forgive me, please forgive me they must think i was drunk, do you know what? what? @@ -4033,7 +4033,7 @@ well today, poll tax has now gone up one pound, but for the old fogies it's gone over to you mike er, hello there, my name's mike, well let's go over to the weather with winsy, no winsy, oh rita's dropped dead, she's jumped off a cliff we think, we think and now we'll go over to winsy. -hello my name's winsy insy spider climb up the spout, down came the rain and washed winsy out, when the sun came out it dried up the rain, insy, winsy spider climbed up again thank you, oh thank you, oh thank you, i know, thank you, well, today, at midday today it's going to be tipping down with rain and winsy, winsy, winsy, spider will fall down the rain, +hello my name's winsy insy spider climb up the spout, down came the rain and washed winsy out, when the sun came out it dried up the rain, insy, winsy spider climbed up again thank you, oh thank you, oh thank you, i know, thank you, well, today, at midday today it's going to be tipping down with rain and winsy, winsy, winsy, spider will fall down the rain, melissa er, oh, right, on toni , tonight we're gonna have sun and maybe a bit of snow and tomorrow morning we're gonna have a full moon oh you're @@ -4051,9 +4051,9 @@ well i said what you looking at you skinny thing, and she just, how dare you spe what you doing you sexy woman? thank you your wife is over there, don't you talked to her like that -who the hell you think you are i've got a good mind to put your beard right in this food +who the hell you think you are i've got a good mind to put your beard right in this food and he said -came up to me and he did, do you want a game of footy, i said oh +came up to me and he did, do you want a game of footy, i said oh sorry about that love, well i'll go and i tore this paper and i said if you're gonna have a wee wee then do it wee on me, so i said, up your all over the place and then i went out @@ -4068,11 +4068,11 @@ and there's this woman called lassie, and this, this other man was talking to er well if you take her upstairs find out, he says, alright then, so he took her up the room, and all you could hear was melissa -and she goes i've had enough questions for one day, i said it plenty of times she said oh shut up you wee wally +and she goes i've had enough questions for one day, i said it plenty of times she said oh shut up you wee wally you think you oh who, hiya i come from australia, yeah, you know -oh my god i think a early goodbye now winny, well that's the end of the news, we now must go over to gender bender the cartoon, gender bender, bom, bom, bom, gender bender +oh my god i think a early goodbye now winny, well that's the end of the news, we now must go over to gender bender the cartoon, gender bender, bom, bom, bom, gender bender what is that? oh well @@ -4080,7 +4080,7 @@ goodbye, see you tomorrow at six am, well goodbye from me and goodbye from him, yeah i had of done. look like an old fashioned woman and it's over like that -robin hood ooh robin hood +robin hood ooh robin hood anybody talk about me today? yeah anybody else? @@ -4096,7 +4096,7 @@ yeah what colour is it this time? copper, same as before who did it? -me it won't come out red cos i've got brown hair it'll just come out sort of +me it won't come out red cos i've got brown hair it'll just come out sort of i'm put, i'm putting this red in it on saturday and saturday, you should do it friday night friday night @@ -4116,8 +4116,8 @@ what an electric blanket? yeah yeah doesn't your mum check, see if you've put it on -my dad puts them to bed oh we're gonna have fuck all and -oh, ain't you forgetting something she's a creep ain't she? +my dad puts them to bed oh we're gonna have fuck all and +oh, ain't you forgetting something she's a creep ain't she? ah? do you realise that, when lisa has it right has what? @@ -4134,7 +4134,7 @@ the sticker was at the bottom, and there was nothing at the top and she, and she mm hey enjoy ain't he? -revolting ah i was watching +revolting ah i was watching today yeah it was good @@ -4156,7 +4156,7 @@ no i mean, this, the paper is the same and you where'd you get yours from? i don't think you can get one now how -have you signed this thing in mrs room? +have you signed this thing in mrs room? you're supposed to of signed it and to, to let you know when your if you haven't signed it, i don't think you can do it yeah, cos in the diner, they said er what have we missed, when she grew up all on her own @@ -4175,33 +4175,33 @@ what you like about them? well as i say, there's a wide variety of contents. does it? i like the letters, do you? -i haven't seen them they're advertising -oh there's letters here very good +i haven't seen them they're advertising +oh there's letters here very good the jokes are like, like that, those -yeah can you see that better there? -let's have a look what? +yeah can you see that better there? +let's have a look what? have you read it? no what he took the sewing machine -i haven't read it yet -i'll turn this down oh remind over in the cold, do business last winter with matching jean and shorts +i haven't read it yet +i'll turn this down oh remind over in the cold, do business last winter with matching jean and shorts i told my -with, they must get hold of a new windscreen before going home oh look just good friends. +with, they must get hold of a new windscreen before going home oh look just good friends. who? just good friends is that on now? yeah oh we'll look, we'll listen to that then, shall we? -we'll look at it +we'll look at it oh have you got that paper? writing er, don't speak too loud now pardon? -no, i'm not that ignorant could of been, it's so funny isn't it? +no, i'm not that ignorant could of been, it's so funny isn't it? no i, i've gotta go now -no don't put it there +no don't put it there oh dear, dear perhaps now, i think i'll put the kettle on yeah, let's have a nice cup of tea @@ -4220,12 +4220,12 @@ thanks, it's best if you point it at the telly go on then, it don't bloody work is that better? i think i'll sue you -turn it down a bit i'm expecting a phone call in a minute, but i think i'll have one. +turn it down a bit i'm expecting a phone call in a minute, but i think i'll have one. turn the telly down mum. i can't hear it if it's any lower put the words on then oh dear -can't wait till saturday, have a rave ma +can't wait till saturday, have a rave ma yeah that's all you want is a rave up innit? do you know what rave is? yeah @@ -4244,10 +4244,10 @@ by aysha's i think where in aysha, no where does she live? -i went up her house last night, it's i dunno how, how i got through, the long way +i went up her house last night, it's i dunno how, how i got through, the long way oh a long way is it? we took the long way, on the way back to the bus stop -i, the new bus stop to the house, is by that er, by the dentist, you know that bus stop there? +i, the new bus stop to the house, is by that er, by the dentist, you know that bus stop there? my dentist, not the bus stop up the top but the one in, lower down, do you know which one? by the yeah, there @@ -4273,16 +4273,16 @@ leanne leanne who? what? -no don't you believe me or what? okay then +no don't you believe me or what? okay then my heart you haven't got a bloody heart i know, no oh, who's that? oh, if that girl's been chucked out of her house, she's been there then all the week then? -no she's only staying tonight and they think, they just phoned me up then and they were on the square, i think she's going home phorr what's that smell, it stinks what? +no she's only staying tonight and they think, they just phoned me up then and they were on the square, i think she's going home phorr what's that smell, it stinks what? was daddy on the phone? daddy on the phone? -no hi bill he's going out mum +no hi bill he's going out mum eh? that bloody him innit? he said he was gonna ring you later @@ -4297,41 +4297,40 @@ didn't you say her house was , didn't you say hers was falling down? no, thought the house was falling down how many sugars do you take these days? eh? -this bench is not straight, anything you put on it seems to wobble what? +this bench is not straight, anything you put on it seems to wobble what? cos i'm clever than you ma, will you write me a letter tomorrow to go down town to look at some clothes what for? what in your dinner hour? in your dinner hour, is it? no not in your school time -sorry that could become a -ah, god who's that, someone at the door give me that kim was +sorry that could become a +ah, god who's that, someone at the door give me that kim was commander, training, sergeant major informed us that we'll would be departing by airport that afternoon, i can't keep my eyes awake, when we asked for he grinned and he looked at me and said -dismal days ha, ha, ha hello, what you laughing at? +dismal days ha, ha, ha hello, what you laughing at? what's happened? what? -probably, probably the best lager in the world that's what i feel like now, is, is there any cornflakes in the cupboard? -yeah i've got a toothache hello -cease her give way wow, ma what? -don't talk oh i'm lazy +probably, probably the best lager in the world that's what i feel like now, is, is there any cornflakes in the cupboard? +yeah i've got a toothache hello +cease her give way wow, ma what? +don't talk oh i'm lazy oh, i'm watching this on telly now -oh, no i'll probably +oh, no i'll probably i -today then mm +today then mm where'd you get that spray from? eh? - is this the wine that you brought? where d'ya get that? -hawk something +hawk something yep. new zealand. mm mm! excuse me, who's that making that noise? mm? -oh look at nankypoo he's got his tongue hanging out. +oh look at nankypoo he's got his tongue hanging out. i know , and he always sleeps like that. does he? mm mm. @@ -4341,7 +4340,7 @@ but that's awful that you've done but everything. . -well it is awful, i agree, but +well it is awful, i agree, but well, just stay there then. do you twos do the cooking rather than go out. well it depends @@ -4392,9 +4391,9 @@ but i think . oh right. we have paper ones. mm mm. -but might ignite. -we'll be no, no, they don't ignite -because the candle is inside the shape of the candle shape holder that they're more translucent. +but might ignite. +we'll be no, no, they don't ignite +because the candle is inside the shape of the candle shape holder that they're more translucent. right. i think, but though we've also got some nice glass thank you. @@ -4417,7 +4416,7 @@ cheers then chaps! cheers. so long as you wait, i think you've been doing this all day. yes, cheers. -thank you very much . +thank you very much . thanks for a lovely super day! @@ -4430,11 +4429,11 @@ i love this wine. mm mm. it is very nice isn't it? it's lovely. -hawk +hawk i've never tried it before michael. well i won't be driving anywhere tonight. i think i'm twiddled after that gin and martini. -it's oak it's been matured in . +it's oak it's been matured in . oh that's okay. mm! delicious! @@ -4459,10 +4458,10 @@ pick pickled ginger. i think ginger and melon is delicious. mm mm. that is beautiful! -cos i thought it was ma , i thought it was erm a ham or something. +cos i thought it was ma , i thought it was erm a ham or something. mm mm. it's lovely! -have you noticed her melon-baller +have you noticed her melon-baller oh yes, she did. i went through everything with her. she was delighted with it. @@ -4479,7 +4478,7 @@ i'm sure they do, it's just mm mm. you know, it's one of those things yeah. -you never think to pick it up for yourself. +you never think to pick it up for yourself. mm. no, exactly. you brought a zester didn't you, for molly? @@ -4497,7 +4496,7 @@ really? first of all. so what, what can you do with it? i mean -just have a bit bit with cold meat cold meat roast chicken +just have a bit bit with cold meat cold meat roast chicken yep. pork mm mm! @@ -4532,20 +4531,20 @@ packet is it? it's actually very subtle. mhm. it's delicious. -so many people when they eat it, they can't actually decipher what it has, you know what it is, that it is ginger. +so many people when they eat it, they can't actually decipher what it has, you know what it is, that it is ginger. yes. it's very subtle. i think margaret doesn't understand the word subtle. -cos she takes about two pounds of root ginger peels it +cos she takes about two pounds of root ginger peels it really? and chops it -and puts it with a pound of philadelphia cheese into the cavity of the chicken outside it's just lightly rubbed with oil +and puts it with a pound of philadelphia cheese into the cavity of the chicken outside it's just lightly rubbed with oil mm mm. -and then about two ounces of powdered ginger sprinkled over it. +and then about two ounces of powdered ginger sprinkled over it. two ounces as well as all the ginger? -and puts it into roast in the oven, and takes it out after fifty minutes and then you get philadelphia cheese and white wine melt it down in the wine +and puts it into roast in the oven, and takes it out after fifty minutes and then you get philadelphia cheese and white wine melt it down in the wine mm mm! -stirring a bit more you know, crushed root ginger +stirring a bit more you know, crushed root ginger mm mm. and that's your sauce to serve on the side. i tell, you've never eaten anything like it! @@ -4564,7 +4563,7 @@ so do i? oh i haven't drunk ginger tea before. well i'll make you ginger tea. well we never tried that before. -but that's sounds what, can i just ask again, so you have a roast chicken yo , and you mix two +but that's sounds what, can i just ask again, so you have a roast chicken yo , and you mix two a pound of philadelphia cheese. yeah. but she does about two pound of root ginger. @@ -4583,11 +4582,11 @@ into the cavity. right. and yo -then after +then after and then fifty minutes oil it, oil -it's +it's the outside as if it's full yeah. @@ -4595,7 +4594,7 @@ and moist. put the ground, with the the ground ginger -the the +the the mhm. you know, the powdered stuff. philadelphia cheese cooked in and @@ -4604,7 +4603,7 @@ keeping the whole chicken . mm. mm. and then roast it. -and then after fifty minutes you do the melt the +and then after fifty minutes you do the melt the she, well she cooks her chicken for only fifteen minutes, but i would cook my chicken oh. longer. @@ -4637,9 +4636,9 @@ so , surely mm. yeah, it'll still be pink. i thought you had to be quite careful with chicken. -well, you're not gonna be -well we only ever use marks and spencers free range chicken. -we we used to have these in dublin didn't we? +well, you're not gonna be +well we only ever use marks and spencers free range chicken. +we we used to have these in dublin didn't we? can we give this dog yeah. some chickens? @@ -4647,19 +4646,19 @@ oh don't! i'll have to try that one in, in dublin, tell molly i've been. that sounds wonderful! it's still a good thing to try. -yeah, we do a well of course we,we used to make contact with who, were having a dinner party that we went to. -that's why we do all our entertaining one at a time. +yeah, we do a well of course we,we used to make contact with who, were having a dinner party that we went to. +that's why we do all our entertaining one at a time. why do you only use marks and spencers' chickens. sheila says they're the best in england. really? she won't have anything else in the hotel. -if there's a chicken dish in the hotel chickens don't come from our suppliers, they come from marks and spencers. +if there's a chicken dish in the hotel chickens don't come from our suppliers, they come from marks and spencers. do marks and spencers so you just freeze them do you? -obviously you get them then from in bulk from +obviously you get them then from in bulk from i just . no. -what you just go to the supermarkets and buy a whole of chickens? +what you just go to the supermarkets and buy a whole of chickens? mhm. really? that's our extravagance. @@ -4687,10 +4686,10 @@ are they nice? they are beautiful! yeah. they really are lovely. -we got about a hundred napkins upstairs . +we got about a hundred napkins upstairs . really? yeah. -the napkins to well cheaper than buying new ones isn't it? +the napkins to well cheaper than buying new ones isn't it? mm mm! yes. mm. @@ -4698,18 +4697,18 @@ you get them for two pounds fifty. four pounds. five pounds each. they're wonderful aren't they? -you go to peter and pay that for an ordinary +you go to peter and pay that for an ordinary mm mm. oh yeah. what d'ya call it, kind of mm. -i just thought that was absolutely delicious! -dave has a gorgeous recipe for erm teriyaki beef. +i just thought that was absolutely delicious! +dave has a gorgeous recipe for erm teriyaki beef. on the menu of biggs. oh what's really? that? -she puts the pickled ginger on one side and another, like a japanese horseradish called wasabe which is green don't try it, it'll blow your head off! +she puts the pickled ginger on one side and another, like a japanese horseradish called wasabe which is green don't try it, it'll blow your head off! really? oh yeah. and th , the, the sort of steak is then it's er cooked like soya sauce @@ -4723,9 +4722,9 @@ really? mm. oh i was just thinking, it'd be nice to go there. i didn't think it would be -the starters are about nine pounds to in at thirty five for caviar. +the starters are about nine pounds to in at thirty five for caviar. really? -main courses are about eighteen to twenty eight. +main courses are about eighteen to twenty eight. and the puddings make about sixty pounds. so it's sixty pounds each mm. @@ -4737,23 +4736,23 @@ yeah. mm. and is the drink very expensive? ya. -her mark-up is about so what i normally do, she has never ever told me to pay for anything. +her mark-up is about so what i normally do, she has never ever told me to pay for anything. and she says go and have a meal oh yeah. then yeah. -you know, and if anybody else does, they do but i always insist on paying for my drinks. +you know, and if anybody else does, they do but i always insist on paying for my drinks. yeah. and thank you. which one? -she obviously didn't know this for a long time and then one day i said to her, well, it was lovely meal and all that but i do think your mark-up on the wine is scandalous! +she obviously didn't know this for a long time and then one day i said to her, well, it was lovely meal and all that but i do think your mark-up on the wine is scandalous! what did she say? of course i get a staff discount. really? -she says well i know, and you know that that bottle of wine costs +she says well i know, and you know that that bottle of wine costs mm mm. -ten ninety five and, and we had two bottles last night so it costs us sixty pounds. +ten ninety five and, and we had two bottles last night so it costs us sixty pounds. well done michael. who's making gearoid pay? nobody makes me pay for it, i always pay for my drinks. @@ -4781,12 +4780,12 @@ yeah. you can't leave a tip regardless? well , michael always leaves a tip. mm. -but what we've done now they've agreed to let me pay and i pay cost price for the drinks. +but what we've done now they've agreed to let me pay and i pay cost price for the drinks. right. so we can drink ourselves silly and get a bill for about ten pounds. and all that wonderful food! oh that's very good isn't it? -i'm looking forward to the sweet i must +i'm looking forward to the sweet i must mm. say. mm. @@ -4806,10 +4805,10 @@ and how long are yours away for? too long. monday morning, four a m they landed. oh! -so you'll have a an awful week then as usual? -well i'm hoping i'm going to have a nice week but it mavis , my housekeeper's away until wednesday so i can't leave the house during the day. +so you'll have a an awful week then as usual? +well i'm hoping i'm going to have a nice week but it mavis , my housekeeper's away until wednesday so i can't leave the house during the day. oh right. -because the morning maid goes home at one o'clock and doesn't come back again until six. +because the morning maid goes home at one o'clock and doesn't come back again until six. the gardener comes. yes. i can't just go off and have a look for somebody or @@ -4834,19 +4833,19 @@ occasionally. i mean, at the moment there's no housekeeper so unless i actually say to the maid will you just put something in the oven for me? that's it. that's appalling though! -and on , on erm thursday thursday evening before they were going out to mark she came home at just about half one. -she came and made me a ham sandwich and the maid just look at her to eat it now. +and on , on erm thursday thursday evening before they were going out to mark she came home at just about half one. +she came and made me a ham sandwich and the maid just look at her to eat it now. brilliant! there really was not a scrap of . that's awful! -because the housekeeper sorts all that out, so when she's away no one does it? +because the housekeeper sorts all that out, so when she's away no one does it? but she bought all these things for me from marks and spencers, you know breaded chicken and mm mm. mm. breasts. yeah. i put them all in the deep freeze. -unless you think about it, you know the day before or the +unless you think about it, you know the day before or the yeah yeah. morning you come in. @@ -4859,15 +4858,15 @@ microwave? doesn't like them. but she bought you one. she get you one. -that was quite funny because it was our first christmas down there and i was saying to the housekeeper that i i wouldn't mind having people come and stay and not a problem because we've got a lovely cooker and we're going to bring our microwave down from . +that was quite funny because it was our first christmas down there and i was saying to the housekeeper that i i wouldn't mind having people come and stay and not a problem because we've got a lovely cooker and we're going to bring our microwave down from . said it's electric, i'm just going to unplug it and bring it down and put it on the work top. the only thing is that it's chocolate brown and my kitchen's all white. -and she did and so i think two days before christmas lady said to me, okay i shall go into peter and choose whatever microwave you want. +and she did and so i think two days before christmas lady said to me, okay i shall go into peter and choose whatever microwave you want. just charge it to my account. that's right. what? -she said well you can't be carrying microwaves around england every time you want to have a meal. -and just, i know that's what, you haven't got one in the cottage and there you are, go and get it. +she said well you can't be carrying microwaves around england every time you want to have a meal. +and just, i know that's what, you haven't got one in the cottage and there you are, go and get it. she's so generous isn't she? yeah. there was no kind of @@ -4886,7 +4885,7 @@ yeah . i said to the guy, how many of these could i actually walk out with? and he said none. they're all display models? -i said what have you got in the so , you know, warehouse on sloane avenue in +i said what have you got in the so , you know, warehouse on sloane avenue in mm. white? oh i think that was one of two. @@ -4899,19 +4898,19 @@ the pamphlet, it's far too complicated for me. she's like that. i mean, she's really sweet. mm mm. -i'm very careful never to admire things or enthuse about things. +i'm very careful never to admire things or enthuse about things. because she's likely to give them to you? because she's likely to give them to you. i mean, she knows i love gardenia mm mm. -and because she was in mustique and hadn't bought me a birthday present she made sure that there were two gardenia plants at the party that night she bought me. +and because she was in mustique and hadn't bought me a birthday present she made sure that there were two gardenia plants at the party that night she bought me. really? she's like that. mm. she knows we love the pink champagne. mm mm. the brand is in. -and it's not kind of standard champagne in the place but she always keeps a supply. +and it's not kind of standard champagne in the place but she always keeps a supply. always has champagne. got any champagne at home? get another bottle of that. @@ -4919,7 +4918,7 @@ he must be running low. you see i, i mean i know obviously the perks don't outweigh all that, er, at least you do get some perks. at least you know, she can be generous and yes. -but she can be absolutely demonic there's no doubt about that. +but she can be absolutely demonic there's no doubt about that. she really can. mm. and she drives you insane! @@ -4930,12 +4929,12 @@ i think she's on back on the right track as well with her. she was in a rut. okay. really? -there is more to life than worrying about how the maid's ironed your nightdress or you know. +there is more to life than worrying about how the maid's ironed your nightdress or you know. so she does have a housekeeper that lives in? no. now molly's been with her since she first got married, you know. she's a big portuguese man-of-war. -and then she has a maid? +and then she has a maid? who's very bitter. is she? why @@ -4950,10 +4949,10 @@ doesn't like sir mark. i think resents him enormously. he doesn't like her. oh really? -because, you know, i understand that before he came along she was there you know, and that kind of situation +because, you know, i understand that before he came along she was there you know, and that kind of situation yeah. yeah. -where you know, well it never used to be like that. +where you know, well it never used to be like that. is it mm mm. her first marriage then? @@ -4967,9 +4966,9 @@ really? i didn't know that. number one was killed in a car crash? really? -and her, their children were not two and three years of age. +and her, their children were not two and three years of age. oh how awful! -and the same week that he was killed, sasha, her daughter was in great ormond street having surgery for cancer of the brain. +and the same week that he was killed, sasha, her daughter was in great ormond street having surgery for cancer of the brain. that's appalling! so so she must have been quite young herself then? @@ -4981,28 +4980,28 @@ through something like and so that. she just divorced the second one? -kind of a touchy subject. +kind of a touchy subject. oh right. he's phil , the theatrical producer. -got all these smash hits in the west end at the moment. +got all these smash hits in the west end at the moment. but, i don't know what the story is. no one has ever said. any more. on the rare occasion that it comes up she kind of laughs it off and says well it wasn't really a marriage. and just change the subject. -so i could of been days +so i could of been days oh. literally. yeah. so sh -well sir marquess across the road it was his first wife who died of a brain tumour and left him with three daughters, as we know. +well sir marquess across the road it was his first wife who died of a brain tumour and left him with three daughters, as we know. oh really? . but it was almost inevitable. so where are all the children now? . -they have one son by this alliance and he's the youngest. -ah but they're all young adults. +they have one son by this alliance and he's the youngest. +ah but they're all young adults. oh so they all do their own thing? so the girl that had ah yeah. @@ -5022,17 +5021,17 @@ but i think that finally . use all these potatoes? we certainly do. yes, it that a joke michael? -i think he just well they've got pots of money between them why should i ever do any work? +i think he just well they've got pots of money between them why should i ever do any work? let them pay for everything, which they do. his daughter's loathe her! really? -although i think the elder one her -but the youngest one is really giving her a attack at the moment. -she's just come out of saint mary's didn't do as well as she thought, or everybody else hoped she would do in her a levels, so is now retaking one. -and she's just an evil little so and so! +although i think the elder one her +but the youngest one is really giving her a attack at the moment. +she's just come out of saint mary's didn't do as well as she thought, or everybody else hoped she would do in her a levels, so is now retaking one. +and she's just an evil little so and so! i hate to say that about anybody, but she really is. yeah. -she conspired to be disruptive. +she conspired to be disruptive. she's a liar. an out and out liar! really? @@ -5043,17 +5042,17 @@ she's stealing stuff? stealing stuff. from the house. does she still live at the home then? -erm officially yeah. +erm officially yeah. but -you know that erm these people chiddyfort where mum and dad are living and erm +you know that erm these people chiddyfort where mum and dad are living and erm which people ? oh yeah. -and they had fostered a girl because they couldn't have any children of their own as far as i know and and, ah they she's a com , a complete horror! -i mean, she's only about eighteen and she, she hates +and they had fostered a girl because they couldn't have any children of their own as far as i know and and, ah they she's a com , a complete horror! +i mean, she's only about eighteen and she, she hates she's got married now though. she hates the parents. yeah i know. -and even about the wedding dress her mother, her mother knew +and even about the wedding dress her mother, her mother knew but she's calmed down a lot. her mother knew, her mother that oh god! @@ -5061,7 +5060,7 @@ if she, if she admired this dress that one ? thank you very much. yes. -that she wouldn't say anything so, dorothy had to actually say erm well i really don't think you should go for that. +that she wouldn't say anything so, dorothy had to actually say erm well i really don't think you should go for that. that's awful! and the daughter said, right i'll have that one. but i think they are getting on better now though. @@ -5089,7 +5088,7 @@ but tell me shall i tell you what that's covered with? it's actually a stuffing mix mm mm! -that you can buy here you can actually get it in harrods as well, and i use as breadcrumbs. +that you can buy here you can actually get it in harrods as well, and i use as breadcrumbs. it's absolutely gorgeous! mm mm! there's more gravy here. @@ -5107,14 +5106,14 @@ the chicken is just is it? gorgeous! mm mm. -and with a of course the vegetables. +and with a of course the vegetables. lovely vegetables! mm mm! gosh! you've done very well michael! i don't take any gravy so have a bit more. do you not? -do you want some michael? +do you want some michael? have you had some? i have some here thank you. at the moment. @@ -5132,7 +5131,7 @@ no. oh i, it could be on, i can't see the red light now, it's gone the other side. i hope we weren't discussing what i thought we were discussing on that mm mm. -tape or you really have to wipe it out. +tape or you really have to wipe it out. i know. mm mm. cos names @@ -5144,7 +5143,7 @@ do you have it on during blind date. oh my god ! that could really lower the tone of the evening. you had your day. -well i didn't tell you about my hot date on wednesday. +well i didn't tell you about my hot date on wednesday. ooh! i didn't know you had one. tell me. @@ -5153,18 +5152,18 @@ you know i had the choir concert last saturday? mhm. it was at a church in hertford. and we were completely frozen cos the boiler had broken down and we were there at two o'clock to rehearse. -and i had one rehearsal of two bach pieces which were really difficult and i was com , feeling completely frantic during the break in rehearsal, and went over to look at the music and some fellow called don bounded over to me and said, oh you can't be you know you sh can't be looking at that now, ba, la dee da dee da! -he must have heard that i'd come back from ireland. -so, he was talking about ireland, really raving about it and his name's kennedy and he's from liverpool and he likes to think he's got irish blood in him, he's been there twice this year and +and i had one rehearsal of two bach pieces which were really difficult and i was com , feeling completely frantic during the break in rehearsal, and went over to look at the music and some fellow called don bounded over to me and said, oh you can't be you know you sh can't be looking at that now, ba, la dee da dee da! +he must have heard that i'd come back from ireland. +so, he was talking about ireland, really raving about it and his name's kennedy and he's from liverpool and he likes to think he's got irish blood in him, he's been there twice this year and mhm. all that. really enthusing about it. so we were chatting away about that. -and then erm after the rehearsal some of us went off to get a pizza before the concert and he said to me, erm are you interested in going to hear the mozart requiem, it's on at the barbican on wednesday? +and then erm after the rehearsal some of us went off to get a pizza before the concert and he said to me, erm are you interested in going to hear the mozart requiem, it's on at the barbican on wednesday? so i said, yeah! co , i've always wanted to hear it, and as you know it's our next concert. -so erm that was fine, until after the concert -was that a subsidised concert by were all the tickets one price or not? +so erm that was fine, until after the concert +was that a subsidised concert by were all the tickets one price or not? at the barbican? i don't know. it was packed! @@ -5186,13 +5185,13 @@ what was she wearing? it was sponsored. i read it in the black and white. -paper and thought well that would have been quite nice. +paper and thought well that would have been quite nice. mm mm. did you go with him? i'll come to that. you said yes did anyway. -i said yes thinking mozart would be lovely, and not thinking any more of it until he stuck to me like a limpet -for the rest of the concert and the penny began to drop erm he said something about the tube station not being the most romantic place to meet and i kind of brushed it off by saying well at least we won't get wet there or something. +i said yes thinking mozart would be lovely, and not thinking any more of it until he stuck to me like a limpet +for the rest of the concert and the penny began to drop erm he said something about the tube station not being the most romantic place to meet and i kind of brushed it off by saying well at least we won't get wet there or something. mm mm. and then he said er, i said to him about i've got to get the last train home. @@ -5208,16 +5207,16 @@ alright. he's tall but he's tall which is great. no problem. -he's in his well actually probably pushing forty at this stage. -but, he's got he's got a a big round red face and little eyes -and a moustache, and the most peculiar little bit under +he's in his well actually probably pushing forty at this stage. +but, he's got he's got a a big round red face and little eyes +and a moustache, and the most peculiar little bit under bit, yes. there. but really it's just like what colour hair has he got? it's just, it's just like a bit like that but he's nice? -which goes mm mm! +which goes mm mm! but i kept hearing him like scrape it during the concert. i know . but it @@ -5226,15 +5225,15 @@ it's ju what colour hair? erm does it matter? -when you have a lobotomy ! +when you have a lobotomy ! especially when he's i don't know . michael , michael oh no . -michael's hair colour i suppose. +michael's hair colour i suppose. a bit like that. -and then he's got he's got a beard, except it's not very long going behind his jawline like captain ahab. +and then he's got he's got a beard, except it's not very long going behind his jawline like captain ahab. do you remember? what? yes. @@ -5243,13 +5242,13 @@ kind of, out like that. really bizarre! weird. peculiar man. -he's head of er he's senior editor of classics at e m i, so he latched onto this sort of, you know +he's head of er he's senior editor of classics at e m i, so he latched onto this sort of, you know ah. -ooh another thing in common, you know da da, da da. +ooh another thing in common, you know da da, da da. and did you -so erm i was feeling a bit edgy about this when we were in the pub after the concert cos i thought maybe he's reading things into it and i, you know, i was just going along for the music. -so i thought, oh maybe i'm reading too much into it. -so i met him on wednesday evening tottenham court road tube station and er chat, chat, chat. +so erm i was feeling a bit edgy about this when we were in the pub after the concert cos i thought maybe he's reading things into it and i, you know, i was just going along for the music. +so i thought, oh maybe i'm reading too much into it. +so i met him on wednesday evening tottenham court road tube station and er chat, chat, chat. he, he talked so much we missed our stop. in a very loud voice! did you? @@ -5258,14 +5257,14 @@ erm, and he kept touching me as well which really annoyed me! oh oh! well, i'm a bit of toucher myself and i, i don't mind if it's friends or family or someone i'm keen on oh yeah. -that doesn't bother me, but considering it was only the second i'd spoken to him and i did not fancy him in the least erm, it really made my skin crawl. -and erm first couple of times i kind of didn't respond, and the next few times i was literally flinching +that doesn't bother me, but considering it was only the second i'd spoken to him and i did not fancy him in the least erm, it really made my skin crawl. +and erm first couple of times i kind of didn't respond, and the next few times i was literally flinching mm mm. and moving away, like, hint, hint. -but he liked gripped me on the arm and then his hand would appear from nowhere during the concert, he like kind of rubbed my arm and are you alright? +but he liked gripped me on the arm and then his hand would appear from nowhere during the concert, he like kind of rubbed my arm and are you alright? . oh it was just a nightmare! i, i know i'm a real bitch saying all this. -but, you know i think it, i thought it was his dingy grey suit to begin with that smelt of moth balls but it, it was his breath. +but, you know i think it, i thought it was his dingy grey suit to begin with that smelt of moth balls but it, it was his breath. it was, i don't know how it smelt of moth balls. and he kept guffaw and going, @@ -5274,30 +5273,30 @@ really? it was, it was a complete nightmare ! oh. and i, i wasn't prepared -i wasn't prepared for for it at all +i wasn't prepared for for it at all go on. -because afterwards i, he had his arm round me when we were leaving and said oh well, i've really enjoyed this evening, we'll do it again won't we? -and i pulled away and i said, well erm i so enjoyed the mozart i've always wanted to hear it. +because afterwards i, he had his arm round me when we were leaving and said oh well, i've really enjoyed this evening, we'll do it again won't we? +and i pulled away and i said, well erm i so enjoyed the mozart i've always wanted to hear it. hint! hint! i mean what could i do? -and then as we approached the tube station the arm around me again and erm and he +and then as we approached the tube station the arm around me again and erm and he but was he a fellow choir man as well? yes! it's awful you see because it's so i would have been, been very rude to him. -but no, but i can't couldn't afford to be rude to him, i've only just joined the choir. -well in future whenever he suggests something i think what you've got to do +but no, but i can't couldn't afford to be rude to him, i've only just joined the choir. +well in future whenever he suggests something i think what you've got to do there's some in here. okay? -i've got two here. -is never you know, join the breaks or whatever and just make sure you're not left alone +i've got two here. +is never you know, join the breaks or whatever and just make sure you're not left alone mm. you're with other girls. well, i'm sorry, he just came on so strong. mm. and, so i was forced into lying. -i said erm i've enjoyed the concert but i'm afraid +i said erm i've enjoyed the concert but i'm afraid yeah. a , er you know, i don't want there to be any. misunderstanding, and he, he said explain. @@ -5306,19 +5305,19 @@ certainly. and i said erm, i'm going out with someone. cos i thought he hasn't taken any of my hints so far. erm, and he said, oh that sort of un , misunderstanding? -and then i thought i'd really put my foot in it and embarrassed both of us +and then i thought i'd really put my foot in it and embarrassed both of us ha. -so there was silence until we got to the tube station and he said, how long have you been going out with this man? -said oh i thought oh becky would laugh if i told her this . +so there was silence until we got to the tube station and he said, how long have you been going out with this man? +said oh i thought oh becky would laugh if i told her this . well er, january, i think. mm. -yes, about ten months i suppose . +yes, about ten months i suppose . this phantom. of the opera. -and erm oh he was, oh very lucky man! +and erm oh he was, oh very lucky man! blah, blah, blah. i had high hopes of us. -ooh he kept, but he kept i'd even worked out my train to, from ealing down to +ooh he kept, but he kept i'd even worked out my train to, from ealing down to oh no! erm , strawberry hill. blah, blah, blah! @@ -5331,42 +5330,42 @@ his route. he said, i hope i'm not embarrassing you but i believe in being frank. blah, blah. and then to my horror -er erm we changed to embankment and he was supposed to go on the district line over to ealing +er erm we changed to embankment and he was supposed to go on the district line over to ealing yes. and i was going down to waterloo for my train mm. -he said erm do you mind if i travel to richmond with you? +he said erm do you mind if i travel to richmond with you? oh! what could i say? i mean no was ringing in my ears but i couldn't say that. i mean, yes, i do mind. -erm so we walked in and out of carriages as he sought a pair of seats together and erm squashed down, he had me like penned into the window, like i've got my bag and my umbrella in between ha , and i'd already told him i was going out with someone. +erm so we walked in and out of carriages as he sought a pair of seats together and erm squashed down, he had me like penned into the window, like i've got my bag and my umbrella in between ha , and i'd already told him i was going out with someone. he was going like that to my face. like, i really felt abused. i mean at the time ya. -i felt sorry for him but i must admit when i got home and the following morning, and since then i've felt quite angry about it. -that's +i felt sorry for him but i must admit when i got home and the following morning, and since then i've felt quite angry about it. +that's the next isn't it? the next time you see the girls in the choir i'll bet they'll turn round and say well i, er, he ca , he was, he was then be careful of whatever his name is. -he was then saying erm now what about a concert this friday? +he was then saying erm now what about a concert this friday? erm, there's such and such going on. -and there's one er a week on saturday, you know, let's go to both of those and i said erm i'm away those weekends. +and there's one er a week on saturday, you know, let's go to both of those and i said erm i'm away those weekends. i said, i'm going away this weekend, i'm going away next weekend yeah, let's not. -and he said erm have you got your diary with you? +and he said erm have you got your diary with you? and i said no. and he said, hadn't you better check? -and then he said, i don't mean to put pressure on, but i want to get to know you, we've got so much in common and erm i want to take you out for dinner, not just go to the concert, but, we don't get to know each other that way. +and then he said, i don't mean to put pressure on, but i want to get to know you, we've got so much in common and erm i want to take you out for dinner, not just go to the concert, but, we don't get to know each other that way. i'll come down to richmond and take you out for dinner, how does that sound? i said, i'll see you at choir. -but we don't get to see each other at the choir +but we don't get to see each other at the choir erm, because you don't stay back for a drink afterwards because you're going to strawberry hill. -i know it'll be easier when you're in fulham, blah, blah, blah, but erm pressure! +i know it'll be easier when you're in fulham, blah, blah, blah, but erm pressure! pressure. pressure. pressure. @@ -5379,7 +5378,7 @@ a lot easier to handle. sorry rachel. and then no . -he said that +he said that i did that for your sister's benefit. i'm not a loner, i'm lonely. he said, i haven't had a relationship since nineteen eighty. @@ -5398,17 +5397,17 @@ nineteen eighty. and i said, oh i'm sure there's someone you ought to join dateline or something. i said i'm there's somewhere out there for you. -and he was obviously really furious that i'd said that . -and i thought, yeah well i know i'd be cross if someone said to that me but i don't give a toss actually . +and he was obviously really furious that i'd said that . +and i thought, yeah well i know i'd be cross if someone said to that me but i don't give a toss actually . you should suggest that he join -dateline and he sounds awful +dateline and he sounds awful we'll, we'll put him on blind date. shall we nominate him? yeah . -and can you believe it erm -i don't believe . +and can you believe it erm +i don't believe . thursday night i was living in dread of the choir. -and i trundling along the district line to the embankment across to sloane square and then hello, hello, i didn't expect to see you here. +and i trundling along the district line to the embankment across to sloane square and then hello, hello, i didn't expect to see you here. oh oh! i never met anyone on the tube before from choir. and i'm sure my face was a picture. @@ -5420,21 +5419,21 @@ with his awful beard and everything. oh i dunno. is there anyone in and i had -the choir that lives near you, or sca , can travel with you? -actually there's paul, the guy who'd given me a lift to the concert and, and he mentioned going to the , the film i saw, erm but i knew he was going to the pub, he always goes to the pub afterwards. +the choir that lives near you, or sca , can travel with you? +actually there's paul, the guy who'd given me a lift to the concert and, and he mentioned going to the , the film i saw, erm but i knew he was going to the pub, he always goes to the pub afterwards. so i pa , i told one girl in the choir what had happened, and i think to begin and what did she say? -with she thought i was overreacting cos she didn't really respond. +with she thought i was overreacting cos she didn't really respond. is she married or what? and then , she is married. -er erm and then later on i, i, i think maybe she did realize, you know, cos i said i wasn't prepared for that and that hasn't happened before. +er erm and then later on i, i, i think maybe she did realize, you know, cos i said i wasn't prepared for that and that hasn't happened before. i didn't want to think, her to think that i was a show-off, you know yes. oh i have fun with men all the time, chasing them and that. mm mm. in my dreams! -and er er -she, she said to me on the way o , er as i was i said look i'm going to scoot now and she said well i hope you don't get any unwanted company on the way back. +and er er +she, she said to me on the way o , er as i was i said look i'm going to scoot now and she said well i hope you don't get any unwanted company on the way back. and i really felt on edge walking back to mm mm. the tube station cos i expected him to spring out @@ -5443,9 +5442,9 @@ from erm, an alleyway or but that man does live near you that can give you a lift. i know, but then i, i'd have yeah but you'd also have -to endure the pub with the other with don. +to endure the pub with the other with don. i know. -well i think the next time you just i mean, go home by yourself next time, you know if there was a i think you've got to make a point of of you know, not being alone with +well i think the next time you just i mean, go home by yourself next time, you know if there was a i think you've got to make a point of of you know, not being alone with mm mm. somebody like that around. mm. @@ -5456,7 +5455,7 @@ see he's been married before he said to me as well. i mean -he said to me on the train to richmond +he said to me on the train to richmond erm stop! there may well be someone in, in the wings but that's irrelevant to me. @@ -5480,7 +5479,7 @@ if anything, he should be kicked out if he's like that. mm. any new girl that comes along is gonna get him leching after her. who's the choir leader? -er th , we have a conductor called andy , who is our guest conductor. +er th , we have a conductor called andy , who is our guest conductor. alright. but is there nobody like erm you know like an orchestra leader? @@ -5488,10 +5487,10 @@ there isn't er, there isn't somebody who's sort of responsible for coordinating there's a chairman. bu , you know there's a committee with a chairman. but we all get changed in the same room when we're at concerts. -and he's . +and he's . what, men and women together? yes! -i know, i was appalled that saturday. +i know, i was appalled that saturday. oh god ! and obviously the only other @@ -5503,12 +5502,12 @@ i , you're too polite though. i wouldn't be as polite as you are. just tell him to bugger off! yeah i would've done too. -get one of those erm attack +get one of those erm attack rape alarm rape things, yeah. rape alarms. -and just bleep that when he comes near you . +and just bleep that when he comes near you . yes. absolutely . honestly! @@ -5520,12 +5519,12 @@ you know, if he starts creating a scene then you say that retched thing has gone you know, d'ya know what i mean? just startle him. mm. -cos then you're not going to be +cos then you're not going to be cos if he's not being put off by a boyfriend which most men would. mm. well if needs mm! -be, i mean i gearoid will turn up. +be, i mean i gearoid will turn up. gearoid. are you nominating ? and i'll play the boyfriend. @@ -5539,7 +5538,7 @@ mm. one of you should go and pick her up that's what i'm saying. mm. -from the choir one night and you can say to him oh my boyfriend's picking me up and then see how . +from the choir one night and you can say to him oh my boyfriend's picking me up and then see how . or you, bring me over and introduce me. mm. and i'll say @@ -5547,25 +5546,25 @@ you know, i'll say thank you for taking anna-marie to, to the mozart concert. mm. i'll have to do it but i think she was very . -it was really, it was really , it was really very helpful to her at her choir and her practice that night. +it was really, it was really , it was really very helpful to her at her choir and her practice that night. er erm yes, cos i'm gonna have to make up some rubbish about seeing him. see my boyfriend isn't too interested in concerts and that's why i've enjoyed coming out this evening. -and here, here am i, and then i'll say you know of course i you know i'm indebted to you because i realize that, you know, anna-marie is quite prepared to go out with other men if she wants to -but i like and make sure it's alright. +and here, here am i, and then i'll say you know of course i you know i'm indebted to you because i realize that, you know, anna-marie is quite prepared to go out with other men if she wants to +but i like and make sure it's alright. i'm actually going to join in the choir. -you'll be able to take her +you'll be able to take her i can't even have a . . -anna-marie's told me so much about it . -and can you tell me the ta , time of trains from . +anna-marie's told me so much about it . +and can you tell me the ta , time of trains from . yum yum, look, come on over here. and that's what he was like on wednesday night, he said look -as so , more or less as soon as he'd said hello he said erm thirty two and two minutes past the hour, they're your trains. +as so , more or less as soon as he'd said hello he said erm thirty two and two minutes past the hour, they're your trains. i checked them up. so i thought i couldn't even say look @@ -5585,7 +5584,7 @@ and that's something no. christine said. thank god he doesn't know where she lives here cos he'll be round knocking on the door. -i know, but the appalling thing is that the address list was given out at the a g m and christine's phone number is on it. +i know, but the appalling thing is that the address list was given out at the a g m and christine's phone number is on it. cos rachel rang me at work and said i need your phone number. i've been fobbing her off saying, i haven't got anywhere permanent. she said, i need your home number. @@ -5595,13 +5594,13 @@ isn't that too far? mm mm. sorry er i but who was that, who was that list handed round to? -to everyone in the choir presumably. +to everyone in the choir presumably. oh that's dreadful! oh god! -so you really +so you really don't you tell christine that. -cos she actually said to me, thank god we're not gonna have him bothering us. +cos she actually said to me, thank god we're not gonna have him bothering us. well i thought don't erm i'll have to say i'm rachel because our voices sound the same. @@ -5609,7 +5608,7 @@ yeah well just don't let christine know. just mm. just say that -don't erm that's very bazaar don't you +don't erm that's very bazaar don't you mm mm. think? i think, i think that's, i @@ -5656,14 +5655,14 @@ this gravy is delicious as well! mm mm. do you like it? mm mm. -took me thirty seconds to make that gravy. +took me thirty seconds to make that gravy. so what's that made out of? booze. i chose the booze and has it got alcohol in it? it has. i wondered whether it had. -erm it's made from bisto, this instant +erm it's made from bisto, this instant mm mm. granules. you'd never believe that would you? @@ -5674,11 +5673,11 @@ oh right. er two tablespoons of madeira oh lovely! lovely! -and some redcurrant and port jelly. +and some redcurrant and port jelly. mm mm! mm. it's absolutely delicious! -well we've nothing to mop it up with. +well we've nothing to mop it up with. dab it behind the ears. i'm gonna get yum yum to clear mine off. it's good that bottle of gravy. @@ -5691,7 +5690,7 @@ years and years and years ago. mm mm. and you can vary it though, if you're having lamb by putting some mint jelly. delicious! -well i certainly wouldn't worry about being rude to that to don the train spotter. +well i certainly wouldn't worry about being rude to that to don the train spotter. no, i think there's some people you have to be very blunt to. donald . mm. @@ -5704,7 +5703,7 @@ who? you did. who? no, i thought, i thought you meant you'd spoken to him after my date. -no,they were on before you went on your date . +no,they were on before you went on your date . left mine afterwards . mm mm. no he's very odd. @@ -5719,7 +5718,7 @@ so, i i didn't er, i didn't instigate a conversation at all. but it sounds as though he doesn't realize that. i didn't ask him whether he got back but some people are so -alright, i didn't i answered in monosyllables. +alright, i didn't i answered in monosyllables. mm. i didn't instigate a conversation. and then i ran out after the @@ -5730,7 +5729,7 @@ yes straightaway. i was thinking how's that? that's because of the mozart, not you. -in highlighted pen that you know so when he goes out with someone in ninete , in two thousand he'll say to someone the last time i went out with someone was in nineteen ninety three. +in highlighted pen that you know so when he goes out with someone in ninete , in two thousand he'll say to someone the last time i went out with someone was in nineteen ninety three. it's sad isn't it? but i felt sorry for him, i did, but that was my immediate reaction that has he got a good voice? @@ -5738,21 +5737,21 @@ yes. he's a good singer? mm. he is. -well he's obviously musical if he's involved in e m i as well. +well he's obviously musical if he's involved in e m i as well. mm mm. -but he can be, he's very, perhaps a bit bossy in it, and erm may, maybe bitter i feel. +but he can be, he's very, perhaps a bit bossy in it, and erm may, maybe bitter i feel. doesn't have a very good sense of humour. mm mm. -i don't think anybody should go out with someone on their own in the beginning, i really don't. +i don't think anybody should go out with someone on their own in the beginning, i really don't. do you not, gearoid. no. not nowadays. i don't care what anybody says. whether it's two yeah. -guys or two women +guys or two women mm mm. -or anything, i really don't think anyone should put themselves in that position. +or anything, i really don't think anyone should put themselves in that position. you're better off going out as a threesome or a foursome yeah. yeah but if you get asked out @@ -5775,52 +5774,52 @@ but you've never had a conversation with him. mm mm. just because you know the guy from marks and spencers. i did that with graham. -i went out, i hadn't even i'd said hello to him, that was it. -you see, i think that's really strange in this day and age. +i went out, i hadn't even i'd said hello to him, that was it. +you see, i think that's really strange in this day and age. yes but you're meeting in a public place. -not like, i mean i was making my way there, he was making his way there and i wouldn't want them to come and pick me up in the car +not like, i mean i was making my way there, he was making his way there and i wouldn't want them to come and pick me up in the car mm mm. -and me go off, i wouldn't do that without really you know, having been out with him a few times. +and me go off, i wouldn't do that without really you know, having been out with him a few times. but i'd make good. my own way there and meet them. in a public place. -but if i met, but then that's slightly different because if i met someone in a nightclub or something like that then i would be quite wary. +but if i met, but then that's slightly different because if i met someone in a nightclub or something like that then i would be quite wary. mm mm. -i don't think i'd i don't know i don't know what i'd do. +i don't think i'd i don't know i don't know what i'd do. i'd feel quite differently. but something like the choir or where you've been working, i don't know you, i, i've got this thing which is well i still i think think you, you know you feel safe . -that even in something like the choir it's somebody that you should of struck up a, er a relationship you know, over several +that even in something like the choir it's somebody that you should of struck up a, er a relationship you know, over several the intervals. mm. yeah. yeah. -and you suddenly, you thought to yourself well you know i actually quite like this chap. +and you suddenly, you thought to yourself well you know i actually quite like this chap. mm. you know, wouldn't it be nice if he had asked me out. and then suddenly the day mm mm. comes along. -not to sort of well you, you can't be blamed because i mean yo , in the innocent you were actually going because of the concert. +not to sort of well you, you can't be blamed because i mean yo , in the innocent you were actually going because of the concert. i know. you see i ne but he didn't , you know, he, he can't believe his luck that somebody no. as attractive as you -said yes +said yes he's got this goat beard and this hairy bottom lip! you know, breathe that smells of moth balls, i mean who would have thought of that. and he, and -if he were taking several of you out why didn't you say to one of the other girls why don't you come? +if he were taking several of you out why didn't you say to one of the other girls why don't you come? did he have a pair of tickets? cos it was when we were walking down michael can i have a look please? -oh sorry ! +oh sorry ! thank you. oh sorry. oh gross! @@ -5847,28 +5846,28 @@ i said that to you. yes, okay. it brings out yeah. -you see i haven't got any unus , i've got stuff a bit like that, but i haven't got any anything like this. +you see i haven't got any unus , i've got stuff a bit like that, but i haven't got any anything like this. the heel and everything's lovely isn't yeah. it? you look very dressy aren't you? -may i start my chocolate? +may i start my chocolate? absolutely. -don't don't dribble it. +don't don't dribble it. yes. put it round this way. i thought i'm going to eat some. mm. -yes because we won't be going -after that comes. +yes because we won't be going +after that comes. late tonight. -could you could you pass me the milk please? +could you could you pass me the milk please? yes. my greatest pleasure. try this. oh that's nice. because it's so busy for me. -on five in this one? +on five in this one? yeah. pardon ? what is he actually saying ? @@ -5877,7 +5876,7 @@ see you've done very well knocking those together. think nothing of it. neither do we. haphazard. -one week it'll be all savoury biscuits to go with and chocolate cake. +one week it'll be all savoury biscuits to go with and chocolate cake. this cake's lovely are you not having any? yes. oh yes, @@ -5896,12 +5895,12 @@ but he'd be made-to-measure. but he didn't have any did he? waistcoats. oh no! -i remember we saw in the other shop it happened again. -do you have any use for your french jacket at all? +i remember we saw in the other shop it happened again. +do you have any use for your french jacket at all? when did you buy some jackets in france? he . -and then we got know the go and get myself out of marks and spencers this weekend which for menswear particularly it was very dowdy . -and, and we . +and then we got know the go and get myself out of marks and spencers this weekend which for menswear particularly it was very dowdy . +and, and we . snobs! unlike your shoes rachel, it's glossed out. no. @@ -5927,7 +5926,7 @@ but then they se , you see they sell those in their staff shop. but i thought it was meant to be anonymous. . -it's up to a point . +it's up to a point . tell us about your job . i can't stand it ! aye well @@ -5941,8 +5940,8 @@ but will they be defending . yeah . that is a west sussex term . been teaching it to hazlemere. -keep your hands close to the dish now michael. -and we just . +keep your hands close to the dish now michael. +and we just . getting michael giggly. no red rock's come back. i just wondered if you'd rather @@ -5956,7 +5955,7 @@ switch it off now for a few minutes. okay? ah ah! i'll leave you with that. -the worm. +the worm. look at these flowers! so these are lovely! mm mm. @@ -5964,7 +5963,7 @@ five cheesies to one slurp of drink. hmm mm. why is it pure gin? i think ted would be proud of me. -well, my stars say if you find yourself at a low ebb this weekend don't worry. +well, my stars say if you find yourself at a low ebb this weekend don't worry. every so often we all need to wind down. there you are. if your a little numb, cynical, or apathetic it's probably a healthy sign. @@ -5984,17 +5983,17 @@ what's virgo? better . it doesn't make sense to buy the cheapest brand of baked beans to save a few pence. it's true. -so then fill your car tank at the most expensive petrol station in town. +so then fill your car tank at the most expensive petrol station in town. if you're going to make economies , make efficient ones. -similarly, if you are going to be extravagant, be so in an a area,where you're actually going to see the benefit +similarly, if you are going to be extravagant, be so in an a area,where you're actually going to see the benefit so you see ha i told you you should have those two pairs of shoes. -happiness will come to all virgos who aim the right arrows at the right targets this weekend . +happiness will come to all virgos who aim the right arrows at the right targets this weekend . gearoid, what are you? it depends. it is the nineteenth of february, which one does it fall on theirs? -pisces or aquarius? +pisces or aquarius? pisces. aquaria , aquarius. mhm. @@ -6006,7 +6005,7 @@ in barbados and er some young chaps had saw me lying on the beach and er they st well your talking about it now and, and with a degree of emotion, do you still feel it? oh, it was feel , it was so terrifying, you just, you regard every one with suspicion after that. mm, mm -i actually feel, there was a time i used to think it wouldn't happen to me because if i was in that situation i would do this, i would do the next thing and when it did actually happen to me it took me ages to get over +i actually feel, there was a time i used to think it wouldn't happen to me because if i was in that situation i would do this, i would do the next thing and when it did actually happen to me it took me ages to get over mm the trauma because your so helpless and what was, what was the it can i ask that happened? @@ -6064,7 +6063,7 @@ because i think women have traditionally been very reluctant both to report dome i think if your, in, in a relationship with the person that commits the crime against you, as victims of domestic violence then there's a tendency to look for the reason you were assaulted within yourself mm -i think its very significant, here we are and lots of people have admitted to being a victim of crime but statistics show that twenty five per cent of women will be assaulted within a relationship and yet no women here has said that and that's probably because the women who have been so assaulted feels somehow it is their own fault, its somehow shameful. +i think its very significant, here we are and lots of people have admitted to being a victim of crime but statistics show that twenty five per cent of women will be assaulted within a relationship and yet no women here has said that and that's probably because the women who have been so assaulted feels somehow it is their own fault, its somehow shameful. possibly also they might not want to go on national television and say that, which, which i would sympathize with entirely i mean you know, why, why bring it on yourself, yes erm, i work for ?in edinburgh and erm, er all too often er we see er female relations er of male offenders, er this lady struck a chord er especially when it comes to serious crime @@ -6101,14 +6100,14 @@ and er, and, presumably your attitude to the police is not a sympathetic one no is that, is that general? as far as domestic violence is concerned, yes. -yeah, i worked with a voluntary group for a while and i remember helping one lady go through, she was raped, and go through the courts, and all her past life was brought up, i mean i was so upset for her and yet the fact that he had actually raped twice before wasn't brought up, but her past life was brought up and the man actually got off in the end because she just could not cope with being on the stand and dealing with it all and it was just so terrible that, that, that the, the ina , +yeah, i worked with a voluntary group for a while and i remember helping one lady go through, she was raped, and go through the courts, and all her past life was brought up, i mean i was so upset for her and yet the fact that he had actually raped twice before wasn't brought up, but her past life was brought up and the man actually got off in the end because she just could not cope with being on the stand and dealing with it all and it was just so terrible that, that, that the, the ina , mm the differences should be male and female like this was so terrible so your describing a system which you feel double victimizes someone who is, who's i think it can do, i mean it was a long time ago and i'm, i'm yeah told that it has changed, but at that time, and i know my feeling was left that if i was raped i wouldn't never go to the police. -well a number of things have come up so let's just take a couple of votes as er, from hearing from a few people and of which people haven't managed to speak so, first of all, er, er people talked about fear being larger than the incidence of assault, are you afraid to go out in the dark?, button one for yes and button two for no do you find that your afraid to go out in the dark, and then this hundred and that's a very, i mean that's, that's a very significant figure fifty seven out of this hundred women say yes that their afraid to go out in the dark from time to time, i mean that, that is not as it should be, let me ask you are you ever afraid in your own home?, button one for yes and button two for no and that two is a very worrying figure, twenty nine of of this hundred say yes their afraid in their home, let me ask you this have you trained in self defence?, button one for yes and button two for no, i mean its something that comes up from time to time and i don't know what your view and whether or not its a good idea, well twelve of the hundred here have er, eighty eight say no, of those twelve would you recommend it?, did it make you feel better?, yes +well a number of things have come up so let's just take a couple of votes as er, from hearing from a few people and of which people haven't managed to speak so, first of all, er, er people talked about fear being larger than the incidence of assault, are you afraid to go out in the dark?, button one for yes and button two for no do you find that your afraid to go out in the dark, and then this hundred and that's a very, i mean that's, that's a very significant figure fifty seven out of this hundred women say yes that their afraid to go out in the dark from time to time, i mean that, that is not as it should be, let me ask you are you ever afraid in your own home?, button one for yes and button two for no and that two is a very worrying figure, twenty nine of of this hundred say yes their afraid in their home, let me ask you this have you trained in self defence?, button one for yes and button two for no, i mean its something that comes up from time to time and i don't know what your view and whether or not its a good idea, well twelve of the hundred here have er, eighty eight say no, of those twelve would you recommend it?, did it make you feel better?, yes at the time it did, but i think i've forgotten every thing i learned. yeah i, i er thought about self defence but i keep thinking about things like that's fine but if someone has a knife or a gun, the one might of self defence that i have been trained on or taught in can possibly help and i can't really see it as being very very helpful because mm, mm @@ -6117,8 +6116,8 @@ do you think in this country that's the case?, people have a weapon now certainl i think so were doing this programme in the united states that'll be, but then of course you living in the states you'll probably all have guns i mean i don't, i wonder, do, do any of you have a gun?, let me ask you that -do you, do, do you have a gun?, button one for yes and button two for no well i'm not going to ask you to identify yourselves the three of you -who have, well in fact, i must ask you this would you, would you like to have a gun?, button one for yes, button two for no, i'll tell you my own view on this after you've voted and nine of you say yes you would, what, what, would any body liked to say why they'd like to have a gun?, yes +do you, do, do you have a gun?, button one for yes and button two for no well i'm not going to ask you to identify yourselves the three of you +who have, well in fact, i must ask you this would you, would you like to have a gun?, button one for yes, button two for no, i'll tell you my own view on this after you've voted and nine of you say yes you would, what, what, would any body liked to say why they'd like to have a gun?, yes well i erm, i was, i was burgled about a year ago and i'm am ex er, i'm a retired criminal lawyer, and, but i, i felt that if i lived in the states and trained in the states and i carried a gun then and i felt very vulnerable in not having a gun because he, i was in my own home and he fist me with a knife mm, mm you, er, it had happened because i had been, i had had a lot of training and a lot of swindles and thing, i was able to talked to him and i talked to him for an hour and a half er, i was curious for one thing to find out why he was, he, he was breaking into people's houses, so that the fact that he was doing it for, to, to get money for drugs @@ -6133,11 +6132,11 @@ do you? but erm , er at a stage that they are in and been for a long time in the states as we will have to er get armed, well i'm sorry to say this but it seems like it well no its your view, although ninety one of the women here said no and er, if i had a vote i'd, i'd probably say no because i'm absolutely convinced i would use it if i had it and er, and well, well, one can be abrupt at times and the that could lead -to other things, we've kind of veered of the, one of the subjects that we were er, we did get onto which was how the police and the courts er handle er well victims and indeed criminals, i wonder if i might conflate erm both those groups into one question, its a very broad question, but i wonder if you think by and large the police do a good job, erm button one for yes and button two for no, erm and the majority here say yes, seventy seventy people say yes the, the police do a good job and since we've talked about the courts do you think the courts do a good job by and large?, we've been talking specifically about erm some of the more bizarre erm statements that have come from the bench, particularly in with reference to crimes erm, that have treated against women, well now, seventy nine say no, so the police comes thumbs up, but the courts are way down, now not surprisingly there aren't many representatives from the courts er amongst this hundred +to other things, we've kind of veered of the, one of the subjects that we were er, we did get onto which was how the police and the courts er handle er well victims and indeed criminals, i wonder if i might conflate erm both those groups into one question, its a very broad question, but i wonder if you think by and large the police do a good job, erm button one for yes and button two for no, erm and the majority here say yes, seventy seventy people say yes the, the police do a good job and since we've talked about the courts do you think the courts do a good job by and large?, we've been talking specifically about erm some of the more bizarre erm statements that have come from the bench, particularly in with reference to crimes erm, that have treated against women, well now, seventy nine say no, so the police comes thumbs up, but the courts are way down, now not surprisingly there aren't many representatives from the courts er amongst this hundred because er there weren't all that many er available, what, what do you think of, twenty one of you said yes, of the twenty one who said yes are you surprised that the great majority of this hundred women are so unimpressed by, by the courts system, who said yes and would you like to defend your answer?, yes er, i must declare an, an interest because i am a, a court lawyer, but i think that a lot of people say no because of the media pres , presentation, you only hear bad stories, they don't hear the good, good stories about the attempts to make the courts more efficient and i think that on the whole and with the circumstances that the courts have to deal with they do a very good job. so its my fault again -the media any, any, yes, up there. +the media any, any, yes, up there. you've got to mention in scotland the one thing that we've got to be proud of is the children's panel system because mm we, its one of the only countries in the world where children can go and in a non judged mental way, a panel can work out what the best thing is to do with them, its unique. @@ -6153,12 +6152,11 @@ yes would any one like to comment on that?, jackie i've just spent six months in cottonvale and i mean its degrading, i mean cos your locked up in a cell from eight o'clock at night till six o'clock in the morning and your not got any toilet facilities you've got to use a potty if you want to go to the toilet and it is degrading, i mean there's people in there, well i was a first offender the first time i was in, but i mean there's people in there seventeen year old that haven't a clue about life in general and it is degrading for them. -so the claims that are made for the good of prison does your not, your not impressed by, well we have to give right of reply to patricia as you work at cottonvale. +so the claims that are made for the good of prison does your not, your not impressed by, well we have to give right of reply to patricia as you work at cottonvale. i would say that if a person is locked up from that time at night, there's circumstances, their perhaps observation for their own safety, erm any body else that can be trusted at night sanitation are not locked in, they have the facilities to go to the toilet during the night, i mean this person that's just said must of obviously been ob observation or was locked up for a reason. were getting into an area which i think is a whole different programme and before this programme started i might tell you we were having a little er discussion amongst ourselves whether or not er zoo's were good for animals and i suppose there is a discussion about whether prisons are inevitably going to be degrading because of, because of what er, what, what a prison represents which is a curtailment of freedom, but we don't have time in this programme, so that's another one for next year, can i ask you, we've, we've touched a lot of basis and it must be frustrating that we can't pursue er to the end some of the things we've er, we've picked on, but can i ask you a couple of final questions, as far as you know have you committed a crime?, button one for yes and button two for no, as far as you know, i mean we haven't got time to go into what they might be so your perfectly free to be very honest and honestly reveals that three people aren't quite sur , oh yes there they are well there are fifty one law abiding citizens and there are forty nine potential felons if only they had been found out, my final question tonight is do you enjoy crime fiction? and that includes television, after all the station that this programme goes out on, wins a lot of revenue for making a very popular er detective fictional thing called taggart, i don't know whether you watch that, or what you read but seventy eight of you enjoy crime fiction, now there's an interesting paradox that we will discuss, why you can discuss at home, we'll discuss it now, good night. - what do you get the headphones for as well? i don't know. he didn't seem to know what they were in there for. @@ -6166,10 +6164,10 @@ oh. well you can listen to what you've taped with the headphones. what? you can listen to what you've taped. -oh +oh you can play it back yeah, if you want to. oh. -i notice if you put the the headphones in it would erm you'd maybe be listening to it as it's taping? +i notice if you put the the headphones in it would erm you'd maybe be listening to it as it's taping? i don't think you can do that. did you have to sign for something to say that you've had it? to say i've had it, yeah. @@ -6187,17 +6185,17 @@ stick it where you like. stick it where you like. but d does it need to be uncovered? no. -it's got erm it's own recording level. +it's got erm it's own recording level. yeah. -and even if it and are you supposed to tell people that you're recording what they're saying or just record it +and even if it and are you supposed to tell people that you're recording what they're saying or just record it erm and then tell them afterwards? i suppose you should tell them that you're going to tape the conversation maybe, yeah. yes. i don't suppose that matters really. -but i mean, if you erm if you put your headphones on you see, they might just think erm you're listening to a walkman. -and er they would come up with some bad language towards you. -then especially if you told them you were recording what they said . +but i mean, if you erm if you put your headphones on you see, they might just think erm you're listening to a walkman. +and er they would come up with some bad language towards you. +then especially if you told them you were recording what they said . could be dangerous. i've asked brian to take the dog out as well, when he comes back. i won't have time now. @@ -6208,10 +6206,10 @@ yeah. ah! didn't i tell you about that? there's no petrol in the car. -you mean every time i have that car i have to put petrol in. +you mean every time i have that car i have to put petrol in. no i put it in the last two times. twenty quid's worth. -so you'll have you watch my little car. +so you'll have you watch my little car. watch it or wash it? watch it. be careful. @@ -6228,38 +6226,38 @@ i mean the roadworks on the m 6 are diabolical now. mm. i it took us three and a half hours coming back from swansea. but we stopped off for half an hour as well. -and i think it's longer coming back that way. +and i think it's longer coming back that way. over the bridge. no it isn't. it isn't. you sure? i'd be positive. shorter. -cos th i remember the first time i went down that way over the bridge. +cos th i remember the first time i went down that way over the bridge. it was about a hundred and eighty miles i clocked up. er but coming back i only clocked up about a hundred and twenty. what was the mileage when we got there? a hundred and eleven? something like that, yeah. -so it was three hundred coming back or total three hundred. +so it was three hundred coming back or total three hundred. i can't remember now exactly. i i think it does make a difference, going over the bridge. i i found it when i was driving the last time. -but i couldn't remember where the turn off was to come up the scenic route. +but i couldn't remember where the turn off was to come up the scenic route. cos i was reading, and you'd passed it. -yeah well you could erm go up, go down the m 50 into ross and then go from there. -yeah but th there was a turn off and i didn't know whether the turn off was at cardiff and we went past it. -yeah, there is a oh to go back that way? +yeah well you could erm go up, go down the m 50 into ross and then go from there. +yeah but th there was a turn off and i didn't know whether the turn off was at cardiff and we went past it. +yeah, there is a oh to go back that way? yeah. yeah. you could turn off for abergavenny again. -abergavenny yeah, but that was, that was going straight up +abergavenny yeah, but that was, that was going straight up so, where's she gone now? who, patricia? -well, she was going to birmingham and then she was going to in a careers office. +well, she was going to birmingham and then she was going to in a careers office. they close at about four o'clock don't they? yeah, very probably. -and she was hoping that they would have sent her for an interview down there. +and she was hoping that they would have sent her for an interview down there. in the afternoon. think she's probably staying in birmingham. well, birmingham's on the cards cos steve, stevey-boy works there doesn't he? @@ -6287,9 +6285,9 @@ it's on at the moment. recording? oh i see. why's that? -oh some experiment? +oh some experiment? right. -some market research just to see how many times you swear at me. +some market research just to see how many times you swear at me. really? yeah. oh that's good. @@ -6305,13 +6303,13 @@ it tastes alright for a few mouthfuls and then it like gets a bit monotonous. i've just been up to tesco's. mm? who were you talking to? -i was talking to er simon and dave and all the rest of the lads +i was talking to er simon and dave and all the rest of the lads yeah. bragging about your bike. and er, no actually. -dave goes have you got your bike yet? +dave goes have you got your bike yet? i goes yeah, just been to pick it up. -he goes oh and i suppose you loved every minute of it? +he goes oh and i suppose you loved every minute of it? what's that grey thing john? has it fallen off the roof? ooh. @@ -6353,7 +6351,7 @@ hurry up. what? he's going as well. he's gone. -he goes upstairs, on the bed, vaseline on your nose go on. +he goes upstairs, on the bed, vaseline on your nose go on. and he's gone up. i think he's getting hooked on the taste of vaseline, that dog. yeah. @@ -6369,20 +6367,20 @@ the one that dropped out of college? work. yeah. yeah. -well i'll ring him up. +well i'll ring him up. see if he's in. you mean you're not going to show off to john ? oh yeah. i'm gonna call for him on the way. does he know matt? no. -i seen andy in town today walking round with his erm headphones in. +i seen andy in town today walking round with his erm headphones in. oh yeah. mm. that tasty? it is actually. it's a bit big though. -well john demolished my little omelette pan. +well john demolished my little omelette pan. oh i see. mm. so i had to use his frying pan. @@ -6391,37 +6389,37 @@ let's have a look at your face. oh nice. did you get vaseline on? mm. -oh, yeah i've got some now. +oh, yeah i've got some now. did you get your vaseline on rick?good boy. i wonder if these people that have to listen to these tapes can understand doggy language as well? no. no? what do you think rick? -did john tell you anybody that takes part will get erm a marks and spencers' voucher? +did john tell you anybody that takes part will get erm a marks and spencers' voucher? oh? mm. wonder if we'll get any, any vouchers for the dog? in the pet food shop. he makes enough noise doesn't he? yeah, yeah. -it was also noted today at these er presentations that i was the one with the least brummie accent. +it was also noted today at these er presentations that i was the one with the least brummie accent. oh. which made me feel good. -well except for andy. -mm we oh yeah andy's nigerian. +well except for andy. +mm we oh yeah andy's nigerian. the nigerian. mm. yeah. -except for him of course, but cos i was getting a bit upset that my voice was going a bit brummie. +except for him of course, but cos i was getting a bit upset that my voice was going a bit brummie. oh right. -i've given her her hairdryer back on trial, i've told her. -if she leaves it plugged in and switched on again she won't get it back. +i've given her her hairdryer back on trial, i've told her. +if she leaves it plugged in and switched on again she won't get it back. yeah. she's definitely unplugged the hairdryer and she's unplugged her radio as well. because it ain't on. i ain't having the house burnt down. bloody hairdryers. -well want to know if rick joins in the conversation will we get any vouchers for doggy food? +well want to know if rick joins in the conversation will we get any vouchers for doggy food? yeah, we do don't we? yeah we do. you are cheeky. @@ -6438,23 +6436,23 @@ did they record it or that, no? which is a good job. mm. cos most of us were petrified anyway. -and that's a bit like that erm the teaching skills that i had to do that time when i was on the course. +and that's a bit like that erm the teaching skills that i had to do that time when i was on the course. mm? -erm and i had to think up something that i do as a hobby er to teach other people. -i, i did those little flowers you see and took them in. -and er it is quite nervewracking really to sit there. +erm and i had to think up something that i do as a hobby er to teach other people. +i, i did those little flowers you see and took them in. +and er it is quite nervewracking really to sit there. specially when the instructors come over and they're sort of sitting watching as well. -well the bad thing was, as soon as i picked my cards up i dropped them all you know? +well the bad thing was, as soon as i picked my cards up i dropped them all you know? mm. all your flash cards? good morning yeah. good morning ladies and gentlemen pshoow and they, they went all over the place. -so i had to pick them back up mm sorry. +so i had to pick them back up mm sorry. bit of nerves. be back to front now, this morning yeah? -john wants me to er sew his trousers for him. +john wants me to er sew his trousers for him. oh. -i'm waiting on him picking up the machine. +i'm waiting on him picking up the machine. it tickles me the way they call it portable and you can hardly lift it. we took patricia in to, we give her a lift as far as longbridge today. she was going back to get her coat changed. @@ -6472,19 +6470,19 @@ you had to fold it in half to get it on. that's what i said to john i said you've got your dinner in between an omelette. yeah. that's right. -i thought i could call it erm a spanish omelette. +i thought i could call it erm a spanish omelette. what i tried to do was one of those did you have ploughman's things. did you have a surplus of eggs or something? pardon me. -well erm, i knew you wouldn't eat sort of sliced ham on its own with erm vegetables. -so i knew you would eat it like that in an omelette. +well erm, i knew you wouldn't eat sort of sliced ham on its own with erm vegetables. +so i knew you would eat it like that in an omelette. mm. i mean, if it had of been smaller. -well, i'll have a go but i may not eat all this but if it was smaller it's really tasty as well. +well, i'll have a go but i may not eat all this but if it was smaller it's really tasty as well. mm. -but you liked those erm were they countryman's or ploughman's in a packet and you just throw them into the pan and cook it for about fifteen minutes? +but you liked those erm were they countryman's or ploughman's in a packet and you just throw them into the pan and cook it for about fifteen minutes? and that was just potatoes and eggs wasn't it? and some cheese. and bacon. @@ -6492,24 +6490,24 @@ don't remember. oh. what i want to do, i want to cut the shopping down as much as i possibly can. well i think eight pounds is a good start. -but when i go to the shops and i spend seventy pound for a week. -we have to keep making trips back to the shop because we need bread or milk or something else that we've forgotten. +but when i go to the shops and i spend seventy pound for a week. +we have to keep making trips back to the shop because we need bread or milk or something else that we've forgotten. so so just make little trips. so we're just making little trips as we run out of stuff. mm. good idea. and see how, if that will work out any better. yeah. -well the good news for the environmentalists is the bike runs on unleaded. +well the good news for the environmentalists is the bike runs on unleaded. mhm. which is good news. -cos like that's not so expensive. +cos like that's not so expensive. so, i shall have to take it to the petrol station in a minute. yeah. does, and does it need erm oil or anything like that? no. he showed me where the little oil level was. -so you don't have a dipstick, there's a little little ho glass hole +so you don't have a dipstick, there's a little little ho glass hole mhm. where you look in. oh right. @@ -6521,23 +6519,23 @@ mm. mm. well, just be careful when you go out. yeah. -cos i mean it's it's not the bikers it's the other vehicle that's on the road. +cos i mean it's it's not the bikers it's the other vehicle that's on the road. alright? not more than two minutes. john will verify this. do you remember john? -we came out of the shop, turned left turned left there, and then turned right. -we're going down this road and john was in front of me and just as john went past this wagon it pulled out and there was a car coming the other way. +we came out of the shop, turned left turned left there, and then turned right. +we're going down this road and john was in front of me and just as john went past this wagon it pulled out and there was a car coming the other way. eeeeh hit my horn. -ha i could have shouted louder. -and he stopped and luckily there was just enough room for me to slow down and just go between them. +ha i could have shouted louder. +and he stopped and luckily there was just enough room for me to slow down and just go between them. i mean that guy just pulled out in front of me. mm. huge, huge lorry. -oh he he didn't see you or just didn't ? +oh he he didn't see you or just didn't ? didn't care. oh. -he saw me alright cos like john said i had the headlights on. +he saw me alright cos like john said i had the headlights on. yeah. well that's it. don't expect anybody else to obey the highway code. @@ -6562,7 +6560,7 @@ come on then. what is it ricky? come on then.. dog. -i don't see any i don't i don't see any bacon in there. +i don't see any i don't i don't see any bacon in there. you're not having bacon till monday. are you gonna buy it tomorrow? no. @@ -6571,19 +6569,19 @@ you're working, so you don't need bacon. i'm not working monday. well you can go and get it. saturday sunday. -let's have some wh when? +let's have some wh when? monday. i'll be up then. i won't need it. well i might get it sunday for you. okay. -but we talk about this and we said we're cutting the shopping down, i'm not going shopping. +but we talk about this and we said we're cutting the shopping down, i'm not going shopping. and the first thing you do is demand that we have butter in the house. so we had to go and do shopping just to get your butter. no you didn't. you bought dog food. you bought milk. -yeah i didn't i didn't actually need to go shopping or i didn't want to go shopping. +yeah i didn't i didn't actually need to go shopping or i didn't want to go shopping. you did. you needed butter. no. @@ -6602,12 +6600,12 @@ brian, you're not to eat it. what! not even on my toast at night? no. -she says you had to go out and buy butter solely because i wanted it. +she says you had to go out and buy butter solely because i wanted it. and i've oh i've had the bollocking cos we've had to buy butter. well i wanted it as well so that's two against one. -and if you see her, see her eating our butter there will be a row. +and if you see her, see her eating our butter there will be a row. cos you've said that. i won't have flora on the toast. @@ -6622,9 +6620,9 @@ well why couldn't you put up with margarine for one day? oh we could have. but i didn't mind going shopping. yeah well sh i wouldn't have minded just for today. -i i didn't mind going +i i didn't mind going i didn't s i i didn't say -now you say that +now you say that i didn't say i'd got to have it today. cos i don't. yes you did. @@ -6632,16 +6630,16 @@ no i did not. you s your suggestion was send brian to the shops. not mine. now that was the -well can you empty one of those and put it and put it in that bucket. +well can you empty one of those and put it and put it in that bucket. will you turn that tape recorder off so i can thump him. thumping me probably won't come out on the tape. i came out with the awful truth today to the lads. so you dropped it. they loved it. so you told them you fell off your bike? -you said you're not gonna believe this. -he goes why aren't you on your bike brian? -i goes i went to the end i goes look i'll tell you all together get it over with i lost my balance and i dropped it. +you said you're not gonna believe this. +he goes why aren't you on your bike brian? +i goes i went to the end i goes look i'll tell you all together get it over with i lost my balance and i dropped it. alright? there you go. er thank you. @@ -6649,7 +6647,7 @@ bye. whoa come here, come here. tell us all about it. he goes what you done? -i goes ah just broken the indicator lens and a few other little bitties. +i goes ah just broken the indicator lens and a few other little bitties. he'll eat that. one of yours. did you like that john? @@ -6658,9 +6656,9 @@ there's another two plays on tomorrow. tomorrow? okay. i'll sort them out. -oh you've been up to joe 's have you mum? +oh you've been up to joe 's have you mum? mm? -have you been up to joe 's? +have you been up to joe 's? got more in . mm?special? i think you were a bit. @@ -6683,27 +6681,27 @@ j one o two. is it tov or? anybody want any more chips? -one o two two. +one o two two. my new number. oh. w y c or something. no thanks. no thanks mary. w y c i think it is. -so all the ones you see t o c and +so all the ones you see t o c and yeah they've got o in them. or v. yeah. t o v or whatever. go and lie down. -at one time the v was only for, for commercial vehicles. +at one time the v was only for, for commercial vehicles. mm? you know light vans and commercials but it's used for anything now. you know our car's d v p. yeah. -oh and i can't eat that bread and butter now. +oh and i can't eat that bread and butter now. i'm chockered. -yeah one of the, one of the lads there alan, he goes er i'm surprised you haven't committed suicide yet after dropping your pride and joy. +yeah one of the, one of the lads there alan, he goes er i'm surprised you haven't committed suicide yet after dropping your pride and joy. well it does hurt your pride. oh yeah. specially when you do it in front of all the neighbours. @@ -6725,7 +6723,7 @@ when does the insurance run out? eh? when does the insurance run out? where does? -the insurance run out. +the insurance run out. it's run out. wednesday. oh wednesday. @@ -6735,7 +6733,7 @@ pressure's not high. pressure was down again this morning. we must keep an eye on that. yeah. -cos between one and two bar on the, on the erm boiler. +cos between one and two bar on the, on the erm boiler. what was it on? eh? it means, means the system wasn't pressurized. @@ -6755,9 +6753,9 @@ oh right. because it's a pressurized system. so if you have a look and you can't see that needle. yeah. -the, the water is the water pressure's definitely changed. +the, the water is the water pressure's definitely changed. well it's changed now cos it's up now. -i in the shower in the shower for one. +i in the shower in the shower for one. it's up now. i it's weak in the shower. er well it would have been. @@ -6770,7 +6768,7 @@ it shouldn't be. it should be okay. and it's cold as well. have you noticed? -yeah i was i had a shower, well, perhaps the water's been turned down a bit. +yeah i was i had a shower, well, perhaps the water's been turned down a bit. i i keep turning it up again but it it's cold every time i use it. you know i pull it out and turn it up hot. no i mean here. @@ -6783,10 +6781,10 @@ it should be higher than that. i'll put it up to two and a half and it should be warm enough there. right. lovely. -is just? +is just? well we'll have to watch that boiler. yeah. -they're fatal if we, if it. +they're fatal if we, if it. you just opened the door on the dog's mouth. opened the fridge door and hit him right on the yeah. @@ -6835,7 +6833,7 @@ that hurt. mary. i didn't want him to have that. mary. -mary where's the paperwork belonging to that? +mary where's the paperwork belonging to that? i dunno john. oh that's some of it. have a, get it all out then brian. @@ -6849,9 +6847,9 @@ i've no idea. friday the thirteenth. what a day to buy a motorbike. see the value of the bike came down, the value of the insurance came down cos i put the value at twelve hundred pounds. -see erm there was a ten percent discount if you had it erm under twelve hundred and fifty pounds. +see erm there was a ten percent discount if you had it erm under twelve hundred and fifty pounds. yeah. -so in some ways it's cheaper insurance but in others it's erm a bit of a sting. +so in some ways it's cheaper insurance but in others it's erm a bit of a sting. have you done? come on. oy. @@ -6861,18 +6859,18 @@ it hides behind mother so that brian can't get at it. no. this plates go in this way. well i'm not allowed to use this machine so er -knives and forks should go in that way. +knives and forks should go in that way. right? why that way? -there are glass plates somewhere. +there are glass plates somewhere. have you made any tea mary? no. no. do you want some tea? -i want to get into the habit of finishing and getting the dishwasher on and ge cleaning the kitchen completely. -i told him to ring i told him ring apex up in case they were recruiting. +i want to get into the habit of finishing and getting the dishwasher on and ge cleaning the kitchen completely. +i told him to ring i told him ring apex up in case they were recruiting. because there are jobs up on the notice board. -but he said apex didn't know anything about it at the moment. +but he said apex didn't know anything about it at the moment. so i mean, if apex don't know anything about it i don't know why they don't . now you know i don't get on with plastic. oh i got it first time. @@ -6882,14 +6880,14 @@ tell her there will be half a pie for her tea otherwise she don't get none. i mean this is ridiculous. yeah. turn that on for me will you? -just +just it's making work for everybody. and one thing we don't want is extra work. -i mean if we get finished now and clean the ki cooker and and clean everything and say right, we're out of the kitchen then, nothing more tonight. +i mean if we get finished now and clean the ki cooker and and clean everything and say right, we're out of the kitchen then, nothing more tonight. that's it. if they want something they can get it themselves. yeah. -yeah but tell them to clean up after them. +yeah but tell them to clean up after them. mm. don't leave it for you all the time. yeah. @@ -6899,10 +6897,10 @@ well i mean that's different to the way we live though isn't it? mm.? mm? packet of instant mash. -tin of peas and a tin of spam. +tin of peas and a tin of spam. mm, could you imagine me lovely. -and throws it all in puts it all on the plate cold and puts it in the microwave. +and throws it all in puts it all on the plate cold and puts it in the microwave. no wonder he sits in the chair and does nothing. because they do it at home. eat that food now. @@ -6911,7 +6909,7 @@ you're being perfectly silly. erm, i can't think what you do tomorrow when you go with steve . i mean that will be three hours continuous. yeah. -i remind me in the morning. +i remind me in the morning. yeah. i'll stick a note on the thing. yeah. @@ -6932,11 +6930,11 @@ i've put a list up erm for the things that i want for my birthday. for the things that i would like for my birthday. are you interested? yeah. -john, how much do i owe you for the erm the lens? -phaw one twenty five. -can i this? +john, how much do i owe you for the erm the lens? +phaw one twenty five. +can i this? yeah. -yeah so i'll keep it in the garage. +yeah so i'll keep it in the garage. keep it in your pocket. right. it's no good in the garage. @@ -6950,7 +6948,7 @@ right, keep that in me pocket. ? alright, yeah. are you having some cake? -er no thanks. +er no thanks. no cake i i'll have some tonight. no yogurt. @@ -6964,21 +6962,21 @@ come on then. after supper. yet again. after supper. -after supper and it's mum -dishwasher +after supper and it's mum +dishwasher that cleans the kitchen. mum is staying out of the kitchen. oh yes! right? -so, if you want anything make it yourself. +so, if you want anything make it yourself. i do anyway. mm? i do anyway. supper. mhm. -well you can sit there and i'll read this list out to you. +well you can sit there and i'll read this list out to you. and i will cringe. -for mummy's birthday mummy would like one a gold locket with a strong chain. +for mummy's birthday mummy would like one a gold locket with a strong chain. two, an eternity ring. three, a hundred pounds worth of premium bonds. four @@ -6990,8 +6988,8 @@ that's it. not a razor. i've got a razor upstairs. number five, a weekend away at a health farm. -oh forget it, you can scrub that out straight away. -number six a large bright dried flower arrangement. +oh forget it, you can scrub that out straight away. +number six a large bright dried flower arrangement. number seven, a large colourful brooch. not gold. number eight, fountain pen. @@ -7007,10 +7005,10 @@ and that's it. okay. pin that up on the board. yeah. -and what you will have to do, you will have to tell each other what you would like to buy or what you would think of. +and what you will have to do, you will have to tell each other what you would like to buy or what you would think of. because, if you scrub them off then i'll know that you're gonna buy them. cross off the health farm. -you can buy me er the locket, the eternity ring, the premium bonds and the weekend away at the health farm. +you can buy me er the locket, the eternity ring, the premium bonds and the weekend away at the health farm. you'd be lucky to get one. good. i think you're getting as bad as me. @@ -7025,12 +7023,12 @@ me. i know. so when are you gonna cross my palm with silver? -she +she i forgot about that. yeah. -when are you going to +when are you going to that will wipe the smile off your face. -i do you want me to get it tomorrow for you? +i do you want me to get it tomorrow for you? mm. cos i can call in at the bank and get it to no, don't get it till i want it to buy her present. @@ -7054,7 +7052,7 @@ she said i was a hypochondriac? terribly overweight. what made her say that i wonder. -and she would like me to go to the well women's clinic every wednesday it's run. +and she would like me to go to the well women's clinic every wednesday it's run. and she would like me to go, book in for an appointment. and she would discuss my diet amongst other things. oh dear. @@ -7065,7 +7063,7 @@ your crisp diet or your food diet? hm! er or the the meals in between diet. -if if i'm on a diet you lot will be on diets. on diets +if if i'm on a diet you lot will be on diets. on diets we know all about it. but there will be no more cake. we know. @@ -7091,7 +7089,7 @@ what words we use, what words aren't used. what slang we use. we use all the words of the english language don't we? we use the yellow ones, the blue ones, the black ones. -i wonder how they'd get on with somebody with foreign? +i wonder how they'd get on with somebody with foreign? george is, george is gonna get me some lights for on here, did you know? who? george. @@ -7104,32 +7102,32 @@ mm. he makes them. well lynwood do them. oh? -so the next time he goes he's gonna get some for me. -oh does george work for the lynwood? -what do you th what do you think +so the next time he goes he's gonna get some for me. +oh does george work for the lynwood? +what do you th what do you think he does he does ma a lot of manufacture for lynwoods. oh. -what do you think of having in here artexed or airtexed or whatever it's called, artex. +what do you think of having in here artexed or airtexed or whatever it's called, artex. yeah, good idea. but we're not spending any money. yeah. -i think jean said, well she watched the others do it. -they only did like erm a square foot every time. -erm you have to do, put it on and then design it. +i think jean said, well she watched the others do it. +they only did like erm a square foot every time. +erm you have to do, put it on and then design it. and then move over to the next square. -put it on, design it she said because it dries very quickly. +put it on, design it she said because it dries very quickly. mm. it's only like a plaster of paris stuff isn't it? it does go off quick. mm that's right. quick. -she said it's er about ten pound a tub but i don't know how far a tub would go? +she said it's er about ten pound a tub but i don't know how far a tub would go? not very far. mm. -and then she said there was stuff called textured paint that has, it's like paint with lumps in it. -i think it's just lumpy paint gone wrong and then and they sell it. -but then she said you get erm you put it on and you get a brush and er not a brush, a roller. -and the roller has a design, a line on it. +and then she said there was stuff called textured paint that has, it's like paint with lumps in it. +i think it's just lumpy paint gone wrong and then and they sell it. +but then she said you get erm you put it on and you get a brush and er not a brush, a roller. +and the roller has a design, a line on it. different designs. that's right yeah. and then you just roll it on. @@ -7140,7 +7138,7 @@ said debbie's used that in her house. it could definitely do with something. but we'll leave it for now. mm. -when, when he was in i saw he i saw mark look at that corner. +when, when he was in i saw he i saw mark look at that corner. mm. and he copped off. that one there? @@ -7154,7 +7152,7 @@ mm. mm. he was saying to me it was very difficult to do. well i can't understand why. -i mean really what he should have done if it, if it was that difficult he should have gone back another half a brick and the j bricked it up all the way +i mean really what he should have done if it, if it was that difficult he should have gone back another half a brick and the j bricked it up all the way mm. level, instead of putting bits and pieces in. surely @@ -7171,7 +7169,7 @@ i mean it didn't have to be spot on. as long as it came back out to where it is now. ah. good boy. -the dog was lying there last night and patricia said something to him, i don't know what she said to him but the look on his face. +the dog was lying there last night and patricia said something to him, i don't know what she said to him but the look on his face. you could tell it really upset him, whatever she said to him. yeah. she she wouldn't tell us what she'd said to him either, so it must have been bad. @@ -7189,18 +7187,18 @@ that's it. close your eyes and go to sleep. go on go on. go on. -you soft animal. +you soft animal. he won't close his eyes in case you do something to him. yeah. in case he see in case he misses something. -what are you going out now? +what are you going out now? yeah. i was gonna wash the car. i'll do it tomorrow. i've never hey mum seen it so dirty. -just think this time next week you'll have me new car for me. +just think this time next week you'll have me new car for me. yeah it's my birthday present. eh? top of me list. @@ -7213,13 +7211,13 @@ you're too late now, you've made the list. oh! you are slow. mm. -do do do do +do do do do how many tapes do they expect you to fill up john? i don't know. as many as are full up. whether it be one, two ten fifteen, it doesn't matter. and what why do you have to fill in the form? -erm every time you use a tape you fill in this is tape side b tape one side b tape two side a tape two side b. +erm every time you use a tape you fill in this is tape side b tape one side b tape two side a tape two side b. oh. so we're still on side one? no we're on one side b. @@ -7227,29 +7225,29 @@ we've done side a. is it full? yeah. when, what was the date we started recording on the tape? -was it saturday? +was it saturday? what date was last saturday? dunno john. fourteen fifte fourteenth? that bloke didn't come on saturday, he come on friday didn't he? -no, well +no, well what, why have you put down that you have your regional accent and i have an irish accent? i haven't. well, you can't tell that i'm irish but i can tell you're irish. oh. how can you do that? -i i . +i i . you're you're a frigging idiot you are. how do you know that people can't tell you're irish? nobody can. -nobody can tell that i'm irish. +nobody can tell that i'm irish. only when i swear. and you know i don't swear very often. no. erm -kids anyway. +kids anyway. but that could change when patricia comes in. -and what does erm why does brian and patricia not have a regional accent? +and what does erm why does brian and patricia not have a regional accent? well i don't think they have. think a brummie accent. they haven't got a brummie accent, no. @@ -7260,7 +7258,7 @@ i'm only putting the truth down as i see it. yeah. you know? i mean i could be wrong. -i can only put down what i know to be the truth as far as i can tell. +i can only put down what i know to be the truth as far as i can tell. mhm. there doesn't seem to be a regional accent in this area does there? if you start going further towards worcester, worcestershire. @@ -7278,10 +7276,10 @@ but i don't look at birmingham people who? the girl next door. when brian ? -thought he'd be but he wasn't. kids . +thought he'd be but he wasn't. kids . out. you'd better eat that food. -i've seen you know the, the coat she brought home first of all? +i've seen you know the, the coat she brought home first of all? i've seen a lot of people up town wearing that coat, but they were all much older. i would have said they were in their forties. yeah. @@ -7296,8 +7294,8 @@ well switch your tape off. oh you've been to see him? yeah. who's that? -and er he he suddenly looked up and went it's brian! -like this and the and the pliers dropped out of his hand. +and er he he suddenly looked up and went it's brian! +like this and the and the pliers dropped out of his hand. ah! like this he was. it was really funny. @@ -7308,7 +7306,7 @@ off to the chinese. the chinese. and er she hasn't changed. -and greg, greg goes oh let me sit on it! +and greg, greg goes oh let me sit on it! oh! so, greg was impressed. what car's he got? @@ -7316,7 +7314,7 @@ a chevette. a chevette. what year? t, same as mine. -how much did he pay for his? +how much did he pay for his? four fifty. no. no it was three seven five. @@ -7330,12 +7328,12 @@ that old beat up thing. that was several years ago. that was er an ital he had out there. oh. -and what's and janet driving now? +and what's and janet driving now? sierra. sierra. yeah. sierra. -and jan's got a a new mini. +and jan's got a a new mini. oh. h reg mini. mm. @@ -7360,7 +7358,7 @@ and janet wasn't impressed at all. no. janet had high hopes for . yeah. -but er i think +but er i think you can do well in that job though. you can be er kidnapped and all sorts. eh? @@ -7368,9 +7366,9 @@ you can do well in that job. you can be kidnapped and all sorts. yeah. and then we could always send brian out to be the motorbike dispatch rider couldn't we? -yeah, so i mean i haven't really done that where, where did i ride to? +yeah, so i mean i haven't really done that where, where did i ride to? where else did you go? -i went down to greg's and i went round to rob's to see how his interview went. +i went down to greg's and i went round to rob's to see how his interview went. and what was his interview for? for rover. oh. @@ -7386,7 +7384,7 @@ he'll be a year behind me, and he'll be on the same money as me. oh right. because he's done his a levels, oh. so he doesn't lose out there. -his dad is also a manager down at erm cowley i think . +his dad is also a manager down at erm cowley i think . mm. his dad does a lot of travelling. and erm @@ -7396,7 +7394,7 @@ and er what department's he in? i've no idea. dunno. -i know he's got a it's er it's one of the craft sections cos he's got craft apprentices under him. +i know he's got a it's er it's one of the craft sections cos he's got craft apprentices under him. oh. and how, how did his interview go? a lot of them have you know. @@ -7404,26 +7402,26 @@ he hasn't had it yet. he's had the test. mm. but he's got the interview next week he thinks. -oh yeah is that did you tell him about the test? +oh yeah is that did you tell him about the test? no, he'd already had it. oh. -because er it come as a bit of a shock to you didn't it? +because er it come as a bit of a shock to you didn't it? er yeah. he he goes i'd no idea it was so hard. he said it was so difficult. think it was a real shock for him. yeah. -and erm we er i gave him a few tips on what to revise on +and erm we er i gave him a few tips on what to revise on yeah. for the interview. -you know the cos they +you know the cos they always ask you the maths rules. th they will pick on something that you're good at. you know. and say if you do have a bit of knowledge on it. -no i just told him to revise the er the cycle of the engine. +no i just told him to revise the er the cycle of the engine. oh. and who erm suck squeeze bang blow. @@ -7437,13 +7435,13 @@ er! oh motorbike! yeah. he goes i don't believe it. -he goes i now hate you. +he goes i now hate you. he hasn't been round for a while, andy, has he? no well, you see andy's got himself a a girl? a an older woman. -well older she -is that the one that rung patricia? +well older she +is that the one that rung patricia? she's a year older. no. which one was that? @@ -7451,7 +7449,7 @@ simon. oh. he's alright. mm. -i think, is in the er garage? +i think, is in the er garage? think so yeah. and then i, then i popped down to see james. oh james has a bike doesn't he? @@ -7459,8 +7457,8 @@ no, that's simon. that's simon well, he's got rid of it. he's got a mini now. a mini. -and james like your bike then? -he went whoa! +and james like your bike then? +he went whoa! big! oh right. so you've done the rounds tonight then brian? @@ -7468,7 +7466,7 @@ i've done the rounds tonight, yeah. have you much petrol left? loads. loads. -i filled it i put six pound on, put six pounds in on friday and i've got loads left. +i filled it i put six pound on, put six pounds in on friday and i've got loads left. and i've been all round the place. you'll have to go round did you go for your gauge then? @@ -7486,7 +7484,7 @@ she might get on it as well. i've been ever so tired. yeah. i tell you what did wake me up though john. -coming down the er the old church highway towards the house from town er the white arrows in the road +coming down the er the old church highway towards the house from town er the white arrows in the road you've gotta keep off them. i found that out. you what? @@ -7499,38 +7497,38 @@ what about them? yeah. i've gotta memorize where they are from now on. why? -the white lines and the arrows in the middle of the lane. +the white lines and the arrows in the middle of the lane. why? they make you change your line. because i went over it mm and skidded? -doing about sixty and i felt a twitch in the wheel and i thought shit! +doing about sixty and i felt a twitch in the wheel and i thought shit! i'm not going over one of them again. mm. well you have to sometimes. you'll get used to it and it doesn't affect you -i suppose it a bit? +i suppose it a bit? after a bit. but you've got to watch them when they're, when you're in the wet. i was i was, i was slightly banked at the time. mm. just very slightly. you w if your d wheel does move it won't move far. -you get used to that, the wheel moving over a bit. +you get used to that, the wheel moving over a bit. i suppose er it's a trick not to over correct? it will stop itself. -it will, it just might slide a bit but it will stop sliding when it comes off it. +it will, it just might slide a bit but it will stop sliding when it comes off it. yeah. -cos by the time you you've felt it you've passed it maybe? +cos by the time you you've felt it you've passed it maybe? well you you've travelled another hundred yards. yeah. -i er i suppose you have to be very careful er and find out what is on the road? +i er i suppose you have to be very careful er and find out what is on the road? but like tomorrow when i go to work keep away from the kerbs. that's the most important thing. yeah. i ride in the middle of the lane. -tomorrow when i go to work on it, i'm going through er i'm not gonna go through bowgreen i don't wanna go that way. +tomorrow when i go to work on it, i'm going through er i'm not gonna go through bowgreen i don't wanna go that way. go that way . well you can go straight up to longridge lane. i'll go straight through longridge lane. @@ -7551,11 +7549,11 @@ tomorrow morning. oh tomorrow. i personally think you would need well the weather forecast is dry anyway. -more experience dri riding on the bike as it is, without erm having your rucksack and things on. +more experience dri riding on the bike as it is, without erm having your rucksack and things on. get used to carrying it. mm? get used to carrying it. -it it didn't bother me at all. +it it didn't bother me at all. i'm not kidding you, it did i didn't feel it. i could feel a slight pressure on me shoulders, but it didn't restrict my movements in any way. when? @@ -7568,18 +7566,18 @@ and don't get over cocky. and keep away from big lorries. yes mum. i fully intend to keep away from them anyway. -i mean a bit of fear is a good thing. +i mean a bit of fear is a good thing. erm, i'm still scared every time i pull away. you know,ji little jitterbugs. yeah. -and i went up iver road as well. +and i went up iver road as well. on a bike? o o on the way back from andrew's, yeah. i always found that awkward at the top. yeah. specially if there was cars on the hill and i had to pull up behind them. cos you you run out of you know, what things to do. -cos you've gotta have one foot on the ground and you've gotta have one o ha foot, one on the brake +cos you've gotta have one foot on the ground and you've gotta have one o ha foot, one on the brake yeah. one on the clutch, one on the throttle yeah. @@ -7602,7 +7600,7 @@ cos it's actually quite s , quite sharp bend. and it gets wet down there as well. it gets a bit slippy on there. and there's manhole covers as you come out the bend. -and don't go don't go speeding brian. +and don't go don't go speeding brian. you don't have the same control over a bike when you're speeding. you don't have the same control over a car it @@ -7610,7 +7608,7 @@ or a bike when you're speeding. it feels better, going slow. cos it's more comfortable. yeah. -your 's +your 's yeah. better. when i say un slow, under fifty. @@ -7627,7 +7625,7 @@ where people can recognize me. that's it. hey look there's bri. look at him go. -brrr +brrr and it will last you longer, you know? yeah. your bike, the engine, the oil. @@ -7635,7 +7633,7 @@ you reduce it's life. it's ever so good at the er cruising though. it's really nice. it should cruise along at about fifty at, you know, quarter throttle. -fifty it does about er three and a half, four thousand r p m. +fifty it does about er three and a half, four thousand r p m. yeah. it's about right for a four hundred. mine would be doing about five grand at that. @@ -7653,7 +7651,7 @@ that was when i wound it up on a carriageway. don't, just keep your revs down. hello rick. you poor tired little boy. -cos erm greg came down the other night. +cos erm greg came down the other night. did i tell you? when you were in wales? he came @@ -7662,19 +7660,19 @@ he came down. to sh show me his car. oh. how long has he had his car? -er he had a he had a polonaise +er he had a he had a polonaise oh right. before that. ooh! i mean that's the pits. bet he, he didn't wanna show that to anybody. no. -he didn't that. +he didn't that. but er and he got this little chevette. apparently he blew the polonaise up. everybody does, don't they? yeah. -er he's bought his little chevette and er it's a nice little car. +er he's bought his little chevette and er it's a nice little car. mm. bit noisy but it's alright. is it yellow or green? @@ -7696,7 +7694,7 @@ no. no. just give me a fiver. haven't got a fiver. -i'll go and er bring me bike in. +i'll go and er bring me bike in. get me stuff ready for tomorrow. hello. and, do you want a wee? @@ -7705,7 +7703,7 @@ do you want a wee? tell me what you want? come here. do you want a wee wee? -don't you cheek +don't you cheek don't eat the microphone rick. you cheeky . t that's it, walk all over me. @@ -7713,7 +7711,7 @@ you cheek the gloves are good. yeah? gloves are, gloves are really good. -they, not as like warm as yours but er they're certainly nice and warm. +they, not as like warm as yours but er they're certainly nice and warm. yeah. you need good gloves yeah. @@ -7738,13 +7736,13 @@ yeah. it could have been there all the time. yeah. and you missed it you see? -and as for being six pound up, she says i must have short-changed someone . +and as for being six pound up, she says i must have short-changed someone . yeah. come on, you're losing your touch now. come on, give me a kiss. go on. quick, quick quick quick. -good boy +good boy go on. get it rick. go on. @@ -7756,12 +7754,12 @@ give me a kiss. kiss. give me a kiss. give me a kiss. -if you don't kiss, kiss +if you don't kiss, kiss rick rick rick rick hey. oh thanks rick. you put it on there? yeah. -well i've left you three tapes out to take with you. +well i've left you three tapes out to take with you. when? now. oh this morning? @@ -7788,14 +7786,14 @@ well i, i got up late and brian was in the bathroom. had to rush downstairs, do my breakfast. had some weetabix quick and a cup of tea. rush rushed into the bathroom. -went in there and went and got dressed so mary was up then so when i got back downstairs the er breakfast, my breakfast was on the table. +went in there and went and got dressed so mary was up then so when i got back downstairs the er breakfast, my breakfast was on the table. again. so all in all, it's quite exciting. you all looking forward to this? yeah. yes i am. -i said to sue i said i can't ring and tell him i ain't going i says, i'll upset him too much. -i think i'd have if you was to say that. +i said to sue i said i can't ring and tell him i ain't going i says, i'll upset him too much. +i think i'd have if you was to say that. feelings. i would have been upset. i would, i'd have gone to . @@ -7807,16 +7805,16 @@ didn't have time really. no, we'll leave this on. i thought we'd be too bollocksed by the time we get up there anyway. er yeah. -you don't john? +you don't john? yeah, should have somewhere. -in case it's er again. -otherwise we folding things up. +in case it's er again. +otherwise we folding things up. do you know them three mirrors i had? i had three mirrors, i can't find the bleeding things. can't you? no. i don't know what i've done with them. -i've got i've got seven i think balls. +i've got i've got seven i think balls. but i've got all seven good ones. but, it looks grotty, it is a good one. yeah. @@ -7825,20 +7823,20 @@ yeah. no, yesterday me flaming back was killing me. really? and i thought oh,. -niggling this morning but i daresay walking round here might do it +niggling this morning but i daresay walking round here might do it it will get rid of it yeah. -i took some yesterday, i was and i took some last night before i went to bed and i took two this morning. +i took some yesterday, i was and i took some last night before i went to bed and i took two this morning. cos my hips were killing me. you what? my hips were killing me, you know? -well i think that's cos i lie on me right in bed. +well i think that's cos i lie on me right in bed. i have to t i go and lie on me left but if i lie yeah. -on my right side it's er +on my right side it's er yeah. you've gotta knife in your side. yeah. -i, mind you i today. +i, mind you i today. ooh. oh you ca i'll let you. if we ever get up this hill. @@ -7852,7 +7850,7 @@ he's conscientious anyway isn't he? he's doing his best. oh yeah. don't look up. -phew oh dear. +phew oh dear. nearly there. i find if i don't look up it's not so bad. you ought to be able to drive up here didn't you? @@ -7865,7 +7863,7 @@ no. i mean if i sold it cheap. eh? even if i only sold it, you know for a couple of hundred pounds. -well you could buy yourself some golf stuff for a hundred couldn't you? +well you could buy yourself some golf stuff for a hundred couldn't you? or well it's worth more than a hundred. well @@ -7887,10 +7885,10 @@ take that downstairs. you can write to mark. then you've got yours and i've got mine then. yeah. -right yeah. -i myself. +right yeah. +i myself. okay. -well it i always think it's terrible you know, when people buy you things and you don't use them. +well it i always think it's terrible you know, when people buy you things and you don't use them. these windows aren't that dirty mary. aren't they? they're not that dirty, it isn't long since i cleaned these you know. @@ -7914,7 +7912,7 @@ it's got a crack in it. oh. well get rid of it then. mm. -i think we've got enough haven't we? +i think we've got enough haven't we? yeah. yeah sell it. he's not, he's not doing these sills like he said he would. @@ -7928,7 +7926,7 @@ we'll keep that one. wh who bought us that? alice and marie . yeah. -and that he he knows that that flat's let. +and that he he knows that that flat's let. er what? let to @@ -7953,14 +7951,14 @@ that's neither here nor there. oh no and it's gone now. i mean you, the other one's gonna be taxed for twelve months, yeah. -twelve months so it's as long as it's broad john. -i suppose i suppose we could get rid of the erm all these pay slips now couldn't we? +twelve months so it's as long as it's broad john. +i suppose i suppose we could get rid of the erm all these pay slips now couldn't we? yeah. i think so. i'll go and get er a black bag for rubbish. oh my god! hey well why don't you sell them at the car boot sale? -well i mean they're only part sets. +well i mean they're only part sets. they aren't actually worth a lot of money. are they? no but i mean you'd gi maybe give somebody a bit of pleasure sorting them out. @@ -7989,16 +7987,16 @@ that's it. that's the rubbish on the . no, these are all foreign coins. you can't get rid of these. -will they go to the boot sale? +will they go to the boot sale? no. no i'll keep them. what's that? rubbish. -well what's the difference between throwing this one out and throwing them out and burning them? +well what's the difference between throwing this one out and throwing them out and burning them? we'll keep the coins. what did you say? i'll keep the coins. -unfortunately +unfortunately tell peter so. yeah yeah, well he's gone so don't worry about that . er and erm yeah he's gone too so. @@ -8006,20 +8004,20 @@ why worry about it. erm what er what are our contacts like at a technical level at ? okay. how often do we get a technical visit in there? -er well it's actually at the technical side is, i i've seen before christmas. +er well it's actually at the technical side is, i i've seen before christmas. about the new phoenix machine that er we haven't got a er opportunity for business on anywhere. -i've tried and they're not interested. +i've tried and they're not interested. what s what sort of bearing was it? it's a small miniature nine millimetre and fourte thirteen millimetre one. er a single one and a flanged on as a a pair a matched pair. -and i sent off details with the +and i sent off details with the a flanged a straight a straight flange? one straight bearing. yeah. one plain bearing and one flanged bearing. as a pair. what erm -it's reference. +it's reference. sent it all to viv with all the details, broke all the reference what volumes? two thousand a year. @@ -8030,16 +8028,16 @@ no. can i? yes of course you can. of course cos if -particularly pointed out the flanged bearing and said, you know that does the flanged bearings don't you? +particularly pointed out the flanged bearing and said, you know that does the flanged bearings don't you? i said, no i didn't. he said, they do. they do flanged miniature bearings and it is possible therefore that mm. somebody somewhere will know. -so what i suggest you do is to give erm jerry a ring. +so what i suggest you do is to give erm jerry a ring. yeah okay. cos they won't need to be to p four limits. -well give jerry a ring and see if there's anything to offer yeah yeah. +well give jerry a ring and see if there's anything to offer yeah yeah. yeah. yeah yeah. yeah. @@ -8047,11 +8045,11 @@ fine yeah. yeah. so yeah okay i will do yeah. i'll send . -ask for his comments i'll use k john cos he's the machine tool man. -so i'll use him as my contact. +ask for his comments i'll use k john cos he's the machine tool man. +so i'll use him as my contact. it's best to keep . yeah okay. -oh and i've spoken to tony meeting. +oh and i've spoken to tony meeting. i'm arranging to go and see him, it'll be into next month now when right. i've had me @@ -8063,26 +8061,26 @@ so could could you do something on that, worries me. i will see what i can find out. yeah i'm i'm i'm . i'm stuck to be honest. -i quoted forty per cent on those screw support sizes last friday. +i quoted forty per cent on those screw support sizes last friday. yeah? i faxed him over on his on saturday morning. so we'll see what happens. erm but er what i've just put here is forty per cent margin until price is sorted. we need to okay. -do this visit with roy and get this price list sorted. +do this visit with roy and get this price list sorted. waiting his reply. right okay. er -you you might you might er er -cos i did have a word with steve on friday and said have you seen jerry and and has he mentioned this +you you might you might er er +cos i did have a word with steve on friday and said have you seen jerry and and has he mentioned this yeah. and and steve said, no i hadn't heard of it actually. i said, well look, we intend to fax through to roy saying, yes we want to do business with you. yeah? yeah. and erm you know, we're waiting for him to come back and say, yeah we need to talk. -jerry so he said he hadn't seen but he's not necessarily going to. +jerry so he said he hadn't seen but he's not necessarily going to. do you do you have direct contract with jerry ? mm. why don't you give him a ring? @@ -8097,22 +8095,22 @@ right and then he probably ring roy and yeah you know, use that as an excuse. yeah. fine okay. -right okay i think that's it then,er okay +right okay i think that's it then,er okay right. -so one's really the one where i need to involve you. +so one's really the one where i need to involve you. basically i if you can. yeah. -the rest i'll let you know +the rest i'll let you know i hear. erm i i'm also i also quite ooh -would like to know what's going on with and . -whether actually has any er control over what 's doing in the marketplace. +would like to know what's going on with and . +whether actually has any er control over what 's doing in the marketplace. okay yeah yeah. -i know it was andy last time and he's a guy so yeah, i'll find out. -well you find out i might be able to find out to . -well yeah okay. -erm that was a point,, i er spindle bearings and i want to take the business off 'em. +i know it was andy last time and he's a guy so yeah, i'll find out. +well you find out i might be able to find out to . +well yeah okay. +erm that was a point,, i er spindle bearings and i want to take the business off 'em. now with it being , we're not gonna look at a high margin straight away cos i know that's a waste of time. er but we can make a reasonable margin including spacers. it's a set of three bearings with a pair of spacers. @@ -8120,50 +8118,50 @@ so you have two bearings in tandem, a pair of spacers and a third bearing. and it's their normal machine centre range. they use like about forty pairs a month. yeah. -erm sell for about eighty seven pound including spacers so i was gonna go in at about eighty three, eighty four but it's the new pricing company so i've got to ask your permission haven't i? +erm sell for about eighty seven pound including spacers so i was gonna go in at about eighty three, eighty four but it's the new pricing company so i've got to ask your permission haven't i? . it's a new product, i'm gonna make reasonable it's about thirty five per cent margin it's a new product? no it's it's a new size for us to supply. we've never b well -historically with what's happened is, the design from japan was taken under licence +historically with what's happened is, the design from japan was taken under licence yeah. -and they were based around and and designs. +and they were based around and and designs. yeah. -now on the five fifty series for example, it's an complete cartridge spindle on the twelve thousand revs, yeah? -and we get you know so anthony would get that business. +now on the five fifty series for example, it's an complete cartridge spindle on the twelve thousand revs, yeah? +and we get you know so anthony would get that business. because complete spindles come under the precision range of products . yeah. this is something i was trying to get clarified but i don't care really as long as somebody gets it. -erm but what happened then is er tended to get the main bearing supply for the normal spindles that manufactured and built. +erm but what happened then is er tended to get the main bearing supply for the normal spindles that manufactured and built. mm. and that was a set of three angular contact ball bearings, and then a n n thirty double row roller at the rear. er we're now doing this partnership which was what today was about, about the new generation spindle. yeah. erm so that's going great, i think that's really going well so the new design, i think we're well in on. -erm the old on that you know, took me two years to get the bearings approved and er you know but then having to wait a year and a half cos had a year and a half's worth of orders on 'em and promised to hold the price for three years is that's what it took for them to use them up, er has run out, new orders have been put on but i've got the chance of taking the business. -er but erm obviously with the thing again, i wanted er obviously +erm the old on that you know, took me two years to get the bearings approved and er you know but then having to wait a year and a half cos had a year and a half's worth of orders on 'em and promised to hold the price for three years is that's what it took for them to use them up, er has run out, new orders have been put on but i've got the chance of taking the business. +er but erm obviously with the thing again, i wanted er obviously what was the -you don't to go to 'em for and they say, well you just took the bloody off me, i want a cut in me . +you don't to go to 'em for and they say, well you just took the bloody off me, i want a cut in me . yeah. this is this is you know i don't want to be seen to be this is clearly er erm a situation where erm we must not knowingly take business which we have not enjoyed before at a price below -no at a price below the existing suppliers ninety four prices. -now when erm you say are supplying at the moment. +no at a price below the existing suppliers ninety four prices. +now when erm you say are supplying at the moment. mhm. yeah. -the problem is dave , the buyer at , is worse than ken . +the problem is dave , the buyer at , is worse than ken . he's a real dipstick. yeah? w his last comment. -wh what happened is, richard was the team section leader, dave historically looks after the bearings sales. +wh what happened is, richard was the team section leader, dave historically looks after the bearings sales. but he's such a dork i'm taking him off it. and they're letting him keep linear. -cos linear is just consignment stock and you know job there. -sally the lass who's taken over the buying for precision bearings, is a great lass got on great with her, and richard. -and they want to come and see the factory, they want to go to yeah, it fell down cos richard was too busy at the end of last year, fine get that sorted and i sally was dropped in the crap by right at the end of last year, came on five sets of bearings, i could've done 'em in two weeks. -i said i'll get you in two weeks, wallop wallop it's alright,to do it, they have 'em back in a month. +cos linear is just consignment stock and you know job there. +sally the lass who's taken over the buying for precision bearings, is a great lass got on great with her, and richard. +and they want to come and see the factory, they want to go to yeah, it fell down cos richard was too busy at the end of last year, fine get that sorted and i sally was dropped in the crap by right at the end of last year, came on five sets of bearings, i could've done 'em in two weeks. +i said i'll get you in two weeks, wallop wallop it's alright,to do it, they have 'em back in a month. we're alright you know, they only way you'll get the business, he's like that, he talks like that, is if you can you know offer a big price saving. that i'm afraid that's one thing you can't do alright. @@ -8184,41 +8182,41 @@ cos i was there when it happened. and s n a look you won't have supply problems with us. mhm. and you could say, look what we've done with . -yeah +yeah competitors of yours. yeah. competitors of yours, wanted bearings in a week, we got 'em bearings in a the problem the problem is that's happened with the design people. yeah? yeah. -i have been given roy , the dra the engineering the the senior designer, dennis er kev who's our +i have been given roy , the dra the engineering the the senior designer, dennis er kev who's our mm mm. he was a development manager, i've been giving 'em earache for the last year and a half, saying, you are falling behind man. we're up and running with , we've got the test rig going, new spindle bearings up, we're pushing it. yeah? yeah. -and it's taken that long for dave to get his arse in gear and he's a so slow. +and it's taken that long for dave to get his arse in gear and he's a so slow. he's he's he's been reluctant to do anything because he's had other things to do. right. -but malcolm in in the end got him to do something . +but malcolm in in the end got him to do something . who who who are the who's the boss of these erm wankish buyers? -richard was the team leader, he's the guy for me to work on . +richard was the team leader, he's the guy for me to work on . i know i could do it who's his boss? who's his boss? -well peter but er +well peter but er who's peter . -peter 's the group er materials manager. +peter 's the group er materials manager. but i wouldn't. he's not one that you can lean on. -er to wh actually leave it with me because richard 's the guy. +er to wh actually leave it with me because richard 's the guy. and sally is taking over from david, it's a handover period. right. because sally's not she doesn't understand one end of a bearing from another. right. she used to do a bit of part time buying from the accounts department. yeah yeah. -she's come down now to take over buying and she thinks dave's a wanker. +she's come down now to take over buying and she thinks dave's a wanker. a prat. yeah? right. @@ -8226,7 +8224,7 @@ and i can get richard and and sally interested right. but david's sat there at the minute in the background. right. -now yes wait +now yes wait what i need to do is get him out the way. till he's out of the way, right. @@ -8236,7 +8234,7 @@ that you on on one of your visits it would be a very good idea if you sat down w yeah, and roy. yes? yeah. -and you have a c not not necessarily with not necessarily with the boss +and you have a c not not necessarily with not necessarily with the boss no no mm. yeah. but just the the the buyer @@ -8257,7 +8255,7 @@ yeah, so try and bring those two together mm. because if if you do that, and it begins to erm o occur to her and if she's fairly bright mm she doesn't seem daft yeah. -she's not clever cos she's bearings , +she's not clever cos she's bearings , erm it it it no she doesn't seem engineering clever. no. @@ -8272,7 +8270,7 @@ mm. you can sort of chair that that mm. meeting and help her to understand -how much we're helping them through this . +how much we're helping them through this . and appreciate how much else we can do. and and okay if we're a pound or two different. we're forty minutes up the road. @@ -8280,18 +8278,18 @@ yeah. yeah. if we can't e e i've had a couple of months of stock on the shelf for 'em. yeah. -in fact i must admit, i hinted to dave if if linear will do consignment stock for , why shouldn't we if we're only forty minutes away. +in fact i must admit, i hinted to dave if if linear will do consignment stock for , why shouldn't we if we're only forty minutes away. but i mean that's the last thing i wanna do but yeah. but even then we could have consignment stock here in effect cos they're only forty minutes away, we could throw 'em in the back of the car and have 'em delivered. well that's what we've got we've got consignment stock here, it's on our premises yeah. so they don't have the problem of of of of of -yeah +yeah the hassle of stocking it and so on. yeah. -so you know -i've just got this david thing and and the thing in the background. +so you know +i've just got this david thing and and the thing in the background. i didn't want to tread on toes. well well you've got a lovely you've got a lovely opportun you've got a lovely opportunity there to sell the non-price benefits. @@ -8319,18 +8317,18 @@ competence as a supplier. no. yeah okay. alright. -i'll give you something to -i'm going tomorrow morning there anyway cos roy's just given me a call, they've got some problems with screw support bearings locking up, but er i'll go over there some time +i'll give you something to +i'm going tomorrow morning there anyway cos roy's just given me a call, they've got some problems with screw support bearings locking up, but er i'll go over there some time right. . yeah . yeah. . -so i'll sally . +so i'll sally . okay, is that happiness? right, yeah okay. -erm just the one's me main concern. -i mean the others you know it's it's what we get and and sort of thing. +erm just the one's me main concern. +i mean the others you know it's it's what we get and and sort of thing. with them it's it's yeah. mm. erm i'm not happy with them and i don't know how you get round it . @@ -8338,10 +8336,9 @@ knowing what's happening there. well er at the end of the day it may be one that we're gonna we're gonna lose but erm mm. if it is - love the ultimate four letter word and were about to use it all over your television screen. where do you start with love, every body wants to love, every body wants to be loved, every one at some time or another is disappointed by love and while its difficult sometimes talking about it not talking about it can have some really serious consequences, so let's try to get to the heart of it tonight, one hundred women are prepared to share their wisdom if not their secrets, i'd like to start off by seeing if we can differentiate between loving and being in love. -have you ever been in love?, are you now?, button one for yes, button two for no and in this hundred, woof ninety three people have been in love, what, what happened?, +have you ever been in love?, are you now?, button one for yes, button two for no and in this hundred, woof ninety three people have been in love, what, what happened?, i mean what, what how did you know you were in love? how did you know that was, that, that was what it was?, yes temporary madness @@ -8404,14 +8401,14 @@ which ever way we look at it, its nature's way of keeping us going, its, its wha so we, are we enhancing a pure biological function or is all this talk of love and in a way i think so, i mean if were quite honest about it but we also see ourselves mirrored in whoever we love we see ourselves mirrored in their eyes which is a very comfortable sort of feeling. what if they, if they love us back? -oh yes well hoping so +oh yes well hoping so yes i think its a bit of a simplification to say that its, its nature's way of keeping us going, because actually er ro , the idea that romantic love is the start of a life long relationship that produces off spring is really quite recent, erm for, for most of history er marriage's were on the basis of continuing er lines, continuing property and people had to erm some how or other cope with living with ano another person that might not necessarily have been the person that they would of chosen from love and, and this is still true in many societies and situations now. so were onto marriage, you see i started trying to talking about love and here we are talking about marriage. let me, let's, let's, let's try a couple of those thoughts, put them to the vote. do you think being in love is let's call it the mating instinct, is being in love merely the mating instinct operating, button one for yes and button two for no, let's er, let's seal that little lust abate there, well forty seven say yes basically i suppose basically being in love is lust, fifty three say no and what about that, that other point, i mean should you marry for love?, button one for yes and button two for no, should you marry for love?well what very modern people you are, cos eighty two of you said yes, fifteen said no, who said no? -i think its possible to fall in love with the same person more than once, you fall in love with them and you get married for that as well as other reasons perhaps, and then you have children and you hardly see them really for the next ten years, at least this is what every one sort of understands and then and then erm and then when you have more time again you can fall in love all over again with exactly the same person, i think this happens to lots of people, which also doesn't happen to a lot of people so you haven't +i think its possible to fall in love with the same person more than once, you fall in love with them and you get married for that as well as other reasons perhaps, and then you have children and you hardly see them really for the next ten years, at least this is what every one sort of understands and then and then erm and then when you have more time again you can fall in love all over again with exactly the same person, i think this happens to lots of people, which also doesn't happen to a lot of people so you haven't well it sounds blissful, but of course i mean a lot of terrible things happen in the name of love including crimes, crimes of passion as there romantically called in france, i mean people have killed for love, yes. i found that love went out the window when it was sweaty socks and handkerchiefs and dirty nappies and all this in front of me and i thought well this is not romance this is bloody hard work. and then, and then did it, did it go the way someone suggested that, that, the you fell in love again, i mean katie said @@ -8420,7 +8417,7 @@ up there i think apart from loving them, you must like them mm, mm and that's the basis, if you like them they'll become your best friend, there's times you don't love them, but you still like them -mm, mm, were, were talking about what happens when people who have fallen in love get together and decide to stay together for a bit and its been suggested that marriage can put some strains on er what started off as a very heady mutual experience, if your lucky, let me ask you this, do you think marriage destroys love?, button one for yes and button two for no, does marriage destroy love?, as you understand it mm a few are not sure but thirty people have said yes, who said yes +mm, mm, were, were talking about what happens when people who have fallen in love get together and decide to stay together for a bit and its been suggested that marriage can put some strains on er what started off as a very heady mutual experience, if your lucky, let me ask you this, do you think marriage destroys love?, button one for yes and button two for no, does marriage destroy love?, as you understand it mm a few are not sure but thirty people have said yes, who said yes erm i, i said yes to er marr being married for, for love and i must admit i think, when i fell in love my head completely went some where else mm and my heart went some where else and i think erm, the, the marriage erm, the love in my marriage was definitely killed by an act which my partner did and i would fall into the crimes of passion i think because i mean to, to me he committed the deadly sin of all and that was adultery and i could never forgive him for that and i think that picks up on a lot, many issues which have been raised tonight about you have to have trust in a partnership, you have to give and take and people change and some people can accept all that but i was not willing to do so. @@ -8436,7 +8433,7 @@ about it as well was it a good influence, i mean do you think the magazines and the books did well i don't think so, i mean its getting beyond real perspective i think sometimes. right now we have, well we've already heard from sandra who's says she's er, er, a romantic writer and there are some other writer's here jean erm margaret, elizabeth are you, you are you pedalling illusions which are er completely deluding people like sadie when she was young are you worried that your actually affecting young particularly female minds in a dangerous way? -mm, no +mm, no i asked for that didn't i? erm what do you think or are you satisfying a market? @@ -8492,7 +8489,7 @@ mm er, but i quite agree one person er there's nothing, nothing greater. yeah i'm, i'm interested that that so many of you go from love to marriage as er swiftly as the horse and carriage similarly would suggest, i mean it, every one's experience of love is, is different, every body here is, we've been talking about love between er men and women, but there's also love between women and women which we haven't talked about at all. do you think society er smiles on all forms of love or do you think some kinds of love and loving are, are actually seen as being lesser than others there, there seems to be less sympathetic for er i mean, yes -well you've just got to look at section twenty eight, now section twenty five, how like we are being discriminated against how even like +well you've just got to look at section twenty eight, now section twenty five, how like we are being discriminated against how even like sorry, erm your not like getting start again, start again getting attacked in pubs you know like that's happened to me, being verbally assaulted in the street has happened to me because i am with my lover who is a woman, who publicly i cannot show like that love, publicly you know cos oh i'm scared of violence you know, i like my face the way it is. @@ -8503,7 +8500,7 @@ its just the very fact that erm there's no equivalent to marriage for lesbian's do you think there should be? yes not so much now i don't think. -i, i, i feel that erm a bit like yourself, what i object is the fact that its again we use +i, i, i feel that erm a bit like yourself, what i object is the fact that its again we use the illusion of love and the actual wording of love mm, mm conjures up images and i just object to the fact that people impose on us, degrenality, i mean i, i think lesbian's and gay men have got a right to their life style as we have and i don't think we should be actually imposing and i think that's what a lot of society and what people come out with does er more or less we don't agree with that and its wrong and its objectional @@ -8524,7 +8521,7 @@ not really ah you didn't fancy it? no, i'm too in my, i like my independence too much, yes. -any one else yes +any one else yes i think i was er, i thought i was in love a few times, but erm in retrospect it was lust so that's, that's, thought that half of you being in love was, was lust any way. @@ -8538,7 +8535,7 @@ also like, why, why, do people want to find love?, like is it maybe lulling them mm, mm i think love is like, when somebody loves you, loves you for just being yourself aha -i, i think to me that would be the greatest +i, i think to me that would be the greatest respects you also yeah, no matter who you are. sadie @@ -8547,7 +8544,7 @@ up there sharing your life with someone, you want to be with that person and you know that if any thing happens you've got that person to rely on and i think if your alone you don't have that. if you can find that person, yes. yeah well i did because my husband before were married was my bus driver on the s m t buses -he certainly found me and from there we just went from strength to strength and erm were still have together. +he certainly found me and from there we just went from strength to strength and erm were still have together. lo , yes if your looking for love and your absolutely desperate there's always a thing called date line which i believe is very successful and i know at least two people who've got very happy marriages from that, so really? @@ -8571,13 +8568,12 @@ turns out to be five foot two, dark hair and really not all that good looking af ah so the message there is erm there's short dark men out there if that's your fancy is there advertising for a partner i mean is it, can't, does it come under trade description act? can they be, can they be sued afterwards -okay well i think we'll er, we'll probably have to stop this as we've run out of time, let me, let me ask the people here one final question, are you in love right now?, button one for yes and button two for no my goodness, sixty two people are rushing home, the other thirty eight +okay well i think we'll er, we'll probably have to stop this as we've run out of time, let me, let me ask the people here one final question, are you in love right now?, button one for yes and button two for no my goodness, sixty two people are rushing home, the other thirty eight are staying for a coffee good night. - and could you tell me when and where you were born, please? -yes, i was born in lane at lane on the eleventh november, nineteen seventeen. +yes, i was born in lane at lane on the eleventh november, nineteen seventeen. and erm could you describe the house you were born in at all? -yes, it was a tt a very large semi-detached house with erm a smallholding attached. +yes, it was a tt a very large semi-detached house with erm a smallholding attached. my father was a miner but loved his garden and we had a big smallholding mhm. all garden, and at the bottom was a streamlet, then had trout in it.. @@ -8593,26 +8589,26 @@ were there? did you ever get any feeling of sort of distaste from anybody about about y your mother leaving home? no. no. -my father was shall we say, well respected and er no, there was no there was never any query about it. +my father was shall we say, well respected and er no, there was no there was never any query about it. mm. so, you lived with your grandparents then. was your grandfather a miner as well? -yes, my granda this was my second grandfather because my gra my own grandfather had died, before i was born, and my grandmother had married again and he was a he was the arm-setter at colliery. +yes, my granda this was my second grandfather because my gra my own grandfather had died, before i was born, and my grandmother had married again and he was a he was the arm-setter at colliery. mm. and your father was a miner at this time, as well? yes. -and also in the house was uncle my grandfather 's brother, uncle bill, who was er a winder at colliery. +and also in the house was uncle my grandfather 's brother, uncle bill, who was er a winder at colliery. mm. -so everybody was based at at , then? +so everybody was based at at , then? yes. do you have many memories of well, the men in the house, coming home from the pit, and talking about the conditions? -m m yes, they talked about work or work , and erm, but not about conditions particularly, and was a medium pit for conditions. -they talked about conditions at which was a wet pit, and er how hucknall was much better, anyhow and things like that. +m m yes, they talked about work or work , and erm, but not about conditions particularly, and was a medium pit for conditions. +they talked about conditions at which was a wet pit, and er how hucknall was much better, anyhow and things like that. but great talk about union activities. what were the union activities? er well, there was the highly immoral thing called overtime, erm if you had too much overtime you was keeping someone out of job. er you wanted a fair number of hours and you wanted a fair wage. -er the union was very parochial . +er the union was very parochial . mm. so the men in the house were all members of nottingham miners association? yes. @@ -8621,9 +8617,9 @@ i suppose the strike would be an early well memory for you? yeah. -the general strike,it's a strange memory because i had to walk down pad er now, erm i forget what the proper word is now, er it's called walk, now . -sounds terr er terrible to me,because pad was the way to colliery, the last half mile along a dirt track. -and er granddad was on maintenance, of course, and i used to have to take his meals, so i used to go past the er picket, along with many other people who were busy coal out of the pit tip . +the general strike,it's a strange memory because i had to walk down pad er now, erm i forget what the proper word is now, er it's called walk, now . +sounds terr er terrible to me,because pad was the way to colliery, the last half mile along a dirt track. +and er granddad was on maintenance, of course, and i used to have to take his meals, so i used to go past the er picket, along with many other people who were busy coal out of the pit tip . er the picket was not as militant as it is now, and there were the talks of scabs, and things like that. but the strike was, well we had the pit ponies up, and er we always used to go and feed them, and then we went, of course, to chapel for meals. i won't say soup kitchens because they weren't that at all, i mean, they weren't as civili you had a civilized meal, i know you sang grace before it, and said grace afterwards, but you had knifes, forks and spoons and chapel china. @@ -8636,12 +8632,12 @@ erm i think they thought they'd been let down at the end of it. erm i was taken to h hear a j , the miners leader at the time, he was the best type perhaps, a welsh chapel parson, erm on the recreation ground and on the marketplace, when thousands turned up, mm. attend . -how how did people feel about , because well if you read read alan alan book, then he's criticized very strongly as being too militant, and r well really cri preferred to him. -how how did the the miners? -well the miners er were middle of the road, as lots of miners are now, but er probably more middle then because, well, the colliery chapel and the co-op were a way of life. +how how did people feel about , because well if you read read alan alan book, then he's criticized very strongly as being too militant, and r well really cri preferred to him. +how how did the the miners? +well the miners er were middle of the road, as lots of miners are now, but er probably more middle then because, well, the colliery chapel and the co-op were a way of life. mm. what about ? -, of course, was a chapel man and er i think they saw, or some of them saw him er a in him a way round, out of things, and, of course , he did deals with the collieries to get people back to work, and whilst families had enjoyed six months in the gardens and doing all sorts of strange things, erm the men mainly wanted to get back to work, because they saw time running out. +, of course, was a chapel man and er i think they saw, or some of them saw him er a in him a way round, out of things, and, of course , he did deals with the collieries to get people back to work, and whilst families had enjoyed six months in the gardens and doing all sorts of strange things, erm the men mainly wanted to get back to work, because they saw time running out. mm. w was the strike a period of hardship particularly? it was hardship in this, that er, perhaps the hardest time came after it when er, well it was called public assistance then, social security payments had to be payed back. @@ -8649,47 +8645,47 @@ all the things that you'd had during the strike, but things did get left, and er which put me off gambling for good, because whilst we won every day, it seemed, we'd lost a lot of money at the end of the year. theoretically we hadn't done, but, of course, we hadn't played anything, but it was good exercise. mm. -well moving onto social life, what are your childhood memories of of playing and with your your father and playmates, etc? +well moving onto social life, what are your childhood memories of of playing and with your your father and playmates, etc? well, of course, er f er fathers and grandfathers er took er the youngster a walk . er there was walking, there was cricket and er billiards, erm street games, things you can't do now because of traffic. but a lot more, i feel sorry for my grandchildren, where they can't have as much fun as i used to have, kicking a tin. mm. did did church figure as prominently in your early life ? oh cha chapel later on, i mean er you know when you got to ten, eleven,ch there were so many things at chapel, i mean from learned dissertations, i mean the gentlemen from the university, here. -er prof and , used to come and talk to the guilds and things, er the men's meeting. +er prof and , used to come and talk to the guilds and things, er the men's meeting. and er then there were the concerts or the pantomimes or the operettas. i always finished up as a bandit, or a pirate, i don't know quite why. i couldn't sing. but equally they did silas marner and er merchant of venice, a good standard, too. so is th is a idea of a chapel being more in the community than just religion? -is that ? +is that ? oh yes, it was a very much a community centre, i mean,we played billiards at chapel, and various chapel people had billiard tables un under their dining table and er we u just go and play billiards. going back to the your mining background, erm after the strike were were your father and grandfather members of both the nottingham miners associa association and the industrial union? erm, yes. -my grandfather became involved because 's union er made a big thing out of compensation cases. -compensation had to be fought for, it wasn't a matter of right, and a piece of a very small piece of coal fell down the shaft, the onsetter's the man at the bottom, and it through his hand and he got compensation and then my father was sacked for the shovel. -too much of a coincidence,i'm afraid, to our minds. +my grandfather became involved because 's union er made a big thing out of compensation cases. +compensation had to be fought for, it wasn't a matter of right, and a piece of a very small piece of coal fell down the shaft, the onsetter's the man at the bottom, and it through his hand and he got compensation and then my father was sacked for the shovel. +too much of a coincidence,i'm afraid, to our minds. do you think the two were connected, then? oh, we're sure they were but er this was the thing with a private collier company where you had er a sort of, not quite chairman, of the colliery sitting there at the top o in the office, watching everybody come and go. -and er after that, my father went with the rounds with the collieries, where you had to belong to union to go to them, and colliery didn't accept what was called the old union. +and er after that, my father went with the rounds with the collieries, where you had to belong to union to go to them, and colliery didn't accept what was called the old union. yeah was? -the pit was the colliery ? -pit as my n pit was colliery, then there was , and then, of course, there were the pits and the pits, on the edge. -er but , collieries as they became, they didn't acc that was lancaster, they didn't accept er the old unions, so they erm they belonged both i can't on friday night i used to the methodist's chapel to pay the old union subscription, and to the west to pay 's. +the pit was the colliery ? +pit as my n pit was colliery, then there was , and then, of course, there were the pits and the pits, on the edge. +er but , collieries as they became, they didn't acc that was lancaster, they didn't accept er the old unions, so they erm they belonged both i can't on friday night i used to the methodist's chapel to pay the old union subscription, and to the west to pay 's. what was your father and grandfather's attitude to authority in the pit? were they very resentful about, well, these dismissals? -very resentful about that,, but er no, er i think er tt some of the pi it was er not authority in the pits, they disliked the co-owners, erm one or two, and respected pit always had a respectable authority er and ownership, i mean, stemming from the quaker one. -but er and the other pits where personalities were involved were not quite so happy. +very resentful about that,, but er no, er i think er tt some of the pi it was er not authority in the pits, they disliked the co-owners, erm one or two, and respected pit always had a respectable authority er and ownership, i mean, stemming from the quaker one. +but er and the other pits where personalities were involved were not quite so happy. but er the managers and er and the the manager of the pit and then the underviewers, and the rest, they were people who had worked their way up generally, and were accepted. so had the idea of the coal owner er well at the end of the century, the the coal ow owner and liberal mp sort of connections in ? -well was pit, was and er they came to the family, that was someone at mansfield, came back to open chapel bazaars, and all sorts of things, and particularly for the adult school. +well was pit, was and er they came to the family, that was someone at mansfield, came back to open chapel bazaars, and all sorts of things, and particularly for the adult school. yeah, going on to schools, which w which schools did you attend? -i went street erm, which was just next door to grandma's, only over the wall,. -and er then to 's street, which was called school, for a year and then to 's, when it opened in nineteen twenty nine. +i went street erm, which was just next door to grandma's, only over the wall,. +and er then to 's street, which was called school, for a year and then to 's, when it opened in nineteen twenty nine. do you have many memories of your, well, early education? street, yes, because er you went er you had a marvellous thing called nature study, come geography, come everything, where you went for walk. but equally,the first thing i remember was my number in the infant school, when i was number fifty five, and er there were fifty eight of us in the class, and one lady kept order. -. they were very ordered classes i'm afraid . +. they were very ordered classes i'm afraid . was much learnt, or? yes, oh yes, you learnt quite a lot and er much depended on er the teacher, of course, they weren't as bound as er teachers had been. mm. @@ -8703,10 +8699,10 @@ and er to me it presented a great opportunity,i i j i won quite a lot of books. i always remember asking for lawrence in arabia, as a sunday school prize. . and they weren't the victorian prizes, that i won,i we got them for getting through an exam, because you could write or something, and er tt well, they were quite good books, and it was one way of getting a book. mm. -w what about street school? +w what about street school? street school, i was th there on only there a year, and the headmaster came in one day, he was another liberal politician. headmasters were always members of the council, in those days, and they were always tended to be la liberal or labour, which i the present labour would say was very pale pink. -and the headmaster at er street school, joseph , was a labour member of council, and joseph was tended to be more liberal. +and the headmaster at er street school, joseph , was a labour member of council, and joseph was tended to be more liberal. he came in one day and asked what m c c stood for, and i've always known a lot of useless information, so i could tell him, so i was then dispatched everyday to the erm radio shop in the high street, to get the cricket scores in australia. and then he asked me, he said, well, have you read that notice on the board about er scholarships? i said, yes, but there's no hope. @@ -8728,66 +8724,66 @@ about going t about getting the henr scholarship to , had only just opened then that hadn't it? it hadn't er i went when it opened. -we were er before then there was the , the school just over the wall to street, was the centre. +we were er before then there was the , the school just over the wall to street, was the centre. it was a pupil, teacher centre. it started life as a technical school, which it was given by subscription, mainly the colliery company, for scientific education. but used during the day by the education committee as a pupil-teacher centre. and up till then, you went to you got your scholarship, you went to the tu pupil- teacher training centre and then you became a teacher. -erm if you passed , erm you did a stint and then you came to college, nottingham for your teaching ticket. -so but was without a a secondary school +erm if you passed , erm you did a stint and then you came to college, nottingham for your teaching ticket. +so but was without a a secondary school yes. for quite a long period, wasn't it ? yes. -yes, until annie came,m after the war. +yes, until annie came,m after the war. was? how did the community feel about that?? they felt strongly ? -they felt strongly about it, but er was only twelve minutes away, on the railway, quarter of an hour on the bus. -and of course, in spite of everything that's being said, the thing about was that because of the two railway stations you could get anywhere in half or three quarters of an hour. -you could get to i know graham went to , which is way out, other went up the kimberley and that area, and other went to sutton. +they felt strongly about it, but er was only twelve minutes away, on the railway, quarter of an hour on the bus. +and of course, in spite of everything that's being said, the thing about was that because of the two railway stations you could get anywhere in half or three quarters of an hour. +you could get to i know graham went to , which is way out, other went up the kimberley and that area, and other went to sutton. and everybody could get home very quickly because of the railway stations that were there. so did you travel to school on the railways? we tr i travelled to school on the railway one bit, when they gave us season tickets, because with a scholarship you got your fares paid. and then they started paying your bus fare, at the end of the week, and so i decided i could walk. . er fourpence return was two mars bars, and quite a lot of us walked. -were there many boys from at ? -oh yes, there were well, all the erm boys from up to about the fifth form, in the old pupil-teachers training centre went, er was formed by joining that and school, they took boys from there . +were there many boys from at ? +oh yes, there were well, all the erm boys from up to about the fifth form, in the old pupil-teachers training centre went, er was formed by joining that and school, they took boys from there . . and er then there was the new intake of ourselves, and er there were probably fifty or sixty the first year. erm, only three scholarship, but then of course, you got the er governors free places, which were nearly the same, and then the number who were being paid for. d s so did you notice any sort of class differences within the school? -very little, after the first week . +very little, after the first week . erm uniform's a great leveller, or a i i'd never had such marvellous clothes. erm i know a friend of mine, and my ambition, then, was to wear a collar and tie and wear half-shoes, as opposed to a jersey and boots. -erm now, of course, we'd wear a jersey and boots quite happily , but er i did get a grant for clothing because otherwise there was no way of goin of accepting a scholarship. +erm now, of course, we'd wear a jersey and boots quite happily , but er i did get a grant for clothing because otherwise there was no way of goin of accepting a scholarship. and erm the immediate reaction, at home, was to say, well, you can't go. and the headmaster said,quietly, let's talk about it. and er so i had clothes from , and er i learnt what clerical colo clerical grey was,and er, also what house shoes were, erm you know, slippers for wearing in school. so tt and of course, the other thing i learnt there was that you had dinner the wrong way round, you didn't have your pudding first, to fill you up.. -so what other memories do you have of of , then? -oh, very happy memories really, we erm we had two or three masters from , erm one was the sunday school superintendent, again this chapel and the son-in-law of the headmaster of street, george edward ,, as he's known to thousands. +so what other memories do you have of of , then? +oh, very happy memories really, we erm we had two or three masters from , erm one was the sunday school superintendent, again this chapel and the son-in-law of the headmaster of street, george edward ,, as he's known to thousands. he must be rolling round, cos he was the maths master, he must be rolling round in his grave, as people say percentage, because he if you said percentage he yelled at you, percentage of what? . erm but you'd failed him, if you didn't get a distinction in school certificate maths, or arithmetic. so h how old were you when you left school? sixteen. -which was, i mean, very late for those ? +which was, i mean, very late for those ? no. no. we left er the secondary school, or as they were then, the grammar schools, at sixteen. you left the other one at fourteen. -i could have stayed at street till i was fourteen , i could have stayed at street until i was fourteen, and then you would've been out. +i could have stayed at street till i was fourteen , i could have stayed at street until i was fourteen, and then you would've been out. and er but at er there you'd got to go for the other two years, and some parents were rather wondering whether that left you late in the queue for a job, because jobs were very difficult. or whether you were going to earn enough, later on. mm. how did you go about finding a job? wrote hundreds of letter,er to the people you wanted to do, because i'd never expected having to find a job, i must admit, because the year before i took school certificate i had got a naval a artificer apprenticeship, but then i got kicked in the eye playing rugby, and failed a medical. -something i'd never to do, so i had to settle down and get school certificate, which i got with my matric exemption, and people from did. +something i'd never to do, so i had to settle down and get school certificate, which i got with my matric exemption, and people from did. it er you were taught, and er i ju i'd say it was as liberal a education as you get now, but you'd got to get your maths, you'd got to english, you'd got to get a language, you'd got to get a science, and mm. it was broadly based. -and so what was the job found ? -and eventually i found a job er as assistant to the er clerking to the rating officer, who had also been a member of t , who was a member of the chapel, and er knew i was looking for a job and er, i hadn't written to him cos i didn't know this one was coming up. +and so what was the job found ? +and eventually i found a job er as assistant to the er clerking to the rating officer, who had also been a member of t , who was a member of the chapel, and er knew i was looking for a job and er, i hadn't written to him cos i didn't know this one was coming up. and so he told you about it, rather than? yes, he told me, he said ah well, have you got a job yet? i said no, not yet, erm i'm awaiting replies from so many. @@ -8804,26 +8800,26 @@ i mean, the pits would be worked out, according to the talk at home, and anyhow, mm. so what did you actually do in the rating office? well, i wrote out births, deaths, marriage certificates, and er then measured up houses on the rating side, erm worked them out for evaluations. -erm used to go down to weddings, at the register office on a saturday morning, and hope that they'd turn up without witnesses, because then you had to be compensated,, for giving your service. +erm used to go down to weddings, at the register office on a saturday morning, and hope that they'd turn up without witnesses, because then you had to be compensated,, for giving your service. how much would you get for? i occasionally got ten shillings, which was more than a week's as much a week's wages. erm but er i learnt to write a fair hand, erm without too many flourishes, which er because i was always told that somebody might be looking at this in a hundred years time, or more. mm. in going to measure houses, did you have to actually go out and visit houses ? yes, oh aye i yes, we you had to measure, and in those days, the councils were grouped in what they called assessment committee areas, and each were wor making sure the other areas were using the same sort of basis. -and i remember, one afternoon, going out with the whole of the rating committee, to houses at eastwood and beeston, and other places, and m in effect measuring them by counting how many nine inch bricks they were across the front and back, to make sure that, you know, nobody was subsidizing anybody else. +and i remember, one afternoon, going out with the whole of the rating committee, to houses at eastwood and beeston, and other places, and m in effect measuring them by counting how many nine inch bricks they were across the front and back, to make sure that, you know, nobody was subsidizing anybody else. mm. erm and you went in houses, you saw them. you know, learnt about construction. mm. did you see much of people's living conditions? particularly poor living conditions,? -oh you saw er you'd seen this because er you had friends all over, i mean, the fact that you went to didn't er tt get rid of all your friends. +oh you saw er you'd seen this because er you had friends all over, i mean, the fact that you went to didn't er tt get rid of all your friends. mm. erm you had friends everywh , in all sorts of places, you didn't dally, shall we say, in some of them that might have been a bit smelly. mm. and others that you wouldn't have gone in anyhow, but they were areas. -but generally i saw more living conditions later on, er when er i started rent collecting for the council. +but generally i saw more living conditions later on, er when er i started rent collecting for the council. mm. and the rating officer was part time with the council, and one day, a rent collector was taken ill, and then i was given a five shilling bag of copper and told to go and collect these when? @@ -8840,7 +8836,7 @@ well it was still very depressed in the coal trade, you were they were doing thi if you worked four, you were worse off than if you worked three, you know, you'd got three days on th er and you got you got three days dole, er unemployment pay. mm. and er so times were still hard, it wasn't until they, let's say until thirty ei thirty eight, that the depression finished in the coal field, when they started building up from then. -and of course, this was the time of the means test, when young men from who er lived at home, their income was taken into account, in assessing how much dad or mum couldn't get. +and of course, this was the time of the means test, when young men from who er lived at home, their income was taken into account, in assessing how much dad or mum couldn't get. and er they took themselves off to coventry and to and to luton, to the motor trades. and quite a few went. what were the? @@ -8852,20 +8848,20 @@ because there'd been arguments about it earlier on in the century, hadn't there? oh there had, had er it h erm had a marvellous water supply and it had a good sewage it had a good sewage disposal system. but erm sewage was to be one of the things i shall never forget, later on. whilst i was working for the council, someone came to ask and we had some new o new officer appointed and he was very worried about getting ca er p permission from the council to launch a sewer scheme that was going to cost a quarter of a million pounds, a very large amount in those days. -and the older members of the staff, and there weren't many, i mean the total s council office staff was only about thi was twenty or so, and erm more men were employed outside, than anything. +and the older members of the staff, and there weren't many, i mean the total s council office staff was only about thi was twenty or so, and erm more men were employed outside, than anything. and they said, well you know how to draw up your agenda, and you'll have something that's contentious, in this case it was the supply of stationery from three local stationers, from printi local printers. and they argue that half the night, and then er your thing will go through on the nod, if you get it in before t half past nine when they er standing order say the council meeting closes. mm. -s so huck urban district council was separate from nottingham wasn't it ? +s so huck urban district council was separate from nottingham wasn't it ? yes. yes. -er nottingham had about three attempts to pinch , and er the last one they were told to put their own house in order, first, because conditions were so much better than in the city. +er nottingham had about three attempts to pinch , and er the last one they were told to put their own house in order, first, because conditions were so much better than in the city. erm mainly as a result,i i contend, that earlier on the quaker coal owners encouraged home ownership, has this very high proportion of er owner-occupiers. tt er in nineteen seventy four, i think, at least about three quarters of them were . mm. there are no there were no big property owners, no big coal, i mean the colliery company only owned sixty houses, i think, which were sold to the tenants, er when the lease ran out. w what about the the health service in nottingham? -in ? +in ? er in ? sorry. erm health service? @@ -8873,10 +8869,10 @@ erm what do you mean? the doctors? mm. oh well you had er some very well loved doctors, we had the black doctor, dr , he was er west indian, he took over from another one, dr , who was also west indian, i gathered, i never knew dr . -but dr was a good cricketer, erm he also wrote a very you could also read what dr put, and he was also said that he sent people to hospital very quickly. -erm then there was the er and he m dr , and er dr and then it became dr , who is still there. -erm dr was the medical officer of health, part time, and dr was a character, he always had a white carnation, he rode round in a carriage on occasions, and he er wrote copperplate. -that's when i had to put these things onto dea er put death certificates into th their the doctor's certificate into english , erm they were pretty good,t others weren't so g , er you know, weren't so good. +but dr was a good cricketer, erm he also wrote a very you could also read what dr put, and he was also said that he sent people to hospital very quickly. +erm then there was the er and he m dr , and er dr and then it became dr , who is still there. +erm dr was the medical officer of health, part time, and dr was a character, he always had a white carnation, he rode round in a carriage on occasions, and he er wrote copperplate. +that's when i had to put these things onto dea er put death certificates into th their the doctor's certificate into english , erm they were pretty good,t others weren't so g , er you know, weren't so good. i have been accused, too, of saying that, you tell your doctor, i'd know what you, i knew what you'd die of,because they had their own things, their own pet hobbyhorses. erm myocardio degeneration and chronic bronchitis, and erm probably quite accurate, but er short of breaking your neck i think you, bronchitis was the killer, in . mm. @@ -8885,26 +8881,26 @@ oh yes, i had to co copy them, and er you know, you got these things, but the re mm. have you s ? did you see many changes in , over the pre-war era? -yes erm during the h the probably one of the reasons i was set on to start with, was the tremendous amount of house building. +yes erm during the h the probably one of the reasons i was set on to start with, was the tremendous amount of house building. i mean, john , who was a local builder, sold a house a day for five years, which is some building. -and you can see john, whichever way you go into , you'll see john types e and g, the semi-detached on road, lane and road, and road. +and you can see john, whichever way you go into , you'll see john types e and g, the semi-detached on road, lane and road, and road. you'll see them everywhere. -and one or two people are very honest, they call the house,because they borrowed the money from halifax building society .. +and one or two people are very honest, they call the house,because they borrowed the money from halifax building society .. what about transport in ? transport? oh well now it isn't a patch on what it was. -erm yo there was so many trains into nottingham, into victoria at twelve minutes, it took you thirty minutes into the midland station, having called at and , and all sorts of places on the way. -they were, first of all, there were and 's buses, direct and the bus. +erm yo there was so many trains into nottingham, into victoria at twelve minutes, it took you thirty minutes into the midland station, having called at and , and all sorts of places on the way. +they were, first of all, there were and 's buses, direct and the bus. and then, of course, come along and er for while there was a competition with chasers over the forest, you know one running either just in front, or just behind the other, sort of thing. and then, tt er reynolds took ove er reynolds went and er trent took over and then duttons went, and trent took over again. what about? did many people have cars in hucknall? -no, very few, erm in lane, which is now in an estate agent's parlance, erm a desirable part of the town, they used to be mr the local the solicitor, of castlegate, and his wife used to drive him to the station, to catch the train to nottingham. +no, very few, erm in lane, which is now in an estate agent's parlance, erm a desirable part of the town, they used to be mr the local the solicitor, of castlegate, and his wife used to drive him to the station, to catch the train to nottingham. she also meet him m met him at lunchtime, because the steam coach used to come out from town, and bring the business men, the wealthier one, out. mm. and i suppose, seeing as it was so short, it was worth coming home? yes. -in that sort ? +in that sort ? oh yes, er he could er he could still have an hour lunchtime, and er only be out of the office, say, an hour and three quarters. erm moving on a l a little bit, what was your social life at the time? my social life, i suppose, ticked round chapel, then it ticked round er cycling and er walking. @@ -8916,31 +8912,31 @@ i'd never ridden a bike, hardly, before. but then they had a cycling club, at chapel, and so we tended to go saturdays, and then i started walking and youth hostelling. we went youth hostelling for m the sort of the chapel choir, after when you grew up in chapel, then you were either found a job teaching, in the sunday school, or you went into the choir. well i went in a choir, i could never sing, and i still can't, and er the choir used to go out quite a lot, and er we cycled and we youth-hostelled, even as w or in on working parties, at some of the peak hostels. -what about erm, you were involved in the amateur dram dramatics ? +what about erm, you were involved in the amateur dram dramatics ? well this er came through the same thing, the youth hostels association, we had a visit from gyp some german ones who did m play reading in hostels, and er some of ours went back there, and the youth hostels associations, they had a play reading group, and er i joined that. -as i say, i'd al been in things at chapel, silas marner and things, but er this was another thing, and of course, that's where i met my wife, at er row, which is the boys' clu was the boys' club's headquarters. +as i say, i'd al been in things at chapel, silas marner and things, but er this was another thing, and of course, that's where i met my wife, at er row, which is the boys' clu was the boys' club's headquarters. and er we did one or two plays there and mm. -in the old s st 's church hall on street, which has now gone. -would robin have acted with you, then? -robin , er william was at school, one year behind me and i played with him, but bill wasn't very er big. +in the old s st 's church hall on street, which has now gone. +would robin have acted with you, then? +robin , er william was at school, one year behind me and i played with him, but bill wasn't very er big. erm i'm amazed now when i see him on television as to how big he is, because he wasn't as a youngster, and he was fragile and er we ribbed him because, in those days, you had an attache case for a school bag, and your initials were put on it. and er, he had the lot, w h m b, you see, and er he wasn't robin, then. .. and er this was one of things that my old boss, when people came into name their children, he said now remember, these initials will go on case, perhaps, one day, and you don't want s a p, or something like that. and if they came in a with name that was unusual, er now, are you sure? -do you want a moment to think about it ? +do you want a moment to think about it ? you know, when somebody came up with mehetabelle, or something like that. -er but no, er robin and the local dramatic club was er very, very good, you're in the market for money, putting on things in the chapel, or in the co-op hall, at . -hit-the was usually done in the co-op hall, and er they were good. +er but no, er robin and the local dramatic club was er very, very good, you're in the market for money, putting on things in the chapel, or in the co-op hall, at . +hit-the was usually done in the co-op hall, and er they were good. mm. -i mean, people didn't pay money just out of,you know, loyalty, completely. +i mean, people didn't pay money just out of,you know, loyalty, completely. what about the spanish civil war? do you remember? well, at that time my best pal went to the pit, his mother wouldn't let him enter in th for scholarship, but he did happen to come here for, well, he seemed to always get a day's day release from the year dot, i think, and er eventually he got some a levels. he got his trade unions things, and his deputy's certificate, and that. but then, he got some a levels and he's finally got an open university degree, good luck to him. and er we used to go occasionally to w e a meetings, in the library at , and er i wasn't a member of his class, but i did once go and hear hugh , when he was at nottingham. -and er then er we had er a tutor who was very, very keen and we nearly all went to er the spanish civil war, and we took er the er paper for ages, erm and er but one of the group did go, frank from , went, but the were always communist, they never claimed to be labour. +and er then er we had er a tutor who was very, very keen and we nearly all went to er the spanish civil war, and we took er the er paper for ages, erm and er but one of the group did go, frank from , went, but the were always communist, they never claimed to be labour. but er they were always er well-remembered, and er w spanish civil war through, i suppose nowadays, you call them fringe newspapers, but there was this paper we used to get at the tim at the time it wasn't the er morning star, or even it's predecessor, erm but you got a paper and you sort of heard the other side. erm er, very concerned as to what it was going to lead up to up, and hoping, you know, against hope that's you weren't going to be involved in anything like that. mm. @@ -8980,65 +8976,64 @@ eventually we m , when we became a mobile, self-propelled anti-tank unit, erm my and on that there was a typewriter and you could send signal messages, and everything. but typewriters we had problems with because, if they went in for repair, you never got them back from the ordinance core, and so at one place in tunbridge wells we handed a typewriter in and because the army were allowed to buy greaseproof paper, we bought a lot of greaseproof paper which came in the package of a new typewriter. erm er, nothing changes. - -i the defendant doctor david against a decision of the taxing master, taxing master of right, er given on the thirteenth of august nineteen ninety three, whereby the taxing master disallowed interest on plaintiff's bill of the cost in the action for a period from the first of november nineteen ninety one to the twenty seventh of may nineteen ninety three, the defendant in his notice of appeal, claims that the taxing master should have disallowed interest for a longer period, in addition to the period he actually al disallowed int namely there should be additional disallowance for the period from the twenty forth of april nineteen ninety one to the thirty first of october nineteen ninety one or for such other periods as the court deems just. +i the defendant doctor david against a decision of the taxing master, taxing master of right, er given on the thirteenth of august nineteen ninety three, whereby the taxing master disallowed interest on plaintiff's bill of the cost in the action for a period from the first of november nineteen ninety one to the twenty seventh of may nineteen ninety three, the defendant in his notice of appeal, claims that the taxing master should have disallowed interest for a longer period, in addition to the period he actually al disallowed int namely there should be additional disallowance for the period from the twenty forth of april nineteen ninety one to the thirty first of october nineteen ninety one or for such other periods as the court deems just. the plaintiffs also appealed against the decision of taxing master right, er and then appealed on the basis that er there should be no disallowance for any interest at all. -there is also a further appeal before the court in relation to an application by the plaintiff for disallowance of interest upon the defendant's bill of costs and er it is claimed that if interest is to be disallowed on their bill, interest should also be disallowed on the defendant's bill of costs. +there is also a further appeal before the court in relation to an application by the plaintiff for disallowance of interest upon the defendant's bill of costs and er it is claimed that if interest is to be disallowed on their bill, interest should also be disallowed on the defendant's bill of costs. so the matter arises in this way, the action that concerns a partnership dispute, er between the plaintiffs on the one hand and the defendant on the other. all the plaintiffs and the defendant were doctors carrying on practice as general medical practitioners at er . -it's er unfortunately the case that relations between the partners broke down and this led in due course to proceedings being commenced by the plaintiffs against the defendant in relation to the dissolution of the partners, those proceedings were commenced in nineteen eighty nine,, er in the high court chancery division, there were a number of issues raised in the litigation, one of the matters was a preliminary issue, er concerning the terms of the partnership and that came before er mr justice on the eighteenth of february nineteen ninety one, whereby he found in favour effectively of the defendant on that preliminary issue er the plaintiffs it seems were then claiming that partnership, the partnership at will, but mr justice held that they were part of the terms of the particular er partnership deed, so the defendants succeeded on that issue, the trial of the action then followed on the twentieth of march nineteen ninety one and er mr justice made an order for dissolution of the partnership, he then give various directions for accountant enquiries concerning the partnership and he made orders for payments of costs, now the orders for costs were this, that effectively the defendant was entitled to some costs of the preliminary issue and that the plaintiffs were entitled to costs of the er ma if i may put it this way, the main action, and there was then the provision for, set off for the defendant's costs against the costs ordered to be paid by the defendant, perfectly normal form of order. -now if the matter arises on taxation in this way, it seems that a loan, the trial judgment was given on the twentieth of march nineteen ninety one, a minute of order was prepared and signed by counsel for both the plaintiff and for the defendants and that was forwarded by the defendant's solicitors to the plaintiff's solicitors under cover of a letter dated the twenty third of april nineteen ninety one, er mr who is the defendant's solicitor in the third paragraph, had a letter wrote as follows i enclose a copy of the draft minute board, approved by mr , he of course was counsel for the defendant,you are now, you, you were presumably now attend a sealed order . -it's er common ground that in fact er no sealed order was drawn up until very considerably later, the sealed order is in fact dated the twenty fifth of may nineteen ninety three. -now between during the period from the decision of mr justice in march nineteen ninety one and the issue of the sealed order in may nineteen ninety three, it's clear from correspondence which has been put before me that there were er various negotiations and discussions between the solicitors for the plaintiff and the defendant dealing with the questions of costs and also with the question of a general settlement of the whole action, er it would be appreciated of course that mr justice order does not have the effect of determining finally the rights of the parties, erm other than the partnership has in fact dissolved because there were still outstanding issues in particular relating to the premises which were used as the surgery of the premises of the part of the prac of the practice or perhaps i should say former practice. -the position was that the plaintiffs effectively retained possession of the surgery premises and the defendant er moved out of the premises and er went and found other surgery premises and er the position as i understand it is that he is carrying on his own practice today from other premises, the plaintiffs are such as now surviving, are still continue to practice from the former part of the premises. -in on the fourteenth of july of nineteen ninety three the defendant took out a summons with a view to having all the outstanding matters resolved and er this summons came before erm deputy master on the twelfth of august nineteen ninety three and he gave various directions including an enquiry in relation to how the surgery premises er ought to be dealt with as in court in the winding up of the partnership and that matter went before mr justice long in december and he decided those issues and gave directions in relation to and how the premises are to be sold, the effect of the directions very vaguely, is that the premises have to be offered to the partners, if only one of the partners shows any interest then there is provision in the relevant deed for ascertaining the price and this is put to that partner at that price, if more than one partner wishes to buy the premises then there is provision for a fixing of a minimum figure and then each of the partners has to put in sealed offers er and the premises will be sold to the partner, the former partner who put in the last offer, that broadly speaking i think is the substance of mr justice order. +it's er unfortunately the case that relations between the partners broke down and this led in due course to proceedings being commenced by the plaintiffs against the defendant in relation to the dissolution of the partners, those proceedings were commenced in nineteen eighty nine,, er in the high court chancery division, there were a number of issues raised in the litigation, one of the matters was a preliminary issue, er concerning the terms of the partnership and that came before er mr justice on the eighteenth of february nineteen ninety one, whereby he found in favour effectively of the defendant on that preliminary issue er the plaintiffs it seems were then claiming that partnership, the partnership at will, but mr justice held that they were part of the terms of the particular er partnership deed, so the defendants succeeded on that issue, the trial of the action then followed on the twentieth of march nineteen ninety one and er mr justice made an order for dissolution of the partnership, he then give various directions for accountant enquiries concerning the partnership and he made orders for payments of costs, now the orders for costs were this, that effectively the defendant was entitled to some costs of the preliminary issue and that the plaintiffs were entitled to costs of the er ma if i may put it this way, the main action, and there was then the provision for, set off for the defendant's costs against the costs ordered to be paid by the defendant, perfectly normal form of order. +now if the matter arises on taxation in this way, it seems that a loan, the trial judgment was given on the twentieth of march nineteen ninety one, a minute of order was prepared and signed by counsel for both the plaintiff and for the defendants and that was forwarded by the defendant's solicitors to the plaintiff's solicitors under cover of a letter dated the twenty third of april nineteen ninety one, er mr who is the defendant's solicitor in the third paragraph, had a letter wrote as follows i enclose a copy of the draft minute board, approved by mr , he of course was counsel for the defendant,you are now, you, you were presumably now attend a sealed order . +it's er common ground that in fact er no sealed order was drawn up until very considerably later, the sealed order is in fact dated the twenty fifth of may nineteen ninety three. +now between during the period from the decision of mr justice in march nineteen ninety one and the issue of the sealed order in may nineteen ninety three, it's clear from correspondence which has been put before me that there were er various negotiations and discussions between the solicitors for the plaintiff and the defendant dealing with the questions of costs and also with the question of a general settlement of the whole action, er it would be appreciated of course that mr justice order does not have the effect of determining finally the rights of the parties, erm other than the partnership has in fact dissolved because there were still outstanding issues in particular relating to the premises which were used as the surgery of the premises of the part of the prac of the practice or perhaps i should say former practice. +the position was that the plaintiffs effectively retained possession of the surgery premises and the defendant er moved out of the premises and er went and found other surgery premises and er the position as i understand it is that he is carrying on his own practice today from other premises, the plaintiffs are such as now surviving, are still continue to practice from the former part of the premises. +in on the fourteenth of july of nineteen ninety three the defendant took out a summons with a view to having all the outstanding matters resolved and er this summons came before erm deputy master on the twelfth of august nineteen ninety three and he gave various directions including an enquiry in relation to how the surgery premises er ought to be dealt with as in court in the winding up of the partnership and that matter went before mr justice long in december and he decided those issues and gave directions in relation to and how the premises are to be sold, the effect of the directions very vaguely, is that the premises have to be offered to the partners, if only one of the partners shows any interest then there is provision in the relevant deed for ascertaining the price and this is put to that partner at that price, if more than one partner wishes to buy the premises then there is provision for a fixing of a minimum figure and then each of the partners has to put in sealed offers er and the premises will be sold to the partner, the former partner who put in the last offer, that broadly speaking i think is the substance of mr justice order. the position at the moment is that the defendant tells me he would like to acquire the premises because erm a low criticism has, was made of the premises as being suitable for the carry on of the doctors surgery in partner, a doctor's surgery in partnership because no doubt the space and other matters, er the defendant tells me that erm they are perfectly suitable for as it were a sole petitioner to carry on his practice from them and that is why he would like to acquire it. -now the taxation of the plaintiff's bill of costs, came before master er and er in his taxation, it seems, and i'm, i think i'm right in saying it, it seems that erm there is no substantial dispute as to the particular items in the various bills of costs with which he was concerned, it maybe that if there were a discrepancy, he has, he dealt with it and nothing has been said before me today, er to suggest that the figures appearing in the bill of costs ought to be varied and accordingly i have not er have to consider the detail items in the bill of costs, the only issue i didn't decide is whether master was correct in disallowing interest for the period that he did, er mr for the plaintiff says that he was wrong er that there was no good reason for disallowing him any interest and that accordingly i on this appeal should erm discharge or reverse that part of taxing order as disallowed interest. -er doctor says not only was the taxing officer right in what he did, but he should of gone further and as i say he should of erm disallowed more interest, the basis of which erm doctor puts forward that submission before me seems to be two fold, first he points out that in fact the plaintiffs failed to perfect the order of mr justice er, er sorry mr justice erm, until the twenty fifth of may nineteen ninety three and that was a, i think he would say a probable failure on part of the plaintiffs and their solicitors to do with what his solicitor had asked them to do in the letter of the twenty third of april nineteen ninety one. -the other point which is made by the defendant is this, he says that the plaintiffs have been guilty of delaying tactics er during the course of this litigation, the result of which has been that er he has not been able to realize his interest in the partnership premises, also he has not been able to acquire a partnership premises and he he, doctor mentioned to me that to the actual conveyance of the partnership premises he's, he tells me was only produced i think thirty and er that er it was only then that he realized there might be a chance that he could acquire the premises for himself, but he says that er because of the general, i think the case is, because of the general conduct of the plaintiffs in delaying the trial of the action one way or another, er the practical effect has been that the plaintiffs have had the benefit of use and occupation of the premises at which he erm, a main view, has a lot of that interest and that they are getting benefit of the kind from that occupation and he is not getting any money in res in respect of that, at least nothing like any market rent because it maybe that there is a fairly small er payment being made, but i'm not too entirely clear whether that is the case or not, but the stock bond is suggesting that the plaintiffs have been obtaining benefit of the use of the premises at his expense and in those circumstances it is unfair er in, in, or otherwise not appropriate that the plaintiffs should be entitled to obtain interest on their bill of costs, in respect essentially of the period of delay, and when i say period of delay included that the period during which the forward of mr justice remained erm unprotected. -when the matter came before the taxing master it appears to have proceeded on footing that erm order twenty eighty, rule four, sorry i, rule, rule twenty eighty, four sixty two er was the relevant er provision under which erm the taxing master disallowed interest. -order twen er, rule twenty, eight, four provides that when a party is entitled to costs, and that of course is the case of the plaintiffs, a, fails without good reason to commence or conduct proceedings for the taxation of those costs in accordance with this order or any direction or b, delays lodging a bill of costs for taxation, the taxing office may one, disallow already part of the costs of taxation that he would otherwise would warn about the party and two, after taking into account all the circumstances, including any prejudice suffered by any other party as result of such failure or delay as the case maybe, and any additional interest payable under section seventeen of the judgements act because of the failure or delay, allow the party so entitled less than the amount he would otherwise have allowed on taxation of the bill are wholly disallowed the costs,his provision for an appeal to allow to the judge and chambers and that is the way the matter is coming before +now the taxation of the plaintiff's bill of costs, came before master er and er in his taxation, it seems, and i'm, i think i'm right in saying it, it seems that erm there is no substantial dispute as to the particular items in the various bills of costs with which he was concerned, it maybe that if there were a discrepancy, he has, he dealt with it and nothing has been said before me today, er to suggest that the figures appearing in the bill of costs ought to be varied and accordingly i have not er have to consider the detail items in the bill of costs, the only issue i didn't decide is whether master was correct in disallowing interest for the period that he did, er mr for the plaintiff says that he was wrong er that there was no good reason for disallowing him any interest and that accordingly i on this appeal should erm discharge or reverse that part of taxing order as disallowed interest. +er doctor says not only was the taxing officer right in what he did, but he should of gone further and as i say he should of erm disallowed more interest, the basis of which erm doctor puts forward that submission before me seems to be two fold, first he points out that in fact the plaintiffs failed to perfect the order of mr justice er, er sorry mr justice erm, until the twenty fifth of may nineteen ninety three and that was a, i think he would say a probable failure on part of the plaintiffs and their solicitors to do with what his solicitor had asked them to do in the letter of the twenty third of april nineteen ninety one. +the other point which is made by the defendant is this, he says that the plaintiffs have been guilty of delaying tactics er during the course of this litigation, the result of which has been that er he has not been able to realize his interest in the partnership premises, also he has not been able to acquire a partnership premises and he he, doctor mentioned to me that to the actual conveyance of the partnership premises he's, he tells me was only produced i think thirty and er that er it was only then that he realized there might be a chance that he could acquire the premises for himself, but he says that er because of the general, i think the case is, because of the general conduct of the plaintiffs in delaying the trial of the action one way or another, er the practical effect has been that the plaintiffs have had the benefit of use and occupation of the premises at which he erm, a main view, has a lot of that interest and that they are getting benefit of the kind from that occupation and he is not getting any money in res in respect of that, at least nothing like any market rent because it maybe that there is a fairly small er payment being made, but i'm not too entirely clear whether that is the case or not, but the stock bond is suggesting that the plaintiffs have been obtaining benefit of the use of the premises at his expense and in those circumstances it is unfair er in, in, or otherwise not appropriate that the plaintiffs should be entitled to obtain interest on their bill of costs, in respect essentially of the period of delay, and when i say period of delay included that the period during which the forward of mr justice remained erm unprotected. +when the matter came before the taxing master it appears to have proceeded on footing that erm order twenty eighty, rule four, sorry i, rule, rule twenty eighty, four sixty two er was the relevant er provision under which erm the taxing master disallowed interest. +order twen er, rule twenty, eight, four provides that when a party is entitled to costs, and that of course is the case of the plaintiffs, a, fails without good reason to commence or conduct proceedings for the taxation of those costs in accordance with this order or any direction or b, delays lodging a bill of costs for taxation, the taxing office may one, disallow already part of the costs of taxation that he would otherwise would warn about the party and two, after taking into account all the circumstances, including any prejudice suffered by any other party as result of such failure or delay as the case maybe, and any additional interest payable under section seventeen of the judgements act because of the failure or delay, allow the party so entitled less than the amount he would otherwise have allowed on taxation of the bill are wholly disallowed the costs,his provision for an appeal to allow to the judge and chambers and that is the way the matter is coming before me. -whether strictly order twenty eight, er order sixty, rule twenty eight for erm applies in this case is not amount entirely clear to me because the obligation to lodge a bill of taxation under rule twenty nine provides that he must begin proceedings for the taxation either within three months after the judgement direction or order of the terminations enter sides are otherwise perfected, and that is presently on it's face which seemed to be debited may of nineteen ninety three and er accordingly that is right, it's not in fact been any failure to comply with order tw order sixty two, rule twenty nine, one, and that hasn't been disregarded, it's not entirely clear to me that erm there is any matter come from paragraph sub paragraph a of rule twenty eight, four, it may already require, still nevertheless erm fall within paragraph b of rule fo , erm there has in fact been a delay in lodging the bill of costs for taxation, the delay being really and truly, the delay in having the order of mr justice perfected and it seems to me that although in chasing matters generally speaking it is the court will itself draw the order, nevertheless where er it seems to be clearly in this case would contemplate it that counsel would sign a minute erm that counsel do sign a minute and that minute has been signed having forwarded by the defendants solicitors to the defendants solicitors seems to me it must be the case that erm the obligation to, as it were, forward that minute to the court, it is an obligation which would lie upon the plaintiffs solicitors and it maybe said that erm there has been delay and erm on the best it should be lodged with the court sealed, er shortly after it was received and that therefore on that footing there has been delay lodging the bill of costs for concession, er mr, doctor doesn't seemed to be take any point in relation to that er because it's not in his interest to do so, it seems to be that he does have to say if it has been delayed, with an order of twenty eight rule four that's a rule, rule, rule twenty eight er four if he is to have interest disbarred and er mr er he'll apparently have the matter of read before the taxing master, it seems that the taxing master did not chew any sympathy with that er suggestion, that er there was in fact no breach of the requirement rule twenty, four, mr he said, very probably, that erm, look on text upon it, he really is concerned to erm have this case dealt with as you put it on the merits, it seems to me it's in the interest of all parties that erm i should deal with the case on merits have on the assumption erm that er, that that was lodged properly i think, i ca i, a matter of which found within rule twenty eight, four and that the taxing officer give our interest under that rule. -right, it's clear in't it under four rule twenty eight, four, it's not essential for the disallowance of any cost or interest that er the taxing officer should be satisfied that erm the other party has been prejudiced, in fact that is not a condition precedent to the exercise of his part and disallow interest in this here item, er any prejudice there maybe is merely one factor to be taken into account in other matters and it does seem to me that the fact the court can, can properly and should properly take into account, is, is that erm, it is desirable that to litigation should erm comply with there obligations, either expressly, express or explicit under the rules of the court to comply with matter such as it should have orders part drawn up and served as appropriate, as i say it seems to me that er the plaintiffs's can be criticized in not erm having perfected the order of mr justice er before they did so but er, i have, it seems to me to look at all the relevant pictures in the case, er if it were the case that the plaintiff suffered any prejudice as the result of that claim, clearly that would be a matter which i would have to take into account, but i'm bound to say it doesn't seem to me that the fender of the plaintiffs to perfect the order did in fact cause any prejudice to the plaintiff and indeed if they, the plaintiffs had perfected the order, it seems to me exactly the same course of events as in fact transpired in this case, would actually have occurred and wouldn't make any difference at all, so unless it's a matter of simply of er seeking to punish the plaintiff as a matter of discipline, it seems to me there is a, not really anything in the point that the order was not perfected er when it seems to me it should of been, and i, there stood to see the other er circumstances, now it's quite clear to me having been referred to correspondence, passing between the solicitors that erm although really from a very early stage er the plaintiffs solicitors referring to mr a letter of early nineteen ninety one indicating that erm the view was being taken that the likelihood was that erm the plaintiffs would have to get their costs out of the defendants share and interest in the premises and er that would be a matter which could only be dealt with when the enquiries director by mr justice had been dealt with. +whether strictly order twenty eight, er order sixty, rule twenty eight for erm applies in this case is not amount entirely clear to me because the obligation to lodge a bill of taxation under rule twenty nine provides that he must begin proceedings for the taxation either within three months after the judgement direction or order of the terminations enter sides are otherwise perfected, and that is presently on it's face which seemed to be debited may of nineteen ninety three and er accordingly that is right, it's not in fact been any failure to comply with order tw order sixty two, rule twenty nine, one, and that hasn't been disregarded, it's not entirely clear to me that erm there is any matter come from paragraph sub paragraph a of rule twenty eight, four, it may already require, still nevertheless erm fall within paragraph b of rule fo , erm there has in fact been a delay in lodging the bill of costs for taxation, the delay being really and truly, the delay in having the order of mr justice perfected and it seems to me that although in chasing matters generally speaking it is the court will itself draw the order, nevertheless where er it seems to be clearly in this case would contemplate it that counsel would sign a minute erm that counsel do sign a minute and that minute has been signed having forwarded by the defendants solicitors to the defendants solicitors seems to me it must be the case that erm the obligation to, as it were, forward that minute to the court, it is an obligation which would lie upon the plaintiffs solicitors and it maybe said that erm there has been delay and erm on the best it should be lodged with the court sealed, er shortly after it was received and that therefore on that footing there has been delay lodging the bill of costs for concession, er mr, doctor doesn't seemed to be take any point in relation to that er because it's not in his interest to do so, it seems to be that he does have to say if it has been delayed, with an order of twenty eight rule four that's a rule, rule, rule twenty eight er four if he is to have interest disbarred and er mr er he'll apparently have the matter of read before the taxing master, it seems that the taxing master did not chew any sympathy with that er suggestion, that er there was in fact no breach of the requirement rule twenty, four, mr he said, very probably, that erm, look on text upon it, he really is concerned to erm have this case dealt with as you put it on the merits, it seems to me it's in the interest of all parties that erm i should deal with the case on merits have on the assumption erm that er, that that was lodged properly i think, i ca i, a matter of which found within rule twenty eight, four and that the taxing officer give our interest under that rule. +right, it's clear in't it under four rule twenty eight, four, it's not essential for the disallowance of any cost or interest that er the taxing officer should be satisfied that erm the other party has been prejudiced, in fact that is not a condition precedent to the exercise of his part and disallow interest in this here item, er any prejudice there maybe is merely one factor to be taken into account in other matters and it does seem to me that the fact the court can, can properly and should properly take into account, is, is that erm, it is desirable that to litigation should erm comply with there obligations, either expressly, express or explicit under the rules of the court to comply with matter such as it should have orders part drawn up and served as appropriate, as i say it seems to me that er the plaintiffs's can be criticized in not erm having perfected the order of mr justice er before they did so but er, i have, it seems to me to look at all the relevant pictures in the case, er if it were the case that the plaintiff suffered any prejudice as the result of that claim, clearly that would be a matter which i would have to take into account, but i'm bound to say it doesn't seem to me that the fender of the plaintiffs to perfect the order did in fact cause any prejudice to the plaintiff and indeed if they, the plaintiffs had perfected the order, it seems to me exactly the same course of events as in fact transpired in this case, would actually have occurred and wouldn't make any difference at all, so unless it's a matter of simply of er seeking to punish the plaintiff as a matter of discipline, it seems to me there is a, not really anything in the point that the order was not perfected er when it seems to me it should of been, and i, there stood to see the other er circumstances, now it's quite clear to me having been referred to correspondence, passing between the solicitors that erm although really from a very early stage er the plaintiffs solicitors referring to mr a letter of early nineteen ninety one indicating that erm the view was being taken that the likelihood was that erm the plaintiffs would have to get their costs out of the defendants share and interest in the premises and er that would be a matter which could only be dealt with when the enquiries director by mr justice had been dealt with. mr -was the defendants solicitors, the parties during nineteen ninety one, the two solicitors, had dealt with the question of costs and er perfectly normal way, the plaintiffs have their costs,drafted by er cost draughtsman, i understand that in-house draughtsman and erm they produced to mr a bill for costs, er mr looked at the bill and met counter proposals and he suggested other figures, erm, figures in the region of forty two thousand pounds, forty seven and fifty thousand pounds for the plaintiffs costs, the correspondence indicates that mr then, now put forward what with respect seems to be entirely sensible suggestion that er really it would not be sensible to proceed with having the cost taxed, he said he didn't foresee any real difficulty in getting them to agree the costs and that er the common sense thing in the interest of all parties was to see if they could reach an overall,settlement er determining all the matters in dispute, effectively this would be what was to be done in respect of the surgery premises, there was i think, there is reference in accounted to another sec another premises as well which apparently were lease, er but are now formed part of the negotiations and er negotiations continued between the parties during nineteen ninety two, by the end of nineteen ninety two the negotiations were beginning to run into difficulties, the plaintiffs were beginning to put forward non negotiable final offers and er the result unfortunately was that in apparently nineteen ninety three the er negotiations into that broke down. -mr was well aware because he'd been told by the plaintiffs solicitors that the plaintiffs received terms for cover or to obtain interest on their costs, the plaintiffs solicitors wrote specifically to mr enquiring was his offer in, in the sum of forty two thousand pounds, that's er the possible agreed settlement figure for costs, er if it was inclusive or exclusive of interest erm there were some delay but er mr wrote back in due course making clear that interest wasn't included, i should also say that in mr er proposed bill of costs he had disallowed interest for a fairly short period in respect of both the plaintiffs bill of costs and the defendants bill of costs and the plaintiffs solicitors don't appear to have erm taken any point on that, but as i say it, the point as to interest was specifically raised by the plaintiffs solicitors letter and er i'm quite satisfied on the correspondence that they when it came to the matter were seen, were desires of obtaining interest in respect of their costs. -the letter from the plaintiffs solicitors in respect of question of interest one causes, the letter of the twenty ninth of january of nineteen ninety two, asking mr to confirm, that in addition to the settlement figure of forty two thousand pounds in respect of costs he'd be paying interest until the date of payment, and er, there was never a mind that erm which find a reply to in, in thirtieth of march nineteen ninety two by mr , there's no unqualified agreement in figure of forty two thousand pounds, i do not wish to appear obstructive but your clients must recognise that there are effectively two issues to be resolved, namely the payment of their costs and the division of the parts of other property, surely in all parties interest that none of these are resolved, so it is surely in all party interest that those, those are resolved contemporary and then the letter goes on to dealing with questions of valuation, the bottom paragraph on page thirty two in the bundle says in answer to your letter therefore is that there is no agreement to pay interest, if there is then my client must be credited with interest on his costs , and then it says surgery and finally if ove if overall agreement cannot be reached then my client reserves his rights on the issue of costs and i feel that this could lead to an acrimonious and protracted taxation, at the end of the day i suspect it would only be enforced the order for costs about taking a charge in my clients interest in the surgery premises , does that improve your clients position at all, as i say that was the position of the thirtieth of march nineteen ninety two and during the remainder of nineteen ninety two there were then further negotiations, some of them appeared to have been carried out er personally between er doctor and er doctor which seems to of been the partner, dealing with the plaintiffs position and er he says about his non negotiable offer at page forty one in the bundle apparently attached to a letter of the twenty first of december nineteen ninety two and er that had a time limit on, the twenty second of march, there was a reminder on the twenty second of february and erm the plaintiffs solicitors wrote on the fourteenth of april nineteen ninety three raising the question of costs erm say that erm we have now received your clients instructions, that they would be prepared to accept the sum of forty two thousand in respect of their standard basis costs which is inclusive of v a t and disbursements, you remember that our initial schedule of costs which i set part of my letter of the eighth of october total fifty thousand, nine hundred and ninety eight pounds, twenty six pence, in addition to this our client would require interest from the which is as of todays date at seven hundred and sixty days at seventeen pounds, twenty six a day totalling thirteen thousand, one hundred and seventeen pounds, sixty, in the circumstances i look forward to receiving your clients cheque for the sum of fifty five thousand, one hundred and seventeen pounds and sixty pence within the next seven days and then it says i believe you were certainly agreeing have been very patient concerning your clients costs, but now we wish these to be paid and that was responded to er mr on the twenty second of april er but why he quite has not been directly involved in the conversation for some time and there was not reasonable expected response for seven days from him, er and then he goes on to say that although he appreciates his firm is still on the record, i shall seek instructions from my client, but it maybe he would wish to give notice of acting in person and indeed that is in fact what happened, what happened in this case. -now it seems to me with erm with great respect from the view of the taxing officer, that er it's quite clear that er both parties were holding han were holding their hands in relation to a question of taxation because negotiations were going on between the parties and indeed the defendants were being requested er not to proceed with taxation but to see if they could obtain an overall assessment and the point was met to the defendants barrister, telling quite frankly there wouldn't be much advantage in the defendants pushing on with erm taxation because they'd only, they would have to look to his interest in the property to get payment, it seems to me in those circumstances that it cannot be said that erm the plaintiffs were in any way acting improperly and not seeking to have the costs taxed during the period while the negotiations were being carried on er because effectively and -mr replied that is what mr was asking the other to do, that is to hold their hand and to enter into negotiations, now i fully appreciate that erm doctor feels strongly that the defendants have not been negotiating in good faith and have been simply dragging matters out for his benefit, now when i say that i'm simply saying what i understand to be doctor view, i'm certainly not suggesting that i'm finding as a fact, but that was the decision, indeed i couldn't cos i've not heard all the evidence on this matter not as mr to address me on that one, it seems to me with all respect to doctor missions on this matter that if there has been any dragging of feet or other improper conduct of either the defendants in connection with er they remain on in the premises and not paying what doctor would consider to be a full and proper rent or if there has been problem about their not disclosing documents when they should have done, the position is that doctor has er by making an appropriate application to the court, for maybe the appropriate relief arising out of the facts which he can establish, but that is not in general a matter which erm the court should go into on the question of taxation, it's not,th this particular taxation of costs is a taxation as i understand it that are formally to the debt of the order of mr justice and there is thus no question of the court having to consider the question when the those tax those costs have been swollen or increased in any way by reason of spinning out negotiations whether to run up costs or otherwise, that simply doesn't arising it seems to me in this case that maybe a matter which may arise possibly at some future date, though i would hope it would not do so, but er so far as the costs down to the end of the trial of the twentieth of march nineteen ninety one are concerned, it seems to me the fact that the parties maybe negotiating subsequently to deter to rece to resolve the outstanding issue, it's not a matter which really goes to the question of erm what is the proper amount to allow for taxation of costs which have already been incurred, before these negotiations erm we don't the figure of the costs appears to have been effectively agreed between the solicitors at forty two thousand pounds, the plaintiff solicitors made it quite clear that they were seeking interest, this was clear in apparently of nineteen ninety two, but this held their hand, er it seems to me the reason they held their hand rather than indicate it was because the defendant through his solicitor was asking them to do so and it seems to me that mr was acting very sensibly in the defendants interest, because if in fact they had gone ahead and taxed their costs there and then the position would simply be that there would of been an award for taxation, in order, there would be a taxation resulting in an order for payment of of some cost probably in the region of forty two thousand pounds and er that order would itself carry interest under the judgements act, it doesn't seem to me it can be sensibly said that erm any interest has to be in any way increased by reason of this delay and it seems to me that erm if one looks at order sixty two and twenty eight er certainly under paragraph b two erm there's a reference there to any additional interest payable under section seventeen because of the failure on the may, erm, it doesn't seem to me that the effect of what has in fact incurred, in this case has been, caused any additional interest to be paid and er it seems to me the only best that i can see in the evidence before me to, which would enable the court to erm, conclude that there should be a disallowance of interest would be as i say because the plaintiffs appear not to have perfected the order for the payment of perfectively two years, just over two years, erm it seems to me however that, that on balance probably it simply a matter of oversight and even if it had been perfected it wouldn't of made as i guess the least bit of difference to the way the negotiations er proceeded and accordingly i take the view that erm there are no grounds for disallowing interest from either the plaintiffs bill of costs or the defendants bill of costs, accordingly erm to allow the defendants appeal in preparation to the disallowance of costs er interest and to dismiss the defendants appeal for application in relation to an additional period, p sixty of course disallowed, i also propose to dismiss the sum of, the appeal by the plaintiffs from the refusal of taxing master to disallow the interest on the defendants bill of costs. +was the defendants solicitors, the parties during nineteen ninety one, the two solicitors, had dealt with the question of costs and er perfectly normal way, the plaintiffs have their costs,drafted by er cost draughtsman, i understand that in-house draughtsman and erm they produced to mr a bill for costs, er mr looked at the bill and met counter proposals and he suggested other figures, erm, figures in the region of forty two thousand pounds, forty seven and fifty thousand pounds for the plaintiffs costs, the correspondence indicates that mr then, now put forward what with respect seems to be entirely sensible suggestion that er really it would not be sensible to proceed with having the cost taxed, he said he didn't foresee any real difficulty in getting them to agree the costs and that er the common sense thing in the interest of all parties was to see if they could reach an overall,settlement er determining all the matters in dispute, effectively this would be what was to be done in respect of the surgery premises, there was i think, there is reference in accounted to another sec another premises as well which apparently were lease, er but are now formed part of the negotiations and er negotiations continued between the parties during nineteen ninety two, by the end of nineteen ninety two the negotiations were beginning to run into difficulties, the plaintiffs were beginning to put forward non negotiable final offers and er the result unfortunately was that in apparently nineteen ninety three the er negotiations into that broke down. +mr was well aware because he'd been told by the plaintiffs solicitors that the plaintiffs received terms for cover or to obtain interest on their costs, the plaintiffs solicitors wrote specifically to mr enquiring was his offer in, in the sum of forty two thousand pounds, that's er the possible agreed settlement figure for costs, er if it was inclusive or exclusive of interest erm there were some delay but er mr wrote back in due course making clear that interest wasn't included, i should also say that in mr er proposed bill of costs he had disallowed interest for a fairly short period in respect of both the plaintiffs bill of costs and the defendants bill of costs and the plaintiffs solicitors don't appear to have erm taken any point on that, but as i say it, the point as to interest was specifically raised by the plaintiffs solicitors letter and er i'm quite satisfied on the correspondence that they when it came to the matter were seen, were desires of obtaining interest in respect of their costs. +the letter from the plaintiffs solicitors in respect of question of interest one causes, the letter of the twenty ninth of january of nineteen ninety two, asking mr to confirm, that in addition to the settlement figure of forty two thousand pounds in respect of costs he'd be paying interest until the date of payment, and er, there was never a mind that erm which find a reply to in, in thirtieth of march nineteen ninety two by mr , there's no unqualified agreement in figure of forty two thousand pounds, i do not wish to appear obstructive but your clients must recognise that there are effectively two issues to be resolved, namely the payment of their costs and the division of the parts of other property, surely in all parties interest that none of these are resolved, so it is surely in all party interest that those, those are resolved contemporary and then the letter goes on to dealing with questions of valuation, the bottom paragraph on page thirty two in the bundle says in answer to your letter therefore is that there is no agreement to pay interest, if there is then my client must be credited with interest on his costs , and then it says surgery and finally if ove if overall agreement cannot be reached then my client reserves his rights on the issue of costs and i feel that this could lead to an acrimonious and protracted taxation, at the end of the day i suspect it would only be enforced the order for costs about taking a charge in my clients interest in the surgery premises , does that improve your clients position at all, as i say that was the position of the thirtieth of march nineteen ninety two and during the remainder of nineteen ninety two there were then further negotiations, some of them appeared to have been carried out er personally between er doctor and er doctor which seems to of been the partner, dealing with the plaintiffs position and er he says about his non negotiable offer at page forty one in the bundle apparently attached to a letter of the twenty first of december nineteen ninety two and er that had a time limit on, the twenty second of march, there was a reminder on the twenty second of february and erm the plaintiffs solicitors wrote on the fourteenth of april nineteen ninety three raising the question of costs erm say that erm we have now received your clients instructions, that they would be prepared to accept the sum of forty two thousand in respect of their standard basis costs which is inclusive of v a t and disbursements, you remember that our initial schedule of costs which i set part of my letter of the eighth of october total fifty thousand, nine hundred and ninety eight pounds, twenty six pence, in addition to this our client would require interest from the which is as of todays date at seven hundred and sixty days at seventeen pounds, twenty six a day totalling thirteen thousand, one hundred and seventeen pounds, sixty, in the circumstances i look forward to receiving your clients cheque for the sum of fifty five thousand, one hundred and seventeen pounds and sixty pence within the next seven days and then it says i believe you were certainly agreeing have been very patient concerning your clients costs, but now we wish these to be paid and that was responded to er mr on the twenty second of april er but why he quite has not been directly involved in the conversation for some time and there was not reasonable expected response for seven days from him, er and then he goes on to say that although he appreciates his firm is still on the record, i shall seek instructions from my client, but it maybe he would wish to give notice of acting in person and indeed that is in fact what happened, what happened in this case. +now it seems to me with erm with great respect from the view of the taxing officer, that er it's quite clear that er both parties were holding han were holding their hands in relation to a question of taxation because negotiations were going on between the parties and indeed the defendants were being requested er not to proceed with taxation but to see if they could obtain an overall assessment and the point was met to the defendants barrister, telling quite frankly there wouldn't be much advantage in the defendants pushing on with erm taxation because they'd only, they would have to look to his interest in the property to get payment, it seems to me in those circumstances that it cannot be said that erm the plaintiffs were in any way acting improperly and not seeking to have the costs taxed during the period while the negotiations were being carried on er because effectively and +mr replied that is what mr was asking the other to do, that is to hold their hand and to enter into negotiations, now i fully appreciate that erm doctor feels strongly that the defendants have not been negotiating in good faith and have been simply dragging matters out for his benefit, now when i say that i'm simply saying what i understand to be doctor view, i'm certainly not suggesting that i'm finding as a fact, but that was the decision, indeed i couldn't cos i've not heard all the evidence on this matter not as mr to address me on that one, it seems to me with all respect to doctor missions on this matter that if there has been any dragging of feet or other improper conduct of either the defendants in connection with er they remain on in the premises and not paying what doctor would consider to be a full and proper rent or if there has been problem about their not disclosing documents when they should have done, the position is that doctor has er by making an appropriate application to the court, for maybe the appropriate relief arising out of the facts which he can establish, but that is not in general a matter which erm the court should go into on the question of taxation, it's not,th this particular taxation of costs is a taxation as i understand it that are formally to the debt of the order of mr justice and there is thus no question of the court having to consider the question when the those tax those costs have been swollen or increased in any way by reason of spinning out negotiations whether to run up costs or otherwise, that simply doesn't arising it seems to me in this case that maybe a matter which may arise possibly at some future date, though i would hope it would not do so, but er so far as the costs down to the end of the trial of the twentieth of march nineteen ninety one are concerned, it seems to me the fact that the parties maybe negotiating subsequently to deter to rece to resolve the outstanding issue, it's not a matter which really goes to the question of erm what is the proper amount to allow for taxation of costs which have already been incurred, before these negotiations erm we don't the figure of the costs appears to have been effectively agreed between the solicitors at forty two thousand pounds, the plaintiff solicitors made it quite clear that they were seeking interest, this was clear in apparently of nineteen ninety two, but this held their hand, er it seems to me the reason they held their hand rather than indicate it was because the defendant through his solicitor was asking them to do so and it seems to me that mr was acting very sensibly in the defendants interest, because if in fact they had gone ahead and taxed their costs there and then the position would simply be that there would of been an award for taxation, in order, there would be a taxation resulting in an order for payment of of some cost probably in the region of forty two thousand pounds and er that order would itself carry interest under the judgements act, it doesn't seem to me it can be sensibly said that erm any interest has to be in any way increased by reason of this delay and it seems to me that erm if one looks at order sixty two and twenty eight er certainly under paragraph b two erm there's a reference there to any additional interest payable under section seventeen because of the failure on the may, erm, it doesn't seem to me that the effect of what has in fact incurred, in this case has been, caused any additional interest to be paid and er it seems to me the only best that i can see in the evidence before me to, which would enable the court to erm, conclude that there should be a disallowance of interest would be as i say because the plaintiffs appear not to have perfected the order for the payment of perfectively two years, just over two years, erm it seems to me however that, that on balance probably it simply a matter of oversight and even if it had been perfected it wouldn't of made as i guess the least bit of difference to the way the negotiations er proceeded and accordingly i take the view that erm there are no grounds for disallowing interest from either the plaintiffs bill of costs or the defendants bill of costs, accordingly erm to allow the defendants appeal in preparation to the disallowance of costs er interest and to dismiss the defendants appeal for application in relation to an additional period, p sixty of course disallowed, i also propose to dismiss the sum of, the appeal by the plaintiffs from the refusal of taxing master to disallow the interest on the defendants bill of costs. well there was just, it's not, surprising it's a very long day, when you initially said i allow the period of the plaintiff by mistake you said defendant, just for the record i allow that, it is the -it's the substantial the plaintiff isn't it, that's allowed -yes i allow the plaintiffs appeal and dismiss the defendants as it were cross appeal from the order in erm it's the august er taxing master right of the twelfth, twelfth of august isn't it? -but i only put that in case the +it's the substantial the plaintiff isn't it, that's allowed +yes i allow the plaintiffs appeal and dismiss the defendants as it were cross appeal from the order in erm it's the august er taxing master right of the twelfth, twelfth of august isn't it? +but i only put that in case the yes, thank you, that is, thank you, thank you very much -my lord all that follows now is that question costs in this my lord there is no doubt that er this is the painful experience for both the plaintiffs and of course for doctor who is unrepresented and therefore must inevitably feel rather isolated in this matter erm, however in my there is no reason to er depart from the usual principal of the costs which should follow the event and of course we know as it the loss on the subsidiary appeal and so i don't press the point on that cos the reality as you've already probably anticipated is all the work has been done erm on this appeal the subsidiary appeal i ask, i don't ask for costs on that, in my submission it should be both sides bear their own costs on that, the reason i say that is that there was no, there was no cross appearing in respect on it in effect, cos after all, all you were doing was er trying to get the same as the other side if we lost, so no worm of can of beans can be done by doctor i had one parallel in my whole skeleton on that, er, but we have substantially succeeded on the main issue and so i, i would ask that costs in favour of the plaintiffs on, on that and here and indeed below. +my lord all that follows now is that question costs in this my lord there is no doubt that er this is the painful experience for both the plaintiffs and of course for doctor who is unrepresented and therefore must inevitably feel rather isolated in this matter erm, however in my there is no reason to er depart from the usual principal of the costs which should follow the event and of course we know as it the loss on the subsidiary appeal and so i don't press the point on that cos the reality as you've already probably anticipated is all the work has been done erm on this appeal the subsidiary appeal i ask, i don't ask for costs on that, in my submission it should be both sides bear their own costs on that, the reason i say that is that there was no, there was no cross appearing in respect on it in effect, cos after all, all you were doing was er trying to get the same as the other side if we lost, so no worm of can of beans can be done by doctor i had one parallel in my whole skeleton on that, er, but we have substantially succeeded on the main issue and so i, i would ask that costs in favour of the plaintiffs on, on that and here and indeed below. what was the order of those costs made below? equally cost in both, on both er summonses the costs were against my clients so but, but i accept that er -mr has got costs below, yes, erm +mr has got costs below, yes, erm i accept that you can't, i should of added that in respect of the decision of er september second decision mm you, you wouldn't be fair of me to ask you to change that no i think i mean that's i would think that's a chance we took and we lost it yes -but i've not our costs -yes mr doctor +but i've not our costs +yes mr doctor i'm sorry my lord for saying this erm, erm i'm, i'm, well i am really gonna ask for legal fees on this well i'll deal with that after we've dealt with the question of costs, what do you say on the question of costs doctor ? -erm, erm feel like they're getting the benefit again, again and again, you now make the costs of at every point they take another, they've got more coming in, erm in terms of cash and er at every point i seem to loose, i loose the first case in ninety one and everything now seems to go against me, it seems as though i don't stand a chance any more. -i think i must make the ordinary orders to costs, well what i will do is erm doctor must i think pay the costs of the appeal against the order of master erm both here and below on the other hand the defendant seems to be able to bear the costs of the appeal against the september order, that's the order, that's the order of, is that mr ?, er sorry when i say the doc doctor bears the costs must er in fact he must, right, it is the august, that's the august decision both, both before erm the taxing officer and on this appeal and er the, i dismiss the defendants appeal against the september board with costs +erm, erm feel like they're getting the benefit again, again and again, you now make the costs of at every point they take another, they've got more coming in, erm in terms of cash and er at every point i seem to loose, i loose the first case in ninety one and everything now seems to go against me, it seems as though i don't stand a chance any more. +i think i must make the ordinary orders to costs, well what i will do is erm doctor must i think pay the costs of the appeal against the order of master erm both here and below on the other hand the defendant seems to be able to bear the costs of the appeal against the september order, that's the order, that's the order of, is that mr ?, er sorry when i say the doc doctor bears the costs must er in fact he must, right, it is the august, that's the august decision both, both before erm the taxing officer and on this appeal and er the, i dismiss the defendants appeal against the september board with costs oh yes i'd object to the settlement and again i'll direct that the costs will be set off, seems to be the sensible course well yes did yes -for which one it shows i'm afraid, my i ask for er if it's required certificate for counsel maybe required for taxation later on. -erm, well i think it's,do , erm i don't know whether you understand what's been asked doctor it cou it's a question of costs, er normally where er matters erm are dealt with in chambers for in counsel appear then erm these counsel don't get paid for the other side erm unless there is certificate for counsel as i understand it, were the, were the counsel appeared before the judge erm they are entitled to their costs and this is er an appeal to the judge, but er what i think mr is saying is, in case he happens to be wrong in that he would like an order that er his fees should be proper fees of the defen of the plaintiffs on this appeal and er such as you could say seems to me that er, that is a, that would be proper -yes, i think it's been of an assistance to the court yes, assistance to me that erm mr has been at least only to of explain the background which erm is not entirely, not an easy matter, so er if it's necessary i'll give a certificate -i'm grateful, that's for today, erm my lord it may sound slightly more erm contentious, but i'd also ask for certificate for counsel for the thirteenth of august hearing, may i say the reason for that, it's a matter that hasn't come before you, you won't know about, it's this, this reason, because at that period it wasn't just the application under twenty eighty or twenty eight, four for delay there was another application er, which was unsuccessful which hasn't been proceed today, but cost were also disallowed with more serious reason, i submit that said showed er negligent or that improper conduct, there was a substantial attack mounted, and i can use no other words fairly describe it on the professional conduct of and for that reason my lord er both cos the seriousness of the allegations, but of course also because of the potential conflict that they acted for themselves and it would of been in situation for us solicitor hence to turn up, er they instructed counsel and my self, and so for that double reason in my believe we should be entitled to at, at first stage, ordinarily i wouldn't of had a very good run for argument but i, it's my suspicion my clue recollection, be backed up by those behind me, and indeed by the documents that a substantial attack was mounted and it was in, i have to say in full flight terms, and much hence couldn't be said to be unreasonable to deem if necessarily, unusually to send counsel in front of a taxing master, well i won't say any more on the point, but that is my suspicion +for which one it shows i'm afraid, my i ask for er if it's required certificate for counsel maybe required for taxation later on. +erm, well i think it's,do , erm i don't know whether you understand what's been asked doctor it cou it's a question of costs, er normally where er matters erm are dealt with in chambers for in counsel appear then erm these counsel don't get paid for the other side erm unless there is certificate for counsel as i understand it, were the, were the counsel appeared before the judge erm they are entitled to their costs and this is er an appeal to the judge, but er what i think mr is saying is, in case he happens to be wrong in that he would like an order that er his fees should be proper fees of the defen of the plaintiffs on this appeal and er such as you could say seems to me that er, that is a, that would be proper +yes, i think it's been of an assistance to the court yes, assistance to me that erm mr has been at least only to of explain the background which erm is not entirely, not an easy matter, so er if it's necessary i'll give a certificate +i'm grateful, that's for today, erm my lord it may sound slightly more erm contentious, but i'd also ask for certificate for counsel for the thirteenth of august hearing, may i say the reason for that, it's a matter that hasn't come before you, you won't know about, it's this, this reason, because at that period it wasn't just the application under twenty eighty or twenty eight, four for delay there was another application er, which was unsuccessful which hasn't been proceed today, but cost were also disallowed with more serious reason, i submit that said showed er negligent or that improper conduct, there was a substantial attack mounted, and i can use no other words fairly describe it on the professional conduct of and for that reason my lord er both cos the seriousness of the allegations, but of course also because of the potential conflict that they acted for themselves and it would of been in situation for us solicitor hence to turn up, er they instructed counsel and my self, and so for that double reason in my believe we should be entitled to at, at first stage, ordinarily i wouldn't of had a very good run for argument but i, it's my suspicion my clue recollection, be backed up by those behind me, and indeed by the documents that a substantial attack was mounted and it was in, i have to say in full flight terms, and much hence couldn't be said to be unreasonable to deem if necessarily, unusually to send counsel in front of a taxing master, well i won't say any more on the point, but that is my suspicion what was the taxing off asked for certificate for counsel, presumably he wasn't well, huh, my lord having lost erm taxing master didn't no i'm sure he didn't @@ -9046,29 +9041,28 @@ well rather didn't have to pay the costs, it didn't really arise no, that's correct yes, that's right. -is it right doctor that you made a, an attack on professional confidence of , other than in a relationship the erm profecting of the order -my lord it is since that erm because, as you mention that er because of all the delay, that i am quite sure that positively intended erm i lost large sums of paying my solicitors,solicitors as well as a surveyor and therefore i attempted to er, er to recoup that +is it right doctor that you made a, an attack on professional confidence of , other than in a relationship the erm profecting of the order +my lord it is since that erm because, as you mention that er because of all the delay, that i am quite sure that positively intended erm i lost large sums of paying my solicitors,solicitors as well as a surveyor and therefore i attempted to er, er to recoup that yes i didn't er -yes i see, i think er unfortunately doctor i in this particular case i ought to make an order for certificate for counsel erm in the current, in respect of the costs incurred below on the thirteenth of august seems to me do er the proper kind of case in which to instruct counsel. -erm, i think so there's no dispute as to what the terms of the order are, er mr it might be helpful if you could erm prepare a minute of order for lodging +yes i see, i think er unfortunately doctor i in this particular case i ought to make an order for certificate for counsel erm in the current, in respect of the costs incurred below on the thirteenth of august seems to me do er the proper kind of case in which to instruct counsel. +erm, i think so there's no dispute as to what the terms of the order are, er mr it might be helpful if you could erm prepare a minute of order for lodging certainly -of course, er provide a copy of that to erm doctor before it is lodged and, i'm sure it can be agreed +of course, er provide a copy of that to erm doctor before it is lodged and, i'm sure it can be agreed my lord do, do we agree to that now or by tomorrow morning? well i would think if it could lodged during the course of the next ten days or so certainly, it'll be done by tomorrow morning -i'm, i'm, if there any question over it, the reason why i said ten days i'm already sitting in london for, until the end of next week and therefore if there were any question, it's obvious that it came before me, and that +i'm, i'm, if there any question over it, the reason why i said ten days i'm already sitting in london for, until the end of next week and therefore if there were any question, it's obvious that it came before me, and that it'll be done by tomorrow morning yes thank you -yes, yes, that can be prepared and erm a copy of that to doctor and +yes, yes, that can be prepared and erm a copy of that to doctor and certainly -doctor if you don't agree with what it says, erm, you can obviously mention that to and er er along speedily say in the course of this week, the matter can be mentioned in formal to me, erm one morning at ten o'clock next week i would of thought. +doctor if you don't agree with what it says, erm, you can obviously mention that to and er er along speedily say in the course of this week, the matter can be mentioned in formal to me, erm one morning at ten o'clock next week i would of thought. in terms of i need to appeal this one -oh yes, leave to appeal, erm it doesn't seem to me that this is an appropriate case for leave, or at least for me to grant leave, doctor +oh yes, leave to appeal, erm it doesn't seem to me that this is an appropriate case for leave, or at least for me to grant leave, doctor all court rise - -and don't put your greasy little hands ha? +and don't put your greasy little hands ha? oh hi warren! you alright shel? what are you doing here you cunt? @@ -9109,22 +9103,22 @@ oh. urgh! urgh! oh my god! -er, er er er er +er, er er er er it was so funny, i had this weird dream the other night, you know. i mean if it's about take that i don't wanna hear. oh yeah. it was. no, i don't wanna hear it. -i got off with +i got off with oh shut up! and it was nice though. it's erm, it was at the, and he was come on! -you're in here to work don't +you're in here to work don't we are. -i said no no eating! +i said no no eating! sorry miss. i'll spit it out straight away. i swear to god. @@ -9133,14 +9127,14 @@ yes. well it does help if you say it twice cos then it's work d'ya hear? -her hearing's +her hearing's i got this brain problem, you know what i mean? come on. you know what i mean? yeah. i know what you mean. ah miss. -this is work though so +this is work though so it isn't wo , oh yeah, i'm working by the way, you know. yeah. yeah. @@ -9168,11 +9162,11 @@ it's really cute. where's the bin? like a virgin . leave it alone! -it's ooh, it's to my, ee, aye, ee aye . +it's ooh, it's to my, ee, aye, ee aye . what is it? ha? what's it for? -i'm gonna tell +i'm gonna tell i thought that was drop dead fred. i know. very funny. @@ -9193,7 +9187,7 @@ really? yeah. don't you think it is really good? nadima, shut your mouth about the jungle book! -mrs will probably +mrs will probably you little baby! you're fifteen years old and you still wanna watch the jungle book. honestly! @@ -9216,7 +9210,7 @@ what am i doing down here? bust her face in! yeah. and, if she starts moaning just gonna bust her face in! -oh by the way i've got the +oh by the way i've got the i say, i've got friends oh yeah . and i'm gonna make them come over and i'm gonna make them beat the shit out of you! @@ -9234,14 +9228,14 @@ yeah. i don't like it. well it's alright. oh . -oh well that's a bit of a bummer isn't it? +oh well that's a bit of a bummer isn't it? oh i hate that. and she's gone and got some. urgh! urgh! why have you got your headphones in? what are you listening to? -i'm listening to like a virgin! +i'm listening to like a virgin! oh i think madonna's crap! ooh! ooh ! @@ -9265,7 +9259,7 @@ a one-way conversation i like madonna. shut, shut your mouth! shut your mouth! -i like madonna . +i like madonna . when you've got as much money as madonna yes i do. and as many fans you can then call her whatever you want. @@ -9284,7 +9278,7 @@ ah ah. do you like shelley? ah ah, he won't say it. you know what i mean? -go on give it to me. +go on give it to me. i understand , i just, you know, i just, ha, i understand. do you like me warren? yes or no? @@ -9302,7 +9296,7 @@ yes i know . nick's a bitch. you're, you're dark. can, can we sing our song? -go on, watch go on then. +go on, watch go on then. my name is nick oh! i don't wanna see your . @@ -9313,7 +9307,7 @@ my name is nick, my mum's a junkie. my name is nick, my mum's a junkie. no don't say that cos i my name is nick, my gran is randy. -my name is nick , my gran is randy. +my name is nick , my gran is randy. my name is nick. my name is nick. ready, steady,your gran is randy . @@ -9321,16 +9315,16 @@ see you guys later. right. see ya. we got a break now. -we got mickey as well. +we got mickey as well. whip whoo! ya -oh i think i'll i'll push in. -i don't like mr i think he should be sacked personally. +oh i think i'll i'll push in. +i don't like mr i think he should be sacked personally. i don't like mr . ooh! ooh! i don't like mr . -i he's alright +i he's alright ooh! ooh! you're gonna break it! @@ -9341,35 +9335,35 @@ you can come over tonight, and don't forget the condoms. are you coming over on saturday? no, he's coming round my house tonight with his condoms. can i come over on saturday? -why don't you both come round +why don't you both come round oh . -no i'll just come round you can appear i make the energies move quickly okay ? +no i'll just come round you can appear i make the energies move quickly okay ? urgh! that's disgusting! i don't even know what you're talking about here, you know? i, i don't nothing about it. -talking about , it's sex. +talking about , it's sex. i dunno nuffink about sex. i'm an innocent child. mm. really? i dunno nuffink about the birds and bees. are you a virgin? -all i know is, the birds go mm mm, and the bees, and the the birds go . +all i know is, the birds go mm mm, and the bees, and the the birds go . yes i am a virgin. -the birds go buzz, and bees go +the birds go buzz, and bees go woo ooh ! no? i'm a virgin . not ! oh! dirty cow. -not me . +not me . who did you do it with then? i done it with my finger. didn't really . no i never. -i done it with erm erm erm done it with mick. +i done it with erm erm erm done it with mick. but i couldn't feel it, i just you finished yet ? that's right, he's really small isn't he? @@ -9384,13 +9378,13 @@ i have the right to say these things, okay? you know. time to go everyone! the excitement's over . -what what excitement? +what what excitement? whoo ooh ooh! come now, come on we better go. no, it, it didn't matter so much in his hand had his hands on the bloody thing he, i just got his a , i just jump up. cos i -you but shelley you don't you don't +you but shelley you don't you don't no i never! yes you did shelley! i never ! @@ -9399,8 +9393,8 @@ i never. and ever since then, face it shelley! i ne , no shut your mouth! shut up! -i'm not ! -that's shelley ! +i'm not ! +that's shelley ! he's a dirty, rotten bastard! shelley no! @@ -9412,10 +9406,10 @@ you enjoyed it. i never! shelley you wanted to you rotten bastard ! -you shelley are a sick fat bitch! +you shelley are a sick fat bitch! i'm going . yeah. -i'm going, you lot are you lot are mad! +i'm going, you lot are you lot are mad! karen? yeah? you going out with somebody now? @@ -9423,7 +9417,7 @@ are you? truthfully? no. it doesn't matter what you tell us. -now c twenty eight that some people who i've noticed have been talking one minute. +now c twenty eight that some people who i've noticed have been talking one minute. oh i hate this fucking woman! i would love to kill her! ooh! @@ -9447,19 +9441,19 @@ i can hear what she's saying to somebody. see look, whisper, whisper, right, whisper. whisper from there see if she can pick it up. somebody should say, karen stop snogging wesley! -wesley man, calm down get your top out of her bra, hand out of her let go of her going for her coconuts . +wesley man, calm down get your top out of her bra, hand out of her let go of her going for her coconuts . what? let go of her coconuts . go on we could have had . is it thursday today? -oh +oh yeah, it's here. is it thursday today? no, friday. i wish it was friday though. why? where you going? -nowhere in particular just want it to be friday . +nowhere in particular just want it to be friday . i can't believe i've gotta get up at flipping ten o'clock on sunday! oh! my god! @@ -9468,7 +9462,7 @@ well don't use mine. i am. alright then. i'm sorry . -winston tell me your life story. +winston tell me your life story. sorry, what was you saying . oh fuck! what are you doing with that? @@ -9515,16 +9509,16 @@ no i wanna read it! read it then. right. the problem page, just seventeen. -arnold schwarzenegger impression fuck you baby! +arnold schwarzenegger impression fuck you baby! asta la vista . don't worry about arnold schwarzenegger. the war is over . it's so unfair -those universal soldiers going to . +those universal soldiers going to . don't you remember?'s got the necklace with the ears on it and he goes can't you hear me? ain't ya? he's got a necklace with ears on it and he goes, can't you hear me? -and jean-claude goes the war is over . +and jean-claude goes the war is over . anyway, anyway, problem page well that's not the point, i would have found out. back on the subject of the problem page @@ -9535,7 +9529,7 @@ ya. right. ready? yes. -do , dear doctor anne i'm fifteen and i need your advice. +do , dear doctor anne i'm fifteen and i need your advice. last night i had sex with my boyfriend ha ah! and then the next day he said he no longer loved me. @@ -9552,7 +9546,7 @@ london. you can tell she's from london. hackney. london. -my er, that's it, my sister's +my er, that's it, my sister's why are you writing problems? boyfriend said i'm a common cow and have a got a big nose. did she? @@ -9567,18 +9561,18 @@ he's got a andy. bigger nose than me. andy. -did your cat legs,le , legs really get did it really get blown off? +did your cat legs,le , legs really get did it really get blown off? ? leg? no. it didn't? -it got in it, but he hasn't got any leg. +it got in it, but he hasn't got any leg. so it has only got three legs? a three-legged cat brilliant! . a three-legged tom. -what have +what have hello wesley. a three-legged cat. tiger. @@ -9589,13 +9583,13 @@ why no. why are you in here? what are you doing in here? -he sits there panting er it's not warren it is wesley, alright? +he sits there panting er it's not warren it is wesley, alright? his name is wesley! anyway , i forgot to bring a tape in for you? tape? what tape? the video. -what's it bring it on friday. +what's it bring it on friday. but it doesn't matter, i'm not going. the what? have you got, have you got a lot on that? @@ -9615,20 +9609,20 @@ where d'ya get it from? well let's face it erm we're not your friends. -some college in norway want a research +some college in norway want a research to say how did you lot get in then? -class cos we were chosen. +class cos we were chosen. wankers! erm, say, say out of the english classes. outsiders i'm quite good in english though. -erm but +erm but what , the what warren? ah? it's all the hospital stewards in here. -this thing's gonna be so bloody then innit? +this thing's gonna be so bloody then innit? no, but she said you could have eight people all talking at once yeah? and they can pick them out. @@ -9667,17 +9661,17 @@ no,jus give me it. just read, no you listen. dear doctor , i'm fourteen -oh dear doctor alan i am fourteen. -a few months what? +oh dear doctor alan i am fourteen. +a few months what? i was fourteen a few months a few months back -a few months back i was bored with myself, and my family, i was playing about with my dog, i started rubbing -i started rubbing it underneath +a few months back i was bored with myself, and my family, i was playing about with my dog, i started rubbing +i started rubbing it underneath and he really enjoyed it. -it really did turn me on and after the first time i done it it it turned me on so much i come. +it really did turn me on and after the first time i done it it it turned me on so much i come. what is wrong with me? -p s i'm a kylie minogue fan, from andrew . +p s i'm a kylie minogue fan, from andrew . you are . andrew. please help ! @@ -9687,16 +9681,16 @@ oh please help. sophie. yeah. yeah. -but you gonna buy them both a -you've really got a disgusting bite ! +but you gonna buy them both a +you've really got a disgusting bite ! ah ah ! -that is disgusting ! +that is disgusting ! i rubbed my give me it. urgh! urgh! josie and anthony are snogging! -i thought you said +i thought you said me and anthony are just friends. are you sure? look at anthony he's rubbing . @@ -9715,9 +9709,9 @@ wesley! wesley! no! miss. -we really can't think about what we need to do, you know. +we really can't think about what we need to do, you know. you had an idea, you said , it's not there. -so what, we'd have to make sure it was exactly the right, the same amount and, in the same flame and the same and see how long it took and whatever took the longest went i dunno whatever? +so what, we'd have to make sure it was exactly the right, the same amount and, in the same flame and the same and see how long it took and whatever took the longest went i dunno whatever? well you might have a yes? i'm really, really interested! @@ -9755,7 +9749,7 @@ i don't believe you. she wanted one of me ? and me? by being a hussy. -peter, robert anthony and grace. +peter, robert anthony and grace. so, six people. she could have picked wesley couldn't she? yeah, she could have picked wesley. @@ -9808,11 +9802,11 @@ i don't give it to miss ! and miss gives it to the student innit? cassie, i've gotta come in on monday morning when there's school to give it to this student. cassie! -you should say you've got +you should say you've got cassie! yeah? cassie, who have we got to give the tapes to? -give and i'll put, monday is it? +give and i'll put, monday is it? hello. what are them tablets? i wanna know. @@ -9851,10 +9845,10 @@ we talking about josie i really think does it look stupid? no don't start, okay? -i really think you should wash your hair because there's all lice running along the table . +i really think you should wash your hair because there's all lice running along the table . do you want one? i'm not a monkey. -i don't really wanna go for you +i don't really wanna go for you ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh . no! get over there. @@ -9884,7 +9878,7 @@ oh! ooh god! we're making a mess, we've made a mess of the table . are you recording it on your thing? -er er, er er er mm. +er er, er er er mm. it really echoes when you bang the table. ha? do it again. @@ -9892,12 +9886,12 @@ good innit? ah! probably have a go at me for smashing their microphone up. wow! -this is excuse me! +this is excuse me! oh sorry! alright. right. oh oh . -everybody everybody up in your mum's! +everybody everybody up in your mum's! everybody up your mum's bum! everybody up your mum's bum! yo mum! @@ -9919,7 +9913,7 @@ wesley dear. ha? i'll come over to you. no i'm listening to the radio. -wesley innit? +wesley innit? wesley, wesley. nick, nick, nick ? yeah. @@ -9936,7 +9930,7 @@ why don't you ask him? cos i'm not talking to him. oh, so it's true? you're not talking to him cos he didn't -no, i called him up in the week, in the holiday and i asked him to come to shelley's and he said call me back. +no, i called him up in the week, in the holiday and i asked him to come to shelley's and he said call me back. oh yeah. simple as that. but you haven't? @@ -9947,14 +9941,14 @@ did you dump him? yes. on wednesday. i didn't dump him. -i just said i don't think we should go out no more. +i just said i don't think we should go out no more. that's a dump. it's not. we compromised. okay. here's mr . -you better get your head down wesley. -when we used to sit with you in humanities sat next to you right, and i was saying like erm erm, you were saying i got you to say so who are gonna bring down the school to beat me up? +you better get your head down wesley. +when we used to sit with you in humanities sat next to you right, and i was saying like erm erm, you were saying i got you to say so who are gonna bring down the school to beat me up? and we got on this subject. and i said no one. and you said you bring the mother-fuckers down. @@ -9981,14 +9975,14 @@ cos i go, steven goes erm, steven goes bring the, to shelley, he goes bring the and i go, and it didn't pick it up and i goes, pardon? could you say that again. bring the what down? -and he was going and i was going the mother what? +and he was going and i was going the mother what? and he's going the mother-fuckers! and i had it all down who nick? no. steven. i had it all down the microphone. -yeah you were going, you were going erm well we'll beat you up. +yeah you were going, you were going erm well we'll beat you up. you'll bring your friends down, then beat us up, then we'll bring our friends and they'll beat them up. and you were saying all this stuff. . @@ -9997,12 +9991,12 @@ i've got it on tape. that's what you were saying. no i wasn't thick though. and you were saying, oh yeah, we found these porno magazines and we're selling them off to perverts. -and i said yeah but you're looking at them and, and you started laughing. +and i said yeah but you're looking at them and, and you started laughing. was the one doing a slice of saturday night. ha, he was in that too. i thought that would have been a good night in the king's hall tonight. and i -that probably . +that probably . yeah. seamas was going. what? @@ -10010,46 +10004,46 @@ aha. he was getting tickets. i know, but there's still tickets there tonight. i'm sure you could have got tickets at the door if you had wanted them early. -someone's probably anybody buying or selling their ticket? -no, but i would say that er, play would be addressing you know, well no say, probably you accepted them for face value to the ticket doesn't say it is. +someone's probably anybody buying or selling their ticket? +no, but i would say that er, play would be addressing you know, well no say, probably you accepted them for face value to the ticket doesn't say it is. mhm. probably be alright. yeah. -you all would interrogated and all the rest of it. +you all would interrogated and all the rest of it. yeah. -go and bring your in you'll never get it out of here. +go and bring your in you'll never get it out of here. aye, that's right. mm mm. great that is! -i don't expect +i don't expect yeah. -i'd love to even to +i'd love to even to well i ride a horse for i believe, i believe it's opening next week. mm oh is it? mhm. -even though something . +even though something . oh! i didn't even know like -but it it's next tuesday. -erm it's opening? +but it it's next tuesday. +erm it's opening? i don't know. i hadn't heard anything about it. oh! i don't know anything about horses. -david's coming round children . +david's coming round children . it's very highly acclaimed. i think i'll use it. -and they're doing it fo for five weeks of the year . -there's been road for a long, long time now. -he was crossing wires in . +and they're doing it fo for five weeks of the year . +there's been road for a long, long time now. +he was crossing wires in . yeah. -that's the sort of, kinda thing that,the two things that you . +that's the sort of, kinda thing that,the two things that you . you couldn't do anything! what? -sure i went to the arts and everything and stuff. +sure i went to the arts and everything and stuff. oh! wasn't in the pantomime? mhm. @@ -10062,51 +10056,51 @@ they go around. they're using the arts. they use the arts. they use their arts. -and they use bangor, little fair of bangor. +and they use bangor, little fair of bangor. aha. i think who's this? it's it's the harberton -the harberton the ulster operatic use th erm no, but i mean, i a , because i wasn't a member it was like one show was okay, and the pantomime as well. -but i mean, you really have to be, like, a member before like if you were starting to like, want to do all the shows they'd want you +the harberton the ulster operatic use th erm no, but i mean, i a , because i wasn't a member it was like one show was okay, and the pantomime as well. +but i mean, you really have to be, like, a member before like if you were starting to like, want to do all the shows they'd want you no, but i mean , no one ever really does all the shows. i know. -but say,ma , maybe if you did the pantomime and then the next one coming up i mean er er er,th , i think they'd actually ask you like, your membership money. -what's the what do you actually do this for? +but say,ma , maybe if you did the pantomime and then the next one coming up i mean er er er,th , i think they'd actually ask you like, your membership money. +what's the what do you actually do this for? no, it's a, as i enjoyed it. you can take . -well something other than just to talk about other than just the normal run of road things. -you know i do this. -well you didn't watch our studio one on last night. +well something other than just to talk about other than just the normal run of road things. +you know i do this. +well you didn't watch our studio one on last night. was on. ? is he a big guy? aye, that was on. oh what's he like? he's like a big turkey! -well then you wanna see +well then you wanna see i don't think that's his son. it is his son. it is his son. it is! i know his daughter-in-law. -i,wha when i went to they were quite young and they were toffs there +i,wha when i went to they were quite young and they were toffs there never heard of them. the dad? no, the son. -and, and er +and, and er oh, the son. -all night, and, they weren't married yet and they would cost all of her bloody . +all night, and, they weren't married yet and they would cost all of her bloody . well you know the -they reckon that the best damn studio now in britain! +they reckon that the best damn studio now in britain! oh! so there you are. t v's working. -i enjoyed it but that was not the right one it was just proper room where er you where you used to every night of the week . +i enjoyed it but that was not the right one it was just proper room where er you where you used to every night of the week . she used to cheer us up . -but he that's . -wouldn't take you out of the because he'd go up there. +but he that's . +wouldn't take you out of the because he'd go up there. i always remembered. i thought , well she's . she could ma , she can make you dance. @@ -10127,48 +10121,48 @@ we have had a right . no. like the b and q store . mm! -they are quite dear that quick cut people . -well they're not saying you've gotta . +they are quite dear that quick cut people . +well they're not saying you've gotta . i suppose. i don't really know. there you are. -how the but i looked at the . -. he travels home from work he sits down are you fucking me about a bit? -and, she says, just me and +how the but i looked at the . +. he travels home from work he sits down are you fucking me about a bit? +and, she says, just me and i think i'll keep it. but he he i would like to, i would like to try it. -well it's alright for a while but that's alright for a wee while now. +well it's alright for a while but that's alright for a wee while now. he's a de , a dead nice bloke. -you know, very very doesn't put himself above anybody else, airs and graces and all, when you see him. +you know, very very doesn't put himself above anybody else, airs and graces and all, when you see him. speaks very politely. very nice man. -very, very great business acumen sometimes i wo , i can er but if you just come . +very, very great business acumen sometimes i wo , i can er but if you just come . mm. . he has no family. -but er, in a way he is . +but er, in a way he is . mm! when are you gonna do it all? so what did his dad say ? good god! -he wrote out another one but his dad reckons he was saying . +he wrote out another one but his dad reckons he was saying . we found it on the back . that t v is rubbish! he'll be the missing the job now. . off the . mm? -his house or and saying i'll be . +his house or and saying i'll be . isn't that strange ! i really . that looks near . -see simon picture in the telegraph? +see simon picture in the telegraph? oh no! i'll go and get you it. i forgot about his wedding day on saturday you know. i know. -you were in town weren't you? +you were in town weren't you? you were working. i was working. mm. @@ -10189,7 +10183,7 @@ where's the tel ? sorry ! all our days. la da, da da . -what was it,just said he puts his mouth on the telly ! +what was it,just said he puts his mouth on the telly ! what was it? it's the way that what was he saying? @@ -10198,7 +10192,7 @@ in a wee deep voice, and he were er er,power why? to . -cos that so song was popular at the time ! +cos that so song was popular at the time ! it wasn't, was it? zero four nine from base. how long, when will he be back in? @@ -10210,7 +10204,7 @@ no,. oh! what's your name? sure enough! -but di did you go to . +but di did you go to . where did you go? sammy. we just went down around town. @@ -10230,7 +10224,7 @@ aye. well, did you tell him? ha? what? -did you say anything ? +did you say anything ? it's where you're staying if you were rich. no i don't think so. . @@ -10240,13 +10234,13 @@ what? i keep saying no mum said. ah yeah. -christmas shopping and he said and er . +christmas shopping and he said and er . lisa. no, i've got something to do. let's hide them. oh! you ask polly. -with one another and then going off to +with one another and then going off to mm. .what? no. @@ -10263,12 +10257,12 @@ so, what do we have to say then? oh! things like, you have to . aha. -i knew was coming. +i knew was coming. alright. you know! so how are you leonora? well, well, how are you? -i i, i'm looking for a blade. +i i, i'm looking for a blade. a blade. why, what do you want blade for? you gonna do your wrists over me at all? @@ -10276,13 +10270,13 @@ oh dear! sure! dear old charlie! what a dear! -that covers too. +that covers too. who? that's george? erm what? -frank, frank needs three boxes of fifteen mils and three boxes down. +frank, frank needs three boxes of fifteen mils and three boxes down. could i have about forty bottles of the er the dom curie yeah. @@ -10309,12 +10303,12 @@ oh god! aye, doesn't sh doesn't she know that? you look awful! so i don't know. -i'll have to get the motorbike. -because it'll spoil erm +i'll have to get the motorbike. +because it'll spoil erm oh god! i just couldn't believe it! yeah. -but i mean +but i mean that was packed sort of like for ages though. @@ -10323,22 +10317,22 @@ do you know the heart, do yo do you know if a heart yes. these are practically . more like it's gonna be easter. -sure when you make nobody . +sure when you make nobody . there's no ties or anything. you don't know. wo wo wo well you could be just like it. -so there has been, well i mean, that's probably what's going round cos that way it's going into the fire as well. +so there has been, well i mean, that's probably what's going round cos that way it's going into the fire as well. mm. can you smell it? no. so what's, what's he saying ? well erm -he's going into the actually. +he's going into the actually. yeah, that's it. yeah, but has she got any kids? you said. no! -i said well, why don't you call me the proper name, is it a ? +i said well, why don't you call me the proper name, is it a ? i just say . sorry? ah, sally . @@ -10351,17 +10345,17 @@ on saturday. the bedroom. that's a fortune and all. must be. -so i said , and i said here one hundred pounds there. -i think i'd it all +so i said , and i said here one hundred pounds there. +i think i'd it all and i said -i said er or he said we could have it for twenty pound a month and we said +i said er or he said we could have it for twenty pound a month and we said aha. -some people perhaps and he said yeah we'll put something together. +some people perhaps and he said yeah we'll put something together. and i said, obviously cash it if it's no good. it's lucky i didn't say . mm. he might. -he said he doesn't catch cos i'll be i've, i'll have those right here for your so you're only paying twenty pounds bloody football bets aren't they! +he said he doesn't catch cos i'll be i've, i'll have those right here for your so you're only paying twenty pounds bloody football bets aren't they! he started to laugh. well she'll see or not. is he always gonna be responsible? @@ -10373,20 +10367,20 @@ get me some tomorrow what? didn't he put a hundred pound on? i would just kill them! -see that . +see that . i don't really know. i'll ask him. ah. he will have pegged it. -you know, and say has erm dominic got er +you know, and say has erm dominic got er i don't know. ! marvellous! yeah. what? -yep, i speaks for him. +yep, i speaks for him. great! -well she said she was very nice. +well she said she was very nice. ah, paddy showed me. oh! is that bad? @@ -10398,10 +10392,10 @@ why? he, he says to me i don't like him. what did he say yesterday? -i said he came and told me you know +i said he came and told me you know oh yeah. -yeah, and i said he said something about going to the pictures so he's going on about it. -so he said joanne says . +yeah, and i said he said something about going to the pictures so he's going on about it. +so he said joanne says . i think that's enough don't you? yeah, but he's been doing really good! i said leave us a couple of small . @@ -10413,41 +10407,41 @@ so, that cheek of the . and are they? oh! unless they're erm -i said why, are you thinking of crossing us? -well you've gone onto social security but but after two weeks it's flew. +i said why, are you thinking of crossing us? +well you've gone onto social security but but after two weeks it's flew. i'd like to go back london. and er yeah. -he'll have to pay a fine before he can pick up for it, this is joanne, i don't but he must he must er be up to something. -he said it's every single way because that's there must be a reason but he said they're not getting priority so we'll be left that he said +he'll have to pay a fine before he can pick up for it, this is joanne, i don't but he must he must er be up to something. +he said it's every single way because that's there must be a reason but he said they're not getting priority so we'll be left that he said fuck his self then! i would say jim, he'll be, he's very lucky he had a i was supposed to be . that's only all he said. -he said i said one thing he's more rebellious. +he said i said one thing he's more rebellious. yeah, that's right. eh? . -but erm that's the only other thing, there's nothing with wrong him. -she says er but she said but they're just trying to work it out. +but erm that's the only other thing, there's nothing with wrong him. +she says er but she said but they're just trying to work it out. oh it's cold! isn't it? -i think there's something between moira and he said surely he said why? -i says and i get , no idea if you would kill . +i think there's something between moira and he said surely he said why? +i says and i get , no idea if you would kill . what's ? how long has francy been here? -four years twenty months. +four years twenty months. aha. i remember her coming here. -cos fifth year on sunday . +cos fifth year on sunday . next thing it's only for the year. -and he went over and i . +and he went over and i . what's that? that's lovely! mm. lovely! mhm. -alan said, he said -and then, from then on things worked out. +alan said, he said +and then, from then on things worked out. he's a nice feller. he is. i like him. @@ -10457,7 +10451,7 @@ colin ? you sure look . who knows me? i suppose ashley. -he said, johnny but because you know them i wouldn't waste +he said, johnny but because you know them i wouldn't waste your time. yeah, cos some of them weren't even here. yeah. @@ -10466,7 +10460,7 @@ in fact we'll have to . mm. excuse me! no hear me! -just you tell him that joanne says flipping since when, easter? +just you tell him that joanne says flipping since when, easter? in a way. because i didn't see him cos . oh no, you never know what he's doing! @@ -10476,7 +10470,7 @@ i don't like to wear . it's hard for you. yeah, he's really a creep! and he -and i said, tell me what i said to you?heard you talking to me then you know she could go mad! +and i said, tell me what i said to you?heard you talking to me then you know she could go mad! must be somewhere where the both of you can meet up. so, how are you? which one is ticking sarah? @@ -10510,7 +10504,7 @@ oh! around there. i hope he's in the club and everything, they all try and out do each other. yes. -you ought to see about jackie getting there +you ought to see about jackie getting there yeah you just go. how often? they're just being finished, you know if she wanted. @@ -10521,13 +10515,13 @@ is it wrong number? i don't know. trisha you ! you know more than me ! -wanted to put her just wasn't right, even now she's . +wanted to put her just wasn't right, even now she's . well there's my mini. there's your mini dad, do you want that? where? we went over there. -when we, when we went to mini . +when we, when we went to mini . there's loads of them. it's lovely! horrible bleeding minis! @@ -10558,15 +10552,15 @@ i jumped on it, back home. cut round there and see how the others drived it's already . it's very nice! -i'll have the then. +i'll have the then. did you? ah! useless! i don't like her very, still trying to get out of it. what? -you don't like as much is what you're saying. +you don't like as much is what you're saying. that's quite i, i quite like over here. -but er +but er does anyone else know? what? no. @@ -10586,7 +10580,7 @@ so to indicate where you're going! it's a woman, joanne. well she . -we've passed . +we've passed . mm. oh jesus! there's a right one! @@ -10596,7 +10590,7 @@ mm. i used to work on the ne , the ne er, drill. so you never really went to any fortune teller? it's down there. -in the, no, but there's a lot down the other way. +in the, no, but there's a lot down the other way. where's that? aha. you went? @@ -10605,10 +10599,10 @@ what's that called? is that it? the theatre's just here. ah yes! -i'll i didn't realize his son was him. +i'll i didn't realize his son was him. he must be working. yeah. -well i'd erm +well i'd erm ah, hey! they're very busy tim said, i mean to the if you wanna buy something here don't be put off by . @@ -10618,8 +10612,8 @@ where are we? ooh ah! as long as we know where it is. we pass it here in a few minutes. -it's anyway after that butchers. -oh!erm then signed himself. +it's anyway after that butchers. +oh!erm then signed himself. so? he hadn't changed. but he has. @@ -10639,15 +10633,15 @@ och! and we did tim's work here. don't know what that is. dad does a lot of work up here. -he does plants +he does plants what? and grain. greenwood avenue! -that's where that and everybody else . -that's where erm this person back there. +that's where that and everybody else . +that's where erm this person back there. back together. oh well if you go out it'll happen! -i don't can't suit me that much! +i don't can't suit me that much! no. mhm. look at him working those two down there, er there @@ -10674,13 +10668,13 @@ yeah, that's right and then with joanne. you see. it was joanne said you'd go down there, so you said alright. -i've measured the so that's okay. +i've measured the so that's okay. you gotta do it for something . indeed! yeah i know. right here! right now! -so the one we got . +so the one we got . here we go. has something happened here? right here! @@ -10689,8 +10683,8 @@ what? what's that? i have never been in there. you was. -me and, you and i was in there on don't know when, years ago. -dianne told me the score so anyway you're like a friend can go with you. +me and, you and i was in there on don't know when, years ago. +dianne told me the score so anyway you're like a friend can go with you. you're driving. ah? so in a way, like someone can go with you and all if you want. @@ -10727,15 +10721,15 @@ it is. i think it is.. i've never been up here before. why, you mean ? -no,arts, and county, yes, i've been with martin . -shaun lends them their going to the health club. +no,arts, and county, yes, i've been with martin . +shaun lends them their going to the health club. she was. she might have told you. -she did anyway. +she did anyway. on there. that's the one david has. -i every time. -i've seen some in there your +i every time. +i've seen some in there your what? urgh! can't see it properly. @@ -10748,9 +10742,9 @@ which? yeah! you can go in there with your dog. er, no you can get your dog on there. -well i don't see the erm +well i don't see the erm ah? -there's people everywhere just coming home. +there's people everywhere just coming home. well i don't know. he's a weirdo! and you just roll up when you're here . @@ -10777,39 +10771,39 @@ it's really changed. like, you can see everything . see the . ballinamore isn't it? -i've never been at it myself, like, but i mean but i mean the and all is, well there's all the stuff on it anyway. -as far as i'm concerned we can get on. +i've never been at it myself, like, but i mean but i mean the and all is, well there's all the stuff on it anyway. +as far as i'm concerned we can get on. yeah. what time is it now? -quarter to three. +quarter to three. tim . in that there? i know. -see, remember when i wa , those houses were first, first built whenever there was like heavy rain and everything they flooded. +see, remember when i wa , those houses were first, first built whenever there was like heavy rain and everything they flooded. can't remember when they were built. i remember those houses being built. we used to come down here every friday afternoon! -and mum, and emma used to pick me up from school, primary school, and i was like, always last out. +and mum, and emma used to pick me up from school, primary school, and i was like, always last out. and erm and usually, aha. i remember we used to come down. -but i remember those being built and a at first whenever there was like rain, or whatever there, they always used to like flood the place! +but i remember those being built and a at first whenever there was like rain, or whatever there, they always used to like flood the place! that place is always packed and i don't think we'll be . aha. oh we can't . i like that song! i think that's quite good. -it's this erm there's three fellers and two girls. +it's this erm there's three fellers and two girls. peace, love and understanding . oh well.. . what about tim and his ? . -we he'll never do that. +we he'll never do that. one so , one show . oh! and your four children are too ! -peace, and love and understanding . +peace, and love and understanding . you reckon? peace what? @@ -10818,7 +10812,7 @@ what do you reckon? yeah. go over there. and understanding. -oh, oh oh understanding. +oh, oh oh understanding. oh ah oh! night. real good! @@ -10854,11 +10848,11 @@ oh i thought it was. i don't think it's wise to talk about the robbery. yeah. don't talk at all. -if she really wants to let her take them in. +if she really wants to let her take them in. there's the fire station. -sammy used to call those engine fires instead of fire engines! +sammy used to call those engine fires instead of fire engines! i think it's a good wee song! -martin carpets. +martin carpets. mm mm. that's it. get parked. @@ -10873,11 +10867,11 @@ still, i can't carry that . eh? you two are chicken! don't you think i should park there? -well either there or no not taller, i don't +well either there or no not taller, i don't my dad wanna be -was gonna buy one of those for richard wa , before he got the metro, it was between one of those and the metro. -and richard said er, would you look sick driving one of those? +was gonna buy one of those for richard wa , before he got the metro, it was between one of those and the metro. +and richard said er, would you look sick driving one of those? he said he loo would die before he got into a car like that! a renault, one of the renault fours or something. a . @@ -10891,18 +10885,18 @@ up that way. this way? yeah but i suppose if you alright ? -da alan she was measured as the store in ulster and all. +da alan she was measured as the store in ulster and all. i really do like that hat! nine ninety nine, that's good isn't it? -you mean i'll think get it when you and me and you know, +you mean i'll think get it when you and me and you know, you'll have to cut up that smaller. i know, my, do yo . but you see no, when you think my room, my room's maybe, right say seven feet wi wide right? -but normally should have a wee bit that goes in and hole. +but normally should have a wee bit that goes in and hole. so like, i don't know. -i think you must prefer everything in that room. +i think you must prefer everything in that room. i know, mum. -you'll have a like and then you could +you'll have a like and then you could that's gone down again ain't it? hanging on her now. i think that's a lovely apartment. @@ -10911,18 +10905,18 @@ gone are the days . do you realize that that's where . what? in that fair. -and that was the first +and that was the first where are my going? down to here, belfast? is that the town one? ya. -you can just go to the other one here providing they can now just go back again and go and ge and get +you can just go to the other one here providing they can now just go back again and go and ge and get where else is there? that one. -no, she's jus , she's just gone to er mr ! -i know, my teacher at school owns lord and cragson floors, he was gonna get me the lino quickly. +no, she's jus , she's just gone to er mr ! +i know, my teacher at school owns lord and cragson floors, he was gonna get me the lino quickly. mm. -down avenue, just there. +down avenue, just there. don't hurry like you did that's the . no we're not. what do you call a car ? @@ -10948,7 +10942,7 @@ when? well what time is it? five past eight. oh! -well let's go ask and roundabout and go and see if there's ah any cheap things cos we've been to see her again and +well let's go ask and roundabout and go and see if there's ah any cheap things cos we've been to see her again and why? we can order it when he comes. well it wouldn't have to be sort of @@ -10980,21 +10974,21 @@ if you did have a car you could go to maces and stuff like that. you wouldn't know anything. no, i'd get another car. well i said -i +i i if she didn't have a car you could go into maces . i did it for years. -i had a thousands ships, but no matter where, you're the one for me baby this i know cos it's true love, you're the one i'm dreaming of true blue baby i love you. -i heard all the lies, i've tried oh so many times, but without they fall again so excited cos you're my best friend! -so if you should ever doubt wonder what love is all about +i had a thousands ships, but no matter where, you're the one for me baby this i know cos it's true love, you're the one i'm dreaming of true blue baby i love you. +i heard all the lies, i've tried oh so many times, but without they fall again so excited cos you're my best friend! +so if you should ever doubt wonder what love is all about this is a nice one then. yeah, that's right. gosh! my other sister's friends. pardon? -true love you're the one i'm, dreaming of you're heart fits me, like a glove, and i'm gonna be true blue, baby i love you! -you're the one i songs are really, really strong. +true love you're the one i'm, dreaming of you're heart fits me, like a glove, and i'm gonna be true blue, baby i love you! +you're the one i songs are really, really strong. your heart fits me, like a glove so we're gonna true blue baby i love you! -no oh more sadness there's one thing that i don't i searched the whole world for someone like you. +no oh more sadness there's one thing that i don't i searched the whole world for someone like you. don't you know, don't you know, that it's true love, oh baby! true love, oh baby! true love, oh baby! @@ -11008,8 +11002,8 @@ yeah, i quite like this song. what? what? what did you say? -will you able to watch then? -like i say +will you able to watch then? +like i say yeah, throw it in. ah! no! @@ -11019,7 +11013,7 @@ so you think it's better? think it's better? yeah. right. -don't you know, don't you know that it's true love you're the one i'm dreaming of. +don't you know, don't you know that it's true love you're the one i'm dreaming of. your heart fits me like a glove . hair. what have you done? @@ -11028,9 +11022,9 @@ yeah, and we use plastic bags . it will sure be him. he's putting the car seat in. la la la, la la la la -tim just said so he isn't having +tim just said so he isn't having la la la -i'm gonna be true blue baby, i love you. +i'm gonna be true blue baby, i love you. we've lost the carpet place. true love, oh baby! true love, oh baby! @@ -11053,11 +11047,11 @@ oh! oh yeah, everything, he was ready for about si i don't know what she said. and he goes pacing up and down! yeah. -pacing waiting. +pacing waiting. he was really, really excited! it's just that i have never seen him who's took all that down there that morning,morning? -cos it's a new caravan, he went to pick it with them when he was staying over. +cos it's a new caravan, he went to pick it with them when he was staying over. . ah well. see what i mean. @@ -11073,21 +11067,21 @@ mm mm, mm mm . the banks are closed till tuesdays and you can't mail them. you don't know where they are. well i dunno. -daddy she's not buying the carpet tomorrow is she? +daddy she's not buying the carpet tomorrow is she? yeah, but mu mum i was ready to wait for it. sure, they're closed on friday won't they? so when are you gonna so that's it! go out? so when are you gonna get the carpet? -in the power of love in the pow ah ah, ah +in the power of love in the pow ah ah, ah ah ah, ah ha ha . ha ha ha! ha ha ha! -take me it's nearly lunchtime now. -how many of the men there, are there at work? +take me it's nearly lunchtime now. +how many of the men there, are there at work? hey? -they won't even let you anyway. +they won't even let you anyway. in the power of love about, how many? in the power of love . @@ -11103,7 +11097,7 @@ he seems alright. i keep getting him on the phone , i already know. look? what? -there's wee there, did you see him? +there's wee there, did you see him? where is that carpet place ? oh craigar carpets? yeah. @@ -11114,7 +11108,7 @@ what did it cost her? see er, home and away? a , no? oh i did. -well i thought it was really nice the way megan er, was asleep. +well i thought it was really nice the way megan er, was asleep. yeah, i suppose . you what? i think i was still . @@ -11123,7 +11117,7 @@ where were you at then? no, i haven't really been anywhere.. ha? interested in my, my apartment.. -this is the nearly got me and i've only seen oh have we actually seen these? +this is the nearly got me and i've only seen oh have we actually seen these? the only och! i must have been desperate! @@ -11132,8 +11126,8 @@ we could do nearly a quarter on a night. it's just up the top of my street. where is the turning here? it's just there... -he having their rows with . -he's in and cyprus that was. +he having their rows with . +he's in and cyprus that was. yeah. that used to be here, you know, when that was on . well i like . @@ -11163,7 +11157,7 @@ have you got a hanky? aye. know where the shops are? in there. -the boston chinese takeaway. +the boston chinese takeaway. look at that! isn't that so funny! look! @@ -11179,7 +11173,7 @@ that's rare! now, i'll show you, i'll point my mini out right. i love the wee midget. right. -well anyway you don't like the midgets. +well anyway you don't like the midgets. why? oh deary me ! look! @@ -11193,43 +11187,43 @@ said , isn't it beautiful! you could even swap it! it's lovely! i'd really like a mini. -it rolls back down. +it rolls back down. i could do with that one. what about a black one? couldn't do it with a black one. see those, the honda civic, that wee white one. i think some of those are brilliant! -i love +i love cos there is an older one of those in the garage . -oh yeah +oh yeah and er, oh it erm so ? i'm sorry ! -and i'll have to get that cheap razor and all . +and i'll have to get that cheap razor and all . you'll have to get a car for a . you'll have to give me those batteries back. what? you must bring those batteries back. what batteries? no way! -you use batteries and i use batteries. -that's a +you use batteries and i use batteries. +that's a dad! -i'll be every morning i get shaved going to work in the morning. +i'll be every morning i get shaved going to work in the morning. then i might take the two out of the doll. what? i might take the other two out of the doll, won't be a problem. -well the i have the about eleven and with the i wouldn't go out of my way them. +well the i have the about eleven and with the i wouldn't go out of my way them. no. cos you're cos yo you're being a pain! -you just shut it or i'll so i will +you just shut it or i'll so i will oh dear! so, can i just jump in there. cut the grass. course she does. -you're only talking off it you know shave. +you're only talking off it you know shave. richard's turn now. you can have it. here! @@ -11244,27 +11238,27 @@ what, what colour is it? still green? i'm not telling you. can't really transfer her back here. -did you go in ? +did you go in ? well it's dreadful! relaxing. . mum and dad are staying here. well . -why, why do you wanna local? +why, why do you wanna local? i just do. oh! you'll need a big tea for that one. what else? -good friday is the thirteenth of may so it's not too bad. +good friday is the thirteenth of may so it's not too bad. is tomorrow you'll be friday? yes. -friday, saturday, sunday, and then mon monday, tuesday, wednesday then i'm back in thursday, friday and then off saturday, sunday, monday. +friday, saturday, sunday, and then mon monday, tuesday, wednesday then i'm back in thursday, friday and then off saturday, sunday, monday. i'm taking friday week off. what, are yous open easter monday and tuesday down there? yeah? -so in a way yo you're doing different hours and all so your pay, was that based on forty hour week? -or was that just based on you being there whenever you had to be there. +so in a way yo you're doing different hours and all so your pay, was that based on forty hour week? +or was that just based on you being there whenever you had to be there. don't forget he's only started th , the job's only started a week! i'm just asking dear! i'm paying for supper. @@ -11272,13 +11266,13 @@ yeah. they're paying me for forty hours. and anything you do above forty hours you can extra for? yeah. -but, saying that means you got a lot +but, saying that means you got a lot you don't have forty hours only to do. i have. -because the hour, the hours forty but there's loads to be done . +because the hour, the hours forty but there's loads to be done . yeah. i'm getting them sorted out with roy -well erm have you had your pay yet from them, no? +well erm have you had your pay yet from them, no? tomorrow? yeah. so you, well then you'll still not know what you're going out with because you still have a few days from last week to get . @@ -11286,9 +11280,9 @@ so you don't know what you'll start with, you'll actually bring in. i will do. do you? on my pay slip. -it doesn't make any difference . -do you remember the form david got with the tax form and all? -he's gonna give it into mericlean and mericlean , just said we'll have to send it off to the tax office to get your tax code changed. +it doesn't make any difference . +do you remember the form david got with the tax form and all? +he's gonna give it into mericlean and mericlean , just said we'll have to send it off to the tax office to get your tax code changed. it's er, the tax code on his p forty five is . well his @@ -11302,17 +11296,17 @@ er o one. the form, er it's a, it's a fo , official form from the tax office. he had five o one. -said, five o one from the year began the first of april nineteen ninety two +said, five o one from the year began the first of april nineteen ninety two ninety two. until such and such, ninety three a. -so mericlean sent it away with his p forty five to have it changed and they said they couldn't accept it that they'd have to re-apply or something. +so mericlean sent it away with his p forty five to have it changed and they said they couldn't accept it that they'd have to re-apply or something. and i mean it was an official thing from the tax yeah. office themself. -they wrote , they wrote back and carole showed me the letter and said that this isn't this is +they wrote , they wrote back and carole showed me the letter and said that this isn't this is not sufficient evidence or something. -not sufficient evidence of the correct code. -i mean how what other evidence +not sufficient evidence of the correct code. +i mean how what other evidence yeah. could you show me? it came @@ -11326,27 +11320,27 @@ you know, see tax people, people like government! well that t v's working. aye. see the t v is. -i don't understand keep on paying a t v licence erm +i don't understand keep on paying a t v licence erm how much is it now? it's, a hundred and ninety i think. is it so? no. -i think eighty five for a colour t v licence erm i is nothing but the greatest load of bull or bullshit! +i think eighty five for a colour t v licence erm i is nothing but the greatest load of bull or bullshit! no,i it's flipping rubbish! people are getting ripped off! even black and white t v's, how much is that? half a . -and all you get is bloody +and all you get is bloody it's only about twenty five pound, is it something like bloody nonsense! that? wildlife and all, three times a week! -who wants to watch what a frigging ca coot lives on or whatever! +who wants to watch what a frigging ca coot lives on or whatever! you have bloody football! -see football i'm sick of people having to get the football ! +see football i'm sick of people having to get the football ! shit football! and that's all you get! -last night i sat up last night to watch that george foreman fight and they had to put football on before it and i fell asleep and i missed the bloody fight! +last night i sat up last night to watch that george foreman fight and they had to put football on before it and i fell asleep and i missed the bloody fight! because of that stupid fi er football! football couldn't wait till the end! a bloody waste! @@ -11356,42 +11350,42 @@ more frigging football! eleven thirty five tonight, football again! christ! . bunch of tarts going round a field chasing a ball! -anyhow where's the oh christ! +anyhow where's the oh christ! you're gonna rip it! -aye, see the ?she's got them offices and half, there's no telling . +aye, see the ?she's got them offices and half, there's no telling . what do you think of it? -i've got official forms here from the tax office, i mean, they say they can't accept it! -if they can't accept it, dunno, who ca who can what would john major have said? +i've got official forms here from the tax office, i mean, they say they can't accept it! +if they can't accept it, dunno, who ca who can what would john major have said? who's john major? the prime minister, you dope! typical woman!! -i feel as though i'm going deaf. +i feel as though i'm going deaf. she's starting to call the wedding off. -that's where you can see all the at work and i i, i haven't even got a stamp so it's . +that's where you can see all the at work and i i, i haven't even got a stamp so it's . that's terrible! what? what time is it? twenty to eleven. what are they calling ? she's terrible! -but once you got there and got stuck into the work and +but once you got there and got stuck into the work and well,whenever i leave the work. what? -still whenever i leave . +still whenever i leave . what time do you start in the morning? nine. nine? -he's gets a well that's all going into the the prisons. +he's gets a well that's all going into the the prisons. show us. no. -i'm always and up the night before +i'm always and up the night before the t v's going. i hate having ! well it's not a race. -i'll stay until lunchtime. -maybe give you a wee lesson so it'll save me going on a course so you could bring in all couldn't you? +i'll stay until lunchtime. +maybe give you a wee lesson so it'll save me going on a course so you could bring in all couldn't you? be a good idea? -well vegetables and potatoes and not a whole lot like, but i mean +well vegetables and potatoes and not a whole lot like, but i mean what potatoes would you want? pink. pink. @@ -11407,16 +11401,16 @@ they're no good. i like the we'll have egyptian floury potatoes. -egyptian are they're good you know. +egyptian are they're good you know. but they're dear! -te twenty twenty pence. +te twenty twenty pence. twenty what? -they're twenty pence and that's because they're high. +they're twenty pence and that's because they're high. high. that's dear. -but, there are a couple of them we're cutting them down. +but, there are a couple of them we're cutting them down. why are you cutting them down? -we don't lose except worse potato and they're all standard size +we don't lose except worse potato and they're all standard size how much? richard? for a five pound bag, how much are they? @@ -11426,7 +11420,7 @@ depends, most of the time there is a . sixty nine for a five bag. oh no, we're sixty nine for . i turned off the plug bit. -you know where our sammy was at school like, it did fruit as well and they don't really eat fruit, but i mean samuel eats fruit . +you know where our sammy was at school like, it did fruit as well and they don't really eat fruit, but i mean samuel eats fruit . aye, well it's it's, i suppose it's all money for him as well. well he only got four or five pounds worth didn't he? well i feel sorry for . @@ -11434,15 +11428,15 @@ yeah.. yeah. do you have granny smiths down there? yeah. -should be, hardly ever . +should be, hardly ever . i'm mm. -sure we went to +sure we went to well, i thought it was mostly for people there. -it's very well i think it's just back there. +it's very well i think it's just back there. yeah. but if you're just a . -not very men have their sunday dinner on sunday. +not very men have their sunday dinner on sunday. yes. mm? i'll be there to work. @@ -11459,33 +11453,33 @@ jesus it's are you sure you've got a driving ? no. erm i, you know that way as you went to ge , you always turn your head to check your blind spot? -i didn't turn my i just went fucking blind spot! +i didn't turn my i just went fucking blind spot! i did it anyway. -i'll try five pound of erm that . +i'll try five pound of erm that . they need washing do they? -i said, what's the point of having a judge and the jury that says ah? +i said, what's the point of having a judge and the jury that says ah? what do you mean? -you know if someone goes it's, gets taken to court for say, a murder +you know if someone goes it's, gets taken to court for say, a murder aha. -what's the point of having the judge sitting up there when it's jury that's saying whether it's -well he has to and the judge has +what's the point of having the judge sitting up there when it's jury that's saying whether it's +well he has to and the judge has oh i see. but that's all? so he could, so much well -to say i'm committing +to say i'm committing he you to jail. well i mean oh, well, well, well, richard. do you have dirty cards, yeah? aha. -oh well she'll be getting off in . +oh well she'll be getting off in . will you pay for them then i'll pay you richard? yeah. -well that's what it will be, more or less,anyho , anyway get the cabbage from the change from the vegetables. -cabbage make a change to the turnip or cauliflower or something. -so just keep that wee bit wait till get them. +well that's what it will be, more or less,anyho , anyway get the cabbage from the change from the vegetables. +cabbage make a change to the turnip or cauliflower or something. +so just keep that wee bit wait till get them. the cabbage is erm white. hard cabbage? @@ -11500,11 +11494,11 @@ and the wee mushrooms and things. eh? what, the wee button ones? oh they're -i usually get tomatoes and all, as well but if three tomatoes still in there. +i usually get tomatoes and all, as well but if three tomatoes still in there. so we won't need tomatoes. -sometimes i get a lettuce but lettuce don't eat it all. -as i've said it's usually sometimes i go out and you need a bag. -the dole queue woman stop. +sometimes i get a lettuce but lettuce don't eat it all. +as i've said it's usually sometimes i go out and you need a bag. +the dole queue woman stop. gosh! look at that! i dunno whether @@ -11515,25 +11509,25 @@ it is! who says! i'm very happy for you! they won't know where they're going. -i'm . +i'm . there's a couple of choices. do not dare! get your okay. -for your ? +for your ? i dunno . so you are. get out that thing. -i didn't know mum was shaving her hair. +i didn't know mum was shaving her hair. what? i just know mum was . -it's only +it's only kept on the walls. no. right. are we going? yes. -she . +she . no. oh ! i'll . @@ -11545,20 +11539,20 @@ yeah. the job as bad as that? no. it's okay. -once you get there it won't be okay. +once you get there it won't be okay. just getting through it. -i reckon i'll get an offer, that'll be i've . -yeah, so contact me first. +i reckon i'll get an offer, that'll be i've . +yeah, so contact me first. are you going out somewhere tonight? well i'm not gonna go . and i mean -i'll tell you what's been on the, the, the and i say that . -so he'll let us know when . +i'll tell you what's been on the, the, the and i say that . +so he'll let us know when . gary went in the church tonight? yeah. yeah, well he's living . as if he's playing cards tonight. -i don't know about it but he was there in church on thursday +i don't know about it but he was there in church on thursday well that would be yesterday. no, this thursday. oh aye. @@ -11586,18 +11580,17 @@ is that on? what's this? shouldn't eat that. there's no t v . - -well st aldate's in the civil war is quite a problem to talk about really, erm in half an hour, because it's so enmeshed in the story of oxford in the civil war which is a long, very interesting one, so what i'm going to try and do is erm to pick out some of the local landmarks that did survive in the 17th century and relate them to what we know about some of the people and in this short half an hour, just try and picture what it was like to live in st aldate's during the civil war. +well st aldate's in the civil war is quite a problem to talk about really, erm in half an hour, because it's so enmeshed in the story of oxford in the civil war which is a long, very interesting one, so what i'm going to try and do is erm to pick out some of the local landmarks that did survive in the 17th century and relate them to what we know about some of the people and in this short half an hour, just try and picture what it was like to live in st aldate's during the civil war. obviously a whole lot else is . i think it's quite important to orientate ourselves first, and you're looking at a map of oxford in 1643, erm and 17th century maps for the most part are what we should call upside down. the north is at the bottom, and i think it helps if you stop thinking about it as a map and you think about it as a birds-eye view, a helicopter view, erm and then the whole thing begins to make sense. -erm now, what you've got there is a slightly later map of 1675, which is exactly the same, the north is at the bottom, i'm afraid the top is not very obvious, if i could just hold it up, you've got the castle there, and you've got it the right way up, and actually there's some writing as well. -erm and the reason i've given you that one is that that was drawn in 1675 by david loggen, and it's a very, very accurate one, and it's rather easier to see some of the places i shall be talking about, so i think it's a nice one for you to have close up. +erm now, what you've got there is a slightly later map of 1675, which is exactly the same, the north is at the bottom, i'm afraid the top is not very obvious, if i could just hold it up, you've got the castle there, and you've got it the right way up, and actually there's some writing as well. +erm and the reason i've given you that one is that that was drawn in 1675 by david loggen, and it's a very, very accurate one, and it's rather easier to see some of the places i shall be talking about, so i think it's a nice one for you to have close up. erm there are some little differences which are quite interesting too. -now, if we find carfax first in the middle, oxford's on the crossroads principle, like so many cities, we've got st giles down here, erm and oxford of course a small city, or we should regard it as a very small city. +now, if we find carfax first in the middle, oxford's on the crossroads principle, like so many cities, we've got st giles down here, erm and oxford of course a small city, or we should regard it as a very small city. it was still a walled city, the walls were all virtually intact, the castle was a bit ruinous, but it was there, and it had its four main gates, erm east gate on the important london road going out past magdalen and over magdalen bridge, erm the north gate here, the westgate by the castle, and then still existing then but not in your map if you can find it, the south gate across the road, just at the bottom of christchurch, can you find christchurch on your map? erm now, perhaps you can that there's a difference in christchurch on your map with this one. -when cardinal wolsey fell, he hadn't finished the building of tom quad, the whole of this side was left open because he'd planned a very grand perpendicular chapel like king's college chapel, and erm the ruins, well no, not the ruins, the foundations were still to be seen apparently in the 17th century john gomley tells us. -but it was open, i mean it must have been fenced in some way later on. +when cardinal wolsey fell, he hadn't finished the building of tom quad, the whole of this side was left open because he'd planned a very grand perpendicular chapel like king's college chapel, and erm the ruins, well no, not the ruins, the foundations were still to be seen apparently in the 17th century john gomley tells us. +but it was open, i mean it must have been fenced in some way later on. erm but there was this great gap and i think had the civil war not come, the dean of christchurch who was the first of the two fells, would have probably finished that building then. as it was it was finished, as you can see on your map, after the war, erm but perhaps you can also see that tom tower is not yet built on yours. that wouldn't come till the 1680s. @@ -11606,19 +11599,19 @@ it didn't quite reach up to carfax, and it had another great landmark, as well a it had 2 big inns, and we're more or less, well, we are on the site of the first one, blue boar inn, and on your map, rather strangely, it seems to be built across the opening of blue boar lane, i don't know if you can see. erm anyway, it's just about there, and then, almost next door, presumably in competition with each other is the other inn, the unicorn inn, erm so that was it just on the south side of blue boar lane. erm one very important house is erm what is now the newman mobray bookshop, and that of course is still very much as it was in the 17th century. -it belonged to an extremely important erm civic family, thomas and john smith, who are the two important ones during the civil war, thomas was mayor just before the war, john smith was a member of parliament in the long parliament, and erm there's a slightly complicated story to the house, thomas moved out of it just before the war and built another one way up the street, but john stayed there, and another important landowner in marston, umpton croak, owned the other half of it. +it belonged to an extremely important erm civic family, thomas and john smith, who are the two important ones during the civil war, thomas was mayor just before the war, john smith was a member of parliament in the long parliament, and erm there's a slightly complicated story to the house, thomas moved out of it just before the war and built another one way up the street, but john stayed there, and another important landowner in marston, umpton croak, owned the other half of it. if you go down to newman mobray, and walk down that little alleyway, rose place, you see what is the frontage of that house, and it's very fine, and you can tell these are important people building themselves a fine house. erm and i've got a picture in here somewhere , which i'll pass round. erm and also, the alice shop? -do you know where i mean? erm well, that too, is a 17th century building, i've got a an early 19th century butler engraving of it here, and some pictures from the alice shop itself, now that was owned by a walter paine, both these citizens were well off brewers, erm those are just pictures of the same one, it's a little bit of a problem because this is called the house belonging to the manciple of christchurch. -i think in fact that's a mistake from,a mistaken caption. +do you know where i mean? erm well, that too, is a 17th century building, i've got a an early 19th century butler engraving of it here, and some pictures from the alice shop itself, now that was owned by a walter paine, both these citizens were well off brewers, erm those are just pictures of the same one, it's a little bit of a problem because this is called the house belonging to the manciple of christchurch. +i think in fact that's a mistake from,a mistaken caption. manciples were like college bursars, and they were very important. i'm rather advertising this because i think it's important to understand that although, and i'm sure you know, that there's this constant war really between, it wasn't of course a physical war, but certainly tension, and difficulty between the university and the city. erm i think it's important not to see the city as a sort of down-trodden, poor,hard-working, well, i'm sure they were hard-working, but very poor people. we're talking about two powerful organisations, both trying to keep their privileges intact. erm undoubtedly the university often won, but that didn't stop the city keeping on trying. erm and i think one other citizen should be mentioned, erm which is one john nixon. -he didn't actually live in st aldate's, but he must have been here a lot, because he was mayor in 1636, he was an alderman erm he was very much a leading in the city, and i think the leader of the opposition to royal policies. +he didn't actually live in st aldate's, but he must have been here a lot, because he was mayor in 1636, he was an alderman erm he was very much a leading in the city, and i think the leader of the opposition to royal policies. erm and erm when he came back after the war, he actually was so much involved on the parliamentarian side he had to leave oxford during the war, but when he came back he built a school in the city which was actually in the guildhall courtyard, it was built round the courtyard, and that remained a free school, for the city's boys right up to the end of the 19th century. right, now, we've talked about very briefly, touched on the division between university and the city, and obviously the erm differences between the king and parliament exacerbated what happened in the city. that's a complicated story i can't really go into at the moment, but was very much to do with the royal policies of the 1630s. @@ -11638,7 +11631,7 @@ erm and i think that's an important thing to remember while we're thinking about well undoubtedly the first thing that happened in st aldate's, the most important thing, was after the battle of edgefield, when the king rode in in state erm in victory he said, though the fact that the battle was indecisive,and it was described by a very royalist writer anthony wood, you may have heard of, is a university antiquarian erm very much on the university and royalist side. ‘they came in their full march into the town with about 60 or 70 coloureds borne before them which they'd taken at the battle of edgehill from the parliament's forces. at christchurch the university stood to welcome his majesty.’ -well he doesn't bother to mention that the king also had an official welcome at carfax, which was the normal place, what was known as the penniless bench, which was at the end of st martin's church, only the of that remains at the moment, now, erm and then was presented with the traditional gift of gloves by the mayor, and the not very generous sum of £520, and just about the same time, alderman nixon and 12 others who agreed with him disappeared smartly from oxford, and weren't to be seen for the rest of the war. +well he doesn't bother to mention that the king also had an official welcome at carfax, which was the normal place, what was known as the penniless bench, which was at the end of st martin's church, only the of that remains at the moment, now, erm and then was presented with the traditional gift of gloves by the mayor, and the not very generous sum of £520, and just about the same time, alderman nixon and 12 others who agreed with him disappeared smartly from oxford, and weren't to be seen for the rest of the war. now the king chose oxford for pretty obvious reasons as his headquarters, he'd lost london, he needed a capital and a headquarters, erm and erm oxford had a delightfully convenient central position, its transport is very easy with the river erm navigable, erm on both sides of it. easy to defend, with its walls still existing, and the two rivers, and of course, with resources, with fuel and war effort, and the kind of buildings where the king could form a court. and the best building, though it's not technically part of st aldate's, was the one he obviously chose as his fort, which was christchurch. @@ -11652,11 +11645,11 @@ erm they had great services were held in christchurch cathedral, and the king wo erm tom tower wasn't there, the elegant pool in the middle wasn't and in fact the whole thing was probably rather chaotic. we know for instance that quite often erm pillaged flocks of cows and sheep were driven into the quad as one of the few open spaces within the city walls. anthony wood gleefully recalls this. -erm so i think you want to regard it not as a sort of glamorous place where the troops were drilling and the drums were beating, but a slightly chaotic and rather dirty place, despite the kings existence. +erm so i think you want to regard it not as a sort of glamorous place where the troops were drilling and the drums were beating, but a slightly chaotic and rather dirty place, despite the kings existence. another person the people in st aldate's would have seen was the kings nephew, prince rupert, erm only 23 but one of the king's major assets, a brilliant cavalry commander. -this is painted just before the war, and it's interesting to compare it with a painting by the court painter, william dobson who worked in oxford during the war, his studio was just around the corner in the high street, because that's rupert very much at the end when things were going badly wrong for him, erm and it's unfinished, perhaps because dobson was beginning to run out of paint, and the experts at allow, and i think just that face tells the whole story about tension and unhappiness, dobson's an interesting painter, one of the first english painters who sort of get to the top in this way, and he painted a lot of the cavaliers at charles' court, erm this is sir john byron who clattered down the main street at st aldate's, before the king even arrived before the battle of edgehill, the one that caused trouble for john smith, erm and he was very much a swash-buckling character, but he didn't spend a lot of time in oxford later, but he was there enough to have his portrait painted. +this is painted just before the war, and it's interesting to compare it with a painting by the court painter, william dobson who worked in oxford during the war, his studio was just around the corner in the high street, because that's rupert very much at the end when things were going badly wrong for him, erm and it's unfinished, perhaps because dobson was beginning to run out of paint, and the experts at allow, and i think just that face tells the whole story about tension and unhappiness, dobson's an interesting painter, one of the first english painters who sort of get to the top in this way, and he painted a lot of the cavaliers at charles' court, erm this is sir john byron who clattered down the main street at st aldate's, before the king even arrived before the battle of edgehill, the one that caused trouble for john smith, erm and he was very much a swash-buckling character, but he didn't spend a lot of time in oxford later, but he was there enough to have his portrait painted. that black mark is erm a scar patch, if you got a scar during the war you got a wound in a scuffle erm you won in the war, you did sort of emphasise this in that way. -and so charles cockshall, who is the owner of court out to the north of oxford, who is the king's master of ceremonies, and i think that's an interesting contrast, because here again you get this feeling of tension, and sadness. +and so charles cockshall, who is the owner of court out to the north of oxford, who is the king's master of ceremonies, and i think that's an interesting contrast, because here again you get this feeling of tension, and sadness. erm there was a great deal of difficulty i think at the court, as well as the rather glamorous exterior. erm the queen didn't arrive till 1643, she'd been in the netherlands raising money for the war effort, very successfully, because she finally came to oxford with 2,000 foot and 1,000 horsemen, and erm a hundred wagons full of equipment as well as cannons and so on. i don't know if it all came to oxford, but certainly most of it did, and erm the city council actually spent six shillings and sixpence strewing the streets with flowers to welcome her, which erm when we have a look at the amount of money that was being, having to be raised elsewhere it was quite generous really. @@ -11742,58 +11735,57 @@ what we don't know, of course, is how they organized their living accommodation, and the fire actually started beyond the north wall, just by the north gate, but the wind was blowing from the north, and it blew it down, and although it didn't burn the rather better stone houses, facing onto st aldate's, erm behind i think a lot of the poorer houses did suffer, and st ebbe's parish, next door, suffered a great deal, and because it was war, i think they just, the city council, city records lament that there how hard it is for people, and there's no money to help them. so it's erm there was in fact a great petition made to the king on these very lines, really because of the fire. so i think life was erm boring, tough, hard-working, pretty unpleasant during the war, erm and i think most of the citizens must have been very very relieved when the surrender finally came, and it brought no actual fighting, and at least the city was left reasonably unscathed. - -sir, is miss not in? +sir, is miss not in? no. could you take your coats off please and come into the blue room. -well who's taking miss 's class? +well who's taking miss 's class? question? what? the answer. can you come through please. -right folks donald is here making typical of english in use from schools at the moment. +right folks donald is here making typical of english in use from schools at the moment. so if you would er ignore the presence of the microphone that would be helpful. -i intend to give you a demonstration today based on work that kevin has done. -he's his plate with hard wax as many of you now have done. -he has varnished the back with, can you remember what sort of special old varnish it was? +i intend to give you a demonstration today based on work that kevin has done. +he's his plate with hard wax as many of you now have done. +he has varnished the back with, can you remember what sort of special old varnish it was? straw hat. correct. well done. straw hat varnish. now it's safe from acid attack on the back and on the front except for where he has lightly drawn through the thin wax coating using the etching . -drawn this little character and what i intend to do is put this into acid and etch it. +drawn this little character and what i intend to do is put this into acid and etch it. the actual etching process where the acid bites through the liner into the metal and makes a rule. -when that's happened i'll take it out of the acid clean it and show you how to take a print from the plate. -i would like you all to try to remember the stages of the process because you're going to have to do, as i said to you last lesson, a small write up on this in order to get your unit of accreditation for this work. +when that's happened i'll take it out of the acid clean it and show you how to take a print from the plate. +i would like you all to try to remember the stages of the process because you're going to have to do, as i said to you last lesson, a small write up on this in order to get your unit of accreditation for this work. that is to say your special certificates . -right erm would you normally be room? +right erm would you normally be room? would you normally be in this room? is it likely that there are other pupils who may turn up in that room in a few minutes? or do you think that you may be the only ones? are they all on the english trip? okay. -in that case could you just take your coats off and put them somewhere erm out of the way. +in that case could you just take your coats off and put them somewhere erm out of the way. please. -now we're gonna be using acid very very dilute acid. +now we're gonna be using acid very very dilute acid. nevertheless we have to take proper precautions. -so, if you would be so kind as to get into a position where you can see what i'm doing without being too close it means that if we do splash any acid by accident er the likelihood of it causing any problems to anyone are minimal. -have you come to supervise miss 's class? +so, if you would be so kind as to get into a position where you can see what i'm doing without being too close it means that if we do splash any acid by accident er the likelihood of it causing any problems to anyone are minimal. +have you come to supervise miss 's class? as it happens it would seem that most of those children are out on an english trip. oh. perhaps you would like to go and do your own thing. perhaps you'd like to stick around and watch this happening because i remember you subbing once for an etching lesson. oh it's an etching lesson is it? yes can you remember? -yes +yes yesterday wasn't it? -and you thought well i'd better not +and you thought well i'd better not i'm not having them running around . that's right. i remember you saying. -so perhaps you'd like to keep them right +so perhaps you'd like to keep them right have a . and make sure i do it right. -but on the other hand if you +but on the other hand if you i don't know how to do it . oh well i meant from the point of view of . safe safety point of view. @@ -11803,31 +11795,31 @@ is that alright? mm. smashing. thank you very much. -this by the way is er donald who is making sound recordings of in the school today. -. so swearing. -er right my friends. -as i say, i would like you to be in fairly close proximity to where i am so that you can see what i'm doing and hear what i'm saying. +this by the way is er donald who is making sound recordings of in the school today. +. so swearing. +er right my friends. +as i say, i would like you to be in fairly close proximity to where i am so that you can see what i'm doing and hear what i'm saying. er and i don't want you to be too close. i will actually be working to start with in this area here. so perhaps you could arrange yourselves in a semi-circle just round here. -right, my friends we've very strange and wonderful chemicals in this erm i do beg your pardon when we are printing. +right, my friends we've very strange and wonderful chemicals in this erm i do beg your pardon when we are printing. the one which you will have come across when we were doing lino printing was turps. we had to use turps didn't we, to dissolve the printing inks? can you remember that, when you did lino printing? mm -but when we're doing screen printing we use very much stronger solvents which can have a nasty effect on your skin. +but when we're doing screen printing we use very much stronger solvents which can have a nasty effect on your skin. you notice i have slight eczema on the palms of my hands. some of us have even worse eczema, yeah? -so it's really important that we don't irritate our skin. -but frankly it's not likely to irritate your skin anyway because er you aren't industrial users of this you would only ever touch these chemicals for a very short time so the any possible side effects they might er have on you will be greatly diminished by the fact that you didn't use them very much. +so it's really important that we don't irritate our skin. +but frankly it's not likely to irritate your skin anyway because er you aren't industrial users of this you would only ever touch these chemicals for a very short time so the any possible side effects they might er have on you will be greatly diminished by the fact that you didn't use them very much. if you're using them in industry, day in day out all day long, then that is the real importance of wearing protective gear. -but i'm just going to demonstrate to you just what happens. -this lovely supple rubber here is exactly the same supple rubber here at one time but now it's gone all hard and denatured because of the chemicals. -so if y if the chemicals will do that over a long period of time to rubber, think what it would do to your skin. +but i'm just going to demonstrate to you just what happens. +this lovely supple rubber here is exactly the same supple rubber here at one time but now it's gone all hard and denatured because of the chemicals. +so if y if the chemicals will do that over a long period of time to rubber, think what it would do to your skin. does that make sense? mm. -these lumps have become so erm hardened by these chemicals that i can't er pick up the thin zinc plate from the tub. -i'm afraid that mrs has gone off with, ah mrs i'll be very grateful if you could bring me in a bowl. +these lumps have become so erm hardened by these chemicals that i can't er pick up the thin zinc plate from the tub. +i'm afraid that mrs has gone off with, ah mrs i'll be very grateful if you could bring me in a bowl. you know the one you just took out? you want it back? i wonder if i could have it back please? @@ -11836,22 +11828,22 @@ a a bowl, it doesn't matter which one. just a plastic bowl please, washing up bowl. do you want anything in it? or just water? -er bring it empty and i'll . +er bring it empty and i'll . thank you very much. -i'm gonna have a a bowl of water handy just in case. +i'm gonna have a a bowl of water handy just in case. so having put on these er temporary protective gloves. these are ones i bought long time ago. -erm they're as you can see, still a bit awkward but much easier to use than these. +erm they're as you can see, still a bit awkward but much easier to use than these. what do you think the other piece of protective gear i might need would be? goggles. goggles. good. and i have a pair of goggles here but there is another safety device built into this which is this window. -in fact the tray of acid will go in there so any splashing around i might do, any upward splashing is not likely to reach . -you will be relieved to know i've ordered some new rubber gloves like this and some new goggles for next term. +in fact the tray of acid will go in there so any splashing around i might do, any upward splashing is not likely to reach . +you will be relieved to know i've ordered some new rubber gloves like this and some new goggles for next term. but you don't need to use them this term anyway so it's alright. the acid we use is nitric acid. -it's very very dilute, only fifteen percent acid the rest is water. +it's very very dilute, only fifteen percent acid the rest is water. and i have used this particular acid already to etch zinc. can't hear you. oh. @@ -11859,20 +11851,20 @@ i just, i'll just . i'll see you later. consequently this acid now contains some zinc which has eaten it away. there'll be a residue of zinc in there. -the other metal which i mentioned to you before which is the traditional method for etching is copper, copper plate. -and i am told that it is not advisable to use the same batch of acid for etching copper as has been used for etching zinc because the deposits of two metals in the acid creates erm an unpleasant, noxious, possibly poisonous gas and i don't know what that would do. +the other metal which i mentioned to you before which is the traditional method for etching is copper, copper plate. +and i am told that it is not advisable to use the same batch of acid for etching copper as has been used for etching zinc because the deposits of two metals in the acid creates erm an unpleasant, noxious, possibly poisonous gas and i don't know what that would do. talking about gas, even this produces gas. therefore you have this machine which is an extractor. -it's called a a fume cupboard i think. +it's called a a fume cupboard i think. a s sort of cupboard. it's open at the front. it has to be because we have to get our hands in. but it's extracting the fumes going out the window. -possibly not very ecologically sound but safer for you at all events. -this hasn't been used for some time so it's a bit so i'm just going to wipe it out so there are no particles or foreign bodies in there. +possibly not very ecologically sound but safer for you at all events. +this hasn't been used for some time so it's a bit so i'm just going to wipe it out so there are no particles or foreign bodies in there. and this bit i do before the lesson and i do this, clean it up afterwards. you don't have to do this bit. -but notice that i'm pouring slowly and gently away from me into the dish which i shall then put in here, and i'm going to put the the plate, which i described to you before, which has been covered with what's on the back? +but notice that i'm pouring slowly and gently away from me into the dish which i shall then put in here, and i'm going to put the the plate, which i described to you before, which has been covered with what's on the back? straw hat varnish. what's on the front? hard wax. @@ -11883,13 +11875,13 @@ what? you have haven't you? what? a watch. -will you time er two minutes please? +will you time er two minutes please? from the moment this goes into the acid. you lower it in gently and sloosh it about so that the acid covers the surface. right, you may troop by that and look down there, notice i wasn't wearing the goggles that was naughty of me wasn't it? -i should have been er while i go and get a turkey feather. +i should have been er while i go and get a turkey feather. okay, you go and have a look at that covered up. -and try and see if we've got er forming on the lines. +and try and see if we've got er forming on the lines. yes. that's what makes er these chemicals so dangerous, you don't know what they are. what do you think i've got this for? @@ -11901,12 +11893,12 @@ to scrape the zinc off? when it's ? very good, yes. that's correct. -as the zinc is eaten away air bubbl er sorry not air bubbles gas bubbles i don't know what gas. +as the zinc is eaten away air bubbl er sorry not air bubbles gas bubbles i don't know what gas. any idea what gas might be being produced? -no i was trying to think it's zinc. +no i was trying to think it's zinc. and it's in a basin of hydrogen zinc and nitrate. -and it would give off nitrate wouldn't it? +and it would give off nitrate wouldn't it? zinc nitrate? which isn't a gas. which isn't a gas. @@ -11917,27 +11909,27 @@ two minutes? right. yeah i think the two minutes is up. david's timed two minutes. -now when that acid is fresh and hasn't been used before two minutes is usually quite enough for it to have done the job it's supposed to do. -this is an imprecise operation because since the acid has been used i don't know how many times because the temperature, the ambient temperature in the room varies. -in the winter when it's cold it works more slowly now when it's very hot it will, should work more quickly. -er i can't say precisely leave it in the acid for so and so time. -so we always this has always been the case for the four five hundred years that people have been doing etching, so they go by a rule of thumb. -the rule of thumb is this when the first cluster of bubbles is fully formed, sweep them away with a bird's wing feather. -so i have duly swept them away. +now when that acid is fresh and hasn't been used before two minutes is usually quite enough for it to have done the job it's supposed to do. +this is an imprecise operation because since the acid has been used i don't know how many times because the temperature, the ambient temperature in the room varies. +in the winter when it's cold it works more slowly now when it's very hot it will, should work more quickly. +er i can't say precisely leave it in the acid for so and so time. +so we always this has always been the case for the four five hundred years that people have been doing etching, so they go by a rule of thumb. +the rule of thumb is this when the first cluster of bubbles is fully formed, sweep them away with a bird's wing feather. +so i have duly swept them away. which means that the acid can get back in there. that the air bubble er the gas bubble, i keep saying air bubble, that's wrong. they are gas bubbles. the gas bubbles forming along the lines were keeping the acid out of the lines. so i've swept them away so that the acid can get back in. -when the second set of bubbles is formed it's done. +when the second set of bubbles is formed it's done. that's the rule of thumb. okay? two formations of bubbles and it's bitten deep enough. so i suppose that was about two and a half minutes wasn't it? so i would think that we're working on a five minute schedule . don't forget that when they first did this, people would not have had personal watches. -and there may only have been one clock in the town where they worked and that would have been on the town hall or the church. -clocks are a very recent er introduction as far as ordinary er working conditions are concerned. +and there may only have been one clock in the town where they worked and that would have been on the town hall or the church. +clocks are a very recent er introduction as far as ordinary er working conditions are concerned. what might have they have had to measure the time as it passed? egg timer. sundial. @@ -11961,11 +11953,11 @@ you scratched your nose and you've got acid on them gloves. right. i did didn't i? yeah. -but i i should come out in great welts soon and start looking like an american werewolf in london. +but i i should come out in great welts soon and start looking like an american werewolf in london. right, my face will start falling off. quite right. -you must be careful not to unconsciously touch anything with even the gloves. -and you should wash the gloves as soon as you've touched the acid. +you must be careful not to unconsciously touch anything with even the gloves. +and you should wash the gloves as soon as you've touched the acid. i should have done that straight away. well spotted. i will do it now. @@ -11978,24 +11970,24 @@ yes. it might be harmful to your lungs. it hasn't been used yet. but it's not er as good as -well that's what it says it is on the erm on the outside. +well that's what it says it is on the erm on the outside. orange spot on me notes . mm? see what it was. now it's green. -that means it's been used with copper. -we have a suspicion that very little reaction has taken place because in fact very few bubbles have risen to the surface. -this could be i don't think acid spends itself as it sits in a bottle does it? +that means it's been used with copper. +we have a suspicion that very little reaction has taken place because in fact very few bubbles have risen to the surface. +this could be i don't think acid spends itself as it sits in a bottle does it? no. it stays the same configuration. mm. it's erm if you've used that lots and lots of times it may have used up all the . -it may have exhausted mayn't it? +it may have exhausted mayn't it? yeah. -so because it worked last time i used it. +so because it worked last time i used it. i'm hoping that it has worked this time. -it's been in there much longer than i'd normally leave it. -so, it will either have not worked at all for some obscure reason or it will have worked well and . +it's been in there much longer than i'd normally leave it. +so, it will either have not worked at all for some obscure reason or it will have worked well and . so whatever has happened, i'm now going to remove it from the acid. i'm going to wash it. lets. @@ -12003,10 +11995,10 @@ stack them high and sell them cheap. erm oh we'll they're going to go for twenty p plus cost of the stamped addressed return envelope yeah. friend. -which is slightly more than some people do with their money. -erm where are we. +which is slightly more than some people do with their money. +erm where are we. oh yes orders to receive letter box stickers. -erm lisa is that i'm not quite sure, from the york university student rooms, is in to help us with the big box pile up. +erm lisa is that i'm not quite sure, from the york university student rooms, is in to help us with the big box pile up. and having spoken to her on saturday when she came along to the energy conservation stall i intend to invite her if it's alright with the meeting to our next meeting which is on the ninth of february to discuss how the greens can help how the university greens can help us with that demonstration. and perhaps forge a link you never know. so if that's that's approved i'll give that a tick and so we can bring it up again later. @@ -12020,14 +12012,14 @@ he's . but i do have something from the membership secretary. right so that's other officers. membership secretary. -well the membership secretary, if i can remember how to spell it, erm mm has indeed been in touch with erm john who very kindly sent us a free copy of erm their version of our membership list. -which is how we found out that one that we have a new member erm sally who i'll add on to my list and er send a newsletter to. -also joan ian and mrs green erm we all thought they joined locally and the national party have no record. +well the membership secretary, if i can remember how to spell it, erm mm has indeed been in touch with erm john who very kindly sent us a free copy of erm their version of our membership list. +which is how we found out that one that we have a new member erm sally who i'll add on to my list and er send a newsletter to. +also joan ian and mrs green erm we all thought they joined locally and the national party have no record. it's the same old story. -erm john has suggested that we send their membership on and then that's definitely it. +erm john has suggested that we send their membership on and then that's definitely it. we're now all up to date and we agree with head office and we can take it from here. erm one minor alteration on that point. -i've got a membership card for possibly er previous +i've got a membership card for possibly er previous from january. sort of yeah from the end of january's er you've got six month's free membership don't worry about it. @@ -12036,17 +12028,17 @@ but it does put in rather six months out of phase with the local membership so a well john sorted that he's brought you up to date now. mm. because you know it's the same thing. -i was gonna give the er local party er it'll be sixteen months worth local membership +i was gonna give the er local party er it'll be sixteen months worth local membership if you want to give us a donation that's entirely welcome. perfectly acceptable. i'll buy some . -i've already bought some +i've already bought some yeah. -bought some more er +bought some more er so what joe wanted the meeting to decide is should we ask mark to send off a cheque for those three people? i think that's the only way to proceed to to sort out this tangle once and for all. yeah. -you see apart from anything else if those people joined through us then we we must make good . +you see apart from anything else if those people joined through us then we we must make good . and we fixed it. the system's fixed so. yeah. @@ -12055,7 +12047,7 @@ we can't ask those people for money if they've already joined once. okay. erm i'll get mark to send a cheque off when he gets back from . okay is that oh i suppose as as another officer i can er tell you that the the newsletter has indeed been finished and gone out. -erm i would like to apologize on behalf of myself and my proof reading team for the fact that two calls for nominations that erm that are in this newsletter don't actually appear to have closing dates on them. +erm i would like to apologize on behalf of myself and my proof reading team for the fact that two calls for nominations that erm that are in this newsletter don't actually appear to have closing dates on them. oh god. which is a bit of a stupendous cock-up from us at least on my part i'm, if i had my engineer's hat on i'd er blame the proof reading team as well. @@ -12063,7 +12055,7 @@ but er i suppose really i er well you forgot to read it because you threw coffee over me. i suppose the blame is at least almost entirely mine. if not entirely mine. -so i i would like to ask the meeting whether erm i suppose technically for advice on this topic. +so i i would like to ask the meeting whether erm i suppose technically for advice on this topic. think we can get away with putting out another newsletter on the seventh of february with a ballot in it anyway for these two things even though we didn't yes. i think so. @@ -12074,14 +12066,14 @@ i think that because i don't think people wait until the deadline to er respond helen? erm i think technically we're actually constitutional because it doesn't say anything in the constitution about us having to publish the deadline. it just says that we have to make the the call for nominations so long before we put out the selection ballot. -so they can do it from they can work it out for themselves actually . +so they can do it from they can work it out for themselves actually . briefing. ah so so it's alright. so everybody who got the newsletter when they read it should have thought, aha best look up i'm sorry -my copy of the constitution that i filed away so neatly when i received that months ago. -i think perhaps an apology and erm and an in er the next newsletter might be appropriate for. -otherwise we'll phoning us up and complaining . +my copy of the constitution that i filed away so neatly when i received that months ago. +i think perhaps an apology and erm and an in er the next newsletter might be appropriate for. +otherwise we'll phoning us up and complaining . you'll probably be ringing people up anyway trying to get them to understand. yes i agree entirely. i don't think people are going to be disappointed if they miss out . @@ -12102,7 +12094,7 @@ oh yes definitely . anything to fit . it will depend what the space situation is. a nice grovel can go in. -advert for the letter box sticker. want stuff or is it contact through the office to . +advert for the letter box sticker. want stuff or is it contact through the office to . yes. unless you have unless you have supplied a specific date. erm if you like i can provide a a specific spiel. @@ -12125,7 +12117,7 @@ certainly. fine idea. and if anybody thinks of any more diary dates or anything. yeah i'll let you know. -i think there might be a i've got one announcement you can put from that. +i think there might be a i've got one announcement you can put from that. again if i collect more material than i have to use no problem. got an item on media watch there did anyone notice that the green party was actually mentioned in the guardian today? no. @@ -12137,8 +12129,8 @@ mm the most we've had for months. i know absolutely. wow. first mention i've actually seen in months. -do we put i wonder who statement for that? -that's not mine . +do we put i wonder who statement for that? +that's not mine . right er well i think i've probably finished apologizing for what i did write in the newsletter erm thank you for getting it out so quick andy @@ -12149,12 +12141,12 @@ because i do. i've decided that this isn't any other business at all. i've got a picture of hugh. have you? -yeah i've got a picture of hugh with one end of a decontaminate poster. +yeah i've got a picture of hugh with one end of a decontaminate poster. yeah. because er he was down there er trying to dip his nose in the toxic chemicals. down at heworth when we were getting er postcards filled in. our neighbour's looking . -i think you can have a rest after campaign. +i think you can have a rest after campaign. erm. do you know what this is about? heworth green. @@ -12163,7 +12155,7 @@ according to this thing in the paper they er had a hundred and thirty people. mm. and er hundred and thirty! -well that's what is says there . +well that's what is says there . you could quite a lot don't they? protestors were joined by york mp hugh bailey and city councillors as they gathered at heworth on saturday. @@ -12172,8 +12164,8 @@ that it's not very nice but it's er i didn't know heworth was gonna be that yes. until it mentioned -they're also apparently with ill health and amongst people living in the surrounding area. -whether there's any truth in this is and the a a e who did the er survey include atomic energy authority who who's like that as well. +they're also apparently with ill health and amongst people living in the surrounding area. +whether there's any truth in this is and the a a e who did the er survey include atomic energy authority who who's like that as well. right okay. i think we must have missed a briefing from must must have done. @@ -12182,14 +12174,14 @@ right well there's a nice er we did get in the paper. we did. mm. right any tasks to carry forward? -well erm steve asked to write letters to to penny . -i don't know whether jean got john to have written to jean or not. +well erm steve asked to write letters to to penny . +i don't know whether jean got john to have written to jean or not. i think he might have done but he didn't say. erm apart from that i think we've done everything this week. -can you just quick quickly fill me in on what this letter to penny is? +can you just quick quickly fill me in on what this letter to penny is? it was about the supporters' campaign in the last yeah. -there's an article about erm where is it here somewhere . +there's an article about erm where is it here somewhere . it's basically offering people erm rather than becoming members they can become a supporter for five pounds a year of the green party for which they get three shortened up beat newsletters and this week it was two sides of a four. together with two further appeal letters. i've just noticed she actually uses the sentence being a green party supporter isn't meant to appeal to everyone. @@ -12209,7 +12201,7 @@ right erm. as requested i wrote and asked about self-catering accommodation at the conference and i received a reply saying that there's one house that erm she's come across that she thinks might be particularly suitable for us. it's a house for for, where are we, for six people. in other words it sleeps six erm and the landlady's willing to have one person sleeping on the floor officially. -slot more people in appropriate. +slot more people in appropriate. erm two single bedrooms and two double bedrooms plus a living room all facilities erm except for sheets and towels. which we'd have to take. what no sheep? @@ -12219,7 +12211,7 @@ and she said to let her know straight away if we think it might be suitable. erm steve and mark and i are definitely interested so that's three people so we're looking for another three people to share. bearing in mind that if we do have the whole house then people are only coming for a few days or or even one night could no they had somewhere to stay. erm and along with this we were thinking about ways to subsidize conference for people and this might be one way to do it for the for york green party to pay part of the cost of renting the accommodation. -erm on the understanding that for any green party members that want to use it over the conference. +erm on the understanding that for any green party members that want to use it over the conference. that's just a proposal it's an idea. so there you go. how many people have said that they're going so far? @@ -12227,9 +12219,9 @@ well er me and steve and mark and you you're going yeah. too aren't you? so that's four of us definitely going to. -erm alison says she'd like to but her you know it depends on this that and the other. +erm alison says she'd like to but her you know it depends on this that and the other. yeah. -i i'm definitely going to i picked this up from the information places. +i i'm definitely going to i picked this up from the information places. it's got all a list of all sort of bed and breakfasts and oh. holiday flats and things. @@ -12249,24 +12241,24 @@ the the extra advantage of the of the house would be cooking which we may get. because if if people took advantage of the of these facilities it would make the whole business an awful lot cheaper for them. and if there's four of us there definitely then that's we only each have to cook once while we're there. yeah. -to get out of conference to go to cook. +to get out of conference to go to cook. if it's close. yeah. if fact it's it's i found it in the past to be a welcome very welcome break from the atmosphere because you can't hang around in in the dining hall without talking a green party. -as i remember it conference tends to run through until new clients so. +as i remember it conference tends to run through until new clients so. not really. so long as we're talking about sort of half a mile away ma maximum or with other sort of proper travelling arrangements. if it's half less than half a mile away then it's it's fine but if not it starts to becoming problematical. the other thing about financing it. so i haven't done the sums in my head. -how much is it actually to get a place? +how much is it actually to get a place? well if it's six pounds for six people that's thirty six pounds a night isn't it? for four nights plus three plus a bit. so it's about forty quid a night and there's thursday friday saturday sunday. it's four nights. -so that's that sounds quite a lot to ask the political party +so that's that sounds quite a lot to ask the political party oh i wouldn't ask them to pay yeah. that would be too much. @@ -12277,7 +12269,7 @@ i i'm quite happy to come in on it. i think i probably would like a single room though. are there two single rooms? two single and two double. -yeah well on a first come first serve basis a single room i'd come in on it . +yeah well on a first come first serve basis a single room i'd come in on it . well strangely enough i think we'll have to have double rooms . well if if we do only get four people it's going to be more isn't it? yeah. @@ -12285,14 +12277,14 @@ it's going to be ten pounds a night each yes erm. roughly and you don't get breakfast thrown in. no that's right. -i i would hope to be able to party conference probably only which would mean turning up either friday night or saturday morning. +i i would hope to be able to party conference probably only which would mean turning up either friday night or saturday morning. so potentially two nights out of the four. does it have an address helen? -no it's through erm +no it's through erm right i just wondered if she gave you an address cos it you know got a super little town map here. if i was being cynical i'd volunteer mark's car to get people to and from the town. if it was a long way out. -well he said that was a possibility but i really so. +well he said that was a possibility but i really so. but then again . erm but then it starts getting very very silly. i mean this is basically she's she already books some flats and house a house because self-catering accommodation's in such short supply because of long lets over the winter. @@ -12304,18 +12296,18 @@ for a night or two to have somewhere that they know they can at least kip on the where you know so as not to have to risk going having to go to an expensive b and b because all the cheap places have gone. so to a certain extent the idea was to that if we had the thing worked out it would be of great benefit to the people who were popping by. erm whereas at this stage the four of us could probably find accommodation which wasn't that much more expensive erm but to have the actual focus for the for the local party . -could we have people to pay the six pound a night and erm you know a hundred and forty four to start with and just ask people to pay the six pound a night anyway and just get as much back as we can? +could we have people to pay the six pound a night and erm you know a hundred and forty four to start with and just ask people to pay the six pound a night anyway and just get as much back as we can? yeah yeah. cos six pound a night isn't bad. it's less than we pay in wolverhampton . oh it's very reasonable yes. -it would be possible i suppose with the commitment of people for the local party to make on the committee. +it would be possible i suppose with the commitment of people for the local party to make on the committee. i mean i have a couple of ideas. -i was going to ask mike if he wants to come as an observer because he's never been to conference and erm +i was going to ask mike if he wants to come as an observer because he's never been to conference and erm and when it comes he was talking about spending a weekend with us anyway so it might be nice thing to do. when it comes to that though there will be people from other green parties who who'll be looking for accommodation so at the last minute we can -dick for example. +dick for example. yeah. we're hoping that we'll if he's coming he might like to be @@ -12332,14 +12324,14 @@ i'll make a decision when i'm in a position to . well this is why it would be a good idea to so people will have to decide in advance and just see how we go for do you have to send off a deposit or anything? i'll find out when i ring and she'll . -if i do i'll be ringing round frantically find out what to do . +if i do i'll be ringing round frantically find out what to do . i would suggest that given the decision we prepared to make now even if you have to send a deposit get the local party to stump up the deposit and collect the money as soon as convenient from the people who are committed to going. is that agreed with all of you here. sure mm. since the local party's going to cover the shortfall anyway if there one. okay. she'll be subletting rooms to people. -slum land for the green party . +slum land for the green party . . right is that erm. okay presumably i should put something again in the newsletter about conference and this accommodation thing. @@ -12349,8 +12341,8 @@ are you coming to conference at all. no i won't be er my family situation can change so. oh. don't have to do things like erm . -we can always run a little creche actually for nanny from scarborough got a baby as well. -give over one of the rooms to people . +we can always run a little creche actually for nanny from scarborough got a baby as well. +give over one of the rooms to people . when is it? it's er the first weekend in march. anyway shall we @@ -12374,13 +12366,13 @@ and john gummer. john gummer right yeah. lots of people who are marginal erm we don't know erm ourselves if if they're intending. so this might help tip the balance. -and because in with it it's a national campaign. +and because in with it it's a national campaign. it's er it's all all to the good. and so it's keeping up the the good work that's of of lobbying mps to such a degree that they they've got to back it which is what's brought it to its second reading as one of the most popular er private member's bills in history. erm we received eleven pounds eighty seven in donations. er the cost of stamps was eight pounds seventy four and therefore our profit -profit was three pounds thirteen pence . -not bad for somebody who thought it was going to cost us money . +profit was three pounds thirteen pence . +not bad for somebody who thought it was going to cost us money . so people gave us money for the stamps that we put on and other people gave us donations. all round erm it was great. we had our presence. @@ -12395,7 +12387,7 @@ but considering considering we were we were didn't make a loss. i held ten fifteen pounds for the privilege. relation thing. -every time i do a stall i i quake in my boots up until i do it and then i feel great when we're doing it and afterwards realize that it's been productive and we we've had a good lot a good response from the public. +every time i do a stall i i quake in my boots up until i do it and then i feel great when we're doing it and afterwards realize that it's been productive and we we've had a good lot a good response from the public. so there we go. helen do you want to tell us about the next stage? yes. @@ -12406,11 +12398,11 @@ first of all there's robert atkins m p. this is the man who erm replaced erm mr yeo oh yes. with his trousers down. -now i think erm ron was a bit upset because he spent most of of christmas sending christmas cards and saying, please please let this bill go through don't give it any . +now i think erm ron was a bit upset because he spent most of of christmas sending christmas cards and saying, please please let this bill go through don't give it any . and he said, oh alright then what's your wife like. erm however no that's right. -erm tim erm you know having desi have design?resigned he was followed by robert atkins mp for south riddle. +erm tim erm you know having desi have design?resigned he was followed by robert atkins mp for south riddle. now mr atkins former job is as minister in northern ireland so he's unlikely to know a lot about what was going on in the in the commons at the end of last session which is a bit unfortunate. he's been hiding under a under an agreement. he should at least be a very effective man. @@ -12421,7 +12413,7 @@ also is his actual title? sorry to butt in. he's the secretary of state for energy or minister for energy -minister yes sure. +minister yes sure. secretary of state for the environment wasn't it? minister for the environment. it's gummer isn't it? @@ -12454,7 +12446,7 @@ i'm asking the people round the table to write these extra couple of letters bec and so we're likely to i think if i put the whole list in the newsletter it might have put people off. yeah. erm -yes is it all about this any more in the newsletter next newsletter? +yes is it all about this any more in the newsletter next newsletter? no because i think by the end well unless something dramatic happens on the fourth of february which is this friday next friday rather. if it does i'll be on to you straight on the phone. but otherwise i i don't expect to need any more work on this for this friday. @@ -12471,7 +12463,7 @@ right i can i i can tell you. erm there'll be a whole a whole day's debate on the bill which is an achievement in itself. at the end of which a number of things can happen. firstly the bill can go through on the nod with no note. -this is possible with ballot laws is now ballot bill. +this is possible with ballot laws is now ballot bill. but we can't rely on it. it's quite possible that some mps will try and talk the bill out. that is try and ensure that when the house rises at two thirty p m the debate on the bill is still in progress. @@ -12486,8 +12478,8 @@ it is no good putting a closure vote by ninety nine to one or even ninety nine t the objector cunningly doesn't vote. we must have a hundred mps voting for the closure. all of it ah right okay. -so we need a hundred present. -which is where on a friday afternoon. +so we need a hundred present. +which is where on a friday afternoon. but if if everybody else around the country has been lobbying as hard we have there's a good chance. after all there's three hundred and three hundred and however many was yes three hundred and sixty mps who supported it. three hundred and twenty seven put their name to an easy end. @@ -12500,21 +12492,21 @@ because surely he's just enforcing the minister's policy. erm yes. but these people get together. right. -i mean it's not as if robert atkins making all the decisions. +i mean it's not as if robert atkins making all the decisions. three hundred people say hang round the bar and say,conservation board i've had lots of letters, well so have i, we'll get get through them they might cause trouble. that that's the plan. well go for democracy the decision being you know for the country being taken by three tories rather than well that's right yes rather than one. well they don't ask john major of course. -. they can tell john major . +. they can tell john major . so why i'm i'm slightly puzzled as to why robert atkins is actually more important than john selwyn gummer? i mean because i'm because john gummer's responsibilities extend a long way into things like housing and stuff as well don't they? whereas robert atkins has more specific responsibility perhaps for getting this area. people of one i don't know that's what i imagine. -people of one of the environment and the other's secretary of state for the environment. +people of one of the environment and the other's secretary of state for the environment. yeah. fair enough. it's just bizarre rules of procedure. @@ -12523,36 +12515,36 @@ yeah. to be honest i think we should be grateful they don't have to have the court magician come in wave their wand and recite the lords prayer. fair enough. -i assumed there would be a reason assume there was going to be a good reason. -erm so who else was on your list of people we ought to write to +i assumed there would be a reason assume there was going to be a good reason. +erm so who else was on your list of people we ought to write to south east cambridgeshire who's the parl parliamentary secretary to john gummer. -who's the sorry your and i can't +who's the sorry your and i can't sorry. erm -garry was robert atkins +garry was robert atkins parliamentary private secretary. and and -and james paice p a i c e +and james paice p a i c e p a i c e yes. of -mp for south east cambridgeshire and he's p p s to john gummer. +mp for south east cambridgeshire and he's p p s to john gummer. and these people are erm unpaid helpers to ministers and secretaries of state it says here. unpaid. so -they're they're the eyes and ears of their boss and they have to report any political pressure so we have to find something for them to report basically. +they're they're the eyes and ears of their boss and they have to report any political pressure so we have to find something for them to report basically. i i wrote to atkins saying as minister for the environment er, please support the energy conversation bill because it's dead good. -presumably i can also write to john gummer saying is dead good. +presumably i can also write to john gummer saying is dead good. am i right to write to the others saying i or should oh yeah. -i write to gerry saying say, please prod robert atkins and remind him that the energy conservation bill's dead good in case he's forgotten. -erm no i think the former i think the parliamentary +i write to gerry saying say, please prod robert atkins and remind him that the energy conservation bill's dead good in case he's forgotten. +erm no i think the former i think the parliamentary but i can write to him in his capacity as robert atkins' parliamentary private secretary. yes. cos otherwise it looks like writing to random m ps. i think you're sort of drawing drawing their attention to the public concern over that sort of phrase. -and widespread cross party support. +and widespread cross party support. yes. honest guv. wishy-washy statements for your audience. @@ -12561,7 +12553,7 @@ oh yes. just a couple cos i mean of lines will do. -name name dropping the supporters i mean for to those tories telling them that the that the association for county councils for example is a backer probably counts more than telling them that that is a backer . +name name dropping the supporters i mean for to those tories telling them that the that the association for county councils for example is a backer probably counts more than telling them that that is a backer . yeah well i think particularly or green particularly doing their own i just take the letters i've already written to other people change one sentence and change the er name on @@ -12569,12 +12561,12 @@ that's fine so comrade. printed off on my er employer's er computer and er put it in one of their envelopes and try to steal a stamp from them. we're gonna get it all down andy don't worry. -how wide is the green party's main bill associated with do you think? -well in the main lobbyist has been ron who's the who's our elected campaigns officers and he's quite literally been spending time treading the the hallowed halls of westminster +how wide is the green party's main bill associated with do you think? +well in the main lobbyist has been ron who's the who's our elected campaigns officers and he's quite literally been spending time treading the the hallowed halls of westminster i mean in the media. in the media i mean i haven't seen much about it in the media. er -well when when it was first read by erm it was mentioned that it had been written by the green party by radio four and the guardian and the independent. +well when when it was first read by erm it was mentioned that it had been written by the green party by radio four and the guardian and the independent. and as far as i know that's the only coverage i've seen personally of it. well i s i saw an article in erm the green alliance, a fairly shadowy organization , er mentioned in their newsletter. it was it was erm promoted by the association of conservation of energy. @@ -12593,31 +12585,31 @@ i don't know who they are really. they send out this newsletter anyway. but i mean the main the main i mean in it in certain quarters we've been down playing that aspect of it simply to get it through. sure. -but er all of the main organizations that have you know world wide and greenpeace and friends of the earth and so on and age concern. +but er all of the main organizations that have you know world wide and greenpeace and friends of the earth and so on and age concern. they all know they were all told that it's it's all a bit above board. but in promoting it to mps we've been drawing their attention to the kinds of organizations which in turn in their eyes just sort of represent that pyramid or structure of votes that . and of course when it goes through they already have our our as it were yeah. with a bit of luck and careful handling. -and the mps who who asked to put it forward including alan they they had to you know they came to ron to ask, can we put your bill forward. +and the mps who who asked to put it forward including alan they they had to you know they came to ron to ask, can we put your bill forward. they all know ron anyway . he's a very old hand in lobbying er which shows it's how it's we've got it this far. mm. -because he's known this labyrinth rubbish that they cling to. +because he's known this labyrinth rubbish that they cling to. okay shall we move on to billboards? mm. before we get bogged down. i haven't received the samples, er oh sorry i i'll moving on to what we're talking about. the national party are mounting a poster campaign for the elections. -for both elections which hope hopefully covers the euros and the er locals starting at the beginning er towards the end of the local election campaign to running through to the june. +for both elections which hope hopefully covers the euros and the er locals starting at the beginning er towards the end of the local election campaign to running through to the june. and they said erm if you would like to see the designs write and ask for a sample so we wrote and i haven't actually received any samples yet. but i have had a letter erm explaining where the billboards are in our area and how much they cost. it's a very badly written letter actually. -for one thing it starts,dear mrs knightingale which got my back up. -erm and then it goes on to say,please find the enclosed the postal sites available in your area miriam who's the green party person who's organizing it has provided the required areas and if you need any more details please don't hesitate to call me or my secretary. -and under the sites may also availability at the time of booking. +for one thing it starts,dear mrs knightingale which got my back up. +erm and then it goes on to say,please find the enclosed the postal sites available in your area miriam who's the green party person who's organizing it has provided the required areas and if you need any more details please don't hesitate to call me or my secretary. +and under the sites may also availability at the time of booking. i look forward to hearing from you with your selections . -but introductory letter aside erm interesting. +but introductory letter aside erm interesting. can i just get clarification here? yes. that letter almost sounds like we us around this table are expected to choose some of the sites. @@ -12646,16 +12638,16 @@ another couple at acomb for twenty pounds and then they also give just a cost fo so i don't know about anybody else but that's cheaper than i expected it to be. yes absolutely. and the fact that they're several in fulford that i'd say are very good sites. -i always read them erm when i about fulford . +i always read them erm when i about fulford . at fulford road or fishergate would be the best one to go for. yes. are these the sort of the like to the end of bus stops? well from what i can gather the cheaper one on fishergate is a bus stop size one. -there's one actually at the bus stop by the police station and there's another one on the corner of the erm just before you turn into terrace there's there's a free standing one outside the shop there. +there's one actually at the bus stop by the police station and there's another one on the corner of the erm just before you turn into terrace there's there's a free standing one outside the shop there. and i think the eighteen pound one is probably the big one on the side of jacksons building. erm actually high up you know full size billboard. which i'd say is less useful in fact than the little ones. -i think the little ones might noticed. +i think the little ones might noticed. cos i mean i all whenever i'm going travelling into into york and they've changed that billboard i always look at it. yeah. people in cars will notice the big one a lot better . @@ -12677,8 +12669,8 @@ i'll tell you now if the poster says labour isn't working i'm not having it. yeah what which is the nearest one to a conservative club? cos there's a conservative club down in fishergate isn't there they actually own the one on the side of the conservative building i thought. -or they thought they did until it always says conservative propaganda on the sides so i think that's a gonna . -it's it's on a little table at the end which says rate card analysis and it had t v areas yorkshire t v north east t v and then principle main secondary local corner shop other and totals numbers in the middle . +or they thought they did until it always says conservative propaganda on the sides so i think that's a gonna . +it's it's on a little table at the end which says rate card analysis and it had t v areas yorkshire t v north east t v and then principle main secondary local corner shop other and totals numbers in the middle . anybody got any suggestions on that ? will we pay the cost of the poster site? is this your understand as well as the cost of the poster? @@ -12694,10 +12686,10 @@ why don't you sponsor you know, members who don't normally come to meetings, to yeah. i think a lot of people would be willing to do that. erm make a big splash in the newsletter, please sponsor your your green party poster for the elections. -doing this this is one erm campaign that as a small proportion of the poster sites is it? +doing this this is one erm campaign that as a small proportion of the poster sites is it? it looks that way yeah. there must be lots of other . -i mean this they must have got my name through miriam so they must already have worked out the they were working +i mean this they must have got my name through miriam so they must already have worked out the they were working right. okay are you willing to go away and yeah i think i need to talk to miriam again don't i. @@ -12711,7 +12703,7 @@ that twelve well i mean it's not the huge massive billboards. i mean if they're just sort of four foot things i mean it's not you know i think. yeah perhaps. -anyway that's really into this idea. +anyway that's really into this idea. especially bob's suggestion of calling for people to sponsor sponsor sponsor a poster. @@ -12719,7 +12711,7 @@ erm should i at least be prepared to again stick something in the newsletter abo as you say it's the sort of thing that might appeal to people because then they can go and look at their poster. be photographed next to it. what do you think? -we could always do posting on the side of the conservative building. +we could always do posting on the side of the conservative building. your direct your direct action at home. yes well come and visit you in prison. right does that cover billboards? @@ -12742,11 +12734,11 @@ oh yeah it's gone back to being a leaflet it was a booklet last week . yes yeah. yes so what we mean is an intro booklet sort of a five sixteen or so pages covering ten or fifteen sort of major green party policy areas. mm. -er the idea was we'd be able to sell it to people or give it to people depending on whether they had any money or not i suppose by the green party. +er the idea was we'd be able to sell it to people or give it to people depending on whether they had any money or not i suppose by the green party. if we were really lucky we'd be able to go to conference and try and sell hundreds of them to other green parties who might want to do the same. so we a number of us went away with lists of topics that we were going to write erm two hundred and fifty or so words about. -and we went away clutching bits of and similar document and things like that. -erm and so far well i'm certainly willing to confess that i took these away full of good intentions and have have so far carried around this torn up copy of the greater london green party for months. +and we went away clutching bits of and similar document and things like that. +erm and so far well i'm certainly willing to confess that i took these away full of good intentions and have have so far carried around this torn up copy of the greater london green party for months. have they not done similar such publications knocking about the green party like catalogues for well we we had our own local manifesto before and the idea, well in in practical terms it was extremely detailed and erm each rewrite was was a very big exercise and just photocopying er it was an extremely large booklet. so we thought essentially really we're slimming down our own local manifesto. @@ -12755,7 +12747,7 @@ where and actually sort of rather than saying this is our manifesto and you know it's also generalizing beyond local council issues. mm. local manifesto tends to be tied to and attempting to remain more timeless that one or two -yeah more to sort of statements of principles rather than just a policy so it lasts a bit. +yeah more to sort of statements of principles rather than just a policy so it lasts a bit. and i wrote my section. i'd just like to make this perfectly clear that i did write a draft for work and leisure. and i even had added colours on this copy. @@ -12763,16 +12755,16 @@ yeah and i hope they weren't too harsh. they were written while i was on a train and probably in a bad mood. i didn't didn't get the opportunity to explain to you the joke beside behind your writing don't use contractions in written material. which is perfectly fair comment except that you've used a contraction. -i knew i'd used a contraction you know . -so +i knew i'd used a contraction you know . +so it does say draft actually. yeah i know. i use contractions in the newsletter some times which is deliberately honest. it's like saying avoid cliches like the plague. -i mean i i'd having been these comments and yes there are a couple of extra points put in there i think that that's fine. +i mean i i'd having been these comments and yes there are a couple of extra points put in there i think that that's fine. it's nice to get some of it done. what about the rest of you lads? -well as soon as i have a window in my diary which i'm not +well as soon as i have a window in my diary which i'm not we'll let you off with the newsletter. contribution it is said. alright i'll i'll undertake to to come up with something for our next meeting. @@ -12786,7 +12778,7 @@ you can minute me and i'll erm did you use any semicolons? probably put a split infinitive as well. well i've got the checking erm. -right so steve is undertaking to be the next brave soldier to write something for +right so steve is undertaking to be the next brave soldier to write something for i don't know what i'm doing. the general we have to be very busy. @@ -12796,12 +12788,12 @@ yeah. we'll just been too busy. then i'll try and get something if i get time but. okay -still i suppose the time's it's the actual the calendar's starting to tick for having this isn't it now. -yeah if we're actually ever gonna make use of it we will, joking aside, have to try and get something . +still i suppose the time's it's the actual the calendar's starting to tick for having this isn't it now. +yeah if we're actually ever gonna make use of it we will, joking aside, have to try and get something . well after after the big box pile up i'm i'm free on the green party. and then the elections and then get our act together. i don't think we need to be too sorry at the reason we're not getting it written is we're far too busy lobbying mps and making protests in the centre of town and things. -so it's probably good rather +so it's probably good rather on balance. right. any other business? @@ -12823,10 +12815,10 @@ we have three voting certificates but you can pass them around it's a shared job. yeah. oh might as well then. -you just have to be approved by the that's all. +you just have to be approved by the that's all. yeah i'll do that thing. right so that's got three so far and -i mean i think if you're not sure whether you want whether you'll be able to go i mean you can still you can still be a delegate then if you do go then you're able to vote so. +i mean i think if you're not sure whether you want whether you'll be able to go i mean you can still you can still be a delegate then if you do go then you're able to vote so. so you'd like to be put down on the ballot to be approved do you? doesn't mean you have to go. just means that if you do go you @@ -12837,15 +12829,15 @@ yeah i would think so. i'll tell him to give you a ring if it's yeah right i'll put him down with a question mark. oh it's nice to see people to see a good list of people who are going. -and i could put myself down as in case i get there for a day or two. +and i could put myself down as in case i get there for a day or two. and for candidates erm yeah i'll i'll stand i'll have to bite the boys again. yeah. talking of standing did did we ever make any progress on fishergate? we haven't got anybody. john hasn't come back to us. no. -erm john said he informed me he he'd stand for monk again and he i told him to write write a . -john 's monk. +erm john said he informed me he he'd stand for monk again and he i told him to write write a . +john 's monk. presumably in the selection ballot we don't have to i think we do have we can have su suggested @@ -12863,11 +12855,11 @@ do you have any not at this time. i guess i can stand somewhere. well that's got the ball rolling. -erm and if anybody runs into anybody else and can ask them or anything if there isn't actually an army of er sort of letters coming through your door saying yes yes make me a candidate. +erm and if anybody runs into anybody else and can ask them or anything if there isn't actually an army of er sort of letters coming through your door saying yes yes make me a candidate. just to remind everybody that we've decided that this year we weren't going to put pressure on people. because it just took so much of our energy last time helping people fill in forms and everything. if people aren't comfortable enough to volunteer. -i mean obviously if for example didn't ring up and say i want to sign your name your name tomorrow, i'd ring her up to see whether she'd lost her mind or something . +i mean obviously if for example didn't ring up and say i want to sign your name your name tomorrow, i'd ring her up to see whether she'd lost her mind or something . because you know she usually does. she's actually got er terrible flu. but i'm going round to see her next weekend. @@ -12878,10 +12870,10 @@ because it's erm it just takes too much energy away. right. and if we haven't got a full slate well i mean looking at that list we're doing quite well. yeah. -so would you be likely to speak to john saying again wouldn't like to pressure jean again but think john would like to +so would you be likely to speak to john saying again wouldn't like to pressure jean again but think john would like to i'm sure john would. erm i shall ring him and ask him make sure he's -i'll try and ask . +i'll try and ask . so have we taken a decision to target bishopgate then? yeah. it's five for the next five years. @@ -12902,7 +12894,7 @@ yes he does he lives in . that's in fishergate isn't it? that's very true. must be an experienced person. -i don't know cold candidate. +i don't know cold candidate. no. yeah the main difficulty is in is in the time period because it's it's quite likely that i mean i'd we'd been we'd been hoping that the target candidate could put in a reasonable amount of personal commitment to to the campaign. other and if it wasn't for for me doing a course next year which would probably preclude me from doing that, i'd be quite interested. @@ -12928,9 +12920,9 @@ possibly we could have later event if we'd read especially about it we could you know five minutes. well you know i mean you said that they did a couple of lines just to say something about -they both i mean they i think they've released four documents outlining the way in which they're going to meet their commitments and they one of their the guardian gave devoted page six the whole of page six to this. +they both i mean they i think they've released four documents outlining the way in which they're going to meet their commitments and they one of their the guardian gave devoted page six the whole of page six to this. erm and one of the pieces was sort of comments from various interested parties and the green party got a couple of lines in there after the lib dems and before . -i was still laughing too much from from some comment that the government did one one of their four promises was to was to put pri public transport before private roads. +i was still laughing too much from from some comment that the government did one one of their four promises was to was to put pri public transport before private roads. i nearly cracked up . john major saying that people will have to accept restrictions on on car usages and it's an amazing thing to come from a tory. yeah and i i asked the question not too much from the green party point of view as from a personal point view as i i would like to know what my government is saying to do about these things. @@ -12946,28 +12938,28 @@ i know i've i've read the publicity material and i thought you were going to say you voted for them. i would have had something to say about that. that's not my party -they had sir jonathan on the radio the day of the message saying they're long on rhetoric and short of substance . +they had sir jonathan on the radio the day of the message saying they're long on rhetoric and short of substance . that was the the overall comment i think that the documents were very very light on detail as you might -i've was just i heard erm how lord jonathan has just been become become a pier or something. +i've was just i heard erm how lord jonathan has just been become become a pier or something. no it's erm his father died. it it's not a hereditary title i think but i think he can become a sir if he wants to. -yeah i just i guess i had hoped to be pleasantly surprised that it wasn't rhetoric +yeah i just i guess i had hoped to be pleasantly surprised that it wasn't rhetoric the only coverage i've seen so far is erm is the news and ten of all things. that we were watching last night. -and the encouraging thing was that they're all things that a few years ago in the green party sort things out they're all there. +and the encouraging thing was that they're all things that a few years ago in the green party sort things out they're all there. absolutely. for all that the government is making a bit of er er idiot of itself by not embracing the things that it needs to embrace the things it needs to do, at least it's saying that it won't do them. which is the first step from the process isn't it? did anyone see panorama erm because er panorama was was almost entirely i've got it taped. devoted to the question of of of road transport and its limitations and erm er although again i mean there was no particular mention to any party other than the government, erm it it certainly seemed to be taking a very critical view of of road transport and it does seem to be spreading now. -it doesn't seem to be er just a few sort of you know any more. +it doesn't seem to be er just a few sort of you know any more. yeah. certainly keeps them going on the grounds that eventually there will you know we'll be able to say and this is what we believed this long and you know this is what has been proved to be necessary. so it's -we can already say that i mean there there obviously there's a lot of talk now about erm taxation towards towards resource taxes and those sorts of things which the green party were saying you know fifteen years ago or something. +we can already say that i mean there there obviously there's a lot of talk now about erm taxation towards towards resource taxes and those sorts of things which the green party were saying you know fifteen years ago or something. and now everyone's talking about it and it's in one way it makes you gnash your teeth that that we're not getting the credit yet -yeah +yeah but in another way it's gotta be given i suppose. mm. one last item for any other business erm i forgot about. @@ -12975,48 +12967,48 @@ there's a book that goes with names in this campaign. erm a policy statement like roads to the future which is what reminded me of it. and the price has gone down it's only five pounds if what from twenty five? -yes thirty thirty five. +yes thirty thirty five. erm and i was going to say we will get a a boiled down version from with our materials for the campaign. but i was going to suggest that we order a copy of the book. certainly. -okay we now have seven and a half minutes on affiliation other groups. +okay we now have seven and a half minutes on affiliation other groups. personally i think we might er defer it because that perhaps we could start with an informal chat on the topic and work up to yeah can you give us sort of thirty second briefing on what we're supposed to be developing right well it came up when war on want wrote to us and asked us to affiliate and we had a brief chat about it and felt that there are many groups that we could affiliate to. war on want almost certainly weren't at the top of the list. erm and then i think it was andy actually who said that erm affiliation is something we could do with considering. -i mean any groups at all and if so which ones. +i mean any groups at all and if so which ones. that it would be useful for us to affiliate to. -what are the implications of affiliating with somebody be questioned by that i don't know the answer to. +what are the implications of affiliating with somebody be questioned by that i don't know the answer to. it depends sometimes he gets the information sometimes it's basically just registering your your approval with them. i mean it depends on each organization doesn't it? sort of two way two way thing you agree or don't agree between yourselves. i'm in some ways surprised the non-political groups want to affiliate with with the party. -war on want are er for a long time have been the only probably the only erm that put their neck on the block as far as social and environmental aspects of the party go. -but you know i agree with you cos that as a charity. +war on want are er for a long time have been the only probably the only erm that put their neck on the block as far as social and environmental aspects of the party go. +but you know i agree with you cos that as a charity. yeah they seem to have a lot more to loose than we do. yeah. there's been a lot of trouble lately a lot of problems haven't they. war on want didn't they go bankrupt or something. they did yeah. -there is a possibility that war on want should be considered as being relatively high on our list of people we would be willing to affiliate with. -that's something that not bad at all they do as well so. +there is a possibility that war on want should be considered as being relatively high on our list of people we would be willing to affiliate with. +that's something that not bad at all they do as well so. so is this was the national war on want who contact us or the local contact? erm it was a lady who came from leek. oh. do we have any feedback from any other local parties or the national party are they recommending it or they only putting out feelers to local parties and ask what what we feel about it? no. -associated with for example you're party. +associated with for example you're party. oh that's just a mailshot deal. they quite likely the green party got a free mailshot and their communication returned or or even might have got some money from them you never know. i thought this sort of thing would be something the green party nationally should decide that whether in principle we ought to affiliate with. yeah but the advice might not have gone amiss and -yes surprising that war on want aren't asking the national party +yes surprising that war on want aren't asking the national party yeah. and instead are mailshotting all the local parties. -i think it may be it may be that they could perhaps get more money if the local parties affiliated separately but -what about our links formal or informal with other york branches of other +i think it may be it may be that they could perhaps get more money if the local parties affiliated separately but +what about our links formal or informal with other york branches of other yeah i mean this is this is erm more the sort of thing that i i had in mind. yeah. erm i think i mean we ought to be doing more with the local friends of the earth and local greenpeace i feel. @@ -13028,14 +13020,14 @@ we are getting on very well with the student green movements. both of which are also non-political so that's that's a good step forward. erm we've been concentrating a lot maintain the links with the with the university and the st james . -erm a lot of our members who were students in york stay on and and become you know active or in other parts of the country when they move on. +erm a lot of our members who were students in york stay on and and become you know active or in other parts of the country when they move on. it's very good good erm good thing for the party and they're usually quite starved of practical campaigning ideas and so we regularly try every at least every year to go and do a tour and erm we've been giving them we we're trying to rope them in on the various activities because they're crying out for -poor steve walking into the meeting at st james and there were about twenty people in the room and you said, this is the green meeting isn't it ? +poor steve walking into the meeting at st james and there were about twenty people in the room and you said, this is the green meeting isn't it ? i can't believe it there's too many people. they're they're both by a fluke at the moment they're both very strong. they went into a quiet period a few years ago it was very quiet erm but er yes they're they're going strong. -we have informal links or have had er our main contact has just left. -i've been trying to liaise with the save our forests which is and forestry privatization and technically i'm on the committee. +we have informal links or have had er our main contact has just left. +i've been trying to liaise with the save our forests which is and forestry privatization and technically i'm on the committee. but my other commitments prevent me from turning up to their committee meetings now so erm i'm sort of stepping back on to i'm just on to their mailing list. but the orig the whole idea behind that was really to to keep the green party's finger on the pulse with that. get people along get the information networked and also to to maintain a political presence amongst the people who are writing to to or potentially to vote for us. @@ -13044,8 +13036,7 @@ erm and the only way we're going to raise a profile with them is by is by making anybody seen this? can i suggest that we wind up the meeting and er. yeah thanks for thanks for facilitating andy that's great. - -the question that most of today's youngsters seem to ask is what was life like in orkney when you were my age? +the question that most of today's youngsters seem to ask is what was life like in orkney when you were my age? well looking back on it now it seems almost a life time away but it's amazing just how well you can remember those far off days. i don't think that i shall every forget the day when sugar came off the ration and at last we could make toffee. prior to that the only way that you could get sweets was if you had the necessary ration coupons. @@ -13084,7 +13075,7 @@ i recently had an interesting encounter with the honeybee and it only served to one bright sunny morning recently i set about painting the front of the house with its yearly coat of white paint to smarten it up. and i decided to paint one part of the wall which had not been painted before. unknown to me a honeybee had made a hive in this part of the wall and not long afterwards i became aware of an angry bee searching frantically for the entrance to its hive. -the sudden change of colour on the wall had upset its sense of direction and it buzzed about angrily and eventually it came into the porch where i was sitting and it stayed there for a few minutes and then went outside searching the wall again for the entrance. +the sudden change of colour on the wall had upset its sense of direction and it buzzed about angrily and eventually it came into the porch where i was sitting and it stayed there for a few minutes and then went outside searching the wall again for the entrance. and after failing to find it once again it came into the porch and complained loudly and so i went outside and with a paint brush i marked the entrance to the hive with three blobs of paint of a different colour and then with a piece of cardboard i guided the tiny winged creature towards the marks on the wall and it went inside. a few minutes later it emerged and flew off and then when it returned it looked at the wall and saw the marks and went inside. ample proof indeed that it had recognized them and it realized that it was the entrance to its home. @@ -13101,7 +13092,7 @@ human beings it seems are not the only animals who go in for worshipping idols. the farm cattle have their gods too and anyone who leaves a car or a tractor and trailer parked in a field of cattle can observe that when such a vehicle appears it produces the most unusual reactions amongst the herd. and that old theory that animals can't see colours is just not true because any vehicle which is black or red in colour appears to get more attention that any other. at first it will be surrounded and sniffed and if it appears friendly then a good licking follows and if this is accepted by the stranger then it's usually used for a good old scratch. -and that's why you can expect to find the car in the morning with the windows all covered in saliva and the wing mirrors all bent and the chrome strips on the doors are often with tufts of cow hair. +and that's why you can expect to find the car in the morning with the windows all covered in saliva and the wing mirrors all bent and the chrome strips on the doors are often with tufts of cow hair. and if the stranger has pleased the local cattle they will show their gratitude by plastering the sides of the vehicle with a generous dolloping of fresh dung before they depart. a field of cattle are normally quiet docile creatures and most of the time it's fairly safe to walk through their midst and they will observe your passing with that quiet curiosity. however the one thing that you must never do is to go between a cow and her calf and i made this mistake one morning and i had to take to my heals and run. @@ -13115,7 +13106,6 @@ when they reached their favourite bathing spot in the burn below the house they however one of the youngsters at the back in his enthusiasm to reach the water tripped and fell over the one in front and this started a chain reaction in the column and the entire orderly procession landed at the bottom in a tangle of webbed feet and flapping wings. this undignified arrival at the bathing spot started off the most dreadful family squabble and several minutes were to elapse before order was restored. the more you observe the bird and the animal life you begin to realize that they're not so dump after all and if anything they begin to look and behave more like human beings every day. - does this have to be done writing it down? yeah is it an important part of it? @@ -13124,29 +13114,29 @@ you know when you have french yeah we'll have to take a, french kids and that talking oh yeah -that's to do with the norway from english -yeah, but, there's a thingy on it, they'll be a but it ain't just us school, it's other schools in it as well -yeah i know, but, they, they'll all, there, the others is two schools is one after another school and we're the only erm boys school and it's not an all girls school doing it, otherwise it ain't -no, there's more schools than that, cos er the lady said that er, she goes i'm, cos there is when you he went what schools are these?, and so reading out a couple of schools, about four of 'em +that's to do with the norway from english +yeah, but, there's a thingy on it, they'll be a but it ain't just us school, it's other schools in it as well +yeah i know, but, they, they'll all, there, the others is two schools is one after another school and we're the only erm boys school and it's not an all girls school doing it, otherwise it ain't +no, there's more schools than that, cos er the lady said that er, she goes i'm, cos there is when you he went what schools are these?, and so reading out a couple of schools, about four of 'em and no, quite out far they were -she that hotel +she that hotel i know oh, er all what? the what? how do you know it's thingy?, how do you know it's for the kids in norway? -she said something about it in school, she goes she wants their names right and their occupation cos say like you go to the butcher shop and then you go to that and the other +she said something about it in school, she goes she wants their names right and their occupation cos say like you go to the butcher shop and then you go to that and the other yeah so norwegian they learn in english don't they though -oh yeah oh but, yeah, but, this is gonna be done mostly on the streets in it for us?, so what they gonna learn about that?don't remember when thingy +oh yeah oh but, yeah, but, this is gonna be done mostly on the streets in it for us?, so what they gonna learn about that?don't remember when thingy the last remember when he hit the first stone and hit that car window i don't -well this thing weren't it, it was parked up, this was ages +well this thing weren't it, it was parked up, this was ages yes this was two years ago, just before er activities week weren't it? -he goes what +he goes what away and he found that legged it @@ -13157,13 +13147,13 @@ he hit the back window and then he didn't do nothing, but then it all shattered did the man go up the school?, he never did he? he did and he thought i grassed, but i never, geezer want your window smashed yeah -a red light come on the back and when, and then when the and let them go, must of heard it, saw running and he's +a red light come on the back and when, and then when the and let them go, must of heard it, saw running and he's er, he didn't have to pay did he? no, he what happened about it then? -and then andy got enough trouble that year cos he as well didn't he? +and then andy got enough trouble that year cos he as well didn't he? i know, he put all the paper up his arm -that was +that was how long these tapes for?, like the first seven there, then, they're ninety minutes tape no not first, not all of 'em is it? @@ -13171,16 +13161,16 @@ yeah, they're t d k ninety they are yeah, i don't think the other ones are is that ninety minutes each way? what?, no it's just, it might be forty five -and i'm gonna go like and leyton orient just scored the goal for this, that and the other it's a big area, and everyone's going what commentator for i said i'm not i'm on the radio +and i'm gonna go like and leyton orient just scored the goal for this, that and the other it's a big area, and everyone's going what commentator for i said i'm not i'm on the radio yeah, that'll get nicked off ya no it won't that will -i will go what i'll do tomorrow is zip it in my inside pocket there and wire it and all you can see, that's enough really you don't have to ask +i will go what i'll do tomorrow is zip it in my inside pocket there and wire it and all you can see, that's enough really you don't have to ask who? does he bunk off a lot peter? no he don't bunk, he, he has got a lot of things, you know, he orders and that see you later -ah ricky did you see the state of our trainers?er ah richard it's fucked up, just gonna go over there it's alright ricky i'll do rick i can just tear this off, but i like the noise on the thing +ah ricky did you see the state of our trainers?er ah richard it's fucked up, just gonna go over there it's alright ricky i'll do rick i can just tear this off, but i like the noise on the thing you never know yeah you haven't got, you touch fucking little shit head what @@ -13192,48 +13182,48 @@ what? is that enough? enough what? you got enough? -eh, i, i was supposed to do well i was suppose to do ten, do you know how many i've done? +eh, i, i was supposed to do well i was suppose to do ten, do you know how many i've done? no one side, not even one, one side, i'm doing now -no, oh rick, rick borrow bikes weren't we?, so how come i done it? +no, oh rick, rick borrow bikes weren't we?, so how come i done it? should of put it on your bike oh what?, what?, bung it on and drop it oh i have really, not, what i've done is i've taped one, one whole side and then i taped over it again by mistake oh -what did say, she ain't come yet? +what did say, she ain't come yet? what about if she lets us keep the walkman mm? what about if she lets us keep the walkman's yeah, yeah, that'll be wicked -she wouldn't, i know she ain't never do that +she wouldn't, i know she ain't never do that is your tape recording? yeah oh no -when a country makes a produc a product, whether it'll be fruit or food or, er clothes and sells them to another country what is that called? -don't look at him, i've written the answer down when a country buys the two, mark take your coat off, give me your walkman, not suppose to bring to school +when a country makes a produc a product, whether it'll be fruit or food or, er clothes and sells them to another country what is that called? +don't look at him, i've written the answer down when a country buys the two, mark take your coat off, give me your walkman, not suppose to bring to school it's a thing sir they make animals and crops okay hey bud, where you going? i was supposed to be going home -example a thousand pound normally two and forty eight pounds, now only forty eight pounds +example a thousand pound normally two and forty eight pounds, now only forty eight pounds what? d'you think it's the wheel of fortune? well it says it is, it's been -it's a whole page spread from such an established reputable company. +it's a whole page spread from such an established reputable company. all prices are fully inclusive of double glazing, grade one security p v c delivered . i don't know. -it doesn't say anywhere there's a guarantee . +it doesn't say anywhere there's a guarantee . cheshire. i wonder if it's the same address as when we got ours? well we should have guarantee somewhere in the box there i mean it's it's, how long is it since it was supposed to have gone bust? well it's years since i thought it had gone bust i thought it was about ten years -wasn't there somebody from who got +wasn't there somebody from who got i can't remember. -when we got that, when we had ours and er they said if you if you found someone else who would like who would have you would get seventy five pounds back and you gave the thing, who was it who was thinking about it? +when we got that, when we had ours and er they said if you if you found someone else who would like who would have you would get seventy five pounds back and you gave the thing, who was it who was thinking about it? was it erm what did they call? isabel? isabel? @@ -13294,7 +13284,7 @@ mostly dry, sunny spells sally was quite intrigued by that we'll have to get her a set of books. there's some bottles, jars, for the bottle bank as well -you know the last time you the erm, the last time you missed the television pages, television supplement in the out of the mirror. +you know the last time you the erm, the last time you missed the television pages, television supplement in the out of the mirror. i don't think they believed me. and it's erm it'll be twice in a month and chris is back again as our paper boy. the other one was so useless but according to the er that new manager in the paper shop everyone else got theirs. @@ -13305,7 +13295,7 @@ because it's got all the ah. are we staying up all thursday night? well, it's up to you . -of course, well you could stay in bed all day on friday and i could take the kids to schools and go back +of course, well you could stay in bed all day on friday and i could take the kids to schools and go back i need to go, i need to go into the co-op and iceland. what shall i get for your mother? i'll get some chocolate biscuits i think. @@ -13324,7 +13314,7 @@ are those ankle boots dry? what? achilles tendon it's better now. -i d on wednesday i did the erm said to me don't do the high heel part if you think it's going to hurt again, you can still have the support under it, but i managed ok. +i d on wednesday i did the erm said to me don't do the high heel part if you think it's going to hurt again, you can still have the support under it, but i managed ok. it didn't hurt. the pink one's the dish cloth, the little one's the one i wipe up small spills off the floor. i wonder how bryony is? @@ -13342,8 +13332,8 @@ i don't know. i like her. mhm? i like her -i'll just ri rinse my fingers hand cream on my hands. -that was used as er, i can't remember what richard was using it as yesterday +i'll just ri rinse my fingers hand cream on my hands. +that was used as er, i can't remember what richard was using it as yesterday he was poking it what're we going to do about these tiles for the step? to cover this little hole up. @@ -13352,28 +13342,28 @@ oh, where're my other glasses? and they were cheaper than cheaper? fenwicks? -cheaper than what you call it, the place in i've got the price +cheaper than what you call it, the place in i've got the price cheaper than the do it yourself shop up ? but when can we get through to newcastle? well i, well i'm on a weeks' holiday aren't i, at easter? -and i've got to go, unless we go to tuesday been to the dentist +and i've got to go, unless we go to tuesday been to the dentist which tuesday? after they break up? that's right. -which is next friday +which is next friday yes so i hope they've sorted out the what?lin -the appeal at the school that mrs was supposed to have let miss white know so she could send it off to the parents to get the money back scanner +the appeal at the school that mrs was supposed to have let miss white know so she could send it off to the parents to get the money back scanner you didn't tell me about that i did tell you you didn't. -all you told me, hang on, ah +all you told me, hang on, ah miss white all you told me was that miss white was retiring but i hadn't to tell anyone, which i haven't done, which i don't intend to do -at the beginning of lent, miss white approached me to see what she should do about the appeal +at the beginning of lent, miss white approached me to see what she should do about the appeal ah ha -as she always does, since i said why send money to great ormond street when there was plenty of children locally? +as she always does, since i said why send money to great ormond street when there was plenty of children locally? yes so i asked if they wanted anything and she said a bed at the cottage hospital what good's a bed with no extra nurses? @@ -13382,52 +13372,52 @@ oh you mean a bed? you mean a special kind of mattress? well she just asked about a bed so i told her that you mean a bed to replace a bed that there already is? -she just said a bed, so i told her there were special beds that we are very useful in fact very necessary in cases and we tend to be short of them +she just said a bed, so i told her there were special beds that we are very useful in fact very necessary in cases and we tend to be short of them ah ha -and a bed costs two thousand pounds. -there's another one can't remember the name of which costs a lot more +and a bed costs two thousand pounds. +there's another one can't remember the name of which costs a lot more ah ha something like five thousand . -anyway, i said i'd make enquiries as to what was wanted and i said because there's a new children's ward will open at the hospital and perhaps they would . -so i saw mrs and mrs said they were aiming to raise money for scanner appeal +anyway, i said i'd make enquiries as to what was wanted and i said because there's a new children's ward will open at the hospital and perhaps they would . +so i saw mrs and mrs said they were aiming to raise money for scanner appeal yes -they're also going to have a obstetric department first time +they're also going to have a obstetric department first time a what? obstetric and patients yes -and that obviously they would be tend to be other children with mother's there so they would need perhaps a play facility there and other children who goes to the e n t clinic can go to the not just go to the outpatients casualty +and that obviously they would be tend to be other children with mother's there so they would need perhaps a play facility there and other children who goes to the e n t clinic can go to the not just go to the outpatients casualty yes there's very limited facilities for children to play with. so, but i also approached mrs earl about a . anyway, she wanted me to go and see her. -she said there was the scanner appeal, the talk about all sorts of other things that were possible and there's an arts appeal and for arts facilities in hospital and all sorts of things. +she said there was the scanner appeal, the talk about all sorts of other things that were possible and there's an arts appeal and for arts facilities in hospital and all sorts of things. so i went back to miss white and said about the scanner appeal and she said that would be she thought that would be the best idea, not the . -i also told here it's the diamond jubilee of the hospital and the children from invited to the hospital that day, that week sorry, it's gonna be a week in june so she wanted to know the details so i asked mrs t would she write to miss white and give her all the details but she thought it would be far better if she went to see her and explain it all. +i also told here it's the diamond jubilee of the hospital and the children from invited to the hospital that day, that week sorry, it's gonna be a week in june so she wanted to know the details so i asked mrs t would she write to miss white and give her all the details but she thought it would be far better if she went to see her and explain it all. she was going on wednesday, i hope she went. hold on, which one was going to see which one? -mrs was going to see miss white +mrs was going to see miss white was going to see miss i see -so then i saw mrs irwin on tuesday when i was in and she came up with all sorts of things that she would like for the new development. +so then i saw mrs irwin on tuesday when i was in and she came up with all sorts of things that she would like for the new development. but there's nothing ready, of course. there's this giant sundial we're going to have in one of the courtyards. it's a giant one. it's it's th the building and the blocks of things in in in the in the courtyard that make the time. -so the sun shines bit of the courtyard when it's eight o'clock and that when it's nine o'clock and so forth. +so the sun shines bit of the courtyard when it's eight o'clock and that when it's nine o'clock and so forth. this is just for the courtyard and these shrubs and things how? where is it going to be seen from? i presume it's seen from the wards that're behind looking down into this courtyard. there's also erm a play area for the children's ward. -there's also some murals on the walls, various artists did murals and of course they've got this grant from for six thousand pound for a exhibition. -a six thousand pound grant for exhibition -well, well, over, over a period it's and other things too but this this set of murals and are involved in it. +there's also some murals on the walls, various artists did murals and of course they've got this grant from for six thousand pound for a exhibition. +a six thousand pound grant for exhibition +well, well, over, over a period it's and other things too but this this set of murals and are involved in it. and various other art things. but also there's the thought of th gar a garden and the children keeping the garden up. -but that's a long way and they have transport difficulties to cope from here to the hospital but then i though perhaps, if -i can't see the education committee, with their lack of money, paying for transport for children out here to go to hospital to do a garden -the the education committee and the school governors have no money at all to pay for that +but that's a long way and they have transport difficulties to cope from here to the hospital but then i though perhaps, if +i can't see the education committee, with their lack of money, paying for transport for children out here to go to hospital to do a garden +the the education committee and the school governors have no money at all to pay for that i know, i would have thought it was very low priority -well it isn't even a priority, it's nothing, they won't get the money,th they won't pay for walk to go swimming but i thought that now that the has acquired that bus and it's gonna be standing around doing nothing for most of the time and it's a twenty nine seater bus. +well it isn't even a priority, it's nothing, they won't get the money,th they won't pay for walk to go swimming but i thought that now that the has acquired that bus and it's gonna be standing around doing nothing for most of the time and it's a twenty nine seater bus. i mean, the seats come up so that wheelchairs go in, but in between times it's twenty nine seats and then you need a p s v licence but that's that's perhaps easily remedied, if you could get a er a driving licence holder to take them, who, a volunteer driving licence holder, among one of the parents or somebody who could take the children at periodic intervals to visit the hospital to do this sort of thing. @@ -13454,20 +13444,20 @@ no, no but and just drive it but but i query as well whether, just because you reduce the number of passengers in it, that you don't need a p s v licence or the equivalent, it isn't a p s v licence but it's it's have looked into that -it sounds doubtful to me, but anyway, there's the insurance point of view, but anyway if people whoa re willing to drive can have experience in driving before they take passengers out. +it sounds doubtful to me, but anyway, there's the insurance point of view, but anyway if people whoa re willing to drive can have experience in driving before they take passengers out. y'know i didn't drive the minibus until i'd driven it without passengers. y'know i i drove the minibus with only somebody in with me before i drove it with people in it did you drive oh yes, i drove that, but that was a long time ago that yeah, but, you drove that one i drove it to ashington and back -you drove to ashington in it. +you drove to ashington in it. erm do you think i could throw these roses out? they're dead, aren't they? i'm afraid so it's a shame pardon? -they'll they'll have been forced from last sunday, that was the wasn't it? +they'll they'll have been forced from last sunday, that was the wasn't it? i know, i know but they were dead by about tuesday. the yellow one was dead by tuesday. what a shame, never mind. @@ -13478,7 +13468,7 @@ it needs a saucer of course well there's a huge saucer on the old one oh but that's in well -plant pot altogether +plant pot altogether well, just leave it there for now. erm, i'm going to put my make up on and think what i need from the shops it's ten o'clock @@ -13498,7 +13488,7 @@ some of the erm stems on it look as if as if , not mouldy, but er they're sort o well we'll just have to dig it up and put another one in green those hyacinths in the corner are taking a long time to come out, aren't they? -i'd have though the tulip in the coal scuttle, the tulips in the cauldron, i thought they'd had it, they were lying down completely +i'd have though the tulip in the coal scuttle, the tulips in the cauldron, i thought they'd had it, they were lying down completely i know, but they've straightened out but they've grown up again. and those forget me nots that're called blue ball and are supposed to have brilliant blue flowers are coming out with tiny pinky purple flowers. @@ -13509,22 +13499,22 @@ oh yeah, the one in the tub looks ok, it's the other one. i like the other one best as well, it's the peach one. when're you going to prune them? well, when i plant that other one where you want it planted, that's -i wonder when er going to have the erm +i wonder when er going to have the erm wheel barrow ready yes. oh, it said in yesterday's paper that someone had had a wheelbarrow valued at thirty pounds stolen from her back garden and it was somewhere at , where the back gardens aren't particularly accessible. so ours must have cost, i'm sure that would cost them a lot more than thirty pounds cos it didn't it didn't say a wrought iron wheelbarrow or anything, it just said a wheelbarrow well there was er four so we'll have to get it -those four tapes incidentally tchaikovsky. +those four tapes incidentally tchaikovsky. i sold them for fifteen pounds. what four tapes? -the four tapes sold them for fifteen pounds in +the four tapes sold them for fifteen pounds in that who sent you? that shirley and gareth sent me for christmas oh. i wish you would think of something you would like for your birthday -i've told you, i want a you need binoculars to go to rome with +i've told you, i want a you need binoculars to go to rome with i can't see very well through binoculars the cistine chapel. unless we take those big ones with us. @@ -13551,7 +13541,7 @@ i thought we were walking well, do you want to walk or do you want to go in the car? well i have to go to the paper shop well i'll drop you at the paper shop while i go round -oh, that's a good idea i hope we can get out at the . +oh, that's a good idea i hope we can get out at the . have you stuck a poster , you haven't, in the back window no, i haven't i think more people see the back coming up that way than they do the front window @@ -13567,23 +13557,23 @@ give me the key please. thanks. oh the car wants to be -sorry he didn't look very pleased, did he? +sorry he didn't look very pleased, did he? if he was in such a desperate hurry, he could have gone round and gone the other way we don't usually get a second post on a saturday you do, you had a parcel oh yeah. i've dropped my pen under your seat. i'll get it when we s unless you, have you got another one? -thanks have you seen kath and rory recently? +thanks have you seen kath and rory recently? no i've just realised i haven't either. when i saw that woman crossing the road, i thought it was here. please let us out someone. press the button somebody -it wasn't +it wasn't oh, thank you kind sir . it wasn't what? -it wasn't the cars there, it was the cars turning at the end of the road +it wasn't the cars there, it was the cars turning at the end of the road we need some sugar. we've had no sugar all this week, not that you've noticed. i made the custard from er sugar cubes. @@ -13599,9 +13589,9 @@ hello, please, and there was no erm television supplement and no comic in the da that's the second time in the past four weeks we've had missed that seventeen that's three sixty five please -two four five sixty five +two four five sixty five thank you -thank you thank you. +thank you thank you. you haven't given me the bits missing from the mirror. well that's erm well i'm sorry but my daily mirror was dev delivered this morning without the television supplement and without the comic and i want them @@ -13629,37 +13619,36 @@ thank you hello hello hello -raises a lot of money through sponsorship few people committing money every month. +raises a lot of money through sponsorship few people committing money every month. will it go in? yeah, i'm sure it will. thank you thank you - -they're not really are they, the chinese or oriental dancers? +they're not really are they, the chinese or oriental dancers? i don't think so anyway, they seem to be a lot of cars at the school this morning. -i parked right on the end of the erm the lane, just +i parked right on the end of the erm the lane, just mm in, there was just enough room for me. mm? -course we were late anyway well not late for john's but +course we were late anyway well not late for john's but which way do you go when i came back into ? -cos you can cut through that +cos you can cut through that i turn round and go back, yeah. mm. -and of course the coach had come up the hill couldn't overtake where i was parked, blocking off the entrance to the lane where i'd just come out of so that the string of cars coming down the road and the first one wanting to turn in and of course the coach had covered it. +and of course the coach had come up the hill couldn't overtake where i was parked, blocking off the entrance to the lane where i'd just come out of so that the string of cars coming down the road and the first one wanting to turn in and of course the coach had covered it. oh yeah -it was completely blocked off coach couldn't go backwards because there was cars behind it. +it was completely blocked off coach couldn't go backwards because there was cars behind it. so i gingerly walked down and crept into the car realized that i was the one that had caused all that -and drove off -and ignored +and drove off +and ignored slinked off into the mist. so he couldn't back back then -no no that wa that was it, completely stalemate. -big volvo estate was facing if he'd go down there, i can get through and he can come back again and he wasn't gonna do that. -too much brain damage +no no that wa that was it, completely stalemate. +big volvo estate was facing if he'd go down there, i can get through and he can come back again and he wasn't gonna do that. +too much brain damage there's a big notice at the end of the lane which says well he'd come up from totnes this morning. oh, yeah. @@ -13667,23 +13656,23 @@ what they usually do is they go up and then back down by the church yeah. and turn and go back again. mm? -it is eight o'clock though -mm perhaps i'll do some gardening. -did you do away with your or just put a plank over the top? -i put back so and then i put against the fence. -oh alex came in today. -ooh +it is eight o'clock though +mm perhaps i'll do some gardening. +did you do away with your or just put a plank over the top? +i put back so and then i put against the fence. +oh alex came in today. +ooh yeah -well he's got he's got plenty of money, right? -and er the car arrives i looked all i could see was mother sitting in the car and puffing this smoke puffing out through the window +well he's got he's got plenty of money, right? +and er the car arrives i looked all i could see was mother sitting in the car and puffing this smoke puffing out through the window mm. -and erm in came he'd had a a little tiny switch out of his black and white telly +and erm in came he'd had a a little tiny switch out of his black and white telly oh yeah -and he said it's a and the switch won't work. +and he said it's a and the switch won't work. i said how long have you had this set? he said ooh about six years, i said yeah and the rest. i said where did you get it from? -he said well i used to work at i got it from . +he said well i used to work at i got it from . i said how long is it since you retired from ? said ooh it'll be erm eighteen years this year. yeah. @@ -13694,13 +13683,13 @@ so he said oh no since i left. i said well i, i'd still reckon it's about ten years old now. oh no it's only six years old. fix the switch on i said you'll never get a new one anyway. -and oh they were talking about rod they was they were saying that, you know, about rod getting married +and oh they were talking about rod they was they were saying that, you know, about rod getting married yeah? well i said well how old is rod? i dunno he said er steve how old's rod? i said well come on you're his dad, you should know how old he is. -so he went out to the car and asked mother how old is rod? -she says i don't know don't remember having him mind you i remember having him but i don't know i can't remember when it was. +so he went out to the car and asked mother how old is rod? +she says i don't know don't remember having him mind you i remember having him but i don't know i can't remember when it was. he's thirty something. hard to put an age on him. ray was thirty eight @@ -13708,7 +13697,7 @@ is he as much as that? mm. well it must be ten years ago when he worked for the b b c and that, he must have been in his late twenties then mm. -so anyway he's he's engaged and it's taken him two years to get engaged so it's gonna take another couple of years to get married. +so anyway he's he's engaged and it's taken him two years to get engaged so it's gonna take another couple of years to get married. yeah. he's still got the m g and it's got three twen twenty three thousand on it now. it's @@ -13716,7 +13705,7 @@ mm s reg, got it from new of course,. and some chap came down from the m g b owners' club and said he'd offer him six thousand for it. mm -but he said he thought that was price cos he said it's worth at least ten the mileage originally, you know? +but he said he thought that was price cos he said it's worth at least ten the mileage originally, you know? mm. it's absolutely like new. ? @@ -13726,31 +13715,31 @@ he bought it from brand new somewhere, in devon, yeah. mm. he's got a metro at the moment they're driving around in, she drives, she passed her test at sixty eight. -so he's seventy eight now she's probably about the same i think. +so he's seventy eight now she's probably about the same i think. mm. -but they had a mini before the metro and er the day they bought the mini they saw an advert in the paper saying that if you buy a mini in the next few days +but they had a mini before the metro and er the day they bought the mini they saw an advert in the paper saying that if you buy a mini in the next few days give you a free colour portable with it. oh. -of course they didn't get the portable with this, they rang them up, said where's my colour portable said i'll put you on to the manager anyway they had some deal that night that erm to launch this mini mayfair or whatever it was wine and cheese thing so he went to the wine and cheese thing and worried he was gonna kick up a fuss so they gave him a telly anyway . +of course they didn't get the portable with this, they rang them up, said where's my colour portable said i'll put you on to the manager anyway they had some deal that night that erm to launch this mini mayfair or whatever it was wine and cheese thing so he went to the wine and cheese thing and worried he was gonna kick up a fuss so they gave him a telly anyway . yeah. he's a penny pinching old bugger he is, god! i can't quite imagine no. coming back in a minute. -yeah what about ? -the dust wagon came up to the warehouse today, the usual they'd got halfway to emptying the first dustbin in the back +yeah what about ? +the dust wagon came up to the warehouse today, the usual they'd got halfway to emptying the first dustbin in the back oh yeah. -and the hydraulic hose on the back of the dustcart broke there was hydraulic fluid all over the +and the hydraulic hose on the back of the dustcart broke there was hydraulic fluid all over the all over the car park. so the driver said can i use your phone? -he came in and trampling this brake fluid all over the carpet. -he got through to the base camp to find out when the chap was coming to fix it. -five minutes later he came in trying to tell tell us jokes and each time he'd been paddling through this brake fluid and the carpet is just you know, brains +he came in and trampling this brake fluid all over the carpet. +he got through to the base camp to find out when the chap was coming to fix it. +five minutes later he came in trying to tell tell us jokes and each time he'd been paddling through this brake fluid and the carpet is just you know, brains mm. hand picked for the job i should think. well we didn't notice the footprints until he'd left. mm. -yeah of course once they get to know where you are +yeah of course once they get to know where you are this is it and you don't o do you open weekends? you don't open saturdays now? @@ -13772,15 +13761,15 @@ yeah, okay lovely. well you know you've only gotta give me a ring alright yeah. -you've only gotta get me, you know i'll be +you've only gotta get me, you know i'll be picked your cheque up? yeah it's in there. yeah. see you shortly. -thank you very much -see you -tata -see you got a on those, yeah. +thank you very much +see you +tata +see you got a on those, yeah. bye now. yes, a little drinkypoohs would certainly help. and they say it's never been so good! @@ -13789,56 +13778,56 @@ mm. a little improvement certainly wouldn't hurt. make sure this doesn't kill it stone dead. yes. -no with these is extra, is, there's on the main board so i think i can get away with just one +no with these is extra, is, there's on the main board so i think i can get away with just one varying degrees is it? -yeah phillips usually put two of these on but right-y-o blast off. +yeah phillips usually put two of these on but right-y-o blast off. innit? that's a bit more like it. cor yeah. -ready -see those are cheap sets we can probably buy them for about twelve quid apiece couldn't we? -yeah that's right. -you can always get twenty five quid off the trade double your money, quick easy money. +ready +see those are cheap sets we can probably buy them for about twelve quid apiece couldn't we? +yeah that's right. +you can always get twenty five quid off the trade double your money, quick easy money. yeah. -that's not a bad is it really?bit of blue perhaps bit more like it innit? +that's not a bad is it really?bit of blue perhaps bit more like it innit? ooh. cor, fair near jumps out at you. compared to what it was it's bloody brilliant innit ? she'll be well pleased with that. -yeah it was a big over to the main you know that -and had a look at the, the but right, whereabouts down there +yeah it was a big over to the main you know that +and had a look at the, the but right, whereabouts down there erm -oh it's down there +oh it's down there that there ah was really black. yeah. -that's that actually i'll do i'll do th no i've just been round most of those. -i'll do this end as well i think be on the safe side. -i've been right round the lot anyway so that's jolly good. +that's that actually i'll do i'll do th no i've just been round most of those. +i'll do this end as well i think be on the safe side. +i've been right round the lot anyway so that's jolly good. over a period of time can you, yes that's it . i think some do. yeah, did you say it's from out of town this one? -industrial estate she lives down somewhere. +industrial estate she lives down somewhere. oh this one is? yeah. oh. yeah. -she phoned this morning and i said i can't come and collect it cos i'm here by myself she said oh i'll bring it in, that's alright, no problem but er we're going away to gloucester at two o'clock +she phoned this morning and i said i can't come and collect it cos i'm here by myself she said oh i'll bring it in, that's alright, no problem but er we're going away to gloucester at two o'clock oh i see i oh i said we'll try and see if we can get it done i says, so oh i see. i said if it doesn't come in at two anyway and i'll lend you something mm very good. -so +so oh well that's good, right. otherwise we'll go down i think we could let her off this time. that's er all your overheads paid innit? that's right, yeah. -i think ian used to sell these things, whatever they are. +i think ian used to sell these things, whatever they are. yeah that's what i said he said no it didn't come from me he said but i think they did used to sell something like that. he popped in a couple of times. his missus earns nineteen grand a year. @@ -13847,21 +13836,21 @@ his missus earns nineteen grand a year at the bank. cor! and he gets about, he didn't say what he got but it's over the twenty three thousand drawings that er they're worried about the level of er tax, you know, for the next my goodness. -so he must, they must get forty grand a year +so he must, they must get forty grand a year between them, yeah. -well i did a proje projection for the erm guy at nationwide, i said well it's probably gonna be about a hundred and fifty grand turnover and about twenty five to thirty percent clear, you know +well i did a proje projection for the erm guy at nationwide, i said well it's probably gonna be about a hundred and fifty grand turnover and about twenty five to thirty percent clear, you know ah net profit. which is about right i suppose, yeah. so i said i said my share'll be about twenty five grand roughly so he's quite happy with that, yeah. -yeah cos i mean come the winter we'll we won't know ourselves. +yeah cos i mean come the winter we'll we won't know ourselves. we will, i shall have to stop playing golf again. still it hasn't stopped me yet. no. -i took erm bank the other day i took hundred quid out +i took erm bank the other day i took hundred quid out right. -so i mean you would still've got your golf thing out +so i mean you would still've got your golf thing out oh right money out there and i had the hundred quid that okay @@ -13869,19 +13858,19 @@ that i gave alan so oh that's alright then. we're all straight. no we seem to be s -wages cos we've been giving ourselves under wages over the last +wages cos we've been giving ourselves under wages over the last that's true, yeah it's all worked itself out hasn't it really. i took the two videos off the shelf and re-boxed them and as soon as oh yeah come back i'll put on the shelf. -no my friend's in the trade i said they're basically working but they've got a halt on somewhere because they've come back you'll have to sort out the you've got but er they're only one ten +no my friend's in the trade i said they're basically working but they've got a halt on somewhere because they've come back you'll have to sort out the you've got but er they're only one ten yeah. -i think they both actually probably work it's just they couldn't figure out the programming on them. +i think they both actually probably work it's just they couldn't figure out the programming on them. you know? yes. yeah. -i mean if i'd had the money +i mean if i'd had the money i think so. first did it, you know and er yeah. @@ -13897,67 +13886,67 @@ oh that was the springs off heads clean, that was the belt that was gone oh yeah plasticine. -set back in the inside? +set back in the inside? yeah. -but i told him about the telly that it's a bit beyond redemption. +but i told him about the telly that it's a bit beyond redemption. mainly for where it's lived for the last three or four years i think. well yeah. -if your person don't have the er over there, i think gary's helping out this week, he might +if your person don't have the er over there, i think gary's helping out this week, he might well i can always ring bob and er confirm that. oh it was bob weren't it? yeah. -and then if he don't want it then -dee dee dee dee dee dee dee dee -thanks very much ta ta council. +and then if he don't want it then +dee dee dee dee dee dee dee dee +thanks very much ta ta council. yeah? that's very nice of them. -yeah well we, we couldn't push for a new +yeah well we, we couldn't push for a new no, no -i was just happy to +i was just happy to well yeah it's you're recording now are you? yes, i've gotta well you've got to get, get something on haven't you? gotta get these tapes filled up. how many tapes have you got to fill up? -there's twenty tapes altogether but +there's twenty tapes altogether but there's no way i can fill up twenty tapes. i don't speak that much -no should have had one in the bedroom last night with next door upstairs. +no should have had one in the bedroom last night with next door upstairs. my god she was making a racket. was she? cor! -grunting and groaning +grunting and groaning really? oh that sort of a racket yeah. yeah that sort of a racket, oh dear. -well next door but one are having erm double glazed back window, you know that main lounge window and the the guy's parked halfway across the drive with the van, left it there all in disarray you can just about get your car up and round and brains that some of these people +well next door but one are having erm double glazed back window, you know that main lounge window and the the guy's parked halfway across the drive with the van, left it there all in disarray you can just about get your car up and round and brains that some of these people no. hmm neat little telly innit? -yeah, it's er it's only +yeah, it's er it's only not working? it's only frame collapse. -oh well done then. -service switch ah! -hang on that's interesting -yeah +oh well done then. +service switch ah! +hang on that's interesting +yeah if the worst comes to the worst dave's found a place where we can get new tyres for about twenty five quid each for the m g. oh yeah. -he's still trying to find some he's phoned a bloke in plymouth see if he can get them. +he's still trying to find some he's phoned a bloke in plymouth see if he can get them. that's a nice tyre we got for the erm caravan for ten quid. it's er -would be nice cos they look ni we had on the other white m g and they're a nice +would be nice cos they look ni we had on the other white m g and they're a nice yeah . the other one's all arrived over safely and the bloke's driven it and he's all happy with it oh good. -and waiting for his next one to come +and waiting for his next one to come oh marvellous. er is he selling them over there? no he's keeping them for just fun cars for himself, he's just got the money to burn over there marvellous -so he's only, he's got a one of the new b m w seven three five that er no the big merc, a big new merc through that's right, not the the latest merc so he says er er he's a bit disappointed with the brakes on the m g but dave said they were a phenomenal brake for an m g he said +so he's only, he's got a one of the new b m w seven three five that er no the big merc, a big new merc through that's right, not the the latest merc so he says er er he's a bit disappointed with the brakes on the m g but dave said they were a phenomenal brake for an m g he said yes. compare it against the latest merc that's right. @@ -13965,12 +13954,12 @@ he's all i expect he's all been paid all his money and mm but it's good in a way that he's got his money because he can sort of, sort of finance ours -well yeah he is, he's got a little bit anyway +well yeah he is, he's got a little bit anyway till we, yeah yeah, i should imagine he is. quite a few bits and pieces. it's getting kevin in to finish it off. i phoned kevin, i've got kevin's mum and dad's phone number off dave and phoned at home but he's gone out for the day or something they said. -but he's got to strip the bonnet so dave said well i'll get my lad to strip the bonnet this afternoon and er you know,few hundred quid for the day we'll be glad to be able to finish off doing them and he's got too many +but he's got to strip the bonnet so dave said well i'll get my lad to strip the bonnet this afternoon and er you know,few hundred quid for the day we'll be glad to be able to finish off doing them and he's got too many yeah cos you haven't been able to to play with really er we c to clear ten we've still got two and a half grand left have we? @@ -13980,62 +13969,61 @@ so if he charges, you know, fifteen hundred for his bit and then another grand t oh well that's good then. we might even clear a little bit more than ten but bit more than ten, yeah. -i mean if he charges two and a half i wouldn't be disappointed cos it's been in his garage, he's pushed everything along and he's always so +i mean if he charges two and a half i wouldn't be disappointed cos it's been in his garage, he's pushed everything along and he's always so yeah, oh and he's been pretty reasonable hasn't he? we're all going out for a drink with yourselves i think. good. that sounds like a good idea. me, i don't drink. -no don't drink any more +no don't drink any more not at this moment. starts tonight dunnit? it was funny i'll see if he can arrange the old erm -the guy's er filling out the form for the er mortgage and he's er said non-smoker? +the guy's er filling out the form for the er mortgage and he's er said non-smoker? yeah, yeah and lynette yeah non-smoker, you know. -when we got outside i said i couldn't very well offer him one i only had two left in the packet +when we got outside i said i couldn't very well offer him one i only had two left in the packet that makes quite a difference on your policy, the premium yeah if you're non-smokers. she laughed, she thought it was hilarious. -it's not my day really earlier today i had to admit to being grateful to john gummer now i'm gonna have to be. -i know it's terrible isn't it i never thought i'd say that. -now i'm gonna have to say i'm gonna be grateful to mr it's a really bad day. -no i am grateful to mr because he's finally crystallised in my mind something that's been bugging me the longer i stay on this council about exactly what the tories see their role here as and it's now very clear to me, more than ever and that is that if you want to be obstructive and negative and if you go on long enough being obstructive and negative what you can end up doing is that you'll find yourself eventually in a position going on long enough that you can make totally meaningless speeches but at least you'll get nice headlines in the paper and that seems to me the whole essence of the tory strategy. -when my colleague to my right here, roger and myself put forward a motion at last council on this issue ably led by our glorious leader to my left i would like to say that we've set up. -now what i would like to say is that we've made clear that we're with certain very clear objectives in pushing forward, in saying that certain things had to be achieved and when i read the lilac piece of paper or whatever colour we want to call it. -i see a set of conclusions that achieve almost everything that was demanded at that time and i am grateful to everybody concerned who's actually sat down and actually really thought about what we're trying to do and everybody has made some compromise here and i shall certainly support this amendment and i shall make the compromise because the one thing in here that i thought was necessary that isn't there is the statement that there will be a head of centre and having actually worked in a project, head of sorry, head of project and having actually worked in a situation where i was a joint manager erm in the long run i think people will see the the wisdom of of a single head of project. +it's not my day really earlier today i had to admit to being grateful to john gummer now i'm gonna have to be. +i know it's terrible isn't it i never thought i'd say that. +now i'm gonna have to say i'm gonna be grateful to mr it's a really bad day. +no i am grateful to mr because he's finally crystallised in my mind something that's been bugging me the longer i stay on this council about exactly what the tories see their role here as and it's now very clear to me, more than ever and that is that if you want to be obstructive and negative and if you go on long enough being obstructive and negative what you can end up doing is that you'll find yourself eventually in a position going on long enough that you can make totally meaningless speeches but at least you'll get nice headlines in the paper and that seems to me the whole essence of the tory strategy. +when my colleague to my right here, roger and myself put forward a motion at last council on this issue ably led by our glorious leader to my left i would like to say that we've set up. +now what i would like to say is that we've made clear that we're with certain very clear objectives in pushing forward, in saying that certain things had to be achieved and when i read the lilac piece of paper or whatever colour we want to call it. +i see a set of conclusions that achieve almost everything that was demanded at that time and i am grateful to everybody concerned who's actually sat down and actually really thought about what we're trying to do and everybody has made some compromise here and i shall certainly support this amendment and i shall make the compromise because the one thing in here that i thought was necessary that isn't there is the statement that there will be a head of centre and having actually worked in a project, head of sorry, head of project and having actually worked in a situation where i was a joint manager erm in the long run i think people will see the the wisdom of of a single head of project. but that's up fo that's up to people experience t t t t to conclude. -but the main there 'ere is, we haven't actually changed our position we have actually stated clearly that we wanted to achieve something, we wanted to make sure that what was being provided in that community was the best best thing possible within the resources available and that things developed on this amendment takes us that way forward and we are at least being clear to our principles rather than just being negatively obstructive. +but the main there 'ere is, we haven't actually changed our position we have actually stated clearly that we wanted to achieve something, we wanted to make sure that what was being provided in that community was the best best thing possible within the resources available and that things developed on this amendment takes us that way forward and we are at least being clear to our principles rather than just being negatively obstructive. mr thanks chair. -i just like to start off by saying and just reminding the council well in particular mr in light of what he said that he doesn't understand what mr is on about, well he's never understood the issue of the merger in highfields. -mr has made more publicity on this issue than any other councillor. +i just like to start off by saying and just reminding the council well in particular mr in light of what he said that he doesn't understand what mr is on about, well he's never understood the issue of the merger in highfields. +mr has made more publicity on this issue than any other councillor. i think there's no issue in his patch that he might want to talk about. -but he's made national headlines local and every other headlines that comes about regarding this issue of the merger. -but i think in seconding this motion i think it's a way forward and i think it's better late than never i think what it talks about that we would not be here today mr chairman if this would have been agreed by what was put by the officers two and half years ago. -it's not a federated system, it actually, positively talks about moving forward as professor states it in the economical situation the council is in. -it talks about one budget covering for the two centres and it also talks about two heads of centres which is more practicable and more rational than any other s situation that would have been if the merger decision would have stayed. -there has never been an argument put by anyone to convince myself or people who have protested against the merger, a rational argument has never been put against what people have said that the merger is a rational way forward. -i think it would have been a disaster and a recipe for disaster because practically if you know what the situation is in the moat centre and the highfields youth and community centre then people would have never resisted to that change. -i'm not saying that people would have never changed their ideas but if it would have been done in the manner that it would have been done in in the first place and if people would have been told about their future lives and if people had been, would've accepted what was going on in light of all the decisions that have been taken previously regarding the merger issue. -i think these proposals not only are a way forward but also in light of what is actually happening in the area of highfields with er the high numbers of unemployment, with the high rate of people underachieving in education i think for the last two and a half years there has been no clear guidelines or structure that has systematically brought about any results in the two centres to move forward where people have lost out by this issue being bureaucratic and a political football that's being kicked about and i think it's about time where we now have cross party consensus that we move positively forward and work towards these proposals. -i mean in so i i come here today with a petition that i presented that also talks about proposing to abolish the merger, i mean this is a move just one step away from that but i still feel in what was proposed at the last full council meeting and i would express my views to the officers that in light of what has been suggested today is actually implemented to the wording as it stands because the joint working party that had been er written up previously never did meet although if i can inform it was only the officers who actually met up and i hope that in light of all the working group and the two heads of centres covering for each other would be implicitly applied. +but he's made national headlines local and every other headlines that comes about regarding this issue of the merger. +but i think in seconding this motion i think it's a way forward and i think it's better late than never i think what it talks about that we would not be here today mr chairman if this would have been agreed by what was put by the officers two and half years ago. +it's not a federated system, it actually, positively talks about moving forward as professor states it in the economical situation the council is in. +it talks about one budget covering for the two centres and it also talks about two heads of centres which is more practicable and more rational than any other s situation that would have been if the merger decision would have stayed. +there has never been an argument put by anyone to convince myself or people who have protested against the merger, a rational argument has never been put against what people have said that the merger is a rational way forward. +i think it would have been a disaster and a recipe for disaster because practically if you know what the situation is in the moat centre and the highfields youth and community centre then people would have never resisted to that change. +i'm not saying that people would have never changed their ideas but if it would have been done in the manner that it would have been done in in the first place and if people would have been told about their future lives and if people had been, would've accepted what was going on in light of all the decisions that have been taken previously regarding the merger issue. +i think these proposals not only are a way forward but also in light of what is actually happening in the area of highfields with er the high numbers of unemployment, with the high rate of people underachieving in education i think for the last two and a half years there has been no clear guidelines or structure that has systematically brought about any results in the two centres to move forward where people have lost out by this issue being bureaucratic and a political football that's being kicked about and i think it's about time where we now have cross party consensus that we move positively forward and work towards these proposals. +i mean in so i i come here today with a petition that i presented that also talks about proposing to abolish the merger, i mean this is a move just one step away from that but i still feel in what was proposed at the last full council meeting and i would express my views to the officers that in light of what has been suggested today is actually implemented to the wording as it stands because the joint working party that had been er written up previously never did meet although if i can inform it was only the officers who actually met up and i hope that in light of all the working group and the two heads of centres covering for each other would be implicitly applied. in light of er near time -all the consultation that also talks about in this paper is met with the two centres, the management committee of highfields youth and commune centre and also the users of the moat centre and i think in light of everything that's gone on i think it's substantially a success to stand here and say that we have at least achieved some result and i i formally would welcome the libs supporting this this afternoon and i'm grateful for the turn that the libs have made and in light of er what er mr the involvement mr has put in. -time time time now please. +all the consultation that also talks about in this paper is met with the two centres, the management committee of highfields youth and commune centre and also the users of the moat centre and i think in light of everything that's gone on i think it's substantially a success to stand here and say that we have at least achieved some result and i i formally would welcome the libs supporting this this afternoon and i'm grateful for the turn that the libs have made and in light of er what er mr the involvement mr has put in. +time time time now please. thank you. thanks chair. -mr do you wish the right of reply. +mr do you wish the right of reply. no it's mr -mr +mr not really chair . i'm mean we've discussed it often but i i would be grateful if we could -it's mr i'd hate to stop mr in full cry -okay then chairman i i would er recommend that we support the amendment moved by mr . +it's mr i'd hate to stop mr in full cry +okay then chairman i i would er recommend that we support the amendment moved by mr . right, those in favour. - welcome back. right, this week an army lieutenant was jailed for fifteen months after a court martial heard him plead guilty to seven charges relating to bullying and humiliating new recruits. the sentence on the staffordshire regiment officer is subject to confirmation but the question we're asking is how often are other recruits subject to bullying and intimidation? @@ -14050,18 +14038,18 @@ from you than the statement you've just made er and i think you'll be you used t if i can come to you andrew , you were in the royal highland fl fusiliers, what that's correct. happened to you? -basically the full time i was in basic training and when i went to the regimental the royal highl fusiliers regiment the first battalion, i was physically beaten and mentally tortured er into the same bargain. +basically the full time i was in basic training and when i went to the regimental the royal highl fusiliers regiment the first battalion, i was physically beaten and mentally tortured er into the same bargain. well what do you mean by mentally tortured? -well they can physically do it to you with use of fists, use of hands and whatever else they've got and they can mentally do it to you like put you in jail that or all sorts of things like when i was on sick leave, they came and lifted me. +well they can physically do it to you with use of fists, use of hands and whatever else they've got and they can mentally do it to you like put you in jail that or all sorts of things like when i was on sick leave, they came and lifted me. right well t t tell me about the physical abuse, what sort of things were they doing to you andrew. beat ya up. n c os, noncommissioned officers beat ya up, and a above them as well. you get so -in a battle camp, you're supposed to be learning how to fight in a war and basically they beat ya up, and in camp as well, it happens in camp too. +in a battle camp, you're supposed to be learning how to fight in a war and basically they beat ya up, and in camp as well, it happens in camp too. and did did you see th w was it widespread, did you see it happening to other people? it's very widespread. -actually i witnessed a guy being raped in the army. +actually i witnessed a guy being raped in the army. that was by that was by normal recruits but it still happens it, actually the the bullying goes down the line. the n c os bully, the officers bully the n c os, the n c os bully the privates and the privates bully the privates. it goes down the line, all the way down the line. @@ -14075,7 +14063,7 @@ i did, i did, i s actually put a stop to it. that's so that was a brave thing to do? i wouldn't say it was brave it was a normal thing to do, wasn't brave, there was nothing brave about that. -was just a normal thing to do +was just a normal thing to do you'd expect yeah y you'd expect somebody to do that for you of course. of course i would. did you find wh when you were being bullied or when other people were being physically intimidated that other soldiers would help them or would they just stand by and let it happen? @@ -14092,13 +14080,13 @@ but there's certainly not a haven for bullies or no nor is it endemic in any way well some people would claim it is endemic. some people would actually claim that there is a culture of bullying within the military infrastructure. but let's t let's t -well i would deny that +well i would deny that well let's talk let's talk to richard . richard er er h these are occasional examples and they're very very rare. i would disagree with that. i would disagree with that a lot. well what's your experience? -well erm apart from my own experience erm i witnessed, i couldn't even m er name as many erm instance of bullying that went on in my regiment erm and for all different kinds of reasons you know. +well erm apart from my own experience erm i witnessed, i couldn't even m er name as many erm instance of bullying that went on in my regiment erm and for all different kinds of reasons you know. erm in my regiment i was in you were in the grenadier guards? i mean i was the on i was the only black guy in the regiment erm for a very long time and erm you know it didn't it doesn't matter what colour you are erm apart from my case, there was if you was erm if you were slow on your runs or you wasn't good at at cleaning your kit you would get bullied. @@ -14108,7 +14096,7 @@ it was just disgusting stuff you know. what sort of stuff? well i mean there was an incidence where erm maybe a guy who didn't clean himself very often they would er a whole group of guys would find it funny to take him into the toilet erm fill a bath up with half with water, put bleach in it erm excrete in it, urinate in it and put him in hit, hit him with ba erm brushes, all kinds of stuff like that. let's let's make it clear. -are these occasional examples that you're +are these occasional examples that you're they weren't occasional at all, not in my regiment, no. and this was in training as well. but is this not something you just have to put up with if you join the army? @@ -14126,7 +14114,7 @@ yeah. says if you can't take how would you be able to handle the front line . if you leave, if you leave let's say if you get caught and sent back then you're gonna get back you know twice as much as you had for the reason for leaving. have you learnt anything from the experience? -yeah i've learnt a lot basically, i've learnt erm erm basically what sort of organization that is and those other ones i could mention as well which run along the same sort of lines erm i've learnt to look after myself +yeah i've learnt a lot basically, i've learnt erm erm basically what sort of organization that is and those other ones i could mention as well which run along the same sort of lines erm i've learnt to look after myself has it toughened you up? yeah it has. so some people might say perhaps perversely that it th it has achieved its desired effect, it's toughened you up . @@ -14148,12 +14136,12 @@ now you would court martial them well i put it to the s i b s i b what's that? that's the special investigation branch . special investigation branch. -all the allegations i made, all the beatings i took, i'm bleeding they investigated nothing, and what the brigadier said, the brigadier is talking nonsense. +all the allegations i made, all the beatings i took, i'm bleeding they investigated nothing, and what the brigadier said, the brigadier is talking nonsense. he knows that the army is w widespread in the army and he . -it's like everything else you company commander, you tell him, he throws it out the window. -he sends you away make you feel happy +it's like everything else you company commander, you tell him, he throws it out the window. +he sends you away make you feel happy do you know i've served in the army for thirty three years and i've commanded every thing at every level in the infantry which both these gentlemen have been in, from a platoon right up now to a brig er brigade and i can honestly tell you that i haven't seen more than a couple of incidents of bullying in the whole of that time . -you're a commissioned officer +you're a commissioned officer the point is the point is that's that's a good point what you've said you don't see it. that's the whole point. you come at a barrack room as an officer @@ -14165,7 +14153,7 @@ with rank on your arm yeah. the soldiers i that room will act a different way i i agree. -when the door shuts +when the door shuts i understand that. a different way again they will . @@ -14173,15 +14161,15 @@ i can understand that , i can understand that. but it's a matter leadership. and leadership in the army is some leadership has got nothing to do with it whatsoever. -leadership +leadership it's just a case of it's just a case of a few individuals or people with rank who think they've go so much power they're gonna press people -yes i'm sorry to hear that people in rank in your particular case were involved +yes i'm sorry to hear that people in rank in your particular case were involved yeah well we've got a job to do if you're a soldier you've got a job to do okay, you've got a bit of training, you've got a job to do right absolutely yeah you don't need no distractions, and bullying and bullying i quite agree, i quite agree -and racism and all that,distractions -i quite agree +and racism and all that,distractions +i quite agree and if you're gonna send people to northern ireland and places like that you want 'em to defend the next soldier? well c could i just come in? but they do. @@ -14189,7 +14177,7 @@ david lightbown yes david lightbown . andrew i'll let you back in. in a minute,in a minute. i i certainly didn't go in in in in with a rank on my shoulder, i went in as a recruit. -but you said +but you said but when i when i when i trained as recruit i trained with a lot of other er lot of other people . but that was in different days, this is nineteen ni there was no easy way out in my day you w yo y @@ -14199,22 +14187,22 @@ now when you did this national service you served your country for a set period of time. i actually did three years of that that period of time in in in the army. the majority of people that went through that service all had some recollection of things they didn't enjoy very much but they by and large thoroughly enjoyed their experience in the army, it livened them up, it made them better men and we have got after all one of the best armies if not the best army in the world, it's got to come from -i don't think that's +i don't think that's somewhere and it has to come from the training. alright andrew briefly briefly. go on. basically i don't disagree with you, aye we have got the best army and i loved my i loved my time in the army but i'm totally against the way i was treated in the army. -that doesn't there's when you're off duty it's great but when you're on duty it's different. +that doesn't there's when you're off duty it's great but when you're on duty it's different. the army's made me a lot better person. -i'm a i totally disagree +i'm a i totally disagree you had a you you you were unfortunate in the way you were treated -with you in the way it is run when you when i took my allegations to him because that's basically what they're saying it is i know it's no allegations -let's not go into the specifics of the court case just now david lightbown, what i want to say to you, do you think it's a case, some people might perhaps unjustifiably but they still would say that those people who are bullied are bullied because they are nonconformists and in the military one has to conform and many people +with you in the way it is run when you when i took my allegations to him because that's basically what they're saying it is i know it's no allegations +let's not go into the specifics of the court case just now david lightbown, what i want to say to you, do you think it's a case, some people might perhaps unjustifiably but they still would say that those people who are bullied are bullied because they are nonconformists and in the military one has to conform and many people well of course of course they do. it's what our the army's all about. so if in any way you're different, if you're black or if you're short or if in any way you're different, you're fair game for the bullies perhaps? it's not whether you're black or white, it's not whether you're pink or green, it's how you respond to orders. -and how quickly you respond to orders situations . +and how quickly you respond to orders situations . did you not respond to orders richard richard? it's not a case of black and white did you say? no. @@ -14226,8 +14214,8 @@ but you survived it. and you will go on surviving it, you will turn why should i have to survive it?my country too you know, i know it's your country too. -and nobody no no nobody nobody is saying that you were tr -i was told when i was in my regiment i was told my country, it wasn't my country that was what i was told. +and nobody no no nobody nobody is saying that you were tr +i was told when i was in my regiment i was told my country, it wasn't my country that was what i was told. nobody is saying that david lightbown you were treated correctly,badly treated . @@ -14239,7 +14227,7 @@ let's speak to er tim er . now tim er, you were a soldier now you're a social worker. we heard earlier on about this this this regimental bath i think they call it, this bath of excreta and urine and bleach and the brigadier and david lightbown said how rare this was, er did you ever see it? certainly to the extent that er richard has experienced it, no. -but it was a fairly common way of getting people who perhaps wasn't up to standard or whatever, other recruits would grab them, and as he's described take them into the bathroom , +but it was a fairly common way of getting people who perhaps wasn't up to standard or whatever, other recruits would grab them, and as he's described take them into the bathroom , throw them into a bath filled with whatever they chose to erm so it's a fairly common occurrence? it happened certainly two or three times during my training. @@ -14247,20 +14235,20 @@ in your own training you saw it? mhm. er the so-called regimental bath. now there's another case here we've heard of er of racism, and i mean racism is the pretext very often for for bullying and bruta brutality and intimidation. -and er er paul your stepbrother er he died while he was with his regiment. +and er er paul your stepbrother er he died while he was with his regiment. what happened to him? -yes my brother er joined the army about two years ago until he took his own life earlier on this summer. +yes my brother er joined the army about two years ago until he took his own life earlier on this summer. erm he started his life er in vietnam in the violence of vietnam, and had therefore a lot of violence in his early life, which i think really stayed with him, but when he did join the army, he was very proud to be doing so, and very proud to be wanting to be part of britain and serving britain in whatever way he could. and a i would say that actually during the early period in the army, i think he probably gave as good as he got. i mean it was tough, life was tough for him and i know that he faced quite a lot of comments both of racist and other other things . -he was vietnamese presumably the comments were of a racist nature ? +he was vietnamese presumably the comments were of a racist nature ? yes er yes that's right. and and he took quite a lot of them but in the time that name calling? oh all of that, name calling and and quite a bit more. but during that time when things were going well, he managed it. i think the thing that worries me most is that later on, he didn't manage it too well, a lot of other things were going wrong in his life, and at that point the name calling continued, and the stuff that maybe wasn't so hurtful early on seemed to become very hurtful then. -and my main concern and complaint is that the army, with its its emphasis on being macho, on being strong, on being okay, doesn't allow people to have their own weaknesses and in 's case, i just wish somebody somewhere in authority had spotted that he was a lad in trouble. +and my main concern and complaint is that the army, with its its emphasis on being macho, on being strong, on being okay, doesn't allow people to have their own weaknesses and in 's case, i just wish somebody somewhere in authority had spotted that he was a lad in trouble. but if you do have pe people will say if you do h have those weaknesses and if er there were times that he could was quite up to the joshing and the name calling, there were times when he wasn't, the very fact that there were times when he wasn't, doesn't that tell you that perhaps the army wasn't the place for him? well i don't know about that because i don't think that anybody stays the same all the way through their life, and i don't think there's anybody in life that's strong in every circumstance. i believe everybody at some point needs support. @@ -14278,7 +14266,7 @@ if i was on the streets of ireland now, and i've been there many occasions and s and i do take it and i have taken it and i just get on with my job. but that's -it's a lot easier it's a lot easier to say that . +it's a lot easier it's a lot easier to say that . richard, richard if you w if you were on the streets of belfast for example goodness only knows what they would say to you, just because you're british and they'd use the pretext that you're black to to really throw horrendous insults at you. let me tell you, let me tell you one incident er in northern ireland. erm we was on patrol, we was going somewhere, we passed er a big factory wall, on the way back er a day later, on the wall was, go home british wog. @@ -14289,7 +14277,7 @@ that's right in the way it has done, and furthermore, every year there's a survey taken in this country, where we look across the country at the public service and we ask people in the community what they think of their public services. year after year we come out with a satisfaction rating of over eighty per cent. now the community doesn't feel that we're a load of bullies, the community doesn't feel that we're not doing our job properly and i think that's very very important. -well robert here a a barrister, i'll just get the microphone over here, you're a barrister and you've prosecuted quite a lot of, you've been in the army yourself and prosecuted a lot of cases, now h he says that er that the british public love the army, but from what we're hearing tonight, there's a lot that's rotten to the core? +well robert here a a barrister, i'll just get the microphone over here, you're a barrister and you've prosecuted quite a lot of, you've been in the army yourself and prosecuted a lot of cases, now h he says that er that the british public love the army, but from what we're hearing tonight, there's a lot that's rotten to the core? well well can i take issue with the brigadier on one point. it's true to say that very few cases come to court martial. but it's the nature of the offence as such that if a soldier is bullied, he's unlikely if he wants to stay in the army, to bring it to the attention of the authorities, because he know that afterwards he has then to live with the people who he's complained about. @@ -14302,7 +14290,7 @@ we we heard there from r richard and andrew, it's a hierarchical bullying as wel i i'm sure that's right, i'm sure that's right. can i just say one thing about andrew's point about the s i b. in my experience the s i b when they receive these sort of complaints do investigate them very thoroughly, and i'm surprised at his experience. -but the problem is the lower level at that,i i i it's at the n c o level where complaints are made by soldiers and because the complaint has to be made through the regiment, then the the pressure is for the soldier to withdraw his complaint . +but the problem is the lower level at that,i i i it's at the n c o level where complaints are made by soldiers and because the complaint has to be made through the regiment, then the the pressure is for the soldier to withdraw his complaint . rea really brief so how widespread is it in the army, bullying or intimidation? how how can we tell, because as an officer, and this is this is richard's point, as an officer how do you know what goes on in the barrack room? nicky can i have a word ? @@ -14343,7 +14331,7 @@ and that is that pick that up briefly then we wanna talk about james again . very quickly. because of course we're looking at the importance of bringing this on right from the time that a man joins as a recruit, and i realize that's when they're very vulnerable indeed, they're unfit probably, they're nervous, they're not a team yet, and we've developed all sorts of things. -for example, we now brief recruits on their rights and tell them and encourage them to actually come forward with their complaints, we very carefully brief and select our n c os, we have open days for parents, we bring parents in so that they can feel part of the set up right from the start and so that their sons join the army and they tell their other friends to make sure they do to. +for example, we now brief recruits on their rights and tell them and encourage them to actually come forward with their complaints, we very carefully brief and select our n c os, we have open days for parents, we bring parents in so that they can feel part of the set up right from the start and so that their sons join the army and they tell their other friends to make sure they do to. we've introduced women's royal volunteer service people, outside the chain of command so that young soldiers can go along and speak to them and you deal yourself with new recruits and so forth as a sort of p r man, you you deal with new recruits? i personally don't deal with recruits but there's as you know there's a depot which er @@ -14366,18 +14354,17 @@ erm anonymous, my son joined the paras five years ago and he was bullied, and an ian from earlsbury, i spent fourteen years in the air force,bull bullying has always gone on but only when soldiers didn't conform. and someone who's and ex-military policeman called to say, a lot of bullying does go undetected, but i if it was left to the royal military police, bullying would decrease. and darren from stoke on trent was in the forces for three years and he didn't see any bullying at all. -well after the break, you can buy them, this is one of them, for as little as twenty five pounds, elton john's been wearing something altogether more expensive at the high court this week but does it look much better? +well after the break, you can buy them, this is one of them, for as little as twenty five pounds, elton john's been wearing something altogether more expensive at the high court this week but does it look much better? will you see the join when you join us? and men in wigs, next. - -for a while i was in the air force and then i lived in various parts of the country. -but coming back to live in like to call it, er in nineteen seventy five. +for a while i was in the air force and then i lived in various parts of the country. +but coming back to live in like to call it, er in nineteen seventy five. and i know perfectly well that there's no way that er i could get my wife to move out of the town, she loves it. and so so indeed do i. -anyhow, er this evening very happy to provide a few pictures for you to have a look at, and hopefully with a bit of information. +anyhow, er this evening very happy to provide a few pictures for you to have a look at, and hopefully with a bit of information. if there's anything you want to er er to ask me about, please don't hesitate to er to butt in at any time. erm can you all reasonably see what er what's going on? -right this is er merely a map erm where we're dealing with er local people. +right this is er merely a map erm where we're dealing with er local people. it's er it's not so necessary probably er as where at times i've given talks in various parts of the country on on this area. er but erm this gives an idea of the railway lines that er well basically were in this area, erm i suppose er still round about nineteen fifty sixty time. some of them had er already gone. @@ -14385,14 +14372,14 @@ but that's that's er basically what was was around. and of course er the nottingham, lincoln y lincoln line here. the er main east coast main line over here. the er mass of lines in the nottingham area, and so on. -and that is a real subject in itself, and i think you've probably had john talking to you. +and that is a real subject in itself, and i think you've probably had john talking to you. have you not? er john's erm quite a whiz on that one. erm anyhow, this evening, i'm proposing to just merely cover this particular area, particularly. -erm and then just coming along here and er as far as and and just coming back to there. +erm and then just coming along here and er as far as and and just coming back to there. erm let's have a look and see what we can we've got. erm well as many of you know the first one of the first things that you see, if you're c approaching the town from from the a six one two, from er . -or from , er is that building, which is the old crossing keeper's house or cottage. +or from , er is that building, which is the old crossing keeper's house or cottage. erm it has been altered somewhat since the original er railway days, but nevertheless it retains quite a bit of the old character erm and er the high pitched roofs erm and the . interestingly, of different styles on that. it's not such an attractive house as the station master's house, but nevertheless er it is one of only two railway buildings now left er in this town. @@ -14400,47 +14387,47 @@ and of course as many of you will know, the railway line er used to run just in there's another picture of it, as one er goes past on the road. and again. very steeply pitched roof. -now if you want to go and have a look at the other oth the oth other building, at er railway er the railway, erm going down road, er again a pointer to that one time this er town did have er a railway, er is of course the arms. +now if you want to go and have a look at the other oth the oth other building, at er railway er the railway, erm going down road, er again a pointer to that one time this er town did have er a railway, er is of course the arms. i think that's they've altered that, they've put a porch over there haven't they, since er i took that one. er but er that was very much the local, er in victorian times. er for the er the station. there again erm i think there's still on the windows here, there's still reference to one of the coal merchants i think isn't there? have a look anyhow. -erm looking across from the arms, one can see that, what i can only describe as a delightful bit of architecture, erm perhaps i'm a little bit er of a philistine, but er i think it's one of the nicest, most attractive buildings in the town. +erm looking across from the arms, one can see that, what i can only describe as a delightful bit of architecture, erm perhaps i'm a little bit er of a philistine, but er i think it's one of the nicest, most attractive buildings in the town. erm you know i like georgian and i like a lot of other architecture but that i think has got tremendous character. er and of course was the old station master's er house. -the erm well let's see, again the steeply pitched roof, the er the chimney's, er the barge-boards, the finials, er and the er angled fencing, which was characteristic of the railway er post about nineteen o seven. -and also the railway used it and er it was used elsewhere, and it's interesting this, i noticed that erm b r have recently erected er er this type of fencing er which is adds insult to injury possibly, on the at er . +the erm well let's see, again the steeply pitched roof, the er the chimney's, er the barge-boards, the finials, er and the er angled fencing, which was characteristic of the railway er post about nineteen o seven. +and also the railway used it and er it was used elsewhere, and it's interesting this, i noticed that erm b r have recently erected er er this type of fencing er which is adds insult to injury possibly, on the at er . er but i you know it's rather nice actually. erm anyhow, that was the sort of site er a few years ago. see it's very very attractive, the erm stonework and so on and the slate roofs. and er er it didn't used to be erm white barge-boarding, er nor white erm fencing. but nevertheless i think it looks very attractive in that way. just note the er the entrance round there in the in the hedge, er from the new building nearby. -there's another picture of it where er this was er about five or six years ago this was taken, and you can see there, going along to the end of the er of this fencing, the post there which was one of the er of the posts er to which the gates, the crossing gates were attached. +there's another picture of it where er this was er about five or six years ago this was taken, and you can see there, going along to the end of the er of this fencing, the post there which was one of the er of the posts er to which the gates, the crossing gates were attached. there you have a brick wall. now once upon a time, there was a railway. -looking back you can see the riverside erm and basically just er here was the railway, and the entrance to the goods yard, er coal offices etcetera, or at least one of the entrances, was on that side. -coming back to look at this erm er, as i say, very attractive building, again, and you can see there's still a bit of work there. +looking back you can see the riverside erm and basically just er here was the railway, and the entrance to the goods yard, er coal offices etcetera, or at least one of the entrances, was on that side. +coming back to look at this erm er, as i say, very attractive building, again, and you can see there's still a bit of work there. and er to go back and you can see it here. -nice lamp and as i say, these er the barge-boarding. +nice lamp and as i say, these er the barge-boarding. excellent erm brickwork as well, just just proud there. now you can see here, again, we've still got er some gateposts. that actually is a a railway gate post unless they've changed it, which i don't think they have. -on that one was taken a little bit earlier, you can see they certainly had one of the old er gates there. -and looking up that er driveway er now they've got that house there,you can see er what the view is, say up that entrance. +on that one was taken a little bit earlier, you can see they certainly had one of the old er gates there. +and looking up that er driveway er now they've got that house there,you can see er what the view is, say up that entrance. and there again, much the same. and just take note of that. and that's what it looked like in nineteen seventy seven. er one had the gateway, cobbled stone, approach to the railway station. terrible shame in my opinion that that building was demolished, allowed to go to wrack and ruin, er and then then demolished. -there you have the er individual walkway th along there, and the entrance along here er up the yard. -the old sort of double erm er goods shed. +there you have the er individual walkway th along there, and the entrance along here er up the yard. +the old sort of double erm er goods shed. er and er vehicles would go down, it drops down inside there, and there's planking er at obviously, level erm on either side er of this arch er this erm er wide way er through to the bottom. and i'll show you a bit more in a little while. there is another picture, taken on a different day, showing, again in about nineteen seventy eight. seventy seven seventy eight, the remains of quite a substantial goods shed, for a relatively small place. -now i daresay most of you know that, really the population of or , was pretty static in the er well from eighteen fifty to about nineteen fifty, or even nineteen sixty. +now i daresay most of you know that, really the population of or , was pretty static in the er well from eighteen fifty to about nineteen fifty, or even nineteen sixty. erm round about three and a quarter thousand. very little change. they had er seventeen or nineteen pubs, i can never quite remember. @@ -14448,13 +14435,13 @@ er for that population. er and er of course a number were closed in the er early part of this century, and more er coming along. we've still got about ten or eleven i think, haven't we? erm really the railway was closed in nineteen fifty nine, for passenger traffic. -just about the time that dougie started er building substantially in the town and doubled to population to its present six and a half thousand or so. +just about the time that dougie started er building substantially in the town and doubled to population to its present six and a half thousand or so. er whether or not it would have survived, i i wouldn't know. anyhow that as i say, was the er goods shed. er that erm was in use er as i say until the closure. now there's a picture of the station, and you can see that we've got the post, the cobbled entrance, on this on the left hand side was the station master's house, the garden. you'll notice that the the erm fencing is vertical. -erm and that was normal practice until the early part of the century, about nineteen o seven i think it was that the started using the er forty five degree angles, style. +erm and that was normal practice until the early part of the century, about nineteen o seven i think it was that the started using the er forty five degree angles, style. but er er vegetable garden, and the lot. there's over here there's er a passenger station. four wheeled coaches er in here. @@ -14468,25 +14455,25 @@ and we've got lamp house, er signal box and the white gate and er woodwork there now that er merely shows that that is a cattle dock. a lot of quite a lot o cattle traffic in those days, agriculture and cattle traffic, and the normal practice er in certainly in the last century, er to avoid disease, was to use a lime wash. er they didn't have the er the normal erm antiseptic washes, which sort of came in later on. -er brothers of were manufacturers of sheep dips and various disinfectants. -and of course as i say those those were around, but erm the reason that is all white, is that it was erm er when the cattle had been got out of the way, they er whacked a fair amount of of lime wash all over things er to er to kill any any nasties there. +er brothers of were manufacturers of sheep dips and various disinfectants. +and of course as i say those those were around, but erm the reason that is all white, is that it was erm er when the cattle had been got out of the way, they er whacked a fair amount of of lime wash all over things er to er to kill any any nasties there. erm here you have a handsome cab. and that cab you'll see in other photographs we've got. -erm that plied to the 's head hotel. -er and again, you'll see on one of the 's photographs i've got, it shows, just to the right hand side as you're looking at the front of the main archway, erm it had the legend, railway, parcels receiving office. -so if you wanted to er send parcels via the railway, anywhere in the country, then you could take your parcels into er the 's head er sort of office there, erm and they were ferried down here. +erm that plied to the 's head hotel. +er and again, you'll see on one of the 's photographs i've got, it shows, just to the right hand side as you're looking at the front of the main archway, erm it had the legend, railway, parcels receiving office. +so if you wanted to er send parcels via the railway, anywhere in the country, then you could take your parcels into er the 's head er sort of office there, erm and they were ferried down here. you didn't actually have to come down er with er to the station to . erm a number of er sort of billboards up here, various signals, erm lamps. quite an interesting picture er and for anybody who is interested in sort of modelling this scene,get is right, er that's a very very valuable photograph. erm it's off a er an ordinary postcard that was produced many many years ago,quite common. erm round about nineteen o five i think that was. now as you let's have a look at er the track layout of the place. -erm want to run to about half past eight or +erm want to run to about half past eight or we'll see how we go. -erm coming in from er on the a six one two from , er we've come to over the level crossing there. +erm coming in from er on the a six one two from , er we've come to over the level crossing there. now this is a er an ordinance survey map of about nineteen fifteen. and at that time, single track over that level crossing erm and the track became double as one went up past about close, isn't it now, over here? -erm 's meadow, close, erm and er then we've got the double track runs into the station up here, past the cattle pens which you saw those white things on the photograph, various signal posts, the goods shed, there, erm an engine shed, a small engine shed which was built to accommodate, normally only one loco. +erm 's meadow, close, erm and er then we've got the double track runs into the station up here, past the cattle pens which you saw those white things on the photograph, various signal posts, the goods shed, there, erm an engine shed, a small engine shed which was built to accommodate, normally only one loco. erm and a little siding by the er track to accommodate erm a loco which was largely used for er coaling purposes, of the locomotive. and and on the er here you've got erm siding with that that erm circular object is called a wagon turntable. and goods wagons that needed to be unloaded, er would be brought into, er at least unloaded erm er perhaps for the distribution of items in the town, would be brought onto that turntable erm and normally horse, purely a horse hook would be er put on er and swung round, and the wagon, or the wagons, a couple of wagons perhaps, would be taken at right angles into that er goods shed for unloading. @@ -14502,43 +14489,43 @@ erm and er they had what they call carriage trucks, which were er flat trucks ba which could be attached to passenger trains, and the er the actual er gentleman's carriage, er horse-drawn carriage, could be loaded onto this flat truck, and er the er would be transported to be available er at his destin in his or her destination. erm and er it was er it was a ramp basically, er up here, so that one could run straight off that ramp, onto this flat truck. and that's a that's one of the what that was used for. -erm as you i say, initially er it was a single track into the station, over crossing. -and erm in between the wars, erm it was made double track, er up towards over there. +erm as you i say, initially er it was a single track into the station, over crossing. +and erm in between the wars, erm it was made double track, er up towards over there. by just merely putting in an additional point, or turnout, here, er to er to make that say double track. that's er well that's all there. -that's a er map i acquired off the water board +that's a er map i acquired off the water board i think from somewhere. . erm the slightly larger erm engine shed here as i say. erm cattle pens, goods shed, the main station building here, the erm station master's house here. a signal box, the platforms on both sides, the smaller building on the north side of the station. erm a weighed a weighing machine, a weighing office over here, and coal offices were situated there. erm i will give a little bit of history of dates, and what things were altered and when in a bit. -erm the the railway track, erm once it was extended through to and i say i'll give you the details on that in a minute, erm went over the er road, and then the track that was nearest to er the town, was curved in and joined that other line erm and er went off to to . -and there's a book on engine sheds, and er engine sheds, which was published some years ago i think by publishing company, er which gives track plans to help people. -but looked at a er at any ordinance survey map, they'd have seen that they got the track plan wrong. +erm the the railway track, erm once it was extended through to and i say i'll give you the details on that in a minute, erm went over the er road, and then the track that was nearest to er the town, was curved in and joined that other line erm and er went off to to . +and there's a book on engine sheds, and er engine sheds, which was published some years ago i think by publishing company, er which gives track plans to help people. +but looked at a er at any ordinance survey map, they'd have seen that they got the track plan wrong. erm that is that is what it should be. -erm some additional sidings,mills over here, some additional sidings were put in, in the early part of this century, and they came off the this track erm just this side of on the left hand side of the level crossing, erm and went er up to a dead end er just along in the right hand side, er over now towards where factory is. +erm some additional sidings,mills over here, some additional sidings were put in, in the early part of this century, and they came off the this track erm just this side of on the left hand side of the level crossing, erm and went er up to a dead end er just along in the right hand side, er over now towards where factory is. erm or bakery. -and then er they returned the line, or double track round here, er and bringing so goods wagons could be brought round into the sort of unloading area er of 's mill. +and then er they returned the line, or double track round here, er and bringing so goods wagons could be brought round into the sort of unloading area er of 's mill. of course 's was a very important customer of the of the railway. now let's give a little bit of er of information. the er there were many railways erm were contemplated in the eighteen thirties and forties and beyond. and erm the er there was a nottingham, lincoln and hull line i think, proposed in eighteen thirty. -erm but this line involving ,, er was actually er part of a much bigger scheme that was put forward about eighteen forty, and really involved er a line from near cross to , on to , on to , and then up to and connecting . +erm but this line involving ,, er was actually er part of a much bigger scheme that was put forward about eighteen forty, and really involved er a line from near cross to , on to , on to , and then up to and connecting . basically sort of cutting across country, about twenty eight miles i think it was. er as an original project. -erm the er in eighteen thirty nine, the the railway came to nottingham, er from derby, and er there were three companies, the , the er railway i think it was, and the er railway or er sorry railway. -and they amalgamated in eighteen forty four to become the railway. +erm the er in eighteen thirty nine, the the railway came to nottingham, er from derby, and er there were three companies, the , the er railway i think it was, and the er railway or er sorry railway. +and they amalgamated in eighteen forty four to become the railway. and er a certain -george known as the railway king was very keen to to get er across into to lincoln and certainly in various other parts of east anglia, to sort of spike other people's guns and to erm er to obtain the traffic for his own er benefit, and for his shareholder's benefit perhaps. -erm and erm the railway, er opened the nottingham, newark, lincoln railway line in eighteen forty six. +george known as the railway king was very keen to to get er across into to lincoln and certainly in various other parts of east anglia, to sort of spike other people's guns and to erm er to obtain the traffic for his own er benefit, and for his shareholder's benefit perhaps. +erm and erm the railway, er opened the nottingham, newark, lincoln railway line in eighteen forty six. he whole thing was built in a year, quite incredible. in in those days. erm because it crossed the trent quite a number of times, and quite a number of trestle er wooden bridges were involved in that construction. but the whole lot was done and opened i think it was er in august, eighteen forty six. -and one of the say one of the proposals was that there should be this er line from , and through this town, and over to join the er nottingham, lincoln line er at . +and one of the say one of the proposals was that there should be this er line from , and through this town, and over to join the er nottingham, lincoln line er at . what was built in eighteen forty seven, and opened in eighteen forty seven, was merely a small branch line, of two and a half, three miles, from this town, to , where it say er er made a er a connection and and a small junction there. -there was no station actually at at that time. +there was no station actually at at that time. erm the station was opened er and trains began to run in eighteen forty seven. but very quickly it was er all all the promises of much traffic. say the town had only got three and a bit thousand people anyhow, three thousand people, erm there was very very little actual passenger traffic. @@ -14547,28 +14534,28 @@ and after a matter of a couple of years of use, er the service had already been or at least it was withdrawn as far as er railway engines were concerned. they did in fact get a horse erm and er they had a small carriage, er and er a horse made the odd er visit up the line, from time to time. er but erm the so the railway line erm still carried a little bit of er of freight traffic, but erm it wasn't quite abandoned, but even some of the er station buildings were removed erm to er to . -so that's that's really what happened, and it wasn't until eighteen sixty, or eighteen fifty eight, fifty nine in time, that the railway directors agreed to reopen this branch line, as they'd been basically promised a lot more traffic. -erm it was still pretty marginal er but er at least it was opened and erm in eighteen er it carried on until, in eighteen seventy, seventy one, the line was extended back to or a station roughly halfway between the two. +so that's that's really what happened, and it wasn't until eighteen sixty, or eighteen fifty eight, fifty nine in time, that the railway directors agreed to reopen this branch line, as they'd been basically promised a lot more traffic. +erm it was still pretty marginal er but er at least it was opened and erm in eighteen er it carried on until, in eighteen seventy, seventy one, the line was extended back to or a station roughly halfway between the two. then er through to erm , and on to. -in those days there wasn't a great deal of of mining, i mean wasn't open, and er there was a tremendous amount, well there's a fair amount of of traffic agricultural traffic, and i mean one had to accept that virtually everything came in, all coal, road stone, erm goods required er for well 's who were going at the time, they er they used the railway. +in those days there wasn't a great deal of of mining, i mean wasn't open, and er there was a tremendous amount, well there's a fair amount of of traffic agricultural traffic, and i mean one had to accept that virtually everything came in, all coal, road stone, erm goods required er for well 's who were going at the time, they er they used the railway. erm and the various er food s food stores er again, virtually everything came in. -and of course in due course er time er the town had a gas station, erm or a gas, not a gas station, erm er a gas works . +and of course in due course er time er the town had a gas station, erm or a gas, not a gas station, erm er a gas works . erm and so again coal was was brought in erm for that. erm anyhow so that is sort of the background. and the railway er it operated, i suppose, pretty marginally, certainly for the rest of er last century. -erm in nineteen o two i think it was, i've got the details at home, erm sidings were put in for 's. -they paid a bit and the railway paid a bit. +erm in nineteen o two i think it was, i've got the details at home, erm sidings were put in for 's. +they paid a bit and the railway paid a bit. and the idea here was that one would be for incoming goods, and one would be for empty wagons or the other way round, er going out. erm and of course the the wagons as i say would would come up right along side that er road. now that's a picture which er many of you will be very familiar of with. erm and it shows it's er just about the turn of the century that is. and er there you have a a s a signal. erm the level crossing gates here, 's mill on the left hand side, erm a er sort of lean to er over the erm sort of loading bay, or unloading bay there. -erm a typical er signal box and a rather pretty little station master's house, there. -and that i say that picture has appeared on everything, even on china, i think you can buy some at erm can't you even with that on it. +erm a typical er signal box and a rather pretty little station master's house, there. +and that i say that picture has appeared on everything, even on china, i think you can buy some at erm can't you even with that on it. it's a very very well known photograph. again, about the turn of the century, erm looking up towards . -the track across here, the crossing gates. +the track across here, the crossing gates. er signal box there, the er lower quadrant signal here. there's a round spot on the back which was used before they had er a white er sort of a black erm stripe, er vertical stripe erm on the er on it there. you can see at the back here, erm a barrow crossing, er which could be used er to get erm heavy items on a on a wheelbarrow, or trolley, over the tracks er from the platforms. @@ -14576,49 +14563,49 @@ erm various lamps, the station b main station building, the s the subsidiary sta er in the background there's the engine shed, erm and a few er one or two, there's a loco there i think. erm one or two bits and pieces anyhow. and on the right hand side, there's the goods shed. -erm in nineteen fourteen, erm 's, who had a water turbine er as their sort of main motive power for their er milling operations, erm put in or had had, er not only this line, siding, but they had one put in round the back here, erm because that was to provide coal, for steam boilers which were er put in to augment the water power. +erm in nineteen fourteen, erm 's, who had a water turbine er as their sort of main motive power for their er milling operations, erm put in or had had, er not only this line, siding, but they had one put in round the back here, erm because that was to provide coal, for steam boilers which were er put in to augment the water power. erm that later on, the signal box that used to be here was moved over to the other side, that's all that's there for. and er that shows it later on when that one at the back had been taken out. -now erm last century er goods came up er the trent to er and er by sailing barge er and er this sort of equipment was used to er to collect er items from the holds of these er barges, erm put on wagons, horse-drawn er and er some steam traction engines, er to be transported around. +now erm last century er goods came up er the trent to er and er by sailing barge er and er this sort of equipment was used to er to collect er items from the holds of these er barges, erm put on wagons, horse-drawn er and er some steam traction engines, er to be transported around. there's another picture of one of the barges on the trent. a steam one. -now the great er as you can see that is a just pre-first world war advertisement from 's. -and erm so they were quite major users of the railway services and indeed, i think that there was at least one clerk, from the railway, employed in 's offices, all day, every day at some time. -there's a picture of er er flour, going out from 's mill er latter part of er last century, erm going out to 's bakery in the town. -a steam lorry that acquired, in the er early part of the century. +now the great er as you can see that is a just pre-first world war advertisement from 's. +and erm so they were quite major users of the railway services and indeed, i think that there was at least one clerk, from the railway, employed in 's offices, all day, every day at some time. +there's a picture of er er flour, going out from 's mill er latter part of er last century, erm going out to 's bakery in the town. +a steam lorry that acquired, in the er early part of the century. erm obviously er no erm pneumatic tyres or anything on that but er quite er good old wo work horses they were. -no that was er that's a picture of er 's erm er i think before they took that off they've taken that off haven't they now? -erm that was when er it had just been erm, well before they started erm altering it into flats, and so on. +no that was er that's a picture of er 's erm er i think before they took that off they've taken that off haven't they now? +erm that was when er it had just been erm, well before they started erm altering it into flats, and so on. but you can see that in fact the railway line came round and in front actually just in in the front here. and there used to be a a lean to just there. that doorway is still there. c c eighteen sixty seven, charles . er it's not the date the place was built, it's the date it er the last time that that particular area was erm rebuilt. -they had a number of fires over the years at 's mill, er and one was in eighteen sixty six or sixty seven. +they had a number of fires over the years at 's mill, er and one was in eighteen sixty six or sixty seven. erm and er that rebuilding was the was when erm that part of the job was er was done. -there's a picture that i obtained from actually ruth who was who was a miss . +there's a picture that i obtained from actually ruth who was who was a miss . erm and it shows it's the twenty i think it's the twenty second or twenty third i've got it at home, er of october nineteen fourteen, this. -erm and it's the the livery of the first full load of coal, into round the back of the er 's mill, erm and there's there's fifteen eight ton railway wagons there, full of coal, just erm coming. -and it's an twelve twenty seven, railway, m r on the front as as standard. +erm and it's the the livery of the first full load of coal, into round the back of the er 's mill, erm and there's there's fifteen eight ton railway wagons there, full of coal, just erm coming. +and it's an twelve twenty seven, railway, m r on the front as as standard. and er bit misty, but that's looking out from the signal box, you can just, possibly just about make out there, and at the back erm the er er with the the erm station master's house etcetera. er that was taken out i say in in due course, but erm er i think that er that picture i borrowed, i mean with her permission of course, erm and er i think it was hung up in the bathroom or somewhere, which was not the best place for a photograph to be really. -and so i took with i say with her blessing, took a er a picture of it for posterity. +and so i took with i say with her blessing, took a er a picture of it for posterity. . erm that's a er rather nice picture, erm which has never been published, not at the moment anyhow. -erm and it was one that erm er mr gave me, many years ago when i was involved with the cricket club, about nineteen seventy seven i think it was. -he knew i was interested in railways and his grand grandfather i think, or uncle was er photographer of the town. +erm and it was one that erm er mr gave me, many years ago when i was involved with the cricket club, about nineteen seventy seven i think it was. +he knew i was interested in railways and his grand grandfather i think, or uncle was er photographer of the town. and this was a photograph erm taken from the roof of the engine shed. and about er i'd guess about nineteen nineteen. nineteen twenty perhaps. and you're looking up towards . i don't know why i'm not really using this er this pointer. well perhaps cos you can't see it. -erm the er arms over there. +erm the er arms over there. the cattle dock here. er a loading gauge just here, to ensure that er anything coming out of that er er that had been loaded in the goods shed was not erm overloaded, and likely to hit tunnels and bridges and so on. there's the wagon turntable, that we mentioned. that end loading er and ramp at er the end. -that's a er that's a railway horsebox there. +that's a er that's a railway horsebox there. erm and the line running into the goods shed there. erm you've got er fire buckets on the end. er a warning not to trespass or something,careful about that. @@ -14626,8 +14613,8 @@ erm o a barrow crossing er between platforms there. there's a engine or carriage co er couple of carriages in there. the gates are shut over there. signal box there. -er the er station master's house, the line disappearing off towards over there. -erm 's mill along here, and actually, you can actually just see there's a wagon there which says, l b s c. +er the er station master's house, the line disappearing off towards over there. +erm 's mill along here, and actually, you can actually just see there's a wagon there which says, l b s c. now that's london, brighton and south coast. what on earth's that doing there? er but er maybe it was erm collecting or delivering a load or something. @@ -14636,8 +14623,8 @@ er or weigh office, and again pretty little building, er the steeply pitched roo and again you've got the same sort of thing. that's the coal er th the the coal offices. there were three, well there we were in fact four coal merchants in the in the town. -there was er 's, erm 's who were probably the biggest, samuel 's, erm 's and s. -erm i think that 's had gone out of the coal merchanting business erm probably by nineteen twenty or earlier, i think. +there was er 's, erm 's who were probably the biggest, samuel 's, erm 's and s. +erm i think that 's had gone out of the coal merchanting business erm probably by nineteen twenty or earlier, i think. i haven't been able to trace anything er later than that. there you've got er a line of coal wagons, and so that's those'll be coming that is a more sort of general merchandise wagons which would be parked in there, loaded or unloaded, erm er shunted across the lines and er into that goods yard, goods shed for er loading and so on. erm lamps, kerosene, wicks and all the rest of it would be kept there. @@ -14646,52 +14633,52 @@ erm and the driveway, er over there. and again as i say it's rather a nice erm picture which erm er was given to me some time ago. a close up really, just showing you er more detail on er that wagon turntable, the buffer stops, rail built buffer stops, or just across there, fire buckets. erm and er there's the er loading gauge and there of course is the whitewashed erm cattle dock. -er and er so there's the goods shed and the er door, the wooden door to provide excess er trucks into there. +er and er so there's the goods shed and the er door, the wooden door to provide excess er trucks into there. er another picture i say really just erm closer up, erm and giving perhaps better detail. you can see the er the pattern of the darker brickworks. there's the sort of pinkish bricks. and again you can see the barge-boarding erm and rather attractive roof designs, er which er reflect er the rest of the architecture. some of the some of the railways were very very functional, not and didn't bother too much about er what places looked like. railway was. -er they perhaps spent too much money that way, but to be fair, the railway was the biggest well the railway er on amalgamation in nineteen twenty three, was the biggest company, and biggest employer in this country. +er they perhaps spent too much money that way, but to be fair, the railway was the biggest well the railway er on amalgamation in nineteen twenty three, was the biggest company, and biggest employer in this country. and if one goes back er and think about that wages were probably no more than two pounds a week on average, at that time, the er share capital of the rail railway i think i'm right in saying, was four hundred and fifty million pounds at that time. quite a concern. they had hundreds of thousands of employees, of horses and er everything. er massive organization. -and of course if you strip everything that's profitable out of it, like the erm er the railway air services went, erm the er the er erm hotels, ferries, everything else you can think of, you're left with er with a runt that doesn't make money, and not surprisingly the government then closes it down. +and of course if you strip everything that's profitable out of it, like the erm er the railway air services went, erm the er the er erm hotels, ferries, everything else you can think of, you're left with er with a runt that doesn't make money, and not surprisingly the government then closes it down. still i'm mustn't get too political must i. er but you know you can always close things if you want to. erm you can fiddle the books, i know that very well. -another picture show the here a little bit here. +another picture show the here a little bit here. erm some of the a adverts in er our sort of parish magazines and and so on, er fifty sixty seventy years ago, some of the names,still there. motor company, well that used er that erm er that's the er . -er 's, well they were well known, very big shop in the town they had. +er 's, well they were well known, very big shop in the town they had. erm where lloyd's is isn't it. now then samuel . -some of 's wagons, delivering coal to mr 's house, well no it was erm 's manor, it was before mr came there. +some of 's wagons, delivering coal to mr 's house, well no it was erm 's manor, it was before mr came there. er but erm that was er the baron's house of course at one time in the eighteen, early eighteen hundreds. now a snow scene. samuel , this was taken from an advertisement in one of the magazines, and one sometimes got a little bit of er of exaggeration. er not quite certain how many he had, he had at least one wagon i know that. erm very common, you know s seventy three, twenty five, eighteen, erm they very often started at sort of seventy three or something like that. -to give the impression before. +to give the impression before. erm i say i don't know how many he did have. erm er but that er is a model of one that i made. er and er i i think it's a fairly accurate representation. erm that is er four millimetres to the foot, erm so not very big. but that's on to scale there. -i i work to a pretty scale on these things. +i i work to a pretty scale on these things. eighteen point eight three millimetres between the tracks. -'s and all the rest of it, and er pictured just by the er er just by the station master's house. +'s and all the rest of it, and er pictured just by the er er just by the station master's house. i'll stop in about five minutes if that's alright. fine. -erm again,l m s yard there, residents . -i think that's where dr lives now isn't it. +erm again,l m s yard there, residents . +i think that's where dr lives now isn't it. in the nineteen sixties an awful lot of er of stuff went, er or was just allowed to er to get into bad repair, and of course er b r weren't terribly interested so they just abandoned it. -you can see again this er this decorative work on there, and again most attractive er chimneys. +you can see again this er this decorative work on there, and again most attractive er chimneys. the er gents toilet. a bit spartan but there it is. -and er the ladies one look er there we are again. +and er the ladies one look er there we are again. going round the other side, where the sun was shining that way better. very attractive for modelling purposes this. looking close close up. @@ -14705,13 +14692,13 @@ and again that's looking at the same time in nineteen seventy se seventy seven, going back to seeing to to looking at the erm goods shed. there you can see the main entrance. and that's where you went down slightly, er or erm carts, lorries, anything else went down there. -erm normally there was a er horse and cart here. +erm normally there was a er horse and cart here. er certainly until the i think probably until the end of the war. erm i believe there ha there was a comma or a yeah, i think there was a comma vehicle that was used, er later on. it may have come from york i don't know. er i suppose that's where they er did a lot of the office work, a wooden shed built on to it. you can see the buttresses, and again the rather attractive brickwork that even even on a goods shed, a functional goods shed. -now that's the entrance and there is where the er there used to be the erm er wagon turntable out here, and the entrance for the trucks was er through that doorway. +now that's the entrance and there is where the er there used to be the erm er wagon turntable out here, and the entrance for the trucks was er through that doorway. i won't say through the door,looks as if it has been. but er there. i'm afraid the er er the end loading ramp and a lot of the other stuff had gone by then. @@ -14723,29 +14710,29 @@ more pictures of the roof timbers. outside, that was some stabling i think there. and er internal roof-work of the stabling. just er recessed there to avoid it getting damaged with things passing on the side. -and we're now now walking round the back and er sort of now pointing towards the arms. +and we're now now walking round the back and er sort of now pointing towards the arms. and you'll notice the er er again the brickwork and the buttressing along there. -now having just walked away er up towards erm er crossing end, there's the . +now having just walked away er up towards erm er crossing end, there's the . and that's the remains of the cattle dock here. er i'm afraid a lot of it had gone by that time. -that was to hang mr on. +that was to hang mr on. or dr . in fact there're two of them, there and one there. -and that's erm crossing house up there. +and that's erm crossing house up there. and you can see that's where the main tracks where and this is of course where we had er sort of sidings and er other things and er and the main yard. erm odd pictures of the engine shed, taken from somebody's back garden i suppose now. er but you can see the er the the engine shed as it was. single road. accommodate er one locomotive only. -they normally had here, er just the one erm locomotive little o four four tank engine, johnson. +they normally had here, er just the one erm locomotive little o four four tank engine, johnson. erm built before the turn of the century. -and and er they also had er normally a little o six o tank er which was er spent a lot of it's time at er a at at the what is what is now er castle. +and and er they also had er normally a little o six o tank er which was er spent a lot of it's time at er a at at the what is what is now er castle. er shunting there. as i say, that er train would nip off to nottingham i think every monday i think it was, and get vacuum cleaned out. er and then return. what i've never seen, there's the that's the er tank, water tank at the top. what i've never seen, is a photograph from the other end. -if anybody can tell me what was at the other end, apart from a hole, then not carefully, er i'd be very grateful. +if anybody can tell me what was at the other end, apart from a hole, then not carefully, er i'd be very grateful. i i guess there was probably a lean to or something like that. but er i just don't know, maybe erm a sand store. but as i say, i've never seen anything, and i've never been able to find anybody who can provide that answer for me. @@ -14763,41 +14750,41 @@ i suspect it's er it's it's er it's some sort of little office at a guess. but i would very very much like to er to find out er and get a picture of what is up there. or somebody could tell me. now that's a bit of a grotty picture put er it's useful to er er to give an idea of what was there. -now after the er there was a incident at erm the er engine shed, er the stabling of the locomotive was transferred away, erm and it used to travel at the end of the day over to the er or , or er engine shed, where it er stayed for the stayed for the night. -er and this is a picture of it and the engine shed, with some ex- locos. +now after the er there was a incident at erm the er engine shed, er the stabling of the locomotive was transferred away, erm and it used to travel at the end of the day over to the er or , or er engine shed, where it er stayed for the stayed for the night. +er and this is a picture of it and the engine shed, with some ex- locos. er which were normal at that time. -erm and er and basically that engine shed is where 's clothing factory is, erm just er at the side of road,. -and by the hill bridge. -a nineteen twenty four timetable, erm not many trains between er and er and . -i say originally there were four, but by nineteen er thir nineteen twenty nine, erm basically the passenger service had ceased, although er we did get there were minor special and so on, that that were run and race days, the stations and the er were used, but basically erm er the er the line beyond er was er virtually entirely erm colliery er and and goods traffic. -but i say it it it became er quite increasingly important right up to its closure er of of er particularly for for catering for bl for erm pit. -er and indeed er a a triangle or a curve was put in near to er bring to bring trains or enable trains to er er to turn round or go round and face nottingham or come from nottingham from yard, and so on. -there's quite a quite a good service as you can see er between erm at least er junction and . +erm and er and basically that engine shed is where 's clothing factory is, erm just er at the side of road,. +and by the hill bridge. +a nineteen twenty four timetable, erm not many trains between er and er and . +i say originally there were four, but by nineteen er thir nineteen twenty nine, erm basically the passenger service had ceased, although er we did get there were minor special and so on, that that were run and race days, the stations and the er were used, but basically erm er the er the line beyond er was er virtually entirely erm colliery er and and goods traffic. +but i say it it it became er quite increasingly important right up to its closure er of of er particularly for for catering for bl for erm pit. +er and indeed er a a triangle or a curve was put in near to er bring to bring trains or enable trains to er er to turn round or go round and face nottingham or come from nottingham from yard, and so on. +there's quite a quite a good service as you can see er between erm at least er junction and . virtually everything. and that was maintained right through to the end. erm a late picture, say on or about the day befor when it packed up which was erm july nineteen fifty nine for passenger servicing. and that was a sad day, erm and i've got the details, i think it was nineteen eighty one, er that it was finally bulldozed. -and i think a lot of that er of the hard core and er went, and was buried near the rifle range, up erm at 's place. -er just off road. +and i think a lot of that er of the hard core and er went, and was buried near the rifle range, up erm at 's place. +er just off road. i think i'm right in that. -you can see that erm good job of the knocking all the er stonework down and so on. +you can see that erm good job of the knocking all the er stonework down and so on. rather sad . now let's move along the line. -erm any any questions on er itself or you know if there's anything i haven't told you, i mean there's probably quite a lot, well there's a lot i know there is. +erm any any questions on er itself or you know if there's anything i haven't told you, i mean there's probably quite a lot, well there's a lot i know there is. but yes anything you want to er erm please jump in. er but if not let's move up erm to towards er towards , and this is erm this is the erm former under-bridge at , going up to mill. now the roadway used to come under the railway. -little humpback, bridge here, erm and used i say used to go through to er mill itself just er quarter of a mile along the track. +little humpback, bridge here, erm and used i say used to go through to er mill itself just er quarter of a mile along the track. erm the er the road was later just moved to the left hand side of that bridge, and er no longer having to have that restriction. but that is still in place as you can see. er a fairly light railway, erm but er but adequate. that's taken from just re wh basically where the roadway is now. and that's the trail looking towards . -now let's move up to the next port of call, which is station. +now let's move up to the next port of call, which is station. i should say it's convenient for neither i should imagine. erm single track shown on this ordnance survey map. again about nineteen er i think nineteen fifteen, maybe a little bit earlier. -erm a passing loop there, for trains to be able to just pull in and let anything going the other way, because it was mainly single track from er from onwards. +erm a passing loop there, for trains to be able to just pull in and let anything going the other way, because it was mainly single track from er from onwards. erm and a little bay there for er goods traffic to go into the sort of station. station platform, the bridge there, and the station master's house, there. a little head shunt at the end to protect anything running back onto the er main line. @@ -14809,48 +14796,48 @@ erm just made it a er does it's not double track er very far, but they have actu and this is erm in the nineteen forties nineteen fifties. when there was a fair amount of er goods traffic particularly coal from . that er that line i think went to just er a bit further up and erm er i say not an any matter of er another couple of hundred yards i think before there was only a single track. -er that is the station master's house at station. -and er it's now the part of the you can er go to a picnic area along here. +er that is the station master's house at station. +and er it's now the part of the you can er go to a picnic area along here. you know you can walk through there back to . you can just see the remains of the platform there. and er platform over here. er this has been altered quite a lot since then, but you can still see the er gate that was er to the yard of the station. moving on, to . -again, er early nineteen hundreds, and you can see single track coming in from here, and interesting bit of track work here, erm station up here. +again, er early nineteen hundreds, and you can see single track coming in from here, and interesting bit of track work here, erm station up here. double track through the station. erm goods shed, er and er siding along here. so interesting type of track work there. -now when the was opened, er it was decided to er to put in a line, erm just near to connect with , and pick up some of the trade for the for railway, cos the or the had already decided to get some from that end as well. -er going up to erm and so on. +now when the was opened, er it was decided to er to put in a line, erm just near to connect with , and pick up some of the trade for the for railway, cos the or the had already decided to get some from that end as well. +er going up to erm and so on. so a line was put in, up to colliery. -and there you have, not a very good picture, but you can see this was th with the goods shed as per the last ordnance survey map. +and there you have, not a very good picture, but you can see this was th with the goods shed as per the last ordnance survey map. slightly altered configuration, but er tracks put in there, erm and er to house quite a lot of wagons and to er allow trains to er to just be held there until they could move up to erm cos that's single track beyond there. that was the quite enlarged quite enlarged er sidings, erm these haven't been changed here, but additional sidings on this side er and i say that curve up here. erm just look at that one that er goods shed, that's er that's interesting cos er there's still remains of that there. -there you can see station. +there you can see station. station master's house there. erm and the i can never remember the name of that road over there. -er o this is road down here isn't it? +er o this is road down here isn't it? anyhow, erm that's in a cutting there. and you can see the track layout. i say in interesting, if you built that in a model, people wouldn't believe you. there's a picture in early b r days, of a i think erm special probably from . and showing that even if the er station isn't actually used for passenger traffic, er it's well kept. now let's look down from the bridge. -and there you see again in early b r days, er the er the station master's house, and er er and the station itself, over here, the goods shed over there , the various track works coming across, the er line up to round here, and as i say the various sidings that were put in to accommodate the additional er colliery and other traffic. +and there you see again in early b r days, er the er the station master's house, and er er and the station itself, over here, the goods shed over there , the various track works coming across, the er line up to round here, and as i say the various sidings that were put in to accommodate the additional er colliery and other traffic. but er considering it isn't er used for passengers, it looks in quite good nick, doesn't it really that. but i say that er just er look at that, and look at the particular roof line. and er the the vent there, the circular vent. now that's what it looks like more or less now. -er looking just er well that picture of that going through th station on a special. -that's roughly the same place. +er looking just er well that picture of that going through th station on a special. +that's roughly the same place. well just a few yards along. picture from the from the er bridge, and there you can see the goods sheds still there. -and that's looking up towards up there. +and that's looking up towards up there. but the house is in quite good order, it has been extended. and that's er from the front view, i didn't go wandering in. but that was the entrance to the station originally. -er i don't know whether that's listed or not, but er i'm surprised it's still there frankly. +er i don't know whether that's listed or not, but er i'm surprised it's still there frankly. so as i say, very very very er prominent building. there's a little weighbridge or or office. er in somebody's garden. @@ -14859,13 +14846,13 @@ er onto the trail. that's one of the see the old railway building there. erm looking up er the er line or that is looking from the bridge erm that's going down towards er th the just it it it er cur curved round to to meet the er the line er an and the s and the station was was here. just along the road. -er that was erm station just along here. -and that's a line from between quite er steep er in quite a steep cutting. -looking towards again from the bridge over the main road, er as one gets er near near . +er that was erm station just along here. +and that's a line from between quite er steep er in quite a steep cutting. +looking towards again from the bridge over the main road, er as one gets er near near . now moving on a little bit further, i know the talk said that i was only going up to er to , but i'm just going a little bit further. we've cut across the er a six one four here. erm at the white post. -er and er the line came from over here, and on that embankment there was a bridge here, er but they farmer has er removed that embankment, but has still left this part. +er and er the line came from over here, and on that embankment there was a bridge here, er but they farmer has er removed that embankment, but has still left this part. and there's some still some one or two rather nice little bridges. er still extant, and er now i rather like the architecture. erm and so i wandered up there and had a look at it and photographed. @@ -14873,7 +14860,7 @@ interesting four four arch bricks, and er and and very nice stonework. and the copings there, the retaining walls. you can see the brickwork there, nicely done and er very attractive for again for modelling purposes. going a little bit further, i'm only er just a couple here. -that's up erm near not a very good picture that, erm but a er l m s eight er eight f, up near that is. +that's up erm near not a very good picture that, erm but a er l m s eight er eight f, up near that is. on a er coal train going towards er towards . and that's a an l m s crab also at . again on a on a special, going towards skegness probably, at a guess. @@ -14882,62 +14869,62 @@ erm and er this is coming in old ordnance survey map, coming in past the race co and er single track at the time, and running double track, and platforms either side, erm a er wedge shape platform, nice wooden building there, another building there. and and er er the platforms either side. signal box over here. -various sidings, er and the trains from would come in to the left hand side of the top platform, erm and er would er go over here and and cut back and go out from this er this side. -a little bit er it's it's not a very good map the er ordnance survey map in the nottingham library, er local studies department. +various sidings, er and the trains from would come in to the left hand side of the top platform, erm and er would er go over here and and cut back and go out from this er this side. +a little bit er it's it's not a very good map the er ordnance survey map in the nottingham library, er local studies department. about the best i could get off them. erm and i've i've obviously photographed it. -now there's a picture er in early b r days again, of the line coming in from here and the very attractive in my opinion, wooden er structures, the shelter there. +now there's a picture er in early b r days again, of the line coming in from here and the very attractive in my opinion, wooden er structures, the shelter there. the racecourse at the back, fencing, platform here, wooden structure here, buildings erm and er you can just see the edge of er another canopy similar to that er on this side. this is taken from the er from a sta er from a signal box er just er over sort of where i am, er here roughly in in line. and er well kept flower beds and so on. barrow crossings here, signals and so on. -there's another picture, now that's looking erm towards up there, and the branch coming in there, behind that er building. +there's another picture, now that's looking erm towards up there, and the branch coming in there, behind that er building. very attractive, take note of what that looks like. a train waiting to go out go out to , er having met the er nottingham lincoln, or lincoln nottingham line which you can see just goes up the the back there. and there's that wooden building there. the train having come in from , and just going er forward well i don't know erm before back to er er to . -i think that's an ex carriage actually, but it makes you realize how small these things were. -in b r days, not a very good picture, but an b one thompson, four six o b one on a erm probably a birmingham train, er real cross country. -and there's the er in the platform there just having come in. -another picture er of the not very good, but erm best i can do, best i've got. +i think that's an ex carriage actually, but it makes you realize how small these things were. +in b r days, not a very good picture, but an b one thompson, four six o b one on a erm probably a birmingham train, er real cross country. +and there's the er in the platform there just having come in. +another picture er of the not very good, but erm best i can do, best i've got. again see the old wooden structures, rather nice lamps and so on. that's what you've got now. don't know whether that's an improvement upon the wooden structures. no i think not. that's where that rather nice, this is w this is the er the departure platform at . -and that's the platform arrival from nottingham to lincoln, on the other side, the lincoln to nottingham one. +and that's the platform arrival from nottingham to lincoln, on the other side, the lincoln to nottingham one. but er not terribly pretty. there you can see that's looking up towards . well the junction's gone completely, that was taken two or three years ago. and that's what you've got left, up there. i don't know why they bother. there's a signal box, from which the other picture was taken. -no doubt a lamp and store there. -er this taken from where the signal box used to be, and that's where the line out to is over there. +no doubt a lamp and store there. +er this taken from where the signal box used to be, and that's where the line out to is over there. there's hardly a trace of it, whoops. -and there you see er really that was the old erm remains of the platform going towards er . +and there you see er really that was the old erm remains of the platform going towards er . that's all that's left. -and again that's the er er platforms as it is now looking towards . +and again that's the er er platforms as it is now looking towards . oh and they sorry the other way round. that's the other end of it. and the er house there,. quite a fair erm service on the nottingham lincoln line. erm there's a sort of typical timetable of the nineteen twenties. -. now moving over to to , er what is castle now, used to be quite a nice er well the the actual building erm that building is still here, and the bulk of that er station building is still there, er but erm i'm afraid all the er the buildings this side have gone, erm and er a lot of this has a lot of this has gone. +. now moving over to to , er what is castle now, used to be quite a nice er well the the actual building erm that building is still here, and the bulk of that er station building is still there, er but erm i'm afraid all the er the buildings this side have gone, erm and er a lot of this has a lot of this has gone. again you you've got er lamps erm and water columns and barrier here. in the background, erm a big goods shed which is still there. i think er it won't be long before that goes i think. -there you can see, early b r days, erm as it shows it's castle, it wasn't castle, it was just in the old days. +there you can see, early b r days, erm as it shows it's castle, it wasn't castle, it was just in the old days. water tower here. there was never a turntable at er at . er but er rather nice er buildings here, and er canopies, which i say have been completely er removed. and er the level crossing of the old a one used to be here. the goods shed at the back, and the train just coming in from lincoln there. and the old semaphore bracket signal there. -er in b r days, a lot of the er traffic between nottingham and lincoln and derby, er was hauled by locomotives from lincoln depot, and when the erm region took that over, they closed the or the er shed down and used erm er lincoln region locomotives. -this is an old express passenger four four o, director class. +er in b r days, a lot of the er traffic between nottingham and lincoln and derby, er was hauled by locomotives from lincoln depot, and when the erm region took that over, they closed the or the er shed down and used erm er lincoln region locomotives. +this is an old express passenger four four o, director class. er in york station erm on a er lincoln to derby train. -erm very attractive er locos they were and extremely successful, they were the mainstay of er the er er line, and er outperformed many of the robinson four six os er that were built subsequently. +erm very attractive er locos they were and extremely successful, they were the mainstay of er the er er line, and er outperformed many of the robinson four six os er that were built subsequently. erm very attractive building, and i think in fact ten years ago when i took that photograph. erm i don't think it's changed much. coming back er along the line. @@ -14953,14 +14940,14 @@ in fact it's a very narrow er er roadway there. it still is. little er signal box at . i managed to go in and have a chat with the signalman. -erm pretty little thing, the er boxes are very standard er in design, they're they were varying in size, but erm the er sort of double hipped roof, the finials erm the angled corners, of the windows erm the er er the rails erm and the er sort of platform there, er very very standard er all over the place. -they've got quite a few of these at erm at , at the railway trust, they've er they've got a number of these signal boxes. +erm pretty little thing, the er boxes are very standard er in design, they're they were varying in size, but erm the er sort of double hipped roof, the finials erm the angled corners, of the windows erm the er er the rails erm and the er sort of platform there, er very very standard er all over the place. +they've got quite a few of these at erm at , at the railway trust, they've er they've got a number of these signal boxes. they reckon they've probably got more than b r now, there. er but a pretty little box that is. that's another view of the of the same box. now a little bit further up the line, whoops, is junction. -now used to be er a link line between erm this er track here, and round the back, erm under road, there's still a bridge there, er and joined up near where the rubbish tip is. -erm and er so trains could er instead of going towards lincoln having to perhaps back up to, they would go round er a triangle basically, and be facing towards , equally if they're coming back, they didn't have to go towards lincoln, and then back, they could erm could erm go round and er take their wares to sidings and marshalling yards. +now used to be er a link line between erm this er track here, and round the back, erm under road, there's still a bridge there, er and joined up near where the rubbish tip is. +erm and er so trains could er instead of going towards lincoln having to perhaps back up to, they would go round er a triangle basically, and be facing towards , equally if they're coming back, they didn't have to go towards lincoln, and then back, they could erm could erm go round and er take their wares to sidings and marshalling yards. er inside, er is a wheel which with which the erm signal box, or signalman, er could er open and shut the gates as necessary. and er a line of levers for points, for signals, and some spares inside. and that was er duly inside, you've got a fair number of spares on that. @@ -14971,16 +14958,16 @@ an old, a very old photograph and a bit grainy. but erm a train just coming in er from lincoln to nottingham. . that's gone now. the signal box and the gates have gone, taken now probably five or six years or so ago. -again typical er box, erm rather attractive, has now got the er normal lifting barriers. -there you can see the er box. -erm and er the er whatd'youcallit, the the er er the level crossing er and house. +again typical er box, erm rather attractive, has now got the er normal lifting barriers. +there you can see the er box. +erm and er the er whatd'youcallit, the the er er the level crossing er and house. , in olden days, before they built the er bridge. when the all the traffic came across the level crossing there. there's still a signal box there. erm that's now a private house isn't it? yeah, it's a listed building. but er rather nice. -and a barrow, a very common sight, and this this type of er of awning, erm very very common, er the barge-boarding er and the er and and the again the roof and the er chimneys and very interesting sort of a in the garden erm of the sort of station master's house, is that. +and a barrow, a very common sight, and this this type of er of awning, erm very very common, er the barge-boarding er and the er and and the again the roof and the er chimneys and very interesting sort of a in the garden erm of the sort of station master's house, is that. very much like er the style used er in coal offices and erm weigh weighbridge at . that's still there. erm where there's a caravan office, or caravan sales place just by the station, at , sorry at er . @@ -14997,25 +14984,25 @@ just to show you a bit further on. that's what nottingham station i used to look like from london road bridge. isn't that beautiful. . absolute er changed a bit hasn't it since er well the lines have gone, the signal box and er and so on. -the old 's premises at the back. -and the bridges, erm lovely o six o, and er erm four wheeled guard's, guard's van with a veranda at this end. -erm these er this is a one a of three or four photographs erm from the society collection. +the old 's premises at the back. +and the bridges, erm lovely o six o, and er erm four wheeled guard's, guard's van with a veranda at this end. +erm these er this is a one a of three or four photographs erm from the society collection. we've got erm tens of thousands of photographs. quite a number are erm there's quite a few taken in the nottingham area in . -erm and this is one in station, one of the spinners. +erm and this is one in station, one of the spinners. beautiful design locos. these erm finished there days really on easy graded routes such as the nottingham lincoln line. and er that's waiting to take a train out to lincoln. erm nineteen er probably just about erm nineteen nineteen, nineteen twenty time that one. there's another similar loco, railway, one seventy eight, spinner. nottingham behind. -underneath the old bridge over the top. +underneath the old bridge over the top. again a train to er out to lincoln, one of the two four os. very much in use on the lincoln line until certainly during the wars. till till about the beginning of the second world war. along with and the other guns of four four o. -mainstay of the motive power at the n, and on the nottingham suburban services, erm the old er built erm er round top fire box, with the safety valves er and erm er well no condensing here or anything on it. -and that's got a bell pipe fire box, and er valves on that. +mainstay of the motive power at the n, and on the nottingham suburban services, erm the old er built erm er round top fire box, with the safety valves er and erm er well no condensing here or anything on it. +and that's got a bell pipe fire box, and er valves on that. again all in nottingham station, on local. and there we are ladies and gentlemen, as er all things should finish with the queen. erm @@ -15027,11 +15014,10 @@ well that's fantastic.. erm anyhow thank you er all very much. right. is there anybody - how you got started singing? how i got started singing? aye. -well me, oh, how i got started singing, it was really just i didn't sing very much really. +well me, oh, how i got started singing, it was really just i didn't sing very much really. my dad was a good singer. he wasn't a trained singer or anything, it was, just happened that he, he was a good singer. my younger brother he's a good singer as well. @@ -15043,7 +15029,7 @@ mhm. and he just sang too. you know that's how he he learnt. so what were his favourite songs? -oh dear, he was what would you say, i don't know he liked the kind of ballads, er he was a more a kind of bay he liked a ballad, so i really couldn't tell you who was his favourite singer or anything like that, just if a song interested him he just +oh dear, he was what would you say, i don't know he liked the kind of ballads, er he was a more a kind of bay he liked a ballad, so i really couldn't tell you who was his favourite singer or anything like that, just if a song interested him he just what do you mean by ballad kind of songs? well more the slow, er songs, not the fast. the love songs and things like that ? @@ -15056,15 +15042,15 @@ was it? here, oh yes. i never i never went out were you were you in the drama clubs here when you were younger then as well? -i was in the drama club when i was when i stayed at home, but we didn't do pantomimes, we we did plays, one act plays, and three act plays, we did three act plays. +i was in the drama club when i was when i stayed at home, but we didn't do pantomimes, we we did plays, one act plays, and three act plays, we did three act plays. we never did pantomimes. -and er but that's the only time, you sang at weddings. +and er but that's the only time, you sang at weddings. so i said, come on mabel, sing. -or my father would sing -so how long did you live in for? +or my father would sing +so how long did you live in for? we've , into the village, we lived out in the countryside till i was eight, and we come down into the i should say town shouldn't i, we come down into the town when i was eight and i was there till i was twenty two, and i came up here, when i got married. mhm, is leslie from this part of the country? -les is from oh well he was, i think he was three when he came up here. +les is from oh well he was, i think he was three when he came up here. he lived in, he was born in castle douglas. mhm. but i think he was three when his father was sh came up here to work. @@ -15078,13 +15064,13 @@ i ca i came here in nineteen sixty one. sixty one. mhm. that's when i got married, nineteen sixty one, i came up. -what did you think of when you came ? -well it was just a quiet wee village just i had come, wasn't much different it was quiet as well. +what did you think of when you came ? +well it was just a quiet wee village just i had come, wasn't much different it was quiet as well. mhm. and er there wasn't there wasn't much difference really. everybody was very friendly, it didn't matter whether you were an incomer or not, they always spoke. mhm. -you got to know people very quick in . +you got to know people very quick in . that was one thing about the village, and your your neighbour would where jane is the now, i don't think she'll have hardly seen her neighbour in dumfries, but here they were always you know you couldn't get away from them. oh they were in or out. @@ -15092,8 +15078,8 @@ so did you do any singing when you came here first? what was the first kind of thing you got involved in ? oh the rural choir, i forgot about that, yes, i joined the rural choir and . and er i couldn't sight read or anything like, i can't sight read. -but i can remember once when i was at the school mrs was our music teacher and we were to go from doh to far, you know doh to far, and they used to s , she used to say listen to mabel, mabel's the only one one of you that can go from doh to far. -but er so when we came mrs the sight reading of course i was lost because she used to +but i can remember once when i was at the school mrs was our music teacher and we were to go from doh to far, you know doh to far, and they used to s , she used to say listen to mabel, mabel's the only one one of you that can go from doh to far. +but er so when we came mrs the sight reading of course i was lost because she used to is that mrs john ? no mrs billy. billy. @@ -15117,48 +15103,48 @@ but there were men in it for quite a while, i was wondering when that kind of fa oh that was faded out before that was a good while before aye before we came up here. -i wonder if, it mr, was it choir or his father or something that had it, i can if i can remember somebody saying. -so what was going on in the way of entertainments and things like that when you came to ? +i wonder if, it mr, was it choir or his father or something that had it, i can if i can remember somebody saying. +so what was going on in the way of entertainments and things like that when you came to ? when i came up to live here? there was quite a few dances, in er, do you mean dances in the town hall? -ah there would be there well just one or two, not not every week or anything like that as far as i can remember. +ah there would be there well just one or two, not not every week or anything like that as far as i can remember. just a few over the winter? -just aye, aye, oh they didn't have them in the in the summer, and of course in them days well the the bars shut at ten o'clock which meant you know they came into the dance hall just after that where nowadays the bars shut at twelve o'clock and +just aye, aye, oh they didn't have them in the in the summer, and of course in them days well the the bars shut at ten o'clock which meant you know they came into the dance hall just after that where nowadays the bars shut at twelve o'clock and it's hardly worth having a dance . it's not worth having a dance. -but i heard the town hall was having one, not the town, was it the town hall or community council having one between, i think it's the town hall, between christmas and new year and really i don't think it's worth their while having them then. +but i heard the town hall was having one, not the town, was it the town hall or community council having one between, i think it's the town hall, between christmas and new year and really i don't think it's worth their while having them then. do you think that's been a big thing contributing to there being a=less dances and things then? do you mean the bars being op oh i think and clubs. i think so really do you think it's the main thing ? -i think that's what's really, it's killed them as far +i think that's what's really, it's killed them as far mhm. as the dances are concerned. and another thing is the young ones don't dance. they can do you mean by young ones my generation ? -i mean , yes, well maybe you can but i do but the the younger ones are ever er you know younger ones like carl and them, they can disco but they they can't waltz or er foxtrot or +i mean , yes, well maybe you can but i do but the the younger ones are ever er you know younger ones like carl and them, they can disco but they they can't waltz or er foxtrot or how did you learn to waltz then? just by going to dances, just by going to dances, we just, you just picked it up, your your partner could do it and you just learnt from there. mhm. that's one thing i've always been a quick learner which has been quite mhm. -i think jane's got er that as well. +i think jane's got er that as well. she seem to be able to pick thing sup. does she like dancing? not as fa not the dancing but when she was working in an office you know they just needed to show her something once and she could pick it up. mhm. it was the same in the the pantomimes when lily has learnt learnt the dancing, i could er after she had showed us about twice i could i could have it no bother and the rest of them were still struggling away trying to learn the steps. so it's quite an advantage. -so did you go to dances quite a lot before you were married ? -oh yes in aye. +so did you go to dances quite a lot before you were married ? +oh yes in aye. was that the place where everybody went to to the town hall. young lads and lasses would get together ? lasses would yes, aye, to the dances. -and they used to run er buses to different places, you know, you used to go to different places, and . -and what kind of band played for the dances when you were in then? +and they used to run er buses to different places, you know, you used to go to different places, and . +and what kind of band played for the dances when you were in then? bands like what tommy has, you know accordion bands. that er they were all more or less that kind of band. so by the time you came here it would mostly just be tommy that was playing? @@ -15166,7 +15152,7 @@ roundabouts, er the only one i can remember is tommy round about, you know playi and , it was just these kind of bands that mhm. were in those days, the accordion bands. -so but we fair enjoyed them , they think, the younger ones don't like them nowadays but +so but we fair enjoyed them , they think, the younger ones don't like them nowadays but mhm. we enjoyed them. cos i like, i like the accordion, i like country dancing. @@ -15179,7 +15165,7 @@ it was supposed to have been quite good up at ,? aye it was sti , yes it was still going when i came up here. mhm aha. -was it mrs , from took it ? +was it mrs , from took it ? and were there men went to the country dancing as well? oh yes , oh yes, aye. not so many men as went ladies but er @@ -15187,40 +15173,40 @@ do you think there was a lot of men. the rise of the country dancing clubs was maybe be to kind of try and compensate in a way for the dances themselves going down, ordinary dances, folk were wanting to do the scottish dancing and things? it could have been but you found -you found at the country dancing, it was different people that was at the country dancing than what than what it was at the more at the the ordinary dances. +you found at the country dancing, it was different people that was at the country dancing than what than what it was at the more at the the ordinary dances. folk that maybe would have been shy to go to a mhm. a big dance? yes er maybe but would come to the country dancing. -or some of the older folk maybe that +or some of the older folk maybe that folk, i think yes, it was more, mhm. right. but you get country dancing that's very energetic really. yes. but i oh i used to go to the country dancing. -so was there a drama club going in when you came here? +so was there a drama club going in when you came here? no. that would be finished up? that was finished up, mhm. -what about the one, was it still going? +what about the one, was it still going? when you came here? -i don't think so, i can't remember eh it going then. -because i think it was tommy that said it was really after the one finished and there was nothing else round about that there was a gap of a few years and then you got started again here. -yes, but er it was actually mike that got it back up here,mike and grace , john 's first wife that started it up. -i can remember leslie coming home, i think i must have been expecting doreen at the time, that was in, that was early early on, nineteen, well that was nineteen sixty three, and he was, he had heard that had i had been in the gatehouse drama club, and er he said, would i be interested in com in coming to the drama in if they started? +i don't think so, i can't remember eh it going then. +because i think it was tommy that said it was really after the one finished and there was nothing else round about that there was a gap of a few years and then you got started again here. +yes, but er it was actually mike that got it back up here,mike and grace , john 's first wife that started it up. +i can remember leslie coming home, i think i must have been expecting doreen at the time, that was in, that was early early on, nineteen, well that was nineteen sixty three, and he was, he had heard that had i had been in the gatehouse drama club, and er he said, would i be interested in com in coming to the drama in if they started? leslie said he would need a special part for me then. but that it took another oh quite a number of years really to get it started up. -they were very good for it's first +they were very good for it's first oh the first concert oh yes those kind of people. -the f i often find that really the first year it was more fun and er then when they started on the plays and that it got more serious and +the f i often find that really the first year it was more fun and er then when they started on the plays and that it got more serious and a bit more like hard work really? it was really, there wasn't so much fun in it, it was all more serious. -and when bobby was there it really was +and when bobby was there it really was i remember oh yes. -he and andy together were very good . +he and andy together were very good . mhm, yes, oh they were, aha. bobby was really, he just kept it going really. sometimes just one person like that or a couple of people ? @@ -15229,29 +15215,29 @@ and he really was a character. somehow in the drama, even though it's so long since he passed away . there's nobody can replace individual people . there no, no, nobody at all. -and do you think er the others feel that like you do about doing the plays that it's maybe a bit more of a strain you know the competitions and -i think some of them do , yes, i know s er some of them have said how much they enjoyed it when it started off first, but er but now it's just got that wee bit more serious. +and do you think er the others feel that like you do about doing the plays that it's maybe a bit more of a strain you know the competitions and +i think some of them do , yes, i know s er some of them have said how much they enjoyed it when it started off first, but er but now it's just got that wee bit more serious. we're with the plays, with going to the festival of course, you can't,you must be serious when you're practising for something like that . do you feel like it's almost like doing a different thing that you're not, you know when you're actually acting in the play you're more self conscious and you're more conscious of what you're you're moving and you're speaking and whereas the likes of the panto you know you just be yourself really with a bit of fun thrown in . -yeah, yes, oh yes aye the plays the plays you've got to think what you're doing wand if you miss your cue line you're putting your, the person next, off as well that it is more er serious and you've got to think more i think +yeah, yes, oh yes aye the plays the plays you've got to think what you're doing wand if you miss your cue line you're putting your, the person next, off as well that it is more er serious and you've got to think more i think mhm. really. but however so you just kind of kept kept on singing, after the choir and that finished? aha, when the pantomime started up that was just carried on in there. -not that i'm a great, good or great singer it's just i seem to have a strong voice. +not that i'm a great, good or great singer it's just i seem to have a strong voice. unfortunately you can always hear me above everybody else. oh dear. that's, you can but if er if folks spoke about you you know they would they would say you were a singer? because you're seen in public and you do sing in public, there's a lot of people that sing but as you say it's sometimes just in their own homes or they used to but they would never sing in public ,they used to sing in the choir . yes, sing in public, no no. -i've i wouldn't i don't think i would go out if somebody said, would you come and sing er at such and such a thing. +i've i wouldn't i don't think i would go out if somebody said, would you come and sing er at such and such a thing. i i don't think i would go. but in the pantomime, well you're singing with everybody else, you're not er on your own really. and the pantomimes a different thing altogether. mhm. -and i mun that i must have words in front of me, if i don't have words in front of me even though i know it, i i still forget it. +and i mun that i must have words in front of me, if i don't have words in front of me even though i know it, i i still forget it. but er that's right, just nerves. i think it's the nervousness that just knocks the words coming out of your head. @@ -15259,43 +15245,43 @@ oh, it's easy to do. aha. oh aye. -but er do you quite like singing for folk that know you? -do you like singing in the village, where everybody knows you, or would you in some ways be less nervous do you think if you were singing like even to folk,who just don't so well ? +but er do you quite like singing for folk that know you? +do you like singing in the village, where everybody knows you, or would you in some ways be less nervous do you think if you were singing like even to folk,who just don't so well ? quite know me so well? do you think that makes any difference? -i think it would really in a way and yet the people in know how you sing so the whereas the maybe wouldn't know. +i think it would really in a way and yet the people in know how you sing so the whereas the maybe wouldn't know. mhm. -and you would you would be more, you'd be more nervous in case they they thought, well she's terrible isn't she? -but it would also be fresher for them, you know +and you would you would be more, you'd be more nervous in case they they thought, well she's terrible isn't she? +but it would also be fresher for them, you know oh yes. folk folk that know you either w might be too critical or they might just switch off because they have heard it before . they have heard it before, mhm. -but i've never well i've never really -you've never -sang in anything other than the pantomime that +but i've never well i've never really +you've never +sang in anything other than the pantomime that mhm. -int he village you know, except maybe at at the social or something like that, said, come on up and sing and then i forget my words and that's me. -do you like to know where, for quite a while in advance what you're going to sing then ? +int he village you know, except maybe at at the social or something like that, said, come on up and sing and then i forget my words and that's me. +do you like to know where, for quite a while in advance what you're going to sing then ? i do really. aha, i do really. -if somebody's would l if somebody wanted me to sing i really would like to know er because +if somebody's would l if somebody wanted me to sing i really would like to know er because do you not have a wee store of your favourite things then that you -oh i have a wee store, yes, but you see you don't carry them, i don't carry them with me, if i carried them with me i could sing i could, well that's it, +oh i have a wee store, yes, but you see you don't carry them, i don't carry them with me, if i carried them with me i could sing i could, well that's it, if you did it more often maybe, i feel if, yes, you would remember them an awful lot easier. aha. but er what, how did how did you collect the songs that you sing then, i mean were they just things that -just taking aye, just songs that i liked and i just er take them off tapes and, and records, and i just write them down, +just taking aye, just songs that i liked and i just er take them off tapes and, and records, and i just write them down, do you do that all the time? are you always, when you're hearing something mhm. you're listening mhm. thinking, oh i'd like to sing that . -and i'd like to, aye, and i just write it down in a if it's on a tape you can put that pause on and just take line by line, you know. +and i'd like to, aye, and i just write it down in a if it's on a tape you can put that pause on and just take line by line, you know. mhm. -but erm and if you listen to the tape long enough you can, i can pick up the tune, +but erm and if you listen to the tape long enough you can, i can pick up the tune, mhm. as well, and just, and have the words. and then as long as the pianist or the accordionist know the tune i'm alright @@ -15308,7 +15294,7 @@ no i would have to learn the tune like by listening to the aha. to the person singing. aha. -that's the only way i would learn a tune, i couldn't sight-read the +that's the only way i would learn a tune, i couldn't sight-read the mhm. the music off a sheet. right. @@ -15329,18 +15315,18 @@ aha, aha oh i like the sound of a clarinet, mhm, i think they're lovely. but er the piano's the only one i would of like to have learnt to play. mhm. -i often feel sorry that i never was able to play but +i often feel sorry that i never was able to play but oh you still could plenty of adverts about . yes oh yes, aye . practice in the town hall. -well we had a piano actually, we got it for doreen and doreen she started to learn, she went to mr . -remember mr that used to live at ? +well we had a piano actually, we got it for doreen and doreen she started to learn, she went to mr . +remember mr that used to live at ? she went to him and then he flitted away. and er she just never went anywhere else and gave up. and carol liked to come through and just tinker but she never got lessons or anything so we just sold it. mhm. -but, as long as the music had doh ray mes written on it i could play with one hand but +but, as long as the music had doh ray mes written on it i could play with one hand but mhm. other than that i was lost. mhm, do you think it's quite good @@ -15348,12 +15334,12 @@ mhm. that they're getting a lot of music at school these days and? i think it is, yes, i think it's a great thing really. do you think it's important? -yes, erm i can't give you a reason why i think it's important though. +yes, erm i can't give you a reason why i think it's important though. but i think it is. -i think it's a it's the lighter side of the their their schooling. +i think it's a it's the lighter side of the their their schooling. they have a serious side but they must have a lighter side as well, mustn't they? in the school. -but you must really enjoy singing to yourself, you must find that something +but you must really enjoy singing to yourself, you must find that something oh i do. you get out of singing that you don't get anywhere else. its's no, no, i i do enjoy, i r i like singing. @@ -15366,7 +15352,7 @@ mhm, mhm, it is, it's lovely . everybody should be able to feel that they can do that, you know? aha. aye, sure they should. -so is there an what kind of things would you like to see in the village and round about int eh way of more music or less music or a different music? +so is there an what kind of things would you like to see in the village and round about int eh way of more music or less music or a different music? would you like more dances ? or ? myself, i'd i'd really enjoy dancing, er so does leslie, leslie enjoys dancing as well. @@ -15376,22 +15362,21 @@ well nowadays i don't know whether you should record this or not, but nowadays e mhm. there, you know. that's a shame. - -that er it should be any account for a pension fund should carry the name of pension fund and any transactions involved with pension fund money wh it should be a duty of the financial institution to make sure that any account they were paying money into was a pension fund account. -if i may say so the key point isn't it that a lot of the transactions you discussed were off market transactions, they were unusual transactions and the financial institutions that were carrying out those transactions whether they were acting as banker or acting a as broker, they would have had knowledge that those transactions were not normal market transactions. -so if the law was clear that in those circumstances they should have been on notice and should have therefore watched where the money was going, there wouldn't have been a problem and are we not saying that legitimate stock lending which i think is what is about is suggesting, if carried on properly on the market, would be all right, but if it immediately goes off market into the back doors and back rooms and people can't see what's going on and the financial institutions take part in that, then they are doing something that un undoubtedly is probably going to cause loss to pension funds and shouldn't there be a clear law which makes them liable in those circumstances. -no you were saying weren't you? +that er it should be any account for a pension fund should carry the name of pension fund and any transactions involved with pension fund money wh it should be a duty of the financial institution to make sure that any account they were paying money into was a pension fund account. +if i may say so the key point isn't it that a lot of the transactions you discussed were off market transactions, they were unusual transactions and the financial institutions that were carrying out those transactions whether they were acting as banker or acting a as broker, they would have had knowledge that those transactions were not normal market transactions. +so if the law was clear that in those circumstances they should have been on notice and should have therefore watched where the money was going, there wouldn't have been a problem and are we not saying that legitimate stock lending which i think is what is about is suggesting, if carried on properly on the market, would be all right, but if it immediately goes off market into the back doors and back rooms and people can't see what's going on and the financial institutions take part in that, then they are doing something that un undoubtedly is probably going to cause loss to pension funds and shouldn't there be a clear law which makes them liable in those circumstances. +no you were saying weren't you? oh i'd say it is yes. wrong anyway in that er i'll say it's the er early on it in the report good defines what he determines a prus trustees duty and as i said to a sort of effectively orb enter into a tr transaction which immediately cost effecting kind of money rather than making money for the pension fund er is against that duty in the first place, but it to it should however be ma made explicit that it is against that duty which i will say stock lending may be okay for a pension fund, but not stock lending where the er pension fund is acting as the borrower rather than the lender. right, ken any other points? -er can i er i i started to comment on about the er er bank accounts and which are y you know er my the reaction that i saw was all round the table er i think we would go further but er any company handling pension funds should carry pensions somewhere in their names on all on all their paperwork etcetera so that everybody's totally clear that they are dealing with pension funds and er er to agree with a comment that you made in one of your earlier reports that er designation of bonus of shares of pension funds should be clearly er marked on those shares er that also would have a at least alerted these financial institutions as once again that they were handling stocks belonging to pension funds and they still ignored it in that that w case that they did, but er they would have not had the excuse that er apparently some of them have made that er they were not aware that these were pension fund assets. -i think they are still claiming well it's not that i didn't know, but anyway ken -er we did we were gonna raise a point on that the clash of the regulatory rules and the producery duty of under trust law, you know and i i think there you know there there was a comment that that i picked up with professor gower you know in his report which i think where he said the government obviously have greater confidence than i in reliance on pristine trust law in relation to modern commercial developments such as unit trusts and occupational pension schemes, which its founding fathers never contemplated. +er can i er i i started to comment on about the er er bank accounts and which are y you know er my the reaction that i saw was all round the table er i think we would go further but er any company handling pension funds should carry pensions somewhere in their names on all on all their paperwork etcetera so that everybody's totally clear that they are dealing with pension funds and er er to agree with a comment that you made in one of your earlier reports that er designation of bonus of shares of pension funds should be clearly er marked on those shares er that also would have a at least alerted these financial institutions as once again that they were handling stocks belonging to pension funds and they still ignored it in that that w case that they did, but er they would have not had the excuse that er apparently some of them have made that er they were not aware that these were pension fund assets. +i think they are still claiming well it's not that i didn't know, but anyway ken +er we did we were gonna raise a point on that the clash of the regulatory rules and the producery duty of under trust law, you know and i i think there you know there there was a comment that that i picked up with professor gower you know in his report which i think where he said the government obviously have greater confidence than i in reliance on pristine trust law in relation to modern commercial developments such as unit trusts and occupational pension schemes, which its founding fathers never contemplated. now there was nothing in good really that i think addressed this mismatch between those two types of law. now i think that the good did say oh well there is a law commission report expected, but i think that you know the good should address somewhere tha that problem of trust law and regulation should and then i did in fact on going through the report and er you know and also your own reports erm there's the one about designation of assets you know, which i think was a very good recommendation of yours, i think the actual area of responsibilities and the wider role of actuaries was important. -i think the inde independent corroboration for actuaries was another important factor, custody confirmation by the auditors, veto of transfer of assets, independent auditors for pension funds, independent custodian arrangements, in-house investment management, you made some comments, co-ordination of the various regulators, co-ordination of the professional advisers, establishment of the pension tribunal, you know now as far as i was concerned on on my sort of looking through it, those were all recommendations that that you have made over your two years and i couldn't really find any response to those in good, and i think that's er you know we we personally found that disappointing. -also i mean er we take your point and we've made it before ken that there's a real danger of asking for a report from someone like professor gower and then picking it, instead of actually taking the whole thing because it does actually add together in some sort of coherence erm and had professor gower's report been an exception in this entirety, we may not have been had the pleasure of having you back again today, but thank you very much, er all three of you for coming points so clearly +i think the inde independent corroboration for actuaries was another important factor, custody confirmation by the auditors, veto of transfer of assets, independent auditors for pension funds, independent custodian arrangements, in-house investment management, you made some comments, co-ordination of the various regulators, co-ordination of the professional advisers, establishment of the pension tribunal, you know now as far as i was concerned on on my sort of looking through it, those were all recommendations that that you have made over your two years and i couldn't really find any response to those in good, and i think that's er you know we we personally found that disappointing. +also i mean er we take your point and we've made it before ken that there's a real danger of asking for a report from someone like professor gower and then picking it, instead of actually taking the whole thing because it does actually add together in some sort of coherence erm and had professor gower's report been an exception in this entirety, we may not have been had the pleasure of having you back again today, but thank you very much, er all three of you for coming points so clearly thanks very much at the end was very good wasn't it? mm. @@ -15401,40 +15386,40 @@ very good. yes. all right, we want to make a start if we can, if people could settle down. what i'm gonna ask you to do, if you could introduce each of yourselves and say which pension fund you er come from er and if we start from your left, my right. -oh the thing in front of me it's malcolm adams and i'm with the national association of british steel pensions. +oh the thing in front of me it's malcolm adams and i'm with the national association of british steel pensions. it's john mostin also with the national association of british steel pensions. i'm gay appleby, general secretary for the national federation of post office and b t pensions. i'm ron smart, chairman of the british erm federation of post office and b t pensions. jim castle, member of the imperial tobacco pension fund. i'm michael smedley, chairman of the impact which is the imperial tobacco pension fund. gay. -thank you chairman erm i would like i know that you've been listening to the first er part of our session this afternoon, erm and i'd like to ask you to discuss with us one of the questions that we asked the group the pension fund erm and that's to discuss the balance of power that exists between the employer and the various groups and classes of pensioner. +thank you chairman erm i would like i know that you've been listening to the first er part of our session this afternoon, erm and i'd like to ask you to discuss with us one of the questions that we asked the group the pension fund erm and that's to discuss the balance of power that exists between the employer and the various groups and classes of pensioner. perhaps if i just start with that simple question and see how it develops. -what help us,we we'll go to we'll direct the questions to different people erm and if you agree, just say you agree so that we don't have er erm a session of people just rec reciting what everybody else has said, but if we start with you erm jim, sorry i can't see the +what help us,we we'll go to we'll direct the questions to different people erm and if you agree, just say you agree so that we don't have er erm a session of people just rec reciting what everybody else has said, but if we start with you erm jim, sorry i can't see the michael smedley. yes, right. erm, we feel very strongly about this that there should be a balance of power with the employer nominating no more than half of the trustees. after all he's put the money in to pay pensions and the beneficiaries ought to have a strong hand in saying how that money is used, so we see half the trustees coming from the employer, the other half from the members of the pension fund, and we've got a pension fund with the very heavy weighting of er pensioners and not so many employees and we would like to see the remaining seats er half the trustees elected, partly from the current employees, partly from the deferred pensioners and partly from the pensioners and reflecting in a broad way the numbers in each of those categories. erm -we think that would be a fair way of of erm managing the fund and avoiding the case of having tame tame trustees who do what they employer tells them. +we think that would be a fair way of of erm managing the fund and avoiding the case of having tame tame trustees who do what they employer tells them. b t, same or different? erm well slightly different in the fact that er we er have two close schemes with far more er beneficiaries than there are er subscribing members, and at the moment that are four nominated by the er employer and four by the unions er we wish to say a pensioner erm that the rights were a pensioner nominee to that board of trustees, because we feel that er the situation is er is going to increase, we've got so many beneficiaries and that the pensioners have no representative er i know that erm people on the boards of trustees are completely impartial, but on the other hand there is no pensioner there, the members are unsure of the fund, because of what's been said, not that i'm implying it's not a secure fund, it is a secure fund, but they think why are they keeping the pensioners off, they there is some sort of hidden agenda they will not have us on there because neither of the businesses although we have tried for several years er they will not entertain at the moment erm a pensioner trustee, and yet professor good in his report acknowledges the merit of pensioner nominated trustees, er particularly in the sort of schemes where we've got,wh where th the majority of beneficiaries. great, british steel? yes er i think we're just slightly different again er chairman inasmuch that the british steel pension scheme at the moment has fifty ce fifty per cent employer er trustees and fifty per cent nominated trade union trustees. -we too would like to see some pensioner and pensioner trustees on that trustee board, but we do also recognise because it is er a large scheme heavily weighted er with er pensioners and deferred pensioners in the very fact that it has been transferred from the public centre of public er sector into the private sector, that we would like to see an independent trustee er er appointed on to the er committee of management it would er er sort of act as a balance and be able to provide er specialist advice to particularly the trade union trustees and for that matter the employer trustees so as to keep a broad balance of what's happening within the that time. +we too would like to see some pensioner and pensioner trustees on that trustee board, but we do also recognise because it is er a large scheme heavily weighted er with er pensioners and deferred pensioners in the very fact that it has been transferred from the public centre of public er sector into the private sector, that we would like to see an independent trustee er er appointed on to the er committee of management it would er er sort of act as a balance and be able to provide er specialist advice to particularly the trade union trustees and for that matter the employer trustees so as to keep a broad balance of what's happening within the that time. very good er we may come back to that in a moment. thank you. -but listening to you make that case it's very similar to reading the great debate on franchise reform in this house in the last century, when people said we should be included and that people like us should be able to have the vote and put people into parliament, it's i mean it was just that you were you were making that plea about pro that the board should be representative as being like the group who are benefiting. +but listening to you make that case it's very similar to reading the great debate on franchise reform in this house in the last century, when people said we should be included and that people like us should be able to have the vote and put people into parliament, it's i mean it was just that you were you were making that plea about pro that the board should be representative as being like the group who are benefiting. you've made very powerfully erm and i'm that's a point that we'll take on board. when you talk about this split, fifty-fifty, could we go back that way. who elects the chairman? -well that's er that's another thing that's happened within the british steel's er scheme, the chairman seems to be elected in himself or by the company, it's certainly not e elected by the trustee board and er a and we would like to see +well that's er that's another thing that's happened within the british steel's er scheme, the chairman seems to be elected in himself or by the company, it's certainly not e elected by the trustee board and er a and we would like to see you mean parachuted in is he? yes, he's certainly parachuted in. all right. but who but, but that's describing what happens, how do you think the chairman should be elected? i think -even letting you you've all talked about the you know employers are paying money in and so on, we don't want the schemes wound up, er if i was the the employer, might i not be concerned if you elected a a chairman that wasn't erm favourable to me? +even letting you you've all talked about the you know employers are paying money in and so on, we don't want the schemes wound up, er if i was the the employer, might i not be concerned if you elected a a chairman that wasn't erm favourable to me? er you might er the company might well be concerned about that point, but er i think if the composition of the board was er correct, that er that possibly wouldn't arise. what you mean you'd have blocking mechanisms? yes. @@ -15446,20 +15431,20 @@ but post office and b t management appoint the chairman of the trustees, there a yes. management, four by the trade unions and the chairman is appointed by the management. right. -no, no, the present the present one was a i think he was a chairman of a big building society before he came into the post office and they use these are on three year terms, but er the previous post office one er spent nine years as chairman, spent three yea three terms of three years. +no, no, the present the present one was a i think he was a chairman of a big building society before he came into the post office and they use these are on three year terms, but er the previous post office one er spent nine years as chairman, spent three yea three terms of three years. so they're there for three years? yes. right and er is it a full-time job the chairmanship? -erm i don't know, i don't think it's erm i mean i i think it occupies er seventy-five percent of his time, but it isn't full-time. -no, i was just thinking,we we're, we're debating the in the commons at the moment, changing the parole board from having part-time members, to having salaried full-time ones, which are on limited contracts and that clearly puts those parole board members in a different position to the home secretary and one it's ju you just do it because it's a part-time activity, you may get some expenses that you think is important, and i just wanted to get clear whether the chairman on a limited contract a large part of their work appointed by the employer. +erm i don't know, i don't think it's erm i mean i i think it occupies er seventy-five percent of his time, but it isn't full-time. +no, i was just thinking,we we're, we're debating the in the commons at the moment, changing the parole board from having part-time members, to having salaried full-time ones, which are on limited contracts and that clearly puts those parole board members in a different position to the home secretary and one it's ju you just do it because it's a part-time activity, you may get some expenses that you think is important, and i just wanted to get clear whether the chairman on a limited contract a large part of their work appointed by the employer. thanks. our chairman is appointed by the company and is usually a senior management member. right. the erm pensioners and the employees have no say whatsoever in that. very good. -that's that's the present case, but i think er impact would say that with a fifty-fifty split, then those trustees should elect their own chairman and should be free to bring in independent trustees, so if you had a board of say four company members and four elected by the members er of the pension fund, they might decide to have two outside independents, one of which they would choose as the chairman. +that's that's the present case, but i think er impact would say that with a fifty-fifty split, then those trustees should elect their own chairman and should be free to bring in independent trustees, so if you had a board of say four company members and four elected by the members er of the pension fund, they might decide to have two outside independents, one of which they would choose as the chairman. so you no longer have a fifty-fifty split then, do you? -er you er you'd have two outside independents and you couldn't say how they would be, but they would be elected by the whole te whole er board of trustees. +er you er you'd have two outside independents and you couldn't say how they would be, but they would be elected by the whole te whole er board of trustees. jane? er i'm forgive me if this information is already available to the committee but er are each of your schemes are they money purchase schemes or final salary schemes? ours is a finance salary scheme. @@ -15472,7 +15457,7 @@ it's one of our advisors. no, but we feel that's very important indeed. absolutely, no. no, no we understand the value of that don't we. -erm well we would like to see training of the trustees, there is no training at the moment er for the trustees in erm either of our schemes er and we very much in our submission came out we felt there should be er training from the trustees. +erm well we would like to see training of the trustees, there is no training at the moment er for the trustees in erm either of our schemes er and we very much in our submission came out we felt there should be er training from the trustees. right. yes, we would like to er certainly see er training become compulsory with trustees and we would also like to see er guidelines set er for that particular training, so that train so that the trustees within all schemes would receive similar training, rather than piece-meal by one set of actuaries or another set of actuaries. erm can i just clarify this point, the impression i'm getting from the, from the phraseology in the way you've chosen your words is that your trustees in your particular pension funds which all er former nationalised industries, er haven't received any training. @@ -15494,7 +15479,7 @@ just to make a party point, is that all right? even accepting the fact that training is desirable i think that the trust law is so complex i know. that it's very, very difficult indeed to be trained to know all the parts of it. -in the last analysis is the innate honesty of a trustee who realises that perhaps something is going right and takes advice. +in the last analysis is the innate honesty of a trustee who realises that perhaps something is going right and takes advice. could we just quickly, who should pay for the training of the trustees, employer or the trust? the trust. the trust? @@ -15502,45 +15487,45 @@ the trust, yes. pen pension fund. very very good. david? -of course the role of the trustees is, is, is re- affirmed really by good who er says that there under the under trust or as he sees it, the trustees should remain the legal owners of the fund and i wonder if we can move on to ownership. -i i think you were all here listening to the erm pensioners before you were they were talking about their ideas which were also our ideas in our er report on the designated ownership of, of the pension funds and in particular they had a couple of ideas which you may have heard about having the word pension in the in the names, just technical points, er pension in the names of er of the funds and and people who were er giving advice on behalf of them. +of course the role of the trustees is, is, is re- affirmed really by good who er says that there under the under trust or as he sees it, the trustees should remain the legal owners of the fund and i wonder if we can move on to ownership. +i i think you were all here listening to the erm pensioners before you were they were talking about their ideas which were also our ideas in our er report on the designated ownership of, of the pension funds and in particular they had a couple of ideas which you may have heard about having the word pension in the in the names, just technical points, er pension in the names of er of the funds and and people who were er giving advice on behalf of them. i wonder if you could like anybody would like to elaborate on that? we'll start at the far end. can i, can i just pass for a minute and think on this one and come back. mm i will pass as well temporarily. erm -it's really sorry, it's really the, the question of whether the the the the pension fund belongs to the trustees or is it has been found +it's really sorry, it's really the, the question of whether the the the the pension fund belongs to the trustees or is it has been found well erm in our organisation and it was in our submission that we felt that it er it should belong wholly to erm the employer erm it should belong to the beneficiaries as well, because we feel very strongly that the pension is deferred pay, it is deferred salary, and therefore they should have an ownership of part ownership in that fund. they pay in six per cent of their salary, why should they be debarred from saying that they own part of those funds. we feel that erm you know that they're both very good schemes an and well run, but we still feel that erm the e fund should not be owned entirely er by the employer. british steel? thank you. -well we consider that er pensions er contributions are deferred pay, including the employers contributions erm that the fund should be held on trust by the trustees and that the employer should have no ownership in it whatsoever. +well we consider that er pensions er contributions are deferred pay, including the employers contributions erm that the fund should be held on trust by the trustees and that the employer should have no ownership in it whatsoever. very good. -er i would, i would echo that, that we feel that they money has been paid in for work or services done by the employer and by the er fund members themselves have contributed and i don't think it belongs to either of those parties in any more, it's held by the trustees to pay pensions, if for nothing it's been put there just to pay pensions, it's not a piggy bank for er for companies to draw out with the with their tame er trustees allowing it, it it's money the trustees hold in in trust and i believe that's the law at the moment and er i i think we would like to see that confirmed in any new law. +er i would, i would echo that, that we feel that they money has been paid in for work or services done by the employer and by the er fund members themselves have contributed and i don't think it belongs to either of those parties in any more, it's held by the trustees to pay pensions, if for nothing it's been put there just to pay pensions, it's not a piggy bank for er for companies to draw out with the with their tame er trustees allowing it, it it's money the trustees hold in in trust and i believe that's the law at the moment and er i i think we would like to see that confirmed in any new law. good, thank you. -off that, er i think several of us believe that the complexities of trust law at the present moment can make it very difficult if one agreed. -our own particular case is our case went to the high court some three hundred thousand pounds, when perhaps if we'd had a dedicated pensions act setting out what could and could not be done, that would never have happened. +off that, er i think several of us believe that the complexities of trust law at the present moment can make it very difficult if one agreed. +our own particular case is our case went to the high court some three hundred thousand pounds, when perhaps if we'd had a dedicated pensions act setting out what could and could not be done, that would never have happened. you, you have a history of legal actions don't you? sorry sir? -you have a history of legal actions +you have a history of legal actions not we ourselves no, no but the companies which we belong. -doesn't it, yes indeed. +doesn't it, yes indeed. what's the state of play on the second one, did it were, were the trustees all dismissed, or did brown wilkinson's judgment stop that? -erm th the net result of it the proposal stopped dead, are those who did not wish to transfer, meaning the pensioners, had an increased inflation percentage as a result er pensioner representatives have been appointed, widows have had a increased pension. +erm th the net result of it the proposal stopped dead, are those who did not wish to transfer, meaning the pensioners, had an increased inflation percentage as a result er pensioner representatives have been appointed, widows have had a increased pension. how much of that flows from the court case,i i wouldn't like to say, but my guess is quite a bit. so you won on that, didn't you, because the proposal was to be no increases unless you transferred, wasn't it? mm yes, indeed. thank you. -any other comments? -it goes on in our case, that both of our pension funds have had massive surpluses, i.e. erm there was a reported surplus by watsons the actuaries, of one point erm seven billion which suddenly er vanished within one year to a seven er seven hundred million deficit and +any other comments? +it goes on in our case, that both of our pension funds have had massive surpluses, i.e. erm there was a reported surplus by watsons the actuaries, of one point erm seven billion which suddenly er vanished within one year to a seven er seven hundred million deficit and er it er seven hundred and fifty three million -of course our members er of which we've got a hundred and twenty three thousand, flood the lines into luton wanted to know what happens they imagined a surplus as being some pot of er big tub of notes that they can dip it and we can dip into, but of course the surpluses have been used basically by british telecom in particular for funding early retirement schemes er we're in no way in knowledge whether the money's every been paid back. -we've been told that er everything's done in, in the relation to the trustee but of course when you're talking about massive sums of one point seven billion, our members er who are seventy five/eighty olds who suffered the problem of the inflatory years, their pensions haven't kept, kept pace with the with the people that are retiring now. +of course our members er of which we've got a hundred and twenty three thousand, flood the lines into luton wanted to know what happens they imagined a surplus as being some pot of er big tub of notes that they can dip it and we can dip into, but of course the surpluses have been used basically by british telecom in particular for funding early retirement schemes er we're in no way in knowledge whether the money's every been paid back. +we've been told that er everything's done in, in the relation to the trustee but of course when you're talking about massive sums of one point seven billion, our members er who are seventy five/eighty olds who suffered the problem of the inflatory years, their pensions haven't kept, kept pace with the with the people that are retiring now. we're gonna come although although there's a lot of people who feel they're all living in the lap of luxury if you're post office or b t pensioners, they aren't and we haven't been able to get this surplus er in any way used for the benefit of those people and er and that's where the ownership of the fund really and the surplus are tied in together. we're gonna, we're gonna stay on this issue of ownership and surpluses for a little time, cos it's actually so important, but it's not unreasonable for your pensioners to think that here was this pot of money to which one could dip into, but the only thing is the pot of money disappeared didn't it? @@ -15548,15 +15533,15 @@ yes,an and what really upset the erm the, the members of the scheme and the pens although they didn't, they didn't act illegally, they didn't say right, we're going to make the redundancy payment act, but what they did say you retire at fifty, we will make your we will enhance your pension to what you would have got at age sixty, we will enhance your lump sum to what you would have got at age sixty and erm give you a redundancy payment from the firm and obviously everybody fifty and plus they've gone in thousands, they had enormous waiting lists and then they had to say no, you can't go you know, too many people wanted to go. what happened, people should have been paying in for ten years were suddenly taking out for ten years and these huge enormous sums and obviously the surplus which our members had helped to build up er and provide through the years and we've got seventy-five year olds on you know, extremely low pensions hardly making ends meet, and there were vast sums of money being given away to the employees, that the employers took a contribution holiday and so they weren't paying into the fund either you know, and all the profits of b t as you all know were soaring and partially because of the use of the pension funds and this has greatly obviously erm upset our members and we feel very strongly about it. right. -as you are probably aware chairman from the media that the british steel national association of british steel pensioners also have a problem with a surplus and are seeking legal advice as to what has taken place. -er certainly the surplus was used to er create a new scheme for the present contributing members and er to the maximum benefit of the new sponsoring company, which er in the pensioners view er certainly er caused a great lack of security to the fund in our view of what they have done and er it is of in our opinion a matter of public concern and that we welcome the opportunity and i believe that you said previously that you're gonna come up on the ownership of surplus, so perhaps getting away from it -we absolutely no, no, you'll find we won't leave this topic cos there's three people who actually want to come in now and i'm going to bring them in round the table. +as you are probably aware chairman from the media that the british steel national association of british steel pensioners also have a problem with a surplus and are seeking legal advice as to what has taken place. +er certainly the surplus was used to er create a new scheme for the present contributing members and er to the maximum benefit of the new sponsoring company, which er in the pensioners view er certainly er caused a great lack of security to the fund in our view of what they have done and er it is of in our opinion a matter of public concern and that we welcome the opportunity and i believe that you said previously that you're gonna come up on the ownership of surplus, so perhaps getting away from it +we absolutely no, no, you'll find we won't leave this topic cos there's three people who actually want to come in now and i'm going to bring them in round the table. clifford first and then er -can i take you back to the er the good report er about trust law,i it the report er concludes that it should be retained as the framework for er occupation of pension schemes. -now i m p a c say that they believe there should be a dedicated pensions act to replace trust law and the national federation post office and b t pensioners say trust law should continue to be the basis of pension funds. -could tell could each of you tell us why you take a different view? -one way or another, i'm not quite sure what the the state of the -we believe now outdated, it was never designed to deal with the current situation the modern situation and when you are talking about +can i take you back to the er the good report er about trust law,i it the report er concludes that it should be retained as the framework for er occupation of pension schemes. +now i m p a c say that they believe there should be a dedicated pensions act to replace trust law and the national federation post office and b t pensioners say trust law should continue to be the basis of pension funds. +could tell could each of you tell us why you take a different view? +one way or another, i'm not quite sure what the the state of the +we believe now outdated, it was never designed to deal with the current situation the modern situation and when you are talking about debts of some four hundred thousand million pounds, trust law does fall down. the only recompe the only resource anyone has is to go to the courts, for the courts to decide what the law is at that present moment. now that's a costly business as we know to our cost, we didn't have to pay the three hundred thousand pounds, the pension fund did, but we had to risk paying those to go to court. @@ -15564,7 +15549,7 @@ now next year something else might happen and somebody may be forced to go to co now we have in the companies act a table a which gives you a suggested er model, memorandum of association and articles association, why not a dedicated pensions act which says in here these are the minimum terms you must contain in your trust deed. you can better them if you wish, but you cannot go below them. people would know exactly where they stood then and we wouldn't have to go keep going to the courts to develop the theory of trust law. -so you'd leave the trust law in existence, so you wouldn't call cause a total legal revolution, but you would impose on that a spy of legal requirements which if trusts wish to through trust law enhance, they could, but they h all have to bring their agreements up to that minimum? +so you'd leave the trust law in existence, so you wouldn't call cause a total legal revolution, but you would impose on that a spy of legal requirements which if trusts wish to through trust law enhance, they could, but they h all have to bring their agreements up to that minimum? up to that minimum yes yeah, very good. a model, model trust deed. @@ -15574,18 +15559,18 @@ page two of your submission yes. paragraph we felt that erm trust law had worked effectively erm you know over the years erm w we were happy with the extra powers that the er committee were recommending and the extra precautions that the committee were recommending that we brought in, but erm we would be happy with that backup to continue with the trust law. -even in the situation that we find ourselves in with the maxwell pension situation, where we find that the the erm trust law didn't prevent the things from happening which did happen. +even in the situation that we find ourselves in with the maxwell pension situation, where we find that the the erm trust law didn't prevent the things from happening which did happen. do you still take that view? -but they hadn't got the backup of erm like th the regulator appointed. -i'm sorry i couldn't hear everything that the maxwell people were saying, sitting behind me,you you've lost their, their voice and you you know, i couldn't hear what they were saying. -but wi with the appointment of er of the regulator and the oth the other erm recommendations that were made by the report, we think with that backup w w we are still basically happy to continue with trust law. +but they hadn't got the backup of erm like th the regulator appointed. +i'm sorry i couldn't hear everything that the maxwell people were saying, sitting behind me,you you've lost their, their voice and you you know, i couldn't hear what they were saying. +but wi with the appointment of er of the regulator and the oth the other erm recommendations that were made by the report, we think with that backup w w we are still basically happy to continue with trust law. well i er er we i wasn't speaking about the, the evidence today, i'm speaking about evidences that have been taken in the past, where we had even trustees before the committee. -we informed the committee that regardless to the fact that they were trustees, they were in no position to challenge mr maxwell and under those conditions then they felt that the the law should be changed that the trust law wasn't sufficient to er look after pensions, because they felt that in certain circumstances in fact gave evidence to the committee, various people gave evidence along those lines, that they were almost powerless against mr maxwell and that's . -that's why i'm surprised you, you take this +we informed the committee that regardless to the fact that they were trustees, they were in no position to challenge mr maxwell and under those conditions then they felt that the the law should be changed that the trust law wasn't sufficient to er look after pensions, because they felt that in certain circumstances in fact gave evidence to the committee, various people gave evidence along those lines, that they were almost powerless against mr maxwell and that's . +that's why i'm surprised you, you take this can i put clifford's point to the point that we're still discussing er which is about the surplus and how both your legal frameworks you're advocating relate to the answers you've given us about surplus and the concern about surplus. now if i, am i right in saying that b t is happy to continue er with the present framework of trust law, because within that framework you've proposed to us er a er a body of ideas about the composition of the numbers of trustees and who they should represent, which would make it much more difficult for employers to raid the fund. yes, because you would have your pensioners and your employers, yes. -and b t so and imperial who's had a different experience to you after a takeover bid from a new employer clearly wants a legal framework, steel braces put within trust law to make it much more clear where power lies in th the operati operation of the trust and that possibly one one of those steel braces would the law would relate on h who could get their hands on the surplus and in what conditions. +and b t so and imperial who's had a different experience to you after a takeover bid from a new employer clearly wants a legal framework, steel braces put within trust law to make it much more clear where power lies in th the operati operation of the trust and that possibly one one of those steel braces would the law would relate on h who could get their hands on the surplus and in what conditions. so to some extent your responses re i is quite naturally a response to the position you face with your employers isn't it. our response to it was of course that er since the post office was re released from the civil service in nineteen sixty-nine to trustee, to pen the trustees, there's been a minimum amount of trustees er i can recollect on those on the funds and we've not had any problem. i don't think the management interferes with the fund like the maxwell situation. @@ -15596,9 +15581,9 @@ you've told us one point seven million disappeared in surplus well deficit. billions. -billions, into a deficit erm that there are large the problem we're looking at now is these very large transfer of assets which people feel that they built up with their contributions and whether that's right or not. +billions, into a deficit erm that there are large the problem we're looking at now is these very large transfer of assets which people feel that they built up with their contributions and whether that's right or not. can i just ask british steel, that i mean you're hearing the other two groups. -in a sense responding to our questions, naturally, depending on how they've been treated by their employer can we have your comments about the sort of legal framework you think the pension fund should be in and then jeremy will take over. +in a sense responding to our questions, naturally, depending on how they've been treated by their employer can we have your comments about the sort of legal framework you think the pension fund should be in and then jeremy will take over. right, well i think the biggest problem with trust law is that it expects too much of trustees. it starts off essentially defining them as people who are impartial, and in no time at all we are talking about them being nominated from different sector interest. however, i think the practicalities in the situation are that we have to face the fact that they are not going to behave impartially and you see we have a classic example in er the circumstances of our own situation as described by john. @@ -15614,11 +15599,11 @@ okay we know where it went and we know what it was used for, but er my question well we did take some er legal advice on it and we were told that it was not illegal, erm i mean we think it's highly immoral erm, but we were told it was not illegal, because they did not actually use the er the redundancy money did not come out of the fund, only this enhanced pension etcetera which was using up the, the surplus and we were told and it started the pension payments at a younger age or something? pardon? -they started paying -yes, at fifty instead of sixty, they said you retire at age fifty and we will make your pension up to what you would have got at age sixty and we will also do the same with you lump sum and so now you know, this and they did that with thirty thousand i think went in one year, it doesn't take long to get rid of one point seven billion pounds when you're doing for that er that number of people erm and +they started paying +yes, at fifty instead of sixty, they said you retire at age fifty and we will make your pension up to what you would have got at age sixty and we will also do the same with you lump sum and so now you know, this and they did that with thirty thousand i think went in one year, it doesn't take long to get rid of one point seven billion pounds when you're doing for that er that number of people erm and i think the problem is that this one point seven billion was er an actuarial assessment by watsons i it may never have been that amount of money. -directly directly b t started erm saying well thirty thousand employees will go this year under b t ninety-two scheme i.e. they will go at fifty, they will draw their pension at fifty, which isn't the trust deed and for many years inland revenue point blank refused to let anybody draw a pension below sixty. -they changed that, so the money er it's a bit different than the maxwell, the money hasn't been erm a switched over to the cayman islands and all over the place, it's it's stayed in, in the but of course we're told by the trustees and by our legal advice that nothing illegal's taken place, the money's been used to st er finance early voluntary retirement etcetera, etcetera. +directly directly b t started erm saying well thirty thousand employees will go this year under b t ninety-two scheme i.e. they will go at fifty, they will draw their pension at fifty, which isn't the trust deed and for many years inland revenue point blank refused to let anybody draw a pension below sixty. +they changed that, so the money er it's a bit different than the maxwell, the money hasn't been erm a switched over to the cayman islands and all over the place, it's it's stayed in, in the but of course we're told by the trustees and by our legal advice that nothing illegal's taken place, the money's been used to st er finance early voluntary retirement etcetera, etcetera. if the trust deed says the pension has to be paid at sixty, then the trust deed says it has to be paid at sixty, surely that you know, that's something you can't get rid of. the schemes now are paid a pension at fifty, but the only, the only snag i understand is it isn't inflation, inflation proofed until fifty-five, but people are drawing their pensions and they get their lump sums at fifty and it's enhanced to take into account the actual and expected earnings for the next three years, so er you take thirty thousand people, one point seven billion can soon erm disappear. @@ -15639,20 +15624,20 @@ so in fact there may be a quality of treatment actually between someone retiring well i doubt it actually at the moment. pardon? the operative word there is might. -yes erm because i doubt it, erm at the moment with the fund that we're talking about the erm the close scheme, because most of these people in b t were originally erm in the post office, and of course when the they split erm then the erm post office workers went over to b t, they get a b t pension but in actual fact they paid into a pension scheme erm for many of them for forty years because they come into that age group, where so many people, you took a job when you were twenty o or or sixteen and you stayed with it for life, you didn't chop and change like people do these days and the majority of our members erm we can go down and i would say the vast majority of our members have actually worked for the post office or starting with the post office and then b t or staying with the post office for forty years, there's no end of them they've got in there forty years service. +yes erm because i doubt it, erm at the moment with the fund that we're talking about the erm the close scheme, because most of these people in b t were originally erm in the post office, and of course when the they split erm then the erm post office workers went over to b t, they get a b t pension but in actual fact they paid into a pension scheme erm for many of them for forty years because they come into that age group, where so many people, you took a job when you were twenty o or or sixteen and you stayed with it for life, you didn't chop and change like people do these days and the majority of our members erm we can go down and i would say the vast majority of our members have actually worked for the post office or starting with the post office and then b t or staying with the post office for forty years, there's no end of them they've got in there forty years service. so no, i can't agree there, that there is erm unequality, they think they are being hard done by. -also history if i might just say that when the post office er split from the civil service, the firm was in deficit for twenty years and of course post office management say quite clearly that they were putting in sums of eighteen per cent of the pay bill when it was only supposed to be nine per cent of the pay bill and that's why they're entitled to the to the surplus. +also history if i might just say that when the post office er split from the civil service, the firm was in deficit for twenty years and of course post office management say quite clearly that they were putting in sums of eighteen per cent of the pay bill when it was only supposed to be nine per cent of the pay bill and that's why they're entitled to the to the surplus. b t say the same, that for twenty years the firm was in deficit and both managements put in much more than the trust deed says to keep us to keep the fund afloat. but that employees paid their six per cent of their erm salary. mm, yeah. -but the both until b t split from the post office, the post office put in if i remember rightly in negotiations those days er they were putting in something like fourteen per cent of the pay bill. +but the both until b t split from the post office, the post office put in if i remember rightly in negotiations those days er they were putting in something like fourteen per cent of the pay bill. i don't want to get on to that i think the point has been made er and let me er ask you to correct me if i if you don't i it's a fair assessment, the point that's really being made is there is a judgmental issue here as to whether a surplus arises from over-funding by an employer er substantial investment performance or or effectively unfair claiming between either the deferred pensioners or the pensioners and i it can be that all of those interests have to put into the pot and it's a judgment as to who actually is doing best in what circumstances. i said i didn't want to get on to this area because it's you know, we could go on all night discussing whether this, well whether that. we we ar it was really helpful if we are concrete in actually the answers that we give rather than speculative. jane. -doesn't it come back to the issue of wh who they trustees are and who's interest, given that trustees are expected to be independent, in the end, who's interests do the trustees represent, because i've had experience of working with a pension fund that was in massive surplus and the actualar actuaries refused to agree their final report until that surplus was dealt with, so that the trade unions and the employer through the trustees had to negotiate a way of spending that surplus and er given the pressures of the actuaries to say we were not allowed th the funds to continue unless you deal with this surplus, then it comes back to the issue of how the board of trustees is made up and if we accept that there is a degree of representation on that board, then just exactly how that representation is divided. +doesn't it come back to the issue of wh who they trustees are and who's interest, given that trustees are expected to be independent, in the end, who's interests do the trustees represent, because i've had experience of working with a pension fund that was in massive surplus and the actualar actuaries refused to agree their final report until that surplus was dealt with, so that the trade unions and the employer through the trustees had to negotiate a way of spending that surplus and er given the pressures of the actuaries to say we were not allowed th the funds to continue unless you deal with this surplus, then it comes back to the issue of how the board of trustees is made up and if we accept that there is a degree of representation on that board, then just exactly how that representation is divided. well in both our our er incidences what happens is that the actuary recommends what erm should happen. watsons actually recommended what should happen with both the surpluses and their recommendation was that both businesses should take a contribution holiday for the next three, five and maybe even be ten years in the post office, depending how investments go erm an- and there was no discussion erm between or negotiation between anybody. that was recommended to the employers, the employers said yes, that's the action they would take, they put it to the trustees, the trustees agreed it and that was it. @@ -15660,8 +15645,8 @@ full stop. well i it's becoming slightly unfair because watsons isn't on the stand, watsons would also you know probably spell out in a little bit more detail, but their advice was comprehensive that there were inland revenue rules that it would put the tru and so on and one would want to s to say that tha that as well, but i do want to move on. british, british steel, yes? yes,i i would like to come in to say how our er scheme was transferred from the er british steel pension scheme to the new scheme in nineteen ninety. -now once the benefits were approved er by the trust deed and er bearing in mind that the chairman at that meeting informed the trustee and i quote in determining the structure of the scheme the company was prepared to enter into consultation with the trade unions and trustees, but this was a consultative process only and not a subject for negotiation; and their company then went on to seek the er er the transfer of the present contributing members er er and a hundred of the members agreed er to transfer into that new scheme. -now the trust deed and rules were asked for prior to their consent and the company made it clear that they would not be available until after the new scheme commenced on the first october nineteen ninety and indeed it was some eight days later on the ninth october at er trustee meeting that the company presented the trust deed and rules and it was resolved that the committee of management would er transfer all the close scheme members er into the new nineteen ninety scheme and er the same trustees appointed themselves er trustees of the nineteen ninety scheme and one hour later were the presentation of a draft deed amending the british steel pension scheme and a draft interim trust deed establishing the british steel pension scheme in nineteen ninety and a draft trust deed and rules of the british steel pension scheme of nineteen ninety were tabled for noting; and those very trustees that were on the first meeting agreed to transfer the assets to the new scheme, set as trustees of the new scheme one hour later, accepted the assets and er without er seeking either legal or actuarial advice and in this case er watsons were advisors to the company to the old scheme trustees and to the new scheme trustees. +now once the benefits were approved er by the trust deed and er bearing in mind that the chairman at that meeting informed the trustee and i quote in determining the structure of the scheme the company was prepared to enter into consultation with the trade unions and trustees, but this was a consultative process only and not a subject for negotiation; and their company then went on to seek the er er the transfer of the present contributing members er er and a hundred of the members agreed er to transfer into that new scheme. +now the trust deed and rules were asked for prior to their consent and the company made it clear that they would not be available until after the new scheme commenced on the first october nineteen ninety and indeed it was some eight days later on the ninth october at er trustee meeting that the company presented the trust deed and rules and it was resolved that the committee of management would er transfer all the close scheme members er into the new nineteen ninety scheme and er the same trustees appointed themselves er trustees of the nineteen ninety scheme and one hour later were the presentation of a draft deed amending the british steel pension scheme and a draft interim trust deed establishing the british steel pension scheme in nineteen ninety and a draft trust deed and rules of the british steel pension scheme of nineteen ninety were tabled for noting; and those very trustees that were on the first meeting agreed to transfer the assets to the new scheme, set as trustees of the new scheme one hour later, accepted the assets and er without er seeking either legal or actuarial advice and in this case er watsons were advisors to the company to the old scheme trustees and to the new scheme trustees. the difference though between you and imperial tobacco was that the trustees went into the courts didn't they? yes. dissimilar. @@ -15670,19 +15655,19 @@ i m p a c which was formed to protect the pensioners had threatened an injunctio so er listening to the gentleman on the left er echoes of nineteen ninety high court case. yes. so you were saying who were threatening an injunction if you didn't go into court? -we engaged a solicitor to look into the matter and he became convinced that there was i won't say a loophole, that there was a reason why this should not be done and er requested the committee of management to to court for advice. +we engaged a solicitor to look into the matter and he became convinced that there was i won't say a loophole, that there was a reason why this should not be done and er requested the committee of management to to court for advice. this was done in the name of one of our pensioners. -and stated that if they did not do so, we would an injunction to stop the proposals going through. -the committee of management took the advice and went to the high court and as a result the proposal was stopped. +and stated that if they did not do so, we would an injunction to stop the proposals going through. +the committee of management took the advice and went to the high court and as a result the proposal was stopped. jimmy? -yes, mr chairman it seems to me regarding that you could drive a double deckered bus through the legislation, and -goodey has not looked at it satisfactorily as far as i'm concerned and as far as many of the scheme members are concerned, i mean he has concluded that the employers are still entitled to er do what they like with the surplus, the only thing that he recommends that they do it with the approval of the regulator himself, but he the other thing that the -goodey has reported and concluded, that as long as they get their hundred per cent minimum requirement they can still go on their contribution holidays, and many and my scheme members feel that this is just a it's a freebie as far as they're concerned and scheme members don't do not benefit from the surplus and they would like to have seen or preferred to have seen +yes, mr chairman it seems to me regarding that you could drive a double deckered bus through the legislation, and +goodey has not looked at it satisfactorily as far as i'm concerned and as far as many of the scheme members are concerned, i mean he has concluded that the employers are still entitled to er do what they like with the surplus, the only thing that he recommends that they do it with the approval of the regulator himself, but he the other thing that the +goodey has reported and concluded, that as long as they get their hundred per cent minimum requirement they can still go on their contribution holidays, and many and my scheme members feel that this is just a it's a freebie as far as they're concerned and scheme members don't do not benefit from the surplus and they would like to have seen or preferred to have seen goodey making a change for the benefit of the scheme members paying into a scheme, rather than employers going away in a contribution holiday. -now is there any other er pension funds that do likewise or have any other experiences as far as surpluses are concerned? -i i find issue with one point in the good report, when he mentioned that a surplus is a notional surplus, it cannot crystallize until the fund actual close down. +now is there any other er pension funds that do likewise or have any other experiences as far as surpluses are concerned? +i i find issue with one point in the good report, when he mentioned that a surplus is a notional surplus, it cannot crystallize until the fund actual close down. if it is in fact a notional surplus, then why is the employer allowed to take money out of that notional surplus, he's taking real money out of from a notional surplus, it should not be allowed. -told you didn't he that the surplus the only way one would know there was a surplus there was when the fund was closed, when every pensioner had been paid money left. +told you didn't he that the surplus the only way one would know there was a surplus there was when the fund was closed, when every pensioner had been paid money left. but in view of the fact that different actuaries can come to different answers and professor good quotes one where a difference of half per cent gives rise to a difference of a hundred and sixty seven million. how does one know and i accept professor good's point what the exact amount of that surplus is. there may be in fact a deficit, and yet we still allow the employer to take money out. @@ -15691,16 +15676,16 @@ right. b t? would you like to respond to jimmy's question? well we were disappointed in the good report because er they did say it was one of the major issues, and yet they said that they didn't think any sweep in changes are needed which rather erm contradicted the earlier part of our report, we would have thought there were erm changes needed. -a group of our here is largely actuarial surpluses and one doesn't really know whether there's a surplus things keep changes. +a group of our here is largely actuarial surpluses and one doesn't really know whether there's a surplus things keep changes. the actuaries go to the employer to find out what their plans are. british steel how you go that answers a really good way of putting it. thank you very much. -well british steel adopted a somewhat more subtler tactic er they make a strong point of the fact that no money has ever been removed from the scheme despite the presence of a six hundred surplus. +well british steel adopted a somewhat more subtler tactic er they make a strong point of the fact that no money has ever been removed from the scheme despite the presence of a six hundred surplus. what they did is took half and used it to reduce their contributions and it was a large reduction, it was a reduction from twelve to currently five per cent. -er okay, different words to describe the same and indeed they didn't take out of any fund, but they achieved the same end result. +er okay, different words to describe the same and indeed they didn't take out of any fund, but they achieved the same end result. jimmy? well if this is the case then you don't see that any recommendations in goodey would stop that kind of thing happening and if you don't see that, what recommendations would you make to the committee that goodey should put any report that would stop that kind of thing happening. -well the fear of boring you because i've said it before, i think that either a trustee made up of an equal balance of members from the various interested groups which is very difficult to achieve in practice and additionally independent trustees certainly in our case, we believe would have stopped it happening because the movements in the direction it went was clear now that we have the information in front of us to the trustees, it was quite clear what was gonna happen and nothing was done about it. +well the fear of boring you because i've said it before, i think that either a trustee made up of an equal balance of members from the various interested groups which is very difficult to achieve in practice and additionally independent trustees certainly in our case, we believe would have stopped it happening because the movements in the direction it went was clear now that we have the information in front of us to the trustees, it was quite clear what was gonna happen and nothing was done about it. now we didn't have a voice, remember we were never even informed before or until two years later after the event that it had happened. there are still british steel pensioners from the old scheme who genuinely do not know that there exists a new scheme. do you not believe that with this recommendation where @@ -15709,20 +15694,20 @@ the problem there i would suggest is the timescale between the things happening in the present didn't understand the two years, i mean he would have told the regulator. yes. -erm whereas if there were independent trustees responsible to the regulator and they were properly trained, they would i suggest be able to smell out very quickly any malpractice and would have straight to the regulator, if only to call a stop for someone to have a look at it. +erm whereas if there were independent trustees responsible to the regulator and they were properly trained, they would i suggest be able to smell out very quickly any malpractice and would have straight to the regulator, if only to call a stop for someone to have a look at it. nothing recommended with goodey in that particular cause is of any good. i don't think so. have erm imperial? belief is that er if you get the trustee balance right, that's the first place where the decision ought to be made, but there should be a fall-back position which good has given, which they the trustees could go to the regulator in the case of er not being able to solve things, but are feeling very much on surpluses, that the money is there first of all to pay pensions and until pensions are paid up to inland revenue levels, whatever they are, then no money should go back to the company. the question of taking pension holidays in between out of surplus is a sort of mid midway position, but er very definitely we feel strongly that money should not go to the company. we have suffered from the same thing as the other two er abalance have said today of money being used from our surplus to provide for redundancy and erm i it's been exacerbated by money being available from the people who are made, made redundant, going to the company and swelling their balance sheets, while all the cost side of it comes out of the pension fund and that has caused a lot of ill-feeling particularly from the older pensioners who have seen years of inflation when their pensions were not made up to the same extent. -in the old days when there was a possibility of of erm ad hoc payments made, er that sort of thing was taken of, since the takeover of the company, that hasn't happened to the same extent so there's a very strong feeling with the older pay er pensioners that they paid money into a pension scheme which now shows a surplus, but other people are benefiting from it. -we need we've got lot's more questions to ask you. +in the old days when there was a possibility of of erm ad hoc payments made, er that sort of thing was taken of, since the takeover of the company, that hasn't happened to the same extent so there's a very strong feeling with the older pay er pensioners that they paid money into a pension scheme which now shows a surplus, but other people are benefiting from it. +we need we've got lot's more questions to ask you. peter? erm, mrs appleby you mentioned briefly earlier the role of the regulator. how do you see the regulator doing his job with a hundred and twenty eight thousand schemes to, to monitor? -great difficulty -erm er well we welcome the erm e er er the proposal that there should be a regulator. +great difficulty +erm er well we welcome the erm e er er the proposal that there should be a regulator. somebody er to whom the erm er er matters could be referred er whom er could remove trustees er who are er not acting in er the best interests er of the fund erm to whom er i understand that the erm beneficiaries could er appeal if they felt that their fund was being erm used i in the wrong way which is something that we haven't got at the moment erm i mean just going very, very briefly back to the question that you asked erm about this how would you stop what's happen happening is by having, we would have thought a pensioner trustee, because even the question has been asked how did it get through the union trustees and the answer is that most of them are employed, and they are looking over their shoulder because jobs are going and redundancies are being made. you've got a pensioner employee er a pensioner trustee on there and they're not looking over their shoulder for their job, they are going to do the job of a trustee and watch the funds, and they would then be able to go to the regulator if they saw something that was amiss. whereas somebody who is employed by the firm might be very worried about doing because they're more bothered about keeping their job. @@ -15732,18 +15717,17 @@ now you're saying erm rather well, that in fact that person or persons could be yes. because they're actually not worried about being sacked yes. -either erm because redundancies are coming up, or imperial trustees down, they were just got ridden of as a way of moving them off the trust. +either erm because redundancies are coming up, or imperial trustees down, they were just got ridden of as a way of moving them off the trust. yeah, very good. -in our case the unions approved our proposals of the company, they raised no objections it was only the who raised objections, the employees didn't and in the high court case, we've just said, how can an employee be independent when he depends upon his employer for his future work. +in our case the unions approved our proposals of the company, they raised no objections it was only the who raised objections, the employees didn't and in the high court case, we've just said, how can an employee be independent when he depends upon his employer for his future work. so, really what you're saying is that if we're looking at trip wires to stop things happening, there's a powerful a really powerful case for a pensioner trustee looking for whistle blowers. yes. -there's also a powerful case for having pensioner trustees there's far less chance of erm people twisting their arm, although they could have the character. +there's also a powerful case for having pensioner trustees there's far less chance of erm people twisting their arm, although they could have the character. and that's where independents come in. but, but, but that's a problem we all face. and we're also saying that if you have a new pensions act, the work of the regulator would be much easier. why? he won't keep have to be going off to court to find out what is the law at that moment of time. - erm it's an adventure and it gives you a sense of freedom. i don't want to do anything too energetic, i just like erm the sound of the water on the boat, wind in the sails you can be as serious about it as you want to be. @@ -15767,12 +15751,12 @@ well we know that a lot of beginners are put off by the complexity of larger boa the second point is that the topper's hull is made of polypropylene which is remarkably tough and resilient. now that's important for sailing schools dealing with a lot of beginners. it's also important for the first time buyer. -right i'm convinced such a good breed and you very kindly rigged this topper up for me so well you won't mind if i take it for a spin will you? +right i'm convinced such a good breed and you very kindly rigged this topper up for me so well you won't mind if i take it for a spin will you? just hang on a minute. i know i said it's easy but it's not that easy. before you go out there are some important safety considerations we should talk about and the first one is personal preparation. i think you're having me on now john. -this is the mediterranean so why am i squeezed into this number? +this is the mediterranean so why am i squeezed into this number? well in really warm weather a t-shirt and shorts may be enough but as it gets colder so you need to add layers of sweaters, trousers and top the whole thing up with a wind and waterproof spray suit but all that can make you a little clumsy, so the answer for most british sailors is a wetsuit like the ones that you and suzanne are wearing. but why is mine slightly different to howard's? you're wearing the summer shorty for greater freedom of movement for your arms and legs but howard's got the full suit, for more protection in colder weather but they both work on the same principle. @@ -15787,7 +15771,7 @@ no, you should always wear personal buoyancy when going afloat in a small sail b for larger boats a life jacket like this one is fine, particularly if you are going further offshore but it's too clumsy to wear in a small sail boat like the topper and so we prefer the buoyancy aid like this one. so it's probably just as well that i didn't leap off in your boat because er even in this climate i, i could have ended up pretty cold and miserable especially if i'd fallen in. well the thing is howard, i don't think you'd have got very far if you hadn't understood how we put the boat together and so i think it's important that we look now into more detail at how to rig the topper. -it seems have done that john's intent on making us a nation of master mariners and under these circumstances, i think i'll adopt the old maritime adage, women and children first, so i'll it back, john can show you how to rig one of these things, alright, come on. +it seems have done that john's intent on making us a nation of master mariners and under these circumstances, i think i'll adopt the old maritime adage, women and children first, so i'll it back, john can show you how to rig one of these things, alright, come on. right suzanne, now we're going to look at the various parts of the topper and how they fit together. right. we'll start with the hull @@ -15795,7 +15779,7 @@ mm. one piece unsinkable, all ready to go in the water. right. and we've got the files, the rudder and the daggerboard. -right, then i know steer the boat, i'm not quite sure what the daggerboards are for. +right, then i know steer the boat, i'm not quite sure what the daggerboards are for. that slots down into a hole in the middle of the boat but that just stops us drifting sideways. oh. then we've got the rig, the mast comes in two parts, the boom, the sail and all the ropes to put them together. @@ -15809,7 +15793,7 @@ while we sleeve it into the sail. okay suzanne, keep on feeding it through. fine, now we're ready to tie the top of the halyard to the top of the sail. there are a few knots that we need to learn when we're sailing. -this particular one is called a rail turn and two half hitches it needs to be tight so that it doesn't come undone when we're out there. +this particular one is called a rail turn and two half hitches it needs to be tight so that it doesn't come undone when we're out there. okay suzanne, now you had to slacken off the halyard to let me tie that last knot so if you could tighten it up again that will pull the sail up to the top of the mast. that's fine, now all we've got to do is to tidy up this end of the halyard and tuck it out of the way. you will see that most sailors are tidy around the boat particularly with loose ends of rope, and there is a very good safety reason. @@ -15829,7 +15813,7 @@ a little knot here just so there's no risk of it coming out and off we go right. so that's how it works, open it up and get the mast. you will probably find it easiest to slide the mast in at an angle like this until the collar fits neatly underneath the mast gate. -at the moment the sail is only attached down its needed edge but before we can use it, we've got to control it properly and that means to tuck it in the boot the jaws clip on here, the down-haul clips on to the sail and is threaded through the jaws before we make it up on the cleat the position of the boom and hence the sail relative to the wind is controlled by this rope, the mainsheet. +at the moment the sail is only attached down its needed edge but before we can use it, we've got to control it properly and that means to tuck it in the boot the jaws clip on here, the down-haul clips on to the sail and is threaded through the jaws before we make it up on the cleat the position of the boom and hence the sail relative to the wind is controlled by this rope, the mainsheet. the next thing to attach is the kicking strap or boom bang. this is used to control the twist in the sail and to stop the boom riding too high. at this stage you simply clip it on and leave it slack. @@ -15859,23 +15843,23 @@ when the boom comes over the top of the boat then you can change sides, sit on t oh, that sounds better well we'll try that once more and then we'll let you go. okay. -so the first thing we do is to change hands, that's good, push, wait change sides, straighten up the tiller, look where you're going that's fine. +so the first thing we do is to change hands, that's good, push, wait change sides, straighten up the tiller, look where you're going that's fine. great. you're ready to go for your first sail. oh. now it's only going to be a short one, just out towards that buoy and when i call you, you can turn round, okay? okay. okay come back to me now. -alright let everything go fine you've become a sailor. +alright let everything go fine you've become a sailor. now all we've got to do is teach you how to sail. this is our stable starting position crawl on the . -the wind is blowing directly across the boat, it's known as the basic two position. +the wind is blowing directly across the boat, it's known as the basic two position. the sail is just flapping and there's no drive in it. it's flapping freely. to start sailing we simply pull in the rope that controls the sail that's the mainsheet. then we can sail off on a reach in either direction just as we saw suzanne doing. now let's watch that again. -from the basic two position, we pull in the mainsheet, we start sailing away on a reach, the wind is blowing directly across the boat and we accelerate away. +from the basic two position, we pull in the mainsheet, we start sailing away on a reach, the wind is blowing directly across the boat and we accelerate away. now to start sailing closer towards the wind, we need to pull in the mainsheet, pop the daggerboard down and then turn the boat gently towards the wind, we reach the point where even with the sail sheeted in tightly, the front edge, the luff of the sail is still flapping, that's as close to the wind as we can get and so we maintain a course to keep the sail full. now we're sailing at about forty five degrees to the wind. we're on the edge of what we call a no go area, if we try to sail any closer to the wind the boat will come upright, the sail will flap and we'll slow down and stop and so the best we can make either side of the no go area is known as a beat. @@ -15911,7 +15895,7 @@ by the time you've mastered gybing, you can sail in almost any direction and so sail trips, maximum driving power from your route. boat balance, keep the hull flat for maximum speed. before and after trip keep the hull level, don't make waves. -daggerboard position, get the right compromise between drive and drag course wave good, the shortest or fastest distance between two points. +daggerboard position, get the right compromise between drive and drag course wave good, the shortest or fastest distance between two points. sail trim isn't simply a question of pulling everything in and forgetting about it as the sail works at its maximum at any one angle to the wind. on a beat, that is with the sheet pulled in tightly but as we turn on to a ridge you'll see that we have to ease the sheet out so that the sail stays at the same angle for the wind. again moving from a reach towards a rung the boat effectively turns underneath the rig and the sail stays at that same angle. @@ -15924,7 +15908,7 @@ that rudder movement equals braking and so it's slowing you down, it may look im let's look at that again, when the boat's heeled over that rudder movement causes a lot of turbulence and that's just slowing you down. for an off trip is much the same, the idea is to keep the boat flat with the bow skimming slowly across the water without too much bow wave and the water leaving the stern very cleanly. again without too much turbulence. -the most common beginner's mistake is to sit too far aft in the boat and that causes a great wrist a tail of to come up from the trunk . +the most common beginner's mistake is to sit too far aft in the boat and that causes a great wrist a tail of to come up from the trunk . a far less common problem but one which is much more dramatic is if you put your weight too far forward. not only will this make the boat difficult to steer but if you try doing it too far, you'll start sailing straight under water. now for the daggerboard position. @@ -15944,7 +15928,7 @@ sailing upwind involves tacking and here you have a wide choice of routes to rea you could reach it in two tacks or in many more. the route you actually take will be influenced by things like the tide, obstacles like shallow water or other boats and by wind shifts and wind shadows from the land. all other things being equal, the most direct route is the best. -sailing downwind it seems most logical to head straight for your goal point but in fact, particularly in stronger winds, sailing downwind can be slightly uncomfortable. +sailing downwind it seems most logical to head straight for your goal point but in fact, particularly in stronger winds, sailing downwind can be slightly uncomfortable. it's better to sail two oblique courses to get down there but this if you choose where to gybe to reach your goal point. launching with an offshore wind is a straightforward process. first simply lift the boat into the water but don't let go at this point because you'll find that the boat will drift faster than you can swim after it, then you lift the daggerboard here, halfway down because you'll be sailing off wind. @@ -15991,7 +15975,7 @@ whoops. what happened there? well she let the boat heel so far before sheeting out that the boom hit the water and wouldn't go any further. she recovered by leaning out more. -suzanne's got a good sense of balance which is always useful when you're sailing now let's look at this gybe to see if it's any smoother. +suzanne's got a good sense of balance which is always useful when you're sailing now let's look at this gybe to see if it's any smoother. oh yes that's much better wow, she's really taking off now. yes, the wind is stronger out there. @@ -16018,7 +16002,7 @@ this is the easiest way of turning the boat over, to tack without moving. swim clear of all the ropes, swim around to the back of the boat, pull the daggerboard down and then simply flip the boat upright again. with the topper, you'll find that there's very little water in the cockpit and so you can start sailing almost immediately. with a little more confidence you barely need to get your feet wet. -if the boat capsizes because it's overpowered simply scramble into the high side until you end up standing on the daggerboard. +if the boat capsizes because it's overpowered simply scramble into the high side until you end up standing on the daggerboard. then lever the hull upright again and clamber back in, it's as simple as that. the worst thing that can happen is for the boat to become totally inverted and here you need to slide the daggerboard quickly out before it drops through the hull. now the accent is on patience. @@ -16039,7 +16023,7 @@ this is more my kind of sailing, rescuing damsels in distress. rescue boats are extremely important. good sailing centres will have at least one and certainly the r y a ones do and they're important because if beginners get into difficulties out on the water you need to be able to get to them as quickly as possible and it also gives them a sense of security to have one of these things around. are you alright like that? -the get her into shore. +the get her into shore. so you've shown us all the basic techniques of sailing and more importantly how to get yourself rescued should things get out of hand but apart from the dubious pleasure of capsizing, are there any other ways of getting thoroughly wet? as with any other sport, howard, the real exhilaration of sailing, comes when you're going faster and that can certainly mean getting wet. in our case the wind is the driving force, so let's now look at strong wind technique. @@ -16058,12 +16042,12 @@ roll the sail around the mast until it's reduced in area. in these conditions i wanted to get rid of about a third of the original sail area and so that's it, now i'm sailing much more happily instead of struggling against the boat i'm sailing in harmony again. the excess sail is rolled up neatly around the mast out of the way and still i've good a good sail shape. that means i can sail happily upwind or downwind in perfect control the whole time. -that's to an expert sailor to reef wasn't it because of course the stronger the wind the more exciting the sailing +that's to an expert sailor to reef wasn't it because of course the stronger the wind the more exciting the sailing absolutely so if we move over from suzanne's boat over to mine, we'll see some of the fittings which make the boat go faster. okay? right so what have we got here? -well this boat's fitted with the race pack which gives it a lot of the extra controls that you'd expect on a larger sail boat. -first of all we've got the kicking strap three to one purchase, the down-haul has a three to one purchase, and the out-haul, that's got a four to one purchase. +well this boat's fitted with the race pack which gives it a lot of the extra controls that you'd expect on a larger sail boat. +first of all we've got the kicking strap three to one purchase, the down-haul has a three to one purchase, and the out-haul, that's got a four to one purchase. it all sounds a lot more complicated now aren't you just making extra work for yourself? no, in fact it makes life easier. three to one, four to one, that simply means that it's that much easier to pull everything in. @@ -16073,7 +16057,7 @@ if you know that for your particular weight and the certain wind strength you wa you can always go straight through it, it would be right every time? yes. in your enthusiasm to get afloat in a good breeze, it's easy to forget about getting the right sail shape and the effect can be dreadful. -just look at this, the sail is far too full for the conditions, the foot is billowing out and the luff is horribly wrinkled which has got too much power there, it's a bag of wind. +just look at this, the sail is far too full for the conditions, the foot is billowing out and the luff is horribly wrinkled which has got too much power there, it's a bag of wind. the general rule is if it looks bad, it probably is bad, so let's get it right. first we tension the foot and then the luff until we get a properly shaped aerofoil. another classic mistake is to forget to tighten the kitten strap for boom bang. @@ -16089,7 +16073,7 @@ aha. that's a ratchet locking the sheets, so all the load is taken by the block and i'm just holding it. that means that you can sail for longer. strong winds without getting tired, so it's a lot more fun. -it's also pretty wet but with the ratchet block taking the strain out of controlling the sail i can concentrate on technique and having fun and respond to the gusts by sheeting in or sheeting out if i'm overpowered and moving bodyweight in or out to suit the . +it's also pretty wet but with the ratchet block taking the strain out of controlling the sail i can concentrate on technique and having fun and respond to the gusts by sheeting in or sheeting out if i'm overpowered and moving bodyweight in or out to suit the . even with the boat sailing flat a certain amount of spray goes aboard, so get the bailer down to drain the cockpit. the daggerboard is raised slightly from the same position in lighter winds because the boat's sailing faster. if the wind drops a bit then you can sit inboard more to keep the boat flat. @@ -16102,7 +16086,7 @@ as i suspect it's not for many of the people here. well sailing is what you want it to be. for some of us it's pitting our strength against the elements, for others it's pitting our wits against other people by going racing and yet other people seek adventure by exploring new sailing areas and the beauty of a small sail boat like the topper is that you can do all of these. in tidal waters like the channel islands, you must find out what the tides are doing. -that means looking up the tide tables to see the times of high and low water and the tidal stream list to find the maximum rates. +that means looking up the tide tables to see the times of high and low water and the tidal stream list to find the maximum rates. in tide free waters like the mediterranean we don't have the same problem but we still need to consult a chart to find out a suitable location for sailing. that may be affected by the prevailing wind and we'll have to find a suitable launching site. well this is a beautiful boat. @@ -16111,11 +16095,11 @@ well, almost, in this particular bay it's fine, we know it's a public beach, we' it's a different matter if you're sailing inland because most inland water is owned by somebody. what about the er winds here? well here we've got an onshore wind, that's perfect, because we know that if we get into trouble just get blown back ashore. -it's different if the wind's offshore because then it can be deceptively close into the shore and further out bigger waves and if you get into trouble you're lost out to sea. +it's different if the wind's offshore because then it can be deceptively close into the shore and further out bigger waves and if you get into trouble you're lost out to sea. right well we're all set. fancy a sail round here suzanne? i think it sounds pretty good fun, i think we should go for it. -right +right let's go. let's go. fun? @@ -16127,7 +16111,7 @@ now that you've learnt to sail on your own, the next step is to sail with other that probably means buy a boat and joining a club. if you are of a competitive nature, most clubs provide the opportunity for you to start racing and there's no faster way into a pretty good technique than by sailing against more experienced people. if you have no intention of racing, every sailing club offers a safer and supervised area to continue your sailing. -having learnt to sail in a sail boat like the topper you can move on to more complex boats with confidence or continue to exploit the versatility and convenience of this single-hander which has become the best selling sail boat in britain the one design nature of the topper, due to its injection moulded hull, is perfect for racing and secondhand values remain high. +having learnt to sail in a sail boat like the topper you can move on to more complex boats with confidence or continue to exploit the versatility and convenience of this single-hander which has become the best selling sail boat in britain the one design nature of the topper, due to its injection moulded hull, is perfect for racing and secondhand values remain high. like every other lively class the topper has an owners' association which organizes rallies, open meetings, national and international championships. i'm beginning to realize why perfectly sane people pitch themselves at the mercy of the elements miles from the security of terra firma,has provided the perfect resort for our first events of the . thanks to the excellent facilities here at menorca sailing. @@ -16135,56 +16119,55 @@ thanks also to the r y a and particularly to john . the r y a beginner's course has certainly got suzanne here sailing with confidence in no time at all. it certainly has. well you look as if you're raring to go and show us what you can do, so i'll give you a push up and away you go. -bye - -couple of decades there has been an unparalleled interest in the occult and astrology and satanism, and witchcraft and society at large, on the one hand it worships at the shrine of science and technology and then it turns and pays its cash, and it does pay its cash , and its homage at the signs of the zodiac, and at the other various things dealing wi or are a part of the occult. -almost every newspaper, national newspaper and local free papers, will have er their horoscopes, television and radio chat shows, again, will have their their resident astrologers telephone call lines to find out what the stars have in store for you, an unprecedented interest in the, in the various branches of the occult. +bye +couple of decades there has been an unparalleled interest in the occult and astrology and satanism, and witchcraft and society at large, on the one hand it worships at the shrine of science and technology and then it turns and pays its cash, and it does pay its cash , and its homage at the signs of the zodiac, and at the other various things dealing wi or are a part of the occult. +almost every newspaper, national newspaper and local free papers, will have er their horoscopes, television and radio chat shows, again, will have their their resident astrologers telephone call lines to find out what the stars have in store for you, an unprecedented interest in the, in the various branches of the occult. some, few years ago, we were told that we were entering the age of aquarius. now this was, really, rather a low-key introduction to a whole new way of life that at the moment is sweeping through the united states and is on our doorstep. -not just a religious movement, but something that involves and enmeshes every area of life, from high national, and international politics, right the way down to the very colour of the, of the latest fashions, the new age movement and sometime in the future we're gonna lo , talk a little bit about that. +not just a religious movement, but something that involves and enmeshes every area of life, from high national, and international politics, right the way down to the very colour of the, of the latest fashions, the new age movement and sometime in the future we're gonna lo , talk a little bit about that. but there's this, this involvement wi with with occult. -now, it's not then that society doesn't believe in the supernatural, we believe in the supernatural, society at large believes in the supernatural, the tragedy is that the natural man, the natural person however, as always is more willing to believe satan's mysteries than he is to believe god's mysteries. +now, it's not then that society doesn't believe in the supernatural, we believe in the supernatural, society at large believes in the supernatural, the tragedy is that the natural man, the natural person however, as always is more willing to believe satan's mysteries than he is to believe god's mysteries. our priorities get turned inside out, they get inverted. -scientists contend that the principles of natural law that govern our universe cannot be turned aside, you cannot ignore them, they are fixed, they are great things that, that you cannot alter god cannot do anything about them. -and so, when you come to the bible and you read the account of jesus here on the earth, turning the water into wine, of jesus stilling the storm, when you into the old testament and you read accounts there of the children of israel, of the me , of the tremendous miracles that were performed by jehovah, god for them well of course, there's a natural explanation to it, because you can't do these things, there are natural laws that stop you doing them you cannot take a glass of water, even if you're god, you cannot take it and make it into a glass of wine instantly, it's got natural processes to go through. -and of course, when jesus came and he healed the people and he spoke words of, of deliverance to those who are demon oppressed and he spoke words of that brought help to those who are blind and so on , there is of course , er, to the natural mind, a very natural explanation, it can all be explained away because you cannot do these things! -and yet, the same science and the same technology that contends of the inviability of the natural laws, the same time is able to set it, one law against it, another itself, and he can do what he wants. -these same men use one set of laws to cancel the effects of another, for example, the application of the law of aerodynamics, enables them to cancel the effect of the law of gravity, that's why you can go up in an aeroplane. +scientists contend that the principles of natural law that govern our universe cannot be turned aside, you cannot ignore them, they are fixed, they are great things that, that you cannot alter god cannot do anything about them. +and so, when you come to the bible and you read the account of jesus here on the earth, turning the water into wine, of jesus stilling the storm, when you into the old testament and you read accounts there of the children of israel, of the me , of the tremendous miracles that were performed by jehovah, god for them well of course, there's a natural explanation to it, because you can't do these things, there are natural laws that stop you doing them you cannot take a glass of water, even if you're god, you cannot take it and make it into a glass of wine instantly, it's got natural processes to go through. +and of course, when jesus came and he healed the people and he spoke words of, of deliverance to those who are demon oppressed and he spoke words of that brought help to those who are blind and so on , there is of course , er, to the natural mind, a very natural explanation, it can all be explained away because you cannot do these things! +and yet, the same science and the same technology that contends of the inviability of the natural laws, the same time is able to set it, one law against it, another itself, and he can do what he wants. +these same men use one set of laws to cancel the effects of another, for example, the application of the law of aerodynamics, enables them to cancel the effect of the law of gravity, that's why you can go up in an aeroplane. man can do it, but god is not allowed to do it, he can't do it! -well, let's look for a few moments this morning at one such incident when jesus did do it and it's in er, mark chapter four, i want to read a few verses from there, mark chapter four. -i'm gonna read from verse thirty five, just the paragraph there, the last paragraph in that chapter it says on that day when evening had come jesus said to them let us go over to the other side and leaving the multitude they took him along with them just as he was in the boat and other boats were with them. -and there arose a fierce gale of wind and the waves were breaking over the boat so much that the boat was already filling up and he himself was in the stern asleep on the cushion. -and they awoke him and said to him, teacher do you not care that we are perishing? -and being aroused, he rebuked the wind and said to the sea hush! +well, let's look for a few moments this morning at one such incident when jesus did do it and it's in er, mark chapter four, i want to read a few verses from there, mark chapter four. +i'm gonna read from verse thirty five, just the paragraph there, the last paragraph in that chapter it says on that day when evening had come jesus said to them let us go over to the other side and leaving the multitude they took him along with them just as he was in the boat and other boats were with them. +and there arose a fierce gale of wind and the waves were breaking over the boat so much that the boat was already filling up and he himself was in the stern asleep on the cushion. +and they awoke him and said to him, teacher do you not care that we are perishing? +and being aroused, he rebuked the wind and said to the sea hush! be still. the wind died down and it became perfectly calm. -and he said to them why are you so timid? +and he said to them why are you so timid? how is it that you have no faith? and they became very much afraid and said to one another who then is this, that even the wind and the sea obey him ? -jesus had been, with his disciples and he had spent the whole day in teaching and preaching to the people, he'd been explaining to them what the kingdom of god was like, he'd been telling them some of the parables that perhaps we're familiar with, he'd been telling them about the parable of the sewer and the seed, the man who went out and he sewed his seed and different things went wrong birds came and picked up the stuff that fell by the wayside, some fell on stony ground and it couldn't put down any roots, some fell amongst thorns and they were quickly choked, but some did fall in good prepared soil and that grew. +jesus had been, with his disciples and he had spent the whole day in teaching and preaching to the people, he'd been explaining to them what the kingdom of god was like, he'd been telling them some of the parables that perhaps we're familiar with, he'd been telling them about the parable of the sewer and the seed, the man who went out and he sewed his seed and different things went wrong birds came and picked up the stuff that fell by the wayside, some fell on stony ground and it couldn't put down any roots, some fell amongst thorns and they were quickly choked, but some did fall in good prepared soil and that grew. and so jesus had been teaching the people. -and at the end of the day he's tired, he's physically weary, and he says let's get away for a while let's go over to the other side. +and at the end of the day he's tired, he's physically weary, and he says let's get away for a while let's go over to the other side. now, it's im , that's an important little phrase there what jesus says, let's go to the other side. he wasn't going for a joy trip, he wasn't going out in the boat just to se to while away an hour or so to relax and to unwind, he wasn't going there to, just to get away from the crowd of people that had been following him and had been listening to him, he had a purpose in going in into the boat, to go to the other side. -we're not gonna be looking at it this morning, but it's quite simple if you were to read on down, the reason why is because on the other side there is a man there who is possessed of a whole legion of demons who desperately needs deliverance and jesus is going over there to bring healing, to bring deliverance to this man. +we're not gonna be looking at it this morning, but it's quite simple if you were to read on down, the reason why is because on the other side there is a man there who is possessed of a whole legion of demons who desperately needs deliverance and jesus is going over there to bring healing, to bring deliverance to this man. but it's important, for what we're going to be thinking of this morning to re , keep that little phrase in mind that jesus said to them let us go over to the other side, there was purpose in going into that boat. and we see in this account, this incident in the life of jesus, that jesus is able to bring peace. there in the midst of turmoil, in the midst of, of unrest, in the midst of anxiety and fear, in the, in the midst of perplexity these disciples not knowing what to do, where to turn, jesus christ is able to bring peace. and the good news, the message of the gospel is that jesus christ is still able to do that. into your life, into my life, he is able to bring peace. -whether we know him or not whether we've never had any dealings with him in the past or not, he is able to bring peace once we allow him to come in and to take control of the situation. -but even if we've known him for many years, if we're committed christians, if we've been followers of jesus, there are occasions, there are times in our life when there is turmoil and there is unrest and if we allow him to se , to take control he is able to bring peace. -so th let's look then back at this illustration for a moment, this incident, jesus then gets er a few of his disciples and they go out, in the boat, and there are others who follow him, they get into their boats quite likely, quite possibly that many of the others would have been followers of jesus, some of his other disciples, it's unlikely in these very small little er lakeside fishing boats that many of disciples would have got in, there might have been four or five of them that would have been about the lot and so the others would have got into some of the other boats which were nearby and, and others are the people that had been listening to jesus, they too get into boats, and they pull out following him, wanting to hear if he's got anything more to say, wanting to witness anything else that he's gonna do, they wanna be there to see and to hear what jesus has to say and is going to do. -and whilst they're sailing across this little lake there in the evening a sudden storm blows up, now in the version of the bible that i'm reading from it says there that, er that is was a fierce storm , other versions will er, give different e , different expressions, it was a fierce, sorry, a fierce gale of wind. -er, some some translations will put it tha that, that a, that a great storm blew up, but he word that is originally used there is the wi i , conveys the idea that this is no ordinary storm, this is just a, a sudden squall that has blown and in a, in a short while will blow itself out again, but it's a strong word that's used here, a word that would, that would denote a whirlwind or a tempest, something above and beyond the ordinary course of events that these disciples, many of them experience fisherman, would have known and been able to cope without any problem. +whether we know him or not whether we've never had any dealings with him in the past or not, he is able to bring peace once we allow him to come in and to take control of the situation. +but even if we've known him for many years, if we're committed christians, if we've been followers of jesus, there are occasions, there are times in our life when there is turmoil and there is unrest and if we allow him to se , to take control he is able to bring peace. +so th let's look then back at this illustration for a moment, this incident, jesus then gets er a few of his disciples and they go out, in the boat, and there are others who follow him, they get into their boats quite likely, quite possibly that many of the others would have been followers of jesus, some of his other disciples, it's unlikely in these very small little er lakeside fishing boats that many of disciples would have got in, there might have been four or five of them that would have been about the lot and so the others would have got into some of the other boats which were nearby and, and others are the people that had been listening to jesus, they too get into boats, and they pull out following him, wanting to hear if he's got anything more to say, wanting to witness anything else that he's gonna do, they wanna be there to see and to hear what jesus has to say and is going to do. +and whilst they're sailing across this little lake there in the evening a sudden storm blows up, now in the version of the bible that i'm reading from it says there that, er that is was a fierce storm , other versions will er, give different e , different expressions, it was a fierce, sorry, a fierce gale of wind. +er, some some translations will put it tha that, that a, that a great storm blew up, but he word that is originally used there is the wi i , conveys the idea that this is no ordinary storm, this is just a, a sudden squall that has blown and in a, in a short while will blow itself out again, but it's a strong word that's used here, a word that would, that would denote a whirlwind or a tempest, something above and beyond the ordinary course of events that these disciples, many of them experience fisherman, would have known and been able to cope without any problem. so whilst they're sailing across, everything is calm, everything is peaceful, and suddenly there arose this fierce gale, this this tempest! so much so that the waves were crashing over the boat, and the boat was filling up with water. -and these disciples and jesus, some of them seasoned, experienced fishermen, they'd been fishermen all their lives, their fathers had been fishermen before them and they were frightened! +and these disciples and jesus, some of them seasoned, experienced fishermen, they'd been fishermen all their lives, their fathers had been fishermen before them and they were frightened! they had never experienced anything like this before. and we find that life is not all plain sailing. life is not just sailing through on a mill pond with sort of red sails in the sunset and that idyllic picture, life is not like that. but life has its storms, it has its tempests, and some of them are a lot fiercer than others. -fearful storms sometimes come along our way and we we wonder what is happening to us and we feel that we're being thrown around and tossed about from side to side, there seems no way out! +fearful storms sometimes come along our way and we we wonder what is happening to us and we feel that we're being thrown around and tossed about from side to side, there seems no way out! there's seems to be no possible escape. and you have to start questioning. and that's just what these disciples did, they started questioning, what's he doing there? @@ -16196,14 +16179,14 @@ if there is a god of love why doesn't he see my situation? if there is a god of love, a god who cares then why doesn't he do something about it? why doesn't help me? why doesn't make a way of escape for me? -where is this god of love when i'm going through this situation? +where is this god of love when i'm going through this situation? now that's a question that we can all come up with at times, whether we're christians or non-christians, we come up and we question, where is god in this situation? why doesn't he do something about it? if he is there, if there is a god, can he not do something? why can't he help me? -as i said, life is not all plain sailing, there are troubles, there are storms and some of them are very fierce and some of them would cause us to, to wonder if there is an escape. +as i said, life is not all plain sailing, there are troubles, there are storms and some of them are very fierce and some of them would cause us to, to wonder if there is an escape. now that doesn't matter whether we're christians or not christians, that is the course of life, that happens to every one of us. -becoming a christian is not the solution and the answer and the th the grand elixir , it solves all of life's problems, it takes away all the difficulties. +becoming a christian is not the solution and the answer and the th the grand elixir , it solves all of life's problems, it takes away all the difficulties. jesus christ never ever made that claim, in fact he said, before you follow me, count the cost. weigh up what it will cost you to commit your life to me. it's not an escape route from all your troubles and all your problems, it's not an escape route from all the difficulties and all the unpleasant things in life, it's not a pathway of ease and of, of in , of un paralleled bliss and enjoyment day after day. @@ -16215,14 +16198,14 @@ don't be a fair weather follower . and when the difficulty gets going, gets hard you turn back, he says don't do that. but before you start, count the cost. he said that a man who's gonna build a, build something, let's put it in a modern setting, the man who's gonna, a man and woman, a couple are gonna put an extension on their house, they don't just go down and buy a few dozen bricks, er, and a bag cement and start, they work out how much it's gonna cost them first of all. -you see, they might have enough for that first barrel load of bricks, and the first bag of cement and sand but perhaps the money will run out shortly after that? +you see, they might have enough for that first barrel load of bricks, and the first bag of cement and sand but perhaps the money will run out shortly after that? and they've got is just a, perhaps a a, a few courses of brickwork. they might even get half the wall up, but that's as far as their capital goes. he says no, he says any man wanting to build an extension on his house, he's gonna sit down and gonna count the cost of it. he's gonna see how much it's gonna cost him in pounds and pence. he's then gonna look at his bank account and see if he can afford it or not. and he'll only start the job if he can afford it, that's if he's a wise man. -and jesus says so count the cost of following me. +and jesus says so count the cost of following me. now jesus wasn't saying this to stop people following him. not at all! he wanted them to follow him. @@ -16232,20 +16215,20 @@ as the bible says, in the world you have you will have persecution, you will hav there are the problems of life which are common to every one of us, whether they're christian or not christian, whether we believe in god or not, there are problems and difficulties and, and situations that are, they're the common lot of humanity. we all know suffering, we all know grief, we all know bereavement. but jesus says, weigh up the costs, balance the account. -and so we've said life is it's gonna bring us problems, it's gonna bring us storms, it's tempests, and some of them are gonna be very, very fierce! -but you know, for the person who does not know jesus christ as their saviour, for the person who has never committed their life to god listen to what god says for that person. +and so we've said life is it's gonna bring us problems, it's gonna bring us storms, it's tempests, and some of them are gonna be very, very fierce! +but you know, for the person who does not know jesus christ as their saviour, for the person who has never committed their life to god listen to what god says for that person. he says, the wicked are like the tossing sea, and you know, as far the bible is concerned, the wicked is not necessarily the man or the woman who does terrible deeds, the wicked is not necessarily who is, who is a murderer, or a child molesterer , or a thief or or or a wife beater or something like that, the wicked is the person who rejects god, who turns their back on god, who says thank you, i can go through my life without, i don't need you, i don't even believe you exist, and even if i do believe you exist i'm gonna do things my way, i'm gonna go through life as i choose. and god says the wicked are like the tossing sea, for it cannot be quiet, and it's waters toss up refuse and mud. there is no peace says my god for the wicked. that's the word of god through isaiah the prophet. there is no peace for the wicked. for the person who rejects and spurns god. -who, wants to go through life by themself. , doesn't mean to say that all the kind of life is one big storm, not at all! +who, wants to go through life by themself. , doesn't mean to say that all the kind of life is one big storm, not at all! david the psalmist, he could see the wicked, and he said why do they prosper? why do i have a hard time, and there's the godless person prospering? he said but david only saw the surface. -and you know, the surface is not all i , you look out on the sea, and it looks like the proverbial mill pond, it's calm, it's barely a ripple of water but it's not still. -i remember many years ago, we had friends who had a fishing boat, er herring drifter, and in fraserburgh the there's a young lad going out with them for a night's fishing and it was a beautiful summer's night! +and you know, the surface is not all i , you look out on the sea, and it looks like the proverbial mill pond, it's calm, it's barely a ripple of water but it's not still. +i remember many years ago, we had friends who had a fishing boat, er herring drifter, and in fraserburgh the there's a young lad going out with them for a night's fishing and it was a beautiful summer's night! and the sea was, it was as calm as the mill pond. i've never been as sea sick in all my life! because you see that surface water,it was only surface water , because when that boat was drifting there was an awful lot of movement. @@ -16253,25 +16236,25 @@ it was, it was going from side to side. it was going up and down. there was a lot of movement under those first few inches of surface water. and that's the picture that, god through isaiah uses. -and this particular it, it maybe all nice and calm on the surface, but underneath there is a whole maelstrom of, of of agitation. +and this particular it, it maybe all nice and calm on the surface, but underneath there is a whole maelstrom of, of of agitation. that's what it says, it brings up the mud and the refuse. -that comes from the se , the seabed churning it up but the sea is never still, it's tossing and in, as the movement there underneath, although it may appear calm on the surface, but there are times when it's not calm on the surface, it's as rough on top as it is underneath. +that comes from the se , the seabed churning it up but the sea is never still, it's tossing and in, as the movement there underneath, although it may appear calm on the surface, but there are times when it's not calm on the surface, it's as rough on top as it is underneath. most of you won't remember the time, and i certainly don't, some of you will, you'll be familiar with the er, healing accounts, seeing pictures on, er either in magazines or on the television news, in in old news reels, of that time when neville chamberlain stepped out of an aeroplane, and he's just been to germany and, and had a meeting with hitler. he comes back with a little piece of paper in his hand waving it, peace in our time. -the scrap of paper, and you know the,th the result of that, and you know the conclusion of it all. +the scrap of paper, and you know the,th the result of that, and you know the conclusion of it all. the whole world in, in a matter of months is engulfed in the, in the horrors of the second world war! -oh it looked good on the surface but underneath it was dark and peaceful. +oh it looked good on the surface but underneath it was dark and peaceful. and your life can be like that. -it looks alright on the surface, you're not going through a hassle at the moment, and our memories are short, fortunately and once we come into a calm patch the hassles of yesterday are quickly forgotten. +it looks alright on the surface, you're not going through a hassle at the moment, and our memories are short, fortunately and once we come into a calm patch the hassles of yesterday are quickly forgotten. we were just enjoying the calm and the peace of today. but underneath there are those hassles, and those, those agitations. and jesus, he meant to come and bring peace. -they say peace, it doesn't just go on the top two inches of the surface water, it goes right to the very depths of your life and keeps . +they say peace, it doesn't just go on the top two inches of the surface water, it goes right to the very depths of your life and keeps . one occasion jesus said, my peace, to his disciples shortly before he left, my peace i leave with you. i don't give, what the world gives, i do it . -i don't give something i haven't got, i don't give something i've no right to give, i'm not giving you something just for , i'm giving you my peace. -and there was never a time when the life of jesus is not shaping us. -you go through all sorts of situations and circumstances but there is a peace and an equilibrium it wasn't just on the surface, it was right to the very depths of his being the whole being. +i don't give something i haven't got, i don't give something i've no right to give, i'm not giving you something just for , i'm giving you my peace. +and there was never a time when the life of jesus is not shaping us. +you go through all sorts of situations and circumstances but there is a peace and an equilibrium it wasn't just on the surface, it was right to the very depths of his being the whole being. but you say, but i am a christian, i've experienced god's peace, i've accepted jesus christ as my saviour. i love the lord! i seek to serve him! @@ -16279,22 +16262,22 @@ but there are still those raging storms that come. there are still those tempests that hit my life and would not be around, and would almost swamp me! well there is a difference you see, there is a difference. and the big difference for these disciples, was that they were not alone. -though you're going through the storm but jesus is in the boat with you. -there is the difference for the person who has put their trust in god who has committed their life to christ and they will go and you and i will go through those storms, and through those tempests, and be knocked around and be, almost swamped by them but the thing is we are not alone jesus christ, he is in the boat of your life with you. +though you're going through the storm but jesus is in the boat with you. +there is the difference for the person who has put their trust in god who has committed their life to christ and they will go and you and i will go through those storms, and through those tempests, and be knocked around and be, almost swamped by them but the thing is we are not alone jesus christ, he is in the boat of your life with you. he says, i will never leave you. i will never forsake you. let me come into the book of hebrews and those words he uses are actually, to be underlined and emphasized. cos in the literary, i will never, never leave you! i will never, never forsake you! -he promises that which is i will lead you till the end of the age. +he promises that which is i will lead you till the end of the age. and jesus was there with them. and that made all the difference for them. and they turn to him, and he speaks a word that brings deliverance. -and he gets up and sees the situation and remember, he said, jesus wasn't out for joy ride, he wasn't just passing an evening relaxing and unwinding and resting away from the crowd, he had gone into the boat for a purpose, he was going to the other side, and no storm was gonna stop him getting there! +and he gets up and sees the situation and remember, he said, jesus wasn't out for joy ride, he wasn't just passing an evening relaxing and unwinding and resting away from the crowd, he had gone into the boat for a purpose, he was going to the other side, and no storm was gonna stop him getting there! there was a man there who desperately needed deliverance! he was possessed with a whole legion of demons! he was, he was,th they they took him, they chained him up, and they let him loose in the local cemetery, and left him there. -you can imagine the population of th , of a nearby town, every now and again they would come down and perhaps throw some food over in this man's direction a loaf of bread, a, a a a a a a, a hunk of meat or, some other food every now and again so he would keep alive. +you can imagine the population of th , of a nearby town, every now and again they would come down and perhaps throw some food over in this man's direction a loaf of bread, a, a a a a a a, a hunk of meat or, some other food every now and again so he would keep alive. but he ranted and raged and rampaged through the local cemetery. so they tied him with chains but the demonic powers were so great in his life that he snapped them like new cords. here was a man who desperately needed jesus! @@ -16304,7 +16287,7 @@ and the disciples didn't know that of course. they were just concerned for themselves. we're gonna per perish! we're gonna die! -so jesus when he sees their situation, he's not concerned by the storm by the way, he's not put out by that because he knows he's going to the other side, but for the sake of them he gets up and he speaks the word, jesus he said, peace. +so jesus when he sees their situation, he's not concerned by the storm by the way, he's not put out by that because he knows he's going to the other side, but for the sake of them he gets up and he speaks the word, jesus he said, peace. be still. be muzzled! silence ! @@ -16314,8 +16297,8 @@ and the disciples are happy once again. and jesus asked them a question, he says to them, why are you so timid? how is it that you have no faith? and j b phillips in his paraphrase he puts that last question like this, what has happened to your faith? -you see, it wasn't that they had no faith, they had faith we were saying the other week when we were dealing with this, we all have faith it's what we do with it. -they had faith, their faith was in themselves and in bailing out, and they couldn't bail quick enough, and so their faith was not realizing anything it wasn't producing the goods. +you see, it wasn't that they had no faith, they had faith we were saying the other week when we were dealing with this, we all have faith it's what we do with it. +they had faith, their faith was in themselves and in bailing out, and they couldn't bail quick enough, and so their faith was not realizing anything it wasn't producing the goods. they had had faith, they had seen jesus perform miracles, they had seen him heal the sick, they had seen him give sight to the blind, they had seen some of the tremendous things that jesus had done. they'd been there at the wedding, when the wine, that water had been turned into wine. they had, they had witnessed him casting out demons, they had heard his teaching, they were familiar with jesus, they had every reason to be, to have faith in him, he says, what has happened to your faith? @@ -16325,55 +16308,55 @@ as long as the miracles were flowing, as long as the sight er er was given to th well when you see things like that happening you can afford to have faith ten feet tall! it's not difficult to believe! and yes certainly, you and i can be like that. -when everything is going fine for us, and god is in quote, blessing us, when our life is flowing smoothly, it's easy then to have faith, it's easy then to trust, but do you know, those disciples in that boat, they were no safer after jesus stilled the storm than beforehand. -their safety had not increased one little bit granted, they were more comfortable and granted, they were enjoying themselves more, they felt better, but they were no safer. -during the past two or three generations there have been, there has been this, this idea of god's favour being expressed in blessing. -very often, we'd link that blessing with material things, the physical things, the healing, the prosperity you know god's blesses us just because i'm sick, he heals me. +when everything is going fine for us, and god is in quote, blessing us, when our life is flowing smoothly, it's easy then to have faith, it's easy then to trust, but do you know, those disciples in that boat, they were no safer after jesus stilled the storm than beforehand. +their safety had not increased one little bit granted, they were more comfortable and granted, they were enjoying themselves more, they felt better, but they were no safer. +during the past two or three generations there have been, there has been this, this idea of god's favour being expressed in blessing. +very often, we'd link that blessing with material things, the physical things, the healing, the prosperity you know god's blesses us just because i'm sick, he heals me. i can't find that in god's word. it's not there. that is not an evidence of his blessing. -you see if that's how we're to judge blessing then what are we to say to people, to men like c t stard who sacrificed an inheritance that in today's value, just in the early part of this century, but in today's value be worth millions of pounds to go to the congo, and to china, and to india? +you see if that's how we're to judge blessing then what are we to say to people, to men like c t stard who sacrificed an inheritance that in today's value, just in the early part of this century, but in today's value be worth millions of pounds to go to the congo, and to china, and to india? in later le li years leaving his wife behind him cos she was unable to go, and going to serve his god therein, where is the blessing in that if this is how we take god's blessing? -or what are we gonna say to men like hudson taylor there in china buried his wife, and buried his daughter, and son. +or what are we gonna say to men like hudson taylor there in china buried his wife, and buried his daughter, and son. and judson in burma burying his whole family within a few short years of getting there. -men like jim elliott who in seek of the taking of good news of the gospel to the indians becomes, as a young man, a martyr. -to men like teddy hobson who in his whole life serving the the of the congolese ends up as a martyr. +men like jim elliott who in seek of the taking of good news of the gospel to the indians becomes, as a young man, a martyr. +to men like teddy hobson who in his whole life serving the the of the congolese ends up as a martyr. he was cannibalized. where is god's blessing in that? -if we equate god's blessing with the nice things that happen to us then they were not blessed! +if we equate god's blessing with the nice things that happen to us then they were not blessed! and they've given far more than but you or i will ever contemplate doing for god! and yet, is that blessing? is that what it really means? is that what the bible means by being blessed by god? -let me read you two or three verses the bible has to say about blessing, first of all, the verse in the book of proverbs proverbs chapter ten, verse twenty two. -it sets the scene perhaps for it said it is the blessing of the lord that makes rich and he adds no sorrow to it . +let me read you two or three verses the bible has to say about blessing, first of all, the verse in the book of proverbs proverbs chapter ten, verse twenty two. +it sets the scene perhaps for it said it is the blessing of the lord that makes rich and he adds no sorrow to it . and we read that and we start thinking of richness in the terms of pounds and pence and material possessions. of course, it's nothing to do with that. -but as jesus said, a man's life does not consist in the, in the abundance of the things he possesses, that's not how you gauge your person's richness. +but as jesus said, a man's life does not consist in the, in the abundance of the things he possesses, that's not how you gauge your person's richness. it's not how many stocks and shares they've got, it's not what the size of their balance is, how much they've got on deposit account, how much credit, how credit worthy they are, that is not the richness of a man or a woman. -here the wise man says, the blessing of god, it makes a person rich and it does not bring sorrow with it. +here the wise man says, the blessing of god, it makes a person rich and it does not bring sorrow with it. it's a strange verse. put it to the back of your mind a moment please. as i turn in to the book of genesis i read there of god coming to abraham, and saying to abraham,that abraham in your family all the nations of the world are gonna be blessed ! how is that blessing gonna come? it comes through the messiah. -it blessed the for abraham, the messiah. +it blessed the for abraham, the messiah. jesus. -because we become middle class? +because we become middle class? because we've become better off? of course not! we are blessed in him because he gave his life for us. that is the source of god's blessing. not in getting, but rather in giving. -the apostle paul when he's writing to the corinthians in his first letter to them, one corinthians . +the apostle paul when he's writing to the corinthians in his first letter to them, one corinthians . well what is this? what's the definition? i suppose if i come around and ask each one of us this morning, can you give a definition? i'm writing a dictionary and i'm stuck on a word, i want the definition of blessing. -and i suppose for every person here, there would be a i would say a similar, but a different er definition. -there'd be a lot of similarity to it, and i think if we're honest a lot of it would come back to things. +and i suppose for every person here, there would be a i would say a similar, but a different er definition. +there'd be a lot of similarity to it, and i think if we're honest a lot of it would come back to things. well let's see what god himself has to say cos he gives us a definition of blessing. -gives it to us in psalm a hundred and thirty three and it's in the last verse. +gives it to us in psalm a hundred and thirty three and it's in the last verse. he is talking about god people being in unity. and he says, as a result of them being in unity, dwelling together in unity, he says it is there that the lord commanded the blessing. whatever that is! @@ -16384,11 +16367,11 @@ that is god's blessing to you. that is god's blessing on me. it's not, how i prosper financially. it's not, whether i'm in good health. -it's not whether,a , whether i've all my little itty-bitty prayers answered. -god's blessing to me is life forever. +it's not whether,a , whether i've all my little itty-bitty prayers answered. +god's blessing to me is life forever. that's his blessing to you. it's not making a list. -it's not giving you total health, and free you from all sickness and diseases. +it's not giving you total health, and free you from all sickness and diseases. it's not answering all your prayers. it's not making your life easy. it is giving you life forever! @@ -16397,22 +16380,21 @@ that is his big parcel he's given to you. it's wrapped up in a . , thanks be unto god for his unspeakable gift! the gift of god is eternal life through jesus christ our lord. -those disciples, they had the storm stilled for them and it got easier sailing. +those disciples, they had the storm stilled for them and it got easier sailing. it was plain sailing then to the other side. -they were more comfortable, it was a, it was a more enjoyable journey, and let's be honest if i can go through life without hassles and without problems my life will be more enjoyable, of course it and these difficulties, and these storms coming away, coming your way your life will be more enjoyable. +they were more comfortable, it was a, it was a more enjoyable journey, and let's be honest if i can go through life without hassles and without problems my life will be more enjoyable, of course it and these difficulties, and these storms coming away, coming your way your life will be more enjoyable. but like the disciples, it will not be any better, or any safer. their safety did not depend on the storm being still. their security and safety depended on jesus being with them. that was it! -your safety, and your security and my safety and security in life does not depend on how pleasant my ways are and how pleasant my paths are how much i manage to amass, and how i can overcome all the little difficulties and problems and steer clear of the big ones the security and safety of my life, now and in eternity,security is there in the boat and lying with him. -see, the real peace is not the stilling of the storm the real peace is that the assurance of who is going to stop it. +your safety, and your security and my safety and security in life does not depend on how pleasant my ways are and how pleasant my paths are how much i manage to amass, and how i can overcome all the little difficulties and problems and steer clear of the big ones the security and safety of my life, now and in eternity,security is there in the boat and lying with him. +see, the real peace is not the stilling of the storm the real peace is that the assurance of who is going to stop it. that's the promise to your eternal life. i will never leave you. -you don't understand the circumstances, you don't understand the storm i might , i might not leave that to me he says i will be with you. +you don't understand the circumstances, you don't understand the storm i might , i might not leave that to me he says i will be with you. i will never leave you. -i will never forsake you even to the end of the . +i will never forsake you even to the end of the . well let's see - come in. hello. oh. @@ -16431,7 +16413,7 @@ and now she's i mean she's she can't even keep water down doctor so she's certainly not gonna keep that down. right. cos she's had it since wednesday. -what the doctor. +what the doctor. hello. hello? the doctor. @@ -16444,7 +16426,7 @@ i've had it bad. i've got out me bed to come up here. mm. right. -let's have a look at your tummy to see what you've poor +let's have a look at your tummy to see what you've poor old tummy. she's very erm fractious. @@ -16452,12 +16434,12 @@ i think she's . you're alright darling. when er just before she's sick it's pains in her stomach. -she's i mean obviously er erm i mean she's com complaining of a sore tummy. -she's able to but +she's i mean obviously er erm i mean she's com complaining of a sore tummy. +she's able to but but she's not had the diarrhoea and i have. oh no. thank goodness. -well i didn't get diarrhoea with it i just got sickness. +well i didn't get diarrhoea with it i just got sickness. she's gonna get the diarrhoea. really? yeah. @@ -16467,7 +16449,7 @@ mm. i know the feeling. mm. she's . -yeah but she's, she's going to, she's gonna have diarrhoea because you can feel +yeah but she's, she's going to, she's gonna have diarrhoea because you can feel mm. i think that's what wrong. she's not been. @@ -16558,7 +16540,7 @@ right. just comes out. that's what i was doing last night. yeah. -well just out to the shop and get some ice-cream or make a table jelly when you go home. +well just out to the shop and get some ice-cream or make a table jelly when you go home. mhm. and just have a little of it every half hour? every hour? @@ -16621,9 +16603,9 @@ i've just come out of hospital. what have you been doing? i had a prolapse bad. so the retching was worrying me a bit. -well +well cos i've still got stitches. -you get started on, on the ice-cream and the +you get started on, on the ice-cream and the i was just coming up to scotland for a holiday . i'm not coming here any more. what with the weather and this i'm going home @@ -16646,7 +16628,7 @@ yeah. aye. and if you give her, just stick her to small amounts for the next couple of days yeah. -and +and okay. yeah. don't, don't force her that's the big secret @@ -16662,120 +16644,118 @@ thank you. bye bye. bye bye. bye bye. -she's +she's bye. thanks a lot. okay. bye. bye now. - number twenty two you er you need to tell the assembly thank you. -one one four nine moderator is it possible or legal at all to insert a completely new twenty two? -simply in light of the the vote that we've just been held? -i'd like simply to ask the assembly to simply reaffirm that we are indeed a christian church, a christian trinitarian church to father son and holy ghost, the gods whom we adore why do we sing this every time if there are a number of members in this assembly who are no longer able to completely agree with such a sentiment moderator? +one one four nine moderator is it possible or legal at all to insert a completely new twenty two? +simply in light of the the vote that we've just been held? +i'd like simply to ask the assembly to simply reaffirm that we are indeed a christian church, a christian trinitarian church to father son and holy ghost, the gods whom we adore why do we sing this every time if there are a number of members in this assembly who are no longer able to completely agree with such a sentiment moderator? i move that the -mr mr i think it's implicit in our own nature and in our own character and a known fact that we are constituted here as a general assembly and we indeed ascribe to that and i don't think we need to affirm it on a lower level of what is in fact the very standard of our existence here er in a general assembly. +mr mr i think it's implicit in our own nature and in our own character and a known fact that we are constituted here as a general assembly and we indeed ascribe to that and i don't think we need to affirm it on a lower level of what is in fact the very standard of our existence here er in a general assembly. i can assure you of that. -number twenty two approved. -number twenty three thank you yes bishop please come forward. -i'm delighted to welcome you i'm sure you'll be at home with one accord being sung on sunday night. +number twenty two approved. +number twenty three thank you yes bishop please come forward. +i'm delighted to welcome you i'm sure you'll be at home with one accord being sung on sunday night. one two eight nine. -i have arrived, i have been given a number by the church of scotland +i have arrived, i have been given a number by the church of scotland i might suggest that you too have arrived, i have answered your roll call. and indeed it's a sign of the times that i speak not with a mitre metaphorically upon my head but perhaps the glengarry of the convenorship of the central council of acts and therefore i am in part your servant here. -and it really is to to promote a couple of the initiatives of your instrument that i stand here. -first of all i would like to bring to your attention the regional ecumenical teams. -at every stage of the interchurch process we were hearing voices saying to us it is not sufficient that there should be fellowship, agreement, companionship, cooperation at the highest levels but it had to be found at every level, it had to be found at grass roots level. -and the meeting of the acts' central council has recently had a report from its local and regional unity er committee proposing that a network of regional ecumenical teams should be established throughout scotland to further the cooperation and joint commitment of congregations and church members in each area. +and it really is to to promote a couple of the initiatives of your instrument that i stand here. +first of all i would like to bring to your attention the regional ecumenical teams. +at every stage of the interchurch process we were hearing voices saying to us it is not sufficient that there should be fellowship, agreement, companionship, cooperation at the highest levels but it had to be found at every level, it had to be found at grass roots level. +and the meeting of the acts' central council has recently had a report from its local and regional unity er committee proposing that a network of regional ecumenical teams should be established throughout scotland to further the cooperation and joint commitment of congregations and church members in each area. this proposal was enthusiastically approved by the central council of acts and has been well received by member churches which are appointing local representatives for each of the forty six areas. -these areas as you might recognize, are the presbytery areas of scotland as these areas seem to be most closely allied to natural and civic boundaries. -now the presbyterian church as the church of scotland enjoys a unique place in scottish life and its structures it has a privileged place but i would suggest to you it has also therefore a number of responsibilities and one, i would suggest in this case, is to try and ensure that these local regional teams are in place. -i think it would be most appropriate for the local representatives of the church of scotland, since the areas are presbyteries, to take the initiative or to give that encouragement without which these local teams will not find a place. -the second thing that i would like to recommend to you on behalf of the instrument acts is the scottish christian gathering which will take place this year from friday the twenty sixth of june to sunday the twenty eighth of june at saint andrew's college . -it is according to the book, which is our sort of bible on the matter, for celebration and vision, for fellowship, exploration and discernment of opportunities and tasks with broad participation from all member churches and others to amplify and strengthen the whole movement of acts. -you will notice it is a yellow card also er it is somewhat larger than the other one which was flaunted earlier before us and the good news is that you've got, each one of you, a copy of this in your cubbyholes. -could i just conclude moderator by saying that those who are engaged in acts the churches which are participating members of this action of churches together in scotland are engaged in a journey together. -the imaginations of each church and indeed s of the several members perhaps shape differently the goal that lies ahead. -but we must be sure that, however shaped in our imagination that goal is, it must be inspired by our lord's own will for his church praying that his disciples would be one as he and the father are one. +these areas as you might recognize, are the presbytery areas of scotland as these areas seem to be most closely allied to natural and civic boundaries. +now the presbyterian church as the church of scotland enjoys a unique place in scottish life and its structures it has a privileged place but i would suggest to you it has also therefore a number of responsibilities and one, i would suggest in this case, is to try and ensure that these local regional teams are in place. +i think it would be most appropriate for the local representatives of the church of scotland, since the areas are presbyteries, to take the initiative or to give that encouragement without which these local teams will not find a place. +the second thing that i would like to recommend to you on behalf of the instrument acts is the scottish christian gathering which will take place this year from friday the twenty sixth of june to sunday the twenty eighth of june at saint andrew's college . +it is according to the book, which is our sort of bible on the matter, for celebration and vision, for fellowship, exploration and discernment of opportunities and tasks with broad participation from all member churches and others to amplify and strengthen the whole movement of acts. +you will notice it is a yellow card also er it is somewhat larger than the other one which was flaunted earlier before us and the good news is that you've got, each one of you, a copy of this in your cubbyholes. +could i just conclude moderator by saying that those who are engaged in acts the churches which are participating members of this action of churches together in scotland are engaged in a journey together. +the imaginations of each church and indeed s of the several members perhaps shape differently the goal that lies ahead. +but we must be sure that, however shaped in our imagination that goal is, it must be inspired by our lord's own will for his church praying that his disciples would be one as he and the father are one. and it seems to me that that oneness, that that unity is pneumatic in character. it is based on the holy spirit. -and it is for us surely to open ourselves without prejudice to the shape that it will take in the future. +and it is for us surely to open ourselves without prejudice to the shape that it will take in the future. i think we can say that if it is pneumatic in character, the shape will be organic. for the moment we move forward believing that we are going in a direction to which we have already been prompted, and in the confidence that the holy spirit is working among us. thank you. i'm delighted bishop you took the opportunity to so address us and it underlines our benefit in being able to have our delegates participate in our debates and discussions. thank you for your contribution. -i put to the assembly deliverance number twenty three approved. -deliverance number twenty four thank you. +i put to the assembly deliverance number twenty three approved. +deliverance number twenty four thank you. three three five. -i am s one that has just been recently appointed to one of these er regional ecumenical teams and at a meeting that was held for the three presbytery areas in the sort of west coast of scotland, around the greenoch area, erm it was, it became apparent that all these people who are being appointed er through their, their churches are in the main clergy and the convenor of the local committee himself a ruling elder of the church of scotland expressed concern about this, that there is no real er and i would just put it to the, to the assembly, there is there is no need for these members to be members of the clergy, in fact it would be good if presbyteries remembered when making a nomination eh that it, er it needn't be, it could be a, a an elder or indeed er a lay person holding no particular office within the church. -that would sustain what eh bishop has just referred to, the grass roots of, of this movement. +i am s one that has just been recently appointed to one of these er regional ecumenical teams and at a meeting that was held for the three presbytery areas in the sort of west coast of scotland, around the greenoch area, erm it was, it became apparent that all these people who are being appointed er through their, their churches are in the main clergy and the convenor of the local committee himself a ruling elder of the church of scotland expressed concern about this, that there is no real er and i would just put it to the, to the assembly, there is there is no need for these members to be members of the clergy, in fact it would be good if presbyteries remembered when making a nomination eh that it, er it needn't be, it could be a, a an elder or indeed er a lay person holding no particular office within the church. +that would sustain what eh bishop has just referred to, the grass roots of, of this movement. twenty four approved then? thank you. -twenty five local involvement number twenty six twenty seven yes? -reverend eleven twenty six. +twenty five local involvement number twenty six twenty seven yes? +reverend eleven twenty six. i've read number twenty seven says draw attention to the possibilities for church members to take part in overseas and exchange visits and i would simply like to do that. -yesterday a minister from an urban priority area er while er welcoming the thought of a an urban priority area fund or urban and rural priority area fund, said that people were at least as important as money in many situations. -none of us can doubt the economic plight of many of the countries where our mission partners work but the relationship of people is every bit as important and visits play a large part in that. -a small group er from my own parish went to india two and a half years ago to visit our missionary partner. +yesterday a minister from an urban priority area er while er welcoming the thought of a an urban priority area fund or urban and rural priority area fund, said that people were at least as important as money in many situations. +none of us can doubt the economic plight of many of the countries where our mission partners work but the relationship of people is every bit as important and visits play a large part in that. +a small group er from my own parish went to india two and a half years ago to visit our missionary partner. she had visited us many times over a nu number of years and said it was our turn to visit her and we just laughed. us go to darjeeling? -but eventually she persuaded us she meant it and we went and it was an invaluable experience meeting not only our missionary partner but the people among whom she lives and and works and has done for many years. -the warmth of the welcome from the girls in the school hostel would have gladdened anyone's heart. -they were not well off and they didn't welcome us because we had brought gifts they simply welcomed us because we had had the interest to go and see them and talk to them. +but eventually she persuaded us she meant it and we went and it was an invaluable experience meeting not only our missionary partner but the people among whom she lives and and works and has done for many years. +the warmth of the welcome from the girls in the school hostel would have gladdened anyone's heart. +they were not well off and they didn't welcome us because we had brought gifts they simply welcomed us because we had had the interest to go and see them and talk to them. we enjoyed their music and shared their worship and we came back changed and enriched and i commend number twenty seven to everyone's attention. thank you moderator. number twenty seven approved? thank you. -number twenty eight approved. -i've got a new number, twenty nine, and you'll find that on the pale blue papers page number sixty five the first notice of i put number twenty nine to the general assembly is that approved? -number thirty approved. -number thirty one approved the deliverance as a whole and as amended, approved. -now before we move further i'd like to take this opportunity of expressing on your behalf our thanks to hugh here for the service that he's rendered our church to this point in time but particularly as the convenor of the board of world mission and unity. -hugh you've been minister of the parish of inverleith here in edinburgh for the past seventeen years, and i understand you were one of the very first vice convenors of the board when it was set up eight years ago having already served the church on the former interchurch relations committee. -you were born in india on the mission field and through your family's experience and your own you've brought to the convenorship of the board a great personal interest in the overseas church and in international affairs. -for several years here in edinburgh you have been the presbytery's world mission and unity convenor and then you became the convenor of the board's local involvement committee which links our congregations to people who work overseas in churches there with whom they serve. -as the convenor of the board since nineteen eighty eight you have visited the european work of the board in rotterdam, in paris, in budapest and in prague also in israel and egypt and you have represented the board at meetings of the world alliance of reformed churches . -hugh you have shown throughout all of your work a deep concern for the people working abroad for our partner churches and for our ecumenical relations and the need to keep these matters to the fore of the church and also of our country. +number twenty eight approved. +i've got a new number, twenty nine, and you'll find that on the pale blue papers page number sixty five the first notice of i put number twenty nine to the general assembly is that approved? +number thirty approved. +number thirty one approved the deliverance as a whole and as amended, approved. +now before we move further i'd like to take this opportunity of expressing on your behalf our thanks to hugh here for the service that he's rendered our church to this point in time but particularly as the convenor of the board of world mission and unity. +hugh you've been minister of the parish of inverleith here in edinburgh for the past seventeen years, and i understand you were one of the very first vice convenors of the board when it was set up eight years ago having already served the church on the former interchurch relations committee. +you were born in india on the mission field and through your family's experience and your own you've brought to the convenorship of the board a great personal interest in the overseas church and in international affairs. +for several years here in edinburgh you have been the presbytery's world mission and unity convenor and then you became the convenor of the board's local involvement committee which links our congregations to people who work overseas in churches there with whom they serve. +as the convenor of the board since nineteen eighty eight you have visited the european work of the board in rotterdam, in paris, in budapest and in prague also in israel and egypt and you have represented the board at meetings of the world alliance of reformed churches . +hugh you have shown throughout all of your work a deep concern for the people working abroad for our partner churches and for our ecumenical relations and the need to keep these matters to the fore of the church and also of our country. hugh you and i share the gift of a very unusual christian name. i understand it's the only way in which these letters are arranged in the anglosaxon language and is often used as an example of such. -it's a very difficult name at times to live up to i'm sure because the word hugh literally means mind or soul and it is important that we seek indeed to live up to what our names mean. +it's a very difficult name at times to live up to i'm sure because the word hugh literally means mind or soul and it is important that we seek indeed to live up to what our names mean. you have certainly applied your mind to the work of the board and you have encouraged its vision and its direction through your intellectual gifts and perceptions and insights. and you've also brought your soul to bear on the work of the board and the work of the church. -within the assembly council i personally valued your contributions the very courteous and thoughtful way in which you presented these and the courage with which you expressed at times the stand that you had to take for the interest of the board. +within the assembly council i personally valued your contributions the very courteous and thoughtful way in which you presented these and the courage with which you expressed at times the stand that you had to take for the interest of the board. and yet above that and beyond that what you were seeking to do was not just to serve the board of world mission and unity, it was to serve what you believed was the good and right for the church of god which you have sought to serve and to support and to take further. for that contribution, and for that depth of spirituality within yourself which you have brought to bear for the benefit of the work of this board and for that of our whole church, we want to thank you very much indeed this morning. i'm delighted and i'm sure you'll be delighted to hear the advice of the business convenor that we suspend at this point in time. -and we, we recons we, we, we we come back to continue our meeting at two o'clock this afternoon. +and we, we recons we, we, we we come back to continue our meeting at two o'clock this afternoon. we adjourn until two o'clock. - she's been dead four years. oh! -it was, it was bad that she used to those draws that bad that after so long you'd see him go all white and then you'd gradually see round the crutch then so, more +it was, it was bad that she used to those draws that bad that after so long you'd see him go all white and then you'd gradually see round the crutch then so, more yeah but right! i and then all of a sudden after so long you saw a new alf. mm. -but, you never there's never a pair of underpants. -you might see a pair of long johns, then long johns, and a pair of socks, but paul said they've opened windows and trevor said it's nearly knocked him off the ladder. +but, you never there's never a pair of underpants. +you might see a pair of long johns, then long johns, and a pair of socks, but paul said they've opened windows and trevor said it's nearly knocked him off the ladder. he said to paul, you've done, cos, i think first time he painted it, paul, he had to paint it wi windows shut, they wouldn't open window. no? no. so i said to paul, well you've done well getting windows open. and even nets are down. -but ah, i've gone in and opened it, it stinks. +but ah, i've gone in and opened it, it stinks. urgh! urgh! well how do people live like that? -i mean bloody erm, axminster carpets all the way through. +i mean bloody erm, axminster carpets all the way through. well it was fitted out well who buys that, social? no. they bought it all cash. when, when, when they bought that house they paid cash for it. -oh i thought in there. +oh i thought in there. no! oh! they sold a farm. @@ -16783,16 +16763,16 @@ oh! and, bought it cash and it were show house. but yeah. -they bought all curtains and carpet, and carpet and i don't think it's altered. +they bought all curtains and carpet, and carpet and i don't think it's altered. it's same in here, right through the room and all the way to the up the stairs, and it's all axminster. -all curtains are er anderson. +all curtains are er anderson. very nice. mm mm. and wallpaper , oh she's papered every, painted and papered every room in there. and i were laughing weren't i? -social services or somebody to do with or somewhere contacted him and asked him to do it but they paid all cash. +social services or somebody to do with or somewhere contacted him and asked him to do it but they paid all cash. mm mm! -and they did every room cos his er sister used to work in homebase be it rich +and they did every room cos his er sister used to work in homebase be it rich and very, very rich, she's yeah. back part time now i think my mum @@ -16809,21 +16789,21 @@ but they pa he painted, he papered every room . really? mm mm. i mean, they've just had a new double glazed back door put on. -and that, but then one morning i we +and that, but then one morning i we but it doesn't look, it doesn't look double glazed does it? no. -one morning i was off up bambury lane and john was waiting to catch paul to come some trust or, i don't know whether it's social or what, bought a detached house on bambury lane cos there were an uproar. +one morning i was off up bambury lane and john was waiting to catch paul to come some trust or, i don't know whether it's social or what, bought a detached house on bambury lane cos there were an uproar. cos mick started all this up there. -and it was done through a trust then, and it was done so quietly that they hadn't time to object. +and it was done through a trust then, and it was done so quietly that they hadn't time to object. mm. -and mentally handicapped live in this house. +and mentally handicapped live in this house. well they do object. -but they've turned this four, five bedroomed detached house, you know, it's got a ramp now up to the front door, the front door's been altered so +but they've turned this four, five bedroomed detached house, you know, it's got a ramp now up to the front door, the front door's been altered so mm mm. -so we made each what was the dining room they've made into a bedroom, but just don't that he, cos you could see them doing it. +so we made each what was the dining room they've made into a bedroom, but just don't that he, cos you could see them doing it. mm mm. and all that. -in fact, tony 's brother, freddie, he's there but johnny was still outside working and he was filthy! +in fact, tony 's brother, freddie, he's there but johnny was still outside working and he was filthy! bet if i took his jacket off and put it in that washer it'd of fallen to bits cos it was that mucky. urgh! oh i thought he was like that. @@ -16831,31 +16811,31 @@ arnie was playing football. they've gone football match at club. so that'll be another pile of bloody washing! yeah. -i've got all mine out to dry . +i've got all mine out to dry . take them upstairs. -not that i normally carry +not that i normally carry hey! have they mentioned anything about easter eggs? say if they haven't. mhm. what? -about a month or, well a fortnight ago. -when i rang up to say i were coming i asked them did they want easter eggs or did they want fa er a box of chocolates or bars of chocolate we +about a month or, well a fortnight ago. +when i rang up to say i were coming i asked them did they want easter eggs or did they want fa er a box of chocolates or bars of chocolate we ah! i know. that's it. yeah. -or do they want money or er +or do they want money or er you mean you've got to take it spend too much money on them. -done with . +done with . i mean, he went to worcester yesterday but he hadn't got enough clothes. mm. he took twelve pound fifty. -i mean he'd ha he had a pack up but they had to have money to buy ra +i mean he'd ha he had a pack up but they had to have money to buy ra postcards. in case they went in this museum. -it was to compare a seaside town with a market town or summat. +it was to compare a seaside town with a market town or summat. and . you've got that going down there haven't you? yeah. @@ -16865,23 +16845,23 @@ because that's about broad yorkshire. even if i try to change the tone of my voice. malcolm's got a . i shouldn't think so. -i think my wants in my bag. +i think my wants in my bag. compare a seaside town, then they'll look at the roman . urgh! -don't put in yvonne's. -i can can slag everybody off now can't i? +don't put in yvonne's. +i can can slag everybody off now can't i? yeah i think they said you can, cos nobody knows what you're saying anyway. -erm i think they said to me bar of i'll say bars of judy, if it's any different i'll let you know. +erm i think they said to me bar of i'll say bars of judy, if it's any different i'll let you know. mm. is there any chocolate they don't like? -do they like not like it with nuts in or like that? +do they like not like it with nuts in or like that? they like whispas. -they like er cadbury's whole nut. -because if my mother ever buys me a bar i'll to stop it. +they like er cadbury's whole nut. +because if my mother ever buys me a bar i'll to stop it. yeah? mm. -and yet arthur was a the other way on. +and yet arthur was a the other way on. they don't like mars bars. well andrew doesn't. he gets sick on mars bars. @@ -16899,9 +16879,9 @@ yeah. for my i know birthday. -now +now well yeah, but -yeah but the new not the triangle it's a bar. +yeah but the new not the triangle it's a bar. oh is it? mm. but you buy a bar. @@ -16923,7 +16903,7 @@ but you've had enough. yeah. i have some chocolate though. i'm on a diet again. -this year i went to and +this year i went to and oh! you've been. i bet @@ -16931,17 +16911,17 @@ yeah. it's brilliant. eva came. yeah. -eva rung up thursday morning, mum wanted her hair permed before he, when eva rung up thursday morning, could she do it thursday night? +eva rung up thursday morning, mum wanted her hair permed before he, when eva rung up thursday morning, could she do it thursday night? so i said, yeah. -so when i came in from collecting my answer monies and what have you, erm eva said new restaurant for you to try doreen. +so when i came in from collecting my answer monies and what have you, erm eva said new restaurant for you to try doreen. what? -she says, ali carver, she said they'd been to that last saturday night with a couple from and she said they paid fifteen pound just them +she says, ali carver, she said they'd been to that last saturday night with a couple from and she said they paid fifteen pound just them mm. and that was, starter, main course, pudding, coffee, lot. only fifteen. there was erm -well we had a what, we had what they call the banquet which was fifteen pound a head. -well, she said that they +well we had a what, we had what they call the banquet which was fifteen pound a head. +well, she said that they the set, the set meal oh it might have been eight pounds. hang on. @@ -16961,44 +16941,44 @@ king prawn, mushrooms, that one works out at, what is it? ele eleven pound eleven. -there and that's thirteen +there and that's thirteen thirteen. but, after that they're all twelve pound a head. -but we had the erm banquet which was fifteen pound a head, and that included your sweet and everything. +but we had the erm banquet which was fifteen pound a head, and that included your sweet and everything. whereas those don't include a sweet. no, including that. oh it were beautiful! what just you and malcolm? it's a, no! there were ten of us. -mal and steve and alan and joyce and and gloria and oh, i can't even say the name and keith and anne. +mal and steve and alan and joyce and and gloria and oh, i can't even say the name and keith and anne. ah! thirty one . we were saying mike that er eva said it had taken them nearly a month to get booked up. for a saturday night. -sylvia had rung up me about booking for a meal and i thought, originally they talked about going a friday night, and they said, friday and saturday are fully booked for the next five weeks. +sylvia had rung up me about booking for a meal and i thought, originally they talked about going a friday night, and they said, friday and saturday are fully booked for the next five weeks. eva said it had taken to wait a month to get in for a saturday night. for a thursday night we could book almost straight away. during the week you can get in -well that's it, market day int it? +well that's it, market day int it? yeah. yeah i noticed that. well they can do then. yeah. -we had er various er, is it won ton? -won tons like little pancakes? +we had er various er, is it won ton? +won tons like little pancakes? they're like little parcels. ah! cos at paul's with prawn in. -place, er whe when margaret and i went we had +place, er whe when margaret and i went we had i think -them and they came had this little pancakes were dishes of er there was a dish of the sauce that +them and they came had this little pancakes were dishes of er there was a dish of the sauce that mm. you put on and then yeah. -there were dishes of chopped up spring onion and all like that and you put your own mixture int middle and then rolled it up. +there were dishes of chopped up spring onion and all like that and you put your own mixture int middle and then rolled it up. ah! but they're won tons. no this,thi this was @@ -17008,8 +16988,8 @@ oh. of i don't know crispy won ton. yeah. -and it was real crisp and it had prawn in it. -prawns and something in th maybe th prawn toasts with sesame seed. +and it was real crisp and it had prawn in it. +prawns and something in th maybe th prawn toasts with sesame seed. prawn toast with sesame seed. yeah. yeah. @@ -17020,33 +17000,33 @@ it were beautiful! i wonder what the ribs are? -then we had the halibut in prawn something, halibut in black bean sauce and that was superb! +then we had the halibut in prawn something, halibut in black bean sauce and that was superb! expensive though the i was gonna say i don't know whether i like halibut. cos that's chunky int it? is it, halibut? oh it was beautiful! -i mean i am but i mean i like fish er -but paul pork and prawn. +i mean i am but i mean i like fish er +but paul pork and prawn. but er e oh it was beautiful! and we had -that must be er quite good wasn't it? +that must be er quite good wasn't it? there was no sweet and sour. but there again none at all there? -yeah, but on the what we had +yeah, but on the what we had ah! we didn't get a sweet and sour. -er er er trying to think what was the one we had? -one was quite hot and spicy but i'd forgotten what we had for the first two the two that they brought out. +er er er trying to think what was the one we had? +one was quite hot and spicy but i'd forgotten what we had for the first two the two that they brought out. we had crispy duck and lemon chicken, that's nice. -er erm prawns and vegetables beef in black bean sauce +er erm prawns and vegetables beef in black bean sauce mm mm. i've never tried that. oh it's haven't tried the black bean sauce beautiful! -a alan at erm pub used to like, he always got summat with black bean sauce. +a alan at erm pub used to like, he always got summat with black bean sauce. oh it's he used to like that. beautiful! @@ -17055,7 +17035,7 @@ no. ah heck! no they don't do any takeaways. eh! -our arthur, arthur sat there and this girl come to clear the pots away and she's been round lots of tables, you know, collecting the cups up together and she comes in and she goes ooh! +our arthur, arthur sat there and this girl come to clear the pots away and she's been round lots of tables, you know, collecting the cups up together and she comes in and she goes ooh! she says, it smells. that's very nice ! and i looked at her and i thought you can't say that! @@ -17064,7 +17044,7 @@ he said, don't get close . yeah. ooh! you smell. -we're off er well york this funny thing i got to see that it all goes through for my dad. +we're off er well york this funny thing i got to see that it all goes through for my dad. and he hasn't got all that stuff now. and er mhm. @@ -17076,16 +17056,16 @@ the men's. with the . oh! anyway, playing at home. -well we've gotta buy next week so judy said if you come last night. +well we've gotta buy next week so judy said if you come last night. by heck! riff-raff are coming down next wednesday. well get off, we won't bloody come! she's saying i don't think we want to go out. cos they were playing newtons thursday night and she said they'll have to write home for nine men so newtons int gonna stand a chance. -well at moment, we're lying second. -but we've gotta next week where newton who are top and can't be beat have gorrit. +well at moment, we're lying second. +but we've gotta next week where newton who are top and can't be beat have gorrit. mm mm. -but chip shop behind us, but club on thursday nights, they beat chip shop six three. +but chip shop behind us, but club on thursday nights, they beat chip shop six three. we won thursday night six three. i've gone right off on the individuals. can't finish. @@ -17093,83 +17073,83 @@ no i can't. i played ellen i'm hopeless. we won -i played with ellen in pairs -we won five one wednesday and it was me that lost . +i played with ellen in pairs +we won five one wednesday and it was me that lost . i played with ellen in pairs. -ellen had played monday night, her individuals down at open then she played who's what? +ellen had played monday night, her individuals down at open then she played who's what? i said to her i didn't even know you were playing. -anyway, she's got through to finals individuals has ellen. -and i'm playing with her in erm and i got sixty one, sixty and i got a, a twenty six. +anyway, she's got through to finals individuals has ellen. +and i'm playing with her in erm and i got sixty one, sixty and i got a, a twenty six. i mean everybody can get a twenty six! when you're going for a sixty. and if i go twenty six. for a sixty i'm, i get, i end up getting er seven. two fives and a one. -oh we always play that one was fi that one was what you call a sixty when you get . +oh we always play that one was fi that one was what you call a sixty when you get . i, i, i also on the five, the er i ended up leaving ellen . what's to bloody finish she said? so she went, eleven. done a fifteen. anyway, she did it. -i said, well i've got to give you the funny finishes for when you come to your finals. +i said, well i've got to give you the funny finishes for when you come to your finals. it's practise. yeah. she said that was good thinking. -so er as i say, we won six for eight, so so erm they're gonna play our next time. -so we're still hoping it int the bottom, bottom playing all the chip shop there. +so er as i say, we won six for eight, so so erm they're gonna play our next time. +so we're still hoping it int the bottom, bottom playing all the chip shop there. and all yeah. . -er er i'll want this conversation +er er i'll want this conversation i know. we're having a conversation though. you got plenty of tapes. -so far +so far the bleeding . -no because my i've got erm a letter don't know whether it was friday or saturday now, on from tamgrams. +no because my i've got erm a letter don't know whether it was friday or saturday now, on from tamgrams. have you heard of tamgrams? -and it was about tampax . +and it was about tampax . in in you know, internal mm mm. -sanitary sort of, asking you what you use what size ha you know, how comfortable did you feel with them, you know, did you wear one at night? +sanitary sort of, asking you what you use what size ha you know, how comfortable did you feel with them, you know, did you wear one at night? did you wear a pad? did you wear a pad when you were er heavy? is there anybody else in the family, you know, a daughter, sister mm mm. all that. -so i put lianne's name down and what she used for her age. -anyway, it said er you will receive free samples soon and then er er incentive bonus. +so i put lianne's name down and what she used for her age. +anyway, it said er you will receive free samples soon and then er er incentive bonus. so i thought well, i'll fill it in and send it back. -and i thought well, even if it was a voucher for pads or owt, i mean, they'll come in for either lianne +and i thought well, even if it was a voucher for pads or owt, i mean, they'll come in for either lianne mm. or me she said. oh but i said, oh owt for nowt nowadays lianne. -so that'll be stood here looking at my jacket, it wants washing, and andrew's does, and our lianne's does . +so that'll be stood here looking at my jacket, it wants washing, and andrew's does, and our lianne's does . seems a bit silly washing mine and andrew's today don't it? -and when er . +and when er . have to get a mo a move on and, oh i must ask her well my, my, my line's just about full of jumpers. i must see daphne today. -well i've, i've seen her today but she said she'd er get me some socks and that out for, out for lianne. +well i've, i've seen her today but she said she'd er get me some socks and that out for, out for lianne. she gave me those on monday. -actually i thought they were quite nice, but gillian er made i ian erm ring the short up cos she thought the legs weren't long enough. +actually i thought they were quite nice, but gillian er made i ian erm ring the short up cos she thought the legs weren't long enough. so, she tried it on her and that and i said it's fine. -but i she'd had to lend ian some money the week before last so so he could do their pocket money. +but i she'd had to lend ian some money the week before last so so he could do their pocket money. he hadn't any money so he had to borrow it off gillian. mm mm. -well they'll not be as that. +well they'll not be as that. bad we could all live in four-bedroomed detached houses can't you? mm. we well, well, you know, today what was the point of having a four bedroom? for show? mm. -you know, you don't go from a, a one-up two-down to a two-bedroomed bung semi-bungalow and then shoot to a four-bedroomed detached. +you know, you don't go from a, a one-up two-down to a two-bedroomed bung semi-bungalow and then shoot to a four-bedroomed detached. and then your own commonsense tells you it's gonna cost you more doesn't it? yeah. -so anyhow, money's that, he, cos he said summat on the monday night. -yeah i want money for andrew's trainers. +so anyhow, money's that, he, cos he said summat on the monday night. +yeah i want money for andrew's trainers. oh i'll see you next week about that. he thinks i'm going halves with him, if he do, well he's got another shock. he has. @@ -17177,7 +17157,7 @@ mm. and if he turns round and says owt, i'll say, ian if weren't for me your kids would be naked. i just bought alan a new pair of jeans. sixteen pound out of club. -cos i thought needs a pair of decent jeans. +cos i thought needs a pair of decent jeans. i bought them both a denim shirt. alright, out of club, but it will get paid for. ah but see you've still got to pay for it haven't you? @@ -17188,25 +17168,25 @@ and i ordered him one. i thought i'll get lianne one and hers came first. mm. and then i , oh i always have to have . -i said, actually, i'd ordered his first i said, but i thought i'd treat you. +i said, actually, i'd ordered his first i said, but i thought i'd treat you. i mean, she's got it on this morning, open with a benetton yeah. t-shirt underneath and it suits her. cos she's got her black jeans on. and black and black and then the denim shirt. yeah. -cos he said to her oh your shirt's nice lianne. +cos he said to her oh your shirt's nice lianne. cos she had it on last week. and she said, my mother brought me it. -and i thought, i'm just going to wait and see what he says, and i'll say well they'll be walking round naked cos he's not bought them a pair of socks, pants, t-shirt jumper, nowt. +and i thought, i'm just going to wait and see what he says, and i'll say well they'll be walking round naked cos he's not bought them a pair of socks, pants, t-shirt jumper, nowt. mm mm, mm. mm. -cos our lianne said to me on thursday mother i'm only going away for week. +cos our lianne said to me on thursday mother i'm only going away for week. cos i'd got her a tube of toothpaste. -i thought i ain't buying her a pump toothpaste cos all the others will you know, if they see a pump toothpaste +i thought i ain't buying her a pump toothpaste cos all the others will you know, if they see a pump toothpaste mm. i thought, right, i'll get her a tube of toothpaste. -and i got her two strips of elastaplast. +and i got her two strips of elastaplast. i thought, well if she's not used to walking boots yeah. they might rub her. @@ -17214,21 +17194,21 @@ er they might rub her. so i thought well if she's got plasters yeah. she's covered. -and er i said, yeah but you know, you don't start spending your own money +and er i said, yeah but you know, you don't start spending your own money mm. -on such things as plasters and what have you. +on such things as plasters and what have you. she has to be in beverley for eight o'clock. monday mo monday morning. monday? first thing, first thing. mm. -and come back about nine o'clock the saturday night. +and come back about nine o'clock the saturday night. i said i'll pick you up . luckily, it is the weekend the car'll be home yeah. -so i'd have to get by car. -but i was gonna go through beverley to police station and not to we turn left at traffic lights now it it's moved. +so i'd have to get by car. +but i was gonna go through beverley to police station and not to we turn left at traffic lights now it it's moved. mm. it's where co-op. int it? @@ -17236,13 +17216,13 @@ you know where th oh i don't know. you know where the co-op is? no. -as you go down er er -well somebody said to me, when i get to traffic lights instead of turning right and going through the bar i turn left and go, as if i'm off up to north cross. +as you go down er er +well somebody said to me, when i get to traffic lights instead of turning right and going through the bar i turn left and go, as if i'm off up to north cross. up to north cross? -as if i'm off, up posh end. -er up the house. +as if i'm off, up posh end. +er up the house. whe where are you coming in? -from . +from . they'll wait oh. and i'll go alan's way you see. @@ -17269,7 +17249,7 @@ all you're doing is taping normal conversations. yeah but you don't know what our normal conversation is do you? ha well -nah i couldn't let all my secrets out. +nah i couldn't let all my secrets out. they say you've got . oh yeah! oh ooh! @@ -17296,13 +17276,13 @@ ah. oh yeah. i've got to go shopping. looks like i'm gonna have to go on my own. -mandy's +mandy's why have you got to go shopping? oh yeah. she goes walking doesn't she? he said summat yesterday about taking an hour off. mm. -but then er he works late last night and he had to go in again this morning. +but then er he works late last night and he had to go in again this morning. yeah. he's always yeah. @@ -17322,45 +17302,44 @@ eh? aunty nora? aunty norma. shall i go up to her in the pub on sunday i'll say, hey aunty nora? -she'd . +she'd . i know she would. she'd say, that i've set you up to say it. why aunty nora? what are you having with your chops mum today? - morning. morning. morning sir. there are some licensing applications george. is there? -application er question number fifty three please your honour please. -send that to all at the crosskeys at, the chester your worships. +application er question number fifty three please your honour please. +send that to all at the crosskeys at, the chester your worships. so that at all? i am. licensee of the crosskeys at the chester. that's right, yeah. -and you're making applications for an occasional license for saturday the twenty ninth of october to run the bar at nell gwyn village hall on behalf of the the village hall committee is that right? +and you're making applications for an occasional license for saturday the twenty ninth of october to run the bar at nell gwyn village hall on behalf of the the village hall committee is that right? no, that's the way it is, yes. the hours you're asking for is seven thirty pm to eleven forty five pm? that's right. -i think you did send this is intending it to be a postal application mr ? +i think you did send this is intending it to be a postal application mr ? i did, yes. -but er, your worships to do it by your colleagues until today because er mr indicate on the application form that er he will not be in fact, operating the bar himself but it would be somebody else. +but er, your worships to do it by your colleagues until today because er mr indicate on the application form that er he will not be in fact, operating the bar himself but it would be somebody else. in fact they, your colleagues wanted more information about yeah that's a who will be operating bar mr ? -well i'm i'm on er mr martin . -actually i did operations between the village hall and the crosskeys and mr martin is on the pub for the last sixteen years you see. +well i'm i'm on er mr martin . +actually i did operations between the village hall and the crosskeys and mr martin is on the pub for the last sixteen years you see. well that concerns this this gentleman to extend the licensing. oh yes sir, definitely. -i'll i'll be going to the village hall but i me i have to +i'll i'll be going to the village hall but i me i have to the crosskeys that's why i put martin , perhaps i've put the wrong thing on you see. i'll be in charge of the bar actually. -so physically you will be exercising something degree of supervision in the +so physically you will be exercising something degree of supervision in the oh that, yes! will you be there when it's time to close mr ? i will, yes. -you see there in particular to young people. +you see there in particular to young people. you are aware of that? oh yes, that, that's why ! then this application be granted. @@ -17368,21 +17347,21 @@ right, thank you very much. thank you. er thank you, thank you very much. -application number fifty four your worships, the a temporary authority in respect of quick save supermarket. +application number fifty four your worships, the a temporary authority in respect of quick save supermarket. . -jacqueline is the applicant your worship. +jacqueline is the applicant your worship. are you representing ? right. could you take the oath please? hold the bible up in your right hand and read the words from that card. -i swear by almighty god that the evidence i shall give is shall be truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. +i swear by almighty god that the evidence i shall give is shall be truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. okay. -now full name and address could you? +now full name and address could you? jacqueline ,. and er, what is your date of birth? thirteenth of the twelfth, sixty four. -and you're making application for temporary authority to operate the licensed -premises known as quick save supermarket +and you're making application for temporary authority to operate the licensed +premises known as quick save supermarket that's right. at er station road,wetherall is that right? that's right, yes. @@ -17399,12 +17378,12 @@ yeah. the present license holder is susan . that's right. right. -sir, there is a letter simply saying er she consents to the er, application, but there's no indication to why she's not here. +sir, there is a letter simply saying er she consents to the er, application, but there's no indication to why she's not here. is that lady now at that qui quick save? yes. she's at work for the company too? well -what's your normal there? +what's your normal there? supervisor. in this depot in wetherall that's right. @@ -17415,29 +17394,29 @@ day every day? yes. the premises ? yes. -what er, experience have you got in er the sale of intoxicating liquors miss ? -well i worked for the past two year really +what er, experience have you got in er the sale of intoxicating liquors miss ? +well i worked for the past two year really where, at the ? i used to work in oldham and then then i come over here. . so how long have you been at these particular premises? -er about a month ago. -mr mr . -well no she says, she said er she said -it is responsibility . -cos she's just given up her her er any er,possibly? -and er miss do you intend to apply for the transfer of this license? +er about a month ago. +mr mr . +well no she says, she said er she said +it is responsibility . +cos she's just given up her her er any er,possibly? +and er miss do you intend to apply for the transfer of this license? yeah. -has an application been submitted for that purpose? +has an application been submitted for that purpose? yes. -to the, which transfer +to the, which transfer oh! er to er i'm not so sure this applicant knows very much about what's going on here anyway your worship! -do you see what i mean, see most of this has been done for the convenience of the quick save supermarkets on that er, i should say. +do you see what i mean, see most of this has been done for the convenience of the quick save supermarkets on that er, i should say. mm. -well, practical purposes at this stage sir she maintains insufficient i've no doubt the licensee will want to know a lot more about the situation, it's very apparent it's not long ago that they last ta transferred to their present holding. -you are aware miss that any persons working in that department have got to be of age? +well, practical purposes at this stage sir she maintains insufficient i've no doubt the licensee will want to know a lot more about the situation, it's very apparent it's not long ago that they last ta transferred to their present holding. +you are aware miss that any persons working in that department have got to be of age? yes. can you undertake that that will apply? yes. @@ -17445,49 +17424,49 @@ and you aware of the restrictions on drink for young people? yeah. and the sort of concern about that? yes. -and we're going to grant this protection order which is temporary permission to keep the premises open and i must tell you that there will be a lot more investigation before the order is granted that the transfer is specialist. +and we're going to grant this protection order which is temporary permission to keep the premises open and i must tell you that there will be a lot more investigation before the order is granted that the transfer is specialist. and we're ordering that the other person, if possible, attends at that . if she's not in the district then it'll be difficult. -and if it is possible, if she is in the district we order that she attends the transfer sessions the outgoing licensee. +and if it is possible, if she is in the district we order that she attends the transfer sessions the outgoing licensee. fifty eight. -have you got the license er miss ? -no it's . +have you got the license er miss ? +no it's . well, but it will not be effective until er, you have produced that license to this court. -erm, i assume it that this er, if the licensee has left those premises wi she's physically left has she there? +erm, i assume it that this er, if the licensee has left those premises wi she's physically left has she there? yeah. er, when did she go? -about a month ago now . +about a month ago now . she left the company then did mm. she? i see, well i would of expected those premises not to be selling intoxicating liquor sir, they've obviously not had a license for a month! -that will also be er considered by the licensing committee at the next hearing! +that will also be er considered by the licensing committee at the next hearing! you must produce that license otherwise it's not effective er, miss ! see, as licensee you have responsibilities! -it's all very well the company telling you as employee what to do it's yo , you're the one who's going to be in difficulties if you don't comply with the licensing laws! +it's all very well the company telling you as employee what to do it's yo , you're the one who's going to be in difficulties if you don't comply with the licensing laws! your whole application's not been very satisfactory miss ! -and the fact that the license is not in puts you in in in difficulty! +and the fact that the license is not in puts you in in in difficulty! we are aware now that you're operating without a license and it's up to you to get that license here as quickly as possible! -right . +right . okay. to do with application as number forty four your worships, please. -it's in respect of erm temporary authority for the your worship. -your worship please i'd like to make to application on behalf of mr for a protection order in respect of vigitalle er, mr mr , mr . +it's in respect of erm temporary authority for the your worship. +your worship please i'd like to make to application on behalf of mr for a protection order in respect of vigitalle er, mr mr , mr . your full name is james ? yes sir. -and you have resided for the last six months at the and at er ? +and you have resided for the last six months at the and at er ? yes. -and are you this morning applying for a protection in respect of the vigitalle +and are you this morning applying for a protection in respect of the vigitalle yes. -er, would you, would you tell the, your worships what experience you've had in the licensed trade. -er, yes sir my current position er, at the moment i'm at the licensed house trainee manager for boddingtons brewery and i've held that position for five and half years. -er previously i've had, held the license of three fishes at lyddon er, for three years er, previous to that i held the license of the mason's arms, with for three years previous to that and before i've been connected with the catering and licensed trade from be fifteen. +er, would you, would you tell the, your worships what experience you've had in the licensed trade. +er, yes sir my current position er, at the moment i'm at the licensed house trainee manager for boddingtons brewery and i've held that position for five and half years. +er previously i've had, held the license of three fishes at lyddon er, for three years er, previous to that i held the license of the mason's arms, with for three years previous to that and before i've been connected with the catering and licensed trade from be fifteen. and you're there for quali qualified rather than just the licensed trade would that be ? i hope so, yes sir. -and are you applying to, but,ar are you proposing to apply for the permanent transfer of this license? +and are you applying to, but,ar are you proposing to apply for the permanent transfer of this license? yes sir. thank you. -er, mrs please. +er, mrs please. mrs , your full is margaret ? yes. and are you the current licensee? @@ -17498,8 +17477,8 @@ that is the application your worship. thank you. a protection order be granted? your worship please. -right . -er, application . +right . +er, application . yes, ? yes. @@ -17509,7 +17488,7 @@ but er excuse the long . page fifty seven please your worship, robert james , he is in the cells your worship sorry! so it will take a moment for him to be bought up. -there are apparently further charges to be put to him your worship the charge of theft and we charge him with handling stolen property. +there are apparently further charges to be put to him your worship the charge of theft and we charge him with handling stolen property. he's only charged with one offence of criminal deception at the moment. right.. fifty five sir, fifty six. @@ -17522,50 +17501,50 @@ that's correct. are represented by a solicitor today? should be. was it mr ? -i have given the you have all the documents in front of you. -well i think mr got represented on a previous occasion that's why i'm asking you that! +i have given the you have all the documents in front of you. +well i think mr got represented on a previous occasion that's why i'm asking you that! well i don't know sir. my solicitor's in birmingham! -my, my records sir that mr was the duty solicitor on that day. +my, my records sir that mr was the duty solicitor on that day. oh! i think he's represented you on more than one occasion . -but don't he know that his solicitor's gotta be here for the today? +but don't he know that his solicitor's gotta be here for the today? i haven't a clue what's happening! i didn't know, i mean i could of spoken to . well you're the defendant, one would of thought yo yo yo know what'll happen to you! i haven't . as, as far as i know i have a committal today. that's right. -but i would of thought that your solicitor was to be here to represent you. -as far as i'm aware my solicitor has been in contact with burnley prosecution to have the case transferred to birmingham crown court. -well he has been a bit +but i would of thought that your solicitor was to be here to represent you. +as far as i'm aware my solicitor has been in contact with burnley prosecution to have the case transferred to birmingham crown court. +well he has been a bit if you tried there. -did you recognise the chap? -i'm afraid sir, i have no knowledge, i haven't certainly myself spoken to anybody with regard to that, i would of thought the normal procedure would be for him to be committed to preston crown court and for the crown courts thereafter to sort out the final venue. -i certainly have no knowledge of of any contact with regard to the ultimate venue and nothing has been marked on my file. -your worships, legal aid was granted er on the thirteenth of september to affirm of burglary. +did you recognise the chap? +i'm afraid sir, i have no knowledge, i haven't certainly myself spoken to anybody with regard to that, i would of thought the normal procedure would be for him to be committed to preston crown court and for the crown courts thereafter to sort out the final venue. +i certainly have no knowledge of of any contact with regard to the ultimate venue and nothing has been marked on my file. +your worships, legal aid was granted er on the thirteenth of september to affirm of burglary. well obviously they're not here your worship. -well all i can suggest is the case is adjourned for the week we'll just have to arrange a solicitor to be here. +well all i can suggest is the case is adjourned for the week we'll just have to arrange a solicitor to be here. i wish for the committal to go along please sir? i've been stuck up in this place -in that case of the day sir because the statements have to read out in full. +in that case of the day sir because the statements have to read out in full. he doesn't want to be represented is that what you're saying? -what i'm saying sir is to save the inconvenience to the court is that if i could have my committal cos i don't wanna be stuck up in this part of the country! -i have a crown court appearance in birmingham and as far as i'm aware my solicitors have been in contact with the prosecution in this part of the country to explain the procedure and as far as i'm aware the committal this morning was to be committed to birmingham crown court with other offenses. +what i'm saying sir is to save the inconvenience to the court is that if i could have my committal cos i don't wanna be stuck up in this part of the country! +i have a crown court appearance in birmingham and as far as i'm aware my solicitors have been in contact with the prosecution in this part of the country to explain the procedure and as far as i'm aware the committal this morning was to be committed to birmingham crown court with other offenses. well you've heard the senior prosecutor say that she knows nothing, she well i don't, i wouldn't have said i don't know sir. oh! -i mean, that case then can i take my my committal to preston crown court, and when i go to birmingham +i mean, that case then can i take my my committal to preston crown court, and when i go to birmingham if you're committed to trial in this court you will be committed to preston. well i'll take it if now then sir. -if it is to be arranged and that you're dealt with at another court crown court will have to arrange that. -well in that case sir can you get the committee then please? +if it is to be arranged and that you're dealt with at another court crown court will have to arrange that. +well in that case sir can you get the committee then please? as of now. -as i say sir we put this matter down till later in the day, the defendant wi will not appear to be represented therefore the committal will have to be dealt with by re reading out all the statements. -it can't be done simply ! +as i say sir we put this matter down till later in the day, the defendant wi will not appear to be represented therefore the committal will have to be dealt with by re reading out all the statements. +it can't be done simply ! then we'll probably put this case back till later in the day. do you see that mr ? because you're not represented @@ -17573,108 +17552,108 @@ well i don't know what the situation is! well i'm te , that's what i'm trying to tell you! you'll have to . but because you're not represented the statements will have to be read out! -which will er take quite some time and er will +which will er take quite some time and er will and certainly will if you're reading to the court which was something you were concerned about. -i'm not . +i'm not . i don't know whether you can help that man with that. -because mr has represented him, mr said before that he he thought it was as duty solicitor that he, he has represented him at some stage as duty solicitor but, he is represented under legal aid though this defendant by a firm of solicitors in birmingham and he's anxious to be committed for trial today. +because mr has represented him, mr said before that he he thought it was as duty solicitor that he, he has represented him at some stage as duty solicitor but, he is represented under legal aid though this defendant by a firm of solicitors in birmingham and he's anxious to be committed for trial today. if he was represented we could do it er, on the section six two. otherwise are there any solicitors present today? not at present, but he doesn't know . oh i see. -he's given certain information to the court which isn't correct anyway! +he's given certain information to the court which isn't correct anyway! have a word with him. it might help everybody concerned if you could have a word with . yes. we'll have a word with . could you deal with cases fifty five and fifty six your worship? -shaun david , mr represents him. +shaun david , mr represents him. are you shaun david ? yes. what's your date of birth mr ? twenty fourth of the seventh sixty seven. -what is your address mr ? +what is your address mr ? . -well you're charged with two offenses, the first of which is that at clitheroe on the twenty sixth of august nineteen eighty eight without lawful excuse you damaged two stained glass windows a picture frame glass and twelve glasses of varying descriptions belonging to whitbread breweries intending to damage that property and the being reckless as to whether that property would be damaged contrary to section one of the criminal damage act in nineteen seventy one. +well you're charged with two offenses, the first of which is that at clitheroe on the twenty sixth of august nineteen eighty eight without lawful excuse you damaged two stained glass windows a picture frame glass and twelve glasses of varying descriptions belonging to whitbread breweries intending to damage that property and the being reckless as to whether that property would be damaged contrary to section one of the criminal damage act in nineteen seventy one. i understand this value, value has been mentioned on a previous occasion, i think three hundred and ninety five pounds? yes it is. yeah. -to that charge shaun david do you plead guilty or not guilty? -worships if i may interrupt the the this erm dispute about the damage which was allegedly caused i have mentioned it to miss this morning and she has undertaken to make further enquiries. -erm briefly, the situation is that it's alleged that he broke two stained glass door panels and mr denies that he broke the second of the two, the one at the front door he says was broken at some time earlier on the evening on which he was involved. -unfortunately miss hasn't been able to conclude her enquiries er, to apportion the damage and to take instructions as to the the residue of what i've just said. -it is suggested er, by both myself and er my colleague that the matter should be adjourned for one week. -well it, it was adjourned last week for him to with instructions your worship. -yes we we've adjourned this case for one week other enquiries can be made. +to that charge shaun david do you plead guilty or not guilty? +worships if i may interrupt the the this erm dispute about the damage which was allegedly caused i have mentioned it to miss this morning and she has undertaken to make further enquiries. +erm briefly, the situation is that it's alleged that he broke two stained glass door panels and mr denies that he broke the second of the two, the one at the front door he says was broken at some time earlier on the evening on which he was involved. +unfortunately miss hasn't been able to conclude her enquiries er, to apportion the damage and to take instructions as to the the residue of what i've just said. +it is suggested er, by both myself and er my colleague that the matter should be adjourned for one week. +well it, it was adjourned last week for him to with instructions your worship. +yes we we've adjourned this case for one week other enquiries can be made. so he doesn't have to, on conditional bail today? well bail will be extended for one week. -well you know what that means mr , you were told this last week you will be to surrender yourself to bail next tuesday at er . +well you know what that means mr , you were told this last week you will be to surrender yourself to bail next tuesday at er . hopefully the matter will proceed next week. can we go your worships? yes, you can leave the court. -case number one your worships please peter john . +case number one your worships please peter john . are you peter john ? that's right. what's your date of birth? nineteen of the first sixty three. what's your home address mr ? . -you are charged with an offence which is contrary to section six of the road traffic act in nineteen seventy two in wallby on the ninth of september drove a motor vehicle on the a six seven one wallby by pass having consumed alcohol in such a quantity that the proportion of it, in your breath exceeded the prescribed limit. +you are charged with an offence which is contrary to section six of the road traffic act in nineteen seventy two in wallby on the ninth of september drove a motor vehicle on the a six seven one wallby by pass having consumed alcohol in such a quantity that the proportion of it, in your breath exceeded the prescribed limit. do you understand? do you plead guilty or not guilty? guilty. have you got your driving license with you mr ? i haven't got it actually, no. why? -because, well i told the police at the time that er i've misplaced it and er my is. +because, well i told the police at the time that er i've misplaced it and er my is. what are you doing about getting er, a replacement? well i haven't done anything at the moment because i di i didn't think it was worth it actually. -well, it says on the bottom of the, your copy of the charge sheet, production of driving license you must produce it, failure to produce it will mean that it is automatically suspended and it also means you've committed yet another offence by not having a driving licence here to produce mr ! -well i wa i wasn't sure whether to, whether it would go through in time for the case and that's why i haven't +well, it says on the bottom of the, your copy of the charge sheet, production of driving license you must produce it, failure to produce it will mean that it is automatically suspended and it also means you've committed yet another offence by not having a driving licence here to produce mr ! +well i wa i wasn't sure whether to, whether it would go through in time for the case and that's why i haven't what's stopping you? send off for it. i wasn't sure what the situation was . -unless the prosecutor is in the fortunate position of having a computer printout of your driving er le , holding your licence record the case won't be able to proceed today anyway. +unless the prosecutor is in the fortunate position of having a computer printout of your driving er le , holding your licence record the case won't be able to proceed today anyway. and your worship, regrettably there is no printout of the driving licence. -well the case can't go ahead today without your driving licence. +well the case can't go ahead today without your driving licence. sorry? the case cannot go ahead without your driving licence. how many weeks do you want to ? -your worship, i would anticipate that it normally takes at least three weeks for a printout for the computer to be able to -and this case is adjourned for three weeks in order that a computer printout will can be obtained. +your worship, i would anticipate that it normally takes at least three weeks for a printout for the computer to be able to +and this case is adjourned for three weeks in order that a computer printout will can be obtained. does that mean i don't have to apply for another licence? no, but er ee i , i suggest you don't apply for the licence now. no, you've left it too late! -but er i would urge you to try to find your driving licence because +but er i would urge you to try to find your driving licence because no, i i i don't think i'll be able to because . -right, well you know you're going to be disqualified eventually for this offence if you're convicted. +right, well you know you're going to be disqualified eventually for this offence if you're convicted. yes. -what, the offence the drink driving offence? +what, the offence the drink driving offence? yes. yeah. do you understand? i realise that. you've pleaded guilty to the charge anyhow, it's a fair cop! -the point is that when you are disqualified you're not just disqualified from driving you are disqualified from holding or obtaining any driving licence. -so if you've got one at home you're committing an offence by being in possession of it. +the point is that when you are disqualified you're not just disqualified from driving you are disqualified from holding or obtaining any driving licence. +so if you've got one at home you're committing an offence by being in possession of it. do you understand? do you understand that? yeah. right. do i -no when you're disqualified. +no when you're disqualified. but don't apply for a driving licence in the meantime. yeah okay alright. -but er you'll be in a far safer position if you actually produce your licence on the twenty fifth of october. +but er you'll be in a far safer position if you actually produce your licence on the twenty fifth of october. right. can i go sir? yes, you can leave the court room. er, so yours is better mrs . er number twenty one sir, the january . -sorry twenty one? +sorry twenty one? yes sir. -your worships, john graham please, twenty one. +your worships, john graham please, twenty one. now, are you john graham ? john geoffrey . john? @@ -17685,17 +17664,17 @@ yes. what's your date of birth mr ? twenty ninth of the eleventh sixty nine. what's your home address? -you're stood up for a number of offenses, the first of which is that on the twenty first of june nineteen eighty eight you, on the public road way in accrington road worley used the mechanics of the vehicle when there was an excise licence in force, it's an offence of the vehicles excise act in nineteen seventy one. +you're stood up for a number of offenses, the first of which is that on the twenty first of june nineteen eighty eight you, on the public road way in accrington road worley used the mechanics of the vehicle when there was an excise licence in force, it's an offence of the vehicles excise act in nineteen seventy one. do you understand? yes. do you plead guilty or not guilty? guilty. -also that you be the driver of the motor car having been required to produce your driving licence for examination to the police officer, failed to do so. +also that you be the driver of the motor car having been required to produce your driving licence for examination to the police officer, failed to do so. to that, do you plead guilty or not guilty? guilty. -also that you used the vehicle without insurance being in force in respect of third party risks a contravention of section a hundred and forty three of the road traffic act to that are you guilty or not guilty? +also that you used the vehicle without insurance being in force in respect of third party risks a contravention of section a hundred and forty three of the road traffic act to that are you guilty or not guilty? not guilty. -also, that on the twenty first of june you've used the motor vehicle at worley on accrington road when there was no test certificate in force. +also, that on the twenty first of june you've used the motor vehicle at worley on accrington road when there was no test certificate in force. are you guilty or not guilty? not guilty. also, that you failed to produce an insurance certificate on being required to do so. @@ -17709,7 +17688,7 @@ no sir. have you got the insurance with you? yes. the test certificate with you? -everything my solicitor was outside. +everything my solicitor was outside. what? i give them to that solicitor that, i were talking to. which duty solicitor? @@ -17719,75 +17698,75 @@ mr . . likely to receive custodial sentences. in this instance. -i can't see any harm . +i can't see any harm . would you like me to show the the prosecuting solicitor? well perhaps it'll save time. . mm? knowing business effects it. -no take them off. -yes, may please your worships i am satisfied that those documents to cover the defendant for the date in question and will therefore offer no evidence in relation to the protest to these premises but to dismiss them. +no take them off. +yes, may please your worships i am satisfied that those documents to cover the defendant for the date in question and will therefore offer no evidence in relation to the protest to these premises but to dismiss them. could i ask sir -yes, stand up mr we listening to those three charges and maybe you'll no test certificate in those two . +yes, stand up mr we listening to those three charges and maybe you'll no test certificate in those two . er now unless there's a prosecution we have the facts for the other offenses i understand. -yeah so please your worships it was the twenty first of june in the morning when the police officer was on duty on the aces accrington at worley he had occasion to stop the vehicle which was being driven by mr and he noticed that the excise licence which was being displayed had in fact, expired at the end of march. -mr was unable to produce his documents in relation to the vehicle which he indicated was his own and he was therefore given an h r t one to produce those documents but you will appreciate from the matters that he's pleaded pleaded guilty to this morning he in fact, failed to produce his insurance driving licence and test certificate within the required period. -your worships, those are the brief facts, i would ask you consider back duty of eight pounds thirty three pence at being called a month of may. -i think you'll find +yeah so please your worships it was the twenty first of june in the morning when the police officer was on duty on the aces accrington at worley he had occasion to stop the vehicle which was being driven by mr and he noticed that the excise licence which was being displayed had in fact, expired at the end of march. +mr was unable to produce his documents in relation to the vehicle which he indicated was his own and he was therefore given an h r t one to produce those documents but you will appreciate from the matters that he's pleaded pleaded guilty to this morning he in fact, failed to produce his insurance driving licence and test certificate within the required period. +your worships, those are the brief facts, i would ask you consider back duty of eight pounds thirty three pence at being called a month of may. +i think you'll find he says . i would like them both to go back from the month of june. i know. i'd also ask you to consider costs of ten pounds. . -he could have the li you can have your licence back offenses to endorse it with. -yeah and er . +he could have the li you can have your licence back offenses to endorse it with. +yeah and er . you're able to help him anyway. yes, i wonder if i may -can i just say before we start but er why that he doesn't call june and his licence for seven months. -sir, i apologise, i was going by this figure made by which indicated that it expired on the thirty first of march, i think and in fact, that is a an error on the officer's part it would appear from the licensing authorities in fact, it expired at the end of may. +can i just say before we start but er why that he doesn't call june and his licence for seven months. +sir, i apologise, i was going by this figure made by which indicated that it expired on the thirty first of march, i think and in fact, that is a an error on the officer's part it would appear from the licensing authorities in fact, it expired at the end of may. yeah. yeah. . -your worships er, these offenses arrived out of er what was, initially a road traffic accident which occurred on the twenty first of june er, when er, mr 's vehicle came into collision with er, a vehicle that was erm stationary in the centre of the road waiting to turn right. -no er allegations of erm concerning the correct, his driving er, are made by the pro prosecution er as a result of the incident but er, as a result of the officer's enquiries er, it came to light that mr was er, in breach of some of the er, other regulations regarding road uses and so the summonses which are to deal with this morning have er have been issued against him. -erm, and you will be aware that at two of er, three of the er summonses that are now left here to de deal with, that's three of the four er, do in fact, relate to clearly produce the documents. -er, failure to produce his driving licence failure to produce a test certificate for the vehicle and failure to produce his insurance documents and what mr says in respect of er, those three offenses is that er, the officer, he accepts, did tell him that he was obliged to produce the documents to a police station but he says that he was suffering some shock as a result of the road accident and er he didn't appreciate what the officer was saying to him at the time and, never having had to produce his documents at the police station before er, he had never er no , known that that was a procedure that had to be followed and in the circumstances he didn't pay any attention to the print on the h r t er, one form that was issued to him and he didn't produce the documents. -it was completely ignorance on his part in that respect. -er your worships, the one remaining summonses, the one relating to the fact that his vehicle er, wasn't taxed at the time of the accident and, i think er he he will be aware his tax er, did run out at the end of may and this accident happened on the twenty first of june. -i've asked him about that and what he said is that er, he was saving up and he was going tax the vehicle as soon he was able to do so but he didn't have the funds and er, to do so at, at that time. -erm he is obviously aware that er by not having the vehicle taxed it's going to cost him considerably more than if he had er taxed the vehicle at the right, correct and proper time. -your worships, mr works for wallbank aerials in worley and he works for them as an engineer his vehicle was erm something that he did use for work, but unfortunately as a result of the accident his has been written off and he hasn't yet been able to er, replace it and so he's having to be erm er, chauffeured by the company to do his er his work. -erm he was using at that time an r registered ford escort er, which was er, only insured third party, fire and theft. -he receives for his employment a take home pay of seventy three pounds per week, he lives with his parents and pays a board of twenty pounds per week he's fortunate in that his employer takes him to work in the mornings but he has to catch the bus home in the evening and at lunchtime on saturdays which costs him seven pounds forty. -he hasn't any other commitments and he would ask that erm he be allowed to pay the fine at the rate of twenty pounds per week. -your worships, those are the circumstances i would ask you to bear in mind that this man a ha , has four summonses against him purely as a result of really ignorance as far as purchasing documents is concerned they were in order and erm he would of produced them had he realised what the officer was saying to him and er, that he would of realised had he not been suffering the shock, but he was actually sufferance suffering at the er at the time of the accident. -i don't think your worships. -well mr er pleading guilty to these offenses and we've listened to what the solicitor has said on your behalf the main offence of having no excise licence you'll be fined seventy five pounds and be willing to pay eighty pounds thirty three back duty and ten pounds costs and for the offenses of failing to produce you'll be fined ten pounds for each of those three offenses. +your worships er, these offenses arrived out of er what was, initially a road traffic accident which occurred on the twenty first of june er, when er, mr 's vehicle came into collision with er, a vehicle that was erm stationary in the centre of the road waiting to turn right. +no er allegations of erm concerning the correct, his driving er, are made by the pro prosecution er as a result of the incident but er, as a result of the officer's enquiries er, it came to light that mr was er, in breach of some of the er, other regulations regarding road uses and so the summonses which are to deal with this morning have er have been issued against him. +erm, and you will be aware that at two of er, three of the er summonses that are now left here to de deal with, that's three of the four er, do in fact, relate to clearly produce the documents. +er, failure to produce his driving licence failure to produce a test certificate for the vehicle and failure to produce his insurance documents and what mr says in respect of er, those three offenses is that er, the officer, he accepts, did tell him that he was obliged to produce the documents to a police station but he says that he was suffering some shock as a result of the road accident and er he didn't appreciate what the officer was saying to him at the time and, never having had to produce his documents at the police station before er, he had never er no , known that that was a procedure that had to be followed and in the circumstances he didn't pay any attention to the print on the h r t er, one form that was issued to him and he didn't produce the documents. +it was completely ignorance on his part in that respect. +er your worships, the one remaining summonses, the one relating to the fact that his vehicle er, wasn't taxed at the time of the accident and, i think er he he will be aware his tax er, did run out at the end of may and this accident happened on the twenty first of june. +i've asked him about that and what he said is that er, he was saving up and he was going tax the vehicle as soon he was able to do so but he didn't have the funds and er, to do so at, at that time. +erm he is obviously aware that er by not having the vehicle taxed it's going to cost him considerably more than if he had er taxed the vehicle at the right, correct and proper time. +your worships, mr works for wallbank aerials in worley and he works for them as an engineer his vehicle was erm something that he did use for work, but unfortunately as a result of the accident his has been written off and he hasn't yet been able to er, replace it and so he's having to be erm er, chauffeured by the company to do his er his work. +erm he was using at that time an r registered ford escort er, which was er, only insured third party, fire and theft. +he receives for his employment a take home pay of seventy three pounds per week, he lives with his parents and pays a board of twenty pounds per week he's fortunate in that his employer takes him to work in the mornings but he has to catch the bus home in the evening and at lunchtime on saturdays which costs him seven pounds forty. +he hasn't any other commitments and he would ask that erm he be allowed to pay the fine at the rate of twenty pounds per week. +your worships, those are the circumstances i would ask you to bear in mind that this man a ha , has four summonses against him purely as a result of really ignorance as far as purchasing documents is concerned they were in order and erm he would of produced them had he realised what the officer was saying to him and er, that he would of realised had he not been suffering the shock, but he was actually sufferance suffering at the er at the time of the accident. +i don't think your worships. +well mr er pleading guilty to these offenses and we've listened to what the solicitor has said on your behalf the main offence of having no excise licence you'll be fined seventy five pounds and be willing to pay eighty pounds thirty three back duty and ten pounds costs and for the offenses of failing to produce you'll be fined ten pounds for each of those three offenses. we will order the fines and costs to be paid at a rate of twenty pounds a week. -so i make that a hundred and thirteen a hundred and twenty three pounds, and the costs are thirty three pence? -erm a hundred twenty six thirty three. +so i make that a hundred and thirteen a hundred and twenty three pounds, and the costs are thirty three pence? +erm a hundred twenty six thirty three. sorry, you're right! -one, two, three +one, two, three a sa hundred and eight one two, three three three sir. -so do, you understand that er mr ? +so do, you understand that er mr ? yes. -you pay out twenty pounds a week the officer of the court is agreed and the address will be given to you by the court usher before you leave it is your responsibility to make sure that money is paid each and every week, the first payment is due by next tuesday. -erm i'm off sick at the moment from work so -so i won't be able to pay the first payment cos, you know ain't got no money. -don't you get any sick payment or -well erm, i've just come up and and the accident so i'm only entitled to money for the first four days. +you pay out twenty pounds a week the officer of the court is agreed and the address will be given to you by the court usher before you leave it is your responsibility to make sure that money is paid each and every week, the first payment is due by next tuesday. +erm i'm off sick at the moment from work so +so i won't be able to pay the first payment cos, you know ain't got no money. +don't you get any sick payment or +well erm, i've just come up and and the accident so i'm only entitled to money for the first four days. i see. and when you are likely to be earning again? -erm perhaps anywhere next week. +erm perhaps anywhere next week. well i do think give fourteen days for the first payment sir. yes. -you have you fourteen days the first payment will be twenty pounds a week thereafter. -so by a fortnight today there's gotta be a payment in? +you have you fourteen days the first payment will be twenty pounds a week thereafter. +so by a fortnight today there's gotta be a payment in? yes. . alright. @@ -17795,82 +17774,82 @@ may we go sir? yes, you can leave the court now. thank you. back to case thirty one. -miss apparently you represent mr er well i i notice from the documents with the er summons it was adjourned because erm their solicitor wrote to say that he will be claiming not guilty? +miss apparently you represent mr er well i i notice from the documents with the er summons it was adjourned because erm their solicitor wrote to say that he will be claiming not guilty? oh yes. is that the case? -yeah, your worships i understand that the the prosecution are are making application i don't that you should go on with this. +yeah, your worships i understand that the the prosecution are are making application i don't that you should go on with this. so is it ? if if it's not going to trial when they were we'll do it now we'll take it now. -i wonder if i can insist, it isn't a matter where and they have spoken to me about this particular case and +i wonder if i can insist, it isn't a matter where and they have spoken to me about this particular case and go to forty five your worship. sorry, i forgot the -the view of the prosecution that this is matter could be dealt with quite satisfactorily by the way of in the court were minded to do that, if the court would accept that course of action. -i understand that mr would be willing to be bound over. +the view of the prosecution that this is matter could be dealt with quite satisfactorily by the way of in the court were minded to do that, if the court would accept that course of action. +i understand that mr would be willing to be bound over. does that compare with that ? -well obviously miss the magistrates will need to be satisfied there are grounds why they should bind him over they will also need to be satisfied that there is a fear for the future otherwise they will not bind him over. -i appreciate that sir, but you may feel at the end of the day that you need to hear conducts from the case and if he is still present obviously whatever the court wishes to do. -i see, well in that case then i will leave it alone, i'll deal with this a little bit later on, obviously it could take +well obviously miss the magistrates will need to be satisfied there are grounds why they should bind him over they will also need to be satisfied that there is a fear for the future otherwise they will not bind him over. +i appreciate that sir, but you may feel at the end of the day that you need to hear conducts from the case and if he is still present obviously whatever the court wishes to do. +i see, well in that case then i will leave it alone, i'll deal with this a little bit later on, obviously it could take as you want. possibly . who else is present mrs ? -er number forty one sir,. -do deal with that your worships please? +er number forty one sir,. +do deal with that your worships please? forty one . are you sylvia ? yes. what is your date of birth please? ha? what is your date of birth please? -er twenty ninth. +er twenty ninth. and do you plead guilty or not guilty? yeah, er guilty. right. -and you're also summoned that on that same occasion you not having given your name and address to any person requiring it at the time, you failed to report the accident at a police station, or to a constable as soon as reasonably practicable and in any case within twenty four hours of it happening again, that's an offence under section twenty five of the road traffic act to that effect do you plead guilty or not guilty? +and you're also summoned that on that same occasion you not having given your name and address to any person requiring it at the time, you failed to report the accident at a police station, or to a constable as soon as reasonably practicable and in any case within twenty four hours of it happening again, that's an offence under section twenty five of the road traffic act to that effect do you plead guilty or not guilty? yeah. you're pleading guilty? yeah. -and finally, that at worley on the twenty fifth of july nineteen eighty eighty, you being the driver of a motor car you failed to afford precedence to a foot passenger on the carriageway within the limits of uncontrolled zebra crossing on king street that's an offence under the pedestrian crossing regulations and the road traffic regulation act of ninety eighty four to that do you plead guilty or not +and finally, that at worley on the twenty fifth of july nineteen eighty eighty, you being the driver of a motor car you failed to afford precedence to a foot passenger on the carriageway within the limits of uncontrolled zebra crossing on king street that's an offence under the pedestrian crossing regulations and the road traffic regulation act of ninety eighty four to that do you plead guilty or not yes. guilty? yes, guilty. right, now listen carefully to the prosecution. do you have difficulty hearing? yes, i'm aware -that be needed. -alright, well perhaps lu turn, turn that way listen to lady speaking here. -just stand as close to her as you like as long as you can hear what's she's saying that's the important thing. -your worships mrs appears before the court today as a result of an accident which occurred on the twenty fifth of july at about four thirty in the afternoon it was on king street at worley and there was only her vehicle involved and a young girl who was using the pedestrian crossing. -apparently at this particular time there was a considerable amount of traffic on the road in question and traffic from one direction had halted in order to allow that the young girl and her friend to cross the road they began to cross on the zebra crossing but, as she reached the centre of the road mrs was driving her vehicle in the opposite direction and she failed to stop the young girl, in her teens, was unable to take, avoiding acci action and she was knocked down as she crossed the road. -apparently she then picked herself up and in fact ran from the scene but mrs didn't stop and didn't make enquiries as to who the girl was and neither was the matter reported by her to the police in due course. -however, the whole incident was witnessed by another driver who took a note of the car number and in turn, of course, reported it to the police and eventually mrs was interviewed on the eleventh of august of this year she agreed that she was the driver at the time and she replied it's okay, but if the little had stopped after the accident i would of sorted things out i couldn't do anything after she ran off. -and that it says, the brief facts, i would ask to consider cost of ten pound. +that be needed. +alright, well perhaps lu turn, turn that way listen to lady speaking here. +just stand as close to her as you like as long as you can hear what's she's saying that's the important thing. +your worships mrs appears before the court today as a result of an accident which occurred on the twenty fifth of july at about four thirty in the afternoon it was on king street at worley and there was only her vehicle involved and a young girl who was using the pedestrian crossing. +apparently at this particular time there was a considerable amount of traffic on the road in question and traffic from one direction had halted in order to allow that the young girl and her friend to cross the road they began to cross on the zebra crossing but, as she reached the centre of the road mrs was driving her vehicle in the opposite direction and she failed to stop the young girl, in her teens, was unable to take, avoiding acci action and she was knocked down as she crossed the road. +apparently she then picked herself up and in fact ran from the scene but mrs didn't stop and didn't make enquiries as to who the girl was and neither was the matter reported by her to the police in due course. +however, the whole incident was witnessed by another driver who took a note of the car number and in turn, of course, reported it to the police and eventually mrs was interviewed on the eleventh of august of this year she agreed that she was the driver at the time and she replied it's okay, but if the little had stopped after the accident i would of sorted things out i couldn't do anything after she ran off. +and that it says, the brief facts, i would ask to consider cost of ten pound. alright then, yeah. you heard ? ya, you did alright. -mr was going to speak for you now. -yes, your worships i wonder if i may assist the court o on behalf of er m mrs erm mrs er has told me that she thought at the time of the incident again was in fact, nearer to five o'clock than than, than four thirty and she was driving from billington towards clitheroe she had come through the traffic lights at the bottom of accrington road in worley and she was proceeding along king street in worley er, towards towards clitheroe and sh she has told me that at the time there was a considerable amount of traffic on the road and yo i in fact had that confirmed to you by er, my friend er the the traffic was sufficiently heavy that in fact, the the traffic travelling in the direction of blackburn er was wai was backed up to the traffic lights as far as the zebra crossing and beyond it and so as mrs erm was travelling towards clitheroe her view of the children on the footpath at the opposite side of the road was obstructed by the cars that were er, travelling towards blackburn. -and so erm, it wasn't as though these children ran across an open zebra crossing and she could see the children travelling er, walking or running all the way across the er er er er the pedestrian crossing the two children one was estimated by her to be about six years old, and the one who was actually knocked down was estimated by her to be about er, nine years old and she wasn't travelling at any significant speed at all, she was travelling slowly because of the amount of traffic and she says that er the first she saw them was erm, appearing from the behind a car and dashing across the front of her car, and in fact, it was only the the the one who ran first the the older of the two children that she actually hit, she hit hit her with the near side front of er of her vehicle. -she hit her and at the same time as she hit her she virtually came to a er, a stop because of the fact she wa she started to brake as soon as she saw the the children appear er, but ne never the less contact was made but thankfully for her and for the child the the contact was a a at no significant speed, the child was just knocked off her feet and she got up and waved to mrs and said i'm alright and she ran off and she was away before mrs had time, even to undo her safety belt to get out of the car. -she accepts that she then was confused, she didn't know what to do erm she didn't think there was any point in getting out of the car which is what sh she should of done, she should of tried to make some enquiries about the child er, but she er, she looked around shrugged her shoulders and and then carried on her journey because she didn't think there was anything else she could do about it. -and then again, ignorance er, at what she should subsequently have done er, then took over because she didn't realise that by having had er made contact with an individual erm it was necessary for her to report the matter to the police and she just didn't realise that that was something that she should have done. -your worships, er, there's nothing at all more sinister in the failure to stop and failure to report than than that,i th that is a a true record of the er er er of the incident as far as mrs was concerned erm and it is something which erm comes about an accident which came about probably through the inexperience of the children er, running across the pedestrian crossing thinking that they have priority erm and not having regard to other road users er, and mrs was travelling at slow speed but it was she was put in a difficult position by the the way in which the children ran across the road. -erm your worships as far as the personal circumstances are concerned she is fifty nine years old, she hasn't worked for the last three years she's in receipt of invalidity benefit similarly her husband who hasn't worked for the last ten or eleven years er, is on invalidity benefit. -erm she would ask that and fine that impose today er, could be paid by her at the rate of five pounds per week erm, she er runs a car her invalidity income amounts to forty six pounds fifteen pence per week and she also receives a super annuation payment from her former employers goldeson's hospital at the rate of a hundred and three pounds per month but she and her husband do have to er to run the home and er, and run the house er, run run the car and she would ask that she'll be allowed to pay at the rate of five pound per week. +mr was going to speak for you now. +yes, your worships i wonder if i may assist the court o on behalf of er m mrs erm mrs er has told me that she thought at the time of the incident again was in fact, nearer to five o'clock than than, than four thirty and she was driving from billington towards clitheroe she had come through the traffic lights at the bottom of accrington road in worley and she was proceeding along king street in worley er, towards towards clitheroe and sh she has told me that at the time there was a considerable amount of traffic on the road and yo i in fact had that confirmed to you by er, my friend er the the traffic was sufficiently heavy that in fact, the the traffic travelling in the direction of blackburn er was wai was backed up to the traffic lights as far as the zebra crossing and beyond it and so as mrs erm was travelling towards clitheroe her view of the children on the footpath at the opposite side of the road was obstructed by the cars that were er, travelling towards blackburn. +and so erm, it wasn't as though these children ran across an open zebra crossing and she could see the children travelling er, walking or running all the way across the er er er er the pedestrian crossing the two children one was estimated by her to be about six years old, and the one who was actually knocked down was estimated by her to be about er, nine years old and she wasn't travelling at any significant speed at all, she was travelling slowly because of the amount of traffic and she says that er the first she saw them was erm, appearing from the behind a car and dashing across the front of her car, and in fact, it was only the the the one who ran first the the older of the two children that she actually hit, she hit hit her with the near side front of er of her vehicle. +she hit her and at the same time as she hit her she virtually came to a er, a stop because of the fact she wa she started to brake as soon as she saw the the children appear er, but ne never the less contact was made but thankfully for her and for the child the the contact was a a at no significant speed, the child was just knocked off her feet and she got up and waved to mrs and said i'm alright and she ran off and she was away before mrs had time, even to undo her safety belt to get out of the car. +she accepts that she then was confused, she didn't know what to do erm she didn't think there was any point in getting out of the car which is what sh she should of done, she should of tried to make some enquiries about the child er, but she er, she looked around shrugged her shoulders and and then carried on her journey because she didn't think there was anything else she could do about it. +and then again, ignorance er, at what she should subsequently have done er, then took over because she didn't realise that by having had er made contact with an individual erm it was necessary for her to report the matter to the police and she just didn't realise that that was something that she should have done. +your worships, er, there's nothing at all more sinister in the failure to stop and failure to report than than that,i th that is a a true record of the er er er of the incident as far as mrs was concerned erm and it is something which erm comes about an accident which came about probably through the inexperience of the children er, running across the pedestrian crossing thinking that they have priority erm and not having regard to other road users er, and mrs was travelling at slow speed but it was she was put in a difficult position by the the way in which the children ran across the road. +erm your worships as far as the personal circumstances are concerned she is fifty nine years old, she hasn't worked for the last three years she's in receipt of invalidity benefit similarly her husband who hasn't worked for the last ten or eleven years er, is on invalidity benefit. +erm she would ask that and fine that impose today er, could be paid by her at the rate of five pounds per week erm, she er runs a car her invalidity income amounts to forty six pounds fifteen pence per week and she also receives a super annuation payment from her former employers goldeson's hospital at the rate of a hundred and three pounds per month but she and her husband do have to er to run the home and er, and run the house er, run run the car and she would ask that she'll be allowed to pay at the rate of five pound per week. yep.. sit down and watch mrs . oh thank you. sit down there. -well mrs you're pleading guilty for these offenses and we've listened to what mr has said on your behalf and we're going to be as lenient as we can in the circumstances. +well mrs you're pleading guilty for these offenses and we've listened to what mr has said on your behalf and we're going to be as lenient as we can in the circumstances. for the offence of failing to stop you'll be fined fifty pounds, you're licence will be endorsed with five penalty points. -for failing to report you'll be fined twenty pounds and your licence will be endorsed and for failing afford precedence on the pedestrian on a zebra crossing you'll be fined ten pounds. -you will also be required to pay ten pounds costs. -that's ninety pounds and we will order it be paid at a rate of five pounds a week. -so mrs the court will endorse your licence that means that the fact that you have these offenses er against your record now will be entered onto on your driving licence by the court, the court will then send your driving licence to the driving licence centre at swansea so that they can er also record on your driving record. +for failing to report you'll be fined twenty pounds and your licence will be endorsed and for failing afford precedence on the pedestrian on a zebra crossing you'll be fined ten pounds. +you will also be required to pay ten pounds costs. +that's ninety pounds and we will order it be paid at a rate of five pounds a week. +so mrs the court will endorse your licence that means that the fact that you have these offenses er against your record now will be entered onto on your driving licence by the court, the court will then send your driving licence to the driving licence centre at swansea so that they can er also record on your driving record. you'll get your licence back in about three weeks time from the driving licence centre. -you must start paying five pounds a week by next tuesday the court usher will give you the address of the court but you must make you send that money every week. +you must start paying five pounds a week by next tuesday the court usher will give you the address of the court but you must make you send that money every week. yes. alright? right. @@ -17878,38 +17857,37 @@ you can go now mrs . thank you. take care of it. mrs ? -mr sir. +mr sir. is that all? yes. oh fine. -would you deal with an additional matter please your worships er, not on your list he's only been brought in almost at the start of the court of this morning. +would you deal with an additional matter please your worships er, not on your list he's only been brought in almost at the start of the court of this morning. carl robert . is he outside or is in he cells? he's in the cell sir. i think he'll be m - -that there was but the figures are actually not as er as er disappointing as er mr may feel. +that there was but the figures are actually not as er as er disappointing as er mr may feel. we do acknowledge that the fatalities by the end of er by the end of december last year fatalities had increased in the county but that does, but that's not really the figure that goes, go on because the numbers involved are actually quite small. overall during last year, this is to the end of, of november actually because fin figures aren't available for the end of the year, the reduction was four point nine percent, which compares with four point three percent in the previous year, so not only are they still going down, they're actually going down slightly more than they were in the previous year and that must be encouraging. and the next point on that is that the amount of road safety in the base budget figures, the amount from various different areas whether it's education, training, publicity, accident investigation or traffic calming, that amount of money is untouched so the same amount will be spent in the coming year a as was spent last year. as far as the capital receipt money goes, not all, it's not been possible to spend all of that this year because the development of some of these urban traffic calming schemes is actually very complicated and we've had to re-think some of them. the result is of that is not fortunate that they've been delayed but that in fact we have as much money to spend on them next year from the capital receipts as we will have spent this year, so in a sense we, we're not going backwards there either. -and then i would just draw attention to the proposals. +and then i would just draw attention to the proposals. several of them there. -er, rural traffic calming, speed cameras, provision for cyclists, pedestrian are all new money with a road safety bias in it, so i think we've done the best that we could this year. +er, rural traffic calming, speed cameras, provision for cyclists, pedestrian are all new money with a road safety bias in it, so i think we've done the best that we could this year. thank you mr . mr oh one sorry one last point. -mr asked about traffic calming on new roads. +mr asked about traffic calming on new roads. er and the answer to that is yes. er when development schemes are put before us, or put before districts, it is possible to er to include a scheme which is designed to be a calmer scheme and in fact we have our own advice notes on roads and res residential areas that we hope to advise developers on that. -and in fact the there, most of the traffic calming is actually being paid for and carried out by the developer for that scheme. +and in fact the there, most of the traffic calming is actually being paid for and carried out by the developer for that scheme. thanks mr . mr . yes er chairman erm the eighteen point three million that we quoted in last year's report, we actually added into the revenue budget the provision for structural maintenance that was contained in the capital programme. erm, there is a figure of seventeen point two million being quoted in this report. as it says, it's just the revenue works programme. -if you add in the structural maintenance which is in the capital programme, which amounts to two point two million, and add that to the seventeen point two, you get nineteen point four million and that's the figure that needs to be with last year's figure at eighteen point three. +if you add in the structural maintenance which is in the capital programme, which amounts to two point two million, and add that to the seventeen point two, you get nineteen point four million and that's the figure that needs to be with last year's figure at eighteen point three. so the equivalent figure for, for the last year is nineteen point four, that's an increase of one point one million. now part of that is inflation and part of it is the addition of, of erm proposals which are in the report erm from the policy and resources allocation of nine hundred and ninety thousand. right, thank you for that clarification mr . @@ -17918,22 +17896,22 @@ agreed. agreed, thank you. right, agenda item number six which is on page one of the blue book. regional transport strategy. -the committee are asked to support this initiative by to develop the sustainable regional transport policy and to appoint the chairman and two other committee members to attend the conference being arranged in march nineteen ninety four. +the committee are asked to support this initiative by to develop the sustainable regional transport policy and to appoint the chairman and two other committee members to attend the conference being arranged in march nineteen ninety four. i would suggest that there would be logic in both the other spokespersons attending this conference. does that meet with committee's approval? agreed right, good, thank you. item seven, shaping the way ahead. -this is an update on the consultation following the conference which was held in july nineteen ninety two i think, yes, erm and basically seeking the committee's approval to have a follow up conference this july in the centre in and to all members of the council to attend as erm for approved as approved duties. -erm, mr would like to say a few words about the conference overall, er sorry about, yes the conference. +this is an update on the consultation following the conference which was held in july nineteen ninety two i think, yes, erm and basically seeking the committee's approval to have a follow up conference this july in the centre in and to all members of the council to attend as erm for approved as approved duties. +erm, mr would like to say a few words about the conference overall, er sorry about, yes the conference. yeah. thank you, thank you chairman. er yes both this and the previous item are linked in a way. -erm, the, the regional conference will be a major national and indeed international conference and i think it's important that are there to participate and influence what goes on in the future. +erm, the, the regional conference will be a major national and indeed international conference and i think it's important that are there to participate and influence what goes on in the future. we are, as you will be aware, in the midst of a very intensive debate about transport policy in the moment, at the moment, er provoked by various things, the m twenty five widening proposals, british rail privatization, er shortage of runway capacity, a variety of things. all of these will be dealt with at that major conference so it is important that we are there. the july conference that we're planning. -the timing is quite nice really and deliberately so in that this will be the follow up to that in a way and it also follows the earlier conference, as you've heard. +the timing is quite nice really and deliberately so in that this will be the follow up to that in a way and it also follows the earlier conference, as you've heard. what we're talking about,w what we intend to talk about in july is not just whether or not our policies are the right ones but the practicality of implementation, which is actually the hardest bit of all to grasp, and what sort of things we might do, whether it's about spending more money, whether it's about influencing people, whether it's about physically restraining people on where they should go. so i recommend that conference to you and i hope it will be er an interesting one. we'll certainly do our best to make sure it is. @@ -17955,55 +17933,55 @@ the, the amount of money is allocated on a weighted mileage basis so it's to do but, having said that, if you feel, particularly with schemes that you are particularly familiar with, that that one is above or another or we could substitute rather than, there won't be any more money, that's the point i need to stress i think. you can make pleas for extra schemes but if you do so i could only suggest that you also accompany it with one that you would rather er is not done, so there are actually replacements rather than additions. i'd best, i'd best leave it there. -right, i've got mr followed by mr . -chairman members i, i'll look very hard for, for the words -i know you will say and i will support you, that we really don't want members bringing up detailed points like that at this committee. -was er whether the please ensure erm looking at carriageway major repairs you see area two tended to ninety three thousand pounds and that covers a lot of things which might include . -would it be possible for areas in area two with that information please? +right, i've got mr followed by mr . +chairman members i, i'll look very hard for, for the words +i know you will say and i will support you, that we really don't want members bringing up detailed points like that at this committee. +was er whether the please ensure erm looking at carriageway major repairs you see area two tended to ninety three thousand pounds and that covers a lot of things which might include . +would it be possible for areas in area two with that information please? yes, we'll certainly do that. -i'll ask mr to get that arranged for you. +i'll ask mr to get that arranged for you. thank you mr . mr . -that you very much mr i've got mr followed by mr . -thank you erm i hardly ever comment on these but i just, i wasn't sure what because quite often these things go under another guise, but there are a number of schemes on the drawing board for investigation as you all know and mr will know some of those they've been around for, for some years. +that you very much mr i've got mr followed by mr . +thank you erm i hardly ever comment on these but i just, i wasn't sure what because quite often these things go under another guise, but there are a number of schemes on the drawing board for investigation as you all know and mr will know some of those they've been around for, for some years. i thought that they were about to come to fruition. -i just hope that they aren't completely lost and in particular i'd just mention the because it's being increasingly used and will be as the bypass comes in into use because access will be restricted to the, the erm roundabout. -it's extremely noisy because the surfacing at one stage just didn't take properly for all sorts of reasons the traffic along there is increasing quite dramatically and i hope that will be part of those schemes. +i just hope that they aren't completely lost and in particular i'd just mention the because it's being increasingly used and will be as the bypass comes in into use because access will be restricted to the, the erm roundabout. +it's extremely noisy because the surfacing at one stage just didn't take properly for all sorts of reasons the traffic along there is increasing quite dramatically and i hope that will be part of those schemes. i'm not trying to work something new, it's already around and i just wanted to make sure it's not forgotten. i'm sure it hasn't been forgotten mr . can i . mr . thank you madam chairman. -erm i'm not gonna mention that sort of little village in the north that i come from but on page twelve i do notice that thousand pounds . +erm i'm not gonna mention that sort of little village in the north that i come from but on page twelve i do notice that thousand pounds . this has surprised me a little. could you give me just a little clarification on that okay thank you mr . mr . thank you chairman. -i think that's probably covered by mr 's point but we'll seek clarification in a second. -erm, please,appalling and have been for many years and er the whole of the road needs to be done. +i think that's probably covered by mr 's point but we'll seek clarification in a second. +erm, please,appalling and have been for many years and er the whole of the road needs to be done. mr yes. obviously there are a number of detailed points and these are just the ones that are coming off the top of this meeting and you will have more when you take them home and, and read them. most of the schemes that are put in here are actually assessed by the area highway engineer and if you've got particular schemes, especially ones that you know you've talked about in the past, the best way of dealing with them is to speak to him directly and say, why isn't it in this time? if you're not happy with the answer then i'd be pleased to hear about it and er and er obviously we can assess the priority . -erm, on there's a specific question i'd like to ask er if he could throw some light on that one. -yes, if i can mention that the is on the and it's really associated with the government's intention to raise the er limit of lorries to forty tons by nineteen ninety nine. -now what we have done is looked at s these causeway relief arches which pass the water from one side of the to the other at . +erm, on there's a specific question i'd like to ask er if he could throw some light on that one. +yes, if i can mention that the is on the and it's really associated with the government's intention to raise the er limit of lorries to forty tons by nineteen ninety nine. +now what we have done is looked at s these causeway relief arches which pass the water from one side of the to the other at . we've looked at those and the v they have very seriously deteriorated. the concrete's spalling, the reinforcement is being attacked and we've looked at various ways in which they can be repaired or replaced. -to replace them, for example, would cost something over a million pounds, but this is actually a repair to those er culverts the . +to replace them, for example, would cost something over a million pounds, but this is actually a repair to those er culverts the . right, thank you mr . right, can i take you to the recommendation on page nine that the programme be circulated to all members of the committee. erm quickly then -i would be the case +i would be the case no er he's got a beard. oh dear ken on erm -ken yeah that's it. +ken yeah that's it. bruce? bruce, yeah. that's it. @@ -18015,19 +17993,19 @@ i like him i do. he, he has some lovely records. good, good choice, you know? i listen to -oh you sound like n n norman wisdom . +oh you sound like n n norman wisdom . sounded just like norman wisdom . -or that bloke at the club making his mouth go go funny +or that bloke at the club making his mouth go go funny ooh that -hey that's, that bloody bloke who at the club that you +hey that's, that bloody bloke who at the club that you norman collier? no that bloke that comes up there. have you been john? no, i'll chuck away. hang on. who's that? -him that him that calls on the bloody bingo . -he says all the frees, firty free. +him that him that calls on the bloody bingo . +he says all the frees, firty free. yeah. and who is that? @@ -18035,7 +18013,7 @@ where's that at? is he, is where, at the beacon and he's oh! -free and four, firty four. +free and four, firty four. he he's a spastic though isn't he? i don't know. is he? @@ -18043,35 +18021,35 @@ oh, i didn't know. i think one of them's in a wheelchair. oh well, you shouldn't make fun. well i never see him. -i well i er i it was just he he sounded like a ponce to me. -you know, and he says sisth and two, sisthy two. +i well i er i it was just he he sounded like a ponce to me. +you know, and he says sisth and two, sisthy two. oh bloody hell. well i admire him if he's -well he he +well he he yeah i'm sure he's erm mm. spastic. mm. i saw a wheelchair there one day and i know oh. -they were saying they were gonna introduce spastic people +they were saying they were gonna introduce spastic people oh. into the club. well, jolly good. -i know one night that we were there and it said mr is upstairs +i know one night that we were there and it said mr is upstairs yeah. -and i thought they were gonna say beam them up scottie . +and i thought they were gonna say beam them up scottie . then all of a sudden the whole fire alarm went ee oo ee oo ee oo ooh all the way round the room. -you'd never heard nothing and everyone -and all the +you'd never heard nothing and everyone +and all the run to a different door. and all the all the boys run he said it's just -it's just to tell you just to show you how efficient that er our callers would be in a fire. +it's just to tell you just to show you how efficient that er our callers would be in a fire. oh. yeah? -yeah i'm gonna have, sod it i'm +yeah i'm gonna have, sod it i'm don't blame you. ooh you bugger. thought i were gonna get that one. @@ -18086,7 +18064,7 @@ eight nine ten jack, ooh! a que que a que. -and eight, eight of yeah. +and eight, eight of yeah. thought we might see pam today. she finishes work at half past er twelve on a friday. though. @@ -18097,10 +18075,10 @@ no. no i expect she's got the club tomorrow morning. she didn't have it oh has she? -last week so she'll be no doubt be there this week. +last week so she'll be no doubt be there this week. mm. three cards. -you are a +you are a oh that would have gone wouldn't it? does she do it every weekend? no, not every weekend. @@ -18151,20 +18129,20 @@ oh! bless you. no. jeez! -no, i've got one but i don't want another one. +no, i've got one but i don't want another one. oh my god, look at that. that's no good. -oh i don't know, if that one come up it would be, oh it's not now. +oh i don't know, if that one come up it would be, oh it's not now. we had a lovely singsong last night, didn't we mum? yeah. mm. who went? you and ? -erm me and mum and er just me and mother. +erm me and mum and er just me and mother. oh. -three +three mother! -do with that one bad. +do with that one bad. oh i can't sling that now, then i'd have two john. wrong one. she always slings my card just at the wrong time. @@ -18193,7 +18171,7 @@ that's a king is it? no i ain't got that one. wrong one. oh i've got that bugger now. -no i didn't. clubs. +no i didn't. clubs. jesus wept. jack follow the leader. two three four. @@ -18237,9 +18215,9 @@ me neither john. me neither. look at that. let's have a count up. -fifteen +fifteen all my cards are gone. -twenty six thirty pigging +twenty six thirty pigging i shall die with these in me hand. ah look at that! well! @@ -18253,7 +18231,7 @@ it must come soon. one of these buggers must. oh that's that king. oh dear. -now i might get a king. +now i might get a king. oh no! would you bloody credit it? eh? @@ -18271,7 +18249,7 @@ oh i only want one pigging card to make forty. seven. no. bugger. -i've you all up and +i've you all up and there. would you bloody credit it? not that two again? @@ -18279,10 +18257,10 @@ that bastard . ah! that's the one i wanted. look at that. -bloody +bloody i know. that's how it goes. -well i ain't got i ain't got a sodding hand. +well i ain't got i ain't got a sodding hand. oh i'm gonna split these bastards. you'll see the bleeding thing come now. would you bloody credit it, eh? @@ -18322,7 +18300,7 @@ no. don't know why i'm bothering. oh jesus! flaming bloody hell. -religious . +religious . gaw gee whiz. well. i don't believe it. @@ -18342,10 +18320,10 @@ look at that. yeah they're all following each other round . what do you want john? i'll try and help you. -well -i've split my bloody -that's and all. -i know but i can't keep can i? +well +i've split my bloody +that's and all. +i know but i can't keep can i? no. i've gotta make something. well. @@ -18355,10 +18333,10 @@ i i tell you one thing, once i go down i i'm out. i i just can't make bloody forty. i can't believe it. stupid person. -four sixes, twenty four twenty four twenty eight twenty nine thirty one thirty bloody nine. -would you credit and i got the bastard . +four sixes, twenty four twenty four twenty eight twenty nine thirty one thirty bloody nine. +would you credit and i got the bastard . oh now what am i gonna do? -twenty four twenty eight twenty nine thirty +twenty four twenty eight twenty nine thirty going over we stand a chance. hey that's that king there. come on, get him in. @@ -18387,7 +18365,7 @@ oh dear. oh here they come. buggered i get a bugger. no! -i +i have you got one? bugger i've got . you bastard . @@ -18395,8 +18373,8 @@ oh my god . would you bloody well believe it. they'll have to let us down in a minute. it's a seven con . -six seven eight i've gotta do it that, like that. -cos i've got that king in case john'll pick it up. +six seven eight i've gotta do it that, like that. +cos i've got that king in case john'll pick it up. he won't. oh my god. three aces. @@ -18432,15 +18410,15 @@ oh i don't believe this bugger. i don't honestly. what five's needed, the spade? spade. -spade +spade there's only one card will get me down. yeah. haven't i got it? no. no. -no it's gotta be one of them. +no it's gotta be one of them. these cards are well mixed up this time aren't they? -yeah th but they're all and i've got nothing to help you john. +yeah th but they're all and i've got nothing to help you john. oh look at that bastard. oh jack. that's what i've just had. @@ -18463,7 +18441,7 @@ mother? you're out. eighteen, twenty one, thirty one, thirty nine. frigging queen. -look at that was coming next time. +look at that was coming next time. your deal con. no, i dealt them. bloody hell. @@ -18491,20 +18469,20 @@ i did. do you fancy that ? with all them bloody fitters. thirty bloody nine. -i couldn't get a pigging every ja +i couldn't get a pigging every ja no. what did you want? -i wanted er the jack of spades the king of hearts or a ace of diamonds. +i wanted er the jack of spades the king of hearts or a ace of diamonds. and you kept picking the jacks, the red jacks? yeah. i had a load of rubbish and all. -i i i i finished up with four sixes and a three four five +i i i i finished up with four sixes and a three four five you you couldn't think six of clubs. you could possibly go all that way and not pick a hand up that would make you something. no. thirty nine. -everything that she chucked away. +everything that she chucked away. i was splitting my hand up in the end cos they were gone. i wanted to but i couldn't pick them up cos i hadn't got enough. and i couldn't get out cos i hadn't got a hand. @@ -18520,7 +18498,7 @@ oh yeah. is that the one you wanted? ace of diamonds yeah. stupid -oh well i i think i'm gonna get a long way . +oh well i i think i'm gonna get a long way . jesus . that's the first four. i don't think i dare look any further. @@ -18531,18 +18509,18 @@ oh aye. aye said the fly. here's my little i said cos i shall phone the bank first thing monday and i shall say right, he's took the car so you can run to him for the money cos you'll be getting none out of me. -then i had a letter from the social security. +then i had a letter from the social security. they've been paying me thirty nine pound sixty haven't they? -and i've been, been to fifty five pound seventy five every week. +and i've been, been to fifty five pound seventy five every week. oh. so you'll get a bit back then? yeah. so i think -it's better +it's better well they're on about backdating it to the third. -but if i write back and say i haven't actually had any wages since the seventeenth of january i might get it backdated from then. +but if i write back and say i haven't actually had any wages since the seventeenth of january i might get it backdated from then. what's that? -did do what he said he was gonna do then? +did do what he said he was gonna do then? yeah. oh. have you had any repercussions? @@ -18553,9 +18531,9 @@ what, with all the tyres done? yeah. how'd they get there? well i dunno. -michael said it were there at erm five to twelve, when he erm quarter past twelve when he come out of work they got in it. +michael said it were there at erm five to twelve, when he erm quarter past twelve when he come out of work they got in it. but he don't know what time they got there cos he don't work in that warehouse. -so he was gonna ask if they got in late because they could have had time to get it repaired. +so he was gonna ask if they got in late because they could have had time to get it repaired. oh i see. did mum tell you we went to see the bachelors last night? yeah. @@ -18564,12 +18542,12 @@ yeah, lovely. had a bottle of champers between us. sherry and champers. yeah. -wonder we weren't er legless. -did you erm could you have drove on that what you drunk alright? +wonder we weren't er legless. +did you erm could you have drove on that what you drunk alright? yeah. i had some chips that's why i was only see what's her name barbara said oh i daren't drink any, i'm driving. -i never thought, well you and john were drinking driving . +i never thought, well you and john were drinking driving . where do you get this from then? a lady come up yesterday to see if i would do it. it's for that. @@ -18581,7 +18559,7 @@ so what are you fighting for now, mm? stop it! oh his face, look . -oh benjy did you get he's still +oh benjy did you get he's still benjy. here. no i ain't. @@ -18618,7 +18596,7 @@ are you looking for more milk? he can't be hungry. he's looking for something. tried him with anything the other day when he were like this. -gave him more +gave him more perhaps he wants a drink now. i gave danny a bed bath yesterday. a bed bath? @@ -18626,19 +18604,19 @@ why? three mornings on the trot i've been up there and i've walked in the front door and i can hear him downstairs snoring, still in bed. i said to him the other morning i said do that again i said look, i'll get you out of bed. i said i'll give you a bed bath. -and i went in his bedroom and there he was snoring away. -so i run the cold tap, got a cupful of water in me hand and went ooosh! -oh he . -he soon . +and i went in his bedroom and there he was snoring away. +so i run the cold tap, got a cupful of water in me hand and went ooosh! +oh he . +he soon . he said i remembered last night he said if i was in bed i was gonna get wet. he said i thought someone was here he said cos i could smell fag smoke. he said i thought someone was here. penny's finished work now hasn't she? yeah. -yeah we're gonna try this erm i'm gonna try this thing. -see if we can get in to some more adult edu education while we're off. +yeah we're gonna try this erm i'm gonna try this thing. +see if we can get in to some more adult edu education while we're off. it's ridiculous. -what name did me and danny come up with?mum and pam for driving school? +what name did me and danny come up with?mum and pam for driving school? oh, hinge and bracket driving academy was it? you cheeky devil! it was danny that thought of it, hinge and bracket driving academy . @@ -18646,11 +18624,11 @@ be a good'un yeah hinge and bracket. hinge and gasket. yeah. -yeah it's erm it's just such a long drawn out palaver they're getting, you know? +yeah it's erm it's just such a long drawn out palaver they're getting, you know? you don't even want that do you? no, don't want nothing. -just wanna be left alone. -he has a few swigs and then . +just wanna be left alone. +he has a few swigs and then . but he don't . don't want it do you? do you want it? @@ -18664,14 +18642,14 @@ is wall knocked out, yeah. is is kev doing it? yeah. -i'm gonna +i'm gonna so who's going who's going tonight? erm david? and lydia up are they? yeah. erm and joe -joey and michelle are joey and erm what's her name are going to germany ain't they for four years? +joey and michelle are joey and erm what's her name are going to germany ain't they for four years? yeah. what's, what's joe's last name? yeah. @@ -18685,10 +18663,10 @@ oh you're wide awake aren't you? kimmy and kimmy found a ferret down the field yesterday. his own ferret oh did he? -went missing for about four hours and when it eventually bolted out this hole it run straight up him and curled up to him. +went missing for about four hours and when it eventually bolted out this hole it run straight up him and curled up to him. did it? and he couldn't make out why cos he's quite vicious, his ferret. -he's got some new ferreting land and erm and when he went to put him in his box there was a ferret already in it but it's absolutely infested with these sheep tics. +he's got some new ferreting land and erm and when he went to put him in his box there was a ferret already in it but it's absolutely infested with these sheep tics. ugh. oh dear. so they've had to sit and pull @@ -18701,7 +18679,7 @@ who's that? i'll go love cos you've got the babby. oh good gawd. oh it looks like your mother. -it looks looks looks like my mother, yeah dunnit. +it looks looks looks like my mother, yeah dunnit. ? yeah. yeah. @@ -18709,7 +18687,7 @@ come on in. come in benj. who is it? dunno. -someone asking for you and rudy. +someone asking for you and rudy. hello! what are you doing here ? hey look who's here. @@ -18769,7 +18747,7 @@ well you're not going surely? well we're not stopping but we're not going anywhere. rudy ain't going nowhere and . are we going? -i said yeah +i said yeah love, can you just put them bottles out? what have we got? a little boy or a little girl? @@ -18780,7 +18758,7 @@ you look well anyway. ooh aren't you beautiful? aren't you beautiful? how old? -er three weeks. +er three weeks. four weeks. four weeks wednesday isn't it? four weeks wednesday. @@ -18799,17 +18777,17 @@ look at him, his wi eyes are wide open. you're just nosy tyler. tyler . mm . -you know, you're +you know, you're no, he was he was only four, five fourteen how is it you, you've kept your weight down then viv? -he's seven eight now. +he's seven eight now. i haven't, i've put it back on love. you haven't. i have. not all of it. well not all of it. but i've put it back quite -i wondered where you'd got, we did ring one night couple of weeks ago but we didn't get an answer and i said well i didn't know whether you'd perhaps popped up the club. +i wondered where you'd got, we did ring one night couple of weeks ago but we didn't get an answer and i said well i didn't know whether you'd perhaps popped up the club. it were a saturday night cos i was in. i probably be working . i've packed in work now you see. @@ -18824,7 +18802,7 @@ oh. you're beautiful. you going back to our mummy now? going back to our mummy? -you can tell +you can tell so how's all your kids? are they all alright? oh they're all fine, aye. @@ -18850,7 +18828,7 @@ now we're going out. shopping. ha! we're going shopping now. -now you look better i'll tell you that. +now you look better i'll tell you that. yeah i'm alright. i'm alright love. @@ -18865,7 +18843,7 @@ oh and that's for the kids. oh yeah. pam's got another outfit for, for the other one. she picked the two up. -i, she should have picked the one up and i but +i, she should have picked the one up and i but yeah alright. oh he's fine. okay. @@ -18901,14 +18879,14 @@ oh it's great to see you. i'm glad you've come. might just have been the what? -just as i said they just phoned, kenny just phoned and said are you coming horseracing? +just as i said they just phoned, kenny just phoned and said are you coming horseracing? i said yeah, well there's nothing else to do. -i get fed up with bloody cards, so erm i said we'll go. +i get fed up with bloody cards, so erm i said we'll go. it's only up the road. it's only in the local flats, you know flat but they always come eh? -they always come just just as i'm getting on and getting well luckily enough i got me me lounge done first thing this morning. +they always come just just as i'm getting on and getting well luckily enough i got me me lounge done first thing this morning. so what's been going on? nothing? everything? @@ -18929,15 +18907,15 @@ no in actual fact we were only saying the other day that, you know,sugar viv? no thanks. george? oh aye. -well got a big place in nottingham you see. +well got a big place in nottingham you see. yeah. mm. so you can imagine that it wants something done. -it fenced up security-wise and everything else so we've been on it overtime and and painting and decorating and getting the -do you want some viv, before i go? +it fenced up security-wise and everything else so we've been on it overtime and and painting and decorating and getting the +do you want some viv, before i go? eh? everything. -no +no bit of toast or something? no you're alright love. georgie? @@ -18951,27 +18929,27 @@ no. no. you get yourself off. you get yourself off. -i'm not going till oneish. +i'm not going till oneish. have you been nicking bloody recipes again? -no these are what i promised er promised joy. +no these are what i promised er promised joy. what are they? weightwatcher's diets. -well have you decided you're not gonna do anything about it? -i think it's just a matter of losing the +well have you decided you're not gonna do anything about it? +i think it's just a matter of losing the yeah. -no i might er might decide to do something about it if i get the inspiration. -i'm just getting now because erm erm i've been for an aud not an audition . +no i might er might decide to do something about it if i get the inspiration. +i'm just getting now because erm erm i've been for an aud not an audition . wrong word. i've been for an interview with mencap. oh aye? -and erm i didn't get the actual job i went for but they put me on the, on the relief register so that i go round to different people's homes or different big hospitals and different mencap homes relieving people when they're on holiday or if they're short of staff or something like that. +and erm i didn't get the actual job i went for but they put me on the, on the relief register so that i go round to different people's homes or different big hospitals and different mencap homes relieving people when they're on holiday or if they're short of staff or something like that. so yeah. -erm so er i'm waiting to hear, so that i'm getting irritable at the minute cos a the money is going and b being out of work, being here all day. +erm so er i'm waiting to hear, so that i'm getting irritable at the minute cos a the money is going and b being out of work, being here all day. it's sending me crackers. i'm used to working day and night. i mean it's very hard to do neither. -husband he wants some beans. +husband he wants some beans. who does? him. i'll beans him. @@ -18986,14 +18964,14 @@ well. what have you gone back up to now, eleven? eleven. but i got down to ten stone. -and but the reason that i got up to ten stone is because christmas . +and but the reason that i got up to ten stone is because christmas . and any i stopped going to weightwatchers. i'm eleven one now. but to go down to ten, that's good. it is keeping it off though, isn't it? once you yeah. -once you've erm got it off you've gotta keep it off. +once you've erm got it off you've gotta keep it off. that is the art in doing it. what are you doing in here? giving him some beans. @@ -19008,18 +18986,18 @@ sit down mate. ah. and i got to ten seven on that. and then i stopped going. -and then i rejoined -so you've got a tomorrow? +and then i rejoined +so you've got a tomorrow? . and i got i was yeah. -i got down to ten -nowadays wanting to work on saturdays and i said right i've had enough friday. +i got down to ten +nowadays wanting to work on saturdays and i said right i've had enough friday. oh yeah. and so were you disappointed when you put it back on? yeah. -but, having said all that +but, having said all that yeah when i finish on friday george i've had enough yeah. you know? @@ -19029,10 +19007,10 @@ i'm not eating meals, i'm eating snacks. snacks. and i'm . -and they're all starch, they're all potatoes and i'll have egg and chips and bread and more bread. +and they're all starch, they're all potatoes and i'll have egg and chips and bread and more bread. i very rarely sit down and have a meal now. no. -and that's erm but it is good. +and that's erm but it is good. and i would er i would . anyway, you can have them. and they're the daily diets are they? @@ -19049,7 +19027,7 @@ couple of hours. there was a lot of low fat cheese. hard cheese. -just near er m forty two there's a lot of er roadworks and there were a +just near er m forty two there's a lot of er roadworks and there were a i've just had me friends down from er wide load. from jersey. @@ -19063,8 +19041,8 @@ no it never come off. no. aggravation they had over there? yeah. -i've got adrian -i see they're still saddam hussein's still flipping messing about as well. +i've got adrian +i see they're still saddam hussein's still flipping messing about as well. what ? yeah. oh, good. @@ -19074,7 +19052,7 @@ he's got to get rid of all that flipping that's er adrian? yeah yeah. -factories for making weapons he's got to +factories for making weapons he's got to that's right. otherwise they're gonna flipping crucify him. how's erm it's craig innit? @@ -19091,8 +19069,8 @@ no. never do it. is he? he's learnt it the hard way now and he's . -and er well -see the old aircraft carriers and destroyers are standing by again. +and er well +see the old aircraft carriers and destroyers are standing by again. yeah. oh, good. yeah. @@ -19109,15 +19087,15 @@ the one we went to spain with. you know we went to the one with the parrot? yes. -he's on drugs fourteen years of . -so we've had hell and high water with -er tracy? +he's on drugs fourteen years of . +so we've had hell and high water with +er tracy? my mate val in jersey, she's been ever so ill. -she's got +she's got is craig still dj-ing then? yeah, aha, yeah. so he's doing well is he? -well he is and he isn't. +well he is and he isn't. oh gawd. it's like talking to a . oh yeah. @@ -19126,7 +19104,7 @@ body. of your body. yeah. and then it cuts it every bit down into cent ce cent cent centimetres you know? -and it erm he can see +and it erm he can see that's the trouble with the youngsters mate. they make the money now and it goes like flipping water. yeah. @@ -19135,48 +19113,48 @@ oh. they don't realize sometimes there's hard times to come. you want something put aside mate. oh aye, yeah. -quick and easy recipe book -keep telling him and that's it. +quick and easy recipe book +keep telling him and that's it. it's a twelve week . are you with me? yeah. -so ideally if you looked at that come to that. -if you worked it out start in week twelve +so ideally if you looked at that come to that. +if you worked it out start in week twelve i've still got them two speakers here, he wanted them. have you? he hasn't said any more about them. yeah. bet he's forgot all about it. yeah. -what does he want +what does he want well he can afford . eh? -i don't know +i don't know they cost me three hundred and fifty, they're brand new. and i said to him you can have it for two, two fifty. you've saved an hundred quid. -i'll tell him +i'll tell him speakers ? yeah. i'll tell him when i get back. yeah. gonna have to save like mad then to buy them. -he will do if he gets it into his head but he got in trouble you see, got in with the wrong crowd and +he will do if he gets it into his head but he got in trouble you see, got in with the wrong crowd and mm. a lot of money off him and all this lot. -he just learnt learning now. +he just learnt learning now. yeah. adrian and andrea are alright are they? oh aye. just said we just bought in fran er franchise for a . yeah. yeah. -have you started or you started ? +have you started or you started ? week we started. been at it three week now, so mm. -erm and then if you that's got to last you all day through +erm and then if you that's got to last you all day through yeah. say you didn't use your so your firm's busy,? @@ -19184,24 +19162,24 @@ no, not really. not busy? no. we're very slack now. -the same as us everything's slow now. +the same as us everything's slow now. i know. just, just before christmas we had no job. and that were right till the end of january. -we've had, we we had stock in our blooming warehouse since what november? +we've had, we we had stock in our blooming warehouse since what november? mm. people didn't want it. no. -it's only now just started now. +it's only now just started now. mm. yeah? yeah. -it's isn't it? +it's isn't it? . -and that's how you know whether you're or not. +and that's how you know whether you're or not. but you've also got your option of calories. right? -which you are allowed +which you are allowed yeah, we could have done without all this bloody hassle down there. yeah. you know? @@ -19211,7 +19189,7 @@ mind you the firm that was in there blue bag i mean they abused the bloody place aye. they knocked it about something terrible. yeah. -so i mean sooner or later would have been had to to do, do up you know? +so i mean sooner or later would have been had to to do, do up you know? mm. and these people decide whether they want the place, and the ideal place for them. whether they want so @@ -19221,7 +19199,7 @@ it's fourteen to twenty one. what's that. mm. eh? -opt er optional calories . +opt er optional calories . well there ain't much that'd be fourteen to twenty, twenty calories is there? no. you've got fourteen er fourteen options. @@ -19231,8 +19209,8 @@ thing is to do . it's quite easy actually. this is a job if i don't lose it, feeding my dog beans one at a time. won't it bubby? -yeah i ain't, i ain't done any work here rea really since, you know done up the place. -well you seen it last year when you came and saw the garden and +yeah i ain't, i ain't done any work here rea really since, you know done up the place. +well you seen it last year when you came and saw the garden and yeah. the back bit yeah. @@ -19240,20 +19218,20 @@ i've only just tidied up the front again last weekend. got it all sorted out. course with the winter and everything you see you can't do much outside. no that's true. -you've got to cut all your grass in the the back there but and with it being wet and +you've got to cut all your grass in the the back there but and with it being wet and and i've got to roll it again with the roller. done a patio . you've done the patio have you? -is your grass come up alright in the back now? +is your grass come up alright in the back now? oh she's had that altered. she's got us pond in now. -no got fish for it? +no got fish for it? she's done it no. little pond she's having. oh. -be for water flowers, you know? +be for water flowers, you know? yeah, water lilies and so on in it, yeah. -so you'll not know it when you come cos it's all fenced off. +so you'll not know it when you come cos it's all fenced off. yeah. we're all pri we're all private it's all fenced off? @@ -19261,11 +19239,11 @@ now. yeah. oh aye. yeah. -course in your area putting up the fences . +course in your area putting up the fences . oh it's all done now. aye. and you're . -and your optional calories is nought to seven hundred +and your optional calories is nought to seven hundred i've put two trees in down the back. i've put an apple tree down one side and i've got a victoria plum on the other side. oh mm. @@ -19314,7 +19292,7 @@ and as soon as i get up i say you coming? and he's up there like a shot. you know? mm. -at night sometimes i'm sleeping and i put me hand like that and he comes up and lays right across the back of my pillow. +at night sometimes i'm sleeping and i put me hand like that and he comes up and lays right across the back of my pillow. that's right. yeah. yeah. @@ -19327,38 +19305,38 @@ come on. come and see dad. benjy, come and see dad. come on. -he skips over for the bloody +he skips over for the bloody oh aye. there's one there, there's two over there. -sometimes he hides it down the back of his seat here. +sometimes he hides it down the back of his seat here. chucks it down the back. oh aye they . and he knows, he knows where they are as well. oh aye yeah. yeah. -over there they're just doing microwave cooking you know . +over there they're just doing microwave cooking you know . don't like meat done in the microwave, do you? no, i don't. i don't mind chicken. i'll leave you them. -and then i can put these together, but that one that one -i suppose basically it's a matter of getting . -yeah i ain't been for blooming ages. +and then i can put these together, but that one that one +i suppose basically it's a matter of getting . +yeah i ain't been for blooming ages. no? that's right. what -you can have in a week or a day. +you can have in a week or a day. i find that is easier for me. -oh i used to do i used to do bradford wakefield you know? +oh i used to do i used to do bradford wakefield you know? mm. -and they took another driver on and he does a lot of that, the runs there you see. -i mainly do now like nottingham and mansfield and leicester and birmingham all round that way you know? +and they took another driver on and he does a lot of that, the runs there you see. +i mainly do now like nottingham and mansfield and leicester and birmingham all round that way you know? mm. -i don't even do now. +i don't even do now. no? -mind you i could now. +mind you i could now. mm. -until you get to london +until you get to london ah london is it mm? i mainly do round the midlands now. mm. @@ -19367,9 +19345,9 @@ mm. to run all over the bloody place and it's a shame. if i'd have known you were coming i wouldn't have booked going out. -oh get yourself off. +oh get yourself off. if i don't do something with me life i spend my life sitting here all day -here you are +here you are stop this dog of mine scratching all the while. i shall brush it and you won't like it ben. i've just give you one good brush haven't i? @@ -19382,7 +19360,7 @@ aye i thought we had. have you? yeah because you fetched kiddies up, didn't she? yeah. -she's just up me photo of the kids look. +she's just up me photo of the kids look. that's them. yeah. don't you lean over, i'm not scratching your tummy. @@ -19397,39 +19375,39 @@ he's absolutely spoilt. worse than any kid. aren't you? eh? -yes i think adrian will be +yes i think adrian will be it's a pity you don't feel like standing up and racing cos it's lovely . yeah. yeah we're going down there now. -it'd be a bit hectic for you though cos it'll be, yeah it's cold but it's uneven ground and that's +it'd be a bit hectic for you though cos it'll be, yeah it's cold but it's uneven ground and that's oh. mm. -you w you're not do you? +you w you're not do you? . see the thing is he's gonna run us up. -it's only just newton bromswell which is just up the road. +it's only just newton bromswell which is just up the road. but you see if you take a car it's eight pound to park a car. ooh! -but if you go in, if you walk in it's free but you, you can't walk there because it's well you're talking about five mile out into the country. +but if you go in, if you walk in it's free but you, you can't walk there because it's well you're talking about five mile out into the country. mm. -and although we're not so far from here cos we're this is newton road and the next town on er village on is newton bromswell. +and although we're not so far from here cos we're this is newton road and the next town on er village on is newton bromswell. mm. but you see if you're coming from hyam you've got to come all the way through chilveston and that way oh yeah, yeah. -and erm cos then pam ph penny phoned and said shall, it's her who's the horsy fanatic but it's lovely. +and erm cos then pam ph penny phoned and said shall, it's her who's the horsy fanatic but it's lovely. yeah we just go and have a pound on the nose you know and er well that's it. you've got to. -there's about ten ten runners. +there's about ten ten runners. they only do it once a year on the flat. -er thursday night erm we went to the gala at the new gala club. +er thursday night erm we went to the gala at the new gala club. you know connells' all been took over by gala? yeah. yeah. -and erm they had their opening, big opening night thursday so he was, he was out, he was up at half past four that morning so i thought well we might as well go. +and erm they had their opening, big opening night thursday so he was, he was out, he was up at half past four that morning so i thought well we might as well go. so i rang mum at four o'clock. -i said do you fancy going out tonight cos it's the bachelors who opened it +i said do you fancy going out tonight cos it's the bachelors who opened it ooh that's alright then isn't it? -so erm so went about half past five. +so erm so went about half past five. we got there for about ten to six. they had a band called me and him on. they done all chas and dave. @@ -19440,16 +19418,16 @@ oh i bet that were great weren't it? yeah. it were yeah. -then we had the local girls that do all this erm balls and +then we had the local girls that do all this erm balls and and twist er you know like the ra ra girls. yeah. -and then er as i say the bachelors come on at seven until eight. -they were rea they were they were good. +and then er as i say the bachelors come on at seven until eight. +they were rea they were they were good. i mean yeah. yeah. -not particularly my cup of tea but mum enjoyed them and they got everybody going and and then we had a good game of bingo. -we had a sherry when we went in and erm bottle of champers on the table and balloons and +not particularly my cup of tea but mum enjoyed them and they got everybody going and and then we had a good game of bingo. +we had a sherry when we went in and erm bottle of champers on the table and balloons and ooh. tell you what she's living it up more now than she did before! well, you have to make something. @@ -19459,7 +19437,7 @@ and it's massive. it's an ex-tesco's warehouse. mm. it's absolutely massive. -but every night they have every saturday night they have a cabaret on and tonight it's renee and renata. +but every night they have every saturday night they have a cabaret on and tonight it's renee and renata. ooh! oh my god. yeah . @@ -19473,11 +19451,11 @@ and the houses are a thousand pounds each. so i mean ooh! yeah. -yeah, so i mean if you have a win yeah, and a woman that sat on the next table to me. -touching my shoulder she said to me i want all the ones, all the ones. +yeah, so i mean if you have a win yeah, and a woman that sat on the next table to me. +touching my shoulder she said to me i want all the ones, all the ones. i said go on, you'll get it you'll get it . and i looked up and said it's here! -and she laughed and she said here here here she went like this and i shou shouted as well. +and she laughed and she said here here here she went like this and i shou shouted as well. mum said good job you shouted, they wouldn't have heard her. i mean she must have been in her seventies. but we, we got it and she @@ -19489,7 +19467,7 @@ i mean it's just a matter of you know, being able to afford to go and yeah. and keep it going. i mean i used to love me bingo. -i mean once upon a time nothing was , but i've spent two and a half thousand pound if not more since i've been off work. +i mean once upon a time nothing was , but i've spent two and a half thousand pound if not more since i've been off work. yeah. you know, the dole don't keep us. well no. @@ -19507,22 +19485,22 @@ so i mean we're and the rest sometimes. i went well -i went down town yesterday and got some braising steak and it cost me five pounds sixty. +i went down town yesterday and got some braising steak and it cost me five pounds sixty. i know. it's crazy. and that's just for three of them. i mean i, four of them. i don't eat it you see. -that's without your and that's without your bits to go with it, your veg. +that's without your and that's without your bits to go with it, your veg. that's right yeah. and then cooking it. i mean i know. gas and electric's expensive now isn't it? i know. -and i keep thinking to myself well something will come along, something'll happen, but i i think what it is there is no jobs round here at the moment. -i think what it is is that i feel if i go into something for the sake of going into it to earn money i shall be absolutely bored with me life. -i f i shall feel as if we've been from here cos when i was first married we lived up round the next road. +and i keep thinking to myself well something will come along, something'll happen, but i i think what it is there is no jobs round here at the moment. +i think what it is is that i feel if i go into something for the sake of going into it to earn money i shall be absolutely bored with me life. +i f i shall feel as if we've been from here cos when i was first married we lived up round the next road. and i shall feel as if i've got up, been round the world yeah. and come back to, to where i were twenty six year ago and @@ -19538,35 +19516,35 @@ mm. yeah. i mean i went out because i mean the house does get boring. -i i got really really fed up. +i i got really really fed up. erm i mean i were working at library. i mean that were no problem. -but then when i left library i just got fed up and i went and went down to help sue didn't i? +but then when i left library i just got fed up and i went and went down to help sue didn't i? and i thoroughly enjoyed it. yeah. mm. it's meeting the people. -but now she's left and she's had a baby and i carried on because he wanted it, the the new landlord wanted me to to stop on and help out. +but now she's left and she's had a baby and i carried on because he wanted it, the the new landlord wanted me to to stop on and help out. oh my giddy aunt. -and i would go in and i i never said nothing to him at first did i?but i just couldn't take it any more. +and i would go in and i i never said nothing to him at first did i?but i just couldn't take it any more. mm. and it was either thinking about the wage packet at end of week which i was at first. mm. -and then i were coming home and i were, i were really awful. +and then i were coming home and i were, i were really awful. and i thought why should i? -and then on thursday i went in to work and i had had enough. +and then on thursday i went in to work and i had had enough. and i come home and i says to him, i'm not having this no more. i said no,. mm. he says well if you want to pack it in love bless you. pack in. -and i did and to be quite honest, i mean it wasn't the money really when you think about it because at end of day, forty six pound he were spending in pub anyway. -so i were working for nothing really. +and i did and to be quite honest, i mean it wasn't the money really when you think about it because at end of day, forty six pound he were spending in pub anyway. +so i were working for nothing really. yeah. but he he were getting cos you were going out and having a drink er on er tuesdays thursdays saturdays and sundays. -whereas now, i mean we don't go. +whereas now, i mean we don't go. you don't go. no. and well i, we even considered me and my sister even considered going back into driving instruction. @@ -19578,7 +19556,7 @@ no? no, i've got to take it all again. you're talking about sixteen, seventeen hundred pound to get you through. yeah. -but you see with this bank thing with the government, you can have a loan i think it's up to about four thousand pound like a restart. +but you see with this bank thing with the government, you can have a loan i think it's up to about four thousand pound like a restart. and it's a free loan for fifteen months. mm. and then on the sixteenth month you've gotta pay it back. @@ -19590,20 +19568,20 @@ but at the end of the day, it ain't really what i want to do. no. i mean i, i want to get into mental health care. mm. -and and erm if i i'm hoping i'll like it when i get in there, but something tells me i would. +and and erm if i i'm hoping i'll like it when i get in there, but something tells me i would. well as i say i went for this interview and she phoned me last sunday didn't she? i went on the monday for the, to the house. then on the tuesday i went to the hospital. -and erm she phoned me up on the sunday. -she said i'm i'm just ringing to tell you joy that you didn't get you you haven't been successful with your application this time. -but she said erm i wanna just tell you all the others that haven't made it, we've just said well i'm sorry. +and erm she phoned me up on the sunday. +she said i'm i'm just ringing to tell you joy that you didn't get you you haven't been successful with your application this time. +but she said erm i wanna just tell you all the others that haven't made it, we've just said well i'm sorry. that's it. -but, with you, we feel you've got so much to offer and we don't really wanna just say no and and and it would make you feel oh blow it i'm not gonna do it. +but, with you, we feel you've got so much to offer and we don't really wanna just say no and and and it would make you feel oh blow it i'm not gonna do it. mm. -she said i feel that there is a place for you in the health, in this mental health service. -but she said what it is is basically we're all just starting from the bottom because this new idea of where they're buying small homes and making them small communities +she said i feel that there is a place for you in the health, in this mental health service. +but she said what it is is basically we're all just starting from the bottom because this new idea of where they're buying small homes and making them small communities yeah. -erm they're all starting from new. +erm they're all starting from new. they're all been institutionalized up till recently. that's right yeah. so they're gradually buying houses in certain areas. @@ -19622,19 +19600,19 @@ and she is she? yeah she's a carer. what the old people? -old people and er and handicapped kids. -erm she's teaching erm she's teaching handicapped now at er hilltop school. -er seven to eleven i think it is. -erm but they are not the really really disabled kids. +old people and er and handicapped kids. +erm she's teaching erm she's teaching handicapped now at er hilltop school. +er seven to eleven i think it is. +erm but they are not the really really disabled kids. no. they're, they are the the mental ones. yeah. -erm +erm cos they're mentally sick or mentally handicapped? mentally retarded. er me men yeah mentally retarded. -they just need a little help like with feeding or or if they throw a tantrum -yeah mentally handicapped more than mentally sick. +they just need a little help like with feeding or or if they throw a tantrum +yeah mentally handicapped more than mentally sick. you see the ones i wanted yeah. to do. @@ -19642,16 +19620,16 @@ i wanted to work with people that had had er severe depression. ex alcoholics, schizophrenics. aye. where you don't do anything like that. -you just work on a plan where that i at the er at the beginning of the day you're, you're given your people to watch. +you just work on a plan where that i at the er at the beginning of the day you're, you're given your people to watch. so every mortal thing that person does you note. like if he doesn't wash, you don't wash them. you note that they haven't done it. mm. yeah. yeah. -and then you see you come along where you're pushing them to live on their own and you make suggestions. +and then you see you come along where you're pushing them to live on their own and you make suggestions. that's right yeah. -and erm i went to a place in and that's what i wanted to do. +and erm i went to a place in and that's what i wanted to do. but you see they ain't got no places here. no. erm and it's a shame. @@ -19670,13 +19648,13 @@ whereas now that's right. th they're coming out into community so you're seeing more of them. oh yeah. -and th th there's more but i mean the facilities for them is there? -well you see and i've also put in for a job for the the marina at northampton which is another mental home. -but that's for a mobility assistant where i go in and befriend somebody and they employ me to take them somewhere for two hours. +and th th there's more but i mean the facilities for them is there? +well you see and i've also put in for a job for the the marina at northampton which is another mental home. +but that's for a mobility assistant where i go in and befriend somebody and they employ me to take them somewhere for two hours. whether it be yeah. -pictures or shopping or round the market or just for a walk or for a meal. -whatever you they employ +pictures or shopping or round the market or just for a walk or for a meal. +whatever you they employ yeah. me, but it's five pound eighty for a two hour session. well you've got to think about going to northampton. @@ -19691,12 +19669,12 @@ yeah, yeah. that's right. do you want me to fetch a pillow? no, you're alright love. -there's plenty of cushions +there's plenty of cushions no, you're alright. -and erm so you see you're, you're throwing money to get money which is, which is a bit stupid. +and erm so you see you're, you're throwing money to get money which is, which is a bit stupid. that's right. pointless . -but then i erm she phoned me yesterday and she said to me have you had any professional lifting erm lessons at all. +but then i erm she phoned me yesterday and she said to me have you had any professional lifting erm lessons at all. i said no. none whatsoever. so she said oh, that's alright, i've got it all in me head what, what i've got with you. @@ -19705,16 +19683,16 @@ mm. mm. but she's offered me a relief post as i say, where i go round and help but she don't know how many hours it will be. mm. -but i think i've got to get in and i've got to think well this next six months erm i've gotta work hard to get in regardless of whether i go voluntary or whether i go to a hospital and learn it at me own you know, expense. +but i think i've got to get in and i've got to think well this next six months erm i've gotta work hard to get in regardless of whether i go voluntary or whether i go to a hospital and learn it at me own you know, expense. yeah. i think i've got to put something in to get something out. i've never been a person that gets something for nothing. for nothing. no. -i've always had to work very hard but at the end of the day i'm, i'm self-satisfied because i'm i'm doing what i want to do. +i've always had to work very hard but at the end of the day i'm, i'm self-satisfied because i'm i'm doing what i want to do. and i do, yeah. -think to myself well it's six months i wish i'd have done it in august, now. +think to myself well it's six months i wish i'd have done it in august, now. mm. mm. wish i'd have took it up in august. @@ -19724,9 +19702,9 @@ yeah. that's right, yeah. you see and yeah. -it's like everything e but th s saying that we had him. +it's like everything e but th s saying that we had him. we had him in september didn't we? -and i mean he took a lot of rehousing cos he come from a a a family that hadn't really cared for him. +and i mean he took a lot of rehousing cos he come from a a a family that hadn't really cared for him. i mean he's a happy little soul, isn't he, in in certain respects? i don't think he'd been ill-treated, but he's took a lot of love and a lot of attention mm. @@ -19737,9 +19715,9 @@ and feel comfortable. but i never leave him. he's never left is he, at all? if i go out i take him to mum's. -or if, if i go out rudy'll stop in. +or if, if i go out rudy'll stop in. or if he goes out i stop in. -it's he's took our life over in a certain respect +it's he's took our life over in a certain respect mm. mm. but he's, he's brought us a lot of pleasure hasn't he? @@ -19757,7 +19735,7 @@ yes. filthy. i have to sit him in the bath and i think june had one didn't she? -she had er hers was er more, whereas yours is nice and white, here were all grey and black. +she had er hers was er more, whereas yours is nice and white, here were all grey and black. yeah. yeah. it were beautiful. @@ -19771,10 +19749,10 @@ you've gotta pick him up like a baby. mm. you coming with dad? are you coming to your dad ? -well my brother the only person he does it to is him. +well my brother the only person he does it to is him. he growls like mad at gary. doesn't he? -i've never heard a dog he don't do it to anybody else. +i've never heard a dog he don't do it to anybody else. sometimes he'll growl at rudy when he comes up to say ta ta in the morning. that's because he don't want me to go to work. i have to bath him two or three times a week. @@ -19790,7 +19768,7 @@ but this is all hair this is. and he's like a teddy bear. he's mummy's teddy boy. he's a teddy bear. -you'll have to remember rudy he's had nothing to eat +you'll have to remember rudy he's had nothing to eat he's a teddy bear. for a day. he's ever so finicky. @@ -19803,38 +19781,38 @@ listen, i'm gonna have to go and get you go and get ready. myself sorted out. erm -but you're not going you're not rushing off are you? +but you're not going you're not rushing off are you? what? well i should be back at five. about f yeah, cos you've got to pick us up. cos pam's son's going to germany for four years tomorrow. -he's just come back from belize erm, and he's they're, they're posted to germany and they leave tomorrow. +he's just come back from belize erm, and he's they're, they're posted to germany and they leave tomorrow. who's that, joe? joe. no i j i don't think joe , i saw what's her name? -erm mi michelle when i was going to the bank. +erm mi michelle when i was going to the bank. debbie. debbie. -and erm she said she'll tell joe and they'll probably pop up. +and erm she said she'll tell joe and they'll probably pop up. they may come up tomorrow, i don't know. -i don't think it's, they're going before don't think he's going before tuesday. -oh well they're posted abroad anyway. +i don't think it's, they're going before don't think he's going before tuesday. +oh well they're posted abroad anyway. and they're all going out for dinner tonight. mm. but pam's coming to the racing with us this afternoon. baby stop scratching. stop it. -erm and er so, i said to him if he runs us up with the car and then he can bring it back. -and if he slips back and pick, picks us up about i don't know, pam'll tell you when she comes. +erm and er so, i said to him if he runs us up with the car and then he can bring it back. +and if he slips back and pick, picks us up about i don't know, pam'll tell you when she comes. i should think about quarter to five. mm. -cos the last race is at five o'clock i think, but i mean it's only if we go couple of hours. -and erm i mean we've got nothing on then. -well george is working in morning so we shan't be stopping late. +cos the last race is at five o'clock i think, but i mean it's only if we go couple of hours. +and erm i mean we've got nothing on then. +well george is working in morning so we shan't be stopping late. cos he's got to be at work for what? six o'clock. are you? -so mm it were just a case of a flying visit cos we've not seen you for nearly twelve months. +so mm it were just a case of a flying visit cos we've not seen you for nearly twelve months. is it as long as that? mm. mm. @@ -19842,14 +19820,14 @@ it's over. it's over. mm i know. i know the time's flying. -well in actual fact to te to tell you the honest truth we've been so busy one way and another over the weekends haven't we? +well in actual fact to te to tell you the honest truth we've been so busy one way and another over the weekends haven't we? yeah. -and then erm we ain't even been to see barbara and her and her new house and they only live +and then erm we ain't even been to see barbara and her and her new house and they only live fourteen mile away. yeah. -she keeps ringing us up and saying are you are you are you coming? +she keeps ringing us up and saying are you are you are you coming? are you coming up to see us? -but i don't get time, you know? +but i don't get time, you know? by the time we get home and and finished. this little dog, he's got something . what are you itching for? @@ -19864,7 +19842,7 @@ he might have got a flea. he might have got a flea rudy. i doubt it . i dunno. -you see, see they do most dogs go down the fields. +you see, see they do most dogs go down the fields. quite possibly he has got a flea duck. i sprayed him with that stuff. ah well if he's @@ -19875,12 +19853,12 @@ will you come up the bedroom? what was that d d d? what's that, d d d? that stuff wasn't it? -i mean that stuff spots. -thing is he might lick it mightn't he? +i mean that stuff spots. +thing is he might lick it mightn't he? mm. yeah. he's alright. -i'll give you we erm we i've got s it's green and it's awful. +i'll give you we erm we i've got s it's green and it's awful. but it it's fantastic stuff. what is it, spray? no it's cream. @@ -19903,9 +19881,9 @@ down here. yeah. cos he wants a pair of shoes. oh alright. -well rudy can take you down to you know where to go tarrers but if you don't wanna go you're, you've got the telly. -you can stay and wh tell me what time you're think about going. -will you, shall you stop for an e stop for the evening? +well rudy can take you down to you know where to go tarrers but if you don't wanna go you're, you've got the telly. +you can stay and wh tell me what time you're think about going. +will you, shall you stop for an e stop for the evening? alright, or shall you it ain't up to me it's up to you. you're the, you're the driver and you've got to get up for work in the morning and everything else. @@ -19918,13 +19896,13 @@ you're going to work. oh dear. pack it in. let mummy give you a drop more spray. -rudy you +rudy you is your white boots alright here george? eh? your white boots. oh aye, yeah. use them at all? -aye i've once or twice. +aye i've once or twice. are you doing any drumming at all george? no. no he's packed up. @@ -19940,16 +19918,16 @@ here here here here here here here here here here oh dear. here. there's hardly anything in it. -but if he is +but if he is you see it it comes off -it comes off the grass you see -come on come on then, in the garden. +it comes off the grass you see +come on come on then, in the garden. oh. oh dear. i'm still no nearer georgie. eh? i'm still no nearer. -still you can decide what you're gonna do. +still you can decide what you're gonna do. you know him. well as i say you've no need to stay late late. i mean @@ -19958,7 +19936,7 @@ you will? well that's we'll be here when you come back. that's alright then. -and then er i don't know . +and then er i don't know . i'll put the heating on rudy. yeah. well viv is stopping in, you're going to town . @@ -19981,12 +19959,12 @@ just telling him. no. now you're putting in bloody flower ponds and all that sort of thing. water lilies and -when it gets established. +when it gets established. i mean it looks noth it looks nothing now. but, you can't rush nature can you? -so +so i mean it's like my garden out the back there. -i mean he runs up and down, he it used to be lovely, all the grass. +i mean he runs up and down, he it used to be lovely, all the grass. well it's gotta be done again, you know? cut and yeah. @@ -19996,9 +19974,9 @@ no. it's pointless anyway isn't it, really? yeah. yeah. -i mean i done all the front here last weekend -oh yes work's never finished. -you've still got your own brother. +i mean i done all the front here last weekend +oh yes work's never finished. +you've still got your own brother. right. can everybody see that? you see, you could say, surely there shouldn't be a weaning conflict, because an offspring should say to itself, okay, my mother wants to wean me, to have more offspring, but those offspring she's gonna have are my siblings, i'm very closely related to them. @@ -20010,10 +19988,10 @@ oh, yes, i've only just said it. right. this is the important point, you have to know it. that's the best way. -but this is the way er puts it, and i think it is a very good way of, of, of putting it, as both and say, the point is, that every individual offspring is twice as closely related to itself, as it is to its, to its siblings. +but this is the way er puts it, and i think it is a very good way of, of, of putting it, as both and say, the point is, that every individual offspring is twice as closely related to itself, as it is to its, to its siblings. so it's quite true of course, that the, the individual offspring wo may be affected by inaltruism. -in other words, erm,whateve the r is greater than c. do you remember our, our formula for penaltriate benefit of an altruistic act exceeds the cost discounted by the degree of that's between a half normally. -the offspring ought to be so put to that's perfectly true. +in other words, erm,whateve the r is greater than c. do you remember our, our formula for penaltriate benefit of an altruistic act exceeds the cost discounted by the degree of that's between a half normally. +the offspring ought to be so put to that's perfectly true. however, the point you have to erm, recall, is that if it's a conflict between parental investment in a sibling and parental investment in myself, i am twice as closely related to myself as i am to my sibling. so when my parent is handing out the parental investment, i will be selected to want the parent to give the investment to my sibling if the benefit is twice as great as it would be to myself. but if it's less than twice as great, i'll want it for myself. @@ -20024,10 +20002,10 @@ we've described it from the offspring's point of view. how does the parent see it? because the parent doesn't see it the same way. how does the parent see it?you, you're a parent, you've got a unit of reproductive success. -erm, what you mean, if, if one reacts about it +erm, what you mean, if, if one reacts about it mm. -bear in mind that see it but it's more likely to pass on energy units, because it's the stronger, you know. -it's more likely to reproduce it in itself. +bear in mind that see it but it's more likely to pass on energy units, because it's the stronger, you know. +it's more likely to reproduce it in itself. yes. yes, it might, it might, but, but, but now you're getting a little bit, you're getting a bit too, too sophisticated now, we're going to come on to that later. erm, we're looking at all other things being equal. @@ -20055,10 +20033,10 @@ let's, supposing that i am the parent. okay. i'm the parent p. here am i, parent p, okay. -i have two offspring, a and b which are smaller, little er a and b offspring a and offspring b, and they are exactly equal in eve every point of view, size, quality and animal okay. +i have two offspring, a and b which are smaller, little er a and b offspring a and offspring b, and they are exactly equal in eve every point of view, size, quality and animal okay. now, erm, supposing that er, i have ten units of parental investment, and i invest ten in a and ten in b because i'm equally related to both of them. okay. -now, supposing that i want a to do something for b, like in 's case,a to give up a food item for b. okay. +now, supposing that i want a to do something for b, like in 's case,a to give up a food item for b. okay. now as far as i'm concerned, if the benefit to b is greater, supposing for example, they're not the same age, sorry, i shouldn't have said that about being the same age. er, supposing they're not the same age. but supposing i invested equal amounts of parental investment in both and supposing that if offspring a gives two units of parental investment to offspring b, the benefit to b's reproductive success will be three minutes, which it could be, if b was younger. @@ -20072,7 +20050,7 @@ so, since i'm equally related to both, in other words, i have an equal number of therefore, i as a parent will be selected to want that kind of thing to happen. okay. you with me. -now, let's go back to what and say and look at it from offspring a's point of view. +now, let's go back to what and say and look at it from offspring a's point of view. offspring a looks at it differently, because offspring a says, my sibling b has only got half my genes, therefore i will make sacrifices for b, wherever b r and greater than c as we saw. now, in this case, the, the sacrifice is er, two units of reproductive success, they benefit er b by adding er, one unit of, of reproductive success to it. so the cost to me is two, er the benefit to my sibling is one, and the degree of relatedness er, is a half. @@ -20091,19 +20069,19 @@ three times half. sorry, three times a half. so, it's three units that i'm giving my siblings. right, three three. -the total benefit is three units of reproductive success, three times a half again, is one and a half, it's not erm, it's not the of two. +the total benefit is three units of reproductive success, three times a half again, is one and a half, it's not erm, it's not the of two. if you think about it, er, there are numbers that will, that will make it work. larger numbers. if erm, what would it have to be? it would have to be at least, erm, what would it have to be, it would have to be at least the benefit, yes, the benefit would have to be at least four on the, on the b's side, in order for that to work. anyway,the these erm, numbers don't matter, this is just an arbitrary example. -the fundamental point that you have to grasp is that parents want any transfers between their siblings that will result in a net gain for the, a, sorry, parents want any transfers between their offspring that result in a net gain for reproductive success. +the fundamental point that you have to grasp is that parents want any transfers between their siblings that will result in a net gain for the, a, sorry, parents want any transfers between their offspring that result in a net gain for reproductive success. it doesn't really matter to the parent, which offspring has gained, as long as there is a net gain. all other things being equal. the offspring, however, don't take the same view. for them, all other things being equal, they will only be selected to make a sacrifice, where the benefit is twice the cost. if you work it out for other relatives, the discrepancy gets even bigger. -as mentioned, if you work it out for maternal erm for maternal cousins, for example the benefit turns out, has to be at least eight times. +as mentioned, if you work it out for maternal erm for maternal cousins, for example the benefit turns out, has to be at least eight times. so the principle, the fundamental principle is that, conflict between parents and offspring, over a we over a altruism, over self-sacrifice, or, selfishness, which is the other side of it. because, this works just as well for selfishness, because, if you think of it, selfishness is negative altruism. it's the opposite altruism. @@ -20116,17 +20094,17 @@ fo for example, says, that he, about his first erm, experience, was as a field o and this is one of the first, on the first day, he was astonished to see, an older male baboon intervene in a fight between two younger ones and stop it. and this astonished him, because he'd seen this kind of thing at home. he'd seen human parents intervene in conflicts between pa er, between er offspring. -you know, like, like er parents did, when her brother was pulling her hair, and she wanted to clout him. +you know, like, like er parents did, when her brother was pulling her hair, and she wanted to clout him. i daresay they intervened to stop the fight. -well, what observed exactly the same thing with, with baboons, and said to himself, why are these animals doing this? +well, what observed exactly the same thing with, with baboons, and said to himself, why are these animals doing this? there has to be a reason why, all the male baboons who have got no particular self interest in, well there's no obvious sign, in a fight between two youngsters, nevertheless he intervened to stop it, and he had realized that the reason, well he ultimately realized, development of parental investment, the reason they intervened to stop it, is that parents do not have the same self interest as their offspring do, when it comes to behaviour of offspring. there's a fundamental ineradicable conflict of interest, because the parents will want any gain to their offsprings net reproductive success. in other words, they favour any act of altruism. but the offspring will only favour acts of altruism where the benefit exceeds the cost discounted by the figure we agreed. how do you erm, well, what, what i mean is, my genes for altruism are present in my body one hundred percent, okay. -any gene i had for making a sacrifice, on behalf of a a sibling, are one hundred percent in my own body. -however, because of the way it relates in this work, they are only fifty percent present in my sibling, so any sacrifice of gene me er, it's not my actual inquest for your finding of the problems, the reason is, this is something we did last term in, in penaltriusm theory, so the others have got an advantage over you, they've already done it this time. +any gene i had for making a sacrifice, on behalf of a a sibling, are one hundred percent in my own body. +however, because of the way it relates in this work, they are only fifty percent present in my sibling, so any sacrifice of gene me er, it's not my actual inquest for your finding of the problems, the reason is, this is something we did last term in, in penaltriusm theory, so the others have got an advantage over you, they've already done it this time. i'm, i'm not surprised that, erm, you're erm,you you're having problems with it. but, it, it ba it's basically the penaltriusm idea that, for example, supposing i sacrifice my life, saving three of my siblings, okay? yeah. @@ -20138,18 +20116,18 @@ so a hundred and fifty percent of my genes for altruism are saved in three sibli that's a net gain for gene for altruism. therefore it would be selected, cos that's what natural selection is. more copies of original. -so the point i'm making is that offspring will be prepared to make sacrifices under those conditions, where erm, the r is greater than c. but parents will want offspring to make sacrifices, wherever b is greater than c, and the parent is not concerned with the discount parameter r, but agreed on relatedness, because parents are equally related through their offspring . +so the point i'm making is that offspring will be prepared to make sacrifices under those conditions, where erm, the r is greater than c. but parents will want offspring to make sacrifices, wherever b is greater than c, and the parent is not concerned with the discount parameter r, but agreed on relatedness, because parents are equally related through their offspring . so any sacrifice by an offspring, that results in a net gain in reproductive success, is good news for the parent. because obviously the parents' got genes in all its offspring. can you see that? yes. -it's counter see you, the reason, the reason that this seems difficult to understand at first is we're not used to thinking of it that way. +it's counter see you, the reason, the reason that this seems difficult to understand at first is we're not used to thinking of it that way. and the reason is normally we look at human relationships from one point of view or another, or assume that perspectives are the same, but clearly they're not the same, the perspective of an offspring is not the same as the perspective of, of the parent. -that was 's basic insight, and it's a very important one. +that was 's basic insight, and it's a very important one. as i have said, i'll go over it in the, in the lecture in more detail, but this is key insight. so does everybody see it now? -or at least got hold of the basic as i have said, the best way to do this, is to sit down with a piece of pencil and paper and work it out yourself. -try and do the sums as it were and think it through, and if you do that, i think you'll see that er, it does work out this way and of course, it gets er, even worse if you consider questions like relatedness through parents, because clearly i may be related to my mother's sister's children, my cousins, er no it's actually nieces, because my mother and her sister share genes, but i'm not er necessarily related erm in the same way, erm, through er, my father's er relatives, for example , because although erm, because my er, my, my relationship between mother's kin and my father's kin is purely through marriage, so they have no joint genetic relatedness. +or at least got hold of the basic as i have said, the best way to do this, is to sit down with a piece of pencil and paper and work it out yourself. +try and do the sums as it were and think it through, and if you do that, i think you'll see that er, it does work out this way and of course, it gets er, even worse if you consider questions like relatedness through parents, because clearly i may be related to my mother's sister's children, my cousins, er no it's actually nieces, because my mother and her sister share genes, but i'm not er necessarily related erm in the same way, erm, through er, my father's er relatives, for example , because although erm, because my er, my, my relationship between mother's kin and my father's kin is purely through marriage, so they have no joint genetic relatedness. so, although i am genetically related to my mother's brother's, or my mother's siblings' children or my father's siblings' children, the fact is, the siblings of both groups are genetically related to each other. and that produces further conflict, because the parents now take a different view. the parents now who they're related to. @@ -20163,13 +20141,13 @@ so my parents er aren't gonna ag agree about my altruism. my mother will want me to be more altruistic to hers, than my father will. my father will want me to be more altruistic to his relatives, than my mother will. and this again will be a cause conflict. -sometimes is, and here of course is conflict between and married partners. -how do we judge who's gonna be greater than we can't say that erm, how do we +sometimes is, and here of course is conflict between and married partners. +how do we judge who's gonna be greater than we can't say that erm, how do we in practice, you mean? how do we do it in practice? -well, i suppose the simple, the short answer is, we don't know exactly how we do it. +well, i suppose the simple, the short answer is, we don't know exactly how we do it. the, the longer and more and less precise answer would be presumably, human psychology has evolved in such a way, as to allow us to make those kind of judgments that would normally be reliable. -er, i mean, for example, erm, if we if you made us, well, let's go back to th your example. +er, i mean, for example, erm, if we if you made us, well, let's go back to th your example. giving up your sweets for your brother. presumably, if you felt sad about that, what you're saying is, you weren't as happy about that as your mother was. your mother presumably, who forced you to do that, was happier than you were about it happening, and that's what made you sad. @@ -20183,7 +20161,7 @@ however,ho how, what was the age disparity between you and your brother? four. four. my guess is though, that if, if the age difference had been something like erm, seven or eight years, by the time your mother was asking you to give up sweets for your very much younger brother, you would probably have matured sufficiently and perhaps identified enough with your mother to see yourself playing a more kind of maternal role, as, you know the grown up sister. -you might not have minded giving up your sweets, because you, you'd have got a different kind of gratification. +you might not have minded giving up your sweets, because you, you'd have got a different kind of gratification. you would have felt oh, i'm being like mummy. and, and i think that kind of thing happens, in fact you notice it happening in families. where there's a big age gap, between the children, the older child often will go along with the parental wishes much more, merely because it's much more mature. @@ -20197,15 +20175,14 @@ i mean, it's not a very good answer, because frankly we don't know,th the full r obviously some variations in oh, absolutely, it would. and, of course, i mean, we have, have to remember, that when we talk about ageing altruism, this is just an abstraction. -i mean, we're not, erm, we're just simplifying a very complex situation, and in fact, probably large numbers of genes are, are involved, and they're, there are probably complex interactions between different sorts of altruism. kin altruism will certainly function within families for reasons that we've just been looking at, but this will also be a fertile and erm, encouraging er, framework for sibling altruism. +i mean, we're not, erm, we're just simplifying a very complex situation, and in fact, probably large numbers of genes are, are involved, and they're, there are probably complex interactions between different sorts of altruism. kin altruism will certainly function within families for reasons that we've just been looking at, but this will also be a fertile and erm, encouraging er, framework for sibling altruism. so it may be that elements of the sibling altruism will develop in families, too. for example, you might have been a mere, much more happy about making a sacrifice for your brother, giving him a sweet, if you knew that on other occasions, he would give one to you, and because you are related to each other . -in other words, you met each other a lot, and w we know you had the kind of situations that - +in other words, you met each other a lot, and w we know you had the kind of situations that what i want to do today. i got some pens, today, which is great. ah, that's wonderful, ah, of course, they don't work. -ah, that's just okay, got one that works. +ah, that's just okay, got one that works. i meant to bring my own, but i forgot, and somebody's used the wrong kind of pen on here, so you can't rub that off. that was probably in desperation. thank you. @@ -20216,7 +20193,7 @@ erm, right, what i want to do this week, is to go on to the next er, work of fre or at least they start, both books really start with the same issue, and the issue in question is in many ways, well, you could argue that it was in many ways fundamental to the social sciences. and, and the issue is, question is is what is often called a problem of social order. the problem of order. -what this means is it's the question of how is society possible. +what this means is it's the question of how is society possible. why do people cooperate? why isn't there total chaos, why doesn't everybody pursue their own self interest at the expense of everybody else, reducing life to a, a state of chaotic erm er, conflict of individuals against each other. this is what is normally called the problem of social order, and of course it's been around in philosophy and, and social sciences, really since the beginning, and er, some of the greatest and earliest works of er, social philosophy like plato's republic, are really in part about this er question. @@ -20231,7 +20208,7 @@ thomas hobbes was an english philosopher who er, wrote a famous book called levi hobbes conceived of what he called a state of nature. this was in fact, the state in which he thought er animals er existed, and it was the condition to which he believed humans beings would be reduced, were it not for the mechanisms that maintain social order. the state of nature,ac according to the most memorable phrase in the book, er, made life nasty, brutish and short. -because in hobbes' view, the state of nature was one of chaotic anarchy in which every individual fought against every other individual in, to quote another well known phrase from the book, a war of all against all. +because in hobbes' view, the state of nature was one of chaotic anarchy in which every individual fought against every other individual in, to quote another well known phrase from the book, a war of all against all. primeval chaos. so this was hobbes' view of the state of nature. of course society isn't like that. @@ -20240,7 +20217,7 @@ it may at times become chaotic and disordered, but that, that's not the normal s in which in hobbes' view, should be a monarch, but in principle be any centralized erm, monopoly of er, of force. and by doing this, by giving up their, or at least part of their individual freedom everybody benefits, because law and order can be imposed by the er centralized authority,what whatever it may be. nowadays, one of the explicit controversies which er, real kind of hobbesian view, is er, debate about gun law, for example. -the there's a widespread idea that if you let people have guns the result will be more crimes of violence and more murders, and therefore, people conclude, er at least they do in this country, that only the state should have a monopoly of firearms, so only the police and the army should be allowed to have firearms. +the there's a widespread idea that if you let people have guns the result will be more crimes of violence and more murders, and therefore, people conclude, er at least they do in this country, that only the state should have a monopoly of firearms, so only the police and the army should be allowed to have firearms. this allegedly, erm, protests the, protects the citizen, and the, the logic of this argument, is really the hobbesian argument, that if you let ordinary individuals have firearms they'll go round killing each other, or so it is alleged. i don't believe it for one minute, personally, but this is the, this is the theory, and i'll explain why i don't believe it, later. the, the importance of this, is that freud is often said to have been a hobbesian thinker, in the sense that, er without necessarily being directly influenced by hobbes, he took a similar, a similar kind of view, or at least, so it is said. @@ -20261,11 +20238,11 @@ well, having agreed with that, freud then, faces a problem, because the problem he had given a picture of religion, which represented it as primarily concerned with guilt, with taboos against incest, and as er, representing the origins of civilization in primeval societies like those of the australian aborigines, and freud erm, remarks in the opening pages of civilization and discontents that totem and taboo was never meant to be a complete theory of religion. he says, all i was doing in totem and taboo, was trying to explain totemism, a very specific form of religion. i wasn't trying to advance a theory about religion in general, says freud, but now i am, and in future of an illusion, he turns to the question of religion in general , not just er, teutonic religion, as in totem and taboo, but religion in general . -so the question he goes on to is, given its civilizing restraining role how did, what er, explanation can we give for religion in general? -and, his answer to that, is that psychoanalysis can give us a very interesting and unique insight into, into religion, and this was an insight which had emerged in the course of, the nineteen twenties, following the developments of psychoanalysis that occurred after the first world war, which we've already looked at and is essentially the concept of transference. +so the question he goes on to is, given its civilizing restraining role how did, what er, explanation can we give for religion in general? +and, his answer to that, is that psychoanalysis can give us a very interesting and unique insight into, into religion, and this was an insight which had emerged in the course of, the nineteen twenties, following the developments of psychoanalysis that occurred after the first world war, which we've already looked at and is essentially the concept of transference. i don't think freud ever uses the word transference in the book, i may be wrong, but er, it may be mentioned, i'm pretty sure it isn't, it certainly isn't in any prominence. you recall that transference is a concept that freud introduced into psychoanalysis to explain the way in which the patient in an analysis, tended to cast the analyst in different roles of different people, usually from their past and usually from their childhood, so the analyst would play the role of father, mother, brother, sister or whatever by turns, very often, in the typical analysis. -and i think you can see that the, the word transference here is, is in the sense that transference erm, alludes to transferring something from one place to another, as if the feeling, which were originally experienced, for example, in the family, were being transferred to the, to the analytic situation, to the, to the analysis. +and i think you can see that the, the word transference here is, is in the sense that transference erm, alludes to transferring something from one place to another, as if the feeling, which were originally experienced, for example, in the family, were being transferred to the, to the analytic situation, to the, to the analysis. so this is how freud originally discovered transference, as an observation made in the course of analysis, and as we saw, erm, a couple of weeks ago, whenever it was i was talking about group psychology, transference was a fundamental concept in freud's theory of groups. because basically what freud was saying was, the group we create semi-unconscious, the, the family. the leader creates the parental role, the followers play the role of the children, and er, as i pointed out in the, in the lecture when i talked about that, often this is erm, explicitly indicated by symbolic terms, in groups, such as papa, erm, erm,whi which gives you the word pope. @@ -20295,18 +20272,18 @@ well, this is, is very reassuring, says freud. it's nice to think, you know, there's someone up there, sitting in the cloud, watching over us and providing, as it were. this is er, this is a great reassurance. again, the, the deity, in many religions is regarded as er, enforcing morality and justice, if not in the here below, then very often in the hereafter. -so many religions, such as the religion of ancient egypt, for instance,whi which made a great fetish of this, has a belief in a judgment after death, followed by eternal retribution er, heaven effectively for the just and er, damnation effectively for the unjust, and some religions like catholicism stick in an intermediate state pur purgatory, where you can work, work off a sentence, as it were , for a few, for a few thousand years. +so many religions, such as the religion of ancient egypt, for instance,whi which made a great fetish of this, has a belief in a judgment after death, followed by eternal retribution er, heaven effectively for the just and er, damnation effectively for the unjust, and some religions like catholicism stick in an intermediate state pur purgatory, where you can work, work off a sentence, as it were , for a few, for a few thousand years. kind of a heavenly parole system. -and if you work off your sentence of pur you get parole to heaven at the end of it which is very nice. +and if you work off your sentence of pur you get parole to heaven at the end of it which is very nice. erm, but you see the point i am making, the idea is that er religion appeals to people, because they, they see the in injustices of the world, erm, you know if er, er, injustice is an, is an inevitable, erm, experience, erm, some of us erm, might be inclined to think especially if you live under the british system of er criminal justice, and so if you can't get justice here, perhaps you can after death, because god is ultimately just, and no mistakes will be made in heaven, as it were. er, there, er, the er sinners will be published, erm,the sinners will be published, er, sorry, that's a, that's a good point, see if i can remember that. -sinners will be published, er punished, the sinners will be punished, and er, the just will be erm, just wi will, er will er will be rewarded. +sinners will be published, er punished, the sinners will be punished, and er, the just will be erm, just wi will, er will er will be rewarded. so that's another great, wishful thought, the great gratification. -particularly if you have a sense of injustice in life. +particularly if you have a sense of injustice in life. again, religion appeals to people, erm merely in the idea of an afterlife. after all, er, the idea of death being the end of everything, isn't particularly gratifying to people, but er, the idea of an afterlife is, is very much more appealing, because it means death isn't the end, it's just a kind of transition from one state to another, and it's nice to think that er, there could be an afterlife, particularly if you can look forward to it, erm, in a, in a better place than here. -so in all these kinds of different ways, religion provides succour erm, gratification and er, is the fulfilment of people's wishes, particularly th their frustrations, their erm, feelings of er being the victims as it were, of the world, can be satisfied to some extent by religious belief, which holds out some, some prospect of and hope, at least in the afterlife, if not, if not in this life. -so said freud, it's no wonder that people believe in religion, because religion can provide you with a lot, with a lot of gratification, but the fundamental psychological explanation for this, says freud, is that these feelings that religion gratifies in adult life, are transferences of feelings that we all had in infancy. +so in all these kinds of different ways, religion provides succour erm, gratification and er, is the fulfilment of people's wishes, particularly th their frustrations, their erm, feelings of er being the victims as it were, of the world, can be satisfied to some extent by religious belief, which holds out some, some prospect of and hope, at least in the afterlife, if not, if not in this life. +so said freud, it's no wonder that people believe in religion, because religion can provide you with a lot, with a lot of gratification, but the fundamental psychological explanation for this, says freud, is that these feelings that religion gratifies in adult life, are transferences of feelings that we all had in infancy. in other words, these things i've been talking about, map, if i may use that concept again from mathematics, they map to earlier feelings. feelings in early childhood, where we were, indeed, helpless, where the world was, in fact, meaningless, where we were er subject as it were to erm, the arbitrary erm to, to, to arbitrary fate, and felt it because we were young children, but in which there really was a power that looked after us. there was a power that was providential, would provide for us. @@ -20319,7 +20296,7 @@ and freud is careful here to use the word illusion. he distinguishes in the book between an error an illusion and a delusion. an error he says, is just a factual misapprehension, but er, you know, you could say er, the capital of australia is vienna. well that would be an error, because it's actually canberra, but you could be, you yo that's, that's a mistake er, that anybody could make. -however, erm, thinking that er, one day, er, you might marry erm, a prince or princess, freud says is an, is an illusion, in the sense that er, people do sometimes marry princ princes and princesses, it could happen, it's not very likely to happen to any particular individual who might have that wish, but it could happen. +however, erm, thinking that er, one day, er, you might marry erm, a prince or princess, freud says is an, is an illusion, in the sense that er, people do sometimes marry princ princes and princesses, it could happen, it's not very likely to happen to any particular individual who might have that wish, but it could happen. erm, as we know does happen. not for long actually , but it does happen. erm, so that's an illusion, a delusion, in other words, an illusion is something that could happen, but the difference between an illusion and an error, is an error is just a cognitive mistake, an illusion is a cognitive mistake that is kept going by a wish. @@ -20327,7 +20304,7 @@ an, an illusion, erm, presupposes that there is some kind of er, of wish er,unde and the wish keeps the illusion going as it were. a delusion, on the other hand, is a, is a much more serious kind of factual error in which the element of wish fulfilness becomes so strong that it won't countenance any evidence against it. so a delusion is something that people insist on believing, erm, no matter what. -for example, erm, in erm, paranoia, delusions of persecution where people believe that is plotting against them, and no matter what you do, erm, you know if you said well look, we can prove to you we are not plotting against you, the paranoic says to you, why do you want to prove this to me, if it's not true, you know. +for example, erm, in erm, paranoia, delusions of persecution where people believe that is plotting against them, and no matter what you do, erm, you know if you said well look, we can prove to you we are not plotting against you, the paranoic says to you, why do you want to prove this to me, if it's not true, you know. you can't win. not against a delusion. so freud is not saying religion is a delusion or an error, he's saying it's an illusion, and it's an illusion because it's a factual mistake maintained by wish fulfilment. @@ -20337,10 +20314,10 @@ they actually existed. whereas erm, divinities exist only in people's er, hopes or imaginations. they don't er, you can't see them in the same way you could go and see your parents. and er, this illusion is maintained according to freud, because of the wishes that people have. -these wishes go straight back to childhood, and so religion represents a transference from childhood and a kind of emotional infantilism in which people try and make out that they're still children, as it were, even though they, even though they really aren't. -and then of course, the other characteristics that go with religion, and that he had emphasized in other books on totem and taboo, like guilt, the feeling that you ought to obey the moral commands of the parents, because after all the parents weren't just benevolent entities who looked after you and rewarded you and praised you, but they were your judges and censors as well . -they punished you when you did the wrong thing, and they rewarded you when, when, when they did, when you did the right thing. -so the believing in religion with, with moral codes, particularly in those religions which have rather strict moral codes, and demand quite a lot from the believer, in terms of adherence to the er, to the moral law even those religions can be explained in terms of freud's transference theory, because that too, comes from childhood. +these wishes go straight back to childhood, and so religion represents a transference from childhood and a kind of emotional infantilism in which people try and make out that they're still children, as it were, even though they, even though they really aren't. +and then of course, the other characteristics that go with religion, and that he had emphasized in other books on totem and taboo, like guilt, the feeling that you ought to obey the moral commands of the parents, because after all the parents weren't just benevolent entities who looked after you and rewarded you and praised you, but they were your judges and censors as well . +they punished you when you did the wrong thing, and they rewarded you when, when, when they did, when you did the right thing. +so the believing in religion with, with moral codes, particularly in those religions which have rather strict moral codes, and demand quite a lot from the believer, in terms of adherence to the er, to the moral law even those religions can be explained in terms of freud's transference theory, because that too, comes from childhood. the thing that you have to obey, if you don't obey you will be punished. that too, is a transference from the childhood situation, where the child is under the authority of the parent. in adult life the, the, the authority of religion stems from this, from this transference effect. @@ -20348,20 +20325,20 @@ now here of course, and, and by now we've reached the closing pages of the book, here, freud in terms of paradox, because on the one hand, he started out asking the problem of order. how is order possible, and answered it in part, by saying, well, religion is a civilizing order creating force. in the next step of the argument, he then said, well, religion is a transference, and therefore a form of infantilism, so now he seems to be criticizing religion, but if he's criti criticizing religion by saying it's an illusion, surely he's jeopardizing civilization, because the danger, as he points out in the book, if you take religion away from people, you say, look, this is just an illusion, god doesn't exist. -the ten commandments are just a myth it carries no more force whatsoever. -might the consequence of that be, that people then go out and murder and steal and rape and fight wars, and do all, do all these kinds anti-social things? +the ten commandments are just a myth it carries no more force whatsoever. +might the consequence of that be, that people then go out and murder and steal and rape and fight wars, and do all, do all these kinds anti-social things? in other words, if you say, religion is an illusion, are you undermining and destroying social order? -this is a this is a paradox that freud has to face up to. -and in the closing pages of the book, he answers this this er, problem, by saying, well look, er, you don't have to base morality, civilization, and social order on an illusion. +this is a this is a paradox that freud has to face up to. +and in the closing pages of the book, he answers this this er, problem, by saying, well look, er, you don't have to base morality, civilization, and social order on an illusion. on the contrary, freud says, basing it on an illusion is, is very very dangerous. because you see, the thing with illusions is, it's okay as long as people believe. -for example, you know, you could frighten a child into i mean this is not an, an analogy freud uses, this is one i thought of, but it's in the same spirit as his argument. +for example, you know, you could frighten a child into i mean this is not an, an analogy freud uses, this is one i thought of, but it's in the same spirit as his argument. you could, for example, frighten a child into conformity with your wishes by saying that erm, you know, if, if the child doesn't go to bed at the right time, the bogie man will come and eat them up, or something. you might say something like that. and i can remember being frightened of the bogie man when i was a little er child. my elder brother used to terrify me with it. erm, okay the bogie man would come and eat me up. -erm, well as long as the child is, is young enough to believe in the bogie man, everything is fine, and that child may well go to bed on time and er, and er, shuts its eyes and goes straight to sleep er in fear. +erm, well as long as the child is, is young enough to believe in the bogie man, everything is fine, and that child may well go to bed on time and er, and er, shuts its eyes and goes straight to sleep er in fear. but what happens if the child matures a bit, and realizes that the bogie man is just er, just er an invention, created to, to set fear in it? in the first place, says freud, the child won't obey any longer, necessarily, because now he's got nothing to fear, and secondly, a child might resent the lie that has been told to him. you know, i was told about the bogie man, but the bogie man, i now know, didn't, didn't, didn't, didn't exist. @@ -20371,11 +20348,11 @@ what we need, says freud, is a sure foundation for social order, and the only fo the trouble with religion, is that transference is based on an illusion and it serves the pleasure principle ultimately, because it's a tremendous wish fulfilment. wish fulfilments as we know, and what we saw about dreams and so on, so the pleasure principle that reigns in the unconscious. and as we saw, the unconscious is out of contact wi with reality and so need take no account of it. -however, says freud, ideally, morality and social order should be based, not on the pleasure principle, but on the reality principle, and, and, and he ends up with this book invoking the idea that science should replace erm, religion in, in this respect. +however, says freud, ideally, morality and social order should be based, not on the pleasure principle, but on the reality principle, and, and, and he ends up with this book invoking the idea that science should replace erm, religion in, in this respect. in other words that science should establish insights into reality which make social order erm, both possible and well founded. now in this particular book, freud doesn't say very much about what these insights er, are. and er, as you'll see, probably next week's, i'm not going to get to this now, er, next week, or possible the week after, even, depending on how long it takes me to get there, i will suggest to you that the revolution now taking place in behavioural science, does suggest wh what they are, and that there are in fact some deeply countering intuitive insights, erm, into this whole issue, which have only emerged in the last few years. -but er, this is just by way of an anticipation, the the general conclusion comes for instance, in this rather generalized book, and relatively short book, is that we ought to base variety and social order on science, and its insights, and certainly not on, on religion, and, and there he, there he leaves the question. +but er, this is just by way of an anticipation, the the general conclusion comes for instance, in this rather generalized book, and relatively short book, is that we ought to base variety and social order on science, and its insights, and certainly not on, on religion, and, and there he, there he leaves the question. however, he takes it up again, at much greater length, in his next book of nineteen thirty, civilization and its discontents. this book erm, begins, once again with the hobbesian problem. the,wi with the, with the question of social order. @@ -20398,36 +20375,36 @@ so it seems to me that those sociologists, and there've been a lot of them, who you could certainly take that view of freud, and it would have been true, perhaps, if freud had died er, before, er, nineteen eighteen, shall we say, or in fourteen. then i think people would be justified in saying, well, freud was essentially a hobbesian social thinker. that was the time when freud was exploring just the id. -after world war one, as we've been seeing, he was exploring the ego, and his writing about the ego, in particular, group psychology and future of an illusion, show quite clearly that he saw the ego as a pro-social fact in the personality. +after world war one, as we've been seeing, he was exploring the ego, and his writing about the ego, in particular, group psychology and future of an illusion, show quite clearly that he saw the ego as a pro-social fact in the personality. something that impelled the individual towards identifying with other people, performing groups, to accepting norms and values for these super-ego, which emerges during this time, and so on. so i think the, the statement freud was a hobbesian social thinker is just wrong. it's factually wrong, or at least it's factually wrong, if you were taking note of freud's writings after world war one. if you look at all freud's writings, i think what you have to say is, if you want to say that, you must make the qualification that the id is a hobbesian erm, thing as it were, but the ego is a pro-social erm, part of the personality. now here, it's useful to contrast the hobbesian approach, which i call the pessimistic view of human nature, with one that i would call optimistic. now the optimistic view of nature is the exact opposite. -a good example of this, if we wanted to er, have somebody as it were, to counterbalance er, the english philosopher hobbes, would be the french philosopher jean jacques rousseau, writing a little bit later, not much actually seventeen twelve to seventeen seventy eight erm, about a century later. +a good example of this, if we wanted to er, have somebody as it were, to counterbalance er, the english philosopher hobbes, would be the french philosopher jean jacques rousseau, writing a little bit later, not much actually seventeen twelve to seventeen seventy eight erm, about a century later. jean jacques rousseau, famous french philosopher, whose view of human nature, was what i would call optimistic, in the sense that, by contrast to thomas hobbes, john rousseau believed that human beings were basically good. he believed that human beings were born sociable, cooperative, altruistic, nice, civilized and that if, in later life, they showed anti-social selfish, criminal erm, egoistic tendencies, it was because of what happened to them after they were born. it was because of the effects of other people and society on them, that they were corrupted as it were. -i once met a social worker, this was years ago, i i was gonna say, this couldn't happen today, but it probably could, erm, one hopes it couldn't happen today, but it probably would happen today, too. -a social worker, who said to me, inside every, every, what she say so inside er, every juvenile delinquent, there's a little leonardo da vinci trying to get out. +i once met a social worker, this was years ago, i i was gonna say, this couldn't happen today, but it probably could, erm, one hopes it couldn't happen today, but it probably would happen today, too. +a social worker, who said to me, inside every, every, what she say so inside er, every juvenile delinquent, there's a little leonardo da vinci trying to get out. well, if you believe that, i think you'll believe anything. but erm, that's the idea, you see, that these kids, er well, you know, they may be delinquent, and do lots of nasty things, but it's only the way they've been treated by society. basically, human nature is good. this was, this is what i call an optimistic view, and this was rousseau's view of human nature, that basically people were good, and er, cooperative, and it was the bad things in human nature that had to be explained, not the good. the good was natural. but the bad things, and of course, rousseau's solution to the problem of order was quite different from hobbes'. -hobbes' solution was, order must be imposed on a recalcitrant human nature, to make society possible, rousseau's theory was, if only people could be liberated from the things that makes them selfish, selfish and anti-social, they would come together in a natural social contract, where individuals would spontaneously give up their freedom, in order to gain the benefits of social cooperation, and rousseau's view was, if only people were, were fully rational, and could free themselves from the unfortunate effects of, of er civilization, they would enter into a state of erm, perfect society in which they could er, associate er without the, the necessity of things like the state or or whatever. +hobbes' solution was, order must be imposed on a recalcitrant human nature, to make society possible, rousseau's theory was, if only people could be liberated from the things that makes them selfish, selfish and anti-social, they would come together in a natural social contract, where individuals would spontaneously give up their freedom, in order to gain the benefits of social cooperation, and rousseau's view was, if only people were, were fully rational, and could free themselves from the unfortunate effects of, of er civilization, they would enter into a state of erm, perfect society in which they could er, associate er without the, the necessity of things like the state or or whatever. very very optimistic view of human nature. later, erm, this was developed by people like marx, who emphasized the ec economic role, erm, the e economic aspect of erm, of er, the ill effects of civilization. but basically the idea, erm, is i think well represented by er, by rousseau, and it's a view that has been very influential, for instance, in modern education, and some people would say it explains the disaster that erm th that some people think er modern education is. -now, the these two views of human nature, the pessimistic, as i'm calling it, and the optimistic lead to two different views of the child, as i've already implied. +now, the these two views of human nature, the pessimistic, as i'm calling it, and the optimistic lead to two different views of the child, as i've already implied. the rousseau view of the child, is one where children are basically er, noble savages. are born free, but everywhere in the chain, as to quote a famous phrase from rousseau, the kind of noble savage view of the child. this regards the child as not in need of socialization or control, but basically er, good in its own right. -in the best example, in modern education, is that er, progressive school, what's the school, summer hill or the school where the kids are allowed to do absolutely everything they like. +in the best example, in modern education, is that er, progressive school, what's the school, summer hill or the school where the kids are allowed to do absolutely everything they like. erm, very revealing. -erm, er, if you, if you know anything about the kind of thing that actually goes on er, it's nothing like the it's supposed to be. +erm, er, if you, if you know anything about the kind of thing that actually goes on er, it's nothing like the it's supposed to be. but that was the, that was the theory that it was founded on. that, that, you know, if you give children complete freedom, they will, they will know, as it were,wh what's best for them, you don't need any, any rules, or anything. or at least er, not any rules they don't impose on themselves. @@ -20440,14 +20417,14 @@ but anyway, the idea that the brutality is er justified, and you have to beat th this goes, i think you can see, with the pessimistic view, the hobbesian view, that for civilization order has to be, has to be imposed. well, where does freud stand in all this? you, seems to me that, if you think about it, the freudian view is what i would like to call a realistic one. -because just as i was saying, that freud's view was that, okay, there's the id and that may be hobbesian, but there's also the ego, which if you like is, is more kind of rousseauness it's pro-social, and therefore i would say freud is not a pessimistic, or an optimistic social thinker, but something in between. +because just as i was saying, that freud's view was that, okay, there's the id and that may be hobbesian, but there's also the ego, which if you like is, is more kind of rousseauness it's pro-social, and therefore i would say freud is not a pessimistic, or an optimistic social thinker, but something in between. what i would call a realistic social thinker, namely, somebody who saw there is good and bad in human nature. -freud didn't go to one extreme or the other, he didn't go to the hobbes extreme and say there is no good in us you know, we're just anti-social egoists, although he did know that was true of the id. +freud didn't go to one extreme or the other, he didn't go to the hobbes extreme and say there is no good in us you know, we're just anti-social egoists, although he did know that was true of the id. nor did he go to the rousseau extreme, saying that we're basically noble savages. but he did recognize that there was strong pro-social currents in the, in the ego, and the resulting view, i think, is what i would call a realistic view of human nature. which i think any sensible person ought to come to, which is, that human beings are neither basically bad, evil, and anti-social, no more are they basically good, altruistic and cooperative. they're a mixture of both. -sometimes, people can be evil, egoistic, destructive and aggressive, and think only of themselves as we know to our cost, and as we see all around us in the world, from time to time. +sometimes, people can be evil, egoistic, destructive and aggressive, and think only of themselves as we know to our cost, and as we see all around us in the world, from time to time. but at other times, as we also know, people can be remarkably altruistic and committed to others. you've only got to think of the career of erm, audrey hepburn who died today, or yesterday, whenever it was. well, she's a shining example of that. @@ -20462,10 +20439,10 @@ that there is another pro-social erm, constituent, the ego, and furthermore, the for example, the pro-social erm, factors mobilize projection and identification, and the anti- social ones are to do with the instinctual drives, and, and, and so on . so it, it, it's a, it goes much beyond merely a kind of er, cliche, of saying, all people can be sometimes good or people can be sometimes bad, and it tells you about the specific way in which this th this comes about. an example, er, of what i'm talking about, which i think shows this very nicely, and is, is something i wanted to mention, because it's important in itself, is the shifts in freud's views on anxiety. -as we saw, in the early phase of psychoanalysis, before world war one, when it was dominated by the view of freud and in the eighteen nineties, and when psychoanalysis was mainly id analysis, and concerned with the unconscious, freud took the view of anxiety as a pathological transformation of the libido. +as we saw, in the early phase of psychoanalysis, before world war one, when it was dominated by the view of freud and in the eighteen nineties, and when psychoanalysis was mainly id analysis, and concerned with the unconscious, freud took the view of anxiety as a pathological transformation of the libido. the libido was then regarded as a kind of emotional torrent, that if it was frustrated underwent a pathological transformation into anxiety. er, i think i mentioned this, i hope i did, pretty sure i did. -after world war one, in the second phase of the psychoanalysis, when he was concerned with the analysis of ego, anxiety became a sense of danger in the ego, and the ego felt anxiety when it was threatened, and as a result, there was three sorts of anxiety neurotic anxiety, when the ego was threatened by the drives of the id moral anxiety, when it was threatened by punishment from the super ego, and realistic anxiety, when it was threatened by dangers from the outside world. +after world war one, in the second phase of the psychoanalysis, when he was concerned with the analysis of ego, anxiety became a sense of danger in the ego, and the ego felt anxiety when it was threatened, and as a result, there was three sorts of anxiety neurotic anxiety, when the ego was threatened by the drives of the id moral anxiety, when it was threatened by punishment from the super ego, and realistic anxiety, when it was threatened by dangers from the outside world. some early analysts, though not freud, i, i emphasize, but some of his followers, took the view that anxiety, for example, in children, was pathological, and they, that generation of analysts tried to bring up their children to be free of anxiety, and, and then, you still get this in a lot of popular child psychology today, the idea that anxiety is always bad and always wrong. anna freud writing many years later in her classic book, erm, normality of pathology in childhood, erm, candidly admits that er, the first generation of analysts was wrong about this, and she, she, she, she candidly says that the analytic profession changed its view, although freud never did. @@ -20502,7 +20479,7 @@ er, no, it's a bit tough, i suppose you could bring some evolutionary insight to it. oh yes, oh yes yes, that's right oh yeah -are you keeping that sort of thing that that in some ways could be considered to be a system. +are you keeping that sort of thing that that in some ways could be considered to be a system. if i let it run away with me, it might, you know tie it up i mean, if you like me to leave your paper, to write to one, i'll be quite pleased to look at it @@ -20526,19 +20503,19 @@ come on in. now, i have some good news for you, and you could do with some good news, couldn't you? yes. least, i hope it's good news, from what you said last night, i think it would be good news. -i have got you a computer, one of these would you like one of those? +i have got you a computer, one of these would you like one of those? i'd love one of those. right, we can get you one. i'll tell you what's happened. the thing is, the school has just launched a, a new programme to lend portable computers to graduate students, okay? -now, we've got one in this department, like this, and er, one of our graduate students was very interested in it, and since she was just finishing her p h d the in some of the ways, some of the most erm, outspoken erm, persons for this, but i'm certainly not alone. +now, we've got one in this department, like this, and er, one of our graduate students was very interested in it, and since she was just finishing her p h d the in some of the ways, some of the most erm, outspoken erm, persons for this, but i'm certainly not alone. there's a growing body now, of people who are thinking along similar lines, and er, so it's, it, it's, i think you'd be unwise to wipe this off just, just as my eccen eccentricity. i mean, it may be that. look, we're gonna have to stop. we can carry on with this next week, as, as you see, we've touched on a big topic, so we'll, we'll leave it to you to introduce next week's discussion, whatever way you think fit, erm, that raises other issues which you want to talk about. okay. thanks very much. -and well done that was an excellent +and well done that was an excellent a little contradictory. erm, i read another erm, book on believing this. yeah, fine. @@ -20549,25 +20526,25 @@ yeah. you ought to point out. right. not completely true. -ah, let me just say what leaders of peacetime margaret was after early life was that a cold mother who was erm, full of personality people of london biography of the leader of the conservative, because at least half the book is about +ah, let me just say what leaders of peacetime margaret was after early life was that a cold mother who was erm, full of personality people of london biography of the leader of the conservative, because at least half the book is about that's where it belongs. erm. at least not fully in command of ourselves, let alone the social and political world around us. it's certainly wrong though,i think erm, there was erm, the question mm. -er, but i do believe that made very important the reason, er, the first question is and people weren't reading about that. +er, but i do believe that made very important the reason, er, the first question is and people weren't reading about that. erm, well -well done, that was absolutely first rate, i mean erm, it was a difficult er, task you had, especially as the book wasn't in the library, of which i am deeply apologetic, because i thought it was, and er, i thought you er, you coped with a very difficult assignment extremely well, and i think you can have an extra and i'm sure everyone else thinks so too. +well done, that was absolutely first rate, i mean erm, it was a difficult er, task you had, especially as the book wasn't in the library, of which i am deeply apologetic, because i thought it was, and er, i thought you er, you coped with a very difficult assignment extremely well, and i think you can have an extra and i'm sure everyone else thinks so too. er, as i have said, i haven't done woodrow wilson before in the past, so, so it was an experiment, and erm, i must admit,yo you rose to the occasion excellently. -the choice of literature, as you realize was meant to be contrasting, and i put book down as an example of what i thought was the worst possible, er, use of use of psychoanalysis, kind of gutter journalism, erm and which you didn't look at, and it's, it's no criticism of you erm, because er, you had your work cut out with what you did do, but the reason i put down gandhi's truth, if anybody's ever read that, have they? +the choice of literature, as you realize was meant to be contrasting, and i put book down as an example of what i thought was the worst possible, er, use of use of psychoanalysis, kind of gutter journalism, erm and which you didn't look at, and it's, it's no criticism of you erm, because er, you had your work cut out with what you did do, but the reason i put down gandhi's truth, if anybody's ever read that, have they? this is the exact opposite from , because it's erm, it idealizes gandhi. it kind of builds gandhi up into a great er figure, as it were, ignoring his feet of clay, erm, which he definitely had. -so erm,book on which is kind of a character association by a pop cycle analysis and gan erm, book on gandhi, which is using cycle analysis, of, of, of, of tremendous contrast. +so erm,book on which is kind of a character association by a pop cycle analysis and gan erm, book on gandhi, which is using cycle analysis, of, of, of, of tremendous contrast. and er, er, the question is of course, where does freud's book on woodrow wilson belong? -does it belong in the kind of erm, camp or not? +does it belong in the kind of erm, camp or not? well, erm, what do other people think? -but isn't, isn't that the quote at the beginning of your book, er, unsigned quote, erm, doesn't that say something about how, how, you know, long aired radio biography of someone is very political or sort of er, disregard all of the important things they really done, and i don't know, i don't know if it's er, pertinent erm, but obviously, in freud, freud wanted to set out to criticize wilson erm, so he, you know, he went in with it. +but isn't, isn't that the quote at the beginning of your book, er, unsigned quote, erm, doesn't that say something about how, how, you know, long aired radio biography of someone is very political or sort of er, disregard all of the important things they really done, and i don't know, i don't know if it's er, pertinent erm, but obviously, in freud, freud wanted to set out to criticize wilson erm, so he, you know, he went in with it. i mean, he was yes. obviously going to buck out of the @@ -20575,7 +20552,7 @@ he was. biographical allegiance which made him look bad. yes. erm, and er, on other hand he got everything, got his own book out biography -of course, i think if, if, if freud were here, he would defend himself, by saying i was quite open about my prejudice against wilson at the beginning of the book, as reminds us, freud says quite clearly, how he felt about all this. +of course, i think if, if, if freud were here, he would defend himself, by saying i was quite open about my prejudice against wilson at the beginning of the book, as reminds us, freud says quite clearly, how he felt about all this. but i think freud would have also gone on to say that he had very good reason for resenting wilson, because he blamed wilson personally for the unjust peace, after er versailles, but er, was indirectly, many people would argue, going to lead to the second world war, and er, so freud's defence i think would be, this man really was responsible. because after all, the situation in my, i don't know, i mean, i don't know how well you know your modern history. i'm not certain, i'm not a great expert on it, but erm, the situation seems to be, that after the first world war, the central power was germany and austria, were defeated. @@ -20583,29 +20560,29 @@ er, france, er was, er battle ravaged and its economy in ruins. this country was bankrupt, and had to borrow money from the united states of america to keep going, and er, russia had just had a revolution and was still in chaos. so the united states was really the only world power erm, erm, as were able to do anything. in, in some ways, the situation you know, was a bit like, like what it is now, since the collapse of the soviet union, only more so, i would say, because the, the other powers were more, were even more prostrate than is, is, is the situation today. -so for a while, the president of the united states effectively had world power, there was no other power in the world who could stand up to the u s, er, after, after, world war one for one argument anyway, and i think freud's er, defence disposition would be, woodrow wilson was the man who came to europe, saying he would bring a just peace for all, and went away leaving a total mess, and, and, freud's er argument in his book is, told us was, well, the mess er, was really wilson's own doing, and if it was his doing, what was it in his character that allowed him to er,si to on some lloyd george, who bullied him into getting most of what they wanted. -so, that would be freud's defence, now, i suppose you would have to know a lot more about modern history, to, to know, if this was really true or not, but erm, the the er, question that freud was really asking himself, really was, why did wilson let us down, because freud admits that he regarded wilson, when he came to europe as a saviour. +so for a while, the president of the united states effectively had world power, there was no other power in the world who could stand up to the u s, er, after, after, world war one for one argument anyway, and i think freud's er, defence disposition would be, woodrow wilson was the man who came to europe, saying he would bring a just peace for all, and went away leaving a total mess, and, and, freud's er argument in his book is, told us was, well, the mess er, was really wilson's own doing, and if it was his doing, what was it in his character that allowed him to er,si to on some lloyd george, who bullied him into getting most of what they wanted. +so, that would be freud's defence, now, i suppose you would have to know a lot more about modern history, to, to know, if this was really true or not, but erm, the the er, question that freud was really asking himself, really was, why did wilson let us down, because freud admits that he regarded wilson, when he came to europe as a saviour. you know, here, here was somebody coming from outside europe who would bring, you know, peace and justice for all. let's hope, i quoted the american constitution correctly, did i? -erm, you know, perhaps the kind of way people look on president today. +erm, you know, perhaps the kind of way people look on president today. you know, which is only day one of his inauguration. we'll see what happens to him, president . but erm, that would be for its, for its er,defence, i suppose. -is it fallible i mean how do, how do modern america let's ask er and erm, er and . +is it fallible i mean how do, how do modern america let's ask er and erm, er and . how do modern americans see woodrow wilson? erm what's your image of him? -er, i don't know, i think he forgot you know, +er, i don't know, i think he forgot you know, yeah i don't, i don't -i remembered him having in my school library +i remembered him having in my school library mm. he was regarded as a very very smart man mm. and er, one of our most intellectual presidents. yeah. and i don't think, i don't think most people considered him vulnerable, very vulnerable. -i mean, they know that working +i mean, they know that working yeah. but i don't think most people, er, would necessarily consider it than now on the european side, they might consider . erm, but you know, but i think they did. @@ -20628,37 +20605,37 @@ frankly, he was a i see. no. everything he wants. -but the things is, he wanted to a lot of things about came up like in the middle +but the things is, he wanted to a lot of things about came up like in the middle mm. -ages before the war you more you think about it, +ages before the war you more you think about it, mm. yes. i see, yes. anyone else got a view on this? he was a very odd man, though mm. -as freud said, that at fourteen adult life +as freud said, that at fourteen adult life good one, doc, yes, -and erm, i mean er, the last eighteen months of his presidency he erm, settled with mrs wilson because he would be incapable +and erm, i mean er, the last eighteen months of his presidency he erm, settled with mrs wilson because he would be incapable yeah, the, of course, er, freud had one advantage here, and that was bullitt. erm, as we know, bullitt was a member of the delegation and an intimate of, of wilson, so the book is er co- authored, so in a sense we should know as we're paying for, for all of it, because er, obviously, he relied on bullitt to give him all this biographical information, and er, consequently what you see freud doing in this in this book is, is er trawling through, as it were, the things that bullitt told him, that, that bullitt had found out, to erm, draw a kind of psy psychoanalytic portrait of woodrow wilson, that erm, tried to explain his problem, why did he not deliver the goods as it were . -and the if you put the character of woodrow wilson aside, the, the central theme which comes out of this book, which is i think why it's important, worth reading certainly the introduction is worth reading. +and the if you put the character of woodrow wilson aside, the, the central theme which comes out of this book, which is i think why it's important, worth reading certainly the introduction is worth reading. there is a three or four page brief introduction er, to the book, which is presumably by freud himself, because it's about psychoanalysis, and i don't think bullitt could have written it. erm, what's worth reading about that, and it comes out strongly in the introduction, is that this is a kind of case stu study of a particular kind of person. er, er, a man who grows up under the shadow of his father, as it were. -so it's quite an interesting, whatever you think about woodrow wilson in the first world war is quite a interesting book, in drawing a character study of the kind of person who freud must have seen many times in his practice. +so it's quite an interesting, whatever you think about woodrow wilson in the first world war is quite a interesting book, in drawing a character study of the kind of person who freud must have seen many times in his practice. the man who grows up idealizing his father, and whose relationship with his father is a largely passive one. so he tends to regard his father as a kind of ideal he can never equal, and tends if anything to identify with er, with his own mother, and play a kind of passive role to his, to his father. and this is how freud explains wilson's inability to stand up to the other men, like woodrow, like cle clements or lloyd george, who were rather aggressive, and er, were, were kind of pushing all the time, what they could out of the, out of the peace settlement, and what, er the book shows, is that woodrow wilson would have confrontations with them and say a lot of fine words, and then the next day, he would, he would give it all away, as it were, he would, he would be ill or he'll backtrack, or when the actual agreements came to be signed, he, he wouldn't do what he said he would, er,wh what he did. so freud has to explain this weakness of wilson, in the face of erm, these much more dominant aggressive men he was up against in these very hard er hitting negotiations, about what to do about the world after, after world war one. -so, freud's view is that he was, this passive erm nature of, of, of, retiring er nature of, of woodrow wilson, which explains his inte intellectuality as says, erm, wilson was a very intellectual man. +so, freud's view is that he was, this passive erm nature of, of, of, retiring er nature of, of woodrow wilson, which explains his inte intellectuality as says, erm, wilson was a very intellectual man. he had a great fondness for speeches and oratory. apparently, in his childhood, he'd give speeches to an empty barn, er, had, would stand in the, in the family barn, erm, giving lectures to the hay, you know, and he, he, he loved this, and he, he was, he had a great erm sense of grandiloquent language and, freud and bullitt's interpretation is that, woodrow wilson, in a sense, was a typical politician. very good at words, not so good at, at, at actions and actually delivering the goods as it were so, why, why do you ? -well, er i asked this, because erm, when i was having my house it came up, and i and i pointed out to her th the astonishing anomaly, i said, look erm, everybody knows about manuscript, ernest and his biography of freud mentions it and says he read it and reports rather well of it, actually, was really quite impressed with it. -i said knew about it, erm, you must have known about it, erm, that standard edition of the complete psychological works of freud, that's its title, and you're one of the editors, one of the editors, i said, there's no evidence that you ever intended to include this book in it, even though, you know, i understand that it couldn't be published as long as woodrow wilson's family was still alive, but erm, you know, why wasn't it published in the standard edition? -and said i don't know. +well, er i asked this, because erm, when i was having my house it came up, and i and i pointed out to her th the astonishing anomaly, i said, look erm, everybody knows about manuscript, ernest and his biography of freud mentions it and says he read it and reports rather well of it, actually, was really quite impressed with it. +i said knew about it, erm, you must have known about it, erm, that standard edition of the complete psychological works of freud, that's its title, and you're one of the editors, one of the editors, i said, there's no evidence that you ever intended to include this book in it, even though, you know, i understand that it couldn't be published as long as woodrow wilson's family was still alive, but erm, you know, why wasn't it published in the standard edition? +and said i don't know. now, she could have been lying. i don't think she would have told me a, a lie. when i asked her things like that, she didn't want to tell me on other occasions, she said i know that i can't tell you. @@ -20670,53 +20647,53 @@ erm, the fact is, she didn't play a dominant part in the standard tradition, alt er, she was mainly one of the editors because she was erm, her father's, you know she even inherited her father's estate. so, so that was in her share of the management . i don't think she'd taken erm prominent role in the day to day planning of the standard edition, this was done by erm, calculable spreadsheet. -so erm, i think when she said she didn't know, er, she was telling the truth, and when asked her if she could explain to me, the very point that just asked me, again she said she, she couldn't explain, she had, she she'd agreed, agreed it was a paradox, that she didn't really know erm, why the book had never been published, or until nineteen sixty seven erm note, note that it, that it had been taken. +so erm, i think when she said she didn't know, er, she was telling the truth, and when asked her if she could explain to me, the very point that just asked me, again she said she, she couldn't explain, she had, she she'd agreed, agreed it was a paradox, that she didn't really know erm, why the book had never been published, or until nineteen sixty seven erm note, note that it, that it had been taken. erm, my only view is that, er, the reason is that, by the time it saw the light of day, because remember, the manuscript was in the, the manuscript was physically in the possession of the bullitt family not the freud family. erm, when the bullitt family sought it to published it, it was published, but by that time, the kind of changes that i talked about at the beginning of my lectures, had already occurred in psychoanalysis. -psychoanalysis had evolved into a highly therapeutic undertaking, which was very very and institutionalized for therapy, and the black books had already been blackened, as it were. +psychoanalysis had evolved into a highly therapeutic undertaking, which was very very and institutionalized for therapy, and the black books had already been blackened, as it were. people were already tending to ignore these very works we're looking at,theomonoism we'll be looking at next week, gonna tell us about that, aren't you . yes. another very black book, er, civilization discon these kind of books were, er, generally er, at, at er best ignored, at worst disparaged, by the psychoanalytic establishment. so when this book on, on woodrow wilson appeared, i mean, it gets even blacker. er, particularly since it was only half right, or you couldn't exactly tell which half, not very clearly, so if it's half by freud, and er, it was a book erm, on erm, a controversial figure arguing over very controversial pieces, and i think the psychoanalytic study didn't want to have anything to do with it, and er, er, one of the reviews of the psychoanalytic journal that said that this is the kind of book that gets psychoanalysis a bad name. and er, on the other side, the, the people interested in it in the social sciences, erm, didn't particularly like it, because, at that time, they were heavily dominated by er, marxist and people on the left. -i mean, i myself, for instance, after i'd published my first book on psychoanalysis in nineteen eighty was summoned to the house of commons by and given a dinner, in the house of commons restaurant, which isn't very good actually, least it wasn't then, and effectively i was told by this great man was, noticed, had a very high opinion of his own ego, that erm, you know the left was in charge of psychoanalysis in this country, and had better conform or shut up. +i mean, i myself, for instance, after i'd published my first book on psychoanalysis in nineteen eighty was summoned to the house of commons by and given a dinner, in the house of commons restaurant, which isn't very good actually, least it wasn't then, and effectively i was told by this great man was, noticed, had a very high opinion of his own ego, that erm, you know the left was in charge of psychoanalysis in this country, and had better conform or shut up. my views were not politically correct. and would i please stop publishing on psychoanalysis and leave it to my elders and betters. like . so i er, i politely told him what he could do with that, well, i was eating his dinner and i couldn't be too rude to him, but erm, you know, when er when, when confronted, i don't give ground over that kind of thing. i said, you know, i'd every right to resume my own research, erm, if the labour party thought it owned psychoanalysis, i'm afraid i have, have to differ. so we, we parted on that note. -but erm, the people like and the left, didn't like the book either, because it didn't tell their particular interpretation, as kind of left marxist er, interpretation as someone has it, was so popular at the time. +but erm, the people like and the left, didn't like the book either, because it didn't tell their particular interpretation, as kind of left marxist er, interpretation as someone has it, was so popular at the time. and so the book was just kind of, ignored i think, and left standing, and now it's out of print, and we've discovered this week, it's not even in the university library. erm, it must have vanished, there was a copy there. -er, so it's, it, it's one of these strangely anomalous works, it, it's, it has spawned, i must admit, some very unfortunate literature, and i think 's own book is the worst example, but it's not the only one. +er, so it's, it, it's one of these strangely anomalous works, it, it's, it has spawned, i must admit, some very unfortunate literature, and i think 's own book is the worst example, but it's not the only one. there's a whole area of psycho-history. has anybody read about psycho-history? there's a whole school of psycho- history mainly in the united states, not many followers here, and er, i must admit, i, i used to have er a class on psycho-history on this course, and i dropped it, and the reason was, i think students didn't find it very satisfactory, and the literature was of such poor quality. it really was er of the sort, you know, if cleopatra's nose had been half an inch longer, history would have all been different, you know, that, that kind of trivia. -erm i think you can see that the problem with this kind of biographical approach to history is it can degenerate into trivia. -of the kind that himself wrote of . +erm i think you can see that the problem with this kind of biographical approach to history is it can degenerate into trivia. +of the kind that himself wrote of . which i think is, er, is one of the worst examples of trivial. because, because clearly, you can see that in the social sciences, there is a big problem. -if you think that individual people have a big role in history, like and woodrow wilson, i doubt if he did, i mean everybody would admit that these were important figures obviously, but the question is, how important were they, compared with social, political and economic factors, possibly beyond their control? +if you think that individual people have a big role in history, like and woodrow wilson, i doubt if he did, i mean everybody would admit that these were important figures obviously, but the question is, how important were they, compared with social, political and economic factors, possibly beyond their control? i mean this is the big issue, isn't it? -i thought, like, i mean, isn't the basic idea of psychoanalysis is that, you know that, that these people are repressing something and that's studying, and the question is how well, can you arrive at what they were repressing, by just sort of secondhand, you know, i mean +i thought, like, i mean, isn't the basic idea of psychoanalysis is that, you know that, that these people are repressing something and that's studying, and the question is how well, can you arrive at what they were repressing, by just sort of secondhand, you know, i mean mm. -wouldn't you, i mean, not as so best way to figure out what they were repressing, but just, i mean wouldn't you need to really have the whole life in front of you +wouldn't you, i mean, not as so best way to figure out what they were repressing, but just, i mean wouldn't you need to really have the whole life in front of you you would. to figure out? -i mean, we urgently certainly we can psychoanalyse a group, you know, the group psy the group psychology, because we all understand how groups act, and we can say, oh, yes groups act like that, you do act like that, that makes sense and that can prove it, you know. +i mean, we urgently certainly we can psychoanalyse a group, you know, the group psy the group psychology, because we all understand how groups act, and we can say, oh, yes groups act like that, you do act like that, that makes sense and that can prove it, you know. but with, with a man, i mean, you really need to have every single incident in his life, to, to really know what that is absolutely true. -yes, this is another big problem i think you put that very well, that people forget, of course, that in clinical psychoan analysis the analyst has a vast amount of data, because the patient is going five times a week, or in freud's case, six times a week, for fifty minutes every day, six days a week, nine months of the year, often for several years and er, the, the sheer amount of data that the analyst gets, is absolutely immense. +yes, this is another big problem i think you put that very well, that people forget, of course, that in clinical psychoan analysis the analyst has a vast amount of data, because the patient is going five times a week, or in freud's case, six times a week, for fifty minutes every day, six days a week, nine months of the year, often for several years and er, the, the sheer amount of data that the analyst gets, is absolutely immense. i mean, i can well recall in my own analysis with , of course, for the first six months she said nothing, and i used to get very frustrated, and say, look, what do you think of this? what's your interpretation, she would say, oh, we don't know enough yet. she said i'm not sure. we'll have to wait and see. and for about six months, i didn't get anything. when interpretations were offered to me, she said so and so, and i said, why, and then she was ready. -she said there was this female, that the other thing, and there was a whole long list of things that pointed to this interpretation, and it was all part of a, as you say a great mass of data, that erm, is, is quite mind-bogglingly large, if you actually erm, see it in words. +she said there was this female, that the other thing, and there was a whole long list of things that pointed to this interpretation, and it was all part of a, as you say a great mass of data, that erm, is, is quite mind-bogglingly large, if you actually erm, see it in words. erm, it's very difficult, of course, to er, well it's impossible actually, to turn that into er written accounts. because of course if you were to tape record analytic sessions, it would change that nature of the, of the analysis. and er, one of the big scientific problems with psychoanalysis is that privacy and confidentiality are prominent, as obviously in other areas of science, you can er, the demonstration has to be in public, as it were . @@ -20724,10 +20701,10 @@ i mean, other people can do the experiment or repeat it. trouble with an individual psychoanalysis, it can never be. so one of the big problems with an historical figure, is that erm, you don't even have that much data to go on, the data you have is gonna inevitably be, be selective and limited. again i think if freud and bullitt were here today, they'd say, well look we did, in fact, have quite a lot of data, because i, bullitt knew wilson intimately for several years and worked with him, and er, freud had rarely the stuff in erm, in all papers of woodrow wilson in the library of congress or wherever they were, and he had a great deal of data. -but even so, 's point is a good one, that there isn't, there's seldom if ever enough this is a small problem in psychoanalysis, i myself hope to put right to some extent, and some of you may live long enough to see this happen, i hope you will. +but even so, 's point is a good one, that there isn't, there's seldom if ever enough this is a small problem in psychoanalysis, i myself hope to put right to some extent, and some of you may live long enough to see this happen, i hope you will. er, that's why i'll tell you all, i even tell young people. there's no point in telling old people, because they'd be dead. -but erm, there are one or two interesting exceptions to this, and one exception is myself, because er, i started analyzing myself through maybe to nineteen sixty nine, and with one or two small exceptions, like when i was being analyzed by and i didn't like it, with any doubt, my entire analysis was being written down. +but erm, there are one or two interesting exceptions to this, and one exception is myself, because er, i started analyzing myself through maybe to nineteen sixty nine, and with one or two small exceptions, like when i was being analyzed by and i didn't like it, with any doubt, my entire analysis was being written down. erm, i guess now in fact, erm er, last few years is all er, is all er entered in data on computer. and it's my intention to keep up this analysis, er, for as long as it takes, probably to the end of my life. and that er, on the centenary of my birth, which will fall in two thousand and forty six, my heirs and executors will be free to er, release it to the world, on condition, however, that it's published complete and unexpurgated and unedited. @@ -20751,13 +20728,13 @@ erm, that would have been er, really worth knowing . but as i've said, it will, it will be preserved in my case. erm, it's my great contribution to science, unfortunately i shall be long dead, and many of yo some of you may, i don't know how many of you will still be alive in two thousand and forty six, but if you are, you may see this day. i won't of course. -but it's a, it's a problem that, that you've put your finger on, and this is why i personally think that a lot of this literature is of such a poor quality. -and certainly this stuff, i mean, when a person's still alive, how can you possibly know enough? +but it's a, it's a problem that, that you've put your finger on, and this is why i personally think that a lot of this literature is of such a poor quality. +and certainly this stuff, i mean, when a person's still alive, how can you possibly know enough? you see, woodrow wilson was dead, bullitt had access to a lot of private material that er, perhaps there's still,i don't know whether it's ever been published. and of course, bullitt had directly observed the man and interacted with him during the critical time at, at the versailles conference. and the whole book is really about er the versailles conference in a way, isn't it, and about why he behaved the way he did at the time. so there's a kind of critical period here, that we have got a lot of information about. -and in a sense, the book is very one dimensional in that it follows just this one aspect of woodrow wilson's character, the critical one. +and in a sense, the book is very one dimensional in that it follows just this one aspect of woodrow wilson's character, the critical one. now of course, in a, in a complete psychoanalysis, if woodrow wilson had been going for analysis, then all kinds of other aspects of his life and personality would have opened up. and you wouldn't get this concentration on one, this one kind of character defect, which er, admittedly, is a, is a problem with the book and, and can make it look as if it is a kind of character assassination. character assassination of wilson? @@ -20766,14 +20743,14 @@ mm. yes, but freud does er justify this er meaning, that this is why to form a psychological that's because of his limitations -i was gonna further say that erm, you know, beside lack of information itself,information of repression, information into someone's life i mean, repression necessarily i mean the, the thing that someone does in their lifetime might necessarily strange and distracted, and the purpose of the thing -well, yes, that, that's true but i think the, er, by the nineteen twenties, when freud was writing this book, was it nineteen twenty nine, twenty eight, twenty nine, +i was gonna further say that erm, you know, beside lack of information itself,information of repression, information into someone's life i mean, repression necessarily i mean the, the thing that someone does in their lifetime might necessarily strange and distracted, and the purpose of the thing +well, yes, that, that's true but i think the, er, by the nineteen twenties, when freud was writing this book, was it nineteen twenty nine, twenty eight, twenty nine, er, well,certainly, yes. they started it, yes. right, so they, sorry, the early nineteen thirties, when they started it. by that time, freud certainly had moved on a bit, from the earlier, perhaps rather narrow concentration on the repression and he was moving into the second er era of psycho psychoanalysis when there was an emphasis more on the total personality on the ego and its mechanisms of defence, to quote a title of a famous book by , and i think this is more the kind of thing that freud is doing in this book, where you, you see not just the repressions in the unconscious, but the whole personality, and you understand it, in terms of its various defensive erm, structures, and the way which it carried out its repression. -in other words, you concentrate not just on what's repressed in id, but on the structure of the ego as well, and the superego, and the course of nature part of it comes out in the book as told us that woodrow wilson had a tremendous superego in the form of his identification with his father, who he further identified with god, i mean, if i come over very critical indeed, and therefore, his own ego was identified with jesus christ. +in other words, you concentrate not just on what's repressed in id, but on the structure of the ego as well, and the superego, and the course of nature part of it comes out in the book as told us that woodrow wilson had a tremendous superego in the form of his identification with his father, who he further identified with god, i mean, if i come over very critical indeed, and therefore, his own ego was identified with jesus christ. and this, for example, i mean, whether we believe this or not, this freud says, or thinks, explains why wilson could come to europe as a saviour, the saviour of mankind, but then failed to deliver the goods, because of the passive nature of his identification, you know, jesus got crucified. which was a pretty passive thing to do, in some ways, erm, and similarly, you could say woodrow wilson ended up crucified by the, by the allies. a certain fourteen points for cruci everybody must have that . @@ -20782,10 +20759,10 @@ does that answer your so it's part of this larger view of psychoanalysis that was emerging in the thirties. where you could have more of a character study, rather than just the kind of erm, capping the unconscious, as it were since like what you say, psychoanalysis was now, i mean, is it mostly centred on the ego? -i mean, one , since you can't go if you don't +i mean, one , since you can't go if you don't mm. would you say that, you know, in modern psychoanalysis presumably just not the, like the structure of the ego, and then they know -wh what, well,i, i wouldn't say just looking similar, i would say additionally looking, but, but in the, in the early days the erm, and i'll be saying something about this in the, in the lectures,bu but just briefly, that you could you could say there were phases in psychoanalysis, the early days, before both of us were born you were here, the, the aim when the method was , the aim was to release the unconscious, bring it to the surface, and that was regarded as more or less enough. +wh what, well,i, i wouldn't say just looking similar, i would say additionally looking, but, but in the, in the early days the erm, and i'll be saying something about this in the, in the lectures,bu but just briefly, that you could you could say there were phases in psychoanalysis, the early days, before both of us were born you were here, the, the aim when the method was , the aim was to release the unconscious, bring it to the surface, and that was regarded as more or less enough. analyses in those days were short by modern standards. there's an example in my book, with one that only lasted six weeks, for example, which is astonishing by modern standards. after world war one, and especially by the nineteen thirties, the, the purview of psychoanalysis, as it were, had, had enlarged to include the ego, as we saw, and so, so what happened then was, the structure of the ego was explored and not just the repressions. @@ -20803,13 +20780,13 @@ all of this is, is just good as well as bits of gold and er and, and you know me and that's rather like modern analysis, everything is interesting. it's not just what is repressed, it's the structures of the ego that bring about these repressions, the identifications and so on. so it's a more complete er picture, of, of, of the personality, and of course it lends itself to this kind of historical portraiture . -because as says, er, the unconscious is, as a sense, is always hidden, so how do you possibly find out about the unconscious of historical figures that are dead and gone? +because as says, er, the unconscious is, as a sense, is always hidden, so how do you possibly find out about the unconscious of historical figures that are dead and gone? well, the answer is with very very great difficulty. but if you were looking at their egos as well, er their whole personality had its defence disrupted, then of course , you may be able to see a bit more, because you are now looking at areas which are co both conscious and manifest themselves in all kinds of different ways. does that answer your, your point? yeah, i suppose i was thinking, i, i always get mixed up when you say psychoanalysis mm. -i just want to you know modern days was just confusing me and er, all this sort of thing. +i just want to you know modern days was just confusing me and er, all this sort of thing. whereas i think it easy, you know sometimes i get confused about what's what right. so, when, when i talk about psychoanalysis in this course, i mean mainly freudian classical, because it's freud's writings we're looking at. @@ -20821,10 +20798,10 @@ have you got anything, any comments you want to say about this? i mean, i didn't read the book. no. no. -er, i must admit i point freud makes,slightly arrogant erm, i mean it, he's, he's, he's a +er, i must admit i point freud makes,slightly arrogant erm, i mean it, he's, he's, he's a yeah. mm. -his father's you know there's peace conference in nineteen eighteen +his father's you know there's peace conference in nineteen eighteen yeah. did you think that, that, that, that their approach was arrogant and their, the, the affect was trivializing? well, not really, no. @@ -20833,10 +20810,10 @@ the actual book, arise that book anyhow, mm. but it's certainly er, certainly a valid question. yeah. woodrow wilson -well, that's what freud -also subject on. -but i know that such a talented writer. -you know, i mean, i was convinced that there was no such thing as religion after i'd read the book i mean, anything i read about, i immediately say, oh yes, of course that's true, you know. +well, that's what freud +also subject on. +but i know that such a talented writer. +you know, i mean, i was convinced that there was no such thing as religion after i'd read the book i mean, anything i read about, i immediately say, oh yes, of course that's true, you know. so. well, next week, will be telling us about another one of these very controversial books, won't you? yes. @@ -20858,20 +20835,20 @@ finchley road station. mhm. and when you come out of finchley road station, it's in a place called . i may be able to give you a thing about it actually, if i've still got one. -you can visit it, it's open it's best to phone up and find out when they're open, because they're not open every day. -and they interesting? -well, there's i mean it's interesting, erm, it's freud's you know, collection of, of classical and antique . +you can visit it, it's open it's best to phone up and find out when they're open, because they're not open every day. +and they interesting? +well, there's i mean it's interesting, erm, it's freud's you know, collection of, of classical and antique . they, they give the impression that the house is the way it was when he lived there, but it's not quite true, actually, it was earlier on. -erm, it's, it's certainly a lot smarter than could remember when lived there. -erm, and now let's see i used to have a file on this, but i might have passed it or given all the stuff away +erm, it's, it's certainly a lot smarter than could remember when lived there. +erm, and now let's see i used to have a file on this, but i might have passed it or given all the stuff away is it? yeah, it probably is. yes, that's, that's the kind of place you would find it. erm, that is the kind of place you would alright. well, if you suddenly find it, you know -er, don't despair, i haven't finished yet, erm ah, here we are, freud i knew i had it, i knew i had it. -they used to write to me quite regularly here you are. +er, don't despair, i haven't finished yet, erm ah, here we are, freud i knew i had it, i knew i had it. +they used to write to me quite regularly here you are. great. thank you. as i said, check the opening hours, they've probably changed. @@ -20936,50 +20913,50 @@ am i on it ? er, well, they hadn't notified me, but they probably, you told them anyway, did you? yeah, because that's the important thing. -erm, yeah the important thing is that they know. +erm, yeah the important thing is that they know. i mean, i know, i've, i've written it down myself. erm okay, you say you're still right, yeah you're still doing this -i didn't think the question that erm, the question culture was the same as our culture. +i didn't think the question that erm, the question culture was the same as our culture. right. and erm,read about the book so far, and i'm going through erm, okay. why? well, there's no need now, i mean, i only suggested this erm, to help you, er, and i wouldn't want to make you write it out er, just for the sake of writing it out. it don't think it's a good use of your time. -and i mean, if you think that just presenting it in the, in the class is er enough +and i mean, if you think that just presenting it in the, in the class is er enough send it down to use yourself, but to be able to carry that through and to, to go on to, to be sincere, and i respect that it's important to be sincere. -if you, you know, talk about people moral values and to be able to do that, and just majority of anything you need to you need to have a that allows you to do that without +if you, you know, talk about people moral values and to be able to do that, and just majority of anything you need to you need to have a that allows you to do that without yes, yeah. yes, it's very important to remember that both in, from this direct point of view and from freud's findings, you shouldn't just assume that it was a watertight compartment between two areas, as it were. one conscious and un it's not like that. i mean, in fact, what, what er, what freud found, he says is sometimes, you get erm, this is in fact a kind of continuing from conscious and unconscious, and there's a big gradation in between, and very often erm, things are erm, unconscious, not in the sense that they're totally lost, and you are unaware of them, but for example , they're, they're isolated. -they, they, they exist erm,princ a very common finding in psychoanalysis is that things will, will, will exist as word representations, with no feeling representation, or they won't be connected to, to er they'd be completely isolated. -you know, a very good example of this, that always sticks in my mind,telling me erm, that once she was analyzing a woman and er, a lot of the analysis was concerned with erm, conflicts, erm, relating to masturbation in childhood, and constantly felt that this was what the analysis seemed to have done , because the woman consistently denied this had ever happened. +they, they, they exist erm,princ a very common finding in psychoanalysis is that things will, will, will exist as word representations, with no feeling representation, or they won't be connected to, to er they'd be completely isolated. +you know, a very good example of this, that always sticks in my mind,telling me erm, that once she was analyzing a woman and er, a lot of the analysis was concerned with erm, conflicts, erm, relating to masturbation in childhood, and constantly felt that this was what the analysis seemed to have done , because the woman consistently denied this had ever happened. absolutely denied, she'd ever done that. then one day, said she described something she often used to do in childhood, habitually did. -and she had a special name for it, i can't remember what is was now, but it was an innocuous word, like erm erm, kneading, or something like that, something you do with your fingers. -erm, and said, okay, that's what you called it in childhood, you called, say kneading, if that's what it was. +and she had a special name for it, i can't remember what is was now, but it was an innocuous word, like erm erm, kneading, or something like that, something you do with your fingers. +erm, and said, okay, that's what you called it in childhood, you called, say kneading, if that's what it was. she said, now, supposing you had to look up what you just described, you know, in a dictionary, and find a word that everybody would associate with it. what word would you find? and she said, the woman thought for a minute, and suddenly she gasped when said that's masturbation, isn't it? -and said, yes. +and said, yes. and she said, but i've always known i did that. and, you see, she'd known it, but it had been entered under another word, in her mind. as she didn't connect it with what everyone else calls masturbation. you know, er, that's a horrible thing that other people do. -she had her own term for it, and as long as it was purely associated with that term, she never connected it. +she had her own term for it, and as long as it was purely associated with that term, she never connected it. and that's quite a typical finding. -that things remain unconscious, not because you never knew about them, but because they're never brought into the relevant connections with other things that make you conscious of the thing in the sense of seeing what's in it for mrs you know,reports. +that things remain unconscious, not because you never knew about them, but because they're never brought into the relevant connections with other things that make you conscious of the thing in the sense of seeing what's in it for mrs you know,reports. so we're not saying it's a question of conscious unconscious, or rigid demarcation where we are actually talking about subtle gradations of consciousness, from complete self conscious awareness at one end, to total loss of all memory of the thing at, at, at the other. -and everything in the between, and most stuff is in between, as a matter of fact. +and everything in the between, and most stuff is in between, as a matter of fact. so i think you're right, it's a very very important, erm, and, and often in life, you can find people switch from one to the other with astonishing speeds. i mean, some people have kind of butterfly minds, with butterfly behaviour, and they switch from being one type of person or another type of person almost minute by minute. you just can't keep up with them. i mean what does this, you know, what is, is this? -i mean, do to have this astonishing capacity of switch all the time. +i mean, do to have this astonishing capacity of switch all the time. you just don't know, know where you are with them. well, that was interesting, it was interesting discussion, er, thanks to an excellent paper, we're, we're, we're delighted, and that was first rate. who did i say was next week? @@ -20999,7 +20976,7 @@ had you seen it before? i hated it. it is a bit, is er is er is a bit odd. i suppose you liked it? -well, i must say i liked it, er, i mean, i showed it because er suggested it. +well, i must say i liked it, er, i mean, i showed it because er suggested it. i thought it filled in the, the kind of, some of the biographical kind of things we don't have time to do in the course. was interesting. i mean, the general, i mean @@ -21009,7 +20986,7 @@ perhaps not. er, it depends yeah, yeah. fine. -the sexual aperitif. +the sexual aperitif. yeah, it did. er. yeah, yeah, have a look, hold on. @@ -21034,12 +21011,12 @@ no. erm, well, i was yeah. and i mean, i considered myself to have been like, er, frequent, or erm, whatever. -so er, on the last seminar, they all talked about sending out letters to all the students who weren't there the attendance was very low, and i received one, but +so er, on the last seminar, they all talked about sending out letters to all the students who weren't there the attendance was very low, and i received one, but right. enough. -and er, i was also asked why i had offered to and i'd already spoken to the students' secretary about it. +and er, i was also asked why i had offered to and i'd already spoken to the students' secretary about it. yeah. -so i wrote back to and +so i wrote back to and mm. yeah. i'm not giving the paper for health reasons. @@ -21054,19 +21031,19 @@ so are you, are you be going to seminar? yes. yeah. yeah,i have to . -thing is i, i just i can't work . +thing is i, i just i can't work . no. -i go sick +i go sick no. somehow i haven't been able to work no, okay. because i'm really worried mm. -when i think about it i think i just can't work, it's like, i've lost interest whenever i find some i feel i'm able to keep up +when i think about it i think i just can't work, it's like, i've lost interest whenever i find some i feel i'm able to keep up mm which is something i mm. -i mean want to i have considered going back to er, training and cancel this +i mean want to i have considered going back to er, training and cancel this right, i see, what dropping this altogether? er, no, i'd like to come in. mm. @@ -21075,15 +21052,14 @@ mm. yeah. and perhaps after that come back to right. -i really +i really well, the, i mean the, the thing about the end fill is - four legs good! two legs bad! unless you're a chicken, or to put it boldly, animals have rights too! but exactly what rights do they have? and does supporting animal rights justify violence? -the animal rights lobby is a forceful one by various means, some legal, some not, some specific, some violent. +the animal rights lobby is a forceful one by various means, some legal, some not, some specific, some violent. campaigners seek to convince the unconverted that animals deserve a better deal! which animals? and what's the better deal? @@ -21094,25 +21070,25 @@ all animals? any animals? do they deserve a better deal? button one for yes, and button two for no. -this is a descriptive vote because this hundred er women are not a representative cross section of the whole of scotland they're invited to come from various places and ninety six of them think that animals deserve a better deal. +this is a descriptive vote because this hundred er women are not a representative cross section of the whole of scotland they're invited to come from various places and ninety six of them think that animals deserve a better deal. when you said yes to that which animals did you mean? and what were you talking about? yes? -i think, a lot of people see the stray dogs problem as a big problem, certainly if people have decided to partake of pets, they have a responsibility to look after them and not throw them out on the streets. +i think, a lot of people see the stray dogs problem as a big problem, certainly if people have decided to partake of pets, they have a responsibility to look after them and not throw them out on the streets. okay so -and i think problems like that are due to human irresponsibility! +and i think problems like that are due to human irresponsibility! so those animals do have a raw deal! okay, that's one area. who else said yes, and why? up, yes? i think animals that are used for human entertainment definitely deserve a better deal, for example, large wi wild animals that are used in circuses, we haven't got the right, as people, to say that they're here for our entertainment. what would that better deal be in that case? -the better deal would be, not being transported up and down the country, and not being made to perform tricks that are un unnatural to their own behaviour patterns. +the better deal would be, not being transported up and down the country, and not being made to perform tricks that are un unnatural to their own behaviour patterns. aha. aha. any other views? yes? -i think that er concern should also spread to animals that are hunted pleasure as well, i.e. the stags, deer, foxes, hares, i mean, there's there's quite a considerable list that's all done for entertainment. +i think that er concern should also spread to animals that are hunted pleasure as well, i.e. the stags, deer, foxes, hares, i mean, there's there's quite a considerable list that's all done for entertainment. mhm. now the better deal there presumably would involve not chasing them at all! @@ -21120,21 +21096,21 @@ not hunting them at all? no! i mean okay. -let them live their lives in peace without the harassment of chasing them with dogs and supporters and what have you! +let them live their lives in peace without the harassment of chasing them with dogs and supporters and what have you! okay. -any others that, yes? +any others that, yes? i don't think animals should be ta , used to be tested for cosmetics mhm. -perfumes or detergents +perfumes or detergents mhm. different things like that. what about medical research? -well, there again, yes, with reservations because if it comes to the fact that if it's going to save human lives, yes. -yes, and you get all the animals who are experimented on and you sa there's not a week that comes out and you don't an a report saying, oh well this this, this causes cancer in rats or and you, imagine the amount, the huge amounts of the sub , whatever substance it is that had been given to rats to cause the cancer, and there's no knowing that the amount that's gonna be given to rats causing cancer, will give cancer to humans! +well, there again, yes, with reservations because if it comes to the fact that if it's going to save human lives, yes. +yes, and you get all the animals who are experimented on and you sa there's not a week that comes out and you don't an a report saying, oh well this this, this causes cancer in rats or and you, imagine the amount, the huge amounts of the sub , whatever substance it is that had been given to rats to cause the cancer, and there's no knowing that the amount that's gonna be given to rats causing cancer, will give cancer to humans! i mean,i it's just absolutely ridiculous! i'm a trustee for the beauty without cruelty charity aha. -and we would like to see an end to all experiments on animals, for cosmetics, toiletry, household product purposes. +and we would like to see an end to all experiments on animals, for cosmetics, toiletry, household product purposes. hasn't that campaign been going for oh many, many years! a long time? @@ -21142,15 +21118,15 @@ yes! and we're making progress now. how? there are already many alternatives to the research carried out on animals which has been going on for a long time. -erm for example, you can grow human skin in a, in a cell culture and use that as a, as a testing er, medium +erm for example, you can grow human skin in a, in a cell culture and use that as a, as a testing er, medium mhm. instead of a live animal. -we can it can use erm a si similar substance for eye tests erm, to test to replace the jeyes eye test +we can it can use erm a si similar substance for eye tests erm, to test to replace the jeyes eye test mhm. which again has been used for a long time on animals. these tests are very misleading. they don't protect bu su er, er the public, they protect the people who are actually manufacturing the products. -now do you think that the campaign th the th , the campaigns against the use in cosmetic testing had anything to do with the changes that were brought in, or do you think advances and responsible er science would have, would have made those changes anyway? +now do you think that the campaign th the th , the campaigns against the use in cosmetic testing had anything to do with the changes that were brought in, or do you think advances and responsible er science would have, would have made those changes anyway? i think inevitably,th the changes would have come because the, the alternatives are better. yep. they are less misleading. @@ -21162,93 +21138,93 @@ yes. none! i think we would have advanced to the stage we are at had we not used animals in the earlier stages for medical research. we're advancing all the time and i think there may came a time we won't use animals at all for medical research, but at, up till now we needed to use animals for medical research. -i think you've got to be realistic about this whole issue, that er, obviously seeing the poor furry little bunny suffering for cosmetics! +i think you've got to be realistic about this whole issue, that er, obviously seeing the poor furry little bunny suffering for cosmetics! mhm. yes! i agree, that is wrong! but, if a test on a chimpanzee would save my child's life i'm afraid i'd go for the test on the chimpanzee. okay. yes? -erm i i think that one of the erm, drawbacks in using animals for any kind of testing is that it sort of precludes in some way using alternatives. +erm i i think that one of the erm, drawbacks in using animals for any kind of testing is that it sort of precludes in some way using alternatives. and i think that, you know people who, they may be trained when they're a studying to mhm. -use animals, and then go onto to work using animals, and erm you know, if maybe alternative techniques were introduced at an earlier stage, maybe in their training, they'd be more likely to them on board. -but, it's almost like it's the established pattern to use animals to test +use animals, and then go onto to work using animals, and erm you know, if maybe alternative techniques were introduced at an earlier stage, maybe in their training, they'd be more likely to them on board. +but, it's almost like it's the established pattern to use animals to test mhm. all sorts of things, and it's gonna take quite a big shifty to get out of that. mhm. yes? i agree with what that lady's just said. -what i find horrible is that there are so many organisations or or places all over great britain, they're all doing the same sort of tests! -can't we collate our knowledge so that not so many tests are having to be done on all these animals? +what i find horrible is that there are so many organisations or or places all over great britain, they're all doing the same sort of tests! +can't we collate our knowledge so that not so many tests are having to be done on all these animals? yes? yes. -erm, being with the s s p c a, i have seen a lot of very sad pictures of animals, but one of the saddest photographs i saw, quite recently was two monkeys, well they're primates, we are +erm, being with the s s p c a, i have seen a lot of very sad pictures of animals, but one of the saddest photographs i saw, quite recently was two monkeys, well they're primates, we are yep. -part of that family too, and they were in a lab awaiting experimentation and they were in cages side by side and they'd stretched their arms out and were holding hands, almost as though, to give each other comfort. +part of that family too, and they were in a lab awaiting experimentation and they were in cages side by side and they'd stretched their arms out and were holding hands, almost as though, to give each other comfort. mhm. monkeys feel pain. -they feel happiness, sadness and they also have a sense of humour. +they feel happiness, sadness and they also have a sense of humour. under the nineteen eighty six act mm. they have stated that all use of animals must be justified and it very carefully policed by the home office, as well as locally. -i mean, it's it's vets etcetera +i mean, it's it's vets etcetera yeah. yep. -are always present in research establishments to ensure the well being of the animals, and very often there is actually no pain involved in the research. +are always present in research establishments to ensure the well being of the animals, and very often there is actually no pain involved in the research. how, how do you know that? well i was told by somebody who's involved in animal right. research! right. -but er, frequently the animals are used for the research and there's no pain involved at that time and they are killed humanly before the research actually takes place. +but er, frequently the animals are used for the research and there's no pain involved at that time and they are killed humanly before the research actually takes place. but do we find it acceptable that animals should be used, however painless the event. well i would rather use an animal any time that my own child! up there. -er, switzerland is one country that has banned the use of animals for research, and i think we ought to be going along these lines that, if animals have rights we ought not to be using them for experimentation. +er, switzerland is one country that has banned the use of animals for research, and i think we ought to be going along these lines that, if animals have rights we ought not to be using them for experimentation. mhm. -and if we were to ban the the process,th erm we would devise other means for research, would, we would find alternatives. +and if we were to ban the the process,th erm we would devise other means for research, would, we would find alternatives. there. th there'll, there'll quickly move it somewhere where we can do it. it's quite -alright, they move it out of switzerland but if we can't have it here we'll have it in pakistan or somewhere where they want the money! -so it won't make any difference in that +alright, they move it out of switzerland but if we can't have it here we'll have it in pakistan or somewhere where they want the money! +so it won't make any difference in that yes? respect. i do not think that research has gone as fast as it should! mhm. -and it's going to be a long time before it's going to be possible, so therefore we still have to use animals, i see no way round it. +and it's going to be a long time before it's going to be possible, so therefore we still have to use animals, i see no way round it. mhm. -and i know that they're using cultures and things but i still think that we are a long way from not using animals. +and i know that they're using cultures and things but i still think that we are a long way from not using animals. up there. -erm can i, can i move this conversation on to the +erm can i, can i move this conversation on to the yes. th th the, the veterinary side? mhm. erm, we've we've covered the fact that animal models don't always reflect the human situation, but if we're going to understand control and eradicate disease in animals, this sort of work must go on. could i go back to something the lady here yes. -said about the animal procedures act of nineteen eighty six, erm, i know she's been told about the animals are killed painlessly and that they suffer very little pain, where there's any pain at all, but in fact this act erm which is governed by a committee only erm issues guidelines as to what might happen. -no matter how serious an infringement there might be of that act they are not subject to any sort of criminal offence. +said about the animal procedures act of nineteen eighty six, erm, i know she's been told about the animals are killed painlessly and that they suffer very little pain, where there's any pain at all, but in fact this act erm which is governed by a committee only erm issues guidelines as to what might happen. +no matter how serious an infringement there might be of that act they are not subject to any sort of criminal offence. sh shall we try and see what the er, what the general feeling on this is? -do you think that er the use of animals in research is ever justified? +do you think that er the use of animals in research is ever justified? er, button one for yes, and button two for no. research there being either on behalf of animals themselves, or on behalf of er, of humans. is research on er, the use of animals in research ever justified? and this particular hundred are creeping in with their votes but have decided, seventy fo seventy seven of them say yes, all be it th th th , by far the majority, and twenty three say no. -could anyone say what the consequences would be if they weren't available for use in er in the development of human er medicines and treatment? -well i wouldn't be here because a horse was used for a toxin to provide the anti-toxin for diphtheria whe , in my days when i was younger there was no toxins as such, vaccination as such and so therefore the horses were used for research to provide the anti-toxins. +could anyone say what the consequences would be if they weren't available for use in er in the development of human er medicines and treatment? +well i wouldn't be here because a horse was used for a toxin to provide the anti-toxin for diphtheria whe , in my days when i was younger there was no toxins as such, vaccination as such and so therefore the horses were used for research to provide the anti-toxins. so do you think people who would like to ban the use of animals in research are in, are in cloud cuckoo land do you? yes? would any of you twenty three like to defend your position? yes? -erm, i'm just not sure why any any person would think that they have more right to life than animals do. -i mean what what gives you more right to life than an animal does? +erm, i'm just not sure why any any person would think that they have more right to life than animals do. +i mean what what gives you more right to life than an animal does? anyone wa -just because we have, a so called civilized nation that we live in that destroys the world, that destroys animals that destroys the environment we're living in! +just because we have, a so called civilized nation that we live in that destroys the world, that destroys animals that destroys the environment we're living in! you know, where's our right to life come from? i think you can far too sentimental about it! -erm humans are more important than animals, you you cannot gi equate an animal life with human life. +erm humans are more important than animals, you you cannot gi equate an animal life with human life. we are the intelligent order. being intelligent, we hope we won't be cruel to animals, but you can't say that we are, animals are just as important as humans. mhm. @@ -21284,13 +21260,13 @@ mhm. choice, they have no say. mhm. there, yes? -how do you know that erm animals don't reason? +how do you know that erm animals don't reason? like, how do you know what goes on, like with, dolphins, with whales, with all sorts of species of animals, like we don't know, well we're so dense we can only see things like this! we don't know what goes on there, we've got no right to interfere with their lives! yes? i think, i think we're overlooking one erm mhm. -great power that the individual has, instead of being ing , indignant about erm, our views on animals in research, we could quite simply exercise our power, not to buy the products, to ask questions of our +great power that the individual has, instead of being ing , indignant about erm, our views on animals in research, we could quite simply exercise our power, not to buy the products, to ask questions of our mm mm. of our doctors what kind of drug it is? what research goes behind it? @@ -21298,87 +21274,87 @@ do to exercise our individual intelligence to examine the facts on no , on the b we can buy a different type of product. and there are many mhm. -companies now erm which quite obviously assert that fact, on the doorways of chemists for instance, they do not test on animals. +companies now erm which quite obviously assert that fact, on the doorways of chemists for instance, they do not test on animals. so you're saying the consumer pressure could could change things? mhm. it it it's every effective measure mm. -of stopping erm, a certain product it simply will go out of production. +of stopping erm, a certain product it simply will go out of production. i would disagree that er, humans aren't used in experiments because i think that we're all being used at various points in our lives, for experiments, medical or otherwise. mhm. -and erm a , a lot of the medicines that are passed er have been passed to a certain degree and then th th the we become the the animal. +and erm a , a lot of the medicines that are passed er have been passed to a certain degree and then th th the we become the the animal. are you speaking as a, as an experienced guinea pig yourself? -well i'm a diabetic erm +well i'm a diabetic erm yes. so to a certain extent th the human that was introduced in the last few mhm. -years has has is an experiment. +years has has is an experiment. how do you feel about that? i, don't mind being used as a guinea pig because i feel that it'll help people in the future. up there. i believe that we have been given the right to have dominion over animals. the point i would like to put over is, i've listened to one or two erm, radio programmes, and television programmes about this and i personally would like to have more evidence of what actually happens to the animals. -i don't think us er er public people really realize what is going on and i think then they would maybe stand up and be +i don't think us er er public people really realize what is going on and i think then they would maybe stand up and be mm. -and be counted, but i think we've tended to stand back and just say well we know it's going on but what is actually being done to these +and be counted, but i think we've tended to stand back and just say well we know it's going on but what is actually being done to these mhm. animals? yes? -yes, we that lady over said there were guidelines, there were people that go in and inspect, but there are not enough, it is a known fact, that there are not enough people to go and inspect all the establishments where animal erm, experimentations are taking place and, i love animals, and alright, yes,yo you can do ex , some experiments on animals but let's not be cruel! -that lady up there said that we have experiments, i'm sure, human experiments , you know, experiments, sorry, on human people +yes, we that lady over said there were guidelines, there were people that go in and inspect, but there are not enough, it is a known fact, that there are not enough people to go and inspect all the establishments where animal erm, experimentations are taking place and, i love animals, and alright, yes,yo you can do ex , some experiments on animals but let's not be cruel! +that lady up there said that we have experiments, i'm sure, human experiments , you know, experiments, sorry, on human people mm. but, on human beings, but we're not put through the state that animals are! we mm. don't have great lumps made to grown on us, we don't go through she , severe pain. -and, which company was it that says, to do something about pain you first have to create it. +and, which company was it that says, to do something about pain you first have to create it. mm. ah, i mean that's terrible! i was responsible for researching into the, so called cruelty free products for beauty without cruelty, and it was a real can of worms! i was yep! i was sorry i got involved in it at one point! -erm cosmetic companies are very devious! +erm cosmetic companies are very devious! it's what they don't tell you that's important. erm, there is a big problem at the moment with cosmetic labelling, for example, erm just exactly what does cruelty free mean? what does against animal testing mean? these are the kind of things that are actually on cosmetic products. mm. it could mean, erm, against animal testing but i go along with it anyway. -it could mean erm cruelty free, er erm who de defines in that case, what cruelty is? -er, not, not tested on animals might mean, by me by but by someone else! +it could mean erm cruelty free, er erm who de defines in that case, what cruelty is? +er, not, not tested on animals might mean, by me by but by someone else! and it all sells products! -and, beauty without cruelty has been involved recently in having er, trying to put forward an e c erm, directive on th er, the labelling of cosmetics, but it's very, very difficult! +and, beauty without cruelty has been involved recently in having er, trying to put forward an e c erm, directive on th er, the labelling of cosmetics, but it's very, very difficult! and, mainly because of those kind of problems. yeah. yep. -what do you mean by erm, not tested on animals? +what do you mean by erm, not tested on animals? the finished product? the ingredient? -ingredients are tested for other reasons too not necessarily just for the cosmetic and toiletry trade. -i think that one of the outstanding erm criticisms that i would make of the whole programme, in research with animals, is the fact that only two licences have been revoked i think you said +ingredients are tested for other reasons too not necessarily just for the cosmetic and toiletry trade. +i think that one of the outstanding erm criticisms that i would make of the whole programme, in research with animals, is the fact that only two licences have been revoked i think you said mhm. -on now, i think it's a bit like factory inspectors, and i talk from experience on this, er th o i me , everything gets cleaned up before the inspectors +on now, i think it's a bit like factory inspectors, and i talk from experience on this, er th o i me , everything gets cleaned up before the inspectors mhm. arrive! if you report something you always get the same reply, nothing wrong when we went round! mm. -i'd like to move with th er, i i think tha wi given wi , though we haven't got all that much time, can we move onto another area that was brought up at the beginning of the programme which was erm the use of animals in recreation and er lisa particularly mentioned hunting, now, she thinks hunting should be banned, do you? +i'd like to move with th er, i i think tha wi given wi , though we haven't got all that much time, can we move onto another area that was brought up at the beginning of the programme which was erm the use of animals in recreation and er lisa particularly mentioned hunting, now, she thinks hunting should be banned, do you? do you think hunting animals should be banned? -various animals that hunted in this country, foxes, in some places deer, hares are coursed er in some places. +various animals that hunted in this country, foxes, in some places deer, hares are coursed er in some places. well well! there's an interesting result! seventy nine of you think yes, hunting should be banned. for the minority, twenty one say, no. would any of those twenty one feel brave enough to say why they said no? yes? -well i i so , should er be unhappy to see the, the the red-coated huntsmen a an abolished scenario. -but, erm i think they could instead have an electric fox, if there's such a thing? -or, a drag and there's no need to interfere with the fox at all. +well i i so , should er be unhappy to see the, the the red-coated huntsmen a an abolished scenario. +but, erm i think they could instead have an electric fox, if there's such a thing? +or, a drag and there's no need to interfere with the fox at all. okay. yes? -they say that hunting's for er er human pleasure, er, i mean personally i've only been to one hunt, and i don't see what all the the, the, the, the trouble's about because the huntsman is only a spectator, it's the hounds that are hunting the fox and it is to keep the foxes down. +they say that hunting's for er er human pleasure, er, i mean personally i've only been to one hunt, and i don't see what all the the, the, the, the trouble's about because the huntsman is only a spectator, it's the hounds that are hunting the fox and it is to keep the foxes down. what's better than , gassing, shooting, poisoning? mm. what's more humane? @@ -21387,47 +21363,47 @@ from my point of view, yeah. yes? beside you. yes, i i would have to, i'd have to disagree with er, my colleague here. -erm, i, it's not the shooting is, most certainly, as long as it's with a a qualified marksman +erm, i, it's not the shooting is, most certainly, as long as it's with a a qualified marksman mm. it's most mhm. -definitely less cruel than hunting because the animal is chased and er, what it's heart is doing while it's being chased and it's, really is the idea's quite horrendous to me! -and actually, hunting doesn't kill all that many foxes, a a hunt probably erm, kills one an, at a meet if they're lucky. +definitely less cruel than hunting because the animal is chased and er, what it's heart is doing while it's being chased and it's, really is the idea's quite horrendous to me! +and actually, hunting doesn't kill all that many foxes, a a hunt probably erm, kills one an, at a meet if they're lucky. but hunting does maintain jobs, and countryside people often say. would anyone like mm. to talk to, to to that? yes? well coming from a rural community -erm hunting and shooting and fishing are very important to the +erm hunting and shooting and fishing are very important to the yeah. -economy of the community and to have suburbia creeping in and trying to dictate to what has been the foundation of the of their economy, for many, many years is almost ridiculous! +economy of the community and to have suburbia creeping in and trying to dictate to what has been the foundation of the of their economy, for many, many years is almost ridiculous! mhm. down there. i think the idea of taking a fox and having it ripped apart legitimized by our society is a bad message to pass onto our children! -when children nowadays are becoming more responsible to our society, and they see us as one world we have a responsibility to protect ourselves and our world, and that includes the animals in it. +when children nowadays are becoming more responsible to our society, and they see us as one world we have a responsibility to protect ourselves and our world, and that includes the animals in it. the seventy nine of you who voted for banning hunting,a are you all townees, do you not understand th the fabric of er, of the country? do you have an alternative to offer that would er, that would sustain that fabric? yes? -i live in the country, i live in the heart of the country right next to a sheep farm, and there's no co , no message at all from the farmer that foxes are a pest it's a misnomer put about by the hunt. +i live in the country, i live in the heart of the country right next to a sheep farm, and there's no co , no message at all from the farmer that foxes are a pest it's a misnomer put about by the hunt. fox hunting was started, two hundred, three hundred years ago by the aristocracy because there wasn't enough deer, because the fo the forests were getting obliterated by the same pi , the same people, it was started as an entertainment, it's an entertainment now! and now the hunt are turning round and they're lying about what they're doing, they're saying it's pest control, they're saying, we do it, it's quick, it's a sharp nip in the back of the neck. it's not! -the hunt encourages foxes into their land they actually build artificial earths, we saw one of saturday when we were out protesting, the ar , they encourage foxes onto the land so they can hunt them. +the hunt encourages foxes into their land they actually build artificial earths, we saw one of saturday when we were out protesting, the ar , they encourage foxes onto the land so they can hunt them. a hunt is no good without foxes. they don't want foxes alright. to be depleted at any way, they encourage them! so you actually go out and do something about yes. -your your your er your feelings? +your your your er your feelings? wha what do you do as a protester? we actually, i'm actually er, in the scottish action against blood sports aha. and we do many things, we write to mp's, we write to councils trying to get them banned off the land, and we've been very successful. -we've actually helped stop the oldest hunt in scotland, in li lithgo in stirlingshire, which ended last year. -we were very successful then and we've now progressed. -we go out every single saturday, weekdays if we can, and we try and stop the stop the fo , hounds killing the foxes +we've actually helped stop the oldest hunt in scotland, in li lithgo in stirlingshire, which ended last year. +we were very successful then and we've now progressed. +we go out every single saturday, weekdays if we can, and we try and stop the stop the fo , hounds killing the foxes so peacefully. so so you're proud of having stopped the oldest hunt in, in scotland? @@ -21435,19 +21411,19 @@ very! right. i'd like to disagree with that. ah. -i'm an ex-master's wife from lithgo in stirlingshire hunt, and we had to stop because erm the country was disappearing underneath us. +i'm an ex-master's wife from lithgo in stirlingshire hunt, and we had to stop because erm the country was disappearing underneath us. we had a new mm. -town built in our country with two motorways, and the towns have all expanded to great extent and that was why we had to give up, it was nothing to do with our friends the saboteurs. +town built in our country with two motorways, and the towns have all expanded to great extent and that was why we had to give up, it was nothing to do with our friends the saboteurs. it was creeping suburbia then, it wasn't creeping suburbia. so wha yes. -what do you do now with the, what do the old the old hunt's people do? +what do you do now with the, what do the old the old hunt's people do? well we've, we just have to er, grin and bear it. there is nowhere else to go for us. yes. -i would like to ask the saboteurs how they can justify the fact that they ill-treat hounds and horses? +i would like to ask the saboteurs how they can justify the fact that they ill-treat hounds and horses? now i personally have had a horse actually had things thrown at it by saboteurs! i feel this is cruelty to horses. @@ -21459,12 +21435,12 @@ can't, you can't like er, you can't say that she might have something thrown at her horse cos maybe you weren't there and maybe generally speaking mm. -erm, i mean people who spend their entire saturday doing something that they, i mean, i don't enjoy going out every saturday! -i mean, i'd like to do the things that, my hobbies, but i go out there because i care and i see that i feel that it's necessary to, to actually stop these people tormenting an animal for fun and if i'm that concerned about animals, i'm not gonna stoop to to hurt a horse, or or the hounds! -i mean i ride myself, i have dogs myself, i mean, it's just another excuse from the hunting fraternity, turn it round, blame the cruelty on the saboteurs when really there wouldn't be any saboteurs if there weren't people to kill foxes purely for fun! +erm, i mean people who spend their entire saturday doing something that they, i mean, i don't enjoy going out every saturday! +i mean, i'd like to do the things that, my hobbies, but i go out there because i care and i see that i feel that it's necessary to, to actually stop these people tormenting an animal for fun and if i'm that concerned about animals, i'm not gonna stoop to to hurt a horse, or or the hounds! +i mean i ride myself, i have dogs myself, i mean, it's just another excuse from the hunting fraternity, turn it round, blame the cruelty on the saboteurs when really there wouldn't be any saboteurs if there weren't people to kill foxes purely for fun! do you want to come back on that? yes. -erm we ha , we have had horses and hounds and damaged but apart from that i would ask the speaker who i , what +erm we ha , we have had horses and hounds and damaged but apart from that i would ask the speaker who i , what mm. or who is the fox's predator? after all, the mouse has a cat, so what is the fox's predator? @@ -21476,17 +21452,17 @@ i'm willing, i'm willing to listen to you! well the , i think these people who concern themselves very much about dictating the do's and don't of fox hunting, if they were to spend a little more time about looking into the research of, how foxes actually live. three hundred thousand foxes are killed annually in this country, either through hunting, which only attributes to a small two point percent, shooting, gassing, snaring, all of which happen during the hunting season as well. so i mean, these foxes are still widespread and abundant, they can sustain seventy percent losses, so what human intervention are you doing? -i mean ha how can you say that killing fifteen thousand foxes a year is helping to control foxes? +i mean ha how can you say that killing fifteen thousand foxes a year is helping to control foxes? up there. i hunt regularly mhm. -because i breed racehorses, i also am a farmer so i wear two hats, but i've actually seen foxes sit down we move the hounds move in,si sit down and scratch in the middle of a field, and then they think ah! +because i breed racehorses, i also am a farmer so i wear two hats, but i've actually seen foxes sit down we move the hounds move in,si sit down and scratch in the middle of a field, and then they think ah! right we're off! -but, in fact from a farmer's point of view they are a su a nuisance, we have a man who co , who supposedly raises pheasants, he traps them, he also trapped my dog and this is him ah, justified, his justification was there were too many foxes. +but, in fact from a farmer's point of view they are a su a nuisance, we have a man who co , who supposedly raises pheasants, he traps them, he also trapped my dog and this is him ah, justified, his justification was there were too many foxes. erm. and so therefore, we don't particularly pretend that they are mm. -that hunting justifies the the end of killing foxes but it does preserve country life. +that hunting justifies the the end of killing foxes but it does preserve country life. we're going to have to close, alas, because it's been very interesting, and er er er a very diverse, ninety six people think animals should have a better deal, seventy seven think that the use of animals in research is justified at ti , from time to time, and well over seventy except . think that hunting should be banned. @@ -21494,30 +21470,29 @@ and, my final question to you, just out of curiosity is, are you ve , a vegetari button one for yes, button two for no. i could of said do you eat animals, but i decided that would be insensitive, to those of you who are vegetarians. -so, in this, very animal loving assembly, i think er, you would agree er, only twenty one are vegetarians and seventy nine people love animals but they also enjoy chewing on them from time to time. +so, in this, very animal loving assembly, i think er, you would agree er, only twenty one are vegetarians and seventy nine people love animals but they also enjoy chewing on them from time to time. wo would er any of you animal eaters like to say something about that position? yes? yes, i would as, as an s s p c a representative. and and also as a farmer, if i mhm. -might say, i'm a beef farmer, erm i enjoy my, my beef very much, my philosophy is that erm, if we're going to use animals we're going to eat the , their time here should be as humane, they should have as humane treatment as possible, and they should be free from fear, hunger and pain, and when the time comes for them to go they should know as little about it as possible. +might say, i'm a beef farmer, erm i enjoy my, my beef very much, my philosophy is that erm, if we're going to use animals we're going to eat the , their time here should be as humane, they should have as humane treatment as possible, and they should be free from fear, hunger and pain, and when the time comes for them to go they should know as little about it as possible. yes, but they never do! you might say that about the human animal really, mightn't you? yes thank you all very much for a civilized and interesting discussion. thank you for joining us. goodbye. - -what time do you get there what, what time did you get there? +what time do you get there what, what time did you get there? . . no,. -you said this morning didn't ya? +you said this morning didn't ya? travelling, between woking and guildford, or whatever. -er, and that, you, you'll at the town cooking dinner, watching television, talking to my friend, or just roughly what you're doing at that time that conversation took place, okay,at work,form, then make me a cup of tea, she was photo-copying, +er, and that, you, you'll at the town cooking dinner, watching television, talking to my friend, or just roughly what you're doing at that time that conversation took place, okay,at work,form, then make me a cup of tea, she was photo-copying, mm. -that's what she was, she was doing . +that's what she was, she was doing . there's an awful lot involved though. , you're usually saying oh it's just, just general . mm. @@ -21525,32 +21500,32 @@ went shopping or whatever, as i say, it, it, it, a couple of days or whatever yo mm. but if you, in two days, that yeah -would be grate, okay, and the same thing for next page, this is the day i started which, like maybe tomorrow or next day or when ever you start it wednesday, i started at ten o'clock in the morning, was i, i was in woking, what was i doing nothing just reading a, do whatever you have to put in your whatever you , +would be grate, okay, and the same thing for next page, this is the day i started which, like maybe tomorrow or next day or when ever you start it wednesday, i started at ten o'clock in the morning, was i, i was in woking, what was i doing nothing just reading a, do whatever you have to put in your whatever you , yeah where you went for a walk, down, went to the shops mm. -or whatever, just let them know roughly what you're doing, cos, all they get is a tape, it gives them an idea of what sort of things were happening at that time, any words they can't pick up if she's cooking, maybe that's something she was making or whatever, erm, in the please write the first names and details, why you know them, of all the people speaking on this side of the tape, in order in which they speak on the tape in the first, first instance, right, you know, so now carla, my husband, myself, lee and, you don't need to repeat them again after that +or whatever, just let them know roughly what you're doing, cos, all they get is a tape, it gives them an idea of what sort of things were happening at that time, any words they can't pick up if she's cooking, maybe that's something she was making or whatever, erm, in the please write the first names and details, why you know them, of all the people speaking on this side of the tape, in order in which they speak on the tape in the first, first instance, right, you know, so now carla, my husband, myself, lee and, you don't need to repeat them again after that mm. so if you don't, don't want, not worried too much about this, i mean, although we want you to do this, i mean, rather just get the conversation, in, even though you don't do this . you want more than that . the knob on the cooker's been turned. put it in the dish. does everybody finish their work experience then ? -yes, no not everyone, some i know one person who's name's adam, he finishes tuesday +yes, no not everyone, some i know one person who's name's adam, he finishes tuesday why? -cos he . +cos he . why's that then? it's just the way they've done it, the firm. oh, the firm. -kim was saying , they do it for two weeks can't believe they would, the different school though, and then that other chap said that, that, erm +kim was saying , they do it for two weeks can't believe they would, the different school though, and then that other chap said that, that, erm oh steveo's under . yeah but that other one said, oh look there's . , oh yeah, mm,, he's a polo, he . eastenders is on. have bath, watch the telly. -what have you gotta do, write your assignment then? +what have you gotta do, write your assignment then? geography and my diary. -what of the and every day? +what of the and every day? yep. how long's the diary got to be? i dunno, page, one page @@ -21558,15 +21533,15 @@ would you write it like an actual, can you fit it in a diary or have you got to i'm not sure. you should really do it like a, like make a little folder thing up and then date it monday, you know yeah. -if you do it for when you've actually left home , when you, when you've actual left at twenty past seven no +if you do it for when you've actually left home , when you, when you've actual left at twenty past seven no what doing monday then? i asked them how old she was? charlie chaplin, thirty six years old. -big, big boobs go run your bath. +big, big boobs go run your bath. gosh look at the size of those glasses. . well, yeah. -six years, how can you always say they're ah +six years, how can you always say they're ah ah, what's wrong the baby? . what's the matter with gary lineker's baby then?. @@ -21575,7 +21550,7 @@ keep fit till after christmas, don't like the cold weather, he's gonna go back a is he? does it, is it, just, is it just run erm . -, what erm, does that cricket thing , steve, is it or is it just cricket season? +, what erm, does that cricket thing , steve, is it or is it just cricket season? cricket season. who is it then? goodness when you, mum and dad's done the back garden, when you meant to be doing the front garden with the weeding and that?, well what's all, you know, all these wages. @@ -21592,7 +21567,7 @@ wrap them up for christmas. no. wh ,wh , what you having for christmas then? . -yeah, and have all this stuff and then they make greedy. +yeah, and have all this stuff and then they make greedy. greedy. you buy the suit. no. @@ -21617,12 +21592,12 @@ we didn't have to pay for that. who's done that? no one,i can keep that,. what? -we bought a fifty pound computer and said to kevin you can keep it. +we bought a fifty pound computer and said to kevin you can keep it. . yeah and i paid ten pounds. i put that down on his christmas list. i'll draw it in a suit, clothes. -yeah, but you won't be getting much because you've had lots. +yeah, but you won't be getting much because you've had lots. don't want , chocolates. didn't get any . tenner on chocolates. @@ -21657,10 +21632,10 @@ don't give me that rubbish. i have, but i like my jeans though. well think, why pay out for a hundred and forty pounds for a suit, when you gonna wear it again? could be, wear it every week. -yeah, i'm sure a walking bank be glad when you've got a job, you'll be earning your own money you can buy your own things. +yeah, i'm sure a walking bank be glad when you've got a job, you'll be earning your own money you can buy your own things. yeah, but i do any way. when? -trainers lost that eighty quid +trainers lost that eighty quid oh. trainers. you've lost it? @@ -21672,7 +21647,7 @@ why? after having a c d for christmas last year, they're a waste of money. no, but it's cheaper to buy a tape because the . yeah you ain't got, you get better quality on a c d. -if you've got the c d we could all , yes you do, we could all use it, then you could have blank tapes, and then you can tape it on cassette but i want a list of two c d's and i, in argos if there's a watch nan want's the list and she want's it this weekend. +if you've got the c d we could all , yes you do, we could all use it, then you could have blank tapes, and then you can tape it on cassette but i want a list of two c d's and i, in argos if there's a watch nan want's the list and she want's it this weekend. no you don't . mm. but, i want it done tonight. @@ -21691,7 +21666,7 @@ yeah. and then what you do there? you stay there. that's what carla's got look. -no, cos the water's not coming up above your face, the water's filled the whole going down and it's got gates. +no, cos the water's not coming up above your face, the water's filled the whole going down and it's got gates. have to try sitting down then. how can you swivel through the gates? well how do you get through the gates? @@ -21699,11 +21674,11 @@ loads of water get up through the gates. so. yeah, so up to the gates, just push yourself off the gates . -how quick can you get to the surface, must be strong ,, two, three riding down to the and you're gonna push it out the way, it's like, it's like the tide, it comes in and then goes back out,. +how quick can you get to the surface, must be strong ,, two, three riding down to the and you're gonna push it out the way, it's like, it's like the tide, it comes in and then goes back out,. should be two in there. why? i don't see . -no if, cos there seemed a pair. +no if, cos there seemed a pair. . at this work experience . in . @@ -21716,24 +21691,24 @@ what's it about then? huh? have to do the practice. know how to do them now? -you should at peter's. +you should at peter's. i don't know peter's . no, i don't actually. -cos i don't know his can't do it. +cos i don't know his can't do it. quit easy though isn't it? all you do is, stick it through, phone your number, push the button, it's gone through. i get fed up doing the . yeah, but, even when you leave school that's what happens don't it? -i, i mean you usually start off with the boy everybody has to start at the bottom,. +i, i mean you usually start off with the boy everybody has to start at the bottom,. . mm, i'm sure. you make yourself cough more by lying down there. -some of those kim's, women she work's with the teacher, he daughter's in this, doesn't half get paid a lot of money +some of those kim's, women she work's with the teacher, he daughter's in this, doesn't half get paid a lot of money not for doing this though, ah? -it is, yeah, something like that, i it's quite a lot of money though. +it is, yeah, something like that, i it's quite a lot of money though. you might be doing it?.. the kid's love it, carla would love it wouldn't she? -yeah, lynn just ordered that one for victoria, she had it on order for seven weeks twenty four pound it was that one +yeah, lynn just ordered that one for victoria, she had it on order for seven weeks twenty four pound it was that one it'll be easy if you write it down. no, just mark on, just put a cross straight through. what you have to, what page is it in, in the book? @@ -21762,13 +21737,13 @@ yeah. four seasons. . . -dad we wanna play it on saturday don't toys, toys and games. +dad we wanna play it on saturday don't toys, toys and games. oh we don't know how much it is. yours . yeah. right next one. -huh, he's probably too much excited of . -right, welcome page forty four. +huh, he's probably too much excited of . +right, welcome page forty four. yeah, item number. six. yeah. @@ -21788,16 +21763,16 @@ m, o, t, i o, n, amy grant, i don't know if got bob marley one or not. he's good. we can buy you that then, if you want it, we never know what to buy you. -right now that's it, were now in the argos . -so did you get your good work for, your good sticker for work again or what?or what? +right now that's it, were now in the argos . +so did you get your good work for, your good sticker for work again or what?or what? yes. -and that's is your letter box up at christmas yet? +and that's is your letter box up at christmas yet? your poster box? we have to . that's on sunday, so what's happening on sunday carla? what do you do? on monday eh -so what is it ad advent calendars. +so what is it ad advent calendars. hooray. which one is it lee? . @@ -21806,7 +21781,7 @@ there that one? no up the top, third one down on the right hand side. with the grey strap? -yeah, i thought that was quite nice on the right hand side page, that one,, three down, yeah. +yeah, i thought that was quite nice on the right hand side page, that one,, three down, yeah. that one? mm. thought that was quite nice. @@ -21817,7 +21792,7 @@ won't hurt, spying on them in it? sorry. they're the . what you want they . -that's it, it's just after the look at the ballerina broach and see what you think, broach, no silver, keep going +that's it, it's just after the look at the ballerina broach and see what you think, broach, no silver, keep going that? keep going that's a nice ring,number one. @@ -21830,7 +21805,7 @@ argos number one. i know the one. that . can i try that one? -we'll see christmas, who?, no it's , er it's on the right hand side, it's, it's the next page at the bottom is it? +we'll see christmas, who?, no it's , er it's on the right hand side, it's, it's the next page at the bottom is it? that's not there. how much? sterling silver, ballerina broach, nineteen, no, eight, eight ninety nine. @@ -21841,7 +21816,7 @@ bennettons, you can buy that . which one, yeah that's the one that erm kim's been trying to get lorraine the bennetton one. nineteen ninety nine. that's not bad, bennetton one? -shall i put that down, argos number fourteen argos number fourteen. +shall i put that down, argos number fourteen argos number fourteen. hang on, page first. page six. yeah, @@ -21854,22 +21829,22 @@ about sixty nine, seventy pounds. seventy pounds. what is? oh yeah, you can get the one i want in. -extra brill. +extra brill. i'll write it down but you'll have to write to see what father christmas says. i might . that was seventy. seventy. -. right now it oh it's seventy in argos. +. right now it oh it's seventy in argos. what's that? erm, one and a half keyboard, item number hang on. -one and a half keyboard item number five and it sixty nine quid, fifty p. +one and a half keyboard item number five and it sixty nine quid, fifty p. sixty nine quid, don't you mean sixty nine pounds and fifty pence. pounds . -mm . +mm . got no baby strap. -fallen in love with that stuff. -you'll have to get your stuff down and, you know what one we'll have to get, you know those big cases that she get's from ikea, and bring it all down and get one of those for your bedroom and keep it all in started your homework yet lee? +fallen in love with that stuff. +you'll have to get your stuff down and, you know what one we'll have to get, you know those big cases that she get's from ikea, and bring it all down and get one of those for your bedroom and keep it all in started your homework yet lee? what? started your homework yet? no. @@ -21877,7 +21852,7 @@ didn't you do it while i was out? yeah, when you come in. was that rushing you to get that paper going? . -that's that little powerful car, like, kearin's, but he's got the motor bike . +that's that little powerful car, like, kearin's, but he's got the motor bike . daddy can we swop places now? why? cos i wanna sit next to you and lee. @@ -21902,7 +21877,7 @@ no,second tonight, the second . . . got a wipe somewhere, don't wipe yourself,rubbish. -going to get lee's ski stuff your cold better . +going to get lee's ski stuff your cold better . ah? is lee's cold better? what are you doing today? @@ -21917,7 +21892,7 @@ you going back to work on . i might. you might? that's when i'll be finished. -i've still got another week to come though, that might be about january the third onwards, for a week. +i've still got another week to come though, that might be about january the third onwards, for a week. christmas. can't get any time off, they won't let you take it off, two days i get. probably get christmas day. @@ -21937,7 +21912,7 @@ i've got dancing . yeah, but leave at quarter past four, you are pushing it. take to london? no, erm,school. -what's there then? +what's there then? school, school on a coach. forty five minutes. what to get to guilford? forty five minutes. @@ -21948,11 +21923,11 @@ er, when i get home i've got to have my dinner, got to get changed no, cos you can go without your dinner can't you? oh,. and have that at seven o'clock. -that's what . +that's what . . -it's they're all doing erm,i've got you , right and there's a really daffy bloke he i've got you . +it's they're all doing erm,i've got you , right and there's a really daffy bloke he i've got you . that's how he's singing it? -yeah, he had to sing it like that and then, then there's, there's only two of them, you know and erm, the, er, other, the other one, he's a black man yeah, and he goes who's that big gorilla in the back and he's pointing to me . +yeah, he had to sing it like that and then, then there's, there's only two of them, you know and erm, the, er, other, the other one, he's a black man yeah, and he goes who's that big gorilla in the back and he's pointing to me . oh was he ha, ha . and then erm, then they had this thing called niff, which was water, and they came round spraying all of us. so where do they come, is vicky in the actual group? @@ -21983,14 +21958,14 @@ gone in keith's house, i was looking in our garden . . you wouldn't know what tree was brenda. is that, is that my cup of tea? -look he's come down stairs,sit on the chair carla. +look he's come down stairs,sit on the chair carla. certainly . oh no, that's what have you been doing then? this week . this week . yeah, but i don't normally do i? have a cup of tea though. -i have a cup of tea do think he's on holiday. +i have a cup of tea do think he's on holiday. there multiplying, and i'm loosing control . got another . yes. @@ -22006,7 +21981,7 @@ hello ! come up here. urgh! i don't want my . -di di di, ah da +di di di, ah da here we go. richard! you've got your what? @@ -22016,7 +21991,7 @@ it's an aeroplane that's you're in an aeroplane? oh i see. i'll be the cook . -she's sitting on a and doesn't know what she's sitting on! +she's sitting on a and doesn't know what she's sitting on! i see. right i'll be, i'll be the . and matthew's the cook in the kitchen. @@ -22049,8 +22024,8 @@ please richard! please stop jumping on the chair arms will you? yeah. you don't jump on chair arms. -that was your daddy james and richard and bryony. -your, he's, he's er he's going to try to leave school earlier today and he'll be here at half past four instead of quarter past five. +that was your daddy james and richard and bryony. +your, he's, he's er he's going to try to leave school earlier today and he'll be here at half past four instead of quarter past five. so, i'll just drink my coffee and i'll get your tea ready quickly. richard, you've gotta set the table. richard, let me wipe your nose again. @@ -22094,7 +22069,7 @@ exciting this weekend? me! not me. not you? -we've got to sit at the back +we've got to sit at the back what are you doing? nothing. you're not doing anything? @@ -22103,12 +22078,12 @@ ah! you can. that there was a mighty splash. he'll, he'll tell you what's next. -he please come out of that drawer will you? +he please come out of that drawer will you? that's right. there was a mighty splash and he fell head first into the river and he didn't come up again. that's exactly right. you know it word for word. -every time i say what which story shall we have today, they say the three billy goats gruff. +every time i say what which story shall we have today, they say the three billy goats gruff. get off! it's exactly the same. @@ -22126,7 +22101,7 @@ oh! d'ya know i've wiped, washed this floor three times from this orange spilt! seventeen one eighty fives? thirty one -can't be bad cos i couldn't work it out ! +can't be bad cos i couldn't work it out ! don't ask me. do you want a calculator? i did it twice in my @@ -22136,8 +22111,8 @@ mum! thank you. thank yo thank you very much. what, what did she say to you? -she's trying to work money out -oh +she's trying to work money out +oh in her head. move over please rebecca, i need to sweep there dear. let's have a look. @@ -22145,7 +22120,7 @@ i'll just, come over here cos this is hot. no you want it! no! oh no! -we want it in soup cups. +we want it in soup cups. get your no! yes you want it in soup cups. @@ -22154,7 +22129,7 @@ do not worry. i'm stirring it to make sure it's hot enough. warm enough. don't worry . -i'll have to though. +i'll have to though. i've got a clean spoon. i don't want a spoon. erm @@ -22191,7 +22166,7 @@ with a bit of luck. here you are. sit on your chair. there's a piece of stottie for you. -and there's a piece of stottie for you. +and there's a piece of stottie for you. wave bye-bye to ann now. bye-bye ann. bye-bye richard. @@ -22201,7 +22176,7 @@ bye andrea. thank you. cor! i'll have to give this floor a wipe again. -my shoes are sticking to the floor. +my shoes are sticking to the floor. where there's orange been spilt. mm mm. oh ! @@ -22211,11 +22186,11 @@ your dad's coming at half past four. well as near as half past four he can. that means he'll be quarter to five ! why's he early tonight for? -well dorothy had to go to a prison in erm clackmannan for her +well dorothy had to go to a prison in erm clackmannan for her mm mm. you know with her job yeah. -and while she's up there, after she's been there she was going to creep to spe +and while she's up there, after she's been there she was going to creep to spe what does she do again for probation officer. oh! @@ -22223,21 +22198,21 @@ she's going to spend the night with her sister yeah. and then pick her mother up cos she lives in creep as well, she can't stay at her mother's house cos she's just oh! -got a one bedroomed flat. +got a one bedroomed flat. one bedroom flat? yes. -anyway, she's i think it's an old people's flat. -she's got she's gonna pick her mother up and come back home, bring her mother back home tomorrow with her. +anyway, she's i think it's an old people's flat. +she's got she's gonna pick her mother up and come back home, bring her mother back home tomorrow with her. mm mm! -and +and is that martin's granny iris? that's right. mm mm. and she's going to stay for a fortnight with them. -so bu bryony! +so bu bryony! your tea, come and have your tea ! what's she doing? -watching television . +watching television . come on square eyes! never mind the television. oh! @@ -22267,12 +22242,12 @@ away from me. she's not very well sally. she's not well ah! -she's not even very we she's got a quite a bad +she's not even very we she's got a quite a bad have you got a cold? -keeps on laughing at me and running away ! +keeps on laughing at me and running away ! oh. come on horror! -i'm not one i'm . +i'm not one i'm . are you our horror? not a horror! you're not a horror? @@ -22298,18 +22273,18 @@ that's a good boy. you like thank you. stottie don't you? -do you know when i go stay with my gareth i've got to so we've got to take stotties with us +do you know when i go stay with my gareth i've got to so we've got to take stotties with us for him and shirley. cos they, shirley loves it as well. and shirley's not a geordie like you. a geordie hinny. mm. oh! -there's a knot in your apron. +there's a knot in your apron. i, i want some more stottie please? good boy. just a sec -may i have er some more stottie +may i have er some more stottie you certainly may. clever boy. mm. @@ -22336,7 +22311,7 @@ don't like it. can we have some more stottie please? yes. here you are. -i want to go . +i want to go . there now. thank you. clever boy. @@ -22363,36 +22338,36 @@ the rumour that skillery bridge had been washed away? it was stephen . yeah but then dad said when he came in that, he'd heard that the middle of it had gone. what? -stephen came in our class and he said that er skillery bridge had +stephen came in our class and he said that er skillery bridge had and who said the flood wall had gone? when you were all sent home early. -er er i think he said that as well. +er er i think he said that as well. ha! one way of getting out of school, i don't know ! he did. he di he did. said that as well? -and and none of his parents came to collect him. +and and none of his parents came to collect him. he just walked by himself. were you only collected? could you only come out if your parents collected you? no, i didn't think they were bothered to tell you truth. so how did you manage to get out early? -well it was well dawn's mum came into school she said we were +well it was well dawn's mum came into school she said we were i want one! oh! -but er nobody rang me. +but er nobody rang me. mm! i don't think i was out. i mean, i would have come up and -i've got a soup! +i've got a soup! and got you all. -have i got all my soup? +have i got all my soup? you have, yes. you like that soup don't you? i don't know how she came in the school. sh she just came in. -she got this pen and paper and wrote everybody's names down mm mm so then she just +she got this pen and paper and wrote everybody's names down mm mm so then she just i didn't re took them all out. i didn't realize, i would have thanked her. @@ -22405,7 +22380,7 @@ let's find some spoons. one you love stottie cake. two -two three! +two three! three ee ee! there's a spoon for bryony. one for james. @@ -22428,7 +22403,7 @@ feeding time? it is. . there you go, you can speak to yourself. -you're pretending that you're speaking to somebody and just speak all the time . +you're pretending that you're speaking to somebody and just speak all the time . i don't . you can't find your what? find my shoes. @@ -22439,12 +22414,12 @@ they're eating better than they did at dinner time. the triplets will have eaten it? what? a shoe. -that wouldn't surprise me at all, the things i've seen them try to eat. +that wouldn't surprise me at all, the things i've seen them try to eat. nope. erm -i'll let i'll let you figure this one out. -is it four four times? -monday he didn't come tuesday he didn't come +i'll let i'll let you figure this one out. +is it four four times? +monday he didn't come tuesday he didn't come wednesday he didn't come. wednesday he didn't come. thursday was about @@ -22457,17 +22432,17 @@ well i know what you mean. could i have some more stottie i ha cake please? -i haven't been up there since i got in from school +i haven't been up there since i got in from school aha. -i haven't checked with the so in, just in case they don't +i haven't checked with the so in, just in case they don't right. see it okay. -they had, they've been telling everyone to go home . +they had, they've been telling everyone to go home . right. -now then ooh! +now then ooh! you're eating very, very nicely. -i, i want some more of that er please. +i, i want some more of that er please. er don't wipe your se hang on a minute till i catch this soup that's dribbling down. you want some more stottie cake? i do. @@ -22496,13 +22471,13 @@ thank you ann. good you're welcome. orange juice. -he's got orange juice in it's got orange juice in it. +he's got orange juice in it's got orange juice in it. your cup's got orange juice in it has it? have you got everything matthew? thank you. do you think i'll be able to put my wellies away now? away . -i think bryony likes erm smarties because she's always sucking the juice out of beans. +i think bryony likes erm smarties because she's always sucking the juice out of beans. i'm just going to, i think i can put my wellies away now. you nearly needed your waders, i tell you! well, we were getting worried. @@ -22524,11 +22499,11 @@ i think it's twenty past four now. mm. yes. -well it's quarter past already. +well it's quarter past already. why are you eating left-handed this bryony? you don't eat left-handed. and richard's decided to be right-handed after all this time. -well that is daddy's isn't it? +well that is daddy's isn't it? i'm not spilling it too. i'm not spilling too. no, you're not spilling it. @@ -22554,7 +22529,7 @@ i want the spoon. you need your spoon. oh. there it is. -wait a minute now, we'll just wipe that on this off the table so it doesn't go on your sleeve. +wait a minute now, we'll just wipe that on this off the table so it doesn't go on your sleeve. that's it. there's some on my arm. there's some on your arm is there? @@ -22564,7 +22539,7 @@ is it off? it is. that's good. that's why we push your sleeves up cos we don't want it on your arms do we? -erm hands. +erm hands. on your hand? there you are then. it's off. @@ -22572,7 +22547,7 @@ what are they having for their pudding? er er richard's got it all over his face ! let's see you richard. -yo oh just a minute, it's dripping down your chin. +yo oh just a minute, it's dripping down your chin. let me get it off here so it doesn't go on your collar. lift your chin up cos your collar's got out of your pinny somehow or other. let me wipe it down here look. @@ -22582,7 +22557,7 @@ that's it. and on my . oh well you'll ha if you keep getting it on your fingers just eat it up and i'll wash you when you've finished. as long as it's not going near your sleeve it doesn't matter. -shall i i want to stir it. +shall i i want to stir it. oh! girls. what are you doing? @@ -22593,21 +22568,21 @@ we've got these in our house. those? those these -soup like soup like things. +soup like soup like things. well you know where i got them from. when er i dunno. you probably got them from the same place. they were free with petrol. oh. -and when paul had his taxi business. +and when paul had his taxi business. betty gave us them. betty? betty gave you yours. betty gave me mine. -they use so much petrol on a taxi business they got she's got about a dozen still i think. -she gave me five i think it was. -it's those that's the same. +they use so much petrol on a taxi business they got she's got about a dozen still i think. +she gave me five i think it was. +it's those that's the same. well i think jim got one and i got five. erm betty gave me five i meant. i think we've got about four or five. @@ -22674,7 +22649,7 @@ hooray! what? it's not dark yet. no it's not dark yet. -it it's springtime now. +it it's springtime now. it was dark when you went home in the it's light time. winter. @@ -22689,7 +22664,7 @@ cos it's springtime now. and james has so soup on his sweatshirt. mm. keep still a minute while i wipe you. -no that's that you don't +no that's that you don't it's because james will not sit straight at the table, he sits sideways. @@ -22730,7 +22705,7 @@ yeah. sally. you're not sally are you? i said i'm not sally. -i'll go and i'll go and find your can anyone see bryony's sock? +i'll go and i'll go and find your can anyone see bryony's sock? oh there it is. and where's her shoe? right. @@ -22778,10 +22753,10 @@ i do. well sit back at the table please. don't get off your chair until you've finished. i sit there. -let's see what i've got +let's see what i've got i want let's see what i -no +no can find for you. aargh! aargh! @@ -22796,7 +22771,7 @@ yes please. want one. you don't? no. -i don't wa i this one. +i don't wa i this one. there you are. i want a green one. you wanted the green one? @@ -22817,7 +22792,7 @@ i thank you. give me yo ann can you look, look a colour one for me? see what colour's in here for you then? -you got a red one for me haven't you? +you got a red one for me haven't you? what love? here you are. thank you. @@ -22829,7 +22804,7 @@ where's my sharp knife? i'm gonna get you! here we are. what colour ra what colour richard? -it's er er er erm +it's er er er erm what colour is it? green. yes. @@ -22844,7 +22819,7 @@ i've lost one. lost one what? lost er what have you lost one of? -let me just wipe your hands and your chin before you wipe them on your sleeves. +let me just wipe your hands and your chin before you wipe them on your sleeves. what are you doing down there bryony? get back on th i dropped it. @@ -22853,8 +22828,8 @@ what did you get? i got it. can i have another biscuit please? you got what? -i got my chocolate biscuit back. -well i got you gre got another green one haven't you? +i got my chocolate biscuit back. +well i got you gre got another green one haven't you? you want me to open that? i don't wanna, i'll do it. i want you to leave it open. @@ -22877,7 +22852,7 @@ is that what you mean? the wrapper on. there you are. on it. -right bryony i'll put your shoe on now. +right bryony i'll put your shoe on now. that's a . come on then. it's your other foot. @@ -22933,18 +22908,18 @@ don't want it warming do i? no. there you are. thank you. -i big boy, i need the toilet. +i big boy, i need the toilet. you need the toilet? a wa -i say i've got a wa well i i don't i, but er i didn't er, i will get washed. -i'll take the +i say i've got a wa well i i don't i, but er i didn't er, i will get washed. +i'll take the yes. you need to be washed first. mm. let's wash your face quickly i will then, then we'll go to the toilet. -erm i will walk on the back erm . +erm i will walk on the back erm . let's see your hands. i need the toilet. i need @@ -22973,7 +22948,7 @@ sal. wait a minute. mm mm mm. it isn't loose enough it won't go over your head. -you look after er amy. +you look after er amy. look after amy? amy's gone home. amy's gone home. @@ -22982,11 +22957,11 @@ you amy, and big richard and matthew have all gone yeah. home now. -but they didn't, you won't get richard . +but they didn't, you won't get richard . come on then. come on then. er, richard! -you're not going upstairs in a mess like that, you'll stick your hands on everything you come to. +you're not going upstairs in a mess like that, you'll stick your hands on everything you come to. let's get you washed. are you going to finish eating that first? you sit there and finish eating that and i'll wash your hands. @@ -23013,10 +22988,10 @@ mm mm. that was a mess! we couldn't have the lights on. all the water came over the top of the bath. -i, i er,o we had to get the ladders we had to go up the ladders didn't we? +i, i er,o we had to get the ladders we had to go up the ladders didn't we? had to get the, ladder? i thought, they'd -they went years ago. +they went years ago. well i thought they'd gone but, but i saw them here. how long was our guarantee? well there won't be anybody there. @@ -23033,27 +23008,27 @@ three at five hundred there. don't go for that one there. the last three hundred . there's no catch. -from such an established reputable company. -all prices are fully inclusive of double glazing the raid one security p v c, da da da. -fittings and all the service guaranteed . +from such an established reputable company. +all prices are fully inclusive of double glazing the raid one security p v c, da da da. +fittings and all the service guaranteed . well i don't know. it doesn't say anywhere where there's a guarantee. -all windows in cheshire. +all windows in cheshire. i wonder if it's the same address as when we got ours? well, we should have the guarantee still, there in the box there. -unle it's, it's how +unle it's, it's how well long is it since it was supposed to have gone bust? well that's since that. i thought it had gone ins i thought it was about ten years. ah. -wasn't there somewhere in lancaster park who got the ? +wasn't there somewhere in lancaster park who got the ? i can't remember. -when we got that, when we had ours it, and er they said if you if you found someone else who would like who would have cold shield you would get er, seventy five pounds back. +when we got that, when we had ours it, and er they said if you if you found someone else who would like who would have cold shield you would get er, seventy five pounds back. mhm. and you gave the thing to, who was it who was thinking about it? -was it erm what did they call isobel isobel +was it erm what did they call isobel isobel . . wasn't it her? @@ -23065,7 +23040,7 @@ cos that, well i don't know, her husband died when we were just, came here. it could have been that. yeah. yeah. -well i phoned shirley and she said she's fine. +well i phoned shirley and she said she's fine. mhm. i told her off for not le not telling me she was ill. and she said, no, no! @@ -23075,22 +23050,22 @@ so where's gareth gone? she was, he was in the house, i didn't speak to him though oh. so that, i just spoke to shirley. -erm sandy's staying with her for a few days. +erm sandy's staying with her for a few days. what else did she say? did you say about us going down or not? no i didn't mention it. ah. at the moment. have you asked her about the -she's got somebody +she's got somebody the letter? staying now. -i asked her about the letter and she kne she said she couldn't remember anything about it but she filled in something when they came back from belfast. +i asked her about the letter and she kne she said she couldn't remember anything about it but she filled in something when they came back from belfast. mhm. -and she said, open it. -so i opened it and it's one of these things er if you book to go to dublin before may the, whatever, the end of may +and she said, open it. +so i opened it and it's one of these things er if you book to go to dublin before may the, whatever, the end of may mhm. -then if you went again in the autumn you you ge you get er fifty pounds' worth of vouchers or something,yo you go half price. +then if you went again in the autumn you you ge you get er fifty pounds' worth of vouchers or something,yo you go half price. it's one of those con things like they tried well like our holiday they, they go yes. @@ -23099,7 +23074,7 @@ why , i mean why would she go to dublin, yeah. dublin before mm. -it's and why dublin when er, when they were +it's and why dublin when er, when they were coming across from belfast. when they crossed from northern aha. @@ -23109,21 +23084,21 @@ cos they're trying to sell the things aren't yeah. they, all the time? anyway, she doesn't want it. -martin still ha hasn't got his erm invalidity pension sorted out. +martin still ha hasn't got his erm invalidity pension sorted out. mm mm. but he's managing alright at the moment. he's filled in all the things. -i forgot to er, i haven't watched the television at all. -and i forgot to record, what do you call that thing? +i forgot to er, i haven't watched the television at all. +and i forgot to record, what do you call that thing? with a devil in it? -well it was half +well it was half i fo way through when i came i forgot to in. that's, i know, i forgot to record it for you. i think i'll go to bed early tonight. -does that rain mean it's off the coast or it's +does that rain mean it's off the coast or it's mm. in our area ? ha. @@ -23133,11 +23108,11 @@ oh yeah. we'll get it with the local news after this. oh well. according to this it's cloud. -at least it's a white cloud not a black one. +at least it's a white cloud not a black one. did you see your mother? no . oh. -but i've got a message , will you tell my brother, no, don't tell my brother th sa they said she said to one of the nurses and they said, your brother? +but i've got a message , will you tell my brother, no, don't tell my brother th sa they said she said to one of the nurses and they said, your brother? oh! my son. i said well what did yo don't you have to tell me? @@ -23154,25 +23129,25 @@ sunny spells. i'll have to get some washing done. oh! sally was quite intrigued by that. -you'll have to get this week's a new one. -we'll have to get a a better box. -there's some bottles jars for the bottle bank as well. +you'll have to get this week's a new one. +we'll have to get a a better box. +there's some bottles jars for the bottle bank as well. you know the last time you missed the erm aye. -the last time you missed the television pages television supplement and a comic thing out of the mirror. +the last time you missed the television pages television supplement and a comic thing out of the mirror. i don't think he believed me. -and it's in it'll be twice in a month. -and chris is back again as our paper boy. +and it's in it'll be twice in a month. +and chris is back again as our paper boy. tt. what happened to the new one? the other was so useless! -but according to the er, that new manager in the paper shop everyone else got theirs. +but according to the er, that new manager in the paper shop everyone else got theirs. so i said, well i'm sorry but i'm not included in everyone else. and he gave me one. i think i'll get the radio times this week . the radio times? why? -cos it's got all the them extra wo got all of them extra ones in. +cos it's got all the them extra wo got all of them extra ones in. oh. are we staying up all thursday night? i don't know. @@ -23181,19 +23156,19 @@ i'm off. oh! of course. well you could stay in bed all day on friday. -and i could take the kids to school and go back i could do that. -we need to oh no we don't. -i need to go to the co-op and iceland. +and i could take the kids to school and go back i could do that. +we need to oh no we don't. +i need to go to the co-op and iceland. what shall i get for your mother? i'll get her some chocolate biscuits or something. -you would think she would put on a lot of weight wouldn't you? +you would think she would put on a lot of weight wouldn't you? i don't think she eats that much though. -i know, she's she doesn't eat that much, but what she is eating i everything's sweet. +i know, she's she doesn't eat that much, but what she is eating i everything's sweet. mm. chocolates and is she eating them? pardon? -does she eat though? +does she eat though? well sh i don't know. you know what the she goes in the @@ -23203,66 +23178,66 @@ you know what those sa staff are like. i know. most of them are, well yes. but, they certainly do. -if anyone offered me a chocolate when i was nursing, yes i would eat it cos i was always hungry . -which reminds me i meant to get weighed this morning before i had my breakfast. +if anyone offered me a chocolate when i was nursing, yes i would eat it cos i was always hungry . +which reminds me i meant to get weighed this morning before i had my breakfast. that don't matter. and i forgot. remind me tomorrow. before i eat anything. i think i'd better put some washing in before i go out. -are those ankle boots dry? -that's all she's saying you couldn't it with these before if you . +are those ankle boots dry? +that's all she's saying you couldn't it with these before if you . what? the boots you've got on. -give better support than the ones those flat heeled ones. +give better support than the ones those flat heeled ones. where did you buy them from? for your achilles' tendon. it's better now. -i get, on wednesday i, i did the erm angeline said to me don't do the high impact if you think it's going to hurt again. +i get, on wednesday i, i did the erm angeline said to me don't do the high impact if you think it's going to hurt again. i co still have the support under it. i managed okay. it didn't hurt. who's angeline? which is the right one for the pink one's a dish cloth. -the blue one's the one i wipe up small stains off the floor. +the blue one's the one i wipe up small stains off the floor. right. i wonder how bryony is? what? i said, i wonder how bryony is? and she wasn't very well yesterday. -every time she got a bump or knock off one of the others she was crying instead of clouting them back. -it must have been richard, i do i don't think richard's very, he +every time she got a bump or knock off one of the others she was crying instead of clouting them back. +it must have been richard, i do i don't think richard's very, he sorry, what d'ya say richard was? -i said i don't well stop running the tap. -i say, i don't think richard's very well either. +i said i don't well stop running the tap. +i say, i don't think richard's very well either. cos he cried more than usual. i wonder what time, the other night, trevor had with them on his own? -what do you think of granny jean offering it offering again to get martin from school to save trevor walking him home? -well it's well perhaps there's nothing in it for him. +what do you think of granny jean offering it offering again to get martin from school to save trevor walking him home? +well it's well perhaps there's nothing in it for him. i don't know. i like her. mm? i like her. can i just ri rinse my thingy. -and get my in. +and get my in. ooh! i've got hand cream on my hands. -that spurtle was used as a i can't -a +that spurtle was used as a i can't +a remember what richard was using it as yesterday. -well he was poking me in the groin. -what are we going to do about these tiles for the step +well he was poking me in the groin. +what are we going to do about these tiles for the step i dunno. -to cover this little hole in our path? +to cover this little hole in our path? i should hate to think what must be down there now. tt. oh! -well leave it cos it's it's -well i told you that fenwicks had and they were cheaper than +well leave it cos it's it's +well i told you that fenwicks had and they were cheaper than cheaper? fenwicks? -but cheaper than what they call it? +but cheaper than what they call it? the place in, the old place. yes. they were cheaper. @@ -23270,33 +23245,33 @@ i got the price for you. cheaper than the do-it-yourself shop up brady's? they were both but when, can we get through to newcastle? -well i well i'll have a week's holiday after easter and i've gotta go unless we go to . -and i've got a an all day meeting, i've arranged it on the tuesday that's if we're being presented to . +well i well i'll have a week's holiday after easter and i've gotta go unless we go to . +and i've got a an all day meeting, i've arranged it on the tuesday that's if we're being presented to . which tuesday? after they break up? that's right. which is, this, next friday. yes. -so i hope to sort it out the lenten appeal well +so i hope to sort it out the lenten appeal well the what? the len lin -the lenten's appeal at the schools that mrs was supposed to let miss know so she could get it off to the parents to get the money back so that they bought the scanner. +the lenten's appeal at the schools that mrs was supposed to let miss know so she could get it off to the parents to get the money back so that they bought the scanner. see, you didn't tell me about that. i did tell you. you didn't. -all you told me go on ah only this one's -miss wanted to -all you told me was that miss was retiring. +all you told me go on ah only this one's +miss wanted to +all you told me was that miss was retiring. but, i haven't to tell anyone. which i haven't done. which i don't intend to do. -at the beginning of lent miss approached me +at the beginning of lent miss approached me yes. -to see what she should do about the lenten appeal +to see what she should do about the lenten appeal aha. as she always does. -since i said, why send money to great ormond street when there was plenty of children's things local? +since i said, why send money to great ormond street when there was plenty of children's things local? yes. so i asked if we wanted anything? and she said what about the bed at the cottage hospital? @@ -23306,78 +23281,78 @@ oh you mean a bed? well tt! d'ya mean a special kind of mattress be -well, she just asked about a bed, so i told her that we were +well, she just asked about a bed, so i told her that we were you mean a bed to replace a bed that there already is? but why's she di na she just said a bed, and so yes. -i told her there were special beds that we have are very useful, in fact very necessary in some, some cases, and are painfully short of them. +i told her there were special beds that we have are very useful, in fact very necessary in some, some cases, and are painfully short of them. aha. -and a nimbas bed costs two thousand pound. +and a nimbas bed costs two thousand pound. and there's another one on the market which i can't remember the name of, which costs a lot more. mhm. something like, five thousand. but i can't remember the name. -anyway, i said i'd make enquiries as to what a is wanted. -and i said there's a, there's a new children's ward will open at the wandsbergh hospital perhaps they would like something. -i saw mrs , and mrs said they were aiming to raise money for the scanner appeal. +anyway, i said i'd make enquiries as to what a is wanted. +and i said there's a, there's a new children's ward will open at the wandsbergh hospital perhaps they would like something. +i saw mrs , and mrs said they were aiming to raise money for the scanner appeal. yeah. -but, also they're going to have a an obstetric adult patient's department at the college hospital for the very first time. +but, also they're going to have a an obstetric adult patient's department at the college hospital for the very first time. a what? a an obstetric outpatients yeah. yeah. -and they're, obviously they would be, tend to be other children with mothers then so they would like perhaps a play facility there. +and they're, obviously they would be, tend to be other children with mothers then so they would like perhaps a play facility there. and other children who go to the e n t clinic, and go to the or just go to the outpatients in general, and the casualty yes. there's very limited facilities for children to play. -so but i also coaxed mrs about the wandsbergh . -anyway, she wanted to, me to go and see her, she said there we there was a scanner appeal, and she was also trying to talk about all sorts of other things that were possible and because there was an arts appeal and for arts facilities at the hospital, and all sorts of things. -so i went back to miss and said about the scanner appeal and she said that would be she thought that that would be the best idea. -not the children's things at the cottage hospital. -i also told her it's the diamond jubilee of the hospital and the children from will be invited to the hospital for that day that week, sorry. -it's gonna be a week . +so but i also coaxed mrs about the wandsbergh . +anyway, she wanted to, me to go and see her, she said there we there was a scanner appeal, and she was also trying to talk about all sorts of other things that were possible and because there was an arts appeal and for arts facilities at the hospital, and all sorts of things. +so i went back to miss and said about the scanner appeal and she said that would be she thought that that would be the best idea. +not the children's things at the cottage hospital. +i also told her it's the diamond jubilee of the hospital and the children from will be invited to the hospital for that day that week, sorry. +it's gonna be a week . so she wanted to know what date it is. -so i, i asked mrs to but would she write to miss and give her all the details. +so i, i asked mrs to but would she write to miss and give her all the details. and she said, oh she'd be, she'd be far better if she went to see and explained it all. and that she was going on wednesday, i think. -up she went you know +up she went you know hold on. which one was going to see which it's one? -mrs was going to see miss +mrs was going to see miss was going to see miss . oh. i see. i didn't know which one. -but i give them a so then i saw mrs on tuesday when i was at ashington. -and she came up with all sorts of things that she would like for the the new wandsbergh development. -but on a but there's nothing ready of course, so th there's, there's a giant sundial they're going to have in one of the courtyards and it's a giant one it's, it's the, the building and the blocks of things in, in the in the courtyard that make up the the time. -so the sun shines on the that particular bit of the of the courtyard and it's eight o'clock, and that one is nine o'clock and so forth. +but i give them a so then i saw mrs on tuesday when i was at ashington. +and she came up with all sorts of things that she would like for the the new wandsbergh development. +but on a but there's nothing ready of course, so th there's, there's a giant sundial they're going to have in one of the courtyards and it's a giant one it's, it's the, the building and the blocks of things in, in the in the courtyard that make up the the time. +so the sun shines on the that particular bit of the of the courtyard and it's eight o'clock, and that one is nine o'clock and so forth. this is just in a courtyard and there'll be shrubs and things so she's got hold on. -wha how where is it going to be seen from? -i presume it's seen from the wards that are up behind looking down onto this courtyard. -there's also erm a play area for the the children's ward there's also some murals on the the walls, various artistic murals. -and, of course, they've got this grant from artcan for six thousand pound for a proggie mat exhibition. +wha how where is it going to be seen from? +i presume it's seen from the wards that are up behind looking down onto this courtyard. +there's also erm a play area for the the children's ward there's also some murals on the the walls, various artistic murals. +and, of course, they've got this grant from artcan for six thousand pound for a proggie mat exhibition. a six thousand pound grant for a proggie mat well exhibition? -well over, over a period, it's and other things too but they sa they said that murals and proggie mats are involved in it. +well over, over a period, it's and other things too but they sa they said that murals and proggie mats are involved in it. and various other art things. -but also,th the thought of a gar a garden and the children keeping the garden up. -but that's a, apparently that was a long way and they have transport difficulties to go from here to the wandsbergh hospital. -but then i thought, perhaps if that -i can't see the education committee with their lack of money paying for transport for children from here +but also,th the thought of a gar a garden and the children keeping the garden up. +but that's a, apparently that was a long way and they have transport difficulties to go from here to the wandsbergh hospital. +but then i thought, perhaps if that +i can't see the education committee with their lack of money paying for transport for children from here well they won't to go ashington hospital to do a they won't so the they, they garden. -the, the, the education committee and the school governors have no money at all +the, the, the education committee and the school governors have no money at all no. to pay for that. i would expect @@ -23388,19 +23363,19 @@ they won't get the money. th they won't pay for them to go swimming well i don't they've gotta walk to go swimming. -but, i thought that now that the m s has acquired that bus and it's going to be standing around doing nothing for most of the time and it's a twenty nine seater bus. -i mean, the seats come out so that wheelchairs can go in but in between times it's twenty seats you see. +but, i thought that now that the m s has acquired that bus and it's going to be standing around doing nothing for most of the time and it's a twenty nine seater bus. +i mean, the seats come out so that wheelchairs can go in but in between times it's twenty seats you see. and then you'll need a p s v well licence. -but, but that's, that's that's easily remedied if you could get a er a driving licence holder to take them oh a volunteer driving licence holder among one of the parents or somebody who could take the children, er, periodically in the bus to visit the hospital to do this sort of thing. +but, but that's, that's that's easily remedied if you could get a er a driving licence holder to take them oh a volunteer driving licence holder among one of the parents or somebody who could take the children, er, periodically in the bus to visit the hospital to do this sort of thing. so that was a possibility. -but i haven't seen miss about all these sort of things. -but i did also say to mrs , that a new head would be appointed to take the imports from the first of september, that it might be better to discuss it with them after i've discussed with miss . -i only know one person i only know one bus driver with children. +but i haven't seen miss about all these sort of things. +but i did also say to mrs , that a new head would be appointed to take the imports from the first of september, that it might be better to discuss it with them after i've discussed with miss . +i only know one person i only know one bus driver with children. there's ambulance drivers. and he got hi i think their children go to the catholic school. -er this letter from the multiple sclerosis +er this letter from the multiple sclerosis yes. says any that says if you've got wheelchairs in you reduce your number of people. @@ -23408,38 +23383,38 @@ you're not to sixteen. you're not reducing the size of the bus. well i think that's crazy. -and someone who's been just used to driving a car are they going to be able to drive the huge long bus with no extra +and someone who's been just used to driving a car are they going to be able to drive the huge long bus with no extra well tuition? well i, i -whether it's got whether it's got sixteen people in it or twenty nine +whether it's got whether it's got sixteen people in it or twenty nine well er it doesn't alter the length of the bus. i drive the minibus at the hospital i know. -which only takes four wheelchairs and of course there's the drivers of, of the minibus things that bring them. -i think, i, i would query that anyway, that just +which only takes four wheelchairs and of course there's the drivers of, of the minibus things that bring them. +i think, i, i would query that anyway, that just would you like to get into a vehicle the length of a bus with no extra tuition no. and just drive but, but it? -but i query as well, whether just because you reduce the number of spa passengers in it that you, you, you don't need a p s v licence, or the equivalent isn't a p s v licence but it's, it's +but i query as well, whether just because you reduce the number of spa passengers in it that you, you, you don't need a p s v licence, or the equivalent isn't a p s v licence but it's, it's oh you do,the they've looked into that. -but it sounds doubtful to me. -but anyway there's the insurance point of view. -but anyway, any i mean that's the easy, and i mean, if, if people who are willing to drive can have experience in driving before they take passengers out. +but it sounds doubtful to me. +but anyway there's the insurance point of view. +but anyway, any i mean that's the easy, and i mean, if, if people who are willing to drive can have experience in driving before they take passengers out. i mean, i didn't drive the minibus until i'd driven it without passengers. yeah. -i mean i i, i i drove the minibus with only somebody in with me before i drove out with people in it. +i mean i i, i i drove the minibus with only somebody in with me before i drove out with people in it. didn't you da drive dancy dags? oh yes, i drove that, but that was a long time ago that. -yeah, but yo you drove that one -i drove it to ashington and +yeah, but yo you drove that one +i drove it to ashington and mm. you drive her to ashington in it. yes. -erm do you think i should throw these roses out? +erm do you think i should throw these roses out? they're aha. dead aren't they? @@ -23452,7 +23427,7 @@ oh i know. the air wasn't it? i know, but they were dead by about tuesday. the yellow one was dead by tuesday. -so what a shame. +so what a shame. never mind. right, i'll put my make up on. have you decided where you want this umbrella tree? @@ -23460,11 +23435,11 @@ er er you need a saucer at the bottom. but they're never the right size for that it wants . well there's a huge saucer on the old one. -ah but that's in it you can put one in that +ah but that's in it you can put one in that well plant pot, that's a different matter altogether. jus just leave it there for now. -erm i'm going to put my make up on and think what i need from the shops. +erm i'm going to put my make up on and think what i need from the shops. right. it's ten o'clock love. i know. @@ -23476,37 +23451,37 @@ it's gotta be better. oh ! i don't that er -i haven't had a a headache like this for a +i haven't had a a headache like this for a still it's much more quick. i know. -i need some le er the, i wanted a carton of live yoghurt i don't think the live yoghurt i used was any good because, for a start it was fruit flavoured, no it wasn't, it was natural, but it said mild flavoured +i need some le er the, i wanted a carton of live yoghurt i don't think the live yoghurt i used was any good because, for a start it was fruit flavoured, no it wasn't, it was natural, but it said mild flavoured mm. -and i don't think it was the proper like the greek style, real live yoghurt that would have +and i don't think it was the proper like the greek style, real live yoghurt that would have mm mm. started all the fungus growing on it. it is beginning to look like a proper stone cup though. -and they're saying that er okay, i'll go and get ready. -so do you want the yoghurt, yoghurt before we go to the ? -i don't think it matters, but if the weather's still going to be freezing at night +and they're saying that er okay, i'll go and get ready. +so do you want the yoghurt, yoghurt before we go to the ? +i don't think it matters, but if the weather's still going to be freezing at night and if so does, does i've got the the,it's outside all the time anyway . i know, but it's got the polythene bag round it still. -i got it standing on that brick so it would drain. +i got it standing on that brick so it would drain. i wish i knew what to do with the other azalea. -some of the erm stems on it look as if the not mouldy but they're, they're sort of +some of the erm stems on it look as if the not mouldy but they're, they're sort of well we'll just have to dig it up and put green. another one in. those hyacinths in the cauldron are taking a long time to come out aren't they? i know. -i would have thought the tulip that went in the er coal scuttle the tulips in the cauldron i thought they'd had it, they were lying down completely. +i would have thought the tulip that went in the er coal scuttle the tulips in the cauldron i thought they'd had it, they were lying down completely. i know. they just straightened they were up. -just grown up again. -and those forget-me-nots that are called blue ball and are supposed to have brilliant blue flowers, they're coming out with erm tiny pinkey, purpley flowers. +just grown up again. +and those forget-me-nots that are called blue ball and are supposed to have brilliant blue flowers, they're coming out with erm tiny pinkey, purpley flowers. i know. if they're blue, so am i! and then we've got miniature roses gonna come up, one that's on it own, that one with the @@ -23520,43 +23495,43 @@ mhm. i like the other best as well, it's the peach one. when are you going to prune them? well, when i plant that other one where you want it planted, that's -i wonder when er john 's going to have the erm +i wonder when er john 's going to have the erm wheelbarrow ready. yes. oh! -said in yesterday's paper that someone had had a wheelbarrow valued at thirty pounds stolen from a back garden and it was somewhere at kirk hill. +said in yesterday's paper that someone had had a wheelbarrow valued at thirty pounds stolen from a back garden and it was somewhere at kirk hill. where the back gardens aren't particularly accessible. so ours must have cost, i'm sure that would cost them a lot more than thirty pounds. mm. -cos it didn't, it didn't say a wrought iron wheelbarrow or anything, it just said a wheelbarrow. -well those er four tapes +cos it didn't, it didn't say a wrought iron wheelbarrow or anything, it just said a wheelbarrow. +well those er four tapes so we'll have to get it -those four tapes, incidentally, i saw, you know the compil the bach, beethoven, mozart and tchaikovsky, i saw them for fifteen pound. +those four tapes, incidentally, i saw, you know the compil the bach, beethoven, mozart and tchaikovsky, i saw them for fifteen pound. what four tapes? the four, not tapes, compact discs. -the set of four that we sent so they were fifteen pound in there. +the set of four that we sent so they were fifteen pound in there. that who sent to you? -that shirley and gareth sent me for christmas. +that shirley and gareth sent me for christmas. ah ah! the i wish you'd think of something you would like for your birthday. -i told you, i want a i would like a fiddle. -d'ya know i and you need binoculars to go to rome with. +i told you, i want a i would like a fiddle. +d'ya know i and you need binoculars to go to rome with. take a couple of them. well i can't see very well through binoculars. the sistine chapel. we mustn't take those big ones with us. -oh jim they're too heavy. +oh jim they're too heavy. i know. -you,an easier camera . +you,an easier camera . it doesn't need a camera, it needs you! new no it doesn't. new camera what's happened with that camera, you've you -got to rewind it every time the better ones now automatically wind, that's what i mean. -you have never sat down and read +got to rewind it every time the better ones now automatically wind, that's what i mean. +you have never sat down and read you have to rewind it, it's a all the problem. @@ -23578,7 +23553,7 @@ okay. pardon? i thought we were walking? well do you want to walk or do you want to go in the car? -well i'll have to go to the paper shop. +well i'll have to go to the paper shop. well i'll drop you at the paper shop while i go round oh. that's a good idea. @@ -23589,7 +23564,7 @@ no, i haven't. i think more people see the back well i know, cos coming up that way than they do the front window. -a lot of people go to now, more people +a lot of people go to now, more people yeah. there, yeah. so they'll see it @@ -23610,14 +23585,14 @@ there's a car wants to be in. it's there. sorry! he didn't look very pleased did he? -if he was in a such a desperate hurry he could have gone down and gone over there. +if he was in a such a desperate hurry he could have gone down and gone over there. we don't usually get a second post on a saturday. we do, you get a parcel delivery. oh yeah. i've dropped my pen under your seat. i'll get it when we sa unless you, have you got another one? thanks. -have you seen kathleen, er katherine recently? +have you seen kathleen, er katherine recently? no. i've just realized i haven't either, when i saw that woman crossing the road i thought it was her. please let us out someone! @@ -23631,10 +23606,10 @@ it wasn't the cars there it was the cars turning in that's stopping him getting we need some sugar. we've had no sugar all this week. not that you've noticed. -i made the custard from er sugar cubes. +i made the custard from er sugar cubes. and i didn't know how lo how old the sugar cubes were. right. -we got them when we packed up your mother's house. +we got them when we packed up your mother's house. right, where am i, i'll meet at er co-op. co-op. @@ -23645,8 +23620,8 @@ see you later. hello. hello. please. -and there was no erm television supplement, and no comic in the daily mirror this morning. -that's the second time in the past four weeks we've had missed that. +and there was no erm television supplement, and no comic in the daily mirror this morning. +that's the second time in the past four weeks we've had missed that. erm, i dunno. there's seven only, oh that one. seventeen. @@ -23663,8 +23638,8 @@ one sixty two. thank you. thank you. you haven't given me the bits missing from the mirror. -well that's erm tt nothing i can do about that until asking for the mirror itself . -well i'm sorry but my daily mirror divi delivered this morning without the television supplement, and without the comic and i want +well that's erm tt nothing i can do about that until asking for the mirror itself . +well i'm sorry but my daily mirror divi delivered this morning without the television supplement, and without the comic and i want the page of them. the actual page? @@ -23682,7 +23657,7 @@ look, i cannae give you one out of there though. well you're going to have to! because i can't -when i pay for a paper i want it to be complete, so i want that piece and i want that, that piece. +when i pay for a paper i want it to be complete, so i want that piece and i want that, that piece. no, wait a minute, where is it? which is the television? can you take my eighty p for this so we can go. @@ -23700,11 +23675,11 @@ there we are. right. right, so i've got the two pieces that are missing from my paper. sorry. -and that's gonna be someone else's paper then? -well i've already paid for mine so i'm going to get +and that's gonna be someone else's paper then? +well i've already paid for mine so i'm going to get well some, well someone'll pay for that. so, well you'll just have to tell them that it's missing. -but when i've paid for a newspaper i expect all the pieces that i've paid for. +but when i've paid for a newspaper i expect all the pieces that i've paid for. and i've already paid for mine, so this i'll take. thank you. hello. @@ -23733,12 +23708,12 @@ because we get no sun in this room whatsoever oh. of course yeah. -with the the bathroom +with the the bathroom well, you said we could. blocking it off. er, we seem to have, you know, before let's enough light in. -before i was a gard er was a mo a gardener, and after i'd three years to the extent i can't. +before i was a gard er was a mo a gardener, and after i'd three years to the extent i can't. you sound like me, i'm always moving who do you want me sign it as? member or vice chairman? @@ -23747,7 +23722,7 @@ that's right. would you like some coffee? no thank you. -i'll er for years she's just come back and she's i said i want . +i'll er for years she's just come back and she's i said i want . where's she been? she's been down to . oh! @@ -23755,20 +23730,20 @@ i didn't know. i yeah. was talking to maurice yesterday. -she's act she er they've been down for a for a flying visit, i think,th they like to fly and fly back because it gets th the fre used to the freedom. +she's act she er they've been down for a for a flying visit, i think,th they like to fly and fly back because it gets th the fre used to the freedom. yes. -you get er rather tied up with looking after marcus and his sister. +you get er rather tied up with looking after marcus and his sister. well, yeah. -i know marcus and naomi is, is relatively easy compared with er +i know marcus and naomi is, is relatively easy compared with er he's a lovely little boy isn't he? -yeah, that one er,wha th were all from, from the er they were all from the +yeah, that one er,wha th were all from, from the er they were all from the urgh! this coffee's cold. -except for the last one which i missed off the last time. -i, it went through alright, but er i've got a reminder this time so i i thought well +except for the last one which i missed off the last time. +i, it went through alright, but er i've got a reminder this time so i i thought well i will miss that one. -that er er,i information centre. +that er er,i information centre. oh yes. ah yes. right well, have you @@ -23776,35 +23751,35 @@ that's it. sorted anything out about the oranges? aha. yes. -erm i've got a letter saying that it's er th the mayor the is it sixteen, fifteen pounds worth of o of er +erm i've got a letter saying that it's er th the mayor the is it sixteen, fifteen pounds worth of o of er oranges. -oranges, is gonna be issued in the place we say that that er, er at two o'clock if it's wet we'll be in the +oranges, is gonna be issued in the place we say that that er, er at two o'clock if it's wet we'll be in the the pavilion. oh! which is, like, next door. -i had the rotaract, erm, they said they'd probably be, offered, er er, one of these castle things er jumping castles from . +i had the rotaract, erm, they said they'd probably be, offered, er er, one of these castle things er jumping castles from . oh! did you see those on the news yesterday? aye. i see, yeah. -they can cause a lot of apparently. +they can cause a lot of apparently. adults and children yeah. injuries. -i fell off one the week before last at the soft play but it wasn't blown up quite enough. +i fell off one the week before last at the soft play but it wasn't blown up quite enough. oh i see. and, as i ste well there's no carpet, he said there's just well, there was -there's a great you know the big heavy erm, foam thing, but it kept slipping away. +there's a great you know the big heavy erm, foam thing, but it kept slipping away. all the morning i kept pushing it back again. aye. yeah. they er couldn't tell me i suppose. -and it a it had happened to of slipped away at that time and i went to step off, and, with it not being blown up properly that's how it just flattened and i went off sid i've still got a big bruise on my left knee! -well erm the only +and it a it had happened to of slipped away at that time and i went to step off, and, with it not being blown up properly that's how it just flattened and i went off sid i've still got a big bruise on my left knee! +well erm the only so i, i do not jump on any more. the only trouble with that sort of thing i is, again if you ever get any wet on it because mm. @@ -23819,12 +23794,12 @@ er do you work? no. mm. -no, erm basically er i think for the anyhow trevor will be coming in, so we'll, we just st try and stay a little more to see what happens at the end. +no, erm basically er i think for the anyhow trevor will be coming in, so we'll, we just st try and stay a little more to see what happens at the end. but erm -see they handed it over to us and, but they didn't wanna you know, it was very when, what they call them? +see they handed it over to us and, but they didn't wanna you know, it was very when, what they call them? erm it was temple wasn't it,la last year? -aye, temple was but it, it was a good job because we had no oranges and they had to go and break in. +aye, temple was but it, it was a good job because we had no oranges and they had to go and break in. it's alright now . yeah. was that the year the oranges were horrible? @@ -23839,22 +23814,22 @@ they've never been really nice. yeah. well i don't know where they're getting them from, but i mean, that's what they say. well that year -and they've got round table laid on to help and they want help from the from us. -so they want us to go around at half past one or the two of them can start cos we've got an addition . +and they've got round table laid on to help and they want help from the from us. +so they want us to go around at half past one or the two of them can start cos we've got an addition . well, it worked. -er, i'm just wondered, you know,wi with because they came to expect it and we, we didn't know. -and, they'd handed it over to us and then obviously they wanted it back, but then -well, i think it's like everything else, i think that er, with, with lawrence being off they're just sort of meeting everything as a crisis and getting, getting +er, i'm just wondered, you know,wi with because they came to expect it and we, we didn't know. +and, they'd handed it over to us and then obviously they wanted it back, but then +well, i think it's like everything else, i think that er, with, with lawrence being off they're just sort of meeting everything as a crisis and getting, getting well if you're at work yo you see as well to go with what you call them? er, he, he didn't he didn't want anything to do with it you see. -that's where and he's not from , he's not from this end so had er no real interest for him i don't think. -if you're at work dorothy could go if i help, i'll help with trevor with his triplets. +that's where and he's not from , he's not from this end so had er no real interest for him i don't think. +if you're at work dorothy could go if i help, i'll help with trevor with his triplets. well you can go and get their oranges and the -yes, but it's, he, he couldn't possibly push that buggy +yes, but it's, he, he couldn't possibly push that buggy around that field. but it isn't in the fields though. it's up beside the @@ -23873,22 +23848,22 @@ it's got a . yes. so it can't be used. right. -but i presume that we do turn out if we do it right in the middle. -well in actual fact, people who turned out were isobel and me, and er what they call him? +but i presume that we do turn out if we do it right in the middle. +well in actual fact, people who turned out were isobel and me, and er what they call him? er, one who goes on? er, from lonsdene? -er fred ? -fred +er fred ? +fred no. fred . no, jack's not very well. -well i helped you one year +well i helped you one year oh yes. cos there was only yes. -there was only you and somebody else. +there was only you and somebody else. well the year i was chairman. -th the, er the year i was wi i was chairman, we were both there. +th the, er the year i was wi i was chairman, we were both there. there was one child came up about seventeen times oh yes! i think. @@ -23897,21 +23872,21 @@ i know. that was the year the oranges were horrible, maybe his mother was making marmalade. the only thing about er is that the rotaract one tentatively mentioned about the . well that's it. -i mean,th tha when we took it over we, we got that, cos people said well, you know, just dishing out the oranges wasn't there should be something organized so rotaract said they would do we said we would give the money towards the prizes. +i mean,th tha when we took it over we, we got that, cos people said well, you know, just dishing out the oranges wasn't there should be something organized so rotaract said they would do we said we would give the money towards the prizes. so that they wouldn't hate us. well when er, the, the, the, there's two words, the charter, and what's the other word? there's two things to do with . food and jar, that's right. yeah. well well barlen, barlen. -barlen and . +barlen and . yeah. yeah. i can't say that properly. -those words aren't used where i come from . +those words aren't used where i come from . and er, er mind, i use words that jim doesn't. -the, the rotaract er presents this year that they're towards, so he's been quite pleased. +the, the rotaract er presents this year that they're towards, so he's been quite pleased. mhm. so they'll, they'll be done. and round table it says, has laid on for the @@ -23928,14 +23903,14 @@ with, with the games and things when, when we were there. yes. and it was a reasonable day too i know all the children. -i mean, we thought it'd rain this year so it's more +i mean, we thought it'd rain this year so it's more yeah. likely to be a better day then and ee, all the kids ended up with a prize didn't they? oh, eventually, yes. i mean,th the yeah they -they were that had bigger to ones +they were that had bigger to ones the winners got who supplied those then? out of the money that we gave them. @@ -23953,18 +23928,18 @@ ah. and the others got little cadbury's ah. creme eggs. -which remi reminds me, i've got to get some for all they spare children before +which remi reminds me, i've got to get some for all they spare children before yes. well before they ran out. -it's surprising actually cos th the more, the more common ones do run out because of course th the other ones are a bit pricey. -the blooming creme eggs are on sale all the year round and then they run out at easter. -that's happened, i couldn't get any one year i took the triplets to the erm goose hill coffee morning in the town hall and i gave them all money for the tombola and one of them won a creme egg -but i persuaded him that it would melt while he had his drink and to put it in my bag and er it was lunchtime when we got home and we were going some i, i can't remember what we were doing afterwards so i gave it to his mother, i thought she could share it. -mind, by the time you'd shared a creme egg between those three and their older brother +it's surprising actually cos th the more, the more common ones do run out because of course th the other ones are a bit pricey. +the blooming creme eggs are on sale all the year round and then they run out at easter. +that's happened, i couldn't get any one year i took the triplets to the erm goose hill coffee morning in the town hall and i gave them all money for the tombola and one of them won a creme egg +but i persuaded him that it would melt while he had his drink and to put it in my bag and er it was lunchtime when we got home and we were going some i, i can't remember what we were doing afterwards so i gave it to his mother, i thought she could share it. +mind, by the time you'd shared a creme egg between those three and their older brother yeah. there's not much of it left. -no, but i could have seen a, there'd be an almighty tantrums from the other two if ji er +no, but i could have seen a, there'd be an almighty tantrums from the other two if ji er aha. james had had it. i can imagine. @@ -23974,30 +23949,30 @@ is there anything much for the agenda for a week on tuesday? not a great deal. i mean, what i'll yeah. -do is we'll get rid of those couple of things left over +do is we'll get rid of those couple of things left over mhm. -and er basically, it's, peter's got the one coming which is er put the ducks in the river. +and er basically, it's, peter's got the one coming which is er put the ducks in the river. mm. er, he's doing the, a, and what i'm er sug suggesting aha. -like well apparently the fella that's done it, for years, and years, for years, for years has had a +like well apparently the fella that's done it, for years, and years, for years, for years has had a mhm. -and he's, he's just ke you know what i mean, i think he's, he's getting an extension so that's why there's a bit of delay on that. +and he's, he's just ke you know what i mean, i think he's, he's getting an extension so that's why there's a bit of delay on that. mhm. and it's where that lot meet . i've been counting them since. well how much, i mean i read the letter in the paper. how much was he paying ? -it was summat like er i dunno, it was summat like five hundred pound a year. +it was summat like er i dunno, it was summat like five hundred pound a year. it was quite modest. mm. er there were thirteen but -drakes cha er chasing one duck er, just past the baths along the promenade. -and then we sat at the far side of the old gate bridge and er an old lady came along and said, and she was counting them but she said, just look at that thing, she counted seven although, in actual fact, by then th these dra the seven drakes had stopped cha chasing the duck and they were all sitting down. -and a there was a domestic one in each group there was one along near the baths in among the thirteen, and there was another white one near old gate bridge. +drakes cha er chasing one duck er, just past the baths along the promenade. +and then we sat at the far side of the old gate bridge and er an old lady came along and said, and she was counting them but she said, just look at that thing, she counted seven although, in actual fact, by then th these dra the seven drakes had stopped cha chasing the duck and they were all sitting down. +and a there was a domestic one in each group there was one along near the baths in among the thirteen, and there was another white one near old gate bridge. i believe we've taken a decision on that for the health conference, last time round. i've got one on page eighty-one, but we'll come to it on pollution control. they're are some others too, chair, on the seminars and conferences we've listed. @@ -24007,7 +23982,7 @@ erm well, as i understand it there is a report on the authorization of officers, ah, that's right, sorry yes, chair, and i don't have copies and, you do? well, i have some, i thought they'd gone round, but this is, erm sorry -chair, it was one officer whom we've got on staff at the moment karen wheeler who's away nursing her new baby, and it's to authorize that officer to carry out certain roles under the health and safety +chair, it was one officer whom we've got on staff at the moment karen wheeler who's away nursing her new baby, and it's to authorize that officer to carry out certain roles under the health and safety can you circulate that, the committee is accustomed to seeing it. i don't think it should cause you any problems, but it is something that's come on late erm as a result of maternity cover. right. @@ -24029,14 +24004,14 @@ i'm an administrator by background, and i think that's interesting, because one of those two colleagues, interestingly enough, one is a health visitor by background, the other is a nurse, but someone who practised or hasn't practised, but as a district health community planner for a number of years. so you can see that we have quite a mixture of people in terms of our backgrounds professionally. the purpose of general management is to try and ensure that in the city that we are getting the best value we can from the health resources that are in the city, and i have the authority now, and the responsibility to spend the budget that i've had allocated from the oxfordshire health authority, by gerald simon who's the general manager. -so a big change in the way that we are arranged has actually come about through the general management structure, and we're hoping that this will give us more room, if you like to start looking at priorities, and to move the budget around in accordance with our feelings about those priorities. +so a big change in the way that we are arranged has actually come about through the general management structure, and we're hoping that this will give us more room, if you like to start looking at priorities, and to move the budget around in accordance with our feelings about those priorities. in that task i am assisted by a team of six managers, all of whom are professional nurses and district nurses or health visitors and they of course are there to advise me on professional issues, and to share with me the management task of using the resources of oxford city in the way that we feel is best appropriate, and in doing that, i think one of the important things for us to do, i don't think we do it quite as well as we should, is to work more closely with the local council, and to look really at what the needs of our local communities are for health, and to try and make sure that the feelings that might well be expressed by individuals, either individually, or through caring associations, or through other statutory agencies, or through voluntary health organisations, are actually given a chance to be there, and to influence our, that official policy and constituents , and to, to influence the planning process. i've made a note of a potting of that briefing paper to you. i personally see this is as one of my major objectives over the next year or so, and in a sense it makes me trebly grateful to be here today, because i hope some of the contacts i might make today will enable me to work alongside you in what might be called even local berkshire band, and to try and get more a multiplicity of views from different organisations channelled through our own value objectives. -and it is the exciting part of my job is to make these links work, start to build on them, and over our links in the city on the environmental and group with tony benn , that's that's doing a very good job, he is a platform for this, for each other, but i think there's a lot more we can do locally erm within the city to build those links, and to work together for better answers for the city, and i hope that, on a practical level, one of the things that interested me was your grants team for local organisations, and i would like to think myself here today, we might look at the health authority, and try to join with them to make some erm practical contribution, particularly to those many carers, and groups of people who have problems, and we're not all just professionals best able to put over during our normal nine-to-five or eight-to-eight days, we we can. +and it is the exciting part of my job is to make these links work, start to build on them, and over our links in the city on the environmental and group with tony benn , that's that's doing a very good job, he is a platform for this, for each other, but i think there's a lot more we can do locally erm within the city to build those links, and to work together for better answers for the city, and i hope that, on a practical level, one of the things that interested me was your grants team for local organisations, and i would like to think myself here today, we might look at the health authority, and try to join with them to make some erm practical contribution, particularly to those many carers, and groups of people who have problems, and we're not all just professionals best able to put over during our normal nine-to-five or eight-to-eight days, we we can. there's a lot we can do, i think, to help the community in a wider sense, and i see that as one of the key elements of my work, to try and make that work. and i'm not too concerned with the day-to-day management of individual professionals, i've got a team to help me do that. -what concerns me is looking at the and trying to forge new creative links with other organisations, statutory and voluntary, in the best health interests of oxfordshire residents. +what concerns me is looking at the and trying to forge new creative links with other organisations, statutory and voluntary, in the best health interests of oxfordshire residents. that i think is my main concern, with a request in a sense to you for supporting that over the next year or so, because i'll be trying to perhaps get invited to the meetings, and perhaps we'll be inviting officers from the authority to join me in looking at ways of building up that local context in planning to get that into our formal planning systems. that will be my key message, and the other thing i'd like to emphasise today, and i'd be very grateful for some sort of early response to that. i have discussed it with dorothy tomkin i think we have a genuine desire to move to a more authority-based planning system, erm, we haven't got the methods of doing that yet, and i turn to c b s and to local authority and to the traditional carers for them to join us in that. @@ -24052,12 +24027,12 @@ and the other thing to say to from me is yes, we would love a multiplicity of vi so that's my bit of bad news. i can see arthur, betty and liz. chairman, may i first of all declare an interest in this. -erm under the new erm system erm every g p must at some time during the visit erm persons over seventy-five. +erm under the new erm system erm every g p must at some time during the visit erm persons over seventy-five. now, what are you doing to ensure that erm that this is carried out because a lot of elderly, they will not go to the doctor, but erm the doctor i believe has got to go and see them. now, what are you doing to really see this is getting off the ground? well, i ian, can i ask you to save the questions and respond at the end, otherwise you'll find the discussion takes much longer, is that alright? -although that may not be appropriate view of that, but, betty? +although that may not be appropriate view of that, but, betty? i was going to raise the very question you raised. there we were as representatives of this city, people who are in contact with erm people who have got problems, we were can you press your button, betty? @@ -24072,7 +24047,7 @@ thank you. i'm finding myself somewhat confused, i mean, i was interested that ian had mentioned the practical voluntary services as one of the groups that he would wish to work with. i think that recently we seem to have had such, so many changes in the health authority, so many different peoples in the post who all seem to be doing the same sort of thing, who've got the family health services authority set up, but it would seem to me that some of the things that are on this piece of paper are things that i understood were being done by the family health services authority. we have a joint planning officer, and we've got quite a lot of joint erm of joint planning going on between the voluntary sector and the health authority and the social services. -we've got a whole erm, a whole erm organisation that in fact the council for voluntary service only this week made an appointment with a very, very, very, very small amount of money that's been made available on a very, very part-time basis, to actually assist with that, with the planning that's going on in the voluntary sector. +we've got a whole erm, a whole erm organisation that in fact the council for voluntary service only this week made an appointment with a very, very, very, very small amount of money that's been made available on a very, very part-time basis, to actually assist with that, with the planning that's going on in the voluntary sector. and i think that we're constantly hearing about new people, new systems of working. erm new people who are being put in posts to liaise and to do this, that and the other, with a shrinking voluntary sector. with a voluntary sector that is erm constantly needing small amounts of resource in order to deliver an enormous amount of service to vulnerable people. @@ -24104,9 +24079,9 @@ yes, but at what level? do you yet know at what level that's going to be organised? i don't know. you don't know, so that's part of the planning system that we're working on? -the working groups are currently on working on that, and they, my colleagues i assume are talking to the the officers of the social services about that, what is happening, but the final outcome has yet to appear. -just answering the first question on assessment of the over seventy-fives, that in fact really should be better left for the to say. -i'm not part of the organisation. +the working groups are currently on working on that, and they, my colleagues i assume are talking to the the officers of the social services about that, what is happening, but the final outcome has yet to appear. +just answering the first question on assessment of the over seventy-fives, that in fact really should be better left for the to say. +i'm not part of the organisation. they have a responsibility for managing the u g b contract, and you quite rightly said that one of the arguments on that contract, assessments of the over seventy-fives. i belong to the community oxford health authority not to the family health services authority, so that's just to clarify that, that did cover two questions that i was asked. in terms of primary health care teams, they are existing members of staff, or health visitors attached to general practices, and we call that collaboration if you like . @@ -24214,7 +24189,7 @@ i think if the committee did that then we'd be back to what five or six years ag is that reasonable at this stage? yes so we can get progress? -chair, could i make, could i suggest maybe that in future when you ask organisations you make it harder for getting a license for street collection, that you tell them that you'll want to know exactly the proportions, but i mean put it back on to them, rather than be you having to bother to it in the future. +chair, could i make, could i suggest maybe that in future when you ask organisations you make it harder for getting a license for street collection, that you tell them that you'll want to know exactly the proportions, but i mean put it back on to them, rather than be you having to bother to it in the future. right, is that not done? it is to a degree, on the application form that each charity receives, it has to state whether it collects for people in the oxford area, but not as a percentage. i think that, more, not sort of say a general question like that, but say that after the collection has happened that you want returns for the number of people in oxford that have benefited from the number of groups in oxford that have benefited. @@ -24227,7 +24202,7 @@ i know, but what i mean is that when they see the city centre, the people who ar don't know about the issues to do with house-to-house collection. are we getting, erm collecting erm in the shopping centres. they just don't actually have that information, a lot of small local groups, and i think maybe the c b s could work with the engineers department in future years and try to get to those groups, because i'm sure a lot of them, actually if they were given the opportunity in time to get in, that, that you might have a lot of people applying for flag and whatever than you do now. -well, by all means, let's do that, and has been represented in committee for some time, we have responsibility for licenses for some time, and if there isn't a dialogue now, then there'll be a good reason why there isn't, and i, i take what you say, liz. +well, by all means, let's do that, and has been represented in committee for some time, we have responsibility for licenses for some time, and if there isn't a dialogue now, then there'll be a good reason why there isn't, and i, i take what you say, liz. but certainly, if we have something like fifty applications, then we'd be into a much more complex procedure. we can see why we don't, and i'm not clear about the reasons why we don't, but there you are, michael. chair, another query about a couple of the comments made just now, about priority being given to organisations which disclaim their proceeds in oxford or oxfordshire. @@ -24253,7 +24228,7 @@ it doesn't, they just haven't requested it this year. well, i mean, that is absolutely nonsense, it's tradition, i'm sure they'll have it. can you take that up with age concern, anne? there's a limit as to how much we can do for half the people in this committee are members -but you see it's inaccurate anyway, because it's five two during nineteen ninety five, and they had it +but you see it's inaccurate anyway, because it's five two during nineteen ninety five, and they had it this year they did for last year. i mean, it's for christmas this year that we want it. @@ -24291,7 +24266,7 @@ the joint report from amanda and phil. amanda, do you want to kick off on this? thank you chair, erm many of you will perhaps know that the health authority did some pioneering work looking at different standard mortality ratios in different wards in oxfordshire, and came up with some rather disturbing evidence that some of the wards had significantly higher incidents of death for people primarily in the forty-five to sixty-four age range than others, and phil and myself wish to continue that work by targeting those wards with a range of measures designed to alleviate some of those health inequalities. and in this report, we've just outlined a very preliminary start to what we're doing. -we'd obviously, we'd like to get the agreement of this committee to continue that work and to take it up to the various bodies and consultation. +we'd obviously, we'd like to get the agreement of this committee to continue that work and to take it up to the various bodies and consultation. and, erm to develop it there's a timetable in the appendices about the progress we envisage making. we'd like to confirm by the end of this year which wards we're targeting and how we're targeting them, which range of erm measures that we're going to undertake. is that we've been involved in health strategy for the past over five years. @@ -24305,7 +24280,7 @@ that's out test. i would also add to that that i think such work would help us in terms of targeting more effectively the existing resources we have in terms of service delivery. are there any questions? sheila? -chair, i'd like to ask amanda, i did st clements and petersfield . +chair, i'd like to ask amanda, i did st clements and petersfield . is there any possibility of, in the near future of doing a council estate, like barton or blackbird leys? erm yes, certainly, i, i would suggest east and st clements because they have got quite high ethnic populations, and we can perhaps be hoping to start there, because environmental health's already worked there, targeting some of the multi-occupation properties, so they've got a very high proportion of black people living there, which means that they're also quite important in the sense of deprivation, but, i mean, we are also very conscious that we should be working on a council estate, and what we, what i would like to do is to simultaneously be starting working in erm a particular sets of communities, is to be given work in consultation in other wards, so that you know, six months down the line before . but thanks for the point, and i mean, i'll make a note of that and take it up to the health authority. @@ -24331,7 +24306,7 @@ the other question i've got is presumably all this is still being done within wh you know the answer to that question, non, there's going to be no extra bids. no extra bids. this particular section's taken some slices already, so we'd better watch what we say to them. -they're doing it within their own time and resources, but it does seem to me to be a very appropriate area for michael? +they're doing it within their own time and resources, but it does seem to me to be a very appropriate area for michael? thank you it's certainly will be difficult, chair, but in answer to mrs tidley, what's happening to our housing, the answer is we've stopped building it. government policy we don't build any housing, and therefore we've got five thousand on the waiting list, and that's why health is a major problem for a lot of people in this city, because we're not building any houses, she knows that, and she and her party do nothing about it. @@ -24377,7 +24352,7 @@ i don't want you to think, caroline that we are acquitting you rapidly, i will t well, thank you, chair, for inviting me here. erm do you want me to speak to this please do. -caroline morrell, from ocadu, do you want to press your button, caroline, so that everybody will please sit down normally and naturally, and maybe moved a bit closer to you, they'll pick up what you're saying. +caroline morrell, from ocadu, do you want to press your button, caroline, so that everybody will please sit down normally and naturally, and maybe moved a bit closer to you, they'll pick up what you're saying. erm but i raised this at the alcohol forum, because erm sometime this summer i had a phone call from mr bailey here, who is a resident of east oxford, to express his concern about various problems erm in east oxford, problems that were posed to residents there. erm i think in fact it would be better to ask mr bailey to explain what his concerns were erm i'd just like to say first although initially it revolves around problems of drinking, i'm looking at other issues of east oxford, in that recently there's been a great deal of concern about glue sniffing in sections there, and there have been various letters from residents in the local newspapers, and i think there's a general level of problem for people living in east oxford, and it's not just that the people there want the streets cleaned up or whatever, they want something constructive and helpful to be done for people. so @@ -24397,8 +24372,8 @@ erm and the, a lot of this was not specific to drug or alcohol abuse but simply and we've now reached a situation in which there's something over twenty percent of our streets is multiple occupation, erm and this is noise and other activities in relation to that are the things that cause the sort of low level of concern, and this was just the peak on top of that of major aggravation. erm i think there are one or two of the elderly tenants in particular who felt really very anxious about activities at night time, and they're going to have their property stolen, or things thrown at their house. i mean these people, there's things like throwing broken milk bottles, throwing milk bottles into peoples yards, removing bicycles, picking up my bicycle, as it happens, and throwing it down several times, erm going down the streets playing a sound system full volume at two o'clock in the morning, which generally left people feeling they didn't know what was happening. -this was only part of a general sort of pattern as it were, where people were beginning to impinge on their lives, there was another well-known local alcoholic there who was knocking on doors trying to get money off people, and there's several elderly people who gave this woman money, because they were frightened that if they didn't something would happen to them. -so i think i can express some of my neighbours concerns, unless, particularly, not particularly worried about those, but there is a general feeling that things are getting worse, and that they're not safe in their own homes, among the more elderly. +this was only part of a general sort of pattern as it were, where people were beginning to impinge on their lives, there was another well-known local alcoholic there who was knocking on doors trying to get money off people, and there's several elderly people who gave this woman money, because they were frightened that if they didn't something would happen to them. +so i think i can express some of my neighbours concerns, unless, particularly, not particularly worried about those, but there is a general feeling that things are getting worse, and that they're not safe in their own homes, among the more elderly. erm and obviously a few people don't like the sight of people on the cowley, the cowley hospital site, and things like that. this doesn't concern me. i do feel i'd like to say one point about the people who were in this house, that it's quite clear, all of them i believe were under care of the social services, erm and i don't know enough about their history to say whether they, where they've been before, whether they've been in some half-way house, or just been thrown out of some mental institution. @@ -24505,7 +24480,7 @@ are there items that people, i mean, i take the point about freezing c o 2 emiss that's woolly to say the least. we may want to make the point that if we are to be committed to doing something about the global warming of the ozone layer then we will need to say when we will do it by. and ensure there's a programme which achieves that. -are there any other additions to that, if not patrick. +are there any other additions to that, if not patrick. yes, i'd like to support michael in the setting up of an environmental protection agency. i think that if we leave it to i don't think it was michael who suggested it. @@ -24537,7 +24512,7 @@ thank you graham. well, i think they'll be a government still there! no, yours. labour! -can i then move you on, and we will correct the pollution and control sub committee minutes when we get to them just and nonnie. +can i then move you on, and we will correct the pollution and control sub committee minutes when we get to them just and nonnie. item nine, there's a report for the half year ending on page forty-one, tony? yes, chair, erm, i was supposed to give the figures if they'd come out at this time. you'll notice one or two minor changes. @@ -24549,7 +24524,7 @@ we haven't had that sort of figure very often before. erm the national figure seems to be, the national figure of food poisoning cases this year looks like being in excess of sixty thousand. erm it was around fifty-four thousand last year, and the figure's just going up and up. the answer to it i just don't know, but the food safety act deals with some of the future, some of the future objectives in terms of better training for people who handle food, and tighter controls on food businesses, so it's something to look forward to, and hopefully in years to come the figure will begin to drop. -on erm food and noise, we're still very, very busy indeed, and our figure for noise inspection is higher than it ever has been before, and the comment that was made under that section will show you that some of that most certainly is the amount of work that the team had to carry out during the summer, one of the benefits of our glorious summer is that most of us slept with our windows fully open for three months or more and one of the dis-benefits was that if anybody else down the road had a party that went beyond normal bed-time, everybody shared that, and our team was very busy in consequence. +on erm food and noise, we're still very, very busy indeed, and our figure for noise inspection is higher than it ever has been before, and the comment that was made under that section will show you that some of that most certainly is the amount of work that the team had to carry out during the summer, one of the benefits of our glorious summer is that most of us slept with our windows fully open for three months or more and one of the dis-benefits was that if anybody else down the road had a party that went beyond normal bed-time, everybody shared that, and our team was very busy in consequence. erm on occupational health, and i don't plead for those figures, because for a time, until helen left to have her baby, we were fully staffed, and the number of inspections and the number of notices served and the number of prohibition notices served are very encouraging indeed. the impact of the section has been very broadly based in the city, and for the first time we've added for you in very brief terms, a domiciliary health information of just the total number of visits made by the city health care, erm and the level of work in terms of notices served, and prosecutions, note, going up in most of the sections, particularly their units they're small numbers, but they are significant, just the same, and the table on the top of page forty-four, erm as i said earlier, i think we reached the highest level of insect complaints in the summer that we've ever had to deal with, it's very usual for us to deal with a thousand, over in the summer period, this time we dealt with sixteen hundred. an amazing amount of work carried out by the three members of the pest control team, with some additional help with larger jobs during the summer period. @@ -24580,14 +24555,14 @@ they are? well, i know he was a man, i saw him! all of them are. and, i certainly have taken steps to make sure that i don't get a wasps nest, but in that particular area again, because he begged to point out to me where the wasp was getting access to, a little tiny space above my bedroom window, and that has now been sealed, so hopefully the wasps another year will find a home somewhere else that isn't quite so close to my open bedroom window. -so perhaps if people were aware of some of the places where wasps can go within their home, they might be able to sort of take those conscious that wasn't actually what i had +so perhaps if people were aware of some of the places where wasps can go within their home, they might be able to sort of take those conscious that wasn't actually what i had well, be quick then! nothing, nothing fascinating. i just wanted to know what on page forty-two under ‘water sampling’, what the bracketing figures say four u stroke s, one u stroke s, etcetera meant, and on page forty-three, why under ‘programme and revisiting inspection’ this four one nine p was starred. -i just wondered what those contexts and you will be bound to be asked it in council if it's not asked now. +i just wondered what those contexts and you will be bound to be asked it in council if it's not asked now. thank you very much, diana. thank you. -chair, we do class as unsatisfactory those samples that the laboratory would covers don't reach certain standards, whatever the standard may be, and that's why we concentrate on that figure that the bathing unsatisfactory at one particular pool, where there was a serious problem. +chair, we do class as unsatisfactory those samples that the laboratory would covers don't reach certain standards, whatever the standard may be, and that's why we concentrate on that figure that the bathing unsatisfactory at one particular pool, where there was a serious problem. and the starred items, i think the starred items, i'm not sure now, i think, can you help here? no, i'm sorry, ken. i'm pretty sure that the @@ -24622,7 +24597,7 @@ what erm my view is that we have a current shortfall, and i think the figures hi erm although one would hate to be, i don't want to be accused of being elitist and saying that e h o's must do a particular job, but what i would like to say it that we need people who are trained to a sufficient level to be able to do the ultra high risk catering area, as distinct from other high-risk areas. it's my professional opinion that we have a problem there in terms of training and expertise, and i feel that, as you've said, the technician is forth-coming, we will be obviously having to draft very, very carefully a job description, but i feel that training requirements will be such that it will be very, very difficult to fulfil those requirements and indeed to cope with this ultra high-risk catering area. it's my considered opinion that the only way we can do that is by an e h o, and we will find, eventually, that we will suffer continued short-fall in terms of ultra high-risk inspection. -i think it's fair to say that we've gone a long, long way in oxford to breaking down barriers with regard to the inspection priorities, and we are in a position within the city where we have nature of, if you like, technicians and staff that are doing jobs that in many other surrounding areas, and indeed throughout the country are the prerogative of e h o, and these include areas specified as high-risk by maff, and include a great bulk of all customer and consumer complaints. +i think it's fair to say that we've gone a long, long way in oxford to breaking down barriers with regard to the inspection priorities, and we are in a position within the city where we have nature of, if you like, technicians and staff that are doing jobs that in many other surrounding areas, and indeed throughout the country are the prerogative of e h o, and these include areas specified as high-risk by maff, and include a great bulk of all customer and consumer complaints. the only area that i'm saying is in need for careful consideration is that related to risks associated with the possibilities of food poisoning and very high-risk food handling. i think really that is all i can say, chair, erm in addition to your comments. thanks very much indeed for your report, matthew, it's certainly very informative, and in an ideal world, i think we might have made a different decision today. @@ -24652,7 +24627,7 @@ erm we've got to recognise the professional advice that matthew is giving us in but we are giving, we are giving him a post, another body, and hopefully with a very careful job description he will get a trained person, because we also recognise the fact that oxford's a marvellous place for people to come. the environmental health department is seen throughout britain as being a nice place to come. i mean, i keep hearing that when i come into the environmental health department, that, just that people are interested in what oxford are doing. -they keep busy, don't they. +they keep busy, don't they. well set up. yes. so we're one of the important environmental health departments, sure, so hopefully we will actually get somebody who is really very good, a food technician to assist in this erm field, and there have, i hope that through food forum we may well be able to help matthew with his, well not just matthew, but help, help that section with the nutrition advice that he feels is still lacking in his team under the circumstances. @@ -24705,69 +24680,68 @@ this thing breaks it down by age, as i say, we're looking at seventy-fives and o more than half the people don't want any help at all. well, i think that's, we can accept the point easily. erm quite a lot of help required in areas of the remit of this committee i would guess, things like home, security and safety, heating down here, quite a lot of people want help with heating. - -they're both, press it hard right that's going. +they're both, press it hard right that's going. press the one, the black one behind there to switch it off. so we're on now are we? -come on beauty +come on beauty have you made any tea? no. oh dear, oh dear oh dear. -oh you hello little doggy. +oh you hello little doggy. try cooking this ham, do you think they might like it then? sorry? the ham. the dogs. try cooking it. oh. -well wouldn't be able tempt them into er -i mean really they should they don't mind +well wouldn't be able tempt them into er +i mean really they should they don't mind well that's the availability of the things isn't it? -i think you might have to er take him down the road afterwards when it clears up. +i think you might have to er take him down the road afterwards when it clears up. oh you're not going to take them with you? -well see how it goes +well see how it goes it's going off a bit now isn't it? oh no. -erm you do realize this ham is already cooked don't you? +erm you do realize this ham is already cooked don't you? no. no. thought it might, they won't eat it like that, that's have they not eaten anything at all? i haven't given them anything yet. oh. -pliers and the screwdriver out take them with you +pliers and the screwdriver out take them with you no, for that job i was doing last night. the ca oh yes on the er the castors -castors. into the garage +castors. into the garage yes have you gotta be there early this morning? no. oh. but i want to get there for nine. -i said to john yesterday i said i i've done the er chair. -i said i wanna get on with these, those dining chairs next in the sale. +i said to john yesterday i said i i've done the er chair. +i said i wanna get on with these, those dining chairs next in the sale. when's the sale? summer time isn't it? about june? -erm may some time in may. +erm may some time in may. well where are you going to get the fabric for those? -trip to +trip to yes margaret, what do you think? -brilliant ideas +brilliant ideas and see they were asking me what i was gonna use yesterday and i said oh i don't know i said, i haven't got a clue. -something about er tapestry. +something about er tapestry. i said oh you're -no +no spending a lot of money and er don't forget i said it's not for us anyway so -it's going to take a lot of fabric both sides and the back. -full length of the back of the chairs across the seat +it's going to take a lot of fabric both sides and the back. +full length of the back of the chairs across the seat exactly. -probably be yards of material that, and you've got six chairs so and you'd have to buy it off the roll, you're not going to get a piece a length at six yards are you? -you know +probably be yards of material that, and you've got six chairs so and you'd have to buy it off the roll, you're not going to get a piece a length at six yards are you? +you know where's your cup? that's mine there, i've got mine out. oh @@ -24775,22 +24749,22 @@ in the bathroom. sun's trying to come out. well i'll be able to take them down in a minute. we'll have to take this thing to ken's. -mm mm ah look batteries. -i'm sure it's in pauline's garden because i've seen a few times. -e t mm watching that +mm mm ah look batteries. +i'm sure it's in pauline's garden because i've seen a few times. +e t mm watching that yes. don't you dare. they look like pink flowers on there don't they? -must be the leaves i think because i don't think it flowers this shrub here. +must be the leaves i think because i don't think it flowers this shrub here. it's the leaves. mm. -that dogwood i moved i'm hoping it's gonna be alright cos it doesn't s show much sign of life at the moment. +that dogwood i moved i'm hoping it's gonna be alright cos it doesn't s show much sign of life at the moment. oh i put it down the other end. oh. i wonder did ann stop smoking yesterday? mm. likes her fags doesn't she? -well think, didn't she give up last year?she said something about it last year on radio, on no smoking day. +well think, didn't she give up last year?she said something about it last year on radio, on no smoking day. alright muff? must be torture for some people. terrible. @@ -24798,12 +24772,12 @@ wonder how many cigars ken's consuming every day now? well i think it's only about four. it's a lot though isn't it? should be -about four a week four a day mm +about four a week four a day mm oh god, there's snow. -mm well we haven't seen any this year have we really? +mm well we haven't seen any this year have we really? too late now. -yeah too late to be serious -i was wrapped up to the eyes when i went u down to put my walking boots on as well because they're comfortable and there were people going going round in their shellsuits and you know i must be feeling the cold more now . +yeah too late to be serious +i was wrapped up to the eyes when i went u down to put my walking boots on as well because they're comfortable and there were people going going round in their shellsuits and you know i must be feeling the cold more now . i don't think i'd have been warm enough in a shellsuit. now what about eating up your meat? come on. @@ -24812,7 +24786,7 @@ do you wanna go for walkies? mm? do you wanna go for walkies? you do? -walkies okay. +walkies okay. now it's on, the light comes on doesn't it when it's on? ooh! so i've left that form there for you to erm @@ -24821,129 +24795,129 @@ oh do, do you want these bin bags? yes, gonna take those to get us some water. oh while it's going, what? -this morning really but what can you do? +this morning really but what can you do? isn't there any at all? no. oh. how is it? it's not bad, it's she can get on for an hour -i mean they are at the moment and if i have a meeting well after about an hour it seems as though you've +i mean they are at the moment and if i have a meeting well after about an hour it seems as though you've working -oh dear god those chrysanthemums done well. -they have, yes they're er they're good value those a pot, i mean but they're reasonably when did you get it? +oh dear god those chrysanthemums done well. +they have, yes they're er they're good value those a pot, i mean but they're reasonably when did you get it? it must be about three weeks ago. can't think what it was for now. i think it was one of those impromptu ones. -i know it wasn't my birthday you just came in with it didn't you ? -it's birthday. +i know it wasn't my birthday you just came in with it didn't you ? +it's birthday. i mean the only trouble is they're no use afterwards are they? -must have had a brainstorm +must have had a brainstorm i said they're no use afterwards are they? -i don't i don't know. +i don't i don't know. because they're forced i reckon. oh. -i think they'll grow if you put them in the garden eventually. +i think they'll grow if you put them in the garden eventually. well well i mean they won't flower again, that's for certain you see and it's it's gotta be -no, well not this year anyway, they they could +no, well not this year anyway, they they could oh right. -have you got, oh ta look take this as well. +have you got, oh ta look take this as well. yes i'm taking it. oh. -i'm going to have a go at this today. +i'm going to have a go at this today. they've dried out a bit, been too tacky to do anything with. bye bye chaps, don't let them out. -no see you then. +no see you then. did they try and drag you up the farm yesterday? well he's, he actually was off the lead and he went straight through right to the other gate oh and you kept them off the road did you? you didn't just er -oh yes well the gate was open so +oh yes well the gate was open so and i always do -so she went into the second field +so she went into the second field i'm not going no it's a quag -carried on for a while realized in the end he had to come back -it's in a bad state hang on +carried on for a while realized in the end he had to come back +it's in a bad state hang on bye, see you later. switch that on while you're morning shirley. that's twice this week five to nine whatever's happening? -i'm going going back the other way. +i'm going going back the other way. i don't know i mean ten o'clock yeah that's normal for you. -it's not, half nine is my +it's not, half nine is my no i know you . alright terry, how you doing lad? -oh looking at his mummy with eyes a shiny blue that bloody car of mine, hear the trouble i had? +oh looking at his mummy with eyes a shiny blue that bloody car of mine, hear the trouble i had? i was late yesterday wasn't i? yes the carburettor? -no, no i it's the m o t you see +no, no i it's the m o t you see oh -next, next week so the other front pads are worn +next, next week so the other front pads are worn yeah -discs like got four pads and i thought oh an hour put those on isn't it? -not much of a job when it came to put them on like the erm you know the pipe that pushes them out? +discs like got four pads and i thought oh an hour put those on isn't it? +not much of a job when it came to put them on like the erm you know the pipe that pushes them out? yeah, yeah you've gotta push them back haven't you? and you've usually got yeah that's right too much fluid in yeah -well it says in the book, push them back with a stick . +well it says in the book, push them back with a stick . with a what? with a stick and a piece of yeah -well if it's frozen there's no way so er i rang up mobil you see in and the fellow said oh if it's been on for s you know few years he said, take your calliper off, put it in the vice and just lever it back that's what we do +well if it's frozen there's no way so er i rang up mobil you see in and the fellow said oh if it's been on for s you know few years he said, take your calliper off, put it in the vice and just lever it back that's what we do yeah. -goes to get the flexible hose off that was ruddy frozen, you the, the union? +goes to get the flexible hose off that was ruddy frozen, you the, the union? yeah, yeah rang him up again he said oh aye well we usually change those he said, the weather gets on them. -said they're not like the old ones that go like as though they're welded +said they're not like the old ones that go like as though they're welded yeah. and you're turning the whole pipe. -he said the only, the other thing you can do is loosen it off take the calliper b and turn the calliper round. +he said the only, the other thing you can do is loosen it off take the calliper b and turn the calliper round. yeah. -it's like turning the car round to take off a bloody bolt, you know? +it's like turning the car round to take off a bloody bolt, you know? oh i thought i'll do that to save another hose. -anyway did that course he said you'll have to bleed it out +anyway did that course he said you'll have to bleed it out yeah. -did the first one right this was on er wednesday afternoon you see? -so came to do the other side, went to the same routine the nipple snapped off. -so any rate i rang this fellow i said eh he said oh he said you've got no chance mate, he said. -he said you can drill it out but he said you oh aye your the thread gets damaged and the seating +did the first one right this was on er wednesday afternoon you see? +so came to do the other side, went to the same routine the nipple snapped off. +so any rate i rang this fellow i said eh he said oh he said you've got no chance mate, he said. +he said you can drill it out but he said you oh aye your the thread gets damaged and the seating that's right, yeah. and he said if you get one leak on that your brakes yeah. you're shot. -so a new calliper how much do you think for a new calliper? +so a new calliper how much do you think for a new calliper? no idea. seventy pound plus vat from volvo's. bloody hell! so i thought there's no way, so i rang round the scrapyards. yeah. there's one at greenville he said oh twenty five pound plus vat. -that's what i did, yesterday morning went with my mate came back, stuck it on so it's cost me the, the pads were seventeen twenty, thirty pound for the what's a name and fifty quid near enough just to do the front brakes. +that's what i did, yesterday morning went with my mate came back, stuck it on so it's cost me the, the pads were seventeen twenty, thirty pound for the what's a name and fifty quid near enough just to do the front brakes. bloody hell. and that's before the m o t. -yeah yeah. +yeah yeah. the other week it cost me fifty quid to go to the, to get it tuned you know? cars, honest to god. -you want some money today don't you, just to ruddy eh? -they work out twenty five pounds an hour in garages. -oh, oh well well you don't go there do you, unless you've got bloody hell. -well our m o t guy, fair do you know and he'll say so and so wants doing, can you take it away and do it? +you want some money today don't you, just to ruddy eh? +they work out twenty five pounds an hour in garages. +oh, oh well well you don't go there do you, unless you've got bloody hell. +well our m o t guy, fair do you know and he'll say so and so wants doing, can you take it away and do it? yeah. and he doesn't charge. yeah. -these other ones, as soon as you leave do it yourself that's another twenty quid for a re-test +these other ones, as soon as you leave do it yourself that's another twenty quid for a re-test yeah. oh aye. -you do it there they only charge fifteen is it or something if they do it. +you do it there they only charge fifteen is it or something if they do it. but i mean you know as you just said then they'd wanna charge you per hour it's yeah. beyond the working man. @@ -24951,54 +24925,54 @@ now shirley, you're still messing about with this little job here. well i wanted the sander. we're just coming in a minute. isn't it? -yes i like this business of putting your what's a name on this d with this you know, the glue on. -well it was so flaky, the wood +yes i like this business of putting your what's a name on this d with this you know, the glue on. +well it was so flaky, the wood yeah. and that sort of seals but it in doesn't it? -well it seals it but it also helps to erm give you some purchase you see for +well it seals it but it also helps to erm give you some purchase you see for yes that's right, when you put the next lot in. the patch, yeah but if you had just glued that then alright bri, how's it going mate? -oh just work innit? -the gentleman there's going out with me round about quarter past eleven do you wanna come with us and call in to that place? -where oh where you going? +oh just work innit? +the gentleman there's going out with me round about quarter past eleven do you wanna come with us and call in to that place? +where oh where you going? see about the wood... oh yeah alright then, yes see if you can get any wood alright, yeah just see what he says. did you bring a sample in? no, i never thought. -no +no but i can ask him and i'll well -tell him er you know, he knows yeah +tell him er you know, he knows yeah er -see it all hinges on if he's got a bandsaw, if he if he hasn't got a bandsaw, wasting our ruddy time. +see it all hinges on if he's got a bandsaw, if he if he hasn't got a bandsaw, wasting our ruddy time. he's going out the port about quarter past eleven. yeah it won't take long will it? because i've got myriads of things to do. never mind. oh you're on about her, oh go oh aye, oh well. don't start that again, you know what i mean? -well she +well she i'm gonna get that lad some. -now if you want some more there +now if you want some more there you mean tony is it or ? is it tony? -the young fellow who or erm +the young fellow who or erm tony tony tony -oh yeah. +oh yeah. we'll see what he says anyway. yeah. -see what the guy . +see what the guy . yeah no trouble mate, yeah just sing out when you're ready boy. -victorian dressing table -oh oh that's nice. -i i did glance over yesterday er +victorian dressing table +oh oh that's nice. +i i did glance over yesterday er yeah. but er fair job i'm doing. @@ -25009,10 +24983,10 @@ paula was paula's here? instead of driving screws through the top. yeah. -screws just at the front underneath here this was in a bad state cos er this was this was up like er like that. +screws just at the front underneath here this was in a bad state cos er this was this was up like er like that. yeah. -this and this end had caved, being unsupported. -so it worth a few bob. +this and this end had caved, being unsupported. +so it worth a few bob. oh aye yes it's nice. i like the legs. what does brian think of the legs, any good? @@ -25025,10 +24999,10 @@ yeah. yes i like that. yeah you can use them again. i'd just drill a hole me and knock them in, you know? -as i say i +as i say i smart innit? yes i like that er -rather than waste all of the oak in the old days here have, have faced it +rather than waste all of the oak in the old days here have, have faced it oh yeah yeah he's put like a fillet on the front yeah yeah all the way round yeah @@ -25039,12 +25013,12 @@ rather than use solid oak. do a lovely smart job on that don't we? gluing it on, eh?messing like that today. pooof! -but er yes that would go anywhere that wouldn't it? -he gave me a before he went on holiday and he hasn't come back. -shirley gone up now. -anyway i must box on chaps. +but er yes that would go anywhere that wouldn't it? +he gave me a before he went on holiday and he hasn't come back. +shirley gone up now. +anyway i must box on chaps. must get something done bri. -moonlight becomes you it goes with your hair and it it's so romantic to know moonlight becomes you so +moonlight becomes you it goes with your hair and it it's so romantic to know moonlight becomes you so morning morning chris how are you love? i'm alright thanks, how are you? @@ -25053,11 +25027,11 @@ morning john, how you doing lad? morning. alright. you've got it cracked have you? -you're all dressed up to go dreaming don't tell me i'm wrong i'm sure i've seen that material before somewhere you know. +you're all dressed up to go dreaming don't tell me i'm wrong i'm sure i've seen that material before somewhere you know. don't i'm sure i've seen that material somewhere before. morning jo -morning jo morning margaret morning paula oh she's not speaking to me this morning paula. +morning jo morning margaret morning paula oh she's not speaking to me this morning paula. i've upset her. i know what it is paula, i haven't borrowed anything yet. hello love. @@ -25069,9 +25043,9 @@ i'm sweating, no i'm what do you think of that? ooh aye! hey, that might do for my chairs do you think? -would that, that style my dining chairs, what do you think? +would that, that style my dining chairs, what do you think? it's just quilting, that's all it is. -oh it's qu oh no it's for er it's more like curtains is it? +oh it's qu oh no it's for er it's more like curtains is it? no. oh. it's going on me chair. @@ -25092,14 +25066,14 @@ a remnant. i've got six chairs to do, where from,abercanny yeah. oh i'll see if i can get some of that. -you see you're you, you're better to go to moston because you're halfway, you're there aren't you, living in queensferry? +you see you're you, you're better to go to moston because you're halfway, you're there aren't you, living in queensferry? yes yeah. you know, go to, go to moston, it's much quicker yeah oh yeah, yeah. but you can't get just go up on the a fifty five quite often the remnants aren't very good you know paula. -oh they are got miles +oh they are got miles i know but a lot of it's rubbish isn't it? it's not all good stuff like this. what, do you think that's rubbish then? @@ -25108,10 +25082,10 @@ you pointed to him then. had a bloody row this morning already oh well i, i wanted just a small box like what you made. -wasn't satisfied with it, he goes and makes a big one as well but i don't want a big one, i don't wanna do a big one for the sale i just wanna do a small one. +wasn't satisfied with it, he goes and makes a big one as well but i don't want a big one, i don't wanna do a big one for the sale i just wanna do a small one. ah well he's always wanted a big one. yes -and er and a stool with a seat to match, that's all i wanted. +and er and a stool with a seat to match, that's all i wanted. mm. that's typical never satisfied with what i do. @@ -25122,16 +25096,16 @@ what a mistake you made. right what are we doing john? chairs we're doing today. there's six of those to do, now then. -yeah put them in the sale, you know i'm gonna put them in the sale see if we can get a few bob right, pattern first i should imagine. +yeah put them in the sale, you know i'm gonna put them in the sale see if we can get a few bob right, pattern first i should imagine. many people coming to the sales. i won't let you i've only put, i've put stuff in. yeah. you know but i er never actually -i, i i made about sixty quid last year, you know? -oh yes i believe it gets er quite a lot, it's er well yesterday there weren't many for that open day. -but for the sale er it's well advertised you know and er there's a lot of people seem to know about it, you know connected with the college mainly i suppose, they get their mates to come ooh there's good stuff and there is some good stuff, you know? +i, i i made about sixty quid last year, you know? +oh yes i believe it gets er quite a lot, it's er well yesterday there weren't many for that open day. +but for the sale er it's well advertised you know and er there's a lot of people seem to know about it, you know connected with the college mainly i suppose, they get their mates to come ooh there's good stuff and there is some good stuff, you know? yeah. so it's er it seems to do pretty well. i'll er i'll try to get a few things, make a few bob you know, to @@ -25144,20 +25118,20 @@ well christ you've gotta be, i've paid that to be honest yeah i've paid seventy for the bloody things. yeah. -erm i dunno -oh they're nice chairs -hundred and thirty maybe i'm not, i'm not quite sure to be honest er not quite sure old mate. -yeah i'll see what they say, you know, erm i'll john, he had a set of erm high backed reproduction erm what do they call them now? -regency nineteen twenties,in the twenties +erm i dunno +oh they're nice chairs +hundred and thirty maybe i'm not, i'm not quite sure to be honest er not quite sure old mate. +yeah i'll see what they say, you know, erm i'll john, he had a set of erm high backed reproduction erm what do they call them now? +regency nineteen twenties,in the twenties yeah out of mahogany. they are nice though, they've got the queen anne legs and the high back you know? yeah. he got about er two hundred for those last year, set of six. -you know he just bought them from sale or whatever it was, sixty, seventy quid bit of polish. -they were not mistaken. +you know he just bought them from sale or whatever it was, sixty, seventy quid bit of polish. +they were not mistaken. did, he did well. -some of them have a lot of stuff, you know i don't seem to ever get hold of the stuff me, to tables and that little eric in there he seems to get loads of stuff +some of them have a lot of stuff, you know i don't seem to ever get hold of the stuff me, to tables and that little eric in there he seems to get loads of stuff yeah i can't he's got a lovely table there hasn't he?it's a nice one. he's got a lot of connections eric, you know and @@ -25166,98 +25140,98 @@ there you go. thank you. and i think that's why we've got such a good dentist. mm -and he erm he was very upset about it. -then he by that time this expensive and that's the one that's . -so he said start again. +and he erm he was very upset about it. +then he by that time this expensive and that's the one that's . +so he said start again. you're still paying out that's the trouble, all the time. well that's it. but on the other hand, what can you do about it? -you can't +you can't no, no it's oh no you can't go round gummy. -we're going to, we've, we've got this going down to for three weeks, you know next weekend or the weekend afterwards, and we don't keep getting appointments, see i'm gonna keep ringing him up and pestering him and saying +we're going to, we've, we've got this going down to for three weeks, you know next weekend or the weekend afterwards, and we don't keep getting appointments, see i'm gonna keep ringing him up and pestering him and saying mm have you got a cancellation? it's life isn't ray? oh yeah. i mean i mean what -friend of ours, he, he hit his tooth, got a lovely tooth ken he's sixty one now, never had much trouble you know -snapped this one off er you know in an ac he fell over or whatever, on his +friend of ours, he, he hit his tooth, got a lovely tooth ken he's sixty one now, never had much trouble you know +snapped this one off er you know in an ac he fell over or whatever, on his yeah, that's right. -said oh god he didn't know whether to pull it out there and then -but it's very hard -but went to the dentist and he said leave it pushed it right back and he said it will grow back. +said oh god he didn't know whether to pull it out there and then +but it's very hard +but went to the dentist and he said leave it pushed it right back and he said it will grow back. did it? oh yes. ah it must long as the roots are oh well yes, oh well yeah, oh well now obviously -so er -i mean my boy had a er a terrible accident ten years ago and smashed all his face all his teeth were when we first saw his face he'd got no teeth left but it's got them all back. -and they're all back and yeah even though they were all, they were all loose i mean still fresh you see the, the break. +so er +i mean my boy had a er a terrible accident ten years ago and smashed all his face all his teeth were when we first saw his face he'd got no teeth left but it's got them all back. +and they're all back and yeah even though they were all, they were all loose i mean still fresh you see the, the break. and it's, the life is in the, still in the tooth if you can find it, but of course sometimes they've gone haven't they? -too late for us +too late for us put up with what we've got eh? what? put up with what we've got. -well as i say i look after mine but i've only got the one missing. -mm i'd hate to have a load of chop ooh -was scared only children he was scared wasn't he? +well as i say i look after mine but i've only got the one missing. +mm i'd hate to have a load of chop ooh +was scared only children he was scared wasn't he? tony was frightened. -oh yes that's stupid that, he he'll end up if he doesn't go, with a mou a mouth of sort of black +oh yes that's stupid that, he he'll end up if he doesn't go, with a mou a mouth of sort of black he, he'll have them all out. yes. -if he we used to the children +if he we used to the children i think that's awful if young people -even our grandchildren were, i mean er right from the beginning even if they only go and sit in the surgery and just watch,ju you know just go and visit +even our grandchildren were, i mean er right from the beginning even if they only go and sit in the surgery and just watch,ju you know just go and visit yeah that's, that's what they do now yeah. -get them trained, get them +get them trained, get them yes, yeah so they're not terrified. -that's right, i mean there's no pain +that's right, i mean there's no pain i think they were frightening years ago when they, when we were kids so they're frightening places. -well we had no, we had no erm nothing to stop the pain. +well we had no, we had no erm nothing to stop the pain. no. we had no injections, we were just put in a chair and, and it cost that's right -two guineas for every filling +two guineas for every filling i know, it's a lot of money. i mean yeah, week's wages yeah. but we, he didn't get more than two or three guineas a week did he when we were first that's right, yeah yes -then we get, i know our dentist was very good, we've always said that if we had a good dentist and a good doctors we're on our holidays, and we have, we've been lucky wherever we've been +then we get, i know our dentist was very good, we've always said that if we had a good dentist and a good doctors we're on our holidays, and we have, we've been lucky wherever we've been mm. mm. we've had good dentists, good doctors. oh it pays you to get a sympathetic one and one that's er not on the but this one is lovely. -this one's young and he's so gentle, you know he +this one's young and he's so gentle, you know he yes. oh they're marvellous. i think that's what tony's harking back to, the old style when you went and they were a bit er callous. yes indeed well,young, how old is he? -twenty five? +twenty five? he's only in his twenties, yeah he ought not, no it wouldn't be would it? no. twenty years ago they were, they were alright weren't they? what am i thinking about? no i'm thinking about -well you know the first time i went was oh i dunno, before the war you know when i was about four or five and i went to get one out i mean my parents +well you know the first time i went was oh i dunno, before the war you know when i was about four or five and i went to get one out i mean my parents but it was terrible i was screaming, i was terrified and, and, and i can still see the place you know, there's something very foreboding about the, the place and the chair was like a and everything was hard wasn't it? -and they wouldn't mess about if you, you they slapped you if you didn't do as you were told. +and they wouldn't mess about if you, you they slapped you if you didn't do as you were told. so that put me right off for a start. -but erm you only get one good set don't you? +but erm you only get one good set don't you? that's right. -i -and also you see right from, right from pregnancy +i +and also you see right from, right from pregnancy well they get it free don't they? at the moment. yeah. -i mean er it's before they're conceived that you've got to try to +i mean er it's before they're conceived that you've got to try to oh yes, yes. -i mean it's no good smoking yourself to death and then er +i mean it's no good smoking yourself to death and then er that's right. falling for a baby and then saying no no @@ -25267,30 +25241,30 @@ it didn't used to but when i, i, i, i feel like going up to these girls and sayi that's right. when they're pregnant or they've got a little baby. it's horrible. -i mean +i mean but you know you can't tell people. -this friend of ours who lost his wife last year, well we've got another friend who was very fond of her she also smokes we just happened to me we didn't say +this friend of ours who lost his wife last year, well we've got another friend who was very fond of her she also smokes we just happened to me we didn't say no. i mean it's happened now so we never absolutely. no you can't. -say to th this chap you know but we just happened to mention in passing to jeanette and she really jumped and said oh pat didn't smoke a lot. +say to th this chap you know but we just happened to mention in passing to jeanette and she really jumped and said oh pat didn't smoke a lot. but was it very sudden? -we know via my daughter she's a nurse and she said no cancer get a lot of uterine cancer and all this it's not, not in the lungs now. +we know via my daughter she's a nurse and she said no cancer get a lot of uterine cancer and all this it's not, not in the lungs now. forget that. that's obvious. but all the other things that's right. it goes to. -but you can't tell these people. +but you can't tell these people. they won't listen. -this lady we're on about now she's she must be on forty, fifty a day. +this lady we're on about now she's she must be on forty, fifty a day. a nervous smoker. see how does she afford it? well that's right, they're both of them at it. god knows. -pin this to the chair +pin this to the chair oh god help well get brian to do that, he loves it. morning bruce, how you doing lad? you busy? @@ -25300,44 +25274,44 @@ what have they got you on this morning? oh and, and a door there to keep you people nice and warm. oh, now? -the summer's coming on now. +the summer's coming on now. we do things back to front yes -we had three lots of different blues and that's the only one i really like +we had three lots of different blues and that's the only one i really like poor old john's puzzled is he, all the time? no he doesn't mind actually, he's very good. -no oh we go a l and it looks nice. +no oh we go a l and it looks nice. he likes a change. you see that the, the, it's so dark in here anyway ray because mm the wall as you know backs yes on to the pub so i haven't got any window at the back. -it's all at the front, yes yes, yes +it's all at the front, yes yes, yes i've only got the window at the front, so the dining area is quite dark dark, yes yes. -so but i wanted something bright in there you know. +so but i wanted something bright in there you know. mm. -but it was only a temporary in there,like the floor and everything just a, a brown carpet because of honey +but it was only a temporary in there,like the floor and everything just a, a brown carpet because of honey oh yes with her season but now right she doesn't have it now yeah -i shall get a nice carpet in there now you know? +i shall get a nice carpet in there now you know? it'll be right one day. joan i think i'd better box on with the webbing here love, i haven't got enough sorry? i'll bo i'd better box on with the webbing on the back. -haven't got me glue anyway so +haven't got me glue anyway so a box? -no, box a coventry expression, get on +no, box a coventry expression, get on oh. get on with me webbing on the back. what you were talking about i'll box on box on. -so i want two down is it and three across? +so i want two down is it and three across? something like that. two down and three a er there's some there sound like a crossword. @@ -25347,21 +25321,21 @@ no i've got webbing here. i've got, no oh, well what are you asking me for? oh ho how many to do. -i'm just saying i'll have i'll have to leave me foam to next week and get some glue so er +i'm just saying i'll have i'll have to leave me foam to next week and get some glue so er well there's some glue in the jar to stick some -but i can't see any there -er the spray try the +but i can't see any there +er the spray try the oh is that glue is it? yeah it is. oh is this the latest? give it a good shake though oh er oh i see, okay, give that a go. -that's the latest that's the latest we'll take manhattan now then, couple it's quiet in here today john isn't it? +that's the latest that's the latest we'll take manhattan now then, couple it's quiet in here today john isn't it? there's not many folks about, what? -oh smashing -th that's where the erm the back +oh smashing +th that's where the erm the back goes in too far. oh of course. see so i, in fact i was wondering whether to just @@ -25373,40 +25347,40 @@ yes. but it is round the back i know yeah, never be seen will it? i can't say -three brass things, no it shouldn't be seen really, so i don't know whether i'm drawing attention to it by putting brass things +three brass things, no it shouldn't be seen really, so i don't know whether i'm drawing attention to it by putting brass things yes that's the thing, of course. i s -cos it's got a handle on it now at the front here round the other side +cos it's got a handle on it now at the front here round the other side yes i'm gonna do mine something like this i think. -have you er it is sprung is it? +have you er it is sprung is it? pardon? sprung? yes. -ooh +ooh did it, they dear god. bloody he it didn't actually have a handle on it. -just put one on it +just put one on it yeah -yeah well you could have a bit of material couldn't you? +yeah well you could have a bit of material couldn't you? yeah. looks a bit rough. -yeah bloody hell! +yeah bloody hell! this webbing now is that alright love? yes. -now you've, your material didn't go the other way on that these chairs did they, before you +now you've, your material didn't go the other way on that these chairs did they, before you no put the webbing on? -yes +yes it just goes on to the edge here. oh yes. i going to hide the back, all that webbing? -oh no oh no wait a minute, no -yeah, you realize do you it's what it, what's wrong. +oh no oh no wait a minute, no +yeah, you realize do you it's what it, what's wrong. the, the fro the top cover should have gone on first should it? -material gone on first. +material gone on first. oh yes procedure for any tackle, if you haven't got any the cover must go that way. oh i, i'd never, i i realize now from six weeks ago when i got the damn things @@ -25425,14 +25399,14 @@ you can use them on something else. yeah well that's no problem. what i'll do, i'll measure up today for er yeah -the top material work out a plan for how much i'll want. +the top material work out a plan for how much i'll want. how much you need. -i'll try and get through the neutrally. +i'll try and get through the neutrally. i dunno yeah, how many have, have you got? six. six? -cos i might be putting a table in the sale on its own but it's a it's dark +cos i might be putting a table in the sale on its own but it's a it's dark oh i it's darker than that. oh. @@ -25442,7 +25416,7 @@ oh, oh, oh. that's no good. whether, you know, people might have bought them as a set otherwise. yeah, yeah that's what it wants, someone with big turned legs -w yeah, some, some yeah +w yeah, some, some yeah on the table. you see them don't you? oh well @@ -25455,13 +25429,13 @@ two? no it's four. oh four, oh it's a set is it? nice. -is it keeping these are you or ? +is it keeping these are you or ? for now. i'm really yeah after a set of six. ah, oh well yeah er -but rea what i really want, is a set of six barley twist. +but rea what i really want, is a set of six barley twist. i mean it's gonna take me ages trying to find them anyway. but i've got a barley twist table. ah you see them yeah, yeah table and you want them to match in @@ -25471,14 +25445,14 @@ but these will do, four of these will do temporary anyway yeah, nice. but i want a set of six in the end. i mean how often do you use six? -well we do, there's five of us in the family see +well we do, there's five of us in the family see oh i see yeah so -we had four kids i mean now it's only when we get visitors you know when +we had four kids i mean now it's only when we get visitors you know when yeah. there's only two of us, you get two visitors we're alright as a four saying that we don't -we keep ours in the garage, the extra two carvers +we keep ours in the garage, the extra two carvers oh yes. and they come down when you know, if we've got any when you need them. @@ -25487,15 +25461,15 @@ otherwise it's just a waste really. well that's probably what i'm gonna have to do. you can get, you can get sets of four can't you? oh yes -but six hard to get. +but six hard to get. i'll just try and get two carvers to match yeah, that's, that's the answer really and er if they're not quite the same you can get away with two carvers can't you? -but er oh well yeah this is what got me, i like the er the legs you know, the the backs i, i didn't like at all because you've got this blue +but er oh well yeah this is what got me, i like the er the legs you know, the the backs i, i didn't like at all because you've got this blue well -you've got no no m no wood that's showing you see, that's the trouble. +you've got no no m no wood that's showing you see, that's the trouble. yes, yes. yeah -erm but i'm hoping they'll put them on a, on the table when we sell them in here and there's that's the first thing that'll hit them is the turned legs you see? +erm but i'm hoping they'll put them on a, on the table when we sell them in here and there's that's the first thing that'll hit them is the turned legs you see? nice. this is a su survey. finished at one point but it's veneered @@ -25514,13 +25488,13 @@ but also people had put nails in the veneer and bits had fallen off and ruined it, yeah. there wasn't any point in me trying felt like a bit of challenge there. -well you know me nothing -if there's any woodworking going +well you know me nothing +if there's any woodworking going is this today is it? yes. too late now. -yes, but you went last week so i didn't but they'd got stuff for you -oh i i thought i had loads of +yes, but you went last week so i didn't but they'd got stuff for you +oh i i thought i had loads of oh ray! never mind my fault sorry i didn't ask because i knew @@ -25529,7 +25503,7 @@ no, no they'd got something for you actually er last friday didn't they? -this erm +this erm yes. yeah, he got me some springs yes well that's why i didn't ask because i assumed @@ -25538,21 +25512,21 @@ you'd ordered everything no sorry. i only need a bit. -i can get some from er chester perhaps, for what i want you know? -so er how often does this do they go to then, how often is this order? +i can get some from er chester perhaps, for what i want you know? +so er how often does this do they go to then, how often is this order? is it -er this is just one that i wanted some stuff and i said to a few people +er this is just one that i wanted some stuff and i said to a few people oh you went round? i see, yeah. and they're delivering it. -i've actually the last time i got some delivered for me was february so i tend to sort of get something about once a month i think. +i've actually the last time i got some delivered for me was february so i tend to sort of get something about once a month i think. mm -it really depends what i'm doing, if i'm doing a lot of stuff, then i don't need +it really depends what i'm doing, if i'm doing a lot of stuff, then i don't need yeah to go because i've got all the hair loads yeah -but at the moment i seem to have done a lot of stuff with foam so -i tend to forget, me, honest to god i think i've plenty and then you come to the you say oh god you know it's never mind. +but at the moment i seem to have done a lot of stuff with foam so +i tend to forget, me, honest to god i think i've plenty and then you come to the you say oh god you know it's never mind. well next time i'll remember you. next time if you'd ask me, and i still won't know. half past twelve! @@ -25562,7 +25536,7 @@ i'll, i'll go, this fellow's moving now so i'll go in there. so you've got a big garden have you arth? oh, no oh. -got a decent size back garden. +got a decent size back garden. mine is, yes yes, yeah. it's er birkenhead you live is it? i live in @@ -25577,19 +25551,19 @@ what part? manfield. oh that was the, the rough part. oh aye yeah, well i am rough aren't i? -highton highton i came a nice part. +highton highton i came a nice part. rough are they. -never used to fight with lads. +never used to fight with lads. they're a tough crowd. -oh yeah watch the showers. +oh yeah watch the showers. yeah nasty aren't they? actually now isn't it? -oh it has come lovely now, with the old sun but there's more to come i think. +oh it has come lovely now, with the old sun but there's more to come i think. er where do you live chris, you say cristleton is it? no no i'm not oh it wouldn't be cristleton far away. -no erm really +no erm really oh you're not a on the chester high road. oh yes @@ -25601,26 +25575,26 @@ gardens we used to go there yeah. oh that's nice, yeah. specially in the spring time when the azaleas are out and that. -yes yeah. -yes oh gardens is fabulous, yeah. +yes yeah. +yes oh gardens is fabulous, yeah. mm. but now you've gotta pay you have yeah -so much to go in -well we we used to join as a, you know, you could become a friend of gardens +so much to go in +well we we used to join as a, you know, you could become a friend of gardens that's right, yeah and it was quite reasonable. -now it's really gone a bit bit over the top i think. +now it's really gone a bit bit over the top i think. mm pay so much a year. so erm yes. -oh i used to pay a year from when you from when you first started paying but +oh i used to pay a year from when you from when you first started paying but mm i've missed the one in january now and i think, oh , i've paid for a year but it's a lot of money. -it's only odd days, it's it's perhaps lovely there in the winter when it's snowing and things +it's only odd days, it's it's perhaps lovely there in the winter when it's snowing and things i know it's absolutely gorgeous. -first seats will obviously in action have you seen the papers? +first seats will obviously in action have you seen the papers? no no, the lady came to the house. well the lady came here just knocked on the door? @@ -25632,23 +25606,23 @@ well just read, just read what it says there. well i mean sh , what she said to me you could probably save me reading wouldn't it? -yeah the doing er, say four, in this area but i there were three. +yeah the doing er, say four, in this area but i there were three. some down in the midlands. i think that's the same isn't it ? and we selected all intelligent looking ones. -yeah but +yeah but bar one! showed him. so they made a mistake filling it in? anyway, she -so we've still got the +so we've still got the anyway he said so he couldn't do it! well i'd only just brought it in the kitchen actually. oh, i thought i'd give you a chance to put on your i don't care! your posh accent. ray, had it . -wasn't just for me i'd like to know him. +wasn't just for me i'd like to know him. you can,. careful! totally, all the complications @@ -25656,18 +25630,18 @@ and of course, they've been absolutely abnormal. you still going on? okay, it's on. no, not really . -wherever a description of youth. -well where have you been today? +wherever a description of youth. +well where have you been today? what is it? what have you been doing? oh is it going? it's good! anyway, listen! mm. -do you want do you want any help to do these posts that's what your down as today? -i think there's want it on don't you? +do you want do you want any help to do these posts that's what your down as today? +i think there's want it on don't you? i just switched that on now yes. -so er so you had a good time? +so er so you had a good time? what about oh yeah. full life? @@ -25676,19 +25650,19 @@ he came home at the home didn't you? he had to come home! oh! well i've sa , is it secret? -he went paul . +he went paul . oh the other day? mm. well monday, wednesday and friday. for those who were staying there i mean. -did you have any yeah, obviously +did you have any yeah, obviously oh well that's lucky i was gonna say did you have any no, no. paperwork to do at night. we had some homework to do yeah she did a little bit, yeah. -so is there a, a bar there and all this caper? -oh yeah yep. +so is there a, a bar there and all this caper? +oh yeah yep. subsidised? no. no? @@ -25706,58 +25680,58 @@ but seriously they want ten times whatever ! and the bricks! ya. where else can you say -and we had -it's not the brick +and we had +it's not the brick not that old chestnut! of course. -so er got the pads seventeen quid weren't they? -no, seventeen pence you could do it yourself! +so er got the pads seventeen quid weren't they? +no, seventeen pence you could do it yourself! what do you mean? -yes, well when i hear do the job couldn't you +yes, well when i hear do the job couldn't you how much? seventeen seventeen yeah. you're kidding! -should of gone to -to do they did mine for fifteen quid! -brake shoes and that dixons as well! -oh no, tell a lie twenty five quid it was. -well this +should of gone to +to do they did mine for fifteen quid! +brake shoes and that dixons as well! +oh no, tell a lie twenty five quid it was. +well this fitted! car. -oh emma's isn't fitted +oh emma's isn't fitted this is the volvo though isn't it? expensive on the volvos. -the price is usually cheaper than -well renault first. +the price is usually cheaper than +well renault first. yeah. oh was that for the renault in? and the yeah. tried to give -which you've gotta do the cos they +which you've gotta do the cos they not bad! so much fluid in the grill. and all the rest! they tied the car so they could get in the vice. -the volvo . +the volvo . it's alright to use. -sally said we had to anyway, i did one side didn't i? +sally said we had to anyway, i did one side didn't i? yeah. carefully! -open the ahhh! +open the ahhh! then go do the other side haven't got much of a bump! and the er there's nothing there ! no. -you looked bigger at +you looked bigger at honest, and stuff like that seems to going longer doesn't it? yeah. -that isn't due for an hour there so january +that isn't due for an hour there so january it snapped off! so what do you do? there's the calibre with the, with the gone! @@ -25767,25 +25741,25 @@ i end up going to greenfield get down! twenty five pound for a second hand one plus ooh jesus! -seventy pound in the volvo. +seventy pound in the volvo. i thought you were gonna say you've broke the engine mounting on the machine what can we do ? -and then you had to go and let it get a new engine! +and then you had to go and let it get a new engine! this is bad enough! all because of a brake that was don't joke about things like that paul, please! -but you know he'd got a huge parlour there was nothing wrong within this one thing and you know, we tried to drill it out you know +but you know he'd got a huge parlour there was nothing wrong within this one thing and you know, we tried to drill it out you know what? mm. ha ! you'll knock it off! -the seating +the seating go on off, off, off! we went down to the oh oh oh! -buy a bowl of stuff +buy a bowl of stuff oh! -he said here are and tapping him over the nose +he said here are and tapping him over the nose he puts his head sort of, down oh! the end of his neck doesn't he? @@ -25796,50 +25770,50 @@ oh yes you've just gotta be mhm. ! -if it's if it seems solid -then you you got no +if it's if it seems solid +then you you got no stay away from the ! pipes. the actual hose is about that long. -it looked as though he it was all in one +it looked as though he it was all in one keep him quiet. and then i spoke to the feller, said aye! is that the union? -it's supposed -it's something there in a magazine the other week there. -found something wrong with his +it's supposed +it's something there in a magazine the other week there. +found something wrong with his what animals do, like and what it means. -he said they just do. -and they were saying that when they lick each others -yeah what does that +he said they just do. +and they were saying that when they lick each others +yeah what does that you know? apparently -it's the the one who's doing the -licking is looking at the +it's the the one who's doing the +licking is looking at the but they tell you yeah. whatever they do it means -is the turn -i thought now erm sort of +is the turn +i thought now erm sort of so i did that both sides so that like he's sort of saying that he's the boss! li like the leader of the . yeah. -could be alternatively older ones or something like that. -well -well i'll tell you what ah, you'll never be er -ja just rubbing and giving him +could be alternatively older ones or something like that. +well +well i'll tell you what ah, you'll never be er +ja just rubbing and giving him oh, he could of er -he started on my renault +he started on my renault subjugated! and it's been running well since i just they'd have to. -keep your fingers crossed and not -oh i don't know i had a subjugated about that. +keep your fingers crossed and not +oh i don't know i had a subjugated about that. they do . so -fair does like rather than +fair does like rather than mm,tha , that's why i didn't say like paying out for a feet aren't they sometimes ? @@ -25847,23 +25821,23 @@ and the brake pads had gone yeah. yeah. oh yes, you've gotta replace them -they're sort of saying that you are really testing your +they're sort of saying that you are really testing your i mean, i replace mine to see that but but the brakes mm. -but they don't your -but the brakes literally bleed them +but they don't your +but the brakes literally bleed them i mean your cat. no i did that before yeah. -to do it's not very dangerous. +to do it's not very dangerous. i hope so. you wonder what that is -same as you have in the +same as you have in the a delightful thing to be i i think you was doing the same to cathy weren't you? -and, everyone goes cathy can the meeting. -well at the what's er +and, everyone goes cathy can the meeting. +well at the what's er what? just walking back ! that i think will be @@ -25873,27 +25847,27 @@ with the greenhouse . what's this, the boy's brigade? yes it is. my god almighty! -here comes the boys. +here comes the boys. where are you from, from mould cygerly cygerly oh, aye! -live in hope die in cygerly , ay? -well well i've got them all wedged in now. +live in hope die in cygerly , ay? +well well i've got them all wedged in now. oh no! bu -there we go right. -thank you +there we go right. +thank you okay! thank you! bye! and -went to the hospital with a lady down the road +went to the hospital with a lady down the road yeah. -and val was on the, got to be home from where you know? +and val was on the, got to be home from where you know? oh yes yes. yes. -i did phone her a few weeks ago and she said, ooh i'll have to see you on friday in mould you know get a +i did phone her a few weeks ago and she said, ooh i'll have to see you on friday in mould you know get a yeah. a bit of a coffee but er oh well, we were coming home on the bu , rest bus together. @@ -25902,23 +25876,23 @@ well she's fine yeah. yeah. well. still working? -she normally get's a in +she normally get's a in oh in wrexham. -is she still working at +is she still working at she didn't or -no on the ? +no on the ? did she yeah. did she work in prescott -i, i thought she'd no, she went +i, i thought she'd no, she went she's to she went to lesher didn't no, she told me she went she? no, she told me she was in another place, i've never heard of it,. -i'm sure somebody told me that she was working with the trainee at er +i'm sure somebody told me that she was working with the trainee at er oh, well she told me she was working, but i'd never heard of, some sewing place, it must be in wrexham. oh did she? but she said they'd laid her off. @@ -25928,38 +25902,38 @@ but at moment she isn't working but she said in between. for them to ring her back. oh! -so she said they've rang her back cos you know i think she's going there again. +so she said they've rang her back cos you know i think she's going there again. but i don't mm. bretfords sh , well she said, i'm sure she didn't say bretfords -no, i i think it was somebody i was talking to from bretford who said that she'd gone she was looking after the +no, i i think it was somebody i was talking to from bretford who said that she'd gone she was looking after the oh maybe, yeah. trainees in leighbridge do you remember when they had them that's right yeah. for so many months i think didn't they? that's right. -and then cos i said, ooh are, are they going to open up again? +and then cos i said, ooh are, are they going to open up again? yeah. -but er but it hasn't has it? +but er but it hasn't has it? it wasn't anything no. and nobody's taken the place over have they? -no it's just bought, well they've got planks across it now, save the cars turning round in there. +no it's just bought, well they've got planks across it now, save the cars turning round in there. oh, boarded up the street? well, you know the, the access roads, yeah. -down street people going and parking up there. +down street people going and parking up there. do , oh! what a shame! i mean -and it's at the end it's -the whole village relied on that +and it's at the end it's +the whole village relied on that got a sale board didn't they for yeah. work? i wonder what for sale or rent. -it's awful for the people that's at the wrong age, and too early to retire really it's +it's awful for the people that's at the wrong age, and too early to retire really it's yeah yeah you know early fifties and too old to get another job! @@ -25971,35 +25945,35 @@ ohhhh dear dear! oh ! is that another story is it ? you want empty road you see when you're trying -one lady said to me take everyone else +one lady said to me take everyone else . off the road and i'll be happy! isn't he terrible! oh! i'm er is he -i, yeah i go well i've started going again now er aren't very good! -he said to me should add erm you know like being +i, yeah i go well i've started going again now er aren't very good! +he said to me should add erm you know like being bit like is what he said. oh. -and he said you'll be able to go round the roundabout then i the flaming things! +and he said you'll be able to go round the roundabout then i the flaming things! so he said you couldn't have done! -so i sa have, so i told him what he said, and he said well that's exactly what it says in the book! +so i sa have, so i told him what he said, and he said well that's exactly what it says in the book! i said yes, well why don't you do it? i said because in the bloody book there's no cars on the roundabout and i says it ! i said you bring me three o'clock -you really +you really in the morning i'll go round the roundabout for you when it's empty! -mm, that's it innit? -i said but when i come here there are cars everywhere, i says on on the picture +mm, that's it innit? +i said but when i come here there are cars everywhere, i says on on the picture there isn't a car in sight! -he sat there and burst out laughing but he said yeah you're right,there isn't ! +he sat there and burst out laughing but he said yeah you're right,there isn't ! did you tend to come on -no well well i've started again now. +no well well i've started again now. yeah. i think it must have been the -what's that programme that was on the other day about the erm ohhh! +what's that programme that was on the other day about the erm ohhh! where was it? no ga , was it ghana? about the trees? @@ -26007,9 +25981,9 @@ about the, yes, this yes. exposee about the ghana. -er well that was corruption from the government! +er well that was corruption from the government! well i suppose most corruption starts at the top doesn't it? -it has to for it to be festering at the bottom! +it has to for it to be festering at the bottom! but erm good grief man! good lord ken! @@ -26017,17 +25991,17 @@ you've gone to town tonight seeing all this! ooh hell! no not really er -just a bit of cheese and a bit of pate. -you know it seems it awful really that two of those places were aren't they?all these, all the forest +just a bit of cheese and a bit of pate. +you know it seems it awful really that two of those places were aren't they?all these, all the forest oh god! fern and thanks er -i mean if somebody did grow a tree i mean, it must be harder in that kind of area but but wi with the right will for people to plant a tree and grow it it's just as easy +i mean if somebody did grow a tree i mean, it must be harder in that kind of area but but wi with the right will for people to plant a tree and grow it it's just as easy ahhh. as chopping it down! well, you know, i mean with up. -correct management they should be able to profit from the forests you know a as well replenish them. +correct management they should be able to profit from the forests you know a as well replenish them. and so unfortunately, it's the short term that's all they think about! ah,it's not. at the end of the day it's just greed and profit to gain @@ -26039,22 +26013,22 @@ yeah, mm. i mean they don't grow overnight do yeah. -but even so, i mean even that can be managed. +but even so, i mean even that can be managed. course it can. at the moment they just what is this ken? -that's german smoked. +that's german smoked. you don't have to light it! it's rather nice that! is it? we've tried this before when -didn't you try it at ah ah, try it. +didn't you try it at ah ah, try it. i can't remember now. no, i don't think so. i don't think we had any cheese did we? can't remember that. -ee ah trouble is you can't see where your cut is when you slice it like that it, oh here we go! -gosh they're going again with paul and cathy. +ee ah trouble is you can't see where your cut is when you slice it like that it, oh here we go! +gosh they're going again with paul and cathy. paul and cathy are going. are they? yep. @@ -26068,15 +26042,15 @@ may was it? well, i was going to say is it before ann has the baby? it's when car , yes, no ah is it going to be, it's gonna be about -er i'm not sure. -well the baby's due after may so if they're going in may +er i'm not sure. +well the baby's due after may so if they're going in may oh well it'll be a , that's it's before oh is that pate? yeah. oh that's okay. many thanks. -you can take that with you that er, if you don't use it up. +you can take that with you that er, if you don't use it up. you don't like the pate? it's no good to me! well ray likes it. @@ -26094,7 +26068,7 @@ oh he's even drooled over me look! i wish! and i was always convinced that i would better things. -i was, i was left on on the doorstep +i was, i was left on on the doorstep the wrong handbag ken, you was didn't you? for the rich. i read that story ken. @@ -26109,29 +26083,29 @@ they took the ugly one ! so, oh well! what's that cheshire one? i haven't tried that. -perhaps er i got that +perhaps er i got that crumbly, is it? i got it from, i don't know, i got it from holston's and i haven't had any from there before. i went into that roberses the delicatessen part mm. -and er they were queuing up there so i couldn't be bothered standing in the queue, so i didn't. +and er they were queuing up there so i couldn't be bothered standing in the queue, so i didn't. didn't get it from there? i didn't stay there for that. -mm, that's distinctive isn't it the smoked one! +mm, that's distinctive isn't it the smoked one! mm. very nice! -i haven't had this particular one before but we used to get a little used to be able to get it in little about +i haven't had this particular one before but we used to get a little used to be able to get it in little about yeah. -tha , that big and er no, i expect the -it's on don't, they reckon they can make cheshire anywhere now can't they? +tha , that big and er no, i expect the +it's on don't, they reckon they can make cheshire anywhere now can't they? no, it's not what it used to be. there must be somebody who can get it? get what? -cheshire cheese is not necessarily indigenous to cheshire now. -oh what,wha +cheshire cheese is not necessarily indigenous to cheshire now. +oh what,wha they make it in lots of places. you mean it's been made in devon -no +no and called cheshire cheese? well i don't know about devon, i'm not sure. no, i i do , i think it's erm @@ -26146,26 +26120,26 @@ over the over the road into whatever! whatever. in north wales. -i don't know, i would have thought that to call it cheshire cheeses it must be +i don't know, i would have thought that to call it cheshire cheeses it must be ain't got any ruddy north wales cheese or clwyd, so what ? perhaps in the mm. -used,ya , you used to be able to get it and it would crumble it was rea , you know real +used,ya , you used to be able to get it and it would crumble it was rea , you know real oh yeah that was distinctive part of it. that cor it was er not like that now. no. -i always remember going to, somewhere with ken this girl gave us a lump of cheese, it must of been cheshire. -ooh i i loved that! -they got this bloody knife and cut half the bloody cheese, i thought i mean, i'm not a polite person when it comes to food am i? +i always remember going to, somewhere with ken this girl gave us a lump of cheese, it must of been cheshire. +ooh i i loved that! +they got this bloody knife and cut half the bloody cheese, i thought i mean, i'm not a polite person when it comes to food am i? must of had about two ounces on the bloody plate! -haven't got the thing on now have you, while you feeding yourself +haven't got the thing on now have you, while you feeding yourself no. up? munching ! he's one of the little munchkins! and then, when he was eating the -putting the marmalade on his toast in the hotel the knife +putting the marmalade on his toast in the hotel the knife and licked the knife! ooh, oh! you scallywag! @@ -26175,81 +26149,81 @@ oh christ ! yeah! yes you are! it's just how he was brought up i suppose an -i remember reading this book it was partly, it was about the german navy +i remember reading this book it was partly, it was about the german navy mm? -and er sh , you know the test before they could become officers they set captain set the table, you see the and they have this food that they know how, how to use the cutlery, this was one of the tests of being an officer. +and er sh , you know the test before they could become officers they set captain set the table, you see the and they have this food that they know how, how to use the cutlery, this was one of the tests of being an officer. oh yeah! mm. -you know, to er they didn't know how to use the cutlery, and, they were, they we , yeah +you know, to er they didn't know how to use the cutlery, and, they were, they we , yeah which piece to use for which course. -they weren't, they weren't gentlemen so they couldn't be er they couldn't be officers. +they weren't, they weren't gentlemen so they couldn't be er they couldn't be officers. mm. oh there's a lot of that well done wasn't there? it's called the class structure. yeah. or system. -well, ironically his creed was supposed to be without that wasn't it hitler? -you know, this supreme race but all more or less equal. +well, ironically his creed was supposed to be without that wasn't it hitler? +you know, this supreme race but all more or less equal. well no, that wasn't the case! -he wanted to create a supreme race didn't he? -no, but the er the germans they were the supreme body weren't they? -he's he's and er he wanted to create a super race. +he wanted to create a supreme race didn't he? +no, but the er the germans they were the supreme body weren't they? +he's he's and er he wanted to create a super race. but the army was run on the old style wasn't it? of course. -you know, they were the they were the er the masters of the army. +you know, they were the they were the er the masters of the army. oh well, this was the main course ray! and then of course the air force, they'd be one up again i suppose. -ah well then maybe +ah well then maybe you mean the luftwaffe? mm. mm mm. -the . +the . well this is luftwaffe. betty. mm. -unfortunately there seems to be a resurgence of of this now doesn't there in europe? +unfortunately there seems to be a resurgence of of this now doesn't there in europe? yes. this right wing element which is terrible! -it's frightening really because you think well you know, i mean you said the years well that couldn't happen +it's frightening really because you think well you know, i mean you said the years well that couldn't happen well -again but but how long does it take before it does happen again? -i mean, do the other do these things happen in cycles and tha you know, is it possible that it'll happen again on a greater scale? +again but but how long does it take before it does happen again? +i mean, do the other do these things happen in cycles and tha you know, is it possible that it'll happen again on a greater scale? a grand well scale, if you like? -it er i mean, it's having grounds now because of the recession! +it er i mean, it's having grounds now because of the recession! yes. that is, that yes. is what brought it about er in setting the stage for in one way, in in -although it hasn't it hasn't come to that in germany, i mean we'll probably be the poor man of europe at the moment aren't we? +although it hasn't it hasn't come to that in germany, i mean we'll probably be the poor man of europe at the moment aren't we? in this country? ah but, i mean it's biting in germany now because they've got all east germans! -that's yes, yes, that's true. +that's yes, yes, that's true. biting before that weren't it? where erm they've had to close down the spi ,and that. -and of course, when, when they when +and of course, when, when they when this of course is exacerbated. -but the going gets tough it's it's easy to blame minority groups and this is what happened before wasn't it? -like on the ruddy that's all they're doing now, bringing all these turks and god knows what! +but the going gets tough it's it's easy to blame minority groups and this is what happened before wasn't it? +like on the ruddy that's all they're doing now, bringing all these turks and god knows what! ha! i mean, even in france, and i mean, in fact, in fact east germany, poor devils they -in france it's more it's worse in in some respects because er it seems to be more powerful the erm the rate of you know, the feeling of . +in france it's more it's worse in in some respects because er it seems to be more powerful the erm the rate of you know, the feeling of . i mean what can you, what can we do? -if, it's happening, i mean what was the soviet union i mean it's +if, it's happening, i mean what was the soviet union i mean it's well i said to margaret, i wonder -news on it it's death and destruction there isn't it? +news on it it's death and destruction there isn't it? all these minority i wonder groups. -with the western groups after the euphoria of saying oh there, well we've cracked it now! +with the western groups after the euphoria of saying oh there, well we've cracked it now! we've destroyed communism. are they now regretting it? and, i don't @@ -26261,85 +26235,85 @@ well i think in some respects stress. they, they wanted the downfall of communism oh they did want it! -but nevertheless it's better the devil you know! -but, having said that you know, that i should imagine that the military are regretting it. +but nevertheless it's better the devil you know! +but, having said that you know, that i should imagine that the military are regretting it. well i mean, the military will definitely -regretting it, in in the west +regretting it, in in the west didn't actually want it to go this far. -because it means a reduction in forces in in all these +because it means a reduction in forces in in all these yeah. -countries erm, and as you say, i mean ha you know, whether they're american generals or or the soviet generals, whatever er they're all, they're all feeling the pinch now because er +countries erm, and as you say, i mean ha you know, whether they're american generals or or the soviet generals, whatever er they're all, they're all feeling the pinch now because er oh i didn't mean that, i mean -at the same time it, i mean the countries wo , have been crippled by the the burden of er defence if you like and we'll call it defence. +at the same time it, i mean the countries wo , have been crippled by the the burden of er defence if you like and we'll call it defence. and they have! erm, but in fact it's probably for some of the state that we're in now! but er i would i wouldn't sa , i wouldn't of said there's a price to pay for everything. -that you see they have created the jobs! -yes yeah but i don't know, it seems crazy to me when they've +that you see they have created the jobs! +yes yeah but i don't know, it seems crazy to me when they've well that's false economy that! -there's such you know sort of appalling need +there's such you know sort of appalling need yes, but that was the get, that was your get out! -or the or the er boost in the, in the economy you know but erm +or the or the er boost in the, in the economy you know but erm yeah, but i don't think -but i mean they were mo they were making +but i mean they were mo they were making might work in our economy, but not in theirs i don't think! well it hasn't! but instead oh no! -of getting on with the five years plans they've put too much effort into producing war machines! -well and this is it i mean, where we could afford it they couldn't! +of getting on with the five years plans they've put too much effort into producing war machines! +well and this is it i mean, where we could afford it they couldn't! well can we? look at america! well they've got greater means, i know -no, they, they could of they could of afforded better than the +no, they, they could of they could of afforded better than the oh yeah! you know? yeah. only just. -so, and unfortunately erm well -i mean they, they were exploiting or they had they had the potential exploit more countries than russia did. +so, and unfortunately erm well +i mean they, they were exploiting or they had they had the potential exploit more countries than russia did. oh course! that is er -oh yeah, they colonised all these places but it makes you wonder, you know, you see all this unemployment and of course this john major's in his answer now is ooh well it's the same everywhe , it's not, not here, it's everywhere! +oh yeah, they colonised all these places but it makes you wonder, you know, you see all this unemployment and of course this john major's in his answer now is ooh well it's the same everywhe , it's not, not here, it's everywhere! they don't say why? well it is. yeah, but why? but -oh but i mean that is not +oh but i mean that is not the concern, and that is not the question,i the question is what are you going to do about it in our country? what are exactly! you mm. exactly! -but i mean the have an excuse don't they? -well that's that's it you know that er it's an excuse. +but i mean the have an excuse don't they? +well that's that's it you know that er it's an excuse. i mean, it's a convenient excuse, that is course it is! that . -i mean i was reading in the paper the other day it was on about recycling -yes, just a please. +i mean i was reading in the paper the other day it was on about recycling +yes, just a please. and the different counties say stop! and the way they've approached it and some yep. -of the more progressive ones, you know they've er addressed the problem of rubbish and recycling wo erm one spokesperson for somewhere like milton keynes, i think it was said there's you know, there's no money to made out of ri , recycling +of the more progressive ones, you know they've er addressed the problem of rubbish and recycling wo erm one spokesperson for somewhere like milton keynes, i think it was said there's you know, there's no money to made out of ri , recycling no. and yet he said not at the moment. -that they would save erm on the erm actual tipping of rubbish +that they would save erm on the erm actual tipping of rubbish how isn't there any money because to be made out of recycling -well well this is what +well well this is what well at the moment it's so dear well what he meant was to -th , i mean he said they +th , i mean he said they process it. we are not well @@ -26348,16 +26322,16 @@ in the short term. sell. in ah. -other words they were selling glass, and they were selling metal back to whatever and manufacturers to re-use but in terms of collecting and the cost of collecting it all and and +other words they were selling glass, and they were selling metal back to whatever and manufacturers to re-use but in terms of collecting and the cost of collecting it all and and that's expensive! handling all this it's, yeah. -the cost that they were having to bear were greater than what they were actually getting back on the sale of this stuff. -but, at the same time the normal sort of refuse if you like, disposable was being reduced because +the cost that they were having to bear were greater than what they were actually getting back on the sale of this stuff. +but, at the same time the normal sort of refuse if you like, disposable was being reduced because that's right! these other items weren't in the normal refuse collection and therefore they were going to sort of reduce them from a weekly collection to a well that's if -fortnightly collection, so they would be saving in that -well that er +fortnightly collection, so they would be saving in that +well that er but not saving to these that's if particular firms @@ -26366,44 +26340,44 @@ that they want. that's if no. mm. -that is their own fault because according to, there was a programme on there and it was saying they, they must be selling it to these firms that recy , that use it +that is their own fault because according to, there was a programme on there and it was saying they, they must be selling it to these firms that recy , that use it mm. they must be selling it well they will do. -them very cheap because it was sa , this programme was on about recycling +them very cheap because it was sa , this programme was on about recycling no thanks. -and it said about tin cans and aluminium and that and it was costing them less excuse me to use recycled you know er used aluminium +and it said about tin cans and aluminium and that and it was costing them less excuse me to use recycled you know er used aluminium mm. -and used steel cans and that it was costing them less to use that than it was to use +and used steel cans and that it was costing them less to use that than it was to use brand new stuff. yeah. yeah. -so, i mean to me, i don't know whether i'm right, but that my first thought is that they must be buying it very +so, i mean to me, i don't know whether i'm right, but that my first thought is that they must be buying it very it's gotta be profitable they must be buying it very cheap then? mm. mm. -so, so the people that are not making any money out of it by doing it are selling it to them very cheap so it is their own fault! -i think initially er +so, so the people that are not making any money out of it by doing it are selling it to them very cheap so it is their own fault! +i think initially er it's only it's been cheaper to -now has got a cost more in the initial +now has got a cost more in the initial well it does -stages until it's sort of, set up, until everyone is sort of you know geared into doing this kind of you know, like all the glass goes here, all the metal goes here, all the goes there +stages until it's sort of, set up, until everyone is sort of you know geared into doing this kind of you know, like all the glass goes here, all the metal goes here, all the goes there well yes, because they're not -and all the companies that are responsible for for re-using it and all the distribution network is set up for collecting an an sending it from here to there you know, once that network is going then surely +and all the companies that are responsible for for re-using it and all the distribution network is set up for collecting an an sending it from here to there you know, once that network is going then surely oh yes! -it's gotta be useful because instead of going you know from one sort at one end and going out the other and never being ever seen again it's going +it's gotta be useful because instead of going you know from one sort at one end and going out the other and never being ever seen again it's going that's right! -in a circle and, and surely that's gotta be cheaper once a network is set up? -and it's a, it's an ongoing thing +in a circle and, and surely that's gotta be cheaper once a network is set up? +and it's a, it's an ongoing thing yeah! -you know i mean, oh oh di you know i mean it's to theorise, i suppose but i mean all it takes really is to have three bins. +you know i mean, oh oh di you know i mean it's to theorise, i suppose but i mean all it takes really is to have three bins. yeah. -you have your paper you have your bottles -you know alright initially as you say it take, it costs but +you have your paper you have your bottles +you know alright initially as you say it take, it costs but to set it up -it does , to set it up,yo you have you have, you'll have to have three, three what's his names? -three, three bin men to come and collect it. +it does , to set it up,yo you have you have, you'll have to have three, three what's his names? +three, three bin men to come and collect it. mm. or no, you have to have three containers. but they do it in canada! @@ -26413,15 +26387,15 @@ but i mean even even got one you see for plastic! -but, but there well yo , you could have four, you could have as many as you like +but, but there well yo , you could have four, you could have as many as you like mm. -but i mean surely, in the long term +but i mean surely, in the long term course! but that co idea he doesn't drink beer, so you can have his for well no,but i mean like but that's the key word is the long term ken! -like you sell, you sell that back to them that that pays the man's wages that is doing it! +like you sell, you sell that back to them that that pays the man's wages that is doing it! mm. mm. but it's the short term isn't it, with them? @@ -26430,8 +26404,8 @@ it's easier for us no the to buy the new raw material and process it yeah i said -and it ah -ah but +and it ah +ah but but yeah, i know but the well this is the this is the way the government's gotta act now! @@ -26441,37 +26415,37 @@ they won't! generated the this is the trouble it's a joke! -this is the trouble with this country because it's has has +this is the trouble with this country because it's has has i mean look at germany! yeah, but i mean they will make progress, i mean this colony -and -is would never +and +is would never mm. advance! -i mean that's why we lost our moto er motorcycle industry +i mean that's why we lost our moto er motorcycle industry yeah. -it's why we've lost most of our industry because they won't, they won't invest in new machinery or mo , new methods! +it's why we've lost most of our industry because they won't, they won't invest in new machinery or mo , new methods! modernisation. i mean they've just won't look ahead! -you see it's the same as they said on there we've had all these inventions -and they get by our country. -and they get, they get in this country and then they go and exploit them in another country! +you see it's the same as they said on there we've had all these inventions +and they get by our country. +and they get, they get in this country and then they go and exploit them in another country! mm. so where's the -computer's the finest example of that produced +computer's the finest example of that produced but in manchester! mm. -this government says ooh we can't afford that, no, it's a it's a gimmick! +this government says ooh we can't afford that, no, it's a it's a gimmick! the yank says we will! bingo! and look, this used to be we could of held them to ransom! one of the best education systems in the world! -and i mean +and i mean i know, it isn't now! -won't be here now well you could sliding right +won't be here now well you could sliding right i know! down the scale! mm. @@ -26480,115 +26454,115 @@ we're way behind germany, france you can only cut back russia -and prune back so much in the name of efficiency before sooner +and prune back so much in the name of efficiency before sooner well or later things su suffer! -there was, there was a programme on channel four there to i was watching before i picked my book up and they had conservative labour bloke and the independent er liberals and these were supposedly they have on on er channel four a a programme called week in politics anyway this night, this, tonight they were doing a a fu , they had a floating audience, supposedly a floating audience +there was, there was a programme on channel four there to i was watching before i picked my book up and they had conservative labour bloke and the independent er liberals and these were supposedly they have on on er channel four a a programme called week in politics anyway this night, this, tonight they were doing a a fu , they had a floating audience, supposedly a floating audience you mean, they were under water? flo ,fa floating vo er voters oh! -er until, until the end and they had a poll of er who who has been persuaded to vote for the three la , you know, what had they done to -oh they had to to say who they supported and -vote for the three, that's right and there was one one put their hand up for he persuaded them that ne , neil kinnock would be a good leader, that was it er so one put their hand up for him one put their hand up for major and she had the cheek to say +er until, until the end and they had a poll of er who who has been persuaded to vote for the three la , you know, what had they done to +oh they had to to say who they supported and +vote for the three, that's right and there was one one put their hand up for he persuaded them that ne , neil kinnock would be a good leader, that was it er so one put their hand up for him one put their hand up for major and she had the cheek to say that that is only because i'm a conservative! -and it was supposed to be , if the audience was supposed to be voting -and i mean but the quite the majority of them er put their hands up for paddy ashdown. -yeah he's a very persuasive character -well when and he wasn't on he wasn't on, but he he at the towards the end they gave the three of them thirty seconds to describe the go , you know, the qualities of of the +and it was supposed to be , if the audience was supposed to be voting +and i mean but the quite the majority of them er put their hands up for paddy ashdown. +yeah he's a very persuasive character +well when and he wasn't on he wasn't on, but he he at the towards the end they gave the three of them thirty seconds to describe the go , you know, the qualities of of the of a good leader. -of of of er their leader +of of of er their leader mm. -and the one one for the libs he only used twenty seconds, twenty two seconds! +and the one one for the libs he only used twenty seconds, twenty two seconds! and he finished? -and, you know he said i'm sure paddy ashdown would think that you could of found something else to use the other +and, you know he said i'm sure paddy ashdown would think that you could of found something else to use the other to say. eight seconds up ! -but er but he ended up, you know as sure as they've asked er the +but er but he ended up, you know as sure as they've asked er the something to say -the show of hands, like he was er he was the one that the floating voters were +the show of hands, like he was er he was the one that the floating voters were yeah. but i mean but only -he, he looks a very persuasive kind of character doesn't he erm i mean he's, he's quite sort of erm well a nice person well he +he, he looks a very persuasive kind of character doesn't he erm i mean he's, he's quite sort of erm well a nice person well he yeah. seems to be! but er -but you know -well see wha wha down there was a couple there in their leather jackets look, looked a cli couple you know, the boy and girl couple of yobbos! -looked a right couple of yobbos and er well what day is it like? -well he says er how could you vote for kinnock he says because the press attacks him and he doesn't defend himself! +but you know +well see wha wha down there was a couple there in their leather jackets look, looked a cli couple you know, the boy and girl couple of yobbos! +looked a right couple of yobbos and er well what day is it like? +well he says er how could you vote for kinnock he says because the press attacks him and he doesn't defend himself! but your dukes up neil! you know! yeah, well and this is the mentality of them! childish! -i mean ha when it comes down to it, at the end of the day today we we live in er a media orientated world don't we? +i mean ha when it comes down to it, at the end of the day today we we live in er a media orientated world don't we? we turn on the box well -and we we see what is fed to us there, we pick up , you pick up the you know, the comic strip papers you know,yo you see headlines there, most of it is is you know tory sort of dominated. +and we we see what is fed to us there, we pick up , you pick up the you know, the comic strip papers you know,yo you see headlines there, most of it is is you know tory sort of dominated. orientated. -but er that so it depends whether you, whether you actually think about what you're seeing and what you're reading and +but er that so it depends whether you, whether you actually think about what you're seeing and what you're reading and well what you're hearing doesn't it? well i mean, i i take the express mmmm. and -they say that ad , it pays to advertise i mean, to me advertising has never done anything for me well i don't think it has anyway but if it pays to advertise and look at the number of people that read the express +they say that ad , it pays to advertise i mean, to me advertising has never done anything for me well i don't think it has anyway but if it pays to advertise and look at the number of people that read the express what do you want lucy? -you know, the that would +you know, the that would what? -convert a lot of people if they +convert a lot of people if they oh yes! definitely because it it is no! -you know, i i i don't, i don't look at the first four pages in the express cos that's +you know, i i i don't, i don't look at the first four pages in the express cos that's no. all it is! it's running labour down yeah. same old stuff! -and yeah. +and yeah. well in a and way how good john major is and how good mm. -and the tory, you know they're giving them victory because they they supposedly we're we're up to the, up to as many er we're level with the with the labour party now. +and the tory, you know they're giving them victory because they they supposedly we're we're up to the, up to as many er we're level with the with the labour party now. mm. and they are, you know, this is a victory! -yeah it's pathetic! -i i i think really they er they forget that that there's a quite a large number of the population, they do think about what's going on, and they're not all children and they're not and aren't all that easy easily persuaded. -but, having said that there is but there are, but there as well! -no but i mean,the there's but there's a lot of people, you see when you say they're not easily persuaded that are working class that are voting tory and they're not easily persuaded they cha +yeah it's pathetic! +i i i think really they er they forget that that there's a quite a large number of the population, they do think about what's going on, and they're not all children and they're not and aren't all that easy easily persuaded. +but, having said that there is but there are, but there as well! +no but i mean,the there's but there's a lot of people, you see when you say they're not easily persuaded that are working class that are voting tory and they're not easily persuaded they cha well they did, i just changed their mind! mm. -well having seen a little bit erm was on the other day and i i mean i i must admit i touch shut up you! +well having seen a little bit erm was on the other day and i i mean i i must admit i touch shut up you! nothing to do with you! -a lot of what's erm you know, going on now, i mean, is just gonna go off as far i'm concerned cos i mean i've already made up my mind. +a lot of what's erm you know, going on now, i mean, is just gonna go off as far i'm concerned cos i mean i've already made up my mind. yeah. i'm a loyal supporter! well that's it! and that's it! -but erm you know o , i mean it's, there's so much analysis and what not, i mean i i think most, most people must do the same a lot of them have made their minds up and the ones who haven't either don't really care +but erm you know o , i mean it's, there's so much analysis and what not, i mean i i think most, most people must do the same a lot of them have made their minds up and the ones who haven't either don't really care no! -or they're so serious about it that they'll probably be watching everything, you know, just to sort of make sure that they know everything about +or they're so serious about it that they'll probably be watching everything, you know, just to sort of make sure that they know everything about yeah. every party! yeah. and making sure i get the right one. but i think the majority of them just won't bother anyway, to watch no. -they've already made their minds up and a and definitely a lot of people vote on on on basically the choice +they've already made their minds up and a and definitely a lot of people vote on on on basically the choice on the spur of the mom on the spur well of the moment, on the day -think well they've had long enough now we'll we'll have a switch you know -or or the they like the look of the bloke, they like his photograph +think well they've had long enough now we'll we'll have a switch you know +or or the they like the look of the bloke, they like his photograph and they'll go and vote for him! that's right. -and i mean there's that been that much publicity about neil kinnock you know, or anti neil +and i mean there's that been that much publicity about neil kinnock you know, or anti neil yeah. kinnock publicity. but er, i mean a lot of people say ooh, you know, i wouldn't trust him with it! @@ -26597,43 +26571,43 @@ well he's never been of course not! in power before well it's only what they've read in the newspaper! -neither has blooming john major you know! -neither has blooming maggie thatcher before she came in, you know! +neither has blooming john major you know! +neither has blooming maggie thatcher before she came in, you know! i mean it's well i mean you've only got lo -they'll be a first time for everything ! +they'll be a first time for everything ! you've got to take the way her wack her image changed wack a wack a wack! over the years mm, yeah. -the voice the +the voice the mm. -shape of the shape of her face and hair. +shape of the shape of her face and hair. in fact i think that spitting image dummy was more like her than she was! you you loo , you look mhm. -at the years how she changed, practically every year! +at the years how she changed, practically every year! her image changed. -well it started to become like er +well it started to become like er a a little what do they call them? these dolls. yeah. what do they call them? barbie doll. -barbie doll and that's what she was. +barbie doll and that's what she was. well no, not as attractive as a barbie doll! -well no, but +well no, but but -i'm but the style was there -she,i it was it was becoming like a dictatorship! +i'm but the style was there +she,i it was it was becoming like a dictatorship! it was her at the helm ooh well this is what it beca , it did and -and th the so called democratic, you know, choice of all these poli , all these mp's and what not which would comprise parliament and government and head of the tory party at the time you know i it really their voices on the, on the the cabinet you know, they were, they were just destroyed! -well, you said you know you, we were on about germany and, and becoming you know could it happen again? -if if she'd of had her way she would of been the dictator of this +and th the so called democratic, you know, choice of all these poli , all these mp's and what not which would comprise parliament and government and head of the tory party at the time you know i it really their voices on the, on the the cabinet you know, they were, they were just destroyed! +well, you said you know you, we were on about germany and, and becoming you know could it happen again? +if if she'd of had her way she would of been the dictator of this yeah. country, and she would of been in power forever! oh i know! @@ -26648,22 +26622,22 @@ she wouldould! yeah, i mean if it meant her staying in power that, i mean she well -would of done it she would of got rid of them to make sure she she stayed there. +would of done it she would of got rid of them to make sure she she stayed there. yes it came to er are you tired? a fine state of affairs didn't it no, i'm alright ken, yeah. -with her even her own party giving +with her even her own party giving well her the heave-ho! well this is it. you know, i mean tha -she was they i mean she was go +she was they i mean she was go that's how it must be. she was going too far for them well she must of been. -well this is it i think she was beginning to endanger her chances of re-election and i think +well this is it i think she was beginning to endanger her chances of re-election and i think yeah. they let her go on too long and it well to be but er @@ -26674,7 +26648,7 @@ yes it has. hasn't it? you know, our policies are working, i mean after thirteen years well they've had long enough to do it! -and this recession that we've been coming out of for so many years now it's i mean it's just turned into a bit of a joke! +and this recession that we've been coming out of for so many years now it's i mean it's just turned into a bit of a joke! they're all making money for themselves aren't they? that's why i'm suspicious well @@ -26684,12 +26658,12 @@ the labour party? no, i don't the big shots you know! money in the bank -no i don't +no i don't well whe whe when they're small they're ken -i, i +i, i but once they get a -well ah now what have i said to you ? +well ah now what have i said to you ? para power corrupts i know. mm mm, yes. and that's the way power corrupts. @@ -26697,29 +26671,29 @@ but, well it's what i've just said! yeah but i mean that's true. you'd never agree with before! -no you we , you was relating it to to power in this country to any country and saying +no you we , you was relating it to to power in this country to any country and saying any country. it was exact, identical. well it is. -and that's what i disagreed with. +and that's what i disagreed with. it is. i i said -it is -you can't compare the ca , the power like just say in a place like turkey which is absolutely rotten! -they got no law at all, or very little with, with the +it is +you can't compare the ca , the power like just say in a place like turkey which is absolutely rotten! +they got no law at all, or very little with, with the well it's corruption! ooh yeah! i mean, if a little kid in the in the -and that is, that is what +and that is, that is what in the in the playground er well that's what it amounts to! you know it's corruption! coerces some kid into selling him his marbles, that's corruption isn't it? but there are levels aren't there? -one one is more +one one is more extreme than the other. -so we've got corruption in us probably so it depends upon the degree +so we've got corruption in us probably so it depends upon the degree well, yes we have. but you don't expect to get out of the ruddy aha. @@ -26740,11 +26714,11 @@ talk with two tongues and say well what do you know about them that you say they've yes. they've got er -what do you base your i , your +what do you base your i , your what happens when they retire? well what happens when they retire? -do they end up working the way we've got to bloody work here on this tiny pension or the pension that they've earned as an mp -well have retired from the labour +do they end up working the way we've got to bloody work here on this tiny pension or the pension that they've earned as an mp +well have retired from the labour well alright party. harold wilson, prime example @@ -26756,12 +26730,12 @@ socialist, i mean well how da , how do you know what ? they're supposed to be against all that aren't they? wait a minute! -how do you know he's a rich man and what do you class what do yo , what do you base in rich ? +how do you know he's a rich man and what do you class what do yo , what do you base in rich ? well a man that's got more than one home for a start! yeah. well er because that's erm -you must have been rich then a couple of years ago? +you must have been rich then a couple of years ago? when you brought a second home! now don't talk ru , you know what i'm on about! no, i don't, no! @@ -26770,10 +26744,10 @@ no, er, wait a minute ray! he's he's, he's lead a public life mm. -so he can write he can write a few books, he can go out there and talk +so he can write he can write a few books, he can go out there and talk mhm. so he earns money, is that a, is that a corruption of his job? -no, well talking to earn money, no! +no, well talking to earn money, no! do you agree? yo , i mean if he er, if he gets paid by @@ -26785,16 +26759,16 @@ and she's yeah. pa , and she's paid half a well i -million pounds for her +million pounds for her well tha that that is yeah. worse isn't it? so i mean, er i dunno but it's it's the degree -how can that how can that man as a socialist justify earning well i don't know what he gets, but we'll say he doesn't +how can that how can that man as a socialist justify earning well i don't know what he gets, but we'll say he doesn't well -get as much as thatcher, say he gets forty thousand -well no, i didn't know no you don't +get as much as thatcher, say he gets forty thousand +well no, i didn't know no you don't oh, now wait a, wait a minute! now i, i have said to, i have said to you he's a rich man @@ -26802,7 +26776,7 @@ that everybody and he shouldn't be! everybody should earn the same. mm. -but you all said that it depends on his skill or his what's his name +but you all said that it depends on his skill or his what's his name or how many kids he's got. if i've got twenty five kids and you've only got one yo , i need more than you! so how can you possibly all earn the same? @@ -26819,7 +26793,7 @@ well, to me you shouldn't have twenty five kids anyway! well that's dictatorship because because it, i would have a dictatorship on that! i mean that's, i would have -well that's, alright well well that's +well that's, alright well well that's control of the world population, i se i would limit to two children. i would er, have control of the @@ -26839,38 +26813,38 @@ yes, so everybody so would need the same pay. but no matter what you'd, you know at the end of the week or the year or whatever -no, but i mean i mean -there's all those people who have the same pay, that at the end of the year they would end up with different amounts because people would manage money differently +no, but i mean i mean +there's all those people who have the same pay, that at the end of the year they would end up with different amounts because people would manage money differently differently some would spend it of course they would! as soon as they get it oh yeah. -some would go into hock and spend it before they get it +some would go into hock and spend it before they get it before they got it yeah. some would save it, and be frugal! -alright, alright then -which is what the tories want you see +alright, alright then +which is what the tories want you see what i want i think the trouble is i want no, you're defending them! -i won't give anybody any money you can go to the shop and buy what you basically need. +i won't give anybody any money you can go to the shop and buy what you basically need. you see yo no but we're devia your we're deviating on the subject -well you did because your, straight away you go onto money which is our god isn't it? +well you did because your, straight away you go onto money which is our god isn't it? well, no but you said it was corruption yeah. and i've only yo mentioned, well you mentioned money because you mentioned harold wilson mm. -with two homes and you said the money they get! +with two homes and you said the money they get! yes. so you brought the subject of the money up! no, no mm. -but you're on about something else, you said the first thing i'd do, that's got nothing to do with harold wilson the first thing i if i were in power +but you're on about something else, you said the first thing i'd do, that's got nothing to do with harold wilson the first thing i if i were in power but there would which be like i @@ -26880,7 +26854,7 @@ yeah. subject! no no no but i'm pa if so go on yo -i were in power there wouldn't be any money no need for it! +i were in power there wouldn't be any money no need for it! then you well i wouldn't have all @@ -26893,26 +26867,26 @@ say that at all! no. yeah. and what would you do -but in the case of these people that start off +but in the case of these people that start off so why why should -fair do's they start off in university, clever blokes and a lot of them worked in the mines, shinwells what's his name? -beven miners +fair do's they start off in university, clever blokes and a lot of them worked in the mines, shinwells what's his name? +beven miners just for money! -well i won't say beven because it's a bloody shame what happened to him! -but never the less a lot of them started off like that didn't they? +well i won't say beven because it's a bloody shame what happened to him! +but never the less a lot of them started off like that didn't they? another one is foot. ah but er he -and as they get into, as you say, power and i quite agree somebody has a talk with them so look here +and as they get into, as you say, power and i quite agree somebody has a talk with them so look here we know we know you're a socialist but you still earned a few bob to get on. -but er, you you we're gonna make you a nice one and join the bloody club so you'll be an armchair socialist and we look after you and that's what they are! -callaghan is another example two or three homes big jim with all his bloody money what does he care about working people? +but er, you you we're gonna make you a nice one and join the bloody club so you'll be an armchair socialist and we look after you and that's what they are! +callaghan is another example two or three homes big jim with all his bloody money what does he care about working people? and this feller kinnock's the same, you can see the style of them! -i think he must be +i think he must be bloody big cuffs!cufflinks! -i think you i think you've been saying -ah well, no not +i think you i think you've been saying +ah well, no not saville row shirts! no, you're making him it's i think if you @@ -26920,7 +26894,7 @@ mistake, you're making a mistake there! as the leader of the labour party or the liberal party you have got to keep up with you've gotta keep up with to go -image and how to be +image and how to be yeah. a leader in this country! no, you haven't! @@ -26932,7 +26906,7 @@ what did he, what where did it get him? well you just said you just go you just said you've gotta give them a how long did it last? how long did it how long did it last? -are you, are telling are you telling me that you'd vote for somebody in rags on the television who promised you a better future? +are you, are telling are you telling me that you'd vote for somebody in rags on the television who promised you a better future? i did! what do you mean you did? voted for foot. @@ -26946,37 +26920,37 @@ well! not! he was never the prime he wasn't, michael foot? -oh i know he put in there. +oh i know he put in there. oh no he he should of been. -he's never been president of +he's never been president of he was very outspoken he was a very outspoken he should of been! -he was leader of the +he was leader of the but the first -bloody only the the way they should dress! +bloody only the the way they should dress! ah, yes well ah, that's got nothing to do with it! oh! but now it has! i mean he's probably got more money than they've bloody got! -the it's all a blind anyway those rags he goes round in! +the it's all a blind anyway those rags he goes round in! duffel coat, he got he got censored there's -because he wore a duffel coat instead +because he wore a duffel coat instead well it's like -that man underneath a duffel coat -what did ken say about this chap from vauxhalls? -convena did all his work and they asked him to go to london you know, there's some was on years ago so he goes to the headquarters and he said he just couldn't believe it, he turned on him and said you're a shallow bloody hypocrite he said! -those lads down there they're fighting living on their ruddy strike pay and look at you lot! -he said they were there the whisky was flowing you know hypocrites! +that man underneath a duffel coat +what did ken say about this chap from vauxhalls? +convena did all his work and they asked him to go to london you know, there's some was on years ago so he goes to the headquarters and he said he just couldn't believe it, he turned on him and said you're a shallow bloody hypocrite he said! +those lads down there they're fighting living on their ruddy strike pay and look at you lot! +he said they were there the whisky was flowing you know hypocrites! and he said, oh come on you're here have a bloody good well time you know. -on your argument then anybody who who works their way up through the ranks and gets to the top has gotta become corrupted! +on your argument then anybody who who works their way up through the ranks and gets to the top has gotta become corrupted! that's what you're saying, no ma well if there i if there in a no matter who, no matter what ! -if they're in a corrupt society and when they get to that position they they don't do anything about it and accept +if they're in a corrupt society and when they get to that position they they don't do anything about it and accept well they it and take they don't @@ -26985,14 +26959,14 @@ yeah. the yeah. basis of the mafia isn't it? -ah, you see if if you don't, i mean it's not, it doesn't happen in, in every walk of life but in big business and in politics if you don't -you have to modify your +ah, you see if if you don't, i mean it's not, it doesn't happen in, in every walk of life but in big business and in politics if you don't +you have to modify your i'll tell you , i'll tell you how no, no if you don't tow the line exactly! if you just don't if you'd be elected -yes and you don't modify you what happens? +yes and you don't modify you what happens? you don't get anywhere! you don't get elected which is what happened well @@ -27004,7 +26978,7 @@ no. elected fifty percent of the population apart from that -wanted control on nuclear weapons, or wanted to abolish nuclear weapons but they the the labour government didn't get in on that basis so they had to modify their and i mean as +wanted control on nuclear weapons, or wanted to abolish nuclear weapons but they the the labour government didn't get in on that basis so they had to modify their and i mean as well you can use that for any argument then but i mean but what what can't you? @@ -27014,13 +26988,13 @@ well well well no i mean it's not well that's what they've bloody done near enough! well yeah! -and another thing that i fifty thousand -the, they it's a -mean time all the vil , all the mines are closing are they gonna say well yes well -well well we've gotta do that because be be being practical. +and another thing that i fifty thousand +the, they it's a +mean time all the vil , all the mines are closing are they gonna say well yes well +well well we've gotta do that because be be being practical. well i think it's a very being short sighted thing to do to erm -well i i think i think you'll find that well if labour gets in -i mean it's +well i i think i think you'll find that well if labour gets in +i mean it's they will, they will scra , they would find that most of the i hope they'll rescind that. mos , they wo , they wouldn't rescind it. @@ -27040,10 +27014,10 @@ oh i know! gone! closed! well -yeah but i'm, i i know i don't +yeah but i'm, i i know i don't well some of them certainly and they closed one the other week that's flooded now -will definitely +will definitely so that's yeah. i don't think that this @@ -27051,25 +27025,25 @@ they, they won't they they wouldn't can't rescind that! they wouldn't bring but i -money on the mining +money on the mining and that goes for a lot of businesses! -i mean, there's enough coal in the united kingdom to last for another two hundred years! +i mean, there's enough coal in the united kingdom to last for another two hundred years! yeah! -and that could possibly be the only, and ah i mean it's it's a +and that could possibly be the only, and ah i mean it's it's a ah but -it's a dirty fuel to use at the moment but they're all, there are means being developed even now on +it's a dirty fuel to use at the moment but they're all, there are means being developed even now on well i've no doubt in twenty i mean years time the tories will re-open them -much it's it's far +much it's it's far at at great cost to us! ah but you see nothing to stop them! -that it's +that it's well very short sighted to get rid of that now! -i mean, we're buying coal which is subsidised abroad so therefore it's cheaper for us to buy it and bring it in, but what happens when all, all our home supplies have dried up -i know i know +i mean, we're buying coal which is subsidised abroad so therefore it's cheaper for us to buy it and bring it in, but what happens when all, all our home supplies have dried up +i know i know and we can't them any more? well you know we , very well what'll @@ -27083,19 +27057,19 @@ place you can get it but the price is ! what happened in nineteen eighty one? they're so short sighted! what did bob say about the miners? -when, you know when that strike was on but it's like a lot of people +when, you know when that strike was on but it's like a lot of people what did he say about the ooh that teachers? bloody lot of, bloody lot of clowns! -arthur scargill bloody clown! +arthur scargill bloody clown! now yeah. -those fellers fought to keep those mines open and they got one of lot miners divided and said oh bugger them! +those fellers fought to keep those mines open and they got one of lot miners divided and said oh bugger them! the fellers in the midlands was it? yeah. -yo er notin +yo er notin yes. nottingham round there? st. helens @@ -27103,7 +27077,7 @@ ooh bloody no wa wa wa wa wa wa wa and they ploughed twenty five million into their mines and said your jobs are guaranteed now fore , forget it you know, you're alright for thirty years what . now they're closing the bloody things! -now, you know we sho something should of happened then they should of prolonged that strike to destroy these buggers and said no you're not gonna close them! +now, you know we sho something should of happened then they should of prolonged that strike to destroy these buggers and said no you're not gonna close them! but the peop lot of people agreed with it! well of course! they said they weren't being @@ -27113,25 +27087,25 @@ what do they do, they divide and conquer ray! yeah but why should bloody intelligent people go along with it ken? that's what gets my plate! because they , because the intelligent people weren't involved! -no i mean, i'm talking about the people who are not actually er, you know +no i mean, i'm talking about the people who are not actually er, you know i i if concerned directly but give but -their approval for these +their approval for these but they're people. -they're not involved, the people the people that give their approval are the people that want it! +they're not involved, the people the people that give their approval are the people that want it! and i mean er, and yeah but i mean -and also they, they get the masses on their side by the media! +and also they, they get the masses on their side by the media! i know! the same as they're exactly! -doing now with the i mean what paper have you got? +doing now with the i mean what paper have you got? i know, well there you are! a labour paper! this is what terrifies me! -and what's, what's er what's your chance? +and what's, what's er what's your chance? the mirror. where's that ball gone? yes. @@ -27139,33 +27113,33 @@ bring that ball here! you got no bloody chance! but as i say, people believe everything, it's gospel! and you never hear the labour party criticising. -you know, but they should be criticised out of hand what's going on in this country but they bloody don't! -well when when if if the labour party criticised and they do criticise +you know, but they should be criticised out of hand what's going on in this country but they bloody don't! +well when when if if the labour party criticised and they do criticise oh they criticise ken, yeah. -the only time that you will hear about it is whe , if you have the television on and you see it happening on the parliament and on your papers. +the only time that you will hear about it is whe , if you have the television on and you see it happening on the parliament and on your papers. well you read your paper don't you? and we get a middle of the road one which is the observer we we'll watch -which is, they get some they do some pretty good -but how often do the i mean, they they don't give you they don't give you every detail that's gone on all week! -oh no they're or there's certain ar +which is, they get some they do some pretty good +but how often do the i mean, they they don't give you they don't give you every detail that's gone on all week! +oh no they're or there's certain ar they only pick a certain subject or yes. whatever that's been thrashed. as you say , we'll see. -well he's gone on seven days of the week complaining about so and so we'll just narrow that down to one article about his his complaint that they may just make a little note he's complained seven times about this! +well he's gone on seven days of the week complaining about so and so we'll just narrow that down to one article about his his complaint that they may just make a little note he's complained seven times about this! so you see a little article that's right. he's not complaining! yeah, but i mean basic things ken, we'll take for example the low wages yeah. -we, we haven't got one now, they got one in germany, they got one in france i in +we, we haven't got one now, they got one in germany, they got one in france i in yes. italy. well yes. -oh there we go, that was mistake number one george dear have you read the er holiday page at all? +oh there we go, that was mistake number one george dear have you read the er holiday page at all? no not yet, er only about france, and i told you about oh i'm not sure the @@ -27173,14 +27147,14 @@ oh dear places you can go to mm which is a fallacy -i thought it was barry there, he looked a bit like him. +i thought it was barry there, he looked a bit like him. no he's trying to get up, get down naughty boy. e t get down, down. down there, there's a good boy -if you tell him sternly, he does understand the tone of your voice if he goes off and sulks for a while, well so be it you'll have to sulk till you get used to it, there you are. -in the u k mm, yeah, all looks very nice, camping +if you tell him sternly, he does understand the tone of your voice if he goes off and sulks for a while, well so be it you'll have to sulk till you get used to it, there you are. +in the u k mm, yeah, all looks very nice, camping joking aren't you camping? -well that's just what it looks like here you just eating al fresco and going back up to the chateau at a night +well that's just what it looks like here you just eating al fresco and going back up to the chateau at a night oh we're back in france again are we? mm yes @@ -27193,7 +27167,7 @@ and then the ferry across it's not so bad for somebody living on the south coast yes but er, as you say erm, really it's such a long journey that you need a breather before you need to start to cross the channel -oh yes i think so a good thing you're inviting ken didn't i to come with us? +oh yes i think so a good thing you're inviting ken didn't i to come with us? yes i did mentioned it erm did you to ken? well you were there weren't you too? @@ -27204,11 +27178,11 @@ well this was erm bulgaria yes, yes mm but er so i, i don't know if he'd be interested in. -i certainly wouldn't coach it so i think you would be creased by the time you got there in two days. +i certainly wouldn't coach it so i think you would be creased by the time you got there in two days. yeah but of course if you were being serious you'd have to ask him directly wouldn't you? -oh yes, yeah, well i, i, i think we'd have to to begin with to er get something a bit more concrete, you know, about time, time +oh yes, yeah, well i, i, i think we'd have to to begin with to er get something a bit more concrete, you know, about time, time yeah -cost and what not, and then you know when we've decided i mean i'm not particularly bothered whether +cost and what not, and then you know when we've decided i mean i'm not particularly bothered whether comes along or not, but i just thought it might be nice to to give him a break away from home and he won't go on his well i mean you're only doing it for him really aren't you, that's the idea was to help him well this is it, he won't go on his own will he? @@ -27231,7 +27205,7 @@ even if we tell us we went away for the weekend we could ask him along couldn't we? well that's true, yes, yes, i mean that's the lakes, it's lovely up there isn't it? -and it's only an hour or so away, so perhaps you should say that +and it's only an hour or so away, so perhaps you should say that get a weekend in i wonder where there is a cheap place to where you can old furniture. @@ -27264,7 +27238,7 @@ is it rimini? rimini, catonica all on the coast, which is er the black polish isn't it? yeah -mm there's a photograph that was in erm karen's radio times, those two girls erm going on a diet. +mm there's a photograph that was in erm karen's radio times, those two girls erm going on a diet. oh yes the erm the very big lady @@ -27276,14 +27250,14 @@ well it, according to what i read before, they say they staple the stomach down but i still like either that or, or the capacity re for your stomach expanding is, is er incredible because er, she still, you know she still doesn't lose weight i still like to know how they staple it. -yeah yes, i don't think you er you can measure i don't know, i mean if they staple it they close it off, er +yeah yes, i don't think you er you can measure i don't know, i mean if they staple it they close it off, er it must be an operation or oh eh, just to staple have a another operation lost twelve stone, god it's like having, losing another person isn't it? -oh i see so it is a case of open you up and putting, inserting these staples must be +oh i see so it is a case of open you up and putting, inserting these staples must be mm she was, what, what are you doing? stop it sounds a bit drastic -said she, she's going in for her fourth operation presumably to have this stapling done again, she says i believe that she'd be far more counsellor, i, i would of thought she, she would of had counselling anyway before they go to stage of operating, surely, i mean, er don't they look in into sort of psychological aspects of it, it's usually a +said she, she's going in for her fourth operation presumably to have this stapling done again, she says i believe that she'd be far more counsellor, i, i would of thought she, she would of had counselling anyway before they go to stage of operating, surely, i mean, er don't they look in into sort of psychological aspects of it, it's usually a on the concept yep more than just physical reason i, i mean a lot of people are grossly overweight they, you know, people usually say oh it's the but now apparently in most cases it's very rare with that so it's gotta be too much eating and why do people over eat @@ -27294,20 +27268,20 @@ i must record that wildlife on one on er, tomorrow night, so i'm in wales oh yes have you read any of your letters about the poems in last week's observer? no -they're not very flattering they didn't er, you weren't rated very highly i'm afraid i think er you tried to get away from the traditional type of +they're not very flattering they didn't er, you weren't rated very highly i'm afraid i think er you tried to get away from the traditional type of oh i see these one that they send in mm yes i er by the thousands i don't go a lot on them myself -oh poetry some of those poems that bon had in her touchstones book, especially the ones, the war, about the war, i read some of those and it made me cry, it was so sad. +oh poetry some of those poems that bon had in her touchstones book, especially the ones, the war, about the war, i read some of those and it made me cry, it was so sad. oh the, the er the ones by erm what's name about the gas and that oh to be honest i can't remember the mm, very poignant mm, but er anti war -what was the one about the erm oh it was about the assembling of the gun +what was the one about the erm oh it was about the assembling of the gun oh yes, oh do you remember that? and it's all about the parts naming oh naming the parts @@ -27344,28 +27318,28 @@ oh so then he started looking yeah they've got a way of measuring wear on er stretchers -yeah i mean it's, it's so clever really isn't it how, how they do sort of er fake furniture like that. +yeah i mean it's, it's so clever really isn't it how, how they do sort of er fake furniture like that. i mean to my mind you might just as well spend your money on, what are you doing idiot, on a well made piece of furniture today like some of those we've seen in, in -beautifully made erm, i mean they're brand new but they will be antiques i suppose in the future you know for your, for your grandchildren sort of thing, but er i mean you can't possibly think what's +beautifully made erm, i mean they're brand new but they will be antiques i suppose in the future you know for your, for your grandchildren sort of thing, but er i mean you can't possibly think what's things that are in there, it's astronomical. mm, quite expensive as you say -mm, you silly dog, what are you doing, what are you doing, oh dear, oh dear, oh dear, right, right, then, yeah, yeah, yeah, get him, right oh he said that heaven +mm, you silly dog, what are you doing, what are you doing, oh dear, oh dear, oh dear, right, right, then, yeah, yeah, yeah, get him, right oh he said that heaven mm -yeah, you do huh, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow,where's muffin, behind the settee? -yes mm +yeah, you do huh, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow,where's muffin, behind the settee? +yes mm did you read this erm review about ruby wax? no i haven't read that yet she's is a, quite a character actually, mind you she does er, it looks like one of those programmes you know er, when you don't want to be sitting in the front row, if she's going to mm pick on you -single, single you out for attention she say erm,miss wax who likes to think of herself now principally as a writer,the comic talents of this calendar who needs laxative. +single, single you out for attention she say erm,miss wax who likes to think of herself now principally as a writer,the comic talents of this calendar who needs laxative. come on e t, come on babe, come on, do you want to go out? go out? -wait a sec, let me get my yeah wait a sec, let me get my coat ah, down stay down, good boy come on, ok, ok, you're going now, yes . +wait a sec, let me get my yeah wait a sec, let me get my coat ah, down stay down, good boy come on, ok, ok, you're going now, yes . taking for walkies margaret. mm, mm, yes are you coming? -well if i take him you can do the veg if you like get down +well if i take him you can do the veg if you like get down i see, i'd just thought you'd might like to go. well i will but i doubt this, oh god i've got heap of things to do right lassie @@ -27432,21 +27406,21 @@ hello there good afternoon how's the family? abnormal -yeah at one time we couldn't get jessy to talk, he'd got a little girl with er and +yeah at one time we couldn't get jessy to talk, he'd got a little girl with er and i noticed the little girl with her, yes. she waved as she came towards me and she said oh can't stop today huh -said i've got to get this one back for her mum or whatever said i'm in a hurry then i met some guy on the field, talking to him and er +said i've got to get this one back for her mum or whatever said i'm in a hurry then i met some guy on the field, talking to him and er who you don't know from adam -a spaniel which was off the lead, covered in mud a young one and of course these, this fellow went straight up to it e t +a spaniel which was off the lead, covered in mud a young one and of course these, this fellow went straight up to it e t off the lead like? off the lead and it was er, so boisterous up and down like this, well he didn't like it straight away he got the old aggro blade up his back about two inches wide then he was watching him like this then he ran away from it or ran away from it you see and then when he came back he came to us and he growled a few times at it, so, but erm, backed off you know -i said he he doesn't mean any harm i said but he's a bit nervous, hoping to god he didn't bite the, bite the other one +i said he he doesn't mean any harm i said but he's a bit nervous, hoping to god he didn't bite the, bite the other one spaniel , yeah. -he said in all that, we got two he said the other one cut itself badly this morning on er a piece of glass obvious he said managed to come back to me you know being on a lead all his leg was cut so he sort of been down to the vet and had two stitches +he said in all that, we got two he said the other one cut itself badly this morning on er a piece of glass obvious he said managed to come back to me you know being on a lead all his leg was cut so he sort of been down to the vet and had two stitches stitches so he said i've had to, they'd have to keep him in for ten days or more you know mm @@ -27469,7 +27443,7 @@ so, and then he was going on about the work he's doing on the yes i thought he probably would. you were nearly at the end of the tape as well weren't you? i thought afterwards i bet that tape would run out when you're talking to and won't be able to turn it over. -mm, i don't think so but er he's had an awful struggle with that because he said buckley's one of the worse places and no interest at all +mm, i don't think so but er he's had an awful struggle with that because he said buckley's one of the worse places and no interest at all nobody's interested no, it's a shame said er , they said wrexham they've got two or three you know mu museums for, and that different halls he said er well, there was talk about er getting the old hall down in the old street community centre, not the, the @@ -27544,7 +27518,7 @@ that's already done innit? well, cos with him being on night, i don't suppose he got up till about he started just after me, yeah one o'clock, yeah, there, and there were huge holes in the -i mean you, you ask him if he'd erm arranged for a cement mixer and he said oh no he didn't want to bother, but i thought afterwards that'll be each one of those holes, he +i mean you, you ask him if he'd erm arranged for a cement mixer and he said oh no he didn't want to bother, but i thought afterwards that'll be each one of those holes, he he says oh a ton what are we going to do with the yes or @@ -27570,7 +27544,7 @@ if he's on there just shout at him will you because oh he's in here he's by the radiator aren't you beaut? he's a beauty babe, oh, rascal aren't you? -would give you that continuous conversation, erm where is, is life is it's surprising how much time you do have to put into it. +would give you that continuous conversation, erm where is, is life is it's surprising how much time you do have to put into it. i mean it surprised me i thought oh yes one and a half tapes a day, yeah, it's, it's a doddle, but erm, not, not only have you got to know how it functions, but you've got to know, know you've got to fill in your, your document yeah @@ -27600,7 +27574,7 @@ i thought, i thought the other one had got it go on , go on. when you think of it, these chemists to date, no wonder their wives are on a low wage and the moaning all the time because they're not bloody chemists, they're just getting pills out of a box yeah, that's right , yes, yeah -you don't see erm doing this but, well after that, i mean +you don't see erm doing this but, well after that, i mean and er, well years ago they had all these bottle of potions on the back shelf i suppose they were mixing up all the time, it's all antibiotics now and isn't it tablets or mm @@ -27616,14 +27590,14 @@ yeah which are all, er what they called? i bet they don't dispense much of that now because most people buy it over the counter don't they? oh their own, yes -i mean you're not going to spend three pound forty on a prescription if you can get a bottle for about one pound fifty so +i mean you're not going to spend three pound forty on a prescription if you can get a bottle for about one pound fifty so where you do it so well where you gonna go for that? where else can you try? er well i was gonna ask for when he comes, gonna ask or ask at the college do you mean? -they seem to know about it, the ones who live in that area and +they seem to know about it, the ones who live in that area and the chemist mm he's an old fashioned type @@ -27639,14 +27613,14 @@ but erm he might be able to er oblige you, he was certainly one of the last of t a tissue in machine, bits dropping in and out look in the pockets you great pi , oh i think there's probably one inside a pillow case knowing you -oh jesus, maggots i caught a few +oh jesus, maggots i caught a few there might be a fiver in one of them you've got no chance of that hey did you know this -yes oh god muffin you're not going out again you're covered in mud. +yes oh god muffin you're not going out again you're covered in mud. i suppose they get fed up stuck in all the time, don't they? -yeah, and they're only out for a few minutes and they're fed up out there as well, and backwards and forwards like a fiddlers elbow go on i want to put those lupins in -today, somewhere never mind, no, you're not having any more biscuits you right i erm, i see it's ten past eleven, i want to get this ball washed, so, er, let them go in the wash +yeah, and they're only out for a few minutes and they're fed up out there as well, and backwards and forwards like a fiddlers elbow go on i want to put those lupins in +today, somewhere never mind, no, you're not having any more biscuits you right i erm, i see it's ten past eleven, i want to get this ball washed, so, er, let them go in the wash right i'm going to work in the workshop i'll tell you what, i get the erm, i get the battery of the, the other one, you can try it. you want to try it don't you if you're going to have it? @@ -27663,7 +27637,7 @@ i don't know use your fantastic that pause -i'm looking for something somewhere yes, well it appears to be working, but whether it's working correctly i don't know oh ray, there is provision here for the headphones, you, you said are you supposed to use headphones with it, mind you it sounds pretty audible anyway, i don't think you need headphones, i mean i'm not sure there's a +i'm looking for something somewhere yes, well it appears to be working, but whether it's working correctly i don't know oh ray, there is provision here for the headphones, you, you said are you supposed to use headphones with it, mind you it sounds pretty audible anyway, i don't think you need headphones, i mean i'm not sure there's a no see how she goes. erm @@ -27672,7 +27646,7 @@ yeah it's just that find out if there's any nails in the, in the wood. possibly have stones you're not likely to get stones em embedded in the -oh i mean whether, whether that one is, is good enough for +oh i mean whether, whether that one is, is good enough for enough mm, and it the nails in the wood that's all @@ -27701,16 +27675,16 @@ they're not, they're not solid glass, they're two panes, which could be separate what re-cut you mean? well no not, not, well we could get them, i never thought of that cut them they wouldn't be the exact size -yes, ah that's a point now, i could take them down to erm, what's his name down the road and ask him, he's very obliging, ask him to cut them +yes, ah that's a point now, i could take them down to erm, what's his name down the road and ask him, he's very obliging, ask him to cut them i don't know it depends er -i was just thinking rather than having plain which you'd have to pay for anyway a plain piece of glass and, and er putting lead on it yourself i think that's a brilliant idea that. +i was just thinking rather than having plain which you'd have to pay for anyway a plain piece of glass and, and er putting lead on it yourself i think that's a brilliant idea that. well the idea is, is it's not so much the lead it suppose to be the bars, i don't know what they look like without old, old er it's a diamond , it's a diamond pattern isn't it for yeah -as opposed to the, but, but some cupboard doors are diamond pattern, muffin will you be quiet have we any more bones cooked for them or have they had them all? +as opposed to the, but, but some cupboard doors are diamond pattern, muffin will you be quiet have we any more bones cooked for them or have they had them all? no there's some there cooked? oh that's what i mean, erm, well listen we'd better try and just, practice somehow and see erm @@ -27725,7 +27699,7 @@ oh i would of thought there was a rest for it surely, no? do you think so? just down the bottom just down the bottom -right what you're going to have to do is erm +right what you're going to have to do is erm get a piece of wood with a nail in it yeah, yeah i tell you what get a hold of that and put something underneath it. @@ -27773,7 +27747,7 @@ well i don't see how, all you've got to do is turn it upside down, you could sti to make your first cut yeah you have to take the guard off and the -knife at the back of the saw, they, it is a bit dangerous, erm where's the guard goes at the top +knife at the back of the saw, they, it is a bit dangerous, erm where's the guard goes at the top mm just wouldn't go in would it, unless it's being stood right down mm @@ -27789,7 +27763,7 @@ we would have to like pull the wood through you see what about that erm, what about that other place that er timber place on the way to kilkern erm we went there, you, oh you went in to ask about some walnut, do you remember when er well er that's the same, that would be worth thinking this you know don't think you'd be very happy you know -i mean you wouldn't wanna pay no be only worth a fiver to cut it, to them it's not worth +i mean you wouldn't wanna pay no be only worth a fiver to cut it, to them it's not worth damaging them, saw, mm well at least we've had a look at the whether we right ok, so we've eliminated all that have we? @@ -27803,7 +27777,7 @@ yeah and about ten irish navvies one down below and one above huh mm -try to get some er old door casings rip down from me you know, now, i was thinking of going to north wales but i know what they'd say cos it, the ones that i got from our rob's you know the they're quite clean but of course they've had nails in the, you know, the head like i made the cab some cabinets you know. +try to get some er old door casings rip down from me you know, now, i was thinking of going to north wales but i know what they'd say cos it, the ones that i got from our rob's you know the they're quite clean but of course they've had nails in the, you know, the head like i made the cab some cabinets you know. i want them split down that road which way? on the deep @@ -27811,7 +27785,7 @@ oh on the deep two or three gorges oh you want to fetch it down to a board technic that's so i can get two out of the one you know for the sides, erm, sides and -oh you want them to deep, deep, deep +oh you want them to deep, deep, deep i don't think i'm gonna get that much joy myself, cos their reluctant aren't they to do anything that's not new. i thought there might be somewhere where they'd have an old circular saw you know, probably got a bit more chance with help, but they do a bit of rough cutting do you know what i mean? yeah, but you won't get two out of it will you? @@ -27998,11 +27972,11 @@ no, not really does it work? it's got the battery in it well i'm not sure really it didn't seem to go to good on the cast iron nails you know the long ones -well, they would have showed a wider picture of the actual picture, and apparently they take,co , the photographers had taken a baby away from it's mother he's standing in the middle of a desert , and there's a picture of them with a baby and all these photographers photographing it ! -sounds a bit like that baby ! +well, they would have showed a wider picture of the actual picture, and apparently they take,co , the photographers had taken a baby away from it's mother he's standing in the middle of a desert , and there's a picture of them with a baby and all these photographers photographing it ! +sounds a bit like that baby ! yeah.! -oh he'll be splattered by a in doncaster ! -when you get a you get a dozen prisoners who are ! +oh he'll be splattered by a in doncaster ! +when you get a you get a dozen prisoners who are ! mum we start wednesday. you were pining upstairs. i wasn't pining! @@ -28031,10 +28005,10 @@ i know. you said you didn't want it. i did not ! at the time. -do you know what though, i need to get some more money for the devon trip in soon. +do you know what though, i need to get some more money for the devon trip in soon. i didn't say i didn't want it again. i don't want it -i'm not i mean so +i'm not i mean so when is that i could always that devon trip then? @@ -28048,16 +28022,16 @@ oh the jobbys! we did have a . plenty of jobbys ! yes. -did anyone fall in? +did anyone fall in? no. -we , it was when i went to, when i, we were doing something with maps when i was at school and they were trying to find out what, it was the, where the local rates where the money was spent for the local rates and one of projects was taken down the sewage works. +we , it was when i went to, when i, we were doing something with maps when i was at school and they were trying to find out what, it was the, where the local rates where the money was spent for the local rates and one of projects was taken down the sewage works. ooh it smelt! it was awful! -and erm, we're gonna go but i paid, i've paid the deposit so +and erm, we're gonna go but i paid, i've paid the deposit so it'll be a case of just the i tell you what . -but i er i , if you like, i can pay the thirty pounds and then that'll make us equal. +but i er i , if you like, i can pay the thirty pounds and then that'll make us equal. well let's have a think. why? do you know what she did? @@ -28082,12 +28056,12 @@ mm. i see. were you, you know,we , do you on erm were you on work, -and we can work with this er, we for my dad died. -well, it came on erm it was coming on while er, you know the da , the day he died and i went into work? +and we can work with this er, we for my dad died. +well, it came on erm it was coming on while er, you know the da , the day he died and i went into work? mm. and it was coming on then, but i didn't think anything of it, cos i, i hadn't had, hadn't got anything to eat all day mm. -and i was upset and i thought it was just that but no, it was about two weeks before that i went down with it. +and i was upset and i thought it was just that but no, it was about two weeks before that i went down with it. i got my period due. is that one got hole in it. is that going to be no good? @@ -28104,7 +28078,7 @@ thought i had done. oh! put dried parsley in next time. i told you, see! -what's all in here? +what's all in here? i want a little thing to crack into. mm. in there. @@ -28116,15 +28090,15 @@ it doesn't say anything about it being separate. no. whoops! i'm not helping you do it. -i'm determined to this you know. -i put, well it's cos you'll be that's, that thing it'll be like prunes. -you know with that that looks very creamy with the cream on it. +i'm determined to this you know. +i put, well it's cos you'll be that's, that thing it'll be like prunes. +you know with that that looks very creamy with the cream on it. mm. put it, oh yeah. so i actually had to buy the, the cheese. oh!. mm. -didn't she realise what a sacrifice when i asked him to make it. +didn't she realise what a sacrifice when i asked him to make it. it smells alright. that's alright. good! @@ -28139,7 +28113,7 @@ is that to put this in? er, well i'm not sure. i haven't made the sponge yet. yeah, i think it's -well i'll , i'll put it in this one because if it will half smell +well i'll , i'll put it in this one because if it will half smell well i'm just trying ,co cos the cheese has got to go in there as well. i know. just to make sure they haven't gone off. @@ -28156,7 +28130,7 @@ then you do another one and put that in there. alright then. heat the oil and fry the onion and garlic until soft but not browned. add the butter and bacon and fry until crisp. -add the and simmer +add the and simmer right. till it has evaporated. meanwhile @@ -28171,7 +28145,7 @@ then drain yes. it with some hot water. beat the eggs with the cheese and the parsley and season to taste with salt and pepper . -don't forget so i could actually start and do the ba , bacon actually couldn't i? +don't forget so i could actually start and do the ba , bacon actually couldn't i? aha. yeah. there a fair amount of parsley in there isn't there? @@ -28183,7 +28157,7 @@ mm! you smelt it? then beat it. right. -two tablespoons of oil so +two tablespoons of oil so is it big enough? yeah. i don't listen to what she does actually. @@ -28191,18 +28165,18 @@ she says it's quite nice. she said something about, she should have added or something but i can't remember what she said. what's hello jenny! -put two tablespoons of in. +put two tablespoons of in. mary, mary, la la la la la ! mary, la la la la la la ! mary do we need a salad? no. you'll need, yes well you'll need a sa -we haven't got a proper salad, i shall have to start ju , shall i leave salad? +we haven't got a proper salad, i shall have to start ju , shall i leave salad? yeah. leave salad for now love, yes. i got some gravy on. -oh yes, we can have some to mop it up, yeah. +oh yes, we can have some to mop it up, yeah. er, now, i asked you the table set haven't i? no. oh! @@ -28223,12 +28197,12 @@ okay. who are the cadbury's creme eggs for? oh! er, i got them, matthews cos he we , that's another one pound fifty he owes me. -to give mrs for the erm but don't tell anybody that i got them, you know. +to give mrs for the erm but don't tell anybody that i got them, you know. cos -to give to mrs for doing the +to give to mrs for doing the yeah. -well he said can i, can you get me three erm walnut whips for mrs and i'll give you money? -well they hadn't got any walnut whips in sainsbury's so i bought some eggs, so . +well he said can i, can you get me three erm walnut whips for mrs and i'll give you money? +well they hadn't got any walnut whips in sainsbury's so i bought some eggs, so . oh! . can i take the salt and pepper through or do you need it? @@ -28239,16 +28213,16 @@ so what, what we do here then elizabeth is the garlic and the onions are done together. we'll do those until it's nice and soft as it said. oh sorry! -erm heat the oil and fry the onion and garlic until soft but not browned. +erm heat the oil and fry the onion and garlic until soft but not browned. add butter, bacon and fry until crisp . -so, see, so, i see so i've got to fry the bacon till it's what? +so, see, so, i see so i've got to fry the bacon till it's what? crisp. -you've got to add the butter and the bacon and then fry them until crisp. -well how am i going to get the ba , how's, how am i going to manage to get the bacon crisp without getting the onions cra brown? +you've got to add the butter and the bacon and then fry them until crisp. +well how am i going to get the ba , how's, how am i going to manage to get the bacon crisp without getting the onions cra brown? well it says add. so presumably you just have it on a low heat. i don't know. -i think you'll find the bacon will cook erm brown +i think you'll find the bacon will cook erm brown mhm. more quickly than your onions will. alright. @@ -28256,36 +28230,36 @@ that's the right amount int mm. it? pardon me! -well yeah. -that's on er with the spaghetti. +well yeah. +that's on er with the spaghetti. you can start on it this year if you like mike! ha! awfully sweet of her isn't it ! -you know, i'm sure the bits of bacon isn't brown. +you know, i'm sure the bits of bacon isn't brown. it's not. this is the first one. it's not. ! the next time i'll just cook it! -i don't suppose you gotta remember about all the which you should have, i mean they they just er be a, a sort of . +i don't suppose you gotta remember about all the which you should have, i mean they they just er be a, a sort of . i know. but they're well dad being a peasant, well maybe -dad sent off some money to the erm help the aged hadn't you mike? +dad sent off some money to the erm help the aged hadn't you mike? have you? yeah. -they sent this thing through costs twelve pounds in a third world country to to have a cataract operation. +they sent this thing through costs twelve pounds in a third world country to to have a cataract operation. mhm. and it's, they've sent this piece of plasticey thing just to look through just the same effect as somebody who's oh! got cataracts. where is it? been sent off now. -but you haven't you got the plastic or anything? +but you haven't you got the plastic or anything? yeah, the plastic's in the bin actually. but, no,we well i don't suppose they want the piece of plastic back. in which bin? -well the one in the erm +well the one in the erm in the living room? dining room. in the living room? @@ -28319,7 +28293,7 @@ we can't do this really till he comes in. oh! he better not go to cheryl's again! i think he has. -i don't he er . +i don't he er . the gammies! mm. does it taste alright? @@ -28331,9 +28305,9 @@ not always. could of done. shall i see if we've got any? well he doesn't always put them in. -well no , don't put out the recipe the way it is way, and then er add. +well no , don't put out the recipe the way it is way, and then er add. make sure that works then you can see if -so much for creative cookery i should think ! +so much for creative cookery i should think ! ah! actually there's, there's enough liquid in here to stop this going brown. that's probably why you have to add the extra butter. @@ -28342,7 +28316,7 @@ my eyes! losing my . i'm going to get cross! ha! -she said don't want everybody to . +she said don't want everybody to . and then says mrs . oh! you can have the wine in . @@ -28353,7 +28327,7 @@ then you say is that right? oh morning derek! you alright ? mummy wants her baby boy home ! -still it may be unfashionable to go for the majority anyway. +still it may be unfashionable to go for the majority anyway. have you just eaten matthew's he's very sandwich again? @@ -28377,7 +28351,7 @@ cos that's gotta be done . is it cooked? yeah. it tastes as though it is. -see i don't want to get it too wet warm it up in a minute can't we? +see i don't want to get it too wet warm it up in a minute can't we? mm. mm! is that finished? @@ -28387,7 +28361,6 @@ alright, i'll go upstairs then. have you tidied your room up a bit? yeah. sort of. - alright. oh it's still going. oh god! @@ -28407,12 +28380,12 @@ that's just here. and? i've got one left. use that one. -have you got a to go with it? +have you got a to go with it? you want to go er so far there. i've got a dart, yeah i've got a name. is it? to be honest with ya, i haven't got a clue. -i don't know where the is. +i don't know where the is. stanwell, are they are a part? stanwell, ask her there? no, yeah. @@ -28446,7 +28419,7 @@ so that's only terry. yeah? yeah, here's one i prepared earlier. -it's on a bit. +it's on a bit. i'm all finished now, i can't do any more. what number's that? erm, as you say @@ -28514,7 +28487,7 @@ can you why? put the corrections in a eh? -perhaps a a +perhaps a a bloody hell! a bracket. well i ain't telling you. @@ -28552,7 +28525,7 @@ durham. oh i see what you mean, i'm following the names clockwise, not the yeah. dots on there. -sorry, er er durham is next, sorry. +sorry, er er durham is next, sorry. on the right, on that picture is bradford. mm mm. you got that er @@ -28581,18 +28554,18 @@ it's durham there. well never mind. durham, right up thanks. -by carlisle, near the abbey. +by carlisle, near the abbey. it's mapped out anyway now. you got molesly twice. mm. -thetford in the little east anglian part of the country. +thetford in the little east anglian part of the country. yeah. -that's the big fat thing that sticks out at the side down there. +that's the big fat thing that sticks out at the side down there. thing, right? a bit like me. shaped a bit like me. right. -next one down in the east midlands is wellingborough. +next one down in the east midlands is wellingborough. how many have got them all right so far then? david. only david. @@ -28600,7 +28573,7 @@ i take it you're marking david's? yeah. alright then. well done david. -well you did something right at er school david. +well you did something right at er school david. this is true. luton. we're having companies on the . @@ -28621,11 +28594,11 @@ a minute. that's wrong. the next one i've put now, i'm going to go out to the east again with maidstone. -hornsea maidstone. +hornsea maidstone. let's do that down there folks. yeah, he's got them all right. mm. -more marks bit tied down to the limit now. +more marks bit tied down to the limit now. croydon. okay. heathrow, right about here. @@ -28635,8 +28608,8 @@ john? byfleet. we're on the, near the m twenty five. stanwell. -up just , just a little bit towards byfleet. -now i'm going to take you to southampton. +up just , just a little bit towards byfleet. +now i'm going to take you to southampton. thanks. yeah, i'll come, across exeter in a minute. it's where the docks are that @@ -28650,9 +28623,9 @@ sorry, llandyssul. i couldn't see i was so llandyssul. far back. -you get lovely don't you? +you get lovely don't you? sort of, lovely, lovely little place there. -got something called the pakistan, they don't give you a a . +got something called the pakistan, they don't give you a a . don't they? they call it , but er i got told off for calling it pakistan. @@ -28664,7 +28637,7 @@ berkshire area. north. show us where birmingham is. after -do you kathy +do you kathy the m four. we're doing well. i put, i put nottingham. @@ -28687,7 +28660,7 @@ yo , you mean you lost birmingham somewhere? no he got cannock and birmingham mixed oh! up. -i tend to +i tend to easy done. er e easily done. cannock is north of birmingham. @@ -28698,7 +28671,7 @@ no. teesside. yep. manchester . -that's a bit, er regionalist +that's a bit, er regionalist sorry. isn't it? are you gonna do the regional accents all the way round. @@ -28706,7 +28679,7 @@ well i'll try. i like this part of the world now, i'm into this bit. i like watching she knows her way around. -i like watching er all quiet on the western front as well cos it all sounds +i like watching er all quiet on the western front as well cos it all sounds and coronation street. yeah. and coronation street as well. @@ -28716,7 +28689,7 @@ yeah? and belfast. i've, i've already covered carlisle have i? yeah. -terry rightly told me i went down the wrong i was looking for names rather than the dots. +terry rightly told me i went down the wrong i was looking for names rather than the dots. carlisle's on the west. surprise surprise ! a bit harder than you thought? @@ -28754,11 +28727,11 @@ write that. is that alright then? i know i've put that on. which one do you want ? -have you got erm jane's +have you got erm jane's yeah, there you go. you've got do i get a bonus point for getting everyone under the south east? -a bit like +a bit like i don't imagine cos you're based in london you got all the m twenty five ones . yeah, i got the lot. @@ -28779,12 +28752,12 @@ jolly good score! next one down from twenty seven? anybody got twenty six? twenty one. -can david know his own roads, i don't know. +can david know his own roads, i don't know. shut up ! yeah . twenty six? twenty five? -have you counted them up so have you? +have you counted them up so have you? yeah? twenty four? twenty three? @@ -28807,14 +28780,14 @@ last night. as i say yo! well done justin. -purposely missing confused of +purposely missing confused of the south east. i got them all wrong on purpose. arsenal weren't down there were they? two down the bottom. all the same arsenal was . -all the same side as the watford gap aren't they? +all the same side as the watford gap aren't they? i got holland and brussels right i mean, holland and brussels that's alright, i got all of them wrong as . @@ -28828,7 +28801,7 @@ not too bad for mm. an indoor sales girl there. cor! -oh that, even thought about that +oh that, even thought about that i'd rather have . is fine. what was that, eighteen? @@ -28888,7 +28861,7 @@ seven? six? five? four? -also i had, put more than that. +also i had, put more than that. i got eight. eight. eight. @@ -28908,8 +28881,8 @@ i think, in their own time at their own expense. that's right. yeah. i just get my bunches of three the wrong way round because i know where they are. -i think before we go. -i know the midlands is in the middle and the south is in the south and +i think before we go. +i know the midlands is in the middle and the south is in the south and not to your customers might be some it isn't. @@ -28924,21 +28897,21 @@ no. you do need to get that's what we need to get very, very, you should have a national map in front of you. -and not just you don't want just our depots, you want them in relation +and not just you don't want just our depots, you want them in relation that's the thing you see the to their customers there. a lot of them places yo , they're not sort of like famous are they? -you know byfleet and hornsea and +you know byfleet and hornsea and they are to us. yeah they are to us but they're extremely famous to us justin. manchester was a nobody until we put a depot in it. hornsea is famous justin. -no, i don't mean that, i mean yo , it's not a popular,yo like a -to start looking for cannock +no, i don't mean that, i mean yo , it's not a popular,yo like a +to start looking for cannock just because byfleet -on saturday +on saturday byfleet doesn't have a premiere football team doesn't mean to say no. it's not famous. @@ -28956,14 +28929,14 @@ it's in stockport. yeah, it's not even in manchester. i know. but you're right. -so now the south east most of those depots that you're looking at cannock isn't in cannock. +so now the south east most of those depots that you're looking at cannock isn't in cannock. no. so, what i'm saying is they're just th , they're, they're, it's just for er the biggest place near it. the biggest place near it. now what -i'm saying is, is you ought to get very close to that geographical map because it's the logistic logistics er difficulty with getting, and you ought to know where there are mountains and where there are valleys and the fact that that, in south wales they can't just go across country, they have to go back down the valley after the m four and up again. -cos we're driving lorries, we're not driving little, you know trial bikes that go over mountains like the brecons and stuff, you have to +i'm saying is, is you ought to get very close to that geographical map because it's the logistic logistics er difficulty with getting, and you ought to know where there are mountains and where there are valleys and the fact that that, in south wales they can't just go across country, they have to go back down the valley after the m four and up again. +cos we're driving lorries, we're not driving little, you know trial bikes that go over mountains like the brecons and stuff, you have to but we do use the sheep in some ways don't we? that's right, that's right, we do use the sheep . but not for @@ -28971,7 +28944,7 @@ no. the sake of the . no, right. what -what i'm saying is, you know, you can't go from stirling to aberdeen in a couple of minutes. +what i'm saying is, you know, you can't go from stirling to aberdeen in a couple of minutes. that's big country up there. and so there's a big mountain range running up the middle of the country, someone thought once was the english channel. well that's okay cos we've got a tunnel now. @@ -28981,7 +28954,7 @@ the english channel, not the pennines. but they're going where's the pennines? erm what i'm saying is i'd say i don't know where it is at all. -i am saying to you now folks become familiar with the erm depots. +i am saying to you now folks become familiar with the erm depots. now what about the depot numbers? no idea. no. @@ -28994,7 +28967,7 @@ write them onto your sheets. aberdeen, thirty nine. yep. and you have corrected your sheets haven't you? -you've got all the right ones next to the +you've got all the right ones next to the mandy's put them on a nice new sheet ain't ya? yeah, well done. aberdeen, thirty nine. @@ -29124,7 +29097,7 @@ deeside. where's cannock? i missed that as well. thirty four. -the man in the back says so. +the man in the back says so. deeside, forty seven. mm mm! manchester? @@ -29133,13 +29106,13 @@ forty nine. forty nine. that was the last,, i should have been market trader, been shouting out that voice and that's, well -he's like chubby int he? +he's like chubby int he? ramsbottom? thirty. belfast? thirty five. erm -on belfast i've been told, and and my oversight, beg your pardon, that erm i mentioned the four regional +on belfast i've been told, and and my oversight, beg your pardon, that erm i mentioned the four regional the branch that . managers. because of the nature of that, that @@ -29151,16 +29124,16 @@ because okay. i talked about four regional managers, they were mainland u k. er, brian , is also a regional director for belfast and the serving areas of belfast as well, okay? -he has sole responsibility for belfast, but he does have regional directors going to but brian tends to cover a general manager role and with with erm dick ma ,. -no, not dick , who's in er belfast? +he has sole responsibility for belfast, but he does have regional directors going to but brian tends to cover a general manager role and with with erm dick ma ,. +no, not dick , who's in er belfast? tom, tom . yeah. -and er himself, run the belfast operation across all the regions. +and er himself, run the belfast operation across all the regions. but sometimes, because he doesn't have hundreds of depots i think he's not regional, but that's my own fault. -brian is the northern ireland region. +brian is the northern ireland region. well done. do get a, er buy a map, spend some money to get one. -you may have in your depot you may have in your depot a map which have pinpointed the t n t depots. +you may have in your depot you may have in your depot a map which have pinpointed the t n t depots. does any, has anybody seen one yet? yeah. the big wa waterproof one which you can draw on? @@ -29170,23 +29143,23 @@ they're, er, well they're not waterproof well but they're coated aren't they? er, so you can wipe them clean if er, you use a special pen. -but, what i'm saying is, if you, salesmen particularly get one, you'll need one to get round the country your patch, but you need to get familiar with the towns up and down the country for deli , for delivery, cos your customers will talk about the area and you're talking to someone from a transport café, you haven't got a clue where the towns are. +but, what i'm saying is, if you, salesmen particularly get one, you'll need one to get round the country your patch, but you need to get familiar with the towns up and down the country for deli , for delivery, cos your customers will talk about the area and you're talking to someone from a transport café, you haven't got a clue where the towns are. i mean, you know, where's your credibility? -and write down erm it. -i know north of border, nothing happens south of the border and like but, but we do deliver down here so do, do give yourself a little practise of that. -now i'm going to ask you to do another little test for me. +and write down erm it. +i know north of border, nothing happens south of the border and like but, but we do deliver down here so do, do give yourself a little practise of that. +now i'm going to ask you to do another little test for me. simple questions, ten questions, alright? do you want ta , tidy up your little bit of paper out the way again? and there's ten questions about the conditions of carriage. name on the top of the list. -now how many people have not seen a list of the +now how many people have not seen a list of the carriage yet? er erm nobody. i think i have not. you haven't paul? i don't think so. -it's the of the company and fax it. +it's the of the company and fax it. i'll look in mine tomorrow. you think you have? see @@ -29205,18 +29178,18 @@ better put your name at the top of the page as well. we'll go through the answers anyway. instead of just spouting at me, i'd just like you all to engage brain with . do you do, i've got one wrong. -alright, just make some notes and stuff that you've got already. +alright, just make some notes and stuff that you've got already. right. i got lost . -what happens in is you do have the people in that area in the first few weeks . +what happens in is you do have the people in that area in the first few weeks . . the customer is same there. -the same as in c. +the same as in c. . finished? pass it to your neighbour and once again. ? -well i've read a few of the , it's just a case of remembering the precise details. +well i've read a few of the , it's just a case of remembering the precise details. cos i, i, know, i know it means roughly in common terms cos, i got a sister to interpret it. finishing her law degree. alright. @@ -29224,7 +29197,7 @@ come round the corner and that no it's not, it's pass, pass your one it's just remembering what's actually on the sheet. -and then it's mine one, pass it down to +and then it's mine one, pass it down to is it pass it twice? yeah, pass it round again. @@ -29246,14 +29219,14 @@ well they, well er, no it's feet u k national let me just da dish this out. and it's do you want to score that for me? -centimetres for worldwide and euro. +centimetres for worldwide and euro. let's score the paper then we'll go through the er i'm sorry. i got number one. ah? i sa i said i got number one. -that's what i wrote but i thought, i didn't put that, it didn't exactly right . -but still, if you , but definitely if you feel like that and it goes +that's what i wrote but i thought, i didn't put that, it didn't exactly right . +but still, if you , but definitely if you feel like that and it goes it's the t n t express. i don't think it was right. it is! @@ -29262,7 +29235,7 @@ look! there! oh. this is the trouble isn't it? -but some are good, especially . +but some are good, especially . kathy, is it you might be buying more. have you just got to sort of like the, these open to interpretation, or has it got to be word for word? @@ -29273,7 +29246,7 @@ yeah. good one. do a tick and a cross if you, interpret it, interpret it the way you want to. if, if you think, hang on -that doesn't sound right we'll discuss the answer as we go round and we'll have a group +that doesn't sound right we'll discuss the answer as we go round and we'll have a group i've got the questions wrong here. have another go then. there yours, take those. @@ -29318,7 +29291,7 @@ got to be strict. it's not very good. once you done the fifteenth , i bought you one. -that's all +that's all what was this? going to. definite. @@ -29341,7 +29314,7 @@ one place to another thing. the one time, one load. classified being a consignment. from one address to another if is the important thing. -yeah, plus it was +yeah, plus it was the important fact was covered in that . who's got that? i'll give you that. @@ -29394,11 +29367,11 @@ mm. him thinking in terms and conditions of carriage. yeah. yo , you wouldn't have just put the carrier normally would you? -that's what i'm saying, so er, just er interpretation of the question slightly misleading there. +that's what i'm saying, so er, just er interpretation of the question slightly misleading there. right. no worries. what is a definition of a consignment? -now if you get these right, word for word you'll be er, i do conditions of carriage quizzes on selling skills courses and the amount of people that get this right i can count on one hand in the last three years. +now if you get these right, word for word you'll be er, i do conditions of carriage quizzes on selling skills courses and the amount of people that get this right i can count on one hand in the last three years. who got it right? david. word for word? @@ -29450,19 +29423,19 @@ i , those, those points are all valid. if there's i missed that. a group of parcels going in two loads it's two -i put and i crossed it outside. +i put and i crossed it outside. two loads. consignments. consignments. -if it's going erm +if it's going erm to different . to two different i got that one. addresses it's two consignments. that's what i meant. if it goes at different times, it's a different consignment. -so in, parcel or parcels, going from one address to another at one time in one load that is a consignment. -if you just say erm a group of parcels er er, in one load that's not enough cos it can be +so in, parcel or parcels, going from one address to another at one time in one load that is a consignment. +if you just say erm a group of parcels er er, in one load that's not enough cos it can be yeah i know. part of a load. i missed out the from address to address. @@ -29470,10 +29443,10 @@ one address to one address. it's yeah. quite er distinct what i di ,a what you'll be determined as. -cos some people er er may think, you know, the agreement because i have split the load you can still charge me the same price and it may not be the case. +cos some people er er may think, you know, the agreement because i have split the load you can still charge me the same price and it may not be the case. right. next one. -what's the question ja andy? +what's the question ja andy? what is the cus , sorry, what should what should the customer provide prior to the collection of a consignment? @@ -29481,13 +29454,13 @@ what was some of the answers there? janey's put, name, address, from another consignment note filled out and service requirement and weight of the consignment. yeah. -so what we were looking for was something more er erm +so what we were looking for was something more er erm did i answer that one? no. i didn't get round to it. anybody get what we were looking for in the, yes you should? what should the customer provide prior to the collection of a consignment? -well obviously the delivery name and address is important and the consignments, so you didn't get that wrong but there was, what we were looking for as well a full written declaration of the nature of contents of any consignment containing dangerous infested, contaminated +well obviously the delivery name and address is important and the consignments, so you didn't get that wrong but there was, what we were looking for as well a full written declaration of the nature of contents of any consignment containing dangerous infested, contaminated aha. or fragile goods. in other words, is there anything, did anybody pick up @@ -29502,7 +29475,7 @@ i did a part of it. oh i reckon justin's got enough cos what -he's got times +he's got times time when ready, weight, number of packages, destination, and then haz well done. @@ -29514,14 +29487,14 @@ well done. because, how can i say even, even i take we've, you'll see, i mean there's a, not a very good illustration of a, the hub with the yellow walls of the, the conveyer belt behind you, but you can see the fairly plain packaging that parcels come in. -the more, er er sophisticated erm wholesale er distributors now know that people just pick up from stock a box don't they? -and, they may have one display displayed, but if you go to somewhere like a warehouse or distribution where you go round and pick up your you can go to a garden you'll pick up a box that's illustrating a flymo lawn mower or something and, and it'll, er they spend a lot of time and money on the packaging, but, a lot of people for pilferage reasons don't illustrate and that's good practise not to illustrate, from our point of view, what's on the package. +the more, er er sophisticated erm wholesale er distributors now know that people just pick up from stock a box don't they? +and, they may have one display displayed, but if you go to somewhere like a warehouse or distribution where you go round and pick up your you can go to a garden you'll pick up a box that's illustrating a flymo lawn mower or something and, and it'll, er they spend a lot of time and money on the packaging, but, a lot of people for pilferage reasons don't illustrate and that's good practise not to illustrate, from our point of view, what's on the package. but you must know what's in it. -just knowing the size and the weight isn't, you might, that's alright, that's only for the price what's in it is vital because if i asked the sales people from their top ten major customers what do you carry for them? +just knowing the size and the weight isn't, you might, that's alright, that's only for the price what's in it is vital because if i asked the sales people from their top ten major customers what do you carry for them? do reme , can yo , can i, can you guess at how many would say i don't know? major customers. half a dozen. -it's a lo , i, i'd sa , they wouldn't admit it bill, they might say something like erm oh it's electronics, but they wouldn't know specifically what electronic. +it's a lo , i, i'd sa , they wouldn't admit it bill, they might say something like erm oh it's electronics, but they wouldn't know specifically what electronic. would that not cause er security problems if you put exactly what was on the box. you don't put , you shouldn't, but you should know. you should declare it. @@ -29554,7 +29527,7 @@ did you accept it paul? it got one. yeah. yeah, you did? -yeah about lifting equipment? +yeah about lifting equipment? about power lifting equipment. yeah i'd accept that. cup of tea for the driver. @@ -29563,11 +29536,11 @@ cup of tea, sustenance , yeah. what we actually put is, er, it is the responsibility in the conditions of carriage. it is a responsibility. where would you find the conditions of carriage. -on the back of every erm contract out there. +on the back of every erm contract out there. on the back of every contract. -because it is subject to the conditions of carriage that we accept their business and therefore we have to provide them with written information. +because it is subject to the conditions of carriage that we accept their business and therefore we have to provide them with written information. now, it is down to interpretation i er er and, it, on your next courses you may do a more in-depth conditions of carriage quiz which will ask you to study the conditions of carriage at night and produce a bit more detailed answer in the morning, but we're not gonna expect you to do that on this course. -erm, number five erm can you read that out for me mandy? +erm, number five erm can you read that out for me mandy? what, sorry, go on. go on. when would you cube a consignment? @@ -29595,24 +29568,24 @@ if you've got a load , if you it's a good point. if you've got a er more consignments on it. -dead we or gross weight +dead we or gross weight yes. well and the big package -that would have meant +that would have meant then it go in , in a large that's correct. dimensions then you cube it. we're gonna do cubing in a minute, do a few exercises on cubing. yes, i mean,je mandy said er, if we've got any consignment which exceeds one point five cubic feet per ten kilos. but you usually know don't you if -it's lower than that actually but er sorry +it's lower than that actually but er sorry mm mm. it isn't. i, i said, yeah a cubic foot, is se , six point six then. that's probably right, yeah. one point five per ten kilos. -you can usually tell when you get used to it and we're gonna talk about visual identity in a minute, but when the mass seems greater overly large to the weight is what er jen , sorry mandy said, and i think that's a good er er a good er analogy there. +you can usually tell when you get used to it and we're gonna talk about visual identity in a minute, but when the mass seems greater overly large to the weight is what er jen , sorry mandy said, and i think that's a good er er a good er analogy there. i got if erm, if the size is greater than the weight actually. yes. i got that. @@ -29639,7 +29612,7 @@ janey got it right. ton per cu , well it's per cubic metre i know. yes. -because in my last job that's +because in my last job that's three feet. how you worked it out, we didn't work with feet. we worked in metres. @@ -29652,7 +29625,7 @@ i dunno, i mean, i got a metre, no , it's not a ton. and if you do a cubic metre, in my old yeah but yo -it was one, it was like one one ton per cubic metre. +it was one, it was like one one ton per cubic metre. that's when you used to work in weight and measure though isn't it? yeah. we do , plus a thousand @@ -29664,7 +29637,7 @@ we always wo we tend to go back to feet i must say. yeah. but i don't know why? -unless it's euro or international and then it's in metres. +unless it's euro or international and then it's in metres. what are you refer , what are you referring to that one, that, what does that that's for loading containers? that's what you ship in . @@ -29677,9 +29650,9 @@ international. no. it's not the same. that's what containers do don't they? -they seal containers and export it to different er ratio. -but the cubic idea is the same, but it's six point six cu , kilos per cubic foot. -so a metre would be about three it's a cubic metre. +they seal containers and export it to different er ratio. +but the cubic idea is the same, but it's six point six cu , kilos per cubic foot. +so a metre would be about three it's a cubic metre. we'll work on that one. gotta be nine , nine. @@ -29723,27 +29696,27 @@ and a show of hands. does everybody understand a lot of people. what consequential loss is or indirect loss? -you lose the parcel but it's end up for example in the, they used a contractor at the other end because we lost the parcel but they're not responsible for that. +you lose the parcel but it's end up for example in the, they used a contractor at the other end because we lost the parcel but they're not responsible for that. we'll just take the blame for it. if, yeah, we don't and erm insure documents anyway. -we don't er offer transit liability on documents because we only that is a flat piece of paper to us, it isn't a valuable item. +we don't er offer transit liability on documents because we only that is a flat piece of paper to us, it isn't a valuable item. we don't con , the, you know, what the arrangement is. mm. if it's your marriage contract and you don't get married because you don't got, that's not our fault. -we just cos we don't ins , it's only a piece of paper to us, you see. +we just cos we don't ins , it's only a piece of paper to us, you see. so documents do not get transit liability on them at all. and tenders and deadlines can be particularly sensitive to that, but you cannot offer transit liability. -but even if this tape is going to record the last speech of somebody famous and it didn't get and therefore they couldn't record it, that is co , the consequence of a delay, you know, a fall of snow or our vehicle breaking down or something not being done, or missed some in human, some human error, it's not our, we don't lay, we'll give, we'll insure or offer transit liability on the value of the goods providing you've got additional full transit liability with us, but we won't for the loss of business because you didn't get it. -is that, can anybody think of a, a courier of documents, it's still the same. -i think that's why super mail offers on large goods. +but even if this tape is going to record the last speech of somebody famous and it didn't get and therefore they couldn't record it, that is co , the consequence of a delay, you know, a fall of snow or our vehicle breaking down or something not being done, or missed some in human, some human error, it's not our, we don't lay, we'll give, we'll insure or offer transit liability on the value of the goods providing you've got additional full transit liability with us, but we won't for the loss of business because you didn't get it. +is that, can anybody think of a, a courier of documents, it's still the same. +i think that's why super mail offers on large goods. mm. it's better than one. mm. mhm. yes. -no we don't do ta , erm the conditions of ca , there's, there's a slight sort of +no we don't do ta , erm the conditions of ca , there's, there's a slight sort of on conditions of carriage for the same day operation but, not in that league at all. on super mail, if that item doesn't arrive in a set time mm mm. @@ -29766,7 +29739,7 @@ yeah sorry if it, if it was like you say yeah. -if they us , if they use a contractor +if they us , if they use a contractor that's what they're, what we're saying. you might, you might get and that sort of from the policy. @@ -29774,21 +29747,21 @@ you might get it no. for nothing. well er -cos but erm +cos but erm but they still go there now. yeah i know, but our sort of van what would it cost? or -like +like carrier like the local land owner at the house of lords can do that. i'll buy you a . yeah but, she didn't say these are all wrong once i look at yeah. the board. paper. -most of them would cos they are going like far -and everyone's . -you've seen people see +most of them would cos they are going like far +and everyone's . +you've seen people see we only, we only insure i didn't say what the license is. we only insure for the intrinsic value of @@ -29805,11 +29778,11 @@ i mean, well it'll probably arrive, it'll turn up somewhere won't it really? but se could do. i mean send another one is what we're saying, have your money back. -if you haven't got the you should be okay. +if you haven't got the you should be okay. or if it arrived, if you paid for a before one customer should expect it to arrive then -noon and it er +noon and it er i mean, same ta super mail, we wouldn't give them their money back. i think that's a bit more than that now. but if you ordered a ten thirty delivery and it arrived before noon, we would just give you the money difference the before twe , ten thirty and the before noon price, not the complete price. @@ -29819,19 +29792,18 @@ and therefore, we have incurred cost and therefore, but okay, it wasn't the guar but you could argue with us, you know. and again, a commercial decision is made locally based on the strength of the account. but we don't, you've gotta be careful as you probably know phil, the abuse can of the ca , you know, carrier, you know, can be a nice little earner if you're not careful. -and, you know, erm people can intend to fail in order to claim money, revenue back, and so on. +and, you know, erm people can intend to fail in order to claim money, revenue back, and so on. d'ya know or damaged goods can, you know, put the foot through it to get the insurance cover on what we pay and we're liable. so you've got to be very, very, very careful. having said that if you, there's been a court of law we'd prob , if, they'd probably erm - sustainability, viability, as in a conceptual sense, and i would also like to suggest that in pushing this discussion forward we ought to bear in mind the, how shall i say it, the principles as espoused by the department of the environment in their planning policy guidance note three, er and in particular those spelt out in paragraph thirty three. and those if you would, for those who have not got them available, erm, we can have them copied and obtain them for you, but i suspect all of all of you sitting round the table will have p p g with you. . anyone short of a copy of p p g three, paragraph thirty three particularly? it's the one prepared for the submission . for those tha who are not to familiar with, the initials p p g, it stands for planning policy guidance, and there are a whole series of these guidance notes produced by the department of the environment for the er advice guidance of, well not only the local planning authorities but anyone else who is interested in the development business, and they are expressions of, i suppose government policy, er and their attitudes towards various aspects, whether it's countryside, housing,trans or transport, and they do pro provide a useful backcloth, in fact an extremely valuable backcloth to the way in which er this matter should be considered, erm i know from the submission which north yorkshire county council have used they would say that the fact they haven't had regard to all this er, but i would like to carry on the discussion against that background, and could you direct your thinking at this stage about the need for a new settlement in the light of the principles spelt out in p p g three and particularly paragraph thirty three. -now then, can we proceed to mr brighton. +now then, can we proceed to mr brighton. sorry, mr donson first? yes, thank you. roy donson, house builders' federation. @@ -29849,8 +29821,8 @@ yes i do find that there's a general thread,an an an and and one would expect th i think also we ought to be guarded about too much detailed discussion of travel distances, we are talking here at most of travel distances of between six and ten miles, in keeping with the policy, erm it seems to me that erm if we we spend too much time on trying to determine whether six or ten miles distant, is is there any great significance in terms of the global environment it would be at least an unproved case, one way or the other, but also there seems to me to be a clear conflict in those who are trying to say that the new settlement proposal falls because not large enough of a site is being proposed, one way and another. it would seem to me that if you've got to prove a case that there that it is the place of last resort, and that place of last resort has got to be at least five thousand dwellings, you are in a place where there is absolute massive growth of demand, and improbably no one has been able to meet a five year supply of housing land, if you are to meet it in the term, if y if those are the criteria to meeting the terms of th of this sort of plan, and in fact what i would submit is that a new settlement solution is very much a part and parcel of a long term solution, and that's where essentially the county strategy is quite right in proposing a new settlement in the context of the greenbelt, because also greenbelt is a long term solution. we've got to look at it in those terms, and so it is not necessary in my submission for anyone to prove at the moment there is at least five thousand dwellings short, erm that that is something which ought to be considered over a much longer time period. -i think that what we have to decide today, or one of the things that needs to be decided is, is the new settlement in the longer term a sensible answer given that all the all the various considerations, and that erm arguing about residual numbers, here or there has to be taken in the much longer context, i think that's what all i would like the to say at the moment on on new settlement erm because of the situation i am in of not being able to er say too much in detail about it, i shan't be making very many contributions to to this particular debate. -can i come back mr donson, or will that, and i take it, alright, i understand the point you are making about the long term solution and size, but if the panel were to be persuaded that to be a viable solution the settlement had, in the end, and i'm not going to define where the end is, almost certainly beyond two thousand and six, that the settlement would need to be of the order of five thousand dwellings. +i think that what we have to decide today, or one of the things that needs to be decided is, is the new settlement in the longer term a sensible answer given that all the all the various considerations, and that erm arguing about residual numbers, here or there has to be taken in the much longer context, i think that's what all i would like the to say at the moment on on new settlement erm because of the situation i am in of not being able to er say too much in detail about it, i shan't be making very many contributions to to this particular debate. +can i come back mr donson, or will that, and i take it, alright, i understand the point you are making about the long term solution and size, but if the panel were to be persuaded that to be a viable solution the settlement had, in the end, and i'm not going to define where the end is, almost certainly beyond two thousand and six, that the settlement would need to be of the order of five thousand dwellings. do you consider it important that we take that into account now, not least because of the, although it's well beyond the plan in its entirety, where the new settlement might go, and its its acceptability in environmental terms, depends in part on how big it is, there may be some places which could easily take fifteen hundred dwellings, but could not take five thousand? that seems to me to be a consideration which may be able to address in general terms by yourselves, but depends very much on the individual proposals, and and erm is is a matter of detail of the individual proposals, i'm sure that you don't want presented here the the fine detail of of individual proposals indeed not. @@ -29861,18 +29833,18 @@ paul brighton, barton willmore planning partnership. can i say first of all that er i support the general approach which has been adopted by yorkshire county council and the the other local authorities in the greater york area, on the way in which they've formulated their proposals for the york greenbelt after a fairly long erm and exhausting process, the question to which i want to address my comments first of all is whether the new settlement is an appropriate and justified planning response, and what i would like to do if i may is look at some of the reasons that have been raised erm in objection to the new settlement as a strategy, erm these issues have been raised by hambledon district, york city council, the c p r e, montague evans, in their written submissions to the examination of the . first of all, erm, if we c could, erm, the question of need. the first element of need is erm the various estimates of commitments of potential land, erm and the argument is, erm, that the additional requirement can actually be met within the inner area, now we covered that at some length this morning, and refer to what we've had said on that in a bit, i don't propose to repeat it. -likewise, part of the argument also revolves around possibility that in additional land within the inner greenbelt boundary, and again you've heard our argument on that this morning, and i don't propose to to repeat that. +likewise, part of the argument also revolves around possibility that in additional land within the inner greenbelt boundary, and again you've heard our argument on that this morning, and i don't propose to to repeat that. a new point that i would make, however, in many of those arguments which relate to the impossible, or alleged availability of additional windfall sites, and land on the inner greenbelt boundary, but i think the analysis which is er carried out is a simplistic one, because it solely relates to residential land requirements, there is no erm attempt to erm bring into the equation whether there is land available for the related employment necessary for that additional residential development, whether there is land available for schools, shops, and mr davis's recreation uses, and so on, and all those will very considerably increase the amount of land required to be released to support residential development, wherever it is located, and that is something which i believe has not been properly taken into account. the second major issue which i believe had been used against the new settlement as a an appropriate greater york area, is that it's inconsistent with erm current recent central government planning advice, and basically the argument is that the proposals for the new settlement are contrary to er planning policy guidance notes three and twelve, and draft er p p g thirteen, if i can deal with p p g thirteen first of all, and the observation of mr curtis that the new settlement is a last resort, erm now i could find no reference to that at all erm in p p g three, or even a sentiment that at planning policy er that a new settlement should be regarded erm as a policy of last resort. my believe is what p p g is inviting local authorities to do is be cautious in proposing them, they should not be regarded as a first option, or an easy option, they should be cautious in proposing them. -special circumstances are required to justify the er proposing the new settlement through the local plan structure planning process, and i believe that is exactly what has occurred over the last five years, and if i could just quickly run through paragraph thirty three of p p g three, and the your invitation for us to comment on the criteria set out there, first of all the first element, the ex the alternative must be erm seen to be a less satisfactory method of providing land for the new housing that is needed, that is the essence of what has occurred in the process which the county council has undertaken over the last couple of years, all of the policy options available have been examined in great detail, have been subject to public consultation, public participation,d i believe clear view was that there were erm constraints operating on york which meant that not all of that additional development accommodated in the adjacent to the existing er york city villages surrounding york. +special circumstances are required to justify the er proposing the new settlement through the local plan structure planning process, and i believe that is exactly what has occurred over the last five years, and if i could just quickly run through paragraph thirty three of p p g three, and the your invitation for us to comment on the criteria set out there, first of all the first element, the ex the alternative must be erm seen to be a less satisfactory method of providing land for the new housing that is needed, that is the essence of what has occurred in the process which the county council has undertaken over the last couple of years, all of the policy options available have been examined in great detail, have been subject to public consultation, public participation,d i believe clear view was that there were erm constraints operating on york which meant that not all of that additional development accommodated in the adjacent to the existing er york city villages surrounding york. the second requirement is that it should be a clear expression of local preference afforded by the local planning authorities, my i think the fact that it has been promoted by the greater york authorities, albeit some of them have erm taken a slightly different view of late, i think that is clear expression that the local, that the new settlement proposal does have a substantial local support. the third element and the fourth element erm i i think relate more to location questions to do with the new settlement, and i propose to deal with those under the legal heading of two c, the next item is that the proposal can be considered alongside policies of restraint, and that is exactly how the proposal for the new settlement has emerged, it is a response to the er proposed greenbelt around york city, and obviously we can put in the greenbelt that there is severe erm policies of restraint operating at er on on the terms of new development. -finally, the last consideration, again i believe that to be a location question which i propose to deal with under the heading two c. +finally, the last consideration, again i believe that to be a location question which i propose to deal with under the heading two c. so the new settlement is one element of a comprehensive approach to development employments in greater york. i would make the point that it has taken thirty five years for us to reach this point where we have comprehensive strategy for york, we have battled with er various greenbelt boundaries in the past, i think there has never been erm a total review development plan requirements for the greater york area, no more of its implications on possible greenbelt boundaries, we now have that and the greenbelt local plan, southern ryedale local plans are being progressed on the basis of that strategy, and there are other plans in the pipeline. and i think the special character and position of the york as one of this country's most important historic, historic towns fully justifies the exceptional step of new settlement. -the second planning policy guidance note which erm the new settlement tracked as was the policy guidance note number twelve, and i wonder if i can grapple for a moment with the s word, sustainable. +the second planning policy guidance note which erm the new settlement tracked as was the policy guidance note number twelve, and i wonder if i can grapple for a moment with the s word, sustainable. it's a word which everyone is using and it's almost like confetti. i i'm not sure that we've had a very helpful description of what sustainable means, erm i suspect people use it in different ways and ther there is no er er common usage established of what it means here, there is no dictionary definition. i've scoured the the technical professional press to find out if there is some general statement which sums up what sustainability means, and the one which i've seen most commonly referred to, i think, and the government has used it in this way, is a requirement to ensure the needs of the present generation are met in a way which does not prejudice future generations, now i do not believe that a properly conceived and located new settlement is any less sustainable in the long term that other forms of urban growth, and by properly conceived i've got to say i believe that to mean properly balanced er form of development for the new settlement, and i think i would say that new settlements have usually been proposed because continued infilling, like the the normal forms of accommodating further development requirements, infill, and peripheral development, have been determined in york context not to be sustainable, the sorts of issues which arise as a result erm of additional development in or on the edge of york and the surrounding villages, problems of additional congestion, loss of green space in towns, loss of employment opportunities and so on. @@ -29882,14 +29854,14 @@ and finally, if we can look at erm, i think the c p r e have raised this, that e first of all if one looks at the draft advice on the erm regional plan guidance prepared by the yorkshire and humberside local planning authorities, they in fact advocate new settlement as an appropriate circumstances, there is not a policy which says that they are not appropriate or are inconsistent with other policy objectives, and i note in that respect that the d o e as mr donson said, are mildly supportive of the new settlement in the greater york area. there is some comment has been made that a new settlement to the south or the south west of york would in some way undermine the urban regeneration erm of leeds city council, now i find this a surprising comment given that though people who are making that comment are also at the same time advocating much increased development allocations to, for example, harrogate district, the main centre for which is erm, nearer than most conceivable new settlement locations to the south and south west of york. in addition i think there's some inconsistency, because within selby district, for example, a lot of development which has been advocated in the past and is likely to be allocated in the future is in places like selby or sherburn in elmet, which again are much nearer to leeds erm than potential new settlement sites to the south and south, south west of york, and yet objection has been raised to er that particular erm element in the planning strategy for selby, and i i can't see the reason why a new settlement should be treated in any different way to any other form of development in that sense. -now you've also invited comments on er the question of whether one settlement is appropriate, and the size of the settlement do you want, would you like to take my comment +now you've also invited comments on er the question of whether one settlement is appropriate, and the size of the settlement do you want, would you like to take my comment well i was trying to stick with the size as an expression of whether the concept is one that should be pursued, and whether that influences the pursuing of the concept, can we can we leave the, the number of settlements till, till later on? right. i think erm there is some dispute as to erm what size the new settlement must be to become what's termed an integrated and balanced community, and given the importance of this issue, and it has been with us for the last three years, ever since the new settlement was first proposed, erm i find it very surprising that north yorkshire county council have not undertaken any work of their own on this subject area, and have relied instead on a a residual approach to to find the new settlement size, and i must say i find that very unsatisfactory, what north yorkshire county council are inviting you, erm, to accept is whatever size the residual for greater york is, you know, has been in the past i should say, proposals from the public, from the private sector have come forward,an and the county council have used those proposals as confirmation that the new settlement of that particular size was viable, it's a sort of self fulfilling prophecy, now i think that's unacceptable, what they haven't done is the second part of the technical exercise, which is to to look at the thresholds of the various services and facilities required in the new settlement. -now i am able to say that barton willmore has done this work, and it has submitted as part of our submission to the e i p, and in summary what i would say is that i believe that that work demonstrates that the new settlement has to be in the order of two thousand to two thousand five hundred dwellings, to begin to achieve the environmental objectives set for the new settlement, and also social objectives which would also be important to the residents of that new settlement. -now north yorkshire county council er i think in their statement look to erm to existing market towns to provide what little evidence they can up to justify fourteen hundred dwellings, er i think that's again a simplistic approach because by definition the market now can seal them up wider catchment area, many of them are some distance from york, and the settlements concerned provide a service base for a number of surrounding villages, and therefore the actual specialities and services found within that particular settlement are greater than one would achieve if it did not have a large catchment area. +now i am able to say that barton willmore has done this work, and it has submitted as part of our submission to the e i p, and in summary what i would say is that i believe that that work demonstrates that the new settlement has to be in the order of two thousand to two thousand five hundred dwellings, to begin to achieve the environmental objectives set for the new settlement, and also social objectives which would also be important to the residents of that new settlement. +now north yorkshire county council er i think in their statement look to erm to existing market towns to provide what little evidence they can up to justify fourteen hundred dwellings, er i think that's again a simplistic approach because by definition the market now can seal them up wider catchment area, many of them are some distance from york, and the settlements concerned provide a service base for a number of surrounding villages, and therefore the actual specialities and services found within that particular settlement are greater than one would achieve if it did not have a large catchment area. but finally, i would like to make one comment about the er the residual approach used to define the new settlement size. -i think there is a tendency erm for local authority planners to to have horizons set by the end date of the current plan period, and work, try and work in that, sort of around the real world i think, where nothing happens, or nothing is conceivable, beyond that time period, erm, this particular approach, er does not work in the case of new settlements, there is no need when having established your design size for a new settlement that it necessarily all has to be built within current plan period, and i think this sort of approach is recognized in cambridgeshire where, in case of the a forty five new settlement, a view was taken at an early stage that a new settlement of three thousand dwellings was needed to meet long term development needs in cambridgeshire, an area where the planning issues and problems where very similar to those of york, and the approved structure plan in policy proposed that new settlement to be designated as three thousand, of which two thousand portion would be built within the current plan period, so it seems to me that the the question of size need not be an impediment to erm designation of a new settlement if the existing requirement and need are adjudged not to require the sort of new settlement size that we are creating. +i think there is a tendency erm for local authority planners to to have horizons set by the end date of the current plan period, and work, try and work in that, sort of around the real world i think, where nothing happens, or nothing is conceivable, beyond that time period, erm, this particular approach, er does not work in the case of new settlements, there is no need when having established your design size for a new settlement that it necessarily all has to be built within current plan period, and i think this sort of approach is recognized in cambridgeshire where, in case of the a forty five new settlement, a view was taken at an early stage that a new settlement of three thousand dwellings was needed to meet long term development needs in cambridgeshire, an area where the planning issues and problems where very similar to those of york, and the approved structure plan in policy proposed that new settlement to be designated as three thousand, of which two thousand portion would be built within the current plan period, so it seems to me that the the question of size need not be an impediment to erm designation of a new settlement if the existing requirement and need are adjudged not to require the sort of new settlement size that we are creating. thank you. thank you very much. mr brighton, erm before i turn to another speaker, your comment about the location of a new settlement, and the likely effect it would have on the west yorkshire conurbation, er i presume from what you've said is that effectively the new settlement, if you have one, its location should be such as to serve the needs of york and greater york, and therefore the further it is away from the west yorkshire conurbation, or the west side of north yorkshire, the more likely it is to fulfil that function. @@ -30019,7 +29991,7 @@ well they've not warmed them up. if i'd known you was coming i would have done that bit of chicken. i've got some sausage rolls here. i needed some change so i got two sausage rolls, i'm gonna wire them up on microwave in a bit right? -er mixed with some beans and +er mixed with some beans and er got bread bill. oh aye . oh what's, what's the difference between a penis and a works bonus? @@ -30033,12 +30005,12 @@ yeah. yeah. er why d why do women parachutists wear jockstraps? to stop them whistling on the way down. -tt -told that one as well and why, why do oh what's other one? -why why don't blind people parachute? +tt +told that one as well and why, why do oh what's other one? +why why don't blind people parachute? don't know. scares the shit out of guide dogs. -cos i read these in a paper and i thought hey these are very good ones here, i thought i'll get them, i'll remember them. +cos i read these in a paper and i thought hey these are very good ones here, i thought i'll get them, i'll remember them. you get worse. it's like our albert, he tells that many jokes i can never remember half of what he tells me. he told me one twice @@ -30046,22 +30018,22 @@ i still can't remember the bleeder. he's pillock brained, your father, yesterday. there he is with the car, drives straight into the garage and the aerial goes ping! so he's waiting for you to come up and have a look at it. -the aerial off the car hasn't he? +the aerial off the car hasn't he? snapped it? mm. well if he's snapped it the aerial i don't know whereabouts it's snapped. though innit? -probably snapped it and +probably snapped it and if steve's going to have electric aerial he'll be doing the same thing. he never ever puts them down. or is it his c b aerial? -the c b one says i've only just let you have it! +the c b one says i've only just let you have it! he's forgot it's there . he's not had much sleep though, poor sod. you've got a spare bedroom you know. he won't sleep in it cos i won't sleep in it. -what's up with you why? +what's up with you why? it's still got everything chucked on it. well it was emptying but it's started filling up again. @@ -30069,7 +30041,7 @@ yeah. now we got our drier other day, it come through. ah did it? yeah. -we can dry dry now, i just leave it, i leave both doors shut and it keeps kitchen warm. +we can dry dry now, i just leave it, i leave both doors shut and it keeps kitchen warm. yeah they do. yes. but you've gotta watch the con mind you it won't make no difference, condensation, will it? @@ -30080,28 +30052,28 @@ ah and we ended up selling it . how's your hoover now then? working so so. -it's the moment. +it's the moment. mind you er yeah well at least it's it's working better than it was. yeah well next thing is a new hoover. so are you doing the one o'clock or not bothering? -no can't be bothered to do owt to be honest. +no can't be bothered to do owt to be honest. that's just how i feel. can't wait for me holidays. you going to stay for tom's thing? no i'm going to where? or -or i'm going to rome +or i'm going to rome innit, rome? yeah. -cos it's somewhere +cos it's somewhere i'll wait for me gold card to come through and then i can go somewhere hot. that should be here before then shouldn't it? yeah . -got a holiday. +got a holiday. oh yeah that thing might come so i'll keep a check out in case i see a yeah, parcel post coming in. big parcel post. @@ -30109,43 +30081,43 @@ midi hi-fi system. yeah she's won in everything. you won it? yeah. -i won a gold card worth a thousand pound +i won a gold card worth a thousand pound mm. and er ah well you're alright. -that's , hasn't had much of a rest today so +that's , hasn't had much of a rest today so has he been out all day then? -no, he'll be out went out at ten to seven but over a sort of i've been up since seven, i've not really sat down all day. +no, he'll be out went out at ten to seven but over a sort of i've been up since seven, i've not really sat down all day. oh! quarter of these? yes please. -oh i haven't had none of them for ages packets of them. +oh i haven't had none of them for ages packets of them. that's what everyone says, oh i used to have those. yeah erm alice at school, she give me one but hers weren't called them and i said they were called imps mm. and these were called summat else but they was exactly the same. -oh i want a bottle of pop have you any in fridge, no? +oh i want a bottle of pop have you any in fridge, no? what bottles? no. oh i'll have a bottle of milk then. well it's cold yeah. -orange bet you're ready for shutting aren't you? +orange bet you're ready for shutting aren't you? what? thought you said about you're ready for shutting. -forgot what i said then +forgot what i said then you're cracking up. oh look at that, i'm gonna be a pig. -mm that's what i've cos i've not been very busy i've been picking, you know like a few peanuts there's chocolate peanuts, there's -he's mending car, he's been working all day and now he's mending car +mm that's what i've cos i've not been very busy i've been picking, you know like a few peanuts there's chocolate peanuts, there's +he's mending car, he's been working all day and now he's mending car it conked out other day conked out other day and he thought it were points, he changed points and i says to him have you changed plugs? -he went i knew there were summat +he went i knew there were summat now he's changing plugs. what, in the dark? he's got one of them clip-on oh. -oogifibs oh a couple of them. +oogifibs oh a couple of them. to do with it. well that's what i, that's what i've been doing. nibbling? @@ -30154,13 +30126,13 @@ i know. i were just like that when i were at home on me own at night, john used to play dominoes on a friday night, the kids were in bed i'd be in and out of kitchen yeah i did picking. -too but this one, he hasn't been on nights. +too but this one, he hasn't been on nights. three twenty three please. -i've got three i haven't got the twenty but i've got the three +i've got three i haven't got the twenty but i've got the three ta. i've just informed him that he can work longer if he wants, i thought smart move. -have you got a bag i can put these into oh there's one over here. -i thought i don't see enough of him now,till half past seven and then he says home all day +have you got a bag i can put these into oh there's one over here. +i thought i don't see enough of him now,till half past seven and then he says home all day like he was before . i think i prefer that actually. do you? @@ -30169,15 +30141,15 @@ tarrah. yeah that's true. you can't win no matter what you do. ta-ta. -i know, it's just that i remembered picking milk up this morning to make maggie a drink, and there didn't seem a lot so i thought i must remember +i know, it's just that i remembered picking milk up this morning to make maggie a drink, and there didn't seem a lot so i thought i must remember a new bottle isn't there? no. there never is is there? -so when i see it cos i thought i have alice and them, so i and in the room and i fridge. +so when i see it cos i thought i have alice and them, so i and in the room and i fridge. oh dear . i wonder where my torch has gone, as if i didn't know like. it were on windowsill in corner. -you know using it. +you know using it. yeah. shan't worry about it that's not the point, he knows damn well it's me snap. @@ -30192,7 +30164,7 @@ ah i just wondered, shall i turn this light off? er yes. why did you fill this up and leave it on table? i don't know to be honest. -it were sat +it were sat i took it to work one day oh. and used it. @@ -30214,7 +30186,7 @@ well usually if there's not a stamp wanted, is there a stamp wanted? no. yeah usually if there's no stamp wanted i get one of lasses while i'm at work, they'll drop it off for me. i always say will you do me a favour and they shove it in box. -erm ah +erm ah ? no, shower. shower? @@ -30248,23 +30220,23 @@ and your dad was born here? no. scotland. scotland? -so i'm er i've got durham, scottish er me grandparents come from lee lancs +so i'm er i've got durham, scottish er me grandparents come from lee lancs lee lancs? yeah, me mum always said lee lancs mm. or was she born in lee lancs? -anyway they were born one place and moved one place and then they come to after i were born. +anyway they were born one place and moved one place and then they come to after i were born. well let's hope they can try and decipher my bloody dialect, because -i -my granddad yeah, yeah but my granddad, he's scotch my other granddad was a german, me grandma were jewish and i were born in london so let them fathom that out. +i +my granddad yeah, yeah but my granddad, he's scotch my other granddad was a german, me grandma were jewish and i were born in london so let them fathom that out. favom mm -yeah i just write where you were born, where your cos it says regional accent, i'm assuming that means +yeah i just write where you were born, where your cos it says regional accent, i'm assuming that means kensington i were born, london. i just put london. yeah well it's london anyway. it's easier. -it's like your billy he +it's like your billy he where did you put billy was born? hong kong. no. @@ -30285,8 +30257,8 @@ mm. cos don't forget there's people who's moved from donny and had their kids in london mm. and they sound different. -our billy don't sound like steve and gary does he? -where they're proper yorkshire-ified, our billy's like a posh sort of yorkshire. +our billy don't sound like steve and gary does he? +where they're proper yorkshire-ified, our billy's like a posh sort of yorkshire. well he were born in hong kong weren't he? yeah but he g er came here at fifteen bloody months old didn't he? he were talking. @@ -30296,7 +30268,7 @@ ah there she is. who's that? nadine. oh. -there's a bit on bottom please write their first name are there any people mentioned above who's first language is not english and that's nadine +there's a bit on bottom please write their first name are there any people mentioned above who's first language is not english and that's nadine yeah. cos she talks both. does she? @@ -30307,17 +30279,17 @@ and i s that's when i says to her where do you come from? she says me dad's turkish. i remember when we stopped out in bahrain at er how do you spell turkish? -t u r k i s h i mean they +t u r k i s h i mean they you missed summat. t u r k k i -i missed i again, i tell you i'm rubbish at spelling, me. +i missed i again, i tell you i'm rubbish at spelling, me. mm they originate from turkey and then they moved to london. -but when we stopped in bahrain out in hong kong, well when we got into hong kong, you get this little tiny cup it's about an eighth of the size of that bloody thing, and it's thick and it's horrible, their coffee. +but when we stopped in bahrain out in hong kong, well when we got into hong kong, you get this little tiny cup it's about an eighth of the size of that bloody thing, and it's thick and it's horrible, their coffee. what is it? coffee. -we stopped at the airport and they says who wants coffee or who wants tea? -and you thought they're coming round with bloody kiddy's toy cups. +we stopped at the airport and they says who wants coffee or who wants tea? +and you thought they're coming round with bloody kiddy's toy cups. but it w it was thick, it were bloody rank it was. you've never tasted coffee like it. thick coffee. @@ -30334,10 +30306,10 @@ do you know it's never failed me yet, i put socks out yeah. and it always ends up going right, so they don't dry, right funny so it don't d or it rains. that's why i thought i'll get the stupid things out this morning and then them, they'll all be dried by tomorrow. -i can't remember if i've been in bathroom and picked them up, steve's getting a sod with him getting bath every night +i can't remember if i've been in bathroom and picked them up, steve's getting a sod with him getting bath every night mm. he's er just dropping them. -did i tell you, had gary paid for his er insurance on that, that er tt if anything happens to him going over to france, he's insured +did i tell you, had gary paid for his er insurance on that, that er tt if anything happens to him going over to france, he's insured oh yeah. twenty one quid, well how long how long's he going, for a week or a fortnight? @@ -30354,7 +30326,7 @@ yeah. i've got summat for your gary. for his ear? no, oh no. -erm he bought that car off steven didn't he? +erm he bought that car off steven didn't he? yeah. i found instructions. ah. @@ -30374,7 +30346,7 @@ but you left round, i've, i have checked bathroom, i took it out of bathroom and guess what, i didn't check? what? our bedroom. -that's on pile in bedroom. +that's on pile in bedroom. i thought ooh! aren't i . yeah that belongs to that car. @@ -30385,11 +30357,11 @@ mm. or he'll end up giving it away as a present, there's nowt wrong with box, car, nothing. he'll save it for his own. well that's it. -if he gets gotta get a bird first. -ah +if he gets gotta get a bird first. +ah your gary's happy as he is, he's enjoying life. he is. -that's the mistake steven's made girlfriends. +that's the mistake steven's made girlfriends. mm. knowing he can't afford them with him being in college yeah. @@ -30403,25 +30375,25 @@ you know? yeah that's true. i'm wondering what that thing is on maureen's wall, have you seen it? no, ain't been looking. -it looks it flaps about, if you look at maureen's wall near drainpipe you can see this thing +it looks it flaps about, if you look at maureen's wall near drainpipe you can see this thing flapping all over. -i keep meaning to +i keep meaning to whereabouts are you looking? you know drainpipe -yeah +yeah you've got that little window, then drainpipe? yeah. at side of drainpipe. -you can see it flapping about, you watch in a sec it starts flapping. +you can see it flapping about, you watch in a sec it starts flapping. can you see it? mm don't know what that is. i don't know. -i keep meaning to -see if it's a vent or summat or a piece of plastic. +i keep meaning to +see if it's a vent or summat or a piece of plastic. might have put one in. they've put it in the sun whatever it is. unless it's that cooker thing, i think her cooker's there. -she's got one of them oogies them erm tt fan things. +she's got one of them oogies them erm tt fan things. oh it might be an extractor. that's it. yeah. @@ -30445,7 +30417,7 @@ now i says, now i've seen some wooden ones in her house, i said yeah. if she wants to swap i'll swap her. yeah. -the crafty bugger says to me, what did she say, they're fourteen pound summat i think she says, these wooden ones +the crafty bugger says to me, what did she say, they're fourteen pound summat i think she says, these wooden ones ah, i dunno. and er i says well i thought you'd got some. now @@ -30454,7 +30426,7 @@ i'm sure i've seen one in her house yeah. and she says no, she says one i've got's only a thin one, you want that thicker one, you know with these being thick yeah. -she says so i thought if i buy you one she says you give me them two, i says whoa hang on a minute, i says i've got two windows +she says so i thought if i buy you one she says you give me them two, i says whoa hang on a minute, i says i've got two windows yeah. not one window, i says i'm not giving you two for one. two for one, that's bloody daft. @@ -30464,7 +30436,7 @@ you know? and she says well i thought if i buy you one you can buy other one, i says go and naff off. well that's daft innit? i says i don't, i says when am i gonna be able to go to town i says and afford fifteen quid for another bloody rail? -i says you +i says you when you've already got some up. yeah! she wants me to take them down and swap them for one. @@ -30477,7 +30449,7 @@ oh. and i thought no i'm not, steve's just cleaned them up. yeah. he spent about two hours in with them. -have you seen what he's done to ends of them, they've gone silvery, he's rubbed and rubbed and rubbed +have you seen what he's done to ends of them, they've gone silvery, he's rubbed and rubbed and rubbed rubbed too bloody hard . and he's rubbed all colour off it. they've got silver ends on them ones. @@ -30486,7 +30458,7 @@ i says can't you rub harder on other piece. he ain't done them ones yet. he's done these ones. well they, are they not silvery then? -well he washed this one first and then he went over there and er then it dawned on him that the ends pull off +well he washed this one first and then he went over there and er then it dawned on him that the ends pull off ah! on ends, so he took the two ends off, cleaned the rails and he was sat on settee watching telly rubbing away and rubbing away and i says hey you gonna put them ends back on? and he'd been rubbing for that long they'd gone that colour. @@ -30498,7 +30470,7 @@ mm. how old were he then, about thirteen? no he were younger than that. i can remember that, he come over and told me. -how did you get them all black mum, i said they're bloody new ones . +how did you get them all black mum, i said they're bloody new ones . not now. mm. i want a new frying pan. @@ -30508,13 +30480,13 @@ have you? you know when we saved them berkeley packets? yeah. can you remember what we saved them for? -marion asked me other day what we were saving them for, i said well we saved them oh i remember! -we saved them, they were on about cameras and that and then we found out inserts inside it that you got it with that didn't you? +marion asked me other day what we were saving them for, i said well we saved them oh i remember! +we saved them, they were on about cameras and that and then we found out inserts inside it that you got it with that didn't you? well it was, it was, yeah yeah. yeah. i've still got stacks of them in kitchen. i think i threw all mine away. -oh we did send for something but i can't remember what. +oh we did send for something but i can't remember what. she got one. you know like we got? what did i send off to get gary them radio earphones? @@ -30526,15 +30498,15 @@ well i s i were saying to irene, i says did you ever get one? mm. she says yeah i'm sure we did mm. -i says well if you don't smoke them i says me and maggie'll get them for you +i says well if you don't smoke them i says me and maggie'll get them for you yeah. i says she'll get gary to collect them at work and that i says yeah. -and i'll ask you know +and i'll ask you know yeah. dave and them to save for me again yeah. -i says and get yoursen summat. +i says and get yoursen summat. anyway er she rooted about in drawers yesterday and er she find it? she found this booklet and it were like a cheque book @@ -30564,10 +30536,10 @@ thought bloody hell. it's a bus. a bus. a bus. -my little'un said bus er our cr -yeah craigy were on about a bus, a bus and erm little'un said bus. -oh, she -and then our craigy said erm home and away nan home and away nan. +my little'un said bus er our cr +yeah craigy were on about a bus, a bus and erm little'un said bus. +oh, she +and then our craigy said erm home and away nan home and away nan. did he? mm. chuffing hell. @@ -30579,30 +30551,30 @@ i thought that were that brian now. where? i don't know. can't see where they've gone. -oh it looks like him. +oh it looks like him. what the crippled brian? he's looking at your house. crippled brian? he's looking at your house. or is he looking at the bus? he's looking at the bus. -he walked up here, walked to your house, looked at the bus i don't know where'd he come from +he walked up here, walked to your house, looked at the bus i don't know where'd he come from and do you know that's only trouble with these nets -i'm gonna have a wee bill's bloody worse, he stands there, he looks out the bloody window as much as any bugger. +i'm gonna have a wee bill's bloody worse, he stands there, he looks out the bloody window as much as any bugger. he has he's just parked car, walked up here, looked at bus and walked back again. is it brian? no, this one's driving a car. he were looking at that bus. -he might be another one of them from the er from the council. +he might be another one of them from the er from the council. yeah, well it's, they've done nowt but look at it for last three month. i like his registration . well he parked car there mm. -walked up there right to your house, eyed bus up and then walked back again. -yeah because what they did they they've done it a few a times though different people, look and see how far it is before it's a blind spot. +walked up there right to your house, eyed bus up and then walked back again. +yeah because what they did they they've done it a few a times though different people, look and see how far it is before it's a blind spot. your bill nearly hit it other week he were telling me. -i dunno but like er say the d a driver's coming this way, he wants to see how far down the road it is before it's a blind spot again. -and if they're from the council or whatever, or whoever does the roads or whatever they'll probably get in contact with him again. +i dunno but like er say the d a driver's coming this way, he wants to see how far down the road it is before it's a blind spot again. +and if they're from the council or whatever, or whoever does the roads or whatever they'll probably get in contact with him again. i should imagine they are from the council. that weren't too bad that one. oh @@ -30614,7 +30586,7 @@ and it won't? no it won't shift. mm. bloody come up one way or the other. -oh i could fancy a nice horse. +oh i could fancy a nice horse. i like leg. i don't want corned beef, that's, that, i don't want that. i like leg. @@ -30631,11 +30603,11 @@ i'm gonna have to go and get some more milk. some miluk yeah, i'll nip this afternoon and get some. i got strawberry or raspberry, i've got one of them. -normally i er put a banana and a strawberry together to give it a different taste. +normally i er put a banana and a strawberry together to give it a different taste. oh yeah, pocket money. it's increased. what about last week's? -yeah +yeah i owe you a penny now. i know you do, that's next week's. have to save a penny. @@ -30645,18 +30617,18 @@ fifty pence the other week. gets a fifty pence but she don't like a fifty pence, she likes it all in change. so she's got loads. yeah so she's got a lot of money. -anyway she left twelve pence on the floor and gary says whose is this money, said you leave it there, it's for enid's no nobody touch this chuffing twelve pence. +anyway she left twelve pence on the floor and gary says whose is this money, said you leave it there, it's for enid's no nobody touch this chuffing twelve pence. she left twelve pence on floor and what? -she left twelve pence on the floor and bill put it in the cubby hole in the fireplace and gary says whose is this money and arthur was going to pick it up an'all, he says leave that he says that's for enid's money. +she left twelve pence on the floor and bill put it in the cubby hole in the fireplace and gary says whose is this money and arthur was going to pick it up an'all, he says leave that he says that's for enid's money. her twelve p. well there are. twelve p. mm. what's sh what's billy do, take her to shop? -he gives no bill gives him fifty p, fifty p to, for whenever he sees her +he gives no bill gives him fifty p, fifty p to, for whenever he sees her yeah. and then he, he goes and buys her smarties and crispies. -that's what i says to +that's what i says to mm does he do that on the way out? mm. @@ -30676,16 +30648,16 @@ you've gotta go over it all. oh i don't know. i've gotta ring anyway, nine sixteen you've gotta d -twenties thirties, forties. +twenties thirties, forties. is that the eldest is the forties? no irene's the eldest the crafty bleeder. that's what i'm looking for, i'm hoping she's rubbed it out in pencil. she scribbled it out. she doesn't, she didn't mind taping or owt, she were pretending that yeah. -she said cos she were talking, she knew tape were still running and she were pretending to say that she didn't say i could do it but she did +she said cos she were talking, she knew tape were still running and she were pretending to say that she didn't say i could do it but she did mm. -erm what she were arguing with me about is her age. +erm what she were arguing with me about is her age. now she's sixty four yeah. so she didn't want me to put sixty four down, but that's cheating @@ -30693,10 +30665,10 @@ mm. cos if you know the age you're supposed to put the age down mm. cos some people'll tell you and some people won't. -so i put sixty four down so well i didn't put sixty four, i put thirty plus thirty four +so i put sixty four down so well i didn't put sixty four, i put thirty plus thirty four yeah, sixty four. so that made sixty four. -so she jumped up, grabbed the pencil and everything, she got a screwdriver first,i thought she were gonna stab me with screwdriver and she were looking for a pencil +so she jumped up, grabbed the pencil and everything, she got a screwdriver first,i thought she were gonna stab me with screwdriver and she were looking for a pencil erm but luckily she's rubbed it out with thingy so you're putting it back in. i'm putting it back in. @@ -30717,29 +30689,29 @@ have you already turned forty three? i were born in forty seven. you work it out. i'm twenty eight. -i thought you were forty well it were your birthday in september weren't it? +i thought you were forty well it were your birthday in september weren't it? you're forty four this year? am i? i dunno. i have to work out how old bill is, bill's fifty, that's three year. -sixty, seventy, eighty, ninety, that's forty three forty four this year. +sixty, seventy, eighty, ninety, that's forty three forty four this year. forty four then this year. if your birthday er i keep getting mixed up, it's your anniversary in february and it's your birthday in september. that's it. so i'll have to change yours to forty three, i put forty two. -well one year ain't gonna make no difference. +well one year ain't gonna make no difference. i forgot you've already had your birthday. mm. -oh i'll just put a plus sign at it. +oh i'll just put a plus sign at it. no, no pluses! that'll make me bloody double it! i can try hard can't i? plus one then. plus one. no i'll leave it at forty two. -i'm, got you only had your birthday three month ago. -or somewhere around there. +i'm, got you only had your birthday three month ago. +or somewhere around there. i'm thinking it's your birthday tomorrow, and it's not it's your anniversary tomorrow. mm. september eighth. @@ -30751,7 +30723,7 @@ bed. yeah more than likely. i had a good anniversary. how do you work that out? -well i kept me own present, i stayed in bed half a day didn't i ? +well i kept me own present, i stayed in bed half a day didn't i ? mm. you swore on my machine. did i say knickers or a worser word? @@ -30763,11 +30735,11 @@ and there's fs and there's bs. oh well they ain't got fs and bs on it's linda that fs and bs'd. steve swore. -er and there's somebody else somebody else swearing. +er and there's somebody else somebody else swearing. if you rub out all the swear words you'll have n no bloody tapes left will you? -oh no it's not bad, i think it were er the first swear word i remember that went, went on it were wait a minute tape two, tape one ain't got none on that i know of. +oh no it's not bad, i think it were er the first swear word i remember that went, went on it were wait a minute tape two, tape one ain't got none on that i know of. oh. -tape two has tape three has. +tape two has tape three has. tape two and tape three. and this is tape four int it? mm. @@ -30778,7 +30750,7 @@ i think they think you've got to have a conversation where you yeah. talk about all what you talk about yeah. -but i don't, i stop it when you get there. +but i don't, i stop it when you get there. yeah. if they don't want no but that's personal innit? @@ -30794,7 +30766,7 @@ cos what's four tapes? when i've finished this one i'll have one side left ninety minutes a tape, that's an three hours. -hour and half, that's three, that's six hours. +hour and half, that's three, that's six hours. how do you work that out? well i taped six hours. ninety minutes a tape, that makes six. @@ -30807,17 +30779,17 @@ er watch that light, cough. well you just said cough and it went off. i were watching it, every time you cough it starts flashing. dinky! -steve keeps saying he were he says i'm having that tape recorder, i says you're not she's coming to take it back. +steve keeps saying he were he says i'm having that tape recorder, i says you're not she's coming to take it back. i'm gonna tell her i'm having that tape recorder, i says you're not, she's coming back for it on friday. it's only a cheapo anyway innit? i know, we've got that one. -we've got four walkmans in here like it, there's one at top there, i think that's same as this one. +we've got four walkmans in here like it, there's one at top there, i think that's same as this one. that one's a radio thingy, the one steven's got's a, a radio thingy, this one isn't. but what he likes about it is microphone. what's that one? that's what my brother's son did to his father. bloody having them then is he? -i paid fi fifteen bleeding quid for that and i sai cos this year, i didn't know he'd done this cos he sits it like that +i paid fi fifteen bleeding quid for that and i sai cos this year, i didn't know he'd done this cos he sits it like that mm. or clips it like that and you can't tell mm. @@ -30825,7 +30797,7 @@ anyway he give it to his father and, well i'd already bought the other one i'd mm cos i says if he looks after it i'll buy him one with radio on as well yeah. -so i just paid that one with radio. +so i just paid that one with radio. but i wish he'd stop nicking my bleeding torch, he's getting a swine for that. i only got it back, you know when i got it back? when he moved out. @@ -30835,13 +30807,13 @@ i get all me torches back when battery's dead. i got one with a big chunky battery, it should've lasted about six month to a year yeah. a right good'un it were, our arthur give me torch and i had to buy a battery, i paid about three pound odd for this battery -tell you what i bet he had it under the blankets reading his books. +tell you what i bet he had it under the blankets reading his books. he did. you've got it. exactly. i wondered what that was? it's something clanging round in your washing machine. -it'll be zip on his erm tracksuit. +it'll be zip on his erm tracksuit. i found jacket, did i tell you? no. i got jacket and bottom. @@ -30851,9 +30823,9 @@ i like that. i can't stick it. i like it if i do it with bacon and sausage. ooh no. -i got your billy yesterday and i says oh do us a favour i says will you say owt, anything, just +i got your billy yesterday and i says oh do us a favour i says will you say owt, anything, just yeah. -tell us about breathing, no you're not getting my voice on that thing he says, i, i don't like hearing me voice and everything, and he threw it on the settee . +tell us about breathing, no you're not getting my voice on that thing he says, i, i don't like hearing me voice and everything, and he threw it on the settee . oh we had a right laugh about it . couldn't stop laughing. me and your mam did one this morning, i had about twenty minutes left on it and she helped me finish it off @@ -30870,7 +30842,7 @@ yeah. yeah, yeah and all that, bloody hell. what have you been doing? have you been to your mam's? -yeah i've been to me mam's, i've just had a cup of coffee and some fairy bun summat or other and ate these fairy buns. +yeah i've been to me mam's, i've just had a cup of coffee and some fairy bun summat or other and ate these fairy buns. the crafty get, she didn't give me one. i've been over and she didn't give me one. yet she comes in here and eats me cakes and biscuits. @@ -30889,12 +30861,12 @@ i know, steven's nicked all polish and i had another one, you know one of them with sponges on? yeah. and he snapped sponge off end. -sat and got going like that +sat and got going like that ooh. couldn't stop laughing. what's j j doing anyway? gone to her mam's? -no she's going somewhere we went to donny other day all money we've been getting like, when i first, she, when i first, before we got that giro for me +no she's going somewhere we went to donny other day all money we've been getting like, when i first, she, when i first, before we got that giro for me yeah. and j j, she got one week's money didn't she? mm. @@ -30906,16 +30878,16 @@ right? out of that other money your seventy odd? yeah. -then i got my seventy odd and she got another week's money and we just put it all together and we split it down the middle said right there's your half, there's mine +then i got my seventy odd and she got another week's money and we just put it all together and we split it down the middle said right there's your half, there's mine mm. -erm she says er right do what you want with yours, i'll do what i want with mine. +erm she says er right do what you want with yours, i'll do what i want with mine. anyhow i went out and i got this baby nest shawl thing oh for baby? yeah. yeah. thirty quid. you what! -thirty quid it's gorgeous, i looked at it she picked this one up, white, and i says don't like it +thirty quid it's gorgeous, i looked at it she picked this one up, white, and i says don't like it is that the one in i says tight get, only eight quid. is that the one in pushchair where their feet are all covered up and @@ -30927,7 +30899,7 @@ and it's got like a hood thing. and you can put them in pushch er pram, sorry yeah. yeah. -well i got one of them and it's pure silk, pale green and white and with all lacy i thought i like it. +well i got one of them and it's pure silk, pale green and white and with all lacy i thought i like it. are you keeping that for all of them now? yeah. that's your special one? @@ -30936,14 +30908,14 @@ good god. and er i says are you going out? she says what on? i says that. -says no that's your money, you buy whatever you want for baby, i'll buy she bought her one for eight quid and i says let's have a look at your one, yours are only eight quid i says, well how much were yours? -i says thirty, she went -you paid thirty quid for that +says no that's your money, you buy whatever you want for baby, i'll buy she bought her one for eight quid and i says let's have a look at your one, yours are only eight quid i says, well how much were yours? +i says thirty, she went +you paid thirty quid for that i says yeah. -she says you +she says you ah. bloody hell. -so anyway i went to index cos i want i want and a watch i'm looking for a watch cos, and i thought oh aye i come to rings, i thought well i owe her a ring so i thought oh better half eternity ring they're cheap anyway. +so anyway i went to index cos i want i want and a watch i'm looking for a watch cos, and i thought oh aye i come to rings, i thought well i owe her a ring so i thought oh better half eternity ring they're cheap anyway. yeah. and anyhow twenty nine ninety nine so i bought her one. i says here don't say i don't buy you nowt. @@ -30980,8 +30952,8 @@ mm. he dismantles the lot, he's stupid. i've got more straps and bloody cordless watches, everything, all over the place. yeah. -cos wayne give him one, he paid seventy quid for it and he dismantled that one in three week of having it. -tt yeah it's in index. +cos wayne give him one, he paid seventy quid for it and he dismantled that one in three week of having it. +tt yeah it's in index. have you got index book? yeah it's in cupboard. i'll show you it. @@ -30998,7 +30970,7 @@ she's more at home than she is at work. that one. did i tell you she got her inheritance? inheritance? -yeah she twenty one other week and +yeah she twenty one other week and and how much she get? four and a half thousand. four and a half thousand pounds! @@ -31028,10 +31000,10 @@ yeah it's real gold and diamond. nine carat gold. diamond set. good god. -yeah diamonds and sapphires it, it's got half, half er +yeah diamonds and sapphires it, it's got half, half er half eternity. eternity, that's right. -one two three three of one, four of other. +one two three three of one, four of other. yeah. oh it's nice that. and then i thought well it's, it's got, it says diamonds and sapphire, i thought they can't be real but it says, you know @@ -31043,10 +31015,10 @@ diamond chips, they'll be little tiny ones yeah. smack in middle are they? yeah they are. -yeah i thought they are er smaller than that. +yeah i thought they are er smaller than that. ah there they are, there. yeah. -that's a diamond and sapphire just a bit bigger than yours +that's a diamond and sapphire just a bit bigger than yours yeah. that one. aha. @@ -31066,25 +31038,25 @@ cos i says thirty odd quid, she says yeah they're on special mm. cos they're knock-down prices aren't they? yeah. -and er she says that she didn't want summat expensive when she could be buying summat for kitchen, you know, like a microwave or summat like that. +and er she says that she didn't want summat expensive when she could be buying summat for kitchen, you know, like a microwave or summat like that. yeah. so i don't blame her really. i've buggered me alarm clock up. i got mad because how did you do that? -it wouldn't set so i hit it and you know buttons? -i went like that on top and i said bloody work! +it wouldn't set so i hit it and you know buttons? +i went like that on top and i said bloody work! and all buttons went inside. oh! steve looked at it, he said i think you'd better go to shop and buy yoursen a new one. i don't know. -sometimes they've got some in that book, they're in them leaflets. +sometimes they've got some in that book, they're in them leaflets. i would have picked that one as well like steve's. that one? yeah. -yeah i that one as well. -there were that one and this other one but i like this other one because it's like that. +yeah i that one as well. +there were that one and this other one but i like this other one because it's like that. there. it might be on one of them leaflet things, you know they make the leaflets? yeah. @@ -31092,7 +31064,7 @@ not in there. might be on that. but they've got some nice things in there. yeah they have. -i were looking for an alarm clock, i thought i better have a new one else i'm gonna start sleeping in for work. +i were looking for an alarm clock, i thought i better have a new one else i'm gonna start sleeping in for work. mm. but they're usually cheap in here but i want one that yeah. @@ -31106,7 +31078,7 @@ cos steve always had to wake me up for work yeah. and er then he decided to buy me a radio alarm for christmas. mhm. -and it worked, i've heard it ever since till i hit it. +and it worked, i've heard it ever since till i hit it. haven't you done owt like this, things like this? can't you have them sort of thing? oh aye yeah we've got a toaster and one of them bra er breville toaster things and @@ -31115,7 +31087,7 @@ er i got rid of that thing. did you? yeah. i've got me microwave now though. -oh cos ain't you got one summat like this? +oh cos ain't you got one summat like this? eh? didn't she have a two ring burner or summat like that? yeah she had a two ring cooker thing, yeah. @@ -31135,7 +31107,7 @@ yeah. they're cheaper in here i know. mm. my -it's with condensation of fat and everything er with them just decorating all rooms and that it's +it's with condensation of fat and everything er with them just decorating all rooms and that it's ah. so you can have microwaves, toaster, kettle yeah. @@ -31158,7 +31130,7 @@ have to have a proper look later, i can't find it. ah found one. i says i can't find them, i found them. here we are -what's that one, number four, number four digital clock, mains operated, fast time, alarm set, snooze feature, battery back-up four ninety five. +what's that one, number four, number four digital clock, mains operated, fast time, alarm set, snooze feature, battery back-up four ninety five. not bad that's not bad at all that. no. @@ -31177,7 +31149,7 @@ you mean if electric goes off? yeah if electric goes off. mm. that was supposed to be battery back-up system, the one i threw on floor. -cos i dismantled it and threw it on floor . +cos i dismantled it and threw it on floor . tt i got right mad. it's a good job i've got two. so i shall have one of them i think. @@ -31207,8 +31179,8 @@ you always get damage at front of tape. best thing to do is just cut it off. ah we will do later cos well or yeah. -he uses cuts it all off and gets rid of it. -yeah it's erm any damage on tape, nine out of ten times i is the first foot it's because when they wind them back i it, it's a jag +he uses cuts it all off and gets rid of it. +yeah it's erm any damage on tape, nine out of ten times i is the first foot it's because when they wind them back i it, it's a jag tight innit? complete jag all the time when they wind them back. yeah. @@ -31216,10 +31188,10 @@ aye well that doesn't bother us. no. ta-ta. ta-ta love. -shorts and so i thought right, clean or mucky, you're in the wash. +shorts and so i thought right, clean or mucky, you're in the wash. so , thought i'll get them all washed and put back in bedroom before he notices they're missing. so that's what i did. -now what we're on about yeah as i were on about, that er what i do is, with days like this, cos you can never guarantee if they're gonna be dry, wet or what, so i watch to see if it rains, if it don't they're virtually dry when i fetch them in. +now what we're on about yeah as i were on about, that er what i do is, with days like this, cos you can never guarantee if they're gonna be dry, wet or what, so i watch to see if it rains, if it don't they're virtually dry when i fetch them in. so that's what i've been doing. i don't know whose t-shirt's whose. that one's mine. @@ -31237,7 +31209,7 @@ breakfast and cup of coffee, i just didn't you didn't? i didn't fe i felt wide awake but i was tired yeah. -so you thought nah i'm not going, i'm stopping at home. +so you thought nah i'm not going, i'm stopping at home. third time that's been in the washer since christmas day. and that's only cos last twice i've thinked of it. where is his lordship anyway? @@ -31247,7 +31219,7 @@ it's easier. how come dave's home? what? how come dave's home? -i thought you says he were working on them mate's car? +i thought you says he were working on them mate's car? which one? mate's car. oh he's finished doing, they've finished doing that one. @@ -31271,20 +31243,20 @@ hey? i give up on them. i give up on them all. i sent him to doctors. -he come in, his eye's right out here, and it's streaming with water and he says he's been to hospital, they dripped some water in it, washed it out must be mine that, what do you reckon? +he come in, his eye's right out here, and it's streaming with water and he says he's been to hospital, they dripped some water in it, washed it out must be mine that, what do you reckon? it is. oh. i can never tell cos he pinches them all. if it's a t- shirt it's his. so he says. -anyway it was streaming with water so er i told him to get down to doctors, he asked if, that's why i said oh stephen's been back. +anyway it was streaming with water so er i told him to get down to doctors, he asked if, that's why i said oh stephen's been back. it must've been while i was stood up there. and he's er what you called it? -er went to nurse so i lent him bike. +er went to nurse so i lent him bike. it's a bit dangerous driving round if his eyes are like that. well mine's got a visor and everything on it. -one of them comes right down there. -so just airing these off. +one of them comes right down there. +so just airing these off. that's what they're like when i fetch them in,it's not bad is it? no they're dry. so i just air them off. @@ -31298,8 +31270,8 @@ you're having a right lazy day? mm. bet you get fed up with that job don't you? yeah, i don't like it -oh -it were nice monday cos she come round hygiene on time +oh +it were nice monday cos she come round hygiene on time yeah. she goes, she started being a cocky little bitch, she's only fucking nineteen yeah. @@ -31307,7 +31279,7 @@ she started being a cocky little bitch, and she wears make- up, really plasters oh yeah. and she started gobbing, i says oh go and take your fucking make-up off you tart. so she took me off hygiene. -stupid cow, she +stupid cow, she is she a supervisor a chargehand or summat? chargehand. at that age? @@ -31315,11 +31287,11 @@ and do i give a fuck? no. no i bet you don't, i wouldn't neither. cor. -i quite liked it where i were yesterday cos he were alright, him. +i quite liked it where i were yesterday cos he were alright, him. are you in mucky end or other end? in between. in between? -well that says a right lot that does . +well that says a right lot that does . all i know there's a mucky end and another end. aye oh well that's not bad. @@ -31342,14 +31314,14 @@ i'm a rotten bastard aren't i? no. everybody does it. you're not on your own. -i tell you summat i'm getting fed up because every time i don't feel absolutely great, and i go over there and say will you stand in for me, i don't feel well, i don't want to. -it was an arrangement we had i, i wouldn't phone in cos you have to wait three weeks for your wages if i phone in. +i tell you summat i'm getting fed up because every time i don't feel absolutely great, and i go over there and say will you stand in for me, i don't feel well, i don't want to. +it was an arrangement we had i, i wouldn't phone in cos you have to wait three weeks for your wages if i phone in. so i says i wouldn't phone in, i'd let you know and you could do it and i'll pay you myself, i don't mind, you know, losing a day's pay. i said i'll pay you mysen. -so er she says yeah fair enough then she won't have to wait three week, cos it's only me that's losing, not her. +so er she says yeah fair enough then she won't have to wait three week, cos it's only me that's losing, not her. yeah. anyway she's been going out on and off for quite a while now. -so i thought well i don't have to wait three weeks for mine so next time i don't feel great i'm gonna call in and take a couple of days off. +so i thought well i don't have to wait three weeks for mine so next time i don't feel great i'm gonna call in and take a couple of days off. according to them i have had four weeks off in ten years. that's it. that's all i've had off. @@ -31366,7 +31338,7 @@ let them find somebody. i says i'm not messing about no more. do you know everybody's had flu and god knows what and i can't catch it. i thought i had it again other day, i felt bleeding awful. -i had that at christmas which made me bad all over christmas right ? +i had that at christmas which made me bad all over christmas right ? and everybody , i says marvellous cos i can have some time off,, it's not fair. i'm not having that, that's cheating. if they can have some time off i can have some time off, fair's fair. @@ -31419,14 +31391,14 @@ yeah. tt. i know. isn't it awful? -aye she get rid of me tomorrow cos she's going to work she says. +aye she get rid of me tomorrow cos she's going to work she says. if she gets up . she got up this morning. oh aye you said you did didn't you? but she said i hate that place, i'm not going. and stayed in bed. i made her a cup of coffee, she went to sleep. -hey now for the past three mornings i've got up out of bed, i've made you a cup of tea every morning and breakfast on a tray, so don't you come complaining to me. +hey now for the past three mornings i've got up out of bed, i've made you a cup of tea every morning and breakfast on a tray, so don't you come complaining to me. only cos you beat me up. pardon? only cos you beat me up. @@ -31457,22 +31429,22 @@ you know i love you, what more do you want? breakfast in bed every day. have you got any more car jobs to do? not yet. -erm back brakes but -well if it don't stop you how old's your mum and dad? +erm back brakes but +well if it don't stop you how old's your mum and dad? he don't know neither. they're in their forties anyway i think. that's what i said well we come to that conclusion didn't we? -me dad's think me dad's forty seven. +me dad's think me dad's forty seven. me mum's about forty three, forty four. oh. i thought your mum were older than your dad. no. your mum looks worn and knackered. she always does. -ah but you know what she does though? -you tell her what she does when she works nights, next day when she comes home in morning. -well it just depends if it's market day she goes to market stays up till two or three in afternoon and then goes to sleep for six about six hours. +ah but you know what she does though? +you tell her what she does when she works nights, next day when she comes home in morning. +well it just depends if it's market day she goes to market stays up till two or three in afternoon and then goes to sleep for six about six hours. what time does she go to work? half nine at night. bloody hell that's a long day. @@ -31493,15 +31465,15 @@ oh you've got a car and a pick-up? and a bike. and a bike? yeah. -well me dad's on about getting rid of car for summat else but i don't know yet. +well me dad's on about getting rid of car for summat else but i don't know yet. he hasn't made his mind up. me mum's on about getting rid of hers and getting a volvo. -i've told her to get an astra they're better. +i've told her to get an astra they're better. a little'un? yeah. same as mine but a new car. no. -with the same front but it's this long. +with the same front but it's this long. she don't want a big'un does she? no she doesn't like driving big cars. why's she want a volvo, it's ginormous! @@ -31513,20 +31485,20 @@ nowt to do with him,metro. why? mm? why? -cos er they rot. +cos er they rot. tommy's next door a little red light keeps coming on. a little red light. -a little red light as though he's got no oil but he has. -it might be his erm tt oil filter's blocked or summat. +a little red light as though he's got no oil but he has. +it might be his erm tt oil filter's blocked or summat. mm. they're prone for that,little red lights. -oil filter +oil filter mine is an'all. have you got a little red light ? yeah, it keeps flickering on and off. on me dad's van, that's a pick-up, when she's yeah. -been running for about half an hour or so, you know when you come to a junction flicking on and off. +been running for about half an hour or so, you know when you come to a junction flicking on and off. i thought you were a mechanic. i am. well get rid of your little red light then! @@ -31537,14 +31509,14 @@ yeah. well i would do, i'd walk back for , me. i'd say it's not on now. well me dad's needs an oil pump on it. -er and he won't pay out for it cos he's a bit tight. -er there's mine needs a few bits and bobs i can't do it though cos i haven't got enough money. -me mum's me mum's is alright, it's just me dad g keeps saying oh there's these noises and i'll, and i'll go in it and there's no noise. +er and he won't pay out for it cos he's a bit tight. +er there's mine needs a few bits and bobs i can't do it though cos i haven't got enough money. +me mum's me mum's is alright, it's just me dad g keeps saying oh there's these noises and i'll, and i'll go in it and there's no noise. but it's his ears are getting old. i know. he's supposed to be getting a hearing aid or summat. -soon as soon as he starts talking about cars yap yap yap yap yap yap he doesn't stop. +soon as soon as he starts talking about cars yap yap yap yap yap yap he doesn't stop. don't worry love it's nice to hear you talk, you carry on. you're picking on me. i'm not picking on you. @@ -31574,21 +31546,21 @@ i've gotta get a job first. thought you'd got one. sort of. sort of. -i keep asking them but they're not ready yet. +i keep asking them but they're not ready yet. i was just telling sarah steve's written for another one is it? it's a bit nearer then int it? sugar. -sugar plants +sugar plants sugar oh fixing machinery? yeah. be alright . doing owt else but that he wouldn't know what he's doing. stick owt electrical in his hand and he's cracked it. -our erm michelle come round tracey's sister +our erm michelle come round tracey's sister yeah? -erm with an application form +erm with an application form where is it? it's in house. oh er. @@ -31598,7 +31570,7 @@ she come round this afternoon. is that for you or for her? it's for her. well that's optic fibres. -who else is oh she's getting bovril one an'all. +who else is oh she's getting bovril one an'all. is she? yeah. who's bovril? @@ -31610,16 +31582,16 @@ shaw lane industrial estate. it's just behind that is it? oh my god! -who'd have believed, i were at other night right? -it were getting on late and i says and er were there, oh we'll walk you home sarah said alright then says come on let's go through woods. +who'd have believed, i were at other night right? +it were getting on late and i says and er were there, oh we'll walk you home sarah said alright then says come on let's go through woods. well anyway it gets half way through this wood i couldn't see couple of yards in front of me when it were foggy? they starts running off! well i crapped mesen me, i started running back towards road and they're going sarah, sarah come back. -so i carried on walking and they start going through this bleeding wood, well they had me climbing over three fence things, all like them metal you know like them metal fences at wood? +so i carried on walking and they start going through this bleeding wood, well they had me climbing over three fence things, all like them metal you know like them metal fences at wood? climbing over them, i nearly cut mesen in half. park. -oh yeah we walked past park cos he asked me if i wanted to go on swings and it led up to his back gate, well, you've never seen me put a sigh of relief on me face, i went +oh yeah we walked past park cos he asked me if i wanted to go on swings and it led up to his back gate, well, you've never seen me put a sigh of relief on me face, i went is it a longer or a shorter? it's shorter but it's scarier. scarier? @@ -31628,10 +31600,10 @@ around back of the gardens. i tell you something if they put lights up down here i reckon it'd make it even more scary though you know, i don't know why. scary. i hate that road. -just think there could be dead bodies in +just think there could be dead bodies in you know what it made me think of? what? -parts of flipping evil dead, and they're going ooh there's a house +parts of flipping evil dead, and they're going ooh there's a house oh i couldn't walk through a wood on a night time. no way. we found a tramp in wood once. @@ -31641,11 +31613,11 @@ he were under these covers and erm well you were then . we walked up we, we thought oh what's this? lifted cover and there were this fella underneath. -and erm we ran off, i were, we were about sixteen or seventeen and er we kept chucking bricks at him. +and erm we ran off, i were, we were about sixteen or seventeen and er we kept chucking bricks at him. he, he was going piss off, piss off. so you know dallas? he chucked this bit of glass, it cut him so we ran over here. -and erm i don't know who it was, he set fire to his quilt +and erm i don't know who it was, he set fire to his quilt so he come running after us. he'd, he'd escaped from one of the prisons. eh? @@ -31662,15 +31634,15 @@ it stunk. er he'd escaped from leeds or summat. what did he do? i don't know. -you'd've been alright if it'd've been a mass murderer slept for years . -you never that one again. +you'd've been alright if it'd've been a mass murderer slept for years . +you never that one again. it were right funny though. i bet he didn't think it was. -if you'd've known then what you knew after you wouldn't've thought it were funny,you'd've not been chucking nowt you'd've been off . +if you'd've known then what you knew after you wouldn't've thought it were funny,you'd've not been chucking nowt you'd've been off . bloody hell. -well we come out of woods and someone had phoned police up or something escaped from leeds. +well we come out of woods and someone had phoned police up or something escaped from leeds. did they get him? -he should of bloody stayed +he should of bloody stayed we're going soon cos i'm starving. aren't you hungry? a little bit. @@ -31680,7 +31652,7 @@ he tells fibs an'all . well a little bit means a lot. tell me darling, what have you really had to eat today while i've been away? while you've been away? -had erm a chopped piece of raw carrot +had erm a chopped piece of raw carrot that's about it. are you on a diet? no. @@ -31700,7 +31672,7 @@ could've been. they refused point blank and he had to take it to another garage. did you send another bill? yeah. -no i i phoned insurance up and told them what they'd said, cos i got maggie to phone, it were maggie that said, they told maggie that they were gonna put a second hand wheel on and everything instead of a brand new one so she told insurance about it . +no i i phoned insurance up and told them what they'd said, cos i got maggie to phone, it were maggie that said, they told maggie that they were gonna put a second hand wheel on and everything instead of a brand new one so she told insurance about it . they went mad, they told us that we'd got to take it to national tyres, took it there, twenty three pound fifty it cost us. what's that for, tracking? tracking and balancing it, none of it were done. @@ -31711,21 +31683,21 @@ cos they should've done it. send you cheque back? yeah. that twenty three pound odd what we had to pay, they said we should pay nothing. -oh you're gonna pay +oh you're gonna pay anything to do with the crash, we don't pay nothing for it. so everything that we've got to pay out we invoice them mm. they deduct it and send us it. and that's what we've been doing. oh. -so it weren't bad, especially the money back. +so it weren't bad, especially the money back. pulling their hair out once they get cheque. you what? they'll be pulling their hair out once it's their own fault. yeah. they should've made arrangements, we phoned up, asked them if we could take it in. -that were on tuesday we phoned up. +that were on tuesday we phoned up. what's the matter ? you going on holiday? no. @@ -31738,7 +31710,7 @@ that were last year, we're in nineteen ninety two now. where you going? greece? don't know yet. -we were on about going weren't we? +we were on about going weren't we? yeah. go camping. haven't got a tent. @@ -31767,7 +31739,7 @@ yeah. yeah, it figures. i says bollocks john. pie. -writing letters upsetting today. +writing letters upsetting today. what, that new one? yeah. no? @@ -31777,14 +31749,14 @@ well go like that then. ah i just wondered. they want washing first. i can see that, they're dirty. -oh, do you wear them or summat? +oh, do you wear them or summat? yeah. -ah went in to where john were working cos i wanted to borrow a spanner, he said i could just murder a cig and his, his mate said ah i could as well. +ah went in to where john were working cos i wanted to borrow a spanner, he said i could just murder a cig and his, his mate said ah i could as well. buy your own bastard. he said i could murder a roll up i said could you? i said buy them. we don't buy them for him. -john looked at me i says i says i've got enough bloody debt without keeping pair of you twats in cigs. +john looked at me i says i says i've got enough bloody debt without keeping pair of you twats in cigs. john just laughed. he says you meant it didn't you? i says yes i did, i am not supplying cigs to him. @@ -31794,39 +31766,39 @@ if he can't afford to smoke he should not smoke. if he can afford to smoke he should buy them himself. shouldn't he? mm. -see this time, weren't i clever? +see this time, weren't i clever? yes. -i thought no i thought i'll reason i've got a big box i thought two weeks, cracked it. +i thought no i thought i'll reason i've got a big box i thought two weeks, cracked it. ah . let me just go and get me erm bleeding thieving little twat. -he knows it's me s snap for work and if there's none left i go with bloody out. -well +he knows it's me s snap for work and if there's none left i go with bloody out. +well did you give him his book? yeah. he's got it? yeah. alright how much was it? -one pound twenty one pound +one pound twenty one pound i were supposed to tape twenty. i want eighty pence off him. no you want it off me, that's the whole idea of it. no. yes! -er no. +er no. that's the whole idea these for me. these were one pound five -whoo expensive -five, six +whoo expensive +five, six i want er eighty pence. how much were ? thirty i think. that big'un? -oh i don't know sixty, seventy, i don't know. +oh i don't know sixty, seventy, i don't know. i want one pound twenty off him. they're cheap -i don't care it's me snap, that's what annoys me. +i don't care it's me snap, that's what annoys me. there's all that. i know. it might boil @@ -31842,10 +31814,10 @@ he come to pick sarah up. has she been down? she didn't go to work today. the idle sod. -oh i'll tell you later why she's not been sort of i'll tell you in a bit. -yeah er i told her all about it so she did some for me right? +oh i'll tell you later why she's not been sort of i'll tell you in a bit. +yeah er i told her all about it so she did some for me right? and she says to get dave when he comes in, i says yeah but i'm supposed to tell people about it. -she says no don't tell him she says you told me, just do it she says and then when we stop it you can tell him. +she says no don't tell him she says you told me, just do it she says and then when we stop it you can tell him. well he were killing his sides a laughing. we were talking about cars and holidays and his mum and dad, ta, and i ke i says to sarah shall i tell him? give me that plate. @@ -31861,12 +31833,12 @@ anyway it takes more. eh? more stuff to put in. oh! -what, what sorry? +what, what sorry? dirty sod. what about cheese and tomato? alright. oh that. -cutting knife did you tell him about car? +cutting knife did you tell him about car? about conking out? mini. oh no. @@ -31874,10 +31846,10 @@ why not? cos we were messing about. what he say when he er heard himself? he were killing his sides a laughing. -cos i, i says to sarah go on we'll have a listen to it and we stopped it anyway i says i'll t i'll take it off if you want, he says no leave it. +cos i, i says to sarah go on we'll have a listen to it and we stopped it anyway i says i'll t i'll take it off if you want, he says no leave it. he says you crafty pair of sods he says, sarah knew all about that didn't she? -i says yeah i says she told me to do it, i says and then let you listen to it. -he says nah leave it, he says any case he says this thing you get he says now you've got my voice he says do i get some of it ? +i says yeah i says she told me to do it, i says and then let you listen to it. +he says nah leave it, he says any case he says this thing you get he says now you've got my voice he says do i get some of it ? i says no you don't. no i get t tape recorder. you and that tape recorder! @@ -31896,7 +31868,7 @@ all you want that tape for is cos it's got a microphone innit? yours ain't got a microphone. mine int as good. i thought yours were same make. -ah that's got a radio on +ah that's got a radio on it's got a radio on, yeah. yeah. i'll buy you one. @@ -31911,11 +31883,11 @@ chuffing hell fire. well if they say no it's no that's it, there's not a lot you can do about it. oh well i know that. once they say no that's it. -there's only you know people that come like and that that i have never said no to. +there's only you know people that come like and that that i have never said no to. they were on once. -apart from that are you hungry? +apart from that are you hungry? bloody hell. -no i'm just doing this jam sarnie to er make things happy. +no i'm just doing this jam sarnie to er make things happy. alright? you daft sod , course i'm bleeding hungry. well your tea's nearly ready, that's why i asked you. @@ -31923,7 +31895,7 @@ what, what mood you in? me? alright. been shop and i treat you to summat. -ooh i just thought of summat you +ooh i just thought of summat you what? what have i done now? done four hundred and sixty nine on that tank of petrol. @@ -31937,8 +31909,8 @@ it were. where's that envelope? it says five hundred and twenty summat on it. yeah. -it weren't thirty odd quid don't go in. -it does when i chuffing empty it and fill it up. +it weren't thirty odd quid don't go in. +it does when i chuffing empty it and fill it up. i've got your petrol money for tomorrow anyhow. cos you've got enough for today, tomorrow haven't you? i've got enough for tomorrow to get me there, get me home @@ -31954,7 +31926,7 @@ i'll give you your pocket money and then you stick a fiver in and i'll give it y i said then i'll give you it back. yeah. mm? -and then we'll fiddle instead. +and then we'll fiddle instead. where you going? put these in ro i'm coming back, don't worry. wouldn't pissing leave you. @@ -31993,7 +31965,7 @@ i've had a go, i've had a new mate today. ooh you've got one for yourself? yeah, foreman. oh. -ask him you got owt to do? +ask him you got owt to do? yeah i've got plenty do you want all this? yeah get it whacked on. @@ -32008,26 +31980,26 @@ cos i've got not as much as it no er it's more. -it's forty one more in your book and loans, than she does according to that book. +it's forty one more in your book and loans, than she does according to that book. well how much does your say? eh? how much is yours then? -i mean all i can do is when dave gives me money write it in here that's all i +i mean all i can do is when dave gives me money write it in here that's all i yes. can do. that's all she does. and i check it after her. and i write in here. yeah, but how much, how much did you have there altogether? -according to that about hundred and fifty quid in all. +according to that about hundred and fifty quid in all. what? according to what? in that. no. hundred and forty three. how else ? -see the this th the there's got to be summat wrong. -but if you, if you add all them up, and then add up all what there is in there there's summat wrong. +see the this th the there's got to be summat wrong. +but if you, if you add all them up, and then add up all what there is in there there's summat wrong. mm. what, what balance is it in, on that bit of paper dave? got last week's payment out of here? @@ -32035,16 +32007,16 @@ thirty six ninety eight i've got. oh! who's this? mm mm. -thirty eight thirty six +thirty eight thirty six tracey? thirty six ninety eight on dock. and linda. mm. forget linda. -yeah but ow! +yeah but ow! no one paid me last week. they get -tracey and, and linda. +tracey and, and linda. no. one of them didn't. no, one of them paid you didn't @@ -32100,14 +32072,14 @@ it shouldn't have. yeah! but i mean what you got on loan -do i ever know who's whose in these this house here? +do i ever know who's whose in these this house here? yeah! course you do! well you marked it in linda's book! didn't mark it. you marked it in in linda's book. i know! -but, on here i've marked it on tracey's +but, on here i've marked it on tracey's what you got for tracey on loans? so you got a two pound transfer? and what you got on tracey on loans? @@ -32133,12 +32105,12 @@ see! oh that's graham's. don't know how to do we? don't let him tell him does he? -are you up and paid +are you up and paid yeah. for these? exactly! -the two pound what was given so i'll ask them to transfer that onto your whose ever book next week -i mean, if i add all them up right? +the two pound what was given so i'll ask them to transfer that onto your whose ever book next week +i mean, if i add all them up right? what? i add all them up. yeah. @@ -32146,12 +32118,12 @@ whose is this one? tracey's. right. add that up. -then add the two together it didn't tally with that. +then add the two together it didn't tally with that. no. -but can i ask you something? -can i take linda's book in to have the total? +but can i ask you something? +can i take linda's book in to have the total? get your book. -see i've there's two pounds +see i've there's two pounds i've cleared that. cos i never o know who's who in here! so how much is it altogether? @@ -32177,15 +32149,15 @@ er, there were two pound payment put through wanna get that the, the video? -er and all it wants is doing is transferring off. +er and all it wants is doing is transferring off. what are you looking for tracey? no. it's over there. -all they'll do is put a local transfer erm, thing in. +all they'll do is put a local transfer erm, thing in. so it sho still should only be the two pound out. i put it in the back of the red thing. -but what i should actual fact be, one should be owing two pound more than what it says and the other one should be owing two pound less. -yeah but sue got it sue got all the tried er everything i could to, to get it to to tally. +but what i should actual fact be, one should be owing two pound more than what it says and the other one should be owing two pound less. +yeah but sue got it sue got all the tried er everything i could to, to get it to to tally. linda. yeah. and then @@ -32200,12 +32172,12 @@ on whose? tracey's. according to this lot. i haven't checked, no you've just said linda before. -no,bu er on tracey's together, is hundred and forty six, forty three +no,bu er on tracey's together, is hundred and forty six, forty three oh no! on this. how much? hundred and forty six eighty three. -hundred and forty four eighty three. +hundred and forty four eighty three. but then i put two pounds, which should have been off linda's. cos you didn't pay me owt off you can have that. @@ -32213,17 +32185,17 @@ i should have real ah? you can have that. i should have realized when i'd taken tracey's book in. right. -i'd put it just down here, i marked it down here when i were here last last week. +i'd put it just down here, i marked it down here when i were here last last week. i marked it as tracey's but i were taking tracey's book in weren't i? so i so i picked tracey's book up. -get a letter from the girl there then. +get a letter from the girl there then. mm. yeah i know. what about? to say i haven't paid, but i have! -well no you'll not get, cos i'll take this in and say, look, can you just transfer two pound off linda's onto this. +well no you'll not get, cos i'll take this in and say, look, can you just transfer two pound off linda's onto this. i mean, all it, all it means off of tracey's onto there. yeah. @@ -32233,7 +32205,7 @@ but if it'd be, it'd be understandable if we were identical twins but we're not! but we're not! yeah but i mean i don't -i just you're just names to me, do you know what i, i mean, i still don't know who, which one you are, now even though you said. +i just you're just names to me, do you know what i, i mean, i still don't know who, which one you are, now even though you said. who are you? linda ! eh? @@ -32247,7 +32219,7 @@ i know. yes! and that one's ivy's daughter! i know! -but i if you put yourself in my position and all you do is call +but i if you put yourself in my position and all you do is call god forbid it if ever i put myself in your position! no but you know what i mean ! @@ -32261,7 +32233,7 @@ then you can't get really stuck can you? yeah, but i still don't know who tracey anne is there! that one's you don't -linda now. +linda now. yeah. yeah. mine's just plain linda. @@ -32281,23 +32253,23 @@ dark hair. tracey hasn't well i just know that tracey and linda and i don't know who's tracey and linda. you know who brian and david is? -yeah, because they're i dunno. +yeah, because they're i dunno. brian ! -no, i know, i don't mean owt, owt wrong but i just can't remember these two names, i don't know why, there's something i've never been able to, cos i've always said to you ain't i? -margaret don't punish yourself! +no, i know, i don't mean owt, owt wrong but i just can't remember these two names, i don't know why, there's something i've never been able to, cos i've always said to you ain't i? +margaret don't punish yourself! even these two get mixed up with us. i know. yeah. yeah. but it's very, very -i ain't sometimes i check and ask tracey for linda. -i don't know why it is but probably because they're always together. +i ain't sometimes i check and ask tracey for linda. +i don't know why it is but probably because they're always together. i think this is what it is. -and, i mean, even when i say make a cup of tea +and, i mean, even when i say make a cup of tea who are you now? i'll even ask them! don't i? -it's because a there's summat. +it's because a there's summat. i don't know why! but i'll get yo that two quid transferred. would you get mixed up with her? @@ -32312,18 +32284,18 @@ listening linda? yeah i'll cha yeah i, no i know, i know where i got it. and i'll just put a note in. -but i mean, that were a simple mista i mean you made a payment of two quid didn't you? +but i mean, that were a simple mista i mean you made a payment of two quid didn't you? yeah that saves you making a payment don't it? -no, well i mean, it weren't as though i hadn't put a payment in it were just that it probably was this taking tracey's book and i marked it onto tracey's, er, tracey's book. +no, well i mean, it weren't as though i hadn't put a payment in it were just that it probably was this taking tracey's book and i marked it onto tracey's, er, tracey's book. here he goes look! and how do you know? eh? -but that will be in together or not? -do you think you can get me something didn't he? +but that will be in together or not? +do you think you can get me something didn't he? must be in there. i mean i have put a payment in,i it's not as though i didn't, i mean that was quite easy mistake to make, to me. -but erm i mean, i don't know about other. +but erm i mean, i don't know about other. cos normally they both pay anyway don't you? i think i might have to er change the wallpaper. oh! @@ -32331,7 +32303,7 @@ don't you dave? who'll come out? mike. ah? -when did you pay in? +when did you pay in? last wednesday. last wednesday? no, he's @@ -32356,17 +32328,17 @@ dad. don't worry about me! no. and he said, is tracey in the kitchen? -yeah but he's probably done tha knows who's anyway ! -i mean, i doubt if he'll know who's brian and who's dave to be perfectly honest. +yeah but he's probably done tha knows who's anyway ! +i mean, i doubt if he'll know who's brian and who's dave to be perfectly honest. well, there you are then. eh? off me. that's why they're always going up to him. -mind you, he and uncle brian they are identical twins people can find out who they are but, well they can't find out who we are can they? +mind you, he and uncle brian they are identical twins people can find out who they are but, well they can't find out who we are can they? don't think it matters at work. oh your tea's here. yeah. -you can make make it right next time with tracey's and linda's anyway, if they hadn't done it in office because i can put two pound what tracey paid onto linda's anyway, it'll still balance it out won't it? +you can make make it right next time with tracey's and linda's anyway, if they hadn't done it in office because i can put two pound what tracey paid onto linda's anyway, it'll still balance it out won't it? do you know no. what i mean? @@ -32380,9 +32352,9 @@ yeah. not on their cards. oh no, it's not on the cards. but -i'll pay as the erm +i'll pay as the erm well i'll tell you summat -no that that were my mistake that. +no that that were my mistake that. i'm not having owt to do with this! no that were my mistake, which er, is a genuine mistake, i mean sh you paid me two quid, as i say, i don't know who's whose now and then you @@ -32390,14 +32362,14 @@ that was linda now. tracey didn't pay that did she? no. tracey didn't pay. -but i took li tracey's book in and probably i've seen the tracey and marked it down there you see on tracey's instead of linda's, which, i mean that's a genuine mistake int it? +but i took li tracey's book in and probably i've seen the tracey and marked it down there you see on tracey's instead of linda's, which, i mean that's a genuine mistake int it? well, who put that well he doesn't on card? ha? parcels haven't been marked. what's that? -er, woman that he were to go to mr . +er, woman that he were to go to mr . a woman? mm. where? @@ -32405,14 +32377,14 @@ him who er were getting engaged to? called david, i think they call him. mm. or is that guy from -he lived down station road. +he lived down station road. ah! station road, course he lived yeah. down station road. he used to baby-sit for her. oh! -we heard today they were supposed to have been getting engaged to er a seventy year old woman! +we heard today they were supposed to have been getting engaged to er a seventy year old woman! who? ernie? mm. @@ -32423,12 +32395,12 @@ no she li lives at er doncaster way. she don't live at doncaster! she's supposed to live down station road in hatfield. -that one he's supposed to be engaged lives her sister. +that one he's supposed to be engaged lives her sister. mm. no, that we that were one of them. that's it! that were one of them. -no, the other one who's, who's supposed to have a +no, the other one who's, who's supposed to have a that's her! a son called david. that one what's got the car? @@ -32439,41 +32411,41 @@ ernie's just bought let's have a nut then. ernie bought her a car. she hadn't got one -he's supposed to have been a with provincial. +he's supposed to have been a with provincial. who? ernie. well they're an insurance company aren't they? and he's supposed to have got four thousand pound from them. two lots of two thousand pound. and the solicitor wants to know where it is. -he wants every single penny accounted for before he starts doing anything. -but she's that we -he had er, fourteen and a half thousand pound once in a building society four year ago there's nine hundred pound left in his bu er, building society account! +he wants every single penny accounted for before he starts doing anything. +but she's that we +he had er, fourteen and a half thousand pound once in a building society four year ago there's nine hundred pound left in his bu er, building society account! they want to know where that is. she, the solicitor, nobody else, just the solicitor. -er he's got some insurance policies one's for eleven hundred pound right? +er he's got some insurance policies one's for eleven hundred pound right? and they're gonna pay that. and that's gotta go straight direct to the solicitor. -also, he's supposed to have had an insurance policies but general accident said it's only for a year and he took it out in seventy seven to nineteen seventy eight. -but he's still got the policy life insurance on it. +also, he's supposed to have had an insurance policies but general accident said it's only for a year and he took it out in seventy seven to nineteen seventy eight. +but he's still got the policy life insurance on it. he was insured with the co-op. he was insured with the co-op. -oh that were a that'll be bound to come. +oh that were a that'll be bound to come. so that's i don't know. -yeah, he won't pay mrs insurance money out yet will he? +yeah, he won't pay mrs insurance money out yet will he? no, he, he, he, he's gotta pay it to the solicitor. it all gotta go to them? it's all got to go to solicitor. -and that fourteen thousand five hundred pound every single penny's got to be accounted for. +and that fourteen thousand five hundred pound every single penny's got to be accounted for. well who's gonna know about that then? the bank. building society he put it in. -the solicitors who gave him the court order for them to release all the details on that. -and even that car he bought the +the solicitors who gave him the court order for them to release all the details on that. +and even that car he bought the who? -the solicitor can take it off him +the solicitor can take it off him the solicitor wants to know why and he'd bought a car had he? yeah. @@ -32489,7 +32461,7 @@ but she's got a husband. that one's he's supposed to be getting married to live at wellingdon and she's seventy year old er and yeah! -she's actually mrs 's sister. +she's actually mrs 's sister. i don't know. it's all mixed up and jumbled. i dunno. @@ -32502,17 +32474,17 @@ who's he reckoned to be? roxy music. and he works at the ? oh stop analyzing! -all i know is cyril's got his bird that's all i know! +all i know is cyril's got his bird that's all i know! ha! -well they had a they've had a bill for er bird seed +well they had a they've had a bill for er bird seed where from? don't know. -from some from somewhere three days after he died! -well i don't know where it were from because ernie used to get his seed from our shop. +from some from somewhere three days after he died! +well i don't know where it were from because ernie used to get his seed from our shop. in staythorpe. yeah. and it weren't brian that sent it. -well he's got it, he's, he's got his, he's got erm a bill and the solicitor has told him that under no circumstances must i pay it. +well he's got it, he's, he's got his, he's got erm a bill and the solicitor has told him that under no circumstances must i pay it. don't pay it! under no circumstances must i pay it! yeah i know! @@ -32543,12 +32515,12 @@ what's this for? market research. then you get . i'm recording you on that tape machine i think. -it's for erm tt everyday conversation. +it's for erm tt everyday conversation. everyday's conversation. -what, me and your dad shouting at each other! +what, me and your dad shouting at each other! yeah. eh! -i might well have got that onto another tape and then every time she says something you just say look what you're doing ! +i might well have got that onto another tape and then every time she says something you just say look what you're doing ! that'll do! no more now. no more! @@ -32557,10 +32529,10 @@ come off it! well that's not really working. what? margaret's not in the . -i wonder if terence'll come today, do that outside wall. +i wonder if terence'll come today, do that outside wall. yeah. they've got to fill it up a bit. -get your feet off your ask her for it then! +get your feet off your ask her for it then! ask her! ask her! hang on! @@ -32574,11 +32546,11 @@ do you know how much? sixty five pence! six ? so margaret we all enjoyed eating them! -about another hour and you'll not be able to see corky's fence. +about another hour and you'll not be able to see corky's fence. i'll be glad when our brighton's off. here! be entrusted to get him on time. -er do you want some advice? +er do you want some advice? what? get done as quick as you can. i've only got two more to do. @@ -32594,7 +32566,7 @@ and you,cos there ain't one in yeah. there. cos he want more and more and more. -i'm just but he needs it. +i'm just but he needs it. that's enough. every week. every, he wouldn't eat them. @@ -32659,10 +32631,10 @@ he's asking you? he's asking you now! he asking you! he asks. -er, there's marion going to work on bus gets to outside my dad's club crash! +er, there's marion going to work on bus gets to outside my dad's club crash! back of bus. i jumped out my skin nearly! -er, summat had ran into back of bus, i don't know what it'd done to, whatever behind us but it didn't hurt bus. +er, summat had ran into back of bus, i don't know what it'd done to, whatever behind us but it didn't hurt bus. no, it's got a great big steel girder at the back! eh! out! @@ -32703,11 +32675,11 @@ yeah. you! get and get leathers! i know he went mad up town. -go and get +go and get you get leathers! leave him! come here. -go and off margaret, go on. +go and off margaret, go on. they say they don't like this, used to like nuts. you're not too fussy are you? they let him come and he won't get any biscuits. @@ -32717,7 +32689,7 @@ all gone now tim. all gone now. she ain't got any more now. you've damn well eaten all my nuts! -he wants your . +he wants your . do you? you can't have a cigarette. . @@ -32776,7 +32748,7 @@ if my number's up, my number's up! no. margaret when you go and,last week when you out of here. it were . -yeah but it were down now monday. +yeah but it were down now monday. oh! it was around here! hampton road. @@ -32788,7 +32760,7 @@ yeah. somebody said a kid got knocked down. it weren't on broadway itself. it turned down one of side streets. -and, i nearly got up to beachfield cos carole said ooh it looks as though it's going down hampton! +and, i nearly got up to beachfield cos carole said ooh it looks as though it's going down hampton! and i never ca i couldn't catch it up. god! it went full belt didn't it dave? @@ -32797,15 +32769,15 @@ ah? down there. well apparently there's an old man down there who got asthma. -that's got asthma, and he often goes into or dia he's a ba diabetic or summat and goes into comas. +that's got asthma, and he often goes into or dia he's a ba diabetic or summat and goes into comas. she told me his name, i don't know. -and you know erm hilary ? +and you know erm hilary ? you know george , that used to do fridges? i dunno. -there were gill that, gillian, hilary, and lynn three lasses with long hair at school? +there were gill that, gillian, hilary, and lynn three lasses with long hair at school? come off grange. -gi er gillian's got right blonde hair. -but they all had plaits right long hair, all of them. +gi er gillian's got right blonde hair. +but they all had plaits right long hair, all of them. i know trevor used to see them. no. wi willie , that's all i know. @@ -32814,8 +32786,8 @@ yeah. no. were they cousins or summat? no. -well er she, she works at midland bank in ta in thorne. -she's about thirty eight maybe. +well er she, she works at midland bank in ta in thorne. +she's about thirty eight maybe. oh! i've seen her. if i remember rightly @@ -32836,22 +32808,22 @@ it is empty. they're knocking down . an old man and woman lived there didn't they? yeah. -who had a garage built onto the side. +who had a garage built onto the side. mm. -and er, the last time i saw them they had a morris minor a gol morri er a blue morris +and er, the last time i saw them they had a morris minor a gol morri er a blue morris a blue one. minor car. cos he er, -does mr still live there down there? +does mr still live there down there? do you know who i mean? no. dan ? don't know. don't know who you mean. -where your mum lived he just lived down the corner. +where your mum lived he just lived down the corner. i didn't know any of them. i didn't even know them who, who lived next door to her at the side of . -all i knew is my mother talked about her that's all, and she, she, my mother knew her but, i didn't. +all i knew is my mother talked about her that's all, and she, she, my mother knew her but, i didn't. i didn't, who the hell's that? prince. @@ -32874,8 +32846,8 @@ did you see that young lad? yeah. i thought he were brilliant that little lad! before michael jackson did. -more practical him living -well he won't go short of a of his erm, tt thingie will he? +more practical him living +well he won't go short of a of his erm, tt thingie will he? no. oh yeah! no i don't like him. @@ -32884,11 +32856,11 @@ he's tries to look like michael jackson don't he? well he di he did a video a and it's a wonder it weren't banned! who? prince. -oh the thing wi +oh the thing wi with his trousers ? did he? oh yeah! -i've seen one oh it might have been michael jackson +i've seen one oh it might have been michael jackson michael jackson. having it off with sheena easton? @@ -32905,18 +32877,18 @@ byes ee bye! see you! yeah. come on, what's wrong with it? -well it's a good letter but your spelling mistake. +well it's a good letter but your spelling mistake. ha! what you should do is erm -the spelling mistakes only occurred when i was shouted. +the spelling mistakes only occurred when i was shouted. yeah. don't worry! i'll put it right. -well do it at work then if you make a mistake just ru ru rub it out. +well do it at work then if you make a mistake just ru ru rub it out. we're not, we'll not be allowed to. how do you know? mhm. -well do it when erm pam's not there. +well do it when erm pam's not there. that's an idea! do it on wednesday. mm. @@ -32925,27 +32897,27 @@ at work. friday. why friday? no i can't do it friday cos i wanna send it off friday. -i'm hoping to get a reply +i'm hoping to get a reply mind you , we won't be going up into, up into to thing until later. will we? yes, but i want to send it from town. -you know, er, we finish work go into the post office and get the reply stamp from there and stamp it and post it +you know, er, we finish work go into the post office and get the reply stamp from there and stamp it and post it mm mm. and it goes from town then. quicker! mhm. cos it'll go into the sorting office and straight yeah. -but then again, i suppose i could do it without the though. -yeah, well you could but mind you, you'll have to do it anyway. +but then again, i suppose i could do it without the though. +yeah, well you could but mind you, you'll have to do it anyway. mind you, you could leave it till monday, next monday and post it. no i want to get it off as soon as i can. don't forget it's in april. and then not long -it's not long till april, then we've gotta gotta get visas and everything. +it's not long till april, then we've gotta gotta get visas and everything. work permits. mm mm. -and erm green card. +and erm green card. green card. the backing. the backing. @@ -32958,7 +32930,7 @@ we gotta wardrobe. have new wardrobes. we'll want a complete new wardrobe. -by the time we get there it should should be warmed up in april. +by the time we get there it should should be warmed up in april. oh i hope so. it's freezing over here! mm mm. @@ -32973,19 +32945,19 @@ but first you've got to get permission. permission? permission. oh! -so we'll have to write to erm we'll have to write to the erm +so we'll have to write to erm we'll have to write to the erm yeah, i know where you can write to, yeah. yeah. -gotta get permission from there and then passports. +gotta get permission from there and then passports. that's the important part ! -passports, visas and and all this lot. +passports, visas and and all this lot. yeah. -and erm i've got to have my hair done. +and erm i've got to have my hair done. your face done! -with a bit of plastic surgery here and there this you know! +with a bit of plastic surgery here and there this you know! plastic surgery. don't need plastic surgery. -i'm a perfectly beautiful plastic surgery is not needed. +i'm a perfectly beautiful plastic surgery is not needed. but in your case it's well needed. yeah ! oh! @@ -32993,21 +32965,21 @@ tt. oh! but first, we've got to finish work. mhm. -it really gave, gives erm jabber jaws something to talk about wouldn't it? +it really gave, gives erm jabber jaws something to talk about wouldn't it? jaws three! -well it could give her something to talk about but she'll be more worried office experience and how old she is, and all this lot! +well it could give her something to talk about but she'll be more worried office experience and how old she is, and all this lot! ah! there's something very, very important that you forgot to say. what? -and you got your hair done, and you got wardrobe and then you got all this lot and that there's one other thing. +and you got your hair done, and you got wardrobe and then you got all this lot and that there's one other thing. what? -you've got to get one very special on your side . +you've got to get one very special on your side . i said that! make arrangements, and get people on your side. well you said that. oh yeah! and i thought of something else as well. -and besides, if it's all rigged like they say you do it'll already be arranged for us. +and besides, if it's all rigged like they say you do it'll already be arranged for us. music! we need the music. ah! @@ -33016,7 +32988,7 @@ well sort that out, later. mm. the jewellery. i want jewellery! -i would think of erm having er pearl necklace. +i would think of erm having er pearl necklace. so that i can take it off and if she gets in my way you can smack her with it! oh no! diamonds. @@ -33025,7 +32997,7 @@ cos you see it cuts. mm mm. and she needs her face rearranging. she needs everything rearranging. -well mind you, what you could really do is just erm, sort of erm have a hammer necklace. +well mind you, what you could really do is just erm, sort of erm have a hammer necklace. hammer? hammer necklace. say it's, new fashion jewellery and every time she gets out of hand just bash her one! @@ -33049,7 +33021,7 @@ hilton. er yeah bu hilton, yeah! but where is the hilton? you know, i'm not sort of er -and we've never to so we don't know. +and we've never to so we don't know. no. ah! it's hollywood. @@ -33064,12 +33036,12 @@ yeah. family. friends. what friends? -tell you there's one person i wouldn't miss. +tell you there's one person i wouldn't miss. who's that then? jane. i don't think jane'd miss jane ! -i don't think jane can see jane. -so we're really going to do it then? +i don't think jane can see jane. +so we're really going to do it then? we're really going to take if the plunge? @@ -33086,43 +33058,43 @@ the big welcome home we'd get if we came over here. especially if we came to sheffield. if we were there. yeah! -home, a sort of home ground as it were. +home, a sort of home ground as it were. mm mm. we'd be bryan adams. the attendants! nobody could be bryan adams! but bryan adams could. -well oh yeah! +well oh yeah! mm. -so but there's one thing ambition and it's to smash that silly cow in the face! -b i c t i will personally do -well le ge well why don't we just use both fists? -we could sort her out together. +so but there's one thing ambition and it's to smash that silly cow in the face! +b i c t i will personally do +well le ge well why don't we just use both fists? +we could sort her out together. but you're forgetting one thing. double you're forgetting one thing. what? she wants what i wanted. please! -don't ever tell anybody you fancy like i was saying, don't ever say you liked him! +don't ever tell anybody you fancy like i was saying, don't ever say you liked him! if you tell anybody well you did once. -if you tell anybody i will deny you are my sister! +if you tell anybody i will deny you are my sister! i will deny everything! deny everything. but it's true, i did like him. -but honestly don't know what you see in him. +but honestly don't know what you see in him. dunno what anybody can see in him! he is awful! -i noticed that when the camera +i noticed that when the camera got onto him ! -you know that he is, you know what they say cameras pick up things. +you know that he is, you know what they say cameras pick up things. i've been on camera. i'm going to be on camera. i've been on camera and it is nerve-wracking! -even if it was in front of the school it was nerve-wracking. +even if it was in front of the school it was nerve-wracking. cos i made -there's one thing i don't like and that's having my photo taken. +there's one thing i don't like and that's having my photo taken. and it will be hard when we have to photos photo sessions! and just think of all those cra cameras! @@ -33133,9 +33105,9 @@ she's beautiful! but she's not. well i mean but in her own way ! -well put it this way +well put it this way go on then. -a dog's better looking than she is so you're in with a chance! +a dog's better looking than she is so you're in with a chance! well she's just called sherry. and don't forget, our dog used to be called sherry! that's another thing i'm gonna get her on! @@ -33148,37 +33120,37 @@ ah don't! but she was better looking than you! ah don't! i like sherry! -i have just insulted of the dog world. +i have just insulted of the dog world. yes you have. i apologize. thank you very much. why are you accepted ? don't forget, our brothers are dogs! and er -we've got a little dog. +we've got a little dog. a little pooch. little pooch! he's so cute! ah! sleepy. -so yeah . +so yeah . so you got i think, i think maybe i would refuse to go, if i go in front of a t v camera. especially if we were doing an interview. ah! and don't forget the talk shows we'd be on! ah no! -do you think we could do you think we could forget about this plan of ours for stardom? +do you think we could do you think we could forget about this plan of ours for stardom? i know i'd, i know i would freeze. i'm not doing it for stardom. we could make movies! no thank you. -you're right though that's when i would freeze. +you're right though that's when i would freeze. starring role with tom short cruise. bloody hell! no way! he's too horrible. -mind you co could be even worser +mind you co could be even worser what could be even worse? acting with tom cruise. what could be even worse than that? @@ -33203,7 +33175,7 @@ but i don't think i'm big. mm mm. look in the mirror? oh very funny! -well if you think that then you go on your own! +well if you think that then you go on your own! wherever you want! oh no! don't want to do it on my own. @@ -33219,34 +33191,34 @@ cor! i sound like the cheese advert don't i? oh! alright then! -there's one difference in the you won't be kissing erm +there's one difference in the you won't be kissing erm veroni veronica dribblethwaite! or her! -do you know, you know when we're talking about moving to america and +do you know, you know when we're talking about moving to america and mm. be in films, well i'm very nervous , we haven't, we haven't even been accepted yet. america, yes. canada . -i wanna try white water rapids. +i wanna try white water rapids. ah! you don't? i do! i don't know why. it looks interesting. -it may sound interesting but it's very dangerous. -don't forget there's all those rocks and the water is cold. +it may sound interesting but it's very dangerous. +don't forget there's all those rocks and the water is cold. alright then, i'll send sherry down there. i'd rather throw her off the empire state building! -one better take her parachute jumping and forgo forget to give her the parachute. +one better take her parachute jumping and forgo forget to give her the parachute. that's even better. -mind you you don't want the ground splattered with horrible things like that though. +mind you you don't want the ground splattered with horrible things like that though. no. -so that sleep on it. +so that sleep on it. yeah. well i'm gonna think about what i'm gonna put in that letter. mm. i think it could do with changing. -mind you my new wardrobe would be bright colours. +mind you my new wardrobe would be bright colours. so would mine. and not dull colours. no, not dull. @@ -33254,7 +33226,7 @@ not brown horrible shirts! i think i might change my hair colour as well every week! oh no! not dyed, wigs. -you know, one week go out with red the next week go out with pink, pink, bright pink or even blonde. +you know, one week go out with red the next week go out with pink, pink, bright pink or even blonde. don't you dare! no i won't. you can go out with any other colour hairstyle, any other colour hair you want, but don't you dare go out with blonde! @@ -33264,8 +33236,8 @@ cos everybody'd be thinking you were me. mind you, does it matter? everybody says we're the same anyway! yeah. -well i'll erm think about it. -i'll tell you what after we've sorted her out we'll sort it out. +well i'll erm think about it. +i'll tell you what after we've sorted her out we'll sort it out. him! who thinks he's erm it! @@ -33273,7 +33245,7 @@ the right word for him! oh i hate that name anyway. it'd be a daft name to live with anyway for the rest of your life! mm. -now, who'd want to be called ellen? +now, who'd want to be called ellen? ellen? yeah. sounds like lemon! @@ -33281,7 +33253,7 @@ shortened! but urgh! no way! -well there's one really name i'd like to be called and no, it's not, it doesn't begin with a. +well there's one really name i'd like to be called and no, it's not, it doesn't begin with a. i wasn't gonna say a. a a er i won't say it . @@ -33289,7 +33261,7 @@ mm. better not do! i won't say it. right. -i know i would get a bit excited if if i was on t v. +i know i would get a bit excited if if i was on t v. lyndsey. lyndsey. especially lyndsey. @@ -33297,17 +33269,17 @@ james and james. d'ya know for kids, they're the only kids that can show, that can make me go bright red! yeah. i know what lyndsey had wanted to do. -autograph of a favourite record. +autograph of a favourite record. i wouldn't be meeting the wrestlers though. -you might be meeting er, the wrestlers but i won't. +you might be meeting er, the wrestlers but i won't. why, what will you be doing? oh i'll think of something! something cheery and nice. -well if you're on the same bill as him, well could always just ask him. +well if you're on the same bill as him, well could always just ask him. or even take her over. no, ask her over. no. -oh no because she'd tell everybody you were used to be in with prat face, prat face ! +oh no because she'd tell everybody you were used to be in with prat face, prat face ! i don't think i can do that. do that sheet properly at work. what sheet? @@ -33318,28 +33290,28 @@ background . we are making yes. that one. -i'm dreading this term when that assessor +i'm dreading this term when that assessor assessor. comes in! you're not the only one! -she scared me witless when she said that on thursday about coming in +she scared me witless when she said that on thursday about coming in assessor. -but he, no one 's expecting him and . +but he, no one 's expecting him and . yeah but he does,sh you don't. you get told in advance. that's alright then. didn't you hear her on friday when she talked to us? -when oh yeah! +when oh yeah! yeah i remember that. -what she says was is erm -i think i'll try to do put some more to this letter. -what she said was last time the assessor came in +what she says was is erm +i think i'll try to do put some more to this letter. +what she said was last time the assessor came in mm. they thought he only wanted to see two people. he's gonna change his mind and no. three. -what, what they thought is that all the ones that +what, what they thought is that all the ones that he tells, he tells us tha that he's going to see two no! but when he gets @@ -33349,18 +33321,18 @@ if you know what i mean? alright! now, they thought it was only gonna be two because there's only two assessing people, right? yeah. -but it turned out to be three and she was put in this an awkward position and she doesn't know what to do, the poor girl who got picked! +but it turned out to be three and she was put in this an awkward position and she doesn't know what to do, the poor girl who got picked! mm. -they a they'll have the other two, they got told in advance but this one, she never. -and that's all that happened. +they a they'll have the other two, they got told in advance but this one, she never. +and that's all that happened. but she says you do,sh that you do get told. but i'm taking no exam! the r s a one exam! oh i know! oh! -mind you if you say it's doing,yo er, started erm writing to somebody you really like and you've gotta get it perfect. +mind you if you say it's doing,yo er, started erm writing to somebody you really like and you've gotta get it perfect. mm. -well that'll be that'll, that will really be hard won't it? +well that'll be that'll, that will really be hard won't it? why? i don't know. did she say you can use a dictionary? @@ -33368,14 +33340,14 @@ yeah. well that'll be da that's daft in your case! why is it? cos you ask me how to spell them! -only because i can't be bothered to look in the dictionary sometimes. +only because i can't be bothered to look in the dictionary sometimes. ho! no? how long have we got till july? february, march, april, may, june, july. not long! six months till july. -well it isn't long when you're in the old . +well it isn't long when you're in the old . that's five now. well i'm not counting this month. but it is really six though int it? @@ -33391,8 +33363,8 @@ that leather outfit. mm. it is nice. no leave it. -i don't you know i might get one myself. -and i want outfits to have the skirts and the jackets. +i don't you know i might get one myself. +and i want outfits to have the skirts and the jackets. yeah. mind you, i don't like the top that goes with it. you know, what she were wearing in the book? @@ -33414,7 +33386,7 @@ what kind of word? one that i thought wrong but i think i've got it right. replied? mhm. -doesn't mm, i've forgotten how to spell it now! +doesn't mm, i've forgotten how to spell it now! r e p l y . i e d . yeah. @@ -33427,7 +33399,7 @@ yes! sorry! do you wear high heels or flat shoes? fairly high. -how big is fairly high? +how big is fairly high? two inches? three? three's too high for me. @@ -33437,7 +33409,7 @@ well there's only two mistakes in it linda. yeah but i haven't really looked at it properly, so no. the mistakes are there in the words -well when i, when i re-do it i'll write it out as i type it and i'll let you see it. +well when i, when i re-do it i'll write it out as i type it and i'll let you see it. okay. first. can i see the other one? @@ -33446,10 +33418,10 @@ no! why not! i said not! great! -so if i wrote a letter and wouldn't let you see it, how would you feel? +so if i wrote a letter and wouldn't let you see it, how would you feel? i wouldn't feel anything cos i'm not really bothered! what if it's about you as well? -well if you write something about me you write something about me! +well if you write something about me you write something about me! and if i don't let you see it, i'm dead? yeah. you're clever! @@ -33458,7 +33430,7 @@ well you think you are! well, if you think, you think! do you know that's ? is it? -well i've not too bothered if you found everything. +well i've not too bothered if you found everything. no. who? as long as you got on well. @@ -33467,23 +33439,23 @@ would you? no. it's funny, in a bit, in a way. yeah. -yo yo it was sort of like he got he got hit on the got run over +yo yo it was sort of like he got he got hit on the got run over knocked down. oh! didn't get run over. run over, he actually went down though. -so do you still want ? +so do you still want ? he's, he's dead! -you di you didn't really expect him er the way they did it, it wasn't like well you didn't believe he was an angel did you? +you di you didn't really expect him er the way they did it, it wasn't like well you didn't believe he was an angel did you? really? until the end. i didn't think he was anyway! no i didn't. until the end. that's what got me. -mind you the title was a bit funny because it didn't almost an angel but if he died and he went to heaven, then he must have been an angel but came back down, he's still an angel. +mind you the title was a bit funny because it didn't almost an angel but if he died and he went to heaven, then he must have been an angel but came back down, he's still an angel. yeah, but an angel on probation, don't forget. -oh the funniest part about it was when he set these people's thing . +oh the funniest part about it was when he set these people's thing . round and round without knowing. yeah. with his sha electric shaver. @@ -33497,11 +33469,11 @@ i suppose that it was filmed where it was so that she'll be in it. probably. she's his wife int she? mm mm. -mind you don johnson and melanie griffi griffith are alright, are man and wife but they're not in every film together are they? +mind you don johnson and melanie griffi griffith are alright, are man and wife but they're not in every film together are they? no. mind you, tom cruise is. yeah. -i know he's married his wife's supposed to be in all his films int she? +i know he's married his wife's supposed to be in all his films int she? she can't act! i know. she cannot act! @@ -33513,8 +33485,8 @@ yeah. bit of everything. mind you, we can't act either. no. -now the best film i've ever seen him in is when he gets killed at the end! -or, even better at the beginning! +now the best film i've ever seen him in is when he gets killed at the end! +or, even better at the beginning! the beginning's much better! mm. we can hardly speak . @@ -33522,13 +33494,13 @@ no. can't help. mind you, his movie career is going downhill a bit. yeah. -he's born on the fourth of july. +he's born on the fourth of july. started going down. yeah. -well, anybody could see that the stupid bu er the way they've he was made up to look like a forty year old and he still looked like a twenty year old! +well, anybody could see that the stupid bu er the way they've he was made up to look like a forty year old and he still looked like a twenty year old! yeah. -and nobody can imagine him like that in twenty years time. -was born on the fourth of july after top gun? +and nobody can imagine him like that in twenty years time. +was born on the fourth of july after top gun? i don't know. or was it after cocktail? i think it was after cocktail. @@ -33537,9 +33509,9 @@ it weren't, it was after! it were after. now cocktail would have been a, been a bit dull if he hadn't have been in it! yep. -still like it when she's in babysitting . +still like it when she's in babysitting . that's a good film. -mind you don't mind going i in the mornings to work but in the middle of the day +mind you don't mind going i in the mornings to work but in the middle of the day no. don't think you no, but if you go in the middle you've got a chance to wake up. @@ -33547,13 +33519,13 @@ well i prefer to be in the mornings so you have to get early don't you? well you do anyway so it don't really matter. but you've got some time to wake up haven't you? -proba yeah but well we haven't got all that long to go now. +proba yeah but well we haven't got all that long to go now. november. mm. never know, you might have a full time job by then. yeah. no but -we might even be in america before then. +we might even be in america before then. well maybe, if only! but, next year will be fine. it'll be alright by me. @@ -33563,28 +33535,28 @@ next year probably. what about this year? while the fuel's still hot. probably this year. -because i am i am beginning to think maybe they could be be erm game feature of the . -i hope i'll i'll wait this year. +because i am i am beginning to think maybe they could be be erm game feature of the . +i hope i'll i'll wait this year. i hope summat ha happens here. it'll be great timing! but wrestle mania's the biggest one here. hulk. i bet he would. -i bet he's . -how about four months? -or when everything's settled. +i bet he's . +how about four months? +or when everything's settled. no. better get in while it's hot. yes, but you've gotta wait for your visas and all that lot, remember, like you said. yeah i know. -and there's another thing one tiny, tiny thing you forgot with all your plans. +and there's another thing one tiny, tiny thing you forgot with all your plans. what's that? how are we gonna get you up in the air? easy. put me in an aeroplane! yes! alright then. -your fear of flying is over! +your fear of flying is over! right? yeah. but i am still going to sit right at the back of the aeroplane away from you! @@ -33592,7 +33564,7 @@ and i still remember what you did to me in the car. i won't be air sick! i can still remember what you did to me in the car. it wasn't my fault, had a big breakfast. -well if you we if you knew you were gonna be sick you could have made it a bit more a different colour than that! +well if you we if you knew you were gonna be sick you could have made it a bit more a different colour than that! urgh! urgh! what's wrong with fiery red ? @@ -33600,7 +33572,7 @@ thank heavens it didn't go on my purple top! ah dear. i do like eggs and bacon for breakfast! urgh! -did you have to mention meat! +did you have to mention meat! ooh! there's nothing wrong with bacon. if you happen to like bacon. @@ -33614,7 +33586,7 @@ come here! what for? aren't you funny? you're very, very funny! -very, very funny ! +very, very funny ! you're very ugly! what were you saying? or what you don't say? @@ -33623,14 +33595,14 @@ i dunno, i forgot. come on! what were you gonna say? what? -supposing we was over there in america for the beginning of july i couldn't go. +supposing we was over there in america for the beginning of july i couldn't go. why? oh linda! mind you, i suppose there's plenty of concerts to go to. yeah, but this'll be my first concert. so! -go and see in concert. +go and see in concert. .guns and roses. guns and roses i'm sorry ! i know you can't stand guns and roses. @@ -33639,11 +33611,11 @@ i'd go and see a guns and roses concert. i wouldn't. and take some concrete with me. i wouldn't. -and do them a nice pair of shoes to walk in . +and do them a nice pair of shoes to walk in . no. -can't be so mean to animals can you? +can't be so mean to animals can you? no. -yeah but none of them none of them have had a brilliant album out. +yeah but none of them none of them have had a brilliant album out. go for bryan adams or yeah. you can get to go see bryan adams in concert. @@ -33662,7 +33634,7 @@ i'm sure there's plenty of others. mm? plenty of others. suppose so. -but this is, is a special birthday. +but this is, is a special birthday. just cos he's reaching thirty. ah! and he'll be twenty two in may. @@ -33679,23 +33651,23 @@ yeah. sorry! you're only a baby! get stuffed! -put it this way if i'm only baby, how come people younger than me have already got a family? +put it this way if i'm only baby, how come people younger than me have already got a family? i know. you've gotta put that down to it. i was your baby at twenty one. yeah. well stop calling me a baby! -just because i'm youngest. +just because i'm youngest. not talking to you any more! are you not? just don't feel like it now! don't talk to me any more then! the only time you can talk to me, you can, when we've got the tickets and we're going. oh! -and erm eh! +and erm eh! that's an idea! if i do my exam well before you -you can tell me what to expect . +you can tell me what to expect . no. i could change my hairstyle and yeah! @@ -33706,7 +33678,7 @@ you could do it for me! but i'm not cheating. i think they'll know the difference though. how do you know? -you're shorter than me ! +you're shorter than me ! not all that short! nice int it? thickest and sho and short. @@ -33732,7 +33704,7 @@ this guy here. him in the red trunks? mm. oh! -he's that and he's run up and down. +he's that and he's run up and down. these ref referees erm, fighters have funny names don't they? do you know what tracey wanted me earlier for? she was writing, she wanted me to look at it. @@ -33775,7 +33747,7 @@ pocket's all wet! and dry it. the inside's dry! you know what i mean? -well that's er dry but oh it doesn't matter. +well that's er dry but oh it doesn't matter. i'll put these on. prefer my own jeans. now what you doing? @@ -33806,28 +33778,28 @@ well if you er, change it but put it this way oh yes! we could win a trip to the grammy's in new york. -we could we could erm rub shoulders with erm amy grant could spend the evening with her then. -you you liar! +we could we could erm rub shoulders with erm amy grant could spend the evening with her then. +you you liar! he did. you liar! honest! you liar! -and then it said, and you, you might get to see prince with his erm . +and then it said, and you, you might get to see prince with his erm . i'd rather see our dog kill our brian! -well, not kill our brian sort of +well, not kill our brian sort of you did. you did brian, i sa honest. but i'd rather be there . never visit the se er, awards like that is he? -he goes and he goes if you live in new york we'll take you to the erm he said then we'll we'll let you fly around the city for a while ! +he goes and he goes if you live in new york we'll take you to the erm he said then we'll we'll let you fly around the city for a while ! yes, but then the trouble didn't mean it like! you didn't mean it? are you joking? no i'm not! the erm, thing about the erm -the trip, but the er flight? -about the flight round er new york, i was only joking. +the trip, but the er flight? +about the flight round er new york, i was only joking. oh i'm . he's so nice! nice face. @@ -33840,81 +33812,80 @@ it's your . did you see anything in here? yes, you showed me everything in there. no, tracey, show me. -i'm gonna get a proper conditioner for my hair cos it don't look! -how can you make sha conditioner ? +i'm gonna get a proper conditioner for my hair cos it don't look! +how can you make sha conditioner ? have you really chickened out? definitely chickened out! -look at that time my dad did that lady over there and left me on the phone and told me to stay there and i was like that. +look at that time my dad did that lady over there and left me on the phone and told me to stay there and i was like that. and yeah, but what about me? -mind you, i've had more erm appeara more erm +mind you, i've had more erm appeara more erm you've had more experience of erm, cameras than i have. why? just because i've been in front of a camcorder! -i wouldn't say i've had experience in movies. -that's the trouble with though she didn't stop every time to get ready for the next scene. -all she did was say carry on as normal. +i wouldn't say i've had experience in movies. +that's the trouble with though she didn't stop every time to get ready for the next scene. +all she did was say carry on as normal. no, he did that. ah! -i suppose if you get, when you get there everything'll be alright. -but it was your idea of erm entrances that got me a bit scared. -from the top more from the top. +i suppose if you get, when you get there everything'll be alright. +but it was your idea of erm entrances that got me a bit scared. +from the top more from the top. top. -yeah, but just sa say, if you come from th the top you, you're like a a waist thing round you and if you fall off that'll catch you. +yeah, but just sa say, if you come from th the top you, you're like a a waist thing round you and if you fall off that'll catch you. so what do you think? about the entrance? can i have a ? -you could come down on the the first half and i can jump and that's like wrestle mania. +you could come down on the the first half and i can jump and that's like wrestle mania. mm. mm. but our feet will come down like that. -put it this way trace i am more petrified than about this than you are. +put it this way trace i am more petrified than about this than you are. that would be a nightmare! will it? -rod stewart on the ooh! - +rod stewart on the ooh! notices for you, first of all those of you who are on the committee . -any er ideas you've got you've got, please pass on to the committee member thursday dinner time. -the only other er notice i've got for you is that tomorrow i forgot to put it on the notices tomorrow we've got a lot of visitors in school there's about er thirty five of them coming over who are likely to be joining us in the lower sixth next september er lessons with the lower sixth to find out what erm what lessons are like you know okay. +any er ideas you've got you've got, please pass on to the committee member thursday dinner time. +the only other er notice i've got for you is that tomorrow i forgot to put it on the notices tomorrow we've got a lot of visitors in school there's about er thirty five of them coming over who are likely to be joining us in the lower sixth next september er lessons with the lower sixth to find out what erm what lessons are like you know okay. now do welcome them, do make them feel at home, especially those of you who are new to the place you will know and remember what it's like when you first come into a strange building that feels like home. -okay, so erm do them and then if they're lost on practical things like they don't know where the toilet is will you help them. +okay, so erm do them and then if they're lost on practical things like they don't know where the toilet is will you help them. and er -thank you the only is that you will have seen organised generally supported that although i think we could support it a lot better than we have. -so er think about that and remember -it's a different format mr dexter this time, we're not having maths we're having a ten minute and that will be followed by a concert . -it's a completely different format, so you might might like to come to that okay. -erm this morning we have er another visitor and who actually was a teacher and works at at a very senior position er heading er very interesting projects to technical location educations and i would like to er introduce you to mr +thank you the only is that you will have seen organised generally supported that although i think we could support it a lot better than we have. +so er think about that and remember +it's a different format mr dexter this time, we're not having maths we're having a ten minute and that will be followed by a concert . +it's a completely different format, so you might might like to come to that okay. +erm this morning we have er another visitor and who actually was a teacher and works at at a very senior position er heading er very interesting projects to technical location educations and i would like to er introduce you to mr good morning everybody. -it's about er ten years ago nearly that i er stopped being a teacher and when i was a teacher er up having to do assemblies er it was always something that i did with great reluctance and er was er pleased if i could get other people to do it er it seems rather odd then er that i've actually said yes coming to do er an assembly here today and it's perhaps a sign of mental instability on my part. +it's about er ten years ago nearly that i er stopped being a teacher and when i was a teacher er up having to do assemblies er it was always something that i did with great reluctance and er was er pleased if i could get other people to do it er it seems rather odd then er that i've actually said yes coming to do er an assembly here today and it's perhaps a sign of mental instability on my part. er what is necessary for me to also convey to you is that the theme that i was given today was one of forgiveness . -er the only difference between the situation now and the situation when i was a teacher is that there are a lot of christians in this room per square metre than there would have been in a school where i taught and that applies to where i work now er because er the number of christians who are around me in in the workplace are actually even smaller i guess and er that may be something that er you will need to recognise is an unusual feature of your school life and that er as you leave school so you're going to go into very different environments where people behave very differently. -when a colleague discovered that i was coming here to do this er she saw it as laughable and she also saw it as something that i would prefer to keep quiet from my colleagues and tried a bit of moral blackmail on me as well to say i'm going to tell them about that if you don't them about this sort of thing. -er to contact when you're talking about forgiveness er well that was just the end you know that point. -life isn't always like that for me and there are times when i do have -christians around me when i am on sundays and on sundays i'm often involved in my own church with er preaching appointments and for me when i'm preaching the the good news that is the heart of is actually one of forgiveness. -i know from my own life of faith that my thoughts, my words and my often fail to match up to the christian ideal there is much that i do that hurts other people and there is much that i do that does not reflect christ. +er the only difference between the situation now and the situation when i was a teacher is that there are a lot of christians in this room per square metre than there would have been in a school where i taught and that applies to where i work now er because er the number of christians who are around me in in the workplace are actually even smaller i guess and er that may be something that er you will need to recognise is an unusual feature of your school life and that er as you leave school so you're going to go into very different environments where people behave very differently. +when a colleague discovered that i was coming here to do this er she saw it as laughable and she also saw it as something that i would prefer to keep quiet from my colleagues and tried a bit of moral blackmail on me as well to say i'm going to tell them about that if you don't them about this sort of thing. +er to contact when you're talking about forgiveness er well that was just the end you know that point. +life isn't always like that for me and there are times when i do have +christians around me when i am on sundays and on sundays i'm often involved in my own church with er preaching appointments and for me when i'm preaching the the good news that is the heart of is actually one of forgiveness. +i know from my own life of faith that my thoughts, my words and my often fail to match up to the christian ideal there is much that i do that hurts other people and there is much that i do that does not reflect christ. the christians good news is that guilt and shame that i have of such behaviour is actually taken away from me. i don't deserve that forgiveness, but the god who loves me who has actually died on the cross for me has actually taken all of that away and more than that has made me new, has actually raised me as a new life with him. i've been lifted out of my selfishness. -now you think that because i am i am forgiven and i preach forgiveness that i would be pretty good as up people, but that's part of my human failure and i must admit that i've given plenty of opportunity to practice at home and at work er the opportunity to forgive, but it doesn't come easily and certainly it isn't a strong feature of the non-christian world in which i work and which you will be working soon. +now you think that because i am i am forgiven and i preach forgiveness that i would be pretty good as up people, but that's part of my human failure and i must admit that i've given plenty of opportunity to practice at home and at work er the opportunity to forgive, but it doesn't come easily and certainly it isn't a strong feature of the non-christian world in which i work and which you will be working soon. forgiveness is not a strong feature of life. -you've been brought up in a television age and you've been particularly been brought up in an age of card cartoons and soap operas and in all of those you would er expect to see good being oppressed that's part of the plot in every cartoon there is a plot in every soap opera, that the good the good people actually end up in difficult situations and the way that results in the cartoons and in the soap operas is usually find revenge or punishment. -let me give an example dirty den got his comeuppance in eastenders erm the road runner always er wants er always manages to get that crafty bull er to the follies of his own tracks. +you've been brought up in a television age and you've been particularly been brought up in an age of card cartoons and soap operas and in all of those you would er expect to see good being oppressed that's part of the plot in every cartoon there is a plot in every soap opera, that the good the good people actually end up in difficult situations and the way that results in the cartoons and in the soap operas is usually find revenge or punishment. +let me give an example dirty den got his comeuppance in eastenders erm the road runner always er wants er always manages to get that crafty bull er to the follies of his own tracks. it's all to do with revenge and punishment rather than with forgiveness. -the only trouble with storylines like that is that life is for more complicated er we may want to see justice be done, we may want to see virtue being rewarded, we may want to see er all of those things happen, but when we make mistakes when we make mistakes, when we are not virtuous, we actually end up not being too keen, but justice should be applied straight away. +the only trouble with storylines like that is that life is for more complicated er we may want to see justice be done, we may want to see virtue being rewarded, we may want to see er all of those things happen, but when we make mistakes when we make mistakes, when we are not virtuous, we actually end up not being too keen, but justice should be applied straight away. we actually want mercy, we want forgiveness, we want leniency. -i've got on the tape here a song which is by manny fryer he used to sing in steel ice band er now i know that that's sort of very old hat, i'm sorry, but i sort of live in the past and er this er i i believe also that these days so that er you know i can sort of justify that but this is a song that er she has sung which er reminds us that each of us has the potential to commit the crime i'll try not to play it fast forward, let's see how we go. +i've got on the tape here a song which is by manny fryer he used to sing in steel ice band er now i know that that's sort of very old hat, i'm sorry, but i sort of live in the past and er this er i i believe also that these days so that er you know i can sort of justify that but this is a song that er she has sung which er reminds us that each of us has the potential to commit the crime i'll try not to play it fast forward, let's see how we go. .consider today and it's two things. -i'm inviting you to consider how far a christian should go in forgiving and to how far a christian organisation like this school should go, in showing forgiveness er i just want to kick you off with one or two points on each of those. -that i on the first point about us and our own showing of forgiveness. -jesus himself has things to say, for example his disciples asked him how many times should i forgive somebody else. -i was actually looking at you before i came in, but just come out here for a second there are two ways i can hurt you. -actually there's probably probably three ways that i can hurt you. +i'm inviting you to consider how far a christian should go in forgiving and to how far a christian organisation like this school should go, in showing forgiveness er i just want to kick you off with one or two points on each of those. +that i on the first point about us and our own showing of forgiveness. +jesus himself has things to say, for example his disciples asked him how many times should i forgive somebody else. +i was actually looking at you before i came in, but just come out here for a second there are two ways i can hurt you. +actually there's probably probably three ways that i can hurt you. one way i can hurt you is physically all right? -and another way i can hurt you is er mentally and the third way i can hurt you is by combining the two together. +and another way i can hurt you is er mentally and the third way i can hurt you is by combining the two together. all right? but i think that basically there's either two or three ways that each one of us has the ability to hurt somebody else. -you've been doing it to each other all the time but if i were to hurt you or if anybody else here were to hurt you physically or mentally how many times would you forgive them? +you've been doing it to each other all the time but if i were to hurt you or if anybody else here were to hurt you physically or mentally how many times would you forgive them? if they did it once, would you forgive them? yes. yeah, probably. @@ -33922,47 +33893,47 @@ if they did the same thing again to you? maybe. maybe. and the third time? -er it's very hard to keep on forgiving somebody for hurting you in the same way over and over again and in this particular example, three times and that's it. -just just all right. -don't more than three times all right thank you very much for your help there. +er it's very hard to keep on forgiving somebody for hurting you in the same way over and over again and in this particular example, three times and that's it. +just just all right. +don't more than three times all right thank you very much for your help there. there is another question, how many times do i forgive somebody. -should it be as many as seven times and jesus had replied both no, no you should be able to forgive forgive them seven times, it should be seventy times in other words stop thinking about counting and just get on with the forgiving. -and in the prayer that jesus +should it be as many as seven times and jesus had replied both no, no you should be able to forgive forgive them seven times, it should be seventy times in other words stop thinking about counting and just get on with the forgiving. +and in the prayer that jesus he says that we should say god please forgive us as we forgive others. -so how far do you actually want god to forgive you up to three times and then no more you know it's it's that kind of er question that we're asking and that we that i feel that is something we should be thinking about that how far should a christian go in forgiving. -it's er all this is a fascinating theory or is it a question in real life. +so how far do you actually want god to forgive you up to three times and then no more you know it's it's that kind of er question that we're asking and that we that i feel that is something we should be thinking about that how far should a christian go in forgiving. +it's er all this is a fascinating theory or is it a question in real life. i invite you to think about just how far you should go in forgiving others in daily living, whether it's in here or outside. another on the second point about how far a christian organisation like this school should go in showing forgiveness. -you may be familiar with those sorts of stories which say my convent life was hell with the sisters of mercy er that kind of story about er church organisations that absolute not to show er christian qualities in the way that they are organised is quite true that often christian organisations do find it hard to show forgiveness. -so should a school like this one equip for the realities of unforgiveness of the world outside, or should it be much more generous in the way it shows forgiveness and can a school be organised so that it does actually reflect christ's teaching on forgiveness. -is this the impossible. +you may be familiar with those sorts of stories which say my convent life was hell with the sisters of mercy er that kind of story about er church organisations that absolute not to show er christian qualities in the way that they are organised is quite true that often christian organisations do find it hard to show forgiveness. +so should a school like this one equip for the realities of unforgiveness of the world outside, or should it be much more generous in the way it shows forgiveness and can a school be organised so that it does actually reflect christ's teaching on forgiveness. +is this the impossible. i'll be interested to hear what the teachers have to think about that and like you. -can we just end with a a short story about the job that i used to do before i did this one. -when i went to the first meeting i had been appointed to the job, i went to the first meeting and there in front of me were lots of people who were managing their own schools and they were organising how to spend money that they had been allocated. +can we just end with a a short story about the job that i used to do before i did this one. +when i went to the first meeting i had been appointed to the job, i went to the first meeting and there in front of me were lots of people who were managing their own schools and they were organising how to spend money that they had been allocated. all sorts of managing business and they had to work together and to hold group organisations. -the person whom i was going to take over the job from said to me at the end of the meeting well what do you think of that meeting and i must admit i the answer and luckily somebody else instructed with some other business and i felt i got off the hook here but in fact that got dealt with very quickly and he came back to me and said well what did you think of the meeting and i had to say to him just one word,was the way i put it. -because everybody in that meeting was thinking about blaming other people they were actually trying to say it's not my fault that thing come in, it's not my fault that things are like this, it's somebody else's fault in a different organisation. +the person whom i was going to take over the job from said to me at the end of the meeting well what do you think of that meeting and i must admit i the answer and luckily somebody else instructed with some other business and i felt i got off the hook here but in fact that got dealt with very quickly and he came back to me and said well what did you think of the meeting and i had to say to him just one word,was the way i put it. +because everybody in that meeting was thinking about blaming other people they were actually trying to say it's not my fault that thing come in, it's not my fault that things are like this, it's somebody else's fault in a different organisation. it's not us, it's them. -and then i had to work with these people and i knew that that was the kind of way that they were operating and i had to teach them by the way i worked but in fact it was okay to admit that we do make mistakes. -we have to admit that each one of us could fail in what we were supposed to be doing and in fact then we could work together, that we could forgive each other and that we could support each other in our work. +and then i had to work with these people and i knew that that was the kind of way that they were operating and i had to teach them by the way i worked but in fact it was okay to admit that we do make mistakes. +we have to admit that each one of us could fail in what we were supposed to be doing and in fact then we could work together, that we could forgive each other and that we could support each other in our work. in my present job i still try to keep that going. -we do need to be able to show forgiveness in all the things that we do but it isn't easy and jesus devotion to is a great challenge to us as to just how far we can go. +we do need to be able to show forgiveness in all the things that we do but it isn't easy and jesus devotion to is a great challenge to us as to just how far we can go. so in your groups now i appreciate it and i have asked . erm i'd like you to be considering those two points. first how far a christian should go in showing forgiveness and second how far a christian organisation like this school should go in showing forgiveness. thanks for your patience. that was very kind of you sir james erm . -particular example, remember this is all confidential i i'm told so er er it won't go any further than this room. -got anything +particular example, remember this is all confidential i i'm told so er er it won't go any further than this room. +got anything all the time so do you think it's something to do with maturity perhaps a child, a child is this wha what do you mean by forgiving? -you can forgive or punish at the same time can't you, you can punish somebody and say that is wrong and yet you forgive them, that is you don't hold it against them but you later on. +you can forgive or punish at the same time can't you, you can punish somebody and say that is wrong and yet you forgive them, that is you don't hold it against them but you later on. they may get they get sort of get a bad name and perhaps not no. no. -you also have to think of the effect it has on other people, how er if you just let people get away with it, it doesn't mean you hate them, loathe them and damn them but er you've got to make them realise that for other people, for everybody. +you also have to think of the effect it has on other people, how er if you just let people get away with it, it doesn't mean you hate them, loathe them and damn them but er you've got to make them realise that for other people, for everybody. what do you think er graham. -what the parents you know . +what the parents you know . one-to-one yes . martina? @@ -33970,48 +33941,48 @@ really. how then, how then? christians are supposed to forgive, but what if say it's the mother of somebody who had a child that's been murdered or if somebody has been raped you cannot say that they should forgive you cos they were a christian. there's a lot of talk about forgiving or forgetting isn't there, some people say i can forgive but i can never forget. -er you might think about some of these parents who have children murdered in the how much do you think revenge comes into it? +er you might think about some of these parents who have children murdered in the how much do you think revenge comes into it? is it? -it's not that they're in rehabilitation, it's just like seeing that person is locked away in the prime of their lives revenge . +it's not that they're in rehabilitation, it's just like seeing that person is locked away in the prime of their lives revenge . is this revenge or is this just the stopping other people from suffering really? shut up anyway they ask about school say, but i don't think schools have the authority really to do anything either way about er forgiveness. -it's like if you fall out with a teacher on the first day of term, if that teacher -you haven't that chapter for the rest of the year and say the teacher probably thinks well this child and -i think forgiveness is not always +it's like if you fall out with a teacher on the first day of term, if that teacher +you haven't that chapter for the rest of the year and say the teacher probably thinks well this child and +i think forgiveness is not always an ideal forgive thine enemy always remember well next time i'll kick you okay number one. yes, yes, yes. number one then please spell the word romeo, romeo. -number two spell the word juliet number three spell the word capulet, capulet. -number four spell the word montague, montague number five spell the word tybaot, tybaot number six spell benbolio, benbolio number seven balthasar, balthasar number eight spell the word escales, escales, the prince of rome. -number nine spell the word mercutio, mercutio number ten spell the word paris number eleven is worth two marks i want you to spell friar and lawrence. +number two spell the word juliet number three spell the word capulet, capulet. +number four spell the word montague, montague number five spell the word tybaot, tybaot number six spell benbolio, benbolio number seven balthasar, balthasar number eight spell the word escales, escales, the prince of rome. +number nine spell the word mercutio, mercutio number ten spell the word paris number eleven is worth two marks i want you to spell friar and lawrence. you get a mark for each. friar and lawrence, friar and lawrence. next one, mantua, mantua. -when romeo went to mantua then verona, verona the last one is apothecary, apothecary, the man who sells romeo the poison. +when romeo went to mantua then verona, verona the last one is apothecary, apothecary, the man who sells romeo the poison. apothecary. okay, swap books then. -right, we'll go through them then erm and i would like to put your hands up tell me how to spell them. +right, we'll go through them then erm and i would like to put your hands up tell me how to spell them. so number one romeo, can someone spell romeo for me please. r o m e o perhaps it was . mum, what's the difference between these pink ones and the normal ones? dunno really! -nice is it? +nice is it? what pink? i bought some this morning. -i just went into the kitchen then . +i just went into the kitchen then . god! dog! come on then! come on then, in you come! jack! in you come! -stand there and you can er er cold ! +stand there and you can er er cold ! i think it's just a different kind of brochure. sorry? i thought it was a different kind of brochure that's all. @@ -34020,7 +33991,7 @@ are you in here? very good! . want some coffee? -erm please? +erm please? can i have it white though mum? sorry? can i have it white though? @@ -34028,12 +33999,12 @@ white. white coffee? yeah. i always do white coffee! -no you don't you do something like that browny colour. +no you don't you do something like that browny colour. what? more milk in you mean? yeah. a lot more milk, about half. -i bet you're absolutely delighted it's half term aren't you? +i bet you're absolutely delighted it's half term aren't you? not really. no? not really. @@ -34049,7 +34020,7 @@ yeah! it'll be you can't do this, you can't do that! i won't do anything! what's beth doing this week? -she's gone off to erm isle of wight. +she's gone off to erm isle of wight. what? she's going back to the isle of wight. she's not is she? @@ -34068,7 +34039,7 @@ have to have jo over then won't you? eh? i suppose! you gotta have jo down haven't you? -no, don't worry they just just gets on my nerves that's all. +no, don't worry they just just gets on my nerves that's all. what? gets on my nerves that's all. why? @@ -34091,11 +34062,11 @@ i haven't got any. i won't be able to get any. what a disaster! they've already been today. -erm what's similar? +erm what's similar? oh god! i don't know! -erm da da da da da. -rothmans got an r on the end! +erm da da da da da. +rothmans got an r on the end! ah yes, liam ! yeah i the number threes are quite popular. @@ -34103,7 +34074,7 @@ is it? okay. one sixty nine. we'll go for those then. -and . +and . yeah, thank you. that'll do. one sixty nine then please? @@ -34119,11 +34090,11 @@ thanks ever so sorry about that! mu , that's okay! don't worry! -i'm sure i can manage! +i'm sure i can manage! thanks a lot then! bye! jack! -i can't hold it's killing my back you'll have to take him! +i can't hold it's killing my back you'll have to take him! yeah. bad dog! she's gonna mi miss the train in a minute! @@ -34149,8 +34120,8 @@ is the sit down! right platform? yes. -she's just going completely bonkers woman! -no cos come on then! +she's just going completely bonkers woman! +no cos come on then! over here with him je! please don't pull! hey!! @@ -34161,19 +34132,19 @@ where's she gone? she'll be up there. sure we're on the right platform? think so. -he shot me down the spar shop at about ninety five miles an hour! +he shot me down the spar shop at about ninety five miles an hour! my back! hopefully, i think it's late anyway. ah ! shall we have a sit down in a minute then? oh fine! je! -erm, when the er train comes he's gotta go over because he won't like it. +erm, when the er train comes he's gotta go over because he won't like it. been up here before! -no but he's i it's slightly altered since then. +no but he's i it's slightly altered since then. oh right. then? -i've had to buy some really horrible ones! +i've had to buy some really horrible ones! mm! loads of chocolate! oh that's for us on saturday night. @@ -34185,8 +34156,8 @@ dunno. didn't ask. now? yeah. -nearly killed me that dog! -i haven't erm taken him for absolutely ages! +nearly killed me that dog! +i haven't erm taken him for absolutely ages! he's so cuddly ain't he? mm. i took him to the spar shop ! @@ -34200,26 +34171,26 @@ he's been down! he's been to the station before. yes, but he hasn't been for ages has he? -and he's been wrestling with this alsatian +and he's been wrestling with this alsatian see if jack goes towards the -puppy and he bowled the puppy over ! +puppy and he bowled the puppy over ! jack's . no just stop him. oh for go je! jessica! you just get him over excited! -stop being stop getting him +stop being stop getting him look you've got the neurotic! for goodness sake! -cor that was a proper macho man i could tell! +cor that was a proper macho man i could tell! would he be on ? -probably will hands . +probably will hands . yeah. calm down now. good boy! calm down. -oh this one's only everyone +oh this one's only everyone sit! said to me this morning. lie down! @@ -34232,13 +34203,13 @@ nothing. i love going on a nice train journey! i wish i was coming with you. i know. -just sit and and you don't have +just sit and and you don't have five hours? oh i'd love it! i would love so would i. it! -that's already now. +that's already now. oh it's packed this train innit? oh it's a policeman! oh no! @@ -34247,16 +34218,16 @@ sit down! lie down! no. don't harass him all the time jessica you make him neurotic! -get all that for bloody i owe that back rent don't i? +get all that for bloody i owe that back rent don't i? here it comes. it's late. no it's on time isn't it? five . -oh no it's not, everybody's moving! +oh no it's not, everybody's moving! no it's the wrong one! it's the wrong one! -it's going into another statwell so that little . -i used to go to primary school in this on a train. +it's going into another statwell so that little . +i used to go to primary school in this on a train. we did once didn't we? yeah! look at that! @@ -34275,14 +34246,14 @@ ten p off. oh! that's it. no. -oh no he's +oh no he's he's very good! he's very oh well good! he's a good boy! he's ! -yeah, all fluffy and good aren't you? +yeah, all fluffy and good aren't you? tongue hanging out! got lovely bright eyes! looking very well these days! @@ -34290,15 +34261,15 @@ masters again, yeah. what do you mean masters? mastered to get into the race. just gave it some thought, give it some thought and initiative and you're in! -i bet, i bet he's scared -i walked down this ledge , walked down the stage and there's for security guards. -you cannot walk past them if you're going in that way. -so we had to go past this little shed which is right up right up this stupid grass earthy bank right over the side so we could see quickly how to get in. -went right round the bottom of this field, looked round the bank and there was just a bloody great hole in the gate massive! -walked through there and got to the simulator took our jackets off, pretended we'd already been in walked straight past and we were right on site! +i bet, i bet he's scared +i walked down this ledge , walked down the stage and there's for security guards. +you cannot walk past them if you're going in that way. +so we had to go past this little shed which is right up right up this stupid grass earthy bank right over the side so we could see quickly how to get in. +went right round the bottom of this field, looked round the bank and there was just a bloody great hole in the gate massive! +walked through there and got to the simulator took our jackets off, pretended we'd already been in walked straight past and we were right on site! we wasn't aware it was there. well i thought, saved us twenty quid! -so all ? +so all ? we were going , we were in! we're in! we're in! @@ -34312,23 +34283,23 @@ yeah. i used an what old one. -so those but fantasia passes are very similar, i just turned mine turned mine round she saw it and went she showed me a blank yellow so i didn't thought it perhaps a different pass but it wasn't just turned it round on her. -i bet your friends a will be sick then, won't they? +so those but fantasia passes are very similar, i just turned mine turned mine round she saw it and went she showed me a blank yellow so i didn't thought it perhaps a different pass but it wasn't just turned it round on her. +i bet your friends a will be sick then, won't they? i just think that when you're up there it's like the stage is a huge platform going out into the crowd, a long one! and there must have been about ten thousand there last time. -they had one of those gyroscopes you can go in and you can spin round. +they had one of those gyroscopes you can go in and you can spin round. oh yeah! -they had one of those in there but i didn't have a go on it though, it was about three quid to go on! -those lasers lasers that the . +they had one of those in there but i didn't have a go on it though, it was about three quid to go on! +those lasers lasers that the . velcro walls? no, they didn't have that there. -a huge octopus,octopus -ish, had these massive tentacles that's going right the way across the ceiling! +a huge octopus,octopus -ish, had these massive tentacles that's going right the way across the ceiling! video screens. very good! they're all gonna be pissed on friday cos we got in for nothing! why is your voice so quiet? -cos the washing machine out there it's . -what sort of smoke from the machine? +cos the washing machine out there it's . +what sort of smoke from the machine? hiss! oh it's ? no ! @@ -34338,33 +34309,33 @@ oh! mum! i've got to write to bicksons. mm. -ask them to write me a reference so i got form to fill in to send off for something but i've gotta write something. +ask them to write me a reference so i got form to fill in to send off for something but i've gotta write something. and i've gotta to, i've gotta say something to them. yeah, well? and i dunno who i'm writing to either. -well, put the principal. +well, put the principal. what should i say? what do you think i should say? -ask to write me a ah i know who i'll ask, alright.. -well cos said that this guy said that 's the guy in so i could +ask to write me a ah i know who i'll ask, alright.. +well cos said that this guy said that 's the guy in so i could well then you i can -have to send him a stamped envelope with the address of the guy and putting on it. -he'll be more inclined to do it then won't he? +have to send him a stamped envelope with the address of the guy and putting on it. +he'll be more inclined to do it then won't he? oh what , what inside in the -inside the letter that you're writing to him. +inside the letter that you're writing to him. i think that that would probably be quite a good idea wouldn't it, really? yes? you must be exhausted? why don't you go to sleep? this stuff haven't i? i've got things to do. -i suppose we could just ignore it. +i suppose we could just ignore it. it's a waste of a day isn't it, really? -i'd rather be extremely tired. +i'd rather be extremely tired. saw zac last night. what did erm, he say? -that's why, i said i, i said i'd heard about you in the papers and the just said oh yeah! +that's why, i said i, i said i'd heard about you in the papers and the just said oh yeah! was he embarrassed? no. wouldn't you be? @@ -34374,8 +34345,8 @@ see you've got that thing going whilst my voice is going. it's alright. i took it down to the spar shop as well. did you? -and erm i took it to the park with jack and he kept pulling and i said bloody dog! -and and then er i took it to the station as well, but i couldn't get many other voices, they were a bit garbled but it works really well! +and erm i took it to the park with jack and he kept pulling and i said bloody dog! +and and then er i took it to the station as well, but i couldn't get many other voices, they were a bit garbled but it works really well! it is such a good machine that! the mike on that is so good! what's he barking about? @@ -34387,7 +34358,7 @@ look! why is he always barking? just for . speak to me . -so erm did dad say anything else then? +so erm did dad say anything else then? about the trip? not really. he just told you off for being a pain, i bet! @@ -34395,7 +34366,7 @@ did he? telling me to take my earring out to have my passport photos done. and take my earring out when i go to have an interview. if they don't love me for what i am that's just tough shit! -yeah, but i mean if it, if it erm if it means that that it might spoil your entry into it, it's such a sa small thing isn't it? +yeah, but i mean if it, if it erm if it means that that it might spoil your entry into it, it's such a sa small thing isn't it? really? eh? they would employ if it was just such a small thing. @@ -34407,9 +34378,9 @@ feel like one! no. too expensive! what? -i was gonna offer you a drink then if you said yes. +i was gonna offer you a drink then if you said yes. i'll make mine if i had to! -one of those old ones maybe, not the tesco ones. +one of those old ones maybe, not the tesco ones. mm. oh thanks. oh he's just eaten my toast out of my hand this dog! @@ -34419,15 +34390,15 @@ you should get more of the . aha! i can't help it after that. where's your ? -bring your down. +bring your down. go back up again. where did poppa go? oh dear! i'm so tired! you, i thought you are you just start getting the shakes by the window again weren't you? -he'll be going to centre of erm dog standing out there. +he'll be going to centre of erm dog standing out there. let's have a look. -i'll have that small coffee. +i'll have that small coffee. it's up there look. can you see it? where? @@ -34440,35 +34411,35 @@ rupert, you still owe me two cigarettes! yeah, i'm going to give you those now! great! would you? -cos i haven't got very many ah, i'm so tired! +cos i haven't got very many ah, i'm so tired! can't keep awake today! feel awful! i think i'm going to have to give my job up . why? because my back is getting terribly bad! -can't you just say your back's , just have a rest for a while? +can't you just say your back's , just have a rest for a while? that's the sa i can't! -i can't go a week with no money! +i can't go a week with no money! oh, what you gonna do then? -i'll have to work won't we? +i'll have to work won't we? i mean unless you don't be silly ! -i don't know what to do really but just finding it very tiring! +i don't know what to do really but just finding it very tiring! here she comes again! eh? -that dog's the dog's in now look! +that dog's the dog's in now look! it's a shame! a shame! come on popper dog! no! no! no! -you've been out twice this morning. +you've been out twice this morning. i like that jacket there, it's nice isn't it? yeah it's . do you dance then a at these things? -wha what a sort of jumping dance? +wha what a sort of jumping dance? what do you mean jumping? ah, ha ha ha ha! like that. @@ -34476,24 +34447,24 @@ proper , proper dancing. proper dancing? is it, is it sort of is it a certain raving dance then or what is it? well not particularly. -it's just when music's being played like that keep going and one point don't you, really? +it's just when music's being played like that keep going and one point don't you, really? what? -i dunno really. +i dunno really. show me. no ! why ? why not? i'm aching all over. -see all that bolshy all that silly bolshiness was totally unnecessary wasn't it? +see all that bolshy all that silly bolshiness was totally unnecessary wasn't it? i tell you all those fantasia security blokes are a bunch of prats, all of them!they're all so stubborn! well er why? in what way? -just go up on the stage and just start just talking to people and suddenly they, get back! +just go up on the stage and just start just talking to people and suddenly they, get back! get back! get off! get off! -why was they saying were they saying it to you then ? +why was they saying were they saying it to you then ? said it to loads of people! go on, get off! get out the way! @@ -34501,57 +34472,57 @@ you know? anybody from cornwall there? yeah, who? neil was there, chris was there, wayne was there, a few others. -i thought, i thought that matthew was +i thought, i thought that matthew was no he's not there, he's skint! -god he's spent he's spent all his grant hasn't he? +god he's spent he's spent all his grant hasn't he? god! he's gonna get into some awful trouble isn't he? mm. -i mean, he's nearly as as overdrawn as sophie and she's, she's nearly completed her course! +i mean, he's nearly as as overdrawn as sophie and she's, she's nearly completed her course! i know! he just hasn't got a clue though! he doesn't care yo hasn't got a clue! he must be worried about it though? surely he must be worried? -well i was talking to him about it, i said i reckon you've spent the you've spent quite a bit now so you might as well just go another get final . +well i was talking to him about it, i said i reckon you've spent the you've spent quite a bit now so you might as well just go another get final . three years! three year course! i know ! -and he can't he usually works in the bistro in padsdown, he couldn't work in there to repay it! +and he can't he usually works in the bistro in padsdown, he couldn't work in there to repay it! because when he's in there his wage packets are like minus fifteen pounds when he's in there! why? because he spends it all! -so really he's got to get a job which is gonna pay the majority of it off. +so really he's got to get a job which is gonna pay the majority of it off. but i'll be down at dad's till ti till september. come up here, then up to heathrow airport. -when are you going to +when are you going to dad's? no oh not for ages yet? -and you going to bristol on monday? +and you going to bristol on monday? i want to go with matthew. is matthew going then is he? yeah? -t, q to do, erm +t, q to do, erm what's the date today? it's a dear sir isn't it, obviously? -have you what's the date? -and she said well, i'm see that i've twenty second er i'm sending him that, mum, to do my reference cos they've gotta they've gotta have that. -well do you think i should write to god! +have you what's the date? +and she said well, i'm see that i've twenty second er i'm sending him that, mum, to do my reference cos they've gotta they've gotta have that. +well do you think i should write to god! shut up! eh? what do you think i should say to the principal? -erm dear sir -erm and i'll put erm at present i am oh! +erm dear sir +erm and i'll put erm at present i am oh! dunno what to write! no listen! -would you be erm dear sir would you be i, no! +would you be erm dear sir would you be i, no! i wo was at bicktons oh he knows that! such and su , no he doesn't! he won't remember you until you i explain who you are! alright. i know. -i was at bicktons which which year was that? +i was at bicktons which which year was that? that was the nineteen ninety year wasn't it? mum! was it? @@ -34559,7 +34530,7 @@ is there any water for a bath mum? studying mum? i don't know. -for +for have you had one rupert? i expect so, yeah. yes, loads! @@ -34581,7 +34552,7 @@ swapped my coat with neil! and you're lying! i'm not lying! don't lie! -bicktons study for an n c a +bicktons study for an n c a what is it? tell me! he swapped it with neil! @@ -34601,18 +34572,18 @@ i didn't! i'm coughing anyway, don't get silly! just don't worry about it! here are rupert's jacket, cos he likes my jacket alright? -look,i was at bicktons studying for an n c a two summers ago , but like ju , it doesn't really matter it's just irrelevant really. +look,i was at bicktons studying for an n c a two summers ago , but like ju , it doesn't really matter it's just irrelevant really. an n c a two summers ago? well what shall i write then? two years ago wasn't it? two years ago. and i was at bicktons studying for an n c a two years ago. an a i am -i am , at present i am applying for a job on the -yo , you're not applying for a job you are applying to to erm go to australia +i am , at present i am applying for a job on the +yo , you're not applying for a job you are applying to to erm go to australia to, hang on! -i was at bicktons studying for n c a two years ago . -i am oh! +i was at bicktons studying for n c a two years ago . +i am oh! ah, this is crap! mum help me out oh! @@ -34627,87 +34598,87 @@ i am hoping to hang on! i am hoping to go -hoping to go to +hoping to go to to australia. australia, through in -in s september -with the whoever it is -through the i a b a. -through the i a b a programme . +in s september +with the whoever it is +through the i a b a. +through the i a b a programme . i need a reference hang on. you can't put i need would you be kind enough -would you be kind enough to complete the reference for me? -and send it to +would you be kind enough to complete the reference for me? +and send it to to provide me with a reference. -would you be kind enough to provide -provide me with a reference -with a reference ? +would you be kind enough to provide +provide me with a reference +with a reference ? yeah? -and send it to the given stamped envelope. -and send it in the pre-paid envelope -to provide me with the reference,would you be kind enough to provide me with a reference and send it via oh my god! +and send it to the given stamped envelope. +and send it in the pre-paid envelope +to provide me with the reference,would you be kind enough to provide me with a reference and send it via oh my god! and se -i just i just dunno what -and send it in the pre-paid envelope. +i just i just dunno what +and send it in the pre-paid envelope. i don't know what he'll think of this ! and send it i send it in the pre-paid envelope? envelope. -in the pre paid envelope . +in the pre paid envelope . what, to the address given, yeah? no! -cos it's erm, the pre-paid envelope is where it's going isn't it ? +cos it's erm, the pre-paid envelope is where it's going isn't it ? pre-pa , that's it isn't it? that's all i yeah. have to write? -yours faithfully yours sincerely or faithfully? +yours faithfully yours sincerely or faithfully? faithfully's nicer isn't it? faithfully? god answer me! -i ! +i ! christ! oh well that'll do! -yours faithfully rupert . +yours faithfully rupert . look! this is ridiculous! -the twentieth was on the thursday friday +the twentieth was on the thursday friday twenty first yesterday. saturday i need er, bicktons address now. where's matthew's letter? yeah, that's right! he went to work on the friday wi -tape three b and i shall get my -would you like your +tape three b and i shall get my +would you like your twenty five -there of vouchers. -which i shall enjoy spending won't i? +there of vouchers. +which i shall enjoy spending won't i? aye! so say something brian for god's sake! where's the paper ? just put on japanese . oh joe! look at his little sides! -oh my sugar? +oh my sugar? mummy? yes please. -do you know every time i put a pen anywhere in this house they just disappear! +do you know every time i put a pen anywhere in this house they just disappear! here's one. . oh thank you. sit down! -okay, three b and over to you! +okay, three b and over to you! how do you ? two sugars is it mum? yeah. the tape's mum! going. -this thing. +this thing. oh are you? ooh! i'm coming! @@ -34716,11 +34687,11 @@ aha. mm. is that seaweed ? okay. -erm what's the date today? +erm what's the date today? twenty third. bo bo bo bo, bo bo bo bo bo, bo bo bo bo . will you say something mel and then i can write your name down there. -erm anyway, we're going in newton abbot, in newton abbot choose our for the model. +erm anyway, we're going in newton abbot, in newton abbot choose our for the model. thank you! are we? yeah. @@ -34742,9 +34713,9 @@ well that dress sophie's got in there is lovely! sorry? that dress sophie's got in there is lovely! oh yeah! -no, they gotta choose from sa miss selfridges, new look, dorothy perkins top girl +no, they gotta choose from sa miss selfridges, new look, dorothy perkins top girl yeah. -mm all them shops. +mm all them shops. what's this for? modelling we're doing at school. oh! @@ -34761,29 +34732,29 @@ oh, but you dunno how we're walking down yet do we? yeah, think that out. we don't know how we're gonna stand. mm. -and erm another thing is that, we got the dress rehearsal the night before the show! +and erm another thing is that, we got the dress rehearsal the night before the show! we need longer than that! won't we? need about ninety dress rehearsals! not that many! -how about if your clothes and fall flat on your face! +how about if your clothes and fall flat on your face! i'll run down it! yeah! -you're the one who's practising there -me and, did you see me and sarah we went up and we went back down again. +you're the one who's practising there +me and, did you see me and sarah we went up and we went back down again. no. -no, cos we were sitting down down by yourself cos it was the last, it's the last one people out. -everyone was walking, you just holding on your like a weren't you? +no, cos we were sitting down down by yourself cos it was the last, it's the last one people out. +everyone was walking, you just holding on your like a weren't you? yeah. -thing tho , but that one where they had to knock people out i reckon the least you looked mm, the more casual you look, you get in. +thing tho , but that one where they had to knock people out i reckon the least you looked mm, the more casual you look, you get in. i had to walk normally. cos yo mm, so did i. well ran down the bottom bit! -sarah, sarah wanted you she had her arm like this . +sarah, sarah wanted you she had her arm like this . yeah. they seem to have -do you erm don't you keep any erm +do you erm don't you keep any erm no. no. you don't what i'm going to say! @@ -34800,19 +34771,19 @@ oh that's a bit of a ! i wanna know what they're gonna do for shoes and that, cos not many of us have got many shoes. yeah! yeah. -i'm not likely for you to do it. +i'm not likely for you to do it. e everybody knows that! thanks mum! -why isn't there isn't any knives! -can you get me one -they're in the dishwasher. -i would have thought they would have given you erm something don't you? -no, the problem is they'll be all but then they'll be secondhand shoes. +why isn't there isn't any knives! +can you get me one +they're in the dishwasher. +i would have thought they would have given you erm something don't you? +no, the problem is they'll be all but then they'll be secondhand shoes. sorry? they'd be secondhand shoes because they've been worn for three days. yeah. that's right. -the shoes would have been secondhand so there's a chance they won't let us have them. +the shoes would have been secondhand so there's a chance they won't let us have them. when is it again? march. twenty fifth, isn't it? @@ -34820,32 +34791,32 @@ i think! yeah. i am going to be in the front seat! oh no you're not! -i'll speak to you. +i'll speak to you. my mum wants a front seat as well! -there'll be a great big clamour i sho i should think for those seats! +there'll be a great big clamour i sho i should think for those seats! i think it's hilarious! but you're very loud, they'll all going shh! i won't laugh i promise! -no, you'll, look you be better +no, you'll, look you be better i'll be really serious. so -you would like to do? +you would like to do? i was, i did wanna do that when i was about five. you did , didn't wanna do it you je? no. well i can't really with black teeth anyway can i? -well, you don't have black teeth by the time everything's finished! -erm what about these trips and plays erm what are you painting? -erm yeah, i've got to put it under there and then with the twenty . -have you got a clean have you got clean underwear? +well, you don't have black teeth by the time everything's finished! +erm what about these trips and plays erm what are you painting? +erm yeah, i've got to put it under there and then with the twenty . +have you got a clean have you got clean underwear? no. -well why don't you it'll be blooming ! +well why don't you it'll be blooming ! it's a long time! it's only three days. it's not! it's four days. three nights je. -it's very good isn't it? +it's very good isn't it? i need a . sorry? he and i go . @@ -34853,7 +34824,7 @@ you don't have to . i'm not! tomorrow. i've got my ! -do you want or marmite on mel? +do you want or marmite on mel? i'll just have butter. sorry? just have butter please? @@ -34874,11 +34845,11 @@ oh! i won't eat chicken now!. chicken's . that's cos i told them . -do you know who jamie is? -you know joe friend? +do you know who jamie is? +you know joe friend? is that her brother? ah! -he's tired! +he's tired! up here. hey! what? @@ -34889,48 +34860,48 @@ he goes on to my lap. unless he's really tired. oh that's jack's towel. oh! -he takes it out into the so i put it out +he takes it out into the so i put it out mm, yeah. -so he can't get up onto the there's a hole in matt's stuff! +so he can't get up onto the there's a hole in matt's stuff! i didn't realize it was half term this week. didn't you? no! -just gonna make it a lot easier with her . +just gonna make it a lot easier with her . oh yeah. very kind of them! -yeah, but steve said it just used to . +yeah, but steve said it just used to . it's always better having somebody though isn't it? -than them on on their own. +than them on on their own. yeah. better write those times down i suppose. -i didn't have to pay mine back at well i can't afford anything really ! +i didn't have to pay mine back at well i can't afford anything really ! don't know what to do about it, do you? what shall we do? -well to go i'll have se i'm not gonna not gonna ignore it, i'm gonna +well to go i'll have se i'm not gonna not gonna ignore it, i'm gonna where did you go last night then? nowhere really. nowhere! -i was with a +i was with a after that he went out! didn't go up there. came home early didn't you? -up ah yeah. +up ah yeah. with anne. with anne? -i felt terrible cos when he said he had one or two +i felt terrible cos when he said he had one or two did you? yes. who bought that? me. what happened to that ? -i think they're all er aren't they? +i think they're all er aren't they? cooking on sunday morning! who is? i like that! are we allowed to ? this time we will . i did go. -yeah, i knew i i re +yeah, i knew i i re up there you didn't no. yeah. mum,whe where's ? @@ -34939,25 +34910,25 @@ oi! matthew don't do that! well! well then! -if you had to do them when you you were +if you had to do them when you you were come on! as well! -well i didn't . -you were using +well i didn't . +you were using can i have a look at yours? just don't worry i'll be . i won't get anything cos you . i've already got one. they're animals ! yeah! -i've been wanting to get out . -like me, i always +i've been wanting to get out . +like me, i always ah! oh you've started to spit already ! but that was . yeah. now he's started to take them. -then you , come here! +then you , come here! is this thing on? hello! are you on? @@ -34968,7 +34939,7 @@ well yeah, i i'll have cereal this morning then if i do! yeah, course you will! cos i was gonna have it night and in the morning, no point mum, yeah! -buying milk +buying milk mum, i don't want that one then she goes back on the three,goes, yeah? well, it'll be easiest won't it? be easier wouldn't @@ -34981,76 +34952,76 @@ yeah. i'll buy a pint of milk but i want some of that! well go on then! as long as you buy the milk, i don't mind you having cereal. -it just gets on my nerves having to buy a pint like +it just gets on my nerves having to buy a pint like got cereal? not . -don't know how the cereal's going don't bloody -and you thinks of his mum! -well i just don't how it pint of milk every time then isn't it? -rupert does, i think tend to get through a hell of a lot of milk. +don't know how the cereal's going don't bloody +and you thinks of his mum! +well i just don't how it pint of milk every time then isn't it? +rupert does, i think tend to get through a hell of a lot of milk. yeah, it's like having two lots of rupert gets through all the milk! cereal! every night! yeah. -and then has a glass, i mean, the number of times he , i mean i think he's the only one who drinks milk by the glassful! -should of got to sat here! +and then has a glass, i mean, the number of times he , i mean i think he's the only one who drinks milk by the glassful! +should of got to sat here! oh ! , it's nothing serious! by mistake! don't you . -i was looking at some last night and they had erm privately owned cottages or +i was looking at some last night and they had erm privately owned cottages or mm. -or whatever and they were a hundred pounds a week or +or whatever and they were a hundred pounds a week or mm. -is it but you see you could er pay for them on the ferry then +is it but you see you could er pay for them on the ferry then on the ferry there. don't you? that's the only thing. oh yeah. if you could work it out and see how much it would be yeah. -and see if it's any +and see if it's any yeah. -cheaper because food's no erm problem i'll be taking loads with me anyway, which we would do anyway. -we'd be on anyway +cheaper because food's no erm problem i'll be taking loads with me anyway, which we would do anyway. +we'd be on anyway yeah. erm and it's then hardly anything on food. well food's not that expensive out there. it's, it's the -same as here isn't it, really? +same as here isn't it, really? yeah but i mean the fruit and veg out there, that was mm. rea i mean that was cheaper wasn't it? seemed to be anyway somewhat. -well they do it by the kilo which works out cheaper. -the price per pound was the same, i think. +well they do it by the kilo which works out cheaper. +the price per pound was the same, i think. i worked it out. -but i dunno! +but i dunno! i just thought that it seemed to be, you know? anyway, we don't eat much when we're in heat anyway do you? -the hot weather it doesn't, they don't really do mashed potatoes and +the hot weather it doesn't, they don't really do mashed potatoes and yeah. -like carol's doing and those revolting french sausages! -went into the supermarket and it said and it said pour, not it said erm pour le animal, well any fool would have thought that was poor the animals, and carol said that looks nice, we'll,we'll have a pile of that! +like carol's doing and those revolting french sausages! +went into the supermarket and it said and it said pour, not it said erm pour le animal, well any fool would have thought that was poor the animals, and carol said that looks nice, we'll,we'll have a pile of that! i said you read the sign on it ? did you have them? no, she didn't buy it! -oh my god there's so much horse meat which puts me right off! -i would never eat their meat out there anyway cos i think pony in it +oh my god there's so much horse meat which puts me right off! +i would never eat their meat out there anyway cos i think pony in it shit! -so i'd rather +so i'd rather mum! well i'm not . i know. -we'd flying through hamburg. -that's what i was saying, you're sort of middle of august +we'd flying through hamburg. +that's what i was saying, you're sort of middle of august fifteenth of august. well that's a sa , yeah, so round about then yeah. -there so we'd have we'd be going out , coming back . +there so we'd have we'd be going out , coming back . yeah? yeah, ask. what do we do ? @@ -35061,11 +35032,11 @@ what? where? that bloke was so mean weren't he? that er er -i'll put on there now. -.gonna do some work +i'll put on there now. +.gonna do some work should have nabbed him the park though! after a week. -sophie's very shortly hadn't i? +sophie's very shortly hadn't i? isn't it? very tiny! can i have a drink please mum? @@ -35073,13 +35044,13 @@ stretchy cheese! can i have a drink ah! please mum? -stretching ! +stretching ! oh! oh! what do you want jessica? erm, lemon please? well, fizzy lemon. -right, i'll go see one. +right, i'll go see one. did you want one? ooh, yes please. i can't understand that bit, below a certain amount . @@ -35102,7 +35073,7 @@ don't believe you! i really don't! ooh! ooh! -well why does it to me? +well why does it to me? your wardrobe's practically the size it's only . of my bedroom! @@ -35124,7 +35095,7 @@ hup! oh god ! merci! thank you. -one thing's popped the sort of +one thing's popped the sort of dad look it's fizzing on top, look! as well. oh! @@ -35137,36 +35108,36 @@ what is? mm. can you see that look, all the little bits of tomorrow. -well, i can't just +well, i can't just oh yours as well! look, can you see out of here, watch! i've postdated it, i mean you know oh! what? lemonade up my nose! -have you got everything but socks and knickers now haven't you? +have you got everything but socks and knickers now haven't you? did you ask rupert if you could use his rucksack? no! he's not here. -i haven't got anything else for her to take except that enormous thing! +i haven't got anything else for her to take except that enormous thing! look! dunno what he's gonna say. -i'll who ru ? +i'll who ru ? yeah. it's tough isn't it? -what if he wants to go bristol or or something? +what if he wants to go bristol or or something? yeah. -you know what he's like about +you know what he's like about there's must be something else you can taking off! oh it's all in there now! well it doesn't, that's not the point is it? -i mean you've done it, you haven't even said you didn't say to mum or i! +i mean you've done it, you haven't even said you didn't say to mum or i! i did! she did! she asked, she asked mum told me! -me and i thought it might be alright, but on second thoughts where's that little blue case? +me and i thought it might be alright, but on second thoughts where's that little blue case? did i chuck that away? i must have done? blue case? @@ -35175,7 +35146,7 @@ is it in your room under your, under your, mum? is it on your wardrobe or under your wardrobe or something? since christmas! -you have to all you can do today is drop me off in, near the memorial in chudleigh cos i got +you have to all you can do today is drop me off in, near the memorial in chudleigh cos i got yeah? yeah, cos i gotta and se oh , are you not going home? @@ -35197,7 +35168,7 @@ all over the oh ! table! look at him! -look at him in ooh! ooh! +look at him in ooh! ooh! under the table! ha ha, ha ha! and he comes back @@ -35209,9 +35180,9 @@ shut up! a pussy cat. he's looking out the window now. my pussy cat bites back! -dogs and will turn round and hit it! +dogs and will turn round and hit it! it'll go schoom ! -i'm not erm cutting +i'm not erm cutting no! the hedge quickly enough down! @@ -35228,7 +35199,7 @@ put your leg down! i got er , approached. mm mm. -we've got four local dogs and they +we've got four local dogs and they lay down! and all the dogs don't like my cat! this one @@ -35248,7 +35219,7 @@ well i wouldn't, jack's dribbling on me! he's got a runny nose! yuk! come here! -look sit down and stay there! +look sit down and stay there! he's stiffened his lead. come here! he's going down. @@ -35262,7 +35233,7 @@ yeah. in what way? she works for a pub. where's that? -i thought she worked in a building society? +i thought she worked in a building society? must have got the wrong person. oh! it's the wrong person mum! @@ -35293,65 +35264,65 @@ a a man. he's the er, an an a a man? yeah. oh! -and my mum's a postwoman in the mornings. +and my mum's a postwoman in the mornings. is she? yeah ! good for her! so it's out at half past five, in at nine i quite fancy being a postwoman! -out at twelve in the mor out at twelve in the afternoon, back at four then back out at seven. +out at twelve in the mor out at twelve in the afternoon, back at four then back out at seven. what, what, oh! eveni what, sort of sorting or -out erm well, mum, in the morning she works as a postwoman and then the rest of the day she works as a, in the pub so +out erm well, mum, in the morning she works as a postwoman and then the rest of the day she works as a, in the pub so oh i see! -and erm and it's really frantic though! +and erm and it's really frantic though! cos in the afternoon she does catering from the pub and then the evening she just works behind the bar. oh! -it's boring over there though because like it gets pretty boring! +it's boring over there though because like it gets pretty boring! it is a bit boring over that way isn't it? mm. there's nobody, oh it's just dismal! i hate going over there! mm. . -packer is it, packham isn't it you live? +packer is it, packham isn't it you live? hackham. hulkham? hackham. hackham? yeah. -bet it's i bet it's boring there isn't it? +bet it's i bet it's boring there isn't it? six houses! oh god! jessica would absolutely freak if i suggested no i wouldn't! we live out there! wouldn't you? -well it's , it's about it's about ten minute walk to chudleigh isn't it? +well it's , it's about it's about ten minute walk to chudleigh isn't it? love it! i'm never in! mm mm ! i don't think i'd like to go in there! -and it's about a five minute up to holdam market on a sunday isn't it? +and it's about a five minute up to holdam market on a sunday isn't it? it's nice there! is it? yes! -i know -her mum works in the erm royal oak at ideford! +i know +her mum works in the erm royal oak at ideford! oh yeah! yeah. -she does er catering there with that drunken old devil! +she does er catering there with that drunken old devil! he er what john isn't it? yeah. -he was really horrible to one of matthew's friends! +he was really horrible to one of matthew's friends! he's sarcastic to everybody! yeah! -he said he was really drunk and he really hurt his feelings! -he my friends we never go over there! +he said he was really drunk and he really hurt his feelings! +he my friends we never go over there! ha ha ! -i think matthew er told him to bugger off i think. +i think matthew er told him to bugger off i think. do you want that last bit? can't eat any more! split it in half. @@ -35370,13 +35341,13 @@ do you remember that? except my mum does it now though. yeah? what sort of thing does she do? -ploughmans, soup erm sandwiches makes she +ploughmans, soup erm sandwiches makes she general pub food? yeah. yeah. she does toasted sandwiches, sandwiches mm. -prawn cocktails oh! +prawn cocktails oh! everything, she does. and john would be lost without her at the moment there! sorry? @@ -35400,11 +35371,11 @@ i bought dad one. he didn't buy me one! why not? well i didn't even realize what day it was! -when's erm +when's erm friday. pancake day? oh! -tuesday it's next tuesday. +tuesday it's next tuesday. ooh! next tuesday. mum do pancakes! @@ -35414,7 +35385,7 @@ he flips them and they go high! i just that's next tuesday? it's in march! -yeah, well it's changed isn't it? +yeah, well it's changed isn't it? it's ne not this tuesday but next tuesday. yeah. it will be in @@ -35426,7 +35397,7 @@ it's the day we come back mm. to school. oh god! -do you go back on a tuesday do you? +do you go back on a tuesday do you? mm. yeah. oh that's rather @@ -35452,8 +35423,8 @@ anything paid at all! nothing! but that's gonna no. -change i think from the with the we've got a staff meeting on the -twelfth i think it is and we're gonna get such a bomb! +change i think from the with the we've got a staff meeting on the +twelfth i think it is and we're gonna get such a bomb! i don't think you'll realize it! finish that off? no. @@ -35464,7 +35435,7 @@ hello! we want just a week's paid holiday! you know, for his senior staff jackie! -who've been there more than +who've been there more than my boy! we reckon we're mm. @@ -35485,11 +35456,11 @@ dribble then go outside! go on! go on! go on! -that's horrible all the over the ooh that's revolting!now! +that's horrible all the over the ooh that's revolting!now! urgh! look! the dog! -is the, the cat the cat back there? +is the, the cat the cat back there? it was. oh it's gone now. oh @@ -35510,7 +35481,7 @@ mm. erm, is rupert back? whe where's rupert going today? oh god! -jessica i do think that that +jessica i do think that that i know, but when's he back? not for hours! oh god! @@ -35518,7 +35489,7 @@ have to put i in that case. no, i'm not! oh ! find something else to put it in. -well your school bag's down +well your school bag's down jessica! there by the erm no it's not cos i just put it upstairs! @@ -35530,13 +35501,13 @@ did you put any and the black erm take those two! -duffel that erm stacey gave you. +duffel that erm stacey gave you. tha that's alright! that's it. take both and take those two. -the black jessica. +the black jessica. to put the school ba books yes. in. @@ -35548,15 +35519,15 @@ what? had a fight over a stick! in the park? i mean a stick about this long! -you know really hard! -you know, not just you know end of it . -in, in they go it's ha! +you know really hard! +you know, not just you know end of it . +in, in they go it's ha! ha! hello! hello! -this thing's is going all erm frayed look! +this thing's is going all erm frayed look! what? -oh the this iron's fraying on the end for some reason. +oh the this iron's fraying on the end for some reason. let me lo oh the lead? mm. i'll put a bit i thought it had always been like that. @@ -35565,8 +35536,8 @@ oh, put it through there. you put a new piece on didn't you? put a lead on it, yeah. yeah. -so how could it all be like that? -cos i cut the end and everything to thread in there,. +so how could it all be like that? +cos i cut the end and everything to thread in there,. i don't know what to do. look for a job i'd say. i do that every day anyway mum. @@ -35580,7 +35551,7 @@ i always go down. every day i go down! and i he's got no intention of getting a job has he, at all? -really +really no he ne he never ever goes down! i bet he doesn't get up till about, well it's eleven now i'll give him another hour and a half! it's crap isn't it? @@ -35592,29 +35563,29 @@ just, it's not cold. when it's raining that i find depressing! don't you? yeah. -especially if you've got nothing to do. +especially if you've got nothing to do. is curly working or not? no. he hasn't had a job for ages has he? a no. well there's no point in him working cos he just loses his -i jus i can't believe that that can be true! -i mean -annie, annie works twenty four hours a we , annie works twenty four hours a week in this shop right and the , she claims family credit as well and i i ,we if adrian works all the benefits go under he has to +i jus i can't believe that that can be true! +i mean +annie, annie works twenty four hours a we , annie works twenty four hours a week in this shop right and the , she claims family credit as well and i i ,we if adrian works all the benefits go under he has to yeah but yo -earn something like two hundred quid a week to to match what they're getting now! +earn something like two hundred quid a week to to match what they're getting now! it isn't like that! it is! -well yeah, er okay i can accept that but i think mentally +well yeah, er okay i can accept that but i think mentally yeah. -you know, i think i mean, i mean he even to going back to college doing a couple of a levels wouldn't alter his benefit. +you know, i think i mean, i mean he even to going back to college doing a couple of a levels wouldn't alter his benefit. i mean, do something, you know! yeah. i could not live like that! no i couldn't. i'd go mad! especially out there over that shop in kings dainton. -he's got his car, he's got jamie so he's not that bad! +he's got his car, he's got jamie so he's not that bad! he's got his son and er yeah but it's not mentally stimulating is it? it's not! @@ -35627,11 +35598,11 @@ go to gateways for me if you want while you're there? eh? go down to gateways for me. and get what? -erm i want a jar of pickle +erm i want a jar of pickle i'll write it all down. and not on an envelope! i'm running out of them. -well that's can you pay for a stamp for that for me please? +well that's can you pay for a stamp for that for me please? why haven't you got one then? no! gotta send it. @@ -35641,7 +35612,7 @@ just gonna see how much money i've got. nor normal pickle? mum! well, the proper . -just normal sort of pickle? +just normal sort of pickle? yeah. loaf of bread. brown, yeah? @@ -35650,24 +35621,24 @@ and, half a pound of cheese. half a pound of cheese? cheese, cheddar. will that be already weighed up into a box will it? -well no,the they weigh it for you. +well no,the they weigh it for you. ah yeah! oh! -there's a stamp there. +there's a stamp there. hello! you coming down town? are you? as long as you don't whinge when i tie you up, alright? and what? -half a dozen apples if they're cheap +half a dozen apples if they're cheap six apples. in the shop. yeah. cheapest you can get. well i don't wanna get hideous sick cox's, i'll get something decent! you won't go and spend fifty nine pence a pound on an apple cos i shall kill you if you do that! -well i shall only spend a pound twenty four. +well i shall only spend a pound twenty four. get rejects from dorset, wormed apples from somerset! well which shop shall i get them from then? eh? @@ -35678,7 +35649,7 @@ and twenty . i shouldn't think you'd need all that. most of it's just . where do i get the apples from? -erm the shop in market walk. +erm the shop in market walk. and make sure he doesn't poo everywhere! oh mum! what do i do if he does? @@ -35695,13 +35666,13 @@ though in't it? and they're it's not acceptable! not buying . -you're not going to pieces of paper are you? +you're not going to pieces of paper are you? cos i would of thought, you would of thought that that was absolutely awful! well it is awful but i don't know what you can do about it! pick it up! he didn't like it? -no, he's miserable but he can ge , he used to go ra ra ra and make noises . -do you know what rupert did to him once? +no, he's miserable but he can ge , he used to go ra ra ra and make noises . +do you know what rupert did to him once? down the co-op? he tied him to some trolleys! trolley. @@ -35723,22 +35694,22 @@ well i do it sometimes but i think that's terrible of you! ah, ha ha ha!thirty six. there's no way they can tell it's . -i suppose there's nothing on television this afternoon sit down. +i suppose there's nothing on television this afternoon sit down. telly down . -don't you think he looks better after being o on that food now? +don't you think he looks better after being o on that food now? i haven't noticed any difference. oh i have! yeah. his coat looks much better. he's always had a good coat though. -well, not when he was ill you know that business. +well, not when he was ill you know that business. it's a blooming shame! -i like those those little dogs, those little tiny . +i like those those little dogs, those little tiny . battery's going off. is it? -bad old one. +bad old one. it's flashing anyway. -yeah but isn't that with er the voices? +yeah but isn't that with er the voices? it is isn't it? if i speak loudly does it flash even more? yeah. @@ -35748,7 +35719,7 @@ been down the job centre then? no! nothing at all? not really. -i bet you that it's all grotty. +i bet you that it's all grotty. well . where's rupert? over with lee. @@ -35759,28 +35730,28 @@ i thought that it's cold out there today! is it? freezing! -i thought that you were thinking of making a trip to bristol? -can't afford it this week. +i thought that you were thinking of making a trip to bristol? +can't afford it this week. not now anyway. -was gonna go and see sophie next week but i can't afford that really either. +was gonna go and see sophie next week but i can't afford that really either. and she can't afford anything for freebies definitely! freebies? well i mean any sort of food or anything. she's said i'm welcome to come up. yes i know, i know you're welcome to come up! -but she hasn't got many sort of major -i don't expect anything off her apart from somewhere to sleep don't i? +but she hasn't got many sort of major +i don't expect anything off her apart from somewhere to sleep don't i? oh would you starve? starve? expecting to cook me food! well i should hope she would! typical man! expecting her to cook for you food! -well if i'm there and i'm a guest if she cooked for her and martin she can't just ignore me! +well if i'm there and i'm a guest if she cooked for her and martin she can't just ignore me! can she? -i don't think she very cooks for martin he's a +i don't think she very cooks for martin he's a yes she does! -she loves to say she doesn't just cos he thinks like that but she does! +she loves to say she doesn't just cos he thinks like that but she does! she's really adamant about not having children! bloody hell is she says that now i hope, i mean i @@ -35791,20 +35762,20 @@ like that. well of course she will! no, i know i mean i can't see her just -she's old enough now to sort of have thought it out really, isn't she? +she's old enough now to sort of have thought it out really, isn't she? don't you think? yeah, but she will but she'll have right up until she's about thirty i expect. thirty five you know. -it's only a isn't it? +it's only a isn't it? i hope somebody does! i don't wanna be an ancient granny! -nobody e , nobody has any girlfriends, nothing do they ? +nobody e , nobody has any girlfriends, nothing do they ? you're desperate to be a granny aren't you? -i'd love to be a granny, i really would! +i'd love to be a granny, i really would! i would always be there for baby ! i'd love it! but she's, they're absolutely adamant about it, you know. -it's just, cos she that er she's going to be everybody's favourite aunt! +it's just, cos she that er she's going to be everybody's favourite aunt! no chance! she isn't half a boring person in't she? no i can understand her not having, not wanting kids for a few years but, can't you? @@ -35816,13 +35787,13 @@ what a tie down that is! it's a it's a tie down. i know! -don't, don't have to tell me that! +don't, don't have to tell me that! i expect one's not that bad. ha, ah ah ! ha, ah ah ! you've got one anyway, ah ha! look vacuum! -the dough it's the dough boy! +the dough it's the dough boy! ah ha, he's jumped through the ring . eh, ah ah ah ! oh he's speaking to pussy. @@ -35840,7 +35811,7 @@ he looked horrible! i tell you what he looked like under those a bil , one of those . -it suits mm, yeah he does! +it suits mm, yeah he does! doesn't he? his top bit goes furry or it's horrible! @@ -35861,17 +35832,17 @@ he's not, he's ! shall i get jessica today mum? she's away in't she? oh yeah! -having a wonderful time naval club. +having a wonderful time naval club. why in't she at school? half term. -do you wear this t-shirt? +do you wear this t-shirt? which one is it? what is it? -this, it was blue, i think, blue at one stage. +this, it was blue, i think, blue at one stage. yeah. oh no. i think i might have this as well. -oh no he's dug up all the leaves! +oh no he's dug up all the leaves! at least i pay for it! you didn't! i bought it! @@ -35882,12 +35853,12 @@ mum, look at the size of his shoulders! look, this bit here look! bloody huge! he's a monster! -he was lying on his back last night like that with his feet, you know how he does +he was lying on his back last night like that with his feet, you know how he does yeah. with his legs wide open yeah. -and we measured his rib cage height of his rib cage down to here, and it one foot five inches! -he's got a chest +and we measured his rib cage height of his rib cage down to here, and it one foot five inches! +he's got a chest yeah ! it's ! @@ -35897,12 +35868,12 @@ he's got a what? a mongey , a mongrel! oh weird! -he's got a big front and a miniature +he's got a big front and a miniature look watch! back end. mum look! so, too big jack! -but i think he's i don't think he's misformed at all. +but i think he's i don't think he's misformed at all. misformed? that's not quite the way to say it ! deformed. @@ -35913,16 +35884,16 @@ you think he's deformed don't you? no, i don't think he's deformed! of course he's not deformed! he's lovely! -very, very actually i think. +very, very actually i think. did you see him dive yesterday? -the bit where he like jumping on the lake they've cut away a bit of the platform so the only way you can do it is jump onto this bit of wood then fly, and literally he was like that, just going in mid air and landed right in the water! +the bit where he like jumping on the lake they've cut away a bit of the platform so the only way you can do it is jump onto this bit of wood then fly, and literally he was like that, just going in mid air and landed right in the water! he's nuts! blinking ! bit cold for that innit? no, it was gorgeous yesterday wasn't it? yeah. and it's very -you and brian were loving it! +you and brian were loving it! brian said not too much today matt,i thought bloody hell what do you think i am! telling me to walk across! is that what he said ? @@ -35932,7 +35903,7 @@ both of you, you're both saps! don't let him go in the water it's too cold! that's rubbish! dogs don't feel that! -at night see he can't leave him alone he sits there and he goes or something like that and jumps on him and gives him a i can't keep my hands off that dog! +at night see he can't leave him alone he sits there and he goes or something like that and jumps on him and gives him a i can't keep my hands off that dog! ah ah ah! yeah i'm terrible ! he's worse than i am really! @@ -35942,8 +35913,8 @@ yeah. what is it? mackerel. is he, he's not even awake and it's twenty past twelve! -i got up late today ten past ten i felt guilty! -i shan't go up there cos he +i got up late today ten past ten i felt guilty! +i shan't go up there cos he unless he's pissed off right something like that. eh? when he lied down like that and he was pissed off @@ -35959,27 +35930,27 @@ ah that stinks! that i think it's still got it stinks! -he waits for me to er go to bed now. -i've only gotta mention, yeah i've gotta got to mention bed i'm going to bed now. +he waits for me to er go to bed now. +i've only gotta mention, yeah i've gotta got to mention bed i'm going to bed now. oh! do you want to go to bed? -and he goes and he's up in the bed, on the bed in a flash! +and he goes and he's up in the bed, on the bed in a flash! he likes it. he soon comes into my old room cos he's gonna be straight up on the bed, right. yeah , he likes, likes climbing on the bed. makes him feel a bit comfy. -most dogs aren't allowed on beds. +most dogs aren't allowed on beds. most dogs aren't, some dogs aren't even allowed upstairs! -most dogs aren't allowed up upstairs. -he's allowed to go wherever he wants do whatever he likes. +most dogs aren't allowed up upstairs. +he's allowed to go wherever he wants do whatever he likes. too right! so they should! shouldn't they? -yeah i mean dog hairs rise anyway so +yeah i mean dog hairs rise anyway so what do you mean, rise? -the hair it rises upstairs. -i mean i, you know friends said it was, oh god i wouldn't allow mine upstairs because of all the dog hairs! -oh well they go up there anyway. +the hair it rises upstairs. +i mean i, you know friends said it was, oh god i wouldn't allow mine upstairs because of all the dog hairs! +oh well they go up there anyway. so, but i don't know what it is, right, it's only a few bloody hairs! he's actually allowed to do whatever he likes. gets his own way as well. @@ -36000,23 +35971,23 @@ i didn't know he had all those blankets how long's he had those for ? two, four what do you not like? -six six, eight, ten, +six six, eight, ten, oh fuck. you dickhead i was gonna -you dickhead you dickhead. +you dickhead you dickhead. nor do i. you dickhead get a drink. -aye well +aye well my wish come true. pray for my wish to come true, i need eleven p, have you got eleven p? quid. -no p. +no p. have you got a quid in change? no. pat have you got eleven p? i don't stephen and if i did i definitely would lend it to you. -johnny old pal have you got eleven p ? +johnny old pal have you got eleven p ? i lent gavin my money. oh well. mm? @@ -36025,9 +35996,9 @@ no i haven't got anything. what do you call it? the wizard of oz. oh no that's dorothy sorry. -no that's dorothy, isn't it, the one that goes we were strolling along on moonlight bay, so you could hear the clouds singing you stole my heart moonlight bay. -on moonlight baby oh god ye gods. -aye well you can get the safest +no that's dorothy, isn't it, the one that goes we were strolling along on moonlight bay, so you could hear the clouds singing you stole my heart moonlight bay. +on moonlight baby oh god ye gods. +aye well you can get the safest is it? aye. peanut butter and strawberry jam. @@ -36035,32 +36006,32 @@ yes. well it's stephen's favourite mm? urgh. -you can tell, you can tell most people tomorrow, just don't tell be in. +you can tell, you can tell most people tomorrow, just don't tell be in. who's your boss? so it is. -wh what's doing now? +wh what's doing now? the only people that know are you, him,and claire. so let's keep it that way folks. -okay -danny danny don't forget that oh for god's sake danny +okay +danny danny don't forget that oh for god's sake danny what do you look like? let's just tell you what you look like, you came to me for a job you wouldn't get it. -well don't come in with the coat tomorrow please or after easter. +well don't come in with the coat tomorrow please or after easter. right. was very impressive. -i can tell you definitely be pissed off today. +i can tell you definitely be pissed off today. oh it was definitely a cracker, did you hear that one? what? colin says to him jesus! -for sakes! +for sakes! for fuck's sake why? och don't talk balls. in where? well what can he say like? we, we didn't -we didn't tell him to +we didn't tell him to don't say that wasn't funny. did you go to er ? yeah. @@ -36074,19 +36045,19 @@ i'm as stubborn, stubborn as a mule like. did he do it yesterday? did he do it yesterday as well? oh, -you know the only two songs i haven't heard that er that i know exist of theirs are prince and . +you know the only two songs i haven't heard that er that i know exist of theirs are prince and . they're on the one the one e p is it? have you got it on tape? yeah. have you got it on tape? you coming tomorrow, no? -dee dee dee, +dee dee dee, would you do me a favour? get a record i just rea i mean i knew that i had heard of it then i realized . -i mean that just like. -oh kevin's gonna kill me you can't play it, you can't play it! +i mean that just like. +oh kevin's gonna kill me you can't play it, you can't play it! why can you not play it? shall i get off at your house? i'll only be sitting in the coffee shop till five past five anyway like so @@ -36100,11 +36071,11 @@ well i'll have to check it out first. why don't you just go in, sign on and then go out again? i know it sounds quite tempting. oh excuse me. -oh you're a fat bastard oh you're a fat bastard oh you're a fat bastard, oh you fat bastard +oh you're a fat bastard oh you're a fat bastard oh you're a fat bastard, oh you fat bastard it's just play playing it without using, without strumming the strings. can you do it? can you do it? -the left hand have you got a minute? +the left hand have you got a minute? which hand's left and which hand's right? that's right. that's right. @@ -36122,20 +36093,20 @@ what? flotsam and jetsam. never heard of them. dunno, sometimes it sounds a bit oper-ish opera-ish on it. -but like i fits in quite well. +but like i fits in quite well. your lawn looks quite -it's quite nice suppose your gardener does it. -well he'll be pissed off all over it with football boots on. +it's quite nice suppose your gardener does it. +well he'll be pissed off all over it with football boots on. yeah he will. -no i'll be alright here thanks. -burp great. +no i'll be alright here thanks. +burp great. it's not really a burp is it? it's sort of more like a urgh urgh -is that the only two that i haven't heard oh you off school today? +is that the only two that i haven't heard oh you off school today? what? you off school today? half term. -oh last day last day +oh last day last day yeah, yeah. what did he do to his head? why?looked really good. @@ -36151,56 +36122,56 @@ thursday. or did you, did you wait the bus and it went ? did you have a good day off school then? yes he did -he just stayed around here and slagged me off, no? +he just stayed around here and slagged me off, no? oh well it was quite easy to do. oh see next year, about this time next year, yeah. -around easter time erm would yous be able to take some person just to come and sit in your shop for a week out of our school? +around easter time erm would yous be able to take some person just to come and sit in your shop for a week out of our school? who? -you see and they're asking for people who could ref who could, you know, give references to cos like put all these, all, down on these different things that you want like you know, say you want but then a lot of people just put down small business and management, something like that. +you see and they're asking for people who could ref who could, you know, give references to cos like put all these, all, down on these different things that you want like you know, say you want but then a lot of people just put down small business and management, something like that. you'll end up with some real wanker like. ah no then, no. i don't mind if it's yous guys. oh it wouldn't be me cos i'm, i'm doing it this year and i only thought of it too late yeah. -and i'd already put my other form in like to er i, and i was raging cos like i could've got and sat in here for a fucking week -well you still can if you want like . -no i have to go and, have to go to this -no some other people were saying about that, you know, ah that they, you know that they were gonna put in for it but they wouldn't let them cos it was shop, you know, blah blah blah. -but i mean yes certainly if it was y if it was you coming down but i don't want +and i'd already put my other form in like to er i, and i was raging cos like i could've got and sat in here for a fucking week +well you still can if you want like . +no i have to go and, have to go to this +no some other people were saying about that, you know, ah that they, you know that they were gonna put in for it but they wouldn't let them cos it was shop, you know, blah blah blah. +but i mean yes certainly if it was y if it was you coming down but i don't want it won't be me. plonker that i don't know. it wouldn't be me. no, no, that's alright you've not talked to me all day and then it's that sort of thing. -well i could probably get somebody who would be into comics like and then that would maybe start you talking and then like, but he could still be an old wanker sure +well i could probably get somebody who would be into comics like and then that would maybe start you talking and then like, but he could still be an old wanker sure as long as what's this? who's this? i don't know who it is. -someone called raoul +someone called raoul you mean raoul as in raoul? friend of johnny's? yeah. no, don't think so. is raoul english or something? -er no i just think his dad is and they've just picked it up from their dad, you know. -it's not the rhythm guitarist the bass player oh my goodness . +er no i just think his dad is and they've just picked it up from their dad, you know. +it's not the rhythm guitarist the bass player oh my goodness . oh they've got a drummer as well a vocalist as well. -oh +oh they must have a a lead guitarist or somebody who fancies themselves as a lead -yes +yes and a drummer. -look at +look at but i don't know who it was, erm just some guy come in and said to us do you mind sticking that up for us, no not at all. sure thing. you're not gonna ? play in johnny's group? -no, well like i haven't learnt it, i can't play i can play up to a certain bit in the start and then i can play the rest of it like, it's just one i can't get it's just real annoying, i have the at the right pitch and i just -no i can get the but i mean i can't go , i can go like and go and that's it. +no, well like i haven't learnt it, i can't play i can play up to a certain bit in the start and then i can play the rest of it like, it's just one i can't get it's just real annoying, i have the at the right pitch and i just +no i can get the but i mean i can't go , i can go like and go and that's it. i need to go yeah. why? @@ -36210,58 +36181,58 @@ what do you eat for breakfast pat? like it's one of those questions you ask people. what year were you born? that's another question. -no +no i had sugar puffs right? do you eat sugar puffs? yeah. i used to eat those all the time, my mum won't buy them any more. -i remember gary, gary it was one of the first it was when he +i remember gary, gary it was one of the first it was when he sugar puffs? -started working and he got one of his first pay packets he went out and bought a box of sugar puffs +started working and he got one of his first pay packets he went out and bought a box of sugar puffs one of the big five hundred gramme ones. why? i don't know. cos he loved them like? -aye well i dunno but anyway +aye well i dunno but anyway i'd love to i hate i'd love to know why they call them sugar puffs. five hundred in a packet right gee pat and he had about four bowlfuls and he was -oh tucking into his fifth when he went blurgh +oh tucking into his fifth when he went blurgh and he never fucking ate them again i know but i'd love to know why they call them sugar puffs cos they're puffed up. cos they're all honey, i know but they're honey. yeah but honey monster. -bollocks there's honey on it, don't talk shit it's pure sugar -pure fattening +bollocks there's honey on it, don't talk shit it's pure sugar +pure fattening sixty nine. sixty one. sixty one? sixty nine. what are we talking about? -oh yes sixty two yes. +oh yes sixty two yes. sixty two, no more than sixty. -sixty two +sixty two you must be really dedicated in this shop. ninety two even yeah! yeah! -how embarrassing -you're the same a you're just, you're younger than +how embarrassing +you're the same a you're just, you're younger than that's what i said paul the first time -the first time you told me your age i went +the first time you told me your age i went that's what i said, you know that? i went no you're not, i thought you were taking the piss out of me when you said it. -no i'm not -yes you do, you look you look younger. +no i'm not +yes you do, you look you look younger. oh you're so youthful paul. oh i know he looks like ronnie, -here are the other two songs i can't play or i haven't heard. +here are the other two songs i can't play or i haven't heard. and the prince. they're covers like. oh @@ -36271,11 +36242,11 @@ aye. i'm going driving tonight. why? killer. -or any shop you, any comic +or any shop you, any comic oh it's brilliant! i thought you were ? -ah well, in tomorrow like but i'm just going in till twenty past nine and then sign my name off and going home. -and i wouldn't even go in because i don't think my dad's making me go in except she kept me,and all behind because we didn't do our homework and she said right see me tomorrow, +ah well, in tomorrow like but i'm just going in till twenty past nine and then sign my name off and going home. +and i wouldn't even go in because i don't think my dad's making me go in except she kept me,and all behind because we didn't do our homework and she said right see me tomorrow, why? there's no difference is there? it's grammar school, why? @@ -36304,7 +36275,7 @@ where? oh i didn't see that, joint lead guitar! is that the one where they go in -the one with +the one with what did yous get him one for? da er father's day present or something? aye. @@ -36316,24 +36287,24 @@ red dwarf. got all the red dwarf tapes. oh whenever blake seven's out too how much was it? -i was standing there and i was going i had the two pound in my pocket like but there's no way i was giving her two pound so bitch +i was standing there and i was going i had the two pound in my pocket like but there's no way i was giving her two pound so bitch bastard. yeah, seen that -and then for there's this thing treating people who'd ruined this guy's marriage +and then for there's this thing treating people who'd ruined this guy's marriage did you tape it? yeah. -the apocalypse and all the people atheists and one where ah the christians, christians over there please well i'm sorry to tell you but the jews were right +the apocalypse and all the people atheists and one where ah the christians, christians over there please well i'm sorry to tell you but the jews were right er do you remember the one where ? -no, he'd gone up to the traffic lights and this cyclist sort of like cycled up, jumped off his bike and wheeled it round the corner so he -yeah, he jumps out -i like the one car park +no, he'd gone up to the traffic lights and this cyclist sort of like cycled up, jumped off his bike and wheeled it round the corner so he +yeah, he jumps out +i like the one car park yeah he got trapped in a car park and he couldn't get out for ages and ages and then as he got out he crashed into another car. ah that's, that's it there. -well did you see the one where he's getting changed +well did you see the one where he's getting changed what's that? he was getting changed in the car and he put a brick on the pedal and all -yes, yes he was going to work and he put the brick on the pedal while he's jumped in the back pulling on his trousers and st st steering with -and cleaning his teeth +yes, yes he was going to work and he put the brick on the pedal while he's jumped in the back pulling on his trousers and st st steering with +and cleaning his teeth steering with his foot. he gets into the back seat and he's got his feet over the fr the front seat steering with his foot ah that's the same one he's making a lunch or something in, in the park @@ -36341,22 +36312,22 @@ yeah. the bit where he's on the beach he's just down to the beach yeah. -and there's this guy sitting sitting beside him, you know sunbathing and stuff, and er he doesn't know what to do +and there's this guy sitting sitting beside him, you know sunbathing and stuff, and er he doesn't know what to do oh the teacher told us this one. he sticks, he sticks the, the trunks. the trunks on top of his trousers, unbuttons himself and pulls them down, and he gets, he's er really, really awkward the way he does it and all the rest of it and gets, he finally gets his trousers off, pulls up his er trunks and your man gets up, pulls off his towel, gets out his white stick and oh he, he went swimming one time and that was pretty good -i can't remember what that bit was, i think he just stood on top -yes he crawled, crawled to the edge of the +i can't remember what that bit was, i think he just stood on top +yes he crawled, crawled to the edge of the oh that's right and then this wee kid got up and jumped off didn't he? do you know that bit where he was ha looking over the diving board and stuff? that was jonathan to a t. -we went swimming with jonathan the other night and he got up on the top board and sort of and he was sort of like hanging on to the bar like this looking over -oh god, that's like. -and he couldn't do it and the worse thing was everybody in the pool had gone go on -what, what happened was robert, rob and me shouted, robert and me were there and who was it, helen was there i think as well, his ex girlfriend we were going go on jon, go on jump and everybody in the pool started it go on jonathan -and he couldn't do it, he was so totally embarrassed and all the rest of it, he had to get down and everybody was boo boo, chicken, chicken +we went swimming with jonathan the other night and he got up on the top board and sort of and he was sort of like hanging on to the bar like this looking over +oh god, that's like. +and he couldn't do it and the worse thing was everybody in the pool had gone go on +what, what happened was robert, rob and me shouted, robert and me were there and who was it, helen was there i think as well, his ex girlfriend we were going go on jon, go on jump and everybody in the pool started it go on jonathan +and he couldn't do it, he was so totally embarrassed and all the rest of it, he had to get down and everybody was boo boo, chicken, chicken oh he felt so wet. i felt so sorry for him. can you do it? @@ -36370,74 +36341,74 @@ i used to dive off the first board yes. and then i hurt my back i di i dive off the first board but i couldn't even jump or drop off the second board. -there was one time i dove in and i hurt my back, i sort of like keeled over, kicked well -oh i know what you mean you went in like that and your back, your, your legs went like that there? +there was one time i dove in and i hurt my back, i sort of like keeled over, kicked well +oh i know what you mean you went in like that and your back, your, your legs went like that there? yeah. ooh! but i've jumped off the second one, i haven't dived off the second one. no way. -i got up, i remember like i'd just i'd just learnt to dive off the first one like i was running down like, yes! +i got up, i remember like i'd just i'd just learnt to dive off the first one like i was running down like, yes! and i got up with the intention of diving off the second one and i went no! jumped off it. -pete petey right? -i'm not joking, his leg his legs were about that wide right? +pete petey right? +i'm not joking, his leg his legs were about that wide right? he wore those new shorts yeah. right? -so he's walking about, the shorts are this wide -the rest of it's like this here he runs into the water and he's into the water like him and bobby used to +so he's walking about, the shorts are this wide +the rest of it's like this here he runs into the water and he's into the water like him and bobby used to god love him. dive off -petey and bobbie used to dive off the top board like +petey and bobbie used to dive off the top board like aye. head first. yes. he's a total wanker . total wanker -i mean there's jody and all those like and they're a real dipstick, they have balls but that wee kid is just so unbelievably stupid like, he was just like +i mean there's jody and all those like and they're a real dipstick, they have balls but that wee kid is just so unbelievably stupid like, he was just like who? petey i know. you just flip on your back like and -you get these jocks that get up there, big and they think they are so cool and then +you get these jocks that get up there, big and they think they are so cool and then big fat massive hairy chest, hairy chest, tiny swimming trunks yeah. that is my seat by the way, erm hairy chest, bit of a sun tan, they've bee they were away last summer hanging over the -oh like totally over, that's why he doesn't need to wear t too many swimming trunks cos you can't see anything anyway -runs along splash, doesn't even make it, make it round, he just and goes like this and then, and then lands in the water like that. +oh like totally over, that's why he doesn't need to wear t too many swimming trunks cos you can't see anything anyway +runs along splash, doesn't even make it, make it round, he just and goes like this and then, and then lands in the water like that. well this guy's jumped off the second board and done a belly flop ooh fuck! ooh -and he he got up and he was totally, totally red. +and he he got up and he was totally, totally red. it was totally red -oh ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, and everybody in the whole pool heard it just go everybody was going ooh! +oh ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, and everybody in the whole pool heard it just go everybody was going ooh! oh fuck! -it was totally wild +it was totally wild that pool that pool would be really good if it wasn't for the water. why what's wrong with the water? it's shitty. ah it's fucking chlorinated to fuck. is it? there'll be dickheads and -i know it's right but that's a laugh i think. -you just you just watch them and all and you just -i thought they were in every pool like, you can m even do it yourself without thinking about it if you want some people -i don't start thinking about it cos i fart under the water +i know it's right but that's a laugh i think. +you just you just watch them and all and you just +i thought they were in every pool like, you can m even do it yourself without thinking about it if you want some people +i don't start thinking about it cos i fart under the water well i'd, i,buy your poster -i i'm going down south next week and i intend +i i'm going down south next week and i intend oh paul we don't wanna hear your problems, buy the poster. credit? you'll be off work, i'll be off work when you get your test. -aye of course if i get the test . -don't, don't be going fuck mad and taking +aye of course if i get the test . +don't, don't be going fuck mad and taking ah i've no intention of going fuck mad. you know what happened on sunday? -cos there is so many people get their licence, bang they're out the door, in the car +cos there is so many people get their licence, bang they're out the door, in the car bang -bash it five minutes down the road, bang bang +bash it five minutes down the road, bang bang on sunday, sunday morning i was up was it that guy that crashed before? yeah. @@ -36451,8 +36422,8 @@ staying after at my house. you can't stay? can i not? no. -i'm away till richard's coming down for me. -my daddy goes erm where will you be so i can in touch with you by phone laughing cos they were shouting at me and then he said to me and then i told him it wasn't and he goes so why do you go +i'm away till richard's coming down for me. +my daddy goes erm where will you be so i can in touch with you by phone laughing cos they were shouting at me and then he said to me and then i told him it wasn't and he goes so why do you go kill that. what? ah don't! @@ -36464,12 +36435,12 @@ forty two. what? why? cos they're lovely and i have a pair. -you can get better ones like from +you can get better ones like from have you heard from home? eh? no. so she wouldn't have died then? -in reality +in reality no she didn't die. oh aye but th they were in vietnam right, and er @@ -36477,37 +36448,37 @@ was she er was she er good was she? no. it doesn't matter . -hey she was right, and she was in the bushes in vietnam and she took hold of these prisoners right +hey she was right, and she was in the bushes in vietnam and she took hold of these prisoners right i didn't know women were allowed to go. -and er just at the very end all you could see was her and your man, the hologram and he'd just been killed about five minutes earlier. +and er just at the very end all you could see was her and your man, the hologram and he'd just been killed about five minutes earlier. so he could have saved himself but he didn't want to. the hologram? aye. and did he not save himself then? no. did he die? -but then how can go on. +but then how can go on. cos he's still he's still a hologram. hologram. so that's how he died then? aye. well it's funny -remember he tried to stab his wife +remember he tried to stab his wife i cried my eyes out at that! -at the very start of last night there was this guy water skiing -big massive fat woman right, and she was just walking about this conference, you know where she's not supposed to be, and all these shoulders stab her right? -and then +at the very start of last night there was this guy water skiing +big massive fat woman right, and she was just walking about this conference, you know where she's not supposed to be, and all these shoulders stab her right? +and then shoulders? -soldiers, right, stab her and they're all dying and then you see the head like it's just all dressed up in these things and it's arnie underneath it and he takes the head off -and it closes up again and he goes chew this or something blows up and then arnie gets -no there's a scene in terminator, he's like wood and metal, in this new terminator -yeah +soldiers, right, stab her and they're all dying and then you see the head like it's just all dressed up in these things and it's arnie underneath it and he takes the head off +and it closes up again and he goes chew this or something blows up and then arnie gets +no there's a scene in terminator, he's like wood and metal, in this new terminator +yeah it is absolutely brilliant the way they do it. what was that what was that well you'd run a mile oh aye. that one er under the water -the little mermaid no. +the little mermaid no. it is fucking brilliant,in a monkey suit. oh a cartoon? aye. @@ -36518,8 +36489,8 @@ i, i was watching, i was watching did you ever see ? i fucking love that do you? -the cu the music is totally shit but i love -we were talking about it one day walking down the road walked up to this woman, went i fucking hate +the cu the music is totally shit but i love +we were talking about it one day walking down the road walked up to this woman, went i fucking hate crap. no it's good , do you watch that? on i t v. @@ -36530,48 +36501,48 @@ oh that's a load of shit. don't you like it ? fucking english. i know -george if you've got any food then we'll, we'll put it on or whatever is happening then, then then by the time i get something to eat +george if you've got any food then we'll, we'll put it on or whatever is happening then, then then by the time i get something to eat give me a lift teacher, oh jesus christ. hi! you can't. i saw him driving the other day, tell you that? yes. -you told me he couldn't drive cos he was +you told me he couldn't drive cos he was traffic lights. did you tell me that? -it was more like, he says +it was more like, he says he already said he could see red and green. how the fuck does he know we can see red and green? exactly. what's red to you and what's red to me is a different thing. oh look there's keg where? -over there, at the , you can't see her she is behind that pillar and she's wearing a peach jumper and +over there, at the , you can't see her she is behind that pillar and she's wearing a peach jumper and oh jesus christ! and turn round i swear to god. -i'll give you matches whatever if you give me a light i'll give you a sweetie. -matches -the er that's one of your bro or er how many of your brothers and sisters will be at home now? +i'll give you matches whatever if you give me a light i'll give you a sweetie. +matches +the er that's one of your bro or er how many of your brothers and sisters will be at home now? aye. that's alright, but i thought, i was sort of thinking if we're all going round your house, we could bring it round to your house. well you can bring it round to my house sound. -will that be +will that be hi. working hard? yes. ah ah ah! -don't get cross now. +don't get cross now. this is your father speaking now so don't get cross. what? right, one two who the hell's that? that's kink, that singing is kink. -i never list i've never listened to the tape +i never list i've never listened to the tape who's that? totally kink. -jon you dirty git +jon you dirty git what? you got mud all over the bed, come and look at it what? @@ -36582,13 +36553,13 @@ where did all this shit come from then? do you think i do shits in my sleep that size. spontaneous, it's just the same as any. it's just tape it and then some wanker sits and tries to work it out. -that's his job,sits and works out for a living. +that's his job,sits and works out for a living. burt reynolds was on donahue last night. -and then i watched prisoner cell block h is it a whole series of them? -i've only ever seen one before right, i watched it last night and it's the same fucking one . +and then i watched prisoner cell block h is it a whole series of them? +i've only ever seen one before right, i watched it last night and it's the same fucking one . i was totally pissed off. is it, is it all the same? -i saw one of those and it was about some punk in new york and it was +i saw one of those and it was about some punk in new york and it was mccloud? oh totally fucking what? @@ -36597,160 +36568,159 @@ i think i have, i've probably seen them all like. hi. hello. what you doing man? -tidying the shop, oh look you've put all things up. +tidying the shop, oh look you've put all things up. wow! so how's you? ah alright. off school thank fuck. -i'm off for cos i have got no work experience cos and she couldn't get me work experience in june and now everybody else is in work experience i get the week off. +i'm off for cos i have got no work experience cos and she couldn't get me work experience in june and now everybody else is in work experience i get the week off. so that's pretty hot, so where's rick got to? -oh he's gone to the library to see i'll have to get +oh he's gone to the library to see i'll have to get great stuff. so what's the trick to the solo on there? -i don't know like, some of it's just real hard, most of it's just easy anyway it goes in the big diddly diddly diddly bit at the end, just -stuff's no problem but er once it starts and get the medium stuff done as well +i don't know like, some of it's just real hard, most of it's just easy anyway it goes in the big diddly diddly diddly bit at the end, just +stuff's no problem but er once it starts and get the medium stuff done as well and there's the bit so that when he gets up three of my frets on the bottom string that you can't bend up, i don't know what's wrong. -and you hit it and it bends up and it just dies and i've been sitting like, i mean i, i definitely don't think that it is anything with the way i hold it in like cos i've been sitting going and i just, just hit it and it goes ee, it just dies so you can't bend, that's on too. -och it might be i dunno it might be with you bending it that there's a bump on that string. +and you hit it and it bends up and it just dies and i've been sitting like, i mean i, i definitely don't think that it is anything with the way i hold it in like cos i've been sitting going and i just, just hit it and it goes ee, it just dies so you can't bend, that's on too. +och it might be i dunno it might be with you bending it that there's a bump on that string. yeah on the, that's a thought, i think yeah. -but th it's something wrong with +but th it's something wrong with it looks real good with -that's what i thought, i thought you know fuck looks like a bloody comic shop for a change. -that's why i stuck all the posters here think the back issues loosening up a bit it was getting pretty tight. +that's what i thought, i thought you know fuck looks like a bloody comic shop for a change. +that's why i stuck all the posters here think the back issues loosening up a bit it was getting pretty tight. nine hundred series. -well okay anyway i thought they'd ring here but couple of people, some, two women i thought it was belfast station +well okay anyway i thought they'd ring here but couple of people, some, two women i thought it was belfast station new window display and everything. -the big guns and the big guns i found a use for the fucking thing. -that looks good actually i thought you'd be practising like mad on your day off. +the big guns and the big guns i found a use for the fucking thing. +that looks good actually i thought you'd be practising like mad on your day off. no. -i was playing last night gotta learn this album i used to have ages and ages ago fucking . -i was really annoyed last night, i was getting really there was all this like down tuning and up tuning like all over the place that looks like bart simpson's dad +i was playing last night gotta learn this album i used to have ages and ages ago fucking . +i was really annoyed last night, i was getting really there was all this like down tuning and up tuning like all over the place that looks like bart simpson's dad mm yeah. got the hair probably what is it? -going to tonight. +going to tonight. are you? i thought you'd given that up. no, back on again. just started, aye. -ah swimming on monday nights and i'm doing training another three times a week +ah swimming on monday nights and i'm doing training another three times a week i'd love to do th i'm really unfit, i mean like totally unfit. sitting here i've got a pot belly and no fucking muscles that's what robert wants then, to do a bit of training and start like getting i'm not like overly fat or anything, i'm the right weight for what i'm, for my height like but i've just got a pot belly -they've got a spare room in my mum's flat so i just took it over and put a weights bench in and, what else, a rowing machine and i started to do some weights +they've got a spare room in my mum's flat so i just took it over and put a weights bench in and, what else, a rowing machine and i started to do some weights i never knew you had all those. have you ? i've had those for years. expensive! sort of like what happened is that robert was sort of like, the three of us sort of chipped in and bought it between us and stuff like that you know, so that all three of us would get the benefit of it yeah -but er i was the only one that ever used it and i used it about once or twice and then, like like, i used it for about +but er i was the only one that ever used it and i used it about once or twice and then, like like, i used it for about hi there. six months steve. -about eight o'clock he says be down, be in for eight o'clock. +about eight o'clock he says be down, be in for eight o'clock. right. -after easter cos i got people have most go in work experience and i didn't get a place after easter like. +after easter cos i got people have most go in work experience and i didn't get a place after easter like. you dog! revision but it's fucking aye he's a bastard so he is what are you doing? -physics a c theory +physics a c theory a bitch. -the worst like -yeah -a c theory sucks some of the questions you haven't done any mag magnetic stuff ha have you? -or er +the worst like +yeah +a c theory sucks some of the questions you haven't done any mag magnetic stuff ha have you? +or er we've got, you know the -all the worst stuff comes at the start of next year electro-magnetic induction, electron physics,stuff, all the shitty stuff i think -course but +all the worst stuff comes at the start of next year electro-magnetic induction, electron physics,stuff, all the shitty stuff i think +course but oh aye eighty five points. we've done er eighty, eighty something points i think, we've done the fucking i know but er that's what i mean, we get all the, a lot of them, about four of them topics worth, we're being given the equivalent of one of the topics you may be do next year you know. -you know you can get and circular motion and stuff all and ac, you know, it's that big. +you know you can get and circular motion and stuff all and ac, you know, it's that big. next year, year's topic will be nuclear, nuclear physics, it's fucking massive,it's about a hundred topics -seriously next year boy you're gonna get one major awakening, you think this year's bad for physics, wait to you start next year. -i, i, i understand all the work like and i'm sitting in class and i'm doing fine fuck all and then i come in and get a test like and he cracks up +seriously next year boy you're gonna get one major awakening, you think this year's bad for physics, wait to you start next year. +i, i, i understand all the work like and i'm sitting in class and i'm doing fine fuck all and then i come in and get a test like and he cracks up fucking who is? me. he come in laughing one day, look at this paul, look at this and he shows me this big long letter that this teacher had wrote on. -erm you see we were given this test, right, it was on gravity or something +erm you see we were given this test, right, it was on gravity or something hiya hello -and freaked out, right, er we did the test on friday, right and he wasn't in on the monday +and freaked out, right, er we did the test on friday, right and he wasn't in on the monday yeah yeah. -we were going yo he's not in , came in the tuesday the reason i was off yesterday was cos i was so fucked off with your test , but he didn't say fucked off +we were going yo he's not in , came in the tuesday the reason i was off yesterday was cos i was so fucked off with your test , but he didn't say fucked off yeah. -erm erm and then he was going spare and he says these are the worst i've ever received in all the years i've been teaching, right? +erm erm and then he was going spare and he says these are the worst i've ever received in all the years i've been teaching, right? and he went the next ones had better be better, right,the next ones were worse totally disastrous. well i'm, aye he just hit the roof, i got fucking twenty five or something. -all of my test marks like paul eighty, seventy two er fifty six, forty three thirty three, thirty three, twenty five +all of my test marks like paul eighty, seventy two er fifty six, forty three thirty three, thirty three, twenty five as well eh? no chance. -i would rather even kill myself, and i do mean kill myself than do +i would rather even kill myself, and i do mean kill myself than do you're wearing your t-shirt? no i haven't seen this for a while yet had this one on for a few days. yeah we were out last night. yeah. at least twenty people. -oh right you got chips, i thought you got i thought you got gravy and a burger +oh right you got chips, i thought you got i thought you got gravy and a burger all donations will be accepted. -fuck +fuck where? no never. -take your ticket back sensible people would like. -no i'm not sensible, i'm even i'm even less sensible than people who didn't take a ticket back. +take your ticket back sensible people would like. +no i'm not sensible, i'm even i'm even less sensible than people who didn't take a ticket back. hasn't he lost it ? yeah. -i lost +i lost where you there? him and gary, over the fence. was it you went over the fence with gary? i remember seeing you inside. well like i, i was with gary, gary -no i went off in the car with they climbed over the fence. +no i went off in the car with they climbed over the fence. posers. no he, he lost the ticket. oh i lost the ticket -gary definitely got the like. -remember he walked out the lost. +gary definitely got the like. +remember he walked out the lost. what? remember he waltzed out in the ? everybody was laughing. who said i had a chip? -i got a pasty i had a pasty so i did. +i got a pasty i had a pasty so i did. well i just, i just get my pay and then i go and fucking blow it all. aye sure they are nice now fuck off. it's alright steve, we'll just start now, -just turn it down and then +just turn it down and then oh right . this is quite a scandal. aye, scandalous -put them back down and +put them back down and there's no way they would fit my record player. you've already got it. i haven't got it. you bought that the other day. you bought that and -but i didn't buy it. -that's right, i did buy it but i forgot to collect it, that was what +but i didn't buy it. +that's right, i did buy it but i forgot to collect it, that was what think so? well it's a ninety nine p pack. aye. singles. . - how are you? fine, thank you. i've got a @@ -36762,25 +36732,25 @@ oh well. i went for a walk out this morning but i just couldn't stand it. no. it's no good i'm gonna have to go out for a breath of fresh air. -i'm better going +i'm better going do you? -but i've got to be honest with you you know. +but i've got to be honest with you you know. no so he says i'm going out -i said oh i feel i'm going out for half an hour that's all. +i said oh i feel i'm going out for half an hour that's all. yeah -i can't see the pleasure you know. -so you seem a lot better -got a lot of washing to do lie down +i can't see the pleasure you know. +so you seem a lot better +got a lot of washing to do lie down yeah he'd like that. yeah, he'd like that. i know but i thought -so i've bit busy with other things anyway. -i thought what i'd do was i'd have a bath, i thought i'd put all the back in the fridge +so i've bit busy with other things anyway. +i thought what i'd do was i'd have a bath, i thought i'd put all the back in the fridge yeah. -and i've gotta put that erm on tonight as well. +and i've gotta put that erm on tonight as well. yeah. -so that might be as well. +so that might be as well. yeah. see i don't feel as i did last night but it's still there, you know i just take some more tablets like, you know. yeah. @@ -36829,10 +36799,10 @@ yeah. it's all bricked up. what else you've been doing? oh i've done a bit of drawing. -you wanna get your hair cut while you're there +you wanna get your hair cut while you're there yeah. yeah, i ought to go and get changed -yeah, well don't stand about +yeah, well don't stand about yeah, that's alight. i'll get oh yes. @@ -36842,16 +36812,16 @@ yeah. i won't be long. yeah, okay. just go and get myself changed. -yeah, i mean you see works' vans all over the place regular. +yeah, i mean you see works' vans all over the place regular. yeah. naughty boys! i never thought about that. -ha oh. +ha oh. not if they keep his licence. no. speeding. dangerous driving. -dangerous driving cos he made the old woman give over and overtook somewhere totally stupid and probably find he had no brake. +dangerous driving cos he made the old woman give over and overtook somewhere totally stupid and probably find he had no brake. he was slowing down anyway! what are we gonna do? it's spitting and spotting innit? @@ -36869,7 +36839,7 @@ yeah, that'd be right. get one more go than you used to now you get one left. tightened up on that, haven't they? mm. -don't half your er insurance now, don't it? +don't half your er insurance now, don't it? you get yep. a speeding doesn't, never did anyway, bother them. @@ -36883,26 +36853,26 @@ a very old granada mm. way back aye. -ah, yes it is +ah, yes it is yeah. yeah. probably buy hundred quid. -hundred quid +hundred quid yeah. aye. and he had a dangerous driving or a speeding i think it is mm. -horrendous insurance bill +horrendous insurance bill he says i can't afford scrap. cost him more. cost him about six or seven hundred quid a year. -cheaper to buy a blimming er cheaper to insure a car wouldn't it? +cheaper to buy a blimming er cheaper to insure a car wouldn't it? mm. oh -no matter what he gets, it's always over five hundred quid cos he's he's +no matter what he gets, it's always over five hundred quid cos he's he's yeah. -lost his licence in the past and you know, when he was a kid like +lost his licence in the past and you know, when he was a kid like mm. and all that takes a long while before they forget about that, doesn't it? @@ -36916,50 +36886,50 @@ he is actually quite sane now though. yeah, well it's like this fellow that got done for speeding. when did he get done? er thur no wednesday. -sat there watching them catch him up he didn't see them before they got him stopped like. +sat there watching them catch him up he didn't see them before they got him stopped like. saw them catch him up coming along with all their blue lights thinking . they'd been in er garage at bottom. mm. aye. -we'd had a little car before he got there. -he said are you speaking to the no, no,around town he says, i don't mind doing a bit more, you know, out and about not much about they just sat in the traffic, you know. +we'd had a little car before he got there. +he said are you speaking to the no, no,around town he says, i don't mind doing a bit more, you know, out and about not much about they just sat in the traffic, you know. mm -but erm so had it been a foxhalls, something about a minute no, he said only for about a mile, that was it. +but erm so had it been a foxhalls, something about a minute no, he said only for about a mile, that was it. i said oh, about forty seconds and he sort of looked. i says well, at sixty you do a mile in a minute. -so i said if it's only for a mile it's going to be well less than a minute at eighty, presuming you were doing more than thereabouts and er that was it. -but the car, he'd er he says oh that was funny he says, i blew past him, popped into fourth, i blew past him real easy going up the . +so i said if it's only for a mile it's going to be well less than a minute at eighty, presuming you were doing more than thereabouts and er that was it. +but the car, he'd er he says oh that was funny he says, i blew past him, popped into fourth, i blew past him real easy going up the . come out at foxhalls at forty, i think he did. -he can come through foxhall like and he, he'd had to speed up he says and then he says he didn't carry on, like. -he hadn't been doing and er reckon he and er think i'm and that was it so right been driving since he was nineteen +he can come through foxhall like and he, he'd had to speed up he says and then he says he didn't carry on, like. +he hadn't been doing and er reckon he and er think i'm and that was it so right been driving since he was nineteen two or three months ago, i think it was. -i remember him saying once before i don't, i don't know what and er he says it's only a fortnight ago since you know . -you get done for, pulled up for speeding or parking or something and you can pay your own fine . +i remember him saying once before i don't, i don't know what and er he says it's only a fortnight ago since you know . +you get done for, pulled up for speeding or parking or something and you can pay your own fine . so i went home, anybody gonna pay me fine? -he says i am gonna cop it off me mother cop it of his mother. +he says i am gonna cop it off me mother cop it of his mother. you're always going too fast! i told you before! he says me dad al me dad was always speeding he, he used to go mad! mm. slow down. -yeah obviously watching wasn't, wasn't watching his mirror very hard. +yeah obviously watching wasn't, wasn't watching his mirror very hard. he hadn't seen copper trying to get him caught up, i wonder how much he was using mirror when he was overtaking people? mm, yeah. whether he was just watching what was coming from the front. -mm saw him coming have to get it cos neil's mum was cross about it. -oh well he was only just finding out what the rules were. +mm saw him coming have to get it cos neil's mum was cross about it. +oh well he was only just finding out what the rules were. there was a gang of us chatting with him. i come up with six points. that made his day. he says have i got a fixed penalty? i says only got a pink form if you've got a fixed penalty. know somebody who got one, like. -no, only a bloke i've never seen one had one. +no, only a bloke i've never seen one had one. yeah, that'd be richard. -mm only he's got to take his licence and insurance in. -as to what happens now he says i've to go to magistrate's court so it's just beginning to sink in that it's gonna cost him some brass and it's going to be serious. +mm only he's got to take his licence and insurance in. +as to what happens now he says i've to go to magistrate's court so it's just beginning to sink in that it's gonna cost him some brass and it's going to be serious. one of them there was of the opinion who could quite easily lose his licence for it. -like he got done +like he got done what he do? run a chief constable over? no! @@ -36974,13 +36944,13 @@ phew! speeding while slightly over the limit it was. him having speed having, having speed . oh god! -mm where's today? +mm where's today? dunno. he started to come over, didn't he? yeah. -they don't come any worse get a cup of tea in between, weren't we? +they don't come any worse get a cup of tea in between, weren't we? mm. -i don't think it would've bothered us when it was spitting and spotting if we'd actually been out there, would it, it's just setting off in it. +i don't think it would've bothered us when it was spitting and spotting if we'd actually been out there, would it, it's just setting off in it. aye, yeah. blue sky! i can see a bit of blue up there. @@ -36988,33 +36958,33 @@ today? no if you were off to do something and being mucked around for the day, innit? mm -took my a long while ago. +took my a long while ago. not surprised to see them now. only ran out a month ago! -just as well so late i've been waiting for to come. +just as well so late i've been waiting for to come. i got some here come in this morning she says, they ran out beginning of september last year. we hadn't thought about it. i thought i was late. mine have been in, oh, i don't know! a good month! innit? -a slightly bigger like a fish box +a slightly bigger like a fish box or what? lobster pots making a smell. yeah, don't, i know name when it come up like that. -anyway we can sort the problem because you'll take them back a won't you?put them outside your house, creating a smell they were playing up. +anyway we can sort the problem because you'll take them back a won't you?put them outside your house, creating a smell they were playing up. pretty fair stack of them i should think, wasn't there? mhm. don't know if the son's got out yet. been doing time. aye. i don't know -they didn't catch him +they didn't catch him he had an argument with a kid, two or three years ago aye. and er they set off in hot pursuit. it was in back of a pick-up. -driving through with a shotgun shooting the guy +driving through with a shotgun shooting the guy still in the back of a pick-up shooting over the roof, like? yeah. oh! @@ -37026,10 +36996,10 @@ you'd think after that one they'd have thrown the keys away for that. mm. the kid hadn't done much get an extra two years for missing. -the kid hadn't done much, i mean it was nowt serious . -you know i had a moving traffic accident -yeah -wasn't trucking there, you know or owt like that. +the kid hadn't done much, i mean it was nowt serious . +you know i had a moving traffic accident +yeah +wasn't trucking there, you know or owt like that. no sense of humour. got brought a pushbike wheel the other day. can you get the cogs off that? @@ -37039,18 +37009,18 @@ i don't think so. oh pity. so what you've done to bend the wheel? i haven't. -the gaffer knocked somebody off their pushbike, had to buy him a new wheel and some compensation +the gaffer knocked somebody off their pushbike, had to buy him a new wheel and some compensation scrounge the wheel! how do you get them off? he says you go to a pushbike shop and get special tools. ring spanner things with the mm. -keys on the outside pumps and things on it to i wouldn't bother. +keys on the outside pumps and things on it to i wouldn't bother. a new set of back cogs for bike's only about seven quid. a brand new set and they come with the ra with the, erm free wheel and everything all in like, just screw them on. -go to a pushbike shop they whip them off and whip them on for you you buy, you know, if you go out and buy one then just take wheel with you they'll stick them straight on. -mm that fellow don't go to the police. -lucky to get away with having to buy him a wheel compensation +go to a pushbike shop they whip them off and whip them on for you you buy, you know, if you go out and buy one then just take wheel with you they'll stick them straight on. +mm that fellow don't go to the police. +lucky to get away with having to buy him a wheel compensation unusual innit. it's very expensive that's why it's unusual. sixty nine ninety nine. @@ -37070,7 +37040,7 @@ he's bloody mad, he's potty, off his rocker. where did you get it? get what? the thing. -well why +well why well why do you need it, why do you need a towel? why do you need a towel. why er why @@ -37079,7 +37049,7 @@ mum and dad's got it. come on mum. go get in the blooming bath. why? -i'll rewi rewind that actually heard what you say, you must be very naughty and nasty thing to be to your son. +i'll rewi rewind that actually heard what you say, you must be very naughty and nasty thing to be to your son. i can't have a sweet then. well you're not give me a sweet an all. should give me a sweet you know. @@ -37109,11 +37079,11 @@ five pounds. that's okay. w would it make much difference for you lending me the money. not a lot. -well there's a quite a bit of difference between five and fifty isn't there and the one thing is for your educational needs and the other i'm so convinced about. +well there's a quite a bit of difference between five and fifty isn't there and the one thing is for your educational needs and the other i'm so convinced about. well yeah. i thought a computer -no, but i know that you're dying to have a computer, and if money was no object, then we probably wouldn't hesitate in lending it to you, but really and truly at this moment things are tight and we can't afford to commit ourselves with things unless it's absolutely necessary. +no, but i know that you're dying to have a computer, and if money was no object, then we probably wouldn't hesitate in lending it to you, but really and truly at this moment things are tight and we can't afford to commit ourselves with things unless it's absolutely necessary. well and that's it, i mean i've made it as plain as i can. that is it and i hate it when you keep on and on nagging. @@ -37127,38 +37097,38 @@ it,half an hour long. well i think it's longer than half an hour. they probably should an hour at the most. -given you er erm +given you er erm the film is about hour and five minutes. -you can probably have a video of it as long of another version. -well it's does help to see different versions because you see that different people interpret the +you can probably have a video of it as long of another version. +well it's does help to see different versions because you see that different people interpret the why do you mm? -well it depends on the people who are producing or directing or whatever, so it's all got different ways of doing it. -when i was studying i went to open air theatre and i saw a version there on christopher er what's his name that chubby fellow with the glasses christopher biggins that's it. -he was playing puck and when i went to see the company doing it well they had a completely different way of doing it, they wo they did it really like er a dec you know the the mechanical play, i don't know if you know a midsummer night's dream. -they did it in a completely slapstick farce way you know th the men who were dressed up women they balloons and had rosy red cheeks and wigs and things, it was quite different. +well it depends on the people who are producing or directing or whatever, so it's all got different ways of doing it. +when i was studying i went to open air theatre and i saw a version there on christopher er what's his name that chubby fellow with the glasses christopher biggins that's it. +he was playing puck and when i went to see the company doing it well they had a completely different way of doing it, they wo they did it really like er a dec you know the the mechanical play, i don't know if you know a midsummer night's dream. +they did it in a completely slapstick farce way you know th the men who were dressed up women they balloons and had rosy red cheeks and wigs and things, it was quite different. how they -well that's it, when shakespeare wrote a play and the text has survived and , but the way of of joshing the people on the way they do it is different every generation and even most of the people in the same generation would would have a different way of doing it. +well that's it, when shakespeare wrote a play and the text has survived and , but the way of of joshing the people on the way they do it is different every generation and even most of the people in the same generation would would have a different way of doing it. okay. -there's a comedienne erm she apparently was born in wales. +there's a comedienne erm she apparently was born in wales. mhm. two ton tessie o'shea that's her. two ton tessie? -she yeah, that's her her nickname, cos she was quite big and she played the nurse in romeo and juliet in the season on stratford on avon and she did it using a welsh accent because she thought shakespeare, having coming from quite near the welsh border country might well have had might well have had a welsh nurse. +she yeah, that's her her nickname, cos she was quite big and she played the nurse in romeo and juliet in the season on stratford on avon and she did it using a welsh accent because she thought shakespeare, having coming from quite near the welsh border country might well have had might well have had a welsh nurse. so it didn't matter that romeo and juliet is set in italy. mm. -she did it as she would have thought shakespeare would have known people and things, you know, she did it like that. +she did it as she would have thought shakespeare would have known people and things, you know, she did it like that. mm. -and i remember amanda seeing a video of romeo and juliet +and i remember amanda seeing a video of romeo and juliet and what struck me was that the costumes were all sort of like you see portraits of elizabethan dress. -now i don't what italy and those middle ages would have been like, that the sort of clothes that were worn. +now i don't what italy and those middle ages would have been like, that the sort of clothes that were worn. mhm. -but the clothing in that film struck me very much as being like elizabethan dress. -yeah, i mean now plays of shakespeare and they're wearing modern dress like those worn at richard the third or something and they're wearing well either first or second world war uniforms. +but the clothing in that film struck me very much as being like elizabethan dress. +yeah, i mean now plays of shakespeare and they're wearing modern dress like those worn at richard the third or something and they're wearing well either first or second world war uniforms. yes. it was very different then. -yeah, well it's just different directors have different things they want to emphasise in a play and if they want to bring something home or they think that using a certain well like say the way the people are dressed and everything will will have more of an impact, you know will -one thing i was wondering about you know they they talk about erm in shakespeare's works is the language the words he uses, the the sort of poetry of it and the symbolism that's used. +yeah, well it's just different directors have different things they want to emphasise in a play and if they want to bring something home or they think that using a certain well like say the way the people are dressed and everything will will have more of an impact, you know will +one thing i was wondering about you know they they talk about erm in shakespeare's works is the language the words he uses, the the sort of poetry of it and the symbolism that's used. erm do they talk about that at all in your english literature yes. do they show you how you can learn about this, there's a book you know the book i bought you it's got notes in it. @@ -37166,18 +37136,17 @@ does that help with it? i suppose pardon? well you should do. -and what about i bought some revision books and things study aids or something for amanda for her english literature -well i bought them for amanda and she was doing romeo and juliet. +and what about i bought some revision books and things study aids or something for amanda for her english literature +well i bought them for amanda and she was doing romeo and juliet. so if you look in those you may find there's some help there. yeah. - come in, good morning. hello, well what's your mum been doing to you this morning ? . well she's just after the freeze her, freeze her tongue. -having the flu, near a fortnight ago now, she's on these pills and she's as bad as ever, and not sleeping again. -she's finished them now, she +having the flu, near a fortnight ago now, she's on these pills and she's as bad as ever, and not sleeping again. +she's finished them now, she she's finished those . let's have a look and see what you've one to your your poor old inside. dearie me. @@ -37201,7 +37170,7 @@ it's er just what's been happening to a lot of folk, sinus trouble. do you like nice medicine or do you prefer those? don't know. you're not bothered ? -she'll say that and then give you the +she'll say that and then give you the horrible stuff. in a bottle. er i can put it in, in a bottle or i can give you tablets. @@ -37220,21 +37189,20 @@ i want to believe it. now one of these in the morning and one at tea time. twice a day, for the next week. one, two, three, four. -tell your mum she could be kinder to you, she's got to for -even though she's already. +tell your mum she could be kinder to you, she's got to for +even though she's already. right oh, okay, bye mrs , -right +right cheerio now. - -up and call me now a little music as well we have on the show we have a video from elvis to give away in the second half of the programme and star guest this afternoon is mary whitehouse. +up and call me now a little music as well we have on the show we have a video from elvis to give away in the second half of the programme and star guest this afternoon is mary whitehouse. oh ho ho steeley dan and erm reeling reeling out the thingummybobs. hello that's a nice way to start it isn't it? -good morning good afternoon whatever you like to call o never mind you know the number. +good morning good afternoon whatever you like to call o never mind you know the number. now er we're going to start this morning talking about animals. more specifically why we're so cruel to them. britain must be an animal erm a country of animal abusers looking at the statistics. why do we hate animals so much? -if you have a view on that o nine o four six four one six four one and i'd like to hear from you all you have to do is pick up the phone and give me a f a call now sorry. +if you have a view on that o nine o four six four one six four one and i'd like to hear from you all you have to do is pick up the phone and give me a f a call now sorry. did karen say to somebody on that thing did i hear her say, what are you on? she looked at me and said that when i walked in this morning. what are you on? @@ -37252,7 +37220,7 @@ so you're the big boss are you? one of them. one of them. have you er polished your brass today got it all ready to talk to me i hope you have. -now sorry alan i've got to turn you up a bit you don't mind do you? +now sorry alan i've got to turn you up a bit you don't mind do you? no not at all. it won't hurt there we are that's nice ok. now alan, first of all er have we learned anything do you think over the years or do we seem to be getting worse? @@ -37277,7 +37245,7 @@ once you've er got over the newness of it the the the thing can be put in away i but with an animal it's for life. er you've got to look after it. you've got to devote a lot of time to the care and attention that it requires. -i i heard the other day what i thought was one of the best advertisements not to have an animal for christmas very emotive, er i think it was for the r s p c a, and i i'm told i don't think you've heard it but it b basically it's it's er the sound of a er well it's a human pretending to be a dog really and saying you know, well this is nice my my er family have taken me to the vet, i didn't think i was ill but never mind. +i i heard the other day what i thought was one of the best advertisements not to have an animal for christmas very emotive, er i think it was for the r s p c a, and i i'm told i don't think you've heard it but it b basically it's it's er the sound of a er well it's a human pretending to be a dog really and saying you know, well this is nice my my er family have taken me to the vet, i didn't think i was ill but never mind. oh here comes a nice man with er an injection. ah perhaps they're going to give me some vitamins. yes. @@ -37299,7 +37267,7 @@ there are many other areas in the country where animals are seriously abused. the northeast isn't the only place. mm. ok thank you very much indeed er chief superintendent. -and pa pat i don't think i don't hold out any hope at all that people will pay any attention they will go they'll see a little puppy somewhere they'll say, oh that's lovely we'll buy that for tommy er, and then tommy will abuse it totally and er they'll say, well the dog was a a waste of time it didn't work properly and er didn't know how to er how to look after itself. +and pa pat i don't think i don't hold out any hope at all that people will pay any attention they will go they'll see a little puppy somewhere they'll say, oh that's lovely we'll buy that for tommy er, and then tommy will abuse it totally and er they'll say, well the dog was a a waste of time it didn't work properly and er didn't know how to er how to look after itself. may i just say that the majority of people will care for their animals but it is those people who buy, we have s er cases where erm people will turn up on christmas day and say to their elderly relative, we bought you a puppy. the elderly relative hadn't didn't want a puppy. never ever wanted a puppy because it makes them a captive person @@ -37310,17 +37278,17 @@ or just after christmas usually between christmas and new year. we're called to waste ground, behind pet shops, a any place to pick up boxes of unwanted puppies, kittens that have obviously been er planned for selling to people er before christmas. good alan thank you very much indeed. you're very welcome. -let er let's hope it'll mm won't be like that er mm this er this year. +let er let's hope it'll mm won't be like that er mm this er this year. now he says deep intake of breath don't have a puppy for christmas. do as i do have turkey instead. i'm playing this one because i like it. -it's a little a little fresh cajun music from new orleans from the and i can say that er that's why i'm playing it really. +it's a little a little fresh cajun music from new orleans from the and i can say that er that's why i'm playing it really. o nine o four six four one six four one any calls about dogs or er any other sort of animal you want to give us a ring call us now. which er er probably rude i dunno it's just . er b b c radio york you are not in the south of france but as it is persistently snowing around the county at the moment i thought you know a little french flavour. was it the beaujolais nouveau wasn't it this week was it? everybody seems to be nodding around here i thought it was thursday it was wasn't it? -could anybody bring us a bottle down here you know because that would be nice wouldn't it on a on a cool saturday afternoon here as we sit overlooking the grand metropolis of york. +could anybody bring us a bottle down here you know because that would be nice wouldn't it on a on a cool saturday afternoon here as we sit overlooking the grand metropolis of york. it would be nice to have just a little swig of the erm of the new grape. has anybody tasted it? i haven't tasted it anybody taste give me a call. @@ -37344,7 +37312,7 @@ give me a call you know the number o nine o four six four one six four one. you can ring now. you can ring about anything you want actually. anything you feel like you can ring i'm i'm i'm i'm i'm really you know. -shame of the killer oh no i don't think we'll do that er look through the sun see if there's anything interesting erm in there i've got nothing in the ewbank . +shame of the killer oh no i don't think we'll do that er look through the sun see if there's anything interesting erm in there i've got nothing in the ewbank . boxer chris ewbank worth around eight million is moaning that he's got no money. what has he done with his money? what has got he didn't give me any. @@ -37356,30 +37324,30 @@ chris ewbank is the best dressed man. that'll upset jonathan ross he always thought he was. er o nine o four six four one six four one. anybody who can hum by the way the er theme to the television programme ivanhoe and i would be interested to hear from you as well. -now as the united nations doesn't have enough on its plate dealing with the problems on earth and obviously they're er they're there at the forefront of everything that happens . +now as the united nations doesn't have enough on its plate dealing with the problems on earth and obviously they're er they're there at the forefront of everything that happens . action is being demanded to track down possible visitors from outer space and this is serious. a small group demonstrators have staged a protest outside the u n headquarters in new york calling for an end to what they say is a cover up over the existence of u f os. one of the organizers, michael luckman, says president clinton is scared to acknowledge that superior beings do exist. the united states er government is afraid as are other governments to admit er to their people that there is a higher form of life. obviously if the u f os touch down that would mean they would be charge and not bill clinton at the white house. -okay well er i i figure that there must be quite a number of er extraterrestrials around around north yorkshire and i thought it would be quite nice actually if er if there are any extraterrestrials listening at the moment they could ring in and we could have a chat. -so if erm if if you yeah yes e t e t phoned when what do you want? +okay well er i i figure that there must be quite a number of er extraterrestrials around around north yorkshire and i thought it would be quite nice actually if er if there are any extraterrestrials listening at the moment they could ring in and we could have a chat. +so if erm if if you yeah yes e t e t phoned when what do you want? i'm not even speaking to you because of that flipping letter. i mean i just noticed it i read, sorry karen walked into the studio totally uninvited through a red light. -that's a particular no no i mean you know for goodness sake can't we av can't we actually ob observe studio discipline? +that's a particular no no i mean you know for goodness sake can't we av can't we actually ob observe studio discipline? what you doing? just shutting that up a bit. that's my knob if i want it open i'll leave it open. don't flatter yourself. there we are you see. just smutty mind haven't you really. -er the individual responsible for this this is your letter from the er director of er the officers of the director general's broadcasting principle assistant dalek to the director general. +er the individual responsible for this this is your letter from the er director of er the officers of the director general's broadcasting principle assistant dalek to the director general. get bert on the phone i want a word with him now. come on you lot you know where he is get him on the phone i want to talk to him. the individual responsible for this unacceptable behaviour shall remain nameless protect his listening and viewing ratings suffice it to say that his name suggests that he is capable of making a big splash. is this the sort of person that's running the b b c? i don't believe he wrote this. -erm likes to spout a lot and is never happier than when he is chewing up all the small fry in the world . +erm likes to spout a lot and is never happier than when he is chewing up all the small fry in the world . this is . the d g joins me in wishing you every success in your future career. you're destined for big things obviously. @@ -37422,12 +37390,12 @@ are you? yeah. tell me they keep you in a garage locked away is that right. that's about the size of the place yeah. -okay we can't do this i don't like it you know talking to the on the programme we don't like it at all. +okay we can't do this i don't like it you know talking to the on the programme we don't like it at all. memo could you not mention the producer quite so much nobody out there knows who he is. i'm going to actually tell everybody who everybody is later so there'll be no trouble. right, now stand by because i'm going to give you a big build up right. -and i've got a and then oh this my paper here hold on. +and i've got a and then oh this my paper here hold on. b b c radio york oh no hang on sorry i got that wrong. i i start you do the jingle first. @@ -37441,7 +37409,7 @@ that's between bedale and catterick at the moment and slight delays are possible also on the a one in the leeming area the inside lane of the south bound carriageway's closed at holby grange for emergency gas repair works and delays are likely as a result there. in selby there's a demonstration taking place this afternoon it starts at half past one and will go via barlby road and scott road and some traffic delay delays are likely as a result. also in york today traffic near to the knavesmire could be slow due to an event taking place there. -in the ripon area weekend roadworks mean the road will be closed as it passes under the a one bridge delays are likely as a result. +in the ripon area weekend roadworks mean the road will be closed as it passes under the a one bridge delays are likely as a result. at stockton on forest stockton main bridge over the a sixty four is closed for resurfacing work through to six o'clock on monday morning. and finally in the thirsk area there are no further reports of snow on the high ground there but some moorland routes may still be a little slippery. danny savage a a roadwatch. @@ -37458,7 +37426,7 @@ okay. bye bye. bye bye. danny savage with the er the traffic. -now the the trains the twelve twenty eight aberdeen isn't going to leave until twelve fifty four er let's have a look anything else er liverpool twelve thirty eight middlesborough edge hill er no leaves on the line but you know you don't you never know the er er er i don't understand that the thirteen eighteen what's that? +now the the trains the twelve twenty eight aberdeen isn't going to leave until twelve fifty four er let's have a look anything else er liverpool twelve thirty eight middlesborough edge hill er no leaves on the line but you know you don't you never know the er er er i don't understand that the thirteen eighteen what's that? what does sar scarborough i suppose that is? gla go ge gar ge ga has the computer gone mad? yeah i'm sorry but the computer's gone mad. @@ -37471,7 +37439,7 @@ there were three words in the don't ring yet there were three words in the title it is difficult it is difficult i know all right? o nine o four six four one six four one this is it. ready? -the hawaiian wedding okay no y you can't have got . +the hawaiian wedding okay no y you can't have got . there are three wo don't answer them yet. don't let the them ring for a bit. the hawaiian wedding now there's a word there missing i wonder if i wonder if you can erm if you can guess that if you are the most entertaining winner you will get this elvis video. @@ -37481,7 +37449,7 @@ o k o nine six four one six four one very few calls out there at the moment i me noel is there hello noel how are you? hello i'm fine thank you. what are you on here for? -because er because i was invited on to speak about current educational issues +because er because i was invited on to speak about current educational issues oh that's good i couldn't you see it's very difficult for me you know i have to look up there i can never distinguish one one one call from another. right. do you have a tit do you want me to your a title do you have er? @@ -37494,25 +37462,25 @@ i'll tell you why cos the b b c there's a directive just gone out i've just been can you believe it? how much more flipping civil can you get. have you heard these quiz sho i mean they're all on radio four aren't they? -all the quiz show yeah basically ? +all the quiz show yeah basically ? well rad radio one as well. -mm where do you live anyway? +mm where do you live anyway? in leeds. oh good. mm it's freezing outside isn't. it certainly is yes. what are we talk oh education we're talking about education right yep. -okay let me do the prog right er noel that's a funny name noel by the way isn't it? +okay let me do the prog right er noel that's a funny name noel by the way isn't it? it's erm appropriate for the time of the year nearly . mm it's like pulse but not. -oh oh er yes. +oh oh er yes. is that how you pronounce it? -erm it it is pronounce to +erm it it is pronounce to not the noel y yeah okay. -anyway right so erm head teachers in the area have been complaining their schools are not tidy not cleaned sufficiently. +anyway right so erm head teachers in the area have been complaining their schools are not tidy not cleaned sufficiently. yes. why? -i mean why why are our children going to school in in pig sties? +i mean why why are our children going to school in in pig sties? well i think it's er down to the competitive tendering process where the county council has had to put out the cleaning contracts for schools to tender. there were problems a few years ago when it first started with th the initial contract which was was won by the the county's own direct service organization and now it seems we're having a repeat of of those problems. er with the new contracts that started in september erm basically it seems that some teachers are having to do bits of cleaning themselves to keep their their classroom up to up to scratch up to the standards they ought they ought to be. @@ -37522,7 +37490,7 @@ and er that is isn't that disgusting? it certainly is yes . that is disgusting yes. -so all these a lot of these firms are not up to the job why do why don't you sack them people are not up to the job why don't they get sacked? +so all these a lot of these firms are not up to the job why do why don't you sack them people are not up to the job why don't they get sacked? well there are monitoring systems which are meant to be in place a and which may be er are not are not effective enough erm. i mean i've heard representatives for county council th this week saying that er as far as they were concerned th the standards weren't sufficiently low yet for them t to take action. but basically th every time the contract comes up for renewal, what will happen for a company to attempt to win the contract it's got to cut the hours of its employees and its also got to try and c cut the costs erm by cutting pay and that's the way that's the way contracts are won in this situation and as long as that keeps happening then the situation's going to get steadily worse. @@ -37553,19 +37521,19 @@ we we well we'd love to be able to get get on with our job and er wi with far le well he's not going to be there for ever. decisions are made decisions are made erm there that we and we have to live with the consequences of them. if they affect education then it's our responsibility to speak up about them. -you see i i think er er probably one of the best erm ministers of er of er education that er has been for quite some considerable time and i bet you throw your hands up in horror when i say this you will totally disagree and i'm talking here cos his name's just slipped out of my mind . +you see i i think er er probably one of the best erm ministers of er of er education that er has been for quite some considerable time and i bet you throw your hands up in horror when i say this you will totally disagree and i'm talking here cos his name's just slipped out of my mind . who was tha who was that oh for goodness sake tall thin gaunt looking man, always had to have about fifteen spoonfuls of sugar in his coffee whenever i met him? s sir keith joseph? er you knew you see sir keith joseph. -now i i remember talking to him for hours once on a programme about education and this was when he first said what we want is teachers to be accountable. +now i i remember talking to him for hours once on a programme about education and this was when he first said what we want is teachers to be accountable. and i'm a great believer in everybody should be accountable right? yes. we well i've no objections to that to that at all. -no none of you do now but when he first suggested it everyone was up in arms and he poor old soul i remembered he said, i've had enough change i i believe in this i i've i've tried i'm too old now and out he walked. +no none of you do now but when he first suggested it everyone was up in arms and he poor old soul i remembered he said, i've had enough change i i believe in this i i've i've tried i'm too old now and out he walked. is there a chocolate machine in the building? and off he went. he was addicted to chocolate. -i i i think erm a lot of teachers would now look back on those days with er a certain fondness now bearing in mind what's what's happened since and the the the succession of education secretaries we've had since since then i mean had the only one in recent years who i would say has attempted a genuine dialogue with the teachers and tried to do something constructive is john mcgregor. +i i i think erm a lot of teachers would now look back on those days with er a certain fondness now bearing in mind what's what's happened since and the the the succession of education secretaries we've had since since then i mean had the only one in recent years who i would say has attempted a genuine dialogue with the teachers and tried to do something constructive is john mcgregor. so when, and i would agree with you again, so when are the teachers going to be accountable, when is somebody who is a bad teacher and heck there are quite a few of them, you know it only takes a couple in every school to make it difficult for the rest, going to be got rid of you know you are not up to the mark out. there there are systems in place in schools already for that and there always have been. you jest with me now come on we're we're we're being serious noel if you are a teacher it is almost impossible to sack you. @@ -37573,31 +37541,31 @@ almost totally impossible. that's simply not true. there there are disciplinary procedures in in all schools erm which are there to be used. why are they never used then? -are all teachers too good to be sacked because it is it is as rare as erm teeth in chickens. -i think it's i think it's very easy to er to ex exaggerate the problem to take one anecdotal evidence of of one about one or two cases and maybe about one or two people and say this is a major problem in every school. +are all teachers too good to be sacked because it is it is as rare as erm teeth in chickens. +i think it's i think it's very easy to er to ex exaggerate the problem to take one anecdotal evidence of of one about one or two cases and maybe about one or two people and say this is a major problem in every school. let me put it this way to you noel i don't think it is. let me put it to you this way you know as well as i do people who really ought to be doing something else other than teaching. you know that as well as i do and those people don't seem to be given the encouragement to move on to another profession. i i some are some are promoted to head teachers i know and i knew you were going to say that. -i wasn't going to say that no . -erm no i i honestly don't think that er that the the problem is as big as as big as you you say it is and i i think the the structures are there to deal with that and if if people had you know if people used them then they would they would work and they from time to time that they are used and you know it it is not impossible to get rid of rid of a teacher in in the way you are suggesting. +i wasn't going to say that no . +erm no i i honestly don't think that er that the the problem is as big as as big as you you say it is and i i think the the structures are there to deal with that and if if people had you know if people used them then they would they would work and they from time to time that they are used and you know it it is not impossible to get rid of rid of a teacher in in the way you are suggesting. okay noel thank you for your er your time and being a good sport this afternoon and i hear you have a little one you had better go back and sort things out. that's right. okay. okay thanks. thanks a lot noel bye bye. -noel from the er n u t. +noel from the er n u t. erm i don't know what this is serious point actually if if you fancy yourself as one of these so called mums and i think it is a little patronizing the er title of a mums' army of teachers, if you think that maybe you could do that and you'd be interested in doing that and you think it's quite a good idea i'd be interested in hearing from you, all right? o nine o four serious talk o nine o four six four one six four one erm if you'd like to do that give me a call. now where is er where is rita where are you rit all right my love all right where's rita i've got i've got yellow i've got red i've got blue i've got green. what number is rita on give me a number because i haven't got white? -twenty four okay right if i put that down there rita hi. +twenty four okay right if i put that down there rita hi. hi. how are you? i'm fine thanks . -hang on let me do that again that's good that isn't it? +hang on let me do that again that's good that isn't it? makes a little noise click click click click. can i have a chip does anybody hi rita hi. @@ -37623,7 +37591,7 @@ no it's not bad no okay. i've just got to get something do you mind? no go and get your chips or whatever. -no i've got i've got i wanted t +no i've got i've got i wanted t it's all right my hubby can wait for his lunch i aren't bothered. jolly well ought to as well. er i wanted to talk to jim bowen you see about this quiz show host ought to be a a little nicer than they are and apparently his answer machine is on at home. @@ -37631,12 +37599,12 @@ well i must admit james i've threatened to put mine on. have you? well karen said that if i won the competition she'd ring back. mm and then you thought, oh god i've done it now . -but i had to speak to you you see and i dialled you while you actually said on the air that anyone that won had to speak to you and said to karen look if you ring back i'll put the answer phone on . +but i had to speak to you you see and i dialled you while you actually said on the air that anyone that won had to speak to you and said to karen look if you ring back i'll put the answer phone on . i know i thought that was good because then everybody puts the phone down you see and they all think they're going to be terribly clever. yes i think it depends on what kind of a message you actually have on your recorder to start off with. is your's rude. no it just says that it's basically to the effect of that the answering machine is quite reliable -i i +i i and if you leave a message it will be dealt with and people do leave a message, whereas before when it just said i'm sorry i'm not available they didn't they just put the phone down. i usually leave a message saying i'm having sex at the moment ring back in about three seconds. and do they? @@ -37652,7 +37620,7 @@ well to be honest ja i can't see that far normally from where i live i can see t okay. i also i i also erm er what was i going to say i would take the disc but i can't find a way of getting into this machine actually it's broken erm . it sounds about par for the b b c. -young danny, the big boss now weekend said er take a disc take a disc and i said yeah well it's knackered er erm. +young danny, the big boss now weekend said er take a disc take a disc and i said yeah well it's knackered er erm. what? sorry. i'm doing that talking to you look for jim bowen's mobile phone number so i thought we'd give him a ring that'll surprise him wont it? @@ -37669,7 +37637,7 @@ no stuff that who cares? er hungry. he well so am i. -actually i was hoping someone's going to bring in some er some some nouveau beaujolais nouveau cos a new one came out on thursday. +actually i was hoping someone's going to bring in some er some some nouveau beaujolais nouveau cos a new one came out on thursday. is there nobody round here listening that can erm that could bring in some beaujolais nouv no no little off licence that will do this free publicity on the b b c to come in a say, look i'm an odd bin or something like that ? i i thought the b b c i thought the b b c couldn't advertise then? no the b b c can't. @@ -37677,7 +37645,7 @@ but you can? well. you're the exception to the rule i suppose? yes you wait till you get severely beaten and then you say i'm very sorry i didn't mean to do that. -hang on hang on i've got rachael from er from guide friday buses. +hang on hang on i've got rachael from er from guide friday buses. oh golly hang on just a minute . i think i think i think you've probably stirred a hornets nest up with that. hang on just a minute. @@ -37707,7 +37675,7 @@ that's right yeah. there's never any spaces behind clifford's tower so i don't know how you're just telling me fibs aren't you? well they're all they're all queuing up to go in there so i not sure. i just don't understand all these buses with the open tops it's freezing out there and all these tourists look they could walk rachael. -well are tourists +well are tourists they could walk, why don't they walk? it's a seven kilometre tour. it takes an hour and a lot of people don't want to walk around the city they'd like the option of going around on the bus. @@ -37718,7 +37686,7 @@ not encouraging lack of exercise we're encouraging an informative tour around th you still got that beautiful blonde hair? we're not on the air are we? no no no we're not on the air. -heaven forbid i wouldn't talk to you like this if we were on the air would i ? +heaven forbid i wouldn't talk to you like this if we were on the air would i ? anyway so go on. right. what were we talking about? @@ -37730,13 +37698,13 @@ not that you need to be any fitter than you are. well they are fit cos they get on and off at any of the stops they go along to the attraction that they want to do. yeah i walk from my front door to my car as well and people say that's not enough exercise. well the a there's the barbican centre for the exercise perhaps they should encourage the tourists there then. -mm forgetting all about oh dear i've got a frog when i go on the air i'll clear that. +mm forgetting all about oh dear i've got a frog when i go on the air i'll clear that. er can you hang on a minute? yes certainly. -i just got a we commercial breaks call you back in a minute don't go away yet. +i just got a we commercial breaks call you back in a minute don't go away yet. rita? rita? -oi rita where's rita gone. +oi rita where's rita gone. you cut her off well get her back on. get her back on or she's not having this i'm sorry about that hang on just a minute block your ears i'm just going to spin round again okay hang on oops er are you their rachael are you there? i'm here yes. @@ -37755,14 +37723,14 @@ seaham who? seaham up in er county durham. oh i know yeah i know seaham yeah. what were are you doing? -i thought i want it on the c ds. +i thought i want it on the c ds. oh right sorry. i should think so. playing with me knobs. look hang on i've got one queu are you all right there rachael? hello. do you get fed up with people saying, are you really like that one in coronation street? -no i don't actually cos i'm nothing like her . +no i don't actually cos i'm nothing like her . erm you look similar. well that's er that's a insult. @@ -37774,7 +37742,7 @@ you were very pleasant. and didn't say you know, it's flipping these tour buses in york that cos all the other people trouble because you can't get anywhere they clog the roads up. well that's really not our problem i mean that's to do with the deregularization of er bus companies allowing any anybody to start up a bus company. oh that's a bit political rachael isn't it a bit political i wasn't expecting that -featured the last er three years some of the other companies have only been here since last year and the year before so i mean we're a national tour operator +featured the last er three years some of the other companies have only been here since last year and the year before so i mean we're a national tour operator experienced in running open topped tours around cities. could you hang on just a minute don't go away just stay there hold on. ah rita. @@ -37855,12 +37823,12 @@ bye. bye. er it's karaoke video as well. so you do need a karaoke machine. -well it's all right because my daughter's got one her music cassette thing whatever. +well it's all right because my daughter's got one her music cassette thing whatever. mm. mm so we can do it on that. oh. and have a good laugh and think of you. -i think i might ring nina i've just found her home phone number in my book . +i think i might ring nina i've just found her home phone number in my book . have you. yeah. why do you want to ring her, james . @@ -37874,17 +37842,17 @@ yeah. and i'll see you later. okay then. all right darling it's been lovely. -i bet you can't find to come and pick it up. +i bet you can't find to come and pick it up. no i can't. no. -oh see you later. +oh see you later. bye james. bye bye. okay let's er let's go back where are you rachael? hello i'm in tower street. i know you're in tower street i'm just being facetious really. any way . -hound dog can you do hound dog no don't don't be cruel how does that go? +hound dog can you do hound dog no don't don't be cruel how does that go? sorry? sing don't be cruel . i'm not singing at all. @@ -37925,7 +37893,7 @@ i'm not singing honestly. show that this guide i can't sing i'd embarrass myself . yeah but nobody can sing -i deter anybody who'd every wanted to get on one of the buses . +i deter anybody who'd every wanted to get on one of the buses . no you wouldn't they'll all come on and say where's that girl that sings robin hood. i don't think they would. are you not going to do this? @@ -37940,7 +37908,7 @@ er got two guides, a guide and a driver to tell you the truth. okay could you let me talk to the driver? yes certainly. put the driver on i want to talk to the driver. -robin hood robin i like that it's great. +robin hood robin i like that it's great. haven't got another record queued up . hello. hi who are you? @@ -37977,7 +37945,7 @@ do you get well paid for this job? no. you don't well you don't deserve to get well paid because not for all the hassle we get. -for all the time that we have to sit behind you when we're trying to drive around blowing our horns going get out the way . +for all the time that we have to sit behind you when we're trying to drive around blowing our horns going get out the way . well ninety per cent of the time you shouldn't be where we are cos it's no cars. absolute rubbish. unless you're a taxi. @@ -37989,7 +37957,7 @@ what would you think i drive round in? i'll i'll make a point in looking out for ya. i've got i've got a huge a huge turbo bentley with a great big whale stuck on the front. oh right. -and andy written down the back if you want to scratch it. +and andy written down the back if you want to scratch it. oh well no i won't do that i'll just drive round at five mile an hour in front of ya. you do that anyway. oh no no be fair it's fifteen usually. @@ -38005,12 +37973,12 @@ aha. salaries and holidays and that thing. and ma , make you pay your pension book this year. mhm. -just ask the old girls to make their and say well i want your national insurance numbers? +just ask the old girls to make their and say well i want your national insurance numbers? now, now where is that? i say, it's on your pension book. is it? i didn't know! -i know mine off by heart. +i know mine off by heart. do you? what your national insurance do you? @@ -38032,8 +38000,8 @@ i got out the bed at five and twenty to eleven and the curtains were still drawn so, i opened the door and i was so pleased when he answered, you know. he said, just at the right time he decided that he can't get bath any more. well that's not a problem. -i said to him yesterday wash all your important little places and i'll do the rest, you know. -so when i got there this morning he was still in his pyjamas he'd got on quite well, all he wanted me to do was wash his face. +i said to him yesterday wash all your important little places and i'll do the rest, you know. +so when i got there this morning he was still in his pyjamas he'd got on quite well, all he wanted me to do was wash his face. would you like another drink? would you like some more er @@ -38067,17 +38035,17 @@ nails. ! she goes, oh no you need to, don't get back, she don't keep her hands still! don't think much of that! -when they get old they're all sort of +when they get old they're all sort of oh! wriggly ! yeah. and i file my dad's but for him. -they came sort of without ! -i said to him all the, you know his his nail +they came sort of without ! +i said to him all the, you know his his nail and i reckon i washed -a pair of black feet the other and i thought my god,! +a pair of black feet the other and i thought my god,! oh god! really? i really thought it was that bad! @@ -38090,7 +38058,7 @@ did you put dettol in the water? the toes are gonna come off in a minute? oh oh, how awful! but they didn't. -i don't have any ruddy or anything +i don't have any ruddy or anything like that. i'd collapse if they did! it'd be awful wouldn't it? @@ -38098,10 +38066,10 @@ ooh ooh ! you could have said this little piggy went to market! yeah ! how dreadful! -it's one he ! +it's one he ! he don't fe , he don't feel nothing now. no, course they can't feel it can they? -i thought about popping out to ! +i thought about popping out to ! urgh! it's gonna come off it's gonna com yeah. @@ -38109,7 +38077,7 @@ in a minute! oh! tony was talking about how cold i am. we've got this old boy that comes to me, often she's told us his hands are rotten, that it's all yellow and horrible! -er i said to george you know, you've gotta remember these things. +er i said to george you know, you've gotta remember these things. if anything happens to that man they'll know he's alright except for tidy. must be awful mustn't mm. @@ -38125,7 +38093,7 @@ you know, she really has! got a lovely body! really she's . what she us ,u used to watch. -yeah because her +yeah because her is lovely! she's got a young body. yeah. @@ -38139,7 +38107,7 @@ probably hadn't been in the sun at all! absolutely lovely body! got a beautiful body! well that ethel's in her seventies and, you see her in just towel wrapped round her and she could wear a -round her head wear them. +round her head wear them. strapless anything. mm! mind you, val looks @@ -38152,7 +38120,7 @@ yeah, but she's firm though marg! in a way no, i don't doubt it. well there's no wrinkles. -and there's no wrinkles or fat involved and everything about her is her. +and there's no wrinkles or fat involved and everything about her is her. yeah. mm. she wouldn't be here @@ -38166,14 +38134,14 @@ that, about bobby's ! rang up last night so i gotta ring her wednesday. yeah. -so we don't actually say the same what we're like it should be alright i suppose. +so we don't actually say the same what we're like it should be alright i suppose. but if you went up when you go and down! when yo , when you go up and down, yeah! you're alright aren't you? you've nothing to worry about. it's when you go up and up, you worry! -wha wha wha kind of a seagull is this ! +wha wha wha kind of a seagull is this ! when you set off breathe out. i'm not lifting my jumper up bill! if he expected a skirt, @@ -38183,7 +38151,7 @@ i hope you're planning to bring that down when i got sunburnt you you thought th oh i know i've been cheated! just as well as a can't fi , throw it over my shoulder! didn't you have the same figure after you had a boys then sylv, er mary? -no, i as flat as a pancake until i had her! +no, i as flat as a pancake until i had her! i've never lost an inch off my bust now. no. oh well! @@ -38206,7 +38174,7 @@ whe , the day i got married i was a thirty two a a yeah. which is a very flat one. yeah. -i'm now up to a thirty four b and i've been a thirty four b ever since then. +i'm now up to a thirty four b and i've been a thirty four b ever since then. mm. and i never went down again. i can get back up to about a thirty eight now. @@ -38217,13 +38185,13 @@ yeah ! in some ways i bet! it has hasn't it? god! -and now, i think to myself, well and inch off wouldn't be bad. +and now, i think to myself, well and inch off wouldn't be bad. yeah. -but i wouldn't wanna go back to a thirty two a not really. +but i wouldn't wanna go back to a thirty two a not really. not as big as i am down here cos you wouldn't look right would you? i'm bottom heavy. yeah, so am i sylve. -can you just imagine anyone like top heavy? +can you just imagine anyone like top heavy? that doesn't bother me. when i was young i had dolly parton? @@ -38237,15 +38205,15 @@ and you find, can you imagine anybody trying to do that these days? no. mm. must be! -i think she's going to always fall over all the time really ! +i think she's going to always fall over all the time really ! yeah. well tell you what, she would never get up would she? no. no. -you know, she'd +you know, she'd isn't it? yeah. -you can have without the honey, you know. +you can have without the honey, you know. oh yeah! you know they're back? are they back? @@ -38265,7 +38233,7 @@ was it? mm. aha! i thought it was last week? -so seven weeks he said it was. +so seven weeks he said it was. no, last weekend. and yet well it's seven weeks last thursday. @@ -38280,7 +38248,7 @@ that's what they said or something. aha. and er but he doesn't look exceptionally brown though. -he's alright for the donnington +he's alright for the donnington no. grand prix. no. @@ -38301,7 +38269,7 @@ yeah. and we come back on the thirteenth. yeah, we go out the day of the and we've booked the taxi. -monaco have you? +monaco have you? yeah. although, i sa , but i hope they've got the right day! so we're getting on with it then? @@ -38324,10 +38292,10 @@ i've put it in dave's birthday? my diary, i've go wrote it in my diary, i got dave's birthday. what you off on holiday? -yeah, with marg +yeah, with marg for two weeks? yeah. -well that gotta be weeks now innit? +well that gotta be weeks now innit? oh yeah! that's right! in june. @@ -38338,7 +38306,7 @@ think well of me while you're three months. -over there doing my g c s e's please ! +over there doing my g c s e's please ! oh! ah! oh god! @@ -38370,7 +38338,7 @@ i've gotta say. it's very nice! it's very nice! well no, they'll be go christmas time when -think all this time +think all this time when you start what date did erm you start? @@ -38378,19 +38346,19 @@ the eighteenth. i've got my orals on the eighteenth, nineteenth, and twentieth of may? yeah. -then i get half term for a week and then my actual exams start. -as i said to you've have this half term off from now on from tomorrow she's got to start +then i get half term for a week and then my actual exams start. +as i said to you've have this half term off from now on from tomorrow she's got to start my first exam i've got is june the fourth. and i've got two on the fourth, one on the tenth, and one on the eleventh, so the last you've got your orals in may. yeah, may the eighteenth, nineteenth yeah. and twentieth. -i will probably have had my french actual one in may. -so definitely haven't had the +i will probably have had my french actual one in may. +so definitely haven't had the so you've got to start revising now. ones back. -we've had the seven exam in the erm +we've had the seven exam in the erm isn't that clear? is that your gateaux? no it's shelley's. @@ -38402,12 +38370,12 @@ is it very dry, exceptionally dry? it is ! well don't speak then? she can't remember -what the last one tastes like ! +what the last one tastes like ! brown innit? -yeah, it's nice, but very dry. +yeah, it's nice, but very dry. it's quite nice . yes. -this one here has really dropped the whole of my particulars on her own! +this one here has really dropped the whole of my particulars on her own! i think that's disgusting! not on my own! ha! @@ -38419,7 +38387,7 @@ ha! ha! ha! five to two! -ha , well who gave you a particulars then? +ha , well who gave you a particulars then? or did you buy a bit? no, she didn't! i bought it. @@ -38429,18 +38397,18 @@ no, you didn't, dad did! i did! dad said i could have an order! you bought the . -let's have this knife. +let's have this knife. yeah. she's got it wrong. -good job i haven't +good job i haven't oh look over there! th there erm they erm -i went back into +i went back into came to the office. -don't you think they're only using that as +don't you think they're only using that as well yeah! -apart from having it on +apart from having it on urgh! no. there was all the mail @@ -38453,8 +38421,8 @@ got any help? yeah. i just cannot have her today as well! -you never heard anything from what's his name? -robbie, about going into london did you? +you never heard anything from what's his name? +robbie, about going into london did you? yeah, it's alright. not a word. no, not a word. @@ -38469,7 +38437,7 @@ he and, erm a the other bloke are still there. the chap who tried to call, the one watching it? behind, yep. yeah, he's still there. -i was gonna say er somebody told me that he'd left and i thought it was you cos nobody would . +i was gonna say er somebody told me that he'd left and i thought it was you cos nobody would . no, he's still here. i got it wrong, yeah. yeah, could have been me marg. @@ -38477,13 +38445,13 @@ could have easily been me. do you think you'd better aim for the winter now? i would, definitely. yeah. -personally, maybe we just +personally, maybe we just did i tell you what's happened? they sent you all notes on well it's quite naughty and then you won't cos goodwood's sorted isn't it? -you'll expect that they the coach was burnt out down in beatmore , if you remember and then the the police took them august there +you'll expect that they the coach was burnt out down in beatmore , if you remember and then the the police took them august there di , no,th october. police took him in that night cos they thought he'd burnt it out himself. and it's taken all this time, it's gone to court and all the rest of it, and they haven't got a case. @@ -38493,9 +38461,9 @@ well they that was genuine. the banks wo wouldn't let me have extra money or anything like that. oh! -they're trying to get somewhere now with the police but it could have happened anywhere! +they're trying to get somewhere now with the police but it could have happened anywhere! no it's alright! -but this, this bloke has sort of said, ooh he said, apparently one of the blokes that were working for him said that he had overheard him saying they were gonna burn the coach out. +but this, this bloke has sort of said, ooh he said, apparently one of the blokes that were working for him said that he had overheard him saying they were gonna burn the coach out. oh! and if this chap said, the one that took it that night, he said there is no point in him doing it because he didn't have the coaches insured for enough. no. @@ -38522,7 +38490,7 @@ i mean i can understand it in this day and age, people trying to get their money back. yeah. get their money from insurance policies and try and make their money back -i suppose what it really amounts to, it's probably someone who's in the same line of business and they're trying to get the best way aren't they? +i suppose what it really amounts to, it's probably someone who's in the same line of business and they're trying to get the best way aren't they? mm. but it's a nasty business isn't it? i know. @@ -38536,14 +38504,14 @@ sorry! this is and you're more number in her little red book! i tell you what though marg -dave's got a job pretty well hasn't he? +dave's got a job pretty well hasn't he? i've done it. yeah, i saw it last week here as well!lo , lot shorter otherwise he'll be complaining his ears are growing too high! -but that if he won't sit there very often marg, then i suppose i'd do anything. +but that if he won't sit there very often marg, then i suppose i'd do anything. your business is my business. oh i see! which was the last time i did george's was the day when i came down . -well it's mr you see, he goes out at twelve o'clock on a sunday and doesn't get in till quarter to four. +well it's mr you see, he goes out at twelve o'clock on a sunday and doesn't get in till quarter to four. work! yeah. work! @@ -38571,7 +38539,7 @@ twenty fourth of march. yeah. so who this bloke is? so that's not this week -it might be +it might be that's next week? no, it'll be bill. yeah. @@ -38596,19 +38564,19 @@ yeah. i might not watch it. yo you don't think she's got any wait a minute. -we think it's a +we think it's a oh,a do you? -boring, then we looked to see what's on the other side, but for some reason she was talking don't they? +boring, then we looked to see what's on the other side, but for some reason she was talking don't they? or time until they do you watch er noel edmonds? -you see coming off the th there's a straight bit erm, but she was very friendly with this woman's mother +you see coming off the th there's a straight bit erm, but she was very friendly with this woman's mother mm. but the daughter still keeps in touch with her. -she's just written to her to say that she's on this is your life on the third or fourth of march, whatever it is +she's just written to her to say that she's on this is your life on the third or fourth of march, whatever it is oh! -and her son-in-law is an actor but mrs doesn't know who he is, what his name is +and her son-in-law is an actor but mrs doesn't know who he is, what his name is oh! -so to speak so she's written and told her whereabouts she's sitting and everything so +so to speak so she's written and told her whereabouts she's sitting and everything so that girl is daft but he wa that's all i can say! @@ -38629,7 +38597,7 @@ i thought ooh! that looks like joannie's old car! i was waiting for the bus. were you? -i thought ooh! +i thought ooh! there's another woman in where were you? there! @@ -38641,7 +38609,7 @@ getting her pension. it out can she ! no. oh, is this local you went? -she ! +she ! in lidmouth yeah. does anyone watch noel edmonds on a saturday night? @@ -38658,13 +38626,13 @@ and you've gotta guess who's but what happened on saturday? house it is. what were they doing? -no , they, go the, you know, it might be your living room, they just put +no , they, go the, you know, it might be your living room, they just put oh i see! oh yeah! -this week with those swimmers they were, those two women put a peg on their nose and had their swimming hats on and was doing the act of swimming in the lane? +this week with those swimmers they were, those two women put a peg on their nose and had their swimming hats on and was doing the act of swimming in the lane? no! no . -apparently erm, they often do this and of course, they sort of went into their home and got this girl with her friend and they sort of put the pegs on their noses and have these sort of rubber hats with those +apparently erm, they often do this and of course, they sort of went into their home and got this girl with her friend and they sort of put the pegs on their noses and have these sort of rubber hats with those yeah. , you know, like they do and they sort of pretend they're they pretend they're swimming @@ -38673,20 +38641,20 @@ don't they? yeah! what, and weren't they? yeah. -well you know, she was just sat there in the chair and they said that they +well you know, she was just sat there in the chair and they said that they you wouldn't believe it! came into this room. would you? no! and sort of and they danced. -they sort of, they danced you know, like they we , they would and sort of , getting ever so silly about it actually! +they sort of, they danced you know, like they we , they would and sort of , getting ever so silly about it actually! and they i know ! cos they did like they didn't say anything. -song person, that last week, and terry weeks ago. -his wife set him up cos he he's always the one +song person, that last week, and terry weeks ago. +his wife set him up cos he he's always the one oh! the one, oh yeah! oh right! @@ -38714,13 +38682,13 @@ watched that. does anybody else know that er, that's his. what's happening on march the second? -oh yes ! +oh yes ! i'm glad about that. -strange advert i saw in the week it it was erm +strange advert i saw in the week it it was erm i i haven't seen it. -it was something about march the second, it was just a clip +it was something about march the second, it was just a clip pancake day is it? no, it's the oh! @@ -38751,8 +38719,8 @@ so something's obviously happening. yeah. but she hadn't found out what. it was just a clipping of it. -it had it sor it was sort of like the body shop sort of theme, but it's not the body theme. -it you know th , their green symbol with the black +it had it sor it was sort of like the body shop sort of theme, but it's not the body theme. +it you know th , their green symbol with the black yeah. in it? well it's green and it's got cream in it, but it's not the exact symbol of the body shop,i a bit different. @@ -38763,7 +38731,7 @@ i don't know what it is. oh they're recording us. what's it for ? what? -you wanna put it on the table where it's actually. +you wanna put it on the table where it's actually. right, just put it on the table and leave it! no you can't. i'll put it on the table, then leave it! @@ -38785,20 +38753,20 @@ no! ought to have a floor manager or something. aye up! -that's okay for them we'll be able to fix something on. +that's okay for them we'll be able to fix something on. often get many of them, don't worry! mostly for the cross both sides. are you coming out tomorrow night? what you going erm going to the legion. i dunno. -legion legion. +legion legion. alright. legion tomorrow night. well i paid my dues. -i paid, i paid er well i'm not off , but i i'll put something towards it. +i paid, i paid er well i'm not off , but i i'll put something towards it. oh i see! -you got something a have you put something towards it? +you got something a have you put something towards it? yeah. i think by christmas you'll have had anything ha! @@ -38815,22 +38783,22 @@ yeah. we didn't unfortunately. we didn't ask, but he said not to. yeah , i know where it is! -se seeing him later on. +se seeing him later on. how much now? should have given us the money, money. no, we're coming out tomorrow night then! oh no! -don't you go getting with all friends +don't you go getting with all friends from the legion? don't they , yeah you'll play in the legion won't you? ah? ah? in here. yeah. -yeah, i might i might have a wander o over there. -you don't want me to come and see how you're getting on +yeah, i might i might have a wander o over there. +you don't want me to come and see how you're getting on do you? -you might be able to unpack bob for us. +you might be able to unpack bob for us. yes. well, from what i know he didn't get no money after that! well, really that's no problem at all ken! @@ -38839,21 +38807,21 @@ yeah, but you gotta be down here early enough for that to see him. he goes on number one don't he? does he? ah, we got class here! -i'm coming along anyway friday. +i'm coming along anyway friday. no we'll beat them then! no doubt. but wha when i was, you weren't around when we played them then were you? cos i didn't come, i was ill. i was ill . i was ill. -i had a we we should be in there. +i had a we we should be in there. but they said we lost it. -but, no to play, you did. +but, no to play, you did. no. -and after that i i you know, seeing him again and he he's not a player -he's unbeaten champion. +and after that i i you know, seeing him again and he he's not a player +he's unbeaten champion. no he's not. -well he . +well he . yeah, but he doesn't play against he doesn't play with us does he? yeah. @@ -38869,11 +38837,11 @@ bit of a, bit of a good darts player. well he's a county player isn't he albert? yeah. reasonable player. -i mean he scored well in the +i mean he scored well in the yeah. -really, the way i look at it he +really, the way i look at it he yeah. -he say, he said he's a fu , he's a terrible player and he played against bob and i and we had we want two double . +he say, he said he's a fu , he's a terrible player and he played against bob and i and we had we want two double . move over. well that's it. mind, that's that's what i like about that bloody . @@ -38881,68 +38849,68 @@ come and kiss the ! you, you ! now you're being rude! right, right. -yeah and +yeah and that's what i like. no, you you put your own, david down there. yeah. yeah. -i think that, i mean they still got the different, if you're playing like a shot +i think that, i mean they still got the different, if you're playing like a shot i think you do. i think you do because -i mean, we got nine players and once you've drawn that out you either leap forward by +i mean, we got nine players and once you've drawn that out you either leap forward by what about the places you go to put eight or nine . eight singles and that's that problem . but you can. -you could have a coming around every week and two you don't get it. -and you talk about buying them young, you can got them, cos he knows . +you could have a coming around every week and two you don't get it. +and you talk about buying them young, you can got them, cos he knows . yeah. . with you coming in, nobody knows they're at the gate. no, i i see what you mean. alright! i like the . -today do you get four at home and four away. +today do you get four at home and four away. yeah. -and that goes on aggregate on the night, yeah? +and that goes on aggregate on the night, yeah? yes. -and the, as we got our own side they can, they can win perhaps they just around +and the, as we got our own side they can, they can win perhaps they just around i'll do it. -the way going back they got before. +the way going back they got before. whereas me and you got a team together, you said forty two playing league and four playing here and four playing a league game. that's right , yes. so you got . -oh no you do , you no, no! +oh no you do , you no, no! well yes. -well no, no, no. -you play four on the team the four on the team play a go right? -then, whichever played a one that game go away again. +well no, no, no. +you play four on the team the four on the team play a go right? +then, whichever played a one that game go away again. yeah. so you've got the same ? ! yes, alright then. -then you play, you play yo you play four singles four singles, four singles and two doubles. +then you play, you play yo you play four singles four singles, four singles and two doubles. i was thinking you played . -i mean they go away, i mean the six always played at the back. +i mean they go away, i mean the six always played at the back. but everybody else is. -brian was saying, he said you going in with your he said and we'll lose that , he said he should play his best bloody +brian was saying, he said you going in with your he said and we'll lose that , he said he should play his best bloody well yeah. six you've got! but darts don't work like that . if you're going to win you gotta play you're best six . that's right. that's right. -you've got to, but then again, you know +you've got to, but then again, you know unless you're not bothered. unless, unless, unless, unless you won and then you get best . well no, you ge if you won and give the rest a game. see we're not bothered. -we're, we're, i mean we're not we're not that bothered really . -yeah, but no could we? +we're, we're, i mean we're not we're not that bothered really . +yeah, but no could we? i mean -well we could, we could help you -i mean we want, we want well, to tell you truth, we shall won on that, we won on that occasion. +well we could, we could help you +i mean we want, we want well, to tell you truth, we shall won on that, we won on that occasion. i put on, i put on my best two doubles haven't i? -and left left +and left left well i only said whatever you want to do. do you wanna go up for suit . i said, that's all we want. @@ -38970,38 +38938,38 @@ no, six. two. one of them. mm. -i mean we played good, but just couldn't get out and they did. +i mean we played good, but just couldn't get out and they did. well the door was open and nobody were worried about that. don't you remember that thirty doubles. what, they got it? they got it? -the only worry about that was brian. +the only worry about that was brian. yes, you're right. yeah! yeah. played out of his skin again. -but er he, i had some . +but er he, i had some . played, he played out of his bloody skin till half way. he couldn't of played as many, he'd have bloody well that was . but the cos he hasn't got any . -that, i sort of said who was it? +that, i sort of said who was it? he plays like you said. -i was going to old chris, i said i said he should play in the class. +i was going to old chris, i said i said he should play in the class. he's quite a good player . -i said, he eats about a as much as much as like a corn packet ! +i said, he eats about a as much as much as like a corn packet ! ah, brian, brian, david has never met you. and he went he would be on the , good that hole! good that hole! -and he went bump, bump, bump took the prize down and i said, and i walked past we said like, to his mate chris, i said, he's improved a damn sight more than i'd have thought. -er yeah, i'm waiting on the dole tomorrow honey. +and he went bump, bump, bump took the prize down and i said, and i walked past we said like, to his mate chris, i said, he's improved a damn sight more than i'd have thought. +er yeah, i'm waiting on the dole tomorrow honey. i'll get the work soon enough. well they've only two pairs. they got bob , the bob . -oldest player who ever +oldest player who ever neil, you can wear the green card. yeah! no, they've . @@ -39029,8 +38997,8 @@ no, i i i can do that. robbie's got it. rob we're gonna win for victory . -and that erm carole down there look. -hasn't been for a few years. +and that erm carole down there look. +hasn't been for a few years. yes. yeah. i pulled my . @@ -39039,12 +39007,12 @@ but, the man goes on number two. i did, the afternoon. yeah. see him a couple of years anyway. -go and pick up? -if you'd see him, i thought you all was under the rest of them but +go and pick up? +if you'd see him, i thought you all was under the rest of them but well that, i think i would have recognized looked younger. the face anyway. -the bloke with the green usually wears the green trousers. +the bloke with the green usually wears the green trousers. but he plays that well every, cos every time i see him play he plays hell of bloody suit! yes. definitely. @@ -39062,8 +39030,8 @@ oh yeah! as long as you, you shouldn't, you shouldn't lose it now. oh i know. no way! -not with -well i wanna go then woman! +not with +well i wanna go then woman! ah? don't move it. eh? @@ -39075,36 +39043,36 @@ the sheep to cross the road and mm. quite unusual! i'd never seen it before and that's the one time i've seen it. -i can remember when you'd see a cloud of dust, perhaps it'll be a mile away and this would be a flock of sheep. -course, they hadn't had lorries in them days, they drive them on the road and you see old shepherd coming along with a couple of dogs and goodness knows how many sheep! +i can remember when you'd see a cloud of dust, perhaps it'll be a mile away and this would be a flock of sheep. +course, they hadn't had lorries in them days, they drive them on the road and you see old shepherd coming along with a couple of dogs and goodness knows how many sheep! and of course, the roads were all gravel then, no tarmac, see this cloud of dust across there. -and er if you see it was coming towards of course you run into them, but if they were going the other way course the dust still keep going. -but but of course this was many years ago. +and er if you see it was coming towards of course you run into them, but if they were going the other way course the dust still keep going. +but but of course this was many years ago. never see a flock of sheep on the road now. it's all done with cars. you wouldn't like this dairy you wouldn't. -it er oh! -it used to be occasional or more perhaps, sometimes show time different shows and that. -so many sheep or, ha show time see, you see these flocks of shop but now you always +it er oh! +it used to be occasional or more perhaps, sometimes show time different shows and that. +so many sheep or, ha show time see, you see these flocks of shop but now you always been to a cattle market. that's a long time ago because se the roads have been tarmacked for goodness knows how long now! -i can remember when the first bit of tarmac was put on a road round here and that down here at upton bypass and all +i can remember when the first bit of tarmac was put on a road round here and that down here at upton bypass and all oh yes! what they call upton bypass. yeah. -oh it was er cry over war wound! +oh it was er cry over war wound! oh! horses will never be able to stand on it! it's slippery and that. what a state they were in then! -my father had er, horses at that time and my uncle out at holt, he had some horses they were talking about this one day and uncles would say well a horse didn't work nearly as hard with that road's were nice and solid. +my father had er, horses at that time and my uncle out at holt, he had some horses they were talking about this one day and uncles would say well a horse didn't work nearly as hard with that road's were nice and solid. father said well it's, it's so slippery they can't stand on them. but it wasn't, it wasn't slippery see, but they thought it would be. yeah. an oh! -i can remember when that upton bypass, when it was done the cry there was about that! +i can remember when that upton bypass, when it was done the cry there was about that! mm. -course, it it used to be the old rough gravel road. +course, it it used to be the old rough gravel road. can you remember ascot road? mm? ascot road? @@ -39126,62 +39094,62 @@ just off clarendon road, dad. eh? just off clarendon road. clarendon road? -er ooh yes! +er ooh yes! clarendon road, yeah. -course i ye , i walked up the top of clarendon road there when a i was first going out to work up there old bill . +course i ye , i walked up the top of clarendon road there when a i was first going out to work up there old bill . yeah. mm. i can remember that. well mm. -it's a road that goes through there to swingdale road and there's a little place in there. +it's a road that goes through there to swingdale road and there's a little place in there. little blue and white wooden hut. mhm. it was. i dunno. -over my uncle er old harry he had a house around clarendon road er oh i dunno! +over my uncle er old harry he had a house around clarendon road er oh i dunno! there wasn't many houses there at that time. mm mm. we built our house there. mm? -erm it was meant to be the oldest house in erm broadstone +erm it was meant to be the oldest house in erm broadstone ah? and we built our hou , not, bought the plot of land and built our own house on it. -well old harry shared with my uncle he had his house and he bought a piece of land on the bottom of his garden and he built wall on his or this piece along the bottom of his garden, but er i couldn't tell you, it wasn't very far up the road. -but er yeah i know. +well old harry shared with my uncle he had his house and he bought a piece of land on the bottom of his garden and he built wall on his or this piece along the bottom of his garden, but er i couldn't tell you, it wasn't very far up the road. +but er yeah i know. but i haven't been up to cla clarendon road for some time now. -er ha! -there used to be a a house on the end of the common up at clarendon road, the opposite side oh! -er old mrs i dunno, but th , anyway there was only this one old house up in the common and er i went up there one time with horse and take a couple of pigs from there down to wimborne market. -but i suppose the old house has pulled down under pressure and built on now but that was the only house going up through there in them days. +er ha! +there used to be a a house on the end of the common up at clarendon road, the opposite side oh! +er old mrs i dunno, but th , anyway there was only this one old house up in the common and er i went up there one time with horse and take a couple of pigs from there down to wimborne market. +but i suppose the old house has pulled down under pressure and built on now but that was the only house going up through there in them days. that was a very old house! wimborne market's supposed to be old. mm? wimborne market must be very old! oh lord, yes! -course we , wimborne cattle market is finished now isn't it? +course we , wimborne cattle market is finished now isn't it? i went to a cattle market in mm. devon mm. with my aunt. ah yeah. -er ha ! -wimborne market every tuesday and wimborne horse sale every other friday. -used to have horse sale every fortnight, see every other friday. +er ha ! +wimborne market every tuesday and wimborne horse sale every other friday. +used to have horse sale every fortnight, see every other friday. ha! -you wouldn't think that there was a enough business to want a horse sale once a fortnight would you? -but mm. +you wouldn't think that there was a enough business to want a horse sale once a fortnight would you? +but mm. course, it was horses in them days, not motorcars. -i can remember first motorcar that we drove in old charlie 's. -old charlie's car wooden spokes, wooden wheels solid tyres and he used to sit up right in there same as i am now, like in a box and the old chauffeur was the chauffeur driving along. -and i suppose they go along about i don't expect they do about six miles an hour. +i can remember first motorcar that we drove in old charlie 's. +old charlie's car wooden spokes, wooden wheels solid tyres and he used to sit up right in there same as i am now, like in a box and the old chauffeur was the chauffeur driving along. +and i suppose they go along about i don't expect they do about six miles an hour. just, chug, chug, chug, chug. at least it was some other form of transport than a horse. oh yes! gave the horses a bit of a rest. mm. -er er er er er er +er er er er er er i would think the mo , motorcar nowadays can go up to something like two hundred odd miles now is it? yeah. mm. @@ -39190,18 +39158,18 @@ mm. oh yeah. ah! but don't matter what it is everything is increasing in speed. -now you see in my days on the railway sixty miles an hour was a good speed for a train it di it didn't reckon to do much more than that see. -i know er, down at corfe junction or a one road across or one another across or there was one road going to wimborne, one going to broadstone, up road and down road. -and of course, they had these signs up about la up close to a signal er twenty, twenty five or thirty or whatever it was, that was miles an hour, they were supposed to reduce to that. -and er i can remember one day a driver, len his name was and he er he said to the inspector, oh he says er i've been through corfe junction he said at sixty miles an hour! +now you see in my days on the railway sixty miles an hour was a good speed for a train it di it didn't reckon to do much more than that see. +i know er, down at corfe junction or a one road across or one another across or there was one road going to wimborne, one going to broadstone, up road and down road. +and of course, they had these signs up about la up close to a signal er twenty, twenty five or thirty or whatever it was, that was miles an hour, they were supposed to reduce to that. +and er i can remember one day a driver, len his name was and he er he said to the inspector, oh he says er i've been through corfe junction he said at sixty miles an hour! what! ooh he said, you don't wanna make a song about it! but he said, i have done. -and er course, that where the restrictions was on see at the and of course, after that, a few years after that, of course take no notice of it now. +and er course, that where the restrictions was on see at the and of course, after that, a few years after that, of course take no notice of it now. it all goes on the same. -er er it were just the same on a motorcycle the faster he'll go the better they'd like it! +er er it were just the same on a motorcycle the faster he'll go the better they'd like it! it's still the same nowadays isn't it? -you get the youngsters that hare off down the road . +you get the youngsters that hare off down the road . mm. ah. what's this, the news on now margaret? @@ -39222,20 +39190,20 @@ mm. you got that er, ticket margaret. yes, i'll get your si , your things for you tomorrow. ah. -well i hope you've been able to pick up a bit of something but i'm not very good at it myself cos old days and old times. +well i hope you've been able to pick up a bit of something but i'm not very good at it myself cos old days and old times. just casual talking. -he said he well he said +he said he well he said yeah. course, cars. you'll have enjoyed doing it won't you dad? yeah. yeah, cos i'm ont' other. -i said er uncle cecil made that cabinet there didn't he margaret? +i said er uncle cecil made that cabinet there didn't he margaret? we're leaving that shit hole of a country! what was it like? yeah, simon said there was a crappy! -simon said there was a dead cat er outside your first hotel and the brothel across the road . +simon said there was a dead cat er outside your first hotel and the brothel across the road . yes. that one. ha! @@ -39251,9 +39219,9 @@ so funny ! ! about the brothel ! come on! -he'd been talking to these erm greek blokes and they invited him into this bar for erm -a drink, all these sex and he went, and he went in and -you know like when you have where you have like a flat between you if you're a student. +he'd been talking to these erm greek blokes and they invited him into this bar for erm +a drink, all these sex and he went, and he went in and +you know like when you have where you have like a flat between you if you're a student. yeah. yeah. but if other person changes @@ -39262,7 +39230,7 @@ their mind, something yeah. like that then like you could be having fun. -when somebody can't keep up with their +when somebody can't keep up with their oh yeah! oh yeah! during the holiday. @@ -39272,13 +39240,13 @@ how's ? like, this is what becky was saying, it's like have you ? and you say i'm gonna move out, you know. and you try and find a place but you can't find one but you said you're moving out so you've got to go along with it. -you're constantly and a motorway going through your house so they give you less than the pro than the market value +you're constantly and a motorway going through your house so they give you less than the pro than the market value yeah , value for it. value for it. yeah. mm. people that have come in contact with him so should be -sally army's one ! +sally army's one ! social workers. yeah i know. ha! @@ -39338,7 +39306,7 @@ no you don't know right! . what does it take -well any +well any for one or two or hospitals. and you start being unwilling to do @@ -39347,10 +39315,10 @@ bloody do anything! hospitals which yeah. deal with them. -oh you put hospitals +oh you put hospitals lost my, lost my door key ! yeah people getting fed up and the hospitals -and erm yeah, something like that, yeah! +and erm yeah, something like that, yeah! getting, getting, into the real world and they yeah. yeah. @@ -39369,15 +39337,15 @@ actually i couldn't stand that, i don't think! yeah. yeah. mm. -either that or they've been proved well +either that or they've been proved well people who've been let out of jail as well. oh yeah! yeah. and passed out. -er marriage break up is one cause. +er marriage break up is one cause. oh yeah! mm. -the woman might get kicked out by the ex-wife or your boyfriend or +the woman might get kicked out by the ex-wife or your boyfriend or yeah. mm. the husband. @@ -39387,7 +39355,7 @@ well why, why can't we yeah. some animals! oh yeah! -squirrels who've had their trees cut down ! +squirrels who've had their trees cut down ! yeah they go, i'm a squirrel! hee hee hee! ee! @@ -39406,15 +39374,15 @@ i know. no! don't! yo you might have ! -there's this panda and he's really bored with, i mean he's, he's getting no sex so he breaks out of erm london zoo to go off and find a partner. -and he walks into this brothel and, there's this prostitute and well business is not going well +there's this panda and he's really bored with, i mean he's, he's getting no sex so he breaks out of erm london zoo to go off and find a partner. +and he walks into this brothel and, there's this prostitute and well business is not going well she's going to undre , yes you do probably, yeah. -so anyway, she hires so he hires this prostitute and they, they go upstairs and he gets a bit hungry so sarnie and they get down to the serious business +so anyway, she hires so he hires this prostitute and they, they go upstairs and he gets a bit hungry so sarnie and they get down to the serious business shh! and he won't in the tree -and tell me, tell me this how did you leave home? +and tell me, tell me this how did you leave home? i do drink socially. cos we haven't got much time. i am . @@ -39422,7 +39390,7 @@ yeah, what sort of wedding? why did you, why did you leave home? how did i left home? i didn't leave home. -i, put me in a detention centre because i was shoplifting and i didn't like it there so i left! +i, put me in a detention centre because i was shoplifting and i didn't like it there so i left! tt tt tt tt tt tt tt tt! what is your name? sarah. @@ -39438,21 +39406,21 @@ i knew you were gonna say manchester! how old are? have you cut holes in your trousers to put sixteen. -big triangles of cloth in and turn them into flares then ? +big triangles of cloth in and turn them into flares then ? no! not quite! do you go begging? -well sometimes, but sometimes i just pickpocket it's much easier that way. +well sometimes, but sometimes i just pickpocket it's much easier that way. have you turned to prostitution as a way of getting money? no, i don't think that's a really good idea, it's not safe. -it's not . +it's not . do you sleep in shop doorways or do you go to a hostel so sometimes? -well, i haven't got much money but well sometimes i do go to hostels, yeah but, most of the time i just sleep anywhere i can find a shelter. +well, i haven't got much money but well sometimes i do go to hostels, yeah but, most of the time i just sleep anywhere i can find a shelter. bus shelters are quite helpful. have you ever thought about going back home? i was gonna say that! no. -i don't i if it would be no point. +i don't i if it would be no point. but why? so you're saying it's better on the streets than at home? yeah. @@ -39471,7 +39439,7 @@ well that could just be a sort of way of life. i mean, when people get beaten up when they're younger it me this is true, i saw it on a t v programme carry on. -they can erm it can affect them in their later life and they hit out at people to show their affection. +they can erm it can affect them in their later life and they hit out at people to show their affection. mm! don't believe that! she never said a nice word to me in my life! @@ -39497,20 +39465,20 @@ ha! ha ! right! how old are you? -i'm thirty three thank you! -and erm where do you come from? +i'm thirty three thank you! +and erm where do you come from? surrey. how long have you been homeless? -er three years. +er three years. why are you homeless? -because i used to be in a mental institution but they said i was well so i'm allowed out now. +because i used to be in a mental institution but they said i was well so i'm allowed out now. but i haven't got anywhere to go to. mm. -haven't you got any living relatives that you could go and see? +haven't you got any living relatives that you could go and see? no. whenever i phone them up they all pretend to have emigrated to australia. oh! -surely the place would have the mental institution would have set you up with a home or something when you left? +surely the place would have the mental institution would have set you up with a home or something when you left? no. where did they put you then? they can't have just turfed you out? @@ -39519,14 +39487,14 @@ oh dear. why don't you pretend to be still mad and go back? i don't think she needed to tell you! and where do you spend your days? -i mean, do you do you sort of wander round the street jabbering to people like this? +i mean, do you do you sort of wander round the street jabbering to people like this? no, actually number one, number two or number three? -or er number three. +or er number three. i make sure i ride on every bus going and sit next to somebody who really doesn't want to sit next to me! how do you get the money to pay for the bus fares? -i ! +i ! no, i just sort of accost people and talk to them and normally they pay me to go away! have you ever thought of prostitution? i'm not that bad! @@ -39538,7 +39506,7 @@ er, do you get any cooked meals a day? no. no. what do you eat? -don't you ever go down to the hostels or down +don't you ever go down to the hostels or down well or sometimes? i want to know what you eat? @@ -39567,18 +39535,18 @@ hello! hello! you'll be good at that! what's your name then? -er, my name is erm mr . +er, my name is erm mr . are you homeless or no, she's a social worker. -no i'm not homeless i'm gonna try and help you are +no i'm not homeless i'm gonna try and help you are you're going to try and help us then are you? if i can, yeah. what do you think it is that causes homelessness? well, we've just had a discussion about this in the hall. oh right! no. -erm a lot of things. -have you, have you encountered many problems with homelessness? +erm a lot of things. +have you, have you encountered many problems with homelessness? are you a lot of problems. is that, is that your erm main area? @@ -39589,13 +39557,13 @@ as a social worker do you have a beard? yeah! i thought so! oh dear! -yes you , and do you wear do you wear sandals? +yes you , and do you wear do you wear sandals? no, i wear shoes. they're a bit cold when you're walking out on the streets. -erm are you, how old are you by the way? +erm are you, how old are you by the way? erm, i'm forty three. forty three. -do you live in a big house or what kind of house +do you live in a big house or what kind of house no. do you live in? i live in , i live in a three bedroom semi-detached house @@ -39611,23 +39579,23 @@ erm , two. two children? and they're with my wife. how old are they? -erm three and nine. +erm three and nine. girls? boys? erm, two girls. mhm. what sort of things do you do to help the homeless? -well basically erm, i go around in some of the streets and try and help people, families who have missed they've lost their chi , erm lost people and try and reunite them. +well basically erm, i go around in some of the streets and try and help people, families who have missed they've lost their chi , erm lost people and try and reunite them. what if they don't want to be reunited, can't that cause problems? yes it can. -i find some people on the streets are quite like, pigheaded and they don't really want to go back for some reason really. +i find some people on the streets are quite like, pigheaded and they don't really want to go back for some reason really. mm. but maybe they've got problems that they can't go back for? yeah, they have got problems and that's why erm, people like us come along and try and help them. have any of wha -the homeless people actually ever been taken into care, like foster and ah, adoption? -erm, yes quite a few times actually. +the homeless people actually ever been taken into care, like foster and ah, adoption? +erm, yes quite a few times actually. especially when abuse is inc be erm abuse. abuse. @@ -39641,11 +39609,11 @@ ah! very good! anyone else? i haven't been. -yes i'd to talk to her. +yes i'd to talk to her. you want to do it? i want hello! -to have a say ! +to have a say ! how am i? i'm alright thank you. is yo , what's your name? @@ -39656,7 +39624,7 @@ me? i don't do anything! haven't you got a job? no! -do you o , come from essex or something ? +do you o , come from essex or something ? yes! an essex girl! no! @@ -39669,7 +39637,7 @@ no i am not! or surrey. well, have you got anything to link with these homeless people? yes! -they accost me in the street every time i walk every time i walk down for money, they're +they accost me in the street every time i walk every time i walk down for money, they're do you e terrible! do you ever give them any money? @@ -39689,7 +39657,7 @@ well those people out on the streets tell me that all the time. i mean, have you seen the reports? of course i've seen the reports! i'm not blind! -well the majority of them are a , abused or get thrown out of mental centres, i mean, some of them just run away from home because they want to and that's only a minority, lots of them have +well the majority of them are a , abused or get thrown out of mental centres, i mean, some of them just run away from home because they want to and that's only a minority, lots of them have i mean very good reasons! well it's still not my problem is it? @@ -39709,11 +39677,11 @@ how old are they? and have any of them contemplated running away? well how do i know! i would ! -there's one's fourteen, one's sixteen, and one's nineteen. +there's one's fourteen, one's sixteen, and one's nineteen. are they all still living at home? yes. yeah. -well apart from the nineteen year he's gone to university. +well apart from the nineteen year he's gone to university. oh! which one may i ask? @@ -39723,7 +39691,7 @@ merit! well yeah sure! very hard to believe i think! -but if you go and look down in your statements now just to check that ! +but if you go and look down in your statements now just to check that ! go on , it's your turn now. i want to know how you actually do that. oh yes you did! @@ -39735,7 +39703,7 @@ go on, check your bank's homeless, okay? oh! you haven't done it! -you haven't +you haven't hello. what's your name? and where do you come from. @@ -39775,19 +39743,19 @@ okay. what's your name? sarah what? sarah smith. -and how long have you been homeless? +and how long have you been homeless? about six months. why are you homeless? -well i used to share a, share this flat with my mate and erm you know, she got a bit out of hand, she kept bringing all these people home and she kept having these parties and it was really difficult for me to study cos i used to go well i still try to go to college, but erm you know, it was really hard for me to study and made my life really, really difficult! +well i used to share a, share this flat with my mate and erm you know, she got a bit out of hand, she kept bringing all these people home and she kept having these parties and it was really difficult for me to study cos i used to go well i still try to go to college, but erm you know, it was really hard for me to study and made my life really, really difficult! isn't it more difficult now though, if you're homeless? ya. how do you get time to study? well, you know i, just doesn't really matter any more, the point is surviving. but i mean, when i was living with her we just had all these arguments cos, you know, i just never got any peace! -there are sometimes i could find this quiet little place somewhere and just think, you know, it's really nice. +there are sometimes i could find this quiet little place somewhere and just think, you know, it's really nice. but, what about your family? can't you go home? -well, i could do but i, you see, i haven't got the money to get home and you know +well, i could do but i, you see, i haven't got the money to get home and you know where do you live then? i live up in scotland somewhere. somewhere? @@ -39795,16 +39763,16 @@ oh great! that's very inverness? aberdeen? -no, some just erm +no, some just erm somewhere! do you beg? by loch lomond. do you beg? oh yeah! -well, sometimes, but you see you know, people aren't willing to give anymore. +well, sometimes, but you see you know, people aren't willing to give anymore. and there's so many homeless people that mm. -you know you try to +you know you try to do you blame them? well yes! of course i do! @@ -39815,15 +39783,15 @@ so you think that maybe a, a labour government wou , could solve all these probl no not really. god! i mean, no government could. -erm what can we ? +erm what can we ? it's got so out of hand , nobody could! what do you eat? -erm anything i can find really. +erm anything i can find really. marks and spencer's sandwich! ho how long is it since how long is it since you've had a cooked meal? and muller yoghurt. -erm i was lucky erm +erm i was lucky erm i like muller yoghurt! place on sunday and they gave me a meal. oh! @@ -39836,17 +39804,17 @@ no. so you're not religious at all? i don't know. i like crunchy one tha , that one. -i used to be, but you know it's nothing re +i used to be, but you know it's nothing re i haven't tried the crunchy one. i al , i u i find it difficult to believe in it any more after what's it done me, you know. cos i like the . i like the peach mainly. and it's really difficult to believe in things like that? -do you want me to done to you? +do you want me to done to you? yeah. we got one person now but -well you know feeling er +well you know feeling er ee ah! just one person. ya! @@ -39855,7 +39823,7 @@ yeah. you should, you should only have about one person yes. like that. -i've, you know, i feel i've trusted him all my life you know, an now i find myself in this situation. +i've, you know, i feel i've trusted him all my life you know, an now i find myself in this situation. it's difficult! thank you very much. now here we have another girl here. @@ -39881,7 +39849,7 @@ and what's your favourite male? no, what's your family situation? do you like danger mouse ? yes i love danger mouse! -mr . +mr . . what's your family situation? how do you mean? @@ -39894,7 +39862,7 @@ are you a yeah i'm, i have a policeman? yes, i'm living at home but i'm also married and i've been married three times before, and i've got six children now. -sounds like hundred! +sounds like hundred! except , half have them have gone away which is nice cos i didn't like them anyway! you don't seem to have a very caring attitude oh i see! @@ -39907,7 +39875,7 @@ so what happened? you left them? are you surprised that they run away? how many people i , in your, are there actually in your household at his moment in time? -is this including milk men or not ? +is this including milk men or not ? nine and a dog. where does the other nine gone? so there's you and your partner @@ -39943,7 +39911,7 @@ look! right. i told you i'm still living at home, right? yeah. -this is , my mother, my father, my sister my brother, me, my husband, one, two, three children. +this is , my mother, my father, my sister my brother, me, my husband, one, two, three children. oh really! and the dog! and the dog, yeah. @@ -39956,23 +39924,23 @@ what sort of dog? do yo a mongrel. right. -and do you get on very well with all of your family but, actually living there? +and do you get on very well with all of your family but, actually living there? not really, no. no. -can't you afford to find you know, your own house or rent a place? +can't you afford to find you know, your own house or rent a place? would you, if you had the chance well not really, no. find your children that had run away? probably not. it's their choice to run away. how old were they when they did run away? -mm one was seventeen, one was six, and -making the choice ! +mm one was seventeen, one was six, and +making the choice ! no. no. my hu , my six year old ran away, but yeah but when -then came back, and then ran away again +then came back, and then ran away again so, aren't you concerned him? he tried to go out the door but she reached him back, but she hasn't aren't you concerned about how he's living? @@ -39986,210 +39954,210 @@ he might even be dead for all you know! that's sweet! don't you care? well -aren't you a bit, the slightest worried +aren't you a bit, the slightest worried why you're not concerned? why did you have children then if you weren't prepared to yeah. look after them suitably? -erm my religion forbid the use of contraception. +erm my religion forbid the use of contraception. could we ya. have that off. yeah. i think everybody now, anorexia is much written and talked about, but perhaps not accurately, how would you define anorexia? -i would say that the criteria that's that's sent out at the moment is is far too strict for the lot, a lot of women and at the moment you're expected to be skeletal, whereas th , you can very well be thirteen stone and anorexic it's, it depends on your attitude towards food. +i would say that the criteria that's that's sent out at the moment is is far too strict for the lot, a lot of women and at the moment you're expected to be skeletal, whereas th , you can very well be thirteen stone and anorexic it's, it depends on your attitude towards food. we have to find criteria for anorexia mhm. -nervosa which essentially means, er loss of body weight or fifteen percent your normal preoccupation with weight, and loss of your periods for three months and a morbid fear of gaining weight. +nervosa which essentially means, er loss of body weight or fifteen percent your normal preoccupation with weight, and loss of your periods for three months and a morbid fear of gaining weight. and, why, you may argue that those criteria are too strict, those are criteria that are used in a medical sense. -well perhaps while we're doing it all, we're talking about anorexia, we should talk about the er, the associated erm, disorder, bulimia, which is only recently become something that people are generally aware of. +well perhaps while we're doing it all, we're talking about anorexia, we should talk about the er, the associated erm, disorder, bulimia, which is only recently become something that people are generally aware of. wo wo would you like to offer er, a definition of of of bulimia as well? well bulimia nervosa is a disorder of binging. er, these binges take places regularly and they may amount to between three to five thousand calories in one binge. what does that mean, three to five thousand calories? i mean er -a normal day you might eat two, three and a half thousand calories so within one short period of eating you would take in maybe double that. -er, associated with that are certain behaviours, typically vomiting, laxative abuse, erm, use of diuretics which are water tablets or excessive exercising. +a normal day you might eat two, three and a half thousand calories so within one short period of eating you would take in maybe double that. +er, associated with that are certain behaviours, typically vomiting, laxative abuse, erm, use of diuretics which are water tablets or excessive exercising. again, there are very many over-valued ideas about weight and what that means to the individual and a pre-occupation with weight. -i believe that the root cause of anorexia and people who binge and in fact, they are failed anorexics really! -there's, there's,th the the aim is the same, the aim is not to not to gain weight er and the control has been lost when th when it's necessary to binge. -but, i believe that the root cause of ano , is is a is a deep-seated unhappiness in the individual. +i believe that the root cause of anorexia and people who binge and in fact, they are failed anorexics really! +there's, there's,th the the aim is the same, the aim is not to not to gain weight er and the control has been lost when th when it's necessary to binge. +but, i believe that the root cause of ano , is is a is a deep-seated unhappiness in the individual. mhm. erm, i would agree that erm, what you saying about the anorexic thing and the fact that's it's a sort of deep-seated unhappiness, but i think that's far too general. -you know, i think that erm, this idea of anorexics being, erm sorry, bulimics being failed anorexics is, a wee bit kind of unfair! -erm, i think the sort of emotional erm sort of like characteristics of both eating disorders are very, very similar. +you know, i think that erm, this idea of anorexics being, erm sorry, bulimics being failed anorexics is, a wee bit kind of unfair! +erm, i think the sort of emotional erm sort of like characteristics of both eating disorders are very, very similar. but i think the reasons why bulimics need to binge, erm is completely different from what than, erm -an emotion that an anorexic could be suffering from. -it's er more to do with the feeling of, it's like filling gaps erm +an emotion that an anorexic could be suffering from. +it's er more to do with the feeling of, it's like filling gaps erm yep. -erm, emotional gaps , boredom,go you know, just a whole sort of like range of various emotions. -erm, where possibly like the, the anorexic, well i don't know cos i'm not speaking from an anorexic point of view, but i think the, the point we're saying, emotions are there but they're dealt with in a, a different way, you know they perhaps starve themselves erm, to sort of like, erm you know ge , get across these emotions, to deal with these emotions. +erm, emotional gaps , boredom,go you know, just a whole sort of like range of various emotions. +erm, where possibly like the, the anorexic, well i don't know cos i'm not speaking from an anorexic point of view, but i think the, the point we're saying, emotions are there but they're dealt with in a, a different way, you know they perhaps starve themselves erm, to sort of like, erm you know ge , get across these emotions, to deal with these emotions. mhm. yes? and one of the differences that anorexia can become much more visible and identifiable, whereas those of us who have experienced bulimia, which i had for thirteen years, can be extremely secret and well disguised because we normally don't change from normal body weight. what's the difference between bulimia and compulsive eating? is there a difference. well, in the definition that we heard, it tends to be associated with, with trying to rid your body of the food that you've consumed during a binge. -compulsive eating normally doesn't go to that extent. -how did you stop bu bu bulimia, i mean it was +compulsive eating normally doesn't go to that extent. +how did you stop bu bu bulimia, i mean it was in the end it was the thirteen years of binging i mean yeah. wha what effect does that have on you? -erm, it it, it makes it very, very difficult to imagine how you'll recover erm, but in the end it's a personal decision to, to try to achieve self respect, to care for yourself better, to adopt good habits of nutrition and exercise, not dieting, cos diets are the biggest con trick of all and certainly, to rid your life of people who don't respect and accept you the way you are. +erm, it it, it makes it very, very difficult to imagine how you'll recover erm, but in the end it's a personal decision to, to try to achieve self respect, to care for yourself better, to adopt good habits of nutrition and exercise, not dieting, cos diets are the biggest con trick of all and certainly, to rid your life of people who don't respect and accept you the way you are. can you identify why you began doing it? -i mean, how old were you when you started er binging? +i mean, how old were you when you started er binging? fifteen. yes. fifteen? -i was certainly to do with feeling that i would have to be a little bit slimmer, that i would have to be acceptable to other people, that i would have to change my shape and at the same time, i could not resist consuming large amounts of food. +i was certainly to do with feeling that i would have to be a little bit slimmer, that i would have to be acceptable to other people, that i would have to change my shape and at the same time, i could not resist consuming large amounts of food. now, fifteen seems terribly young that's right. for a girl to start, to start worrying about that kind of thing! is is that a societal pressure? -i mean is it a ah,th wi , is there any history of it in the family an and, what did your family, did you family know? +i mean is it a ah,th wi , is there any history of it in the family an and, what did your family, did you family know? families don't generally know. -and it, it wasn't until many years later that i told anyone at all that's, that's the thing i was saying about bulimia, it's very secret. +and it, it wasn't until many years later that i told anyone at all that's, that's the thing i was saying about bulimia, it's very secret. and in the end, did you, i mean wha , did you get the support of of professionals or or yes. erm, but in the end th o only one had any impact and in general,see seeing a female professional was, i have to say, a lot more helpful than seeing male professionals. mm. yes? -er, my experience is slightly different when erm when i had been trying to sort of recover, i didn't, i didn't feel as if i've get any help from professionals that i approached. -and in fact, i get an awful lot of support from friends erm, not family because my family aren't, weren't aware of it, erm but i mean, really it came from fre , really close friends that i could sit down and talk to and that could understand me and accept me, just like what the girl said as well. +er, my experience is slightly different when erm when i had been trying to sort of recover, i didn't, i didn't feel as if i've get any help from professionals that i approached. +and in fact, i get an awful lot of support from friends erm, not family because my family aren't, weren't aware of it, erm but i mean, really it came from fre , really close friends that i could sit down and talk to and that could understand me and accept me, just like what the girl said as well. mm mm. yes? -i think my g p actually sent me further down hill into anorexia after i'd lost about, about when i was seven stone i went to see her, i'd never seen her before and she said well you look perfectly acc , sociably acceptable to me so i went on to lose two more stone before going back to see her and was admitted to hospital as a medical emergency! -and, did continue to get professional help after that, but i think she was actually one of the factors that sent me further down, by telling me i looked well! +i think my g p actually sent me further down hill into anorexia after i'd lost about, about when i was seven stone i went to see her, i'd never seen her before and she said well you look perfectly acc , sociably acceptable to me so i went on to lose two more stone before going back to see her and was admitted to hospital as a medical emergency! +and, did continue to get professional help after that, but i think she was actually one of the factors that sent me further down, by telling me i looked well! what age were you then? twenty. yeah. and can you identify why yo wa was, are yo are you now over it? are you -yeah i would class myself as a recovered anorexic, but as recovered as i'll ever be! +yeah i would class myself as a recovered anorexic, but as recovered as i'll ever be! i don't think i'll ever totally get over it. i've still got a very distorted body image that i have to live with. i think i'm fat! the reality of anorexia for you was what, just not eating at all? cutting down on food, i was university missing whole meals, telling people i was training, i'm a p e teacher so sport and the perfect body was very much up front, so the more weight i lost the better i was told i looked until it became totally out of control and i was eating an apple and black coffee a day and then vomiting so that i had nothing in me. -erm my metabolism was out the window. +erm my metabolism was out the window. now, as a p e teacher you're working what, boys and girls? yes. -do you see ah,th the pe , the boys and girls or the, the young people that you're working with erm, having the same veering towards the same kind of thing, i mean, do you see pressures on on girls, towards achieving that perfect body in the way that you felt it yourself at one time. +do you see ah,th the pe , the boys and girls or the, the young people that you're working with erm, having the same veering towards the same kind of thing, i mean, do you see pressures on on girls, towards achieving that perfect body in the way that you felt it yourself at one time. i see boys calling the girls fat and it makes my hair stand on end! -erm it goes on continually and these poor girls are oh you're fat! +erm it goes on continually and these poor girls are oh you're fat! you've got a great big bottom! and they're not, they don't have, they're normal. i wonder what you think of what you're hearing? yes? i just wondered how much actual help professionals are? -i mean, is is there really enough help given? +i mean, is is there really enough help given? i mean, we talk about eating disorders yeah. -but do they really actually dig into the the real reasons for the eating disorders or they just try and get you back onto a stable diet? +but do they really actually dig into the the real reasons for the eating disorders or they just try and get you back onto a stable diet? yes? i think what put me off in th and certainly em embedded was some of the comments as around control of our lives. mhm. -and maybe hope that we as, as people as women need to do is regain control of our lives so they, they belong to us, so it doesn't matter if if boys say we've got fat bottoms or not,yo you say my bottom's alright an and you live with that. +and maybe hope that we as, as people as women need to do is regain control of our lives so they, they belong to us, so it doesn't matter if if boys say we've got fat bottoms or not,yo you say my bottom's alright an and you live with that. i'd be interested to know the lady who mentioned that, er she got help from friends, what sort of help did she get from her friends? -i mean, how can you help someone with a a problem like this? +i mean, how can you help someone with a a problem like this? how best can you help someone with a problem like this? it was really, really difficult! -erm, she started really by, well th well there is two of them involved at the time, but they started by reading a book on the subject and really just talking to me about it certainly, because i mean they really didn't understand, you know because food to them is just food, you know it was just some meal they had to eat because they were hungry and they couldn't understand why i had got this whole thing completely distorted. -erm there was a, i mean there was a lot of friction, i mean, i mean i'm really lucky to have the strength of a friendship that i did because you know, if, i wouldn't have got, you know where i am, sort of without it, i think. +erm, she started really by, well th well there is two of them involved at the time, but they started by reading a book on the subject and really just talking to me about it certainly, because i mean they really didn't understand, you know because food to them is just food, you know it was just some meal they had to eat because they were hungry and they couldn't understand why i had got this whole thing completely distorted. +erm there was a, i mean there was a lot of friction, i mean, i mean i'm really lucky to have the strength of a friendship that i did because you know, if, i wouldn't have got, you know where i am, sort of without it, i think. aye, so you related to that more than you would rela , related to a professional, a doctor or someone erm, when i first approached trying to help you? -doctors they started putting me on anti-depressants, tranquilizers, sleeping pills erm, and you know, they were, their whole manner was just absolutely terrible! +doctors they started putting me on anti-depressants, tranquilizers, sleeping pills erm, and you know, they were, their whole manner was just absolutely terrible! i mean, i felt that, it made me worse as well, by going to them and i decided that i would never go back to them again, you know. that's quite interesting! is it a , yes there? -can i just sort of say i'm i'm somebody working on a team er, that deals with eating disorders. +can i just sort of say i'm i'm somebody working on a team er, that deals with eating disorders. i think things have changed quite dramatically in the last few years certainly, we admit very few people and we see them mostly as an outpatient. -i think it actually depends where you go to to seek help and who your first erm person that you go to +i think it actually depends where you go to to seek help and who your first erm person that you go to mhm. -i mean there is a, i don't know if anybody saw there was a a programme on, it was actually b b c, erm, this week, it was about somebody who felt that she was very overweight and actually had her stomach stapled! +i mean there is a, i don't know if anybody saw there was a a programme on, it was actually b b c, erm, this week, it was about somebody who felt that she was very overweight and actually had her stomach stapled! and i mean, i find that really horrendous! i think your g p is maybe one of the first places to go but the trouble, i think, with people with eating problems is it's very hard to explain what the problem is. mhm. -and i think that's what a lot of problem with condemned by the g p is is they're not able to articulate the unhappiness that's coming from the eating disorder, so they're told to go away and put on a couple of pounds and because they haven't expressed that feeling the g p can't or isn't thinking enough to try and and poke into it a little bit more. +and i think that's what a lot of problem with condemned by the g p is is they're not able to articulate the unhappiness that's coming from the eating disorder, so they're told to go away and put on a couple of pounds and because they haven't expressed that feeling the g p can't or isn't thinking enough to try and and poke into it a little bit more. so what would be better? -i think, one of the most important things is finding a trusting friend or a member of family so that you can then try express some of the feelings so that you're in a better position erm, to try and explain the problem. +i think, one of the most important things is finding a trusting friend or a member of family so that you can then try express some of the feelings so that you're in a better position erm, to try and explain the problem. one of the great difficulties is that many young people find it extremely difficult to admit that they have a problem. -and in fact, even with as many professionals as one would wish it's often extremely difficult to actually engage people in treatment erm, and the whole process of getting people into treatment or into health can be very difficult, both for the young person and for the therapist or helper involved. +and in fact, even with as many professionals as one would wish it's often extremely difficult to actually engage people in treatment erm, and the whole process of getting people into treatment or into health can be very difficult, both for the young person and for the therapist or helper involved. i don't want to give the impression that professionals are unhelpful at all. -i mean carole said earlier, it's a question of eventually making your mind up that you want to do something about it, but then professionals are maybe there to assist. -what you've described must be something that erm that that families of people who are suffering from eating disorders must feel very much, that there's nothing that they can do to, to to help. -families feel very rejected by professionals erm, in my research i've found that er, the families of younger sufferers tend to be involved in treatment but they feel very much that they're under the microscope, that they disapprove, that they're seen as being pathological families. -with older sufferers, erm, usually families are excluded from treatment, they're kept out, they're told that they're daughter erm must be seen on her own and they feel very helpless and very unloved and unsupported by by the professionals. +i mean carole said earlier, it's a question of eventually making your mind up that you want to do something about it, but then professionals are maybe there to assist. +what you've described must be something that erm that that families of people who are suffering from eating disorders must feel very much, that there's nothing that they can do to, to to help. +families feel very rejected by professionals erm, in my research i've found that er, the families of younger sufferers tend to be involved in treatment but they feel very much that they're under the microscope, that they disapprove, that they're seen as being pathological families. +with older sufferers, erm, usually families are excluded from treatment, they're kept out, they're told that they're daughter erm must be seen on her own and they feel very helpless and very unloved and unsupported by by the professionals. mm. erm, in fact, i've found that the families are no different from any other families, there's no typical anorexic family. -i think erm yo e you know you asked about the support and i think having identified that there was a gap in the support in +i think erm yo e you know you asked about the support and i think having identified that there was a gap in the support in mhm. -times of i mean, i actually think it's a an awful lot of ask of a friendship, or of a family situation and also, indeed, if you i mean i think sometimes they can be very supportive but th the true understanding may not be there and erm i think that's what led me to start up a self- help group in edinburgh erm which is, has been erm running for the last two years now. -and, i think that level of real understanding that you do get from fellow sufferers, and indeed, it's a su , it's a support for erm families as well who are able to come along and, and share that kind of support. +times of i mean, i actually think it's a an awful lot of ask of a friendship, or of a family situation and also, indeed, if you i mean i think sometimes they can be very supportive but th the true understanding may not be there and erm i think that's what led me to start up a self- help group in edinburgh erm which is, has been erm running for the last two years now. +and, i think that level of real understanding that you do get from fellow sufferers, and indeed, it's a su , it's a support for erm families as well who are able to come along and, and share that kind of support. mhm. -after my own experiences i wo i wouldn't advice someone not to go to their g p, but firstly, i would advice them to contact the eating disorders association er, because they are very helpful and they're more supportive than any g p i've ever come across. +after my own experiences i wo i wouldn't advice someone not to go to their g p, but firstly, i would advice them to contact the eating disorders association er, because they are very helpful and they're more supportive than any g p i've ever come across. okay. yes? you mentioned er, earlier about yo , the fact that you were surprised that it was fifteen year olds, and that was quite young yeah. -and yet, in fact, that's the time when you're most vulnerable yo , it's time of puberty, your +and yet, in fact, that's the time when you're most vulnerable yo , it's time of puberty, your mhm. -interested in fashion, your interested in the opposite sex and th the ages between fifteen and eighteen teenagers ar , tend to be faddy, if it's not er, their body shape th th , it's vegetari , vegetarianism. -i think there's a third fact that you touched on earlier that i think it's just worth mentioning and that is that we know it's also a genetic pre-disposition to anorexia nervosa, in other words, we know that in certain families it is a disorder that will run from one generation to another. +interested in fashion, your interested in the opposite sex and th the ages between fifteen and eighteen teenagers ar , tend to be faddy, if it's not er, their body shape th th , it's vegetari , vegetarianism. +i think there's a third fact that you touched on earlier that i think it's just worth mentioning and that is that we know it's also a genetic pre-disposition to anorexia nervosa, in other words, we know that in certain families it is a disorder that will run from one generation to another. na , yes? erm, i'd consider myself to have an eating disorder but i don't have anorexia or bulimia. -and er, i first started feeling i was overweight when i fourteen and i was, i was twelve stone and i went to the doctor and got black capsules to take which had me as high as a kite for a long time! -and then there were the the dose was reduced and then i had to come off them altogether and after twenty nine years of dieting unsuccessfully i gave up dieting and i haven't put on any weight since i gave up dieting! +and er, i first started feeling i was overweight when i fourteen and i was, i was twelve stone and i went to the doctor and got black capsules to take which had me as high as a kite for a long time! +and then there were the the dose was reduced and then i had to come off them altogether and after twenty nine years of dieting unsuccessfully i gave up dieting and i haven't put on any weight since i gave up dieting! and, and what sto , why did you stop? -erm, a friend started a a self-help group which i went to. +erm, a friend started a a self-help group which i went to. and i realised, well i had realised for a long time that dieting wasn't the answer for me. and erm oh so, over twenty nine years you're saying that food was controlling your life, in a way? oh yes! very much so! i mean that was , that was the dominant thing, was wha what you -i could have told you every single item of food i had in the cupboard every, down to the last bean! +i could have told you every single item of food i had in the cupboard every, down to the last bean! and now i don't know. i have sweets lying on the counter, i don't have to take them if i don't want to. i'm not controlled by food any more, and i don't feel guilty any more. i think the lady who said earlier when you go to your g p you can't express yourself mm. -i went to my g p, having avoided her for fifteen years, having getting the old story every time you went well you must go on a diet! -i had been on diets and to put it in context, over twenty years i've lost a hundred and twenty stone! +i went to my g p, having avoided her for fifteen years, having getting the old story every time you went well you must go on a diet! +i had been on diets and to put it in context, over twenty years i've lost a hundred and twenty stone! which if you break it down is only about a pound and three quarters a week and i think a lot of people are like that. -but, when you look at it in that context it becomes very much erm, part of your life, and it takes an awful lot to break that habit and there's no help. +but, when you look at it in that context it becomes very much erm, part of your life, and it takes an awful lot to break that habit and there's no help. up there. i think it's very easy to fall into the trap of feeling guilty. mm. -erm, i went on a diet last year, to one of these clubs and, within record time got to the weight i was supposed to be, calorie counting and then i had to come off and i found for weeks after feelings of terrible guilt if i ate +erm, i went on a diet last year, to one of these clubs and, within record time got to the weight i was supposed to be, calorie counting and then i had to come off and i found for weeks after feelings of terrible guilt if i ate mm. a chocolate biscuit! i was mentally calorie counting every time, it took me ages to get back to a sort of normal life. -can you identify th that the point at which worrying about food, we've all agreed we shouldn't be, but there it is we do, er pitches you into eating disorder and er i know ca , is is there preventive action to be taken apart from changing society completely? +can you identify th that the point at which worrying about food, we've all agreed we shouldn't be, but there it is we do, er pitches you into eating disorder and er i know ca , is is there preventive action to be taken apart from changing society completely? yes? -i think it's when you become inappropriately absorbed around the areas of food i think, too, because i work with teenagers +i think it's when you become inappropriately absorbed around the areas of food i think, too, because i work with teenagers mm. -that early intervention is the best way of coping with it, and certainly it demands that parents and friends and teachers, and people concerned are aware of any change which is sustained over a period because by early intervention then you're probably coping with the problem rather than the eating disorder, because the problem is there before the eating disorder. +that early intervention is the best way of coping with it, and certainly it demands that parents and friends and teachers, and people concerned are aware of any change which is sustained over a period because by early intervention then you're probably coping with the problem rather than the eating disorder, because the problem is there before the eating disorder. erm, can intervention, as you call it, be effective do you think? very! -if it's early, before the pattern's really entrenched. +if it's early, before the pattern's really entrenched. yes? -i think it's wrong to underestimate erm i i it's particularly initially, how, how positively reinforced it can, it can be around you erm, just this the idea of losing weight and that er you know, people will be wha , for whatever reasons are, either envious or they want to know how you can do it, they want to know, and particularly if it's linked with exercise then it's all very good things to do and you know, the media's telling you and a , everyone's telling that this healthy lifestyle that actually then goes out of control through being so controlled erm e e , there's a, well there's a thin line between it, being a very positive experience, and you're suddenly buying smaller jeans and erm you know, it's just everything is is feeding, if that's the right word, this idea that it, that that it's tremendous to be +i think it's wrong to underestimate erm i i it's particularly initially, how, how positively reinforced it can, it can be around you erm, just this the idea of losing weight and that er you know, people will be wha , for whatever reasons are, either envious or they want to know how you can do it, they want to know, and particularly if it's linked with exercise then it's all very good things to do and you know, the media's telling you and a , everyone's telling that this healthy lifestyle that actually then goes out of control through being so controlled erm e e , there's a, well there's a thin line between it, being a very positive experience, and you're suddenly buying smaller jeans and erm you know, it's just everything is is feeding, if that's the right word, this idea that it, that that it's tremendous to be mm. losing weight, to realising that you can't do anything about it. i think the advice i would give any mother of an anorexic is to tell them how awful they look! -i wish i'd been told early on what i looked like and what i was doing to my body. -nobody wanted to be cruel enough to hurt me because they thought i was so vulnerable at that time and i really wish i'd been told that i looked disgusting! +i wish i'd been told early on what i looked like and what i was doing to my body. +nobody wanted to be cruel enough to hurt me because they thought i was so vulnerable at that time and i really wish i'd been told that i looked disgusting! but at another level, if we could show love, respect and acceptance for each other in the magnificent diversity that that we show as women, instead of patronising and attacking each other on the basis of our body shapes, that would be a great step forward! hooray! yes? i'd like, i'd just say that i the the are professionals now that do know more about eating disorders and i do think there are clinics being set up. -erm, we do know quite a lot about erm, why it is that when you diet you start to think about food all the time, and why it is that certain things happen, and i think that there's more and more information and knowledge being gathered and yes, the na , the desire to change has to come from the individual but perhaps, having clinics available where people can go when they're ready to change or where they can get help. +erm, we do know quite a lot about erm, why it is that when you diet you start to think about food all the time, and why it is that certain things happen, and i think that there's more and more information and knowledge being gathered and yes, the na , the desire to change has to come from the individual but perhaps, having clinics available where people can go when they're ready to change or where they can get help. i think very often you do need professional help and it isn't possible to do it with family and friends because of the interaction that actually makes it worse. so there's a practical suggestion and i, i like, i like carole's philosophical suggestion that we could start celebrating the diversity of human kind. i mean, that's the kind of thing one often hears on this programme, is it wishful thinking or d'you think we could actually achieve it? @@ -40198,13 +40166,13 @@ wahey! yes? i think the media have an awful lot to answer for! yeah. -i run one of the self-help groups that one of the ladies mentioned and we looked at an outsize catalogue recently and it went up to size twenty six and in some cases up to a size thirty and the ladies who modelled the clothes were no bigger than a twelve, possibly a fourteen, but a very shapely fourteen! +i run one of the self-help groups that one of the ladies mentioned and we looked at an outsize catalogue recently and it went up to size twenty six and in some cases up to a size thirty and the ladies who modelled the clothes were no bigger than a twelve, possibly a fourteen, but a very shapely fourteen! mm. mm. so the media, even when anything you do depends on your size,yo your image is all for a woman, your brain or your ability really comes way down the line! -you have to look good first before anyone listens to your other abilities! +you have to look good first before anyone listens to your other abilities! but looking big and good are not incompatible are they? -i was just gonna say, i i think we should possibly stop blaming the media or whatever actually happens and perhaps echo what the the lady earlier said, i think that it's in our hands, we're the women that could make this happen ! +i was just gonna say, i i think we should possibly stop blaming the media or whatever actually happens and perhaps echo what the the lady earlier said, i think that it's in our hands, we're the women that could make this happen ! yes? well i i was just si oh sorry! @@ -40213,22 +40181,21 @@ one at a time!! i was just sitting here wondering why men don't have this image problem? because there are an awful lot of overweight men and i don't see any problem with them at all! they don't seem to have any problems between each other either! -i'm quite concerned that my four year old daughter is after a sindy doll and wondering whether perhaps sindy dolls shouldn't be produced in erm such diverse figures as real life? +i'm quite concerned that my four year old daughter is after a sindy doll and wondering whether perhaps sindy dolls shouldn't be produced in erm such diverse figures as real life? well there's an are we, are we providing an interesting idea! -our future generation with women with an ideological figure such as sindy. +our future generation with women with an ideological figure such as sindy. a lot of ideas and certainly worth talking about it. it's something i hope we'll talk about again. i hope you've learnt something and i know that i have! thanks very much for joining us. - erm a farmer bought a new tractor yesterday a farmer bought a new tractor yesterday, good, right can you read the next four out, er trevor bother, winner, winter,dr driver that's okay the river was very cold -the river was very cold, right, can you do the next one four charlie +the river was very cold, right, can you do the next one four charlie never, number the blazer was very warm the blazer was very warm, right, yeah, erm @@ -40240,20 +40207,20 @@ the helicopter was very big, good, so you've all had a chance to use one set. can we have a look at the ones underneath, in the orange block and will you do the first one heather? the bomber opens the gates to attract the driver good and the next one, charlie -when spinning its web a spider makes a clever pattern +when spinning its web a spider makes a clever pattern good my brother does a paper round and delivers a hundred newspapers every morning good a -crossing the road always remembers stop and +crossing the road always remembers stop and go on ca camels in, in a desert yes without water, right, edward -in the modern +in the modern hold on travelled by helicopter -excellent so you've already got percentages sorted out there, can we just look at the next block of words, and hello, hello, right, no, yeah well i, yes i i think it all went great, unfortunately erm, so i really can't really consider on, on that. -but that details of that actually has a but i don't think it's a total story okay so i'll, i'll put it all down on, on paper and then we'll take it from there, okay, thanks, bye . +excellent so you've already got percentages sorted out there, can we just look at the next block of words, and hello, hello, right, no, yeah well i, yes i i think it all went great, unfortunately erm, so i really can't really consider on, on that. +but that details of that actually has a but i don't think it's a total story okay so i'll, i'll put it all down on, on paper and then we'll take it from there, okay, thanks, bye . right, sorry about that, so shall we start this time with charlie, first four charlie, what's it say? what's a r e saying there? there @@ -40273,7 +40240,7 @@ what's that bear it any longer that's right b e a r that's right same as the animal it's also the animal so that you're actually left with three er words that sound the same, two of which are spelt differently and the third which is the name of an animal, okay. -they did, do then, put a pencil to there, mm you've already done it haven't it +they did, do then, put a pencil to there, mm you've already done it haven't it there was lots of bare people on the beach oh dear me, there are lots of bare people on the beach, right, what about fare, what are you going to do about that? what sort of fare is that? @@ -40283,15 +40250,15 @@ oh, oh yeah how do you spell , how do you spell fair for fair haired? f a i r f a i r yes and this one is f a r e -no that's spelt the other way f a i r anyone help him? +no that's spelt the other way f a i r anyone help him? f a r e what does it mean? is it, it was a fair idea no that's the same as erm was it like erm you gave me a fair amount of no, that's the same thing, you're going on a journey -no oh you are slow, come on you're going on a journey, not in a car +no oh you are slow, come on you're going on a journey, not in a car fairly long time -ah, no +ah, no journey journey, we're going to travel, right no, you're getting warm, no, no @@ -40396,11 +40363,11 @@ yes absolutely luggage luggage erm, i had to have my luggage checked at the airport -i had to have my luggage checked at the airport, you see what's happened to the end of that word, look at it right, you've got age at the end because what rule is working there? +i had to have my luggage checked at the airport, you see what's happened to the end of that word, look at it right, you've got age at the end because what rule is working there? got a double g pardon? got a double g -no have a look, you're only looking at the beginning of it here try again +no have a look, you're only looking at the beginning of it here try again it's got the e on the end and what sort of e is that? not the magic, magic e @@ -40441,7 +40408,7 @@ why couldn't you actually have j u g, one g, l e? why couldn't you have the spelling j u g l e? something would happen to the l something would happen not to the l but to the vowel. -hello i'm terribly busy norma actually, i've got a full lesson at the minute, erm, i'll, i'll try and, and sort that out as soon as i've finished this lesson +hello i'm terribly busy norma actually, i've got a full lesson at the minute, erm, i'll, i'll try and, and sort that out as soon as i've finished this lesson okay, thanks for telling me norma thank you, bye . jugle @@ -40452,7 +40419,7 @@ i had a struggle getting the ball out of the scrum well done, i, very good, i had a struggle getting the ball out of the scrum, right wriggle wriggle -erm i had to wriggle out of the scrum +erm i had to wriggle out of the scrum i had to wriggle out of the scrum, right, good farewell, is that farewell i have to say farewell to my @@ -40479,16 +40446,15 @@ yes, that's what you're going to do today well that's perfectly alright. i've tried to make them a little bit longer. - any plans? -well i, obviously want to try and attend meetings if and when possible, er i've been to one last week, which basically was er because i don't feel i'm qualified to get up and david got up and spoke very well actually, he was always, at the police not neighbourhood watch, er to do with the cascade telephone system which we found out afterwards, after a three quarters hour debate a man came up to dave afterwards and showed him a memo which said this cascade system has now ceased in november nineteen ninety-two and that was the the abuse on that particular meeting. +well i, obviously want to try and attend meetings if and when possible, er i've been to one last week, which basically was er because i don't feel i'm qualified to get up and david got up and spoke very well actually, he was always, at the police not neighbourhood watch, er to do with the cascade telephone system which we found out afterwards, after a three quarters hour debate a man came up to dave afterwards and showed him a memo which said this cascade system has now ceased in november nineteen ninety-two and that was the the abuse on that particular meeting. i do intend to er to attend inaugural meetings with each of the c p o s er with a view to looking i mean obviously at some stages you said to me that i would probably have to attend at short notice mm probably by going to these meetings i can pick up the be best practice for ideas which can be passed on to the others if anybody hears of any neighbourhood watch group meetings, i think make sure paul knows about it so he can attend where possible yeah -like him to go and look at the one at er the at er which seems to be a successful one -well i went to the last week and i did say that i'd like to go to that one, i'll go to as many as i can +like him to go and look at the one at er the at er which seems to be a successful one +well i went to the last week and i did say that i'd like to go to that one, i'll go to as many as i can yeah what i would like and i'm sure it happens with the previous c p o er and i have been notified by telephone and i keep saying to them let me know, but i would like probably a memo from each c p o to say that there is a meeting on this particular night. do you mean inaugural meetings @@ -40510,7 +40476,7 @@ er we just kept them on and there's i know quite a few schemes have stopped work probably now we started it might be well worth while g getting rid of some of these schemes that aren't operating are you saying then that when one's lapsed for six months or over a given period of time we should actually go out there and remove the signs yeah -well that's one of my next questions because i think it's debatable either way, a a lot of people and i'm finding this just want to be in a neighbourhood watch scheme to take advantage of insurance er and also to have the sign up once the signs are up and they got insurance they're not bothered, and you can tell that by the er gist of the conversation on the telephone. +well that's one of my next questions because i think it's debatable either way, a a lot of people and i'm finding this just want to be in a neighbourhood watch scheme to take advantage of insurance er and also to have the sign up once the signs are up and they got insurance they're not bothered, and you can tell that by the er gist of the conversation on the telephone. the other the other thing is i've discussed this with c p os as regards the signs, if a scheme folds then we take the sign down, there are arguments for and against, no no say yeh or nay at the moment @@ -40520,7 +40486,7 @@ deterrent towards crime prevention on the other hand it might make some people realise that if they're no longer a scheme then they don't get the er the yeah once a co-ordinator's retired or resigned who do you actually communicate with to find out if the group wants to continue playing -well it should be in the file and i asked for this and keep it before me when a scheme is set up, a we have a map which i must have sent out letters, +well it should be in the file and i asked for this and keep it before me when a scheme is set up, a we have a map which i must have sent out letters, em i've received very few replies so the signs can be erected and b either a deputy co-ordinator or the deputies that should come in, now some some oblige a lot of them don't right well let's find one or two of these schemes that appear to have lapsed, send some letters to the names in the file, if we don't get any positive response within a couple of months, let's go and take the signs down er and then wait for the squeals @@ -40543,7 +40509,7 @@ i think so for their information i intend o go through all the files in due course, i mean it's well -it its a big task, em er the thing is that i think that that the first point of call is one is that we get the questionnaire out and see whether you know the one where can we can the questionnaires to all the neighbourhood watch is it,w w we prepare the questionnaire and we get on and send it out, right. +it its a big task, em er the thing is that i think that that the first point of call is one is that we get the questionnaire out and see whether you know the one where can we can the questionnaires to all the neighbourhood watch is it,w w we prepare the questionnaire and we get on and send it out, right. depending on the replies from them in relation to those that have lapsed we then send a second letter to them saying is there anybody that will take over the scheme, if not, right we we intend to remove the signs from the er from the area and then if there is no reply to this letter within fourteen days we you know we'll come and remove the signs. i think there's a lot of them that trawl will bring out a couple of dozen schemes that have totally lapsed, and people will write snotty letters saying i've told you this once before. @@ -40553,14 +40519,14 @@ and and remove the signs and any claim and and please inform your insurance companies, and depending on the area we'll give a photocopy of the map and derek will fetch 'em in, derek can take them down. -who'll doing +who'll doing no we have that many er applications i mean i've just gone through a division and i've got er a pile of cards literally an inch thick with people a made an initial inquiry or b they've been furnished with questionnaires and not been returned, so i'm sending those er right through the divisions mm that's the task of the moment, in between the everyday work. mm, yeah then of course there's this insurance thing to do as well when david's er free and sorted out -yeah well it's a lot of that +yeah well it's a lot of that yeah, at least we'll end up with a scheme that's up-to-date and accurate yeah well we could also from that by photocopying the er the addresses erm and sending these letters out we might well get updated on the schemes anyway @@ -40576,11 +40542,11 @@ i still think we have to have the system as such, perhaps not so intricate, but we might, cos you won't be able to put maps and things on them eh but certainly the main co-ordinators er -almost like the burglar alarm you just have scheme, head co-ordinators, you know deputy co-ordinator, number of 'ouses and that just a basic so you go in +almost like the burglar alarm you just have scheme, head co-ordinators, you know deputy co-ordinator, number of 'ouses and that just a basic so you go in we we don't want really is street co-ordinators because no that'd be a mammoth task -if you have somebody like somewhere like that +if you have somebody like somewhere like that i'm not talking about that, i'm now talking about tollerton but it's eight hundred properties, it's a small village but there are twenty seven street co-ordinators, so you know erm yeah so say all you need is just access to that field so if they do change you can just at the moment you do i take it you're recording people who sort of ring up say i'm interested you send out a package to them you record them @@ -40595,16 +40561,16 @@ think about it, but i mean you don't start a file at that stage do you? no just a card in er a pending tray and that's it so you know who they are, yeah -er a sheet of paper for tracy to get the initial erm out and then they just go through the system +er a sheet of paper for tracy to get the initial erm out and then they just go through the system and you also get sometimes two people off the same street well that's it -it's just a reference they want you mr smith two doors away +it's just a reference they want you mr smith two doors away well i've had one for basingfield or basingfield oh i spoke to her, yeah yeah, i've had three applications all for the it's only a small village albeit it's spread and that's a you know for the er village -well have you spoken to sergeant to alleviate all the paperwork, and +well have you spoken to sergeant to alleviate all the paperwork, and yeah yeah and incur any additional expense three three farms and there's only te ten properties altogether in about two hundred yards @@ -40616,7 +40582,7 @@ do they include that in the scheme, some of them on the rate, i won't bother wit yeah okay anybody i've got one i meant to put on the main agenda and i forgot, and i wrote the agenda . -i've been offered the opportunity by er bob in training er in force have taken this on er the tactical unit have taken it on, the chance of er one day erm assessment or appraisal training, at erm probably at exeter for those of us that do it and erm i think that perhaps with the the way that the diverse way that our staff's spread out the proper ways of assessing people which i've i've never been shown how to do and i don't think many of us have. +i've been offered the opportunity by er bob in training er in force have taken this on er the tactical unit have taken it on, the chance of er one day erm assessment or appraisal training, at erm probably at exeter for those of us that do it and erm i think that perhaps with the the way that the diverse way that our staff's spread out the proper ways of assessing people which i've i've never been shown how to do and i don't think many of us have. erm i mean he it sort of went through our staff inspector wise and er paul was sort of chatting, and he wasn't being unkind he said yes, they'll be dinosaurs because it's a long time since you've had er any training like that. what about civilian staff, i have to assess my staff, i haven't had no training. yeah, yeah @@ -40637,7 +40603,7 @@ first time he's said anything nice about me, i thought i'll get in while i can derek, it won't last right, anyone else want to bring any points up took me, took me about bloody two days to do your last one -stuart is having a social event on the eleventh of march for the media and the police, i'll circulate this round with a er slip on it, erm it involves a conducted tour of the police station and some bits and bobs +stuart is having a social event on the eleventh of march for the media and the police, i'll circulate this round with a er slip on it, erm it involves a conducted tour of the police station and some bits and bobs oooh and everyone's very welcome to come, i'll let you know reply to it @@ -40645,7 +40611,7 @@ eleventh of march well it's now come under a general invited round to us all yeah eleventh of march, yeah -the on the contacts slip so you can read at your leisure, anybody else want to raise any points, tracy at all, david +the on the contacts slip so you can read at your leisure, anybody else want to raise any points, tracy at all, david about car park green vans, green vans green vans @@ -40663,23 +40629,23 @@ i was coming to david tomorrow morning if it's still there yeah yeah -we're not gonna put any down cos it's going somewhere else +we're not gonna put any down cos it's going somewhere else but they're gonna have to find him -erm bob bob +erm bob bob no no no you have to wait until all the transit vans are out and double parked put it across across the transit van bays so nobody can get in at all mm, or their transits let's throw the keys away -i was saying to david this morning there was a on the police that was good +i was saying to david this morning there was a on the police that was good probably terribly naive oh it says something like j r green a number which doesn't exist and any tradesperson could have the name address type of trade and a real phone number course they would yeah you could change the signs quite regular though couldn't you -painter and decorator one day and er butcher the other +painter and decorator one day and er butcher the other quite easily -throw, throw some paint over the back and everything paint running out the back +throw, throw some paint over the back and everything paint running out the back mm yeah detail like that hear that @@ -40687,11 +40653,11 @@ rubbish really, not our problem, anybody else want to bring any points up no no we've got dates for the meeting, i've got two suggestions, one is that i can't see any point anymore why here here -and it's to one +and it's to one yeah, here here better headquarters, yeah, where where -s thirty one, if we book it in advance we can get in s thirty one downstairs in the canteen, cos we're only an hour and half, two hours meeting +s thirty one, if we book it in advance we can get in s thirty one downstairs in the canteen, cos we're only an hour and half, two hours meeting yeah we can be finished by quarter to twelve good idea, any items of agenda for sergeant , who will be organising the next meeting in s thirty one @@ -40733,15 +40699,14 @@ are we closing the meetings yeah we're all bored the meeting's closing just before ten thirty thank you. the sun has now risen the sun is over the yard arm. - come in. good morning. morning . you're a stranger. aye. -what can we do for you this morning ? +what can we do for you this morning ? it's my pills. -i need pills +i need pills you need some poison. . i'm only needing the lazarite and er aspirin, @@ -40750,17 +40715,16 @@ no? no i'm alright for that. i'm okay for . you're alright for your spray. -so that's i am due my line too. +so that's i am due my line too. fine. is that ? aye. -are you still gardens, yeah? +are you still gardens, yeah? yes. -there you are young walter, and that'll keep you for a week . +there you are young walter, and that'll keep you for a week . doctor. right. cheerio now. - good morning. it's mackeson gold cup day, it's been raining heavily at cheltenham, there's a non-runner in the big race details coming up. we'll also be looking back a little bit at the breeder's cup, we'll also have the result of your poll for the channel four racing personality of the year, there's the picture puzzle and lots of other things as well which i can't remember. @@ -40792,8 +40756,8 @@ scu's running for the press. scu's yeah yeah yeah is that a help or a hindrance ? -i don't anyway this is just one of the highlights of what has been two marvellous days at the mackeson meeting sponsored of course by whitbread and the big race today is the fifty thousand pound mackeson gold cup confirming fifteen runners over two and a half miles. -panto prince is out and general pershing is now new favourite and clear favourite. +i don't anyway this is just one of the highlights of what has been two marvellous days at the mackeson meeting sponsored of course by whitbread and the big race today is the fifty thousand pound mackeson gold cup confirming fifteen runners over two and a half miles. +panto prince is out and general pershing is now new favourite and clear favourite. neil doughty eleven to two, bradbury star that has to be the favourite easing slightly this seven to one with general idea. just looking at those prices on the screen i suppose oakes general pershing is a worthy favourite or is he? well it's a very very competitive race i i i suppose he may have the best chance but there are an awful lot with good chances. @@ -40806,7 +40770,7 @@ mm. erm but at that sort of price i think he's opposable. well let's see what we can oppose him with. bradley star is a very nice horse he's a classy performer this one, josh gifford's horses are in tremendous form and i was talking to the man who who rides him deckland murphy he's my next door neighbour he thinks he'll run a big race. -he would be my pick i must say, of them he's he's +he would be my pick i must say, of them he's he's the trouble is he's run he's run some marvellous races but somehow when it comes to the crunch and er in in in better class races he just gets just gets beat. he loves cheltenham though i mean he's had four firsts and a second erm, he's only won i admit @@ -40822,30 +40786,30 @@ the only problem is that the ground now might well have gone against this horse. but he did win the galway plate earlier this summer. this is fast ground at galway and that's the problem with general idea as you say derek er if it gets softer like at cheltenham that will be very much against him. -but er it doesn't look like a steeplechase but it is in fact -a two mile steeplechase the galway plate and general idea running really well from and express but the ground's the problem. +but er it doesn't look like a steeplechase but it is in fact +a two mile steeplechase the galway plate and general idea running really well from and express but the ground's the problem. and lighter weight as well last year and has more weight today so he's had he would have had to have improved about four or five pounds to win today? that's right. and there's very li very little between him and er the the other ex-irish horse second schedule. exactly. well let's have a look we've got er second schedule. now he's recently joined david nicholson's stable. -yes that's right er i er believe in fact i know because the duke says so in the racing post today the reason he's gone there is to get adrian maguire because adrian has ridden him already in ireland and the owner wanting to stick with maguire which you can't blame him for +yes that's right er i er believe in fact i know because the duke says so in the racing post today the reason he's gone there is to get adrian maguire because adrian has ridden him already in ireland and the owner wanting to stick with maguire which you can't blame him for exactly as david nicholson said he'll be taking orders from the jockey today instead of the other way around. i don't imagine he says that very often. perhaps he's given the duke his orders. oh i'd like to do that. -now well let's have a look at this horse and another schedule because as i say he was trained in ireland by arthur and er we saw them at punchestown back in april where he finished second to another of his rivals today bishops hall. +now well let's have a look at this horse and another schedule because as i say he was trained in ireland by arthur and er we saw them at punchestown back in april where he finished second to another of his rivals today bishops hall. as they come to the final fence second schedule being pressed by ebony jane and bishops hall on the nearside and over the last second schedule and bishops hall on the nearside, ebony jane in third, in fourth place is joe white and racing into the closing stages it's second schedule with bishops hall on the nearside graham bradley again as they go to the line, bishops hall wins it for harry , second schedule is second, joe white is third, ebony jane four. bishops hall doing it nicely under brad and it's good to see him in the saddle today because he was offered the ride on morley street but he'd already said yes and he's a man of his word and he agreed to ride this horse. and there's been a lot of hoo-ha in the press about should be ride morley street or shouldn't he. once you say yes you gotta stick to your word and morley street, good horse, but has a lot of weight today. lot of weight and again it's it's fences isn't it. he'd last time tried over these he he wasn't at his best. -erm had a run on the flat so you know i mean i think we should be but -it's a it's a very bold thing of toby baldwin to run him in this race it seems to me, you know i mean he definitely appeared to not like . -yes +erm had a run on the flat so you know i mean i think we should be but +it's a it's a very bold thing of toby baldwin to run him in this race it seems to me, you know i mean he definitely appeared to not like . +yes it's only his third run and he's he's in the most competitive two and a half mile chase in the year. but he oozes class and he's had a strange preparation. you mention the flat race. @@ -40854,7 +40818,7 @@ it was at newmarket just a couple of weeks ago. and i can tell you he he does an an awful lot. here you can see him second last but making ground now. er my patriarch and er is is taking the lead from ritto who later ran so well in the cesarovitch but just look at morley street now. -here he comes past one past another past yet another into third place in the end and that was an extraordinarily good performance. +here he comes past one past another past yet another into third place in the end and that was an extraordinarily good performance. no. it's a very good turn of foot for a for a jumper isn't it though ? @@ -40895,8 +40859,8 @@ well general pershing is the buzz horse this morning. victor chandler the longest eleven to two, i should think he's been trampled to death in the rush. er ladbrokes went five to one. that is being taken to good money they say, it was the professional's choice yesterday the faces were all backing it yesterday. -the five to one will last to the end of the ten minute guarantee at the shops, it will then go four and by the general pershing could be as low as seven to two or a hundred to thirty according to ladbrokes. -hills have had erm each way for nephew and our margaret but the focus of the betting today with this rain coming at cheltenham is going to be gordon richard's general pershing and he's gonna go off a short price. +the five to one will last to the end of the ten minute guarantee at the shops, it will then go four and by the general pershing could be as low as seven to two or a hundred to thirty according to ladbrokes. +hills have had erm each way for nephew and our margaret but the focus of the betting today with this rain coming at cheltenham is going to be gordon richard's general pershing and he's gonna go off a short price. is your money going to be on the favourite? er my money's gone on storm storm alert about ten days ago at twelves and mm. @@ -40908,13 +40872,13 @@ mhm. and i've said that you know i'd rather it was on the soft but whether it will get yeah. the trip or not we'll find out this afternoon. -it's gonna be a cracking good race at too. +it's gonna be a cracking good race at too. but what about the other race meetings today? let's have the early news. oakes. yes. wind's up. -there's no danger of the river rising so fast it floods the course as it sometimes does but sadly as you can see, rain overnight and it's raining now. +there's no danger of the river rising so fast it floods the course as it sometimes does but sadly as you can see, rain overnight and it's raining now. and do watch out for those roadworks on the m four just by the m twenty five junction. well at nottingham as well as first race twelve forty five there's a wedding. the prospective mr and mrs martin are celebrating their wedding in a private hospitality suite and as well as er entertaining their guests they're sponsoring the andy and tracy wedding day novelties chase. @@ -40923,39 +40887,39 @@ so all the very best to them. the going however whether their horse will like it or not is good from good to firm and there's a non runner in the one fifteen that's number one urgh canderbill, there we go. that's about a third of an inch of rain overnight and again it's gonna be wet for the rest of the day. when you go into the course follow signs for colic park. -celebrating your wedding with chase but this is ayr and it's the only dry spot in the british isles. +celebrating your wedding with chase but this is ayr and it's the only dry spot in the british isles. there was no rain overnight so that the ground er is good with just a few soft places. no hazards on the roads. -and the where the meeting of the day is at lingfield park. +and the where the meeting of the day is at lingfield park. first race there twelve twenty because there are eight races so an action-packed good value afternoon there. an eighth of an inch of rain overnight but that shouldn't make any difference at all but a wet windy day. no reported hazards. -doesn't look a brilliant day does it weatherwise at the races clouds. -wetherby by the way tuesday third annual charity meeting in aid of the international spinal research trust. +doesn't look a brilliant day does it weatherwise at the races clouds. +wetherby by the way tuesday third annual charity meeting in aid of the international spinal research trust. it's on tuesday sixteenth of november. a lot of local people have certainly er given generously so should be a good day's racing. always is at wetherby if you can win there you can win anywhere. but what about the guy who's won the channel four champion tipster competition for last week? let me first of all give you his name and i'll tell you what this guy's damn brilliant. -it is robert from road in in oxfordshire who got an amazing a hundred and thirty points. +it is robert from road in in oxfordshire who got an amazing a hundred and thirty points. now i say amazing let's just see where he got his winners. -now that okay no problems there,second and third but look at this, he gave the first second and third and they didn't even have a handicap. -er the looking for a rainbow, flight lieutenant, all skill of course, well you deserve that. -well done robert and you get five hundred pounds. +now that okay no problems there,second and third but look at this, he gave the first second and third and they didn't even have a handicap. +er the looking for a rainbow, flight lieutenant, all skill of course, well you deserve that. +well done robert and you get five hundred pounds. we'll have another champion tipster competition in a fortnight here on channel four which will be coming from newcastle. now let's test your turf knowledge as we go into the commercial break. -this er turf trivia today has been sent in by s who comes from great lumley in county down. +this er turf trivia today has been sent in by s who comes from great lumley in county down. know it well. -he asks quite simply with which horses did trainer fred rival win the mackeson gold cup four years running in nineteen sixty eight, sixty nine, seventy and seventy one? -you get scratching those heads and i'll give you the answer in three minutes from now. +he asks quite simply with which horses did trainer fred rival win the mackeson gold cup four years running in nineteen sixty eight, sixty nine, seventy and seventy one? +you get scratching those heads and i'll give you the answer in three minutes from now. okay did you get it right? with which horses did trainer fred rival win the mackeson in sixty eight, sixty nine, seventy and seventy one four years running. -they were jupiter boy, gay trip, chatham and gay trip again. +they were jupiter boy, gay trip, chatham and gay trip again. what an incredible performance that was. three different horses won it four years running. the late and much missed fred rival by the way i saw mercy at the horse of the year show a few weeks ago. still looking as good as ever. -erm non runners, non runners there were three in so far, two of them were at cheltenham. +erm non runners, non runners there were three in so far, two of them were at cheltenham. they are far senior in the first in the twelve fifty and panto prince did not run in the mackeson at two o'clock. and canderbill is out of the one fifteen at nottingham. any good news in the papers alastair? @@ -40964,15 +40928,15 @@ and here in the sporting life there's the man who rode gay trip to mackeson vict large as life and smiling. he's been in the wars a bit since his racing career. he was one of my childhood heroes, a marvellous jockey and a great chap. -he's been on the sauce basically but he's kicked the habit and he says of kicking the drinking habit i've had a lot of help and a lot of good counselling, in the end it's up to me. +he's been on the sauce basically but he's kicked the habit and he says of kicking the drinking habit i've had a lot of help and a lot of good counselling, in the end it's up to me. i don't want to be complacent but since march i seem to be winning . well that's great news. and a lot of people have rallied round terry biddlecombe, very popular man, injured jockeys' fund among others and he's back in the back in the swim fully employed and in action for mackeson today at er cheltenham. here in the mail peter scudimore wearing his new hack's hat. pipe can still meet the gold standard. -there are a lot of people saying that mike martin pipe is not the force he was etcetera but there's been a change of policy down at and if anyone thinks that pipe has lost his touch they're talking twaddle. +there are a lot of people saying that mike martin pipe is not the force he was etcetera but there's been a change of policy down at and if anyone thinks that pipe has lost his touch they're talking twaddle. he'll be back and he might be back at working men's prices. -you pay your money and you take your choice on the mackeson and here j a magrar in the telegraph idea represents mackeson value . +you pay your money and you take your choice on the mackeson and here j a magrar in the telegraph idea represents mackeson value . he has some very harsh words for the japanese about their ban on frankie detory saying it's shortsighted and harsh in the extreme and we'll all say yes to that. er in the star brad's a star. this is josh gifford exclusive another one of these trainers learning to be a journalist. @@ -40980,7 +40944,7 @@ time some journalists learned to be trainers i think. he says i'm convinced he's a mu this is bradbury he's a much better stronger horse this season and really do think he can bring the beer money back to sussex. we will see. -and here today's bandwagon rolling tip,pershing po poised to fulfil his promise , that's paul johnson in the racing post, john de moreville in the express pershing to strike his target and now here is something of which nobody can be proud gosforth park south africa . +and here today's bandwagon rolling tip,pershing po poised to fulfil his promise , that's paul johnson in the racing post, john de moreville in the express pershing to strike his target and now here is something of which nobody can be proud gosforth park south africa . this is in the sporting life and it's also in the racing post and this is a cynical move by the bookies to pick your pocket. there are five race meetings today. there are more dog cards than you shake a stick at yet the bookies are peddling this tripe from south africa through the morning. @@ -41010,12 +40974,12 @@ i wasn't part of the warm hum of approval i don't suppose so. and mr meredith was a failed jockey in england. he ended up riding a few jumpers in france so its erm although he's a good trainer now i don't think he's an authority and it's poppycock er frankly. -but when appear over here they're a great success. +but when appear over here they're a great success. is there anything in it? oh of course they're of course they are a great success. they are top class jockeys. but our top class jockeys in america do not flop about they use a slightly different style. -admittedly they're a little bit less streamlined but if you're going to say that that makes a serious difference +admittedly they're a little bit less streamlined but if you're going to say that that makes a serious difference but what's the difference in the courses as well over here that our our guys have to cope with. true @@ -41033,19 +40997,19 @@ and in all sorts everywhere they want to anywhere they want to yeah -so but there it's it's a very interesting point there because a lot of our young boys now the dow holland alan munroes are riding more the american style. +so but there it's it's a very interesting point there because a lot of our young boys now the dow holland alan munroes are riding more the american style. it's an interesting point. i don't think he's right in what he says but i think it might have been a bit tongue in cheek as well. they certainly weren't saying it about lester piggott on royal academy a couple of years back either. -no but i did say about it lester piggott on a few weeks ago . +no but i did say about it lester piggott on a few weeks ago . yes. lester piggott when he won on . mm. -and the next . +and the next . very good. very good impression. talking of lester piggott he of course was the winner of the first ever channel four personality of the year trophy which we awarded for the first time last year. -he was a guest on the morning line at newmarket and there it is that magnificent trophy which is valued at five thousand pounds. +he was a guest on the morning line at newmarket and there it is that magnificent trophy which is valued at five thousand pounds. now we couldn't have him in this year to give the others a chance so this is how you voted for the nineteen ninety three racing personality of the year on channel four and let's take it in reverse order starting with the person who finished fourth. in fourth place one of the hardest working and most successful trainers in britain jack barry. he polled nine percent. @@ -41055,14 +41019,14 @@ runner-up the ever popular willie carson. willie received seventeen percent of the overall votes. so who did you vote for? who's the nineteen ninety three channel four racing personality of the year? -it is mary reevley who polled twenty percent. +it is mary reevley who polled twenty percent. just as successful on the flat or over jumps i think this is a very very worthy winner our congratulations to mary reevley and i'm gonna get her on the show and present the prize to her. if we get her on the show that really will be something cos i know she's shy but well done. -ling dell can be proud of her up in north yorkshire. +ling dell can be proud of her up in north yorkshire. charity bets twenty five pounds and we came down in the car from newmarket she had the she had the post out the light everything, now what's what's it going on? exactly. i've not, alastair accused me of being topical because of a member of the royal family this week this is not the reason but i've gone for leotard in the one twenty five at cheltenham. -could a lot fitter than it did +could a lot fitter than it did ah i love it. oakes what are you going for? @@ -41071,7 +41035,7 @@ ballasarly i'm going for. ballasarly? there's a slight i mean over hurdles there's a doubt about his stamina mm. -but erm he won at a huge long was it the er queen alexandra +but erm he won at a huge long was it the er queen alexandra yeah. at royal ascot erm so that i'm confident he will stay and mr pipe is not dead yet. that's true. @@ -41083,18 +41047,18 @@ cor blimey. i haven't heard of that one. general pershing is the one to be on at the big race. that's mine let's check it out. -oakes is going for ballasarly in the two thirty five cheltenham, leslie's going for leotard that's the top weight in the first at one twenty five er oh in the second. +oakes is going for ballasarly in the two thirty five cheltenham, leslie's going for leotard that's the top weight in the first at one twenty five er oh in the second. alastair's going for front street at nottingham number five in the two twenty, thomo's going for general pershing in the two o'clock at cheltenham. picture puzzle. picture puzzle. can you work out today's picture puzzle? -this horse is running somewhere today. +this horse is running somewhere today. okay i wonder where? i promise three extra ice creams a day now will you please come on the set. something to do miss er sara lingfield i wonder where that's running today? -o eight nine one double nine double one double four win a hundred pound do you win a copy of this book? +o eight nine one double nine double one double four win a hundred pound do you win a copy of this book? this is the william hill racing dates. it's a smashing book that graham sharp's brought out. what's the date today chaps? @@ -41103,16 +41067,15 @@ peter niven rode a five timer at ayr in nineteen ninety two. eighteen eighty nine the foston selling plate at derby was declared void after the whole field got lost in the thick fog covering the course and ended up running round the back of a cricket pavilion. have you been round the back of a cricket pavilion recently? no. -but there was a one day in which frenchie nick nicholson erm brought all the tail-enders across and had been told the one thing he shouldn't do was be last he was thinking i'm not last and behind you then he came in in front of him and he was last. +but there was a one day in which frenchie nick nicholson erm brought all the tail-enders across and had been told the one thing he shouldn't do was be last he was thinking i'm not last and behind you then he came in in front of him and he was last. i love it. lovely story. anyway that's it from the morning line. -i'm off to windsor they're off to cheltenham and everywhere else. +i'm off to windsor they're off to cheltenham and everywhere else. we'll see you next saturday. we'll give you the result of picture puzzle then. -till then from all of us bye bye. +till then from all of us bye bye. see you next week. - good afternoon and welcome to on the record. we know what the conservative party thought of michael heseltine this week, they cheered him to the echo when he strode on to the platform at blackpool. but what does michael heseltine think of the party? @@ -41139,7 +41102,7 @@ don't don't quarrel with him. don't quarrel with him . so what does that mean? no need for a bypass? -because they +because they no no no no i just lost the tip of an artery. closed down, finish. so there's it w it wasn't close to the heart. @@ -41152,7 +41115,7 @@ er but it takes time to recover from the er the the shock and the experience and but i've come a long way and er so i'll go back next er wednesday to the department and er er if people will bear with me and put up with it er i'll take it er fairly slowly to start with but i dare say there will come a time when er erm you won't notice much difference. what you you say the shock of it. what what was it like? -all of those of us who haven't had a heart attack live in fear of it obviously and think +all of those of us who haven't had a heart attack live in fear of it obviously and think yeah well, i mean we all my father died of a heart attack. mm. and erm er that was a long time ago. @@ -41189,7 +41152,7 @@ you looked terrible. which i wished to portray. but this sort of tottering wreck. yes. -you know, hobbling to the helicopter it was my +you know, hobbling to the helicopter it was my foot which had had been had gout induced. nothing to do with the heart at all. anyway, sod's law you know. @@ -41202,7 +41165,7 @@ no no i didn't. i mean i must be honest, i did not feel that frightened erm it wasn't an acute pain that that i mean i mean one of the things that one has to realize, you can become a heart attack bore. very easily. everybody who's had any sort of tremor or experience or much worse, they're all individual and it's no use me talking to you about my heart condition, because you haven't got my heart. -erm e e they're all individual and mine i think, looking back, was erm erm er a light er experience and i mean as i've said, the the erm er w this telescope they shove up you, er i mean, chris patton had the same thing. +erm e e they're all individual and mine i think, looking back, was erm erm er a light er experience and i mean as i've said, the the erm er w this telescope they shove up you, er i mean, chris patton had the same thing. erm is local anaesthetic in the groin. up goes the telescope, you're lying there you know, and the doctor told me, he said, do you wanna watch? do you wanna watch? @@ -41212,7 +41175,7 @@ anything but. absolutely. but erm anyway that's it's all it's all now a few a few months ago. did it change your perspective on anything, on life, on politics, on what you're doing in in in the job? -well i suppose erm well i i i i mean i remember er ludicrous really, sort of thinking of what i would say at the tory party conference while i was lying in that hospital in venice. +well i suppose erm well i i i i mean i remember er ludicrous really, sort of thinking of what i would say at the tory party conference while i was lying in that hospital in venice. and i actually made some notes . erm then. and er so i mean it's you know, i am a politician i mean you know, it's in the blood i've b been in the in the house of commons now for about a quarter of a century. @@ -41223,7 +41186,7 @@ i there are other things i could do. i'm a manic gardener and i that's what i've been doing. erm i could go back to commerce, although er that side of my life is some way behind and it it's always been very successfully done by er my colleagues in the company that i started. so er you know i i've i've never had a sort of er a one way track about politics, although i adore it and i've er i've enjoyed it hugely am enjoying it and i -ah i was going to pick you said, i have enjoyed it hu i was about to leap in and say, ah that means . +ah i was going to pick you said, i have enjoyed it hu i was about to leap in and say, ah that means . yes ye no no no no no no. how kind. well that's the value of a programme like this, you can correct. @@ -41231,12 +41194,12 @@ otherwise that'd be over the headlines. heseltine says, future quite. is in the past. -you know +you know which is not exactly what i am saying. erm no the fact is that er i i love politics. it's er and and i have always wanted to be president of the board of trade. but what about more ambition, further ambition now? -well that's a sort of wary question but all politicians +well that's a sort of wary question but all politicians but you'd expect me to ask it. i know you're bound to ask it. and you i'm not going to give any different answer i've ever given. @@ -41246,7 +41209,7 @@ and er er i i think that er all this sort of chat about leadership challenges an i don't think we shall see it. i especially i don't think so after after the very er impressive speech he made on friday. but there is we can come to that in a moment if we may. -but there is something about you that is a bit different to politicians. +but there is something about you that is a bit different to politicians. apart from that but well th that's true that's true . trouble. trouble. @@ -41270,7 +41233,7 @@ long hair. long hair, tall. you know. been around a long time. -erm i what is it, who knows, who cares? +erm i what is it, who knows, who cares? you know, if i'm president of the board of trade, i'm a loyal member of john major's cabinet. i intend to go on doing that as long as he wants me. and the inevitable qu you'd expect me to ask this to you. @@ -41278,7 +41241,7 @@ if john major fell under a privatized train, would your hat still be in the ring or well would you say, i've had it all now, i do -i i mean i you know, you never make these er you can get every sort of evasive answer to these questions. +i i mean i you know, you never make these er you can get every sort of evasive answer to these questions. and they're all lies, you know, they may sound nice and they may deceive people, but the truth is, any politician that i know and respect, when it comes to the crunch, if they think they have a chance of preferment and obviously ultimate preferment, take it. some of them do it sheepishly, and with reluctance and say, it's never what i ever had in mind. but they always do it. @@ -41292,7 +41255,7 @@ you cannot if you're in the the house of commons and there's a vacancy or someth your friends are the ones who say, well you're the guy who could do this. and if they don't say that, or if they positively say, you're not the guy, you're wasting your time. the only reason that you can make progress in that sort of situation is if there's a body of opinion that says that you should. -but somebody like you could always find friends to say, yes you ought to do that +but somebody like you could always find friends to say, yes you ought to do that no i don't agree with that. i d i do not agree with that at all. i mean, there could i mean i think the house of commons is now some way past in in my life in the sense i haven't been there since er june. @@ -41300,7 +41263,7 @@ i've no idea about the mood, i've no idea what people will think of er maybe lar you see they've nothing to be frightened of any more. but they're wrong. ah but they -aren't they because you're saying, i'm still around +aren't they because you're saying, i'm still around no they may not be wr i i mean the the fact i'm around doesn't mean to say that i'm frightening. and i haven't changed. i've never been frightening. @@ -41329,15 +41292,15 @@ but she hasn't. as far as i'm concerned, personally, so far, she has. what was the deal then? that i wouldn't pursue the issues of nineteen eighty six. -and i i haven't i with the no it's very simple, i left it to the select committees of the house of commons. +and i i haven't i with the no it's very simple, i left it to the select committees of the house of commons. but we're talking about now, we're talking about mrs thatcher having written -i deal +i deal a set of memoirs er critical of the prime minister while he's still in office . erm er i'm she hasn't been critical of me. no but she's been critical of lots of other people. well we don't know for sure yet about what she's said about you. do we. -if +if that's what i said, if she sticks to the deal, i'll stick to the deal. s but but y what what you're saying is that if someo have you seen the book by the way? have you read the book? @@ -41354,7 +41317,7 @@ well look, let's stand back. my interest is in the unity and success of the conservative party. i don't want to see i i deeply deplore the divisions between left and right and the accentuation of often very phoney distinctions and mislabelling that goes on. it's a development that has grown in my political lifetime over erm i suppose twenty years now. -and i don't like that aspect of politics, the divisiveness of it all, the personal sort of er attentions of it all. +and i don't like that aspect of politics, the divisiveness of it all, the personal sort of er attentions of it all. i know it's there, but i thought that john struck with me a very powerful note, when he said in his conference speech, i should share these things first in private. and i don't think it would do any good for me on this programme, or any of my colleagues, and of course the media will be now all over the place trying to achieve this. to get instant reactions, instant comments which will blow the thing up. @@ -41386,7 +41349,7 @@ and and and and have no illusions, the money and the contents are very linked. that it's no use going round saying, well here's my view of history as i wrote it. er and it's factual it's it's analytical, it's it's erm devoid of the sort of bitchiness of politics. cos you won't get enough money. -you mean people spice them up +you mean people spice them up oh yeah, sure sure. you think mrs thatcher's done that? i have no idea. @@ -41407,13 +41370,13 @@ i w i i personally er made it clear at the time when they changed the rules er e erm i think that er erm politicians understand full well the nature of the profession in which they're involved and the parliamentary party is erm more than able to exercise a proper judgement, er i don't think there's any case at all for er changing th i don't think there was a case for changing the rules and i don't think there is a case for changing the rules today. so you're out of step with people like douglas hurd and norman fowler? well i mean i you know the let's have a discussion. -i don't think it's not a not a complete you can't get a headline, tories divided over rule changes. +i don't think it's not a not a complete you can't get a headline, tories divided over rule changes. you know it's i don't know, it's an interesting no no i don't believe that. i think it's perfectly reasonable that the parliamentary party should have those sort of powers. and i'll tell you why i think it's reasonable, because they would only use them seriously in extreme circumstances. -doesn't matter if i'm not going to name any names but i mean i've seen some people who it's been suggested might stand two hoots of a flick of a finger whether someone of the sort that i've seen mentioned, stood or not. +doesn't matter if i'm not going to name any names but i mean i've seen some people who it's been suggested might stand two hoots of a flick of a finger whether someone of the sort that i've seen mentioned, stood or not. you are are you thinking of mrs theresa gorman there ? i'm not going to i'm not i'm not going to be drawn into discussing the names of any particular person, i'm merely saying it would be of no consequence. it would be a joke. @@ -41498,14 +41461,14 @@ the dash the the the sort of headline dash out of the house of commons, the mome and then to withhold one's vote as with almost a matter of habit and routine, that cannot be in the best interests of the conservative party. and you have to realize, none of us are there cos we've got happy smiling faces. we're there because the conservative party chose us, and put us there. -yeah but +yeah but and so we have obligations to them. but you're not there you're not in parliament to represent the conservative party, you're in parliament to represent your constituents. i i think you've got to just look at that constitutional concept. the constituency that chose you was the conservative party. that that chose you. but you represent every individual in that constituency . -the the the no no no no you were chosen by the conservative party. +the the the no no no no you were chosen by the conservative party. you then stand for election. the reason why you're elected is because a sufficient number of people wanted a conservative government. now it's perfectly true, they understand i hope rightly, within the framework and philosophy of the conservative party, that you have to respect the integrity of the individual. @@ -41531,7 +41494,7 @@ well so we were told. i dare say that's what you were told. it's not what she thought. -did you say to her, i'm going out to re i'm going out and i may be gone for a long time. +did you say to her, i'm going out to re i'm going out and i may be gone for a long time. i if i remember correctly those are words that led to the death of a very distinguished explorer. i had no intention of dying the political death. er the erm er fact of the matter was that er er as has been recorded by those less emotionally charged at that moment, i didn't flounce out of the cabinet. @@ -41539,14 +41502,14 @@ i had made it quite clear but you went on telly minutes later. oh there was a television camera as you left downing street . you went to a press conference. -er that was four o'clock in the afternoon. +er that was four o'clock in the afternoon. no no i mean the the i mean when i've g been drawn er down a road i don't intend to go no because the the point i'm trying to make is that it is unrealistic surely for the leader of the party to say to his mps who aren't delegates after all, but who represent the interests of their constituencies, shut up, come to me privately if you have any concerns. that's not realistic is it . i i i think he said, first, to me privately. in other words, you talk it through, you try to resolve it. not dash for the television cameras. -that was the point that i heard him make in brighton. +that was the point that i heard him make in brighton. and and even there will come a time after the private dialogue, where he people have the right. i let me give you an example, i've always respected erm teddy taylor and john biffen who have taken the extreme view on europe. er i think they genuinely believe their case, it's not a case that i believe, but i i've always genuinely respected them for the case they take. @@ -41577,7 +41540,7 @@ two th nearly two thirds of our trade goes with europe. i don't mind the sort of the use of language that gives this or that impression if that's what contemporary politics demands, i'm as guilty of that as er the next man. but if we create a psychology in this country where to the men and women who earn the crust upon which we depend, our business community, are switched off to the significance of europe, there's only one people who'll suffer and it is us. and when peter lilley says for instance -i am not prepared to yeah yes, but you will not get me to to separate myself from my colleagues . +i am not prepared to yeah yes, but you will not get me to to separate myself from my colleagues . half well let me let me finish the the quote because well there are but but but but well alright but but peter lilley is saying, is suggesting in a in a speech at a party conference that half the population of continental europe are scroungers. i mean one wonders how that helps this kind of partnership. that that you obviously think is so important. @@ -41592,8 +41555,8 @@ and i know that whatever the rhetoric, mrs thatcher used all the rhetoric, nobod all these regulations that we're now having to i'm having to with expert er help from my colleague er neil hamilton, having to look at and redo, do you know where they all came from? most of them came from the single european act. from the cofield agenda. -that mrs thatcher -which which mrs thatcher rightly committed us to and rightly whipped us through the house and and it and it +that mrs thatcher +which which mrs thatcher rightly committed us to and rightly whipped us through the house and and it and it right, so we're to ignore all these things that we hear at the conference. there is no difference between the the endless bad mouthing between local and central government, as one tries to blame the other. and central government trying to blame the europeans. @@ -41615,10 +41578,10 @@ er not relative not relative poverty because obviously the tide of prosperity ha it's better not to have to have pensions than not to have pensions, surely not . but but but look at the look. oh no no no oh no that th er i that is not in er what i was talking about was the social values, er not the existence of the welfare state. -that has i mean most of the welfare state has been er it'll either created or extended by conservative government so +that has i mean most of the welfare state has been er it'll either created or extended by conservative government so but beveridge achieved nothing? er no, beveridge did, but he never intended to achieve what we've got. -er i mean, you will know that i wrote a book called no time for ostriches in when i was on the back benches, in favour of work fare. +er i mean, you will know that i wrote a book called no time for ostriches in when i was on the back benches, in favour of work fare. er i i think that with three million people out of work, we have an unemployment problem which creates erm a a disadvantage group particularly in some of the stress urban areas where we have to look at more radical solutions to what is basically the payment of cash for nothing in return. now i have said that, it's not government policy, perhaps i'm stretching over the bounds of saying it, but er those these ideas are around. but clearly, what you have said in the past has led us to believe that you think self help does not solve all the problems, the government now seems to be telling us @@ -41635,11 +41598,11 @@ now if you say to me, this is i go back to my work fare, if you're talking about you are entitled to say, well okay we understand you've got a problem, we know that there's an economic er er difficulty across the world, what are you gonna give us in exchange? and beveridge would have been perfectly happy with that question. peter lilley wouldn't. -well +well oth alright, i won't use the name peter lilley if you don't if you prefer i didn't. others in the cabinet would not. well s s but why so why should -so many of those speeches blackpool +so many of those speeches blackpool why should we be worried about the existence of a debate in a cabinet. i mean this is so n i remember, i used to go to nato alli er er er di discussions as defence ministers. and people would sort of say, there's a division in nato. @@ -41651,14 +41614,14 @@ if you can't have a debate in cabinet, what's the point off cabinet? i y c yes, debates in cabinet perhaps, but we're not talking about debates in cabinet, we're talking about speeches made at blackpool or at fringe meetings of blackpool, which lead people to believe that the government is moving substantially towards the right. now that's significant, that isn't just a this isn't just a debate about some vague ideological nicety, how many angels on the head of a pin? this is fundamental to the way british politics is going . -well you should y i i i er these la these these labels are so difficult to fit because if you say, moving to the right, you then have to show me what policies the government is pursuing and you'll probably find that i either play the part in thinking off argu arguing for them some years before some of my colleagues. +well you should y i i i er these la these these labels are so difficult to fit because if you say, moving to the right, you then have to show me what policies the government is pursuing and you'll probably find that i either play the part in thinking off argu arguing for them some years before some of my colleagues. well i'm talking about policies that haven't yet been instituted. i mean sure. we've got we've got michael howard now talking about, maybe it's better if er if the illegitimate children of single mums erm are adopted, rather than stay with their mothers. -well i mean that is i i something that well to the best off my knowledge, the government has not announced or taken any sort of decision on. +well i mean that is i i something that well to the best off my knowledge, the government has not announced or taken any sort of decision on. but the home secretary is saying, you know, this is something we will think about . -well i you'll forgive me the disadvantage, i'm not trying to cop out, but the disadvantage of not having been immediately involved is that i haven't seen that quotation from michael . +well i you'll forgive me the disadvantage, i'm not trying to cop out, but the disadvantage of not having been immediately involved is that i haven't seen that quotation from michael . alright but if but you would not approve of that kind of language of that kind of er expression of government intent if that's what it was . i i i i would i think that would be something that would be controversial. er i would like to k to know more about what michael is saying before i got involved in any discussion of that. @@ -41814,95 +41777,93 @@ but portillo whose spanish name meaning the narrow gate, is very citable to a ma oddly, if the p m risks giving him one in the next reshuffle, it might be a sign that his own confidence is returning. ministers and whips are worried what the mood of their mps will be when they get back to westminster. most fears centre on whether the maastricht rebels and populists like the wintertons, tony marlowe - good morning, everyone. -i think we have nearly a full house but there may be one or two more people to come. -erm taking part within the presentation this morning ah are frank who is the fr managing director of pearsons, and james er, who's the finance director. -er we're going to take questions at the end er the camera there is for internal use only and at the end we'll hand out copies of the slides to anyone who wants them. -our profits are disappointingly small in relation to, er er, the, er first half of last year er then, we had buoyant conditions and we made more money than we ever had before. -recession had already promised a slow start to this year er, but in january when worry about the gulf actually gave way to the war itself erm, the trading climate which was already weak erm worsened still further. -er, consumer confidence fell away and u k consumers kept more of their cash in their pockets er, in fact, erm, they saved over two and a half billion pounds more in the first quarter of ninety one than they had in the same er, quarter of last year. +i think we have nearly a full house but there may be one or two more people to come. +erm taking part within the presentation this morning ah are frank who is the fr managing director of pearsons, and james er, who's the finance director. +er we're going to take questions at the end er the camera there is for internal use only and at the end we'll hand out copies of the slides to anyone who wants them. +our profits are disappointingly small in relation to, er er, the, er first half of last year er then, we had buoyant conditions and we made more money than we ever had before. +recession had already promised a slow start to this year er, but in january when worry about the gulf actually gave way to the war itself erm, the trading climate which was already weak erm worsened still further. +er, consumer confidence fell away and u k consumers kept more of their cash in their pockets er, in fact, erm, they saved over two and a half billion pounds more in the first quarter of ninety one than they had in the same er, quarter of last year. one immediate casualty of the change in conditions was advertising. -recruitment adversiding advertising for example virtually ground to a halt as businesses started to shed er, people, rather than to look for them. +recruitment adversiding advertising for example virtually ground to a halt as businesses started to shed er, people, rather than to look for them. so what happened to our trading profit? -in this analysis er, if you set aside the effect of our sale of elsivir er, the variance was forty nine million seventy percent of which relates to the u k. the drop in profits from our newspapers was the biggest and probably the most widely expected a substantial proportion of their costs are fixed and, er, they therefore are particularly sensitive to, er changes in volume. -fine china and investment banking inevitably er, er er er er suffered from the economic conditions so did entertainment er, which also brought two extra burdens er, firstly the er marked reduction in tourism and, er, for the first time, a three and a half million pound er, bill for alton towers' loss-making winter quarter which i think we, we've flagged er, quite consistently. -after newspapers, books showed the largest decline er, and the fifteen million variance is shared roughly one fifth by addison wesley and two fifths apiece by penguin and longman. -two of the abiding characteristics of these businesses are first that like newspapers a high proportion of their costs are fixed and secondly, unlike newspapers er, their main selling season is in the second half of the year. -outside aw's erm, specialists books er, er, markets er, book sales have been almost universally slow there were very high returns as book sellers everywhere reacted to reduced er, demand by replacing or winding down their stock. -this particularly affected penguin substantially increasing its spec i its expected first half loss. -penguin also incurred losses of two million on smithmark its american remainder book businesses er, before selling it. -longman the least seasonally biased of the three struggled to break even in the first half and this removed the normal pattern of longman's half-year profits helping to offset the first half losses of the other two businesses but before we get too depressed er i point out that addison wesley s sales were up by eleven percent and the size of the first half loss reflects the company's decision to gear up in advance er, for what we w believe will be a very strong er, second er, half performance. -er, overall i think it's right to say that we're disappointed by these results but we're not downhearted. -all of our businesses have maintained or improved their market shares as managers we concentrate on the full year rather on either half and because of our seasonal bias er, those of you who've been, er, to our interim presentations before er, will remember that without fail i tell you our results at the half-way stage are not a clear guide to the outcome of the year as a whole. -the major part of our profits are made in the second half er, and this year er will certainly be no exception. -to underline the point i thought i'd show you this four year average one thing that the exercise shows is that between them our book, entertainment and fine china businesses normally account for about seven percent of pearson's annual profit in their first half and for about thirty three percent of our profit in the full year. -this year their net first half contribution was negative which will strongly exaggerate the seasonal bias towards the second half er, conditions will still be far from ideal but with the gulf factor out of the way and some visible improvement in our overseas markets, particularly north america we think the trading environment will be broadly equivalent to that of the second half of last year. -now, er, before i hand over to frank er, a word about the dividend er, in recent years we've paid an interim dividend which was half the total of the previous year's dividends and so, er, had a built-in increase. -this year we thought it right to reserve our judgment er, until the end of the year so we matched last year's interim. +in this analysis er, if you set aside the effect of our sale of elsivir er, the variance was forty nine million seventy percent of which relates to the u k. the drop in profits from our newspapers was the biggest and probably the most widely expected a substantial proportion of their costs are fixed and, er, they therefore are particularly sensitive to, er changes in volume. +fine china and investment banking inevitably er, er er er er suffered from the economic conditions so did entertainment er, which also brought two extra burdens er, firstly the er marked reduction in tourism and, er, for the first time, a three and a half million pound er, bill for alton towers' loss-making winter quarter which i think we, we've flagged er, quite consistently. +after newspapers, books showed the largest decline er, and the fifteen million variance is shared roughly one fifth by addison wesley and two fifths apiece by penguin and longman. +two of the abiding characteristics of these businesses are first that like newspapers a high proportion of their costs are fixed and secondly, unlike newspapers er, their main selling season is in the second half of the year. +outside aw's erm, specialists books er, er, markets er, book sales have been almost universally slow there were very high returns as book sellers everywhere reacted to reduced er, demand by replacing or winding down their stock. +this particularly affected penguin substantially increasing its spec i its expected first half loss. +penguin also incurred losses of two million on smithmark its american remainder book businesses er, before selling it. +longman the least seasonally biased of the three struggled to break even in the first half and this removed the normal pattern of longman's half-year profits helping to offset the first half losses of the other two businesses but before we get too depressed er i point out that addison wesley s sales were up by eleven percent and the size of the first half loss reflects the company's decision to gear up in advance er, for what we w believe will be a very strong er, second er, half performance. +er, overall i think it's right to say that we're disappointed by these results but we're not downhearted. +all of our businesses have maintained or improved their market shares as managers we concentrate on the full year rather on either half and because of our seasonal bias er, those of you who've been, er, to our interim presentations before er, will remember that without fail i tell you our results at the half-way stage are not a clear guide to the outcome of the year as a whole. +the major part of our profits are made in the second half er, and this year er will certainly be no exception. +to underline the point i thought i'd show you this four year average one thing that the exercise shows is that between them our book, entertainment and fine china businesses normally account for about seven percent of pearson's annual profit in their first half and for about thirty three percent of our profit in the full year. +this year their net first half contribution was negative which will strongly exaggerate the seasonal bias towards the second half er, conditions will still be far from ideal but with the gulf factor out of the way and some visible improvement in our overseas markets, particularly north america we think the trading environment will be broadly equivalent to that of the second half of last year. +now, er, before i hand over to frank er, a word about the dividend er, in recent years we've paid an interim dividend which was half the total of the previous year's dividends and so, er, had a built-in increase. +this year we thought it right to reserve our judgment er, until the end of the year so we matched last year's interim. frank. -well as michael says, we're not proud of the results er, and we're not going to try and dress them up, michael hasn't tried to do that and i certainly don't intend to. -but nevertheless i do want to er, bring home to you the underlying strength of our businesses there's no question, we're very wel very well faced for, for an upturn. -but before doing that er, you may reasonably ask what action we've taken er, during this year when it's been such a difficult year. -do you remember at the announcement of last year's results we erm we mentioned that we were concentrating on four themes one's cost reduction er driving for cash erm, improving our market share and investing for the future. -starting with cost reduction any cost reduction programme always involves a lot of redundancy and, and this is no exception and from the slide you'll see that we've er we've had a staff reduction er, from the the plan for this year of one thousand and thirty three er and that's the, that will save us in a full year something like fifteen point nine, sixteen million pounds. -this year er, there's been a negative benefit in the first half of two million and there'll be a positive benefit in the second half of two million. -incidentally, it doesn't include the disposal of smithmark we've also er we've also gone in for other cost reduction exercises, for instance at er dalton with a review of warehousing and distribution er, we should save about a million pounds in a full year and we've been ramming home to our chief executives the need for annual payroll reviews to be geared to the profitability of the company rather than t rather than to the rate of inflation er, or even, er in, even the market place. -driving for cash er well an indication of how strongly we, we've been driving for cash is that er the reduction i in er operating cash flow is less than the reduction in profit. -we've been telling our chief executives that even though you can't get the sales then at least try to work on your working capital, try and get your working capital er, ratio down. -and there's been quite a bit of success in in that area both of the newspaper companies er, are doing better than last year and er longmans for instance expect er expect their operating cash flow erm their working capital rather to be lower this year than last year by by year end. -erm improving market share, well all of our businesses have improved their market share during this recession and i'll, i'll mention them as i go through the individual companies. -investing for the future although, although we've been keen to drive for cash er, we really wanted to, to use the benefit of having a strong balance sheet and so where investment has seemed sensible and sound, we've made those investments, of course we've put er, cash in the b sky b er and we've also invested further in the er spanish group, the recollectors group taking our stake in expansion, adding some cash and getting a stake in the bigger bigger grouping. -if we look at the individual businesses there we er see the individual profits. -if we start with the financial times well by their standards it's not a good result er, but again let's get it in context, the newspaper's trading margin is just, just under ten percent, it's er it's about nine point six percent er, and on the circulation front they've done well in market share terms where we've marginally improved our our market share in the quality market. -er in europe we've gone up six percent in circulation and in japan we're on target there and under budget. -in advertisement, er in the advertisement volume area, again we've increased our market share amongst the qu er, quality dailies a marginal increase er but it's nationally we've done very well and for instance in europe we're sixteen percent head, ahead of last year in volume and revenue terms. -on the cost side, apart from the redundancies i mentioned, well including the redundancies i mentioned er, the non volume related costs are only three percent ahead of the previous year. -east india dock is now er, virtually fully utilized printing the basildon papers in the daytime and the financial times at night and the observer on saturday night and we've got high hopes of getting the contract to print the japanese er, european edition of the japanese daily and that, that will fill the morning slot so that really will be er, great utilization of, of that er installation. -has been affected on the revenue front mainly in the medical publishing but to some extent in the erm in the financial sector although we're still absolutely market dominant in that sector but we've increased the circulation there by ten percent. -the f t magazines have all increased their market share and profile, our electronic, er erm, information business has grown in revenue terms by twelve percent. -turning to westminster press the cost westminster press in a full year er, will amount to three point eight million pounds and er . -all of our paid fors have er, done very well this year in circulation terms all but two of them have increased their circulation in the first half, despite quite high price rises, for instance the york county newspaper, the weekly there, we have a daily but the weekly there went up by five p and the weekly in bath where again we have a daily that went up by six p. +well as michael says, we're not proud of the results er, and we're not going to try and dress them up, michael hasn't tried to do that and i certainly don't intend to. +but nevertheless i do want to er, bring home to you the underlying strength of our businesses there's no question, we're very wel very well faced for, for an upturn. +but before doing that er, you may reasonably ask what action we've taken er, during this year when it's been such a difficult year. +do you remember at the announcement of last year's results we erm we mentioned that we were concentrating on four themes one's cost reduction er driving for cash erm, improving our market share and investing for the future. +starting with cost reduction any cost reduction programme always involves a lot of redundancy and, and this is no exception and from the slide you'll see that we've er we've had a staff reduction er, from the the plan for this year of one thousand and thirty three er and that's the, that will save us in a full year something like fifteen point nine, sixteen million pounds. +this year er, there's been a negative benefit in the first half of two million and there'll be a positive benefit in the second half of two million. +incidentally, it doesn't include the disposal of smithmark we've also er we've also gone in for other cost reduction exercises, for instance at er dalton with a review of warehousing and distribution er, we should save about a million pounds in a full year and we've been ramming home to our chief executives the need for annual payroll reviews to be geared to the profitability of the company rather than t rather than to the rate of inflation er, or even, er in, even the market place. +driving for cash er well an indication of how strongly we, we've been driving for cash is that er the reduction i in er operating cash flow is less than the reduction in profit. +we've been telling our chief executives that even though you can't get the sales then at least try to work on your working capital, try and get your working capital er, ratio down. +and there's been quite a bit of success in in that area both of the newspaper companies er, are doing better than last year and er longmans for instance expect er expect their operating cash flow erm their working capital rather to be lower this year than last year by by year end. +erm improving market share, well all of our businesses have improved their market share during this recession and i'll, i'll mention them as i go through the individual companies. +investing for the future although, although we've been keen to drive for cash er, we really wanted to, to use the benefit of having a strong balance sheet and so where investment has seemed sensible and sound, we've made those investments, of course we've put er, cash in the b sky b er and we've also invested further in the er spanish group, the recollectors group taking our stake in expansion, adding some cash and getting a stake in the bigger bigger grouping. +if we look at the individual businesses there we er see the individual profits. +if we start with the financial times well by their standards it's not a good result er, but again let's get it in context, the newspaper's trading margin is just, just under ten percent, it's er it's about nine point six percent er, and on the circulation front they've done well in market share terms where we've marginally improved our our market share in the quality market. +er in europe we've gone up six percent in circulation and in japan we're on target there and under budget. +in advertisement, er in the advertisement volume area, again we've increased our market share amongst the qu er, quality dailies a marginal increase er but it's nationally we've done very well and for instance in europe we're sixteen percent head, ahead of last year in volume and revenue terms. +on the cost side, apart from the redundancies i mentioned, well including the redundancies i mentioned er, the non volume related costs are only three percent ahead of the previous year. +east india dock is now er, virtually fully utilized printing the basildon papers in the daytime and the financial times at night and the observer on saturday night and we've got high hopes of getting the contract to print the japanese er, european edition of the japanese daily and that, that will fill the morning slot so that really will be er, great utilization of, of that er installation. +has been affected on the revenue front mainly in the medical publishing but to some extent in the erm in the financial sector although we're still absolutely market dominant in that sector but we've increased the circulation there by ten percent. +the f t magazines have all increased their market share and profile, our electronic, er erm, information business has grown in revenue terms by twelve percent. +turning to westminster press the cost westminster press in a full year er, will amount to three point eight million pounds and er . +all of our paid fors have er, done very well this year in circulation terms all but two of them have increased their circulation in the first half, despite quite high price rises, for instance the york county newspaper, the weekly there, we have a daily but the weekly there went up by five p and the weekly in bath where again we have a daily that went up by six p. and every single westminster press centre has increased its market share. -turning to er books and starting with longman. -well there as i mentioned a staff reduction of a hundred and ninety two and significant er staff reduct er cost reduction in other, other areas we, we analyze every single er publishing unit and where the erm where they were marginally profitable or less than marginally profitable er we've taken appropriate action. -and as i mentioned earlier longman expect the cash flow this year to be better than last year despite the the reduction in profits. +turning to er books and starting with longman. +well there as i mentioned a staff reduction of a hundred and ninety two and significant er staff reduct er cost reduction in other, other areas we, we analyze every single er publishing unit and where the erm where they were marginally profitable or less than marginally profitable er we've taken appropriate action. +and as i mentioned earlier longman expect the cash flow this year to be better than last year despite the the reduction in profits. last year i told you alhambra er, was receiving the treatment. -this year it's on profit, on budget at the half-way stage and i expect it to be on budget by the end of the year. -we mentioned a small acquisition in japan last year,medi on the medical side of longman, p p s k k it cost us about four million pounds and we were reckoning on a profit of about half a million a year pleased to say that its er, its profit looks like getting to a million pounds by the year end. -and english language teaching at longman which is of course the biggest er biggest profit contributor erm their blueprint sale is expected to exceed nine hundred thousand this year. -addison wesley our american college publisher as michael mentioned th at the half-way stage their sales were eleven percent ahead of er, last year, and you may remember last year they had record sales and record profits and er they're forecasting er something like fourteen percent a head by the year end in sales terms and they are expecting to maintain their their margins and last year was a very good margin indeed. -once again there's been great emphasis on cash maintenance. -penguin the staff reduction there doesn't look particularly er high but then we were reducing staff there last year and we've er, we've disposed of smithmark and the travel guides er, the warehouse and distribution system is working very well and we've been adding distribu distribution clients there er the autumn list looks very strong indeed particularly in the u s especially and er, we've shipped er, over two million of stephen king's latest book and there's another one due in the autumn and we're expecting to ship about two and a half million of er of, of that one. -er in the u k we've held our market position and it's been a a pretty desperate market we were one of the few if not the only book seller who refused to er to yield better discount terms er, on the threat of er every, every book seller was every er publisher was threatened with erm not being stocked unless we gave bigger discounts. -we held our position against that and i'm pleased to say er, we will continue, we will continue to be stocked. -er our distribution system has got great press recently and it's regarded as one of the three best distribution systems in the u k. one of the things we're trying to do is to pay less for our books, it's very easy to pay very very fancy prices for, for er mid-range authors and for them not to earn out, so we're looking for much cheaper books. -a good example is dances with wolves which cost us four thousand as a and has already sold over a hundred and twenty thousand copies. -penguin continues to try and develop its merchandising and is quite successful and the latest success is to get the flower fairies adopted by marks and spencers for their sleepwear range which will also be marketed in the u s a as well. -federal and capital is a small er but high quality er new er newsletter business in the states and er it's done very well indeed to improve its profits. -on the entertainments side er, last year of course we had that one-off benefit with not having to absorb the first quarter's loss and this year the er first quarter was pretty disastrous because we had an er er an er amalgamation of, of a the gulf war b the recession and in london i r a bombing and that really stopped tourists coming to london from overseas and from the rest of the u k. but i'm pleased to say that er we, we're coming back very strongly and for instance in july at virtually all of our centres attendances were either up to last year very nearl very nearly up to last year or ahead of last year and er at chessington our revenue was thirteen and a half percent up on last year which i think justifies our investment there. -some of our competitors in the north have been er really struggling and erm offering four pounds off on a seven pound fifty entrance fee so bearing that in mind we're v v very confident that we've im improved our market share in that area too. -we opened our amsterdam, our new exhibition in amsterdam in june and er, up to now audiences have flocked there many weeks they've been thirty percent ahead of er ahead of budget. -moving on to b sky b well it's making excellent progress by the end of july we had over two point three million homes connected and over half of those are subscribing to one or two movie channels. -costs are well down and will continue to fall and i'm more confident than ever that we're on to a winner. -if we move to oil well our oil business obviously operates in a cycle different to our publishing businesses and er, at the end of the first half it had record sales and profits fifteen percent ahead in dollar terms ten percent ahead in, in sterling terms which may surprise you slightly, but i think james probably will talk about that later. +this year it's on profit, on budget at the half-way stage and i expect it to be on budget by the end of the year. +we mentioned a small acquisition in japan last year,medi on the medical side of longman, p p s k k it cost us about four million pounds and we were reckoning on a profit of about half a million a year pleased to say that its er, its profit looks like getting to a million pounds by the year end. +and english language teaching at longman which is of course the biggest er biggest profit contributor erm their blueprint sale is expected to exceed nine hundred thousand this year. +addison wesley our american college publisher as michael mentioned th at the half-way stage their sales were eleven percent ahead of er, last year, and you may remember last year they had record sales and record profits and er they're forecasting er something like fourteen percent a head by the year end in sales terms and they are expecting to maintain their their margins and last year was a very good margin indeed. +once again there's been great emphasis on cash maintenance. +penguin the staff reduction there doesn't look particularly er high but then we were reducing staff there last year and we've er, we've disposed of smithmark and the travel guides er, the warehouse and distribution system is working very well and we've been adding distribu distribution clients there er the autumn list looks very strong indeed particularly in the u s especially and er, we've shipped er, over two million of stephen king's latest book and there's another one due in the autumn and we're expecting to ship about two and a half million of er of, of that one. +er in the u k we've held our market position and it's been a a pretty desperate market we were one of the few if not the only book seller who refused to er to yield better discount terms er, on the threat of er every, every book seller was every er publisher was threatened with erm not being stocked unless we gave bigger discounts. +we held our position against that and i'm pleased to say er, we will continue, we will continue to be stocked. +er our distribution system has got great press recently and it's regarded as one of the three best distribution systems in the u k. one of the things we're trying to do is to pay less for our books, it's very easy to pay very very fancy prices for, for er mid-range authors and for them not to earn out, so we're looking for much cheaper books. +a good example is dances with wolves which cost us four thousand as a and has already sold over a hundred and twenty thousand copies. +penguin continues to try and develop its merchandising and is quite successful and the latest success is to get the flower fairies adopted by marks and spencers for their sleepwear range which will also be marketed in the u s a as well. +federal and capital is a small er but high quality er new er newsletter business in the states and er it's done very well indeed to improve its profits. +on the entertainments side er, last year of course we had that one-off benefit with not having to absorb the first quarter's loss and this year the er first quarter was pretty disastrous because we had an er er an er amalgamation of, of a the gulf war b the recession and in london i r a bombing and that really stopped tourists coming to london from overseas and from the rest of the u k. but i'm pleased to say that er we, we're coming back very strongly and for instance in july at virtually all of our centres attendances were either up to last year very nearl very nearly up to last year or ahead of last year and er at chessington our revenue was thirteen and a half percent up on last year which i think justifies our investment there. +some of our competitors in the north have been er really struggling and erm offering four pounds off on a seven pound fifty entrance fee so bearing that in mind we're v v very confident that we've im improved our market share in that area too. +we opened our amsterdam, our new exhibition in amsterdam in june and er, up to now audiences have flocked there many weeks they've been thirty percent ahead of er ahead of budget. +moving on to b sky b well it's making excellent progress by the end of july we had over two point three million homes connected and over half of those are subscribing to one or two movie channels. +costs are well down and will continue to fall and i'm more confident than ever that we're on to a winner. +if we move to oil well our oil business obviously operates in a cycle different to our publishing businesses and er, at the end of the first half it had record sales and profits fifteen percent ahead in dollar terms ten percent ahead in, in sterling terms which may surprise you slightly, but i think james probably will talk about that later. this is a particularly good performance, specially in the u s a where there's been a very serious downturn in natural gas. -we've increased our market shares virtually everywhere er two very strong er improvements venezuela and nigeria and the the initiative we've taken with the soviets to rework their wells er should be onstream by the end of the year and we're hoping that may lead to other opportunities er, both in russia and er and there's the possibility from that of some business in eastern europe as well. -investment banking although this year it's a very different difficult environment for investment banking particularly a house that concentrates on, on corporate finance er there hasn't been a great deal of m and a activity and if, if there has it hasn't been a very high erm very high ticket. -er but there have been a lot of issues and we've done well in that field but of course it doesn't produce the same kind of fee income as the m and a activity. -lazzards new york managed to maintain their figures of last year in dollar terms and if we take the lazzard houses as a whole we're second only to goldman sachs now in the erm in the m and a table internationally and that's on the value of bids on which we've advised. -fine china we had a very poor first four months but then in may world sales were nine point nine percent ahead of last year and in the u s a over the last ten weeks we've actually been ahead of nineteen ninety. +we've increased our market shares virtually everywhere er two very strong er improvements venezuela and nigeria and the the initiative we've taken with the soviets to rework their wells er should be onstream by the end of the year and we're hoping that may lead to other opportunities er, both in russia and er and there's the possibility from that of some business in eastern europe as well. +investment banking although this year it's a very different difficult environment for investment banking particularly a house that concentrates on, on corporate finance er there hasn't been a great deal of m and a activity and if, if there has it hasn't been a very high erm very high ticket. +er but there have been a lot of issues and we've done well in that field but of course it doesn't produce the same kind of fee income as the m and a activity. +lazzards new york managed to maintain their figures of last year in dollar terms and if we take the lazzard houses as a whole we're second only to goldman sachs now in the erm in the m and a table internationally and that's on the value of bids on which we've advised. +fine china we had a very poor first four months but then in may world sales were nine point nine percent ahead of last year and in the u s a over the last ten weeks we've actually been ahead of nineteen ninety. one factor in this is our exporting the very successful bridal collection that we developed in the u k, we've exported that to canada and the u s and that's gone down very well indeed. -we've also had significant growth in our chain store business in this country we've signed a new two-year contract with air canada and we're much more optimistic about the rest of the year we've got orders, production and sales all nicely in equilibrium ready for the second half. -now i'll pass you to er james. -i'd just like to make two or three points first of all the exchange factor which frank touched upon when, when talking about profits you probably all totally familiar but i have forgotten quite how much the dollar has strengthened recently beginning of the year it was nearly two dollars and the result of that is that for the erm first half as a whole the impact of er exchange translation was adverse for our profits compared with last year to the tune of about one and a half million pounds. -it's not enormous but it's perhaps er not the way people er were thinking. -now the consequence of the fact that the dollar end of june er relatively strong at around one sixty of course did impinge on er our er borrowings since we do have a considerable percentage of our gross in dollar terms and if we turn to the next slide er we can see er the summary of the balance sheet at thirtieth of june. -now you'll be familiar with the fact since we went through it in april that there has been a sharp jump in our known assets brought about by the sale of elsivir and the fact that it had a very substantially written down value in our books, seventy five million pounds. -so you've had a sharp increase in our shareholders' funds during the six months and a reduction in our net debt which may not be quite as er substantial as you expected but it is the combination of on the one hand the proceeds of elsivir less some reinvestment which frank mentioned, we put a little more money in b s b and the minority interests and we do have traditionally in the first half an adverse net movement of funds from operation about ninety five million and then we had thirty two million odd er of simply revaluation as a result of translating our dollar debt at er the one sixty as opposed to the year ending rate. -so net debt is two sixty four million er and therefore the pro forma debt equity ratio's halved from fifty seven percent to twenty eight percent we do of course expect it to be somewhat lower by the year end as our working capital which is coming to its peak season, unwinds. -i'd like to go into a little more the composition of the net debt which again is something that er interests some of you we have er a reduction both on gross debt and equally an increase in cash as you would expect as a result of the elsivir sale the increases are not fixed debt fixed term fixed rate debt is a function again of the exchange rate we haven't in issued any more the whole of the reduction of debt therefore is confined to our floating rate or variable debt and that amount's ready to the repayment of the gilder drawings we had under our to hedge or partially to hedge our holding in elsivir we have increased our cash holdings and they remain concentrated in sterling as part of our sterling er asset er portfolio which is managed from millbank and which we regard as our investable funds as and when needed. - +we've also had significant growth in our chain store business in this country we've signed a new two-year contract with air canada and we're much more optimistic about the rest of the year we've got orders, production and sales all nicely in equilibrium ready for the second half. +now i'll pass you to er james. +i'd just like to make two or three points first of all the exchange factor which frank touched upon when, when talking about profits you probably all totally familiar but i have forgotten quite how much the dollar has strengthened recently beginning of the year it was nearly two dollars and the result of that is that for the erm first half as a whole the impact of er exchange translation was adverse for our profits compared with last year to the tune of about one and a half million pounds. +it's not enormous but it's perhaps er not the way people er were thinking. +now the consequence of the fact that the dollar end of june er relatively strong at around one sixty of course did impinge on er our er borrowings since we do have a considerable percentage of our gross in dollar terms and if we turn to the next slide er we can see er the summary of the balance sheet at thirtieth of june. +now you'll be familiar with the fact since we went through it in april that there has been a sharp jump in our known assets brought about by the sale of elsivir and the fact that it had a very substantially written down value in our books, seventy five million pounds. +so you've had a sharp increase in our shareholders' funds during the six months and a reduction in our net debt which may not be quite as er substantial as you expected but it is the combination of on the one hand the proceeds of elsivir less some reinvestment which frank mentioned, we put a little more money in b s b and the minority interests and we do have traditionally in the first half an adverse net movement of funds from operation about ninety five million and then we had thirty two million odd er of simply revaluation as a result of translating our dollar debt at er the one sixty as opposed to the year ending rate. +so net debt is two sixty four million er and therefore the pro forma debt equity ratio's halved from fifty seven percent to twenty eight percent we do of course expect it to be somewhat lower by the year end as our working capital which is coming to its peak season, unwinds. +i'd like to go into a little more the composition of the net debt which again is something that er interests some of you we have er a reduction both on gross debt and equally an increase in cash as you would expect as a result of the elsivir sale the increases are not fixed debt fixed term fixed rate debt is a function again of the exchange rate we haven't in issued any more the whole of the reduction of debt therefore is confined to our floating rate or variable debt and that amount's ready to the repayment of the gilder drawings we had under our to hedge or partially to hedge our holding in elsivir we have increased our cash holdings and they remain concentrated in sterling as part of our sterling er asset er portfolio which is managed from millbank and which we regard as our investable funds as and when needed. the child victims of war. images that are now a daily occurrence in dozens of countries across the world. millions of young lives have now been devastated. @@ -41922,58 +41883,58 @@ bill hamilton, b b c news. can anybody fail, fail to be moved by those pictures. children really are under fire throughout the world, literally and metaphorically. even in those countries where the, the real firing has stopped, there's the aftermath. -many of the wars, most of the wars, are civil wars and you know the bitterness, the lingering bitterness after a civil war doesn't help the children who have suffered from that war. +many of the wars, most of the wars, are civil wars and you know the bitterness, the lingering bitterness after a civil war doesn't help the children who have suffered from that war. also just think of the troubles in our own northern ireland, right on our doorstep. think of the problems that children have there. -but even where there is no real warfare, man's inhumanity to children has caused serious deprivations of rights and of benefits generally. -food, health support, education, kindness,care, affection. -these are all features of a child's life that they need. -otherwise children, without those, grow up physically,psychologically damaged and the purpose of save the children fund is to work to give children the chance of a better childhood and the chance to grow up to be adults who won't repeat the sins of their forefathers. +but even where there is no real warfare, man's inhumanity to children has caused serious deprivations of rights and of benefits generally. +food, health support, education, kindness,care, affection. +these are all features of a child's life that they need. +otherwise children, without those, grow up physically,psychologically damaged and the purpose of save the children fund is to work to give children the chance of a better childhood and the chance to grow up to be adults who won't repeat the sins of their forefathers. your royal highness, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to this annual public meeting in this, our seventy forth anniversary year. -some of you er may take it amiss if i were to describe you as veterans but my by contrast, this is my first annual public meeting and not just as chairman. +some of you er may take it amiss if i were to describe you as veterans but my by contrast, this is my first annual public meeting and not just as chairman. i've never had the opportunity to attend one before. although i have been a long time supporter. -today, her royal highness nick hinton and his team will talk about the very impressive work and the tasks that lie ahead in the fifty countries and the u k in which save the children operates. +today, her royal highness nick hinton and his team will talk about the very impressive work and the tasks that lie ahead in the fifty countries and the u k in which save the children operates. i i will talk about the fund as i found it in my capacity as a very recent chairman. a fresh pair of eyes. -a fresh pair of eyes of a relative new boy and the first thing i noticed was my family's reaction. +a fresh pair of eyes of a relative new boy and the first thing i noticed was my family's reaction. it was as though they were saying to me, at last you're doing something worthwhile and respectable. -my first impression was how well everything runs and in saying that i really am paying a tribute to previous chairmen. -for whose efforts on behalf of the fund i i really do thank them and i'd like to make a special thanks to lady chandler, lucy stepped into the breach as acting chair about a year ago and since i was elected has done a tremendous amount to help me settle in quickly and i hope effectively. +my first impression was how well everything runs and in saying that i really am paying a tribute to previous chairmen. +for whose efforts on behalf of the fund i i really do thank them and i'd like to make a special thanks to lady chandler, lucy stepped into the breach as acting chair about a year ago and since i was elected has done a tremendous amount to help me settle in quickly and i hope effectively. i'm most impressed also with the hard work, the dedication and the, the sheer efficiency of the director general and his top team. -i was talking, yesterday as it happened, to the chairman of another very large children's charity and i asked him how his, the spend, the annual spend of that charity was distributed between the work of the charity, the purpose of the charity and the support functions and he said about eighty twenty. -now i have to tell you that last year we raised a hundred and thirteen million pounds and of that over ninety per cent, that's a hundred and four million pounds were actually spent on projects for children and i'm very proud of that ratio indeed and i think it ought to give you, the raisers of money, a great deal of comfort because for a fund with two headquarters buildings which operates all over the world this is a distribution of funds of which to be proud. -now i've met not many yet, but very impressive, a few very impressive field workers. -i've not had a chance to visit abroad yet but i think i've got two visits booked next year to various remoter parts of the world, but i've met some who are on leave, recuperating from the circumstances they've been in, sometimes illness, sometimes just the sheer tension of being under fire. +i was talking, yesterday as it happened, to the chairman of another very large children's charity and i asked him how his, the spend, the annual spend of that charity was distributed between the work of the charity, the purpose of the charity and the support functions and he said about eighty twenty. +now i have to tell you that last year we raised a hundred and thirteen million pounds and of that over ninety per cent, that's a hundred and four million pounds were actually spent on projects for children and i'm very proud of that ratio indeed and i think it ought to give you, the raisers of money, a great deal of comfort because for a fund with two headquarters buildings which operates all over the world this is a distribution of funds of which to be proud. +now i've met not many yet, but very impressive, a few very impressive field workers. +i've not had a chance to visit abroad yet but i think i've got two visits booked next year to various remoter parts of the world, but i've met some who are on leave, recuperating from the circumstances they've been in, sometimes illness, sometimes just the sheer tension of being under fire. each country presents its challenges, some physically demanding, others morale sapping, there is disease, there are primitive conditions in which to live and work. i'd just like to mention one, somalia. i'd like to pay a tribute to the courage of our people there, both the indigenous er workers for the fund and the ex-pats who've gone out there to lead that work. we're in touch with them every day, they refuse to leave and we're very grateful to them for their efforts. -but those in the field, the front line could not continue without the less than glamorous work that has to be carried out back here in h q. they also serve, who work in our offices, collect our money, keep our accounts make sure the administration is working well. +but those in the field, the front line could not continue without the less than glamorous work that has to be carried out back here in h q. they also serve, who work in our offices, collect our money, keep our accounts make sure the administration is working well. produce the educational material which is superb. and i visited both offices and i'm most impressed by the cheerful dedication and sheer hard work and efficiency of the people i've met. -but the people i want to thank most are you the volunteers. +but the people i want to thank most are you the volunteers. people without whom we wouldn't be able to raise so much money. it's your tireless efforts as fund raisers that enable save the children fund to survive. -if children are to be helped in the u k and throughout the world then we all have to succeed in persuading people to donate. -those who work in our shops, those who arrange events, those who collect great and small sums of money from companies and from individuals, are all playing a vital part in the continuing work of save the children fund. -i think we call er the volunteers, or those who run the shops anyway, sally's army and that is in my way a tribute to sally barker who's chairman of our branches advisory committee and does so much to make sure that the money does get raised in the field. +if children are to be helped in the u k and throughout the world then we all have to succeed in persuading people to donate. +those who work in our shops, those who arrange events, those who collect great and small sums of money from companies and from individuals, are all playing a vital part in the continuing work of save the children fund. +i think we call er the volunteers, or those who run the shops anyway, sally's army and that is in my way a tribute to sally barker who's chairman of our branches advisory committee and does so much to make sure that the money does get raised in the field. it's a chairman's very pleasant duty to thank you all. -as you will know we're given large sums of money by governments, the e e c and others, to work in countries in need, to tackle specific tasks. -but the money that comes in that way never fully covers the expenses involved in supporting our efforts in those countries. -the money you raise therefore is extremely important in enabling the s c f to tackle major, major tasks. -without that money we would not carry on and we could not carry out our work effectively. +as you will know we're given large sums of money by governments, the e e c and others, to work in countries in need, to tackle specific tasks. +but the money that comes in that way never fully covers the expenses involved in supporting our efforts in those countries. +the money you raise therefore is extremely important in enabling the s c f to tackle major, major tasks. +without that money we would not carry on and we could not carry out our work effectively. i therefore am thanking you not, not just as a courtesy but in order to convey just how important your efforts are and just how important the seventy fifth birthday appeal is going to be next year. if that succeeds we really will be able to maintain the momentum of the fund and the work that it does throughout the world. -if we don't raise our targets, we shall stumble but i'm absolutely confident from all the news that comes in from the field, that we shall raise our targets. -i know that plans are well advanced throughout the country for a massive collecting effort next year and i want to wish all of you involved all the very best in your efforts as we approach these days, that's to say donation days, in the coming year. -i'm sure your spirits will rise to the occasion like the balloons in our logos and the banners at the side here. -rise to the occasion. -but i cannot finish er without also thanking most warmly, our supreme supporter in the task of fund raising, her royal highness. +if we don't raise our targets, we shall stumble but i'm absolutely confident from all the news that comes in from the field, that we shall raise our targets. +i know that plans are well advanced throughout the country for a massive collecting effort next year and i want to wish all of you involved all the very best in your efforts as we approach these days, that's to say donation days, in the coming year. +i'm sure your spirits will rise to the occasion like the balloons in our logos and the banners at the side here. +rise to the occasion. +but i cannot finish er without also thanking most warmly, our supreme supporter in the task of fund raising, her royal highness. i know you will agree with me, that her example is inspiring to us all. save the children fund and children throughout the world have every reason to be grateful for her unstinting efforts. it's not often a chairman has the chance to thank her royal highness publicly and i do so with pleasure now. -and now to illustrate aspects of save the children's fund and its long term health work, here now is a short video shot on location in lesotho in southern africa and in pennywell in sunderland. +and now to illustrate aspects of save the children's fund and its long term health work, here now is a short video shot on location in lesotho in southern africa and in pennywell in sunderland. thank you. save the children's work is not just about dealing with emergency situations. it is mainly concerned with long term development. @@ -41983,19 +41944,19 @@ contaminated water kills more people than any poison. nine thousand children a day die from one of six preventable diseases around the world. to combat these problems needs a concerted and effective approach. lesotho is one of eight countries across the globe in which save the children has introduced the riders for health project, working with the ministry of health, a successful programme has been developed which provides primary health care to almost five times as many villages that could have been reached on foot. -the save the children fund programme with the motorcycles has made a very big difference to the number of visits that health assistants can make to villages. +the save the children fund programme with the motorcycles has made a very big difference to the number of visits that health assistants can make to villages. before they had the motorcycles they had to walk which meant a lot of travelling time and then less time at the, each village when they arrived. -now with the motorcycles they spend less time travelling and they can spend more time in the villages doing their educational and health work. -we found that the number of visits that on average that they can do has increased by four or five hundred per cent. +now with the motorcycles they spend less time travelling and they can spend more time in the villages doing their educational and health work. +we found that the number of visits that on average that they can do has increased by four or five hundred per cent. in fact they couldn't really do their job without the motorcycles. previous attempts to start the project before nineteen ninety had failed because of poor maintenance to the bikes, and accidents. by introducing specialist training and good management the bikes have been used extensively. -that's good well forwards excellent, well done, very good. +that's good well forwards excellent, well done, very good. the learning process from this project has been invaluable and it's allowed save the children to move forward in several other countries. recent research into how governments and donors contribute to the provision of health services shows that effective long term systems need to be put into place. these can be worked through with local cooperation. riders for health is a good example of what can be achieved through good planning. -i think that the riders for health project has given us ah a model that can be used in a great many other situations and we've found here in lesotho that many other ministries and government departments are interested in what we're doing because the motorcycles, if used properly, can provide a very cost effective form of transport. +i think that the riders for health project has given us ah a model that can be used in a great many other situations and we've found here in lesotho that many other ministries and government departments are interested in what we're doing because the motorcycles, if used properly, can provide a very cost effective form of transport. it is their work in the villages which is most impressive. the local health workers are able to spread basic advice on health and cleanliness as well as providing cheap but effective medicine such as immunisations and rehydration salts. most importantly the workers help to improve the local water supply. @@ -42012,24 +41973,24 @@ pennywell is a housing estate in sunderland where one in three adult males are u health is a big issue here. sunderland has the fourth highest number of smoking related deaths in the u k. low birth weights are more common. well obviously unemployment is very high in the north east and er all the major health indicators are related directly to income. -so consequently er poor poor people live shorter lives and they suffer more chronic illnesses. +so consequently er poor poor people live shorter lives and they suffer more chronic illnesses. and this is also er true of the children. twins rachel and rebecca, seen here at just over a year old, live on the estate with their mother carol. when the twins learned to climb up the stairs, carol was terrified they might have an accident. she probably could never have afforded a stairgate, so save the children lent her the equipment from its safety loan scheme. -the safety gates have made a big difference, since i've gotten them erm i've got peace of mind for the stairs and i can answer the phone and i haven't got to like keep trying to pull them downstairs and do do different things. +the safety gates have made a big difference, since i've gotten them erm i've got peace of mind for the stairs and i can answer the phone and i haven't got to like keep trying to pull them downstairs and do do different things. the family centre provides a place for people to get practical help and advice with their problems within walking distance. -save the children have developed in this area. -i mean before they came to the centre i think people felt save the children only did work in countries abroad. -makes us all realise what a good job save the children do in our country as well. +save the children have developed in this area. +i mean before they came to the centre i think people felt save the children only did work in countries abroad. +makes us all realise what a good job save the children do in our country as well. whether it's the u k or africa, simple and appropriate solutions with the cooperation of local communities can have the most dramatic effects in improving the lives of our children. it is in these areas that save the children has consistently moved forward through developing long term strategies which are being added to and developed year after year. your royal highness, ladies and gentlemen, good morning. i am michael taylor and i'm the director of the united kingdom and european programmes department of the save the children fund. what we've just seen conjures up for me some positive messages of direct impact upon children and young people's lives through our work in this country and overseas. this is very much my experience of this organisation in the eight months i've worked here. -prior to coming to save the children through the media, i was more aware of your work, the emergency work all over the world. -as director of social services for the london borough of hillingdon i knew of the work with refugees in my role in hillingdon i was responsible for services for child arrivals at heathrow airport and i worked closely with save the children on the successful effort to get specific recognition for asylum seeking children in the asylum and immigration appeals act. +prior to coming to save the children through the media, i was more aware of your work, the emergency work all over the world. +as director of social services for the london borough of hillingdon i knew of the work with refugees in my role in hillingdon i was responsible for services for child arrivals at heathrow airport and i worked closely with save the children on the successful effort to get specific recognition for asylum seeking children in the asylum and immigration appeals act. what i didn't know was of the ninety-plus pieces of work, both large and small, which save the children undertook in the united kingdom. i believe an important issue for all of us in the run up to and throughout the seventy fifth birthday, is the need to increase the understanding and raise the profile and the value placed upon our work in the united kingdom. i feel we will've achieved significant progress if we have turned, i didn't know you worked in the united kingdom, into it's good to know that the rights and needs of children are just as important to you in the united kingdom as they are overseas. @@ -42043,33 +42004,33 @@ this will be done in partnership at all times with the in country non-gav non-go the massive changes brought about by the ending of the cold war and by the collapse of state mechanism in some eastern european countries opens up a significant opportunity to undertake work in the very near future. save the children fund has been involved already directly in partnership and with other international save the children members in providing direct and emergency aid to former yugoslavia. however i think it's important to stress that right from the early days of the conflict we had determined not to be involved in providing large scale emergency relief. -this was primarily due to a concern that given commitments elsewhere, we did not have the logistical support and any activity in former yugoslavia would mean a major diversion from a already established programmes overseas. -however this summer a temporary programme coordinator has visited the region and a short term programme of material support to children's homes has been provided and we are now working to put other facilities in s to institutions in serbia and are hoping that through the restructuring of children's services, when the conflict is over and we believe obviously that may be some off, that we can tri can contribute to meeting the longer term needs of children in that war torn zone. +this was primarily due to a concern that given commitments elsewhere, we did not have the logistical support and any activity in former yugoslavia would mean a major diversion from a already established programmes overseas. +however this summer a temporary programme coordinator has visited the region and a short term programme of material support to children's homes has been provided and we are now working to put other facilities in s to institutions in serbia and are hoping that through the restructuring of children's services, when the conflict is over and we believe obviously that may be some off, that we can tri can contribute to meeting the longer term needs of children in that war torn zone. in slovenia a psychiatrist has been advising staff in refugee camps as to how to respond to the needs of traumatised children. in croatia we are supporting an agency which provides direct assistance to refugee families and to young people. this work in former yugoslavia will become an established part of our european programme. -in romania we are planning to work with romanian save the children and to help the romanian government in its juvenile justice system which is sadly in need of major development and change. +in romania we are planning to work with romanian save the children and to help the romanian government in its juvenile justice system which is sadly in need of major development and change. we're also engaged with the european community in discussion over a bid for funding to develop social work, child protection and alternatives to institutional care and to other child care systems within romania. this work again will be undertaken in partnership with non-governmental child care organisations in that country. through g contacts already established throughout the u k department, links have been d=established and developed with work in poland,russia and albania and we're working to assess the policy, practice development or programme contribution we might make in those european countries. i believe our credibility and our strength in these new initiatives in europe flow from our status as an international development agency and from our high quality work in projects in the united kingdom. i'd now like you to hear directly from a young person for whom access to one of our projects in the united kingdom has made major changes in her life. -to caroline home is a room for her possessions, abandoned by her mum and dad as a baby, she spent her life moving from one set of parents to another. +to caroline home is a room for her possessions, abandoned by her mum and dad as a baby, she spent her life moving from one set of parents to another. when you haven't got no one, you have to, sort of like find a way of doing it for yourself and it's much harder. today caroline lives alone in a room in oxford. without family guidance she sometimes finds it hard to manage, especially money. while some of her friends have taken drugs, caroline's been in trouble with the police for stealing from shops. in the beginning i did it to look good, cos i wanted the money, towards the end it was doing it to live, it was literally doing it to live. i hated doing it. -i used to go into a shop and i'd shake and i'd know that i was doing wrong and i'd be really scared and i'd just knew i don't want to go to prison so i decide to stop it. +i used to go into a shop and i'd shake and i'd know that i was doing wrong and i'd be really scared and i'd just knew i don't want to go to prison so i decide to stop it. now when she needs a hand, caroline turns to life chance. a partnership between save the children, social and youth services it helps youngsters help themselves by turning moans into action. really we're trying to give young people a voice, put them in the driving seat. gradually it sort of like brings people out of themselves and do you know what i mean, they learn to do things. whilst as a worker i might see the process, to me very important, i think there's a lot of concrete outcomes for young people feel we have achieved this, we did this for ourselves, it's ours, we own it. you've gone and achieved something, you feel like you've done something good, you feel like you're somebody. -this is when i was pregnant went to put my name down on the housing list and they said to me sorry you can't we've got too many people on there already. -life chance workers hope this can homeless teenagers who will be the next to benefit from the project. +this is when i was pregnant went to put my name down on the housing list and they said to me sorry you can't we've got too many people on there already. +life chance workers hope this can homeless teenagers who will be the next to benefit from the project. building up trust and friendship takes time but for hundreds makes life chance a lifeline. i think that caroline's experience as portrayed in that video is not unusual. many children and young people get caught up in crime. @@ -42080,16 +42041,16 @@ many people say that the solution is to take the young person who has committed save the children fund's years of experience shows it doesn't work and indeed that form of incarceration can lead to some of the tragic circumstances of self image, damage and even death which have occurred in penal institutions and been reported recently. we've also we believe got concrete evidence to show that community based alternatives do work. at scone park in the north east of england we offer classes in motorbike maintenance and land conservation to young people. -they build on young people's skills and confidence so they feel that they have something to offer to the world and to their own community. +they build on young people's skills and confidence so they feel that they have something to offer to the world and to their own community. latest figures show an overall twenty seven per cent decrease in crimes reported in that area since the project began. because of our experience at scone park and in many other projects in the twelve years we have been working with young offenders, we, along with the other children's charities, oppose the government's proposals on persistent young offenders. kenneth clarke, when home secretary, announced the establishment of secure training centres where young people aged up to fifteen years could be sentenced for a period of up to two years. we took the view that this was a misplaced use, both of the finances required as it would divert money away from community provision, but also that there were no success criteria guaranteed other than removal from community. the children engaged in crime often come from families where there is high unemployment already and where the prospects of employment are actually denied school leavers. -they're children and young people with a very poor self image and where their investment in the education system has probably been partial to say the least. +they're children and young people with a very poor self image and where their investment in the education system has probably been partial to say the least. there is little out of school provision and where the youth service is actually suffering savage cuts in terms of local government finance. projects such as scone park have shown that there can be alternative provision and that you can meet the needs of children and young people and respond to those in their own community and develop the investment in that community. -in taking this view we are not denying that the loss of liberty may actually be necessary in a few extreme cases and this should only be where the child presents a significant danger to him or herself or where there is a significant risk of major further offending and severe damage to community. +in taking this view we are not denying that the loss of liberty may actually be necessary in a few extreme cases and this should only be where the child presents a significant danger to him or herself or where there is a significant risk of major further offending and severe damage to community. these incidences are very rare and actually disposals through the courts do exist using the care facilities which are already available to the local authorities and the secure accommodation. we know that custody does not stop young people committing crimes when their sentence is over. seventy five per cent of young people released from custody re-offend within two years. @@ -42103,28 +42064,28 @@ recently government ministers and the media have tended to concentrate on the sm in fact, according to government statistics, only two per cent of lone parents are aged under twenty. the majority of lone parents are older, divorced, separated or widowed women. in reading the media recently one would believe that those figures were actually reversed. -housing policy in this country has traditionally given priority to children's needs and we would find it very worrying if that priority were eroded in any way by the introductions of policies aiming to discriminate against children in one setting i.e. children of lone parent families. +housing policy in this country has traditionally given priority to children's needs and we would find it very worrying if that priority were eroded in any way by the introductions of policies aiming to discriminate against children in one setting i.e. children of lone parent families. a recent report by the institute of housing managers confirmed that no specific priority is given in the analysis of housing need an and the awarding of points by which housing is allocated. but again the suggestion through the media would be that in order to gain top priority you need to be a young single parent with at least one child. we consider that punitive policies such as cutting benefit payments or not providing adequate housing for lone parents or their children, would immediately damage the health and well being of children and we consider that that in itself is contrary to the u n convention on the rights of the child. -we will continue to encourage government to take positive steps to improve the situation of families in poverty, like providing better child care and better support services to families and maintaining and improving benefits at a level which actually ensure economic stability and guaranteeing that housing, safe and proper housing, is available for all children in our society. -our experience at our projects demonstrates that given the opportunity, lone parents, like any parents, want to improve the situation of their children by by working and by not being dependent upon benefits. +we will continue to encourage government to take positive steps to improve the situation of families in poverty, like providing better child care and better support services to families and maintaining and improving benefits at a level which actually ensure economic stability and guaranteeing that housing, safe and proper housing, is available for all children in our society. +our experience at our projects demonstrates that given the opportunity, lone parents, like any parents, want to improve the situation of their children by by working and by not being dependent upon benefits. at the pattmore project in london and the rosemount project in glasgow for example, mothers are provided with adequate child care and it enables them to attend courses and gain skills and qualifications that give them a better chance in the job market. the very positive self image, the change during the first week, that single parents experience those courses is absolutely striking. we believe that the children of all lone parents can best be helped by po policies which support their commitment to their family and their children and pathways out of poverty should be built which ensure that all families living in poverty have the chance to change their situation. like your chairman, i am a newcomer to the fund and my induction experience has not been limited to the division offices in the united kingdom or visiting projects in the united kingdom. in july of this year, along with the overseas director mike arrinson, i spent seven days in bangladesh. -we visited both city and rural programmes and were struck by the amazing capacity of the people to overcome adversity, both natural disasters and the extremes of poverty. -the desire in all the work which we saw there was to extend to develop and to move ahead with new ideas to meet needs. +we visited both city and rural programmes and were struck by the amazing capacity of the people to overcome adversity, both natural disasters and the extremes of poverty. +the desire in all the work which we saw there was to extend to develop and to move ahead with new ideas to meet needs. the video which follows now portrays some of our work in bangladesh and i'll provide the commentary upon it. khulna is a large industrial city in south western bangladesh. it attracts many migrant families from the surrounding rural areas and as such is similar to many of the cities in bangladesh. people flood to the city seeking employment, seeking security and actually trying to find a means of sustaining family life. -many seek employment in matchbox manufacture, in working with textiles in stone breaking,in ship building, metal working and in paper manufacture. +many seek employment in matchbox manufacture, in working with textiles in stone breaking,in ship building, metal working and in paper manufacture. the slums people live in have open sewers, amazingly crowded housing, poor sanitation and ineffective drainage. eight hundred to a thousand people will live in a dense area and are subject to the vagaries of government and landlords. slums are bulldozed overnight on occasions to make way for new developments. -these people live amongst the wealthier residential areas in all of the cities of bangladesh. +these people live amongst the wealthier residential areas in all of the cities of bangladesh. the seasonal rains bring a deterioration in the living conditions and without effective drainage sewage overflows into the homes. children are more prone to disease. these were the conditions in the slums which we visited in dacca. @@ -42145,55 +42106,55 @@ women are now participating in credit saving schemes organised through save the in groups of five they each save weekly after which one of their number can take a loan and invest in an income generating project. each group opens their own joint bank account,manages their own money,does some basic budget planning and learns to fill out the forms and paperwork necessary to record all the transactions and keep track of the state of the fund and their management of it. we saw numerous examples where people bought equipment. -for example amina has bought a sewing machine. +for example amina has bought a sewing machine. this will give her financial independence and a steady income. she has repaid the debt and now has sufficient money on which to live. -rebaya and her daughter purchased the materials necessary to men to make incense sticks and again have achieved a degree of financial independence which six months before could not have been expected. +rebaya and her daughter purchased the materials necessary to men to make incense sticks and again have achieved a degree of financial independence which six months before could not have been expected. some people use the money to buy fishing nets. our integrated health programme has provided a catalyst for slum families to have a hand in controlling their environment and working together to benefit each other. free of money lenders and learning to save and contribute financially to their own programme is an important step towards long term self sustainability. thank you. thank you very much indeed mike for that excellent presentation. -and now i would like to ask her royal highness to come to the platform and address us. +and now i would like to ask her royal highness to come to the platform and address us. thank you very much ma'am. chairman, ladies and gentlemen. -well i'm delighted to see so many of you have taken the trouble to come and join us today for yet another annual public meeting and in welcoming you can i give a particular welcome to our new chairman mike betts, thank him very much indeed for joining us. -he has an excellent background in support,not involved in in the running but continuous interest and support and for him to take on this challenge shows a particular kind of commitment to the work of the save the children fund and we're very grateful to him for taking it on and i sincerely hope that he will enjoy the experience, especially after meeting all of you today. +well i'm delighted to see so many of you have taken the trouble to come and join us today for yet another annual public meeting and in welcoming you can i give a particular welcome to our new chairman mike betts, thank him very much indeed for joining us. +he has an excellent background in support,not involved in in the running but continuous interest and support and for him to take on this challenge shows a particular kind of commitment to the work of the save the children fund and we're very grateful to him for taking it on and i sincerely hope that he will enjoy the experience, especially after meeting all of you today. mike thank you for joining us. today is an important occasion for the fund. -it always is er a moment to reflect, to look forward to renew acquaintances, to recharge the batteries, to get new ideas and that's quite right and this public meeting marks the eve of a particularly important year for all of us at the save the children fund. +it always is er a moment to reflect, to look forward to renew acquaintances, to recharge the batteries, to get new ideas and that's quite right and this public meeting marks the eve of a particularly important year for all of us at the save the children fund. our seventy fifth birthday year. -i hope it will be a birthday year in in every way, er but it's not just a good excuse to have a party there is very serious intent behind this birthday. +i hope it will be a birthday year in in every way, er but it's not just a good excuse to have a party there is very serious intent behind this birthday. when eglantine jebb launched the save the children fund in may nineteen nineteen, one of her aims was for the fund to work for its own extinction. seventy five years on that day seems more distant than ever. -eglantine also said that children are always the first to suffer and that is certainly as true today as it was then which means that the save the children fund's work is needed now as much as it was then. -b but the funds to support this work are harder to come by and you don't need me to tell you that. -yet the need is such that our spending at home and overseas has doubled in the last two years and still vital pieces of work in the u k and overseas await funding. +eglantine also said that children are always the first to suffer and that is certainly as true today as it was then which means that the save the children fund's work is needed now as much as it was then. +b but the funds to support this work are harder to come by and you don't need me to tell you that. +yet the need is such that our spending at home and overseas has doubled in the last two years and still vital pieces of work in the u k and overseas await funding. the sad reality is that nearly seventy years after eglantine jebb drafted the world's first charter of children's rights, the charter which became the foundation for the nineteen eighty nine u n convention. -children's rights to health, to a good education, to safety, to a secure childhood are still threatened. +children's rights to health, to a good education, to safety, to a secure childhood are still threatened. in short children across, across the globe are facing pressures and conditions that are no longer considered acceptable to an international community that sees so much suffering around the world. they want to do something. i believe with our experience that the save the children fund can do something positive that will last. -we urgently need funds to be able to respond effectively and to meet the increased demands being made on us as well as to maintain our existing work. +we urgently need funds to be able to respond effectively and to meet the increased demands being made on us as well as to maintain our existing work. that's why save the children is marking this seventy fifth birthday year with the biggest and most important fund raising appeal in the organisation's history. our target is to raise, in cash and in pledges, an additional twenty five million pounds over and above our normal fundraising. but before i talk in more detail about how we hope to raise this money let me spend a little time explaining why i feel that this appeal is so vital to children everywhere. -i need hardly remind you of the many emergencies that save the children has responded to in recent years. +i need hardly remind you of the many emergencies that save the children has responded to in recent years. the most recent was for somalia, and you responded magnificently, helping to raise over five million pounds for relief work. but as you know the needs of the world's children go far beyond the immediate emergencies like those in somalia or liberia. the need for sustainable health, education and welfare services is as acute as ever. -children in the united kingdom face different sorts of problems but they too are under threat. -parents need help with their own lives so that their children don't suffer from the unemployment and homelessness that contribute to ill health and an unsafe living environment that too many children have to live with today. +children in the united kingdom face different sorts of problems but they too are under threat. +parents need help with their own lives so that their children don't suffer from the unemployment and homelessness that contribute to ill health and an unsafe living environment that too many children have to live with today. it is only by establishing and maintaining development programmes and by working in conjunction with families, with communities and with governments that we can begin to achieve lasting improvements which tackle the root causes of the poverty and inequality that threaten so many children. investing in human resources is a fundamental part of that process too. it helps to promote the political stability and economic growth that is an essential backdrop to any kind of lasting change. -but as you know the save the children is just one development organisation and with limited resources, so a major part of our task is to use our influence and authority to press for change on a wider scale by keeping the issues of poverty and inequality and of children firmly on the international agenda. -ladakh in north west india, very distant, remote, mountainous, a harsh environment for any child to grow up in. +but as you know the save the children is just one development organisation and with limited resources, so a major part of our task is to use our influence and authority to press for change on a wider scale by keeping the issues of poverty and inequality and of children firmly on the international agenda. +ladakh in north west india, very distant, remote, mountainous, a harsh environment for any child to grow up in. most villages are perched over ten thousand feet up in the himalayas. many can be reached only by walking, for several days along precarious footpaths and they may be cut off half the year by snow. in winter, the temperature can drop to minus forty degrees centigrade. -ladakhis live from farming and livestock rearing and believe me they know how to do this. -they know how to cope and they have very sophisticated forms of irrigation. +ladakhis live from farming and livestock rearing and believe me they know how to do this. +they know how to cope and they have very sophisticated forms of irrigation. but although they are largely self sufficient, needless to say livelihoods in these sort of conditions and communities are on a knife edge. the growing season is short and the tiny fields are extremely difficult to plough. for health and welfare most villages depend on village healers. @@ -42201,43 +42162,43 @@ but unless this is combined with techniques like vaccination and knowledge of or to net to get an education beyond primary level, children have to leave their village primary schools because the terms coincide with the peak agricultural seasons. save the children d went into ladakh fifteen years ago to provide emergency feeding for malnourished children. today that emergency programme has evolved into a broad based community programme, focusing on health, education and economic status and training of teachers and health workers. -to give ladakh's children a better start in life means supporting services that work in harmony with local structures and rhythms. +to give ladakh's children a better start in life means supporting services that work in harmony with local structures and rhythms. now there is primary health care for all mothers and children however remote their community. -families have become involved in income generating schemes and children have better access to education and in all these areas the villagers, particularly women, work closely with staff to play an active part in the development of their own community and the securing of their children's future. -now a glasgow inner city area migh may seem light years away from all this but in many ways the need is just as acute. +families have become involved in income generating schemes and children have better access to education and in all these areas the villagers, particularly women, work closely with staff to play an active part in the development of their own community and the securing of their children's future. +now a glasgow inner city area migh may seem light years away from all this but in many ways the need is just as acute. and they are still a community under pressure. royston in glasgow, where unemployment is high, the housing is high and poor and there are few safe areas and precious little childcare provision. many of the residents are single parents who often feel isolated and trapped and unable to improve their situation. -save the children's rosemount project which i visited in june is working with parents and children, providing quality child care with individual attention for each child and offering courses in computing and child care for women to improve their skills and equally important, their confidence. +save the children's rosemount project which i visited in june is working with parents and children, providing quality child care with individual attention for each child and offering courses in computing and child care for women to improve their skills and equally important, their confidence. in other words giving people the raw materials to improve their lives and safeguard their children's future. both of these interventions are successes in their own right. they apply to different communities, they have responded to different communities' needs but they also contribute to a ripple effect of achievement at national and international levels which will ultimately benefit the lives of many more children. they are setting standards of good practice that we in the save the children fund can then help to spread. -these children the world over need your continued help and that is what this birthday appeal is all about. +these children the world over need your continued help and that is what this birthday appeal is all about. with seventy five years of working with children under our belt and with our many achievements on behalf of children with pioneering schemes, we have the experience and the expertise to achieve real and lasting change. so where do we start with the mammoth task of raising an additional twenty five million pounds? i have little doubt that nineteen ninety four, ninety five will be a challenge, especially in today's economic climate. this is going to be a year when we will all have to go that extra mile for children. -but i'm afraid your reputation precedes you, you are renowned for rising to challenges like these and i feel sure that you can build on your previous successes and that together we can and probably will, do it. -i will be launching the birthday year in january when i hope that among other things, we might succeed in gaining recognition for eglantine jebb and our many achievements for children and i was delighted to be asked to chair the birthday advisory group and to be closely involved with activities during nineteen ninety four. +but i'm afraid your reputation precedes you, you are renowned for rising to challenges like these and i feel sure that you can build on your previous successes and that together we can and probably will, do it. +i will be launching the birthday year in january when i hope that among other things, we might succeed in gaining recognition for eglantine jebb and our many achievements for children and i was delighted to be asked to chair the birthday advisory group and to be closely involved with activities during nineteen ninety four. one of the activities we have great hopes for is our private appeal which will run alongside our public fundraising. -this is a first for the save the children and we will be approaching wealthy individuals, foundations and trusts for donations towards our work. +this is a first for the save the children and we will be approaching wealthy individuals, foundations and trusts for donations towards our work. that will not be easy because most of them are heavily involved in funding of all sorts of other organisations and they have their own interests. -we will have to be very sure that we know what we're talking about when we meet them to persuade them that we need their funds more and we can make better use of them and we hope to raise around half of that twenty five million pounds from them. +we will have to be very sure that we know what we're talking about when we meet them to persuade them that we need their funds more and we can make better use of them and we hope to raise around half of that twenty five million pounds from them. i'd like to take this opportunity to thank sir david scholey, the chairman of s g warburg for chairing the private appeal. sir david is a long term supporter of save the children and has sat for many years on the industry and commerce group. and i'd also like to extend my thanks to his very able committee. -our corporate members are ready but they very much need your help. +our corporate members are ready but they very much need your help. we are relying on you and all the other volunteers around the u k in your contacts with the public to help make this year a success. you are the public face of the save the children fund. the people who have carried the fund raising banner throughout the years. the people at the fund raising coal face who have the skills and the expertise to ensure that our seventy fifth birthday year goes down in save the children's fund raising history. this year though we want to attract new supporters and search out people who haven't traditionally supported save the children as well as building on the commitment of our existing supporters. -you are all familiar with our loyal supporters, but what about those people on the fringes who may have given a donation or done something for save the children in the past, but never really followed it up and there are the people who are interested who think, it's a charity i feel i ought to support. +you are all familiar with our loyal supporters, but what about those people on the fringes who may have given a donation or done something for save the children in the past, but never really followed it up and there are the people who are interested who think, it's a charity i feel i ought to support. let's see if we can move them on this year so that they start to think it's a charity i know i really want to support. what better time than a birthday year to persuade all these people to become active and long term supporters of the save the children. plans are well underway for next year. -i know that many of you have already come up with some interesting ideas on seventy fifth theme. +i know that many of you have already come up with some interesting ideas on seventy fifth theme. many branches have already scheduled a range of exciting events based on the birthday in addition to the events that will be happening nationwide. like the thousands of birthday parties that we hope will take place on may the nineteenth. there will be more on all these happenings later today. @@ -42245,90 +42206,90 @@ other fund raising plans are well advanced too. i'm delighted that our old friends at tesco, a founder corporate member of save the children, are once again lending their generous support. in nineteen ninety four they are making us their charity of the year and offering to work with us across the u k to help raise an extra million. i would also like to thank another of our corporate members, cadbury limited. -over the past eighteen months cadbury and save the children have worked very successfully together, staging three strollathons sponsoring nationwide pantomimes and running a promotion on chocolate bars. +over the past eighteen months cadbury and save the children have worked very successfully together, staging three strollathons sponsoring nationwide pantomimes and running a promotion on chocolate bars. i think that was probably the most popular. as our seventy fifth birthday approaches, cadbury hopes to stage more events and promotions to help us meet our seventy five million t pound target and meet our commitment to the world's children. -all in all it promises to be an exciting enjoyable and hard working year for save the children and all its supporters. +all in all it promises to be an exciting enjoyable and hard working year for save the children and all its supporters. it is going to be hard work. -nobody would pretend that raising an additional twenty five million pounds is going to be easy but time and again you have risen to the challenge. +nobody would pretend that raising an additional twenty five million pounds is going to be easy but time and again you have risen to the challenge. we must make very sure we know what we're doing it for. it will help to remind ourselves of the challenge that eglantine jebb took up. -her clear sighted approach to bring long lasting help to mothers and children, so that children could benefit, wherever they were whatever their country, their colour, their situation -urban or rural, their culture, their religion, their society in the sense of its development and their expectations and their infrastructure. +her clear sighted approach to bring long lasting help to mothers and children, so that children could benefit, wherever they were whatever their country, their colour, their situation -urban or rural, their culture, their religion, their society in the sense of its development and their expectations and their infrastructure. she was frustrated by short term palliatives. -when knowledge of basic principles might cure for future generations many diseases and even hunger and that education might set solid foundations for extending and repeating that knowledge, as well as the economic viability of the community and a sense of responsibility. +when knowledge of basic principles might cure for future generations many diseases and even hunger and that education might set solid foundations for extending and repeating that knowledge, as well as the economic viability of the community and a sense of responsibility. a sense of responsibility in the children that we help, that they all grow up to be responsible adults. in seventy five years the fund has remained true to her principles and yet it is as pioneering as she ever was. i hope she would be pleased by our efforts, in spite of the fact that we are still here and needed. i know she would be proud of you, the fund raisers, who make it possible. -as you set about making your plans for next year let me leave you with this thought from eglantine jebb if children of any country are physically or morally abandoned the whole world loses by it and the whole world gains if children grow up healthy, capable and ready to work for the good of their neighbours. +as you set about making your plans for next year let me leave you with this thought from eglantine jebb if children of any country are physically or morally abandoned the whole world loses by it and the whole world gains if children grow up healthy, capable and ready to work for the good of their neighbours. good luck. -thank you very much indeed for that superb key note address. +thank you very much indeed for that superb key note address. and now let us proceed with the next business of the day, it gives me great pleasure your royal highness to er invite you to present several save the children awards this morning. these awards are given in recognition of outstanding services to children. five people who've been nominated for awards are not available to receive them from her royal highness. -though absent they are ray , lee , kim , cho and marjorie . +though absent they are ray , lee , kim , cho and marjorie . congratulations to them all, they'll be receiving their awards in due course. we now -now for those who are present i will call out each name and if each one can come forward and receive the award from her royal highness. +now for those who are present i will call out each name and if each one can come forward and receive the award from her royal highness. joe lady sarah esther josephine anne dora jill -thank you award winners and thank you all for your contribution to save the children fund. -now i have some er parish notices for you all. -now there are imbit information stands on level five where several catering points are available for lunch and er members of the audience can also attend four fringe meetings. -these meetings are making the most of the seventy fifth in shops, involving young people in singing for the seventy fifth, branches sharing fund raising ideas for the seventy fifth and small world theatre extracts from moving, a play on the theme of refugees. +thank you award winners and thank you all for your contribution to save the children fund. +now i have some er parish notices for you all. +now there are imbit information stands on level five where several catering points are available for lunch and er members of the audience can also attend four fringe meetings. +these meetings are making the most of the seventy fifth in shops, involving young people in singing for the seventy fifth, branches sharing fund raising ideas for the seventy fifth and small world theatre extracts from moving, a play on the theme of refugees. now these are taking place between one and two this afternoon. -i should say that there are only seventy five seats available for each fringe meeting so if you want to go hurry on and get your tickets which will be issued at level three information desk on a first come, first served basis. +i should say that there are only seventy five seats available for each fringe meeting so if you want to go hurry on and get your tickets which will be issued at level three information desk on a first come, first served basis. a colour coded system will be in operation to help you find your way around those fringe meetings. now i just want to end this morning session by reminding you to be in your seats by two twenty. -we have a speaker er patricia routledge in her guise as mrs bucket or mrs bouquet she would not be very pleased if you were late. +we have a speaker er patricia routledge in her guise as mrs bucket or mrs bouquet she would not be very pleased if you were late. for one of her candle-lit after-lunch speeches. thank you very much for this morning, we'll see you this afternoon. -interesting as well as a er edible lunch er we're very pleased now to start away the afternoon session and i'm particularly pleased to be able to introduce patricia routledge, she's an actress with so many parts in so many media that i'm not going to make any further introduction, but merely to ask her to come up and speak to us. +interesting as well as a er edible lunch er we're very pleased now to start away the afternoon session and i'm particularly pleased to be able to introduce patricia routledge, she's an actress with so many parts in so many media that i'm not going to make any further introduction, but merely to ask her to come up and speak to us. when she has finished sally barker, branches advisory committee chairman, will make her presentation. thank you very much. your royal highness, ladies and gentlemen. it is a particular privilege for me to be here today and part of me feels not totally qualified. -i have over the years sent my postal order regularly and it wasn't until two years ago that i became more actively involved in the work of save the children fund raising. -i was invited to give an entertainment at the bristol old vic theatre, the wonderful old theatre royal, the oldest extant theatre still being used in the country and one of the oldest in the world, a very beautiful place erm and i was asked if i would do an entertainment that i have called come for the ride which i was persuaded to concoct by my home town of birkenhead in the north west of england. +i have over the years sent my postal order regularly and it wasn't until two years ago that i became more actively involved in the work of save the children fund raising. +i was invited to give an entertainment at the bristol old vic theatre, the wonderful old theatre royal, the oldest extant theatre still being used in the country and one of the oldest in the world, a very beautiful place erm and i was asked if i would do an entertainment that i have called come for the ride which i was persuaded to concoct by my home town of birkenhead in the north west of england. i did it there originally and then did it at festivals all over the country. i have a particular affection for bristol and the west country, i'd like you know that, those of you who've come all the way to london from the west and i so i was very happy to have this evening and be able with er an accompanist and musical director, to provide entertainment that would raise money. -i was told early on that it was possible that your royal highness would be able to be there and indeed you were and it gave us all one of the most unforgettable nights. -i remember after the show you spoke for twelve minutes without a note and not only that but you came round afterwards and spent eight or ten minutes with us, the artists, which absolutely made our evening. +i was told early on that it was possible that your royal highness would be able to be there and indeed you were and it gave us all one of the most unforgettable nights. +i remember after the show you spoke for twelve minutes without a note and not only that but you came round afterwards and spent eight or ten minutes with us, the artists, which absolutely made our evening. it seems to me that that attention to the moment is significant of the great work that you do for this particular charity. now i recently have accumulated unto myself, a notoriety that i didn't originally seek. -and certainly didn't expect but everywhere i go it comes at me. +and certainly didn't expect but everywhere i go it comes at me. it gives me great pleasure because people are extremely kind and extremely generous. we're very obsessed with things called viewing figures in television and i worked out quite simply that if everybody among the eleven million people who are supposed to view keeping up appearances every sunday, popped a penny into a money box for save the children fund one sunday night, that would raise a hundred and ten thousand pounds within an hour, now why don't we get going and encourage people to do that. -multiply that by seven and it's seven hundred and seventy thousand pounds. +multiply that by seven and it's seven hundred and seventy thousand pounds. what we are able to do in my job is to do what i was happy to do which is to give a performance in aid of a charity, one soon learns how to expend one's energy and in which direction to focus it. earlier this year, on april the twenty second,her royal highness, the princess royal, entertained various representatives from the world of entertainment and sport and journalism at buckingham palace. we had the most wonderful evening, it began with a film show, an extremely well er composed film to do with the work that is being done, the variety of work that is being done in the variety of places. -various reports a plea for support a plea for interest particularly for the seventy fifth anniversary year next year and after that we had the most lovely party. +various reports a plea for support a plea for interest particularly for the seventy fifth anniversary year next year and after that we had the most lovely party. i have a list here of people in my particular part of the profession who have pledged themselves to assist with the great drive forward for the seventy fifth anniversary. a number of celebrities were appearing in the cadbury's sponsored pantomimes around the country and supporting the save the children fund raising activities. these include lesley joseph, jeff capes, bobby davro, windsor davies, john nettles and gloria hunniford and ian botham. pam ferris from the darling buds of may is actively supporting the fund and will help with publiscation and er fund raising, publicising and fund raising in the birthday year. sandi toksvig, the comedy actress, has been advising on the seventy fifth birthday plans with television, book and consumer magazine support, she'll be visiting zimbabwe in october with a b b c television crew to film a documentary and will be visiting and filming save the children fund projects while she's there. -lulu ulrika johnson, tessa sanderson, debby mcgee and linda bellingham all lent their support to this year's cadbury's strollathon and we look forward to their continued support in our birthday year. +lulu ulrika johnson, tessa sanderson, debby mcgee and linda bellingham all lent their support to this year's cadbury's strollathon and we look forward to their continued support in our birthday year. next year i am going to be very active in the theatre and i've already this morning, sown the seed er for possibly er giving a particular performance er of one of the plays in this particular season i'm going to do er for save the children fund and i've said i've said move fast, get on with it. -william wordsworth nearly two hundred years ago, wrote this my heart leaps up when i behold a rainbow in the sky. -so it was when my life began so it is now that i am a man. +william wordsworth nearly two hundred years ago, wrote this my heart leaps up when i behold a rainbow in the sky. +so it was when my life began so it is now that i am a man. so be it when i shall grow old or let me die. the child is father of the man. -and that is what it seems to me is the purpose of all our support for this fund. +and that is what it seems to me is the purpose of all our support for this fund. i've been particularly impressed with the officials and executives and workers that i've met. i've been particularly impressed today to learn how people come here every year, particularly for this meeting and of all the various ways in which money can be raised. the money is there, we know this. -i always say that we all spend our money on what we really want to spend it on and put a bit by for what we really desire to achieve. +i always say that we all spend our money on what we really want to spend it on and put a bit by for what we really desire to achieve. it is wonderful all the work that you do. and i applaud and admire it. -i am here partly because i was fortunate enough to have the happiest and healthiest of childhoods and i see it as a very happy obligation to try to do my best to ensure that all over the world it is possible for other children to enjoy something of what i had. -god bless you all and i hope to be walking alongside you during the seventy fifth year anniversary efforts. +i am here partly because i was fortunate enough to have the happiest and healthiest of childhoods and i see it as a very happy obligation to try to do my best to ensure that all over the world it is possible for other children to enjoy something of what i had. +god bless you all and i hope to be walking alongside you during the seventy fifth year anniversary efforts. in sri lanka thousand of families have moved from the countryside to the capital colombo in search of a better life. instead they find nowhere to live, nothing to eat and poor health and education. save the children is helping families to rebuild the ghettos, to make a better life for themselves and the next generation. @@ -42340,36 +42301,35 @@ poor children in jamaica often fall prey to drugs dealers who offer them clothes save the children helps youngsters living and working on the streets, it runs schools where the poorest can get hot meals and lessons. just one more example of how save the children does just that all round the world. yes. -those are some of the reasons why i and many others support save the children and thank you patricia routledge for talking to us today, it was a pleasure listening to you. +those are some of the reasons why i and many others support save the children and thank you patricia routledge for talking to us today, it was a pleasure listening to you. hello everyone. once again it is lovely to see you all. well this is it, next year is our seventy fifth birthday so today is one of our most important meetings we will ever have. it'll be a very challenging year for volunteers, i'm sure you'll all agree. in the past year i've been invited by many of you to meet branch members and to make shop visits all over the united kingdom. -it's been a privilege to have done this and i'm overwhelmed by the enthusiasm i've encountered. +it's been a privilege to have done this and i'm overwhelmed by the enthusiasm i've encountered. you, save the children fund volunteers, are determined not to let the recession beat you. the message i've given to london is that volunteers are in very good heart and it doesn't stop there. the really good thing is that there are a huge variety of plans for our big year. more of that later. but what about the last twelve months. what stories do our figures tell us? -well while we were all delighted about the tremendous increase in income two years ago we were also a little concerned about how we should hold on to it, but we have. +well while we were all delighted about the tremendous increase in income two years ago we were also a little concerned about how we should hold on to it, but we have. last year branch income was on target at seven point eight million pounds, a massive increase on the plateau of five to five and half million pounds we were on before skip lunch. congratulations to you all. and the shops, well there are now one hundred and fifty nine shops. together they have raised five point seven million pounds last year, a wonderful result and thank you all. i particularly want to highlight the shop cash donations. -we've introduced a new donations box and some shops have special donations secretaries and many helpers encourage donations too. +we've introduced a new donations box and some shops have special donations secretaries and many helpers encourage donations too. what a success story. shop cash donations have gone up from five hundred and sixty three thousand to six hundred and twenty nine thousand, a marvellous increase. - hello sir. how you doing? not so good. what have you been up to then? oh i think my health's breaking up. -it's my ears and er my back. -i w i was in and seeing the doctor +it's my ears and er my back. +i w i was in and seeing the doctor mhm. and he's given me pills and that for it, but it's my ears . this is one that's been, i've had appointment and for three times i'd had to cancel it . @@ -42385,7 +42345,7 @@ is there? let's have another look at this. oh my. for goodness sake. -there's a wee man with a pick and shovel in +there's a wee man with a pick and shovel in oh aye. it's solid. is it? @@ -42410,13 +42370,13 @@ cos i've been trying and trying for ages to get that. no. it's the, it's absolutely solid. -the, the drops are not not doing anything. -seeing doctor the other week. +the, the drops are not not doing anything. +seeing doctor the other week. my back absolutely killing me. and i'm falling asleep every time i sit down. we'll need to do something about that. that's not right. -between that and my back and my knees it's +between that and my back and my knees it's . two drops of this aha. @@ -42440,273 +42400,272 @@ all. now then. thirty two grove. -grove . +grove . now is your insurance line due in about a fortnight ? aye. aye. right. -here we are then and they'll have to get that sorted for . +here we are then and they'll have to get that sorted for . great. thanks. okay. right. cheerio now. cheerio. - good evening ladies and gentleman. good evening, bert. -thanks for coming along tonight as you see we have our a g m tonight and er hope er to see a lot more faces here tonight +thanks for coming along tonight as you see we have our a g m tonight and er hope er to see a lot more faces here tonight his car broke down. -oh apologies from brian his car broke down. -oh well . +oh apologies from brian his car broke down. +oh well . jack should be here. -er brian w val anybody else? +er brian w val anybody else? i think people shy off the a g m,because they're frightened of getting jobs on the committee. -right then could we have the minutes from the previous a g m, please. -the minutes of the annual general meeting held at labour club on monday the seventh of december nineteen ninety two. -there were thirteen members present,in the chair apology er apologies from joe and emily and robert who were injured in a car crash on the way here. -minutes of the a g m on the second of december nineteen ninety one were read proposed jack and seconded that they be accepted. -all in favour there were none against and no abstentions. -matters arising there were no matters arising unusually. -secretary's report the secretary thanked joan and reg for the club during the year especially for donating items for the open show for the and christmas social. -it was a very hard job holding everything together and it required tremendous dedication from everyone concerned. -difficulties had arisen over the globe hotel in february last year and we have been forced to move yet again. -we were once more experiencing difficulties hopefully they would all be out before too long. -we hadn't managed to get any speakers this year but had all enjoyed the previous meeting in oc in october. -there had been a trip to yorkshire in april and another to the british aquarist festival in november, both of which had been enjoyed by all. +right then could we have the minutes from the previous a g m, please. +the minutes of the annual general meeting held at labour club on monday the seventh of december nineteen ninety two. +there were thirteen members present,in the chair apology er apologies from joe and emily and robert who were injured in a car crash on the way here. +minutes of the a g m on the second of december nineteen ninety one were read proposed jack and seconded that they be accepted. +all in favour there were none against and no abstentions. +matters arising there were no matters arising unusually. +secretary's report the secretary thanked joan and reg for the club during the year especially for donating items for the open show for the and christmas social. +it was a very hard job holding everything together and it required tremendous dedication from everyone concerned. +difficulties had arisen over the globe hotel in february last year and we have been forced to move yet again. +we were once more experiencing difficulties hopefully they would all be out before too long. +we hadn't managed to get any speakers this year but had all enjoyed the previous meeting in oc in october. +there had been a trip to yorkshire in april and another to the british aquarist festival in november, both of which had been enjoyed by all. this concluded the secretary's report. -brian proposed wilf seconded that the be, the, seconded that the report be accepted all in favour, there were none against and no abstentions. -show secretary's report in the show secretary's absence due to the accident on route tonight the chairman said mrs had done a fantastic job over the year and he wished to record his thanks to her. -the fish on the bench have increased over the year and he asked everyone to bring out just one fish every meeting. -the secretary would phone to find out if they were alright after the accident and if nec necessary contact the chairman. -treasurer's report the balance sheets were circulated to all and the treasurer went through each item of expenditure, explaining in detail. -there was a healthy balance for nineteen ninety three and this was mainly due to members supporting raffles and the fact that we have not put the show stand off at the british aquarist festival for a couple of years. +brian proposed wilf seconded that the be, the, seconded that the report be accepted all in favour, there were none against and no abstentions. +show secretary's report in the show secretary's absence due to the accident on route tonight the chairman said mrs had done a fantastic job over the year and he wished to record his thanks to her. +the fish on the bench have increased over the year and he asked everyone to bring out just one fish every meeting. +the secretary would phone to find out if they were alright after the accident and if nec necessary contact the chairman. +treasurer's report the balance sheets were circulated to all and the treasurer went through each item of expenditure, explaining in detail. +there was a healthy balance for nineteen ninety three and this was mainly due to members supporting raffles and the fact that we have not put the show stand off at the british aquarist festival for a couple of years. this had built up the present balance to what it now was. -mr proposed seconded that the report be accepted. -all in favour none against and no abstentions. +mr proposed seconded that the report be accepted. +all in favour none against and no abstentions. this concluded the reports. -there was no librarian's report due to mr being absent. -the chairman thanked all those who had worked hard and tirelessly over the last year for the benefit of the club and its members. +there was no librarian's report due to mr being absent. +the chairman thanked all those who had worked hard and tirelessly over the last year for the benefit of the club and its members. election of the committee. -now i don't propose to go through erm the proposers and seconders, i shall just go through the nominees er and there was no opposition. -so er presumably er you understand that it was, they were all elected. -the chairman peter vice chairman, bill secretary, h treasurer a b show secretary, e assistant show secretary, r librarian, jane committee j m w and j . +now i don't propose to go through erm the proposers and seconders, i shall just go through the nominees er and there was no opposition. +so er presumably er you understand that it was, they were all elected. +the chairman peter vice chairman, bill secretary, h treasurer a b show secretary, e assistant show secretary, r librarian, jane committee j m w and j . all these members were elected unanimously and unopposed. now, any other business. -we were asked to try to arrange an inter-club table show with hulton aquarist society. +we were asked to try to arrange an inter-club table show with hulton aquarist society. the secretary would approach the hulton secretary. -the treasurer asked if we could make an early start to the meetings eight p m prompt. -it looked very bad when we advertised an eight p m start and if -if you members came along there was only two or three people here at eight p m. -this concluded the business of the a g m and the chairman closed the, the meeting at ten ten ten past ten. -other club business social evening on monday the twenty first of december mr would donate egg and cress sandwiches b w would donate cheese cheese and onion wilf would donate boiled ham. -secretary would arrange chicken pieces pork pies sausage rolls, sausages on sticks cheese and onion and cheese and pineapple on sticks and would also donate mince pies. -jack may be able to donate some scones we would have bingo a knock-out competition and the whisky roll plus a raffle. +the treasurer asked if we could make an early start to the meetings eight p m prompt. +it looked very bad when we advertised an eight p m start and if +if you members came along there was only two or three people here at eight p m. +this concluded the business of the a g m and the chairman closed the, the meeting at ten ten ten past ten. +other club business social evening on monday the twenty first of december mr would donate egg and cress sandwiches b w would donate cheese cheese and onion wilf would donate boiled ham. +secretary would arrange chicken pieces pork pies sausage rolls, sausages on sticks cheese and onion and cheese and pineapple on sticks and would also donate mince pies. +jack may be able to donate some scones we would have bingo a knock-out competition and the whisky roll plus a raffle. prizes required please. -there was no further business the chairman closed the meeting at ten forty p m. +there was no further business the chairman closed the meeting at ten forty p m. any matters arising from those minutes? no matters arising? can we have a proposer and seconder, please? yes is there a proposer? and a seconder? seconded. -i haven't got a you don't give me one! -i'll give you er give you an extra cup of tea at supper time. +i haven't got a you don't give me one! +i'll give you er give you an extra cup of tea at supper time. thank you. -oh hang on a minute, the secretary can go first. +oh hang on a minute, the secretary can go first. oh matters arising. there's none arising. -no correct. +no correct. no matters arising. no. -propose second -yeah but joe joe proposed -yeah we've done that bit we've done that bit -and brian seconded +propose second +yeah but joe joe proposed +yeah we've done that bit we've done that bit +and brian seconded we've done that bit now we're on to matters arising. -yeah minutes of the previous a g m proposed and seconded, right? -matters arising proposed and seconded that they be accepted recommendations -yeah no no, because there was no matters arising. -just put that on so you can proposing and seconding . +yeah minutes of the previous a g m proposed and seconded, right? +matters arising proposed and seconded that they be accepted recommendations +yeah no no, because there was no matters arising. +just put that on so you can proposing and seconding . confusing, isn't it? no, not really! right secretary's report can we have the secretary's report. yeah. -erm secretary's report, it's much the same as last year er, we had two trips this year two coach trips one to the yorkshire aquarist festival in ap was it april? +erm secretary's report, it's much the same as last year er, we had two trips this year two coach trips one to the yorkshire aquarist festival in ap was it april? i think it was april, wasn't it? and one to the british aquarist festival in october. -they were both enjoyable erm i can't really say which i enjoyed the most er, i thought they were both very good and of course good value for the money because they don't charge very much for the fares well i don't think they do. -erm then we had the three-way inter-club table show with hulton and skelmersdale and st helens erm the first one was st helens and that was the only wasn't it, about april and we won that we, we it was a whitewash really, wasn't it? -erm then we had one at sk hulton in july and we won that er, not quite as much of a whitewash was it? +they were both enjoyable erm i can't really say which i enjoyed the most er, i thought they were both very good and of course good value for the money because they don't charge very much for the fares well i don't think they do. +erm then we had the three-way inter-club table show with hulton and skelmersdale and st helens erm the first one was st helens and that was the only wasn't it, about april and we won that we, we it was a whitewash really, wasn't it? +erm then we had one at sk hulton in july and we won that er, not quite as much of a whitewash was it? nevertheless we won handsomely. and the third one was at skelm -which was not organized because we don't know anyone -which was we don't know who won we don't know what the score was but we think that but we're, we're assuming that that's because they bring out all their secret showmen who don't sh travel they have a little core, hard core of that don't travel but they, they bring them out -they bring them out at their own table shows and, and it's -appropriate that we should that much +which was not organized because we don't know anyone +which was we don't know who won we don't know what the score was but we think that but we're, we're assuming that that's because they bring out all their secret showmen who don't sh travel they have a little core, hard core of that don't travel but they, they bring them out +they bring them out at their own table shows and, and it's +appropriate that we should that much well that appears to be so . -i never cared for results never cared for results at all. -robert is +i never cared for results never cared for results at all. +robert is we never saw a fish either. no. -i don't think erm on reflection, i don't think that a three-way table show is a good thing. -i would prefer to see an inter-club with skelm and an inter-club with hulton i think they get too big, two clubs is too difficult to organize when there's three cos you, you're getting it's not , it's the -it's not that the show secretary was er at club had not done his job. +i don't think erm on reflection, i don't think that a three-way table show is a good thing. +i would prefer to see an inter-club with skelm and an inter-club with hulton i think they get too big, two clubs is too difficult to organize when there's three cos you, you're getting it's not , it's the +it's not that the show secretary was er at club had not done his job. at skelmersdale? yeah. -i mean he's in the auction when he should be with them writing the labels. +i mean he's in the auction when he should be with them writing the labels. yeah. -yes i mean it doesn't go down well and i'll say the things you have to do when you when you're helping to run a club, you have to commit yourself to the club and you have to do the jobs that th presented by the club. -i mean i date mine, er well i don't date 'em i i sign the cards at home and do all that at home before i go +yes i mean it doesn't go down well and i'll say the things you have to do when you when you're helping to run a club, you have to commit yourself to the club and you have to do the jobs that th presented by the club. +i mean i date mine, er well i don't date 'em i i sign the cards at home and do all that at home before i go that's right. -and then when i come here i've just got to date what fish is on the bench. +and then when i come here i've just got to date what fish is on the bench. that's right. and it cuts down the work then. -the way he's doing this is there's they can go. +the way he's doing this is there's they can go. well that's no use is it? that's no use. -i know they were still judging after midnight and that's no good really no good at all on a working week. -when we got there we had to species of fish and then take it out and -yeah yeah. -it's a good idea it's a good idea in principle but, but it's not a workable proposition when you've over a hundred fish and there's evening +i know they were still judging after midnight and that's no good really no good at all on a working week. +when we got there we had to species of fish and then take it out and +yeah yeah. +it's a good idea it's a good idea in principle but, but it's not a workable proposition when you've over a hundred fish and there's evening yes. she hasn't got enough time -one of the didn't come till nearly quarter past ten. -yeah yeah. -i think it er, on reflection i think er i would discourage members from having a three-way table show i like the, the one-off you know, one against one because it works better +one of the didn't come till nearly quarter past ten. +yeah yeah. +i think it er, on reflection i think er i would discourage members from having a three-way table show i like the, the one-off you know, one against one because it works better yeah. i think it works better. yeah. -yes of course yeah, but the, you know, we, we have to, i have to make a report and i have to recommend so i'm recommending that we forget about the three-way stuff. -er, we had a breeders' meeting in october which was i enjoy them very much, i enjoy the the talk because it's the first chance i get during the year when i can sit down and listen and i don't have to worry about them generally, in another club, i don't have to worry about minutes or anything, i just sit and listen and it's great it, i really enjoy that. -meetings once again i have to say the old, old chestnut please can we start at eight o' clock er we're getting new members who get a bit discouraged when we have a late start. -i know it isn't easy but erm i think we should you know, try and we advertise starting at eight o'clock and very often there's only alan and i here at eight. +yes of course yeah, but the, you know, we, we have to, i have to make a report and i have to recommend so i'm recommending that we forget about the three-way stuff. +er, we had a breeders' meeting in october which was i enjoy them very much, i enjoy the the talk because it's the first chance i get during the year when i can sit down and listen and i don't have to worry about them generally, in another club, i don't have to worry about minutes or anything, i just sit and listen and it's great it, i really enjoy that. +meetings once again i have to say the old, old chestnut please can we start at eight o' clock er we're getting new members who get a bit discouraged when we have a late start. +i know it isn't easy but erm i think we should you know, try and we advertise starting at eight o'clock and very often there's only alan and i here at eight. so if we could all try our best to get here at eight o' clock. -particularly when we're trying to get juveniles into the club i mean they want to go at ten possibly you owe them not starting till -yeah yeah. +particularly when we're trying to get juveniles into the club i mean they want to go at ten possibly you owe them not starting till +yeah yeah. it's very difficult to -nine there's nothing, you know they'll get discouraged. -so you john now jonathan he's only fifteen, i know he looks in his twenties, but he's only fifteen and he's done a lot of homework so it makes him late and it makes him uncomfortable and he's fidgety because he knows he's got to disturb us when he goes out, he doesn't doesn't enjoy disturbing us, so i have to make that clear to you. -erm again i er the old story, we can't get speakers on a monday and better luck in last year this year, sorry er i was able to get danny but there again he came very expensive erm but we brought, we had to bring him from lancaster so er, you can't expect him to come for nothing. -so erm and another thing i was going to suggest erm i need help really erm for the meetings, i need somebody who will help, a social secretary say somebody who will help with the raffles and somebody who will organize meetings, what's going on at meetings because it's getting, the job is getting most difficult and i work part-time and it's, it's, i'm not getting any younger and i'm finding it a struggle to try and get everything fixed, the raffles and the what's going on and everything organized, so if you, if you if you could see the way clear, perhaps we could create a social secretary or an assistant secretary where we could have somebody who can give a hand with the organization of the meetings -just to get things like slide shows or erm videos and things, you know, that's how we're gonna -organizing the raffles just to get things like slide shows organized videos organized just a little bit of help. +nine there's nothing, you know they'll get discouraged. +so you john now jonathan he's only fifteen, i know he looks in his twenties, but he's only fifteen and he's done a lot of homework so it makes him late and it makes him uncomfortable and he's fidgety because he knows he's got to disturb us when he goes out, he doesn't doesn't enjoy disturbing us, so i have to make that clear to you. +erm again i er the old story, we can't get speakers on a monday and better luck in last year this year, sorry er i was able to get danny but there again he came very expensive erm but we brought, we had to bring him from lancaster so er, you can't expect him to come for nothing. +so erm and another thing i was going to suggest erm i need help really erm for the meetings, i need somebody who will help, a social secretary say somebody who will help with the raffles and somebody who will organize meetings, what's going on at meetings because it's getting, the job is getting most difficult and i work part-time and it's, it's, i'm not getting any younger and i'm finding it a struggle to try and get everything fixed, the raffles and the what's going on and everything organized, so if you, if you if you could see the way clear, perhaps we could create a social secretary or an assistant secretary where we could have somebody who can give a hand with the organization of the meetings +just to get things like slide shows or erm videos and things, you know, that's how we're gonna +organizing the raffles just to get things like slide shows organized videos organized just a little bit of help. will you? thank you, robert. yes. -so if we make a list of what we've got when you have a video night, if you or, or somebody else has the video list, you can say, well if you bring them back -that's right and we, brian had the club slides which he very kindly handed over to us when he, he, he felt it became difficult for him to cope with it erm cos his dad's not well. -we have the club slides in our house so that you know really whoever takes over organizing the meeting should really have those and they're all sorted out in order so it's just a case of diving in the bag and looking for whatever you want, ever the i always try to bring some fish to look at, to the the scr to the screen erm some of the fish that were on show on the table for that particular sh er in erm table show because i think it shows interest and to learn more about the fish and it's always nice when somebody else knows a lot more about the particular species than you do, and i is able to tell you quirks and fancies that they have. -so i always try to do that but i, i, again i find that it's very erm very tiring and it's very, gets very can get very involved with it, so i would like us, i'd like you to think of the idea of a social secretary to help with the raffles and organizing what's going on at the meetings please. -erm and that's about all i have to say, mr chairman. +so if we make a list of what we've got when you have a video night, if you or, or somebody else has the video list, you can say, well if you bring them back +that's right and we, brian had the club slides which he very kindly handed over to us when he, he, he felt it became difficult for him to cope with it erm cos his dad's not well. +we have the club slides in our house so that you know really whoever takes over organizing the meeting should really have those and they're all sorted out in order so it's just a case of diving in the bag and looking for whatever you want, ever the i always try to bring some fish to look at, to the the scr to the screen erm some of the fish that were on show on the table for that particular sh er in erm table show because i think it shows interest and to learn more about the fish and it's always nice when somebody else knows a lot more about the particular species than you do, and i is able to tell you quirks and fancies that they have. +so i always try to do that but i, i, again i find that it's very erm very tiring and it's very, gets very can get very involved with it, so i would like us, i'd like you to think of the idea of a social secretary to help with the raffles and organizing what's going on at the meetings please. +erm and that's about all i have to say, mr chairman. need a proposer . i keep losing me place. i'll have put me -i know it's, it's not not -and the report from the treasurer can we have your report, please? +i know it's, it's not not +and the report from the treasurer can we have your report, please? this is what everyone's been waiting for. -have the er figures in front of you of our progress during the last twelve months you will no doubt see that we are in a very nice financial position er only a pound and a penny off that magic thousand pound in in the club now. -erm during the year we've made about er two hundred and two hundred and twenty odd pounds. -er it's not due to my expertise at all, it's just mainly due to the fact we don't go to shows these days we've always in the good old days when we used to go to shows we spent probably a hundred and thirty to two hundred pounds a year so we never had very much money as we don't go to these shows and spend this money it is it is a it is accumulating each year. -erm i'll go through, roughly through the accounts in case anybody's not quite clear what it's all about. -er we started off with seven hundred and seventy five pounds, seventy six, at the beginning of the year er the membership is only thirty seven, we have fewer members but er that's a very small proportion of our income. -four pound for visitors only seem to come and then disappear not many of them seem to join us. -erm because of a social evening er we had a raffle and a whiskey bowl i think the purists might not like the e in whiskey but that's the way it's been done that must be the southern way. -erm right the yorkshire aquarist festival we had a coach two ninety three pound on the coach and a raffle a hundred and six pound erm on the inter-club we had a fourteen pound twenty five entry and we had a raffle, twenty nine twenty five, making forty three pound fifty. -yorkshire was quite a success this year, we made a lot of money o on the income side er sixty two pound for entries ninety one pound ten for refreshments hundred and nine forty for the raffle, our kind and thanks to bert -thanks to bert +have the er figures in front of you of our progress during the last twelve months you will no doubt see that we are in a very nice financial position er only a pound and a penny off that magic thousand pound in in the club now. +erm during the year we've made about er two hundred and two hundred and twenty odd pounds. +er it's not due to my expertise at all, it's just mainly due to the fact we don't go to shows these days we've always in the good old days when we used to go to shows we spent probably a hundred and thirty to two hundred pounds a year so we never had very much money as we don't go to these shows and spend this money it is it is a it is accumulating each year. +erm i'll go through, roughly through the accounts in case anybody's not quite clear what it's all about. +er we started off with seven hundred and seventy five pounds, seventy six, at the beginning of the year er the membership is only thirty seven, we have fewer members but er that's a very small proportion of our income. +four pound for visitors only seem to come and then disappear not many of them seem to join us. +erm because of a social evening er we had a raffle and a whiskey bowl i think the purists might not like the e in whiskey but that's the way it's been done that must be the southern way. +erm right the yorkshire aquarist festival we had a coach two ninety three pound on the coach and a raffle a hundred and six pound erm on the inter-club we had a fourteen pound twenty five entry and we had a raffle, twenty nine twenty five, making forty three pound fifty. +yorkshire was quite a success this year, we made a lot of money o on the income side er sixty two pound for entries ninety one pound ten for refreshments hundred and nine forty for the raffle, our kind and thanks to bert +thanks to bert it says here. for breaking the record for four minute mile. -the tombola thirty nine again thanks to bill for breaking the records. -five hundred and fifty pound and sponsorship coming from the members of course fifty three pound fifty. -all our w most of our money does come from the members themselves as you've seen. -er the er the breeders' evening now what happened on this breeders' evening is that the they run the raffle then give us our expenses out of it so that eleven pound eighty is the is the part of the raffle proceeds which we need to, to e to er for our expenses, you'll see on the other side erm that we spent that eleven eighty, six eighty for er refreshments and five pound for the rent. -er, the rest of it they take for the er to keep the breeders' going keep . +the tombola thirty nine again thanks to bill for breaking the records. +five hundred and fifty pound and sponsorship coming from the members of course fifty three pound fifty. +all our w most of our money does come from the members themselves as you've seen. +er the er the breeders' evening now what happened on this breeders' evening is that the they run the raffle then give us our expenses out of it so that eleven pound eighty is the is the part of the raffle proceeds which we need to, to e to er for our expenses, you'll see on the other side erm that we spent that eleven eighty, six eighty for er refreshments and five pound for the rent. +er, the rest of it they take for the er to keep the breeders' going keep . erm -oh yes excellent. -er the coach to er to er bowness on the bus we took thirty nine pound erm with discount from last year people who er bought some last christmas we made twenty three pound on that the library, only thirty pence course, we've had trouble with the library because we can't leave it here now and er so that's why it's s so low the, the income. -er six twenty for the sale of badges fancy some of that was from a previous year. -yes it was it was. -i forgot about the sale of badges last year -that's probably two years actually er income from that. -sales that were left over from the open show, three pound thirty fourteen pound ten for the collection, now that is as you see, that is over from last year last year the table show so we actually have double the number of entries on the bench this year which is a healthy sign -really that -and er hopefully if we can only just bring enough fish each and every time erm we'll even get it higher. -now as you can see, our main income is our raffles two hundred and sixty pound, that is an increase of ooh seventy five pound on last year. +oh yes excellent. +er the coach to er to er bowness on the bus we took thirty nine pound erm with discount from last year people who er bought some last christmas we made twenty three pound on that the library, only thirty pence course, we've had trouble with the library because we can't leave it here now and er so that's why it's s so low the, the income. +er six twenty for the sale of badges fancy some of that was from a previous year. +yes it was it was. +i forgot about the sale of badges last year +that's probably two years actually er income from that. +sales that were left over from the open show, three pound thirty fourteen pound ten for the collection, now that is as you see, that is over from last year last year the table show so we actually have double the number of entries on the bench this year which is a healthy sign +really that +and er hopefully if we can only just bring enough fish each and every time erm we'll even get it higher. +now as you can see, our main income is our raffles two hundred and sixty pound, that is an increase of ooh seventy five pound on last year. paid a hundred and eighty five last, two hundred and sixty this year. -er i'd just like to thank everybody for their generosity for taking part so . -erm we're trying to have beer put on the price each time now to make it worthwhile so you get a chance of getting your money back. -right that makes a total of seventeen eighty six, sixty one over the year. -erm, right on the expenditure side we have our normal subscriptions for the year, a s erm the f b a s which you all know, there's no strangers here who don't know what these are the a l a and the whale and dolphin er preservation society which we have taken on as a personal thing in the, in the er name of the club because it's cheaper +er i'd just like to thank everybody for their generosity for taking part so . +erm we're trying to have beer put on the price each time now to make it worthwhile so you get a chance of getting your money back. +right that makes a total of seventeen eighty six, sixty one over the year. +erm, right on the expenditure side we have our normal subscriptions for the year, a s erm the f b a s which you all know, there's no strangers here who don't know what these are the a l a and the whale and dolphin er preservation society which we have taken on as a personal thing in the, in the er name of the club because it's cheaper no, it's in my name. it's in your name but it's on behalf of the club. it's on behalf of the club, yeah. -because the the, the club one's getting rather expensive so we yeah +because the the, the club one's getting rather expensive so we yeah eighteen pounds. so we decided to join that for this year. -the rent for the club room er five pound per go, a hundred and fifteen pound erm the christmas social, we spent fif thirty five fifty one on the refreshments and seven eighty nine on the whisky, making a forty three forty expenditure the club trophies, we spent nineteen pound fifty this year and we saved a lot of money on that this year, we spent about a hundred and thirty to forty last year erm so we have got a quite a difference just trying to find last year's erm there they are trophies, a hundred and sixteen pound we paid last year so have, we did save a lot of money by doing them ourselves more or less. -erm the inter-club show erm we had to pay judges er two of them thirty pound, we would normally have got keith for nothing, i know that we had two judges so we had to pay them er we did like so that's two fifty pounds and we bought some we had some old trophies which we were able to buy plates for to use for that event. -erm postage and stationery eight forty four raffle tickets ten thirty eight raffle prizes, sixteen twenty four,if i'm short. -erm table show judges, we had a table at the beginning of the year when we had the gentleman from runcorn, what's his name? +the rent for the club room er five pound per go, a hundred and fifteen pound erm the christmas social, we spent fif thirty five fifty one on the refreshments and seven eighty nine on the whisky, making a forty three forty expenditure the club trophies, we spent nineteen pound fifty this year and we saved a lot of money on that this year, we spent about a hundred and thirty to forty last year erm so we have got a quite a difference just trying to find last year's erm there they are trophies, a hundred and sixteen pound we paid last year so have, we did save a lot of money by doing them ourselves more or less. +erm the inter-club show erm we had to pay judges er two of them thirty pound, we would normally have got keith for nothing, i know that we had two judges so we had to pay them er we did like so that's two fifty pounds and we bought some we had some old trophies which we were able to buy plates for to use for that event. +erm postage and stationery eight forty four raffle tickets ten thirty eight raffle prizes, sixteen twenty four,if i'm short. +erm table show judges, we had a table at the beginning of the year when we had the gentleman from runcorn, what's his name? paul. -paul came to came to judge erm er that's the only time we've had a judge. -er hundred and forty pound for the coach to yorkshire which we got on the other side, a hundred and six pound back so the club er sponsored that, a hundred and thirty four pound, and thirty four pound. -erm right the open show fifty nine ninety five for the hire of the hall, much the same as last year, it's keeping pretty well down er, it's, we paid fifty three eighty last year, but i think because little bit for a longer time this year. -erm the judges, seventy five er and that's ten pound less than last year, maybe because we're struggling to get judges forty two pound for the trophies erm er, fifteen pound for the fish tank and plates at seventy five forty seven, crisps, eight seventy eight, which we struggled to sell we think you could sell crisps but we had a struggle. -postage, stationery, fourteen o six raffle tickets, eleven pound, making a total of two thirty twenty six as against on the other side the income, three ninety six so we made a hundred and sixty six pound on on the open show which is a great increase on last year because last year we only made twelve pounds something twelve pound and a penny we made last year, so this is a great increase. -the coach to the breeders' evening that's what i mentioned before, we paid for the refreshments and the rent show secretary has only claimed two pounds which is a scandal really she's probably paid twenty out, twenty pounds -yeah i think so cos she's sitting here smiling. +paul came to came to judge erm er that's the only time we've had a judge. +er hundred and forty pound for the coach to yorkshire which we got on the other side, a hundred and six pound back so the club er sponsored that, a hundred and thirty four pound, and thirty four pound. +erm right the open show fifty nine ninety five for the hire of the hall, much the same as last year, it's keeping pretty well down er, it's, we paid fifty three eighty last year, but i think because little bit for a longer time this year. +erm the judges, seventy five er and that's ten pound less than last year, maybe because we're struggling to get judges forty two pound for the trophies erm er, fifteen pound for the fish tank and plates at seventy five forty seven, crisps, eight seventy eight, which we struggled to sell we think you could sell crisps but we had a struggle. +postage, stationery, fourteen o six raffle tickets, eleven pound, making a total of two thirty twenty six as against on the other side the income, three ninety six so we made a hundred and sixty six pound on on the open show which is a great increase on last year because last year we only made twelve pounds something twelve pound and a penny we made last year, so this is a great increase. +the coach to the breeders' evening that's what i mentioned before, we paid for the refreshments and the rent show secretary has only claimed two pounds which is a scandal really she's probably paid twenty out, twenty pounds +yeah i think so cos she's sitting here smiling. so joe doesn't get so many mushy peas. -er champion of champions we've, i bought some prizes for the champion of champions, and food er just to go with the trophies er keith again was our judge and erm knowing that he doesn't willingly accept money, he wants to come and do it for nothing erm how many proposed that we buy him something a bottle to take with him, so we bought him a bottle of wine to take with him and er that was the three pound. -so that gives us a total expenditure of seven eighty seven sixty two for the year and that leaves us with a balance er of the year and that's nine ninety eight ninety nine pence. -so we're exceedingly well off really for the size of the club and my trip to amazon, up the amazon collecting fish gets nearer and nearer -gets nearer every day you wouldn't get +er champion of champions we've, i bought some prizes for the champion of champions, and food er just to go with the trophies er keith again was our judge and erm knowing that he doesn't willingly accept money, he wants to come and do it for nothing erm how many proposed that we buy him something a bottle to take with him, so we bought him a bottle of wine to take with him and er that was the three pound. +so that gives us a total expenditure of seven eighty seven sixty two for the year and that leaves us with a balance er of the year and that's nine ninety eight ninety nine pence. +so we're exceedingly well off really for the size of the club and my trip to amazon, up the amazon collecting fish gets nearer and nearer +gets nearer every day you wouldn't get erm very far on a thousand pound though, would you? -well as i say i mean we're doing very well and all the money and, and you know, ninety percent of the money comes out of the the er the members' pockets really i mean ev even the sub for the open show, we put out a lot of that even the stuff and things like this, so we do provide an awful lot of money. -er we haven't used very much of it this year i mean i think er i mentioned a few weeks ago the, the question of trips out perhaps in the spring to do fish and that, we could consider er we don't want to just go er accumulating money for the sake of it erm, we want to get some benefit out of the money we've got. -erm we may of course go to bowness next year if the circumstances change and we can manage it that will course cost a fair amount of money but that remains to be seen, we'll have to wait and see how the club progresses during the year whether we think we can do it . +well as i say i mean we're doing very well and all the money and, and you know, ninety percent of the money comes out of the the er the members' pockets really i mean ev even the sub for the open show, we put out a lot of that even the stuff and things like this, so we do provide an awful lot of money. +er we haven't used very much of it this year i mean i think er i mentioned a few weeks ago the, the question of trips out perhaps in the spring to do fish and that, we could consider er we don't want to just go er accumulating money for the sake of it erm, we want to get some benefit out of the money we've got. +erm we may of course go to bowness next year if the circumstances change and we can manage it that will course cost a fair amount of money but that remains to be seen, we'll have to wait and see how the club progresses during the year whether we think we can do it . right, any questions? no? -we don't them. -we don't with thousand pound in his back pocket can't be bad. +we don't them. +we don't with thousand pound in his back pocket can't be bad. it's coming to the stage soon when we'll have to put it in a building society, get some interest on it. -i mean sh shame in the banks i mean we don't get charges any charges from this bank, i mean if, if you er put it in some banks you get interest charge you on your cheques and all sorts of things, it, it's as broad as it's long usually but er i mean we are gonna accumulate money, i don't think we should accumulate very much more now, we, we've ample funds for everything we need er but it's a question -but it's just lying in the bank dormant and it's not making any interest i know it's not being, i know we're not being charged but -trouble is -building society, i don't know they do it. -maybe you could the only way we could do it is er a joint account and that would be have to be based on trust you know, a mutual trust between er y your two main people er y you would just have to trust them erm nobody, how do members feel about if you +i mean sh shame in the banks i mean we don't get charges any charges from this bank, i mean if, if you er put it in some banks you get interest charge you on your cheques and all sorts of things, it, it's as broad as it's long usually but er i mean we are gonna accumulate money, i don't think we should accumulate very much more now, we, we've ample funds for everything we need er but it's a question +but it's just lying in the bank dormant and it's not making any interest i know it's not being, i know we're not being charged but +trouble is +building society, i don't know they do it. +maybe you could the only way we could do it is er a joint account and that would be have to be based on trust you know, a mutual trust between er y your two main people er y you would just have to trust them erm nobody, how do members feel about if you that's true. -well it's a and stuff like that, i mean +well it's a and stuff like that, i mean but i mean i -the reason i propose giving he has to do is come +the reason i propose giving he has to do is come it's embarrassing. -and sometimes he, he, he feels it be putting on those -yes yes and he's such a nice man and he does it so willingly if he can. -that's why he's +and sometimes he, he, he feels it be putting on those +yes yes and he's such a nice man and he does it so willingly if he can. +that's why he's yes. oh, i'll have one off him, yeah when it's done like, you know it's going oh yes, i'll have one him. yeah, he's doing it. -yes yes. +yes yes. we are struggling with judges aren't we? -and what about, you know about the judges, don't you? -yes, but it doesn't -i just mentioned it er we have we have had a suggestion from b class judges that er that the b class judges can show at er an, an open show providing, providing they declare beforehand -providing they declare their interests -it is what i've always thought for a long time that somebody like brian if he's not if he's not showing at our fish at our show, even as an a class judge, i, i fail to see why he can't judge at our show it's, he goes to skelm and, and judges there and our fish will be there or strange really when we're struggling for judges that, that we don't do these things. +and what about, you know about the judges, don't you? +yes, but it doesn't +i just mentioned it er we have we have had a suggestion from b class judges that er that the b class judges can show at er an, an open show providing, providing they declare beforehand +providing they declare their interests +it is what i've always thought for a long time that somebody like brian if he's not if he's not showing at our fish at our show, even as an a class judge, i, i fail to see why he can't judge at our show it's, he goes to skelm and, and judges there and our fish will be there or strange really when we're struggling for judges that, that we don't do these things. yeah, but we're looking at the financial side, aren't we really? -w with brian -well i know i mean it we're struggling to get judges, aren't we, and it's not going to get any better, it's going +w with brian +well i know i mean it we're struggling to get judges, aren't we, and it's not going to get any better, it's going no. -to get worse if anything, not better the way things are going. -we're obviously obviously thinking along these lines +to get worse if anything, not better the way things are going. +we're obviously obviously thinking along these lines is there? -he, he was apparently and then on the saturday or sunday h h he, he started to reject so he had to go back in. +he, he was apparently and then on the saturday or sunday h h he, he started to reject so he had to go back in. oh. yeah. where did he used to live? @@ -42715,12 +42674,12 @@ where was he from? so all, all the a class judges are getting a little bit long in the tooth now no more questions? no one, no more questions? -i'd like er to thank alan for being involved erm a proposer and seconder? -proposed by steve seconded by -right er please can we have your report please. +i'd like er to thank alan for being involved erm a proposer and seconder? +proposed by steve seconded by +right er please can we have your report please. well it's not much, i mean -you would like to see more on the tables -well we have had more fish out yeah we have had more fish out +you would like to see more on the tables +well we have had more fish out yeah we have had more fish out in the show pardon? where did we come in the show ? @@ -42731,131 +42690,130 @@ that wasn't too bad. i shall put in the report must do better! do better! we do want more fish out. -any comment about the s the sort of format of the table show do we want to change them at all -how, how did it work out on the champion of champions night with having the the table show, the full table show that we cancelled when danny came er how did it work er did it work out comfortably? +any comment about the s the sort of format of the table show do we want to change them at all +how, how did it work out on the champion of champions night with having the the table show, the full table show that we cancelled when danny came er how did it work er did it work out comfortably? oh yeah -er i felt, i've been after danny for nearly twelve months to come see and not been able to get him on the night i want him the only night he was able, was available was i think it was one night when we had something else on i can't remember what it was. -erm i think it was an inter-club actually, oh the inter-club table show was the only night he could manage and that was no good to us so erm we, we the only way we could do it was to t bring him the night that there was a full table show transfer the full table show to the champion of champions judge that first and put the winning fish into the champion of champions and i know, well it's gonna be woof you know a rush and that will, oh well, never mind. +er i felt, i've been after danny for nearly twelve months to come see and not been able to get him on the night i want him the only night he was able, was available was i think it was one night when we had something else on i can't remember what it was. +erm i think it was an inter-club actually, oh the inter-club table show was the only night he could manage and that was no good to us so erm we, we the only way we could do it was to t bring him the night that there was a full table show transfer the full table show to the champion of champions judge that first and put the winning fish into the champion of champions and i know, well it's gonna be woof you know a rush and that will, oh well, never mind. least we knew we'd get some extra fish didn't we? yeah it's good that they had a fairer chance of getting on to the tables twenty minutes -so erm i'm you kn i don't propose to do that again because i wouldn't er i wouldn't arrange a speaker if we had a full table show but it's nice to know that it did work out because we were, i was forced into a corner a little bit erm and i think it was worth it because we as i say i've waited a long time for danny and he was well worth listening to, i can listen to danny for hours because he he just speaks and, and tells you about his fish, i'm, i'm very very fond of listening to danny cos i think he gives a good talk. -he has he the same problems that we've all had you know erm and yes he's, he's, he's very easy to listen to despite the fact that he's a southerner. +so erm i'm you kn i don't propose to do that again because i wouldn't er i wouldn't arrange a speaker if we had a full table show but it's nice to know that it did work out because we were, i was forced into a corner a little bit erm and i think it was worth it because we as i say i've waited a long time for danny and he was well worth listening to, i can listen to danny for hours because he he just speaks and, and tells you about his fish, i'm, i'm very very fond of listening to danny cos i think he gives a good talk. +he has he the same problems that we've all had you know erm and yes he's, he's, he's very easy to listen to despite the fact that he's a southerner. but we'll forgive him that -he comes from near windsor, doesn't he, cos he said he has a mate has a fish shop in windsor +he comes from near windsor, doesn't he, cos he said he has a mate has a fish shop in windsor that's right often go to windsor that's right. we was looking at a video -erm it's an old one and it's called fancy fish and we were sorting our videos out to list 'em and then we'll make a list and then we'd let you have and then if you want a video and that, you know what you got and we were looking through this fancy fish and it's erm i don't know if you remember it, it shows an open show at oxford +erm it's an old one and it's called fancy fish and we were sorting our videos out to list 'em and then we'll make a list and then we'd let you have and then if you want a video and that, you know what you got and we were looking through this fancy fish and it's erm i don't know if you remember it, it shows an open show at oxford oh yeah, i think so. yes i remember. -anyway it's an open show +anyway it's an open show yeah i think the and he's got longer hair. -yeah yeah +yeah yeah yeah well he still looks young, i mean despite the fact that he's a grandfather i think twice over grandfather for years been a grandfather for years. -he's got a a oh dear . -right er may i just make one comment on by bringing the table show with danny and er th champion of champions it er it er i don't know how many people champion of champions, +he's got a a oh dear . +right er may i just make one comment on by bringing the table show with danny and er th champion of champions it er it er i don't know how many people champion of champions, can't hear you. -you know, i, i couldn't bring all the fish i mean i just put some on the table i couldn't bring all the champion of champions -cos of the tank couldn't carry it. +you know, i, i couldn't bring all the fish i mean i just put some on the table i couldn't bring all the champion of champions +cos of the tank couldn't carry it. because of the time and the yeah it probably would never happen again cos it was yeah it was a lot of work -yes yes. -we had no how many people showed on monday?five of them? +yes yes. +we had no how many people showed on monday?five of them? yeah. there's a lot of it actually, it'd be nice if -i realize that, you know i would say five of them five people in both departments champion of champions let's hope that it never happens again, you know, these things do happen. -well is on that, you know. -there was yourself and , jack -and er +i realize that, you know i would say five of them five people in both departments champion of champions let's hope that it never happens again, you know, these things do happen. +well is on that, you know. +there was yourself and , jack +and er you didn't bring any ? no i didn't bring any, no -erm that gentleman +erm that gentleman was it the cold water temperature -it could have been worse could have been worse. +it could have been worse could have been worse. would only be couldn't have been really much better really, well yeah -well he was dashing out when i when i called him erm his wife answered the phone and she said you just him he's going out at the door so he came rushing back and i said i wanted him to judge champion of champions and the and i said there'll be two and he said, hang on, and he's write it down said i'll just stick it all at one and see to it when i come back, oh i gotta go and he went. +well he was dashing out when i when i called him erm his wife answered the phone and she said you just him he's going out at the door so he came rushing back and i said i wanted him to judge champion of champions and the and i said there'll be two and he said, hang on, and he's write it down said i'll just stick it all at one and see to it when i come back, oh i gotta go and he went. yeah. and that was it. -yeah yeah yeah. -well he, he appreciated at the previous table show on the sixth of october and that was a case when it was always you know, because danny only told me on that night that he could come. +yeah yeah yeah. +well he, he appreciated at the previous table show on the sixth of october and that was a case when it was always you know, because danny only told me on that night that he could come. yeah. -so it was all a hotchpotch, it was all and i had to do the the best i could for those who showed fish and that was the only way i could do it. -right er thanks emily for your report. +so it was all a hotchpotch, it was all and i had to do the the best i could for those who showed fish and that was the only way i could do it. +right er thanks emily for your report. any proposers and seconders? -i'll propose emily's report and, and in doing so i'd like to say thank you to her for her sterling work this year, i think she's done a terrific job erm and i'd like to thank her personally for the help she's given me over the year. +i'll propose emily's report and, and in doing so i'd like to say thank you to her for her sterling work this year, i think she's done a terrific job erm and i'd like to thank her personally for the help she's given me over the year. i couldn't have managed without her. any seconders? got to get your name in the minutes somehow. right, thanks emily. -erm librarian's report +erm librarian's report sixty p and thirty p oh is it? thirty pence. yeah well -we auc we auctioned the books after as you know and erm so i i'll have to make a new list of what's left and let you have it. +we auc we auctioned the books after as you know and erm so i i'll have to make a new list of what's left and let you have it. i know i, i will be against -they take books out once or twice and then the older members don't take 'em out +they take books out once or twice and then the older members don't take 'em out i mean i know it's difficult yeah. -having them at home i mean erm +having them at home i mean erm yeah -but they're still not -they didn't they didn't take them out of the joe you know erm -er i think we get a saturation point and the thing that annoys me is that young fellow who came to the club had a got, we got a special went to the special trouble of getting a for him and i cannot get it off him and he lives up newton way somewhere i've been to him three times -i've been to that house -and i've i've phoned three or four times and you can get no reply and i'm, i'm a bit cheesed off with it cos this is the second time +but they're still not +they didn't they didn't take them out of the joe you know erm +er i think we get a saturation point and the thing that annoys me is that young fellow who came to the club had a got, we got a special went to the special trouble of getting a for him and i cannot get it off him and he lives up newton way somewhere i've been to him three times +i've been to that house +and i've i've phoned three or four times and you can get no reply and i'm, i'm a bit cheesed off with it cos this is the second time small claims court. -for want of a better word they're actually stolen books are stolen. -i'll get it i'll get it back, i know where he lives. +for want of a better word they're actually stolen books are stolen. +i'll get it i'll get it back, i know where he lives. do you? -i mean -yes i've phoned and i've written three times and i've written to his mother our official letter, official no headed notepaper she's not there, she works as a nurse doesn't she? +i mean +yes i've phoned and i've written three times and i've written to his mother our official letter, official no headed notepaper she's not there, she works as a nurse doesn't she? she's not in till nine o' clock. -well they anyway, were they? -they were -order it specially cos it's not a book you'd ask for often, is it i suppose. -yes i know er yes i er er i er er i, i think it's a good thing that people, if they ask for information, you've got to buy books to get them. -but what's aggrieved me is that he's just waltzed off with it and not -it looks like he just and come here just to get a book. -i'll ask him and he's, he's just ignoring all the er -that's right a letter that we're taking him to court -i know there's a couple +well they anyway, were they? +they were +order it specially cos it's not a book you'd ask for often, is it i suppose. +yes i know er yes i er er i er er i, i think it's a good thing that people, if they ask for information, you've got to buy books to get them. +but what's aggrieved me is that he's just waltzed off with it and not +it looks like he just and come here just to get a book. +i'll ask him and he's, he's just ignoring all the er +that's right a letter that we're taking him to court +i know there's a couple erm yes. what was his name? alan . - okay, a course on presentation skills. -how many have been on a on a training course before? -i know has so several of you have already been on a training course so you'll know the sort of er way in which we work and the way things happen. -erm let me just let me just ask you first of all what is the value for you and for the company of of developing skills on presentations. +how many have been on a on a training course before? +i know has so several of you have already been on a training course so you'll know the sort of er way in which we work and the way things happen. +erm let me just let me just ask you first of all what is the value for you and for the company of of developing skills on presentations. what's the value? respective clients -indeed, indeed so that's what you might use, yep what's the value, i mean what does it do what does it do for the company first of all? +indeed, indeed so that's what you might use, yep what's the value, i mean what does it do what does it do for the company first of all? promotes it promotes it, so it's about image isn't it? -it's about because the company after all is you it's a group of people and so er it's about putting over the right image so quality presentation to a client the image. +it's about because the company after all is you it's a group of people and so er it's about putting over the right image so quality presentation to a client the image. what's the value to you as individuals? more confidence it gives you more confidence, yeah, what's it do for you within the company? pushes your standing up oh that's what i thought yeah yeah yes -well i mean you're right in a way bob those people who seem to get on within a company some of them are people who seem to be able to say the right words at the right time don't they? +well i mean you're right in a way bob those people who seem to get on within a company some of them are people who seem to be able to say the right words at the right time don't they? they seem to be able to put their point of view over. they they're able to by by the way they present themselves they're able to demonstrate their value within the organisation and as bob says hopefully then it increases your status. -yeah although the tape's on i'll still say i'll still say i mean there are people within the company as within any company i'm sure who you when you get to know their technical ability or lack thereof you think well how have they managed to get where they have but they just seem to be able they seem to have this ability to be able to be in the right place at the right time. +yeah although the tape's on i'll still say i'll still say i mean there are people within the company as within any company i'm sure who you when you get to know their technical ability or lack thereof you think well how have they managed to get where they have but they just seem to be able they seem to have this ability to be able to be in the right place at the right time. well yes but also say the right words at the right time yeah? yep. so being able to present effectively and put your point of view across is very important within within the company context for the company in order to to project the right image and also to pro project your own right image. to show your value, to demonstrate your worth for the organisation. @@ -42879,13 +42837,13 @@ right, erh what i'd like to do then is er i say could you just introduce yoursel tony would you start us off? erm i work for alright -erm which is quite management at +erm which is quite management at right erm i suppose one of the er things i'd like to er get out of this would be a bit more -okay so putting all the that positive +okay so putting all the that positive yeah sort of ums and ahs oh right okay okay so i mean are are you saying that's about confidence? -is it or ? +is it or ? well maybe , maybe, maybe thinking ahead too much er right, okay okay so better preparation so that when you make the presentation it's more effective, yeah? yeah i mean you're trying to think ahead, you're umming and ahing @@ -42896,35 +42854,35 @@ yeah good, do you do you make present any sort of presentations ? well i meet clients quite a bit erm the last one i actually made was last week oh really -to tarmac financial directors directors +to tarmac financial directors directors how do you how do you feel it went? -it went pretty well actually, the feedback i got from my immediate boss fairly pleased with it was pleased with it +it went pretty well actually, the feedback i got from my immediate boss fairly pleased with it was pleased with it good obviously right yeah, good okay good. so effective preparation. mike. -i'm a senior with south west i management course i cover site planning right the way through. +i'm a senior with south west i management course i cover site planning right the way through. erm been in the game now for something like forty years. started as an apprentice and worked my way through to management. -erm this course or mainly my presentations are written +erm this course or mainly my presentations are written okay er we in fact have a tender mm -frequent the main discussion er was in fact erm internally with our director +frequent the main discussion er was in fact erm internally with our director right information or what have you right -and also to our site teams cover successfully the job and explain to them how the teams were built up +and also to our site teams cover successfully the job and explain to them how the teams were built up right, okay the main thing i suppose. this was dropped on me out of the blue, i must admit this course was it , okay? right erm would be more confidence in presentation -okay how to deal with -how to project and verbally +okay how to deal with +how to project and verbally how to give how to give an image of confidence yes okay @@ -42935,81 +42893,81 @@ yes yes absolutely, oh yes this this course is entirely about verbal presentatio yep great thanks. jeff -erm my name is and i work for my objective of this really is to reappraise my presentation skills. +erm my name is and i work for my objective of this really is to reappraise my presentation skills. i did this course erm about ten years ago right so this is very much a refresher course okay so you're you're wanting some some feedback yes -er right was that with with jeremy? +er right was that with with jeremy? yes yeah fine, okay great thanks. sarah. -i work my main aim on this course is to gain confidence +i work my main aim on this course is to gain confidence right i don't do many presentations mainly because i work in a small team right, right so it's about confidence great thanks. bob -senior midland area and i've been working on a job in coventry which is basically work er what i hope to get mainly out of this course is an increased level of personal confidence so i can overcome basic nervousness when speaking. +senior midland area and i've been working on a job in coventry which is basically work er what i hope to get mainly out of this course is an increased level of personal confidence so i can overcome basic nervousness when speaking. how to handle the nerves, i'll say right now and half of you may want to walk out of the room. i don't have a magic wand i do not have a magic wand that you know take three deep breaths turn round twice and your nerves will disappear yep. -so if that's what wanting we've got problems straightaway erm but certainly we will discuss what to do about that yes and to recognise them and to understand why, yes, fine but i don't have a magic wand. +so if that's what wanting we've got problems straightaway erm but certainly we will discuss what to do about that yes and to recognise them and to understand why, yes, fine but i don't have a magic wand. i'd i'd be a millionaire if i did wouldn't i? rob . -senior engineer for midlands area i'm er presently on seventeen million pound office development the job's completion erm my presentations are basically from site labour to erm professional engineers and architects +senior engineer for midlands area i'm er presently on seventeen million pound office development the job's completion erm my presentations are basically from site labour to erm professional engineers and architects yep on a one to one basis or or to small meetings mm what i hope to gain on the course is to be able to speak more confidently and to get over the nerves. right, great thanks. gordon -senior engineer for midlands region, currently been working on the developments which is design built and development gangs of which +senior engineer for midlands region, currently been working on the developments which is design built and development gangs of which yep erm i have er one to one dealing with subcontractors engineers the architects and site meetings not a great preparation but there is more or less every day to day right -erm i hope to get out of this more personal confidence and more talk more clearly +erm i hope to get out of this more personal confidence and more talk more clearly so it's to be clear in what you're saying to be able to explain yourself clearly so it's about clarity -right +right the need to make it clear so that people understand without having to sort of keep coming back and asking again and again, yep, great, thanks. john -i'm i'm the senior south west i currently work schemes my main aim on the course is er to gain more confidence +i'm i'm the senior south west i currently work schemes my main aim on the course is er to gain more confidence right okay what sort of. do you make presentations now? meetings yep so it's it's about meetings? yep great, thanks, tom -erm, my name's from edinburgh a couple of jobs one which is the sort of presentations i do tends to be one to one the hardest one for me as i say meetings with quite a lot of people there +erm, my name's from edinburgh a couple of jobs one which is the sort of presentations i do tends to be one to one the hardest one for me as i say meetings with quite a lot of people there right erm, i think i want to try and improve my presentation right, so it's the actual presentation skills themselves that's right and what we actually do when we're standing up so that it becomes more effective yeah? great. -my name's i'm from tarmac construction plant at depot i'm office manager and i'm also in charge of the stores hiring all the plant and equipment for all the sites in our area +my name's i'm from tarmac construction plant at depot i'm office manager and i'm also in charge of the stores hiring all the plant and equipment for all the sites in our area right -i also as many stores as possible +i also as many stores as possible of course erm i don't make presentations as such but erm i do have one to one discussions with on the sites on what plant they need and stores right, yep -basically i hope to be more effective in talking to as i can +basically i hope to be more effective in talking to as i can right, so it's about persuasion isn't it? yeah right,mike -i'm i'm a site agent for tarmac construction at erm i attend quite a few erm presentations really, tender interviews often going to the clients management meetings, site meetings and then like a lot of you the one to one situation. +i'm i'm a site agent for tarmac construction at erm i attend quite a few erm presentations really, tender interviews often going to the clients management meetings, site meetings and then like a lot of you the one to one situation. sure apart from most of those right erm i'd like to be able to present something in front of me which prompts me a bit better than i do at the moment i tend to get lost in what's in front of me. right, right so that's that's partly to do with you your preparation isn't it but it's if i put the word script yeah -we'll i know what we mean yep how do you prepare what what you physically have in front of you so that you're able to put the point over effectively +we'll i know what we mean yep how do you prepare what what you physically have in front of you so that you're able to put the point over effectively yeah right yep great, dave -morning, i'm i'm a site agent for tarmac refurb based in birmingham +morning, i'm i'm a site agent for tarmac refurb based in birmingham yes -erm, the bulk of my presentations are obviously site based, site meetings,meetings meetings. -i have been involved in meetings +erm, the bulk of my presentations are obviously site based, site meetings,meetings meetings. +i have been involved in meetings right for a variety of different contracts er my last presentation was a site meeting last thursday right @@ -43019,19 +42977,19 @@ keeping the meetings as precise because i tend to my meetings wandering and ah, okay now that's that's keeping to the theme of the meeting yes, okay now that's about meetings as such isn't it which is a which is almost another subject but i know what you mean it's about timing in a way yes, that's what you're saying? -we're not gonna get into anything about chairmanship of meetings on this course, there is a meeting's course that does that so i don't want to promise you something that i'm not gonna i'm not gonna be able to deliver i know what you mean certainly in terms of timing of your presentation keeping t time with your presentation we'll be looking at that and help you achieve that. +we're not gonna get into anything about chairmanship of meetings on this course, there is a meeting's course that does that so i don't want to promise you something that i'm not gonna i'm not gonna be able to deliver i know what you mean certainly in terms of timing of your presentation keeping t time with your presentation we'll be looking at that and help you achieve that. so can we can we keep it to that? yep, fine -okay, i ju as i say i don't want to promise you something that that i know i'm not going to be able to achieve in these two days because that's not yep certainly if you want to talk about that you know as a separate thing outside the time then then we'll be able to help you do that, okay? +okay, i ju as i say i don't want to promise you something that that i know i'm not going to be able to achieve in these two days because that's not yep certainly if you want to talk about that you know as a separate thing outside the time then then we'll be able to help you do that, okay? okay yep -as i say i don't want to promise you something and and then and then at the end you say well hang on we didn't look at that because that's not within the agenda of of these two days. +as i say i don't want to promise you something and and then and then at the end you say well hang on we didn't look at that because that's not within the agenda of of these two days. okay, so what we're looking at over these two days and what in order for you to be able to say yes we've achieved the objectives er by tomorrow is how to use that time that we have to prepare to to the most er efficient and effective so that e the preparation you know when you've prepared it that yes when i stand up to speak i'm gonna be able to put these points over effectively and make the presentation memorable. confidence and in a way that attaches to also nerves, how to be able to stand up and appear confident, appear that you know what you're talking about and you are you can confidently put your message across. some feedback now jeff said okay he's done this course before and he's looking for feedback to to see the level of his competence at this point, but everybody er i'm sure you will agree by the end of tomorrow will have got feedback. feedback on how effective you are and how your effectiveness has increased over the two days. because when all said and done if at the end of two days you don't feel that you're any better at making a presentation then when you started then why have you been here for two days. so certainly in terms of feedback erm and how to deal with these nerves. -what to understand to understand what they're about. +what to understand to understand what they're about. to make sure that we're able to put our point across clearly so that we speak in a clear way so that people don't have any er doubts as to what you actually mean. when we've prepared how do we then effectively present. what are the skills we need to stand up and be able to present effectively? @@ -43043,23 +43001,23 @@ erm and how we can speak to time and how we can control that time and make sure so if by the end of tomorrow we can say yes we've achieved all that have have we got a course? yep okay. these these are a measure aren't they they're a measure of the quality of what we're going to do over the next two days and therefore i will come back to these tomorrow afternoon i will check through them and if everybody can say yes yes i'm satisfied with that then we've achieved what we set out to achieve today. -okay now as those of you who have been on a course will know er on a training course one thing i particularly ask you and we all do is to be open minded. +okay now as those of you who have been on a course will know er on a training course one thing i particularly ask you and we all do is to be open minded. we're here for two days and i'm going to present to what to some of you will be some new ideas some new concepts that you've perhaps never come across before. so i ask you to be open minded they may seem a little bit off the wall to start with, but everything that we do is done for a purpose to achieve er what we're wanting to achieve and what i do want to achieve is by the end of tomorrow is to have given you a system. now you might think presentation and a system do they go together? what i'll do is give you a system whereby even at the drop of a hat you will be able to put together a few words and speak with clarity, speak coherently and be able to put your point of view across. -you know the situations where you're in a i don't know a meeting in some presentation and somebody wants you to give a vote of thanks have you ever had that,i had that birmingham university one time. -i'm a member of the institution of electrical engineers and er because i'm by background an electronics engineer and i was at a meeting there where a chap was giving a talk on design express lifts you know at northampton and the chairman stood up and introduced doctor whoever he was sat down turned round to me in the second row and said could you give a vote of thanks at the end. +you know the situations where you're in a i don't know a meeting in some presentation and somebody wants you to give a vote of thanks have you ever had that,i had that birmingham university one time. +i'm a member of the institution of electrical engineers and er because i'm by background an electronics engineer and i was at a meeting there where a chap was giving a talk on design express lifts you know at northampton and the chairman stood up and introduced doctor whoever he was sat down turned round to me in the second row and said could you give a vote of thanks at the end. so i'm hoping that this system that i give you will allow you to do that, anybody been a best man at a wedding? what do you say at a wedding. oh dear me so i'm hoping that the system that i give you will allow you to deal with all those situations as well as make a longer presentation where you do have some preparation time. so be opened minded. i take on board these ideas for these two days. -at the end of two days you say well fine but it's not for me i can't do anything about that when you walk out the room but i hope my objective is to convince you that here is something that like lots of other people in time i can it's a very very useful system. +at the end of two days you say well fine but it's not for me i can't do anything about that when you walk out the room but i hope my objective is to convince you that here is something that like lots of other people in time i can it's a very very useful system. .. try it out when you leave here, try it out in the meetings and the presentations that you have to make i encourage you to do that, to try it out in your day to day working and for those people who have either already been on this course or are coming on this course after you that you meet encourage them to do the same, because there's nothing like encouragement and feedback from each other to be able to use these new ideas. -and of course if you've got any questions in the two days i'm not just going to er at you all the time you know it's participation is this so any questions that you have any comments you want to make please feel free to make them at any time it's not going to throw me. +and of course if you've got any questions in the two days i'm not just going to er at you all the time you know it's participation is this so any questions that you have any comments you want to make please feel free to make them at any time it's not going to throw me. you have a set of notes here now i'm not gonna start at page one and work right through to page whatever it is erm they are there for you to take away for you to make notes during these two days er and for you to take away so that they're they're for revision and er there are as bob's just discovering pages where a i'll ask you to make make specific notes er that i'll supply to you as we go along. -okay then let me just by way of er introduction er to the concepts and the content of what we're going to do over the next two days let me just put a very small fraction of a picture up here. +okay then let me just by way of er introduction er to the concepts and the content of what we're going to do over the next two days let me just put a very small fraction of a picture up here. i don't know if anybody's seen this before. anybody want to stake a month's salary on what this is a picture of? a church @@ -43094,7 +43052,7 @@ so those are all if you like the background, the things that do change but the f so but nevertheless we will look at a little bit at those peripheral things, but we're going to concentrate mainly on the design and on the delivery of a presentation so that's what we want to what we want to look at over the next two days. but of course if we're going to do that we need somewhere to start and where we're going to start is that i'm going to ask you to each to make a presentation, a very short presentation. so what i'd like you to do if you haven't got some paper there's stacks of paper here and what i'd like you to do is grab a piece of paper and write down what i'm going to tell you. -okay i'm going to ask each of you to speak for three minutes so you might like to jot that down. +okay i'm going to ask each of you to speak for three minutes so you might like to jot that down. a three minute presentation okay. okay here we go then. well the first question i want to ask you is how do you feel you got on in those presentations. @@ -43102,7 +43060,7 @@ got it over and done with got it over and done with yes, yes somebody somebody dried up did they nobody sort of er i wish it was true well okay. -the the first question is this is this thing about nerves isn't it because that's the first feeling you have when you got up get up here is and as said i'm dry already and i haven't even been up there and done it yet the voice is dry and you know then you feel a bit shaky and all that sort of thing and why do we why do we feel nervous? +the the first question is this is this thing about nerves isn't it because that's the first feeling you have when you got up get up here is and as said i'm dry already and i haven't even been up there and done it yet the voice is dry and you know then you feel a bit shaky and all that sort of thing and why do we why do we feel nervous? a fool of ourselves sorry in case we make a fool of ourselves @@ -43133,7 +43091,7 @@ in the br at the back of the brain there is the pi pituitary thank you pituitary gland biology -well done, i never can get that word out i stumble with it every time and that gets a signal from the brain that says this is a difficult situation this is something i'm not used to this is some i it's very primitive it's it's from the days in the jungle or whatever er a fear of fright over absolute it's fight or flight, and that's why you start breathing quicker because the blood wants more oxygen because it's ready to run or to fight because the muscles, it is +well done, i never can get that word out i stumble with it every time and that gets a signal from the brain that says this is a difficult situation this is something i'm not used to this is some i it's very primitive it's it's from the days in the jungle or whatever er a fear of fright over absolute it's fight or flight, and that's why you start breathing quicker because the blood wants more oxygen because it's ready to run or to fight because the muscles, it is it's true it's absolutely true and this shaking is the limbs are ready to spring into action one way or another and this gland injects adrenalin or sorry it sends a signal to the adrenal glands which sit on the top of the kidneys yeah, and pumps adrenalin into the blood which again is something that makes you ready and that's what all these things about about a dry throat a wonky voice a shaking limbs is all about a very primitive instinct of fight or flight. @@ -43144,8 +43102,8 @@ sorry when nobody else is here when nobody else is here but i mean one definition of that is that you're asleep yeah. if there's no sort of arousal of any sort yep. -let's just plot a graph when we stand up here we're wanting to perform right we're wanting to do an activity we have some level of anxiety. -now we've just said there needs to be some level somewhere if you're right down this end of the curve here you're either asleep or dead so there's some peak performance at some level of anxiety or arousal and as the anxiety increases the performance drops off. +let's just plot a graph when we stand up here we're wanting to perform right we're wanting to do an activity we have some level of anxiety. +now we've just said there needs to be some level somewhere if you're right down this end of the curve here you're either asleep or dead so there's some peak performance at some level of anxiety or arousal and as the anxiety increases the performance drops off. okay. but you have to have some level of arousal has to be something pumping round you round your blood your brain has to be working in some way to be able to perform. so we have some peak okay at which we are performing. @@ -43153,23 +43111,23 @@ right down this other end of the curve the level of anxiety is so high that perf i mean there was a classic case a couple of years ago of a lady who was pushing a baby in a pram across a zebra crossing and as she was half way across out of the corner of her eye she saw a truck thundering towards her which was quite clearly wasn't going to stop and that you know a sort of fairly anxious situation, and she froze. she could not move. she absolutely could not move because her level of arousal was so high she had no performance her performance being walking in that case -well but i mean that's an example and as i say at this end where you've no arousal you're either asleep or dead, there's no sort of performance performance of any sort and we talk about having those butterflies in the stomach don't we? +well but i mean that's an example and as i say at this end where you've no arousal you're either asleep or dead, there's no sort of performance performance of any sort and we talk about having those butterflies in the stomach don't we? we talk about the butterflies and that that's to do with this this effect of the the adrenalin in the system. now the professional presenter is the one who can get them to fly in formation . it's it's not about being able to get rid of them totally and we agree that we need some sort of level of arousal it's being able to perform despite them to use that arousal to put into an effective presentation, and that's what this two days is about is getting those butterflies for you to fly in formation. to be able to actually present effectively whilst still having those butterflies whilst still having that that slightly anxious feeling. i get it, i get it every time i come into one of these but i i hope that i've got it in got them in formation. -now the purpose of therefore of this training course and any any training course is to do this is to be able to handle the arousal and increase your level of performance and even get the peak to move that way so for any level of arousal you're getting better performance but you're also able to handle a bit more butterflies a bit more of the nerves in order to perform effectively, and apart from a training course like this how do you achieve that? +now the purpose of therefore of this training course and any any training course is to do this is to be able to handle the arousal and increase your level of performance and even get the peak to move that way so for any level of arousal you're getting better performance but you're also able to handle a bit more butterflies a bit more of the nerves in order to perform effectively, and apart from a training course like this how do you achieve that? experience experience, which is based on practice practice, doing it yep. so when i said to bob this morning was it bob, i said don't i don't have a magic wand that's gonna get rid of them but what i hope i'm gonna give you over these two days is a system whereby you can use that and can support you so you're able to effectively present despite having the nerves and be able to put over your point of view effectively, yeah? -how do you feel about that yeah okay. +how do you feel about that yeah okay. yeah everybody everybody happy well i you just sort of went like that and i wasn't quite sure whether you was sort it was an early morning -oh sorry so that's that's what it's what it's about so what we want to do then over these next two days is to develop the skills of design and delivery and will allow us to do that allow us to improve our performance despite the fact that we do have the nerves and by practice by doing it by putting yourself in the situation where you have to make a presentation and almost as one chap said one time sitting there actually with your sitting there remembering he said actually volunteer to make presentations to the other people there . +oh sorry so that's that's what it's what it's about so what we want to do then over these next two days is to develop the skills of design and delivery and will allow us to do that allow us to improve our performance despite the fact that we do have the nerves and by practice by doing it by putting yourself in the situation where you have to make a presentation and almost as one chap said one time sitting there actually with your sitting there remembering he said actually volunteer to make presentations to the other people there . but it's it's about about doing that and about being able to practice and use these skills and techniques so that we can improve performance. so let's let's look at what we can do then. well okay this morning what i'd like to do in the half hour or so that we've got before lunch is to talk about the skills we need when we actually come up here to deliver then this afternoon we'll look at that feedback from the video and what you did and then we'll move on to the skills of design, the preparation skills. @@ -43248,8 +43206,8 @@ pregnant pause pregnant pau that's right a pregnant pause isn't it? i mean but it's perhaps one of the most difficult things when you start out doing presentations isn't it. -because you get that silence in the room and mmm you want to fill it so but you're right the use of the pause effective and particularly with a variation in pitch that gives that emphasis the two combined together can be very very effective. -okay so the power the pace the pitch and the pause all to do with voice and slight variations on those compared with normal one to one conversation okay. +because you get that silence in the room and mmm you want to fill it so but you're right the use of the pause effective and particularly with a variation in pitch that gives that emphasis the two combined together can be very very effective. +okay so the power the pace the pitch and the pause all to do with voice and slight variations on those compared with normal one to one conversation okay. so that's about the voice itself now under paralinguistics also comes that the concept of words. words are are i mean what are words? a simple thing to say but what are words? @@ -43261,7 +43219,7 @@ could express feelings yes. facts thoughts facts feelings yes thoughts absolutely there there there a code aren't they? -i mean if you speak three different languages you could use three different words to put the same sort of thought of a picture dog, chien, hound there's probably an italian and a and that but if you speak the languages then different words different codes if you like are for the same idea. +i mean if you speak three different languages you could use three different words to put the same sort of thought of a picture dog, chien, hound there's probably an italian and a and that but if you speak the languages then different words different codes if you like are for the same idea. so that's what words are about. now brr any anybody here like me from yorkshire? no you're from slightly further north. @@ -43281,26 +43239,26 @@ no no yes but i know what you're saying -alright yeah, okay you see the point that that it's it's words what the heck's he talking +alright yeah, okay you see the point that that it's it's words what the heck's he talking no no i know exactly oh you did, yeah it's it's er no but i mean in terms of the actual word you don't know what it is no er it's it's about geography isn't it? er coming from different areas of the country. right let me just explain then just just for the sake of completeness. -erm in the days when they had terraced houses back to back terraced houses erm well anywhere in the country i guess but but where i come from it was fine for the people who lived with their doors on the on the road but the people who lived at the other side of the block they couldn't get from the road so every so often down the down the terrace they had a little alley way an entry i think you'd probably call it in scotland, don't they? -we talking about this and i was saying about coming from construction i says i've says i've to go up the cut like +erm in the days when they had terraced houses back to back terraced houses erm well anywhere in the country i guess but but where i come from it was fine for the people who lived with their doors on the on the road but the people who lived at the other side of the block they couldn't get from the road so every so often down the down the terrace they had a little alley way an entry i think you'd probably call it in scotland, don't they? +we talking about this and i was saying about coming from construction i says i've says i've to go up the cut like oh the cut yeah -where i call the cut, and he's going the cut what cut that's the canal i says up the cut between the two the two buildings she said no that's the alley +where i call the cut, and he's going the cut what cut that's the canal i says up the cut between the two the two buildings she said no that's the alley that's the alley, yeah, or the ginnel or the snicket you know or in liverpool they call it a jigger or the cut yeah so you see the point, if you're making a presentation and you use words like that based on where you come from the geography you know your regional variations then it's a bit it's a bit difficult for er effective communication isn't it? so we have think about making sure that we use or if we use a word and people don't understand it explain it -explain it, absolutely now so that's about words based on geographical variations or regional variations within the country er er something to be avoided but what about in the industry you're in. +explain it, absolutely now so that's about words based on geographical variations or regional variations within the country er er something to be avoided but what about in the industry you're in. jargon jargon. absolutely yeah. -now there's a word that covers that and that the the choice of words based on on getting it right for the audience particularly in terms of jargon is what is called wordsmith. +now there's a word that covers that and that the the choice of words based on on getting it right for the audience particularly in terms of jargon is what is called wordsmith. cho choosing words in if if you think of a parallel with blacksmith, a blacksmith takes base metal and sort of bends it and shapes it to the appropriate shape. choosing the right words for the audience particularly based on jargon is what's called wordsmith. now somebody said they got involved in prequalification meetings, yeah. @@ -43325,10 +43283,10 @@ itchy ear you've got an itchy ear or an itchy chin absolutely yeah. that it exactly that. so body language if you read a lot of the books on body language it takes one single action and it interprets it based on that. -now if we take it just one step further, there was a lady well there still is a lady called and she did some research, what she was trying to look at was the the sort of body language if you like the actions that people er use and associate that to their personality and she looked particularly at people who were open positive communicators truthful i suppose but people who were open communicators and looked at the sort of things they did and also at people who perhaps weren't quite so honest and open and truthful. +now if we take it just one step further, there was a lady well there still is a lady called and she did some research, what she was trying to look at was the the sort of body language if you like the actions that people er use and associate that to their personality and she looked particularly at people who were open positive communicators truthful i suppose but people who were open communicators and looked at the sort of things they did and also at people who perhaps weren't quite so honest and open and truthful. and she didn't take individual actions what she took was what she called clusters. clusters of actions so she looked at things like the use of the hands the use of the feet the use of the eyes erm and what she called the centre line. -the body's centre line and she equated that and what she said was in terms of the hands that people who were open and positive communicators used on average more symmetrical open palm gestures than individual or closed palm gestures non-symmetrical. +the body's centre line and she equated that and what she said was in terms of the hands that people who were open and positive communicators used on average more symmetrical open palm gestures than individual or closed palm gestures non-symmetrical. and if you look at there are certain er types of people in history who use very non-symmetrical hand gestures who perhaps you might say were not the most open communicators in the world and if you take a film of of erm hitler and er people of that ilk in the second world war and you analyse almost frame by frame you'll see that and count the number of non-symmetrical hand gestures you will find that they're quite high as a percentage. now i'm not saying that we stand here and all we do is that because when you want to emphasise a point then sometimes a a single non-symmetrical a single hand gesture is more appropriate. @@ -43340,28 +43298,28 @@ absolutely, and you will find when we look on the video the number of people who so that is one thing as i develop this theme you'll you'll see. so of course the next question comes well well how do you manage to put it down, i guess?hands we'll come on to that. okay? -now another thing as i said that she looked at in terms of clusters was the centre line. +now another thing as i said that she looked at in terms of clusters was the centre line. now ladies and gentlemen we all know that there are certain parts of the body that it is quite natural that we like to protect such as a direct free kick. erm and and ladies perhaps would tend to do the same sort of thing. -now what that does of course is close off the centre line and what found was that people who were positive communicators as they spoke to somebody they presented the centre line to them. +now what that does of course is close off the centre line and what found was that people who were positive communicators as they spoke to somebody they presented the centre line to them. now if i'm presenting my centre line to tony and speaking to him that feels fine yeah, but if i talk to you dave over my shoulder like that i mean how does that feel? talk to you and tell you something you know it feels as though i don't care lack of interest lack of interest that's right. so presenting the centre line and okay we're going to come on to the eye contact as well in a moment, presenting the centre line with eye contact means that it feels much more positive for the audience in terms of the delivery. -so the centre line is an is an important aspect of now if you're holding your notes yeah i i mean that's not a very open sort of centre line is it because i've got this as a barrier. -in a way this standing behind and it's unfortunate we have to have something as big as this table er and if i stand behind it then you know gordon's not getting my full centre line yep. +so the centre line is an is an important aspect of now if you're holding your notes yeah i i mean that's not a very open sort of centre line is it because i've got this as a barrier. +in a way this standing behind and it's unfortunate we have to have something as big as this table er and if i stand behind it then you know gordon's not getting my full centre line yep. so standing behind a barrier is another thing. -the third aspect the third aspect that er noticed was movement of the feet whilst in this sort of a situation. +the third aspect the third aspect that er noticed was movement of the feet whilst in this sort of a situation. in any communication and mike used that term and this is what this is about in communication there is a gap it doesn't matter whether it's you know writing a letter making a phone call or just standing this sort of distance away. there's a gap over which these words have to flow. yes, there's a gap in this communication. now if i stood here all the time for two days and presented to you just standing here do your eyes move have to move if you're watching me all the time your eyes are fixed aren't they in one position? yeah and the problem is that that because you have to look in one position it means that that the whole thing becomes boring and and your interest starts to drift. but if i'm moving around slightly like this and you're having to follow with your eyes as i'm making my presentation it brings variety to it brings that bit of variety like you said earlier that it brings some interest to it. -so just just small movements of the feet i'm not talking well there's a classic one i had when i was at college we had a lecturer imagine a big lecture theatre you know two hundred people and there was there was a board and he presented his lecture like this,plenty of foot movement but he presented his lecture like and he just walked up and down. +so just just small movements of the feet i'm not talking well there's a classic one i had when i was at college we had a lecturer imagine a big lecture theatre you know two hundred people and there was there was a board and he presented his lecture like this,plenty of foot movement but he presented his lecture like and he just walked up and down. well i mean what do you end up doing if somebody makes a presentation like that. give up watching you either give up watching or you keep a score don't you, yeah? @@ -43370,7 +43328,7 @@ you don't listen to what he's saying because you know just it just becomes so it but but small movement a little bit of movement around and some people did as we'll see when we look at the video this afternoon, but some people you know grew roots er it becomes that way. again it's part of the nervousness yeah i'm gonna put me notes down there and i'm not gonna hold them i you know i don't want to be anywhere away from them so it's all tied up with the preparation as well. but some movement of the feet er is important to keep variety . -so that's what er worked on connection between the cluster of movements and sort of advanced body language if you like and the personality so someone who is perceived as using ja symmetrical palm gestures and open centre line and some movement in the feet is seen more as a as a positive communicator, a more open communicator, and it enhances the quality of the presentation. +so that's what er worked on connection between the cluster of movements and sort of advanced body language if you like and the personality so someone who is perceived as using ja symmetrical palm gestures and open centre line and some movement in the feet is seen more as a as a positive communicator, a more open communicator, and it enhances the quality of the presentation. now there was one other thing that was mentioned. the third aspect was contact with the audience, yeah. audience contact. @@ -43400,9 +43358,9 @@ okay you need to keep their interest don't you? oh absolutely, yes, i mean i mean the effect -sure erm no amount of audience contact will compensate for a boring subject. +sure erm no amount of audience contact will compensate for a boring subject. yeah, oh yes i erm erm i'm not saying that and that's when we come on to the the design and the content that we put in. -yeah, you're absolutely right very important point yeah no amount of eye contact is going to compensate for something that that doesn't hold their interest. +yeah, you're absolutely right very important point yeah no amount of eye contact is going to compensate for something that that doesn't hold their interest. okay. what else then what other methods do we have besides having eye contact what else might we do to involve the audience to make them feel involved? questions @@ -43425,23 +43383,23 @@ ask them yes look directly at them well yeah that's eye contact -well well done thank you +well well done thank you i got it with the fourth one yeah that's right that's right you were just waiting for me to say tom weren't you yes yes that's fine. and some of you some of you did that this morning although you may not have realised it er but you said well well like rob said and er just just making people feel part of it by by using their names and that's exactly the purpose of having these plaques in front and why i asked you to to use erm to put your name on them is so that we can do that. so that we can use people's names as part of the presentation and yeah yeah you know he actually noticed what i said and that sort of thing. so they feel really part of er part of it. -sometimes i've er okay so it seems like it seems like a terrific amount to think about while you're standing here doesn't it as well as thinking about what you're actually the content of what you're actually going to say. -but a lot of these things come quite naturally er i hope we'll see on when we look at the video that really i don't think anybody had a major problem with the voice er and the words as well when you're talking about two million pounds so in terms of the voice i don't believe anybody has any major problems. +sometimes i've er okay so it seems like it seems like a terrific amount to think about while you're standing here doesn't it as well as thinking about what you're actually the content of what you're actually going to say. +but a lot of these things come quite naturally er i hope we'll see on when we look at the video that really i don't think anybody had a major problem with the voice er and the words as well when you're talking about two million pounds so in terms of the voice i don't believe anybody has any major problems. there may be one or two when we might just say well perhaps just a little bit more volume but it's not perhaps just er slacken off on the pace a little bit. so i don't think in terms of paralinguistics anybody here has a major problem. but when we come to look at the cluster and the and the audience contact then then you know we may see something a little bit different, okay but er those are the important aspects things like things like whoops the use of the hands you know several people put their hands in their pockets or put them behind their back or something like that. now that is you know what do you do with these things i mean they're a nuisance when it comes to making a presentation. the secret i find and you may over the next day or day and a half to a couple of days you may well see me just do that occasionally i'll just throw my hands back down to me side. if they get in if they start getting in the way the best thing to do is just let them relax to the side and try and forget about them, i know it's difficult to forget about them but just to the conscious effort with the hands is just to put them at the side. -then as you start to make the point you'll find your hands will come up naturally and bend from the elbows it sounds crazy to say but if if you suddenly go coo i've got everything in me pocket but +then as you start to make the point you'll find your hands will come up naturally and bend from the elbows it sounds crazy to say but if if you suddenly go coo i've got everything in me pocket but just do that that, that's what i find is the best thing to do and then carry on with what you have to say and then the gestures become quite natural because all of this this is is not i'm not trying to -six pairs of opposites and then expanded by okay now that that's fine but how do you move on and where do you move on to in order to get that structured thought pattern? +six pairs of opposites and then expanded by okay now that that's fine but how do you move on and where do you move on to in order to get that structured thought pattern? if you're going to come and stand and present something to somebody there's got to be a reason for it? yes, there must be be a reason and as i'm sure, i mean like like the objective, and then what you can do at this stage in the design process is once you've got the objective then you select those themes or ideas from your what you've done just now to support that objective, so that when you come up my objective is to convince you or my objective is to inform you then the information that you're going to give out supports that objective. so one thing that was mentioned this morning was somebody wanted to be able to be more persuasive in order to put a point of view across. @@ -43452,7 +43410,7 @@ well we've got to select a number of themes to support a given objective. how many themes do we select? so what you've got there is a mass of you've got six twelve words on the first circle and then you've got twenty four words on the outer circle are you gonna dump all that information on to the audience to try and persuade them of your objective? there's only so much that anybody's brain can handle at any one time so let's just do a little experiment because there was a chap called george miller an american psychologist who worked on this idea of what is the capacity of the brain, how many bits of information can the brain hold on to at any given time. -if you turn to page eight what's that john? +if you turn to page eight what's that john? i'm useless at this, i know what's coming. you you know what's coming. @@ -43477,7 +43435,7 @@ nine, o, five, one, six, two, four, seven, three, eight, two, seven. i mean er let's just read them just see how you got on. three, eight, one, five, six, two. okay, seven, four, two, nine, eight, one, three, four, seven, six. -i've got the mixed up +i've got the mixed up yeah and nine, o, five, one, six, two, four, seven, three, eight, two, seven say that one again nine, o, five,one, six, two, four, seven, three , eight, two, seven. @@ -43496,22 +43454,22 @@ a cabbage. there was a game wasn't there that they played cabbage so long as you got the question wrong you got a cabbage if you got it right you got a prize -right that's right +right that's right and that's what the brain's like, you've got to try and hold on to cabbages all these cabbages yeah. you've got to try and hold on to so much information that something eventually has to drop. because some people do get the ten and some people can get to twelve but guess how they do it. -they chunk it up into pairs or groups of three or something like that so four groups of three or two groups of six or whatever, because what miller actually found was the span of conception was and is seven plus or minus two. +they chunk it up into pairs or groups of three or something like that so four groups of three or two groups of six or whatever, because what miller actually found was the span of conception was and is seven plus or minus two. people can hold on to seven plus or minus two bits of information and the plus or minus two he called the local factors which are you know whether it's warm out whether you feel warm or cold or whether or what time of day it is have you just had a heavy lunch whatever it might be. something that effects even the time of the year all sorts of things. -so the maximum is nine that people can hold on to and the thing about nine of course is it splits up into three threes and that's why i say some people will group a twelve number into four threes or something like that or three fours because they're all well within this span of conception. +so the maximum is nine that people can hold on to and the thing about nine of course is it splits up into three threes and that's why i say some people will group a twelve number into four threes or something like that or three fours because they're all well within this span of conception. so as it says at the bottom of page eight there's a golden rule for presenting is use three themes. okay? so the number of themes you use to support your objective is three and then for each of those themes you divide it into three subthemes. remember what i did there i got three themes and for each one i got three subthemes so that what you put over to them to the audience are those three themes. they're able to hold on to that for the duration of the talk and be able to understand them as concepts and therefore it helps to put over the ideas. -so we'll have a coffee break and then what i want you to do when you come back is i'll give you an objective for the talk that you're going to give based on that you've just done and then i want you to select three themes and three sub-themes that will support the objective that you'll then be able to use. +so we'll have a coffee break and then what i want you to do when you come back is i'll give you an objective for the talk that you're going to give based on that you've just done and then i want you to select three themes and three sub-themes that will support the objective that you'll then be able to use. okay? right start again @@ -43525,17 +43483,17 @@ give you headlines and then they start and they go they expand on each headline, and then at the end they give you the headlines again, they summarise it. absolutely, and it does because it a it what dave says it's an emotional whole and you start off and you come back to where you started. it's a whole a complete, and so it it emotionally prepares with the headlines, tell them what you're gonna tell them then you tell them it and then it satisfies them by coming back to where you started. -so in other words it's about an introduction an expansion and an end now as i've said tomorrow i'll fill in a bit more detail on those so if you leave some some gaps there between those three sections. +so in other words it's about an introduction an expansion and an end now as i've said tomorrow i'll fill in a bit more detail on those so if you leave some some gaps there between those three sections. so an introduction do you remember what i said about the the er structured thought pattern you've now got in front of you, let me go to mine which is all blank. -the introduction is good afternoon ladies and gentlemen my name is i'd like to talk to you about flying and i hope to persuade you to come along on saturday and take part in some flying. +the introduction is good afternoon ladies and gentlemen my name is i'd like to talk to you about flying and i hope to persuade you to come along on saturday and take part in some flying. and i'm going to talk to you about three things about the safety of flying, about the cost aspects of flying and the enjoyment that you're going to get out of it when you take part. and that's my introduction, i've told you what i'm gonna tell you. -and then expand on it, and so i go into each of these and i go to the and i say a few words about each of these particular themes. +and then expand on it, and so i go into each of these and i go to the and i say a few words about each of these particular themes. i won't go all through that again. -and when i've expanded and i've told you then i then come back to my ending and i say, okay so what i've done i've told you about three aspects of flying, about the safety of it,ab about the costs involved in taking part in flying and about the enjoyment you're gonna get out of flying and i hope that i've persuaded you that you will come along on saturday to take part, and that's the ending. +and when i've expanded and i've told you then i then come back to my ending and i say, okay so what i've done i've told you about three aspects of flying, about the safety of it,ab about the costs involved in taking part in flying and about the enjoyment you're gonna get out of flying and i hope that i've persuaded you that you will come along on saturday to take part, and that's the ending. so it's use the red obviously the title and the red's for your introduction to say what you're going to say then say it by using your greens and then say what you've said by going back to the red and coming back to your objective. -now coming back to the objective i say it leaves you on a high note then rather than the and that's all i'm gonna say tell them what you're gonna tell them then tell them then tell them what you've told them. +now coming back to the objective i say it leaves you on a high note then rather than the and that's all i'm gonna say tell them what you're gonna tell them then tell them then tell them what you've told them. okay? so that in a nutshell is is what it's about. so you've all got your structured thought pattern now, yeah? @@ -43548,60 +43506,60 @@ javelin, thank you, there's the lady with the javelin then you see or somebody you know looking at the long jump and they're muttering away to themselves. well there're not normally saying will you get out the way before i throw this thing or i'll stab you with it. what they're actually doing is they're affirming to themselves they're verbalising the performance improvement or the performance they're going to give. -remember i asked you this morning to just just after lunch to jot down what it was that you need to improve on just as you're setting the clock just say something like by the end of this talk i'd like you to congratulate me on having moved around a bit more having not put me hands in me pockets, whatever it might be. +remember i asked you this morning to just just after lunch to jot down what it was that you need to improve on just as you're setting the clock just say something like by the end of this talk i'd like you to congratulate me on having moved around a bit more having not put me hands in me pockets, whatever it might be. yeah so just an aff an affirmation of of what you intended. okay morning everybody morning let's a what are we going to be doing today then as dave's already observed because he's seen my notes it's going to be a very full day er so we need to crack on. what i'd like to do first of all is just to summarise wha what we did yesterday. just very quickly summarise that and what i'd like you to do is take notes in the new form that we've got now with er a thought pattern so if you, -morning okay +morning okay excuse me okay we've only barely started if you take a a fresh piece of paper then, a fresh sheet of paper and and er the orientation that you now know we need to do if we're going to do if we're going to do a thought pattern this morning tom, we're jus just gonna summarise what we did yesterday by means of a a thought pattern. -so if in the middle of the page you write day one let's just summarise er what we did yesterday. +so if in the middle of the page you write day one let's just summarise er what we did yesterday. well it was twenty three hours i was going to say twenty four hours ago, but twenty three hours. -we started off with er some introductions and er the introductions, you introduced yourself and we discussed the the objectives that the company have and also the objectives that you have for the course. +we started off with er some introductions and er the introductions, you introduced yourself and we discussed the the objectives that the company have and also the objectives that you have for the course. the objectives give us a way of er measuring at the end of the course whether the course has achieved for you what you wanted from we'll come back as i said to those this afternoon and and just review them to see that you got out of the course what you. okay having done that we discussed what the content of the course was going to be and then i asked you to make a first presentation. -pres presentation one and it was to last three minutes and the subject was what would i do if i won two million pounds and we recorded that er on the c c t v for later playback. -having done that we then talked about the problem that we all have on these sorts of occasions which is the problem of nerves and we talked about the symptoms of dry voice and the shaking limbs the the wonky voice and the reasons why we have er these nerves and we also talked about the causes of the the primitive instinct of fight or flight er how we get get our body ready to handle this unusual situation. +pres presentation one and it was to last three minutes and the subject was what would i do if i won two million pounds and we recorded that er on the c c t v for later playback. +having done that we then talked about the problem that we all have on these sorts of occasions which is the problem of nerves and we talked about the symptoms of dry voice and the shaking limbs the the wonky voice and the reasons why we have er these nerves and we also talked about the causes of the the primitive instinct of fight or flight er how we get get our body ready to handle this unusual situation. and we we discussed the the difference between anxiety and arousal and how we can turn our anxiety into arousal to ensure performance and i plotted a little graph if you remember. -of performance against arousal levels and we agreed that the the purpose of training like this and also putting these principles into practice is to be able to handle more and more arousal er more and more nerves and still and still be able to perform in a confident manner. -we then talked about the first of those two towers of tower bridge if you remember which was about the skills that we need for er delivery. +of performance against arousal levels and we agreed that the the purpose of training like this and also putting these principles into practice is to be able to handle more and more arousal er more and more nerves and still and still be able to perform in a confident manner. +we then talked about the first of those two towers of tower bridge if you remember which was about the skills that we need for er delivery. what are the skills that we need when we stand up in front of people to actually deliver what we have to say and there were three aspects we looked at i wonder why it was three? i wonder why it was three? erm three aspects, first of all there was that little word i gave you er to describe pa paralinguistics -thank you the voice and and the words that we said paralinguistic is correct. -the study of the voice what we say and how we say it i then introduced you to if you like advanced body language and based on the work that marion north did and rather than take an individual movement of the body we took a cluster and how many aspects where there to cluster i wonder there were three weren't there. -hands, feet centre level. +thank you the voice and and the words that we said paralinguistic is correct. +the study of the voice what we say and how we say it i then introduced you to if you like advanced body language and based on the work that marion north did and rather than take an individual movement of the body we took a cluster and how many aspects where there to cluster i wonder there were three weren't there. +hands, feet centre level. okay so paralinguistics, the cluster and the other one was the need for audience contact. the way we get feedback from the audience the way we ensure that we involve the audience as well through the use of the eyes the names er and asking questions. and then we had the moment that a lot of you er weren't looking forward to which was playing the video back, yes. -and this gave you an opportunity to see yourself to see others and to take part in some coaching something that we did again yesterday and we shall be doing again today we then talked about the the design aspect first of all we talked about er the way the brain is involved in this communication and some of the aspects of the brain. -so the brain we talked about the two hemispheres the left and the right hemisphere the fact that the left is very much involved in a a linear way whereas the right is involved in spatial way, anybody remember the relative contribution of the two halves? -yeah ten for the left and ninety for the right and the reason we talked about this and the way that's involved in communication is that we said well if there's a lot more power or a lot more contribution to the design of what we're doing of a spatial nature and that is how the the audience's brain work more powerfully in the spatial nature let's present what we have let's design it and then deliver it as close to a spatial nature as we can okay. +and this gave you an opportunity to see yourself to see others and to take part in some coaching something that we did again yesterday and we shall be doing again today we then talked about the the design aspect first of all we talked about er the way the brain is involved in this communication and some of the aspects of the brain. +so the brain we talked about the two hemispheres the left and the right hemisphere the fact that the left is very much involved in a a linear way whereas the right is involved in spatial way, anybody remember the relative contribution of the two halves? +yeah ten for the left and ninety for the right and the reason we talked about this and the way that's involved in communication is that we said well if there's a lot more power or a lot more contribution to the design of what we're doing of a spatial nature and that is how the the audience's brain work more powerfully in the spatial nature let's present what we have let's design it and then deliver it as close to a spatial nature as we can okay. that was the purpose of talking about about the brain and the two the two aspects of it. and of course the left brain is very much involved in the words the right brain with the ideas, so that's the creative side. okay then we used this er in a way that we're using it right now to er produce our design for what we were going to say through thought patterns. -now nice abbreviation for thought patterns is thop t h o p when we talk about thought patterns or thops a method of gathering ideas a meth a method of getting things down on paper so we don't lose them but not in a linear way in a spatial way a right brain activity. -and what we did we created a framework first of all with six pairs of opposites pairs of opposites and er if you remember this happened in a fairly slow and methodical way very much a left brain activity saying well okay is this a valid pair of opposites to do with that. +now nice abbreviation for thought patterns is thop t h o p when we talk about thought patterns or thops a method of gathering ideas a meth a method of getting things down on paper so we don't lose them but not in a linear way in a spatial way a right brain activity. +and what we did we created a framework first of all with six pairs of opposites pairs of opposites and er if you remember this happened in a fairly slow and methodical way very much a left brain activity saying well okay is this a valid pair of opposites to do with that. so that was that was a very much a left brain activity. -we then moved on and expanded we expanded we brought with with a minimum of two words to do with each of those twelve words that we generated and we did this in a much faster way a much more creative way a right brain activity. +we then moved on and expanded we expanded we brought with with a minimum of two words to do with each of those twelve words that we generated and we did this in a much faster way a much more creative way a right brain activity. when i say a right brain of course it doesn't mean that the left brain's just shut down completely but it's predominantly a a right brain activity it's the the creative part. and then we use this method to then go a stage further to prepare for the second presentation. -so i gave you a topic sport or a hobby or an interest that you had and you produced a thought pattern for that just as we'd done in the practice one with the subject of water, but then we moved on a stage further to get what are called a structured thought pattern. +so i gave you a topic sport or a hobby or an interest that you had and you produced a thought pattern for that just as we'd done in the practice one with the subject of water, but then we moved on a stage further to get what are called a structured thought pattern. structured thought which had as its main attributes three themes of course before you had that you had to have a clear objective which helped you to choose what those three themes were, and why why did we choose three as a based on yeah -yeah, yes verbally yes if we're writing we'd actually be six but it was it was the span of conception wasn't it the capacity of the brain the span of conception says that if you deliver your presentation in groups of three in three themes and three subthemes then the audience is able to hold on to that and the way in which we set up the delivery or the way in which we delivered the structured thought pattern was through method +yeah, yes verbally yes if we're writing we'd actually be six but it was it was the span of conception wasn't it the capacity of the brain the span of conception says that if you deliver your presentation in groups of three in three themes and three subthemes then the audience is able to hold on to that and the way in which we set up the delivery or the way in which we delivered the structured thought pattern was through method aldershot -aldershot method yeah which goes under the little the little rhyme words can anybody remember +aldershot method yeah which goes under the little the little rhyme words can anybody remember that's it that's it as dave described it it's an emotional whole it's it's er satisfying er to the listener. it's complete in itself and er people by human nature like things to be complete or whole it is it is emotionally satisfying. -so basically that was er an introduction an expansion and an ending. +so basically that was er an introduction an expansion and an ending. the aldershot method. got through quite a bit yesterday didn't we? quite a bit there er when you lay it out like that in a pattern a thought pattern which shows just how much er we did actually get through er from where you started at ten in the morning or just after with the presentation right through to the second presentation. @@ -43611,25 +43569,25 @@ so it does get used ha ha in a practical way. it would be very strange if i stood here saying don't use a linear script use thought patterns and yet i was reading everything off a linear script wouldn't it? you sort of wouldn't really believe that er i was serious about it. okay right what i'd like you to then select red on your pen. -now in a way what you could say what we have here is a trunk of a tree and the branches and then the leaves and the fruit at different levels on this . +now in a way what you could say what we have here is a trunk of a tree and the branches and then the leaves and the fruit at different levels on this . what i'd like you to do is put put a rectangle round three words, it doesn't matter where they are on on the whole thought pattern, three words that are the highlights what were the three things that were the highlights or the most important thing for you yesterday. -for instance i might go erm that one that one and er that one. +for instance i might go erm that one that one and er that one. okay just a rectangle round three three er things that were the highlights for you yesterday the most important things that er came through to you yesterday. -so he knows what's coming +so he knows what's coming the eyes don't ya. some a lot of you said yesterday that you don't always get in this formal situation having to stand up in front of people. but what if you have sort of meetings one to one or even even in three or fours. -so you know when you get in a meeting sometimes you've got a point of view on an agenda item and you think how where am i gonna get support for for my point of view on the meeting? -or you know you're in a meeting and the chairman what's your opinion john on this where you what do you think about this? +so you know when you get in a meeting sometimes you've got a point of view on an agenda item and you think how where am i gonna get support for for my point of view on the meeting? +or you know you're in a meeting and the chairman what's your opinion john on this where you what do you think about this? a good way of doing it is the aldershot method, how to your put your point across very very clearly but also succinctly you know short and to the point. -so if somebody said to me what what were the highlights for you yesterday, aldershot method tell them what you tell them just list them. +so if somebody said to me what what were the highlights for you yesterday, aldershot method tell them what you tell them just list them. so what are the three important things for me yesterday were the aldershot method the arousal curve and the need for audience contact so i told them what i'm gonna tell them. now i tell them why if you're gonna tell somebody why why your opinion is something the word because is bound to come into the sentence soon. -so i've said i've listed them well the important points for me were the aldershot method the arousal curve and the need for audience content. +so i've said i've listed them well the important points for me were the aldershot method the arousal curve and the need for audience content. the aldershot method was particularly important for me because i realised that it's something we use every day or we see every day er and it emotionally prepares the audience the listener for what i'm going to say. tell them what you're going to tell them before you tell them, and then summarise it at the end and tell them what you told them. it's emotionally satisfying it's a very important method to get a point across. -the need for arousal thought well should i be absolutely calm when i'm giving a presentation but i never am so is it right and now understanding that you need a certain level of arousal to be able to perform at all is is satisfying for me because at least i understand the situation now and able to work with it rather than against it . +the need for arousal thought well should i be absolutely calm when i'm giving a presentation but i never am so is it right and now understanding that you need a certain level of arousal to be able to perform at all is is satisfying for me because at least i understand the situation now and able to work with it rather than against it . and audience content when you're making a presentation i feel that's very important because you need to have feedback as to how well things are going. if you don't look people in the eye if you don't involve them then they're not with you and if the audience aren't with you then the presentation doesn't . so for me the three points were the aldershot method er the importance of understanding arousal and the need for audience contact. @@ -43641,9 +43599,9 @@ so obviously if mike's been chosen once or he's done it he doesn't want somebody so just jot down at the side of the page the other eleven names in the room okay everybody's tony, mike, jeff, sarah, bob, rob, gordon, john, tom, joanne, mike dave. just jot the other people's names down and then obviously when they've been they've said their piece just strike their name through so you don't go and . tony, mike, jeff, sarah, bob, rob, gordon, john, tom, joanne, mike, dave. -you should have eleven names down there are you alright can you see where have you got to rob -rob yeah gordon, rob, gordon john joanne mike and dave -okay right let's the meeting. +you should have eleven names down there are you alright can you see where have you got to rob +rob yeah gordon, rob, gordon john joanne mike and dave +okay right let's the meeting. so you've you've got your three points so remember the er the aldershot just list what they are then expand briefly on them then list them again and then invite somebody else to to give their er their opinions. okay? morning everybody erm the three points that were important for me yesterday were the aldershot method the the arousal curve and the need for audience contact. @@ -43653,29 +43611,29 @@ arousal curve well understanding the need for arousal for me helped because i no and the need for audience contact i found particularly important because if you get feedback from the audience looking them in the eye involving them then you're able to know how your talk is progressing and whether you need to modify it in any way to be able to maintain the audience's interest. so in summary the three points for me were the aldershot method the arousal curve and the need for audience contact. bob what did you find yesterday? -the cluster i found particularly er important and so like yourself the aldershot method and structured thought patterns er the cluster was important er because as you say when people have got nerves they need to get some basic guidelines for overcoming the problem er we all tend to put our hands in our pockets and stand rooted to the spot and all the rest of it but there are ways of overcoming it, it's just a matter of practice erm the aldershot method is er obviously a very effective method erm if you get into the habit of doing it in threes er erm you see every day you use the news at ten news at ten analogy obviously -obviously identifiable it's a very effective one and also the structured thought patterns idea er before you go into something to actually sit down and prepare something er your thoughts in a developing from there er it's a very simple thing to do but very effective. -those are the three things the aldershot sorry the cluster the aldershot method and structured thought patterns yesterday +the cluster i found particularly er important and so like yourself the aldershot method and structured thought patterns er the cluster was important er because as you say when people have got nerves they need to get some basic guidelines for overcoming the problem er we all tend to put our hands in our pockets and stand rooted to the spot and all the rest of it but there are ways of overcoming it, it's just a matter of practice erm the aldershot method is er obviously a very effective method erm if you get into the habit of doing it in threes er erm you see every day you use the news at ten news at ten analogy obviously +obviously identifiable it's a very effective one and also the structured thought patterns idea er before you go into something to actually sit down and prepare something er your thoughts in a developing from there er it's a very simple thing to do but very effective. +those are the three things the aldershot sorry the cluster the aldershot method and structured thought patterns yesterday you were looking at me i knew you were going to say that again the three things that came out for me yesterday were the structured thought patterns obviously the arousal and the need for audience contact. -i found the erm structured thought patterns and the span of conception is very interesting in the fact that you do things in threes and obviously that gives a certain logic net to everything that you do and the way that you prepare your presentation . +i found the erm structured thought patterns and the span of conception is very interesting in the fact that you do things in threes and obviously that gives a certain logic net to everything that you do and the way that you prepare your presentation . the arousal i've always thought that er that you shouldn't be nervous but you always are but obviously as you're nervous when you do a whole host of things and nerves as you become more skilled at it go away er and i'd assume that like most things that the nerves will totally disappear and was somewhat surprised to find out that you're always aroused that's right -when when you do that, and obviously the need to gauge the erm presentation against audience contact to see that they're involved and they're obviously understanding what you're saying and pick them up and grab them. +when when you do that, and obviously the need to gauge the erm presentation against audience contact to see that they're involved and they're obviously understanding what you're saying and pick them up and grab them. so for me the three things were the structured thought patterns plus the arousal and the need for audience contact. what did you think sarah? i found the three most important things for me yesterday were the span of conception the clusters and the whole subject of nerves. -the span of conception useful to gather that three is the best number and dividing it up into threes and threes again was simplest and effective way of setting it up. +the span of conception useful to gather that three is the best number and dividing it up into threes and threes again was simplest and effective way of setting it up. clusters and nerves well again i always felt that nerves were supposed to go away when you got good at things, now i'm pleased to discover that isn't true. -i also found that the clusters was useful for we all said guidelines +i also found that the clusters was useful for we all said guidelines what to do when you stand up there like an idiot so to sum up that the three most important things the span of conception nerves and clusters. -erm from yesterday er i think meself personally i'm very methodical sort of person and i felt what was most important the revelations meself was thought patterns and the use of most structured structured in a presentation and also the importance i couldn't believe how that using them made such a difference actually to yourself when you're standing there and the audience participation erm thought patterns well i've always used that was just a revelation i mean i've never -thought it could be so easy to put me thoughts on a piece of paper could help me so much i think that's what i thought patterns structured +erm from yesterday er i think meself personally i'm very methodical sort of person and i felt what was most important the revelations meself was thought patterns and the use of most structured structured in a presentation and also the importance i couldn't believe how that using them made such a difference actually to yourself when you're standing there and the audience participation erm thought patterns well i've always used that was just a revelation i mean i've never +thought it could be so easy to put me thoughts on a piece of paper could help me so much i think that's what i thought patterns structured well yesterday the three things that i felt that were most useful to me was one the delivery two the coaching and the thought patterns. -erm thought patterns being actually understanding laying it out and seeing the way it works which obviously structured thought patterns but it's the basis of and grasping erm actually delivering it your delivery erm of it using the cluster but the coaching was invaluable, it was constructive criticism we all know what was wrong and it it just helped yesterday for someone not to be coaching just to help you through it erm and i think all those three things became invaluable really mean because most of those leads on to the other ones structured erm so the sort of thought patterns the coaching and the was very good -well, things that i learnt yesterday was erm aldershot method the structured thought patterns and the coaching erm the aldershot method is tremendous i liked that a lot for expansion editing summarising and first class and i will use it from now on. -erm the aldershot method works or appears to work very well with structured thoughts the two merge together very well and erm again that's the putting down on paper i didn't believe that had actually talk at all and yet it works and as you read it things come into the brain and when you combined all that with the coaching and you can see what you're doing wrong the rest of it. -again that's excellent but it's also also to see yourself video +erm thought patterns being actually understanding laying it out and seeing the way it works which obviously structured thought patterns but it's the basis of and grasping erm actually delivering it your delivery erm of it using the cluster but the coaching was invaluable, it was constructive criticism we all know what was wrong and it it just helped yesterday for someone not to be coaching just to help you through it erm and i think all those three things became invaluable really mean because most of those leads on to the other ones structured erm so the sort of thought patterns the coaching and the was very good +well, things that i learnt yesterday was erm aldershot method the structured thought patterns and the coaching erm the aldershot method is tremendous i liked that a lot for expansion editing summarising and first class and i will use it from now on. +erm the aldershot method works or appears to work very well with structured thoughts the two merge together very well and erm again that's the putting down on paper i didn't believe that had actually talk at all and yet it works and as you read it things come into the brain and when you combined all that with the coaching and you can see what you're doing wrong the rest of it. +again that's excellent but it's also also to see yourself video erm and realise that no you don't sound quite as bad as you think you might. so the three things that really got me yesterday was the aldershot method the structured thoughts and the coaching they all went together very well and rob let's see what he thinks well the three things that er were most significant for me yesterday were the cluster the thought patterns and the aldershot method. @@ -43687,41 +43645,41 @@ so the end the three things for me yesterday cluster, thought patterns and the a thank you very much well for me exactly the same as bob sorry robert, the aldershot method plus er the thought processes. the aldershot method because er it it sort of explained to me the most effect way of getting across whatever you want to say so that made me a feel a bit happier about that. -it also made me think that perhaps i had more control over the whole presentation generally which is my biggest concern so get up there and just do some and therefore it's going to go on to the confidence side of it. +it also made me think that perhaps i had more control over the whole presentation generally which is my biggest concern so get up there and just do some and therefore it's going to go on to the confidence side of it. the cluster erm i was always very aware of this bit so it made me you know aware that there are things you can do and watching everybody just seemed just the answer inside you. it didn't look er odd it looked okay so that would make me a bit more confident i think a bit less self conscious. -but the most important thing i thought was the thought process i mean just just saying this while you were just going on i just jotted down in the same way you could come off with three ideas that around and i felt that was that was ideal. -it keeps the your your presentation and it stops those pregnant er pauses you know suddenly you realise christ i've forgotten lost the thing. +but the most important thing i thought was the thought process i mean just just saying this while you were just going on i just jotted down in the same way you could come off with three ideas that around and i felt that was that was ideal. +it keeps the your your presentation and it stops those pregnant er pauses you know suddenly you realise christ i've forgotten lost the thing. so for me aldershot method, cluster but most important was the thought patterns. gordon er yes there the three things i got out of erm yesterday's course was the thought patterns the aldershot method and the delivery. the thought patterns allow me to erm put down what i wanted to talk about, expand on it and at the same time break it down into areas and on the other and spend some time on each area. the aldershot method erm because it showing you how you broke that subject down allows you to erm introduce it expand on it and summarise at the end. er the delivery part it was more the cluster but the overall delivery allowed me to prepare how i was going to be standing er how to get the audience in contact with me the eye the eye contact and also the way i spoke. -so to summarise the thought patterns the aldershot method jeff +so to summarise the thought patterns the aldershot method jeff the three things that came out of yesterday for meself were the the aldershot method the delivery . the aldershot principally because it gave a structure to what i had to say at least went up there fairly confident of what i had . -the delivery because it gave me what i had to think about when i was up there language body language and then the playbacks i could look at the two things that mike just highlighted as one and two. +the delivery because it gave me what i had to think about when i was up there language body language and then the playbacks i could look at the two things that mike just highlighted as one and two. the aldershot method the structure of what i said and the way the delivery had come across. the feedback gave me a review of those questions. -so out of yesterday it was how to put the structure together as the delivery of how it came across and what the audience's reaction was to it. +so out of yesterday it was how to put the structure together as the delivery of how it came across and what the audience's reaction was to it. morning ladies and gentlemen -carry on mike and then to john +carry on mike and then to john good morning ladies and gentlemen the three main items i got out of yesterday was the er structured thought patterns the cluster and the playback -the structured thought patterns i found that the most important because when i was up at the table on the second presentation i was able to have my thoughts relating to the layout already and with in fact just the single element of the subject shown on my paper i could immediately focus on that and in fact give the details of that right the way through. -on the cluster erm not having in fact had any erm work on this type of thing before i didn't realise that holding a paper could close you down and in fact without moving my feet i wasn't getting movement i was just static and with no use of the hands you were to express yourself sufficiently. -with the playback that in fact erm as has said it showed me what in fact i was doing right and wrong, erm i've been on television before once when i was running the london marathon but this time it was actually me and me alone in a work element and i could in fact see what i was doing and why i was doing it and understand in fact the corrections from the morning to in fact the afternoon presentation when i came back for the second one. +the structured thought patterns i found that the most important because when i was up at the table on the second presentation i was able to have my thoughts relating to the layout already and with in fact just the single element of the subject shown on my paper i could immediately focus on that and in fact give the details of that right the way through. +on the cluster erm not having in fact had any erm work on this type of thing before i didn't realise that holding a paper could close you down and in fact without moving my feet i wasn't getting movement i was just static and with no use of the hands you were to express yourself sufficiently. +with the playback that in fact erm as has said it showed me what in fact i was doing right and wrong, erm i've been on television before once when i was running the london marathon but this time it was actually me and me alone in a work element and i could in fact see what i was doing and why i was doing it and understand in fact the corrections from the morning to in fact the afternoon presentation when i came back for the second one. so the main elements for me were the thought process the cluster and the playback. now let's john john erm the three things i i er got most out of yesterday were the structured thought patterns, playback and the audience contact. -the structured the structured thought patterns gave me an actual er organisation to my talk be it only just a few words on a piece of paper it was simple yet er gave the organisation to the actual talk while you stood up in front of an audience. -er the audience contact when you were actually stood up in the front and you're there on your own just getting a little bit of feedback from the audience itself er does help and then the playback which erm i think it helped a lot to see how you faired particularly on that fir first attempt what areas you had to concentrate on to rectify your problems. +the structured the structured thought patterns gave me an actual er organisation to my talk be it only just a few words on a piece of paper it was simple yet er gave the organisation to the actual talk while you stood up in front of an audience. +er the audience contact when you were actually stood up in the front and you're there on your own just getting a little bit of feedback from the audience itself er does help and then the playback which erm i think it helped a lot to see how you faired particularly on that fir first attempt what areas you had to concentrate on to rectify your problems. so in summary the three main things i got out of yesterday were the structured thought patterns the playback and the audience contact. great thank you all very much indeed. so i hope you see, that this aldershot method which several people have mentioned is is a very effective way of structuring what you do here it can also be used very simply in in a meeting just to be able to put your point across simply but effectively. -so that's another situation and as we'll talk about and i hinted at yesterday er the dreaded vote of thanks situation and the the er giving of the gold watch and er and the being a best man at a wedding or even a bride or groom at a wedding er again is a is a way of helping this aldershot method is a way of helping you to to get your thoughts together and put them across effectively. +so that's another situation and as we'll talk about and i hinted at yesterday er the dreaded vote of thanks situation and the the er giving of the gold watch and er and the being a best man at a wedding or even a bride or groom at a wedding er again is a is a way of helping this aldershot method is a way of helping you to to get your thoughts together and put them across effectively. so what else are we going to do today then. two things i want to just touch on er fairly briefly er because of the time factor but i do want to touch on before you get into continuing with your er development for your third presentation. er the questions of how to handle questions and also the use of visual aids. @@ -43740,7 +43698,7 @@ i let the audience draw their own thought patterns yep that produces something that then moves on to discussions right -i call it no notes at all +i call it no notes at all right and they write the lecture for me they write yeah @@ -43753,7 +43711,7 @@ well what i do it on is planning oh yes and er control of sub contractors then you get a mixed group from tarmac er different companies and their conception of what planning is and conception of what controlling sub contractor is yeah -is totally different so i did the first lecture with what my idea of to find myself talking to a a contract housing guy whose biggest order was two thousand pounds +is totally different so i did the first lecture with what my idea of to find myself talking to a a contract housing guy whose biggest order was two thousand pounds right so i've have them produce the lecture and then we've gone on from like doing yep @@ -43776,7 +43734,7 @@ to this to actually looking at what they're producing right, yes, and that's an important factor that that if you feel everybody's looking at you it is important attention it does it moves attention away just takes takes the little bit of the tension off you so you can do that as well. -so it's it appeals to the right brain that visual aspect it can take attention it can actually make the presenter move around when it switches attention what does that do for the audience then? +so it's it appeals to the right brain that visual aspect it can take attention it can actually make the presenter move around when it switches attention what does that do for the audience then? wakes them up er absolutely, yeah it keeps the interest going doesn't it? so it's it's an interest thing as well it keeps the interest it changes the emphasis switches the attention makes a break doesn't it it just changes er er a natural break that happens and it changes attention. @@ -43790,7 +43748,7 @@ it loses impact doesn't it because a the power of the voice is hit against there so while you're writing on the board have one of those pauses. now again it's oh there's silence in the room but while you're writing what what are the audience doing if you're not speaking? watching -absolutely they're reading it with you so they're with you so you're you're holding their interest even though you're not actually saying anything, yeah, and again you may you may have noticed well another thing is once you've once you're written put the pen down and the easiest thing in the world to have a but if you want to make a point and you probably noticed once i once i put the red lines around the red boxes round there and i gave you the first demonstration of the aldershot method i stood here okay. +absolutely they're reading it with you so they're with you so you're you're holding their interest even though you're not actually saying anything, yeah, and again you may you may have noticed well another thing is once you've once you're written put the pen down and the easiest thing in the world to have a but if you want to make a point and you probably noticed once i once i put the red lines around the red boxes round there and i gave you the first demonstration of the aldershot method i stood here okay. now if i want to write something i can just turn like that and i'm not turning me back away. okay if you're left handed then then i guess you're probably gonna feel more comfortable that way round erm but while you're using this and while you're making a point about what you've written just just stand to the side of it i usually put me hand up have done there just make the points to be made, yes. so that's that's the way to use that is not to talk to it but to have a silence while you're writing er and then to stand at the side while you making the points that are that are associated with what you've written up. @@ -43801,7 +43759,7 @@ that's actually all i want to say about the flipchart unless anybody's any other well the only one that comes back to me is you've got the ability to review that's right, that's right you can you can yep, good it has that creative element about it doesn't it because as you say if you get them to produce it get the audience to help produce it then again it's involvement and the whole thing is is erm more spontaneous than than pre-prepared. -i mean if if i'd done that this morning and i'd written it all up before you came in and then said well what we've done is this and then we did that and then we did that but as as it was generated as we discussed then then you were with me i hope at the way it went +i mean if if i'd done that this morning and i'd written it all up before you came in and then said well what we've done is this and then we did that and then we did that but as as it was generated as we discussed then then you were with me i hope at the way it went it's quite important though to do it fairly neatly oh indeed indeed and i'm not the neatest writer in the world i will say and erm i wasn't @@ -43811,7 +43769,7 @@ that's right the first time i get up well you see i cheat i have it lightly pencilled in well that's you can do that -that's because that's +that's because that's you want to start suddenly you find yourself either i have i tell you i've done that before now and then that one ends up right down in the bottom corner and it's it's @@ -43827,15 +43785,15 @@ well the way i do it is i i try and avoid the lecture lecturer yes, because i assume the audience knows as much about control and sub contractors as i do right -but the idea is to to get their ideas so that you can tell somebody else how you do it on your side then you can tell somebody else +but the idea is to to get their ideas so that you can tell somebody else how you do it on your side then you can tell somebody else yeah -the need, i need to change information +the need, i need to change information yeah it brings out some interesting ideas i bet it does -and i the flipchart +and i the flipchart yeah -and that's that's the only way it's amazing we ever get any sort of +and that's that's the only way it's amazing we ever get any sort of right let me just then talk very briefly about this fella. now we're fortunate with with this that if i turn it on it's very quiet but if any of you had and i'm sure jeff you've probably seen it where you get some older machines and the fan in there rattles like mad and there's nothing worse than having that thing rattling all all the day. so the first point is if you're going to show something show it, let everybody deal with it let everybody look at it then when you've finished with that turn it off because you want the centre of attention to come back to you, presumably. @@ -43857,7 +43815,6 @@ right at the top of the colours i have here are is purple, i often wonder whethe i don't know interesting. interesting question. but of the colours we've got here in this list purple is the one that has the most impact, followed by blue - erm, a number of issues will come through in a moment or two, but first of all can we start this morning's business by calling on the chair of the standing orders committee john , to give report number three. john. thank you. @@ -43877,7 +43834,7 @@ colleagues i'd just like to put one of er john's themes and that is that for the we can do it, you can do it, i know that and er so if we all act with a bit of restraint, we'll get through. the other point is i gave you an undertaking yesterday to come back to you on the reschedule of the programme in respect of items that have fell of the agenda during the course of the week. now what i'm proposing to do is to issue a revised programme in respect of the afternoon session this afternoon, which will take in some of the business that er has has already fell off which would be at the end of the private session this afternoon so we'll try and get in er rule twenty regions in their manage and their management which will take in three motions, thirty six, thirty seven and forty and then we'll turn, hopefully, to the social security payments resolutions, you'll remember that they fell off, composite two eight three, motions three seven nine, three eight five and three eight six. -er, equally colleagues, i intend to try and take er key national officers' report during the course of this morning. +er, equally colleagues, i intend to try and take er key national officers' report during the course of this morning. you'll recall that the key fell off the agenda as well, earlier or should i say, wasn't very painful. should i say the report fell off the agenda. so that's what, that's the way i'm hoping that we can proceed, as i say, yes with your assistance and then if we can get through that business, then equally tomorrow morning, we'll be doing a similar thing,we we'll issue another revised programme which will er take in some of the outstanding stuff that's fell off. @@ -43892,14 +43849,14 @@ unlike some union conferences, some business is not taken, but this conference a all business is taken, so that particular, those particular items that you've referred to i am already seeking to schedule that business for tomorrow, but i don't want to preempt the situation and chance my arm any further than what it is, because i could end up falling on my face and i want to try and avoid that. but i could assure you colleagues that business will be taken, okay? right thanks very much indeed for that colleagues. -now, it's now my pleasure to welcome on your behalf chris the secretary of portsmouth trades council. +now, it's now my pleasure to welcome on your behalf chris the secretary of portsmouth trades council. chris has been secretary for trades council for ten years, he's a w e a tutor, that's his er profession, he's an organizer, and he organizes courses throughout hampshire and the isle of wight. more recently i understand that chris has had er had a very interesting, made a very interesting study of the french trade union movement, that must have been fascinating. erm, difficult job, difficult part of the world for the trade union movement. for his sins he's a member of e m e s a, but we won't hold that against him! just a very warm welcome on behalf of the g m b please address our conference. thank you dick. -actually the last time i was stood up on a platform and did this was in front of erm a s g t congress in dieppe and i tell you i had to do it in french, and it was much more difficult so i'm hoping this one will go smoothly, but i, what i'd really like to do is begin with is offer you erm delegates and platform both, a very very warm welcome from the trade union movement in portsmouth. +actually the last time i was stood up on a platform and did this was in front of erm a s g t congress in dieppe and i tell you i had to do it in french, and it was much more difficult so i'm hoping this one will go smoothly, but i, what i'd really like to do is begin with is offer you erm delegates and platform both, a very very warm welcome from the trade union movement in portsmouth. we're absolutely delighted that you're here in portsmouth for your congress and it's very very important to us and i think perhaps i'd take a little bit of time to explain why it's important. the first thing is erm those of you that know this area will know that it's er not like the rest of hampshire er leaving aside southampton. it's an industrial city, it's a working class city, it's a city that has been very very hard hit by recession. @@ -43916,7 +43873,7 @@ didn't he recognize that trade, the trade union movement had a role to play er i we've also looked at the needs of our local community, our local trade union movement and one of the things that we're extremely concerned about is health and safety. er, i mean that's, that's not just here it's everywhere, but one of the things that is very clear is that people often do not have access to the sort of information that they need about hazards. and so we, we are in the process of setting up an online database computerized which would be accessible by not just branches, but individual erm health and safety reps for a fairly minimal affiliation which will tap into the latest information which will be updated er every three months and we feel that again that's something in conjunction with, clearly with the unions in the city something that a trades council should be doing, something that raises our profile, explains to people what trade councils, what the trade union movement is all about and does it effectively using modern techniques and modern methods. -we're also, now that we have er erm the, the council's actually hung, but now we have the, the labour group largely in control of the direction of what's happening in the city er we've been able to raise some issues that were extremely difficult to raise under the previous tory administration. +we're also, now that we have er erm the, the council's actually hung, but now we have the, the labour group largely in control of the direction of what's happening in the city er we've been able to raise some issues that were extremely difficult to raise under the previous tory administration. one of the things that concerns us is provision for people who are unemployed and we are we are speaking and working, speaking to and working with the labour group and the labour party on establishing a centre for people who are unemployed. particularly i think to the, to, to, not to provide something that they encounter elsewhere, the hoops they have to go through in order to get benefit, the restart programme, we're not interested in that we're interested in solidarity support, rebuilding confidence,keep keeping unemployed people in contract with the local trade union movement, and that that's something that i personally regard as extremely important and something that, that erm with this partnership of the labour party, the labour group and the trades council and the trade unions in the area, i think we do very effectively. so we believe that unions should be effective, should be active trades councils should be effective, should be active, should be using modern methods, but without, and i stress this, without losing sight of our traditional concerns and values. @@ -43925,20 +43882,20 @@ the amount of press coverage that's been generated this week by your conference the third reason why we're, we're pleased to see you here is that erm as a trades council, we've and this er and dick mentioned this in his introduction, we've initiated a major international programme, major in terms of our size obviously as er as a local body, involving links between union activists here primarily in france er, in northern france, but also links now developing in spain with the new ferry going between portsmouth and bilbao, we're starting to meet with the unions in spain who are interested in speaking about the, the, the differences in wages in terms and conditions working for the same ferry company, doing the same jobs in the port, a comparative look at how the, the wages terms and conditions differ and we want to, we want to go and visit them in the autumn and, and work out, and work on more links on a sector basis, so that our colleagues down in bilbao in northern spain can link up with people in the, in the, in similar sectors here and we've done this over the last three and a half years with the unions in france, we've had exchanges of all sectors, the public sectors, transport, erm, health, social services, shop workers. it's been enormously successful because we've done it on an activist basis so that activists have met one another, all those prejudices and all those stereotypes have immediately vanished as soon as people have stayed in one another 's homes and realized that people have the same problems, they have the same, they have the same problems and the same difficulty er as difficulties as we do. maybe their system's organized differently, but fundamentally the problems are the same and that's given our people the confidence that they needed because they've been able to see that people everywhere, it's not just them isolated in, in, you know, tory britain, who are facing these particular difficulties, but issues of privatization for example as the same in france and actually about to get much worse, er but, and, and i think that helped erm our colleagues from france who've also got a perspective on their struggles and their battles we've been able to support one another with information about companies working, multi-national companies working on both sides of the channel. -one example er, a couple of examples erm, we've worked together with the unions in moulinex in northern france who bought swan kettles er which is where the g m b is erm is highly organized and er in those er meetings between the unions in, in moulinex and swan we've been able to see the disparity between the conditions and the wages and be able to speak about ways in which people can go back to their, to their er workplace and work on that with that knowledge. +one example er, a couple of examples erm, we've worked together with the unions in moulinex in northern france who bought swan kettles er which is where the g m b is erm is highly organized and er in those er meetings between the unions in, in moulinex and swan we've been able to see the disparity between the conditions and the wages and be able to speak about ways in which people can go back to their, to their er workplace and work on that with that knowledge. er we've done the same for renault trucks in northern france and in dunstable, brought, brought the unions together simply through the contacts that we've made here in portsmouth. erm, so we are particularly pleased to have you here because we know as well that the g m b is in the forefront of erm establishing activity within europe, one of, one of the few unions i think is that the only unions will have an office open in brussels. er something that is, is inconceivable to me that the, the other unions don't do it because i, i believe it's gonna be enormously important to our trade union movement. so our, our international work has er been important to us and we are pleased to s to see you here to raise that profile as well. erm, so finally i should say that above all we are very pleased to see you, we're delighted to have you here. erm, we hope that you will come back soon, because for all the reasons i've outlined it's tremendously important to us and it's nice to have a body of, a big large body of trade unions in the city in terms of our feelings as, as local trade unions as well. -erm, i the light's, the light's flashing erm +erm, i the light's, the light's flashing erm i thought for one hopeful minute you were gonna wind up then. -i am gonna wind up i'm just gonna say if anybody wants some information about our database which is open to anybody in the country, i've left some leaflets there erm, i've been asked to plug trade union news which has been important to us too so i have erm and i finally i'd say thank you very much for inviting me to come and speak to you. +i am gonna wind up i'm just gonna say if anybody wants some information about our database which is open to anybody in the country, i've left some leaflets there erm, i've been asked to plug trade union news which has been important to us too so i have erm and i finally i'd say thank you very much for inviting me to come and speak to you. chris thanks very much indeed for that very thoughtful and welcoming address. -i'd like to present on behalf of congress to you a banner bright by john and also a tankard suitably inscribed. +i'd like to present on behalf of congress to you a banner bright by john and also a tankard suitably inscribed. colleagues er back to the agenda, national officers report duncan . -president, congress, duncan national office. +president, congress, duncan national office. at last year's congress, i outlined the devastating effect that the recession was having on the engineering, shipbuilding and aerospace industries. i recall the catalogue of redundancies that have been declared in nineteen ninety one nineteen ninety two. unfortunately that story continues and ninety two ninety three is seeing even more of our colleagues made redundant, not in hundreds but in thousands. @@ -43978,14 +43935,14 @@ duncan, two things. first a note of caution on your report on aerospace. you mentioned the saudi deal has been announced, but so far it's only for the tornado and not the full go ahead to . excuse me. -also there's been no announcement so far on the hawk trainer which involves most of the four and a half thousand at as many more in british aerospace and other companies. -secondly for your efforts in putting for the recent joint delegates conference on the out-sourcing and that's a company's way and not mine. -of the information and technology department by british aerospace,and that thanks is not used from apex, it's also from m s s at or acknowledged it was your efforts and not their that brought that conference about. +also there's been no announcement so far on the hawk trainer which involves most of the four and a half thousand at as many more in british aerospace and other companies. +secondly for your efforts in putting for the recent joint delegates conference on the out-sourcing and that's a company's way and not mine. +of the information and technology department by british aerospace,and that thanks is not used from apex, it's also from m s s at or acknowledged it was your efforts and not their that brought that conference about. this out-sourcing could put the software technology for the defence of the country into the hands of a foreign-controlled company and it could cost another two thousand british aerospace jobs. thank you duncan. forty six, forty seven, yes. president, congress, ron , yorkshire and north derbyshire, at the moment, as far as i'm aware still employed by british coal. -duncan, salary and conditions claim i quote due to the turmoil within the industry at the time of compiling this report, we have not as yet presented a claim . +duncan, salary and conditions claim i quote due to the turmoil within the industry at the time of compiling this report, we have not as yet presented a claim . duncan, we have now gone seven months without presenting a claim, during which time our members have continued to work hard for the corporation. we are doing our jobs, it is not our fault that the board members and the government cannot do theirs, but as usual it is always the workforce who are suffering. don't let us lost a year, if we let them use turmoil in the industry as an excuse for not meeting us, we will never sit round a table with them again. @@ -43997,8 +43954,8 @@ yes. president, congress, ed , westminster trade union and political staffs branch for the london region. congress, i think it's only right to draw to your attention that in item five b usdaw that at the last usdaw conference there was a motion passed saying that there should be recognition for the independent trade union within usdaw which is ourselves, g m b apex. however since that time, there has been no recognition granted by usdaw, the main reason for which is the general secretary, who allegedly had said that because his organization is not a profit making organization, there is no reason to have a trade union there. -now these are the kind of people we have to deal with and i know duncan has a problem in usdaw there's gerry the negotiator for the london region. -er will you remember me next month? +now these are the kind of people we have to deal with and i know duncan has a problem in usdaw there's gerry the negotiator for the london region. +er will you remember me next month? yes. ne mo i meant next week. yes. @@ -44040,10 +43997,10 @@ less knock knocks, and more eat, eats! oh dad! the garden's looking better isn't it? all that work. -i better knock knock +i better knock knock yes, till next week. ah no! -i mean the grass was so long. +i mean the grass was so long. it's much better now. mum. looks much @@ -44053,13 +44010,13 @@ sorry. this is a joke for you. knock, knock. who's there? -ah sheep. +ah sheep. well sheep who? well sheep who keeps go who keeps going round supermarkets saying shampoo. oh! that's some obscure jokes. -so obscure you'll have to explain that one to me. -well mum had some pictures +so obscure you'll have to explain that one to me. +well mum had some pictures not with your mouth full sunshine. when you've emptied your mouth. it looks better for going around most of the edges and going over the grass. @@ -44070,7 +44027,7 @@ by the yes. well i mean it was a lot it was a lot of edging to do. -i mean it was just the back though. +i mean it was just the back though. now if you'll excuse me a moment. i'll just watch the last few laps. how many laps are there to go? @@ -44088,7 +44045,7 @@ no it's er, mum, shall i finish this? mm mm. all my carrots i'm eating. i would rather you ate your vegetables, yes, rather than the chicken please. -but mum i +but mum i yes? i won't go hungry. well i hope you won't. @@ -44098,13 +44055,13 @@ if you can't, you can't so easily if you haven't got a better car. the grand prix. hey yo! camera. -get your show biz shocks of the they caught me when i was standing on my head. +get your show biz shocks of the they caught me when i was standing on my head. well they've switched the wa water in for a motor. come on, eat it sunshine. you do. that rhymes. come on, eat up and then we can go and watch the end of the grand prix as well, can't we? -i thought it was the cup final. +i thought it was the cup final. no, that was this afternoon. oh! mum. @@ -44141,7 +44098,7 @@ funny, cos we've never had cows in there. we have. there have been cows in the field. i think it was before you were born. -and it wasn't for long, i must admit, that we had cows in that field but i think +and it wasn't for long, i must admit, that we had cows in that field but i think mum we the sheep are best. mum, we had horses in the winter once when i was a baby. @@ -44150,7 +44107,7 @@ and that was years ago. when i was a baby. that was nine years ago. no you weren't a baby. -we had horses again well maybe when you were a baby. +we had horses again well maybe when you were a baby. yes er, i was, i, i saw a picture yes. yes we yes that's right. @@ -44163,23 +44120,23 @@ i'd rather there were sheep in the field than pigs. didn't like having pigs. geese were alright weren't they? except it wasn't very nice watching them disappear just before christmas. -well at least they gave some to some old concentration -we don't eat lamb any more do we? -after things that we've seen in that field . +well at least they gave some to some old concentration +we don't eat lamb any more do we? +after things that we've seen in that field . pardon mum? -we've given up eating lamb lamb since there's been sheep in the field haven't we? +we've given up eating lamb lamb since there's been sheep in the field haven't we? we haven't had lamb for years now. we haven't. no. we only eat chicken. -i no, we, we had it in the i think, indian, italian. +i no, we, we had it in the i think, indian, italian. no, we don't. -indian takeaway. +indian takeaway. get chicken. ma. mum. mhm? -mum, tell you what mum, do you like, have you ever tried eating pork chops? +mum, tell you what mum, do you like, have you ever tried eating pork chops? a long time ago, yes. do you like it? i liked it at the time, yes. @@ -44187,10 +44144,10 @@ well mum haven't eaten pork chops for a long time. mum. yes? -now there's sheep in the field while, while there's sheep in the field, we won't eat lamb. +now there's sheep in the field while, while there's sheep in the field, we won't eat lamb. no. i don't think, i don't think i want to eat lamb ever again. -when there's pigs in the field we won't eat pork chops. +when there's pigs in the field we won't eat pork chops. cos they'll grill crossly. we only eat chicken now don't we? and meat. @@ -44200,10 +44157,10 @@ come on poppy. finish that mouthful of carrot. when i've finished my orange juice can i get down? yes you can! -finish your carrot and finish your orange juice, then we'll go we'll go in the sitting room and watch the rest of the race. +finish your carrot and finish your orange juice, then we'll go we'll go in the sitting room and watch the rest of the race. no. see, see who wins. -can i orange juice, only my orange juice please? +can i orange juice, only my orange juice please? well you've got your carrot in your mouth, just finish eating it. just swallow it. drink your orange juice and then you'll swallow your carrot. @@ -44212,7 +44169,7 @@ you store food in your cheeks. no, pouches. mm mm. go on swallow. -it's awful cos minnie keeps taking throwing her wrappers out, her food. +it's awful cos minnie keeps taking throwing her wrappers out, her food. took it down to our bedroom and spitting it out! does she? that's @@ -44250,13 +44207,13 @@ well i see that car stepping out chris? i am if we can get a sitter. where? -what you've missed it now! +what you've missed it now! what did it do? it started to slide. have we been topping that up a little? or have you just been very careful? oh. -anybody want any well there's only strawberries. +anybody want any well there's only strawberries. no you have those. do you want some strawberries chris? i'll share them with you? @@ -44270,20 +44227,20 @@ chris if you're gonna roll around on the lawn after it's been cut the least you can do is give yourself a shake before you come in. how many more laps? -we're not fast as in this. +we're not fast as in this. shh shh shh shh shh shh shh. not a large number. i got nettled. i'm not surprised. -no, even with my gardening gloves on i got nettled when i was pulling at around that honeysu +no, even with my gardening gloves on i got nettled when i was pulling at around that honeysu well they're not very successful gardening gloves are they? well no! the nettles are very potent. mm mm. -see two bolters , or whatever that is in +see two bolters , or whatever that is in it's nearly seven o'clock! i know that! -cos i've got to take these kids up for a bath soon er er you can stay +cos i've got to take these kids up for a bath soon er er you can stay well i down here if i'll record may to december but i'd like to watch @@ -44296,16 +44253,16 @@ but i'm not bothered jane. why should i be the only one that suffers? i'm not bothered about that. i would rather wa yes, well you can suffer it all with me. -erm i'd like to watch lovejoy please. +erm i'd like to watch lovejoy please. i thought last week was the last one? last one of the, but they're showing one of the old ones and we, i haven't seen it, so oh. -doo doo doo da da . +doo doo doo da da . there's nothing else on after that. we've got a clear evening after that. after that? it'll be bed time! -it'll finish, what half nine? +it'll finish, what half nine? well i dunno. i hope there's an extended news. there's bound to be. @@ -44314,7 +44271,7 @@ would you like a couple of pardon chris? who's pa -the the one the one ran out of the crash on this ? +the the one the one ran out of the crash on this ? well it's happened, before now chris. mm mm. silly things, like crashing, running out of petrol. @@ -44325,7 +44282,7 @@ consummately easy win? he did indeed. oh that's a good picture they've got there isn't it? that's really constructive. -that looking at a bald head, a stupid girl, and something else. +that looking at a bald head, a stupid girl, and something else. oh! but why is she stupid? i bet they show other people all that. @@ -44350,7 +44307,7 @@ but chris knows. that's renny. yeah. here are, look, look, this groupie's getting into everything. -erm senna ma drives a macclaren doesn't he? +erm senna ma drives a macclaren doesn't he? yes. yes he does. he's got brazilian on. @@ -44366,20 +44323,20 @@ breaks your mum's heart that, to see all that champagne thrown. no it's not the waste of champagne, i feel sorry for everybody getting so sticky. oh . ooh, ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh! -i know what it's like trying to get alcohol out of your clothes. +i know what it's like trying to get alcohol out of your clothes. no don't tell me to have my dress cleaned. -last time senna had something like hundred and twenty didn't he? +last time senna had something like hundred and twenty didn't he? pardon? sorry? -last time senna had something like a hundred and twenty . -erm yeah probably he did have . +last time senna had something like a hundred and twenty . +erm yeah probably he did have . looks like the sun was shining there chris. mm. oh she's out there again! where? i wonder who was sponsoring the race? mm? -you can afford to be can't you? +you can afford to be can't you? mm. why's she so we well yes she's @@ -44404,7 +44361,7 @@ when i listened to the six o'clock news i was hoping you wouldn't come on the radio running through and tell me -no, oh do i ever? +no, oh do i ever? they said it was half way through yes, well that's a at the six o'clock news. @@ -44452,9 +44409,9 @@ come on. yippee!putting in some bubbles in the bath. i'll get . why is two thousand three hundred your favourite number? -because when that parcel came from gwyneth you said that i think probably two thousand three hundred mini-bites in it. +because when that parcel came from gwyneth you said that i think probably two thousand three hundred mini-bites in it. ha! -i don't know why, it's funny, two thousand three thousand, three thousand . +i don't know why, it's funny, two thousand three thousand, three thousand . are you happy now? yes. it's not hair wash night is it? @@ -44467,7 +44424,7 @@ too late when they've got bubbles. yes. you don't have bubbles when you're gonna to wash your hair. come on! -but, but ah ah! +but, but ah ah! mum can you tell jokes in here? yes, course you can tell jokes. is that tape on? @@ -44479,16 +44436,16 @@ get undressed. what, what did the policeman say to a bath? well i don't know, what did the policeman say to the bath? you're on top of the pipes. -no, he no well what did the shoe,sha what did the pop star say to the bath? +no, he no well what did the shoe,sha what did the pop star say to the bath? what did the pop star say to the bath? not one of your obscure ones are they? come on. -this is like your isn't it? +this is like your isn't it? you're on top of the pipes. you're on top of the pipes. don't now i don't see that's funny. -well he got it. +well he got it. you're on top of the pops. oh oh! i see! @@ -44502,20 +44459,20 @@ yes, actually it's quite good that well in an obscure sort in obscure -of way . +of way . there's lots of it there. yes. well yo er yo just remember we've got to get washed . dad. yes love? -what did the bath say to a policeman very moodily? +what did the bath say to a policeman very moodily? i don't think i want to know. you get into well it says this bath this minute! yeah. -and the and then or else i'll open my plug and water'll come out before you get in. +and the and then or else i'll open my plug and water'll come out before you get in. mm. erm, that isn't a joke. no, i don't think it was funny. @@ -44532,9 +44489,9 @@ i don't know. what did the policeman say to the woman? dare i ask ! no. -what, what was the policeman say what, what did the policeman say to the woman who was having a rest? +what, what was the policeman say what, what did the policeman say to the woman who was having a rest? i don't know. -what did the policeman say to the woman that was having a rest ? +what did the policeman say to the woman that was having a rest ? they said, mummy, move yourself! no. no. @@ -44561,7 +44518,7 @@ got bubbles. oh . i'm going to sta all that's for the wash? right! -cos it's chitty +cos it's chitty cos it's what? chitty. are you saying chitty chitty bang bang? @@ -44595,10 +44552,10 @@ rather than still, you're only just six. your spelling's quite good. mum. yes? -did you like my bit about the chip in chitty chitty bang bang? +did you like my bit about the chip in chitty chitty bang bang? i did. yes. -i meant, about the, the one about the rockets and manchester. +i meant, about the, the one about the rockets and manchester. mm mm. and about that boat called chitty chitty bang bang. i'm coming into your school @@ -44627,7 +44584,7 @@ yes. she missed it. can you i'd like -can we put on that side because i think that's where to keep it. +can we put on that side because i think that's where to keep it. i don't want to lose that again. do you remember when we got it? yes. @@ -44635,7 +44592,7 @@ pantomime it got, we caught it. we caught it. yes, it was really good. -and these so you can catch eggs. +and these so you can catch eggs. we need to waggle it. that's better than ca catching the eggs is better than catching the wagon wheel. yes, i think so too. @@ -44647,11 +44604,11 @@ but he only ever throws the one egg. come on sa move it boys! dad! i want, oh dad! -but we've only just got the bubbles in and the soap'll dissolve them. -yes it does, the soap does dissolve +but we've only just got the bubbles in and the soap'll dissolve them. +yes it does, the soap does dissolve mm. -erm yes. -so it's that way. +erm yes. +so it's that way. well it does. it says in the . this is a really good bath! @@ -44674,7 +44631,7 @@ what? goodness me! been carrying the lawn around with him. oh oh oh oh . -oh well i look out onto the window and see that it's +oh well i look out onto the window and see that it's wah ! just mud. right. @@ -44683,15 +44640,15 @@ ah . i emptied there with all the erm lawnmower and everything. then i can peg you out to dry. -you don't want to, cos you're not really no good david. -two lawnmowers going at the same time the neighbours must be annoyed. +you don't want to, cos you're not really no good david. +two lawnmowers going at the same time the neighbours must be annoyed. yeah, and i was trying to listen to that lousy interview. well you didn't tell me. i didn't realize. i did try. well, as soon as i realized i stopped. no you didn't, you ran out of petrol. -well i would have gone round the back again. +well i would have gone round the back again. mummy. on the radio? is that why i went out of @@ -44711,7 +44668,7 @@ and the conservatives will have won. d'ya think? hopefully. why not? -do you know how i want to be the prime minister of next year? +do you know how i want to be the prime minister of next year? yeah. next er @@ -44727,7 +44684,7 @@ oh! i thought you said he wanted to be. alright. who do you want to be the prime minister next year? -er er president +er er president president gorbachov. oh yeah! oh! @@ -44759,7 +44716,7 @@ go on david, get on with soaping now love. david heard that mr major was going to be prime minister and he said,surely it's mrs major . i didn't! i, i, i think -er and chrissy, and chrissy said to me, i didn't realize a man could be prime minister . +er and chrissy, and chrissy said to me, i didn't realize a man could be prime minister . quite so, i think if kinnock but i if kinnock gets in you've got an old woman so you'll be right. @@ -44767,7 +44724,7 @@ i think that's fantastic! that david, they thought but i thought it was that women could o only women could hold the top jobs. -no, i thought if it was a man it was a president and it was a woman it was prime minister. +no, i thought if it was a man it was a president and it was a woman it was prime minister. oh yes,yo you're destroying my belief in what you were thinking about. cos i thought you thought only women could come on david, soap please. @@ -44776,11 +44733,11 @@ before your brother gets in. well i thought come on! no ! -have they got the wax work up yet? +have they got the wax work up yet? in the, that hall somewhere, i can't remember where it is. madame tussauds. i'm not sure. -they have a wax work of ma mrs thatcher up and erm mis mr erm major wouldn't go there till they erm so that, they've still got mrs thatcher's one up. +they have a wax work of ma mrs thatcher up and erm mis mr erm major wouldn't go there till they erm so that, they've still got mrs thatcher's one up. i don't know. they're both conservative. mm. @@ -44813,7 +44770,7 @@ you will be! that's one thing you don't say. here. dun dun, da dun dun, dun dun diddle diddle diddle diddle . -get back in before he, can i +get back in before he, can i he's erm have some more water in? he's, he's put you the bubbles at your end chris. @@ -44853,13 +44810,13 @@ a feeble five. no he's not. he's a silly six. mm. -no that's in the there's this detective erm there's these, there's these detective book and th there's a girl, detective girl sam, and erm her e the feeble five headed by steve . +no that's in the there's this detective erm there's these, there's these detective book and th there's a girl, detective girl sam, and erm her e the feeble five headed by steve . so, what's er that, a take-off of the famous five? i don't know. -but er and if sh she's in the last book, she tells how ugly erm, erm steve was. -er, but erm she wouldn't bother to she'll be getting her e old age pension before she's finished. +but er and if sh she's in the last book, she tells how ugly erm, erm steve was. +er, but erm she wouldn't bother to she'll be getting her e old age pension before she's finished. mm mm. dave! stop it! @@ -44869,7 +44826,7 @@ my shoes are stuck to the well that's good. look, this part . -right plonker let's do that. +right plonker let's do that. i'm not getting out yet. i beg your pardon? i'm not getting out yet. @@ -44878,13 +44835,13 @@ no! oh no he's not, he's, he's gonna get out in ten seconds. no i'm not. here are chris. -i'm going to get out in three . +i'm going to get out in three . ah ! get off! i'm going to get out in i beg your pardon? ah! -get off ! +get off ! dad ha! get off ! @@ -44984,7 +44941,7 @@ i'm not. cos you keep going on about it. mm. mhm. -how about ba er how about ambers how about andrex. +how about ba er how about ambers how about andrex. has anybody heard the weather forecast today? yeah. you, you were listening to it on the radio. @@ -44999,11 +44956,11 @@ ian mccaskill's trying to tell us what the weather forecast'll you wouldn't be like for thursday and i'm sort of thinking, why thursday? -then it suddenly dawned on me, why thursday. +then it suddenly dawned on me, why thursday. right. come on! move it! -yeah but you did the weather all sunny on the computer. +yeah but you did the weather all sunny on the computer. yes, but i haven't been to work today. i mm. @@ -45018,18 +44975,18 @@ i know. she ee shh. go on dave, get on. chris. -splash this splash over the splash over the bath. +splash this splash over the splash over the bath. there, a really big splash! mm, whoosh! well i'll do that. -i'm was having on mine. +i'm was having on mine. alright? which one's yours? are you a smartie one? yeah. well go and fetch it then. right. -there's a a thing there. +there's a a thing there. do you want any more drink? no thank you, i, please let me just finish clearing and i'll, i'll get it finished off quickly. you were telling that judy, julie. @@ -45042,18 +44999,18 @@ well you'll have some kit-kats or summat won't you? nope. breakaway? i think i've got breakaways. -i want to put the disposal unit on so can you move this? +i want to put the disposal unit on so can you move this? come on sunshine, come and sit with me here. right. i'm ready. you're ready? what are you going to do? -well, first i need a light of concentration +well, first i need a light of concentration oh light helps you concentrate does it? yes. go on then. have some light. -that's sit down! +that's sit down! no next to me here. oh right. i'm coming. @@ -45063,7 +45020,7 @@ right. now what are you going to show me? i'll tell you. right. -one, plus, plus one. +one, plus, plus one. i'm taking some ones. oh i see. that's how you set that up to do that is it? @@ -45129,7 +45086,7 @@ two o seven nine. which is? what does that make? it's the number of a steam engine i've got. -i'm not bothered whether it's a number of a steam engine but how do you pronounce that number? +i'm not bothered whether it's a number of a steam engine but how do you pronounce that number? two hundred a no. no. @@ -45188,7 +45145,7 @@ but what's ten hundred? a thousand. right. so why didn't you say that? -you didn't yo +you didn't yo i, i did. i was expecting you to count, nobody says ten hundred. do they? @@ -45198,16 +45155,16 @@ every number ga always goes up to nine. then it triggers over into another one doesn't it? yes. now what were we saying the other day? -you have, units tens, hundreds, thousands +you have, units tens, hundreds, thousands but dad don't you? -but three er there. +but three er there. check that number. ha! that was stupid. yeah. mm mm. -so mrs was showing you how to do this? +so mrs was showing you how to do this? right. yes. what, what else have you learnt to do with a calculator? @@ -45228,7 +45185,7 @@ now you did that without a calculator didn't you? oh i see. right, now this time do it with the calculator. so you've got -four turn it on. +four turn it on. turn it on. you run out of light? there are. @@ -45249,16 +45206,16 @@ now that wa that time, that's easy. that just proves what you already know. right dad, i'll show you something else. no. -i was going to do more +i was going to do more but i wa i want to show you something, that's all. go on then. -nine, fifty six square root. +nine, fifty six square root. er who taught you that? well, i lis no one. -it's mrs said to mark +it's mrs said to mark just a minute. -he, he, he was getting the controls wrong. +he, he, he was getting the controls wrong. he pressed square root instead of equals . yes. and so you've discovered @@ -45271,13 +45228,13 @@ yes. is the number which if multiplied by itself yes. gives you back the number you started with. -take, for , the easiest one is four. +take, for , the easiest one is four. the square root of four is two. try it on your machine. right. what do i press? -four four, square root and it gives you two. -because two times two gives you four. +four four, square root and it gives you two. +because two times two gives you four. try the square root of nine. just press clear. yeah, i just press this one. @@ -45286,8 +45243,8 @@ clear that bit. cos it clears the whole mind. right. what shall i press? -nine square root is three. -so if you multiply three times three you get nine. +nine square root is three. +so if you multiply three times three you get nine. now it's easy when you deal in numbers like that because if you go to sixteen yes. the square root is four. @@ -45312,7 +45269,7 @@ it's three. no. three times three. i don't know the answer! -well look three three and three. +well look three three and three. so how many have you got? ten. no! @@ -45330,7 +45287,7 @@ right. right. so clear all that and go back to what you wanted to do. right, i'll show you. -ten square root is +ten square root is three point one six two two seven seven six. right. eh eh. @@ -45357,8 +45314,8 @@ well you co i, i want to get clever with you. oh i thought you had been. shall we turn that off now then? -i'll get -on city news there's gonna be something about trams in manchester somebody wants to see. +i'll get +on city news there's gonna be something about trams in manchester somebody wants to see. well is it the new ones or is it, on the television, or on the radio? yeah, on, on the television. do you want to switch it on? @@ -45367,7 +45324,7 @@ yes . course i am, in anything like that. well i'm, i'm going up for my shower is that okay? okay, off you go. -i'll come up soon and despatch david. +i'll come up soon and despatch david. sorry? oh! what? @@ -45377,7 +45334,7 @@ bit? it's the second half. so there won't be much more? no. -oh no, i mean it's about another another eight minutes. +oh no, i mean it's about another another eight minutes. right. i thought he'd want to see,take my shower. yes, off you go then. @@ -45397,16 +45354,16 @@ i've got one sheet. take the green crayon then. right, i've got the green crayon. put it that way. -hang on let me just turn the television down. -you you keep your eye on it so that when your tra tram programme comes on we can watch it. +hang on let me just turn the television down. +you you keep your eye on it so that when your tra tram programme comes on we can watch it. right. what to do? well it's that way you need it. i want a table for this. well you can't use these tables. -don't let me just move this magazine. -write five on it. +don't let me just move this magazine. +write five on it. have i got to write five on mine? yes. right. @@ -45415,7 +45372,7 @@ there you are. double add. double add? i'm not used to double add. -five plus plus equals +five plus plus equals equals equals, equals? well this is a bit of a nonsense. @@ -45441,7 +45398,7 @@ a square root at three hundred and four? yes. haven't a clue. equals -equals now what do you want me to do with all these? +equals now what do you want me to do with all these? guess. oh i'm guessing. write your name at the top. @@ -45473,12 +45430,12 @@ how do you do a seven? er er, like that. you know how to do a seven. oh here's the tram bit. -let's fli turn up the sound then we can no you've done that backwards, it's seventeen not seventy one. +let's fli turn up the sound then we can no you've done that backwards, it's seventeen not seventy one. here we go look. oh look dave this is great! -going back to the old trams. +going back to the old trams. but how can they go through the towns? -well trams dave they do both, they go on the railway lines and they go through the town centre. +well trams dave they do both, they go on the railway lines and they go through the town centre. right. oh dear! don't watch this . @@ -45502,21 +45459,21 @@ eighteen! no you don't. well do it, do it the way on your fingers. you've got thirteen plus four. -thirteen got it now? +thirteen got it now? yes. plonker! right. now let's do this one. this is, this is easy. great! -now yo there you are now then now getting a little harder but you can do it in just the same way. +now yo there you are now then now getting a little harder but you can do it in just the same way. . so what's the answer? yes! you've got it right. -now this last one then we'll do something different. +now this last one then we'll do something different. that's right. -thirty three minus two is thirty one. +thirty three minus two is thirty one. that's not bad. right what do you want to do now? mm? @@ -45525,10 +45482,10 @@ right. well we can do plenty of that. have you cleared up all your toys and everything before julie comes? there's that -well then why is it still out? +well then why is it still out? and have you cleared up everything in the dining room? -oh my er trees are still out. -chrissy hasn't put all the climbing up things away. +oh my er trees are still out. +chrissy hasn't put all the climbing up things away. mm mm. well shall we go through and do some clearing up then? come on. @@ -45540,10 +45497,10 @@ go put those away please. off you go. right. now you said you were gonna tell me what's happened on the news so far. -three people have er been killed in a railway accident after their their car ran into the side of a train. +three people have er been killed in a railway accident after their their car ran into the side of a train. oh dear! -wh which is about er which is about er open er the day after tomorrow. -what's open the day after tomorrow? +wh which is about er which is about er open er the day after tomorrow. +what's open the day after tomorrow? the level crossing. oh it's closed now is it? no, they're going to open it. @@ -45554,7 +45511,7 @@ and dad? yes. you know that many level crossings are one barrier? yes. -well that they showed us er a thing about the speed about about the traffic approaching lights when they're starting flashing. +well that they showed us er a thing about the speed about about the traffic approaching lights when they're starting flashing. it showed you a car go over that, going over,tha a lorry going over crossing and the lights were starting to flash. well a lot of people do that. it's very dangerous. @@ -45571,15 +45528,15 @@ activates the lights as it's approaching the crossing. yes cos most,o most of that one barrier, it said on the news that they're o automatic. that's right. so -they have er special cameras which they take the line of the trains both sides. +they have er special cameras which they take the line of the trains both sides. mhm. -and the barriers drop, so if you try and go through when the lights are flashing or if you try and go round the barriers the chances are the train's getting nearer and nearer and could hit you. +and the barriers drop, so if you try and go through when the lights are flashing or if you try and go round the barriers the chances are the train's getting nearer and nearer and could hit you. so it's a very silly thing to do. yes. like if it's one metre away and there's a car going across. well if you were that close and the lights started you'd probably get across. but if you, like, you know what it's like when we come -if, if the barriers were down er and you were still on the railway er th ah there's only way you can escape. +if, if the barriers were down er and you were still on the railway er th ah there's only way you can escape. go round by the barrier pole. well yes, but look at the crossings we've got in driffield. yes. @@ -45589,45 +45546,45 @@ er they've got full barriers you see. full barriers. double are safe. -well, they're different because they have them they're really controlled by a man in a signal box so they're +well, they're different because they have them they're really controlled by a man in a signal box so they're yes they are controlled. controlled by a television. er -if they're controlled well dad, everyone knows that one th the tackleby's controlled by a man. +if they're controlled well dad, everyone knows that one th the tackleby's controlled by a man. oh yes. that was good wasn't it? yes. yes, you enjoyed that trip into the signal box didn't you? oh yes. -but though it was rather dangerous. -after all in my, you know my er people working on the rails book? +but though it was rather dangerous. +after all in my, you know my er people working on the rails book? the one yes. . it says, you must never try to steer ru steer round a bu barrier poles. that's right. -and they're trying to take away as many er possible erm, mainly one barrier er railway gates as possible. +and they're trying to take away as many er possible erm, mainly one barrier er railway gates as possible. well i didn't know they were trying to get rid of those. especially on busy main roads. but some of the crossings around this area didn't have any barriers at all ah ah. -and they just had the flashing lights. +and they just had the flashing lights. well it's like wo ones at meading ro meadow road. that's right. they're only wooden ones. -ah well tha no meadow road's got the old gates but at natherton there were some that didn't have any barriers at all, they were just flashing lights. -now, do you remember now let's think whether you were born. -when the lockington railway disaster happened that was just a few miles from here. +ah well tha no meadow road's got the old gates but at natherton there were some that didn't have any barriers at all, they were just flashing lights. +now, do you remember now let's think whether you were born. +when the lockington railway disaster happened that was just a few miles from here. at manchester? no, lockington. ah. -and that was where er, a train came off the railways when it hit a van on +and that was where er, a train came off the railways when it hit a van on oh. on the crossing er and killed a lot of people. oh. -i, i, i know, i'd, i have never heard never heard. +i, i, i know, i'd, i have never heard never heard. oh! -that's sa surprise cos i was on the way to hull oh yes! +that's sa surprise cos i was on the way to hull oh yes! you were around because i was going to take you and chrissy to hull to a train fair ah yes! and mum and chrissy slept in the car. @@ -45643,22 +45600,22 @@ mm mm. i hope, i hope . well we went past the crash and we could see that there was something going on but we weren't sure what it was. it happened just after we went past the, just before. -you could see er a couple of land rovers going down with flashing blue lights and things towards +you could see er a couple of land rovers going down with flashing blue lights and things towards i the crossing. and th th and they would be police ones if they'd got blue lights and mm mm. so did you, could you hear the sirens? no i couldn't. -but erm when we, by the time we got into hull i heard it on the radio what had happened and we went to the toy fair and then we came back and there was er you could see all the ambulances and everything still there. +but erm when we, by the time we got into hull i heard it on the radio what had happened and we went to the toy fair and then we came back and there was er you could see all the ambulances and everything still there. and the train was there leaning over. but half of it was still on the rails. yes it was the front coaches went off. front coaches? onto the side i think. well what sort of express? -it was erm well what do you think it would be? -er i think it must have been a multiple unit. +it was erm well what do you think it would be? +er i think it must have been a multiple unit. that's right. it was a diesel multiple unit. and it was before you had your pacers and sprinters. @@ -45666,11 +45623,11 @@ yes. thank goodness for that! i wouldn't want one of those, one of the pacers or sprinters or metros spoilt. but dad! -they're all multiple units at sometimes. +they're all multiple units at sometimes. yes, of course they are, but we, i was talking about the old sort of diesel multiple unit. yes. one with the yellow front. -you can get all different sorts of, one with two red lights erm one with two windows +you can get all different sorts of, one with two red lights erm one with two windows can you? yes. mm. @@ -45681,7 +45638,7 @@ well i'm gonna have to start thinking about getting ready. what about you getting ready for bed now? dad. mhm? -what about the manchester crossing disaster? +what about the manchester crossing disaster? which one was that? er, just outside manchester. mm mm. @@ -45699,16 +45656,16 @@ you, you told me about it when you came home once. you told me about that disaster. well, your memory's better than mine. i can't remember it now. -the only tha disaster i know very well is the tay one the tay tay bridge. +the only tha disaster i know very well is the tay one the tay tay bridge. the tay bridge. yes. and half of it still is standing. what else do you know? -er er tt oh what about? +er er tt oh what about? the tay bridge. -er er well the engine which should have pulled, the post train, broke down so that went to the works and the engine which took its replacement +er er well the engine which should have pulled, the post train, broke down so that went to the works and the engine which took its replacement mhm. -was one which they which fell down with a crash. +was one which they which fell down with a crash. oh! mm mm. dad! @@ -45725,12 +45682,12 @@ about all this at tay bridge. about other things in my book. mm mm. anyway, come on, let's go get ready. -they really should give give you a magazine article itself about the tay bridge. +they really should give give you a magazine article itself about the tay bridge. well you've got a magazine that's got a lot of it in. but not very much. no. here's julie here now phil ! -i've left the tape running running. +i've left the tape running running. sorry cat. oh. come on. @@ -45747,7 +45704,7 @@ it's taking mummy! advantage! sit down. -i wonder if i +i wonder if i you don't mind? i'll take you through in a minute, i'm just cleaning my shoes. alright. @@ -45766,10 +45723,10 @@ can hear the sheep. yes. they're noisy tonight. oh you brought all your work with you? -erm there's all the stuff there. +erm there's all the stuff there. there's only biscuits, i haven't been able to do any baking. i don't want, i don't eat them. -i don't eat any more . +i don't eat any more . well especially if it's my baking! mm. now david will be down in a minute. @@ -45779,8 +45736,8 @@ do you know how to work the fire? , if i can work it anybody can. erm, chris is out at cubs but he gets brought home. right. -so he'll arrive about twenty to, quarter to eight, and he just gets dropped off. -well, the person who's dropping him off might just check that there actually is somebody in the house, you know, so do you know how to work the television? +so he'll arrive about twenty to, quarter to eight, and he just gets dropped off. +well, the person who's dropping him off might just check that there actually is somebody in the house, you know, so do you know how to work the television? no. well okay, i'll come and help you. it's on standby and then er @@ -45798,11 +45755,11 @@ there. so a one-legged person going out of here. i'm trying to put my shoes on. right. -erm david +erm david david. he's out there eating again. having his yoghurt. -his toothbrush is up, judy he's +his toothbrush is up, judy he's julie, not judy! i said julie didn't i? oh yes alright. @@ -45810,12 +45767,12 @@ he's erm, he's self-sufficient, as chrissy walks in david can go up to bed, he's he's been . if you let him though he'll, he'll stay up all night and read to you and things like that, but no, just send him to bed. i don't mind if he reads for a few minutes but that's it. -chrissy will come in, he might come in bringing simon and his mum +chrissy will come in, he might come in bringing simon and his mum he won't! -you know fran bri +you know fran bri yeah. brings him home? -and the last two weeks they've come traipsing in to swap +and the last two weeks they've come traipsing in to swap they won't tonight. they won't. to swap megadrives. @@ -45829,16 +45786,16 @@ you can tell them to clear off. you can erm have a go on my exercise bike if you want. -that's if nobody else does . +that's if nobody else does . erm don't you like it? well tha it requires effort. -er er yeah, and chrissy goes to bed at eight. +er er yeah, and chrissy goes to bed at eight. he can only read till half past. but he knows, he knows that. i know, but there's nothing for you to know -he'll julie around +he'll julie around really! you know he does. well i shall smack his bo oh yes. @@ -45849,9 +45806,9 @@ yeah. he cried. that was years ago! yeah that was when you were going to bill's, the last time i came -oh that was for yeah the party +oh that was for yeah the party baby-sitting. -it's a oh yes the boston, oh yes, the fancy +it's a oh yes the boston, oh yes, the fancy yeah. yes it was. party. @@ -45865,7 +45822,7 @@ bill's party. you remember bill? bill? yes. -oh the the glaswegian optician. +oh the the glaswegian optician. can't remember anything about his parties worth repeating. they were the same sort of things that i never got invited to again. ah! @@ -45888,12 +45845,12 @@ any, anyway you did get your hair done this morning then, yeah? suit you. tt! oh ! -see mr last night. +see mr last night. mm mm. did you? oh that's nice. yeah. -i don't think the prospect cheers jane up particularly but what are you doing? +i don't think the prospect cheers jane up particularly but what are you doing? i don't know that i've even seen that . he gets frustrated when he can't win though. yeah but don't we all. @@ -45904,16 +45861,16 @@ i know, but it gets him depressed. i know, but er, jane goes through the same, i can't remember things. oh! i should be able to do this and that but, but it happens. -it's just as you get older i think you, you begin to notice it more because your conscious of your faculties not being there. -anyway, erm but, but with john he wo he will, he'll get really uptight, he won't erm +it's just as you get older i think you, you begin to notice it more because your conscious of your faculties not being there. +anyway, erm but, but with john he wo he will, he'll get really uptight, he won't erm i don't even think it . alright? anything else? are you taking your car? cos if you are i'll have to move mine. we'll take whichever one we can get out quick julie. -erm, jane's'll be easy. -mind you, i've erm far enough forward to be able to get +erm, jane's'll be easy. +mind you, i've erm far enough forward to be able to get oh! we'll manage. will you? @@ -45921,13 +45878,13 @@ i'll see. yeah. i can see the drive . you seen what they've been doing? -putting the new +putting the new yeah. in the bottom. yeah. i saw the cones. -actually they're all er they are, nearly all of them have been broken so they've obviously caught up with the list from the . -er er er okay sunshine? +actually they're all er they are, nearly all of them have been broken so they've obviously caught up with the list from the . +er er er okay sunshine? we'll go now. see you ne see you later. ni-night. @@ -45945,19 +45902,19 @@ anything more to do? no. i don't think so. i'm tired. -are you going to finish off in the kid's room? +are you going to finish off in the kid's room? yeah, i'll switch this thing off. i'll watch the rest of newsnight in bed i think. right. oh! what's this branch for, did you work out? -well it looks like it's a handy for one or something. +well it looks like it's a handy for one or something. oh! it is isn't it? -that's why it's got to be with the making the bird table i suppose. +that's why it's got to be with the making the bird table i suppose. it's obviously . -it'll be about i think about half past one. -but i can find out for definite later on. +it'll be about i think about half past one. +but i can find out for definite later on. i've got grandma's . what about another one? it's the only one there is . @@ -45973,7 +45930,7 @@ you've got joinery and i, i haven't. i was told i had to. oh! -i was +i was had a chance to get my job finished. you don't take any notice of them do you? yes, well i thought so . @@ -45984,14 +45941,14 @@ it's lovely isn't it? mm. had it trimmed, do you feel better? she's taken quite a lot off actually. -and that it didn't feel it when she was sort of combing it, but now i'm actually doing that i can feel it short. +and that it didn't feel it when she was sort of combing it, but now i'm actually doing that i can feel it short. it's not there. mind you, it needed it. it did need it. she said it did. oh i need a cut. -so yeah . -so, i'm thinking oh it's hard, when i actually feel it it feels thicker at the end and it does feel better but when i've washed it, i shall feel all hairy now all afternoon. +so yeah . +so, i'm thinking oh it's hard, when i actually feel it it feels thicker at the end and it does feel better but when i've washed it, i shall feel all hairy now all afternoon. yes. i'm just going to look . yeah. @@ -46011,7 +45968,7 @@ albert says i've got to sell 'im. shall we sell you? mm. who's gonna make you, scratching his bloody head, and he's made his head bleed. -would you have colin about him. +would you have colin about him. well. colin. i ended up paying for him. @@ -46022,9 +45979,9 @@ she's frightened to death of 'im isn't it. i know. but i don't think geoff would be very pleased. -well, if you say to him, that just say that and that, that's you know, oh, just say something like, just say something like i can't keep up with him dennis, he's throwing loads of dust about, just say to him,think about selling, to you want to buy him back or, you know. +well, if you say to him, that just say that and that, that's you know, oh, just say something like, just say something like i can't keep up with him dennis, he's throwing loads of dust about, just say to him,think about selling, to you want to buy him back or, you know. well, they won't, i don't think they'd have him back. -no and that's a +no and that's a i don't think, i don't think sell him. has he got to wait. a. @@ -46054,16 +46011,16 @@ i don't think you get attached to birds like you do animals. i don't think you get attached to birds like dogs. not like dogs and cats. no. -i mean albert said,if we do get that bungalow, we are 'cos the owner, he said she'll disappear. +i mean albert said,if we do get that bungalow, we are 'cos the owner, he said she'll disappear. she'll disappear. -i mean i'll be upset about our whisky, 'cos we're, i mean, we've had a long time, although she's not a pet pet, you know what i mean. -what feel like. +i mean i'll be upset about our whisky, 'cos we're, i mean, we've had a long time, although she's not a pet pet, you know what i mean. +what feel like. well, they they just, they go away when you take them somewhere fresh. and they don't know where they are. that one. they're very very sometimes, you're lucky, and you know, if if you keep them in long enough -we've always had cats, always had cats, when we lived at and we moved into and we'd had this one cat years, it were old cat. +we've always had cats, always had cats, when we lived at and we moved into and we'd had this one cat years, it were old cat. i wouldn't say it was ready for popping off, you know what i mean. yeah it were always fit and we were only there a fortnight, three weeks disappeared. @@ -46103,9 +46060,9 @@ she said, well our john's coming down tonight, she said, just get me twenty. i said, you might as well get forty, i said, because if he's late coming down yeah, right. and he can't round shop after, you'd be stuck, and i mean, he. -i don't albert don't mind going for her cigs, but it's just that we don't get up early in the morning, you know, and if me mum's ringing at eight o'clock in the morning, 'cos she got no cigs. -it's a bit unfair like, when when she could at -i said she said after my job at +i don't albert don't mind going for her cigs, but it's just that we don't get up early in the morning, you know, and if me mum's ringing at eight o'clock in the morning, 'cos she got no cigs. +it's a bit unfair like, when when she could at +i said she said after my job at margaret's not very well. she hadn't seen margaret since christmas eve. yeah, but she ain't been bad since christmas eve. @@ -46120,8 +46077,8 @@ i i mean, you're anything like that, but not not for a month, i mean. i got two toilet papers on . oh yeah. well, put one in your pocket then, -i margaret last night. -oh i i bet if you look at it, +i margaret last night. +oh i i bet if you look at it, i don't pete's been to me mum's for about six months. because i can't remembering him going. he never goes without margaret. @@ -46131,7 +46088,7 @@ mm. well, i said to her, told her about not having nowt to eat from that wednesday morning, er wednesday dinner time, till thursday when they went well she took away fish last night for her supper. oh. -and that she she looked shocked, you know, she didn't didn't know me like, and er, well she was shocked, and then i said i said, right well we'll have to get together and sort something out about stopping with her, and pete said straight away. +and that she she looked shocked, you know, she didn't didn't know me like, and er, well she was shocked, and then i said i said, right well we'll have to get together and sort something out about stopping with her, and pete said straight away. margaret's there every day, she goes out every morning. right. not that he actually asked her. @@ -46139,14 +46096,14 @@ years ago about beryl. i told you that's what he said. and i said, aye up, i don't mean in day-time. i says on a night-time, i said, you know, she can't leave her home now, i said, she can't manage to put coal on fire, and she can't manage to get up up to eat and drink and that, i said, i don't mind dropping off and taking me turn on the night-time but i mean, but it's hard, it's hard with me with kids every night. -it's for you with kids. +it's for you with kids. but i don't, certainly don't mind taking her down once a week or twice a week and taking me turn. karen there's no need, no need, you're needed at bloody home. i mean, there's only you got kids. there's no reason your margaret can't stop when he's on nights. -or afters. +or afters. no. -i mean, 'cos we can all down. +i mean, 'cos we can all down. only days really what's difficult for him. yeah. i don't think pete'd stop. @@ -46159,7 +46116,7 @@ you're bending watching ya. will you settle down. no. -i don't think margaret would want to stop, actually. +i don't think margaret would want to stop, actually. no, i don't think they would. none of em will but er, i don't think @@ -46170,18 +46127,18 @@ er, to say 'cos i mean, i closest, and i don't go. yeah, but i was your but er, me and me mum's never got on like our margaret and me mum have. no. -it's same as, what ow she's gone into hospital with her, you know, and i'd actually been that day, you know what i mean, i don't mind, don't get me wrong, i'm not cross, 'cos i don't mind. -but it annoys you they they they think they're doing a lot for her 'cos they go in ev every morning. +it's same as, what ow she's gone into hospital with her, you know, and i'd actually been that day, you know what i mean, i don't mind, don't get me wrong, i'm not cross, 'cos i don't mind. +but it annoys you they they they think they're doing a lot for her 'cos they go in ev every morning. yeah, they're more thought of. yeah. more thought of. has he. yeah. -i mean, i know, but colin ain't been down much this week, because colin's been working, he's been working every day and that, you know what i mean, it's been a bit hard for us to get down but we tried. +i mean, i know, but colin ain't been down much this week, because colin's been working, he's been working every day and that, you know what i mean, it's been a bit hard for us to get down but we tried. yeah. who should try and pick kids up and then have an hour down there. well, he spends more time there than me. -'cos i've been this morning and i've cleared fireplace out, washed +'cos i've been this morning and i've cleared fireplace out, washed no, you're not wearing your shoes in here. and i've 'oovered up, and dusted and polished. @@ -46196,7 +46153,7 @@ i can't, our margaret's drying it on radiators, and i says to albert, what me mu he says, i don't know. it's still there. so i'm gonna ask her if i can borrow it -it's +it's and then now i'll do her dryer washing for her. yeah. i mean, i only really wanted to dry me towels, because i hate having to run out laun launderette while i'm drying all me other clothes on radiators. @@ -46216,10 +46173,10 @@ oh, alright. barney mum to 'ospital, and i, er she give me a lift. she dropped her washing off. -i thought she'd dried it, and she said, oh, i'm just gonna put this washing on radiators, and then it, it were then that er it made me think, well, what done with her dryer. +i thought she'd dried it, and she said, oh, i'm just gonna put this washing on radiators, and then it, it were then that er it made me think, well, what done with her dryer. yeah, i know. well, 'cos i mean, she can't be paying much electric. -it's not that that your margaret ain't got time to stop there and dry it for her, you know what i mean. +it's not that that your margaret ain't got time to stop there and dry it for her, you know what i mean. oh, all you got to do is put it in, somebody'll take it out. yeah. go over there, no don't, she won't go outside, keep them on there. @@ -46230,24 +46187,24 @@ you know what i mean, the yeah, she she said she might. she's took er fish and that, and she's tried in ways like that. yeah. -i mean i can't afford to take care -we tried to -we can afford to keep afford to dog. +i mean i can't afford to take care +we tried to +we can afford to keep afford to dog. and margaret's dad, when they, when my kids were little would never take our kids anywhere but they -it were me dad, it were me dad that didn't take up +it were me dad, it were me dad that didn't take up and always relied on one or the other, i don't -me dad wouldn't me dad didn't mind taking +me dad wouldn't me dad didn't mind taking i don't care which one. but they would never take 'em out for day no, i know. but they would fetch 'em and pay for them, and i even today, you cannot buy love. no. -and it's proven my point, our dawn wouldn't even think about there. +and it's proven my point, our dawn wouldn't even think about there. our our corinne goes round when she got to. don't think about what. our corinne don't only go round when she got to. she goes round -goes round weeks ago. +goes round weeks ago. well, she won't go and stop. said she won't go and stop again. who's gonna stop then. @@ -46255,17 +46212,17 @@ when we were all on about stopping i don't mind going and doing her shopping and bits, she says, i'm not stopping. yeah. when you were on about that love, what pa was saying about, you know, like every night, that our kids, when, they had their pyjamas on, and they're like, to get hold,i'm lying watching television, i'm usually falling asleep, but i put the kids,you know. -and er, last time i i get in touch, me mum told me,turned round and says to me, i don't want any more mum, i says why, he says, oh she won't let me have pillow and then i then i think if summat else brought to light, i kill her +and er, last time i i get in touch, me mum told me,turned round and says to me, i don't want any more mum, i says why, he says, oh she won't let me have pillow and then i then i think if summat else brought to light, i kill her yeah. if she had come in yeah. and that, i know it's a filthy old thing, but it it's comfort ain't it. yeah. -and when they start let them have the pillow down, they don't feel, they can't get comfortable. +and when they start let them have the pillow down, they don't feel, they can't get comfortable. i know it's a little bit trivial like, but it's just, it's still she has queer ways me mother. karen i i'm forty-seven and i can't work me mother out, so, no chance for you working her out, few years you've known her. -no no, i i, i mean, she's always been alright with me really, i mean,y you know, she's not not at all mother-in-law, she's not +no no, i i, i mean, she's always been alright with me really, i mean,y you know, she's not not at all mother-in-law, she's not well, me and me mum's, me and me me mum's never been close. it were always like, me and our colin were more or less with me dad, and our margaret and john were more or less for me mum. then when they got older, me dad sort of took our john on, because our john were mechanical minded, and our colin got pushed out a bit, 'cos our colin weren't interested in cars. @@ -46279,17 +46236,17 @@ it's always been our margaret. mind you, did you see that photo that yeah. you are, i mean, i could just work out,i said, your margaret and john are a lot like you. -she is 'cos she's got margaret's lips and your nose, but out of all of you, i think your your jo you can see your john in it, can't you, more than anybody. +she is 'cos she's got margaret's lips and your nose, but out of all of you, i think your your jo you can see your john in it, can't you, more than anybody. i always think our john looks more like a prescott, 'cos he al every time i see him, i see me uncle bill more and more. -yeah, john used to say, years ago about how much that you're, john looks like your brian, and i don't think he looks anything like it. +yeah, john used to say, years ago about how much that you're, john looks like your brian, and i don't think he looks anything like it. no, i don't. -and she again now, she says like somebody your john look like that bloke next door. +and she again now, she says like somebody your john look like that bloke next door. what a load of rubbish, i thought well. no. he looks more and more aye. our colin's getting more and more like me dad. -well, brian ain't it. +well, brian ain't it. brian , brian i think don't like, er, they are, they're all like that. all of them. @@ -46298,23 +46255,23 @@ yeah, i think he does. but then again, he did look like that photo, i think he does look like that photo, but you were younger then, yeah. but he does look like uncle bill. -mind you colin's getting more like your dad every day. +mind you colin's getting more like your dad every day. i know he is. black welding glasses on, and he turned round and he made me jump. like oh, colin, and then he go like this, you know,isn't it. -you know, he'll come running glasses. +you know, he'll come running glasses. yeah. i can't do it. and right, he made me heart jump, 'cos he looked just like your dad, and then a few days later, he's in garage again, and johnny come in and he said, god he said, he gave me a flaming heart attack out there. i said, why, and he said, he turned round with these glasses on, then he said it was just like john's stood there. i says, don't tell me, i said, he did the same thing to me the other day, and it were only within a couple of days of each other. when he puts those glasses on, honestly he's his double. -i think it's the way he looks, like, if you know what i mean, you know like pull his face and like, look over glasses, i mean,he did it to me when did it to johnny. -he probably thought like. +i think it's the way he looks, like, if you know what i mean, you know like pull his face and like, look over glasses, i mean,he did it to me when did it to johnny. +he probably thought like. he's like me dad, er me dad, he never had no patience, and our colin's just like him. mind you, i'm like our colin as well in a lot of ways. i haven't got a lot of patience. -but where where we're better off 'cos albert, he's calm, where you and our colin are both fiery tempered +but where where we're better off 'cos albert, he's calm, where you and our colin are both fiery tempered yeah. where, when i start, albert's he, i tell you want he doesn't do, i shouldn't let you hear, but, when he, when him and me are arguing when we were younger, and me dad used to wind colin up, and wind me up, and i'd get madder and madder, and me dad used to love it. @@ -46325,10 +46282,10 @@ i know. and instead of just ignoring him. ignoring him. -you don't, he and he going through bloody +you don't, he and he going through bloody yeah, i know. what -a where +a where no. bird pooh on window. but,i mean, er, @@ -46338,7 +46295,7 @@ i know aren't they dirty. he thinks a lot about ya yeah. right duck. -you know, i he mustn't pushed me, that man, who that keeps asking me out. +you know, i he mustn't pushed me, that man, who that keeps asking me out. i mean, i sometimes, i mean, i admit i'm not most passionate person in the world but i then again i'm not you're not by your bloody self. i'm not frigid or owt @@ -46347,7 +46304,7 @@ no. i keep saying to him, look colin, i said, i know a couple of times a week's enough for me, but that's worth waiting for, but when you're doing it three times and then get sick of it. and he can't understand that. yeah. -you think got 'er. +you think got 'er. aye. no. no, don't do any more. @@ -46360,7 +46317,7 @@ i know, but you're wasting 'em. i tried to make a it's alright like that. oh yeah. -you're wasting 'em that back door shut! +you're wasting 'em that back door shut! it scared me. go and tell auntie june to shut the back door. else she'll be missing a bird. @@ -46374,10 +46331,10 @@ aye. flies round your head, you know. oh aye, gets stuck in your hair. well, he's not going out. -i in a minute +i in a minute he will get on your head an' all i will get on his head in a minute, again. -aren't we he's got +aren't we he's got he's got what? got, your a bogie. @@ -46395,7 +46352,7 @@ behave, bloody scratching. bloody big, stupid sod. i'm making a bed for for barney. and barney's in bed. -i need a blanket gotta blanket for 'im. +i need a blanket gotta blanket for 'im. told you now, make your pillow,fellow, is barney got little little legs? he he's in bed. has barney got little little legs @@ -46403,7 +46360,7 @@ mm. a little bit bigger don't ya. look at that flaming dog. come on, come on, throw them over there. -i wonder if there's any way you can actually check, you know, where he is, is there any way that +i wonder if there's any way you can actually check, you know, where he is, is there any way that watch me tea, now. straight out, or, well, what what do you think erm, @@ -46426,7 +46383,7 @@ er. bert. are you doing alright, are ya. what they do, they look they look around and they weigh up up pros and cons up, and it it's like these insurance brokers, they ring all over to buy cheapest insurance for you, well, that's what allied dunbar are doing. -well, well, this is a broker, but it's a broker, so that's +well, well, this is a broker, but it's a broker, so that's yeah. you see, what it is, it's where they've been behind with their mortgage, we will pay a slightly higher rate, but it's only yeah. @@ -46436,7 +46393,7 @@ so it's only a matter of a yeah, but one per cent 's a hell of a lot you know. it's a penny in the pound. yeah, but i mean it, it will drop, it will drop again. -but the thing is, also what i thought of once we gotta us a mortgage and got established, you could always remortgage and go into er like bradford and bingley, and come out like that +but the thing is, also what i thought of once we gotta us a mortgage and got established, you could always remortgage and go into er like bradford and bingley, and come out like that yeah, once you get it back up to yeah. yeah, well that's @@ -46445,11 +46402,11 @@ it'll not be a dodgy one. put it in there, then. it won't be, it's not forced to be a building society. no, it isn't. -it gonna to be a building society. +it gonna to be a building society. oh, well, it might be abbey national. no, it's come back, it's got target finance on it. ah. -well that's o that is a finance company and not a building society. +well that's o that is a finance company and not a building society. if it says finance, it doesn't mean a building society. nine times out of ten, it's a finance company. same as er, mercantile, and @@ -46486,7 +46443,7 @@ we started out with key finance and we ended up with mercantile credit, didn't w yeah. changed companies three times, that time we had that four thousand pounds. you told me about that, yeah. -well said that it will be a sm a really small building society. +well said that it will be a sm a really small building society. he says, that, 'cos er, it's not well. big building societies are not prepared to give you rates, and small building societies are wanting to get going @@ -46496,7 +46453,7 @@ well, finance companies only, you only get the interest on what is left. on the money that you owe. yeah. that's the difference. -and between them both, you can, you could i mean you take a ten thousand pound out with a mortgage, mortgage, and you could end up paying what, twenty thousand, twenty four thousand back. +and between them both, you can, you could i mean you take a ten thousand pound out with a mortgage, mortgage, and you could end up paying what, twenty thousand, twenty four thousand back. yeah. well, finance company. you, you borrow ten grand or twenty grand whatever you like to, and you get a certain amount put on that, and that's it, it's fixed. @@ -46524,20 +46481,20 @@ if you say, oh, we'll take it over ten years. well you've got ten years interest to pay, ain't ya. so you pay the interest for for nine years, and they start paying your loan off. we're still having trouble getting insurance, and er, anyway i phoned, and i wrote him again yesterday, and he's given this number, who er, who he's with. -'cos he had a right job,got plastic, 'cos he even plastics, i mean that's +'cos he had a right job,got plastic, 'cos he even plastics, i mean that's yeah. inflammable, ain't it. anyway, er, the bloke who managed to get him insurance, this this, the premises are insured with him, yeah. so i thought, well, if he's already got, er, part of his insurance without having yeah, because he was in, paper, waste paper, and the fire insurance on that must have been colossal. -that's where cardboard and paper. +that's where cardboard and paper. yeah. sasha come in here, shut door. he's not coming in. but er, i can't understand why, because i mean, let's face it,he he's only using fibre-glass and they're not that flammable no, what they're saying is. -not the flammable, it's the er indemnity, nobody can breathing it in who's in +not the flammable, it's the er indemnity, nobody can breathing it in who's in oh, yeah, yeah. they're frightened like, in years to come, like, they're gonna try and make a claim against them 'cos their er, been on the chest, is summat like that. yeah. @@ -46571,7 +46528,7 @@ i bet aye. i couldn't it might be dust out of his wings. -yeah i every time i come here. +yeah i every time i come here. nineteen ninety one, ninety two. i must have sensitive eyes eighteen hundred and fifty two. @@ -46586,7 +46543,7 @@ a hundred and forty pound. in two years. in two years. now, if that had been a finance company, i would have paid a damn sight more. -but it cost us thirty seven pound a month. +but it cost us thirty seven pound a month. but, last year, we put, no wait a minute, last year, we paid 'em four hundred and eight pound fifty two, and they put two hundred and seventy two pound fifty interest on. so actually all we paid, was thirty seven, per cent @@ -46611,7 +46568,7 @@ communist countries. everything's owned by the by the government and er, i know it's not a right good thing, like, but if it could work properly, it would be a damn good thing. watch she don't bite ya. i mean, communism in england, -in it's in it's proper form would be a wonderful thing, but er, it's on because er, it's only the rich people what make people poor. +in it's in it's proper form would be a wonderful thing, but er, it's on because er, it's only the rich people what make people poor. i know. the say as with damn education, like, at bloody tory sods, they took all blinking, we gi for al for all these people what's going to college, every time they drop on holidays they've got nothing to keep 'em. no. @@ -46623,21 +46580,21 @@ yeah. it says, everything they're doing, it says, is going back to the eighteenth century, when you hear about these kath catherine cookson days, working for pennies and you can't get educated un cutting back, they're cutting back on education. -oh, you're telling me +oh, you're telling me they're making it so only the rich can be educated. -yeah, trying to turn it back into +yeah, trying to turn it back into at the end of the day. i mean, our colin's there waiting for a grant and what's happening. sweet nothing. -now we're, it were in bloody paper last on thursday, they don't get nothing when they're on holiday. +now we're, it were in bloody paper last on thursday, they don't get nothing when they're on holiday. no, they don't, i mean, how the hell they supposed at eighteen year old without a job. mm. if they have a job, they don't get no grants. -and how can you have, hold a a job down +and how can you have, hold a a job down i don't think and do education at same time. -i'm not sure, but i think i don't got my family allowance until i were eighteen, i think, i think they used to give us +i'm not sure, but i think i don't got my family allowance until i were eighteen, i think, i think they used to give us let me keep our karen's oh. so i've got a form to fill in, actually. @@ -46645,11 +46602,11 @@ it should have gone back last week, and i it'll all stop when she gets her grant through. don't knock me. she said not necessarily. -i think it will stop them thought shit i'm not bloody going to declare it, +i think it will stop them thought shit i'm not bloody going to declare it, yeah. she applied for a grant, and in, er in career, it says like, -sasha -you'll, like you you +sasha +you'll, like you you no, you'll rip it. left home, you know, we are, like, say our karen to leave home. aye. @@ -46658,15 +46615,15 @@ and she were living in the parks. get up here. yeah. they used to give 'em subsidies to help 'em pay the rent, they've stopped that, so they've either to gerra job, to help put supplement to pay in the, you know, their housing accommodation, or they've got to stop school. -in summer holidays, er, the grant don't they take that six weeks +in summer holidays, er, the grant don't they take that six weeks off the grant. off the grant, so that actually they get six weeks money less, through the year, than they should do, where they're used to paying all through year for twelve months, now they don't. now, they don't get anything for that six weeks that they're not at school. no. so, you know, any girl that's not living at 'ome. -she got to go out and work for that six weeks, to, to earn the money feed the -and where can you get that bloody kind of money, only corner. +she got to go out and work for that six weeks, to, to earn the money feed the +and where can you get that bloody kind of money, only corner. yeah, but where can you get a job. well, that's it. where can you job. @@ -46674,31 +46631,31 @@ well, it's forcing the girls on to streets, ain't it. yeah. corner. i mean, they're begging 'em you to ke they're begging you to keep 'em on at school, and yet you can't get no help to keep 'em on. -it's like other day,we were talking to this bloke like, and he were on about businesses, says you can't underst , oh he said something about finances,how difficult it is to get finance to start a business up and er, he said, i know, he said you can't me, he said. -you seen all these adverts about starting your own business, you know, governments like, you know, doing all these courses and making it out as though it's it's dead easy to get fi , you know hitting your head against a brick wall +it's like other day,we were talking to this bloke like, and he were on about businesses, says you can't underst , oh he said something about finances,how difficult it is to get finance to start a business up and er, he said, i know, he said you can't me, he said. +you seen all these adverts about starting your own business, you know, governments like, you know, doing all these courses and making it out as though it's it's dead easy to get fi , you know hitting your head against a brick wall yeah. the only way you can start a business, is by starting it without insurance straight off your own back, and then, you know, after it's running, get insurance. yeah. that ho ninety five per cent of firms do that. regulate. -i mean it's +i mean it's i mean, look at laddo round there what's been broke into. -he's no insurance no insurance whatsoever, 'cos he couldn't afford it. +he's no insurance no insurance whatsoever, 'cos he couldn't afford it. i know. ours is gonna us about a thousand pound for insurance. oh. -well, a thousand pounds not a lot, karen, but er it all depends what the, what what you gonna be insured for? +well, a thousand pounds not a lot, karen, but er it all depends what the, what what you gonna be insured for? it's not. i mean, even that, you're gonna you you gonna be insured for breaking in and break-ins and yeah, i think it's everything. -i think it's +i think it's that's what i mean, so what you're actually getting for your, thousand pound isn't a lot of money. no. i think it's covered for like, like you say, like for some reason, say you had a fire, and you had to stop work. yeah. i think it's covered for that. -covered for personal injury, er, covered for hundred thousand, for like, that's what trailers,they've got trailers in. +covered for personal injury, er, covered for hundred thousand, for like, that's what trailers,they've got trailers in. it's covered for everything. i mean, you imagine somebody breaking in and setting fire to a trailer. i mean, it's a lot of money when you think norma's paying nine hundred pound just for her car. @@ -46709,7 +46666,7 @@ what for car? yeah. right what how how comes that, then? -because, well, cabriolet's are classed as dangerous, aren't they, because they're soft roofed. +because, well, cabriolet's are classed as dangerous, aren't they, because they're soft roofed. oh, aye. it's not got no aye, this @@ -46728,7 +46685,7 @@ i'm still are ya. well, i i i'll promise not to fondle. need to tell her. -connie get in touch with me again, i told her that. +connie get in touch with me again, i told her that. i don't know. tell the truth innit. aye. @@ -46737,7 +46694,7 @@ he wouldn't be be able to keep that promise if he'd tried. he won't promise. who no, i don't. -i be you get to walk by yourself +i be you get to walk by yourself see that piece in free press about no. it's a big piece. @@ -46747,8 +46704,8 @@ give mummy that free press that paper. one. yeah -er for me eyes. -it's only one like you had for +er for me eyes. +it's only one like you had for he does make a lot of dust. i thought, when, last time i were here, i kept thinking, well, why's he only doing it, 'cos i know he never done it before. when i thought, he says to colin, i said,bird, you know, like, when something started to @@ -46759,13 +46716,13 @@ mm. i'm not worn no make-up for ages, 'cos me eyes seem to be like, itching all of a sudden. aye. so whether it's just that as well. -well, it can't be 'im, 'cos we always had +well, it can't be 'im, 'cos we always had yeah. it's gotta be 'im. yeah. -you bald headed mutt, aren't ya george. +you bald headed mutt, aren't ya george. old baldy. -he's can he talk? +he's can he talk? yeah. he says he's baldy. @@ -46780,18 +46737,18 @@ oh. it's it's er, benji. benji, come off. -i didn't, i mean, i don't like small the right brightly coloured or what, but it looked like it were coloured like this, like this kind of colouring. +i didn't, i mean, i don't like small the right brightly coloured or what, but it looked like it were coloured like this, like this kind of colouring. yeah. it it's blue. i'm sure, she said it's blue. it's got some cream in it as well ain't it. well,more, so i couldn't see, but i just, to me it was just like er, thought it was like minky coloured. but mind ya,more like a, but what i was gonna say is, -suppose to be a but i mean +suppose to be a but i mean on back of it, on back of it, she's got like all them tapestry pictures laid over back of it. yeah. she got, same on chairs, all, you can hardly see the suite, 'cos she's got, she says, and er, i says to her, i says to her, oh it's nice your suite, innit. -she says yeah, if i can keep it clean, she got all cushions covered up, well like er, er +she says yeah, if i can keep it clean, she got all cushions covered up, well like er, er keep it clean, there's only them two buggers. i know, but what's the point of having a new suite, and having old covers on it like that. they make me laugh, when they sit in 'ouse with blanket round them, so they don't have to turn 'eating up. @@ -46799,7 +46756,7 @@ i don't aye, you go in there and it's empty that other that's empty. i know, i see it. -i tell you what, you to make mistakes in your life, i mean and, i just, well one of those things that that i'm pleased about, is that i just george when +i tell you what, you to make mistakes in your life, i mean and, i just, well one of those things that that i'm pleased about, is that i just george when don't work. aye. when what? @@ -46813,24 +46770,24 @@ get on with it. we do you'll end up with a smack bum. benjy, will you leave her alone. -are you have you told her to leave me alone? +are you have you told her to leave me alone? yeah. no. -get on ya benj +get on ya benj do you always smack him, when he plays yeah, i smack his bum. does he play with dad. no. -why he plays does he play with toilet paper? +why he plays does he play with toilet paper? no, he eats it. -no, look ain't that 'orse going back +no, look ain't that 'orse going back where? you've missed it, it's gone now. i mean, when you think of what he started with, karen, yeah. he borrowed money from his father-in-law. yeah. -is that which one? +is that which one? it's gone. which. me dad, if if me dad had done what @@ -46840,12 +46797,12 @@ well, well richard won't. i know. er. she's is his cousin. -is that maybe the other side, but i don't be wendy's side. +is that maybe the other side, but i don't be wendy's side. she's his cousin. 'cos i says to her one day, well why don't you ask yer, your relation, if he'll er, if he'll give yer a job. give us a job, she said, he won't even pass the time of day with us. i said, well, i, there must be summat there, out there, she said no, he said, she said it goes back a long time. -but er, she says, never even speaks to us. +but er, she says, never even speaks to us. and if we if if we ring up, he puts he just puts the phone straight down, soon as you tell him who it is. probably goes back from when they went he said, i, she said i can live without him anyhow. @@ -46857,20 +46814,20 @@ i found some mighty muscle in garage, you know. how much. you know that big round tin. i, not how much is in it, but it'll probably be about that much in bottom. -i know wanting to do this room, really, 'cos it would be too cold. +i know wanting to do this room, really, 'cos it would be too cold. get away with one. -i wish we'd just too cold. -you won't, as far as we're having to buy coal at that price. +i wish we'd just too cold. +you won't, as far as we're having to buy coal at that price. no, i know. every time we have any spare money, it has to go on pigging coal. how much. you know that big round tin? yeah. i don't know how much is in it, but probably be about that much in bottom. -might be really, couldn't too cold. +might be really, couldn't too cold. get away with one. -i wish we'd afford some i mean, it's cold. -you won't while we're having the buy coal, at that price. +i wish we'd afford some i mean, it's cold. +you won't while we're having the buy coal, at that price. no, i know. every time we have any spare money, it has to go on pigging coal. we'll probably just buy some, and that lad'll ring up. @@ -46889,8 +46846,8 @@ that's what moo cows do. you're crackers. it is. it is a moo cow. -i mean like er, eileen was saying summat yesterday, she said, she said i don't er, have at home, she said, i decided to i said i'm frightened, and sometimes knows i'm not frightened. -i said, i'm frightened someone's in the 'ouse, i'm frightened not waking everybody well, well what do you do, i says, you don't, unless you have a go, you don't, i mean, if i'd turned out you know, you don't really know. +i mean like er, eileen was saying summat yesterday, she said, she said i don't er, have at home, she said, i decided to i said i'm frightened, and sometimes knows i'm not frightened. +i said, i'm frightened someone's in the 'ouse, i'm frightened not waking everybody well, well what do you do, i says, you don't, unless you have a go, you don't, i mean, if i'd turned out you know, you don't really know. i know. i mean, that you might, and then again, you might be a millionaire inside three months. @@ -46904,7 +46861,7 @@ but this time i decided it's what i want to do and bugger it. if we don't sell it, we we haven't lost anything. oh well. sell it till we move. -i honestly think myself +i honestly think myself as long as we're not worse off than what we were before we moved. i honestly think meself, that i might have a have a couple of hard months, maybe three, first three months might be a bit difficult for me. oh, it probably will be. @@ -46912,8 +46869,8 @@ well, i think, once he gets established, and once he starts getting work in, i t oh we can always lend you a couple of ten pences. i know. i know we're hard up, but you can ten pence. -you never know, might be to make enough money to take you out somewhere for a decent christmas do. -oh +you never know, might be to make enough money to take you out somewhere for a decent christmas do. +oh yeah, christmas party. yeah. yeah, might. @@ -46924,19 +46881,19 @@ him that used to work with our colin. yeah. you know, er, well, aye, the -it, he would +it, he would it's gotta be better than being on dole, innit. no, i don't know. oh, is that no he's, no he's got a good job. -he works at with plenty of overtime. +he works at with plenty of overtime. benjy. -colin phoned him up, and er, it it he mentioned, how he was starting up, and he said he might be interested, anyway colin phoned him a couple of weeks ago to see if he was still interested in. +colin phoned him up, and er, it it he mentioned, how he was starting up, and he said he might be interested, anyway colin phoned him a couple of weeks ago to see if he was still interested in. anyway he says he'd pay him the same money as what he's on there, 'cos he'd have to really, wouldn't just say, say you've, you've got to, but how the hell get it, if he don't get paid up front. what do ya mean? well, wages, -got to +got to well, it have to come out of capital, at first. yeah. put by ten or eleven thousand, or whatever it is, just come out of that. @@ -46957,7 +46914,7 @@ but we don't know how long it'll be, before get any money coming in, and if you so then, what what comes out of business we'll pay him anyway. yeah. you might have too much in bank for family credit, that ten thousand, it's only eight, innit? -it's got, it's gotta know what increase, when you running a business. +it's got, it's gotta know what increase, when you running a business. yeah. oh, i don't know. if you apply for it straight away, could you say you don't know how much monies coming in. @@ -46975,23 +46932,23 @@ oh. i ju i mean, it, now it's just getting me, more depressed than nowt else, i mean, i just wish that they'd phone and say yeah, we've got you a insured. and then, i mean, 'cos we daren't say that to accountant know, to have 'ouse valued, 'cos what's point in, i mean, anybody said to us, er, get it sent off, you'll find, you're, somebody will insure ya. but what if they don't. -you've lost all your ain't ya. -ya, so that's the end of the world. +you've lost all your ain't ya. +ya, so that's the end of the world. even if you find out they won't. no. -why don't you get a free put on market. +why don't you get a free put on market. no, the on the company's, that's coming up with all the money got to oh aye. do the valuation. -and they ought to form value of what, so they know how much it's worth, what the company that's gonna earn them the money want the money for the valuation. +and they ought to form value of what, so they know how much it's worth, what the company that's gonna earn them the money want the money for the valuation. it's just another way of making a bit more money out it. that's it. well, it's same as when you buying and selling 'ouses. -you when it comes out, when, the people that's, mind me cigarette, darling, the people that's gonna buy your 'ouse, who, mortgage company comes out and values it, they've got that to pay as well haven't they. +you when it comes out, when, the people that's, mind me cigarette, darling, the people that's gonna buy your 'ouse, who, mortgage company comes out and values it, they've got that to pay as well haven't they. yeah. the same as, i, them that buys our 'ouse, they'll have to pay whatever it cost for 'em to value our 'ouse, see if it's worth lending money, we'll have the same thing with er bungalow, down there. yeah. -it's only money i mean, how long are they 'ere. +it's only money i mean, how long are they 'ere. yeah. ten minutes. mean, that woman come out, when when we had this done, didn't she, @@ -47002,7 +46959,7 @@ what was that for, for you know when we had extension put up. oh yeah, yeah, well, -did it value. +did it value. they sent they sent 'em out from er, abbey national and we had to pay, well we did pay 'im fifty pound, people that put the building on paid. she keeps getting up. she's not. @@ -47021,21 +46978,21 @@ yeah. yeah, because if ya, if ya, get it before ya start your business. you've still got it to pay as soon as you get it. yeah. -trust them, because it's in their at the moment. -well, i still believe in and i don't pushed around and say, no you can't have money, no you can't get insured, and so that means others. +trust them, because it's in their at the moment. +well, i still believe in and i don't pushed around and say, no you can't have money, no you can't get insured, and so that means others. you haven't lost anything have ya? well, just er disappointment, i suppose. for what well, yeah, -then again, i mean, i +then again, i mean, i there's always summat else you can go and do. -you know that, doing that, fabricating, and things like that, you know like actual welding and that type of er, we wouldn't make as much money out of that as you probably would +you know that, doing that, fabricating, and things like that, you know like actual welding and that type of er, we wouldn't make as much money out of that as you probably would no. no, you'll be, you'll be stuck to it, all time, and it's not good for 'im. no. and it kills your eyes welding. benjy. -but as he said to me, why don't you go welding. +but as he said to me, why don't you go welding. i says, the point is i've got bad eyes as it is, yeah. what's the point in making them worse. @@ -47055,8 +47012,8 @@ yeah. a spray area, then yeah. employ a sprayer. -so, i mean, we know what we want, but it's them and not us, i mean, it is frightening to start a business up, 'cos we don't know how much work we'll be getting, but, i mean, -well, it's same for anybody starting any business, ain't it, you don't know if it's gonna work as well. +so, i mean, we know what we want, but it's them and not us, i mean, it is frightening to start a business up, 'cos we don't know how much work we'll be getting, but, i mean, +well, it's same for anybody starting any business, ain't it, you don't know if it's gonna work as well. it might go well for the first three or four months, and then all of a sudden we might have a lapse in a few months , yeah. you could be struggling to keep it above @@ -47081,13 +47038,13 @@ i can tell you that, now. oohh. what? oohh. -you feel like er, that's whose, like ex soldiers throughout the company, and he said to colin er, he said, how many people are you thinking about employ , our colin seems to think there'd be enough work to keep 'im going, like, he says, he says, well how many people are you thinking about employing, he says, only only me and me like, it's oh, oh, he says, there's plenty of work to keep two of going, he said, i thought you employed about six. +you feel like er, that's whose, like ex soldiers throughout the company, and he said to colin er, he said, how many people are you thinking about employ , our colin seems to think there'd be enough work to keep 'im going, like, he says, he says, well how many people are you thinking about employing, he says, only only me and me like, it's oh, oh, he says, there's plenty of work to keep two of going, he said, i thought you employed about six. so if he thinks that colin do have six working for him, and he's got enough work for six, then surely there's gonna be plenty of work for two of 'em. yeah, but what he means by six is, he gets the jobs done quicker yeah, but then you still got six wages to pay out, haven't ya. yeah. that's it. -he probably will have six later on, if he gets it off, but the thing is, i mean, he'll need somebody to drive wagons round yard, and half the time,y you know, he'll be sat doing nothing, scratching his nose. +he probably will have six later on, if he gets it off, but the thing is, i mean, he'll need somebody to drive wagons round yard, and half the time,y you know, he'll be sat doing nothing, scratching his nose. them's the people he's got to be wary of, the people that want a job, but don't wanna work for it. there's a hell of a lot in broadway and stainford, yeah. @@ -47096,9 +47053,9 @@ mind lee's a, lee's a good worker, he says that, he wants, you know, best worker yeah, but i mean, working for a mate, is different to working for a firm. yeah. you know, i mean -well, he's not a mate, he won't, he's working with him when he were at er over in brad oh, here's richard now. +well, he's not a mate, he won't, he's working with him when he were at er over in brad oh, here's richard now. aye, you'd better jump in bed with him, -oh dear, no but he is, richard is the one with the comical magazine,laughing bursts two incomes. +oh dear, no but he is, richard is the one with the comical magazine,laughing bursts two incomes. i think that's part of yes. look, slow down, or you're driving me mad. @@ -47108,7 +47065,7 @@ get settled. pity she can't go as well, you could have had a quiet weekend. where's gavin like, is he with colin? no, in the barn, 'cos they went yesterday morning, and er, they end up sleeping last night,due back today -i was i was +i was i was don't make sense. mmoo if i don't 'ave 'im, i'll be having 'im for a, you know, two days at a time. @@ -47126,7 +47083,7 @@ i thought it were twenty sixth. that's true. well, you'll have to wait while a week before -oh, i said george,bed with ya, i said, that's worse +oh, i said george,bed with ya, i said, that's worse oh benjy lie down, what matter with ya. he's worse than your father ain't he. lie down now. @@ -47144,51 +47101,51 @@ what were you saying about er, two hours old. look in me dad's then. maybe in february after this worst month of year. -but, after everybody's birthdays and anniversaries in bloody february. +but, after everybody's birthdays and anniversaries in bloody february. aye. it must be the summer what does it. aye, it's always it's linda's anniversary tomorrow. -it's her birthday on on wednesday, it's our on twelfth, and whenever our dawn has this baby, that's gonna be in february. +it's her birthday on on wednesday, it's our on twelfth, and whenever our dawn has this baby, that's gonna be in february. yeah. it's your birthday, me mum's birthday. have we got any buggers in march? it won't matter whether it's born on your margaret's birthday or not, it still won't get nowt. it won't get nowt. -it were born on,yvon yvon hang on, get it yvonne's birthday is the first of february, and mine's the twenty first, but she'll be a year older than me, so she's like a year and twenty days +it were born on,yvon yvon hang on, get it yvonne's birthday is the first of february, and mine's the twenty first, but she'll be a year older than me, so she's like a year and twenty days yeah. exactly older than me. first and twenty-first. you want to do what she's doing now. who's it for. oh. -i thought it was that wife. +i thought it was that wife. oh, norma. oh no. oh no, not 'er. norma. -pack one, her. -i know, i call that, but i mean, i don't down the town,but her. +pack one, her. +i know, i call that, but i mean, i don't down the town,but her. but i, i didn't think i like that. mum, mum watch this, are you watching. you have to lose a race now and again. yeah, but she ain't even, are you watching, -er, what was was i saying, the i don't know what george has all the customers, i mean, she's isn't even particularly +er, what was was i saying, the i don't know what george has all the customers, i mean, she's isn't even particularly isn't she, she's not what you call really bonny, she ain't got a right bonny face. i know she's got a nice figure. she's as thick as two short planks, she's got a dirty mouth. i mean, i, you know, maybe -i can't understand your cross. +i can't understand your cross. i know. -cannot understand or something. +cannot understand or something. their as different as chalk and bloody cheese. -plenty of different people cheap, er,the other people who have different likes to you, but what, what you might think's attrac attractive, somebody else'll +plenty of different people cheap, er,the other people who have different likes to you, but what, what you might think's attrac attractive, somebody else'll yeah. won't be, you know. -to be quite honest, without talking like a school on a fence. +to be quite honest, without talking like a school on a fence. they're not very happy, they ain't been happy for a while, but it's getting worse,wh is, what is them now is, you know i say things to colin, and co i mean, colin'll tell me like, you know, you know,over there, and er, he's latest thing is, they built this little office. -you know when you go into on the right, er a coal-house and a wash- house ain't there. +you know when you go into on the right, er a coal-house and a wash- house ain't there. yeah. the coal-house part it's is quite wide now we've done it, big coal-house, but altered and then it twists, and like a small office, and when when i were there, after michael had shown it me and colin, he says oh, he says, er i'm come in here to get get out of way, and you know, he was like telling me, i thought i don't want to be a fiddle, because it's alright telling colin, the boys @@ -47196,7 +47153,7 @@ telling yeah, yeah. ain't it, yeah, it's not like a woman telling you problems. don't knock my dusters off. -anyway, i just said, well, summat about about what i said, i says, yeah,nice to get away from it all, ain't it, to be by yourself, and that's all i said, and i think he knew that i i didn't want to +anyway, i just said, well, summat about about what i said, i says, yeah,nice to get away from it all, ain't it, to be by yourself, and that's all i said, and i think he knew that i i didn't want to but, and he said to colin oh shit. said, he said, yeah, he said, it'll be ideal in here, he said, i can put, he said, put a full lock on door, and he said, i can come in here, he said,and so i thought, ah. @@ -47207,23 +47164,23 @@ well, i think it's got a lot to do with the climate we're living in, you know, rushing about there's that much, there's that many people out of work, there's and you know, there's that many pressures on people. -i mean, it's like like colin and i, i mean, like we're happy but then, no were not hundred per cent happy at all,but like, er, like some people i can't if you get upset, some people eat more, some people eat less, or you know, some go into recluse, some get and like colin, +i mean, it's like like colin and i, i mean, like we're happy but then, no were not hundred per cent happy at all,but like, er, like some people i can't if you get upset, some people eat more, some people eat less, or you know, some go into recluse, some get and like colin, he's when he's depressed, he's goes like a raving sex mania, he -i'm bloody glad albert don't, he'll drive me out of a bed. -he takes all, takes all his +i'm bloody glad albert don't, he'll drive me out of a bed. +he takes all, takes all his why didn't you stop no i think every i think everybody's got themselves summat some faults. nobody's hundred per cent perfect. -i mean, i don't think colin's unhappy where he wants to do, then an offers an offer, like either they go in and make share, but if they work all day. -no, it's not er, it's so much i mean, he's at work all day,and he works all bloody hours that god sent, when they want, when they got down, +i mean, i don't think colin's unhappy where he wants to do, then an offers an offer, like either they go in and make share, but if they work all day. +no, it's not er, it's so much i mean, he's at work all day,and he works all bloody hours that god sent, when they want, when they got down, yeah. and what happens. -he's got to build an office where he can go and let, sit in it, can't abide +he's got to build an office where he can go and let, sit in it, can't abide that's right. summat wrong somewhere. now look at our margaret and peter. -they've got no family, so they've got no pressures like that, they haven't got any money problems well they're not 'appy. +they've got no family, so they've got no pressures like that, they haven't got any money problems well they're not 'appy. they live two entirely separate lives. yeah, i know. there's is just a marriage of er convenience. @@ -47256,13 +47213,13 @@ find another woman and buy another house and start again. mm. i mean like jeremy and kay, i mean, they're not happy. they pretend they are, but i mean like, he's he's -they've got to do, aren't they, i mean, after all bloody harm they caused. +they've got to do, aren't they, i mean, after all bloody harm they caused. yeah, you know, you know how flaming miserable and mardy he is. yeah. he's another one. but you see when he living with ange, maybe he were younger then, but i mean like, when he were living with ange, he had all the women as you know, plus he had kay, plus he had, you know, ange, he had everything, there was kay,as well, weren't he, now he can't. no. -but then again, if, even kay over there with she said something about er, oh we've been out, but, i told you i went to a last monday. +but then again, if, even kay over there with she said something about er, oh we've been out, but, i told you i went to a last monday. yeah. and she said something about, oh we've been to that new pub, she said, mind, she said, we had to come home at half past nine, she said, he'd had enough, she said, he were ready for bed, god, she said he's turning into a right old man, and you know what i mean, she didn't, she wouldn't, exactly. @@ -47280,7 +47237,7 @@ he's really forty-three this year. don't work. he'll be forty-three this year, and she'll be thirty this year. the only thing, time that happens is, that is you hear about, -look george +look george if yo if one's fifty over sixty, he's plucking his feathers out. then it works. @@ -47288,9 +47245,9 @@ but when your younger it, or even when you're young, you know, it does. but when you get into your forties well, it's like, i mean like, it works. -i'm me and colin are settling down a lot compared to what we were five year ago. -i mean, like, like now, we were a, say even two and three years ago and somebody'd said to me, are you going to spain, and i would have said, yeah, we'll go to majorca, lovely, we could stop out all night, do what you want. -now only three or four years later i'd say of yeah we're go to somewhere a bit quieter, so that kids can go to bed of a night time, we could have a apartment. +i'm me and colin are settling down a lot compared to what we were five year ago. +i mean, like, like now, we were a, say even two and three years ago and somebody'd said to me, are you going to spain, and i would have said, yeah, we'll go to majorca, lovely, we could stop out all night, do what you want. +now only three or four years later i'd say of yeah we're go to somewhere a bit quieter, so that kids can go to bed of a night time, we could have a apartment. yeah, that's right, yeah. yeah. and that, i'm changing that way, but, if our kids have to be home with the, a group, when i went to see squeeze. @@ -47300,19 +47257,19 @@ johnny won't go anywhere like that. kay's wanted to do what we do, and johnny's not interested. yeah. like went to fair, she went to the riding, he . -he said, that's ya like a big kid, going up fair. -i mean, look at -i mean, that's all she is, yet, she's she's only a bloody +he said, that's ya like a big kid, going up fair. +i mean, look at +i mean, that's all she is, yet, she's she's only a bloody yeah, twenty nine. well, i like to go on rides. -i go on rides, june won't go on. +i go on rides, june won't go on. i know. yeah, well, that's what i mean, go on, shit. the thing is, like he is even apart apart from 'im being a lot older than 'er, he acts older. -i mean, he acts like his always, er forty three, he acts like he's like, fifty sometime, well you you're older than, you know what i mean, he acts older than you, because as you say, you'll go on fair rides and +i mean, he acts like his always, er forty three, he acts like he's like, fifty sometime, well you you're older than, you know what i mean, he acts older than you, because as you say, you'll go on fair rides and aye. -mind you, we're we're getting on +mind you, we're we're getting on no, but you know what i mean, i mean, yeah, i know what you mean. fifty, @@ -47321,7 +47278,7 @@ four. fifty-three, fifty-four. i'm fifty-three -your fifty-four next birthday you're only a couple of months off. +your fifty-four next birthday you're only a couple of months off. well, i'm fifty-three. he's fifty-three. 'cos you probably do more things. @@ -47332,7 +47289,7 @@ he should be keeping himself young for 'er. mm. instead of 'er keeping him young, she's, he's making her old. that's it, yeah. -i think chris on about moving to blinking gainsborough, now. +i think chris on about moving to blinking gainsborough, now. gainsborough. colin were telling me today. yeah. @@ -47348,7 +47305,7 @@ mum. wait a minute. er, derek, paid him off, yeah. -and got johnny to finish it. +and got johnny to finish it. mummy. and er, i i saw chris quite a lot, then, but i mean, they're not living how they used to do, i mean, they they were always boozing and that, yeah, i know. @@ -47357,9 +47314,9 @@ but er, give up, sasha. i says to tommy, why don't they buy one of them big caravans, i said, because every time they get mum. -it must be costing them a fortune, when every time they move, they alter 'ouse, they decorate and put new carpets down and furniture -my god, we'll have to -yeah, well, i mean, i mean not +it must be costing them a fortune, when every time they move, they alter 'ouse, they decorate and put new carpets down and furniture +my god, we'll have to +yeah, well, i mean, i mean not yeah but i mean, twelve times, karen. i know. you're saying like us, i mean, we wouldn't want to move again, i mean, if we move again, it's 'cos something's gonna happen with his business, ain't it, @@ -47371,7 +47328,7 @@ is it mandy whose older, yeah. i mean, i thought mandy's er, eighteen, nearly nineteen. so. -oh no, she must be older because er, vicky's twenty she must be about eighteen. +oh no, she must be older because er, vicky's twenty she must be about eighteen. no, she's same age a treena, twenty. so in twenty years, they've had twelve 'ouses yeah. @@ -47385,14 +47342,14 @@ er, they moved, they went on to one, two, three. didn't they. yeah, then t' -yeah, then, now they went to aye, they went to oval, went to bungalow +yeah, then, now they went to aye, they went to oval, went to bungalow yeah some four times. four, yeah, four or five times, yeah. yeah. yeah. there's only us who never moved. oh yeah. -angie how long's me mother been in there. +angie how long's me mother been in there. i'm forty-eight this year, me mum must have been in there nearly fifty year. and we've only moved into here. in actual fact your pete and margaret have moved more, in the twelve years that they were married, i know they've been married longer now, but when,th they been married twelve years and they moved four times, @@ -47400,13 +47357,13 @@ yeah. we've been married twelve years, and we've moved three times, so we haven't moved as much as them, really. no. no. -i couldn't keep moving and +i couldn't keep moving and i couldn't move like that. i mean, a couple of moves, is fair enough, yeah, but bloody twelve. no. and it's not as if they made money every time they moved, 'cos they haven't, 'cos they lost money on that 'ouse, there. yes. -i won't it. +i won't it. well, chris said they moved because er, give up. er, transport, you know. @@ -47417,7 +47374,7 @@ but they moved down, they moved from 'ere because he says, er, too noisy, weren't it. too too noisy and dogs were keeping them up all night. oh. -so i don't what the excuse is for moving from road. +so i don't what the excuse is for moving from road. same thing, 'cos it's noisy down there. yeah. i could scare you, auntie june. @@ -47433,7 +47390,7 @@ no. but we never hear it. you don't hear it. no, we didn't. -i remember one first night we stopped there, buses were coming at crack of dawn, +i remember one first night we stopped there, buses were coming at crack of dawn, yeah. it must have been about four or five o'clock in morning, and now we never hear any traffic. no. @@ -47442,8 +47399,8 @@ perhaps you get used to. yeah. but we don't hear many people, on a road like that. no. -i were thinking about that bungalow, and, well actually it's as far from our road, nearly as far from our road to there, as what is it from bungalow window to road. -where to yeah. +i were thinking about that bungalow, and, well actually it's as far from our road, nearly as far from our road to there, as what is it from bungalow window to road. +where to yeah. it really is know, thinking about people walking back as far as t' shopping my point. there nowt much difference in, from t' garden @@ -47458,8 +47415,8 @@ it'll be awkward getting cars in and out, when you know, with one more to be out that's the only difficulty. you'll probably end up say, leaving one on road all night. yeah. -don't hurt i mean, -oh, not leaving one on bloody road +don't hurt i mean, +oh, not leaving one on bloody road well, we could put 'em at night time, it's just through time, if one backs in, comes in behind other. yeah. it's a one way street and all ain't it, that makes it worse. @@ -47483,20 +47440,20 @@ and that. yeah, that's straight behind it. oh. not like them, i mean, they can see straight into our -i'm not sure, but i think it was mr that had that bungalow built. +i'm not sure, but i think it was mr that had that bungalow built. you know mr yeah. somebody told me that he had that built. oh. -years ago before he had that 'ouse built on road. +years ago before he had that 'ouse built on road. oh. -what you doing with the a cup of tea. +what you doing with the a cup of tea. sasha. she's there. she's there. come 'ere. georgie babes. -them can be about, i mean, that's what it probably is. +them can be about, i mean, that's what it probably is. that's what it is. dust, yeah. oh. @@ -47531,7 +47488,7 @@ yeah. oh,, or summat daft like that, they call it. but, it's like sum , it's like some people of being allergic to different things, you know. no, he wants to stay out, he pulls his feathers out when he's in cage. -how do you off feathers, and not off birds. +how do you off feathers, and not off birds. you do, you get it off any bird. yeah but some are not, not so much 'im 'cos he don't shed his feathers as much as 'im. 'e's not half, 'e's not half as dirty as 'im. @@ -47563,12 +47520,12 @@ the only time you'd see it, as if be in the light when it settles, i think. you know, you see it then. when it settles on summat dark. -i know, i pulled i told you, i'm having deliver milk round, didn't i, they're ever so good. -i'd only had it round about ten minutes and i thought +i know, i pulled i told you, i'm having deliver milk round, didn't i, they're ever so good. +i'd only had it round about ten minutes and i thought aren't you beautiful. yeah. up there. -i was into +i was into yeah, it's cold outside. he ain't. he won't @@ -47602,31 +47559,31 @@ what you're doing. george. mind you, i think they were, going back to george and norma again, i mean like, how she cuts his hair,style, and colin'll say to me, oh, aye. -i mean, that, maybe that's the way they do it, ain't it, you know what i mean, they'll say, he sometimes when you think of some of the things he does like that. +i mean, that, maybe that's the way they do it, ain't it, you know what i mean, they'll say, he sometimes when you think of some of the things he does like that. yeah. mind you i'll tell you that mohican cut. i'll tell you summat. -on a were it last sunday, yeah it were last sunday when i took off, er lisa always goes down to 'elp 'er, when, like what, you know when eileen cut her finger, what did she do to her finger? +on a were it last sunday, yeah it were last sunday when i took off, er lisa always goes down to 'elp 'er, when, like what, you know when eileen cut her finger, what did she do to her finger? she did have it all bandaged up, she were she were cleaning toilet at bottom, and er, apparently there was a piece out of it and she didn't know, and she wiped round it, it sliced it, and it were bleeding like mad, well she came across to our 'ouse, and we weren't in, and then she went to kevin's and she had she had it, but it, now it's just like a line now, yeah. yeah. but should think it had gone deep. well, lynn did her shift last sunday morning, and when i went home, lisa were home. yeah, -and she says to lisa, er, when you get to end of shift, you you rule off, what you have sold, everything you've sold, but next shift starting here's your daddy. +and she says to lisa, er, when you get to end of shift, you you rule off, what you have sold, everything you've sold, but next shift starting here's your daddy. she said to lisa, rule off when you've finished, for june to starting, and then she said, did you rule off when i told ya. well, she went, like balling and shouting at the top of her voice, i mean, she talks to terry like shit. -i mean, i shout and our +i mean, i shout and our let your dad in sasha. but it's it's like, i don't think i don't think she can. she'll be able to open it, karen. -if i spoke to 'im, like lisa spoke to terry, i'd i'd gerra clip round bloody +if i spoke to 'im, like lisa spoke to terry, i'd i'd gerra clip round bloody you would that. she talks, she talks to him like -told me how she talk to terry. +told me how she talk to terry. i'm bloody authorised and no second thoughts. no second thought at all. cage. @@ -47638,12 +47595,12 @@ they're right. she's right. can i come in. no wonder she's bundle of nerves. -she makes and she's as green as them shelves. +she makes and she's as green as them shelves. yeah. yeah. mind you he is useless, terry. tell the truth, give you that. -my knees i tell you what you can't, you know +my knees i tell you what you can't, you know yeah. oh deary me. terry's a good bit older than 'er. @@ -47667,10 +47624,10 @@ it don't look bad, actually. mind you, it were falling out that much everywhere else, he wouldn't know the difference, would he. no. but you know, but she talks to him like like, nobody. -well, she'll say to him, put kettle on and butter some bread, and he'll sit there, and he's smoking, and he's continuing what he's doing, you know, and she'll go and do what she's doing, and she, have you flicking arse-hole you to do, and, you know, any, it just goes in that ear, comes out 'ther ear, and just sallies on, and don't take blind bit of notice. +well, she'll say to him, put kettle on and butter some bread, and he'll sit there, and he's smoking, and he's continuing what he's doing, you know, and she'll go and do what she's doing, and she, have you flicking arse-hole you to do, and, you know, any, it just goes in that ear, comes out 'ther ear, and just sallies on, and don't take blind bit of notice. i mean, she's got a right squawky voice, oh, horrible. -'cos i always when she talks she's squawking. +'cos i always when she talks she's squawking. oh, when she squeaks, yeah. when she when she does get up a few octaves, i cringe. @@ -47692,32 +47649,32 @@ honestly. i only wanted it for a yeah, honestly, i wouldn't put it on, if you were stopping a week. she did all our garage round it, she's said it worth it, well, it's been there twelve months, she wouldn't put it on anywhere else. -she says it +she says it it probably wanted stirring. na, it was cheap. what a load of rubbish. what. -that priest trying to to take a curse off that i've heard a lot of excuses, half are bloody mad. -has he bought as well. +that priest trying to to take a curse off that i've heard a lot of excuses, half are bloody mad. +has he bought as well. mm. oh he's showing he cares. -there's a big piece in there about ain't there. +there's a big piece in there about ain't there. ah, yeah. yeah, 'cos she's just altered it. it's opening to public. yeah. to civvies. -i mean, i couldn't anyway. +i mean, i couldn't anyway. well, you can go, it's not er, it's well go up there for our christmas dinner, -yeah, when you get your +yeah, when you get your no rules on the general public, there wasn't a general public, it was only collar and tie. tie. but now it's casual. but now he's put a casual bar in as well. -he's opened another bar, he when they went bust. +he's opened another bar, he when they went bust. they aye. doesn't want @@ -47730,14 +47687,14 @@ always on about it. paper. what you want paper for. it's in middle. -no peter wants about them finally closing his business down. +no peter wants about them finally closing his business down. he's still obliged to no, i mean, the c g whittakers. i was working there other day. ha. -i said people you. +i said people you. i went to put back what he had somebody take out. -he were that as well. +he were that as well. well, you know, i didn't mean exactly the middle, go back well, i don't bloody know, alright if you can say middle, you mean middle. papers. @@ -47747,14 +47704,14 @@ no. go on. you shut up. there's a picture of it going, -many pictures in the opposite. +many pictures in the opposite. there's a picture of it. your worse than albert, but why don't you go to front of bloody paper. you got your finger in it nearly. well, turn it over. wow, go on. -no, that's not it, not yet ain't ya. +no, that's not it, not yet ain't ya. there it is. now why don't ya, why don't ya go to middle. page twenty-one. @@ -47766,8 +47723,8 @@ there now, you women. you're women. nice boys don't holler. it looks nice. -where's the paper of your 'ouse. -that's where it can probably be next week or week after, i don't know. +where's the paper of your 'ouse. +that's where it can probably be next week or week after, i don't know. i don't think, he he said, he said lie down,lie down i don't think they've been to take the photographs yet @@ -47777,14 +47734,14 @@ they usually send it to ya. do they, yes. oh. -mind, it is from er,what they do is send them through the post, just check 'em, make sure everything's alright, ain't it. +mind, it is from er,what they do is send them through the post, just check 'em, make sure everything's alright, ain't it. did they ask you what you were leaving, and things like that. no. no. oh. -i i forget to ask him, to make it +i i forget to ask him, to make it what. -i don't whether they do or not. +i don't whether they do or not. what. see a man about a dog. oh. @@ -47792,7 +47749,7 @@ time he got his scruffy if anybody comes june, just say, i have you been in touch with yet, and they'll say no, well, say well, sasha, do you mind. you'll have to go with -mind you can always say to you caught me at a bad time, you say, it's supposed to have appointment only, but just say, can you, is there any chance of you coming back. +mind you can always say to you caught me at a bad time, you say, it's supposed to have appointment only, but just say, can you, is there any chance of you coming back. yeah. yeah. you put appointment only on board. @@ -47813,7 +47770,7 @@ i don't mind beds being untidy and things like that. no. i mean, you don't look at, your not, who's sleeping in your bed. when ours were, it was a right state when we looked at ours, but we still said we'd have it. -mind, it's just that, it's worth nowt as we've name it. +mind, it's just that, it's worth nowt as we've name it. we'll get it right one day. one day, karen, one day. when the moon comes up and it's in two. @@ -47825,27 +47782,27 @@ you'd be employing, you'd be employing builders to come in and do it for you. yeah, that's what i said, it'd be nice, wannit. it would. your half of next door to get some -remember, remember, if you want taking anywhere, it's er, is it four pound ten an hour chauffeurs. +remember, remember, if you want taking anywhere, it's er, is it four pound ten an hour chauffeurs. yeah. -what i mean you have to put petrol in, i mean, it doesn't +what i mean you have to put petrol in, i mean, it doesn't no, you have to put petrol in. do you hell, not at four pound an hour. walk. one fifty an hour, driving. -ain't it four fifty an hour chauffeuring, and he puts petrol in, and taxes and insures car. +ain't it four fifty an hour chauffeuring, and he puts petrol in, and taxes and insures car. bugger off. back of the bloody van. -you can't go in van with ya, with ya suit on, and +you can't go in van with ya, with ya suit on, and oh, you've got to, you go play your part. -you got to have a chauffeur, you'll have to buy me a hat you'll have to buy me a hat you'll have to make it worth me while coming off dole at forty pound a week. +you got to have a chauffeur, you'll have to buy me a hat you'll have to buy me a hat you'll have to make it worth me while coming off dole at forty pound a week. yeah. -you paying me in 'and, and dennis is paying me in 'and and i'll a er, thousand pound a week, the way that i keep getting these job offers. +you paying me in 'and, and dennis is paying me in 'and and i'll a er, thousand pound a week, the way that i keep getting these job offers. back-handers. anticipation obligations. the only trouble is they're only offers. what's happening down here, then, didn't you hear no more about when you finish then, down here at no. -only some bad things, what i've supposed to have done, or what i'm not supposed to have done. +only some bad things, what i've supposed to have done, or what i'm not supposed to have done. but who cares over it. some money out of it, i took him to court. @@ -47878,9 +47835,9 @@ yeah. oh! paid her yesterday albert. that means we can't bloody get no cough mixture while she gets home. -you ain't give her +you ain't give her no. -well well i'll look down our house. +well well i'll look down our house. yeah. never mind. i'll have to, i'll have to go home and see where she's put it. @@ -47891,9 +47848,9 @@ she's been up erm, with it at night. she were bad on friday. she was! she were coughing like mad! -i wanted her to have complete weekend in bed. +i wanted her to have complete weekend in bed. well i, i took bad yesterday, i were, i were in bed nearly all day yesterday. -and i was worse +and i was worse i couldn't move! last night. bloody woke the dog when i went past! @@ -47904,7 +47861,7 @@ here. dogs outside? yeah. yes. -but er i sa i said look i said, you're not doing yourself any favours by going to work, and i says, and i don't mind you having day off. +but er i sa i said look i said, you're not doing yourself any favours by going to work, and i says, and i don't mind you having day off. no you can't when you're bad. you bloody can't! no, no, she we but she were te friday she was terrible! @@ -47913,20 +47870,20 @@ well she's like as well, you know. she's worse this morning. she's worse. -she's not been asleep a minute all night! +she's not been asleep a minute all night! no, that's it. -so she'll to stay in bed for a -course, i were ba i weren't very well yesterday so i said i'm not very well, but i had pains as well, back pain and all all +so she'll to stay in bed for a +course, i were ba i weren't very well yesterday so i said i'm not very well, but i had pains as well, back pain and all all yeah. all kinds of pains this is. i says, no, i said i'm gonna stop in bed today. so i stopped in bed now i, i'm better, well no, that's only way you'll throw it off. yeah. -i'm a bit better but i've had to get out this morning to let june stay in ! +i'm a bit better but i've had to get out this morning to let june stay in ! yeah. well i say, she were terrible on friday, i know. -right then, i'll get off home and er see what's what. +right then, i'll get off home and er see what's what. alright. but she never said. she never bloody said! @@ -47939,9 +47896,9 @@ yep! can you lend me a fiver while our corrinne comes home? mm. i suppose so. -she's er no we lent our corrinne our money +she's er no we lent our corrinne our money yeah. -to get her tax she got paid yesterday +to get her tax she got paid yesterday mm. and she didn't, she hasn't paid us it back. so, we're, we're skint and i want to go and get some @@ -47953,7 +47910,7 @@ oh dear! she said. i couldn't, i had pains all over place! i couldn't speak! -couldn't do erm, anything, i was surprised. +couldn't do erm, anything, i was surprised. just give her some, bit of these. no i've got some, i've got some better than them. well they're ever so good if you've got @@ -47972,7 +47929,7 @@ mm mm. you alright? i know she were coughing her guts out here! i know! -er,gi i've done that you know, when i were younger and i'd strained a heart muscle! +er,gi i've done that you know, when i were younger and i'd strained a heart muscle! oh! mm. i couldn't lie down for five weeks! @@ -47986,18 +47943,18 @@ i can manage without it. i don't drink. i like a bit of brandy! i'm still coughing like, but not as bad. -cos i said to her get some of that cough stuff cos i've only took about three times this . +cos i said to her get some of that cough stuff cos i've only took about three times this . what venos? ah! but it's yeah. -not a tickly cough she's got it's a chesty cough. +not a tickly cough she's got it's a chesty cough. and it's dear! it were one i know! sixty five! well i'm gonna get some for her. -well i paid er seventy five pence for twelve of them er anadin! +well i paid er seventy five pence for twelve of them er anadin! ha! bruce! bruce! @@ -48012,13 +47969,13 @@ back! ah la la la la la la! kill! maim! -oh you're daddy's is all stained at the back and at the arm. +oh you're daddy's is all stained at the back and at the arm. right then. right elephant. is that just her natural mother then? shut up! ha! -i think it's gonna be good! +i think it's gonna be good! hoping, i'm hoping. i'm hoping. what do you want? @@ -48078,7 +48035,7 @@ he ain't gonna fuck hit him! take your love and promises . mm! smell nice now! -well joanna she won't . +well joanna she won't . like my car or something. bruce! bruce! @@ -48087,7 +48044,6 @@ you got it on there? aye . fuck me! what the hell's wrong with twenty minutes! - function engineer is responsible for issuing to the client. that's, yeah. replaces urgent work. @@ -48102,10 +48058,10 @@ it is. it's, it's sort of following the demise of part of er trevor's empire. thus making it even cheaper. for to a smaller an empire. -i should use that word, that was used very loosely that word cheap. +i should use that word, that was used very loosely that word cheap. what? cheap? -i mean i'm briefed +i mean i'm briefed on that. mm. okay. @@ -48113,7 +48069,7 @@ so the urgent work procedure has now been removed to make life easier. d two and to let the client know where the job lies within our organization. good. -given a point of +given a point of straight into a function and that function head will then s write to the client saying, i've got it. my project coordinator is mr x, and then we've got the point of contact established straight away. there are quite a few fairly minor changes to the appointment contract procedure but i haven't, i don't pretend, intend briefing those because i think most people can read. @@ -48179,7 +48135,7 @@ yes. that's what it says though don't it? . and that's what it says. -the value of authority from the client. +the value of authority from the client. yeah. so it will be in your letter of delegation yeah. @@ -48191,7 +48147,7 @@ mhm. that duty. mhm. then there's, i, i, i'm the only person. -quite a long time now i begin to understand there are m s twos and threes are project engineers, and i +quite a long time now i begin to understand there are m s twos and threes are project engineers, and i not necessarily. no. er @@ -48228,7 +48184,7 @@ oh no. he's responsible. no. because within, within our, within our procedures and our quality systems, the word project engineer crops up quite a lot. -project team +project team yeah. but it's, it's not defined as er an m s two or an m s three. i mean take the example that hugh is always using, is that if i wanted to knock a wall through, a hole through that wall and put a door in there with a link in it surely to goodness we @@ -48271,20 +48227,20 @@ no. but the point t that hughie makes is that y you allocate er y you, you make the project engineer someone who have trained, and, and that you know is capable of doing that job. yeah. well i can think of one m s one in our er office who i'd be quite erm quite happy with him doing all the project eng engineering duties except finance. -because he, he just has you know a very slap happy er attitude towards finance, but from an engineering point of view you can trust him +because he, he just has you know a very slap happy er attitude towards finance, but from an engineering point of view you can trust him mm. so this means you daren't give him anything now. -well in that case i wouldn't put him on er on a job that was made out on site but i would keep him in the +well in that case i wouldn't put him on er on a job that was made out on site but i would keep him in the t as far as the allocation of, of erm the project engineering responsibilities, that forms part of the quality plan. that, that, that he is given a note as part of the quality plan saying, here you are son, you are now project engineer. these are your duties. you are responsible for that job and you are identified on the project quality plan check list as to what you will be doing and what other members of the team will be doing. he couldn't live, live by it. -you know it d the first thought bloody hell. +you know it d the first thought bloody hell. if you don't want to use it don't use it. s t o with unlimited signing power. there's an anom anomaly here. -but if you don't want to use it don't +but if you don't want to use it don't and anyway he can't, he can't actually spend, spend this money unless he's got oh yeah. oh yeah. @@ -48295,7 +48251,7 @@ can we, can we bottom the v o yeah. one as a start . i don't see there's a problem with the v o one, because -it's +it's nobody nobody can issue v os unless they're delegated to do so, in, in the letter that's signed by me. i rely on you gentlemen and, and they have got the permission of the project manager to spend that money. @@ -48310,14 +48266,14 @@ an and i must admit that i wouldn't, i would not expect to see anybody delegated because i just don't think they i they're competent to do the duties of the engineer's representative, because you need a knowledge of the contract. tt. well. -there are some jobs that, that we get involved with are very very small -we've had john on +there are some jobs that, that we get involved with are very very small +we've had john on yeah. -john 's been on jobs and he's er +john 's been on jobs and he's er well. he's been as the r e, which is reasonable to be fair. yeah. -so's steve +so's steve we as r e. we @@ -48368,7 +48324,7 @@ unless they're delegated t to do so within the contract and i rely on you to mak what if they're,wh what if they're below m s two level? no no. no r e will issue a v o. -they might do if they're m s two i mean the project engineer +they might do if they're m s two i mean the project engineer if it's the project engineer. yes. yeah. @@ -48388,7 +48344,7 @@ about erm does in the two and threes. does in the two and threes. yes. -cos senior in a lot +cos senior in a lot i mean th that's the title. senior project engineer and project engineer. yeah. @@ -48434,7 +48390,7 @@ talk to you about you know ne next week mm. because it's all rolled into the same thing. right. -i say it's +i say it's shall we leave it till then? responsibility. right. @@ -48446,7 +48402,7 @@ the role o of i can see what you're driving at. the role of a project engineer is defined in q s p six. which roger hasn't seen yet -yeah the role +yeah the role but he but it is the day to day d detailed development of a project to meet the cost specification and timescale defined in the client's remit. undertake the requirements of the project quality plan. @@ -48467,7 +48423,7 @@ okay. let's debate that then when we get together. thanks for raising it jim. fair point. -have you read what +have you read what it's, it's important that we nail it down very very quickly because the clients' reports depend very much upon the input of the project engineer. project engineer. the only, the, there is only the project engineer can get into the databases to put anything in, or, or their clerical support, to get anything into the general notes about that particular @@ -48476,7 +48432,7 @@ project. i think we're meeting early next week isn yeah. tuesday isn't it? -tuesday +tuesday so we'll bottom that tuesday. okay. could i briefly go back to liquidated damages, because there's nothing in the procedure, i think, that says what happens when you send that form to the client, he says, i haven't a clue. @@ -48484,11 +48440,11 @@ what do you think? cos that's exactly what's gonna happen. because i've seen oh dear. -that form before and they will not know what to put on it or what they +that form before and they will not know what to put on it or what they you may be l well be right there. -maybe to tell them what liquidated damages +maybe to tell them what liquidated damages they need leading by the hand gentlemen. -can't we just put a clause +can't we just put a clause we need, we need, no. they don't. organize everyone by us. @@ -48523,19 +48479,19 @@ and your extra supervision costs. no. i was thinking about the client's extra costs. oh. -then the gain +then the gain actually. overrun by three weeks -the fact that we've still got our supervision +the fact that we've still got our supervision yeah. but, but we put that in. yeah. -but during +but during not only that yeah. but we, we should be prompting them. course that we know about it. -well there's the fact that he might have borrowed the money for a ten million pound project, and he can't have a use of it because it's named and he's paying interest +well there's the fact that he might have borrowed the money for a ten million pound project, and he can't have a use of it because it's named and he's paying interest on that ten million pounds. extended plus services for diverted traffic and so on. be discussed. @@ -48549,16 +48505,16 @@ a and the forms as it stands picks up most of the points that we've just raised. does it have a box for us to put our costs in? oh yeah. it starts off with that. -thank god for that +thank god for that th they're, they're, they're not our costs terry. they're his costs. yeah. mm. i mean we charge him. correct. -he's the one that +he's the one that no. -but +but correct. why? and we can tell him how, how much we're gonna charge him but it's up to him or whatever. @@ -48593,7 +48549,7 @@ mm. good. good. next. -it was +it was erm maintenance and use of portable electrical apparatus k nineteen stop one. the safety one. er it talks about erm @@ -48610,7 +48566,7 @@ mhm. by plant well will be by plant . right. erm m for mother four stop one, payment application by contractors. -erm there are quite a few in, in this series which follow the same sort of thing is that er, all projects all jobs on site er will have a quantity surveyor from dave 's section. +erm there are quite a few in, in this series which follow the same sort of thing is that er, all projects all jobs on site er will have a quantity surveyor from dave 's section. erm and will eh? nominated. @@ -48631,11 +48587,11 @@ however when specifically requested by the project q s, the resident engineer or a project q s is responsible for agreeing all valuations and for processing all invoices for payment for physical work, and passing these to the client for payment. so what's the change? because on many jobs certainly smaller jobs, er the resident engineer or the project engineer would -be doing the +be doing the and normally normally they will do that and in, in the future -well +well yes it will. -they can say, yeah,th the project q s is just gonna say, measure me all +they can say, yeah,th the project q s is just gonna say, measure me all that's right. i haven't time to go and do that. what i'm looking for, this is part of @@ -48649,17 +48605,17 @@ and in m in many cases the most cost-effective procedure will be for the lad on and i don't see anything contentious about that. can i take it that if i don't, i don't like how it is worded then, because i don't think you said that. -sorry to +sorry to no. it, it was worded that way because there are -it says the project q s is responsible for agreeing all site measurements . +it says the project q s is responsible for agreeing all site measurements . that's what it says. yes. he is responsible for that. he is. and he may delegate that -he may delegate to -i agree with you but +he may delegate to +i agree with you but and in many cases will delegate that. he is also responsible for the valuation he has raised it with the contractor. @@ -48671,7 +48627,7 @@ it says, normally it says, normally obtaining them personally the letter of delegation has always said that q s will measure yeah. yeah. -measure the works +measure the works re in, in, in, in the past words. @@ -48680,18 +48636,18 @@ well i don't think now what hughie's saying is that that will be done th that responsibility -mutually -valuations because we've got this +mutually +valuations because we've got this mm. perhaps you do. which, which personally i don't think really there's a need for a great deal of site measurement. -i think, i think it should all be, you know, basically it should be done from +i think, i think it should all be, you know, basically it should be done from the offices. because they've dug a big hole doesn't mean you measure the big hole. it's all part of the measuring anyway. you're paying for the hole they should have dug provided it was at least as big as they -in accordance with the and the er the +in accordance with the and the er the what do you call it? yeah well. the @@ -48705,12 +48661,12 @@ yes. i don't want any more s in instances where the quantity surveyor thinks he's got a certain fee that he's working to, only to find out later hear hear. on that somebody's knocked it down by half and not told him. -because that causes all sorts of problems on the report and, and bad blood all round. +because that causes all sorts of problems on the report and, and bad blood all round. course it did it's not what team work's i mean i, no. i would reiterate that my objective is a very simple one, and that is to give the client the most cost-effective service we can. -er with this instruction, it will get picked up on the quality +er with this instruction, it will get picked up on the quality co in accordance er check list. good. @@ -48724,20 +48680,20 @@ no. because i think that there should be no reason why the q s shouldn't provide you with that service in the same way as he provides anybody else jim. unless there's but he's, but he's not geared up to do it. -but you've got erm a q s then. +but you've got erm a q s then. we have. -i'm not too sure that means . -well i think, i think bloody robots +i'm not too sure that means . +well i think, i think bloody robots we all were. in there like. -electrical away isn't it? +electrical away isn't it? mis yeah. mister metal. that's wound the buggers up. metal mickey. really metal mickey. -well that's +well that's really a bright spark. you know. yeah. @@ -48809,7 +48765,7 @@ i mean our objective is to give the, the client a good efficient cost-effective objectives. but d dave, dave, dave could not handle, in b e s, what he handles on the civil side. in what respect? -h he is not staffed up to do what +h he is not staffed up to do what could quite easily ask you to do all the erm running around the actual measure the site measurements, but the agreeing, the valuations, and the processing of the invoices, he does himself. @@ -48830,7 +48786,7 @@ it's let's what i'm, what i'm saying is if, if you want to really stir people up, bring in a procedure within telling them what you're doing, and then imple implement it at a later date and people will say, this is not quality. hey jim -you will +you will the reason why we're the reason why we're doing this now is is to right. try and achieve that objective. @@ -48845,21 +48801,21 @@ well he doesn't. that's what i'm saying. he hasn't done yet. you can't have that, he doesn't. -have a word with dave and ask him himself +have a word with dave and ask him himself dave dave was a party to this s -d dave, dave wrote this +d dave, dave wrote this procedure. did the change. well you may be certain he didn't consult with me. yeah. and that's the point i'm making. mm. -these procedures should be manag you know part of management consultation, not part of the dave writes it, if he like says, well that's what we'll do for b e s, and then, and then i'm told, oh, that's what we do for b e s, i tell staff, and that causes a great deal of unrest in staff. +these procedures should be manag you know part of management consultation, not part of the dave writes it, if he like says, well that's what we'll do for b e s, and then, and then i'm told, oh, that's what we do for b e s, i tell staff, and that causes a great deal of unrest in staff. hey jim why? -why +why back on him? jim. -cos i haven't had an opportunity to do it to +cos i haven't had an opportunity to do it to why should b e s be a different, a different situation from bridges or works? well in, in theory certainly probably there is no reason for it, but in practice, it hasn't happened yet this is the point. it hasn't actually happened. @@ -48876,7 +48832,7 @@ it doesn't say that. this procedure should say you do this. that's what we're doing at the moment. right. -he's quite right in saying +he's quite right in saying book is an instruction. yeah. and jim's @@ -48885,7 +48841,7 @@ but it's not the first time that a procedure's finished. come out early. so you've implemented a procedure for wh which you haven't set up you haven't even looked at the resource information -but can be briefed +but can be briefed we are introducing a procedure. yes. and in order to c come in and say @@ -48894,7 +48850,7 @@ no. why don't you do this? and i could say well i, i've never done this. i can't do this, and q s is not geared up to do it. -what ? +what ? and straight away we say, well this procedure, doesn't work. yeah. but it's @@ -48902,17 +48858,17 @@ right. yeah. come out, it's come out early. damn it all. -we had a procedure erm about senior project engineers, er about two years before we +we had a procedure erm about senior project engineers, er about two years before we we've gotta keep repeating that. er does it? -put that into the bridge office in +put that into the bridge office in mhm. intended . right. the thing with this , the thing that puzzles me a bit er -just because you booked that -on this, and i'll reiterate this, is the process that we go through as i understand it for introducing procedures, is that we take a diagonal slice through the organization er in other words there's a draft procedure produced. +just because you booked that +on this, and i'll reiterate this, is the process that we go through as i understand it for introducing procedures, is that we take a diagonal slice through the organization er in other words there's a draft procedure produced. that is sent round to people who will have been involved. they have the opportunity to input, it is amended er taking account of, of the comments taking account of some of the comments. @@ -48923,12 +48879,12 @@ but by a very virtue of the draft going round and being commented on people are we don't see . mm. -all the drafts +all the drafts no. wh what wh where going on. that falls down hugh, is that people assume because they've commented that, that when it comes out in its final version it'll reflect their particular comment. -they never get a feedback saying, thanks for those comments but i've those because, because i thought somebody else's +they never get a feedback saying, thanks for those comments but i've those because, because i thought somebody else's comments were more a lot more slice . no. @@ -48942,7 +48898,7 @@ mm. it is a er er a specific direct. request or a direct request that something is changed, then it -is given to in this particular case the dave s of the world or other function heads and told +is given to in this particular case the dave s of the world or other function heads and told i would still like to issue that. er a and i think we issue it and then t in jim's situation, erm i think what you tell your staff is that this, this has been issued, and we are gonna find a way of erm working it in your organization. @@ -48967,7 +48923,7 @@ the erm you might not have a problem q s in four weeks time. -with dave but at the moment if we're audited tomorrow +with dave but at the moment if we're audited tomorrow well as i understand it, this is what's happening at well i still don't present. @@ -48981,7 +48937,7 @@ mm. mhm. and he can delegate the site measurement to your staff. and in most cases will do. -as long as it's a you do your +as long as it's a you do your and he processes the paper. and once you do a quality plan for that, that delegation . anything to your section at the moment does he? @@ -48993,7 +48949,7 @@ for long enough i've said budget engineers run the job. yeah. where i mean our, invariably our in involvement is much greater than the q s. naturally. -and many of my staff in s in not just but one or two others, see this as the tail wagging the dog if you like where somebody says, you will do so and so, or you know, i'm telling you you'll do this. +and many of my staff in s in not just but one or two others, see this as the tail wagging the dog if you like where somebody says, you will do so and so, or you know, i'm telling you you'll do this. now it's how you read that into that procedure. that's the problem with it. there's no problem i @@ -49003,8 +48959,8 @@ why should the q s estimate all our work? mm. the there is no real good reason why he shouldn't. -why he shouldn't other than the fact that keeping -in fact there's a +why he shouldn't other than the fact that keeping +in fact there's a up to date. there's a very good reason why he could he do that? @@ -49025,20 +48981,20 @@ aha. we do. yeah. b e s? -well you told me +well you told me i mean come on it's the same ball game. yeah. -i mean i +i mean i it is the same ball game and, and as far as i, as far as i'm concerned it makes more sense so why aren't the q s for b e s work now? and p way work? -and p way work cos that's what you've said it does and you, you're +and p way work cos that's what you've said it does and you, you're we are doing. i'm afraid i'm not helped much we are doing. -i'm, i'm gonna call a halt to this here because without david here who +i'm, i'm gonna call a halt to this here because without david here who right. knows the detail we, all we're gonna do is enjoy the sound of our own voices. i think. @@ -49067,11 +49023,11 @@ i've seen, i've seen all this mm. in that case when it is ours. -well we can't +well we can't we've got a right. -in that case jim you say to your staff that you're gonna have a dialogue with dave and myself, with a view to confirming how it will be implemented as far as your organization is concerned. -but surely +in that case jim you say to your staff that you're gonna have a dialogue with dave and myself, with a view to confirming how it will be implemented as far as your organization is concerned. +but surely we can still issue it, we can still brief this issue that issue? @@ -49094,7 +49050,7 @@ our project quality plan check list reflects that. naturally your mm. your way out is to get -d dave to write a letter, saying for all projects i wish him to do +d dave to write a letter, saying for all projects i wish him to do y no. no. no. @@ -49103,7 +49059,7 @@ all all that, all that that is stupid. all that jim's trying to do the reason why -is to change +is to change i, i don't mean that in a disrespectful way. no. no. @@ -49117,7 +49073,7 @@ now if we work as a team and we work very sensibly and reasonably, it may wo may but at the end of the day these guys sign off price correct. these guys therefore must have a facility of ensuring that the price is correct, from an internal control point of view i want them to be involved in certifying that the price is correct. that is how we came to the conclusion that they should be -i, i, i i certainly think there's a great deal of sense in it all. +i, i, i i certainly think there's a great deal of sense in it all. but we don't even measure yet . i, i've yet, i've got a, a major job on my hands to reeducate people and bring in systems for much more accurate measurement of our work. it's a very difficult job to measure is m and e. @@ -49144,16 +49100,16 @@ a and all i'm saying is that and i rest my case mm. is that if we came to be audited -procedures should be what is happening, not what our aspirations are. +procedures should be what is happening, not what our aspirations are. no. i'm sorry. particularly when they're long way . no. but, but when you're measuring something -i don't want otherwise you finish up with five separate er management procedures . -but also is it necessary. +i don't want otherwise you finish up with five separate er management procedures . +but also is it necessary. jim -so we can make +so we can make let's issue that. because you, david and i need to sort out what we need to do to implement it @@ -49165,7 +49121,7 @@ i'm s not suggesting they could. and some management procedures cannot work very well in m and e as they can in civils. not because mm. -you know we don't want to in, in, in the civils team or what have you. +you know we don't want to in, in, in the civils team or what have you. indeed it works very well. but in some cases some procedures cannot be worked on m and e yeah. @@ -49242,7 +49198,7 @@ and i'll just plug that up that. we'll expect one from you then? -i'll tell trudy's +i'll tell trudy's so it's not d is it d two point three or not? i'll, i'll have to check with her another time. right. @@ -49265,7 +49221,7 @@ and erm in the context of regional railways fine. wanting them from us. yeah. -but i must say that we're using these client reports and managers within each section +but i must say that we're using these client reports and managers within each section i know you are. the only one who is. are finding them extremely useful @@ -49278,7 +49234,7 @@ they do find them extremely helpful. have you run off c any interim report from t the computer yet? -no cos i wasn't too sure if it was available you telling me it is available. +no cos i wasn't too sure if it was available you telling me it is available. a as i said this morning t to the management team it is available. the only problem is as a one-off exercise on er existing jobs. @@ -49286,12 +49242,12 @@ we will have to put in er a summary of the existing remit. including right. all the variations and what not. -and that's something that mike and ken will help dig the historical contracts out and, and suggest er a remit. +and that's something that mike and ken will help dig the historical contracts out and, and suggest er a remit. erm b cos, cos he, it prints a remit back out out the client . but it, it, it's ready when, when are we likely to, to have the contract reports available? -the q s -the physical works +the q s +the physical works the physical works. yeah. we're gonna start specifying that now and brian will, will er @@ -49326,7 +49282,7 @@ than go the other way. mainly because we're doing, we're trying to read the client's mind at the moment. and w we we're putting together what we think the client wants. what i'm looking for is feedback from the clients which say, yeah, these reports are alright as far as they go but really i don't want all that information or i want this information. -or +or and i would hope that we, we we enter into that with th that spirit and mm. we're prepared to look at the the client reports and change them so that they become as good as we, we can get them. @@ -49336,7 +49292,7 @@ it is the first step. for the prediction of fees? i mean we've just yes. -got something back from intercity on the p s work where they're wa wishing us to predict to certain date what we're gonna be spending over the next six months. +got something back from intercity on the p s work where they're wa wishing us to predict to certain date what we're gonna be spending over the next six months. nine months. the football ? yeah. @@ -49364,9 +49320,9 @@ yeah. yes. so, so really we're gonna have to have a manual involvement or override there by the project coordinator to, to, to -well if, if you remember we, we agreed with keith he would have a think that and a talk to +well if, if you remember we, we agreed with keith he would have a think that and a talk to yeah. -roy er roy +roy er roy you'd remind him about it hugh. yeah. but what i'm gonna suggest is that again we go back to the client, and say basically, this is what we think we can provide is that good enough? @@ -49387,16 +49343,16 @@ don't like the sound of that. er the project engineer sits down and manually, let's be honest. no. -cos he's gonna just divide it by the number and it's it's +cos he's gonna just divide it by the number and it's it's it's it's a very minor part of the operation. mm. i think you've got a little bit careful with lots of our jobs which have got very very small fees attached to them. yeah. yes. -which +which it's, it's hardly worth doing. -at the present time we're saying to on the monthly report we're saying to the client, we've spent three thousand out of five thousand, and their anticipated final cost is going to be five thousand. +at the present time we're saying to on the monthly report we're saying to the client, we've spent three thousand out of five thousand, and their anticipated final cost is going to be five thousand. yeah. and i he knows when we're actually gonna finish the job and therefore mm. @@ -49416,7 +49372,7 @@ but this is where we need to talk to the client yes. of course they are. isn't it? -j j just agree with client he might, might be prepared to accept on a quarterly basis +j j just agree with client he might, might be prepared to accept on a quarterly basis yeah. you know? i mean we don't necessarily have to give him it every month. @@ -49424,7 +49380,7 @@ one could argue yeah. if we're not careful we'll be causing him work. oh. -know what they want half of them anyway when they're +know what they want half of them anyway when they're ah. let us halt it there. the customers. @@ -49438,16 +49394,16 @@ is that good enough? and the chances are they'll say, bloody hell, that's marvellous. because what they're getting now is nothing. mm. -well +well and i'll tell you what, what they're getting from us is infinitely better than they're getting from anybody else. -you see even from leeds north west the outside party job and the p t pay monthly, so it's important that the client knows what he's gonna be facing. +you see even from leeds north west the outside party job and the p t pay monthly, so it's important that the client knows what he's gonna be facing. but what we do is we estimate three months mm. and divide by three. yeah. then you get an average, not bad. -you know, and that's, that's the way +you know, and that's, that's the way what's that mean? mm? no. @@ -49458,7 +49414,7 @@ next one den. well. there aren't any more. ther there have been quite a few that have come out recently which i haven't briefed. -some of them are fairly minor and it's to read them. +some of them are fairly minor and it's to read them. others which are perhaps a little bit of er a change from what we've been used to doing, mm. are currently being revised yet again. @@ -49467,9 +49423,9 @@ right. i think an hour of this is about enough isn't it? den that was great. i mean i know there's been a lot of debate and i know that er you may feel it's been a bit of a waste of time -but the fact that there's been so much debate +but the fact that there's been so much debate if, if, if you say, mary had a little lamb -mary had a +mary had a it will go down in the oxford dictionary or something. right. we've got that out the way. @@ -49493,7 +49449,7 @@ you did. it was a very good report. oh. well. -just cos they came down doesn't make the bit of +just cos they came down doesn't make the bit of here we are. it was dated the fifteenth of april nineteen ninety three. erm and erm one was at norfolk park viaduct. @@ -49502,7 +49458,7 @@ we briefly mentioned that one last time if you remember. he had his head jammed or something yeah. mm. -i it shot up in the air +i it shot up in the air yeah. you mentioned the man basket @@ -49519,11 +49475,11 @@ okay. we don't need to do it this time. we didn't have the facts you see last time. written down. -it was al it was all facts +it was al it was all facts verbally. yeah. next one is erm on bridge three o six eight a, reford. -a dumper driver collided with a, a rapid metal development soldier and that's some p part of the temporary works. +a dumper driver collided with a, a rapid metal development soldier and that's some p part of the temporary works. striking jumbo scaffolding. strike, that's right, jumbo scaffolding,dr striking the driver on the leg. @@ -49536,7 +49492,7 @@ not sure makes you wonder doesn't it? i will say that. it, it, perhaps there's something wrong with the dumper. -was it +was it doesn't it say whether it's the same dumper? was it the same dumper? yeah. @@ -49545,12 +49501,12 @@ it isn't. what are the recommendations? what are the report, what, what's in clauses what used to be thirty seven and thirty eight? recommended course of action and stuff like that. -we're not +we're not that's a good question terry. were these dumper drivers certificated? why it happened? i mean -i've of watching brief jobs for which we are not responsible. +i've of watching brief jobs for which we are not responsible. oh. it's nowt to do with us then isn't it? well. @@ -49558,7 +49514,7 @@ i'm i mean i'm not being facetious but what is the bloody point no. it's s -in telling us +in telling us i don't know why you're clogging our meetings up with somebody else's accidents. because i'm supposed to report all accidents yeah. @@ -49578,7 +49534,7 @@ erm quite a valid point. the, unless we want to brief to our staff the potential hazards in er mm. well. -the use of dumpers on er sites. +the use of dumpers on er sites. i think we should. there are two points that i, you would be looking at normally if you were investigating it. one would be @@ -49623,13 +49579,13 @@ we haven't briefed it. we haven't briefed it. did we not brief it last month? no. -we haven't briefed +we haven't briefed no. we discussed it. we did it at the safety meeting. one which yeah. -erm work was organized during to saturday night during the possession which included people standing in the four-foot i in the tracks. +erm work was organized during to saturday night during the possession which included people standing in the four-foot i in the tracks. and for one reason or another the subcontractor bowled up on site on the saturday afternoon and decided to do it then. and he set up his own system of work using wal er er lookouts etcetera using er walkie-talkie radios and staff exposed themselves to danger by standing in the four-foot. @@ -49675,7 +49631,7 @@ erm to show how serious we consider mm. and the subbie by the way who did the work the incident to be. -we're banning him for further and i'm gonna +we're banning him for further and i'm gonna whatever. saying, ban him for life. again. @@ -49686,18 +49642,18 @@ what was his name? i'll let you know. in fact i'll let you have a copy of what i've got this yeah. -p pa pete i think. +p pa pete i think. that's that's where we're likely to drop the clanger. pete . yeah. . -cos he might +cos he might ah. -but pete might just come out in his wife's name next week +but pete might just come out in his wife's name next week mm. and start trading. you've got no idea. -this subcontractor has worked for for a number of years. +this subcontractor has worked for for a number of years. so. it's not a fly by night firm. no. @@ -49716,16 +49672,16 @@ okay let's have a look. right? next one. i'm gonna go into the erm the irish route improvements thing we talked about this morning. -which norm that. +which norm that. yeah. i know about that. okay. right. potential work. -erm chris 's visit on the eleventh of june, i think we briefed last time? +erm chris 's visit on the eleventh of june, i think we briefed last time? yeah. yeah. -er i think it's just worth mentioning again that it's still on and er i, i think er it is really more important than ever now for us to impress on chris what good work we do because er of the changing situation within the industry. +er i think it's just worth mentioning again that it's still on and er i, i think er it is really more important than ever now for us to impress on chris what good work we do because er of the changing situation within the industry. and the more people that know what good work we do the better. provision of photographic services. over to you my friend. @@ -49747,16 +49703,16 @@ b b w w why? why can't you just use a task request form that says. please p well. -i mean +i mean please provide prints off the following negative numbers four number eight by eight prints off these t off, off negative numbers so and so. splendid. -are you gonna write +are you gonna write and put the dopacs number on. you're gonna on something. yeah. -copy it to andrew and then andrew knows when the i b i s invoice comes forward that it's something to be +copy it to andrew and then andrew knows when the i b i s invoice comes forward that it's something to be then he'll sign it off. paid for. because we've got thousands of i b i s invoices that come to us that are not for us. @@ -49766,10 +49722,10 @@ okay. good. good. you're pointing -a and it's come from peter +a and it's come from peter oh. will you stop being . -you've got to do something wrong +you've got to do something wrong it's come from peter mm. they will not, they, they want to be erm procured in a structured way, such that they know they're gonna get paid. @@ -49798,7 +49754,7 @@ what it is it's the intercity core brief oh! that's why i i've seen it. -we've had it, a copy of it +we've had it, a copy of it have you got a copy of this? yeah. yeah. @@ -49816,10 +49772,10 @@ it gives us an update on privatization reorganization most of which has appeared anything? in railnews. right. -and it gives us a er tt details of the current intercity marketing strategy which is again +and it gives us a er tt details of the current intercity marketing strategy which is again not interested in that either. yeah. -we, we have +we, we have good. that's right. and get a green ticket . @@ -49827,7 +49783,7 @@ so. they're encouraging people to drive their bloody cars yeah. burn more fuel and just travel on a train. -extra fuel +extra fuel environmental . yeah. it is. @@ -49846,7 +49802,7 @@ ah. urgent nature yeah. erm that was actually issued some time ago but wasn't briefed. -but it was quite a significant change that we were +but it was quite a significant change that we were oh. so we d we d seven was er er work on emergent nature @@ -49855,7 +49811,7 @@ indeed. no. it's been put through as the procedures. yes. -cos people +cos people d seven was the acknowledgement so. so that was to say that we'd w @@ -49868,7 +49824,7 @@ withdrawn this particular d two stroke three. so if you look in your manual you've now onl only got one d two stroke yeah. -three +three rather than two d one, right. a a a and the, and the, and the d seven bit is, is in a different section? is covered by part d two stroke one. @@ -49887,7 +49843,7 @@ if you view files three to five. the main message i would give is that the board has responded to the government with regard to the pensions issue, and suggested a number of improvements to the government's proposals. yeah. -the scheme +the scheme the board's did that didn't it? yeah. @@ -49895,7 +49851,7 @@ the board considers the b r employe employees who transfer involuntary involunta scheme . we've seen all that. but that, that's only a suggestion. -it's not been +it's not been yes. yeah. i mean wasn't this, wasn't this @@ -49918,7 +49874,7 @@ roger freeman secretary for yeah. no. mcgregor's secretary of state. -roger freeman's transport +roger freeman's transport well. transport minister then. i, i @@ -49954,7 +49910,7 @@ yeah. right. n nothing more there? if anyone wants to borrow the core brief, they're welcome to do so. -ken would like to read it. +ken would like to read it. ha we got, have we got a copy upstairs? norman has a copy. that's fine. @@ -49975,7 +49931,7 @@ shall i get? we've finished the rule review today at four. can i, can i just ask one thing if we've finished -i'm +i'm and any other business? right. plan printing. @@ -50002,12 +49958,12 @@ see you. bye. isn't it horrible? mm. -i'm getting +i'm getting innit? i bet she'll bloody wait up for susan to ring. oh i expect so, aye. susan won't ring. -she said to her in the week when she rung she won't ring until i thought it was like midnight last night she was getting in and she wasn't gonna ring till today but it'll be tomorrow she'll ring her. +she said to her in the week when she rung she won't ring until i thought it was like midnight last night she was getting in and she wasn't gonna ring till today but it'll be tomorrow she'll ring her. yeah. she'll wait up. sure as eggs is eggs. @@ -50019,12 +49975,12 @@ surely is. must be cos it's so horrible. did you say you were working with roy tomorrow? well i might be, i don't know. -bloody ballbag'll probably phone me in the morning or something. -i might be going to er ellesmere port, there's coffin stones to get up, they've got er hoist thing there so i don't know. +bloody ballbag'll probably phone me in the morning or something. +i might be going to er ellesmere port, there's coffin stones to get up, they've got er hoist thing there so i don't know. yeah? -i might be there or i might be with roy, i don't know. +i might be there or i might be with roy, i don't know. will you be home any earlier than you have been? -we might try and put all the on tomorrow and if they do they'll just work till they get them on . +we might try and put all the on tomorrow and if they do they'll just work till they get them on . i don't know. i think. what i was thinking. @@ -50035,7 +49991,7 @@ pop the lock on. i can take these if you bring the grey bag. right. sally's off tomorrow and tuesday as well. -i think she +i think she one of the jobs we are doing is to identify what schemes they're planning that they won't need to build. that's not possible. if you need a larger one that that @@ -50043,48 +49999,48 @@ that's what it says. i've got a no but template. -on a bridge bit +on a bridge bit why not? -it's, it's that's really linked to do we need to do the caernarvon link if we're doing the bypass? -do they need to do the they've proposed that they to bypass erm if we're doing the caernarvon bypass. +it's, it's that's really linked to do we need to do the caernarvon link if we're doing the bypass? +do they need to do the they've proposed that they to bypass erm if we're doing the caernarvon bypass. well can they detrunk that bit? well it doesn't say that. well can they detrunk that bit? responsibility not yeah. theirs if they put the bypass in. -so what came out of this, well it could be +so what came out of this, well it could be so are they looking to build a bypass first? -the gut reaction this morning is we could end up with a bypass scheme at the end of it and no caernarvon link. +the gut reaction this morning is we could end up with a bypass scheme at the end of it and no caernarvon link. oh that's no good is it? of course it is. cos we're still continuing designing a caernarvon link . four percent fee . mind you it's, it's a smaller job. what's smaller? -well if they're doing that then we s we're looking to make this a dual carriageway on the richard principle that if it's a trunk road it's worth building a dual, a dual carriageway. +well if they're doing that then we s we're looking to make this a dual carriageway on the richard principle that if it's a trunk road it's worth building a dual, a dual carriageway. if you can convince him on traffic grounds fair enough. so they're serious -course the initial thing is we get some reaction back from this, this -so they're seriously looking to the trunk road network coming down bypass and then going off round the caernarvon bypass? +course the initial thing is we get some reaction back from this, this +so they're seriously looking to the trunk road network coming down bypass and then going off round the caernarvon bypass? or is that just -that wasn't er ray 's view. +that wasn't er ray 's view. that was this other guy's view. based on this other scheme really he said oh yes. but which,whi which other guy? this ve vernon whatever his name is. -the are proposing this. +the are proposing this. they won't want that. -they wo they won't -but the the guy that's looking after the schemes +they wo they won't +but the the guy that's looking after the schemes yeah. guy. he's what? -he's looking after the schemes for the leisure office. +he's looking after the schemes for the leisure office. oh! oh he wasn't from . sorry i thought he was -he was from the leisure office looking after the . +he was from the leisure office looking after the . right. got it. that's what it's, he's interest @@ -50097,11 +50053,11 @@ have a lovely meeting. seminar i will yes. er you're going on this thing at the end of the month? -meetings yes. -there'd appear to be out of this office. +meetings yes. +there'd appear to be out of this office. there seems to be an awful lot of us going, yeah. i'll o i'll only be there friday morning and saturday. -i won't be there friday afternoon since i'm taking my son to the dentist . +i won't be there friday afternoon since i'm taking my son to the dentist . i do wonder if it's really w er i mean okay. see you tomorrow. @@ -50114,49 +50070,49 @@ i'd better get me timesheet out of it's signed. oh it's signed. oh that's alright. -we don't want bothering us do we? +we don't want bothering us do we? er where were we? mm? where were we? we were drawing up plans. it looks as though we're gonna be doing some extra survey work. mm. -ah that's what i was saying what +ah that's what i was saying what yeah, now detail on roundabouts. right. how much staff did we use? -can, can you the erm the ormskirk +can, can you the erm the ormskirk oh, that's a pity. -track of methodology but -push to get steve today. -well i left a message with his saying +track of methodology but +push to get steve today. +well i left a message with his saying were any of these four arm rou it's a five arm roundabout isn't it? were any of these four arm roundabouts? yes we did that one didn't we? -we need to do these -yeah that was roundabout. +we need to do these +yeah that was roundabout. that was a six arm. -and we did that one. +and we did that one. yeah that was a that's five arms isn't it? five. what other ones did we do? that one there? hello charlie. -we did, yeah, we did the here. +we did, yeah, we did the here. that was a five arm. -well these down here about fifteen or sixteen +well these down here about fifteen or sixteen oh yeah well th yeah the motorways were four arm. how many staff do we need to do that then? -the full turn in count. -suppose, well supposing we count ins and outs and the +the full turn in count. +suppose, well supposing we count ins and outs and the yeah. sample. right. -you need one t to where, where were, where we talking about now? +you need one t to where, where were, where we talking about now? st david. see you're gonna get some busier than others. yes. @@ -50171,17 +50127,17 @@ it's only really a four and a half hour roundabout isn't it? yes but one is out and yeah. yeah. -so you can obviously that's gonna just be one person. -one person could do a two way on a quiet arm but the others are gonna need one person to do ins, one person to do outs. +so you can obviously that's gonna just be one person. +one person could do a two way on a quiet arm but the others are gonna need one person to do ins, one person to do outs. and one person at each arm doing a sample. -so you've got nine plus four did we do a sample all day? +so you've got nine plus four did we do a sample all day? no, just in the peak hours they're sampling. didn't we do them off peak as well? we should have done them off peak as well shouldn't we? i don't know. i mean jan did those. i think it was just peak hours. -er it's gonna take thirteen people isn't it? +er it's gonna take thirteen people isn't it? yeah, i mean if it was peaks only i mean there's nothing to stop me doing it. well i appreciate that. or you use it, you put everybody on in the peaks @@ -50190,35 +50146,35 @@ and then you, you you use the cutback in the off, in the off peak they rotate the staff and -i'm not the thing is what you're assuming then is that the pattern in the peak hour is typical for the day as a whole. +i'm not the thing is what you're assuming then is that the pattern in the peak hour is typical for the day as a whole. that's not right is it? -mm maybe not. +mm maybe not. well you'll get a different pattern in the morning peak and the evening peak for a start won't you? mhm. mind you maybe you won't. -depends, what you're really concerned about is how does the proportion of traffic split to left and right and straight ahead isn't it? -if that pattern basically stays the same then you've got, the volume, the flow will go up and down. +depends, what you're really concerned about is how does the proportion of traffic split to left and right and straight ahead isn't it? +if that pattern basically stays the same then you've got, the volume, the flow will go up and down. mm right. but if we did a full turning count how would we do that? you can't do it can you? it's not realistic. -you have to do if you're doing that you have to have all the ins and outs plus a circulation flow. +you have to do if you're doing that you have to have all the ins and outs plus a circulation flow. yeah. and i've never done one like that. -we've always you know, found a way round it. +we've always you know, found a way round it. what we did before, was we did counting in flows and circulating. -i think what we would do supposing we didn't, supposing we just had heavy vehicles and light vehicles? +i think what we would do supposing we didn't, supposing we just had heavy vehicles and light vehicles? that's gonna make things a lot easier isn't it? -yeah well we, for queensferry we just had three classes. -motorbikes, cars, light goods h g v including two three and four axle and buses for the, for the whole count, now for the samples rob didn't even want it classified. -it was just a vehicle regardless of what it was. +yeah well we, for queensferry we just had three classes. +motorbikes, cars, light goods h g v including two three and four axle and buses for the, for the whole count, now for the samples rob didn't even want it classified. +it was just a vehicle regardless of what it was. yeah. -i suppose we could do a classified count er on the a four eight seven sort of a bit away if we wanted a proper classified count couldn't we? +i suppose we could do a classified count er on the a four eight seven sort of a bit away if we wanted a proper classified count couldn't we? yeah. separate, on another day. yeah. or we could just use whatever we get at the interview side. -erm perhaps the thing to do is to look at how it varied in nineteen eighty six. +erm perhaps the thing to do is to look at how it varied in nineteen eighty six. did you get that report out? yes you did. how it varied between the two sides. @@ -50226,14 +50182,14 @@ there's three thousand one hundred there. mhm. that's two way. on a twelve hour day. -so assu you're talking about, well supposing that 's grown, it may be four thousand, so you're talking about two thousand tr vehicles in the interview direction over twelve hours. -so you're gonna want to interview forty percent right? +so assu you're talking about, well supposing that 's grown, it may be four thousand, so you're talking about two thousand tr vehicles in the interview direction over twelve hours. +so you're gonna want to interview forty percent right? how many do you think you'll need? -do you think you'll need if you have t a team of four on, is that a half team or a six team? +do you think you'll need if you have t a team of four on, is that a half team or a six team? a half. a four. -we did have we worked a six team but it's not as easy to work out. -i'm only thinking that you've got somebody counting? +we did have we worked a six team but it's not as easy to work out. +i'm only thinking that you've got somebody counting? yeah. there's one person counting? two. @@ -50242,17 +50198,17 @@ yeah. one's on a break. two. sorry? -oh what are you on about now? +oh what are you on about now? when th there's a half team? a half team. right yeah. -if there's a half team one people, one person counting one on a break and two interviewing. +if there's a half team one people, one person counting one on a break and two interviewing. and they have a break every three hours. -can one person count and cope with that sort of flow? +can one person count and cope with that sort of flow? no i'd want two people. two people counting? oh what are you on about now? -on this this quieter roa oh right. +on this this quieter roa oh right. er yeah one person would be alright. that's the same sort of flow as we had a birkdale cop. mm. @@ -50260,9 +50216,9 @@ isn't it? we only had half a team there. right. yep that's alright then. -well my feeling on the roundabout is that we need to do, count ins and outs and do a sample. +well my feeling on the roundabout is that we need to do, count ins and outs and do a sample. okay. -and erm i think that's the thing to do. +and erm i think that's the thing to do. yeah. see the, so say if we, like you just said, we need thirteen people mm. @@ -50275,33 +50231,33 @@ you know where the horses were in the field? that was a four armed roundabout. just down from yeah. -the station house place where we parked -you'll find that erm the flows there are very low. +the station house place where we parked +you'll find that erm the flows there are very low. so you think we could get away with treating that as a crossroads and have people i reckon doing that? i reckon well we could have a person counting and not only are they counting what's coming out of their junction, but they could do left, straight on or right. -treat it as a crossroads perhaps. -i reckon si yes four or six people would cover that, no problem. -i think you'll find the flow is a a low +treat it as a crossroads perhaps. +i reckon si yes four or six people would cover that, no problem. +i think you'll find the flow is a a low it wasn't busy when we were there was it? -no i mean it may be, you know you i it may be reasonably busy straight through but i would have thought even there you're probably talking about four not a lot higher than that i wouldn't have thought. +no i mean it may be, you know you i it may be reasonably busy straight through but i would have thought even there you're probably talking about four not a lot higher than that i wouldn't have thought. no. -okay i'll take four people +okay i'll take four people and erm we're going very round very slow. and the visibility was good and everything. -so i'd have thought that erm you could put four or six, four or six people on that. -and actually if we just counted this to through traffic wouldn't be too much -hello right. +so i'd have thought that erm you could put four or six, four or six people on that. +and actually if we just counted this to through traffic wouldn't be too much +hello right. your pudding? -what erm have you heard any of it?you have. +what erm have you heard any of it?you have. what did it sound like? it's good. -we both just said that it ne you'd never think that you sound right on tape. +we both just said that it ne you'd never think that you sound right on tape. i always think i sound high pitched. -sounds all like bloody what she does say. -yeah +sounds all like bloody what she does say. +yeah nearly didn't recognize you there jimbo. me? no, sorry another jim. @@ -50309,7 +50265,7 @@ oh. jim with a suit on. must be going to a funeral. or going for an interview. -i've just seen yeah he must have an interview. +i've just seen yeah he must have an interview. ooh. oh god . you'll never guess who was in the pub yesterday. @@ -50322,56 +50278,56 @@ i just heard you, heard you twang twanging your ruler. doing. twanging? twanging. -did you, did anybody see that film about erm st the stolen cars? +did you, did anybody see that film about erm st the stolen cars? the other night, what ? friday night. mm no. no. what station was that on? -erm i dunno, it was one of these er documentary type things and it was just like all organized crime, they were just erm -saying of all, all the things that they get up to you know,cutting using a stolen car +erm i dunno, it was one of these er documentary type things and it was just like all organized crime, they were just erm +saying of all, all the things that they get up to you know,cutting using a stolen car mhm. or a write off car and joining them and welding them yeah. down the middle. cos that's what happened to brian, you know when brian had his orion nicked?got stopped in the cars or something? -little sutton cars. +little sutton cars. and then, it's taking him ages to get has he got it now though? yeah. but er the things that they were doing were just unbelievable. erm you know to get the chassis numbers and that. -buying old say a scrapped a written off sierra you know, picking them up cheap for about a thousand quid from the scrappy +buying old say a scrapped a written off sierra you know, picking them up cheap for about a thousand quid from the scrappy yeah. -and then getting all the the chassis numbers and that and welding them on to these stolen cars and because what, you know, er siobhan's dad had a, bought a montego and i don't know how it came about but they discovered that erm it had a diff i mean it's had a maestro engine in it and it had this that and the other. +and then getting all the the chassis numbers and that and welding them on to these stolen cars and because what, you know, er siobhan's dad had a, bought a montego and i don't know how it came about but they discovered that erm it had a diff i mean it's had a maestro engine in it and it had this that and the other. and er they had to repossess it and he was paying . and i don't know how, what's happened about it now but at the time he was still having to pay for it mhm. even though they'd taken the car. -there was a woman there that erm the police do this service thing where they'll look a car over for you, if you bought a car that you know has been er in an accident and it's been +there was a woman there that erm the police do this service thing where they'll look a car over for you, if you bought a car that you know has been er in an accident and it's been yeah. -they will have a look at it over and check it over. +they will have a look at it over and check it over. and there was a woman on it, she had a really nice orion, a j reg. -anyway when they had a good look at it the front half was an escort and the back half was an orion, half a stolen car. -you know they hadn't even matched the same bloody type of car. +anyway when they had a good look at it the front half was an escort and the back half was an orion, half a stolen car. +you know they hadn't even matched the same bloody type of car. there's not really a lot of difference though is there between -there is +there is well there isn't and i i said to mike what did it look like, you know? he said it was nice. -but when they're doing these welding jobs they haven't got them on those things so as they're doing it like it's all moving and +but when they're doing these welding jobs they haven't got them on those things so as they're doing it like it's all moving and yeah. yeah they're totally it was just a complete bodge. i if you're driving along you can throw out the balance of the car. yeah. -well it was that erm one in manchester, that crash you know there was three people killed in the middle of manchester wasn't there? +well it was that erm one in manchester, that crash you know there was three people killed in the middle of manchester wasn't there? oh i seem to remember something like that. -erm and the car just broke up in half and that was, that had been er welded but like the police are saying as well as soon as they sort of get wise to what they're doing and they find a way to er you know, get on to them, they devised something else. -and the people doing it in these garages erm, you know like respraying and doing all the welding and everything, really he said some of the things they were doing if they did it legally they'd make a good go of it +erm and the car just broke up in half and that was, that had been er welded but like the police are saying as well as soon as they sort of get wise to what they're doing and they find a way to er you know, get on to them, they devised something else. +and the people doing it in these garages erm, you know like respraying and doing all the welding and everything, really he said some of the things they were doing if they did it legally they'd make a good go of it mm. they were that good at what they were doing. -tell me was i dreaming or did i see a sketch on t v where there's a car driving round, down the road being chased by the police and the driver said to the passenger er here take this and he says what's that for and he says it's to steer the car, presses a button and the car splits +tell me was i dreaming or did i see a sketch on t v where there's a car driving round, down the road being chased by the police and the driver said to the passenger er here take this and he says what's that for and he says it's to steer the car, presses a button and the car splits it's an advert for malcolm. the car s the car split in two. yeah. @@ -50380,13 +50336,13 @@ it's an advert for that film called malcolm is that what it was? about the yeah. -retarded lad that invented all these strange and he did bank robberies with a remote control car. +retarded lad that invented all these strange and he did bank robberies with a remote control car. it was an advert, it wasn't but i did see it on the t v? oh you did. oh that's fine. -straight after er the advert for del-boy when he says and you know what you can do with that. -even talking about trailers now. +straight after er the advert for del-boy when he says and you know what you can do with that. +even talking about trailers now. trainers? talking about te television trailers. oh, oh yeah. @@ -50394,7 +50350,7 @@ not just the programmes. there was a programme on about trailers the other night as well. have you seen the, the advert for these trainers with no laces, you just tighten the thing up. puma discus system. -they're out on the twenty of march or something. +they're out on the twenty of march or something. mm. i wonder how much they're gonna be a pair? dunno. @@ -50405,7 +50361,7 @@ something like that. i thought it was a built in egg timer or something . obviously another time saving device. yeah. -to save you what say thirty seconds? +to save you what say thirty seconds? oh at least. ah there's no point getting cynical is there? not at this time of the day, no. @@ -50414,49 +50370,49 @@ rest of the week. exactly. where did he go? i thought you were going out? -i i'm finishing early but i'm not go going out. +i i'm finishing early but i'm not go going out. watch you don't er swallow that the wrong way. i didn't even have anything in me mouth. sharp intake of breath. excuse me? -for their telephone number i've just put a question mark and i've put a note here to say i was internally transferred. +for their telephone number i've just put a question mark and i've put a note here to say i was internally transferred. s sounds like i've had an operation doesn't it? i'm being internally transferred . oh. someone pressed the i c m button. yeah. -oh i told you didn't i that er the fellow with the portakabins that does work for the b b c, he had the portakabin and then your tables are two pound each, and your chairs range from fifty pence to one pound fifty. -i think the ones that are fifty pence are those blue and white striped ones off the prom at prestatyn +oh i told you didn't i that er the fellow with the portakabins that does work for the b b c, he had the portakabin and then your tables are two pound each, and your chairs range from fifty pence to one pound fifty. +i think the ones that are fifty pence are those blue and white striped ones off the prom at prestatyn job lot. -and er he didn't say how much the toilet was but that'll probably be separate. +and er he didn't say how much the toilet was but that'll probably be separate. you know, it's a separate thing so there must be a separate price, it would cost a bloody fortune. and the visibility didn't seem very good out of them. but the smallest one, the twelve foot ones, there's only one window. the door's in the back end. -erm so i presume that was the opposite end to where the tow bar would be +erm so i presume that was the opposite end to where the tow bar would be mm. and then just one window in it. maybe just down the length of one side. or even just at the end. yeah. no i think it was down the side i think he said. -but i i think that'll be too expensive anyway. +but i i think that'll be too expensive anyway. mhm. -and that's why mr said he he'd er +and that's why mr said he he'd er he'd do it, yeah. and we know where we are then with the toilet. you know, you know what you're getting don't you? yeah. how much ? -yeah it'd be erm jim said there would be no problem because his men have to empty their own chemical loos anyway. +yeah it'd be erm jim said there would be no problem because his men have to empty their own chemical loos anyway. but the bowl coupling could be a problem. he said but we'll sort it out, don't worry love. -they're all very nice people. -they have got an accent this 's got one but he sounds more lancashire than anything. +they're all very nice people. +they have got an accent this 's got one but he sounds more lancashire than anything. and he's nowhere near. perhaps he's just moved there. mm. -i'll have to er give her a ring to and tell them to send me the advert. +i'll have to er give her a ring to and tell them to send me the advert. tell them to buy . mhm. when does it go out? @@ -50465,93 +50421,93 @@ today. is it going in the post? no. didn't we tell you that? -to have it in er daily post, the post is the morning one the echo's the evening to have it in for one day in the post and the echo, how much? +to have it in er daily post, the post is the morning one the echo's the evening to have it in for one day in the post and the echo, how much? dunno, about eighty quid. three hundred and ninety six pound sixty four pence. so you said we'll have it in all week? how big was the advert? er about a hundred words in a box. -two columns wide and erm eight centimetres down. +two columns wide and erm eight centimetres down. we reckoned that was about quarter of a page. it's a lot of money isn't it? -but see the reason i have to send this to liverpool for them to put it in +but see the reason i have to send this to liverpool for them to put it in mhm. cos it has to go through our advertising agents. cos we advertise in a special format don't we? -we have the dash lines round the box +we have the dash lines round the box mm. and we have the logo on the bottom and that. -so they've had to do it so i mean she quoted me -thirty six quid for this thirty six eighty four or something for the local paper. -but erm you know it might be more but that's +so they've had to do it so i mean she quoted me +thirty six quid for this thirty six eighty four or something for the local paper. +but erm you know it might be more but that's mhm. nothing to do with me. -but i mean like i didn't think it was worth putting it in the post to start off with anyway. -but if we don't get a good response to this i might stick it in for the day in the post. +but i mean like i didn't think it was worth putting it in the post to start off with anyway. +but if we don't get a good response to this i might stick it in for the day in the post. mhm. -is the secretary at dealing with it or is she gonna forward it all on to you? +is the secretary at dealing with it or is she gonna forward it all on to you? no i've put our address. i said that i didn't like that idea to start off with no well it because although it's only a small concern she's gonna have her own stuff to do. it's not just that it's the delay in it getting to you anyway. -yeah and plus the fact i said to mike it's all very well saying send stuff there, she can open it she'd be no wiser whether they sound any good or not. +yeah and plus the fact i said to mike it's all very well saying send stuff there, she can open it she'd be no wiser whether they sound any good or not. mm. so i said no i said, well i've put the phone number as well and i said it might as well, stuff might as well come straight here. mhm. -so i'll give her a ring later in the week or something and i'll see if they'll send me the send me the +so i'll give her a ring later in the week or something and i'll see if they'll send me the send me the mhm. policing do you the drop the e, or do you leave the e in? in. policing. erm i'd have thought you dropped it. -what shall i say cos it's it's not a very -sergeant said he would be happy to help with the policing oh +what shall i say cos it's it's not a very +sergeant said he would be happy to help with the policing oh if you drop the e it looks like policing doesn't it? put it in. yeah, i think maybe you keep it in. it's not a very nice word is it? -well i'm just coming to ask you that +well i'm just coming to ask you that staffing. yeah. double f. have you got the twenty five hundred plans? i haven't got any just at the moment. -er sergeant will be +er sergeant will be beg your pardon? sergeant oh yes? erm very pleased to help us. -as soon as we've got the layouts he'd like to meet us and go out to site . +as soon as we've got the layouts he'd like to meet us and go out to site . he seems very keen to help us do this. right what about the er recruiting and the police cover? he's so do we need to write -he said on the blower +he said on the blower i've started it. -yeah it's about two hundred and twenty four pages. +yeah it's about two hundred and twenty four pages. is that all? -yeah +yeah well he is. he says he will do it himself. -and i said they will require cover for their breaks he fell down on that one, he doesn't think those two days. -he said oh yes, yes they could have a sandwich . +and i said they will require cover for their breaks he fell down on that one, he doesn't think those two days. +he said oh yes, yes they could have a sandwich . he seems very good. excellent. right. -mm that doesn't +mm that doesn't they're in the same -any records of, we had this discussion i have er any rec any, every telephone call i make . -right +any records of, we had this discussion i have er any rec any, every telephone call i make . +right but that's because well that's right . i mean it's a case, and then you end up saying yes and you don't need to record every telephone call they're in the same drawer as the memos. -they're in the bottom +they're in the bottom well i mean she could -yeah and the alternative you know mi mike's made calls in the past . -that's always been very important and that should be the letter so that should be on on the, on the +yeah and the alternative you know mi mike's made calls in the past . +that's always been very important and that should be the letter so that should be on on the, on the must be a good microphone stand surely? brilliant the purpose of the meeting is only to record conversations. @@ -50561,17 +50517,17 @@ okay, just to put you in the picture where no it's alright. go on. yes. -i've had several telephone calls well i've made them as well. +i've had several telephone calls well i've made them as well. the advert has gone in. i've done all enquiries about putting the advert in for the temps. yes. -it went to liverpool on friday and they were gonna do their best to get it done and +it went to liverpool on friday and they were gonna do their best to get it done and do we know when it goes in the er -i think i told liverpool that if it gets to erm caernarvon to the caernarvon office by today it will appear in this week's issue. +i think i told liverpool that if it gets to erm caernarvon to the caernarvon office by today it will appear in this week's issue. do we know when that comes out? no, i couldn't get that off her. off who? -well i asked the girl and the she, we sort of sidetracked and when i come off the phone i realized that she hadn't said. +well i asked the girl and the she, we sort of sidetracked and when i come off the phone i realized that she hadn't said. i think it's what i'm thinking of is that thursday or something like that. @@ -50579,9 +50535,9 @@ presumably after that we w or on that date we'll start to get phone calls? this is true. and we need to be prepared yep. -because obviously er i mean if you're in +because obviously er i mean if you're in yeah. -they can be rung through to you but p erm will need to be warned that we may get a flood of phone calls +they can be rung through to you but p erm will need to be warned that we may get a flood of phone calls yeah. and what they're about. and also i think it might be as well to have a pro forma. @@ -50590,8 +50546,8 @@ yeah, well no we haven't so we could probably do with doing oh that and then, you know like if i get inundated i can let jim do some. well that's right. -i mean really it, it's erm er we, we have a form don't we we, we use when people are interviewed for something or other? -well if we put their name and address and phone number on it, i mean it's probably just as well to use a standard thing that you can xerox. +i mean really it, it's erm er we, we have a form don't we we, we use when people are interviewed for something or other? +well if we put their name and address and phone number on it, i mean it's probably just as well to use a standard thing that you can xerox. yeah. maybe jim and i could and when they ring up @@ -50607,7 +50563,7 @@ yeah if we you can swear in the privacy of your own home. it was your company that i didn't want to swear in front of not the tape actually -yes alright +yes alright no if we er do something so as they have a checklist and we can all, you know like me and jim say, have a copy to say oh right, can we take your name and address, telephone number and if you've got a pad of them or or, or some by you you can just fill it in and let it go through. yeah that'd be a good idea @@ -50624,33 +50580,33 @@ yeah okay. erm and that also makes sure, if you've got it all in front of you, erm that ensures that you're getting all the information that you need rather than thinking oh hang on, what else do i need sort of thing. right, so that's the temporary staff. yep. -so what we haven't made any progress on beyond, on that side of things is erm if we do the coding over in caernarvon, where that will be. +so what we haven't made any progress on beyond, on that side of things is erm if we do the coding over in caernarvon, where that will be. yeah. -erm like i think we all sort of ruled out er +erm like i think we all sort of ruled out er i don't think it's big enough is it? because of the size, no. -er just out of interest i did ring the other day +er just out of interest i did ring the other day yeah right. -er the the room, the smallest room they have is for twenty five to thirty people +er the the room, the smallest room they have is for twenty five to thirty people mm. which i mean even that may be too big for what we want. erm in any case that is in use every week on a monday and a wednesday. so already you're only talking there was a thing about exams. -wasn't it didn't you ring them up and they said we have exams on or something? +wasn't it didn't you ring them up and they said we have exams on or something? no. -that must be something +that must be something something goes on in that room on a monday and a wednesday. which room is that? -that's the, i've got it in the file, a small conference room or something like that, or the committee room or something it's called. +that's the, i've got it in the file, a small conference room or something like that, or the committee room or something it's called. cos there is a room called the navigation room. -no that wasn't an that wasn't an option. -there was this one for twenty five to thirty people and then there was another one for say forty or fifty and then it zoomed up to like a hundred. +no that wasn't an that wasn't an option. +there was this one for twenty five to thirty people and then there was another one for say forty or fifty and then it zoomed up to like a hundred. and even if we were to use this oh i know now, yes. -small room, you couldn't leave anything on the walls so it would all be a come down at night, back up in the morning +small room, you couldn't leave anything on the walls so it would all be a come down at night, back up in the morning what erm er did you look in the file and see what they hired last time? -erm no. +erm no. cos it may i mean i've probably seen it yeah. @@ -50658,31 +50614,31 @@ but i can't remember. cos probably it will say what room it was. yeah it was this small, i it may well have been ano -think it was this i thought it was the small +think it was this i thought it was the small oh it was that one was it? well you're talking now anyway do you want me to get it? er have you got it on your desk? yes. -oh right -how many days are we talking about anyway?coding data. +oh right +how many days are we talking about anyway?coding data. couple of weeks i suppose. right. -no wait a minute, three sites you're talking about a week and a half or something aren't we? +no wait a minute, three sites you're talking about a week and a half or something aren't we? yeah. fortnight at the most. yeah. cos you've got to allow for like they might not have done it before. -erm but you're talking fifty eight pound a day +erm but you're talking fifty eight pound a day mm. for that small room which i think's a bit steep personally. let me take a look. it's er -it's possible that you did get on the the +it's possible that you did get on the the it crossed my mind. there's the oak's room. -can't +can't the oak's room up to a hundred and twenty. four pound per hour. sixteen pound a day. @@ -50690,15 +50646,15 @@ and what are you saying it is now? fifty eight pound a day. that's an awful lot more isn't it? yeah. -there's i mean so many of them have caught on. -jan for example, when we had the the town hall thing, that was five pound a day. +there's i mean so many of them have caught on. +jan for example, when we had the the town hall thing, that was five pound a day. yeah. it's twenty five pound a day now. i think they've just all jumped on the bandwagon. they don't provide anything really do they? well no, that's it. so as soon as she said that it was in use monday wednesday i sort of -if we went to +if we went to subconsciously ruled it out. village hall, church hall yeah ? @@ -50706,31 +50662,31 @@ which is a church hall, they don't have a charge, you have to make a contributio where's this sorry? well you, you need to, it's pretty grotty, it's a grim place mm. -but it's er it's the church the parish hall in . +but it's er it's the church the parish hall in . whether they've got tables and stuff like that i'm not sure. mm. if you ring roger yeah and ask him. -he did investigate having a public enquiry there last year. -and erm so he will have a phone number of the vicar and so on. +he did investigate having a public enquiry there last year. +and erm so he will have a phone number of the vicar and so on. mm okay. okay. -i mean in a w well i can't, did we, i wonder if we recharge this to the welsh office or not? +i mean in a w well i can't, did we, i wonder if we recharge this to the welsh office or not? we probably do. probably doesn't matter does it? no i would have thought -the other thing might be to ring up borough council cos they've got offices in caernarvon. -suppose that that place they might, there might be a er a parish hall there or something +the other thing might be to ring up borough council cos they've got offices in caernarvon. +suppose that that place they might, there might be a er a parish hall there or something that pub would be alright wouldn't it? yeah. okay, or that would be twenty five pound a day as well, or fifty pound a day as well . anyway it's a thought. i mean if we have to -er obviously what you're saying with it's already in use and we can't have it? +er obviously what you're saying with it's already in use and we can't have it? yeah. -it's not erm it's no good just saying oh we can have three days out of the week anyway. +it's not erm it's no good just saying oh we can have three days out of the week anyway. no. you know, it's gotta be monday to friday or none at all hasn't it? mm. @@ -50738,7 +50694,7 @@ well if it was four days it would be alright but mm. anyway okay so they're a few options to try as regards the coding -alright and if we can't find anyway where we'll have to out and come back here. +alright and if we can't find anyway where we'll have to out and come back here. yeah. problem as well. i think we, we should find somewhere. @@ -50746,16 +50702,16 @@ yeah. really. erm so that's a few options as regards the coding. now -right -the interviewing and the briefing session i think we'll probably get away with in debbie 's -yeah we're not going to, i mean we're only going to we're, we're -well it's not a sort of formal interview +right +the interviewing and the briefing session i think we'll probably get away with in debbie 's +yeah we're not going to, i mean we're only going to we're, we're +well it's not a sort of formal interview we'll only be briefing the interview staff that's right. and accounts staff. yeah. -so we're only talking about half a dozen -well i think it's slightly more. +so we're only talking about half a dozen +well i think it's slightly more. well eight or ten or something isn't it? yeah. thanks. @@ -50764,10 +50720,10 @@ yeah you're talking about a dozen people, something like that aren't you? i mean for that er well if necessary we can bring them into here. yeah. -half a dozen and half a dozen +half a dozen and half a dozen yeah. that's, i can't see that being a problem, that should be okay . -have you briefed before? +have you briefed before? yeah. well mike comes out. mike shows his face doesn't he? @@ -50787,30 +50743,30 @@ what w w and anyway we now, we've, we've also got to progress on site layout and things haven't we? yes. -and get in er the cones and signs. -yeah i've had er -we, we, you've got we've got to wait till tomorrow haven't we? +and get in er the cones and signs. +yeah i've had er +we, we, you've got we've got to wait till tomorrow haven't we? that's right, yeah. yeah. -now as regards signs i've spoke to numerous, oh school holidays i've got erm +now as regards signs i've spoke to numerous, oh school holidays i've got erm when the schools are off. right. i spoke to the education department on friday. -erm as regards a caravan i spoke to this bloke frank +erm as regards a caravan i spoke to this bloke frank no he's gone bust. well he hasn't gone bust but they don't hire them any more oh right. but i did try him. -er no gwyllam at gwyneth county council -gwyllam oh no i'm thinking of peter . -erm he didn't think they had any bilingual signs and they didn't have they weren't using their portakabins so they scrapped them all last year sold them off. +er no gwyllam at gwyneth county council +gwyllam oh no i'm thinking of peter . +erm he didn't think they had any bilingual signs and they didn't have they weren't using their portakabins so they scrapped them all last year sold them off. mm. but he did give me somebody to ring about caravans mm. -but then later on in the day he rung back and said he had found some bilingual signs but all he's got were about four foot square er with census point ahead. -he hasn't got things like stop census. -stop if required or slow census point which is the ones we use. -it might be worth asking erm mel +but then later on in the day he rung back and said he had found some bilingual signs but all he's got were about four foot square er with census point ahead. +he hasn't got things like stop census. +stop if required or slow census point which is the ones we use. +it might be worth asking erm mel yeah. about that. you see for a start we need to decide to we need it. @@ -50819,26 +50775,26 @@ bilingual? bilingual? they can't have been bilingual last time because they were hired from staffordshire county council. no. -and the other thing er if they they just haven't got anything like that. +and the other thing er if they they just haven't got anything like that. yeah. they use sort of blank -wasn't there a big fuss though because there wasn't enough effort made on the bilingual side the last survey we did? +wasn't there a big fuss though because there wasn't enough effort made on the bilingual side the last survey we did? i don't think so was there? there's a letter in the file -well that's +well that's about erm why we didn't use bilingual staff for one of the particular dates. erm it come from the county surveyor, apparently he'd had complaints. but i mean it was purely a re a recruiting problem. -er you know erm the letter, the reply went back from dave saying that every you know, possible thing was done to get bilingual staff but at the end of the day you know they couldn't come up with the goods. +er you know erm the letter, the reply went back from dave saying that every you know, possible thing was done to get bilingual staff but at the end of the day you know they couldn't come up with the goods. i mean the lengths they went to advertising, i hope we're gonna have more luck now. -they had temping agencies, job centres, local papers the job centre only came up with about two people. +they had temping agencies, job centres, local papers the job centre only came up with about two people. so i'm touching wood that we're gonna be in a different situation. -i wonder if, i wonder if erm you know if you rang up erm the county council and said you know i mean er y just make use of a contact and say look, we wanna do this survey, you know, do you happen to know a any members of your family +i wonder if, i wonder if erm you know if you rang up erm the county council and said you know i mean er y just make use of a contact and say look, we wanna do this survey, you know, do you happen to know a any members of your family yeah. you know? it maybe yeah. -you can very often er for instance at cheshire very often i mean there were sort of some people's wives would like to do it. +you can very often er for instance at cheshire very often i mean there were sort of some people's wives would like to do it. yeah. it may be, you know? yeah. @@ -50847,51 +50803,51 @@ who is it you've spoken to at gwyneth? er gwyllam . and where is he? who, how did you get hold of him? -erm +erm you rang up, did you ring up owen ? er no. -i spoke i just rung up erm it was highways and transportation and +i spoke i just rung up erm it was highways and transportation and mm. -i asked to speak to somebody in the highways in the transportation +i asked to speak to somebody in the highways in the transportation mm. -this was at bangor and then i got another number and then i got told that they now have the direct organisation +this was at bangor and then i got another number and then i got told that they now have the direct organisation right. so then i rung this person here and spoke to a steven mm. -who was the head from the civi civil engineering division. +who was the head from the civi civil engineering division. yeah. -steven put me through to this gwyllam +steven put me through to this gwyllam right. -who is in the, the depot place. +who is in the, the depot place. right. and that's how i got on to him. okay. -so we've not spoken to anybody on the sort of like the traffic erm counting side of things there? +so we've not spoken to anybody on the sort of like the traffic erm counting side of things there? no. no. okay. so this fella was, he come up, he found these signs and said, you know, didn't know if they would be, be any good. -erm but he'd given me this number, glen about portakabins. +erm but he'd given me this number, glen about portakabins. er he's at . -and i rung this glen er wherever that is erm and he does have these portakabin things. +and i rung this glen er wherever that is erm and he does have these portakabin things. er several measurements is that, that's a hire company is it? -yeah, they're like they've got a big fleet of them. +yeah, they're like they've got a big fleet of them. erm right. but they're portakabins? yeah, rather than caravans. yeah. -now i don't think they sound very to suit our needs. +now i don't think they sound very to suit our needs. well you have to furnish them as well don't you? well that's it. -and there's all separate, two pound a table from fifty pence to one pound fifty for a chair. +and there's all separate, two pound a table from fifty pence to one pound fifty for a chair. there's no toilet in them and you probably have to hire them by the week do you? er minimum of four weeks. yeah. and how do you move them around? -well they would move them round this fella himself, but it's gonna be a hell of a lot of money to get them to do that. +well they would move them round this fella himself, but it's gonna be a hell of a lot of money to get them to do that. mm that's what i would have thought. plus there's no toilet. exactly. @@ -50909,9 +50865,9 @@ yeah. it would be cheaper to get david . yeah well i've spoke to david . he's quite willing to take the caravan out there. -erm and then you've got the toilet on there. +erm and then you've got the toilet on there. you know what you're getting because we've had it before. -so then i got back on to gwyllam and said that if we provided our own caravan, would you someone there be willing to do the from site to site and he said that wouldn't be a problem. +so then i got back on to gwyllam and said that if we provided our own caravan, would you someone there be willing to do the from site to site and he said that wouldn't be a problem. right. but he doesn't know any details. okay. @@ -50920,9 +50876,9 @@ we don't know dates or anything yet do we? no. so i think we've developed in that direction that i can go ahead as soon as i've got some dates and book it properly with mr . i think that's probably the best. -and just let these do the transporting because this this fella honest to god he was doing me head in. -erm saying oh one left, we've got a contract with the b b c you know, isn't it. -oh and if he said it once well he said it half a dozen times trying to impress me. +and just let these do the transporting because this this fella honest to god he was doing me head in. +erm saying oh one left, we've got a contract with the b b c you know, isn't it. +oh and if he said it once well he said it half a dozen times trying to impress me. so let's stick to mr . we know where we are with him. oh right, yes well i'm quite happy with that. @@ -50930,58 +50886,58 @@ right. er so the only other thing are the automatic counters then isn't it? mm. yeah. -and we, we've got to wait for erm mel to be in tomorrow. +and we, we've got to wait for erm mel to be in tomorrow. haven't we? yeah. and we're obviously going to ask him to he, he to go ahead with it. -looks after, i, i'm not sure exactly what he does, but he does sort of look after the welsh office's own traffic counting programme. +looks after, i, i'm not sure exactly what he does, but he does sort of look after the welsh office's own traffic counting programme. mm. -they have a sort of programme of their own on er doing counts on roads. -i mean a and most of it's done through the county councils. +they have a sort of programme of their own on er doing counts on roads. +i mean a and most of it's done through the county councils. so we'll have certain sites that are counted and they have the, the equipment. -er when we last did the work there in nineteen eighty nine he'd, he'd provided gwyneth with three machines which they moved round and put on different places for us. +er when we last did the work there in nineteen eighty nine he'd, he'd provided gwyneth with three machines which they moved round and put on different places for us. and i think they're ones that have a cartridge in. and the information's recorded on the cartridge. -and they take the cartridge out and they send it down to cardiff which is where mel is +and they take the cartridge out and they send it down to cardiff which is where mel is yeah. and he chucks it into, bungs it into his machine and then gets the printout then which he then sends to wherever. ah. -so what we, we need to go to him i think in the first instance and say we want to do x y and z, and if he, if he says fine you know. +so what we, we need to go to him i think in the first instance and say we want to do x y and z, and if he, if he says fine you know. but if he says i'm sorry, i haven't got the equipment we then have to go outside yeah. -obviously but i think you need clearly in the first instance to use that -and you're saying to also mention to me if he's got +obviously but i think you need clearly in the first instance to use that +and you're saying to also mention to me if he's got well i, it's just a thought. i mean if we're gonna be speaking to him we may as well ask whether yeah. -just to say that we, you know, that we'll, we, we're going, we're proposing to do some origin destination surveys interviewing, and we'll need the signing to go with it that gwyneth don't appear to have them and, and in consequence we're proposing to hire them elsewhere. -erm and erm you know, we know that last time it was done er the, the signs were not bilingual, the ones census point and so on +just to say that we, you know, that we'll, we, we're going, we're proposing to do some origin destination surveys interviewing, and we'll need the signing to go with it that gwyneth don't appear to have them and, and in consequence we're proposing to hire them elsewhere. +erm and erm you know, we know that last time it was done er the, the signs were not bilingual, the ones census point and so on yeah. and that erm is he w er would, did he think that would be a problem. yeah. cos i think last time we hired them from staffordshire and i'd have thought if they're going to buy some they will be very happy to hire us them. -cos presumably, when you look at the layout most of the signs are keep left signs. +cos presumably, when you look at the layout most of the signs are keep left signs. yeah. -or you get the you get ones that are sort of road narrows +or you get the you get ones that are sort of road narrows yeah. and you get the, the warning ones. yeah. -and the warning ones have a little census plate on. -erm so presumably you perhaps need to do something about that. +and the warning ones have a little census plate on. +erm so presumably you perhaps need to do something about that. but the keep left ones they're gonna have in stock aren't they? yeah. -so the only ones you really need and, and the, and the road narrows and the warning ones, they're all gonna be in stock. +so the only ones you really need and, and the, and the road narrows and the warning ones, they're all gonna be in stock. yeah. -so the only ones that probably need to get made are census stop if required etcetera. +so the only ones that probably need to get made are census stop if required etcetera. so there's only three of those. -yeah slow census and whatever. -so presumably if, if staffordshire have them made and we get those three whizzed up to caernarvon you know, the rest can sort of fit into place. +yeah slow census and whatever. +so presumably if, if staffordshire have them made and we get those three whizzed up to caernarvon you know, the rest can sort of fit into place. cos if you put survey instead of census at the bottom, i mean i know that's not strictly speaking how it should be, but they must have signs for us to survey because they have their own, presumably they have their own surveyors go out and yeah. yeah like -you know and +you know and you see yellow ones don't you? on the motorway and stuff yeah. @@ -50990,14 +50946,14 @@ but they very often, that triangular one with an exclamation mark, there'll be a yeah plate on the bottom that says survey. yeah. -well maybe it's not really right, but, but perhaps that i'd have thought it would be alright. +well maybe it's not really right, but, but perhaps that i'd have thought it would be alright. yeah. census, it's probably the same in welsh as well you know, don't you know? yeah, i see what you mean. we might be able to get round it. i'll see what this fella says. -well i mean i was saying to this bloke well can you think of anywhere where we might be able to, oh no no no can't think of anywhere. -well you could try clwyd or something but can't think everybody you know. +well i mean i was saying to this bloke well can you think of anywhere where we might be able to, oh no no no can't think of anywhere. +well you could try clwyd or something but can't think everybody you know. clwyd might well do some. i wonder oh it might be worth giving nige a ring. @@ -51010,19 +50966,19 @@ davydd . never heard of him . he's brian's brother is he? no. -okay so let's just go +okay so let's just go he used to work for liverpool city i think, and he was called dave there. -er right, just going back to the actual er roadside interview, is that one on the the b road, or is it the a? +er right, just going back to the actual er roadside interview, is that one on the the b road, or is it the a? that's the one. er i was only going to propose to use four staff on that. have a look at the, i think that's what we've done last time. yeah. okay. -have a look at the erm we must have a count but yes, have you got that report? +have a look at the erm we must have a count but yes, have you got that report? of the or have you given it back to me? -well no just the oh, yes it might be on that but i the early report -the reports on the erm surveys which were done +well no just the oh, yes it might be on that but i the early report +the reports on the erm surveys which were done did you give it back? yes i did. right. @@ -51033,8 +50989,8 @@ yes. and i think you're right. and the other thing oh -oh we've put in a making the interview forms, just having the welsh translation on the top. -i was explaining to jim how we could do that and it looked pretty straightforward so or, or not. +oh we've put in a making the interview forms, just having the welsh translation on the top. +i was explaining to jim how we could do that and it looked pretty straightforward so or, or not. it's have we got the interview forms? that we used last time? @@ -51046,7 +51002,7 @@ what, how w , what are w , have we got our current ones, our standard ones? yeah. cos presumably it would be best to use those wouldn't it? yeah. -i think you could, you could accommodate it if you just reduced that sli the, what the normal one slightly, and there's t there's room to put the er translation on the top. +i think you could, you could accommodate it if you just reduced that sli the, what the normal one slightly, and there's t there's room to put the er translation on the top. i'll do you a mock up of that and see what you yes, good idea. what you think. @@ -51056,43 +51012,43 @@ how many are we gonna want? three thousand? perhaps it's worth having a separate print run for that isn't it? yeah, might be. -it's not i think if they use this offset thing, the masters last about five hundred so you're not it's not, it's not a silly amount. +it's not i think if they use this offset thing, the masters last about five hundred so you're not it's not, it's not a silly amount. yeah. would it take, oh wait a minute! three thousand interviews what say, would you think three thousand interviews? i'm just trying to think what we were averaging. -but i mean that one of them's not gonna you're not gonna get as many on that b road. -will we will we want those? +but i mean that one of them's not gonna you're not gonna get as many on that b road. +will we will we want those? oh i can't remember you know what we used for ormskirk -it doesn't matter if we if we get too many cos you can always use +it doesn't matter if we if we get too many cos you can always use well that's it. can't you? yeah. mm. if you see what i mean. yeah. -well so you think actually send something through to reprographics for them to do in liverpool? +well so you think actually send something through to reprographics for them to do in liverpool? well you don't want to be doing it on the machine down here do you? no. and if you got three thousand interviews, say a thousand at, well y you probably wouldn't, you'd probably get probably two of those boxes would do wouldn't it? -you could get nearly four thousand interviews couldn't you, altogether? +you could get nearly four thousand interviews couldn't you, altogether? yeah. -at two on a page is two thousand sheets plus however many you'd only get one on. -so i'd have thought three thousand wasn't out of the way really. +at two on a page is two thousand sheets plus however many you'd only get one on. +so i'd have thought three thousand wasn't out of the way really. and like you say if there's some left they won't go to waste anyway. no. oh on the other hand i suppose we could say well we'll use, we'll get some and if we run out we'll use english ones. if you do it that way, you know, by the time they get there they should know what the questions are shouldn't they? yeah. excuse me, by the time you run a -cos we hold the original to that. +cos we hold the original to that. to the interview -well we'll need some anyway. +well we'll need some anyway. yeah. -we've probably, i mean we, we hold the original on an a three so it might be worthwhile doing a copy of it. +we've probably, i mean we, we hold the original on an a three so it might be worthwhile doing a copy of it. doctoring it oh i see yeah. to insert the welsh because john will have to send the original off for @@ -51105,34 +51061,34 @@ i'll, i'll dig it out after. yeah, right. right, is there anything else? so, yeah there is. -erm things like whether i'm using my car and stuff i suppose i need to speak to mike about? +erm things like whether i'm using my car and stuff i suppose i need to speak to mike about? i haven't done anything about that. right. erm erm statutory undertakers? bus companies -yes we'll need to write to all those and we'll need to write we need to write to the police +yes we'll need to write to all those and we'll need to write we need to write to the police yeah. -on in two guises don't we? -partly because we're doing a survey but partly to warn partly because of the emergency services aspect. +on in two guises don't we? +partly because we're doing a survey but partly to warn partly because of the emergency services aspect. yeah. -so we need to write to the police to er i suppose the thing to do is we write in a general way to the, the chief constable, north wales police +so we need to write to the police to er i suppose the thing to do is we write in a general way to the, the chief constable, north wales police yeah. which is i think in colwyn bay yeah it is. -and but when it comes to actually organising the police control of the survey sites, we, we speak to the erm traffic inspector at wherever it is. -i'm not sure +and but when it comes to actually organising the police control of the survey sites, we, we speak to the erm traffic inspector at wherever it is. +i'm not sure right so who did you say in colwyn bay? -what what +what what just write to the chief constable. i think we need to write three letters. -one to the police, one to the ambulance, one to the fire brigade just saying we're proposing to do them. +one to the police, one to the ambulance, one to the fire brigade just saying we're proposing to do them. obviously that'll have to be when we've fixed the sites yeah. and the dates are on. yeah we'll do this but that's normal. -general letter to the police saying that we're intending to do these surveys, just putting them in the picture and put a note in that erm once, you know, dates and whatever, you know, we'll give you further details as and when we know +general letter to the police saying that we're intending to do these surveys, just putting them in the picture and put a note in that erm once, you know, dates and whatever, you know, we'll give you further details as and when we know well i wouldn't, i don't think i'd worry about writing to them until we've got the dates. oh okay. oh i suppose we've gotta, oh well what did we do last time? @@ -51140,25 +51096,25 @@ i remember the problem was last time sending those little plans out, the ormskir give them the drawing number so we sent a transmittal note, course we never got a transmittal note back. it's best to avoid that. yeah. -erm right well i think the thing to do is, on beyond that is to make sure we work through the checklist. +erm right well i think the thing to do is, on beyond that is to make sure we work through the checklist. okay? -erm now layouts, site layouts. +erm now layouts, site layouts. yeah maps and things. so are you leaving the ball in my court on that? on what? on the statutory undertakers. cos i can probably get some information out of here. -i think i if you want er i mean you're quite happy to draft a letter? +i think i if you want er i mean you're quite happy to draft a letter? yeah. i mean that's a i mean again -standard thing that goes to all of them +standard thing that goes to all of them we need to write them, warn yeah, and we ask them to let us know what they've got planned don't we? yeah. so you could send them a letter with a little diagram that yeah. i wonder how good that is, yes i think that's alright isn't it? -then they wouldn't they'd understand what we, that meant wouldn't they? +then they wouldn't they'd understand what we, that meant wouldn't they? yeah but that's got specific things on . true. yeah well all we did for ormskirk was, it was just an o s map and we just drew a bloody great circle round it @@ -51166,26 +51122,26 @@ and said this is the study area. that's probably the best thing isn't it? yeah. and blow up -an o s and just well within our sites and everything +an o s and just well within our sites and everything but don't give it a drawing number. no. it's just attached to the letter. yes. now you get your, you've got your list of who you want to write to? yeah. -if you check with erm dennis because they're doing all, you know, doing the contract documents, he could confirm all the, the current addresses. +if you check with erm dennis because they're doing all, you know, doing the contract documents, he could confirm all the, the current addresses. okay. that alright? yeah. you're sounding a bit weary . -no that's alright +no that's alright there's no rush about this, i mean er you know, you've got well well there is up to a point because you know how bad they are at responding. yes there is. i mean er what i mean is it needs to be done this week sort of thing. yes. -oh that's okay i'll get all them off . -i'll do a, i'll do a draft letter this afternoon, you can have a look at it, erm we'll knock a plan up and her get the addresses and then that's it's easy then innit? +oh that's okay i'll get all them off . +i'll do a, i'll do a draft letter this afternoon, you can have a look at it, erm we'll knock a plan up and her get the addresses and then that's it's easy then innit? yeah. i wonder if we do want to put it in oh sshh @@ -51195,25 +51151,25 @@ er, yes. sorry about that. no it's alright we're only trying to work somewhere, somewhere quiet. i suddenly thought that on the advert that's gone in -yeah there's a chair here. -on the advert that's gone in i did wonder whether to put please respond by such and such a date? +yeah there's a chair here. +on the advert that's gone in i did wonder whether to put please respond by such and such a date? don't worry about it. you don't think it's necessary? if they don't respond by the date, you know do it quickly yeah. they're not interested. okay. -that's all we did for the statutory undertakers. -dead simple. +that's all we did for the statutory undertakers. +dead simple. just drew them a whacking great circle round it and yeah, good. okay? -so something similar +so something similar excellent. something like that yes. yes. erm -so i'll speak to dennis for er addresses. +so i'll speak to dennis for er addresses. is there a phone number in the ad or just an address? a phone number as well yeah. oh right. @@ -51222,9 +51178,9 @@ you know cos it wastes so much time. your name ? yeah. -but we'll just have a word with anna-lee and if, i think you know, she'll say what's it concerning and if i'm not there well she can put them through to you. +but we'll just have a word with anna-lee and if, i think you know, she'll say what's it concerning and if i'm not there well she can put them through to you. okay. -erm so you say, are we saying that we're gonna leave the police till we've got some dates? +erm so you say, are we saying that we're gonna leave the police till we've got some dates? and the well we know when we're gonna do it don't we? do we? @@ -51234,10 +51190,10 @@ don't we? well we wanna know whether we were gonna try and do them all in that week? twenty seventh of april. monday tuesday thursday. -i think the plan that goes to to the police thank you needs to show the i interview sites on it. +i think the plan that goes to to the police thank you needs to show the i interview sites on it. you remember we had, on the ormskirk one we did one that had a study area on it? yeah. -but we also had one that showed the individual locations. +but we also had one that showed the individual locations. yeah. and i think that was the one that went to the police. right. @@ -51245,33 +51201,33 @@ er and the fire brigade and, and so on. yeah cos they'll want to know. well that's it. yeah. -and all you're doing is warning them that they will, the things will be there and we'll make sure that if a emergency vehicle comes along erm +and all you're doing is warning them that they will, the things will be there and we'll make sure that if a emergency vehicle comes along erm but they will know your precise dates won't they? well they'll want to know precise dates. i can't remember that we did actually. -no i don't know whether we do give them, even the precise dates. -it isn't really much use then is it, just giving them a rough ? +no i don't know whether we do give them, even the precise dates. +it isn't really much use then is it, just giving them a rough ? well it's only a warning. well we'll have a look back in, i'll have a look back in the file and see what we did last time. -erm do you wanna do that, have a look at what we'd said in ormskirk +erm do you wanna do that, have a look at what we'd said in ormskirk yeah. on that side of things? yeah. i think i wrote to them if i remember rightly. well i didn't. -erm now we need to do something about layout plans. -so we need to get some if we're going to work on ordnance survey ones we'll need to sort something on that. -have to have a chat with anyway you're not in an immediate rush to do that are you? +erm now we need to do something about layout plans. +so we need to get some if we're going to work on ordnance survey ones we'll need to sort something on that. +have to have a chat with anyway you're not in an immediate rush to do that are you? no. -the, the yeah. -what have you told only you haven't told gwyllam anything have you? -cos you, what you've told him is did you talk about chapter eight? +the, the yeah. +what have you told only you haven't told gwyllam anything have you? +cos you, what you've told him is did you talk about chapter eight? no. no. -i, i just said to him, when he said we've got these census point ahead i said well we've got certain restrictions, you know, we've certain rules and regulations we've gotta comply with i mean i didn't reel off any of this blah. -but i said oh, are you familiar with setting up roadside interviews and for this type of thing? +i, i just said to him, when he said we've got these census point ahead i said well we've got certain restrictions, you know, we've certain rules and regulations we've gotta comply with i mean i didn't reel off any of this blah. +but i said oh, are you familiar with setting up roadside interviews and for this type of thing? oh yes, we've got such and such a fella out there that does nothing but that out all day long. -and yet they didn't have any signs so i think he's talking through his hat. +and yet they didn't have any signs so i think he's talking through his hat. but what he probably means is that they set up signs for yeah. you know, roadworks and stuff. @@ -51280,13 +51236,13 @@ yeah. so i mean i would have thought they've gotta comply with the same yeah. the same sort of things. -i think the thing is, actually, just thinking about it, there will be a welsh version of this if there is one if you see what i mean? +i think the thing is, actually, just thinking about it, there will be a welsh version of this if there is one if you see what i mean? yeah. -if there isn't one then we, we er er it er oh mind you i suppose there's no hassle to them to put a welsh thingy, anyway i'll look at that. +if there isn't one then we, we er er it er oh mind you i suppose there's no hassle to them to put a welsh thingy, anyway i'll look at that. right, now the other thing is that what jim's doing which is that programme, how is that coming along? yeah. -what i did was i got i went down to the print room and i got a piece of a one paper and i mean if you want to use chris -chris over in chester office, see if, that one would, oh mind you there isn't a chair there is there? +what i did was i got i went down to the print room and i got a piece of a one paper and i mean if you want to use chris +chris over in chester office, see if, that one would, oh mind you there isn't a chair there is there? mind you is jonathan away? there's this chair here. jonathan's not here. @@ -51297,81 +51253,81 @@ so, you know, there's desks around anyway mm that you could use okay. -and erm er that's what i used if you want to borrow that you can. +and erm er that's what i used if you want to borrow that you can. thanks. -and do it in pencil and just, and then we can rub it out +and do it in pencil and just, and then we can rub it out yes. and change things and so on, yeah. well it's easy to change isn't it? -because presumably peter will need to incorporate that in an overall programme. +because presumably peter will need to incorporate that in an overall programme. when we look at the highway side. so it's just the traffic side which i'm dealing with here? yes. cos that's all i'm dealing with. -okay and perhaps erm perhaps you'd also like to l would you like to look at this side of things as well? +okay and perhaps erm perhaps you'd also like to l would you like to look at this side of things as well? incorporate that into it? no, the, the layout plans, do, do some layout plans. oh yeah sure. marty's done them before you see haven't you? yep. -so i'm, i'm just trying to look at the ones for and then we'll go from there. +so i'm, i'm just trying to look at the ones for and then we'll go from there. okay, is that alright? yeah. now, have i given either of you task schedules for this no. stuff? -so i need to do that don't i? -er in fact i never gave telephone call it's no good telling me to do something -task schedules,ooh i'll have to get the form. -okay, so you want a task schedule for doing doing the traffic report? +so i need to do that don't i? +er in fact i never gave telephone call it's no good telling me to do something +task schedules,ooh i'll have to get the form. +okay, so you want a task schedule for doing doing the traffic report? mhm. mm yeah? yeah. and also for doing the programme. yeah? -and you want a task schedule for organizing this, it's a bit unspecific isn't it? +and you want a task schedule for organizing this, it's a bit unspecific isn't it? yeah. okay. -erm how is that then? +erm how is that then? er you happy to leave things as they are for the minute? carry on on that basis? -yeah, the only other thing like when you were saying about site layouts, if there's any maps that we need, and that's including maps for coding, wall maps, you know, large scale. +yeah, the only other thing like when you were saying about site layouts, if there's any maps that we need, and that's including maps for coding, wall maps, you know, large scale. well obviously we've got to progress into that. -we need to prepare some zone plans and gazetteers maybe. +we need to prepare some zone plans and gazetteers maybe. yeah. -erm oh well i'll er the other thing i was thinking of is that er we could be looking er towards beginning, you know even now, to doing a trips network and things like that. -there's no real reason why you, say, shouldn't start to build up the data on that. +erm oh well i'll er the other thing i was thinking of is that er we could be looking er towards beginning, you know even now, to doing a trips network and things like that. +there's no real reason why you, say, shouldn't start to build up the data on that. yeah. -erm y y you know you, you could do a diagram and presumably the person to speak to would be billy or maybe peter cos i think peter did the bulk of the work. +erm y y you know you, you could do a diagram and presumably the person to speak to would be billy or maybe peter cos i think peter did the bulk of the work. okay. beverley did a lot of the actual sort of dogsbody work, you know, the actual doing of it. -erm so you need to build up a picture of what you've got erm but there's no real reason why we shouldn't be working on that now it seems to me. +erm so you need to build up a picture of what you've got erm but there's no real reason why we shouldn't be working on that now it seems to me. er in principle. -yes beginning, you know, we, we know what we're trying to do obviously we don't necessarily know every, every node in the network erm cos obviously once you start doing that, or when we start doing tr the, the journey run things erm we're going to need to know what we're wanting. +yes beginning, you know, we, we know what we're trying to do obviously we don't necessarily know every, every node in the network erm cos obviously once you start doing that, or when we start doing tr the, the journey run things erm we're going to need to know what we're wanting. so there'll be two sides of it c er -well there, there won't be any will there? +well there, there won't be any will there? erm mm. but anyway i mean it's all part of the picture. what i'm getting at is there's no reason why we need, we should wait until after the surveys to start looking at trips. which is what happened on ormskirk. mind you it was partly because we didn't get a programme. -but there's no reason, and on as well. +but there's no reason, and on as well. alright? -right, so me and jim had a chat the other day just looking at the the roadside entries and the counts and i was sort of saying if we work on the basis that we want between ten and twelve people, twelve people maximum +right, so me and jim had a chat the other day just looking at the the roadside entries and the counts and i was sort of saying if we work on the basis that we want between ten and twelve people, twelve people maximum mm. -erm i think we're be able to do all the counts with that number of people including the st david's roundabout and +erm i think we're be able to do all the counts with that number of people including the st david's roundabout and mm. but we do need to clarify exactly what you want on that. -whether you want samples doing cos that's gonna take more people, or whether you're just doing ins and outs and stuff like that. +whether you want samples doing cos that's gonna take more people, or whether you're just doing ins and outs and stuff like that. well and on the other roundabout for that matter. are you off? -yeah i've got a seminar in manchester . +yeah i've got a seminar in manchester . oh right. how did it go? fine. -probably find that traffic percent +probably find that traffic percent we're just talking now this, this is, this is one we're discussing. oh well just south of caernarvon on the first section erm between caernarvon and ? yes. @@ -51379,9 +51335,9 @@ yeah. gwyneth haven't really started on doing any of that work yet. work. and they need to do traffic. -and also they need to confirm the traffic erm turning 099 junction at er i can never pronounce it, beginning with an l. +and also they need to confirm the traffic erm turning 099 junction at er i can never pronounce it, beginning with an l. yeah . -and er maybe count, maybe do their traffic counts out of that as well. +and er maybe count, maybe do their traffic counts out of that as well. so the guy that was in charge of those schemes with gwyneth yeah. was at the meeting or came into the meeting to explain about the schemes. @@ -51389,23 +51345,23 @@ what's his name? erm peter will know. peter's got his name down. -cos that was one of the things we talked about +cos that was one of the things we talked about vernon somebody or other i think his name was. vernon need to contact them. yes, need to do that this week. -but they, this, these, well he's got a copy now of the report and he's gonna c comment back on what +but they, this, these, well he's got a copy now of the report and he's gonna c comment back on what do welsh office want any more bits copies of that? so that's fine, good. erm and they should comment this week about what extra bits they think they could perhaps cover. -so maybe a few more turning counts the census +so maybe a few more turning counts the census mm. right. and that wasn't where i well i haven't been -particularly looking for work from that particular -to know is they raised er the question about the er counts we're doing for the caernarvon link +particularly looking for work from that particular +to know is they raised er the question about the er counts we're doing for the caernarvon link yes. which is part of this study. yes. @@ -51419,12 +51375,12 @@ mm. what about the work for gwyneth? if that's extra what do we charge that to? -that is bypass. +that is bypass. they don't want us to charge it to extra to works? -we could have a two point six seven multiplier +we could have a two point six seven multiplier no. er er er as far as they're concerned any extra work is just an enhancement of the rate to the bypass erm rate, point six two percent. -that was what pointed out. +that was what pointed out. he pointed out? any said we need approval for extra work @@ -51438,22 +51394,22 @@ we're gonna have to put what was paul saying about the wedding then? only said who he invited. i said, i said have you invited aunty joan and them? -he said oh i've invited aunty joan but nobody else cos i didn't fancy any of the others. +he said oh i've invited aunty joan but nobody else cos i didn't fancy any of the others. and has he invited joan to the day do and that? yeah. -but he hasn't invited any to the night . -i think i might have his conscience by saying that i don't mind. -well for what they see i can understand him asking joan and graham erm maybe they've gotta watch how much they're +but he hasn't invited any to the night . +i think i might have his conscience by saying that i don't mind. +well for what they see i can understand him asking joan and graham erm maybe they've gotta watch how much they're i know but an extra four people's not gonna cost that much more is it? shut up. you little sod. the cat? yeah. oh i'm shattered . -why i asked him is because he had a wedding invitation for rob and jen +why i asked him is because he had a wedding invitation for rob and jen yeah. well to be honest i can understand why he's not asking them. -you know they'll make up with friends you know, what family they're not asking won't they? +you know they'll make up with friends you know, what family they're not asking won't they? oh aye. no it's not as if you're all close is it? no. @@ -51462,7 +51418,7 @@ no watch this fool. ram him off the road. oh i had a really good day today. -i didn't go till about half ten ah no cos i had a few letters and stuff to write first and i thought right i'll just take me time and, cos i wanted to i didn't wanna go faster than you know than i should, i should have done sort of thing cos i wanted to time it properly. +i didn't go till about half ten ah no cos i had a few letters and stuff to write first and i thought right i'll just take me time and, cos i wanted to i didn't wanna go faster than you know than i should, i should have done sort of thing cos i wanted to time it properly. erm it took me an hour and a quarter. and it's exactly sixty miles into the middle of caernarvon. so i @@ -51471,21 +51427,21 @@ well no but that's where i had to go. see you can allow a few extra miles for getting oh. to the others. -so you wanna allow yourself a an hour and half really don't you? +so you wanna allow yourself a an hour and half really don't you? do you think, or not? well i don't think so because that, i mean there won't be any traffic hardly no. when i'm going so i'll just allow the same. and then i should do it in an hour. -you know i'll be leaving at about half five. +you know i'll be leaving at about half five. no, not b about quarter past five i'll be leaving, five to quarter past. -that's allowing a a good hour and a quarter. +that's allowing a a good hour and a quarter. but it's not gonna take me longer at that time of the morning than it has done today at eleven o'clock or so is it? -coming home it took me a bit longer cos it was all that delay at the hill. +coming home it took me a bit longer cos it was all that delay at the hill. oh aye that's right i heard it on the radio. yeah oh it's pathetic . oh no the rest of it, it's not too bad, it's not a bad journey, it's quite pleasant really. -so i went straight to the county offices and saw the rooms you know where we're going to +so i went straight to the county offices and saw the rooms you know where we're going to yeah. be doing the coding. dead smart. @@ -51497,63 +51453,63 @@ yeah. they have. like a pin board thing? yeah. -gonna have some of them there's three i think and they're really long ones. -er so i'm gonna have them but she showed me the small room, what they call the small room, well that was huge well it will be perfect for what we want. +gonna have some of them there's three i think and they're really long ones. +er so i'm gonna have them but she showed me the small room, what they call the small room, well that was huge well it will be perfect for what we want. really plush, you know all the carpets mm. and everything? -erm and then she said oh and this is the other one and it was like all er it was bigger again obviously, and all the tables in a square -like a conference type -yeah but each seat ooh excuse me each seat had a microphone built into the desk. +erm and then she said oh and this is the other one and it was like all er it was bigger again obviously, and all the tables in a square +like a conference type +yeah but each seat ooh excuse me each seat had a microphone built into the desk. oh aye? but i thought that'd be more of a hindrance than a help yeah. -for what we were doing so when i got back to the office i rung and i tempor well provisionally booked this, the smallest of the two which i think will be brill. +for what we were doing so when i got back to the office i rung and i tempor well provisionally booked this, the smallest of the two which i think will be brill. so so what did she say about the money when you tried her for less money? or didn't you actually say? well that one you have to ring the head office in bangor, i had to ring her when i got back. -they only er showed me the rooms, they do the bookings and i just said -and it's actually in the like the council offices? +they only er showed me the rooms, they do the bookings and i just said +and it's actually in the like the council offices? yeah. they have all like them chambers there as well you know? -but i just said that it was for the welsh office cos i thought if er they knew it was for a authority you know? +but i just said that it was for the welsh office cos i thought if er they knew it was for a authority you know? yeah. -i said do you, do you think there'd be any discount er with it being a block booking? +i said do you, do you think there'd be any discount er with it being a block booking? and she didn't say no full stop, she said oh she said i'm not sure she said, i'd have to enquire about that. -so i just thought she's gonna yeah if it was out of the question she could have said oh no that's it, there's a flat rate so i +so i just thought she's gonna yeah if it was out of the question she could have said oh no that's it, there's a flat rate so i yeah. -think she's gonna ask -thing is with them welshies they probably haven't tried to bloody they haven't got the sense. +think she's gonna ask +thing is with them welshies they probably haven't tried to bloody they haven't got the sense. no. -if somebody else was trying to book it, one of those welshy types, they haven't got the sense to ask -no, i said well i said that i'd appreciate it cos it's worth a go and she said oh yes i agree with you there. +if somebody else was trying to book it, one of those welshy types, they haven't got the sense to ask +no, i said well i said that i'd appreciate it cos it's worth a go and she said oh yes i agree with you there. which field's min in? not any of these. so that was good. -ooh i can't stop yawning. -so then i thought oh i'll go and find er the offices again, church street. -and we'd gone a roundabout way the last time we were there and i thought oh i'll give it a go, anyway i walked straight down this road, have a look oh yes, turn up here anyway i, i sort of got me bearings and i thought oh yes it's just down here he's in the field just down there. +ooh i can't stop yawning. +so then i thought oh i'll go and find er the offices again, church street. +and we'd gone a roundabout way the last time we were there and i thought oh i'll give it a go, anyway i walked straight down this road, have a look oh yes, turn up here anyway i, i sort of got me bearings and i thought oh yes it's just down here he's in the field just down there. is he? do you wanna go or not or go straight to your nan's? go straight to nan's, call on the way back. if it isn't too late. couldn't see him. -erm so i went straight to this place and there was a fella downstairs, his secretary was erm out on her lunch. -anyway i said oh i said you're not expecting me, said who i was and where i was from. +erm so i went straight to this place and there was a fella downstairs, his secretary was erm out on her lunch. +anyway i said oh i said you're not expecting me, said who i was and where i was from. i said i called in to see either michael or the secretary, mirelda her name is. mm. and er so he said alright. i said i'm also gonna be che cheeky and see if i can use your toi he said oh yes he said, go and help yourself he said there's a kettle down there, make yourself a drink, make yourself at home. -so anyway i thought i won't have a drink cos if this secretary wasn't there i didn't know how long she'd be so er but i di i went upstairs to where we had the meeting with mike the other week. -and erm joe his partner was there so i had a really good chat to him. +so anyway i thought i won't have a drink cos if this secretary wasn't there i didn't know how long she'd be so er but i di i went upstairs to where we had the meeting with mike the other week. +and erm joe his partner was there so i had a really good chat to him. what do you mean his partner like? is it just like a little firm? and this michael's one of the partners in the firm? no there's just them in the office. oh aye. they've merged with us now. -erm so i had a chat to him. +erm so i had a chat to him. he drew me a little plan of how to get to w h smiths and that. what the hell do you wanna go to smiths for? maps. @@ -51572,29 +51528,29 @@ it's just a one to twenty five thousand, a pathfinder. cos i picked up the chester to wrexham one instead of the snowdonia one. caernarvon's on the snowdonia map. ah. -an o s one to fifty thousand and that's what i thought i'd picked up this morning to take with me but when i looked it was chester and wrexham so it didn't do me much good. +an o s one to fifty thousand and that's what i thought i'd picked up this morning to take with me but when i looked it was chester and wrexham so it didn't do me much good. so i thought oh well i'll buy this other one and claim it back off the firm? yes. -three pound ninety something chicken butties and bag of crisps and that, it was nice. -cos i'd parked on the top of this multi-storey car park at the offices, is it called? -erm i parked on the top. +three pound ninety something chicken butties and bag of crisps and that, it was nice. +cos i'd parked on the top of this multi-storey car park at the offices, is it called? +erm i parked on the top. so it wasn't all dark and that mm. cos i wanted to be looking at me plans. and i ate me butty there on top. in the pouring bloody rain and howling wind i expect. -it was, yeah it was horrible . +it was, yeah it was horrible . so then i just had a drive round all the sites. did you find them all alright? yeah. i know where i'm going now with er all of them. -you know and getting to them, i know how to get from one to the other without going, you know? +you know and getting to them, i know how to get from one to the other without going, you know? all round the houses. i've got a good idea of where everywhere is. so i was quite pleased. mm. -when i got back ooh you know i told you about that job? +when i got back ooh you know i told you about that job? we've put a bid in for arrow park. mm. rob thinks we've got it. @@ -51603,14 +51559,14 @@ winning some bloody jobs aren't you. what have they done, dropped their prices? well rob's doing them isn't he? oh they have had to drop their prices. -they've had to go for the we did them a few sort of quotes on the survey side of this arrow park and er we've gotta, you know, really stick to this tight budget because it's the only way you can get them no matter what people are telling you erm about the recession being over, people still want things for nothing. -so this survey might have to be done at the beginning of april. +they've had to go for the we did them a few sort of quotes on the survey side of this arrow park and er we've gotta, you know, really stick to this tight budget because it's the only way you can get them no matter what people are telling you erm about the recession being over, people still want things for nothing. +so this survey might have to be done at the beginning of april. but it's not a big one so well when's these in caernarvon, the end of april? starting the twenty seventh of april. -it's the weekend after 's wedding? +it's the weekend after 's wedding? yeah. -so i shall be enjoying myself at the wedding +so i shall be enjoying myself at the wedding mm. ready for my hard slog. eh? @@ -51618,7 +51574,7 @@ you'll be knackered. i know. er yeah so we'll have this thing at arrow park to do. he's hoping to do that. -we'll looking into doing we need to know how many cars gone in, how many cars go out +we'll looking into doing we need to know how many cars gone in, how many cars go out into the ? of the hospital grounds. but there's residential sections as well. @@ -51627,50 +51583,50 @@ there's two entra entrances you'll have to er take the registration of every bloody car! that's what we are doing. jesus god! -it's probably because they're taking over the er accident and emergency department from clatterbrick it's shutting down and it's all going to arrow park. +it's probably because they're taking over the er accident and emergency department from clatterbrick it's shutting down and it's all going to arrow park. well that's not why we're doing it. well it is. that's what's happening, it was on the radio the other day. -this is just well i mean it maybe connected with that but we're doing it because they want to increase the car parks . -so we're looking to do it with tape recorders on the busiest entrance and you know and just say car d five one four r g m blah blah blah. -get them all down and then the person on the quieter entrance can just write them down. -but you don't necessarily have to say the whole number. +this is just well i mean it maybe connected with that but we're doing it because they want to increase the car parks . +so we're looking to do it with tape recorders on the busiest entrance and you know and just say car d five one four r g m blah blah blah. +get them all down and then the person on the quieter entrance can just write them down. +but you don't necessarily have to say the whole number. you know you can just say d five one four. well that's what you wanna, so much quicker wouldn't it, just say the escort d five one four. -yeah, you don't even have to say the the make. -and then erm they all get punched into the, rob's got a special computer programme thing, you punch them all in er and then it does a ma a matching thing. -and it come, at the end of the day it comes out with all the ones it's matched, the duration it's been there and er makes it a damned sight easier basically. +yeah, you don't even have to say the the make. +and then erm they all get punched into the, rob's got a special computer programme thing, you punch them all in er and then it does a ma a matching thing. +and it come, at the end of the day it comes out with all the ones it's matched, the duration it's been there and er makes it a damned sight easier basically. should be quite good. -then we've got in june we're supposed to be doing journey time surveys and traffic counts on the m sixty three. +then we've got in june we're supposed to be doing journey time surveys and traffic counts on the m sixty three. i won't get off at this one, no? no. -i'll get off at the +i'll get off at the erm now they're talking of doing roadside interviews in both directions on the motorway on the slip roads. be a big job that will. yeah. so i hope it comes off. loads of money , you'll be minted. yeah. -it's about time we got something, don't, you know for months we scratched round looking like we're busy, now we're meeting ourselves backwards, coming backwards. +it's about time we got something, don't, you know for months we scratched round looking like we're busy, now we're meeting ourselves backwards, coming backwards. better that way though innit? -days go +days go yep. but i mean i'm already starting stopping later, unintentionally you know, just cos i wanna finish something. here i turn now do i? yeah. -well that this is the bloody supermarket. +well that this is the bloody supermarket. well where was the turning? i've never course you do. i don't. yes you do. -er yeah i've already got over thirty hours credit. +er yeah i've already got over thirty hours credit. and you're not supposed to have more than thirty even though mike's got about a hundred and three. mm. how the hell he's wangled it, honest to god! well he must be fiddling it cos he, he's never bloody worked it. no. -so erm and i, i can't just take a flexi-day because i'm already, i've already got leave to use. +so erm and i, i can't just take a flexi-day because i'm already, i've already got leave to use. so i'm gonna see how i get on an if i keep doing it i'm just gonna get it as overtime. what are you having? fish and chips? @@ -51683,8 +51639,8 @@ are we late? yep. the chips . yeah. -cooeee -cooeee +cooeee +cooeee she's probably asleep. probably. sorry! @@ -51692,21 +51648,21 @@ couldn't hear you. ooh how are you? i couldn't hear you shout. -i know, i couldn't long time getting -well i was allowing you time with your leg but we thought you've got the telly on loud. +i know, i couldn't long time getting +well i was allowing you time with your leg but we thought you've got the telly on loud. oh aye i have really, yes have you? -we've been in chinky we've brought our tea. +we've been in chinky we've brought our tea. we've brought our tea. we've been to the chippy, we haven't had any tea yet. haven't you? so can we eat them here please ? yeah. -right you take them in there the table. +right you take them in there the table. yeah we can do, saves stinking out in here. you'd better put something on it. yeah. -oh there's nothing to +oh there's nothing to i'll not ask you in there with the table because there wasn't enough room. the what? there's a little table there, a little folding table there. @@ -51717,7 +51673,7 @@ yeah. ? oh aye. no i'm alright there. -go on go and sit on +go on go and sit on no i'm grand. no you wanna rest your leg. ooh don't matter about resting me r about resting me leg. @@ -51739,12 +51695,12 @@ go cut you some bread? i'm alright, i d i want a butty thank you. michael how, how many rounds do you want? oh just one ta. -it's er who erm wholemeal. +it's er who erm wholemeal. aye, just one thanks. only one? yep... so they'd better be nice seeing as we've been all the way -just get me the marge out of there +just get me the marge out of there to . yeah, there it is, vitalite. vitalite. @@ -51760,11 +51716,11 @@ has it gone a bit easier for you? what? what do you want? what do you want? -er just do you want one or two? +er just do you want one or two? one. please. two. -just just one. +just just one. one. yeah. i don't want one thank you. @@ -51772,21 +51728,21 @@ you know where the salt and vinegar is don't you? oh aye. it's already on them thanks. there's plenty on them, they're alright. -oh there in er in the cupboard there. +oh there in er in the cupboard there. is your nan okay? do you want a few chips on a plate nan? no thanks i've only are you sure? -i've only just got just had a big dinner love. +i've only just got just had a big dinner love. have you? what have you had? -i had a la lamb chop cabbage +i had a la lamb chop cabbage ooh. -roast potatoes rhubarb, stewed rhubarb, ron's stewed rhubarb. +roast potatoes rhubarb, stewed rhubarb, ron's stewed rhubarb. lovely. and cream. nothing like looking after yourself. -oh it was very nice and it's his first rhubarb. +oh it was very nice and it's his first rhubarb. mm. me mum give your mum a cou just a couple of sticks. @@ -51809,10 +51765,10 @@ thank you. what did you say? i said there was no need to have got him a plate. spoiling him, he doesn't have a plate at home for his bread and butter. -well y your dad likes a lot of a out of the paper, i dunno. +well y your dad likes a lot of a out of the paper, i dunno. it ta tastes nicer out of a paper. oh they do. -if i, if i'm out yes, i li i like them in a pa in a, in a paper, you know, but er i've got no cake to offer you, i can't some biscuits. +if i, if i'm out yes, i li i like them in a pa in a, in a paper, you know, but er i've got no cake to offer you, i can't some biscuits. no, i'll be alright after this. no ta. alright with this thanks. @@ -51823,18 +51779,18 @@ no. no. oh well if you haven't had chi or haven't done for a long time you enjoy them. i er you do. -nan you'll love why don't you go back and watch your programme and have a sit down and we won't be two ticks eating these. -your mum had a what did she have? +nan you'll love why don't you go back and watch your programme and have a sit down and we won't be two ticks eating these. +your mum had a what did she have? oh she'd been up to pearks mm? -she bought a steak and kidney pie now then, no she didn't have chips steak and kidney pie and some er couple of iced buns, she bought me a, an ordinary pie. +she bought a steak and kidney pie now then, no she didn't have chips steak and kidney pie and some er couple of iced buns, she bought me a, an ordinary pie. oh yeah? so i had that at dinner time. mm. oh me mum's been here today? -and she called she did ask the girl for er two er cream doughnuts +and she called she did ask the girl for er two er cream doughnuts yeah? -and she, she's a new girl, your mum said +and she, she's a new girl, your mum said hmm and she gave her iced buns. oh! @@ -51844,40 +51800,40 @@ they were nice. little devils. oh. me mum's been here today has she? -yeah, she come about half past twelve? +yeah, she come about half past twelve? oh she said yesterday she might call. half past twelve. mm. -and she went from here about er well she said she was going at quarter past two. -i said it is quarter past two if you i'm not pushing you off but you've got to be somewhere on time. +and she went from here about er well she said she was going at quarter past two. +i said it is quarter past two if you i'm not pushing you off but you've got to be somewhere on time. yeah. -have a we had a bit of a chat +have a we had a bit of a chat good. -and er she went sort of thing. +and er she went sort of thing. mhm. so i always take my dinner in there. well aye, might as well have a bit of comfort. -and and then i come back in here, i always get my sweet and take that back again. +and and then i come back in here, i always get my sweet and take that back again. i watch blockbusters -oh yes, we had ab er well while you were in the shower. +oh yes, we had ab er well while you were in the shower. and then i always stop and watch the news. -so i come er come in here after and er washed up +so i come er come in here after and er washed up mhm. and i'd just peeled an orange to be honest i just fancied an orange, i thought oh here you are and i'd just that very minute sat down. -why don't you go and sit down again and we'll come in as soon as we've finished these. +why don't you go and sit down again and we'll come in as soon as we've finished these. oh aye. so you can rest your leg. are you sure you don't want any biscuits only i haven't any ? no we're alright thanks. thanks. i'm fine. -i'll be too full up -not i am without cake but irene brought me some small ones yesterday +i'll be too full up +not i am without cake but irene brought me some small ones yesterday mhm. -and i've only just finished our, our christmas er bun loaf sort of thing, you know +and i've only just finished our, our christmas er bun loaf sort of thing, you know have you? anyhow no this is fine. @@ -51889,7 +51845,7 @@ are you having one anyway nan? yes, there's the water in the kettle and everything in. well o i'll, if you put it to boil okay. -they're nicer than our chips. +they're nicer than our chips. do you want tea bags or loose tea? anything. whatever's easiest. @@ -51904,12 +51860,12 @@ are they? oh aye, we'll be coming here again. your dad always likes them from here. yeah. -oh they're your mum and dad now aren't they? +oh they're your mum and dad now aren't they? yeah. got nowhere local for chips. oh lovely, thank you. smashing. -you get a good one thirty, that's not bad is it that? +you get a good one thirty, that's not bad is it that? now then i'm going to leave you to it. okay, we'll be through in a minute. i'll just go and finish my orange. @@ -51925,10 +51881,10 @@ the chips are fifty. mm. oh, think he's charged . or does three sixty sound more like it? -erm three sixty that would be one eighty. +erm three sixty that would be one eighty. mm. yeah maybe it was three sixty. -get pots of tea ? +get pots of tea ? is your nan having any? she must be having one, put them straight in the cups. they're one cup things . @@ -51936,7 +51892,7 @@ she must have made one. how ? didn't she? yep. -ooh come on. +ooh come on. struggling a bit now. do you want any more chips? aye. @@ -51983,7 +51939,7 @@ it's on the chair. go on. oh? oh erm who is he? -he was in that erm what was it called? +he was in that erm what was it called? alan bleasdale, you know that fella that did boys from the black stuff oh aye? erm he was in one of his plays. @@ -51993,13 +51949,13 @@ i thought it was the fella that had the nervous twitch. is it? oh aye of course it is yeah. what was it called? -erm ooh i can't remember what it's called. +erm ooh i can't remember what it's called. i don't know any he's been in a few things. oh is this the new robert lindsey his name isn't it? i mean it's crazy. -erm i think i don't know that it's so much class, i think it's just this image of girls do this and or women do that and men do the other. +erm i think i don't know that it's so much class, i think it's just this image of girls do this and or women do that and men do the other. well and also i'd like to throw in my, my views of these people who advise young children on their careers. i think that basically it's a bunch of hocus pocus. erm barbara bryant. yes, can i bring this argument a bit closer to home and talk about the sexual division of labour within the family, which i think is one of the underlying causes of discrimination against women, and that's really just a fancy term for the fact that when we talk about child care women do most of the work and men do very little, and really i don't think we can look at the position of women without looking at how, in fact, child care and caring is organized within the family. @@ -52015,7 +51971,7 @@ no, i think you're into victim blaming. let's look at the position of women once they actually get into the child care role and certainly the position of poor women erm the man is then the wage earner, the women then is relatively powerless. the man has more economic power, more physical power, a higher status. the only influence really the woman might have is in the love and affection level of operating, and it's a very unfair power battle and that is, in fact, what it turns into. -at least in what other poorer women were telling me, when it came to after work and weekends the men were quite the women were prepared to look after the children and felt it was their role to look after the children while the man was at work; when the man came back he continued to feel that the woman should look after the children erm for the rest of the time, and the idea of a shared child care arrangement did not operate in at least a number of the families that i talked to and had been one of the causes of the breakdown of the marriage and one of the precipitating factors in the man physically abusing the woman. +at least in what other poorer women were telling me, when it came to after work and weekends the men were quite the women were prepared to look after the children and felt it was their role to look after the children while the man was at work; when the man came back he continued to feel that the woman should look after the children erm for the rest of the time, and the idea of a shared child care arrangement did not operate in at least a number of the families that i talked to and had been one of the causes of the breakdown of the marriage and one of the precipitating factors in the man physically abusing the woman. but why, why do the women accept that role of having no power? do you think that that's just the way things are and they can't change it and society gives me more economic power and he has more natural strength, so this is an on-going battle that won't change very much? i mean how do @@ -52034,7 +51990,7 @@ that's what you've indicated, so how do people claw back the bad position that t well, as is with everything when you're talking about changing things, women really have to get themselves organized , nobody's going to give it to them. ah, yes, erm you're getting very close to victim blaming here. you're suggesting that they've been disorganized? -no, i'm i was suggesting that the odds are against them and that men have used a type of emotional blackmail against women, which has always been very successful, where they're actually forced, because there are no things like cheap or free workplace nurseries, they are forced to be the primary carers. +no, i'm i was suggesting that the odds are against them and that men have used a type of emotional blackmail against women, which has always been very successful, where they're actually forced, because there are no things like cheap or free workplace nurseries, they are forced to be the primary carers. women are faced with an impossible situation, when if the man refuses to do the child care at the weekend and walks out, what do they do? do they also leave their children? women are faced with making a choice between the needs of their children and their own needs, and that is one of the things which, because they've put the needs of their children, the needs of their dependents, ahead of their own needs, they themselves and the needs of women have not got as far as they could. @@ -52044,7 +52000,7 @@ and if she were to approach her husband on that basis, that's a lever of power, the result of an unequal balance of power is where i went back to, is the precipitating factor in marital violence which is, you know, some surveys put as high as one in four families, is in fact when the woman becomes uppity. define uppity. uppity is when she no longer agrees with the man's definition of her appropriate role within the family. -but who you see at the very beginning they must have established what the roles were. +but who you see at the very beginning they must have established what the roles were. no, society establishes the rules. the families are within that structure, where it is accepted that it is the man who goes out to work. whether in fact there are disadvantages for some men, whether in fact it's very unusual for women to be the primary bread winner, when the man becomes the primary bread winner then the man holds the economic power. @@ -52054,16 +52010,16 @@ there is no equivalent to the invalid care allowance which is given to the perso it's a pretty bleak picture that you're painting right now. theresa smith, how will we change it? well i'd like to go back to the sorts of things that barbara bryant has been talking about. -if you talk to women in the sort of project where she's working, i think you do get a very strong picture of people who have very little confidence in themselves and certainly think that education is not for them, and if you then look at projects like second chance for women, there's a range of access projects, particularly for for people who want to get back into education when they think that they've had precious little chance to get anything out of education when they were at school themselves. +if you talk to women in the sort of project where she's working, i think you do get a very strong picture of people who have very little confidence in themselves and certainly think that education is not for them, and if you then look at projects like second chance for women, there's a range of access projects, particularly for for people who want to get back into education when they think that they've had precious little chance to get anything out of education when they were at school themselves. the sorts of experiences that you then get people talking about is really well i've learnt to stand up for myself for the first time, erm i now know what i want to do, i know who i am, erm projects where i've been involved, where you get women saying things like well two years ago i would never have dreamt of going and talking to the council about my house, or my children, or that i can't get a job because i can't get child care, and i wouldn't have dreamt of doing that and people who now say well now i can do that, i know that i can go and stand up for myself and stand up for what i think is right, just as well as my husband can. it's that sort of change that i think is extremely significant, and i think it happens for women very much at that stage, when they have been through those sorts of experiences themselves, so one way in which i think that we can change things is — and help people to change things for themselves — is very much to support and develop those kinds of second change erm access, returning to education, returning to work, type projects as very much part of mainstream education and employment, and i would like to see a much greater range of those sorts of projects available for people and erm a lot more government resources into supporting that kind of provision. all right, but you're sitting there on the nursery provision for under five's working party, you chaired that committee meeting yesterday. no, i didn't, i'm only one of the spokespeople. -sorry, information was wrong there, but nevertheless you're near the top of the tree in trying to help get more nursery places in the county and you know that you're being you may have the best intentions, but you don't have the facilities to do very much about it. +sorry, information was wrong there, but nevertheless you're near the top of the tree in trying to help get more nursery places in the county and you know that you're being you may have the best intentions, but you don't have the facilities to do very much about it. things aren't going to happen from the government so much. maybe people have to look at alternatives and non-governmental ways to change things. any suggestions there? -yes, i think that well non-government ways, i certainly thing that we should be continuing and i think ordinary people should be continuing, as indeed they are. +yes, i think that well non-government ways, i certainly thing that we should be continuing and i think ordinary people should be continuing, as indeed they are. if you talk to people in the street the majority of people who have young children are certainly saying we need day care, we need opportunities for ourselves erm and are quite prepared, some of them at any rate, to go and say that to their local councillors and to write to their m ps. and that's perfectly clear. if you're talking about non-government ways to do it, then i think that in any authority there are lot of voluntary organizations struggling to make provision of this kind. @@ -52079,7 +52035,7 @@ yes. it was just a quickie, i just wanted to read this little point that i actually think brings lots of what you've been discussing about together, and it's a light hearted, but it does have some relevance if i can just say it. because women's work is never done, and underpaid, or unpaid, or boring or repetitious and we're the first to get the sack, and what we look like is more important than what we do, and if we get raped it's our fault, and if we get bashed we must have provoked it, if we raise our voices we're nagging bitches, and if we enjoy sex we're nymphs and if we don't we're frigid, and if we love women it's because we can't get a real man, and if we ask our doctor too many questions we're neurotic and if we expect the community to care for our children we're selfish, and if we stand up for our rights we're aggressive and unfeminine, and if we don't we're typical weak females, and if we want to get married we're out to trap a man, and if we don't we're unnatural, and because we can't get adequate safe contraceptives, but men can walk on the moon, and we can't cope or don't want a pregnancy we're made to feel guilty about abortion, and for lots and lots of other reasons we're all part of the women's liberation movement. audrey, thanks very much. -sorry, but all together. +sorry, but all together. quite wonderful. thank you. we've talked about the women's movement so far. @@ -52118,7 +52074,7 @@ yes, but how would you want men to change. would you want them to be able to express their emotions more intensely and precisely, able to show how they feel? would you like them to be more capable of looking after children. what is it that you're looking for in terms of change for men? -that's a i think there's a different different aspects. +that's a i think there's a different different aspects. the way people express emotion is not simply a gender, it's not simply about how men and women behave, it's have how erm people behave in different parts of this country, or between england, say, and france. oh, so you don't think there's any distinction no, i didn't say that. @@ -52126,25 +52082,25 @@ in emotional expression between men and women. no, no, i didn't say that. what i did say is that there are differences in emotional expression between people in different countries, just as much as yes. -there are between between genders. -i would certainly i would certainly hope that men would become much less erm nervous and ashamed about expressing emotion erm and i would certainly hope that erm men learn as much as women do about erm how to look after children and how to bring them up, and i think there's some evidence that that actually is happening. +there are between between genders. +i would certainly i would certainly hope that men would become much less erm nervous and ashamed about expressing emotion erm and i would certainly hope that erm men learn as much as women do about erm how to look after children and how to bring them up, and i think there's some evidence that that actually is happening. so if you are asking me what i would like to happen, i would certainly like that to be the case. -i think how you do it is very is a very different matter, particularly when you still have very many schools, for example, who erm take the registers — going back to basic things. +i think how you do it is very is a very different matter, particularly when you still have very many schools, for example, who erm take the registers — going back to basic things. look at schools in this city. there are still schools which take registers separately, the boys and the girls separately, or who have pink library book cards for girls and blue library book cards for boys. this sort of thing. -now that's that's unthinking, but if that is happening in our education system, then i think there are real questions about how we change. +now that's that's unthinking, but if that is happening in our education system, then i think there are real questions about how we change. so i think it'll be slow. mhm. ann mobbs, what is it that you would like to see in terms of change for men? well i think a lot of women are looking for an equal partnership really erm where the rules are laid down and they know where they stand, you know. the rules laid down by whom? well i think by men and women. -i think i think it's quite important that there is an equal partnership. +i think i think it's quite important that there is an equal partnership. i mean i have to say for myself, i mean i was married. -erm enjoy living on my own, and i wouldn't really want to enter into another what i felt was a very oppressive relationship really erm because erm i don't think there are very many men who do think in terms of equality within erm within erm partnerships and within relationships within marriages. -i brenda thornton, do you think it's that bleak? -yes, i think i think it is. +erm enjoy living on my own, and i wouldn't really want to enter into another what i felt was a very oppressive relationship really erm because erm i don't think there are very many men who do think in terms of equality within erm within erm partnerships and within relationships within marriages. +i brenda thornton, do you think it's that bleak? +yes, i think i think it is. i think it is really because i think what we've got to do, if we are going to have any sort of partnership or equality, i think men have got to become more like women. i think they've got to become less competitive, less arrogant and less dominant, seeing that as the macho role, and i think they've got to become erm much more erm feminine and approve the feminine characteristics, so that there isn't so much difference between the two genders, and particularly in marriage and in the home. but something i would like to say, which no-one has touched on at all; we've all been talking about the laws that affect women and equal opportunities, and no-one has mentioned anything about the horrendous hours that are worked in parliament making it not impossible, but extremely difficult for women to become politicians working in parliament to be the people who make the laws, to be the people who can actually affect women's roles in society erm everyone seems to accept the fact that our own parliament, totally dominated by men, and the sort of hours that only men can work, making it extremely difficult for women. @@ -52163,9 +52119,9 @@ because it's a feminine trait that women are, on the whole, far erm less easily erm and well barbara's shaking her head again . she disagrees with everything you've said on this programme. -yes, i mean, i feel very strongly in terms of women's rights, but i think there are obviously a lot of differences between women and you can't generalize women, the same as you can't generalize individual personalities traits on for men. +yes, i mean, i feel very strongly in terms of women's rights, but i think there are obviously a lot of differences between women and you can't generalize women, the same as you can't generalize individual personalities traits on for men. i mean gender is one issue, but it's not the only one, and one of the ones that it seems to me that we've missed out on erm to date, when we're talking about international women's day, is race. -i mean we've talked only about about women; we've maybe touched on class, and we've not even mentioned the position of black women and the extra discrimination that they face in our society, and in other societies. +i mean we've talked only about about women; we've maybe touched on class, and we've not even mentioned the position of black women and the extra discrimination that they face in our society, and in other societies. erm i well how would you characterize that discrimination as extra? what's the extra dimension? @@ -52184,7 +52140,7 @@ they're the sort of women who are needed to make the real changes. ann mobbs, why aren't women much more angry than they appear to be? or maybe i'm misreading them; maybe they are; maybe they're about to boil over. i think a lot of women are very angry about erm the way they're treated by society really erm but it's interesting, isn't it, that the kind of erm jobs that erm women have? -i mean with this exhibition that we've booked ‘just the job’, which is black women erm and the kind of jobs that they've got, a large percentage are carers and erm and it is the thing that erm women feel that they can do and it erm in a way that it comes out of their role in the home, the caring role, and erm and it's a role that they get sort of erm trapped into and it doesn't pay very much money, as brenda was saying earlier. +i mean with this exhibition that we've booked ‘just the job’, which is black women erm and the kind of jobs that they've got, a large percentage are carers and erm and it is the thing that erm women feel that they can do and it erm in a way that it comes out of their role in the home, the caring role, and erm and it's a role that they get sort of erm trapped into and it doesn't pay very much money, as brenda was saying earlier. mhm. and one of the reasons why the black women in liverpool put this exhibition together erm and they tried to pick out different kinds of jobs that women had to show that black women could do those jobs, and they were saying look, there's lots of stereotypes erm about the kinds of jobs that black and asian women can do that fit in with their personalities, and you know the world is wide open and you are able to do this and you don't have to be erm a singer or a model or erm or erm erm a runner, you know, the whole stereotypes in terms of what black people are good at and they're saying let's break away from this, let's show the kinds of things that we can do and we can do anything that we set our minds to and erm the exhibition is very positive, actually. it's very nice. @@ -52194,19 +52150,19 @@ theresa smith. what will be different this time next year? well erm if i'm crystal ball gazing, i would hope that all the women in this country, whatever their colour and whatever their class, would have access to first-class provision for their young children, so that if they wished to work they could actually work in jobs that paid them enough and gave them job satisfaction. currently that's true for very few women. -i would hope that's a hope i would hope that enough women who wanted to could actually be in parliament if that's what they wanted, could be runners, could be models. +i would hope that's a hope i would hope that enough women who wanted to could actually be in parliament if that's what they wanted, could be runners, could be models. i would hope that this government would actually be recognising those sorts of aspirations. your question about why aren't women angry — maybe people don't express anger until they can see that there is some point in being angry and that being angry actually helps you to change things. maybe that's what i would say by this time next year. maybe we ought to hope that more people will be angry in ways that actually mean that we can change things. do you believe that women feel more empowered or less empowered now than they did last year? i think that's a very difficult question. -erm the women that i talk to in groups up and down this county, i think some are angrier than they were, some are feel more empowered erm if they have if they've had these sorts of experiences that i was talking about earlier. +erm the women that i talk to in groups up and down this county, i think some are angrier than they were, some are feel more empowered erm if they have if they've had these sorts of experiences that i was talking about earlier. talking in leicester this week and last week to groups of black women, some black women are saying i have never thought before about being able to talk about what i am and making up my own mind. i think when i meet — and maybe would count them not in hundreds, but in tens — when i meet women who make those sorts of comments and say this time last year i would not have said that, then those sorts of things encourage me very much. ann mobbs, which way do you think the pendulum's swinging. next year, what do you think will have changed; not what you hope will have changed, but what do you see as practical? -i don't think there's going to be any dramatic changes at all really. +i don't think there's going to be any dramatic changes at all really. i don't think life is like that. i mean unless we had erm a change of government, say, and we had a women's ministry where someone was putting a lot of thought into the role of women in our society, and what one could do to improve the position for women, but we haven't got a government that's thinking in those kinds of ways. mhm. @@ -52219,14 +52175,13 @@ because the two men were the chairmen and all the women had all the lower positi now, no, erm if there isn't a ministry for women, and if there isn't a government change i don't think that's a bad thing. and barbara bryan, next year what will be on the cards? i think much the same as is on the cards this year, that women are angry, in my view, erm women are proud of what they're doing. -some women, and hopefully more women, will turn that into political action — whether that's demanding a playgroup for or whether it's demanding that their political leaders were mainly male, pay more attention to women. +some women, and hopefully more women, will turn that into political action — whether that's demanding a playgroup for or whether it's demanding that their political leaders were mainly male, pay more attention to women. they have to keep fighting. well, many thanks indeed for fighting for the last hour on this programme. thanks to ann mobbs and to theresa smith, to brenda thornton and to barbara bryan. that's it from me, bill heine. thanks for joining us. goodbye. - kelly. you are once again doing it completely and utterly wrong. at the wrong place again. @@ -52240,12 +52195,12 @@ what else have you been doing wrong kelly? . you've been using a brush instead of a spatula for spreading glue. the spatula . right. -now i hope that only kelly has been doing things as desperately wrong as kelly has been doing them. -looking around at all the there are a whole lot of people who have left the same even border all the way round instead of having an even border top and sides and leaving a bigger border at the bottom. +now i hope that only kelly has been doing things as desperately wrong as kelly has been doing them. +looking around at all the there are a whole lot of people who have left the same even border all the way round instead of having an even border top and sides and leaving a bigger border at the bottom. which you'll remember you were told to do so that there's a space for your name. sarah stand up and come over here. sam, will you stop doing that please my love and come across here so that you two don't . -i'm using a white colour pencil here in order to draw a line from to the work that is being mounted on here. +i'm using a white colour pencil here in order to draw a line from to the work that is being mounted on here. and you might say that the word has not been mounted on there. no it hasn't because we . can you see what i'm doing without me having to ? @@ -52253,23 +52208,23 @@ or are you baffled by what you see? ? mm? no. -it's a demonstration and the, the line itself is like framed within a frame. -and i should imagine that the light paper's the backing paper and that i've already glued my work on the paper and my my picture is already glued just there. +it's a demonstration and the, the line itself is like framed within a frame. +and i should imagine that the light paper's the backing paper and that i've already glued my work on the paper and my my picture is already glued just there. can i have my sellotape back? and i'm now drawing sorry. -a white line about half a centimetre from the edge of the work being put on. -right this is a decorative line round the sides of . +a white line about half a centimetre from the edge of the work being put on. +right this is a decorative line round the sides of . does that make sense? just a white line. now you can make that look even smarter by making a second white line on the outside. -and then moving the erm ruler slightly away from the border for the second line over the top of it which makes it thicker. +and then moving the erm ruler slightly away from the border for the second line over the top of it which makes it thicker. so you've got a thin white line on the inside and a thicker white line on the outside. that's point one. -point two is this, that i made the bottom border there er about be exactly five centimetres. -and i'm going to put a guide line which is one erm er half a centimetre from the side there . +point two is this, that i made the bottom border there er about be exactly five centimetres. +and i'm going to put a guide line which is one erm er half a centimetre from the side there . yes christine, can i help you? -i've put two very faint white lines there in white. +i've put two very faint white lines there in white. you could use ordinary pencil, are you alright bruce? have you lost something? aye i was just @@ -52279,18 +52234,17 @@ jane? j a y n ? yeah. -so imagine you were writing jayne here j now it's a very long name, jayne and you have to put the title on there too, so i couldn't put it all in capital letters on this occasion could i? -probably that was a little bit on the, the large side anyway so i would use lower case as well on this one, a bit like, a bit like junior school writing. +so imagine you were writing jayne here j now it's a very long name, jayne and you have to put the title on there too, so i couldn't put it all in capital letters on this occasion could i? +probably that was a little bit on the, the large side anyway so i would use lower case as well on this one, a bit like, a bit like junior school writing. do you know what i mean? then it'll fit on very easily. you have to use your common sense. but you can see how a white pencil on that paper, that's going to look quite smart. without, without the picture. -so that's the next stage. +so that's the next stage. go. - can i start by asking your name? -well my name is er mr laurence er o of the treasurer of the in edinburgh area. +well my name is er mr laurence er o of the treasurer of the in edinburgh area. and erm what was your date of birth? my date of birth was the thirty first of the, of the seventh, o nine. which makes me now approximately seventy six years of age. @@ -52339,7 +52293,7 @@ and in those days we required the money and er often, very often we had to do it do a double shift. which meant you come home from your double er shift, went to your bed, had about four hours sleep and were back out for your normal shift again. was you erm in a union or anything at all at this time? -yes, the miners' union then was just wasn't that that was started was . +yes, the miners' union then was just wasn't that that was started was . in fact there's, very near the start of the unions in and o er that, that the miners' union was one of the first to start up. do you think it gave you erm any advantages being in a union? y oh yes it gave us advantage to the extent that we'd someone b behind us to fight for any, any er grievances that we had. @@ -52358,9 +52312,9 @@ mhm. that we wouldn't be stepped upon. were you involved in er any strikes or anything? yes, i was involved in the nineteen twenty six strike. -and in nineteen twenty er strike going at the present day there was what we called the soup kitchens. +and in nineteen twenty er strike going at the present day there was what we called the soup kitchens. and every local village where there was a mine had these soup kitchens. -i do not forget the other unions which were going at that present time helped us out quite a bit. +i do not forget the other unions which were going at that present time helped us out quite a bit. though we los we actually lost the strike through no fault of our own. there was just because there wasn't enough money within all unions, not forget that there wasn't such a thing as a t u c then, this was in at the infancy when the unions first started, there wasn't such as a t u c, trades unions congress. these were er in, in its infancy then and er we had a soup kitchen and er we, we got soup once a day, when we got issued with it. @@ -52371,43 +52325,43 @@ where we used to b boil the water. and the soup was made in these boilers, and they were issued with their soup then. and that was all we got. what was it erm started the strike in the first place? -well they started the strike as muddled as as some greens come up and the men as union thought that was not right. +well they started the strike as muddled as as some greens come up and the men as union thought that was not right. not forgetting in that most of the mines then, at that particular time, were nearly all privately owned. mhm. were nearly all privately owned. were nearly all privately owned. most, right across the length and breadth of great britain, were all privately owned. -which the present administration of central government are doing their best to, under the same hammer as it was in those days, so it's just, this is just a repeat performance of the those days and the government today. +which the present administration of central government are doing their best to, under the same hammer as it was in those days, so it's just, this is just a repeat performance of the those days and the government today. was what it erm finally brought about the end of the strike in twenty six? pardon? what was it finally brought about the end of the strike in nineteen twenty six? -well it were just like i like i the unions weren't as, as er financially well off as they were er at the present day. +well it were just like i like i the unions weren't as, as er financially well off as they were er at the present day. there was not the money, we were forced to. -as i say the present day er premier just now is actually trying to do the same thing as a repeat performance +as i say the present day er premier just now is actually trying to do the same thing as a repeat performance so sort of erm what was, was there erm any victimizations or anything like that, from the bosses when you went back to work? oh immediately there was a victimization in the pit,o the pit was out. mm. it was er taken there . the grievance was taken to the union, the union just say er told the steward who belonged to that particular pit there, right, just call the men out, that's it. -s so erm did presumably are quite strong like that then? +s so erm did presumably are quite strong like that then? oh oh yes oh yes it was one of the be it still is one of the best unions. -still is one of the best for sticking +still is one of the best for sticking mm. was there erm i've forgotten what i was going ask you. er mm were there erm many strikes at the time? oh no, oh no, oh there were all v very few and far be there may have been local strikes but, such as one day er a grievance been put in and the men struck work just for it. -but immediately the get a result. +but immediately the get a result. so all our lads are more or less, that was lightning strikes and finish off. mm. one day and it was finished you know? -because that would union, you see? +because that would union, you see? did you work in the pits for a long time? i was five years in the pits. mhm. -er eh in er in lanarkshire and motherwell, and er at that time, being a young lad no more between er f er fourteen and twenty, i realized then that wasn't going to be a life for me. +er eh in er in lanarkshire and motherwell, and er at that time, being a young lad no more between er f er fourteen and twenty, i realized then that wasn't going to be a life for me. so i then decided that i would join the army. now i joined the army. -i served my time in both india, palestine, gibraltar, egypt and these sort of places abroad and when i, i nine months of my colour service to finish, which were a twelve year service,when war broke out in nineteen thirty nine. +i served my time in both india, palestine, gibraltar, egypt and these sort of places abroad and when i, i nine months of my colour service to finish, which were a twelve year service,when war broke out in nineteen thirty nine. i then went er across to france with the b e f. was in france about nine months approximately when the big invasion started in poland and through france. i was taken prisoner of war at saint valerie for a few of my friends in from edinburgh who were taken prisoner of war. i was taken to a main camp called lamstor camp in er polish er german border. @@ -52421,35 +52375,35 @@ yes. oh yes. we were used as miners, yes. how did the pay and the conditions and such like in the army compare with erm being in the mines? -er the, the money, the money that i money difference wasn't great but the fact was er who you were thinking about er when you did come out. +er the, the money, the money that i money difference wasn't great but the fact was er who you were thinking about er when you did come out. you had a lot of, a lot of qualifications which you could get in the army in those days that you didn't have when you were in civil life. for instance you could learn to be a, a motor driver, you could learned to be an electrician, you could learn to be an engineer, you could learn to be anything. -and you through these courses and you got a certificate when you come out which er some of the said to us, a fully qualified member of a, so these advantages were open to us then you see? +and you through these courses and you got a certificate when you come out which er some of the said to us, a fully qualified member of a, so these advantages were open to us then you see? mm. so this was the, the main incentive for joining the army then? pardon? was that the main incentive for joining the army? knowing that you gain qualifications? -well my that was my incentive the mines. +well my that was my incentive the mines. yeah. -but as i've already told you just, it was very ironical that i should l go back down the hole in er germany again . +but as i've already told you just, it was very ironical that i should l go back down the hole in er germany again . were the conditions worse in the, in the german mines? in the ? -oh no, i the mine, the mines in germany at that time were far advanced of what er britain's mines were. +oh no, i the mine, the mines in germany at that time were far advanced of what er britain's mines were. cos they had different methods of doing the, digging the coal out, than they h than they had in britain. and i believe . although i've not been down a mine since then, er the german mines to my er estimation were far more advanced than what the british mines were. were you made to work hard harder being a prisoner of war? no harder than we did in britain. you could not, no, a miner once he's been a miner, cannot go down er a pit and say to anyone down a pit, and say to anyone down a pit, that he's not a miner. -because he gives his right away. -the experience he has gained in the mines at immediately a man g a man who has been in the mines goes down there again his er n er he gives himself away, because, just because of the experiences. +because he gives his right away. +the experience he has gained in the mines at immediately a man g a man who has been in the mines goes down there again his er n er he gives himself away, because, just because of the experiences. i saw an incidence er down in the, the mine a, a miner himself can tell, by the creak of a tree just where the heavy, heavy weight's coming on the, on the, the roof. and where there's likely to be a fall. and the miner can only pick up a, a pick and knock the rook and he can tell exactly where er where it's weakest in the rook. so, so these thi these things did do, show up when you're d when you're down the mines. a ma a magic phase, you can't give it away. -and they didn't ne we didn't need the if we were a miner. +and they didn't ne we didn't need the if we were a miner. a mine w a miner could tell another miner by his accent. not just by him telling he's a miner he can say er that's a miner. what, what did you do erm after the war? @@ -52464,71 +52418,71 @@ er yes. oh vast differences. my first experience in going into tramcars er in, in edinburgh anyway and i suppose that the same thing would have happened er in any country,just gone through the ravages of war, with blackouts and so forth. the people from the highest paid to the lowest paid were all just one unit. -and i wish to god that would just come back again, now there people would just treat one of our as they did it one of during the war's years. +and i wish to god that would just come back again, now there people would just treat one of our as they did it one of during the war's years. and i can't see any reason why they can't. -why they should, people with a higher look down their nose at the people who are lower than themselves, i can not figure out. -i think we need another war to get rid of the er get rid of some of the thing that's happening at the present day. +why they should, people with a higher look down their nose at the people who are lower than themselves, i can not figure out. +i think we need another war to get rid of the er get rid of some of the thing that's happening at the present day. so you think the war erm unified the people? -behind the +behind the er it definitely it had proved it itself. it proved it, the war years proved it to the people. er that they were, they were all just one. but nowadays we're not, nowadays we, there's a higher, a middle class and a lower class and a lower lower class. what erm what kind of employment did you find when you came back from the war? -well i, i erm my first employment was in the, was in the building trade with er an old firm in edinburgh called and believe me i was not a very fit person then after seven, five years and i was like a rake, i was like a skeleton. +well i, i erm my first employment was in the, was in the building trade with er an old firm in edinburgh called and believe me i was not a very fit person then after seven, five years and i was like a rake, i was like a skeleton. and i got there and by good luck i got a very good er site agent and after asking me what i'd done, he says it's alright son we'll build you up. -and he actually treated me like a, more or less a son, the site agent, and he made sure er i gradually developed my muscles. +and he actually treated me like a, more or less a son, the site agent, and he made sure er i gradually developed my muscles. he never put me on a heavy job until at such times he thinks i was fit . well that's the way i was treated when i came home. -by the the i served five year then and i left that and i went into corporation transport which was tramcars then. -and i went then from a, a timber mill and they there's various different jobs i've been in since then, you know? +by the the i served five year then and i left that and i went into corporation transport which was tramcars then. +and i went then from a, a timber mill and they there's various different jobs i've been in since then, you know? what was the conditions like in the building trade after the war? -well er you know at that time there in the building trade there was er what they term a, an essential work order. +well er you know at that time there in the building trade there was er what they term a, an essential work order. which you had, the government, the government or building firms had to guarantee you forty four hours' payment f of wages, forty four hours guaranteed and you had to get that whether you were working or not. -so that was an essential work order was by the government in power then. -that m er the firms must guarantee forty four hours wages for the man, doesn't matter what -was, was this erm to protect the men or to make sure that erm +so that was an essential work order was by the government in power then. +that m er the firms must guarantee forty four hours wages for the man, doesn't matter what +was, was this erm to protect the men or to make sure that erm it's er it's more or less a retainer for the men. aha. -a retainer so that they could have, that man couldn't go in another job +a retainer so that they could have, that man couldn't go in another job . aye. presumably this was cos there was a big erm a big surge on to rebuild the oh yes, yes there was -country +country yes, yeah. mhm. -the, the present, the present day er in edinburgh, the present day buildings that i helped to build up are now in pilton and in fact er out in saint i built, that was a er built a fact i did all the rough . -both in pilton and in present day er pilton circus which is er er there's a lot of er controversy going over er m making them, privatizing them and so forth but i l i was er the building of these things and did all the er the work for them. +the, the present, the present day er in edinburgh, the present day buildings that i helped to build up are now in pilton and in fact er out in saint i built, that was a er built a fact i did all the rough . +both in pilton and in present day er pilton circus which is er er there's a lot of er controversy going over er m making them, privatizing them and so forth but i l i was er the building of these things and did all the er the work for them. is that erm quite a dangerous job working on the, on the building sites? well it depending what, what sort of job you're doing. all depending what sort of job your job, it could be dangerous if you didn't know what you were doing. -i mean you couldn't put a stranger on a job that you, you yourself . +i mean you couldn't put a stranger on a job that you, you yourself . but once you were qualified for the job you couldn't put a stranger on you had to ta teach that stranger a job. -before what he was to +before what he was to erm where did you go after the, after the building, the building work? after the building i left er the building work and became a tram conductor where i went through a course in the, down at shrub hall went through a conductor's course. after going through the conductor's course i then went to leith depot, old leith depot er of the, with the tramcars. eventually was put on the tramcars as a, a conductor. served with them as a conductor er for about approximately four years er and the experiences i had er as a conductor were many and varied er er if you do er recall er the old tramcars er the fares weren't in comparison today. -i can remember quite vividly the old tramcars running there er day and night, with the last service leaving the outskirts of edinburgh around about er twelve er eleven thirty and you g have about ten minutes or so to reach the depots which there were many and varied at this particular time. +i can remember quite vividly the old tramcars running there er day and night, with the last service leaving the outskirts of edinburgh around about er twelve er eleven thirty and you g have about ten minutes or so to reach the depots which there were many and varied at this particular time. there was depots in tower cross, portobello, leith, and many other places like that. -but while i tramcar leaving any suburban area there was always what was known then as a worker's return. +but while i tramcar leaving any suburban area there was always what was known then as a worker's return. and that worker's return was three pence. three pence for a worker's return. and it was always on that er tramcar, whichever er suburban district they were leaving, was always a packed car. always fully laden. -because the conductor always had to wait until such time as the queue was diminished quite a bit and hi his tramcar was full so that the next tramcar come along er coming along, whatever number, was to be d the same thing happening again. +because the conductor always had to wait until such time as the queue was diminished quite a bit and hi his tramcar was full so that the next tramcar come along er coming along, whatever number, was to be d the same thing happening again. so the suburban districts then were very well served with the old tramcars. and i believe myself today, at present day,the tramcars were coming back again, there would be, could be a way of resolving this matter of going onto different buses. i take, for instance, the present day just now where we have, what we term, the old aged pensioner's railcard. -now what is to stop, instead of an old age pensioner getting on, with their ticket, or a thirty pound annual ticket or their quarter quarterly ticket. +now what is to stop, instead of an old age pensioner getting on, with their ticket, or a thirty pound annual ticket or their quarter quarterly ticket. what on earth's to stop, to have a transfer ticket, which could be used on any bus at all. so there would b take away this anomaly of old people having to use three buses to get from one end of the town to the other, which means, in actual fact, that each bus they went on to, they paid this ten pence, which if there's three, if they do not turn it twice a week, twice a day, that's sixty pence. -now why can't they issue a ticket, transferable ticket so i don't have to use three buses, all i have to do is i've got one ticket, now that ticket reserved for particular . +now why can't they issue a ticket, transferable ticket so i don't have to use three buses, all i have to do is i've got one ticket, now that ticket reserved for particular . do you think then that the er trams provided a better service for the people than the buses? -well we were a better er service, they were a better ser i'm not saying that i think so, i know they were a better service don doesn't does n they're not quite proof, there were in an tramcar edinburgh corporation tramcars were running, they were running at a, a, every year a profit. +well we were a better er service, they were a better ser i'm not saying that i think so, i know they were a better service don doesn't does n they're not quite proof, there were in an tramcar edinburgh corporation tramcars were running, they were running at a, a, every year a profit. whereas at the present time, with the buses, it's all deficits. if that is not proof i . the one speech for the other surely. @@ -52542,64 +52496,64 @@ and attend your branch meetings. was there any erm disputes or anything at that time on the, on the trams? oh very few and far between. very few and far between. -maybe just locally, at local garages but as far as, far as being the all national or anything like that, there was never anything i with the tramcars. +maybe just locally, at local garages but as far as, far as being the all national or anything like that, there was never anything i with the tramcars. were the erm the relations with the bosses and the workers quite good, on the ? very good, very good. oh. -even with the inspectors too, there was always a good er going with the, the people in those days. +even with the inspectors too, there was always a good er going with the, the people in those days. mhm. and was this quite a well paid job? well it erm it was average, it was average. yes. and er did you have to work like erm shifts and things like that? oh yes. -ex exactly the same as going to the present day. +ex exactly the same as going to the present day. you had the split shifts and the down shifts and maybe we were called for er a what did you do after you left, you left the trams? after i left the trams then er i went er i went away to east kilbride. i used to work for a certain er c er creamery there. er -getting milk, separating milk er pasteurizing milk and like that. +getting milk, separating milk er pasteurizing milk and like that. was east kilbride one of the erm one of the new towns? it was er now it was, now at the start of the new town er present east kilbride a new town, it was known as a new town and it was just starting to build up. and i had better chances of getting a proper house for myself and my family which was then two daughters and my wife and i. so we actually went there to better ourselves and try and get a h a reasonable house to sort of live in and -was there a lot of encouragement given to people to move out premises? +was there a lot of encouragement given to people to move out premises? oh yes, at that time there was, yes. oh yes. if they accepted it of course. was it er easy finding a job at that time as well, in the, in the new towns? oh yes. -it was being that the, the rolls royce saturday, came in to east kilbride and, and american firms like that were coming along. +it was being that the, the rolls royce saturday, came in to east kilbride and, and american firms like that were coming along. singer sewing machines and sort of things like that. they were all coming into east kilbride, there was b cos after all there was starting off a new town and they was building up then from it. what were the erm conditions like in the creamery where you worked? very good. we got our free milk, of course, we got our free milk. -that was one we got our free milk as many pints of milk as we required for to keep our fam but no more, no more than that, just much your family had they'd allow you a pint per per person. +that was one we got our free milk as many pints of milk as we required for to keep our fam but no more, no more than that, just much your family had they'd allow you a pint per per person. was it erm was it hard work in the in the creamery? oh no. no not in comparison to the jobs i'd already been in. oh no this was much easier for me. -because at that time . +because at that time . and er after this did you move back to edinburgh? -i moved back to edinburgh too because er my er my family had taken a yearning for edinburgh, they didn't like east kilbride so i says left. +i moved back to edinburgh too because er my er my family had taken a yearning for edinburgh, they didn't like east kilbride so i says left. and also it's true today, you go where your family wants to go and that was, this was er they had a yearning for that and they were not settling down so what did you do when you when you moved back to edinburgh? well i went into a timber yard er known as er, what was the timber yard again now? . and they . -where as i said er working with timber. +where as i said er working with timber. was that erm like sawmill or something? sawmills, sawmills and . cabinet makers was that a dangerous job? well it could be dangerous, if you didn't watch what you were doing. like every other, other job you've got to er gain experience as you go along, you've got to experience. -and you've always got to, you've always g advice and on how to handle it before you, you put actually handling them. +and you've always got to, you've always g advice and on how to handle it before you, you put actually handling them. were there erm any accidents or anything? er but if there was any accidents through negligence, if there were accidents, it was negligence er and the people by themselves. -which is er worker often, often often most of our accidents is caused by negligence. +which is er worker often, often often most of our accidents is caused by negligence. so what were the conditions in the er in the mill like? very good, very good conditions. very good conditions indeed, aye. @@ -52611,48 +52565,48 @@ so it, it didn't really matter to me. i've always still held my card. although i still held my card of the transport and general workers. mhm. -so you continue to be a member of the transport and general +so you continue to be a member of the transport and general oh aye, yes, oh . oh yes. -god i you could never tell if you're, you're going to be there long enough in job, if the, the boss didn't like you then he would just say well you're, you're paid off and that's it, so that's sort of benefit of keeping your union membership up you could go to anywhere where there was a trade union, a union membership and get a job. +god i you could never tell if you're, you're going to be there long enough in job, if the, the boss didn't like you then he would just say well you're, you're paid off and that's it, so that's sort of benefit of keeping your union membership up you could go to anywhere where there was a trade union, a union membership and get a job. so er the, was being unemployed at that time quite precarious? -if there was +if there was it was, it was. at that time, yes. it was er at that time because of the, they were very few and far between. employment was very few and far between. -because there wasn't the same amount of work,this is just after the war i'm talking about, and there wasn't so many going then. +because there wasn't the same amount of work,this is just after the war i'm talking about, and there wasn't so many going then. there were only starting making themselves then. er so were erm were jobs quite hard to come by in those days, after the war? well er well it all depended on the individual themselves. -if there's a miner who's in getting work. +if there's a miner who's in getting work. although you had to be very careful in er in d knowing what to go after. depending on the rate of wages. depending on the rate of wages. -so you're actually, if you're going for a job, you want er for the highest place where you get the highest wages, which was a for any working, you're going to +so you're actually, if you're going for a job, you want er for the highest place where you get the highest wages, which was a for any working, you're going to what did you do after you left the erm after you left the timber mill? after the timber mill, er . now can i remember about after the timber mill? let's see now. -my mind's a blank i've been in that many different jobs now. -i thought you said you were in a, a warehouse after that wasn't +my mind's a blank i've been in that many different jobs now. +i thought you said you were in a, a warehouse after that wasn't oh that's right. -you i was in a warehouse at served thirteen year there. +you i was in a warehouse at served thirteen year there. and i was working in a large warehouse, a three floor warehouse, a grocers,grocers. i served there for thirteen year, became a chargehand eventually and eventually the f the firm folded up. what were they very old established firm, it was established in er eighteen fifty six. so it was a, a, a firm of about a hundred years standing at that time. -but the both brothers who owned it er charles er john and tom were becoming very very aged and were not capable of carrying on the job. +but the both brothers who owned it er charles er john and tom were becoming very very aged and were not capable of carrying on the job. and they approached the son who wasn't interested so they just folded up. what were the conditions like where you worked in the warehouse? ah well we, we actually made our own condition and this is one time, i'm telling you again, where my union membership came in very handy. -i actually made it a union firm . +i actually made it a union firm . so you unionized the whole firm then? organ organized it. organized the people inside it. -and i explained to them what benefits they were getting. +and i explained to them what benefits they were getting. mm. although the employer was pretty reasonable to us he p always payed us sixpence above the rate. above the normal rate. @@ -52662,25 +52616,25 @@ i pay my men sixpence over the, the rate. so i says well thank you very much, but still for mu l people benefit themselves. mm. they're better being in a union, he says i agree with you, quite agree with you. -the union fights for he says, and the union's a but i'm one of these employers who paying them, my men a plus rate, so i'm paying men sixpence plus over the normal rate so there was no difficulty there. +the union fights for he says, and the union's a but i'm one of these employers who paying them, my men a plus rate, so i'm paying men sixpence plus over the normal rate so there was no difficulty there. mhm. -so he obviously wouldn't have thought the union would have been much of a threat to him seeing as he -no, no it didn't because he was prepared to pay over er above the rate . +so he obviously wouldn't have thought the union would have been much of a threat to him seeing as he +no, no it didn't because he was prepared to pay over er above the rate . the union already fought for that rate and they got it. but he was paying them sixpence above the rate so there was no problem to him. did you notice much differences in the work once you got promoted to a chargehand? -well er there was i didn't do so much of the normal grafting naturally, but i was always, if there was a new man came on the job they would always learns. +well er there was i didn't do so much of the normal grafting naturally, but i was always, if there was a new man came on the job they would always learns. and i was to show him what to do and i made sure that all . on the first day i made sur i stayed with that man all day. as i said i stayed with that man all day. -although i wouldn't t in interfere with show him how to do the job and er i would make sure he understood the job. +although i wouldn't t in interfere with show him how to do the job and er i would make sure he understood the job. if he asked me such and such i'd say now this is how you do it. if he said to me, after i'd shown him, that he understood it, i would say alright, show me how you do it. and then that way the man learnt. mm. the man himself learnt. and usually the man telling me he understood if eventually when he starts the job, he hasn't understood at all, he's just saying so, but i wanted to prove to the man himself that he could do it and prove to myself that he could do it. -so i was in a safe and so was the man. +so i was in a safe and so was the man. but so you were given the responsibility then to train people up? given the first in this . @@ -52703,7 +52657,7 @@ mhm. and they didn't have all this er legislation about redundancy money or anything then? no no. in its infancy then. -and, and then er at that particular time you know and er then unemployment you, i you had to see each firm was issued with the and the firms had to agree that you had to sign a contract of employment so that er if you were leaving or he was paying you off, you had to be given two weeks' notice either way before they pay you off. +and, and then er at that particular time you know and er then unemployment you, i you had to see each firm was issued with the and the firms had to agree that you had to sign a contract of employment so that er if you were leaving or he was paying you off, you had to be given two weeks' notice either way before they pay you off. and that was the contract of employment. mhm. yeah. @@ -52712,8 +52666,8 @@ ah well i was, i was a y on er thing we had back in the building trade. back in the building trade once again which i had experience before so i had no problem . and the reason in the first place i did leave the building trade was my hands was breaking out with in industrial disease, see? dermatitis and i felt i couldn't go near cement and all of that. -but then i, eventually i tried the building trade again and i joined a firm called er forget, or something like that and i was working up in george street in, in, in edinburgh. -you always go building, we gutted right from ground floor, left the existing walls in. +but then i, eventually i tried the building trade again and i joined a firm called er forget, or something like that and i was working up in george street in, in, in edinburgh. +you always go building, we gutted right from ground floor, left the existing walls in. and then inside building we completely demolished inside, just sort of left the retaining walls and built it up from fourteen feet below the ground to five storeys, high,itself. and we had to go down through fourteen feet of solid rock. so this was obviously quite a difficult job? @@ -52723,20 +52677,20 @@ and er building trade work, both of these things had left me with the qualificat did you notice much difference in the sort of er erm the techniques or the machinery or whatever that was being used between ? ooh vast va er er in the building trade? oh yes, yes. -for instance you see all these big they'd actually built up from the ground up, they'd no taking now just the odd . -they built up from a working +for instance you see all these big they'd actually built up from the ground up, they'd no taking now just the odd . +they built up from a working was there still the erm the, the thing you talked about with the guaranteed work at that time? yes. oh aye aye. yes -but er the essential work contract then that i had spoken about in the first place the building trade, that was a government order. -essential, essential work which was operated during the war years and er what year a couple, several years after that. +but er the essential work contract then that i had spoken about in the first place the building trade, that was a government order. +essential, essential work which was operated during the war years and er what year a couple, several years after that. that was an essential b eventually that was taken away, but the building trade still believed if a building firm wanted men, they had to have at least a thirty two hour guarantee, which is at present still in operation. a thirty t they had to guarantee an employee thirty two hour guarantee, was that to get rid of the sort of ee erm the way them building firms used to take people on every day? exac stop this casual labour business you see? -whe whereas the building trade would say oh i'll take you, you're a friend of mine, i'll take you you're a friend of i can take you, you're a friend . -it was it was a great lot down in leith here, and i've often seen it down in leith docks. +whe whereas the building trade would say oh i'll take you, you're a friend of mine, i'll take you you're a friend of i can take you, you're a friend . +it was it was a great lot down in leith here, and i've often seen it down in leith docks. when i've been down there trying to get casual work, you know in leith docks? and he just down, they're all in a big crowd . and a chap come out the offices and say right, you you you . @@ -52748,23 +52702,23 @@ mhm. i've had s still operating now to present day, i don't know. mm. what did you do erm after that? -well as a reach up up . +well as a reach up up . in fact that's what i left from, i left from the job at job street in george street with the building trade. that's when i . -and i work after that. -but the site prepared to let me work, to carry on then as s they ma and i wouldn't claim my pension until i'd finished. -and behind that, their reasoning for that is, for every year that i worked over my retir retireable age, there's a that is added to my pension. -he says i haven't got you working long longer i worked the bigger the pension i have when i go out . +and i work after that. +but the site prepared to let me work, to carry on then as s they ma and i wouldn't claim my pension until i'd finished. +and behind that, their reasoning for that is, for every year that i worked over my retir retireable age, there's a that is added to my pension. +he says i haven't got you working long longer i worked the bigger the pension i have when i go out . so were you allowed to work er after your retireable age? not, not at that particu when they got to hear about it. mm. -of course they, they had questions of and he says oh well i've sat with him, the man's prepared working at lambert, but no you can't allow the man to work after he's sixty and that was it. +of course they, they had questions of and he says oh well i've sat with him, the man's prepared working at lambert, but no you can't allow the man to work after he's sixty and that was it. so that was me on. but the oaps were you involved in any erm political parties or anything er ? no no not necessary though, though i have done quite a wee bit just now er in support of my labour party, you know? done quite a wee bit and i've been there at a few of their, quite a few of their meetings and erm a good friend of quite a few of the councils. -and lothian district council. +and lothian district council. quite a good friend of them you know and i'm a close contact with them. is it just been recently that you've started to get involved ? within the last ten years, i've been ten years activ actively concerned with the old aged pensioners' association and er the labour movement. @@ -52773,16 +52727,16 @@ d do y do you think there's a great difference between the labour party now and ah well, more or less the same. they're more or less as a, i don't think there's a great lot of difference onl i d i, they're not pushing, they haven't the same, the, i would like to say, i would say they haven't the same interest in their union, they've not the same interests in the union as they had in the earlier days when there was a union. mm. -did your involvement in the trade unions when you were young got lead to your, any involvement in the labour party or anything like that? +did your involvement in the trade unions when you were young got lead to your, any involvement in the labour party or anything like that? oh no, not necessarily through the union, no no. i've just had so solely an interest to defend myself. ah but i believed if i'm going to discuss or argue about anything as regarding that i had to be interested in it. and to be interested you've got to attend your branch meetings and know what's going on. whether it be a union branch meeting or any other branch meeting you had to be there and you had to know what you're talking about. -don't just go into these meetings and sat there like a dumbbell. +don't just go into these meetings and sat there like a dumbbell. you liked it, if you've been active at all you'd want to know what's going on. and the only way you can do that is b attending your branch meetings. -i mean there's no, no use a man being employed and he's got a shop steward if he don't and depend on the shop steward coming down to tell him what happens in the meeting. +i mean there's no, no use a man being employed and he's got a shop steward if he don't and depend on the shop steward coming down to tell him what happens in the meeting. my reply to these people, if they asked me what happened at the branch meeting i say, do you want to know what happened in the branch meeting? yes, i said well attend them. so that was er that was my answer @@ -52792,12 +52746,12 @@ the firm that i worked from weren't too bad. but as i say as paying the er r i, i've seen them when i'm going round the site er i got an option from the firm, i'd be allowed time off my work, my actual work on the, on the, on the site, to go round and collect their unions dues. i'd got an option from the firm and they were very good that way. and i've seen them, whenever they see me come along, going away and trying to hide. -but i say there's been a +but i say there's been a you mentioned the erm the national association of scottish old age pensioners' associations scottish old age pensioners' association. what do they erm, that, what does that association do? -oh well wait a i'm just going to read first to you. +oh well wait a i'm just going to read first to you. the name of the association shall be the scottish old age pensioners' association. the, the association shall be non party and non sectarian , you understand my meaning by that? that we advocate the immediate implementation of the scottish old people's chapter, to strive to maintain and improve the standard of living of pensioners by ensuring that the pension will rise according to the cost of living or er or livings or earnings,which er whichever is the most advantageous . @@ -52808,7 +52762,7 @@ that's er br is it er was it a very large organization? well we er it's a, it's a national organization in fact, it's, it's all over the country, all over er scotland. from as far up as er in er inverness down to the er borders. -er branches approximately thirty one branches in edinburgh which i myself er er attend to. +er branches approximately thirty one branches in edinburgh which i myself er er attend to. as far as the financial side of things goes. and er a g a good er and er, can be er the mi the name itself, the scottish old age pensions association is not to be mistaken from er, sometimes it's misread as the scottish old age pensioners' association. now if you use that, that g gives the people the wrong impression that you must be a pensioner before you can join it, but this is not so. @@ -52819,7 +52773,7 @@ do you have a lot of er younger members? that's what we er we want, that's what we require, because don't forget old people er, in fact our present national treasurer, a mrs mary , is now serving as the national treasurer and has done for the last thirty five years. still national treasurer and she's o well over eighty, she's still the national treasurer. board of conference, every year for two, two days conference, and we go to different parts of the country, aberdeen, dundee, glasgow, stirling, you name it, we have conference in. -it changes every year so we go to these conference and we fight on our declaration of intent, on pensions, pensions reviews, that's er reviewing a pension what we're trying to get for the government of the day to review the pensions every six months instead of at the present every year. +it changes every year so we go to these conference and we fight on our declaration of intent, on pensions, pensions reviews, that's er reviewing a pension what we're trying to get for the government of the day to review the pensions every six months instead of at the present every year. are as an instance do that, the present government er last year, in fact since it some over, it was the seventy nine, er nineteen seventy nine. we were getting paid our pensions on the first week of nove november. now if anyone like to look at the present day and er pension book, they'll discover that since then, for the last three years, they've done the people of this country out of one week's pension every year. @@ -52827,28 +52781,28 @@ they've now, this government has actually made a, a fifty three year or a fifty is it a very er lobby, ooh yes yes yes. we're, i am up at least, anything from ten to twelve times a year up at lothian regional council or the district council in deputations concerning, anything concerning the old age pensions associations. -and has been imposed on old people of er edinburgh and er . -so the, they're, the old people have been been done o out of a lot of money. -this year in itself, the single person has been done out of two pound ninety pence and er after the er older ones that's four pound odd. +and has been imposed on old people of er edinburgh and er . +so the, they're, the old people have been been done o out of a lot of money. +this year in itself, the single person has been done out of two pound ninety pence and er after the er older ones that's four pound odd. this year alone. -so if you total it up,be er again and first of all council being a, being a council, and they succeeded very well. -and at the leith, south leith very very well and they just er district council. -was there a lot of that sort of feeling around, that sort of protestant action -no no this one man this one, one man in the whole of edinburgh district council was protestant tax. -what er caused them to put that for the er group forward i could not tell you, but that's what he stood for, this protestant action. -he was neither liberal, labour, conservative, none of them, he was just, he -mm. -what had been a er election representative until +so if you total it up,be er again and first of all council being a, being a council, and they succeeded very well. +and at the leith, south leith very very well and they just er district council. +was there a lot of that sort of feeling around, that sort of protestant action +no no this one man this one, one man in the whole of edinburgh district council was protestant tax. +what er caused them to put that for the er group forward i could not tell you, but that's what he stood for, this protestant action. +he was neither liberal, labour, conservative, none of them, he was just, he +mm. +what had been a er election representative until er er an election agent,election agent when you're er a er d doing the work of an election agent, you've got to be responsible for all the data going out concerning the running of the election. making sure that your candidate attends every meeting, for er s you know during er an election campaign they've got to attend all the meetings. -well the election agent was the man responsible for getting that data through to the, the candidate to say that you're speaking at a meeting, such and such a night, and another meeting at such and such so keeping the, keeps that candidate on his toes, all the time, during an election campaign until election's over and then of course er you know what transpires after that i su it's either +well the election agent was the man responsible for getting that data through to the, the candidate to say that you're speaking at a meeting, such and such a night, and another meeting at such and such so keeping the, keeps that candidate on his toes, all the time, during an election campaign until election's over and then of course er you know what transpires after that i su it's either was you involved in the labour party for a long time before erm before you were the election agent? no. no no no no. no n never. -of course i had this spell er er don't forget i was five years as a prisoner of war, and a lot of interest because i was a union member pra b previous to that you see? +of course i had this spell er er don't forget i was five years as a prisoner of war, and a lot of interest because i was a union member pra b previous to that you see? was this what erm led you to join the labour party? -your initials at a trade union +your initials at a trade union yeah yes, that was er actually yes er mhm. i wanted to see how it o o operated politically. @@ -52859,7 +52813,7 @@ what did erm how did you find the labour party at that time compares with the la oh much better. w er united. it's not united at the present day, there are far too many lefts and rights and centres. -if there's e if there any party's operating at all, there's only one p one thing and that's centre. +if there's e if there any party's operating at all, there's only one p one thing and that's centre. no lefts, no rights, centre. united. and the same in most of our organizations in this country at the present day, and that's what's wrong. @@ -52868,7 +52822,7 @@ when you've got a left, a right and a centre, you've got three different parties so the labour party got united then at that time? oh definitely, very well united, yes. then. -but don't forget that was just after the war and er the labour were beginning to build up, getting things better, run better country than they were previous p people. +but don't forget that was just after the war and er the labour were beginning to build up, getting things better, run better country than they were previous p people. did the labour party gain a lot of support after the war? oh yes, aye they did oh. oh aye proved it, they got in. @@ -52877,23 +52831,23 @@ erm now did your er labour party membership lapse after, after that time? er yes it did lapse. because i had seen my young brother-in-law and i says i'm gonna be like that then, didn't fe er feel any of this er at that time. me,as the district council. -i couldn't see myself doing it so as i said i wasn't going to make a fool of myself by putting my name as being nominated forward er as a candidate etcetera lose interest that's the first thing that happened because they knew i was an outspoken bloke. -i knew spoke too much next nominee, next candidate for . +i couldn't see myself doing it so as i said i wasn't going to make a fool of myself by putting my name as being nominated forward er as a candidate etcetera lose interest that's the first thing that happened because they knew i was an outspoken bloke. +i knew spoke too much next nominee, next candidate for . and i felt it wasn't up to them, i didn't have enough experience i wanted to gain some more experience but it just fell away, lapse. and erm you're, you're not a member of the labour party again? no i'm not a member of the labour party yet. oh. -you see the pre the present system we've got scottish old age pensioners is non sectarian, non political. +you see the pre the present system we've got scottish old age pensioners is non sectarian, non political. you understand? -is this er does that actually debar from belonging to er +is this er does that actually debar from belonging to er oh i could have er er well it doesn't debar me but i feel it, it would it wouldn't be right, for me being a labour party member sitting on a, a non-segregated and non-political gr er ah association, mhm. now er you, you mentioned your, your pensions association. now you're area treasurer, aren't you, for the area treasurer, er edinburgh area -can you tell me a bit about the organization and what its aims -well the aims i'll just read this and this says, this gives you most . -this the name of the association shall be the scottish old age pensions association. +can you tell me a bit about the organization and what its aims +well the aims i'll just read this and this says, this gives you most . +this the name of the association shall be the scottish old age pensions association. the association will be non party and non sectarian. one. that we advocate the immediate implementation of the scottish old people's chapter to strive to maintain and improve the standard of living of pensioners by ensuring that the pension will rise according to the cost of living or earnings, whichever is er is the most ad advantageous. @@ -52903,107 +52857,107 @@ and social services as may be required to ensure the welfare of the aged as set to this end we employ all constitutional means in cooperation with similar bodies on all questions affecting the welfare of pensioners . that's, that's our aim. aim and object of it. -where the,le let's say association was first formed on the thirteenth of february nineteen seven, nineteen thirty seven, so you can see by that date fifty years an established national organization for the whole of scotland. +where the,le let's say association was first formed on the thirteenth of february nineteen seven, nineteen thirty seven, so you can see by that date fifty years an established national organization for the whole of scotland. what does the er the organization do? the organiz er organization doing is er fighting in every place where we think that there are o old aged pensioners being in er imposed upon in any way. whether it be welfare, gas bills, housing, you name it and we're in there fighting to, to keep them above the water, their heads above the water. -you go on about erm some of the experience you've had, some of the you've met. -well i er er er i've occasionally thing that was about last ye er year or the year before a as being a member of one of the, one of the lunch clubs. +you go on about erm some of the experience you've had, some of the you've met. +well i er er er i've occasionally thing that was about last ye er year or the year before a as being a member of one of the, one of the lunch clubs. er and er the lothian region took over the lunch clubs when they took over er this two tier government in scotland, you know? they took over the lunch clubs. and immediately they started raising the prices of the lunch clubs. -well we were up there one time er at the lothian region and we to be up and tell that this was imposing higher things on, higher prices on both the bus buses, because they were raising the bus fares at the same time, and they were increasing the lunch club. -now the, the pensions when they raised at the same time, because we only pension raised every year, and we're up there at that particular time at the lothian region, a full council meeting. +well we were up there one time er at the lothian region and we to be up and tell that this was imposing higher things on, higher prices on both the bus buses, because they were raising the bus fares at the same time, and they were increasing the lunch club. +now the, the pensions when they raised at the same time, because we only pension raised every year, and we're up there at that particular time at the lothian region, a full council meeting. and er we had told them that the q the quality of the food was reasonable. but the quantity the quantity of the food being issued in lunch clubs was very very u even disgraceful. -i er er i serve our people with quantity of food that's supposed to be meant to be a dinner for an old old age person. -and er they listened very carefully to us, in fact council of kivanagh actually brought up a sample of the dinner they issued to old people and i, i did notice as soon as they put this sample on the table the opposition the c conservatives and they still are, their heads bowed. +i er er i serve our people with quantity of food that's supposed to be meant to be a dinner for an old old age person. +and er they listened very carefully to us, in fact council of kivanagh actually brought up a sample of the dinner they issued to old people and i, i did notice as soon as they put this sample on the table the opposition the c conservatives and they still are, their heads bowed. they refused to look at it. -and i would have thought that that was a disgraceful thing to do in a public, in the council to a, a sample being brought up and they were afraid to look at it. +and i would have thought that that was a disgraceful thing to do in a public, in the council to a, a sample being brought up and they were afraid to look at it. their heads were actually downcast, they themselves were ashamed of it and yet they would not commit themselves to vote for it. -will you tell me a little about the erm the campaigns you've the erm the free erm travel on the buses -oh well the, the campaigns er i'm, i'm o i'm only speaking actually about the, down here in leith i started my campaign for er the er let's see,campaign for er introd reintroduction of free travel for the elderly. +will you tell me a little about the erm the campaigns you've the erm the free erm travel on the buses +oh well the, the campaigns er i'm, i'm o i'm only speaking actually about the, down here in leith i started my campaign for er the er let's see,campaign for er introd reintroduction of free travel for the elderly. the campaign was supposed to start with,a away back in the beginning of september. -well i by good luck have had some copies of the petition sent down to me, so i started it, it immediately and i had in the first they made over one thousand one hundred and twenty five signatures. +well i by good luck have had some copies of the petition sent down to me, so i started it, it immediately and i had in the first they made over one thousand one hundred and twenty five signatures. in the first day. -and i had er had given myself a target of five thousand for leith so i turned up the next and made my five thousand in fact i made five thousand and fifty signatures for the h and i believe myself if, if every branch were doing the same as i had been doing then we would have no problem at all in getting a hundred thousand signatures which is our aim. -and they said so at the er at the district council, went up to district and i asked for the support of the district council and er probably john immediately said, you have the full support of the district council for it he says and i'll ensure that you get support with the result i also received four posters direct from the edinburgh district council with john photograph on it and with the caption st stating every old age pensioner should be signing here. +and i had er had given myself a target of five thousand for leith so i turned up the next and made my five thousand in fact i made five thousand and fifty signatures for the h and i believe myself if, if every branch were doing the same as i had been doing then we would have no problem at all in getting a hundred thousand signatures which is our aim. +and they said so at the er at the district council, went up to district and i asked for the support of the district council and er probably john immediately said, you have the full support of the district council for it he says and i'll ensure that you get support with the result i also received four posters direct from the edinburgh district council with john photograph on it and with the caption st stating every old age pensioner should be signing here. so that in itself was a great boost for me and it er it helped a lot. -i also got support from er labour labour party in leith who sent down two volunteers to help me. +i also got support from er labour labour party in leith who sent down two volunteers to help me. so it's made a lot, a big difference too. i also had support from lance house and from er leith community centre. so i wasn't, i wasn't doing it all on my own, you understand my meaning? -i weren't doing it all although i sort of organized it. +i weren't doing it all although i sort of organized it. and when i took, i had to report back to area control i was immediate i got immediate applause. but i just said i don't want any applause for this at all, i feel that every pensioner, every pensioner should sign it whether they belong to the association or not. -whether they have a senior citizens' club with the association. -if they want the free bus passes they've got to something done about themselves and . -one of my in fact was i can remember, i went up when i was first er paying for paying for an annual ticket with their bus passes and eight pound for a single ticket for us er for our quarterly ticket. -i was up there three days campaigning, objecting to this that i'm being charged and believe me for those three days i stood right in queen street, just outside the offices there, and at no, any time during, at any particular time of day, you could have come along to me, and there were still one thousand five hundred people standing there, rain, hail, sleet or blow. +whether they have a senior citizens' club with the association. +if they want the free bus passes they've got to something done about themselves and . +one of my in fact was i can remember, i went up when i was first er paying for paying for an annual ticket with their bus passes and eight pound for a single ticket for us er for our quarterly ticket. +i was up there three days campaigning, objecting to this that i'm being charged and believe me for those three days i stood right in queen street, just outside the offices there, and at no, any time during, at any particular time of day, you could have come along to me, and there were still one thousand five hundred people standing there, rain, hail, sleet or blow. for their tickets, and i said at the area council if they had turned up like they turned up to pay them thirty pound and eight pound, if they'd turned up at the same time with a petition form what a difference it would what kind of erm reaction do you get from the different political parties to your campaign? -oh well, well er most of us are b even, even the tories themselves know, they know that we're fighting for the old people, but do they we get the same old reply from them, where is the money coming? -that's the s o o reply, and that is all cos because of the central go government support grant who are naturally younger. -they're responsible for the, for the present that they keep, they keep sending us this and that minister,and that. +oh well, well er most of us are b even, even the tories themselves know, they know that we're fighting for the old people, but do they we get the same old reply from them, where is the money coming? +that's the s o o reply, and that is all cos because of the central go government support grant who are naturally younger. +they're responsible for the, for the present that they keep, they keep sending us this and that minister,and that. but they're, they're the gov they're going to end up in the government. -they're going to govern the country, they cut the money off from they cut the support grant from the, the from the district council, and still are, still are, and there's going to be even bigger cuts the next year. -going to be even bigger cuts the ne and it's en there no used to lothian regional council hall and district council. +they're going to govern the country, they cut the money off from they cut the support grant from the, the from the district council, and still are, still are, and there's going to be even bigger cuts the next year. +going to be even bigger cuts the ne and it's en there no used to lothian regional council hall and district council. if the lothian regional c council can't get their money from a from, a central government, where are they going to get it from? so erm do you get a lot of support from the labour party for your campaign? -oh every time, without fear wherever you are er labour's scottish commons gives full support to the scottish old age pensions association's pensions policy. -that's from our own, we also have the trades union congress with the same. +oh every time, without fear wherever you are er labour's scottish commons gives full support to the scottish old age pensions association's pensions policy. +that's from our own, we also have the trades union congress with the same. and that's when i say we have a, a campaign which is going to, it's a demonstration and er and rally in the end of march, of next year. when we will be marching off probably from regents street, proceeding along queens er princes street . -and then we've got us a we're going to the cinema. +and then we've got us a we're going to the cinema. and that's a, and that's them all over the country, not only edinburgh, all over the country, in north south east and west and you name it. -and we have branches, but we could have a lot more because the amount of branches we have, although we have a lot of branches of scottish old age pensions we are not old age pensioners are not united, they're not united, the only way they can be united, if it's a national organization, join your national organization and fight the government. +and we have branches, but we could have a lot more because the amount of branches we have, although we have a lot of branches of scottish old age pensions we are not old age pensioners are not united, they're not united, the only way they can be united, if it's a national organization, join your national organization and fight the government. you can't do so locally, if you're all working separately. -you've got to unite and get in the one gives us strength to fight them. +you've got to unite and get in the one gives us strength to fight them. is er how large is your organization? nationally. -well i er th well i couldn't, i'm not in a position to give the, the total because the national, the national treasurer would be able to you see? -and as i said, mrs mary she's the national treasurer and has been for over thirty years. -that woman's now approaching eighty three, eighty four years of age and she's still national treasurer, so it gives you a sort of sample of the, the kind of people they have at the top, who are really their heart and soul in it. +well i er th well i couldn't, i'm not in a position to give the, the total because the national, the national treasurer would be able to you see? +and as i said, mrs mary she's the national treasurer and has been for over thirty years. +that woman's now approaching eighty three, eighty four years of age and she's still national treasurer, so it gives you a sort of sample of the, the kind of people they have at the top, who are really their heart and soul in it. pensioner themselves who would sit down and think, now take for instance assuming that i wouldn't be a member of that just so surely a, a senior citizens' club. -now you go into a seniors citizens' club, you enter your name and you get registered in the register, you get your cup of tea and then you get social activity. +now you go into a seniors citizens' club, you enter your name and you get registered in the register, you get your cup of tea and then you get social activity. i remember thinking si sit down and say and where do we get this money pay for this tea, and this money pay for the registration. where do you get it from? a voice says it's solely from my pension,quite able and get enough to give to join the association at less than a penny a week. do you find you get a lot of erm resonance from old age pensioners when you ask them to join. are a lot of them er quite prepared to fight to get their erm oh the the members -the members who are members of the branches are prepared to fight, but it's not them i'm er i'm the other people who are er they're gaining from our fight, they're gaining from our fight. +the members who are members of the branches are prepared to fight, but it's not them i'm er i'm the other people who are er they're gaining from our fight, they're gaining from our fight. where we've tried, we've tried to keep a reasonable pension for them. but they're not fighting because they've nobody no, national officials to fight for them. -we, we have the only national organization to f er that goes on to fight for goes, goes to parliament and fights for them. +we, we have the only national organization to f er that goes on to fight for goes, goes to parliament and fights for them. have you had any erm any sort of successes in your campaigns that you've run? -oh yes oh well er er is just across in fact is across the border. +oh yes oh well er er is just across in fact is across the border. everyone got free passes over there. has that just been in re-instituted lately? yeah, oh aye. by just . -it's only within the last couple of year, and then oh no you cannae do a certain of the er it was actually our vice president at the started the campaign over in fife, and they won through. -and there again the supported the, both the region and their district council. -and here we have the calling under er an administration you know who they are and they're hanging their heads every time you speak, you speak to them. +it's only within the last couple of year, and then oh no you cannae do a certain of the er it was actually our vice president at the started the campaign over in fife, and they won through. +and there again the supported the, both the region and their district council. +and here we have the calling under er an administration you know who they are and they're hanging their heads every time you speak, you speak to them. they're ashamed of themselves but they're afraid to admit it. -they're afraid of, ashamed of themselves and they do to the old people. +they're afraid of, ashamed of themselves and they do to the old people. and they're afraid to admit it. they've all got somet an, an evasion or a counter argument with you. -and it's general to fail. -i've bought, i've, i've, as i say, when i pay my have you got a mother and father? -. and they ne er never never answers it direct, never answers it direct. +and it's general to fail. +i've bought, i've, i've, as i say, when i pay my have you got a mother and father? +. and they ne er never never answers it direct, never answers it direct. what's that got to do with it? never comes out with anything like that just,got another one ,answer you. -can you tell me about the er incident that happened when you went to meet erm brian at the council offices? +can you tell me about the er incident that happened when you went to meet erm brian at the council offices? oh yes, at that particular time, i will tell you that once again er, that was er i was supposed to go for an interview and this was er for the er declaration of intent of,wh which was er supposed to er supposed to be given every year to both the lothian regional council and the district . -and this is happened all over the country, each area are doing the same thing and all of this this er produce this declaration of intent and ask the, the head of the er council to put it to their members and get the support of their members. +and this is happened all over the country, each area are doing the same thing and all of this this er produce this declaration of intent and ask the, the head of the er council to put it to their members and get the support of their members. now the r the reason for us doing that is that if they do accept it, they are duty bound as a council to write to prime minister, prime minister, direct, saying they support the declaration of intent. -cos every, cos really the should go direct to her, and it as she's taken notice of you yet. -all, all it does it comes round and er er regional council, say no we support she's got to think,. -well that's the idea of, anyway we're going back to brian and er accepted that he would accept the d the deputation,showing there was three of us, there was the m the president of the area council, myself and the secretary. -well we er duly arrived down at quarter to ten as twenty six of september this year. -and we went up there and we had just we'd, we took the labour rooms and er of course we had got a cup of tea with them you know? -and in comes councillor the leader of the labour group, you see? +cos every, cos really the should go direct to her, and it as she's taken notice of you yet. +all, all it does it comes round and er er regional council, say no we support she's got to think,. +well that's the idea of, anyway we're going back to brian and er accepted that he would accept the d the deputation,showing there was three of us, there was the m the president of the area council, myself and the secretary. +well we er duly arrived down at quarter to ten as twenty six of september this year. +and we went up there and we had just we'd, we took the labour rooms and er of course we had got a cup of tea with them you know? +and in comes councillor the leader of the labour group, you see? well lads, he says, i'm sorry you'll have to wait another hour. course naturally we, we asked why? what was the matter? @@ -53016,40 +52970,38 @@ why doesn't he ph ring for his bloody chauffeur? or his k . why doesn't he get that? no. -no he says er that, that's er that's all i can tell you er that's, he wouldn't until eleven o'clock,come. +no he says er that, that's er that's all i can tell you er that's, he wouldn't until eleven o'clock,come. and er immediately he went there was, somewhere around about eleven o'clock he . right,that deputation of er old age pensioners. -so we immediately walk through and he's all, all . +so we immediately walk through and he's all, all . very pleased to meet you, no no . -now he says er, what is this now, and of course immediately the president says, well you know happens er mr , can we says you've read it before, you see? -and so the our declaration of intent, you've read of before, you know what we're up here. +now he says er, what is this now, and of course immediately the president says, well you know happens er mr , can we says you've read it before, you see? +and so the our declaration of intent, you've read of before, you know what we're up here. and of course er once he read it and er put it down and scribbled in his notes. agrees with so and so and agrees with this and agrees with that. -first of all,mr can i ask you a question? -i says how come you deputation, you gave us a time of which to be here, now we said, we turned up a quarter hour beforehand and i says we get a phone call er a an intermission from councillor that you couldn't make it because that your car broke down. +first of all,mr can i ask you a question? +i says how come you deputation, you gave us a time of which to be here, now we said, we turned up a quarter hour beforehand and i says we get a phone call er a an intermission from councillor that you couldn't make it because that your car broke down. he says that's right. er , that's alright, let's behave ourselves, i says what about us, we've been here since quarter to ten waiting for you to come. you . you're not the one who's got to . i says what was wrong with you not on a corporation t er a corporation bus? and he didn't know where to look. -but eventually he, he, he again when time we started and then he moved on to it, back on to declaration of intent, and they pulled him up and took . +but eventually he, he, he again when time we started and then he moved on to it, back on to declaration of intent, and they pulled him up and took . he didn't agree with er h no, he read a part of one of the d declaration of in one of resolutions, that a substantial concessionary fare would be alright. and that's what you're getting here so as far as i'm concerned . i says you're picking holes, you're picking holes and i says i'll tell you what, that declaration of intent is last year's declaration of intent. i says a new declaration of intent has not yet been printed. i says but you'll find next year when we approach you with this declaration you'll find it's been changed to free passage and where will your argument be then? . proper gent mi mind, don't get me wrong. -er he'll, he's a good fighter and a good, a good, a good but there's certain points you can pick holes . - -somebody once said that if angelism, sharing the gospel was one beggar telling another beggar about bread, where it could be found and undoubtedly when he was saying that he was thinking of that story that account that we had read to us earlier from the second book of kings, chapter seven, and i'd like us to er turn back to us for a few moments this morning and perhaps draw some lessons for ourselves sometimes as christians its very easier for us to say what sins are, and we can see other people's failings, you don't have to be a christian to do that of course, plenty of other people can do that, they see the failings of other people, they see the wrong doing they do, they see their wickedness their, their waywardness, whatever words we want to use to describe it, and we say well that is sin, perhaps for most of us this morning we could make er a list a, a, a tabulate a table of sins and we might say well they are worse sins and there are lesser sins and i would i suppose by and large there would be a fairly reasonable consensus of opinion regarding what was sins and what were not sins. -sometimes the bible surprises us a little bit of course, and it puts it finger on things that we perhaps don't really want to talk about or we don't even consider as sins and the bible is quite clear that not all sins are what we do often there what we don't do in parable that jesus told concerning the traveller, the man who went down to jericho, we don't condemn the priest and the levite for what they did, but we do condemn them for what they didn't do, their sin was not what they did, it was what they left undone, going over and looking at the man was very note worthy, as least there was some interest there and we don't condemn them for that, but we do condemn them for hurrying along and not reaching out and helping the man in the pistol of james and chapter four and verse seventeen james says there, any one then who knows the good he ought to do and doesn't do it, sins so the sins that you and i comment or the sins rather that we are guilty of are not just the things that we do there of times the things that we don't do and sometimes there more difficult for us to put a finger on, we can justify them so very easily its been said that all it needs for evil to triumph, is for good men to say or to do nothing well lets look at the, that,illu illustration there that we have in the second book of kings. -as i mentioned early the, the city of sermaria it was under siege and the army of seria was encamped all around it, ben hadad was a great warrior, he would of been the, the alexander or the napoleon of his day and he had set up this encampment around the city of sermaria, nobody could get in, nobody could get out and very quickly the stocks of food and water er were used up, rationing would of been introduced but it only lasted for a certain period, they'd got to the stage it tells us in the previous chapter that er, that a donkeys head was sold for eighty shekel's of silver and some folk had even got to the, had sunk to the level of cannibalism, of eating their own children and the city was, when they heard about this they were in an uproar and they started blaming god and in between the city of sermaria of all its suffering and hopelessness and helplessness and the army encamped about with all of their supplies, there was this area of no mans land in which they were caught up four men who were leapers and they were trapped there, they didn't want to go over to the serians because they'd be killed, they didn't want to go back into the city because they weren't allowed there and any way what was the point, they'd only die of starvation in there and so these four men are caught up in no man's land and yet their no better off than people in the city, now god had promised deliverance, through his serve and eliger he had promised deliverance, eliger said tomorrow about this time a measure of fine flour shall be sold for a se shekel and two measures of barley for a shekel in the gate of semaria, he said the gates are gonna be open, there's gonna be food and its gonna be a reasonable price and it says the royal officer who's hand the king was leaning on said the man of god said behold, if the lord shall make windows in heaven could such a thing be, he said don't talk stupid man, how can such a thing happen for us?, he didn't believe what god servant said and eliger brings out to him a terrible judgment, he says because of your unbelief you will see it, but your not participate in it but lets look at these four men for a moment, cos that's where our real interest lies this morning, i just wanted to say three things in their experience, the first things is that they were amazed that, at what they found, because after they come together and they talk about it and they said well what shall we do and they weighed the pro's and the cons and semaria doesn't look very attractive with its cannibalism, they said well the least if we stay here were gonna die, if we go into semaria we'll die, lets go down to the serein camp, the worse they can do to us is put us to death and were dying men any way, but they may just take pity on us, we maybe allowed to grope around in their dustbins and get some scraps of food, they may at least allow us that, and so they make their way down just as evening is falling, they make their way down to the serein lines and when they get there, they are amazed at what they find, you see their condition was helpless and hopeless, they were dying men any way, they were lepers, but they were dying of starvation, that was far more imminent than their leprosy, their problems and their needs were greater than themselves, they could not meet their own needs, their problems and their needs were greater than their government, the king in semaria and all of his court could not meet the needs of his people and then in verse five, we read something there, they arose at twilight to go to the camp of aramians or the serein's and when they came to the outskirts of the camp of the serein's behold there was no one there, they expected to at least meet a guard, there would surely be somebody on sentry duty even if the rest of the soldiers had gone in to their tents and were perhaps getting ready for their, for the evening, going to bed or whatever they were gonna be doing, having their evening meal, there would at least be somebody on guard duty, but when they got there, there was no one there, god had stepped in, god had intervened and the good news of the christian gospel is that god has intervened in our, in the midst of our helplessness, in the midst of our hopelessness, god has intervened, he had stepped in to history, so often you'll hear folks say, well why doesn't god do something, why does god allow this to happen, why does god allow that one, why doesn't he do something all they really show by that comment is their own ignorance, because god has done something, god has intervened, listen to what it says in john three sixteen, for god so loved the world that he gave, he's only son and the er, the er apostle paul and he's writing to the gallations, in chapter four and in verses four and five hear what he says there,but when the time had fully come god sent his son, born of a woman, born under law to redeem those under law that we might receive the full rights of son, er of sons , god has done something, he's sent his son jesus christ into this world in fact his done the greatest thing he could do, he has done the very ultimate thing, he has sent his son into the world that's the greatest intervention god could ever have made, it was far greater than, than just intervening in sm , in some small local event, were you see some catastrophe happening and you say well why doesn't god do something there, or there's a war situation going on in some other part of the world, well why doesn't god step in and stop it, god has stepped in, not in a local situation, not in some er passing problem or need but he's stepped into the greatest way possible by sending his son jesus christ into the world to dye for men and woman, to take away sin, to pay the price that god's righteousness demands for sin so god has intervened and his intervention has changed the whole situation, its brought a whole new complexion on things, its changed the colour completely, no longer is the world now under darkness and in, and in pending judgment in doom, because jesus christ came and he took that judgment and that, that condemnation upon himself, he said i've not come to condemn the world he said its already condemned, its already under judgement, the sword of damocles is already hanging over the world and jesus christ came in and to take that judgment and that condemnation on himself and when he died there on the cross and rose again, there came that burst of light in a world that had been shrouded in blackness and darkness, a world that had been shrouded in sin suddenly for the first time sees the light, god has paid for himself the price of sin, god has intervened and changed the whole situation and the message of the gospel is that if you and i allow that intervention to effect us personally, then like those four men surely we too are amazed at what we've found. -if we've come to guard and received forgiveness of sins, if we have become good followers of jesus christ and we are not amazed then there's something wrong with what we've received that god should so love, not just the world, but should so love me, that he gave his son to die for me and that was the sort of er discovery that these four lepers made they've come down there, they've found that the sight before them was amazing, there was no enemy there, the enemy had disappeared and the tents with all their contents were there before them, they were amazed with what they found and you and i when we come to god through jesus christ, we are amazed at what we find, we find forgiveness, we find the restoration of a relationship between ourselves and god, we find an access to receive god's blessing to receive his favour, to receive his gifts that he has for us, no wonder the apostle paul cries out thanks beyond to god for his unspeakable gift, but then again these four men they were not just amazed that what they found, they were, they got absorbed in what they got, because they got a lot more than they bargained for, they possibly in their wildest dreams thought they might at least get, get what the cook was throwing out, they might get to, to the dustbins, they might get what was left over, that would of been great, they were dying of starvation, the driest mouldiest crust would of been like, like a banquet to them, but they got so much more than they anticipated and they got absorbed in it, every thing was there's for the taking as they pulled back the, the flap of the tent as they go in and they see the tables laid out there, they see the food and the drink, they see the plenty, these men who for weeks have known terrible poverty, there might of been a time earlier on in the siege when a few scraps got thrown over the city wall, when the bins were put out the side of the city of an evening, er they would go there and forage amongst them, but all that had stopped long since and it was only the bits and pieces that they managed to forage for themselves and get for themselves that they'd been eating of late, but here every thing is there for the taking, they rubbed their eyes, they pinched one another to make sure their not dreaming, it really is food and drink in a, in an abundance they couldn't of thought of a few mo hours earlier one moment they had nothing, the next they've got every thing, what was it they needed, food, the tables would of been laden with it, it was the food, enough food for an army and there's only four of them, did they, were they thirsty, here was drink, here was wine and, and drink in abundance the rags, the tatters they were dressed in, there were garments and wardrobe full of clothes here for them, did they need money, well the tents were full of the gold and the silver and, and, and valuables, there were a sufficiency, every thing was there you know the idea that the christian life is drab and poor is such a terrible false hood, its an iniquitous lie of the devil, the tragedy is that we have actually often made it that way, we have made the christian faith something drab, something boring, something for old folk er and er you know, people who are, who are, just wanting a crutch because their coming to the end of their natural life and we've made it something drab and dull listen to what the apostle paul says when he's writing to carinthian's in his second letter in chapter eight, he says you know the grace of our lord jesus christ, that though he was rich for your sakes he became poor, so that you through his poverty might be rich, god, he's purpose follows his people, he's not that we've a drab, grey, dull uninteresting life, jesus said i've come that you might of life, and that more abundant, that in all its fullness and god has purpose for us, and when paul is talking about riches there, he's not talking about pounds and pence, he's talking about the richness of the life that we enjoy its not a case of not doing this and having to do that the other thing, its a case of enjoying life as god purposes it, as god intends it you know if you don't enjoy your christian life now, let me tell you your in for a rude awakening when you get to heaven, because the quality of life is not gonna change the only things that'll change is its la it, it will, it will be in his presence, the quality of life will not change because already now we have received eternal life, he has given his life to us and he hasn't got some other special, you know, super duper life laid up, there's nothing, there's nothing greater ahead, god hasn't got any thing greater for us than what he's already given to us in embryonic form here and now why if we take on er a, a, a dazzling scintillating new zest and zap when you get to heaven, that life is already given to you and to me know go back to these four men at the moment, they had never known any thing like this before this was better than all their birthdays rolled into one, this was the greatest day in their experience and if they would live to be a hundred they would never know another day like this, they were having a tremendous time, it said they, they, they, they went into one tent, listen to what they did, they went into one tent and they, they ate, they drank, they had a party and they carried from there the silver, the gold and the clothes and they went and hid they returned and entered another tent and then they did the same there, they were having a tremendous time, this was a beano to end all beano's, this was the greatest day in their life, they were having a wonderful time and why shouldn't they, why not you know there are folk who would, who'd want to make us as christians er and er, ee, put us into a straight jacket the bible tells me even the sunsets free, is free indeed and i don't see any suggestions as i read the new testament, that first of all the life of jesus was drab and uninteresting, or that he expects me as his follow to lead a drab, a grey life, oh its not always gonna be a ple an easy life but that doesn't reduce the, the zest and the excitement in it but you see the danger is when having a good time is the reason for living and the only reason for it, you see, if god has intervened in our life, if the message of the gospel is true, if god in christ has taken away your sin and made you in christ a new creation then you have every reason to enjoy life, in a sense your only able to start enjoying life now, you may have enjoyed some of the things that, that folks suggest that make up life, but they've finished, there gone, what happens when the, when, when the wine has run out, what happens when the parties over, you know all about it the next day, don't you, what happens then, its such short lived, its only worth having whilst its coming to you all the time, but that's not so with a christian life, because it doe , depend on just the things that we have or the experiences that we go through, because it is something that, that we have within, it is, it is a quality of life that we possess, because we possess the one who is life himself, listen to what paul says when he's writing to timothy in his first letter in chapter six it is command those who are rich in this present world not to be arrogant or to put their hope in wealth, those who think that, that er in having possessions that is the secret of life or, or in having a good time and, and, and the rest of it that is what life is all about, he said warn them not to do that, because that is so uncertain, he says but to put their hope in god who richly provides us with every thing what for, for our enjoyment, why has god given us these things, why is, why is god even, he is natural creation there for us, it is for our enjoyment, its not to make us miserable or to make us grey and drab and burden by it, it is for us to enjoy, when god created ada adam and eve and put them in the garden, the, they were told to enjoy it, even the fruit enjoy it, its there for your benefit and then the new creation, every thing that god has provided is there for our enjoyment, but the dangers is when that enjoyment, is the reason for living and that's all we do it for and were so taking up with ourselves, i am gonna have my good time, i'm gonna enjoy myself as a christian and i can do it and you can do it, you become insular and we become introverted and the only thing that matters is me having a good time, my world centres around me and me enjoying myself and me having this and me having that, this blessing and that gift and that other blessing, we become self centred and taken up with our own good times, as long as i can be there in the centre, as long as i can go from, from, from this celebration to that celebration, as long as i can go from this er festival to that festival to this special meeting to that one, i'm gonna have my good time well that was what these fella's were doing, they were going from tent to tent, from celebration to celebration having a great time and then the truth hit them they were ashamed with what they had done, they said to one another we are not doing right, this days a day of good news, but we are keeping silent, if we wait until morning light punishment will overtake us, now therefore, come, let us go and tell the kings household how guilty are we, how guilty are you, how guilty am i of the sinner silence, remember how we started, its not always the things that we do its often the things that we don't do, how guilty are we of the sin of silence these men had known nothing, known poverty and, and, and, and starvation, they were amazed at what they'd found, they'd became absorbed in what they had got and now they'd became ashamed of what they had done with it what was the sin that troubled these men they said we are keeping silent. -back in the city there were thousand of people doomed, dying and all unnecessarily because here was plenty, here was sufficient for the whole city and possibly the greatest sin that you and i can be guilty of and that the church is generally guilty of, but you know when we talk about the church generally its, its so easy because that's general, you and i that are the church, not the denomination, not the organization, it you and i, possibly the greatest sin that we can be guilty of is the sin of silence, i'm not talking now about a rude, belligerent, discourteous, butting hole, button holding of people, i'm not talking about that, i don't see any place in gods word for that sort of attitude or that sort of approach but are we still silent, what about with those with whom we have the right, because we've created a relationship, because they know us and they've seen us and they've seen the experiences we've gone through and they've seen what god has done in our lives, what about with those people do we wait for others to do it, shifting the responsibility. -thinking in, in, in the context of our, of our mission, this town wide mission, well that's billy's job, he's better at it than i am, but its not his job, its my job as much as its his and its your job as much as its mine, we do not well to keep silent these men they were troubled by their sin of silence, perhaps you and i should be troubled by our sin of silence because the extension of that, and here's the really great thing, as far as they were concerned, the ex the, the ongoing because they were troubled by their sin of silence and they did something about it, they were thrilled at the sight that they saw, as they see the city being delivered, and as they see starving men and women eating food perhaps for the first time in days or weeks, buying good wholesome food at a reasonable price, that was the sigh that thrilled them and you can imagine them, and i think they'd be entitled to a little bit of pride that i'm glad we told them, i'm glad we went back and shared the news apart from any thing we couldn't of coped with all ourselves, it would of been so wrong to of kept it, it would of been so wrong just to of eaten it ourselves, i'm glad we went back and told them. -jesus said just before he was living his disciples, his followers, you and me, he said you shall receive power after the holy spirit has come upon you and you shall be witnesses unto me yes we witness by our life but there's a danger in making that a cop out, because one other requirement of a witness is that they talk, they've gotta say what they know, these four men were good witnesses, they went back and they told the city what they had found, and there's placed upon you and me that responsibility to go back and to tell what we've found, this is a day of good tidings, we do wrong to keep silent. - +er he'll, he's a good fighter and a good, a good, a good but there's certain points you can pick holes . +somebody once said that if angelism, sharing the gospel was one beggar telling another beggar about bread, where it could be found and undoubtedly when he was saying that he was thinking of that story that account that we had read to us earlier from the second book of kings, chapter seven, and i'd like us to er turn back to us for a few moments this morning and perhaps draw some lessons for ourselves sometimes as christians its very easier for us to say what sins are, and we can see other people's failings, you don't have to be a christian to do that of course, plenty of other people can do that, they see the failings of other people, they see the wrong doing they do, they see their wickedness their, their waywardness, whatever words we want to use to describe it, and we say well that is sin, perhaps for most of us this morning we could make er a list a, a, a tabulate a table of sins and we might say well they are worse sins and there are lesser sins and i would i suppose by and large there would be a fairly reasonable consensus of opinion regarding what was sins and what were not sins. +sometimes the bible surprises us a little bit of course, and it puts it finger on things that we perhaps don't really want to talk about or we don't even consider as sins and the bible is quite clear that not all sins are what we do often there what we don't do in parable that jesus told concerning the traveller, the man who went down to jericho, we don't condemn the priest and the levite for what they did, but we do condemn them for what they didn't do, their sin was not what they did, it was what they left undone, going over and looking at the man was very note worthy, as least there was some interest there and we don't condemn them for that, but we do condemn them for hurrying along and not reaching out and helping the man in the pistol of james and chapter four and verse seventeen james says there, any one then who knows the good he ought to do and doesn't do it, sins so the sins that you and i comment or the sins rather that we are guilty of are not just the things that we do there of times the things that we don't do and sometimes there more difficult for us to put a finger on, we can justify them so very easily its been said that all it needs for evil to triumph, is for good men to say or to do nothing well lets look at the, that,illu illustration there that we have in the second book of kings. +as i mentioned early the, the city of sermaria it was under siege and the army of seria was encamped all around it, ben hadad was a great warrior, he would of been the, the alexander or the napoleon of his day and he had set up this encampment around the city of sermaria, nobody could get in, nobody could get out and very quickly the stocks of food and water er were used up, rationing would of been introduced but it only lasted for a certain period, they'd got to the stage it tells us in the previous chapter that er, that a donkeys head was sold for eighty shekel's of silver and some folk had even got to the, had sunk to the level of cannibalism, of eating their own children and the city was, when they heard about this they were in an uproar and they started blaming god and in between the city of sermaria of all its suffering and hopelessness and helplessness and the army encamped about with all of their supplies, there was this area of no mans land in which they were caught up four men who were leapers and they were trapped there, they didn't want to go over to the serians because they'd be killed, they didn't want to go back into the city because they weren't allowed there and any way what was the point, they'd only die of starvation in there and so these four men are caught up in no man's land and yet their no better off than people in the city, now god had promised deliverance, through his serve and eliger he had promised deliverance, eliger said tomorrow about this time a measure of fine flour shall be sold for a se shekel and two measures of barley for a shekel in the gate of semaria, he said the gates are gonna be open, there's gonna be food and its gonna be a reasonable price and it says the royal officer who's hand the king was leaning on said the man of god said behold, if the lord shall make windows in heaven could such a thing be, he said don't talk stupid man, how can such a thing happen for us?, he didn't believe what god servant said and eliger brings out to him a terrible judgment, he says because of your unbelief you will see it, but your not participate in it but lets look at these four men for a moment, cos that's where our real interest lies this morning, i just wanted to say three things in their experience, the first things is that they were amazed that, at what they found, because after they come together and they talk about it and they said well what shall we do and they weighed the pro's and the cons and semaria doesn't look very attractive with its cannibalism, they said well the least if we stay here were gonna die, if we go into semaria we'll die, lets go down to the serein camp, the worse they can do to us is put us to death and were dying men any way, but they may just take pity on us, we maybe allowed to grope around in their dustbins and get some scraps of food, they may at least allow us that, and so they make their way down just as evening is falling, they make their way down to the serein lines and when they get there, they are amazed at what they find, you see their condition was helpless and hopeless, they were dying men any way, they were lepers, but they were dying of starvation, that was far more imminent than their leprosy, their problems and their needs were greater than themselves, they could not meet their own needs, their problems and their needs were greater than their government, the king in semaria and all of his court could not meet the needs of his people and then in verse five, we read something there, they arose at twilight to go to the camp of aramians or the serein's and when they came to the outskirts of the camp of the serein's behold there was no one there, they expected to at least meet a guard, there would surely be somebody on sentry duty even if the rest of the soldiers had gone in to their tents and were perhaps getting ready for their, for the evening, going to bed or whatever they were gonna be doing, having their evening meal, there would at least be somebody on guard duty, but when they got there, there was no one there, god had stepped in, god had intervened and the good news of the christian gospel is that god has intervened in our, in the midst of our helplessness, in the midst of our hopelessness, god has intervened, he had stepped in to history, so often you'll hear folks say, well why doesn't god do something, why does god allow this to happen, why does god allow that one, why doesn't he do something all they really show by that comment is their own ignorance, because god has done something, god has intervened, listen to what it says in john three sixteen, for god so loved the world that he gave, he's only son and the er, the er apostle paul and he's writing to the gallations, in chapter four and in verses four and five hear what he says there,but when the time had fully come god sent his son, born of a woman, born under law to redeem those under law that we might receive the full rights of son, er of sons , god has done something, he's sent his son jesus christ into this world in fact his done the greatest thing he could do, he has done the very ultimate thing, he has sent his son into the world that's the greatest intervention god could ever have made, it was far greater than, than just intervening in sm , in some small local event, were you see some catastrophe happening and you say well why doesn't god do something there, or there's a war situation going on in some other part of the world, well why doesn't god step in and stop it, god has stepped in, not in a local situation, not in some er passing problem or need but he's stepped into the greatest way possible by sending his son jesus christ into the world to dye for men and woman, to take away sin, to pay the price that god's righteousness demands for sin so god has intervened and his intervention has changed the whole situation, its brought a whole new complexion on things, its changed the colour completely, no longer is the world now under darkness and in, and in pending judgment in doom, because jesus christ came and he took that judgment and that, that condemnation upon himself, he said i've not come to condemn the world he said its already condemned, its already under judgement, the sword of damocles is already hanging over the world and jesus christ came in and to take that judgment and that condemnation on himself and when he died there on the cross and rose again, there came that burst of light in a world that had been shrouded in blackness and darkness, a world that had been shrouded in sin suddenly for the first time sees the light, god has paid for himself the price of sin, god has intervened and changed the whole situation and the message of the gospel is that if you and i allow that intervention to effect us personally, then like those four men surely we too are amazed at what we've found. +if we've come to guard and received forgiveness of sins, if we have become good followers of jesus christ and we are not amazed then there's something wrong with what we've received that god should so love, not just the world, but should so love me, that he gave his son to die for me and that was the sort of er discovery that these four lepers made they've come down there, they've found that the sight before them was amazing, there was no enemy there, the enemy had disappeared and the tents with all their contents were there before them, they were amazed with what they found and you and i when we come to god through jesus christ, we are amazed at what we find, we find forgiveness, we find the restoration of a relationship between ourselves and god, we find an access to receive god's blessing to receive his favour, to receive his gifts that he has for us, no wonder the apostle paul cries out thanks beyond to god for his unspeakable gift, but then again these four men they were not just amazed that what they found, they were, they got absorbed in what they got, because they got a lot more than they bargained for, they possibly in their wildest dreams thought they might at least get, get what the cook was throwing out, they might get to, to the dustbins, they might get what was left over, that would of been great, they were dying of starvation, the driest mouldiest crust would of been like, like a banquet to them, but they got so much more than they anticipated and they got absorbed in it, every thing was there's for the taking as they pulled back the, the flap of the tent as they go in and they see the tables laid out there, they see the food and the drink, they see the plenty, these men who for weeks have known terrible poverty, there might of been a time earlier on in the siege when a few scraps got thrown over the city wall, when the bins were put out the side of the city of an evening, er they would go there and forage amongst them, but all that had stopped long since and it was only the bits and pieces that they managed to forage for themselves and get for themselves that they'd been eating of late, but here every thing is there for the taking, they rubbed their eyes, they pinched one another to make sure their not dreaming, it really is food and drink in a, in an abundance they couldn't of thought of a few mo hours earlier one moment they had nothing, the next they've got every thing, what was it they needed, food, the tables would of been laden with it, it was the food, enough food for an army and there's only four of them, did they, were they thirsty, here was drink, here was wine and, and drink in abundance the rags, the tatters they were dressed in, there were garments and wardrobe full of clothes here for them, did they need money, well the tents were full of the gold and the silver and, and, and valuables, there were a sufficiency, every thing was there you know the idea that the christian life is drab and poor is such a terrible false hood, its an iniquitous lie of the devil, the tragedy is that we have actually often made it that way, we have made the christian faith something drab, something boring, something for old folk er and er you know, people who are, who are, just wanting a crutch because their coming to the end of their natural life and we've made it something drab and dull listen to what the apostle paul says when he's writing to carinthian's in his second letter in chapter eight, he says you know the grace of our lord jesus christ, that though he was rich for your sakes he became poor, so that you through his poverty might be rich, god, he's purpose follows his people, he's not that we've a drab, grey, dull uninteresting life, jesus said i've come that you might of life, and that more abundant, that in all its fullness and god has purpose for us, and when paul is talking about riches there, he's not talking about pounds and pence, he's talking about the richness of the life that we enjoy its not a case of not doing this and having to do that the other thing, its a case of enjoying life as god purposes it, as god intends it you know if you don't enjoy your christian life now, let me tell you your in for a rude awakening when you get to heaven, because the quality of life is not gonna change the only things that'll change is its la it, it will, it will be in his presence, the quality of life will not change because already now we have received eternal life, he has given his life to us and he hasn't got some other special, you know, super duper life laid up, there's nothing, there's nothing greater ahead, god hasn't got any thing greater for us than what he's already given to us in embryonic form here and now why if we take on er a, a, a dazzling scintillating new zest and zap when you get to heaven, that life is already given to you and to me know go back to these four men at the moment, they had never known any thing like this before this was better than all their birthdays rolled into one, this was the greatest day in their experience and if they would live to be a hundred they would never know another day like this, they were having a tremendous time, it said they, they, they, they went into one tent, listen to what they did, they went into one tent and they, they ate, they drank, they had a party and they carried from there the silver, the gold and the clothes and they went and hid they returned and entered another tent and then they did the same there, they were having a tremendous time, this was a beano to end all beano's, this was the greatest day in their life, they were having a wonderful time and why shouldn't they, why not you know there are folk who would, who'd want to make us as christians er and er, ee, put us into a straight jacket the bible tells me even the sunsets free, is free indeed and i don't see any suggestions as i read the new testament, that first of all the life of jesus was drab and uninteresting, or that he expects me as his follow to lead a drab, a grey life, oh its not always gonna be a ple an easy life but that doesn't reduce the, the zest and the excitement in it but you see the danger is when having a good time is the reason for living and the only reason for it, you see, if god has intervened in our life, if the message of the gospel is true, if god in christ has taken away your sin and made you in christ a new creation then you have every reason to enjoy life, in a sense your only able to start enjoying life now, you may have enjoyed some of the things that, that folks suggest that make up life, but they've finished, there gone, what happens when the, when, when the wine has run out, what happens when the parties over, you know all about it the next day, don't you, what happens then, its such short lived, its only worth having whilst its coming to you all the time, but that's not so with a christian life, because it doe , depend on just the things that we have or the experiences that we go through, because it is something that, that we have within, it is, it is a quality of life that we possess, because we possess the one who is life himself, listen to what paul says when he's writing to timothy in his first letter in chapter six it is command those who are rich in this present world not to be arrogant or to put their hope in wealth, those who think that, that er in having possessions that is the secret of life or, or in having a good time and, and, and the rest of it that is what life is all about, he said warn them not to do that, because that is so uncertain, he says but to put their hope in god who richly provides us with every thing what for, for our enjoyment, why has god given us these things, why is, why is god even, he is natural creation there for us, it is for our enjoyment, its not to make us miserable or to make us grey and drab and burden by it, it is for us to enjoy, when god created ada adam and eve and put them in the garden, the, they were told to enjoy it, even the fruit enjoy it, its there for your benefit and then the new creation, every thing that god has provided is there for our enjoyment, but the dangers is when that enjoyment, is the reason for living and that's all we do it for and were so taking up with ourselves, i am gonna have my good time, i'm gonna enjoy myself as a christian and i can do it and you can do it, you become insular and we become introverted and the only thing that matters is me having a good time, my world centres around me and me enjoying myself and me having this and me having that, this blessing and that gift and that other blessing, we become self centred and taken up with our own good times, as long as i can be there in the centre, as long as i can go from, from, from this celebration to that celebration, as long as i can go from this er festival to that festival to this special meeting to that one, i'm gonna have my good time well that was what these fella's were doing, they were going from tent to tent, from celebration to celebration having a great time and then the truth hit them they were ashamed with what they had done, they said to one another we are not doing right, this days a day of good news, but we are keeping silent, if we wait until morning light punishment will overtake us, now therefore, come, let us go and tell the kings household how guilty are we, how guilty are you, how guilty am i of the sinner silence, remember how we started, its not always the things that we do its often the things that we don't do, how guilty are we of the sin of silence these men had known nothing, known poverty and, and, and, and starvation, they were amazed at what they'd found, they'd became absorbed in what they had got and now they'd became ashamed of what they had done with it what was the sin that troubled these men they said we are keeping silent. +back in the city there were thousand of people doomed, dying and all unnecessarily because here was plenty, here was sufficient for the whole city and possibly the greatest sin that you and i can be guilty of and that the church is generally guilty of, but you know when we talk about the church generally its, its so easy because that's general, you and i that are the church, not the denomination, not the organization, it you and i, possibly the greatest sin that we can be guilty of is the sin of silence, i'm not talking now about a rude, belligerent, discourteous, butting hole, button holding of people, i'm not talking about that, i don't see any place in gods word for that sort of attitude or that sort of approach but are we still silent, what about with those with whom we have the right, because we've created a relationship, because they know us and they've seen us and they've seen the experiences we've gone through and they've seen what god has done in our lives, what about with those people do we wait for others to do it, shifting the responsibility. +thinking in, in, in the context of our, of our mission, this town wide mission, well that's billy's job, he's better at it than i am, but its not his job, its my job as much as its his and its your job as much as its mine, we do not well to keep silent these men they were troubled by their sin of silence, perhaps you and i should be troubled by our sin of silence because the extension of that, and here's the really great thing, as far as they were concerned, the ex the, the ongoing because they were troubled by their sin of silence and they did something about it, they were thrilled at the sight that they saw, as they see the city being delivered, and as they see starving men and women eating food perhaps for the first time in days or weeks, buying good wholesome food at a reasonable price, that was the sigh that thrilled them and you can imagine them, and i think they'd be entitled to a little bit of pride that i'm glad we told them, i'm glad we went back and shared the news apart from any thing we couldn't of coped with all ourselves, it would of been so wrong to of kept it, it would of been so wrong just to of eaten it ourselves, i'm glad we went back and told them. +jesus said just before he was living his disciples, his followers, you and me, he said you shall receive power after the holy spirit has come upon you and you shall be witnesses unto me yes we witness by our life but there's a danger in making that a cop out, because one other requirement of a witness is that they talk, they've gotta say what they know, these four men were good witnesses, they went back and they told the city what they had found, and there's placed upon you and me that responsibility to go back and to tell what we've found, this is a day of good tidings, we do wrong to keep silent. my name is les , i work for wiltshire county council. what follows is a meeting of the wiltshire county council's policy and resources committee held on tuesday twenty-fifth january 1994. on the agenda is membership changes. @@ -53060,9 +53012,9 @@ second item on the agenda is election of chairman could i have nominations pleas mr is there a seconder for mr ? are there any other nominations? -mr is elected chairman -yeah, look yeah, i'm just yeah, yeah -the next item is the election of vice chairman erm, do you wish to defer this item? +mr is elected chairman +yeah, look yeah, i'm just yeah, yeah +the next item is the election of vice chairman erm, do you wish to defer this item? anybody not? that is deferred. next item is apologies @@ -53074,43 +53026,43 @@ is everyone agreeable to the recording of today's proceedings? aye are there any against? that is agreed. -second announcement is the victoria county history exhibition, i wish to bring to members attention bring members attention to the victoria county history exhibition currently taking place in the old county hall foyer. +second announcement is the victoria county history exhibition, i wish to bring to members attention bring members attention to the victoria county history exhibition currently taking place in the old county hall foyer. i hope members will find time to visit this exhibition which is on today, tomorrow and thursday. item six attendance of non- members of the committee. -mr in respect of item seventeen the environmental strategy +mr in respect of item seventeen the environmental strategy thank you. item seven, members allowances, cash limits. -erm i'll like to deal with this in a if possible in a number of separate motions so that we can deal with the various bits of work that need to be done, but i'll call mr first -thank you chair, erm, in likelihood that i, i mean you may wish to these separately as well but i'll group wish to see, is to, a is to approve an extension of the maximum aggregate by five per cent, b officers continue to monitor expenditure reporting to group leaders monthly and c officers and group leaders look into the allowance scheme to see if any suitable alterations need to be made. +erm i'll like to deal with this in a if possible in a number of separate motions so that we can deal with the various bits of work that need to be done, but i'll call mr first +thank you chair, erm, in likelihood that i, i mean you may wish to these separately as well but i'll group wish to see, is to, a is to approve an extension of the maximum aggregate by five per cent, b officers continue to monitor expenditure reporting to group leaders monthly and c officers and group leaders look into the allowance scheme to see if any suitable alterations need to be made. yes, erm, i had in mind that, is there a seconder to that?my own view is that erm, and that goes for most of the way for dealing with the problem, but i think it would be appropriate for this committee to make it clear that erm, any extension of the maximum aggregate for the current financial year will be met by an appropriate reduction or a corresponding reduction in the expenditure for ninety four ninety five, erm and i'm not certain that that's absolutely clear to the public or indeed to all members of chair as you say it is legally required -i mean if, if, if, if the principal of the five per cent is acceptable then if you wish to qualify the being put in from the words you said then that is acceptable by the labour group. -okay, but i just wanted to go on to say that i think in reviewing how the budget may be brought more closely under control in the coming year, officers will need to look at the erm size of the committees because we are working with committees at the moment that are larger than those committees which used to exist when this year's budget was set and that has had some impact and we need to have the implications of any change of committee size whether that might affect the budget, how that would affect the budget, also whether there is any potential for reducing the number of committees further and also whether the rates might be changed, i particularly would like officers to report on what, whether there would be any significant saving from er setting the rates at the round figures they were at a couple of years ago erm -ten pound and twenty pound and twenty-five pound which apart from anything else i found easier to remember when filling out a form, but i think that may think it's not worth doing. +i mean if, if, if, if the principal of the five per cent is acceptable then if you wish to qualify the being put in from the words you said then that is acceptable by the labour group. +okay, but i just wanted to go on to say that i think in reviewing how the budget may be brought more closely under control in the coming year, officers will need to look at the erm size of the committees because we are working with committees at the moment that are larger than those committees which used to exist when this year's budget was set and that has had some impact and we need to have the implications of any change of committee size whether that might affect the budget, how that would affect the budget, also whether there is any potential for reducing the number of committees further and also whether the rates might be changed, i particularly would like officers to report on what, whether there would be any significant saving from er setting the rates at the round figures they were at a couple of years ago erm +ten pound and twenty pound and twenty-five pound which apart from anything else i found easier to remember when filling out a form, but i think that may think it's not worth doing. i think the most important thing is to make clear, i'm hoping to make clear somewhere that next year this council will have a members allowance budget which is one and a half percent more than this year, at the maximum, and it may not even have that i'm not certain that we've agreed that with the policy committee, i don't know if anybody knows if we have yes we have, well i would erm, let's see how do we do this, we've got a motion on the floor, erm, anybody else? mr -chairman i have an amendment to that motion, because, because i believe it's important that we start to identify a lot of councils publish at the end of the year for public consumption a list of the allowances drawn by members, and i think that would be very useful and i would make, as an amendment, i would, would add to the proposal put by mr that we call for a report to be pu er, to be presented to us of the amounts of allowances drawn by members, each member +chairman i have an amendment to that motion, because, because i believe it's important that we start to identify a lot of councils publish at the end of the year for public consumption a list of the allowances drawn by members, and i think that would be very useful and i would make, as an amendment, i would, would add to the proposal put by mr that we call for a report to be pu er, to be presented to us of the amounts of allowances drawn by members, each member would you accept that, that should be for the financial year ? more than happy chairman that, that, that it should be that -can i, can i, if i, if there's a second can i -speak to my +can i, can i, if i, if there's a second can i +speak to my i view with considerable concern erm, what has happened since may, in, in the field of allowances. over the last few years the members allowances have been reduced, er, er have been underspent quite considerably on the amount that's been allowed. each year the amount has gone up by inflation, and yet we see something approaching thirty thousand underspent on previous years, and here we are looking in the first year of this council to a, a, at least a five percent overspend and er, i wonder if we've erm, excluded the time when there weren't many meetings at the beginning if we wouldn't have seen a considerably larger overspend. i'm, in my own mind, i'm sure this is due to a proliferation of working parties, extra committee meetings a ,a , and seminars, and i personally think it's typical of when your party get anywhere near control that there is always more talking and less action, but i do believe that we ,we , we're, we are not looking good in the eyes of the public in this overspending of our own allowances. i think you've got to do something drastic, at the end of last year a considerable number of working parties and committees were actually reduced or eliminated, and i look at education and i look at the sub- committees of education, they've all been replaced by working parties now that meet more and more regularly. -we can't go on paying ourselves that sort of money, we can't go on, and mr i know in a minute we'll talk about the number of people who attend committee meetings erm and sit in on them, and that's increased considerably, erm, so i think it's important that we do get down to this problem, we grasp the nettle, and i, i believe that will mean that we start to look seriously at reducing the number of times members come and talk here, and perhaps we let the officers get on with the action that they should be getting on with -thank you chairman, erm, i've heard what mr said then i think it is worth reminding ourselves that a significant number of members of this council are new to this council and it's therefore quite right and proper that in the first year of the business of this council that there should be a significant number of seminars and briefings to enable members to fully acquaint themselves with the business of the council the working of the er, operations of this council so that we can in fact make informed decisions er in the future. +we can't go on paying ourselves that sort of money, we can't go on, and mr i know in a minute we'll talk about the number of people who attend committee meetings erm and sit in on them, and that's increased considerably, erm, so i think it's important that we do get down to this problem, we grasp the nettle, and i, i believe that will mean that we start to look seriously at reducing the number of times members come and talk here, and perhaps we let the officers get on with the action that they should be getting on with +thank you chairman, erm, i've heard what mr said then i think it is worth reminding ourselves that a significant number of members of this council are new to this council and it's therefore quite right and proper that in the first year of the business of this council that there should be a significant number of seminars and briefings to enable members to fully acquaint themselves with the business of the council the working of the er, operations of this council so that we can in fact make informed decisions er in the future. i entirely accept that if er, four years on we were still doing the same thing that then they'd be er, some erm, requirement for er, cutting back but i think it is also worth reminding ourselves that due to the action of this conservative government in er, forcing the local government review, er, we are facing the spectre er, of an additional full meeting of this council, and indeed we have had to er, respond to that government initiative. so it's by no means only er, arising from the erm, need to get on with the business of the council, some of the work that we're facing at the present moment has been forced on us er, through no fault of our own because of government action. -thank you chairman, i, i second er 's motion, erm trying to be not political about this i got some figures from the er county council which indicate that from the first of april ninety-two to the thirty-first of december ninety-two eighty-six members attended committee meetings of which they were not members. +thank you chairman, i, i second er 's motion, erm trying to be not political about this i got some figures from the er county council which indicate that from the first of april ninety-two to the thirty-first of december ninety-two eighty-six members attended committee meetings of which they were not members. from the first of april ninety-three to the thirty-first of december ninety-three, that figure is a hundred and sixty-five, so therefore it, it, it's doubled in effect. -now if you assume that they were paid somewhere between a half-day allowance and a full-day allowance, you're probably looking at somewhere up towards fifteen hundred pounds. -now there are occasions where members legitimately need to attend committees to speak to something in which they have an interest but the difficulty is, that in the past when we had permanent chairman, a member who wanted to attend the meeting had to ask the permission of that permanent chairman and there are occasions when that permanent chairman thought, well, there is no need for that member to attend and he has said no. -in the present situation, the officers find themselves in a very difficult position, i cannot imagine an officer saying no to a member and this is what has happened if we run out of money, then the very thing that we are seeking to do, in other words to implement the democratic process to allow people to come to meetings and speak will go by the way, and i can remember some time ago when i was a new member on here saying i would be prepared to attend property sub-committee briefings as a deputy and not be paid and i was very smartly brought up by a friend in the labour group who said that's all right for you, you can afford it, but it's not alright for some of us 'cause we can't. and the difficulty is if we run out of money and we either have to stop the allowances or we have to slash the allowances, yeah, knows who it was, we have to slash the allowances, then legitimately people will be able to say that the democratic process is being stifled because they are not going to be allowed to go to meetings, and therefore, i think that situations whereby a member attends to speak to a, an item, a specific item and then stays on for a double length meetings and claims double length allowances that sort of thing has got to be stopped, and also members attending just to nod approval at something that has happened that they've been associated with, that should stop, if they want to come they should come at their own expense. +now if you assume that they were paid somewhere between a half-day allowance and a full-day allowance, you're probably looking at somewhere up towards fifteen hundred pounds. +now there are occasions where members legitimately need to attend committees to speak to something in which they have an interest but the difficulty is, that in the past when we had permanent chairman, a member who wanted to attend the meeting had to ask the permission of that permanent chairman and there are occasions when that permanent chairman thought, well, there is no need for that member to attend and he has said no. +in the present situation, the officers find themselves in a very difficult position, i cannot imagine an officer saying no to a member and this is what has happened if we run out of money, then the very thing that we are seeking to do, in other words to implement the democratic process to allow people to come to meetings and speak will go by the way, and i can remember some time ago when i was a new member on here saying i would be prepared to attend property sub-committee briefings as a deputy and not be paid and i was very smartly brought up by a friend in the labour group who said that's all right for you, you can afford it, but it's not alright for some of us 'cause we can't. and the difficulty is if we run out of money and we either have to stop the allowances or we have to slash the allowances, yeah, knows who it was, we have to slash the allowances, then legitimately people will be able to say that the democratic process is being stifled because they are not going to be allowed to go to meetings, and therefore, i think that situations whereby a member attends to speak to a, an item, a specific item and then stays on for a double length meetings and claims double length allowances that sort of thing has got to be stopped, and also members attending just to nod approval at something that has happened that they've been associated with, that should stop, if they want to come they should come at their own expense. but if we're not careful, the real people, the real people who should be are going to be the losers, because they would not be able to draw the attendance allowance which they need to attend. so, i mean what i'm saying is that i think we should have a league table if you like of, of attendances, i, i recognise that that may not be popular, but i think it's going to be one way of sorting out those people who attend every opportunity, and sometimes just to pat an officer on the back. this is not something that attendances allowance should be, should be used to pay for, and i think that unless we look at it very carefully indeed, and we perhaps get around to having a proper chairman for each committee instead of this sort of er, bugginses chart er, we're going to be faced with, with lots of difficulties. @@ -53120,67 +53072,67 @@ yes, let's not open up the debate about chairmanship of meetings er, got a coupl yes, thank you chairman. obviously one of the er, critical things is actually reduce the er, length of time at meetings, er, with that in mind i'll be very quick. unclear -as i say when you become a councillor you do not do it for money, i mean i think probably to be a better reason to become a councillor these days. +as i say when you become a councillor you do not do it for money, i mean i think probably to be a better reason to become a councillor these days. it affects your job, your job prospects, your family life and the hidden costs, such as letters, telephone calls leaflets and the rest of it, you do not do it for money. you seem to be sort of trying to encourage a guilt complex by this, this idea put forward by the conservatives, which is not the case, people should not feel guilty in trying to do the benefit that they can to benefit the people of wiltshire. -and i also don't think that there's any need for this extra recommendation in most commonwave that a question, and that is to actually find out the expenses claim by individuals. +and i also don't think that there's any need for this extra recommendation in most commonwave that a question, and that is to actually find out the expenses claim by individuals. written question or shall we give them a written answer? there's no need to actually to put it down as a recommendation that stays forever more, there's just no need for it. -the other things i'd like to put forward is the things that mr actually put forward, the idea of reducing committee sizes, reducing committee numbers. -perhaps maybe a cut off time for when a meeting should finish, which i think we'd all dearly love, maybe that very common in business, maybe it's about time we put it into council life as well, so those of progress, not trying to make people feel guilty but trying to serve the people they represent. +the other things i'd like to put forward is the things that mr actually put forward, the idea of reducing committee sizes, reducing committee numbers. +perhaps maybe a cut off time for when a meeting should finish, which i think we'd all dearly love, maybe that very common in business, maybe it's about time we put it into council life as well, so those of progress, not trying to make people feel guilty but trying to serve the people they represent. mr mr chair. erm, i seem to find myself in this committee in a minority of one. it's a little like listening to those debates in parliament where parliament vote themselves extra salaries and i feel very uncomfortable in this process, i thought i might be coming here this morning to disagree with my own group, or those members of them that don't agree with me, perhaps joined with the conservatives in opposing this motion, but i find in fact that everybody is saying oh let's put up the er, the heading, i feel very uncomfortable with this having spent six months in the budget review, criticising officers up hill and down dale every time that they exceeded their budget, having told them that either they balance their budget or that they came in next year with a budget with no more than a one and a half percent increase, or their successors would be doing it for us. i feel very uncomfortable therefore, to sit in a room full of members, sitting here proposing to add five percent to the limit for members allowances, simply because we've been unable to control our own behaviour, and to come in within that, i think it's a very poor example, and it's an example that i'm not prepared to set. -i am going to vote against the motion, i'm disappointed with the liberal group not come in with a more constructive amendment or even a proposal, as i would say asked you to do. +i am going to vote against the motion, i'm disappointed with the liberal group not come in with a more constructive amendment or even a proposal, as i would say asked you to do. i'm even more disappointed in the conservatives, for not opposing it, i don't object to their list of members being published, i don't see that that would do any harm, as far as i'm concerned, every employee could have their wages printed up on the wall. we are elected by the public to do a job and we shouldn't be ashamed of the amount of money that we're paid for it, and what i would say is, that no manifesto in may's election said we were going to come here and vote for more money for members, nobody put on their leaflets, vote for me and i will raise members allowances by five percent in the coming year, i didn't and i won't support that, and you will argue, perhaps some of you that that's not really what we're doing, but it look's like it, doesn't it? and i think it's close enough to looking like it that the public may believe it, and i hope the public won't believe it, but certainly i'm not prepared to allow them to think it of me, and therefore i will vote against the motion. okay, mr thank you mr chairman, just one point mr , we're not voting ourselves five percent more, we're taking five percent off next year's allowance and putting it to this one so it's a negative rollover, so we're actually spending some of next year's money this year. the point i'm going to make is that erm, if we aren't going to get through the year and we're all going to have to take a percentage of our march allowances because the money's run out and we're cash limited even if we give ourselves five percent extra, erm, could i get an assurance from the officers that the people that haven't put in their forms will get a note to remind them to do so, so that everybody is in there, you won't suddenly find that because you haven't had your claim form in by the fourteenth you're gonna get nothing and everybody else is gonna get something. -thank you, i think actually we've been debating mr 's amendment which seems to have widespread approval and i was ready to put that to the vote. +thank you, i think actually we've been debating mr 's amendment which seems to have widespread approval and i was ready to put that to the vote. mr i was just going to settle up to you, that was it. i think that just a few points that needs to be made. first of all i think at the end of the day that we all know a democracy never comes cheap, it's erm, there are cheaper alternatives for administering decisions, but erm, but dictatorship doesn't go well and therefore democracy will never come cheap. i do agree that there are some particular areas this year that are for concern. -there has been, i think has put it adequately very well, that there are members who've turned up really for no real reason but to speak on a minor item which members of their group could've taken on their behalf, and therefore erm, i, i do support that we need to look at that particular issue, and i think that can be dealt with under the present chairs arrange arrangement without having to have permanent chairs. +there has been, i think has put it adequately very well, that there are members who've turned up really for no real reason but to speak on a minor item which members of their group could've taken on their behalf, and therefore erm, i, i do support that we need to look at that particular issue, and i think that can be dealt with under the present chairs arrange arrangement without having to have permanent chairs. i also support the proposal to have a list published, i know who's gonna be top of the list, it's possibly going to be me, and i'm not ashamed of that so erm,let's go ahead and do it, 'cause it is public money, and the public have a right to know where that money's going, so i'm not ashamed of that. -i think that also that said to me at the point that there is, people need to er, be paid attendance because otherwise you deny people the opportunity to be able to stand for council,there , otherwise you are going to end up with those that are either rich or retired as the only people who can attend a council which , and therefore we must remember that and make sure those who want to have the opportunity to participate in local government are actually compensated for their, for their erm, for their work. -okay, taking a vote on mr 's amendment, which is to ask officers to publish a list of allowances claimed, i think that's all allowances, but not presum , not necess , and including travel and subsistence. +i think that also that said to me at the point that there is, people need to er, be paid attendance because otherwise you deny people the opportunity to be able to stand for council,there , otherwise you are going to end up with those that are either rich or retired as the only people who can attend a council which , and therefore we must remember that and make sure those who want to have the opportunity to participate in local government are actually compensated for their, for their erm, for their work. +okay, taking a vote on mr 's amendment, which is to ask officers to publish a list of allowances claimed, i think that's all allowances, but not presum , not necess , and including travel and subsistence. okay, not travel. for the years ninety-one two, ninety-two-three, ninety-three- four those in favour of that amendment please show. ., and the against? and that is carried, before taking the motion -amendment which i hope will financial control which is that the of financial services shall have no discretion to accept claims for the financial year ninety-three ninety-four, submitted after the thirtieth of june nineteen-ninety- four, that effectively means that that two month rule which he does have discretion on he will not have in the case of late claims in this financial year, that means we'll know exactly what the figures are, by the thirtieth of june. +amendment which i hope will financial control which is that the of financial services shall have no discretion to accept claims for the financial year ninety-three ninety-four, submitted after the thirtieth of june nineteen-ninety- four, that effectively means that that two month rule which he does have discretion on he will not have in the case of late claims in this financial year, that means we'll know exactly what the figures are, by the thirtieth of june. can i put that, does anybody want to debate that? i thought actually we had a standing order already that claims had to be in within a certain time limit yes, yes and i believe that, that three months is the time limit two months -two months but he had discretion +two months but he had discretion well, oh i see you're removing the discretion,ke in this particular case we're removing that discretion to try and tie the year down. right, well, well debated, do you want to speak on that? -yes i would if i may. -can i just reassure mr that if actually we were not, er, if we were discussing an increase in members allowances then i would be fair square with him. -we're in a position where we're going to borrow a bit from next year, that actually puts the pressure on as i see it's about nine or ten thousand extra this year, the allowance is about a hundred and eighty thousand, the total, erm, we're adding nine or ten thousand to that, we're taking it off it for next year, so we've already got ourselves something like an eighteen to twenty thousand reduction in members allowances next year so the pressure is on to resolve the problem, and er, perhaps mr might feel that actually that extra pressure might make us resolve it. +yes i would if i may. +can i just reassure mr that if actually we were not, er, if we were discussing an increase in members allowances then i would be fair square with him. +we're in a position where we're going to borrow a bit from next year, that actually puts the pressure on as i see it's about nine or ten thousand extra this year, the allowance is about a hundred and eighty thousand, the total, erm, we're adding nine or ten thousand to that, we're taking it off it for next year, so we've already got ourselves something like an eighteen to twenty thousand reduction in members allowances next year so the pressure is on to resolve the problem, and er, perhaps mr might feel that actually that extra pressure might make us resolve it. i got the dates wrong, it's the thirtieth of may that's two months after the end, so the amendment i'm moving thank you, er, mr on the amendment, on the amendment, as you're seeking to amend standing orders, is this committee able to do that? -i think the particular point about the two month rule which may be extended at the discretion of the director, which obvious taking his discretion away, i don't think that's a standing order +i think the particular point about the two month rule which may be extended at the discretion of the director, which obvious taking his discretion away, i don't think that's a standing order yeah, i, i don't think it's a standing order sir, i think its part of erm, i'm just trying to find it, it's part of the member's allowances, and this committee is charged with dealing with member's allowances. can i put that to the vote?say aye aye -well now, i think and i think we may i would say that erm, i improving the qualified budget as well,but there's no doubt , i put the motion to the vote, those in favour please show +well now, i think and i think we may i would say that erm, i improving the qualified budget as well,but there's no doubt , i put the motion to the vote, those in favour please show aye and the against . -agenda item eight mr 's appointment to the sub-committee of the west regional association with deaf, for the deaf, should be an approved duty for the payment of travelling and subsistence allowances only. +agenda item eight mr 's appointment to the sub-committee of the west regional association with deaf, for the deaf, should be an approved duty for the payment of travelling and subsistence allowances only. on the grounds that this is erm, now appropriately remote from the county council's work. mr . yes chairman, i think that before you phrased that motion you might have enquired as to the circumstances of this, and, and everything that surrounds it. @@ -53197,33 +53149,33 @@ it has put in it's place, a, er a general purposes and finance sub- committee, t now, the, the membership of this particular, er, special purposes committee if you like, erm is the core officers and three other members, and they called for volunteers, and one came from avon, one came from dorset, put his name forward from wiltshire. now i am one of the officers on there which gives two members from wiltshire a seat on this particular committee. however, we have no executive committee, and we have only one other meeting a year, erm, if you, i, i would like you to suggest that if you accept this restructuring of er, the organisation, and the fact that the members will not be attending other meetings during the year, you might see fit to allow the attendance allowance on this particular sub-committee. -thank you, er mr that was, was quite, erm, was quite informative, very. -i just wanted to check what the position of the old executive committee of the w r a d which been appointed, whether that was in fact erm, something that qualified for a full allowance. +thank you, er mr that was, was quite, erm, was quite informative, very. +i just wanted to check what the position of the old executive committee of the w r a d which been appointed, whether that was in fact erm, something that qualified for a full allowance. miss yeah, but, i mean i was just, erm, i found that very informative as well, i was very disappointed that if that much money er, information was available that we were not given it as members, because it would have made decision making far more sensible, but erm, -i as an amendment as i am involved in the attendance allowance . +i as an amendment as i am involved in the attendance allowance . er, i must, i always claim the attendance allowance when it has been as executive, as i've been the one member from wiltshire attending. whenever there's been officers get together, then w r a d itself paid for my travelling expenses and i have never claimed that from the authority, as i didn't believe that was proper. but as the organisation has seen to be when it meets generally speaking, the council and the executive are one and the same dealing with exactly the same business, i've considered it a meeting of the organisation, and the organisation now basically is going to be the seven sub-committee plus an annual general meeting of it's full council. miss -well, i mean, i think, er from, i mean certainly i don't know how you feel chairman, but my view of this has changed if what mr says is correct, then it seems that this seems, that this is the, the basic sort of day to day decision making erm, group, erm, and far more central to the purposes of w r a d than previously appeared, and there would seem to me therefore to be some case of paying an attendance allowance or else erm, deferring the decision erm, until we have even more information, but i think, if it really is the, the, the sort of decision making bit then attendance allowance ought to be paid. +well, i mean, i think, er from, i mean certainly i don't know how you feel chairman, but my view of this has changed if what mr says is correct, then it seems that this seems, that this is the, the basic sort of day to day decision making erm, group, erm, and far more central to the purposes of w r a d than previously appeared, and there would seem to me therefore to be some case of paying an attendance allowance or else erm, deferring the decision erm, until we have even more information, but i think, if it really is the, the, the sort of decision making bit then attendance allowance ought to be paid. who seconds i'm, i'm happy to second -members please show and the against. -the members say aye +members please show and the against. +the members say aye aye -against +against attendance allowances for members, i would move that er, a scheme be commenced from the first of april ninety-four, and that the wording attached to the paper, be altered in two respects,in place of the phrase is a person over sixty-nine years of age, the words is an elderly person, and more significantly at the end of paragraph four, and normally lives with a member as part of the member's family and be able to be left at th , be unable to be left unsupervised, be added, and that er, power to delegate a director of financial to amend the rates of allowances from time to time rates of attendance allowance for members, and that the scheme be met from the overall member's allowance to which we recently referring. okay, miss -erm, yes, well i'm very glad you've moved the amendments about the scheme. +erm, yes, well i'm very glad you've moved the amendments about the scheme. i don't quite know what's, what happened, because i remember very well amending these details the last time it came to policy and resources, and that was agreed, because the changes you have made use the working, wording of the thamesdown scheme, it seems to me far better, erm, as you have moved it, because er, very many people who are elderly, who are sixty-nine years or more or less don't need any supervision at all. erm, indeed some eighty ninety year olds don't need any supervision, on the other hand some people in their early sixties may need to be looked after, and, you know, i don't fancy the idea of anybody being able to claim allowances because they've fit granny, erm, on the other hand anybody who needs to ought to be able to, and i think this wording secures that. thank you chairman. erm, i, i shall oppose er, your motion erm, on on two grounds. -erm, firstly, we are looking at carers for employees, and we're unlikely to come up with very much, because we haven't got much money to do it. -and yet we are seeing as members, coming back to mr 's point, making a, setting an example which is opposite to that which we force on our employees. +erm, firstly, we are looking at carers for employees, and we're unlikely to come up with very much, because we haven't got much money to do it. +and yet we are seeing as members, coming back to mr 's point, making a, setting an example which is opposite to that which we force on our employees. and the other one is financial. -if members allowances are a hundred and eighty thousand this year which is somewhere around there, mr may correct me but i think i'm not too far out, we've already upped those this year to a hundred and eighty- nine, so next year there'll be a hundred and seventy-one and the thirteen thousand cost of this will reduce it to a hundred and fifty-eight i actually don't think that is possible, we can't afford it within the terms of of the present set up, unless someone's going to dramatically reduce the length and the number of meetings in this council, which i think is highly unlikely, i think we've got to set a good example to our employees, i think that this would give completely the wrong message. +if members allowances are a hundred and eighty thousand this year which is somewhere around there, mr may correct me but i think i'm not too far out, we've already upped those this year to a hundred and eighty- nine, so next year there'll be a hundred and seventy-one and the thirteen thousand cost of this will reduce it to a hundred and fifty-eight i actually don't think that is possible, we can't afford it within the terms of of the present set up, unless someone's going to dramatically reduce the length and the number of meetings in this council, which i think is highly unlikely, i think we've got to set a good example to our employees, i think that this would give completely the wrong message. we're looking after ourselves, er, but we're not prepared to look after them, and, i'm afraid i have to oppose it. i'll just make a humorous point, i've got a sick dog, but i see that isn't er, covered. yeah, well,, mr . @@ -53236,7 +53188,7 @@ i believe there's two aspects to this. there's the firstly that of young children, and it's something that i remember putting a motion to in the last administration about a creche or whatever or looking into this facility, in the fact of erm, trying to encourage more people with young families to erm, actually get involved in local government and politics. but i think there's also the other end of the scale which is, which is what, you've slightly amended this year, is the fact of elderly people erm, i know recently that myself have gone through the fact of my gran had er, was going through a very sick period, and if she'd have come back home, it would have been very difficult for me to have had to look after her at the same time as trying to attend my council duties, and this would have been the same for my dad, and the additional income which this would have brought, to have paid someone to be able to look after her whilst we were at council meetings, and you can remember that these meetings sometimes go on, you can say well, this meeting should be over by one o'clock then it goes on till three o'clock or whatever, and then peop , the problems mount up for that person left on their own, and i think that those things have to be taken into consideration, and i believe that this is the first step forward in trying to recognise that people have responsibilities outside of the council chamber. thank you, mr -thank you very much mr chairman, i would like to endorse what mr has said, erm, i assume that this carer's allowance is aimed primarily er, at er, women with dependant children. +thank you very much mr chairman, i would like to endorse what mr has said, erm, i assume that this carer's allowance is aimed primarily er, at er, women with dependant children. erm, and i feel very strongly, and i urge members to consider that we should support this as a matter of principle, to help er, that group of our society, i me , i was going to suggest an amendment that we ask for the average age of this council erm, to be published along with the expense claims? yes, to be published along with the expense claims. @@ -53244,14 +53196,14 @@ although joking apart i urge members to support this on principle, i think we sh thank you. sorry,i'd better re ,re , er remove the word married, women with dependent children should be helped to represent their communities. thank you. -yes, i'd p , i would personally prefer the word people or parents +yes, i'd p , i would personally prefer the word people or parents no, i, i, i, just, just a cover note, i think it's quite true that this is one of the small steps one can make to make it a little bit more possible for people with dependents to take a full part in local government, and the majority of the people who are excluded at the moment are in practise erm, women with dependent children, but there are many other people including men, and including people with dependent elderly relatives, and i think we need to make it the rule rather than the exception that local government has a carer's allowance scheme. i'm confident that the scheme won't cost anything like as much as the estimate, but i'm, i'm sure it's right that it's been, having having done some background work to see how many people might claim it i'm confident that that we've erred on the safe side here by a substantial amount, and that's why i'm sure it can be met from the overall budget. but i would agree with mr , that it does add a further pressure, it means we have to have a real review of erm, how we pay allowances in order to stay within our budget limit, which i think is two hundred and two thousand for the current year, and erm, a little bit more for next year, according to the previous paper. did you want to come in mr ? thank you chairman. -erm, i, i wanted to pick up the point mrs said, i, i don't think this will necessarily this will be one of those allowances which people will er, claim on a regular basis. -er, i am mindful chairman that i embarrassed you acutely at the end of education meeting on friday, erm,and i know that i, i have a circumstance coming up in february, where i have a child who is unexpectedly on a training day, erm, on a day where i actually have two meetings of this council, now either i get substituted, or we arrange for a one off carer situation. +erm, i, i wanted to pick up the point mrs said, i, i don't think this will necessarily this will be one of those allowances which people will er, claim on a regular basis. +er, i am mindful chairman that i embarrassed you acutely at the end of education meeting on friday, erm,and i know that i, i have a circumstance coming up in february, where i have a child who is unexpectedly on a training day, erm, on a day where i actually have two meetings of this council, now either i get substituted, or we arrange for a one off carer situation. now i'm not for a mom , i'm not for a moment suggesting that it's something that would be picked up on a regular basis, but i think it does mean, as you rightly say, that er, if, if, if such a procedure does arise then i'm conscious that i'm in a one off situation, i know there's at least one of our colleagues on our benches who has this on, with children on a more regular basis. erm, i i think we will encourage er, people with dependants to play a more active role in the er, business of this council and in, i think it is something that is worth er, considering and it is worth carrying forward. i, i'm very sad to learn that the committee may not fee , feel quite so constrained to assist er, employees. @@ -53259,25 +53211,25 @@ i think er, we need to er, look at this issue of carers far more rigorously, and okay, i'll put the motion to the vote, those in favour please show,and the against. that is carried. nine one, supplementary capital estimates of the magistrates court, -letter circulated this morning from officers to amend the figure, i think all members should have had that and i will move that a capital supplementary estimate of fifty-five thousand and four pounds be approved for expenditure on the magistrate's court services described in the report and in the letter circulated this morning. -chairman you've got to allow me because by the time i've finished you won't be able to stop me, er, but i mean if there's a lot of money floating about in this area then i think that er, some committee or other should be looking at the the refurbishment of the courts in devizes which are a disgrace, and partly the fault of this council when th they were allowed to get into such a state, and i mean at some stage or other, something or else is gonna to have to happen to them and i would hope that the magistrates in their wisdom in some committee or other are, are deciding to take these courts back into use. +letter circulated this morning from officers to amend the figure, i think all members should have had that and i will move that a capital supplementary estimate of fifty-five thousand and four pounds be approved for expenditure on the magistrate's court services described in the report and in the letter circulated this morning. +chairman you've got to allow me because by the time i've finished you won't be able to stop me, er, but i mean if there's a lot of money floating about in this area then i think that er, some committee or other should be looking at the the refurbishment of the courts in devizes which are a disgrace, and partly the fault of this council when th they were allowed to get into such a state, and i mean at some stage or other, something or else is gonna to have to happen to them and i would hope that the magistrates in their wisdom in some committee or other are, are deciding to take these courts back into use. thank you mr . -we don't have much control over what the magistrate's court committee do, as we could tell from our efforts to appeal against the closure of some other magistrate's courts erm, anybody else on this subject, i'll put this to the vote, really since it's a technicality. +we don't have much control over what the magistrate's court committee do, as we could tell from our efforts to appeal against the closure of some other magistrate's courts erm, anybody else on this subject, i'll put this to the vote, really since it's a technicality. it's a pure technicality, mr chairman, but i did ask at the previous meeting er, that the erm, director of property services respond to me on a matter relating to wootton bassett magistrate's court, if we have such a large amount of money that we can spend i think the questions that i posed then, er are relevant and i would appreciate a reply. er, mr erm, i think your point is covered in the next item on the agenda where there is a reference to to twenty-five thousand included the ninety-three four budget for wootton bassett. can i put this to the vote? -those in favour please show and the against that is agreed. +those in favour please show and the against that is agreed. nine two, you have a paper from the, which is a copy of the paper th , that the director of financial services submitted to the magistrate's court committee management board, a response from the magistrate's courts management board for the county council erm, i will move to note the response of the magistrate's courts committee and to confirm our previous recommendation to the county council regarding this part of the policy resources committee budget. those in favour please say aye. aye -and the against that is carried. -item ten, which i think is the probations committee budget i will move to accept the probations committee's budget and to agree an increased county council contribution of twenty-six thousand pounds. +and the against that is carried. +item ten, which i think is the probations committee budget i will move to accept the probations committee's budget and to agree an increased county council contribution of twenty-six thousand pounds. aye -i see nobody wishing to speak, those in favour please show any against? +i see nobody wishing to speak, those in favour please show any against? that is agreed. -right,for the next item members will need to note the statements from the joint trade unions liaison committee and the non-domestic rate-payers group and to find item twenty-one two today's papers, the minutes of the budget review sub-committee, meeting held on the eighteenth of january, agenda item twenty-two brackets one. -there's a recommendation from the budget review sub-committee for us to deal with, at er, minute seven, little at the bottom of page two. -the fifth paragraph of that has the proposed council tax bands the county council services but these have been amended by a letter you've been sent dated the twenty- first of january, as a result of information from council regarding their tax base. +right,for the next item members will need to note the statements from the joint trade unions liaison committee and the non-domestic rate-payers group and to find item twenty-one two today's papers, the minutes of the budget review sub-committee, meeting held on the eighteenth of january, agenda item twenty-two brackets one. +there's a recommendation from the budget review sub-committee for us to deal with, at er, minute seven, little at the bottom of page two. +the fifth paragraph of that has the proposed council tax bands the county council services but these have been amended by a letter you've been sent dated the twenty- first of january, as a result of information from council regarding their tax base. and i will move from the chair to recommend the county council, erm, as shown on page three, that is to say paragraphs little one, little two, little three, little four and little five with the amended band figures. and i would like to say thank you to the people who sit on the budget review sub- committee, a committee which actually i don't attend as often as i probably ought to, particularly to the labour spokesperson , for the way he's guided the committee, both from within the chair and at other times, on it's work this year, to be able to propose a budget which erm, so well fulfils the aims that many of us had when we were elected in may, which were of course, to maintain services, er, to squeeze efficiency out of the sy into the system and squeeze any waste out, and to get our officers working towards zero base budgets. and to a very large degree, that has been erm, achieved, and i think that erm, the prospects for the county council for ninety-four five are now much better than they appeared to be a year ago, and er, i think the prospects for ninety-five six will need to be looked at through the budget review sub-committee and this committee at an early stage, and i'm sure that the workman-like way in which it's addressed it's business is a good sign for the future. @@ -53291,7 +53243,7 @@ er, mr . thank you chairman. i, i er, you would not expect me to continue with the euphoria which you were trying to create earlier, and er, i have to say that i suppose that you wouldn't er, be proposing any different budget to this would you, in the circumstances that you've got. but we wouldn't be starting at that, at the point that you did because we did not, would not have spent the approaching five million that you spent in the first er, month or two of this council. -we note that you have addressed the problem on social services in your re in your erm, proposal, er and that we we're grateful for. +we note that you have addressed the problem on social services in your re in your erm, proposal, er and that we we're grateful for. we were faced, as you reminded me with a projected twenty-four million pound shortfall. that projection of course took into account the fact that you'd raised the base and therefore you had extra money to find. but when you look carefully at where that twenty-four million disappeared to, you start to find the problems with your budget. @@ -53301,7 +53253,7 @@ but there was a costed projection of eleven point two million in that, you're no now we'll here very quickly from people who say that we've devolved more money to schools. we've devolved the money to schools, but they've got to spend most of it back with the council here. what the thing of course is, and we all know what it is, it's an effort to penalise those secondary schools who've gone grant maintained, but they don't get the extra money, they get a hundred pound a pupil less. -don't shake your head mr , read the letters that are coming to me, from those schools like who can see the reduction in their budget next year. +don't shake your head mr , read the letters that are coming to me, from those schools like who can see the reduction in their budget next year. look at the police budget, and we shall be discussing the police budget later on, you had a windfall, underspend on police pensions, but we all know those police will retire at some time or other, and when they do there is a commitment to their lump sum payments and their pensions. you've had a bit of luck there, you might turn the other way next year, and you might find that you've got an increased number of police retiring, and if you have, you're going to find extreme pressure on the police budget, and you will see that there is the reductions that the chief constable told you he would have to make if that happened. you're already short short-funding the police budget without that factor as well. @@ -53317,8 +53269,8 @@ thank you chairman. er, first point, i'm not absolutely certain, when you moved your proposal, you moved from budget review, the clauses one to five. i'm not sure that you also removed clauses c, d and e from the order paper, and if you haven't i'll so move. thank you, i'll accept that amendment. -members are clear what mr spotted which is that in addition to the from budget review, we also need to agree some er, effectively some delegations in c, d and e, of the recommendation laid out in pages two and three of the main agenda. -i think that's what mr 's moved as an amendment, and i'm happy to accept that, so that forms part of +members are clear what mr spotted which is that in addition to the from budget review, we also need to agree some er, effectively some delegations in c, d and e, of the recommendation laid out in pages two and three of the main agenda. +i think that's what mr 's moved as an amendment, and i'm happy to accept that, so that forms part of thank you chairman. i mean,wha what i would like to go on and say is, that er, which the change of administration it has been necessary to er, adopt a different way of, of developing the budget, and i think you're quite right to erm, pay credit to the effort of the er, budget review er, sub-committee. i think we also need to recognise that there has also been a er, high level of er, commitment from er, officers employed by this council to achieving the changes that we have asked in terms of financial management, now i'm not going to pretend for a moment that er, we've gone all the way there yet. @@ -53335,16 +53287,16 @@ erm, i think it's a false economy to cut on maintenance, you only leave trouble the young people following us will have to pay for our mistakes if we cut on maintenance now. and i do, i'm more concerned with the lack of capital in maintenance that'll we'll, we're going to have on the roads and infrastructure this year, i think there's always a reason to put a little bit of capital maintenance into both our buildings and our roads. it needs to be done now and it's going to cost us more if we leave it till later, on that point i can't agree with your budget, so, i'm afraid, it's roads that put me against it. -well i will just come in here because i think mr wants to get his figures a bit more accurate. +well i will just come in here because i think mr wants to get his figures a bit more accurate. i don't think even in our wildest dreams we managed to spend an extra five million in the first few weeks of this council, i remember a couple of million going into schools and few hundred thousand for voluntary organizations, and er, and old people's homes. but the other figure i think he's, he'll have to recheck is his figure on highways structural maintenance, because in fact two and a half million's in the base budget and one and a half million's in the approved list of thirty-seven bids at at er, priority number two. it seems to me entirely up to him, if he so wished, and his group, if they felt there needed to be more money spent on highways structural maintenance to have moved other bids up to priority order when discussing the capital budget. and i do think it's unfortunate when people try and confuse capital and revenue expenditure, in order to try and er, support their own rather weak political position. erm, but it's impressive that he now feels we should be allowed to spend more money to create jobs, because of course a lot of us have been trying to point that out for years to the governments which stupidly cap authorities so they can't actually carry out the infrastructure improvements that are needed to enable the economy and the society to function properly. -i'll call mr to . +i'll call mr to . thank you chair, thank you particularly for your kind words, they are appreciated. erm, doesn't a lot change in a year really, or even in six months. -in may, mr and his group had the opportunity to vote with us in spending another two million pounds on the education system of this county, and now he is complaining only six months later, that we aren't spending enough, and i think we've said before, the conservatives have, and continue to have the opportunity for action, but they will not support their words with deeds. +in may, mr and his group had the opportunity to vote with us in spending another two million pounds on the education system of this county, and now he is complaining only six months later, that we aren't spending enough, and i think we've said before, the conservatives have, and continue to have the opportunity for action, but they will not support their words with deeds. erm, we've seen it also through the budget process, where all the way through, and it's been a very open process, we have no alternative proposals from the conservative group, they have complained and have criticized but they have offered no alternatives. this morning they offer no alternatives other than to spend more. i mean it might as well be perhaps, i don't know, lambeth council in the nineteen-seventies that they are representing, along with john major there. @@ -53359,7 +53311,7 @@ hear, hear. i think also, the people of wiltshire will be glad that it us here setting the budget, and therefore the precept and their council tax next year, and something that people will be looking at is their council tax bills, and noting that they go up by six point three percent, or are proposed to, with the provisional assets aim which is set by the government. and people may be wondering why they're going up by so much, when after all, the s s a, and that is the figure that we're restricted to set by the government, is only going up by three point three percent, and half of this is for care in the community money, so that, all that care in the community money remember, pound for pound in that it's added to our budget, is knocked off the budget of social security, that is not, not any extra money spent on people. so in reality our s s a is going up about one and a half percent, and as you know our budget has gone up about one and a half percent, so why is the council tax going up six point three percent? -well, as usual it's all there in the papers that mr has prepared for us if anybody cares to read them, and you will notice, the national non-domestic rate, the business rate as it's known, the contribution that the government are passing on from the business rates paid in wiltshire, back to the people of wiltshire is dropping by seven point nine million pounds, it's being cut from a hundred and eighteen point six to a hundred and nine point three million pounds, and again this is pound for pound. +well, as usual it's all there in the papers that mr has prepared for us if anybody cares to read them, and you will notice, the national non-domestic rate, the business rate as it's known, the contribution that the government are passing on from the business rates paid in wiltshire, back to the people of wiltshire is dropping by seven point nine million pounds, it's being cut from a hundred and eighteen point six to a hundred and nine point three million pounds, and again this is pound for pound. pound for pound it's coming off the people of wiltshire, and it's going to fund kenneth clarke's budget deficit. kenneth clarke has robbed the people of wiltshire of that money. that's nine point three million pounds of business rates, and i'm sure i'm not the only person here that pays business rates in wiltshire, and i haven't noticed any sign that my rate bill are going down, course they're not. @@ -53369,14 +53321,14 @@ so we could have reduced that, and i think that is the criticism that i make of they should be standing here now as the party of high taxation, and saying sorry to the people of wiltshire for supporting kenneth clarke and his team, for supporting john major and his team, and they should be saying sorry for the part that we pa played in lying to the electorate at the last general election. hear, hear. well, follow that, erm, -i think that er, i'll be very brief because a lot of it's already been said, and you've already, mr chairman picked up mr on his dodgy figures, erm, with his five million, erm, because what that was about, just under three million was actually fulfilling our election pledges, which is something we have noticeably failed to see from this conservative government. -erm, mr goes on about displaying items of pain in a really rather sort of strange way, erm, the only reason why there's any pain in this budget is because of the constraints that this tory government is putting on us. -and if we were able to make a budget erm, without the constraints of the s s a and so on, we would not, erm you know, and without the cuts of business rates as mr said, there wouldn't need for any pain anyway. +i think that er, i'll be very brief because a lot of it's already been said, and you've already, mr chairman picked up mr on his dodgy figures, erm, with his five million, erm, because what that was about, just under three million was actually fulfilling our election pledges, which is something we have noticeably failed to see from this conservative government. +erm, mr goes on about displaying items of pain in a really rather sort of strange way, erm, the only reason why there's any pain in this budget is because of the constraints that this tory government is putting on us. +and if we were able to make a budget erm, without the constraints of the s s a and so on, we would not, erm you know, and without the cuts of business rates as mr said, there wouldn't need for any pain anyway. erm, we have, as you would have seen, and has already been noted, erm, balances considerably higher than the seven million we've previously set, at the, at the moment, and these will erm, be able to make provision if necessary, for police pay should happen to be higher than er,we are told than, than the one point five percent, which has something that people have raised with me, and erm, have said, that oh of course you lose grants if you don't decide it now, but that is not in fact the case. erm, i think that we have a very sane, sensible budget proposed here, and i trust that every sensible councillor will support it. i, oh, i'm sorry, i didn't see you. -erm, could i go back to what mr was saying, of course the main thing is, really that er, the difference in this budget and previous ones is that we are not paying projection costs million. -erm, what mr very carefully very carefully failed to mention of course is that the rates of has in fact gone up by eleven point one percent. +erm, could i go back to what mr was saying, of course the main thing is, really that er, the difference in this budget and previous ones is that we are not paying projection costs million. +erm, what mr very carefully very carefully failed to mention of course is that the rates of has in fact gone up by eleven point one percent. very conveniently not mentioned. yes, i, i, the can we erm, can we move on? @@ -53384,34 +53336,34 @@ the, the motion i moved needs to be adjusted because of our decision on the prob little three, erm, where the reference to drawing from balances is made. that figure needs to go up by twenty-six thousand to read nought point two three one million, and what's left needs to go down by twenty-six thousand at ten one one four o million. erm, i'll put the motion to the vote, which consists of the whole of paragraph b of the budget review sub-committee's recommendation, with this being a recommendation to the county council, and with paragraphs c, d and e from the original agenda paper. -those in favour please show and the against? +those in favour please show and the against? that is carried. thank you very much. er, item twelve. i'm going to take these two together, that's twelve one and twelve two. -twelve one deals with the recommendation for economic developments and tourism sub-committee, er the er projects, and twelve two with the er, capital budget report from the director of financial services, which is in the budget book, i refer to the recommendation on these items from the budget review sub-committee, which is in their minutes, at agenda item twenty-two one, at the bottom of the third page and going over to the fourth, erm, a number of paragraphs. +twelve one deals with the recommendation for economic developments and tourism sub-committee, er the er projects, and twelve two with the er, capital budget report from the director of financial services, which is in the budget book, i refer to the recommendation on these items from the budget review sub-committee, which is in their minutes, at agenda item twenty-two one, at the bottom of the third page and going over to the fourth, erm, a number of paragraphs. and erm, i'll move those recommendations from the budget review sub-committee, a, b, c, d, e, f, g and h. -in doing so i would erm, particularly like to say how much i appreciate the success of the bid, in erm, as, as an example of county, counties working together, erm, and indeed officers working together, and indeed of getting a positive response from the government. +in doing so i would erm, particularly like to say how much i appreciate the success of the bid, in erm, as, as an example of county, counties working together, erm, and indeed officers working together, and indeed of getting a positive response from the government. i think from time to time, little bits of the government do work reasonably well, and do respond reasonably well to county council and local authority initiatives, and although i couldn't pretend that a hundred and, that twenty- five thousand pounds is going to solve the unemployment problem in wiltshire, nor indeed solve the problem being created by the run- down of defence industry, nevertheless, i think credit should be given where credit's due. -a lot of credit is due to our officers in this respect, for er, securing the success of that bid, and indeed for securing a back-up capital resource facility, in the unlikely event that we don't get the supplementary credit approval, er, for the er, for the expenditure. +a lot of credit is due to our officers in this respect, for er, securing the success of that bid, and indeed for securing a back-up capital resource facility, in the unlikely event that we don't get the supplementary credit approval, er, for the er, for the expenditure. so, i've moved the motion, anybody wish to speak on this item? -okay, those in favour please show and the against . -nobody else, er, agenda item thirteen treasury report +okay, those in favour please show and the against . +nobody else, er, agenda item thirteen treasury report aye. thank you. agenda item fourteen, i recommend that the county council approve the recommendations of eleven a, b and c. aye those in favour please say aye. aye -and the against that is carried. -item fifteen, i move to approve the supplementary capital estimate of twenty-five thousand pounds for the st mary's infant school special nursery unit. +and the against that is carried. +item fifteen, i move to approve the supplementary capital estimate of twenty-five thousand pounds for the st mary's infant school special nursery unit. those in favour please say aye. aye -and the against that is carried. +and the against that is carried. item sixteen, the district auditors management letter and audited accounts for ninety-two ninety-three. mr . thank you chair, chairman. -i have a particular over the management letter, and i'm sure mr will be aware that in fact i refer of course to the facilities management contract. +i have a particular over the management letter, and i'm sure mr will be aware that in fact i refer of course to the facilities management contract. erm, this management letter was distributed er, to all of us, so i suppose some of us at least will have read it. and, and the district auditor is particularly concerned. he says, i remain concerned that it is not yet possible to agree an implementation plan for recommendations made in his previous report. @@ -53421,46 +53373,46 @@ now how long ago was that contract? eighteen months? and this is a letter dated a couple of months ago, is it? erm, what's been going there? -now the facilities management contract is being held up by mr as an example for the property out-sourcing. +now the facilities management contract is being held up by mr as an example for the property out-sourcing. well i don't think it's a very good example, if it's being criticized. perhaps it's the kind of example, in the same way that westminster council was held up as an example, and it's now being criticized by the district auditor. -erm, perhaps it will be mr 's policy to impune all district auditors that their findings are not worth erm, troubling with. +erm, perhaps it will be mr 's policy to impune all district auditors that their findings are not worth erm, troubling with. well, i don't suppose this contract's costing us twenty-one million, but it's costing us several million, and i would hate to think that er, any of that is being wasted, or not spent in the best possible way, and i would therefore recommend, chair, that we refer the matter of the facilities management contract to the budget review sub-committee for consideration of the way it's not being implemented. right, thank you. -referring to, paragraphs one hundred and four to one hundred and nine, saying , miss also wishes to comment on this +referring to, paragraphs one hundred and four to one hundred and nine, saying , miss also wishes to comment on this erm, yes i do, very much indeed. i'm extremely disappointed, that erm, we don't seem to make any progress towards getting the savings erm, that, that, erm, we were promised. -i, i hesitate to suggest, i mean that i'm quite happy to support what mr is saying, because i really hesitate to suggest reviving the old computer and financial services working party, because i think that was probably my most miserable experience on this council, with the single exception of the budget review er, parallel, or whatever it was, when it was led by . +i, i hesitate to suggest, i mean that i'm quite happy to support what mr is saying, because i really hesitate to suggest reviving the old computer and financial services working party, because i think that was probably my most miserable experience on this council, with the single exception of the budget review er, parallel, or whatever it was, when it was led by . erm, but it seems to be the case that when there are not councillors here whinging away at officers, saying why isn't it working, nothing happens, it all gets sort of forgotten or something. -and we've got to do something about it, we were promised these savings, there aren't any, it doesn't look as if anybody's working awfully hard to get them, and i'd like to know why not, and what's going on, and i'm quite happy to support what mr proposes, that we refer it all to budget review. +and we've got to do something about it, we were promised these savings, there aren't any, it doesn't look as if anybody's working awfully hard to get them, and i'd like to know why not, and what's going on, and i'm quite happy to support what mr proposes, that we refer it all to budget review. you might have noticed, there is an officer response. mr -can i just say sir, we are, er, the manager is preparing a report, tonight plans a report for the february the twenty-second meeting of policy resources committee, on the first, well it's not the first year, first tranche of the f m contract, and dealing with these points of the +can i just say sir, we are, er, the manager is preparing a report, tonight plans a report for the february the twenty-second meeting of policy resources committee, on the first, well it's not the first year, first tranche of the f m contract, and dealing with these points of the it started at the end of march, it's the first nine months, it's the first tranche of the erm, the f m arrangement, and, and your members will be getting a report in february on that. mr you would expect me to defend it, wouldn't you chairman, and i will. -i still remain convinced, that the, that the contract that we wrote, and, and, and we undertook remains the right -i don't know where mr get's his ideas from. -but there nd we undertook remains the right +i still remain convinced, that the, that the contract that we wrote, and, and, and we undertook remains the right +i don't know where mr get's his ideas from. +but there nd we undertook remains the right no chair, i would very much like it to be looked at in great detail by the budget review committee, actually, you'll see in the report that many of these problems were identified as areas of concern by the district auditor prior to the signing of the contract, and he was given, it seems, various assurances which may or may not have been met, and i would like to go into much more detail than would be possible with this committee. i'm actually thinking in terms of an hour or two, with the responsible manager reporting in detail to the budget review committee. -we're talking about a lot of money here, that has been spent, and has continued to be spent, and the sooner we get it sorted out the better, and i'd like to see it on the agenda of the next budget review committee, which would prior to the policy committee, i believe next, and so we could perhaps augment er, mr 's report with some findings of our own. -right, now i'm told that the report to next policy committee is coming anyway, it won't be ready for the next budget review, but you'd like, erm, so,cou , perhaps you'd better word your motion so that the officers completely clear as to what you're proposing. +we're talking about a lot of money here, that has been spent, and has continued to be spent, and the sooner we get it sorted out the better, and i'd like to see it on the agenda of the next budget review committee, which would prior to the policy committee, i believe next, and so we could perhaps augment er, mr 's report with some findings of our own. +right, now i'm told that the report to next policy committee is coming anyway, it won't be ready for the next budget review, but you'd like, erm, so,cou , perhaps you'd better word your motion so that the officers completely clear as to what you're proposing. yeah, i, i'm suggesting that the facilities management contract, be referred to the budget review sub-committee for consideration, and in that way we can actually consider it, and obviously if the report is not yet prepared, erm, perhaps we can put some input into it, i have to say, that it disturbs me to be given an answer, that don't worry everybody, there's a report coming, and then we suddenly say well, we might like to look at it in three weeks time, we're told actually it's not written yet. that was seconded i think by mr right, well i mean i think it, it's actually quite simplified by the fact that i don't think there actually is a firm date for the budget review before the next p and r anyway. erm, but i think p, er, budget review, or somebody needs to have a look at it, if you've got budget review and you've got people who, most of the people who were on the old working party know the background there anyway, seems as good a place as any to look at it. i mean i actually voted for this contract, erm, rather reluctantly, but it seemed better than not, doing so at the time, but we were given assurances, and it was very well understood by absolutely everybody, that vigorous management would be needed in order to achieve the targetising and that was the only way that the savings were going to be made, and it does seem that, that, erm that has not been going on. -i would support what mr was saying. +i would support what mr was saying. yes, we have a small problem with the dates, that's all. the budget review sub-committee has a provisional date of thursday the third of february, which was in the minds of members and officers to deal with anything urgent that needed to be dealt with before county council budget making. -erm, i'm happy to take mr 's view on this. +erm, i'm happy to take mr 's view on this. whether he wants to get f m onto the agenda and firm that up as a date for a meeting. well i, i think it's, that's a meeting that we were thinking of not having unless there was some sort of panic caused by yet another change of the government's position on budgets. so it's still in obeyance isn't it? what i'm suggesting really, is let's get it on the agenda for budget review whenever the next meeting is, to be considered in depth, and if that gives an extra couple or three weeks for officers to write the report, fine, if it goes beyond the next policy and resources a week or two won't matter in the scheme of things, it's detailed consideration i'm looking for, rather than a fast fix in ten minutes at the next p and r. okay, everybody clear what the motion is? -those in favour please show and the against any further points on the district auditor's reports? +those in favour please show and the against any further points on the district auditor's reports? miss erm, yes. i would like to draw attention particularly in the light of the next item on the agenda, er, to paragraph erm, paragraph forty-two to forty-five, talking about environmental management. @@ -53498,7 +53450,7 @@ specifically i notice his comment in relation to the christie miller controversy erm, i wonder if this is a matter which budget review might wish to keep on a continuing brief, so that, to satisfy themselves that the, this council is in fact making progress, and will be in a position to satisfy the district auditor in future years that we are er, taking on board the comments that he's making and er, moving forward. i'm conscious of the fact obviously that individual departments are taking them on board, but i think we, it is important that we actually do have a consistent approach, and it might well be that budget review at some future meeting might want to consider the monitoring of progress in order to satisfy the district auditor in future events. i've looked, for example, erm, to his comment on the police communications rooms, which will actually have a significant impact on er, the budget of the police committee in future years. -yes, i, i mean, i think, i don't want to come in there, but i think the difference between the point that you've made mr and, and some of the others is the district auditor hasn't put a thing in a box. +yes, i, i mean, i think, i don't want to come in there, but i think the difference between the point that you've made mr and, and some of the others is the district auditor hasn't put a thing in a box. if he puts a thing in a box, it means you really have got to read this, and worry about it, but i think he's fairly happy with the progress on police training and police communication arrangements. if it had been up to me, you'd have one police communication room, not two, because i've worked in operations control, and you want to have a single control room for your authority, if any other system is less efficient than that. but i appreciate there were good operational reasons why he did what he did, but that's just from my own experience. @@ -53510,7 +53462,7 @@ if it doesn't come to the full county council, then i will make sure it does, bu well, that would be a change in procedure, i think, i don't recall that the closure of berwick st james school was dealt with by county council, but berwick st james was closed, i don't think we can pretend in either way about that. and i voted, i think, if i had a vote that day, i certainly voted in favour of that, and so did members of all groups. some members voted against. -but erm, i, certainly mr had the right through standing orders to ensure that that er, was er, taken to county council, wouldn't he? +but erm, i, certainly mr had the right through standing orders to ensure that that er, was er, taken to county council, wouldn't he? yes sir, county council could make that decision, it would first though have to consider a report from the education committee, under the education act. it's all very hypothetical. mrs @@ -53525,11 +53477,11 @@ but there is the other argument that has to be taken off, is that of, there is m but it doesn't mean, it's not, reality says that's not possible, because central government will not give us additional money to spend on education. therefore, we're left with a certain pot and we must manage that the best way possible in providing the best education, not only for children in village schools, but in towns and every of large or medium size throughout this county. and why should the education of those who live in large towns suffer to finance uneconomical schools in rural areas of this county. -i'm not saying that they are uneconomical, but there may be the odd one or two cases, like the of berwick st james is a fine example, when it became uneconomical to maintain that school for the number of pupils which were attending, or proposed to be taken in the near future, and it was a sensible option for those children, and economically to close that school. +i'm not saying that they are uneconomical, but there may be the odd one or two cases, like the of berwick st james is a fine example, when it became uneconomical to maintain that school for the number of pupils which were attending, or proposed to be taken in the near future, and it was a sensible option for those children, and economically to close that school. and that has to be maintained in the future. -i don't support this blanket band of reducing surplus places for the sake of reducing surplus places, like the district auditor, and if quote right, it's an accountant looking at erm, looking at figures and nothing else, and i think that is the problem with the issue, erm, we've seen in other schools, in larger schools, where they've developed erm, classrooms into a decent library, or resource area, but in the, in the, in the overall spectrum they're still counted as classroom spaces, and if that classroom was put back er in, into a class, the school would suffer environmentally, because that school would have no library facilities, no resource facilities which it's able to appreciate at the present time. +i don't support this blanket band of reducing surplus places for the sake of reducing surplus places, like the district auditor, and if quote right, it's an accountant looking at erm, looking at figures and nothing else, and i think that is the problem with the issue, erm, we've seen in other schools, in larger schools, where they've developed erm, classrooms into a decent library, or resource area, but in the, in the, in the overall spectrum they're still counted as classroom spaces, and if that classroom was put back er in, into a class, the school would suffer environmentally, because that school would have no library facilities, no resource facilities which it's able to appreciate at the present time. i believe that this group, the labour group will continue to support rural schools, where we feel that they are viable, and of benefit to the children. -our arguments on friday, and still are, that we believe the two tier system is educationally beneficial than the three tier. +our arguments on friday, and still are, that we believe the two tier system is educationally beneficial than the three tier. but that argument we lost on friday, and i'm not going to pursue it today. but what i, we are not prepared to do, is allow the schools that we represent to suffer, just to maintain small schools in this county, which are no longer economical or viable or educationally beneficial to the children that attend them. we are not prepared to stand by and let schools in areas that we represent get closed or re-organised or whatever, at the expense of small village schools, which should be re-organised, or re-rationalised before schools in large urban areas. @@ -53541,7 +53493,7 @@ can i remind members of a fact that in the sake of a county where there are more right, erm, i move that we er, having dealt with the f m under a separate motion, that we note the district auditor's report. those in favour please say aye. aye. -and the against that's carried. +and the against that's carried. item seventeen. . well now, i'll move the recommendations at seventeen and eighteen, but erm, i feel something further is required to try and get er, our officers working with our committees on local agenda twenty-one, and indeed in bringing forward the environmental audit scheme. @@ -53549,16 +53501,16 @@ i don't want to have a working party, but i'm wondering if we should lay down so mr . thank you manag , er mr chairman. er,sorry. -sorry about that er, er, erm +sorry about that er, er, erm actually i was yeah . erm, it's just on the big print on the bottom of page one, g two. er, what's the point of analysing fuel for it's su , er, diesel fuel for it's sulphur content? it's much more economical both for th , and good for the environment to buy low sulphur fuel. -because, you know, it, it's cheaper to run your vehicles on low sulphur diesel, and it is because you don't get the deterioration in it, and it's better for the, it's better for the atmosphere. +because, you know, it, it's cheaper to run your vehicles on low sulphur diesel, and it is because you don't get the deterioration in it, and it's better for the, it's better for the atmosphere. so i would have thought would be better to buy low sulphur contented diesel rather than analyse it, and in c thirteen, it worries me a little bit, because i believe that the district councils are the drainage authorities with the right about land drainage, and it was taken away from the county council several years ago. so are we actually putting our feet into what's being done by the district councils over c thirteen. i, i totally agree with what they're saying, but i'm just worrying that we're trying to do the job that the district councils are supposed to do. -i, i, i would wonder if mr 's questions need to be erm, taken up with the chief public health inspector, because i think that that, or it, that appears to be, or possibly the trading chi=standards, trading standards officer, neither of whom are here. +i, i, i would wonder if mr 's questions need to be erm, taken up with the chief public health inspector, because i think that that, or it, that appears to be, or possibly the trading chi=standards, trading standards officer, neither of whom are here. erm, because er, it does seem that erm, though we're not talking about our own fuel, we're talking about testing other people's fuel, and erm, there's an, it's an arcane point about district councils. miss . erm, thank you chairman. @@ -53568,7 +53520,7 @@ erm. oh, sorry i've got sex on the mind. erm, i think, you know, when it says, at the end, towards the end of paragraph eleven, talking about the environmental management scheme for local government,could be utilised as tools to help improve the management framework for the councils precedents and initiatives in environmental matters. i would have felt much happier if the word had been will rather than could. -erm, it's quite clear from the district auditor's letter that he thinks that we're not being systematic enough, about what we do about environmental improvements, and it seems fairly clear to me to, that if we just push the to the service committees, erm, nothing will ever happen, except possibly on planning, and that erm, it will just sort of quietly disappear because it's not the top priority of any of the other service committees. +erm, it's quite clear from the district auditor's letter that he thinks that we're not being systematic enough, about what we do about environmental improvements, and it seems fairly clear to me to, that if we just push the to the service committees, erm, nothing will ever happen, except possibly on planning, and that erm, it will just sort of quietly disappear because it's not the top priority of any of the other service committees. and, it's only if this committee decides to take a hand in pushing environmental issues forward, that they will actually come about, except, almost by accident. and i would suggest therefore, that what we ought to do, is to ask not only for erm, the service committees to have reports, but for there to be erm, a, a, at some point a round up report of policy and resources. i don't know if we ought to put a timetable on that, on what's going on, on this erm, eco-management erm, business, but also, i was wondering, could we not ask for a report to the march or april meeting of this committee, on what actions we could take to make progress on the recommendations of the district auditor in paragraph forty-four. @@ -53576,7 +53528,7 @@ erm, those are specifically, that there should be a formal framework for monitor these are all things that we can take specific action, some easier and cheaper than others, to do something about. but i think we need to have a report to this committee, saying what we could do, and then we can decide what we will do. and i would like to move that that is added to your recommendation mr chairman. -er, i think, miss you're moving er, an extra paragraph nineteen as it were to er, that a report be made to, shall we say the april meeting of policy and resources committee on progress in implementing the district auditor's recommendations, er paragraph four . +er, i think, miss you're moving er, an extra paragraph nineteen as it were to er, that a report be made to, shall we say the april meeting of policy and resources committee on progress in implementing the district auditor's recommendations, er paragraph four . but what i, i specifically worded this, what actions we could make, could take to make progress okay. because if you still want the answer to progress, the answer will come back none. @@ -53584,12 +53536,12 @@ erm, if you ask for what actions we could take, then we'll have to work out a wa is everybody clear on that amendment, which i'm happy to accept into er, my motion. i call mr . thank you chair. -erm, i don't know if it's worth speaking now, i, i'd like to second everything that has said, and what the auditors have said erm, in the management arrangement. -i do thank mr for this report, but i would have liked to have seen that the chief executive had been a signatory to it as well. +erm, i don't know if it's worth speaking now, i, i'd like to second everything that has said, and what the auditors have said erm, in the management arrangement. +i do thank mr for this report, but i would have liked to have seen that the chief executive had been a signatory to it as well. because hear, hear. it is something whi which affects the whole council, it isn't the prerogative of any particular service committee, and though on environmental matters and public health matters, another mi may be responsible and know more, it is an overall policy which erm, is being developed and needs to be erm, needs to be brought into play. -erm, there is a need, as said, to make staff away of the authorities environmental policies. +erm, there is a need, as said, to make staff away of the authorities environmental policies. erm, i dare say, on all our staff, our staff could make us more aware of environmental policies, and you know, are aware of erm, the need for the environmental action, erm than, erm than the action we are taking ourselves. that er, er, little action has been taken in the last thirty forty years since this has been being discussed, erm, i think the first international conference erm, produced their own report in nineteen sixty. erm, we had the rio conference in nineteen ninety-three, erm, we'll still doing very little about it. @@ -53600,18 +53552,18 @@ since having said that erm, i'm not immediately looking erm, for high expenditur would suggest, erm, would be libraries and museums. and i suggest libraries and museums, because i dare say they have the greatest experience in information co-ordination systems erm, within the, within the council, and i think, er, and of course they're highly involved out in the community. you'll find a library in absolutely every community, and reacting with people, and i would like to suggest that erm, a pilot project is erm, promoted within the libraries and museums committee, and that libraries and museums committee consider that at it's next meeting. -okay erm,mr please. +okay erm,mr please. thank you. if we look at the paper before us mr chairman, er, g two, and c thirteen. er, g two is something which is specifically an envir , part of the environmental strategy. but c thirteen, about the conservation of the water environment and water resources, is a matter which could be incorporated in the county structure plan. as opposed to g two. -i was wondering whether erm, the director of planning and highways could, in an update, as proposed by erm, councillor erm, suggest other ways in which our environmental strategy could be inc er, could, could be strengthened. +i was wondering whether erm, the director of planning and highways could, in an update, as proposed by erm, councillor erm, suggest other ways in which our environmental strategy could be inc er, could, could be strengthened. i have already suggested that c thirteen could become the formal part of the county structure plan, and that would strengthen it enormously. but because g two can't become a, a structure plan issue, i was wondering if the erm, environmental strategy of this council, when it is adopted, er, er,wh when it's formulated and, and, and, and adopted, er, could that be incorporated as an appendix to the county structure plan. -i think there are a variety of ways mr chairman, in which our environmental strategy, when it's formulated, could be publicised and that's one way forward, and i wonder whether director could perhaps incorporate an argument for or against that,i , in, in,i , in the paper that councillor has suggested. +i think there are a variety of ways mr chairman, in which our environmental strategy, when it's formulated, could be publicised and that's one way forward, and i wonder whether director could perhaps incorporate an argument for or against that,i , in, in,i , in the paper that councillor has suggested. thank you mr . -i'm going to bring mr in in a minute, but i think mr . +i'm going to bring mr in in a minute, but i think mr . firstly chairman, er er, a comment about the district auditor, i do find it a little perverse, that in fact on the last subject when we were talking about small schools, he doesn't take into account any other erm, item than the financial argument. and then suddenly we find the district auditor making comments about an environmental strategy, which i would have thought was, if he worked on the basis of the last one, rather outside his remit. erm, i, i think sometimes if he's prepared to talk about such things as this, he should be prepared to consider the advantages to villages of, of small schools, and not just work on the financial item. @@ -53633,30 +53585,30 @@ i think we have to be very careful we don't take reactions which actually negate mr thank you chairman. if i could just briefly address three or four of the points. -firstly miss 's correct. +firstly miss 's correct. it, it isn't being approached very vigorously at the moment, er in a general sense because of two things. one is, none of the departments are resourced to give this a lot of attention, and secondly we have been waiting for further guidance from the government on the outcome, particularly from local government, in respect of agenda twenty-one. now this week the government are publishing four papers on, and i quote, the u k's government first strategy for sustainable development. -so miss 's point is very appropriate to bring a report back to a future committee in the near future, er, that covers the queries that have been raised by members, and the government's new policies or new proposals, i will take instructions from the chief executive on that, and will, er subject to the chief executive's review, also cover matters such as structure plan, and the co-ordination of this er, within, within the local authority. +so miss 's point is very appropriate to bring a report back to a future committee in the near future, er, that covers the queries that have been raised by members, and the government's new policies or new proposals, i will take instructions from the chief executive on that, and will, er subject to the chief executive's review, also cover matters such as structure plan, and the co-ordination of this er, within, within the local authority. and, to try and give options for members, at different expenditure levels of how we may move forward, because it isn't a cheap process, or not if we follow the lancashire model it isn't a cheap process, but of course we can scale our proposals down. so subject to me taking advice from the chief executive, er i feel we can do what members require. thank you chairman. -may i just i think that this has all party support, erm, the actual scheme was produced, erm,f and if the government is a signatory to that, erm, unfortunately the signatory to it was the environmen ,environmen , environment minister tim yeo, who has now departed but +may i just i think that this has all party support, erm, the actual scheme was produced, erm,f and if the government is a signatory to that, erm, unfortunately the signatory to it was the environmen ,environmen , environment minister tim yeo, who has now departed but it, you know, it does have, it does have government, government support, so that it isn't, we're not trying to do anything which erm, the government isn't supporting as well. -and, er, you know, that's just, so that mr is aware that we're trying to do what john major agreed at rio. +and, er, you know, that's just, so that mr is aware that we're trying to do what john major agreed at rio. okay, i er, we've got a motion, let's put it to the vote. -it's paragraph seventeen, eighteen and the additional item added by miss about a report to the april meeting on what action can be taken to implement the district auditor's recommendations, and from what we've heard i think that report will also contain reference to today's, the correct response to today's government four papers erm, on the policy with regard to the rio summit . -and i hope that, and indeed the point about the, the er, what might be added from the environmental strategy into the structured plan, which mr made. +it's paragraph seventeen, eighteen and the additional item added by miss about a report to the april meeting on what action can be taken to implement the district auditor's recommendations, and from what we've heard i think that report will also contain reference to today's, the correct response to today's government four papers erm, on the policy with regard to the rio summit . +and i hope that, and indeed the point about the, the er, what might be added from the environmental strategy into the structured plan, which mr made. erm, so we'll look forward to that report, er, those in favour of the recommendations please say aye. aye. and the against. they're carried. miss . thank you. -erm, as the person who mo , moved the original motion, i would be very happy to move the recommendations, and to thank mr , mrs , mr and mr , who are the only members here present who voted for it at the time. +erm, as the person who mo , moved the original motion, i would be very happy to move the recommendations, and to thank mr , mrs , mr and mr , who are the only members here present who voted for it at the time. erm, it has actually worked, erm, in that it seems that there's a very fair chance that er, in spite of the very discouraging things that were said by some of the people on my right when i moved this, erm, there is a very good chance now for a reasonable er, settlement in south africa, which i think should erm, make everyone in this chamber very happy, and it is that, undoubtedly the case that economic pressure had a great deal to do with that. thank you chairman. -miss moved . +miss moved . you have already second, but i was going to second it, and say how very pleased i am to have the opportunity to second it. those in favour, please shout it. aye. @@ -53691,25 +53643,25 @@ and i'd want to know that the person who did that was going to be punished, and and i think for too long, we've listened to the libertarians who want to think of the rights of the criminal all the time, and er, and don't worry too much about the victim. i think that the genetic er, testing that was, that is now law, has to go a long way towards finding criminals, who once they've been tested will find it very difficult to commit crime again, because they're on record, and they'll be on computer record. many announcements made by the home secretary are moving in the way that i have always wanted it to move, and i believe that er, in wiltshire this will have a very positive effect. -we have already, we believe accepting in wiltshire for two of the new parish constable erm, appointments. +we have already, we believe accepting in wiltshire for two of the new parish constable erm, appointments. i only hope that the police committee will actually support those and get on towards introducing them, because that is a way of using some of the people in our village communities to erm, to keep an eye on the community and see that those people that shouldn't go round. i hear that maybe, we're not going to support that policy. i hope, and i shall be bringing it up at the next police committee, that we will commit ourselves to that initiative will a view to bringing in those two pilot schemes in the county and extending it at a later date. so chairman, i move my original motion as an amendment to yours. -mr please. +mr please. thank you chair. i erm, i think it's worth correcting some of the financial mistakes again, that mr , and then perhaps give him some more facts on that. the paper circulated demonstrates that since eighty-eight nine through to ninety-three four, whereas county council spending as a whole has gone up by thirty-eight percent, spending on the police has gone up by eighty-eight percent, and that's more than double. -now i, i think that, you know, if mr 's got any complaints about that, and he says that that isn't privileged, well i think he can only blame his own administration as well as anybody else's. +now i, i think that, you know, if mr 's got any complaints about that, and he says that that isn't privileged, well i think he can only blame his own administration as well as anybody else's. i think surely we cannot deny the facts that the police have received very good funding from this authority, and indeed in this current budget they continue to do so. we've given them three hundred and sixty-four thousand pounds of extra funding, which we could legitimately have taken away as, particularly in the way that it was done, and as i understand it they er, revealed their v i p protection two months early to the home office, and therefore cut our s s a by a substantial amount, and i would even perhaps start that as a, as i could, as a series of criticisms about the way the police maintain their budget, and about the way that they have responded. it's perhaps the only committee, if one dare call it a committee of this council, where the chief officer hasn't troubled to come to the budget review and represent the interests of his committee. -i can only take it that he wasn't that concerned, that perhaps the chief constable doesn't share mr 's concerns, and is perhaps happy that he has received the generous funding that we state he has. +i can only take it that he wasn't that concerned, that perhaps the chief constable doesn't share mr 's concerns, and is perhaps happy that he has received the generous funding that we state he has. it seems to me that he can't be that unhappy because he's currently managing twelve vacancies deliberately, in order to produce underspend so that he can re-surface his car park, maintain privileged restaurants for his erm, senior officers, chauffeur driven car for himself and build a new hangar for his helicopter. this produced, even despite that, two hundred and thirteen thousand two hundred pounds of underspending in ninety-three four on just general expenses, on operational expenses, now i think if, if the chief constable says he hasn't got enough money to do what he wants to do, he could start by spending all of the money he's had this year, in recruiting all the officers he's been allowed to recruit. i think in fact it's a bit of a cheek for the chief constable to go to the home secretary here ev , home secretary again this year, asking for more officers, when he hasn't recruited all the ones that he was given last year. and that's perhaps why he's been turned down. -i, i don't think mr 's actually got any very reasonable criticisms at all, and we must again say, as we often do to conservatives now, who do you think's been running the country for the last fourteen or fifteen years? +i, i don't think mr 's actually got any very reasonable criticisms at all, and we must again say, as we often do to conservatives now, who do you think's been running the country for the last fourteen or fifteen years? are the dangerous libertarians, or do you mean liberals, that you accuse of running the country? are the people like margaret thatcher? i hadn't noticed her being soft on criminals, soft on people. @@ -53721,13 +53673,13 @@ more and more money has been spent on the police, and it hasn't worked, and that your government didn't have any courage then to back up it's own man, and force through some changes, and so i don't know what your policy is, it seems to change every couple of years. but one thing you can't do, is criticise this county council at all, it's simply not our fault. hear, hear. -i certainly can criticise what mr said. +i certainly can criticise what mr said. i'll just pick up, first of all one or two of the points he made. erm, he, he, he er, decried the building of the hangar, in fact that resulted in an infinitely cheaper and better contract, saved a lot of money doing it. er, i can assure him the chief constable more than shares our concerns about his,hi ,hi , his under-funding. erm, this idea that the police had more more money, yes they have had more money, what, what er, has been very conveniently ignored is the enormous amount of money we've had to spend on special protection duties. that is where most of the increase has gone. -now erm, mr refers to er, er, privileged funding. +now erm, mr refers to er, er, privileged funding. this is a total distortion of the true facts. in fact erm, there's been less funding per head in wiltshire, than many other authorities in the country. until eighteen months ago @@ -53738,29 +53690,28 @@ and that was the reason why, and in fact the total shortfall, the total unmannin now the home office has said, the home secretary rather, has said this year that he's not granting any more policemen this year, but he also said that if county councils wished to fund more policemen, he would certainly look at that. the true fact is we are no longer prepared to fund them, because we've cut the police budget. and erm, looking then at base budget which has been mentioned. - the first session we're gonna look at is called training and . it's just literally about a twenty minute session. -the purpose of the session really is to give this training course an overview and also to, to sort of have a for training. +the purpose of the session really is to give this training course an overview and also to, to sort of have a for training. what we want to do in this session as i said it will only take about twenty minutes, there are three key things we want to do. one, we're going to look at why well trained staff are, are so important to the c u, secondly we're going to look at things responsibility training is and lastly we want to look at a systematic approach that you can take as training. those are the three things we're gonna cover in about twenty minutes. -well the first thing that we want to think about is why well trained staff are so important to the company and do this very much a participated session, ignore the tape, i am, i've forgotten about it already! +well the first thing that we want to think about is why well trained staff are so important to the company and do this very much a participated session, ignore the tape, i am, i've forgotten about it already! so why are well trained staff so important to the company? you can just shout out any ideas you have so why do we need well trained people? productivity. productivity. yep? cost efficiency. -much more cost effective isn't it if things to be done once rather than have to do reading them two or three times and generally the reason that things are repeated a number of times is that perhaps people are not really quite sure or not that that are systems, yet productivity the better trained people are people who can do things, get it right the first time and they can do more work can't they than somebody else you are not having to pick it up as the manager responsible and put mistakes right. +much more cost effective isn't it if things to be done once rather than have to do reading them two or three times and generally the reason that things are repeated a number of times is that perhaps people are not really quite sure or not that that are systems, yet productivity the better trained people are people who can do things, get it right the first time and they can do more work can't they than somebody else you are not having to pick it up as the manager responsible and put mistakes right. so productivity and cost efficiency. -it gives a good impression +it gives a good impression yeah, like so many industries we're competing on good service aren't we and if we do things right it does convey a very professional image of c u to, to, to the company, to the, not to the company, to the, to the market place. i mean you were gonna say something. any more? so we've got -er yeah that's a good one isn't it? -just as if , if we are in a sort, team leader or a section head as i've shown, it doesn't mean to say that we hold all the knowledge, we can pass it on to others, who can he pass it on to somebody else although you ultimately may be responsible for the training of other people, you don't need to do it all yourself do you, but unless you pass on skills, you're gonna make a sort of a quite a vicious circle for yourself aren't ya? +er yeah that's a good one isn't it? +just as if , if we are in a sort, team leader or a section head as i've shown, it doesn't mean to say that we hold all the knowledge, we can pass it on to others, who can he pass it on to somebody else although you ultimately may be responsible for the training of other people, you don't need to do it all yourself do you, but unless you pass on skills, you're gonna make a sort of a quite a vicious circle for yourself aren't ya? yeah. and how does training do that? we all like to get things right don't we? @@ -53768,7 +53719,7 @@ we all like to think we can do things and we can do things well. it actually helps our morale doesn't it and it sort of helps our confidence. i don't know about you, but if i had to sort of pass something on to somebody else to check, if i can see somebody scribbling on it, i, i, i, i feel quite edgy, i hate it, i like to feel that i can do it and i can do it well and that other people don't need to have to amend it. there have been a lot of studies done with regard to morale and job satisfaction and it has been shown that, that if people are well trained, they feel a lot more loyalty towards the company cos they feel that somebody's actually taking responsibility for their training and development. -how does that help us in the outside world if people know that we we give good training? +how does that help us in the outside world if people know that we we give good training? yeah we attract a better class of candidate don't we? people hear within the market place that, that we give good training, that we do develop people and it does attract good people to join us doesn't it, whereas very few people want to join a company where you go nowhere, where you're not given any training you stay in the same job for ten years and it does nothing for you. most of us like to feel that we can join in and we can progress if we want to. @@ -53779,15 +53730,15 @@ yeah. we need to sort of plan we need to grow people, develop people. otherwise if we don't invest money and time in training, we're forced to have to go outside to sort of buy in people, because we haven't actually invested in them. . any more? -i think those are the those are the key things that we want to put across really. -i think the other thing is is about erm flexible as well, we've got a flexible workforce. -if people are well trained, you've got lots of people in turn you know when you've got absenteeism or holidays, you've got lots of people who could be slotted to different positions for you and obviously the better trained people are, it does help with the talent, it makes you more flexible and you've got more people who can possibly go for certain jobs. -awful lot of reasons why training i is so important to us an and basically it simply all comes back to our statement isn't it,it it's to be a sort of feeding insurer to give unsurpassed service. +i think those are the those are the key things that we want to put across really. +i think the other thing is is about erm flexible as well, we've got a flexible workforce. +if people are well trained, you've got lots of people in turn you know when you've got absenteeism or holidays, you've got lots of people who could be slotted to different positions for you and obviously the better trained people are, it does help with the talent, it makes you more flexible and you've got more people who can possibly go for certain jobs. +awful lot of reasons why training i is so important to us an and basically it simply all comes back to our statement isn't it,it it's to be a sort of feeding insurer to give unsurpassed service. i mean th there's no way we could do that unless we've got well trained staff. -we can't compete on the basis, we can't project the profession if people aren't well trained and people are making slow and the only way we can overcome that is by taking the time to train people. -and on a more le local level you're quite right the better trained people there are, the more they, the happier they feel the more work they have, the more job satisfaction they have. -there is a direct correlation between morale, motivation, job satisfaction and absenteeism and staff turnover, if people are happy they generally want to stay for us they're much more loyal and work harder and when we're managing an area it becomes a lot easier because we are not having to, people are well trained they do the things right first time, you're not having to correct their mistakes. -so training is is essential really, it's fundamental. +we can't compete on the basis, we can't project the profession if people aren't well trained and people are making slow and the only way we can overcome that is by taking the time to train people. +and on a more le local level you're quite right the better trained people there are, the more they, the happier they feel the more work they have, the more job satisfaction they have. +there is a direct correlation between morale, motivation, job satisfaction and absenteeism and staff turnover, if people are happy they generally want to stay for us they're much more loyal and work harder and when we're managing an area it becomes a lot easier because we are not having to, people are well trained they do the things right first time, you're not having to correct their mistakes. +so training is is essential really, it's fundamental. in fact we'll move on quickly now to have a look at, we've looked at why it's so important. if we spend one or two minutes just thinking about whose responsibility is training? who do you see as the sort of holding responsibility for training? @@ -53798,23 +53749,23 @@ who else do you see as holding responsibility for training? training officer. yeah. training officer. -that's what they're they're employed to do at any particular site, but they don't hold total responsibility do they? +that's what they're they're employed to do at any particular site, but they don't hold total responsibility do they? line manager's job. yes, yeah. line managers and supervisors as well are, are responsible for training because as a line manager or a supervisor you're responsible aren't you for training and developing people. that is one of your accountabilities to develop others and training falls into that. now you may as a manager think well you don't have to do it all yourself, you can use senior people within your section who have the knowledge or you can use training officers or you can use people like ourselves at the training centre or the c b t or the i vs or it could be that you bring the marketing department to help you out. there are lots of resources available for you, but ultimately if you have a manager or a supervisor in your title, then you are responsible for the training development of others, or in a technical, louise and andy the b t as are responsible for the, the technical training, aren't they, of others within, within the section cos you have the knowledge. -well what a lot of people say on the course is i know it's my responsibility, but i always, i don't always have the time to train because there's a lot of backlog, there's a lot of pressure, it's and we all say to them that training is like a catch twenty two situation. +well what a lot of people say on the course is i know it's my responsibility, but i always, i don't always have the time to train because there's a lot of backlog, there's a lot of pressure, it's and we all say to them that training is like a catch twenty two situation. if you don't make the time for training due to the work, pressures or deadlines or backlogs, and if you're not training others they make mistakes don't they? if they're not properly trained it's not their fault, people can only do what they can do can't they? -if th they don't know if people are not properly trained they are making mistakes then it does make more work doesn't it? -because the mistakes have to be rectified and it puts us under even more pressure because you've got even less time. -so training we do need to make the time otherwise it does become a catch twenty two situation. -but as you said if it is your responsibility you'll have to do it all yourself, there are lots of resources and lots of other people who can actually help you out who have the knowledge and you can use because you can use it as a development tool can't you for some of your members of the section to to give them some training expertise. +if th they don't know if people are not properly trained they are making mistakes then it does make more work doesn't it? +because the mistakes have to be rectified and it puts us under even more pressure because you've got even less time. +so training we do need to make the time otherwise it does become a catch twenty two situation. +but as you said if it is your responsibility you'll have to do it all yourself, there are lots of resources and lots of other people who can actually help you out who have the knowledge and you can use because you can use it as a development tool can't you for some of your members of the section to to give them some training expertise. right so we'll just look at the sort of er the negative side of not making the time that we get more mistakes. -we have to rectify more mistakes and put more pressure on us. -what i'd like to introduce lastly now is an approach that you can take to training to help yourselves and to help make it more effective and more systematic and what i'd like to introduce to you is, is something called the training cycle and the rest of the course is actually based around the training cycle and i know margaret you've actually seen the training cycle a few weeks ago, i'm not sure if, if any of the others are, any of the others familiar? +we have to rectify more mistakes and put more pressure on us. +what i'd like to introduce lastly now is an approach that you can take to training to help yourselves and to help make it more effective and more systematic and what i'd like to introduce to you is, is something called the training cycle and the rest of the course is actually based around the training cycle and i know margaret you've actually seen the training cycle a few weeks ago, i'm not sure if, if any of the others are, any of the others familiar? yes, i have. you've seen it before. good. @@ -53833,33 +53784,33 @@ yeah. to find out? yeah, yeah. yeah. -identifying trainees is all about finding out who needs to be trained and what they need to know and if you remember one of ject objectives we had for the course is, was to, so that by the end of the course you will actually develop a system by identifying the trainees because this is sort of hit or miss. -if they're gonna do training well, then we need some sort of system to find out who knows what and what people need to learn. +identifying trainees is all about finding out who needs to be trained and what they need to know and if you remember one of ject objectives we had for the course is, was to, so that by the end of the course you will actually develop a system by identifying the trainees because this is sort of hit or miss. +if they're gonna do training well, then we need some sort of system to find out who knows what and what people need to learn. we need some sort of method for finding out what people need to know. -the second part once we know what people need to know we now need to think about putting together some training which actually satisfies that particular need. +the second part once we know what people need to know we now need to think about putting together some training which actually satisfies that particular need. so this next part is called design in training. we're slipping into the training jargon here, but all it is is writing, just putting together some material which is, which is just what they need. if you haven't done this, if you haven't found out exactly what people need to know, the danger is that when you actually start to put together some material it's very hit or miss isn't it? it could be that you're giving them some stuff that we already know or it could be that you're giving them some stuff which is far too advanced for them, they don't have the basics there. sometimes we know people very well, but it still helps doesn't it if somebody else comes in that there's some sort of system there that somebody else who takes over your section can find out exactly who's received what. the last point then is delivering the training. -once we've actually written the session we can then deliver it and the delivery is generally much more effective if we've put together material which suits their needs perfectly. -you feel more confident don't you in a group situation if you know exactly what people er er know or what they don't know, cos there's nothing worse isn't there than to go in and thinking they may already know this, i might be going in an teaching my grandmother to suck eggs here, i'm not sure what they know about this. +once we've actually written the session we can then deliver it and the delivery is generally much more effective if we've put together material which suits their needs perfectly. +you feel more confident don't you in a group situation if you know exactly what people er er know or what they don't know, cos there's nothing worse isn't there than to go in and thinking they may already know this, i might be going in an teaching my grandmother to suck eggs here, i'm not sure what they know about this. you feel much more confident don't you if you know exactly what people need from you. you go in feeling better and cos you feel better you'll deliver it in a much more effective way. -and the last part is something that a number of you had for your objectives is and evaluation monitoring and evaluating training. +and the last part is something that a number of you had for your objectives is and evaluation monitoring and evaluating training. once you've actually delivered it, you then need to find out well was it successful, did we achieve our objectives, did people learn, what we wanted them to learn. -this is the very important part of the training cycle and the cycle is incomplete cos there's no good investing in time and training is there if we don't know whether we've been +this is the very important part of the training cycle and the cycle is incomplete cos there's no good investing in time and training is there if we don't know whether we've been successful or not. if we have, great, we find out what else they need to know. if they haven't quite got it, then we may need to re-do parts of it. but we think the training cycle is something that's continuous. if people are new we need to train them to get the maximum competent level don't we? if they've been with us for quite some time there are always ways we can enhance people's skills aren't there? -there are always ways that we could make people more effective or help people to got the wrong flip, but, but to grow into other jobs. -so that's the training cycle and we believe that if you follow that approach to training, then it will help you to be very effective and successful. +there are always ways that we could make people more effective or help people to got the wrong flip, but, but to grow into other jobs. +so that's the training cycle and we believe that if you follow that approach to training, then it will help you to be very effective and successful. that's something that we definitely do here. -right first of all i said it was an overview and that's all it was. +right first of all i said it was an overview and that's all it was. what we wanted to look at to start with was why training is so important, whose responsibility training is and lastly a systematic approach to training. what we're gonna do now, it's just coming up to twenty past three, so we'll take a tea break and then after tea we'll come back and we'll spend about an hour or so looking at identifying trainees. we'll look at what you're currently doing and we also suggest to you something that you could be doing. @@ -53875,8 +53826,8 @@ yeah and i need the diction i dunno why . asking questions referring, do you get that situation whereby you're told something two or three times and yet they keep coming back? is it a training need, or could it just be the fact that if they pass it on to you, they know you're dead? two aspects of that, but i think that's a good way of identifying training. -yeah, we're on the training cycle again another one. -contact with the outside world customer services +yeah, we're on the training cycle again another one. +contact with the outside world customer services so what would you, how would you identify from that? there's no margin so we got two then on to errors and erm complaints. @@ -53888,27 +53839,27 @@ it says, you know broadening it out a bit so we can be a bit more specific. alright. changes in job specifications, personnel changes. reinforced ones -alright changes in job spec -i procedures were introduced. +alright changes in job spec +i procedures were introduced. any others? backlog okay. yeah, erm by examining people's body language . we're not going to that one now, cos i haven't examined your body language i'm not really interested. -erm right, difficult one that it's like the body language after what?looking at do some work. -amazing +erm right, difficult one that it's like the body language after what?looking at do some work. +amazing yes, thank you for that precise definition there. what was that, sorry? -yeah you wanna see if they can do it or not you can tell if somebody, if you give somebody something to do body language you can normally -yeah sit at their desk . -now the thing about positives, when identify you know somebody might have training. +yeah you wanna see if they can do it or not you can tell if somebody, if you give somebody something to do body language you can normally +yeah sit at their desk . +now the thing about positives, when identify you know somebody might have training. now be positive about it. when they've been promoted to a high ranking job. right, promotion. and if you've got somebody who's gonna be promoted or you think might be promoted in a couple years' time, or even yeah less than that, well what should you be doing? you ever heard a succession plan is? -er you probably don't do it erm you know er so brazenly probably the back of your mind but again key staff, you are key staff er yeah if you actually prepare somebody to take over your job when you're not there sort of thing. +er you probably don't do it erm you know er so brazenly probably the back of your mind but again key staff, you are key staff er yeah if you actually prepare somebody to take over your job when you're not there sort of thing. so in a way it's a succession plan. what other things might come out? what do we do once a year? @@ -53919,64 +53870,64 @@ review. anything else, appraisals, yeah things like that? anyone else . comprehensive list. -new recruits ask them what a good idea. -charts of asking questions, if people come to you and ask questions keep referring the same things similar things to you all the time. +new recruits ask them what a good idea. +charts of asking questions, if people come to you and ask questions keep referring the same things similar things to you all the time. perhaps it's cos they don't know the basics. what sort of errors do they make? -persistently make errors and the same with it. -complaints from other departments and complaints from members of the public, changes in job spec er new technology perhaps er backlogs that, people always have a backlog don't they? +persistently make errors and the same with it. +complaints from other departments and complaints from members of the public, changes in job spec er new technology perhaps er backlogs that, people always have a backlog don't they? is it cos they're lazy, often think it's cos they're lazy don't they? -i think it's often because people are always and then it always gets put to the bottom of the pile. +i think it's often because people are always and then it always gets put to the bottom of the pile. things they're not so sure about . -perhaps might not be it, can't, you can't wave a magic wand and say everything's but they might not. -body language can suggest you have like jumping out a window or hanging themselves or whatever. +perhaps might not be it, can't, you can't wave a magic wand and say everything's but they might not. +body language can suggest you have like jumping out a window or hanging themselves or whatever. promotion, succession planning. -we do enough succession planning in c u you know it's magic you know, you know number two like it's smashing number two it's still you know, you know young children, number two has a different connotation to what it does here, but definitely if you are a number two here, it means the same to what a child thinks it is, but i +we do enough succession planning in c u you know it's magic you know, you know number two like it's smashing number two it's still you know, you know young children, number two has a different connotation to what it does here, but definitely if you are a number two here, it means the same to what a child thinks it is, but i er, and appraisals. -all all packets that we can use to identify i really do need people to talk to me. +all all packets that we can use to identify i really do need people to talk to me. alright, so that's a brief out overview if you like of some of the errors that we can do. -let's go a bit more specific job analysis. -we do the first bit who needs to be trained what do they need to know is the second -yeah, so what they need to know and why forms a heading job analysis. +let's go a bit more specific job analysis. +we do the first bit who needs to be trained what do they need to know is the second +yeah, so what they need to know and why forms a heading job analysis. where do you get your job analysis from? personnel. what? personnel. personnel. okay, has anyone seen their job spec? -does it actually give you any training on it? -it's very broad isn't it yeah. +does it actually give you any training on it? +it's very broad isn't it yeah. erm -oh no it's the same sort of thing you're told it when you +oh no it's the same sort of thing you're told it when you you're told it aren't you? it tends to be blocked up in somebody's mind what you do. -right, that's the other element, it's what you think they think you should be doing and it's amazing how few people, yeah that's the yeah -i talking about, but that's what job specs are all about. +right, that's the other element, it's what you think they think you should be doing and it's amazing how few people, yeah that's the yeah +i talking about, but that's what job specs are all about. it might seem long-winded, but dependent upon er if you get it right at the start with it, it might mean that one of the things we're suggesting er you might say no, it's not for me this, but you might think that job analysis is a good way of identifying training. what they've gotta do and why they do it. what's the starting point for job analysis do you think? what's the first thing you've gotta identify? -yeah, the need for the job er er yeah, not, not quite exactly what i'm looking for,the way of the trainer's dilemma isn't it? +yeah, the need for the job er er yeah, not, not quite exactly what i'm looking for,the way of the trainer's dilemma isn't it? i've got an answer for that it's not quite right, what shall i do? can i just say no, shut up. or should i and this is all part of it isn't it? cos he won't say anything to me if i don't know what's wrong erm won't say anything else will he? -what results +what results yeah, alright. yeah okay, so we're looking for results. the results of this person why are they employed. so the results that we expect out the job. if you get results it could earn a job analysis what would we do? -if i, if i was a job analysis person, what will i sit next to you wouldn't i and what would i have missed out? +if i, if i was a job analysis person, what will i sit next to you wouldn't i and what would i have missed out? right, yeah. another word for main responsibilities. mm, you're testing me today aren't you! right. -key tasks what is the person's key task? -this is difficult stuff i'm not gonna spend a lot of time on this because it's covered on various other courses as well. +key tasks what is the person's key task? +this is difficult stuff i'm not gonna spend a lot of time on this because it's covered on various other courses as well. things like appraisal skills er level one level two, various others, other courses that we run. -there's your job the first thing i should do is say well what are the key tasks, what are the areas that would mean results? +there's your job the first thing i should do is say well what are the key tasks, what are the areas that would mean results? perhaps a working demonstration might highlight something i'm trying to . take the job of a receptionist. who's been a receptionist? @@ -53986,34 +53937,34 @@ right. let's list the tasks of a receptionist. shout now, go on,let let's go for it. telephone, answering it -and telephone, answer. +and telephone, answer. that's what you think they do. er, you're right, erm i can't think of the right word er re-route. re-route, same thing as what you meant isn't it? diverts, if i wrote divert up here you might use it against me in later life. -erm er route, let's just call it route er to correct yeah? +erm er route, let's just call it route er to correct yeah? does that make sense, that's for the receptionist we don't expect her to fiddle with the rates for liability, capital or whatever do we? anything else a receptionist does? okay? -okay, so it's erm meet public yeah? +okay, so it's erm meet public yeah? we need to right fair enough. -well i did do stat view in the first year but not very much +well i did do stat view in the first year but not very much yeah. no, no i how to use it. -find stat view very difficult to use myself but er when the time comes, once you've got a few that are filled in we can erm well i'll show you how to do an s p s s data file and, and erm so you can bash your data in and if you bring it back we can turn it into a system file and analyze it. -erm so er that shouldn't be too bad. +find stat view very difficult to use myself but er when the time comes, once you've got a few that are filled in we can erm well i'll show you how to do an s p s s data file and, and erm so you can bash your data in and if you bring it back we can turn it into a system file and analyze it. +erm so er that shouldn't be too bad. so i don't know do you, do you fancy now kind of giving the different versions to a few people by way of er er yeah. another pilot and, and see if erm -well i'll just do it in my flat i suppose +well i'll just do it in my flat i suppose yeah. yeah fair enough if, if that's erm you know how you fancy starting. -and then if you +and then if you finish it off. -any, any sort of, yeah, any sort of changes or anything erm er i don't know if you're around sort of early next week we can +any, any sort of, yeah, any sort of changes or anything erm er i don't know if you're around sort of early next week we can yeah. get the yeah. @@ -54023,16 +53974,16 @@ and er it usually takes about three working days and er okay. and away you go. -how subjects are you ? -erm with a thing like this, i mean what i usually say to people it depends on erm if you've got a lot of numerical data, oh you might as well have this back for the time being so +how subjects are you ? +erm with a thing like this, i mean what i usually say to people it depends on erm if you've got a lot of numerical data, oh you might as well have this back for the time being so sweaty hands soaking into it or anything erm er then it does help, if you're looking for p less than point o five, and aren't we all these days, erm -you know er it helps if erm it helps if the groups that you're comparing between there's about sort of at least twenty people in each sort of thing, erm and the same goes for things like, things that you might want to do squares on or something like that erm so i mean if you were interested in comparing people who attended very regularly with people who only attended once in a while erm you know it would help if there were about sort of more than forty people altogether so that there was sort of, you know +you know er it helps if erm it helps if the groups that you're comparing between there's about sort of at least twenty people in each sort of thing, erm and the same goes for things like, things that you might want to do squares on or something like that erm so i mean if you were interested in comparing people who attended very regularly with people who only attended once in a while erm you know it would help if there were about sort of more than forty people altogether so that there was sort of, you know mm. -you could median split them at whatever the medium was and then you've got two groups to compare erm because it usually looks quite nice if you've got something comparative as well as looking at the average sort of, you know, pattern of responses on the questionnaire. -equally if you've got erm i don't know what other kinds of differences you might want to erm er look for but again if you're looking for differences it helps if there's about sort of twenty people in each of the groups sort of thing. +you could median split them at whatever the medium was and then you've got two groups to compare erm because it usually looks quite nice if you've got something comparative as well as looking at the average sort of, you know, pattern of responses on the questionnaire. +equally if you've got erm i don't know what other kinds of differences you might want to erm er look for but again if you're looking for differences it helps if there's about sort of twenty people in each of the groups sort of thing. or if you're comparing people with themselves as it were, that is looking for differences between how they answer one question and how they answer another question, then sort of , you know, kind of twenty or more people and you've got a reasonable chance of showing up some, some p less than point o fives. -erm i don't know that's, this is not in any official stats books but it's just my experience with students' projects that if you get more than, there's a sort of critical mass of about, about forty respondents and then you're much more likely to start showing some interesting statistically significant findings for some reason, erm i don't quite know why but er it's one of life's little mysteries but er so that's usually if there's a lot of numerical data what i'd try and advise people to er to get. +erm i don't know that's, this is not in any official stats books but it's just my experience with students' projects that if you get more than, there's a sort of critical mass of about, about forty respondents and then you're much more likely to start showing some interesting statistically significant findings for some reason, erm i don't quite know why but er it's one of life's little mysteries but er so that's usually if there's a lot of numerical data what i'd try and advise people to er to get. oh that's so you know i mean more than that by all means, you know, er so much the better, you know y the more the merrier but erm certainly you know kind of it's a good idea to at least try and get that many erm yeah. @@ -54042,7 +53993,7 @@ mm. and erm they've got eighty members so oh right. mhm. -so they're like sending me a list, well they sent me back a half list +so they're like sending me a list, well they sent me back a half list mm. i said to them can i have a list they said oh yeah sure she went we'll put it in your mm. @@ -54051,25 +54002,25 @@ pigeon hole, you know it's just like bit of, scrap of paper with like a few name mm. and they said oh we'll get the list to you, the full list to you as soon as possible i mean yeah. -that was about two weeks ago +that was about two weeks ago yeah. well i mean it's often things that people do in their spare time the, the record keeping isn't perfect and, and yeah that's the thing they haven't got time, yeah. they don't have a, you know, kind of computer based mailing list that they can print out or something you know? -no yeah i know that so +no yeah i know that so mm. so i should yeah. -if i, if i get in touch with them then i'll +if i, if i get in touch with them then i'll mm. yeah i mean that might certainly give you some, you know, kind of you know regular attenders to er to, to yeah. -to look at erm so er yeah +to look at erm so er yeah great. are you into football very much yourself or er yeah. oh right mm so it's, it, this, this emerges out of a personal interest thing? -yeah +yeah oh right. mm. yeah i support bristol city @@ -54078,8 +54029,8 @@ are you from that part of the world at all or? er forest of dean. oh right so er mm yeah it's the nearest place really. -yeah within the nearest place with a biggish -with a yeah. +yeah within the nearest place with a biggish +with a yeah. football team possibly yeah. anyway right. @@ -54091,14 +54042,14 @@ yeah fine erm but as i say it's just sort of you know kind of minor layout chang yeah. so you know at a pinch you could probably run it like that and i don't suppose anybody would notice the difference but, you know, just in terms of you know making things look attractive right. -erm so you know but you may find if you give, print off a few and give them to a few people over the weekend +erm so you know but you may find if you give, print off a few and give them to a few people over the weekend mm. you may find that some additional changes occur to you mm. which you might want to incorporate anyway so you may not want to print off another version anyway yeah. so er -erm oh yeah the other thing was it's two sided at the moment, is that +erm oh yeah the other thing was it's two sided at the moment, is that mm. best or do you think erm generally speaking the consensus is it helps if it's sort of on one side @@ -54108,7 +54059,7 @@ okay yeah. double sided, collated, stapled different coloured paper and all, you know, all this sort of thing yeah. -so er erm er so that's no, is there anything else we need to worry about with regard to that? +so er erm er so that's no, is there anything else we need to worry about with regard to that? er no i don't think so. so as i say i think it'll, i think it'll, it'll run okay and behave itself on the assumption you can get some people to fill it in so er yeah. @@ -54120,10 +54071,10 @@ okay. mm. i shall try to. yeah. -and yourself +and yourself oh yes i could do with one. are you working? -yeah well i'm, i'm gonna try and get the final year lecture for tuesday sorted actually on saturday and erm it's usually, it's usually guy but i think i'm doing it this week, yeah, because i've got quite a few to do on things like racist in the media and guy's mate dennis has just written a book and he's given me a manuscript of it and it's about how racist psychology is which is +yeah well i'm, i'm gonna try and get the final year lecture for tuesday sorted actually on saturday and erm it's usually, it's usually guy but i think i'm doing it this week, yeah, because i've got quite a few to do on things like racist in the media and guy's mate dennis has just written a book and he's given me a manuscript of it and it's about how racist psychology is which is really? yeah and he's spotted racism in the atkinson et al textbook and all sorts of, all over the place so erm mm there should be something interesting to talk about in that for a start. yeah. @@ -54152,27 +54103,27 @@ ah! oh well erm yeah i didn't fancy let's see -going up to the senile +going up to the senile no i don't i don't blame you. erm -i sort of started to feel a bit ill before so +i sort of started to feel a bit ill before so yeah. -well do er do come in er well did you have a pleasant trip down? +well do er do come in er well did you have a pleasant trip down? erm yeah it was okay, it wasn't too bad. mm. -alright cos i think we've been sent these on approval to see if we want to adopt them for course material +alright cos i think we've been sent these on approval to see if we want to adopt them for course material yeah. you see so erm they seem quite nice. yeah. -erm well i, i don't know quite what erm they'll be teaching you out of in your er abnormal course but erm er i do find the, the the sort of current generation of american textbooks quite erm +erm well i, i don't know quite what erm they'll be teaching you out of in your er abnormal course but erm er i do find the, the the sort of current generation of american textbooks quite erm mm. quite a nice, quite exciting erm i tell you what, swivel that swivel chair round and, and sit on that okay. -do you have a drink please or +do you have a drink please or yes of course. now erm what sort of flavours appeal? -now we've got ordinary tea, we've got herbal tea, we've got coffee out of a coffee machine, we've got lapsang souchong, we've got ordinary tea i've mentioned that already haven't i? +now we've got ordinary tea, we've got herbal tea, we've got coffee out of a coffee machine, we've got lapsang souchong, we've got ordinary tea i've mentioned that already haven't i? erm we've got soap powder and shampoo oh i'll have some sort of tea, that'll do. @@ -54190,24 +54141,23 @@ yeah. erm it's not too what's in the middle? elderly it's cheese and pickle -oh good, i can't -oh well yeah, got you there. -erm yeah if er you have no objection, what it's for is the, there's this outfit called the british national corpus and they're trying to make a record of english language as it's used in the late twentieth century erm so it's a sort of resource for further scholarship so it can assist in writing dictionaries and studying grammar and, and all sorts of things like that and erm they're attempting to tape conversations from all over the place erm er i've got a bit of bumph about it, it's quite interesting erm and in some cases it's sort of out of erm er it's out of people's homes, it's out of broadcasts, it's out of meetings, it's out of all sorts of things erm at work and at home erm +oh good, i can't +oh well yeah, got you there. +erm yeah if er you have no objection, what it's for is the, there's this outfit called the british national corpus and they're trying to make a record of english language as it's used in the late twentieth century erm so it's a sort of resource for further scholarship so it can assist in writing dictionaries and studying grammar and, and all sorts of things like that and erm they're attempting to tape conversations from all over the place erm er i've got a bit of bumph about it, it's quite interesting erm and in some cases it's sort of out of erm er it's out of people's homes, it's out of broadcasts, it's out of meetings, it's out of all sorts of things erm at work and at home erm have you just turned it on now? yeah it's, it's just on at the moment er they didn't hear any the other stuff oh. erm so -oh yes it's oxf er oxford university press, chambers dictionaries, british library, lancaster university oxford university erm so er it's erm quite interesting so +oh yes it's oxf er oxford university press, chambers dictionaries, british library, lancaster university oxford university erm so er it's erm quite interesting so do you mind if i have a cigarette? no go ahead are you sure? go ahead i don't, no i don't mind people smoking in here, it's fine by me. so er oh dear, oh i'm a bit frazzled. frazzled? -yeah i mean it er i was up till about two a m so er +yeah i mean it er i was up till about two a m so er what, marking? -well i've just about finished marking for the moment, er what it is erm i went out last night, ill advised - +well i've just about finished marking for the moment, er what it is erm i went out last night, ill advised goes sure you don't want to go badminton, mm, ah? no @@ -54237,7 +54187,7 @@ i ain't got that many what? can you lend us no i haven't got any money -er done a hole there, it's not even going through the hole +er done a hole there, it's not even going through the hole turn that handle, see you later then no i want a pound, lends us a pound jo no @@ -54245,7 +54195,7 @@ yeah no yeah i haven't got a pound on me -show us can you lend us a pound? +show us can you lend us a pound? no please no @@ -54258,7 +54208,7 @@ just give me your change then i haven't got any change well, how, your coppers, you must have a pound tucked away somewhere mum, mum have a game of something neil, then you won't have to go into town will you? -not staying here with you just because you're bored i ain't +not staying here with you just because you're bored i ain't i'm not bored eh? shut up parrot @@ -54293,19 +54243,19 @@ oh come on you must have some change to be or not to be, oh no come on sis no -i'll do anything please i, i +i'll do anything please i, i you, you clean my black boots for me, polish my black boots for me and i give you a quid when i come back no, no you do it now or you don't get your pound what these ones? yeah -alright then i tell you something if i clean these and i don't get that pound +alright then i tell you something if i clean these and i don't get that pound yes you will, you'll definitely get a pound if i clean these and i don't get a pound these are going in the pond i promise you a pound if you and then they walk in the bin so i suggest you don't give me any hassle -oh i'll give you , i'll give you a pound don't worry, make sure you do the job properly, mm you'd better do it outside, cos the er, the boot polish don't go on the carpet. -ah look at this mum look i'm wiping for a pound +oh i'll give you , i'll give you a pound don't worry, make sure you do the job properly, mm you'd better do it outside, cos the er, the boot polish don't go on the carpet. +ah look at this mum look i'm wiping for a pound alright if i can see my face in them you, you might have a tip see you've got your purse in your bag you better give me the money @@ -54326,7 +54276,7 @@ are you sure you turned that bleeding kettle off? i have well why's it still steaming then? cos it's hot -and the frying pan not really i think the taste is distorted or something +and the frying pan not really i think the taste is distorted or something the taste gone wrong, erm, what you want? what shall i put? which part, how do i write @@ -54340,7 +54290,7 @@ i don't know something to do with erm sports i suppose well, or some entertainme yum yum it's like i suppose yesterday and it's worse, worse today than when i done it yesterday -got a sports thing yet? +got a sports thing yet? no, where's, where's that then? go and pump, pump some weights today you can go and do that can't you?, @@ -54371,10 +54321,10 @@ trying to think what to put down your relationship here whose? his oh -the bird cor, better +the bird cor, better oh yes god don't start him off again -pretty boy oh +pretty boy oh can do with some fags pardon? can do with some fags @@ -54391,8 +54341,8 @@ through the post you or something mind -you save five pounds wet wet's -they've sold out geoff and er trevor's off to see him ain't he? +you save five pounds wet wet's +they've sold out geoff and er trevor's off to see him ain't he? his mum got him tickets oh well wet wet wet, not wet wet @@ -54444,7 +54394,7 @@ cos when you have a bath all the, you know, put the fan on and all the steam'll like a sauna in there when you have a shower i suppose he knows what he's doing be a bit of drilling i suppose won't it? -all they have to do is drill there well he won't do no drilling +all they have to do is drill there well he won't do no drilling he will why? he's gonna have to drill @@ -54460,7 +54410,7 @@ yeah that's what i said to you didn't i? only when i take them off danny, danny come up over my socks no one 's asking you are they? -oh god +oh god cor strewth see even now mum you can't see when you're doing the washing up i suppose your @@ -54482,7 +54432,7 @@ would he hell said he was i went this morning i said enjoyed your weekend then, she said oh yeah, i said how's daniel then? -daniel she says, danny weren't there i said well jean said, she said well jean wouldn't know him if he come and sat on her lap so she said no he weren't there, said erm i used to go down there, she said she was very good. +daniel she says, danny weren't there i said well jean said, she said well jean wouldn't know him if he come and sat on her lap so she said no he weren't there, said erm i used to go down there, she said she was very good. yeah and erm no see what's happened you see, that's gotta go @@ -54499,7 +54449,7 @@ no i can't, no not there let's have it then no, no you can't love, because we've done it at work -go on then that is the same thickness as that in there, that is +go on then that is the same thickness as that in there, that is what's that there then? that's what that, that's come off there that has well you pull it out don't you? @@ -54510,7 +54460,7 @@ ah? it's harder than what you think it is this oh, i wonder why this was yeah -i suppose that's why it went, sucking it up properly i suppose she had it riding up +i suppose that's why it went, sucking it up properly i suppose she had it riding up had a tug at it and that's what rips it i suppose yeah i'll get you a pair of pliers? @@ -54532,14 +54482,14 @@ yeah well she said she's got a lot of scrubs to do and all that business yeah so she said while you've been doing that she said she's been sort of gassing to anybody you know, so she said it's been mentioned by management and they said oh well she'll be able to sort of hovering while she stood there you know, time, time to natter she could be erm, got time to do that. -yeah so i said oh i see, so that was that, so i think they've got a, a meeting in a couple of weeks and they'll sort of tell her discreetly that she has to carry on and do it what she's been the +yeah so i said oh i see, so that was that, so i think they've got a, a meeting in a couple of weeks and they'll sort of tell her discreetly that she has to carry on and do it what she's been the time sort of thing you know, so, said it's been noticed that like and all that you know? yeah but erm, you know, get it's got to be scrubbed more often so you know normally -that is the same thickness as what this i think can you hold that dear? +that is the same thickness as what this i think can you hold that dear? i'm surprised joy didn't say something about it yesterday actually joanne perhaps she didn't have it she done quite a bit of hovering really @@ -54569,11 +54519,11 @@ oh god yeah tommy shh good morning -oh what have you got to do erm, college +oh what have you got to do erm, college i think that's what he's gone down for i think is it? oh -yeah should of asked erm jean, asked er whatever her name is, for the details +yeah should of asked erm jean, asked er whatever her name is, for the details yeah but but she said he's now going er, erm october who is? @@ -54583,14 +54533,14 @@ yeah this is february ain't it so he goes what does he, be getting it again, but he hasn't done it yet has he? no but he's due, he's booked in for erm -oh oh +oh oh what's a matter with you then? about what? goes to show it's been used then don't it? oh yeah, what did you get that bloody cable over pardon? where'd you put that cable? -oh oh +oh oh excuse me what? this carpet gets filthy @@ -54619,7 +54569,7 @@ who? erm yes please what? -all of them please have you got those, all of them did the shop sell +all of them please have you got those, all of them did the shop sell this morning, those potatoes yeah oh they call it @@ -54633,7 +54583,7 @@ her last ones, about two pound something a bag they're two fifty a bag in there ain't you? yeah -weather i suppose got something to do with it had a weekend down there with her and ant +weather i suppose got something to do with it had a weekend down there with her and ant oh yeah cos she weren't very well really no, no, they broke down didn't they? @@ -54653,7 +54603,7 @@ oh yeah there were sixteen of them, sixteen of them all there sixteen? yeah sixteen of them, well the more of them you see the cheaper it is -yeah she said that er they walked into minehead on sunday +yeah she said that er they walked into minehead on sunday oh yeah, jean told me she said no , jean said oh i can't walk that, have a bloody heart attack she says, so they put her in a trolley they put her in a bloody trolley and oh course she said, this woman said erm @@ -54671,7 +54621,7 @@ well it's not that she, it was affecting the drink she had you know oh i see she said the drink, the drinks are quite expensive down there yeah, i'm glad they took their, took their own -yeah cos what, what they said like, their own, cos they run out of wine at the bar and er, they went in the supermarket and got two bottles of wine and kept them on the table you see +yeah cos what, what they said like, their own, cos they run out of wine at the bar and er, they went in the supermarket and got two bottles of wine and kept them on the table you see oh so, they said what was it? @@ -54704,11 +54654,11 @@ oh no erm, oh the yes, i said it was all let us make our way there, we'd get lost who? -no go and have a look see what it's like +no go and have a look see what it's like most probably end up in wales pardon? we'd most probably end up in wales or something -i'd go and ring barry up then +i'd go and ring barry up then so what you gonna do for eats tomorrow then? well you won't have much time now to eat no don't, i shall, if i'm home by, only if i got back by five, i, i better @@ -54756,10 +54706,10 @@ let me see then, round your kneecaps? no i have, i have lost it, i tell you what, now listen don't you start splattering at me mate now look, this -had been a, a mark going around that, right and that's what +had been a, a mark going around that, right and that's what i have lost it though, i have there are, don't tip that over the cloth then -alright then, come on then you know i forgot i didn't have me keys with me this morning, of course the first one +alright then, come on then you know i forgot i didn't have me keys with me this morning, of course the first one didn't you have your sandwiches then? i just, i had erm soft bread you know get that cut that bread did you? @@ -54767,7 +54717,7 @@ did you have that luncheon meat that's in there? yeah you did there's two slices left, i shall have that tomorrow -no, no i'm not that keen on it i just have a couple of biscuits and a cup of tea when i come home +no, no i'm not that keen on it i just have a couple of biscuits and a cup of tea when i come home yeah oh yeah i'll get some more thursday yes, what biscuits do you want, big ones? @@ -54780,7 +54730,7 @@ no mo oh i just wondered, here are ah? -i just wondered if you had anything planned for the weekend that oh +i just wondered if you had anything planned for the weekend that oh what number is nigel at then? erm, oh sixty erm, sixty three oh that's better then innit? @@ -54790,14 +54740,14 @@ who? swallow end, erm if that's it then i can er write her card out later on oh if you like i can put it through her door -oh that's alright she must be about er sixty four, five i suppose +oh that's alright she must be about er sixty four, five i suppose ah? i say she should be about sixty four, erm eight four is she eighty four? yeah dunno ah? -no they're alright aren't they? +no they're alright aren't they? do you like them? those other ones they come off it i think what ones? @@ -54833,7 +54783,7 @@ they won't need if they thought it was that bad they would of picked it up on the m o t wouldn't they? that's what they said, cos i, i said is it something that has to be checked regularly, he said no, it doesn't really go that often yeah -so erm something +so erm something so you'd be paying out for some more tyres if you don't have that checked or anything yeah ain't you? @@ -54845,7 +54795,7 @@ and in between time she goes to meet gordon so er oh yeah i don't know where they live, i know the court but i don't know whereabouts they are. no -only where erm mrs and that live and that's about it +only where erm mrs and that live and that's about it done me ironing and got that out the way oh yeah quite damp out there really, when i ironed it @@ -54864,7 +54814,7 @@ or something yeah alright then there's a potato in there, thought rather to use that who? -oh yeah they've got something like that down erm +oh yeah they've got something like that down erm they roll it out on the dance floor upstairs something like that i suppose that's right, it's on now that is. @@ -54876,33 +54826,33 @@ neville . oh! you got any first class stamps anywhere? yeah? -i'm a first erm class si stamps. +i'm a first erm class si stamps. stamps? yeah. -cos i've got i've got a couple here twenty four pence. +cos i've got i've got a couple here twenty four pence. fifty, fifty pence? no, i got some green in here. -erm two pence. +erm two pence. no i can't find any. . here are, er -four at twenty four pence and two at two pence. +four at twenty four pence and two at two pence. so that's . -and that if i post it tomorrow friday. +and that if i post it tomorrow friday. so if i put a twenty four one on then it could leave that like that, right? don't want her to pay any out at the other end do we? oh yeah. you don't know what second class post is do you, first? no, i guess that'll be thirty four or something. the book. -twenty, a couple of twenty four pence ones here but joy reckons it's more than that. +twenty, a couple of twenty four pence ones here but joy reckons it's more than that. no, just -yes i put a twenty four pence one on and a two pence one. -cos don't want her to pay any at the other end do i? -and i post it tomorrow er, thursday. -ah this pick this up in derek's office today look. +yes i put a twenty four pence one on and a two pence one. +cos don't want her to pay any at the other end do i? +and i post it tomorrow er, thursday. +ah this pick this up in derek's office today look. and if i just go to clean and erm -this what do you reckon? +this what do you reckon? yes. where they going to that? wembley aren't they? @@ -54913,7 +54863,7 @@ and the other one's simply red i think. how much did they pay for a ticket then, how much? i dunno. i have to ask when he comes tonight. -he put that up today. +he put that up today. he thought about it last week but it's pretty hush hush i think. yeah. oh dear! @@ -54924,7 +54874,7 @@ ian and i, just going with six of them or something. or perhaps he's going up in his van or some i dunno! well cos, you gotta get in early cos everybody else is sort of erm they were so popular last year. -cos the er you know they'll be +cos the er you know they'll be yeah, it had football tomorrow. mm. is it on? @@ -54939,13 +54889,13 @@ it is. yeah , that's my brilliant idea! i'll take it football. yeah, take it to football. -oh yeah, see how people sort of natter on. +oh yeah, see how people sort of natter on. natter on, yeah. you know sometimes . fight! and swear!! the first tape we played back and it was him eating toast! -god, it was like ooh it was terrible! +god, it was like ooh it was terrible! yeah. so, as if the blooming whole thing was distorted or something. sounded like,was it? @@ -54953,22 +54903,22 @@ ooh ee ooh! ooh eh ! i shall remember that now. ee er! -so you won't be able to wear his bottom ones out will he cos he ain't got nothing to grind on now! -we didn't turn the window light on. -i says this week . +so you won't be able to wear his bottom ones out will he cos he ain't got nothing to grind on now! +we didn't turn the window light on. +i says this week . yeah, didn't want to trouble you. what time you coming up? -so he's standing right the other +so he's standing right the other yeah. end. you'll have a light there and a light there, all on ooh! together. that's great isn't it? -because that switch there +because that switch there yeah. is to the entrance. -is that light that light. +is that light that light. yeah. what this one? yeah. @@ -54976,16 +54926,16 @@ well i ain't got nothing yet. after christmas . no! don't make no difference. -well, the only trouble is if you did put that one i must admit. -yeah, what i thought see, if you come out and i'm covering the door and this light on you'll be able to see straight away. +well, the only trouble is if you did put that one i must admit. +yeah, what i thought see, if you come out and i'm covering the door and this light on you'll be able to see straight away. yeah. yeah. -see look if i sort of turn round +see look if i sort of turn round yeah, like briony and got she comes in here, so she yeah. -switches that on to sort out her . +switches that on to sort out her . yeah. cos i got help her with that. see we could put the outside light there. @@ -55000,24 +54950,24 @@ oh my god! he dived on the . what i'll do is put your clips up the top here and then erm burn them! -just let it at the bottom. +just let it at the bottom. don't wanna keep the chairs.. and then someone . hey? -er i don't care! +er i don't care! don't you care? no. you saying about having so some chips, i think you could have had it in here! that's twenty five six. god! could have had some in, some in here couldn't he? -could of had a bit of mash and could of had a bit of mashed potato and couple of eggs or something. +could of had a bit of mash and could of had a bit of mashed potato and couple of eggs or something. couple of sausages. yes i know. we did offer him some ice cream but he said no thank you. no,. i never said that. -oh you had again didn't you? +oh you had again didn't you? what? them cheese fritters? those @@ -55026,7 +54976,7 @@ peas. they are, mushy peas. mushy peas. mhm. -they must squash them in the hand and just throw it in mustn't they? +they must squash them in the hand and just throw it in mustn't they? well, yeah, yeah, yeah. so i'm off in to watch eastenders then. no. @@ -55046,7 +54996,7 @@ how old? yeah. cor! ah? -i reckon my nappies! +i reckon my nappies! thank you. right thank you very much. aha! @@ -55067,7 +55017,7 @@ ah christ i've only just got in mama! oh you'll want half a tin won't you? you could store these for another two years mum. what is that love? -it's got b dot b dot e october ninety four. +it's got b dot b dot e october ninety four. oh! salt. oh you want that switched off, okay. @@ -55107,7 +55057,7 @@ mm. no, i thought you wanted one. oh no, i don't need one, no. alright. -he's quite happy to undo the the squashed . +he's quite happy to undo the the squashed . oh god! friends? i tell you, i go i tell you neil you're very perpetual. @@ -55117,7 +55067,7 @@ and a long time, innit? what? well starkness though. -and you haircut +and you haircut haircut at last! what's up doc! yeah, i think i know it as well. @@ -55125,16 +55075,16 @@ all gums. goody goody gum drops! gummy! oh yeah, that's good ! -gummy, gummy +gummy, gummy his first name. -well i . +well i . now that's a loaded question innit? gonna put foot in his mouth now! it's not,on my side of the story! are you gonna put your teeth in neil? eh? both feet gone! -don't on the plate then. +don't on the plate then. there's no room is there? no. want some of it taken off then? @@ -55146,7 +55096,7 @@ christ, only wanna fit in my mouth! ta. th they let me have these scales. i was working right up to then. -so then you put and then pop them in to +so then you put and then pop them in to ya. oh! i'll go look in there when that . @@ -55172,13 +55122,13 @@ well i mean the sooner that's . chips and everything else on it. yeah. mind! -drinks when you brush your glass on them. +drinks when you brush your glass on them. well i, didn't you do that mum? i couldn't understand what? well they can be tipped back in the tin then can't they? mhm. mash that in and you can have butter on if you wanted to. -no roast potatoes will be fine. +no roast potatoes will be fine. yeah. wha they can throw dinner on this. @@ -55194,26 +55144,26 @@ in about quarter to six or something isn't he? quarter past five. quarter past five? yeah. -down the site bloody thing! +down the site bloody thing! i'm gonna cut a load and go pick david up i suppose innit? mm? ta,. oh no! no! -i want my mug. +i want my mug. alright? -you're afterwards aren't you then? +you're afterwards aren't you then? they me , they're doing a good job! well so have you then! no. -don't forget at quarter past five. +don't forget at quarter past five. no, mum said quarter to six! i'm just correcting her! right then. ! that's right. ha? -so i erm what did you say neil? +so i erm what did you say neil? i say, not in there neil. what's what? what's for what? @@ -55240,7 +55190,7 @@ why, what's the matter with it then? you go to light it. see, just keep going so the flint's gone. oh! -that's gone home now. +that's gone home now. here are mate, let's have a look at it. . still, bit cheap to buy ain't they? @@ -55270,15 +55220,15 @@ well i'm glad anybody has a bit of . do you want a cup of tea neil? well i dunno. right! -erm i'm going to the bank let's wake this lot up! +erm i'm going to the bank let's wake this lot up! where do you go for that, bath travel for that then neil? where? for that brochure. bath travel, where's that? -no, where do you get the thing from then? +no, where do you get the thing from then? what? butlins? -well i got it from that travel agents +well i got it from that travel agents oh! er the one in the precinct? @@ -55286,7 +55236,7 @@ by, yeah, by boots. oh yeah. do you want take that. -put it put it in that one. +put it put it in that one. ooh! i dunno what we're talking about here! eh? @@ -55296,8 +55246,8 @@ yes please. right. i've got some. do you mind! -your dad's -well she used to come in erm may to december didn't she? +your dad's +well she used to come in erm may to december didn't she? mm. chip butty then? eh? @@ -55311,11 +55261,11 @@ they don't have meat in do they? i don't think joanne's done so well in bar now. why? just so they can have a day off or something. -one of the girls have got bronchitis so +one of the girls have got bronchitis so mm. is she going in the car? no, she's going by train. -cheaper than the car by the time you've paid petrol there and back again. +cheaper than the car by the time you've paid petrol there and back again. what are you watching . why? just wondered. @@ -55324,11 +55274,11 @@ six thirty. i thought you'd already . otherwise i'll walk home, i've done it before. no. -there's round that all out there later on then? +there's round that all out there later on then? i should put a tape no, by pass brian. -go and see the if you wanted them. +go and see the if you wanted them. well i can for two hours mum. mm? what? @@ -55338,13 +55288,13 @@ your cheap then ain't you? very nice! no, five pound an hour. oh. -and whatever time i'll +and whatever time i'll yeah , why not! would you rather have a cup of tea? -tell you what i'll charge you qui , twenty quid for the whole day. +tell you what i'll charge you qui , twenty quid for the whole day. what? twenty quid for the whole day. -oh well emma only charged that to do the lounge! +oh well emma only charged that to do the lounge! i know. and that was wallpapering that was! i know, i'm gonna paper. @@ -55364,10 +55314,10 @@ out there. yours and dad's over here. finished in there. do you want this do you, anywhere? -er stick that up there. +er stick that up there. i expect the oven's turned off. i can hang on. -no, but i expect it's too hot in there crack the dishes. +no, but i expect it's too hot in there crack the dishes. it's alright. jesus christ! what? @@ -55377,7 +55327,7 @@ neil phoned me. i don't care! hopefully i -so first, so don't give me that! +so first, so don't give me that! and neil did cos he was on when you was out there. no he didn't! yes he did! @@ -55386,12 +55336,12 @@ where are you going to football tomorrow night? why, do you wanna come? with dad and with dave the butcher. is there enough room for me in the back, and neil? -cos i'm not going to reading tomorrow so i'm, i might as well go to football tomorrow instead use that +cos i'm not going to reading tomorrow so i'm, i might as well go to football tomorrow instead use that oh yeah. money. -erm ? +erm ? yeah. -well he's a bit scared though and we assured him there's no violence and +well he's a bit scared though and we assured him there's no violence and ha! what's that lovey? joanne and @@ -55403,19 +55353,19 @@ yeah. is there enough room for me to go? of course there is! what about neil as well? -er yes! +er yes! okay. -i was gonna go to reading but erm sally-ann can't make it cos there's someone ill at work. -so erm the money that i was gonna you know, use for that i'll use for the ticket. +i was gonna go to reading but erm sally-ann can't make it cos there's someone ill at work. +so erm the money that i was gonna you know, use for that i'll use for the ticket. yeah, but you're going off early though, what time's neil finish work then? well no, neil said quarter six we were going. -but i mean, he can, he's at king's anyway tomorrow so it won't take him long to get home. +but i mean, he can, he's at king's anyway tomorrow so it won't take him long to get home. well you can pick him up on the way then couldn't you? yeah, what time does he finish work then jo? -well about five-ish, but i mean he'll be ready for quarter to six +well about five-ish, but i mean he'll be ready for quarter to six er or whatever time you need to go. -well i if you if he takes some old clothes with him love +well i if you if he takes some old clothes with him love mm. and then see we , he'd probably wanna get home and then get changed properly. have something to eat quick. @@ -55436,12 +55386,12 @@ okay then. mm. cos yes, something down there's gonna be pretty dear innit? yeah well they got -what they, what we got i tell you. +what they, what we got i tell you. is there? yeah. we'll take your flask. what about tickets? -we gonna have to get tickets when we get there? +we gonna have to get tickets when we get there? no. how will , how will i know then? , yeah. @@ -55450,15 +55400,15 @@ okay. great! alright then? great! -they will have to pay innit? +they will have to pay innit? it's too late! just as well you ain't coming! eh? i dunno, might sneak in the boot yet mate! well, the back's on the ground straight away! have to get your dad to get a ro , roof rack and put it on there. -a big belly -michelin michelin woman! +a big belly +michelin michelin woman! alright? cheers mum! oh joanne don't want any does she? @@ -55491,14 +55441,14 @@ it was tough. is that right? now perfect they'll be they will be. -not this is the go , like my sister alma +not this is the go , like my sister alma mm. -when we used live at we lived down nissen huts right? +when we used live at we lived down nissen huts right? why on earth, cor ! jackanory! stories, doesn't it? no, no, no! -anyway i wish you met erm you know your mum's +anyway i wish you met erm you know your mum's you know more than me! has she gone out then? yeah! @@ -55512,15 +55462,15 @@ oh has she? i don't where she got them and i didn't ask ! but anyway well she bo must of bought it. -you know that band , yeah well, we used to have one come from the down, he used to tap onto the erm tried to get off and everybody stuck to it. +you know that band , yeah well, we used to have one come from the down, he used to tap onto the erm tried to get off and everybody stuck to it. stuck to it, yeah. yeah. these people, aren't they brave? -was it down there? +was it down there? no. no,. . -er, and went on the you know la la la like this +er, and went on the you know la la la like this like, what like? that's alright. oh but @@ -55529,15 +55479,15 @@ no. yet? now you just gotta juggle which one it is. still on nig. -that's a new one cos there's not much +that's a new one cos there's not much is that the ones out the front is it? -yeah, they +yeah, they bits or something. that's right the best one's out there. -that in there? +that in there? i thought, yeah. yeah. -so we got another one of those right back? +so we got another one of those right back? at the back, yeah. ah, ah ah ah . will try and get the screwdriver. @@ -55549,9 +55499,9 @@ oh. i've gotta shove it down. well i think you want to . so now you want a bulb to go in there now. -well i suppose . -what i'd do, as long as you actually ha for instance and light er -a light, yeah that's right. +well i suppose . +what i'd do, as long as you actually ha for instance and light er +a light, yeah that's right. in the kitchen area. what's that? good heavens! @@ -55559,7 +55509,7 @@ oh yes, cos erm it's a bit dark mum! yeah it is a sixty, you see it on the top don't you? it is. -i was gonna put it in that there but it's too bright so do you get any potatoes? +i was gonna put it in that there but it's too bright so do you get any potatoes? ooh yes! it were how much? @@ -55571,7 +55521,7 @@ no. just old ones. on the market don't she? try selling them cheaper. -you ain't got a water in there nig? +you ain't got a water in there nig? don't get a lot of water there. maybe i'll get little bits, i dunno. well i want to clear that room really .. @@ -55584,10 +55534,10 @@ yeah, i'll to , try and get your tools. oh they're handy ain't they? no. oh. -suppose you can't interfere with the weather there +suppose you can't interfere with the weather there i'll get your porch light. in the attic. -yeah, but i know you wouldn't pay, pay for +yeah, but i know you wouldn't pay, pay for well we got no pocket there. still not long enough. this is not long enough. @@ -55596,7 +55546,7 @@ so we're getting there. oh yeah. where's all my screwdrivers gone. i don't know!! -over them +over them dunno mate. it's on the little table. where? @@ -55607,12 +55557,12 @@ shall look alright . yeah! spend more time out there than they will out here! aha, they're joking ain't they ! -did you want any peas or anything with that? +did you want any peas or anything with that? no, no, no. that's you sure? okay. -are these, are these and er ? +are these, are these and er ? just like crisps. nice. start what ? @@ -55625,10 +55575,10 @@ don't worry i'll walk home. oh yes, gillian! yeah! thursday night, yes. -yeah, we're not i'm not in tomorrow night. +yeah, we're not i'm not in tomorrow night. yes, yeah. that's right, yeah. -i sa yes, no not i won't finish, i in the meanti , i told brian so he he most likely ringing li er lynn. +i sa yes, no not i won't finish, i in the meanti , i told brian so he he most likely ringing li er lynn. thank you. yeah. steve. @@ -55639,8 +55589,8 @@ yep! here you go . that's alright. no, that's alright. -at half past eight, i'll okey-dokey. -okay love it's yeah what he no,wha what the trouble is we got erm one o one our chap's retired and erm i'm gonna go there for the , just ask him for it, just to say, you know have a, have a quick dri , now if you're popping over to . +at half past eight, i'll okey-dokey. +okay love it's yeah what he no,wha what the trouble is we got erm one o one our chap's retired and erm i'm gonna go there for the , just ask him for it, just to say, you know have a, have a quick dri , now if you're popping over to . alright poppet. okay, okay love. yeah, see yo , see you soon then. @@ -55654,7 +55604,7 @@ so what you doing? playing thursday instead of wednesday? no. oh! -this is the for dad. +this is the for dad. oh i see. take, those two there's. anything else? @@ -55689,12 +55639,12 @@ i've got to set the video again. what happened? sorry! well what did you pull out? -that's up is that it looks that way . +that's up is that it looks that way . . -but that's not like, that does fit somewhere. +but that's not like, that does fit somewhere. what? i know, but it's switched and it's still working? -no, that off your hand there nigel. +no, that off your hand there nigel. oh no! set each side. yes. @@ -55705,7 +55655,7 @@ i dunno do i? i don't know. that's the . it's alright there now. -. do you want, do you want er . +. do you want, do you want er . the eh? oh well! @@ -55718,7 +55668,7 @@ well you're gonna, gonna use it a lot anyway. no, you're not, i am! take one if we do of raffles and go out and pose! -well it's pretty good innit? +well it's pretty good innit? that's good that! yeah, it's good. eh? @@ -55727,8 +55677,8 @@ what was that again? that was . still it ain't bad. no, oh god ! -have you then nigel ? -but, yeah eight. +have you then nigel ? +but, yeah eight. oh what's on that er don't worry about that. don't worry, i know what it is! @@ -55736,10 +55686,10 @@ don't worry, i know what it is! i just don't know how you can finish that title now. no i ain't done nothing! oh which is ? -it's twenty one thirty nine. +it's twenty one thirty nine. that's alright then. but that's not actually . -sorry, shall i switch it off? +sorry, shall i switch it off? no. that lady was in the kray brothers. yeah. @@ -55749,11 +55699,11 @@ adrian , what a name! well i'll wash up the . no, leave it there. leave it there for a couple of days . -well you put them, i mean he didn't he? +well you put them, i mean he didn't he? he did. and he come out of here, out of nick. -yeah, i picked all the yeah. -you're going to shaun's club tomorrow +yeah, i picked all the yeah. +you're going to shaun's club tomorrow eh? night. you what? @@ -55767,13 +55717,13 @@ enough people there to have a bundle! they thought they'd have the mexican wave when someone go get, get up and go to the loo! a load of . yeah, which are you? -you should of got in a bunch of ! -yeah well you shouldn't have hey? +you should of got in a bunch of ! +yeah well you shouldn't have hey? no. -he said on the old shillings i want neil's bed but it weren't that cos he's bit of a fun to, you know , you know +he said on the old shillings i want neil's bed but it weren't that cos he's bit of a fun to, you know , you know oh yeah. and he's got all , don't think nothing of getting to any trouble with it, you know. -he can say he got up now, waiting for the loos so he thought he it was a mexican wave ! +he can say he got up now, waiting for the loos so he thought he it was a mexican wave ! what? ha! for murder. @@ -55784,15 +55734,15 @@ switched to . no. blowing out ! i'm gonna have a . -did you hear what say, get on alright with the toast? +did you hear what say, get on alright with the toast? the law can't win! eh? i ain't . perhaps it's the bulb is it love? no. -it's er something . +it's er something . got a light? -where's the out of nigel's there. +where's the out of nigel's there. oh, is he? what was it then, a fuse? oh! @@ -55806,7 +55756,7 @@ yeah. go outside anyway. so what have we got here? it's not that one. -it's on here now. +it's on here now. you tested it? no, i didn't test it, now power. it was like this. @@ -55825,9 +55775,9 @@ is this a true story, yeah? yeah. this is true story. well it's not a story. -some of it was on about that man there, face got her to stay the night then he was gonna watch it on telly in the er lounge. +some of it was on about that man there, face got her to stay the night then he was gonna watch it on telly in the er lounge. maureen's late isn't she? -makes you worry about their don't it? +makes you worry about their don't it? yeah. how did nick get on at darts last night then? he won. @@ -55836,7 +55786,7 @@ who was they playing against then? viking who? viking -and er +and er oh yeah! we're up the club. club. @@ -55853,12 +55803,12 @@ that's true enough. can i try the torch out then? well i don't know. doesn't show a reaction. -that's right it's . -are those wires connected to tho those erm +that's right it's . +are those wires connected to tho those erm no. just like the dagmar how long ago was this happened? -about eighty nine. +about eighty nine. oh yeah. they found that horse didn't they? gone missing. @@ -55866,7 +55816,7 @@ oh yeah. what horse? erm shergar. -no it's the name of a horse it, it's about to give a foal or something and erm somebody took it and they found in the new forest. +no it's the name of a horse it, it's about to give a foal or something and erm somebody took it and they found in the new forest. oh yeah. quite a good place for you know. yeah. @@ -55881,9 +55831,9 @@ no i haven't watched it! oh! what, i don't think they look much like you alright? -but i'm gonna mess about. +but i'm gonna mess about. did you watch ? -no, it's a so +no, it's a so course you can't focus on on us it's taping the programme innit? yeah. well can't you just use that then nigel? @@ -55892,25 +55842,25 @@ just a minute! no,. i'll sta , i'll stay in here right? in here. -well no it won't. +well no it won't. yes please. it's on his coat now. -what do you reckon to these erm, these then nigel? +what do you reckon to these erm, these then nigel? ha? what do you reckon these ? dunno. -have a look at the back. +have a look at the back. how can you, how can you trace it back to the owners? -take it all out start again. +take it all out start again. take that little bit of wire out down there. what little bit of wire? these bits. no, no, cos i just said are you getting on with it nigel, that's all look. -it's , take that right. +it's , take that right. what do you reckon to those? which one's that then? ah . -tell you what i'll do i'll tape it on the e end of that er total recall. +tell you what i'll do i'll tape it on the e end of that er total recall. eh? will you get on that ma , has it got a long play ? probably. @@ -55927,12 +55877,12 @@ that's all! no, i don't know! that don't seem very bright does it? that's better -hello, oh tavari what time is it mate? +hello, oh tavari what time is it mate? nineteen, twenty past, kick off alright you don't have to make an issue out of it you gonna use the tape up to there are you? yeah you don't have to -no, that's er, that's first prize that's, that's how much you win, ah? +no, that's er, that's first prize that's, that's how much you win, ah? twenty past no, it even says in here, it says look, there well may be groups of supporters in different categories who'd like to arrange seats together, unfortunately not be able to do this unless you are prepared to wait until the end of the main selling period alright @@ -55943,12 +55893,12 @@ oh about time to boo, who's he? come on, come on you want a chew? -take one of these they'll make you feel better oh no don't this is +take one of these they'll make you feel better oh no don't this is just say no yeah or give us here a bloody mint ah? -just got him to give me a mint gasping for it +just got him to give me a mint gasping for it i was saying to this bloke at work west ham must be the only positive transfer to give west ham pay for about the last twenty five years laughing up their sleeves, can't even bloody sell anything, but sell them at a profit. who will they sell? @@ -55963,22 +55913,22 @@ yeah i know but do what? boo hooray, come on -come on come on you reds -if they got, if they're not gonna win tonight, if they don't beat bolton i'm gonna tear my season ticket up look ah +come on come on you reds +if they got, if they're not gonna win tonight, if they don't beat bolton i'm gonna tear my season ticket up look ah you're not even a season holder are you? -next year i will be next year i will be, they should win tonight, i hope so +next year i will be next year i will be, they should win tonight, i hope so yeah, yeah they were also saying about how good he is when they were interviewing yeah that's right, yeah -come on you reds, come on you reds +come on you reds, come on you reds mind you as if no i never saw him playing no come on you reds -go on oh crikey in the first minute, bloody hell,come on then -come on you reds +go on oh crikey in the first minute, bloody hell,come on then +come on you reds go on go on jason -jason go on +jason go on yeah no it's what? @@ -55988,77 +55938,77 @@ yeah alright oh dear well play, come on then -come on you reds, come on you reds, come on you reds -that's yours david come on now good throw that goes to waste +come on you reds, come on you reds, come on you reds +that's yours david come on now good throw that goes to waste i just laugh don't miss it, what a miss ah? -it's alright come on +it's alright come on that's where those yeah yeah you go -cor jesus christ no fag ash is on again -i'm not opposed to links when they're relevant, i've in fact argued and encouraged them and defended them where they've taken place and i believe that they were important but i don't believe in them taking place where they're irrelevant and er where they er are unhelpful. +cor jesus christ no fag ash is on again +i'm not opposed to links when they're relevant, i've in fact argued and encouraged them and defended them where they've taken place and i believe that they were important but i don't believe in them taking place where they're irrelevant and er where they er are unhelpful. cornwall has one of the worst black spots in the country for unemployment, poverty and further economic difficulties, has one of the lowest gross domestic products in europe. -the central statistical office er show regional g t p figures for cornwall in nineteen ninety one that put cornwall so badly off er that our g d p is in fact just er seventy three percent of the national average, whilst devon's figures are eighty seven percent and i might add in terms of the different progress of the two, in nineteen eighty nine cornwall's g d p was seventy five point six percent so it's actually fallen back whereas plymouth's was eighty five point five percent and you've actually seen it grow. +the central statistical office er show regional g t p figures for cornwall in nineteen ninety one that put cornwall so badly off er that our g d p is in fact just er seventy three percent of the national average, whilst devon's figures are eighty seven percent and i might add in terms of the different progress of the two, in nineteen eighty nine cornwall's g d p was seventy five point six percent so it's actually fallen back whereas plymouth's was eighty five point five percent and you've actually seen it grow. so we've actually been moving in opposite directions er in the er in the two areas. the economic performance of the two are divergent, they have a different set of problems and the linking of part of plymouth with cornwall creates a wholly artificial unit unrelated to geographical, social or economic reality. -indeed the creation of a split in the city of plymouth itself, makes that divide even more stark because it's even more clearly not in the interests of plymouth, as plymouth city council have been keen er to point out. -the plymouth interest, that final point, is i believe as clear as cornwall's and the natural links in south devon would provide the basis for a seat in which it could be better represented. +indeed the creation of a split in the city of plymouth itself, makes that divide even more stark because it's even more clearly not in the interests of plymouth, as plymouth city council have been keen er to point out. +the plymouth interest, that final point, is i believe as clear as cornwall's and the natural links in south devon would provide the basis for a seat in which it could be better represented. cornwall needs a voice of its own, to argue its case for regional funding, to improve infrastructure, to reduce unemployment and to encourage industry. funds need to be directed at improving cornish roads, communications and rail links. -the liberal democrats are opposed to the basis of this review at national level we believe an opportunity has been missed or perhaps i should say ducked for the common, fair electoral system for which this country is supposedly a signatory. +the liberal democrats are opposed to the basis of this review at national level we believe an opportunity has been missed or perhaps i should say ducked for the common, fair electoral system for which this country is supposedly a signatory. but if the chance for a fair electoral system is lost at least we should have played to what strength there is in a single member system and properly recognised the individual communities of the u k. that chance has been missed without review and on that grounds i don't believe this review should go through. richard shepherd. -thank you sir erm in that the government and the opposition front bench want to move this measure erm fulfilling their commitments to the maastricht treaty, i accept the methodology and the precedent that the government cites, i think that's appropriate, erm i just wanted to very briefly say that this is of course a vote no longer like the generality of the population voting for the membership of a golf club in which we have varying degrees of er interest. -we are now trying to affirm citizenship through the vote and therefore the nature in which we distribute these seats and the affirmation that we give through the vote will not relate in fact to any of the sentiments i believe as pronounced by the opposition front bench. -both the liberal democrats spokesman and the opposition front bench ally themselves to an out of reach of er lunacy that is not shared by the generality of the population outside. +thank you sir erm in that the government and the opposition front bench want to move this measure erm fulfilling their commitments to the maastricht treaty, i accept the methodology and the precedent that the government cites, i think that's appropriate, erm i just wanted to very briefly say that this is of course a vote no longer like the generality of the population voting for the membership of a golf club in which we have varying degrees of er interest. +we are now trying to affirm citizenship through the vote and therefore the nature in which we distribute these seats and the affirmation that we give through the vote will not relate in fact to any of the sentiments i believe as pronounced by the opposition front bench. +both the liberal democrats spokesman and the opposition front bench ally themselves to an out of reach of er lunacy that is not shared by the generality of the population outside. i understand sir that at the last erm election european matters only thirty one percent of the population could find their ways to voting stations. that may be of course because they were denied the liberal democrats panacea for everything namely erm proportional representation. there is profound and deep argument of course that that is no more representative or true of democracy than a single member constituency. it is a legitimate debate and of course the parroting of it as the only way forward is inappropriate to serious people trying to discuss that. one understands the route as to why the erm liberal democrats wish to pursue that. one cannot understand the route why that's so that the labour party wishes erm to advantage that. -but what i am saying in context, no this has a deal to do with the co boundaries, as you know erm the honourable member well knows, the essence of this this is wholly inappropriate in terms of erm trying to latest citizenship through an arrangement of six additional boundaries into a erm union and a political state and i think that that is the profound objection that this side of the house has expressed over a long period of time now, is a reflection of the public mood in the country in respect of this election and the way the boundaries er are are erm apportioned and all i say in conclusion is that this is an evidence further of the irrelevance of this house in reflecting and attesting to public opinion outside. -well mr er deputy speaker i er don't wish to er follow the honourable member of one of my er neighbours but i actually think it's really part of grown up politics to ensure that the political opinion of a nation is adequately represented in the forums of that nation whether it be in this place or in the european er parliament and to that extent i make no bones about it that erm i wish that we were debating a different electoral system and mr deputy speaker going back to the minister's introduction erm it is a fact, i didn't wish to intervene because i didn't, it's a short debate and i didn't want to take up er extra time, but it is a fact is it not that our electoral system unique across europe means that our deadline as opposed to what the french are going to do is different to all the other member states. +but what i am saying in context, no this has a deal to do with the co boundaries, as you know erm the honourable member well knows, the essence of this this is wholly inappropriate in terms of erm trying to latest citizenship through an arrangement of six additional boundaries into a erm union and a political state and i think that that is the profound objection that this side of the house has expressed over a long period of time now, is a reflection of the public mood in the country in respect of this election and the way the boundaries er are are erm apportioned and all i say in conclusion is that this is an evidence further of the irrelevance of this house in reflecting and attesting to public opinion outside. +well mr er deputy speaker i er don't wish to er follow the honourable member of one of my er neighbours but i actually think it's really part of grown up politics to ensure that the political opinion of a nation is adequately represented in the forums of that nation whether it be in this place or in the european er parliament and to that extent i make no bones about it that erm i wish that we were debating a different electoral system and mr deputy speaker going back to the minister's introduction erm it is a fact, i didn't wish to intervene because i didn't, it's a short debate and i didn't want to take up er extra time, but it is a fact is it not that our electoral system unique across europe means that our deadline as opposed to what the french are going to do is different to all the other member states. see all the other member states of er european er community mr deputy speaker,use proportional representation either on national lists or on large regional lists. -it is very easy if you like the day before literally as the minister said, the day before for them to make their change as to where the cut off point comes. +it is very easy if you like the day before literally as the minister said, the day before for them to make their change as to where the cut off point comes. it doesn't affect the value of anybody's vote in those countries at all. -that cannot be the case in a single member constituency arrangement. -it will have to be for us at least twenty one days, that's the absolute rock bottom minimum i would have thought therefore the french i suspect have us over a barrel and we would have to cough up for the enormous expenditure of an extra building at strasbourg which is not needed erm as i understand it er that er view i savoured i don't erm have the details of that. -but mr deputy speaker i sincerely hope these are the last erm boundary changes we have to debate. +that cannot be the case in a single member constituency arrangement. +it will have to be for us at least twenty one days, that's the absolute rock bottom minimum i would have thought therefore the french i suspect have us over a barrel and we would have to cough up for the enormous expenditure of an extra building at strasbourg which is not needed erm as i understand it er that er view i savoured i don't erm have the details of that. +but mr deputy speaker i sincerely hope these are the last erm boundary changes we have to debate. i mean it has been referred to that we might have to do them again, i sincerely hope we don't have to go through this process again. -in fact i suspect on june the ninth even the wipe out of the conservative party in the european elections may make even those members that side think that in order to say their own skins in the future they will actually have to start to think about a fairer electoral system and indeed there will be a unified system on the way forced by europe on this house if we do not take it upon ourselves to do so and it will be our own fault that we've shirked our responsibilities in my view to actually take it on board. -as my honourable friend said from the front bench, the labour party is absolutely firmly committed now both by the voices of the leadership and the votes and the resolutions at our party conference that we are in favour of a proportional representation system for the european parliament and i hope that when the elections come mr deputy speaker, and people will be arguing about why they're voting for europe on june the ninth in one boundary as opposed to another and why they've got erm erm different rules for this election of course as indeed for the last european election because the registration will be different, allowing all kinds of erm how can i put it foreigners in inverted commas, to vote in our elections in this country because it is the european elections that we will actually put the point across that er for the future there will be different arrangements made indeed. -the second point i want to er make mr deputy speaker wholly relating to this erm er clutch of er orders of which er eighteen plus the er the schedule which the minister didn't have time to go through in great detail, is the thrust of why i put the amendment down erm in fact that this order should not be er erm approved indeed until the citizens of gibraltar have been and able to be represented in the european parliament. -now i know that's not selected and i don't make any complaint about that erm far from it er i would not complain ever against the chair but i did introduce erm well i don't and i wouldn't but i erm introduced the erm first reading of a bill on this matter yesterday. -m mr deputy speaker, you will have seen if you read these er orders in front of us today running to at least er i reckon about ten thousand words, but by and large, all and sundry are going to be bote, er going to be out of vote on june the ninth, citizens of the european union and the minister has actually said on one or two occasions, all citizens of the union, well it is not true that all citizens of the union will be able to vote on er june the ninth. -i'll grantcha if you're a citizen of the union living in south america, the west indies or the pacific and you happen to be a member of the french colonies, you'll have a vote in the european parliament in the elections. -but if you happen to be a citizen of the union a citizen of the european union, a member of the only mainland european colony belonging to this country namely gibraltar, you don't have a vote. -now i don't think that's right, fair or democratic and if we've shied away from it for years handling this issue and now we're in the position where this house has total responsibility for the thirty thousand citizens in total of gibralt it's not the electorate, the total population, thirty thousand and we continued to deny them vote yet they are citizens of the european union under our own legislation and accepted as such by the european parliament and it is wholly wrong mr deputy speaker that the boundaries that we're discussing in this bill were not drawn so that and it could easily have been done,that we could have incorporated the twenty odd thousand european union citizens of gibraltar who do wish to be part of spain and won't be for fifty years or more until it's been a democracy that long, but to give them the right to vote. +in fact i suspect on june the ninth even the wipe out of the conservative party in the european elections may make even those members that side think that in order to say their own skins in the future they will actually have to start to think about a fairer electoral system and indeed there will be a unified system on the way forced by europe on this house if we do not take it upon ourselves to do so and it will be our own fault that we've shirked our responsibilities in my view to actually take it on board. +as my honourable friend said from the front bench, the labour party is absolutely firmly committed now both by the voices of the leadership and the votes and the resolutions at our party conference that we are in favour of a proportional representation system for the european parliament and i hope that when the elections come mr deputy speaker, and people will be arguing about why they're voting for europe on june the ninth in one boundary as opposed to another and why they've got erm erm different rules for this election of course as indeed for the last european election because the registration will be different, allowing all kinds of erm how can i put it foreigners in inverted commas, to vote in our elections in this country because it is the european elections that we will actually put the point across that er for the future there will be different arrangements made indeed. +the second point i want to er make mr deputy speaker wholly relating to this erm er clutch of er orders of which er eighteen plus the er the schedule which the minister didn't have time to go through in great detail, is the thrust of why i put the amendment down erm in fact that this order should not be er erm approved indeed until the citizens of gibraltar have been and able to be represented in the european parliament. +now i know that's not selected and i don't make any complaint about that erm far from it er i would not complain ever against the chair but i did introduce erm well i don't and i wouldn't but i erm introduced the erm first reading of a bill on this matter yesterday. +m mr deputy speaker, you will have seen if you read these er orders in front of us today running to at least er i reckon about ten thousand words, but by and large, all and sundry are going to be bote, er going to be out of vote on june the ninth, citizens of the european union and the minister has actually said on one or two occasions, all citizens of the union, well it is not true that all citizens of the union will be able to vote on er june the ninth. +i'll grantcha if you're a citizen of the union living in south america, the west indies or the pacific and you happen to be a member of the french colonies, you'll have a vote in the european parliament in the elections. +but if you happen to be a citizen of the union a citizen of the european union, a member of the only mainland european colony belonging to this country namely gibraltar, you don't have a vote. +now i don't think that's right, fair or democratic and if we've shied away from it for years handling this issue and now we're in the position where this house has total responsibility for the thirty thousand citizens in total of gibralt it's not the electorate, the total population, thirty thousand and we continued to deny them vote yet they are citizens of the european union under our own legislation and accepted as such by the european parliament and it is wholly wrong mr deputy speaker that the boundaries that we're discussing in this bill were not drawn so that and it could easily have been done,that we could have incorporated the twenty odd thousand european union citizens of gibraltar who do wish to be part of spain and won't be for fifty years or more until it's been a democracy that long, but to give them the right to vote. to give them the right to vote by absorbing them into one of the english constituencies and it could have easily been done. -i accept completely what the honourable member for erm truro truro actually said in his speech just er that he just made, absolutely right that the cultural and the geographical identity of people matters so far as the european parliament is concerned and in respect of our responsibility, the responsibility of this house to citizens of gibraltar. -it's wrong, mr deputy speaker, if they're living in this country erm on a semi-permanent basis and happen to have been here last october they'll have a vote so will any everybody else who's a citizen of the european union, so will peers of the realm who happen to be living elsewhere whether they're in this country or outside this country under these regulations and previous regulations, have a vote in the european elections and i think it's wholly wrong that erm citizens of other european countries namely france because that's the one and it's remarkable is it not that france is the one that's gonna be the cause of this whole edifice collapsing if we don't submit to their extra demands but citizens of france who are citizens living in their colonies, as i've said in south america, the west indies and the pacific, will have a vote in the european elections on june the ninth and yet we have got citizens for whom we are responsible for in this house, we cannot shirk it onto anyone else, we deny them the responsibility and i think it's about time the house addressed this matter. +i accept completely what the honourable member for erm truro truro actually said in his speech just er that he just made, absolutely right that the cultural and the geographical identity of people matters so far as the european parliament is concerned and in respect of our responsibility, the responsibility of this house to citizens of gibraltar. +it's wrong, mr deputy speaker, if they're living in this country erm on a semi-permanent basis and happen to have been here last october they'll have a vote so will any everybody else who's a citizen of the european union, so will peers of the realm who happen to be living elsewhere whether they're in this country or outside this country under these regulations and previous regulations, have a vote in the european elections and i think it's wholly wrong that erm citizens of other european countries namely france because that's the one and it's remarkable is it not that france is the one that's gonna be the cause of this whole edifice collapsing if we don't submit to their extra demands but citizens of france who are citizens living in their colonies, as i've said in south america, the west indies and the pacific, will have a vote in the european elections on june the ninth and yet we have got citizens for whom we are responsible for in this house, we cannot shirk it onto anyone else, we deny them the responsibility and i think it's about time the house addressed this matter. mr teddy taylor. mr deputy speaker. -i just wanted to say three brief things about the boundaries, before doing so i think i may have to declare a personal interest. -i have to tell the house i have in fact put my name forward to be considered as a candidate to stand to stand for conservative +i just wanted to say three brief things about the boundaries, before doing so i think i may have to declare a personal interest. +i have to tell the house i have in fact put my name forward to be considered as a candidate to stand to stand for conservative party in the new constituency of south essex. -it's just possible mr deputy speaker, it's just possible i may not be selected for all kinds of reasons but if i was selected it might at least give the people of that lovely part of the world the chance of having the referendum they never had over maastricht because of the shameful way in which the labour party was not willing to allow the people to have their say on that vital issue. -the three issues i want to put forward to the minister are, number one does this matter? -my honourable friend the member for has rightly said that only thirty one percent of the people bother to vote and so why be bothering with new things at all. -in logic we would say to ourselves because the germans are getting more seats, because east germany is being added to the union, why on earth should britain get more as well and it seems very difficult to explain why we should have extra seats at all. -the other factor we should also bear in mind is the great majority of the people are not only not interested, they're basically hostile the whole business and i think that members may not have really noticed if they looked at the european newspaper, the highest ever figure, fifty three percent of all the people of britain are now totally and completely opposed to the whole business of the e c, they don't think it's a good idea. +it's just possible mr deputy speaker, it's just possible i may not be selected for all kinds of reasons but if i was selected it might at least give the people of that lovely part of the world the chance of having the referendum they never had over maastricht because of the shameful way in which the labour party was not willing to allow the people to have their say on that vital issue. +the three issues i want to put forward to the minister are, number one does this matter? +my honourable friend the member for has rightly said that only thirty one percent of the people bother to vote and so why be bothering with new things at all. +in logic we would say to ourselves because the germans are getting more seats, because east germany is being added to the union, why on earth should britain get more as well and it seems very difficult to explain why we should have extra seats at all. +the other factor we should also bear in mind is the great majority of the people are not only not interested, they're basically hostile the whole business and i think that members may not have really noticed if they looked at the european newspaper, the highest ever figure, fifty three percent of all the people of britain are now totally and completely opposed to the whole business of the e c, they don't think it's a good idea. so why should we have new boundaries. -there is of course a special interest in south essex where the people are concerned that while the government wanted to give aid to south essex because of its unemployment, this was unfortunately stopped by commissioner mr and also of course by commissioner mr milan solely on their decisions and this is a fact that all the papers assisted area status was put forward by the government for south essex. +there is of course a special interest in south essex where the people are concerned that while the government wanted to give aid to south essex because of its unemployment, this was unfortunately stopped by commissioner mr and also of course by commissioner mr milan solely on their decisions and this is a fact that all the papers assisted area status was put forward by the government for south essex. it was also of course, we were put forward for objective two, this was turned down by these two commissioners simply because they sliced off two percent of the application. so there is a special interest of course in south essex. -but the viewpoint i would like to ask the minister, it's a very important one is, can you give us any more assurance about whether this is actually going to happen? +but the viewpoint i would like to ask the minister, it's a very important one is, can you give us any more assurance about whether this is actually going to happen? has he been in touch with the french government? -it's very important indeed that people for example in southend on sea should know where they're going. -if this new regulation comes through they'll be part of a new seat but if in fact they don't have this regulation come into effect they'll belong to another s and when you've had in fact in southend say the lowest recorded percentage voting of any constituency in england at the last euro elections i think it's terrible important we should in fact explain to people whether this is likely to happen. +it's very important indeed that people for example in southend on sea should know where they're going. +if this new regulation comes through they'll be part of a new seat but if in fact they don't have this regulation come into effect they'll belong to another s and when you've had in fact in southend say the lowest recorded percentage voting of any constituency in england at the last euro elections i think it's terrible important we should in fact explain to people whether this is likely to happen. i think that people are getting very concerned indeed over how the french government are basically disrupting so many worthwhile things for silly reasons. -we had the g a t talks held up for a lengthy period simply because the french wanted even more cash for agriculture and of course they got it and it's rather silly when we're spending two hundred and fifty million pounds a week on dumping and destroying food. +we had the g a t talks held up for a lengthy period simply because the french wanted even more cash for agriculture and of course they got it and it's rather silly when we're spending two hundred and fifty million pounds a week on dumping and destroying food. we agreed to give more money to the french for agriculture. but in the case of these boundaries. of course certainly. @@ -56067,31 +56017,31 @@ mr deputy speaker i i wouldn't be in order to go into this but i don't agree at i must insist we get back to the boundaries, i've repeatedly had to do so this afternoon i would have thought it that the message would have got over to me honourable members before now. sir teddy taylor. absolutely right mr deputy speaker and i just wish that members wouldn't raise these irrelevant points. -what i do say to the honourable gentleman is his argument is rubbish, bad for the third world, bad for the people of europe and outside mr deputy speaker i'd be glad to give him his answer although quite rightly to say i can't give it here. -but this particular case mr deputy speaker what we want to know from the minister is on these new boundaries what do we actually have to do? -my understanding is that the european parliament has got so many buildings now including a great new building at brussels built at huge cost, enormous cost and a new building they want to build at strasbourg. +what i do say to the honourable gentleman is his argument is rubbish, bad for the third world, bad for the people of europe and outside mr deputy speaker i'd be glad to give him his answer although quite rightly to say i can't give it here. +but this particular case mr deputy speaker what we want to know from the minister is on these new boundaries what do we actually have to do? +my understanding is that the european parliament has got so many buildings now including a great new building at brussels built at huge cost, enormous cost and a new building they want to build at strasbourg. they're now paying rentals of twenty four million pounds a year. now quite frankly mr deputy speaker, if we want these new constituencies, including south essex, it seems we're going to have to say to the french they can have lots and lots of money to build lots and lots of new buildings for this rather ridiculous parliament and quite honestly mr deputy speaker, members tonight in voting on the new boundaries will really have to decide what we want to do. -are we simply to chuck out these extra six constituencies and say no to the french, we're not going to agree to extra silly expenditure or are we in fact going to cave in as we've done so often. +are we simply to chuck out these extra six constituencies and say no to the french, we're not going to agree to extra silly expenditure or are we in fact going to cave in as we've done so often. i think members should bear in mind the costs of caving in to french blackmail. we did it over g a t at great expense to the people of this country and of europe, great damage to the third world. -it seems if we agree to these new constituents coming through, we'll only do it by having additional buildings which are utterly wasteful and quite honestly mr deputy speaker, i think you'll your constituents a very distressed indeed about the waste, the fraud and the mismanagement of the e c, of course sir. +it seems if we agree to these new constituents coming through, we'll only do it by having additional buildings which are utterly wasteful and quite honestly mr deputy speaker, i think you'll your constituents a very distressed indeed about the waste, the fraud and the mismanagement of the e c, of course sir. i'm most grateful to the honourable gentleman er of course these buildings are all related to the orders were discussing in order that m e ps can be elected in the first place and is it not interesting to note that if agreement can't be reached as indeed is the position of the moment er in u what is called the european union over where actually the parliament is going to sit. one would have thought the agreement could be reached easily on that matter. what on earth is the possibility of reaching agreement on much more substantial matters? -a aren't we supposed to believe this european union is won, that it's all unanimous on the rest of it, there doesn't seem to be much evidence of that, even when it comes to where the m e ps should actually sit. -how right you are mr deputy speaker, of course i couldn't go into this because it's out of order but on the other hand i would simply say to the honourable gentleman if he looks at the basic policies, the basic flaw of the e c is it can't solve problems and all these new m e ps we're thinking of sending over i think we should bear in mind the problem, they're going over to something where problems can't be solved. -the ideal example of course the c a p, we've had reform after reform but nothing happens. +a aren't we supposed to believe this european union is won, that it's all unanimous on the rest of it, there doesn't seem to be much evidence of that, even when it comes to where the m e ps should actually sit. +how right you are mr deputy speaker, of course i couldn't go into this because it's out of order but on the other hand i would simply say to the honourable gentleman if he looks at the basic policies, the basic flaw of the e c is it can't solve problems and all these new m e ps we're thinking of sending over i think we should bear in mind the problem, they're going over to something where problems can't be solved. +the ideal example of course the c a p, we've had reform after reform but nothing happens. the final point mr deputy speaker and of course the honourable gentleman knows this is absolutely right, expenditure at an all time high, mountains at an all time high and also of course the gap between consumer prices and world prices the highest ever recorded. as the secretary of state for foreign affairs said to me, twenty eight pounds a week extra per family, including the honourable gentleman's constituents . really it's er testing my patience now i'm afraid. -i must insist the honour honourable gentleman and interventions too should be in accordance with the with the debate and wi o o on the boundaries, so teddy taylor. -mr deputy speaker how right you are mr deputy speaker, i've been trying very hard methodically to stick these regulations, unfortunately when you get members ask you direct questions if one doesn't get any kind of answer it gives the impression you're ignoring them. +i must insist the honour honourable gentleman and interventions too should be in accordance with the with the debate and wi o o on the boundaries, so teddy taylor. +mr deputy speaker how right you are mr deputy speaker, i've been trying very hard methodically to stick these regulations, unfortunately when you get members ask you direct questions if one doesn't get any kind of answer it gives the impression you're ignoring them. what i can say to the honourable gentleman who i know always attends these european debates with great regularity, i'll be only too glad to speak to him outside as well as the honourable gentleman to try and clarify these matters. -the final point i want to make mr deputy speaker which i think is very, very important indeed, bearing in mind that fact that so few people bothered to vote in these is is there any possibility that before these regulations come into effect we can have at the same time, a little pamphlet put out saying exactly what these additional m e ps and the existing ones actually can do. +the final point i want to make mr deputy speaker which i think is very, very important indeed, bearing in mind that fact that so few people bothered to vote in these is is there any possibility that before these regulations come into effect we can have at the same time, a little pamphlet put out saying exactly what these additional m e ps and the existing ones actually can do. i think quite honestly in the progress of democracy, people sometimes gain the impression that the european parliament can do things it can't do. i know a lot of people who study it carefully take the view if it closed down tomorrow nobody would notice apart from the taxi drivers in strasbourg. -but the kind of things people write about now will say can we do anything about the export of live cattle? +but the kind of things people write about now will say can we do anything about the export of live cattle? the answer's no. can we stop the euro plug? of course not it's going through majority vote in the european council. @@ -56103,10 +56053,10 @@ sir geoffrey holn . thank you mr deputy speaker. i'm delighted to once again have the opportunity of following the honourable member for southend in a debate about european matters. i wish him well in his er efforts to become a candidate in the forthcoming european elections. -i'm also looking forward to seeing a copy of the election manifesto on which he fights those elections and er er how it will be possible for the conservative party to er put forward a manifesto that he is comfortable with and also a manifest that the honourable member for say old bexley and sidcup is similarly comfortable with but er no doubt that's a matter for the conservative party. +i'm also looking forward to seeing a copy of the election manifesto on which he fights those elections and er er how it will be possible for the conservative party to er put forward a manifesto that he is comfortable with and also a manifest that the honourable member for say old bexley and sidcup is similarly comfortable with but er no doubt that's a matter for the conservative party. the great advantage of having a fixed date er for these european elections on the ninth of june, a date that's been well known for a considerable time now, should be the certainty for the electorate, that they know not only the date of that election but the geographical boundary er of the constituency in which they live er the candidates that they can choose from and of course in relation to european elections, the number of er members of the european parliament that there will be representing the united kingdom. -but even if we agree this order tonight none of those issues will actually be clearly resolved er, there is a temptation and i regret that the honourable member for southend succumbed to this, there's a temptation to blem blame the french and the french government for this present state of uncertainty. -er, but that assertion needs to be examined just a little more closely because the british government are not without blame in relation to this matter, er the issues er affecting these forthcoming elections should have been resolved at the edinburgh summit during the presidency of the british government. +but even if we agree this order tonight none of those issues will actually be clearly resolved er, there is a temptation and i regret that the honourable member for southend succumbed to this, there's a temptation to blem blame the french and the french government for this present state of uncertainty. +er, but that assertion needs to be examined just a little more closely because the british government are not without blame in relation to this matter, er the issues er affecting these forthcoming elections should have been resolved at the edinburgh summit during the presidency of the british government. they should have been resolved in december nineteen ninety two because it was decided at that summit that there would be eighteen extra seats for er the then er united germany. that there would be an extra six seats for france, italy and the united kingdom. but in addition the british government went along with the er demand by the french government that they should recognise strasbourg as a meeting place for the european parliament in perpetuity. @@ -56115,149 +56065,149 @@ john major came back from the edinburgh summit and he told this house that he wa that he was entirely happy with the results of that summit. but in so doing the prime minister overlooked two crucial aspects of what was decided at that summit. firstly he overlooked the fact that the european parliament had consistently voted for brussels as a meeting place. -that the european parliament in fact led by conservative members of the european parliament very often on this issue had argued strongly that brussels should be a single meeting place for the european parliament. -there are members of the european parliament who s s support strasbourg as a meeting place clearly, but the majority do not, the majority want to meet in a single city and in so doing the majority have accepted that there should be a new european parliament building in brussels and that european parliament building now operates. +that the european parliament in fact led by conservative members of the european parliament very often on this issue had argued strongly that brussels should be a single meeting place for the european parliament. +there are members of the european parliament who s s support strasbourg as a meeting place clearly, but the majority do not, the majority want to meet in a single city and in so doing the majority have accepted that there should be a new european parliament building in brussels and that european parliament building now operates. it operates however on a very limited basis in the course of nineteen ninety four it's likely that there will only be eight half day meetings of the full european parliament in brussels. -so the second factor that the prime minister overlooked is that the existing chamber in strasbourg is simply not large enough to accommodate the extra numbers of euro mps who will be elected to the european parliament, not so much as a result of the edinburgh agreement, but in fact as a result of the er enlargement that is in prospect. -again something that the government have strongly supported. +so the second factor that the prime minister overlooked is that the existing chamber in strasbourg is simply not large enough to accommodate the extra numbers of euro mps who will be elected to the european parliament, not so much as a result of the edinburgh agreement, but in fact as a result of the er enlargement that is in prospect. +again something that the government have strongly supported. now, given that the government's support of the idea of strasbourg as being a permanent place of meeting for the european parliament. -it's proper that we should be asking in the context of these proposals for boundary changes, affected as they are by the decision of the er first of all the french national assembly and now the french government to make life difficult for the other member states as far as the ratification of these proposals are concerned, it's right that we should be asking what is the position of the british government in relation to these matters. -i i asked the er the minister earlier about this question and i appreciate his difficulties being a home office minister rather than a foreign office minister and i quite understand his reluctance to er stray too far from his departmental portfolio but the reality is that the british government agreed that the european parliament should continue to meet in strasbourg but we've heard nothing from the minister as to where the money should come from er in order to make that commitment a reality because i'm sure that every member opposite would say that the uncertainty about the present boundaries is not the er responsibility of the british government, that it's a matter for the french government to sort out which boundaries er will be in place in the united kingdom by june the ninth, the date of the european elections, but the reality is that the british government have gone along with the arrangement for having strasbourg recognised as a er seat for the european parliament. +it's proper that we should be asking in the context of these proposals for boundary changes, affected as they are by the decision of the er first of all the french national assembly and now the french government to make life difficult for the other member states as far as the ratification of these proposals are concerned, it's right that we should be asking what is the position of the british government in relation to these matters. +i i asked the er the minister earlier about this question and i appreciate his difficulties being a home office minister rather than a foreign office minister and i quite understand his reluctance to er stray too far from his departmental portfolio but the reality is that the british government agreed that the european parliament should continue to meet in strasbourg but we've heard nothing from the minister as to where the money should come from er in order to make that commitment a reality because i'm sure that every member opposite would say that the uncertainty about the present boundaries is not the er responsibility of the british government, that it's a matter for the french government to sort out which boundaries er will be in place in the united kingdom by june the ninth, the date of the european elections, but the reality is that the british government have gone along with the arrangement for having strasbourg recognised as a er seat for the european parliament. but they've gone along with it without recognising that there will be a cost and members opposite have consistently criticised the european parliament for having a number of buildings from which to operate. they're right to criticise the european parliament for that. that's no making of the european parliament, the european parliament will be delighted to hold its meetings in the new building in brussels. er but the truth of the matter is that the british government would not . interesting but when are we gonna hear something about the boundaries. mr geoffrey holn. -i i'm grateful mr deputy speaker and i i will certainly er stay in order but the british electorate coming up to june the ninth and the european er elections will not know even if we pass these particular proposals tonight er in which constituencies they will be voting and if i may give an illustration as the honourable member for truro did er er as far as his european constituency is concerned er the european constituency of derbyshire ashfield will d be divided into three different directions as the result of this particular order in council if we pass it tonight. +i i'm grateful mr deputy speaker and i i will certainly er stay in order but the british electorate coming up to june the ninth and the european er elections will not know even if we pass these particular proposals tonight er in which constituencies they will be voting and if i may give an illustration as the honourable member for truro did er er as far as his european constituency is concerned er the european constituency of derbyshire ashfield will d be divided into three different directions as the result of this particular order in council if we pass it tonight. there will be a a a series of new constituencies created across the east midlands. -the electorate will expect to know who the candidates are in those er er particular constituencies. -indeed the political parties preparing for those elections are in the process of selecting the candidates er there will in fact be an extra constituency in the east midlands as a result of this particular order in council er and indeed the political parties at some stage will have to select new candidates for the six extra seats across the united kingdom. +the electorate will expect to know who the candidates are in those er er particular constituencies. +indeed the political parties preparing for those elections are in the process of selecting the candidates er there will in fact be an extra constituency in the east midlands as a result of this particular order in council er and indeed the political parties at some stage will have to select new candidates for the six extra seats across the united kingdom. that process is under way and the processes of political parties in choosing candidates are an important part of our democratic process. -if that is the case that each of the political parties, as i assume is the case for er the conservative party, i know it to be the case of the labour party i assume the same is true for the liberal democrats and other parties represented in this house, that they undertake the very considerable organisational er er process of selecting candidates only to find a few weeks before june the ninth, that as a result of the difficulties that i've described as far as the french government attitude towards these elections is concerned, that er in fact we have to revert to the existing arrangements and that we cannot have these new er boundaries in place. +if that is the case that each of the political parties, as i assume is the case for er the conservative party, i know it to be the case of the labour party i assume the same is true for the liberal democrats and other parties represented in this house, that they undertake the very considerable organisational er er process of selecting candidates only to find a few weeks before june the ninth, that as a result of the difficulties that i've described as far as the french government attitude towards these elections is concerned, that er in fact we have to revert to the existing arrangements and that we cannot have these new er boundaries in place. that will cause astonishing confusion to the electorate. -it will something which the government will seek er to blame on the french and therefore mr deputy speaker i do think it important that the record is set straight er as far as the french government are concerned. -the british government er not only went along with this agreement at the time of the edinburgh summit, they positively endorsed this arrangement er as being something that they er strongly supported and urged upon other member states in the european community er and that i think is a relevant matter with respect er mr deputy speaker, i i appreciate that er there are other issues relating to these er er constituencies that are of greater concern perhaps to er honourable and right honourable members but this question of who actually is to pay for any new building in the european parliament is something that i believe the government cannot avoid. -i appreciate the minister's difficulty representing the home office with no specific responsibility for these matters as far as er er europe is concerned er but nevertheless this is a matter that does affect the electorate and one that i think the house should take er notice of. +it will something which the government will seek er to blame on the french and therefore mr deputy speaker i do think it important that the record is set straight er as far as the french government are concerned. +the british government er not only went along with this agreement at the time of the edinburgh summit, they positively endorsed this arrangement er as being something that they er strongly supported and urged upon other member states in the european community er and that i think is a relevant matter with respect er mr deputy speaker, i i appreciate that er there are other issues relating to these er er constituencies that are of greater concern perhaps to er honourable and right honourable members but this question of who actually is to pay for any new building in the european parliament is something that i believe the government cannot avoid. +i appreciate the minister's difficulty representing the home office with no specific responsibility for these matters as far as er er europe is concerned er but nevertheless this is a matter that does affect the electorate and one that i think the house should take er notice of. i'm grateful mr deputy speaker. morgan. thank you mr deputy speaker. -erm i'm er rising to take the opportunity to sum up the debate er for those of us on this side of the house and to say that on this side of the house we do welcome these orders actually coming through, delayed though they are and er besmirched though they are by the usual examples of government incompetence in failing to send them to the scrutiny committee in the proper manner to allow the usual processes to take place but wi that's par for the course these days. -i want to welcome obviously particularly er the order relating to wales because it confers on wales er one additional seat, giving us five altogether because of the rise in the welsh population over the last ten years and that er although wales was under represented under the previous erm er you know distribution of seats which gave us only four we will be slightly over represented when we have five because you simply can't have four and a half seats, it's got to be one or the other but since the welsh population is continuing to rise very rapidly then it is likely that that will be put right. -i mean the welsh population in percentage terms is now rising more rapidly than that of england and therefore by the year two thousand and one when the next review would take place er we er will certainly fully occupy if you like, that fifth seat in terms of the average size because welsh euro constituencies were during the past ten years, very slightly larger on average than those in england and so er we are moving from under representation to slight over representation for a temporary period er simply because er you know wales is regarded as indivisible for this purpose and that's why we welcomed this debate. -i give way briefly to the honourable member. +erm i'm er rising to take the opportunity to sum up the debate er for those of us on this side of the house and to say that on this side of the house we do welcome these orders actually coming through, delayed though they are and er besmirched though they are by the usual examples of government incompetence in failing to send them to the scrutiny committee in the proper manner to allow the usual processes to take place but wi that's par for the course these days. +i want to welcome obviously particularly er the order relating to wales because it confers on wales er one additional seat, giving us five altogether because of the rise in the welsh population over the last ten years and that er although wales was under represented under the previous erm er you know distribution of seats which gave us only four we will be slightly over represented when we have five because you simply can't have four and a half seats, it's got to be one or the other but since the welsh population is continuing to rise very rapidly then it is likely that that will be put right. +i mean the welsh population in percentage terms is now rising more rapidly than that of england and therefore by the year two thousand and one when the next review would take place er we er will certainly fully occupy if you like, that fifth seat in terms of the average size because welsh euro constituencies were during the past ten years, very slightly larger on average than those in england and so er we are moving from under representation to slight over representation for a temporary period er simply because er you know wales is regarded as indivisible for this purpose and that's why we welcomed this debate. +i give way briefly to the honourable member. i'm grateful to the honourable member and listening very carefully to this argument. obviously the integrity of wales is very important to him otherwise he would p p presumably be prepared to accept that part of england could have gone with one of the new seats. -would he care to address the fact that because these orders are being taken separately for wales and england it is not possible to make the quota applicable in the same way in the same parts of the united kingdom. -wales is being given a quite different quota to england and because cornwall is being included in england for this purpose we are being unfairly treated by wales' being generously treated. -would the honourable member care to comment on that inequality? -i i obviously cornwall is a special case which we obviously as our celtic cousins it is the only non-anglo saxon county in england and as a result we feel a very, very strong erm er almost a kind of uncle erm nephew relationship to cornwall, whereas the cornish are certainly not welsh but they're certainly not anglo saxon english either. -we have a great deal of sympathy er but whereas i don't think some of the ideas that have been floated tonight for a cornwall and gibraltar west seat er or erm any kind of link up between cornwall and any tail end of a welsh seat we don't think is practical and i think he's gotta solve this problem er within the confines of cornwall being regarded as part of england if not anglo saxon. +would he care to address the fact that because these orders are being taken separately for wales and england it is not possible to make the quota applicable in the same way in the same parts of the united kingdom. +wales is being given a quite different quota to england and because cornwall is being included in england for this purpose we are being unfairly treated by wales' being generously treated. +would the honourable member care to comment on that inequality? +i i obviously cornwall is a special case which we obviously as our celtic cousins it is the only non-anglo saxon county in england and as a result we feel a very, very strong erm er almost a kind of uncle erm nephew relationship to cornwall, whereas the cornish are certainly not welsh but they're certainly not anglo saxon english either. +we have a great deal of sympathy er but whereas i don't think some of the ideas that have been floated tonight for a cornwall and gibraltar west seat er or erm any kind of link up between cornwall and any tail end of a welsh seat we don't think is practical and i think he's gotta solve this problem er within the confines of cornwall being regarded as part of england if not anglo saxon. that's not a problem that i can actually deal with er but wales certainly er you know takes the sort of interest in europe that we have seen from most of the conservative speakers er in trying to sum up this debate you have to refer to them er of not being able to show, there's a definite sort of anti european theme coming through from most of the speakers from the back benches who've chosen to take part in this debate tonight from the other side and it's difficulty to avoid summing up the debate without some reference to the points that they have made which is in complete contrast to the attitude that we have erm in wales er towards europe and that we are. poor practices at the bank which the auditors were aware of for years, a crashing indictment er of the auditors. -it did, if you look at that report er th th that the curry curry gold or whatever, curry report erm i i i it shows that b c c i actually provided loads of financial benefits to some of the auditors er these benefits included loans to two price waterhouse partnerships in the caribbean er in addition it said there were serious questions concerning the acceptance of payment and possibly housing from b c c i and its affiliates by price waterhouse partners er the in grand caymans er and possible acceptance of sexual favours. -the report is more interesting than by the member for south east derbyshire er not that there's much sex in it but if er er i it's more interesting er sexual favours provided by b c c i officials to certain persons affiliated er with the firm. -now this is an appalling situation, er th the b c c i's books were certified by the auditors as a true and fair record from december nineteenth er december thirty first nineteen er eighty seven forward a and that meant that people had confidence in b c c i, here we're told that the auditors are giving it er a certificate of a a true and fair record er encouraging therefore people to in t to to invest and yet prior to nineteen eighty nine price waterhouse knew of gross irregularities er in b c c i's handling of loads, particularly the load to c c a h which was the holding company for first american er bank shares. +it did, if you look at that report er th th that the curry curry gold or whatever, curry report erm i i i it shows that b c c i actually provided loads of financial benefits to some of the auditors er these benefits included loans to two price waterhouse partnerships in the caribbean er in addition it said there were serious questions concerning the acceptance of payment and possibly housing from b c c i and its affiliates by price waterhouse partners er the in grand caymans er and possible acceptance of sexual favours. +the report is more interesting than by the member for south east derbyshire er not that there's much sex in it but if er er i it's more interesting er sexual favours provided by b c c i officials to certain persons affiliated er with the firm. +now this is an appalling situation, er th the b c c i's books were certified by the auditors as a true and fair record from december nineteenth er december thirty first nineteen er eighty seven forward a and that meant that people had confidence in b c c i, here we're told that the auditors are giving it er a certificate of a a true and fair record er encouraging therefore people to in t to to invest and yet prior to nineteen eighty nine price waterhouse knew of gross irregularities er in b c c i's handling of loads, particularly the load to c c a h which was the holding company for first american er bank shares. all this was known to the auditors, they didn't spill the beans. now why have we not had an inquiry which will bring out what happened in the case of b c c i so we can base proper and effective regulation er on that er in i in in in in inquiry. -the government feels it can rely on er auditors to protect the interests of share holders and the creditors and the other stake holders but i have to tell the minister that that reliance which is now er strengthened by the regulations b by the er the order today has always proved er inadequate in the er in in the past er because poor auditing practices always get covered up, there's no way for anybody to know how bad or how good er the audit is as long as a company er survives and we haven't developed in this country, the proper institutional framework to regulate auditors er effectively and to actually make them er er accountable. -now and er i have to point out to minister this side of the house er actually proposed much stronger provisions on er detection of fraud er in at the the building societies act and the financial services act er in in er er er of eighty six er we have these orders er brought in far too late because the government is continuing to place reliance on an industry and a framework which has a history er of of failure. -they can't beat the auditors on effective replacement for regulation. +the government feels it can rely on er auditors to protect the interests of share holders and the creditors and the other stake holders but i have to tell the minister that that reliance which is now er strengthened by the regulations b by the er the order today has always proved er inadequate in the er in in the past er because poor auditing practices always get covered up, there's no way for anybody to know how bad or how good er the audit is as long as a company er survives and we haven't developed in this country, the proper institutional framework to regulate auditors er effectively and to actually make them er er accountable. +now and er i have to point out to minister this side of the house er actually proposed much stronger provisions on er detection of fraud er in at the the building societies act and the financial services act er in in er er er of eighty six er we have these orders er brought in far too late because the government is continuing to place reliance on an industry and a framework which has a history er of of failure. +they can't beat the auditors on effective replacement for regulation. in the united states quite rightly, state inspectors visit and monitor banks er and that's the only effective way we're going to know what's er w what's going on. -there should be such a requirement in britain, instead of just relying that we are about these orders er on the o o on the er auditors er them that that that the the themselves. -er er er i mentioned er in an earlier interjection the fact that price waterhouse in this country er wouldn't give evidence and didn't provide information to price waterhouse partners er er i i in the united states er er the government i think, can only er deal with this by some effective regulation er of auditing er and by some er er effective er independent regulate. -there needs to be er a banking commission to take these functions away from a bank of england performed so poorly er and was shown to have done by the er b by the bingham report. -my own preference is for er er er er a securities next change commission, an independent commission as in the united states with a banking commission underneath it er an accountancy er commission underneath it, but an effective framework of independent regulators to whom the auditors can report er when they er wh wh when they found the they find fraud. -my honourable friend from the front benches made the point about the gaps in er these regulations, they don't cover lloyds, they don't cover pension schemes, pension funds they don't cover banks which are domiciled er in the er in in the united states but er we also have the point which i made in the interjection to the minister that unless there's a duty to detect fraud er er as well as report it, it's really doubtful if the auditors can perform er the function. -we pointed out them from this side of the house er the local government's finance act does impose both duties. -now the audit industry was in favour of that at the time because it saw itself as able to get its fingers into local authority audit so they were prepared to accept that they could do it then, it's only now er when it's proposed on what's been their traditional prerogatives, they er er they audit of banks and private sector er er companies that they balk at the proposition and say ooh it's horrendous we can't do it. -well i have to tell the minister that the firms are advertising for detection services all the time, k p m g peter marwick advertising this, they will er investigate financial frauds and rectify and recover from them that requires specialised accounting skills, k p m g forensic accounting offers experience in the techniques of fraudsters and the procedures er they may have followed. +there should be such a requirement in britain, instead of just relying that we are about these orders er on the o o on the er auditors er them that that that the the themselves. +er er er i mentioned er in an earlier interjection the fact that price waterhouse in this country er wouldn't give evidence and didn't provide information to price waterhouse partners er er i i in the united states er er the government i think, can only er deal with this by some effective regulation er of auditing er and by some er er effective er independent regulate. +there needs to be er a banking commission to take these functions away from a bank of england performed so poorly er and was shown to have done by the er b by the bingham report. +my own preference is for er er er er a securities next change commission, an independent commission as in the united states with a banking commission underneath it er an accountancy er commission underneath it, but an effective framework of independent regulators to whom the auditors can report er when they er wh wh when they found the they find fraud. +my honourable friend from the front benches made the point about the gaps in er these regulations, they don't cover lloyds, they don't cover pension schemes, pension funds they don't cover banks which are domiciled er in the er in in the united states but er we also have the point which i made in the interjection to the minister that unless there's a duty to detect fraud er er as well as report it, it's really doubtful if the auditors can perform er the function. +we pointed out them from this side of the house er the local government's finance act does impose both duties. +now the audit industry was in favour of that at the time because it saw itself as able to get its fingers into local authority audit so they were prepared to accept that they could do it then, it's only now er when it's proposed on what's been their traditional prerogatives, they er er they audit of banks and private sector er er companies that they balk at the proposition and say ooh it's horrendous we can't do it. +well i have to tell the minister that the firms are advertising for detection services all the time, k p m g peter marwick advertising this, they will er investigate financial frauds and rectify and recover from them that requires specialised accounting skills, k p m g forensic accounting offers experience in the techniques of fraudsters and the procedures er they may have followed. awareness of the indicators, the possible irregularities, the resources needed for a fast and accurate investigation, experience of the quality of evidence required to support a successful case and the expertise to assembly and present that evidence. we can assist in tracing funds and unravelling the most complex international cases. -they can provide all that for a fee why can't they provide it as a compulsory necessary part er of the service,it wouldn't be more expensive the minister claimed, if you do a proper audit it can't be more expensive. -proper audit er is the effective way er to detect fraud and that needs to be at the at the er the re requirement er er that we impose er on and i, as i pointed out er at the moment the auditors themselves are not being effectively er regulated. -lord justice er bingham did say that the relationship between the client, the auditor and the supervisor er is an issue of policy which is more appropriate for decision by parliament than the accounting profession and yet er we're still subjecting that to control er by the auditing practices board, not a statutory body er er and it's already told us that it's going to impose passive requirement on auditors er in this very difficult area. +they can provide all that for a fee why can't they provide it as a compulsory necessary part er of the service,it wouldn't be more expensive the minister claimed, if you do a proper audit it can't be more expensive. +proper audit er is the effective way er to detect fraud and that needs to be at the at the er the re requirement er er that we impose er on and i, as i pointed out er at the moment the auditors themselves are not being effectively er regulated. +lord justice er bingham did say that the relationship between the client, the auditor and the supervisor er is an issue of policy which is more appropriate for decision by parliament than the accounting profession and yet er we're still subjecting that to control er by the auditing practices board, not a statutory body er er and it's already told us that it's going to impose passive requirement on auditors er in this very difficult area. now passive requirements on auditors are just not adequate for the detection of fraud. -the draught standard they've put forward states the duty to make a report direct to a regulator does not impose upon auditors a duty to carry out specific work, no specific work, don't do anything just go along. -that's ludicrous, unless you do the work you can't make the report. +the draught standard they've put forward states the duty to make a report direct to a regulator does not impose upon auditors a duty to carry out specific work, no specific work, don't do anything just go along. +that's ludicrous, unless you do the work you can't make the report. no auditing practices in addition to those carried out in the normal case of auditing the financial statements are carried out. -auditors are not responsible for reporting on irregulated entities overall compliance with rules with which it is required to comply, that's unlike local government, nor are they required to conduct there work in such a way that there is reasonable certainty that they will discover breaches. -they're not actually required er to go out er looking for things, just sit there be passive er a and it'll all come pouring in, that seems to be the er the . +auditors are not responsible for reporting on irregulated entities overall compliance with rules with which it is required to comply, that's unlike local government, nor are they required to conduct there work in such a way that there is reasonable certainty that they will discover breaches. +they're not actually required er to go out er looking for things, just sit there be passive er a and it'll all come pouring in, that seems to be the er the . fraud doesn't work that way, you don't get the fraudsters rushing in and saying here's the evidence mr auditor, get me. -it's all well concealed and unless the auditor has an obligation to actually hunt this down, the kind of white hunter er er of the british economy er then er it won't be detected and the passive approach to audit such as the er audit practices board is recommending is simply a recipe for further disasters er and further audit failures. -couple of final points er madam deputy speaker, er the government should surely have clarified responsibility of auditors. +it's all well concealed and unless the auditor has an obligation to actually hunt this down, the kind of white hunter er er of the british economy er then er it won't be detected and the passive approach to audit such as the er audit practices board is recommending is simply a recipe for further disasters er and further audit failures. +couple of final points er madam deputy speaker, er the government should surely have clarified responsibility of auditors. who are they actually responsible to? to whom do they owe a duty of care? -it's no good just saying you can report fraud er to er t t to the regulator, they should also be responsible to the shareholders, the stake holders, everybody involved er in er er er a company er and in fact er they aren't they have really responsibility to no one except the directors er who appoint them, the company share holders are given very little information, the choice of auditors er is firmly in the director's director's hands, the depositors, the consumers, the employees er have no say er in the appointment of er auditors and more important the recent legal cases for instance and the al saudi bank er er and berg er sons er and company also decided that er auditors don't owe a duty of care er to individual shareholders, potential investors, the current or potential creditors er even though that information is supposed to be there to help markets understand what is happening to that committee and the government showed no indication that it wants to reverse these judgements, it should reverse them, there should be specific responsibilities attached to er auditors to give them a duty of care er so that we get the information er and er spend more widely and the share holders and the stake holders know what's going on er er er as well as er the bank or the financial er institution er itself. -now my honourable friend has already quoted er the presence the,o of the department of trade in this er er pointing out in er his book er where there's a will there's a corpse er er that er there shouldn't be a conflict of interest because accountancy firms shouldn't do other work. -that should be a paramount objective er in financial institutions because d t i inquiries have indicated er that the work is less adequate er when er they're relying er on when a man is checking his own figures or those of a colleague, that was er er in at the roadships erm re report. +it's no good just saying you can report fraud er to er t t to the regulator, they should also be responsible to the shareholders, the stake holders, everybody involved er in er er er a company er and in fact er they aren't they have really responsibility to no one except the directors er who appoint them, the company share holders are given very little information, the choice of auditors er is firmly in the director's director's hands, the depositors, the consumers, the employees er have no say er in the appointment of er auditors and more important the recent legal cases for instance and the al saudi bank er er and berg er sons er and company also decided that er auditors don't owe a duty of care er to individual shareholders, potential investors, the current or potential creditors er even though that information is supposed to be there to help markets understand what is happening to that committee and the government showed no indication that it wants to reverse these judgements, it should reverse them, there should be specific responsibilities attached to er auditors to give them a duty of care er so that we get the information er and er spend more widely and the share holders and the stake holders know what's going on er er er as well as er the bank or the financial er institution er itself. +now my honourable friend has already quoted er the presence the,o of the department of trade in this er er pointing out in er his book er where there's a will there's a corpse er er that er there shouldn't be a conflict of interest because accountancy firms shouldn't do other work. +that should be a paramount objective er in financial institutions because d t i inquiries have indicated er that the work is less adequate er when er they're relying er on when a man is checking his own figures or those of a colleague, that was er er in at the roadships erm re report. there's a who er er a whole series of other reports, bernhope and fauder for instance, critical of er audit reports er report in in that context and i have to say to the minister er that none of the auditors criticised by d t i reports over the years have actually be disbarred from er from practice. now what kind of a sanction is that er to make the auditors actually do the job properly. we need an effective independent regulator, not the mafia regulating mafia and saying it's quite understandable boy, we'll let you off this time which is what happens now er with the institute of chartered accountants er as a recognised supervisory body er in this er in this particular field. -we have to have er an effective control er and discipline er of auditors. -the secretary of state er told me er that the has been no occasion where criticism from a companies auditors by my department's inspectors in reports published since june nineteen seventy nine has led to an audit partner being excluded from membership of a professional accountancy body, er and no auditor criticised in d t i inspector's reports has been debarred from auditing as a result of information er in that report. -so bearing in mind the government itself has never iss er initiated any criminal action against auditors criticised in d t i reports, there are no effective sanctions. -now for all those reasons madame speaker, this these orders er er today are inadequate, too little, too late, we can't vote against them, much as the the member who preceded me seemed inclined to vote against them and i wish that he had the g er the guts of 'is cu the courage of his convictions er he should vote against them, er we on this side are far more responsible er than that because to vote against them er might be an indication that we're as much in frau in favour of fraud as members on the other side of the house, er we're not in favour of fraud, we welcome any progress to detection of fraud, even progress that we asked for five eight years ago when the relevant legislation was passed. +we have to have er an effective control er and discipline er of auditors. +the secretary of state er told me er that the has been no occasion where criticism from a companies auditors by my department's inspectors in reports published since june nineteen seventy nine has led to an audit partner being excluded from membership of a professional accountancy body, er and no auditor criticised in d t i inspector's reports has been debarred from auditing as a result of information er in that report. +so bearing in mind the government itself has never iss er initiated any criminal action against auditors criticised in d t i reports, there are no effective sanctions. +now for all those reasons madame speaker, this these orders er er today are inadequate, too little, too late, we can't vote against them, much as the the member who preceded me seemed inclined to vote against them and i wish that he had the g er the guts of 'is cu the courage of his convictions er he should vote against them, er we on this side are far more responsible er than that because to vote against them er might be an indication that we're as much in frau in favour of fraud as members on the other side of the house, er we're not in favour of fraud, we welcome any progress to detection of fraud, even progress that we asked for five eight years ago when the relevant legislation was passed. for that reason we have to welcome er the er th th the orders, but they're just not good enough. here, here. mr john greenway. -er well madam deputy speaker i think erm that the last half an hour shown that er the quality of debate in this house er remains extremely high and that even when you have an issue which on the face of it looks to be as dry as dust er that er there are some honourable members who will pick an argument er when perhaps er on the face of it there ought not to be much of an argument er i can't erm i can't say that erm i agreed with much of what erm the honourable member for great grimsby said er he seemed to imply er quite early on his er speech that most of the city of london er was collapsing in a sea of sleaze and er er other other goings on which are extremely er to be regretted but erm i think we ought to er remind him er that erm, you know, all all of these four orders er followed the bingham inquiry into er what happened at b c c i which was not a british bank, was an international bank based erm overseas and i think i'm right in saying this and i'm sure my honourable friend the minister will confirm when he winds up er this is the first er such difficulty er that we've experienced for a great length of time. -er, now the the point i really want to refer to is erm just what role an auditor ought to play er in the er insurance and financial service industry in looking at particular firms, erm i have several interests which the honourable member for edinburgh central knows about, er the one that i think is relevant er to tonight is that i am an elected member of the insurance brokers registration council and the way that erm the way that we regulate insurance brokers erm is laid down by statute but it does actually demonstrate the advantage, the benefit of erm of having a statutory requirement for audit and for er a proper oversight of what then follows in terms of the way that the regulator reacts to what the auditor may say. -the purpose of of these four orders, which i must say i greatly welcome, it is one of the, the most beneficial things to come out of the b c c i er disaster er and er i if i can say in in effectively in answer to to everything the honourable gentleman for great grimsby said and he and i have debated on many occasions, if fact usually on the television not on the floor of the house, but er an an an an because of it for not quite so long either, er but erm th the point i would make to his is that really what he was saying was th that what went wrong with b c c i is that price waterhouse knew there was fraud and didn't say so and that wha what lord justice bingham pointed out was that there is a clear conflict of interest between the interest of the client who they work for and the public interest and that what needed, what was needed was some amendment to the banking act to clarify that and that is precisely what er this order actually does and you can't really er madam deputy speaker, expect anyone to really seriously criticise the government when in actual fact not only have they come up with the regulation to deal with that but they've also gone further and said we will apply this to financial services and to building societies and to insurance companies as well, just to be absolutely sure. -now i would be the first to admit that i i'm not a judge as accountant, i'm an insurance broker er and erm i don't understand er and i'm not aware of all of the rules and regulations that affect accountants er and affect the way audits are carried out,b but i must say i was a bit surprised t to hear during the debate, er that that was really what the problem was, the problem with b c c i was this conflict of interest, that fraud was known and it was not declared er and er i think that these er these regulations should now make that considerably er more clear. -the point i i simply wanted to to make which is why i i sat through the debate, erm is the honourable member for edinburgh central er in his er speech er which i i must say i did expect, called for stronger regulations, er we had the argument the other week about whether there should be statutory regulations or whether we should make er the er self regulation system that we have with financial services industries work. -erm, i take the view that we ought to try and make the existing arrangements work and we are fast approaching a very key point er in that process erm i understand that on thursday, er securities and investments board, the board will consider the er p i a, proposed p i a prospectus and that er within a week or so we shall all be able to to read it and to look at it erm and the key point, which really is arises out of what we're discussing tonight, the key point is what regulatory framework should the p i a place on intermediaries and on er life assurance companies, pension funds, financial advisors generally er in order to ensure that the public interest is protected and that if there are potential frauds erm such as the levitt case er that we talked about earlier and i think the honourable member in sort of by implication in terms of er community service, er punishments that he referred to, er had also that in mind, er just what should we do to ensure that if there is malpractice and fraud, it's picked up very, very quickly. -certainly this order on financial services, helps because it makes absolutely clear that if an auditor sees malpractice and potential fraud he has an obligation and a duty to report it straight away to the regul regulator, but that will help the process. -but there will as i my honourable friend knows, there will be quite an argument when we see the prospectus and i haven't had the priv the privilege of seeing it erm although i've had the opportunity to discuss er its contents with th with the er chairman of the p i a er er and the chief executive. +er well madam deputy speaker i think erm that the last half an hour shown that er the quality of debate in this house er remains extremely high and that even when you have an issue which on the face of it looks to be as dry as dust er that er there are some honourable members who will pick an argument er when perhaps er on the face of it there ought not to be much of an argument er i can't erm i can't say that erm i agreed with much of what erm the honourable member for great grimsby said er he seemed to imply er quite early on his er speech that most of the city of london er was collapsing in a sea of sleaze and er er other other goings on which are extremely er to be regretted but erm i think we ought to er remind him er that erm, you know, all all of these four orders er followed the bingham inquiry into er what happened at b c c i which was not a british bank, was an international bank based erm overseas and i think i'm right in saying this and i'm sure my honourable friend the minister will confirm when he winds up er this is the first er such difficulty er that we've experienced for a great length of time. +er, now the the point i really want to refer to is erm just what role an auditor ought to play er in the er insurance and financial service industry in looking at particular firms, erm i have several interests which the honourable member for edinburgh central knows about, er the one that i think is relevant er to tonight is that i am an elected member of the insurance brokers registration council and the way that erm the way that we regulate insurance brokers erm is laid down by statute but it does actually demonstrate the advantage, the benefit of erm of having a statutory requirement for audit and for er a proper oversight of what then follows in terms of the way that the regulator reacts to what the auditor may say. +the purpose of of these four orders, which i must say i greatly welcome, it is one of the, the most beneficial things to come out of the b c c i er disaster er and er i if i can say in in effectively in answer to to everything the honourable gentleman for great grimsby said and he and i have debated on many occasions, if fact usually on the television not on the floor of the house, but er an an an an because of it for not quite so long either, er but erm th the point i would make to his is that really what he was saying was th that what went wrong with b c c i is that price waterhouse knew there was fraud and didn't say so and that wha what lord justice bingham pointed out was that there is a clear conflict of interest between the interest of the client who they work for and the public interest and that what needed, what was needed was some amendment to the banking act to clarify that and that is precisely what er this order actually does and you can't really er madam deputy speaker, expect anyone to really seriously criticise the government when in actual fact not only have they come up with the regulation to deal with that but they've also gone further and said we will apply this to financial services and to building societies and to insurance companies as well, just to be absolutely sure. +now i would be the first to admit that i i'm not a judge as accountant, i'm an insurance broker er and erm i don't understand er and i'm not aware of all of the rules and regulations that affect accountants er and affect the way audits are carried out,b but i must say i was a bit surprised t to hear during the debate, er that that was really what the problem was, the problem with b c c i was this conflict of interest, that fraud was known and it was not declared er and er i think that these er these regulations should now make that considerably er more clear. +the point i i simply wanted to to make which is why i i sat through the debate, erm is the honourable member for edinburgh central er in his er speech er which i i must say i did expect, called for stronger regulations, er we had the argument the other week about whether there should be statutory regulations or whether we should make er the er self regulation system that we have with financial services industries work. +erm, i take the view that we ought to try and make the existing arrangements work and we are fast approaching a very key point er in that process erm i understand that on thursday, er securities and investments board, the board will consider the er p i a, proposed p i a prospectus and that er within a week or so we shall all be able to to read it and to look at it erm and the key point, which really is arises out of what we're discussing tonight, the key point is what regulatory framework should the p i a place on intermediaries and on er life assurance companies, pension funds, financial advisors generally er in order to ensure that the public interest is protected and that if there are potential frauds erm such as the levitt case er that we talked about earlier and i think the honourable member in sort of by implication in terms of er community service, er punishments that he referred to, er had also that in mind, er just what should we do to ensure that if there is malpractice and fraud, it's picked up very, very quickly. +certainly this order on financial services, helps because it makes absolutely clear that if an auditor sees malpractice and potential fraud he has an obligation and a duty to report it straight away to the regul regulator, but that will help the process. +but there will as i my honourable friend knows, there will be quite an argument when we see the prospectus and i haven't had the priv the privilege of seeing it erm although i've had the opportunity to discuss er its contents with th with the er chairman of the p i a er er and the chief executive. er it is important i think, that we don't er have too many regulations, that's why i have some sympathy for what my honourable friend, the member for south hamms, was saying, that we don't er regulate to the point where firms just go out of business and give up, that it's too expensive and it's too burdensome. -but that we get a balance right between the amount of regulations an and the cost of it but that it is in a sense, effective and and the plea i would make to my honourable friend when he considers this p i a prospectus and what should be done and wh to what extent the government feels it should support it, is that what we actually want is not a specific requirement that says you've got to have this much, that much capital erm and so on, but that there is a function, there is a regular audit trail, there is a a regular, annual look at the figures, the accounts of all these intermediaries, er and firms where the difficulty has been er in the past. -because i i i've said this to him before on on the floor of the house, that is what we are required to do in the insurance brokers registration council for all insurance broking firms, that is what parliament required in the insurance brokers registration act and it is not an onerous requirement on firms, it is not excessively expensive so it would meet i believe, any cost compliance test er that erm the er the d t i might wish to to insist be carried out. -what it does is it means that there is a proper look each year at the finances of each individual firm er and er if there are things which are wrong, they are reported straight away and that really i think is the lesser of all of this with b c c i, er that er where things are not all they should be that they are dealt with and they are reported quickly and these orders,madam deputy speaker, go a long way to helping to ensure that and for that reason i believe the house should warmly welcome them. +but that we get a balance right between the amount of regulations an and the cost of it but that it is in a sense, effective and and the plea i would make to my honourable friend when he considers this p i a prospectus and what should be done and wh to what extent the government feels it should support it, is that what we actually want is not a specific requirement that says you've got to have this much, that much capital erm and so on, but that there is a function, there is a regular audit trail, there is a a regular, annual look at the figures, the accounts of all these intermediaries, er and firms where the difficulty has been er in the past. +because i i i've said this to him before on on the floor of the house, that is what we are required to do in the insurance brokers registration council for all insurance broking firms, that is what parliament required in the insurance brokers registration act and it is not an onerous requirement on firms, it is not excessively expensive so it would meet i believe, any cost compliance test er that erm the er the d t i might wish to to insist be carried out. +what it does is it means that there is a proper look each year at the finances of each individual firm er and er if there are things which are wrong, they are reported straight away and that really i think is the lesser of all of this with b c c i, er that er where things are not all they should be that they are dealt with and they are reported quickly and these orders,madam deputy speaker, go a long way to helping to ensure that and for that reason i believe the house should warmly welcome them. mr anthony nelson. madam deputy speaker. -this has been a curiously old fashioned debate in some ways with one hou side of the house calling for more regulation and the other side of the house calling for less regulation and my honourable mem , my honourable friend the member for south hamms er did say eloquently again this evening. -i can say to my honourable friend, the member for rydale who takes such a close interest and is so well informed er on these matters, er i'm very grateful to him for the welcome he's given for the orders here, he's absolutely right to say that we have gone beyond er what restrictive called for by bingham, we have extended it to other sectors in the financial we welcomed the honourable gentleman from edinburgh central that these er orders are in some way timid, they are what was called for by the treasury select committee, they are what was proposed er by bingham and we have er introduced them er here tonight. -i say to my honourable friend as far as the p i a's concerned he will have an early opportunity er to consider er the prospectus on that which is indeed being published er and i take very seriously the point he makes about adequate monitoring procedures and the need for an audit trail. -i think that is a central criterion to attach the effectiveness of self regulating organisations if the the methodical nature of their monitoring er a and the way that that is done and i hope all concerned will consider these matters carefully. -my honourable friend the member for er south hamms, madam deputy speaker, er gave i thought a a an amusing but perceptive speech about the growth of deregulation, indeed some were saying that deregulation er is in fact the fastest growing part of bureaucracy in whitehall and there have been calls to deregulate the deregulators er, he is of course quite right that parkinson's theory can extend in this area and one can find that deregulation acquires a life and momentum erm of its own. -but the underlying purpose, that of reducing unnecessary bureaucracy, stripping away the red tape which hinders enterprise and good er governance in this country, is something that the government is very committed to and we intend to promulgate that doctrine throughout all the areas and that of course is being taken forward in legislation. -as far as er the honourable gentleman for edinburgh central is concerned, he said there was a case for a wider inquiry into the auditing o of companies, well that is not something specifically called for er by bingham although i acknowledge that a case can be made for that but i think we want to be extremely careful before extending that in the way that he and the honourable member for great grimsby proposed beyond the direct er responsibility to the members or the owners of the company. -it must be right for auditors to audit and for regulators to regulate and i do not think that it helps the argument for there to be an overlap in responsibilities and in some way, as i say, to turn auditors into snoopers and narks er er and make more supine one's er regulators. +this has been a curiously old fashioned debate in some ways with one hou side of the house calling for more regulation and the other side of the house calling for less regulation and my honourable mem , my honourable friend the member for south hamms er did say eloquently again this evening. +i can say to my honourable friend, the member for rydale who takes such a close interest and is so well informed er on these matters, er i'm very grateful to him for the welcome he's given for the orders here, he's absolutely right to say that we have gone beyond er what restrictive called for by bingham, we have extended it to other sectors in the financial we welcomed the honourable gentleman from edinburgh central that these er orders are in some way timid, they are what was called for by the treasury select committee, they are what was proposed er by bingham and we have er introduced them er here tonight. +i say to my honourable friend as far as the p i a's concerned he will have an early opportunity er to consider er the prospectus on that which is indeed being published er and i take very seriously the point he makes about adequate monitoring procedures and the need for an audit trail. +i think that is a central criterion to attach the effectiveness of self regulating organisations if the the methodical nature of their monitoring er a and the way that that is done and i hope all concerned will consider these matters carefully. +my honourable friend the member for er south hamms, madam deputy speaker, er gave i thought a a an amusing but perceptive speech about the growth of deregulation, indeed some were saying that deregulation er is in fact the fastest growing part of bureaucracy in whitehall and there have been calls to deregulate the deregulators er, he is of course quite right that parkinson's theory can extend in this area and one can find that deregulation acquires a life and momentum erm of its own. +but the underlying purpose, that of reducing unnecessary bureaucracy, stripping away the red tape which hinders enterprise and good er governance in this country, is something that the government is very committed to and we intend to promulgate that doctrine throughout all the areas and that of course is being taken forward in legislation. +as far as er the honourable gentleman for edinburgh central is concerned, he said there was a case for a wider inquiry into the auditing o of companies, well that is not something specifically called for er by bingham although i acknowledge that a case can be made for that but i think we want to be extremely careful before extending that in the way that he and the honourable member for great grimsby proposed beyond the direct er responsibility to the members or the owners of the company. +it must be right for auditors to audit and for regulators to regulate and i do not think that it helps the argument for there to be an overlap in responsibilities and in some way, as i say, to turn auditors into snoopers and narks er er and make more supine one's er regulators. so i i i don't think that there's a case for er widening the er widened inquiry into the auditing of companies. -he said there was a case for extending the duty of care of auditors beyond members but this again was something that bingham didn't necessary find er necessary as a result of his inquiry into b c c i. +he said there was a case for extending the duty of care of auditors beyond members but this again was something that bingham didn't necessary find er necessary as a result of his inquiry into b c c i. he asked about what material significance meant. -that of course is very much set out in the guidelines of the er sta er statement on auditing er standards. -he asked about lloyds, he is quite right that that is not covered er by these orders but it is the case that it is a condition of the appointment of ordered, er of auditors into syndicates er that they shall report, they have a duty er to report er where these situations arise. +that of course is very much set out in the guidelines of the er sta er statement on auditing er standards. +he asked about lloyds, he is quite right that that is not covered er by these orders but it is the case that it is a condition of the appointment of ordered, er of auditors into syndicates er that they shall report, they have a duty er to report er where these situations arise. er, mr deputy speaker i don't have time to deal with the other points but if i've missed anything in particular i will write to honourable members concerned. can i just finally say that the whole import of the orders is to ensure that they look at the criteria of authorisation, they are concerned with the authorisation of firms which take public deposits and investments and when that is brought into question, when there is evidence to suggest that those criteria are not being adequately med it must be right to impose a non costly duty on the auditors to bring that about, that is what these orders do tonight, i think they're an extremely welcome addition to the stable of measures of regulation and they will improve materially depositor protection. motion number four the question is the motion on the order paper,say aye. aye. no. i think the ayes have it, the ayes have it. -the leader of the house will put amendments five to seven informally. +the leader of the house will put amendments five to seven informally. question is the motions on the order papers,say aye. aye no, i think the ayes have it, the ayes have it. -we then move to motion number eight mr secretary redwood to move it. -mr deputy speaker i beg to move that the local government finance report wales nineteen ninety four to ninety five house of commons paper number one six eight, which was laid before this house on the thirty first of january, be approved. +we then move to motion number eight mr secretary redwood to move it. +mr deputy speaker i beg to move that the local government finance report wales nineteen ninety four to ninety five house of commons paper number one six eight, which was laid before this house on the thirty first of january, be approved. this report sets out my decisions on the local government revenue settlement for nineteen ninety four five. -i understand it will be convenient to discuss at the same time the next motion on the order paper that the local government finance amendment report wales nineteen ninety three, ninety four, house of er in i in in in in inquiry. -the government feels this house on the thirty, thirty first of january be approved. -this latter one puts right a mistake in the description of the basis for distributing the distributable amount for ninety three four which was approved by the house on the eighth of february nineteen ninety three. +i understand it will be convenient to discuss at the same time the next motion on the order paper that the local government finance amendment report wales nineteen ninety three, ninety four, house of er in i in in in in inquiry. +the government feels this house on the thirty, thirty first of january be approved. +this latter one puts right a mistake in the description of the basis for distributing the distributable amount for ninety three four which was approved by the house on the eighth of february nineteen ninety three. i can assure the house that the amendment in this document does not affect the money authorities should received. mr deputy speaker, i announced my provisional settlement proposals to the house on the thirtieth of november last. i have given careful consideration to the representations i have received on the level of settlement and the views that the local authority associations in coming to my final decisions. i believe that my provisional proposals remain appropriate. -i propose to set total standard spending for nineteen ninety four, ninety five at two thousand seven hundred and four point eight million pounds. +i propose to set total standard spending for nineteen ninety four, ninety five at two thousand seven hundred and four point eight million pounds. this includes the sum of eighty six million for care in the community, it is an increase of four point two percent or over one hundred million pounds extra cash compared with nineteen ninety three, ninety four. -i thank the secretary of state for giving way, he he did say that erm er the figures in these report were in a sense provisional at the end of last year, erm but that he feels erm, with the passing of time, nothing has happened to change his view. -would he tell us then what he believes the impact of the er pay settlements will have on the spending he's allowed local authorities because it seems to me there must either be a cut in staff er and a cut in services if they're gonna keep within the the money that he made available at the time when he wasn't aware of these settlements. -mr deputy speaker i i'm grateful to the honourable gentleman for posing the central question and i hope in the course of my remarks i will satisfy the house, if not all labour members, that the settlement proposals are at is all to the good and delivered by councils throughout wales and that they offer enough money er to avoid sacking essential staff, certainly the offer enough money to avoid sacking any teacher who is needed in the classroom. +i thank the secretary of state for giving way, he he did say that erm er the figures in these report were in a sense provisional at the end of last year, erm but that he feels erm, with the passing of time, nothing has happened to change his view. +would he tell us then what he believes the impact of the er pay settlements will have on the spending he's allowed local authorities because it seems to me there must either be a cut in staff er and a cut in services if they're gonna keep within the the money that he made available at the time when he wasn't aware of these settlements. +mr deputy speaker i i'm grateful to the honourable gentleman for posing the central question and i hope in the course of my remarks i will satisfy the house, if not all labour members, that the settlement proposals are at is all to the good and delivered by councils throughout wales and that they offer enough money er to avoid sacking essential staff, certainly the offer enough money to avoid sacking any teacher who is needed in the classroom. i don't want to see that happen, i trust members of the house don't wish to see it happen. -it is up to local authorities, but i believe the extra grant, the extra spending permission, means that a good quality education can be delivered to children in wales er without it in any way being jeopardised by these proposals and i would illustrate later on in my speech that local government does have considerable flexibility to spend wisely and well and it has resources at its disposal to do a good job. +it is up to local authorities, but i believe the extra grant, the extra spending permission, means that a good quality education can be delivered to children in wales er without it in any way being jeopardised by these proposals and i would illustrate later on in my speech that local government does have considerable flexibility to spend wisely and well and it has resources at its disposal to do a good job. i give way. -secretary of state for giving way, but when he made his proni provisional announcement on the er on the total s s a for wales, was he aware that the er the various er salary review bodies would be bringing in a er a recommendation which was almost twice the current rate of inflation? -mr deputy speaker, no i did not know the exact amount of the recommendation but i of course assumed there was likely to be some pay increase and i have made an increase in grant which i am just about to explain to the house which will go some way to meet the requirements of local authorities and there are other assets and resources they have er which i will illustrate later on in my speech. +secretary of state for giving way, but when he made his proni provisional announcement on the er on the total s s a for wales, was he aware that the er the various er salary review bodies would be bringing in a er a recommendation which was almost twice the current rate of inflation? +mr deputy speaker, no i did not know the exact amount of the recommendation but i of course assumed there was likely to be some pay increase and i have made an increase in grant which i am just about to explain to the house which will go some way to meet the requirements of local authorities and there are other assets and resources they have er which i will illustrate later on in my speech. i propose to provide two thousand four hundred and nineteen point two million pounds in central government support towards this spending, an increase of three point three percent on nineteen ninety three, ninety four. so honourable members opposite will see that that is a good rate of increase compared with the current rate of inflation. the support package will comprise seventeen hundred and forty point one million pounds in revenue support grant. @@ -56273,7 +56223,7 @@ this modest increase, coupled with transitional arrangements announced in the bu about twenty thousand business rate payers who face the largest increases following the nineteen ninety revaluation, will benefit by five point three million pounds from the transitional changes. this mr deputy speaker, is a decent settlement for local government in wales. it gives local authorities an additional one hundred million pounds to spend when the low level of inflation is helping them keep down the cost of providing their services. -the eighty six million pounds i am providing for care in the community is an increase of almost fifty million pounds on nineteen build on the introduction of the service in ninety three, ninety four year. +the eighty six million pounds i am providing for care in the community is an increase of almost fifty million pounds on nineteen build on the introduction of the service in ninety three, ninety four year. since the nineteen ninety to ninety one settlement, revenue resources for local authorities have increased by almost five hundred and thirty million pounds or twenty seven percent. my provisional settlement proposals were met by some criticisms that they could lead to substantial increases in council tax levels, increases as high as fifteen percent were suggested. most local authorities have yet to set their budgets but i am glad to report to the house the press reports indicate a far more modest level of increase. @@ -56284,53 +56234,53 @@ on december the fourteenth i announced my provisional capping criteria. i will give careful consideration to local authority budgets and make my capping decisions in the light of all the information available to me when i've received it. i should like i if i may mr deputy speaker, to commend welsh billing authorities for their better than expected performance in collecting the council tax. they estimate an overall surplus on collection funds, of seventeen point six million as at the thirty first of march nineteen ninety four. -this translates into an average eighteen pounds reduction in council tax for a band e dwelling which could be passed on to council tax payers in their ninety four, ninety five bills or of course allows them more flexibility in their general financial planning. +this translates into an average eighteen pounds reduction in council tax for a band e dwelling which could be passed on to council tax payers in their ninety four, ninety five bills or of course allows them more flexibility in their general financial planning. local councillors have considerable flexibility in their budgeting. sums of money i am describing tonight are large, revenue and capital spending combined, of over three thousand million pounds is many times the amount spent by quangos in wales outside the health service and the grant represents a large share of my total budget for wales and i hope members opposite are not suggesting i should cut spending on health, that is a vital service which i thought they supported as well. flexibility is increased by the payment of rate support grant and distributable non-domestic rates as a block grant. it is then for local authorities to decide how to spend the money their given in line with their priorities and their local needs. council can raise income through fees and charges, they have balances which they can choose to spend or retain,they have assets which they can use for their service provision or they can sell to raise capital. -they have large administrations which they should always be looking to make more effective and in an area like education, there are surplus faces to be removed, energy to be used more efficiently and services to be contracted out if this can provide better value for local tax payers. +they have large administrations which they should always be looking to make more effective and in an area like education, there are surplus faces to be removed, energy to be used more efficiently and services to be contracted out if this can provide better value for local tax payers. i apologise for interrupting him. i wonder, he's no doubt aware of the quite serious problems facing the south wales police and the funding of the local authorities of the police. -is there any hope that he as secretary of state along with the home office minister, might get round a table with south wales police to sort the problems out because on the ground the seriousness is about the growing problems of crime and law and in fact the lack of in fact, policeman on the beat. -so i hope he will be able to accept this offer or request on behalf of many, many constituents of mine and i'm sure of others too. -mr deputy speaker i'm just about to come on the south wales police but i will answer the point directly, er i and my honourable friend the parliamentary secretary are always willing to discuss with local government, matters relating to local government finance and we have done so over the months leading up to this settlement and my honourable and right honourable friends in the home office are always willing to discuss matters on the police er where they are important and warrant a ministerial meeting and that again has happened recently with the home office min minister discussing this very issue. +is there any hope that he as secretary of state along with the home office minister, might get round a table with south wales police to sort the problems out because on the ground the seriousness is about the growing problems of crime and law and in fact the lack of in fact, policeman on the beat. +so i hope he will be able to accept this offer or request on behalf of many, many constituents of mine and i'm sure of others too. +mr deputy speaker i'm just about to come on the south wales police but i will answer the point directly, er i and my honourable friend the parliamentary secretary are always willing to discuss with local government, matters relating to local government finance and we have done so over the months leading up to this settlement and my honourable and right honourable friends in the home office are always willing to discuss matters on the police er where they are important and warrant a ministerial meeting and that again has happened recently with the home office min minister discussing this very issue. the last thing i want to see is local authorities skimping on the police. the budget problems of the south wales police have been much in the news. recently published audit commission profiles show that the south wales police expenditure per head of population is above average for comparable forces and more police are on duty than for similar forces. i trust that local authorities and the police authorities will make sensible decisions about future services. i think most of the issues that have been raised tonight already, are ones for the police authority and i hope they will get on with their job. where necessary police stations should be kept open and enough policemen should be made available for beat duties and for detection work, i give way. -wherever blame might lie as regards the situation with the south wales constabulary at the present time, surely it would be madness to merge gwent police force with the south wales police force at this unfortunate time because gwent has a very, very good record and we want it to stay like that. -er mr deputy speaker i i will make sure that the home office sees the transcript of this debate and i have noted the report the honour the matter the honourable gentleman has raised. -mr deputy speaker the last thing also that i wish to see is local authorities . +wherever blame might lie as regards the situation with the south wales constabulary at the present time, surely it would be madness to merge gwent police force with the south wales police force at this unfortunate time because gwent has a very, very good record and we want it to stay like that. +er mr deputy speaker i i will make sure that the home office sees the transcript of this debate and i have noted the report the honour the matter the honourable gentleman has raised. +mr deputy speaker the last thing also that i wish to see is local authorities . i'm most grateful to my right honourable friend er for giving way. -would he not agree er that the fact that erm the home office plan to give allow for seven million pounds extra er for the police budget in w in wales whereas in actual fact local government has chosen er to to give only two point two million er through the police budget er is a disgrace and reflects very badly on the running of the police authority and on the chairmanship of that committee. +would he not agree er that the fact that erm the home office plan to give allow for seven million pounds extra er for the police budget in w in wales whereas in actual fact local government has chosen er to to give only two point two million er through the police budget er is a disgrace and reflects very badly on the running of the police authority and on the chairmanship of that committee. mr deputy speaker my honourable friend is right that the allocation of budgets is a matter for the local authority and that is a matter for public debate er in the council chamber. thank you. of state therefore explain why in england it's prof possible to get a straight answer from the secretary of state with the figures of the s s a for the last five years, for this year and for next year and it's not possible to get that for wales either from the home secretary or from the honourable gentl right honourable gentleman. -mr deputy speaker, as the honourable members knows, our s s a calculations are on slightly different basis from england as we set out in this report and we do believe that local authorities should have the maximum flexibility to make their own decisions and it is therefore a matter for local debate. +mr deputy speaker, as the honourable members knows, our s s a calculations are on slightly different basis from england as we set out in this report and we do believe that local authorities should have the maximum flexibility to make their own decisions and it is therefore a matter for local debate. whether they value their police service enough or not and whether it needs more money or not to do a good job or whether the authorities should take a look at how it is being run. but mr deputy speaker i. -i i take it that honourable gentle right honourable gentleman is making an implicit criticism of his colleague the secretary of state of the environment er, er and the home secretary who has responsibility can produce figures for england. +i i take it that honourable gentle right honourable gentleman is making an implicit criticism of his colleague the secretary of state of the environment er, er and the home secretary who has responsibility can produce figures for england. he cannot produce them for wales, why is that? it's surely because the right honourable gentleman is not providing the money to welsh local authorities. here, here. mr deputy speaker,tha that was a fatuous point. -i've already answered the underlying question, i do believe that they should have the maximum discretion and then they should be answerable for their decisions to their local electors who want a good police service and want a good education service and there is money there for them to do it if that is their wish. -for the last thing i wish to see alongside skimping on the police is local authorities reducing the number of teachers where they are needed to teach pupils. +i've already answered the underlying question, i do believe that they should have the maximum discretion and then they should be answerable for their decisions to their local electors who want a good police service and want a good education service and there is money there for them to do it if that is their wish. +for the last thing i wish to see alongside skimping on the police is local authorities reducing the number of teachers where they are needed to teach pupils. because i am delighted to report that education standards in wales have been rising over the last few years following the introduction of the national curriculum and our other reforms. but as i said in a speech recently, we have a lot further to go, more progress to make and that is very much at the top of my agenda of, the agenda of my right honourable friend the education minister. local authorities in wales have reduced the level of rent arrears by over ten percent between nineteen ninety, ninety one and ninety two ninety three but there is more progress to be made. -since nineteen eighty seven the number of vacant local authority dwellings has also fallen and these are the cuts i do want, cuts in the number of empty houses, cuts in the rent arrears, cuts in the tax arrears so that the money is there to spend on the services that people want. +since nineteen eighty seven the number of vacant local authority dwellings has also fallen and these are the cuts i do want, cuts in the number of empty houses, cuts in the rent arrears, cuts in the tax arrears so that the money is there to spend on the services that people want. i am pleased to report that care in the community has in general, been successfully introduced. it is a good example of a major service being given to local government so that local rather than national democracy can determine the details of its future and how it flies in the face of the criticisms of the party opposite, that we're always taking important things away from local government. here is one of the fastest growing services in the public sector over the decade to come and we've entrusted local government with it. i give way. i'm very grateful, i'm very grateful to the secretary of state. -could he just make sure though that in his plans by defining community care and by by that i mean social care as opposed to health care, in a certain way. -what he might be doing is to actually seek to increase the proportion of our very vulnerable population into the means testing category and that what he's got to watch is that he doesn't end up in a position whereby defining health care in one way and social care very carefully. +could he just make sure though that in his plans by defining community care and by by that i mean social care as opposed to health care, in a certain way. +what he might be doing is to actually seek to increase the proportion of our very vulnerable population into the means testing category and that what he's got to watch is that he doesn't end up in a position whereby defining health care in one way and social care very carefully. health care will then be denied its proper role and that is clearly seen in the discharge of elderly people into the community and a point he knows well because he's heard it from me before, without the necessary disabled facilities being in place for those elderly people and it is his department that decided to put the disabled facilities grant in the basic credit allowance to compete against over local authority priorities in that section. why doesn't he put it back into the special credit allowance? mr deputy speaker, members opposite speak with forked tongues. @@ -56338,17 +56288,17 @@ they first of all say they want local government to be more responsible, to be m i, like the honourable member, happen to believe the point he's made is right, that this should be a high priority, the money is there for local government to do it, i've explicitly recognised the needs of the disabled in my settlement for next year by increasing it substantially and i hope local government will respond and do the decent thing. i want to see elderly people looked after well and if they can be looked after at home all well and good but of course they need the facilities. i give. -i i'm very grateful to the secretary of state, erm is he aware that increasingly over this winter there have been examples of homes for the elderly and particularly nursing homes in the private sector without casting a valued judgement on the role of the private sector, er homes that are finding difficulty in the filling the beds because of policy that is being pursued in care in the community. +i i'm very grateful to the secretary of state, erm is he aware that increasingly over this winter there have been examples of homes for the elderly and particularly nursing homes in the private sector without casting a valued judgement on the role of the private sector, er homes that are finding difficulty in the filling the beds because of policy that is being pursued in care in the community. does he realise that some of these homes er are perhaps have only half their beds full which means that there are vulnerable people there, uncertain as to whether their home, their only home is going to remain er in existence. can he give some assurances that there will be coherent planning to make sure that there are no vulnerable people er affected in this way, in the transition over to care in the community? -mr deputy speaker that's exactly what the authorities are asked to make sure about and of course they must have sensible plans so that there are always beds and facilities for those who need them, but in a way it's a success of care in the community that that more elderly people are being looked after in their own homes and so we've arrested the very rapid growth in permanent residential places which was occurring before the policy was introduced er, as we now see, despite some gloomy forewarning, local authorities have in general managed well in the first year of their responsibilities, they've examined thousands of cases and many people have been helped to make decisions about their own futures. +mr deputy speaker that's exactly what the authorities are asked to make sure about and of course they must have sensible plans so that there are always beds and facilities for those who need them, but in a way it's a success of care in the community that that more elderly people are being looked after in their own homes and so we've arrested the very rapid growth in permanent residential places which was occurring before the policy was introduced er, as we now see, despite some gloomy forewarning, local authorities have in general managed well in the first year of their responsibilities, they've examined thousands of cases and many people have been helped to make decisions about their own futures. many are able to continue living as they wish in their own homes. this has meant a fall in the demand for residential care which had been increasing rapidly in previous years and it is the duty of the relevant authorities to plan future provision er so that everything will work smoothly for those most in need. i trust local authorities will respond positively to this settlement. i believe in good local government. i believe that councils have an important role to play. i am disturbed if i learn of cases of alleges impropriety or irregularity in their financial performance or in their accounting. -i trust all parties in this house will unite, not only in believing in local government but in agreeing that local government should set and maintain the highest possible standards of conduct when spending the very substantial sums of money parliament votes to it. +i trust all parties in this house will unite, not only in believing in local government but in agreeing that local government should set and maintain the highest possible standards of conduct when spending the very substantial sums of money parliament votes to it. this settlement mr deputy speaker, is a large settlement. it is a good settlement in an area of low inflation. it gives local government in wales the money it needs to provide high quality services and to get on with the job. @@ -56359,51 +56309,50 @@ question is the motion on the order paper, mr ron davies. here, here. thank you very much mr deputy speaker. i think we've seen a a new model secretary of state this evening. -he er came to the despatch box and he talked about conciliation. -he said that he had taken into account the views of local authorities put to him since he met them last year, he might have taken in to account of course, we didn't accept any of the er er observations. -he commended er local authorities, he commended labour controlled local authorities for their collection rate of the council tax and for their collection rate of rents. -he actually praised the value of democratic local government and he compared that with his own quango state. -it really is er a new model secretary of state although the fact of the matter is mr deputy speaker, that er his reality of course is quite different from his and the reality is that this is a poor settlement for local government in wales and it's been roundly condemned, not least by the county councils, who is the largest employers in wales will have to face the considerable burden imposed on them by the government's acceptance of the public sector er review body recommendations but without the additional cash to meet those awards and what this settlement er does represent mr deputy speaker is a further step along the road that we've been travelling since nineteen seventy nine. +he er came to the despatch box and he talked about conciliation. +he said that he had taken into account the views of local authorities put to him since he met them last year, he might have taken in to account of course, we didn't accept any of the er er observations. +he commended er local authorities, he commended labour controlled local authorities for their collection rate of the council tax and for their collection rate of rents. +he actually praised the value of democratic local government and he compared that with his own quango state. +it really is er a new model secretary of state although the fact of the matter is mr deputy speaker, that er his reality of course is quite different from his and the reality is that this is a poor settlement for local government in wales and it's been roundly condemned, not least by the county councils, who is the largest employers in wales will have to face the considerable burden imposed on them by the government's acceptance of the public sector er review body recommendations but without the additional cash to meet those awards and what this settlement er does represent mr deputy speaker is a further step along the road that we've been travelling since nineteen seventy nine. the financing of local government is er again circumscribed, local government's ability to respond to the needs of the community it serves as it and its electors deem appropriate is being curtailed yet again and of course local government is losing its independence to central government and this centralising tendency which this settlement further represents is one of the most pernicious and corrosive characteristics of the modern conservative party. -it won't be lost on anyone concerned with the application of this settlement that despite the secretary of state's earlier remarks as the democratically controlled public sector, represented by local government, faces further cuts. -the undemocratic sector represented by the one hundred and eleven welsh quangos has seen budget increases. +it won't be lost on anyone concerned with the application of this settlement that despite the secretary of state's earlier remarks as the democratically controlled public sector, represented by local government, faces further cuts. +the undemocratic sector represented by the one hundred and eleven welsh quangos has seen budget increases. in the case of the major bodies the d b r w, the w g a and the c b d c of over eight percent. -i don't think either, given the succession of scandals and the aura of sleaze hanging over the secretary of state's quango sector that anyone would deny that in terms of value for money and financial probity, direct democratic control is a far better watchdog than the financial control systems of the welsh office. +i don't think either, given the succession of scandals and the aura of sleaze hanging over the secretary of state's quango sector that anyone would deny that in terms of value for money and financial probity, direct democratic control is a far better watchdog than the financial control systems of the welsh office. here, here. -the total standard spending of two thousand seven hundred and five million pounds is one hundred and five million pounds above the settlement for the current financial year. +the total standard spending of two thousand seven hundred and five million pounds is one hundred and five million pounds above the settlement for the current financial year. the secretary of state has argued that this is nearly a four percent increase. -in the stricter sense it is nearly a four percent increase but that statistic itself is absolutely meaningless. -in the current financial year budgets what authorities would have spend in delivering services, not what the welsh office consider they should spend, were two thousand six hundred and eighty eight million pounds and against that the next years settlement which we're debating tonight, represents only a point six percent increase. +in the stricter sense it is nearly a four percent increase but that statistic itself is absolutely meaningless. +in the current financial year budgets what authorities would have spend in delivering services, not what the welsh office consider they should spend, were two thousand six hundred and eighty eight million pounds and against that the next years settlement which we're debating tonight, represents only a point six percent increase. even that is not itself a true reflection of reality. -the current settlement, as the secretary of state indicated, includes provision for community care to the tune of eight six million pounds. +the current settlement, as the secretary of state indicated, includes provision for community care to the tune of eight six million pounds. that itself is some forty million pounds below the association of welsh counties assessment of what is actually needed to meet the needs of the community and it is in any event not available for general spending. -so if that figure is removed from the spending total the current increase is only two point three percent above the settlement for nineteen ninety three, ninety four and being twenty eight million pounds, or one percent, below the current years budgets actually represents a four percent real terms reduction and that is a measure of the cuts which the government this year wishes to force on local government. +so if that figure is removed from the spending total the current increase is only two point three percent above the settlement for nineteen ninety three, ninety four and being twenty eight million pounds, or one percent, below the current years budgets actually represents a four percent real terms reduction and that is a measure of the cuts which the government this year wishes to force on local government. under any circumstances this would be difficult enough but this year welsh local government has to suffer the commu the cumulative burden of previous years cuts. it also has to struggle with the social and economic consequences of the recession vested on the country by central government and of course it is expected this year to meet the costs of what is an unwanted and will be a costly and unsatisfactory reorganisation of local government. predictably, while the government with one hand is distorting their expenditure and creating unnecessary expense, it is with the other reducing the discretion available to councils to raise their own resources. the capping limits, unfair and arbitrary as they are, are again imposing a straight jacket. -all welsh counties for instance are limited to increasing their budgets of one point seven on point seven five percent over nineteen ninety three, ninety four are as the cities of cardiff and swansea and the borough of newport and it is this cap of one point seven percent as my honourable friend for cardiff south and penarth has pointed out, which is at the route of the funding problems of the south wales police authority area. -at the same time yes i i'll happily give way to the honourable gentleman. +all welsh counties for instance are limited to increasing their budgets of one point seven on point seven five percent over nineteen ninety three, ninety four are as the cities of cardiff and swansea and the borough of newport and it is this cap of one point seven percent as my honourable friend for cardiff south and penarth has pointed out, which is at the route of the funding problems of the south wales police authority area. +at the same time yes i i'll happily give way to the honourable gentleman. specific point of the south wales police authority's difficulties, would he not say that at least they're partly due to the police authority believing that it was going to be er underspending in the current year and being out in its calculations by about two million pounds, wouldn't you think that that was at least a factor? -well i i think that the honourable gentleman really must accept that er coming from a party which is er in office in er in the welsh office and has er two hundred million, two hundred and eight million pounds i think unaccounted for last year, it really ill becomes him er to lecture, to lecture anybody. -the fact of the matter is that er the fact of the matter is that there has been er a c cumulative problem of er of expenditure in the south wales police authority area stemming back to nineteen eighty eight and they have faced an under funding of thirty eight million pounds since that time. -they've had er enormous difficulties and er the honourable gentleman will er know that the south wales police authority committee, its officers and its chief constable have er visited parliament er to put their case to members representing the south wales police authority area and indeed to er earl ferrers the minister er responsible for the police and they certainly haven't had any er criticism made of them by his own government and if er he believes that there is a criticism i would suggest that he takes a leaf out of the book of his er, his right honourable friend the secretary of state and refers the matter so that it can be properly audited and er i think the honourable gentleman knows that when that is done he will see that there is no blame attached whatsoever to the members or the officers of the police authority. +well i i think that the honourable gentleman really must accept that er coming from a party which is er in office in er in the welsh office and has er two hundred million, two hundred and eight million pounds i think unaccounted for last year, it really ill becomes him er to lecture, to lecture anybody. +the fact of the matter is that er the fact of the matter is that there has been er a c cumulative problem of er of expenditure in the south wales police authority area stemming back to nineteen eighty eight and they have faced an under funding of thirty eight million pounds since that time. +they've had er enormous difficulties and er the honourable gentleman will er know that the south wales police authority committee, its officers and its chief constable have er visited parliament er to put their case to members representing the south wales police authority area and indeed to er earl ferrers the minister er responsible for the police and they certainly haven't had any er criticism made of them by his own government and if er he believes that there is a criticism i would suggest that he takes a leaf out of the book of his er, his right honourable friend the secretary of state and refers the matter so that it can be properly audited and er i think the honourable gentleman knows that when that is done he will see that there is no blame attached whatsoever to the members or the officers of the police authority. but i will give way if he wants to develop his point further. -is the honourable gentleman unaware that the district auditor has in fact indicated that there is a total lack of accountability or any sort of proper financial control in the police authority. +is the honourable gentleman unaware that the district auditor has in fact indicated that there is a total lack of accountability or any sort of proper financial control in the police authority. is he as the shadow spokesman for wales, unaware of that? -the er the honourable gentleman might well have seen a copy of the er the provisional report which has been prepared but that provisional report is er the same basis as the report er which was presented to er westminster city council er and then we weren't talking er a difficulty of er two million pounds created, created as a direct result of government under funding of the police authority there,we were talking about the expropriation of millions of pounds to line the pockets and to further the political interests of his party and i did notice the honourable gentleman er vociferous in his condemnation of westminster city council or any of the other tory controlled city councils. +the er the honourable gentleman might well have seen a copy of the er the provisional report which has been prepared but that provisional report is er the same basis as the report er which was presented to er westminster city council er and then we weren't talking er a difficulty of er two million pounds created, created as a direct result of government under funding of the police authority there,we were talking about the expropriation of millions of pounds to line the pockets and to further the political interests of his party and i did notice the honourable gentleman er vociferous in his condemnation of westminster city council or any of the other tory controlled city councils. but of course, of course is if there is any evidence whatsoever er of financial mismanagement in the police authority it is a matter which has to be properly investigated. -it has to be the subject of a proper report er by the er audit commission, but the district auditor and if they find that there has been er er wrong doing, if they find that there has been any er wilful neglect or if they find there has been any er unacceptable er maladministration then i will certainly join with the er the secretary of state in condemning that. +it has to be the subject of a proper report er by the er audit commission, but the district auditor and if they find that there has been er er wrong doing, if they find that there has been any er wilful neglect or if they find there has been any er unacceptable er maladministration then i will certainly join with the er the secretary of state in condemning that. but i of course have the advantage of being one who condemns that degree of maladministration whether it applies in the democratic sector or in the quango sector and unfortunately, unfortunately despite all the corruption, i i'll give way to the honourable gentleman if i could just er finish the point i'm making, unfortunately despite all the corruption and all the mismanagement and all the fraud for which the secretary of state is personally responsible as secretary of state. - -i'm going to ask professor lock if he would like to open on this er this matter and proceed policy to major exceptions etcetera. +i'm going to ask professor lock if he would like to open on this er this matter and proceed policy to major exceptions etcetera. how does that strike you? i was expecting a chance to get my papers organized. it's alright alright. thank you sir. -the erm i think the best way to er start on this er. +the erm i think the best way to er start on this er. sorry, david lock. -the best way to start on this dis section of this discussion may be to erm express the observation that the county council and at least one of the local authorities which is harrogate, erm are already engaged in have been engaged in for some time a very positive erm activity to try and attract to the county inward investment predicament that the economic development unit of the county council, the economic development of at of at least the one local authority that i have named and erm prospective developers such i'm representing today, share common predicament, is that the existing structure plan constructs some obstructions, erects some obstructions to the attraction of inward investment into the county. +the best way to start on this dis section of this discussion may be to erm express the observation that the county council and at least one of the local authorities which is harrogate, erm are already engaged in have been engaged in for some time a very positive erm activity to try and attract to the county inward investment predicament that the economic development unit of the county council, the economic development of at of at least the one local authority that i have named and erm prospective developers such i'm representing today, share common predicament, is that the existing structure plan constructs some obstructions, erects some obstructions to the attraction of inward investment into the county. existing structure plan in short is erm set out in such a way that it pos positively discourages the accommodation of inward investment on a large scale. it is in the shared interest of of the parties i'm describing that this county should be able to attract and accommodate er inward investment of strategic significance to help the people of this county find the due employment that they need. the difficulty we all share is how can one construct a planning framework which allows for strategically significant inward investment to be accommodated without declaring an open season of speculative proposals from developers and uncertainty at the local level up and down the county. @@ -56414,10 +56363,10 @@ looking through our own experience in other parts of britain and having read som and to set criteria for this strategic site exception policy which we feel should be added to the plan, to set this criteria in such a way that it would so point to the local authorities in the making of their local plans but it was clear that the policy did not provide a speculative opportunity for everybody any landowner throughout the county. the criteria that we have suggested in the paper we've put in for for the discussion session stems from detailed observation and experience of what inward investment of the strategically significant kind might be looking for. one of its most distinguished distinctive characteristics is the size of site which we know from experience which the county harrogate borough and ourselves at least have already here can be the order of magnitude of fifty hectares. -now almost by definition it's very very unlikely in this county that a site of that size development would be found within a built-up area. +now almost by definition it's very very unlikely in this county that a site of that size development would be found within a built-up area. but size is the first criteria it seems to me that one should be looking at. on location where what criteria might be used to guide location, i've said it's most unlikely to be found in a built-up area, but clearly close to good communications networks is important and must be within a reasonably short travel time of the national highway network. -and i'll volunteer suggested in for me in the paper as a criterion that it also ideally should in my opinion have a the potential for railway connection given the thrust of policy a decade two decades ahead of us. +and i'll volunteer suggested in for me in the paper as a criterion that it also ideally should in my opinion have a the potential for railway connection given the thrust of policy a decade two decades ahead of us. the next issue is that we know that these prospective inward investors are likely to be looking for a site in reasonably attractive setting. this is very difficult because it means er it is a potential threat as it were to the countryside of the county. so we're suggestion criterion which make it quite clear that such a strategic site should not under any circumstances be located in the national parks, areas of outstanding natural beauty, heritage coast, greenbelt and other specially designated areas of countryside protection. @@ -56434,9 +56383,9 @@ and i offer that as a idea for discussion. policies which no doubt david erm allenby will explain later of harrogate would suggest that harrogate borough is one in this county that feels it could accommodate a strategic site. there may be others, i'm guessing, presume that er mr hesel mr heselton is looking as though he might be welcoming of a strategic site given half a chance. the point i'm trying to get at sir is that erm it is none of it is in none of our interests, either the planning authorities or even of the developers, that if we were to erm find a strategic sites policy appropriate for this alteration, it's in none of our interests that it should be confusing to the public or to the development industry as to how rare a thing this should be and how tightly directed it should be in geographical terms. -criteria i've su criteria i've suggested narrows the geography pretty precisely but if you felt the need, the local authorities felt the need, for even further protection it does seem to me from my own experience of the nottinghamshire precedent it is possible if if you felt so inclined and the county was to agree you could narrow it even further by naming one or two erm local authorities such a site erm should be discovered. +criteria i've su criteria i've suggested narrows the geography pretty precisely but if you felt the need, the local authorities felt the need, for even further protection it does seem to me from my own experience of the nottinghamshire precedent it is possible if if you felt so inclined and the county was to agree you could narrow it even further by naming one or two erm local authorities such a site erm should be discovered. now that sets the general scene sir. -what i haven't done and i ought to because of the erm the way that this discussion has to unfold, i ought to say that pure few sentences about why should there be a strategic sites policy at all and erm i ought to put that on the record although it's pretty well trailed in all the paper work. +what i haven't done and i ought to because of the erm the way that this discussion has to unfold, i ought to say that pure few sentences about why should there be a strategic sites policy at all and erm i ought to put that on the record although it's pretty well trailed in all the paper work. and it it goes like this that the economy of north yorkshire generally and of some of its districts in particular has reached the point where it is not possible from internally generated growth to provide er the jobs that the residents . it is therefore necessary q e d for this county to be able to attract if it can some of the footloose investment which is available in britain and er generally in europe. to attract that inward investment to provide local jobs it's necessary for north yorkshire to have one or more sites which are as available and as attractive as competing locations. @@ -56461,13 +56410,13 @@ and sorry. a bit more about the the range of employment you would envisage on the sort of fifty hectare site that you've talked about. do you mean range in terms of numerical quantity or type or all sorts? -er oh all. +er oh all. please. certainly. the, i've forgotten what your first question was now . housing housing right. -the i'm not an economic development officer so the er breadth of the perspective i have is limited from market experience rather than from a broader overview. +the i'm not an economic development officer so the er breadth of the perspective i have is limited from market experience rather than from a broader overview. the market experience is that the inward investors of this scale on the strategic importance that we're discussing generally speaking generate no significant housing demands as part of their package. there may be a handful of key employees brought in by that company to the location to establish the plant erm and to erm recruit and run the work force but my experience of these inquiries and prospective inquiries is that generally speaking they are looking to recruit labour locally and so this is not a housing generator type of development. this is a job supplier type of development. @@ -56482,7 +56431,7 @@ this county is one that for quite a long time has had the policies, i think it's i i i eleven. thank you, in the existing structure plan. there's a there's a established prejudice against warehousing and distribution er developments in this county in the existing structure plan. -to be candid with you i would expect there to be, i'm certain, that there will be demand for er modern warehousing and logistic floor space of strategic scale strategic importance er in this county. +to be candid with you i would expect there to be, i'm certain, that there will be demand for er modern warehousing and logistic floor space of strategic scale strategic importance er in this county. and i know this presents the county council with some problems i don't know currently what the the local authorities' view on it is. but do let me say a couple of things about it. a subject i happen to know quite a bit about because we've got seven and a half million square feet erm in development at the moment in lutterworth at magna park. @@ -56491,14 +56440,14 @@ er modern logistics floor space will at the very least yield about a thousand jo er sorry getting all my digits in the wrong place. try and get it right. it is a hundred jobs per hundred thousand square feet, that's right. -and the reason why those job densities work like that is that modern logistics floor space comes brings with it typically an office element unit. +and the reason why those job densities work like that is that modern logistics floor space comes brings with it typically an office element unit. so you'll get a big erm warehouse erm which may be typically erm computer controlled, retrieval systems, storage, inventory, stock control and all the rest of it which will employ a certain number of people. but also with it comes erm office accommodation which is handling the clerical processing, ordering and so on of the business itself. and that is a relatively new phenomenon and the type of warehouse which historically we all knew which was men in brown coats driving forklift trucks is not what it's about, it's about er pretty sophisticated labour erm dealing with erm computer systems and electronic retrieval systems and often working in shifts on twenty four hour basis. now whether we would find in our strate if we were to have a strategic sites policy erm whether there's an issue there that it might let in as it were too much of that kind of land use and not enough of the manufacturing or proper office kind i think is worth kicking around the table. and if it is an issue as to whether there's some way of containing that. but i'll have to be very careful with it i i do expect, i would expect, that there would be inquiries for that kind of investment here erm it's just that we haven't any major ones in the last couple of years of that type because the overall framework here is opposed to it. -i suspect the answer to my first question is about numbers of jobs, by virtue of what you've just said as long as a piece of string. +i suspect the answer to my first question is about numbers of jobs, by virtue of what you've just said as long as a piece of string. would you like to hazard a guess about how long the string might be? on the number of jobs? well, if you'll just, if i'm allowed to turn round and consult the chap sitting behind me i can actually give you a direct a direct answer. @@ -56510,10 +56459,10 @@ on the basis of a hundred per hundred thousand square feet to which you'd have t yeah. per hectare. something like that. -i'm i'm embarrassed about that because +i'm i'm embarrassed about that because it's alright. the speech we had about job densities yesterday. -it obviously wasn't accidental that it worked out that way. +it obviously wasn't accidental that it worked out that way. yep. thank you. thank you. @@ -56528,7 +56477,7 @@ yes i what do you do in reaction to that? you're looking at mr potter do want him i'm just throwing it open. -because i don't think he wanted to be asked question as his first question . +because i don't think he wanted to be asked question as his first question . erm it it does like this sir that i would imagine that what what we're after here is a policy which would enable a local authority if it so wished to put into its local plan a strategic site. so that by the time so that when you're out catching elephants you've already got the the the planning story is straight already as part of your net is that i've got a planning yes. @@ -56536,7 +56485,7 @@ mr potter. erm david potter north yorkshire county council. er in fact you have anticipated one of the questions i was going to ask. are we talking here about the principle of major exceptions or are we actually talking about a site. -but the reason as it were was to address some of the issues er that professor lock has raised. +but the reason as it were was to address some of the issues er that professor lock has raised. and i think i need to place this issue of inward investment in its proper context in terms of the county council's economic development strategy and the planning strategy for the county. erm inward investment in terms of the county council's economic development strategy is recognized as important and i think professor lock quotes the economic development strategy. i have the strategy in front on me but i it also the strategy also places the economy of the county in in that context in so far as we're dealing with er the county of north yorkshire is reliant upon some twenty five thousand small businesses employing twenty five people or less and has only forty one firms serving one local market employing over three hundred people. @@ -56551,18 +56500,18 @@ can you can you submit that? i i can certainly. essentially what it's talking about it inward investment on small scale. inward investment which could be accommodated within the existing plans existing strategies on existing sites. -and in fact at the greenbelt plan inquiry er er i i spent a considerable amount of time arguing on the issue of prestige sites and the availability of prestige sites within the greater york area already planned and available. +and in fact at the greenbelt plan inquiry er er i i spent a considerable amount of time arguing on the issue of prestige sites and the availability of prestige sites within the greater york area already planned and available. er i think the county council recognizes the role of inward investment but that it is a small part of the ec economic growth. -in fact the revised economic development strategy which professor lock probably doesn't have a copy of, refers to inward inward investment as being desirable erm and is of critical importance but whilst it will be vigorously sort in this way it has to be said that the bulk of north yorkshire suffers from a relative lack of financial incentives from central government in terms of whose regional policy does not have a priority. +in fact the revised economic development strategy which professor lock probably doesn't have a copy of, refers to inward inward investment as being desirable erm and is of critical importance but whilst it will be vigorously sort in this way it has to be said that the bulk of north yorkshire suffers from a relative lack of financial incentives from central government in terms of whose regional policy does not have a priority. even when north yorkshire sites have been short-listed by an investor on quality grounds the county has had no means of matching the financial incentives elsewhere. and i think the er inward investors that professor lock is referring to in terms of the german car manufacturer er the information that we have is that those were the very factors they considered and erm north yorkshire is not short- listed. erm we have not perceived that inward investment of this scale is required or that the economic structure of the county could support such a major investment. it is based on small firms. -and i look at issues much broader that the sites availability. +and i look at issues much broader that the sites availability. availability of labour erm the structure of the labour force. now in terms of harrogate for example that is largely focused on erm on the office commercial sector. there is no obviously er pool of manufacturing labour or erm strong manufacturing base sufficient to support a firm coming in and and taking up these large quantities of land. -i mean why should this be in there'd be a strategic sites policy. +i mean why should this be in there'd be a strategic sites policy. it's it's not necessarily possible to generate jobs from with within its own boundaries. i mean the focus of the plan and the way we've approached erm trying to identify the appropriate level of of land takes into account all that we considered to be the needs of the local economy. and i think this inward investment that professor lock is referring to and the scale of investment that he is referring to must be considered as additional and and would draw in additional jobs. @@ -56587,7 +56536,7 @@ and a key in all of this and professor lock er mentioned is why should we have e and in that i can only speak for the harrogate district erm but the situation may well apply to other districts. yesterday professor lock referred to to harrogate's bubble having burst. erm indeed over the last two or three years the borough council's become extremely concerned at the deteriorating economic situation within the district and particularly around harrogate itself. -the current in harrogate's case significant number of major job losses and we we estimate that those amount to between three and four thousand jobs, er many of which we feel are still to come through the system and are therefore not reflected in unemployment figures of yet. +the current in harrogate's case significant number of major job losses and we we estimate that those amount to between three and four thousand jobs, er many of which we feel are still to come through the system and are therefore not reflected in unemployment figures of yet. the result of all this has been a rapid rise in in registered unemployment er nevertheless and a steep rise in in long term unemployment. and particularly of concern to us an adverse structural shift in various employment sectors. and the borough council has responded to this situation by adopting a number of policy objectives including the one which seeks to attract appropriate inward investment projects. @@ -56621,10 +56570,10 @@ same sort of feel that mr allenby's been dealing with? yeah. terry heselton selby district. erm i'm in i'm in some difficulty because this is this is a matter that's arisen since the original matters er matters for discussion were drawn up so i'm not able to give you the formal views of the council in that respect. -but it it might be worth if if i outline my own office view +but it it might be worth if if i outline my own office view well let me have your professional view. right well yes that's what i was about to do. -erm well as i've as i've in my submission i i think we can give qualified support for the proposal that erm harrogate have put on the table. +erm well as i've as i've in my submission i i think we can give qualified support for the proposal that erm harrogate have put on the table. i'll come as no surprise to you that er what's been suggested would be consistent with the sorts of arguments that that i put forward yesterday. erm going back to to my point that the existing development plan system hasn't served selby district particularly well. and picking up professor lock's point erm we are certainly in the market to attract footloose investment. @@ -56643,7 +56592,7 @@ erm where i have to qualify my my support is is, and and i do particularly want because clearly an increase in in in the allocation sends a much stronger signal to potential investors and it carries with it a greater degree of certainty as far as the district council's concerned, as far as potential investors are concerned. and also of course as a far as local people are concerned. the implication -so sorry can i just ask, so in effect you haven't shifted your ground from the view which you expressed in paragraph three point six of your submission where you've just confirmed in fact that you'd rather have a proper or the ability to make a sort of proper measured allocations, part of which would make provision or allow the facility to cater for major inward investment? +so sorry can i just ask, so in effect you haven't shifted your ground from the view which you expressed in paragraph three point six of your submission where you've just confirmed in fact that you'd rather have a proper or the ability to make a sort of proper measured allocations, part of which would make provision or allow the facility to cater for major inward investment? er terry heselton selby district. well,another way of putting it is that this might be an additional er policy that that would help us as well as er yep. @@ -56660,7 +56609,7 @@ professor lock will no doubt correct me if i'm wrong but from memory in neither it may be, but i can't remember, that both of them preceded section fifty four a. was that true at lutterworth? i'm i'm not competent on, er david lock, i'm not competent on toyota. -erm all i have is the layman's knowledge that it was a gift to edwina curry's constituency . +erm all i have is the layman's knowledge that it was a gift to edwina curry's constituency . er erm and i don't think it had a planning history. the the erm situation for lutterworth er magna park however i i am familiar with and it certainly preceded section fifty four a and erm in in there were two phases. er the first of erm er three three million square feet, second of four and a half, and erm the er in both cases it triggered the call-in procedure under the departure and in both cases er a public inquiry had to be held er or the secretary of state chose to call a public inquiry. @@ -56673,7 +56622,7 @@ erm the difference is that erm it a magna park is specifically an exclusively ra erm the land is a disused airfield required very cheaply so there was no great exposure in getting that site away and its first occupiers were the company that had bought it and asda did their own buildings to begin with for their own use. what we're talking about here is a is a different circumstance where the erm competition for inward investment up here further north is more intense. a number of erm elephants coming into view is fewer. -there are fewer elephants about up here erm and er the issue that obviously concerns me from the development point of view is the is the time scale, is the process rather, that that the planning policy would im would imply. +there are fewer elephants about up here erm and er the issue that obviously concerns me from the development point of view is the is the time scale, is the process rather, that that the planning policy would im would imply. and sorry, while i'm speaking i'm i'm left a little confused. when you heard me i was imagining a process whereby you'd have a strategic sites policy in the structure plan which would enable a local authority in preparing its local plan if it wished to identify a strategic site and that would then become in the local plan, you know subject to all those consultation processes, and then it's part of the portfolio that is available in the published arena with a statutory framework behind it. erm david allenby didn't talk like that. @@ -56684,7 +56633,7 @@ erm my starting point on all of that is the development issues report that erm w and the conclusion of that is we go for a criteria based approach for the time being, see see what the response was to that er and nothing was said about identifying the site as such. i think the difficulty with taking a a site approach is that it's difficult erm to assess what the employment benefits are of something that you're not sure about. erm now it may be that on a particular site erm conditions could be laid down to ensure and secure that there were significant employment benefits accruing from the development of that site. -but what we had in mind in looking at this through the the local plan was that er we'd be looking at specific end users to see what the benefits were of those those end users and to assess those benefits against any environmental harm that there would be and strategy as a whole. +but what we had in mind in looking at this through the the local plan was that er we'd be looking at specific end users to see what the benefits were of those those end users and to assess those benefits against any environmental harm that there would be and strategy as a whole. so i think erm there is there is a difference between us in all of that, but that needn't necessarily mean that we won't identify a site in the future. can i take it from what you said professor lock that you would envisage this policy as providing for b one b two and b eight development? yes. @@ -56709,11 +56658,11 @@ in other words it would have to be job beneficial, it would have to be of strate but i think i had imagined it would it would allow, if it was wanted, it would allow i eleven to be overridden it would be one of the things it would be an exception to. i think potentially professor lock you could be inventing some work for barristers given that policy i eleven says provision will not be made. it does doesn't it? -but then if we're exempting ex exceptions policy except as maybe provided an exception policy number seven . +but then if we're exempting ex exceptions policy except as maybe provided an exception policy number seven . . i can i can see the the trap here. erm it maybe that in this alteration the erm it's worth just spending a minute on whether b eight should just be kept out of the frame for the moment and it's something that gets dealt with at a later time when more policies are in play. -can i ask would that seriously if it were limited or by virtue of the panel report having identified this problem we reported that we saw a problem if it included b eight, would that be a problem from the point of view either harrogate or selby if b eight was in effect, if not in the policy itself, excluded? +can i ask would that seriously if it were limited or by virtue of the panel report having identified this problem we reported that we saw a problem if it included b eight, would that be a problem from the point of view either harrogate or selby if b eight was in effect, if not in the policy itself, excluded? david allenby harrogate borough council. erm perhaps i could answer that chairman by saying that the policy i've suggested from the humberside structure plan would er would i think cover that er problem in that it starts off by saying, proposals for industry and commerce that are not in accordance with the relevant policies of this plan will not normally be permitted. and then put special provision for very large projects. @@ -56729,7 +56678,7 @@ i eleven sorry yes. yes it's not it's not absolutely exclusive. mr broughton. thank you chairman. -as i said this morning doesn't oppose er in principle the idea of of of er an exceptions policy. +as i said this morning doesn't oppose er in principle the idea of of of er an exceptions policy. but er looking at er professor lock's suggestion and the criterion that is set out there i think er a number of people might be interested to have a go at those criteria so to speak. and certainly from erm my department's point of view we would be looking for er an inclusion of a criterion on the need to avoid higher quality agricultural land. that's it. @@ -56804,10 +56753,10 @@ and i really do question whether the potential benefits of such such an exceptio i tend to think that it should really be left outside the development plan process and it should be for individual developers to prove exceptional needs. that way it can be dealt with through the departure process and the checks and balances the departure er introduces erm are in place erm to to protect local interest. do you want to come back on something or can i ask professor lock to -well it was really er, ken williamson of north yorkshire. +well it was really er, ken williamson of north yorkshire. it was really er the point er mr allenby made. it seems to me that what we're talking about here is harrogate's land allocation being, not necessarily an i five, but sixty hectares which he agreed was adequate for i five yesterday, plus i suspect another fifty which would be a strategic site. -although there may be differences between er professor lock's approach and harrogate's superficially i think the the mutual objective seems to be er between the two strategic site within the development plan in harrogate district and on the access one site of the a one a fifty nine junction. +although there may be differences between er professor lock's approach and harrogate's superficially i think the the mutual objective seems to be er between the two strategic site within the development plan in harrogate district and on the access one site of the a one a fifty nine junction. could i check out i i mean i'm still not sure whether harrogate are happy with sixty hectares at i five to meet their requirements, that was what i understood yesterday. are we talking about another fifty hectares really to add on to that? not necessarily as i five but as another fifty hectares as industrial or employment land whatever you'd like to call it. @@ -56821,7 +56770,7 @@ thank you. professor lock. sir. erm er four or five points. -er the contribution to the discussion made by mr jewitt of hambleton erm is a necessary contribution but it really doesn't fit or sit well with the economic circumstances of other parts of the county. +er the contribution to the discussion made by mr jewitt of hambleton erm is a necessary contribution but it really doesn't fit or sit well with the economic circumstances of other parts of the county. i don't know about hambleton but erm talking in er erm on high ground about conservation and so on erm is very difficult when a local authority is faced with structural change in its economic base and major unemployment. i mean that is a serious social and political issue to which there should be in my submission a planning response. we can't just ignore it erm it is proper planning to try and do something about it. @@ -56843,7 +56792,7 @@ in other words it's not part of its standard employment allocation but it's put erm that zoning that allocation in a local plan backed by this erm er er policy in the structure plan would be enough in my judgement to enable the economic development people to actually capture the, get the elephant in the trap. but indeed it is not planning permission. because that elephant is going to probably require an environmental assessment or environmental statement erm and there would be infinite numbers of details to tie up in section one o sixes and goodness knows what else specific to that user or users, those users when they the came in the frame. -but unless you've erm got the certainty from the planning framework point of view that subject to those important details its planning permission is deliverable, then the elephant will go somewhere else. +but unless you've erm got the certainty from the planning framework point of view that subject to those important details its planning permission is deliverable, then the elephant will go somewhere else. there is a restaurant in my home town, as i guess there is in many, called something special. i have eaten there once and came away describing it as something not very special. how, picking up on the terms you use professor lock, how would the policy guarantee that what this elephant was special? @@ -56911,7 +56860,7 @@ they they've looked at erm housing and er industrial development, er i wasn't at and er with the exceptions policy erm how many exceptions would we allow? i mean we're told that these erm types of development are few and far between. er supposing the economy did take off erm we used up all the industrial land that er had been allocated to the districts. -er which took care of all the the local needs, reduced unemployment, er and we have a lot of these exceptions coming forward. +er which took care of all the the local needs, reduced unemployment, er and we have a lot of these exceptions coming forward. er do we then have a situation where the county's strategy's significantly undermined? we attract a lot of new housing er requirements for new housing development er commuting is patterns have significantly changed. erm i just feel it's er it's a dangerous policy. @@ -56924,18 +56873,18 @@ alright yep. erm that i think wouldn't be the case. if if er i five sites have been taken up and employment needs of districts have been addressed and the county in general have been addressed, then er an inward investment wouldn't provide or offer substantial proven employment benefits. those benefits don't need aren't there because there is employment. -so that that consideration would be waived in the balance and clearly erm it wouldn't be right to those sort of developments. +so that that consideration would be waived in the balance and clearly erm it wouldn't be right to those sort of developments. i don't i don't there is a is a problem in that respect. thank you. . sharon watson craven district council. er i think from craven's point of view erm we couldn't really see any justification for a strategic exceptions policy in craven's case. -erm craven's economic development strategy is based on growth amongst small local businesses erm and we have very few large employers. +erm craven's economic development strategy is based on growth amongst small local businesses erm and we have very few large employers. erm mos mostly our economic base is through small businesses and that's where we see er the future growth of employment needs being satisfied. erm i perhaps do have some sympathy for harrogate's position. erm they perceive a need for this policy, er they have a a perceived structural changes in their economy and er there is resultant fear erm that perhaps they would not be able to respond flexibly enough er with the policies that are in place and see a need for this additional one. from a purely selfish point of view, if the policy were to indicate specific areas of the county erm where this policy would er be appropriate and would apply erm and as long as it excluded craven , then i think -clearly you know we've er it being in. +clearly you know we've er it being in. how however, i mean from a a broader point of view i think i would have some general reservations as have been confessed previously by mr earle and and mr jewitt. erm but i do have some sympathy with harrogate's position and indeed selby's position er to some extent. but certainly in the craven context i do not feel there is any justification for this policy. @@ -56959,7 +56908,7 @@ perhaps if we if we looked a little at humberside's experience. erm to the best of my knowledge erm policy e four has been utilized only one since this structure plan was approved in in nineteen eight seven er enabling erm one the districts and myself back to the humber to to acquire an an international erm company. erm but it hasn't to the best of my knowledge it has not resulted in a rash of of developments and motorway intersections. i i quite accept the the m eighteen m sixty two is not the the a one or the m one. -erm but erm i i merely pose it as as an indication that erm it is possible for local authorities to erm not open the door to development, speculative development, er if they do not wish to do so erm because it does not ride override existing structure plan policies. +erm but erm i i merely pose it as as an indication that erm it is possible for local authorities to erm not open the door to development, speculative development, er if they do not wish to do so erm because it does not ride override existing structure plan policies. erm others have have suggested that it could be handled through the existing . if if a major proposal came along and the local authority wan district wanted to grasp it with both hands they could use the er existing erm development plan process to do so. erm even if it was contrary to existing erm adopted local plan. @@ -56981,7 +56930,7 @@ thank you sir. thank you. mr rudd do you want to come back on something? erm i didn't but i i shall. -if you leave it long enough you get picked on. +if you leave it long enough you get picked on. obviously. julian rudd ryedale district council. in in not supporting the application of such a policy to ryedale district, i'm not by any means saying that the district council would never support erm such elephants as er as have been referred to. @@ -56996,7 +56945,7 @@ it is er chairman. er ken williamson north yorkshire. it's in response to mr allenby's question we seem to be patiently waiting for i think he posed it some time ago about the county council's view on whether in the absence of a strategic exceptions policy or whatever you call it, a major exceptions policy in the structure plan, whether the county council would object to it being pursued in the in the local plan. chairman i think er i don't think we've got any any option but to say yes we we would. -i think at er the sort of level of development and the location implications of er such a strategic exception, fifty hectares in some location which was totally outside the context of approved locational policy, this would represent a significant element of really nonconformity with the plan. +i think at er the sort of level of development and the location implications of er such a strategic exception, fifty hectares in some location which was totally outside the context of approved locational policy, this would represent a significant element of really nonconformity with the plan. i think we'd have to have to make our views known on that. chairman i'd just david allenby harrogate borough council. i'd just like to come back on that because i'm referring here to erm county council paper n y seven which was er relating to the i five i twelve issues we were issuing yesterday. @@ -57013,7 +56962,7 @@ they see that their i five allocation is sufficient. er but we acknowledge that over time circumstances may change and that it may be appropriate and such circumstances erm needs may change different circumstances may arise and they would have to be dealt with within the strategic planning framework. erm if at some time in the future a local plan picked up a change in circumstances and made a cogent argument inn favour of varying from the strategic framework, we would have to consider that on its merits. the elephant analogy arose because most of us all of us recognize an elephant when we see one but it is very difficult to describe it -and mr potter has gone some way to acknowledging that in saying that the circumstances may change. +and mr potter has gone some way to acknowledging that in saying that the circumstances may change. however if this undefined elephant arises, bearing in mind the time the development planning process takes, is it reasonable to think that the elephant would wait around long enough for that to happen? we i i think we we discussed this briefly earlier in terms of erm if a proposal came forward it was perfectly within the remit of the applicant to make a planning application and to argue that circumstances had changed. erm and there was nothing within the development plan system which would preclude this. @@ -57039,7 +56988,7 @@ i i that hasn't been made clear and erm you you then end up with getting down to bearing in mind that this is i suppose now going to be one of the performance indicators er that local authorities have got to er publish every year. er so in other words it it muddies the water and it seems to me that it's quite unnoted because it be suggesting a policy which is to counteract the effect of erm section fifty four a. in other words trying to restore the status quo er the status er that that that existed before section fifty four a er and and restoring flexibility that was perceived to exist then. -now it does occur to me to wonder and i, again a personal view, to wonder whether intended that section fifty four a should be counteracted by the terms of the policies that followed it. +now it does occur to me to wonder and i, again a personal view, to wonder whether intended that section fifty four a should be counteracted by the terms of the policies that followed it. do you want to answer that one mr saunders? i think the number of er er ex i think the fact that this is merely an exception a major exceptions policy that deals only with exceptional cases and the the humberside structure plan refers to possibly once or twice over a planned period erm might er indicate it's not intended to open to subvert section fifty four a. as for er as for departures, a strategic context in terms of a structure plan policy erm that allows for major exceptions will must surely assist in in considering any application that comes forward as a as a departure under under . @@ -57067,7 +57016,7 @@ yeah. afternoon and i was going to ask you to sort of sum up with your views as the sort of i'm very willing to do progenitor of this er -if you're feeling the moment +if you're feeling the moment particular animal and then ask mr williamson to or mr potter to conclude for the county. thank you i'm very happy to do that. david lock. @@ -57095,7 +57044,7 @@ i referred sir at the beginning to er the limited experience i've had in notting and i pointed you sir to the fact that in that county at least they found that to further contain it it helped to name districts. what i hadn't expected was the reaction we got here today which is that erm whilst there are smiling dis , he's smiling now, there are smiling districts who might be pleased to be named as areas in which a major exception might be accommodated and i hadn't expected the others would like a bit of it if there was one going too. so this all suggests to me that the establishment of fierce criteria could make this a very rare exception is the key and erm i think we've had it in the course of the discussion, it'll now be on the record, erm an exploration of the kind of criteria those could be. -and erm you've got that harrogate goes into it in some detail. +and erm you've got that harrogate goes into it in some detail. but erm my closing remarks we be these sir that the the actual reality is that north yorkshire and some of its districts want and deserve inward investment. the present planning policy framework frustrates that objective and an enabling policy framework is now required. a legitimate moment to to put it in place. @@ -57135,17 +57084,16 @@ i'm also particularly grateful for, and i said yesterday, to our two friends in i'm grateful to north yorkshire and through you to the strensall people for the arrangements and the use of the village hall and i think i must commend mr whipp for his fortitude through the last week or so. because even if he wasn't participating he was sitting listening. thank you very much. -chairman before before you do finally er pack your bag and zoom off back to wherever it is you're going, could i on behalf of the county council and all of our participants here today and those who've been around in the last fortnight thank you and miss whittaker and your assistant able assistants er mrs binns and dave in the programme office for the sterling work they've done. +chairman before before you do finally er pack your bag and zoom off back to wherever it is you're going, could i on behalf of the county council and all of our participants here today and those who've been around in the last fortnight thank you and miss whittaker and your assistant able assistants er mrs binns and dave in the programme office for the sterling work they've done. and for making the e i p erm an interesting and er fortnight and i think er commending on the way that you er and your colleagues have handled it er all the way through and er we hope that er at the end of the day we'll get something back from you fairly quickly which er we'll act upon. i won't promise thank you very much chairman. i shan't promise before christmas.. - hiya. hello. oh oh here comes the monster. here comes the monster. -well miss come and have your head cut off. +well miss come and have your head cut off. erm she's got asthma. right. @@ -57171,11 +57119,11 @@ ears that's a no. your brains ears. -i was thinking +i was thinking and your nose. getting ears. -her vaccinated +her vaccinated and your nose. let's have a look in your nose. see what's going on in here. @@ -57194,7 +57142,7 @@ told that i was trying to get an appointment at the asthma clinic but they could right? mhm. yeah. -so +so she's, she's,sh she's got sinus sinuses. but this cough @@ -57220,15 +57168,15 @@ i would like oh. we will. to be referred to -erm -doctor +erm +doctor . but i saw a doctor there, a doctor , mhm. -he was excellent before christmas. +he was excellent before christmas. she had a whoop whooping cough. mhm. -and he did say to me he would like to have seen her again at and monitor this, this +and he did say to me he would like to have seen her again at and monitor this, this mhm. er cough that she's got. now i thought i would quite like to @@ -57237,11 +57185,11 @@ get her referred there again. cos yes. she was there a couple of years ago, two or three years ago. -but i was pus pushing and p pulling of course i never saw the same doctor twice. +but i was pus pushing and p pulling of course i never saw the same doctor twice. but now i feels as if i've got a sh a name of a doctor aha. er out there. -we'll soon get that +we'll soon get that if you don't mind. mm. and you wouldn't like your head cut off? @@ -57282,7 +57230,7 @@ aye. you're right. shouldn't she? you're right. -they and they're and they're guzzling they're fighting with each other and oh. +they and they're and they're guzzling they're fighting with each other and oh. right. i'm not the only one they've all got this cold haven't they? it's . @@ -57299,7 +57247,7 @@ are you sure you're not kidding me on? i i promise. er could you give me a prescription for calpol? mhm. -er put your jacket on . +er put your jacket on . thanks. oh. could you tear this? @@ -57307,7 +57255,7 @@ shall i show you the big needle? for freezing yeah. your tongue? -this here. +this here. great big long one. oh. here we are. @@ -57317,9 +57265,9 @@ no. no . today? no. -we, well you could send +we, well you could send direct to the house. -well we'd send +well we'd send yeah. alright. . @@ -57329,12 +57277,11 @@ thank you. bye. goodbye mrs . bye. - that will be val. er i think they have changed contractors. again? again. -but anyway whether that's true or not the this was a s s seems to be as a result of +but anyway whether that's true or not the this was a s s seems to be as a result of criticism about them not turning up and this sort of thing. erm hi. @@ -57342,23 +57289,23 @@ sorry i'm late so i had a long chat with the, with the cleansing officer and the main point i know, i know. liz, do you want a chair? -the main point that i made to him was that after such a superb beginning where, where they actually state how much rubbish we produce, there's absolutely no mention even though there's space at the bottom there's no mention of recycling at all. +the main point that i made to him was that after such a superb beginning where, where they actually state how much rubbish we produce, there's absolutely no mention even though there's space at the bottom there's no mention of recycling at all. and he said well it's a different, you know different department. mm. i know yes -and this was, this, that, that wouldn't have entered into that brief but my argument was that, you know everybody would be much happier if there was less rubbish to put in the landfill sites in the first place. +and this was, this, that, that wouldn't have entered into that brief but my argument was that, you know everybody would be much happier if there was less rubbish to put in the landfill sites in the first place. now that was about two weeks ago and i've been sitting on it meaning to, to write to the press and say how disgusting it was. which i have just done today. aft , no yes, half way through i spoke to to the environ environment officer mm -who was much more switched on. +who was much more switched on. he's a new environment officer, he's only been there for a month or something. -and he says that erm. +and he says that erm. he sort of agreed with me that it was a waste of an opportunity. erm but he did say that he's actually writing a leaflet which they can run to seven or eight pages. a detailed one about recycling. -anybody will read so eight pages. +anybody will read so eight pages. well i don't know. i just don't know. but i mean he was very interested and when i said that we'd actually done a recycling directory and that i was thinking @@ -57375,13 +57322,13 @@ i mean he knows that we have a recycling d . i was in touch with them. i sent them the recycling. why do they pretend not to know? -i mean they should be fully a aware of of of our +i mean they should be fully a aware of of of our val well this is a new guy. is that mr ? mr? . the recycling officer. -is that, is the one, i wrote to +is that, is the one, i wrote to hold on . there. ? @@ -57390,8 +57337,8 @@ is that the one you spoke to? tom . yeah. that's him . -only he said that they were gonna get an initiative through the schools on er -is is +only he said that they were gonna get an initiative through the schools on er +is is he's the one anyway that's that's my letter. draft letter which i have not got, it's very very rough, for the press. @@ -57404,7 +57351,7 @@ what? cooking oil. cooking oil? yeah. -if you have got one of those deep fat fryers you, you have quite a bit to throw away. +if you have got one of those deep fat fryers you, you have quite a bit to throw away. well don't put it in water. no, i don't. i don't. @@ -57415,8 +57362,8 @@ no not cooking oil. er pet , car oil . car oil. that's a totally different story. -i'm sure -but i mean the bottom bit obviously we've got to talk about whether we actually do want +i'm sure +but i mean the bottom bit obviously we've got to talk about whether we actually do want bifocals today new. . but this guy seems to be well worth nurturing. @@ -57424,20 +57371,20 @@ yes. here you are. it says here oh that's waste oil cooking fat and other liquids. i know it says fat collection but i -well that only should only be because erm the bin's going to be soiled. -in in in in the end terribly smelly that's the reason. +well that only should only be because erm the bin's going to be soiled. +in in in in the end terribly smelly that's the reason. i mean why there shouldn't be cooking oil in in in landfill. i mean -dad +dad dad's not in mm -i can only think that i mean it sticks to the sides of the bin at the bottom +i can only think that i mean it sticks to the sides of the bin at the bottom well if it's if it was very hot could it could it melt the plastic? it could even melt the plastic yes. or could it ignite? yeah. -no i i definitely foodstuffs out of the water. -i mean into the bin first and then wash the dishes. +no i i definitely foodstuffs out of the water. +i mean into the bin first and then wash the dishes. to keep the water clean. mm. stuff you put in water. @@ -57448,59 +57395,59 @@ it doesn't say does it? well it doesn't say, no i think, i think they put recycled if it was don't you? well exactly that's -you seen that story, what is it, one paper er if you get the letter of the week you can take part in the draw and get a flight to from stanstead to dusseldorf. +you seen that story, what is it, one paper er if you get the letter of the week you can take part in the draw and get a flight to from stanstead to dusseldorf. wh what paper's this then? -i i got it last night . -there was the most horrible letter in england or britain joining the common market . +i i got it last night . +there was the most horrible letter in england or britain joining the common market . i'll get you one of those bags. -no oh you did tell me about it +no oh you did tell me about it yeah i did tell you. -do you, well do you then know why doesn't, isn't rob in touch with them any more? +do you, well do you then know why doesn't, isn't rob in touch with them any more? oh yeah, very much so. i spoke to trish, rob's away at the moment yeah. -but i spoke to trish tonight. +but i spoke to trish tonight. and erm -but i mean he's also in the sub committee isn't he? +but i mean he's also in the sub committee isn't he? there was this working committee wasn't it and then the sub committee to the working committee on environmental matters. -no, yeah but i mean that leaflet very likely wouldn't have you know i mean i think this this leaflet +no, yeah but i mean that leaflet very likely wouldn't have you know i mean i think this this leaflet no no but but that this mr mr , yeah but i mean -didn't know +didn't know okay he should, he should have tapped us as a resource certainly. yeah. -but i mean you know i i'm certainly gonna follow this up. +but i mean you know i i'm certainly gonna follow this up. mm. and i think we ought to get him over to one of our meetings. -and and he said he would. -and i think if we could make it get one of the uttlesford chaps to the same meeting +and and he said he would. +and i think if we could make it get one of the uttlesford chaps to the same meeting marvellous thing they did. yeah. -well what he did say was don't you know don't go over the top in criticizing that because +well what he did say was don't you know don't go over the top in criticizing that because yeah. you know he he says that there's a lot of things which are happening. -he's got all sorts of schemes a lot of schemes in the pipeline. +he's got all sorts of schemes a lot of schemes in the pipeline. i suppose he doesn't want to be seen to be just reacting to your letter he's obviously started doing these things off his own bat anyway hasn't he? oh yes. yeah. -i mean and and he he feels that er pressure groups like ourselves are very positive because it gives him a bit of weight when he's arguing for things. +i mean and and he he feels that er pressure groups like ourselves are very positive because it gives him a bit of weight when he's arguing for things. yeah -well they can't push it from the top -but i mean on a sort of wider thing erm +well they can't push it from the top +but i mean on a sort of wider thing erm yeah. -you know one of the things that we could do is to do another directory. +you know one of the things that we could do is to do another directory. yeah. -i think because i think i think +i think because i think i think but -it's a real shame we're so out of date. -mhm but i i you know we we're can we actually do it? -i mean we would need fifty people +it's a real shame we're so out of date. +mhm but i i you know we we're can we actually do it? +i mean we would need fifty people no i would not distribute it to deliver er from door to door. i would erm put it out in the library, put it out in in surgeries. -put it out in public places and that's it because i mean the number of people erm they went to these directories like hot cross buns. -i mean every week i supplied them with a new stack of everybody wanted them. +put it out in public places and that's it because i mean the number of people erm they went to these directories like hot cross buns. +i mean every week i supplied them with a new stack of everybody wanted them. what, the recycling directory? yeah they come through the doorstep, through the doors though. @@ -57508,20 +57455,20 @@ through the door they they just throw them away. they didn't read them. i said well don't you live in stortford, didn't you have it delivered? no. -and i'm sure they'll pick them up if they see them in the +and i'm sure they'll pick them up if they see them in the if they printed -print them up and they do it on their own will. +print them up and they do it on their own will. couldn't we do it with him? with him? well yeah pro i mean they could couldn't they sponsor us to do it or something? -well yeah i i've i've whether he well i mean if, if he's gonna do this seven page thing then i you know i you can look at it two ways. -either we can influence and help that to be to be good or or you know if that's a failure then see whether they can help us to produce one for the town. +well yeah i i've i've whether he well i mean if, if he's gonna do this seven page thing then i you know i you can look at it two ways. +either we can influence and help that to be to be good or or you know if that's a failure then see whether they can help us to produce one for the town. mm. -i mean i'd much rather they do it if we can influence him enough. +i mean i'd much rather they do it if we can influence him enough. they've got the right information. -well the thing if we did it with our as they keep saying there's some, there's so much in the pipeline. -i mean it might take us another two week two months before we get it out. +well the thing if we did it with our as they keep saying there's some, there's so much in the pipeline. +i mean it might take us another two week two months before we get it out. three months. well i would say six months. @@ -57529,73 +57476,73 @@ yeah no i would just think of something really straightforward. they do want stuff on local levels i mean if he's east herts he's got a huge area, hasn't he? yeah. -it it might be a help to him to have little local groups that helped him out with these things. +it it might be a help to him to have little local groups that helped him out with these things. but i mean if we print something and then suddenly they instal all these new bottle banks which we didn't know about. then they are not mentioned well in our recycling directory and we can do the next one he should know about them shouldn't he? -well we must that's why, certainly have to, before -could you drag him along to a meeting? -yeah well that's what they said we could do that. +well we must that's why, certainly have to, before +could you drag him along to a meeting? +yeah well that's what they said we could do that. i'll write that down. erm, is that okay for that i just have something that i read in new scientist does everybody take it? no -oh well i'll give you one to look at it's just a little article about +oh well i'll give you one to look at it's just a little article about thank you. recycling in in egypt. and i just liked reading it so much that i thought you'd like to read it too. don't have to read it now cos it's quite long. -it's it's it's really hot . +it's it's it's really hot . cos they they reuse absolutely everything. and they make they're living out of it. -in east german they are now drowning in rubbish because they used to have a perfect recycling scheme everything was collected and recycled cos they just didn't have the materials. -now they are flooded with the west european goods their recycling isn't worth any more. -on the other hand they haven't got the landfills and the whole scheme that the west has developed and they i mean it's a health hazard meanwhile. +in east german they are now drowning in rubbish because they used to have a perfect recycling scheme everything was collected and recycled cos they just didn't have the materials. +now they are flooded with the west european goods their recycling isn't worth any more. +on the other hand they haven't got the landfills and the whole scheme that the west has developed and they i mean it's a health hazard meanwhile. one of the major problems they have to face. -far east lots of guys sort of collecting cardboard boxes and that's all they did they flatten down cardboard boxes and then another one did newspapers and whole newspapers and +far east lots of guys sort of collecting cardboard boxes and that's all they did they flatten down cardboard boxes and then another one did newspapers and whole newspapers and the whole town is composed of a yeah. it's like a big . -i just thought it was interesting. -erm i did write er as was suggested asking about erm facilities for cyclists in the potential shopping centre development in bishop's stortford. -and they are, they are interested in cyclists but from what i could make out reading this they're not really going to help us a great deal. +i just thought it was interesting. +erm i did write er as was suggested asking about erm facilities for cyclists in the potential shopping centre development in bishop's stortford. +and they are, they are interested in cyclists but from what i could make out reading this they're not really going to help us a great deal. if you want to pass it round and read it. it's it's they're gonna use the green wedges that are already there and the existing footpaths which are already cycled along. what, what good is that to me? -it's just in stortford it's not that easy for a cyclist is it? +it's just in stortford it's not that easy for a cyclist is it? no -and they've got all the places say don't lean your bicycle here and you're not allowed to take it into jackson +and they've got all the places say don't lean your bicycle here and you're not allowed to take it into jackson one girl nearly got knocked off going up newtown road. it's really quite narrow as you're going up there. -what about the all the cars all parked round corners everywhere like up at havers. +what about the all the cars all parked round corners everywhere like up at havers. mm. they could do something about that. have you every cycled up there? -not round havers,wh they park where those, those sort of shops are they they park all around the corners so that you have to go out round them. -and of course you meet something coming the other way wrong side of the road. +not round havers,wh they park where those, those sort of shops are they they park all around the corners so that you have to go out round them. +and of course you meet something coming the other way wrong side of the road. oh yeah. what annoys me is that everybody parks on the pavement as well. mm. seem to disobey all laws there are about parking. it does, it doesn't really help us does it? -do you wanna pass these around as well if anyone wants to look. -all the replies got eleven or so replies that i've had for that questionnaire. -there are a few people willing to help aren't. -but i haven't gone really as i hoped cos i'd envisaged having the membership list with sort of names of who'll make cakes, who'll help on the stall and then know who to phone +do you wanna pass these around as well if anyone wants to look. +all the replies got eleven or so replies that i've had for that questionnaire. +there are a few people willing to help aren't. +but i haven't gone really as i hoped cos i'd envisaged having the membership list with sort of names of who'll make cakes, who'll help on the stall and then know who to phone yeah. -when i wanted some help or who to invite to meetings but because i haven't got a reply from everyone or most people, it can't work does it? +when i wanted some help or who to invite to meetings but because i haven't got a reply from everyone or most people, it can't work does it? is that all the replies you got? sent more than fifty out. i did sixty and caroline copied even more . she's a good girl. did georgina reply? -erm did actually, yes. +erm did actually, yes. yeah, cos when i phoned she said she's still quite interested. mm. yeah i thought she was but she said if the baby . -and i've got a local group summer questionnaire which i couldn't really fill in. +and i've got a local group summer questionnaire which i couldn't really fill in. . isn't it awful! i thought i'm just as bad as you know everybody else really. cos i wasn't sure of some of the answers. @@ -57607,15 +57554,15 @@ i know we did the returnable bottles. i mean cos and we did that stall on peat but we didn't really take part in the peat day of action did we? .what do you think? fiona and i did the electricity -what at the supermarket . +what at the supermarket . is that the global warming and electricity privatization? that one? was it? -it was erm efficiency of +it was erm efficiency of oh fuel and efficiency. right that one then. oh we didn't, we didn't do the ozone layer one did we? -did you do a stall on that ozone layer? +did you do a stall on that ozone layer? we did do something. with the oh we did, yes. @@ -57630,12 +57577,12 @@ right. have you written to your mp about fuel efficiency? yes i did. we did. -i know erm i thought i wrote to the electricity board in, i wrote to somebody about erm how er things should be labelled about how efficient they are when using electricity. +i know erm i thought i wrote to the electricity board in, i wrote to somebody about erm how er things should be labelled about how efficient they are when using electricity. you took part in the er electricity efficiency didn't you? yes. yeah but didn't, we didn't write to our mps though. i thought we were -supposed to write to somewhere else was it the department of the environment or now what would it be, energy? +supposed to write to somewhere else was it the department of the environment or now what would it be, energy? we wrote, wrote to them cos i've got a reply to that letter somewhere with a great wad of information about various fridges and yeah, yeah @@ -57646,7 +57593,7 @@ we haven't found out about company car fleets have we? we tried. well i tried and then i was let down by the group. i don't remember anything about that one -we arranged it two days or three days and each was cancelled +we arranged it two days or three days and each was cancelled march ninety one? . in march this year? it was this year. @@ -57655,20 +57602,20 @@ last year. i didn't think we'd done anything about that this year. but that was last year. yeah. -but we haven't done a march ninety one then. -scanned the local press for power station applications or authorizations h m i p. +but we haven't done a march ninety one then. +scanned the local press for power station applications or authorizations h m i p. written to michael heseltine about acid rain? may ninety one. written to your mp to ask him her to press for strict e c standards for c o two emissions from vehicles may ninety one. when was that? wasn't that on the talk? -do you remember this talk we had that was last year. +do you remember this talk we had that was last year. er -writing a letter to chris patten about the protocol. +writing a letter to chris patten about the protocol. yeah. so that was, that was early this year. -yeah written something. -that to do with the ozone layer. +yeah written something. +that to do with the ozone layer. i don't know. it it's mostly sort of things about energy. isn't it? @@ -57678,14 +57625,14 @@ yeah well this is c o two in in cars, private cars. yeah things to do with er emissions and written that? in may ninety one? -yeah sounds about right. +yeah sounds about right. ask local car dealer to write to car manufacturers to press for the introduction of more fuel efficient cars? may ninety one. no. lobbied your local authority on peat use? not really did we? -erm joined the newsprint campaign?no. -written up details of recycling campaigning experience for and sent it to . +erm joined the newsprint campaign?no. +written up details of recycling campaigning experience for and sent it to . no. why me? . complained to your mp about the national road traffic forecast. @@ -57703,12 +57650,12 @@ sorry? do you own your no! do you? -we we have acquired a large chunk of the the yes. +we we have acquired a large chunk of the the yes. so you should, you should nominate that as a site of the interest shouldn't you? -erm it's valuable but not that valuable. +erm it's valuable but not that valuable. but it says here, written written to linda chalker about the i t p o. -now i, i rang, i sent a postcard which was ready written. +now i, i rang, i sent a postcard which was ready written. do you think that counts? promoted the . well we did try. @@ -57716,133 +57663,133 @@ yeah, put that we did do that. didn't get very far though did we? actually that seems to have fizzled out. haven't heard anything about that for a while. -erm written to the government in u k bank about the bank propose new foreign policy. +erm written to the government in u k bank about the bank propose new foreign policy. i think we might have done that. i think we might have done that. i know that i've written to british gas. -and i think i wrote world bank. +and i think i wrote world bank. that was, thing is that was quite a long time ago. i'm sure it wasn't this year. this is february ninety one. it's alright but you get to the bottom of those stairs and sometimes . -er check locally for claims of environmentally or sustainable tropical hardwood it's not really, i mean i do look when i go to all these d i y places to see what they've got. -haven't really +er check locally for claims of environmentally or sustainable tropical hardwood it's not really, i mean i do look when i go to all these d i y places to see what they've got. +haven't really local wood guides ? -well rob's got two +well rob's got two cos i'm just deciding on a new window frame. -and all the firms are claiming that they only get their hardwood from government erm replanting programmes. -and one got a stamp and a seal on that. +and all the firms are claiming that they only get their hardwood from government erm replanting programmes. +and one got a stamp and a seal on that. but whether that is acknowledged by our friends of the earth i don't know because i mean they have so many stamps and seals on they won't give you names now will they? the friends of the earth . they won't give you names of companies any more. no but if this stamp, this acknowledgement. -oh it's like a little is it? +oh it's like a little is it? good government scheme or not. -whether that is known by friends of the earth as a good scheme or not. -i think there's a day of action coming up on this sort of d i y stuff. +whether that is known by friends of the earth as a good scheme or not. +i think there's a day of action coming up on this sort of d i y stuff. so maybe we'll get some more information about that. -i'm gonna try and get the book back from rob. -martin's an architect and and it actually probably would be you know it might be a good thing to actually sort of provoke a question with architects because they do specify these things and they're the ones who actually say you know right we'll specify hardwood . -it's one of the decisions that are actually made by them in terms of what they use so erm that could be something that is +i'm gonna try and get the book back from rob. +martin's an architect and and it actually probably would be you know it might be a good thing to actually sort of provoke a question with architects because they do specify these things and they're the ones who actually say you know right we'll specify hardwood . +it's one of the decisions that are actually made by them in terms of what they use so erm that could be something that is yeah round to architects just sort of provoking the question cos they, a lot of them have never thought about it mm. -and er you know if they did erm i mean martin asked about the, he asked about the good wood guide you know and i told them where they can get it but that they can have it in their office and put it in their library. +and er you know if they did erm i mean martin asked about the, he asked about the good wood guide you know and i told them where they can get it but that they can have it in their office and put it in their library. you know so that, that's quite a good idea. yeah -but that's so quickly out of date again you see the good wood cos i mean they they have new government schemes, schemes every year don't they? +but that's so quickly out of date again you see the good wood cos i mean they they have new government schemes, schemes every year don't they? mm. and new other schemes. and what, at least it will enable you to know what the tropical species are because some of them have got quite weird and wonderful names and most people don't know what some of them are. mm. i know mahogany is citello . -i noticed they had some philippine mahogany doors in do it all +i noticed they had some philippine mahogany doors in do it all mm. -on saturday and yet, that you have to be careful because they they have that i've forgotten what her name was on on wogan saying next time you go into a d i y store and you see a mahogany toilet seat you know don't boy buy it think of the forest. -well if you go into a d i y store you'll find it's a mahogany stain i don't know if they really make mahogany . -it would be very expensive +on saturday and yet, that you have to be careful because they they have that i've forgotten what her name was on on wogan saying next time you go into a d i y store and you see a mahogany toilet seat you know don't boy buy it think of the forest. +well if you go into a d i y store you'll find it's a mahogany stain i don't know if they really make mahogany . +it would be very expensive yes you'd probably gauge by the price i would think. yeah. plastic plastic. plastic one. -erm oh -yes actually this cycle thing . -cycle parking is actually i wish they'd actually pay a bit more places to actually put your bike and you didn't have to sort of tie it up to some lamppost or something +erm oh +yes actually this cycle thing . +cycle parking is actually i wish they'd actually pay a bit more places to actually put your bike and you didn't have to sort of tie it up to some lamppost or something yeah, yeah. -there's hardly anything +there's hardly anything i mean they could give you a decent stand to put it in cos i hate those ones at sainsbury's. cos if you've got anything heavy in the bag, the bike falls over. -the ones at the library as well. -er and they ought to have a little shelter over it to stop your saddle getting wet if it rains . -i've got, i mean i've got my spots where i park it, i, it at woolworth's and outside the post office because it keeps it dry. +the ones at the library as well. +er and they ought to have a little shelter over it to stop your saddle getting wet if it rains . +i've got, i mean i've got my spots where i park it, i, it at woolworth's and outside the post office because it keeps it dry. and out of the way. all the roads into town are just awful. -i mean the dunmow road, hockerill +i mean the dunmow road, hockerill oh yeah. -you know really scary. -you know you get asphyxiated with petrol fumes and then you get the danger of being thrown off your bike. +you know really scary. +you know you get asphyxiated with petrol fumes and then you get the danger of being thrown off your bike. cycling -yeah they squeeze you off the road if you go up that hill to hockerill lights. -i -you must to cat. -just walk slowly in the middle of the road. +yeah they squeeze you off the road if you go up that hill to hockerill lights. +i +you must to cat. +just walk slowly in the middle of the road. so that there's no way they can take overtake on the right or on the left. that's the only way. -our cat, and i've really watched her makes a point of going and walking slowly in the road. +our cat, and i've really watched her makes a point of going and walking slowly in the road. and i think that is exactly what we have to do as cyclists. not squeeze to the side because they might not see you there. -right +right well you sh you're supposed to ride a fair way out from the gutter, never in the gutter so they can see you round the bends. yeah but -and they often hoot you if you're doing it but that's the place +and they often hoot you if you're doing it but that's the place that is their fault if they hoot. erm especially going up that hill at hockerill lights. -they overtake you and then they slow right down so that you have to go oohooh and stop. +they overtake you and then they slow right down so that you have to go oohooh and stop. you can't cycle that slowly up a hill can you? -they come in too quickly on, once they've passed you +they come in too quickly on, once they've passed you they don't they're in like that aren't they straight in front of you. frightens me . cycle underneath a car today . oh dear. -michael 's got helmet. +michael 's got helmet. that's a good idea. -yes idiot wearing it though. +yes idiot wearing it though. if everybody looks like him! oh well. -i mean it looks alright if you've got all the gear on you know cycling shorts and top and everything +i mean it looks alright if you've got all the gear on you know cycling shorts and top and everything make them like swimming hats with lots of little flowers all over them yeah. but if you do get one you have to be careful you get one that's done to the proper standard because some don't work apparently. absolutely nothing. -well that's what i thought it just seemed to say they were gonna have sort of cycle ways going through the green wedges along where i cycle already. +well that's what i thought it just seemed to say they were gonna have sort of cycle ways going through the green wedges along where i cycle already. mm. and that's no help at all is it. we can't complain. that should do quite well in trying to get the traffic away from the centre in stortford anyway. mm. -they were talking pedestrianizing +they were talking pedestrianizing i think that's been on, on the cards for a long time hasn't it? yeah. pedestrianizing and they've never done it. sorry! -erm wh have we done anything about the environmental charter? -because i started doing it a long time ago +erm wh have we done anything about the environmental charter? +because i started doing it a long time ago yeah, yeah bob did that didn't he? it vaguely yeah and we presented it and then it fizzled. -the group fizzled out because we presented the charter. -and that was the aim of +the group fizzled out because we presented the charter. +and that was the aim of it asks here have they adopted it? erm wouldn't or we aim to still try. -well . -i i think, i've a funny feeling that did adopt it but quite how much that means i don't understand. -well it's awful, having to do this questionnaire we, we've done . +well . +i i think, i've a funny feeling that did adopt it but quite how much that means i don't understand. +well it's awful, having to do this questionnaire we, we've done . all these workshops that have been going on that we haven't been to. well they just kind of recognized the principles don't they but they don't ensure that they'll actually put them into practise. -that's what adopting means it's not actually committing . +that's what adopting means it's not actually committing . yes i thought they had, yes. how about these questions. does the group have a constitution? @@ -57851,23 +57798,23 @@ does the group have an office? no. we've got our plastic box! plastic? -i know i know everybody will be disappointed but i couldn't get cardboard ones, stick it all in. +i know i know everybody will be disappointed but i couldn't get cardboard ones, stick it all in. we bought the storage boxes anyway to keep all the . -no but you can't really i mean that's what supposed to have it like an actual proper office. -you can't have all in cardboard boxes. -it's erm not easy to organize. -you can't and keep them open at the same time. -what is the most common problem you've experienced in your dealings with street? +no but you can't really i mean that's what supposed to have it like an actual proper office. +you can't have all in cardboard boxes. +it's erm not easy to organize. +you can't and keep them open at the same time. +what is the most common problem you've experienced in your dealings with street? it's phoning them up and the person i want to talk to isn't there! i think. -have you had any, anybody else phone them up or written to them? +have you had any, anybody else phone them up or written to them? no? no. i think they're quite abrupt and rude whenever i've phoned them up. are they? they're not terribly friendly. -oh they're usually okay i, i mean what they don't know . -i mean i just find it annoying cos you get through to somebody who then passes you on to somebody else and then they'll talk to you and say well the person you want to talk to isn't here at the moment so you've had all this phone call and then you've got to ring again. +oh they're usually okay i, i mean what they don't know . +i mean i just find it annoying cos you get through to somebody who then passes you on to somebody else and then they'll talk to you and say well the person you want to talk to isn't here at the moment so you've had all this phone call and then you've got to ring again. and you have to do it in office hours as well. what has been your proudest moment this year? oh that was rob. @@ -57875,14 +57822,14 @@ when he was able er to enter the sub committee. oh yes. he was really proud of that and he, he made a point of that being i'll write that down. -for him years of struggle to get any influence to finally find himself +for him years of struggle to get any influence to finally find himself oh good one. what sort of committee is it then? hearing aid! well i think one does speak a bit louder in public meetings, it's just . and i i can only do this work i'm sorry. sorry i didn't hear -oh i i didn't hear either. +oh i i didn't hear either. turn that thing off. i was asking what sub committee it was. er the environmental. @@ -57895,20 +57842,20 @@ yeah east herts. environmental sub committee? yeah. he sits on it. -well he had this environment mental officer, they they in inaugurated him then at this meeting meeting when erm the thing you handed over +well he had this environment mental officer, they they in inaugurated him then at this meeting meeting when erm the thing you handed over charter. the environment charter. why's it a sub committee? -what happened to the proper committee as well. +what happened to the proper committee as well. yeah. reports then back to the proper actual coun the er -the work's committee +the work's committee district council meeting. -well i know at district council there was two environmental groups, was it the officers group and the members group. +well i know at district council there was two environmental groups, was it the officers group and the members group. oh. i wonder which group herts county council. -cos when i was on the hertfordshire environmental of the group which has folded +cos when i was on the hertfordshire environmental of the group which has folded i've got all this money in the abbey national and there's no, no group any more, i think i'll have to keep keep quiet. i'll have to send it off to . @@ -57921,8 +57868,8 @@ the officers group and the members group that was right. right. anyway. onwards. -erm there's going to be a sort of event at the rhodes centre. -erm for one world week on the twenty fourth of october and we've been asked to do a stall there. +erm there's going to be a sort of event at the rhodes centre. +erm for one world week on the twenty fourth of october and we've been asked to do a stall there. which i said yes to without asking anybody so i hope that's alright. what date is it? october the twenty fourth. @@ -57930,79 +57877,79 @@ that's a thursday. we're doing a traidcraft stall? oh yes you what? -well he wanted to know who the traidcraft person +well he wanted to know who the traidcraft person oh really. and he said, he said he tried to phone you up and i said oh don't worry. cos any you always get the answerphone. could leave a message . is it? it's at the rhodes centre thursday october the twenty fourth. -well if we do a stall i would really like to have at least a leaflet on new recycling. +well if we do a stall i would really like to have at least a leaflet on new recycling. yeah okay. -so that we have, i mean nothing of design or anything just short information because i think it's so +so that we have, i mean nothing of design or anything just short information because i think it's so right. out of date. yeah. i know, and he said you could sell things as well now. -i don't know what you think, i just wondered did we ought to order anything from friends of the earth catalogue like those sort of things to sell. +i don't know what you think, i just wondered did we ought to order anything from friends of the earth catalogue like those sort of things to sell. cos that, i mean they're always going to be useful i use them myself and i expect you all mm. the question is the quantity -er yeah -i've no idea. +er yeah +i've no idea. well i mean i i know what barbara feels about this. -she feels that erm at the, the level that we are working at it is really coun be counter productive to hold stock. +she feels that erm at the, the level that we are working at it is really coun be counter productive to hold stock. because however hard you try stock deteriorates. yeah. erm but i you know i feel that that very often we don't sell stock -well couldn't we just have a few things -and i feel that if we did have stock then then we would erm sell it. +well couldn't we just have a few things +and i feel that if we did have stock then then we would erm sell it. so i mean that that's two ways of looking at it. -certainly if we've got some stuff in a box -well i mean we needn't buy the expensive things like sweatshirts +certainly if we've got some stuff in a box +well i mean we needn't buy the expensive things like sweatshirts shall i try at erm cambridge? i mean it's october. yeah but they, will they, they won't sell you on at a discount will they? -cos if we all +cos if we all but i mean i i just know that that harlow tried stock keeping and selling, they gave up. i know that er in hertford they were quite desperate. all came up with the same idea and they wanted to do it. -and in the end they came to barbara's conclusions so that its a an expensive thing. -but i mean if we only had like the writing paper and the envelopes and re-use labels, small items of stationery -the stickers and i mean -they still do yeah. +and in the end they came to barbara's conclusions so that its a an expensive thing. +but i mean if we only had like the writing paper and the envelopes and re-use labels, small items of stationery +the stickers and i mean +they still do yeah. but i mean i i expect, i mean even we had some left over e eventually you could sell them to our own members because they'd all want to use it mm. and it's cheaper than ordering it off the catalogue. that's a good idea about cambridge isn't it? you could borrow there stock, is that what you're thinking and then take back what we didn't sell. -that's what +that's what i mean i've never talked to them so i i don't know yet well if they would let us borrow it, that's a different matter to buying it from then because we then wouldn't make any money on it. -well i don't, i have never heard of a local group that makes money out of this selling. +well i don't, i have never heard of a local group that makes money out of this selling. well you you buy it all at thirty three or twenty five percent discount so you can then sell it at a bit more. but then you have then you have the stuff that doesn't sell and deteriorates and you still have to have paid for it so -i think it's possible to make a bit of money but at at at the rate you know i feel we're all the time putting the cart before the horse. -erm you know if if we are going to try to keep going as a viable group then yes one of the things we should consider i mean i i don't i've come here sort of thinking oh is this it, is this the crisis meeting or -is it you know erm i mean i feel so so passionately that that we should keep going but +i think it's possible to make a bit of money but at at at the rate you know i feel we're all the time putting the cart before the horse. +erm you know if if we are going to try to keep going as a viable group then yes one of the things we should consider i mean i i don't i've come here sort of thinking oh is this it, is this the crisis meeting or +is it you know erm i mean i feel so so passionately that that we should keep going but mm. -i also feel just that i am able to contribute next to nothing in terms of time so and i think w we're almost all in that situation. -erm you know we sort of seem to limp from one meeting to another without really committing ourselves to anything much. -and you know if we were able to commit ourselves to two public, two meetings, three meetings of some sort in a year where we're actually gonna do something and present some sort of front par part of presenting some sort of front is to try to sell a few bits of pieces if we're prepared to accept that we're going to lose money. +i also feel just that i am able to contribute next to nothing in terms of time so and i think w we're almost all in that situation. +erm you know we sort of seem to limp from one meeting to another without really committing ourselves to anything much. +and you know if we were able to commit ourselves to two public, two meetings, three meetings of some sort in a year where we're actually gonna do something and present some sort of front par part of presenting some sort of front is to try to sell a few bits of pieces if we're prepared to accept that we're going to lose money. yeah. i mean if we, we're preaching you should use recycled products we, if we had a few to sell at least mm. yeah. i mean you you're be selling your traidcraft stuff i mean which -why why does barbara believe it's okay to sell that but not +why why does barbara believe it's okay to sell that but not no, well we're, we're in exactly the same problem with traidcraft. -you know we we used to sell thousand of pounds worth a year and now we're down to couple of thousand a year and we're s , we are losing money on that. +you know we we used to sell thousand of pounds worth a year and now we're down to couple of thousand a year and we're s , we are losing money on that. mhm. -no we're not actually losing money but i mean with traidcraft we are getting to the low point where we put borrowed stock +no we're not actually losing money but i mean with traidcraft we are getting to the low point where we put borrowed stock well that's the recession isn't it? or -well, what i thought was with this one world week thing at least people that, who go might be more receptive to what we have to say to show and sell . +well, what i thought was with this one world week thing at least people that, who go might be more receptive to what we have to say to show and sell . yes we've done really well with with traidcraft because that is, that's the whole reason for the the the concert and they're gonna have this concert in there as well and people will be buying tickets to go to. yeah. @@ -58022,16 +57969,16 @@ yeah. that was last year or was that two years ago? er there was something at st michael's but i didn't know it was the one world week. -yeah i have never been involved in a one world week event at st michael's. +yeah i have never been involved in a one world week event at st michael's. i thought there was one there . you certainly were there. in the church -no i don't i don't think +no i don't i don't think yeah. anyway i mean hopefully this this will be sort of you know if it's well publicized it it will be well attended because of the past. i think we might as well get in a few things and anyway i want some envelope re-use labels . i've run out completely. -there you are so many packets already. +there you are so many packets already. well if you don't want traidcraft's re-use labels i don't care! oh! i didn't know you did them! @@ -58043,36 +57990,36 @@ well who's gonna do the leaflet? i will. i think we ought to sort that out well that will be, i personally think that's the only thing we can do. -and we should just sort of say what is necessary to find out and everybody gets a few telephone numbers or telephone calls check out addresses find out about new ones, get in contact with the district council erm what is in the pipeline. +and we should just sort of say what is necessary to find out and everybody gets a few telephone numbers or telephone calls check out addresses find out about new ones, get in contact with the district council erm what is in the pipeline. find out about uttlesford possibly why there's is running and whether that is going to br breakdown. -erm and if we then find money for printing it i would approach barclays bank, banks, local banks and would it do it very modestly the same local the same style er and only hand it out to places where people are likely to pick it up. +erm and if we then find money for printing it i would approach barclays bank, banks, local banks and would it do it very modestly the same local the same style er and only hand it out to places where people are likely to pick it up. and not bother about . -i mean charity shops erm library, hairdressers, surgeries boardman as i know +i mean charity shops erm library, hairdressers, surgeries boardman as i know i think that's a very sensible idea actually rather than er trying to do the whole town. -because that was er you know i mean it got the group together +because that was er you know i mean it got the group together yeah i thought because everybody had the same experience. i liked the experience because i had never done it. mm. what a waste of time. -the number of people i've talked to that i definitely knew had got and never knew they had got it. +the number of people i've talked to that i definitely knew had got and never knew they had got it. mm. -yeah i mean but on the other hand the there's probably quite a few that did read it. -i mean i know when we moved house i had folder and one of each had got in it the recycling directory +yeah i mean but on the other hand the there's probably quite a few that did read it. +i mean i know when we moved house i had folder and one of each had got in it the recycling directory mm -which is quite a nice surprise! +which is quite a nice surprise! i mean had they had they sold to someone outside bishop's stortford yeah. then they could yeah. erm i think we have to have something if we have a stall. -we lost all the erm cartoons original cartoons. +we lost all the erm cartoons original cartoons. yeah. oh that's a shame. well i could photocopy that couldn't you. yeah. -the detail +the detail difficult to see what it is. but erm oh that's a real shame. @@ -58083,7 +58030,7 @@ yeah. er something before i i always forget everything. the german friends of the earth's people told me never to do the washing on monday mornings. i mean that's something to put there as well i think. -because it's a peak time for electricity and the electricity board er produces according to peak demands. +because it's a peak time for electricity and the electricity board er produces according to peak demands. that's got nothing to do with recycling has it? no. i know but @@ -58097,7 +58044,7 @@ it's an interesting though. i didn't know that they produced according to peak yeah, i think it's important to know it's very important to know, yes. -erm whatever. +erm whatever. don't do it monday mornings. i usually do mine at midnight when i get home! yes. @@ -58109,18 +58056,18 @@ i mean i've had mine flood and i've had its thermostat go and it boiled everythi i mean that would have been a disaster i mean it's only because i was upstairs and i thought oh i can smell boiling. you know it was like when you boil up hankies i thought what a! . there was dye came out of everything it was awful. -and another time it was all pouring all over the floor -the other thing i mean to be healthy it's more important to dry things and keep them dry for a while than to boil them. +and another time it was all pouring all over the floor +the other thing i mean to be healthy it's more important to dry things and keep them dry for a while than to boil them. bacteria survive heat for a short time. yeah. -but they don't a for the percentage of bacteria that survives drought is is minimal. -so you don't need to boil logically. -er if you just keep your hankies iron them, keep them dry. +but they don't a for the percentage of bacteria that survives drought is is minimal. +so you don't need to boil logically. +er if you just keep your hankies iron them, keep them dry. then they are, then they are sterile. be bothered. anyway, back to the point. he said pointedly. -well leaflet. +well leaflet. stall. we've got to get back to the stall. yeah er the recycling leaflet. @@ -58128,12 +58075,12 @@ who's gonna do it? it's not gonna be done if we don't get somebody to actually front you know well take it on -the thing is that i i can do revamp it on computer. +the thing is that i i can do revamp it on computer. because it w you can scan what ma manually? -no you just stick it on a photocopier -i see i wa before you do that i'll get in touch with the guy who drew it and if he if he has got an original copy he might be able to erm to er -what, what you can do is you can then get basically you get the computer to type that out type that out. +no you just stick it on a photocopier +i see i wa before you do that i'll get in touch with the guy who drew it and if he if he has got an original copy he might be able to erm to er +what, what you can do is you can then get basically you get the computer to type that out type that out. ah. and then you just do a run, you don't have to go on to print it at all you just print it off. that's one option @@ -58143,36 +58090,36 @@ i've got a mackintosh and a laser printer. so i mean i've got some recycled paper but but well traidcraft's got loads to sell. -not doing very well are you +not doing very well are you no! -because i have this erm dilemma. -whether to just photocopy off a very good original +because i have this erm dilemma. +whether to just photocopy off a very good original yeah or do we print the whole lot. and we came to the conclusion it was cheaper to print oh than photocopy. -what it's a bit slow isn't it? -yeah it depends, well you can get get it to run through copies but the problem is that the cartridges for these printers they, they cost about fifty pounds. -mm +what it's a bit slow isn't it? +yeah it depends, well you can get get it to run through copies but the problem is that the cartridges for these printers they, they cost about fifty pounds. +mm they're not cheap. so if i can do one run and then photocopy it. mm. -it a is actually a lot better because you can get them usually get them down to about five p a copy. +it a is actually a lot better because you can get them usually get them down to about five p a copy. well won't you lose, lose definition on the drawing though with a laser printer? no. no? -no it's even better +no it's even better oh that's alright. okay, no it's, i'm just going by the one at school and it, because it's all made up of little dots you no, this is a laser printer. -this does it absolutely it's not a dot printer it's it is a laser printer . +this does it absolutely it's not a dot printer it's it is a laser printer . oh, well he keeps calling it his laser printer!seen it in action we don't see that well. so you, you said you could do it for five p a copy? well i r , i r , i reckon i reckon you can down to that, yeah. that's printing both sides. yeah. -double sided printer and i i'll try and get that verified but +double sided printer and i i'll try and get that verified but i think we could sell it i think we could sell it for yeah. ten p or twenty p. @@ -58181,13 +58128,13 @@ oh yeah. ho how many that's our, i mean, you know you can go round in newsagents or doctor's surgery and dump them. but to actually say right can you s can you collect the money for us! -well one could put a box next to it. +well one could put a box next to it. well in some places, yeah . yeah but i mean, mm. a copy's a lot. it is, yeah. -well although -i mean it i'm not suggesting that isn't cheap but erm to produce at five p a copy +well although +i mean it i'm not suggesting that isn't cheap but erm to produce at five p a copy oh yeah. thousand it's gonna cost what's it gonna cost? er. @@ -58196,27 +58143,27 @@ five thousands. fifty pounds. mm. mm. -i mean i'm, i'm, i'm only going on the fact that i i tend to do everything on the cheap so i tend to get if i can find somebody who does photocopying i can do it then we'll do it. -for me to produce that'll cost me basically my time and my my you know i, say my laser copies' paid for by my business erm +i mean i'm, i'm, i'm only going on the fact that i i tend to do everything on the cheap so i tend to get if i can find somebody who does photocopying i can do it then we'll do it. +for me to produce that'll cost me basically my time and my my you know i, say my laser copies' paid for by my business erm copies. -so i mean if i, if i produced for instance si five or six masters and then people can go and do copies here and there that's actually not a bad way of doing it. -and that'll be, i've got about a ream of, well it's only about a ream paper. +so i mean if i, if i produced for instance si five or six masters and then people can go and do copies here and there that's actually not a bad way of doing it. +and that'll be, i've got about a ream of, well it's only about a ream paper. just pr producing new copies as you need them rather than produce five thousand and i think we we have sort of hundreds to throw away in the end. -but i it to to er recycling. +but i it to to er recycling. yeah. -well i'll get in touch with this east herts guy to get all his information. +well i'll get in touch with this east herts guy to get all his information. good. mm. but erm -you know, we need to find out where to take -somebody needs to collect somebody needs to be a contact for getting all the information to by a certain date. -well you can get it through me, yeah. +you know, we need to find out where to take +somebody needs to collect somebody needs to be a contact for getting all the information to by a certain date. +well you can get it through me, yeah. okay. -tesco do they actually do now? +tesco do they actually do now? no. has anybody been there? no. -well they collect aluminium cans. +well they collect aluminium cans. oh do they? yeah, that's what i was told. i acted on what everyone had told me i then asked my friend who had a contact in tesco's about it she said well there is one. @@ -58231,36 +58178,36 @@ yeah, cos there's one at the swimming pool isn't there? yeah. yeah. mm. -does anybody know anything about, there's this little note in about erm recycling paper, all sorts of paper magazines, cardboard er on the first monday of the month. +does anybody know anything about, there's this little note in about erm recycling paper, all sorts of paper magazines, cardboard er on the first monday of the month. does anybody know anything about that? is this for boots? -every first monday of the mo month is the birchanger scout -scout +every first monday of the mo month is the birchanger scout +scout and he gave me that information repeatedly and he's terribly involved. it, it's fantastic. right, yeah. i'm always worried that his enthusiasm is stretched to the limit no, no i mean the number of pe . -i've just passed my a levels i've got loads of papers going what can i do. +i've just passed my a levels i've got loads of papers going what can i do. well i said, ring birchanger scouts! and as far as i know he always . -i mean the address is on there anyway. +i mean the address is on there anyway. yeah, oh right. is it? oh. er -quite pertinent actually if we are actually going to do one. +quite pertinent actually if we are actually going to do one. what? -to ask people sorry in my, in the letter +to ask people sorry in my, in the letter yeah. -to the press, ask people to er submit any information. +to the press, ask people to er submit any information. yeah. -oh what you mean you're gonna put at the bottom of the of, the same letter or +oh what you mean you're gonna put at the bottom of the of, the same letter or well, yes. yeah. -just write down all the information we've got now so there is can recycling at the swimming pool and at tesco privately run. +just write down all the information we've got now so there is can recycling at the swimming pool and at tesco privately run. swimming pool -erm swimming pool +erm swimming pool who's going to get the information who runs that? who? mm? @@ -58268,47 +58215,47 @@ well i can do that i suppose. well who runs what? the swimming pool because i know the scouts do the tesco one and whenever they are put in these cardboard boxes they have to be sorted so somebody must sort them. -oh they're not, they're not asking sorting, oh i see. -erm so there must be somebody responsible and i think if, if we write swimming pool and people take their cans there +oh they're not, they're not asking sorting, oh i see. +erm so there must be somebody responsible and i think if, if we write swimming pool and people take their cans there yes we'd have to check. erm i should first check. check with them, yeah quite. so i i do, you do tesco. i'll do the swimming pool. -i, i, i would check who actually is responsible for that +i, i, i would check who actually is responsible for that . but of course all paper now is all paper? all paper. -what about this chap then? +what about this chap then? it's in the library th with his number. well, you ring him but if he, if he gets upset or, or oh i see. -it's it's strange you can give that as an address. -any uttlesford town of some size has got a comprehensive recycling centre now that takes any paper +it's it's strange you can give that as an address. +any uttlesford town of some size has got a comprehensive recycling centre now that takes any paper do you have to sort it? do you have to take it sorted? no. no. it's just a big skip? -and it says -at stanstead +and it says +at stanstead do they then sort it? the car park -no, they it's the council collects it and in uttlesford, that's why i said we should get at the same time an uttlesford councillor because i would +no, they it's the council collects it and in uttlesford, that's why i said we should get at the same time an uttlesford councillor because i would yes, yeah like to know a, whether their new scheme is only temporary, is about to break down. mm. or whether they actually get the disposals cost incorporated into this skip collecting cost. -because the money they can get for this mixed paper must be a pittance. +because the money they can get for this mixed paper must be a pittance. mm. -almost hardly worth their while but +almost hardly worth their while but if you look at the tonnage kept out of the landfill yeah. it might work. yeah, but i mean it it so where's this place in stanstead then, do you know? -erm if you go in, along cambridge road there's the turning to the right isn't there the first when you come up the hill. +erm if you go in, along cambridge road there's the turning to the right isn't there the first when you come up the hill. at the monument,th th whatsit hill. chapel hill. chapel hill. @@ -58320,27 +58267,27 @@ go down it's it's first left once you've turned right at you know where the library is? opposite, opposite there isn't it? opposite the fire station? -near the white house round the back of the white house. +near the white house round the back of the white house. where the health centre is. yes, round the back of those few little shops in london road. and you can take anything. you can take erm any drink can unsorted. you can take glass and you can take pa papers. -and in saffron waldren -suddenly thought you still got to have a little holdall membership forms in it, haven't you? +and in saffron waldren +suddenly thought you still got to have a little holdall membership forms in it, haven't you? with all that peat and stuff. they even take er pills. -with all that +with all that do they? oh that's interesting to know -remember w we did that peat they had a box that had a national membership forms in. +remember w we did that peat they had a box that had a national membership forms in. we could have that on the stall couldn't we? -oh yes,w i mean we have got various leaflets produce still which is in reasonable condition. -i've got yeah. -yeah we could take that you know membership and our own membership forms as well. +oh yes,w i mean we have got various leaflets produce still which is in reasonable condition. +i've got yeah. +yeah we could take that you know membership and our own membership forms as well. what pub is that then? did you say a pub? -a pub, yeah, in front of the pub er in . +a pub, yeah, in front of the pub er in . just before the oh the one in . yeah. @@ -58351,30 +58298,30 @@ the royal oak? yeah cos that's next door but one to me so, yeah. oh that's where you are. yeah. -well anyway that is a new item on the recycling directory +well anyway that is a new item on the recycling directory right -oh they've got one near those shops in humana? -could you find out what happens to the ? +oh they've got one near those shops in humana? +could you find out what happens to the ? yeah i know they come er there's a big lorry comes and collects them. yeah. -but whether they are sent to the third world or torn into rags or +but whether they are sent to the third world or torn into rags or yeah -well you've got the, i mean industry uses rags. +well you've got the, i mean industry uses rags. wiping up oil and things like that. i might c call . -if i see them collecting i'll ask . +if i see them collecting i'll ask . and then if you're collating you have to ring. yeah. -erm find out from -oh well i'll get the -the charity shops what they want -havers shops +erm find out from +oh well i'll get the +the charity shops what they want +havers shops yeah. address oh right. charity shops. -ah er the other item that we must mention is any extra plastic bags +ah er the other item that we must mention is any extra plastic bags yeah, i'll ask about plastic bags. are extremely welcome in any charity shop. now, what about engine oil? @@ -58388,9 +58335,9 @@ but can you take it back to garages as well? no. no. no. -halfords halfords in harlow is one that that that we found out took it. -but i ce ce i'm almost certain the council takes it. -yeah i remember big bins wasn't sort of sure what else +halfords halfords in harlow is one that that that we found out took it. +but i ce ce i'm almost certain the council takes it. +yeah i remember big bins wasn't sort of sure what else they also take batteries. i know that. car batteries. @@ -58405,12 +58352,12 @@ i i'm collecting those. yeah. you are collecting them? what happens to radio batteries? -are still doing it? +are still doing it? yeah. -and they bring them up to me -ah +and they bring them up to me +ah i'm just waiting for a day of action on . -what do english er what do the english do with batteries and then dump them! +what do english er what do the english do with batteries and then dump them! in those letters ursula th there's yeah? a letter which says they they have stopped doing it. @@ -58418,33 +58365,33 @@ oh yeah. that photostad have stopped doing it. oh. about the second, quite early on isn't it? -oh yeah i was +oh yeah i was i was gonna say it's about the last one! think you were reading them upside down! -well they only, they only er took the batteries over to me before we left on holiday. -so they must still be doing them and that was two huge boxes. +well they only, they only er took the batteries over to me before we left on holiday. +so they must still be doing them and that was two huge boxes. oh. er -i know they are not very happy +i know they are not very happy well that needs a check that needs needs another check i i would guess. yeah. and i quite honestly i don't i i'm going to say about back to this erm sump oil. -my brother-in-law said he read in the paper that erm over a year sort of the amount of oil tipped on our land and down drains which shouldn't be there is almost like equivalent to the disaster at exxon valdez. +my brother-in-law said he read in the paper that erm over a year sort of the amount of oil tipped on our land and down drains which shouldn't be there is almost like equivalent to the disaster at exxon valdez. i heard that. -th erm the amount of oil that people just tip on the ground, or down the drains or whatever +th erm the amount of oil that people just tip on the ground, or down the drains or whatever mm. over a year is equivalent to the disaster of the exxon valdez. so really people ought to be trained to take their engine oil out -there's this, there's this er out of sight out of mind principal -you are fined you are heavily fined in germany and for decades already. -you were not allowed to wash your car on a normal street because oil would automatically be flushed into into the guttering, into the +there's this, there's this er out of sight out of mind principal +you are fined you are heavily fined in germany and for decades already. +you were not allowed to wash your car on a normal street because oil would automatically be flushed into into the guttering, into the they must be going absolutely mad about east germany mustn't they? -well it's just so incredible that this oil has never been i mean nobody focused on it did they? +well it's just so incredible that this oil has never been i mean nobody focused on it did they? no. people just don't think. they just tip it oh tip it down the drain. -same with petrol stations i mean the way they spill the petrol. +same with petrol stations i mean the way they spill the petrol. i know! there used to be safety catch mechanism yeah. @@ -58454,13 +58401,13 @@ they had a row at erm petrol station when that happened to her. and they said it was our car. and, and it went, cos it was quite a bit more worth petrol that went all over the place. and she refused to pay. -and they me up about it. +and they me up about it. i, i sort of denied all knowledge . i didn't know it had happened! i think they were being most unreasonable. we at the time the attendant said it was alright. she didn't have to pay for it. -it could easily i mean will be shorter i think. +it could easily i mean will be shorter i think. sorry? fewer localities now. this will be shorter. @@ -58470,19 +58417,19 @@ oh a few tips. oh with respect i really think it ought to be recycling and nothing else. mm. -well i just find these, i mean we had quite a few now +well i just find these, i mean we had quite a few now cos recycling sort of comes into the tips for daily life as well though doesn't it. it's part of it. -like protecting people don't just save bottles they save their glass jars +like protecting people don't just save bottles they save their glass jars seem to be patronizing people when really you just want to give information. as well. people don't always think of. yeah. -re-using things, re-using things is almost the same as recycling isn't it? +re-using things, re-using things is almost the same as recycling isn't it? re-use? yes. yeah! -i suppose it's i mean +i suppose it's i mean well it is really isn't it? re-using is better than recycling. yeah. @@ -58492,11 +58439,11 @@ erm i take so it reduce or re-use, recycling? has anybody got a con -punchlines are much better than sort of er . +punchlines are much better than sort of er . because people'll read those. well you can write save money across the top then well i, i wrote actually that article for the the herald and post that has appeared in harlow but not here. -a whole load of tips like that. +a whole load of tips like that. oh. now every week i open herald and post and think oh it's gonna be in there, it's gonna be in there but it never is. it's only appeared in harlow and she told me it would get in the bishop's stortford one but it hasn't so far. @@ -58509,7 +58456,7 @@ school. well i mean somebody who knows the teachers or yes. that's gonna be a difficult one cos they don't always want -i will i'll do the schools. +i will i'll do the schools. yeah. erm the general public walking into their yeah. @@ -58520,37 +58467,37 @@ i'll do the secondary. what about that? okay. primary. -well i think boy's high were active in between weren't they? -whether they er still are. +well i think boy's high were active in between weren't they? +whether they er still are. how about st mary? -i i found that erm erm littered all over the place! -st mary is wall! +i i found that erm erm littered all over the place! +st mary is wall! the p e do they still do it? -the p e teacher is supposedly collecting aluminium cans and we've been through various daft schemes of stopping the children from throwing the cans everywhere because we've got this coke machine. -and we even had one where they paid a ten p deposit on a can so they paid forty p instead of thirty or whatever. +the p e teacher is supposedly collecting aluminium cans and we've been through various daft schemes of stopping the children from throwing the cans everywhere because we've got this coke machine. +and we even had one where they paid a ten p deposit on a can so they paid forty p instead of thirty or whatever. and i got hardly any cans back. or they did was b buy them from the school canteen where they were still thirty! and the coke machine wasn't used. well why not er encourage the canteen to charge forty -they didn't but then they had +they didn't but then they had as well? well, they won't because they they they have to make money in order to survive. the more money they make the better for them. they have to run it as a business now. for profit i'm afraid. -er oh i did have one polish lad who's now left who used to go round looking for all the cans and he'd then collect the ten p's! +er oh i did have one polish lad who's now left who used to go round looking for all the cans and he'd then collect the ten p's! scheme folded. through lack of support. so what else is mentioned here? -i think that still holds. +i think that still holds. and i can check, i will go and . and car batteries is the same. other batteries i'll check. -pills er you check +pills er you check yeah. . -furniture erm yeah i think that's. +furniture erm yeah i think that's. is there a second hand furniture shop now in bishop's stortford? there is one isn't there? is there one down by the causeway? @@ -58569,65 +58516,65 @@ could i just borrow your pen and i'll write that down. thanks. are red cross still taking furniture in stortford? now where is red cross? -erm well i think the furniture you have to take down to ware when i last phoned. -there's a number in the er when i was church street so that's a few years now so it needs to be checked . +erm well i think the furniture you have to take down to ware when i last phoned. +there's a number in the er when i was church street so that's a few years now so it needs to be checked . would you do that? so it's whether they take furniture? okay. -newspapers i think that is normally isn't it? -do you think people are +newspapers i think that is normally isn't it? +do you think people are folded -what's that shop in the causeway near the sunbed erm it it's a second hand furniture in there isn't it? +what's that shop in the causeway near the sunbed erm it it's a second hand furniture in there isn't it? is it? -but h i mean are people in the habit of wanting to get rid of furniture? -i mean i mean if it, if it's really grotty i mean +but h i mean are people in the habit of wanting to get rid of furniture? +i mean i mean if it, if it's really grotty i mean well you can get i mean, according to the leaflet you can just phone up and get the council to collect . no . glass, we haven't got any bottle banks. -and that's where we need to contact what is in the pipeline +and that's where we need to contact what is in the pipeline yeah. bottle bank somewhere. -yeah there's, there's one at sainsbury's now isn't there which is new since that. -yeah there is thorley sainsbury's. +yeah there's, there's one at sainsbury's now isn't there which is new since that. +yeah there is thorley sainsbury's. thorley sainsbury's. they have one now? they do. yes. oh! they suddenly found the room. -yes actually. -well in a parking block. -er would anyone like coffee? -no thank you. +yes actually. +well in a parking block. +er would anyone like coffee? +no thank you. one, two. -now what was it, i mean or would you prefer anything else? +now what was it, i mean or would you prefer anything else? some tea? tea? i'll i'll go and check . -one thing i struck me this week there's a new regulation as regard punctures on tyres because i had this completely flat tyre and a whole new set of tyres and i said to him well can't you mend it, can't you put an inner tube in like i i've done before cos there was a nail in it you see. +one thing i struck me this week there's a new regulation as regard punctures on tyres because i had this completely flat tyre and a whole new set of tyres and i said to him well can't you mend it, can't you put an inner tube in like i i've done before cos there was a nail in it you see. yeah. -and i said just get the nail out and re repair the inner tube he said no it's the there's a new regulation this year that if the outer case of the you know the tyre has +and i said just get the nail out and re repair the inner tube he said no it's the there's a new regulation this year that if the outer case of the you know the tyre has tea. -they're not allowed to repair it because safety regulations because the whole expanse and then supposedly the actual puncture comes off. +they're not allowed to repair it because safety regulations because the whole expanse and then supposedly the actual puncture comes off. and i said well what happens to these extra tyres? right. so he sa , i mean does anybody know anything about anything like that? no, no. -presum i mean i just lost four -i know this i just know about about a sort of friend of ours is making money meanwhile in germany . -he found well of course erm connections so he got the permission through the embassy. -he's now running lorry loads of worn tyres to russia, to the soviet union and makes money loads of money because the tyres, they couldn't ha get any tyres so the tyres he saw there were totally without profile. +presum i mean i just lost four +i know this i just know about about a sort of friend of ours is making money meanwhile in germany . +he found well of course erm connections so he got the permission through the embassy. +he's now running lorry loads of worn tyres to russia, to the soviet union and makes money loads of money because the tyres, they couldn't ha get any tyres so the tyres he saw there were totally without profile. you know. yeah. -so the old tyres he could erm find in germany were a lot better. +so the old tyres he could erm find in germany were a lot better. he carted them over. . making thousands out of it. yeah. well people do that here though don't they? -se sell them to africa and places yeah . -alright if it doesn't rain actually so it wouldn't matter if they didn't have treads on er treads on the tyres if it's dry it doesn't really matter you just go round slicks and +se sell them to africa and places yeah . +alright if it doesn't rain actually so it wouldn't matter if they didn't have treads on er treads on the tyres if it's dry it doesn't really matter you just go round slicks and i think could chop them up and use them to make road surfaces with. -yeah but percentages is +yeah but percentages is mm. at least you know they can do it! mm that's right. @@ -58635,7 +58582,7 @@ oh they can do quite a lot of it. i mean even the, the su surface out of the play in playgrounds . mm. i can never quite work out why that . -most roads +most roads so, so far i've got two coffees here and one tea. anybody else for anything? i'll have a coffee please. @@ -58647,26 +58594,26 @@ white. white. so we've got about six weeks in which to do this. so how many weeks -i mean there's no excuse i all the jobs are quite quickly done aren't they? +i mean there's no excuse i all the jobs are quite quickly done aren't they? yeah. -so what we ought to have a deadline for collect collecting the information. +so what we ought to have a deadline for collect collecting the information. and then get together yeah. to put it together. and then decide on and how to -and how to get, how to get it to put it together. +and how to get, how to get it to put it together. shall we say three weeks? -three weeks yeah. +three weeks yeah. probably for everybody just to do it and yeah. -and i don't think anybody has more time in in four weeks time +and i don't think anybody has more time in in four weeks time so if you say six weeks by then you yeah yeah. it's too near. so the thirtieth of september we'll meet here again. meeting? -can, can we meet at house? +can, can we meet at house? yes. it's more sensible for meet where? @@ -58680,39 +58627,39 @@ mondays is actually not very good for me but hopefully by then i don't think i can make that either but er val, can i have your phone number please? right. -erm what did you say? +erm what did you say? thirtieth? well that's . go through. -so plastics erm ya i think that's re-using is better than recycling. -and erm then mention the charity shops. -i mean we don't need to imply anything there. -there's no new recycling centre nearby for plastics is there? +so plastics erm ya i think that's re-using is better than recycling. +and erm then mention the charity shops. +i mean we don't need to imply anything there. +there's no new recycling centre nearby for plastics is there? so who mentioned this the what? -talk about recycling mention that. +talk about recycling mention that. i just remember it from the . -now bejam have become iceland they haven't done the plastic bags collection have they like the, a lot of the . +now bejam have become iceland they haven't done the plastic bags collection have they like the, a lot of the . they haven't got a provision for plastic bags is that worth checking out? -i know a lot of the iceland do have a recycling +i know a lot of the iceland do have a recycling i i'll do that, if i'm doing plastic bags at charity shops i'll check -plastic bag recycling +plastic bag recycling what's happened to sainsbury's one p back cos they don't actually -yes i was yes +yes i was yes they don't actually give you one p any more. no! -i think supposed to, they are supposed to. +i think supposed to, they are supposed to. i i always make them give me three p -this in the friend of the earth, germany she stayed with us, i really would have liked you to meet her. +this in the friend of the earth, germany she stayed with us, i really would have liked you to meet her. she was fanatic! you have cat f food in tins! how dare you!you know . -what do they +what do they from the butcher and oh, really. locally, no transport. -cut out transport. +cut out transport. only local foods and if it's available. yes well mm. @@ -58722,39 +58669,39 @@ you doing the bottle banks? who's doing the bottle banks? yeah. thanks ever so much. -because er caroline once wanted one in a school and we weren't allowed to have it. +because er caroline once wanted one in a school and we weren't allowed to have it. no i won't thank you. -well there's one at erm . +well there's one at erm . the erm wine merchant. you know erm the one down the bottom of thorley hill. -well they were, they were sort of advertising er giving you money back. +well they were, they were sort of advertising er giving you money back. . i don't know if down in the er yeah. can you find out more ? -and also we do -quite a few we can write at the bottom er for more inf if you have any more information or something in small print +and also we do +quite a few we can write at the bottom er for more inf if you have any more information or something in small print mm. -please contact and then we can do the next few hundred +please contact and then we can do the next few hundred the thing is you can, you can change them very easily. ya. that means you can er pay for it easier. i wouldn't print more than three hundred for a start. -so if we get further information we can always if not we can just get printed. +so if we get further information we can always if not we can just get printed. that's very impressive isn't it? -that's that council of environment . +that's that council of environment . no sorry. council's environment advisory committee. -oh that must be that must be the one er +oh that must be that must be the one er rob's on. -thought this was good about the, buying the r s p c a that boat oil spill. +thought this was good about the, buying the r s p c a that boat oil spill. doesn't look very steady though does it! yeah they look like! it's ever so tiny isn't it! yeah. coracle . well they've got to keep their green image, green image going haven't they? -so kath while you were coffee making we decided on er three weeks for collecting information. +so kath while you were coffee making we decided on er three weeks for collecting information. oh right. and another three weeks for production. which will make the thirtieth of september a meeting at portland road. @@ -58783,7 +58730,7 @@ beforehand. i'll probably phone it in actually. yeah. if that's okay. -er second at what ti . +er second at what ti . wednesday second of october. what time? eight thirty. @@ -58792,10 +58739,10 @@ and this is, this is about the leaflet is it? yeah. yes. get all the information. -decide on how we do the thing. +decide on how we do the thing. and erm do take it to go into details of that it's probably much more sensible to do it with just two or three people. -but er at least if we can pull the information together that evening that'd be a start. +but er at least if we can pull the information together that evening that'd be a start. form a sub committee! ooh! sub committee with everybody present! @@ -58811,7 +58758,7 @@ your welcome. i'll be in touch. bye. so what's gonna be on this stall then? -apart from the new leaflets and a few +apart from the new leaflets and a few some re re-use labels. yeah. you're gonna buy, you're gonna buy some? @@ -58820,26 +58767,26 @@ i'll just do it. okay. those traidcraft ones. we've got some money. -money sitting round accounts doing nothing. +money sitting round accounts doing nothing. how much money have we got? oh. probably loads. can't remember. i'd better let you know what we have got in stock just in case there's anything there that you're yeah. -you haven't have you? +you haven't have you? no. i i don't think so. -are you gonna get leaflets and you know friends of the earth leaflets? -i've got l , well they've got loads, i've got a big wallet folder full of all the various leaflets. +are you gonna get leaflets and you know friends of the earth leaflets? +i've got l , well they've got loads, i've got a big wallet folder full of all the various leaflets. you have. right. erm -car stickers and +car stickers and cakes or anything like produce or i don't know. i mean it, it's up to you. -i don't know if it's that sort of a do really. +i don't know if it's that sort of a do really. mm. hundred and sixty eight pounds thirty nine pence. oh gosh! @@ -58847,26 +58794,26 @@ is that their new catalogue or is that the one, the summer one? this is spring summer. it's it's the latest one isn't it? i haven't had another one . -i mean they may be just just just about bringing one out so +i mean they may be just just just about bringing one out so they're just about to bring one out aren't they? -the christmas lot will be out +the christmas lot will be out that one. sorry? august that one. -the r s p b -well i i've been sent a local -oh that was is that true? +the r s p b +well i i've been sent a local +oh that was is that true? no i've got a -no, it said it in there +no, it said it in there i've got a local group six pound order form autumn and winter ninety one. but i don't think they change that much. i think they just sort of it's the same thing in a different order. -and it's it's got a lot of sort of stuff that's left over from +and it's it's got a lot of sort of stuff that's left over from christmassy things that'll do. yeah. erm. -but i mean do we want to have any produce or anything else? +but i mean do we want to have any produce or anything else? i'm just looking at this stall thinking there's gonna be next to nothing on it. mm. yeah. @@ -58877,7 +58824,7 @@ to make it look right so good advertising! what is the, what is the concert in fact? well i, i honestly don't know an awful lot about it. -i don't think he knows that much +i don't think he knows that much it was low cost through the no cos it's concert. there's going @@ -58887,17 +58834,17 @@ all saints, they were going to have a concert weren't they. no. this is at the rhodes centre. the rhodes centre. -the concert at which we've got this stall. +the concert at which we've got this stall. yeah. -the traidcraft's stall. +the traidcraft's stall. . -i mean he kept he didn't know. +i mean he kept he didn't know. he said to me on the phone he didn't know a great deal cos he was just getting it all together. and he said, today he phoned me just as i was going out and i didn't really sort of stop and talk to him very long. he just asked me what we needed and i said well a table. we don't really need anything else do we? like power supply or -oh no quite +oh no quite something with flashing lights on it! so what time of the day is that? it's evening. @@ -58913,18 +58860,18 @@ i mean well i don't know! sounds a funny, funny evening to me! bit of a mish-mash isn't it. i mean -but he's he just +but he's he just the oth . the other thing we could do. sorry. liz. -is is to see whether green consumer rob and trish want to, to to have something. -i guess that would be a . +is is to see whether green consumer rob and trish want to, to to have something. +i guess that would be a . i mean i wonder who exactly you're attracting if you've got people coming to listen to music and then -well i think something to do with the church isn't it. -i think he mentioned the church +well i think something to do with the church isn't it. +i think he mentioned the church go through the church ? -i don't know what the one,the the there's usually a theme for every one world week each year and i don't know what the theme is for this year. +i don't know what the one,the the there's usually a theme for every one world week each year and i don't know what the theme is for this year. . act together for tomorrow's world. yeah! @@ -58941,68 +58888,68 @@ i don't know. i'll ask him. i'll ask him . erm we'd better get on to a few other things. -i've got erm greenpeace written to me. -they're having a family fun day on what day is it. +i've got erm greenpeace written to me. +they're having a family fun day on what day is it. saturday the twenty eighth of september. -that's at much hadham hall, village hall. +that's at much hadham hall, village hall. two o'clock to five o'clock. they want to know if we want to have a stall there? -family fun day much hadham village hall? +family fun day much hadham village hall? yeah. do you know where that is in much hadham? opposite the bull pub isn't it? right. -er he wants to know do we want to have a stall there and that's gonna cost us five pounds. +er he wants to know do we want to have a stall there and that's gonna cost us five pounds. if we have that. erm -well you could get produce for that. -and then if you ordered now. +well you could get produce for that. +and then if you ordered now. i bet they probably be really competing with them in a way won't we cos they've got all the same sort of stuff. won't they? yeah. -greenpeace sell them mugs and re-use labels and sort of things like that. +greenpeace sell them mugs and re-use labels and sort of things like that. i don't know what you think. -erm and there's er +erm and there's er i would suggest if it's a fun day why don't we do a game or something. why do, you know. well it's. they're celebrating their twentieth birthday celebrations. -erm and then th in the evening there's an event. +erm and then th in the evening there's an event. which starts at eight o'clock with two live bands, cabaret, disco and bar. tickets three pound fifty. does anybody want to go? -that's a good idea but it's offer to do a game. -well they've got what they've got on here is they've got whale watch talk and slides. +that's a good idea but it's offer to do a game. +well they've got what they've got on here is they've got whale watch talk and slides. . punch and judy show. -magic and juggling with ka plate spinning. +magic and juggling with ka plate spinning. er playbus painting competition. -raffle, refreshments, tombola and various merchandise stalls so i suppose that's us. +raffle, refreshments, tombola and various merchandise stalls so i suppose that's us. quite mm. do they do fire eating act or -we can contortionism or my legs up behind my neck. -an alternative might be to just to ask whether some of our membership forms could be put out so that +we can contortionism or my legs up behind my neck. +an alternative might be to just to ask whether some of our membership forms could be put out so that well i think they're more interested in the five pounds! yeah alright well. yeah. i mean to make a contribution. no to be honest because that that's what greenpeace do isn't it? don't you belong? -yeah start the harlow one up +yeah start the harlow one up yeah. -the whole of their effort really is devoted to +the whole of their effort really is devoted to yeah they don't do it. they're actually, they just do fund raising to their local groups and everything else is obviously sort of controlled by central office or that's right everything is central. -ac action is central or something. +ac action is central or something. yeah but i mean -so they're probably just gonna have their you know merchandise and a few people sort of +so they're probably just gonna have their you know merchandise and a few people sort of it's difficult really because i mean we're sort of striving for the same sort of things i know. yeah. aren't we. -it's er you don't want to be seen to be erm +it's er you don't want to be seen to be erm who's it actually run by? competing with each other in any way. well. @@ -59016,55 +58963,55 @@ oh well. it's signed by s . oh no sorry.. that can't possibly say . -well it says leslie at the top. +well it says leslie at the top. but there's something else underneath. i mean is that but is that a greenpeace central office thing or is it erm a local group. a local group? east herts. -but does it, pat does it doesn't he? +but does it, pat does it doesn't he? for herts yeah. he still does it now. how do you know? that have got so involved in that. yeah. -and and bob did it here in bishop's stortford but i don't know whether he's still i think he still does it because he was very committed. -but i i just pat was doing it for bishop's stortford on or thereabouts because he sent me all the details about the whale walk . +and and bob did it here in bishop's stortford but i don't know whether he's still i think he still does it because he was very committed. +but i i just pat was doing it for bishop's stortford on or thereabouts because he sent me all the details about the whale walk . cos i i gave his name to this guy organizing the one world week. and he hadn't had any joy out of greenpeace. can i borrow that a minute? what this? yeah -the problem we've got with greenpeace they might not have so much in the way of merchandise and they just have the stickers and -there's the leaflets. +the problem we've got with greenpeace they might not have so much in the way of merchandise and they just have the stickers and +there's the leaflets. things and leaflets. yeah i think it just depends whether the local group want to take up the option or not. -i don't think there's anything i've got to tell you. -er except there's a day of action but it's right that's right into november now so you can hear about that . -so we this next meeting at +i don't think there's anything i've got to tell you. +er except there's a day of action but it's right that's right into november now so you can hear about that . +so we this next meeting at yeah. -i i think we can sort out more about the st stall i mean if we can sell things -well this this this er greenpeace letter predates the september. +i i think we can sort out more about the st stall i mean if we can sell things +well this this this er greenpeace letter predates the september. oh that is a pity. -i think that's actually a bit too soon to get ourselves organized -shall i shall i just write off and send them like pound or donation and a few leaflets could +i think that's actually a bit too soon to get ourselves organized +shall i shall i just write off and send them like pound or donation and a few leaflets could yeah. say we're quite prepared to make a contribution, mm. -you put them out or circulate them. +you put them out or circulate them. yeah? yeah i mean don't think rob would be interested. yeah. he he ought to know about it though i'll ask him about it. cos he lives up the road from there doesn't he? -oh yeah. +oh yeah. erm and he could collect some money for the . alright i'll tell yeah. -i expect he, you know they're fairly busy but you know they may well +i expect he, you know they're fairly busy but you know they may well and i'll tell not want to go. yeah. @@ -59072,27 +59019,27 @@ anyway i'll see you all on wednesday thanks for coming. erm bye liz. -i'll going in the afternoon +i'll going in the afternoon there's a few other things that i've got to get through here. i mean -erm i've got here. -i've been sent some stuff by chris who used to run harlow group. +erm i've got here. +i've been sent some stuff by chris who used to run harlow group. oh yeah. chris who was that? ? . not christine! -yeah that's right they cos erm so i've got a whole long list of all these people who used to belong to harlow which is absolutely enormous. +yeah that's right they cos erm so i've got a whole long list of all these people who used to belong to harlow which is absolutely enormous. is that friends of the earth? yeah. -masses of names +masses of names loads of money and well no, i -no they've folded now +no they've folded now they have folded. -well i think that list is the list that what was his name, chris? -quite a few as well. +well i think that list is the list that what was his name, chris? +quite a few as well. but if you look properly it's a, that is not only harlow. remember he wanted to merge the groups? don't you remember? @@ -59115,31 +59062,31 @@ stort valley group . well there's a lo quite a lot. it's mostly harlow actually when you look through it. but there are bishop's stortford ones too. -yeah that's all the +yeah that's all the and the vast majority's harlow. that was his plan of having what, what do they do they want. what do they want to do? do they want join our group or nothing. -he said he he's apparently just moved and he's got involved with this other charity erm to do with the united nations friends of the earth and just passed it on to me. -cos the there there must be useful contacts you see. +he said he he's apparently just moved and he's got involved with this other charity erm to do with the united nations friends of the earth and just passed it on to me. +cos the there there must be useful contacts you see. people who sympathize. we've got the names. mm. they were fairly enthusiastic when they started off. mm. -so i -but i i mean we i don't know whether you think it's worth contacting or not. +so i +but i i mean we i don't know whether you think it's worth contacting or not. it might be. yes. w either when we've got a reason to contact them yeah. -or with a specific letter for them saying you know welcome if you if you feel like it. -actually just just quickly er i just noticed on that list of your questionnaires that we got back a couple that they didn't actually know what was going on. -and that you know perhaps this is er erm publicity wise i wonder whether we're falling a bit short on our publicity. +or with a specific letter for them saying you know welcome if you if you feel like it. +actually just just quickly er i just noticed on that list of your questionnaires that we got back a couple that they didn't actually know what was going on. +and that you know perhaps this is er erm publicity wise i wonder whether we're falling a bit short on our publicity. well. -they didn't know i mean like first newsletter we've had in ages. +they didn't know i mean like first newsletter we've had in ages. and it's something else that we need to get we can't just sort of no exactly @@ -59148,21 +59095,21 @@ but it's ever so easy for somebody to sit at home and say well you should be doi oh yeah yeah. and not doing no i'm i'm not sa , i'm not saying. -i'm not saying you should be doing anything i'm just er +i'm not saying you should be doing anything i'm just er no i didn't mean you, i meant them! no well . -i well really i don't think you should say you're not doing enough! -no +i well really i don't think you should say you're not doing enough! +no i think last year more or less shows that we really have to concentrate on one thing. do it and then plan yeah. plan the next . -because otherwise we just +because otherwise we just and then write about it if we want to. yeah. -so what what we'll do quickly to write and inform them all that we're doing this stall and won't we? +so what what we'll do quickly to write and inform them all that we're doing this stall and won't we? yes. -we could even send them a recycling sheet. +we could even send them a recycling sheet. yeah. and the most recent newsletter. yeah. @@ -59173,16 +59120,16 @@ yeah. or that lot? sorry? yeah sorry i was also tal we were talking about our own membership -talking about stortford +talking about stortford oh right! and we passed on. -no i think they i mean +no i think they i mean they complain they don't get any information. -my first contacts with friends of the earth in this region sort of what six years ago was harlow. +my first contacts with friends of the earth in this region sort of what six years ago was harlow. mm. -and they were all enthusiastic and confident and +and they were all enthusiastic and confident and well what happened to them? -and when there was another friend who was still over here at that time. +and when there was another friend who was still over here at that time. and we went three times and they always planned and planned and planned and had ideas what they could do. and they never pulled round to actually doing it no. @@ -59191,18 +59138,18 @@ right. and i think the same happened as with us. they wrote letters and they did didn't have the energy mm. -to write again and again you know and you never get a positive answer, clear answer first, first time round do you? +to write again and again you know and you never get a positive answer, clear answer first, first time round do you? mm. you have to write and and write more details or put more pressure on and have more people write. -but if you just write a single letter +but if you just write a single letter yeah but you should . -i know you two have been +i know you two have been yeah. mm. i'm used to it. -i mean it evaporates. +i mean it evaporates. . -didn't we have er a membership thing which said about erm membership form which actually explained what what we did in if you want to join return this sort of thing. +didn't we have er a membership thing which said about erm membership form which actually explained what what we did in if you want to join return this sort of thing. yeah. i've got loads of those. have you still got those? @@ -59221,35 +59168,35 @@ sort of what's the approximate number of people on it? i don't know. i'm not very good at estimating numbers. one two three four -oh and then there was there's it's it's it's not all harlow it's all just +oh and then there was there's it's it's it's not all harlow it's all just yeah it's stort valley. ya. -this chris what was his name? +this chris what was his name? i don't remember. i don't, didn't even know his name was chris. don't you remember he he then suggested th that walk along the stort? i do yeah. -i mean i'd forgotten all about him but i can remember +i mean i'd forgotten all about him but i can remember do you remember that. that was a really silly thing wasn't it? can i just have a look kath? yeah. -he organized it all and then i think was it a week before he suddenly said well we can't possibly have two hundred people walking along a nature trail that we want to protect. -and he was really of the illusion that there might be i think two hundred no six hundred people +he organized it all and then i think was it a week before he suddenly said well we can't possibly have two hundred people walking along a nature trail that we want to protect. +and he was really of the illusion that there might be i think two hundred no six hundred people two hundred people might turn up. turning up. in the end i think three people turned up. oh. -it was, it was no it was +it was, it was no it was this looks really interesting. get it. i had to write off yeah. -er it was a nice er display thing to show to show the kids when you do talks in schools. +er it was a nice er display thing to show to show the kids when you do talks in schools. yeah yeah. well i mean i'd certainly use it. is is that greenpeace? -yeah that's what i think is it's no +yeah that's what i think is it's no it's a resources pack mm. it's his own is it? @@ -59258,16 +59205,16 @@ oh yeah. oh yeah. for ten instead of twenty. originally cost twenty pounds and we could get it for ten it's er -it's chris -it's erm living forests resources pack. +it's chris +it's erm living forests resources pack. looks good doesn't it?that i thought. -erm with all sorts of po posters and teacher's notes and things. +erm with all sorts of po posters and teacher's notes and things. well i firmly believe in building up a library . so do i. good i'm glad i i mean there's you said that because i w i want to buy a book! -no library because i think er if you are contacted for information and you are able to say okay we have a book or we have books. +no library because i think er if you are contacted for information and you are able to say okay we have a book or we have books. yeah. that's that's one of the things i i i ke , i've kept all my new scientists. i keep these. @@ -59276,79 +59223,79 @@ i go through them gonna collate that cos there's loads of stuff in there good. yeah. but i do get quite a few people phone me as you know asking for information. i just photocopy relevant bits -none of none of them has got in contact with me. +none of none of them has got in contact with me. really! no. aren't they funny. i get the feeling well i should give you er that they either phone in. -phone me and then get it all given to them just like that. +phone me and then get it all given to them just like that. that yeah. and no further effort involved cos well i should, i could . no it isn't. this woman who, who keeps phoning me up about all this oil pollution on her land. she she. -i sent, i wrote off to friends of the earth, i got a load of information all about the law and she still phones me up and say oh you know what the district council's they won't do anything and the n r a wasn't doing anything. +i sent, i wrote off to friends of the earth, i got a load of information all about the law and she still phones me up and say oh you know what the district council's they won't do anything and the n r a wasn't doing anything. and i said well when did you last contact them? february! -apparently she's got a problem that the oil pollution is coming off this site where they're refurbishing the boilers. -it's gotten on to her land and off her land and into the ditch, which is you know the n r a +apparently she's got a problem that the oil pollution is coming off this site where they're refurbishing the boilers. +it's gotten on to her land and off her land and into the ditch, which is you know the n r a where is that? -er roydon some way? +er roydon some way? you know where all those nurseries are? -and because the oil is coming to the ditch via her land they can't have a go at the primary source. +and because the oil is coming to the ditch via her land they can't have a go at the primary source. this is what she said and i, to me it doesn't sound right. -she said nobody'll nob they all say they haven't got the power to prosecute and i said well the n r a has. +she said nobody'll nob they all say they haven't got the power to prosecute and i said well the n r a has. they've got more clout than anybody else. mm. more clout than the district council. and then she keeps saying but you know what these councils are like. and i said i'm not talking about the council, i'm talking about the n r a! -and now she wants me to find out how can er found out about a solicitor or somebody who specialises in this sort of thing. +and now she wants me to find out how can er found out about a solicitor or somebody who specialises in this sort of thing. to take the district council to court. -so that she's more expensive to them than this other lot will be. +so that she's more expensive to them than this other lot will be. apparently they're causing quite te dreadful pollution. -it's all this oil from the boilers leaking on to her into her soil and out into the ditch. -well +it's all this oil from the boilers leaking on to her into her soil and out into the ditch. +well certainly is. -but erm in the back of my mind there comes that she's saying to me don't get involved, don't get involved. +but erm in the back of my mind there comes that she's saying to me don't get involved, don't get involved. you know who owns all that land, it's the mafia. and this could be why she's getting nowhere. you could give her er erm er wr , give her the address of friends of the earth, london. oh she's already . that's how she got in contact with me! -you see they refer everybody on and then i +you see they refer everybody on and then i well but they should give her a soli , the name of a solicitor. there must be green solicitors about. -i have to write to them and ask them and about a month later they reply to me and i pass it on to her. +i have to write to them and ask them and about a month later they reply to me and i pass it on to her. because i don't know off hand. -i've asked jeffrey to ask a friend about it who's a solicitor if he knows anybody but i c , i can't i haven't got the in information. +i've asked jeffrey to ask a friend about it who's a solicitor if he knows anybody but i c , i can't i haven't got the in information. i don't -does anybody of you remember where friends of the earth england erm analyze their expenditures. -their income and their finance for the last year? -i i saw it somewhere and i got lost track of it. -and i was appalled as to how much they spend on publicity. +does anybody of you remember where friends of the earth england erm analyze their expenditures. +their income and their finance for the last year? +i i saw it somewhere and i got lost track of it. +and i was appalled as to how much they spend on publicity. but i can't do anything with it because i lost the numbers. mm. i don't know i'll have, have a look. i don't remember seeing the thing is this . -does anybody of you seen that or remember? +does anybody of you seen that or remember? no. no. no. -so are we saying yes to that? +so are we saying yes to that? yeah. yeah. -erm can i just ask you. +erm can i just ask you. does anybody wanna go on the energy campaign weekend? no thank you. -and there's this book. -which i think we might like to don't worry . -erm energy without aids. -which i think would be a good idea if we got it because i don't know about you but i'm always having arguments with people who say oh we can't have the whole country covered in windmills and +and there's this book. +which i think we might like to don't worry . +erm energy without aids. +which i think would be a good idea if we got it because i don't know about you but i'm always having arguments with people who say oh we can't have the whole country covered in windmills and mm. things like that. they all think nuclear powers okay. @@ -59365,45 +59312,45 @@ well you don't get them. i do and i feel obliged to pass it all on. i can't just sort of no. -but it, i, it's only six ninety five and i thought if we had you know a few facts at our fingertips to say well that's all rubbish you know. +but it, i, it's only six ninety five and i thought if we had you know a few facts at our fingertips to say well that's all rubbish you know. so what is that? -is that er booklet or something? +is that er booklet or something? it's a book. book. -just talking about al you know alternative -on erm renewable yeah +just talking about al you know alternative +on erm renewable yeah energy really i think. yeah. -because they keep saying oh what's gonna happen when the whole population of china wants a fridge and +because they keep saying oh what's gonna happen when the whole population of china wants a fridge and mm god! i haven't got an answer for things like that. mm. there is no answer really. -because want to catch up with us and we're already using too much energy. +because want to catch up with us and we're already using too much energy. change your lifestyle. -i just thought the more facts you've got at your fingertips the more easy it is to persuade people. +i just thought the more facts you've got at your fingertips the more easy it is to persuade people. yeah if we've got some money we might as well spend it. yeah. yeah. okay. educate ourselves. -an and the next day of action as i said before is on tropical rainforests erm . +an and the next day of action as i said before is on tropical rainforests erm . connection with er tropical woods -oh we did actually do +oh we did actually do november the ninth. for the architects. like hertfordshire architects yeah. for example. do something basically have a -yes +yes mailshot or ring them up or. -they're a pretty depressed lot at the moment +they're a pretty depressed lot at the moment yeah i bet they are. they have nothing to do not much to look forward to so they'll probably like a bit of excitement. nothing to do. -no i i don't know what it's going to be about they haven't sent any information. +no i i don't know what it's going to be about they haven't sent any information. it's just that er i've got the date. right. when when they say. @@ -59420,37 +59367,37 @@ well if i if i get well it's only two week's after. yeah. and i don't know what it's going to be -you know know which would recommend +you know know which would recommend yeah. this. -i mean i have been into this window frame business. +i mean i have been into this window frame business. mm -because we have to have sash and sash soft wood. -so anyway various companies wrote. +because we have to have sash and sash soft wood. +so anyway various companies wrote. well they do use tropical rainforest wood but yeah. -it's government er schemes. +it's government er schemes. yeah it's like some sort of erm okay. yeah. -and i mean i have, i i remember that on some t v programmes they they said it's all bogus +and i mean i have, i i remember that on some t v programmes they they said it's all bogus mm. i mean that it is not really government run er . they reforest it but what they reforest is eucalyptus or -yeah palm erm they oil palm plantations +yeah palm erm they oil palm plantations mm. mm. they just er . actually i've got a, i've got a brilliant picture that i took outside the train. -erm we were travelling through malaysia and erm it's just one canopy tree standing on its own in the middle of nowhere. +erm we were travelling through malaysia and erm it's just one canopy tree standing on its own in the middle of nowhere. and there's all this sort of undergrowth. and it's obviously that one wasn't, just didn't want it or it was dead or something and they just left it. mhm. and it's just the one. -and then i've got all the pictures of all the logs on the train wagons and er that was really it was a, it was a good picture actually cos i thought oh look at that poor old tree there it's +and then i've got all the pictures of all the logs on the train wagons and er that was really it was a, it was a good picture actually cos i thought oh look at that poor old tree there it's yeah. all its friends and then it was just standing there on the ground. -but really it's completely it's completely wiped out malaysia the whole of central malaysia is just just gone. -and all the soil's eroding cos it's sort of sand and it's red. +but really it's completely it's completely wiped out malaysia the whole of central malaysia is just just gone. +and all the soil's eroding cos it's sort of sand and it's red. and it goes into dust. so it goes everywhere so i mean there's gonna be trouble with that in the future . it's where they get all the flooding isn't it? @@ -59460,7 +59407,6 @@ oh. okay. thanks. thank you very much. - right mom? where's the food? i'm hungry mom. @@ -59469,7 +59415,7 @@ just for me? oh gratitude. picker. oh hey clifton's coming round, gonna play football -clifton and we're gonna play football +clifton and we're gonna play football what's clifton clifton what's up michael? @@ -59514,7 +59460,7 @@ what? what's that shit music in the background? what's that shit mus come and finish your dinner -oi listen to this. +oi listen to this. you know that taping thing? you know the micro thing you know? yeah i'm doing it now. yes i am. @@ -59523,7 +59469,7 @@ it is . not for me man. nick who? nick who? -oh duane told me something about nick or nicky. +oh duane told me something about nick or nicky. was it? what's he say? oh right. @@ -59536,16 +59482,16 @@ i'll phone nick and colin right. alright then laters. dickhead, dickhead. laters. -he said some and get your and finish your dinner +he said some and get your and finish your dinner i have to phone nick forget about nick -shit what's nick's phone number? -and stop swearing the tape +shit what's nick's phone number? +and stop swearing the tape you're allowed to swear. no. fucking hell man. oh no. -i can swear it i like okay +i can swear it i like okay hello hi nick yes @@ -59555,7 +59501,7 @@ i'm taping you hello say hello to microphone hello mister mike -yeah, pucker, hard core yeah, oi coming down park? +yeah, pucker, hard core yeah, oi coming down park? i dunno come on yeah y he @@ -59570,7 +59516,7 @@ what? yeah, it's bloody wicked. i'm i'm going down there at five o'clock yeah yeah -alright then, if you're not doing nothing right alright then laters, pucker. +alright then, if you're not doing nothing right alright then laters, pucker. who else can i ring? mhm? i have to get a lot of people @@ -59578,16 +59524,16 @@ don't use my telephone no seven five hey -four four nine . +four four nine . hello, colin? hold on -colin, yeah yeah, oi, d'you wanna come and play football then? +colin, yeah yeah, oi, d'you wanna come and play football then? yeah, what time do you reckon you'll be there? -er says he's gonna knock for me about five yeah and we're gonna be there at five yeah. +er says he's gonna knock for me about five yeah and we're gonna be there at five yeah. so what time d' you reckon you can get there by if you leave now? five past five what, if you leave now? -well after i've had my dinner five past five +well after i've had my dinner five past five alright then, you know where we're gonna be? yeah, it's either the fence yeah, you know that white fence, either there or on the other side where those gold things are you know, or if we're not there, go on the other side of the park where the other gold things are. know what i mean? @@ -59633,24 +59579,24 @@ mom. y'know when they're gonna say god, what kind of a family are there? yeah, just like any other normal family -no +no shut up -listen, you know yeah he went and brought a pot noodle cos he didn't want you to cook for him cos your food's really shit. +listen, you know yeah he went and brought a pot noodle cos he didn't want you to cook for him cos your food's really shit. it's nice they brought him up -no call it shit -mom +no call it shit +mom i don't want no more chips well don't have any i'm not mom, right, listen yeah. -i always looks after him +i always looks after him oh bloody hell mom take girls. they're gonna be there mom how many of you about eleven of us -yeah right nick lives in southgate right next to me,lives in, where's he live? -he lives right you know and +yeah right nick lives in southgate right next to me,lives in, where's he live? +he lives right you know and yes yeah, he lives there leave at half past ten @@ -59672,7 +59618,7 @@ well wicked. love you too much to ever stop love, rastafarian now right. no go away, who's it for ? -no it's for right in school +no it's for right in school yeah? yeah? are you taping now? @@ -59681,7 +59627,7 @@ okay . right in school yeah, erm after they gave us these yeah and they like wanna see like how we talk and all that. you know yeah. -rastafarian style and all +rastafarian style and all who wants who wants to see how you talk? er it's whatsit it's some some er norwegian thing and are you taping? @@ -59698,12 +59644,12 @@ she don't know what to say. .fuck off, you're allowed to swear as much as you like. are you. yeah. -fuck fuck fuck fuck i'm gonna fail +fuck fuck fuck fuck i'm gonna fail you're gonna fail is it? what's that you're gonna fail and you're gonna cheat for your g c s es ? -said that how am i gonna how am i gonna cheat +said that how am i gonna how am i gonna cheat you're gonna cheat. -you've got the answer sheet for the g c s es exam +you've got the answer sheet for the g c s es exam terry go away. okay i'm going i'm going. that is my very ungrateful sister who's a fat tart. @@ -59712,17 +59658,17 @@ it's in here. wicked. you know what i found, you know you walk all the way round with your friends down the village and you come home. yeah? -when you the other side telephone and i'll come and pick you up . +when you the other side telephone and i'll come and pick you up . what where the park is? -not where the park the village on the way down. +not where the park the village on the way down. yeah but i'm gonna walk with richie and andrew up to bloody down there. with richie and andrew innit? yeah and i give you a lift up to here . when you get the other side of the park yeah. -you know in the village there's a park where there's flowers. +you know in the village there's a park where there's flowers. no. -you know where +you know where yeah but everyone's gonna be walking there you don't mum. yeah but then you're gonna separate. no we don't we separate right at the bottom of this hill. @@ -59756,33 +59702,33 @@ mm? cornwall. innit? huh? -i put an ad for the cafe on this. +i put an ad for the cafe on this. shall i say shout. -here's a shout going out to college, the boys. +here's a shout going out to college, the boys. . yes. don't do that. i have to leave it on all the time though. -here's another shout going to in college, boy. +here's another shout going to in college, boy. i hate norwegian people. i hate norwegian people. -oh i asked steve he said he'll come. +oh i asked steve he said he'll come. steve said he'll come. yeah. luckily. huh? luckily. luckily. -who told your brother to have a birthday on bloody saturday? +who told your brother to have a birthday on bloody saturday? couldn't he have it something like next month or something. i bought some tapes to listen to. -i got megahits thirteen, and oh yeah c d. +i got megahits thirteen, and oh yeah c d. cos i'm gonna tape it again cos my thing's clapped up and all.. what? the tape like i keep on doing it wrong. cos i done it with my old hi-fi yeah and it conked out. -it well it does tapes yeah but it's like the bass keeps on going down then it goes high then the main bit's like you know what i mean it all gets crapped up so i'll tape it again. +it well it does tapes yeah but it's like the bass keeps on going down then it goes high then the main bit's like you know what i mean it all gets crapped up so i'll tape it again. do you like it? what? that c d. @@ -59799,11 +59745,11 @@ she goes, fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck really loud yeah she goes fuck fuck who's that? my sister. she's got a bloody erm french g c s e today. -the main g s g c s e yeah for french, a whole big thing big . +the main g s g c s e yeah for french, a whole big thing big . she's leaving in a couple of weeks. -she's going college. -how long's your brother going going there? -my sister's gonna go to college. +she's going college. +how long's your brother going going there? +my sister's gonna go to college. maybe she might be. it's either , or sixth form. going to the sixth form? @@ -59811,7 +59757,7 @@ maybe. what is? is it? you p you should have played football yesterday you know. -i saw mustapha down there, he played went with his erm father. +i saw mustapha down there, he played went with his erm father. played football. huh? who came. @@ -59839,7 +59785,7 @@ listen to this now? who? yeah. yeah and teachers from our school are gonna listen to it. -mr is a wanker. +mr is a wanker. it don't matter. they can't give me detention for this. yeah man. @@ -59860,7 +59806,7 @@ nick. besides nick. everyone. everyone oh. -oi nick,nick i done this bad burp +oi nick,nick i done this bad burp and i put it on my ghetto blaster yeah, me and nicky listened to it yeah, and it comes out wicked . put that on. no it's not on this tape, it's on the other tape. @@ -59878,9 +59824,9 @@ mhm. mhm. mhm. mhm. -guess who asked out nick. +guess who asked out nick. mm. -guess who asked out, +guess who asked out, who? derek. mhm he's a dickhead isn't he. @@ -59909,7 +59855,7 @@ or are you a bad girl? you're a poofter. is it still taping? yeah, leave it on. -get one big gruesome +get one big gruesome just do a real one mate. oi . execution thing. @@ -59917,11 +59863,11 @@ yeah. it's gonna be bad. you motherfucker. oh wicked, i can pick up the revs. -innit, pick up the revs. those fingerprints? +innit, pick up the revs. those fingerprints? me. you? no. -it wasn't what time is it tel? +it wasn't what time is it tel? it's erm five to. yeah. yeah. @@ -59932,8 +59878,8 @@ going to the park today. okay? are you taking the baby? no. -take all that hassle. -oh carolina is a girl she buck up in the +take all that hassle. +oh carolina is a girl she buck up in the and rock your body just like you move, some come girlie, girlie, da da, da da da da . go away michael! go, go to mummy. @@ -59944,7 +59890,7 @@ go away!! faggot! hello. yeah. -er erm possibly, yeah. +er erm possibly, yeah. you coming then? ah meet you up the park then? you got a , yeah, yeah! @@ -59957,13 +59903,13 @@ boo ooh! yeah. if i go, yeah? i'll be down the park. -i mean alright. +i mean alright. is it th , everybody's gonna be down the park, yeah? i dunno. what down the park now? no. what? -oh micky mars bars been knocking for me, clinton's supposed to be knocking for me, jay don't know what the fuck's he's, he's supposed to be doing! +oh micky mars bars been knocking for me, clinton's supposed to be knocking for me, jay don't know what the fuck's he's, he's supposed to be doing! oh. colin dunno know what he's gonna do. colin. @@ -59979,7 +59925,7 @@ look, if you wanna ride up, ride up, if you don't, don't. alright, give me a call. don't tal , i don't wanna talk to you nick. no i don't want to talk to nick. -nick i don't wanna talk to you. +nick i don't wanna talk to you. look i don't wanna talk, i wanna talk to paul. paul. word up. @@ -60011,20 +59957,20 @@ they're a bloody pest these kids! bikes are dangerous things aren't they? mm. but no, nothing wrong with a bike. -it's the one that is riding it's a the danger is! +it's the one that is riding it's a the danger is! yeah, well that's it! they whip mm. in and out and in and out, till mm. you don't know where they are! -in, in holland when we were there motor cars were not allowed on the roads! +in, in holland when we were there motor cars were not allowed on the roads! it was all push bikes! mm. the main street, you know? -course, there was a at the far end of the street, a a red long, long street it was! +course, there was a at the far end of the street, a a red long, long street it was! very long! -there was factories on it and of course the workers keep coming in and out. +there was factories on it and of course the workers keep coming in and out. look at the potatoes over there! mm. under plastic. @@ -60041,14 +59987,14 @@ for the band to sit is there? not really. hello david! hello! -no, it's just somewhere to sit in and look out at the en , er the ships and boats going by. +no, it's just somewhere to sit in and look out at the en , er the ships and boats going by. it's like a shelter. unless they mean to have a marina here are they? there's a marina down in the docks! oh, i see. well perhaps they're going to have races or something if the mm. -the couldn't be wider . +the couldn't be wider . the mm. water wouldn't be wide enough. @@ -60056,11 +60002,11 @@ mm. very strange! what shops are they? aha. -well this blue van is parry and blockwell the garage! +well this blue van is parry and blockwell the garage! this digging was here. mm. weren't it? -well i'd have thought i dunno! +well i'd have thought i dunno! by the church. yeah. mm. @@ -60078,25 +60024,25 @@ i know. it's football, as a rule, on a friday innit? oh it's friday! i keep thinking it's saturday! -no, there's is there? -she's umbrella ! -trying to hold it together ! +no, there's is there? +she's umbrella ! +trying to hold it together ! oh ! a lot of houses for sale!isn't there? -yes i've er that's what makes me wonder and they're they talk about building more! +yes i've er that's what makes me wonder and they're they talk about building more! the chances are we won't be going! they're building more for council houses. council tenants. -homeless families. -well they could buy some of these and turn these into council houses or flats or something like that. +homeless families. +well they could buy some of these and turn these into council houses or flats or something like that. well they could, but they won't! cos the people want too much for them! anything going on up here? no, i don't think -yep all looks quiet. +yep all looks quiet. bet that's getting damp! and it seems to be in a hole don't it? -it's down it's below the road as +it's down it's below the road as yes. well! yeah. @@ -60113,10 +60059,10 @@ these daffs ave come out. yeah. mm ahhh i think it's going to be a wet afternoon. -it's sleety ooking on the window look! -so i +it's sleety ooking on the window look! +so i you watch the rain hitting the windows, it's like sleet! -yeah , i think they said that er you know be today. +yeah , i think they said that er you know be today. yeah! is that snow on the mountains? didn't see it. @@ -60130,14 +60076,14 @@ ay we ought to have bought some knitting wool. and done something. well never mind, you got trousers to shorten. -and that . +and that . well you might as well do it and press the two together. two together. ey ou got two to shorten now! oh god! -sally says that cardigan that i knit , that black one, she said tha i , it's lovely to wear she said! +sally says that cardigan that i knit , that black one, she said tha i , it's lovely to wear she said! it's heavy! -and it doesn't stretch and it er er er it looks, it feels good she says! +and it doesn't stretch and it er er er it looks, it feels good she says! aha! what's that one? you know that black one? @@ -60153,7 +60099,7 @@ one eighty a ball she said! oh! i said i was thinking of making a waistcoat or something out of one. and she said it doesn't go bubbly. -the only, if anything it might shrink a little. +the only, if anything it might shrink a little. oh! not much. but you'd have to hand wash it? @@ -60162,7 +60108,7 @@ does she ? she boils hers and all! all the white one. oh! -yeah but er +yeah but er bleaches them and all! does she hand wash her woollies? yeah. @@ -60183,7 +60129,7 @@ they've let that . that's nice that one. yeah. nice and plain. -they're nice lit , little plain one like that gives you plenty of scope for a creeper up the wall don't they? +they're nice lit , little plain one like that gives you plenty of scope for a creeper up the wall don't they? i can't stand creepers on the walls! i'm afraid it brings the caterpillars in! oh no they don't! @@ -60191,13 +60137,13 @@ i dunno. that's why i can't do it. but some do. it all depends on the variety and the -there's house, we've just passed it now on the and it's er a montana clematis. +there's house, we've just passed it now on the and it's er a montana clematis. oh ey well it's at , it's all in the bloody attic! it's everywhere! oh god, i couldn't have it! gives me the creeps! -that's what i'd be scared of otherwise i'd put one. +that's what i'd be scared of otherwise i'd put one. that's it! do you want it or not? mhm. @@ -60205,23 +60151,23 @@ mm mm mm mm . mm mm mm mm mm mm mm . ooh! now it's starting. -come in the afternoon. +come in the afternoon. oh oh! -and they'll be looking for not for me +and they'll be looking for not for me i don't expect! ooh that's better! -get in the corner ! +get in the corner ! watch your wires! go on! come on! right. that's it! -the er here. +the er here. do you think we're gonna have snow? i hope not! i'll tell you. not, then yeah.. -i told you +i told you . oh i don't know! i don't know! @@ -60234,33 +60180,33 @@ ta so what they gonna build behind you, another garage? is it? mhm. -be alright won't it? +be alright won't it? oh yeah, it's a big . could be you extending?other shop do you think? it's all we know. what shop's down there? it's all the same one at the back. yeah but how many, how many times has it been a shop? -you don't seem to ge , er often does it? -no . +you don't seem to ge , er often does it? +no . yeah. -tell you what'll end up there +tell you what'll end up there so you wanna extend this back, this is in the right place this! yeah. -cos it people come off the sites or go to the corner shop, don't cross the road. -yeah, if that was where that garage is and all of this was clear it'd be great wouldn't it! +cos it people come off the sites or go to the corner shop, don't cross the road. +yeah, if that was where that garage is and all of this was clear it'd be great wouldn't it! yeah, you'd have your pull in as well! . -go on think about it! +go on think about it! ooh, you never give up ! well this is it? -of the -oh the the car people, it used to be! +of the +oh the the car people, it used to be! we've already got oh! -a garage down the end there. +a garage down the end there. if it was you see, they'd be quick enough coming to tell you! -ey right tara thanks! +ey right tara thanks! snotty, drizzly, runny noses! the parents' fault! everything he asked me to. @@ -60276,7 +60222,7 @@ no! there's big guys in rugby. it's there when i put -put some and some fingers +put some and some fingers mm? i just wish you hadn't got the glasses . it's for people @@ -60285,7 +60231,7 @@ as well. yeah, i'm gonna, i'm gonna be well you won't have bloody ! no! -but i don't go round do i? +but i don't go round do i? running round, bumming round . ah?.. who me? @@ -60300,9 +60246,9 @@ change it round then she won't come next time! that's right. gonna like it! you look more natural. -, cos we thought about getting a . +, cos we thought about getting a . .we'll just be , be about open. -well, didn't you tell them we're going out tonight separately and then there's the +well, didn't you tell them we're going out tonight separately and then there's the well the thing is whatever they do to it now it's going to last for two years. @@ -60320,7 +60266,7 @@ you can look after it now! i wa , i'm gonna pick him up! and not, come here! if i get it through -the m o t next february . +the m o t next february . here! take that . so that's just something . @@ -60329,7 +60275,7 @@ well that's right! then! yeah. grandfather clock. -more colder is it? +more colder is it? that one. that one? ding that'd get on @@ -60339,25 +60285,25 @@ knives and forks. it's not long enough! out here, in a minute. give them to me! -yeah well only talk about fishing, you see? +yeah well only talk about fishing, you see? i'm gonna be fishing all around the boat! no, not for long. but i got a good one! i've been getting getting out fish. -don't you can catch fish -well i'm gonna wait for while! -i'm afraid i'm gonna wait until it , cos you gotta wait for all of the salmon to come up river. +don't you can catch fish +well i'm gonna wait for while! +i'm afraid i'm gonna wait until it , cos you gotta wait for all of the salmon to come up river. rubbish! rubbish! because -if you catch a trout you should catch it before +if you catch a trout you should catch it before not with flies! he's catching trout and he's no, i'm fly fishing! catching salmon now! no way ! no! -there's a there's all that fish +there's a there's all that fish so you like fishing? especially fresh water. yeah! @@ -60373,10 +60319,10 @@ you can! there's the bridges! i said, well he said, it's two bridges. two bridges. -there's a road, you can't cross them! -the bridge here with another on? +there's a road, you can't cross them! +the bridge here with another on? how long is it ? -where he goes fishing, it's, the bridge is up +where he goes fishing, it's, the bridge is up not me! no she was that ! @@ -60389,14 +60335,14 @@ that we catch! carp for cooking. aspic's . i don't . -going down the right?, five years old down the river was the first time ever but just have to wait for him! +going down the right?, five years old down the river was the first time ever but just have to wait for him! oh! -two two traps . +two two traps . get your hands off it! no! ricky! come on! -granddad's , are you gonna eat it? +granddad's , are you gonna eat it? yeah. yeah. yes indeed! @@ -60405,49 +60351,49 @@ i go fly fishing. you'll love fly fishing! you wanna see it! when you gonna take me then? -you cast out you see them you see that fish! -and your lines and then you tease it!. +you cast out you see them you see that fish! +and your lines and then you tease it!. teasing it? i'll do it twice, and then tease it! same to you! -i was talking about the club and and that she was there! -then fishing you know,.. +i was talking about the club and and that she was there! +then fishing you know,.. ? i don't know what it was? this is bermondsey no. just take the cover. -one of the lads had nicked it started cooking it! +one of the lads had nicked it started cooking it! so scott ! . dad! scott and end up with bait! bloody eating it! -scott and , they caught a squid in scotland for bait now! +scott and , they caught a squid in scotland for bait now! that's yeah. and then his mum goes, what's that in the fridge? i said squid. get it out of here! -oh is it? -i've tried brains. +oh is it? +i've tried brains. oh,my dad yeah we heard that other . i got more chance of catching a fish now cos we're going saturday and sunday! -that's good and it's a what was this name? -she were you know, shaped in rings! -and she eat she eat it! +that's good and it's a what was this name? +she were you know, shaped in rings! +and she eat she eat it! that's ! ! -well it is only i've eat it! +well it is only i've eat it! oh! no! they weren't big enough. dad, did you get that t v from comet? the town comet? -shall we -you want all yo , all your stuff from ben in the +shall we +you want all yo , all your stuff from ben in the bag. i put all . . @@ -60458,55 +60404,55 @@ you've had warm weather out here. it needs to come down here. i'll drop it down a peg. -on one television so they're forty eight years old and they've never been . +on one television so they're forty eight years old and they've never been . i would want to save one now. i like it. -it's definitely don't +it's definitely don't did ricky do this? -it's just that er +it's just that er she's been in . -special offer on sunday. -is a three or four -each +special offer on sunday. +is a three or four +each yeah. yeah. and a hundred and fifty to cost . even after he comes in. come in! -fourteen forty +fourteen forty no! no! fourteen inch television, one in each room! excuse me! they won't ! -that's slightly . +that's slightly . one hundred and eighty five? -yeah one eighty five i paid seven hundred and twenty five pound! +yeah one eighty five i paid seven hundred and twenty five pound! is that ? seven hundred and twenty five it was my plan to get one though. -but, it's er it's +but, it's er it's it's a marvellous thing! they are ! yeah, but that's , mine had some -and now they're telling you, you got the video aren't they? -and they'll give you a one year warrantee . +and now they're telling you, you got the video aren't they? +and they'll give you a one year warrantee . and then granddad's got any videos,. . -it's to buy that picture a thou a thousand pounds! +it's to buy that picture a thou a thousand pounds! that's what rude, innit? . if you got . and ! what? -erm, derek said , and derek said that erm that he now hoping you'd go down and stay when they get naughty pictures! +erm, derek said , and derek said that erm that he now hoping you'd go down and stay when they get naughty pictures! yeah,! ! but the thing is, if you fall out of bed you ain't gonna sleep! -cos they their trouble that i i and away! -they says, well i here we go, on the chair count to ten! -divide by the number of that's not . +cos they their trouble that i i and away! +they says, well i here we go, on the chair count to ten! +divide by the number of that's not . that could be . it's very full now!. you count that. @@ -60520,13 +60466,13 @@ for running people's ? yeah. yeah! oh yeah! -well but i don't see why! -just cos -well hayden says to me, if you go either give me a ring, he said, and i . +well but i don't see why! +just cos +well hayden says to me, if you go either give me a ring, he said, and i . yeah, we'll have to do some work out . -which is the or the fourteen inch television colour telly i know because, the blokes let us down! -no, hayden says if we go to comet cos he said, cos i said i bought my video at comet and they were offering twenty five per cent off , twenty five per cent off off the at comet so that's about the third of the place . +which is the or the fourteen inch television colour telly i know because, the blokes let us down! +no, hayden says if we go to comet cos he said, cos i said i bought my video at comet and they were offering twenty five per cent off , twenty five per cent off off the at comet so that's about the third of the place . oh! so he didn't , you get twenty five percent off. @@ -60534,15 +60480,15 @@ we had fifty percent off the price you see!total. yeah. what about after sales service? who comet? -well i asked comet fridge! +well i asked comet fridge! , that's what she means! comet do it. -well they're . -i mean when i had we got c d serviced. -and don +well they're . +i mean when i had we got c d serviced. +and don and i come and said sixty pound! -no, but it be beneficial if it's comet and the receipt came back for our insurance from comet erm +no, but it be beneficial if it's comet and the receipt came back for our insurance from comet erm dixons! they're all, they're all same, they're all the same. @@ -60550,49 +60496,49 @@ comet and yes. it's all owned by kingfisher. kingfisher. -because if we bought the fridge and the at comet and collected the receipts back on the insurance . +because if we bought the fridge and the at comet and collected the receipts back on the insurance . he said they're all the same. they're owned by kingfisher ,. -we we bought this fridge from comet to keep the insurance -i was oh it's still working, yes. -and he says that -well at least it's pounds off . +we we bought this fridge from comet to keep the insurance +i was oh it's still working, yes. +and he says that +well at least it's pounds off . yeah, well mum's telly eleven . and they said to her now, not to insure it . when it's gone, it's now . . i tell you what you . -it's something like a +it's something like a how much did it cost last time? -i'm them over. +i'm them over. paul's mother's flipping well angry! -last time he that's my . +last time he that's my . why does ? he, he might say to me you can't use . that's a load of nonsense! but i said to them,take that cheque . -oh fucking hell ! -.because mum's territory is there you got a few people complained! +oh fucking hell ! +.because mum's territory is there you got a few people complained! and it's . and sure it was . it's like i've got nothing to do! -the . +the . it's all downstairs. we've asked them to try. they're here to celebrate the . -how long till you're back in your now then mum? +how long till you're back in your now then mum? you want to be sure of comet. -ask where's my dealer? +ask where's my dealer? where's the after sales service come from? -oh, especially with a . +oh, especially with a . mm. why didn't he give you some hotpoints? but who'd buy it then? that's where i've gotta go, yeah. -no you, you go down , off and she said you can full holidays arranged daily, and we came that was on the tuesday, the wednesday i had to phone them, done on friday! -and they'll +no you, you go down , off and she said you can full holidays arranged daily, and we came that was on the tuesday, the wednesday i had to phone them, done on friday! +and they'll . that erm i'll never know! @@ -60601,68 +60547,68 @@ i don't want that! oh yeah! that's yeah, and that's nice! -claimed about half of it. +claimed about half of it. never heard of it! -oh i know -anytime -she might have been . +oh i know +anytime +she might have been . or round? yeah. on the monday. it takes four ah? -or five . +or five . you can look! mm. hard cash! that one's a daisy! innit beautiful! -if you've got a t v remote control things once he'd said that he'd . +if you've got a t v remote control things once he'd said that he'd . so you're lucky!, at least you know. -cos there's one problem that if you tape a programme . +cos there's one problem that if you tape a programme . mm. -and all i remember is the then afterward . +and all i remember is the then afterward . well that's -you can't ask +you can't ask i suppose? yeah. yeah. and it's three and they want forty the video innit? -we could've had a two forty video tape, it said, two forty on it and when we put it in weren't it?. +we could've had a two forty video tape, it said, two forty on it and when we put it in weren't it?. said two forty on it, didn't it? two forty box! oh i shall . you can buy one video from here. -oh well +oh well how much does that cost? only one eighty. how much did that cost ? he just, he just i do , you put it in the big shop didn't you? i put it in, okay -, over er the pub at the end. +, over er the pub at the end. you put it in, you don't go onto, you don't pay . -well we got so phillips on the, on the sheet and er they're all . -they're he got all the videos from the states,in the states. -sent over all these blooming instructions for the video was all i needed! +well we got so phillips on the, on the sheet and er they're all . +they're he got all the videos from the states,in the states. +sent over all these blooming instructions for the video was all i needed! and the american system from argentina -and er just you got the switch? +and er just you got the switch? yeah, you got the no. switch here. but his accommodation over there. -unless you . +unless you . is that out there? she's coming back in the . -cos she just took them off and then and now now she owes me something posh. +cos she just took them off and then and now now she owes me something posh. and now . so where do you get your television teletext then? -all in the remote control for the lot!. -we were looking at the and not teletext. -which is the smaller any more. +all in the remote control for the lot!. +we were looking at the and not teletext. +which is the smaller any more. no! not the one we looked at . well mine and nana's isn't teletext. @@ -60678,11 +60624,11 @@ about about three. what? oh! -all you do turn on the thing +all you do turn on the thing no, you let him show me alright? no just show -yeah, alright then i won't move yet -where do i keep +yeah, alright then i won't move yet +where do i keep mm. but he does to me! oh right! @@ -60691,7 +60637,7 @@ well i'm yes. put down . do you have to ? -yeah, well ah but i walked through u +yeah, well ah but i walked through u can he go out? oh yeah. he's going now! @@ -60703,16 +60649,16 @@ but i'm inclined to yeah. get a general impression right, cos yes. -i'm finding something totally wrong with and got shot of it and then things have been +i'm finding something totally wrong with and got shot of it and then things have been well actually he didn't, but he says -worse thinking he'd been to solicitors but i'm trying to track down anybody! +worse thinking he'd been to solicitors but i'm trying to track down anybody! just trying to get some information. -apparently oh my god tha they're that much within the law. +apparently oh my god tha they're that much within the law. yeah, that's what we've been told. they must have a legal section cos this is one of the biggest organisations,leisure group in britain yeah. for caravans. -they, they, they,they own +they, they, they,they own they're going to clear themselves aren't they? you clear you! more than that! @@ -60725,14 +60671,14 @@ yeah, you see! well we may as well have got that money and thrown it down the toilet! gone straight in the bin! well that's right! -straight away this year, you get a list through now, do you want winter cleaning done, curtains cleaned, +straight away this year, you get a list through now, do you want winter cleaning done, curtains cleaned, yeah. carpets cleaned, upholstery cleaned? or outside valet, do you want the underneath painted with grease and everything? i say we did have it done. -by the time you add all that up if you're not local. +by the time you add all that up if you're not local. all your profit's gone! -you'll you will end up paying them! +you'll you will end up paying them! yeah. yes. and then we paid for a winter clean. @@ -60742,10 +60688,10 @@ i had to go down there twice to get it done! okay? because the windows were filthy! -twice, that we argued . -well, well you came here didn't you when the curtains hadn't been +twice, that we argued . +well, well you came here didn't you when the curtains hadn't been jump down then phillip! -and when i spoke to mr , i said well if i was renting a caravan and went to see it and it was dirty like that, i wouldn't want to take it on! +and when i spoke to mr , i said well if i was renting a caravan and went to see it and it was dirty like that, i wouldn't want to take it on! and, i said surely you have somebody who goes round and checks them before they're let? no, he said! so what they do is, apparently they wait for somebody to complain @@ -60753,8 +60699,8 @@ yeah. and then they look at the caravan! do they? that's somebody who comes up to rent it! -so i said and in that case then probably you move them into another caravan? -oh no, we clean it and they go into it! +so i said and in that case then probably you move them into another caravan? +oh no, we clean it and they go into it! i said, you mean to say people wait around while you clean the caravan? i don't believe it! you're alright , you're alright for your holiday, find a caravan dirty, you've gotta complain before it gets cleaned! @@ -60771,28 +60717,28 @@ mum! they're not gonna want to know! they don't belong there. yeah. -and you can't complain to th , the chamber of commerce because if they show this up too much -temby's gonna lose a lot of trade! -i don't want +and you can't complain to th , the chamber of commerce because if they show this up too much +temby's gonna lose a lot of trade! +i don't want yeah. mm. i mean -they have their, their +they have their, their i said to him we've been conned! i said we've been stitched up! that's how i look at it! i was furious last week! mm, so i ju , i was just trying to find, but you see, there again you're new people, we found new people last week didn't we. yeah. -he wasn't happy that man. +he wasn't happy that man. he bought a big caravan, he was very unhappy! there we are! the way they do no, but these caravans should you carry on? i don't know, is it here or over there?. -so you see, this is only way you can them! -get to a situation where you've had a caravan before and to make any money to pay, you've then got to buy another caravan to subsidise that one and you seem to be it's sort of +so you see, this is only way you can them! +get to a situation where you've had a caravan before and to make any money to pay, you've then got to buy another caravan to subsidise that one and you seem to be it's sort of like a chain all time. mm. yeah. @@ -60805,7 +60751,7 @@ yeah, we did. cor talk about make your curl! dreadful! mm. -so as i say, but i'm just resigned to it! +so as i say, but i'm just resigned to it! so what would you have to do now then? take your caravan off? we can't! @@ -60821,12 +60767,12 @@ just pay cash mum! for them. what darling? -in the end we're gonna out. -can we ? +in the end we're gonna out. +can we ? we feel mm? we're gonna lose -not only any money that we get back on it, but we lose the letting +not only any money that we get back on it, but we lose the letting money mm. we lose the investment! @@ -60844,7 +60790,7 @@ for them it is , yeah it's a good one for them! they're too big to fight, that's the trouble isn't it? are they? that's what everybody says! -i see, i'm, i can't accept that, there's gotta be a way +i see, i'm, i can't accept that, there's gotta be a way no! round it! no, i'm afraid not! @@ -60853,7 +60799,7 @@ i've, i've threatened him! i will be outside with a placard! do not buy a caravan on field park! i've threatened him, that's what i'm going to do! -of the er erm . +of the er erm . i've seen it done last week,. throw a brick through his windows! there's been nothing done! @@ -60879,7 +60825,7 @@ was he pissed? yeah. what it see what -is now when i drop this one round i'll tell you about then. +is now when i drop this one round i'll tell you about then. yes. okay? er @@ -60887,37 +60833,37 @@ will we have hot water? well don't say no, cos i'm going home! er -you can what it is, there's new laws +you can what it is, there's new laws that's right. coming out now, it's no , nothing to do with us. there shouldn't be any water heaters in bathrooms, okay? right? -now we're gonna get it moved okay? -you can use it, but it's at your own risk, alright? -oh that's -well that's too +now we're gonna get it moved okay? +you can use it, but it's at your own risk, alright? +oh that's +well that's too oh my god now ! -well what what happened? +well what what happened? what are we sure's gonna happen as far as ? -well what it is you've used it all last year haven't you? +well what it is you've used it all last year haven't you? right? -all you wanna to do is the ventilation on it. +all you wanna to do is the ventilation on it. do you? okay? er oh . -all, all our vans now are are to be re-flued. +all, all our vans now are are to be re-flued. yeah. are you with me? yeah, cos we saw one in that oh that's right. kitchen . that's right. -but what it is er they've been like that for years, like, in the bathrooms +but what it is er they've been like that for years, like, in the bathrooms to daddy. and all! -you know, i mean all it is like i say, it's i'd use it, put it that way. +you know, i mean all it is like i say, it's i'd use it, put it that way. right yeah. i'd use it. @@ -60925,10 +60871,10 @@ er, i would not have worries about it. but if something went wrong then do you ? well all i do come on! -well i suppose it could be done. +well i suppose it could be done. it would? well all it is, -is er the fumes +is er the fumes mum! given off from it. are you with me? @@ -60939,7 +60885,7 @@ there could be a build of fumes. when we going? do you see what i mean? yeah. -you know, that, that's the only thing er +you know, that, that's the only thing er alright. what it's about, like. yeah. @@ -60951,14 +60897,14 @@ enough to kill you! yeah, but as far as it's b s standards go, if it's not b s standard approved no. that's the insurance on the -no, well +no, well boiler. that's right. yeah. so then are you telling me that these people are renting this place out? no, you can't rent it out until it's done you see? -so when was that when was that done? +so when was that when was that done? this week. we come in in here last week! people were here last week then? @@ -60970,7 +60916,7 @@ who's the, who's, who's, who's the boss up here today? yes, old age pensioners they were! i don't believe they were mind! -because the +because the i don't think there was anyone in here this week! still on the . i don't think there was anyone in here @@ -60978,7 +60924,7 @@ should be here. this week! two people. who's, who's, who, who's, who's the boss today up there? -well you wanna see er david . +well you wanna see er david . david ? yeah. and he's there now is he? @@ -60988,53 +60934,53 @@ have a word with him. but that's what it is. i can't help with nothing else . well that -said erm supposed to use it like, yeah. -as far as the leg , as far as getting the the flue sorted out in this, how long do you reckon it'll take? +said erm supposed to use it like, yeah. +as far as the leg , as far as getting the the flue sorted out in this, how long do you reckon it'll take? what do you say now? er i know what! well, like i said, one of his contractors are going out to , like. yeah. -that's why i like to know how when they're gonna do it like. +that's why i like to know how when they're gonna do it like. so this caravan can't be rented out until it's sorted out, like? that's right. yeah. and you don't know how long it's gonna be? -er i don't. +er i don't. i don't know how long it's gonna be, you know what i mean, i just -so who covers the loss on the caravan and on the rental? +so who covers the loss on the caravan and on the rental? that's not my -so it's dave again? +so it's dave again? that's not my place! listen, you could he's the general manager, like. yeah that's debbie should of come down . yeah. -but er that's, that's the reason for it like, you know? -well why what did you say then? +but er that's, that's the reason for it like, you know? +well why what did you say then? we came down to wash the caravan yes. yeah. -and on the windows was the had all been serviced. +and on the windows was the had all been serviced. yeah. -and that blue thing now has gone on since! +and that blue thing now has gone on since! tha , with red signs of all, across it! -yeah oh. +yeah oh. well they're doing them all now, for service -now, we were washing +now, we were washing you know? washing the caravan on the sunday yeah. and people were to come in here on the tuesday. oh, well i i thought, i don't know . -a bus load er a four, three or four bus loads from +a bus load er a four, three or four bus loads from lancashire somewhere. lancashire or north of england somewhere. saying there was, what say? bus loads? -three or four bus three or four bus loads of . +three or four bus three or four bus loads of . old age pensioners! pensioners! last week? @@ -61042,16 +60988,16 @@ so they said! that's what they told us! cos i said there's no way i'd sleep in it myself! cos it was too damp! -well we never had any last week! -well somebody said it . -i i i might, i might be wrong +well we never had any last week! +well somebody said it . +i i i might, i might be wrong like! you know . well that's what they said! -i never see ! +i never see ! you'll see a bus up there won't you? cos i'll . -we're learning +we're learning are you , are you sure it was this week, it was supposed to be? no , not next week? last week, cos i had to get it all! @@ -61071,10 +61017,10 @@ well, no hot water ! well that's what they told us, yeah. and that's why we've -well that's like i say, with the +well that's like i say, with the we must have the caravan finished! the thermostat. -yeah, like i said with the actual water heater there, it's been, there's been water heaters in caravans like that for years! +yeah, like i said with the actual water heater there, it's been, there's been water heaters in caravans like that for years! when we to you know what i mean? we only had this at the end of the @@ -61084,7 +61030,7 @@ and we've had trouble with it yeah. all the time! yeah. -but er like i said, the fluing part of it, is, is out of our hands. +but er like i said, the fluing part of it, is, is out of our hands. it's not yeah. it's not us who's put that on. @@ -61096,37 +61042,37 @@ oh! oh! you know, the, the the gas people. -it's yeah the gas council and all, like, these new bloody laws they've bought in like! +it's yeah the gas council and all, like, these new bloody laws they've bought in like! that's right. mm. that's why you can see they've all had them yeah. -they've had to extend the pipes all this and that like, you know? +they've had to extend the pipes all this and that like, you know? yeah. but it's down to be getting moved. you know what i mean? -but that's all it is, because it's in a confined space and with a shower going they're worried about fumes and all like, you know, the carbon monoxide, like, you know? +but that's all it is, because it's in a confined space and with a shower going they're worried about fumes and all like, you know, the carbon monoxide, like, you know? mm. yeah. -but er put it this way, i've been on courses, like i wouldn't i use it. +but er put it this way, i've been on courses, like i wouldn't i use it. you know what i mean? mm. -cos er like i say, if i'd had a window open or so you know what i mean? +cos er like i say, if i'd had a window open or so you know what i mean? that's right.. -and all if it's a little nippy you . +and all if it's a little nippy you . is it? but i said, that they've been in bathrooms for years like! -you know they and smaller bathrooms than that like! +you know they and smaller bathrooms than that like! oh, well i don't know what to do! -but like i said, it it's just, it's gonna get moved like, no cost to you like, you know what i mean? +but like i said, it it's just, it's gonna get moved like, no cost to you like, you know what i mean? it's er yeah. but an advantage to them! is that what you mean? -but if something went wrong then, this caravan was burnt that's the end of it! -they might just take those down. +but if something went wrong then, this caravan was burnt that's the end of it! +they might just take those down. well i , cos the co , the insurance wouldn't cover it? -cos they have got these records will have these records. +cos they have got these records will have these records. no, you'll have a certificate then, and all, saying that the caravan covered, it'll be tested every year then. so it isn't going to be used this week? but, no @@ -61144,14 +61090,14 @@ there was two people sitting there. they've just gone out. no. after you came. -well they've, they bought a a caravan down here, a brand new one! +well they've, they bought a a caravan down here, a brand new one! yeah. -and they bought it last summer and they've had trouble ever since! +and they bought it last summer and they've had trouble ever since! and they're going around asking people what ! what's up with their's then? well they've had to move the caravan ! -it was dirty and damp and ! -they're going round the caravans . +it was dirty and damp and ! +they're going round the caravans . ay he hasn't come . oh! @@ -61164,9 +61110,9 @@ and you weren't told there was gonna be ? no. what the hell are they talking about? nothing! -we knew that they were testing them, and checking it over and bringing it up to standard, but we didn't know anything about it other than that! +we knew that they were testing them, and checking it over and bringing it up to standard, but we didn't know anything about it other than that! only . -you take one, that's your one. +you take one, that's your one. lovely! well it wasn't me anyway, i don't know! oh mark'll be fuming that's for sure! @@ -61184,43 +61130,43 @@ here without a damn thing, you can't use it can you? what do you think? you know? they never asked me -if they could or the flue in so it's +if they could or the flue in so it's that's right, say it like that! -never been repaired. +never been repaired. neglecting the . well having said, what, what is it all about? -it's because the no, no water heater should be in the bathrooms! +it's because the no, no water heater should be in the bathrooms! so where's that gonna go then? well it must either go in the kitchen or in the cupboard somewhere, but you know? -that's what they've er put it to. +that's what they've er put it to. what you said to me. oh yeah. oh well we'll have to move won't we? yeah. -it's working, like gas-wise, like i say, it is it's virtually, it's just the ventilation clearing out the the fumes which are given +it's working, like gas-wise, like i say, it is it's virtually, it's just the ventilation clearing out the the fumes which are given mm. off from it. do you see what i mean? -well it is isn't there a, there's a chimney above there isn't there? +well it is isn't there a, there's a chimney above there isn't there? yeah. -that's right, yeah, but but now like i said, you're gonna have to , to have your certain pipes. +that's right, yeah, but but now like i said, you're gonna have to , to have your certain pipes. like, have you seen them all going round? they got long poles on the back step. will it'll be longer than that ? -no cos they haven't done this one because it shouldn't be in here! +no cos they haven't done this one because it shouldn't be in here! even in the fire? yeah. right. -yeah, i mean, it shouldn't be in here, like, that's why they haven't that's why they've put it there. -that's why they hung on the to the shipment cos these aren't supposed to be in the bathrooms. +yeah, i mean, it shouldn't be in here, like, that's why they haven't that's why they've put it there. +that's why they hung on the to the shipment cos these aren't supposed to be in the bathrooms. right. you know what i mean. you know? the alright -i think there'll be a lot of people who won't move off to be honest! +i think there'll be a lot of people who won't move off to be honest! they won't do? -, cos they won't er go to the cost of them. +, cos they won't er go to the cost of them. but, like i say, we're covering that, like. you know what i mean? hoh @@ -61230,17 +61176,17 @@ he doesn't know, he's the only one i can think of. he , he's, he's not in a position to say whether he knows or not. he says he doesn't know! oh! -no, well i +no, well i it's nothing to do with him! it's not his department. -but he said there is a gang going round, and some are putting the chimneys on and the others are going in and doing the flues. +but he said there is a gang going round, and some are putting the chimneys on and the others are going in and doing the flues. and he said, it looks as though they've put the chimney on and found that the flue is the ba the boiler's in the bathroom, so they've had to come down here. said because it shouldn't have a chimney on it! but he said, i don't know it's no , nothing to do with me! it's the no. bri it's the british gas that's doing it! -oh well that's right he's gotta blame somebody! +oh well that's right he's gotta blame somebody! but he said, i would do it because i know, i've worked for the gas board! mm. i would know how to handle it. @@ -61253,20 +61199,20 @@ mum! and she's going round, she's gonna try and take them to court! so she should! it's bis , i think they mean business people! -.and she's going she got out papers and pencil! +.and she's going she got out papers and pencil! taking names and addresses who'll back her up! mum,. you could see through the window. and the rain comes in when you open the door! blimey! -and she said and he said, well they told didn't they? +and she said and he said, well they told didn't they? got three bus loads, three or four bus loads of people! yes of old age pensioners coming down! she said , they hadn't! she said! and they're in -we haven't had anybody have we? +we haven't had anybody have we? mum, will daddy be here? why doesn't daddy come? granddad. @@ -61288,7 +61234,7 @@ what? they're supposed to ha! ha! -to pay people to come and clean the caravan out at the weekend. +to pay people to come and clean the caravan out at the weekend. no, i mean this flue thing should of been . the caravan's been cleaned! well you says they hadn't even washed the curtains! @@ -61297,7 +61243,7 @@ what? i'll leave it till next week! you said they hadn't washed the curtains! they're not washing the curtains, they're putting new ones in! -yes, well that's their er stipulations and that's what they're supposed to do once a year! +yes, well that's their er stipulations and that's what they're supposed to do once a year! it hasn't been done has it? no, they're not! danny's paid for new curtains to go up! @@ -61311,23 +61257,23 @@ will you shut up and wait! why? that's why! was closed? -yes yes, they're not opening till next week are they? +yes yes, they're not opening till next week are they? next week, is it warmer? -mum ! +mum ! you've just had ! -so next time you come down it will be open and then you'll be able to go. +so next time you come down it will be open and then you'll be able to go. oh, poor dolly! what can i do first? i think ours and all will be going home. -going home minute of the day! +going home minute of the day! no i bloody haven't! i kept the ! and that woman!! -i went out to check the date on the and to turn the place over. +i went out to check the date on the and to turn the place over. gees i was shocked! brand new! she owned it! -mm, yeah she had a with her! +mm, yeah she had a with her! and i couldn't wait you see. well i'd have had it all on tape! have you gotta ? @@ -61344,8 +61290,8 @@ emeralds there! yeah, and a ruby on the other! you found the good bit ! mm. -well wait and see what er mark has got to say. -mm . +well wait and see what er mark has got to say. +mm . laying properly. aha? no. @@ -61361,7 +61307,7 @@ no was it? . so what did she say to you when she went? -she said . +she said . this woman and man. oh she said we'll make enquiries she said. she was going on about the grass they've left on the @@ -61371,7 +61317,7 @@ yeah, she was a bit! she's looking for somebody to back her up! mm. and that's why i cannot get involved. -but we're gonna do it and she says she hadn't as yet! +but we're gonna do it and she says she hadn't as yet! that's what she said. mm. . @@ -61379,23 +61325,23 @@ i don't think she said she's doing extra! she says you'll have the bill for this! yeah. a man just stated it! -that we're taking responsibility we'll be moving out! +that we're taking responsibility we'll be moving out! we won't get paid for it! we wanted to charge them! i don't know anything them see. -it might be that they're in under promotions team. +it might be that they're in under promotions team. their only parking! i see us having to perhaps last year. -perhaps erm perhaps they're only parking their caravan on the . +perhaps erm perhaps they're only parking their caravan on the . and only letting it to friends and i suggest mm. their grandson. -but er somebody was in and left it all filthy and mouldy and what for! +but er somebody was in and left it all filthy and mouldy and what for! oh! yes? -had the cleaner gone in it? +had the cleaner gone in it? i don't know . i don't think so, no. how? @@ -61407,9 +61353,9 @@ i don't think it's really clean, and they charge you for it! of course they do! they're out to get all they can out of them! mm. -as he says it, it's the biggest holiday +as he says it, it's the biggest holiday and -company in britain and he said er, they just keep under their +company in britain and he said er, they just keep under their yeah. legal limit! he said. @@ -61417,8 +61363,8 @@ you can't get them to admit that. and, and they'll keep all the profits that they can! they're not gonna let you get away with a lot! you know, such as new curtains! -they try to bother them. -and i dare say, like these he said they they've paid for their caravan, cash! +they try to bother them. +and i dare say, like these he said they they've paid for their caravan, cash! so that's close to ten thousand pounds! and they thought it was an investment! where as now they @@ -61432,7 +61378,7 @@ well they haven't got total control over letting it! . no. perhaps they'll go. -mark is making his will isn't he? +mark is making his will isn't he? ah a good ! oh she's left her dolly in there! ooh god, sally was taking her out! @@ -61442,20 +61388,20 @@ i dunno! oh, she's, she coming back, look, there's her book and her pencil. mark. well sally was right anyway. -this is the caravan here. -sally will take it off, mark's . +this is the caravan here. +sally will take it off, mark's . i don't know what this is. oh! -i know she bought any there's her roller skates! +i know she bought any there's her roller skates! oh yeah. oh well, i'm off! i know, he was going into the office! why? -i can't find he's not in there in reception? +i can't find he's not in there in reception? perhaps he's gone to shops? i don't know which way he's gone then. -what's surname? -erm no. +what's surname? +erm no. ? dunno! perhaps you ought to look for a phoney. @@ -61475,10 +61421,10 @@ hey? ! now we'll go and find mum. mm. -i can't remember, the man he said . +i can't remember, the man he said . keep it on ooh! -enough will be used at from it. +enough will be used at from it. oh!and all do you think? what kind is it? a recording? @@ -61492,16 +61438,16 @@ well it's going round like hell, any how! well yeah, it's taping your voice! oh! oh, i hope it heard something nice ! -yes, well they're listening for slang ! +yes, well they're listening for slang ! oh! oh my god! -i said to her check the phone boxes and penny's in there phoning danny and , and bloody lorna! +i said to her check the phone boxes and penny's in there phoning danny and , and bloody lorna! mm. -i re , i er i co , heard sally -and down there +i re , i er i co , heard sally +and down there counting phoning them. -but i didn't know who it was and i thought, god, has danny arrived! +but i didn't know who it was and i thought, god, has danny arrived! he does sound, that woman! can't understand her! oh yes @@ -61509,17 +61455,17 @@ she's out! i can! she's in piling a bloody list! yeah, i'm, i, i can't -and she's got it down where do +and she's got it down where do i can't you come from? your name? -i thought when i was looking at her talking and i thought, you're a school mistress. -i wouldn't say that, i'd have said , she's a landlady. +i thought when i was looking at her talking and i thought, you're a school mistress. +i wouldn't say that, i'd have said , she's a landlady. and this is extra. -oh i would have said she was a school mistress. -and her her bed and breakfast is +oh i would have said she was a school mistress. +and her her bed and breakfast is was a school mistress! -bed and breakfast is er paying keeping this caravan. +bed and breakfast is er paying keeping this caravan. no, i would say that they were and it's not retired and he's had a good job in his time. @@ -61528,7 +61474,7 @@ well i feel he's but i said to him. no. -i said to him er that er it was an extra and he said that was the object of it. +i said to him er that er it was an extra and he said that was the object of it. helps the pension. you know? he didn't say it in so many words, but @@ -61536,14 +61482,14 @@ mm. it was an investment, that's what i said. mm. he said yes. -so i shouldn't be surprised, they're both retired and, and er pension. -she said they've had they've had a couple of days out here trekking, trying to catch people! -their pension is their pension and their bit of income keeps them, and that's all sort of thing, in a little bit of luxury. -he she's looking for tenants! +so i shouldn't be surprised, they're both retired and, and er pension. +she said they've had they've had a couple of days out here trekking, trying to catch people! +their pension is their pension and their bit of income keeps them, and that's all sort of thing, in a little bit of luxury. +he she's looking for tenants! no. -how, i did you find it clean? +how, i did you find it clean? mm. -you know, are you happy with er arrangements +you know, are you happy with er arrangements then? what did you think of cleanliness and oh well of course that @@ -61551,35 +61497,35 @@ and then perhaps she'll take their names and addresses! yes. and the date see, mrs so and so was in that caravan on such and such date! if ever it came to court! -cos he said somebody's got to bring them down! +cos he said somebody's got to bring them down! mm. and he said, we're disgusted with our caravan! yes. well of course, that might be a private ! -well that's what i would say about this if this was new i wouldn't let people go in! +well that's what i would say about this if this was new i wouldn't let people go in! theirs might be a private caravan on the site, and le , like jackie's. and letting it as private. see, jackie won't let anybody in her caravan. -but she said they've let it to people and they've just wrecked the inside of it! +but she said they've let it to people and they've just wrecked the inside of it! everything she said! it's a total mess! and it's a brand new last july we've had it, she said! mm. and it's filthy ! mm. -and she said that everything was mouldy in er you know the even the curtains were mildew! +and she said that everything was mouldy in er you know the even the curtains were mildew! and how did she put salt round? -because this is a hell of a lot damper today than what it was when i had the salt about you. -you but er some people +because this is a hell of a lot damper today than what it was when i had the salt about you. +you but er some people course not! yes. well i'd never heard of salt being put down before! -but she yes, she told me that in all, in the shop. +but she yes, she told me that in all, in the shop. in the reception. she said, put it yeah, well down. -yeah, these might tell you but i always heard that salt was damp! +yeah, these might tell you but i always heard that salt was damp! yeah but it attracts the the water in @@ -61589,7 +61535,7 @@ and of course, once it's in the salt, it's steams! well it's only now it feels like this! it was not like this when we were down here washing it. well that's common sense when you think about it isn't it? -you put, you put a drop of water on it you put er a bowl of salt and that will go down eventually! +you put, you put a drop of water on it you put er a bowl of salt and that will go down eventually! mm. if the air is damp. it's collected the water . @@ -61599,24 +61545,24 @@ she said, straight to me now! i said that caravan is soaking wet, i said! the mattresses! mm. -and she said er well it does take time for them to dry out doesn't it, she said? +and she said er well it does take time for them to dry out doesn't it, she said? but i, there was people in it last week! yes i know, she said! well if she's covering -i said well there's no way i +i said well there's no way i she is paid to cover the boss! -there's no way i'd of slept in it, i said and not i wouldn't of done it! +there's no way i'd of slept in it, i said and not i wouldn't of done it! let alone, old age pensioners, i said! -and you know we've been to a few caravans +and you know we've been to a few caravans go in that end bedroom and feel the bed! that feel a bit, caravans that we used to go to were like this chalet. -the chalets we used to go to mrs er i can't remember her name now! +the chalets we used to go to mrs er i can't remember her name now! but her boys used to run steam roller outside middle house and i used to take them in. -she used to see that the beds were aired. +she used to see that the beds were aired. she did see to them! -she put oil heaters in the caravan and she kept the the mattresses in her bungalow! +she put oil heaters in the caravan and she kept the the mattresses in her bungalow! she'd only got about eight caravans then. -and then we went in and had a caravan somewhere up by aberystwyth, ginnie and me, and you kids. +and then we went in and had a caravan somewhere up by aberystwyth, ginnie and me, and you kids. that was an old farmer's caravan weren't yes. it? @@ -61630,28 +61576,28 @@ i mean, caravans are caravans, call them what you like! only one saucepan we had! and it was stew everyday if we didn't go out for dinner! ah! -and you +and you remember that cup of tea? -remember that cup of tea cos the water gave out on us at one stage! -yeah, we had to walk across the bloody fields for water ! +remember that cup of tea cos the water gave out on us at one stage! +yeah, we had to walk across the bloody fields for water ! and milk. -yes, friendly woman at the farm! +yes, friendly woman at the farm! we should have had a time, we'd of had to go home! well who's caravan was it? -oh somebody who's lived er out gloucester ! +oh somebody who's lived er out gloucester ! yes i know! perhaps that's where aunty ginnie got her but er bug from ! but erm -the people at the farm they were supposed to seen you know, for her? -she made out that she was paying at the farm to clean it. +the people at the farm they were supposed to seen you know, for her? +she made out that she was paying at the farm to clean it. did you tell them that in the farm. well ginnie did! -got her to do the dirty work for for free ! -well same when we went and found them boys in it! +got her to do the dirty work for for free ! +well same when we went and found them boys in it! oh he's walking back home in temper now ! -well it was a job to get in here just after ! +well it was a job to get in here just after ! and now you're on the staff! oh shush here's now he @@ -61669,10 +61615,10 @@ come and have a look! cos everything is, as i left it! how long do i keep that for? somebody else been here,. -this water heater is not to be used as it failed to reach the er oh well i now! +this water heater is not to be used as it failed to reach the er oh well i now! wait, and i'll go and find out! -that's for the bed er television and the microwave. -this and the water heater. +that's for the bed er television and the microwave. +this and the water heater. and ask her about the water heater cos if i can't take a shower i will stink! funny way of running business any how! look at him with the bloody roll in the window! @@ -61680,22 +61626,22 @@ oh . but er, danny says that they said that they were people had been in! overflowing! -yes i know, but he he said people are in last week! -but that's what +yes i know, but he he said people are in last week! +but that's what they're overflowing with bookings for the summer! oh! and now? yeah, cos they could have three times as many caravans! -by june they'd let them go! +by june they'd let them go! they're overflowing with them! not now! -of course, you see, it's you that's using the caravan this week so they can come here they can they? +of course, you see, it's you that's using the caravan this week so they can come here they can they? no. -somebody comes quick and wants the caravan they're supposed to be there ready! +somebody comes quick and wants the caravan they're supposed to be there ready! oh! ooh the sun is warm! can you feel it? -is it the sun or is it this heater ? +is it the sun or is it this heater ? you can just see oh i dunno, maybe the sun! @@ -61711,7 +61657,7 @@ i dunno. ha? i dunno. what do you think,? -now erm mrs and i down the caravan park. +now erm mrs and i down the caravan park. right. yeah, they were . but people were in last week! @@ -61719,38 +61665,38 @@ mm. erm,. what? cos i came down! -and i cos i was amazed they told me about this salt rubbish! -so i did it and bowls are full of water! +and i cos i was amazed they told me about this salt rubbish! +so i did it and bowls are full of water! i was shocked! -and then, i thought well i gosh this caravan isn't is it because the salt had gone? +and then, i thought well i gosh this caravan isn't is it because the salt had gone? i i , it could be because it feels quite cold and damp . -anyway there's er there's no ! +anyway there's er there's no ! there's no television in there! right. -there's and there's a big sign on the water heater it's not to be used! +there's and there's a big sign on the water heater it's not to be used! right.. and i said we are going back home! -er would you +er would you yeah. -er -yes, and i will from the . -yeah ? +er +yes, and i will from the . +yeah ? yeah. right, i'll go and get the . and i said there's a did you tell him, as he's threatened to come home? down there now. she said she's trying to find it. -suppose we better go back home! +suppose we better go back home! going in the shop first. why is it? she's got no excuse! i'll go down there first. to tell them not to mess about with that water heater! ohhh she didn't know! -i said well when i was here last that sign wasn't on the thing then! +i said well when i was here last that sign wasn't on the thing then! don't forget! -and i'll put them back in the back . +and i'll put them back in the back . is that the door key? who's in the toilet? is ? @@ -61759,14 +61705,14 @@ i'll take those out the window. what? what? co they're coming down now. -er i said, that the sign on the washing thing washing thing wasn't there last. +er i said, that the sign on the washing thing washing thing wasn't there last. darren put the microwave into store. and the telly is in store, and they'll be bringing that right now. -right, what about the what about the water heater? +right, what about the what about the water heater? the microwave's with . he took the microwave! -no , darling, because it just stays there. -yeah, right what about the water heater? +no , darling, because it just stays there. +yeah, right what about the water heater? that's the more important thing! she said, she didn't know but she getting somebody down here now! so we still don't know whether that's gonna be operational! @@ -61785,19 +61731,19 @@ otherwise i'll go up there! it was alright last season! yeah! she doesn't understand it herself! -i said we were here doing the caravan, it wasn't there then! +i said we were here doing the caravan, it wasn't there then! somebody's been in! -somebody did, they was there was two people in here last week! -what to rented it? +somebody did, they was there was two people in here last week! +what to rented it? yeah. two old age pensioners. -they're supposed to be ! +they're supposed to be ! in the end,! what, so these two people have been in here, staying here, no television, no microwave? yeah! two old age pensioners! are they ripping them off then? -the old age pensioners are paying for a caravan including these, you know, facilities, and the people don't get them! +the old age pensioners are paying for a caravan including these, you know, facilities, and the people don't get them! i don't know! but that's what she told me! i'll see about mic , microwave in the house. @@ -61815,23 +61761,23 @@ well that's a big job! mummy! well it's up to them put it right! mummy! -yeah but what i'm saying is that's my week up the spout like, innit? +yeah but what i'm saying is that's my week up the spout like, innit? mummy! -er well how much +er well how much oh by the way, sally's got the shopping. be here? oh we'll wonder shall we ! -oh well come round and tell us! -they they should have been, they, if they failed +oh well come round and tell us! +they they should have been, they, if they failed come on! it, they should have reported it to you! -that's what +that's what only getting cold water!. see . i can't do any more than that! i'm not taking it out on you! i'll take it out on them! -i just burnt twenty quid on food and if i stay here to eat it i'll take it out on them! +i just burnt twenty quid on food and if i stay here to eat it i'll take it out on them! you, you're paying you're paying us ooh look at that! a lot of money @@ -61846,7 +61792,7 @@ have you tried lighting that boiler then? no. light it! what if it blows? -and i'll touch it later when let them do it! +and i'll touch it later when let them do it! ha ! ah? that lights working. @@ -61856,7 +61802,7 @@ course it's electric, you put the fridge on before! and i said i put the fridge on. bulbs are . and i said when we went in, i went in to show mark now, but i said i can, you can do it myself. -i was going in i was gonna ask somebody to come down and show us how to light the boiler. +i was going in i was gonna ask somebody to come down and show us how to light the boiler. and i said there's a big blue sign across it, not to use it! do not use! i said to her,that! @@ -61868,8 +61814,8 @@ not very soft!! i better show off them big ! do ! still wobbly innit? -we'll we'll lend you which says only . -it's do you think they'll be long? +we'll we'll lend you which says only . +it's do you think they'll be long? not long, why? why is the man going to come here? it's in the car!. @@ -61887,10 +61833,10 @@ quick! yes, go and hide! why? i'll start. -we're going to bloody +we're going to bloody the night -bad week a, a week's in -darren put the microwave into store!! +bad week a, a week's in +darren put the microwave into store!! why didn't he leave it alone,? switched off. that's it! @@ -61900,7 +61846,7 @@ you've got it at home! so it's at home? put it in store, so he's finding another! right! -said he +said he mum! the water now! for christ's sake! @@ -61908,10 +61854,10 @@ mum! have you thought about why? going to that fair yet? -no, cos we +no, cos we so you're basically so what you're saying is you're -no it doesn't matter! +no it doesn't matter! oh god! i'm gonna fetch my mother in! for god's sake! @@ -61921,8 +61867,8 @@ are you coming to sit in? i don't know where, when they'll come! so you've got to wait? we'll have to! -we'll have to get your bags all in there if we're not stopping, we can't stop! -there's a great big thing on the front go home! +we'll have to get your bags all in there if we're not stopping, we can't stop! +there's a great big thing on the front go home! .leave your bag in the car mum. oh! we'll have to stay here . @@ -61931,7 +61877,7 @@ there's nobody at the house. course you can! what? what's all this? -but now they've put it . +but now they've put it . all in there. plenty of room for the chair. mm? @@ -61964,11 +61910,11 @@ i'll walk up there and he'll be coming back down, he'll give me a lift back down this is the bit where mama says i'm just like susan , i'll have a go at it, i'll demand it! susan says she does it, but she doesn't really do it! yeah well, where as i will then! -ah shut up for half an hour now will you? +ah shut up for half an hour now will you? erm half an hour! half an hour! -the er the gas stoves doesn't! +the er the gas stoves doesn't! the gas is on! oh, it's on? oh i can see now, yes! @@ -61981,29 +61927,29 @@ old age pensioners? but it wasn't here! it wasn't on then! no, i've er, i, i, think it happened since. -and you see er it's one of those things that can wait. -but all were these were ta er all these were tested. +and you see er it's one of those things that can wait. +but all were these were ta er all these were tested. well dave's done it! before we came down here to clean the caravan. cos the man said to me, look you've got a new flue on! and that one over there has as well! -well that fail sign wasn't on the caravan when we was doing that axle underneath. +well that fail sign wasn't on the caravan when we was doing that axle underneath. no, because -they were saying what -the blue one was on saying it had been tested! +they were saying what +the blue one was on saying it had been tested! that's not to say it failed! no. oh! well i come down the week after that. -there's a on then! +there's a on then! children to sit on! look! i don't! here they are then! i don't why it's for children to sit on it! -not or potatoes. +not or potatoes. those pretty earrings you got! where did you get those from? susan gave them to me . @@ -62018,7 +61964,7 @@ little flowers! makes you a little clown doesn't it? no, you're a little clown! ha! -has anybody +has anybody hello darling! little darling! i'm not @@ -62041,7 +61987,7 @@ oh well! i nearly trod on your fingers then didn't i? did i? mm mm mm. -yeah i thought i'd seen cloud on top on the hills. +yeah i thought i'd seen cloud on top on the hills. that's what you think! maybe! oh i don't think, they only had the telly . @@ -62051,38 +61997,38 @@ i know cold! ooh look at dolly's knickers! just look at those! ooh! -when they come down then do we or what? +when they come down then do we or what? and then ! ooh i told got a tow truck? -i've counted about seventeen to twenty caravans. +i've counted about seventeen to twenty caravans. and there was er oh you haven't been your wearing your glasses ! ! there was erm mum! six people. -er two two of them +er two two of them mum! -five adults and a little one a baby one went +five adults and a little one a baby one went mum! along there shall i sit on here? -and the caravan next the one opposite the shop +and the caravan next the one opposite the shop just sit here then. -or the business +or the business go to your room. caravan next door do i have to go to sleep? -and those people got out a and i've seen. +and those people got out a and i've seen. so there are a few we're not going to be here tonight! in the, in the . yeah. -can we are we going to ? +can we are we going to ? i don't know ! see what time we've got left! -this is what i do to my teddy just hold her by her leg nice teddy, look! +this is what i do to my teddy just hold her by her leg nice teddy, look! you're dolly! ooh! ooh!! @@ -62091,11 +62037,11 @@ have to get another sober! . a bird on the roof! walking about. -can we walk to grandma? +can we walk to grandma? i don't want to! well you just play there! in his -yes and there's a bird on the roof and he was trying get up there +yes and there's a bird on the roof and he was trying get up there to see his mummy! yeah! here he comes! @@ -62129,9 +62075,9 @@ later! later? later, we're going home! have to get ready for work! -we shall have to go up there +we shall have to go up there not today! -we will . +we will . can we have another? gotta go work mum! come on mum, be the host! @@ -62152,10 +62098,10 @@ oh, no hot water! you won't be able to wash your face! mum! mm? -when i went into the can we play? +when i went into the can we play? please? please mummy! -do you know she's a little +do you know she's a little mum! bit, ain't she? what? @@ -62166,7 +62112,7 @@ mum? mum, can i? can i? then going to the shop. -don't why? +don't why? oh, i've gotta go to reception first. go to the shop. where you going? @@ -62186,18 +62132,18 @@ well you can come back and i'll tell you what happens! i'm going up to reception. so as i can take her for a ride and back. i don't want to go for a ride! -i want to go that ! +i want to go that ! oh, that isn't until next monday dear! monday or tuesday. and it's saturday today. -now then saturday +now then saturday no, it's the one with the slide! yeah, well it isn't open until monday or tuesday. so it's saturday today can we go and have a look in case she's wrong? can we? -i'll pop you out in the bag in a minute ! +i'll pop you out in the bag in a minute ! can we? why nanny! i don't know! @@ -62212,23 +62158,23 @@ nappy! why, why does the man wanna come? mind you don't fall! why does wanna come? -just seeing why the water heater isn't working! +just seeing why the water heater isn't working! it is working! it isn't working! which heater? in the bathroom! it won't get hot! the water doesn't get hot! -and it should when you have a bath shouldn't it? +and it should when you have a bath shouldn't it? mm. do you know what? -when when the have +when when the have once upon a time! get off! when -come and get and get your skates in the car! +come and get and get your skates in the car! why? -cos we will have to go in the car. +cos we will have to go in the car. oh have you got your skates? mum! i want to go down see it. @@ -62244,9 +62190,9 @@ well now's the time to learn innit? you've gotta put -put a size of a on it! +put a size of a on it! mummy, i want to go! -well you've gotta put your wellies on and +well you've gotta put your wellies on and you gotta put your shoes on! ha? put your shoes on, quick! @@ -62264,7 +62210,7 @@ no! right this very minute! wow you else i shall say ding dang on your bum! -you can't make me!cos cos you're not gonna i'll give you a smack bum! +you can't make me!cos cos you're not gonna i'll give you a smack bum! urgh you still got ! here mum! mum! @@ -62282,24 +62228,24 @@ mountain climbers! oh weh climbed up on . do you want your coat on? -did they know that they we , these were coming down? +did they know that they we , these were coming down? yeah! and mark, definite cos it's on the papers, it's on the books! we asked them . mm. -that's why ask what time of year! +that's why ask what time of year! this is, god, a bloody afternoon wasted! damn thing's gonna be a bloody pest! it will go! -how much a week rent do you pay for ground? +how much a week rent do you pay for ground? no, it all comes out at the end of the summer, see. -yeah, but d er, do they tell you how much they take out? +yeah, but d er, do they tell you how much they take out? yeah. it's all laid out. ha qq ho ha . -are the at the back any different is it? +are the at the back any different is it? yeah. -but er, i think that the the tiles a bit near the woodwork. +but er, i think that the the tiles a bit near the woodwork. mhm. look at her, going on down the road! oh she's got her bike. @@ -62320,22 +62266,22 @@ no. sorry to trouble you, do you own the caravan i'm renting? i own them. you own it? -oh!erm we own a caravan. -could you tell me have you been very happy with the services ? +oh!erm we own a caravan. +could you tell me have you been very happy with the services ? how everything works out, the parking charge come in. -and that?. -well come in! +and that?. +well come in! thank you. i don't really know much about this cos my son does it all. oh i see! hiya hello! i'm cold! -you know nice way to get warm! +you know nice way to get warm! yeah ! . -erm i don't really know much about it this is our first spring, you see? +erm i don't really know much about it this is our first spring, you see? there's all grass on there! is it? so this a new @@ -62349,7 +62295,7 @@ out there really! you stand out there then! i don't want to walk all over your carpet! oh ! -there's a there +there's a there yes. and stand right on it! erm @@ -62368,23 +62314,23 @@ and, are you going to let it out? no. oh! why? -well, we bought a caravan last year actually at the end of may +well, we bought a caravan last year actually at the end of may yeah. yes. and erm move out the way! -we it we don't think it was let out very often. +we it we don't think it was let out very often. that was through to the end of september. -when we came up to see it well it was a brand spanking new +when we came up to see it well it was a brand spanking new yeah. we nearly cried! it was in such a state! only had it for a few months. -upholstery, carpets the bath the toilet the cooker, the fridge the whole lot was filthy! +upholstery, carpets the bath the toilet the cooker, the fridge the whole lot was filthy! and when we think that we saw it when it was new! yeah. and i went storming down to the office, didn't i? -and i said renting it, because it must of been occupied by animals! +and i said renting it, because it must of been occupied by animals! mm. it was disgusting! animals and . @@ -62392,19 +62338,19 @@ ah know well we've stated yeah. -it doesn't matter what you state, cos we had heard from other pe , i've been doing this, i've been up here last weekend cos i am so angry about all this! +it doesn't matter what you state, cos we had heard from other pe , i've been doing this, i've been up here last weekend cos i am so angry about all this! well we've had a little it's just a joke! problem now! that's why we're here. really? ah! -er there are so many with nothing +er there are so many with nothing well we came -to do with these . -we came down my son came down here month and he and er, put red lead all underneath it. +to do with these . +we came down my son came down here month and he and er, put red lead all underneath it. you know the ? -following sunday i came down to wash it and polish it and now we've got blue stickers in the bathroom the heater! +following sunday i came down to wash it and polish it and now we've got blue stickers in the bathroom the heater! we had a message and the through @@ -62413,19 +62359,19 @@ and they know it! how many here did they do? -here he is coming back! +here he is coming back! be careful, the door opens outwards! -we erm we had a letter through but it was to test the boilers, because . +we erm we had a letter through but it was to test the boilers, because . so we did and we've yes. heard no more about it! -ah well i got a thing tested on ours thought ours was alright. +ah well i got a thing tested on ours thought ours was alright. i hope so! well there's a great on the sunday we were here oh was it? that blue thing was on the window! -that's to say water? +that's to say water? but now it's got red across it, failed! and that wasn't there . and you've got to pay more money to make sure it's put right! @@ -62435,14 +62381,14 @@ there are! didn't know anything about it! you do! they tell you that! -the whole thing is just +the whole thing is just there are no rules. -this is this . +this is this . see, ours was nineteen ninety one because it you're joking! -was er absolutely +was er absolutely three years, or two years, i dunno! -ah well cos i think the newer one will be this is some government thing to do with the gas. +ah well cos i think the newer one will be this is some government thing to do with the gas. i mean with fitting the yeah. flue. @@ -62453,12 +62399,12 @@ hey! some of them of failed, and if they fail you have to pay so much. you have to pay so much anyway to have it changed. but, as i say, we've been very unhappy about it! -we had erm notes through about out of +we had erm notes through about out of ten pillows, seven needed replacing and we needed a new milk saucepan, a new frying pan, a new ashtray mm! cleaners etcetera! -so, i replaced most of them myself and then whenever we came down course we complained about the cleaning! -when we came down well it was still less that desirable! +so, i replaced most of them myself and then whenever we came down course we complained about the cleaning! +when we came down well it was still less that desirable! it's terrible! and erm the cooker was filthy! @@ -62468,9 +62414,9 @@ all what? i mean we're talking about a thing that's been used for a couple of months! yeah. -then he came in er sort of right at the end said, well look, i'm so cheesed off with you lot +then he came in er sort of right at the end said, well look, i'm so cheesed off with you lot can't we do anything about it? -she said, look let me know, how much it's going to cost me to get rid of this, because i've had enough! +she said, look let me know, how much it's going to cost me to get rid of this, because i've had enough! and we've only just bought it ! well so er @@ -62490,31 +62436,31 @@ price! they quote anything! so you find you're, you're on your own! yeah. -and erm you know, if we pay up -everything is -it's cost a fortune to actually the caravan sited pay out six thousand quid right? +and erm you know, if we pay up +everything is +it's cost a fortune to actually the caravan sited pay out six thousand quid right? and then, you have to let it out then. -through them they have to have first option. +through them they have to have first option. they're the one that gets the benefit! -well two weeks ago +well two weeks ago but then they can't sell it! they can't sell it! and that's only the new one! -cos they said, i won't be able sell it cos they they've got so many new ones on the site! +cos they said, i won't be able sell it cos they they've got so many new ones on the site! last week there was people in here! so how could that water be like it is? cos you can't use it! there is no hot water! well he can't! -well everything everything is +well everything everything is in their favour. -and i've well the people, all the people i've spoken to and everybody i've spoken to is very unhappy! +and i've well the people, all the people i've spoken to and everybody i've spoken to is very unhappy! i haven't spoken to one who's satisfied yet! i've been on the telephone to people! -i'm taking numbers off of caravans where they're letting and i've been round and spoken to people who are in them caravans, and not one is happy! +i'm taking numbers off of caravans where they're letting and i've been round and spoken to people who are in them caravans, and not one is happy! last week a chap down here, david yeah. -told me, he said, well ninety five per cent are happy. +told me, he said, well ninety five per cent are happy. i said, really? well i haven't found one yet! out @@ -62524,7 +62470,7 @@ what did they say now? they're all very unhappy! i tell you! this woman doesn't know anything, like! -she just said there's two boys out on there on site and the one, the, the ginger haired boy knows the you know the problem. +she just said there's two boys out on there on site and the one, the, the ginger haired boy knows the you know the problem. and i mum! said, well look i said, i don't wanna know @@ -62534,7 +62480,7 @@ i said, is this he , water heater gonna be ? i don't know! i, oh it's alright, she said it's in the bathroom? i said yeah. -she said well he knows about it, it's all in hand! +she said well he knows about it, it's all in hand! well well i that's no good to me, like! @@ -62565,27 +62511,27 @@ perhaps they've been in and done it now. bloody thing. well the one door is empty and and the first booking for the caravan, she just said it again. -i've got it on my tape is th the twenty first of march. +i've got it on my tape is th the twenty first of march. when the first comes in? when the first comes in. on the twenty first of march. and danny said the third . third did he?the first which was the sunday and he had to get it ready because they were coming in on the tuesday, on the third. -that's why there was such a mad panic to get it done on the sunday the last day before so why are the mattresses back there getting bloody damp? +that's why there was such a mad panic to get it done on the sunday the last day before so why are the mattresses back there getting bloody damp? oh i forgot to give him them. mark isn't coming over to pick the car up. he doesn't want to. he's enjoying his break. -oh he's he's alright a couple of days and getting old i think. +oh he's he's alright a couple of days and getting old i think. mark loves it. loves being on his own. ah but he don't get the chance does he? although i like being by myself. -but then i different age isn't it, to ? +but then i different age isn't it, to ? what the bloody hell is that? montrose twenty eight. r twelve. -well it's the key of somebody's cottage +well it's the key of somebody's cottage it's the key of somebody's caravan but it's not ours. perhaps it's the one he's got. i'll go and try these in the door now cos this is ours. @@ -62607,14 +62553,14 @@ one. what? this is the owner's set, a mr . well who's are these? -well you'd better see mark first and and let them have them back. +well you'd better see mark first and and let them have them back. mark. it's nothing, these aren't nothing to do with mark. oh. they belong in the . it smells musty in here. yes. -this is a caravan smell and mrs 's clothes used to stink by it. +this is a caravan smell and mrs 's clothes used to stink by it. mm. oh i don't believe this! couldn't be bothered to shop. @@ -62622,37 +62568,37 @@ i'll give them all to mark. and then i'll go up the shop and get some, i'll need a couple of boxes. where's the microwave? ooh god . -gas on or should we turn the lights on so we can get the +gas on or should we turn the lights on so we can get the no paper. i've gotta have er paper to leave messages. i was gonna ask mark for a pen. i've got a pen and i've got paper. -a big note. +a big note. so that i can say the fire's burning. mm. well you can call by and tell him that. yeah but i want it for the men that's going to alter the gas. oh. for signs. -i'm gonna put one in there one on the kitchen -you'll have to buy a paper pad that's all . +i'm gonna put one in there one on the kitchen +you'll have to buy a paper pad that's all . and one by the fire. yeah. -then all the doors should be open see. +then all the doors should be open see. they are damp but they don't feel too bad no. see if they leave the doors open it's not too bad. oh well. -coat hanger on the floor. +coat hanger on the floor. feel this and feel those beds in there. -but i mean this is a er er er +but i mean this is a er er er his home. -yes but it's a a cold room +yes but it's a a cold room no that's wet. yes it's wet. well these were too weren't they? and he's stuck them by the fire. -yeah them all . +yeah them all . well i'm just gonna get the paper and that's it. costing a bloody fortune. eh? @@ -62660,7 +62606,7 @@ to light the fire. goes out and yeah. any toilet paper. -no paper or haven't got pens there. +no paper or haven't got pens there. no pens. no tissues. any tissues? @@ -62671,15 +62617,15 @@ too hard. let's go down the toilet, see if it's open. no wait a minute. no wait a minute. -disconnected the gas, took that bloody old heater off, connected it up somewhere else and whatever they're gonna do and then the gas is coming through a fire. +disconnected the gas, took that bloody old heater off, connected it up somewhere else and whatever they're gonna do and then the gas is coming through a fire. well mark is there. we can pop across and see. -he's not gonna go round the caravan and try each bed out is he? -he said he was going to and see that it was done +he's not gonna go round the caravan and try each bed out is he? +he said he was going to and see that it was done mhm. things were done well that's a matter of . -oh it'd be better for him to put that fire on at night time and go over in the morning and switch it off. -well be at work before he can be out of bed probably, in the morning. +oh it'd be better for him to put that fire on at night time and go over in the morning and switch it off. +well be at work before he can be out of bed probably, in the morning. have to . and if he's gonna walk to tenby they could be starting when he's in tenby. well sally will be there. @@ -62690,20 +62636,20 @@ two of them. if those men wasn't going there i would say right, put the gas fire on. put it on low and leave it the night and day cos it was left on for a week once wasn't it? mm. -oh god that was, that was at er the flat. +oh god that was, that was at er the flat. left on for a fortnight. oh and it was a cold day. -but it was in august or the end of september or someth er er the beginning of september and it was a chilly day but it was still summer. +but it was in august or the end of september or someth er er the beginning of september and it was a chilly day but it was still summer. it wasn't, you know, it wasn't terribly cold. -but we went home and i remember going in the room, i opened the door and oh it's lovely and warm in here! -so i stood by the door i wait till dad come in cos he was the last out and it was always my fault like, i would have left the fire on not him. -so i stood by the door and i never moved till he went in oh he said but with a caravan i don't know. +but we went home and i remember going in the room, i opened the door and oh it's lovely and warm in here! +so i stood by the door i wait till dad come in cos he was the last out and it was always my fault like, i would have left the fire on not him. +so i stood by the door and i never moved till he went in oh he said but with a caravan i don't know. mm they're not very powerful grates are they? -dunno oh nan he says, get mark -is, is yours a heater? +dunno oh nan he says, get mark +is, is yours a heater? mm? is yours a a long and -well you either put one bar on or the lot is on or it's very dim like this is low and you can't see it at all. +well you either put one bar on or the lot is on or it's very dim like this is low and you can't see it at all. there's no heat from it. you want something that gives heat there is heat. @@ -62712,11 +62658,11 @@ oh. but you want to air them beds, you want to dry them beds. i mean you've got to have heat there. well danny says get mark and bung them in the bloody car and bring it home. -the best thing you want to stick it in the room and put a heater . +the best thing you want to stick it in the room and put a heater . well we could put it in the spare bedroom. put it up against the radiator. mm. -but if someone's going there next week, that's two beds, three beds. +but if someone's going there next week, that's two beds, three beds. you could put them in the sitting room. and put the heater on there, put the fire on there. mm. @@ -62725,22 +62671,22 @@ i do like this. i'm afraid i you don't have to. have a drink and it disappears. -oh i dunno +oh i dunno and there isn't the flavour in it that used to be. and this is marks and spencers? mm. -there's a you know they used to put i suppose vanilla essence or some of these no almond would it be? +there's a you know they used to put i suppose vanilla essence or some of these no almond would it be? mm. i don't know. there used to be a lot more taste on it though than there is on that one anyway. well if he's going down there tomorrow why can't he bring them back? well i suppose he could. i have to say it would help him. -i suppose they're i suppose they're worrying him? +i suppose they're i suppose they're worrying him? they want something done about it. well i wouldn't bloody . no way. -that thing on top of that mattress, the thing that doesn't fit who's is that? +that thing on top of that mattress, the thing that doesn't fit who's is that? oh theirs. dunno. belongs to the caravan @@ -62751,8 +62697,8 @@ because that is the mattress for the bed that folds away in the sitting room. right? but it seems to me to be a foam thing. it is. -and it's covered in a, in a po polythene would you say? -plastic or what it is covered? +and it's covered in a, in a po polythene would you say? +plastic or what it is covered? cloth. cos you couldn't put that by the fire. yeah. @@ -62775,36 +62721,36 @@ the mattresses. mm? well i've put the big one in but i know that the rest wouldn't go in. mm. -but then the little bedroom wasn't so didn't seem so damp. +but then the little bedroom wasn't so didn't seem so damp. but you didn't try it did you, really? -in that caravan a caravan's a caravan, call it what you like but in that caravan that mark is in there was that little room where the w hot water heater is +in that caravan a caravan's a caravan, call it what you like but in that caravan that mark is in there was that little room where the w hot water heater is mm. -and there was a hole er on the floor over there with a grating on it that was you could see through to the ground. +and there was a hole er on the floor over there with a grating on it that was you could see through to the ground. mm. -well if through the winter months when there's no fire in there, no nothing in there the damp is bound to be coming through there. +well if through the winter months when there's no fire in there, no nothing in there the damp is bound to be coming through there. fog gets in. course it does. all caravans are like that. but you've got to have those caravan, those vents because the van is so small and you've got gas supplied. it's rules and regulations. -if you've got a gas fire in +if you've got a gas fire in it it means that they haven't been doing their duty in the winter then. -if they guarantee to put the mattresses all up in the dry they asked you to do yours or did they say they would do it? +if they guarantee to put the mattresses all up in the dry they asked you to do yours or did they say they would do it? they done it. well how's the damn thing on the bed then? -because they put it back there for these people that was coming in. +because they put it back there for these people that was coming in. oh. they didn't seemingly. we don't know. do we? no. -well there were no there anyway. +well there were no there anyway. so they say. it's all hearsay. well alright. perhaps the man was working part-time. perhaps he never noticed the . -perhaps the people were in the van and found the beds wet and said well we can't sleep here and they slept in the sit with the fire on. +perhaps the people were in the van and found the beds wet and said well we can't sleep here and they slept in the sit with the fire on. i dunno. it could have been. cos there was only two here. @@ -62827,13 +62773,13 @@ oh. i don't know. neither have i. that's why i -but er anyway if danny's, if if mark is there now he can bring one home today and then he can bring the others tomorrow. +but er anyway if danny's, if if mark is there now he can bring one home today and then he can bring the others tomorrow. er it's only the two little ones. if there are two little ones there. yeah. if there are two little ones there. -if they're big enough for for susan's two boys. -and and one for +if they're big enough for for susan's two boys. +and and one for well their girls have gotta sleep in them. mm. er it's only one big one and two little ones. @@ -62841,7 +62787,7 @@ well then you might as well push that little thing in as well mightn't you? oh yes. and bring them home. but mark won't be there when you take them back. -well he says he's going to the, he said he was going to the on friday and they would be finished by friday. +well he says he's going to the, he said he was going to the on friday and they would be finished by friday. and he was going to see that it was finished by friday. mm. well you could take them back on friday. @@ -62854,16 +62800,16 @@ oh. it's a double mattress, a double bedded mattress. i can't bloody lift that. so the only thing that i would suggest is to -well still mark will be there. +well still mark will be there. or he could come down with you on saturday? or sally maybe would be able to come down with you saturday and help you? unless we went over the same day that susan went over. and kept the mattresses till susan goes. -but the understanding is that like mark has got the caravan this week. +but the understanding is that like mark has got the caravan this week. mm. but if they had a booking to go into it, mark's gotta get out. oh well he could ring you up and you could take them back down but at least they would be dried. -cos if anybody who could they come on if they caught cold and and +cos if anybody who could they come on if they caught cold and and well i dunno. you or him? i dunno. @@ -62879,7 +62825,7 @@ yes. the thing is old mark is there to see to it. mark won't be there to see to it? why? -because how does m mark know? +because how does m mark know? mark right, he's got up this morning and he's gone to tenby. and he's gone to look around tenby. while he's gone those men have gone in there. @@ -62900,9 +62846,9 @@ and fix it to the well mark will be back there tonight and he can switch it on when he comes home. make it his responsibility. oh you don't understand! -in the meantime the men have took the water heater off the wall. +in the meantime the men have took the water heater off the wall. they've put it from that wall, and they've stuck it on to this wall. -oh let's connect it up see if it works. +oh let's connect it up see if it works. now in the meantime there's gas seeping through that fire there with no light. oh. so you've blown your caravan. @@ -62913,8 +62859,8 @@ well no. cos mark's going in one, sally's going in the other. oh bring them home then. bring them home and tell them that you're taking them home to air. -and i don't suppose, they're not wet you see. -it's different it's, they're damp it's different if there'd been a hole and the water was coming in. +and i don't suppose, they're not wet you see. +it's different it's, they're damp it's different if there'd been a hole and the water was coming in. they're not saturated. no. it won't take them long. @@ -62922,17 +62868,17 @@ that's what i says. if those men wasn't working there i wouldn't hesitate. the fire would go on and i'd leave it on low mm. -and the atmosphere would warm up right through the caravan. +and the atmosphere would warm up right through the caravan. mm. but i'd hump them into the sitting room. if those men came there on tuesday mm. -and done their work and mark rang me here and said, on tuesday the caravan's great now, the fires are alright. +and done their work and mark rang me here and said, on tuesday the caravan's great now, the fires are alright. i'd go straight over there and switch the fires on. mm. well i'd even tell him to go down only he ain't got the keys. -cos they're not going to take an awful long time in a good hot room to dry. -the only thing again that i'm thinking of what if we gets them out of the caravan and we gets them into the car and we're getting them in and out here and then we gets them back into the car to take them back over and in to the caravan, what if we rip the bloody things? +cos they're not going to take an awful long time in a good hot room to dry. +the only thing again that i'm thinking of what if we gets them out of the caravan and we gets them into the car and we're getting them in and out here and then we gets them back into the car to take them back over and in to the caravan, what if we rip the bloody things? well if we rip them we rip them and i'll mend them. mm. they are yours aren't they? @@ -62940,28 +62886,28 @@ mm. put a patch on them. then she turned round and she said, i said to her those beds are soaking, i said. there's nobody can sleep in those. -yes, she said but er when i went down there to check after you'd gone, she said erm yours was erm the driest of them sort of thing. +yes, she said but er when i went down there to check after you'd gone, she said erm yours was erm the driest of them sort of thing. suppose they didn't bother with them. and i said didn't bother with them. see they're alright. -i said then well i said from the time now, i said there is nobody i said, can sleep on those mattresses. +i said then well i said from the time now, i said there is nobody i said, can sleep on those mattresses. no she said, it does take a while for caravans to dry out. -well say what you were saying -so in other words you don't go to the caravan. +well say what you were saying +so in other words you don't go to the caravan. . let it be their responsibility, they put them in there. well mark's going in at his own risk, see? they sold them to you complete. so? so they're yours. -what's the good of a bed a bed without a mattress? +what's the good of a bed a bed without a mattress? i'm talking about the mattresses. what are you talking about? the caravan! well i thought you was talking about mattresses airing in front of the fire. well that subject's gone! oh well -i'm saying that park, what the woman said that she went down to check the vans last summer +i'm saying that park, what the woman said that she went down to check the vans last summer mm. end of last summer. long time since then . @@ -62970,7 +62916,7 @@ and she went down to check in the winter time and she said your van was really d oh. well it all depends how she checked. perhaps. -well then they then they went and put the mattresses back in their places. +well then they then they went and put the mattresses back in their places. now the mattresses are soaking. mm. and i said there's nobody can go and sleep on those mattresses. @@ -62982,11 +62928,11 @@ oh well, i should take advantage now mark is in, bring the damn things from ther then you can get him to help you take them back on friday. i think we'd have to ring them up and let them know what we're doing. well go in office and tell them. -you can talk personally better than on the phone. +you can talk personally better than on the phone. cos they are your mattresses aren't they? when you take them back they're there for their inspection. -unless you you take electric blanket down? -put it on, oh you can't put that on a damp bed can you? +unless you you take electric blanket down? +put it on, oh you can't put that on a damp bed can you? not really. don't think so. not @@ -62995,13 +62941,13 @@ what? er er electric blankets. don't know. they're built er pretty, pretty good that way i think. -i don't know what about the lags for the wall +i don't know what about the lags for the wall and another thing, i didn't even look in mark's room. -was there pillows and blankets and quilts in his caravan? +was there pillows and blankets and quilts in his caravan? i didn't look. well perhaps sally had a hunt dunno. -oh well well i dunno i think i'll go and wash me hair. +oh well well i dunno i think i'll go and wash me hair. it's desperate for it. i've gotta have a bath in the morning. tomorrow. @@ -63011,11 +62957,11 @@ what? have a bath tomorrow. well you can have one . good god, you can have one now if you want it. -i hope you know i'd er see he'll have to put the back seat of the car down into a van. +i hope you know i'd er see he'll have to put the back seat of the car down into a van. shit i'm afraid in case those mattresses rip. mm? because they're so thin. -well i'll mend the buggers for you . +well i'll mend the buggers for you . and don't be afraid of a patch dear. it's not that i'm afraid of a patch. are caravan sizes the same as everyday sizes? @@ -63026,13 +62972,13 @@ mm. but they're not spring mattresses. mm. although what's on the bed is nice mattresses. -oh what's have you got his dinner? +oh what's have you got his dinner? yes. oh. bloody cheek, do him the world of good to go without for a day or two. he won't eat it. well that's it, he he -it's treating him like a kid of five or six year old isn't it? +it's treating him like a kid of five or six year old isn't it? he forgets that he well the thing is he doesn't have a dinner every day of the week. it won't hurt him. @@ -63045,7 +62991,7 @@ well i don't imagine, unless he went out for it. fish and chips at night is it, his dinner? look at the ruddy traffic. mm. -oh held up. +oh held up. oh the lights have come higher up now. oh. it's sunday today. @@ -63064,7 +63010,7 @@ there are four niggers in there. mm? four niggers in that . mm. -oh god. +oh god. now i need the key . mm? gonna need the key for this. @@ -63080,7 +63026,7 @@ i fancy an icecream. she said well i'll go and get you one. he said no, you know what your memory's like, you're bound to forget. she said no i won't, what do you fancy? -he said well i fancy vanilla and strawberry icecream with chocolate sauce, raspberry sauce, crushed nuts and a flake. +he said well i fancy vanilla and strawberry icecream with chocolate sauce, raspberry sauce, crushed nuts and a flake. she said right, vanilla and strawberry icecream, chocolate sauce, crushed nuts. said right, i shall be back in five minutes. two hours later she come back with a ham sandwich. @@ -63097,7 +63043,7 @@ and you can spend the whole day without a bite. as for me, i always take my packed lunch. and pot noodles is one of my favourite dishes. no. -i don't think that the pub is open the cafs aren't open the amusements aren't open. +i don't think that the pub is open the cafs aren't open the amusements aren't open. the bar's open. no. all locked up and in darkness. @@ -63113,10 +63059,10 @@ i dunno. and er did he eat the dinner? well i dunno. -i left it there and then went down the caravan. +i left it there and then went down the caravan. when we come back he'd got the dishes all ready for me. so you don't know if he ate it or not? -no the dishes . +no the dishes . mm? she gave me a key. mm. @@ -63129,35 +63075,35 @@ you told me they'd got a set of keys. what's happened? so she give me a set of keys. and? -and erm i give them to mark. +and erm i give them to mark. aye. and i told him i want them back, don't take them to the office. -so what did they say about you keeping them on?? -i went in there again and i told her that you'd rung and some angela from sales andrea, we haven't got an andrea she said. +so what did they say about you keeping them on?? +i went in there again and i told her that you'd rung and some angela from sales andrea, we haven't got an andrea she said. so she said somebody else it could have been. i said i don't know i said. angela no. i don't know. -but erm she said she has said that we could do this and she said that's fine, she said. -as long as you don't as long as you don't put erm anything too near it. +but erm she said she has said that we could do this and she said that's fine, she said. +as long as you don't as long as you don't put erm anything too near it. mm. -and i said mark's here so that he can switch it switch it off at nights. -so anyway while i was there darren came in. +and i said mark's here so that he can switch it switch it off at nights. +so anyway while i was there darren came in. is everything alright? he said. are all the jobs done? -and i said well look i said, i've got to come because i said there's no way anybody i said i wouldn't do it myself, i wouldn't put anybody in those beds. +and i said well look i said, i've got to come because i said there's no way anybody i said i wouldn't do it myself, i wouldn't put anybody in those beds. i said something's got to be done and it won't wait. -and i said i'm going to leave the fire on and er mark's here and he'll switch it off at night. +and i said i'm going to leave the fire on and er mark's here and he'll switch it off at night. that's alright she said. -let's see she said,th when's the first when's your first booking? +let's see she said,th when's the first when's your first booking? not until, i think she said april twenty first. -yeah that comes under the bookings. +yeah that comes under the bookings. that's our first booking, paid booking. nothing about these ones that's already been in. we're there -susan is there she said the twenty first and i on the twenty first. +susan is there she said the twenty first and i on the twenty first. but she wouldn't be on their books like that would it? well she'd be on a form, yes. that's the twenty first of march. @@ -63165,10 +63111,10 @@ yes. well perhaps she was talking about sue then. i don't know. i didn't really stop to find out. -and er she said that'll be alright. +and er she said that'll be alright. and mark's there, i said he'll switch it off at night. fine she said, as long as there's nothing left too near the fire. -so i took the envelope off those tickets and i tore that up and wrote down and i stuck it in the water heater that the sitting room fire may be on, please check. +so i took the envelope off those tickets and i tore that up and wrote down and i stuck it in the water heater that the sitting room fire may be on, please check. i put another one then on the draining board. cos if they're going to fix it round the sink, he doesn't know where they're gonna put it. you know, while i was there darren came in. @@ -63177,20 +63123,20 @@ and i said well no i said there's some water i said. mark's on holiday this week i said. they've put him in another. oh that's right he said. -i heard something about this he said, er i was on holidays all last week he said but erm it's bloody lies cos i saw him last week. -and he said erm yeah he said cos we've gotta pay this he said because it's all in the guarantee. +i heard something about this he said, er i was on holidays all last week he said but erm it's bloody lies cos i saw him last week. +and he said erm yeah he said cos we've gotta pay this he said because it's all in the guarantee. in the warranty. and he came in and i said and the mirror on the dressing table isn't done. -you know and that's gone and i said feel these beds i said. +you know and that's gone and i said feel these beds i said. they're soaking wet. and he felt them and he said they are a bit he said. -so i said well i danny rang this morning and he got permission to put the fire on and put them, i'm going to move them all into the front and erm to air them up. +so i said well i danny rang this morning and he got permission to put the fire on and put them, i'm going to move them all into the front and erm to air them up. and i said there's no way anybody can sleep in there. that's alright he said. -and he checked and then he went so i took the bags off the pillows in case they were sweating in the bags and i put them out on the seats. +and he checked and then he went so i took the bags off the pillows in case they were sweating in the bags and i put them out on the seats. i put the quilts all out on the seats. and . -because there's eight there's er seven, there's eight pillows then and +because there's eight there's er seven, there's eight pillows then and he's done nothing. yeah. he @@ -63201,23 +63147,23 @@ she's still there? tiny. yes. she said how's danny then? -and i said oh he's at home i said this week i said and that oh and she said well tell him to get over here and we'll sort him out. -i said eh i said when danny comes in he'll sort you out. +and i said oh he's at home i said this week i said and that oh and she said well tell him to get over here and we'll sort him out. +i said eh i said when danny comes in he'll sort you out. and she laughed about it. -darren said you know the girls in the were saying that you weren't well, how was you and one of these days. +darren said you know the girls in the were saying that you weren't well, how was you and one of these days. i don't know what this is all for. -well they th th the kids were there but +well they th th the kids were there but and he said will you be there? and i said well i don't know. you should have said yes, we're gonna try to. that's why i got the tickets. -it depends now how er mm i don't know. +it depends now how er mm i don't know. tea? he enjoyed it for forty years. two thousand five hundred pounds. oh. he made a mistake. -you know, if there's nothing like the last week then did you have your tea danny? +you know, if there's nothing like the last week then did you have your tea danny? i had one piece of butter and jam. i can't take them tablets till i've eaten something. oh. @@ -63241,18 +63187,18 @@ good god there's a mirror in the sitting room as big as that wall. you'll see it when you go over there. beautiful thing. yes, -and i said i've bought a box of matches for him to go down and light this fire thinking you know he might need two or three matches at a time. -but er well i gave him a box of matches to go with him and i thought oh well he'll have plenty of matches then. -and i took them in, he says what do you buy them for? +and i said i've bought a box of matches for him to go down and light this fire thinking you know he might need two or three matches at a time. +but er well i gave him a box of matches to go with him and i thought oh well he'll have plenty of matches then. +and i took them in, he says what do you buy them for? he said. i've got loads of matches. in this caravan everything's electronic. -fridge, light switches ooh beautiful thing it is. +fridge, light switches ooh beautiful thing it is. ten times the price of ours i expect. a caravan is a caravan after all, isn't it? -but for what we want it for ours is good enough. +but for what we want it for ours is good enough. good enough. -that's what i'm saying perhaps they must let it out though. +that's what i'm saying perhaps they must let it out though. if we were having why's malcolm got it? if we were having a caravan like that, i'd be too frightened to let it. @@ -63263,7 +63209,7 @@ let it. there we are. i couldn't afford to pay for it then could i? no. -he's right up by the wishing wheel well or whatever it is. +he's right up by the wishing wheel well or whatever it is. you know this reproduction furniture? and the little lead windows? that's got it all inside it. @@ -63272,22 +63218,22 @@ is it? no. the shower is. quite a few people there today. -whether it was the fine weather bringing them out or yesterday. +whether it was the fine weather bringing them out or yesterday. lot of owners where down checking it see. eh? -lot of owners were down checking them. +lot of owners were down checking them. mm. they were . you could see the mattresses all under the sheet. -and they were cleaning the windows and washing the box +and they were cleaning the windows and washing the box i would do that next year. mm? mm. i'd do that next year. we never saw that old girl trudging round today. -the life of a caravan isn't long is it? -not we've got. -when we bought it he told me i'd have at least ten years because the make of it is it's a good make. +the life of a caravan isn't long is it? +not we've got. +when we bought it he told me i'd have at least ten years because the make of it is it's a good make. and the make has got a lot to do with it. oh. and what is the make of it? @@ -63303,7 +63249,7 @@ mm i know, that's what she said. i don't how she knows. if i, if if i found out there was animals in our caravan, i'd take them to town. but how do you know if you're not there every second? -you you for one, like her, when you went to the caravan, you'd smell it like that. +you you for one, like her, when you went to the caravan, you'd smell it like that. oh i . but you'd smell it wouldn't you? mm. @@ -63311,7 +63257,7 @@ and they know this. cos there are dogs there, great big ones. yeah. mm big white ones. -that that man yesterday, he paid six thousand pound for his caravan. +that that man yesterday, he paid six thousand pound for his caravan. he s he said that on the tape. mhm. i listened to the tape with her last night. @@ -63333,22 +63279,22 @@ that's the price of a new one. i know they're as good as a house almost. well he said on that tape, i gave them a fat cheque of six thousand pounds. mm. -well that isn't bloody half of what we paid. +well that isn't bloody half of what we paid. yeah i'm paying for mine monthly, but i won't disturb fourteen thousand seven hundred. -perhaps perhaps he's got a an agreement. -like perhaps he bought the ground and the caravan, and then they had an agreement that er stone park would er b you know let it, be responsible for when they let it or something. +perhaps perhaps he's got a an agreement. +like perhaps he bought the ground and the caravan, and then they had an agreement that er stone park would er b you know let it, be responsible for when they let it or something. yeah. -see there's different contracts altogether there. +see there's different contracts altogether there. mm. -i mean he she was going on that tape about she had to replace some things. +i mean he she was going on that tape about she had to replace some things. mm. -she had well i've got nothing like that. +she had well i've got nothing like that. no. -if something is gone they replace it. +if something is gone they replace it. that's part of the contract. -well everything had gone on the one. +well everything had gone on the one. well -dishes and furniture and +dishes and furniture and pillows. everything was ripped out or destroyed. pillows. @@ -63357,11 +63303,11 @@ she had to pay for eight pillows. mm. we've had no bills like that. we were asked if we wanted to do the chassis. -and she was so toffee-nosed as if they said the curtains. +and she was so toffee-nosed as if they said the curtains. oh yes i'll have them c gotta have them done. -and and probably said they'd maintain the thing for her at a price. +and and probably said they'd maintain the thing for her at a price. well at a price yeah. -i mean they don't do nothing for nothing. +i mean they don't do nothing for nothing. no of course not. they're out to get money, aren't they? it's their living. @@ -63372,7 +63318,7 @@ and it saves and i will next year. it saves thirty five pounds. mm. -but for that thirty five pounds the carpets are shampooed, the seats are shampooed, the lot. +but for that thirty five pounds the carpets are shampooed, the seats are shampooed, the lot. were they in today? what? the men? @@ -63383,7 +63329,7 @@ cos there was two he come to see two workmen went by. yeah, further down. -i even went, i was dying to go to the toilet so i thought oh i'll go down to the big er and i had no toilet paper so i'll go down to the big toilets and shower rooms. +i even went, i was dying to go to the toilet so i thought oh i'll go down to the big er and i had no toilet paper so i'll go down to the big toilets and shower rooms. they're all locked. everything's locked up there. everything's locked there. @@ -63412,7 +63358,7 @@ when i was over there last they were, there was four trucks r loading that super mm. long lease i expect. four lorry loads of stuff there. -yes, it's could be like thomas shop. +yes, it's could be like thomas shop. he has it for so long. oh i don't know. mm. @@ -63423,7 +63369,7 @@ you've gotta put in tenders for it then. cos they must make a bomb though. unless stone park has got it. cos a lot of stuff isn't in. -they could be put a manager in and the benefits. +they could be put a manager in and the benefits. i suppose they would. mm. perhaps they do. @@ -63439,29 +63385,29 @@ did he have a paper? mm. should have brought it back, did you? no. -he bought the saturday one that's got the week part in it. +he bought the saturday one that's got the week part in it. why didn't he come over and fetch the car then? because he said there's no point, i don't want it. well i've got to take his over now, he'll have to bring me back. yeah. -what i was going to tell him, if he was to come over, take my car there when i'd have taken this car over, i would have had a car to come back. +what i was going to tell him, if he was to come over, take my car there when i'd have taken this car over, i would have had a car to come back. well that's what he said. he said you'd better keep the car there in case his won't be ready or something. mm. lot of kids about though. -in another couple of weeks spring then. +in another couple of weeks spring then. would if the weather would take up. but still they book regardless of weather don't they? mm. mm. that's the night for my birthday. all the machines and everything are switched off in there. -yeah but you see on the, oh i don't know what date it is sixteenth tomorrow on the eighteenth erm eighteenth, nineteenth, twentieth they have freddie and the dreamers there. +yeah but you see on the, oh i don't know what date it is sixteenth tomorrow on the eighteenth erm eighteenth, nineteenth, twentieth they have freddie and the dreamers there. well that's wednesday. yeah. so they must be open at nights to practise. mark is there. -mark mark is going to it. +mark mark is going to it. that george roper's there the week after. will sally be able to go with him? course she will. @@ -63472,11 +63418,11 @@ but on that one, there's no children allowed in there. it's adult only. and there's a buffet with it. a free buffet. -well now, do they run a show and that racket's going on in the entertainment club at the same time? +well now, do they run a show and that racket's going on in the entertainment club at the same time? oh you can't hear it. the show is up in the other rooms. huge big rooms up there. -in the room. +in the room. it holds sixteen hundred and fifty people. we didn't go up there. mm. @@ -63496,7 +63442,7 @@ she, she she's dead now er mm. mm. mildred. -well george roper is there on the twenty eighth of march. +well george roper is there on the twenty eighth of march. oh is that his name? yeah. george roper. @@ -63511,22 +63457,22 @@ well you know, bit of acting, comedian. featuring stars cabaret george roper and a full supporting programme. i think that'll be very old. well he's fifties. -gonna say i don't think he could go on his own, go down on his own +gonna say i don't think he could go on his own, go down on his own well . -i mean they've got the comedians there er next week for four nights. +i mean they've got the comedians there er next week for four nights. the ones that are on television. a string of comedians saying jokes one after the other. though this year well i i never thought much of george roper. -i i he was nothing without mildred. +i i he was nothing without mildred. mm. -well he like harry worth weren't he? -it's er the way he says things. +well he like harry worth weren't he? +it's er the way he says things. he could make you laugh by looking at him. i mean he is a comedian. i thought she was the bottom of it all. it was she that kept the thing going. -well no cos the show was based on that er spencer, what was his name? +well no cos the show was based on that er spencer, what was his name? frank spencer? frank spencer and betty thing. this show was based on the same thing. @@ -63546,9 +63492,9 @@ arthur was the husband. mm. oh there we are. oh dear. -ring sally now then, cos she wants to put in the bath with her. +ring sally now then, cos she wants to put in the bath with her. well does she go in in the morning? -no i dunno sally works on a monday. +no i dunno sally works on a monday. oh. oh aye yeah. so i dunno. @@ -63562,62 +63508,62 @@ that's alright then. but i really should have looked at me plants. mm? i should have looked at me plants today. -anyway our darren came in,and i'm gonna forget darren came to the caravan and i was telling him about these wet sheets and beds and the mirrors done and what i was doing there and oh he said and about the mattress he said and i said to him mattress, it's still the same mattress. +anyway our darren came in,and i'm gonna forget darren came to the caravan and i was telling him about these wet sheets and beds and the mirrors done and what i was doing there and oh he said and about the mattress he said and i said to him mattress, it's still the same mattress. yes he said, i've gotta wait he said. -i'll be putting a new mattress in er i'll be putting another mattress in. -and he said i've got to put after dark . +i'll be putting a new mattress in er i'll be putting another mattress in. +and he said i've got to put after dark . what do you mean after dark? i said. he turned round well i've got to move about discreetly he said. -and i said erm you talking about then? +and i said erm you talking about then? and he said oh i've been taking it out of one of our own caravans, our own caravans he said. new one. oh there we are though he said, i don't want . -he said to me have you got it on tape? +he said to me have you got it on tape? i said no, no i haven't. no. -and that's when he said he said i'll be going up one night when it's dark he said. +and that's when he said he said i'll be going up one night when it's dark he said. i'll take it out of one of our vans. so i said what do you want me to do then, leave this mattress on the bed? and you'll be taking it? -and i said or shall i it might not be done then i said so i'll have to air them. -oh yeah he said . +and i said or shall i it might not be done then i said so i'll have to air them. +oh yeah he said . that's what i'll be doing . yeah. -the microwave because the microchef -mark i forgot to ask you what was in the caravans, the sleeping arrangement. +the microwave because the microchef +mark i forgot to ask you what was in the caravans, the sleeping arrangement. is there sleeping bags there? -is there quilts or what do you know? +is there quilts or what do you know? so i said to her take kirsty's sleeping bag. take your s and i said have you got a sleeping bag? no. -i said well i gave mark a sleeping bag and er two blankets and a couple of pillowcases. +i said well i gave mark a sleeping bag and er two blankets and a couple of pillowcases. there must be pillows, i'm sure of it. -and erm i said take kirsty's sleeping bag and call in here for a sleeping bag and i'll give you a couple of blankets to go with it. +and erm i said take kirsty's sleeping bag and call in here for a sleeping bag and i'll give you a couple of blankets to go with it. and i said i'll . so she said yes. she wants to know do you want buy her . for a hundred and fifty pound. why is she selling it? -no because er well she said +no because er well she said well i told her today, i said look mark said there's no money. -or i said the money you don't spend . -i said when you come home trousers, what you want. +or i said the money you don't spend . +i said when you come home trousers, what you want. what did she say? she said small ones. doesn't matter if they're long in the leg. he'll have to try the trousers on . he'll have to try the shoes on. -but he said on wednesday and you'll pay in the money into the bank +but he said on wednesday and you'll pay in the money into the bank hannah was on. oh god yes! -missed that and er oh i forget where she went to. +missed that and er oh i forget where she went to. er venezuela was it ? no. -erm where the leaning tower of pisa +erm where the leaning tower of pisa pisa. -nice, that's very nice +nice, that's very nice she don't go near a shop. she don't spend no money now much. oh yes she does. @@ -63625,14 +63571,14 @@ oh yes she does. i see, she went in the shop and she bought the bloody shop. did she? a jewellers shop. -and she bought a, a cameo brooch with a little ring on top that she could put a chain in as well. +and she bought a, a cameo brooch with a little ring on top that she could put a chain in as well. you know, you can put the chain on it and yeah. pin it on the brooch. and she gave two thousand lira for it. much. -it was an awful lot cost two thousand lira . -she's going to next week she's going to the pope. +it was an awful lot cost two thousand lira . +she's going to next week she's going to the pope. going to italy and a visit to the pope. rome. er italy he said. @@ -63648,7 +63594,7 @@ still born babies. what is all this? i don't know. what have you got? -the news and, oh yes it's only a few minutes lovey. +the news and, oh yes it's only a few minutes lovey. quarter past, no wait, quarter to six. it's quarter to seven. has your clock stopped? @@ -63666,8 +63612,8 @@ so it'll come on after this. mm. it's a documentary thing. yes, i suppose so. -ends, oh look -oh stupid old +ends, oh look +oh stupid old mm. ooh. oh yes. @@ -63677,15 +63623,15 @@ i dunno. has had to tear up its election coverage plans because tory ministers are scared to meet top industrialists . mm. top industrialists, those are big business boys. -chancellor norman lamont and treasury ministers were told er chancellor norman lamont and treasury ministers were to be grilled like labour spokesmen by a panel of businessmen and just one union leader . -but there was to be norman lamont and a tr and treasury ministers, three or four of them. +chancellor norman lamont and treasury ministers were told er chancellor norman lamont and treasury ministers were to be grilled like labour spokesmen by a panel of businessmen and just one union leader . +but there was to be norman lamont and a tr and treasury ministers, three or four of them. and there was to be the big industrialists, three or four of them. same as labour was done the other day. but the tories but the tories have scrapped agreed plans claiming the panel is not politically balanced. the b b c two programme is regularly pr presented by peter jay who's panorama special on the slump was controversially axed last week . -they're not willing to stand up see erm er what's it, richard dimbleby was it richard or the other one? -was +they're not willing to stand up see erm er what's it, richard dimbleby was it richard or the other one? +was jonathon. richard's dead. no the boy, the other boy. @@ -63696,20 +63642,20 @@ the other boy. there's two boys alive. david? mm. -i don't know one from the other by name. +i don't know one from the other by name. but the one was at him yesterday and he, well he didn't know what to say next. he did quiz him. that's david. is it? on a sunday. -well and, and er lamont even said that er unemployment would get higher. -he even said so yesterday +well and, and er lamont even said that er unemployment would get higher. +he even said so yesterday can't get no bloody higher can it? oh it could. twenty two percent vat if the tories get back. mm. jobless er tory jobless figures were exposed yesterday as a fraud. -the official unemployment total of two two million six hundred and four thousand one hundred is more than a million short of the real figure because the tories have found thirty ways not to count jobless people . +the official unemployment total of two two million six hundred and four thousand one hundred is more than a million short of the real figure because the tories have found thirty ways not to count jobless people . that right? they say unless you've been unemployed six months you're not unemployed. you're looking for a job. @@ -63719,8 +63665,8 @@ six months. six weeks, yeah. well if you haven't been working for six months you are looking for a job, you are not unemployed. they don't call that unemployment. -course this is all voting propaganda again. -i mean when is it it's a disgrace to the social service workers isn't it? +course this is all voting propaganda again. +i mean when is it it's a disgrace to the social service workers isn't it? to make them wear uniform. they're getting them like prison officers and policeman and well it's the same as anywhere else. @@ -63731,9 +63677,9 @@ that's only to advertise the place though isn't it? marks and spencers and it isn't. if you went into your clarke's shoe shop they've all got the same clothes. -it's it makes it so easy that the staff, one can't dress any better than the other. +it's it makes it so easy that the staff, one can't dress any better than the other. they're all equal. -when you go to places like in the big stores the staff have all got the same type of apron er overall. +when you go to places like in the big stores the staff have all got the same type of apron er overall. and that's for the customer, if it needs help they know who is who to go for advice. yeah. that's all it is. @@ -63760,16 +63706,16 @@ but there's no need to go to that prices. a name on. you can have the firm's name and give them a brooch or something. well they've got them anyway, haven't they? -but val was on about it last summer. +but val was on about it last summer. they was talking about it then. -but she said that they had been so many months or when everybody else had a pay rise they only had a little bit. +but she said that they had been so many months or when everybody else had a pay rise they only had a little bit. and the extra that they should have had is going to pay for these uniforms. oh. didn't want the uniforms. well a percentage is taken out of your money for them. there's no doubt about that. mm. -well that's what she was on about that, and and they was they were going +well that's what she was on about that, and and they was they were going well everybody has got to do that. to go on strike because of it. and really, it would be a good thing for val. @@ -63777,17 +63723,17 @@ why? well she's gotta pay so much for her bloody clothes. she makes her own, a lot of them. she's still gotta buy the material. -well she would rather have her own than be dressed up like looking like rolled doll she said. +well she would rather have her own than be dressed up like looking like rolled doll she said. cos they were all on about it. they were talking about going on strike over it, about it anyway. is it going to rain? mm. could have the odd little shower. no er tonight it's supposed to rain. -david the chief economist of nat west bank expects output to rise by only point six percent this year. -a much lower rate than predicted by chancellor norman lamont on last week's budget. -mr also believes interest and mortgage rates will remain high . -so if people reads this paper which is the, which of the papers are read the most? +david the chief economist of nat west bank expects output to rise by only point six percent this year. +a much lower rate than predicted by chancellor norman lamont on last week's budget. +mr also believes interest and mortgage rates will remain high . +so if people reads this paper which is the, which of the papers are read the most? which is the most popular paper? the mirror and the sun. and today i think isn't it? @@ -63795,25 +63741,25 @@ well the sun is conservative. what's today? conservative. i don't know. -well the sun used to be a labour paper. +well the sun used to be a labour paper. well didn't that er rupert murdoch take it over? i don't know. rupert murdoch? and he's a conservative? he's an australian isn't he? mm. -whatever i can't remember. +whatever i can't remember. but i knew it before it was the sun you see. no, what do you call it? yes, the sun. it was the daily herald wasn't it? when it came out first. ooh. -senator ted kennedy revealed yesterday that he is to wed lawyer victoria who's father is to stand trial over an alleged fraud. +senator ted kennedy revealed yesterday that he is to wed lawyer victoria who's father is to stand trial over an alleged fraud. kennedy sixty started dating the thirty eight year old divorced mother of two last june. -i love her and her children very much he said. -victoria's father retired oh he's father's victoria's father, retired judge edmund denies fraud . -the kennedy's are in trouble every corner aren't they? +i love her and her children very much he said. +victoria's father retired oh he's father's victoria's father, retired judge edmund denies fraud . +the kennedy's are in trouble every corner aren't they? it's nothing to do with him. no, but er i mean he's even marrying into trouble. the whole of his family. @@ -63826,23 +63772,23 @@ at least one case is understood to be involved in a murder charge. a top level enquiry is underway into the racket. dubbed by prison wives the cellnet scandal after the cabinet mobile phones system. visitors are thoroughly searched before they are allowed in to the jail which houses two hundred remand prisoners, killers, i r a terrorists and rapists, and the investigation will examine whether a prison officer may have brought in the phone. -one senior officer said it would be extremely difficult to smuggle one in, security is so tight here on visits . +one senior officer said it would be extremely difficult to smuggle one in, security is so tight here on visits . oh well, there's always a lapse isn't there? what time does this budget start today i wonder? not that we've what budget? heard it all before. what budget? -this er, the labour giving their oh dear +this er, the labour giving their oh dear is barnado's advertising? back again. oh there. make a credit card donation. -or for more information about our work ring . +or for more information about our work ring . right let's go and empty the washing machine. put another load in. it's not drying . -no i don't +no i don't although the wind is rising apparently. mm. it's des o'connor tonight. @@ -63860,7 +63806,7 @@ oh i said i wanna . i said i've got a tape here. i said i'm sure he'll want to listen to this? and she said what do you mean? -i thought you were gonna go and tell him that he'd better see me today. +i thought you were gonna go and tell him that he'd better see me today. i, i've got a tape here and i'm sure he's gonna be interested in this. or i'm taking my caravan off here right now. oh yes. @@ -63870,12 +63816,12 @@ i said i bloody can do that. that is my caravan, not yours. i said i can do it. and i will do it if that man's not gonna see me. -so with that call it coincidence, call it what you like but one of these low-loaders come in to pick up a caravan or something like. +so with that call it coincidence, call it what you like but one of these low-loaders come in to pick up a caravan or something like. and i said there you are, he's there waiting to pick my caravan up. he was empty you see. i don't know who he was. -and she said wait here mr and in she goes in to this bloody meeting and out he came. -and he said i'm sorry mr but you haven't got an appointment. +and she said wait here mr and in she goes in to this bloody meeting and out he came. +and he said i'm sorry mr but you haven't got an appointment. i said do you want me to have an appointment, do you want to listen to this tape? or do you want me to take my caravan off here? he said why? @@ -63885,26 +63831,26 @@ i said and not only i think that, other people on the site think so. he asked me if i could wait five minutes. when i'm in there. and darren was on a day off and he's been . -and darren come in spoke to me and he says oh i danny. +and darren come in spoke to me and he says oh i danny. i said no you bloody won't. you'll get in that office with me. i said i want him in there. he sold me the caravan. and i went in there. -i says now have you had any visitors from a couple of nights in my caravan. +i says now have you had any visitors from a couple of nights in my caravan. no he said. i said i think somebody's saying some untruth to me. -i said because i've got a tape here and there's a couple who'll go to court if necessary. -and i said is my caravan being cleaned weekly as people go out if they've got it for a fortnight fortnightly. +i said because i've got a tape here and there's a couple who'll go to court if necessary. +and i said is my caravan being cleaned weekly as people go out if they've got it for a fortnight fortnightly. yes he said. -i said well you play that i said cos i've played it back. -and out he goes and gets this woman and in she comes with a chart with a woman's name the job number, that done it week by week or fortnight, whatever it does. +i said well you play that i said cos i've played it back. +and out he goes and gets this woman and in she comes with a chart with a woman's name the job number, that done it week by week or fortnight, whatever it does. and that is all there and signed that she done the caravan. it's her signature. her signature. that the caravan is cleaned. it's got to be he says. -he said because people leave their dirty things and beds and all this kind of thing. +he said because people leave their dirty things and beds and all this kind of thing. he said we cannot allow that. well you can understand that. yes, well he knows from experience. @@ -63915,12 +63861,12 @@ he said and do you know that we're a multi- million pound organization. of course, of course . mm? he said we're not . -so i said well a couple approached my wife here on on saturday. +so i said well a couple approached my wife here on on saturday. i said and they're very happy and ninety nine percent of the people on this site are happy. solid like. -and i said i you tell me if i'm happy. +and i said i you tell me if i'm happy. cos you've gotta convince me now, this morning, or my caravan's going off here. -i said and before you start that the caravan can't go for four years,on this tape. +i said and before you start that the caravan can't go for four years,on this tape. did he listen to it? oh yes. bring that here. @@ -63934,19 +63880,19 @@ no no. i just want some chips. do you want tea? i'll have coffee please. -anyway he wants to ask when this tape goes back, if he can have a copy of it. -he rung his managing director up there in front of me. +anyway he wants to ask when this tape goes back, if he can have a copy of it. +he rung his managing director up there in front of me. mm? -at hemel hempstead. +at hemel hempstead. hemel hempstead? yeah. -and he said he'd got a very +and he said he'd got a very pizza? yeah, please. -serious complaint that he'd just got. -that i'm in the office with him. +serious complaint that he'd just got. +that i'm in the office with him. and er -he to the managing director that i was in the office with a very serious complaint. +he to the managing director that i was in the office with a very serious complaint. and making accusations. and you were making accusations? yeah. @@ -63954,10 +63900,10 @@ i was. yeah. and he wanted to know what steps he could take. well danny wanted to know if it was true. -so they asked they wanted to know how, how we got the tape. +so they asked they wanted to know how, how we got the tape. so i showed him that letter you had. mm. -and he asked me to a ask you to when they ra give the tape back if they could possibly supply a copy of it, of that tape to them. +and he asked me to a ask you to when they ra give the tape back if they could possibly supply a copy of it, of that tape to them. in the meantime he's gotta write to these people. they know the people. mm? @@ -63969,14 +63915,14 @@ mm? and the caravan must be taken off within twenty eight working days. well i think it was taken off this morning. no, it's still there. -cos i saw that er bloke in er park landrover. +cos i saw that er bloke in er park landrover. oh you saw him that day didn't you? well they're moving and hunting caravans all the time mark. -they're on the roadways +they're on the roadways yeah well he he said he said no i'm talking about i saw, actually saw that guy who's in our caravan oh yeah? -in a landrover with a park bloke. +in a landrover with a park bloke. and all of a sudden three big juggernauts came into the camp and one of them was on the back of a truck. they they they well er er sh @@ -63986,9 +63932,9 @@ she said she couldn't take it off. no, he maybe it wasn't him then. i just thought it looked like him. -he told me it was still there and that he'd been told he's got to write to them today and they've got to get it taken off within twenty eight days. +he told me it was still there and that he'd been told he's got to write to them today and they've got to get it taken off within twenty eight days. yeah. -cos she was trying to find a, a reason or an excuse to sue them for it. +cos she was trying to find a, a reason or an excuse to sue them for it. she stated that. mm. it's all on the thing. @@ -64000,30 +63946,30 @@ they can't afford to break the law. no well do that. oh my god! -come here are you walking that way. -oh baby it's +come here are you walking that way. +oh baby it's too much work, i was just -nothing to do +nothing to do don't hurt him. the corner. -i wondered if they might have -stuck in the +i wondered if they might have +stuck in the push. -helen, do you think it's +helen, do you think it's no it isn't there in here look! where? you put it in. they're big they -daddy +daddy he'll never manage with them. wouldn't bother. -come here come here! +come here come here! roll them back. oh you've taken it off! -here look darling fingy go in thumby go in +here look darling fingy go in thumby go in put your thumb in! -that one in that one. +that one in that one. look wait. ah! oh helen this'll never work! @@ -64033,29 +63979,29 @@ i can't do it. i'm not messing about like that all day. i'll just take them back to the stall then. look people wanna get past helen! -excuse me +excuse me here are. here's the bag. -take them back to the stall and get him pair of woolly ones come on. +take them back to the stall and get him pair of woolly ones come on. don't you ! look come here, out the way! ricky! no ! -good boy come here. +good boy come here. come on. there are. gotta . see you ann -tara bye bye +tara bye bye see you next saturday. i hope so. -these ones yep. +these ones yep. ) gotta what? where is he? those are ninety nine p, this time. -got up all night and walked round and round and round on his blooming bad leg! +got up all night and walked round and round and round on his blooming bad leg! ay? then i go home and change. don't you mean . @@ -64063,49 +64009,49 @@ only a quiz. are you putting a suit on? good cos you won't get in a where are them then? -no but he said i did quite well +no but he said i did quite well yeah well you wanna -well he said i realise i with a +well he said i realise i with a your girlfriend's got no what? -it's not going off the rails +it's not going off the rails with the boys at the no, you're not last year. yes, yeah. you're sighing. no i haven't got a he i fancy , no ! -not not like that well you now just +not not like that well you now just friends. -just, no no no no ! +just, no no no no ! a bit more than friends. yeah but got feelings. -good looking if she what i think ! +good looking if she what i think ! just friends for the moment. a platonic relationship. at the moment. -at the moment out with me ! +at the moment out with me ! jammy devil! you're a randy little bugger aren't you? -she'll go with and go then you got +she'll go with and go then you got careful how you're driving. i'm not driving. well if you're driving then. alright. won't get drunk or owt will you? -course not he's never drunk in his life never been drunk at all not even +course not he's never drunk in his life never been drunk at all not even come on. -got something wrong with his blood so he's not allowed to ricky! +got something wrong with his blood so he's not allowed to ricky! come here. mind the road! -come here good boy, come here come here. +come here good boy, come here come here. now don't take them off. come on. i don't ! what's up? -okay then what about them ones? -one for only ninety nine p, so i had to make the money up they got +okay then what about them ones? +one for only ninety nine p, so i had to make the money up they got i want a pair of them. unless you get them a . ? @@ -64114,38 +64060,38 @@ come here ricky. to pay for it all. you're going to give me another one they've sold out they're gonna get them. -you get five for ninety nine p who wants to get +you get five for ninety nine p who wants to get you paying? -yep i bought the card. +yep i bought the card. go on that. -don't know i don't like it on the number one! -that's two 0 three . -that's ! +don't know i don't like it on the number one! +that's two 0 three . +that's ! i don't think er !! -look what you , animal animal! +look what you , animal animal! okay ! -look we can if you're not quiet! +look we can if you're not quiet! you what? no. mama ! oy! -pretty good are you? +pretty good are you? what like a christmas ? -i thought i'd make this week, i had four last week. +i thought i'd make this week, i had four last week. oh. those things up there. -i had to get one bag i didn't like to ask her for two. +i had to get one bag i didn't like to ask her for two. they're in here? ah my toe! where are they helen? i've got those things in, that's why. they think they'd have your bags. -here's your nappy -got all the toys in, that's why oh no! +here's your nappy +got all the toys in, that's why oh no! sa the throw them out. you'll have to throw these out. -throw them out where shall i +throw them out where shall i outside , out the way. are we yeah. @@ -64164,27 +64110,27 @@ here ! jonathan! look! i gotta go to gateway. -i know but we gotta swap that, that's it. -we've gotta brought +i know but we gotta swap that, that's it. +we've gotta brought oh. that puzzle. yeah. -i want that it's on the tape, turn it off. +i want that it's on the tape, turn it off. he's dropped that bloody bag on my foot with all them tins in it! ha. look at my foot look! it had nine tins of cream in it. we were gonna buy a flat up there. oh. -we were but they're tiny! -i know they're like the +we were but they're tiny! +i know they're like the come here. no, no no. -no they were only twenty six thousand. +no they were only twenty six thousand. god they were dear! well quite, and then i said hey nanny ! -no twenty six, i'm glad +no twenty six, i'm glad hey nana ! i went and had a look, that one went. was it? @@ -64192,11 +64138,11 @@ that one look. yeah. to this. yeah it's big enough for one but it isn't it big enough for two, that's the one we went to see. -paul live in one of them well, did. +paul live in one of them well, did. that's the one we went to see. look lovely. yeah but -pay it all, but +pay it all, but it's only got a bed in the bedroom you no erm wouldn't be able to bloody move! @@ -64210,13 +64156,13 @@ didn't see me, did you? just open the door and jump on the bed, if you want to put a bed in. no i should think it would be no you open the door and -no i know no it's it's alright for one +no i know no it's it's alright for one it's big for one though. -but not for two i mean me and stuart +but not for two i mean me and stuart not exactly little are we,. we had a look. work . -i know well it's not your don't wanna open the door and can't open the door properly cos the bed's there,one step and you're on the bed. +i know well it's not your don't wanna open the door and can't open the door properly cos the bed's there,one step and you're on the bed. leave it ricky! no! ricky, i'll belt you one! @@ -64226,11 +64172,11 @@ that's what i said. look what they're doing on the bed? . no. -oh i if i +oh i if i get ! go on! much time if i, if i'd been on my own. -like that stuart is he up there. +like that stuart is he up there. ah! live and learn. ha! @@ -64250,23 +64196,23 @@ these. the what? upstairs. i think he means. -he's gone now gone to see if his horses have won. -it's a nine to four one ! +he's gone now gone to see if his horses have won. +it's a nine to four one ! nine to four, that's what he wants. on the head. -half a dozen nine to four winners in the alphabet . -four hundred hundred to one. +half a dozen nine to four winners in the alphabet . +four hundred hundred to one. that'd get good house, without a mortgage, ha. -straight back in now? +straight back in now? yeah i've been told. you got gotta have really? -two pounds sixty to tell them how to do that six horses and if you win good prizes, you get a thousand or two with if you win. +two pounds sixty to tell them how to do that six horses and if you win good prizes, you get a thousand or two with if you win. rather than going to church. you don't have any faith. who? dad dad. -no i gotta look in here, where are you going? +no i gotta look in here, where are you going? i've just got my oh no, i'm not having in there, with the pushchair and the i'll be in gateways then. @@ -64283,48 +64229,48 @@ you're alright? yep. mummy ! helen! -i'll just stop here to get the erm i'll stop here with her. -oh yeah and i'll run back then. -only i want only just get me a tin of hair lacquer, normal hold for tinted that's all i want. +i'll just stop here to get the erm i'll stop here with her. +oh yeah and i'll run back then. +only i want only just get me a tin of hair lacquer, normal hold for tinted that's all i want. normal hold, tinted. -or ooh no not or a super hold nothing like that. +or ooh no not or a super hold nothing like that. alright. -i'll give you the money, but that's all i want silly me going +i'll give you the money, but that's all i want silly me going put it away! round, isn't it? hey? ah ba -been a good girl who's a good girl then? +been a good girl who's a good girl then? hey? who's a good girl? what? good girl? yeah? been a good girl? -he's +he's want to eat? only joking! -er two please can i have another one, please? +er two please can i have another one, please? bored? no i'm just resting. -no thi this size, i got one bigger than the other one, +no thi this size, i got one bigger than the other one, how much is this? eighty five. -oh so don't have any. +oh so don't have any. i guess that's twelve quid then about, i forgot now. that's a good idea. where's my ? standing at the checkout . -well +well how many's in here? twenty. oh yeah, oh give us some. what? fourteen quid left out . do you want some? -i bought him some of those cheekies hey you know i'm said i knew i forgotten something out of gateways,don't you ? +i bought him some of those cheekies hey you know i'm said i knew i forgotten something out of gateways,don't you ? filter coffee. -no where is she? +no where is she? where is she? boo! aah ! @@ -64333,34 +64279,34 @@ i've got two bags of cakes in here. don't expect me to carry them! eeurgh! you'll never push a pushchair with that lot on, helen. -this one's got all weekend to sleep in it and her +this one's got all weekend to sleep in it and her give me one of those bags, i suppose i've got to carry them! go and get them. -yeah i know she did well i suppose we better really +yeah i know she did well i suppose we better really go ahead, right open your legs. i'll be just over there. -yeah right good exercises. +yeah right good exercises. what? mummy. -come here hold my hand aha properly ! +come here hold my hand aha properly ! scruffy little bugger! -he's pulling his trousers down ! +he's pulling his trousers down ! ha. -ha he's -he's got his hands down in his pockets in the . +ha he's +he's got his hands down in his pockets in the . oh ho. -hands in pockets he's copying +hands in pockets he's copying where's he gone? -him you just can't see him,jonathan . +him you just can't see him,jonathan . aha. -kept on pulling his trousers down and putting his out in his pockets. +kept on pulling his trousers down and putting his out in his pockets. they're all hanging round his ankles. aha ha, typical. -i know baggy aren't they? +i know baggy aren't they? bell bottoms. it's only cos he's doing it. fashion freak. -no steven's that's jonathan . +no steven's that's jonathan . yeah jonathan does that, ah aha. oy! what? @@ -64375,27 +64321,27 @@ hello david. and you? alright bib bib bib -yes it was quite good +yes it was quite good when you meeting your mate then? three o'clock. ooh have i got a ? -got time to help her with this shopping and bloody come and get your mail! -pick up one of them bags for her i weren't watching anyway out +got time to help her with this shopping and bloody come and get your mail! +pick up one of them bags for her i weren't watching anyway out come here ricky. come here. -i can't hold that just hold the trolley with the bags in there. +i can't hold that just hold the trolley with the bags in there. ha. come here. -er we'll go -just ricky! -doesn't make round here, you can have the with -it's our house cos i we had a look at that one, that flat +er we'll go +just ricky! +doesn't make round here, you can have the with +it's our house cos i we had a look at that one, that flat what does it say,? it says go across the back -ma mum! -hey quiet in this shop. -no they're not in there i thought they it would be dark. -what did you put it on there for?let's sit down sit down!sit down!. +ma mum! +hey quiet in this shop. +no they're not in there i thought they it would be dark. +what did you put it on there for?let's sit down sit down!sit down!. oh there's try london. lived in london, she's going out with someone, living with someone and she's five months pregnant! @@ -64410,9 +64356,9 @@ bloody hell! all she ever wanted was a erm baby. -yeah five nearly six months. -she's not il a bloody what do you call it ? -at no. +yeah five nearly six months. +she's not il a bloody what do you call it ? +at no. oh. she left before she was pregnant. oh. @@ -64425,15 +64371,15 @@ steven. our steven? yeah. why what's he done? -alright th the car blew up on a dual carriageway there's +alright th the car blew up on a dual carriageway there's that's right. -a big bang i'm driving there's this great big bang and the bonnet lit up +a big bang i'm driving there's this great big bang and the bonnet lit up he went. the bonnet lit up oh god! right thought great! -it's staying on the dual carriageway, well i went round steven's to see if he thought to tow it round mine cos the already been on my back once oh no he said i've only just walked in from work i'm having my tea then i'm going to bed he said, there's no way i'm towing no motor for the he said, just f off! +it's staying on the dual carriageway, well i went round steven's to see if he thought to tow it round mine cos the already been on my back once oh no he said i've only just walked in from work i'm having my tea then i'm going to bed he said, there's no way i'm towing no motor for the he said, just f off! well well we'd have what did you say? done it for him! @@ -64447,39 +64393,39 @@ he comes round, and just say no, i'm not doing nothing for you. oh. what about when you borrowed our battery when yours wouldn't go? that's what i mean. -just say no and if he again say no. +just say no and if he again say no. when i come out . -when i , but he won't i put them all out, in fact . +when i , but he won't i put them all out, in fact . . -ah oh. +ah oh. go on. -no i won't cos the police were at the car no . +no i won't cos the police were at the car no . sounds like it were a robbery. -come out again police come out of the ca er er they were at the car there oh i said that's my car, he said oh yeah, i said yeah, he said, what's your name? +come out again police come out of the ca er er they were at the car there oh i said that's my car, he said oh yeah, i said yeah, he said, what's your name? felt like it. -checked with his radio, he goes alright then phoned back to the police station on his radio, he said it's not stolen the owner's now here he said, can you please get it moved? -i said well i'm trying to i said this bloke what happens to be my oldest brother i said, and he won't even tow it for me! +checked with his radio, he goes alright then phoned back to the police station on his radio, he said it's not stolen the owner's now here he said, can you please get it moved? +i said well i'm trying to i said this bloke what happens to be my oldest brother i said, and he won't even tow it for me! so he said, oh why not? -steven thinks that just be i only just got in he said, i'm having my tea and he said there's no way i'm gonna do nothing like that at this time of night when i've been fourteen hours at work so then he stormed off back home again so he said well you'll have to move it cos it's obstructing the dual carriageway someone might come round that corner fast and hit it. -he said it's not an offence he said if you've broke down, you can't help, he said but you've gotta really move it so i went round to paul and there was about seven or eight blokes that pushed it all the way round to bernie's. -no you don't forget helen he could come down +steven thinks that just be i only just got in he said, i'm having my tea and he said there's no way i'm gonna do nothing like that at this time of night when i've been fourteen hours at work so then he stormed off back home again so he said well you'll have to move it cos it's obstructing the dual carriageway someone might come round that corner fast and hit it. +he said it's not an offence he said if you've broke down, you can't help, he said but you've gotta really move it so i went round to paul and there was about seven or eight blokes that pushed it all the way round to bernie's. +no you don't forget helen he could come down i don't forget things like that. -and ask for any help in doing his car don't go to work or can he borrow this, just say no i'm sorry you couldn't help us and i'm your sister so now i can't +and ask for any help in doing his car don't go to work or can he borrow this, just say no i'm sorry you couldn't help us and i'm your sister so now i can't i know help you. -he has been like that for since he's been with her he has +he has been like that for since he's been with her he has i know about it. -he used to help us with anything before he got with her he'd always help me he always looked happy, now he +he used to help us with anything before he got with her he'd always help me he always looked happy, now he mum mum mum ! but now he's with her, he don't wanna now. well, you can just do the same with him. i you're not that bothered are you? -well no but i like to think that steven's still my brother. -yeah well i my son but he don't treat a mother. +well no but i like to think that steven's still my brother. +yeah well i my son but he don't treat a mother. but he's not he's not that when he's with her. -he wouldn't of come th wa on his saturday before his birthday he wouldn't of come and seen me unless he thought he was getting something out of it. -i asked him to i told him to. +he wouldn't of come th wa on his saturday before his birthday he wouldn't of come and seen me unless he thought he was getting something out of it. +i asked him to i told him to. yeah exactly! didn't come cos he wanted to did he? he @@ -64490,46 +64436,46 @@ gone! i know. ricky. you should of kept his present. -don't worry he's not getting nothing for christmas but a card and that's it can't even come and say hello, so bugger him! -doesn't bother me you, stu and i have been broken hearted a few months ago and i've cried over him not coming to see me but not any more. +don't worry he's not getting nothing for christmas but a card and that's it can't even come and say hello, so bugger him! +doesn't bother me you, stu and i have been broken hearted a few months ago and i've cried over him not coming to see me but not any more. i've not cried! well i have. yeah and it turn them different. how do you think you'd feel like she didn't want to know you when she grew up. -because her daddy drink drinks in there in the pub. +because her daddy drink drinks in there in the pub. he always in the pub. does daddy go in there drink drinks does he? no. does ricky go in there? no he's never been there. you've been in there have you? -when you come across here that bag mum. -i'll just leave it there he'll be at home with his mother now watching them on the telly. +when you come across here that bag mum. +i'll just leave it there he'll be at home with his mother now watching them on the telly. where's your ? there ricky. who's in there? look! -ha ha ha is it big? +ha ha ha is it big? big. -stuey stuey going in there. +stuey stuey going in there. can't move inside there! gone home now. gone home now. gone home to see his mummy. -gone to see his mummy like mum +gone to see his mummy like mum i've had a -that that +that that oh go on, you heavy boy! careful. -oh boy +oh boy oh boy ! -when we get right to the again. -oh yeah got a tre got and tree and all the decorations are there. +when we get right to the again. +oh yeah got a tre got and tree and all the decorations are there. i'm not putting them up though! -he ain't putting them up is he take them down to helen's then some lovely decorations we'll ask him for them helen. +he ain't putting them up is he take them down to helen's then some lovely decorations we'll ask him for them helen. no. why? -there's a lovely tree and a lovely decorations there could do with tree they're not gonna use it, you might as well have them. +there's a lovely tree and a lovely decorations there could do with tree they're not gonna use it, you might as well have them. charge. for the kids. charge. @@ -64538,36 +64484,36 @@ why? mightn't you? did you get in before christmas? oh i don't think so, the way he's going! -so the council informed seth if i don't move in a month i'll have to put an application in +so the council informed seth if i don't move in a month i'll have to put an application in and put another one in. bloody hell! are yo you signed the papers? -yeah well, no yeah. +yeah well, no yeah. no? -got got that form didn't we? +got got that form didn't we? yeah and it said go in next yeah i week to sign them. -yeah but george +yeah but george hold onto there. -i can't go +i can't go where are you? -before so i lent them, so he's gone in i go by the same time as him we both gotta sign them +before so i lent them, so he's gone in i go by the same time as him we both gotta sign them and you both sign. -together and he's not going in there. -oh well post through there, yeah? -if they do ah i don't think i'm gonna be a bit bloody pleased! +together and he's not going in there. +oh well post through there, yeah? +if they do ah i don't think i'm gonna be a bit bloody pleased! jonathan, do you know back slash? you know what jodie and david's ? come in here please. look all we do. -ooh +ooh lie down dog ! -who's there mum +who's there mum i know it's a dog. out! out! -beattie come over here and take your coat off come on then take your coat off. +beattie come over here and take your coat off come on then take your coat off. er no! dog. @@ -64587,7 +64533,7 @@ he's been outside, hasn't he, so there's bound to be. still stinks dad -in here, well they must have bloody hamsters then. +in here, well they must have bloody hamsters then. whistles something bloody stinks, dunnit? can you smell it? @@ -64595,14 +64541,14 @@ hey! do you want a fag? did you have enough money for that prescription? oh you don't have to pay do you? -no there was a full time education i put that supposed to pay for them. +no there was a full time education i put that supposed to pay for them. you're not are you, on yts, you don't. -yeah cos i ain't got a form i haven't filled out a form, well i have, but i ain't got it back. +yeah cos i ain't got a form i haven't filled out a form, well i have, but i ain't got it back. just put that on. -i put full time education on it ed that's a aren't i so i'm +i put full time education on it ed that's a aren't i so i'm mm. full time education. -who's that? +who's that? dog. have to go every week on the train who's that? @@ -64617,39 +64563,39 @@ boots are, i know. i ain't got a pen that's why i didn't fill it in. daddy. just have to . -there's ! +there's ! what? hurt? -hurts, yeah getting told where my knee hurts. +hurts, yeah getting told where my knee hurts. ha? hurt okay. hurt. does it hurt, does it? -your a right mother ooh yeah it does hurt. +your a right mother ooh yeah it does hurt. oh shut up! -got an up on top the thing look. +got an up on top the thing look. somebody want a cup of tea? oh well i will in a minute. this it? what? -that one . +that one . ca you take your coat off? yes. take your coat off. -a mac mac +a mac mac music, yeah, don't touch! don't touch the music. -ann's wants to be a stress attack at the minute ooh . +ann's wants to be a stress attack at the minute ooh . a ann ann love. hat. yes. looks like lee, don't he? -i haven't got any headphones so i can't have a +i haven't got any headphones so i can't have a dad! listen to yourself. -what got +what got you can't oh i got them but i mean i ain't brought them with me. course you could use a normal @@ -64666,19 +64612,19 @@ they're not. at least it's sixty, seventy quid. it's only lent to me for a week bu she's back next friday for it. -probably to record it, what did you expect? +probably to record it, what did you expect? it's got a radio and tape on it. -now ricky ! +now ricky ! aha. tell him he's gotta er his prescription. come here! thank you. mum? what? -where's that gone? +where's that gone? why ask me? well why ask me now ? -ooh ah ah god! +ooh ah ah god! how can you go to a nightclub tonight like that? i will, ha. what? @@ -64686,30 +64632,30 @@ step last night. yeah look what you done to yourself. ricky! put it down ! -just blow my nose +just blow my nose no. probably. oh yeah? -no i read that one, ha ha read the sun. +no i read that one, ha ha read the sun. what's dad get now, sun or the star, or does erm. normally get two? -that having a word with the dog i'm gonna +that having a word with the dog i'm gonna does he like the dog? yeah i or is he fed up of it? -amount of crap +amount of crap just where 's he craps on the floor, you have a massive pong when that happens. don't do it in one, it does it all over the floor don't you like that? -little dollops all over, and there's one spot, little +little dollops all over, and there's one spot, little well why doesn't he put bloody newspaper there? -no it does all over the place, wherever put newspaper down, he does it on the carpet so kept doing it by the cooker so we put newspaper down there, and put the toys away, see they was in the way you see, put newspaper down there and then next wouldn't have that,. +no it does all over the place, wherever put newspaper down, he does it on the carpet so kept doing it by the cooker so we put newspaper down there, and put the toys away, see they was in the way you see, put newspaper down there and then next wouldn't have that,. ooh god! leave that! who rick? who rick? -or me da da da da da +or me da da da da da ha! oh dear. oh da da @@ -64718,95 +64664,95 @@ no it should be alright tonight, nothing out of the ordinary. hoo hoo. shall be quite glad. ah. -look at this, look my tea's made. +look at this, look my tea's made. your tea? all to myself. -it's what we stop urgh! -what we did last night, stop for a chicken on the way over there. +it's what we stop urgh! +what we did last night, stop for a chicken on the way over there. where did you get the ? wahhhh ! well last weekend i bought a -no go like that -bought it for the dog and about fifty quid of it altogether +no go like that +bought it for the dog and about fifty quid of it altogether yeah. -on the way home cos i bought a tenner for that for forty quid. +on the way home cos i bought a tenner for that for forty quid. and all the money went in the bank. you, you ! -so i got in my leg. -don't know where to go though don't know where the best places are don't know where they are. +so i got in my leg. +don't know where to go though don't know where the best places are don't know where they are. hey, he's out! -going about five t , half four, five o'clock time going to cambridge first. +going about five t , half four, five o'clock time going to cambridge first. want a cup of tea? yeah yeah -yes please you gotta meet him somewhere first, provided +yes please you gotta meet him somewhere first, provided that's late. he's going. mm. what's his name? brian. look, look. -we got a bloke called rubbles why have travellers always got funny names? +we got a bloke called rubbles why have travellers always got funny names? they have -why -because if we told them that +why +because if we told them that why? -there's balloo peggy +there's balloo peggy yeah they're only nicknames. -no real names balloo, peggy fibi, violet walter they're all our, real old fashioned names there's er fibi, peggy, balloo violet erm +no real names balloo, peggy fibi, violet walter they're all our, real old fashioned names there's er fibi, peggy, balloo violet erm walter a -sophie well that's not really a weird name but she's there as well bernie knows them all +sophie well that's not really a weird name but she's there as well bernie knows them all a ma they all know bernie. -ah yeah bu a -and they got all -they've all got brothers called ricky lee,jo joe boy, john boy an billy +ah yeah bu a +and they got all +they've all got brothers called ricky lee,jo joe boy, john boy an billy mm. -je boy and stuff like that they all call them boy at the end of the name john boy an -that's why he's only got a boy +je boy and stuff like that they all call them boy at the end of the name john boy an +that's why he's only got a boy joe boy -it's what they call roseanne girls aren't they? -ricky lee an all that lot as if bernie don't know ricky lee is a bloody name and erm lisa marie is as well. -that's what steve don't call his if he has a girl. -i know beca that's only cos we were going to call her lisa marie weren't we? +it's what they call roseanne girls aren't they? +ricky lee an all that lot as if bernie don't know ricky lee is a bloody name and erm lisa marie is as well. +that's what steve don't call his if he has a girl. +i know beca that's only cos we were going to call her lisa marie weren't we? oh i don't know . -we were gonna call her lisa marie but then i said bernie said that because mum done so much for me during +we were gonna call her lisa marie but then i said bernie said that because mum done so much for me during mum ar when i was pregnant with ricky an all the rest of it and called her anna marie, after mum ma -cos we called it changed it from lisa to anna for mum. -ooh look look. +cos we called it changed it from lisa to anna for mum. +ooh look look. he da da with lee -dee dee dee -girl i'm i'm going out with tonight see her name's panja and it's spelt p a n j a +dee dee dee +girl i'm i'm going out with tonight see her name's panja and it's spelt p a n j a panja. -no tanja tanja, i can't pronounce the second name. +no tanja tanja, i can't pronounce the second name. do you want a couple of these? she foreign then? -her dad is italian. +her dad is italian. i'm not hat, i'm not. -ha ha, oh dear noddy. +ha ha, oh dear noddy. i'll tell you something as well. what? you're paying for this boy. got lovely handwriting, look. hey. say her sister's called sophia -er girl is +er girl is janice cos this is -there's tania, sophia and what's her name can't remember, it's an italian name the other one. +there's tania, sophia and what's her name can't remember, it's an italian name the other one. what am i? -very weird name, she's got her other sister. -don't say anything ah dear, come here +very weird name, she's got her other sister. +don't say anything ah dear, come here ricky come here. come here. kettle's off. oh dear -oh dear come on don't cry, you be a tough little boy you'd be tough little boy didn't you? +oh dear come on don't cry, you be a tough little boy you'd be tough little boy didn't you? oh no what's happened to the kettle? do try plugging it in, helen. @@ -64816,14 +64762,14 @@ i have ! try putting some water in it ! oh shut your gob! hey! -no there's panja and sophia an and i don't know what the other one's name is +no there's panja and sophia an and i don't know what the other one's name is very weird. me me mo sit on . it's a seat. -well funny girls ' names. +well funny girls ' names. who? -said oy -oy oh. +said oy +oy oh. what? foll that's not her name! @@ -64835,12 +64781,12 @@ oh. she don't like amanda though. hey name a horse folly ! -dog !woof woof oy oy oy ! +dog !woof woof oy oy oy ! cut two white holes in it, then send them in the bank, it'll be chocolate! oy, oy ! down. -er, you got a pen then, so i can fill out this prescription. -here are here are. +er, you got a pen then, so i can fill out this prescription. +here are here are. somewhere, but i don't know where. up here. you want some new words on that thing then do you? @@ -64848,34 +64794,34 @@ what? i'll talk in back slang, if you want. go on then. what? -shut your face -he don't like wanna get on my shoulder. +shut your face +he don't like wanna get on my shoulder. what shall i say? -oh oh oh -talk in traveller's traveller's +oh oh oh +talk in traveller's traveller's working? yeah. -talk in traveller's talk at me -could be back slang. +talk in traveller's talk at me +could be back slang. what does that mean? -well you say i don't know if you watch neighbours, do you? -no very rarely. -well you put another word in between each letter of the other word sort of like +well you say i don't know if you watch neighbours, do you? +no very rarely. +well you put another word in between each letter of the other word sort of like ah ma mum put it on neighbours it's an alibi mum where they'd say mum. -first letter of one word put allay and then the last letters of the word sort of like he helen will be halibin like that you see and that's how we talk at work if we got a get +first letter of one word put allay and then the last letters of the word sort of like he helen will be halibin like that you see and that's how we talk at work if we got a get mum , mum -if we gotta wind someone up sort of like one of the girls fancies a bloke she'll tell it to his face, but in back slang so he don't know she's saying they go er, what? +if we gotta wind someone up sort of like one of the girls fancies a bloke she'll tell it to his face, but in back slang so he don't know she's saying they go er, what? plenty of women down there? loads. -must i bet they're all +must i bet they're all dad! made redundant, -sort of like, talk about this toilet, say i'm going toalibi to i go,toalibi -allay i to loogoo is to galagy is go tolagee is two galaga tolagol and +sort of like, talk about this toilet, say i'm going toalibi to i go,toalibi +allay i to loogoo is to galagy is go tolagee is two galaga tolagol and and we all speak like that at work, ha. ricky, leave it! get out! @@ -64883,47 +64829,47 @@ i don't want you. daddy. yeah, kettle's gone kettle has gone off. -i don't it will water. +i don't it will water. take his advice . -not you either ricky leave the dog alone. +not you either ricky leave the dog alone. what? leave it! i remember to stroke it gently. oh! -er er er -you yuk! -i went to that at jasons' i think i'll go and find that erm +er er er +you yuk! +i went to that at jasons' i think i'll go and find that erm aah! -i just don't know what was wrong with it, i've work, jason said ja we a subject turned to what he wore in bed ja and jason said nothing, right but he said when it's winter i wear my t-shirt and the pants and i cuddle up to my glow worm and we was all taking the mickey out of his glow worm, right so i've come home and i read the paper and i'll see glow worm in it, so i cut it out and give it to him and he stuck it up in the factory ! -so every time everybody goes past and goes how's your glow worm boy today and takes the mickey out of him! +i just don't know what was wrong with it, i've work, jason said ja we a subject turned to what he wore in bed ja and jason said nothing, right but he said when it's winter i wear my t-shirt and the pants and i cuddle up to my glow worm and we was all taking the mickey out of his glow worm, right so i've come home and i read the paper and i'll see glow worm in it, so i cut it out and give it to him and he stuck it up in the factory ! +so every time everybody goes past and goes how's your glow worm boy today and takes the mickey out of him! mm. -i said, and roy was being rude though cos i said to roy, i said, haven't you got a glow worm, he said no mine's got eyes on the end of it! +i said, and roy was being rude though cos i said to roy, i said, haven't you got a glow worm, he said no mine's got eyes on the end of it! mine don't light up,it's got eyes on the end of it ! what did our jason say? -stroke him nicely, her nicely whatever it is. +stroke him nicely, her nicely whatever it is. no that's a nose. coco the clown. mummy, mummy! what have you called it coco for? woooh! -cos it's -you dog you no not no +cos it's +you dog you no not no what you doing? -no if anybody go to sleep +no if anybody go to sleep yeah -i mean before , so i said yeah i said er -dad dad, hurry ! -hold i've gotta my words on you go go on couldn't tell anything else about it, i said yeah it had an orange on and he said, you got the lea oh course -dad dad +i mean before , so i said yeah i said er +dad dad, hurry ! +hold i've gotta my words on you go go on couldn't tell anything else about it, i said yeah it had an orange on and he said, you got the lea oh course +dad dad should be erm no. he said you want drinky? mhm. tell mummy -apparently he's still got a lead +apparently he's still got a lead tell mummy. i said yeah but i mean look! @@ -64942,17 +64888,17 @@ i want a drink. hang on a minute, you can have some of mine. mummy. aye? -i said yeah the collar on -i said the collar and the lead, match so he bought the collar out of his pocket and goes +i said yeah the collar on +i said the collar and the lead, match so he bought the collar out of his pocket and goes mama -he said por i said yeah then i said +he said por i said yeah then i said mummy. can i have a look at the lead? he said oh you can't have the lead mummy . -they match, and he said well he said you can pick it up +they match, and he said well he said you can pick it up and that's all ! -me me me me. +me me me me. ah! ah ah ah. your feet that time and get on with it. aah ! @@ -64962,12 +64908,12 @@ yeah alright. just leave him, be. bloody , can't afford no chips,go and get us some. ah ah ah ah. -well you can't get some, when it's late hey? +well you can't get some, when it's late hey? oh! ask him? will you pop and get some chips if i get you some money? get yourself some, if you want. -ah ah +ah ah aye? yeah. will you? @@ -64981,30 +64927,30 @@ only have for signing he had one, two, three shut up ! -no, one want one? +no, one want one? shut up! shut up! -several portions, gave us all all the scraps and salt and vinegar. -if i can go to and get two pounds of -no better get them several portions. -ooh i will pay i wi +several portions, gave us all all the scraps and salt and vinegar. +if i can go to and get two pounds of +no better get them several portions. +ooh i will pay i wi get salt, the scraps and salt vinegar we'll eat. got a pen then? no i kept on meaning to get one though. oh wah! -oh down our chemist. +oh down our chemist. go in the chemist, they'll have a pen inside twenty prescription. -what happens boys out over there. -no i don't have to cos i always fill mine in when i'm in there. +what happens boys out over there. +no i don't have to cos i always fill mine in when i'm in there. i know you don't have to, you told me. -that that. +that that. matter. aha that! where's my other leg? ee. -nana you ! +nana you ! mummy got some, look. let's see. ee that! @@ -65016,7 +64962,7 @@ ah! er er er er i'm going out that one? -tomorrow night then have that bit, go on then. +tomorrow night then have that bit, go on then. hold it properly. is it there? hold it properly. @@ -65024,39 +64970,39 @@ don't be too long cos i've gotta go home. that's nanny pu is it? -gotta put this in, ain't i so i'll say can i come ba i +gotta put this in, ain't i so i'll say can i come ba i oh ricky! i'm gonna say can i come back over for it. mm. -get a table -yub yub yub yub yub good girl. -mind don't spill the tea shouldn't make it so bloody -that pale. +get a table +yub yub yub yub yub good girl. +mind don't spill the tea shouldn't make it so bloody +that pale. that why don't you come? come on dad. no. come on. -where's your letters anyway, you should be looking at +where's your letters anyway, you should be looking at twelve. -not nine pound got fourteen pound and a a bit eight pounds tax, and five pound in national insurance, so i bought home eighty four pound shut the door! +not nine pound got fourteen pound and a a bit eight pounds tax, and five pound in national insurance, so i bought home eighty four pound shut the door! where is the letters, anyway? -in here i'll look for them when you're out. +in here i'll look for them when you're out. where's the dog? -don't slam the door see you +don't slam the door see you that's not bank. -aye get in! +aye get in! bank's usually got a window envelope innit? dog! he's so . oh no! -that one's a bit burnt cos bernie left it on top of the cooker where's the dog ? -out here go on, get in! +that one's a bit burnt cos bernie left it on top of the cooker where's the dog ? +out here go on, get in! come on let's just, you know, open the door. -i cou couldn't see touch my leg get here ! +i cou couldn't see touch my leg get here ! just don't kick it! -might kick , don't kick mine leave it +might kick , don't kick mine leave it come on. smells burning. what is it? @@ -65066,39 +65012,39 @@ warm, warm. yeah, drink it up then. now cool it is. drink it up now. -yes +yes my shoulder really aches. -look in there! -ha where? +look in there! +ha where? no touch! -hey oh. +hey oh. oh dear! oh oh. -then they're be moving we'll be nearer then. +then they're be moving we'll be nearer then. hee ah hee come down occasionally can't you? how many tapes you got there? -twenty got to fill the bloody tapes in a week, if i could. +twenty got to fill the bloody tapes in a week, if i could. yeah. don't you wear it a does, do they know you wear it at work? can't wear at work. no, in the canteen. i ain't done it yet. oh. -still gotta out. -oh and how you +still gotta out. +oh and how you pocket yeah. -and clip the thing on there and they'll think it's a bloody radio or something! +and clip the thing on there and they'll think it's a bloody radio or something! yeah you wanna get some headphones for that as well, then that makes all i've got some headphones. yeah well they're not made to work are they they're at work -cos they +cos they no i can't afford this. -no you don't plug them in, just put the wire in your pocket then they'll think they can just listen to music. -well then they won't talk to me they won't take any notice anyway, if they do, i've got a letter i can tell them what i'm doing. -go on expla a letter will make a +no you don't plug them in, just put the wire in your pocket then they'll think they can just listen to music. +well then they won't talk to me they won't take any notice anyway, if they do, i've got a letter i can tell them what i'm doing. +go on expla a letter will make a well drink up! people if they say what the hell are you doing. you what? @@ -65108,47 +65054,47 @@ she's stirred him up. properly! if people say to you i'm drinking it properly -what the hell are you doing, you give them that and if they say they don't wish to be on the tape you have to erase their voice. +what the hell are you doing, you give them that and if they say they don't wish to be on the tape you have to erase their voice. oh. na -some people might not object although it's anonymous +some people might not object although it's anonymous me. no one knows whose voice it is but it's nanny -me go me go. -i've got about ten of them to give people if they ask we what are you doing. +me go me go. +i've got about ten of them to give people if they ask we what are you doing. look a ack is it? -yeah, can't you tell they're from bloody dictionary,all the wording on the letter. +yeah, can't you tell they're from bloody dictionary,all the wording on the letter. ack and i got i get twenty five quid for doing it. mum. mm. mum? what? -well i get twenty five quid's worth of vouchers from marks and spencers i shall buy stuart a shirt, i'll give it for something for christmas, won't it? -see that erm yet together they will provide the permanent record of how the english language is spoken in the +well i get twenty five quid's worth of vouchers from marks and spencers i shall buy stuart a shirt, i'll give it for something for christmas, won't it? +see that erm yet together they will provide the permanent record of how the english language is spoken in the ouch! nineteen nineties. yeah. mm. -thought to start, it'd be a bit of fun no harm is it +thought to start, it'd be a bit of fun no harm is it aah! -you ! +you ! i'll bite rick and more ricky, don't bite back! rick. and my turn. well leave it then! are you weed yourself? -mm well +mm well leave it! it's no wonder it bites you ricky. it's alright. -yeah ricky yeah bit. +yeah ricky yeah bit. helen,he'll hurt it. -he we go girl ooh which one up here now sit still! +he we go girl ooh which one up here now sit still! keep still. -me ear. +me ear. anna ! i don't want it, put it up there. father. @@ -65158,19 +65104,19 @@ say nan. yes, da da da likes him. -look +look full of moans and groans as usual. nan? -look nana. +look nana. ha? that dog's trying to lick that probably wants a drink. ma ma . wants some food, i know that. well give it some blooming food then! -all it eat right, is since the stuff's been back last sunday, he's had what we eat, what our scraps left over from dinner. +all it eat right, is since the stuff's been back last sunday, he's had what we eat, what our scraps left over from dinner. cor . -he don't eat +he don't eat ah going ah, ah @@ -65185,7 +65131,7 @@ mine! na na na na. mine! mine! -it ain't a bad night look we got thirty eight pence on label and it was twenty nine. +it ain't a bad night look we got thirty eight pence on label and it was twenty nine. mm. twenty nine pence. na na na na na na @@ -65198,99 +65144,99 @@ yeah. will dad be in that? no. that -no touch are you a good boy. +no touch are you a good boy. yeah. are you? -where's dinner? -i dunno if you're supposed to put water in this dinners or what? -no it's best leave it dry in a separate +where's dinner? +i dunno if you're supposed to put water in this dinners or what? +no it's best leave it dry in a separate what and put it in a ? -yep it's separate separate water. -i dunno -here are , dinner. -bit of mutton i you ought to call it mutton. +yep it's separate separate water. +i dunno +here are , dinner. +bit of mutton i you ought to call it mutton. how? -come here away from it, so it can have its dinner come on. +come here away from it, so it can have its dinner come on. oh no. come on, leave it alone. no look. -it's got a whole tin in that dish that'll fill it up won't it? +it's got a whole tin in that dish that'll fill it up won't it? never mind. -oh see him. +oh see him. well i know, but he didn't have top dog meat since he's been here. not since he's been back for a week. say that whole tin will do it, won't it? -today i tried to get a whole tin every day, it's just because it happened. +today i tried to get a whole tin every day, it's just because it happened. say that. leave her alone, come on! you have been feeding it though? -course i have, been giving it a what we've had, like when the kids didn't eat their dinner or we ain't eat all our dinner been giving it what's left on the plate, well +course i have, been giving it a what we've had, like when the kids didn't eat their dinner or we ain't eat all our dinner been giving it what's left on the plate, well and he's had chops and mash and all that lot. bananas. -had a bit of everything chips we'll put it all in one dish an it'll eat it all. +had a bit of everything chips we'll put it all in one dish an it'll eat it all. shouldn't pe leave her to lick the plates though. -no, no i scrape them from the plates into its own dish greg come here let's have you having dinner come on. -me me me eat it. +no, no i scrape them from the plates into its own dish greg come here let's have you having dinner come on. +me me me eat it. yeah uncle jonathan's gonna get you some. me me eat. that was . -me me me me mu +me me me me mu ricky come in here please darling. see jonathan's gonna get you some -jonathan's gotta get you some leave him +jonathan's gotta get you some leave him alone. me mu -or out ricky it will! +or out ricky it will! look at that! -that will bite it back at you, if you just go near it, when it's having dinner and i don't like +that will bite it back at you, if you just go near it, when it's having dinner and i don't like woof woof for john arghh! -come and sit down anna uncle jonathan's getting you some now come on, come and sit down. +come and sit down anna uncle jonathan's getting you some now come on, come and sit down. eat. -michael was it got ever so big. +michael was it got ever so big. yeah. well we gotta buy it -for one three quid +for one three quid ahh! ahh! well they all go in the pet shop, all but one. yeah? i got to go. funny looking thing. -no it's just that erm, mandy and jeff tried it when she wasn't on them her little 'un out the way please ricky can i have a look? +no it's just that erm, mandy and jeff tried it when she wasn't on them her little 'un out the way please ricky can i have a look? oh yeah. what it is. ow ow ow out! -out dog. -daren't lo stick my fingers in too much, he might bite me, cos he got teeth now well they're all in there scrambled up together oh there's bernie and jeff. +out dog. +daren't lo stick my fingers in too much, he might bite me, cos he got teeth now well they're all in there scrambled up together oh there's bernie and jeff. hi. hello -erm +erm granny. -yeah i don't +yeah i don't dad? dad? dad? yeah i know. -look you can read the questions. +look you can read the questions. hello, hello, hello. oh. no that was try bill? hey daddy ! -hi ya dad. +hi ya dad. i said there might be a connection. -daddy, daddy daddy? +daddy, daddy daddy? do you wanna take your coat off. what? daddy. -look puppy. +look puppy. yuk! yeah. is that your cortina? -ah dada +ah dada it's a renault. i hear you want one ? help. @@ -65303,8 +65249,8 @@ got a case for it mum? no cos the dog'll bite you, cos it's having its dinner, you're not. -cos it's having its dinner if you got a case you -me me me me biscuit me +cos it's having its dinner if you got a case you +me me me me biscuit me it only wants to go for a little 'un now and i'll say, right that dog'll be out the door. mum? definitely. @@ -65314,7 +65260,7 @@ ricky! tell him. stop it now. cos he's eating. -he's eating ricky. +he's eating ricky. we haven't seen him how? don't kick it ! @@ -65332,9 +65278,9 @@ alright her tapes are finally in. have you finished with your crap, yeah? that stuff down there. -cos it's in that +cos it's in that what's that? -box all mine. +box all mine. what is it? identity card. oh. @@ -65353,14 +65299,14 @@ bern! hey ! bern? what? -look +look where i gotta look? didn't you bring any helen? -what, i can't see them thirty three i have you leave them milk tubs there cos i've had enough of them no leave it. +what, i can't see them thirty three i have you leave them milk tubs there cos i've had enough of them no leave it. what have you done? -cleared out the fridge leave them we've got many of them to go. +cleared out the fridge leave them we've got many of them to go. i know, i see him the other day. -no i asked her to start but that's all, and i kept that in the meant to be setting up a place in the posh area but they gotta have +no i asked her to start but that's all, and i kept that in the meant to be setting up a place in the posh area but they gotta have doesn't work, though. didn't he mend it? cos you're not supposed to stick the knife in, are you? @@ -65368,11 +65314,11 @@ no. no. i do that, i've done that before. nan did that and buggered hers up. -i know that'll take a long time to do it though won't it? -you get some boiling water in a bowl and stand in th heat of the boiling water will melt it what i used to do. +i know that'll take a long time to do it though won't it? +you get some boiling water in a bowl and stand in th heat of the boiling water will melt it what i used to do. not so quick is it? -yeah get a little bowl and stand it in. -get somewhere. +yeah get a little bowl and stand it in. +get somewhere. hel? i might have to do that wet, hey? helen? @@ -65382,49 +65328,49 @@ moving? next weekend. what, next thursday? next saturday. -what afternoon? +what afternoon? i don't know. because i'm gonna have to still have the saturday for my shopping, aren't i? got work tomorrow. -do it friday night go friday night. -no what was i saying, oh yeah, when the machines at work break we got the fitter there cos you've always got a fitter about, ain't you, when they go wrong? +do it friday night go friday night. +no what was i saying, oh yeah, when the machines at work break we got the fitter there cos you've always got a fitter about, ain't you, when they go wrong? and they're always going wrong. what? -well anyway this woman the machine got water on the switch and every time you turn the switch on +well anyway this woman the machine got water on the switch and every time you turn the switch on mummy let me have my blanket. it bleeps hello. -so the boy went to pam and got a +so the boy went to pam and got a hello. -hairdryer to dry it out right and he's drying this switch out with the hairdryer and all and everything turned the switch on and about five hundred volts were on shock so they had to call +hairdryer to dry it out right and he's drying this switch out with the hairdryer and all and everything turned the switch on and about five hundred volts were on shock so they had to call might get one in you. they had to call a special engineer is that what happened out. -yeah well he reckoned +yeah well he reckoned they had to call a special engineer what a wha what are they? out. who are they? yeah you must, did you, did they put salt and vinegar on them. no. -have to a have a slice of bread or something, won't you? +have to a have a slice of bread or something, won't you? ah ah ah! here's yours. hundred milligrams. what is it? hundred milligrams. -let's have a look at the packet. -all readers hang on a minute careto profaine good stuff. +let's have a look at the packet. +all readers hang on a minute careto profaine good stuff. i alright . read all of this stuff -at that at that. -wonder why i gotta double it? +at that at that. +wonder why i gotta double it? at that. -don't know i sink the , +don't know i sink the , i went and turned the bottom as well got i -it's a blooming extra one you're supposed to have twenty eight thirty. +it's a blooming extra one you're supposed to have twenty eight thirty. a third. what's that? tablets. @@ -65435,85 +65381,85 @@ for my poorly leg. what's that? ta. oh no! -put i'm in full time education tick it pay for it she said er what you on then? +put i'm in full time education tick it pay for it she said er what you on then? dada. -i said i'm on a yts, she went oh she said i don't know if you're for them, i said er well if you don't i'll find out and then tell you at the she goes, yeah, we'll do that she says but i do , i don't know if owe have to pay for them or not, you know she said i think you're supposed to have a form. +i said i'm on a yts, she went oh she said i don't know if you're for them, i said er well if you don't i'll find out and then tell you at the she goes, yeah, we'll do that she says but i do , i don't know if owe have to pay for them or not, you know she said i think you're supposed to have a form. yeah. salt. come on you two. big bern. -mine's alright you heard bernie little thingamy cup with the -there's the salt in the cupboard ooh you got the vinegar. -ricky ricky ricky me me, me me me me. -blow it, it's hot pull it down so she can reach. +mine's alright you heard bernie little thingamy cup with the +there's the salt in the cupboard ooh you got the vinegar. +ricky ricky ricky me me, me me me me. +blow it, it's hot pull it down so she can reach. ha ha. -eat it oy! +eat it oy! what? eat it. ah bernie. -oh thought the dog eat it, cos they won't eat their chips. -thursday the twelfth of december at eleven am. +oh thought the dog eat it, cos they won't eat their chips. +thursday the twelfth of december at eleven am. no my chips! what is it? -you are the lord thought you said there were that one it doesn't say +you are the lord thought you said there were that one it doesn't say no, mine! me do it. -no because they cou first, that's been here about three weeks and the little one's only been here two weeks. -oh initial training will be on the twelfth of december. +no because they cou first, that's been here about three weeks and the little one's only been here two weeks. +oh initial training will be on the twelfth of december. finished. best day to have it on. -we shut down first friday something -what is this? -i don't know got my christmas party, that day at work. -well they can see you. -no a i've gotta go, i've gotta get on the training cos +we shut down first friday something +what is this? +i don't know got my christmas party, that day at work. +well they can see you. +no a i've gotta go, i've gotta get on the training cos ay! -at atch, atch. +at atch, atch. hot, mm. -hard work got a christmas due about that as well. +hard work got a christmas due about that as well. good. ow! ow! owwww! ow! what? -don't +don't no! -got exactly the same haven't you,? +got exactly the same haven't you,? put it in last year. ! -oh well +oh well no! wanna drink. no. ? first training centre. -i'd say it's not tech was, yes. +i'd say it's not tech was, yes. no. -cos that's a girl a college +cos that's a girl a college don't they have a day release thing? yeah. yeah. well is that hill street training centre? -i'm just saying there was mine was tech, i expect the college at the old college. -yeah, cos you been the college up there didn't you? -yeah that's the only bit i hated i'd rather have been at work all week and i didn't +i'm just saying there was mine was tech, i expect the college at the old college. +yeah, cos you been the college up there didn't you? +yeah that's the only bit i hated i'd rather have been at work all week and i didn't i think you i didn't used to like going to college once a week. -in the chip shop we bought some fish out the fryer and put in the top and straight away got them bloody tongs picked it up and poured the bloody grease off it and put it in the bloody bag thought it was terrible. -well it was if it's only just come through from the fryer +in the chip shop we bought some fish out the fryer and put in the top and straight away got them bloody tongs picked it up and poured the bloody grease off it and put it in the bloody bag thought it was terrible. +well it was if it's only just come through from the fryer yeah i know but they had literally poured it off. ta take me out. there dog. he's eaten hers off the floor. yeah. -i'm a good girl cat. -no don't poke in the head cos granddad's can't work. +i'm a good girl cat. +no don't poke in the head cos granddad's can't work. mm. -got a packet for when we get home so i that's got to make my . -i i ooh ah oh ah! +got a packet for when we get home so i that's got to make my . +i i ooh ah oh ah! ah! ah! ooh mind jonathan's knee darling, it's poorly. @@ -65536,13 +65482,13 @@ much more of that without anything at else. ay! -no don't play trampolines sit down please now ! +no don't play trampolines sit down please now ! she's gotten them all round here sit! look. hello. dad. -look at her look salty . +look at her look salty . yeah. were not having them. i mum chi chi chip @@ -65550,67 +65496,67 @@ no! are you gonna sit down with ricky and eat them? yeah. hey? -me me me. +me me me. are you going to sit down? me. -sit down then sit down then. -sit down ricky. -me i i -sit down over there with ricky and i'll bring them to you. +sit down then sit down then. +sit down ricky. +me i i +sit down over there with ricky and i'll bring them to you. tripping over her shoe laces. sit down then. sit down then. you jammy little pest. here are. -look at her all sweet and innocent, and when i turn away she'll nick a chip i can see you sit down! +look at her all sweet and innocent, and when i turn away she'll nick a chip i can see you sit down! sit down! there. oh chip! here are. chip! do you want a smack bum? -that's what you get if you got a throw a paddy now ain't gonna eat them? +that's what you get if you got a throw a paddy now ain't gonna eat them? back nana. yes. back nana. she's alright sitting there. mm. -dad yeah, right +dad yeah, right what? in there? dad. -nanny soon have to go where do i go? +nanny soon have to go where do i go? . where am i going? who am i going to see? -dunno +dunno pardon? stuart. stuart? yeah. -we'll pay twelve ninety four wouldn't you ? +we'll pay twelve ninety four wouldn't you ? no. well what colour they made your leg stop hurting. and then -ha . -i hope to say if used to work. +ha . +i hope to say if used to work. ooh yeah. ha ha ha. what col ol our? -i wouldn't live with your father if he took drugs, i'll tell you be dead. +i wouldn't live with your father if he took drugs, i'll tell you be dead. they don't taste of nothing if they're capsules. they do. -perhaps cos there's usually sort of like a thin plastic +perhaps cos there's usually sort of like a thin plastic do you wanna taste one? ar'nt they? what? mum? you wanna taste one? -usually sort of like a thin plastic over +usually sort of like a thin plastic over wanna taste one? over the powder innit? do you wanna taste one? -no they're dissolvable plastic innit? +no they're dissolvable plastic innit? what is that? usually got no taste. all that matters is your leg gets better dear. @@ -65624,10 +65570,10 @@ what was that? oh that lad next door. oy ! now where was that? -under the table you'll find a chip . +under the table you'll find a chip . the one lives next door to me. -definitely crossword time, i've gotta have a go at it but there's not a lot left in there nothing in the teapot -no it's +definitely crossword time, i've gotta have a go at it but there's not a lot left in there nothing in the teapot +no it's sorry, do you want another one? do you want me to go and make you another one? no that's alright, i'll do it. @@ -65638,14 +65584,14 @@ oh you have. alright? yeah. yeah, alright, yes. -yes mum chuck us the paper mother. +yes mum chuck us the paper mother. aye? see how well we do this week. are you warm enough? yeah, it's not cold, are you cold? no i'm alright. page. -okay okay one, two, three that's it. +okay okay one, two, three that's it. really. right, are you ready girls? yeah. @@ -65655,25 +65601,25 @@ girls, we're called girls now, that sounds ha, ha, ha, ha. good. fish of a carp family, five letters . -oh god . +oh god . yeah let's not bother perch. doing it, cos that wo , let's not bother doing the questions. -could be a perch it's quite safe. +could be a perch it's quite safe. yes. -i don't think so er ha +i don't think so er ha a mulch? but i don't know any others. carp. -no, i want one of the carp family never mind,a riddle in a cracker, five letters . -mot oh motto. +no, i want one of the carp family never mind,a riddle in a cracker, five letters . +mot oh motto. yes. motto. easy. yeah. should do it in pencil. ancient name for the spanish peninsula, six letters -erm now that's one for you. +erm now that's one for you. what is it? iberia. mhm. @@ -65693,12 +65639,12 @@ why not, european market again? i don't think it's anything to do with that, but i know there's a you can't have a capon any more. oh you can't an all. tree or shrub with white or yellow flowers, six letter . -could be loads, couldn't it. -yeah here's one -it's white or yellow forsythia, they've got white yellow but +could be loads, couldn't it. +yeah here's one +it's white or yellow forsythia, they've got white yellow but they've got yellow on same white as . no? -no religion revealed through mohammed . +no religion revealed through mohammed . islam innit? the russian wolf hound, six letters . erm. @@ -65711,19 +65657,19 @@ try mark, luke or john. ruth. better leave that one. mark, luke or john innit? -matthew, mark oh eh, sorry the gospel it might be . -we'll have to wait until we get +matthew, mark oh eh, sorry the gospel it might be . +we'll have to wait until we get or they are -it's only matthew that it's not . -matthew, mark, luke and john yeah all those i got. +it's only matthew that it's not . +matthew, mark, luke and john yeah all those i got. meeting for spiritualistic phenomena . -a seance that's what +a seance that's what spell that. shirley wanted us to go to. who did? -that's what shirley said, are you coming to church so she go she goes to a spiritualist. +that's what shirley said, are you coming to church so she go she goes to a spiritualist. oh does she? -i said no staying at, mum, she said well bring mum i said i don't think her a her her scene. +i said no staying at, mum, she said well bring mum i said i don't think her a her her scene. ha. wouldn't of minded. wouldn't you? @@ -65731,18 +65677,18 @@ oh i'll take you some time then, i love it. yeah i wouldn't mind it ann. i love it, i do. you been before? -that's oh yes lots hundreds i always go +that's oh yes lots hundreds i always go well there you are, why didn't you say? well i didn't think you might not be interested. ann yo yo i'm not yo a have you been before? -no, but i've told you +no, but i've told you you'd like to -thing got a book in here about it. +thing got a book in here about it. shirley's really into it, i used to be. is she? -i used to be, but i haven't been for a long while i used to we can't say that i was there last year but -alright then, can i go there is +i used to be, but i haven't been for a long while i used to we can't say that i was there last year but +alright then, can i go there is well any sundays. it's a isn't it behind angles @@ -65753,15 +65699,15 @@ it's every sunday, shirley goes ev they've gone now. she doesn't, does she? does she go? -mm sometimes in the week she goes as well. +mm sometimes in the week she goes as well. does she really? look sorry, we're talking again. sorry dear -ooh . -alright we'll go then not next week cos she er sheila will be here. -aye alright alright. +ooh . +alright we'll go then not next week cos she er sheila will be here. +aye alright alright. next one dear, sorry . -one who manages another's business +one who manages another's business we can take it up one who manages another's business nosey parker! @@ -65773,9 +65719,9 @@ lyrics. birthplace of saint theresa, five letters . who knows. yep. -theresa, india she's the she's the indian isn't she the -no birthplace of not mother theresa, saint theresa. -oh sorry sorry. +theresa, india she's the she's the indian isn't she the +no birthplace of not mother theresa, saint theresa. +oh sorry sorry. italian city famous for its holy shroud, five letters . turin. turin. @@ -65788,7 +65734,7 @@ yeah. aye? i think you're probably right. yeah probably is. -there you are you are i'm not much good at these +there you are you are i'm not much good at these device for drawing premium bonds winners ah i dunno. bird, a female of the ruff, five letters . @@ -65797,15 +65743,15 @@ female of the what? the what? the ruff. what is a -a ruff a bird -yeah but you wrote it in, so you must know the answer, i saw you write it in what's the answer? +a ruff a bird +yeah but you wrote it in, so you must know the answer, i saw you write it in what's the answer? a reeve. oh. yeah. thank you, at least as if he knows. aha. a shakespeare comedy, three, seven, four -three, seven, four seven twelfth night the twelfth night? +three, seven, four seven twelfth night the twelfth night? no. what is it then? not a lot i can i do with this much, the winter's tale. @@ -65813,41 +65759,41 @@ the winter's tale. kind of orange, five letters . seville. five letters. -that's six er what then? +that's six er what then? navel. navel. king of tire who assisted solomon in the building of the temple, five letters . charlie. -dunno david +dunno david charlie bloggs. -blank i r, blank +blank i r, blank paddy. blank i r -blank m know this one tira ? +blank m know this one tira ? hieroglyphics. tima tiram. tiram. don't know. -tiram one of the divisions of a flower calyx, five letters . +tiram one of the divisions of a flower calyx, five letters . petal. what is a flower calyx? probably a petal. oh. -portuguese enclave in china, five letters m a c +portuguese enclave in china, five letters m a c oh god! blank -blank macau semi precious stone, five letters t blank p blank, blank. +blank macau semi precious stone, five letters t blank p blank, blank. topaz topez =az. vincenti biasco writer of the four horseman of the apocalypse etcetera no idea. -we've got six letters comedy by oscar wilde one, five, two, two, ten . +we've got six letters comedy by oscar wilde one, five, two, two, ten . a yeah, a a something something, something something -erm of the no something. +erm of the no something. and something of something. something of of of erm something. ? @@ -65861,17 +65807,17 @@ sailor, not an officer, six letters . mutloe scrooge's late partner whose ghost appears in a christmas marley. -carol six letters . +carol six letters . marley's ghost. native of the largest of the continents, five letters . asia. -county in eire five letters c l blank r e clare. -the american buffalo, five letters blank i blank o blank bison? +county in eire five letters c l blank r e clare. +the american buffalo, five letters blank i blank o blank bison? bison. mhm. -lady nancy the first +lady nancy the first astor -woman mp to take . +woman mp to take . astor blank s t o r. well i know it without you telling me the blanks! @@ -65880,23 +65826,23 @@ nest of a bird of prey , five letters. bu not bad, not bad, not bad at all. at first go through them. not bad at all. -go on then try and s +go on then try and s of the carp family, five letters , t blank n blank h. tench. -must be a the gospel is blank blank r blank, so it must be mark. +must be a the gospel is blank blank r blank, so it must be mark. mark. -now what we got here one who manages another's business a g e blank blank. +now what we got here one who manages another's business a g e blank blank. agent. agent. -the russian wolf hound is the blank u r z blank blank. +the russian wolf hound is the blank u r z blank blank. oh yeah, it's a funny name. bu something, burzoi? yeah something like that. -cos that macau bit, sometimes they spell macau with an o r or u could be macau with an could be burzoi. +cos that macau bit, sometimes they spell macau with an o r or u could be macau with an could be burzoi. yeah something like that, funny name. -could be burzoi not sure. +could be burzoi not sure. you got a headache again? -i knew you had we ain't going out tonight, we're stopping here well i am +i knew you had we ain't going out tonight, we're stopping here well i am we are. i'm not! what? @@ -65908,14 +65854,14 @@ well i'm stopping the night no you're not. unless you're gonna chuck me out. i'm alright, -no you're not you got bad head again, you're +no you're not you got bad head again, you're well alright, not that bad. -couple of couple of tablets. +couple of couple of tablets. i'm alright, tell her i'm alright. yeah for goodness sake! -i'm alright ann really i am, don't be silly. +i'm alright ann really i am, don't be silly. couple of tablets. -tree or shrub with white of yellow flowers begins in a and ends in a, six letters. +tree or shrub with white of yellow flowers begins in a and ends in a, six letters. ah? begins in a and ends with a. yeah. @@ -65926,42 +65872,42 @@ and ends with a? yeah. i don't know,, i better get my gardening book out. -gardening catalogue ready, yes i got one there they keep sending me them i never astor no +gardening catalogue ready, yes i got one there they keep sending me them i never astor no what about acacia? oh yeah acacia. -acacia mm clever dick. -no looks as though it's well no it could be seeple +acacia mm clever dick. +no looks as though it's well no it could be seeple what? oh. flower i don't know what a calyx is, i just thought petal fitted in, i mean i don't know. -mm could be seeple +mm could be seeple what's a calyx then? -well calyx is in in the flower, in the +well calyx is in in the flower, in the oh well if it's seeple then it won't be the petal will it? because isn't in there. -six letters so, all you need is one two, three, four birthplace of erm saint theresa is a blank i blank a. +six letters so, all you need is one two, three, four birthplace of erm saint theresa is a blank i blank a. mm sshh sshh better look that up. i know. in asia. -erm comedy by oscar wilde is th loo i think it's woman a woman of no +erm comedy by oscar wilde is th loo i think it's woman a woman of no importance. importance. a woman of no importance. is that what it is? i think so. yeah. -not sure burzoi is it? +not sure burzoi is it? borz -yeah it is but i couldn't tell you ho +yeah it is but i couldn't tell you ho how to spell it, but it is some funny name like that. vincenti blasgo sh writer of the four horseman of the apocalypse is i b blank n blank blank. oh, no idea. i b? mm. it wouldn't be addition, would it? -no be in a +no be in a it's the burzoi be in a in a way your book things. @@ -65969,32 +65915,32 @@ be in a dic er encyclopedia, won't it. yeah. shall i go look it up? mm. -if you like in with budgies. +if you like in with budgies. yeah. -well pu put the cover over them stuart. +well pu put the cover over them stuart. put the cover on them. -or shut the gate cos if not they'll come out you'll find. +or shut the gate cos if not they'll come out you'll find. can't fly in the dark. yeah but he's gonna ? put the light on. -yeah, they'll come out of it they think it's daylight again. +yeah, they'll come out of it they think it's daylight again. when you put the light on then they come out and then i'm in trouble, i can't get them back in yeah i know. again. no cos it's dark and they won't fly. yeah then yo yo you strip the light off, i've had all that. -yeah they won't fly when it's dark, they just stay where -if you come out and then you put the light off yo yo they've got to su the way you put them in the cage. +yeah they won't fly when it's dark, they just stay where +if you come out and then you put the light off yo yo they've got to su the way you put them in the cage. they can't fly at night. yeah, don't worry about me ann, i'm alright. you're not right, you're not like you should be. well i know no a i can't see that that friday is now sunday night. -oh yeah but it's not too bad i'm alright i really am i feel a hell of a lot better. -maybe, you still got a headache, and you're still not right you wouldn't of +oh yeah but it's not too bad i'm alright i really am i feel a hell of a lot better. +maybe, you still got a headache, and you're still not right you wouldn't of i'm alright. -gone to sleep if you were alright no never mind and you're going the doctor's we'll make appointment tomorrow cos you won't and if i make one you'll have to blooming go and do it . +gone to sleep if you were alright no never mind and you're going the doctor's we'll make appointment tomorrow cos you won't and if i make one you'll have to blooming go and do it . oh. i think i'm a i'm a i am i feel a lot better. i can't see that that could of been friday's episode that's still effecting you today. @@ -66008,34 +65954,34 @@ yeah look at that one !maybe we've miscalculated. that might be later might'n it? might be earlier ! there's a sixty one. -what staff have left and +what staff have left and they must be the ones in the white blouses then. -yeah mm mm. +yeah mm mm. it's funny isn't it, you don't imagine people with hair like that! it's fifty four. -she was a bit of a tart, weren't she? +she was a bit of a tart, weren't she? yeah. and this is only there's the bandstand, miss . oh yeah, while she was a teacher then,i say ! i say! -green oh mrs . +green oh mrs . oh she might be in an eighty one. -eighty one as a pupil? -mm in the sixth form. +eighty one as a pupil? +mm in the sixth form. eighty one? or in eighty. no way! no way ! -oh yeah well maybe a bit before that these are the eighties. -where was do you reckon miss then? +oh yeah well maybe a bit before that these are the eighties. +where was do you reckon miss then? mm? -do you reckon polio then? +do you reckon polio then? probably. i thought she knew, she had when she was a child. did she? i don't know then. -mm mm miss ! +mm mm miss ! no it must have been before nineteen eighty. i reckon it was seventy five to seventy nine. i reckon seventy one then. @@ -66047,25 +65993,25 @@ they're very early aren't they? twe twenty seven. fifty seven. sorry? -fifty seven, if she was born in forty seven, she'd be forty seven she'd be forty forty four now +fifty seven, if she was born in forty seven, she'd be forty seven she'd be forty forty four now yeah. and if she was -about sixty something. -no cos she'd have been twenty then wouldn't she almost -no no not in sixty +about sixty something. +no cos she'd have been twenty then wouldn't she almost +no no not in sixty no. one. -oh yeah sixty one. +oh yeah sixty one. there was sixty one. how old would she have been in sixty one? -forty forty two, forty one, twenty nine three seventeen six +forty forty two, forty one, twenty nine three seventeen six me, i was fine thank you! what have you it's a bit. don't look like it . should i not ask? if you want . -right +right here we are. mm. mm. @@ -66073,11 +66019,11 @@ we've finished the last, we've finished the last one. . yeah. was it nice?. -mm, ok those peculiar people. +mm, ok those peculiar people. who is? those wondering round in a daze and being peculiar. oh, sorry -who was that too. +who was that too. i'm sorry. . that's . @@ -66091,13 +66037,13 @@ what you talking about? . . solved the problem, don't worry. -you get if you use the toilet roll? +you get if you use the toilet roll? sorry? . why do you want it to glow, it'll show more if it glowed. it's fashionable. it is fashionable . -well you . +well you . mm, no. well . it's french next. @@ -66116,7 +66062,7 @@ no. you come back in here or not? yeah. yeah. -well now,. +well now,. yeah. yeah.. er, what is it? @@ -66126,7 +66072,7 @@ it's at erm, wembley isn't it? i can't remember . who's go is it? what you go . -er . +er . i need that one as well. mm. i need that one as well. @@ -66151,10 +66097,10 @@ no,. it wasn't yesterday, it was ages ago. was it? mm. -i . +i . . no, it wasn't this week. -i have to give you a . +i have to give you a . you sure?. . . @@ -66171,7 +66117,6 @@ don't need that. how'd you know, it's your go isn't it? your go. it's my go, oh. - good evening. this is another in our series on britain in europe. tonight, and during the next two tuesday programmes, we are going to look at cultural links and influences. @@ -66196,7 +66141,7 @@ the british in their quiet way think of themselves as the salt of the earth, and in turner's time art was very international. rome was, i suppose, the capital of the art world, but rome was essentially an international place where many a britisher was famous; where flaxman, for instance, had established himself as one of the most famous artists in the world. we hardly mention him nowadays. -turner did the grand tour, certainly; he learnt a lot in italy, but he learnt equally a great deal from english artists and from dutch artists and in so far as he used the grand tour, and used what rome and other countries had to offer, that's what every artist did, every european artist, not just the english. +turner did the grand tour, certainly; he learnt a lot in italy, but he learnt equally a great deal from english artists and from dutch artists and in so far as he used the grand tour, and used what rome and other countries had to offer, that's what every artist did, every european artist, not just the english. and of course there have been many moments when english art was very important on the continent indeed. an obvious example is the pre-raphaelites, who, whilst still being spurned in england, except that they were collected by, i don't know, manchester businessmen, spurned in london, let's say, were enormously influential in brussels, in paris, and in germany and austria. can i ask you a rather difficult question? @@ -66216,7 +66161,7 @@ a lot of modern art has tended to be that way, often abstract art, that people t it's a big subject but i'm in a sense referring to it only in this context because it's precisely in these areas that british art in the twentieth century has been very important. a man like ben nicholson, elderly now, rather frail, still i hope working — certainly last year he was still working and exhibiting — is part of an international modern art tendency, or number of tendencies and is recognized as such, and yet if you examine his art, it's full of englishness as well. you see one can be both. -one can be both part of the international abstract art and some of his work is abstract, and even in that context bring into it qualities that once one knows the idiom people can recognize as purely english and one can also, at the same time as he was much of the time, be a figurative artist that do landscapes, interiors, figure paintings (rarely), and figure drawings of a very high quality, and again they are partly of an international modern and they are partly essentially english works. +one can be both part of the international abstract art and some of his work is abstract, and even in that context bring into it qualities that once one knows the idiom people can recognize as purely english and one can also, at the same time as he was much of the time, be a figurative artist that do landscapes, interiors, figure paintings (rarely), and figure drawings of a very high quality, and again they are partly of an international modern and they are partly essentially english works. what about the art public? it seems to me that ultimately artists must be successful or otherwise because of the public response to their output. is the british public different from new york public or the continental public? @@ -66234,7 +66179,7 @@ at the post-impressionist exhibition you could scarcely move at all for people, this actually reinforces what you're saying i suppose. yes, i think you would find that everywhere people will crowd into especially post-impressionism, which is van gogh, etc., more than they would into an avant-garde exhibition. i don't mean that people necessarily have to like what's going on. -what i'm begging, especially our leaders so to speak, to do is to stop thinking that it's all kind of a joke that's being perpetrated by idiots or by of some sort against the public. +what i'm begging, especially our leaders so to speak, to do is to stop thinking that it's all kind of a joke that's being perpetrated by idiots or by of some sort against the public. alas the exhibition at the royal academy, it should be fuller of course because there are some good things there. any exhibition is worth going looking at and thinking about, but i do think that that is an extraordinarily bad exhibition. it's the first time i've come away from an exhibition thinking that the exhibition as such was stupid. @@ -66265,7 +66210,7 @@ there is a sense in which after much complex art, much elaborate art, much sermo in the case of alan charlton, he has these six very fine grey panels, by very fine i just mean they are handsomely proportioned, they are very carefully coloured to a very precise, not just colour but also weight of colour and brightness and so on, but the way they're shown in the royal academy exhibition, and this is part of it's stupidity, is, well i got the feeling it was intended to kill them to stone dead by putting them next to something very loud, very elaborate, very expressionist, a vast canvass by a very good painter by mutter. to put these two things together is like forcing people to eat, i don't know, salt and sugar in the same spoonful. i am not saying which is the salt and which is the sugar — it just is absolutely designed not to produce an intelligent reaction in the spectator. -the only way to show work is to show it either absolutely by itself, in a very plain setting, so that you can notice every detail of how the light falls on it and so on, or to show it with other absolutely minimal works, so again you get this utter simplicity and you become very aware of the space in which the thing is hanging and so on , but there must be a very clear, simple setting, as indeed for new classicism, and i sometimes think that this kind of art is the son or grandson of new classicism, in which incidentally britain was the leading country. +the only way to show work is to show it either absolutely by itself, in a very plain setting, so that you can notice every detail of how the light falls on it and so on, or to show it with other absolutely minimal works, so again you get this utter simplicity and you become very aware of the space in which the thing is hanging and so on , but there must be a very clear, simple setting, as indeed for new classicism, and i sometimes think that this kind of art is the son or grandson of new classicism, in which incidentally britain was the leading country. so, lastly, where is art going in the future? would you care to gaze in your crystal ball? briefly, no. @@ -66274,11 +66219,10 @@ the thing about art is that it isn't just a nostalgic wallowing in things of the thank you very much norbert. next week, michael hall will be talking about music. until next week then, goodnight. - hello it's me again, with this head of mine. what have you been doing to your head now? -i've already been up at your +i've already been up at your you says it was inflammation of the nerves in the aye. . @@ -66290,7 +66234,7 @@ eh. and see what's going on. let's see i thought it was a . -i took it off doctor, and i i take +i took it off doctor, and i i take so mind the wee er nerve pills that you gave me mamma . mhm. och, i can't remember, diazepam, took one of them at , whether it's nerves or what @@ -66306,7 +66250,7 @@ i've been burping an awful lot, in my stomach. what's worrying you? och, i don't know. i haven't the foggiest. -have +have i feel awfully depressed as well. right. whether it's this pain that's doing it i know i don't know. @@ -66319,7 +66263,7 @@ i mean for a while i think it was maybe my glasses, but these are just new no. lenses i've got. now then. -i thought the change of life would be starting on me as well. +i thought the change of life would be starting on me as well. well this is the other thing that could could be starting. ah. you're a bit young. @@ -66341,7 +66285,7 @@ cannae get awake? she's not been taking them, she's been able to sleep at night but she's sleeping all day and all. right. just something for to pep her up a bit. -but i i i'm at early in the morning so me mammy says, why don't you try one of the diazepam that i've got. +but i i i'm at early in the morning so me mammy says, why don't you try one of the diazepam that i've got. i took one and it took it away. disappeared? aye. @@ -66365,7 +66309,7 @@ one after your cup of tea in the morning aha. and one after your cup of tea at six o'clock. right. -and you take that over to and get +and you take that over to and get any time? some x-rays. aye, any time after er i guess half past nine in the morning. @@ -66397,52 +66341,51 @@ get her going . right, many thinks, cheerio. right cheerio now. - okay would you like to start then? right has everyone had a chance to look at some stuff since last time? much. okay sally-ann, have you had a chance to look at some of the things which we're gonna do today as well? i haven't had a look at any books at all but, erm i was worried about . -okay so do you want to run us through some of the things that we haven't really discussed in detail of what we're gonna talk about in here today, specifically have we, i mean i thought something along the lines of er the nature and extent of sexual variations in english, or any other language you want. +okay so do you want to run us through some of the things that we haven't really discussed in detail of what we're gonna talk about in here today, specifically have we, i mean i thought something along the lines of er the nature and extent of sexual variations in english, or any other language you want. so in what way can it differ men and women differ in conversation? and you can make it specific you can just discuss it and make very specific interruptions or turn-taking if you want. -on the other hand you could talk about things in general what the different aspects in the speech are +on the other hand you could talk about things in general what the different aspects in the speech are being in other languages as well. is this -yeah i mean okay cover the languages to show how they did it properly, so if there is something else you want to bring in then that would be good. +yeah i mean okay cover the languages to show how they did it properly, so if there is something else you want to bring in then that would be good. but i suppose it would mainly worthwhile concentrating on english, because that's where most of the data's from. -er i've got some notes here which i can go through wouldn't actually be necessary but when sally-ann's going through her notes if anyone else would like raise anything which backs it up or disagrees with it or whatever then, you know please you know butt in and say whatever think might might be relevant at the time. -have you stopped the erm the -the don't before easter though. +er i've got some notes here which i can go through wouldn't actually be necessary but when sally-ann's going through her notes if anyone else would like raise anything which backs it up or disagrees with it or whatever then, you know please you know butt in and say whatever think might might be relevant at the time. +have you stopped the erm the +the don't before easter though. what ? i'm not quite sure when the official handing in date for this essay is, because of the fact that some essays have overrun from last term. i suppose that really, probably is friday week three but, i don't suppose it has to be. which reminds me. have i got your last essay in yet or not? -i'm a little bit confused there and i can't get it out. +i'm a little bit confused there and i can't get it out. okay. honest. okay. well like i say i'll i'll mark the rest of them when i've got them all in. -i can't really mark then till i don i don't want to mark them until i've got them all in cos otherwise it's not really fair so hopefully next week sometime. -i this morning, i've been running around and i can't get it out . +i can't really mark then till i don i don't want to mark them until i've got them all in cos otherwise it's not really fair so hopefully next week sometime. +i this morning, i've been running around and i can't get it out . what is it on wordperfect? hm. -i keep getting and things like that. -oh maybe could go to the advisory after i think they're open till five. +i keep getting and things like that. +oh maybe could go to the advisory after i think they're open till five. mm. if you go there afterwards and what they say. er right okay then. right erm these notes are sort of based on a lecture that i went to when i was in sixth form erm and the theme for it is, men and women, do we speak the same language? erm so first of all sounds and pronunciation. -er men tend to have a lower pitch on the whole, erm th they're louder and the's due to their physiological differences, erm jacqueline once said that, men try to talk bigger than they are whereas women talk as though they're smaller. -erm it's been shown that women strive for a pronunciations and and sort of go more towards the . -erm some women tend to have more pitch variation and they're more emotional so they're more likely to use encouraging tones er which can sometimes be seen to be slightly patronizing, whereas boys think it's soppy to be emotional or expressive way, so that if you're in school and you're asking people to read out in class, erm a girl would be more likely to be more expressive, whereas a boy would be a little bit more monotonous, and just sort of read it out and not put any emotion into it. +er men tend to have a lower pitch on the whole, erm th they're louder and the's due to their physiological differences, erm jacqueline once said that, men try to talk bigger than they are whereas women talk as though they're smaller. +erm it's been shown that women strive for a pronunciations and and sort of go more towards the . +erm some women tend to have more pitch variation and they're more emotional so they're more likely to use encouraging tones er which can sometimes be seen to be slightly patronizing, whereas boys think it's soppy to be emotional or expressive way, so that if you're in school and you're asking people to read out in class, erm a girl would be more likely to be more expressive, whereas a boy would be a little bit more monotonous, and just sort of read it out and not put any emotion into it. and go to words of meaning, erm and the descriptions of colours where men are more likely to say purple whereas women would describe it as aubergine or plum and go into more detail about the shading than the colour. then erm names, babies i if a baby's christened timothy er it gets called timmy or nicholas gets called nicky, which sort of ties in with the biscuits being called bickie and horsie and doggie and all this sort of ee things that you say to babies. but as soon as the n the kid nicky hits teenage years then he wants to be called nick, whereas if the girl's been christened nicola and she's called nicky through her childhood, when she hits teens she's still called nicky. so girls don't seem to mind the ee thing whereas the the boys do. -erm also if you look at entertainment, like james saville calls himself jimmy saville, terence wogan is terry wogan, so but then you look at people like charlie chaplin, when he was doing his comedian role he was c he called himself charlie chaplin, and when he's directing films he called himself charles chaplin, so maybe it's all like a bit of a serious thing. -so maybe that implies that when do the kids have got that ee ending. +erm also if you look at entertainment, like james saville calls himself jimmy saville, terence wogan is terry wogan, so but then you look at people like charlie chaplin, when he was doing his comedian role he was c he called himself charlie chaplin, and when he's directing films he called himself charles chaplin, so maybe it's all like a bit of a serious thing. +so maybe that implies that when do the kids have got that ee ending. then we go to the taboo language and if you talk about when you go to the toilet, if you everybody excuses themselves to leave and that's both men and women and then somehow you have to say where you're going, so the women are more likely to use the polite sort of euphemistic kinds of things like they'd say toilet or loo, whereas the men are more likely to say bog. and they actually say what they do when they get there. oh, younger men are more likely to use coarser tones and be more explicit erm although they wouldn't use those sort terms to their father or elder men, and the women are more likely to use euphemisms like spend a penny, powder your nose and things like that. @@ -66450,27 +66393,27 @@ and then we go to grammar. women tend to use more standard forms er and men are more likely to use regional dialect forms. so that shows women are more status conscious and men are more maybe could be more concerned with their macho image, and they associate the non-standard with macho image. erm there is a study where they looked into erm men in the workforce and women and in the workforce and er if men worked together in factories it sort of reinforces their speech patterns, their workmates are reinforcing their speech pattern so they're more likely to use non- standard. -and then there was a study into and area of belfast where most of the men were unemployed and it was the women who were going out to work in the factory and it was found to be the other way round, and the women spoke more of a non-standard than the men did when the men were staying at home. +and then there was a study into and area of belfast where most of the men were unemployed and it was the women who were going out to work in the factory and it was found to be the other way round, and the women spoke more of a non-standard than the men did when the men were staying at home. it was the women going out to work. then we get use and interaction. -women tend to use more questions which sort of softens the effect of what they're saying, so they'll say things like, there we go and the men say things like, let's go. +women tend to use more questions which sort of softens the effect of what they're saying, so they'll say things like, there we go and the men say things like, let's go. erm women are more likely to use the words such as may, might, possibly, perhaps which seem to be a little less forceful. in turn-taking men have be shown to interrupt women more than they interrupt other men, er and then there's the use of mm. erm it's been shown that men seem to er connect the word mm with i agree, that's what they use it to mean whereas the women tend to use mm as i understand. erm so where do these differences come from? -they come from the way socializes children er during the early school years, boys and girls tend to have different activity, the boys in the groups are in groups outdoors and the girls and in tos and fros and they're sharing their little secrets and being loyal to each other and whispering away in little corners. +they come from the way socializes children er during the early school years, boys and girls tend to have different activity, the boys in the groups are in groups outdoors and the girls and in tos and fros and they're sharing their little secrets and being loyal to each other and whispering away in little corners. so that women aren't taken seriously. so do we speak the same language? -yes, but with differences and we don't always the same message. +yes, but with differences and we don't always the same message. and that's that. okay, right. has anyone got any other things to add to that? no. -there was a when we were talking about erm how er women sit there and chatter, it's sort of trivial. -said to be trivial erm which meant it isn't erm book says that erm cos women talk about things like erm children and husband and things, +there was a when we were talking about erm how er women sit there and chatter, it's sort of trivial. +said to be trivial erm which meant it isn't erm book says that erm cos women talk about things like erm children and husband and things, mhm whereas men talk about cars and stuff like that. -and that's it's not true at all it's just different it considered. +and that's it's not true at all it's just different it considered. right, and we've got part of this linked in with the stuff you might have done on sapir-wharf hypothesis in the sense that er people talk about different things because they might be relevant to their actual lives. er and of course if you're in one group, you might think that something's trivial and you might denigrate another a group for talking about those things, when in fact that group sees it as an important talk about it might see the thing that the other group hold dear to talk about as something trivial, and to denigrate. so yeah, i mean that's definitely something that that comes into it. @@ -66478,13 +66421,13 @@ erm what sort of d differences are there in conversational styles? i mean it's a thing you might want to talk think about or you night have read about, things like interjections and er interruptions and overlapping. and how erm men tend to ignore them, they're like they're not interested and not going to pay any attention. right, do you want to explain that a bit more, about -well things that they the actually say anything which is sort of a sign that you listening, understanding but if they delay it, it's say it 's the women that pauses,wanting some sort of suddenly realizes +well things that they the actually say anything which is sort of a sign that you listening, understanding but if they delay it, it's say it 's the women that pauses,wanting some sort of suddenly realizes right. -that women uses use minimal responses anyway, then then you know like all males speak a male didn't use minimal responses +that women uses use minimal responses anyway, then then you know like all males speak a male didn't use minimal responses so it wouldn't be that they interruptions listening necessarily it would just be that wouldn't expect to have to. yeah, right yeah. women use women use minim minimal -responses but when men use them it quite often delay . +responses but when men use them it quite often delay . i mean one thing that's mentioned before is about tag questions, which is where you put on question to the end of your sentence, as in oh don't you agree or isn't it or you know you know the sort of thing i mean. er now i mean one thing that a lot of the literature says is that this might indicate a power, and another thing that the literature says is that it tends to be women who do more of it. @@ -66497,7 +66440,7 @@ now modal tag is one for seeking agreement whereas an effective tag is one that women used seventy five percent effective tags and twenty five percent modal tags, so in general their tags were to show concern rather than to actual seek agreement, so it wasn't showing a lack of power according to this study. whereas the men had sixty percent effective tags and forty percent modal which is still the same direction but to a lesser extent. which shows that perhaps a misindica in this situation perhaps the men are seeking agreement rather than the women are, because the women seem to be doing it to actually show concern, rather than to seek agreement, which doesn't turns a lot of the traditional thing about tag questions on it head. -pointed out how tag questions there's only certain structures you can put them in, that were going to direct it rather than proper questions say someone who's asking all proper questions,is he going to use as many tag questions anyway? +pointed out how tag questions there's only certain structures you can put them in, that were going to direct it rather than proper questions say someone who's asking all proper questions,is he going to use as many tag questions anyway? mhm. and that sort of the that's something else which you might find, a lot of the time in er literature about interaction with children, you might find that er where parents are asking their children to do something, like if they're playing a game, you might find some you'll find that mothers and fathers talk differently to sons and daughters er so you start off with a direct ac action like put that one there, if they're playing lego or something, straight prom put that on there down to er wouldn't it be a good idea to put that on there down to could you put that on there or let's put it on there. @@ -66505,15 +66448,15 @@ and you find more or more or less forceful ways of of giving directives, and one has anyone read anything about turn-taking in conversation? yes. and how that works. -sort of there's a model, a conversational model and if it if it's if it's conversation is following a model then it's it means that it's running smoothly +sort of there's a model, a conversational model and if it if it's if it's conversation is following a model then it's it means that it's running smoothly mhm. -and you erm you know your next big and the mean a signals as to whether or not it sort of the floor's being offered. +and you erm you know your next big and the mean a signals as to whether or not it sort of the floor's being offered. mhm. -and you've just go to to generally in single sex conversation it follows the model. +and you've just go to to generally in single sex conversation it follows the model. quite often erm when it's men and women speaking the men will interrupt a little more erm which makes the women fall silent. whereas women hardly ever overlapped mhm okay. -so in the two things that can happen in conversation to to give it to make it stop running smoothly are overlapping and interruption and like some of them are quite difficult to tell apart but usually it's if you're transcribing stuff it's fairly obvious. +so in the two things that can happen in conversation to to give it to make it stop running smoothly are overlapping and interruption and like some of them are quite difficult to tell apart but usually it's if you're transcribing stuff it's fairly obvious. what's can you remember what the point in a conversation is where a speaker has a chance to to become a new speaker? like it's it's t r p @@ -66522,15 +66465,15 @@ yeah that's the thing i was thinking of the t r p like you say the transition re i mean that is like a point in the conversation where a change in turn-taking could ha potentially happen. now when you get to a t r p what are the three things that can happen? i don't know if any of the li any of the stuff you read mentioned this or not. -erm the the somebody speaking includes erm address someone to make it really obvious who the next speaker's going to be. +erm the the somebody speaking includes erm address someone to make it really obvious who the next speaker's going to be. mhm. -or it you leave it open and one of the other speakers in the more than one or more of the other speakers in the conversation could decide to start to talking, or no one could erm start talking the present speaker at the moment gets another chance to carry on. +or it you leave it open and one of the other speakers in the more than one or more of the other speakers in the conversation could decide to start to talking, or no one could erm start talking the present speaker at the moment gets another chance to carry on. okay that's right, yeah. okay has anybody else got anything more on that on that subject?if we go back for a bit and just go back to the idea of the theory, which is something that probably should have come at the beginning but it doesn't matter too much. and like there are two different sort of schools of thought about men and women's conversation. er one is like the traditional school of though and the other one is like the feminist way of looking at things. -er just to run through what the two what the two schools sort of think it will be fair to say that the traditional school thinks as follows. +er just to run through what the two what the two schools sort of think it will be fair to say that the traditional school thinks as follows. er in terms of syntax and pronunciation, women were always thought of as being more careful than men, er a lot of dialectologists in the past considered women to be very conservative in their speech, they ascribed conservatism to them. er men and women were always thought to use different specialist vocabularies, that's something else that was said. er women were also said to be polite, diffident, verbose and deferential, which @@ -66544,7 +66487,7 @@ except that women were deferential to other speakers they would let they would t i'm not saying that the same person thought of these two things at once, but okay. these are these are things which were all said. -er said in in an article that women used empty language. +er said in in an article that women used empty language. that was a phrase he used. so what so traditional schools thought that women did a lot of recognized they thought that women did a lot of talking but that a lot of it wasn't really any use. yeah that that was just the ideas it had. @@ -66559,12 +66502,12 @@ and that was by a women called robin lakehoff and she wrote a paper called l lan er the things that she said were that women used more hedges, such as i think er hedges are sort of things that get put into the conversation if al allegedly if somebody wants to give the impression that they're not quite sure, and they wouldn't w you know like i wouldn't want to say it for sure but i think that. er and then similarly to that they er were said to seek agreement by lakehoff she said they used more questions and more tag questions. she said, as you said, they s she said they used less swearing and more please and thank yous. -and also as you said, the thing with colours, they were said to perhaps use less basic colour terms, so if some men were shown a bluey-green some men would say and some would say whereas a women allegedly would say turquoise or whatever. +and also as you said, the thing with colours, they were said to perhaps use less basic colour terms, so if some men were shown a bluey-green some men would say and some would say whereas a women allegedly would say turquoise or whatever. er now a lot of things in lakehoff's paper perhaps people have disagreed with since then such as the things about tag questions and hedges erm i mean some studies have said that if you look at the actual modality of tag questions, like we said before, the actual function of it that isn't the case. but still it's an important paper that sort of broke away from a lot of the traditional thinking and led towards a lot more feminist stuff. i mean you c you can't really read wh a book on this list about women's and men, s language without finding the reference to lakehoff in the back somewhere. -did she actually do research? +did she actually do research? er a lot a lot of hers was intuition yeah, er some students were given shown some s some utterances @@ -66586,35 +66529,35 @@ er the same things happens with nouns and verbs and other things and in ja japan er again i think you can find some information on that in thorn and henley. right, er another situation where there's men and women differences is in multilingual communities, er you find that men and women's attitudes to varieties or language varieties or languages can carry so some men will try and avoid using one of their languages because they see it as a low prestige variety whereas some women will use it because for them it's a high prestige variety. likewise you might find that switching and mixing will change according to status of the languages. -er there's another book which is similar to the other one in the sense that it made up of some papers by phillips, steel and tants and that has some information about mexicano in it, er and you find that some people er were giving mexican language a low a low prestige rate whereas other group in the community were doing the opposite and giving a high prestige rate or certainly a less low one, er in favour of spanish a lot of the because it was in i think it's in south america i guess, er you find that a lot of the locals were switching to spanish because it was coming the dominant language er because of societal pressures and constraints and so on. +er there's another book which is similar to the other one in the sense that it made up of some papers by phillips, steel and tants and that has some information about mexicano in it, er and you find that some people er were giving mexican language a low a low prestige rate whereas other group in the community were doing the opposite and giving a high prestige rate or certainly a less low one, er in favour of spanish a lot of the because it was in i think it's in south america i guess, er you find that a lot of the locals were switching to spanish because it was coming the dominant language er because of societal pressures and constraints and so on. er but a part of the community were trying to keep mexicano and there's men and women differences in that. -there's a caribbean island and apparently they just because the men their sort of ancestors invaded the island,all the men and you know they +there's a caribbean island and apparently they just because the men their sort of ancestors invaded the island,all the men and you know they mhm. -and then they kept their language kept the language. +and then they kept their language kept the language. right. -okay did anybody get a chance to read the paper which was about conversation? -i just wondered what what that came up with as it's conclusion. +okay did anybody get a chance to read the paper which was about conversation? +i just wondered what what that came up with as it's conclusion. w well it might be worth having a read of that. er okay what else? has anybody got any that i haven't haven't really covered yet? mhm. -and how erm but it probably got a little to do with the way groups actually organize. -whereas the boys are more but the tend to give more . +and how erm but it probably got a little to do with the way groups actually organize. +whereas the boys are more but the tend to give more . right. -but the girls tend more equal responsibility and not . +but the girls tend more equal responsibility and not . what differences do you f i mean have you got any specific examples there or? -no er the girls sort of say things like perhaps ask her, do you have any we could get on a bit more so they don't include themselves in what they're going to do. -whereas the boys give me the pie get off my steps or something +no er the girls sort of say things like perhaps ask her, do you have any we could get on a bit more so they don't include themselves in what they're going to do. +whereas the boys give me the pie get off my steps or something mm. right. -is there something about where one girl was using what would be boys language when +is there something about where one girl was using what would be boys language when yeah. -someone else came round to her house she was like you know get off my yard -yeah,yeah, so girls are perfectly capable of using those when need be +someone else came round to her house she was like you know get off my yard +yeah,yeah, so girls are perfectly capable of using those when need be yeah, i mean i the important thing is i think the children do recognize the differences, not that they don't notice the differences, because they're like you say they're capable of using the other if it if it suits them. er i mean that goes back again to the articles which you might have about the way that parents talk to their children, and you quite often find that then very very quickly the children grow up speaking in a same way as the parent of that sex talked to the them. -so if a child gets spoken to in a fairly direct way by imagine a female child by her father and the same female child gets spoken to in a not so direct way be her mother, then even of this the child is likely to both version, she'll grow up using female variety because she's she can affiliate herself with her mother and i mean she knows that is the variety she's expected to use. -i think can't really remember i don't know how father would use different language he's talking to his son or daughter. +so if a child gets spoken to in a fairly direct way by imagine a female child by her father and the same female child gets spoken to in a not so direct way be her mother, then even of this the child is likely to both version, she'll grow up using female variety because she's she can affiliate herself with her mother and i mean she knows that is the variety she's expected to use. +i think can't really remember i don't know how father would use different language he's talking to his son or daughter. yeah that's true as well. er it sort of goes in four ways i mean the fathers talk more directly than the mothers whether or not it's a boy or a girl they're talking to. but they do talk more directly to boys than girls, so it's sort of graded in that way. @@ -66624,15 +66567,15 @@ has anyone got any i mean i you don't all need to write about the same thing or er does everyone want to do a general essay or do people want to do a s a specific thing? general essays can turn into just regurgitating from the . okay so is there anything you've read that you all would want to concentrate on? -erm well not that i've come across yet i'd rather do something that's getting the facts and then giving examples. +erm well not that i've come across yet i'd rather do something that's getting the facts and then giving examples. mhm. -i want top do something on what what you noticed about and what you've got +i want top do something on what what you noticed about and what you've got right. right. er let me think. i'll just go and find out when the due date for this essay is, and then cos if it is the end of week three then i'll i'll say o i'll say it can be in in week four sometime. but if it's due in when the project originally was which was week five, then that -gives you a bit more time to decide exactly what you want to talk about cos if if it has go to be in week three or week four, then we really sort of like decide now what you're going to write about so that n cos next week is gonna be our last meeting on this topic, so you really want to sort of give a bit of a presentation on what you're going to say. +gives you a bit more time to decide exactly what you want to talk about cos if if it has go to be in week three or week four, then we really sort of like decide now what you're going to write about so that n cos next week is gonna be our last meeting on this topic, so you really want to sort of give a bit of a presentation on what you're going to say. yeah i want everyone to do like five or ten minutes next week on what they're gonna write. okay i 'll just go and find out. what are they supposed to be doing by the way? @@ -66641,14 +66584,14 @@ it got cancelled . cancelled it got cancelled? oh right, didn't hear that then. -there oh that's why we're not doing it any more, so what do we have to do instead of having to do an essay ? +there oh that's why we're not doing it any more, so what do we have to do instead of having to do an essay ? just an essay. oh, they decided not to give us quite so much work? mm. oh right. -so we is that why the +so we is that why the is that what we're meant to be doing this term,tutorials? -think so i don't +think so i don't when do our tutorials stop? i'm really confused. we've got two more tutorials? @@ -66656,7 +66599,7 @@ what oh yeah, week three and week four, and yeah. i'm so confused about what's going on. i think i must be not looking at the list or not reading half the stuff. -the first who put dictation and and i was going, what? +the first who put dictation and and i was going, what? where did it say that? i shan't find the le you know the letter we got sent in the holidays? yeah. @@ -66677,8 +66620,8 @@ cos he's a runner. oh excellent,? put the history of phonetics yeah. -so little blue brochure and -this is the study of papers written in the fifteenth century or something +so little blue brochure and +this is the study of papers written in the fifteenth century or something history of phonetics? i'm sorry if you're interested in this then go for it. you need a @@ -66694,7 +66637,7 @@ yeah it is. that sounds excellent. right it's due in week three i think. hurray. -er but as far as i'm concerned if it comes in in week four, that's fair enough, but things after that then they start to get a bit upset +er but as far as i'm concerned if it comes in in week four, that's fair enough, but things after that then they start to get a bit upset but i sa i said to chris, when is it? she said, week three. er and i said, give or take a few days, and she said, yeah. @@ -66702,26 +66645,26 @@ so if it's inside week four then that will quite reasonable, does that sound oka okay has anyone had a think about what they want to do? i mean does anybody else know? sort of everything we've had so far's been pretty general. -okay if any of you wanted to you could always go out some tape recorder and people have a listen to it. -but obviously if you're going to do that you'll have to do it during next week some time on the other hand i could give you a list of five topics and you could choose one. +okay if any of you wanted to you could always go out some tape recorder and people have a listen to it. +but obviously if you're going to do that you'll have to do it during next week some time on the other hand i could give you a list of five topics and you could choose one. yeah oh yeah i mean there's five five things five things in men or women's conversation t to do and essay about. -say one about interrupting, one about topics, and one about perhaps interaction with children, one about er what or you could even i mean if i did er i did a list of that you could even do the same one, you wouldn't have to do one each. +say one about interrupting, one about topics, and one about perhaps interaction with children, one about er what or you could even i mean if i did er i did a list of that you could even do the same one, you wouldn't have to do one each. you know you got your erm tag questions? yeah. -might not be one of the question in it as tag questions could be +might not be one of the question in it as tag questions could be oh yeah. specific. -okay er there's one title i've got written down here which i don't know if anyone's interested in. +okay er there's one title i've got written down here which i don't know if anyone's interested in. evaluate the claim that women are more d ob evaluate the claim that women are more observant of the prestige norms in their speech than men are. does anyone fancy that? -let's if i write down okay the which i've just suddenly thought of were er +let's if i write down okay the which i've just suddenly thought of were er turn-taking and interruptions and overlap and tags and tag questions, topic selection and interaction with children, which i think i just mentioned make sure you've got them down so we can forget them. er what? what? what have i done? oh you weren't supposed to be able to read it. -no, we can read it but it's +no, we can read it but it's it's just happened a lot this week. er so yeah, you want to do some questioney tag things? yeah. @@ -66729,23 +66672,23 @@ okay, i mean just ignore that one, forget i wrote it. i mean on something like interruptions there's only so much you can say. er yeah, which is why may be general one might be more useful dependi it depends how much -whereas if you do interaction of children you can do it here, +whereas if you do interaction of children you can do it here, mhm. oh yeah i mean if you wanted to also link that with multicultural situation or or cross cultural or comparing it with other ones i mean that's no problem. -language of the different to +language of the different to okay. certain dialectic language. -yeah well if you want to that then that's fine as well, i mean that tell you what, the best thing then is can everyone put a note in my pigeon hole by monday in other words, you've got the weekend to decide for definite. +yeah well if you want to that then that's fine as well, i mean that tell you what, the best thing then is can everyone put a note in my pigeon hole by monday in other words, you've got the weekend to decide for definite. gives us just like a provisional title of what the essay will be, on what your essay will be. is that alright, cos then you've gone away with any ideas you've got from now which is probably none, er and then it also means that i don't have to spend next week worrying in case we get to friday and thursday and you're still not sure what you're doing. is that alright? okay if you just sort of like think of a vague title which sums up what the things are which you want to cover in the essay and if you get it to me by monday then that that'll be quite good. -you know about questions, is it questions like sort of +you know about questions, is it questions like sort of well tag questions and er and questions in their own rights which i i supposed seeking agreement is the idea. or with anything which is vaguely connected with that i mean that just sort of a coverall term for it. excuse me. okay so does everyone, think they'll gonna be able to think of something over the weekend? -okay and then if next week somet if next week everyone can have okay w i think what you need to do f for next thursday is for monday to give me what you're going to do and then between monday and thursday, try and read anything you can about that topic. +okay and then if next week somet if next week everyone can have okay w i think what you need to do f for next thursday is for monday to give me what you're going to do and then between monday and thursday, try and read anything you can about that topic. i mean you could forget this list that i gave th b that gave you, unless there's anything on it that is still relevant, but find the things yourself on that topic so that on thursday next thursday you can each spend ten minutes talking about things which you've read in your topic specifically. and if anyone chooses the same topic as somebody else then you can do it together or not together or which ever. but if that can be a general idea for next week. @@ -66755,32 +66698,31 @@ book er where you where you which one? -on on your chapter six and nine, do you know what chapter nine ? +on on your chapter six and nine, do you know what chapter nine ? er. not off the top of my head, i can't remember. -was that was that theory? +was that was that theory? was it that? -i can't remember what the off the top of my head, no. +i can't remember what the off the top of my head, no. chapter six is,. right, er -as questions lead to shouting and then crawling back to his then a little bit about language and an experiment that they did . +as questions lead to shouting and then crawling back to his then a little bit about language and an experiment that they did . right, sounds like there's a bit on topics in there so it might be worth having a look at anyway. - monday sixteenth may monday nineteen eighty three. -mr tommy inverness. -can i ask firstly mr when you were born? -august the sixth nineteen twenty nine. +mr tommy inverness. +can i ask firstly mr when you were born? +august the sixth nineteen twenty nine. now was this in tormore? in tormore house er by lochassynt. in sutherland ? in sutherland. that's correct. -and how long were you in fact there? -well up until the time i would be about eight years old when my father decided there was a change in the estate then and it was off to argyllshire dalmally that sir douglas and lady as she was then decided to go and wanted my father to come with him. +and how long were you in fact there? +well up until the time i would be about eight years old when my father decided there was a change in the estate then and it was off to argyllshire dalmally that sir douglas and lady as she was then decided to go and wanted my father to come with him. but him being from up there and my mother also and their people were still alive which was my grandparents on both sides they were very reluctant to sort of go. -but when a job came he he would be wanting a diff different shooting ground in in argyllshire comparison to the hard rocks of sutherland. +but when a job came he he would be wanting a diff different shooting ground in in argyllshire comparison to the hard rocks of sutherland. mm. pine pastures green to the tops of ben dorain and and up black mount where the craig estate took it was it was in their estate. so therefore my father was very keen to go too. @@ -66793,24 +66735,24 @@ now your father was the the stocker at tormore is that right ? yes he was the stocker at tormore. who was he employed with then? well the estate er er er the duke of sutherland had the whole of assynt and then h general stewart who was born in nedd and worked and made his fortune if it was as you would say in canada on the c p r. -canadian pacific railways and he was able to take a lot of people from the place he was born in out to canada. +canadian pacific railways and he was able to take a lot of people from the place he was born in out to canada. mm. what d'ya recall of your early days with your father at tormore? pardon? what d'ya recall of your early days at tormore with your father? -well he was a very active man my word he would soon go right from the house to the top of as you would say because we had sheep then. +well he was a very active man my word he would soon go right from the house to the top of as you would say because we had sheep then. and if he saw a sheep that shouldn't be where they were and the gentry about to come within days he would soon get them down. mm. without a collie dog. and well i remember hearing about it and and saw it probably as i grew up myself. -so he was and it had it's tormore house was really a lovely place. +so he was and it had it's tormore house was really a lovely place. did the did the gentry come fairly frequently to the estate? yes. oh they came up with their servants all servants up from the south by train to inverness and then a charabanc or vehicle of such that was in it then because it was only metal roads we had then. but they were good metal roads that took all the traffic. well i remember at that time the steam roller that was just doing the road outside tormore house and many's the day i was trying to get on it with a very good friend of ours that's now dead. a hugh . -no relation but a great friend of ours. +no relation but a great friend of ours. he was a steam roller driver. mm. and were the gentry in er lochassynt lodge or was it tormore? @@ -66834,7 +66776,7 @@ you mentioned that you were perhaps more scared of er ministers. well yeah ministers er. when i think of it nowadays and i see children so very going round to the various churches that when people used to say about ministers well. when you heard there was a minister coming i was just afraid and looking to see would you see that dark black clothed individual coming. -and even that seemed a but thinking of the old tramp and he was in a a sort of all belaggered looking way. +and even that seemed a but thinking of the old tramp and he was in a a sort of all belaggered looking way. my word but you weren't frightened of him because you were told that he was an old man and one of the road men of the road. and there was no fright to be taken from him. is it correct to to say that the tramps actually used to make a special point of coming to to see your father ? @@ -66846,8 +66788,8 @@ they wouldn't come in they wouldn't come into the porch even. they would sit outside wait in that days we had a seat out in the and even if was a seat for sitting outside they would sit on their own way or on a rock. no they just had their own way of life and you wouldn't change it and they had stories to my father. they would tell sing where they came from and who they saw and all the way up they came. -and they would be looking for a bed for the night and it would be in the old hay shed that we would put them but there wouldn't be a problem. -it was in the winter time so it was full of hay but they would be very careful and we would ask them that they had no matches in case er there was no cigarettes much and that but pipes they were pipe smokers. +and they would be looking for a bed for the night and it would be in the old hay shed that we would put them but there wouldn't be a problem. +it was in the winter time so it was full of hay but they would be very careful and we would ask them that they had no matches in case er there was no cigarettes much and that but pipes they were pipe smokers. old clay pipes with black twist. but they would soon tell that they would have their before they would go to bed and thanks er very much when getting the bed and you could er vouch for that they would never. but the odd one yes we saw the odd one but they were very odd. @@ -66855,7 +66797,7 @@ aye they were very odd. y you refer to them as mile stone inspectors. mile stone inspectors and gentlemen of the road. mm. -and there's a story about the late duke of portland when he was travelling up to to estate where his lodge was. +and there's a story about the late duke of portland when he was travelling up to to estate where his lodge was. there was many's a tramp that would have taken the a nine then but this one in particular and he was very very fond of him and he would ask when he was around to that he would get over to see him. and when that poor tramp perished out on the roadside one severe winter or spring time the duke found out where it was and to this very day there's a little mound and a stone put on it. that was the er lord of caithness i think tommy that the stone was. @@ -66875,7 +66817,7 @@ well fearsome looking wild looking as you would say it now. but but the very opposite to what people would er er th think of them as regards people now. and that's ordinary people. -but but they looked wild because they would have long hair beards a and and all oh my word they were wild looking but er. +but but they looked wild because they would have long hair beards a and and all oh my word they were wild looking but er. and probably it was cold weather they would have two or three coats er you know. and jackets probably below and their little bag of stuff. whatever they were carrying. @@ -66897,11 +66839,11 @@ well they would be discarded. it's it's like i i better not say say this but irishmen over that when when i when i used to work with irishmen my word they was good irishmen. very good friends of mine. but they would work they would never see them with dungarees. -they came with a good suit on and they would go to work with a suit double breasted and then and they would work there and make a lot of money and when the next thing they would do they would hit into town and get all rigged out and then that was them from top to bottom from their hat right to their feet and then they were hitting the road then. +they came with a good suit on and they would go to work with a suit double breasted and then and they would work there and make a lot of money and when the next thing they would do they would hit into town and get all rigged out and then that was them from top to bottom from their hat right to their feet and then they were hitting the road then. yes i could say that that's true about irishmen. mm. the the tramps never mentioned some of the places they were actually forced to stay whether it was under a road bridge or? -oh oh yes they yes they would stay under a road bridge too because you would see the er er if you would look a a bridge and they would say oh there's a tramp there's a place there if you could tell me and you would see the rocks put up and where the bed was always above water level oh yes. +oh oh yes they yes they would stay under a road bridge too because you would see the er er if you would look a a bridge and they would say oh there's a tramp there's a place there if you could tell me and you would see the rocks put up and where the bed was always above water level oh yes. mm. below the certain bridges. mm. @@ -66919,12 +66861,12 @@ mm. you see one stayed but he was there before him and the other one carried on. no they would never they would never blend together. mm. -like whiskies blend . +like whiskies blend . no no they would never. they were they were very very fine people. and and the tinkers that came there. mhm. -er wouldn't want to but from from there was there was one lot. +er wouldn't want to but from from there was there was one lot. and there were and the women folk would have their haberdashery and the men were tin smiths. they would make pails and basins like you were being requiring in your sc er scullery or in the milk house as you would keep milk there. so they were all and very industrious looking. @@ -66942,7 +66884,7 @@ er well celts. as the years came on they were beginning to get mystery fo folk but er not in my time. well that sort of people that was coming. -if ones came as in little wee pi pickups we called them the little lorry things you would sort of keep your eye very much because you didn't know they were looking for scrap and if you told them you had nothing they might go away with your iron gates or something. +if ones came as in little wee pi pickups we called them the little lorry things you would sort of keep your eye very much because you didn't know they were looking for scrap and if you told them you had nothing they might go away with your iron gates or something. this was during the mid thirties? oh yes i would say that yes that was coming more that way yeah yeah. coming more that @@ -66951,7 +66893,7 @@ did you ever have bye-names for these characters? well th th there was one joe wrench. er but i don't know what's that. but somebody so told me aye and i said that was a funny name or was it else's then. -well i said i remember a man called joe wrench and but er oh i wouldn't er but one said oh joe wrench is very black looking. +well i said i remember a man called joe wrench and but er oh i wouldn't er but one said oh joe wrench is very black looking. well the bugger is just coming on and he was cleaning the car down hosing her car so he says i turned the hose on him. well the hose landed on him alright but it landed on his parcel and it the whole thing fell out on the road. so there was a bit of @@ -66969,7 +66911,7 @@ so whatever he and if he was dumping anything oh er er they would ask the father they wouldn't be left with a whole pile of stuff or er. no oh no they or they would dump it in a place where nobody would see it you see. and when they were coming along lochassynt were they making for anywhere in particular? -we we well er er see they were on their rounds and then they'd be going round by nedd and and probably scourie they were just doing their circular. +we we well er er see they were on their rounds and then they'd be going round by nedd and and probably scourie they were just doing their circular. aye they had their places for. yes it's amazing aye. and did you have ever a chance to gain some sort of insight into their backgrounds? @@ -66995,7 +66937,7 @@ s some of them did yes if they came in the springtime and then in the ar in in t yes oh some would w w work but some wouldn't. er and if if they would work they didn't want money for it but they would stay a while with you so that they would get their bed for the night and they would get their grub. mm. -what type of work did they ? +what type of work did they ? well they would take in er er er they would er er and they would put hoe potatoes you see when that was coming on that time. and they would help to lift potatoes and they would er stack corn and hay. oh yes and that's those only that would do it but you wouldn't get the ordinary man taking any he would just be on his rounds. @@ -67003,9 +66945,9 @@ and you wouldn't say oh i think it's going to be wet today john you better stay. not him his his mind was made up on going and that was it. and were you visited by the peddler the pack-man character yes. -who sold goods +who sold goods oh oh yes er er who who sold. -er there was one chappie that er erm i can remember of him and he had a suitcase and well he had a shaving soap i suppose cos people used soap then with your shaving brush and and that and proper shaving brush and razor blades probably that quite. +er there was one chappie that er erm i can remember of him and he had a suitcase and well he had a shaving soap i suppose cos people used soap then with your shaving brush and and that and proper shaving brush and razor blades probably that quite. yes but i remember right a . so it was things that wasn't too heavy to carry but things that was always needed in a house and that you could run out of. when we were er were living all on the road so we were expecting to be supplied by vans. @@ -67013,7 +66955,7 @@ mm. and my word there was plenty of vans in them days. both getting butcher meat. what even in the thirties? -yes oh yes er er when we had a wee baker's van coming up from the nedd to lochassynt when when lochassynt lodge you see. +yes oh yes er er when we had a wee baker's van coming up from the nedd to lochassynt when when lochassynt lodge you see. so these people that had little private shops in them days did well because when the people came to the lodges it all the commodities were bought to as well as them. it's not like nowadays when people has big fridges mm. @@ -67056,7 +66998,7 @@ er we only probably did it when ourselves we got venison beforehand on the last but no no er there was so many hinds having to be shot in the winter time and and and it would be sent away you see. but not away what they're doing now or but it'd be sent down to their premises down in the in the shooting lodges in the south. mm. -and that and to their friends. +and that and to their friends. and there would be always a beast or two cut up for to be given to the village. mm. oh yes that was one thing. @@ -67068,7 +67010,7 @@ to make money. no no there was no money made of it. it was just for their for their own use. mm. -and haunches of venison that was the best part in the they would be sent away to themselves the haunches. +and haunches of venison that was the best part in the they would be sent away to themselves the haunches. but the other parts with the ribs and all that'd be cut up given to the and the lodge itself for the. and all the estate men first of all would get everything. and all the crofters then that was paying rent. @@ -67097,57 +67039,56 @@ and painters and joiners they would have themselves. all self-contained? yes self-contained yes. there'd be a joiner and he'd be engaged in a - -erm what, what we do today is to way go back over some of the ideas about land reform and then carry them through to the ninety fifty er agrarian reform bill. -erm what we've been looking at is the process of land reform. -tt and we're obviously looking at a process of land reform which has, has undergone a number of changes and i think we, we've begun to see some of the influences on those changes and particularly over the, the last week or so the this has . -tt er and i in a sense there's kind of been an upward trend in terms of progression through that, that reform but within that there have obviously been a number of and in a sense what we've been coming to terms with is, is what has been causing those, those variations, those changes in that policy. -tt and i think we've identified in a number of different factors erm er behind that, that trend and that erm i in a sense there's, there's the kind of distinction between the ideological approach and the pragmatic approach in that we, we've seen there is a, i think a, a broad ideological impetus behind the reform in the sense that there is this long-term commitment to overthrowing feudalism. +erm what, what we do today is to way go back over some of the ideas about land reform and then carry them through to the ninety fifty er agrarian reform bill. +erm what we've been looking at is the process of land reform. +tt and we're obviously looking at a process of land reform which has, has undergone a number of changes and i think we, we've begun to see some of the influences on those changes and particularly over the, the last week or so the this has . +tt er and i in a sense there's kind of been an upward trend in terms of progression through that, that reform but within that there have obviously been a number of and in a sense what we've been coming to terms with is, is what has been causing those, those variations, those changes in that policy. +tt and i think we've identified in a number of different factors erm er behind that, that trend and that erm i in a sense there's, there's the kind of distinction between the ideological approach and the pragmatic approach in that we, we've seen there is a, i think a, a broad ideological impetus behind the reform in the sense that there is this long-term commitment to overthrowing feudalism. there is this commitment to overthrowing feudalism through class struggle and there is i think this vision that under new society will be more egalitarian, not completely egalitarian i think there is, there is an attempt to move in that direction for a set of ideological reasons. -but we've also seen that the various,th that there is a whole range of, of practical day to day issues which have come up which have, have like distorted a s a straightforward progression along those ideological lines tt and in particular over the last we, we've, we've identified the political and military factors erm -which have been relevant there and the political factors during the japanese war, the a need to form a united front, a need to moderate policy and then, over the course of nineteen forty six, forty seven, the need to move in a more radical direction, to go back to land reform and, and land reform a scale in terms of absolute egalitarianism because that was seen as the way of, of mobilizing mass peasant support, particularly amongst the poor, most quickly. +but we've also seen that the various,th that there is a whole range of, of practical day to day issues which have come up which have, have like distorted a s a straightforward progression along those ideological lines tt and in particular over the last we, we've, we've identified the political and military factors erm +which have been relevant there and the political factors during the japanese war, the a need to form a united front, a need to moderate policy and then, over the course of nineteen forty six, forty seven, the need to move in a more radical direction, to go back to land reform and, and land reform a scale in terms of absolute egalitarianism because that was seen as the way of, of mobilizing mass peasant support, particularly amongst the poor, most quickly. so one of the influences on, on the progress of land reform is, is this interaction between ideology and pragmatism. -perhaps er er another way of looking at this would be to see it in terms of rightist deviations and leftist deviations and one might see erm the er the moderate policies er of thirty seven to forty nine i in a sense as being erm a rightist deviation, one might see forty six forty seven as being leftist deviations and the left is seeking to overcome rightist deviations, the right seeking to overcome leftist deviations and you've got some kind of oscillation between the two. -tt so that th the er there's that aspect to it, which i think er complements rather than contradicts the, the ideological pragmatism one. -another way of looking at this might be to say in a sense there are there are two bits, one is identifying where we are now and identifying in relation to both +perhaps er er another way of looking at this would be to see it in terms of rightist deviations and leftist deviations and one might see erm the er the moderate policies er of thirty seven to forty nine i in a sense as being erm a rightist deviation, one might see forty six forty seven as being leftist deviations and the left is seeking to overcome rightist deviations, the right seeking to overcome leftist deviations and you've got some kind of oscillation between the two. +tt so that th the er there's that aspect to it, which i think er complements rather than contradicts the, the ideological pragmatism one. +another way of looking at this might be to say in a sense there are there are two bits, one is identifying where we are now and identifying in relation to both ideological position and in terms of, of the practical realities, both in terms of rightist and leftist deviations, where we want to be. -so in any one point in time the movement is going to depend on identifying exactly where you are at the moment in terms of any of the cycles and where it is you want to get to in relation to, to a particular situation facing you. +so in any one point in time the movement is going to depend on identifying exactly where you are at the moment in terms of any of the cycles and where it is you want to get to in relation to, to a particular situation facing you. so i think there are, there are all those kind of bits which are there in terms of the understanding of, of where policy was and where it was going. tt now if we just take that, that latter point up for a minute we can -look in early nineteen forty eight where we are,wh where the land reform process had taken the communist party tt and then we could begin to look forward to where policy was going to go from there in terms of the military, political, economic, ideological future and what i'm going to do today to, to begin with anyway is, is to just consider where we are and where it is we're gonna go and in a sense we could, it might be helpful to, to put ourselves back in a position of being the central committee again. -now what, what was emerging in the end of last week's discussion was that there's been the agrarian land law,land law of er october nineteen forty seven, absolute egalitarianism and a recognition certainly by the spring of nineteen forty eight that that had overstepped the mark at least in terms of its implementation in that it had in particular led to the encroachment of middle -peasant and that that had had adverse consequences in terms of maybe economic output, certainly in terms of mobilization, certainly in terms of, of political effect on, on the middle peasant and therefore there had to be the, the correcting bit to this and that correction comes either very late forty seven but particularly early nineteen forty eight when the excesses of the, the campaigns and excesses against the middle peasants have to be, be corrected and there are very clear statements from mao that the middle peasant must not be encroached upon. -perhaps a bit more than that, the old nineteen thirty three class differentiation documents are reissued and they are reissued together with the supplements which we saw came out in the autumn of nineteen thirty three which and, and those supplements where then extended to allow the middle peasant to er up to twenty five, on some of the readings up to thirty percent, of his income from exploitation. +look in early nineteen forty eight where we are,wh where the land reform process had taken the communist party tt and then we could begin to look forward to where policy was going to go from there in terms of the military, political, economic, ideological future and what i'm going to do today to, to begin with anyway is, is to just consider where we are and where it is we're gonna go and in a sense we could, it might be helpful to, to put ourselves back in a position of being the central committee again. +now what, what was emerging in the end of last week's discussion was that there's been the agrarian land law,land law of er october nineteen forty seven, absolute egalitarianism and a recognition certainly by the spring of nineteen forty eight that that had overstepped the mark at least in terms of its implementation in that it had in particular led to the encroachment of middle +peasant and that that had had adverse consequences in terms of maybe economic output, certainly in terms of mobilization, certainly in terms of, of political effect on, on the middle peasant and therefore there had to be the, the correcting bit to this and that correction comes either very late forty seven but particularly early nineteen forty eight when the excesses of the, the campaigns and excesses against the middle peasants have to be, be corrected and there are very clear statements from mao that the middle peasant must not be encroached upon. +perhaps a bit more than that, the old nineteen thirty three class differentiation documents are reissued and they are reissued together with the supplements which we saw came out in the autumn of nineteen thirty three which and, and those supplements where then extended to allow the middle peasant to er up to twenty five, on some of the readings up to thirty percent, of his income from exploitation. so it's not just the, the standard middle peasant who is being protected, it is if you like the well to do middle peasant who's being protected. so there is, there is this very clear and i think very substantial protection for the middle peasant. -over and above that, mao is is in a sense coming up with, with a new set of proposals. -he he's arguing i think on a basis of, of the experience of the past few years that the situation now in china was a, was a rather variable one, that land reform had proceeded at different rates in different areas and because areas where different that had to be taken into account and mao explicitly was going back to the idea that in the newly liberated areas the policy would be one of rent reduction, interest rate reduction and that rent and interest rate reduction had to be established for some time until the position had consolidated around rent reduction, around interest rate reduction and once that had happened you would then be able to go into land reform itself. +over and above that, mao is is in a sense coming up with, with a new set of proposals. +he he's arguing i think on a basis of, of the experience of the past few years that the situation now in china was a, was a rather variable one, that land reform had proceeded at different rates in different areas and because areas where different that had to be taken into account and mao explicitly was going back to the idea that in the newly liberated areas the policy would be one of rent reduction, interest rate reduction and that rent and interest rate reduction had to be established for some time until the position had consolidated around rent reduction, around interest rate reduction and once that had happened you would then be able to go into land reform itself. in a sense mao is, is adopting very much the position that he seems to have taken erm in nineteen forty five when he's, he's looking forward to land return but saying at the moment our policy of rent reduction, interest rate reduction will continue and at some stage we will then be able to move on into, to that reform. so there's a clear policy for, for newly liberated areas. -as far as the old liberated areas were concerned, there was going to be a kind of land investigation again. +as far as the old liberated areas were concerned, there was going to be a kind of land investigation again. there would be a reassessment of how the land reform process had worked. -where it was found that middle peasants had been encroached upon, where it was found that middle peasants had been dispossessed erm that position would be rectified and that would be given back to middle peasants. +where it was found that middle peasants had been encroached upon, where it was found that middle peasants had been dispossessed erm that position would be rectified and that would be given back to middle peasants. so very different policies for the old and new liberated areas. and in a sense mao is saying that it's, it's not right to go straight for land reform, you, you've got to go for this policy of rent reduction, interest rate reduction first. -and alongside this went a much stronger wash your face campaign and the names of the , names of party members were published. -erm mao was worried that as,i in the course of the, the latter stages of directive and the there had been abuses of the system by party members and that had led to the party getting a bad name with the peasants and the way to rectify that was to publish the communist party membership so everybody in the village would know who was a communist party member and they would be able to see, mao believed, that on the whole party members had behaved properly, they hadn't exploited the situation for their own advantage and where they have they would be, there would be a with them to correct. -now that i think is, is the position as of the spring of nineteen forty -can i just stop there for a minute er er is this the best -any, any points anything anybody would like to add to this? -did you call it wash your fact sort of? +and alongside this went a much stronger wash your face campaign and the names of the , names of party members were published. +erm mao was worried that as,i in the course of the, the latter stages of directive and the there had been abuses of the system by party members and that had led to the party getting a bad name with the peasants and the way to rectify that was to publish the communist party membership so everybody in the village would know who was a communist party member and they would be able to see, mao believed, that on the whole party members had behaved properly, they hadn't exploited the situation for their own advantage and where they have they would be, there would be a with them to correct. +now that i think is, is the position as of the spring of nineteen forty +can i just stop there for a minute er er is this the best +any, any points anything anybody would like to add to this? +did you call it wash your fact sort of? mm. yes i mean it, it can be, i think it can be . -it's not something which is introduced for the first time in nineteen forty eight but, but there is erm sort of another round of it erm and sort of the new dimension is that the, everybody's name is published because until then you, you didn't er you didn't know who the party members were. +it's not something which is introduced for the first time in nineteen forty eight but, but there is erm sort of another round of it erm and sort of the new dimension is that the, everybody's name is published because until then you, you didn't er you didn't know who the party members were. mm. right. -now we need to decide where to go from here. +now we need to decide where to go from here. now i, i, i er our, our, in a sense our policy now is that we're going to sort of readjust the policy in, in the north . -as we go into the south we are just going to conduct a rent reduction, interest reduction campaign and we, we will then aim to consolidate that position and at some stage we will then move forward into land reform again, but to do that we will probably need a new land law because we're recognizing the old agrarian land law is, is inappropriate,absolute egalitarianism is now dead in a sense of as erm it's sort of saying that, that as mao is arguing in may forty eight, may forty eight that absolute egalitarianism is wrong. +as we go into the south we are just going to conduct a rent reduction, interest reduction campaign and we, we will then aim to consolidate that position and at some stage we will then move forward into land reform again, but to do that we will probably need a new land law because we're recognizing the old agrarian land law is, is inappropriate,absolute egalitarianism is now dead in a sense of as erm it's sort of saying that, that as mao is arguing in may forty eight, may forty eight that absolute egalitarianism is wrong. so, so, so that bit of it we've, we've moved forward . -er are you happy with this idea that, that sort of the immediate future in the newly liberated areas is, is just rent reduction, interest rate reduction, consolidate that and then move on? +er are you happy with this idea that, that sort of the immediate future in the newly liberated areas is, is just rent reduction, interest rate reduction, consolidate that and then move on? do does this seem to be the right policy? -it would have more affect in the south +it would have more affect in the south on the moderate side erm it would, would stand a better chance than yes, right. and as a starting point @@ -67156,27 +67097,27 @@ and there's more of a justified presence. so that it, it would actually fit the conditions in the south in terms that we are, you're moving into an area of, of higher tenancy and therefore rent reduction, interest rate reduction is, would have a significant effect. right. you say this rent reduction? -oh cos i, i thought they erm they had the three different areas +oh cos i, i thought they erm they had the three different areas mm -but erm i thought forty eight, areas where and carry out -yes, i, i think that was that was still when the i think that was still in a sense under the auspices of the old agrarian er of the of forty seven was still being given by . -erm i think bro broadly, certainly by the time you've got through to the later spring th th there is y yes i mean i in a sense there are sort of three areas if you like but, but very broadly the areas which had not been taken over yet i is very much a slower process of consolidation and then you wait for the next rule. -er you're happy with this, this seems okay in terms of policy +but erm i thought forty eight, areas where and carry out +yes, i, i think that was that was still when the i think that was still in a sense under the auspices of the old agrarian er of the of forty seven was still being given by . +erm i think bro broadly, certainly by the time you've got through to the later spring th th there is y yes i mean i in a sense there are sort of three areas if you like but, but very broadly the areas which had not been taken over yet i is very much a slower process of consolidation and then you wait for the next rule. +er you're happy with this, this seems okay in terms of policy doesn't it seem slightly odd though? -in the sense that, in a way going on from what i was saying on the face of it south china ought to be the area where land reform will be easiest to achieve in the sense that here you've got a society which is landlord dominated, heavily landlord dominated and therefore w where one would expect that the antagonism, antagonisms between landlords and tenants would be at their greatest. +in the sense that, in a way going on from what i was saying on the face of it south china ought to be the area where land reform will be easiest to achieve in the sense that here you've got a society which is landlord dominated, heavily landlord dominated and therefore w where one would expect that the antagonism, antagonisms between landlords and tenants would be at their greatest. i in, in the north you've got a higher proportion of owner-occupiers and -you perhaps haven't got the same degree of landlord exploitation, you might, i think one might argue from, from what we said earlier that in the north you've got a s a slightly more paternalistic landlord, it's, it, there's less, less absentee landlordism landlords were more likely to have been behaving within the confines of moral economy wouldn't, wouldn't have been tt erm reducing rents, it was done on a much more, more personal sort of scale. -you move into the south which is the area where landlord exploitation might have been at its most intense, where you would expect antagonisms to be greatest, where one would expect that peasants would be actually demanding land reform and, and indeed if you, you go back to, to the you've clearly got that almost spontaneous underlying radicalism because of the, the intense landlord exploitation. -what we're saying on the whole is that we, we are moving south erm militarily we, we now control most of north china, we begin to move on to the into areas of very high tenancy where landlordism was thought to be at its extreme but all we're doing is reducing rents and interest rents. -i think if, if they adopted a policy of erm of struggle last time, i mean they would get to land reform indirectly but i don't think you can erm initiate it from the party as such like because that causes all sorts of problems through definitions and things like that but -yeah i think right but i think the way of analyzing is through just saying you, what are your grievances and then ultimately that will result in landlords being driven out. +you perhaps haven't got the same degree of landlord exploitation, you might, i think one might argue from, from what we said earlier that in the north you've got a s a slightly more paternalistic landlord, it's, it, there's less, less absentee landlordism landlords were more likely to have been behaving within the confines of moral economy wouldn't, wouldn't have been tt erm reducing rents, it was done on a much more, more personal sort of scale. +you move into the south which is the area where landlord exploitation might have been at its most intense, where you would expect antagonisms to be greatest, where one would expect that peasants would be actually demanding land reform and, and indeed if you, you go back to, to the you've clearly got that almost spontaneous underlying radicalism because of the, the intense landlord exploitation. +what we're saying on the whole is that we, we are moving south erm militarily we, we now control most of north china, we begin to move on to the into areas of very high tenancy where landlordism was thought to be at its extreme but all we're doing is reducing rents and interest rents. +i think if, if they adopted a policy of erm of struggle last time, i mean they would get to land reform indirectly but i don't think you can erm initiate it from the party as such like because that causes all sorts of problems through definitions and things like that but +yeah i think right but i think the way of analyzing is through just saying you, what are your grievances and then ultimately that will result in landlords being driven out. right. -so they've learnt that they can't implement land reform unless they've got the support of the popular masses and it's got to come from them cos ultimately they, they're pursuing land reform in order to get the peasant support and if that's not what they want there's no point in just erm imposing it on them. +so they've learnt that they can't implement land reform unless they've got the support of the popular masses and it's got to come from them cos ultimately they, they're pursuing land reform in order to get the peasant support and if that's not what they want there's no point in just erm imposing it on them. you've got to, the peasants have got to be demanding it themselves. alright, so what you've learnt from the experience in north china is that you are actually better off to go in fairly gently mm. -and begin the process and then allow the peasants to kind of take it over, to become involved, to become vocal and to become activated. -and you've got to educate the masses and perhaps instil erm more revolutionaries, sort of a more, a culture that actually sees that they're not gonna gain just material benefits but how that this is in order to advance society forward. +and begin the process and then allow the peasants to kind of take it over, to become involved, to become vocal and to become activated. +and you've got to educate the masses and perhaps instil erm more revolutionaries, sort of a more, a culture that actually sees that they're not gonna gain just material benefits but how that this is in order to advance society forward. mm. yes and take control of them in terms of direction and so on. yes. @@ -67186,10 +67127,10 @@ you're saying it's the, it's the, it's the party that, that erm mobilizes them, that, that you've got to create it for them. i mean by just doing this sort of settling of accounts is that creating it for them? er i mean is that creating a sparkle? -i think i mean it's a, it's a very small sparkle just saying -now's a chance to erm +i think i mean it's a, it's a very small sparkle just saying +now's a chance to erm is, isn't the idea that -most likely to make people believe that they can achieve a certain thing and let them get up and do it and erm so that the party's role is in the initial stage fostering as much mobilization +most likely to make people believe that they can achieve a certain thing and let them get up and do it and erm so that the party's role is in the initial stage fostering as much mobilization yes. creating a common consciousness and then let the peasants go with that. not do actually do the land reform themselves, but to create the conditions whereby they can believe in themselves. @@ -67198,124 +67139,124 @@ so land reform is, is, and this will be very counter to nineteen forty seven, la and this rent reduction, interest rate reduction together with the kind of settling accounts procedure which presumably will come out of this is the means by which you mobilize the masses and once you've got them mobilized, you can then move on to land reform. but it's, it's premature to go for land reform straight away. yeah. -i, i -bring up this point about the masses being were the masses revolutionary or not +i, i +bring up this point about the masses being were the masses revolutionary or not yeah. -and i remember doing my first, one of my first essays erm saying that i didn't think they were and all that they were erm was the fact that er er of and you said to me at the end that's fine as far you've argued it but i think you'll change your views as you go on and i don't know if i have. +and i remember doing my first, one of my first essays erm saying that i didn't think they were and all that they were erm was the fact that er er of and you said to me at the end that's fine as far you've argued it but i think you'll change your views as you go on and i don't know if i have. right . -so erm i don't whether or not i s i still don't think they were ultimately revolutionary, i think they were just erm people who they think were exploiting them at the time sort of erm you know in a certain situation +so erm i don't whether or not i s i still don't think they were ultimately revolutionary, i think they were just erm people who they think were exploiting them at the time sort of erm you know in a certain situation just because they weren't revolutionary doesn't mean that they didn't have the potential to become revolutionary i know. sure. yeah. -and erm it was +and erm it was but they di didn't have the idea of revolution in themselves, they didn't have the idea of overthrowing the landlords themselves. -but maybe cos there was no opportunity, they didn't see there to be i mean like they didn't know any better but as soon as, i mean things are rapidly changing they're given the opportunity to erm i mean through the struggles to actually take charge of the conditions and to gain so some material and perhaps there was beginnings of them seeing that well perhaps we ought to look more to this sub-culture and to erm +but maybe cos there was no opportunity, they didn't see there to be i mean like they didn't know any better but as soon as, i mean things are rapidly changing they're given the opportunity to erm i mean through the struggles to actually take charge of the conditions and to gain so some material and perhaps there was beginnings of them seeing that well perhaps we ought to look more to this sub-culture and to erm well i mean it's change their values. -it's very party initiated isn't it? +it's very party initiated isn't it? the party's giving -putting these ideas into their heads of erm creating a society in which -but then the peasants surely should be able to choose to accept or reject what the party is trying to instil in a way. +putting these ideas into their heads of erm creating a society in which +but then the peasants surely should be able to choose to accept or reject what the party is trying to instil in a way. yeah. but i mean it's the idea, the idea is coming, is not coming from themselves, it's coming from the party that, that er that you can create a system without landlords. -it has to though because if in the pa if they've had this long-term sort of culture for all this time they need to be given ideas but essentially if their traditional values were so strong they would have rejected what the communist party was trying to say, but because they accepted it it meant they ha they did actually have the potential to be revolutionary. -and going on from that surely we argue that the may the fourth directive came about or certainly was, was put out as this is what the peasants three times the peasants had demanded land return i e they were in advance of the party, they were more radical, they, they were, in a way they were saying look this, this rent reduction is not enough we want a much stronger programme, we actually want the land reform. +it has to though because if in the pa if they've had this long-term sort of culture for all this time they need to be given ideas but essentially if their traditional values were so strong they would have rejected what the communist party was trying to say, but because they accepted it it meant they ha they did actually have the potential to be revolutionary. +and going on from that surely we argue that the may the fourth directive came about or certainly was, was put out as this is what the peasants three times the peasants had demanded land return i e they were in advance of the party, they were more radical, they, they were, in a way they were saying look this, this rent reduction is not enough we want a much stronger programme, we actually want the land reform. and that's what the directive says? yes. -well maybe they -but that's, that's entirely logical -the, the more you argue for this economy, and the more you argue no this is, this really is how the peasant felt and he that the peasant really erm didn't have any ideas of changing society at that of the landlord system the more i assume that one would support this kind of rent reduction, interest rate reduction campaign which allows you to slowly build up that mobilization which is necessary. -the,th th th the o the other thing that is i think, i think there is something in this, is that there was, at least within some sections of the peasantry, erm er a, a kind of erm revolutionary zeal which they were building themselves and they were wanting to go beyond the party. -and, and that would derive from cases where landlord exploitation was particularly severe and therefore peasants were saying no rent reduction, interest rate reduction is not enough, we want to go further than that now. +well maybe they +but that's, that's entirely logical +the, the more you argue for this economy, and the more you argue no this is, this really is how the peasant felt and he that the peasant really erm didn't have any ideas of changing society at that of the landlord system the more i assume that one would support this kind of rent reduction, interest rate reduction campaign which allows you to slowly build up that mobilization which is necessary. +the,th th th the o the other thing that is i think, i think there is something in this, is that there was, at least within some sections of the peasantry, erm er a, a kind of erm revolutionary zeal which they were building themselves and they were wanting to go beyond the party. +and, and that would derive from cases where landlord exploitation was particularly severe and therefore peasants were saying no rent reduction, interest rate reduction is not enough, we want to go further than that now. and i think there is that element there. mm. -and you think that's not just a sort of relatively recent phenomenon in the sense of you know, the sort of mid nineteen thirties or you think it's always been there? +and you think that's not just a sort of relatively recent phenomenon in the sense of you know, the sort of mid nineteen thirties or you think it's always been there? you know just an idea -yeah whether or not you whether or not you think it's been induced by the fact that, that they've heard what happened in and they think that they can start doing that as opposed to ch as opposed to just saying we're going to exist by creating -sure, there may be some thinking that, there may also though be er if you move through to the forties you're,y you're twenty years on from the nineteen twenties, you, you've had and you've had deterioration in agricultural conditions er as, as we've seen you've got erm increasing landlord absenteeism, you, you've got a downward, an upward pressure on rent in terms of how much was having to be paid in real terms, all of those things might have come together to, to, to push the peasant over and to push him outside . -it it's it's a possibility +yeah whether or not you whether or not you think it's been induced by the fact that, that they've heard what happened in and they think that they can start doing that as opposed to ch as opposed to just saying we're going to exist by creating +sure, there may be some thinking that, there may also though be er if you move through to the forties you're,y you're twenty years on from the nineteen twenties, you, you've had and you've had deterioration in agricultural conditions er as, as we've seen you've got erm increasing landlord absenteeism, you, you've got a downward, an upward pressure on rent in terms of how much was having to be paid in real terms, all of those things might have come together to, to, to push the peasant over and to push him outside . +it it's it's a possibility mm. -erm i, i don't i, i would be a little unhappy saying the peasant still, in the nineteen forties, was st totally still bound by foreign economy +erm i, i don't i, i would be a little unhappy saying the peasant still, in the nineteen forties, was st totally still bound by foreign economy mm. -but clearly there, there is an element of that, there is an element that they'd gone beyond it that's that that bit is difficult to define and quantify. -what was erm how, how badly was the south by affected by the japanese, i mean what were the peasants likely to have gone through in the last few years? -erm they would not have gone through the same sort of occupation. -erm the japanese presence in the south was, was more just along the coast, they, they, they'd taken the trading ports erm and they had some of the interior but on, on the whole south china had not been dominated by the japanese,th th th their base was very much the north china plain and, and spreading across towards the communist areas . -i mean they cut in through manchuria down the north to, to, across to north china plain, had taken the cities on the eastern seaboard which was what they wanted, i mean th th they really wasn't any point in controlling the rural south, it would have taken so many troops, so much administration if they'd that then they had everything they wanted from the trading ports so there wasn't that japanese presence and so the clearly was different. +but clearly there, there is an element of that, there is an element that they'd gone beyond it that's that that bit is difficult to define and quantify. +what was erm how, how badly was the south by affected by the japanese, i mean what were the peasants likely to have gone through in the last few years? +erm they would not have gone through the same sort of occupation. +erm the japanese presence in the south was, was more just along the coast, they, they, they'd taken the trading ports erm and they had some of the interior but on, on the whole south china had not been dominated by the japanese,th th th their base was very much the north china plain and, and spreading across towards the communist areas . +i mean they cut in through manchuria down the north to, to, across to north china plain, had taken the cities on the eastern seaboard which was what they wanted, i mean th th they really wasn't any point in controlling the rural south, it would have taken so many troops, so much administration if they'd that then they had everything they wanted from the trading ports so there wasn't that japanese presence and so the clearly was different. mm. -so they're not trying to, you know, get themselves back together again having erm you know, the japanese having left and, you know +so they're not trying to, you know, get themselves back together again having erm you know, the japanese having left and, you know the villages have been razed and all that sort of stuff? -er there would have been some cases where that had happened erm and clearly the nationalists had withdrawn from most of southern china into, into south west china and therefore erm th th there'd been er and there was quite a lot of fighting going, still going across south china so i it's not quite the same . +er there would have been some cases where that had happened erm and clearly the nationalists had withdrawn from most of southern china into, into south west china and therefore erm th th there'd been er and there was quite a lot of fighting going, still going across south china so i it's not quite the same . the nationalists don't have so much of hold now over the south. -er they do after, yes th the, the nationalists had moved back across the south after nineteen forty five erm th th they'd, they'd retreated from the japanese progressively after nineteen forty one and abandoned shanghai and etcetera. +er they do after, yes th the, the nationalists had moved back across the south after nineteen forty five erm th th they'd, they'd retreated from the japanese progressively after nineteen forty one and abandoned shanghai and etcetera. they now moved back, in sympathy with the japanese surrender, they moved back and the nationalists took shanghai and really controlled the whole of, of south china again so that the, the old landlord system had been re-established. sorry you were going to say something. -erm no what coming out of this is that how that although one would assume in the south that the peasants ought to be more revolutionary, in actual fact it's the reverse and why is this happening, is it because of the fact that the communist party were in the n that maybe essentially that the peasants in china er were reactionary and worked within the confines of moral economy, but because of the presence of the communist party in the north they became more revolutionary and that's sort of suggested by the success of land reform there and the fact that how, that they can't implement it in the south. -or is it because there's a different culture in the north and south because the, the two parts of china are very different, so you don't know whether it's the communist party that's determining this difference or whether it's just because of a difference of culture there. -and it's, it's difficult for us to tell because we don't have that many regional studies to be able to know exactly what it was that was determining these differences of values. +erm no what coming out of this is that how that although one would assume in the south that the peasants ought to be more revolutionary, in actual fact it's the reverse and why is this happening, is it because of the fact that the communist party were in the n that maybe essentially that the peasants in china er were reactionary and worked within the confines of moral economy, but because of the presence of the communist party in the north they became more revolutionary and that's sort of suggested by the success of land reform there and the fact that how, that they can't implement it in the south. +or is it because there's a different culture in the north and south because the, the two parts of china are very different, so you don't know whether it's the communist party that's determining this difference or whether it's just because of a difference of culture there. +and it's, it's difficult for us to tell because we don't have that many regional studies to be able to know exactly what it was that was determining these differences of values. yes, but there might be some important differences that we would want to bring up, which we, we perhaps could take a bit further. erm there might for example be economic differences. -now tt if you look at it this way,le let's suppose that the communist party was successful in its military campaign and it, it takes military control of south china, which it was beginning to then, and did up to nineteen forty eight -could you, and therefore its political position is becoming increasingly secure erm and the there was no major military threat to land reform. -there was no reason in terms of a a, a military position why you shouldn't have introduced land reform in, in the way that going through and you are moving into an area where as we've seen landlordism was at its -and peasant antagonism ought to have been greatest and therefore you on the face of it it seems surprising doesn't it that land reforms didn't take place immediately, or they weren't attempting land reform to take place immediately. -i mean if, if, if you were looking from outside and you were going to choose an area that you were going introduce land reform you would choose south china wouldn't you? -now is, is the fact that they don't do that, they still go for this rent and interest rate reduction is it because of the experience of the north, they found that the best way in the north was to go for rent reduction, interest rate reduction and then go on, and they were simply taking that experience into the south, but taking it into a different area where it was no longer necessary or appropriate? +now tt if you look at it this way,le let's suppose that the communist party was successful in its military campaign and it, it takes military control of south china, which it was beginning to then, and did up to nineteen forty eight +could you, and therefore its political position is becoming increasingly secure erm and the there was no major military threat to land reform. +there was no reason in terms of a a, a military position why you shouldn't have introduced land reform in, in the way that going through and you are moving into an area where as we've seen landlordism was at its +and peasant antagonism ought to have been greatest and therefore you on the face of it it seems surprising doesn't it that land reforms didn't take place immediately, or they weren't attempting land reform to take place immediately. +i mean if, if, if you were looking from outside and you were going to choose an area that you were going introduce land reform you would choose south china wouldn't you? +now is, is the fact that they don't do that, they still go for this rent and interest rate reduction is it because of the experience of the north, they found that the best way in the north was to go for rent reduction, interest rate reduction and then go on, and they were simply taking that experience into the south, but taking it into a different area where it was no longer necessary or appropriate? mm. -it's not such a pragmatic thing then because -one of things you said earlier on you said when you do become very radical erm it's, the distinctions between become blurred +it's not such a pragmatic thing then because +one of things you said earlier on you said when you do become very radical erm it's, the distinctions between become blurred mm. that erm one of the most important things is to keep up your production right. -and therefore if you're gonna er introduce this radical land reform straight away, i mean say there is no landlord but there's a peasant, or i mean unless the party's ac completely active +and therefore if you're gonna er introduce this radical land reform straight away, i mean say there is no landlord but there's a peasant, or i mean unless the party's ac completely active mm. and they're gonna get hit. right. -and basically what they need to do is create peasant economy to increase production as they learn from the land. +and basically what they need to do is create peasant economy to increase production as they learn from the land. ah right. -so if you go too radical you're gonna hit production, and you're gonna step back which +so if you go too radical you're gonna hit production, and you're gonna step back which right, and are you beginning to say that production is coming to be a more important criteria now? yeah i think so. -well it certainly has but there's still kind of elements of +well it certainly has but there's still kind of elements of i think especially when they find out that there's not much land to go round as they ash assumed. -assume that if you give them a population that owned seventy eight percent of the land and find out fifty percent of the land , then you, you know, you can't just give land, everyone's not just gonna have land, you have to increase production to make everyone better off. +assume that if you give them a population that owned seventy eight percent of the land and find out fifty percent of the land , then you, you know, you can't just give land, everyone's not just gonna have land, you have to increase production to make everyone better off. mm. right. -so whereas in the north the, in a sense the, the main criteria was mobilization as you're moving south in the new situation a new criteria is, is production. +so whereas in the north the, in a sense the, the main criteria was mobilization as you're moving south in the new situation a new criteria is, is production. you need, you need, you need mobilization you need yeah. support, but then even more you need production. yeah. right. -there's also another problem with land reform in i can't really see how they could implement land reform without reverting to similar sorts of they used in which is defining class distinctions and the chaos that that causes and the problems it causes erm it is almost as if , if you go back to erm settling of accounts +there's also another problem with land reform in i can't really see how they could implement land reform without reverting to similar sorts of they used in which is defining class distinctions and the chaos that that causes and the problems it causes erm it is almost as if , if you go back to erm settling of accounts mm. -okay you're erm you're getting rid of your communist ideas you're finding a smoother way to getting erm to achieving a similar sorts of effects -hit the top end get a cross-section o of, but you still get the same, ultimately the same sorts of results erm by, by erm by adopting that policy whereas if you go for trying to draw distinctions, you end up erm -right so it's, yes, so, so, so the danger is, is chaos and the movement gets out of hand and +okay you're erm you're getting rid of your communist ideas you're finding a smoother way to getting erm to achieving a similar sorts of effects +hit the top end get a cross-section o of, but you still get the same, ultimately the same sorts of results erm by, by erm by adopting that policy whereas if you go for trying to draw distinctions, you end up erm +right so it's, yes, so, so, so the danger is, is chaos and the movement gets out of hand and right. one way around that might be then to have enough cadres on the ground in order to, to do it properly. i mean even, in a sense you, you, you're worried about the excesses. yeah. -but also the administration of and trying to rectify the +but also the administration of and trying to rectify the right. right. -s so the, the more you've got, the less that is +s so the, the more you've got, the less that is yeah the, the less but i still think there's a fundamental problem with drawing the distinction right. right. fine. -erm but maybe this, this issue is, is, could be important in the sense that you, you've got tt er if you take china as a whole you've probably got well in excess of a million villages erm you've probably got a denser population in the south than the north so you've got more than half a million villages in the south -okay, and if you're going to conduct land reform you've got to have an effective land reform team to go into each of those villages. -erm so you, you, and you, you're looking of, of land reform teams of four, five members so you're, you're looking at somewhere between two and three million cadres to go into the villages. +erm but maybe this, this issue is, is, could be important in the sense that you, you've got tt er if you take china as a whole you've probably got well in excess of a million villages erm you've probably got a denser population in the south than the north so you've got more than half a million villages in the south +okay, and if you're going to conduct land reform you've got to have an effective land reform team to go into each of those villages. +erm so you, you, and you, you're looking of, of land reform teams of four, five members so you're, you're looking at somewhere between two and three million cadres to go into the villages. and you've got two or three million cadres, trained cadres who know what they're doing, are experienced, who knows what the south is who know what the south is like. -so that there, there may be a, an important personnel problem th th that you realize that well okay the option of going for land reform is, is there but you're saying er it's likely trouble my experience of the past is that, that radical land reform is, is disruptive it could affect production, it could get out of hand, it could alienate people in order to control them we need a lot cadres on the ground and we haven't got them. +so that there, there may be a, an important personnel problem th th that you realize that well okay the option of going for land reform is, is there but you're saying er it's likely trouble my experience of the past is that, that radical land reform is, is disruptive it could affect production, it could get out of hand, it could alienate people in order to control them we need a lot cadres on the ground and we haven't got them. well even if you did have them would it, would it definitely be for the better? i mean they were, they were still so corruptible. -or had that changed were they, were they mo more educated now and less corruptible? +or had that changed were they, were they mo more educated now and less corruptible? who? the cadres. the cadres. @@ -67323,183 +67264,183 @@ because to some extent erm yeah. the rightist and leftist deviations were, were because of them. yes. -er so you would you would need a very heavy rectification programme to sh to ensure, not just that you had enough cadres, but that the cadres were going in with, with the right attitudes. -erm it, that would take time, i mean it's,th that would be very difficult to control. +er so you would you would need a very heavy rectification programme to sh to ensure, not just that you had enough cadres, but that the cadres were going in with, with the right attitudes. +erm it, that would take time, i mean it's,th that would be very difficult to control. yeah. -you're right so it's, so it's not just in terms of the number of the cadre, it's the quality of the cadre, and, and you can't just erm er i mean you can't just pick, you can't you've gotta educate them, create them etcetera, yeah. -in applying that how that they didn't implement land reform because it wasn't viable but if erm another way of looking at it is that how the communist party no longer saw land reform as the best way, means of achieving greater +you're right so it's, so it's not just in terms of the number of the cadre, it's the quality of the cadre, and, and you can't just erm er i mean you can't just pick, you can't you've gotta educate them, create them etcetera, yeah. +in applying that how that they didn't implement land reform because it wasn't viable but if erm another way of looking at it is that how the communist party no longer saw land reform as the best way, means of achieving greater yes. -egalitarianism and that how that increased production was seen as the you know, priority, and so perhaps they would want to just i mean it might seem appear that they were changing their policy to a more moderate land reform but this was not an end in itself it was a means to an end in order to increase production which would benefit the population as a whole, so it's, they still had the same goal +egalitarianism and that how that increased production was seen as the you know, priority, and so perhaps they would want to just i mean it might seem appear that they were changing their policy to a more moderate land reform but this was not an end in itself it was a means to an end in order to increase production which would benefit the population as a whole, so it's, they still had the same goal yeah. which is to achieve greater equality but you're having different means to achieve that. right. it, it, it's a different means to an end, it's a much slower means to an end mm. -in the, in the sense that i if, if you look,i if you adopt a sort of retrospective view, i e if you look back from say anything after nineteen forty nine and you say look, hold on erm this was the final stage of the revolution. -the communists had never been in a better position than they were in in, in nineteen forty eight, the civil war was, was clearly going in their favour erm they were to achieve power within eighteen months and at precisely the point where they had everything going for them, they are adopting the most moderate policy. -if there was any time when radical land reform would have succeeded, it was during nineteen forty eight to nineteen forty nine, and it's precisely that time looking into an area which would seem to be the most favourable for radical land reform, they have not taken that opportunity. +in the, in the sense that i if, if you look,i if you adopt a sort of retrospective view, i e if you look back from say anything after nineteen forty nine and you say look, hold on erm this was the final stage of the revolution. +the communists had never been in a better position than they were in in, in nineteen forty eight, the civil war was, was clearly going in their favour erm they were to achieve power within eighteen months and at precisely the point where they had everything going for them, they are adopting the most moderate policy. +if there was any time when radical land reform would have succeeded, it was during nineteen forty eight to nineteen forty nine, and it's precisely that time looking into an area which would seem to be the most favourable for radical land reform, they have not taken that opportunity. how much control did they have over ? -well they're getting increasing control, increasing control but not and er so yo what you're saying is that, is that even if, if you go back to the reality of nineteen forty eight, actually they didn't realize they were going to get that control as quickly. -they, they were seeing as being an, a longer drawn out struggle +well they're getting increasing control, increasing control but not and er so yo what you're saying is that, is that even if, if you go back to the reality of nineteen forty eight, actually they didn't realize they were going to get that control as quickly. +they, they were seeing as being an, a longer drawn out struggle mm. not, which, one which would not be over in a year and a half. -i mean we've, i mean at that point you've got that was the point where you've got the massive united states aid coming in erm you, you've got erm united states equipping china with all enormous fire power, sending tanks in etcetera, i mean this was the beginning of, of the realization of the united states that, that the communists were a threat and they didn't like it and they, they were putting massive ai aid erm and, and that there was all that united states war machine erm -and this, this other thing as well about erm which is obviously and erm i think what they had in mind was that before you start doing anything radical, before you start having any real land reform at all, you have to ensure that you really have control of that area, he's had this +i mean we've, i mean at that point you've got that was the point where you've got the massive united states aid coming in erm you, you've got erm united states equipping china with all enormous fire power, sending tanks in etcetera, i mean this was the beginning of, of the realization of the united states that, that the communists were a threat and they didn't like it and they, they were putting massive ai aid erm and, and that there was all that united states war machine erm +and this, this other thing as well about erm which is obviously and erm i think what they had in mind was that before you start doing anything radical, before you start having any real land reform at all, you have to ensure that you really have control of that area, he's had this yes, right. -experience of trying to, trying to put through land reform in erm areas which then led to just incredibly bad +experience of trying to, trying to put through land reform in erm areas which then led to just incredibly bad yes. -cos all the sort of people communists they're all just full of hot air and just really get lost +cos all the sort of people communists they're all just full of hot air and just really get lost right. the important lessons they learnt cos at first they thought land reform would enable them to achieve mass mobilization yes. but now they realize that however you need to have mass mobilization in order to have successful land reform right. right. -and so land reform was no longer seen as a means to achieve their end that they that and that it wasn't the best policy to consolidate power, it was you needed to have the mass support there first so that's why land reform was no longer seen as their goal so they didn't take it up at this point when one would expect them to pursue it. +and so land reform was no longer seen as a means to achieve their end that they that and that it wasn't the best policy to consolidate power, it was you needed to have the mass support there first so that's why land reform was no longer seen as their goal so they didn't take it up at this point when one would expect them to pursue it. it's, well it's still a goal but it's one step off? yeah. right. -so, so there are two bits, there's, one is th that you need the the, the, the evidence from the north is that you need mobilization in order to get land reform and the way to get mobilization is rent reduction, interest rate reduction and then sort of the, the struggle meetings and that provides the activism to go to land reforms and the other bit is, is the military one,th that you've learned that if you're going to go through with land reform and keep the support, you've got to make sure you've got your military security first. -erm and because in, even in nineteen forty eight, you couldn't guarantee that +so, so there are two bits, there's, one is th that you need the the, the, the evidence from the north is that you need mobilization in order to get land reform and the way to get mobilization is rent reduction, interest rate reduction and then sort of the, the struggle meetings and that provides the activism to go to land reforms and the other bit is, is the military one,th that you've learned that if you're going to go through with land reform and keep the support, you've got to make sure you've got your military security first. +erm and because in, even in nineteen forty eight, you couldn't guarantee that you were better off to, to play it cautiously. -if you put the two together erm you i it becomes understandable why they, they adopted these policies to the south, even though sort of from what happened the first time particularly in a retrospective way, the expectation would be you would, this would be the are where you would go for land reform straight away. -i mean in, in, in retrospect they probably could've achieved it because they, they got the military er they, they, they did get the military security and you probably could've afforded actually to, to mobilize the peasants through land reform. -i if, if you could have got some cadres on the ground, you know, so, so the other bit of this is is if you are going to go for land reform you've got to have, not just the military presence and military security, but enough trained honest highly motivated cadres. -surely erm part of the problem +if you put the two together erm you i it becomes understandable why they, they adopted these policies to the south, even though sort of from what happened the first time particularly in a retrospective way, the expectation would be you would, this would be the are where you would go for land reform straight away. +i mean in, in, in retrospect they probably could've achieved it because they, they got the military er they, they, they did get the military security and you probably could've afforded actually to, to mobilize the peasants through land reform. +i if, if you could have got some cadres on the ground, you know, so, so the other bit of this is is if you are going to go for land reform you've got to have, not just the military presence and military security, but enough trained honest highly motivated cadres. +surely erm part of the problem ah right. obviously -right so we, we, we also need a new land reform document, because we can't use the because egalitarianism we've, we've recognized from the experience of the north is wrong, that's not gonna work so we need something else. +right so we, we, we also need a new land reform document, because we can't use the because egalitarianism we've, we've recognized from the experience of the north is wrong, that's not gonna work so we need something else. right. fine. so one of the things we're going to, to do is to, to see what that new land reform document might be. before we do that can i just take up one other point. , sorry -two reasons policy, one was the er military secured area -erm what was your question? +two reasons policy, one was the er military secured area +erm what was your question? wouldn't, wouldn't you need the peasant mobilization first? yes. before the land re before you could have successful land reform. sorry i lost my place. erm -erm well th th th yeah but th th th there's, there's the military security you need erm you, you need er tt you've got to have the, the, the personnel to be able to do it +erm well th th th yeah but th th th there's, there's the military security you need erm you, you need er tt you've got to have the, the, the personnel to be able to do it mm. and you've recognized that there are dangers if you, if you try and mobilize people too quickly i i it, it needs to be done slowly. -but is there also the, the, the idea of,a and in a sense one thing you haven't actually got an appropriate land reform -so you have to actually figure a new one out before we can +but is there also the, the, the idea of,a and in a sense one thing you haven't actually got an appropriate land reform +so you have to actually figure a new one out before we can ? -do you have something like a sort of guide book, you know how to conduct -ca can we, that, that's after +do you have something like a sort of guide book, you know how to conduct +ca can we, that, that's after break for coffee. one other thing before that. is, is it possible to argue that the south is fundamentally different in terms of its ? -tt er if, if, if you go back to some of the things we were looking at last term er er this idea of commercialization tt er argue that the south was a very different type of country to the north, that it is commercialized at least to a much greater extent -and i if, i mean i if you take 's argument, if you take 's argument, they are all to do with, with provinces in the south and, and the argument is that here we have, we are looking at a commercialized viable economy and both and and for example are all arguing really that landlordism is not the problem the problem is that you, you, you, you you need to go further in terms of commercialization and that that, and that's the way to go. -i e you're not really looking at a feudal economy in the south any more i it may be a much more heavily commercial capitalist economy and therefore the kind of land reform programme that you might incorporate from a feudal north might not be entirely relevant. -so there might be something in the argument that, that it's not just a, a question of what you've learned from the north, but there may be a recognition that the economy in the south is different, or at least they might be arguing, those who are arguing that the economy in the south is different and that, that reform might not be necessary, it might not even be appropriate in the south. +tt er if, if, if you go back to some of the things we were looking at last term er er this idea of commercialization tt er argue that the south was a very different type of country to the north, that it is commercialized at least to a much greater extent +and i if, i mean i if you take 's argument, if you take 's argument, they are all to do with, with provinces in the south and, and the argument is that here we have, we are looking at a commercialized viable economy and both and and for example are all arguing really that landlordism is not the problem the problem is that you, you, you, you you need to go further in terms of commercialization and that that, and that's the way to go. +i e you're not really looking at a feudal economy in the south any more i it may be a much more heavily commercial capitalist economy and therefore the kind of land reform programme that you might incorporate from a feudal north might not be entirely relevant. +so there might be something in the argument that, that it's not just a, a question of what you've learned from the north, but there may be a recognition that the economy in the south is different, or at least they might be arguing, those who are arguing that the economy in the south is different and that, that reform might not be necessary, it might not even be appropriate in the south. it's a possibility. did the communist party know that though? -cos surely they'd want to try to make peasants see that exploitation was i mean cos there was still an agrarian problem in the south, just because it was more commercialized and economically viable there was still thousands, tens of thousands of people who were starving and stuff so erm did the communist party recognize this difference in the economy, in the economic structure between the north and the south? +cos surely they'd want to try to make peasants see that exploitation was i mean cos there was still an agrarian problem in the south, just because it was more commercialized and economically viable there was still thousands, tens of thousands of people who were starving and stuff so erm did the communist party recognize this difference in the economy, in the economic structure between the north and the south? i mean we can because we've studied it and had all the statistics and stuff. and would they wanted to have believed it. -i don't think they s th th they obviously didn't see it in, in quite the terms that +i don't think they s th th they obviously didn't see it in, in quite the terms that but i think there was an awareness that there was likely to be much more opposition to, to land reform in the south. not s in a sense just by individual feudal landlords, but by landlords saying well i'm, i'm not really feudal anyway, that i've moved on from that, i am a commercial landlord rather than a feudal landlord. this is the difference? mm. -you don't have any of this sort of you have to work -dates that they had sort of like bonds in which they have to work to supply labour for certain dates on their land instead of feudal ties +you don't have any of this sort of you have to work +dates that they had sort of like bonds in which they have to work to supply labour for certain dates on their land instead of feudal ties exactly. yeah, yes. -as opposed to that was a part of being a tenant, you know, for the honour of you pay me rent but you also come and work on my land for how many days +as opposed to that was a part of being a tenant, you know, for the honour of you pay me rent but you also come and work on my land for how many days but as such just because you're hiring people that's still going to be, in marxist terms, seen as exploitation. right. -but it might be in but it, it is, it is -i i that was right,th th th there is a i that they could be, if you like, capitalist landlords and feudal landlords. -now capitalist landlords might be the development certainly in terms of production you, you might be disrupting a viable, commercial, capitalist orientated economy, and would you really want to do that? -well no if you tried to then you, you'd be in some difficulty rules which, you know +but it might be in but it, it is, it is +i i that was right,th th th there is a i that they could be, if you like, capitalist landlords and feudal landlords. +now capitalist landlords might be the development certainly in terms of production you, you might be disrupting a viable, commercial, capitalist orientated economy, and would you really want to do that? +well no if you tried to then you, you'd be in some difficulty rules which, you know yes. -commercial industrial society +commercial industrial society yeah. yeah. -and it might also be that +and it might also be that the landlords in saigon are if you like more commercial, more capitalist, it might be they were better organized than landlords in the north. i mean th th th the clan links in the south were much stronger than they were in the north, and therefore there might be even greater commercial landlord opposition to land reform than there had been in the north. was the south not more erm densely populated as well? yes. yeah. -so you'd end up putting much smaller sort of bits of land +so you'd end up putting much smaller sort of bits of land yes. for each peasant which is going to harm production too. so there's gonna be less there's, there's less inequality or -there's a greater pressure of population therefore are you saying that, that land reform might at least on the model tried in the north, might not yield any economic benefits +there's a greater pressure of population therefore are you saying that, that land reform might at least on the model tried in the north, might not yield any economic benefits mm. -in terms that, that th th the erm land to released would be relatively small? +in terms that, that th th the erm land to released would be relatively small? yes. right. -so the economic gains from land reform in the south might not be that great. +so the economic gains from land reform in the south might not be that great. i mean you, the, the more you argue the south is a viable economic system, the less there is to gain from land reform. -erm -and stuff like that -i mean the amount of land each family will get if you redistribute land, then the land for the family is not gonna be able to support the family. +erm +and stuff like that +i mean the amount of land each family will get if you redistribute land, then the land for the family is not gonna be able to support the family. right. but yeah. yes mm. yes. -erm i, i think i might have missed adam's point and i was going back to whether the south was more efficient than the north because just tying it in with the seminar we had on managerial farms, weren't there more in the north than in the south? +erm i, i think i might have missed adam's point and i was going back to whether the south was more efficient than the north because just tying it in with the seminar we had on managerial farms, weren't there more in the north than in the south? and so then that would just prove that how, managerial farms weren't that much more efficient? er i think those are separate issues. -you, you, you're right to say that on the whole there, the managerial farms were in, in the north, although there w there was clearly some in the south +you, you, you're right to say that on the whole there, the managerial farms were in, in the north, although there w there was clearly some in the south mm. -erm i don't think this in itself said anything about level of efficiency of managerial farms. -erm i think it's, it's saying more about how how we categorize this economy in the south, it clearly, it, it's not a managerial +erm i don't think this in itself said anything about level of efficiency of managerial farms. +erm i think it's, it's saying more about how how we categorize this economy in the south, it clearly, it, it's not a managerial mm. -erm but that, the fact that there were managerial farms in the north might erm have er er important implications for the kind of land reform document we would want to draw to accommodate the situation in the north as well. -yeah my problem is just erm having said that we don't think land reform should go ahead in the south because it's a fairly efficient set up +erm but that, the fact that there were managerial farms in the north might erm have er er important implications for the kind of land reform document we would want to draw to accommodate the situation in the north as well. +yeah my problem is just erm having said that we don't think land reform should go ahead in the south because it's a fairly efficient set up mm. -then the, the main problem is rent because presumably it all, all starts being creamed off the top so, okay you don't have to redistribute land, but you can still get rid of the landlords and the people who are erm taking away the surplus +then the, the main problem is rent because presumably it all, all starts being creamed off the top so, okay you don't have to redistribute land, but you can still get rid of the landlords and the people who are erm taking away the surplus right. from, from the , you could either do it by a method of taxing landlords so heavily yes. -that it's barely worth their while to erm to employ try and get rid of them by doing that er which er which means that there shouldn't be redistribution of land that much and therefore +that it's barely worth their while to erm to employ try and get rid of them by doing that er which er which means that there shouldn't be redistribution of land that much and therefore right. -s yes so rent reduction will, could make a significant difference in the south because you've essentially got a landlord tenant society +s yes so rent reduction will, could make a significant difference in the south because you've essentially got a landlord tenant society yeah. and you, it might open the way for peaceful land reform yeah. mm. -i mean if, if you er er the whole experience of was that you could get rent reduction and interest rate reduction relatively peacefully so you wouldn't get disruption etcetera and you wouldn't get disruption and what, what you might come to recognize as a more , a more viable agricultural system. -so peaceful land reform based around rent reduction, interest rate reduction, might be the ultimate strategy for given your learning process in the north, given the nature of the economy in the south. -so if you, i mean, to go back to our initial proposition, whilst on the face of it it seems curious that in the area in south china where one would expect land reform to be easiest to achieve the communists adopt a much more moderate, slower, cautious policy but for a whole variety of reasons we, we're, we're tending towards the view that that would be the most appropriate anyway. +i mean if, if you er er the whole experience of was that you could get rent reduction and interest rate reduction relatively peacefully so you wouldn't get disruption etcetera and you wouldn't get disruption and what, what you might come to recognize as a more , a more viable agricultural system. +so peaceful land reform based around rent reduction, interest rate reduction, might be the ultimate strategy for given your learning process in the north, given the nature of the economy in the south. +so if you, i mean, to go back to our initial proposition, whilst on the face of it it seems curious that in the area in south china where one would expect land reform to be easiest to achieve the communists adopt a much more moderate, slower, cautious policy but for a whole variety of reasons we, we're, we're tending towards the view that that would be the most appropriate anyway. yeah. right. and er so, so, so we are er ou out of this it's er we're still, we're still committed to land reform are we? -we st we still want to achieve land reform because that ultimately is, is going to be the only way of ensuring that we end feudalism and the proper benefits go to the poor. +we st we still want to achieve land reform because that ultimately is, is going to be the only way of ensuring that we end feudalism and the proper benefits go to the poor. so we, we, we've got in a sense this holding exercise of rent reduction, interest rate reduction but we are going to need a new land reform document to take us through, i mean certainly once we get to nineteen forty nine and we are in power,th th we, we are gonna want land reform aren't we? mm. sure, do, we do need land reform? isn't it? right. -okay so we are,w w we're now in a position of, certainly by nineteen forty nine we're, we're on the verge of power, we want l we, land reform is not taking place any more, there are still some areas in the north it hasn't taken place out in the far north west it hasn't taken place, so we, we, we are going to need a new land reform document based on all the experience we've got which will carry us through and, and it's really that land reform document, document that we are going to implement for the whole of china, and it's going to be that document which really is going to abolish feudalism and create some sort of equality. -well let's have some coffee and then come back and +okay so we are,w w we're now in a position of, certainly by nineteen forty nine we're, we're on the verge of power, we want l we, land reform is not taking place any more, there are still some areas in the north it hasn't taken place out in the far north west it hasn't taken place, so we, we, we are going to need a new land reform document based on all the experience we've got which will carry us through and, and it's really that land reform document, document that we are going to implement for the whole of china, and it's going to be that document which really is going to abolish feudalism and create some sort of equality. +well let's have some coffee and then come back and we've gotta devise a new land reform law. what's our priority? -what, what, what really is the land reform to achieve now? +what, what, what really is the land reform to achieve now? of feudalism you've gotta right. yeah. protect commerce and industry. protect commerce and industry. -yeah, i guess it's all -just looked after go on. -erm well erm it's that +yeah, i guess it's all +just looked after go on. +erm well erm it's that yeah. -we are now in power but i don't think that presumably proved that we can run an economy efficiently +we are now in power but i don't think that presumably proved that we can run an economy efficiently mm. and once we've got that then we have the resources from that i think to introduce other programmes that take @@ -67510,78 +67451,78 @@ erm wh when you're saying to run the economy, do you mean the rural economy or the economy, you know, china as a whole? well let's say we've moved on to and we're into nineteen forty nine say yeah. -and we've in nineteen forty nine -and w w w we are either half controlled or we're, we can now see that you know the civil war is, is going so quickly our way that we are going to have control within a year or so we are likely to have control over the economy as a whole. +and we've in nineteen forty nine +and w w w we are either half controlled or we're, we can now see that you know the civil war is, is going so quickly our way that we are going to have control within a year or so we are likely to have control over the economy as a whole. d does that begin to make a difference? yes because now right. yes. so we then have to coordinate our policies mm. -erm this is going to be really hard work . -it's got, i mean, surely the, the middle peasants or even the rich peasants the group of people that are gonna be most productive in the economy erm so you know your reform has to be fairly moderate in that sense that they have to be able to promote +erm this is going to be really hard work . +it's got, i mean, surely the, the middle peasants or even the rich peasants the group of people that are gonna be most productive in the economy erm so you know your reform has to be fairly moderate in that sense that they have to be able to promote right. economic growth and, and right. so in a very broad sense agriculture is going to have to con contribute to china's, china as a whole's economic development mm. i e to, to, and will contribute to china's industrialization because once we are in control industrialization will be necessary. -so agriculture will have to play a role in that and therefore we want to increase agricultural output and in order to do that you want to protect the middle and rich peasants who are the most efficient producers, or i e managerial farms if, if they are more efficient, you want to, if you want it would not make sense to take land away from rich peasants in order to give to poor peasants when rich peasants might be more efficient producers. -well it depends how quickly the poor peasants can achieve more efficiency how quickly they can do that. +so agriculture will have to play a role in that and therefore we want to increase agricultural output and in order to do that you want to protect the middle and rich peasants who are the most efficient producers, or i e managerial farms if, if they are more efficient, you want to, if you want it would not make sense to take land away from rich peasants in order to give to poor peasants when rich peasants might be more efficient producers. +well it depends how quickly the poor peasants can achieve more efficiency how quickly they can do that. right. -yes, so, so, so you're taking decisions in terms of well which are the most efficient +yes, so, so, so you're taking decisions in terms of well which are the most efficient within the countryside and how can we create those m those . -that er that, that, i mean that efficiency thing is becoming an important consideration in a way which we, we, we've not mentioned before. +that er that, that, i mean that efficiency thing is becoming an important consideration in a way which we, we, we've not mentioned before. mm. -well i mean surely it's, that's the point now is to try to make a fair erm law and one that is ideologically erm designed seeing we've got to power, or we've got certainty of obtaining power, therefore land ownership has got to be land ownership which has been capitalism marxist +well i mean surely it's, that's the point now is to try to make a fair erm law and one that is ideologically erm designed seeing we've got to power, or we've got certainty of obtaining power, therefore land ownership has got to be land ownership which has been capitalism marxist so th th is becoming more complex. -i i in the past our aim with land reform has been very largely erm we want to end feudalism and we want to maximize mobilization we, we're now saying okay we, we still want to those, but we, we've also got to ensure that somehow we have a land law which ensures that agriculture will play a role in china's industrialization and so we will get maximum efficiency from the agricultural sector as well as mobilization, as well as ending feudalism. -er er we could say that we've got a much bigger range of aims and does that mean that we are more likely to have -it's going to be very difficult isn't it, for us to be able to achieve all of those aims at the same time. -well er i mean well things like communal ownership advocate them to be reforms -you can move beyond the efficiencies of erm of the erm managerial systems or the existing systems by erm creating, you could do coll collectives and then using state support to erm bring in erm more capital -you reckon state collectives do you? -well well you, you can advocate erm mutual aid and all these sorts of things which erm which are erm a step towards, i mean i'm not saying they're directly -you can encourage it without how the +i i in the past our aim with land reform has been very largely erm we want to end feudalism and we want to maximize mobilization we, we're now saying okay we, we still want to those, but we, we've also got to ensure that somehow we have a land law which ensures that agriculture will play a role in china's industrialization and so we will get maximum efficiency from the agricultural sector as well as mobilization, as well as ending feudalism. +er er we could say that we've got a much bigger range of aims and does that mean that we are more likely to have +it's going to be very difficult isn't it, for us to be able to achieve all of those aims at the same time. +well er i mean well things like communal ownership advocate them to be reforms +you can move beyond the efficiencies of erm of the erm managerial systems or the existing systems by erm creating, you could do coll collectives and then using state support to erm bring in erm more capital +you reckon state collectives do you? +well well you, you can advocate erm mutual aid and all these sorts of things which erm which are erm a step towards, i mean i'm not saying they're directly +you can encourage it without how the right. agricultural system works. -so you might actually want to put something of that in to your land reform +so you might actually want to put something of that in to your land reform yeah and, and you can have erm through loans etcetera you can start increasing right. capital which yes. -you could get into a situation which is beyond managerial farms anyway because you've got more capital +you could get into a situation which is beyond managerial farms anyway because you've got more capital are they gonna have the resources to do that though? from the government. ha? -it's from the gov the government +it's from the gov the government but where does the government get the money from? -the same place it got the the erm tt the money for -twenty er twenty or something in, in loans. +the same place it got the the erm tt the money for +twenty er twenty or something in, in loans. well -i dunno -wouldn't you, and that's what's -well yeah -right questions er on that , yeah, okay. -erm going back to your point, we, we are operating within the context of a new democracy, right, which is, is, is broadly a kind of democratic approach erm i e that it's, it's an indication of a sort of the bourgeois revolution but within that you're saying it's not just a democratic revolution, it's a new democratic revolution and within that there will be elements of socialism being created. -so we, we are not just creating capitalism per se we are building in that direction er but there will be elements of socialism there which we can then build on and take us forward. +i dunno +wouldn't you, and that's what's +well yeah +right questions er on that , yeah, okay. +erm going back to your point, we, we are operating within the context of a new democracy, right, which is, is, is broadly a kind of democratic approach erm i e that it's, it's an indication of a sort of the bourgeois revolution but within that you're saying it's not just a democratic revolution, it's a new democratic revolution and within that there will be elements of socialism being created. +so we, we are not just creating capitalism per se we are building in that direction er but there will be elements of socialism there which we can then build on and take us forward. so our, our land reform is going to have to reflect that so you would expect to see elements, perhaps, of socialisms being created. okay. -so, so th th that would be some of the thinking which would lie behind sitting down and, and and drawing up a, a reform document a land reform document, in the very late nineteen forties. -sh i mean to, to my mind, shouldn't the land ownership possibly one of the key issues cos that is if you have land ownership and then you're just paving the way for the new capitalist society and to, you know,according to marxist theory which i think is a pretty dodgy one,they have to go from capitalism to achieve socialism +so, so th th that would be some of the thinking which would lie behind sitting down and, and and drawing up a, a reform document a land reform document, in the very late nineteen forties. +sh i mean to, to my mind, shouldn't the land ownership possibly one of the key issues cos that is if you have land ownership and then you're just paving the way for the new capitalist society and to, you know,according to marxist theory which i think is a pretty dodgy one,they have to go from capitalism to achieve socialism right. -socialists , which is just a load of rubbish if you ask +socialists , which is just a load of rubbish if you ask okay. -but, but, but, but our experience of the past +but, but, but, but our experience of the past did not get the peasants to support us unless we give them that. yeah. that's right, so that's what i'm -saying if, if +saying if, if want to do that abolish land ownership then it would suggest they're going for a ideologically based right. -land reform, if they don't it's suggesting it's just another means of obtaining power by fragmenting -erm or, or a pragmatic in terms of erm you want to minimize disruption, you actually want to get production going and the way to get production going is to give the peasants the land themselves. +land reform, if they don't it's suggesting it's just another means of obtaining power by fragmenting +erm or, or a pragmatic in terms of erm you want to minimize disruption, you actually want to get production going and the way to get production going is to give the peasants the land themselves. yeah, that's right. which isn't really erm compatible with social with communism. i don't see how you can argue it is, i don't see how anyone can. @@ -67595,25 +67536,25 @@ but i mean feudalism okay. it's hardly communism is it? erm no, but you're, at least you're getting out of feudalism. -well yeah but capitalism +well yeah but capitalism but you can't go straight for socialism or communism. well that's what they said but why not? because i mean that's just rubbish, they said you have to go to -capitalism and then, then naturally evolve into socialism communism. -well, but we, no we're not saying that, what we're saying is that we so all we're trying,w w w that they were saying we can't go from cap er from feudalism to socialism but we don't want to go just from feudalism to capitalism, we want to go into er if you like a capitalism with socialist characteristics. +capitalism and then, then naturally evolve into socialism communism. +well, but we, no we're not saying that, what we're saying is that we so all we're trying,w w w that they were saying we can't go from cap er from feudalism to socialism but we don't want to go just from feudalism to capitalism, we want to go into er if you like a capitalism with socialist characteristics. we, we want there to be elements of socialism built into the capitalism we're creating which will allow us to go straight into, to socialism in the future. mm -and supposed to see the superiority of socialism in this capitalist -what socialism anyway? -well there was a, there was a debate or something and that's when the committee -erm i'm not sh w w well would you really have, have, have worried about that at the time?getting out of feudalism then why exactly how you're gonna go from there. -i mean as long you are going in a way which is setting up getting through to socialism as soon as possible, i'm not sure there would be any point in thinking about those issues until you've got a bit further. -i mean i'm, i i dunno. -i was just, i mean did they really believe that it would, it would just lead straight on to socialism? -i, i, i think they probably believed that, that, that the best way to get into socialism was to begin to create socialist elements from the start, that would facilitate the move erm and once you'd got full control, i mean this is where, where there might be kind of bits you can say that once, once we, we need to make these assurances to get us out of feudalism. -once we, once we are out of feudalism and once we have political control we can dictate wherever we want to go and once we've got full control we will go into socialism. -but as of, as of nineteen forty eight forty nine, if you'd said you'd gone into a village, right you guys we're going into socialism, we are gonna create collective farming the peasants would have said no. +and supposed to see the superiority of socialism in this capitalist +what socialism anyway? +well there was a, there was a debate or something and that's when the committee +erm i'm not sh w w well would you really have, have, have worried about that at the time?getting out of feudalism then why exactly how you're gonna go from there. +i mean as long you are going in a way which is setting up getting through to socialism as soon as possible, i'm not sure there would be any point in thinking about those issues until you've got a bit further. +i mean i'm, i i dunno. +i was just, i mean did they really believe that it would, it would just lead straight on to socialism? +i, i, i think they probably believed that, that, that the best way to get into socialism was to begin to create socialist elements from the start, that would facilitate the move erm and once you'd got full control, i mean this is where, where there might be kind of bits you can say that once, once we, we need to make these assurances to get us out of feudalism. +once we, once we are out of feudalism and once we have political control we can dictate wherever we want to go and once we've got full control we will go into socialism. +but as of, as of nineteen forty eight forty nine, if you'd said you'd gone into a village, right you guys we're going into socialism, we are gonna create collective farming the peasants would have said no. so there position in nineteen forty nine wasn't re in effect all that secure cos no. of the personnel that @@ -67621,224 +67562,224 @@ right. i mean th th th th they were on the way to military security, but were they going, they, they, they recognized they had to carry the population with them. i think there, there was a genuine democratic element to this that, that it,i i i it wasn't going to be forcible socialism, it was going to be socialism which would come naturally because that would be what the population wanted. mm. -and that, that would come gradually. -well you, you could do the sort of token gesture of giving them the land like they did in the past, at least that's showing what some sort of communism +and that, that would come gradually. +well you, you could do the sort of token gesture of giving them the land like they did in the past, at least that's showing what some sort of communism in order to get the support, yes, and to or in order to end feudalism, which was, was the, the priority. after that it's anybody's guess. okay. -let's, let's have a look at the, the document -so have you all got one you can you can see ? -so, article one feudal exploitation by the landlord class shall be abolished and the system of peasant land ownership shall be introduced in order to set free the rural productive forces, develop agricultural production and thus pave the way for new china's industrialization . -so that the, the, the two main aims are, are stressed there, you are gonna end feudal exploitation and you are going to create a new system which will set free the force of rural production in order to pave the way for new china's industrialization. -so for, for the first time the revolution is given an economic goal in that it is to set up industrialization and in a sense the ending of feudalism and the creation of industrialization emerge as, as the two forces whereas up until now it has been feudalism perhaps egalitarianism. -so it's we, we've already, that, that already has changed significantly. -er you've then got a series on confiscation confiscation and retribution of land, so article two, land, draught animals, farm implements and surplus grain the landlords surplus houses shall be confiscated. +let's, let's have a look at the, the document +so have you all got one you can you can see ? +so, article one feudal exploitation by the landlord class shall be abolished and the system of peasant land ownership shall be introduced in order to set free the rural productive forces, develop agricultural production and thus pave the way for new china's industrialization . +so that the, the, the two main aims are, are stressed there, you are gonna end feudal exploitation and you are going to create a new system which will set free the force of rural production in order to pave the way for new china's industrialization. +so for, for the first time the revolution is given an economic goal in that it is to set up industrialization and in a sense the ending of feudalism and the creation of industrialization emerge as, as the two forces whereas up until now it has been feudalism perhaps egalitarianism. +so it's we, we've already, that, that already has changed significantly. +er you've then got a series on confiscation confiscation and retribution of land, so article two, land, draught animals, farm implements and surplus grain the landlords surplus houses shall be confiscated. other, other property shall not be confiscated so you're gonna take all the land, animals, implements from the landlords, you're gonna take their surplus grain, their surplus houses into the countryside but, but nothing else you, you're gonna take from landlords. -er you're gonna take in rural land belonging to, to shrines, temples, monasteries, churches, schools, organizations etcetera etcetera etcetera industry and commerce shall be protected from infringement, industrial and commercial enterprises operated by landlords and the land and properties used by landlords to greater industrial shall not be confiscated erm you, you're worried that if you confiscate them they're simply broken up between people and those productory forces are disbanded. -so you, you, you're taking landlords farm assets, but you're not taking their industrial, commercial or urban assets at all. -and then er revolutionary armament d dependents, farmers, workers, staff professional workers, peddlers and others who rent out small pro portions of land because they're engaged in other occupations, or because they lack the labour power, shall not be classified as landlords. -if the average per capita of land held in such does not exceed two hundred percent of the average per capita land held in the locality it shall remain untouched. -so there's a group within the village that you are going to allow to own twice the average +er you're gonna take in rural land belonging to, to shrines, temples, monasteries, churches, schools, organizations etcetera etcetera etcetera industry and commerce shall be protected from infringement, industrial and commercial enterprises operated by landlords and the land and properties used by landlords to greater industrial shall not be confiscated erm you, you're worried that if you confiscate them they're simply broken up between people and those productory forces are disbanded. +so you, you, you're taking landlords farm assets, but you're not taking their industrial, commercial or urban assets at all. +and then er revolutionary armament d dependents, farmers, workers, staff professional workers, peddlers and others who rent out small pro portions of land because they're engaged in other occupations, or because they lack the labour power, shall not be classified as landlords. +if the average per capita of land held in such does not exceed two hundred percent of the average per capita land held in the locality it shall remain untouched. +so there's a group within the village that you are going to allow to own twice the average so you're enshrining inequality within it. -is there a a sort of suggestion of reward here? -you know there's some tenants -well, er sure but what about commercial workers and peddlers and others who +is there a a sort of suggestion of reward here? +you know there's some tenants +well, er sure but what about commercial workers and peddlers and others who but there's already inequality by not stripping the landlords of anything but yeah. -tt and then we come to rich peasants, land owned by rich peasants and cultivi cultivated by themselves or hired labour and their other properties shall be protected from infringement. -so anything that the landlo er the rich peasant owns and works himself or cultivates by hired labour you're going to allow to keep. +tt and then we come to rich peasants, land owned by rich peasants and cultivi cultivated by themselves or hired labour and their other properties shall be protected from infringement. +so anything that the landlo er the rich peasant owns and works himself or cultivates by hired labour you're going to allow to keep. and, over and above that, small portions of land rented out by rich peasants shall remain un untouched. -in certain special areas the land rented out by rich peasants may be requisitioned in part or in whole with the approval of the people's government at level or above. -you special permission to encroach on all of the rich peasant's land he rents out. +in certain special areas the land rented out by rich peasants may be requisitioned in part or in whole with the approval of the people's government at level or above. +you special permission to encroach on all of the rich peasant's land he rents out. why do they use the word requisition instead of confiscate? does requisitioning have the same connotations as confiscation? -so they are they're being harsher on landlords but on the rich peasants they're just taking back the land instead of -requisition, if you're in the position say then it's like it's for a common cause +so they are they're being harsher on landlords but on the rich peasants they're just taking back the land instead of +requisition, if you're in the position say then it's like it's for a common cause mm. -if you take away some of the land confiscate's a punishment. +if you take away some of the land confiscate's a punishment. yeah. at the end of the day the effect is the same. so i it's another, well it may, the effect may be the same but it's another way of drawing distinctions between landlords and rich peasants and you are treating landlords differently from rich peasants. -and then the last is if the portions of land rented out by rich peasants of a semi-landlord type exceed in size the land held by themselves and by their hired labour the land rented out shall be requisitioned. -but that would seem to imply that only if a rich peasant rents out more land than he owns and works either by himself or hired labour, he will be able to keep that all. -so a rich peasant will be able to keep all of the land he was working himself, all the land he was working by hired labour and land that he hired, er that he rented out as long as the amount he, he rented out did not exceed all of the land that he worked himself or used hired labour. +and then the last is if the portions of land rented out by rich peasants of a semi-landlord type exceed in size the land held by themselves and by their hired labour the land rented out shall be requisitioned. +but that would seem to imply that only if a rich peasant rents out more land than he owns and works either by himself or hired labour, he will be able to keep that all. +so a rich peasant will be able to keep all of the land he was working himself, all the land he was working by hired labour and land that he hired, er that he rented out as long as the amount he, he rented out did not exceed all of the land that he worked himself or used hired labour. pretty generous position for rich peasants isn't it? -that's not clear exactly what that last bit says cos it's not saying like you all of the land they rent out, but i guess it just means the excess above which +that's not clear exactly what that last bit says cos it's not saying like you all of the land they rent out, but i guess it just means the excess above which right. i think if i was a rich peasant i would be using that to argue that you could take my rented land, it was well so would i. -a leftist nut-case might -right, yeah but fine. +a leftist nut-case might +right, yeah but fine. but i mean th there is, if, i mean , that is generous to rich peasants. -it also sort of encourages them to farm as much land as they can to presumably rent more out. +it also sort of encourages them to farm as much land as they can to presumably rent more out. yeah. right. land and other properties of middle peasants, including well to do middle peasants, shall be protected from infringement. so we, we, we're still working to middle peasants being able to earn twenty five or thirty percent of their income from exploitation, either hired labour or renting out land and we won't touch it at all. -so the, the the only land that we are taking in is landlord land and the land that rich peasants rent out over and above, if er in size larger than the land they are going to continue to work, either themselves or with hired labour. +so the, the the only land that we are taking in is landlord land and the land that rich peasants rent out over and above, if er in size larger than the land they are going to continue to work, either themselves or with hired labour. er we're not, we're not touching middle peasants at all, they're sacrosanct. -so they're still, they were still keeping to their aims of achieving greater equality, it was just not absolute equality egalitarianism. -that is you, you, you're miles away from absolute egalitarianism. +so they're still, they were still keeping to their aims of achieving greater equality, it was just not absolute equality egalitarianism. +that is you, you, you're miles away from absolute egalitarianism. but to rich peasant economy. -this rich peasant economy ought to benefit the population as a whole because it's increasing production and erm if it becomes more efficient then the rents won't have to so high the poor peo poor people benefit. -yeah but the only thing you're really doing is, is taking away this nominal erm exploitive relationship, you're still gonna be exploiting the of existing +this rich peasant economy ought to benefit the population as a whole because it's increasing production and erm if it becomes more efficient then the rents won't have to so high the poor peo poor people benefit. +yeah but the only thing you're really doing is, is taking away this nominal erm exploitive relationship, you're still gonna be exploiting the of existing mm. -and you might, you might but there's still gonna be erm be certain divisions in the society perpetuating. +and you might, you might but there's still gonna be erm be certain divisions in the society perpetuating. i actually think it's, it's, okay it's a more equal society, but it is by no means an equal society you're creating. -so i mean well let's go on then. -the distribution of land, all land under of production confiscate with the exception of those to be nationalized to be taken over by the peasant association, the unified -distribution to poverty stricken peasants who their land . -production landlords should be given an equal share so that they can make their living by their own labour and thus reform themselves through labour. -er land should be distributed by taking village as a single unit, that should be distributed in a unified manner according to the population therein based on the principle of allotting the land to its present tiller and making necessary readjustments in land held by taking into consideration the amount, the quality and location of land. -so i it, it's the old nous quantity and quality coming in there. -er but basically you're going to give land back to the people who are tilling it because that's what they, they have an attachment to. -er and then going on to article twelve under the principle +so i mean well let's go on then. +the distribution of land, all land under of production confiscate with the exception of those to be nationalized to be taken over by the peasant association, the unified +distribution to poverty stricken peasants who their land . +production landlords should be given an equal share so that they can make their living by their own labour and thus reform themselves through labour. +er land should be distributed by taking village as a single unit, that should be distributed in a unified manner according to the population therein based on the principle of allotting the land to its present tiller and making necessary readjustments in land held by taking into consideration the amount, the quality and location of land. +so i it, it's the old nous quantity and quality coming in there. +er but basically you're going to give land back to the people who are tilling it because that's what they, they have an attachment to. +er and then going on to article twelve under the principle of allotting land to the present tiller, land owned by the tiller should not be drawn upon for redistribution. when rented land is drawn upon for distribution proper consideration sh should be given to the present tiller. -land he acquires through distribution plus his home land shall be slightly and suitably more than the land held in arbitrary distribution of the peasants who had little or no land. -should be the present tiller should re retain the approximate average per capita land, land holding in the in the locality. -so if you already own land you would end up with a larger unit than if you owned no land before. -so we are looking at creating a society with our rich peasants who are going to own significantly more than whatever the average is going to be, and significantly more than middle peasants. -we've then got well to do middle peasants, we've got middle peasants who would in turn -own more than a part-owner, part-tenant before the revolution, who after the revolution would own more than a full tenant before the revolution. +land he acquires through distribution plus his home land shall be slightly and suitably more than the land held in arbitrary distribution of the peasants who had little or no land. +should be the present tiller should re retain the approximate average per capita land, land holding in the in the locality. +so if you already own land you would end up with a larger unit than if you owned no land before. +so we are looking at creating a society with our rich peasants who are going to own significantly more than whatever the average is going to be, and significantly more than middle peasants. +we've then got well to do middle peasants, we've got middle peasants who would in turn +own more than a part-owner, part-tenant before the revolution, who after the revolution would own more than a full tenant before the revolution. maintaining differentials -well basically, apart from landlords and the +well basically, apart from landlords and the peasants, there's er something for everybody. yes. -but landlords, oh no but they +but landlords, oh no but they lan lan er and landlords get some land. mm. mm. -so you are about as far away from absolute egalitarianism as you can get, you are actually enshrining -you are creating a system within the countryside which is based on inequality. -and then there's a, a series of er oh and they add er er during the people's governments or at or above the may in accordance with the local land agency set apart certain land bound to be nationalized and used for the establishment of experimental farms or one or more county's or model state farms, so there's provision for the creation of so a form of socialism over the countryside but it's, it comes a long way down the list. +so you are about as far away from absolute egalitarianism as you can get, you are actually enshrining +you are creating a system within the countryside which is based on inequality. +and then there's a, a series of er oh and they add er er during the people's governments or at or above the may in accordance with the local land agency set apart certain land bound to be nationalized and used for the establishment of experimental farms or one or more county's or model state farms, so there's provision for the creation of so a form of socialism over the countryside but it's, it comes a long way down the list. quite token isn't it? and very token, mm. -so our final document when, and this is, this is issued in june nineteen fifty, we are in power, we are a communist government and our land reform is one which enshrines inequalities, it protects middle peasants it in effect minimizes what it can give to the poor. +so our final document when, and this is, this is issued in june nineteen fifty, we are in power, we are a communist government and our land reform is one which enshrines inequalities, it protects middle peasants it in effect minimizes what it can give to the poor. there is, there is no egalitarianism whatsoever. there is very little provision, there is, there is token provision for the creation of socialism. and, and this is what revolution has produced. at precisely the point where we could have been at our most radical we are at our least radical, this is the least radical document that we've come across. are you happy with this? -not particularly but i understand that er it is, you now have the whole of china which small areas erm relatively small areas, you've now got the whole thing, i mean if you start initiating very radical reforms, as you say you don't have the personnel or the resources to erm to prevent a, you know, a big change disruption. +not particularly but i understand that er it is, you now have the whole of china which small areas erm relatively small areas, you've now got the whole thing, i mean if you start initiating very radical reforms, as you say you don't have the personnel or the resources to erm to prevent a, you know, a big change disruption. yeah presumably you've gotta start somewhere haven't you? -you know you've gotta start somewhere, you can't just , you've gotta start somewhere -yeah but the +you know you've gotta start somewhere, you can't just , you've gotta start somewhere +yeah but the establish the principles this is where you want to start then? what? no that's what i'm saying -i'm saying that you know you, you should er perhaps try to establish some underlying principles to your policy. -but isn't there, isn't there a big difference between sort of recognizing the faults of past land reforms and advocating something like this? +i'm saying that you know you, you should er perhaps try to establish some underlying principles to your policy. +but isn't there, isn't there a big difference between sort of recognizing the faults of past land reforms and advocating something like this? why? i mean it's not merely recognizing that past land reforms didn't work, it's a totally different policy. th th th this in effect is creating capitalism in the countryside. mm. you've got private owned , you've got inequalities. -so the +so the creates capitalism. -that's only because you're looking at it in a very short- term perspective, they, the way they saw the communist revolution was by a very long drawn out process and so it wasn't that the revolution had just created this was, this was an important step in order to lead to their ultimate goal. +that's only because you're looking at it in a very short- term perspective, they, the way they saw the communist revolution was by a very long drawn out process and so it wasn't that the revolution had just created this was, this was an important step in order to lead to their ultimate goal. and it just goes to show that the communist party were very forward looking but -i, i would, i would be very surprised if the communists understood how deterministic idea of erm some sort of progression, i think you can't really say in about ten years' time we're gonna be here +i, i would, i would be very surprised if the communists understood how deterministic idea of erm some sort of progression, i think you can't really say in about ten years' time we're gonna be here so it was pragmatic but it could also fit into their ideology in that how, that if they'd gone straight for socialism now come on, this, this is disgraceful. -there's no this is a disgraceful +there's no this is a disgraceful no but if they'd gone straight for document for a communist party to base land reform on. -there's no ideology at all. +there's no ideology at all. absolutely, absolutely none. -i think it's only pragmatic in that it's maintaining production levels. +i think it's only pragmatic in that it's maintaining production levels. or helping production but so is this what, they certainly ? yeah, this is it. -this is +this is that's no, no no but i mean the basis of it was presumably landlord out and china was based around this yeah. -well it was for the next two years. -they didn't +well it was for the next two years. +they didn't no, no. oh right. i mean this, these, these, these well that's alright then. -no, i mean we would, no -so i mean this is just another basic erm +no, i mean we would, no +so i mean this is just another basic erm yeah. well in fact it, it it has in fact gone full circle because through the nineteen fifties you went through to co-ops to collectives to communes which lasted through to nineteen seventy eight, the communes were then disbanded and you're back, now, after reform which took very much system. but, you know, if, if, if i'd have put, when we, when we started to talk at the beginning of this term we had at the beginning a general discussion about what are we gonna put in land reform, if i'd have come along to s to you and i'd said well i think we should do this we'd of laughed. right. -and i, i, i, i, i, i would not have endeavoured to persuade you that this was going to be the land reform document that was, that this is it. +and i, i, i, i, i, i would not have endeavoured to persuade you that this was going to be the land reform document that was, that this is it. it doesn't surprise me that they did it. but this isn't this is it? -i mean you said two years later change. +i mean you said two years later change. ah well sure but then the whole lot goes, but, but, but, but, but this was, this was the document, i mean the way this was put forward, this is going to last us through into the foreseeable future. -erm you know,th th th this er er it was a medium term horizon on this at the time. +erm you know,th th th this er er it was a medium term horizon on this at the time. are you saying that they didn't mean what they said then? -and that i mean cos mao said that how that you needed to have a moderate policy, that was the correct one +and that i mean cos mao said that how that you needed to have a moderate policy, that was the correct one absolutely. -in order to ha to achieve one's goals, are you saying that how look well you've just got to assume that they were wrong that they didn't mean what they said? +in order to ha to achieve one's goals, are you saying that how look well you've just got to assume that they were wrong that they didn't mean what they said? i mean it's perfectly yeah. -legitimate to think that how that they did think that this was a short-term goal in order to achieve their long-term objectives. -one, one might argue that erm one might argue that there is a cynical implication thereupon, one might argue that but, but in i i in exactly the same way at the moment you might argue that all the assurances they've given on hong kong are, are not worth the paper they're written on and, and, and as soon as the, soon as you get through to nineteen ninety seven they'll walk in. -er are, are you saying no that they, they are not er +legitimate to think that how that they did think that this was a short-term goal in order to achieve their long-term objectives. +one, one might argue that erm one might argue that there is a cynical implication thereupon, one might argue that but, but in i i in exactly the same way at the moment you might argue that all the assurances they've given on hong kong are, are not worth the paper they're written on and, and, and as soon as the, soon as you get through to nineteen ninety seven they'll walk in. +er are, are you saying no that they, they are not er but you see they wouldn't have been able to realize their goals in nineteen forty nine. i mean, okay why not? supposing if they had -fifty they could, they could have gone they could have gone +fifty they could, they could have gone they could have gone but could they? were th were the peasants ready for it? is that what the peasants wanted at that time? ah. -well okay bu but in that sense are you saying that the learning experience was such that the peasant was so conservative and reactionary and so was all you could do? +well okay bu but in that sense are you saying that the learning experience was such that the peasant was so conservative and reactionary and so was all you could do? yeah which peasants are you talking about? mm. are you talking, saying the peasant, i mean it doesn't mean anything does it, the peasant? mm. all peasants. i mean it may just depend upon how secure the -how, how would you have felt as a poor peasant +how, how would you have felt as a poor peasant i mean it really does depend upon how secure they were and how much, how much support,ge genuine support they had of the, the masses as a whole, because if they didn't then there's no way, and people weren't calling for them to establish socialism at that time were they? would they have known what socialism was? exactly. and so how can the communist party -but i mean -just say right, we're gonna do this, this -just because they don't know what it socialism -theoretical concept or something, they might have known that they wanted +but i mean +just say right, we're gonna do this, this +just because they don't know what it socialism +theoretical concept or something, they might have known that they wanted yes but it's the basic underlying concept capitalism and becomes rich as the we western world then th they'll be all for that -no, i just find that really difficult because they didn't have the means at that time to achieve it. +no, i just find that really difficult because they didn't have the means at that time to achieve it. i mean we've already established the fact they didn't have, they didn't have the personnel to . yes they did. they were in power. they were in power but i mean who's to say that the pe there's not gonna be a civil war and they'll be thrown out of power. -so why did they think that they had the er means to do it in nineteen forty seven? -you know when they said, when they went for a very radical policy -well perhaps because they were more idealist and that now they're becoming more realist but they're still erm i mean they're learning from their past mistakes and they've seen that right so we have to have a moderate policy which is gonna take us a little bit further towards socialism. +so why did they think that they had the er means to do it in nineteen forty seven? +you know when they said, when they went for a very radical policy +well perhaps because they were more idealist and that now they're becoming more realist but they're still erm i mean they're learning from their past mistakes and they've seen that right so we have to have a moderate policy which is gonna take us a little bit further towards socialism. they're not totally contradicting their ideals. -oh yeah +oh yeah it confirms our suspicions at the last gasp we were right. it's all this absolute power corrupts actually isn't it? mm. -erm the, the people who did mao ? +erm the, the people who did mao ? or ? -well i mean there, there, there's no question about nineteen forty nine absolutely non no documents could have come out unless they had mao's approval. +well i mean there, there, there's no question about nineteen forty nine absolutely non no documents could have come out unless they had mao's approval. mm. er did he shoot the other people involved by any chance? that's behind this right. erm -i e it's the same person who comes up with -i mean yeah as you say he's very high personable person, there must be some reason behind it er and a lot of the theoretical reasons that he says of +i e it's the same person who comes up with +i mean yeah as you say he's very high personable person, there must be some reason behind it er and a lot of the theoretical reasons that he says of of ideological progression, maybe he thought that, that, that erm the only, ultimately the only way to capitalis er to communism was through capitalism and he needs to establish a period of capitalism first. sure yes. and that's what sort of marx said. @@ -67846,66 +67787,65 @@ so that yeah. yeah but it doesn't mean that they're selling out completely does it because it mm. -it means that it's just, it's a realization of, of the progression of communism is to establish a capitalist phase. +it means that it's just, it's a realization of, of the progression of communism is to establish a capitalist phase. okay. communism rather a, a weak theory doesn't it? -it's like saying -well mao would do anything the communist party, let's make it capitalist society. -no because if you look at marxist writing it's,i it's, you go through certain stages and you can't achieve +it's like saying +well mao would do anything the communist party, let's make it capitalist society. +no because if you look at marxist writing it's,i it's, you go through certain stages and you can't achieve that's right. -and that's what's happening to us now -that's just, that's just but why does it have to happen? +and that's what's happening to us now +that's just, that's just but why does it have to happen? it doesn't. if they really wanted they could've just gone straight for it. if they'd really wanted to. -they wanted to make it work though and they couldn't have made it work unless they had had the i mean the right conditions to do so. +they wanted to make it work though and they couldn't have made it work unless they had had the i mean the right conditions to do so. you could have you could have made it work. -you could've made it work if the peasants if the peasants were revolutionary, if the peasants had changed their value system and weren't and that there were very few who were still working within the economy. +you could've made it work if the peasants if the peasants were revolutionary, if the peasants had changed their value system and weren't and that there were very few who were still working within the economy. so er are are you saying this is all that was possible because the peasant really was a capitalist at heart? well it was very likely that this policy was gonna succeed in what? -and they was gonna take a bigger risk, in keeping them in power so that they can achieve their longer term ends. -but sh sh sure they can succ succ they can succeed in creating capitalism, it, it it, it might succeed in paving the way for new china's industrialization but we've gone a long way from any any ideological position, we've gone a long way from well what is in the best material benefiting class of the poor peasant now the poor peasant is not gonna get very much out of this. +and they was gonna take a bigger risk, in keeping them in power so that they can achieve their longer term ends. +but sh sh sure they can succ succ they can succeed in creating capitalism, it, it it, it might succeed in paving the way for new china's industrialization but we've gone a long way from any any ideological position, we've gone a long way from well what is in the best material benefiting class of the poor peasant now the poor peasant is not gonna get very much out of this. it seems as if a disillusionment, the communists are trying you know, trying policies yeah. and they're still not bloody work what can we do? -okay well we're in a really bad situation, i mean we can achieve something at least and perhaps oh perhaps communism doesn't work after all, they just seem to be doubting their own beliefs and what they've read. +okay well we're in a really bad situation, i mean we can achieve something at least and perhaps oh perhaps communism doesn't work after all, they just seem to be doubting their own beliefs and what they've read. and that's the only way i can see a way through this, thinking okay they've got this ideology, they've tried it twice and it still hasn't worked. let's go back to the drawing board and try something else. cos this, this is definitely not communism in any sense. right. -i mean does, does this document surprise you? +i mean does, does this document surprise you? i mean is yes. is that what you thought the nineteen forty nine revolution was all about? -i'm not surprised it's come back erm to, to a sort of right is this an expression of mass mind do you think? +i'm not surprised it's come back erm to, to a sort of right is this an expression of mass mind do you think? what do you think? -cos if it is communist behaviour -there is, no there's no mass argument because you've got +cos if it is communist behaviour +there is, no there's no mass argument because you've got why not? this different situation that's not mass minded. well it's quite, i'm sure that i'm sure, i'm sure that a lot of, i'm sure the rich peasant -well there's about eight people -cos really they're the only f you know they'll be going yeah that's my mass line alright -well of course it is, yeah but that's not thing is it? +well there's about eight people +cos really they're the only f you know they'll be going yeah that's my mass line alright +well of course it is, yeah but that's not thing is it? well, it is for them you see, -there, there's no such thing as an absolute mass line, the mass line in particular two types of people. +there, there's no such thing as an absolute mass line, the mass line in particular two types of people. no that's not a mass mind then is it? exactly. well there's no such thing as a mass line then is there? but anyway we, we, we'd better stop there. -but i think it's important we've, we've now got what what the policy was. -on the face of it it looks very much as though this is erm very little social justice -what, what i hope we'll do next week is to, is to take that idea up and to see maybe why this policy came through erm and we'll look at the, like the arithmetic of that as to, as to how much money there was, how much land there was in fact. +but i think it's important we've, we've now got what what the policy was. +on the face of it it looks very much as though this is erm very little social justice +what, what i hope we'll do next week is to, is to take that idea up and to see maybe why this policy came through erm and we'll look at the, like the arithmetic of that as to, as to how much money there was, how much land there was in fact. mm. how you could actually achieve a distribution. -so i think for next week i'd like to be looking in some detail, there are two sources on this one is, is and the other is ,tho those two are crucial in terms of understanding or, and and that those are crucial in terms of understanding erm why this policy document . +so i think for next week i'd like to be looking in some detail, there are two sources on this one is, is and the other is ,tho those two are crucial in terms of understanding or, and and that those are crucial in terms of understanding erm why this policy document . er who's doing next week? if, if you're stuck for them come and see me cos i've got them - -right mrs do have a seat. +right mrs do have a seat. what can i do for you? it's the eczema again. oh. @@ -67925,7 +67865,7 @@ but these two are fine. mm. mm. hmm. -this bubbly area. +this bubbly area. you say that's . mm. yeah. @@ -67939,7 +67879,7 @@ right,. okey-doke. hmm. it's, it's a bit cracked . -it makes it very +it makes it very as i say it's better than, it's a bit better than it was. but it's still not that no. @@ -67952,7 +67892,7 @@ mm. okay. because as soon as it starts to die down you could probably go back on to betnovate to keep it maintained. and you may actually have to use betnovate on a preventative basis every now and again. -even if there's not a deal there, as soon as it starts it's slightly flaky straight in. +even if there's not a deal there, as soon as it starts it's slightly flaky straight in. but what i'm gonna do is give you erm dermavate dermavate is actually more potent than betnovate in the ointment form again to get the rapid penetration. and once again, like betnovate it's used twice a day. and in a similar fashion you should use the dipabase to keep the skin as soft and moist as you can @@ -67961,7 +67901,7 @@ rather than letting it get dried out and cracked. dermavate is, as i say, it's more potent, it's probably not so suitable for keeping going with, but for jumping on top of things in a hurry, it's fine. and i think that's what we ought to use. sometimes you actually need to use it under something, but it's difficult to use under things and part of the hand. -i don't know what you mean under +i don't know what you mean under well sort of under a dressing, or oh right. under a bit of polythene, so it, it actually gets absorbed even quicker. @@ -68003,11 +67943,11 @@ well between gemma and the dog you don't stand much chance do you? said he was gonna bring some biscuits up the street cos i still haven't got any. well i've gotta go down the street, i'll bring some biscuits back. i was just telling marje -oh it's not it's just and i'll walk down and er i will bring him some biscuits back +oh it's not it's just and i'll walk down and er i will bring him some biscuits back oh he heard you, on tape. don't bring the best chocolate ones, well i didn't start getting any dinner cos jenny's just on about getting fish and chips. -yeah we we're gonna get some fish and chips +yeah we we're gonna get some fish and chips it's a belgian drink. oh yeah? oh? @@ -68018,48 +67958,48 @@ you don't, you don't even feel . twelve percent. is it really? yeah. -as i say i, that's why, that's really why i was expecting you more towards twelve o'clock time. +as i say i, that's why, that's really why i was expecting you more towards twelve o'clock time. so i said well if they're gonna get . . don't worry about it, we'll go down and get some later on. -with the car +with the car perhaps to that moor road yeah, we'll go up there. that's strong. -yeah well it yeah it is a bit. +yeah well it yeah it is a bit. it is strong yeah. it's nice stuff. -they said, they said it don't give you a hangover but don't believe it cos i had a you have a -you s you serve it in a you know the big chunky glasses you can get? +they said, they said it don't give you a hangover but don't believe it cos i had a you have a +you s you serve it in a you know the big chunky glasses you can get? well if you put them in the freezer mm mm. -up, pour it straight in and down. +up, pour it straight in and down. mm. do you still drink like that brock? -like in budgens few weeks . +like in budgens few weeks . we'll get some of that when eileen and tony come. went down yesterday and they're out of stock. it's expensive over here though innit? -er i get it for three quid, three something like. -is that the the big bottle or the small one? +er i get it for three quid, three something like. +is that the the big bottle or the small one? no, they're the small ones, small bottles yeah. it's expensive that. oh yeah i know, -we we'd pay about four pound for twenty four bottles. +we we'd pay about four pound for twenty four bottles. this beer called yeah. it's, it's er belgian. oh. -and it's it looks like ginger beer. -when you pour it out you get a big head on it like this and it's, it's lovely stuff. +and it's it looks like ginger beer. +when you pour it out you get a big head on it like this and it's, it's lovely stuff. it goes down like wine. -it's, it's smooth, real smooth. +it's, it's smooth, real smooth. yeah. -they have quite a few er foreign beers in er in budgens these days cos the other week we saw some of that brock +they have quite a few er foreign beers in er in budgens these days cos the other week we saw some of that brock oh yeah that's erm that's then when he went down he said well he couldn't see any yesterday. -no don't i don't i, i just get, i mean i, sometimes i have some like but it's so easy to get hold of it out there mum. -i mean we've always got drink in the house and s and occasionally we'll have a drink at night but sometimes we just don't touch it for ages unless anyone comes round. +no don't i don't i, i just get, i mean i, sometimes i have some like but it's so easy to get hold of it out there mum. +i mean we've always got drink in the house and s and occasionally we'll have a drink at night but sometimes we just don't touch it for ages unless anyone comes round. it just sits there well i mean your dad's got anyway, i'll be gone and i shan't be long. @@ -68072,21 +68012,21 @@ i've got some. have you? oh that'll do then. i'll have some later. -we've got some in the pantry. +we've got some in the pantry. but i can bring you some if you want some. come and taste mine. oh no, no. -when you've tasted mine you might not want, you might want me to bring you bring you back a different sort . +when you've tasted mine you might not want, you might want me to bring you bring you back a different sort . why, where do you get yours from? from the doctor. the vets. -no he +no he look at these in bits. eh? are you going down the street now? yeah. well you want some money don't you? -this is, hang on this is a part of italy. +this is, hang on this is a part of italy. this is the time we went to the beach in italy. i'll just look at these. and the sun setting. @@ -68094,35 +68034,35 @@ let me show you ones with tony and them on then. it's a nice big beach isn't it? is this down in the ? is it tony? -er no +er no no it's over towards naples. oh i see. this is tony's street. you can't get two cars down the street. can't you really? could just get his car down it. -and they had to park it in a a , an alley on the side. +and they had to park it in a a , an alley on the side. oh yeah? -it took me six turns to get it, get it reversed in. +it took me six turns to get it, get it reversed in. because there's no room at all. shall i show you a picture of tony? these. -these pictures are all round tony's village. +these pictures are all round tony's village. yeah. see what his village is like. -if dad starts looking through there he'll never get down the street . +if dad starts looking through there he'll never get down the street . well he he's gonna look at the rest when he comes back. see them when you come back. -right-oh +right-oh well he won't be long unless he sees anybody to talk to. he's like you for that. -er did you want anything else? +er did you want anything else? no thanks dad. i can't think of anything. -i can't think of anything except for the biscuits because i've run out of biscuits. -i was eileen. +i can't think of anything except for the biscuits because i've run out of biscuits. +i was eileen. i know what you want. -no no i'm no i'm i'll just get some cough medicine. +no no i'm no i'm i'll just get some cough medicine. me money's around though, i don't know where it is. no i'll bring you some back. it's in your bag. @@ -68145,19 +68085,19 @@ no thanks. another one in the pot if you want one. no. it's on the adriatic? -erm the other side. +erm the other side. the other side is it? it's the western coast. oh the west. it tastes like liquid salt! -ugh no wonder he said +ugh no wonder he said you what? it tastes like liquid salt. i know your dad said he didn't like it. that's why i didn't say anything before you tried it but your dad said he didn't like it. it acts as a mouthwash as well. is there any particular kind you do like? -erm i don't care as long as it ain't that. +erm i don't care as long as it ain't that. i'll have any sort but that. right. this is all rou this his village. @@ -68169,11 +68109,11 @@ that's the house, that's his back garden. part of it. that's looking out of erm big garden. -that's looking out the front window +that's looking out the front window oh yeah. -over the rooftops next door. -i mean you know, sometimes you you see a picture of a place when you've been there and it doesn't even resemble it. -you know, as it is now it's very lovely. +over the rooftops next door. +i mean you know, sometimes you you see a picture of a place when you've been there and it doesn't even resemble it. +you know, as it is now it's very lovely. over the road i mean. yeah. they're practically touching actually if, if they, if they had a balcony and tony had a balcony you could shake hands @@ -68181,8 +68121,8 @@ oh. yeah . that's opposite tony's front window it looks nice. -it looks nice -where he a man's growing his tobacco look. +it looks nice +where he a man's growing his tobacco look. well tobacco? growing his tobacco. @@ -68194,15 +68134,15 @@ we've got loads the same. i think you usually tend to get yeah. when we, we come back from holiday -that's +that's your dad usually finds he's taken the same picture two or three times or more or less and keep them in the same bits won't you? -yes +yes same place but a different angle. this is -this is all out of his back window the views out of upstairs, out of his kitchen window. +this is all out of his back window the views out of upstairs, out of his kitchen window. all these. -that's the photos i took of it, yeah at the palace. +that's the photos i took of it, yeah at the palace. it's only like a little village isn't it? it's not a, not a big town. oh it's, well it's three little villages together. @@ -68211,17 +68151,17 @@ erm there's erm mm. yeah, oh yeah. it's boiling there though. -they're walking round in er woolly jumpers. +they're walking round in er woolly jumpers. were they really? it's about twenty four degrees. i was sweltering, i was wearing a t-shirt and they were out you know with jumpers on and all sorts. -they wear pyjamas at night and all sorts they do. -there's carbi resorta and his village itself is called viapechio something like that. +they wear pyjamas at night and all sorts they do. +there's carbi resorta and his village itself is called viapechio something like that. i can't really say it. no. . that's their dog, sally. -now this is where you can see this is +now this is where you can see this is their step's there yeah. well you know you look down into that, onto that flat, the one ? @@ -68229,23 +68169,23 @@ yeah. well there's another one over this side. that bit there is the under part to tony's house where the cousin lives. oh. -no, hang on what is she? +no, hang on what is she? sister. -she's she's maria's sister, maria's his ? +she's she's maria's sister, maria's his ? no, it's philomena's sister. -philomena's sister lives there. +philomena's sister lives there. that's a big plant isn't it? crikey it's as tall as you. yeah it's elephant ears or something isn't it? elephant ears. love that. now these -if you've got good eyes you might +if you've got good eyes you might there's one of them. oh yeah? oh yeah. -all these things on the wall you can't touch it. -this is tony with his camera. +all these things on the wall you can't touch it. +this is tony with his camera. if you touch it it rots. does it? yeah. @@ -68260,9 +68200,9 @@ there's lizards on all of them. they get in your bed don't they? ooh. never got one in mine. -lizards +lizards when we went down the south of france we saw lizards like that on the walls. -they moved ever so quick +they moved ever so quick yeah these do. yeah. this is tony's cellar. @@ -68271,13 +68211,13 @@ no it's, it's literally chopped out of rock. you can see all the steps are all yeah. stone. -it's all chopped it's like a cave. -you go down and then you walk along here, right to the end right round, sort of round the bend there +it's all chopped it's like a cave. +you go down and then you walk along here, right to the end right round, sort of round the bend there yeah. and there's a well. he's got a well. and this is really deep ain't it tone, this bit? -that's about forty foot down +that's about forty foot down this is about forty foot down and then it drops again oh. into a well, where he gets his all, his fresh water from it. @@ -68292,39 +68232,39 @@ oh i see. yeah. these are the same again. these are over the rooftops. -and anything that does come from the you know the system? +and anything that does come from the you know the system? mm. -erm it's bad. +erm it's bad. you know, it's really dirty water. lovely little villages though. i mean you can see how they live, i mean look at the roads. ever such a job to get our car up there. that's philomena walking up the street. oh. -she's saying no don't-a take-a one of me. +she's saying no don't-a take-a one of me. switch-a the camera off! photos yeah. -. oh these are the actual +. oh these are the actual you walk down the road erm marje it's really funny. -and it's hey mario +and it's hey mario ciao. -ciao mario cappuccino? +ciao mario cappuccino? and off they go. it's really funny. i'd love to live there. yeah. it sounds really nice. fantastic. -hughie come here. +hughie come here. oh that's next door's dog. can't remember come and see me. what it's called. but it ain't very nice. that's next door's dog. -these are all grapevines -she's got grapes lemons she's got a tree that's got lemon, orange and grapefruit on it ain't she tone? +these are all grapevines +she's got grapes lemons she's got a tree that's got lemon, orange and grapefruit on it ain't she tone? yeah. growing in the garden? yeah. @@ -68333,20 +68273,20 @@ on one tree? lemon and a yeah on one tree. they were all grafted on and they're all growing on the same tree. -derek's got an apple tree with different kinds growing on it. +derek's got an apple tree with different kinds growing on it. derek's got an apple tree with three different varieties on it. marvellous innit? that's clever. -that's that's sunset. +that's that's sunset. yeah i might have guessed that. yeah. out of his kitchen window. looks like a castle dunnit? but it ain't. it does. -and that's a shot see this part under here is maria's under part where the cellar cellar goes down no and yeah, that's no. +and that's a shot see this part under here is maria's under part where the cellar cellar goes down no and yeah, that's no. this is where the cellar is. -you go round through maria's gate then you go down the back and behind that little pole there +you go round through maria's gate then you go down the back and behind that little pole there yeah. and down under here. that's where the cellar is isn't it? @@ -68357,47 +68297,47 @@ their bedroom doors used to open up onto this balcony. you could come out in the morning oh. that's a nicer one of the garden. -this is the that's the lemon, orange and grapefruit tree there. +this is the that's the lemon, orange and grapefruit tree there. oh yeah? -the grapes are all along here see behind the washing? +the grapes are all along here see behind the washing? yeah. -and she's got kiwi fruits and peppers and all sorts of things growing in the garden. +and she's got kiwi fruits and peppers and all sorts of things growing in the garden. there's eleanor. to grow them. -climate for it +climate for it do you remember eleanor? she was a little dark-haired, curly girl. beautiful curly dark hair she had. she was a little tiny dot. -aubergines. little aubergines, they're like this. +aubergines. little aubergines, they're like this. you know, they're the little ones she says. all fresh, picks them when she wants them. they're all at er monte casino . there was a big battle there. -the er the germans bombed the monastery. +the er the germans bombed the monastery. oh yeah? and er the italian government rebuilt it. oh yeah? -but the view cos you, you're going up seven miles +but the view cos you, you're going up seven miles mm. all, all the roads round, yeah?seven miles innit? it is. -it's se seven miles of road up to the top. +it's se seven miles of road up to the top. yeah. and the view is lovely. -the actual cellars they've got some of the old er writings that the, the monks and you're not allowed to take photographs. +the actual cellars they've got some of the old er writings that the, the monks and you're not allowed to take photographs. yeah? -and there's a book and it's oh about quarter of and it's got the bible written in fourteen nineties. +and there's a book and it's oh about quarter of and it's got the bible written in fourteen nineties. and it, it's there, you can see it. you can see the writing on the pages. -you know, it's fantastic. +you know, it's fantastic. yeah. no i can't say i remember her. the only one i remember is the son, the oldest boy i think. oh dear, he wears me out steven. steven! oh god. -and she she's, she talks more than me, and sh her voice is like +and she she's, she talks more than me, and sh her voice is like that's saying something. grapes, look at them. yeah. @@ -68407,14 +68347,14 @@ derek's got a grapevine as well. had forty pound of grapes off it last year. did they? yeah . -these are all rou you see they're all these are all round that area. +these are all rou you see they're all these are all round that area. what about hotel rodeo yeah. -and that's all these are in tony's hou i'm just trying to show them tony's house first you see cos it's it's all these tiles that fascinate me. +and that's all these are in tony's hou i'm just trying to show them tony's house first you see cos it's it's all these tiles that fascinate me. some of these look more or less the same don't they? yeah they are. -we took them look at the -yeah we used seven films. +we took them look at the +yeah we used seven films. what's that, chickens or ducks? dunno. they keep everything round there. @@ -68429,7 +68369,7 @@ you'd be in your element you would. these tiles are all throughout. amazing aren't they? oh they're wonderful. -all you do is, you get a mop and you just swish it over and you get a dry mop and just polish it up. +all you do is, you get a mop and you just swish it over and you get a dry mop and just polish it up. no polish or anything. and they shi lovely aren't they tone? yeah. @@ -68439,23 +68379,23 @@ don't know quite what he's doing, pulling a funny face as usual. and that's me trying to learn me italian. she's telling me these little bits to write down. oh this is me, me and philomena. -me this is me and philomena. +me this is me and philomena. i'm right into the italian soaps while i were over there. the what? oh christ yes. the italian soaps, couldn't understand a word, they were ever so good. -they're argen they're argentinean which are dubbed into italian. +they're argen they're argentinean which are dubbed into italian. oh. well oh dear me. it starts at quarter to eight, goes off at ten. it's what was you supposed to be doing there then ? -they're watching t oh i, i was messing about with tony so i, i flashed me skirt, flashed me knees. +they're watching t oh i, i was messing about with tony so i, i flashed me skirt, flashed me knees. oh this is alexandro's birthday. -alexandro he lives next door, right? +alexandro he lives next door, right? and he's living in his garage mum. -this is going down, round the back +this is going down, round the back ooh er. why? he's got loads of money. @@ -68463,7 +68403,7 @@ absolutely loaded isn't he tone? who alexandro? alexandro. oh yeah. -and he lives in this garage because out there you get earthquakes, and when you get earthquake damage to your house the government will fix it. +and he lives in this garage because out there you get earthquakes, and when you get earthquake damage to your house the government will fix it. they say yes you're allowed so much money to have your house fixed and they fix it. but they only come when they're ready. and he's, he took all his stuff out because he thought er they said they were coming. @@ -68493,12 +68433,12 @@ he's lucky he never died. i tell you. are they war graves tony? yeah, yeah. -yeah in monte casino it's erm there's the english, polish erm ooh and french cemeteries. +yeah in monte casino it's erm there's the english, polish erm ooh and french cemeteries. there isn't a german one. no. no. no. -now what's funny about this place is they're all italians that are in there but there's loads of them that live in this particular area, that lived in bedford for a long time. +now what's funny about this place is they're all italians that are in there but there's loads of them that live in this particular area, that lived in bedford for a long time. so they all speak english. in bedford i know. so there is @@ -68507,7 +68447,7 @@ she speaks with a bedford accent. ooh er. ever so funny. jean, was her name? -zina zita? +zina zita? what was her name? zelda, zina? veena. @@ -68515,13 +68455,13 @@ veena? yeah. nice girl she was. no i remember derek saying how many italians there were living in bedford. -this is the hotel rodeo at garoteo where we stayed, where we rosetto where we stayed on our way down towards tony's. +this is the hotel rodeo at garoteo where we stayed, where we rosetto where we stayed on our way down towards tony's. oh. oh mum it was terrible! -no, the place was okay but we had lizards outside our door, loads of them. +no, the place was okay but we had lizards outside our door, loads of them. i it were ca , it was, it was raining so much you see? -there's more of s sally hiding behind the curtain. -monte casino where we went straight into the pub and tony says three beer and hallo he said, alright mate? +there's more of s sally hiding behind the curtain. +monte casino where we went straight into the pub and tony says three beer and hallo he said, alright mate? yeah really. he said do you work? he says now and again. @@ -68548,28 +68488,28 @@ down the road. you'll see his family in a minute, hang on tony's friend. he's tony's friend. -yeah we got in to er roseo and . -and er i heard this clanging. +yeah we got in to er roseo and . +and er i heard this clanging. and i thought . you know, we were going for about ten minute . -so i looked out the window and i see and they've all got these big bells round their neck. +so i looked out the window and i see and they've all got these big bells round their neck. yeah? string like, you know? oh. he's my friend as well now . some of these photos are terrible. that's his family. -that's his mum and his grandma and granddad and his dad and his brother and his brother's wife. +that's his mum and his grandma and granddad and his dad and his brother and his brother's wife. mm. i've got some nice photos. i sent them one, they're ever so pleased. they were all dressed up. -you know not, not just a cowboy belt. -they've all got flowers in the hair and all sorts. +you know not, not just a cowboy belt. +they've all got flowers in the hair and all sorts. yeah? that's me and maria doing the potatoes. yeah. -that's +that's yeah that's my mate, yeah. me and me and erm sorry not maria, there's maria. that's me and philomena. @@ -68580,26 +68520,26 @@ she used to come in, she'd say antonio! then tony'd say bella ! he used to talk to her in english with an italian accent. it used to crack me up. -and she, and she used to +and she, and she used to you doing potatoes by the bucketful? well there was a lot of us for dinner. they don't half eat though! good grief. -i mean, you got dinnertimes it was erm typical pasta with her home-made, home-made spaghetti sauce and parmesan cheese, great big plateful and loads of meat on the side. -and then at night egg and chips, cos she knows tony likes chips or chops and ooh. +i mean, you got dinnertimes it was erm typical pasta with her home-made, home-made spaghetti sauce and parmesan cheese, great big plateful and loads of meat on the side. +and then at night egg and chips, cos she knows tony likes chips or chops and ooh. said didn't i, i'm gonna put loads of weight on? ha! ate loads. -that's a that's a fresh fig off a tree. +that's a that's a fresh fig off a tree. you can walk the roads and pick them. ooh i've been told they're very nice. i've never tasted one but they say they're very nice. ooh. -they taste so different to the figs we get. +they taste so different to the figs we get. yeah. they're really nice. oh this is the night we arrived. -things like that +things like that like the cheese. this is the night we arrived, we were looking at photos look. oh yeah. @@ -68615,11 +68555,11 @@ how many did we do? oh dunno. or germany to two thousand something? -i did two thousand four hundred kilometres. +i did two thousand four hundred kilometres. it was ooh it was, do you know, it's one of the best trips i've ever made. -yeah it's +yeah it's i've never been anywhere like that, to drive through. -the, the travelling you know? +the, the travelling you know? we did fifty what was it? fifty three tunnels? ooh, look at me there look. @@ -68633,7 +68573,7 @@ seven fifty something going down, seventy something coming back i think. that's right. oh you, cos they just dig through the mountains you see, so you don't have to -the, the longest the longest tunnel is er nineteen kilometres. +the, the longest the longest tunnel is er nineteen kilometres. ooh, some tunnel that is. yeah, what was it called though? it was gotard @@ -68654,12 +68594,12 @@ because he ain't got no teeth mum, you know they well i, i can see it's him when they're yeah. a bit closer up but -you know when you ain't got your teeth in, how your face tends to s sag a bit? +you know when you ain't got your teeth in, how your face tends to s sag a bit? yeah. well you see, tony's got them here but he ain't got them there so he's, when he sits there and he's relaxed his face goes sad . he got sad old tone though. -every time i write a letter to him now i say keep smiling, turn them corners up cos they all go on at him. +every time i write a letter to him now i say keep smiling, turn them corners up cos they all go on at him. oh there's them cows. yeah. oh there's sally playing peep-o again. @@ -68680,7 +68620,7 @@ these are the ones i like. that's a nice looking house isn't it? mm. bit unusual. -yeah there's loads of nice little houses round there's another one round here with pictures on the walls somewhere. +yeah there's loads of nice little houses round there's another one round here with pictures on the walls somewhere. i see cow's got the right of way. it's the streets i like. look at the streets. @@ -68697,7 +68637,7 @@ that's tony's street. is that luxembourg? look at that one. ooh er, crikey. -that's +that's yeah, oh he's . no lie down. that's it,lie down. @@ -68712,34 +68652,34 @@ yeah. you can go the coach route can't you? we wondered round the streets just taking photos. you can go the coach route can't you? -yeah well we was, we was gonna go down the west coast go and see rome and then down from there. +yeah well we was, we was gonna go down the west coast go and see rome and then down from there. yeah. but the weather was terrible. i was driving through what, eighteen inches of water. -yeah when you go through switzerland. +yeah when you go through switzerland. yeah. it seems to be following you. yeah well switzerland weren't too bad cos the road surfaces are pretty good. yeah. but in italy there's no drainage. ooh. -but on, on a motorway brand new motorway, no lines +but on, on a motorway brand new motorway, no lines yeah. no white lines, nothing. no? about eighteen inches of water. right? cor! -and the cars are just straight on. +and the cars are just straight on. you know, -went round taking photos of old and the new. +went round taking photos of old and the new. see this is the new stuff that's going up. yeah. and the old stuff is much more interesting, don't like the new stuff. yeah. -this is a a rest home for the nuns. +this is a a rest home for the nuns. and they go there when they retire. -see that's that's sort of there. +see that's that's sort of there. that was built sort of there. that's the old stuff. yeah. @@ -68747,7 +68687,7 @@ and this is the new. there's timesharing and different and this one -it was bloody we well i had to stop because i couldn't see my way at all. +it was bloody we well i had to stop because i couldn't see my way at all. this one's another one. that's in the next village. it's a nice street innit? @@ -68755,7 +68695,7 @@ it is nice. yeah. and that's, that's the fish in the palace park. and that's switzerland, coming out of switzerland. -and the other one is what's on the front ? +and the other one is what's on the front ? that's monte casino very nice. and that was monte casino on that one. @@ -68767,24 +68707,24 @@ the other one's absolutely chock-a-block. i'm keeping them together in their little bits because i've got them all sorted where they belong, so have you seen these? no. -this is all, they're all the little houses and and streets and and that, that one. +this is all, they're all the little houses and and streets and and that, that one. right, what's the next lot? alright, sit down you. sit down joey. good boy. -right now did you see the one with the sea on? +right now did you see the one with the sea on? oh no. well that's the day we went to the sea. when weirdo bought us a coffee. which sea's that? -it's the mediterranean innit? +it's the mediterranean innit? i don't know, it's on the left hand side. or is it the north sea? naples side. oh. i think it's the mediterranean. did you see naples? -no we never went +no we never went no. even the locals won't go and park their car in right, philomena's two brothers, both policemen in naples @@ -68798,12 +68738,12 @@ oh it's terrible! yeah. yeah. the sea looks nice though. -the cars get ripped off, if they park they'll take the car. +the cars get ripped off, if they park they'll take the car. will they? yeah. yeah. -i, i waited until i got back into switzerland before i said i've been to italy and i haven't got a scratch on the car. -oh it's lovely but see now this is, when was this? +i, i waited until i got back into switzerland before i said i've been to italy and i haven't got a scratch on the car. +oh it's lovely but see now this is, when was this? oct early october? early october and it were end of season. mm. @@ -68811,7 +68751,7 @@ wouldn't believe it would you? no. and they just shut up and go. yeah. -yeah cos, cos +yeah cos, cos e everywhere you go they're using the horn. yeah. now it's against the law to that in germany. @@ -68826,10 +68766,10 @@ how far is the village from the sea? twenty five k's. i think if you know where you're going it's nearer than we went. we do weren't too sure were we? -was that was that hot air balloon following you by any chance ? +was that was that hot air balloon following you by any chance ? it, it just came over, yeah it, it came up over the it looks nice dunnit, that? -we were just standing there looking over the the the +we were just standing there looking over the the the that's er the parapet yeah. @@ -68854,8 +68794,8 @@ oh it's, it's there on the side of the box. sorry? yeah i've shown them that, yeah. but there's some more as well in there. -you need a, a you need to see it though really. -you can't get it it's such a sort of panoramic sort of view, you know? +you need a, a you need to see it though really. +you can't get it it's such a sort of panoramic sort of view, you know? all this is all in erm alabaster. ooh it's lovely. mm. @@ -68880,34 +68820,34 @@ yeah. there's all sorts. yeah. i think they're goldfish actually. -there's some goldfish but +there's some goldfish but these look like goldfish. carp and, it's got everything in there. i don't think there's any koi carp. look at it, there's millions on that one. yeah that's lovely innit? cle and yet you look at the water. -it don't look very clear when you look at it, but the sun and that it was it weren't half hot that day. +it don't look very clear when you look at it, but the sun and that it was it weren't half hot that day. well the camera can probably see more than you do. there's statues everywhere. i was just testing the camera so -i, i, i ordered a camera and expected it to be with us the week before we went. +i, i, i ordered a camera and expected it to be with us the week before we went. we were gonna leave on the saturday morning, it arrived the friday night. did it really? yeah. oh, it didn't give you much chance then to get used to it did it? -i mean you know +i mean you know no. -i just, i just got seven films and i said well if they friday if i don't, well +i just, i just got seven films and i said well if they friday if i don't, well well they worked good didn't they? there's some that are a bit, you know no, they're, they're alright. they're nice. they're good photos they are. this reminds me of when we went round versailles. -that's all painted ceilings and +that's all painted ceilings and yeah. -this is like in a big glass case and it's other parts , there's like a little bit there looks like the nativity and then the rest is all parts of naples in olden times. +this is like in a big glass case and it's other parts , there's like a little bit there looks like the nativity and then the rest is all parts of naples in olden times. it shows you the ooh. the . @@ -68917,9 +68857,9 @@ yeah. oh yeah, tony was saying. they're hundreds of years old aren't they? yeah. -and look this, this room, you've got the it was all like this, all gold filigree, it was all over. +and look this, this room, you've got the it was all like this, all gold filigree, it was all over. yeah. -the ceilings, all down the walls furniture. +the ceilings, all down the walls furniture. ooh it was it was it was the er the throne room wasn't it? throne room, yeah. @@ -68928,25 +68868,25 @@ mm. and that's er this sort of thing, as i say i it reminds me very much of versailles when we went round there. yeah. -that's all painted ceilings and +that's all painted ceilings and how far's tony actually from naples? -it's about sixty kilometres. +it's about sixty kilometres. sixty is it? yeah. but, cos you see tony, he, he likes to take people out mm? -and h he's been to places his memory's terrible. +and h he's been to places his memory's terrible. is it really? yeah. oh yeah. yeah. he he has been ever so poorly clive. -he, he you see what +he, he you see what i, yeah cos last time you when come over he was supposed to have been ill weren't he? oh yeah. -yeah oh he's er what happened to him, right he used to like a drink when he were here. -he went out there and you see and, and they drink wine instead of tea. +yeah oh he's er what happened to him, right he used to like a drink when he were here. +he went out there and you see and, and they drink wine instead of tea. yeah, yeah. yeah. and he was going round and they made such a fuss of him cos he was philomena's husband @@ -68956,8 +68896,8 @@ yeah. it comes all the way down. did you see that first one, where they're? yeah? -you'll see it quite a way up. -you'll see it in a minute when you get back to the end again. +you'll see it quite a way up. +you'll see it in a minute when you get back to the end again. you see it's not, not alcoholic the wine. no. and when it's pressed out of the grapes, the juice comes out, they allow it to stand for five days and then they put it into bottles. @@ -68970,7 +68910,7 @@ no it's just pure grape juice. oh god, really kicks you. yeah. it kicks. -does it +does it yeah. well, see when you're drinking that all day long yeah yeah. @@ -68979,22 +68919,22 @@ yeah, yeah. and that's oh. so w without alcohol there wouldn't be no dehydration either would there? -not in -no +not in +no no, no. -no i should think it's it's very potent. +no i should think it's it's very potent. even the, the locals add water to it. do they really? you know they get a small glass like a whisky glass? mm. -half of the wine and they top it up with water. +half of the wine and they top it up with water. oh. -and, and th this erm it's like the coffee. +and, and th this erm it's like the coffee. italian coffee in little cups. more than four a day if you're a working man. if you don't work, one a day. yeah? -because it, it it would rot your stomach. +because it, it it would rot your stomach. ooh dear. stuff ooh ooh. @@ -69020,7 +68960,7 @@ there's tony, me and maria. who's maria? maria's erm philomen's sister. oh. -that's across the gardens of the palace you know? +that's across the gardens of the palace you know? yeah. all the mountains all round it. that's what i like about it, all the mountains all over the place, you know? @@ -69030,11 +68970,11 @@ yes they're lovely. and the weather was gorgeous. well we did have some rain but well for that time of the year it was remarkable really. -er . +er . oh that's at rocetta . you can see rocetta from tony's garden. it's a little, it's a place. -it's, it's a hill, a big and this is where hannibal started his trek +it's, it's a hill, a big and this is where hannibal started his trek oh. with the elephants, across the alps. rocetta was his first campsite. @@ -69049,16 +68989,16 @@ what i'll do, i'll pass you the box and then you can take them out a bit at a ti ain't they? oh. your dad'll wanna look through them i expect when he gets back. -that's where hannibal parked his ele had his first campsite. +that's where hannibal parked his ele had his first campsite. oh oh. that's a true story then, hannibal? oh yeah. i didn't er realize that actually, yeah. -well where, where tony lives there's that village is over three thousand years old. +well where, where tony lives there's that village is over three thousand years old. there's tunnels under the ground. yeah. -tunnels +tunnels well you know the what was it, romulus and remus? yeah. with the wolf. @@ -69091,17 +69031,17 @@ oh as i say i've seen the film. i, i liked the film of hannibal, with oliver reed. now that's quite good. yeah. -was it +was it i've never seen the film. it's very good, the film is. but i mean round there it's absolutely steeped in history. i couldn't believe it. mm. -i mean er when they told the tales of the of the seven winds and the was it seven winds? +i mean er when they told the tales of the of the seven winds and the was it seven winds? yeah. -the seven winds and romu romulus and remus and the, the, the wolf it all happened round there. +the seven winds and romu romulus and remus and the, the, the wolf it all happened round there. and they reckon the golden wolf is still down -but +but there somewhere. rome is supposed to be built on seven hills isn't it or something? it is. @@ -69113,7 +69053,7 @@ just like this can't you? yeah. amazing place. we didn't go into rome, we went round it. -it spreads about twenty five mile +it spreads about twenty five mile for the time of the year it's gorgeous isn't it? yeah look at the size of me though mum. i ain't half a fatso. @@ -69126,9 +69066,9 @@ i'm supposed to be trying to watch me weight now. yeah? yeah. it's massive. -i've er, i've lost about a stone in a couple of months or so, that's all, but it's er better than gaining i suppose. +i've er, i've lost about a stone in a couple of months or so, that's all, but it's er better than gaining i suppose. back to where i started i think. -unless you've got two pictures of that same street, no +unless you've got two pictures of that same street, no no, you're back to where you started. this is rocetta clive. @@ -69136,21 +69076,21 @@ mm. funny little place. ah. right rocetta now where's this? -oh this is the palace this is the, the monte casino this is where +oh this is the palace this is the, the monte casino this is where it's the abbey the abbey at monte casino do you remember -oh i've heard about the abbey yeah. +oh i've heard about the abbey yeah. the war film. you know where it all got bombed yeah. -and what they took all the treasures down into the cellars so they were saved and they rebuilt it. -in the same style as it was years ago, using some of their old bricks and everything that they could but it's been +and what they took all the treasures down into the cellars so they were saved and they rebuilt it. +in the same style as it was years ago, using some of their old bricks and everything that they could but it's been yeah. rebuilt in the same style and all the treasures are still there. -yeah it's amazing, all these -i've seen the film of this where they're trying to g and all around from outside you can see the graves the graveyard. +yeah it's amazing, all these +i've seen the film of this where they're trying to g and all around from outside you can see the graves the graveyard. yeah. -there's the german graveyard, the italian the, the erm british and canadian +there's the german graveyard, the italian the, the erm british and canadian no, the german one's not there. the german one is not round monte casino i thought it was. @@ -69166,32 +69106,31 @@ derek said he might come up tonight. yeah we saw jenny down town yesterday, she said they were coming up tonight. ooh, can't stand this. how, how high up were you there tone? - -could you also for your passports just note the following information. -country of issue, whether it's a five or ten year passport expiry date and your passport numbers. +could you also for your passports just note the following information. +country of issue, whether it's a five or ten year passport expiry date and your passport numbers. again we can, we use that information when we go through various customs and border points. -if if we can give the lists in it just makes it easier. +if if we can give the lists in it just makes it easier. so if i could ask you just to complete that. forms? yes er there's some more over here, they're on their way round. -right, has everybody got one now? +right, has everybody got one now? are there any spare green forms anywhere? here. thank you. can you, if you can let, simply let me have those in at the end of the session or if you can give them to eleanor at the end of the session. right. okay wh what er i'll give you time to fill that in at the end. -erm what we're gonna do for the second part of the morning is to look, if you like at the tourism application for the determinants of demand. +erm what we're gonna do for the second part of the morning is to look, if you like at the tourism application for the determinants of demand. i'm gonna start by going back to that graph we looked at first thing this morning which is trying to explain what had been happening to the pattern of tourism, both visitors to this country and visitors moving away from this country in the period nineteen seventy eight to nineteen eighty two. -and if you wanna look at this graph the period we're talking about is indicated with these dotted lines and you can see the green line here representing u k residents holidaying abroad. +and if you wanna look at this graph the period we're talking about is indicated with these dotted lines and you can see the green line here representing u k residents holidaying abroad. you've got a very sharp increase and then after nineteen eighty two it stabilizes a little bit. er it moves up again in eighty five to eighty six and the general trend you can see is still upwards though it's certainly not repeating the growth in this period. -at the same time, you can see the domestic holidays the pattern's less clear, but certainly there doesn't appear to have been any growth. -now what i want to do is look at what was happening at that time and then try and explain using the determinants of demand what the patterns actually were. -and so if we look at what happened generally between nineteen seventy eight and nineteen eighty two the general picture is that the number of total holidays taken actually fell by three percent. +at the same time, you can see the domestic holidays the pattern's less clear, but certainly there doesn't appear to have been any growth. +now what i want to do is look at what was happening at that time and then try and explain using the determinants of demand what the patterns actually were. +and so if we look at what happened generally between nineteen seventy eight and nineteen eighty two the general picture is that the number of total holidays taken actually fell by three percent. and the number of u k holidays taken, domestic holidays in this country, that figure fell by seventeen percent and yet we can see here that holidays actually taken abroad by u k residents rose a staggering fifty seven percent over the four year period. -so clearly in this period the u k holidaymaker moved from being someone who primarily took their holidays in the u k very definitely into someone who was now taking their holidays abroad. +so clearly in this period the u k holidaymaker moved from being someone who primarily took their holidays in the u k very definitely into someone who was now taking their holidays abroad. now furthermore, if we look at what was happening to the population itself, remember that under the economic basis of looking at determinants of demand, we saw that income was a crucial factor. and so if we look at what was happening to income at that time, we find that the disposable income, meaning the amount of money we have to spend on other things after we've bought essentials, that figure rose by only one and a half percent throughout this period. however, holiday expenditure rose by twenty four percent and spending on overseas trips rose by fifty percent. @@ -69200,15 +69139,15 @@ now the other thing we should remember is that between nineteen seventy eight an at the same time, we know that unemployment in this period was rising rapidly. and so if people had less money in their pockets and they were losing their jobs, what factors can explain why more and more people were actually going on holiday abroad? it doesn't, if you like, make sense and the key year, as i say, is nineteen seventy eight because that was the first time that spending on overseas holidays exceeded the spending on u k holidays. -so from nineteen seventy seven, seventy eight the u k holidaymaker now became an overseas holidaymaker in the main. -and we can conclude that some form of revolution had taken place in overseas holiday participation despite the high unemployment and the recession. +so from nineteen seventy seven, seventy eight the u k holidaymaker now became an overseas holidaymaker in the main. +and we can conclude that some form of revolution had taken place in overseas holiday participation despite the high unemployment and the recession. what we're gonna try and answer now is the reasons why this happened. because on the basis of the economic models and the way which we look at determinants of demand in economics, this shouldn't have happened, we should have had the reverse, we should have had fewer holidays being taken and certainly fewer overseas holidays. can anybody s like to suggest what reasons could possibly explain why so many overseas holidays were being taken? or where the money was coming from to actually pay for these holidays. is it to do with the package industry revolution? right. -er certainly within package holiday companies itself, competition was intense during this period and price being the major factor in determinants of demand, all the tour operators try to keep price down to a minimum and over this period you would find the average price for a package holiday would barely have changed one year to the next. +er certainly within package holiday companies itself, competition was intense during this period and price being the major factor in determinants of demand, all the tour operators try to keep price down to a minimum and over this period you would find the average price for a package holiday would barely have changed one year to the next. in fact if you look at the average price of a package holiday since nineteen seventy eight, the increase in prices has been absolutely marginal. certainly well below the rate of inflation. an illustration if you like of how competitive the package holiday industry became. @@ -69224,67 +69163,67 @@ er making yourself feel good even if it's only for a short time. if you can imagine someone losing their job, the depression that actually causes, perhaps both within them and with their family, the idea of being able to take them away for a holiday to forget about things might be a good thing at the end of the day. the other thing is that of course, going back to the competition with price, these holidays weren't that expensive. we're not talking about vast sums of money necessarily here. -are there any other factors which can explain the taking of these holidays? +are there any other factors which can explain the taking of these holidays? the rising cost of holidays in the u k. er okay, it could be the rising cost of holidays in the u k. possibly not so much the cost, what other factors in the list of, of determinants could come into play now? weather. right, climate is always a major consideration. -er in nineteen seventy six for example, we had the long hot summer as people call it. -i think we had something like eight and a half months without rain and there's the feeling, quite often, that when we get a good summer in this country, people assume that the next summer will be just as good. -and so you can imagine all the people in nineteen seventy six thinking well you know, there's definitely been a climatic change, we're gonna holiday in the u k in nineteen seventy seven. +er in nineteen seventy six for example, we had the long hot summer as people call it. +i think we had something like eight and a half months without rain and there's the feeling, quite often, that when we get a good summer in this country, people assume that the next summer will be just as good. +and so you can imagine all the people in nineteen seventy six thinking well you know, there's definitely been a climatic change, we're gonna holiday in the u k in nineteen seventy seven. nineteen seventy seven's summer was a total washout and that would tend to push people perhaps more towards guaranteed sunshine in the mediterranean. so climate is a key factor. anything else? okay well let's look at some of the main possible reasons for this in more detail. the reasons i'm gonna give you were supplied by a guy called tony . -tony is actually a consultant. -he used to be the marketing director of butlins and obviously these trends were important to him when he was at butlins because butlins was actually losing the market. +tony is actually a consultant. +he used to be the marketing director of butlins and obviously these trends were important to him when he was at butlins because butlins was actually losing the market. so the reasons why. -the first thing we can say is definitely the strength of the pound. +the first thing we can say is definitely the strength of the pound. the pound sterling was very strong against the dollar and relatively strong against currencies like the deutschmark. now bearing in mind what we were saying about exchange rates before the break, if the pound was strong that obviously implied that people wanted to buy sterling, but what goods did they want to buy off us? what major good were we producing or did we start producing around nineteen seventy seven? which brought a lot of money into the country. one major good. output. -okay it begins with o oil. +okay it begins with o oil. okay? very good. north sea oil. north sea oil came on board and suddenly we had a product which people wanted to buy. in order to buy the oil off us, they had to pay sterling and so hence the demand for sterling goes up and suddenly we were viewed as a very rich economy. -ironically the price of sterling went up so high that it made it very difficult for us to sell our other manufactured goods and many people are now of the belief that because of the north sea oil price rises, this had an adverse affect on our economy, making it more difficult for us to sell manufacturing goods because the pound was very strong against other currencies. +ironically the price of sterling went up so high that it made it very difficult for us to sell our other manufactured goods and many people are now of the belief that because of the north sea oil price rises, this had an adverse affect on our economy, making it more difficult for us to sell manufacturing goods because the pound was very strong against other currencies. so the strength of the pound caused through north sea oil was a major factor. it meant it, it was very cheap for us to go to places like florida for our holidays. secondly, there was relatively low inflation abroad, certainly in the main holiday destinations in europe. prices were not going up too fast and again this made it economical for us to visit. there was also a decline in real air transport cost. and by this we mean in terms of things like the cost of fuel, although it did go up again in nineteen seventy nine, but also with respect to new services being offered. -er laker with his skytrain, the people's express, we had a lot of new airline operations starting up which offered cheap seats so that the relative cost of flying was coming down. +er laker with his skytrain, the people's express, we had a lot of new airline operations starting up which offered cheap seats so that the relative cost of flying was coming down. and the net result of all of these things together is that it narrowed the cost value differentials between u k and overseas holidays. overseas holidays now started to look cheaper than actually going abroad. sorry, than actually holidaying in britain. -right, the second factor which tony outlined was what was happening in the population and again we've already talked about this. +right, the second factor which tony outlined was what was happening in the population and again we've already talked about this. basically there's a decline in the number of children during this period, people under the age of sixteen, by around about eleven percent. -at the same time, there was a growth in the age group between sixteen and twenty four of about seven percent. -and finally, again we've already talked about the elderly er age groups, there was a growth in the sixty plus age group of about five per cent. -sir is that children ? +at the same time, there was a growth in the age group between sixteen and twenty four of about seven percent. +and finally, again we've already talked about the elderly er age groups, there was a growth in the sixty plus age group of about five per cent. +sir is that children ? yeah. yeah sixteen, under sixteen, then sixteen to twenty four, and then sixty plus. now in this particular period if you were looking at these figures just like this, what would be your automatic reaction in terms of the type of holidays we ought to be providing? what sort of holidays should we now start providing during this period? which age group? right, sixteen to twenty four. -so can you think of any er brochures or any companies which were around at that time to take advantage? +so can you think of any er brochures or any companies which were around at that time to take advantage? probably the most famous one right, club eighteen to thirty. okay so club eighteen to thirty was doing good business around this period because of this situation. -now what we have to do however is look at it in more in more detail than just simply the age of people. -we're also gonna look at where they live, remember what they're income is etcetera and the important thing is because of these increases here and because of the recession in general, it dictated to us that there were gonna be more one and two person households. +now what we have to do however is look at it in more in more detail than just simply the age of people. +we're also gonna look at where they live, remember what they're income is etcetera and the important thing is because of these increases here and because of the recession in general, it dictated to us that there were gonna be more one and two person households. households without children in other words. and this implies greater mobility both physically and financially. -if you picture a, for example, a typical couple perhaps living in london, erm the price of property is such that you maybe start with an apartment. +if you picture a, for example, a typical couple perhaps living in london, erm the price of property is such that you maybe start with an apartment. if you want to have children you've gotta offset that against, for example, having a car or a new stereo, things which affect your lifestyle. so the pattern would have been perhaps towards marrying later, or certainly having children later and then perhaps moving out of london. so this in a sense tends to reinforce the idea of these households with just one and two people living in them. @@ -69299,29 +69238,29 @@ climate obviously is a major determinant of demand, attracting people to if you ironically, now we're probably moving into a new era where sunshine is actually seen as something harmful giving things like skin cancer, er certainly in the australia market it's the case at the moment. and so ironically, although climate will be a factor in er this century and into the next century, it could be well to escape the sun. the direct reverse if you like of this period here. -the second factor is of is the whole question of holiday entitlements. -the number of weeks paid holiday that a worker will get is increasing rapidly so as today we have the norm of twenty days plus public bank holidays, giving more time if you like to engage in a package holiday abroad. +the second factor is of is the whole question of holiday entitlements. +the number of weeks paid holiday that a worker will get is increasing rapidly so as today we have the norm of twenty days plus public bank holidays, giving more time if you like to engage in a package holiday abroad. another social factor is the whole thing about foreign holidays being seen as somehow superior. remember we keep talking about tourism as being fashionable, it's fashionable to say you've been to certain destinations. saying you've been to those destinations in the u k doesn't actually hold the same appeal or esteem. so the foreign holidays, because you're guaranteed sunshine, cheap alcohol, everything else, somehow being seen as better than the traditional british holiday. at this time remember the traditional british holiday was seen as staying in a boarding house with a landlady. -you had to be in at a certain time you know, you had very standard cuisine, it was, it had become if you like, ridiculed in jokes and things of this nature. -and yeah another one connected to this whole lifestyle, aspirational argument the image the brochures give us of a couple si sitting on a terrace with, you know, you can almost hear the music in the background, the sun setting over the sea. +you had to be in at a certain time you know, you had very standard cuisine, it was, it had become if you like, ridiculed in jokes and things of this nature. +and yeah another one connected to this whole lifestyle, aspirational argument the image the brochures give us of a couple si sitting on a terrace with, you know, you can almost hear the music in the background, the sun setting over the sea. if you like, giving us the hollywood image that we can live that lifestyle for two weeks. very difficult to imagine british resorts somehow trying to capture that. i mean you simply can't, you can't guarantee the sunsets for one thing. a fourth factor, education. -er around this period we have the widespread use of things like colour television which has now started to appear in everybody's homes and the beginnings of various holiday programmes. +er around this period we have the widespread use of things like colour television which has now started to appear in everybody's homes and the beginnings of various holiday programmes. so that again, once a week you have a visual image of what different resorts look like, but this time in colour. and again we talked last week about the use of colour in photographs in brochures and things, if you like, to reinforce the sunshine element when you're sat in the snow in the winter watching wish you were here or one of the holiday programmes. video is probably also an important factor. a lot of travel companies starting to introduce video. -very commonplace today go in to thomas cook's there'll be a video running continually with one destination or another or an activity holiday etcetera. +very commonplace today go in to thomas cook's there'll be a video running continually with one destination or another or an activity holiday etcetera. and a fourth factor, third factor rather, school trips. -now again i mentioned this last week, the idea of introducing schoolchildren at a very young age to different countries and different cultures so that in fact when they come to go on holiday on their own or with a partner it holds no fear for them unlike, if you like, senior citizens might do. +now again i mentioned this last week, the idea of introducing schoolchildren at a very young age to different countries and different cultures so that in fact when they come to go on holiday on their own or with a partner it holds no fear for them unlike, if you like, senior citizens might do. and it's plain that this in fact is one of the major reasons explaining why more and more people are actually travelling overseas now. -the final thing is to do with marketing and here we've got, in particular, the convenience of the its, remember the inclusive tours. +the final thing is to do with marketing and here we've got, in particular, the convenience of the its, remember the inclusive tours. you go to a travel agent, you pay a cheque and that will cover your accommodation, your meals, your transport, your insurance, it can even cover your entertainment. very very easy to purchase. if you contrast that with holidaying in britain, even today relatively few people will be a buy a package holiday in britain because somehow we think we can do it better ourselves. @@ -69336,40 +69275,40 @@ if you go past any travel agent's window during the winter, look at what they've invariably it will have palm trees and sunshine. it has maximum impact when we're trudging through the snow and the rain. and the final thing, a factor we've already mentioned, price competition. -now these are the reasons that, why tony claims the revolution would have taken place around this period. +now these are the reasons that, why tony claims the revolution would have taken place around this period. and these are all re really valid but what i want to do now is start looking more into how a visitor actually thinks. what influences them inside their heads to actually go for a certain destination. and how do we actually use this in marketing. -now we started the morning by looking at the determinants of demand. -and what i want to do now is to look at two elements. +now we started the morning by looking at the determinants of demand. +and what i want to do now is to look at two elements. i'm gonna split the determinants into two. on the one hand i'm gonna say you've got the enabling factors, these are things which enable you to actually participate in taking a holiday overseas. and then here we've got the motivating factors. if you like the psychological influences. -so we might in fact simplify this by saying these are the enabling factors if you like, to leave home these are the motivating factors pulling us to a certain destination. +so we might in fact simplify this by saying these are the enabling factors if you like, to leave home these are the motivating factors pulling us to a certain destination. and,go through the enabling factors first, they're very very straightforward, it's the motivating factors which are more complex. so what are the things which enable you to leave home? -firstly if you've got a supply of holiday products on offer. +firstly if you've got a supply of holiday products on offer. if you've got travel agents round every street corner then it's very easy simply to walk into them and buy a package on the spot. you don't need, for example, months of preparation and planning in terms of perhaps where you're gonna go. this is particularly true in recent years, because more and more people nowadays book holidays at the last minute. very often it's to try and take advantage of price deals, but also it's because we now know there perhaps isn't the urgency to buy a holiday in february because we know there'll be plenty around still in june or july. increasingly as well many people are making their own holiday arrangements. er some of you i suspect are already into things like bucketshop flights. -how many how many people are aware of bucketshop flights? +how many how many people are aware of bucketshop flights? tried it? well not necessarily tried it but you're aware that they exist. yes, well it's a few people. -these are very very cheap discounted tickets er usually using what we might call the dodgier carriers of the world, not necessarily those which have got a bad safety records or crash records, but where the cuisine isn't quite as good on board, or you don't get an inflight movie. -erm just to digress, you've got well known airlines er such as tarob of rumania where you can get cheap flights with them virtually anywhere except ironically to rumania -erm you've got other airlines erm such as erm er geruda of indonesia er imam of bangladesh, there's a whole sequence of them. +these are very very cheap discounted tickets er usually using what we might call the dodgier carriers of the world, not necessarily those which have got a bad safety records or crash records, but where the cuisine isn't quite as good on board, or you don't get an inflight movie. +erm just to digress, you've got well known airlines er such as tarob of rumania where you can get cheap flights with them virtually anywhere except ironically to rumania +erm you've got other airlines erm such as erm er geruda of indonesia er imam of bangladesh, there's a whole sequence of them. and if you wanna go somewhere in south east asia you can pick up flights which are very very cheap. less than half the price of, for example, a standard british air apex ticket. so the supply available is very important. likewise when we go to a country, we need somewhere to stay and over the last decade there have been more and more hotels built in virtually every place in the world. secondly, you need disposable income, obviously. a third factor concerns, if you like, the demographic situation, if you've got children erm if you've got elderly relatives to look after, that will obviously determine whether you're enabled to travel and perhaps where to. -you've also got geographical factors the journey time. +you've also got geographical factors the journey time. again last week we talked about the feasibility of going to australia for a week and the impact it would have on you after things like jetlag. you've got things like socio-cultural factors in terms of paid holidays. how many paid holidays do you get a year and when are you likely to be able to take them. @@ -69381,7 +69320,7 @@ for example if you go for a peter stuyvesant activity holiday, you have to have erm unless you've got a doctor's note saying that you've passed the medical, they won't allow you to actually go on the activity holiday. now that's a drawback in many respects, but it's also if you er think about it, a very good selling point. it makes it sound really challenging and adventurous before you've even bought the package, the mere fact that you have to go through that beforehand. -motivating factors are more complex and the sort of things we'll be talking about here something we call income elasticity. +motivating factors are more complex and the sort of things we'll be talking about here something we call income elasticity. and in fact we'll come back to look at this and bob will also be looking at er with you environmental analysis as well. erm the whole question here is if you have more money in a sense, what do you spend it on? in general we find that, for a very small increase in, for example, wages, we tend to spend a lot more, proportionately, on holidays. @@ -69393,33 +69332,33 @@ but it doesn't seem to work like that. in general even if the price of a holiday goes up extortionately, the number of people going overseas tends to stay about the same. w we haven't noticed, if you like, a very big change in it. if you at the statistics over the last three to four years, you'll find the number of u k people travelling abroad has always stayed round about the thirty million mark, despite what's happened to the prices. -a second factor motivating people again it's the demographic situation, the fact that if you haven't got children, you're free to do what you want. +a second factor motivating people again it's the demographic situation, the fact that if you haven't got children, you're free to do what you want. you don't have any, if you like, responsibilities as such. geographical factors can be a motivating factor, er we've talked about the sun and the influence of the sun. you can also have geographical factors again, as we said last week, to do with things like scenery and obviously geographical factors are very important if we consider skiing er with the classification of the ski slopes between difficult and suit beginners. or the pistes as we call them. -socio-cultural factors these relate to things like our beliefs and notions and our aspirations. +socio-cultural factors these relate to things like our beliefs and notions and our aspirations. but probably the key one here is the belief that somehow if we go on holiday, we're gonna come back totally refreshed. -again we talked about this last week, fifty weeks of the year you toil and you look forward to your holiday months in advance, you then take your holiday and somehow it recharges your batteries so that you're ready to do battle again for the next fifty weeks. -it's claimed by many people that we live in a cycle where, if you like, we struggle to get through fifty weeks of the year to live for holidays recharge the batteries, then you go into it again. +again we talked about this last week, fifty weeks of the year you toil and you look forward to your holiday months in advance, you then take your holiday and somehow it recharges your batteries so that you're ready to do battle again for the next fifty weeks. +it's claimed by many people that we live in a cycle where, if you like, we struggle to get through fifty weeks of the year to live for holidays recharge the batteries, then you go into it again. incidentally on this one you've got the lifestyle aspirations. if you think of what you do on a holiday, it's a totally different lifestyle to when you're normally working and obviously people desire to have that sort of experience more and more, and you've got the rise of things like short breaks. so again the trend today is towards people having at least one overseas trip a year and possibly two or three short break weekends as well. er increasingly, we're also looking at a new market which has a holiday in the summer overseas and in winter goes skiing. again trying to get more of this lifestyle into their day to day existence. comparative prices are gonna be a motivating factor. -competition, the price of alternatives etcetera and then you only have to look in any travel agent's window to see that that's an important factor today. +competition, the price of alternatives etcetera and then you only have to look in any travel agent's window to see that that's an important factor today. windows covered in prices, lots of talk about discounts, vouchers, all sorts of things to try and get you to part with your money. personal mobility. here by the main we're talking about the motor car. the advent of the private car has made a greater percentage of the population mobile, we can reach many different areas today by private car. -and then we've got some factors which i wasn't sure where to put, government regulations erm again you'll come on to this later in the year deregulation of the airlines allowing free competition between airlines and low prices. -issuing of passports, currency exchange controls these can be both enabling and motivating factors. +and then we've got some factors which i wasn't sure where to put, government regulations erm again you'll come on to this later in the year deregulation of the airlines allowing free competition between airlines and low prices. +issuing of passports, currency exchange controls these can be both enabling and motivating factors. and finally, the big one, the impact of the mass media. -everything from newspapers to television movies the lot. -and so while these things here enable us to leave home, if you like, these things are buzzing round in our head and in marketing these are things we have to look at in order to, we have to be able to make product and then try and assess how will the tourist or potential tourist respond to this. +everything from newspapers to television movies the lot. +and so while these things here enable us to leave home, if you like, these things are buzzing round in our head and in marketing these are things we have to look at in order to, we have to be able to make product and then try and assess how will the tourist or potential tourist respond to this. what will they think about it. -and so just gonna do a diagram now, just look at buying influences. +and so just gonna do a diagram now, just look at buying influences. what are the things which actually are going through someone's head when they buy a product. you don't need to list all of these, just the headings are fine. we've got both, if you like, cultural motivations in our head. @@ -69443,7 +69382,7 @@ so attention seeking's one thing. have a good time. sorry? to have a good time. -okay, you could what, what would you be hoping to achieve during that good time? +okay, you could what, what would you be hoping to achieve during that good time? have a few laughs, what else though? what other things do you hope or do you think might happen shall we say? to meet some nice people to go on holiday with. @@ -69457,7 +69396,7 @@ right, cuisine could be an important motivating factor. er basically stuffing yourself to excess for two weeks. drinking yourself to excess for two weeks for peanuts. again, that would be something. -but in general the people who are doing some of those things, a lot of it's probably escapism certain type, complete break from their work. +but in general the people who are doing some of those things, a lot of it's probably escapism certain type, complete break from their work. what other things do you think you would hope to get as a result of your holiday? time to relax. right. @@ -69486,34 +69425,34 @@ see how it feels, the way that they live there. okay well that would again tie perhaps more in with culture. i mean you can, you're starting to get, if you like, a big list now of motivating factors. er for example all of us in this room, if we went to one destination, we'd probably all come away with a different combination of things that we'd actually got from it. -it might be education, it might be knowledge, interest can be another one er relaxation, romance, having a good time there are a whole se sequence of different reasons. -there are other reasons as well, things like peace and tranquillity er time to reflect er and yeah there are other motivations as well which you, if you like, are kind of negative. -for example the desire to escape your humdrum existence back here, er the desire to escape the family, er to have someone moaning at you continually, these are all important factors which add on. -so in effect there are kind of like negative motivating factors which is basically all to do about escape where you don't care where you go as long as you get away from here. +it might be education, it might be knowledge, interest can be another one er relaxation, romance, having a good time there are a whole se sequence of different reasons. +there are other reasons as well, things like peace and tranquillity er time to reflect er and yeah there are other motivations as well which you, if you like, are kind of negative. +for example the desire to escape your humdrum existence back here, er the desire to escape the family, er to have someone moaning at you continually, these are all important factors which add on. +so in effect there are kind of like negative motivating factors which is basically all to do about escape where you don't care where you go as long as you get away from here. and then there are the things you get when you actually go to a destination. -so again if we look at all of these things across the top we've got other things influencing across here when you go on holiday you, each of you in this room, you'll probably have some idea beforehand of what you want to get out of that holiday. +so again if we look at all of these things across the top we've got other things influencing across here when you go on holiday you, each of you in this room, you'll probably have some idea beforehand of what you want to get out of that holiday. for example if you go on an overland trip trekking in erm south america, you're clearly looking for something totally different than the person who goes on the sort of typical club eighteen to thirty type holiday. -other things which will influence, it's claimed, are things like social class er again used ex er extensively by marketing people in this country. +other things which will influence, it's claimed, are things like social class er again used ex er extensively by marketing people in this country. now you'll be doing this before christmas, and what it is is there, there are lots of different categories we can use but the standard one is dividing the population into six distinct categories. -by and large it's according to people's occupations and you start with a which will be professional people, surgeons solicitors etcetera. +by and large it's according to people's occupations and you start with a which will be professional people, surgeons solicitors etcetera. you have b which are managers. c one which would be office workers. -c two skilled workers. +c two skilled workers. d unskilled workers and e, that would be everybody else. okay? and as students you're in e. so this will actually influence you, because you'll be able to look through the brochures and see which of those groups it's being targeted at. -erm to give you an example let me show you this brochure here this is page and moy high prices and clearly that is aimed at a and b. -looking at this one you can see that the whole format's totally different, like the cartoon on the front and the layout. -and that who would you say that was aimed at? +erm to give you an example let me show you this brochure here this is page and moy high prices and clearly that is aimed at a and b. +looking at this one you can see that the whole format's totally different, like the cartoon on the front and the layout. +and that who would you say that was aimed at? well it's young people, what sort of occupations? would it appeal to you? do you think? -er there +er there mm yeah i think it would yeah. so we're probably thinking perhaps partly students. -er because people in this age group haven't yet become managers and certainly not professional, we're probably thinking more in terms of the es and students and perhaps c twos c ones. +er because people in this age group haven't yet become managers and certainly not professional, we're probably thinking more in terms of the es and students and perhaps c twos c ones. these are not cheap holidays so it probably rules out the d category. so the social class structure is important. it's also the question of mixing between these groups as well. @@ -69530,15 +69469,15 @@ our thought processes. for example if you went to nepal, one of your motivations for going there might be to meditate or relax and that would be a cognition. it's something you would know within your own head. we have the various learning processes, how do we learn? -that's quite an interesting one, if you consider as students how do you learn erm in general you probably don't learn that much in lectures because for example we know from experiments that we all have a limited attention span. -basically you will listen for maybe seven minutes then you switch off for two minutes then you switch on again and then you try and think well what was i listening to seven minu well you know, three minutes ago what was probably said in the last two minutes. +that's quite an interesting one, if you consider as students how do you learn erm in general you probably don't learn that much in lectures because for example we know from experiments that we all have a limited attention span. +basically you will listen for maybe seven minutes then you switch off for two minutes then you switch on again and then you try and think well what was i listening to seven minu well you know, three minutes ago what was probably said in the last two minutes. by the time you've sussed that out, you've missed another five minutes, your brain gets confused so you then switch off again for another three minutes and try and clear everything. and you're doing this the whole time. but how do we actually learn? taking information through your senses. -okay you take in right reading, listening +okay you take in right reading, listening from experience. -from experience and there are also the occasions very often when you're, if you like, force fed. +from experience and there are also the occasions very often when you're, if you like, force fed. when you've got exams you have to learn. you have to be able to hold it up there and perhaps put it down on paper or apply it. we also learn from things like television. @@ -69546,13 +69485,13 @@ most of you here, a great deal of your knowledge probably comes from watching te possibly more nowadays than, for example, from reading as would have been the case in the past. this is an interesting one, the interpersonal response. how do you interact with people when you go abroad? -are you the type who wants to go up to, you're on holiday in spain, go up to a spaniard go hola +are you the type who wants to go up to, you're on holiday in spain, go up to a spaniard go hola you know, and actually try and hold a conversation with them. -are you the type who thinks god there's someone from spain over there, oh it's alright there's a load of people from my nationality in the bar and stick with them. -are you looking for the interaction where you learn something about the culture from talking to the people or do you want minimal interaction where simply you visit a place, and you stay in your little bubble or ghetto with people of your own tour company, you do everything together and you never come into contact with local people. -erm two if you like extremes and there's a lot of things in between. +are you the type who thinks god there's someone from spain over there, oh it's alright there's a load of people from my nationality in the bar and stick with them. +are you looking for the interaction where you learn something about the culture from talking to the people or do you want minimal interaction where simply you visit a place, and you stay in your little bubble or ghetto with people of your own tour company, you do everything together and you never come into contact with local people. +erm two if you like extremes and there's a lot of things in between. it doesn't incidentally mean that one is good and the other is bad. -er a lot of people give the impression that we should all be more interactive, that we should go abroad and speak languages to many of these people, but the people you come into contact with when you go on holiday in spain, the only spanish people are likely to be the waiter who served you and he's serving you as part of his job. +er a lot of people give the impression that we should all be more interactive, that we should go abroad and speak languages to many of these people, but the people you come into contact with when you go on holiday in spain, the only spanish people are likely to be the waiter who served you and he's serving you as part of his job. his job is also to be friendly to you, to smile at you, you know, when you want it, so it's not really an equal relationship. it's very difficult, if you like, to develop a true friendship and exchange of ideas. the waiter very often will tell you what you want to hear. @@ -69563,22 +69502,22 @@ in particular, what prejudices. do you have a prejudice against for example eating oily food? do you have a prejudice against the french? which a lot of english people do. -erm prejudices come from all sorts of things, some of them are historical, some of them are generated out of things like football and arguments in the evening about good teams. +erm prejudices come from all sorts of things, some of them are historical, some of them are generated out of things like football and arguments in the evening about good teams. prejudices, we're all born with them, they're if you like perceptions which are only changed very often through experience. we've then got general motivations themselves, which we listed. it's cheap price, good deal, that sort of thing. -and finally perhaps your own personality as well. -are you an extrovert person outgoing, willing to take a chance, willing to take a risk or are you more introverted perhaps? +and finally perhaps your own personality as well. +are you an extrovert person outgoing, willing to take a chance, willing to take a risk or are you more introverted perhaps? what is traits? traits means characteristics. -just to show you how this has developed, you don't need to copy this down, it's something that you'll do in the second year of your course, but we mentioned in particular here how you interact with people and what goes through your head. -and this has actually been categorized into two tables and by , they claim that you can define different types of tourists according to, firstly, the way in which they interact with the local people. +just to show you how this has developed, you don't need to copy this down, it's something that you'll do in the second year of your course, but we mentioned in particular here how you interact with people and what goes through your head. +and this has actually been categorized into two tables and by , they claim that you can define different types of tourists according to, firstly, the way in which they interact with the local people. so at one extreme you've got the explorer who simply goes off into the unknown. the, the last thing the explorer wants on holiday is to meet people from their own country. th they wanna get far away from it. they don't really like being called a tourist in many places. many of them will use the term traveller because somehow it's less derogatory, it sounds more impressive. -and these people here will learn languages, they will eat the local food, they will do anything the locals do, they will dress like them, the lot in order to try and get as full a experience as possible. +and these people here will learn languages, they will eat the local food, they will do anything the locals do, they will dress like them, the lot in order to try and get as full a experience as possible. at the other end, you have what we call the charter tourist. the person who goes there and basically they want to take their home with them. in the case of an englishman they'll want to take their beer, steak and chips, everything over to simply a hot climate and they live in their bubble. @@ -69586,12 +69525,12 @@ so you have these two extremes. in between you have elite, offbeat, unusual, mass and so on but they all lie somewhere between these extremes in terms of totally interacting and totally ignoring in many cases. the second type is the cognitive normative. in other words, defining tourists according to what's actually going through their heads. -and here for example you might have the recreational mind, healthy mind and body the existential, the person who as much as anything may be looking for an experience based on meditation, er religion, this sort of thing. -er you've got, also down here, experimental the person who experiments if you like with different cultures, trying to think of a different way, who's interested in religions. +and here for example you might have the recreational mind, healthy mind and body the existential, the person who as much as anything may be looking for an experience based on meditation, er religion, this sort of thing. +er you've got, also down here, experimental the person who experiments if you like with different cultures, trying to think of a different way, who's interested in religions. now you may think that the number of people in this category here is very minimal, but there's increasing numbers of people around the world travelling now who are motivated by things like this. you only have to look at the number of visitors going to places such as nepal er to see the increase there, to see how important this connection be. now for our purposes, the kind of thing we're gonna do, is look at a much simpler breakdown of tourists. -and this is gonna introduce you to a new word called psychographic and psychographic, you think you've got, you can break it in two you've got the psychological aspects and the graphic or mapping, the mapping of the psychology. +and this is gonna introduce you to a new word called psychographic and psychographic, you think you've got, you can break it in two you've got the psychological aspects and the graphic or mapping, the mapping of the psychology. and this has been translated by a gentleman by the name of stanley clog but we don't usually refer to it as clog's theory or anything like that. and stanley clog identifies four different types of tourist and these are the main ones which we're gonna use. @@ -69599,28 +69538,28 @@ two of them you'll of heard before i'm sure. the first one you won't have done. psychocentrics are the first one. if you're a psychocentric tourist, you're the type of person who's self inhibited. -you're perhaps a little nervous of change you haven't got really a desire for adventure or anything too challenging. +you're perhaps a little nervous of change you haven't got really a desire for adventure or anything too challenging. you prefer well packaged routine holidays in popular tourism destinations and you're looking at the three ss or four ss we should say. -so you're looking at a package holiday resort in spain in the main. +so you're looking at a package holiday resort in spain in the main. okay, psychocentrics. again, like to be in the crowds. the alternative are what we call alocentrics, these are outgoing people with varied interests. they're keen to explore, to find new things and they're likely to want independence. -and in between these two we also have something called midcentrics who do bits of both, but these are the two extremes. +and in between these two we also have something called midcentrics who do bits of both, but these are the two extremes. so all of you in this room are either a psychocentric or probably an alocentric. the type of person who goes on this holiday is almost certainly gonna be a psychocentric. -the type of person who goes on this holiday to destinations for example want somewhere unusual perhaps to india, is more likely to be an alocentric person cos they're getting away from the crowds. +the type of person who goes on this holiday to destinations for example want somewhere unusual perhaps to india, is more likely to be an alocentric person cos they're getting away from the crowds. okay so psychocentrics and alocentrics. so this is what stanley clog produced, now we're gonna add two more to this, two that you're all familiar with i'm sure, firstly, sunlust people. -people who chase the sun beach holidays and there's a lust for a tan. -so for example w i can't remember your name who's the girl next to you? +people who chase the sun beach holidays and there's a lust for a tan. +so for example w i can't remember your name who's the girl next to you? michelle. michelle is obviously a sunlust person in that respect and depending on whether she goes to a main package resort in spain or perhaps a beach in india, she can either be a psychocentric sunlust person or an alocentric sunlust person. and the alternative to this is wanderlust. -the person who wants to explore, keep on the move and typified by some form of touring holiday. -okay so now whenever you look at a package holiday brochure, you should be able to identify the market just using two words sunlust alocentric, wanderlust psychocentric and so on. -so if you're looking at a touring holiday in europe it's wanderlust probably, and if it's an, a coach tour round europe it's almost certain to be psychocentric. -if you're looking for a tour around borneo and indonesia, that's away from the crowds so we can say it's an alocentric wanderlust. +the person who wants to explore, keep on the move and typified by some form of touring holiday. +okay so now whenever you look at a package holiday brochure, you should be able to identify the market just using two words sunlust alocentric, wanderlust psychocentric and so on. +so if you're looking at a touring holiday in europe it's wanderlust probably, and if it's an, a coach tour round europe it's almost certain to be psychocentric. +if you're looking for a tour around borneo and indonesia, that's away from the crowds so we can say it's an alocentric wanderlust. so it's a very simple way, if you like, for us to define markets fairly accurately. okay can everybody understand that? sunlust, wanderlust, psychocentrics and alocentrics. @@ -69629,9 +69568,8 @@ er i've got two handouts which i want you to pick up er now. one is something sp specifically written on the demand for the tourism product after nineteen ninety one. try to highlight those factors or the determinants of demand which were gonna be important in buying the tourism products in nineteen ninety two. and the second is something on tourism decision making. -this simply gives you, it's only a two page handout, it gives you some idea of the sort of motivations from what people have written about them. +this simply gives you, it's only a two page handout, it gives you some idea of the sort of motivations from what people have written about them. what i also want you to do on this is if you can refer to adrian bull's book, the economics of travel and tourism, and just go through the relevant chapter on demand. - it's the wensley gate,group. the tape recorder is now running, i hope that it's going to be recording, but let us not erm, be inhibited as a result of that. erm, programmes, erm, haven't got a programme. @@ -69664,7 +69602,7 @@ if you see an article, a snippet, er, a comment, from a newspaper, from a magazi cut it out and bring it along, and i think it will all add to our discussion of healthy eating. i will try and remind you about that, er, on other occasions, so that it doesn't er, slip into the recesses. er, and the other thing, just to comment on the programme. -i hope that we shall have the deputy lord mayor, er, bob on the last wednesday of our session. +i hope that we shall have the deputy lord mayor, er, bob on the last wednesday of our session. the reason the programme's taken so long, was to find a time when he's available. that wednesday is in the school holiday, although we shall be continuing. it means that he can slip out of school, er, in the afternoon, when normally, in nor on a normal school day, he would not be able to do that. @@ -69738,9 +69676,9 @@ the term is used negatively, but the black sheep of the family maybe an attracti everyone, is says, can think of black sheep of their acquaintance. every can you think of a black sheep of your acquaintance, do you do you. no, i don't whether i can. -not acquaintance. +not acquaintance. perhaps i've, perhaps i've, perhaps i've mixed in a very sheltered society. -perhaps family history, perhaps, but not the very +perhaps family history, perhaps, but not the very yes, yes. no. i don't think er, and of course, er, again perhaps the idea of a black sheep, has changed over the years. @@ -69756,7 +69694,7 @@ nowadays, you know, erm, don't know whether that sort of thing enterprise, culture. en enterprise, culture, yes indeed. yes, yes. -er, i mean in the olden days, they used, they they usually the sent to the colonies or, sent into the army or or into religion, weren't they. +er, i mean in the olden days, they used, they they usually the sent to the colonies or, sent into the army or or into religion, weren't they. mm. mm. mm. @@ -69770,7 +69708,7 @@ yes. yes. yeah. i think they use the phrase now, do their own thing. -that yeah, yeah, yeah +that yeah, yeah, yeah mm. mm. mm. @@ -69790,7 +69728,7 @@ that showed initiative. but did it cut him off from the guidance he needed? the story relates, that he spent all. he was not prudent enough to have saved, so he began to be in want. -having came to the he was hungry, so he was glad to be h hired by a local farmer as a swine herd. +having came to the he was hungry, so he was glad to be h hired by a local farmer as a swine herd. even the pods he was giving to the pigs, he would have liked to have eaten himself. he decided to go home, and offer to be a servant instead of a son. but his father was overjoyed to see him, and at once threw a party. @@ -69798,7 +69736,7 @@ his elder brother coming home from the fields and hearing dancing enquired what when he heard the explanation, and that even the best calf had been killed, the fatted calf had been killed, to help the party he was furious. and that is understandable. at this point, we are then asked to consider, does the elder brother become the family black sheep, is there a sort of change of position. -i don't know what +i don't know what i wouldn't think so. no. a brother. @@ -69826,20 +69764,20 @@ i'm no longer, yes. the next, the next question is is jealousy another powerful promoter of family black sheep. i'm not quite sure what that means. is is is is jealousy another power promoter of family black sheep. -it is jealousy that pushes people into being black sheep, into er doing something which is not acceptable. -yes, i think it can part of it. +it is jealousy that pushes people into being black sheep, into er doing something which is not acceptable. +yes, i think it can part of it. mm. mm. you know one sees, rightly or wrongly, that the other one is having preferential treatment. yeah, yeah. and getting attention seeking. it could well have been the jealousy of the older brother, what caused him to be thought of as a black sheep. -black sheep, yes, yeah so jealousy is quite powerful, could could be the driving force, between sons, yes. +black sheep, yes, yeah so jealousy is quite powerful, could could be the driving force, between sons, yes. sons. in those days when there's land expected. yeah, yeah, yeah. -this, by the way, erm, it it is applied with this study, and that is during the thirties, particularly on the, well it it actually carried on into the forties, but but the, there was a almost a character in many plays, where one one character was, in effect, the family black sheep. -erm, there was in eden end, erm, there was another character in erm,there was a further one in +this, by the way, erm, it it is applied with this study, and that is during the thirties, particularly on the, well it it actually carried on into the forties, but but the, there was a almost a character in many plays, where one one character was, in effect, the family black sheep. +erm, there was in eden end, erm, there was another character in erm,there was a further one in oh, yes. yeah. now, all these were black sheep, they were the nicest of the lot, and there was no, they were the ones you turned to, if you wanted to discuss your troubles. @@ -69847,11 +69785,11 @@ not the other respectable brigade, and indeed in eden end, the whole play turns mm. the the family black sheep, the other sister went, er, er, left home to go on the stage. but of course, when she came back, all sorts of things began to happen, that's by the way. -one other little point, in brideshead revisited, there's a character who never appears, she's always spoken about, and thwarted and that is the man who brideshead marries, and she says, talking to julia, julie was no better than she should have been. +one other little point, in brideshead revisited, there's a character who never appears, she's always spoken about, and thwarted and that is the man who brideshead marries, and she says, talking to julia, julie was no better than she should have been. you know, she says, in every catholic family, er, there is always a relapse person, and it's usually the nicest. aw. mm. -so even evelyn waugh's told this story. +so even evelyn waugh's told this story. yes, yes, yes, yeah. so a again, the idea of perception comes into it, doesn't it. @@ -69860,7 +69798,7 @@ it's it's the way, erm, the person is perceived and and and the perception may not be accurate. it it that it may be influences, er, at work there. erm, the the the suggestion was then, that the two young men and the the parable of the prodigal of son, started off as insiders, but in turn, they became outsiders in in in in some way. -erm, and the final short paragraph of that section refers to the parable of the lost sheep, er, not necessarily of black in colour, but deviant in behaviour, figuratively a black sheep. +erm, and the final short paragraph of that section refers to the parable of the lost sheep, er, not necessarily of black in colour, but deviant in behaviour, figuratively a black sheep. i'll leave you to to look up that one, and erm, and and read if you want to do. a section then on branwell bronte. a short life, you erm, you you you perhaps will be able to contribute from your knowledge of erm, bronte, particularly of branwell bronte. @@ -69888,7 +69826,7 @@ encouraged by his father and several friends, branwell acquired an artist's stud but, sad to say, talking and drinking got the better of him, and his work deteriorated. twice he became a tutor, but he neglected his work. in one case he had an affair with the mistress of the house, which led to his dismissal. -he had a period as a railway clerk at bridge, but was dismissed because of a deficit of eleven pounds. +he had a period as a railway clerk at bridge, but was dismissed because of a deficit of eleven pounds. as barbara and gareth lloyd-evans say, it's impossible to know how the money disappeared. embezzlement forgetfulness, inefficiency. did branwell grow up. @@ -69921,12 +69859,12 @@ which tend to . yes, i i think, in cer in in most cases that would happen, wouldn't it, if if if the child starts off with a feeling of insecurity, with possible instability. mm. -then a powerful father is going to make the situation worse. +then a powerful father is going to make the situation worse. because him being the only son. mm. he was probably spoilt by his sisters, and and got more or less what he wanted as a child, and as a child. -carried on you know, what i want, i get. +carried on you know, what i want, i get. mm. in adulthood. what is this, thirty, thirty, how old was he, thirty-one when he died. @@ -69940,7 +69878,7 @@ not mentioned there, but doubtless. that is, that is true. okay, the next thing, erm, accurate or not, trevor and i have already sa erm, talked about this, erm, many an adult school members will remember the enthusiasm and popularity that surrounded the future edward the eighth, when he was prince of wales. prince of wales it is suggested erm, was a black sheep of the family. -here it was thought, was a man who understood the people and for them. +here it was thought, was a man who understood the people and for them. someone with a genuine concern for the wounded of world war one, the miners of south wales, the unemployed, for, and homeless in general. in slightly less than a year, citizens high expectations had been shattered and it was all over. as john parker put it, in the king of fools, he had it all, wealth, charm, good looks, and he threw it all away on an american divorcee, who even his closest advisers considered an adventuress. @@ -69957,20 +69895,20 @@ affection bringing with it devoted support, brought success from a role undertak edward said he could not fulfil the role without the support of the woman he loved. some family black sheep are making a bid for affection. edward had the attention of the whole world, but without adequate personal affection, it was of no avail. -on december the eighth, nineteen thirty-six, time of the ab abdication, the times published a singularly apt quotation from a hopeless, throneless king, loathsome to men below to god's above a sad example of the slights of life. -what is your view of the way edward was treated after his abdication. +on december the eighth, nineteen thirty-six, time of the ab abdication, the times published a singularly apt quotation from a hopeless, throneless king, loathsome to men below to god's above a sad example of the slights of life. +what is your view of the way edward was treated after his abdication. and none of us admits to being alive when all this happened, we, that goes without saying. absolutely. i did see him as a six year old child. -so yes, as a -visited our town, our town. +so yes, as a +visited our town, our town. he was a six year old child. -erm, i was a six year +erm, i was a six year yes, yes, yes, yes, yeah. so wh wh what do you think of the the attitude that was displayed towards him after the abdication? he was very, very, generously treated. far too generously. -i mean, he he could five hundred thousand pound on a christmas present to his bride. +i mean, he he could five hundred thousand pound on a christmas present to his bride. my god. mm. he was more or less paid to go away and keep his head down, wasn't he. @@ -69983,14 +69921,14 @@ all the here , a lot of the hereditary jewellery never, never got found. no. no. after he had gone. -it was the er, either they they er -yes, i think they off. +it was the er, either they they er +yes, i think they off. say something. mm. so he he was he was paid off in in er, in a way. yeah. yeah. -allowed to +allowed to yeah, they had to. go away and keep quiet, and yeah, yes. @@ -69998,26 +69936,26 @@ it all of course, the erm, the interesting thing is, that he wasn't the black sheep of the family. no. no. -it's okay i prefer pizza. +it's okay i prefer pizza. yeah you can't always eat pizzas jonathan! -and lasagne and shepherd's pie. +and lasagne and shepherd's pie. oh. can you remember when steven put that salt on my dinner. -yeah who's going with mr ? +yeah who's going with mr ? mm? i said who's going with mr ? -jason and tom liam and matt probably and i don't know the rest. +jason and tom liam and matt probably and i don't know the rest. friends though isn't there? -yeah a tiny bit more. +yeah a tiny bit more. that's very nice jonathan. -mm oh ha oh! +mm oh ha oh! couldn't eat a bit more than that. cor, nor could i! it's filling innit? mm. very filling. here's daddy. -oh you're are you? +oh you're are you? we couldn't wait no longer! no i've been . ooh ooh ooh! @@ -70025,9 +69963,9 @@ ah smells a bit spicy what is it? ah bread! don't worry you'll . oh pardon me! -another job ooh oh you've had yours then. +another job ooh oh you've had yours then. mm i've just had it. -might as well take that, you've got plenty there oh, how you been then? +might as well take that, you've got plenty there oh, how you been then? okay. alright? you got my message did you? @@ -70037,7 +69975,7 @@ well yeah you know go mondays. well yeah but i thought you went monday mornings. no. monday afternoons. -no i didn't realise that well i mean +no i didn't realise that well i mean well i had to come all the way back didn't i. why? because i don't like his van. @@ -70045,13 +69983,13 @@ yeah but what's the matter? i couldn't, you can't really see on it. oh. i couldn't see, i ain't got my glasses on me. -oh i see oh. +oh i see oh. i'd have a guess. -yeah but i've gotta make so i had to come all the way home! -i'd come to that they -well i've made appointment for wednesday so bloody well keep that! +yeah but i've gotta make so i had to come all the way home! +i'd come to that they +well i've made appointment for wednesday so bloody well keep that! dad, i wonder why -yeah +yeah tape flickers? no. your voice. @@ -70066,8 +70004,8 @@ is it? yeah. oh good! is the tape ? -yeah yeah. -i taped i want you to check it for me, i taped me and sue walking home cos i have to do around the school you see. +yeah yeah. +i taped i want you to check it for me, i taped me and sue walking home cos i have to do around the school you see. yeah. so i can do it walking home can't i? yeah. @@ -70077,42 +70015,42 @@ he's on holiday for three days. oh is he? oh. i think he's getting his . -yeah no i didn't realise he weren't there said to see you tomorrow, they never said nothing and john said what's the matter with ken? +yeah no i didn't realise he weren't there said to see you tomorrow, they never said nothing and john said what's the matter with ken? i said oh i don't know. john ? -yeah so he said er what's the matter? +yeah so he said er what's the matter? john ? -yeah, said i dunno, said he isn't here today but er +yeah, said i dunno, said he isn't here today but er yeah well pam says he's got three days holiday. -oh can you come and stay ? +oh can you come and stay ? i didn't hear a word you said. what? . -what's that terry waite that's it. +what's that terry waite that's it. accident ooh ooh! in the . and he wonders why he's got a that's right he does. -something wrong with his he's likely to. +something wrong with his he's likely to. yeah. -he's on booze saturday afternoons and saturday night sunday afternoon lun sunday night, i said my god! +he's on booze saturday afternoons and saturday night sunday afternoon lun sunday night, i said my god! still with the money he saved he's got enough . -well he said he got through fifty quid. +well he said he got through fifty quid. well that's quite some money, fifty pounds worth of that's what he said -well he can put bought as much as we're gonna buy you can drink yourself silly for thirty one. -yeah i know. +well he can put bought as much as we're gonna buy you can drink yourself silly for thirty one. +yeah i know. no i thinks that sounds silly. what? -can you get can you get too oh there's none in it i like +can you get can you get too oh there's none in it i like shandy too. that's hot! nice. -pete's gone down to the shop and got yourself a bottle whisky. +pete's gone down to the shop and got yourself a bottle whisky. has he really? -makes the look nice dunnit? -well he's got a cold, a very bad cold. +makes the look nice dunnit? +well he's got a cold, a very bad cold. oh yeah. gotta bring him up to scratch . yeah. @@ -70128,14 +70066,14 @@ he went is that enough? yeah that's fine. is that alright ? -yep wonderful! +yep wonderful! right, done it! oh mum what have you done to it? -you don't want here are . +you don't want here are . oh alright, give it to them. even my . -no don't wipe your dirty one! -i'll get a clean one just turn that water off for us jonathan? +no don't wipe your dirty one! +i'll get a clean one just turn that water off for us jonathan? oh why? don't mess about with that! where? @@ -70145,53 +70083,53 @@ that's better. oh wait, let's see what you gotta tell me today. it's been a lovely day. i beat you to it. -yeah well i couldn't so i had to come over and and buy them a flipping new one! -ooh i number again, i'll take it out in a minute. +yeah well i couldn't so i had to come over and and buy them a flipping new one! +ooh i number again, i'll take it out in a minute. yeah. -oh no -and er she said well, i said i'm ever so sorry but she's anyway so i thought oh god! +oh no +and er she said well, i said i'm ever so sorry but she's anyway so i thought oh god! that's a step in the right direction. yeah. i rang yep dee dee dee doo doo . -you can't, you don't go through to that office at i go further on +you can't, you don't go through to that office at i go further on yeah. but they are amalgam is it yeah -amalgamating, with another firm so the paper work probably has got lost so i +amalgamating, with another firm so the paper work probably has got lost so i she said she was gonna ring me back, but you see i haven't been here this afternoon so i'll perhaps ring again tomorrow. okay. -well i couldn't do nothing about it really, she said well that'll be sorted out in she said i'll treat it, we're now sorting it out today what we're doing. +well i couldn't do nothing about it really, she said well that'll be sorted out in she said i'll treat it, we're now sorting it out today what we're doing. mm. -so i said well i hope it's not gonna be too long i said cos we're not a a very big firm and i said, you know, we want the money! -she said well i should imagine that's what's happened the paper work here has got muddled up with the other. +so i said well i hope it's not gonna be too long i said cos we're not a a very big firm and i said, you know, we want the money! +she said well i should imagine that's what's happened the paper work here has got muddled up with the other. oh. -so she said i'll do i'll sort it out straight away for you well i had a phone call at -eight o'clock this morning, who the hell that was from, i don't know, i was out the washing line i come flying in but i never got it, and nobody's rung. +so she said i'll do i'll sort it out straight away for you well i had a phone call at +eight o'clock this morning, who the hell that was from, i don't know, i was out the washing line i come flying in but i never got it, and nobody's rung. . -not unless i get a few phone calls from been here today. +not unless i get a few phone calls from been here today. yeah. but you must get that portable done cos then that reaches over there i can no it wouldn't would mm. it? i bet it do i bet it will! -well they go for it round to the erm cemetery. +well they go for it round to the erm cemetery. yeah well that'll be ever so handy, well you can try it can't you ? what way down now? to the cemetery? the cemetery round st. andrews. yeah. flipping heck! -would do then well if we go -past services. +would do then well if we go +past services. yeah, mum's house is over there. yeah don't go very well the other way we said, didn't we? i've i dunno why. it was half way outside . -well +well tell you why too bad. oh. @@ -70203,40 +70141,40 @@ yeah. you must get it sorted out though, after christmas yeah. there isn't much point now but -we can get right down to nearly. -well you see he'll +we can get right down to nearly. +well you see he'll why not? he'll be breaking up the twentieth and how long you on holiday, fortnight? -no +no i thought you had a long christmas break? well not i . we don't break up till the twenty eighth. yes you do, you break up on the twentieth! christmas on the twenty fifth. oh. -christmas day, yeah precisely! +christmas day, yeah precisely! christmas day is the twenty fifth! do you want a cup of coffee geoff? i bet this bit i'll have it after my tea. -cos got muddled up, then you know what he said? +cos got muddled up, then you know what he said? he said we'll have the twi quiz thing, we have the quiz thing on the twenty eighth. who said that. mr . i think he means the eighteenth. -no he probably means the twentieth. +no he probably means the twentieth. i'm just going in here -about the +about the to have this, no he said the la jonathan. -he said the last day yeah oh i hate these silly men. +he said the last day yeah oh i hate these silly men. mm. this one i swapped with christopher. yeah. this one i swapped with christopher. yeah -and this one i swapped with christopher +and this one i swapped with christopher yeah. he's got a little cloak. tell your dad what time we got up. @@ -70247,7 +70185,7 @@ this morning. that was last nights. yeah. that's it. -i'm going up stairs okay? +i'm going up stairs okay? go on then. yeah well i've i've just done that. two. @@ -70255,55 +70193,55 @@ so i just put you on it. what about me? well you are on it, you twit! oh. -see i got sue on it as well. +see i got sue on it as well. you can't get them back. erm, what else can i put there? what? we was at home put having tea -my aren't there. +my aren't there. then what can i put? no good on there, you told them off. walking from work. -yeah but that that is the sunday thing that's how i get muddled up with the date, but that's on the same tape you see? +yeah but that that is the sunday thing that's how i get muddled up with the date, but that's on the same tape you see? yeah. aha. -oh i'll put that yeah go on what was you gonna say? -oh i was just saying about that turkey thing and you said we'd never eat er +oh i'll put that yeah go on what was you gonna say? +oh i was just saying about that turkey thing and you said we'd never eat er frozen. -mm i was saying when he worked at smedley they used to can up baked beans for er smedleys themselves tesco's +mm i was saying when he worked at smedley they used to can up baked beans for er smedleys themselves tesco's yeah. -all sorts of different people he said i would never ever buy any beans he said cos of this chappie who used to work they used to unless you change over the tin or something he used to spit in the tins. +all sorts of different people he said i would never ever buy any beans he said cos of this chappie who used to work they used to unless you change over the tin or something he used to spit in the tins. urgh how disgusting! every time i said, my god! -every time he said he said i never had a ba tin of baked beans my god! +every time he said he said i never had a ba tin of baked beans my god! oh that's absolutely disgusting! -yeah he said ju that's it you just don't know what you buy in there. +yeah he said ju that's it you just don't know what you buy in there. cor i couldn't le urgh! quite! oh and we eat a lot of baked beans -i hope he don't work there still urgh! +i hope he don't work there still urgh! won't know. -what what time shall i put on there? +what what time shall i put on there? what time? -on here oh i'll put about +on here oh i'll put about mm. -yeah cos me and jonathan started talking on it before. +yeah cos me and jonathan started talking on it before. yeah. you know? mm. mm. -i ain't made too many mistakes oh i've put them marathon . +i ain't made too many mistakes oh i've put them marathon . mm. -nothing exciting happening, there's them poisoned dwarf. +nothing exciting happening, there's them poisoned dwarf. my mothers today. why's that? cos they took him off and put him somewhere else. i bet he didn't like that? no. was bleep in? -yeah he had a big do with the council man. +yeah he had a big do with the council man. why? the council bloke come down oh, what is val's accent? @@ -70311,71 +70249,71 @@ well west is it? yeah. to be exact. -well i don't know well that'll be on there if they want to know anyway now, you've just said it. -mm erm yeah the council bloke come down and went in while his father was there -i see you've got no carpets down anywhere the door's not painted and he said you've been living here for two years! +well i don't know well that'll be on there if they want to know anyway now, you've just said it. +mm erm yeah the council bloke come down and went in while his father was there +i see you've got no carpets down anywhere the door's not painted and he said you've been living here for two years! well what's the council man got to do with that? well they got a grant you see. well carpets ain't got nothing to do with it surely? -yes they have that's when i the house is finished. +yes they have that's when i the house is finished. oh. -when your carpets were down, you moved in so he's coming back december the eighth. -i thought he would have to tell them got his carpets down. +when your carpets were down, you moved in so he's coming back december the eighth. +i thought he would have to tell them got his carpets down. he had a carpet just put down in his lounge. well he's got a lot to do then. he was belly aching . cor! how's how's the thing between blue and -completely by now. +completely by now. good heavens! -even the first day back there was hardly any atmosphere at all very serious mood they were but kim keeps well out of it. +even the first day back there was hardly any atmosphere at all very serious mood they were but kim keeps well out of it. oh i think she's the trouble maker there myself. -yeah she'll just keep well out of it. -i think that's what started it all off i think she's running off. +yeah she'll just keep well out of it. +i think that's what started it all off i think she's running off. yeah. oh whatever you done? -yeah she was erm well necessarily cos that day blue was working on the other team as well so he had his erm break at different time. +yeah she was erm well necessarily cos that day blue was working on the other team as well so he had his erm break at different time. yeah. -and i er she comes storming out of the canteen swearing not at anybody in particular, just at herself really! +and i er she comes storming out of the canteen swearing not at anybody in particular, just at herself really! and then she's seen me, oh what time does blue finish? -i said whenever he about half past three so erm so then she come down geoff said you gotta finish half past three blue my god!. +i said whenever he about half past three so erm so then she come down geoff said you gotta finish half past three blue my god!. oh. and he did as well. what you mean? -well like sometimes i'll say to him everybody gonna finish about four you know +well like sometimes i'll say to him everybody gonna finish about four you know yeah. -what happens, then his she stands there, you bloody by four but i mean he finished when i said he was gonna finish for a change i should think. +what happens, then his she stands there, you bloody by four but i mean he finished when i said he was gonna finish for a change i should think. i didn't know julia hadn't been in for a long while. no, what's the matter with her? -she'd erm was erm getting a pie out the oven and cos some of the juice went on the floor, she wiped it up thinking she'd wiped it up properly and she didn't, she slipped, she's broken a couple of bones in her foot. +she'd erm was erm getting a pie out the oven and cos some of the juice went on the floor, she wiped it up thinking she'd wiped it up properly and she didn't, she slipped, she's broken a couple of bones in her foot. cor! no i ain't seen for ooh she hasn't been there for about a month. that's it then . i suppose she must have her foot in plaster. -mm and old bob down the road, bob , he hasn't been in for about the same sort of time this'll be his fourth week won't it? +mm and old bob down the road, bob , he hasn't been in for about the same sort of time this'll be his fourth week won't it? well i see him walking about the other day! he's hurt his hand. oh. come home from work on the saturday and assume he went shopping or something, apparently he hurt his hand.. has he? -yeah mr said have you seen do it? +yeah mr said have you seen do it? i said, no i haven't. -well i seen her at even the other day. +well i seen her at even the other day. yeah. -i think it might have been saturday possibly. +i think it might have been saturday possibly. by saturday normally i see him. well he goes up to do his shopping don't he, in town yeah. -and walk up . +and walk up . yeah. what does he do for christmas geoff? no idea. cos he's got a son away hasn't he? got a son up sunderland. perhaps goes there? -mm he normally goes up to his son's every six weeks. +mm he normally goes up to his son's every six weeks. does he? yeah. that must be a lonely old life for him living there all on his own. @@ -70387,21 +70325,21 @@ carrying on with . oh i don't know! yeah she was. i thought she was dead or something! -no she got off so she innit. +no she got off so she innit. oh i dunno. -i've i think i'm right in saying she was something to do with erm that boy who +i've i think i'm right in saying she was something to do with erm that boy who married someone else. yeah. oh! i think she was that doing it. perhaps it was her. -i dunno but erm oh yeah she's god, everybody used to go round their house. +i dunno but erm oh yeah she's god, everybody used to go round their house. oh crumbs! mm. and thi and this -all the blokes on the one night on they used to go in there. +all the blokes on the one night on they used to go in there. they didn't! -i assure you they did it's hard working down there for so long it +i assure you they did it's hard working down there for so long it yeah cos he's a nice little man ain't he? yeah he's harmless. yeah ever so harmless little fellah. @@ -70409,229 +70347,229 @@ yeah. hard working old boy as well. what about what brian said last night? what? -about, cos that man was sitting outside may . +about, cos that man was sitting outside may . oh may . he weren't sitting outside her house at all, he was sitting up here! yeah well he, didn't go up the sides or something? oh well he might of done, yeah. -make our bloody -they're paranoid for people breaking +make our bloody +they're paranoid for people breaking yeah. in arn't they. yeah. -i was telling sue about it, oh my god she said! +i was telling sue about it, oh my god she said! she said well they didn't look the type, i was going well now yeah. quite honestly he didn't! yeah. -i said and he's quite and inoffe i inoffensive little man he was a nice little man. +i said and he's quite and inoffe i inoffensive little man he was a nice little man. bag of nerves weren't he? well yeah, but he was a nice little man. yeah. he knew what he was talking about. -he reminded me of someone, i couldn't quite i know somebody who acts very much like him i just can't well i told him you remind me of someone. +he reminded me of someone, i couldn't quite i know somebody who acts very much like him i just can't well i told him you remind me of someone. did you get your milk today? no, none at all. oh right. -ooh i rang the club and sorted that out, done +ooh i rang the club and sorted that out, done mm. that. yep. -so she said well don't don't put them down again i'm doing it by the computer. +so she said well don't don't put them down again i'm doing it by the computer. ah! -so i said well do i get the things now? -so she said well no cos she said you're you're in the re in arrears a bit. +so i said well do i get the things now? +so she said well no cos she said you're you're in the re in arrears a bit. ooh i said, oh have i? it ain't a lot! -so she said i'll do it on the computer and and i'll let you know so we're eighty pound behind well course we never sent one month at all! +so she said i'll do it on the computer and and i'll let you know so we're eighty pound behind well course we never sent one month at all! did you not? no! -so we got behind so i said well we'll tr i'll try and get caught up sort of, in the new year you know, get them a bit . +so we got behind so i said well we'll tr i'll try and get caught up sort of, in the new year you know, get them a bit . actually i think i'm gonna finish that catalogue anyway i'm just which one are we talking about? grattan. oh yeah. and just have the other one cos they're such a peculiar funny firm they are! mm. -so i explained to them, i said well that's cos you changed over and i sort of never put it across through oh she said well don't worry i've done it now, she said you haven't got anything to worry about now, i said well it did bother me a bit to think that i didn't think you had my payment! -oh yes she said, we've had it i thought well why send me letters,then! +so i explained to them, i said well that's cos you changed over and i sort of never put it across through oh she said well don't worry i've done it now, she said you haven't got anything to worry about now, i said well it did bother me a bit to think that i didn't think you had my payment! +oh yes she said, we've had it i thought well why send me letters,then! well that's a standard letter i suppose and well that's what she said, that's a standard letter. -yeah the only trouble is, you know, standard letters don't always sort of +yeah the only trouble is, you know, standard letters don't always sort of well you get some little old dear what runs the that's right. catalogue to yeah. -get a little bit of pocket money or that's the only way she can get anything! +get a little bit of pocket money or that's the only way she can get anything! oh they're out in that car again out there. they've been working on sarah's today. damn! they're up to the roof aren't they? -yeah yeah +yeah yeah what's -they put the trusses on and then they fill the gables in and then put the tiles on. -i didn't think sarah didn't go to the ol lo oh had oh i wouldn't of thought that was a pair, +they put the trusses on and then they fill the gables in and then put the tiles on. +i didn't think sarah didn't go to the ol lo oh had oh i wouldn't of thought that was a pair, oh no they want something flash don't they. -well val was telling me caroline got the kids all in a row and said something about erm you know, more or less to say well i want to leave your father she said +well val was telling me caroline got the kids all in a row and said something about erm you know, more or less to say well i want to leave your father she said she did? what do you think about it sam? and he just put his head down. and what do you think about it erica? and she burst into tears! -and what do you think about it erm what did i say the other one's name was? +and what do you think about it erm what did i say the other one's name was? ben, erica which one did i say? that'll be ben the oldest. -ben, erica you said ben and erica. +ben, erica you said ben and erica. no it was sam. -oh sorry, sam no it's sam, erica. +oh sorry, sam no it's sam, erica. yeah well anyway the other one yeah. he said well i think that's the best you can do father, he said we've had enough hassle for you for all these years! -so she said quite right, she said he's done nothing but bully you lot ever since you've been children! +so she said quite right, she said he's done nothing but bully you lot ever since you've been children! so she said and i felt very proud of my son, ah i said i wouldn't want a son of mine who said that to his father! no. i wouldn't of wanted it. -well no, but on the other hand you know +well no, but on the other hand you know yeah but all said and done geoff, they are his fa , he is their father. yeah but i mean it depends what sort of bloke he is, and i mean if he is like that -he you know what a big head he is. +he you know what a big head he is. yeah but i mean you don't know what he's like to his kids do you? well she said he he's done nothing but bully them. well then the kid's right ain't he? -well you heard what he said he wants his children to have a good education and he pushes them all the time, they've gotta if they do anything +well you heard what he said he wants his children to have a good education and he pushes them all the time, they've gotta if they do anything yeah. -they've gotta be brilliant at it but +they've gotta be brilliant at it but yeah. -you see some children ain't got it in them and you know +you see some children ain't got it in them and you know oh yeah. but you heard what ashley said about swimming. -made them yeah. -well, to me if a child has got a by all means encourage along but you shouldn't push them into anything cos later on in life they get a bloody complex about everything you know if they +made them yeah. +well, to me if a child has got a by all means encourage along but you shouldn't push them into anything cos later on in life they get a bloody complex about everything you know if they i don't know. if they've got a job or something they're frightened they're not gonna do well and -where do you draw the line between you know, not sort erm encouraging and not -well i do it all look at it's the way you say it. +where do you draw the line between you know, not sort erm encouraging and not +well i do it all look at it's the way you say it. well that's what i'm saying, so perhaps the kid was right in what he said. well yeah but i wouldn't been a bastard to him well -well would you like your son to say i think +well would you like your son to say i think well no but i don't to think i am like that with jonathan. well no. -well i don't like -but he's always been like that with them kids you know yourself if they do anything it's gotta be done +well i don't like +but he's always been like that with them kids you know yourself if they do anything it's gotta be done well you know how he is, if you say too much to him, don't do that, don't shout at me! -he soons starts squawking and wiping his eye and stamping about the place but if he's like that all the while to them so what is . +he soons starts squawking and wiping his eye and stamping about the place but if he's like that all the while to them so what is . they've all gone off to fiji. who has? the parents, he said he was going didn't he? oh him as well? -so she said, val said i thought good for you mate, you didn't get pushed out he's gone they're all gone till the new year innit? +so she said, val said i thought good for you mate, you didn't get pushed out he's gone they're all gone till the new year innit? well i wouldn't of wanted to go with them myself. well not after that little escapade, nor would i. -i wouldn't of thought so i would of sa i would of said well if i bloody ju good enough for living with i bleeding come on a i don't think she'd want him on holiday with her anyway and her sister said is she hadn't got enough money, she'd pay for it. -that's right that's what val told me. +i wouldn't of thought so i would of sa i would of said well if i bloody ju good enough for living with i bleeding come on a i don't think she'd want him on holiday with her anyway and her sister said is she hadn't got enough money, she'd pay for it. +that's right that's what val told me. she don't have time for him. what? she hasn't got a lot of time for him now. -who hasn't her sister? +who hasn't her sister? her sister. -no she just says he's a bloody big head! +no she just says he's a bloody big head! well he is isn't he? well yeah. ah i mustn't i must admit i don't think i know any worse than him. -but i think he's quite harmless really geoff i don't think he +but i think he's quite harmless really geoff i don't think he oh yeah. means any harm, that's his way. well that's yeah but i i must admit i find it quite tiring. -well he's always been pleasant to me you gotta -i can honestly say he's the sort of bloke i would sort of try not to get lumbered with at a party or somewhere like that i mean i don't mind i didn't mind talking to her but i find her -well i find her boring. +well he's always been pleasant to me you gotta +i can honestly say he's the sort of bloke i would sort of try not to get lumbered with at a party or somewhere like that i mean i don't mind i didn't mind talking to her but i find her +well i find her boring. yeah. -i find her very boring although she's a very kind person. +i find her very boring although she's a very kind person. yeah, no i could talk to her more than i could talk to him. -i'm surprised you know, she isn't stuck for them children mo any more if he'd been +i'm surprised you know, she isn't stuck for them children mo any more if he'd been oh yeah. -like this that's it. -let's face it she erm i mean she was the one who bloody married him! +like this that's it. +let's face it she erm i mean she was the one who bloody married him! well she hates him! yeah. she literally hates him! yeah. -well i think that's awful i do. -well yeah well i suppose that's what she thinks, if she gonna go through the rest of her life with a bloke she hates. -well she might as well get rid of him now, i suppose while she's young enough to find perhaps find +well i think that's awful i do. +well yeah well i suppose that's what she thinks, if she gonna go through the rest of her life with a bloke she hates. +well she might as well get rid of him now, i suppose while she's young enough to find perhaps find yeah. somebody else. well whatev whatever's all this big house in aid of then? i bet they're gonna build it and sell it! well that's gonna be the farm though innit? -they'll have to sell sell the farm and everything. +they'll have to sell sell the farm and everything. well yeah, i would've thought so because le and hope . -well let's face it erm he's got a, a half a half a right to it. +well let's face it erm he's got a, a half a half a right to it. i know yeah. -he's worked hard, he's worked he ain't he does work, when he works. +he's worked hard, he's worked he ain't he does work, when he works. does he though? well i dunno. -i always see him riding about up the steven there he's always up there i know when i used to work for it was always steve who used to be riding to this farm, riding to that farm, checking on this, checking on that and taking the wages round that sort of thing. +i always see him riding about up the steven there he's always up there i know when i used to work for it was always steve who used to be riding to this farm, riding to that farm, checking on this, checking on that and taking the wages round that sort of thing. and he does it now does he? oh yeah. -you never see that erm do you? +you never see that erm do you? no you don't. -well yeah cos when you think like that if they do pack up he's got no no nothing. +well yeah cos when you think like that if they do pack up he's got no no nothing. no not really. -well not unless they they don't sell that house well look at poor old dick! +well not unless they they don't sell that house well look at poor old dick! yeah but he's just about retiring age anyway isn't he. yeah but he's still gotta have a home to live in geoff! -well yeah, alright yeah but they normally get out don't they? -when they were like jack what's his name? -erm jack the foreman he got out and when he when he retired cos you know +well yeah, alright yeah but they normally get out don't they? +when they were like jack what's his name? +erm jack the foreman he got out and when he when he retired cos you know well that's like er the house went with the job. -but then they've got er er said they they asked if they could rent his house off him until they got themselves sorted out. +but then they've got er er said they they asked if they could rent his house off him until they got themselves sorted out. no bloody way he said! did he? i thought to myself well yo if laura had a house and then thought pete was in that in that position, i'd of helped him. did he really? -yeah well they've had they've had a big today. +yeah well they've had they've had a big today. who have? . oh? -well i thought she said i ain't gotta then have they? -a hundred pou thous thousand in debt they had two lo two bloody great morgan cars! +well i thought she said i ain't gotta then have they? +a hundred pou thous thousand in debt they had two lo two bloody great morgan cars! about what was that? -well i reckon that's her either his mother or her mother. +well i reckon that's her either his mother or her mother. yeah. -cos when i was coming home from pete's a bloke stopped me er whatever's that noise? +cos when i was coming home from pete's a bloke stopped me er whatever's that noise? i dunno. -a bloke stopped and he said er can you tell me where is? -i said well you're in the oh he said i'll tell you what i want, a little black and white house i said it's just there look i said nearly you're nearly on top! -he got a few yards down, he said so i said well have yo you haven't come round to view the house today have you? +a bloke stopped and he said er can you tell me where is? +i said well you're in the oh he said i'll tell you what i want, a little black and white house i said it's just there look i said nearly you're nearly on top! +he got a few yards down, he said so i said well have yo you haven't come round to view the house today have you? oh no he said, i said because they got a funeral on, he said that's what we've coming for, we're coming to pick granddad up. oh. well i thought well i didn't want people going round there no. -well that was a waste of their time if they'd have gone round there to view them, weren't it? +well that was a waste of their time if they'd have gone round there to view them, weren't it? yeah. -so that was not having a lot of flipping luck is she? +so that was not having a lot of flipping luck is she? no. but they haven't put them out their home. no. alright, but i think they've gotta re-house them first haven't they? i dunno. -well yeah they just shove you out on the street, they gotta especially if you got children they gotta re-house you. +well yeah they just shove you out on the street, they gotta especially if you got children they gotta re-house you. yeah. -but i dunno whatever's whatever's this bloody world coming to? +but i dunno whatever's whatever's this bloody world coming to? , she said i really don't where it's gonna end geoff, i don't know no more. well you never guess what she said today? no. -well i wa she said i'm gonna start up drinking june i said you're not! +well i wa she said i'm gonna start up drinking june i said you're not! she said i bloody well am! she said you can up and have one with me if you like sometimes, i said alright then. she said well he's got his fags, she said i'm gonna start drinking! -i said well be warned val! -she said i know when to stop, i thought yeah but +i said well be warned val! +she said i know when to stop, i thought yeah but yeah but that i've heard all that before! @@ -70639,104 +70577,104 @@ jonathan what are you doing ? ooh and there's ooh something else happened as well! yeah. she erm -sha sharon's not going out with them now for christmas. +sha sharon's not going out with them now for christmas. oh yeah, why's that then? cos marie's going in hospital having her operation. yeah. -she said and i'm not leaving her to you see! +she said and i'm not leaving her to you see! no. -but val said them children them children have they manipulate her. +but val said them children them children have they manipulate her. yeah. -i thought well manipulates you val. +i thought well manipulates you val. . -so she said erm i'll bloody told her straight she said! -but she said there's geoff worried sick about that old girl +so she said erm i'll bloody told her straight she said! +but she said there's geoff worried sick about that old girl yeah. -because he's said well she's go she's they got her this little place, didn't they? +because he's said well she's go she's they got her this little place, didn't they? sorted it all out for her and carp it was all carpeted everything yeah. now she's gone and moved down in west . -but he val said it was that flipping rough +but he val said it was that flipping rough yeah. and the house is like a tip! yeah. -and she said geoff kept saying to her oh i wouldn't move from where you are, you know you got your place lovely i if you the reason she moved was cos she wanted tony to get the breakfast round what was said that's what val said. +and she said geoff kept saying to her oh i wouldn't move from where you are, you know you got your place lovely i if you the reason she moved was cos she wanted tony to get the breakfast round what was said that's what val said. i can well imagine. -so she said the 's go out with them don't they? -di oh yeah that makes me laugh! +so she said the 's go out with them don't they? +di oh yeah that makes me laugh! what? what does? -well she isn't is she? -well erm -that's what i mean they don't call them they call them cos she don't want to lose her name does she? +well she isn't is she? +well erm +that's what i mean they don't call them they call them cos she don't want to lose her name does she? pathetic innit! i didn't think ken liked the woman. bloody arrogant can you get! well ken don't like the woman anyway, does he? i know he don't no. -well i certainly wouldn't sit down at christmas dinner with them that's why +well i certainly wouldn't sit down at christmas dinner with them that's why yeah they're going. oh you said yeah. -and er mervy. +and er mervy. yeah. -and that's all now so val said she said i said to cheryl now don't you go and take mervy away cos me and ken certainly aren't gonna go and sit sit with erm the 's all dinner time so she said what they're gonna do, they're going out for the meal and everything and then they're ken are gonna go to cheryl's for the rest of the day so i said so that's upset your plans then val she said isn't it just! +and that's all now so val said she said i said to cheryl now don't you go and take mervy away cos me and ken certainly aren't gonna go and sit sit with erm the 's all dinner time so she said what they're gonna do, they're going out for the meal and everything and then they're ken are gonna go to cheryl's for the rest of the day so i said so that's upset your plans then val she said isn't it just! she said i've been really looking forward to it june. -have a break looked like she gonna cry any second! +have a break looked like she gonna cry any second! she said oh. -do you know me and ted have been married thirty year no not thirty, they've been going out together thirty years +do you know me and ted have been married thirty year no not thirty, they've been going out together thirty years yeah. -then she said do you know these last six months we do nothing but argue she said we've never argued so much! +then she said do you know these last six months we do nothing but argue she said we've never argued so much! yeah. and she said oh i think it's only the pressure. well that's right. -i said well me and geoff argue more, i said we never used to cos we never argued a lot did we? +i said well me and geoff argue more, i said we never used to cos we never argued a lot did we? no. -well we have done i felt sorry cos i hadn't really when she phoned me up over there i was up i thought oh my god! +well we have done i felt sorry cos i hadn't really when she phoned me up over there i was up i thought oh my god! yeah, -cos i'm a bit worried we gotta get things sorted out so i rang i said i didn't to get onto you, she said no i know how they feel she said her granddad always do things like that. +cos i'm a bit worried we gotta get things sorted out so i rang i said i didn't to get onto you, she said no i know how they feel she said her granddad always do things like that. what? -you know break appointments i said well that only worries +you know break appointments i said well that only worries it ain't quite the same is it? well i said i suppose geoff couldn't get away. -well they just wouldn't let me -i said that that worried m that really sort of worried me so i rung her back anyway, she's alright. -well, you don't wanna worry about them because at the end of the day, i mean if if that was absolutely desperate i shall turn round and say well i'm sorry i've bloody got to and that's it! +well they just wouldn't let me +i said that that worried m that really sort of worried me so i rung her back anyway, she's alright. +well, you don't wanna worry about them because at the end of the day, i mean if if that was absolutely desperate i shall turn round and say well i'm sorry i've bloody got to and that's it! you know, but i mean but you must go wednesday geoff! -yeah no +yeah no and she been -it was they was that panicking cos tomorrow morning, the ministry are coming and +it was they was that panicking cos tomorrow morning, the ministry are coming and yeah. they was panicking. -we all it is ba , well i say all it is this bloody great strip right be between the ceiling and the walls, the right length of corridor and the manager see it and he said look that should be shiny sort of like and it's all pitted so he said you'll have to go up here he said and do it all with steel abrasive said fair enough. -so of course i, took me about half hour to find the forklift cos somebody had nicked it by time i went got the chemicals robin comes down, he said oh don't worry about he said do i do it tomorrow morning he said, they'll be nobody about then can you go down the bot bottom and do the butterflies? -i felt well bloody marvellous, you now,i it was that imperative it had gotta be done, you can't have time o no i'm sorry you can't! +we all it is ba , well i say all it is this bloody great strip right be between the ceiling and the walls, the right length of corridor and the manager see it and he said look that should be shiny sort of like and it's all pitted so he said you'll have to go up here he said and do it all with steel abrasive said fair enough. +so of course i, took me about half hour to find the forklift cos somebody had nicked it by time i went got the chemicals robin comes down, he said oh don't worry about he said do i do it tomorrow morning he said, they'll be nobody about then can you go down the bot bottom and do the butterflies? +i felt well bloody marvellous, you now,i it was that imperative it had gotta be done, you can't have time o no i'm sorry you can't! so you could of gone to that appointment tonight? -well, well no, no because it was then about, that's what i'm is, then four o'clock you see, so i mean i knew i wouldn't make it anyway that's why i thought i'd better ring cos the job that we finished was half past three so i thought well even if i come home i shall be late even if i don't get changed and washed or anything. +well, well no, no because it was then about, that's what i'm is, then four o'clock you see, so i mean i knew i wouldn't make it anyway that's why i thought i'd better ring cos the job that we finished was half past three so i thought well even if i come home i shall be late even if i don't get changed and washed or anything. yeah well you can't go there not washed and changed. no that's what i thought i was but you got an appointment fo you could of had one for tomorrow but i thought wednesday is a better day i thought. -wednesday is a better day, and anyway thursday's erm he's got a he's gotta go at four actually go at four not an appointment, he's gotta go at four. -why erm why do the ministry keep coming down there then? +wednesday is a better day, and anyway thursday's erm he's got a he's gotta go at four actually go at four not an appointment, he's gotta go at four. +why erm why do the ministry keep coming down there then? do they turn up there? well i don't know, whether they're trying to catch them out but they they certainly coming down more and more an and sort of more and more frequent. i'm surprised they warn them that they're coming. -well it's erm the sort of things they pick them on really is not that +well it's erm the sort of things they pick them on really is not that not hygiene sort of thing? -no, thing i mean silly little thing, well i think it's silly but there you are, they all see to know what they're talking about but i mean cer certain things like in the fillet room +no, thing i mean silly little thing, well i think it's silly but there you are, they all see to know what they're talking about but i mean cer certain things like in the fillet room mhm. the meat is not allowed to go on just an ordinary pallet. it's gotta go on a special one? -it's gotta go on a steel pallet and yet next door in the export chiller they're allowed to go on a wooden pallet and we work on wooden pallets erm +it's gotta go on a steel pallet and yet next door in the export chiller they're allowed to go on a wooden pallet and we work on wooden pallets erm i'm surprised they use wood. -well if you see how many pallets they got and you see the trouble is the metal ones are so slippery they're all the while dropping meat all over the floor. +well if you see how many pallets they got and you see the trouble is the metal ones are so slippery they're all the while dropping meat all over the floor. yeah i suppose they would, yeah. -there's loads of things they're on about oh th the there's a whole book what they gotta h have sorted out. +there's loads of things they're on about oh th the there's a whole book what they gotta h have sorted out. do they? oh christ yeah! -certain doors are not to be opened things like emergency exits there's they notice that there's more one of the emergency exits is actually broken, so the door don't even open. +certain doors are not to be opened things like emergency exits there's they notice that there's more one of the emergency exits is actually broken, so the door don't even open. bloody hell! so all that stuff well then that is, that's gotta be sorted out because if you @@ -70746,35 +70684,35 @@ that's right. yeah. well that's like us we haven't got an emergency exit. what way do you go to your nearest exit then? -well there's a bloody great roller door, but you see it's at the end we work +well there's a bloody great roller door, but you see it's at the end we work yeah well what about if the fire was down that end? well exactly! how would you get out? -we haven't got the oh yes there is, oh course there is, that's a lie we go through yeah. +we haven't got the oh yes there is, oh course there is, that's a lie we go through yeah. yeah well what about if the fire's between the box room and this exit? -well that's where they are i went that slid across there like that, phewf! +well that's where they are i went that slid across there like that, phewf! where are you going? what ab oi! don't ask then! i mean i won't even talk to myself am i? no.. -i didn't tell your mum that i'd got it on you see she said now all that i've been saying! -so i said well no, no they won't take no notice of that, i said anyone that's been +i didn't tell your mum that i'd got it on you see she said now all that i've been saying! +so i said well no, no they won't take no notice of that, i said anyone that's been yeah. -i said they ain't gonna say ooh that's val on there, i said the +i said they ain't gonna say ooh that's val on there, i said the no they don't know who it is, do they? i said well they don't know! -no it's the london university of +no it's the london university of what is it? london university. in cambridge got something to do with, what was that he said? -well anyway something about university you know all these studies they do. +well anyway something about university you know all these studies they do. yeah. it's all about speech patterns. -geoff and joan thought erm someone was trying to rob us along here! -he sat in his car out there +geoff and joan thought erm someone was trying to rob us along here! +he sat in his car out there poor little man! -and they thought that he was the accomplice sitting outside while somebody was going round the house. +and they thought that he was the accomplice sitting outside while somebody was going round the house. i said i don't know what hollering for, he's got a bloody i'm surprised they haven't got rottweiller there! @@ -70783,9 +70721,9 @@ oh yeah. detective or something! but how pathetic! yeah. -well well no, you know i had at mum's and i +well well no, you know i had at mum's and i yeah -come home and i thought well i'll drop that, i'll stay and go up the ladder and i was gonna do painting you got him hey up!! +come home and i thought well i'll drop that, i'll stay and go up the ladder and i was gonna do painting you got him hey up!! so i jumped right away. ! then i thought what on earth did he say! @@ -70794,17 +70732,17 @@ well i can never understand him. no i can't. i thought what ever's he on about! i can. -if we ought to had him mate they'd have thought he'd come from +if we ought to had him mate they'd have thought he'd come from well another planet! i can't never understand him. no i must admit i can't. -we have this french woman come in she comes quite often mrs and she said i'd like to make an appointme appointment on the she said the eleventh, and i thought i said pardon? -and she said it again and i thought well i it didn't sound like eleven eleven i don't know what it sounded like really and i just went so that'll be wednesday the eleventh? -and i thought if she says yes, i've got the date right ! +we have this french woman come in she comes quite often mrs and she said i'd like to make an appointme appointment on the she said the eleventh, and i thought i said pardon? +and she said it again and i thought well i it didn't sound like eleven eleven i don't know what it sounded like really and i just went so that'll be wednesday the eleventh? +and i thought if she says yes, i've got the date right ! yeah. and did you get it right? -yeah that's embarrassing, you feel an idiot don't you! +yeah that's embarrassing, you feel an idiot don't you! i was just gonna say yo yeah i was just gonna say you got a purple tint in your hair but i can see what it is now! @@ -70812,19 +70750,19 @@ she got those to purple tint on top. i like her hair tha that colour do you geoff? i don't mind either way really. -i don't look like ann now do i? +i don't look like ann now do i? no ! i dunno no. -well i think er the funny thing is it's looks dark now. +well i think er the funny thing is it's looks dark now. yeah. well that's cos it's always been so light -but i suppose it's been +but i suppose it's been isn't it? yeah. -ah i like it i knew there was something +ah i like it i knew there was something oh i like her hair. -different to me have a at least when you have it down sarah +different to me have a at least when you have it down sarah if you think so i've yeah. i think i could of @@ -70832,35 +70770,35 @@ oh yeah er i mean i know it's a bit messy at the moment, i ain't washed it since last time you see! oh i see yeah. isn't you really? -no erm but when i when i have i'm so used to having it up and all tucked back when i have it down i feel scruffy +no erm but when i when i have i'm so used to having it up and all tucked back when i have it down i feel scruffy yeah? -yeah i think you do feel tidy if your hair's off your face. +yeah i think you do feel tidy if your hair's off your face. yeah. yeah. -mm but mind you i had that headband didn't i? -but what i'd like to do is i'm gonna set it on rollers i'm gonna blow dry the top i'm gonna +mm but mind you i had that headband didn't i? +but what i'd like to do is i'm gonna set it on rollers i'm gonna blow dry the top i'm gonna yeah. -set the back on rollers and then, you know when i have it all clipped there with an oval clip +set the back on rollers and then, you know when i have it all clipped there with an oval clip yeah. in my neck? -secure it there, pin it all under, then i'd like to get a net with sequins on it or +secure it there, pin it all under, then i'd like to get a net with sequins on it or oh yeah! -or something to put over it for evening, but i can't find one. +or something to put over it for evening, but i can't find one. i wonder where you find one of them from? you know, sort of back comb it out so it's sort of well they must do them sarah, mustn't they? -yeah but i thought i ain't seen anybody with it like that be a bit different, sort of when we go out new years eve and that. -mm where's a ? +yeah but i thought i ain't seen anybody with it like that be a bit different, sort of when we go out new years eve and that. +mm where's a ? i don't think we got one round here. only peterborough i suppose. peter or cambridge i suppose. yeah. mm. -and or perhaps a real sort of top hairdresser, they might have them they sometimes have bits and +and or perhaps a real sort of top hairdresser, they might have them they sometimes have bits and yeah. pieces don't they? well that used to be all the rage once, didn't it? -yeah i mean we got hairnets at work sort of clear ones though. +yeah i mean we got hairnets at work sort of clear ones though. i remember hairnets you get oh yeah! @@ -70868,16 +70806,16 @@ o yeah and but they're erm they're red. -ah no ours are just you couldn't tell you'd got it on. +ah no ours are just you couldn't tell you'd got it on. no. no. -sort of a hair colour practical +sort of a hair colour practical yeah. you see. that's right. -but i think next time i might have it cut short. +but i think next time i might have it cut short. you're not! -i might do, i don't know i'm fed up with it really! +i might do, i don't know i'm fed up with it really! you want a change? how yeah. @@ -70885,15 +70823,15 @@ was you thinking of having it cut? short. what short short? yeah. -actually i think it suits you, i mean really i like it's not on her face anyway isn't it? -no so short +actually i think it suits you, i mean really i like it's not on her face anyway isn't it? +no so short so i think no. short hair would suit you cos you haven't got it all over your face have you? -cos i saw erm a photo when i was eighteen and i it was sort of short in the neck over my ears short in there and then sort of fuller there and then just a bit of you know a light fringe not a heavy fringe and i thought i might have it like that so +cos i saw erm a photo when i was eighteen and i it was sort of short in the neck over my ears short in there and then sort of fuller there and then just a bit of you know a light fringe not a heavy fringe and i thought i might have it like that so yeah. -that'll be nice i can't really remember -well i think if that was me i'd have that done now in case you don't like it by the time you you get married and that could be growing again. +that'll be nice i can't really remember +well i think if that was me i'd have that done now in case you don't like it by the time you you get married and that could be growing again. oh no i wouldn't have it cut until after i got married. oh no. @@ -70903,91 +70841,91 @@ oh. cos i definitely want my hair long for when we get married. you do? yeah. -yeah so that i can either have it up or down really. +yeah so that i can either have it up or down really. yeah. i've got the choice then. -yeah i do do you know i don't like to see brides with their hair down if you've got long hair i +yeah i do do you know i don't like to see brides with their hair down if you've got long hair i oh. -but i don't think sometimes i think well if it looks nice but some of them brides on there that just hangs don't it? +but i don't think sometimes i think well if it looks nice but some of them brides on there that just hangs don't it? oh yeah, i'm not having it like that. -mm i think i but sarah did it at work, she did it sort of plaited it from here round +mm i think i but sarah did it at work, she did it sort of plaited it from here round oh yeah! -and this was taken up in like folds but the plait stood away from the head, it sort of come out +and this was taken up in like folds but the plait stood away from the head, it sort of come out oh yeah! you know, as you get them half baskets that fit on a wall mm. yeah. -not as much but it sort of come out like that and then you sit your flowers it makes that a shell if you know what i mean? +not as much but it sort of come out like that and then you sit your flowers it makes that a shell if you know what i mean? oh yeah! -but it it's flatter coming on there and then you sit your flowers all along on there but +but it it's flatter coming on there and then you sit your flowers all along on there but oh that's sounds nice! -but then i'd i like it fuller and prettier. +but then i'd i like it fuller and prettier. yeah. -you know i'd like a little bit more curly and not +you know i'd like a little bit more curly and not yeah. curly curly but sort of fuller and well you'll have to have it done a couple of times yeah. -sort of try two or three styles then sort of how well you gotta think about your headdress and that first, haven't you? +sort of try two or three styles then sort of how well you gotta think about your headdress and that first, haven't you? yeah. what you're gonna have and then pu guide your hairstyle to go with it we or yeah. or your wearing wha well, yeah. no i'll be the next sa -what you be doing in the new year sarah? -i know, i think after christmas i'm gonna go and have a look for some dresses and you see when it was an ordinary colour i was gonna have ivory but now it's this colour i think i'll be better having having white, i don't know. +what you be doing in the new year sarah? +i know, i think after christmas i'm gonna go and have a look for some dresses and you see when it was an ordinary colour i was gonna have ivory but now it's this colour i think i'll be better having having white, i don't know. mm. -i think if you've got the white . +i think if you've got the white . yeah. yeah but you aren't but then you haven't got a white skin sarah have you? you've got a sort of a bit of an olivy skin haven't you? -it's not -yeah yeah. +it's not +yeah yeah. yeah so you will have time to -i shall be out there every day ! +i shall be out there every day ! get a yeah. tan won't you? yeah. you'll have time to do that. -you see if you have iv , and ivory dress certain colour bridesmaids dresses don't go with ivory. +you see if you have iv , and ivory dress certain colour bridesmaids dresses don't go with ivory. yeah. so they do do they? no. that sort of thing. -you're right yeah. -cos i think with ivory, i think peaches and that look nice, but i think with white i like stronger colours . +you're right yeah. +cos i think with ivory, i think peaches and that look nice, but i think with white i like stronger colours . yeah. still, i don't very often wear pale colours. will you have your bridesmaids dresses made? -i don't know i hadn't really thought about it. +i don't know i hadn't really thought about it. had you thought about your bridesmaids yet? -yeah i am not gonna have all six i think. +yeah i am not gonna have all six i think. oh are you! -yeah, but i'm short of two little ones, or one little one erm amy's cousin joanne and and then helen florence's little girl, helen +yeah, but i'm short of two little ones, or one little one erm amy's cousin joanne and and then helen florence's little girl, helen yeah. -and amy's cousin claire and then this girl who's hair i do +and amy's cousin claire and then this girl who's hair i do what? -this girl who's hair i do erm her little girl, karla cor she's if i found a little girl to look like her, i'd have one! +this girl who's hair i do erm her little girl, karla cor she's if i found a little girl to look like her, i'd have one! oh. but she is so pretty! she's got white blonde hair. so you want another little one? yeah. are you having any page boys? -yeah i might do yes erm probably ben. +yeah i might do yes erm probably ben. well didn't you just have that's what mum said, have the why don't you have the little bridesmaid and the page boy. with the page boy? yeah. -instead of having another bridesmaid, have a page boy and so the two little ones go up together page boy +instead of having another bridesmaid, have a page boy and so the two little ones go up together page boy yeah. -and erm bridesmaid and then have your bridesmaids behind. +and erm bridesmaid and then have your bridesmaids behind. yeah mum, that's what mum said. i think that'd look nice i might do. @@ -70997,46 +70935,46 @@ yeah. both blonde. ooh mm. -she's ever such a pretty little girl, she's got white blonde hair +she's ever such a pretty little girl, she's got white blonde hair oh i think that'll be nice! really sort of she's just a pretty little girl. yeah. then she dresses her lovely as well. then you haven't gotta worry about finding another one. -no yeah i could do that. +no yeah i could do that. couldn't you? but apart from that i hadn't really thought about it really. -well , jonathan don't do that while that's on because it ain't no good doing it! -well yeah get over christmas and then you can start sorting yourself out really. -yeah , yeah i know and i think once the matters on the bungalow and that -mm that's right. +well , jonathan don't do that while that's on because it ain't no good doing it! +well yeah get over christmas and then you can start sorting yourself out really. +yeah , yeah i know and i think once the matters on the bungalow and that +mm that's right. big! i'm not big. there's just a lot to think about isn't there? yeah. yeah cos tha once christmas is here, that'll soon come won't it? yeah, eight months then. -it'll fly by now christmas +it'll fly by now christmas yeah. -new year, easter +new year, easter ooh can't wait ! yeah. can we go ? -jonathan goes to soon. +jonathan goes to soon. i can't wait till christmas! -not till next september well it'll +not till next september well it'll next be soon after i get married then won't it? yep. yeah. oh! i don't want to go in. -and won't you sarah? +and won't you sarah? i don't want to go! you get the first week will seem a bit strange but once you get the first week over you're alright then. oh no! i'll skip the first week. -you will be won't you? +you will be won't you? yeah. and you're working. yeah. @@ -71051,17 +70989,17 @@ oh! what does he do then? well he's a labourer really. what bi for builders? -sort of classed as a labourer and +sort of classed as a labourer and he erm, he didn't have a job for two weeks! -he said he can't get unemploym erm the dole or nothing cos he's self employed! +he said he can't get unemploym erm the dole or nothing cos he's self employed! then there's twelve of us down. what? twelve is it? -he can't get any money se so so he can't get erm what do you call it? +he can't get any money se so so he can't get erm what do you call it? social security social security. if you've got money in the bank! -well i said that's terrible that our boy should suffer because he's got money in the bank, and saved his money! +well i said that's terrible that our boy should suffer because he's got money in the bank, and saved his money! yeah. he's gotta live off his ear off his money ain't he? well he isn't certainly gonna dwindle @@ -71075,15 +71013,15 @@ yeah that's right! social security . i said you're paid the same. no. -social security is when you haven't got no money and he has got money. +social security is when you haven't got no money and he has got money. well i ain't got any but they won't give me any! -well that's like when older people when they save for their retirement and that you know +well that's like when older people when they save for their retirement and that you know yeah. they can't get things cheap like bus passes and all that can they? no. -well well i think, i, i don't think it pays you to save up er +well well i think, i, i don't think it pays you to save up er no. -for your retirement and so you'll be comfortable off cos you might as well live off your state like everybody else. +for your retirement and so you'll be comfortable off cos you might as well live off your state like everybody else. yeah. you might as well enjoy your money as you go along, why bother to have any! @@ -71091,48 +71029,48 @@ they were saying on the television the other day why bother! the new taxes well i certainly isn't going to, sarah! -the new tax law thing +the new tax law thing i shall get as much out the system as i can mate! me me. well i told you that. -if they go up erm the government now wanna +if they go up erm the government now wanna help! -bring this new tax, but instead of poll tax and community charge and that it's gonna be like a new erm property tax. +bring this new tax, but instead of poll tax and community charge and that it's gonna be like a new erm property tax. oh yeah, i think i've heard of that. -and er what they're saying that, sort of, you get people, shall we say, older people who -he's -are retired so they got no income and then perhaps been left the house +and er what they're saying that, sort of, you get people, shall we say, older people who +he's +are retired so they got no income and then perhaps been left the house oh! in in a will or something yeah. so they have the house and move into house then they pay a lot -but they're gonna taxed so heavily that they can't afford to live in it under this new tax! +but they're gonna taxed so heavily that they can't afford to live in it under this new tax! they've just gotta sell it! -i thought well how what a bloody shame! +i thought well how what a bloody shame! terrible isn't it? -mm i mean er why don't they do it on like the square, how big your house is because that way you could i know it's not far when people who live in a great big old house don't have to pay as much cos if this i mean uncle trevor and aunty they've got a massive great house haven't they? +mm i mean er why don't they do it on like the square, how big your house is because that way you could i know it's not far when people who live in a great big old house don't have to pay as much cos if this i mean uncle trevor and aunty they've got a massive great house haven't they? have yeah. -but if this because it's old or something they don't have to pay so much the +but if this because it's old or something they don't have to pay so much the the rates the rates, yeah. you know? yeah. -but if you only went on the square foot it don't matter how big it was well that's like, surely that'd be fairer? -that's right it wasn't -yeah but ah then again why i mean like a lot of people have don't have actual they haven't got money but they they sort of choose to have money tied up in property ,though it don't mean to say you're wealthy just because you've got a big house does it? +but if you only went on the square foot it don't matter how big it was well that's like, surely that'd be fairer? +that's right it wasn't +yeah but ah then again why i mean like a lot of people have don't have actual they haven't got money but they they sort of choose to have money tied up in property ,though it don't mean to say you're wealthy just because you've got a big house does it? if no. -you've got no money we haven't got any money but, you know -doo doo doo doo +you've got no money we haven't got any money but, you know +doo doo doo doo i mean why should i i why should you be condemned just because you've put your money into your house? yeah that's right, i mean some people don't alright fair enough they want you to buy your own property but now . yeah. oh! -and if you go a spend if you in if you've got a big house and you tend to spend thirty thousand pound on a new car you don't get taxed on that +and if you go a spend if you in if you've got a big house and you tend to spend thirty thousand pound on a new car you don't get taxed on that phone! phone geoff! new car. @@ -71140,42 +71078,42 @@ shall i pause this? i thought it was the front doorbell. shall i stop it? no, leave it on. -well that's like there's jobs like +well that's like there's jobs like shall i stop it till daddy's back? -your dad and geoff they pay a stamp at turners don't they? +your dad and geoff they pay a stamp at turners don't they? yeah, they do. they still have to pay a self employed one as well you know? i didn't know whether your dad knew that? you still have to pay it back, i said well i don't think you should have to pay it back! -cos you're going there because your own business has not any more! +cos you're going there because your own business has not any more! yeah. . well yeah, geoff wouldn't be there if i if his business was running alright! well i said i don't think that's to e you should pay two stamps myself! -no well there's nothing wrong in pay any. +no well there's nothing wrong in pay any. like bloody ! -yeah cor i could i could couldn't you? +yeah cor i could i could couldn't you? i feel like giving him away but i don't know whether i would, but i feel like it. yeah. i'm surprised someone hasn't. -which erm relative of 's has died? +which erm relative of 's has died? dunno who has. well i reckon that's her mother or his mother. i don't really know, i haven't heard mm anything about it. somebody will find me . -yeah because erm as we come home from work these two sort of big saloon cars, black ones sort of come up, mourning cars i suppose you call them and they stopped at 's and picked a load of people up. +yeah because erm as we come home from work these two sort of big saloon cars, black ones sort of come up, mourning cars i suppose you call them and they stopped at 's and picked a load of people up. i thought you called a ? no ! but you mean, no not them jonathan! oh. -and then as we was coming home from pete's, a chap stopped us and asked us where was so i told him where was he said i'm looking for a little black and white house i said it's right there look! -he was right up to it so i said well i don't know whether you're going round to view the house cos that's on the market aren't they? +and then as we was coming home from pete's, a chap stopped us and asked us where was so i told him where was he said i'm looking for a little black and white house i said it's right there look! +he was right up to it so i said well i don't know whether you're going round to view the house cos that's on the market aren't they? here we are yeah. -you got the in here? -cos i said erm no i haven't actually, stop cos i said that +you got the in here? +cos i said erm no i haven't actually, stop cos i said that that's what i've come round for! then. they got a death in the family today and then he said that's what we've come, we've coming to pick up granddad, so i reckon that is @@ -71190,32 +71128,32 @@ no it was . oh well that's there was some smart cars round there today. yeah? -oh . +oh . ooh! hey? . well i said they haven't had the house yet! that's right. i know ! -i bet that that's pretty as well. +i bet that that's pretty as well. . no that's him you've been in it! -that's him on the phone +that's him on the phone so have i! -he was saying all the sort say at work you know that they they don't know and they start on about er -you have been a . -you ruin your chances so about three times a week the comes in to arrange my poll tax and all this and they get going you know well why should a bloke that having a big house and he only pays the same rate as them so i said, well it's like this as far i'm concerned i said you know no bloke works perhaps twice as many hours as you do he chooses +he was saying all the sort say at work you know that they they don't know and they start on about er +you have been a . +you ruin your chances so about three times a week the comes in to arrange my poll tax and all this and they get going you know well why should a bloke that having a big house and he only pays the same rate as them so i said, well it's like this as far i'm concerned i said you know no bloke works perhaps twice as many hours as you do he chooses haven't you? -yeah yeah. +yeah yeah. when i said, i think that's wrong! yeah. -the only time you don't pay a self-employed stamp is if you your business earns,yo you can actually get away it, if you've lost money on your own business on paper or if you've earned +the only time you don't pay a self-employed stamp is if you your business earns,yo you can actually get away it, if you've lost money on your own business on paper or if you've earned well we have! why have you got it? yeah tha that's what i'm saying, i ain't got to. you haven't got to pay it? -no +no what about that last lot? ah that's , what they've said once you've paid it, you can't get it back, and if you don't pay it they can't insist you pay it. well you haven't paid it. @@ -71231,68 +71169,68 @@ paying for them all year long? ah but perhaps ken's the same as you then? cos i shouldn't think he's made any profit. dunno, well that's the situation. -i think you're allowed you're allowed to make thirty pound a week profit fifteen hundred pound a year, anything over fifteen hundred pound on your business they gotta pay tax. +i think you're allowed you're allowed to make thirty pound a week profit fifteen hundred pound a year, anything over fifteen hundred pound on your business they gotta pay tax. well you had a loss. . god! so a i said it's a shock ken lost we didn't know you see, well geoff paid it last year, well he di he di he didn't have to! -my name is jonathan . -so that's like dad said, i mean things +my name is jonathan . +so that's like dad said, i mean things dad? are not always can you pass me the -the people that have left are sort of in the recession and that now, there's all the really big business people and that that have come down to the same level as everybody else. +the people that have left are sort of in the recession and that now, there's all the really big business people and that that have come down to the same level as everybody else. that's right. -and they're all creating but you know +and they're all creating but you know yeah. -there's been a lot of people that have been on that level for a long while. +there's been a lot of people that have been on that level for a long while. that's right. yeah we have. yeah. yeah. -you know, but now cos all tha all them estate agents that had all the boom and everything didn't they? +you know, but now cos all tha all them estate agents that had all the boom and everything didn't they? yeah. -yeah made a fortune didn't they? +yeah made a fortune didn't they? yeah. -well but i mean, brian was saying himself you know he can't remember at least he's says he's been working down london when he hasn't been earning a hundred pound a day you know, it's something, we just accepted it, he said over the years i've been earning a hundred pound a day he says, and that was it you know yo yo just do. -and now he's nowhere earning +well but i mean, brian was saying himself you know he can't remember at least he's says he's been working down london when he hasn't been earning a hundred pound a day you know, it's something, we just accepted it, he said over the years i've been earning a hundred pound a day he says, and that was it you know yo yo just do. +and now he's nowhere earning that's it. nowhere near that amount. he says he worked like a pansy he said and now he says i go mm. -and he says and i'm putting in god knows how many hours, he said and we got a drop to fifty pound a day . +and he says and i'm putting in god knows how many hours, he said and we got a drop to fifty pound a day . he's halved them wages has he? i said well exactly i said . is this our book mum? yeah. -but i mean i i wouldn't even mind earning two hundred a fifty a week. -well no, well i mean like we do i mean i mean but i mean my gross up about three hundred over tony's but i put in many hours right? +but i mean i i wouldn't even mind earning two hundred a fifty a week. +well no, well i mean like we do i mean i mean but i mean my gross up about three hundred over tony's but i put in many hours right? yeah. isn't it about like that quarter to five in the morning i know. -till quarter five at night and then saturdays as well till dinner time you know? +till quarter five at night and then saturdays as well till dinner time you know? but they yeah. better that me. -i found some . +i found some . but then you want it . -well that's right that is +well that's right that is they it. so you're gonna get tax back as well, like you was told? -that's it -gonna get that back so i mean all these little bits -that are grumbling cos they've come down, but really they've come down to the same level as +that's it +gonna get that back so i mean all these little bits +that are grumbling cos they've come down, but really they've come down to the same level as well that's right. everybody else. yeah. yeah. that's right sarah. -they don't +they don't well brian was telling me levels off! you was . @@ -71305,52 +71243,52 @@ oh i've got one of them things. geoffrey oh. wants one, don't you geoffrey? -er no i mean, them over there +er no i mean, them over there mm mm. -oh but they really get up my nose!just wanna do is phone me up, you know i i sa oh had a row with , don't say anything like about quarter to four time and i said to her, well i'll be quite honest i said er there's sixty pound a week or seventy pound a week i get more than you i said i have never heard a load of moaning pratts in all my life! -i said you overtime you're moaning cos you gotta do, oh yeah we're always +oh but they really get up my nose!just wanna do is phone me up, you know i i sa oh had a row with , don't say anything like about quarter to four time and i said to her, well i'll be quite honest i said er there's sixty pound a week or seventy pound a week i get more than you i said i have never heard a load of moaning pratts in all my life! +i said you overtime you're moaning cos you gotta do, oh yeah we're always yeah. -the one's that have gotta i said and as soon as you ain't got no overtime ooh we aren't allowed a lot this week, we're a bloody flat week da and a i said i don't know what to do to keep you happy! -i said if you said to me, geoff, i want all the overtime i can get i can get the overtime i'll go round and i'll try and or if you say to me well i don't want the overtime, i'm quite happy with a flat week then i'll know what i am but i said you change from day to day, one day you wannit, another day you don't! +the one's that have gotta i said and as soon as you ain't got no overtime ooh we aren't allowed a lot this week, we're a bloody flat week da and a i said i don't know what to do to keep you happy! +i said if you said to me, geoff, i want all the overtime i can get i can get the overtime i'll go round and i'll try and or if you say to me well i don't want the overtime, i'm quite happy with a flat week then i'll know what i am but i said you change from day to day, one day you wannit, another day you don't! you yeah. -just want the job, to suit you if you wa , if you want to go and pick your kids up from school you'd think that oh why should we do work today, you know, let somebody else do it! +just want the job, to suit you if you wa , if you want to go and pick your kids up from school you'd think that oh why should we do work today, you know, let somebody else do it! so i said right. well blow that! i said there's a you gotta take it when it's there ain't you? that's right i said, you know, i can't understand you! -i says yo you go out to your flipping eleven pound a week +i says yo you go out to your flipping eleven pound a week mummy ! oh no! and er he gets a thirty five pound a week child allowance on his for his four kids! typical innit, though! -that's a about a innit bloody hell! -paying they're paying +that's a about a innit bloody hell! +paying they're paying yeah so well you . -so i er he said er no he said, it's not that he said i don't like people to tell me you've got to do overtime today, he said, i like to be asked! -i said well i'll be quite honest mate, there's two hundred people working in this factory and i said, if you think that e all the charge hands and the supervisors have got to come down and roll up you lot to get the job done i said you turn round and you think if you was in business, whatever it is you like to do, if you're in business and you've got an order and that order's gotta be out by six o'clock tonight and you've gotta grovel to your workers otherwise you'd lose that order, i said what would you say? +so i er he said er no he said, it's not that he said i don't like people to tell me you've got to do overtime today, he said, i like to be asked! +i said well i'll be quite honest mate, there's two hundred people working in this factory and i said, if you think that e all the charge hands and the supervisors have got to come down and roll up you lot to get the job done i said you turn round and you think if you was in business, whatever it is you like to do, if you're in business and you've got an order and that order's gotta be out by six o'clock tonight and you've gotta grovel to your workers otherwise you'd lose that order, i said what would you say? down the road mate, i'd get somebody who wants to do the job. -yeah that's right +yeah that's right i said and that's exactly how they are! -i said they aren't gonna put up with like you! -i said and that's why cos paul said to me, he said, i never hear you moan, i said look you won't hear me moan because it's not that i enjoy the job i hate the job i said i hate the work, and i find it hard work but at the end of the day on a friday, i know that six o'clock in the morning on a friday i can go up to the nationwide anglia, slip my card in there and i know there's gonna be a couple of hundred of quid in there with the +i said they aren't gonna put up with like you! +i said and that's why cos paul said to me, he said, i never hear you moan, i said look you won't hear me moan because it's not that i enjoy the job i hate the job i said i hate the work, and i find it hard work but at the end of the day on a friday, i know that six o'clock in the morning on a friday i can go up to the nationwide anglia, slip my card in there and i know there's gonna be a couple of hundred of quid in there with the yeah. -tax paid and everything, and i know it's gonna be in there i said now that to me is worth a lot i ain't gotta worry whether there's gonna be cheque from out on my doormat in the morning or if it's gonna bounce when i put it in so i sa +tax paid and everything, and i know it's gonna be in there i said now that to me is worth a lot i ain't gotta worry whether there's gonna be cheque from out on my doormat in the morning or if it's gonna bounce when i put it in so i sa . as far as i'm concerned -whatever o overtime they sling at me, i'll do not because i feel like doing it but i need to do it there's +whatever o overtime they sling at me, i'll do not because i feel like doing it but i need to do it there's yeah. my wife and kid at home! -so he said oh oh said his moan and groan so he said well i spoke to blue he said, he's off sick he said and he gets ninety pounds a week for being at home i've been working here all week he said, for a hundred and forty so i'm forty pound a week better off than him! +so he said oh oh said his moan and groan so he said well i spoke to blue he said, he's off sick he said and he gets ninety pounds a week for being at home i've been working here all week he said, for a hundred and forty so i'm forty pound a week better off than him! yes but he's sick! -i said he's not on holiday he's sick! +i said he's not on holiday he's sick! well forty pound a week's forty pound a week extra yeah. innit? -that's +that's so i said how much a month. yeah. @@ -71363,30 +71301,30 @@ you're working for a hundred yeah. and forty pound a week but would you go and check see what the heating's on? -you have to be sick you still get paid -the temperature's +you have to be sick you still get paid +the temperature's i said you're going about it with the wrong attitude! mm. a lot of people say i'm bloody lucky to get paid for being at home sick! and that they've got a job. -yep, i said what are you -oh -i said no i was home sick and i in bed like you said i couldn't who's gonna turn round and say well there are geoff there's a hundred quid mate +yep, i said what are you +oh +i said no i was home sick and i in bed like you said i couldn't who's gonna turn round and say well there are geoff there's a hundred quid mate that's it. we know you're ill in bed? i said but you're nobody is! bloody lucky! i said that'd do you good to be in business for a couple of years, that'd get you sorted out! -they all think that's like he said they think oh stand up in the corridor, that's alright, amy said if you don't if you have a holiday, you don't get no money +they all think that's like he said they think oh stand up in the corridor, that's alright, amy said if you don't if you have a holiday, you don't get no money absolutely! well like they're he said they don't know half! -that's what i said to ron, i mean i've never known i can't remember the last time i when i used to work for colin for ten years trying to get a holiday out of colin was like trying to get blood! -oh you can't have two weeks at once you know but over there you gotta get rid of your holidays before december, you gotta get rid of them otherwise you lose them. +that's what i said to ron, i mean i've never known i can't remember the last time i when i used to work for colin for ten years trying to get a holiday out of colin was like trying to get blood! +oh you can't have two weeks at once you know but over there you gotta get rid of your holidays before december, you gotta get rid of them otherwise you lose them. take them, you've got to get rid of them! mm. -in the end i couldn't get rid of them, i had two days off when i was ill and i had as holidays to ge to get them sort of settled up you know. +in the end i couldn't get rid of them, i had two days off when i was ill and i had as holidays to ge to get them sort of settled up you know. to get what? that's like this woman at work to get . @@ -71399,31 +71337,31 @@ to her like erm oh yeah . yeah. erm, what did i say? -something about oh what did i say? +something about oh what did i say? she's a funny woman anyway, i said something like -they are peculiar breed! -i should think i should think you it's nice to have the six weeks ahead of us and she said well it's not a holiday! +they are peculiar breed! +i should think i should think you it's nice to have the six weeks ahead of us and she said well it's not a holiday! i thought well i wouldn't mind ooh no! six weeks of not having to get up and you gotta go. no, not going into the shop at least, yeah. cor! -she said she said for the first week you unwind, i thought if we have a weeks holiday that means that the time you unwind you're back to work again! +she said she said for the first week you unwind, i thought if we have a weeks holiday that means that the time you unwind you're back to work again! you're back to work . that's right. -she said and then i have two weeks erm homework to mark and then we have a weeks holiday i thought well that's two weeks +she said and then i have two weeks erm homework to mark and then we have a weeks holiday i thought well that's two weeks yeah. holiday cor! really. that's it. she said and then the next week you're preparing to go back! -well why can't she do that two weeks marking in that first week she needs to unwind? +well why can't she do that two weeks marking in that first week she needs to unwind? yeah. and then have a -and yet another client of mine who's a teacher, she said oh yeah she said it's lovely, she said i suppose i ought to do the marking and all that at the beginning she said but i leave it, she said, and i sometimes do it in the last week. +and yet another client of mine who's a teacher, she said oh yeah she said it's lovely, she said i suppose i ought to do the marking and all that at the beginning she said but i leave it, she said, and i sometimes do it in the last week. yeah. -i thought to myself that's two different +i thought to myself that's two different yeah. attitudes really. yeah. @@ -71442,7 +71380,7 @@ yeah. get all weekend don't you? sometimes we get what they call baker days. yeah. -you know, so they don't do too badly they do quite well really. +you know, so they don't do too badly they do quite well really. yeah. . ah i dunno. @@ -71453,30 +71391,30 @@ they all sort of always bloody moaning! and they're all aren't they? -ready to ta , that's what i said to him you're always ready to take out hand outs, what ever's there to be handed out, you know. +ready to ta , that's what i said to him you're always ready to take out hand outs, what ever's there to be handed out, you know. yeah. -cos that really got up, up my back when the , i mean tho ain't a ba , bad bunch of old boys but i normally go down but they they clear and once we've done our work before dinner break they all clear off and i go down to the and then i sort of walk back more or less behind them you know, to the break like and as i go past the club, i go and wash my hands, they go straight in, i go and wash my hands and i walk past the and er we should go to dinner at quarter to twelve and i go past, it's one minute past quarter to twelve so cos when we go in there you see quarter past twelve due to go back i always give them two or three minutes and i say that's it, that's , ah we was late coming in, i said no you weren't! -we was i said look i can read a bloody clock as well you can, i said i wa walking behind you down the , you went in the canteen and when i went past it was one minute past quarter to! -so i said you know, the one minute past quarter to and there's a sort of quietly you know but then you know, just have to grab at +cos that really got up, up my back when the , i mean tho ain't a ba , bad bunch of old boys but i normally go down but they they clear and once we've done our work before dinner break they all clear off and i go down to the and then i sort of walk back more or less behind them you know, to the break like and as i go past the club, i go and wash my hands, they go straight in, i go and wash my hands and i walk past the and er we should go to dinner at quarter to twelve and i go past, it's one minute past quarter to twelve so cos when we go in there you see quarter past twelve due to go back i always give them two or three minutes and i say that's it, that's , ah we was late coming in, i said no you weren't! +we was i said look i can read a bloody clock as well you can, i said i wa walking behind you down the , you went in the canteen and when i went past it was one minute past quarter to! +so i said you know, the one minute past quarter to and there's a sort of quietly you know but then you know, just have to grab at yeah. they get excitement out of taking two extra minutes give them an, inch and they want a yard i think oh my god! you know, i, it's so petty that! -that's like sarah at work, i mean she leaves at twenty past five, if she thinks that, she'll leave at ten past five i mean she thinks you're stupid because she don't always go but even when she's not going she +that's like sarah at work, i mean she leaves at twenty past five, if she thinks that, she'll leave at ten past five i mean she thinks you're stupid because she don't always go but even when she's not going she yeah. -still goes at twenty past five so why don't she go at six when we do? +still goes at twenty past five so why don't she go at six when we do? yeah. you know. yeah. and she said she even taking her home sarah! i told her i wouldn't. -yeah cos she used to get me t , and then she rang me up one day when i was and said dad erm dad can't bring me round there cos the car's not working, can you come and pick me up? -yeah . +yeah cos she used to get me t , and then she rang me up one day when i was and said dad erm dad can't bring me round there cos the car's not working, can you come and pick me up? +yeah . she said i'll give you some petrol money, i said i'm not bothered about petrol money, i said it's the fact that i've gotta come round to pick you up, i said i'm not a taxi! yeah. -and then i was late, when i got round there i thought well she'll at least be waiting at the top of the drive, if not at the top of the road. +and then i was late, when i got round there i thought well she'll at least be waiting at the top of the drive, if not at the top of the road. yeah. she weren't there, i had to go round the house knocking on her door and oh yeah. @@ -71485,13 +71423,13 @@ yeah. well yeah you don't mind giving anybody a lift no. if they make their way to you. -yeah and she used to be hammering on the door, twenty past five you know yeah -but mrs the other day it was something like two o'clock, mrs said to her, she went to lunch one till two mrs oh have you had your lunch? -she said no, are you off lunch yet? -she said not until five past, mrs said you can get up them stairs, she said you go at ten minutes early every day! -she said i'm sure you're gonna quibble about five minutes lunch hour! +yeah and she used to be hammering on the door, twenty past five you know yeah +but mrs the other day it was something like two o'clock, mrs said to her, she went to lunch one till two mrs oh have you had your lunch? +she said no, are you off lunch yet? +she said not until five past, mrs said you can get up them stairs, she said you go at ten minutes early every day! +she said i'm sure you're gonna quibble about five minutes lunch hour! oh she actually told her then? -yeah but bu oh she's just ! +yeah but bu oh she's just ! yeah. idle! yeah. @@ -71502,42 +71440,42 @@ yeah. yeah. and she don't do nothing! yeah. -yeah does she do any hairdressing yet or? -a little bit but she really winds me up she does. +yeah does she do any hairdressing yet or? +a little bit but she really winds me up she does. yeah that's how i yeah. -i ! -and then she said to me mrs gives us erm sometimes an extra ten pound, she gets a y t s allowance +i ! +and then she said to me mrs gives us erm sometimes an extra ten pound, she gets a y t s allowance yeah. and she ooh i don't know i'm gonna have to something to her cos some weeks i get it and some weeks i don't, i said you ought to think yourself lucky you get an extra ten pound, i said, we don't! -i said we bring them, we're earning the money cos she don't earn her own money does she +i said we bring them, we're earning the money cos she don't earn her own money does she no. just shampooing. no. no. she said i want to know whether i'm gonna get it regular or not! i said think yourself lucky you get any extra at all! -mm yeah . -and then she said about her erm y t s, oh i haven't got my bus money back yet i only get an allowance! -i said well i never used to get any anyway, and i said i used earn less than you! +mm yeah . +and then she said about her erm y t s, oh i haven't got my bus money back yet i only get an allowance! +i said well i never used to get any anyway, and i said i used earn less than you! yeah. you know she cor! mm. i mean -hand outs every time! +hand outs every time! but they don't know half do they? that family has more handouts than anybody i know! -and the, what is the the thing what annoys me is they're working! +and the, what is the the thing what annoys me is they're working! mm. yeah. -that is what annoys about it or fair enough if they haven't got any money they get these handouts but when they're working and they still get them that's when i think it's wrong! +that is what annoys about it or fair enough if they haven't got any money they get these handouts but when they're working and they still get them that's when i think it's wrong! i mean we're the mugs aren't we really? well course we are! that's right. my mo , i think my motto's gonna be, see if you can't beat them, join them! yeah. yeah. -but that's exactly the same me and ady having this bungalow built, i mean some people been ever so funny. +but that's exactly the same me and ady having this bungalow built, i mean some people been ever so funny. yeah. wonder why . why should you and @@ -71545,44 +71483,44 @@ yeah. yeah. oh that's alright been funny? -for you, i said we worked you know, we've not been given anything, everything +for you, i said we worked you know, we've not been given anything, everything yeah. -we've got we've worked for. +we've got we've worked for. yeah. i mean they get ma , they know for six months, they get married with all the gear, the next year they got a baby, fair enough, that's up to them. and then and then they get divorced! -you know, i mean we haven't i ain't got a new car or anything, i've had that +you know, i mean we haven't i ain't got a new car or anything, i've had that yeah. years and yeah. yeah. -people do what you know, everybody's different what they do with their money +people do what you know, everybody's different what they do with their money yeah. aren't they? so they think yeah. -just because we saved for that that you know +just because we saved for that that you know well you saved hard for it, so then why shouldn't you have it? that's what i know. you want to do with your money -i said that to +i said that to that's up to you. -you know got he he's quite, he's having it built over here. +you know got he he's quite, he's having it built over here. he's important what? sarah! oh. -no kidding you, his is your dad's bungalow, and it's a house! -about as big as your dad's bungalow! +no kidding you, his is your dad's bungalow, and it's a house! +about as big as your dad's bungalow! that's painting the front in. oh! if you look round here cos he's right opposite us. it's a concrete slab yeah. -it don't look any +it don't look any he put at all do they? no. @@ -71590,39 +71528,39 @@ well he's it is bloody huge, he's had the fireman round there! i said to geoff when you get your footings in they do you think to yourself, cor that ain't gonna be very big! you do yeah. -but as soon as it builds up, you see how big it's gonna be so i said well that's gonna be like erm buckingham palace i should think! -but they haven't a concrete slab! +but as soon as it builds up, you see how big it's gonna be so i said well that's gonna be like erm buckingham palace i should think! +but they haven't a concrete slab! cos he said it's gonna be as big as the other house. the old house. and do you know he's getting all i wonder how they're doing it? well he thinks he's gonna get his tiles for nothing isn't he, geoff? -yeah, he said i got a thousand pound well i'll ring around, he said i got a thousand o off my, i saved a thousand pounds on my roof he said i thought bloody hell, how much cost costing him ! +yeah, he said i got a thousand pound well i'll ring around, he said i got a thousand o off my, i saved a thousand pounds on my roof he said i thought bloody hell, how much cost costing him ! no, but he's, he went to the ideal but he homes exhibition oh yeah. -and course they're doing this new tiles. -they bought out, this company have bought out a new tile and he said they're looking for a sort of nice house to have as a sort of a show house and then he thinks he'll get them for nothing. +and course they're doing this new tiles. +they bought out, this company have bought out a new tile and he said they're looking for a sort of nice house to have as a sort of a show house and then he thinks he'll get them for nothing. cor must be really ! -mind you, i mean when we were choosing our bricks he said ooh erm he gave number and that, i mean i know he's not too bad is he when you want +mind you, i mean when we were choosing our bricks he said ooh erm he gave number and that, i mean i know he's not too bad is he when you want oh . -he can help them ooh you want to ring him a my bricks should of cost what did he say? -four hundred or four hundred and forty or something erm and on, i can't remember what he said he was getting them for i +he can help them ooh you want to ring him a my bricks should of cost what did he say? +four hundred or four hundred and forty or something erm and on, i can't remember what he said he was getting them for i two hundred and thirty? come from belgium? probably yes. yeah. he told me that. -but geoff said there aren't any bricks that are that much money anyway! +but geoff said there aren't any bricks that are that much money anyway! so i don't know whether he's right or not. no. cos we but we -rang them up and he was dearer than all the blooming builders merchants! +rang them up and he was dearer than all the blooming builders merchants! yeah. at least kevin was saying. -cos you see we was lucky how we got our bricks didn't we? +cos you see we was lucky how we got our bricks didn't we? weren't yeah. we geoff? @@ -71634,62 +71572,62 @@ yeah geoff sold him the car sold him a couple of cars and he said well he'd oh. -got a load of brick, where did he have them -he had it , he got caught by he got er -there's like a big pallet all surrounded and he got a big pond down the bottom it's erm near grimston common +got a load of brick, where did he have them +he had it , he got caught by he got er +there's like a big pallet all surrounded and he got a big pond down the bottom it's erm near grimston common oh yeah. -common and he lived at grimston and er he got this plot and er what was right next door to it was a sort of real big old li like a french chateau and he wanted a big ge red brick georgian house, a real big one, sort of sitting at the back of this plot that the owner +common and he lived at grimston and er he got this plot and er what was right next door to it was a sort of real big old li like a french chateau and he wanted a big ge red brick georgian house, a real big one, sort of sitting at the back of this plot that the owner oh yeah. had put down the end. -anyway he got all his bricks and everything and er he got all his ideas what he wanted and then they turned round and said no, we're not gonna let you build down there. +anyway he got all his bricks and everything and er he got all his ideas what he wanted and then they turned round and said no, we're not gonna let you build down there. so we bought his bricks. -so he's got all his bricks up virtually i think he said, but i ain't worried about it cos i'll get rid of them somewhere and i helped him out, i sold this car and, and told him what i was doing and he come i've just the thing for you, just cos was having bricks like your dad's, the sand grain sort of brick, you know. +so he's got all his bricks up virtually i think he said, but i ain't worried about it cos i'll get rid of them somewhere and i helped him out, i sold this car and, and told him what i was doing and he come i've just the thing for you, just cos was having bricks like your dad's, the sand grain sort of brick, you know. oh yeah. -ooh he said i've got just the for you, he said,he said . +ooh he said i've got just the for you, he said,he said . and that's how we got them. -and i di in the end they the same for them, but +and i di in the end they the same for them, but he and geoff went over there and loaded them on the trailer . -we would of done it by ourself sorted out. -yeah we do a we went over there and loaded them all on and then got a puncture in the trailer,! -put them on a didn't they, then load them load +we would of done it by ourself sorted out. +yeah we do a we went over there and loaded them all on and then got a puncture in the trailer,! +put them on a didn't they, then load them load yeah. -them on yeah. -used be able to sit in the car would be go up the back don't they? +them on yeah. +used be able to sit in the car would be go up the back don't they? yeah. -and i used to load the boot up and bring them and load home like in the boot of my car my sales manager said to me the other day, how the hell did you get bright red dust in your boot? +and i used to load the boot up and bring them and load home like in the boot of my car my sales manager said to me the other day, how the hell did you get bright red dust in your boot? i dunno! there's all like red brick dust in your boot! oh no! geoff was getting the bricks. -and i had avenger estate, and i done the same with that and i got away with it for ages and i what you want a do, i know what you wanna do he erm, i mean that's that's really sort of pushing it over the top but he got a great big sheet of polythene, he went down to ready mix and had a load of ready mix in the back of this avenger estate, brand new he'd only just got it! +and i had avenger estate, and i done the same with that and i got away with it for ages and i what you want a do, i know what you wanna do he erm, i mean that's that's really sort of pushing it over the top but he got a great big sheet of polythene, he went down to ready mix and had a load of ready mix in the back of this avenger estate, brand new he'd only just got it! and course well we didn't do that but -and then on top of that he took the battery off pat's car and it fell over in the front so all the acid burnt the carpet! -come back dinner time and they were saying well no you see you can't just a borrow a car to go to dinner in, yeah that'll be alright man and i hadn't even been in it since roy bought it back! +and then on top of that he took the battery off pat's car and it fell over in the front so all the acid burnt the carpet! +come back dinner time and they were saying well no you see you can't just a borrow a car to go to dinner in, yeah that'll be alright man and i hadn't even been in it since roy bought it back! absolutely went spare you know ! -sent memos all round, you know and he called me in the office that day, to say i'm really disappointed in you, i said, what do you mean? -he said well i give you that avenger estate he said cos i thought you were building your house, that'll be handy for you you know yeah you did and you let me down badly! -so i thought now what do i say, do i drop myself in it or do i say well that wasn't , that was roy, i said well you know i said i must admit i said i i'm sorry so erm then roy said well that battery he said was me he said i, i borrowed geoff's car again and look the battery fell over in it so i'm gonna help him er then i sa , a piece of that bloody great went across our french doors and this, there's a went across +sent memos all round, you know and he called me in the office that day, to say i'm really disappointed in you, i said, what do you mean? +he said well i give you that avenger estate he said cos i thought you were building your house, that'll be handy for you you know yeah you did and you let me down badly! +so i thought now what do i say, do i drop myself in it or do i say well that wasn't , that was roy, i said well you know i said i must admit i said i i'm sorry so erm then roy said well that battery he said was me he said i, i borrowed geoff's car again and look the battery fell over in it so i'm gonna help him er then i sa , a piece of that bloody great went across our french doors and this, there's a went across cor! -there and i went down to the at and he said we got your lintel in mate, do you want to take it? -so i said yeah i can do so he said bring your van down, so i never said nothing so bob said, got any like your dad had +there and i went down to the at and he said we got your lintel in mate, do you want to take it? +so i said yeah i can do so he said bring your van down, so i never said nothing so bob said, got any like your dad had oh yeah. -it's for our new one again you see so i rolled the front seat down put my brief case on the front seat so he says, where's your van then mate? +it's for our new one again you see so i rolled the front seat down put my brief case on the front seat so he says, where's your van then mate? i said it's here! no, where is it? i said that is it! yo you can't put it in that he said, it's brand new! -that'll be alright so cos he slid his my brief case and er i got all the way home, no problem at all, i'd got newspaper under the back, so it didn't scratch the back when i come to come down mill road this lorry's go , i mean i got the tail gate up and er i sort of looked in the mirror, i thought oh my goodness my tail gate, i could hear it so and i braked a bit sharp and that slid down and scratched along the dash board! +that'll be alright so cos he slid his my brief case and er i got all the way home, no problem at all, i'd got newspaper under the back, so it didn't scratch the back when i come to come down mill road this lorry's go , i mean i got the tail gate up and er i sort of looked in the mirror, i thought oh my goodness my tail gate, i could hear it so and i braked a bit sharp and that slid down and scratched along the dash board! oh dear! trying to get it out , sort of plastic dash went creeeh! cor! -this lintel! -that went right across there but well i suppose . +this lintel! +that went right across there but well i suppose . well i imagine there is. yeah. mum? i wanna play a game. -alright then i'm sorry that's not in there. +alright then i'm sorry that's not in there. mum! well it don't matter we'll probably be able something out the sale anyway. yeah you can get it, yeah. @@ -71697,14 +71635,14 @@ mum, yeah that's right. take up. what? -er +er no. . -oh oh didn't look. +oh oh didn't look. anyway i'd better go, i'll see, well if i don't see you before i'll see you next wednesday for my birthday. then won't i? -yep, so what time is it, half past six is it, or do you want me quarter past six was it, or half six, what time do you want me? +yep, so what time is it, half past six is it, or do you want me quarter past six was it, or half six, what time do you want me? is quarter past six too early? no, i'm home till quarter past eight. is that alright? @@ -71722,39 +71660,39 @@ would you spend pardon? a hundred and ninety nine pound on me on my birthday? certainly not! -no i didn't think you would ! +no i didn't think you would ! no i knew you wouldn't! would you eighty nine? can't afford that sort of money jonathan. -no cos it's just a computer game. +no cos it's just a computer game. i really can't. eighty nine pound! oh . -i think that's the something for you, but dad's struggling i really am struggling! -oh i'll find something cheaper oh! -that cos you know what american was? +i think that's the something for you, but dad's struggling i really am struggling! +oh i'll find something cheaper oh! +that cos you know what american was? no. you know julian's one? yeah. -yeah well it isn't that one, it's i'll find it and i'll read it out to you julian's one is two hundred and thirty four ninety nine +yeah well it isn't that one, it's i'll find it and i'll read it out to you julian's one is two hundred and thirty four ninety nine yeah. -because it's got gold wheels right it's got a better suspension. +because it's got gold wheels right it's got a better suspension. jonathan you, have you turned that tape off? oh! -well turn it off now if you wanna watch in fifteen minutes. +well turn it off now if you wanna watch in fifteen minutes. have you got all your school things ready? yeah. you got your trousers all muddled up. oh! why do you always have to tell me! well it's not, very nice going to school with . -right every time we have school's . +right every time we have school's . your flys are undone! hi!ha! ask him to have his undone then! yeah and he's always . is he? -mm yeah. +mm yeah. and you don't play in blooming class will you? no i won't. yuk! @@ -71766,7 +71704,7 @@ okay, i'll be back in a minute! do you have to go so early? yeah. well why do you go so early? -i wanna meet my mates. +i wanna meet my mates. oh. well a but andrew likes to be going early. andrew who? @@ -71775,41 +71713,41 @@ andrew ? . why does he like going early? he just wants to, don't he! -oh do your coat up. +oh do your coat up. don't throw away! don't forget your bike tonight. -i'll just pick it up. +i'll just pick it up. i wondered if you'd help me out in the garden, perhaps like if it's still nice when you come home from school? yeah. clear some of the leaves up. if it's bright enough. yeah if it's nice. -i work till four o'clock, and then and then it'll be getting dark won't it? -yeah yeah that's right. -packet and raise your hand there. +i work till four o'clock, and then and then it'll be getting dark won't it? +yeah yeah that's right. +packet and raise your hand there. pardon? do i have to be home by five? you're not going today, you're going tomorrow. oh yeah i am. -yeah i'll meet you up there look, look at her look, look who's looking in the window! +yeah i'll meet you up there look, look at her look, look who's looking in the window! can i let her in? yeah go and let her in. -oh . +oh . hurry up ! -come here you are +come here you are come on in! good girl! -alright then off are you? -hey mummy you know when you used to go to toilet in the middle of a conversation. +alright then off are you? +hey mummy you know when you used to go to toilet in the middle of a conversation. yeah. -yeah i know how you do that. +yeah i know how you do that. pause it. yeah, do you know pause it? yeah. so do i. yeah. have you ever paused it yet? -no,because i'm frightened o i might i haven't done that. +no,because i'm frightened o i might i haven't done that. can i try? no not now, you can perhaps try today. yeah get in the middle of mu i @@ -71820,18 +71758,18 @@ her breakfast. yeah and guess who hasn't been fed either! ahhh! ginge. -poor little ginge. -alright then do you want to go then? -yeah just kiss goodbye bye! -bye bye be a good boy won't +poor little ginge. +alright then do you want to go then? +yeah just kiss goodbye bye! +bye bye be a good boy won't i didn't spoil the tape today! i don't want to ! -oh yeah i can do bye then! +oh yeah i can do bye then! . -yeah bye ! +yeah bye ! bye ! morning! -twenty please, and have you got a birthday card for mother please? +twenty please, and have you got a birthday card for mother please? ooh! isn't it cold! grandma's back in the wrong place! @@ -71840,8 +71778,8 @@ oh crumbs yeah! ooh! ooh and i want a packet of sage and onion stuffing, whereabouts is that? anywhere here? -it's up the top there in the yellow packet next to the paxo breadcrumbs, up the top shelf. -yeah oh yeah ooh god i'm knocking all the shop down! +it's up the top there in the yellow packet next to the paxo breadcrumbs, up the top shelf. +yeah oh yeah ooh god i'm knocking all the shop down! you got some good slippers on! hey? oh! @@ -71849,74 +71787,74 @@ there's always something isn't there? well yeah. is rene here today? yeah. -oh that's nice with the little bunny rabbits on that's a nice one, the little bunnies innit? +oh that's nice with the little bunny rabbits on that's a nice one, the little bunnies innit? yeah. -oh shall gi and one for jonathan erm nan +oh shall gi and one for jonathan erm nan that one. oh those two will be alright. those two? -yeah lovely thank you and do you have stockings? +yeah lovely thank you and do you have stockings? i've got so i've got some here. i'll just have a look they're not erm pop socks -that's one size stockings there's not much left in the way of them now because most people you know don't wear stockings, these are pop +that's one size stockings there's not much left in the way of them now because most people you know don't wear stockings, these are pop well socks and tights. tights -and that i think they're all tights there. +and that i think they're all tights there. are they all tights? -yeah apart from that one pair that you got in the, that you had there. -yeah that's not really the right colour for her erm what else can i think of? +yeah apart from that one pair that you got in the, that you had there. +yeah that's not really the right colour for her erm what else can i think of? have you tried this v p sherry? no. -well she drinks sherry you see i thought well is that a sweet sherry? +well she drinks sherry you see i thought well is that a sweet sherry? i don't know er what's it got on it, it's medium isn't it? it's cream isn't it? -cream sherry, that should be fairly shouldn't it? +cream sherry, that should be fairly shouldn't it? well yeah it should be. -yeah i'll have that then well the lovely thanks very much. -did 's grandma die or something? +yeah i'll have that then well the lovely thanks very much. +did 's grandma die or something? mm? 's yeah. up the road. -i think last +i think last oh. week. oh the funeral was yesterday weren't it? yeah. -yeah where was she buried down here then? +yeah where was she buried down here then? cos she lived do she lived no she was in marshlands nursing home. oh was she? oh i didn't know. -yeah she'd been in there about seven or eight months i think. +yeah she'd been in there about seven or eight months i think. oh. -that's why they erm the funeral was actually from carole's. -yeah i se well i happened to be coming home from school cos i thought there was a the hearse coming and then i watched two mourning cars two flashy great big things! +that's why they erm the funeral was actually from carole's. +yeah i se well i happened to be coming home from school cos i thought there was a the hearse coming and then i watched two mourning cars two flashy great big things! mm. i thought crumbs i bet that cost a lot! they do don't they? i thought how the other half live! i must be doing something wrong! -suppose sometimes in those circumstances, i know i mean my mum and dad died two years ago it was a thousand pound! -yeah it must be it's not cheap -well -to die is it ! +suppose sometimes in those circumstances, i know i mean my mum and dad died two years ago it was a thousand pound! +yeah it must be it's not cheap +well +to die is it ! so six months later terry's mother died it was a thousand pound gone up! crumbs! it had gone up in that time. don't worry about that val i'll do it when i get home. -one of those cars terry's mother only had two. +one of those cars terry's mother only had two. yeah. -but he didn't have the he he had the hearse and one car we had the hearse plus three more cars. +but he didn't have the he he had the hearse and one car we had the hearse plus three more cars. did you really. and cost us a thousand pound. yeah. -about five hundred pound those three cars. +about five hundred pound those three cars. was it really? cor! and his coffin was draped with the union jack. @@ -71926,11 +71864,11 @@ he was into a lots of things, he was er in the sea scouts, he was the district c oh he's all sorts of things then? yeah. yeah. -he's also done a lot of things with his +he's also done a lot of things with his yeah. -so i mean they +so i mean they yeah. -sent from london, from the heather's scouts organisation set a wreath that was , it stood up +sent from london, from the heather's scouts organisation set a wreath that was , it stood up really? something to stand it up to it was that heavy, it was the scout's , it was beautiful! oh lovely. @@ -71940,8 +71878,8 @@ ah! right, that's five fifty seven that lot altogether. hold on, do you want the fifty seven if i've got it? if you've got it yeah. -yeah, i've got it five six seven. -right lovely thank you ah i suppose i better be off to work. +yeah, i've got it five six seven. +right lovely thank you ah i suppose i better be off to work. right. yeah i don't wanna take a bottle of sherry round, the school will think i'm gonna be on the booze all afternoon do won't they! something to talk about. @@ -71957,167 +71895,167 @@ thanks a lot. ta ta. cheerio! bye bye. -yeah tara val oh! +yeah tara val oh! that's alright, just leave it. you don't mind me doing this do you? what?no. that's alright is it? -no +no alright then. -it's that alright. +it's that alright. i switch it off now before i go out then ! ooh you weren't! -oh i did i thought +oh i did i thought i fancy that. have you seen what's across there? what he's got in his back yard? -no well i ain't do you want anything on there? +no well i ain't do you want anything on there? oh but one of these isn't gonna be ready for christmas. you know what he's got geese for don't you? what. they reckon you could touch their beaks ! -oh yeah, yeah 's have got them that was, that funeral was at 's that was her grandma i reckon that's +oh yeah, yeah 's have got them that was, that funeral was at 's that was her grandma i reckon that's oh was it? -why she hasn't been to school she was in erm the . +why she hasn't been to school she was in erm the . oh. -also got a bottle of sherry in here, i th people think i'm going on the booze ! -i bo just bought one up the shop for geoff's mums birthday well she's now +also got a bottle of sherry in here, i th people think i'm going on the booze ! +i bo just bought one up the shop for geoff's mums birthday well she's now yeah. starting to have a glass of sherry every night, well i thought well why not! -if she can get a few bottles +if she can get a few bottles mm mm/ -that's saves her paying for it herself don't it? -and i got her a box of black magic so that's her birthday present sorted out so she can eat and drink then can't she! +that's saves her paying for it herself don't it? +and i got her a box of black magic so that's her birthday present sorted out so she can eat and drink then can't she! well she don't want ornaments and things like that, does she at her age? they got so many! -i don't know what to buy my dad for christmas but if i +i don't know what to buy my dad for christmas but if i ooh no -buy him a bottle of baileys he +buy him a bottle of baileys he does he like that? loves baileys yeah. yeah. -well i mean +well i mean well yeah he hasn't gotta buy -you don't want +you don't want well no. stuff he, you know. -see my dad likes videos and things like that but he wa he, i know he likes aftershave, he likes that old spice and that so i thought well i'll get him something like that or i thought i sort of saw cos i'm going shopping saturday, i'm trying to get it all saturday if i can. +see my dad likes videos and things like that but he wa he, i know he likes aftershave, he likes that old spice and that so i thought well i'll get him something like that or i thought i sort of saw cos i'm going shopping saturday, i'm trying to get it all saturday if i can. i don't blame you. -so i thought well if i can sort of get think to myself a rough idea before i go jonathan's going to geoff's mums cos geoff's gotta work all day saturday you see? +so i thought well if i can sort of get think to myself a rough idea before i go jonathan's going to geoff's mums cos geoff's gotta work all day saturday you see? yeah you said that. well that's something to do with they're working this saturday and then they break up a bit earlier or something. oh i see, yeah. -something like that, so i said well that's a good job i'm going this saturday innit really? +something like that, so i said well that's a good job i'm going this saturday innit really? yeah. ooh! it's a bit nippy isn't it? i'm frozen! i think -mrs won't be there. +mrs won't be there. no, she's gone on a trip, simon called round he just dropped mother off. oh yeah she was going with you mum isn't she? -yeah +yeah who has she got, does she know? she doesn't know, i don't suppose she'll know till she got there will she? -no probably not, no course she wouldn't i think jonathan's with mrs . +no probably not, no course she wouldn't i think jonathan's with mrs . gone has she? -oh yeah, she's going tomorrow no tomorrow, they go don't though. -tomorrow +oh yeah, she's going tomorrow no tomorrow, they go don't though. +tomorrow ooh! ooh ! -half past ten isn't it? +half past ten isn't it? what this morning? -yes my mother in law. +yes my mother in law. ooh! -she's gonna be there tonight i thought well i always could just well i think i might come over if you've gotta be there. +she's gonna be there tonight i thought well i always could just well i think i might come over if you've gotta be there. oh! she isn't bringing the boyfriend is she? -she's not, she +she's not, she no she wouldn't would she? she wouldn't! no. oh perhaps she's gonna try and she might want to stay i don't know. -sort of you know, sort of get peace with you again ooh! -without anything almost wished she hadn't of come +sort of you know, sort of get peace with you again ooh! +without anything almost wished she hadn't of come oh! -we went down this park cos we wanted to +we went down this park cos we wanted to yeah. and when we walked in she's got her brother and her boyfriend. oh! and they always go on a wednesday, they never go on a thursday. oh! -i mean that's why we went on a thursday and they'd changed their as a chap that seems very strange to me! +i mean that's why we went on a thursday and they'd changed their as a chap that seems very strange to me! yeah. -because she knows we go once every you know every other thursday at least. -perhaps she was frightened that she'd gotta +because she knows we go once every you know every other thursday at least. +perhaps she was frightened that she'd gotta yeah see you on your own. says she's coming over so what's oh! you never know! -ooh you ha wait and see is graham at work today? +ooh you ha wait and see is graham at work today? no, but, well it tuesday is his day off but he's got late till eleven this morning. oh that's alright. -and this afternoon, don't know whether to have an exploratory operation on knee in huntingdon +and this afternoon, don't know whether to have an exploratory operation on knee in huntingdon oh yeah! -yesterday and they sent him home last week and he's on crutches at the moment. +yesterday and they sent him home last week and he's on crutches at the moment. oh. -so graham has gone round +so graham has gone round morning! -hello bill be home, it'll be five. +hello bill be home, it'll be five. yeah. -perhaps his work has so +perhaps his work has so has it? yep. i think that's how it goes, you see, this is geoff's busy time. -chris said that always like that christmas time because they have the pay talks in january and they always cut them back +chris said that always like that christmas time because they have the pay talks in january and they always cut them back do they? -pay talks yeah. +pay talks yeah. oh! to make them think there's not a lot of work and that you know? -oh yeah yeah -so he said yes you know, they say well if you want to be paid it means people'll have to be sacked and all this, well you know! +oh yeah yeah +so he said yes you know, they say well if you want to be paid it means people'll have to be sacked and all this, well you know! well yeah that's how they go don't they, yeah. that's right. ooh! i'm in the infant end today aren't i? -yeah well i me and margaret should be in the hall but i think they've assumed that there will be less +yeah well i me and margaret should be in the hall but i think they've assumed that there will be less can go in the hall can't they? -they can all go in the hall and then that'll leave me free to go out first like i should do. +they can all go in the hall and then that'll leave me free to go out first like i should do. well that's right yeah. -i was told i should lend that classroom to them i can't ge really get out first and that should be my turn to be out first today. +i was told i should lend that classroom to them i can't ge really get out first and that should be my turn to be out first today. yeah cos i definitely shan't be out first shall i? no. -no and if not that'll be margaret out first, out of the hall, won't it? +no and if not that'll be margaret out first, out of the hall, won't it? yeah. -i mean she'll be out two days on the trot. +i mean she'll be out two days on the trot. yeah and that's not fair, and that's cold today isn't it? -no and you see it's just them two i think they could put him sort of like in the hall and if there's a +no and you see it's just them two i think they could put him sort of like in the hall and if there's a yeah. -he -ask eric yeah yeah cos there won't be that many will there? +he +ask eric yeah yeah cos there won't be that many will there? well i wouldn't of thought so, the whole class gonna be missing. ooh! -so really that'd be the best idea but -yeah do you know my washing was virtually dry when i went home yesterday. -mine got quite dry finished the ki the kids wet on the radiator. +so really that'd be the best idea but +yeah do you know my washing was virtually dry when i went home yesterday. +mine got quite dry finished the ki the kids wet on the radiator. i ju i but my towels were dry enough to iron. -yeah my flannelette sheets were virtually dry just +yeah my flannelette sheets were virtually dry just yeah. -popped them on the radiator for ten minutes and i i well i ironed them i usually do my bits -well i left it i thought i've just gotta sit down had a they got daisy. +popped them on the radiator for ten minutes and i i well i ironed them i usually do my bits +well i left it i thought i've just gotta sit down had a they got daisy. oh yeah. they do look brown , well! she wanted to play and she wanted to colour and oh oh oh she wanted to do all sorts did she? -oh then erm said i love my granddad i said what about your grandma? +oh then erm said i love my granddad i said what about your grandma? no! -i said not oh alright she says, a little bit! +i said not oh alright she says, a little bit! she likes her granddad does she? -yeah i said do you love jack? +yeah i said do you love jack? no, she said because he doesn't love me! oh ! god she didn't know! @@ -72127,19 +72065,19 @@ friend. how old is she now? she'll be four in february. ooh so when would she go to school? -next september i would think +next september i would think ooooh! could of been yeah. -might take her september i don't know. +might take her september i don't know. well they will do, cos they do here don't they? -cos she's doing mornings at nursery now nine till half past eleven. +cos she's doing mornings at nursery now nine till half past eleven. and does she like it? loves it, yeah! yeah she's that type of little girl, ain't she? yeah. she's a, sort of outgoing isn't she? -well i said it'll soon be christmas she said yes not quite four weeks she said. +well i said it'll soon be christmas she said yes not quite four weeks she said. ha! i what she want for christmas, did she say? @@ -72149,64 +72087,64 @@ well julie went and got it the other day that's why fetched her out, to get thei oh. so dad collected her out of nursery and then julie picked her up when jack come out of school. so what does jack want? -well i want a train set and i think one of . +well i want a train set and i think one of . oh! and they want walkie talkie things oh yeah jonathan used t out of them. yeah. -she wants this doll, well julie got it yesterday and said i phoned up, she said you've gotta listen to this she said i've just put a battery in when you want to hear it cry . +she wants this doll, well julie got it yesterday and said i phoned up, she said you've gotta listen to this she said i've just put a battery in when you want to hear it cry . does it? the only way you can stop it is putting a dummy in it's mouth! and oh she'll like that then won't it? so -jonathan wants this erm this lego set that's got well i have got it actually and it's a big lorry +jonathan wants this erm this lego set that's got well i have got it actually and it's a big lorry yeah. with a helicopter and all that on the all on oh! -the back i says -so she's colouring yesterday she kept have you got a handkerchief? +the back i says +so she's colouring yesterday she kept have you got a handkerchief? in my pocket she said, in a minute! is she still as blonde as ever? -yes yeah ever so blonde. +yes yeah ever so blonde. yeah. -that kept it kept getting in her eyes, i said i'll fetch it over and brought it back, put them slides in face no she said, shaun'll do it! -oh i was all you know +that kept it kept getting in her eyes, i said i'll fetch it over and brought it back, put them slides in face no she said, shaun'll do it! +oh i was all you know does he make a lot of fuss of her then? -well not ever such a lot and then +well not ever such a lot and then she just took to him. -and then she said i'll go to the toilet she says i can go by myself she says! +and then she said i'll go to the toilet she says i can go by myself she says! you're not coming in! so i had to stand outside the door oh. -good job the bolt well the bolts up +good job the bolt well the bolts up yeah. -tight, always has done +tight, always has done well that's good. -you know and then she come out, i said i'll tuck you no she said, shaun will! +you know and then she come out, i said i'll tuck you no she said, shaun will! ah ho! so i thought -so shaun's well in favour so he could look after her, i think she'd stay with him. -oh, some of the older ones down the infant end again jonathan went last week so i said he +so shaun's well in favour so he could look after her, i think she'd stay with him. +oh, some of the older ones down the infant end again jonathan went last week so i said he oh what a common little cow! oh no! i thought he weren't gonna bring them sue? -he weren't all over the sixth form i've not got a to live with! -so she said i dunno so i said is it awkward to talk? -she said yeah i said alright then so whether they'd got someone there then i don't know. +he weren't all over the sixth form i've not got a to live with! +so she said i dunno so i said is it awkward to talk? +she said yeah i said alright then so whether they'd got someone there then i don't know. you don't know do you? margaret's on this tape this time. yeah? -ooh i don't how old margaret is fifty two i think. -ooh bloody hell! +ooh i don't how old margaret is fifty two i think. +ooh bloody hell! what? nice little bump there. where? oh yeah ! it seemed quiet in school today, didn't seem so many children, is there? yeah. -i told you about mr wife didn't i? +i told you about mr wife didn't i? yeah. very poorly! yeah. @@ -72214,11 +72152,11 @@ very poorly! that's a shame really innit? yeah. ladies, l a d i e s innit? -mm rurgh! +mm rurgh! arrived, a doubler i v e d i v e d. yeah. -that bloody erm er what do you call it? er personnel woman was there today. +that bloody erm er what do you call it? er personnel woman was there today. well i don't know whether nick went today cos i see his car. i thought he said he'd gotta go somewhere? oh what a shame! @@ -72231,7 +72169,7 @@ am or pm or is that? am. well he'll perhaps get an interview fairly quick won't he, if they want people? ooh i don't know. -cor hey you, we're swearing a lot on that was they doing that for my benefit do you think? +cor hey you, we're swearing a lot on that was they doing that for my benefit do you think? no, they always swear like that! ah you never heard nothing have you! cor blimey i wouldn't want to be there! @@ -72244,28 +72182,28 @@ cor i wouldn't like working with that lot then! mm. men tend to talk like that don't they? they didn't . -no well that wasn't a office in the office. +no well that wasn't a office in the office. do you go in there then? -i can stay in there they was sitting on the bleeding ! +i can stay in there they was sitting on the bleeding ! so was sally. -cos that australian said er get many more ruddy red ants in here he said, we'll need to start chipping in for the coffee! -i said and if when he come in he goes i suppose, they don't want to stay in do they? +cos that australian said er get many more ruddy red ants in here he said, we'll need to start chipping in for the coffee! +i said and if when he come in he goes i suppose, they don't want to stay in do they? well blow me! so he said er well you were right in checking it, cos you sold her escort didn't you? -well yeah but i mean i shall have +well yeah but i mean i shall have well you'll have to tell him, you've done it. -well i ain't done it yet, i've only erm +well i ain't done it yet, i've only erm why can't they do anything till february? -well no i'll tell you later june. -oh alright then er +well no i'll tell you later june. +oh alright then er er you know we're going to your mum's tonight? yes. are we? -and you know what i wanted, some fairly liquid or they've gotta go up and get it. +and you know what i wanted, some fairly liquid or they've gotta go up and get it. yeah. -oh we can go up to that fina garage i should think they have it. +oh we can go up to that fina garage i should think they have it. and show dad what i bought you and him. right geoff. have a look. @@ -72279,30 +72217,30 @@ and i bought that, that was twenty five yeah. that, was twenty, one pound what is it? -fifty five it's a laser box the dragons light up in different colours, look see there's nothing +fifty five it's a laser box the dragons light up in different colours, look see there's nothing oy ey yeah. -inside it and then for you and mum i bought a little something, it was one pound forty. +inside it and then for you and mum i bought a little something, it was one pound forty. oh, a duck. yes. mm. -ah i bought that +ah i bought that where was that from then? fitch william museum. oh. -all of that was -so look +all of that was +so look i know it's really i put them yeah. with my other little ducks. -yeah erm ernie's quite a nice old boy. +yeah erm ernie's quite a nice old boy. he was very pleasant on the phone, very pleasant. yeah. well we were talking about mating. mm. oh. erm -cor it was ever so good at that museum cor it was ever so tall though! +cor it was ever so good at that museum cor it was ever so tall though! they got them wash house! yeah cos you know the wheat house has got five big poles @@ -72311,59 +72249,59 @@ well so has this! yeah i know what you mean. with a load to spare! yeah. -right, and you go inside, it's got two floors each about floors about as tall as our house! +right, and you go inside, it's got two floors each about floors about as tall as our house! you yeah. i know. not all about that, it was . one night . -they got a lot about egyptians though they got egyptians -they ain't got a mask or anything like tutenkhamen has, have they? -no there was only one real mask. -oh well that's i've seen jimmy. +they got a lot about egyptians though they got egyptians +they ain't got a mask or anything like tutenkhamen has, have they? +no there was only one real mask. +oh well that's i've seen jimmy. when do you see him? in the . what? -half past eleven just now literally just now and er and he basically he don't know about what he's on about. +half past eleven just now literally just now and er and he basically he don't know about what he's on about. oh no! -nope, he don't know erm what he's saying is +nope, he don't know erm what he's saying is a lovely little man weren't he? -that blokes that's erm dro been rigging it who he does the things for. +that blokes that's erm dro been rigging it who he does the things for. why? -well, because he said for obvious reasons, he said er i didn't want my name and address mentioned. +well, because he said for obvious reasons, he said er i didn't want my name and address mentioned. isn't mentioned in the papers. -now he's gonna wish we'd tell him so he said erm +now he's gonna wish we'd tell him so he said erm well what has he done with it then? -oh it was genuinely gone quite genuine, he said you now, he had a , that we know about but it had genuine +oh it was genuinely gone quite genuine, he said you now, he had a , that we know about but it had genuine cor , it didn't do that! -well there are you don't go near them. +well there are you don't go near them. well we'll have to get our own then won't we? -so he said choice because it was his property they contacted him but he said what he's done is though right there isn't anywhere near that amount! +so he said choice because it was his property they contacted him but he said what he's done is though right there isn't anywhere near that amount! he said we're talking about eighty or ninety we're short on twenty two. -we could we can, ah no no in terms of money he's talking about four or five thousand maximum. +we could we can, ah no no in terms of money he's talking about four or five thousand maximum. well -where did you get the twenty two from then? +where did you get the twenty two from then? cos he told me there's three hundred gone. well jimmy ought to tell her -well you know what he's trying to do, he's trying up the claim so when back, he's still gonna get the amount that he wants so he said t to jim something about, he isn't paying the insurance i said you're joking! -he said i've insured it he said but i ain't paying as well he said! +well you know what he's trying to do, he's trying up the claim so when back, he's still gonna get the amount that he wants so he said t to jim something about, he isn't paying the insurance i said you're joking! +he said i've insured it he said but i ain't paying as well he said! if you're getting all the money he said, you can pay the premium! -so erm they're sort of having a few words at the moment. +so erm they're sort of having a few words at the moment. yeah well that don't help with getting your money though does it? -no and what's happened is, he's been up the bank and er the thing has +no and what's happened is, he's been up the bank and er the thing has saved his money. -and the thingo's gobbled up his card as he said, well if it hasn't gobbled your card then no problem. +and the thingo's gobbled up his card as he said, well if it hasn't gobbled your card then no problem. if it has there's a problem. -we'll have to re-issue another one which could take sort of, you know, this time of year it's over a week so he said well it definitely has. +we'll have to re-issue another one which could take sort of, you know, this time of year it's over a week so he said well it definitely has. did he say, i'm desperate for my money! -yeah so he said well what do erm and he said the woman up there didn't really ask what had happened! +yeah so he said well what do erm and he said the woman up there didn't really ask what had happened! it was a t s. why did it gobble his card up then? -well because a t s had gone straight to the bailiff and the courts to freeze his account. +well because a t s had gone straight to the bailiff and the courts to freeze his account. ooh my god! -mm because his account was frozen as soon as he put his card in it took it in! +mm because his account was frozen as soon as he put his card in it took it in! oh! so he said, can i get a new card? could you have that done to you then? @@ -72371,30 +72309,30 @@ no. you couldn't have that done to you? oh sorry, i thought you said did i have it done. well no cos i ain't got one of them sort of cards have i? -his was like sort of a bank credit card but bank said he put the cheque card in and that was only a fifty quid thing anyway. +his was like sort of a bank credit card but bank said he put the cheque card in and that was only a fifty quid thing anyway. but he alright. -could draw it up to a a thousand pounds on that card i mean +could draw it up to a a thousand pounds on that card i mean and you said he's only just paid it, well that's what he said, if i'd known what i know now, he said i wouldn't of paid it! -he says i'd better go and check the money so he said erm but what he couldn't understand was they wrote to him and said that they haven't paid the cheques but they didn't say anything about freezing his account! +he says i'd better go and check the money so he said erm but what he couldn't understand was they wrote to him and said that they haven't paid the cheques but they didn't say anything about freezing his account! well they should by law, surely! -well dunno. -so he said erm i said to the woman i went to the court this morning so he said when you explain to me he said i've got money in my pockets cos i borrowed it from dad tha he said i owed sixty two pound so he said i said to the woman in the court how can i pay this the sixty two pounds when you've frozen my account? +well dunno. +so he said erm i said to the woman i went to the court this morning so he said when you explain to me he said i've got money in my pockets cos i borrowed it from dad tha he said i owed sixty two pound so he said i said to the woman in the court how can i pay this the sixty two pounds when you've frozen my account? she said, that's your problem! -he said well it isn't cos it's your problem so she said, no i'm sorry, she said, you know it's one of those things! +he said well it isn't cos it's your problem so she said, no i'm sorry, she said, you know it's one of those things! he said well actually i have got the money because i borrowed it. so he paid it? -well yeah but he said without this card he can't get no money, cos he's used what money he had to pay off the card. +well yeah but he said without this card he can't get no money, cos he's used what money he had to pay off the card. i don't feel like going up thingamy tonight do you? i do. no. but we ought to. oh! -well you're only going to grandma's. -going to grandma's, but mum was going up to b and q. -oh never heard of that. +well you're only going to grandma's. +going to grandma's, but mum was going up to b and q. +oh never heard of that. he thought you meant going to aunty hilda's. mm. mm. @@ -72405,42 +72343,42 @@ hey dad! doing it. well i can't wash up, i ain't got no fairy liquid. oh i see what you mean, yeah. -you know in the erm ooh the london museum? +you know in the erm ooh the london museum? yep. the ceiling's just cracked, the painting. well you just can't do nothing! -the ceiling's just painted innit? +the ceiling's just painted innit? yeah. -yeah well then this has got all glass domes it's got little patterns and they're three d and coming out! +yeah well then this has got all glass domes it's got little patterns and they're three d and coming out! mm. -and the best room is not the egyptian it's the erm and armour things +and the best room is not the egyptian it's the erm and armour things you loved that did you? -yeah the spear the blokes holding his other horse and it reaches right to the ceiling! +yeah the spear the blokes holding his other horse and it reaches right to the ceiling! cor! -about a bit taller than this house. -oh i used to like making things like that cos he makes things for the london museum. -what did? -mm he did. -ooh it's for ages! +about a bit taller than this house. +oh i used to like making things like that cos he makes things for the london museum. +what did? +mm he did. +ooh it's for ages! they ain't very big! no they had a van didn't they? people.. -yeah well he only used to make miniatures he makes them . +yeah well he only used to make miniatures he makes them . does he? -he did promise +he did promise well he'd bring some down . -talking of miniatures my god! +talking of miniatures my god! they gave old mate some stick this morning! -cos at peterborough football club beat beat liverpool last night. +cos at peterborough football club beat beat liverpool last night. oh i bet yeah. they did. got in the first division. did they? -and they went and put a poky little old football club in won this well of course they everybody! -he stuck hi and he get that wound up towards the end i felt sorry for the poor little soul! -e every person went past they go alright peterborough! +and they went and put a poky little old football club in won this well of course they everybody! +he stuck hi and he get that wound up towards the end i felt sorry for the poor little soul! +e every person went past they go alright peterborough! liverpool . is he a liverpool supporter then? mm. @@ -72454,11 +72392,11 @@ one nil. one nil! mm. ah!! -so er he sat there tea break +so er he sat there tea break ooh. -and you didn't mean to do it cliff meant to mess about and make out he's gonna knock his coat over like that +and you didn't mean to do it cliff meant to mess about and make out he's gonna knock his coat over like that and he did. -yeah, and it went all over the table! +yeah, and it went all over the table! well he jumped up, cor he went learing into him! cliff said, i'll buy you another one, no i don't want another one! don't wannit, no! @@ -72469,7 +72407,7 @@ oh why do they do that to him? i don't cos he said know. -it's like kevin innit? +it's like kevin innit? and mum always i suppose it is, that's like that. . @@ -72477,15 +72415,15 @@ but he yeah. they used to tease him when he first come. yeah. -cos when he was little in the infants he's ever so tiny weren't he? -but a don't matter how big they are +cos when he was little in the infants he's ever so tiny weren't he? +but a don't matter how big they are he has a go at them. oh he does! terrible! what if they were small like him? well he'd kill them . he's really nice jonathan. -yeah, yeah i mean cos ivan says to me, he says, he makes me laugh he said, cos he don't back off does he? +yeah, yeah i mean cos ivan says to me, he says, he makes me laugh he said, cos he don't back off does he? i said no he don't. ooh are there any strawberries in that? that is strawberry. @@ -72495,7 +72433,7 @@ yeah. mind cos it's all down it's strawberry syrup. ooh it's nice! -strawberries in syrup dad would like strawberries. +strawberries in syrup dad would like strawberries. yeah. you ever tried a little bit of that? i don't like it. @@ -72503,25 +72441,25 @@ you'd like this one. no. gosh , you know it tastes crea , don't taste like yoghurt. no. -it like +it like why? go on try a tiny bit out the corner. no, no i don't go -like no +like no no dad don't want it it might make him feel sick. well when you finish your tea, just have a tiny bit. -no i really don't want to mate, i really don't want to you enjoy it. +no i really don't want to mate, i really don't want to you enjoy it. cor look at that one! -dad was gonna ring you up at eight o'clock before you went to school and say +dad was gonna ring you up at eight o'clock before you went to school and say what for? have a nice day and yeah. someone was on the phone. ahh! -yeah i sorted out all my ten p ready to go and they were there. +yeah i sorted out all my ten p ready to go and they were there. ahh! ooh and that girl who left, what was supposed to go oh i didn't leave till ten past, did i? @@ -72530,23 +72468,23 @@ no. she come in today. oh! why's that? -come into work i think it's assumed she'd left but she didn't leave, she di she had enough of it so she had a couple of days off come in this morning and er i said to steven, no idea what the situation was. +come into work i think it's assumed she'd left but she didn't leave, she di she had enough of it so she had a couple of days off come in this morning and er i said to steven, no idea what the situation was. oh! -he said yo it's terrible in here he said, it really is, he said i've never known such catty in all my life! +he said yo it's terrible in here he said, it really is, he said i've never known such catty in all my life! what is catty then? -well right old bitches they are! +well right old bitches they are! well they come from the right area, don't they? yeah. let's face it. that's right. you can't get any worse than that can you? -no cos whenever we go in there they're always moaning if cliff starts singing or something. +no cos whenever we go in there they're always moaning if cliff starts singing or something. no! -oh they go if he starts singing! +oh they go if he starts singing! why! -cos singing? -so he dropped a metal pallet on purpose and course, it makes a hell of a row! -yeah well i would of thought it'd been nice, been nice to have +cos singing? +so he dropped a metal pallet on purpose and course, it makes a hell of a row! +yeah well i would of thought it'd been nice, been nice to have well somebody happy around instead of miserable. yeah but he, he is rather loud. @@ -72560,46 +72498,46 @@ i ha i had sort of few, few words with him this morning. with who? cliff, cliff . why? -cos of that come in front again. +cos of that come in front again. we do. -i never said nothing mm cos +i never said nothing mm cos why aren't you drinking that? yeah when i've had this. -i never said anything then he er i could see he'd gone cos he just stood there for about ten minutes like th and everybody else was working, he just stood there like this for about ten minutes by the rack see him doing nothing i never said nothing he come charging through with a rack and knocked all the pallet over what they just stacked up with fifty boxes on so we had to make that right and he stacked a load of l t m boxes which are temperamental anyway and he hadn't pulled the wrap tight so as soon the bloke lift them up with the forklift, they fell all over! +i never said anything then he er i could see he'd gone cos he just stood there for about ten minutes like th and everybody else was working, he just stood there like this for about ten minutes by the rack see him doing nothing i never said nothing he come charging through with a rack and knocked all the pallet over what they just stacked up with fifty boxes on so we had to make that right and he stacked a load of l t m boxes which are temperamental anyway and he hadn't pulled the wrap tight so as soon the bloke lift them up with the forklift, they fell all over! they fell over. ooh christ! -and then i'd i'd had enough and then he started messing about and he started pushing the boxes down through my strapper then, course that messed the strapper up! +and then i'd i'd had enough and then he started messing about and he started pushing the boxes down through my strapper then, course that messed the strapper up! so i did it? i was doing the lift. oh! he said what's the matter? -i said well what you do in your private life it's up to you if you want to get drunk and you want to spend money then that's fine but once you step over that clock tower i said and you start interfering with my work it's a different thing, i said well i've and i've just said nothing because although you ain't worked right, at least you've sort of you've work in this factory sort of in the morning, you've got over it but +i said well what you do in your private life it's up to you if you want to get drunk and you want to spend money then that's fine but once you step over that clock tower i said and you start interfering with my work it's a different thing, i said well i've and i've just said nothing because although you ain't worked right, at least you've sort of you've work in this factory sort of in the morning, you've got over it but and then yeah . -there's been disaster tonight ain't gonna put up with it! +there's been disaster tonight ain't gonna put up with it! so what he say? didn't say anything. -i said you know, i think you've gotta sort yourself out lee and everybody went sort of quiet but paul said i've never had a rollocking! -i said well in all fairness paul, you ain't actually bloody got , i said i don't do it for the fun of it i said and i don't like doing it but i see, he just sort of -well that's silly comment can't be doing him any good! -i said well the thing is discipline. +i said you know, i think you've gotta sort yourself out lee and everybody went sort of quiet but paul said i've never had a rollocking! +i said well in all fairness paul, you ain't actually bloody got , i said i don't do it for the fun of it i said and i don't like doing it but i see, he just sort of +well that's silly comment can't be doing him any good! +i said well the thing is discipline. if grandma went if the transport -into the she'd sherry each. +into the she'd sherry each. cor! -i said if the transport get that load of l t m thrown back robin is gonna get it right in the neck! -and if robin gets it in the neck i shall get it in the neck and i shall be getting it in the neck because of you! +i said if the transport get that load of l t m thrown back robin is gonna get it right in the neck! +and if robin gets it in the neck i shall get it in the neck and i shall be getting it in the neck because of you! so i said i think well then what did he say? i said i can assure mate, i said i shall make sure there's hell to pay! -i said but i shall be wrong for not saying anything about you coming to work drunk. +i said but i shall be wrong for not saying anything about you coming to work drunk. so i said i'll leave you to think about that. -well he must of had that amount he must be contin , he must have alcohol in the body continuously. -of course he has he was drinking saturday afternoon to saturday night, sunday afternoon and the sunday night not monday night but again last night. +well he must of had that amount he must be contin , he must have alcohol in the body continuously. +of course he has he was drinking saturday afternoon to saturday night, sunday afternoon and the sunday night not monday night but again last night. so he never gets over it does he? -and he went to bed half past two. +and he went to bed half past two. and got up at four. before then i should think, quarter to four. i should think he looked like nothing on earth did he? @@ -72607,61 +72545,61 @@ yeah. well he's gonna kill his self isn't he? that's right. anyway he's just rotting his bowel, he'll be rotting his liver next! -yeah i said to him cliff, i think it's tragic mate! -i said that's none of my business, nothing to do with me but i said i should think it's a tragic waste for you and i say, it wastes your money but that's entirely down to you. +yeah i said to him cliff, i think it's tragic mate! +i said that's none of my business, nothing to do with me but i said i should think it's a tragic waste for you and i say, it wastes your money but that's entirely down to you. and what did he say? nothing. he didn't say a word, no. well it is a shame innit? -mm i mean, you know when he gave up the drink +mm i mean, you know when he gave up the drink he was a different man. he was a different bloke, yeah. mm. -and the trouble is you see they all make laugh of it old cliff, old cliff, old cliff! +and the trouble is you see they all make laugh of it old cliff, old cliff, old cliff! and that makes him worse, really. -yeah well i said to him, what you don't realise is cliff they laugh at you to your face +yeah well i said to him, what you don't realise is cliff they laugh at you to your face but they talk at the behind your back! -end of the day when you do something wrong they're the first to nip in that office and say what you've done wrong and why you've done it wrong. +end of the day when you do something wrong they're the first to nip in that office and say what you've done wrong and why you've done it wrong. yeah,. but i think i shall have a quiet word with him tomorrow morning when i get to work. gonna see him? yeah. and say what? -well, you know i just can't sort of let it go on. +well, you know i just can't sort of let it go on. well he perhaps won't do it any more now you've told him. as soon he gets his mouth round a guinness bottle mate, that's it!. well for heaven's sake, how many does he have? -well it's roughly about five pound and, one pound and i thought he said one pound forty a pint. +well it's roughly about five pound and, one pound and i thought he said one pound forty a pint. how many bottles does he have? -well he got through fifty quid on saturday and sunday so that's forty pints innit? -that's twenty pints each day -what and forty pints in a night ! -no forty pints in two like saturday afternoon and saturday night, sunday afternoon and sunday night, he got through forty pints or perhaps just under forty pints but that's it. +well he got through fifty quid on saturday and sunday so that's forty pints innit? +that's twenty pints each day +what and forty pints in a night ! +no forty pints in two like saturday afternoon and saturday night, sunday afternoon and sunday night, he got through forty pints or perhaps just under forty pints but that's it. well is he an alcoholic? -well he's always been able to drink like that he's . +well he's always been able to drink like that he's . well he's happy enough behind all this isn't he? -well well i dunno. +well well i dunno. well i'm, i must admit i don't know. -but i was the trouble +but i was the trouble what? is he's rotting his stomach isn't he? -yeah i mean, and the trouble is what n annoys me more than anything is the fact that he's good worker i me even when he's drunk, alright he don't work at full capacity but he does sort of almost as much as what they do and when he's +yeah i mean, and the trouble is what n annoys me more than anything is the fact that he's good worker i me even when he's drunk, alright he don't work at full capacity but he does sort of almost as much as what they do and when he's yeah. -sober he can do more than they do i mean i that ain't the sort bloke you wanna lose, and i'm, when he balls and shouts at them well he gets on your nerves really but at the end of the day i'll you know, i'll put up with it. +sober he can do more than they do i mean i that ain't the sort bloke you wanna lose, and i'm, when he balls and shouts at them well he gets on your nerves really but at the end of the day i'll you know, i'll put up with it. you can put up with that, good god! -yeah because he's a, he's a bloody good worker but and when he's like cor! -and the other morning disgrace! -the funny thing is, like there's a beer smell isn't there? +yeah because he's a, he's a bloody good worker but and when he's like cor! +and the other morning disgrace! +the funny thing is, like there's a beer smell isn't there? yeah. -but he has got the sort of acidy sort of alcohol smell on his breath just like you'd been on spirits all night or whatever, any sort of you know, wine and it's not a beer sort of smell. -but i mean he's i mean ivan said to me, phworgh, he said when cliff's breathing over you! +but he has got the sort of acidy sort of alcohol smell on his breath just like you'd been on spirits all night or whatever, any sort of you know, wine and it's not a beer sort of smell. +but i mean he's i mean ivan said to me, phworgh, he said when cliff's breathing over you! i said i know i said, just like neat alcohol innit? god he said! -well i should think that's acidity in his stomach innit? -definitely and he'll say i've got this pain, i've got this pain, i should think you have cliff! +well i should think that's acidity in his stomach innit? +definitely and he'll say i've got this pain, i've got this pain, i should think you have cliff! oh it's not that, no it's not. where's he get the pain? in his side. @@ -72670,79 +72608,79 @@ i think he's rotting his liver, that's the feeling. liver, yeah , exactly. but you see he's that thick . -you can't tell him nothing he would say oh no no no, beer's no problem, beer's no problem no it's not that experience, not that experience, i said well you wanna smell yourself cliff! +you can't tell him nothing he would say oh no no no, beer's no problem, beer's no problem no it's not that experience, not that experience, i said well you wanna smell yourself cliff! cor god! -well i still alcohol. +well i still alcohol. it does. -yeah alcohol -and your guess is that he said er bought something +yeah alcohol +and your guess is that he said er bought something guinness is a heavy drink! yeah he's that's surprising he don't have such a bad head! -no he said er -ah cor! -well fancy being a like that all that time it's bad enough when you've been out on a binge and you get that headache then. -chris ivan said to me, he said cliff wanted us to go and have a drink he said when we've finished work on a friday he said last night, i tell you, i said i said no, no i didn't! +no he said er +ah cor! +well fancy being a like that all that time it's bad enough when you've been out on a binge and you get that headache then. +chris ivan said to me, he said cliff wanted us to go and have a drink he said when we've finished work on a friday he said last night, i tell you, i said i said no, no i didn't! well how are you all gonna get home? oh yeah he don't mean that he had a lot of drink, just have a drink and come home. i said well i hope you enjoy . well it isn't worth it, you can't afford to drink and drive can you? i know. mel's got her lights up, did you see them? -yeah well yeah. -mm yeah talking about that now he's out the way basically what he was gonna say was, as simple as this +yeah well yeah. +mm yeah talking about that now he's out the way basically what he was gonna say was, as simple as this . well it don't matter does it? oh alright then. -yeah no he was just saying that head office they'll dictate to them like anybody else so he said i've got to have erm the mortgage up to date for a start before i can consider anything. +yeah no he was just saying that head office they'll dictate to them like anybody else so he said i've got to have erm the mortgage up to date for a start before i can consider anything. i thought you'd done that, you was gonna do that? -yeah but i haven't that's what he saying, but he said what i wouldn't do is ju , don't just say right phrum there's +yeah but i haven't that's what he saying, but he said what i wouldn't do is ju , don't just say right phrum there's what do you mean? -there's a thousand pound he said, you know, if you can make it right sort of over the next month but he said basically i cannot do anything until erm the end of february, he said you come in the end of february he said and then we can start to sort it out, he said i can't do anything for you until then. +there's a thousand pound he said, you know, if you can make it right sort of over the next month but he said basically i cannot do anything until erm the end of february, he said you come in the end of february he said and then we can start to sort it out, he said i can't do anything for you until then. did you tell him that? who? malcolm. -no no point in me well anyway when she +no no point in me well anyway when she she'll know. -mm so he said erm, that's the situation he said but you can forget your business he said, as far as i'm concerned he said, you've lost for two years so he said consequently he said you're gonna lose this year are you? +mm so he said erm, that's the situation he said but you can forget your business he said, as far as i'm concerned he said, you've lost for two years so he said consequently he said you're gonna lose this year are you? i said well i wouldn't be surprised. -so he said well all i can say is he said you wanna just forget that erm +so he said well all i can say is he said you wanna just forget that erm and just do it on the money you owe on the house. -yeah exactly don't get involved at all. -so he said well how do you feel about your business? -so i said well you know, i can't just wind it up over the next six months, i said er what i wanna do i said is erm i gotta carry it on for that transit for that orion till i finished anyway so it's gotta go another year so i said well what i'm feeling about doing i said is er just sort of keeping a finger in the pie i said, he said, if i'd said tomorrow, if i had finished the whole the tomorrow i've gotta buy a car i can buy it finance so i'm gonna get no tax relief on the h p i get no depreciation no nothing like that i said so at least if i still self employed i can if i have the sort of two or three vehicles or whatever three, four, five vehicles but i said at least i can have some erm and i can then sort of they would be more utilised, where as i said at the moment we got more vehicles than we really need to keep full capacity so he said yeah, yeah fair enough then. -i said well that's what is, i said if you look at it the depreciation is so heavy compared with the income, and i said and the insurance as well but i said hopefully cos we haven't had any of er any claims at all this year you know, i said i know but all of the insurances of gone up, but i said i'm hoping that we can sort of get the insurance down if possible so he said, yeah fair enough then. -he said well from my point of view anyway at least he said just disregard that completely he said and we will do it on what you earnt, so he said all i can is erm just put in as many hours as you can to get your wages up on that side erm and then by the time we look at that he said, the end of february obviously you'll have december, january and february which will be good months there, i said yeah so he said well then you know erm a hundred pound here and a hundred pound here he said, it all helps to keep the figure up for you so he s +yeah exactly don't get involved at all. +so he said well how do you feel about your business? +so i said well you know, i can't just wind it up over the next six months, i said er what i wanna do i said is erm i gotta carry it on for that transit for that orion till i finished anyway so it's gotta go another year so i said well what i'm feeling about doing i said is er just sort of keeping a finger in the pie i said, he said, if i'd said tomorrow, if i had finished the whole the tomorrow i've gotta buy a car i can buy it finance so i'm gonna get no tax relief on the h p i get no depreciation no nothing like that i said so at least if i still self employed i can if i have the sort of two or three vehicles or whatever three, four, five vehicles but i said at least i can have some erm and i can then sort of they would be more utilised, where as i said at the moment we got more vehicles than we really need to keep full capacity so he said yeah, yeah fair enough then. +i said well that's what is, i said if you look at it the depreciation is so heavy compared with the income, and i said and the insurance as well but i said hopefully cos we haven't had any of er any claims at all this year you know, i said i know but all of the insurances of gone up, but i said i'm hoping that we can sort of get the insurance down if possible so he said, yeah fair enough then. +he said well from my point of view anyway at least he said just disregard that completely he said and we will do it on what you earnt, so he said all i can is erm just put in as many hours as you can to get your wages up on that side erm and then by the time we look at that he said, the end of february obviously you'll have december, january and february which will be good months there, i said yeah so he said well then you know erm a hundred pound here and a hundred pound here he said, it all helps to keep the figure up for you so he s yeah but that don't help us with malcolm does it? no, but i mean all i can say is basically erm give him as much as yo , we can, when we can. yeah. and can you do -and he said he's quite prepared to do it, he said, there wouldn't be no problem but he said i cannot do it, he said they are +and he said he's quite prepared to do it, he said, there wouldn't be no problem but he said i cannot do it, he said they are what, is he gonna lend, what's he gonna lend you then? -about thirty three thousand but you see what he said is, head office make the rule and he said and they're not -no there's no problem that we can +about thirty three thousand but you see what he said is, head office make the rule and he said and they're not +no there's no problem that we can no. have it? that's right, he said what but you can't have it till february. -yeah because he said as soon as they see arrears he said they insist that it's paid up and they insist that you have like three months pay them no problem he said +yeah because he said as soon as they see arrears he said they insist that it's paid up and they insist that you have like three months pay them no problem he said yeah. and then there's no problem. i said no, but he's well we can manage that probably yeah. couldn't we? -but he's, he give me a a print out, he said well here's your print out look so he said as soon as -but you'll have to ring malcolm and tell him geoff because he'll be on the phone to miriam. -yeah but she'll know she'll know that in fact he'll be seeing her. +but he's, he give me a a print out, he said well here's your print out look so he said as soon as +but you'll have to ring malcolm and tell him geoff because he'll be on the phone to miriam. +yeah but she'll know she'll know that in fact he'll be seeing her. was he alright? malcolm or -yeah he just said you did say i can have some more money, i said well yeah. -ah we ain't but you must pay your mother too, geoff! -yeah yeah. +yeah he just said you did say i can have some more money, i said well yeah. +ah we ain't but you must pay your mother too, geoff! +yeah yeah. and then there's andy as well. -yeah well what i think i'll do +yeah well what i think i'll do well why don't you pu yo well did you use that other thousand? what? @@ -72750,36 +72688,36 @@ or is that still in the bank? or have we used it all now? what you on about now? hang on,yo your losing me! -well you do dad's two you give to him +well you do dad's two you give to him i give him two and a half. -yeah, well then you had that rest well there should -be quite a bit in that account because there was only one six that went through for this insurance and there hasn't been a lot more going through this month. -no -so you got erm quite a bit. -ah but it'll be something few days, you see from cars find out what i've still got on there yeah let me just see. +yeah, well then you had that rest well there should +be quite a bit in that account because there was only one six that went through for this insurance and there hasn't been a lot more going through this month. +no +so you got erm quite a bit. +ah but it'll be something few days, you see from cars find out what i've still got on there yeah let me just see. yeah well come on then cos i want to get to mum's cos i'll do that washing up when i come back shan't i? oh alright then. -well then tha i hope you should help erm this weekend +well then tha i hope you should help erm this weekend that's why i sa that's why i told them the weekend i thought at least i'll have something shan't i? -ooh for goodness sake ca can't you write a cheque out for that david! +ooh for goodness sake ca can't you write a cheque out for that david! yeah. and that other one's got to be paid within seven days so we yeah. well, how long has go got, till next week? yeah. oh. -well we'll send them altogether the weekend hang on, bung it in. +well we'll send them altogether the weekend hang on, bung it in. alright then. alright. you ain't drunk your coffee, do you wannit? -no i don't, put it away we've got +no i don't, put it away we've got and i'll wash up when i come back. -i haven't anyway. +i haven't anyway. well you'll have help me when i come back i thought. david.. that'll do. i won't get a fairy liquid, your mother might have one. -erm twenty there fifty two hundred ten +erm twenty there fifty two hundred ten i ain't gonna bother to count it twenty cos does the mortgage come out of that sixty grand @@ -72788,64 +72726,64 @@ dunnit? twenty no, what i'm gonna say to you about this about what? -three twenty twenty five +three twenty twenty five have you put him in? no, that's what i said, i di , she said to me -get and you lot never told me that renault went out last night! +get and you lot never told me that renault went out last night! nobody told me about that! that's a bloody good job i didn't have a booking for it. -well was it? -yeah but i i'd rather know, cos i,don't know where i am! -erm see mrs can have +well was it? +yeah but i i'd rather know, cos i,don't know where i am! +erm see mrs can have the white for fifteen. . let me cross her out and put fifteen in there. -so, put how much money how much is she paying then? +so, put how much money how much is she paying then? thirty five, that's there. -that'll be enough then yep cos that's the same amount of money. +that'll be enough then yep cos that's the same amount of money. right? yep. -then the 's want you to fill the bus up with petrol. +then the 's want you to fill the bus up with petrol. do they? they're a hundred and seventy miles. yeah. -well i'm sure that's why i've put that there look, that's the same colour pen no one else is got anything so it is them. -yeah well why ain't why is bringing that back then? -erm, i think she's bringing that back erm early hours of the morning, at +well i'm sure that's why i've put that there look, that's the same colour pen no one else is got anything so it is them. +yeah well why ain't why is bringing that back then? +erm, i think she's bringing that back erm early hours of the morning, at yeah. twelve, about twelve o'clock. yeah, fair enough then. -so, but what i'm saying is you've got a twelve here and oh well that wouldn't make no difference cos she'll have that back, that'll be ready for them na yeah well then we got a twelve there as well! -yeah well that's what i was gonna say, so forget about the other blue ones they can have that. +so, but what i'm saying is you've got a twelve here and oh well that wouldn't make no difference cos she'll have that back, that'll be ready for them na yeah well then we got a twelve there as well! +yeah well that's what i was gonna say, so forget about the other blue ones they can have that. that's what, that's what i was trying to tell you. yeah. -so now he's gonna have the twelve minibus erm what do you call him? +so now he's gonna have the twelve minibus erm what do you call him? darren ? darren yeah. -i'll put darren well that is clean cos i cleaned that up. -well we got a lot going on this haven't we? +i'll put darren well that is clean cos i cleaned that up. +well we got a lot going on this haven't we? mm. and i've got to try and get to work, get home, get my jobs done and get these cleaned as well i don't know how i'm bloody gonna do it all! no. i'm hoping your not gonna be home too late. -well i think i will be june i don't know, i mean that's been quarter to six these last two nights. -well see carole and them are bringing that back tonight at her erm his son is gonna come back and then +well i think i will be june i don't know, i mean that's been quarter to six these last two nights. +well see carole and them are bringing that back tonight at her erm his son is gonna come back and then yeah. they're gonna leave that here that's it. so if i get up there and do it early in the morning, well it don't get light till half seven no. -well i could do that first i think before i do anything else so that'll mean i've got to do so that if the long is clean +well i could do that first i think before i do anything else so that'll mean i've got to do so that if the long is clean no. is it filthy then? ha ! oh get off, sorry darling. -yeah well that's gotta be cleaned as well sometime, for him nine o'clock that morning, well i can't get all that done, by myself! +yeah well that's gotta be cleaned as well sometime, for him nine o'clock that morning, well i can't get all that done, by myself! maybe . -well i shall have to lend that's all. -well that erm well it all -depends what time i'm back from you see i, i wanna try and get them hours in tomorrow +well i shall have to lend that's all. +well that erm well it all +depends what time i'm back from you see i, i wanna try and get them hours in tomorrow well yes. so then that means me fri , i like to leave friday yeah. @@ -72853,33 +72791,33 @@ free. yeah. so the sierra i can do ready for you to take to kevin on fri friday night is it? yeah i'm delivering it over there friday night. -yeah well that isn't a prob well well perhaps that'll be better if i had er long wheel base down here and do that first, that goes out first? +yeah well that isn't a prob well well perhaps that'll be better if i had er long wheel base down here and do that first, that goes out first? yeah. -but how can i i can't get it down here you see, not unless you go and dropped it off like +but how can i i can't get it down here you see, not unless you go and dropped it off like bring it down and . -yeah well now that bell gone it's out on +yeah well now that bell gone it's out on s saturday night to sunday. so you gotta tax that. yeah. so get your papers ready and everything tonight yeah. and we'll give it to your mum tonight. -yeah oh yeah. +yeah oh yeah. so well won't do it till friday anyway will we? oh no, well don't worry then. -so and the estate i've gotta clean up. +so and the estate i've gotta clean up. now did jimmy have that, today? yes, he bought it, that's what i say he brought it back when i was down there. oh! where's the little slip of paper i don't know what you done with it, i never see it. so what's today? -wednesday erm +wednesday erm what? . oh well you can write it on again can't you? -do it when you come home i'm just saying a bit +do it when you come home i'm just saying a bit no , i wanna do it now. did you find that other bit of paper? no . @@ -72887,7 +72825,7 @@ ooh christ! well that's there somewhere geoff, cos i wouldn't throw nothing away, you know i don't. ah! oh! -oh i've got the +oh i've got the is that it? yes. oh bugger me, that was inside @@ -72895,16 +72833,16 @@ yeah. that book! that's it. give us that here! -and i wanna don't go and lose it! +and i wanna don't go and lose it! that's definitely i put this is where i put my no. stuff i want yeah. to keep! -i don't care where you put it love, just don't and lose it. +i don't care where you put it love, just don't and lose it. in there. -here jonathan, here's your mat, now +here jonathan, here's your mat, now can i have the pen there please? and i must do my cubs this weekend, both of them. right, so we're talking @@ -72916,8 +72854,8 @@ yep, well i want to get going jonathan cos i've er yeah. do your flies up. then -go and get your shoes on jacket on. -long wheel base tuesday +go and get your shoes on jacket on. +long wheel base tuesday cos i gotta wash up when i come back thursday and sandwiches also. @@ -72925,9 +72863,9 @@ friday go on. a hundred and twenty five. come on love,. -sierra thirty -and we need -friday fifty four. +sierra thirty +and we need +friday fifty four. i'll turn this off now shall i? what have we go to get? fairy liquid. @@ -72937,11 +72875,11 @@ we thought we didn't know what to buy you and i know you like chocolates and i k i've got another bottle. saves on hankies don't it! what? -cos there's reg reg is having +cos there's reg reg is having they were what? the heart attack and -we got margaret one of things ! -there were plenty of germs +we got margaret one of things ! +there were plenty of germs what ? we've not, we've not been too good at one of them what death traps ! @@ -72949,19 +72887,19 @@ oh does granddad have one? oh no! seeing as it's your birthday, yeah that's right , happy birthday for tomorrow anyway. yeah that's -and there's all around +and there's all around you'll be at cup final on thursday. the world. yeah. let's hope you win. just as well i've been staying out the way . -i won't give it i shan't tell him ! +i won't give it i shan't tell him ! no they're doing that i'm coming home. -but a well i should think so, you don't know. +but a well i should think so, you don't know. something else well i was gonna change them but you might as well. -cos there the most +cos there the most ooh lovely i do like them walnut. grandma i what ? oh look he's a @@ -72971,28 +72909,28 @@ or there. thatcher. yeah. that's why all -i said and they already +i said and they already what's ? ! mending the cars and different signals. -it sounds like that they know as -yeah we got one using six -speak to, just speak to me i don't wanna be . +it sounds like that they know as +yeah we got one using six +speak to, just speak to me i don't wanna be . . yeah. oh no! well i said that's up . well i thought well if ah! -we come earlier we can go back earlier cos of geoff cos you know so i fetched him. +we come earlier we can go back earlier cos of geoff cos you know so i fetched him. oh . -i get to feel like anyway. +i get to feel like anyway. well i said i felt knackered when they left here! -it were only quarter past one and i finished at and i felt really +it were only quarter past one and i finished at and i felt really yeah. yeah. what about this one? -this one looks to be alright +this one looks to be alright yeah. ha ha ha! well i thought it was a little bit different myself. @@ -73000,7 +72938,7 @@ yeah. suppose that'll . i like rabbits as you know. cor! -look the has got that one, that one, that one works. +look the has got that one, that one, that one works. that's what susan bought him didn't she, for his birthday last time? he wears this one for school. he's not listening! @@ -73012,14 +72950,14 @@ course you have. and he bought, he bought me and geoff a lovely yeah. -little duck. +little duck. i said he are, give him the money to spend on his self! that's right. i didn't as , i did tell you you shouldn't of bought me anything! i know. really! that's brown ain't it? -yeah but if you put it in the dark it goes all starry. +yeah but if you put it in the dark it goes all starry. are you working tomorrow granddad? what? no. @@ -73031,43 +72969,43 @@ said could be yeah. a couple of days. is that alright mum? -no i'll be the best team we've had. +no i'll be the best team we've had. 's starts at four. i thought val said he was having three days holiday? -i don't think he'll before at now. +i don't think he'll before at now. well somebody said oh! . otherwise we well i don't mind. i'll go round there shall i? -see +see well that's what val told me. -so he said well that's you down but he said he wanted to cut them back. +so he said well that's you down but he said he wanted to cut them back. well he hasn't has he? -no well yeah it's up to him what he says. +no well yeah it's up to him what he says. i'll have that one. alright. -i said that's bo , that's bothered me about that bleeding , i like him a lot. -well . +i said that's bo , that's bothered me about that bleeding , i like him a lot. +well . who are they? -i never told you i just everything's going round in the room i just had and make the best of it. +i never told you i just everything's going round in the room i just had and make the best of it. blow him! -we don't want him grandma that's why he can't get +we don't want him grandma that's why he can't get a vehicle from anybody else cos i think he's messed that's right everybody up there! -i tell you i think he owe a lot of money. -but can you him? +i tell you i think he owe a lot of money. +but can you him? well we've got a tenner to go have we? -but i ain't had chance to say to you, but i was saying to cos when i called in and see you think about it he -he was desperate to get there desperate! +but i ain't had chance to say to you, but i was saying to cos when i called in and see you think about it he +he was desperate to get there desperate! absolutely yeah. desperate! now he's never ever offered to pay that fifty odd quid. not till today. -yes so and i reckon quite frankly cos he's living on that lay by up the end and i reckon he was hiding, do a runner or something or he ain't up to something no good! +yes so and i reckon quite frankly cos he's living on that lay by up the end and i reckon he was hiding, do a runner or something or he ain't up to something no good! well he weren't gonna have my vehicle. he's such a devious little tyke! yeah. @@ -73079,20 +73017,20 @@ for a couple of weeks rent. and he went out to pay,first place. yeah. that's how he was in the first place though. -so the young he was +so the young he was jonathan! he really had me ! why don't you sit on the pouffe and let grandma sit there. yeah i'm alright. there's a place there! -no i'm alright ! +no i'm alright ! shift up then! -can't see no i, i didn't i didn't probe him i said what about the money though? -well what a well i said you are a gentleman of the land well he said i haven't got a lot of money. +can't see no i, i didn't i didn't probe him i said what about the money though? +well what a well i said you are a gentleman of the land well he said i haven't got a lot of money. well i said how would ? -well well i said nor do i. +well well i said nor do i. i said we've had so much -aggro i said no money no cars!you'll get a car i said i know you will he said! +aggro i said no money no cars!you'll get a car i said i know you will he said! call the police in. oh well i ain't bothered! i'm afraid she was rude to us! @@ -73100,37 +73038,37 @@ and i said as well i said we put up a lot with him! i'll go to court. oh! -i said on what well he said it's gotta be well cos maggie said it's too late i said no -you can have it, he said that's i said yes +i said on what well he said it's gotta be well cos maggie said it's too late i said no +you can have it, he said that's i said yes yeah. on two wheels! that's right. -not on +not on so he won't! -i said if you're going to court neil and if that ain't paid, i said there's beth can manage they and they paid us out. +i said if you're going to court neil and if that ain't paid, i said there's beth can manage they and they paid us out. so what are you trying to say then? i said you're gonna have yo have gone to cornwall. oh no he's not! and put the miles on the clocks. that's ve , that's all very well -well you might as well save him his and if he has got the car he's gonna hammer it cos he don't +well you might as well save him his and if he has got the car he's gonna hammer it cos he don't course he does. at all. -yeah he'd have probably blown the bloody thing up! +yeah he'd have probably blown the bloody thing up! that . -well i rang you just in case you know i don't want yo how we need the money so i thought to myself cornwall, twenty eight? +well i rang you just in case you know i don't want yo how we need the money so i thought to myself cornwall, twenty eight? i thought well that ain't worth it! but i'd rang the number -i suppose it's on -you see, well i put the phone down. -yeah it is twenty eight when you think about it, time you get the van up there. +i suppose it's on +you see, well i put the phone down. +yeah it is twenty eight when you think about it, time you get the van up there. well no. . flipping thing! up and down you know that they they don't think of that though. -you could let they wouldn't let anyone put him in. +you could let they wouldn't let anyone put him in. they'll think that's all . they go to. bloody change that! @@ -73145,7 +73083,7 @@ he hadn't they got one! they wanted to ! -yeah he's got his tricks! +yeah he's got his tricks! he don't want to come down to me cos i shall send him off! i shall say i'm sorry! @@ -73154,9 +73092,9 @@ yes, so are you. i know. so she said. you wanna try a bit of roll? -she said +she said no not yet, i've only just had my tea! -granddad gran wants some sherry, do you want a glass? +granddad gran wants some sherry, do you want a glass? yes please. yeah. half'll do. @@ -73167,14 +73105,14 @@ ken's got a bit more to do then? yeah. i should think he'll be glad when that's done won't he? oh it's -they've put a on there's +they've put a on there's and the blinking machines been letting down so much! who's machine is it? you mean he's gotta pay for it? does he hire it? -well i, i don't know what sort of terms he's come to i suppose he told them why how much he'd got you see. +well i, i don't know what sort of terms he's come to i suppose he told them why how much he'd got you see. oh! -can't just have it so they charge you so much an acre you see and he used to have it. +can't just have it so they charge you so much an acre you see and he used to have it. oh so yo , when you've finished you just take it back sort of thing? yeah. oh i see. @@ -73185,57 +73123,57 @@ oh geoff, you've only just had your tea ! no i can't eat one. ooh i can't eat one yet. what's he doing? -there's some +there's some jonathan mind! we got held up don't open that one! -we we couldn't find out what's wrong with it. +we we couldn't find out what's wrong with it. let grandma open which one she wants! -the last time the chain come off come off, as i say, just come undone and it's +the last time the chain come off come off, as i say, just come undone and it's what's grandma done with her nest of tables? and she hadn't. . when the chain brakes she said oh blimey! -if it brakes down there's there's taking it up to top sprocket so it comes off you see. +if it brakes down there's there's taking it up to top sprocket so it comes off you see. yeah. then it don't quite work right then. yeah. -well it shouldn't it it did i but if you just went up to the top they got a pair of i should think about four or five lengths they had to take it off the sprocket and er course you see they -grandma +well it shouldn't it it did i but if you just went up to the top they got a pair of i should think about four or five lengths they had to take it off the sprocket and er course you see they +grandma let in front, then they've gone down! yeah. -and ken said no way can we do we gotta take take some off. +and ken said no way can we do we gotta take take some off. aha. mm. that's what i'd like. -and i was, i was there we put it under the , on the bar you see , we were changing, blocking up, blocking them in there and the that just would not go up! +and i was, i was there we put it under the , on the bar you see , we were changing, blocking up, blocking them in there and the that just would not go up! mm. -so what it was th ch ha the chain couldn't give up you see. +so what it was th ch ha the chain couldn't give up you see. oh. -cor isn't mr a weird looking ! +cor isn't mr a weird looking ! well the chain -will you +will you the bit takes it up to the oh! to the top -and went. +and went. oh ho oh oh! -top of the but it stops losing . +top of the but it stops losing . haba, haba, haba! -has to keep it coming out there. +has to keep it coming out there. what have you given me that for? -turn over just in case -you want some +turn over just in case +you want some had to put some time for give us a bit more light dad please? -i was amazed. -bet +i was amazed. +bet what have you done jonathan? let me take that off of there. -i tell him he won't forget will he? +i tell him he won't forget will he? who? -i won't cos +i won't cos no. i'm going out you see, so i've got to yes. @@ -73245,32 +73183,32 @@ well you got my glass jonathan! here you are. look . -this is your wife's birthday here. +this is your wife's birthday here. i know. oh boy! -i said i was looking i said where's grandma, i put that ne table there is that alright? +i said i was looking i said where's grandma, i put that ne table there is that alright? what table? yes course it is. well i thought what's grandma done with her nest of tables? so i was looking for, i didn't know where it was and i thought well -well when i you see i used to push the settee in pull it out i thought well i don't know i might as just as well leave it here. +well when i you see i used to push the settee in pull it out i thought well i don't know i might as just as well leave it here. i think it looks nice like . so do i. -i have it when des and doris is here you see. +i have it when des and doris is here you see. it's more homely. -yes so i +yes so i well on the phone you'd think he was business ex ec the way he talks! -well he used to be he owns the other factory now. +well he used to be he owns the other factory now. i know . what does he do now then? -well they, they just you know they they just have this erm craft sort of, they do stall and and they make stuff for the shop they had he had a couple of retail shops, he had a factory yeah i think he said he had fifty two people working for him. +well they, they just you know they they just have this erm craft sort of, they do stall and and they make stuff for the shop they had he had a couple of retail shops, he had a factory yeah i think he said he had fifty two people working for him. cor he isn't keen on this! cor i am. then he said he had some oh can i have it? bad debts or no. -something sort of, nearly finished him! +something sort of, nearly finished him! what do you say? we know how you feel! he always pays you though don't he geoff? @@ -73280,14 +73218,14 @@ oh this is . mind grandma, it's a bit strong. most he said, don't get done. in what one? -well er you know tony says oh we want this and we want that he shall have to employ somebody to do, do them so there's no , just get involved +well er you know tony says oh we want this and we want that he shall have to employ somebody to do, do them so there's no , just get involved cor! -with too much +with too much ooh ! yeah. we ought to had emma here now didn't we? yeah she likes a glass of sherry don't she? -we ought to had +we ought to had yeah. get them out together. oh! @@ -73299,51 +73237,51 @@ cor yeah! well you wanna go what you ? he's been going to bed too late! -oh, the night before me and we went to bed, had a lovely night and then last night we couldn't last. +oh, the night before me and we went to bed, had a lovely night and then last night we couldn't last. i don't know what i'd have done if we had a . what they call a . -yeah well what +yeah well what well jonathan couldn't get to sleep last night. cos i had a blocked nose. ah. he's got a did you? -bit of co well i said he's come in ain't he? +bit of co well i said he's come in ain't he? but that . yeah. but you see he don't feel the cold! -but +but but i made him put his coat on. yeah? didn't get them on. -that's ten +that's ten he yards. he drinks it too quick. yeah. well that don't hurt does it. and er -kevin +kevin why, a couple of sherries isn't gonna i . make or break you is it? -it's when the +it's when the they should help you to sleep really. why not? that's what i'm saying, i never seen ! can i have another one now? -see i never heard them i +see i never heard them i not yet! looking at. drink too much, cor! -but we painted it all +but we painted it all what, you mean you granddad. drink too much? can we have one of those things? -well, i don't one glass one alright, i go +well, i don't one glass one alright, i go . and fill it again! well that won't hurt you! @@ -73351,18 +73289,18 @@ right,granddad. couple of glasses of sherry! then i go i had two glass fulls -and that's -and mum had two glass fulls, but she didn't drink hers so i had four glass fulls. -my when it hit the side of the -ooh -well it hit the tractor +and that's +and mum had two glass fulls, but she didn't drink hers so i had four glass fulls. +my when it hit the side of the +ooh +well it hit the tractor mm. don't mind that . i always ooh! find sherry burns my stomach! tear in it and th holes in it. -here i feel it here. +here i feel it here. no i feel it here i do. but it er yeah when it goes down @@ -73371,18 +73309,18 @@ i had one yet, i'm gonna i weren't gonna have one yeah. cos i've only just had my tea -don't say +don't say but i will try a little one. and then wash her back we haven't long had tea! -shelves and +shelves and very nice. i'm gonna sit there st so er daddy went and fetched he he put the washing in the where is blackie? -goes in the wash and and put some +goes in the wash and and put some oi shut up! me and him you see. yeah. @@ -73391,28 +73329,28 @@ aren't you gonna let her in? the man said go and get her in. shall i go let her in? -so he i he, he just put them put the washer in and, and just take care of it. +so he i he, he just put them put the washer in and, and just take care of it. yeah. -i said i've ruined this tracksuit haven't i? +i said i've ruined this tracksuit haven't i? shall i go and get her in? -you'll have to +you'll have to erm before we have any help in! then he said yeah. -i said the funny part about it was we never had at home -so when you bring her out shut that door -that's the we wanna, we're gonna up +i said the funny part about it was we never had at home +so when you bring her out shut that door +that's the we wanna, we're gonna up i said town oh going up town and then -turn the off -was or not, +turn the off +was or not, what you mean? the kitchen door. yeah. -i think +i think june. it's alright now they've got at @@ -73423,51 +73361,51 @@ and the join, and it fell off that was the only . and then gone back! ooh ooh! -i had to say, say well i never where the hell did that come from? -geoff he pulled out . +i had to say, say well i never where the hell did that come from? +geoff he pulled out . did he? yeah. and the machine wouldn't work so well geoff did buy me some sherry glasses he says oh, you give me two -like very similar to this. +like very similar to this. what colour's the oh! little boy in? mm. -then he said er er er +then he said er er er you make nice pastries, nice and light. -i said to dad, are you getting too -, he said i'll work late i know what +i said to dad, are you getting too +, he said i'll work late i know what and everything's very nice , lovely! mm. -because you want the right size join what you put in they hadn't got any, no more of these +because you want the right size join what you put in they hadn't got any, no more of these no i said to geoff well i hope he don't come back. who? -they're supposed to +they're supposed to that bloke, i don't want him coming . well dear you won't worry, i'll shall soon tell him to ! -you ought to you ought to say to him, i shall ring the police, you come round here any more! -people in the, in the bay i wouldn't +you ought to you ought to say to him, i shall ring the police, you come round here any more! +people in the, in the bay i wouldn't no i'm not! i don't want him, it worried me that he might come and bother your mother. yeah. no! -there's no this time. +there's no this time. i can stick up for myself! oh! -so he won't you just don't -i did that +so he won't you just don't +i did that i know you can. old bloke! -end of the day and if you don't let him in, he don't have to have any +end of the day and if you don't let him in, he don't have to have any no. anyway! well i tell you something if he ke , if he does start to hassle us i shall ring the police and i shall tell them! mm. -i should use -i shan't have no qualms about it, i shall say well he's hassling me and my mother-in-law and we can do without it! -that old boy that i spoke to, when his he was with his daughter, i said you give me my bloody keys and you money! +i should use +i shan't have no qualms about it, i shall say well he's hassling me and my mother-in-law and we can do without it! +that old boy that i spoke to, when his he was with his daughter, i said you give me my bloody keys and you money! i gotta move! i said well there's a wheelbarrow down there mate! rent-a-van's up there. @@ -73475,7 +73413,7 @@ so she come the other day, she said well my dad is like that. she wants to come in. i said well he's not gonna ha! -be like that with me my dear, i said, tell me how to run my son's business! +be like that with me my dear, i said, tell me how to run my son's business! that's right. well what are we going to do? i said well that's his hard luck! @@ -73486,28 +73424,28 @@ twenty six! and it's brurgh! oh. -i said it's funny, i said, but now when you're trying to help -don't mind these +i said it's funny, i said, but now when you're trying to help +don't mind these well you can't take no notice of that, i said i'm afraid i do! that's right. -so he went so away we went. +so he went so away we went. hello blackie! hello! they like that, cor she's getting a fluffy coat isn't she, now? -well it's like with them gypsies weren't it ? +well it's like with them gypsies weren't it ? yeah. now the policeman wouldn't go! and you went after them? my mother's -well it's like me innit? -oh ! +well it's like me innit? +oh ! well geoff's nearly got a smack in the ear hole today! yesterday. well yesterday. your glass again now? no, she hasn't drunk the first one yet! -and i worked on the till this morning i said to . +and i worked on the till this morning i said to . what? yeah she is quite cold isn't she, on the phone? what annoys me, she told me to have them plums! @@ -73516,43 +73454,43 @@ and he had to me! she said don't tell such bloody lies, i said he's going in caravan! who's is that caravan? -so her head come out what's the trouble? -i said he's only got a bag of my plums! +so her head come out what's the trouble? +i said he's only got a bag of my plums! what do you mean got a bag of your plu ? i said i saw him! i said he's, he's been right back past my window! -you, you, don't he said, i'll down to you, i said i don't bleeding first! +you, you, don't he said, i'll down to you, i said i don't bleeding first! that's alright. -i said to that caravan i get upset! +i said to that caravan i get upset! he said well i ain't going up there! -well i said i'll go with you but he did he eventually go? +well i said i'll go with you but he did he eventually go? that policeman, did i go with . him or did he no. no he wouldn't dare! no. -unless he went with a team i don't know. +unless he went with a team i don't know. and you went and he didn't? yeah! -ken said my mother's just been well i'm not going. +ken said my mother's just been well i'm not going. innit marvellous! he said we're not to go any more on our own. can i have another sherry please? yeah, he said we're not supposed to go on our own! now she won't change. -well i suppose yeah cos they could set on him on his own +well i suppose yeah cos they could set on him on his own yeah. he wouldn't stand a chance would he? oh no god ! they , they normally have a back up all the time don't they, policeman? they're never normally on their own are they? -well i mean he was stealing and then, what about that time when i rang the police to say he's nicking apples out +well i mean he was stealing and then, what about that time when i rang the police to say he's nicking apples out grandma. of here. sherry please? and he said i gotta see him pick them! -they won't cha , you won't chase him +they won't cha , you won't chase him i gotta catch him! well i said if you stand there long enough i said, you'll catch him! i sa @@ -73564,9 +73502,9 @@ and then give theirself away don't they? yeah , people scarper don't they? yeah! i said i saw the boy come over the -ooh i reckon there was an accident today on the a seventeen erm +ooh i reckon there was an accident today on the a seventeen erm what time? -ooh it's early in the morning. +ooh it's early in the morning. yeah well i said to you there was skid marks all over and the traffic was right back down the a seventeen, when i got there it would it be sort of before your dad went? @@ -73574,23 +73512,23 @@ perhaps say quarter to nine? cos i saw two police car go along there. might have been. they were flashing their lights. -wouldn't like to say really cos then you when you start at quarter to five +wouldn't like to say really cos then you when you start at quarter to five no you you haven't got no idea of the no. time sort of pass -but i did hear this one and i run to the window +but i did hear this one and i run to the window by the time we do our morning and the , you're then getting up sort of thing you see yeah. this is it. -and then it's +and then it's and then there's two police cars going towards wisbech i saw them mummy. flashing ah! lights. what's the matter dear? -so it no this is broad daylight +so it no this is broad daylight i want another glass of sherry. you better ask grandma. he wants another glass of sherry grandma. @@ -73600,8 +73538,8 @@ and that's all you have, you don't have yeah. no more jonathan! oh! -must be about nine time well what time does dad go? -oh that'd be about quarter nine. +must be about nine time well what time does dad go? +oh that'd be about quarter nine. oh it could well of been then, yeah. yeah. aren't you feeling very well jonathan? @@ -73609,7 +73547,7 @@ got all my cake and no shopping for me. he's got a bit of cold that's all. i'm hot. i think he's had a busy day. -oh +oh perhaps getting a bit tired. i'm hot! there you are that'll perk you up then. @@ -73625,25 +73563,25 @@ anybody else? you what? shall i do you one? yeah might as well yeah. -i'll have one why not. +i'll have one why not. you'll soon finish that bottle! that's don't matter, i got another one. -that other one what was it? +that other one what was it? yes. oh you didn't ought to have open that, that's what i said! -it don't matter that other ain't done. +it don't matter that other ain't done. oh innit? oh no. oh i thought it had. no. -oh we didn't to drink yourselves. +oh we didn't to drink yourselves. oh well go on! had a drink. -it's about twenty one +it's about twenty one yeah. -we'll have to make sure we get a bottle of sherry in for christmas geoff. +we'll have to make sure we get a bottle of sherry in for christmas geoff. mm. well we usually what do we usually drink? @@ -73658,14 +73596,14 @@ yeah. i do like that. daddy what happened if you go glug glug glug glug glug? you'll go lug lug lug lug ! -you'll burn your throat and you'd feel very -yeah and you wouldn't be, feel very well. +you'll burn your throat and you'd feel very +yeah and you wouldn't be, feel very well. ah! dee dee dee. you won't have it if you're gonna drink it quick. -just sip it jonathan sip it at . +just sip it jonathan sip it at . did you have another one? -coming at and again. +coming at and again. yeah? yeah? ooh crumbs! @@ -73674,33 +73612,33 @@ that's cor! what they're trying to do. dad? -well you can't you know +well you can't you know i need some whisky! i know your car's getting -old but i i it yeah but it don't look erm -it take +old but i i it yeah but it don't look erm +it take that rust. -but you get some, they're full of rust and it makes you wonder -oh it's terrible +but you get some, they're full of rust and it makes you wonder +oh it's terrible how they keep on the road, don't it? -we've seen them, they seem to and the mud guards hang off! -and i met some of them cha you know that chap and +we've seen them, they seem to and the mud guards hang off! +and i met some of them cha you know that chap and mm. it's fascinating! -yeah that's right that's right. -well you'd you'd think they wouldn't want them on the road cos if they had an accident the people would get killed, they'd just +yeah that's right that's right. +well you'd you'd think they wouldn't want them on the road cos if they had an accident the people would get killed, they'd just well my one crumble wouldn't they? -er car park about a fortnight ago. +er car park about a fortnight ago. . well i wonder however that that got through to touch that. yeah. -course th the one of the wings wa , was bashed inside, they were hanging off! +course th the one of the wings wa , was bashed inside, they were hanging off! do you wanna finish that thing? yeah. oh? -do you want finished. -there's people out they was in, it was the paper the other day about about the da , about the arresting people. +do you want finished. +there's people out they was in, it was the paper the other day about about the da , about the arresting people. yeah. yeah. that's that girl who you knew. @@ -73709,7 +73647,7 @@ yeah that's it. how did he do it? little girl. yeah. -and they +and they he's a big old boy , john ! that the wings ho hold on big fat slob! @@ -73721,7 +73659,7 @@ same age virtually. yeah. well when he was so and it -actually do it myself +actually do it myself what are you doing? can't he? yeah, if someone lifted the gearbox @@ -73732,7 +73670,7 @@ yeah. baby, he was i said i've such a puny sickly looking thing! -i've done a hundred and twenty thousand +i've done a hundred and twenty thousand but and the gearbox was as the day they come out! cor his head and shoulders taller than you isn't he jonathan? @@ -73744,22 +73682,22 @@ is he bonny? ooh yeah! he weighs he comes to there on me. -how much no he's tall , lot ta bigger than that isn't he geoff? +how much no he's tall , lot ta bigger than that isn't he geoff? he's a lot taller oh yeah. about there. -than jonathan, john is a big old +than jonathan, john is a big old well ricky comes boy isn't he? ricky's only there. -how much does j erm john weigh? +how much does j erm john weigh? nine and nine and a half. nine and a half stone? more than me! -so anyway -well weighs ten and a half! -losing that old datsun they got hold +so anyway +well weighs ten and a half! +losing that old datsun they got hold well i said i think that's far yeah. too fat for young girls! @@ -73774,33 +73712,33 @@ oh yeah i saw her didn't i? well if her mums was to slim her down now. she's going -no in second gear. -norma 's little girl, is she as fat as ever? +no in second gear. +norma 's little girl, is she as fat as ever? try to pull yeah. parts . well no she did go on a diet, she used to go and see a dietician at the hospital. who's that? -kerry -i'd, she used to come round and help +kerry +i'd, she used to come round and help i think erm. she weighed nine and half didn't she? . and she's what? nine years old. -what walked to +what walked to she's er and back again. do you yeah. mind if i have a cigarette? -the head the youngest nine +the head the youngest nine and a half stone year old! i want an ashtray, go get us one. you hasn't started it mum! -all the shout +all the shout no i know i ain't started it! i don't have to rush! well i haven't started! @@ -73813,40 +73751,40 @@ any more of it! no . ! you shouldn't drink it quickly! -ooh you'll go without +ooh you'll go without when we got straightened up we can -if you can have +if you can have that's wrong to drink all that ain't it? -that was +that was like that. put you off. yeah. -if if i think i'm it'll be +if if i think i'm it'll be and then alright. and then e everybody in a minute. -when he's when he's facing this way +when he's when he's facing this way he wants sleep yeah. sleeping. wouldn't of helped us. -well i'm hoping he's gonna go to bed not too late tonight. +well i'm hoping he's gonna go to bed not too late tonight. ooh your dad and i will sleep like a top. yeah. -if +if i said to that mrs -i thought , i thought we'd go to erm . +i thought , i thought we'd go to erm . what's her name? . at any rate he ? -he +he he'll be alright . -why does have that fish? -says he's -cooking i told you . +why does have that fish? +says he's +cooking i told you . mm. front of the drive. why doesn't nan have @@ -73856,41 +73794,41 @@ i did, i didn't even like to move well granddad uses that. round there and oh. -that's -and norma used to say, i don't put them to bed with charlie because they don't go to sleep, in and out of bed she tried the bed's . +that's +and norma used to say, i don't put them to bed with charlie because they don't go to sleep, in and out of bed she tried the bed's . that's right. so where you going jonathan? i was ta i'm going to get something. -i was talking to mrs +i was talking to mrs i said what about it? -your little old come up the window and +your little old come up the window and no. pulled the curtains back. -you still +you still i said now that one's baby in there. cor! -i said i'll spray +i said i'll spray well i te is it, you know how no. -cos i walked home with liz tonight +cos i walked home with liz tonight oh. cos, i had to go and pick jonathan up didn't i? cos it was getting dark and he hadn't got his light no. -on and i didn't i said to him i'll come and meet you a i said you can come to the hall cos that's ever so light through there +on and i didn't i said to him i'll come and meet you a i said you can come to the hall cos that's ever so light through there yeah. -cos all them,so oh and talking about that, i see the manor house er you know the one on the chase +cos all them,so oh and talking about that, i see the manor house er you know the one on the chase 's. -i see that all lit up look at that, look nice! +i see that all lit up look at that, look nice! so i thought i bet it does! cor blimey i could live in there! yeah. that looked really lovely! oh yeah what was i saying erm -about liz and coming meeting jonathan. +about liz and coming meeting jonathan. oh yeah, so i walked with her. well her little granddaughter's a lovely little girl! well then i @@ -73904,7 +73842,7 @@ look what i got, a ! well liz used to no we're not playing that tonight jonathan, we've come down to sa talk. -and then she used be spotless at one time! +and then she used be spotless at one time! her washing, you couldn't touch her! i don't know what's happened to her! well sh @@ -73919,13 +73857,13 @@ toys and it's just toys, it's not lotto look! look! he said lotto! -too thin, ooh i'd love to stop -oh yeah i thought he'd put +too thin, ooh i'd love to stop +oh yeah i thought he'd put bless you! that was your dad's. was it? mm. -and brian bought you that didn't they? +and brian bought you that didn't they? some more belonging to it in there look jonathan, that other thing there. what this one? the trailer. @@ -73939,36 +73877,36 @@ no. do you? and i suppose that's the in this didn't did it? -wouldn't think so, i mean that's probably +wouldn't think so, i mean that's probably an air force thing. well ! -they've only +they've only where? must have the whole army nearly! -we see a tank like this wha , on a like this one of these a man in a jeep +we see a tank like this wha , on a like this one of these a man in a jeep what you mean right? today? -yeah and we see a lorry with a bloke he was doing like that looking out the back and we all go ahhhh ! +yeah and we see a lorry with a bloke he was doing like that looking out the back and we all go ahhhh ! what real? yeah. oh! where did you sit on the bus? -er in the middle. +er in the middle. oh you didn't sit on the back seat then? no, not at all. -when we went to er zoe's place there they'd got some tins, that megazone tin what i've got +when we went to er zoe's place there they'd got some tins, that megazone tin what i've got oh yeah. on the shelf. had yeah. they? yeah, and that other one what i put my stamps in. -yeah the one. -i said well i got some of them ! +yeah the one. +i said well i got some of them ! old oxo tins and that yeah. -er +er yeah cos you oh we used to have, when we used to go on the strawberry field see. @@ -73984,10 +73922,10 @@ yeah. and i laughed i, they make all them bon bons don't they at the moment. well is she upset cos we're sitting on her seat? -well you perhaps won't believe me but i sit where geoff is and she gets right against me and there's all this to spare isn't there granddad? +well you perhaps won't believe me but i sit where geoff is and she gets right against me and there's all this to spare isn't there granddad? yeah but they like to be close. and if i come here -like we like touching me. +like we like touching me. yeah my cat then she'll go to me again. does. @@ -74008,7 +73946,7 @@ so! well do you want them to think your mother's cuckoo? yeah, well they're not gonna know who you are, are they? well i think so cos i have to write in the book, i have to put myself! -yeah but you don't put who you are on it! +yeah but you don't put who you are on it! i put myself. well who else is myself? if that isn't me! @@ -74027,17 +73965,17 @@ what? he was outside! cat flap. hello! -he's oh mum i i'm going! +he's oh mum i i'm going! oh! ah! ooh! love bite . -did anybody get for not behaving? +did anybody get for not behaving? only two people. who was that? -erm that was mark and jeremy and unless somebody owns up they were pinging a dried pea at lee and nearly hit mr ! +erm that was mark and jeremy and unless somebody owns up they were pinging a dried pea at lee and nearly hit mr ! ooh crumbs! -we won't have any more plays ever! +we won't have any more plays ever! what sort of plays? all plays. well i, it wouldn't worry you, you aren't gonna be there! @@ -74055,23 +73993,23 @@ and do you know who he thinks it is? who jeremy jeremy . i wouldn't be surprised! -and he won't, and he wouldn't own up ever! +and he won't, and he wouldn't own up ever! he would never own up. well that isn't very fair on the rest of you though is it? -mr has got he said if you're don't own up you'll put everybody in doubt. +mr has got he said if you're don't own up you'll put everybody in doubt. matthew didn't do it. hasn't he been very well? dunno. probably, cos he wouldn't of missed a trip would he? no. has that tape nearly finished? -i've no idea jonathan i'm not looking. +i've no idea jonathan i'm not looking. on side b. -well dad'll probably ha , he usually has a lot to say when he comes home from work he's been home and rushed out so i +well dad'll probably ha , he usually has a lot to say when he comes home from work he's been home and rushed out so i oh. he's had to go and get a battery -for the minibus. -i'll tell you what you can do on the freezer there's some cat food for the cat you can feed him that. +for the minibus. +i'll tell you what you can do on the freezer there's some cat food for the cat you can feed him that. all of it? no not all of it! it's only half! @@ -74082,7 +74020,7 @@ but i can't reach the pizzas. yes you can, they're on the top, you reached them the other night. these will do. from down the bottom. -will you please try them? +will you please try them? but it hurts my belly! it hurts! oh go on jonathan! @@ -74090,13 +74028,13 @@ but it hurts! why does it hurt your belly? well cos i have to lean over! on my belly! -well how do you think mum does, she isn't half much taller than you anyway! -yeah but you can go like that cos you got long arms. -would you go down a hole if it was life or death that was just enough for you to get into +well how do you think mum does, she isn't half much taller than you anyway! +yeah but you can go like that cos you got long arms. +would you go down a hole if it was life or death that was just enough for you to get into yeah. and stay in there jonathan cos . -erm it was about a foot wide. +erm it was about a foot wide. . wouldn't you? not if it was life or death? @@ -74107,10 +74045,10 @@ well i suppose i would have to. i certainly wouldn't like it. nor would i! it's got a load of rat holes in! -can't smell in that. -i can get to the . +can't smell in that. +i can get to the . hurry up! -shut the door, i want to garden. +shut the door, i want to garden. no i ain't gonna talk to myself! well just keep saying something, keep talking to me! i can't you berk, you're right outside the door! @@ -74126,8 +74064,8 @@ i'm just getting out all the good bits. i hope dad's not gonna be too late yeah. cos we was late home for tea last night weren't we? -yep that's my dad! -that's my daddy he is always la la la la la late he never comes early early on +yep that's my dad! +that's my daddy he is always la la la la la late he never comes early early on he's always late, that is true. doo doo doo doo doo da oh god! @@ -74135,46 +74073,46 @@ what does it mean sugar there goes the phone. wha shall i turn it off? no, that's alright. -my i wanted to do,is said my name is jonathan do do, doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo do da da da da da da da money dee da my name is jonathan ee ee ee dee doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo din din din din din din my name is jonathan din din din and it's mine and it's mine oh oh oh mum mum bom bom bom bom bom, bomby om bomby om doo de doo doo doo doo dee dee dee dee doo doo doo dee doo doo dee dee dee i said my name is jonathan come on mum i kept the cassette going. +my i wanted to do,is said my name is jonathan do do, doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo do da da da da da da da money dee da my name is jonathan ee ee ee dee doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo din din din din din din my name is jonathan din din din and it's mine and it's mine oh oh oh mum mum bom bom bom bom bom, bomby om bomby om doo de doo doo doo doo dee dee dee dee doo doo doo dee doo doo dee dee dee i said my name is jonathan come on mum i kept the cassette going. oh. it hasn't started yet. i want that pen. -just so you know mm mm, mm mm mm mm mm mm . +just so you know mm mm, mm mm mm mm mm mm . all these people want cars, i can't understand it -normally they don't want this time of year. -yeah they've changed their mind haven't they?catch me up and . -renault's out that's on there the cars he's got that -you can catch me but you can't catch me yet come on mum, they want you talking! +normally they don't want this time of year. +yeah they've changed their mind haven't they?catch me up and . +renault's out that's on there the cars he's got that +you can catch me but you can't catch me yet come on mum, they want you talking! i know,yo , i can't talk every five minutes of the day. well you've got to if you want to keep the money. is that all you think about is money jonathan? -mm i thought that's all you thought about! -no i could do with a lot more. +mm i thought that's all you thought about! +no i could do with a lot more. that's what i mean. that is the more i think about it though. that's all i think about. what? -that's all i think about mm. +that's all i think about mm. i know it is. -i hope daddy will be -right, clare she said it's not fair! -my sister is getting the compact disc for five hundred and ninety nine pound and i'm only +i hope daddy will be +right, clare she said it's not fair! +my sister is getting the compact disc for five hundred and ninety nine pound and i'm only she's lucky then! getting a computer for a hundred and ninety nine pound! the price isn't the point. -blooming heck four she, her blooming sister's getting five hundred, she's getting four hundred. +blooming heck four she, her blooming sister's getting five hundred, she's getting four hundred. well, i don't know where they get their money from! nor do i! and they got a skoda! well that, precisely. well they just gone to , they're going to europe. oh are they? -mm that's what she said. +mm that's what she said. did she? yep. she's a funny girl isn't she jonathan? she's weird!. -cos she erm she's throws a wobbly quite often don't she? +cos she erm she's throws a wobbly quite often don't she? yeah. is she like that in class? yeah. @@ -74183,17 +74121,17 @@ yep. for doing it? . oh no she doesn't do it in front of mrs . -i shouldn't think, she hates mrs don't she? +i shouldn't think, she hates mrs don't she? does she? yeah, i dunno why. -mm, i bet i do, ha ! +mm, i bet i do, ha ! why? -well mrs only tells her off when she's naughty. +well mrs only tells her off when she's naughty. well she ain't really i know she's not the most popular person, but she is right a lot of the time. not all the time though. -well not all the time, nobody's right all the time, but she is a right she is right a lot of the time jonathan because some of them children misbehave +well not all the time, nobody's right all the time, but she is a right she is right a lot of the time jonathan because some of them children misbehave who? terribly! ooh they had a lot of bangers this morning! @@ -74203,12 +74141,12 @@ what was is then? everybody fell over. in the first play. oh. -cor right, there was one little boy i felt sorry for him right, he went up, down, up, down, weee! -want ben you know ben don't you? +cor right, there was one little boy i felt sorry for him right, he went up, down, up, down, weee! +want ben you know ben don't you? yeah. he fell over, jonathan could you take that lego box off my table! mm. -he fell over and his tooth went straight through his lip! +he fell over and his tooth went straight through his lip! urgh! we had to take him to hospital and he had three stitches in it. weren't it? @@ -74217,24 +74155,24 @@ i thought it was ben ? i don't know who took him. no it weren't ben . it was! -ben you know lisa ? +ben you know lisa ? that isn't lisa, that's erm emma. no, what's her name now? helen? -nope i can't think of her name. +nope i can't think of her name. it is, lisa! -it isn't lisa erm she's got blonde hair hasn't she? +it isn't lisa erm she's got blonde hair hasn't she? dunno. -oh, i can't think of her name now cos i got a mental block. +oh, i can't think of her name now cos i got a mental block. it isn't ben ! are you talking about a boy that plays with sarah ? well i don't know, he only comes part-time. oh. yeah well maybe in the -gemma gemma . +gemma gemma . that isn't ben! -gemma and ben are brother and sister +gemma and ben are brother and sister how do you know it is ben though? what is it then? not ben. @@ -74243,26 +74181,26 @@ yeah. did you know? yeah. was a lot of blood. -mm . +mm . how did he fall over? oh he'd been tripped. -cor right, he went woosh! +cor right, he went woosh! woosh! woosh! when he got up they was like that. what? he had a tooth, that went straight through his bottom lip. -yeah you could see the tooth outside, i thought ahhh! +yeah you could see the tooth outside, i thought ahhh! yorrible! -my name is jonathan -mrs said he was ever so good. +my name is jonathan +mrs said he was ever so good. mm. well i think we better have our tea if daddy's here in a minute. -so get that lego off the table and you tea. +so get that lego off the table and you tea. my name is jonathan, i am a boy i'd like to be a big fat boy ! don't be silly jonathan! -i've got an ambition and it is to grow fat i'd like to grow like a big fat . +i've got an ambition and it is to grow fat i'd like to grow like a big fat . you're not funny, that's ever so silly! can you guess what the last one word was gonna be? no. @@ -74277,7 +74215,7 @@ yeah! alright. doo doo . i think tea will be virtually ready. -well come on dad +well come on dad if he comes. i suppose i'll have to put his in the microwave, i can't keep messing about like this. if he comes now it'll be perfect timing. @@ -74285,17 +74223,17 @@ what? if he comes now it'll be perfect timing. well he did the other night didn't he? walked in as i said it. -yeah you go well if dad don't walk in, any second now and he walked in! +yeah you go well if dad don't walk in, any second now and he walked in! i know he did. -come on now i want the lego off the table please! +come on now i want the lego off the table please! and i said in a minute. don't be so cheeky! isn't cheeky! i warned you the other night, me and you gonna fall out if you keep being cheeky. that ain't even cheeky! -remember what erm two christmas cards today look! +remember what erm two christmas cards today look! who from? -one from mrs next door +one from mrs next door mrs ? you know, who used to be there? i said hello from the . @@ -74304,19 +74242,19 @@ hope life is treating you well. we shall have to pop in one of these days and surprise you. i've got a headache. i can't remember what they look like. -meantime we wish you a very happy nineteen ninety two, our warmest wishes carole and ian p s julian bought his own place two years ago. +meantime we wish you a very happy nineteen ninety two, our warmest wishes carole and ian p s julian bought his own place two years ago. who's julian? that boy, their son, the young one. i can't remember them! -and that one's from michael and nathan and gareth. +and that one's from michael and nathan and gareth. gareth? you know michael ? -didn't they come down here, them two boys one night with their dad? -to pick up a well they come here one afternoon to pick up a car. -what when we ni , when played that football game? +didn't they come down here, them two boys one night with their dad? +to pick up a well they come here one afternoon to pick up a car. +what when we ni , when played that football game? yeah that's right. one of them was about my age weren't he? -yeah i think he goes to when you go. +yeah i think he goes to when you go. does he? i think so, i'm not quite sure. i liked him. @@ -74328,27 +74266,27 @@ dale. is it dale? dane? dale. -yeah he goes. -and dale dale. +yeah he goes. +and dale dale. well i don't know his name! i -er lee ee ooh +er lee ee ooh i don't know them all. ee ee ee ee ee ooh . -hey right guess how they put we three kings, it goes this is how gary put it on the sheet, he goes we three kings , no is bitter perfume he will die and go in his tomb . +hey right guess how they put we three kings, it goes this is how gary put it on the sheet, he goes we three kings , no is bitter perfume he will die and go in his tomb . who said that? i read what it said! people die and what? go in their tomb. something like that. well that ain't very nice! -and i and instead of ma , no frankincense to offer have i , he goes,frankincense to o , no,frankincense to jesus to +and i and instead of ma , no frankincense to offer have i , he goes,frankincense to o , no,frankincense to jesus to well you'll singing o for the infants aren't you? yeah. -well that's gonna be in the church then, that -yeah we +well that's gonna be in the church then, that +yeah we three kings of orient i, what . that's in a week! @@ -74364,29 +74302,29 @@ what's the date? what's the well it says on here look jonathan, if you look! what's today? -it says a christmas service will be held in the oh no it isn't the juniors are now helping the infants with their nativity story on wednesday the eighteenth of december this was originally a advertised, by me, at taking place at six thirty in walton st. peter church, i'm afraid this was a mistake on my part, as in fact the performance is rather ten thirty on the da on that day at walter st. andrew church. +it says a christmas service will be held in the oh no it isn't the juniors are now helping the infants with their nativity story on wednesday the eighteenth of december this was originally a advertised, by me, at taking place at six thirty in walton st. peter church, i'm afraid this was a mistake on my part, as in fact the performance is rather ten thirty on the da on that day at walter st. andrew church. this timing will enable even the youngest children to take part. -mum'll go to that cos i like carols. +mum'll go to that cos i like carols. i'm not! well course you are going to it! don't want to! why? i don't like them new words! they're rubbish! -right, and the other story goes the angels go to be +right, and the other story goes the angels go to be can you get off to sing to him i'm ready! the angels going to sing to him. i'm ready jonathan! now quickly! -get them in, get them in, get them in, them in get them in, get them, get them in, them in doodle oodle ooh,. +get them in, get them in, get them in, them in get them in, get them, get them in, them in doodle oodle ooh,. i'm sitting here tonight. i'm sitting over there mum. why? i like sitting over there better. well then why did you let me put all your things you have that side? -nee nee nee nee nee nee nee nee nee nee . +nee nee nee nee nee nee nee nee nee nee . right, let's give you some chips. . is that enough? @@ -74397,7 +74335,7 @@ fit four people in there won't we? where? this , 's, auntie val. yeah a lot of people have been there, i do agree. -helen or +helen or yes. is that who that was from? yeah, helen,yes. @@ -74414,11 +74352,11 @@ how many do you want? that's enough. thank you. what? -what are you me for . +what are you me for . don't show your ignorance please! -don't you mean i don't what you mean! -well there is a please and thank you word! -yeah thanks. +don't you mean i don't what you mean! +well there is a please and thank you word! +yeah thanks. oh dear! uncle ken went up there. up where? @@ -74430,25 +74368,25 @@ can i just ask you . yeah well he's not home yet. isn't he? no. -oh alright i'll come, pop back later then. -yeah he shouldn't be long before he's home but +oh alright i'll come, pop back later then. +yeah he shouldn't be long before he's home but yeah. pop back. -erm i can't tell you what time he'll be home really erm well say in the twenty minutes he's bound to be home cos he he's been home and then he's had to shoot out again, he's gone to get the battery so he won't be long. +erm i can't tell you what time he'll be home really erm well say in the twenty minutes he's bound to be home cos he he's been home and then he's had to shoot out again, he's gone to get the battery so he won't be long. no, alright then. alright? -i'll give him a bell about in half hour about six o'clock? -yeah yeah that'll be fine, yep, yeah. +i'll give him a bell about in half hour about six o'clock? +yeah yeah that'll be fine, yep, yeah. okay then thanks a lot. -okay then yeah, bye! +okay then yeah, bye! bye! about half five! silly git! it is half five! -say that about people mum's awful saying that! +say that about people mum's awful saying that! especially when the tape's on! -ooh i forgot about that! -yeah well mum can't he looked alright. +ooh i forgot about that! +yeah well mum can't he looked alright. ooh! i burnt myself! i've done you one as well. @@ -74456,27 +74394,27 @@ oh no! what are they? oh well me and dad will have to have more each. i don't think you'll like them anyway jonathan. -i've had one before didn't like it. -that's what i thought i should think dad'll come home now that he's gone. +i've had one before didn't like it. +that's what i thought i should think dad'll come home now that he's gone. erm put it on the table cos he's bound to walk in. i bet he doesn't. yeah, if you put it on the table he won't, and if you don't -well i'll leave i can't wait any longer, i'm hungry. -mr went to the dentist this morning didn't he? -dunno probably. -he just after dinner or this morning. +well i'll leave i can't wait any longer, i'm hungry. +mr went to the dentist this morning didn't he? +dunno probably. +he just after dinner or this morning. who did you have teaching you this morning then? not all morning. well part of the morning, who taught you this morning? mr . i thought you said he went to the dentist? -mm nobody we just had to get on with my work. -oh mr kept an eye on us. +mm nobody we just had to get on with my work. +oh mr kept an eye on us. which classroom was he in then? -mr next door next door. +mr next door next door. oh he's gone back in his own classroom now has he? -no it's just they need a teacher. +no it's just they need a teacher. you need a lot of teachers don't you? yeah. what teacher do you like the best? @@ -74494,50 +74432,50 @@ oh i had a giggle! oh! i had a tiny bit of a giggle! why? -poor she didn't actually go to the museum at all. +poor she didn't actually go to the museum at all. no she went to the dentist instead, i mean the hospital. yeah. -she was gonna go erm when next door went weren't she? +she was gonna go erm when next door went weren't she? mm. -have , enough of her jonathan. -and i thought wergh! +have , enough of her jonathan. +and i thought wergh! is it? -no she's only having her teeth out! +no she's only having her teeth out! yeah but she's diabetic. she was really worried, she was going yeah but she's under anaesthetic. cor i wouldn't! but she has to cos she's a diabetic. so!. -mm just a sec. +mm just a sec. here's comes your dad. talk of the devil! i should think . -that's er staying outside. +that's er staying outside. to his stuff. mm. oh yeah. -they want it about eleven but i said, can you get down to get it? +they want it about eleven but i said, can you get down to get it? because your dad won't be there, will he? -i have a your dad can +i have a your dad can i thought it'd be back by now. aha. and also that young chap's been here for the van. oh yeah. it was a nice little feller. -yeah and he's he's gonna ring you about half past six. +yeah and he's he's gonna ring you about half past six. was that that bloke that rang me up? or anything like that. -no +no dunno! what colour coat has he got on? got jeans on him. hasn't he got a red coat? -he had another boy with him might +he had another boy with him might but who's got a red coat? had he got a red coat? i dunno. -cos if he had a red coat, with a little white patch on it i see him walking round the village. +cos if he had a red coat, with a little white patch on it i see him walking round the village. i have had them erm mm. you like them do you? @@ -74549,30 +74487,30 @@ you what? not needed, give me that half. don't like the peas. oh i thought you was on about the pie. -no, don't mind the pie no i meant don't like them new peas. +no, don't mind the pie no i meant don't like them new peas. they ain't got a lot of flavour have they? no. i've done all inside that van. mm. just gotta wash the outside. you wanna charge for it. -yeah, cos it's sun , saturday. -no he don't, mr has it tomorrow! +yeah, cos it's sun , saturday. +no he don't, mr has it tomorrow! ooh crumbs! what are you gonna say to him? sorry you can't have it. well he's moving furniture as well. -well you said to me he could have it he said i'll have tonight. +well you said to me he could have it he said i'll have tonight. yeah but he must bring it back by nine! why? -i forgot mr was having it. +i forgot mr was having it. mm. so your mum won't be able to go shopping till nine then? no. -well they don't normally go till about nine anyway well they can't cos the post office don't open till do you want a coffee? -no i'll have a cold drink i don't mind what it is. -do you know i've been so busy, i done that van this morning, i've done my housework and two loads of washing been over petes' did i tell you? +well they don't normally go till about nine anyway well they can't cos the post office don't open till do you want a coffee? +no i'll have a cold drink i don't mind what it is. +do you know i've been so busy, i done that van this morning, i've done my housework and two loads of washing been over petes' did i tell you? yeah. rang you? no. @@ -74583,7 +74521,7 @@ make a change didn't it? i quite like them. yep. not a lot of meat in them though is there? -oh, i'd have this then i +oh, i'd have this then i who's is that? them ones we got from . oh. @@ -74595,26 +74533,26 @@ to post tomorrow. well i'd have done them myself! well i got a post office aren't i? we ain't heard a word from jimmy have we? -no i got . +no i got . pardon? i got . why, what you gotta do? -that car back from fiesta got the minibus going out got the estate car,he and jimmy's look, he talks about mr , he has left that like a tip! -it stinks of kid wee! -but to work this morning, i could of done it! +that car back from fiesta got the minibus going out got the estate car,he and jimmy's look, he talks about mr , he has left that like a tip! +it stinks of kid wee! +but to work this morning, i could of done it! mum? i said take the bus. yeah but you said you'd be busy! -yeah but i could of when i got home! +yeah but i could of when i got home! now i've gotta do it in the dark! tell me . -well the hoover won't , except i had to scrub that mini that erm that van, it was so filthy! +well the hoover won't , except i had to scrub that mini that erm that van, it was so filthy! yeah. and now who ? he did. jimmy did. i wonder where he's getting his vehicles from this week? -he's got his ain't he? +he's got his ain't he? i thought you said they stopped the ? well, he isn't supposed to be using it. can i have a spoon please? @@ -74627,40 +74565,40 @@ tyres and . you don't owe them nothing do you, i hope? nothing to do with a t s, don't like them. precisely for that reason i should think! -well wha what he said was he went up there there's erm could they put on the front wheels to the back and the back wheels to the front didn't say anything the bloke said, well we can't charge you. +well wha what he said was he went up there there's erm could they put on the front wheels to the back and the back wheels to the front didn't say anything the bloke said, well we can't charge you. oh. and the bloke said well we can't charge you for that. so this is isn't what it's all about? -well, that's how it all come see he owes them a hundred and seven pound and er +well, that's how it all come see he owes them a hundred and seven pound and er when he asked them change the tyres over they wouldn't do it. oh. -yeah but they said we can't charge you for it he said we sell a new tube or sell you a new tyre he said we can charge you but we can't charge you labour. +yeah but they said we can't charge you for it he said we sell a new tube or sell you a new tyre he said we can charge you but we can't charge you labour. that's ridiculous innit? -yeah, so he said well charge me for wheel balancing then or something no he said, we can't do that. +yeah, so he said well charge me for wheel balancing then or something no he said, we can't do that. he's just being awkward by the sound of it. so he said will you do it for nothing? and he said it's not a charity case! could you pay him to do it? he says no. -said fair enough he said and with that i come out the garage. +said fair enough he said and with that i come out the garage. well why don't he use that bloke at st. johns, who you use? he does now. -so erm he's phoned up me your money cos he said they daren't put me in court you see. -well that's a ridiculous thing to do! +so erm he's phoned up me your money cos he said they daren't put me in court you see. +well that's a ridiculous thing to do! well they say they're gonna put you into court, you get it paid don't you, before anything goes further? -yeah yeah well you see what he said was he could not see how they could warrant him that sixty odd come as interest justify doing it. +yeah yeah well you see what he said was he could not see how they could warrant him that sixty odd come as interest justify doing it. it will all depend how long has he owed them it. possibly about a year i think. cor! my god! so he said, i'm not having that! -and walked round ah so they er got a, sort of court bailiff involved. +and walked round ah so they er got a, sort of court bailiff involved. for sixty two pound, it must of cost them more than that! cost a lot of money i would of thought. they obviously don't like him do they? -no well erm it's a big firm so -perhaps it's -what they did in is er . +no well erm it's a big firm so +perhaps it's +what they did in is er . yeah but he's got his self a bad name now isn't he? yeah. it made me laugh when your mum kept on about him last night, about having all his hampers stolen. @@ -74669,24 +74607,24 @@ twenty two grand! ridiculous innit? the blokes on the make isn't he? yeah. -you see he's and then he had the cheek to charge me for insurance! +you see he's and then he had the cheek to charge me for insurance! well i expect him to pay the insurance. who did pay the insurance? -did, but i gonna give it back. +did, but i gonna give it back. well i should think so,gonna get twenty two grand out of it! cos he'd have taken them to court and said well he didn't even pay it, i did! -well actually they erm i think the maximum they'll pay out is eighteen thousand. +well actually they erm i think the maximum they'll pay out is eighteen thousand. yeah but i don't think that's gonna be such an easy case to . well, i don't. you know it looks to me they said they'd got it. -they think that it's all cut and dry, well they haven't got the then people will come round and investigate yet! +they think that it's all cut and dry, well they haven't got the then people will come round and investigate yet! no. mum that'll come out on the tape! well i can't stop it cos the kettle's boiling! don't be silly! mum is there any shandy please? -baby . +baby . jonathan put that straight in the bin for mum, will you please? yeah. you yum @@ -74700,9 +74638,9 @@ he was saying , they're going to yarmouth. ah! i see. -that's where they're going cos he said they he's not actually for the itself +that's where they're going cos he said they he's not actually for the itself yeah. -it's you know, for the workers, they're going out on a meal. +it's you know, for the workers, they're going out on a meal. so who's paying it then? he is gonna pay his self. tomorrow? @@ -74711,55 +74649,55 @@ oh that's . well they can . well i presume so. what did he er -he ought to have done it through the college got it cheaper. +he ought to have done it through the college got it cheaper. ah oh oh! he said this is nothing to do with the college. why don't he er well i suppose he's, the man's got his reasons. -i was gonna say what you mean, put petrol in it? +i was gonna say what you mean, put petrol in it? seems stupid! yeah cos you gotta lay out money aren't you? -yeah so if i decide to -oh he said, when he's finished i don't whether he's not picking it up till later on. -ooh and another that's what i wanted to tell you about well i don't think we can help him out. +yeah so if i decide to +oh he said, when he's finished i don't whether he's not picking it up till later on. +ooh and another that's what i wanted to tell you about well i don't think we can help him out. oh well. gentleman wanted a minibus yeah. -now, he talked rather nice erm with having four +now, he talked rather nice erm with having four yeah. i can't remember his name at all i can i can't think of it now. i'm gonna go and watch t v. -well what he wanted, he wanted a minibus from there to there and there well we can't can we? -we can have one from there to there but he can't have one here. +well what he wanted, he wanted a minibus from there to there and there well we can't can we? +we can have one from there to there but he can't have one here. daddy, mummy can he? thinks the key was down i the -jonathan i don't really -just a minute jonathan , let mum because the college has got one there +jonathan i don't really +just a minute jonathan , let mum because the college has got one there yeah. -toby's got one there and got the other one there. +toby's got one there and got the other one there. yeah. well what time is toby coming back? well so he can't have that one then? and the isle of ely college is going out for a meal, so that won't be back, so he can't have that one, so we haven't got one! no. -for friday night, but he can have one sort of, first thing saturday morning. +for friday night, but he can have one sort of, first thing saturday morning. but otherwise we haven't got one. -no er +no er erm, and that lady's gonna ring about the fiesta and then that young boy's gonna ring about the van. hooray! but that means that won't get cleaned outside for mr mr . -well but it's very clean inside, i scrubbed it. +well but it's very clean inside, i scrubbed it. mm. and polished it. mm. i wouldn't of thought he'd of worried too much about the outside. well it isn't that bad, it's only down the bottom anyway. -no, under the right hand side, there's none the left hand side well i said i only washed +no, under the right hand side, there's none the left hand side well i said i only washed one side. i started washing my . who turned the light out? @@ -74768,33 +74706,33 @@ why? well that's gotta be back by nine in the morning. yeah. as long as he's got that back in the yard by nine. -well i did see him, he seemed alright but you see you can't tell what people are like,yo you may think they have ni +well i did see him, he seemed alright but you see you can't tell what people are like,yo you may think they have ni i know. -nice personalities but he could now do a runner with our van couldn't they? +nice personalities but he could now do a runner with our van couldn't they? yeah. i reckon that's what honky tonk was on the other night though. yeah. was he? i reckon he's in trouble. yeah. -so let me just think. -so well, he could have the van well how much would you charge him for tonight? +so let me just think. +so well, he could have the van well how much would you charge him for tonight? twenty quid. -yeah cos mr 's got the renault. -i told my mum -oh in decent state he didn't last time i scrubbed well i wou +yeah cos mr 's got the renault. +i told my mum +oh in decent state he didn't last time i scrubbed well i wou go on monday? no. oh. -yeah well they sho i said i'd i was looking through this +yeah well they sho i said i'd i was looking through this mm -and i was thinking cor we say we haven't been doing very well, but look at that week there! -and then look it's not +and i was thinking cor we say we haven't been doing very well, but look at that week there! +and then look it's not yeah. -too bad for this time of i bet we're doing better this year, this time of the year than we did last. -yeah . -well you see you do that minibus want cleaning up, that blue one or was that clean before we put it in the shed? -no that's part of the the windows washing but i'll quickly washed over them just to spruce them up a bit but i thought if i put mrs in that, is she driving, or is she not? +too bad for this time of i bet we're doing better this year, this time of the year than we did last. +yeah . +well you see you do that minibus want cleaning up, that blue one or was that clean before we put it in the shed? +no that's part of the the windows washing but i'll quickly washed over them just to spruce them up a bit but i thought if i put mrs in that, is she driving, or is she not? erm, i should imagine so. yes, she is. is she? @@ -74805,14 +74743,14 @@ well i can't help it. well you'll just have to explain to her, the other one yeah. hasn't come back after you've -well no , no what i'm saying was, the fifteen seaters here you see but i can't, i shan't be put the petrol in for the both shall i?clean tomorrow night. +well no , no what i'm saying was, the fifteen seaters here you see but i can't, i shan't be put the petrol in for the both shall i?clean tomorrow night. well i don't know what time she's picking it up at actually. oh. i should imagine that's his number. what number? i hope he paid you this week then. yeah,. -well you with his money you can pay off them two bills. +well you with his money you can pay off them two bills. yeah. cos yo you don't put them through do you? his? @@ -74822,16 +74760,16 @@ put any on ? well then forget about this time, that won't hurt will it? we've been doing alright otherwise. mm. -pete was talking about his roly he said june, he said he is such a character! +pete was talking about his roly he said june, he said he is such a character! so i said, is he? -so he he's been up he's one of type of dogs, he said like a human you wouldn't know if he went in the house they wouldn't know whether he was coming out with a double barrelled shot gun to shoot yourself or +so he he's been up he's one of type of dogs, he said like a human you wouldn't know if he went in the house they wouldn't know whether he was coming out with a double barrelled shot gun to shoot yourself or yeah. with a glass of sherry in his hand! he said he's yeah. one of them types! yeah. -pete was hoping they ain't drunken no cider! +pete was hoping they ain't drunken no cider! he must have had four glasses while i was there. oh lo erm i shouldn't talk about him cos that's not nice and he said , i said to him . @@ -74840,25 +74778,25 @@ and there's always loads of sherry glasses and wine glasses all over! yeah. they must both drink. cliff erm -they're not even afford it. +they're not even afford it. that's right. cliff had a do again tonight with kim. whatever for this time! -well same thing. +well same thing. well i thought he didn't go down there any more? no. as we was just coming home. -she stood there yabbing at the end of the counter, when are you coming out! +she stood there yabbing at the end of the counter, when are you coming out! he said oh for god's sake shut up kim! -so she said er shut up your fat ! +so she said er shut up your fat ! she didn't! he said i've told you before he said, if you ever say that again he said i was gonna knock your head off! -and anyway i walked past him and he went back and he was sh moaning at her so erm two of the old boys he'd been working with said whatever's all that about? +and anyway i walked past him and he went back and he was sh moaning at her so erm two of the old boys he'd been working with said whatever's all that about? so there. i said oh another one! -i want well out of it, so course she come in got changed, so he said to me i would like you tomorrow to have a word with robin about stopping her coming down to us he said because erm it makes me feel very uncomfortable he said and we had that hassle he said it's a load of nonsense he said i've forgotten +i want well out of it, so course she come in got changed, so he said to me i would like you tomorrow to have a word with robin about stopping her coming down to us he said because erm it makes me feel very uncomfortable he said and we had that hassle he said it's a load of nonsense he said i've forgotten well i suppose it does make him feel uncomfortable. -yeah he said i've forgotten about it blue's forgotten about it he said, but she won't let it rest he said he said it's well she's a child, she's only a child geoff that's +yeah he said i've forgotten about it blue's forgotten about it he said, but she won't let it rest he said he said it's well she's a child, she's only a child geoff that's yeah. why. yeah he said i'm not having he says. @@ -74867,88 +74805,88 @@ yeah, he said from there soon. that's what he said, he said she can throw a tantrum he said and get everybody sort of feeling sorry for her he said, as and when she wants he said. well i suppose it probably wasn't tha , a complete pack of lies geoff. -yeah so he said i i want ca , robin to stop her coming down here he said. +yeah so he said i i want ca , robin to stop her coming down here he said. so you've gotta be the one who tells him. -yeah so ivan said +yeah so ivan said well i think he's right. -yeah, so ivan said to me, he said er he said well i do i suppose you have noticed he said but whenever she comes down here he said the whole line stops i said i quite agree i said well let's be honest about it if he's knocking out the meat he , it's gotta stop cos he stops +yeah, so ivan said to me, he said er he said well i do i suppose you have noticed he said but whenever she comes down here he said the whole line stops i said i quite agree i said well let's be honest about it if he's knocking out the meat he , it's gotta stop cos he stops jonathan ! he stops talking to, stops to talk to her i said and obviously if the meat isn't coming out the box, the meat isn't coming out of the box! well that's right. well that is right innit? yeah. -but she's like a child really you gotta pity her really haven't you? +but she's like a child really you gotta pity her really haven't you? yeah. -but the point is, why should other people suffer her. +but the point is, why should other people suffer her. yeah. you know, they shouldn't have to should they? no. -all that worrying! +all that worrying! terrible! my best friend's lost his father and he said well i lay awake all last night thinking about it. well i thought good god! there's nothing you can laying awake . no. -well oh he said it's at work and oh god! -well they ain't bloody paranoid isn't he? -well i wouldn't like to say he's paranoid but i said well that's like cos he said you must our house is filthy june? +well oh he said it's at work and oh god! +well they ain't bloody paranoid isn't he? +well i wouldn't like to say he's paranoid but i said well that's like cos he said you must our house is filthy june? i didn't pass comment. no. -so i said well, that's like this pete, you live the way you want to and i'll live the way i want to, i said it's immaterial to me. -your paying me to keep it a bit tidy, i said and that's what i'm paid for, i said i ain't paid to pass an opinion whether it's clean or dirty he said you sound just like me june, i said oh do i? +so i said well, that's like this pete, you live the way you want to and i'll live the way i want to, i said it's immaterial to me. +your paying me to keep it a bit tidy, i said and that's what i'm paid for, i said i ain't paid to pass an opinion whether it's clean or dirty he said you sound just like me june, i said oh do i? i said well i'm not bothered what other people do, i said they can well if he was tidy you wouldn't have a job would you? what? if he kept the place tidy, you wouldn't have a job. well i nearly said that to him, but i thought ooh no! -but, i thought to myself well that's up to him how he li , he, he lives his life. +but, i thought to myself well that's up to him how he li , he, he lives his life. yeah. i don't want my house looking like a tip! but i but he is bothered about it. yeah. -he said and that's tricia, he said she he said when i used to live on my own with simon +he said and that's tricia, he said she he said when i used to live on my own with simon yeah. -he said, and she used to come down he said she used to think i've got another woman! +he said, and she used to come down he said she used to think i've got another woman! li li whatever for! -he said cos i used to keep the house tidy he said i've been the in the army june an he said i can i can run a household he said but we and then working the shifts i do he said and go up the horses and that he said i just don't get time to do it! +he said cos i used to keep the house tidy he said i've been the in the army june an he said i can i can run a household he said but we and then working the shifts i do he said and go up the horses and that he said i just don't get time to do it! he said well you know i, i iron mostly, most of the ironing, i said yeah i know you do. whatever does she do then? -well well he said when he's not there she comes home she cooks them an evening meal but she's she she's she's got a p , he said she's gotta give some time to harriet, that's not fair +well well he said when he's not there she comes home she cooks them an evening meal but she's she she's she's got a p , he said she's gotta give some time to harriet, that's not fair yeah. -if she don't, i said well that's true i said you can't and we're not gonna neglect, which they don't. +if she don't, i said well that's true i said you can't and we're not gonna neglect, which they don't. yeah. -and then he said er by the time she's sorted out and washed up +and then he said er by the time she's sorted out and washed up yeah. and i thought, she don't wash up, she yeah. leaves it for me! yeah. -erm it's tha then getting towards and she's gone down and done the horses he sh he said it's then getting to harriet's bed time so she baths her all sorts her out and he said well she does work hard, he said and by the end of that she she won't be able to do anything else! +erm it's tha then getting towards and she's gone down and done the horses he sh he said it's then getting to harriet's bed time so she baths her all sorts her out and he said well she does work hard, he said and by the end of that she she won't be able to do anything else! no . well i said i can understand that pardon? -i i said well i suppose it's i do and he said but you work hard june, i said i know but i said kno i said what i do, i can only have hour out there and an hour inside. +i i said well i suppose it's i do and he said but you work hard june, i said i know but i said kno i said what i do, i can only have hour out there and an hour inside. yeah. -and i said i can sort of keep on top of mine, but i said i am up early. +and i said i can sort of keep on top of mine, but i said i am up early. yeah. he said well trish isn't. i said well i get up early. mm. if i'm doing like my jobs. yeah. -i said i'm, most morning i said sort of every other morning i'm ironing here at half five +i said i'm, most morning i said sort of every other morning i'm ironing here at half five yeah. i said because if i don't i can't pick up all this. yeah. cor he said, i wouldn't wanna iron that time of the morning! -i said well i'm afraid if i don't, i said, i don't do it! +i said well i'm afraid if i don't, i said, i don't do it! that's right. i said and i do i said i can't bare piles and piles of ironing. so he said well if you'd have come over this morning june you'd have fainted! so i said why? he said well there was -talking about fainting i still have my i can't standing talking about bloody ! +talking about fainting i still have my i can't standing talking about bloody ! what're you gonna now then? take this bloody car up! yep. @@ -74956,19 +74894,19 @@ and he picked up four people on his, on that, imagine your the bus driver. yeah. a man went to edinburgh yeah,then. -and picked up five people on his bus. +and picked up five people on his bus. yeah. -then he got four off in kings lynn three more got on at erm queensgate +then he got four off in kings lynn three more got on at erm queensgate yep, come on then, get your shoes on! -and a little boy nipped on to see his mum the boy never got off so he was still on the bus +and a little boy nipped on to see his mum the boy never got off so he was still on the bus yeah. so that here's your shoes. -then him and his mum got off along with the rest of the people what was the driver's name? +then him and his mum got off along with the rest of the people what was the driver's name? dunno ! your the driver! oh ! -james did that to me , me and john, i was thinking i went fred! +james did that to me , me and john, i was thinking i went fred! he goes, i didn't know your name was fred! james who? he was fighting everybody yesterday! @@ -74980,26 +74918,26 @@ yeah. he isn't having a party did he? yeah might do. oh i don't think he is at this rate na , jonathan! -no he might he's he might get a few friends and go out or . +no he might he's he might get a few friends and go out or . that ain't tight enough mate. yes it is! -right do you wanna quickly do these up? +right do you wanna quickly do these up? no. oh alright then, that's up to you. no. now look jonathan! i'll put them in the deep part. okay. -now look you've got to give that ticket back to mr otherwise you won't get a christmas dinner! +now look you've got to give that ticket back to mr otherwise you won't get a christmas dinner! oh! there it is in there, and there's ninety p , there's a pound coin in there and then i'll sort out about the dinner money with mrs . yeah. alright? -yeah go and leave it on the side for now. +yeah go and leave it on the side for now. go and what? -oh blimey . +oh blimey . why? -if he gets he will. +if he gets he will. oh blow him! do you not wanna go to ? i don't mind. @@ -75014,18 +74952,17 @@ shall i wait and think about it? yeah. go on then. bye! -be a good boy now jo learn those ! +be a good boy now jo learn those ! i will! alright, bye! bye! yeah see you! - it's gotten off of me. that good is it? now. that away. -have you come across anything think ooh we could do with a look at that? -erm no. +have you come across anything think ooh we could do with a look at that? +erm no. oh. erm okay. @@ -75046,13 +74983,13 @@ if there was an exam question which said sketch a graph of, where would the mark what would you get marks for? the axes. okay, x and y. -the points +the points which parti particular points? -points given for like co-ordinates. +points given for like co-ordinates. erm let's , if they say sketch a graph, right. i they wouldn't give you any points. -erm directions. +erm directions. or shape of the line. okay, general shape. what would be the interesting parts of the shape? @@ -75062,11 +74999,11 @@ erm . just checking it was on at a reasonable volume. -erm end or anything else that might be interesting . +erm end or anything else that might be interesting . mm. where it cross the x and y erm -what's where are the interesting points on that? -er er er there . +what's where are the interesting points on that? +er er er there . okay and these are, these are fairly interesting as well. just . what's happening in the, near the, the limits? @@ -75075,8 +75012,8 @@ so, sketching a graph is not the same as plotting one. mm. any idea what that graph would be? x squared. -erm, what would not quite the right shape what would that graph be? -y equals something plus x squared. +erm, what would not quite the right shape what would that graph be? +y equals something plus x squared. right, there'd be some x squared in it. and there might be, it would be something x squared, and there might be something x and er well there's definitely a constant mm. @@ -75085,7 +75022,7 @@ cos when x is zero still there's y has still got a value. so that's going to be minus something mm. so it's about minus three. -x squared cuts +x squared cuts the x axis in two points. two points. this one @@ -75096,7 +75033,7 @@ x cubed. so this is, there's going to be an x cubed term in here somewhere, and there might be x squared and xs and anything else, but if it cuts it three places, it's got three r three roots. so it's x cubed. what about this one? -i have to sketch curves this sort of thing. +i have to sketch curves this sort of thing. just touches. y equals x squared. something like, it's going to have an x squared in it somewhere. @@ -75105,7 +75042,7 @@ where's the x, where's the y? it's gonna be about plus three, three plus. mm. x squared. -so it'll be something like x minus three x squared. +so it'll be something like x minus three x squared. mm. if that's three. just touches. @@ -75115,7 +75052,7 @@ so x equal three or x equal three. yeah. sort that one out. erm don't forget these endpoints. -if you have something like y equals x squared plus six what would that look like, going as x goes from minus infinity through zero to plus infinity? +if you have something like y equals x squared plus six what would that look like, going as x goes from minus infinity through zero to plus infinity? what would be the interesting points on that? erm that'd be six. y would be six,. @@ -75141,18 +75078,18 @@ at minus a million. erm what would that approximate to? a million plus six. -no -do you enter a big competition, and you could win a million pounds plus six. +no +do you enter a big competition, and you could win a million pounds plus six. compared to the million pounds nobody bothers much about the six, so just a when it gets very large, y is roughly equal to x squared. -so if you know the graph of y equals x squared which unfortunately i can't draw tonight it's draw it for you, could draw it from the inside keep telling everyone else. +so if you know the graph of y equals x squared which unfortunately i can't draw tonight it's draw it for you, could draw it from the inside keep telling everyone else. right. now, there's a y equals x squared. yeah. so around here, round this bit,there won't be any difference. hmm. -around six plus six, let's say plus six in there. +around six plus six, let's say plus six in there. for, for some length, that'll be sort of almost flat, won't it? i mean mm. @@ -75165,17 +75102,17 @@ people say oh i'll take it from minus five to plus five. right? if we had something like y equals erm x minus ten. right. -times x minus erm or times ten minus x like that, okay. +times x minus erm or times ten minus x like that, okay. funny way of writing it, but you ca you could write it that way. ten x. -erm people might say oh well we'll take it from minus five to plus five. +erm people might say oh well we'll take it from minus five to plus five. yeah. and you'd get some sort of shape. but you'd miss a lot of important points. yeah. erm if they took it from minus ten to plus ten yeah. -you'd see a lot more things of interest and maybe say oh i'll take it from minus fifteen to plus fifteen. +you'd see a lot more things of interest and maybe say oh i'll take it from minus fifteen to plus fifteen. but you're still missing out a big, very important part of the graph, because for a lot of its range it actually, you know, looks something like well what would that look like? when x is gigantic. ten times. @@ -75205,7 +75142,7 @@ it's a million so one million it's a times minus one million. is? -million times +million times and what is the sign of it though? minus. it's the same @@ -75220,7 +75157,7 @@ at that point, it could be doing all sorts of weird things, and you'd think oh, mm. erm it might well look like that for that very small piece of graph, but the overall picture you've lost completely by not going far enough so you, you want minus infinity to plus infinity. when you substitute infinity in, just think well if it was about a million, what could we ignore? -i mean, you could work all this out right. +i mean, you could work all this out right. ten x plus another ten x. okay? and then minus a hundred and minus x squared, and put the millions and things in but don't need to. you've got it factorized like this, you could just, oh, that's about a million. @@ -75236,7 +75173,7 @@ mm. it was forty five degrees so you thought it was one, but the scale was two to one. yeah. the gradient is the tan of the angle, but you can only read that off the graph if you've got the same units. -same scale on the x and y. erm what would be let's say someone gave you this find an approximation for the gradient erm y equals x squared minus one. +same scale on the x and y. erm what would be let's say someone gave you this find an approximation for the gradient erm y equals x squared minus one. x squared? y equals x squared minus one, at around the point where x equals three. someone wanted to know the gradient. @@ -75248,16 +75185,16 @@ so y is three squared minus one. yeah okay. be y would equal eight. yeah. -erm so +erm so good. right, draw a sketch, cos we need to know what we're working with here. -so y could perhaps equal three. -the rest of the graph +so y could perhaps equal three. +the rest of the graph the opposite point. right. good. it's symmetrical down the y axis. -and the lowest point. +and the lowest point. it'd be about one . about one. what's the graph going to look like here, when x is very big? @@ -75272,7 +75209,7 @@ so th the minus one doesn't make a lot of difference, so as x is very, when x ge mm. you're working with millions of millions. so it looks like y equals x squared, moved up a bit, more or less, as a good approximation. -i mean a hundred is probably big enough, twenty five might be is more or less big enough. +i mean a hundred is probably big enough, twenty five might be is more or less big enough. mm. er five, say we can have five here, you can have twenty five,over here somewhere, mhm. @@ -75303,7 +75240,7 @@ maybe seventy, maybe eighty. so you could draw a rough sketch like that, mm. just measure it with a protractor, or measure along here. -that would be if we drew wh wh how do we find the gradient really? +that would be if we drew wh wh how do we find the gradient really? we draw a little triangle, don't we? yeah. so at point one, it's nought. @@ -75349,10 +75286,10 @@ point two squared. is it? two point two . can you remember the factors of a plus b times a minus b. -a squared minus a b +a squared minus a b yeah. a squared minus a b -plus plus b a. +plus plus b a. minus a b plus a b? two a b. no. @@ -75361,9 +75298,9 @@ plus a b. which cancel each other out. yeah. erm -then plus b times a m +then plus b times a m minus b squared. -minus b squared one point one squared +minus b squared one point one squared minus point nine squared. a squared minus b squared so it'll be, be one point one, plus point nine @@ -75397,25 +75334,25 @@ squared it gets smaller and smaller. so that's going to be nought point four. mm. so the gradient at that point is about two. -erm what wh where were we where did i say find the gradient? +erm what wh where were we where did i say find the gradient? where x equal to three? yeah. -sorry something wrong that. +sorry something wrong that. so we'd be, oh, okay, that's good cos you can do it. when x is three? so when x is two point nine, say. two point nine, and then y -when x one see what y is down here. +when x one see what y is down here. it was three point one. don't forget you can look at this, y equals x plus one times x minus one, which, when you see it that way tells you where it's going to, where its roots are. where it's going to cut the axes. yeah. -x so there y will be two point nine plus times two point nine minus one. +x so there y will be two point nine plus times two point nine minus one. right. which is three point nine times nought point nine, okay. -but f we can, we can, we can save that to the end because i think that was +but f we can, we can, we can save that to the end because i think that was aye. confusing probably wasn't it? when we're doing it this way, we can forget about the, with this x, x two is going to be three point one squared @@ -75432,7 +75369,7 @@ mm. which will come to, if we add them it's six times nought point two. the gradient will be one point two. that's a bit better because a gradient of one is forty five degrees and we s we said it should be more than that. -erm one point two. +erm one point two. find out which ang what angle has a tan of one point two. tan minus one . one point two. @@ -75442,16 +75379,16 @@ so you were, you were closer to seventy. you see how hard it is to see just from the graph, from a, from mm. a sketch, if you plotted it on paper, but this is without plotting it, we're getting it quite accurately. -erm maybe someone says it could be useful for you to try it again, without any help from this page at all. +erm maybe someone says it could be useful for you to try it again, without any help from this page at all. so we've got y equals x squared, minus one. and we want the gradient at the point where x equals three. but we want to get very very close to it, like only nought point nought one before it and nought point nought one after it. so what value would ? around the point where x is three. -erm so you'd need nought in the middle. +erm so you'd need nought in the middle. no, i'm not thinking of drawing a sketch at the moment, we've done the sketch on the other page ah. -and we're just thinking of what value are we going to, what would be the value of x point nought one before three? +and we're just thinking of what value are we going to, what would be the value of x point nought one before three? er two point nine nine. okay. two point nine nine would be one of them. @@ -75461,20 +75398,20 @@ right. right? and in between would be three. between would be three. -up one that, we'll just take . +up one that, we'll just take . what will y be when x is that? erm two point nine nine squared minus one. okay. so you'd just write it as, i mean as it's minus one, you can take it off as you go along, but it's, sometimes it'll be a minus six or something, so write it as two point nine nine squared minus one. -erm three squared minus one. +erm three squared minus one. okay. now subtract -when you have to +when you have to that y from that one. okay. -it's two point nine nine plus three point +it's two point nine nine plus three point mm. -oh oh, yeah, don't, don't do it all in your head. +oh oh, yeah, don't, don't do it all in your head. okay. do the first stage first. take that expression away from that, and once you're left, what happens to the minus ones? @@ -75489,7 +75426,7 @@ now we'll just take the that, three point nought one, minus right, so it's three point nought one squared, -minus the two point nine minus +minus the two point nine minus erm what was the difference in the xs? point nought one. @@ -75497,7 +75434,7 @@ point nought two. point nought two sorry . so we put that underneath, on the bottom half of the fraction. okay. -that's, that's now when you've got an a squared minus b squared, you can factorize that i mean you could just do that on your calculator, and do it in one go, but it's quite easy to do it as three point o one. +that's, that's now when you've got an a squared minus b squared, you can factorize that i mean you could just do that on your calculator, and do it in one go, but it's quite easy to do it as three point o one. a plus b, times a minus b. okay? so three point nought one plus two point nine is point nought two. no sorry, is five point six. @@ -75506,7 +75443,7 @@ and the the top is six. six. times. -times three point nought one minus two point nine nine , which is point two. +times three point nought one minus two point nine nine , which is point two. equals six point oh two. now work out what it's equal to. @@ -75521,10 +75458,10 @@ six. six. so the gradient six . -wh when you do it to sort of fairly accurately like that, it six. +wh when you do it to sort of fairly accurately like that, it six. when we did it fairly roughly, it came to one point two? yeah. -erm six because, because we didn't do this bit did we? +erm six because, because we didn't do this bit did we? that should have gone i think that was wrong. that should have been six times nought point two over minu @@ -75546,12 +75483,12 @@ that's a very good approximation. yeah. so gradients are a very important part of, of sketching a curve. erm you already pointed out some of the important points where the gradient gets to zero. -erm does, does things that might be interesting? +erm does, does things that might be interesting? okay. you've already mentioned it earlier, actually, symmetry. not always symmetrical about this axis. they might be symmetrical about here or here. -or it this way round. +or it this way round. what's that? what's that? that's a . @@ -75561,11 +75498,11 @@ what gives you that? well, what does that look like from the way you're looking at it? s the way you're looking at it, it looks something like erm y equals x to -x +x the fourth plus three or something. mm. good. -so looking at it this way up i mean it's x equals y to the fourth plus three and that's all minus. +so looking at it this way up i mean it's x equals y to the fourth plus three and that's all minus. mm. x x equals three minus y to the fourth. it's a funny way of putting it. @@ -75575,13 +75512,13 @@ er if someone says that's not good enough, i want it in terms of y equals well okay we'll have to bring the three over to this side, and take the fourth root,. but you can always swap the axes, if you don't like what they give you. mm. -so if, if i say draw erm y equals the square root of x, and you think i haven't got a clue what that looks like. +so if, if i say draw erm y equals the square root of x, and you think i haven't got a clue what that looks like. you can square both sides. -you can draw y squared equals x, and all you have to do is say well, i can draw the other way round. +you can draw y squared equals x, and all you have to do is say well, i can draw the other way round. mm. y equals x squared. you draw your y equals x squared,turn the paper round that way, and whichever way, i'm going to draw y equals x squared. -and erm y equals x squared, and that's y and that's an x. then turn it the other way up to get x equals y squared, and now that's the y and this is the x. +and erm y equals x squared, and that's y and that's an x. then turn it the other way up to get x equals y squared, and now that's the y and this is the x. and this is a, should have drawn it that way round, mm. to get the, the x squared, this would be the minus x squared. @@ -75598,21 +75535,21 @@ sketching and plotting? there's the revision . . have you done every one? -every question twice three times? +every question twice three times? four, even. oh, that's too many. no actually, oh you'll have to oh i'm sorry, i'll go back to three . you'll have to do them all you'll have to undo -do them or something. +do them or something. that's it. do them all backwards, yes. i haven't got it with me. mhm. yeah. okay. -so you've been sketching them? +so you've been sketching them? yeah. and plotting them? mm. @@ -75649,7 +75586,7 @@ this is displacement, which is the distance from a fixed position. come from that way. bit of negative time in there. what's happening there then? -well it's speeding up to there accelerating and it's +well it's speeding up to there accelerating and it's mhm. it's speeding up again. what's happened? @@ -75663,10 +75600,10 @@ if i got the intervals right they'd be the same. so every one second, it's gone another ten metres or so. yeah. gradient is the same all the time. -ah, so it's just steady +ah, so it's just steady fixed constant speed, constant speed. -how about have a bit so that bit -erm don't know. +how about have a bit so that bit +erm don't know. mm. s i'd say that's ten metres or something. where are you after one second? @@ -75689,13 +75626,13 @@ yeah. not moving. so that's a steady speed. and it stops. -that's, it changes abruptly. +that's, it changes abruptly. from a steady speed. it doesn't need to brake or does it just? mm. if it's a physical body, to change speed, it'll have to have to brake. and the s what would, so, that's a fixed speed. -there's another str another straight line . +there's another str another straight line . there's another straight line, another fixed speed. which one is faster? every one second,ten metres. @@ -75720,7 +75657,7 @@ in a very short space of time then, but then carries on. very short space of time it's gone quite a distance. so that was a, that is at, that constant speed there is much faster than, than this one. and then, it's stationary -it's +it's for a while. and then just goes down there. @@ -75746,7 +75683,7 @@ most graphs will keep going on up, and there's a tendency for people to make the mm. or at least to where they started. that means it's going backwards. -erm now you don't do, paper three, you don't do velocity time graphs, but you probably do them in physics don't you? +erm now you don't do, paper three, you don't do velocity time graphs, but you probably do them in physics don't you? you would do them in physics. it's just like pure coincidence. aha! @@ -75764,41 +75701,41 @@ yeah, because i mean it had them in our exam, right. in our mock, we had like those four pictures, and you had to say which was it comes up time and time again, and you have to know the difference between the different types. -so you also, when you get used to each type individually, need to then be able to switch between +so you also, when you get used to each type individually, need to then be able to switch between mm. between one and the other. yeah. -so if we've got erm acceleration against time and we get, no, no peeping. +so if we've got erm acceleration against time and we get, no, no peeping. no peeping. we get a flat one, what does that mean? -it's every one second, you've gone further. +it's every one second, you've gone further. we haven't gone anywhere we've measured the acceleration. the acceleration there is say forwards. -one two +one two and for every one second, you're going forty metres per second. so you're going at a steady speed. per second. it's, it's a, it's an acceleration, it's metres second to the minus two. now are you happy with that, because most people aren't? okay. -we'll come back to that in a minute, but let's say a rocket, or a car, which would you prefer that do? +we'll come back to that in a minute, but let's say a rocket, or a car, which would you prefer that do? car. car. constant acceleration car. -erm no frictional resis resistance, you just put your foot down and it's, you know where a car accelerates from rest +erm no frictional resis resistance, you just put your foot down and it's, you know where a car accelerates from rest mm. and then after a while the acceleration reduces? the speed is still going up, the acceleration, and eventually it reaches a top speed and it stays there. mm. okay, it's zero acceleration, it's not getting any faster. mm. -erm how would we measure that? +erm how would we measure that? a constant acceleration. say we had an accelerometer. an acceleration measurer. mm. -which force on a weight or something can feel acceleration, i think you can, my son said you can't but i think you can +which force on a weight or something can feel acceleration, i think you can, my son said you can't but i think you can so, acceleration is a constant. what's your eventual top speed? it just, just keeps going faster and faster and faster and faster @@ -75816,8 +75753,8 @@ measure acceleration. there's a car, and we want to know its acceleration between two points. doesn't matter. there's your car. -erm you start the stopwatch. -er stopwatch you m you time it from there to the ten metre. +erm you start the stopwatch. +er stopwatch you m you time it from there to the ten metre. erm what's along your x axis? your independent variable? time. @@ -75834,7 +75771,7 @@ make it one second. alright, make it ten. sorry,, make it ten seconds. plus one second. -then the you have to have y how far the car has travelled, +then the you have to have y how far the car has travelled, do you? know how quickly. what is acceleration? @@ -75857,7 +75794,7 @@ mm. because that's what you need for overtaking someone. you can go from forty to sixty in point three seconds or something, you can really shoot past anything on the road. so forty to sixty, miles per hour, metres per second, whatever you like, let's say metres per second. -let's say it goes from forty to si forty metres per second to sixty metres per second in ten seconds. +let's say it goes from forty to si forty metres per second to sixty metres per second in ten seconds. more of a slug, this car. so what would that acceleration be? how w what would the units of acceleration be? @@ -75865,11 +75802,11 @@ twenty metres per second per second. twenty metres per second, per second. per second. it's simpler to say per second per second . -it's or per second squared, or second to the minus two. +it's or per second squared, or second to the minus two. what is this rubbish, it doesn't, doesn't, cannot possibly mean anything real. mm. well, it is real. -it's erm fifty miles per hour per hour. +it's erm fifty miles per hour per hour. yeah. right well we'd normally say, miles per hour per second. what's, what's your acceleration at the moment? @@ -75898,7 +75835,7 @@ are you a bit happier with that? yeah. but not totally convinced. no . -erm that length per time per time, is the unit. +erm that length per time per time, is the unit. let's just have a little look. what are the units of displacement? er @@ -75906,7 +75843,7 @@ what's the difference between displacement and distance? displacement is how fast it's going, the speed. miles per hour. show me something that is erm arm's length away from, from your right shoulder. -okay, show me something else that's an arm's length from that's your right shoulder isn't it. +okay, show me something else that's an arm's length from that's your right shoulder isn't it. arm's length . i was expecting you to go like this. right, okay, that, show me something else that's arm's length from your right shoulder. @@ -75938,11 +75875,11 @@ you know ben lech?hill, red hill going down to ? i was young and foolish at the time, fifty miles an hour on a bike ? very, very high gear on it, we used to go out a couple of us -and er we were passing this m +and er we were passing this m you've got this on tape remember? oh no! we went past this bloke in a morris minor, -a convertible, with a eyes streaming, it was really hard to see, and clocked his speed at fifty, and er the bloke behind me nearly got hit,because when i went past this bloke i went +a convertible, with a eyes streaming, it was really hard to see, and clocked his speed at fifty, and er the bloke behind me nearly got hit,because when i went past this bloke i went all over the road. no you didn't really though did you? ooh no. @@ -75953,7 +75890,7 @@ yeah. and displacement. when they measure your speed, they're measuring your velocity really, they're measuring it in a particular direction, along that road. mm. -erm so we'll call it distance, right? +erm so we'll call it distance, right? but we're actually talking about displacement, just so that you feel more comfortable with it, cos there are other things coming up to make you feel less comfortable you see. okay. so the police say you were doing forty miles an hour. @@ -75963,9 +75900,9 @@ they say, ah well, we followed you for a tenth of a mile, right, and it took you and we, our little machine here has calculated it that that's forty miles an hour. yeah. okay, so what did they do? -they had your hundred a hundredth of a mile say, let's say it's erm let's say it was a tenth of a mile. +they had your hundred a hundredth of a mile say, let's say it's erm let's say it was a tenth of a mile. nought point one miles. -and they divided that by erm nought point o +and they divided that by erm nought point o hours. mhm. right? @@ -75974,11 +75911,11 @@ hours. so what speed is that? er have a guess at it then check it on your calculator. -point one divided by point zero one . -will the two first cancel out? +point one divided by point zero one . +will the two first cancel out? do they? no. -if i gave you this tenth, hundredth, thousandth okay? +if i gave you this tenth, hundredth, thousandth okay? what would you do? run. that's hours. @@ -75989,7 +75926,7 @@ so you've got one over one hundredth. so that's a bit tricky that, doing it that way, you've got one over one hundredth . the, the easy way, do you like fractions on the bottom of fractions? no. -oh, times by ah. +oh, times by ah. what are you going to times it by? times that by ten over one. no, times that by a thousand over one. @@ -76000,14 +75937,14 @@ you've got to times that by a thousand. okay? it's been at the playhouse in past years though. oh, well maybe. -no, it wasn't, wasn't at last year was it? +no, it wasn't, wasn't at last year was it? was it? well last year i did it at latton bush . well what, what's the date?. the seventh. the seventh of march. erm, so that's going to be before our next meeting isn't it? -so erm, if anybody wants to help contact me . +so erm, if anybody wants to help contact me . yes, what time, how much is, how much the day is it all day? i haven't any details either than what she said . no . @@ -76029,7 +75966,7 @@ yeah. tee-shirts and er sweat shirts and all sorts of things so we can take them along, so that's, that's saturday the m , seventh of march, if you think you can help at all see avriel afterwards. have you got a date? yeah, got a couple. -anything you we got some of those things, tell me, i'll bring it along . +anything you we got some of those things, tell me, i'll bring it along . mm, yeah,. right any other future events that ought to be mentioned. erm, i suppose i don't know whether we ought, whether we should mention it here, erm, the, the national a g m is a future event really isn't it? @@ -76055,7 +75992,7 @@ well i think who's, who's thinking of going? i, i, i've booked, erm oh. -out comes yeah, so . +out comes yeah, so . you thinking of going erm yeah i eh peter? @@ -76071,7 +76008,7 @@ anybody else thinking of going? any other offers? cos, cos you're going by car are you or? i'll, i'll drive yeah, so there are three seats spare in my car, vehicle. -so that you plymouth . +so that you plymouth . instead of writing a check, send the cheque . if you can stand the strain of the noise and diesel engine all that way. . @@ -76091,8 +76028,8 @@ no. it's motorway all the way. erm, anybody else interested for it, you said not didn't you. it's not to late to book i think it says something about surcharge after sixth of march or something on the form doesn't it? -we'll make it . -i don't think she was in no. +we'll make it . +i don't think she was in no. . right, does saria had a form, she must cos you said she's booked, peter have you g , peter you've got forms have you? don't think she has got a form, no, alma have you got any spare forms for that. @@ -76107,13 +76044,13 @@ erm. i think er, i guess that any individual members would get them in their, erm journal. yes. i might, i might, yes, we, i, well, i'll, looks like it . -i'm an individual member, perhaps i've done, got round to opening the . -i'm not sure, i'm not sure, they, they have been there . +i'm an individual member, perhaps i've done, got round to opening the . +i'm not sure, i'm not sure, they, they have been there . that's possible . . quite happy you know telephone them to send on ah, right, well, we'll just check, yeah. -cos that's when, when, when we get to that nearer the date, we could, we could just, you know, when you're confirmed that you've been booked and you're definitely going, erm we could look at the finances and see how much we could afford to, to give, erm, something to each person to help with,eit either with the accommodation or, or the transport. +cos that's when, when, when we get to that nearer the date, we could, we could just, you know, when you're confirmed that you've been booked and you're definitely going, erm we could look at the finances and see how much we could afford to, to give, erm, something to each person to help with,eit either with the accommodation or, or the transport. mm. cos the accommodation is quite a bit, isn't it? it's fifty , sixty or more, probably more this time. @@ -76133,7 +76070,7 @@ erm, say anything about that? well it's not sort of place you can get it to, before, before breakfast is it, so er, no. mm. it's not, we, we have sometimes gone very early on a saturday morning to places like nottingham, but, it's not too far for that. -right, well that's good, erm, and, so in, in relation to the a g m erm we did, we were asked about putting in motion's erm, are you having to leave the one about the press after what john said? +right, well that's good, erm, and, so in, in relation to the a g m erm we did, we were asked about putting in motion's erm, are you having to leave the one about the press after what john said? how do you feel?. one, what, one that we erm, one, yes, yes, but as a group why don't we review having another prisoner when we got when we got, when we got the next one yes certainly. @@ -76150,10 +76087,10 @@ got to be ready tonight, if they're to get it. no. right, erm, so, i think, i think, as far as future events that's all what we need to mention? now, erm rose is secretary and she's had things through from er british section headquarters and she'll tell us what she's got there. -erm i don't know if this one concerns us, it's about er, a working group for children, do we have, we don't have a working group for children . -no, we've never been very close to the now. +erm i don't know if this one concerns us, it's about er, a working group for children, do we have, we don't have a working group for children . +no, we've never been very close to the now. i won't obviously . -erm, i've also received information from the region, erm with lots of events that's coming up in the east anglian region, erm, just run through those quickly, er, there is a workshop on this thursday at the courts , erm, there is on thursday twelfth of march there is er, somebody from the columbian committee for human rights speaking at an open meeting, that's the fifth er, wednesday first of april there is er somebody called duncan , he's a paediatric surgeon who works part time as a volunteer at the medical foundation for the care and victims of torture who will be speaking at st. mary's and st. edmunds group, and that, that's bury st. edmunds, and then the next east anglia regional meeting is on saturday may the twenty third at bury st. edmunds again. +erm, i've also received information from the region, erm with lots of events that's coming up in the east anglian region, erm, just run through those quickly, er, there is a workshop on this thursday at the courts , erm, there is on thursday twelfth of march there is er, somebody from the columbian committee for human rights speaking at an open meeting, that's the fifth er, wednesday first of april there is er somebody called duncan , he's a paediatric surgeon who works part time as a volunteer at the medical foundation for the care and victims of torture who will be speaking at st. mary's and st. edmunds group, and that, that's bury st. edmunds, and then the next east anglia regional meeting is on saturday may the twenty third at bury st. edmunds again. may twenty third? yeah may the twenty third, it's a saturday two to five pm at the friends' meeting house, bury. bank holiday weekend isn't it? @@ -76176,7 +76113,7 @@ okay, well i'll, i put some information not full details . right. erm, actually there wasn't a lot of detailed stuff, there was erm, materials for gr groups and winter sales do you want to pass that over to aida please? -which we have a erm, there's a bit about release policy and procedures for local groups, er, groups can help their prisoner with mummy or other erm relief, erm on the christmas family particularly and it's, it's explaining you know how they do it and the best ways to go about it. +which we have a erm, there's a bit about release policy and procedures for local groups, er, groups can help their prisoner with mummy or other erm relief, erm on the christmas family particularly and it's, it's explaining you know how they do it and the best ways to go about it. mm, cos there's a special fund available for that, that's particularly why they anyway they explain all about it, if it would, if we need it. er, there's a mandate workshop. @@ -76185,21 +76122,21 @@ i'm the trainer. you're the trainer, oh well . i've been very bad on this recently, i've really been too busy or tired, but i have got, i have, today i have had arrived oh not today, the last few days, the new mandate workshop, so so you've got to read through it and let . -i was gonna say, having spent some months or years well . +i was gonna say, having spent some months or years well . it's all the new bits in about it, yes mind you, there's always, always been a mandate, the mandate workshop was the very first one that's produced, but this is an updated version and changes . yeah, have there always been workshops , continue workshops on mandate or? yes, there's always been a mandate workshop? -or just when there reviews? +or just when there reviews? no, there's always been a mandate workshop, explaining why, you know, what our mandate is . you, you did give once to a group a few years ago. yes, i've done the mandate workshop, yes, and i've done it with other groups too. mm. so you've covered a bigger region in the past, not just stortford. -i, i have about five or six groups, i can, i can go and give talks . -so even if we don't call on you to, do it, you won't be called . +i, i have about five or six groups, i can, i can go and give talks . +so even if we don't call on you to, do it, you won't be called . and i have a lobby workshop too. -amnesty's mandate what, what the don't do, or do do. -will there be any erm talking about lobbying, be in, in erm before and er . +amnesty's mandate what, what the don't do, or do do. +will there be any erm talking about lobbying, be in, in erm before and er . i don't know . done any . . @@ -76208,10 +76145,10 @@ so the er lobbying workshops is the that's why they're being cancelled epping forest and redbridge are doing, erm, they've got some lobbying workshops mm, presuming it's got that in mind -yeah, i mean he is . +yeah, i mean he is . . -lobbying workshops would be that combined, erm there is er, a one page journalist leaflet which we can order a pound for a hundred, that's it, that's all our journalist friends . -, yes that's , erm yeah, i, last month i received the er, this booklet on the trade and they seemed to be coming out to doing campaign on erm a collection between british training and goods, er and their use abroad erm, and they now, they've got a, a booking form for a fringe meeting at the a g m, if anyone's particularly interested attending. +lobbying workshops would be that combined, erm there is er, a one page journalist leaflet which we can order a pound for a hundred, that's it, that's all our journalist friends . +, yes that's , erm yeah, i, last month i received the er, this booklet on the trade and they seemed to be coming out to doing campaign on erm a collection between british training and goods, er and their use abroad erm, and they now, they've got a, a booking form for a fringe meeting at the a g m, if anyone's particularly interested attending. shall i pass, shall we pass this one . . yes, the report on this, this book. @@ -76224,29 +76161,29 @@ it's called the m s p, the military security police, mm. security . i could, seems to though they're getting stronger on this than . -mm, it's come to the front of the journal hasn't it section +mm, it's come to the front of the journal hasn't it section yeah. mm. -one, one er stress in my, on what happens so that, that it's companying it's been manufacturing leg irons that's been going out there to the nile, hasn't it, wasn't it to . +one, one er stress in my, on what happens so that, that it's companying it's been manufacturing leg irons that's been going out there to the nile, hasn't it, wasn't it to . they didn't mention , they'd mentioned somewhere else, but erm somewhere. i think it was central america wasn't it? wasn't it saudi?. no. saudi they had some sort of electronic torture chamber -thing electric was -oh yeah, the erm, the house of or something. +thing electric was +oh yeah, the erm, the house of or something. yeah. -wasn't one of the chair was, though the man held up, held arms was it? -he wasn't an, i think he was . +wasn't one of the chair was, though the man held up, held arms was it? +he wasn't an, i think he was . oh, perhaps erm got a number of . yes, mm, one wonders what a british company are doing manufacturing leg irons anyway in the twentieth century . -no when you get to, when you get to the magazine, i'll see on the front cover . +no when you get to, when you get to the magazine, i'll see on the front cover . yeah. -it's not it's very . +it's not it's very . right, anything else from headquarters? -erm, i know there's a world conference at the assembly, central hall, westminster, twenty second of february. +erm, i know there's a world conference at the assembly, central hall, westminster, twenty second of february. it's bury st. edmunds interest in asian we generally go if we've got an asian prisoner, we haven't, perhaps it's of opinion . sorry i missed that, asian week. as @@ -76259,9 +76196,9 @@ er this is erm, er this is the spring, can't read out what it is, the spring, th . and they, the first prize is a thousand pounds cash, second prize family holiday cottage in the isle of mule and third prize holiday cottage in norfolk and fourth prize holiday apartment in cumbria and the, i mean the idea is you take a book and try, if you have a place of work or, or friends that will buy raffle tickets er just try and sell them and er, how much are they? er fifty pence each. -fifty pence each, right, erm, and er fill in the slips and either bring them back to us or send them off yourself to headquarters, shall i put, i'll put those out for anybody who feel they could sell them, it all, it all helps to raise money for amnesty and helps to get them erm spend the money on the new prisoner's. -yeah, i have a complimentary copy of new internationalist i'm not quite sure why they sent them, but -it's on, it's on the right . +fifty pence each, right, erm, and er fill in the slips and either bring them back to us or send them off yourself to headquarters, shall i put, i'll put those out for anybody who feel they could sell them, it all, it all helps to raise money for amnesty and helps to get them erm spend the money on the new prisoner's. +yeah, i have a complimentary copy of new internationalist i'm not quite sure why they sent them, but +it's on, it's on the right . yes , it's, it's got stuff that we could use that's all. mm. er, the news letters we get, monthly news letter for groups, er, this one, which is all about what different groups in britain are doing, can give you ideas . @@ -76281,7 +76218,7 @@ erm, and then if anyone wants to look at these, look at the er ninety one annual haven't seen them. and these booklets that are . has that recently become ninety one, one? -no, we had these two meetings ago, but i bring it with me on meetings for anyone who's . +no, we had these two meetings ago, but i bring it with me on meetings for anyone who's . yes, and people should tell you if they take it,mm, mm. okay, that's all. right, very good, that's all from headquarters, right then we move on to then any other business, erm i think mainly it's just the odd verse with arrangements for next meeting, because our next meeting is our own a g m, erm, at, which we erm elect our officers for the next year, er, and there are, are other arrangements to make, erm we sometimes put a little form don't we on the end of the minutes that, people to fill in if they wish to nominate someone, i think we should do that even though very, very rarely gets actually filled in, erm, and we have some post which we have elections for others where we can phone the people who are doing those jobs and, and hope they'll carry on. @@ -76292,15 +76229,15 @@ yeah, we don't, we don't seem to have a vice chairman, looking at last years perhaps, perhaps, perhaps it was because of that we didn't have it, and the treasurer and the secretary are officially erm, and we do have constitution don't we now of course, so we can look at the constitution and see what it says . erm, i think what those post were, were erm elected and then the -means we've got to produce . +means we've got to produce . . -right, we, we, we did actually draw, or we not draw, we, we adopted a constitution during the year and the officers that are erm elected are the chair, the secretary and the treasurer, erm and other, together with other such officers, yeah to to determine by general meeting, erm, so it's really only those three, er and we have sometimes had advice chair if there's only been one chairman haven't we, one chair person erm so i think people need to say if they don't wish to carry on the jobs they're doing and if anybody wishes to nominate anyone in a particular post then slip at the bottom of the minutes could be filled in and either brought to meeting or sent back to the secretary. +right, we, we, we did actually draw, or we not draw, we, we adopted a constitution during the year and the officers that are erm elected are the chair, the secretary and the treasurer, erm and other, together with other such officers, yeah to to determine by general meeting, erm, so it's really only those three, er and we have sometimes had advice chair if there's only been one chairman haven't we, one chair person erm so i think people need to say if they don't wish to carry on the jobs they're doing and if anybody wishes to nominate anyone in a particular post then slip at the bottom of the minutes could be filled in and either brought to meeting or sent back to the secretary. erm, i think i will give up being chair this time, i've done it too long, too long, and i've had it john as co-chair during the year and i hope that he'll be able to carry on as, as chair person, i think really i've done it, done it for long enough erm, and we'll have to ask, we hope, we hope the treasurer just taken over will carry on . erm, and if anybody else has any other post they, they're interesting in doing in taking on or, or would like to help with that could be said as well couldn't it? well are we then not going to have another co-chair? well it depends how you want to deal with it, i mean erm, this, the, the, the i think it was just my idea last year of, of sort of erm sharing some of the load i think at that point and hoping that someone could perhaps take over, erm, this just says the following should be elected, a, chair, b, secretary and c, treasurer, but erm -well, i, will, you know, i mean, will carry on as chairman, but i, i'd welcome competition in the post if anyone's interested +well, i, will, you know, i mean, will carry on as chairman, but i, i'd welcome competition in the post if anyone's interested . but, it's unfair saying that i erm, i,continue in my inefficient way if you're all willing to put up with me. i think if, if you are going to be the only chair person then there should be a, there, there should be a, a deputy so if you're not able to take the chair, there is somebody else . @@ -76309,7 +76246,7 @@ somebody could perhaps sat and perhaps that's that's a good idea . that, that person ought to be elected as well. mm, what under, that'll be a what vice chairman or -well was to be chairman, was to be vice chair now under these this new . +well was to be chairman, was to be vice chair now under these this new . is it in the constitution? it isn't in the constitution, no. no it isn't is it? @@ -76325,7 +76262,7 @@ well i think, we'll, we'll see what, we'll see what comes, if somebody else wish erm, erm, only too willing to welcome competition cos they're all to aware of my short comings, mm. mm. erm, so. -well, if, if there isn't anybody else who wishes to compete with you for the chair, er, then i think there ought to be a vice chair. +well, if, if there isn't anybody else who wishes to compete with you for the chair, er, then i think there ought to be a vice chair. yeah. right. now the other thing about, about the meeting is erm, we sometimes arrange for sort of special refreshments or something different in that line, it's at ann's house, erm do you want, do you want us to do anything about that ann or? @@ -76344,7 +76281,7 @@ cheese cheese and biscuits, she's saying. what do, do you want help with that ann, would you like people to bring some or, or, or what? . -mm, well confir you can confirm with mary, i think mary's offer to possibly. +mm, well confir you can confirm with mary, i think mary's offer to possibly. shall i, shall i leave you and mary to sort that out? okay. between you, mm, mm. @@ -76361,7 +76298,7 @@ right. tenth of march. tenth of march. where's that then? -that'll be at erm ann i've forgotten your number . +that'll be at erm ann i've forgotten your number . . that's fine, what's the address? oh sorry , ninety four. @@ -76371,7 +76308,7 @@ oh yeah. yeah.. get rid of that on tape, yeah,we won't be transcribed. why you writing it down for? -so, that the next meeting. +so, that the next meeting. right, that's, good, that's it , without, without your tape recorder. . right, erm, so, now that's, that's er the a g m, now erm, any other business? @@ -76380,21 +76317,21 @@ right, let see, erm, er, who's got their notes? ann, did you say yes? i said yes. right, ann, you gonna start? -well, this, i told you about this french boy that phoned, that contacted me, he's erm,my name is , i'm nineteen, i'm a student at harlow college, i'm studying english foreign language and law a level, if there's an amnesty international i would like to set up a group in the college i hope you're involved in local groups are writing you to receive about me,and information about the local group . -so i well i sent him er our sheets, er sheet about the group and the minutes and er i contacted michael er, who said he'll be very happy to help in, so i er phoned up this chap and said, gave him michael's number and said erm he'd like to come to this meeting tonight, he said yes, so i went to pick him up and i just couldn't find that blinking house, anyone who knows harlow, he's in parsonage leys, i just couldn't find the number it was , i just couldn't find anything less than thirty seven +well, this, i told you about this french boy that phoned, that contacted me, he's erm,my name is , i'm nineteen, i'm a student at harlow college, i'm studying english foreign language and law a level, if there's an amnesty international i would like to set up a group in the college i hope you're involved in local groups are writing you to receive about me,and information about the local group . +so i well i sent him er our sheets, er sheet about the group and the minutes and er i contacted michael er, who said he'll be very happy to help in, so i er phoned up this chap and said, gave him michael's number and said erm he'd like to come to this meeting tonight, he said yes, so i went to pick him up and i just couldn't find that blinking house, anyone who knows harlow, he's in parsonage leys, i just couldn't find the number it was , i just couldn't find anything less than thirty seven . -and i had, got pick up two so i, i just had to give up, i phoned him up when i got here, apologise, he hasn't been in touch with michael yet, i don't know why not, er, though why, er sorry +and i had, got pick up two so i, i just had to give up, i phoned him up when i got here, apologise, he hasn't been in touch with michael yet, i don't know why not, er, though why, er sorry erm, there used to be . sorry, there used to be a group at the college i think. yes, yes. well there used to be that's right,with you john,talking about college group just about that time . -erm yes and it's, it's funny thing i haven't sent things to the college with, with the other stuff that went out, but, er we have, i have spoken to michael about college, yeah i mean . +erm yes and it's, it's funny thing i haven't sent things to the college with, with the other stuff that went out, but, er we have, i have spoken to michael about college, yeah i mean . so we didn't, yeah well if we've got someone's who's interested in starting a group, that's the time which to start, we did, yeah, but there was a group, er previous thing but i think that, there was one girl who was very er keen, but i think when she left it probably lapsed. mm, but. yeah, yeah, i did, did discuss it with michael, i'd forgotten that, i just remembered now . maybe, maybe i don't know if he's shy or anything, why he hasn't phoned up michael yet, perhaps i ought to ask michael to phone him then, he does , yes. -maybe, yes , we have, we have approved school or er student group officer so we should perhaps let him you know, perhaps we should, perhaps we should come back to him or michael could. +maybe, yes , we have, we have approved school or er student group officer so we should perhaps let him you know, perhaps we should, perhaps we should come back to him or michael could. mm. well, shouldn't, shall i should imagine, mm. @@ -76412,23 +76349,23 @@ he's only there till the summer, by the way. yes, well perhaps we could get it going quickly then . right, erm, now, er, do you want to say something? -i did, yes, erm, when erm, we thought our prisoner was finished the co-ordinators wrote to me and said would i be interested, would our group be interested in erm, writing to yugoslavia's still, because with the civil war going on there's lots of cases coming up, for example there was a whole hospital full of patients that were taken prisoner i don't know if they were actually physically removed or whether they were held in the hospital without access to medical treatment for something like ten days, and erm, saria did say she'd help me last time and i wrote back and said yes, two of us could write once a month, well they're taken that very liberally and, and, got two or three things from the already and erm, if anyone else is interested in writing an odd letter say once a month to yugoslavia maybe they could erm, let me know later on.. +i did, yes, erm, when erm, we thought our prisoner was finished the co-ordinators wrote to me and said would i be interested, would our group be interested in erm, writing to yugoslavia's still, because with the civil war going on there's lots of cases coming up, for example there was a whole hospital full of patients that were taken prisoner i don't know if they were actually physically removed or whether they were held in the hospital without access to medical treatment for something like ten days, and erm, saria did say she'd help me last time and i wrote back and said yes, two of us could write once a month, well they're taken that very liberally and, and, got two or three things from the already and erm, if anyone else is interested in writing an odd letter say once a month to yugoslavia maybe they could erm, let me know later on.. good, that's fine, right, any other business? shall we have just a quick lisa and dean want to tell us what's going, cos they've had you, had the first meeting now, haven't you? do you want to tell us what interest there was. i, i was about to ask the same thing, yeah . -are you going to,interest . +are you going to,interest . well i called a meeting but i didn't think i advertised it well enough because there was a lot of interest and then i think we held it at the wrong time as well didn't we, mm. -we held it after prep, so we've organised another one for tomorrow lunch time and erm and lot more people express interest because of that, we haven't actually got any letters yet. -no, that's so when we leave there should be more interest. +we held it after prep, so we've organised another one for tomorrow lunch time and erm and lot more people express interest because of that, we haven't actually got any letters yet. +no, that's so when we leave there should be more interest. mm, mm, good, good. and i'm intending to, to hold a few more assemblies as well to sort of get interest going again because it's been a while since we did an assembly on it, so if we do another one, that usually gets it going again doesn't it? what you run assembly's with on, particular topic then. -yeah , well we'll take erm michael gave us say erm a, an assembly sheet didn't he and we just read from that, and that got a lot of interest from that. +yeah , well we'll take erm michael gave us say erm a, an assembly sheet didn't he and we just read from that, and that got a lot of interest from that. yeah mm, good -how many teams were suppose to meet out of that? +how many teams were suppose to meet out of that? it was about twelve people. how many is that? . @@ -76449,7 +76386,7 @@ yeah. are you, you keen to keep in touch keep, keep coming to the meetings or? yeah, mm, mm. yeah. -you found it's contact, yeah, good, erm +you found it's contact, yeah, good, erm right, now, erm smashing. anything else you want to bring up? @@ -76465,7 +76402,7 @@ you know when we did that . yeah, i think i do, yeah birchwood . that was margaret dane, what it was, yes. yeah. -the name of the person is linda er +the name of the person is linda er what, what, was it a request for a speaker? yeah. yeah, right why have they sent that to you? @@ -76479,7 +76416,7 @@ linda . mm, i've got a mr, head of humanities mr i . there we go, so who, who is, this person is i don't know, that's their name i have now, that's a . yeah,. -so that'll be a speaker day . +so that'll be a speaker day . okay. . will, will you follow that up? @@ -76489,7 +76426,7 @@ erm, birchwood high school. no, the, the, i've got all that linda linda , yeah. -yes, it'll be worth following that up, cos that's, that's one of the erm, they, they've done quite a lot of work of amnesty and general studies in the past, there was a sheet of sort of quotes of, how good the amnesty was, and there was one from the teacher at birchwood or what, what's margaret dane school, so erm, yes, if, if you could definitely follow that up erm john +yes, it'll be worth following that up, cos that's, that's one of the erm, they, they've done quite a lot of work of amnesty and general studies in the past, there was a sheet of sort of quotes of, how good the amnesty was, and there was one from the teacher at birchwood or what, what's margaret dane school, so erm, yes, if, if you could definitely follow that up erm john yeah. cos that'll be a very useful school to have interest . erm. @@ -76502,27 +76439,27 @@ yes, could you, perhaps you could find out which school she's at yes, okay. erm. could give her a ring, find out what school she's at and then -and then if, if it's fine with her, we'd have some, well you'd let you know,contact +and then if, if it's fine with her, we'd have some, well you'd let you know,contact , what's the time . alright, yeah, okay. right. -because it's, i mean it would be very good if we could have several schools +because it's, i mean it would be very good if we could have several schools yeah. interested. -er have you got, all these people waiting to be told . +er have you got, all these people waiting to be told . . right, i hope, we won't be to long now, perhaps if we could just bring up the item you wanted to mention. -yeah, erm, right, yeah, that's all the other items, erm what's been er been going through my head recently is, is er the, looking at the pattern of the meetings and the way the meetings are arranged and, and how, erm, at the last meeting we had a speaker er and that i think, we all found that quite interesting and the one, one from central america that things and i feel we ought to have that much more frequently than we do have er, a, either a speaker or a focus of some sort of meetings erm, so i think that's something i'd like to raise and get the a g m at the next meeting i think similar thing we ought to consider there. +yeah, erm, right, yeah, that's all the other items, erm what's been er been going through my head recently is, is er the, looking at the pattern of the meetings and the way the meetings are arranged and, and how, erm, at the last meeting we had a speaker er and that i think, we all found that quite interesting and the one, one from central america that things and i feel we ought to have that much more frequently than we do have er, a, either a speaker or a focus of some sort of meetings erm, so i think that's something i'd like to raise and get the a g m at the next meeting i think similar thing we ought to consider there. erm, quite how we arrange cos this, as margaret says there's a lot of business to get through on occasions, but er, this, this meeting seems to had a lot, but, you know, er whether we could alternate er a business meeting with a, a, a speaker so i thought functional meeting every two months and a speaker attending er, er the other month, erm, i'm really sussing it open for ideas, what, what do other people feel and maybe we should have speaker on a separate night . mm, well, this, or is everybody happy with the, the format as it is? er. -is it not but er +is it not but er yeah. speaker's a very good idea, but difficult to organise, mm. i think a, every so often it'll be very interesting, very sort of, we did try this once didn't we? this, this has cropped up before, oh yes this idea of trying to change this . -michael , michael started the ball rolling in my mind, er, yes he, he, i, one thing erm yesterday, erm one thing he, he started to coming to more meetings last year and erm i think he'd seen one or two people come along and not, +michael , michael started the ball rolling in my mind, er, yes he, he, i, one thing erm yesterday, erm one thing he, he started to coming to more meetings last year and erm i think he'd seen one or two people come along and not, mm. a couple of new people come along and then, not, not follow up yes, there can be. @@ -76538,15 +76475,15 @@ we have had that in the past haven't we? we i can't remember. remember we used to have a prisoner group didn't we, when i first came so that the -what groups, yeah groups for particular things on, on the, you know like campaigns or prisoners there were special groups dealing only with this those, they met on there own, not there weren't any +what groups, yeah groups for particular things on, on the, you know like campaigns or prisoners there were special groups dealing only with this those, they met on there own, not there weren't any schools groups. -yes, the schools group, yes, i mean, that, that could operate more, in fact we could have, instead of having just talking about the, about the india one, er instead of having one person at it, it could be a group of, of three perhaps, er . +yes, the schools group, yes, i mean, that, that could operate more, in fact we could have, instead of having just talking about the, about the india one, er instead of having one person at it, it could be a group of, of three perhaps, er . but then they'd still presumably report back to the main group about what they'd been doing. yes . yes. so you're really, in a way, you're not much difference than where you started. i think margaret's right, if, if we really want to get through the business we can and however busy we are, erm . -i wouldn't we wouldn't to every time, but i mean it can be, it can be just a very brief report on what's happened, you know, if we want to get through. +i wouldn't we wouldn't to every time, but i mean it can be, it can be just a very brief report on what's happened, you know, if we want to get through. if we said, like, if we, every second month say or every third month, then we, we knew we were going to have a speaker, we could the time before we could then do the business more thoroughly and carefully so that the month of the speaker we could just go through it very quickly . . alternatively to, alternative to, to speaker, can we get erm, you know, brief films about different countries and, political systems and so on. @@ -76577,8 +76514,8 @@ what was that one? what was that one? it was about death penalty wasn't it? . -there's all sorts like, like recruiting, making contact with the schools, er, lobbying, er, there, there about ten or twelve different workshops now, almost on almost every aspects, so and that would be something that we could give, if, if these weren't . -but there has to be one guarantee in because i think once we had rather good one, about six people kept, you can never tell how many come, i mean you'd want maybe bigger, more than, more space in this room. +there's all sorts like, like recruiting, making contact with the schools, er, lobbying, er, there, there about ten or twelve different workshops now, almost on almost every aspects, so and that would be something that we could give, if, if these weren't . +but there has to be one guarantee in because i think once we had rather good one, about six people kept, you can never tell how many come, i mean you'd want maybe bigger, more than, more space in this room. well, we've, have got another room maybe we might sometimes be able to use haven't we? well we could use the . or your dining room, yes. @@ -76589,7 +76526,7 @@ mm. though we do seem to be doing quite well in numbers. yes, we have lately, yes. better than last year. -that suddenly, i mean it means you divide into smaller groups quite often, and, and have discussions on you can, yeah.. +that suddenly, i mean it means you divide into smaller groups quite often, and, and have discussions on you can, yeah.. speak on what you've got. no, might be my speech, do we need a, meet, meet in a more public place, erm. no, no, we can't. @@ -76602,7 +76539,7 @@ i honestly think it would. i think if anything, i'm sure it would. yeah, mm, sure. i think. -i'm sure that it would make us more careful the months before. +i'm sure that it would make us more careful the months before. mm, mm. right, going on the streets think it would, going to find that many people that, that could speak to that was @@ -76620,12 +76557,11 @@ business? yes, just, just, remind people the next, the next meeting erm, is tuesday the tenth of march, we always meet on a tuesday evening and it will be at ann's house in harlow, which is , said on the tape . must be of benefit. . -right, er, people can take what bits from tables they want them, or, i've got s , i've got one put out, erm, shall we open that door a bit, it's getting a bit hot in here, erm, don't know if mary wants any help out there. +right, er, people can take what bits from tables they want them, or, i've got s , i've got one put out, erm, shall we open that door a bit, it's getting a bit hot in here, erm, don't know if mary wants any help out there. good. - testing, testing. okay right, so what we've been looking at this week is trade in agricultural commodities, and er, possibly a little bit of gatt as well. -and i believe bob has asked you to er, i think, collect some data erm, on trade in wheat and cotton erm, as an example. +and i believe bob has asked you to er, i think, collect some data erm, on trade in wheat and cotton erm, as an example. we'll come on to that a bit later on. but can you just give me, sort of, a brief overview of what's happened to the composition of world trade right, say over the last hundred years or so. what have been the main features? @@ -76645,20 +76581,20 @@ right, super, anything else? population growth. yes, populations have, have increased. technology. -yep, i mean that might in a sense -yes, we're gonna get +yep, i mean that might in a sense +yes, we're gonna get transport technology has er, certainly er, certainly improved. right, okay, so, in ge in general, we can say that world trade has risen over time due to essentially, well, is that, is there anything else that? more countries have er, a big surplus, and more countries having a big deficit in food supply yes -so therefore +so therefore so that says something about specialization of production possibly, that countries are now more highly specialized than they once were. yep, i mean, that in a way is a function of, leagues with which international trade can be conducted. you know, if you, if international trade is very difficult as it was, say two hundred years ago, then you've got to be self sufficient. whereas, erm, you can now exploit individual countries comparative advantage of this trade erm, is, is rel is relatively er, is relatively easy. are there any other factors, that might have increased, for an incre might have led to an increase in world trade? rising population, improving transport and technologies. -i know this might sound obscure, but erm, i read somewhere when that erm, if you actually bring in protectionism, it sounds like it could actually increase trade. +i know this might sound obscure, but erm, i read somewhere when that erm, if you actually bring in protectionism, it sounds like it could actually increase trade. if you bring in protectionism? don't know how it worked, as in as of, liberalize, or if you increase @@ -76673,13 +76609,13 @@ what other factors, there's a big, this fact that we're missing, alright, rising increased consumption. yes, that's right, or right income. -yes, income, that's right, incomes have risen, er, and as a result we're consuming more goods, consuming more goods it, it followed, well not automatically, but there's a likelihood that trade will also, will also rise. +yes, income, that's right, incomes have risen, er, and as a result we're consuming more goods, consuming more goods it, it followed, well not automatically, but there's a likelihood that trade will also, will also rise. okay, so, that's, they're the reasons to account for the rise in absolute values of er, trade in all commodities, what about erm, why has the er, trade in manufactures er, increased as a proportion of total trade? i mean, it's not divorced from the things that we've just been talking about well, cos incomes have risen so, there's more consumption okay. specialization as well, er -good right okay, i mean, what income elasticities of demand for +good right okay, i mean, what income elasticities of demand for higher for manufactured goods, or high relative to agricultural goods okay, so, because income elasticities of demand are generally high for manufactured goods as the world economy gets richer, it will want to consume proportionately more of those. right, now, we could all become self sufficient, alright. @@ -76690,7 +76626,7 @@ what's also happened to trade in manufactures? it's specialized that's right, okay. to, well, produce constant -yes, that's right, you've got because the, the market for er, any one say manufactured goods, in theory could be a, a world market now because there are relatively cheap methods of transporting this er, this particular good. +yes, that's right, you've got because the, the market for er, any one say manufactured goods, in theory could be a, a world market now because there are relatively cheap methods of transporting this er, this particular good. what's happened is because the potential market has risen, firms have specialized. alright, and this is why we get, erm, cars are an excellent example of this erm. you know, toyota, toyota's plant down the road in derby, massive investment, erm, a huge production capacity. @@ -76703,7 +76639,7 @@ alright. trade automatically follows therefore. right, we need the specialization and er, the sort of demand elasticity erm, in that argument to suggest that world tra to explain why world trade has risen. what else, before we come on to agricultural products,what, are there any other notable features of trade in manufactures? -alright, it has risen, right, risen very dramatically erm well, let's try and rephrase this, erm, what's another major reason for the growth of manufacturing trade? +alright, it has risen, right, risen very dramatically erm well, let's try and rephrase this, erm, what's another major reason for the growth of manufacturing trade? manufacturing trade is, seems to have grown very rapidly, not only because we're producing erm, or con consuming more of a, a particular commodity, but also because consumers like opportunities in taste. changes in taste, yes consumers like @@ -76717,31 +76653,31 @@ alright, now, they're not exactly the same products, but they are very similar. you know, erm, as far as the statistics might go, you know, a car is a car is a car. so you lump them all together, but we know as consumers, that, the skoda is inherently different to the lamborghini or something, alright. excuse me. -hello, tim speaking. +hello, tim speaking. hello marina. very well thanks, and yourself? -right mhm essentially yeah, use it as a, erm, as a motivation for the, for the tutorial erm,partic particularly the, the first part of it, talking about gatt, sort of erm, the er, sort of characteristics of trade, how it's changed, indication of protectionism. +right mhm essentially yeah, use it as a, erm, as a motivation for the, for the tutorial erm,partic particularly the, the first part of it, talking about gatt, sort of erm, the er, sort of characteristics of trade, how it's changed, indication of protectionism. no, no they don't. well, yes it should, it should be, and there's some good figures in there that you may want to tell the students about, and then what i would do is recommend that they have a look at it because the current issue. that came out of the current issues in agricultural economics book. alright, if you tell them erm, that's where it came from, there are copies in the library, it might be a good idea that they have a look at it. alright? that's it, that's o that's okay, i don't think there's anything else, okay, yes, okay, cheerio, then marina, bye . -right,erm, yes, so,inder intra-industry trade is growing very, very rapidly and that, and this is, sort of the main, one of the main reasons why trade in manufactures has grown rapidly, rapidly. +right,erm, yes, so,inder intra-industry trade is growing very, very rapidly and that, and this is, sort of the main, one of the main reasons why trade in manufactures has grown rapidly, rapidly. why's intra-indu intra, intra-industry trade grown? well, as consumers, we like to er, consume differentiated products, right. manufactured goods are easily differentiated, right, you've only got to bung power steering on a car, or a few go, go faster stripes and you have you know, sort of, to the consumer, a different product. right, although it is still a car, it's, it has different attributes. alright, so there's plenty of scope for differentiation, product differentiation. and also, erm, there's great scope for economies of scale er, in manufactured goods, therefore consumers can benefit, right from er, exploiting the comparative advantage in particular, in particular countries. -production tends to be focused on very large plants, erm, and each plant will produce erm, a particular good for the whole world market and so therefore trade must, must increase. -so, perhaps those explanations might account for declining er, relative share in agriculture as well as the increasing share of manufactured goods, because the other side of that coin is, well, income elasticities of demand for agricultural goods is less than unity so there's a de declining sector aspect there, erm, is it easy to differentiate agricultural products? +production tends to be focused on very large plants, erm, and each plant will produce erm, a particular good for the whole world market and so therefore trade must, must increase. +so, perhaps those explanations might account for declining er, relative share in agriculture as well as the increasing share of manufactured goods, because the other side of that coin is, well, income elasticities of demand for agricultural goods is less than unity so there's a de declining sector aspect there, erm, is it easy to differentiate agricultural products? very difficult. right, it's not impossible because what tends to happen is that you can erm, you can change the product mix of what the consumer receives. instead of him just buying purely the raw commodity, you can er, change the, the degree of processing erm, the quality of, of the product, erm, so there is some scope for different product differentiation, but certainly not the same scope that there is in manufactures. do you think the scope has increased because of erm, packaging or whatever? mm, i mean that's, it's, you know, a potato is a potato is a potato, in, you know in commodity terms, but you know, you can change the way the, the product by attaching lots of services to that raw food product, and that's where the scope for differentiation comes from, it's the, the combination of attributes in er, agricultural goods so you've t v dinners and all the rest of it. -erm, how about economies of scale, you said that was important the increase in manufacturing trade, you know, implies that products will be produced at a lower unit value, and therefore benefit consumers and er, therefore increase his trade cos consumers will buy the cheapest product if that comes from abroad, so be it. +erm, how about economies of scale, you said that was important the increase in manufacturing trade, you know, implies that products will be produced at a lower unit value, and therefore benefit consumers and er, therefore increase his trade cos consumers will buy the cheapest product if that comes from abroad, so be it. so what about economies of scale in agriculture? do you think there are economies of scale to the same extent? no. @@ -76749,17 +76685,17 @@ why, why not? it's more perfectly competitive, isn't it, i mean it's produced say, the scope for it is less because it's on a smaller scale in general. mm, that's right, i mean the fact that agriculture tends to be perfectly com right, why there tends to be a lot of independent small producers is because there are no economies of scale, you know, apart from beyond, you know, a certain size of farm, you know,stud studies in the u k show that once you get, get beyond about two thousand hectares there are, there are significant dis-economies of scale, and although there are economies of scale up to that point, and that's only in the case of very specialist types of production, by and large once you've got a farm in excess of five hundred hectares, erm, you start to run into dis-economy, and mostly managerial dis-economies of scale. that's not the same er, well that's not the case with erm, with things like car man car manufacturing. -i mean we can toyota can produce, you know, sufficient corollas or whatever it is that they make at derby erm, to sat to satisfy the whole of the world market for that particular car, just from one plant. -and that one plant occupies about sort of, one hundred and fifty hectares or something like that. -if you wanted to erm, er, satisfy the demand for a particular food commodity you'd need erm, an area equivalent to the six biggest states in america. +i mean we can toyota can produce, you know, sufficient corollas or whatever it is that they make at derby erm, to sat to satisfy the whole of the world market for that particular car, just from one plant. +and that one plant occupies about sort of, one hundred and fifty hectares or something like that. +if you wanted to erm, er, satisfy the demand for a particular food commodity you'd need erm, an area equivalent to the six biggest states in america. clearly,that's not feasible. there's a geographical dimension involved in agricultural production, that leads to dis-economies of scale. alright, and er, essentially land is the constraining, the constraining factor. -right, because we need land to produce food, more so than we need land to produce cars or tape recorders or whatever that sort of militates against economies of scale, and that's why we have erm, a large number of relatively small producers in this country and throughout the world. +right, because we need land to produce food, more so than we need land to produce cars or tape recorders or whatever that sort of militates against economies of scale, and that's why we have erm, a large number of relatively small producers in this country and throughout the world. erm, it's because you need land, and er, the bigger the area of land you've got, the more time it takes to get your combine harvester from one side to the other er, and so on and so forth. so, the optimal size of plant in agriculture is very, very small compared to the optimal size of plant in manufacturing. okay, and that could be another reason why international trade, erm, has, had declined relatively in agriculture. -now anything else that may have accounted for the erm, decline of agricultural trade, and the increase in manufacturing trade? +now anything else that may have accounted for the erm, decline of agricultural trade, and the increase in manufacturing trade? because of erm, protection policies, mm like erm, the c a p in france. @@ -76774,7 +76710,7 @@ okay, yes, leads to retaliation, anything else? leads to loss of market. mm, yes, leads to loss of market, you know. if we're self sufficient due to a policy that subsidizes our farmers, we're not going to want to import anything. -so those are all reasons why trade in agricultural goods may have fallen, is protectionism in ari agriculture is second to none. +so those are all reasons why trade in agricultural goods may have fallen, is protectionism in ari agriculture is second to none. there's no industry that's erm, as heavily protected as er, as agriculture on a world scale. okay, so what, so what other effects does protectionism have? it reduces er, trade in agricultural goods, anything else? @@ -76792,7 +76728,7 @@ yes, it increases self sufficiency, what about the prices of agricultural goods the size of the world market in agricultural erm, goods and the volatility of prices on the world market? aren't agricultural prices subsidized twice, they're subsidized to the farmers, so the farmer gets x for growing it which increases the price automatically on the market, but aren't they subsidized so they can be sold abroad? yes, that's, that's true. -so that's well, before we can go in, launch into this, i mean it's often said that erm, er, well, one of the major reasons why agricultural commodity trade hasn't been included in gatt, like virtually every other er, product has been, is because governments are saying, look this is a domestic policy, it's got nothing to do with international trade, we're supporting our farmers, it's a domestic policy. +so that's well, before we can go in, launch into this, i mean it's often said that erm, er, well, one of the major reasons why agricultural commodity trade hasn't been included in gatt, like virtually every other er, product has been, is because governments are saying, look this is a domestic policy, it's got nothing to do with international trade, we're supporting our farmers, it's a domestic policy. it doesn't, you know, it doesn't have anything to do with trade. now, clearly that's a very naive way of looking at er, protectionism. but that's the main argument why agricultural policies have been allowed to increase in their severity, rather than erm, fall. @@ -76800,11 +76736,11 @@ that makes no sense, because they're selling that product abroad, the farm produ they might be, they might be, yes. if they are selling it abroad, it's international though. mm, ah yes, you can't, any domestic policy has international ramifications, if it affects er, resource allocation and, and demand and agricultural protectionism, like any protectionism will, will er, will reallocate resources, not according to comparative advantage, but according to some erm, some priority, we want to support our agriculture, therefore we'll erm, give agricultural producers a lot of money. -now, clearly that's going to dis distort trade because, if we're increasing domestic production come in, ah, hi mervin. +now, clearly that's going to dis distort trade because, if we're increasing domestic production come in, ah, hi mervin. sorry, you alright for tomorrow? yes, i can go to the lecture, but i'm teaching at eleven like yourself. i'll er, i'll see you if win's free at, at eleven. -yes, yes, i've been to se i've a couple of people up to sort of promise a hand +yes, yes, i've been to se i've a couple of people up to sort of promise a hand yes, is, is, is tony, is tony er, busy as well? tony's got a le meeting at ten thirty. ah, which won't finish @@ -76815,7 +76751,7 @@ right, well we'll sort, we'll sort something out, but i'll see if winnie's, i'll yes, yes, i'm sorry about that, yes, yes, okay. i mean if the worst comes to the worst, we'll sort of, cancel a lecture, or something ah, well, it's only a matter of giving them a cup of coffee afterwards. -right, okay, i'm sure we can go, we can look after, we can get robert in or something +right, okay, i'm sure we can go, we can look after, we can get robert in or something yes, that's right we just get, just grab a couple of people. sorry to disrupt your class. that's okay, i'll, i'll sort it out anyway, later this afternoon, yes, yes that's right, yes that's it @@ -76839,14 +76775,14 @@ ten days to er, yes, yes, that's right. there's a lot of brinkmanship going on at the moment, a lot of er, horse-trading i dare say, going on as well. erm, but er, okay. -erm er, okey-doke, domestic policies will affect world, world market. +erm er, okey-doke, domestic policies will affect world, world market. it's likely, will world market prices fall? or rise as a result of protectionism? rise. why might, why might they rise? because they cost more. what costs more? -erm panic +erm panic it may not do you know what tends to happen, is that world prices fall, alright, in the presence of protectionism. alright, because what you're doing, is that you're increasing domestic production. @@ -76859,7 +76795,7 @@ it's only the inefficient producers that support their agricultures, because it' right, in the long run, they've got to cover all their costs, right, they will be driven out of business, but that may take some time. alright, so in, in the short run, because more is being produced, alright, and demand has been increased very much, or in world terms, then market prices will fall. all market prices will fall. -and world market prices also tend to fall because these erm sort of protectionist programmes are often too successful, so not only do we reach self sufficiency, but you reach the status of net exporter. +and world market prices also tend to fall because these erm sort of protectionist programmes are often too successful, so not only do we reach self sufficiency, but you reach the status of net exporter. now, for net exporting, for a net exporter, so our production exceeds our own consumption, how the hell do we er, how the hell do we get rid of it? do we just burn it? or do we dump it? @@ -76867,7 +76803,7 @@ what tends to happen is that domestic agricultural production has already been s the world market becomes a residual, a residual market as a result, erm, you know, because we're dumping cheap products, you know, and the, the only way we can sell european grain right is to, is to undercut the world market. now, because we're a major player in, in grain markets and most other markets, the european community, increasing its supply on the world market will have a non-trivial effect on price. prices will come down, right. -erm that's what we observe, is that protectionism leads to a lowering of world, world prices. +erm that's what we observe, is that protectionism leads to a lowering of world, world prices. what about the volatility? does protectionism have an affect on volatility do you think? right, think of it like this, if, if all countries of the world, right, engage in free trade, there is no protection. @@ -76880,7 +76816,7 @@ because the world market is very, very tiny now, because nobody uses it, that wi so what you tend to observe is that when protectionism, when everybody protects, or when a lot of people protects, the world market erm, becomes a sink right, for any excess production. right, it becomes a residual market, right. you know, if you can't sell it at home, you know, you get rid of it on the world market. -now, if the world market is very small, then the term world market is a bit of a misnomer when er, when most countries protect. +now, if the world market is very small, then the term world market is a bit of a misnomer when er, when most countries protect. the world market becomes very, very volatile and er, so protectionism tends to lead to erm, to price volatility and this is one reason why agricultural markets are so volatile. right, it's, it's because world markets are residual markets because there's so much agricultural protectionism. okay. @@ -76891,7 +76827,7 @@ sorry? if we don't live off agricultural trade, what are we going to live on? we have to keep the track all turned on. i mean, vital to life -well yes, but it only represents two percent of g d p in this country it's, it's insignificant. +well yes, but it only represents two percent of g d p in this country it's, it's insignificant. ah, that's the thing, it's not insignificant. because if you stop agricultural production, you're going to be in big trouble. right, okay. @@ -76920,14 +76856,14 @@ it's not only the developing countries that are dependent upon agricultural expo so, who, who are the beneficiaries, are there, are there any beneficiaries at the moment of liberalization? clearly farmers in protecting countries benefit,any anybody else that benefits? from protectionism? -mm say if you're on the world, if you, if you're a net importer, right, erm, and you're buying your food commodities from the world market, you must have been rubbing your hands over the last fifty years cos you're getting , you're buying, you're buying a food commodities will lower, lower prices than you would have done in the presence of free trade, cos there's all this dumping and european surpluses, you know come in +mm say if you're on the world, if you, if you're a net importer, right, erm, and you're buying your food commodities from the world market, you must have been rubbing your hands over the last fifty years cos you're getting , you're buying, you're buying a food commodities will lower, lower prices than you would have done in the presence of free trade, cos there's all this dumping and european surpluses, you know come in yes he is here win yes, erm, sue's after you, if you going, she wants to know, can you go to lunch in ten minutes? when, one o'clock no i can't come, i'm dining with er, charles and a post-grad. -so gerard's his name, erm, remind me to see about, are you free tomorrow at eleven? +so gerard's his name, erm, remind me to see about, are you free tomorrow at eleven? yes, tony's just dropped that on me oh from a great height. @@ -76937,26 +76873,25 @@ okay, and you will suffer as a result of liberalization, and by and large those right okay. tell you what we'll do is er, leave it there now. i would recommend you do is look in this book, there's a coup a couple of copies of which is, i mean er, is in the library, right. -current issues in agricultural economics er, edited by your lord and master, professor rayner and also a chap called david coleman okay so, current issues in agricultural economics by a rayner and d coleman. +current issues in agricultural economics er, edited by your lord and master, professor rayner and also a chap called david coleman okay so, current issues in agricultural economics by a rayner and d coleman. but if you look at chapter four in that book, we have the title, agricultural trade and the gatt. alright, now the first part of this chapter spells out erm, er, developments in agricultural trade, why it's, why it's fallen in relative terms right. it then goes on to look at the costs of protectionism so they're, they're looking at erm, the numerical estimates as to how much erm, protectionism costs,not only for domestic producers and consumers and tax payers, but also for third countries. it then goes on to look at erm, why agriculture hasn't been included in the gatt up until now, and prospects for a solution within the gatt. -this er, although it's not on your reading list, erm, the reading list that bob gave to you, er, it, it should be. +this er, although it's not on your reading list, erm, the reading list that bob gave to you, er, it, it should be. it's essential to erm, to what you've been going through in the last, in the last few lectures. -readable, full of erm, empirical evidence about costs of agricultural protection, and what's happened to agricultural prices and i re i do recommend that you have a look at it if you, it's an invaluable if you look at anything, look at, look at this one article. +readable, full of erm, empirical evidence about costs of agricultural protection, and what's happened to agricultural prices and i re i do recommend that you have a look at it if you, it's an invaluable if you look at anything, look at, look at this one article. and there should be a couple of er, issues of this book in, in the library, okay, right, well thanks very much. have a very good holiday and er,tomorrow there won't be a normal agri-econ lecture, there'll be a special lecture, but it'll be in the same place, same time. -hello, tim speaking, i was on my way charles. +hello, tim speaking, i was on my way charles. okay, i'll see you in a minute. bye . right, that's it. right. - got well loads of homework tonight. got any merit marks today? -er one yeah in maths ooh er -for the class work look at that homework i got two wrong and in science steady should be finish. +er one yeah in maths ooh er +for the class work look at that homework i got two wrong and in science steady should be finish. try doing that. i can't. are you coming to the fair tomorrow? @@ -76966,38 +76901,38 @@ yeah. are you going? half past ten to half past twelve. is dad? -could do love cos i've gotta get er karen's er card. +could do love cos i've gotta get er karen's er card. what from the fair? yes i might find something there. there's some good things but th they don't do cards. what sort of stalls are there? -no i got the cakes does it look alright paul? -could of got the but they're there . -so will we got to that other place dad? -yeah hopefully ring up her ring up er ticket line see if it's er they might be +no i got the cakes does it look alright paul? +could of got the but they're there . +so will we got to that other place dad? +yeah hopefully ring up her ring up er ticket line see if it's er they might be a day -about a day yeah. -day what is it o eight nine eight one -o eight nine eight four hundred three three three. +about a day yeah. +day what is it o eight nine eight one +o eight nine eight four hundred three three three. alright. -in that one paul and i are going into work, alright? +in that one paul and i are going into work, alright? is that alright? yeah he's going to do his homework there. i have a -yeah i know you out who takes you tonight then? -mark i can't remember gotta get -cleared up before sunday i've gotta go at nine o'clock tomorrow morning to get the cake. +yeah i know you out who takes you tonight then? +mark i can't remember gotta get +cleared up before sunday i've gotta go at nine o'clock tomorrow morning to get the cake. yeah. twenty third. where's the calendar gone? have you got it? -by the phone oh no it's this round the erm on the table i might you change you can't go. -make a other meeting. -yeah i've done the booking. -well that's alright we can go w whe y you if you're at mencap oh you w -i only said we're getting a lift and richard to write a letter to join the dance. +by the phone oh no it's this round the erm on the table i might you change you can't go. +make a other meeting. +yeah i've done the booking. +well that's alright we can go w whe y you if you're at mencap oh you w +i only said we're getting a lift and richard to write a letter to join the dance. why is tha why is david involved in that all of a sudden, it's not through us is it? -i dunno still right +i dunno still right dad it's the tenth of it's very odd isn't it! december. @@ -77005,45 +76940,45 @@ what? tenth of december. oh right. oh!er look i mean it at all unless david gives me a little -may other meeting. +may other meeting. that's a good reason for david to give me a lift isn't it? he won't mind will he? you'll have all re you'd know where it is, won't you, by then? well i know where it is i just don't know how to get there. normal squad for tomorrow . -do you hear gary lineker's got his son's got +do you hear gary lineker's got his son's got yeah. but it it's not life only fourteen life endangering though is it only fourteen babies under twelve months old get that every year! -god you know you are lucky wouldn't you? -the irony of it is this is that he has done a lot, he gave ten thousand +god you know you are lucky wouldn't you? +the irony of it is this is that he has done a lot, he gave ten thousand yeah. pounds, is it, not to the leukaemia was it or w was it? -think it was cancer childhood cancer or something. +think it was cancer childhood cancer or something. yeah it's almost though he knew, it weird! -i mean fourteen babies a year that can +i mean fourteen babies a year that can get leukaemia? and as well as his son? -no ah yeah under twelve months old only fourteen babies a year get it oh that's dreadful! +no ah yeah under twelve months old only fourteen babies a year get it oh that's dreadful! how old's his baby then? well it just shows you how famous he now means you are. -mail and it says about what a lovely family they are and how it's gotta +mail and it says about what a lovely family they are and how it's gotta shame! -be good that a such a er erm show what a perfect family how they sort of go through it all. +be good that a such a er erm show what a perfect family how they sort of go through it all. it said a lot of people who're watching how they react? -yeah by a family who knew them personally not off . +yeah by a family who knew them personally not off . will he still be playing for tottenham, mum? will he still be going to japan. -ask at your your christian union about sunday and bring that up, sunday lunch we had a right old ding dong at work today! +ask at your your christian union about sunday and bring that up, sunday lunch we had a right old ding dong at work today! what about trev it? -trevor thinks it's not stopping you going to church he said. +trevor thinks it's not stopping you going to church he said. true. -dad can i have your quiz can i have the quiz. -no we're gonna do it tomorrow morning no i won't. +dad can i have your quiz can i have the quiz. +no we're gonna do it tomorrow morning no i won't. how many questions are you gonna have in it? dad? what? @@ -77051,100 +76986,100 @@ how many questions are you gonna have in your quiz? dunno i hello is that john? i n i like the new quick ones -it's ruth here. +it's ruth here. than the ones in the -i don't know how to tell you this i can't i can't -lot's of +i don't know how to tell you this i can't i can't +lot's of make the tenth ! -well i i i could but all +well i i i could but all we'll go through go through some papers and start cutting out things -and i a chair for the +and i a chair for the only thing if i if you do it even in the chair for a meeting -you won't enter the quiz so what do you wanna do? -about erm +you won't enter the quiz so what do you wanna do? +about erm would you rather me do it on my own i think -and then you can enter with cos i thought about sticking everybody into pairs +and then you can enter with cos i thought about sticking everybody into pairs cos they've asked me. mean i won't be able to enter the quiz? well you'll know the answers won't you! -oh i want that some if all the social services just put in with the thing having +oh i want that some if all the social services just put in with the thing having please can i a ask the questions? -a series of six meetings about this +a series of six meetings about this now let's have everything tha i want to aim a at doing any oral questions just ah? like -a lot about it and shan't be, frankly i'm relieved i don't actually know a lot but when the meeting to discuss what we're supposed to do is on december tenth yo so i'm a bit torn cos i in a way that's what i ought to be doing even though the welfare business in a way that's wh that's what i ought to be doing cos it's entirely . -would you like paul to buy presents tomorrow? +a lot about it and shan't be, frankly i'm relieved i don't actually know a lot but when the meeting to discuss what we're supposed to do is on december tenth yo so i'm a bit torn cos i in a way that's what i ought to be doing even though the welfare business in a way that's wh that's what i ought to be doing cos it's entirely . +would you like paul to buy presents tomorrow? for me at the fair? -oh well he says he's got e he's got enough now hasn't he? +oh well he says he's got e he's got enough now hasn't he? no you want one! to give to me on sunday. oh i see. still put that aside . -oh trevor was quite good he di he d he would've got his big pay rise today an didn't push it too much i don't think perhaps it's nick though +oh trevor was quite good he di he d he would've got his big pay rise today an didn't push it too much i don't think perhaps it's nick though why's got a big one? -well he got promoted didn't he he's stable now that child though hasn't he? +well he got promoted didn't he he's stable now that child though hasn't he? until they start tre tra blurgh they start treatment straight away don't they, these days. -oh he's only twelve and ended up as one of the smallest birds +oh he's only twelve and ended up as one of the smallest birds but it said i heard that it said chemotherapy well what's that's erm drugs is it, no that's radiation isn't it? makes your oh y -hair fall out +hair fall out well you wouldn't give that to a little baby would they? well you'd have to. -i thought they washed the blood out changed all the blood. -blood type and that's what that other woman died girl died of didn't she they -i was saying to trevor it's it's not very nice but it's rather so much better than than than having a cot death isn't it? +i thought they washed the blood out changed all the blood. +blood type and that's what that other woman died girl died of didn't she they +i was saying to trevor it's it's not very nice but it's rather so much better than than than having a cot death isn't it? if you see what i mean. mm. -i can actually imagine the feeling of going to a cot and then finding no no the child was dead, that's awful. -done there was a our school dinners today i went into this give you four pounds back i get twenty two pounds sixty have you got two tens in change of a twenty? -i haven't got five pounds +i can actually imagine the feeling of going to a cot and then finding no no the child was dead, that's awful. +done there was a our school dinners today i went into this give you four pounds back i get twenty two pounds sixty have you got two tens in change of a twenty? +i haven't got five pounds have you got two tens you want to change for a twenty paul? no sorry. -that's been quite good that cos you know i had a hundred and ten pounds left +that's been quite good that cos you know i had a hundred and ten pounds left mm. -i only took out the palace because i knew i'd given i'd written a cheque for forty -you'd written out a cheque -and i've only just started, still got two people outstanding so i've got that forty pound and i put that into the building society and use that forty pounds for months see so it kind of like saved it for me, i've managed, had to do without it +i only took out the palace because i knew i'd given i'd written a cheque for forty +you'd written out a cheque +and i've only just started, still got two people outstanding so i've got that forty pound and i put that into the building society and use that forty pounds for months see so it kind of like saved it for me, i've managed, had to do without it yeah. and er when have you got to pay all that. -what mu a a th agent says i only have to pay it off a day +what mu a a th agent says i only have to pay it off a day how much is it? what just write a cheque? -yeah and that way . +yeah and that way . well you won't be there on the day. well dave'll be down there today. well not you can't pay on the night, can you? -well i suppose i'm sure adrian won't mind if i paid him the day after or a week after or something. +well i suppose i'm sure adrian won't mind if i paid him the day after or a week after or something. you're unemployed i wouldn't have thought you could've stood a hundred and fifty, two hundred pounds withdrawal. -no i don't mind saying it i i'm not gonna ask any more. +no i don't mind saying it i i'm not gonna ask any more. what? -well so that yo about adrian after a few weeks it's you know +well so that yo about adrian after a few weeks it's you know remind me to wash in these cupboards before sunday. yeah. -have you seen jan and joan dress up to their their victorian day jan came like a an upright stripped erm working, not working class a sort of governess right she had +have you seen jan and joan dress up to their their victorian day jan came like a an upright stripped erm working, not working class a sort of governess right she had yeah. frumpy shoes and a . where'd she get the clothes from? -oh she borrowed it, and a bonnet and a white flowers an all and joan turned up like a a twenty five year old victorian fashion model you should have seen her! -black silk skirt maroon blouse her hair done up in a bun draped with gold jewellery oh talk about looking the part! +oh she borrowed it, and a bonnet and a white flowers an all and joan turned up like a a twenty five year old victorian fashion model you should have seen her! +black silk skirt maroon blouse her hair done up in a bun draped with gold jewellery oh talk about looking the part! what's wrong with that? and john hired this thing like a cape -who's idea is it? +who's idea is it? was it? -oh it's it's quite common, everybody does it if you have a vic if you study victorians anyone who a victorian and they all they did all done out, chairs er table space at the front, they did drill in the playground they played with tops and hoops in the playground, all the children the m parents hired costumes from fairy godmothers fairy godmother's done a roaring trade especially +oh it's it's quite common, everybody does it if you have a vic if you study victorians anyone who a victorian and they all they did all done out, chairs er table space at the front, they did drill in the playground they played with tops and hoops in the playground, all the children the m parents hired costumes from fairy godmothers fairy godmother's done a roaring trade especially ah i should think fairy godmothers put the ideas into somebody's head, i would have thought. -that's not -we might +that's not +we might it's just a very good way of er teaching chi i mean children will i mean that's the kind of experience yeah. you never forget, do you? -some of but you can't do it for something like a medieval's day or roman +some of but you can't do it for something like a medieval's day or roman no. day it'd be grim, but victorian victorian @@ -77154,121 +77089,121 @@ and they had to they had to sit in rows and they had to do as they were told and ha! to speak. yes. -apparently some of the children got quite scared of jan cos jan played the part so well ah joan for life. +apparently some of the children got quite scared of jan cos jan played the part so well ah joan for life. frightened the life out of them. yeah. ah back ah back ah back and bill . so what did john look like perhaps like a little billy bunter didn't he? -ah no he looked very good he had a gown and a mortar board and cane and bow tie and pin striped socks, quite good, yep. +ah no he looked very good he had a gown and a mortar board and cane and bow tie and pin striped socks, quite good, yep. and they wore that all day all of them all day? -all day and then he got all to do at lunch time yeah they kept it up all the day, they had separate play time, they had had to eat their lunch in the class room all they were allowed was a piece of fruit, a bread and water and they all had to have, you know, they had a bread roll supplied by the school an a an apple i think and jan made them write out their names and some of them couldn't write their name! -boy called daniel couldn't write daniel cos all last year he'd been allowed to put danny an he'd forgotten how to write daniel! +all day and then he got all to do at lunch time yeah they kept it up all the day, they had separate play time, they had had to eat their lunch in the class room all they were allowed was a piece of fruit, a bread and water and they all had to have, you know, they had a bread roll supplied by the school an a an apple i think and jan made them write out their names and some of them couldn't write their name! +boy called daniel couldn't write daniel cos all last year he'd been allowed to put danny an he'd forgotten how to write daniel! search me! how old's that child? -ten and john +ten and john and he can't that's what's so dreadful, joe was language coordinator and they came from her! can't write names. -and another boys name was thomas and he couldn't write that cos all last year he'd been tom an he'd forgotten how to write his surname they're not dim children both of them +and another boys name was thomas and he couldn't write that cos all last year he'd been tom an he'd forgotten how to write his surname they're not dim children both of them frightening isn't it? -family she says quite an eye opener an they had write lines if they did anything wrong one boy just i reckon she could carried him but +family she says quite an eye opener an they had write lines if they did anything wrong one boy just i reckon she could carried him but no. -you can't be three times where's tonight gone? +you can't be three times where's tonight gone? all this stuff in out here shall i? you think you're exhausted after a days work imagine if you've been doing that all day long, shouting look! -and shrieking, no i mean that +and shrieking, no i mean that i shout and shriek all day long! -ooh i'll lose my voice up there today we've done some really good things though try and do see more my hall is very full if he bothered to come to school he'd have seen them! -still find those what's this that's broken from? +ooh i'll lose my voice up there today we've done some really good things though try and do see more my hall is very full if he bothered to come to school he'd have seen them! +still find those what's this that's broken from? but mummy you could -paul spikes. +paul spikes. excuse me! you took them and i want the batteries for them. -some people go round +some people go round you asked me for them. in science books excuse me ! what does it say? fourteen and a half. were they marked? -no look at this here. +no look at this here. don't like the smell of your narcissus. -well go and won't they. +well go and won't they. don't like the smell. somebody look! can you see it? -let's go . +let's go . oh well neat! -you know i can't see from that distance i thought john had a snowman badge on today, when i got close it's an owl and it said i am the vet. +you know i can't see from that distance i thought john had a snowman badge on today, when i got close it's an owl and it said i am the vet. he enters into th the to the fray doesn't he with it er -no he's got a grey jumper with an owl beaky on it all over the front and a mortar board on the owl. +no he's got a grey jumper with an owl beaky on it all over the front and a mortar board on the owl. did they have to ask him to do that or did he just volunteer. -oh probably just did it do you know what terry's do you know what one of my children did today?do you know what did apart from the fact he spent all day crying then he had to do the corrections, i said go back and do your corrections, said right on your own i wrote something that went no homework done, so he wrote no homework done,no homework done, no homework done ! +oh probably just did it do you know what terry's do you know what one of my children did today?do you know what did apart from the fact he spent all day crying then he had to do the corrections, i said go back and do your corrections, said right on your own i wrote something that went no homework done, so he wrote no homework done,no homework done, no homework done ! oh no! er! i can just scream ! -ah spent all day weeping today with one thing and another when he weeps +ah spent all day weeping today with one thing and another when he weeps why cos you keep telling him off? he oh! -they'd write a poem for her about my greatest fear, i said i remember last year there was a boy called ali and he wrote a story about a poem about this bird and cos he was really scared of that and so i said i don't suppose any of you will write about being scared of me except perhaps adine! +they'd write a poem for her about my greatest fear, i said i remember last year there was a boy called ali and he wrote a story about a poem about this bird and cos he was really scared of that and so i said i don't suppose any of you will write about being scared of me except perhaps adine! eh. -all americans go eh nine o'clock tomorrow i'm going over to kate ten thirty that gives me a bit of lee-way i've got a at ten i thought it was ten thirty i ought to get some money out really you're not going into woking tomorrow morning are you doing your quiz? +all americans go eh nine o'clock tomorrow i'm going over to kate ten thirty that gives me a bit of lee-way i've got a at ten i thought it was ten thirty i ought to get some money out really you're not going into woking tomorrow morning are you doing your quiz? do you want some help with it, not really. -well i was gonna paper out and start cutting out some faces i think cos i mean a i may just as well i mean i was quite happy to let paul help me out but then +well i was gonna paper out and start cutting out some faces i think cos i mean a i may just as well i mean i was quite happy to let paul help me out but then he can't take part. he can't enter the quiz then no you should do it but he shan't all yourself and then i don't think i'm gonna do as much as i'm just gonna do -no cos you won't -a big stream of pictures right +no cos you won't +a big stream of pictures right yeah. -and them i'm gonna think i'm gonna do the same south america +and them i'm gonna think i'm gonna do the same south america yeah. but do south american you know get some big ones yes. -in that might be fun mighten't it? +in that might be fun mighten't it? yeah i can't do it with you. -and you could already write up in red pen you sort it out instead of arguing about trying to do it. -yeah you could u u or split up the to start. -some proverbs, i can't think can you complete these proverbs good book up there for that i don't know at all, there's something wrong ooh this looks really good got look at this book, all the streets it's got like the house of commons and the house of lords +and you could already write up in red pen you sort it out instead of arguing about trying to do it. +yeah you could u u or split up the to start. +some proverbs, i can't think can you complete these proverbs good book up there for that i don't know at all, there's something wrong ooh this looks really good got look at this book, all the streets it's got like the house of commons and the house of lords oh yeah! -take you brilliant book that +take you brilliant book that alright. -i'm at school -you can smell it in the book +i'm at school +you can smell it in the book it's got all proverbs and what things mean. what's all this then. well they're proverbs aren't they. all of them or yeah. single ones? -well all sorts, let sleeping dogs lie, the ones that underline them as i've underlined in biro. -where did you get that -sort of big words for little words that's a big word, you have to think of an addition, i've had it in nineteen -fifty eight it is or nineteen sixty three geographical facts +well all sorts, let sleeping dogs lie, the ones that underline them as i've underlined in biro. +where did you get that +sort of big words for little words that's a big word, you have to think of an addition, i've had it in nineteen +fifty eight it is or nineteen sixty three geographical facts oh yeah. -peoples of other land, look all the people that come from -mum, how do i get +peoples of other land, look all the people that come from +mum, how do i get are you sure it's up-to-date though? well you bu you'll know if it isn't. dad? sorry. spell deceased. deceased, d e c e a s e d. -look, masculine, feminine kevin masculine, feminine some of them are really hard zar, marino distinctive name given to some countries, look the dairy of northern europe, debonair cut your nails down! +look, masculine, feminine kevin masculine, feminine some of them are really hard zar, marino distinctive name given to some countries, look the dairy of northern europe, debonair cut your nails down! urgh! -look famous famous founders, pioneers africa for east or west i think it'd be there today the muses do you know what that says? +look famous famous founders, pioneers africa for east or west i think it'd be there today the muses do you know what that says? yes. -any more famous faces oh you're gonna do up? -no i was wa er what what the other guys did he's gone through a whole load of newspapers cutting peoples faces out +any more famous faces oh you're gonna do up? +no i was wa er what what the other guys did he's gone through a whole load of newspapers cutting peoples faces out yeah. some a little quite obscure yes. -and just stuck it in little boxes, like little boxes and +and just stuck it in little boxes, like little boxes and yeah. -that put it underneath that's all i'm gonna do is, do i i'll measure the framework +that put it underneath that's all i'm gonna do is, do i i'll measure the framework yeah. and stick them on photographs an filling in a the names underneath. of who you think it is. @@ -77276,9 +77211,9 @@ yes. seen them really. ish so that it score -the la funny enough they had gasgcoigne and the picture was so poor it looked people put things like oh you know er edna everage things like that and he ju , he looked like -a woman and he the really -you know you're of pictures now then. +the la funny enough they had gasgcoigne and the picture was so poor it looked people put things like oh you know er edna everage things like that and he ju , he looked like +a woman and he the really +you know you're of pictures now then. yeah. so you're gonna photocopy this or are you just doing one original one? no i'm gonna photocopy it. @@ -77288,17 +77223,17 @@ about going cos i've got tomorrow as well. well you're at football tomorrow. yeah not all day. -virtually watching boon i've got some a two paper i think. -ah don't look! -even if i looked i wouldn't know gotta be fairly small pictures haven't they? +virtually watching boon i've got some a two paper i think. +ah don't look! +even if i looked i wouldn't know gotta be fairly small pictures haven't they? how do you spell disappearance? -yeah aha go over there +yeah aha go over there d i s a double p e a r a n c e -cos you're far too near whe wha i'm what i'm doing. +cos you're far too near whe wha i'm what i'm doing. and again. -d i s a double p e a r a n c e. +d i s a double p e a r a n c e. do you want a coffee ruthy? -yes please i'll have a maxwell house cappuccino. +yes please i'll have a maxwell house cappuccino. have some women in it. ooh it's a good one, there's some really obscure ones! do some of the things you'd know! @@ -77308,16 +77243,16 @@ well mainly the children . dunno them. your your cousins. -i'll do a full face on that one cos that's hard. +i'll do a full face on that one cos that's hard. what is it? -knowing yvonne she'll hee hee! -actually it's surprising how many faces you can get just looking at cheap newspapers you see, incredible! -you think ooh that's well done quite easy. -oh did you do kettle's boiled kettle's boiled it's only three weeks since the last party this is all for jim's benefit isn't it . +knowing yvonne she'll hee hee! +actually it's surprising how many faces you can get just looking at cheap newspapers you see, incredible! +you think ooh that's well done quite easy. +oh did you do kettle's boiled kettle's boiled it's only three weeks since the last party this is all for jim's benefit isn't it . i thought this has co ro come round quite soon. -well she goes june come on, could have had it next friday i think something must be happening next friday, she goes to australia on the seventh well maybe that is next friday oh no it's the isn't it? +well she goes june come on, could have had it next friday i think something must be happening next friday, she goes to australia on the seventh well maybe that is next friday oh no it's the isn't it? so she can't come to the ? -cos the sixth is next friday no. +cos the sixth is next friday no. it's just as well cos she's bound to say something about my quiches! ha ha ha!. . @@ -77326,65 +77261,65 @@ lots. you do it all tonight? no. why? -erm i can't. -you can't do any tomorrow can't do any on sunday i suggest you do it all tonight. +erm i can't. +you can't do any tomorrow can't do any on sunday i suggest you do it all tonight. can't. -you don't about this cappuccino is i don't understand is that here maxwell cappuccino is +you don't about this cappuccino is i don't understand is that here maxwell cappuccino is you can't open the packet. twice the volume yeah, but twice that's right much more powder than you use we i know you can't open the packets, it's stupid! -honestly paul you won't have time to do it tomorrow and sunday well you can work 'till nine o'clock tonight. +honestly paul you won't have time to do it tomorrow and sunday well you can work 'till nine o'clock tonight. how much, can i? you can work 'till nine o'clock tonight. these narcissi are really strong. sorry? cor they're really strong. -ooh yeah aren't they. +ooh yeah aren't they. mm. -i don't they're going to grow that tall, somehow but gone up straight as a dye haven't they? -i can't put them down there to begin with, i think they all draw up +i don't they're going to grow that tall, somehow but gone up straight as a dye haven't they? +i can't put them down there to begin with, i think they all draw up hey than lower down. -my hic hyacinths have all come out except no, they've all come out, one goron l looks like it's gone and lot congealed little bad and another hyacinth has two have come up and other ones not come up at all. +my hic hyacinths have all come out except no, they've all come out, one goron l looks like it's gone and lot congealed little bad and another hyacinth has two have come up and other ones not come up at all. you haven't had as many as usual have you? -well no not perhaps as many as last year. +well no not perhaps as many as last year. i'm gonna have to go in this afternoon again . what did i do with the scissors? -took them out to make the tea did you get any biscuits? -no except for some . +took them out to make the tea did you get any biscuits? +no except for some . there's some kit-kats up there. well you're not having any. i wouldn't mind one. -no pauline +no pauline just one. would agree. i'm nine two this morning on the scales, i'll have you know. wanna a kit-kat pauly? -yes please how do you spell whereabouts? -w h e r e a b o u t s seems to be a lack of spelling at your, this place ah! +yes please how do you spell whereabouts? +w h e r e a b o u t s seems to be a lack of spelling at your, this place ah! urgh! put plenty of royalty in. are you looking? oh no, why should i! trouble is paul i wouldn't cheat. -she's you pauly. +she's you pauly. i won't cheat! you'd love to though. why? -i gave my top group your algebra homework today they said pau is this paul's homework, i said yes that's not fair i said why isn't it fair? +i gave my top group your algebra homework today they said pau is this paul's homework, i said yes that's not fair i said why isn't it fair? well it's too hard, i said how do you know it's too hard? -and they all did it apart from chris who said urgh she always works us too hard! -apart from christopher most of them managed it paul especially richard he's really clever i know who that is, lady di. +and they all did it apart from chris who said urgh she always works us too hard! +apart from christopher most of them managed it paul especially richard he's really clever i know who that is, lady di. shut up ruthy! is this one lady di? is mum not entering it then? yeah. course i am. then why are you looking? -i'm not looking paul don't tar everybody with the same brush. +i'm not looking paul don't tar everybody with the same brush. what? pardon, don't tar everybody with the same brush. ooh pardon me! @@ -77397,29 +77332,29 @@ so you were looking in the first place! no you were looking at the mal vicinty vicinty spell vicinty -i don't know, about it . +i don't know, about it . will i have to pull up any of those caps heads before your mum comes round? no. we were just hanging around talking today and the children done christmas card competition an wi some really and me and ah! moira ! -and and joanne joe, say who could judge this, this is for our competition we'll say heidi coming, no, is anybody else in it, no er sarah'll come in cos she doesn't know, right? -so john came up and we said er we were wondering who could judge th christmas card competition and he was saying oh i don't know,and then th the p t a chairman came up erm we said oh perhaps you should judge the christmas card competition erm and she said well melissa is judging it and we said pardon! +and and joanne joe, say who could judge this, this is for our competition we'll say heidi coming, no, is anybody else in it, no er sarah'll come in cos she doesn't know, right? +so john came up and we said er we were wondering who could judge th christmas card competition and he was saying oh i don't know,and then th the p t a chairman came up erm we said oh perhaps you should judge the christmas card competition erm and she said well melissa is judging it and we said pardon! then john,, said well didn't you ask her this morning then! and joan says oh no i forgot! -well and even that didn't jog his memory, that he should have asked her to judge it! +well and even that didn't jog his memory, that he should have asked her to judge it! what a dozy ! you know who's judging it then? -well mary going to judge it and, would he let her do it on her own, no he followed her round, making comments here, making comments there, trying to influence her fact is, this'll make you laugh, you know the wall displays you know th erm the books, where's wally where's wally you have this page, of really tiny little things and you have to find wally, who's a person, right? +well mary going to judge it and, would he let her do it on her own, no he followed her round, making comments here, making comments there, trying to influence her fact is, this'll make you laugh, you know the wall displays you know th erm the books, where's wally where's wally you have this page, of really tiny little things and you have to find wally, who's a person, right? yeah. in minute detail, hidden on the page is something, you remember how simon had books like that yeah. -in where's lisa, where's freddie, anyway it's where's wally, for that he said er i think i'll get a picture of somebody and er course he i said you gonna call it where's wally? +in where's lisa, where's freddie, anyway it's where's wally, for that he said er i think i'll get a picture of somebody and er course he i said you gonna call it where's wally? he said no i'm wanna call it where's the wally! -milly said cos we'd been talking about this all day and they, the children had been saying to john you gonna have a picture of yourself in where's the wally thing? -and erm milly said ha can't think of a more suitable candidate and swept off ! +milly said cos we'd been talking about this all day and they, the children had been saying to john you gonna have a picture of yourself in where's the wally thing? +and erm milly said ha can't think of a more suitable candidate and swept off ! if you don't want the car i'll drive to school tomorrow. what? i said if you don't want the car i'll drive paul and myself to school tomorrow. @@ -77428,24 +77363,24 @@ well then it's not fair, use a different newspaper. well i haven't got them. we got our local papers, aren't there any in there? doesn't matter. -you get yes you do you get pictures of pop stars and that in the +you get yes you do you get pictures of pop stars and that in the yeah? mail. right. -and you can have my magazines +and you can have my magazines that's a hard one. -as well if you want the express and the mail have much the same pictures got a football magazine and a woman you can have a football, i can't u look +as well if you want the express and the mail have much the same pictures got a football magazine and a woman you can have a football, i can't u look still get some wrong it don't matter anyway does it. football will be there for children won't it? -yes that's what i mean, i noticed that the man who did it balanced it rather nicely, he had some actors some politicians, that everyone can contribute especially in a . -except for me if you think my general knowledge is abysmal! +yes that's what i mean, i noticed that the man who did it balanced it rather nicely, he had some actors some politicians, that everyone can contribute especially in a . +except for me if you think my general knowledge is abysmal! abysmal! erm after football's done, then it must be us. . -will you tell paul he's gotta finish his homework tonight, if he can't do any tomorrow he can't do any on sunday not cutting off their hair? +will you tell paul he's gotta finish his homework tonight, if he can't do any tomorrow he can't do any on sunday not cutting off their hair? yes. let's see. -not allowed to look can i read that? +not allowed to look can i read that? no. please? no. @@ -77458,7 +77393,7 @@ cutting out like mad here. have you got a pen?anything that writes paul? no, anyway you didn't ask me! i have. -then in there and get it! +then in there and get it! how much did you pay for this pen in the market? it's got a loose nib! what? @@ -77477,42 +77412,42 @@ paul! well you shouldn't keep taking them! tell you what you can have a pair for christmas instead of a computer. oh yes please! -there's a pair there look paper's there. -you saw then you were looking ! +there's a pair there look paper's there. +you saw then you were looking ! i'm not . you were ! see you can't be trusted. -ray wilkins is it ? +ray wilkins is it ? oh that is ridiculous! -sorry i just . +sorry i just . that's it! -see you can't be trusted, you're a you get quite upset when you get accused and pauly quite rightly accuses you. +see you can't be trusted, you're a you get quite upset when you get accused and pauly quite rightly accuses you. i caught her looking paul. she's always looking! -she'll always look up got a pritt stick? +she'll always look up got a pritt stick? yeah. where is it. usual place. where's the usual place? where's the usual place? -can't it isn't pardon? +can't it isn't pardon? where in there is it in there? it is . was she looking? she was looking at what, ray wilkins. well how do you know of ray wilkins? -well cos she called it out. +well cos she called it out. pay my attention to it, i look harder. she. stop making silly noises then! -she'll be ferrero roche. -i'm really not hey how about getting erm if i can get there early enough individual christmas cakes they were gonna sell them for +she'll be ferrero roche. +i'm really not hey how about getting erm if i can get there early enough individual christmas cakes they were gonna sell them for oh yeah. -two pounds each individual iced christmas cakes like this. +two pounds each individual iced christmas cakes like this. cheap. yeah. -i want one of them might be nice for natty. +i want one of them might be nice for natty. keep it in the box. boing! de er der der der der . @@ -77520,40 +77455,40 @@ you're on still, look! yes you're on, no you're off. dad? eh? -i today did you do one bulls eye no not cut up the thing and say which sport does this person belong to might get a picture of rob andrews see if they stick rugby or tennis on. -yes paul that'll be a bit unfair for the other twenty nine people around wouldn't it? +i today did you do one bulls eye no not cut up the thing and say which sport does this person belong to might get a picture of rob andrews see if they stick rugby or tennis on. +yes paul that'll be a bit unfair for the other twenty nine people around wouldn't it? what other twenty nine people round? ah! then you'd know all the answers. can't do one for everything! i think you should have a music one. -one or two i i know now i'm writing them down and . -ha ha i'm in at tomorrow morning i'm hoping when i wake up i wanna nice and +one or two i i know now i'm writing them down and . +ha ha i'm in at tomorrow morning i'm hoping when i wake up i wanna nice and so what time do i need to wake up? from the fair? not very early, you can sleep in i've gotta go to waitrose to pick up the stuff. sleep into when? well ten o'clock. ten o'clock! -oh hang on i'm leaving at ten cos i want to be there a little early and start them but i hope to get some perks. +oh hang on i'm leaving at ten cos i want to be there a little early and start them but i hope to get some perks. nine okay? wake up at nine? yeah i'm going to waitrose at nine. -so which fair is this at school is it? +so which fair is this at school is it? yeah, what do you think i'm talking about! oh i don't know i heard it's a craft fair, that's all i heard. all this time daddy thinks it's a like -no i said it's a lovely craft fair. -it's called christmas fair but you and darren have got a stall so ah +no i said it's a lovely craft fair. +it's called christmas fair but you and darren have got a stall so ah why did you know what to do there then? -i already bought a children's thirty five pee each. +i already bought a children's thirty five pee each. yeah. -zoe said are they for your little said which little fun are you talking about zoe? +zoe said are they for your little said which little fun are you talking about zoe? said yes they're both for paul ha ha! -little look at those brilliant grafts mum double grafts they're called hobart and darwin. +little look at those brilliant grafts mum double grafts they're called hobart and darwin. why are they called double grafts? -they're not called double they've sort of got a about rainfall and temperature. -oh and they show two things so y you'll have to see if there's any correlation between the two is there any correlation between rainfall and temperature, and is there? +they're not called double they've sort of got a about rainfall and temperature. +oh and they show two things so y you'll have to see if there's any correlation between the two is there any correlation between rainfall and temperature, and is there? when rainfall goes up does temperature up and vice versa? dunno just gotta describe them. well that's what you have to say, is there any correlation between @@ -77562,36 +77497,36 @@ they all correlate. yeah. it's connection isn't it kev? mm. -yeah and you've gotta see +yeah and you've gotta see that's level six, you should be doing that. what's level six? -well correlation i've just done that with all my children, you should be level six, no good doing it, you should be it want you to do two pieces of work for monday and all the same level, so there's an extra two you've got to do. -and what homework do you, what do they get what homework do they get over christmas? -they get poem, my greatest fear and they get a project homework from lynn. +well correlation i've just done that with all my children, you should be level six, no good doing it, you should be it want you to do two pieces of work for monday and all the same level, so there's an extra two you've got to do. +and what homework do you, what do they get what homework do they get over christmas? +they get poem, my greatest fear and they get a project homework from lynn. so how many homeworks do they get, two? -yeah how many have you got? +yeah how many have you got? five. rubbish! clap trap! that word would go down well. -you know that lady that did the thing so lary what did you w and you say the children w meant knew what it meant, what did they say it meant? -well sort of meant all knowing. -no lary means something like it's sort of like someone mm +you know that lady that did the thing so lary what did you w and you say the children w meant knew what it meant, what did they say it meant? +well sort of meant all knowing. +no lary means something like it's sort of like someone mm ah you know that word as well. yeah well how do you spell it? l a r y. l a r y? -yes it it's lary, it's sort of like someone insults you like they er you've only got four toes and so i'll say that's well lary! +yes it it's lary, it's sort of like someone insults you like they er you've only got four toes and so i'll say that's well lary! and then y but i take that then what like an insult? -lary, yeah like hey you when and got too lary! +lary, yeah like hey you when and got too lary! sounds like aunty sheila's mardy got it? she says mardy don't she? -lary everyone's going oh that's lary but -well i've never heard of it and they i said -but and you called james a moron or something like that +lary everyone's going oh that's lary but +well i've never heard of it and they i said +but and you called james a moron or something like that yeah but he goes moron @@ -77606,22 +77541,22 @@ no lary. rude? yeah. no i'm sure he didn't mean rude. -not unkind, it's like you shouldn't take that from him that's bad get him out ding da ding ding ding ding ding boo boo diddle erm, doo doo doo doo diddle erm dum dum dum diddle erm ding ding diddle er er diddle er yeah yeah doo diddle erm doo doo dee dee dee boom boom diddle erm boom . +not unkind, it's like you shouldn't take that from him that's bad get him out ding da ding ding ding ding ding boo boo diddle erm, doo doo doo doo diddle erm dum dum dum diddle erm ding ding diddle er er diddle er yeah yeah doo diddle erm doo doo dee dee dee boom boom diddle erm boom . hurry up! -i'm moving, i'm scrooving, i'm dooving this is hard, got to take all these notes and just put them into all sort of a summary. +i'm moving, i'm scrooving, i'm dooving this is hard, got to take all these notes and just put them into all sort of a summary. spell summary. -s u m m a r y today is saturday. -is there any connection why have you coloured it in red biro! -and oh i don't really know. +s u m m a r y today is saturday. +is there any connection why have you coloured it in red biro! +and oh i don't really know. that doesn't show anything! -yet the january, february, march the temperature is high which is temperature i can't tell by looking at that, which one's temperature and which one's rainfall. +yet the january, february, march the temperature is high which is temperature i can't tell by looking at that, which one's temperature and which one's rainfall. that's temperature and that's rainfall. yeah but which line refers to which, how can i tell? -you need to put the dotted line there and square there +you need to put the dotted line there and square there no you can look like that. how? -rain, ten millimetres of rain equals one millimetre ten of rain equals one millimetre and this one one degrees celsius equals -well i'm sorry i don't think that is very clever for you! +rain, ten millimetres of rain equals one millimetre ten of rain equals one millimetre and this one one degrees celsius equals +well i'm sorry i don't think that is very clever for you! there and one degrees, how can temperature what? @@ -77629,12 +77564,12 @@ one degree celsius equals one millimetre yes. so it's twenty five degrees celsius in january? no. -well i thought it wouldn't be a bad idea to put some sort of clue on it. +well i thought it wouldn't be a bad idea to put some sort of clue on it. we've got twelve people coming, right? -er yep what's that gotta do with anything? -well cos i'm gonna have pairs i think here +er yep what's that gotta do with anything? +well cos i'm gonna have pairs i think here and one you! -oh singles then? +oh singles then? it's more no fun in pairs isn't it cos the people can have the scraggle and talk to each other. @@ -77645,12 +77580,12 @@ put michael with oh yeah if you put michael with two other people, it's completely fair. but then your implying something aren't you. -why don't you say if you're a child you can go in a group of three, if your adults you'll have to be in a group of two, so the children can attach themselves to any group. +why don't you say if you're a child you can go in a group of three, if your adults you'll have to be in a group of two, so the children can attach themselves to any group. right. right. -you've got eleven people you need four groups you don't have four groups it's not worth doing is it? -gotta share it all out perfect even why don't you say, stick it on the wall, give them each a piece of paper and they've gotta do it i've got an idea, you can compile a quiz -fine i'm +you've got eleven people you need four groups you don't have four groups it's not worth doing is it? +gotta share it all out perfect even why don't you say, stick it on the wall, give them each a piece of paper and they've gotta do it i've got an idea, you can compile a quiz +fine i'm and then you could have a treasure hunt for the children you know couldn't i. @@ -77664,40 +77599,40 @@ your father! what? have a chart. heart. -you'll let people overlook each other then sort of overlooking +you'll let people overlook each other then sort of overlooking cheating you mean! -yes i mean that's the first thing you have to say, you have to think when you look at you keep, anybody who does the whispering +yes i mean that's the first thing you have to say, you have to think when you look at you keep, anybody who does the whispering is mum. -is giving their answers away in fact, what we did, the team of four, is they all had a little pad of paper, if you spotted something you knew, you went and you wrote it down because people we there. +is giving their answers away in fact, what we did, the team of four, is they all had a little pad of paper, if you spotted something you knew, you went and you wrote it down because people we there. you did it in silence. -yeah tried to do and they obviously can't. -why aren't you gonna for faces. +yeah tried to do and they obviously can't. +why aren't you gonna for faces. well this th this is the the faces and i thought i'd do the maps and the rest were questions i don't know whether y should do some questions. well you'll have to think of some. -yeah i'll see how i go any +yeah i'll see how i go any you got the maps of south america? yeah. -i've got one at work a blank, you should of asked me for it. +i've got one at work a blank, you should of asked me for it. what all split up, yeah? yeah. oh. -i could get it tomorrow morning in my +i could get it tomorrow morning in my yeah could you? blanked out without the er the countries names yes in it? oh yeah. -i've got all the countries blanks might not oh i might not even have the countries on but if you had blanks you could put countries in, that'll be easier than +i've got all the countries blanks might not oh i might not even have the countries on but if you had blanks you could put countries in, that'll be easier than no that'll be harder. -no what the boundaries? -yes because if you've got the scale you just drop, trace it all off where as you got the you've the you gotta sort out work out i th the scale of everything, haven't you? +no what the boundaries? +yes because if you've got the scale you just drop, trace it all off where as you got the you've the you gotta sort out work out i th the scale of everything, haven't you? no you just draw the lines. yeah but how do you ge what scale? -how you going to know exactly where the boundaries go or i in between some land-lock countries that you got it in the right position +how you going to know exactly where the boundaries go or i in between some land-lock countries that you got it in the right position how many land-lock countries are there in south america? -well enough anyway, i mean i thought you were giving me something easier to do not -well i think why would you do it tonight if i didn't have it? +well enough anyway, i mean i thought you were giving me something easier to do not +well i think why would you do it tonight if i didn't have it? yes say i didn't have it tomorrow you'd well @@ -77706,19 +77641,19 @@ probably ni or tomorrow i was gonna do that. i seem to think you should take the easy bit, cos that's gonna be miles too hard! no i like to balance it, i ju there's some balance there, there's some easy ones and some hard ones. i'll tell you what's best for michael. -i don't feel that's very good because you're just gonna get children totally pull out of it unless they're +i don't feel that's very good because you're just gonna get children totally pull out of it unless they're no. really really good. -children are allowed to go -you find that if if if i in a team, if there's teams i you find that in a singles, but if there's a team e if everybody feels the everybody feels they can contribute something to it when you've got -you can have those +children are allowed to go +you find that if if if i in a team, if there's teams i you find that in a singles, but if there's a team e if everybody feels the everybody feels they can contribute something to it when you've got +you can have those allowed to be the idea of that, you don't wanna make it yeah i know -too easy -no there are no husbands allowed to be with any wife and children can attach themselves to which group they want. +too easy +no there are no husbands allowed to be with any wife and children can attach themselves to which group they want. so work out the groups, you work out the groups. -well there's going to be apart from your father there's going to be seven adults. -listen, a man with a woman but not wi not by marriage cos say like andy with nanna +well there's going to be apart from your father there's going to be seven adults. +listen, a man with a woman but not wi not by marriage cos say like andy with nanna well i could go with two children, i expect. well write down the names let's have a go at, let's work out, let's work out the teams cos i'm the cleverest person, i can go with two teenies! @@ -77732,8 +77667,8 @@ can i, thank you. then people don't argue then do they, if they say look that's the team then th people are h happy. there's nanna and margarite, if i find him another -yes, they don't know cos they're both daily mail readers and i'm cutting the majority of these out. -and and maybe an adult +yes, they don't know cos they're both daily mail readers and i'm cutting the majority of these out. +and and maybe an adult don't put no four groups, is all you'll get out of twelve people. don't put michelle and andy together. @@ -77741,11 +77676,11 @@ i'm not? don't put papa a nanna and er adrian -and kevin with andrew yeah no not kev and andrew because +and kevin with andrew yeah no not kev and andrew because erm mooty yeah. mooty and michelle -hang on i +hang on i what other adult is there? there's only me is karen quite good? @@ -77755,21 +77690,21 @@ three, four will be as sharp as iron can i be with papa then? it'll have to be me with papa. -okay . +okay . that's the eight adults. who're you putting karen with? be careful cos karen is the andy. andy. no that's far tha well -think again isn't that +think again isn't that nanna and michelle and mooty, why you think that's too clever? -andy an andy and karen will streak through. +andy an andy and karen will streak through. what better than michelle and mooty? i bet you. -she generations though. -i bet i'll give you a bet karen will win it. +she generations though. +i bet i'll give you a bet karen will win it. what about papa? who you gonna put karen because @@ -77784,26 +77719,26 @@ it should be no it'll have to be karen and andy cos mooty and andy! yeah? -cos the others are different generations, they're at a disadvantage cos they're the same generation andy +cos the others are different generations, they're at a disadvantage cos they're the same generation andy yeah. and karen. yeah so -karen doesn't read the mail and nor does andrew. +karen doesn't read the mail and nor does andrew. you'd be surprised, karen's well read, newspaper wise she's not oh of course or something. -right you got that'll do, i think unless your father wants to +right you got that'll do, i think unless your father wants to no. now three of those groups can have a child should be with nanna and adrian. no. why not? -you mean you with nanna and adrian yeah i think you should +you mean you with nanna and adrian yeah i think you should okay. -be with them put michael with andrew and karen tha +be with them put michael with andrew and karen tha which one are you gonna have? who can have lisa, me and papa or michael an mi michelle and mooty? -see i'm in so me th th they'll all be able to contribute. +see i'm in so me th th they'll all be able to contribute. michelle and mooty. that's right cross michael out then? @@ -77812,13 +77747,13 @@ cross michael out. why? just cross him out. why? -you've gotta think of the generations they would be more likely to lead a pop star or sort of person that would know all those those sort of things, put michael with michelle and mooty and lisa with papa and mum -be careful who you put mooty with cos mooty +you've gotta think of the generations they would be more likely to lead a pop star or sort of person that would know all those those sort of things, put michael with michelle and mooty and lisa with papa and mum +be careful who you put mooty with cos mooty i've put her with michelle! oh that's alright, that's fine, yes. -and lisa with papa and you. +and lisa with papa and you. so that left andrew and karen on their own? -yes that's fair +yes that's fair do you think that's fair? sorry? andrew and karen, you think @@ -77827,53 +77762,53 @@ they're so clever that they're yeah. going to beat anybody else? they will win. -yeah, so listen to this nanna, adrian and me +yeah, so listen to this nanna, adrian and me go to dad. okay i'll read it out, nanna, adrian and me, dad? make up on. okay? sorry? -nanna, adrian and me papa, mum and lisa andrew and karen -he's not listening he's not listening +nanna, adrian and me papa, mum and lisa andrew and karen +he's not listening he's not listening i am yes michelle , mooty and michael. that's alright. is it after lunch, i presume? yes. -i knew michelle and mooty would need somebody else cos you know michelle mooty would have a . +i knew michelle and mooty would need somebody else cos you know michelle mooty would have a . paul you gonna throw me another pencil i seem to have lost paul don't belittle the lost one. older generation. no but s throw me a pencil please? -i'm just saying would she know about michael jackson and all that sort of stuff. +i'm just saying would she know about michael jackson and all that sort of stuff. is daddy putting michael jackson in? -i don't know, he's bound to put in, i hope. -i'm not giving any clues away i'm balancing as best i can. +i don't know, he's bound to put in, i hope. +i'm not giving any clues away i'm balancing as best i can. what do you want? pencil, i know you couldn't concentrate on three things! -comet have you used the match box? -yes that brown crayon you've got in your hand'll do. +comet have you used the match box? +yes that brown crayon you've got in your hand'll do. why, why will it do? -well you seem a bit desperate. +well you seem a bit desperate. what you gonna do with it? right so you're going to go work well -after i've gone to have you? +after i've gone to have you? yeah. -you can go to work when the tape stops well he's not going to watch you sticking all those on at work what's he gonna be doing. +you can go to work when the tape stops well he's not going to watch you sticking all those on at work what's he gonna be doing. he's doing his homework. -i can draw some sides just like i can put i could make a just draw neatly in the teams bi on a big piece of paper that'll make it look really good,. -and when were you going to do the map of you can't do that map tomorrow can you? +i can draw some sides just like i can put i could make a just draw neatly in the teams bi on a big piece of paper that'll make it look really good,. +and when were you going to do the map of you can't do that map tomorrow can you? yeah. well when will you do that at work then? before or after football? i'll slot it in sometime tomorrow. -right, fine wish you could slot into washing up mood. +right, fine wish you could slot into washing up mood. ooh there's a hard one. there. -ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh that'll sort out the i'd like someone to say, i'd like to have one or two that nobody gets. +ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh that'll sort out the i'd like someone to say, i'd like to have one or two that nobody gets. is there a prize? what do you mean? sorry? @@ -77885,13 +77820,13 @@ er little individuals is it? well they'll have to be equal prizes wouldn't they? i've got it! -whichever team wins th the cha children can give out the christmas presents. +whichever team wins th the cha children can give out the christmas presents. what christmas presents? those presents up there. big deal! can't fool you. -well i've never prize -it's only it's only fun, i mean what are you gonna give them? +well i've never prize +it's only it's only fun, i mean what are you gonna give them? the team that wins gets their presents. he said i used to laugh at my dad when he used to do these quizzes but when that's why you'll start getting more and more like your dad. @@ -77905,7 +77840,7 @@ scrap? scer er ap . why? one little bit, i wouldn't argue with her. -you could do a treasure hunt, dad dad +you could do a treasure hunt, dad dad mm? you could do a treasure hunt. no it's too hard. @@ -77917,16 +77852,16 @@ who? no he no go upstairs th in pairs if they wanna do it, quietly. upstairs and find . getting silly! -you should have answers up there and each person has their gro group reading one in the breakfast room +you should have answers up there and each person has their gro group reading one in the breakfast room but we got go grammatical each person has to speak. -why don't they go out well i can have somewhere else but they can all have their quiet place to talk. +why don't they go out well i can have somewhere else but they can all have their quiet place to talk. is it tonight casualty on? eh? fridays? done today's paper? don't know. can i have it then. -then cut it up, i don't know you cannot loo go through you cannot go through those! +then cut it up, i don't know you cannot loo go through you cannot go through those! i only want the television page i don't care for friday kevin @@ -77943,18 +77878,18 @@ no mum can do them. i might win. mum can do mathematical sums. -i've got a lovely mental test for the children it's a bit hard. +i've got a lovely mental test for the children it's a bit hard. is it? better than -two one one i am so tired, i've got to get up early tomorrow , right i want that recorded twenty one thirty, shall i her out? -yes you better had +two one one i am so tired, i've got to get up early tomorrow , right i want that recorded twenty one thirty, shall i her out? +yes you better had as well. oh where are your keys? paul can you turn this thing to nought. yes. -or on this one or you have to have the other one? -the other one should be a button i've pressed the button just lift this up button she set, there you go. -thank you so if i press play and record now twenty one thirty, twenty two thirty it's half past ten thirty five to half past ten that's alright so if i press play and record now it should come on at wha one and a half and ten one forty so it should come on when it says one forty. +or on this one or you have to have the other one? +the other one should be a button i've pressed the button just lift this up button she set, there you go. +thank you so if i press play and record now twenty one thirty, twenty two thirty it's half past ten thirty five to half past ten that's alright so if i press play and record now it should come on at wha one and a half and ten one forty so it should come on when it says one forty. shoe shoes shoe i took them upstairs. where are you going? @@ -77965,9 +77900,9 @@ when are we leaving? dad? mm? when we leaving? -in a minute oh this is it oh no they're not re releasing in that cor look at this he's not doing the one, he's doing all his christmas ones together . +in a minute oh this is it oh no they're not re releasing in that cor look at this he's not doing the one, he's doing all his christmas ones together . who? -cliff that's why they did it, cos they put them all together. +cliff that's why they did it, cos they put them all together. mm? clever i think. right i got my key then. @@ -77977,11 +77912,11 @@ right, yeah. well will you be very late? no. see you then. -hello my name's geoffrey chaucer and i'm going now, bye. -are paul are erm manchester united playing in their blue strip today, will they do you think? +hello my name's geoffrey chaucer and i'm going now, bye. +are paul are erm manchester united playing in their blue strip today, will they do you think? yeah. that's their unlucky strip. -let's hope +let's hope it's a disgusting strip. that awful white and blue yeah. @@ -77992,7 +77927,7 @@ not with a red no. so, we're so much like red aren't we? red and blue. -team's us they can't have red or blue either . +team's us they can't have red or blue either . what did they have, what colour did they have before the blue? oh it was blue last year wasn't it? it was a bluey weirdy one before @@ -78006,7 +77941,7 @@ they played the cup final in white didn't they? yeah. right. i looked up the teletext and it said full squad for manchester united. -even paul parker's fit. +even paul parker's fit. so they've got the full not the palace full squad? man united? @@ -78019,7 +77954,7 @@ i don't think don't think that's, that means that i don't think. i hope not. that's all we need. -i've got to try and make sure the petrol lasts till the texaco garage +i've got to try and make sure the petrol lasts till the texaco garage when's that? where is the texaco garage? that one by carshalton ponds i don't think there's any one nearer is there? @@ -78030,71 +77965,71 @@ been to it before but not for a long time . is this the a three or the m twenty five? a three. lovely new road. -be kind of funny to see the mascots going on knowing what they've done . +be kind of funny to see the mascots going on knowing what they've done . oh yeah. -except they'll have had a four course meal to eat. +except they'll have had a four course meal to eat. will they? -well maybe. +well maybe. does that mean they would have if they have it at the ? on saturday well i mean it's the option to have it saturday. i don't know, at at that price i don't know. i don't think very many do. really don't. fast. -did you see that erm did you hear that in the zenith data +did you see that erm did you hear that in the zenith data yes. -er game? -when the q p r man interviewed the ref. -the the sky television man interviewed the , +er game? +when the q p r man interviewed the ref. +the the sky television man interviewed the , oh yeah. he said what's the coin? -and he says nineteen sixty two when i started reffing and he said the oth they're not i'm not giving them this one but these two are for the other mascot scene. +and he says nineteen sixty two when i started reffing and he said the oth they're not i'm not giving them this one but these two are for the other mascot scene. you lost out there didn't you really ? they were badges. they gave themselves badges . -oh badges. +oh badges. oh. what did you ref say? -no chance sorry you can't have it? +no chance sorry you can't have it? dunno. -geoff thomas sent for +geoff thomas sent for he asked on your behalf didn't he? yeah. well you can't ask any more of geoff thomas than that i suppose. -i wonder why that little bit was in the paper about geoff thomas being absolutely priceless? +i wonder why that little bit was in the paper about geoff thomas being absolutely priceless? was it cos someone's what bit? someone's after him again? what bit? there was a little article in the sun i told you about. -alan smith saying geoff thomas is absolutely priceless. -er all he's got to do is score more goals. +alan smith saying geoff thomas is absolutely priceless. +er all he's got to do is score more goals. that's what i couldn't understand. what a nerve! .i think he meant for england. all he had to do to seal his england career was pop in a two, a few goals like he does at palace yeah. -and er could be on the way to a regular spot. +and er could be on the way to a regular spot. he is in a regular spot at the moment. well i don't know. hope, hope that's true. -yeah but well you look that that jaguar four litres! +yeah but well you look that that jaguar four litres! . four litre car! yeah but what are you gonna do with four litres? i dunno. well quite. -it does about eighteen miles to the gallon. +it does about eighteen miles to the gallon. how many miles do we do to the gallon? i hope we do something like thirty six. thirty six! don't think it's much more than that. -how can his, well if ours is one point six there's three times +how can his, well if ours is one point six there's three times no it doesn't work that way. it doesn't work like that? no. -so what how long will it take him to get eighty miles filling up every ? +so what how long will it take him to get eighty miles filling up every ? well i mean do they have huge tanks? -i mean they take if you, if you filled up you could put i think it's about twenty six gallons in that car. +i mean they take if you, if you filled up you could put i think it's about twenty six gallons in that car. and how many can we put in? nine? eleven? @@ -78105,7 +78040,7 @@ i think this might take eleven. so how much do they spend if they filled it ? don't forget if you've got all that weight, you've got that you're gonna lose even more petrol. so if you filled that up, how much would that cost them? -well, twenty six i think it's something like isn't it something like two pounds a gallon now? +well, twenty six i think it's something like isn't it something like two pounds a gallon now? you don't, they do it all by litres now so it's really hard about fifty p? about fifty, fifty pounds? @@ -78119,21 +78054,21 @@ i suppose you have to be able to afford all that if you can afford the car in th right. yeah if you have to moan about that you shouldn't be driving it in the first place. motto, what? -motto of the story is er er don't, don't buy expensive cars if you're gonna want to run the thing though. +motto of the story is er er don't, don't buy expensive cars if you're gonna want to run the thing though. you've spent all your money on this car. -all of a sudden you realize -well like that new advert for the rover he says don't, i keep thinking my back my back tailgate's flapping or i keep hearing, you keep hearing creaking don't you? +all of a sudden you realize +well like that new advert for the rover he says don't, i keep thinking my back my back tailgate's flapping or i keep hearing, you keep hearing creaking don't you? a creak here and you think what's that, what's this, what's that? so that new rover has been built so everything fits perfectly, right? so nothing rattles. what do you mean nothing? no toleran er the tolerance is you know minimal. -whereas the tolerance here'd be i dunno eighth of an inch here eighth of an inch there he says the advert says as soon as you have tolerances like that then thing work loose and start rattling and creaking and +whereas the tolerance here'd be i dunno eighth of an inch here eighth of an inch there he says the advert says as soon as you have tolerances like that then thing work loose and start rattling and creaking and e e. you can hear it go e e er e. yeah. -you imagine cruising in a car, lovely car like that and it makes no noise. -just cruising away and it just like glides, and you glide you know like, like papa's citroen type that kind of suspension. +you imagine cruising in a car, lovely car like that and it makes no noise. +just cruising away and it just like glides, and you glide you know like, like papa's citroen type that kind of suspension. yeah. is this a new rover? crikey what was that? @@ -78143,26 +78078,26 @@ yeah. was this a new, is this a new rover ? carving everybody up. yes. -that was er that, yeah well it's not out yet is it? -looks like a looks like the front of a b m w to me. +that was er that, yeah well it's not out yet is it? +looks like a looks like the front of a b m w to me. i think that's what they're trying to emulate. oh that one. how much is it? supposed to be. don't know how much it costs. -should think it starts at about sixteen, seventeen thousand . +should think it starts at about sixteen, seventeen thousand . yeah . a three's heavy isn't it? look. yeah. so you got any ideas what you're gonna get, what you should get mum for ? er. -we could just fall back on a bit of sweets and chocolate or something in the end but i'd like to get some -what what sort of thing are you gonna get her? +we could just fall back on a bit of sweets and chocolate or something in the end but i'd like to get some +what what sort of thing are you gonna get her? there's some funny little weird shops down thornton heath aren't there? what sort of thing are we talking about? well i dunno. -something i'm not i've no idea until i see it. +something i'm not i've no idea until i see it. well something like soap or what? could get her some, some toiletries or something. i dunno. @@ -78171,16 +78106,16 @@ a moss chemist might be able to get her some bromley don't they? there is a moss chemist on the way. oh yes she did tell me that she'd like some of that. yes there is one isn't there? -by shops. -right we, we'll we'll treat that as a fail safe then. -if we can't see anything more unusual suppose we could always fall back on the bubble baths or the anyway i think that's a bit more than but there you go. +by shops. +right we, we'll we'll treat that as a fail safe then. +if we can't see anything more unusual suppose we could always fall back on the bubble baths or the anyway i think that's a bit more than but there you go. they're off to football aren't they? look at that! -i've never seen a metro so full. +i've never seen a metro so full. how many people are there in it? five. five full adults. -look really down on his haunches. +look really down on his haunches. oh yeah! low! it's really low innit? @@ -78200,7 +78135,7 @@ you wanted to let who go? i wanted to let that car go, i was why? well i like to be polite. -i don't like the people like this who who straddle across you and just stop you. +i don't like the people like this who who straddle across you and just stop you. mm. specially when they're indians. come on, let him go for goodness sake. @@ -78208,35 +78143,35 @@ what's that plonker holding that sony thing for! yeah i i held up a traffic jam of about sixty cars doing that . there's . still there. -do you judy then? +do you judy then? somebody call judy. judy, yeah . yes it's judy. ah! -what did the say up there? +what did the say up there? i don't know. wah. -i think we're gonna have to invite erm adrian again. +i think we're gonna have to invite erm adrian again. one of these football evening matches we could couldn't we? yeah. -i'm gonna see how many people i can let go across here, between here and palace. +i'm gonna see how many people i can let go across here, between here and palace. right four do you wanna count? oh no i did four at that one and i just did one there. that's five all together now. five. -five five times i was polite. +five five times i was polite. no but they, they just ran out in front of you, those other four. -no, well no i let them go though. -well the third one did. +no, well no i let them go though. +well the third one did. so we're counting from five? five yeah. -only ones i don't like are the ones in like oh that doesn't matter cos he's allowed to do that cos it's a keep clear zone there. +only ones i don't like are the ones in like oh that doesn't matter cos he's allowed to do that cos it's a keep clear zone there. i wonder if they're going to our match here, do you think? -they look like a football crowd don't they? +they look like a football crowd don't they? not really. do they? -well i dunno +well i dunno it's a woman a woman driving it. is it? yes. @@ -78245,36 +78180,36 @@ perhaps not then. four men so if we get there early enough do you feel like a wimpy? a wimpy? -sony, sony sony sony me sony -i don't know what that's a tiny little shop for a sony isn't it? +sony, sony sony sony me sony +i don't know what that's a tiny little shop for a sony isn't it? yeah. oh it's not a sony shop though look. -it's audio sony advert. +it's audio sony advert. oh. i bet they've got one of these tape recorders in it though. mm. -sony me sony sony me sony . +sony me sony sony me sony . a wimpy? cheapskates. -they don't put the lights on in this christmas thing till it's slightly dusk. +they don't put the lights on in this christmas thing till it's slightly dusk. i know. well we can't hardly see them now. -well you well you would be able to though wouldn't you? +well you well you would be able to though wouldn't you? would you? you wouldn't want to put them on, they're not so spectacular are they? -cuts cuts down on the electricity bill. +cuts cuts down on the electricity bill. plus two sports. -it's funny, every time we've sat at our seats that bloke has come to ask the chap next to me +it's funny, every time we've sat at our seats that bloke has come to ask the chap next to me yeah. what he thinks of the match hasn't he? -. there hasn't been one game we've been there that he hasn't or both of them haven't . +. there hasn't been one game we've been there that he hasn't or both of them haven't . suppose they're both season ticket holders. -james was well gutted on friday . -james right like mr right he didn't know right and we have this sort of erm water fountain and he was running towards it and he, and he filled up his mouth with it and he was spitting it everywhere and we were all sort of getting out the way and mr told him if you don't want to drink it then leave it alone and he sort of turned and walked away. -mr who's quite strict isn't he? +james was well gutted on friday . +james right like mr right he didn't know right and we have this sort of erm water fountain and he was running towards it and he, and he filled up his mouth with it and he was spitting it everywhere and we were all sort of getting out the way and mr told him if you don't want to drink it then leave it alone and he sort of turned and walked away. +mr who's quite strict isn't he? yeah. he looks -he badminton. +he badminton. james oh does he? james was really unlucky. @@ -78284,7 +78219,7 @@ yeah. that's rather disgusting though i know. putting water in and spitting it out. -he should have remembered because always walks down there on fridays to do his badminton class. +he should have remembered because always walks down there on fridays to do his badminton class. did he give him a de de detention or not? no, he told him to get away. yeah well always mucks around on fridays don't they? @@ -78292,16 +78227,16 @@ sort of like ah no more school for about two days. more relaxed mood. james is very excitable yeah. -now when i, when we went to that open day that mr is very stern isn't he? +now when i, when we went to that open day that mr is very stern isn't he? mm yeah. -didn't think it helped he'd, just before we got there his biro had exploded in his pocket . +didn't think it helped he'd, just before we got there his biro had exploded in his pocket . all the ink was all over his shirt, it was coming out all over the place. i don't think he was in the best of moods when he, we got to him. but he seemed very very stern. -he doesn't smile very much. +he doesn't smile very much. no. terse. -we have his wife er mrs for english. +we have his wife er mrs for english. and you say they're nothing to do with mark no. ? @@ -78325,7 +78260,7 @@ but they are. i don't think he's i don't think he's interested as you is he really? no, nowhere near. -but he's probably not there. +but he's probably not there. he's probably at a party or something like that, or yeah. i don't think he's got any lack of things to do, has he? @@ -78353,7 +78288,7 @@ don't know. can't remember. on the computer most of the time. and i took part in some of their tests. -i got better results than some of the actual fifteen year olds. +i got better results than some of the actual fifteen year olds. that'll be quite good about your maths test won't it? cos you'll be, you're doing it again with, like that aren't you? your maths @@ -78362,23 +78297,23 @@ yeah. you could get better than them. yeah. virtually every year the eighth, eighth year always does get better than the ninth year. -look that house is really old. +look that house is really old. look it's got the plaque on it. what's a plaque mean? is that a fire station thing? -well yeah it's yeah. +well yeah it's yeah. no no it's not but it's, it's saying how old those houses are. all, all these yeah? are really old. they look quite new. yeah. -well no they're kept to look like new really old. +well no they're kept to look like new really old. were th , were those white boards always there? -it's got a surrey surrey badge on it look. +it's got a surrey surrey badge on it look. building of historical interest. what's so historic about that? -don't know well it's probably near erm three or four hundred years or something. +don't know well it's probably near erm three or four hundred years or something. yeah. everything's old around here isn't it? apart from it's sort of like everything's old that side @@ -78389,7 +78324,7 @@ talk about that being out of place. look at that. what? well -what budgens? +what budgens? that bloke looks like your derek doesn't he? the old sunday school teacher. what in the car? @@ -78400,27 +78335,27 @@ nice. he's only got a beat up old metro. yeah. spent four hundred pounds on it. -they, they had a documentary on metros apparently and the me they said that metros of a certain period for about, i think from his period sort of a registration, b registration, y registration they're absolute rubbish apparently. +they, they had a documentary on metros apparently and the me they said that metros of a certain period for about, i think from his period sort of a registration, b registration, y registration they're absolute rubbish apparently. yeah. you know, all the rusting and everything, they've improved now. the me if he had a metro now he'd, you'd get a better deal but they said that they're cheap though aren't they? well yes but not cheap if you have to keep replacing them and -think he'll probably buy a new car probably. -photographic photo service. +think he'll probably buy a new car probably. +photographic photo service. how do you spell sergeant? i've always wondered that. is that how you act is that sergeant? -erm yes. +erm yes. it's not s a r? -er i think the american version is and i think that's the english version and that's right. +er i think the american version is and i think that's the english version and that's right. so his name is actually somebody sergeant? yeah. ooh i wouldn't mind buying that, look. for sale, doesn't say a price though, but look, doesn't half look new doesn't it? where? complete new opel body i reckon he's got there. -t registration but opel manta. +t registration but opel manta. nice. genesis. who's that? @@ -78428,7 +78363,7 @@ oh that's phil collins isn't it. this corner here gets worse and worse, traffic lights and yet the traffic yeah. gets further and further back. -and yet two or three years ago it used to stop up there. +and yet two or three years ago it used to stop up there. now you stop further, now you're almost stopping on the lights. the lights are getting clogged up . yeah. @@ -78438,8 +78373,8 @@ don't they? that wood. no. no. -suppose it's not very zoopy sport does it, like ? -no, it's not conducive as a sporty image the walnut facia. +suppose it's not very zoopy sport does it, like ? +no, it's not conducive as a sporty image the walnut facia. facia. don't think. how do they make that building curved? @@ -78453,7 +78388,7 @@ they're always for sale. there's always a for sale sign out outside one of those or one of those. i reckon it's one of those flats, you can always get a flat there. are they flats? -so many that, er yeah, so many of them that soon as one's sold somebody else sells another one. +so many that, er yeah, so many of them that soon as one's sold somebody else sells another one. yeah. well how many are there? seventeen to twenty @@ -78464,17 +78399,17 @@ yeah. specially both sides. yellow flag coming out of his aerial. oh where would you prefer your ae aerial? -would you like it there up there or at the back? +would you like it there up there or at the back? up there's alright. -i like it the way the ones that you can close each time, now i'm sure my aerial will last longer. +i like it the way the ones that you can close each time, now i'm sure my aerial will last longer. cos you can what do you mean close. well it compacts. oh yeah. -the ones that stick out all the time, they i suppose that is good. +the ones that stick out all the time, they i suppose that is good. if you have one that doesn't compact, you you're best to have one in the middle cos it's less likely to get pranged there isn't it? yeah. -here like walkers by can bend it and oh look. +here like walkers by can bend it and oh look. here's my next one. six. i've let six go now. @@ -78483,7 +78418,7 @@ i didn't, no i haven't. no. haven't had the opportunity to. what is this lady dressed up like? -what has she got on ? +what has she got on ? what has she got on her hair? weird. bunch of wool . @@ -78502,8 +78437,8 @@ there's loads of new garages going in all over the place. volvo could have let that one go but i was too late. yeah. -volvo seem to be moving out all over the place. -i think they're trying to set up er nought, their own things rather than just joining petrol stations. +volvo seem to be moving out all over the place. +i think they're trying to set up er nought, their own things rather than just joining petrol stations. where's the secombe centre back there. have you been to that place, holiday inn? @@ -78529,20 +78464,20 @@ eight! wow. eight people. wowsers eight people. -she's gonna sit there all day she's that far back . +she's gonna sit there all day she's that far back . funny. think it's obviously to do with trusting your car's power. -it's also being alert to watch. +it's also being alert to watch. i mean some people just don't expect you to let them out so they're dreaming mostly . yeah. -times you flash people er? +times you flash people er? and you have to flash flash flash flash flash before you know oh, oh, ooh! let her out. -you know, they're just, they're just waiting you know, sort of others are like on the ball almost too much. +you know, they're just, they're just waiting you know, sort of others are like on the ball almost too much. they whip across you before you've even thought about it. isn't texaco around there somewhere? texaco? -er no that's b p. +er no that's b p. texaco is round the corner. don't forgot to switch that off when we go in the garage. yeah. @@ -78560,7 +78495,7 @@ you have to send off. do you? yeah. but have you got a form or something to get at the garage? -er you can ask then. +er you can ask then. it's those ones where you just flick it around. what were they called? what were they called? @@ -78588,7 +78523,7 @@ the garage is here. yeah. sort of past half way. can't believe these are only forty five minutes. -cos we've been talking at least there. +cos we've been talking at least there. mm. this is a tricky one to get in to isn't it? this is the one, you know i went wrong in the b p? @@ -78600,23 +78535,23 @@ you know, went to the esso and i went all wrong and i couldn't le , i went down oh yeah. woman said no way . no way chummy. -oh there you are children should be application forms here. +oh there you are children should be application forms here. yeah it's going round. why must you check, every time? cos i think sometimes it doesn't . you just sit there thinking you're taping and you're not. oh. -er how did she get it on there? +er how did she get it on there? pooh. mummy's gonna say that's very strong, paul. -in fact put it at the back somewhere i think pong. +in fact put it at the back somewhere i think pong. no. why should we have it in the back? that's it. really strong innit? -can you put that in the in the glovebox then please. +can you put that in the in the glovebox then please. do you wanna bit of this? -no thank you bounty what's the egbert fund? +no thank you bounty what's the egbert fund? i'm supporting the egbert fund. do you know it? looks like er the spastic one. @@ -78626,30 +78561,30 @@ i don't think we'll pick spice again, do you? no. ooh! smells like somebody's lavatory . -looks like you'll have to sort of like put it up for a day and then take it down for a week and put it back in again. +looks like you'll have to sort of like put it up for a day and then take it down for a week and put it back in again. it's too much for one day . -you shou , perhaps you should have kept the bag on it. +you shou , perhaps you should have kept the bag on it. you know it's too strong to . you take the bag off, off it after a month or something. even your bounty must taste a bit poorly. yeah? yeah. -bet the bloke listening to this can hear it smell it. +bet the bloke listening to this can hear it smell it. i know. put it in there. . open the glovebox when we get yeah. -er hang on though, perhaps that's not so good. +er hang on though, perhaps that's not so good. i, it might make the sweets taint. mm. -i reckon we'll when, when we get out we'll put it in the boot and it'll filter through through on its own . +i reckon we'll when, when we get out we'll put it in the boot and it'll filter through through on its own . ooh dear! how about just keeping it in the bag? it's overcoming me. yeah. open your window, quick. -oh look. +oh look. panic. not everybody's window, paul . ah! @@ -78660,7 +78595,7 @@ in the bag. oh it's disgusting smell. and why did you hit this car? well you see -my son took his magic pongo tree out +my son took his magic pongo tree out and i was overcome, thus hitting the car in front. i see mr . do you expect us to believe that do you? @@ -78671,7 +78606,7 @@ can you leave that alone! i leant on it. lean out a bit cos i'm shutting the windows again. no i want it. -i +i i hope this traffic jam's not all the way to croydon. i do so hope. oh can you imagine what that purley way's gonna be like? @@ -78683,9 +78618,9 @@ at the moment i'm just trying to forget that awful spice stuff. innit? yeah i think you did wrong. you should, you shouldn't have er yeah. -you shouldn't have er opened the packet. +you shouldn't have er opened the packet. it's funny that shop didn't smell of it did it? -so i mean the seal must keep it all in until you open it up. +so i mean the seal must keep it all in until you open it up. ugh ugh. open it ugh . no it's quite a nice smell if it's like taken out now. @@ -78711,13 +78646,13 @@ yeah. you imagine what purley way's gonna be like ton , today. christmas shopping . awful -oh we're taking forget two o'clock. +oh we're taking forget two o'clock. i said two o'clock we'd be parking. stopped for petrol i suppose. yeah but dad, not for that long. so when will we park now? set an estimate -well look there's an estimation look they're parking, they're queuing on this brow of the hill instead of the other one. +well look there's an estimation look they're parking, they're queuing on this brow of the hill instead of the other one. everybody's got christmas fairs on haven't they? look, balloons. this is the day. @@ -78729,18 +78664,18 @@ yeah. it's the toy service tomorrow isn't it? is it? yeah. -that really is a strong +that really is a strong no it could, you could overcome, i wonder if there's a warning on the packet. do not open this and drive at the same time. really heady. on an empty stomach it's made me feel quite queasy. oh look he's done, someone's done that to his, look, look. -smashed his wing mirror, look jam a glass in it, er sock in it to stop the glass falling out . +smashed his wing mirror, look jam a glass in it, er sock in it to stop the glass falling out . oh it's not too bad. yes paul. well really you should have read shouldn't you? dad! -you told me to take it all the way out. +you told me to take it all the way out. should have got that blue one. i knew that was your fault. stinks! @@ -78748,21 +78683,21 @@ yes but you opened it all. actually i don't even want it anywhere near me. ah. it's gone all my nose funny now. -nose i've got my asthma. +nose i've got my asthma. asthma. asthma. by the way, if you can hear a word i say you're better than i am. oh get this out. phew. -i'll have to lob that -that car's got smile just to annoy everybody . +i'll have to lob that +that car's got smile just to annoy everybody . what? smile, just to annoy everybody that blue datsun says on what does that, what does that mean? ooh, yeah be pleasant and ooh. there you are, look, look you can read that ah. -i thought you meant that what about the one in front of it then? +i thought you meant that what about the one in front of it then? baby on board. i can't stand those ones. can you see? @@ -78776,8 +78711,8 @@ very long lasting. yes, very long lasting. hang on, i'm just opening the window again. recording commences at three past two. -with . -got a palace picture on. +with . +got a palace picture on. man united! oh. don't let them out. @@ -78785,8 +78720,8 @@ they can stay there. we hate united. hello again. hello, hello, hello. -who is that munching cashews on the tape . -here we go, you go right close, go ah! +who is that munching cashews on the tape . +here we go, you go right close, go ah! you wicked trickster you. would you like a cashew nut? you can't have a cashew nut. @@ -78797,7 +78732,7 @@ that's me! mm tasted nicer ones. can't afford to eat them like that! -mm can. +mm can. mm. lovely. should eat them about a quarter at a time. @@ -78822,7 +78757,7 @@ oh that's where you should go for your computer, look. p c world. yeah. this bit's not so bad. -once you get through that traffic light back there +once you get through that traffic light back there yeah. it's alright. mm. @@ -78836,12 +78771,12 @@ they make them longer during the evenings and saturday. orange! and this lot have got to go first haven't they? mm. -yeah . +yeah . quite ridiculous. far too long. far too long, yeah. how do people know it's gonna change? -they just sort of start their engines still red. +they just sort of start their engines still red. changes. regulars down here i should imagine. where? @@ -78849,7 +78784,7 @@ regulars probably who come down here and know regulars . they can count. yeah. -no they can probably see down the end and they +no they can probably see down the end and they well these lights used to be quite easy, didn't mind being stopped by them. now you're petrified of being stopped by any of them cos you know it's yeah. @@ -78880,12 +78815,12 @@ no. i'd sell bright. no i wouldn't sell bright. i'd buy someone first. -make sure someone was interested in . -i'd buy deane and swap bright in exchange for deane. -no matter how bad he doesn't like it he's well and truly gutted. +make sure someone was interested in . +i'd buy deane and swap bright in exchange for deane. +no matter how bad he doesn't like it he's well and truly gutted. er so him for deane and yeah but deane won't be available till the end of the season. -there's no way sheffield united +there's no way sheffield united er i dunno. just stoking the price up i think. cos it's not old bassett now, this is what it's all about. @@ -78896,14 +78831,14 @@ but deane didn't score today. it was beazley apparently. beazley. beazley. -er i might see if i could pick up that sheffield united guy jamie hoyland. +er i might see if i could pick up that sheffield united guy jamie hoyland. he's quite good. -as you say the main problem is, as you say is are you going to change your whole team, game +as you say the main problem is, as you say is are you going to change your whole team, game yeah. i don't know. -i think they'll do it slowly but not this slowly. +i think they'll do it slowly but not this slowly. i mean i th i think we should have bought someone along with er gabbiadini to play with him. -could just bring him and expect stuff. +could just bring him and expect stuff. mm could you get i think he's gonna have to raid the bottom divisions again, you know. what sort of bottom divisions? @@ -78920,30 +78855,30 @@ yes it was. three hundred and fifty. oh anyway, it was still pretty good wasn't it? wasn't cheap, i mean -no, but i mean you could see play really well . +no, but i mean you could see play really well . i mean southgate's all the more pleasing when you think he's somebody that's worked his way up, right? yeah. that's really nice to see. and he played really well. southgate is a harder person to mark isn't he? yeah. -i think i'd drop mortimer oh look, palace. -red car it's like ours isn't it? +i think i'd drop mortimer oh look, palace. +red car it's like ours isn't it? yeah. i'd drop, i'd drop paul mortimer yeah. and have collymore in right? -and encourage that's the trouble, you drop mortimer you drop somebody who can er flip the ball in but i think you definitely want to take the heat off wright. -now if if all collymore does is distract but mortimer was not playing enough of the game. -we can't afford people like mortimer to, i mean he scored a goal but i mean +and encourage that's the trouble, you drop mortimer you drop somebody who can er flip the ball in but i think you definitely want to take the heat off wright. +now if if all collymore does is distract but mortimer was not playing enough of the game. +we can't afford people like mortimer to, i mean he scored a goal but i mean yeah. -eddie i think is worth sheer sort of opening teams up. -well he does open, there's no not many players can play a team better like than opening up -so what'd you do, say you had back next week so our next game against birmingham. +eddie i think is worth sheer sort of opening teams up. +well he does open, there's no not many players can play a team better like than opening up +so what'd you do, say you had back next week so our next game against birmingham. what would you do then? well i mean they've got, they've got, he's gotta do something because you're gonna lose that birmingham game. can see that coming now. -but birmingham must have won today cos they had equal top must have won i would have thought. +but birmingham must have won today cos they had equal top must have won i would have thought. that's good. chelsea won one nil. how do you know? @@ -78951,23 +78886,23 @@ you'd have thought forest would have beaten chelsea wouldn't you?really annoyed yeah. i suppose so. what are you gonna buy mum? -he's gone the whole hog that guy hanging down to his +he's gone the whole hog that guy hanging down to his oh. so what are you gonna buy her? newbury fruits? or something like that, er -they did very well with those little tulip hand out things didn't they? -there's a lot of people who er don't, who would not have gone to the bother of going into the shop and buying a one pound or two pound or four pound +they did very well with those little tulip hand out things didn't they? +there's a lot of people who er don't, who would not have gone to the bother of going into the shop and buying a one pound or two pound or four pound but why did they do well out of them if they were free? well yeah they're free but they've got their advert on it haven't they? tulip -tulip tulip, i mean you're like a roving little advert aren't you? +tulip tulip, i mean you're like a roving little advert aren't you? i mean it, it draws your eye those little pictures doesn't it? -you +you oh he's got, he's got the hanging one at the front hasn't he? and he's got a badge on the right hand side as well. yeah. -so he really is +so he really is you see that guy next to us? he's got a palace earring hasn't he?on one of his ears. oh my goodness. @@ -78975,26 +78910,26 @@ on his left ear. he's nice though isn't he, wasn't he, he did say something yeah. i didn't have to say anything. -i said to him i don't know, he said did you enjoy yourself tuesday? +i said to him i don't know, he said did you enjoy yourself tuesday? oh i said, did you see us? oh yeah we saw you. and his dad's nice. yeah. but that other bloke was there but he wasn't in his normal place. -yes +yes why wasn't he in his normal place? palace played really well. -the first twenty five minutes, when you think we were one nil up right i thought gosh if we could get that second goal it would have made all the difference and united would have been really would have been in trouble. +the first twenty five minutes, when you think we were one nil up right i thought gosh if we could get that second goal it would have made all the difference and united would have been really would have been in trouble. was a good game though. oh i enjoyed it, yeah. -just don't enjoy palace losing, but sheer football and it just shows you that ironically the two games can match each other and there were chances for palace to wrap that game up. -but er when they do play that ball to ball business erm -yeah. -we look like we've got huge spaces in our in our midfield. -i mean that's what teams are doing now, they're realizing that's where all our weakness is in midfield so don't take a er a hefty boot and try and er er people like thorn and i mean thorn and young were impeccably they played beautifully today. -you cannot ask thorn and young, i've never seen two players play they do, they did th , they do the simple thing but they do it consistently well. -over and over again, maybe a hundred, hundred and fifty times in one match and they'll make one mistake and usually like coleman was there to c , i think coleman backed up well and gareth backed up well once or twice. -but defence wise superb. +just don't enjoy palace losing, but sheer football and it just shows you that ironically the two games can match each other and there were chances for palace to wrap that game up. +but er when they do play that ball to ball business erm +yeah. +we look like we've got huge spaces in our in our midfield. +i mean that's what teams are doing now, they're realizing that's where all our weakness is in midfield so don't take a er a hefty boot and try and er er people like thorn and i mean thorn and young were impeccably they played beautifully today. +you cannot ask thorn and young, i've never seen two players play they do, they did th , they do the simple thing but they do it consistently well. +over and over again, maybe a hundred, hundred and fifty times in one match and they'll make one mistake and usually like coleman was there to c , i think coleman backed up well and gareth backed up well once or twice. +but defence wise superb. absolutely su , there was a lapse with that guy, don't know who was to blame about that third goal but i mean it was young. er young let it plop over @@ -79003,7 +78938,7 @@ it was like, it was like a, like they were waiting for an offside or some there but it was the same when palace scored and exactly the same thing happened didn't it? why do they lapse? it's weird. -yeah, it's well they do say both sides that it's the most dangerous time straight after a goal. +yeah, it's well they do say both sides that it's the most dangerous time straight after a goal. i mean often, times you see teams equalize immediately. you know it's like, you sometimes you can go a whole game like seventy minutes of a game and no-one's had a goal scoring chance yeah. @@ -79014,12 +78949,12 @@ i don't know, it's psychologically sort of still got their mind on going through on what happened. yeah. it's like at school when they're thinking oh no, no and they've scored again. -it's like you've scored, you're so elated and you +it's like you've scored, you're so elated and you fact you you often sort of watch videos of managers. -managers are often shrieking you know about what's happening next rather than you know, all their players are jumping with joy all over each other and you think and they're saying get in your positions. +managers are often shrieking you know about what's happening next rather than you know, all their players are jumping with joy all over each other and you think and they're saying get in your positions. do your stuff. -don't let it slip straight away, i mean that was annoying thing is that we didn't deserve to lose three one really, i mean -sneak that that box of sweets in then for mum . +don't let it slip straight away, i mean that was annoying thing is that we didn't deserve to lose three one really, i mean +sneak that that box of sweets in then for mum . i bet she knows you've done that for her. eh? i bet she knows you've bought that for her. @@ -79038,7 +78973,7 @@ you what? our sunroof's pretty isn't it? very stylish. what's the time? -this very busy road, isn't it? +this very busy road, isn't it? i suppose so. busier. seems to be very busy @@ -79051,15 +78986,15 @@ yeah you were well fluky then, getting the how come that shop had them and the other one didn't? you wouldn't believe it would you? no. -nice big posh shop like and it's got cheap +nice big posh shop like and it's got cheap yes. -and nasty in it. +and nasty in it. yes. hope you're enjoying it. follow you up it would be real boring just listening to a load of rubbish wouldn't it? i mean making up conversations all over the place. -suddenly it clears this bit. +suddenly it clears this bit. what you're memory? no this road. oh, this road. @@ -79071,10 +79006,10 @@ don't know. i don't really know. what's all this, why does meltis always have that stand of eighty, eighty years? well it's how long they've been going, i suppose. -surely they've been for the last four years and they must or do they just keep it at eighty one then they go to ninety? +surely they've been for the last four years and they must or do they just keep it at eighty one then they go to ninety? i don't know. i've never noticed that badge before. -hallo how many miles have we done? +hallo how many miles have we done? sixteen thousand one hundred and sixty. how many did we have when we bought it? how long ago @@ -79091,13 +79026,13 @@ what if we lose at birmingham paul. will you wanna go to the chelsea match? what chelsea match? well the chelsea match is the following tuesday. -is that yes. +is that yes. yeah. yeah. and what saturd , what's the match on saturday before squeezed in between that? what? i don't really know. -er erm is there a game on saturday? +er erm is there a game on saturday? i think there might be. oh i've got it, i've got it. it's come to me. @@ -79111,25 +79046,25 @@ no, you know when we played our birmingham replay? yeah. that night we were gonna play tottenham. were we? -mark told me that. +mark told me that. it was on his picture list. really? that night we were gonna play tottenham oh well. in the league. oh sorry. -perhaps we can play tottenham when they haven't got er gary lineker in their games any more. +perhaps we can play tottenham when they haven't got er gary lineker in their games any more. yeah. -you start hitting periods like this and you think oh no. -you think every team you start worrying about almost every side don't you? +you start hitting periods like this and you think oh no. +you think every team you start worrying about almost every side don't you? yeah. -oh we always worry about every side cos crystal palace always hate the bad sides. -cos usually we do well against the man united and as soon as we start losing against them we start getting worried. +oh we always worry about every side cos crystal palace always hate the bad sides. +cos usually we do well against the man united and as soon as we start losing against them we start getting worried. they outplayed us last season at fairground didn't they? liverpool -what do you mean at liverpool? +what do you mean at liverpool? what did liverpool do to them then? -well we lost no we beat them two one +well we lost no we beat them two one yeah. i remember that. most surprising result of that season. @@ -79143,17 +79078,17 @@ be great if that is. we will score first. they will equalize and we'll score two more. we have got to get another goalgetter. -i mean old erm does his bit crossing and splitting defences and getting goals but not scoring them. +i mean old erm does his bit crossing and splitting defences and getting goals but not scoring them. what do you mean, getting goals and then not -now, well now it's just now we've got nobody who, who score actually really scores goals except thomas i would say at the moment. +now, well now it's just now we've got nobody who, who score actually really scores goals except thomas i would say at the moment. we really do need somebody who regularly pops them in. what about gabbiadini? what about gabiadini? -well he's coming along. -i don't see him -i think he he had a really good first half i think it like, i think that to be fair, apart from coleman an southgate everybody faded in the second half didn't they? +well he's coming along. +i don't see him +i think he he had a really good first half i think it like, i think that to be fair, apart from coleman an southgate everybody faded in the second half didn't they? yo. -yo +yo yeah. what's that, man united fans? wallington. @@ -79166,13 +79101,13 @@ yeah. leeds, i like man united, i don't, i don't hate them or anything i just, they get a bit i dunno. mind you not that they've had an awful lot of success recently but they are, really are a cocky lot. leeds are aggressive so you're always quite glad that you've beaten them but . -specially with palace i think they seem to think but they really . +specially with palace i think they seem to think but they really . should have finished them off in that first -yeah can i just flick the light on for a second? +yeah can i just flick the light on for a second? thank you. -yes, see who i mean i can't think of anybody who's in the reserves who could do any better than the lot that are in, in at the moment. +yes, see who i mean i can't think of anybody who's in the reserves who could do any better than the lot that are in, in at the moment. can you? -other than perhaps give colleymore a full blooded game, right? +other than perhaps give colleymore a full blooded game, right? doesn't he get a full blooded game at the moment? i think perhaps it's, it's worth it now. the season, i mean we're not gonna come top of the league are we? @@ -79182,35 +79117,35 @@ i think we can afford to blood colimore as a good one now. he could have this whole of this season to get used to playing, right? yeah. and then who knows what fireworks could happen the season after. -i mean he's never gonna be a when he's obviously another bright. +i mean he's never gonna be a when he's obviously another bright. who wants another bright? -we're supposed to to the better style of play. +we're supposed to to the better style of play. no, i don't know. well why did we buy gabiadini? why? what would be the point of buying gabiadini? no, well i, i mean you saw the point really. -i mean to pick i mean who, who who could replace ? +i mean to pick i mean who, who who could replace ? he's, i, he, the way he plays is virtually unique, isn't he? -so i mean you're not gonna say well let's go and get another ian wright off the peg so fair enough. -but er in the kind of situation where ian wright was very very good was in tight situations. -differently through se sheer speed and but er i can see gabiadini i mean ian wright never flicks like some of the flicks that he does. +so i mean you're not gonna say well let's go and get another ian wright off the peg so fair enough. +but er in the kind of situation where ian wright was very very good was in tight situations. +differently through se sheer speed and but er i can see gabiadini i mean ian wright never flicks like some of the flicks that he does. i mean some of the flicks are fantastic. but erm there is a nice side to his game but god he doesn't half fade. can you afford somebody that fades like that, i don't know it's the whole team fades at the moment. i, i, that's what i would do. -i'd drop mortimer now and er keep, i wouldn't, i'd keep mcgoldrick up don't have him as a sweeper. +i'd drop mortimer now and er keep, i wouldn't, i'd keep mcgoldrick up don't have him as a sweeper. i mean if you're gonna have mcgoldrick as a sweeper then you'd have to bring mortimer back but why not i noticed it was quite odd that he didn't use mcgoldrick as a sweeper did he? i mean we, we went out to win that game didn't we, again? well, don't you think? yeah. -we didn't play a and yet the defence played well enough. -so i think drop mortimer and bring colimore in for a full ninety minutes and then and and again and again and again. -get sort of like half a dozen games. -i think drop bright colimore. +we didn't play a and yet the defence played well enough. +so i think drop mortimer and bring colimore in for a full ninety minutes and then and and again and again and again. +get sort of like half a dozen games. +i think drop bright colimore. well. i mean bright, i mean well yes, you could say, yes @@ -79228,15 +79163,15 @@ he sort of give me a player that did, outside yes, well, yes. coleman and southgate. -well it it was one of the, i mean when you saw +well it it was one of the, i mean when you saw oh look, that's where fergie made those funny faces. oh and you didn't see that did you?in the paper . -look croydon caterham valley. +look croydon caterham valley. eyes. christmas presents. er one thing, what's the name of this record you want? enya. -it's in the, it's in i think it's number nine in the hit parade +it's in the, it's in i think it's number nine in the hit parade what's it called? what's enya's record called now paul? eh? @@ -79256,7 +79191,7 @@ is it? it was green last time you i asked you. enya anyway. are you celebrating your birthday tomorrow? -well paul was asking this, when well i'll have some presents. +well paul was asking this, when well i'll have some presents. whoever comes, brings me in we'll open those. do you want yours opened ? i'll open one in the morning i think. @@ -79266,7 +79201,7 @@ so you'll take paul to church in the morning will you? alright. well you can drop him off and pick him up. i could do, yeah. -now you've found my keys for my i really need to get those +now you've found my keys for my i really need to get those what's that he's got? what's that? my . @@ -79275,23 +79210,23 @@ yeah. more money than sense. wonder what he looks like now? how old was he there? -nineteen sixty eight, so that's twenty three years ago. +nineteen sixty eight, so that's twenty three years ago. he was only twenty three then i should think. let us have a bit of the paper. listen to this. -absent minded spinsters beryl and doris lost their car in a repair shop . +absent minded spinsters beryl and doris lost their car in a repair shop . yeah i know! i read that. the sisters are eighty and eighty one reported the mini stolen and bought another one. -got the er three months later they received thirteen hundred pound pay off from insurance commercial union and promptly bought a replacement car. +got the er three months later they received thirteen hundred pound pay off from insurance commercial union and promptly bought a replacement car. but when they booked their new car into tristar motors for its first service, they found their old model waiting for them . -that is dreadful garage that didn't phone to find out why they hadn't picked it up though, isn't it? +that is dreadful garage that didn't phone to find out why they hadn't picked it up though, isn't it? i'd have thought unless they lost their address. hee hee hee hee. -i mean the fact that this come out is that the -that was in the mail that was in the mail. +i mean the fact that this come out is that the +that was in the mail that was in the mail. yeah but the fact it's come out is that they've been honest. isn't it? right? @@ -79309,17 +79244,17 @@ no i know but he, that's what he's famous for isn't it? tears of a clown. i bet someone's vid , i bet alan's videoing all these. put them all together. -look at the sets in in sixty eight . +look at the sets in in sixty eight . you could, as the camera goes by you can see where all the sellotape and the gum's stuck to boxes. i mean look at those boxes. -just just scrappy old blue looks like something the art college has knocked up. +just just scrappy old blue looks like something the art college has knocked up. who is that? moody blues isn't it? is it? ha ha you used to look like that. -they all look like allied carpet salesmen now don't they ? -i mean they looked old then don't they? -i mean you didn't have sixteen, seventeen year olds in those days coming through did you? +they all look like allied carpet salesmen now don't they ? +i mean they looked old then don't they? +i mean you didn't have sixteen, seventeen year olds in those days coming through did you? they were sort of like mm. i mean look at those boxes. @@ -79340,16 +79275,16 @@ jaws is on. included the who, the small faces, the move, the kinks, the moody blues and jimi hendrix. absolute rubbish on television. that's what merle said. -now house of elliott's finished she's got nothing to watch. +now house of elliott's finished she's got nothing to watch. i bet she's watching bugsy malone. did you hear that, winston churchill's doing bugsy malone? oh. -and catherine's in it and that er i said ooh haven't you seen it merle, she said no. +and catherine's in it and that er i said ooh haven't you seen it merle, she said no. i said ooh i've got the video. she said well what's it like. -i said ooh you'll either find it really funny or you wouldn't find it funny at all but erm +i said ooh you'll either find it really funny or you wouldn't find it funny at all but erm how could you not find it funny? -catherine well i can see that +catherine well i can see that oh! i can imagine that tom would find it funny. i said it's a very good film. @@ -79361,14 +79296,14 @@ i said what do you work for fat sam? i don't think she knows it very well. she said she's seen the film but none of the other family have seen it. you know. -where they, they're having a fight and they've got all the different people in the news like chinese people go and there's fights and then they get, there's custard pies thrown at them. +where they, they're having a fight and they've got all the different people in the news like chinese people go and there's fights and then they get, there's custard pies thrown at them. oh yeah. -and germany going boom boom boom boom -that's just gonna make an awful mess on stage isn't it if they ? +and germany going boom boom boom boom +that's just gonna make an awful mess on stage isn't it if they ? is that all she's got to do? yeah. she said it's a very small part. -they go pow they've got french people being fired at +they go pow they've got french people being fired at i wonder if they'll have the er custard pie part in it? oh yeah? splurge guns. @@ -79379,15 +79314,15 @@ splurge guns. oh look. pete townshend. the who. -i met liz in er woking paul. -i met liz in woking. +i met liz in er woking paul. +i met liz in woking. stall made over seventy pounds. -and jo won a major raffle prize. -liz said isn't it typical. +and jo won a major raffle prize. +liz said isn't it typical. she won a huge box of groceries. liz said i won a raffle prize. i said oh what did you win? -she said well it was down to the last two she said, i had a choice between a red and green cushion or a fitness test. +she said well it was down to the last two she said, i had a choice between a red and green cushion or a fitness test. ah! so she said i took the fitness test. i said you don't need a fitness test liz . @@ -79397,18 +79332,18 @@ her husband well she could be her father. oh no. -well he's he's fifty five. +well he's he's fifty five. he is fifty five. that's why she's talking about him retiring isn't it? -yeah but i mean she looks about fifty five to me . +yeah but i mean she looks about fifty five to me . liz! she's younger than you isn't she mum? actu no she probably is forty five but she only looks she's not younger than us. about forty. -the way she carries herself makes her look -i i thi feel i look i i feel thirty so i mean i always think -and liz makes herself look +the way she carries herself makes her look +i i thi feel i look i i feel thirty so i mean i always think +and liz makes herself look i thought that was very interesting that she's so fit though. oh look it's all when the who used to smash their rec , all their, i mean that used to be disgusting. @@ -79417,7 +79352,7 @@ they used to break up all their things on stage. dreadful isn't it? why? well that's what pop groups used to do. -they went to total excess and then they had to come back the other way. +they went to total excess and then they had to come back the other way. well look at them now. well one died. the guy, the drummer just drove his car into the swimming pool didn't he and drowned. @@ -79438,7 +79373,7 @@ is he still alive, pete townshend? yes. cor look! christmas shopping in croydon tuesdays and thursdays. -and the week before christmas monday tuesday thursday friday. +and the week before christmas monday tuesday thursday friday. he's dead though jimmy hendrix isn't he? yes. he's dead. @@ -79453,7 +79388,7 @@ you said you could see it. you lying hound. no that was the that was the furniture repository. no you said -yeah that was the furniture repository nothing about the crystal palace . +yeah that was the furniture repository nothing about the crystal palace . no thank you ma. i'd nearly forgotten that. @@ -79468,7 +79403,7 @@ the site is where the zoo is. oh i'm taking the phone up to phone my sister. i'll stop the tape and clock, with the children. -we were christmas shopping can you imagine +we were christmas shopping can you imagine six hours! awful. so i said what have you got it all then?she's bought your present but she can't post it. @@ -79476,10 +79411,10 @@ she said it's heavy what is it? so you might be getting something else. it's quite a nice book. -so i -so she's gonna buy simon either chocolates dairy miniatures +so i +so she's gonna buy simon either chocolates dairy miniatures yeah. -or a supply of chocolate miniatures. +or a supply of chocolate miniatures. or a supply of caps for his gun. can you pull the curtain please paul. what a big supply? @@ -79489,9 +79424,9 @@ a supply of caps for his gun. twelve yeah i told her twelve . or roll cap. -make sure it's oh yeah. +make sure it's oh yeah. it's two new guns. -one takes roll cap and one takes +one takes roll cap and one takes well we've got plenty of roll cap haven't we? we've got a wadge of roll cap. that's @@ -79519,7 +79454,7 @@ i've done a job. i've been round to merle's. no. i'd like you to do a proper job. -i'd like you to take a sponge and i'd like you to clean the paintwork on the stairs. +i'd like you to take a sponge and i'd like you to clean the paintwork on the stairs. please. what about touching up? i'll touch up. @@ -79557,8 +79492,8 @@ scored the second? hughes i think. what's on ? you'll have to listen to it then. -oh -oh hang on you didn't see no goals you didn't see? +oh +oh hang on you didn't see no goals you didn't see? no. oh. oh i s , it was on telly? @@ -79575,7 +79510,7 @@ sshh. did they tell you how he was? did they tell you how he was? no. -can we have a look at the, we'll have a look at the results cos i didn't see er no no not that lot. +can we have a look at the, we'll have a look at the results cos i didn't see er no no not that lot. turn all of it off. thank you for that bit. i thought you meant teletext. @@ -79587,7 +79522,7 @@ no! do you know what he was doing in the car? with the speaker? i th he thought i didn't, couldn't see. -he was going ooh ooh ooh. +he was going ooh ooh ooh. that poor person what do you want? on the end of that tape. @@ -79597,16 +79532,16 @@ he hasn't got a clue what he wants. eh? . what do you want? -let's have one results weekend league programme. -let's have a look at -one five one +let's have one results weekend league programme. +let's have a look at +one five one got the gates on there, look. twenty nine thousand. is that a lot? well apparently it's gone up. it says in this paper that last they could only they could only hold twenty seven. -but now apparently there's a, this with this seating or something there's now can hold thirty one. +but now apparently there's a, this with this seating or something there's now can hold thirty one. and it wasn't completely full was it? paulie? no. @@ -79615,11 +79550,11 @@ so liverpool's got the biggest capacity has it? they could just get thirty thousand in there. i think thirty one's a bit so liverpool's got the biggest capacity has it? -oh manchester united would no manchester united have er oh at home yeah. +oh manchester united would no manchester united have er oh at home yeah. liverpool can hold about forty two -manchester city twenty two +manchester city twenty two that's pretty low -nearly all those were with home fans weren't they? +nearly all those were with home fans weren't they? what? well manchester city versus wimbledon. nearly all those will be home fans. @@ -79633,7 +79568,7 @@ that's how they stay up. that's how wimbledon stay up. they go up to those games nil nil. -and they make it nil nil they've drawn wi , now with manchester city and liverpool in two successive weeks, nil nil. +and they make it nil nil they've drawn wi , now with manchester city and liverpool in two successive weeks, nil nil. you cannot break them down. that's why we stay quite near the top. wasn't it? @@ -79644,7 +79579,7 @@ we're sixth. yeah i know. no they can go above us. they always was above us. -but they're above us on cos our goal average must look absolutely diabolical now. +but they're above us on cos our goal average must look absolutely diabolical now. the goal average must paul. watch my lips. @@ -79654,23 +79589,23 @@ gosh oldham, good old oldham. did us a favour there then didn't they? now! west ham did us no favours. -one two ah ee oh ee ah . +one two ah ee oh ee ah . can i have one five two what do you go like this. press the red button. cor! barnsley beat newcastle three nil paul. what's so weird about that? -well poor old newcastle. +well poor old newcastle. what? brighton beat plymouth. four nil was the biggest score. yeah. who won four nil? well tranmere lost four nil at ipswich. -oh that was +oh that was southend won again. -they've gone up +they've gone up i mean who would have thought that tranmere would have lost four nil? who would have thought that when you drew southend in a cup, you think oh great we'll thrash them. they'll be could be a first division team next season. @@ -79695,9 +79630,9 @@ shut it! i was just gonna say, what games have we lost? we are getting used to it, i mean there was a coup , a sea , last season we had five one you lost not long ago! -yeah but i mean last season we hardly, paulie and i hardly ever used to come home having lost. +yeah but i mean last season we hardly, paulie and i hardly ever used to come home having lost. now we're starting to get used to it. -now you lot. +now you lot. what have we lost at home, paulie, this season? come on. a lot. @@ -79705,7 +79640,7 @@ arsenal. yes. man united. is that all? -oh and you lost +oh and you lost no hang on. that's the two we've seen. have we lost any others? @@ -79721,18 +79656,18 @@ i thought we did. i was sure, i thou west ham? i know. -that was that was annoying. +that was that was annoying. we should not have wo , lost that. you'll soon be losing against birmingham. birmingham. -well they there's another stupid mistake here! +well they there's another stupid mistake here! birmingham city l c three r. they've got us down that we won! one nil. yeah their stat statisticians are going mad. yeah. statisticians. -would you like page now? +would you like page now? yeah, page three. there were lots of draws. thirteen draws. @@ -79761,9 +79696,9 @@ i've been a west brom supporter they wouldn't be able to afford to keep the ground on would they? all my life. what? -they wouldn't be able to afford to keep the ground on if they went out +they wouldn't be able to afford to keep the ground on if they went out well i mean it shows you what marvellous west brom were. -when west brom got lost four nil to woking wasn't it paulie? +when west brom got lost four nil to woking wasn't it paulie? the next round they had west brom supporters supporting, came down from yeah. birmingham to support woking in the next round. @@ -79773,7 +79708,7 @@ but that's all much of a muchness isn't it? nothing over four. no. was right. -we er we would have played tottenham on the night of the q p r game. +we er we would have played tottenham on the night of the q p r game. oh. i got mixed up with . he said q p r . @@ -79788,8 +79723,8 @@ what did they do? what did they do? oh i've got to see what they did. got to see what they did. -two hundred and seventy five people watching . -oh i thought woking were +two hundred and seventy five people watching . +oh i thought woking were at gateshead. i am so desperate to see what they did. well that's it. @@ -79797,14 +79732,14 @@ there aren't any more results. hearts won again. what about one five seven? there aren't any more results! -they don't have they don't have amateur do they? +they don't have they don't have amateur do they? yes they do. -try can you try number one please. +try can you try number one please. there's one off for fog. fog? oh yeah there it is. berwick east ham. -can you go to number one one five eight. +can you go to number one one five eight. one five seven. what would you like dear? i would like b b c one please. @@ -79816,12 +79751,12 @@ i mean it's gonna be weeks isn't it? they've arrested it now haven't they? there's noth there's nothing on number one about it at all. oh. -sport football +sport football saturday review. league table. non leagues -ipswich -three eight. +ipswich +three eight. jemson saves the . now we should have picked him up. why didn't we pick him up? @@ -79830,8 +79765,8 @@ that's . are you sure woking ? should be the next page yeah. -the premiere. -this is so i tell you what i'm gonna run out of here and go boogey boogey +the premiere. +this is so i tell you what i'm gonna run out of here and go boogey boogey oh if they've won they've done it. five nil! oh it just @@ -79839,8 +79774,8 @@ five nil. oh yes ! they're just walking away with that division. it's a waste of time. -the whole -do you know what said to me? +the whole +do you know what said to me? he said are they top of that division? yeah. @@ -79853,27 +79788,27 @@ ludicrous! so what happens? they go into the vauxhall league next year? yeah, they'll be definitely in the . -that's in their division five couple of seasons la we could be fourth division team. +that's in their division five couple of seasons la we could be fourth division team. couple of seasons! if crystal palace don't succeed you could be playing woking. shut it. love it. -that means if they, they'll go up this season +that means if they, they'll go up this season shall we pack up supporting palace and go to woking paulie? yes. i'd pay for that. i'll pay for very funny. -a woking season ticket free, for nothing. -i i've done a tu turncoat once already so it's easier for me . +a woking season ticket free, for nothing. +i i've done a tu turncoat once already so it's easier for me . there's nothing on lineker there at all. -yet other times +yet other times i think we should go and watch woking more often. what? you mean like every other week? yeah, when we're not watching yeah -no i think i think we should take go to some more woking evening games dad. +no i think i think we should take go to some more woking evening games dad. oh do you? yes! i mean we've never been to it. @@ -79881,12 +79816,12 @@ have you ever watched woking play? no. i want to. lineker. -the condition of the baby son of england's football is poorly but stable. +the condition of the baby son of england's football is poorly but stable. that was yesterday's. -ah oh that's exactly what the other one said. +ah oh that's exactly what the other one said. poorly but stable. that was on six o'clock this morning that was on. -two people died +two people died oh . can i just watch this please? ugh it's jaws. @@ -79894,7 +79829,7 @@ it's gross. guys getting eaten. it or something? no. -you don't need to hear the music. +you don't need to hear the music. ugh that's horrible. this is a horrible film jaws. look it's got somebody's body in its @@ -79917,8 +79852,8 @@ oh that's in the studio. it's all in the studio isn't it? oh no it's not. -i mean the the plasticine sharks are stupid. -oh the story of this particular one is that it er er they tried to make out that the erm that the the the the shark has actually got something against the human beings on this boat and it keeps chasing them. +i mean the the plasticine sharks are stupid. +oh the story of this particular one is that it er er they tried to make out that the erm that the the the the shark has actually got something against the human beings on this boat and it keeps chasing them. here it comes again. there's in a studio, that bit. look out here it comes. @@ -79932,8 +79867,8 @@ yeah they look gross now don't they? oh they are quite lifelike. oh god it's broken. oh you can see it's a model can't you? -ugh it's swallowed it. -my stones didn't come out very shiny. +ugh it's swallowed it. +my stones didn't come out very shiny. i like these bits where there's a shot which goes down . so can i start wearing my dressing gown before christmas then? no. @@ -79949,7 +79884,7 @@ he keeps going geoffrey chaucer's here . but we saw the best bit paulie. the last five minutes . have you turned it off? -no, it was the last you know the dramatic end that everybody who's been waiting for watching that film from seven o'clock till +no, it was the last you know the dramatic end that everybody who's been waiting for watching that film from seven o'clock till that off? er? you haven't turned that off? @@ -79965,7 +79900,7 @@ but the towel's for wiping your hands on. don't blame me! it's not my fault. i'm just geoffrey chaucer. -the famous poet canterbury tales. +the famous poet canterbury tales. where art thou jonathon. where art thou jonathon . do you want to do any jobs. @@ -79986,7 +79921,7 @@ zachramondo dudes . i think paulie's invalidating most sides by total and utter gibberish. well isn't that what they want to know? eh? -what the mental cases in woking +what the mental cases in woking totally illiterate. mumalissimo i used some big words on the way down. @@ -79995,7 +79930,7 @@ mumalissimo where are you bonjourdino. oh paul don't be silly! go to bed if you're going to be silly. go and learn your words for tomorrow. -bought one of those stinky old er pine tree things and paulie ripped the whole wrapper off it +bought one of those stinky old er pine tree things and paulie ripped the whole wrapper off it oh! spice. yeah, i'll come out in a minute. @@ -80015,7 +79950,7 @@ these things. oh right. i don't know. i'm very sad. -i've decimated the the arrangement. +i've decimated the the arrangement. have you? absolutely. ha ha ha. @@ -80026,7 +79961,7 @@ they had flower keeping stuff, you know the stuff you get in the packet? mm. and they had half an aspirin, pinch of sugar. lost one. -oh no sugar in these ones. +oh no sugar in these ones. that's alright. yeah you usually put sugar in those. there. @@ -80038,11 +79973,11 @@ in yours. he did look, he did look so sore. ah! poor -but what mrs had done, she'd restructured his insides. +but what mrs had done, she'd restructured his insides. what? -she'd had to use, muscle tissue had wasted away where it had been stretched by the double hernia +she'd had to use, muscle tissue had wasted away where it had been stretched by the double hernia yeah. -and she also had to remove part of his bowel. +and she also had to remove part of his bowel. mm. just clip it up wherever she could. fantastic surgery she's done. @@ -80059,12 +79994,12 @@ and of course where . but she's done a fantastic job. mm. hello! -but i said to well you know dave and i will be in the rest of today if you do get worried. +but i said to well you know dave and i will be in the rest of today if you do get worried. yeah. check up is booked monday at three o'clock . oh. and i said well if you want to take him earlier. -but i have planned to shopping +but i have planned to shopping mm. well we were there for ten you see. we had to wait and wait and wait. @@ -80073,21 +80008,21 @@ hello. all showered and managed to dry your own feet? that's something. yeah i've i've got . -i i i lift my legs up to my head. +i i i lift my legs up to my head. yes. wish i could do that! -he's practising for the +he's practising for the poor little herbie he'd erm, he'd got a double hernia. hernia. mm. -they've taken away all the gubbins this is mrs who looked after debbie's cats. +they've taken away all the gubbins this is mrs who looked after debbie's cats. do you remember? taken away the grobbins? grobbins? . -i don't know what i don't know what it is. -not even, not even i +i don't know what i don't know what it is. +not even, not even i not grobbins no. they've castrated him at the same time oh. @@ -80101,7 +80036,7 @@ the muscle had wasted with the pressure of the double hernia. the muscle had sort of disintegrated almost. she's had to use what muscle she can to restructure his bowel. she's a marvellous surgeon. -it's of money isn't it? +it's of money isn't it? well the bill's nearly three hundred pound. oh oh! jesus! @@ -80117,7 +80052,7 @@ yes. that's why you should have aspirin to relax it. cos it helps it mend. ooh. -i feel as if i want to it hurts and i feel as if i want to move it. +i feel as if i want to it hurts and i feel as if i want to move it. yes. he's told me be very bloody careful cos it can go out just like that. but he did tell you to move? @@ -80128,10 +80063,10 @@ tell it you're gonna move. i like the way he puts it. so the wrestling's out tonight is it? oh -ooh ooh -have to get with the rock. +ooh ooh +have to get with the rock. alright rock? -ooh rocket ooh. +ooh rocket ooh. ooh ooh isn't it lovely? ah! @@ -80139,8 +80074,8 @@ ooh rocket ooh do you like having your tummy scratched? ooh rocket ooh yeah we got there for ten o'clock and we had to wait till they'd finished all the out-patients before they'd let the in-patients. -in mrs 's surgery. -there were two doggies in their pens still sparkers you know where they've had things +in mrs 's surgery. +there were two doggies in their pens still sparkers you know where they've had things what'd do they do? do they keep the doggie under sedation whilst he's healing up? how long has he been there? @@ -80153,40 +80088,40 @@ oh he's had all that done? yeah. did the operation how does he feel in himself? -well he was he heard audrey's voice in the waiting room +well he was he heard audrey's voice in the waiting room pretty bloody awful . and he was whining . -she said it's alright herbie i'm here and he for a minute. +she said it's alright herbie i'm here and he for a minute. and i said he's gonna do damage if he's trying to get up at the door yeah. the way a little dachsie would you see? yeah. -so we talked to him but erm we didn't actually see mrs until about a quarter to eleven. +so we talked to him but erm we didn't actually see mrs until about a quarter to eleven. and she said you know, on no account must he strain. obviously he's got dissolving stitches in. on his insides. -and she said there was so little muscle left. +and she said there was so little muscle left. it had been so stretched and strained by . but she had to do the best she could . peter will . and of course audrey's not too quick on her feet you see since she broke her hip. -so i was trying to help audrey and that and help herbie. +so i was trying to help audrey and that and help herbie. so herbie didn't try and jump in the car before i could lift him and trying to get audrey in with her stiff leg. and then get the rug across her . -she didn't turn a hair when she said two hundred and ninety three pounds. +she didn't turn a hair when she said two hundred and ninety three pounds. i suppose it's like anything. you get an estimate for it. -well it's cheaper than i suppose. -parts and labour . +well it's cheaper than i suppose. +parts and labour . parts and labour. eh? does it come with a three month guarantee? -cheaper than princess princess margaret or . -no mrs said she was very lucky. +cheaper than princess princess margaret or . +no mrs said she was very lucky. she'd been to three lectures . one of the topmost veterinary surgeons in europe. yeah. -and that's why mrs asked her to do it. +and that's why mrs asked her to do it. she'd actually seen it done. seen slides and been to lectures on it. i don't know it must be wonderful to be able to mend . @@ -80196,20 +80131,20 @@ well as long as nothing breaks, nothing gets . no, now way must he strain so she's, she's got some liquid paraffin to drop on his dinner. quite a major operation. he's been ever so bright. -walking about quite well, he did turn to lick his under his tail but his little tail was wagging. +walking about quite well, he did turn to lick his under his tail but his little tail was wagging. and he was walking fine. he even stopped and had a tinkle. see they don't know it's to hurt. -no no. +no no. no i think i think animals are fantastic they way they put up with pain. because they can't tell you. and after a major operation there he was wagging his tail and you don't know the threshold of pain in animals do you? can't tell you. well no. -very seldom you hear a dog or a in pain. +very seldom you hear a dog or a in pain. oh you do. -oh +oh what's the matter? odd. what's odd? @@ -80219,7 +80154,7 @@ do you want a cup of coffee? cup of herbal tea? an aspirin? nothing i can do you for? -oh you're book's upstairs. +oh you're book's upstairs. do you want that? .is it actual pain then, or stiffness? or just that you're frightened to move? @@ -80236,7 +80171,7 @@ when i came up. it was late. you were up getting dressed. no. -i brought you a hot water bottle your aspirin. +i brought you a hot water bottle your aspirin. when i let the dog out. yeah but i didn't take it then. you didn't take it then no . @@ -80244,12 +80179,12 @@ you could have another one love. it would relax your muscles.? no it's probably gone. nature will usually tell you . -what i always found with with lumbar aches was erm putting the knee up sideways across your erm . +what i always found with with lumbar aches was erm putting the knee up sideways across your erm . hello rocket. how are you rocket? hello rocket. oh he's pushing hard isn't he? -ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh. +ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh. ooh! now what do you do? do you want to be hauled up? @@ -80272,7 +80207,7 @@ don't try and get up straight. good try rocket. has he been out today? oh yes he's been . -been round the woods at haven't you? +been round the woods at haven't you? then i went off and left him you see when i ooh. it's a good idea of yours putting me on the floor rocket. @@ -80293,9 +80228,9 @@ you'd look even funnier. oh i must do. he likes his pulled it to pieces yet. -well dinda got on alright in with her christmas shopping. +well dinda got on alright in with her christmas shopping. did she? -she's got three or four presents i think. +she's got three or four presents i think. good. marks and sparks is horrendous. oh you've got up off of the floor. @@ -80303,16 +80238,16 @@ how did you do it? climbed up the chair. climbed up the chair? mm. -and you your side? +and you your side? yeah i climbed, i went, i came up properly. crawled . rolled over on your side. would you like a cushion? no it's alright. do you want a hot water bottle? -no it's okay. +no it's okay. ooh that's . -ooh it's +ooh it's it's better when you sit up straight isn't it? trying to relax it. it's ever so difficult. @@ -80320,7 +80255,7 @@ no, it takes quite a lot of . right sweetheart. you alright? yeah. -are you gonna go in to erm walton end or are you +are you gonna go in to erm walton end or are you yes. gonna leave that until afterwards ? after what? @@ -80334,15 +80269,15 @@ he just did. he did? perhaps he used his wing mirror. like i do. -that's a quite nice little place there. -and you don't pay over the odds prices because it's not an expensive place to have your shop. +that's a quite nice little place there. +and you don't pay over the odds prices because it's not an expensive place to have your shop. oh. that's good. you go to these big stores and they pay so much in heating and lighting and staff . -this er pavement's quite nice . +this er pavement's quite nice . isn't it attractively done? done like parquet. -don't know who's paying for it all whether council is or what? +don't know who's paying for it all whether council is or what? so do you want to go over there first? it's up to you. what do you want to do? @@ -80352,11 +80287,11 @@ beautiful cakes. fruit crumble. oh dear. it's a good job i don't eat that sort of thing any more . -erm new era +erm new era new era? mm. this is all the ice creams. -oh you have a bag of something in the sweet box in the cupboard in the kitchen which you must take and put on your desk. +oh you have a bag of something in the sweet box in the cupboard in the kitchen which you must take and put on your desk. really? and let everyone else eat them up. they're humbugs or something. @@ -80364,9 +80299,9 @@ oh right. that's what you're supposed to be having as well, isn't it expensive . selenium? who you are? -didn't you read it in the magazine? +didn't you read it in the magazine? you're having selenium are you? -no i'm not. +no i'm not. what, what's it for? is it for me? didn't you read it in best? @@ -80382,7 +80317,7 @@ i think it was for you. oh. here we are. it's not that. -t h i i, that's it. +t h i i, that's it. sounds alarming. that's it, it really is a help. is it? @@ -80390,11 +80325,11 @@ yeah. yeah. camomile tea okay, i don't know how many is in your packet? i gave -erm probably drunk them all. +erm probably drunk them all. i must remember to take one to, there the one's aren't they? yeah they're much cheaper than safeway. -to -christmas bananas. +to +christmas bananas. i'm nearly out of feverfew. better get some. oh i never find it. @@ -80402,7 +80337,7 @@ it's in a box like that. then one of the girls comes over and says here it is, straight away. . it's down here somewhere i think. -feverfew just ridiculous. +feverfew just ridiculous. here it is. look. hold on. @@ -80422,8 +80357,8 @@ well i've only got one hand as well. should have had a basket. eggs, new era, camomile tea. christmas cards. -in there you've put bananas in there. -erm where's your eggs gone? +in there you've put bananas in there. +erm where's your eggs gone? eggs? mm. just there. @@ -80448,7 +80383,7 @@ thankyou. you're very quiet this afternoon. pardon? very quiet. -for a friday and coming up to christmas . +for a friday and coming up to christmas . it is isn't it? yes. thank you very much. @@ -80467,15 +80402,15 @@ bye bye. i hope you've got my gloves? yeah i've got them. your gloves and your brolly. -i got keith some rice mixture yesterday and he didn't eat it. -he wanted come on then. +i got keith some rice mixture yesterday and he didn't eat it. +he wanted come on then. it's warm enough to have the door open. what do you need here? christmas cards. -they're er they're in there. +they're er they're in there. they're good aren't they? oh no that's, that's where i usually get them. -in that bin. +in that bin. these are thirty p. they're quite . and then robins on the front. @@ -80492,7 +80427,7 @@ isn't it? that's good isn't it? i suppose they're all alike but they've put different ones on the outside. well they must be similar. -erm casseroles. +erm casseroles. they probably won't have any cos it's winter now. they only sell casseroles and things in the summer. oh look. @@ -80506,13 +80441,13 @@ mm. arcal crystau d'arc yes. i don't know. or crystau d'arc whatever you like to call it. -no, she said well she means an oven dish. +no, she said well she means an oven dish. still they're very nice. i wish they'd got a bigger one. what size are they then? -two one and a half to two pint i would think. +two one and a half to two pint i would think. oh they're not very big are they? -and that's a water set. +and that's a water set. hello love! hello. you haven't got any larger casserole dishes have you? @@ -80523,7 +80458,7 @@ yeah. about a three pinter. yeah. ten pound one. -no we do one like this, in this colour, pyrex but a big one . +no we do one like this, in this colour, pyrex but a big one . oh that's alright. but you haven't got one? but no, it's that one there. @@ -80531,9 +80466,9 @@ that's the size up from that one. yeah. that's what we want, yes. yeah. -but haven't got one. +but haven't got one. oh you rotten thing. -actually ask the girls and if they get them, go up the warehouse next week they'll bring you one. +actually ask the girls and if they get them, go up the warehouse next week they'll bring you one. they're nice, those. they're ever so popular. we sell a lot of them. @@ -80550,13 +80485,13 @@ that'd make it the three pints. so you'd want the next one up wouldn't you? that would be that one. well it's a three or four pints she's after. -it's probably a four +it's probably a four it doesn't look big enough. are you sure it says one point five quarts? well it says it on there somewhere. one point five quart. well. -perhaps it's perhaps they hold more than you think they do. +perhaps it's perhaps they hold more than you think they do. i don't know.. what do you think dinda? should i take this one? @@ -80576,13 +80511,13 @@ it's a, it's a, it's a christmas present . oh i see yeah. ah. three to four pints she said. -that looks yeah looking at it -i think it +that looks yeah looking at it +i think it it's quite capacious, actually. yeah. i think it's a nice dish. -have you we haven't got a measuring jug. +have you we haven't got a measuring jug. haven't got any what? that is right isn't it? one pint is @@ -80594,7 +80529,7 @@ why they can't put three pints on instead of one point five quarts . but does she want a three to four one? if she wants a three to four you gotta have the next size up. three stroke four -well she said three or four. +well she said three or four. oh i see. so obviously she was easy about the size. i think that would be ample cos usually there's only two of them @@ -80605,7 +80540,7 @@ true. yeah i think we should grab it while we see it actually. i think we should too. it'll be half the price it is in boot's cookshop . -do you want me do you want me to drop it or should you drop it? +do you want me do you want me to drop it or should you drop it? i don't know. do you remember jackie, he used to be another one look. @@ -80614,11 +80549,11 @@ and that that one holds quite a lot no. no. do you remember jackie? -he used to be dark haired and worked in the toy shop in sandhurst. +he used to be dark haired and worked in the toy shop in sandhurst. yes i do. yeah i thought you would. i knew the face. -used to go in for your model paints and coloured marbles +used to go in for your model paints and coloured marbles that's right, yeah. there you go. long time, long time ago. @@ -80627,20 +80562,20 @@ you haven't, haven't changed . you haven't changed. i mean your face i knew straight out. it was your hair that got me. -well the grey come through and i was just sort of i thought i can't wait all those years with dark hair. +well the grey come through and i was just sort of i thought i can't wait all those years with dark hair. i had a friend who had long hair and she, she let it grow right the way through. and for nearly seven years she looked like an old woman of eighty. yes. and i thought i am not gonna have that. well that's right. i agree with you. -so i more or less had a crew cut. +so i more or less had a crew cut. yes. and er of course it's still grey now yes. -except like this bit here which er grows +except like this bit here which er grows i know, oh yes it always grows a dark bit. -but that all took i think, when you're older when you go grey it's, it, you look softer and you get away with the grey coming through on white hair. +but that all took i think, when you're older when you go grey it's, it, you look softer and you get away with the grey coming through on white hair. yes. that's right. but on dark hair. @@ -80661,7 +80596,7 @@ and then it began to get a bit darker. not my eyelashes and eyebrows they're silver. always silver. absolutely silver. -mine are yeah, dark still. +mine are yeah, dark still. but my, i thought no i'm not gonna go pepper and salt. that's right yeah. i don't mind going silver. @@ -80670,12 +80605,12 @@ this is natural silver on the temples. that's right. yeah, like, look here you see look. yes, yes you've got a silver. -i mean i've got, i mean i don't mind this but why shouldn't you do it? -and my friend she looked about eighty +i mean i've got, i mean i don't mind this but why shouldn't you do it? +and my friend she looked about eighty yes i couldn't agree with you more but she still looks old for her age. yes. -my best friend was your colouring and she always has a rinse. +my best friend was your colouring and she always has a rinse. it's her husband. she said i don't mind going grey but, but paddy objects because he says it makes him feel old. oh. @@ -80689,19 +80624,19 @@ they usually say go to chestnut rather than keep to black. mm. actually i wish i'd gone like this years ago cos you get yes. -you know much more fun than when you +you know much more fun than when you you reckon? i don't know cos i've never been brunette, jackie. so i wouldn't know love. -oh yeah, i think, i think it's because i i had that severe hair style i think, you know i looked hard. +oh yeah, i think, i think it's because i i had that severe hair style i think, you know i looked hard. well i was severe. i had a severe style. that's right. -you always had yours didn't you? +you always had yours didn't you? the neat pleat mm. yeah that's right yeah. mm the neat pleat. -but it was lovely for parties with a black velvet bow and sequins down the back. +but it was lovely for parties with a black velvet bow and sequins down the back. oh yeah. i loved it yeah. well when you go on holiday swimming. @@ -80724,14 +80659,14 @@ she ain't got that problem yet. you wait till no. she's probably saying oh this is so boring this conversation but when she gets to our age that'll be the same. -well well she'll just she'll just go silver. -she was silver when she was little so i suppose she'll go back to silver. +well well she'll just she'll just go silver. +she was silver when she was little so i suppose she'll go back to silver. anything else you want to look at dinda? no i don't think so. it's probably about quarter to yes i expect it probably is. hello love. -we'll grab this casserole because erm +we'll grab this casserole because erm hopefully i won't what's her name wasn't sure if you'd get any more in of the next size up so right. @@ -80741,24 +80676,24 @@ it's much, it holds much more than you'd think doesn't it? yeah, they hold quite, yeah they do these, don't they? yeah. just put it in a bag for you. -seven pounds -so's so's people don't think we've nicked it. -mind you they they know we haven't nicked it. +seven pounds +so's so's people don't think we've nicked it. +mind you they they know we haven't nicked it. sorry my love, you want? seven please. come back has it? mm. -i'm counting, i'm counting five isn't it silly they put on there one point five quarts? +i'm counting, i'm counting five isn't it silly they put on there one point five quarts? yeah. they couldn't put on three, three pints. no, no. yeah, that's right european import. next week when i come in you'll have the next size up. -yeah thankyou. +yeah thankyou. right. thankyou -never mind get my hair done. +never mind get my hair done. thanks a lot girls. see you again soon. yeah. @@ -80783,23 +80718,23 @@ oh it's cold. if they have two minutes. not now, later. last friday you were packed out. -no because that chair is there she can't sit comfortable, hair dryer's sitting behind. +no because that chair is there she can't sit comfortable, hair dryer's sitting behind. but you were packed last friday. you had got perms and heaven knows what on the go. strange isn't it? one -still we had two ladies doesn't come. +still we had two ladies doesn't come. ah. -you see she was on telephone three o'clock she can't make it. +you see she was on telephone three o'clock she can't make it. because she's going to take her daughter somewhere. it's alright for her but it doesn't suit us. well not, not at that short notice. i know. -unless it's an accident or something when you can't +unless it's an accident or something when you can't no no no she's just going out to daughter. thank you turan, very much. okay. -don't know what, don't know what they'll make of all that gobbledegook. bye bye love. +don't know what, don't know what they'll make of all that gobbledegook. bye bye love. have a good weekend. see you soon . see you next week. @@ -80808,14 +80743,14 @@ well you're supposed to use side a it won't tape it doesn't matter . but it does to them, because they've got side a and side b on every tape. yeah. -and if they haven't got side side one tape two following i mean side two side, tape two side a following tape one side b, it puts them out a bit i should think are you going up the dog path? +and if they haven't got side side one tape two following i mean side two side, tape two side a following tape one side b, it puts them out a bit i should think are you going up the dog path? yeah, come on . when, when did you get all this stock of perfume? -erm, four years ago, three or four years ago . +erm, four years ago, three or four years ago . . -he went out on christmas eve, to find you present +he went out on christmas eve, to find you present that's right, i remember that . -and he got this job lot of perfume, and he said oh i can shot these out over the next few years, i said, oh if you really want to . +and he got this job lot of perfume, and he said oh i can shot these out over the next few years, i said, oh if you really want to . where does he keep them? i've no idea, in fact last year, did he give you some last year? i can't remember , @@ -80828,11 +80763,11 @@ take it all away, he probably gave it to girls at work as well or something. yes. well no, cos it would be too late after christmas wouldn't it? probably, no he doesn't give presents . -oh he does, he gives er his secretary and switch board girl a box of chocolates and a bottle of wine and but i do all the christmas cards +oh he does, he gives er his secretary and switch board girl a box of chocolates and a bottle of wine and but i do all the christmas cards yeah, i know you do -and all the at work. +and all the at work. hold on -well i got to work all day and i'm still oh do you think, want me i can get you two i'll write you a list,. +well i got to work all day and i'm still oh do you think, want me i can get you two i'll write you a list,. i don't have a list from him. no. just have to try and remember @@ -80845,7 +80780,7 @@ well exactly, so don't bother . people . and can you do a christmas card for so and so, because he's been, he's been delegated to help me with my machine yeah -development and mind you i like larry and ken +development and mind you i like larry and ken . well larry's, i mean he's a genius, so he is a bit awkward to get along with, erm not awkward to get along his sweet, but he's peculiar. @@ -80854,17 +80789,17 @@ yes. hurry up, be a good boy. . no. -said garden. -i don't think so when i went to let him in he'd pulled himself up round the patio and looked as though he expected to be walloped for being silly he's taken us this morning. +said garden. +i don't think so when i went to let him in he'd pulled himself up round the patio and looked as though he expected to be walloped for being silly he's taken us this morning. the trailers, the cars there, but i can't see, can't see another . -oh well now, when, when do you want to go into on monday, just after lunch? +oh well now, when, when do you want to go into on monday, just after lunch? yeah, be great. well, yeah,. . . well it could be after we've walked him in the morning. -walk, yeah . -so long as i shove the washing in the don't like it in there it's dingy, unless the sun's out. +walk, yeah . +so long as i shove the washing in the don't like it in there it's dingy, unless the sun's out. yeah, shall we . if you'd rather. mm. @@ -80872,7 +80807,7 @@ give us more freedom in the afternoon if we need to go into wokingham instead, d come on. i think maybe . -oh here's another dog i think oh it's judy's, not it's not hello, haven't seen you for a long time, hello, haven't seen her for a long time, morning, good morning oh she's a sweetie isn't she? forgotten her name come and say hello, i haven't seen you for ages, so him once on the , good morning. +oh here's another dog i think oh it's judy's, not it's not hello, haven't seen you for a long time, hello, haven't seen her for a long time, morning, good morning oh she's a sweetie isn't she? forgotten her name come and say hello, i haven't seen you for ages, so him once on the , good morning. oh dear . oh, oh dear. @@ -80880,7 +80815,7 @@ about time i did walk round. have you? yeah. haven't got your wife with you this morning too much for her . -no,saturday , well she's got little jobs that she like's to do you know at home +no,saturday , well she's got little jobs that she like's to do you know at home yes. and so she's not come out. yeah. @@ -80894,7 +80829,7 @@ a bit of rough, mm. er, hoping over the , but she can't no. go up those slopes. -no, no, i usually see you together on the or along the flat path, yes . +no, no, i usually see you together on the or along the flat path, yes . that's right, yeah , on the flat that's right . gotta walk on the flat ,. @@ -80904,7 +80839,7 @@ tessa, yes tessa, there's two tess and two jess, oh dear, walk on the oh are there? yeah. oh -but, they did write to them on the counter and that that trouble, and she said that you know, that we can walk round there you know. +but, they did write to them on the counter and that that trouble, and she said that you know, that we can walk round there you know. oh yes, oh, the rangers say the same thing, do what you've always done. yeah. just somebody on the council with a lot of, a lot of , there's a @@ -80912,16 +80847,16 @@ they're just a person keeping an eye, i suppose they've got to respond to it you the ranger's always bring their own dogs. mm. always have digger with them. -yeah yes it's eh, it's just someone going awkward you know. +yeah yes it's eh, it's just someone going awkward you know. oh that's right. someone just that's right . does,, he came in one day and i said that we really don't travel a lot you know mm. -we just go to out here and, or the park or something like that +we just go to out here and, or the park or something like that yes . -and he said oh you don't go to do you? -i said yes i go there n , most mornings oh he said it's a filthy place, a filthy place you know +and he said oh you don't go to do you? +i said yes i go there n , most mornings oh he said it's a filthy place, a filthy place you know who was this? er, the man that does my car oh. @@ -80933,7 +80868,7 @@ and i think it's a friend of his. too true. yeah,. but it just shows how, here, i said, how embarr there's no different to any other place where ever you go. -no, no oh i agree people shouldn't let dogs foul on the pavement and in shopping places and things, cos it can be dangerous, but out in the woodlands if it wasn't for all the animals we wouldn't have any green stuff, trees and bushes seagulls are up . +no, no oh i agree people shouldn't let dogs foul on the pavement and in shopping places and things, cos it can be dangerous, but out in the woodlands if it wasn't for all the animals we wouldn't have any green stuff, trees and bushes seagulls are up . no. no, it's that , oh. it seems, it seems calm enough doesn't it? @@ -80953,7 +80888,7 @@ yeah i thought get january over and we shall be alright. oh i don't know february can be horrible sometimes yeah , have snow in february before haven't we?. -yes , we had the, we had the six foot drop in february do you remember?were cos we live on a steep hill and +yes , we had the, we had the six foot drop in february do you remember?were cos we live on a steep hill and oh it's great fun . @@ -80968,9 +80903,9 @@ and the sun was shining and everyone had got pla plastic bags, anything they cou oh yeah. they were going down our front lawn then down the, then down then down the roadway, cos it's a dead end you see, so there's not much , not much traffic oh i see, oh you're alright -it's not, it's not when you get to the end of it then there might be a couple of . +it's not, it's not when you get to the end of it then there might be a couple of . yeah if you, if you're coming up you daren't stop the driver and there's things hurtling at ya, there's kids on sledges coming at you at about fifteen miles an hour and you'll have to try and drive around them and -i'll stick to the old what they've got in california then. +i'll stick to the old what they've got in california then. oh yeah, erm, oh i'd rather have our climate i think. it get up over a hundred, people killed oh it's horrible isn't it? @@ -80980,7 +80915,7 @@ funny actually they couldn't, when the rescue people came they couldn't see wher really! mm, it's, it's, it's on this mornings news oh . -this dust, this dust in california. +this dust, this dust in california. i have heard, i have read about it . this dust , and a, what's it a hundred and fifty cars all piled up on top of one another oh shit. @@ -80991,8 +80926,8 @@ oh that's awful. so. i wouldn't like it that dry. no. -it's the same as that place in australia where they haven't seen rain for seventeen years, i mean there's children who are grown up now at college have never seen a spot of rain, i'd hate that i'd rather have our, sometimes dismal climate. -well look how we get don't we, when er we've gone too long with shower of rain +it's the same as that place in australia where they haven't seen rain for seventeen years, i mean there's children who are grown up now at college have never seen a spot of rain, i'd hate that i'd rather have our, sometimes dismal climate. +well look how we get don't we, when er we've gone too long with shower of rain mm, mm. you know the sun is nice that's right , @@ -81006,7 +80941,7 @@ oh well, we, really the weather's not to bad, you, you haven't got to be to sens yes, you have. . yeah, so far we've been very lucky in, in britain i think, apart from the hurricane damage, once or twice, on the whole our climates is not bad. -oh, you . +oh, you . yeah, but, you're mad getting worried to much, you know we had our green house all smashed up and everything and it's been upsetting , yes . erm, when you think about after all . @@ -81072,7 +81007,7 @@ and that it's all for money and they're doing alright, i mean they're already ma well the big ones are, yeah. yes. oh yes. -there's only one thing, it might mean more part time jobs for college leavers and things if they go to work on a sunday in the big stores and they did, give them a foot up to start a job, then get taken on you know as . +there's only one thing, it might mean more part time jobs for college leavers and things if they go to work on a sunday in the big stores and they did, give them a foot up to start a job, then get taken on you know as . but the one's that's gonna be hit i think are, people like old lionel. yes. mm. @@ -81093,7 +81028,7 @@ yeah. dogs. yeah. hello, good morning, good morning, all . -can't supermarket's gonna be open, i'll be getting their green grocery's down there and that really. +can't supermarket's gonna be open, i'll be getting their green grocery's down there and that really. yes.. told you it was a good idea to save throwing it. brilliant. @@ -81103,16 +81038,16 @@ that's brilliant. my daughter says when, when did you go to wimbledon? . hold a racket . -good ball boy a girl, quite right, gosh she's the same shape as rocket. +good ball boy a girl, quite right, gosh she's the same shape as rocket. they're all good dogs, but he doesn't give it back though. he does , oh yes he does. -he might he might do. +he might he might do. she, she, yeah she's given it,oh well, we've got to walk old thing i suppose, and then go to lionel's, get some more fresh fruit. you see they're again there you don't get it in a packet you can pick out the grapes you want. that's right, yeah. you can pick them out yourself. yeah. -oh i, i find that quite good, you know. +oh i, i find that quite good, you know. and also, you know sometimes he's prices are much better than the supermarket's prices . yeah , mm. you don't have to pay for all that fancy lighting. @@ -81132,7 +81067,7 @@ yes. . but in, in a month or two yeah. -picking and my wife can't eat much in the way of apples +picking and my wife can't eat much in the way of apples no. she get's tummy trouble mm, yeah. @@ -81174,7 +81109,7 @@ max. max come on. but there's also another little one i've noticed, i just under her eye yes. -er, with . +er, with . doesn't bother her does it?. no, no, she's not worried, but when we took her up recently, he, he, he said it's only a wart like that, he didn't sort of worry mm , mm. @@ -81183,7 +81118,7 @@ no, you can't really see the one on rocky's ear at the moment, you can in some l when ya, when ya, when you're grooming him you can. and that's happened just recently has it? yeah, yeah. -no, last week . +no, last week . well we took him , took him for his injection in october yeah,three or four months . they'd have been there about a couple of weeks . @@ -81201,13 +81136,13 @@ no. but eh, she, it doesn't seem to worry her it's not causing her any no. rocky, doesn't worry him. -it seems to be worry you . -oh, i'm careful with the brush , i'm careful, obviously with a brush and comb, i'd hate to, hate to jab it well we've got to go i suppose. +it seems to be worry you . +oh, i'm careful with the brush , i'm careful, obviously with a brush and comb, i'd hate to, hate to jab it well we've got to go i suppose. ah,. -that german shepherd having a good, oh he's gone, it's the oh dear +that german shepherd having a good, oh he's gone, it's the oh dear were lucky to have this place aren't we? oh it's lovely isn't it, it's beautiful. -were lucky to you go and lo look round anywhere else, no where like sanders +were lucky to you go and lo look round anywhere else, no where like sanders no. because, what with this, the bridges and rivers edge borough. @@ -81218,7 +81153,7 @@ are they? yeah, they've taken only . over the car, as national trust. -i, i noticed they got shifted, they went to menley, weren't it . +i, i noticed they got shifted, they went to menley, weren't it . yes, some , some went into the doctor's surgery car park in aylesmore, it's full of caravans i mean they're getting now that, that,before they go any where now. mm. @@ -81241,10 +81176,10 @@ the mess they must have made in . hundreds of pounds you know clear all oh the wreck was incredible wasn't it? yeah. -it was like a rubbish dump, and yet there's good old erm, grounds man, as soon as the had gone, they were down there, there was half a dozen of them and they got it cleaned in two days. +it was like a rubbish dump, and yet there's good old erm, grounds man, as soon as the had gone, they were down there, there was half a dozen of them and they got it cleaned in two days. yeah, i notice that, yeah. -and it look's good, you know the . +and it look's good, you know the . and the , where, where they've used all the, the woodland beside the lake as there toilet facilities yeah. and they talk about dogs! @@ -81252,15 +81187,15 @@ yeah. gee, i know which i prefer. yeah. mm. -well, that's why people to do when they want to take that photograph of our dog that time, when that women +well, that's why people to do when they want to take that photograph of our dog that time, when that women yes. kick up a row, i said you want to look at the dogs, just go outside and see all the old rubbish that get's chucked out there yes. -there, there's the kentucky chicken thing +there, there's the kentucky chicken thing yes. whatever it is, and throw their cartoons and there's coca cola tins yes. -i, i, said if if there are , er people making far +i, i, said if if there are , er people making far more sure . mess i said than the dogs. @@ -81277,7 +81212,7 @@ you have to run for it. yes, yes. yes. nice chatting to you. -bye bye dear, take care they're a nice old couple. +bye bye dear, take care they're a nice old couple. mm. his wife's really slow now. yeah. @@ -81288,7 +81223,7 @@ they use to have a, is it a . she's a sweetie, she's always got a soft looking smile on her face, he's always smiling too please him oh excuse me. yes, he's worried were -not a lot on tonight, there's only a very apparently dropped. +not a lot on tonight, there's only a very apparently dropped. really. so,. well anything else is a let down. @@ -81306,7 +81241,7 @@ i think it's . but if it's got anything about . if they've got the american indian culture in it then it will fascinate me, yeah . -i think it has, it's , it's got a lot of . +i think it has, it's , it's got a lot of . it's basically a love story between him and a, see he's a, he's a cowboy officer, and she, she's a indian squaw obviously, they fall in love and they all this sort of vote of comment on . yes, yes. but there is a lot of erm, obviously the , the indian ways and so on. @@ -81316,33 +81251,33 @@ yes that's worth it . . a lot of our modern hol hello max. -modern come on, no she hasn't got anything for you,. +modern come on, no she hasn't got anything for you,. come on, come on, come on. -you know, it, it makes me smile sometimes when i say come and try the mo modern politic approach to your ache, ache's and pains, your ailments. +you know, it, it makes me smile sometimes when i say come and try the mo modern politic approach to your ache, ache's and pains, your ailments. . -most of it comes think so, i mean so much of it comes from the north american indians that +most of it comes think so, i mean so much of it comes from the north american indians that mm. and right back into the er, the keltic legions and the medieval monks. that's right, there's certainly a . -that's what i said to you, your dad when he didn't want to take aspirins for his restrained back, and him, don't believe in these drugs and i said look, if a monk gave you this he'd, he'd give you the bark of a birch tree, pound it up in a pestle and water and you'd think it was magic and you'd take it and you, relax your muscles, is that what it is?, -i said yes that's what aspirin is originally birch bark. +that's what i said to you, your dad when he didn't want to take aspirins for his restrained back, and him, don't believe in these drugs and i said look, if a monk gave you this he'd, he'd give you the bark of a birch tree, pound it up in a pestle and water and you'd think it was magic and you'd take it and you, relax your muscles, is that what it is?, +i said yes that's what aspirin is originally birch bark. well of course they used to use the poppy, for people in great pain oh yeah,. -amputations, child birth gosh the leaves are thick. +amputations, child birth gosh the leaves are thick. mm, they're lovely aren't they? when ever i see these big leaves you know these big ones yes. they remind me of when i was at school. -sycamore oh, sycamore and . +sycamore oh, sycamore and . used to get told to go out in the autumn and we used to get told by the, used to get taken out by the teacher into some woods and you would have to collect the leaves . actually i -could always , could always see if biggest, biggest leaves like these you know,. -that is a sycamore cos it isn't a, there isn't a conker tree around here that's sycamore, there they are, that's it, that's a sycamore tree, beautiful colour these are dances with wolves. -oh, it's in shop. +could always , could always see if biggest, biggest leaves like these you know,. +that is a sycamore cos it isn't a, there isn't a conker tree around here that's sycamore, there they are, that's it, that's a sycamore tree, beautiful colour these are dances with wolves. +oh, it's in shop. if it's . if it's good, erm, can i say truthful background of the indians . -well,actually and it might be based on a true story, don't know if it +well,actually and it might be based on a true story, don't know if it do you remember when vaughan was, vaughan was doing his meditation yeah. and he was trying to get in touch with a north american indian, that a, thingamy in wales was fixed up @@ -81357,9 +81292,9 @@ i, i just ask him if, and it, the question that i'm interested in the answer to, suddenly cross your legs, ouch . that's a good idea. she said to me just say to him like i do enough vaughany, don't want to hear any more. -i said no, i, i would hate to offend him because it's all so well meant being a mother in law you have to watch it. +i said no, i, i would hate to offend him because it's all so well meant being a mother in law you have to watch it. , honestly you couldn't be much worse than . -oh mother in law is. +oh mother in law is. . she's just . i'm not buying her a present, i mean i'll chip in with a present for you for her and mark if it comes, but we'll have to go to , but erm, you know, she,. @@ -81367,7 +81302,7 @@ as a person, you know, i'd never have any time . yes, yes, i mean you never, she lives in that great place and she's got no money , they're not, they're not her presents are they, they're from diane. no, of course, of course . -so, i tell you what, if, if we do end up spending christmas at gonna give me the present i got to di and said thank you di for giving stella the christmas present . +so, i tell you what, if, if we do end up spending christmas at gonna give me the present i got to di and said thank you di for giving stella the christmas present . it so . i mean as an acquaintance i could tolerate her but i . i couldn't i'm afraid. @@ -81379,15 +81314,15 @@ she used to say what diane, i've never heard of a diane, after they were married . and when anyone treats my daughter like that i find it very hard to forgive, i know it hurts my kids, i'm much more up in arms than if they hurt me. remember that first christmas when she put the cat among the pigeons by saying to me your husband told me that he can't really afford he's flying because you spend all his money, when i, when i've been backing him, saving money for his aeroplane and his lessons and -what did you say to dad?did you say that to dad didn't you say it . +what did you say to dad?did you say that to dad didn't you say it . but i thought she was stirring it you see and so did diane. what did you tell . i didn't believe her you didn't, you never . but he said, i said it as a joke when she was asking me about my flying and i said i don't do as much flying as i'd like to, i've, i've got a wife to support and she takes all the money. -but i said i am the money i gave him his first flying lesson, i paid for it, like i bought his first three cars. +but i said i am the money i gave him his first flying lesson, i paid for it, like i bought his first three cars. . -i excused myself and went to bed i think but she repeated it so solemnly you see not as, say somebody saying a joking sort of way. +i excused myself and went to bed i think but she repeated it so solemnly you see not as, say somebody saying a joking sort of way. yeah, good stirring . and it was just after frank had left her and gone to live in that place in . does, does anybody know what he's doing,. @@ -81402,28 +81337,28 @@ a machine he's designed, i don't know for what purpose, i didn't dare ask, i was it's not to, it's not to isolate gamma rays . probably, but he was hiding he wouldn't come out because he said that the men from outer space were after him. it's funny you know, i've reading, i'm reading silence of, silence of the lambs at the moment and er, you know, it's got in there, a lot of er, er, mentally ill patient's have got this idea that, men, men from mars have . -well i said to diane you know, i didn't laugh, i didn't think it was funny, i thought it was sad and i said but he needs help, if vaughan's you know, he's got two sons, but mark's a bit hopeless and he was at oxford anyway, i said surely somebody should go and get him some some treatment, sanitation. +well i said to diane you know, i didn't laugh, i didn't think it was funny, i thought it was sad and i said but he needs help, if vaughan's you know, he's got two sons, but mark's a bit hopeless and he was at oxford anyway, i said surely somebody should go and get him some some treatment, sanitation. yes. -you can get cranks, you just believe in flying saucers and a quite happy harmless, but, i think they need checking on to make sure that they are happy with the life they're leading it bothers me a lot +you can get cranks, you just believe in flying saucers and a quite happy harmless, but, i think they need checking on to make sure that they are happy with the life they're leading it bothers me a lot so where is he now? well he's still in manchester i think. doing what? is he living with, living in a . i think he's in lodgings. is he? -but of course he got half the value of trafford hall, which was quarter of a million? +but of course he got half the value of trafford hall, which was quarter of a million? mm. something like that, eighth of a million, it'll do me anyway. oh listen to that bird, isn't it beautiful it's a thrush. well . -that's alright degradable. +that's alright degradable. oh isn't it beautiful, he must think it's spring. . -oh it's gorgeous oh you beautiful bird.. +oh it's gorgeous oh you beautiful bird.. oh,in't he? like a spring sound. i hope they don't start nesting and then get all there . -have a good time wouldn't you? +have a good time wouldn't you? yes yes , the . @@ -81433,12 +81368,12 @@ oh it's beautiful. . really doing his nut isn't he? perhaps that is his er, this is, this is my place,. -yes, there he goes yes it was a thrush you must come and try and hear the nightingale's again again , you haven't +yes, there he goes yes it was a thrush you must come and try and hear the nightingale's again again , you haven't . oh, would you . would you try, you're supposed to try wish, wish for luck when you tread in it you know. -luck come on. +luck come on. ooh, where did you go? oh don't look like that, no one 's gonna hurt you baby, might smack your bottom once or twice. come come on. @@ -81459,7 +81394,7 @@ oh. that figures. help them out you see. that figures. -getting withdrawal symptoms you see, i only . +getting withdrawal symptoms you see, i only . do you, if you don't sell well,, all the fruit, if you don't sell all the fruit cakes. @@ -81470,12 +81405,12 @@ i'm warning . . he can't leave the place alone, everyday he's here , . -grapes no not one twenty, yes, keith goes through them like a hot mouth through butter. +grapes no not one twenty, yes, keith goes through them like a hot mouth through butter. these look drier than the ones at the back, it must be the latest one, or are they all the same? no, all the same. -that's alright my love you like grapes as well dinda. +that's alright my love you like grapes as well dinda. i do . -oh look, a little baby one, given you voucher i'll just have half a dozen for you. +oh look, a little baby one, given you voucher i'll just have half a dozen for you. that's alright i ain't got nothing to pop back. have got loads in the garden. . @@ -81489,12 +81424,12 @@ especially now i've got so many . so many people on weirdo diets. an iceberg, four salad tomatoes, some cress if you have it, i did, i did get banana's, and they haven't disappeared yet, oh look the clementine's are in dinda isn't that beautiful, you could candy that, wouldn't it be attractive, candid to keep -there we are, er four seventy one . +there we are, er four seventy one . oh aren't they whoppers . two. i say,. yes. -nice and plenty, them . +nice and plenty, them . i've, i've got about four in the bottom of the fridge. oh. er what'd i say, cress, got some fresh cress for keith's salad. @@ -81507,7 +81442,7 @@ that's it. a bunch like that. that's it, then it goes in my bars on the window sill. i've got half an aubergine and i'm not going to make a veg pie anyway, it's a beauty isn't it. -no, i know, i'm just showing how much . +no, i know, i'm just showing how much . aren't these beautiful. they are aren't they. small and perfectly formed, like me. @@ -81518,7 +81453,7 @@ yeah. he's, he's got i think, i think you should stop fondling it now. . -he's got a university degree you see, so he knows what i'm talking about, when i say +he's got a university degree you see, so he knows what i'm talking about, when i say oh well . beautiful. @@ -81526,7 +81461,7 @@ there you are. i didn't know you had it i don't know about it. i didn't know you had a degree until the other day and lionel said oh -oh yeah, yeah, i've got enough money to +oh yeah, yeah, i've got enough money to . give me . yeah. @@ -81603,20 +81538,20 @@ i just saw somebody put it on them on the . i used to be quite good at and i'll ask again on tuesday when i ring. it's supposed to be very good for you. -i used to be very good at this, i use to . +i used to be very good at this, i use to . so did i yes, you did, yes. we'll put it on the list and i'll try on tuesday for you. . so that's all i've got with me after i've been to . -well, you've anyway, so. +well, you've anyway, so. if they're more than eighty, i, i can't have it anyway. so you want to keep yo-yo,. oh . i'm all ready if i got my handbag, but when i start walking because of the cars being broken into i don't carry a handbag, you see, i just carry money in my pocket. oh, there's a lot had their cars broken into . -i've had mine done twice, mine done twice, mm, the police were up the other day lying in ambush, and i'd spotted them and phoned the local police station and said there's men lurking in the bushes of are they policemen?, she said yes madam, they're policemen. +i've had mine done twice, mine done twice, mm, the police were up the other day lying in ambush, and i'd spotted them and phoned the local police station and said there's men lurking in the bushes of are they policemen?, she said yes madam, they're policemen. i don't, i thought they looked to they looked to clean and, and well groomed yeah. to be erm, sort of scroungers. @@ -81658,7 +81593,7 @@ well they are now, my daughter now has a proper bum bag, but this was just a sch oh yeah, yeah. and i use that in the summer, when i don't want big pocket's yeah, yeah, good idea . -i think . +i think . keep your hands free i must have washed me hands . you have to think when you've got, like me with my two little grand daughters, you know . @@ -81683,14 +81618,14 @@ thank's a lot girls. . are you looking at they big doggy? i was looking at the scalectrix. scalectrix, that's the next thing is it? -oh look, come on, yeah christmas lights are up not a lot mind you, a few bare bright bulbs. -mm, mm, shop +oh look, come on, yeah christmas lights are up not a lot mind you, a few bare bright bulbs. +mm, mm, shop what is that patch for? i don't know.. . i don't know my dear. hello baby we weren't long were we? -haven't seen dan in there for a long time, i thought he'd left lionel and gone off to get a a highly lucrative job somewhere you don't somehow expect to see a, a young man with a university degree working in your local green grocer do you? +haven't seen dan in there for a long time, i thought he'd left lionel and gone off to get a a highly lucrative job somewhere you don't somehow expect to see a, a young man with a university degree working in your local green grocer do you? mm, what's his degree in? i haven't asked him, i didn't like to. they must have been high up in the tree,leaves. @@ -81702,9 +81637,9 @@ i didn't recognise it, it hasn't got any leaves on. i beg your pardon, it does look like a beech bowl doesn't it? yeah it does,. yes, you're quite right it is. -no up where the other's are, where they've just hidden in the bushes, i found sum brand new ones on wednesday or thur , after we had the heavy rain why we going this way? +no up where the other's are, where they've just hidden in the bushes, i found sum brand new ones on wednesday or thur , after we had the heavy rain why we going this way? . -oh, i'm very fond of the meadow walk get any more wild ,actually, i suppose there are rabbits and things up here. +oh, i'm very fond of the meadow walk get any more wild ,actually, i suppose there are rabbits and things up here. but there are. we should come one day at dusk and the bunny hoppers will be out, or of course very early in the morning. why, you wouldn't come very early in the morning. @@ -81714,25 +81649,25 @@ brooks lovely isn't it? the what? . oh yes. -i don't think i've ever been to , quite pleasant . +i don't think i've ever been to , quite pleasant . surely that's the , that is the house where queen elizabeth the first spent all her girl hood. i've no idea. -perhaps it was burnt down and re-built or something didn't seem at all tudorish did it? +perhaps it was burnt down and re-built or something didn't seem at all tudorish did it? . . -you think all the big houses in london that are now official government all along the strand big private houses, savoy palace, the . +you think all the big houses in london that are now official government all along the strand big private houses, savoy palace, the . mm. way back in the thirteen, fourteenth century. mm. and your name sake barnard of bolier that's his palace opposite on the other bank of the thames. -mm . +mm . i'm still amazed about eighty gardens though. -eighty gardens, oh made me laugh. +eighty gardens, oh made me laugh. well that's not what amazes me, eighty gardens. eighty gardens, but then as a place that size, and the didn't have any machinery don't forget everything had to be well i expect now, they've got about five . i should think they probably still, in the, in the high season, i should think they probably still need fifteen, twenty -oh look,tractor . +oh look,tractor . i think it still belongs to the duke of devonshire because he was interviewed at the end wasn't he? mm. and he said they have to systematically sell something to keep the place up. @@ -81744,7 +81679,7 @@ i know a lot of people say they shouldn't good idea . have houses that size, but i think it's an awful shame to let our heritage go. yeah, i agree, if people did . -i tell you another thing that amazes me, how any one with a sovereign right,were a sovereign in those days, could have given up the palace of westminster which is so beautiful,palace, together i suppose reigned after the duke of is it? +i tell you another thing that amazes me, how any one with a sovereign right,were a sovereign in those days, could have given up the palace of westminster which is so beautiful,palace, together i suppose reigned after the duke of is it? . it was only built erm, what a couple of hundred years ago wasn't it? what buckingham palace? @@ -81758,11 +81693,11 @@ oh yes. . oh yeah. . -i think buckingham palace is lovely compared to westminster palace, beautiful old stone and the, and the shape of it and it's windows, it's beautiful huge of course, there again the court then had loads and loads of er, there were ten . +i think buckingham palace is lovely compared to westminster palace, beautiful old stone and the, and the shape of it and it's windows, it's beautiful huge of course, there again the court then had loads and loads of er, there were ten . .. -and a lot of the government, governing people of the country oh it is a bit chill and damp isn't it? -did you mention anything to your dad about wanting to watch dances with wolves? -ah, i wouldn't of imagine for one second he would want to watch, so it might be better if i buy the video and see +and a lot of the government, governing people of the country oh it is a bit chill and damp isn't it? +did you mention anything to your dad about wanting to watch dances with wolves? +ah, i wouldn't of imagine for one second he would want to watch, so it might be better if i buy the video and see no, no , you can watch it at your why you gonna get something @@ -81771,7 +81706,7 @@ something more adventure, i don't want to buy it, i may, i may not be that keen well you know, in that case you'll have to wait until he goes away somewhere for the evening. didn't like fantasia, where i can listen to the music and watch them. oh, we'll see what's going on, have a look . -i would like to see dances with wolves he'll probably be asleep any way dinda. +i would like to see dances with wolves he'll probably be asleep any way dinda. he puts the variety performance on he'll go to sleep. mm he's actually been out of his armchair today long enough to erm, spend ten minutes putting a washer on the hand basin in the loo. @@ -81785,10 +81720,10 @@ mm.. she owes me a letter, thank heavens, somebody who owes me a letter instead of vice versa. can't remember whether i owe madge a letter or she owes me one. here dog. -he's probably having a visit run like bat out of hell good gracious. +he's probably having a visit run like bat out of hell good gracious. oh look. oh sorry. -hello magpie, there's two of them ooh come on, come try again. +hello magpie, there's two of them ooh come on, come try again. . are there's a playful one coming, ah, been called away what a shame. he's a devious one . border collie, a sheep dog. @@ -81802,7 +81737,7 @@ they get into mischief. that erm, they have to be occupied doing yes, yes. they are, aren't they, they really are very smart. -oh yes, well look how kelly could get. +oh yes, well look how kelly could get. oh yeah, they're like a hyperactive child. that's right, very much. kelly was alright, as long as he was doing things, but he wanted to be doing things all the time. @@ -81869,18 +81804,18 @@ yeah, but they don't . cos, cos they're big enough, if they even in love, they can knock a child, well they could knock a grown up flat on your back. she'll not be too . yes, no squeeze the paws , -we got , +we got , not, not too hard for her but enough so that it's uncomfortable yeah. and they hate it, and after, after a week, after a week of having their paws squeezed every time they jump up,stop . -i've a lot, a lot of my friends have got big dogs and they say oh they will jump up and i say squeeze her paws, it usually works +i've a lot, a lot of my friends have got big dogs and they say oh they will jump up and i say squeeze her paws, it usually works mm. in a week, ten days, something like. i'll have to do that. they're a very , but they can still knock you flat on your back. oh yeah, well she's had a, a some old chap who was walking around here, she just ran past him yeah. -and she just caught the back of his leg . +and she just caught the back of his leg . oh yeah , behind your knees you can. he just crumpled up. i say she's only doing, she's only playing around. @@ -81889,7 +81824,7 @@ mm, i'll have to try that with the feet, come on. bye, bye. do you want to play?, want to play?get it, get it, come on. -get it, get it oh play rock. +get it, get it oh play rock. . look. . @@ -81899,7 +81834,7 @@ and they can't keep her? pardon . moving , moving to america. oh what a shame, have they got somebody to take. -well i'd imagine they'd go too there, and they're still looking for someone . +well i'd imagine they'd go too there, and they're still looking for someone . oh,. you'd like to take her would you? . @@ -81911,7 +81846,7 @@ but erm get it. , you should have told him to put an advert in . have ads in where? -i don't think they're been yet. +i don't think they're been yet. i would imagine . where you going? into the dog walk. @@ -81926,7 +81861,7 @@ god it's carpeted with leaves now. haven's seen sam. no. or davey . -good boy, hurry up good boy rocket +good boy, hurry up good boy rocket . what, no, no, you'll try and go get back across the meadow, i expect. probably will. @@ -81943,18 +81878,18 @@ again today. no, no, no, what every you like , , if you like dog crap on your shoes. -yeah,at home shoes off. +yeah,at home shoes off. no rocky, no, no, no what, what, maybe he wants to, maybe he wants to you know what. oh come on, you know him, he'll just takes us up the woods for the hell of it. honesty. -come on then, come on come then, be a good boy, hurry up . +come on then, come on come then, be a good boy, hurry up . he's eaten another dish of biscuits. -cleaned out his dinner bowl and eat more biscuits. +cleaned out his dinner bowl and eat more biscuits. foxes you after is it? good lad, good lad, good lad. hurry up. -good boy good boy good boy. +good boy good boy good boy. i'll have to try that. you looking at your favourite tree again? gorgeous isn't it?, beautiful tree. @@ -81968,10 +81903,10 @@ yeah,is it? try and get one of these gadgets, and see if we can er get the nightingales next week. there's i don't suppose the radio part of this is put in then,. -i'm not messing with it, just recording playing back. +i'm not messing with it, just recording playing back. . not that i like walking around with music blasting anyway, i'd rather listen to the birds. -mm oh, i'm warm now after that walk. +mm oh, i'm warm now after that walk. good. . no sign of sam, ah here he comes, hold on then, the dogs gonna have a talk. @@ -81980,8 +81915,8 @@ who's down there, who is it, who is it, who is it?. hello sam, hello, hello, hello, hello. he don't know who to say hello to. hello sam. -he don't know who to say hello to you or me or what . -three of us he's gonna have a widdle, that'll sort all the problems out, hello. +he don't know who to say hello to you or me or what . +three of us he's gonna have a widdle, that'll sort all the problems out, hello. how's , how's your eye. keep still a minute, let's have a look, come here, sam, sam hey, sam, sam , come here. @@ -81996,9 +81931,9 @@ he has, he hasn't been very active actually there is an unfair advantage here he was looking sleeping in the car today, that's what it is he's just woken up. -cos i looked . +cos i looked . he's been asleep in the car . -didn't get a bite on any of them, not even a take, crabs +didn't get a bite on any of them, not even a take, crabs oh the fish are about down there where? can you see? @@ -82006,7 +81941,7 @@ seagulls are out there they're not gonna catch any big ones are they? nothing noticeable, it's normally a good sign though put some speed on -you are oh speed is ninety around here +you are oh speed is ninety around here what? speed limit's ninety around here seventy @@ -82018,8 +81953,8 @@ why? because you don't pull out in front of a car going seventy miles an hour how do you know it's a she? because it's an obnoxious move, it must be -looks like a fella to me -that is no i can't see, wow +looks like a fella to me +that is no i can't see, wow quick overtake her see if we can see sorry stop in here, do it all @@ -82029,12 +81964,12 @@ do it all won't have one yes they'll have one, i've not been in there go and have a look in atlantis while you're here what's atlantis? -atlantis has got, they're an electrical shop, they're on sales, see if you can find +atlantis has got, they're an electrical shop, they're on sales, see if you can find no, i don't, i want the tap all bloody stuff, i don't want a new whatsit you can see yes exactly, dad can get erm fifteen percent off there and you can give that's his car -he didn't want one, i say you're gonna get one if, if, if, if mr going, you'd better go and get one, but oh no she wouldn't +he didn't want one, i say you're gonna get one if, if, if, if mr going, you'd better go and get one, but oh no she wouldn't poo! what stinks? the plant @@ -82047,10 +81982,10 @@ do you wanna smell? oh toxic is it? no, -what's what stinks then? -oh i didn't want to tell you this phil, but +what's what stinks then? +oh i didn't want to tell you this phil, but what? -it's the +it's the you've gotta no, this isn't gonna smell, i like the condom it's wearing it's just the things you poke your hairs up on a sharp stick @@ -82063,7 +81998,7 @@ have a goody oh thank you, oh i love these, what you done to them? don't know, they're melting what have you done? -i use that thing which sort of congeals them together +i use that thing which sort of congeals them together that was a long word, congeal here's another word conjugal i don't know why, good god what the hell's he doing over the road? @@ -82072,14 +82007,14 @@ he's not supposed to be in there, what the bike is doing, you're not allowed to it's a woman i rest my case yeah -women -erm close your window +women +erm close your window why? otherwise you'll knock out the record oh, sorry about that -i thought was cold -i apologise for any temporary loss -i wonder where i'd get that vinegar from? +i thought was cold +i apologise for any temporary loss +i wonder where i'd get that vinegar from? i'd probably get it from boots boots mm @@ -82091,16 +82026,16 @@ yes, this mm? aha, you can try in quick save, they might have one i doubt it -you can try +you can try oh yeah and where here? mm i shall go in here i go, here i go, here i go, we are off to the show to the show ho we didn't do bad here, it was quite quick actually -always quite quick, always quite quick +always quite quick, always quite quick doesn't cost me anything, me personally it costs the practice -ah, but who's gonna pay for it oh hurry up, hurry up, hurry up +ah, but who's gonna pay for it oh hurry up, hurry up, hurry up what? i need the loo and i need a sweety, have another sweety @@ -82113,9 +82048,9 @@ what? i just like them you do you mm, yeah -oh mind my fish erm best get all the work done tomorrow +oh mind my fish erm best get all the work done tomorrow why? -cos we will i'll come dressed for dirty work tomorrow +cos we will i'll come dressed for dirty work tomorrow there's dirty work afoot eh? that's right do you want morse taken out? @@ -82132,7 +82067,7 @@ no he's not brand new series, yes it is is he? yeah, brand new series -oh good oh right +oh good oh right it look's quite good actually i erm, it's on tonight er old regan's on tonight regan? @@ -82149,7 +82084,7 @@ alright then, oh regan as in sweeney? yeah oh pilot tape for it you see -oh right, yes yes the sweeney it's quite good it ba, ba, ba with dennis waterman,ba, ba, do, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba quick mow that jogger over got him, now we've got time turn this when we've done this, erm, put the plants in and everything till i gave it at table tennis +oh right, yes yes the sweeney it's quite good it ba, ba, ba with dennis waterman,ba, ba, do, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba quick mow that jogger over got him, now we've got time turn this when we've done this, erm, put the plants in and everything till i gave it at table tennis you can't get any work done if you play table tennis well we'll get the motor work done first mm @@ -82157,7 +82092,7 @@ then play table tennis no yes, i've gotta have a chance to win again no chance -where were they, five five games on? +where were they, five five games on? er, no you won six five did i? yes @@ -82172,17 +82107,17 @@ geese, get the guns herons , herons they're not herons, herons don't fly in threes how many do they fly in then? -ones they're still +ones they're still they fly in one's what? -on their own +on their own singularly that's a long word isn't it? singularly yeah that's not so bad what's it mean? something to do with singling,si si singing -we we can have a game of count down masters +we we can have a game of count down masters count down masters -cogitation don't follow that one up +cogitation don't follow that one up mm come on oh the loo, how much further is it? i'm getting desperate @@ -82190,18 +82125,18 @@ ah desperate's a good word desperado, singular desperate mm latin for desperado -oh dear oh it's down about here when, did it the other day, and the woman just drove out straight in front of me from another lane +oh dear oh it's down about here when, did it the other day, and the woman just drove out straight in front of me from another lane lovely i just, i mean, why bother having roundabouts i ask myself well it was a woman come on yes it was a woman women don't comprehend roundabouts, driving cars oh -you should know that by now, nothing is ever +you should know that by now, nothing is ever it is an excuse what? er don't put your ear piece to the micro to my blooming sweets -i'm not keen on ear droppings in my sweets +i'm not keen on ear droppings in my sweets they're not mine, don't worry mm, i know i love it, i love it. @@ -82218,7 +82153,7 @@ what fishing magazine? your fishing guides it's shut is it? it shouldn't be it's six o'clock -not stopping now i haven't got no money anyway sorry i haven't got any money for the tape oh dear +not stopping now i haven't got no money anyway sorry i haven't got any money for the tape oh dear oh fish and chips, i fancy fish and chips no you don't well i fancy the woman serving @@ -82228,17 +82163,17 @@ have you ever tried max's kebabs? no mm, pretty good, hey there's danny's dad, he'll go right up high, erm up er, up roman road, i bet you which one? -that one in front see it's gone, ram him over -oh -not to over there, dear oh dear -i want to be danny's dad, i want to be danny's dad go that way look +that one in front see it's gone, ram him over +oh +not to over there, dear oh dear +i want to be danny's dad, i want to be danny's dad go that way look oh he's going the wrong way, moron, mm, where's he going? bonsoir, bonsoir -wow oh dear +wow oh dear what? -i now realize why it was reaching love it, it's getting right +i now realize why it was reaching love it, it's getting right erm,bom bom bom -so if we're going to do er i'd better unclip this hadn't i? +so if we're going to do er i'd better unclip this hadn't i? yo yes not one @@ -82250,7 +82185,7 @@ you'd thought that these houses could of least put a bit of paint on why? make it look more attractive no -they look grotty like that +they look grotty like that i still think that you should buy jean a range rover why? she likes them, nice cars @@ -82261,13 +82196,13 @@ what do you mean difficult to run? they're a damn sight more efficient than this i'll tell you that for a start rubbish they take more petrol, but servicing-wise they don't require as much -rubbish they're probably a lot more expensive to run than this +rubbish they're probably a lot more expensive to run than this well just because this is a jag h j six convertible, it's neither here nor there oh, what the whole part of the problem running is, is the depreciation thing, the more, the more you spend on a car the more the more depreciation you're going to get oh i suppose so -i'm not saying i suppose it's better +i'm not saying i suppose it's better well this is a classic car as they go -it's a, it's a, it's a er +it's a, it's a, it's a er oh no what? le pool de javelle horse dirt, mm @@ -82276,7 +82211,7 @@ we weren't ah at last home so that's basically, i now got a b grade for and that gives mm -so that's english, and i've gotta get, er he reckons he'll get a b grade for the er lit, but i was so cheesed off with that erm piece i got today, thirty five and thirty five, one mark off being er an a, he put at the bottom aargh, if only you'd seen the lousy ending, cos he said if i'd got the, an extra couple of sentences it er would of been forty eight, forty, so that's, so annoying, but i've now gotta write an informal letter, i don't know how that comes under informal letter +so that's english, and i've gotta get, er he reckons he'll get a b grade for the er lit, but i was so cheesed off with that erm piece i got today, thirty five and thirty five, one mark off being er an a, he put at the bottom aargh, if only you'd seen the lousy ending, cos he said if i'd got the, an extra couple of sentences it er would of been forty eight, forty, so that's, so annoying, but i've now gotta write an informal letter, i don't know how that comes under informal letter you write to an imaginary friend, you're inviting him down for the summer holidays and you say all that, all about the sort of things that you're planning to do with them, make it up can you put bad spellings in those as it's informal? no you cannot, you'll write it like a normal, a formal letter, like you would write to melanie @@ -82300,22 +82235,22 @@ dinner's now no dinner's in at least twenty minutes at least if you rough twenty minutes probably, if you just rough out -yes it's easy enough those so, i hope they don't get bitchy because most of mine are on, on the computer +yes it's easy enough those so, i hope they don't get bitchy because most of mine are on, on the computer well then write the song through, write the informal letter by hand yeah, i might do your handwriting's quite nice and neat -erm, oh i've got another piece back that i've twenty nine, twenty nine as it goes +erm, oh i've got another piece back that i've twenty nine, twenty nine as it goes that's a c innit? yeah, but that goes, that goes in the lit file, so i got rid of my er with the thirty five i managed to get rid of erm who's got all these things? they're at school in a box thank goodness for that -but er, so now i've got a thirty six, thirty five, thirty four, thirty four, thirty four, thirty two and thirty, so that's a b count in b file, so there's no hassle with that, but if i can get on and get rid of the er, i've got twenty eight, twenty nine in there as well, er twenty eight in there as well, so i want to get rid of the twenty eight and twenty nine but it is a guarantee that a b file, so there's +but er, so now i've got a thirty six, thirty five, thirty four, thirty four, thirty four, thirty two and thirty, so that's a b count in b file, so there's no hassle with that, but if i can get on and get rid of the er, i've got twenty eight, twenty nine in there as well, er twenty eight in there as well, so i want to get rid of the twenty eight and twenty nine but it is a guarantee that a b file, so there's mm no real worry about it, but erm i want to do better what about your economics? or don't you know that yet? -yeah, he still keeps far faffing around with the erm whatever detail, yeah, he still hasn't given it to us +yeah, he still keeps far faffing around with the erm whatever detail, yeah, he still hasn't given it to us well how you supposed to do it? did you get, did you get that thing finished er geography whatever it was? something, something @@ -82329,7 +82264,7 @@ because i didn't have time, but er they started geography course work today and why were you out the lesson? the drama thing, so i'm a se a section hand already on that and i've even got a, well we're supposed to listen to it tomorrow, we've got a tutor period instead, so it means that we miss another lesson can't you copy out what you, what you missed? -yeah, i'm out tomorrow night, i'm out school, selling books again so should be at home +yeah, i'm out tomorrow night, i'm out school, selling books again so should be at home when you gonna get all this work done richard? yes i'm trying to get it done, but i am getting pressure from the year group as well, it was, and so i've got that, back out at wednesday, so i'm gonna have to have my hair done last gonna wednesday what? @@ -82341,8 +82276,8 @@ yes, er probably until about half four well that's alright, she ain't she's not here till half three in any case yeah, you'll have to come home a bit er, a bit er yes i know -she's so this'll probably be our last appointment here wouldn't it? -no i was saying to her i'd probably have one more before i go anyway and er i'm, i'm gonna ask her if she with my, cos at that nana's there, i mean there'll be four of us there, it might be worth an hour and a quarter drive +she's so this'll probably be our last appointment here wouldn't it? +no i was saying to her i'd probably have one more before i go anyway and er i'm, i'm gonna ask her if she with my, cos at that nana's there, i mean there'll be four of us there, it might be worth an hour and a quarter drive what her? she wouldn't wanna drive an hour and a quarter well she might not, she might do @@ -82363,7 +82298,7 @@ no, no, no she won't do that but she could, i dunno perhaps we can work something out, i dunno, er failing that we'd have to come out to her house oh right, yeah, i'd rather go up the road, stupid -i know, but she's really good though, i be shall sorry to erm, have to give her up +i know, but she's really good though, i be shall sorry to erm, have to give her up oh dear, see that tutor tomorrow morning for an hour, hey hey what, get the job er copied up then i can't do job, it's course work, don't you understand? @@ -82381,7 +82316,7 @@ look, if you've got work to copy up, why can't you study and work in because he's a tutor what do you do in it? i have d r n l as to do -mm, i used to let my when it's tutor period, get on and do some revision work +mm, i used to let my when it's tutor period, get on and do some revision work good grief. and it's much nicer it, they know what they've got to look at. i've got to go and see wally in tomorrow for the forms, i ain't got any forms to fill in cos i'm officially not leaving, i'm only moving @@ -82393,27 +82328,27 @@ do get that out of your mouth please which is it gonna be? i'm not signing or changing anything richard until we have exchanged contracts oh yeah, that's easy muck around do what i do -no richard because the whole thing can fall through when we have our survey done it might show a defect or something, we might pull out, when they have their survey done it might show a defect so they might pull out, you don't do anything richard until the contracts have been exchanged, then you can start saying right i think that's, that's, every thing's definite -alright we were doing company law and +no richard because the whole thing can fall through when we have our survey done it might show a defect or something, we might pull out, when they have their survey done it might show a defect so they might pull out, you don't do anything richard until the contracts have been exchanged, then you can start saying right i think that's, that's, every thing's definite +alright we were doing company law and mm, mm i was damn good i knew everything, first i had to watch the accounts and secondly i'm looking at all this stuff for when i start my business mm, mm -so i'm saying ah that's that and that, that, so i basically have we were looking at erm, what's it? +so i'm saying ah that's that and that, that, so i basically have we were looking at erm, what's it? partnerships, did you know that if i start a partnership with phil right, mum mm -i will be completely liable for erm liability +i will be completely liable for erm liability yes -but that's, wouldn't affect me because i'll be taking loans out so there and i can have up to twenty er partners, nineteen in fact, because there's twenty partners altogether, basically, so there is definitely benefits for being in partnership +but that's, wouldn't affect me because i'll be taking loans out so there and i can have up to twenty er partners, nineteen in fact, because there's twenty partners altogether, basically, so there is definitely benefits for being in partnership as if er, there's not, if you've got twenty partners or there's twenty of you altogether you're splitting profit twenty ways i'm not having twenty partners, i'm having phil and that's it what, we'll sort it out later erm when you've got the capital right? -erm, but sole, we're looking at sole proprietor as well, there's some good things in that, i e they're cheap to set up, stuff like that, so they're not bad as they go, but, i suppose well i'll have to sell when i've got more money, i didn't get any replies today not a single blooming one, i'm a bit cheesed off, so erm, i think i might ring back that one of the ones that i did get a reply from and say thank you. +erm, but sole, we're looking at sole proprietor as well, there's some good things in that, i e they're cheap to set up, stuff like that, so they're not bad as they go, but, i suppose well i'll have to sell when i've got more money, i didn't get any replies today not a single blooming one, i'm a bit cheesed off, so erm, i think i might ring back that one of the ones that i did get a reply from and say thank you. i would leave it for a while richard well dad said i should say something i would just leave it for a while -but er, it's all i've had for now i suppose,oh god i've got maths tomorrow, hate maths +but er, it's all i've had for now i suppose,oh god i've got maths tomorrow, hate maths no you don't i do well that is, that is a really stupid attitude to go into isn't it? @@ -82421,7 +82356,7 @@ oh i hate it no you be one g c s e i'll fail don't be so silly, if he drops that glass i'm gonna kill him -dog went mad when i +dog went mad when i eh? sorry? dog went mad @@ -82430,26 +82365,26 @@ dumping himself and running around and banging into doors and things, stupid mut mm, mm well he is so cheeky, and you can tell when he's hungry cos he goes back for and stand by it again, sometimes he does and sometimes he doesn't well more fool you for letting him -well he's obviously hungry if he wants say have a second bonio so i just give it to him so what oh excuse me will look good with my full colour and commendations and credits and +well he's obviously hungry if he wants say have a second bonio so i just give it to him so what oh excuse me will look good with my full colour and commendations and credits and which means we've done three times in a night and a half, agnes? oh, she's useless! so you're gonna write up the list? yeah, may as well. -but today when we finished up to the middle of th here. -but erm so as what we have to do is to basically arrange start arranging things. +but today when we finished up to the middle of th here. +but erm so as what we have to do is to basically arrange start arranging things. like songs. what do you reckon i should get? -sort of trout trout hors d'oeuvres and stuff? +sort of trout trout hors d'oeuvres and stuff? oh my god! i can't stand fish! no, do smoked salmon. or smoked salmon hors d'oeuvres. you know, bits of smoked salmon on cheese sticks and things. ya. -poke people's eyes with a +poke people's eyes with a cos you don't want wanna have a meal, sort of nicknacky that you can sort of nibble. like donna! -sausage rolls and stuff like that sort of thing. +sausage rolls and stuff like that sort of thing. yeah. i don't suppose you fancy taking this tape machine home tonight do you, and recording some of your conversation with your brother or something? the longest conversation we have is, get off the computer, it's my turn! @@ -82459,7 +82394,7 @@ yeah, i tell you what you could take this to school for me. why? and you could tape it, er imagine it's yours yeah. -well, then you won't get the comments will you that i get? +well, then you won't get the comments will you that i get? yeah. what do you think? one of the lessons i've got are design, and not a lot happens in design. @@ -82481,21 +82416,21 @@ don't do it! turn this off. oh! erm -all you can do is leave it,ge take the out that one you know, like a and that, put that over the e end so it; s a nice warm bit like here, just enough to see. +all you can do is leave it,ge take the out that one you know, like a and that, put that over the e end so it; s a nice warm bit like here, just enough to see. oh you'll have to buy a new light top. mm. you could of course, have a big marquee in the back garden. oh yeah! richard. what? -er, we're not gonna be able to tape er la law. +er, we're not gonna be able to tape er la law. yes you are! i asked first! erm, no because we're recording red dwarf for dad. i'm sorry, i asked first! i don't care! i do! -because you can tape like music, beginning music and then he can tape it, he only wants a couple of minutes beginning. +because you can tape like music, beginning music and then he can tape it, he only wants a couple of minutes beginning. if you only want the bloody music,whe i, what's the point of taping in the first place! i want the music, cos i wanna co introduce them to music, so tape it, i asked first! you got a tape recorder there! @@ -82519,22 +82454,22 @@ not like brotherly love! i hate him! ah tho yo re , ah you don't really! so, we can have -a marquee out in the back garden. +a marquee out in the back garden. wo! what's this? be a bit cold wouldn't it? valentine, to richard, from richard. i know! ro roses are red, violets are blue, i'll get straight to the point, i want to bonk you ! -roses are red, violets are blue, most poems rhyme this one doesn't ! +roses are red, violets are blue, most poems rhyme this one doesn't ! no, read it properly! read it right! properly! -roses are red the day is blue, my only wish now is that i spend it with you. +roses are red the day is blue, my only wish now is that i spend it with you. roses are red, violets are blue, i'm writing to tell you i'm in love with you. -you never see me who wrote you that then? -er, er er er, mel . +you never see me who wrote you that then? +er, er er er, mel . i bet you, i bet you can't guess who . thank you! no. @@ -82547,7 +82482,7 @@ you know what he's waiting for ? yeah.. see you've made a mess on the board as well. mm! -i mean it why grey inside? +i mean it why grey inside? i wonder which poem book she got that out of? no, she wrote it herself. how do you know? @@ -82558,19 +82493,19 @@ i want your body! mm mm! noticed the poems rhyme without detection there. it's because,i have a rather large -a finger of fudge is just enough to give +a finger of fudge is just enough to give to give myself up! no. to win the by-election. a finger of fudge is just enough -a finger of fudge is just enough to give me myself a dee dee dee dee! +a finger of fudge is just enough to give me myself a dee dee dee dee! stiffy! -if, i'll fill my with goodness, nothing now can save her +if, i'll fill my with goodness, nothing now can save her a finger of fudge is just enough so go and vote for labour! but don't! please, now this is a conservative household! oh alright! -maggie thatcher rules good on her! +maggie thatcher rules good on her! down with the poor! up with the rich! i agree! @@ -82582,8 +82517,8 @@ about who? graham. why? i dunno. -she wants to see who's interested in po in helicopters. -i think it's which er sixty ki six +she wants to see who's interested in po in helicopters. +i think it's which er sixty ki six komenchi ah! that's a nice helicopter! @@ -82592,7 +82527,7 @@ what? there was a list. list of what? oh it's underneath there. -er it was there it is! +er it was there it is! mm mm. ah ! kate, donna, helen, jenny, georgina, sarah,ji i er,sa is that right? @@ -82607,7 +82542,7 @@ sarah no, start from the beginning. kate. no! -i'm not gonna well, no. +i'm not gonna well, no. not kate? not kate. donna? @@ -82628,7 +82563,7 @@ rebecca? maybe. jessica? maybe. -sarah wacko-jacko! +sarah wacko-jacko! sarah wacko? oh definitely! oh @@ -82654,12 +82589,12 @@ danny. ? no. she must be joking! -paul and bryant ? +paul and bryant ? erm, bryant maybe. no. i didn't put paul ! couldn't have been him. -so i'm gonna show dad that list this weekend see if he says oh oh oh! +so i'm gonna show dad that list this weekend see if he says oh oh oh! what that? yes. he's not gonna know any of them is he? @@ -82669,29 +82604,29 @@ yeah. that those are rebels can you? helen has he told yo , has he tol , if he doesn't know them he's not gonna know is he? -helen's quiet, jenny's quiet ooh i tell you what, i'm beginning to fall for jenny actually i have to admit. +helen's quiet, jenny's quiet ooh i tell you what, i'm beginning to fall for jenny actually i have to admit. i'm not. she kept looking at me today in god! now, at lunch. -giving me all sad looks cos she feels sorry for me. +giving me all sad looks cos she feels sorry for me. my little helen! helen! my little richard! a failure of natural selection! ooh! -you wanna perhaps. +you wanna perhaps. so if we can, yeah, well i suppose so. so i've recorded half an hour of tape already up here. -i got -can't you spell ! +i got +can't you spell ! what? -can't you spell ! +can't you spell ! ? yeah. . it's starts with j actually, in case you were wondering! -i thought was a g? +i thought was a g? that video was quite fun this morning wasn't it? ah . well talk about getting to the climax! @@ -82715,7 +82650,7 @@ it was quite funny, i have to admit. she was very good looking! i thought she looked like sarah . you reck any, anyone who's blonde looks like her isn't it? -well, she yo , she was er do you think i should invite sarah? +well, she yo , she was er do you think i should invite sarah? if she'll come. but i , does she know any of those people? no, not really. @@ -82750,21 +82685,21 @@ yeah. it's not good! oh what! done really good! -well you still do it for three years and ! +well you still do it for three years and ! german in three years, like that. -well oh yeah! -acht bitter +well oh yeah! +acht bitter so, well that's what we'll have to do then. -i'll have to have a have to have a word with good old dad and see what he suggests. +i'll have to have a have to have a word with good old dad and see what he suggests. basically, say, ah ya! das is good das fater that's, my father in german. no! -erm yes. +erm yes. didn't i just say it. -er er god i'm -then you say swina -mine a ah ! -re er er er er re , er er er er +er er god i'm +then you say swina +mine a ah ! +re er er er er re , er er er er open that cupboard . what? cupboard. @@ -82786,7 +82721,7 @@ the shirt. why, what's it got in there? just get the shirt out! what's wrong with it? -ge get it out on the hanger that's it! +ge get it out on the hanger that's it! don't knock it off! bring it over. st. michaels, oh yeah! @@ -82819,14 +82754,14 @@ turn them in. them ones? that's it! can you get them out then? -they're kind of a disgusting colour aren't they? +they're kind of a disgusting colour aren't they? you're not turning up to school in this are you? that's the one! -it's all hanging out, it's all it's all hanging out. +it's all hanging out, it's all it's all hanging out. put that on the door. good! have you ever thought about getting out of here, you know, if it's all on the door? -er denim jacket on top of that i think. +er denim jacket on top of that i think. i don't think so! don't think, denim jacket? well, where you going anyway? @@ -82840,11 +82775,11 @@ i know all my lines, my lines is, my name's robert and i like playing cowboys an i then in front of sam and she's the headmistress and i say, i've been sent to see you by miss huddy, miss trudgenell, because i got caught miss trudgenell! cleani ,co cos i got caught pulling a little girl's pigtails. -she said erm tt don't you know it's ma only my privilege to do that? -and i say, no miss trudgenell, she says er, why did you do it? -i said, because i wanted to , see miss and she says, right! +she said erm tt don't you know it's ma only my privilege to do that? +and i say, no miss trudgenell, she says er, why did you do it? +i said, because i wanted to , see miss and she says, right! bend over my table! -she gets the cane out and just as she's about to whip me, er jane walks in. +she gets the cane out and just as she's about to whip me, er jane walks in. and she bu , joins in does she? yeah. and then er, basically, that's it! @@ -82863,7 +82798,7 @@ oh. oh god! it's, he is such an awful actor! even i can't -i can imagine daniel sort of coming in you know +i can imagine daniel sort of coming in you know exactly! evening all! he is, he does! @@ -82880,7 +82815,7 @@ he's crap! what, do you reckon i should wear i reckon he'd better off with the music to be honest, i mean what me? -no him +no him oh oh! no, he's no good! shall i wear that one? @@ -82894,7 +82829,7 @@ oh my god, richard! looks like ca carly's curtains! she hangs them round her waist! she -or do you reckon i should wear a white casual +or do you reckon i should wear a white casual well,ha , you're supposed to be a five year old yeah. dressed in that? @@ -82904,10 +82839,10 @@ exactly! that's what i said! have you got the little cap as well? with shorts on? -i thought i se , i'll be a boy, er donna's. +i thought i se , i'll be a boy, er donna's. what a cap? yeah i know! -i didn't know she was due ! +i didn't know she was due ! what's the matter with grey trousers? grey trousers maybe? black shoes, grey trousers and that? @@ -82927,14 +82862,14 @@ do you think that, that one maybe? i dunno. if you like. do you reckon she'll prefer it in that colour? -no, i'm taking not bothering. +no, i'm taking not bothering. i mean, nobody's gonna bother to check the colour of your shirt with about twenty other people on stage ? -there's my global hypercolour. +there's my global hypercolour. what a ! ooh there again, what do you reckon to these? i've never worn these? neither have i. -i've only got one pair of i've only got one pair of +i've only got one pair of i've only got one pair of get into these actually. yeah, i've got one pair presenting clothes . bloody hell! @@ -82956,7 +82891,7 @@ do you prefer them to those ones? not particularly. right. those are more casual actually. -and i can wear a white shirt straight laced white. +and i can wear a white shirt straight laced white. ha er er ! what's do , by the way, what's donna wearing? oh! @@ -82966,13 +82901,13 @@ wo ooh, ooh, ooh! tell you what, i do, but i can't wait that you want to. wow! -erm, a very, very, very, very, very slinky erm black skirt and tights, and a very low top! +erm, a very, very, very, very, very slinky erm black skirt and tights, and a very low top! i'm talking seriously slinky! oh i see! a er phew! we're talking seriously tasty! -so +so not me, i sprayed my balls with that stuff. oh lend you a jacket, moron! er @@ -82981,7 +82916,7 @@ so it's good stuff this! thank you very much. you seen it? -what sort of take it every morning ? +what sort of take it every morning ? that's right! yep! it's good stuff for bad breath actually! @@ -82997,7 +82932,7 @@ yeah. to put our thing onto tape. how the hell am i gonna do that? why? -mean, how the hell you gonna do that ? +mean, how the hell you gonna do that ? yeah, what do have to say anyway? that thing we did in class. oh that! @@ -83005,7 +82940,7 @@ yeah. ow! ow! ow! -right, so just a minute, so let's let's plug up this te te ,ta ta ta ta ta tape. +right, so just a minute, so let's let's plug up this te te ,ta ta ta ta ta tape. ivor ! how you gonna do that? no, use that while i'm doing the entertainment. @@ -83013,7 +82948,7 @@ that, oh so what?! oh well i wouldn't mind being entertained by her! -to be perfectly honest. +to be perfectly honest. ooh that's nice! ooh! very nice indeed! @@ -83027,13 +82962,13 @@ you got a flinch or what? keep on doing that! this one? -i'll in the eye, don't want this waste my expensive deodorant! +i'll in the eye, don't want this waste my expensive deodorant! this stuff costs a fortune now! this lynx is expensive as well! this is one ninety nine a can! and it doesn't last very long, there's only about two week's worth there! cos i absolutely spray myself to death! -erm booze, booze! +erm booze, booze! we gotta limit that. so you don't want food? you don't want, you just want sort of crisps and nicknacky things @@ -83041,14 +82976,14 @@ sausages. and sausages and hors d'oeuvres sausages. hors d'oeuvres. -salmon and you want salmon on rolls +salmon and you want salmon on rolls salmon on biscuits? sam salmon the bed! ha! salmon on the rolls , and salmon on ! -salmon on toast and sort of stuff like that? +salmon on toast and sort of stuff like that? toasted salmon. basically do you know what? @@ -83071,7 +83006,7 @@ you told me that one! yes, well that's er, er really not andy! what about,i i thought that was quite good ! i've got a joke for you. -what do you call a scouse in a five-bedroomed house? +what do you call a scouse in a five-bedroomed house? burglar. what do you call a liverpudlian in a suit? defendant. @@ -83079,20 +83014,20 @@ yes! oh you heard it? i was waiting for . you sod! -erm why do essex girls wear knickers? +erm why do essex girls wear knickers? keep their nipples warm. why don't , oh it was brilliant ! -why do erm what's the difference between a skoda and an essex girl? +why do erm what's the difference between a skoda and an essex girl? you can drive an essex girl more than a hundred yards! er oh it's ! the side of shoes are all peeling, look, they're all cracking up. oh well, i'm not surprised. -you do, sort of, put them under wear and tear. +you do, sort of, put them under wear and tear. i walk with them! oh dear! i sprayed my hair! -i hold my hair spray ! +i hold my hair spray ! designer wear hair! cor! but did she tell you how she's gonna wear it? @@ -83100,7 +83035,7 @@ on her head! no! good possibility! no, you've gotta try. -there is rumours decisive rumours that she's gonna wear on it her head! +there is rumours decisive rumours that she's gonna wear on it her head! she looked very nice today in science! i was watching that film and thinking of her. i have to tell you. @@ -83112,13 +83047,13 @@ can you imagine that! he's walked up to her and asked her out! so? he was a prat! -so he can be a prat ! -i spent six months too priming my time then +so he can be a prat ! +i spent six months too priming my time then it still didn't work ! it still didn't damn well work, too right! -and then asked her out it orgasmo, or what, too! +and then asked her out it orgasmo, or what, too! yes! -she's, well looking at her in p s e d and she looked so cute and adorable! +she's, well looking at her in p s e d and she looked so cute and adorable! who? helen. oh, jenny's not to bad either! @@ -83131,27 +83066,27 @@ it's huge! what? her bum. who? -sarah 's. +sarah 's. i don't think i've ever looked. it's a whopping great thing! just trying to lift it! yeah. it's not that big ! -you get it is,her bum as well! +you get it is,her bum as well! oh dear! -so i've basically gotta take one of those suit holders in tomorrow to school for my costume. +so i've basically gotta take one of those suit holders in tomorrow to school for my costume. cos i'm not gonna go in and get it ruined. -as,lloyd grossman would say it's quite novelty . +as,lloyd grossman would say it's quite novelty . tony. i can't do that ! that's right. i can't say that. no you can't say that one without a . -erm damn! +erm damn! i've forgotten what i was gonna say! ah, phone! phone! -oh miss might be communicating to us all. +oh miss might be communicating to us all. it's a phone! sign! @@ -83176,7 +83111,7 @@ hello? hi! what do you want? alright, i'll have to. -i've got little andy sitting here! +i've got little andy sitting here! who is it? it's . go away! @@ -83184,7 +83119,7 @@ yes, you were saying? let me listen. we haven't got any. no, we didn't! -i rang danny and already checked so there isn't basically! +i rang danny and already checked so there isn't basically! that's crap! is jim there with you? or is he at home? @@ -83201,7 +83136,7 @@ getting me undressed! forget about it nick! did you hear that ? did you hear what he said? -oh well, basically well +oh well, basically well mm! oh it's nothing of interest. er @@ -83210,9 +83145,9 @@ what ? do what? do what? oh well, nothing of interest. -erm, no yo i've, er i've asked him at the parents' evening what he expected us to do for economics, right? +erm, no yo i've, er i've asked him at the parents' evening what he expected us to do for economics, right? and yo you're never gonna guess what he wants us to do for our final bit of course work? -we have got to go and stand outside marks and spencers and ask questionnaires and we've gotta do the same in wimbourne. +we have got to go and stand outside marks and spencers and ask questionnaires and we've gotta do the same in wimbourne. ridiculous or what! i think it's crap! i think it's pathetic! @@ -83226,27 +83161,27 @@ oh god! i think it might be worthwhile actually so the school can come and bail us out! urgh! god it's ridiculous! -i mean will be arrested for kerb crawling! +i mean will be arrested for kerb crawling! i mean, you can't do that sort of thing, surely! oh well, i think it's ridiculous! -as you can tell, i said, andy's been drinking i think. +as you can tell, i said, andy's been drinking i think. i wouldn't know. -er, blackcurrant yeah, blackcurrant mate, i'm afraid. +er, blackcurrant yeah, blackcurrant mate, i'm afraid. so i i was a bit stupid letting him on that sort of thing. -we were this, just discussing the party here that we're having and we've now got twenty five guests you see. +we were this, just discussing the party here that we're having and we've now got twenty five guests you see. guests? twenty five! it should be a great doss up! donna, georgina, sarah ,er er er pa oh ah, i'm definitely meant to record that! -georgina, er, helen, jenny, claire , claire , sarah madeline, that lot. +georgina, er, helen, jenny, claire , claire , sarah madeline, that lot. it should be a great doss up! tell him there's about twenty so -million girls, and two boys ! +million girls, and two boys ! pardon? yeah, and you, phil, that lot. -phil's gonna basically, when we've all had as you would know with all the other girls, then erm he basically has to come and sin erm, we repent to him, basically! +phil's gonna basically, when we've all had as you would know with all the other girls, then erm he basically has to come and sin erm, we repent to him, basically! yes. exactly! that's basically what we , er what's happening. @@ -83259,9 +83194,9 @@ what? on are on now. when's what? oh i don't know exactly. -as soon as i can arrange a free couple of weeks away, yep. +as soon as i can arrange a free couple of weeks away, yep. cos i gotta get booze and food and all that stuff in. -so, andy's gonna hire a video camera to, to film er stuart and phil, and that stuff. +so, andy's gonna hire a video camera to, to film er stuart and phil, and that stuff. so it should be a good laugh like a good old er, jolly jaunt! but we'll have to have a look. right! @@ -83285,15 +83220,15 @@ well there's not a great deal to talk about. as no. it goes. -but you have to have, er it'll be good if you could find something for her. -well, we'll see er hardly think that i know any active +but you have to have, er it'll be good if you could find something for her. +well, we'll see er hardly think that i know any active well you admirals at the moment. well not active, but you do go down to portsmouth quite regularly don't you? -well yeah, i mean i might i can probably get more advice on the r a f or army than, than the navy. +well yeah, i mean i might i can probably get more advice on the r a f or army than, than the navy. can you find out for the army for me? mm mm mm. -and +and mm. put it forward. yes, probably. @@ -83303,22 +83238,22 @@ oh well, course it is! i know that. recruit , there's a mhm. -erm there's two guys want to go in the marines in mine anyway and so they're paying erm, a levels of fifteen hundred quid for one of them. +erm there's two guys want to go in the marines in mine anyway and so they're paying erm, a levels of fifteen hundred quid for one of them. well he's getting paid fifteen hundred yeah. quid a levels. yeah, that's a good idea. -and so, if i do that for the army and then get them to do my degree as well. +and so, if i do that for the army and then get them to do my degree as well. yes. so, you get fifteen hundred for going the ar , er, doing a levels, which isn't bad is it? nope. -have a with that. +have a with that. so, that's not too bad. that's right. and you have erm -are you going to look around the house again tomorrow? +are you going to look around the house again tomorrow? no. are you going for a buy then? well, probably will do. @@ -83327,20 +83262,20 @@ er, if i go then you can go. yeah. don't see any reason why not. we could pop up this saturday. -no, i'm not going while is driving. -oh er sammy. +no, i'm not going while is driving. +oh er sammy. so, when they gonna sell he his, this week? hang on! oh i dunno. -i do i haven't heard anything, i was supposed to ring them and find out. +i do i haven't heard anything, i was supposed to ring them and find out. oh god! don't really understand why i haven't. they're playing around! no. or they would have got back wouldn't they? by now. -well possibly. -have you filled in all th , did you hear telephoned back? +well possibly. +have you filled in all th , did you hear telephoned back? the one you were supposed sorry? did you call that number back? @@ -83355,17 +83290,17 @@ nope. shouldn't have bothered! sorry? said, i shouldn't have bothered. -anyway, i dropped, i rang his office and then erm alistare rang me on the mo i think, i think if alistare rang me they could tell me that er if i did, or i, no i got the message +anyway, i dropped, i rang his office and then erm alistare rang me on the mo i think, i think if alistare rang me they could tell me that er if i did, or i, no i got the message no you in yo , i got another message in the office, that's right. -no, you got one from mum in the evening. +no, you got one from mum in the evening. no, a different, the next day. oh! and i thought he came back again. oh well, it's another part of the office then. oh my god! oh! -but er, yes won't be long but er it's ridiculous! +but er, yes won't be long but er it's ridiculous! well then, nothing's stopping you putting the damn thing on. it's not plugged in, there's not enough plug sockets. but you don't need the, you don't the plug in for the erm @@ -83389,29 +83324,29 @@ it's our fifth in ten years . i should imagine that went down well! yeah! you could say that. -she rang erm a le , did she tell so , did, mum tell you about the time she had erm some calls about two in the morning? +she rang erm a le , did she tell so , did, mum tell you about the time she had erm some calls about two in the morning? yeah. -imagine calling maggie at six in the morning! +imagine calling maggie at six in the morning! i mean, glenys at six in the morning. exactly! i think they'd got another hour. sh she's weird! didn't i oh that cedar table needs re layering. -one general well well i wouldn't worry about it yet, i don't think. -you can't read belgian though can you? +one general well well i wouldn't worry about it yet, i don't think. +you can't read belgian though can you? yeah. oh, didn't know you could. oh it's better than buying a new one isn't it? i would hope so. oh, you're going through those! -do you have to ti , do you tick them off against your cheque book stubs? -no , that's not what i'm doing, i just wanna see which erm which building society sorry, which erm not building society, which erm +do you have to ti , do you tick them off against your cheque book stubs? +no , that's not what i'm doing, i just wanna see which erm which building society sorry, which erm not building society, which erm bank? -er what do they call them? +er what do they call them? stadium? life assurance, erm yes. -loans erm is directed. +loans erm is directed. haven't you er, you got alistare insured, and you haven't got me insured? not true. it is true. @@ -83423,17 +83358,17 @@ mum says he's insured. not any more. oh! brilliant! -so if i pop my clogs nobody get any. +so if i pop my clogs nobody get any. dee doo doo doo . -but erm oh damn! +but erm oh damn! stay there. try not to talk too much. i don't know want you to have too much. -why can't i get rid of this thing for you? +why can't i get rid of this thing for you? what thing? save the accountants doing it. what things? -your cheques on the statements. +your cheques on the statements. mm? because it's dead easy! i know it is. @@ -83451,40 +83386,40 @@ when we get ourselves sorted again. i love doing that! great fun! i used to be able quite regular. -with the p c and b. +with the p c and b. oh dear ! my friends are already applying for their summer jobs. yeah? yeah. james has applied to macro. he'll probably get in as well, little, bloody sod! -but, i'll have to see, yeah i'll have to g pop along to liphook actually, if we do that if you re do go back, well i can pop round the village can't i? -sort of if i go smartly dressed i can see if they've got anything. +but, i'll have to see, yeah i'll have to g pop along to liphook actually, if we do that if you re do go back, well i can pop round the village can't i? +sort of if i go smartly dressed i can see if they've got anything. well it's an idea. -gotta ring phil actually,wha is it too late now? +gotta ring phil actually,wha is it too late now? dad? what? is it too late to ring phil? it's about my c, will i get my references. oh don't do it now! -cos it's, i've gotta get th , ask if i can if they need a, explain er +cos it's, i've gotta get th , ask if i can if they need a, explain er well don't do it now! oh well i'll, have to ring him tomorrow, it's very important! can't forget that. cos then we sort of, turn out, get a finger out and get a move on! -and so, it doesn't look good if i don't bring the information in so i'd better hurry up with that. -i've also gotta put my german onto tape tomorrow. +and so, it doesn't look good if i don't bring the information in so i'd better hurry up with that. +i've also gotta put my german onto tape tomorrow. oh! i haven't got a microphone, what a shame, i can't! mm. ah dear! no, i can't do that. -so erm that's german homework i can't do. +so erm that's german homework i can't do. dear oh dear! oh! oh, oh! i'm -well that's probably doing too much work. +well that's probably doing too much work. oh very funny! you're being sarcastic i take it? oh, me ? @@ -83497,18 +83432,18 @@ not good enough! who cares! don't do that! habit. -erm there's no reason why i can't go out with you on friday is there? +erm there's no reason why i can't go out with you on friday is there? where? to liphook no. if you're going up that house on friday afternoon. -pop up to london we could already +pop up to london we could already why am i going friday afternoon? just saying, just in case you do ! -i can leave at the new +i can leave at the new well i'm not going to am i? new house. -oh i've got my biology tomorrow. +oh i've got my biology tomorrow. aargh! dum dum da! should be doing about @@ -83527,7 +83462,7 @@ no, no, no, no, no! oh no! god! increase the premiums. -twenty seven from the nine two thousand one eight. +twenty seven from the nine two thousand one eight. i still think it'd be good if my bike went walk about . be a good way of doing it. get it practically sawed up and that. @@ -83538,14 +83473,14 @@ saying it's broken. i'll stretch you for it. oh good! why? -well, only really because of erm as mature, as policies mature before the er +well, only really because of erm as mature, as policies mature before the er what do you mean they mature? you can collect them? yeah. before are they pensions? no, no, no, no! -they're, they're er and er life insurance against the mortgage. +they're, they're er and er life insurance against the mortgage. what? you borrow money yeah. @@ -83564,7 +83499,7 @@ in other words the money from your life insurance will pay the mortgage? yes. so we've not got that much hassle then? no, not yet. -so well then, what you worrying about? +so well then, what you worrying about? i wasn't worried! good! glad to hear it! @@ -83587,7 +83522,7 @@ some of it's useful, i mean what and that thing? what? that can be chucked. -well, we need it, the amount of stuff at the moment, and get rid of it when we know what we're doing with that thing. +well, we need it, the amount of stuff at the moment, and get rid of it when we know what we're doing with that thing. well we're gonna need two removal vans. well if we have two removal vans, we have two removal vans! we didn't fit in the last one. @@ -83604,8 +83539,8 @@ aren't they? well obviously not. oh yeah, true ! the housing market is hardly buoyant is it? -so, in other words, you can push them down a bit. -did you get the er bit they saved on the stamp duty to buy the kitchen? +so, in other words, you can push them down a bit. +did you get the er bit they saved on the stamp duty to buy the kitchen? it's possible. does that mean yes? oh good! @@ -83617,14 +83552,14 @@ don't ask, you don't get! exactly! but do you think they'll load the thing on the joints? or -we'll probably have to split it i would think. +we'll probably have to split it i would think. oh excuse me ! but it shouldn't be too much should it? no. we eve , we can dig them up and fix them, really, there's real problem getting anybody in. so why have the three trees gotta come down? what three trees are they? -well those that are right next to the the ones growing up between the two bedrooms. +well those that are right next to the the ones growing up between the two bedrooms. ah! oh that, that one the big one. @@ -83632,7 +83567,7 @@ the big one? the big one on the back. yeah. oh tha , we need that anyway. -tha that one's actually another . +tha that one's actually another . oh brilliant! then we got one round the corner in the patio area. oh no! @@ -83642,11 +83577,11 @@ oh! but it's right up against the house, it's gotta come down. tt. i bet next door are gonna get bitchy aren't they? -well possibly. +well possibly. then we'll erm why's it gotta come down? does it have to? -oh th the erm the surveyor reckoned that that house next door +oh th the erm the surveyor reckoned that that house next door yeah. was built afterwards as a servant's house. lovely! @@ -83669,14 +83604,14 @@ he said it was a big one didn't they? mm. cos it's probably double the size of this one. er it's, -it's gotta be well it's ri , what do you reckon, four thousand square feet? +it's gotta be well it's ri , what do you reckon, four thousand square feet? no, no! oh i can't work it out. i really can't afford it must be pretty close. so you don't need all this, surely? what do you need alistare's report for? -i'll keep the no, i just keep the stuff, that's er got sentimental value. +i'll keep the no, i just keep the stuff, that's er got sentimental value. oh christ! i'm gonna burn all of mine! no you're not! @@ -83688,7 +83623,7 @@ so when are nan and granddad gonna come then? oh it's alistare's trust fund. hang on a minute. well i'm sure what's going in there. -are they gonna come and stay with us, sort of in december +are they gonna come and stay with us, sort of in december i dunno when they'll onwards? come. @@ -83697,7 +83632,7 @@ oh ss right! struth! -this never changes . +this never changes . it's just a copy anyway. mm, course. what's the passport for? @@ -83706,10 +83641,10 @@ my to , very first one. oh god! who's that? peace -an ugly looking son of a bitch! +an ugly looking son of a bitch! police, peace like man! it says . -but this stuff needs brushing out once it's that supposed +but this stuff needs brushing out once it's that supposed mhm. to be quite simple to remove. i'll have to try something different. @@ -83718,15 +83653,15 @@ we'll see! cos there's only a few that i get on really well with. well we'll see! it's,now. -probably more than that actually, and er well they are -and the policy you are. -,no it's about four five probably. +probably more than that actually, and er well they are +and the policy you are. +,no it's about four five probably. oh what the heck! -oh well, i can't shift -you almost got those doctors. -what time is it, by the way please? +oh well, i can't shift +you almost got those doctors. +what time is it, by the way please? you got a watch on? -it is nine fifty two. +it is nine fifty two. oh god! i better check my . be a bit late. @@ -83742,16 +83677,16 @@ what annoys me is that i know i saw the damn thing not too long ago! it must be in there then. god, i'm thirsty again! i've been thirsty all evening! -yeah, so said it was that spaghetti bolognese that did it. +yeah, so said it was that spaghetti bolognese that did it. makes you thirsty. mm. well, it's probably mm. it's probably that. maybe it is a flu going around then. -well these all need to be well i mean quite often this stuff we can +well these all need to be well i mean quite often this stuff we can throw? -no, no, half of this stuff we can actually keep bi , or or leave, leave for them because it's actually relevant information. +no, no, half of this stuff we can actually keep bi , or or leave, leave for them because it's actually relevant information. what leave them bills and everything? no i mean it's and guarantees? @@ -83769,9 +83704,9 @@ not all of them, no. well a lot of , yeah? and water softener as well? all those big salt pebble things i have to fill up every week in the ? -well i guess we may get a we may get ourselves a waste disposable unit. +well i guess we may get a we may get ourselves a waste disposable unit. good! -get one of those we got in, particularly in favour of those. +get one of those we got in, particularly in favour of those. does she like them? stick some raw eggs and things down there. get it chopped up. @@ -83795,14 +83730,14 @@ exactly! so that's a definite bonus! well it wasn't, although they'd actually be going around burning ourselves anyway! i do, you know those frying pans that you bought, the frying pans and saucepans? -an , you know the metal bit that's by the handle that's a really poor safety device! +an , you know the metal bit that's by the handle that's a really poor safety device! poor? -on the saucepans there's a metal rim sort of piece at the end of the handle +on the saucepans there's a metal rim sort of piece at the end of the handle is there? that that touches the actual saucepan yes. when you pick that up you put your thumb on it! -i +i and i burnt myself so many times on that! don't pick it up so close to the handle then! yeah but it's @@ -83811,15 +83746,15 @@ it's isn't it? why am i difficult. -missing missing some subtle point here. +missing missing some subtle point here. are we leaving the washing machine, by the way? no! well that absolutely, we've gotta get a new washing machine! don't be stupid! we have, look, this one! -it's only because it's not so not erm stable. -just adjust the feet slightly. -if i had it on a solid floor, but it's gotta go, don't forget it's on a a wooden floor. +it's only because it's not so not erm stable. +just adjust the feet slightly. +if i had it on a solid floor, but it's gotta go, don't forget it's on a a wooden floor. oh i suppose so. what you want is a so so , is a solid floor. is it? @@ -83827,14 +83762,14 @@ mhm. oh right. well that makes a difference, solid floor. oh oh! -will you stand it, sort of the garage in your er best job of the afternoon? +will you stand it, sort of the garage in your er best job of the afternoon? won't be too bad. well this, well i think it's a hotpoint. well no. everything you buy is a hotpoint! no it's not! there's nothing wrong with buying that. -well l e c are pretty good that's why we buy them! +well l e c are pretty good that's why we buy them! so, oh! the tapes nearly run out! thank god! @@ -83843,16 +83778,16 @@ ooh it works! i bet i will get nice and fluffed out so that it i will keeping talking to this stupid machine! oh god! -but still oh er +but still oh er why? -they'll probably contact and they'll check every single doctor. +they'll probably contact and they'll check every single doctor. why is that? -then i'll i think it's disgraceful! +then i'll i think it's disgraceful! we'll have to get the guy out from sticks and stones to do our fireplaces. is it a real fire there, by the way? -well it's and in the bedroom. +well it's and in the bedroom. there's on in the bedrooms? -well, one of the bedrooms has got a fire. +well, one of the bedrooms has got a fire. now, let me guess, you're having that one? i dunno. they,na , nan and granddad may have that as a sitting room to start with. @@ -83868,7 +83803,7 @@ yeah, yeah marshmallows! yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah! cor, it's ages since we've done that! -used to do it down there and we used to get stones that blew up and poinged everywhere! +used to do it down there and we used to get stones that blew up and poinged everywhere! aha. ah, i love that! yeah! @@ -83886,7 +83821,7 @@ is it? you've seen it. i can't remember. which room is it in? -well there's a fire in the main room. +well there's a fire in the main room. oh, and that's the ballroom, i think it's called dad, the ballroom. i don't think so! it's called the ballroom! @@ -83894,19 +83829,19 @@ oh well that's what, yeah, they call it, i think it's hardly that. well it's big! i know that, yeah. big house! -well the house gotta . +well the house gotta . it's gotta be there somewhere so just let's and find it. right! -i'll look in my ro so that sort of thing she can look at in the morning. +i'll look in my ro so that sort of thing she can look at in the morning. oh god, i'm starving ! oh! -i thank god that . +i thank god that . oh i'll take twiglets into school tomorrow. mhm. make a change. get . -twiglets and er and the pasty. -you have to get the done as well. +twiglets and er and the pasty. +you have to get the done as well. yes. put, put that on the shelf though. exactly! @@ -83915,7 +83850,7 @@ i don't think you'll ever get tha that to be done now. yes i will. not with the rigging, the rigging's had it! well then, do, redo the rigging, that's not a problem. -no, it's a bit difficult. +no, it's a bit difficult. just a matter of it's a shame, it's a beautiful ship! just a matter of finding the time! @@ -83927,7 +83862,7 @@ probably about sixty three isn't it? oh easily! easily! shame! -lovely +lovely a shame , yup! cos it's the solid ones . yep! @@ -83940,7 +83875,7 @@ on some so much to do! on some . so much to do and so little time! -we went to parkside reproductions your desk the maho , mahogany one. +we went to parkside reproductions your desk the maho , mahogany one. oh god! just can't be bothered about that yet richard! no you said for the new office. @@ -83950,14 +83885,14 @@ let's go and watch the news. alright. ah! i saw what's his name today by the way. -. and clobbered me again! +. and clobbered me again! wanted to know if you'd said anything. mum? i said anything? i mean, if i said anything to you. about what? me me me mention yo , something in the newsletter. -wa wondered if you were gonna do anything. +wa wondered if you were gonna do anything. so, i said no, i'd mentioned it to you and talked about it. i think he must think we're complete idiots or something! i've got a temperature, by the way. @@ -83969,15 +83904,15 @@ well you gonna, oh i've gotta bring a cup of tea in for you, have i now? yeah. oh right! i'll get up and get the damn thing shall i? -do you want me to do anything else while i'm up up and about? +do you want me to do anything else while i'm up up and about? there we go! anything else you'd like while i'm up? -scratch your back, or get the paper, or the get the post in, or take the dog for a walk or then, shall i? -richard, on the odd occasion you something for me richard i ought to be a lot for you! -altogether +scratch your back, or get the paper, or the get the post in, or take the dog for a walk or then, shall i? +richard, on the odd occasion you something for me richard i ought to be a lot for you! +altogether i said , i can do tea. well i'm not doing tea, alistare can do it, he's been home all day! -alistare does something +alistare does something he's been home all day. no! he did @@ -83992,7 +83927,7 @@ don't see why you can't do it. don't ask me to take that in again tomorrow, cos i can't! if i'm supposed to be doing it. can you take it in tomorrow mum? -i better take it back tomorrow hadn't i? +i better take it back tomorrow hadn't i? mum? i would have, you said she's calling here to pick it up er, isn't she? yes. @@ -84002,15 +83937,15 @@ how are you? alright. doing a gig aren't you? down at the r a f club, yeah. -yes, it was in a bloody scrap yard and this jack come to me we had he had mentioned it before but he said we said we're not bothered, you know, he won't er that was in there. -where the bloody hell have you been he said ! -i've been cos i haven't been to the r a f club for ages there. +yes, it was in a bloody scrap yard and this jack come to me we had he had mentioned it before but he said we said we're not bothered, you know, he won't er that was in there. +where the bloody hell have you been he said ! +i've been cos i haven't been to the r a f club for ages there. no. no. and he said, are you still doing that one on the twentieth of march? -i thought buzz buzz buzz! +i thought buzz buzz buzz! i said,oh i'll let you know tomorrow jack . -so i got hold of dave and i said ring stuart and ring +so i got hold of dave and i said ring stuart and ring i didn't know, it was david just, sort of, saying that, it's something your going to do. ring re the it was @@ -84018,32 +83953,32 @@ the drummer it was and ask, do they wanna do it like? yeah. -they both, i rang dave back on the sunday and he said they both wanna do it so took it! +they both, i rang dave back on the sunday and he said they both wanna do it so took it! it's money innit? did you get your car? yes, i got it, yeah, yeah. what day? the thirteenth or the fourteenth? -oh i got it on the bloody saturday didn't i ! +oh i got it on the bloody saturday didn't i ! got it on the saturday. you're alright then. -well, six fifty i got if for like, i try give him a six hundred and he ummed and ahhed and then he said well he said well i'll take the six hundred he said, can you manage the hundred quid over the next five or six weeks? -i said, well i can't to be honest with you, i said i've gotta pay back what i bloody +well, six fifty i got if for like, i try give him a six hundred and he ummed and ahhed and then he said well he said well i'll take the six hundred he said, can you manage the hundred quid over the next five or six weeks? +i said, well i can't to be honest with you, i said i've gotta pay back what i bloody yeah. borrowed like! yeah. -i said, i'll tell you what, i said er cos my mum lent me seven hundred +i said, i'll tell you what, i said er cos my mum lent me seven hundred yeah. down. yeah. i said i'll give you six fifty, so i'll have to try and scrounge the other fifty quid to tax the bloody thing! yeah. -he said i don't know what the car owes me he said can you come back tomorrow about half past ten? +he said i don't know what the car owes me he said can you come back tomorrow about half past ten? i said yes alright then, which was the saturday like. -so i left it till about twenty past eleven didn't i? +so i left it till about twenty past eleven didn't i? i thought oh i'll keep him on tenterhooks,ey -so i got, he said er where you been he said? +so i got, he said er where you been he said? i thought you'd changed your mind! he said it's alright i'll do the oh. @@ -84052,19 +83987,19 @@ but they put the tax up in the budget didn't they? on the car tax! yeah. so i went to tax it with the fifty five quid as i thought! -i had to pay the new increase! +i had to pay the new increase! yeah? yeah. sixty pound fifty it cost me for six months! oh why, it's more isn't it for -yes, i know it's more it was always more before. +yes, i know it's more it was always more before. yeah, it was fifty five wasn't it before, half year? yeah. yes. yeah. yeah. and what is it now? -and what is this ? +and what is this ? sixty pound fifty. sixty pound, is the oh! @@ -84072,14 +84007,14 @@ like i, i've taxed this from the first of march like. yeah. yeah. -yes, if they'd have done it from, say, the first of april fair comment like, i wouldn't of said +yes, if they'd have done it from, say, the first of april fair comment like, i wouldn't of said yeah. you know, wouldn't yeah. of said nothing, oh well it's gone up, it's gone up like! yeah. i know. -but i paid for the first of march so i've lost li literally fourteen days haven't +but i paid for the first of march so i've lost li literally fourteen days haven't yes. i? yes. @@ -84091,16 +84026,16 @@ march like! same as me. i only tax mine for six month now then,ay? yeah well it -but er they what's er name, it'd cost me fifty five quid end of this month! +but er they what's er name, it'd cost me fifty five quid end of this month! yeah. know what i mean? but i've got this ea , other ten quid going on it! -well,fo , fortunately +well,fo , fortunately yeah well, it was right it was cheaper to do it for twelve months anyway. oh yeah that's right, it was cheaper. -it was er what was it, hundred quid weren't it? +it was er what was it, hundred quid weren't it? yeah. -and it was hundred and ten if you did it over the two six +and it was hundred and ten if you did it over the two six two months like. yeah, that's it. @@ -84126,21 +84061,21 @@ yeah ! oh ! you like that, do you ? it's alright. -i've seen in real life,! +i've seen in real life,! yeah. how's your mum? -alright, she's ah, been this morning and er they took the sling off now, she's getting onto use it again. +alright, she's ah, been this morning and er they took the sling off now, she's getting onto use it again. is she better when she stands up now? she used to oh yes! -what is was, she gets with kimmy barking she gets +what is was, she gets with kimmy barking she gets yeah. herself worked up on it. -she's frightened of, sort of, opening the door thinking that the dog might get at her +she's frightened of, sort of, opening the door thinking that the dog might get at her get her. i mean, if she'd have just shouted! -i said well the dog knows mike, and +i said well the dog knows mike, and yeah. and mike's used to the dog, she wouldn't bother. oh no! @@ -84149,7 +84084,7 @@ quick, yes. so, yes she's alright now. but if good! -if erm, you knock you know, you know my mum's still here +if erm, you knock you know, you know my mum's still here yes. so if i'm going out, i'll leave the money under here anyway. okay love? @@ -84166,25 +84101,25 @@ i said how you feeling? she said, i'd like to see a . he said after she'd . yes, it's a shame! -she's got two she's got daughters and +she's got two she's got daughters and can you post that for me please? yes. -and she but er i think one lives in hull. +and she but er i think one lives in hull. near hull,cos i said , i said where are you going? oh she said,i don't she said ! we'll have to see. she's had her teeth . -i think that house of joe 's is up for sale isn't it? -it's all which house did he, cos there's two there isn't there, gordon? +i think that house of joe 's is up for sale isn't it? +it's all which house did he, cos there's two there isn't there, gordon? you know joe, who i mean? oh,fo him, down the ponderosa down the ponderosa ? joe, who you used to go and see. oh! -joe and +joe and yeah. yes! was it the one that side or this side? -the the bungalow this side. +the the bungalow this side. you're going down the road yes. there's two bungalows, or three bungalows isn't there? @@ -84208,21 +84143,21 @@ yeah. oh course, she died didn't she? yeah. yeah. -i, i had +i, i had but i thought she had a son living with her? i think there was two sons weren't there? -and one son -well i'm sure if you ever +and one son +well i'm sure if you ever yeah. you go past yeah. down there, you have a look. -yes +yes one of well i them's like i like -as though it's all been emptied and, and erm i don't know! +as though it's all been emptied and, and erm i don't know! yes! well i imagine right. @@ -84239,13 +84174,13 @@ no! my eyes off the road. when did i,? oh! -i was gonna get this when it's chilly. +i was gonna get this when it's chilly. what, when they've all passed there? that's right! -and i go back door here. +and i go back door here. yeah. yeah. -at like, like you're it's, you come into a bend and you've got to watch it and i er just had a quick glance at it like, isn't it, you know? +at like, like you're it's, you come into a bend and you've got to watch it and i er just had a quick glance at it like, isn't it, you know? it's the second one. yeah. and it looks as though it was all whitewashed and . @@ -84267,7 +84202,7 @@ aha. and he came back home. oh yeah. but as for the others, i don't know. -well last last year she came to the erm the social, we have it in november, a big social event er you know? +well last last year she came to the erm the social, we have it in november, a big social event er you know? well they all haven't got a soft mum and dad like you. mum? seven and eighth on there. @@ -84286,7 +84221,7 @@ i've still got the runs by the way. i've still got the runs by the way. i might not be here next week. i've got to go and see the doctors i think. -do you want to take a are you still taking malaria? +do you want to take a are you still taking malaria? yeah. no, it was erm aye. @@ -84314,11 +84249,11 @@ your nan's missing some chocolate eclairs. missing some chocolate eclairs? oh dear, i wonder where they've gone. hang on i'll have a look in the safe. -hark do i do i hear the pools man coming round? +hark do i do i hear the pools man coming round? mm nice. not steak again. steak seven times a week, well. -you're gonna mess with that and it'll be crackling all over did you know? +you're gonna mess with that and it'll be crackling all over did you know? and has me mum been? no. well where was she this morning when i was phoning? @@ -84336,7 +84271,7 @@ every time i come in this sink it's full of pots. isn't it awful. my god isn't it terrible. and i'm sick of having steak every night mother. -you're dreaming again +you're dreaming again can't we have porridge for a change? who's she on the phone to now? she's not on the phone, she's talking to me mum. @@ -84346,7 +84281,7 @@ and that's all you're getting. is there onions in that gravy? no. we did have some but it went. -alison must have i don't know why alison puts water in these cos you don't need it. +alison must have i don't know why alison puts water in these cos you don't need it. cos there's water in the frost. hang on kim. chucked a big piece of salmon away, herbert didn't want it. @@ -84356,19 +84291,19 @@ i did two steaks and he only wanted one. well i don't know whether you like salmon or not. do you? mm. -the food your daughter gives me anything'll do . +the food your daughter gives me anything'll do . all i've had today was a pastie, i thought i'd fast a bit. this fasting makes you hungry. doesn't it kim? -damn again. +damn again. take something for it. here you are mate. very nice that, very nice. eh? me stomach starts to churn. -everything i eat my stomach starts churning. -why does it record on that way and yet it's running that way? -because you're probably doubling doubling up on the recording. +everything i eat my stomach starts churning. +why does it record on that way and yet it's running that way? +because you're probably doubling doubling up on the recording. what do you mean? will you stop it! are you ready my little @@ -84392,10 +84327,10 @@ that's what they damn want isn't it? does it want some new batteries in? it's flickering. yeah. -alright evening mother, evening father, how are we? +alright evening mother, evening father, how are we? you alright? ready to go? -go and see sally visiting picture looks nice +go and see sally visiting picture looks nice eh? the picture looks nice eh? @@ -84404,7 +84339,7 @@ it stinks of er eh? it stinks in here, what you've been varnishing? where just walking at the moment at cottage hospital now. -evening i'm the good looking one +evening i'm the good looking one hello how are you? yeah, hi you @@ -84420,7 +84355,7 @@ you're looking well, have you been ill? eh? you're looking well, have you been ill? who's is this here? -no you're alright, don't worry, it's alright there, don't worry do you want it moving? +no you're alright, don't worry, it's alright there, don't worry do you want it moving? want it put it down over here yeah i put it, i'll put it there and if you want, if you want it back @@ -84489,7 +84424,7 @@ probably economise you'd be no good working for standing there waiting for you'd be out -as a fact your hair at the back, don't tell anybody you're a hairdresser for god's sake. +as a fact your hair at the back, don't tell anybody you're a hairdresser for god's sake. pardon? where's kim? over at dave's, dave's at er, we're talking about the er, @@ -84498,7 +84433,7 @@ i said well it gives them a bit of panache don't it? well, oh probably, here we go, got one on ain't take no -by the time you get up the road and get back why people really +by the time you get up the road and get back why people really along here i don't know i don't know , i don't know you don't have @@ -84586,7 +84521,7 @@ i've got to get out as soon as i get, i've, i've promised at night i'd have, i'l that's right, yes i didn't want to, but no, well if you get someone trustworthy -well i, i, i, i've see mrs i've had her for so many, many years +well i, i, i, i've see mrs i've had her for so many, many years oh well but you see, i thought, i've got to get somebody strange now, for, for, for night time oh @@ -84627,7 +84562,7 @@ are you warm enough? i'm warm enough, yeah right patience -that's it i think +that's it i think when are you going to do the bucket work sally? there's all that bucket work waiting to be done, eh, the bucket work i, huh, @@ -84726,7 +84661,7 @@ seventy shillings, oh that'll do. no it won't think about it yeah, i know i did. -well it's not bad for seventy shillings see that +well it's not bad for seventy shillings see that go on, come on, it's one pound two pound, i beg your pardon @@ -84781,13 +84716,13 @@ gotta get done yeah i'm arguing with them, when i'm i give it a break for a couple of, well about three sundays now -tell her i'm sorry, tell her i need my babe i'm a tell her, we've, we've +tell her i'm sorry, tell her i need my babe i'm a tell her, we've, we've i mean, a couple of them i like i remember a go, a go with some of them that i thought i could do, but realised i can't do, do you know what i mean? i, i, i was, about, what i, i do, i bought an elvis presley one er a tom jones one, that drinks one, you know, that i like, it's, it's well i like singing it, what i mean, i think what it is i'm looking for the old, i'm not being funny, i'm looking for the old voice i don't like me voice, i'm not liking it at all and i think that's what putting me off on taping it and listening to myself after, i don't, i like, i like to -i shouldn't do it, i'm not gonna do it any more, i'm not gonna tape me own voice and listen to it i just +i shouldn't do it, i'm not gonna do it any more, i'm not gonna tape me own voice and listen to it i just not listening to me own voice left a good job in the city, working for a man yeah, quite smooth actually @@ -84802,11 +84737,11 @@ well the phrase at the end, i'm just about get , but, yeah get the phrase in the end, it's, what we've done is, at the end they go, they do a rolling, rolling down the river, rolling, rolling, down the river, rolling, rolling down the river -and they, no, and they dropped rolling, rolling see what i mean? +and they, no, and they dropped rolling, rolling see what i mean? oh yeah one, two and when you think, you think you want another one? -ooh i've got one another, it goes rolling on the river right +ooh i've got one another, it goes rolling on the river right yeah yeah no @@ -84831,45 +84766,44 @@ i like do the tom and, i won't, tom and jerry, i might do the tom jones one, cos which i don't you don't have to be beautiful awfully sorry love, have to er dash off a bit - erm john and jonathan sit down but when i i want you to read your essay about your home. -simon i want you to read about your home as well +simon i want you to read about your home as well and as martin is still giving out i think i'll have you christopher please to read yours about monster, so i'll have the two monster ones first and then the two home ones. right, just sit down for a minute and let's, michael read his first. the monster from the marsh. -i saw the monster arrive from the marsh he looked at the when i saw him i ran +i saw the monster arrive from the marsh he looked at the when i saw him i ran the monster from the marsh. when i was walking past the marsh one, one night, when i was on my way back from school i heard a rus rustling noise behind a bu bush, when i went up the, went up first to the bush a big dragon-like thing jumped out from behind the bush, it gave me such a fright i nearly fainted. -i started to run up, straight up the hill, erm lucky the monster was running straight at me and sticking out of the crowd and he tripped over and after the end +i started to run up, straight up the hill, erm lucky the monster was running straight at me and sticking out of the crowd and he tripped over and after the end my home. -my home is near the trees and i live there in, in my house there is +my home is near the trees and i live there in, in my house there is i have lots of places in my -and i have one one pigeon and a dog. +and i have one one pigeon and a dog. my home is made of wood, and the roof is made of tin and the colour of it is grey. it has two doors, one, four windows, i, i don't have the garden or, oh, in my house there are six rooms and one of them is er, one, one of them is my, is my room and a picture and a -my my, and +my my, and room and er my home. -i live in a tree so does my mum tree house, my mum and my dad and my brother and my dog and dad live there. +i live in a tree so does my mum tree house, my mum and my dad and my brother and my dog and dad live there. our house is made of wood and is dark green. -we have four windows and four doors, we have got a there is a big hill in front of it and it is good, but if it, if the tree house because we find the, the trees and then and then we were, we play in the tree house sometimes with the dog. -inside our home we have a lot of furniture, we have four rooms, one in the bathroom, one in the bedroom and one in the lounge and one in the kitchen +we have four windows and four doors, we have got a there is a big hill in front of it and it is good, but if it, if the tree house because we find the, the trees and then and then we were, we play in the tree house sometimes with the dog. +inside our home we have a lot of furniture, we have four rooms, one in the bathroom, one in the bedroom and one in the lounge and one in the kitchen right then. -i like erm, christopher and simon +i like erm, christopher and simon yes i know, take your books and show right, erm, jonathan here -right john has written a story about his home right it's a good descriptive story on how people live +right john has written a story about his home right it's a good descriptive story on how people live until one day they couldn't think of any way that you could may improve it. my home. i live in a tree house, my mum and my dad and my brother and my dog and my sister. our house is made of wood and is dark green, we have a four windows and four doors. it has got wooden roof. -there is a big hill in front of it and it is good but erm because we climb the, the tree and climb it and we play in the tree house today with the dog. -inside our home we have a lot of furniture we have four rooms and one in the bathroom, one in the bedroom and one in and one in the lounge and one in the kitchen here +there is a big hill in front of it and it is good but erm because we climb the, the tree and climb it and we play in the tree house today with the dog. +inside our home we have a lot of furniture we have four rooms and one in the bathroom, one in the bedroom and one in and one in the lounge and one in the kitchen here okay, right so if we cut out the one they might @@ -84885,7 +84819,7 @@ and then it might flow a bit more evenly, might it then, right michael bring you just a minute john, right michael i want you to read yours through once more for me please. do it about the monster monster from the marsh. -when i saw the monster from the marsh, one night, i was, i was, i was frightened, i, i, i, i was he looked liked a when i saw him i ran back to camp and i felt frightened, i hid under my sleeping bag the end +when i saw the monster from the marsh, one night, i was, i was, i was frightened, i, i, i, i was he looked liked a when i saw him i ran back to camp and i felt frightened, i hid under my sleeping bag the end right, see michael was describing that how he felt yeah how did feel then? @@ -84911,7 +84845,7 @@ yeah right, the people who have not read an essay out yet, i want you to sit, just a minute michael, next to somebody and i want you to read your essay to them and see what they think about it and how you could maybe improve it and i want michael and john to go and show steve your books as well now please, right boys do that now then, yes, could you take yours to show please do we have to show both? -not sure it's still working. +not sure it's still working. it's still working the thingy is it recording us? @@ -84924,7 +84858,6 @@ and that isn't essay, either work your book or, and get it er, yes, well it has to be up and when you've finished it you can then do a picture about your - right erm, can i start by asking you, can you tell me your full name please? mary . and can you tell me your date of birth. @@ -84939,7 +84872,7 @@ yes. and er father came as a sexton from from horley with a parson you see. and so yes. -mother was a er a the cook in the rectory so they got together you see, that's how they got . +mother was a er a the cook in the rectory so they got together you see, that's how they got . oh i see. why was it your father came came to llaneilian? from suffolk. @@ -84950,7 +84883,7 @@ oh i see. yes. yes. erm was his father in the church as well? -oh no i don't know where father i don't know where his father was no . +oh no i don't know where father i don't know where his father was no . no. do you know much about your mother's parents? oh my mother my mother was brought up with her grandmother in llaneilian. @@ -84958,7 +84891,7 @@ oh i see. yes. yes. my father came from horley, suffolk with a parson you see. -to llaneilian to got to get it they got they got together and they got married and they had ten children. +to llaneilian to got to get it they got they got together and they got married and they had ten children. i in in in in the same place. mother was brought up with her grandmother. i see. @@ -85003,7 +84936,7 @@ yes. mm. of a church. i see. -and er i he used he used he u used to take lunch he wouldn't he wouldn't take tea dinner he used to have like to have tea in a bottle. +and er i he used he used he u used to take lunch he wouldn't he wouldn't take tea dinner he used to have like to have tea in a bottle. oh did he. and er cold? @@ -85014,7 +84947,7 @@ yes. mm. and er he er he used i used mother used to send me with the tea to the to the church to the churchyard to father. oh i see. -and i put father all the time and i couldn't find him. +and i put father all the time and i couldn't find him. there he was in the bottom of a grave. oh yes. did you yourself go to school in llaneilian? @@ -85083,7 +85016,7 @@ and er w he used to work between er you know, do do do odd jobs, mm. between like ten yes. -and er he he used to ring the bell and he used to clean he had to clean the church and all the rest of it you know. +and er he he used to ring the bell and he used to clean he had to clean the church and all the rest of it you know. yes . oh yes. yes. @@ -85116,11 +85049,11 @@ to an old lady. and er she had to pluck them and everything, clean them ready to put in the oven you know. mm. i remember. -and we had to run to take these chickens +and we had to run to take these chickens oh i see. why was that? where would where would the chickens come from? -oh mother used to go and from different farms you know. +oh mother used to go and from different farms you know. oh i see. and she used to clean them kill them and clean them and mm. @@ -85130,7 +85063,7 @@ oh yes yes yes . i see. erm what kind of food would you eat? in those days? -oh th we used to have a i don't know whether you used to eat it we used to have a erm er turnips and p and er and er made a have a basin full of buttermilk and and potatoes mixed together you know. +oh th we used to have a i don't know whether you used to eat it we used to have a erm er turnips and p and er and er made a have a basin full of buttermilk and and potatoes mixed together you know. oh yes. they were very good you know. yes. @@ -85143,7 +85076,7 @@ mm. we had three cows. and mother used to you had three cows? -milk them and make erm make the buttermilk and we used to have buttermilk and potatoes in a basin mixed up and +milk them and make erm make the buttermilk and we used to have buttermilk and potatoes in a basin mixed up and oh i see. pepper and salt in them. yes. @@ -85161,12 +85094,12 @@ the bell-ringer's house. er? it was the bell-ringer's house then ? yeah. -and er he used to be he he mother used to make make some tea for him and warm tea in a bottle in a glass bottle you know. +and er he used to be he he mother used to make make some tea for him and warm tea in a bottle in a glass bottle you know. and he he didn't li he didn't like milk, he liked mhm. and so i was the one that used to take this lunch to father . mm. -and er i went to look for him once and i couldn't f couldn't find him anywhere. +and er i went to look for him once and i couldn't f couldn't find him anywhere. and i shouted, father, father. no sign of him. and there he was, i went to look and i saw at the end there, a big pile of erm earth fresh earth you know. @@ -85212,7 +85145,7 @@ so if it was just two rooms you had, yes. erm were they both used for sleeping in at night? oh yes. -and then one would be used erm as in the daytime as a sitting room or +and then one would be used erm as in the daytime as a sitting room or oh no we'd no sitting room. no. what were they u what did you do in the daytime then? @@ -85220,7 +85153,7 @@ oh we used to er we used we used to at sc we used to be at school until we were mm. and then we er we left school and then we went to work for to w we went to look for work. i see. -erm what how did you used to spend your time when you were at school but in your spare time. +erm what how did you used to spend your time when you were at school but in your spare time. oh. when you weren't at school. w oh we used to we used to go out gather firewood and we used to @@ -85263,8 +85196,8 @@ oh yes, quite happy. mm. yes. we how would your would your mother be busy all the time? -oh yes mother was very busy. -she used to with the with these confinement cases you know. +oh yes mother was very busy. +she used to with the with these confinement cases you know. with the with the mothers who used to have er used to have babies you know. mm. and mother used to attend to them with a doctor like you know. @@ -85293,7 +85226,7 @@ was erm would she get paid for that? oh yes. yes? yes. -so just just occasionally would that +so just just occasionally would that yes that's right, yes yes. mm. erm how did she know how to do that? @@ -85345,7 +85278,7 @@ er finished to dig the graves. i see. yeah. yes. -so erm w if had he been doing digging graves when he was in suffolk? +so erm w if had he been doing digging graves when he was in suffolk? pardon? had he been doing the same job when he was in suffolk ? oh no. @@ -85363,8 +85296,8 @@ oh i don't know, i couldn't tell you. no . or don't you know? mm. -erm -he ca he came with the he came with excuse me he he came with a rector +erm +he ca he came with the he came with excuse me he he came with a rector mm. from suffolk. and he ca he got a job in the old church llaneilian church to do this job the gal grave digging you know. @@ -85391,10 +85324,10 @@ oh he was very young was he? he came with with a rector to llaneilian church. mm. -and after after he came and settled, my three brothers went and dig dig the graves in the old llaneilian church you know . +and after after he came and settled, my three brothers went and dig dig the graves in the old llaneilian church you know . yes. -and when they were when they were out of er of er anybody to dig the graves they used to send for father. -father used to and do the grave. +and when they were when they were out of er of er anybody to dig the graves they used to send for father. +father used to and do the grave. mm. yeah. did he ring the bells in other churches? @@ -85406,7 +85339,7 @@ yes. yes. and funerals. would he be the only person ringing the bells? -oh no there was a there was another man but he was a but queer like you know he was alright but he used to ring the bell and did you hear the bell ringing on sunday? +oh no there was a there was another man but he was a but queer like you know he was alright but he used to ring the bell and did you hear the bell ringing on sunday? and so i said, yes. and it was him that was ringing the bell you know. yes. @@ -85435,19 +85368,19 @@ it would take him a long time then wouldn't it? oh yes. they didn't he didn't drink he didn't he didn't dig the graves all a in one in one in one day like you know. no. -he used to for different days for grave digging +he used to for different days for grave digging oh yeah. there. mm. yes. why how did your brothers manage to do the same job as he did? -well i i suppose they were they were going around with him you know in the +well i i suppose they were they were going around with him you know in the to do the grave and then they got . they used to b to do brickwork in the grave. you know. to oh. -to to with bricks. +to to with bricks. oh i see. mm. was that just sometimes he'd do that? @@ -85462,18 +85395,18 @@ oh i suppose they were they used to make them with with with with soil in those with soil? some soil yes and cement you know. ah. -cement them together and then leave them to dry and them er left them to dry until the till they they get dried you see. +cement them together and then leave them to dry and them er left them to dry until the till they they get dried you see. yeah. so h would he do that as well or would he'd do that. oh yes. yes yes yes. oh i see. -i don't what mother used to mother used to take s chickens. +i don't what mother used to mother used to take s chickens. she used to take dressed chickens six every tuesday. every tuesday ? -to to a place. +to to a place. we used to call it. -and she used to dress them and they was ready to put in the oven and with these chickens . +and she used to dress them and they was ready to put in the oven and with these chickens . so you'd have to deliver them? pardon? to deliver them. @@ -85482,7 +85415,7 @@ oh yes, i was at home yes. what was that every tuesday? well er well she used two tuesday and thursday and saturday. she used two the the this lady that took had the chickens and ready to put in the oven there. -and we used to her home in the wintertime +and we used to her home in the wintertime yes. so she she did that and she did she was a midwife sometimes as well. oh yes. @@ -85497,7 +85430,7 @@ did you ever have new clothes, when you were young? oh not very few. mm. erm what about birthdays, did you have anything special on birthdays ? -oh i tell you what we used to have a dresser like this in front of of of a of a h of a of a at home and er mother used to make a a jelly and she used to put it underneath the dresser and put a plate on on top of it in case the mice would get it. +oh i tell you what we used to have a dresser like this in front of of of a of a h of a of a at home and er mother used to make a a jelly and she used to put it underneath the dresser and put a plate on on top of it in case the mice would get it. i see. yes. mm. @@ -85511,13 +85444,13 @@ mhm. i remember the once we used to e he used to catch er blackbirds. catch them? he used to catch blackbirds. -he used to put a in front in the front and put the and put some string in the and put plums in it. +he used to put a in front in the front and put the and put some string in the and put plums in it. and yeah. when when the when the blackbird would go in, he'd pull the string. oh i see. and and caught them. -and he he used to cook them and do you know we we used to pluck them and we used to roast them by the fire in a +and he he used to cook them and do you know we we used to pluck them and we used to roast them by the fire in a did you? yes. what did it taste like? @@ -85537,12 +85470,12 @@ oh yeah. no not many, only father did. but er not many people would would er do that you know. mhm. -we had a little garden in the front and we used to put er a in in in the in in on the soil and we used to put some crumbs on on a on a plate you know. +we had a little garden in the front and we used to put er a in in in the in in on the soil and we used to put some crumbs on on a on a plate you know. mm. and then the birds would go and pick the the the yes. the crumbs there. -so when they they we used to pull the pull the pull the pull the bread the the line +so when they they we used to pull the pull the pull the pull the bread the the line mm. and c and caught them. and do you know we used to pluck them and we used to fry em er fr and fry them in front of the fire. @@ -85551,11 +85484,11 @@ yes. yes. and how many birds would you catch to eat a meal? oh . -we we used to have lots, they used to go my father used to put er a a bird a bird trap er bird second time to catch and we used to pluck them and and them and roast by the fire you know . +we we used to have lots, they used to go my father used to put er a a bird a bird trap er bird second time to catch and we used to pluck them and and them and roast by the fire you know . yes. so erm would you have that often? would you eat blackbirds often? -well it just depended it was snowy. +well it just depended it was snowy. yes. yeah. because erm was that when there was other food was short? @@ -85572,7 +85505,7 @@ yes. oh i was afra to catch them with. i was afraid of the ferrets. -we had to hold them and father put them +we had to hold them and father put them h where would he keep his ferrets? oh, in a box. in a box? @@ -85580,7 +85513,7 @@ yes. in the house? no, in the shed. yes and how many did he have? -oh just depends er sometimes he'd they they brought them little you see so they were father would separate the the big ones from the little ones and +oh just depends er sometimes he'd they they brought them little you see so they were father would separate the the big ones from the little ones and mm. yes. dear me. @@ -85615,14 +85548,14 @@ did he poach to get the yes. pheasants? yes. -th they used he used to er hunting with the with the with the with the with the with the with the people that used to go hunting. +th they used he used to er hunting with the with the with the with the with the with the with the people that used to go hunting. with the people you know. oh right. from the mansion. and and er father used to go er a beater with a big stick to beat the he yeah. -and do you know father used to now where they used to and he used to go and caught a lot of them . -and them. +and do you know father used to now where they used to and he used to go and caught a lot of them . +and them. in the place where they used to be. mm. yeah. @@ -85645,7 +85578,7 @@ no i don't i don't remember no. no . you don't remember? no. -erm did he go fishing much your father? +erm did he go fishing much your father? no father never went fishing. never. no. @@ -85661,14 +85594,14 @@ rabbits. mm. yes and fish. mm. -and er birds we used to we used to we used to father used to caught pheasants occasionally. +and er birds we used to we used to we used to father used to caught pheasants occasionally. mm. would you ever have erm any other meat? would you have lamb or beef ever? oh yes we used to have it yes. yes. just was that often? or just a a few times. -on no well we only used to have a nearly every week you know. +on no well we only used to have a nearly every week you know. mm. and what vegetables would you have in the garden. oh we we we we used to have er suede and er carrots. @@ -85677,9 +85610,9 @@ and er turnips. father used to he was a great gardener. he used to put everything in the garden. and i tell you what he used to do. -he we used he used to put a in the little front garden like you know. +he we used he used to put a in the little front garden like you know. mm. -and what he used to do in this , he had a string in the and er he could the string put some some er crumbs in the in the er in a and the birds go in and he used to he used to catch them and we used to kill them and pluck them you know. +and what he used to do in this , he had a string in the and er he could the string put some some er crumbs in the in the er in a and the birds go in and he used to he used to catch them and we used to kill them and pluck them you know. oh . which birds were they? blackbirds. @@ -85718,18 +85651,18 @@ oh i went to service did you? yes. where did you go into service? -oh i went to to a place and er there was a staff of maids there you know. +oh i went to to a place and er there was a staff of maids there you know. mm. where was that one? where was it? what was it called? -oh +oh yes. what was the name of the house? . mm. and and er so i -so i er we used to catch these blackbirds and them in a and pull the string and they used er try and catch them and we used to we used to kill them and and pluck them +so i er we used to catch these blackbirds and them in a and pull the string and they used er try and catch them and we used to we used to kill them and and pluck them roast them. and roast them. what did you do in @@ -85740,7 +85673,7 @@ quite yes? well. what happened, what was it like? -well er i went when i was when i went first went and do you know i went into the to the place and do you know i run away from the place. +well er i went when i was when i went first went and do you know i went into the to the place and do you know i run away from the place. i went to. was that on your first day? yes. @@ -85774,7 +85707,7 @@ yeah. yes. yes. what was it like when you were when you were young starting work at that age? -well i used i used to be in the kitchen you know. +well i used i used to be in the kitchen you know. mm. and they used to catch pheasants and er i had to clean i had to pluck these pheasants and er birds and get them ready and ready for them to put in the oven. yes. @@ -85791,7 +85724,7 @@ and i used to kill er c er clean them. mm. and i used to get them ready for them to put in the oven or fry it. and i sometimes i used to fry them first. -and in the oven and er put some in the oven and put some gravy on and they were lovely now. +and in the oven and er put some in the oven and put some gravy on and they were lovely now. were they? yeah. erm would you have to do a lot of cleaning work as well in the kitchens? @@ -85810,9 +85743,9 @@ vegetables and you know yes. and birds. how many people worked in the kitchen? -oh there were there were there were cook and cook waitress and cook general and waitress oh i don't know how many they were. +oh there were there were there were cook and cook waitress and cook general and waitress oh i don't know how many they were. were there a lot of other servants as well? -oh yes in the in the big rooms +oh yes in the in the big rooms you know. we were in the back place you see. yes. @@ -85842,7 +85775,7 @@ did you used to see erm the master of the house ever? oh yes very very often see him. mm. he was a nice gentleman. -top hat. +top hat. mm. and a walking stick. yes. @@ -85867,9 +85800,9 @@ do you remember what kind they were? oh they were beautiful things. er satin blue and satin green you know. mm -and er and and the hats with with the bow with a bow on it . +and er and and the hats with with the bow with a bow on it . were you did you wish you had clothes like that when you were young? -oh aye you know. +oh aye you know. did you? yes. did you used to have to wear a uniform? @@ -85878,8 +85811,8 @@ you did? what was it like? oh very nice. i used to i used to er wear print and white apron in the in the morning. -and in the afternoon i used to wear erm a blue and er and er blue oh i forgot. -and a big bow +and in the afternoon i used to wear erm a blue and er and er blue oh i forgot. +and a big bow mm. would you serve food as well at the table? oh yes. @@ -85891,7 +85824,7 @@ did they often have big parties? oh yes, they had parties galore. did they? yes. -erm would they have lots of important people coming to dinner +erm would they have lots of important people coming to dinner oh yes. mm. yes. @@ -85918,16 +85851,16 @@ erm they were they were people in those days too you know. good people you know. mm. -i remember the one one of the ladies, er she was dressed in erm in green and she had a big bow . -big you know. +i remember the one one of the ladies, er she was dressed in erm in green and she had a big bow . +big you know. mm. -and a big hat and she had a big bow she looked you know . +and a big hat and she had a big bow she looked you know . yes. can you tell me about erm a typical days work that you would have to do. can you remember what you'd have to do? oh w when i first went to to place i i had to er i had to clean er clean i had to i was like a scullery maid. -and i used to clean birds, poultry you know pheasants and things like that. -and i used to and ready to put in the oven. +and i used to clean birds, poultry you know pheasants and things like that. +and i used to and ready to put in the oven. dressed up and i used to take them and i used to leave them in the kitchen and the the head kitchen maid er the head kitchen maid w went and took them in. mm. ready to put in the oven see. @@ -85938,7 +85871,7 @@ that's a hard one. was it very early? oh yes. yes. -we used to get up seven o'clock in the morning you know. +we used to get up seven o'clock in the morning you know. mm. would you as all the servants would you eat together yourselves? oh yes. @@ -85948,7 +85881,7 @@ yes in the kitchen yes. mm. and would you eat leftovers from from the from the mai the master's food? or would you have erm a s a different meal altogether? -oh no we had we had fresh meals for for ourselves and they had different meals for the for the gentlemen as well you know . +oh no we had we had fresh meals for for ourselves and they had different meals for the for the gentlemen as well you know . yeah. yes. we could see it all set in the in the kitchen ready to put in the oven you know. @@ -85983,8 +85916,8 @@ no. did you look forward to going home sometimes? oh yes. yes. -i i i i went to to a place first and er i and i i went home you know, without them knowing. -mother took me back by the hair +i i i i went to to a place first and er i and i i went home you know, without them knowing. +mother took me back by the hair mhm. by my hair. did did they know you'd gone home? @@ -86021,9 +85954,9 @@ but our department hasn't changed, the women are just doing the same job as they mhm. years ago. and probably in the picking as well. -in the winding it's just their lot hasn't changed a great deal. +in the winding it's just their lot hasn't changed a great deal. mhm, mhm. -except i would say the winders are worse off cos they're doing three shifts . +except i would say the winders are worse off cos they're doing three shifts . right, mhm. and i just couldn't hack that i don't think. aha. @@ -86048,21 +85981,21 @@ i said, i'd like a really good pair of trainers. and i'm no good at tying laces so she got me a pair of adidas you know with the velcro, aha. she said, why can't you be a normal mother and just want chocolates or perfume? -i said, well that's not much good when you're hanging from the end of a rope . +i said, well that's not much good when you're hanging from the end of a rope . and who do you go with? i go with my husband. your husband? mhm. and whereabouts do you go, just -oh glencoe, skye, aran, you know just +oh glencoe, skye, aran, you know just mhm. up there. do you, do you stay up there, do you have mhm. a caravan. -no, a tent, or we've got an estate car if it's just a weekend jaunt, and it's maybe wet, we just sleep in the back of the car +no, a tent, or we've got an estate car if it's just a weekend jaunt, and it's maybe wet, we just sleep in the back of the car aha. -so complete change from this place anyway, +so complete change from this place anyway, aha, and you meets up with so many wonderful people. aha, aha. it gives you something else to talk about. @@ -86079,7 +86012,7 @@ how about ah but as i say my daughter thinks i'm mad. how about nicknames? you have a lot of nicknames in the factory? -er well er the just these two people that retired there, er they used to come this man in a car from , that was their lift to their work. +er well er the just these two people that retired there, er they used to come this man in a car from , that was their lift to their work. and it was the days of the c b mhm. and he had this handle,a and er they were saying, we'll need to get ourself a handle, @@ -86091,7 +86024,7 @@ aha. so that, that's a bit of it in there. aha. so you just basically, you all -a and, and +a and, and know each other by your ordinary names? mhm. you don't shout nicknames @@ -86106,7 +86039,7 @@ i don't know. you'd like to tell us? cos we're novices at this. och aye. -i mean er does it bother you at all that well i mean are most of the men managers? +i mean er does it bother you at all that well i mean are most of the men managers? managers men? er the management where's the opportunities for like female apprentices and things like that? @@ -86119,7 +86052,7 @@ mhm. and the way the management work in here,i can say is they,aim they're promoting anybody to a chargehand they usually promote somebody that's actually no threat to themselves. there's a kind of yes man, that, that's the way the carpet industry works in general. mhm. -they don't promote somebody that's gonna shimmy past them up the corporate ladder although you couldn't +they don't promote somebody that's gonna shimmy past them up the corporate ladder although you couldn't say this place is a, a giant corporation . mhm. @@ -86129,7 +86062,7 @@ aha. have bu be a better grounding. aha. yes. -but i saw that in the glazier and when i worked in there, they would bring people in. +but i saw that in the glazier and when i worked in there, they would bring people in. mhm. oh m @@ -86150,7 +86083,7 @@ mhm, what's the pay like compared to other factories in the area? it's quite low. is it? mhm. -because er how many years ago is it? +because er how many years ago is it? seven or eight years ago we, we, we're on piecework, we made our own wage. er and most of us had in excess of a hundred pound, maybe a hundred and six, a hundred and ten pound, but when this guy bought place over, there was a kind of flat rate, and we'd to drop sixteen pounds to ninety mm. @@ -86162,7 +86095,7 @@ mhm. so you jumped at the chance, but it is, i think th th poverty wage in europe is it not, not about a hundred and forty, a hundred and forty five pounds? well we're nowhere near that, nowhere near that. mm, that's right, mm. -that's why when i hear my daughter talking about getting fifteen or twenty k a year i'm going it would pay me two or three years for god's sake. +that's why when i hear my daughter talking about getting fifteen or twenty k a year i'm going it would pay me two or three years for god's sake. you can look after me then. but saying that if you want a decent wage in here you have to work a lot of overtime. yes. @@ -86183,112 +86116,111 @@ do you think it's sort of, you know, do you hold a lot of views in common with p not, no, not really. not really. we've got quite a mixture. - oh, has it gone round a bit? yeah, it's gone round a bit now. yeah. -well we had oh i'm trying to think what we had today oh got out of assembly because i had to go and speak to this maths teacher who's dead boring! -mr but like i pretended i had to go and see him not because i had to go and see him just because i didn't wanna go to assembly really! +well we had oh i'm trying to think what we had today oh got out of assembly because i had to go and speak to this maths teacher who's dead boring! +mr but like i pretended i had to go and see him not because i had to go and see him just because i didn't wanna go to assembly really! oh! cos i'm like that! -we haven't, we haven't got assembly at the moment cos like you know that erm musical ? +we haven't, we haven't got assembly at the moment cos like you know that erm musical ? oh yeah. -it's all, all that but ooh, that's a groovy stage ! +it's all, all that but ooh, that's a groovy stage ! oh what! -oh yeah -left over left over at and stuff which +oh yeah +left over left over at and stuff which oh yes -oh we've made these telephones ! +oh we've made these telephones ! and well look well we know that now ! yeah but it's just -ah gee have a look if shaun and joanna are back, oh yeah they are. +ah gee have a look if shaun and joanna are back, oh yeah they are. i said i'd go down there but the, like the car wasn't there so i didn't go back. oh dear ! i didn't, i didn't know joe was out actually. yes. isn't scott down there? -no, he's gone to a play at the college and a yeah i was er like when i realised that had come on i thought does he know? +no, he's gone to a play at the college and a yeah i was er like when i realised that had come on i thought does he know? just don't say anything ! -and thought that they were picking his nose ! +and thought that they were picking his nose ! maybe he's not in ! i thought, oh never mind ! put the phone down again. and then i thought, well you can always and like say, can you tell scott! -and i will +and i will can you tell i've come on so i'm not pregnant! alright? -and i thought like his mum might not find that really amusing or anything +and i thought like his mum might not find that really amusing or anything yeah. -so and i thought i could just leave him sort of like a message that was subtle enough -so he'd know, like erm +so and i thought i could just leave him sort of like a message that was subtle enough +so he'd know, like erm tell him he's not a daddy! yes ! -ring , could you tell scott that er that erm oh god, i don't know! +ring , could you tell scott that er that erm oh god, i don't know! actually i was thinking of some really good, funny things i could say earlier i can't think of any now! -things like erm oh yeah, could yo could you tell scott that er, he doesn't have to go to church and pray any more, something like that ! +things like erm oh yeah, could yo could you tell scott that er, he doesn't have to go to church and pray any more, something like that ! tell him he doesn't have to go to confession with helena! that's right ! oh gee! -he doesn't have to book me an appointment at the clinic ! +he doesn't have to book me an appointment at the clinic ! ooh i wonder what that could be about ? -er, like this morning at break i walked, i walked straight past peter right and er come up to me and he goes that's not very nice is it? +er, like this morning at break i walked, i walked straight past peter right and er come up to me and he goes that's not very nice is it? i thought what ! -he just walked straight past me, oh well i'm so sorry and he goes what's wrong with you anyway lately? +he just walked straight past me, oh well i'm so sorry and he goes what's wrong with you anyway lately? nothing! nothing wrong with me ! nothing at all! it's ! oh pete can i talk to you about something ? -oh shrimpy made me laugh me about it cracks me up like ! +oh shrimpy made me laugh me about it cracks me up like ! ah, look at the, look, just look at this letter he wrote me! -ah pete , yeah he was saying +ah pete , yeah he was saying i i -joe was saying how how he was really embarrassed cos he showed your mum or something! +joe was saying how how he was really embarrassed cos he showed your mum or something! my mum goes what letter's that? i goes oh it , you read it. -like like all the way to it i was thinking -helena, i don't really know how to put this but i i'll have a go. +like like all the way to it i was thinking +helena, i don't really know how to put this but i i'll have a go. i thought he said i've got to go! i was gonna say bye ! that's a long letter then! i'm sorry about being in a mood saturday but i wasn't really in a mood with you. -i know i told you that i was but i was feeling sorry for someone, not emma or anyone like that. +i know i told you that i was but i was feeling sorry for someone, not emma or anyone like that. oh dear ! -i care for emma more than i can say, but i also care for you and i'm really sorry if you were hurt. +i care for emma more than i can say, but i also care for you and i'm really sorry if you were hurt. excuse me! excuse me! excuse me! wuargh! -oh . -i had to in that! -at the moment everyone has been talking about other people behind people's backs yeah shrimp, you got good english! +oh . +i had to in that! +at the moment everyone has been talking about other people behind people's backs yeah shrimp, you got good english! i didn't tell you what emma thought just in case you're catching this bit ! that's cos i don't know. -i don't think a person told, who apologises isn't really an apology but i thought there must a reason why you didn't. +i don't think a person told, who apologises isn't really an apology but i thought there must a reason why you didn't. yeah. ah oh! i know he, he can't write! and joe told me on sunday you're illiterate! why yo , you didn't. -i was going to apologise for being stupid on sunday when you both disappeared. -me and andy looked all over for you both last night i had a few things on my mind +i was going to apologise for being stupid on sunday when you both disappeared. +me and andy looked all over for you both last night i had a few things on my mind didn't look very well, we were walking down by the side of the road ! -but -things on my mind er, my my mind to be able to apologise. -oh i'm sorry ! +but +things on my mind er, my my mind to be able to apologise. +oh i'm sorry ! and hope we can still be friends? -love to be ! +love to be ! well whe , when i got to that -bit i went i mean i was feeling a lit , wasn't , i'm gonna barf! -oh i'm going urgh! -i just thought get a life! -you know how +bit i went i mean i was feeling a lit , wasn't , i'm gonna barf! +oh i'm going urgh! +i just thought get a life! +you know how give me that ! -he makes me laugh he always writes in capital letters doesn't he? +he makes me laugh he always writes in capital letters doesn't he? mm. and join in ! @@ -86296,71 +86228,71 @@ oh you sound like mrs yeah! ! wow! -well and he wrote me this letter saying erm saying i, i realise that there's been something on your mind recently and i hope you can talk to me about it. -oh yeah, by the shrimp i could of got pregnant! -things like and i know you can talk to me +well and he wrote me this letter saying erm saying i, i realise that there's been something on your mind recently and i hope you can talk to me about it. +oh yeah, by the shrimp i could of got pregnant! +things like and i know you can talk to me because you've got the world's problems and everything ! ah, it ju , although, i mean, just when you said that just reminded me that time hannah ! i'll never oh god! i was just bor , the rest of my days! -you joked me about what she should of in the day? -yeah, yeah oh +you joked me about what she should of in the day? +yeah, yeah oh when. god! what, what what exactly -i was staying on i said oh er, yeah cos yo , had joe saying you were disappointed that i couldn't say it to your face! +i was staying on i said oh er, yeah cos yo , had joe saying you were disappointed that i couldn't say it to your face! and i said, ah yeah, but she didn't say it to my face, did you see -and er and erm and joe was saying this to shrimpy i think, or so i think she was saying to shrimpy +and er and erm and joe was saying this to shrimpy i think, or so i think she was saying to shrimpy mm. and erm -hannah -yeah, hannah hannah 's got a twitch! -and was going, i know what she said,i was there ! +hannah +yeah, hannah hannah 's got a twitch! +and was going, i know what she said,i was there ! oh! -i'm thinking i'm sure you were hannah because actually you were inside and they were outside, there's like a door and the rest of the house between you! +i'm thinking i'm sure you were hannah because actually you were inside and they were outside, there's like a door and the rest of the house between you! i think, ah gee! -but i can't believe that girl oh scott tells me everything! +but i can't believe that girl oh scott tells me everything! like i ju , honestly i oh yes! scott , scott, scott told me what it was all about and i was going,not to me! it's me here ! oh yeah ! -it might be and oh ah i was just sat there going mm, yes i believe hannah! +it might be and oh ah i was just sat there going mm, yes i believe hannah! you yeah. you don't actually know anything that we're talking about! -because we hate you! +because we hate you! but there you go ! no i don't hate her she just annoys me badly! that's all ! -she made ee she made a heather a birthday cake the other day and i, i've got say actually this cake was pretty good but like, she had to take it to school! +she made ee she made a heather a birthday cake the other day and i, i've got say actually this cake was pretty good but like, she had to take it to school! i mean, the girl is sad! -if you're gonna take a birthday cake to school i mean, that is sad isn't it? -my brain's just died ! +if you're gonna take a birthday cake to school i mean, that is sad isn't it? +my brain's just died ! but that is very very sad! -but like er, she took it sch to school and scott was giving us a lift to school so didn't have to walk and she's in the car and she's going if this gets if this gets all smashed up scott i hope you realise i'm blaming you! +but like er, she took it sch to school and scott was giving us a lift to school so didn't have to walk and she's in the car and she's going if this gets if this gets all smashed up scott i hope you realise i'm blaming you! and she was serious! i was thinking i would of turned round and ge get out i did get out the fucking car! -i sa , i said i just went i just said to her look hannah you don't have to come in the car! +i sa , i said i just went i just said to her look hannah you don't have to come in the car! and like, i said it jokingly but wi with mm. -like a sort of you know -sort of with a sort of i'm dying to stick this knife in your back ! +like a sort of you know +sort of with a sort of i'm dying to stick this knife in your back ! yes. oh! oh, did you see inspector morse last night? no i saw the very end bit. -did you see the where's she where that girl stabbed er her what was that girl in? +did you see the where's she where that girl stabbed er her what was that girl in? i was sat there, me and my dad were going,what has she been in ? she was in erm got a really irritating voice hasn't she? -you know where there was that there was the young girl and there was the old wo , oldish woman who was supposed to be a film star or something? +you know where there was that there was the young girl and there was the old wo , oldish woman who was supposed to be a film star or something? oh yeah! -that thing where erm she, she worked for him so that +that thing where erm she, she worked for him so that yeah. she lived in that hotel. mm. @@ -86370,9 +86302,9 @@ it was crap wasn't it! to be funny! that stupid everyone thought the -irritating little dog and th , the and ted out of grange hill porter ! +irritating little dog and th , the and ted out of grange hill porter ! yeah. -did you watch the one where you wanted to go mm i'd like to casserole that dog! +did you watch the one where you wanted to go mm i'd like to casserole that dog! yeah ! ahhh ! ah dear! @@ -86386,98 +86318,98 @@ your . you know? look say nothing! -this is, this is sad i am and how worried i've been this has been round my neck! +this is, this is sad i am and how worried i've been this has been round my neck! my luckiest lucky pendant ! -lucky is looking bent which has been bent and battered ! -it's like, got scrapings out of it and everything and and it's in this little lovely container or something down my neck! -i, i bet, i bet i i bet it's the first time in your life you felt shi , yes come on ! +lucky is looking bent which has been bent and battered ! +it's like, got scrapings out of it and everything and and it's in this little lovely container or something down my neck! +i, i bet, i bet i i bet it's the first time in your life you felt shi , yes come on ! which i'm saying, you can hold m , you can hold me to this, i will never ever ever complain about being on again in my life! but i think ah dear! -i'll just boycott that now and start complaining! +i'll just boycott that now and start complaining! ah dear! and we nearly made andy sick yesterday, it was so funny! -we was going like because like, we was talking about it and er he goes +we was going like because like, we was talking about it and er he goes about what? periods. oh, being on! -yes and er, like i said er i was, like i was talking to like he was +yes and er, like i said er i was, like i was talking to like he was yeah ! -i goes yeah it was you know i the worst time is in assembly and you think oh jesus! -and you stand up and you like you like mm, accidentally rub your hand on your arse +i goes yeah it was you know i the worst time is in assembly and you think oh jesus! +and you stand up and you like you like mm, accidentally rub your hand on your arse yeah. just to make sure ! sure, yeah ! and you look at the chair just to make sure there isn't a pool on there! yeah ! -and you walk away going like this you know ooh let's squeeze my legs in as much as possible ! -yeah . -we thought we'd start with an interesting topic ! +and you walk away going like this you know ooh let's squeeze my legs in as much as possible ! +yeah . +we thought we'd start with an interesting topic ! well why not! it's what we talk about all the time anyway! yeah ! yeah. -i tell you when we'll have to put this on on saturday night! +i tell you when we'll have to put this on on saturday night! but, when everyone's gone when it's just us three! oh yeah! that'll be a right one! my dog's a virgin ! my dog's a big dobbo ! -i'll never forget that i will never forget that, i had, i'll told my mum like that we i told my mum we'd be sleeping over and she said that was alright and she sort of looked at me as if to say mm, yes will helena's brother be there? +i'll never forget that i will never forget that, i had, i'll told my mum like that we i told my mum we'd be sleeping over and she said that was alright and she sort of looked at me as if to say mm, yes will helena's brother be there? yes, helena's brother will there all night, mum! jimmy hill! not that she's sleeping at clare's are we ? no ! it's a bit. oh wild ! -he will be back about ooh eleven o'clock in the morning ! +he will be back about ooh eleven o'clock in the morning ! oh no! look at me weep ! i'm really disappointed cos i don't think my mum will let me stay now! i think you're just gonna rush home and tell her and everything else! yeah! course i am! -oh mum i've decided not to sleep at helena's because her nice brother's gonna be there! +oh mum i've decided not to sleep at helena's because her nice brother's gonna be there! mum goes, well do you wanna stay there if the dog's gonna be there? oh no no i'll put the dog in the shed! . -no mum, actually erm i'm not gonna go down to helena's and wi ,wi , you know with the dogs -i'm gonna come home +no mum, actually erm i'm not gonna go down to helena's and wi ,wi , you know with the dogs +i'm gonna come home perhaps have the riot you know! -they're all gonna be being arsed out their faces! -everyone's just gonna be laying on the floor going god i'm arsed! +they're all gonna be being arsed out their faces! +everyone's just gonna be laying on the floor going god i'm arsed! i'm blood thirsty! everybody's just gonna have a real riot! -and then helena, joanne and me would be sleeping over but because they've got a dog i'm not going to sleep! +and then helena, joanne and me would be sleeping over but because they've got a dog i'm not going to sleep! in case it spits on me ! yeah ! again ! again ! -no but like i said to my mum it'll be alright because your do , your brother'll be in all evening won't he helena? +no but like i said to my mum it'll be alright because your do , your brother'll be in all evening won't he helena? honestly, yeah! honest guv! -my brother, my brother really wants to did, did you know pete like, phoned me up yesterday +my brother, my brother really wants to did, did you know pete like, phoned me up yesterday yeah. -and like i thought, i had to make up an excuse why i went out! +and like i thought, i had to make up an excuse why i went out! cos ever , like my mum and my brother were in when i got home. -so i came home and i goes +so i came home and i goes and he go and mum goes where have you been? i goes, oh there's been arguments again! -oh there's you spend all your time sorting out other people's arguments and i'm not as thick as that! +oh there's you spend all your time sorting out other people's arguments and i'm not as thick as that! actually mum, i'm not! stick the v's up at you mum! behind the wall of course! -i don't think i'll go i don't want to have a broken nose! -and er and er +i don't think i'll go i don't want to have a broken nose! +and er and er got any nail clippers? -yeah er there! +yeah er there! ah! and er -dog brush ooh! +dog brush ooh! yeah. -looks like a dog's brush +looks like a dog's brush ooh! ooh! ooh! ooh! do you think? just see if you @@ -86488,7 +86420,7 @@ else! what? i've got a red one of those ! oh! -yeah, but it's not as big as it's not the same size as that is it? +yeah, but it's not as big as it's not the same size as that is it? no, cos yours is a cat brush and mine's a dog brush! oh sorry! dog! @@ -86499,62 +86431,62 @@ i hope so! foxy chick ! alright then, i'll let you off! ah! -erm did i tell you about that lucy and ricky? +erm did i tell you about that lucy and ricky? when lucy reckoned ricky didn't want her any more? -and i goes do this to ricky go up to lucy and go yo, hot chick! +and i goes do this to ricky go up to lucy and go yo, hot chick! come over to my place i'll drop my trousers and we can have a quickie ! and he did ! and what did she say? -er sorry +er sorry nothing could of told her that i, i to , i told her and she goes what did she say? -i told her say something really, really stupid like like okay then steaming dude or something ! +i told her say something really, really stupid like like okay then steaming dude or something ! alright then. okay! and then, where was i? oh yeah! so i came home, my mum goes what you be ,wha what's happening anyway? -i goes ah shrimpy's been having a massive go at pete he's threatened to punch his face in and all this business ! +i goes ah shrimpy's been having a massive go at pete he's threatened to punch his face in and all this business ! gosh you ge , i bet pete was worried! i know ! -but he was, he was threatening him anyway and he said pete was +but he was, he was threatening him anyway and he said pete was what from friday night? do you know about what? -no, no he's been befo , been after that! +no, no he's been befo , been after that! yeah. why? -woh,christ -she's been in a shop with him i think. +woh,christ +she's been in a shop with him i think. they'll . -yeah, they'll ! -erm why, why was he doing that on friday? -yeah, well apparently right well in case you didn't +yeah, they'll ! +erm why, why was he doing that on friday? +yeah, well apparently right well in case you didn't well she's got a theory but go on -in case you didn't notice i was in rather a little bit of a mood on friday! +in case you didn't notice i was in rather a little bit of a mood on friday! were you ? i didn't try to hide it oddly enough ! oddly enough! -i went cos it was then i goes to pete, oh no i ought to go out really, and he goes no you're not! -sort of looked at me and went okay +i went cos it was then i goes to pete, oh no i ought to go out really, and he goes no you're not! +sort of looked at me and went okay well if you i'm not arguing ! -if you want my body, you know you've got it! +if you want my body, you know you've got it! you only have to ask once! but like erm i wonder if they listen to these? if you are listening -er i know i look like a real goody goody and everything i'm not really ! +er i know i look like a real goody goody and everything i'm not really ! anyhow, the man go on. with the man i thought woh! -i was so tempted to sit there and say excuse me dear you need a shave! +i was so tempted to sit there and say excuse me dear you need a shave! or, excuse me you look like my dad twenty years ago! that exci , it's alright this thing from the past, he did remind me of someone actually. -mr that's who it is ! +mr that's who it is ! mr ,. ooh ooh fiddle with my moustache! -i bet they know you +i bet they know you anyway, right what was it about cos they won't be able to understand a thing we are saying! going ooh! @@ -86563,45 +86495,45 @@ i i ! and we're talking at the same time as well? oh let's not all talk at the same time! let's be magic roundabout people! -so they want a realistic conversation +so they want a realistic conversation then do they? -no let's let's loo +no let's let's loo anyway, where was i? -i was saying, oh yeah erm shrimpy like, we, me and scott were playing snooker and i, i came in to see if like, either of you, anyone else wanted to play doubles and like,swimp , shrimpy was just sat by himself in the middle of the floor, cross-legged just sat there like a little pixie or something! +i was saying, oh yeah erm shrimpy like, we, me and scott were playing snooker and i, i came in to see if like, either of you, anyone else wanted to play doubles and like,swimp , shrimpy was just sat by himself in the middle of the floor, cross-legged just sat there like a little pixie or something! well, no not a little and i just went six foot three pixie ! right, so a six foot three pixie, never mind! -but like he was just sat there! +but like he was just sat there! and i went over, i goes you alright? he goes, yes! oh sorry! please forgive me! i goes, do you wanna go, go and play snooker? so he goes, yeah alright then. -oh come on you can be on my side cos it was obvious, like, he was just sort of sat there. +oh come on you can be on my side cos it was obvious, like, he was just sort of sat there. mm. -and erm and then like, he went back in after we'd finished playing and me and scott carried on playing for a bit and then erm what was he going? +and erm and then like, he went back in after we'd finished playing and me and scott carried on playing for a bit and then erm what was he going? oh yeah, he told me afterwards right, that he, the only reason he was angry was because friday night reminded him of the time in his past or something! and pete reminded him of, him of the person that he hated and all this! -and i was thinking shrimpy, you're stupid! +and i was thinking shrimpy, you're stupid! get a life ! you sure! oh ! and then, cos i thought boy! so what did he do? what did shrimpy do on friday night? -oh, he told richard richard that he was, he was gonna se , he wanted to smack pete's face in! +oh, he told richard richard that he was, he was gonna se , he wanted to smack pete's face in! oh yeah! so what did richard do? course, richard who keeps everything to himself ! -richard not known as mersey tunnel gob or anything ! -oh dear ! +richard not known as mersey tunnel gob or anything ! +oh dear ! oh dear i couldn't believe it though! i mean that is sad! ahhh no! i can't believe it! -but pete reckoned it was because like cos like pete's seeing susan +but pete reckoned it was because like cos like pete's seeing susan mm. and like then he was with you. @@ -86610,10 +86542,10 @@ yeah. and he reckoned pete was a total bastard and everything! even though he doesn't know susan he a yeah. -he reckons pete's cheating on susan, he's been really bad to helena as well he's just using them and all +he reckons pete's cheating on susan, he's been really bad to helena as well he's just using them and all yeah. this business. -but, in a way i mean like, i thought that as well, but then i thought well that's stupid that is because you weren't as as bad as pete was were you? +but, in a way i mean like, i thought that as well, but then i thought well that's stupid that is because you weren't as as bad as pete was were you? i mean, let's face it i mean, who's taking advantage of him you were ta , you were taking advantage, not him! @@ -86621,16 +86553,16 @@ i mean, on both times it's been me taking advantage of him, it really yeah. because i mean he -he's been both times and i haven't. -let's face it you fancy him don't you? +he's been both times and i haven't. +let's face it you fancy him don't you? he knows that! and mm mm -like he just i mean he just you know, he's there isn't he, at the time? -he thinks like, okay fair enough lets have a bit of snog you know, fair enough, whatever else! +like he just i mean he just you know, he's there isn't he, at the time? +he thinks like, okay fair enough lets have a bit of snog you know, fair enough, whatever else! but like he's so funny though! -he cracked me up, he goes like, like with that i mean +he cracked me up, he goes like, like with that i mean and shrimpy fancies you rotten anyway! that's the only the reason! he's probably just jealous! @@ -86642,44 +86574,44 @@ yeah. obviously not said anything to pete about me mm. so i dunno! -he said it to andy though, and i mean i don't, i don't know, andy really surprises me because like he always seems to be like, the quiet one doesn't it? -i mean, when we're all like, laughing and joking and everything he's like, oh yeah really in with it but when everyone's like arguing or whatever he he +he said it to andy though, and i mean i don't, i don't know, andy really surprises me because like he always seems to be like, the quiet one doesn't it? +i mean, when we're all like, laughing and joking and everything he's like, oh yeah really in with it but when everyone's like arguing or whatever he he mm. doesn't get involved because everything revolves round him doesn't it? yeah. -but like everybody,eve +but like everybody,eve it's his house everyone goes to isn't it? -everybody seems to andy seems to know everything! +everybody seems to andy seems to know everything! like, andy knows about me! -and like, scott told me and thinking about it if i'd of been in in the frame, frame of mind that i'm in know for example, i would of sort of pah! +and like, scott told me and thinking about it if i'd of been in in the frame, frame of mind that i'm in know for example, i would of sort of pah! what right has he got to know or anything? -but like, i don't mind cos i know he won't say anything. +but like, i don't mind cos i know he won't say anything. mm. -i mean flipping talk about keeping it a secret! -i went to the door last night ten minutes after scott had told him and like, i was crying at the door, and he goes ahh, is something not wrong like, you know? -and he was being nice, but sort of, jokingly nice and i goes oh yeah, you know? -and er, he goes oh i don't expect, has it got anything to do with helena and joan? -i said, oh no nothing to do with them and he goes ah, shrimpy then? +i mean flipping talk about keeping it a secret! +i went to the door last night ten minutes after scott had told him and like, i was crying at the door, and he goes ahh, is something not wrong like, you know? +and he was being nice, but sort of, jokingly nice and i goes oh yeah, you know? +and er, he goes oh i don't expect, has it got anything to do with helena and joan? +i said, oh no nothing to do with them and he goes ah, shrimpy then? i said no. and like, i'd no idea that he knew! and mm. -erm like he's really nice like that though. -yeah, i know -i re , i'd i mean, i don't fancy him, no fair enough he's ugly in my opinion! +erm like he's really nice like that though. +yeah, i know +i re , i'd i mean, i don't fancy him, no fair enough he's ugly in my opinion! yeah. -but, i really do like, i'm, i'm always +but, i really do like, i'm, i'm always he's a really nice person! -i mean the i mean, like, i mean, people say it that a personality makes up for like, looks or whatever, and with hi , he's the only person i've ever met where it really really does! +i mean the i mean, like, i mean, people say it that a personality makes up for like, looks or whatever, and with hi , he's the only person i've ever met where it really really does! yeah. his personality is just so nice! and he's yeah. such a lovely person he really is! -you know and i +you know and i yeah. just think ahhh, you know? -that's, i tell you what that's the one person that, sitting here thinking now, i can't think of any time where i've been angry with andrew +that's, i tell you what that's the one person that, sitting here thinking now, i can't think of any time where i've been angry with andrew no. at all. like i get, i mess about with him and like @@ -86687,20 +86619,20 @@ yeah! cos like, he told everyone about me and pete and everything, you know? yeah. like what him and joe had an argument about. -but er you know? -so you're not gonna say that on the tape then are you hel ? +but er you know? +so you're not gonna say that on the tape then are you hel ? no, i'm not gonna, i'm not gonna say it on the tape,! -but i mean he did, well he, he knew, i told him +but i mean he did, well he, he knew, i told him mm. but i mean, him and joe were in the room at the same time. yeah. -you know, and i you know, i sort of told him. +you know, and i you know, i sort of told him. well i did mm. tell him ! and he, but he didn't actually tell anybody. mm. -i mean, he made a few comments a but nothing that anybody could tell. +i mean, he made a few comments a but nothing that anybody could tell. no. i mean, everybody knows now anyway. yeah. @@ -86708,7 +86640,7 @@ to do , can you really see them all? what? the what? -the them things. +the them things. no, i di , i had one on my neck yeah. i had one @@ -86725,7 +86657,7 @@ and i've got one on my back. and can you see that one? let's have a butchers! where? -thought it was just there somewhere. +thought it was just there somewhere. it's probably gone now actually. yeah just there. @@ -86745,10 +86677,10 @@ can see it straight through it! the shirt and the collar and you could still see it! and it was like, i'm not joking, it was the colour of that! mm. -and it was there a week, oh well, at the last, the last thing i saw of it was like, monday night and when did he give it me? +and it was there a week, oh well, at the last, the last thing i saw of it was like, monday night and when did he give it me? the sat , the we , the saturday a week before! and i swear, it really hurt! -and it right on as well, just there! +and it right on as well, just there! mm. really really hurt it did! and it wasn't, oh god! @@ -86756,47 +86688,47 @@ and we only did it as a joke!you ! i didn't even know they were there to be quite honest. i got mm. -up the next morning and, cos i had that you know, that stripy top on? +up the next morning and, cos i had that you know, that stripy top on? yeah. -and my mum, my mum was sat in the weathers with me and i'd talked to her and everything and i didn't even know that that +and my mum, my mum was sat in the weathers with me and i'd talked to her and everything and i didn't even know that that yeah. one was there! and like,but like, i got -up the next morning and i just went oh jesus! +up the next morning and i just went oh jesus! but there was they were like this one still and up there and the one on my back as well! -and scott, scott did this and like and erm he goes oh it's not that bad! +and scott, scott did this and like and erm he goes oh it's not that bad! and i goes, oh you stupid git! why did you have to do it there for, you know? put my school shirt on, oh you won't see it! oh no won't see it with that flipping big collar on my school shirt! actually, you couldn't see it, but you could see it through anyway so it didn't make really that much difference. -but like, i got the mirror down and like, i looked at it and whether it was the light or whether it just hadn't come up cos it was only like, a few seconds afterwards +but like, i got the mirror down and like, i looked at it and whether it was the light or whether it just hadn't come up cos it was only like, a few seconds afterwards mm. -i looked at it and it was just like sort of, light brown and i thought oh that's not too bad! -i got home and it was like, glowing and i'm thinking oh my god! +i looked at it and it was just like sort of, light brown and i thought oh that's not too bad! +i got home and it was like, glowing and i'm thinking oh my god! there was like, arrows pointed to it still ! -i mean, i only had that one on my neck and i thought and like i was i was ! +i mean, i only had that one on my neck and i thought and like i was i was ! wi , with your polos on ! collars ! all round you! like, my dad le , like i was doing the crossword or something my dad leant over me and i went, yeah, oh really! yeah. i haven't actually got a neck ! -yeah, that was like me, i mean like i'd, i wasn't bad like, cos all the time i was just wearing like polo necks or like shirts with high collars and stuff cos it wasn't actually on my neck it was just like on my, this one. +yeah, that was like me, i mean like i'd, i wasn't bad like, cos all the time i was just wearing like polo necks or like shirts with high collars and stuff cos it wasn't actually on my neck it was just like on my, this one. mm. i don't know what that is actually? it's a collarbone . collarbone yeah. -but like erm pyjamas, cos you know i wo , i usually wear those ones with like low neck or like +but like erm pyjamas, cos you know i wo , i usually wear those ones with like low neck or like yeah. my babygro or something. mm. -so like, there was me sort of all of a sudden wearing like old t-shirts and stuff in bed so that i'd got quite high collars and mum was sort of going +so like, there was me sort of all of a sudden wearing like old t-shirts and stuff in bed so that i'd got quite high collars and mum was sort of going aren't your pyjamas clean? yeah, they're clean but i wanna clear up spots on my back! yeah, still wanna clear up the spots on my back. @@ -86808,42 +86740,42 @@ neck! that was lucky really in a way oh! isn't it? -and i was thinking, oh i wa honestly i didn't know they were there. -but like, scott was going to me he was going to me, oh stop complaining or i'll give you one your tit, like and i goes well i wouldn't mind so much if it was on my , i wear a bra all the time +and i was thinking, oh i wa honestly i didn't know they were there. +but like, scott was going to me he was going to me, oh stop complaining or i'll give you one your tit, like and i goes well i wouldn't mind so much if it was on my , i wear a bra all the time you know i mean yeah. you don't even take your bra off to do p e or whatever! i mean, no one 's gonna see it there are they? -you're flipping massive one ! +you're flipping massive one ! i dunno. -if zena saw it and, and made a a subtle comments like +if zena saw it and, and made a a subtle comments like mm. you know oh got a nasty ah bruise there! -yeah, actually se , i sa , actually she said oh what, have you been walking into this time? +yeah, actually se , i sa , actually she said oh what, have you been walking into this time? hah, shut up! shut up before i punch your face in! -but like erm no one else saw it. +but like erm no one else saw it. but, i tell you what, it was so embarrassing! -the, it was the mo , the monday after the saturday got, the saturday it was done, i had p e oh great! -so there's me like i'm sat in first lesson we have p e last lesson sat in the first lesson and i'm th , i've thought god my bra strap feels really lose! -so i'm right i thought oh my god! +the, it was the mo , the monday after the saturday got, the saturday it was done, i had p e oh great! +so there's me like i'm sat in first lesson we have p e last lesson sat in the first lesson and i'm th , i've thought god my bra strap feels really lose! +so i'm right i thought oh my god! there's a gap in between, they're not attached any more! what would you do ? -.i mean, like, okay it wasn't bad i mean let's face it and i'm not exactly flipping dolly parton am i?! +.i mean, like, okay it wasn't bad i mean let's face it and i'm not exactly flipping dolly parton am i?! exploding everywhere wouldn't she ! -but like, i was thinking this is gonna be so embarrassing like in p e! +but like, i was thinking this is gonna be so embarrassing like in p e! with ha half a bra on ! ! -my cups down my cups down to my waist ! -i sa , i was sat there and and then we was in maths, like the lesson before and i was going zena, i don't wanna do p e! +my cups down my cups down to my waist ! +i sa , i was sat there and and then we was in maths, like the lesson before and i was going zena, i don't wanna do p e! i just do not want to do p e! and she's going, why not? -you like p e, i don't wanna do it zena will you write me a letter to get me out of it? -she's going no i won't, you know, not unless you tell me what it i , why it is you don't wanna do it! -so in the end i wro , i wrote her this letter because i couldn't say it out loud in case anyone else heard me! +you like p e, i don't wanna do it zena will you write me a letter to get me out of it? +she's going no i won't, you know, not unless you tell me what it i , why it is you don't wanna do it! +so in the end i wro , i wrote her this letter because i couldn't say it out loud in case anyone else heard me! and say that i've busted my bra strap ! so she goes, oh don't worry about it. like, we go into the loo and like, you can mend it. @@ -86854,38 +86786,38 @@ did this one? no! the loop's attached to the end of the strap! it's a bit of the cup that's actually come apart, unsewn! -so that meant i had to get the part of the, the top bit of the cup, thread it through the hoo , the hoop and then tie it in a knot! -so like, you can imagine i had to have all the strap completely undone so like the, the buckle was like down here! +so that meant i had to get the part of the, the top bit of the cup, thread it through the hoo , the hoop and then tie it in a knot! +so like, you can imagine i had to have all the strap completely undone so like the, the buckle was like down here! and above the knot! comfortable then? -well it wasn't, it wasn't that bad but like it was really weird because like you could see like, people like, especially the lads, just sort of looking at you and then like not meaning to be pervy but just like, looking again as if to think why has emma got a, a extraordinary lump on half the top of her boob, you know ! +well it wasn't, it wasn't that bad but like it was really weird because like you could see like, people like, especially the lads, just sort of looking at you and then like not meaning to be pervy but just like, looking again as if to think why has emma got a, a extraordinary lump on half the top of her boob, you know ! it's like a lump there! they're thinking, mm, a shame ! -but like, it was alright then because like means that you can changed up in this one corner of the changing room all the time and so i'd got my shirt on while i was putting my t-shirt on like for the reason that my bra strap was bust, not actually because i'd got a gigantic love bite around my neck ! +but like, it was alright then because like means that you can changed up in this one corner of the changing room all the time and so i'd got my shirt on while i was putting my t-shirt on like for the reason that my bra strap was bust, not actually because i'd got a gigantic love bite around my neck ! but like er but i mean so that was alright really. -but, i couldn't believe it cos i he goes to me, what do you think of love bites? +but, i couldn't believe it cos i he goes to me, what do you think of love bites? and i goes, i think they're horrible to be quite honest, i don't yeah. like them! same as me! -i goes to scott, i really really hate love bites and er and he goes, yeah and me. -the only time he's ever had one was at this kid's party fran , franny someone, he's actually a bloke ! -ooh that's -i said that's he went to this party and he he was like really hard and he was really drunk and he gave scott, noel and ian a love bite like for a joke ! -he just decided to do just for a laugh! +i goes to scott, i really really hate love bites and er and he goes, yeah and me. +the only time he's ever had one was at this kid's party fran , franny someone, he's actually a bloke ! +ooh that's +i said that's he went to this party and he he was like really hard and he was really drunk and he gave scott, noel and ian a love bite like for a joke ! +he just decided to do just for a laugh! oh, how sick! ah what a gay ! -i know like, anyway but like, scott had gone home said to his mum like, is his mum isn't, going what's that on your neck? +i know like, anyway but like, scott had gone home said to his mum like, is his mum isn't, going what's that on your neck? you know,woh what you been doing, sort of thing! -and he's told her the whole story so noel's gone home and his mum's gone, what's that on your neck? -so noel's gone oh someone tripped me up, i fell down the stairs and hit it on the coffee table, right! +and he's told her the whole story so noel's gone home and his mum's gone, what's that on your neck? +so noel's gone oh someone tripped me up, i fell down the stairs and hit it on the coffee table, right! his mum believed him! -so then his scott's mum and noel's mum met in town and they were just talking and scott's mum it's dis , god it's disgusting isn't it that lad given all them little lads love bites! -and er noel's mum's going well what? +so then his scott's mum and noel's mum met in town and they were just talking and scott's mum it's dis , god it's disgusting isn't it that lad given all them little lads love bites! +and er noel's mum's going well what? i don't know what you mean! -noel said he'd hit it on the coffee table ! +noel said he'd hit it on the coffee table ! next day at school, noel's come in and gone to scott, you bastard! why do you have go and tell your mum the truth for ! i'd never tell my mum that! @@ -86902,13 +86834,13 @@ i think they're at least really disgusting! cos like, scott was going i've never gave anyone one, you know. -and er hannah's going we started off the conversation where was the perviest you've ever had one i mean, knowing that i didn't have one, ever had one before and that was mark , feeble attempt that lasted about ten minutes +and er hannah's going we started off the conversation where was the perviest you've ever had one i mean, knowing that i didn't have one, ever had one before and that was mark , feeble attempt that lasted about ten minutes i think ! and i was really upset about that as you can imagine! -but like erm what was i saying? -oh yeah so i was going what's the perviest place? +but like erm what was i saying? +oh yeah so i was going what's the perviest place? i was thinking, you know, scotts bound to have some pervy ones off mandy ! -but like er, and he was going oh i've never had one except for like, this franny bloke!. +but like er, and he was going oh i've never had one except for like, this franny bloke!. girls don't do it to boys as much as boys do it to girls though do they? no i know. that is really sick though! @@ -86918,22 +86850,22 @@ i think it looks awful on boys! i mean, it looks bad enough on girls but i mean i know, it looks really cheap doesn't it? yeah. -sort of like eh eh eh eh eh! -but i didn't that's why it's +sort of like eh eh eh eh eh! +but i didn't that's why it's i'm a big slag! that's why i ha! i didn't tell anybody. yeah. at school. -you didn't tell anyone like, except joe then told stuart,mr ! +you didn't tell anyone like, except joe then told stuart,mr ! really funny! -but i ca , honestly when pete phoned me up and like, i was getting so worried! +but i ca , honestly when pete phoned me up and like, i was getting so worried! and he's going -yeah but i swear you should have heard pete mouthing off at joe! +yeah but i swear you should have heard pete mouthing off at joe! i know. and because like, he didn't even know about the love bites! -cos scott goes to him cos, we were talking about flipping biting other people's nipples or something ! +cos scott goes to him cos, we were talking about flipping biting other people's nipples or something ! he did, he and he did actually bite me! @@ -86950,46 +86882,46 @@ hurt! well scott does that i screamed! all the time! -like he doesn't think he doing it but it really doesn't it? -i mean like keeh god me -i went i went +like he doesn't think he doing it but it really doesn't it? +i mean like keeh god me +i went i went god! -i actually went arghhh you've gotta to! +i actually went arghhh you've gotta to! yeah. -and and like then, like them two they're being , and they goes what's up? +and and like then, like them two they're being , and they goes what's up? i goes, nothing! nothing! you know, and it really hurt! yeah. -but i mean but joe said they were actual bite marks and it wasn't +but i mean but joe said they were actual bite marks and it wasn't yeah she did. there wasn't actually bite marks, but he did bite me, but yeah. they was like love bite marks. mm. -and i think, so pete wasn't right and she wasn't right either. +and i think, so pete wasn't right and she wasn't right either. yeah. but but like, he was really sounding off at joe! -and like, i mean he didn't know about that! -and scott goes oh it's a good job it's a good he didn't give her a love bite ! -and pete's gone what, i didn't did i? +and like, i mean he didn't know about that! +and scott goes oh it's a good job it's a good he didn't give her a love bite ! +and pete's gone what, i didn't did i? and like, everyone was just sat there going, oh my god drool on the floor man, you don't even know! i've only got three! but oh god! i mean they weren't very bad or anything but mm. -i mean jesus christ! +i mean jesus christ! you've gotta be sad not to notice have you? -i mean he's got about ! +i mean he's got about ! ah, but is he coming on saturday? hasn't he? he's -oh i asked him +oh i asked him you've asked ? i asked him whether he was and yeah. -he said that he wa he didn't know, he was either coming now or was going to tramps . +he said that he wa he didn't know, he was either coming now or was going to tramps . yeah. cos someone said last night they were going to tramps but whether that was just like, they might be going to tramps or what. this bra's too small, i'll have to get a new one! @@ -87003,86 +86935,86 @@ and if it's a toss up between me and susan it's,yeah susan ! yeah. you know? but i i -i can't believe it actually, i mean and no, no offense to you because you know i do , you know i don't mean this whatever +i can't believe it actually, i mean and no, no offense to you because you know i do , you know i don't mean this whatever no. offensively. mm. -but like he goes on on and on, don't he about how wonderful susan is and then you know he gets drunk and that's it isn't it? -but like, he even said it, he said to me when i was drunk and i, and it pissed me off a little bit actually cos like, he goes to me you know like i i was saying about it and he goes erm well she was the one who wanted it all casual and everything, and i said oh yeah. -and he goes he goes yeah well, i do it because she does it! +but like he goes on on and on, don't he about how wonderful susan is and then you know he gets drunk and that's it isn't it? +but like, he even said it, he said to me when i was drunk and i, and it pissed me off a little bit actually cos like, he goes to me you know like i i was saying about it and he goes erm well she was the one who wanted it all casual and everything, and i said oh yeah. +and he goes he goes yeah well, i do it because she does it! oh that's nice isn't it ! and i'll, i thought, i goes go on then! -i'll i'll +i'll i'll flattery's the way to a girl's heart! no, i go, i i went, oh thanks very much! i don't think he heard me! yeah. under your breath, something. yeah and i went oh thanks! -well i didn't actually but he was arsed i just said oh thanks very much! +well i didn't actually but he was arsed i just said oh thanks very much! like yeah. and went and sat in the corner of the bathroom and went, scowled at him for a bit! yeah. -but you know. +but you know. oh gee i dunno!hey? i don't know! i wasn't even gonna tell scott i hadn't come on! -but then he kept going on about how brilliant your party was gonna be and everything and i'm sat there thinking let's face it, if i come on between you know, because like, it would have been alright cos i'd be finished like, today or tomorrow and then it would have been like nice and ready for the party! +but then he kept going on about how brilliant your party was gonna be and everything and i'm sat there thinking let's face it, if i come on between you know, because like, it would have been alright cos i'd be finished like, today or tomorrow and then it would have been like nice and ready for the party! mm. how do you do! but like er -but erm like, i'm putting out of bounds signs on my mum's and brother's. +but erm like, i'm putting out of bounds signs on my mum's and brother's. yeah. well i said to i mean i said to scott -you can you come in here. -i said to scott look +you can you come in here. +i said to scott look as long as i'm not in here. yeah. three people ! i said, i said to scott or you can go in the bathrooms. -like ooh can we have it in bath please? -cos you know what i mean that's as you know i, i can't even lie in a bath any more, it's not fair ! +like ooh can we have it in bath please? +cos you know what i mean that's as you know i, i can't even lie in a bath any more, it's not fair ! fiona was saying to me today at school, oh emma can i have a bit of your height please? i was thinking, oh yeah i'll just chop my legs off at the knee shall i? it's really bad but now! -like everyone's jealo ,a , like everyone's jealous of me at school and i wouldn't say i'm over tall! +like everyone's jealo ,a , like everyone's jealous of me at school and i wouldn't say i'm over tall! but no. -like you know, loads of people are smaller than me! +like you know, loads of people are smaller than me! mm. i'm, i, you know i'm going off you know with one of the tallest! -yeah, you know those heeled shoes i've got? -i mean the heels have gotta be what two inches? +yeah, you know those heeled shoes i've got? +i mean the heels have gotta be what two inches? mm. when i've got them on i'm taller than my dad! can you believe that, i'm taller than my dad! that is disgusting! -if i grow any more i'm just gonna flipping start chopping bits off myself! +if i grow any more i'm just gonna flipping start chopping bits off myself! stop eating ! yeah, but eating doesn't make any difference anyway does it? i'd rather eat loads and at least then i won't look so lanky! mm. -but actually i'm com quite quite pleased with my body at the moment, my legs are still a bit skinny but apart from that i'm doing okay i think? +but actually i'm com quite quite pleased with my body at the moment, my legs are still a bit skinny but apart from that i'm doing okay i think? i like my legs. yeah. -you have you've got a really nice body anyway! -actually, me and joe were saying the other day, like ever erm who was it, someone said something about people being fat or whatever and someone's gone, oh yeah, like helena, you know jokingly and erm and me and joe both turned round and said yeah but she's not fat though is she, she's like more you're more wide aren't you? -yeah , i'm not, i'm not fat that way, i'm like that way. +you have you've got a really nice body anyway! +actually, me and joe were saying the other day, like ever erm who was it, someone said something about people being fat or whatever and someone's gone, oh yeah, like helena, you know jokingly and erm and me and joe both turned round and said yeah but she's not fat though is she, she's like more you're more wide aren't you? +yeah , i'm not, i'm not fat that way, i'm like that way. you're sort , you're like your mum aren't you, you're like, wide? mhm. -but like i don't know, i don't think there's anything wrong with it, i mean -but like, like, i mean andy, andy goes yeah, like, cos we were talking about that, and he goes, yeah you've got childbearing hips! +but like i don't know, i don't think there's anything wrong with it, i mean +but like, like, i mean andy, andy goes yeah, like, cos we were talking about that, and he goes, yeah you've got childbearing hips! yeah. -he goes, unlike my sister who's got house-bearing hips ! +he goes, unlike my sister who's got house-bearing hips ! and i go, no it's not in that yeah, i went shhh! ! @@ -87102,49 +87034,49 @@ she is a bit! yeah. oh,. i feel really sorry for her actually -cos i'm i know if i had it i'd just feel really awful if i had bo +cos i'm i know if i had it i'd just feel really awful if i had bo yeah i know! same as me. that's why i always hate that people tell me! -like, even if it meant writing them anonymous note, you know ! -and like, you always think to yourself like you always think to yourself, yeah, you know i would tell someone and if it's what you would +like, even if it meant writing them anonymous note, you know ! +and like, you always think to yourself like you always think to yourself, yeah, you know i would tell someone and if it's what you would i can't! . -you know i would, i'd just sort of +you know i would, i'd just sort of if it was someone really close to me yeah. i would. i've told i'd say my brother he had it before. -and i have told my brother. +and i have told my brother. but like, your brother's alright, cos you go, oh you smelly bastard! ! -i go god, oh your breath stinks can't you? +i go god, oh your breath stinks can't you? mine probably does actually. but it don't matter if you offend him does it? no. really? -but like, i could say to you, you know ah, you know, how are yo , you know, and i'd probably make a joke out of it! +but like, i could say to you, you know ah, you know, how are yo , you know, and i'd probably make a joke out of it! god you stink! i might say -yeah +yeah oh you run out of deodorant or something, you know! -but you can't sort of turn round to hannah and say hannah, you've got b o ! +but you can't sort of turn round to hannah and say hannah, you've got b o ! i know it's like you smell ! -it's like fiona at school right he ,o , vicky and iona were having this ma , major crisis about whether to tell her she's got b o? -cos i don't know whether it's bo , but she just smells to quite honest! +it's like fiona at school right he ,o , vicky and iona were having this ma , major crisis about whether to tell her she's got b o? +cos i don't know whether it's bo , but she just smells to quite honest! and she's a really nice person, right, she's a bit portly mm. -like, she's coloured right, but she's a bit portly and she just smells to be quite honest! +like, she's coloured right, but she's a bit portly and she just smells to be quite honest! mm. -and she's got this smell,yo , it's her smell do you know +and she's got this smell,yo , it's her smell do you know yeah. what i mean? -and like you da , can't tell it, like just walking around or whatever, if you're sitting right next to her and she leans over you +and like you da , can't tell it, like just walking around or whatever, if you're sitting right next to her and she leans over you mm. -or when she's on the trampoline and you're +or when she's on the trampoline and you're yeah. standing by the trampoline. oh it's just horrific! @@ -87157,41 +87089,41 @@ there's this girl right, you know lisa ? yeah. remember she was at ricky's party yeah. -well we've got this thing against her now cos she's flirting with ricky! +well we've got this thing against her now cos she's flirting with ricky! ricky and lucy have finished by the way. oh have they? finally! yeah. -he, he was up town with this other girl, holding her hand walked past lucy and smiled at her! +he, he was up town with this other girl, holding her hand walked past lucy and smiled at her! that wa , that is sad! and wha -anyway lisa 's been flirting badly with ricky for ages! +anyway lisa 's been flirting badly with ricky for ages! i mean everyone knows she fancies him, but like, she's been getting really flirty! -so, like, we've got this thing about her, anyway, she was com and she was talking to fiona today and she was stood next to me, and like in a way, i was laughing at her but i felt so sorry for her cos she really, really stunk! -and like i wouldn't sa , she's not the sort of person who you'd think oh you know i mean like +so, like, we've got this thing about her, anyway, she was com and she was talking to fiona today and she was stood next to me, and like in a way, i was laughing at her but i felt so sorry for her cos she really, really stunk! +and like i wouldn't sa , she's not the sort of person who you'd think oh you know i mean like oh you smell! -yeah like, not being nasty but hannah to look at her you think you'd think, oh you know she might sort of bit bit pongy! +yeah like, not being nasty but hannah to look at her you think you'd think, oh you know she might sort of bit bit pongy! mm. -and like, lisa 's like, you know so +and like, lisa 's like, you know so yeah she's like, really clean cut isn't she? she's like anyone isn't she? -she's like us sort of thing, you know? -i mean, here's me saying smelly bum, you know ! +she's like us sort of thing, you know? +i mean, here's me saying smelly bum, you know ! even, even, even no, but even more radiation! -than that, i mean i mean, i'm not being nasty but i mean look at our hairdo's! -i mean we're not exactly , well i'm so worried about you know +than that, i mean i mean, i'm not being nasty but i mean look at our hairdo's! +i mean we're not exactly , well i'm so worried about you know yeah. how i look just at this second or anything! yeah, but she does doesn't she? -i know, but like she says, she's hair and everything isn't she? -and all her make up and she got and she's really pretty really +i know, but like she says, she's hair and everything isn't she? +and all her make up and she got and she's really pretty really yeah. isn't she? she is actually. -pete said she pete said he'd give her one! +pete said she pete said he'd give her one! and i said, oh god i wouldn't! -and i to also admitted to him that i +and i to also admitted to him that i have yo , have yo female. have you heard about the wallet fiasco? @@ -87199,28 +87131,28 @@ no. oh yes, i did! yes. shall i bring it on saturday? -and i just went mm! +and i just went mm! yeah. ha! -and i knew exactly what it was you they were talking about! +and i knew exactly what it was you they were talking about! what she was talking about! -but do you know i went why? +but do you know i went why? why did i do that? -why am i +why am i honestly, they don't care! ah! but i knew exactly that he was talking about me and i thought what? -and i goes but i had to, i had to, i goes why? -and he goes well i've got some money in it! +and i goes but i had to, i had to, i goes why? +and he goes well i've got some money in it! i've got my visa card in it! i goes why pete, really evilly! mm. -and he went and he went well what do you think? -and i just went jesus!! -i was just so ooh! +and he went and he went well what do you think? +and i just went jesus!! +i was just so ooh! i just think, oh no what am i gonna do now? -well just tell him no. +well just tell him no. unless you want to? couldn't really leave it. @@ -87229,7 +87161,7 @@ no. would? no. not really. -but clare is going like i told clare about it. +but clare is going like i told clare about it. is she coming to the party? i don't know. it depends really does , cos joe said something about it depends if her boyfriend's got any money to come up or something or @@ -87243,25 +87175,25 @@ having a butchers! shall i turn the light off so you can see? no, it's okay i can see. oh no! -shame of all shame, it's my brother and steve and sam across +shame of all shame, it's my brother and steve and sam across and i'm just staring out the window ! see if they wave back. -yes, my brother is waving back even though he's ! +yes, my brother is waving back even though he's ! oh! god! oh! why is he -why is he hanging round steven again? +why is he hanging round steven again? he must be sad character, and that's the only reason why! sad character! -erm i tell you what it's dead windy outside! +erm i tell you what it's dead windy outside! it is yeah. really, really windy! that's why i've got my hair like this! so have i. while i was taking the dog out. -i put mine like this and that's why it hasn't stayed very well actually ! +i put mine like this and that's why it hasn't stayed very well actually ! do you wanna poster? what of? u 2. @@ -87272,7 +87204,7 @@ yeah! if you don't want it? yeah, have it! thanks. -i tell, i put i tell you where i put that where i used to have my erm my berlin wall poster. +i tell, i put i tell you where i put that where i used to have my erm my berlin wall poster. oh you're taking that which down? @@ -87285,22 +87217,22 @@ no. i'll put that up there. that's great! thanks. -and then i can take that down, that flipping marilyn steven, the really ugly just seventeen model! +and then i can take that down, that flipping marilyn steven, the really ugly just seventeen model! have you seen that one? -i'm not joking, this must have had collars and right mm,! +i'm not joking, this must have had collars and right mm,! ! oh dear! -but erm oh what was i gonna say? -oh they're all about malcolm bless you! +but erm oh what was i gonna say? +oh they're all about malcolm bless you! i couldn't believe clare though! horny bloke! -cos she goes erm she goes i told her right and she goes well you're going to aren't you? +cos she goes erm she goes i told her right and she goes well you're going to aren't you? i goes what? -she goes, she goes well you might say that now but when you actually get there you'll really want to. -and er i goes you know, i was a bit, i was a bit shocked really, cos like +she goes, she goes well you might say that now but when you actually get there you'll really want to. +and er i goes you know, i was a bit, i was a bit shocked really, cos like yeah. clare's never told me that she'd done anything with stuart. -you er but when we were talking about this she told me that +you er but when we were talking about this she told me that yeah. he'd asked her to go on the pill. yeah. @@ -87308,19 +87240,19 @@ and has she? no. she didn't want to! so she's not going to. -but erm i'd, i don't but like chat to her cos she's, honestly she's such a nice person and like +but erm i'd, i don't but like chat to her cos she's, honestly she's such a nice person and like mm. -she's one of them people who she might be a little bit like hard to talk to at first +she's one of them people who she might be a little bit like hard to talk to at first mm. -but if you like, just go absolutely crazy like i do! +but if you like, just go absolutely crazy like i do! cos she's used to me being crazy ! yeah. -like going ooh, ooh!, you know ! +like going ooh, ooh!, you know ! you know the way i do. -the way you do like. -and er ah, she'll be alright. +the way you do like. +and er ah, she'll be alright. yeah, if i mean, if she comes in everyone'll be fine with her won't they? -i mean flipping two sips of cider and i'm anybodys! +i mean flipping two sips of cider and i'm anybodys! have me in the bathroom if she wants me! ooh er look! but er @@ -87328,12 +87260,12 @@ give her a blow job ! what do did you catch that one ? do think they'll work it out? -oh dear, so like i say i'd you know chat, you know chat away to her because i +oh dear, so like i say i'd you know chat, you know chat away to her because i yeah. think, cos she really wants to come but like yeah. i mean -she's she's such a swot it's unbelievable ! +she's she's such a swot it's unbelievable ! dear oh me! i mean, she reckons i'm a swot, and i reckon she's a swot, you know! it's really funny! @@ -87345,45 +87277,45 @@ even a cassette recorder! hello darling! but er ah dear! -i hope she does come actually cos like she's a real good laugh. +i hope she does come actually cos like she's a real good laugh. yeah. you know, she's really nice! -and an anyway i wanna get her drunk and chop all her hair off so she's looks hideously ugly! +and an anyway i wanna get her drunk and chop all her hair off so she's looks hideously ugly! i know, her hair's gorgeous isn't it? mm. she's so pretty as well! could not believe it! -rachel come up to me today, she's deadly serious, you know like lovely gorgeous ginger hair! +rachel come up to me today, she's deadly serious, you know like lovely gorgeous ginger hair! no. you must of seen her round town. well she's got the most gorgeous ginger hair! really thick, quite long, bit longer than mine. i don't know her but -it is really nice and like, she's the most gorgeous looking girl you've seen in your life! +it is really nice and like, she's the most gorgeous looking girl you've seen in your life! i've probably, i've probably seen her but i've, i've talked about her haven't i? mm. about rachel. -i've heard the name. -and erm come up to me today and she goes have you got any scissors? -i goes no why? +i've heard the name. +and erm come up to me today and she goes have you got any scissors? +i goes no why? oh it doesn't matter. she walked to zeena, zeena got any scissors? -no why do you want them? +no why do you want them? so, oh it doesn't matter. oh come on rach , come on tell us, you know! -she's going i wanna cut my hair. +she's going i wanna cut my hair. and she was deadly serious! i'm going, no you're not, don't be stupid! she gone, i've had enough of it, it's really getting me down! i thought, and she was really depressed about it! oh my god! -but like, mr really really bad like maths teacher, he goes erm he goes to , she goes to him the other day oh you're only picking on me cos i got ginger hair! +but like, mr really really bad like maths teacher, he goes erm he goes to , she goes to him the other day oh you're only picking on me cos i got ginger hair! yeah, you're right i am! and he was being really nasty! -and i thought, i was thinking god that is really, really nasty that is! -but like then er, she, she just turned round to him and she goes tell you what, i would really, really, love it if you woke up tomorrow and you had ginger hair, cos that'd really, really give you a dose of your own medicine! -then then er and he was going, oh don't be childish rachel and all this! +and i thought, i was thinking god that is really, really nasty that is! +but like then er, she, she just turned round to him and she goes tell you what, i would really, really, love it if you woke up tomorrow and you had ginger hair, cos that'd really, really give you a dose of your own medicine! +then then er and he was going, oh don't be childish rachel and all this! and, it's nothing to do with that! and she goes, oh yeah, as if you'd know! and like, he's really getting her down! @@ -87393,16 +87325,16 @@ i mean, i'd kill for hair that colour! i think if you've got a really nice colour ging , you can have, either have a hideous colour ginger yeah. or a really, really nice! -no, but she has got like, it's that it's dark ginger. +no, but she has got like, it's that it's dark ginger. mm. dark gingery-red, it's gorgeous! -like, it's not it's not ginger, it's sort of like auburn. +like, it's not it's not ginger, it's sort of like auburn. rusty. rusty auburn. mm. oh it's gorgeous! it's really nice! -well you see that you see, she probably looks at it every day and thinks, oh hideous! +well you see that you see, she probably looks at it every day and thinks, oh hideous! yeah. but, you see, you see it every day and think, ah that's so lovely! ah that's so gorgeous! @@ -87412,7 +87344,7 @@ i mean like yeah. you don't want what you've got do you? no. -i wake up every morning and think, oh my god it's that acne! +i wake up every morning and think, oh my god it's that acne! mm. oh, got up. @@ -87432,7 +87364,7 @@ two. and i would not even notice one spot! not even the one in the middle of my forehead? no! -i tell you what i noticed when you first walked in you got you got thick eyeliner on, that's what i noticed. +i tell you what i noticed when you first walked in you got you got thick eyeliner on, that's what i noticed. yeah. before anything else. thick eyeliner on the top of my eyes, i don't wear eyeliner on the bottom just in case you think i'm a tart! @@ -87442,106 +87374,106 @@ i must be bad! you're talking to a tape recorder now em ! i know. i've done it before! -oh gee, tomorrow right, mum has gone to me the other day oh, there's this woman at bridge she wants someone to baby-sit for her on wednesday nights. +oh gee, tomorrow right, mum has gone to me the other day oh, there's this woman at bridge she wants someone to baby-sit for her on wednesday nights. do want, do you wanna, you interested? and i said, yeah alright then, you know, fair enough. -so she goes well she reckons it'll be a good idea if you went up to meet the little lad, he's only six, he's called mark. -i thought oh alright, fair enough. -she's goes, oh she's gonna phone thursday night, she phoned me tonight oh i'll pick you up at half four is that alright? -i thought, yeah, fair enough she goes, we can go and pick him up from the child-minder and then er you can come for some tea and you'll be home by about half seven! +so she goes well she reckons it'll be a good idea if you went up to meet the little lad, he's only six, he's called mark. +i thought oh alright, fair enough. +she's goes, oh she's gonna phone thursday night, she phoned me tonight oh i'll pick you up at half four is that alright? +i thought, yeah, fair enough she goes, we can go and pick him up from the child-minder and then er you can come for some tea and you'll be home by about half seven! oh fucking hell! no way! i mean, cor blimey, i've never seen the woman or the kid before in my life! mm. i mean, i don't mind going up to their house, sitting down having a cup of tea and biscuit -difficult situation or whatever! and saying oh yes, hello mark! +difficult situation or whatever! and saying oh yes, hello mark! are you going to read me a story and show me your bedroom? oh goodo right, well, better be off then,bye ! but like she must be really picky if she's doing that! i know! -but mum said like she's she's divorced so sh , she's forty she's got like a six year old kid and the kid is really brainy! +but mum said like she's she's divorced so sh , she's forty she's got like a six year old kid and the kid is really brainy! and i'm sort of thinking, oh my god, modern woman! mm. modern woman with modern brainy kid! and that she's got and thinking oh my god this kid's gonna be better than me! -yeah, she's got this gentleman friend. +yeah, she's got this gentleman friend. oh yeah. -he takes her out and spoils her rotten like! -and she wanted me to baby-sit last, like, last no, what day is it today? +he takes her out and spoils her rotten like! +and she wanted me to baby-sit last, like, last no, what day is it today? thursday. mm. yeah , tonight. -and erm but like, she wasn't gonna be back till quarter past eleven! +and erm but like, she wasn't gonna be back till quarter past eleven! i mean, i don't mind that but you know what my mum's like? so er i wouldn't do it in the week. i mean, i'd mean i'd do it, in a week -yeah, that's what , that's what she said, the woman going well i suppose that's a bit late in the week really, she's got school the next day? +yeah, that's what , that's what she said, the woman going well i suppose that's a bit late in the week really, she's got school the next day? and mum just goes, yeah. she goes, well i didn't know if you'd wanna do it so i just said that. -and you know er but she goes like, she's like, like she said to me, once you've done it once she'll expect you to do it again, and again! -and like, it's alright say like, once every so often but like once or twice -a week or whatever in, like staying out late, cos that means i wouldn't be back till like, quarter to twelve! +and you know er but she goes like, she's like, like she said to me, once you've done it once she'll expect you to do it again, and again! +and like, it's alright say like, once every so often but like once or twice +a week or whatever in, like staying out late, cos that means i wouldn't be back till like, quarter to twelve! and get ready for bed it's too much , yeah! it's too much isn't it? -but like erm my mum was saying, you know she's like she's got a, definitely got a good job and like, the kids really sort of +but like erm my mum was saying, you know she's like she's got a, definitely got a good job and like, the kids really sort of you get, are you alright? comfortable? yeah. -sh , he's really sort of like, dead brainy and goes to the child-minder and goes to school and whatever! -but like erm she said like, he's a really good kid. +sh , he's really sort of like, dead brainy and goes to the child-minder and goes to school and whatever! +but like erm she said like, he's a really good kid. well mm. -i mean well i thought to myself, god what a life! -i mean, i know it's not her fault but like, every wednesday she has all the people from the college bridge go to her house to play bridge. +i mean well i thought to myself, god what a life! +i mean, i know it's not her fault but like, every wednesday she has all the people from the college bridge go to her house to play bridge. i mean the kid's poor kid! just sat there on the sofa! i mean, okay, he goes to bed about, what, eight o'clock or whatever? -but like, i mean god, do you know i'd really hate that! -i mean, i used to hate it with like having flipping anyone come up to our house when i was little! +but like, i mean god, do you know i'd really hate that! +i mean, i used to hate it with like having flipping anyone come up to our house when i was little! yeah. i remember, i remember once apparently his mum's hardly there! -because the baby-sitter she's got at the moment right she said she doesn't mind doing mondays, tuesdays and fridays as well as the weekends but she doesn't wanna do every day each week. +because the baby-sitter she's got at the moment right she said she doesn't mind doing mondays, tuesdays and fridays as well as the weekends but she doesn't wanna do every day each week. ma , how much does she go out? i mean, god, the poor kid i feel really sorry for him! yeah! -i mean ooh! -that's why she's asked me to do it, but like i said to mum you know, i'm not gonna say to her, oh yeah i'll do it whenever you want, i'll say like they're gonna do this extra course on wednesday nights and she said, like unless she could get a baby-sitter she couldn't go which is the reason i'm doing it. +i mean ooh! +that's why she's asked me to do it, but like i said to mum you know, i'm not gonna say to her, oh yeah i'll do it whenever you want, i'll say like they're gonna do this extra course on wednesday nights and she said, like unless she could get a baby-sitter she couldn't go which is the reason i'm doing it. so like just say you'll do it wednesday night. -yeah say i can do it wednesday nights, apart from that, you know it's too bad sort of thing! -so i think i'm gonna change my nights this, of staying in to either mo , monday and wednesday or tuesday and wednesday something like that. +yeah say i can do it wednesday nights, apart from that, you know it's too bad sort of thing! +so i think i'm gonna change my nights this, of staying in to either mo , monday and wednesday or tuesday and wednesday something like that. i don't know really! -but like, like erm that'd be quite good because if i go to someone else 's house like, you don't wanna be sort of like, messing about with all, all the stuff, you haven't got anything to mess about with, do your hair or whatever can you? +but like, like erm that'd be quite good because if i go to someone else 's house like, you don't wanna be sort of like, messing about with all, all the stuff, you haven't got anything to mess about with, do your hair or whatever can you? no. mess around with your make up. -so i can get loads of homework done and erm like i can count that as one of my nights in. +so i can get loads of homework done and erm like i can count that as one of my nights in. mm. -so that'll be quite useful i reckon really as well as getting a bit of money. -well, oh my mum's having such a fit about like on our er, exam leads like er she goes to me this morning, like my da , her and my dad were talking about it she is saying, and she'll do it! +so that'll be quite useful i reckon really as well as getting a bit of money. +well, oh my mum's having such a fit about like on our er, exam leads like er she goes to me this morning, like my da , her and my dad were talking about it she is saying, and she'll do it! cos me yeah. and my, my, me and my brother are gonna be off at the same time yeah. -like be doing his a levels and that she's saying that she's gonna take both of our stereos, lock them in the, lock them in the shed all day, take +like be doing his a levels and that she's saying that she's gonna take both of our stereos, lock them in the, lock them in the shed all day, take mm. -the keys with her and take the er, plug off the telly so we've got nothing to occupy us! +the keys with her and take the er, plug off the telly so we've got nothing to occupy us! and she's serious as well! mm. -because we're both such weak willed people, honestly! +because we're both such weak willed people, honestly! same as me. -i mean, i've got a, i've got a french homework that was due in today told mrs i'd left my book at home, i accidentally bought the wrong book! -so she goes, i want it first thing tomorrow morning, and i mean like this is talking like, we're talking major here! +i mean, i've got a, i've got a french homework that was due in today told mrs i'd left my book at home, i accidentally bought the wrong book! +so she goes, i want it first thing tomorrow morning, and i mean like this is talking like, we're talking major here! mm. -and like i started doing it, i'll read it out in english i started writing it in french came to a word i didn't know and thought ah leave it! +and like i started doing it, i'll read it out in english i started writing it in french came to a word i didn't know and thought ah leave it! and i've left it now! mm. -so like i'll go in, half nine i'll get a drink, you know sit down, look out the window, see if scott's in, phone him up if he is say helloee darling! +so like i'll go in, half nine i'll get a drink, you know sit down, look out the window, see if scott's in, phone him up if he is say helloee darling! ah, erm by the way i'm not pregnant ! god this subject keeps coming up doesn't it? @@ -87549,18 +87481,18 @@ i'm gonna oh! get dead bored now! whoever it is that's listening to our interesting conversation! -don't you reckon that'd be dead boring though, i mean i mean +don't you reckon that'd be dead boring though, i mean i mean , i know, but like, i thought i bet they're looking forward to this tape ! -yeah but like think about it, first, i mean the first couple of tapes of people like saying oh yeah, so then we had sex, and then we gave him a blow job! +yeah but like think about it, first, i mean the first couple of tapes of people like saying oh yeah, so then we had sex, and then we gave him a blow job! yeah but i mean and then he licked me out while we're on the phone! oh god ! emma, you sound so crude! but i mean the twelfth -of the third ninety two. +of the third ninety two. ninety two. well done dear! what time did you start recording this side of the tape? @@ -87569,12 +87501,12 @@ nine. twenty five past! god! they're big tapes aren't they? -i thought it was only supposed to be forty five minutes long? -nine twenty five p m ready. +i thought it was only supposed to be forty five minutes long? +nine twenty five p m ready. ready. this is gonna get really tedious after a bit isn't it? i know, it's gonna be totally boring isn't it? -er chatting +er chatting chatting with friends at home! with friend. i wonder who's gonna go through all these tapes? @@ -87587,54 +87519,54 @@ i hope you're not female? i don't mind if you're female at all! i'm not, i'm not, i'm not , i'm not quite like that! i am! -er who spoke first? +er who spoke first? i can't remember! i think it was me. no it wasn't it was me cos i was saying that if yo , if your pen didn't work. oh, emma. oh, i was the one saying if you're pen doesn't work and my name's emma dearest! -er student. +er student. student. anyway, what was i gonna say? oh yeah, i reckon all grannies are gonna be taping this they're the only with loads of spare time, we're just doing this for a laugh! mm. but i mean it's gonna be dead boring though isn't it? -listening to them complaining about the usual stuff! -yeah so i reckon whoever's doing this i, i bet whoever gets this tape, i bet there's fighting over this tape! -i bet there is cos no one else will talk +listening to them complaining about the usual stuff! +yeah so i reckon whoever's doing this i, i bet whoever gets this tape, i bet there's fighting over this tape! +i bet there is cos no one else will talk yeah. bj's or anything! are you listening to that, then? bj's ! oh god! i think that's . -did a did erm anyone tell you about james's dad? +did a did erm anyone tell you about james's dad? james? you know james ? -his dad's called his dad's called barry. +his dad's called his dad's called barry. yeah. -you must know james 's dad. +you must know james 's dad. the one we were hiding from at the fair. oh! remember him? no. he goes, well anyway, he's this like, really really mad bloke! -he goes to er, ian and like, ian's gone to him, oh hello mr , you know, and he's gone ooh, don't call me mr , he's from wales you see! +he goes to er, ian and like, ian's gone to him, oh hello mr , you know, and he's gone ooh, don't call me mr , he's from wales you see! he's not welsh ooh! or anything! yeah, he is, he's welsh. -i wouldn't put on an accent because they're cha , they're they're trying to well never mind! +i wouldn't put on an accent because they're cha , they're they're trying to well never mind! oh okay. who cares! i'll put on my accent anyway. thinking i'm welsh! -he goes oh, don't call me mr , call me b j! +he goes oh, don't call me mr , call me b j! ah no! -and like, there's +and like, there's it is, yeah! -and like, ian was just, cos he's like barry and ian was just sort of stood there going oh my god, i'm gonna laugh! +and like, ian was just, cos he's like barry and ian was just sort of stood there going oh my god, i'm gonna laugh! ah oh! did i tell you whe , when i went to the opticians? @@ -87645,13 +87577,13 @@ he was the most unbelievable person i've ever met in my life! oh! oh yes, he was wasn't he? oh god! -my brother went my brother went yesterday as well. +my brother went my brother went yesterday as well. gotta have glasses? well he could have some done. yeah. cos he, he couldn't read the bottom two lines. -oh yeah, that's good though, and i can't read the top two lines ! -you know well what can you see with your left eye? +oh yeah, that's good though, and i can't read the top two lines ! +you know well what can you see with your left eye? erm erm h @@ -87659,69 +87591,69 @@ nothing! ha ha ha ! oh! ian's so funny! -but erm yeah. -i dunno where to take this next, shall i take it downstairs and yeah well, my half on this is stinted. quite interesting. +but erm yeah. +i dunno where to take this next, shall i take it downstairs and yeah well, my half on this is stinted. quite interesting. cos we all just sit there and watch telly and we don't talk! we had a, we had a really goo , it's a pity you weren't here earlier actually cos we had a stu , a nice conversation about politics. -oh, my dad kept going shhh i'm trying to watch the football all the time! -and i was cos i had, i had a massive argument with vicky about party politics! +oh, my dad kept going shhh i'm trying to watch the football all the time! +and i was cos i had, i had a massive argument with vicky about party politics! right, cos she's such a selfish conservative bitch ! mm. yeah. -going well, i don't care why should we have to pay for all those poor people! +going well, i don't care why should we have to pay for all those poor people! that can't keep jobs! oh i put down clive! oh he really makes me mad he does! -me an , me and natalie were having a real bad go at him! -sort of going just cos daddy'll sort you out then! +me an , me and natalie were having a real bad go at him! +sort of going just cos daddy'll sort you out then! yeah! oh god! oh he drives me mad sometimes! -it like sh , i couldn't believe it she was she's so conservative! -she sat there going well why should we have to pay for poor people who can't be bothered to get jobs, they're so lazy! +it like sh , i couldn't believe it she was she's so conservative! +she sat there going well why should we have to pay for poor people who can't be bothered to get jobs, they're so lazy! oh yeah, like there's a load of and i like, i jobs going round! honestly, yeah! -i was going absolutely eppy this is in the middle of class, i was going eppy and she goes and i goes, oh yes just cos daddy's got a very nice car and you live in inkborough like this! +i was going absolutely eppy this is in the middle of class, i was going eppy and she goes and i goes, oh yes just cos daddy's got a very nice car and you live in inkborough like this! yeah. -and i was hon , i just went so mad! -and everyone in the whole class julian julian +and i was hon , i just went so mad! +and everyone in the whole class julian julian mm. was going to me, hey helena calm down! -and i was going no i won't calm down ! -and i was screaming by this time and miss goes oh be quiet everybody! +and i was going no i won't calm down ! +and i was screaming by this time and miss goes oh be quiet everybody! mm, yes you're hard, i'm really scared! ma , it's like, it's like -my dad this morning he woke me up by pulling me up by the hair, bashing my face into the pillow a couple of times, i just looked at, then go, and i looked at him +my dad this morning he woke me up by pulling me up by the hair, bashing my face into the pillow a couple of times, i just looked at, then go, and i looked at him got a comb anywhere? comb? -even if it's one of those tremmy pretend combs you get with a barbie doll, oh this'll do! +even if it's one of those tremmy pretend combs you get with a barbie doll, oh this'll do! don't know what it is, but it'll do! -hope you haven't brushed anything pervy with this one! +hope you haven't brushed anything pervy with this one! pubes! oh yes i'm always brushing my pubes! oh, i know ! how did you know? . that's my pu , pube comb! -well you've gotta admit, it does look it does look like one of them sort of things ! +well you've gotta admit, it does look it does look like one of them sort of things ! have you, have you seen what pubes,? yeah ! oh goodo ! erm, anyway, what was i saying? -oh yeah, and i just looked up from the pillow and went oh, watch me shiver! +oh yeah, and i just looked up from the pillow and went oh, watch me shiver! in a very sarcastic voice ! -oh did you see erm mary +oh did you see erm mary no. whitehouse the other day? -no, i missed it , but your get on with it anyway! +no, i missed it , but your get on with it anyway! ooh wasn't that weird it sprays at once! i like this, it smells nice! i think it smells awful actually! ah, i think it smells really nice! -naomi always wears that. +naomi always wears that. can smell ! well at least i ain't got b o! this is disgusting! @@ -87733,18 +87665,18 @@ you know,touch my pen! was there a minute ago wasn't it? ah, here it is! oh it's on the floor! -emma the hero finds it again! +emma the hero finds it again! oh dear! love can i say ! what time you gotta be in? -i, i haven't actually got to be in at any time except i did say i'd be in at half nine. +i, i haven't actually got to be in at any time except i did say i'd be in at half nine. oh! oh, it's half nine now! oh ha! slap my thigh! you look really worried though emma! you look like you're about to rush home! -oh dear i must rush home because it's half past nine and i'm going to get told off +oh dear i must rush home because it's half past nine and i'm going to get told off ah ! for being late! i've just missed red dwarf! @@ -87752,8 +87684,8 @@ oh never mind! oh oh oh go ho od! what? missed red dwarf! -never mind you see mister tape recorder person. -they're coming in ah ! +never mind you see mister tape recorder person. +they're coming in ah ! i'm suffering a lot though! you've caused us to miss red dwarf! cos we just enjoy talking to you so much! @@ -87763,23 +87695,23 @@ so you're dad won't call you a tart! actually, he shouldn't be in. listen, listen to your oh well! -lucky you're lucky, i'm not pregnant penny. +lucky you're lucky, i'm not pregnant penny. yeah ! -right at the end of somewhere. -lucky i'm not pregnant powder case! +right at the end of somewhere. +lucky i'm not pregnant powder case! oh dear! -well are you going to leave that on? +well are you going to leave that on? no i'm turn it back. gonna switch it off? cheerio then darling! cheerio then man! oh dear! bye! -sam shut up! +sam shut up! so this means i gotta walk home all on my little own-some? pardon? this means i gotta walk home all on my own-some? -yeah, well it'll be erm at little bit light anyway won't it? +yeah, well it'll be erm at little bit light anyway won't it? what? it'll be light. light? @@ -87791,28 +87723,28 @@ actually! what have you today? what lessons? mm. -graphics er maths, science english and r e. +graphics er maths, science english and r e. what did you miss the other day? when you was off? . oh, a few other things. -i've caught, i've caught up on most of it i've got to copy up some maths but i'll, i'll borrow someone's book this weekend. +i've caught, i've caught up on most of it i've got to copy up some maths but i'll, i'll borrow someone's book this weekend. cos i won't have any homework cos i did that homework last night. what, for the weekend? what? -no, but she won't give you two sets of homework other. +no, but she won't give you two sets of homework other. what the , maths homework you mean? yeah. -so i'll be able to borrow somebody's book and copy that. +so i'll be able to borrow somebody's book and copy that. it's only algebra anyway! the stuff i was doing last night. shouldn't be too bad. -is joanne and emma coming to sleep on saturday night? +is joanne and emma coming to sleep on saturday night? yeah. where are you going to sleep? -down there in the front room. -well, we might as well i mean it's just easiest place really. -and that yo can keep the dog and cat upstairs a bit can't we? +down there in the front room. +well, we might as well i mean it's just easiest place really. +and that yo can keep the dog and cat upstairs a bit can't we? if he'll go. if he'll go. he won't be very happy if everybody's down here and he's up there! @@ -87822,7 +87754,7 @@ i know, but he always sits on emma and ! don't she like it? used to it. -i mean, i don't mind it if he comes and sits by me well they're not used to him you see. +i mean, i don't mind it if he comes and sits by me well they're not used to him you see. they're not used to little sammy! shush up! wimps. @@ -87836,7 +87768,7 @@ i'm not quite forty two yet! soon! i will be. but not yet! -pardon me boy da doo dee doo doo doo . +pardon me boy da doo dee doo doo doo . are you going into town then tomorrow? or to @@ -87849,41 +87781,41 @@ haven't made up my mind yet ! i never make up my mind until about what about? half twelve tonight. -what about shrimpy, have they got over his tantrums? +what about shrimpy, have they got over his tantrums? oh i think so. -he, he's just he picks someone to have a go at! +he, he's just he picks someone to have a go at! so he's been having at yeah. pete has he? he's been having a go at pete. -and it's a bit, it's a bit nasty of him really cos when, like, all this thing was with emma and everything pete was the one that was really nice to him! +and it's a bit, it's a bit nasty of him really cos when, like, all this thing was with emma and everything pete was the one that was really nice to him! mm. -he's always taking it out on them i noticed! +he's always taking it out on them i noticed! yeah. what we having for tea? chicken. i can see it's chicken ! chicken what? -chicken and er rice. -well, what we normally have you know, in the sauce and that. +chicken and er rice. +well, what we normally have you know, in the sauce and that. yeah. -i wouldn't know the posh name! +i wouldn't know the posh name! chicken chasseur. if you like! -emma was the happiest i've seen her in about two weeks! +emma was the happiest i've seen her in about two weeks! she was er she said her brother wasn't getting on didn't she? yeah. -when she came to the door and i i didn't know whether to invite her in or not like i went come in and,an she like, looked at me and i goes,don't ask ! +when she came to the door and i i didn't know whether to invite her in or not like i went come in and,an she like, looked at me and i goes,don't ask ! well it wouldn't matter if they were ? what? -it wasn't it was a bit strange, a bit naughty! -well erm i think it's dead interesting actually! +it wasn't it was a bit strange, a bit naughty! +well erm i think it's dead interesting actually! oh! -something in a bit of sex. -different things, and i remember the woman came round the other day about drinking whisky. +something in a bit of sex. +different things, and i remember the woman came round the other day about drinking whisky. on a sunday she came! -mind you, i mean, we got no whisky anyway so i said she's looking for somebody who erm drinks at erm a spot of whisky. +mind you, i mean, we got no whisky anyway so i said she's looking for somebody who erm drinks at erm a spot of whisky. i says, oh sorry you've come we don't drink whisky. she says, not even at christmas? i says no. @@ -87895,13 +87827,13 @@ she wanted to see dad. she should have gone to see uncle alan he's and alcy er she'll go and drink shri er, not drink shrimpy! -er go and see shrimpy. +er go and see shrimpy. does he drink like that? he's always drinking whisky! ha! that'll rot his innards then! aha. -oh dave let me! +oh dave let me! got a letter david? have you got a letter? yeah. @@ -87914,9 +87846,9 @@ is it from nottingham? cheltenham. not bristol then? is it? -oh it is -apparently that's all that's from there actually. -there, in that that picasse or whatever it's called! +oh it is +apparently that's all that's from there actually. +there, in that that picasse or whatever it's called! oh dear! rejected. this is nothing! @@ -87934,18 +87866,18 @@ oh well! never mind! never mind! try and get in bristol somewhere. -make it weird is that what +make it weird is that what no this is from you said? -no this is from er sunderland. +no this is from er sunderland. the fourteenth place b a! -from at least two g c s e's g c e o level. +from at least two g c s e's g c e o level. you get a b a from that mum! b a honours degree, yeah. flipping hell! mm! -bit of yes? +bit of yes? my brother a b a, yes! and i spent ages ! that's a shame! @@ -87954,70 +87886,70 @@ probably got too many people. probably filled the course already. yeah. and it is a popular place. -probably thought hoh oh, we're not having him! +probably thought hoh oh, we're not having him! oh no! hoh oh no! -a from lincoln no ! +a from lincoln no ! can't have that! fourteen points. that's a shame weren't it? yeah but mind you, bristol's popular isn't it? yeah. -i'll just wait to see what turns up. +i'll just wait to see what turns up. don't that dog ever shut up! oh shut up! alright! i do to. oh! well that's a disappointing isn't it? -yeah, well you ca -you're bound to get in one of them somewhere. -but all the poly's have accepted me still +yeah, well you ca +you're bound to get in one of them somewhere. +but all the poly's have accepted me still who? -haven't heard from bristol -bristol , bristol +haven't heard from bristol +bristol , bristol yeah. -and what's that one what came? +and what's that one what came? what? this one? -er, fourteen points erm +er, fourteen points erm about three d's this. no. -the two er +the two er ah yes, you see, that's sunderland i mean that's up in the james goes there. back country isn't it? but, the accommodation will be cheaper. yes i know, but it's such a long way to get up there!isn't it? i mean, he's not exactly travelling everyday is he? -well no, but you still got to pay to get up there and get back on ! +well no, but you still got to pay to get up there and get back on ! see what i mean. i told you it'd be chicken chasseur! erh -you're dead disappointed aren't you mum ? +you're dead disappointed aren't you mum ? i liked that one!. ha ha ha ! -mind you wou , oh you couldn't! +mind you wou , oh you couldn't! what? -well i mean if, if it was full and they didn't all get the +well i mean if, if it was full and they didn't all get the oh yeah, if erm -you know, qualifications for it, like wha , what would happen then? -well on the a lot of places like, they advertise in papers and stuff for the places that are still open, places that are still open. -like, and you phone up and you can get in. -well i mean, it's not necessarily to say that you know, that they +you know, qualifications for it, like wha , what would happen then? +well on the a lot of places like, they advertise in papers and stuff for the places that are still open, places that are still open. +like, and you phone up and you can get in. +well i mean, it's not necessarily to say that you know, that they mm. are all going to get it is it? no. -i knew that one as soon as i saw that it was from that is was a reject one. -well you got that other one from didn't you? -i thought what was that er south , southampton or portsmouth or something? +i knew that one as soon as i saw that it was from that is was a reject one. +well you got that other one from didn't you? +i thought what was that er south , southampton or portsmouth or something? and portsmouth portsmouth -wa was straight from picasse but picasse don't necessarily send out just depends on whether the poly's send out to them as well. +wa was straight from picasse but picasse don't necessarily send out just depends on whether the poly's send out to them as well. but oh! -they sent me erm or sent me a load a load of material with it. +they sent me erm or sent me a load a load of material with it. i really wish that they wouldn't do that though! oh dear! pasties! @@ -88031,46 +87963,46 @@ that no. you know, if you and york isn't. -i suppose it's a mile round trip. +i suppose it's a mile round trip. twenty five pound up on the train, return! return. -so thirty five. -that's really clear ! +so thirty five. +that's really clear ! as well! ! -god this dog is ! +god this dog is ! well i hope bristol accept me now. why who have you got? you got sam! -just york and aberystwyth. +just york and aberystwyth. hull. -oh, aberystwyth yeah. -but this is this is one of the most popular ones in the country so +oh, aberystwyth yeah. +but this is this is one of the most popular ones in the country so what nottingham? yeah. -it's got very high arts intake as well. +it's got very high arts intake as well. very high? -arts intake. +arts intake. oh! -like you know english, sociology and all that. +like you know english, sociology and all that. oh! so that'll be why it's full then? yeah. -you were you were late in sending it weren't you? +you were you were late in sending it weren't you? and that's because you were going to go . you might be, get a place. if you buck your ideas up! -and get a with that in. +and get a with that in. what's that supposed to mean? dog! what's that supposed to mean? you better get your exams! yeah. -but buck your ideas up? +but buck your ideas up? buck your ideas up? yeah. -i mean sort yourself out and +i mean sort yourself out and but i am sorted out! get on with it! instead of messing about! @@ -88085,39 +88017,39 @@ well when is it? next week. next week. -gizzmo keeps trying to persuade me to go with her but i don't really want to. -no i shouldn't worry +gizzmo keeps trying to persuade me to go with her but i don't really want to. +no i shouldn't worry cos er , she's gotta go cos her brother's in it. shouldn't you? -i thought about asking actually. -her brother's knuckles oh,he's huge! +i thought about asking actually. +her brother's knuckles oh,he's huge! he's only about five foot ! -a b and a c that is. -yeah, but a, it says a two i mean, if you get three then you can get nottingham couldn't +a b and a c that is. +yeah, but a, it says a two i mean, if you get three then you can get nottingham couldn't yeah. you? yeah. -well three c's must be over the points then. +well three c's must be over the points then. right -er -not like that feller yesterday said that really they can er they can refuse if you get +er +not like that feller yesterday said that really they can er they can refuse if you get well yeah! a di difference of their point stipulation oh, yeah. -and er their gra , grade stipulation so even if you got three a's they can still refuse you. -he said that he said it doesn't happen in york, but it has happened in some places you know. -i could understand them refusing you if they'd asked for say, a b in english and c in something else +and er their gra , grade stipulation so even if you got three a's they can still refuse you. +he said that he said it doesn't happen in york, but it has happened in some places you know. +i could understand them refusing you if they'd asked for say, a b in english and c in something else yes. and you got d in english and d in so , although it may not be the point, or c. yes. -because then you you wouldn't certainly up, be up to the standard would you? +because then you you wouldn't certainly up, be up to the standard would you? in that particular no. mm. -er particular thing. -but i suppose espec , like if you got really really good grades you'd be different to the group. -you know, say if they wanted to get you three c's and you got three a's shut up sam! -you could be lot a lot different to the group. +er particular thing. +but i suppose espec , like if you got really really good grades you'd be different to the group. +you know, say if they wanted to get you three c's and you got three a's shut up sam! +you could be lot a lot different to the group. the higher standard? yeah. mm. @@ -88136,39 +88068,39 @@ oh! is that alright? yes. oh! -didn't walk home with me cos i had to go i was and wa , was going to the other side. -how come the had the school photo in it? +didn't walk home with me cos i had to go i was and wa , was going to the other side. +how come the had the school photo in it? was it? -mu mine ! +mu mine ! i've got a bad habit of shouting like that today. -like in science today i goes oh for god! +like in science today i goes oh for god! ! what ? i got into i'll show you what? -i'm only saying thank you. +i'm only saying thank you. i know! this is really good! -doo doo and i took the best . +doo doo and i took the best . are we going up to york tonight? yeah. -we've got, we're going, ooh together now. -but as long as we've got can't enjoy myself, can't even have a fag, might as well have, not be going! -shouldn't have to worry cos she's +we've got, we're going, ooh together now. +but as long as we've got can't enjoy myself, can't even have a fag, might as well have, not be going! +shouldn't have to worry cos she's shhh! shh, oh don't else a man might come in . like, oh yeah i know he means ! -and dad goes, i'm i think i might only just have orange juice! +and dad goes, i'm i think i might only just have orange juice! besides , i mean i can't have a fag! i goes, can't i just have two on a friday? no you can't!, might as well not bother going then mighten i! -cos anyway! +cos anyway! especially if you can't have a fag! is she, you know, really bounced up about it? no, she just like, cos he's going down the club. -from high school kids, you know? -so i might make a trip to . +from high school kids, you know? +so i might make a trip to . mm. he's just too daft, cos he won't even let her have two! she hasn't had any since tuesday! @@ -88180,26 +88112,26 @@ yeah, but dad'll . ah! ah that's it, run back and tell everybody, run run! ah, like she always does! -yeah well i don't want gary , she's . +yeah well i don't want gary , she's . she must be! -instead of going like quarter past, goes oh go down, let's get boring now, yeah yeah! -i said, oh go a bit later then, i goes cos i'll make it quarter past seven i'm not sitting round for half an hour, not like kiddos +instead of going like quarter past, goes oh go down, let's get boring now, yeah yeah! +i said, oh go a bit later then, i goes cos i'll make it quarter past seven i'm not sitting round for half an hour, not like kiddos oh dear! -cos cos my mum and dad won't be able to get that cos my dad's working. +cos cos my mum and dad won't be able to get that cos my dad's working. well the outing's in that area the next day. ha!stay, stay, stay with ah haaa ! oh, had an exciting date at school today then? no. -i rushed last night, i did two of my geographies i did one of them this dinner time, and other he didn't ask for my book in! +i rushed last night, i did two of my geographies i did one of them this dinner time, and other he didn't ask for my book in! couldn't believe it! ha! -course, that was didn't want to come and she said oh they asked for it in so i just pretended i didn't i'd handed mine in and didn't say anything like, you know in ca like, cos i had to go and get them yesterday. -.flipping johnnie is coming tomorrow! +course, that was didn't want to come and she said oh they asked for it in so i just pretended i didn't i'd handed mine in and didn't say anything like, you know in ca like, cos i had to go and get them yesterday. +.flipping johnnie is coming tomorrow! and his laugh! tomorrow? thought he was coming sunday? no, tomorrow. -between two and four , cos i've got and do the papers tomorrow afternoon, they don't come till four, i do the papers about half four to half go out, you know quarter past five +between two and four , cos i've got and do the papers tomorrow afternoon, they don't come till four, i do the papers about half four to half go out, you know quarter past five still having over to me i'm going out tomorrow night though aren't you? @@ -88211,20 +88143,20 @@ and then it'll look as if i've hardly been . about half seven . is she pissed off ? we've gotta be going fairly early anyway. -she goes to me, oh how you getting to well i was hoping like, you'd take me, she goes, oh yes? +she goes to me, oh how you getting to well i was hoping like, you'd take me, she goes, oh yes? that's a surprise! and i goes will you? he goes yeah alright then. gonna take us down the square. -last night we were shopping, i wanted to go and get something cos i said to her right can you ? +last night we were shopping, i wanted to go and get something cos i said to her right can you ? can i spent all my money! yeah. -and he goes yeah alright then. +and he goes yeah alright then. what's wrong? -i goes, can you go and get and some beers, yeah cos otherwise, i should, you know you said lend us a pound, he goes yeah, i goes well you can yo he goes not a pound, one pound four p! +i goes, can you go and get and some beers, yeah cos otherwise, i should, you know you said lend us a pound, he goes yeah, i goes well you can yo he goes not a pound, one pound four p! i goes, well have . -he goes yeah alright then. -so he got me last nights, we're gonna have to go tomorrow so we'll have to go tonight now, gotta tell ! +he goes yeah alright then. +so he got me last nights, we're gonna have to go tomorrow so we'll have to go tonight now, gotta tell ! speak up a bit! what for? gotta get near the microphone! @@ -88244,35 +88176,35 @@ yeah. emma wants one. and all the tapes, and all the batteries and everything. yeah. -anyway so we're adding up -just don't think about it, i've got used to it now you know, so i'm not shy. -so you know he got something so he went, he went, he went, he went i think you give me, he goes, not one pound four, it's one pound it's gone up innit? +anyway so we're adding up +just don't think about it, i've got used to it now you know, so i'm not shy. +so you know he got something so he went, he went, he went, he went i think you give me, he goes, not one pound four, it's one pound it's gone up innit? i said oh yeah! one thirteen. -so no! +so no! they're not! -it was one it was one it was one eighteen, with the matches and everything so the matches +it was one it was one it was one eighteen, with the matches and everything so the matches where from? the matches are,, the matches are eight p, they always have been. oh yeah. -and then sti they've gone up to one ten now for . +and then sti they've gone up to one ten now for . mm! -so now he'll get all the drink tomorrow. -are a bit worse he said you know get some women. +so now he'll get all the drink tomorrow. +are a bit worse he said you know get some women. i don't know whether clare's coming or not. oh, why not? -because well she's got a load of work to do, she's such a swot it's unbelievable! -and her boyfriend's down and he's staying till sunday. +because well she's got a load of work to do, she's such a swot it's unbelievable! +and her boyfriend's down and he's staying till sunday. well why can't he come round here? what else are they gonna do? -i dunno but, she's gonna phone me up anyway. +i dunno but, she's gonna phone me up anyway. if she's coming, she's coming, if she's not, she's not! mm. oh good! but i'm not , i'm not bothered either way really! -yeah, i'm going to pat's on tuesday. +yeah, i'm going to pat's on tuesday. what for? -well,bozz at school had some free tickets the music's usually twot when you're given free tickets! +well,bozz at school had some free tickets the music's usually twot when you're given free tickets! on er, this something of luxembourg, i dunno,so oh! duke of luxembourg. @@ -88285,19 +88217,19 @@ anyway, so i think our well drama teacher might be in that! -well, he's given me a ticket and he's gonna give , loads of us going, there's about ten of us! -so we'll go, gonna go there for about seven, it starts at half seven come home that night. +well, he's given me a ticket and he's gonna give , loads of us going, there's about ten of us! +so we'll go, gonna go there for about seven, it starts at half seven come home that night. bit of doss you know! oh! well we're get you got -up town about seven i'll see if bozz's mum can take us and cathy's dad can bring us back cos dad's at work. -you know, we can walk round town a bit, you know and ahem! +up town about seven i'll see if bozz's mum can take us and cathy's dad can bring us back cos dad's at work. +you know, we can walk round town a bit, you know and ahem! yeah,that's , have another yes,, yes, that's right. -don't tear my shirt, oh sorry ! +don't tear my shirt, oh sorry ! i like that. -i get a real erm i've gotta take the dog out. +i get a real erm i've gotta take the dog out. right. look at my cold sores! ta they're not, they're not too bad actually. @@ -88326,10 +88258,10 @@ well like, upstairs! well i'm not gonna take it round, why? it's only gonna downstairs in the living room! . -right i'll, i'll ju ju i'll just pretend i'm listening to it. +right i'll, i'll ju ju i'll just pretend i'm listening to it. i'll take the things with me. -i'll just pretend i'm listening to it and i'll just put it on the side and just the switch the thing on they'll never know the difference. -the answer is so is he paying you? +i'll just pretend i'm listening to it and i'll just put it on the side and just the switch the thing on they'll never know the difference. +the answer is so is he paying you? about twenty five pound. do you? you kidding me or what? @@ -88355,7 +88287,7 @@ trust you to be number one! you cow! aha! that isn't fair! -i want money, i've, you re get blooming all that money a blooming week anyway, don't you! +i want money, i've, you re get blooming all that money a blooming week anyway, don't you! it's only a voucher from marks and sparks. oh. twenty five pounds worth. @@ -88364,7 +88296,7 @@ dunno,something for my mum . just for starters i should think. na , ahh! can't talk now i gotta stinging armpits! -what you at er you know that razor i've got? +what you at er you know that razor i've got? well i thought, well i can't be bothered to get , so i got it and i went chee chee! yeah, i sprayed my arms yesterday and i went takes all the ski , like top layer of skin off @@ -88372,8 +88304,8 @@ yeah. i was thinking, god, did it sting this morning? well, i'm kee , keep forgetting every so often and mm. -like it stings a bit. -you ought to get like erm soft and gentle it doesn't sting. +like it stings a bit. +you ought to get like erm soft and gentle it doesn't sting. it's not that though, it's cos you're not supposed to use it under your eyes, it's a flipping face shaver! oh, no, but i mean, it don't make any difference! yeah @@ -88388,16 +88320,16 @@ oh ! wasn't me , best impressed! so it is funny! it wasn't funny! -and all he kept doing was twisting my arm last night, and my leg bummer! +and all he kept doing was twisting my arm last night, and my leg bummer! ahhh ! no don't wanna put my name down! you've gotta have name, goes on the tape, you big girl! -i thought she said it was erm emma said that it was +i thought she said it was erm emma said that it was it's anonymous. well who's in that! that's not very anonymous is it ? yeah, but thi this, right just gets shoved with the tapes. -like, they don't know who it is i it's not, after they've taken it away it's no connection to me whatsoever, they don't where i'm +like, they don't know who it is i it's not, after they've taken it away it's no connection to me whatsoever, they don't where i'm do that. from at all. yeah, but you've got my name down there! @@ -88408,13 +88340,13 @@ emma? yeah. who else put in, what you? what's that say at the bottom bit? -friend no . +friend no . i'm not , put no friend of yours in that box! hello darling, is that tape six? i'm on tape six am i? no. -no, you're on, you're on that's only tape one side b. +no, you're on, you're on that's only tape one side b. oh! that's all i've got onto so far! you're, you're the @@ -88426,18 +88358,18 @@ i thought you weren't coming out last night? i wasn't! she came round here! tut ha ! -here's me, farting around with bloody shrimpy and andrew! +here's me, farting around with bloody shrimpy and andrew! da doo doo doo . -ah, i was so angry , i was, he had my arm right, i forced, pushed him back it was, like, behind my back so i lent back thinking oh he'll give me his arms then anyway old flipping hag came in didn't she! +ah, i was so angry , i was, he had my arm right, i forced, pushed him back it was, like, behind my back so i lent back thinking oh he'll give me his arms then anyway old flipping hag came in didn't she! and i went, ha ha, just turn over the cassette! -she called me an old snout , flipping thing is right, like thing like the noise that i've +she called me an old snout , flipping thing is right, like thing like the noise that i've yeah. -i was going making like the sound was down he's singing this song and then he went and pam comes in, and she, i mean how comes then he knows her? -god, who is it the the what's it, paediatric or whatever it was? +i was going making like the sound was down he's singing this song and then he went and pam comes in, and she, i mean how comes then he knows her? +god, who is it the the what's it, paediatric or whatever it was? somebody like that, you know some doctor is at the door! who the bloody hell was that she goes? -i went out, come back in to ask and there was shrimpy, me and andrew, me and andrew come in i left the door open cav goes shut the door! +i went out, come back in to ask and there was shrimpy, me and andrew, me and andrew come in i left the door open cav goes shut the door! i said, oh is pat coming in? he said, i don't bloody care! i went ha ha! @@ -88462,7 +88394,7 @@ oh please helena will you take him for me? oh, he's such a waster, he's unbelievable! come on then, i'll take it outside with me. give it to sam in his mouth ! -yeah you should have told me i would have bought them out with me if you'd said. +yeah you should have told me i would have bought them out with me if you'd said. i didn't realise did i! shall we have one? sam, come on boy! @@ -88479,8 +88411,8 @@ fucking turds and all ! wait for the dog. i feel a right bozo oh, the dog's having a shit! -ah it was really funny though! -like, me and emma last night, honestly the first, about five minutes, like we were all, both going mm, yeah, er, ah, and then we just thought oh fuck this for an idea ! +ah it was really funny though! +like, me and emma last night, honestly the first, about five minutes, like we were all, both going mm, yeah, er, ah, and then we just thought oh fuck this for an idea ! and we just said absolutely anything! we was talking about the love bite pete gave me and everything! yeah. @@ -88502,7 +88434,7 @@ didn't you know she thought she was pregnant? no. oh piss! ah, don't say anything! -i thought, cos you said down there you said in my house you said something about being pregnant. +i thought, cos you said down there you said in my house you said something about being pregnant. no i never! yes you did! no i never! @@ -88510,32 +88442,32 @@ oh i thought you knew? have they? i've really put my foot in it now haven't i? no,whe , when did she do it with scott then? -i don't know but they must of done it sometime. +i don't know but they must of done it sometime. it weren't when, the other when we got all pissed? no, but i mean why's she think she's pregnant then? i mean, didn't they use anything for yeah! -but she well she didn't, i mean she didn't tell me the intimate details or anything i don't even know whether she has, she wo , she might have ju ge , been getting over dramatic or something! -but she but her period was a week and half late and she started well panicking! -yeah, well she -and you know , you know when we thought, yeah well she'd, she'd just come on when she came down to my house and she was really, really, really in a happy mood! -and er you know, you know when we saw them two walking +but she well she didn't, i mean she didn't tell me the intimate details or anything i don't even know whether she has, she wo , she might have ju ge , been getting over dramatic or something! +but she but her period was a week and half late and she started well panicking! +yeah, well she +and you know , you know when we thought, yeah well she'd, she'd just come on when she came down to my house and she was really, really, really in a happy mood! +and er you know, you know when we saw them two walking yeah. the other day? -that was what she was upset about she thought, oh dear,scotty's a going to be a daddy ! +that was what she was upset about she thought, oh dear,scotty's a going to be a daddy ! fucking hell,! i hope she hadn't done it that saturday when we all were outside and we watching -she might not have done it, done it but like she might have -like -like yeah. -cos you never know, i mean andrew wipe spunk all over somebody, you know! -yeah, i i should think she like she's done some done naughty things -well we all do though +she might not have done it, done it but like she might have +like +like yeah. +cos you never know, i mean andrew wipe spunk all over somebody, you know! +yeah, i i should think she like she's done some done naughty things +well we all do though and, yeah if she's given him a blow job, i mean -but i mean, she's probably done something like that and she's just got over dramatic about it! -guess what she's said she's gonna write to go on the pill! +but i mean, she's probably done something like that and she's just got over dramatic about it! +guess what she's said she's gonna write to go on the pill! did she? well not to me ! she did and she says, she goes, i wanna go on the pill while i've got the courage! @@ -88545,19 +88477,19 @@ probably! like a hangover the next day! fucking emma in a minute! but don't say anything cos i don't know! -cos she, she said it to me cos she was on such a high you see cos she'd just come on, didn't you see her last night? +cos she, she said it to me cos she was on such a high you see cos she'd just come on, didn't you see her last night? no i didn't because you oh! -stayed and andy's and we'd just gone over to the shops and . -but er yeah. -but, you see, she was on a real pardon me! +stayed and andy's and we'd just gone over to the shops and . +but er yeah. +but, you see, she was on a real pardon me! a real big high about it, she'll probably tell you. but she i know! -probably didn't wanna tell you in front of hannah and everything ! -well she rushed up today , she hugged me and ha hugged hannah , and then +probably didn't wanna tell you in front of hannah and everything ! +well she rushed up today , she hugged me and ha hugged hannah , and then yeah, well that's it's so happy about. -hu hugged er hannah ! +hu hugged er hannah ! can you just imagine though, hugging andrew, his face! oh my god! oh no! @@ -88568,8 +88500,8 @@ wait he's down the bottom. wait here, i'll catch up with him. ah there he is! -but er but er yeah, so but like, she's been saying to me cos she's been thinking about whether she is or not she er she's been like like everywhere there's babys and prams and everywhe , on the telly and everything,do you know what i mean ? -it's been really bad actually and er +but er but er yeah, so but like, she's been saying to me cos she's been thinking about whether she is or not she er she's been like like everywhere there's babys and prams and everywhe , on the telly and everything,do you know what i mean ? +it's been really bad actually and er yeah, but unless she'd done it with him she wouldn't be panicking that much! no. i bet she has. @@ -88577,14 +88509,14 @@ i mean, and she really known him for six months you know? yeah. ah dear! so that was a bit of a giggle! -so do you +so do you what? think clare will come? i don't, i doubt it, i don't think so. ah ah oh! -pity, emma's decided she's bringing a camera now and she reckons he bringing his! +pity, emma's decided she's bringing a camera now and she reckons he bringing his! and i said no fucking way you'll get any pictures of me having a bang! -and andrew goes oh, is this going to be let joanne everybody with a picture! +and andrew goes oh, is this going to be let joanne everybody with a picture! i've well it's gonna be really bad because i'm gonna be doing this and taking pictures! you're not doing it at the party? @@ -88597,44 +88529,44 @@ you'll be doing it while we're going to sleep. no way, when we all lie down fucking hell are you, no! picking up all the juicy gossip around here, you're not doing that then! -no, i won't do it then i'll do it i'll do it in the early evening when no one 's too drunk. -then a bit later, but not well don't do it when we are gonna go to sleep because cos we end ups tal talking about who's dad's got the biggest plonker! +no, i won't do it then i'll do it i'll do it in the early evening when no one 's too drunk. +then a bit later, but not well don't do it when we are gonna go to sleep because cos we end ups tal talking about who's dad's got the biggest plonker! is your, is your dog still a virgin? i know. -like, you know what, my dog's still a virgin ! +like, you know what, my dog's still a virgin ! virgin ! i always say, you're drunk that night. -so they all go and all. +so they all go and all. are they? tonight and tomorrow. oh jesus! -andy's getting eight cans of strongbow three for tonight and five for tomorrow. -i said i'd bottle of wine off my dad just for us three, that's just for us three. +andy's getting eight cans of strongbow three for tonight and five for tomorrow. +i said i'd bottle of wine off my dad just for us three, that's just for us three. oh yeah, of course! you know. -and then er we'll have that . +and then er we'll have that . you gotta ask your dad, remember, for a bottle. -no, cos a i won't be drinking it anyway it's only gonna you and emma that's drinking it! +no, cos a i won't be drinking it anyway it's only gonna you and emma that's drinking it! yes, i know! you just ask him for one! you're not gonna have a bottle each! i had a bottle and i was absolutely blabbing! and i threw up, that's how strong it is joe! oh i'll have my dad's then, she can have your dad's. -no,ha , i mean, joe like, you won't be able to handle a bottle each on top of all that other stuff! +no,ha , i mean, joe like, you won't be able to handle a bottle each on top of all that other stuff! yeah, i wannoo ya ha , joanne you're going to die of alcohol poisoning ! you're only selfish! i'm sure you're mum and dad have got a lot! oh john, he's not that close for god's sake! flipping cold ! -ooh it's not come here sam! -it's alright leave it. +ooh it's not come here sam! +it's alright leave it. oh god's it cold! that much perfume i've put on my cold sores,. he's gone.. so will i ! -and then you're dead if you undo them there ! +and then you're dead if you undo them there ! but er oh we'll forget he's ! @@ -88645,17 +88577,17 @@ well he couldn't help being a miserable sod,he looks a right miserable sod ! no! he's not a miserable sod. he probably just forgot. -i'll bring my matches when i like take the dog in i'll nip upstairs and say i've gotta get something and i'll just grab my matches out of there in case he's lost them or something! -like he probably would do! -in my book i'm gonna have to write down mark, and put in brackets all the way through he's called shrimpy. +i'll bring my matches when i like take the dog in i'll nip upstairs and say i've gotta get something and i'll just grab my matches out of there in case he's lost them or something! +like he probably would do! +in my book i'm gonna have to write down mark, and put in brackets all the way through he's called shrimpy. m out in a minute,changed. -quick +quick what? put a tape on it's like m i five or something in here . don't, no not not that -i don't believe you i swear the tape. +i don't believe you i swear the tape. what? we ain't got a tape. i can fill it in for . @@ -88664,11 +88596,11 @@ i know. er fill that in. oh sugar, i've gotta start filling all these in now. do you think that's right? -thirteenth of the third ninety two. +thirteenth of the third ninety two. what time? five past seven. seven. -redditch eh eh eh eh +redditch eh eh eh eh visiting friends. who spoke first? me wasn't it? @@ -88684,9 +88616,9 @@ do you think i ought to fill andy in quickly? he'll be the next in. yeah he will won't he? this lot'll be shrimp and he don't matter. -andy insurance clerk age? +andy insurance clerk age? nineteen. -nineteen now redditch +nineteen now redditch he doesn't call himself a clerk though. what?friend i'll tell him you're a friend, he won't believe that. @@ -88700,9 +88632,9 @@ helen nobody's coming. what? i can't get it in my pocket. do you want a piece of pasta? -you can't alright and! +you can't alright and! what you done? -i across the to get some and ended on my bollocks. +i across the to get some and ended on my bollocks. oh that's nice. that's the last time i no it isn't. @@ -88711,10 +88643,10 @@ that that smarts. that's not gonna do much. do you want a band-aid? i've got a split sac. -i've got one testicle down here somewhere and the other one's still embedded in bedroom. +i've got one testicle down here somewhere and the other one's still embedded in bedroom. what d what did you land on?bed? was it you who went bloody hell? -one of those cab yeah it was one of those +one of those cab yeah it was one of those it was really loud. it was one of those cabin beds. and erm the rim was like about that thin. @@ -88726,12 +88658,12 @@ not nice. ha!ha. mm? for a long time. -this special what was it called again? +this special what was it called again? it says on it somewhere doesn't it? dynamike dynamike how embarrassing, is that. -you go smack, straight on them. +you go smack, straight on them. yeah then i get a drill with a wire brush on it and go bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz out. okay. @@ -88743,12 +88675,12 @@ works wonders. nice. scratch. erm what drink you getting anyway? -i was gonna get well i'm contemplating but i'm either getting four cans of strongbow and a bottle or just eight cans of strongbow. +i was gonna get well i'm contemplating but i'm either getting four cans of strongbow and a bottle or just eight cans of strongbow. for tomorrow? or today? well some are for tonight as well. well you know what'll happen -if you get the that'll all be gone by tonight. +if you get the that'll all be gone by tonight. no that'll go, that'll go right through tomorrow. oh. yeah, that bppppprrrrrr @@ -88766,7 +88698,7 @@ it's n it's not ugh. it's cider. it's ugh. i prefer tesco's own myself. -oh i'm not buying that, cos it's not strong enough for me . +oh i'm not buying that, cos it's not strong enough for me . oh you man. it depends if you get the strong stuff you dipstick. i don't care what you do with my dipstick. @@ -88775,19 +88707,19 @@ don't drinking lots of cider. don't you go to band rehearsal any more? i thought you'd be at band last night. -well i was supposed to be but erm every single time they arrange it and they either tell me the wrong da well they told me the wrong day last week cos, they told me tuesd they told me it was thursday when it, when it was actually tuesday when i was getting pissed at scott's house so erm it was too late by then. +well i was supposed to be but erm every single time they arrange it and they either tell me the wrong da well they told me the wrong day last week cos, they told me tuesd they told me it was thursday when it, when it was actually tuesday when i was getting pissed at scott's house so erm it was too late by then. then they said erm there's one on sunday, oh no there isn't. and this what do you mean we didn't get pissed at scott's at all. and this didn't we? yes we did. -it was birthday last tuesday. +it was birthday last tuesday. was it? oh we weren't pissed. merry. you two were, i wasn't. -i was not was i? +i was not was i? i was . a little bit. i wasn't . @@ -88798,7 +88730,7 @@ i was not at all. i could just about hear carter in the far reaches of my mind. but erm he was i was fine. -course helena mrs hold my drink, not that i get a hangover every single time or anything. +course helena mrs hold my drink, not that i get a hangover every single time or anything. hangovers i don't! you do! @@ -88806,7 +88738,7 @@ what is a hangover? not after that i didn't. what's a hangover? shut up andy else you'll get a punch in the face. -i'm just going to +i'm just going to i bought my long sleeved carter top today. what? oh yeah. @@ -88819,14 +88751,14 @@ for my ace party. go and get it then. no. we -well i want, i wanna wear my and i can't have it till my birthday. -i'm gonna be really annoying, i'm gonna cut my jeans off half way down the shin. +well i want, i wanna wear my and i can't have it till my birthday. +i'm gonna be really annoying, i'm gonna cut my jeans off half way down the shin. no you're not! no. i am. you're not cos you're gonna look a twat. well i am a twat. -can, can i can i feel your leg ? +can, can i can i feel your leg ? go on please? easy access and. what do you want? @@ -88842,14 +88774,14 @@ you've got it matches. i remembered everything else i wanted. oh it was so funny at work today, greg fell off his chair. -packet of condoms fell out of his pocket +packet of condoms fell out of his pocket and they were ripped . -ah no he was, he, he wouldn't sit on his chair cos he'd just called me an arsehole and i goes oh sit down greg! +ah no he was, he, he wouldn't sit on his chair cos he'd just called me an arsehole and i goes oh sit down greg! i said sit down gregory and shut up. so he went to sit down but his chair weren't there. all i saw were this pair of legs sticking over the desk and him going aaaaagh! -and his condoms -and he got up and then one of the girls said hi greg dropped your johnnies. +and his condoms +and he got up and then one of the girls said hi greg dropped your johnnies. i've never seen anyone go so red in my life. how old's he? twenty three. @@ -88860,24 +88792,24 @@ maybe he doesn't want any children yet. he we he went redder than that. redder than that? is that your mum happy? -i in the bath. +i in the bath. i walked in i, i had to lock the door with the penny, walked in, got the bog roll do you realize you haven't called for emma? well done. -oh what cos that'll be alright won't it? +oh what cos that'll be alright won't it? it'll be alright. -scott come round and she'll meet us down here. +scott come round and she'll meet us down here. yeah. er? oh well -well when er when them two, when them lot go and get the stuff +well when er when them two, when them lot go and get the stuff up above the streets and houses rainbow's flying high. -everyone can see them flying in the sk oh did you see the rainbow today? +everyone can see them flying in the sk oh did you see the rainbow today? no. it was about what, four o'clock i went over tesco's did i see the rainbow? i was in it. -it was abs shut up, it was absolutely massive. +it was abs shut up, it was absolutely massive. what, in the rain? in the rain, yes. absolutely massive. @@ -88888,18 +88820,18 @@ by tesco's it was it was coming out the field. goes let's ah! rush over to see if we can find the pot of gold. -well andy is erm general errand boy for at the moment +well andy is erm general errand boy for at the moment mm. and what's your actual job? what's my job title? yeah. -is claims sorry insurance claims correspondent. +is claims sorry insurance claims correspondent. insurance clerk. no, not clerk. oh. i'm not a clerk thank you. -no i'm a claim correspondent. +no i'm a claim correspondent. well if someone asks you what we, what you do i deal with claims. oh. @@ -88922,16 +88854,16 @@ how much do you get paid a year? just to be nosy like, you know. six thousand. is that all? -so you can give away more than they, they gi than they pay you ? +so you can give away more than they, they gi than they pay you ? for what i do my, my pay is shit. pardon ? really. i'd tell them where to go. well shrimpy's on twice as much as i am. -you can't tell anything when you've +you can't tell anything when you've well all he got a car. -and anyway all he does is spring inspect springs. +and anyway all he does is spring inspect springs. and people wonder why i've got no money. mm. people why, wonder why i've got no money. @@ -88940,7 +88872,7 @@ oh that sounds really good. oh god, is hannah singing? tell her to sit on that and swivel three times. better make sure she wiped her arse properly first. -oh, oh dear oh dear . +oh, oh dear oh dear . what ? come here. what ? @@ -88954,14 +88886,14 @@ it's no good quibbling. i wanna be famous. i'll ask, i'll i'll ask h i'll tell him afterwards i wanna be famous he'll say. -but it'll sound really awful if i i tell him now. +but it'll sound really awful if i i tell him now. tell him at the end of the week. mm. if he don't like it i can record over it but no you won't. i know you. you're nasty-pasty aren't you? -no if he, if he really doesn't like it then i'll oh dear +no if he, if he really doesn't like it then i'll oh dear just tell him the truth. there it is, there it is. mm mm @@ -88981,7 +88913,7 @@ they look like they're on something. yeah, so? they probably are . they're on the stage for singing. -yeah but, right, they're on drugs i reckon. +yeah but, right, they're on drugs i reckon. so? so andy doesn't like any such thing do you and? i don't. @@ -89004,47 +88936,47 @@ you can say it as loud as you like jo. i know, i don't want to say it as loud as i like. go on, you shout it. open the door. -there we are there's no-one in there. +there we are there's no-one in there. it wasn't exactly a joke was it now andy? -it didn't make anybody laugh because it was funny -you both laughed when i shut the door. +it didn't make anybody laugh because it was funny +you both laughed when i shut the door. no it's just cos you're a twat -yes it's vagina. +yes it's vagina. we know. -see the tufts of hair spring out and the clitoris bulge. +see the tufts of hair spring out and the clitoris bulge. shut up. -no i know but -it should be quite +no i know but +it should be quite what are you looking at him like that for? what? -that to you dunnit? +that to you dunnit? what? no. listen to it. yeah, it's dynamic. bit louder cos it's to drown you out. -andy andy andy andy how could you? +andy andy andy andy how could you? what? how could i what? what, bought that? what? have i what? -well one, how could you have bought that and two, how could you let her drone through it like that? +well one, how could you have bought that and two, how could you let her drone through it like that? well oh. i bought that cos it's good. nobody wants to listen to it,. well you did. -i could imagine +i could imagine it's fun. get hours of pleasure out of this. -what are you complaining about? +what are you complaining about? you would have gone out and bought it. no i wouldn't. -well dynamike +well dynamike mm? -she plays on yours all the time about her, your dynamike +she plays on yours all the time about her, your dynamike mm. mm mm mm mm. @@ -89074,15 +89006,15 @@ alright i love you then you can . alright we'll we'll arm wrestle we'll arm wrestle no cos i can ar you can arm wrestle, i can't. -that's your for being such a all day. +that's your for being such a all day. come on home laura got done for skiving yesterday, they all went to pam's house. skived tuesday wednesday thursday off. -lisa got caught -her mum saw her and she laura and erm to get caught. +lisa got caught +her mum saw her and she laura and erm to get caught. that's mine. though. -mrs wasn't there. +mrs wasn't there. how many ? what ? don't! @@ -89093,7 +89025,7 @@ i know it's on. i'm recording you. are you? yeah. -er maybe, hold that a minute jo. +er maybe, hold that a minute jo. maybe i'd better tell you what this is all about. she's getting a twenty five pound voucher for doing this from marks and spencers. what? @@ -89113,13 +89045,13 @@ get out. i could sue you for that. i know. no. -no she'd record over it if she didn't +no she'd record over it if she didn't no but you see i couldn't tell you at the start because you'd sound, you wouldn't have said half the things you did say. i would. and you've gotta, you've gotta like talk totally normally you see. never normal -yeah on there -no but you normal for you +yeah on there +no but you normal for you i wanna hear it. i wanna hear it. what, what is it @@ -89131,14 +89063,14 @@ except you've gone in as ins insurance clerk cos we couldn't, we couldn't decide oh! that's really gonna cock things up innit? an insurance clerk yeah -yeah you've got all the you know a condom dropped out of his pocket and everything +yeah you've got all the you know a condom dropped out of his pocket and everything oh good. i bet you feel ace. don't tell shrimpy, we -did i say on there? +did i say on there? yeah. -insurance er -no do no it's it's it's totally +insurance er +no do no it's it's it's totally that's me. it's erm it's totally anonymous anyway. but like they're just doing a survey @@ -89146,13 +89078,13 @@ where did you get that from? it's a bloke come round. a bloke came round and gave it all me. and i've got -cos they got to her house first cheat +cos they got to her house first cheat i've gotta tape all my conversations for a week. and like keep it and run off. what? -no i -like tomorrow night +no i +like tomorrow night oh yeah! i, i had to sign a bit of paper. we'll be arseholed. @@ -89169,7 +89101,7 @@ alright emma? he just found out. found out about what? nothing -aha +aha oh well how are you doing then scott my friend? oh alright, just about. now did you see it last night? @@ -89177,27 +89109,27 @@ what? no. me and emma were talking you know i'm babysitting on wednesdays? -upstairs for ages and we +upstairs for ages and we you taped it? no. -i can't believe it, i've been slagging off for the three weeks this is crap, this is really naff. +i can't believe it, i've been slagging off for the three weeks this is crap, this is really naff. last night -so you babysit wednesday ? +so you babysit wednesday ? yeah. remember i've got the equivalent of high graphic b s e? -she's going a-raving in a red red and white checked dress with a big floppy hat with pigtails and this little glove puppet penguin called mr flipper +she's going a-raving in a red red and white checked dress with a big floppy hat with pigtails and this little glove puppet penguin called mr flipper every wednesday is it emm? yeah. and it was so stupid . bridge. playing bridge for some . eh? -well erm someone fell off a chair to +well erm someone fell off a chair to it was you again? what? it was you again was it? -no it wasn't me -oh by the way scott +no it wasn't me +oh by the way scott don't tell him. alright. nothing. @@ -89208,7 +89140,7 @@ oh dumb! don't tell him. thank you. we all are. -oh good job i wasn't +oh good job i wasn't no if you know you don't talk normally. he's just been telling us about how this bloke's condoms dropped out of his pocket. yeah i said @@ -89230,8 +89162,8 @@ andrew insurance clerk cos it's ano i cos it's anonymous it's anonymous. anonymous it is. -anonymous -cos on once it leaves me they don't know who it is. +anonymous +cos on once it leaves me they don't know who it is. they just get the book and they get all the tapes. well i told them what it is now, insurance p l c all the claims come in . @@ -89240,10 +89172,10 @@ claims to be the pervert. yeah. like we were last night. you're not suppose except we did . -we yeah +we yeah well that's really taking the whole thing seriously. the only, see the first thing i noticed -the first thing i noticed about you when you walked in was you'd got, you'd got that's on the top of my eyes by the way, not the bottom because of our +the first thing i noticed about you when you walked in was you'd got, you'd got that's on the top of my eyes by the way, not the bottom because of our something. i was listening to it t oh i've got a letter for you . because i was writing it in r e @@ -89251,7 +89183,7 @@ yeah, you owe me a letter. who? you wrote me a letter thursday as well. -cos went up there on purpose emma. +cos went up there on purpose emma. cos i phoned you emma? and you said you had a letter. @@ -89267,8 +89199,8 @@ thursday. yeah i know but i weren't gonna give it you. they're strange aren't they? well why do you think we kept turning the music down?? -no it's just that you come in my house, fine. -you can record my voice, fine but you turn me music down +no it's just that you come in my house, fine. +you can record my voice, fine but you turn me music down yeah . you're that's why i did it see? @@ -89288,55 +89220,55 @@ bung bungle had his sun hat on he was dead sexy you should have seen it. one missing it were really good it were. -and talking of did you hear my song? -my one -yeah please please don't -under a tree people are making the rubber johnnies +and talking of did you hear my song? +my one +yeah please please don't +under a tree people are making the rubber johnnies oh god, no not this. -red ones, yellow ones take your pick it all depends on the length of your dick or prick . +red ones, yellow ones take your pick it all depends on the length of your dick or prick . or prick was my little ending. -cos i thought i was cool +cos i thought i was cool you'll have to speak up now everybody. i watched the end of the video. on one thing that really drives me mad about carter. why does he rest his nose on the microphone? yeah. our house -she thought you said knobs. -why does he rest his knob on the microphone ? -perhaps his name's -no, he wasn't on about knobs, on about +she thought you said knobs. +why does he rest his knob on the microphone ? +perhaps his name's +no, he wasn't on about knobs, on about oh. gonna say yeah. -gonna say you know my mum put that bloody card up don't you? +gonna say you know my mum put that bloody card up don't you? what card? the one you sent me. oh did she? -the card . -i just left all my cards in a pile that night cos i was a bit +the card . +i just left all my cards in a pile that night cos i was a bit were you? -and erm and the ne oh oh about two days later i'm looking at them oh on the mantelpiece i better +and erm and the ne oh oh about two days later i'm looking at them oh on the mantelpiece i better i can't move it cos it'll be conspicuous by it's absence did she laugh? i dunno, she just put it up. i thought it was good. mr bulge. yeah. -so no-one saw mr bean's i wanna be elected? -you know on er on monday? +so no-one saw mr bean's i wanna be elected? +you know on er on monday? he goes oh shit yeah of course 8 this is a quiet bit, just talk amongst yourselves. don't talk to it because it ma it sounds stu i was listening to us this morning. piss on my grave! -i was just going i was listen i was listening +i was just going i was listen i was listening you , i'll urinate. -i was listening to the end bit, i was saying what were we about at the end. +i was listening to the end bit, i was saying what were we about at the end. is, is shrimpy coming or what? yeah he is. let's, let's shake this. yeah. -i can hear your penny shaking in there ha ha ha and i was listening oh jesus . +i can hear your penny shaking in there ha ha ha and i was listening oh jesus . what's the matter? that could be him now. yippee. @@ -89359,9 +89291,9 @@ when i came down earlier and now it's er gone. shrimpy whoops. er no -whoops whoops quarter past six. -excuse me but a ninety pound deal sort of like knocked the stuffing out of me for -yeah but you were supposed to put it in last night, not this morning. +whoops whoops quarter past six. +excuse me but a ninety pound deal sort of like knocked the stuffing out of me for +yeah but you were supposed to put it in last night, not this morning. can i have them now ? i haven't got it. you haven't got them? @@ -89371,14 +89303,14 @@ why? said you're not starting fires again are you? i said oh yeah watch me start a fire. -oh boots. +oh boots. can you get me some of them boots? yeah. pardon? can you get it? i haven't had one yet oh ch -i'm getting +i'm getting what? i don't know what's happening. i'm just gonna get @@ -89389,19 +89321,19 @@ it could have been. that ninety pound bill was painful, i can tell you that much. what ninety pound bill for what? i hit my car on the kerb. -the wheel had a bulge in it, i went to have it fixed and the +the wheel had a bulge in it, i went to have it fixed and the i'm alright thank you. good. i don't believe that. what? -you've only had that car a fortnight and you've already done about five hundred about four hundred and fifty pound worth of damage. +you've only had that car a fortnight and you've already done about five hundred about four hundred and fifty pound worth of damage. who's fault is it? oh no look it was the invisible man driving the car. it's all my fault. -you had that allegro +you had that allegro three hundred and fifty pounds worth. not my fault, it was the, the other driver's fault. -well it was. +well it was. yes, exactly. i was just right we're going out, come on. @@ -89411,23 +89343,23 @@ our house and how are you andy? you're looking jolly. yes, good. -did you switch it on last night? +did you switch it on last night? you know when it was going really weird? yeah, then i turned it off. what did you switch it on for? to record. cos everybody was talking. -don't tomorrow. +don't tomorrow. what you writing? only a letter. ah -ah aha! +ah aha! well it's got my name in it! so? so? yeah so, you don't need to know do you? oh thanks. -and i'm only putting helena and emma were talking to each other on the bus. +and i'm only putting helena and emma were talking to each other on the bus. that's all i've put. well just tell him i'm not getting involved with it, alright? i know, he never said you was. @@ -89440,18 +89372,18 @@ it's your party. alright i will. i wonder if pete will come tonight? dunno. -sh when er when emma told me that erm richard said that they probably weren't going to tramps i was, i was walking around going oh boo hoo boo hoo i'm so sad all the time going oh boo hoo boo hoo +sh when er when emma told me that erm richard said that they probably weren't going to tramps i was, i was walking around going oh boo hoo boo hoo i'm so sad all the time going oh boo hoo boo hoo oh don't look at my letter. i saw you you crafty sod . -and and er scott kept going what you doing? +and and er scott kept going what you doing? i was going nothing, i'm just being sad. boooo hoooo . it was really funny. -oh i was laughing all still dream of love oh dear. +oh i was laughing all still dream of love oh dear. i'm so tired . that was i'm so tired. -and who can say begin . -responsibilities +and who can say begin . +responsibilities that's very nice. what? bastards. @@ -89459,19 +89391,19 @@ have you only just noticed? all the times i've played it, have you only just noticed? my mum hasn't even noticed yet. i were playing it really really loud this morning. -i had mine on this morning and er but she was out anyway. +i had mine on this morning and er but she was out anyway. my mum nearly said shit yesterday,a nervous breakdown. -she goes er she goes ssshhhh no i'd better not say that since, seeing as you're in. +she goes er she goes ssshhhh no i'd better not say that since, seeing as you're in. i goes mum i've heard it all before! for goodness sake. i don't know what she thinks i am. you know, someone, you know? i'm not a flipping nun am i? i've just finished. -lovely i'm so pleased. +lovely i'm so pleased. for long are you? about five days. -i was blinded what time are we gonna chuck them out tonight? +i was blinded what time are we gonna chuck them out tonight? dunno. half one? if you like, i'm not bothered. @@ -89484,10 +89416,10 @@ a g a g r double e d. r e e d yeah. it was just the d that was wrong. -oh dear i'm really really really really really looking forward to it. +oh dear i'm really really really really really looking forward to it. not that you can tell or anything. i can't get anything out in the crossword, i've only got thirst. -first guardian citizen don't know. +first guardian citizen don't know. heavenly. don't know. how do you spell saw as in looked? @@ -89505,16 +89437,16 @@ no. but it must be mustn't it? oh aye. what's that? -fifteen seventeen ninety two? +fifteen seventeen ninety two? suppose so. didn't think they had shops in them days. oh yeah jo. only joking . -oh two hours left, ha ha ha. +oh two hours left, ha ha ha. bye bye mummy and daddy. watch me weep. cheek . -not cheek cheek but cheek as in cheek, you know? +not cheek cheek but cheek as in cheek, you know? it's just spelt the same. how do you spell it? c h.. double e k. @@ -89527,26 +89459,26 @@ spell it . have you seen my nail file? no. can't find anything in this room, it's so messy. -scott then had the cheek to tell me what can i put, good luck? +scott then had the cheek to tell me what can i put, good luck? yeah. -cheek to tell me good luck. +cheek to tell me good luck. wish me good luck it should be. got any tippex? please. -er no, just cross it out. +er no, just cross it out. no i wanna keep it neat. it's one of these important letters. oh never mind it doesn't really matter. -no in your bag . +no in your bag . is it? -god you lazy sod. -i'm gonna, i'm gonna get scott tonight if he makes any comments and this fist is gonna go strop straight where it hurts. +god you lazy sod. +i'm gonna, i'm gonna get scott tonight if he makes any comments and this fist is gonna go strop straight where it hurts. he's just got me mad now telling me to good luck. -he really has, he's got me really aaaah! +he really has, he's got me really aaaah! oh, where's my nail file gone? god this tippex stiff enough? yeah. -andrew i said something about stiff right, and he goes what? +andrew i said something about stiff right, and he goes what? i goes i didn't mean it like that. can you un o can you undo it?turn it? oh @@ -89558,21 +89490,21 @@ i always get ti ugh it's all over your face, tippex. is it? oh never mind. he has got me annoyed now, he really has done. -oh dear -yesterday meaning when you come -er think i'll put a bit of beatles on. +oh dear +yesterday meaning when you come +er think i'll put a bit of beatles on. oh no. emma said i'm in a beatles mood. -i'm telling him all about it now, emma said she doesn't need it +i'm telling him all about it now, emma said she doesn't need it what? good luck. oh. -and i replied shrimpy's fine aha -nail file +and i replied shrimpy's fine aha +nail file shrimpy's fine. -he phoned me this morning this morning and put and he's alright. -love love me do you know i love you +he phoned me this morning this morning and put and he's alright. +love love me do you know i love you you'll start writing that if you're not careful. what? cos if i sing, when i'm doing my homework if i sing along to a tape or something i start writing the words down. @@ -89582,24 +89514,24 @@ oh. we left them oh that's the letter shrimpy se sent me. oh right. -left them and said we left them and said +left them and said we left them and said he had such a go at me for showing it my mum. -anyway we left them and and said +anyway we left them and and said whoops. -i said come to mine at four. -somebody new oh. +i said come to mine at four. +somebody new oh. right, that's all my clothes put away. scott makes -love me do -any comments tonight -please me do +love me do +any comments tonight +please me do he's getting it in the gones. you love scott really. i don't. how do you spell i'm going you spell gones? -g o n e g o n e s +g o n e g o n e s gones that is. gon gon double o? no cos you spell gonad g o n a d. @@ -89610,69 +89542,69 @@ a a d s yeah. gonads. -as he is an interfering what's the word when you say he thinks he's perfect and he's mister hard man? +as he is an interfering what's the word when you say he thinks he's perfect and he's mister hard man? big head? -interfering big head -overprotect protect protective bastard. +interfering big head +overprotect protect protective bastard. oh you're not gonna start a massive argument tonight are you jo? no. no, i'm just telling the truth what i think of him. -er although +er although you're such a good singer. so? i don't care. -so helena wishes that there will be no arguments or slanging, slagging matches is it slanging or slagging off? +so helena wishes that there will be no arguments or slanging, slagging matches is it slanging or slagging off? slanging. -slanging matches don't worry there won't be, i'll just hit him. +slanging matches don't worry there won't be, i'll just hit him. won't be as after i've give him one he won't be able to move. oh i'm looking forward to tonight so much now. so am i. -joanne please don't start a massive argument. -i've give him one he won't be able to move let alone talk. +joanne please don't start a massive argument. +i've give him one he won't be able to move let alone talk. your letters look nice and neat, mine are always scraggy, i can never understand them. -dear helena, i don't really rea really know how to put this but i've had i'll have a go. +dear helena, i don't really rea really know how to put this but i've had i'll have a go. i'm sorry about being in a mood on saturday but i wasn't really in a mood with you. -i'll now tol t no i know i told you that i was that i was feeling +i'll now tol t no i know i told you that i was that i was feeling that, that's -sorry for someone not emma or +sorry for someone not emma or he's done a sentence wrong there. one like that . yeah. i care for emma more than i can say but i also care for you and i'm really sorry if you were hurt. at the moment everyone has been talking about other people behind people's backs. -i didn't tell you what emma thought because i don't is that a blank page? +i didn't tell you what emma thought because i don't is that a blank page? yeah. -i don't think a person told i don't think a person told to apologize isn't rea really an apology so i think there must be a reason why you didn't and so told me on sunday why you didn't . +i don't think a person told i don't think a person told to apologize isn't rea really an apology so i think there must be a reason why you didn't and so told me on sunday why you didn't . what a load of waffle. oh i know, he just waffles. -i was going to apologize for being stupid on sunday when you both disappeared. +i was going to apologize for being stupid on sunday when you both disappeared. me and andy looked all over, looked for both of you. -last night i had a few things on my mind to be able to apologize. +last night i had a few things on my mind to be able to apologize. i'm sorry and hope we can still be friends . -i read it and i just went what! for a start and then -i went, and then i went well he can't have looked around for us too well because we were walking by the side of the road. -but yeah he probably come past no he probably went up there as we come down that corner by erm ipsleigh and when they come back we'd probably gotten here by then. +i read it and i just went what! for a start and then +i went, and then i went well he can't have looked around for us too well because we were walking by the side of the road. +but yeah he probably come past no he probably went up there as we come down that corner by erm ipsleigh and when they come back we'd probably gotten here by then. but we, i mean we were walking by the side of the road all the way up greenlands drive. what did i say, scott then had the cheek to something me? wish me, that was it wasn't it? scott's not your best friend at the moment then? oh you may not have, you may have gathered that like anyway. -erm enough enough of slagging slagging the little shit i think +erm enough enough of slagging slagging the little shit i think the little shit . shit stirrer. no, yes, shit ? -i think that's, i think that's good actually stirrer, how do you spell stirrer? +i think that's, i think that's good actually stirrer, how do you spell stirrer? s t double r s t i double r e r. that was all. -stirrer and on to more important business, i think that sounds quite good actually, important right at the bottom of the page business drink +stirrer and on to more important business, i think that sounds quite good actually, important right at the bottom of the page business drink drink? will you go with him and get it? yeah. -drink erm can you, what time is it? +drink erm can you, what time is it? half one. -can you come to +can you come to ? no. oh i'm surprised. @@ -89680,14 +89612,14 @@ he's had his hair cut this morning, reckons on having it cut short, really short i said don't shrimp ooh. i said it looks nice as it is and i don't know if he will or not, i forgot to ask him on the phone. -can you come to helena's at seven forty five pardon me and +can you come to helena's at seven forty five pardon me and er isn't it? -i don't expect scott and emma will come in your car but i would just go with you if that's okay. +i don't expect scott and emma will come in your car but i would just go with you if that's okay. don't let anyone listen to this tape. why? -cos it's got all me reading this out all about scott hasn't it? +cos it's got all me reading this out all about scott hasn't it? jo no-one listens to my tapes anyway. -no i mean like you know? +no i mean like you know? emma and scott? yeah. course i won't! @@ -89695,20 +89627,20 @@ well er on their walkman, on the earphones. mm. yeah yeah yeah go with you if that's okay. -helena reckons she will chuck you all out +helena reckons she will chuck you all out no i'll chu i tell you, i'll chuck him and scott out if they both start. no i'm not on about that i'm on about lea chucking them out at one o'clock. ah. half one -at one thirty am +at one thirty am -ish -ish one thirty am-ish, there we go. depending on what we're doing. -hold your hand +hold your hand no i'm only i'll ask him if he knows whether pete's coming. -coming tonight, not in a sperm way. -not in a sperm way +coming tonight, not in a sperm way. +not in a sperm way sperm way? i'm being really funny there. wasn't that funny? @@ -89716,66 +89648,66 @@ ha ha. oh it was hilarious. i thought it was quite good for me actually. you laughed so just shut up. -it's such a feeling that my love i can't hide, i can't hide, i can't hide +it's such a feeling that my love i can't hide, i can't hide, i can't hide that my love i can't hide, i can't hide, i can't hide . bring this down so we can listen to this. yeah you got that something . is, yeah you're a good old beatles fan you are jo. i want to get down and boogie, do that head bashing like we did at that gig. -oh jo -wanna hold your hand, i wanna hold your hand, i wanna hold your hand mm mm mm mm mm mm i feel happy inside -i feel happy inside -feeling that my love i can't hide well blooming er what's his name, julian won't disappear will he cos liz isn't here. +oh jo +wanna hold your hand, i wanna hold your hand, i wanna hold your hand mm mm mm mm mm mm i feel happy inside +i feel happy inside +feeling that my love i can't hide well blooming er what's his name, julian won't disappear will he cos liz isn't here. no. i'm not disappearing all night anyway. -i'll put erm i'll tell you now shit, is that how you spell now? +i'll put erm i'll tell you now shit, is that how you spell now? it's not it's know innit? what? that's know, now is n o w. i always do that. i always put k's in front of it,always forget. -i think i've done it further actually. +i think i've done it further actually. well further behind actually. -i can't hide, i can't hide i think i put new actually. -and i'll kiss you tomorrow i'll miss you -you tomorrow i'll miss you remember i'll aaaaaggghhh +i can't hide, i can't hide i think i put new actually. +and i'll kiss you tomorrow i'll miss you +you tomorrow i'll miss you remember i'll aaaaaggghhh always be true and then while i'm away while i'm away i'll write home every day -i'll write alright!every day +i'll write alright!every day and i'll send all my loving to you -and i'll send all my loving to you i knew that bit. +and i'll send all my loving to you i knew that bit. i'll pretend that i'm kissing -pretend that i'm kissing alright then -the lips i am missing and your dreams will come true -lips i am missing i like this one. +pretend that i'm kissing alright then +the lips i am missing and your dreams will come true +lips i am missing i like this one. have to put this on tomorrow night if pete ain't here. if pete isn't here? -i'm away write home every day +i'm away write home every day there's still gonna be music on even if pete can't . no this song i meant. loving to you what do you mean, if pete isn't here? lips that i'm missing. -loving i will send to you have to tell him we're boogieing away. -we are -all my loving +loving i will send to you have to tell him we're boogieing away. +we are +all my loving boo how do you spell boogieing? is it b b double o alright i know, i don't wanna s oh put, i'll put bogying i know me. -boogieing away to -bogying -yeah beatles what was this one called?tomorrow i'll miss you +boogieing away to +bogying +yeah beatles what was this one called?tomorrow i'll miss you erm and remember i'll always be true -it's erm oh damn! +it's erm oh damn! don't matter. yeah boogieing away to the beatles, they are ace. all my loving. alright. -and we are going to listen to them tonight. +and we are going to listen to them tonight. so tough shit so tough shit . ooh an hour and a half @@ -89783,120 +89715,120 @@ i think that'll do. boo hoo bye mummy and daddy. god you're counting! i am. -helena is counting the minutes -until mummy and daddy ha ha are going. +helena is counting the minutes +until mummy and daddy ha ha are going. her mummy mummy and daddy, ha ha ha, childish . -and daddy love -if you could have just seen yourself then, you leapt up +and daddy love +if you could have just seen yourself then, you leapt up till her mummy and daddy go -buy you diamond ring my friend if it makes you feel alright i'd get you everything my friend if it makes you feel alright i don't care too much for money, money can't buy me love -ring my friend if it makes you feel alright it's ace if you just sit down and listen to the old beatles isn't it?feel alright i don't care too much for money, money can't be me love can't be me love +buy you diamond ring my friend if it makes you feel alright i'd get you everything my friend if it makes you feel alright i don't care too much for money, money can't buy me love +ring my friend if it makes you feel alright it's ace if you just sit down and listen to the old beatles isn't it?feel alright i don't care too much for money, money can't be me love can't be me love say you love me too anyway i may not have a lot to give but what i've got i'll give to you good luck i don't care too much for money, money can't buy me love, buy me love -but you need it i don't -everybody tells me so oh i'm such a good singer, ha ha ha +but you need it i don't +everybody tells me so oh i'm such a good singer, ha ha ha anyway good luck you need it i don't -no no no no -no in fact don't worry about +no no no no +no in fact don't worry about i wouldn't let anyone else find that letter if i were you. -don't worry about scott's how do you spell opin oh opinions, right +don't worry about scott's how do you spell opin oh opinions, right o p i n i o n s i know. if my mum finds it i'm dead. basically. basically. -love don't want that pound back squirm. -oh god piece of paper now. -no diamond rings and i'll be satisfied that money just can't buy -that money just can't buy -i don't care too much for money money can't buy me love love love can't buy me love +love don't want that pound back squirm. +oh god piece of paper now. +no diamond rings and i'll be satisfied that money just can't buy +that money just can't buy +i don't care too much for money money can't buy me love love love can't buy me love oh dear oh dear oh me. -it's only half well twenty to two and i'm blooming tired. +it's only half well twenty to two and i'm blooming tired. i want to go to bed. -god you're such a lazy have you got an envelope? +god you're such a lazy have you got an envelope? no. only cos then if we sent them nobody's gonna likely to spot it. please, you must have an envelope somewhere. and i've been working and i've been working -like a dog, it's been a hard day's night boom boom boom boom sleeping hope they don't come too early, although then we'll, i can just leave a note. -that you do will make me feel alright ta. -work all day money -work all day to get your oh talk of the devil, richard 's out there. +like a dog, it's been a hard day's night boom boom boom boom sleeping hope they don't come too early, although then we'll, i can just leave a note. +that you do will make me feel alright ta. +work all day money +work all day to get your oh talk of the devil, richard 's out there. ha your lover! oh i, i was so frightened yesterday when he came round. -he were just made me laugh come on then i'll just come out with you, in the garden. +he were just made me laugh come on then i'll just come out with you, in the garden. and i come out he goes oh it's cold i'm just gonna get me coat, i'll be back in a minute -ooh he's dead creepy though isn't he? +ooh he's dead creepy though isn't he? yeah. he's alright though. i know he's alright but no problems. -he kep i was laying there and i was just dropping off to sleep, i was oh it was , and he, in h in he waltzes oh i, he, i, he goes what you doing in here? +he kep i was laying there and i was just dropping off to sleep, i was oh it was , and he, in h in he waltzes oh i, he, i, he goes what you doing in here? i goes what the hell's it look like, i'm going to sleep! -he goes he goes you can't go to sleep, and he sat on the edge of my bed for about quarter of an hour. +he goes he goes you can't go to sleep, and he sat on the edge of my bed for about quarter of an hour. your bed. what do you mean your bed ? you was on andrew's. ooh ah -well i was only going to sleep jo , i wasn't doing anything, i'm just tired. +well i was only going to sleep jo , i wasn't doing anything, i'm just tired. oh i can't put it in there, it's not going to fit. things that you do will make me feel alright -and like he just, he just sat there and it was, ooh it was so creepy. -and like i thought i'm not gonna look up in case he goes for me or something, so i just kept my head in the pillow and pretended the light was blinding me oh ha ha cos when i get you alone what? +and like he just, he just sat there and it was, ooh it was so creepy. +and like i thought i'm not gonna look up in case he goes for me or something, so i just kept my head in the pillow and pretended the light was blinding me oh ha ha cos when i get you alone what? in their car. what? -home +home what's the matter? -i don't think holding me tight tight +i don't think holding me tight tight can see me tonight can't you? ah you are going to be so arsed, it's going to be so funny. -i won't be that bad, i won't have any ci er get one gotta get some, have to now cos we're not gonna have any. -i doubt if i'm gonna get phyllis is there. -phyllis and johnnie . -i call them but it's not, it's . +i won't be that bad, i won't have any ci er get one gotta get some, have to now cos we're not gonna have any. +i doubt if i'm gonna get phyllis is there. +phyllis and johnnie . +i call them but it's not, it's . oh i've got a sore knee ooh it's no wonder! i've got fluid on it, it hurts. ooh well you go to sleep bef when they've gone, when they go out yeah, have a bit of a kip for a bit can't i? -i doubt if erm we'll be down here before she goes up to mine i don't reckon. +i doubt if erm we'll be down here before she goes up to mine i don't reckon. when? yeah she is, she's dropping in -for after, after mum and dad go have the hand slapping and the yeah they've gone! +for after, after mum and dad go have the hand slapping and the yeah they've gone! anyway i wanna have a bit of a talk to her. what about? well about all this business with shrimpy. yeah but you, you must admit shrimpy's trying his damn hardest. -i, i, i mean i don't know, i wasn't there for half the things she was talking about last night, i mean i was upstairs for three quarters of an hour trying to go to sleep +i, i, i mean i don't know, i wasn't there for half the things she was talking about last night, i mean i was upstairs for three quarters of an hour trying to go to sleep yeah well i mean i was there and all they did was they didn't say anything to each other, in the same room, just acted totally normally but didn't say anything to each other . shrimpy's trying his flipping nice to try and let this drop and just . -we all know he still fancies her he's just trying to, you know keep it he's just trying to forget it and try and act as normal as possible with her and hopefully things will get back to be back to what, what they were. +we all know he still fancies her he's just trying to, you know keep it he's just trying to forget it and try and act as normal as possible with her and hopefully things will get back to be back to what, what they were. but flipping scott, mister interferior interferior ? yeah interferer. -flipping no, it really annoys me that does. -they're always going on about how much shrimpy gets other people involved and can't stick up for himself aren't they? -and bloody scott runs rushing off and thinks he's mister hard man. +flipping no, it really annoys me that does. +they're always going on about how much shrimpy gets other people involved and can't stick up for himself aren't they? +and bloody scott runs rushing off and thinks he's mister hard man. what sort of things are you gonna say anyway? -well i'm just gonna, i'm just gonna say that joanne's a bit worried about shrimpy which is true +well i'm just gonna, i'm just gonna say that joanne's a bit worried about shrimpy which is true yeah. you know? -and i'm just gonna say you know, i think it would be better if scott didn't rush in like that, you know? +and i'm just gonna say you know, i think it would be better if scott didn't rush in like that, you know? i can understand why he did it, to be quite honest. -yeah but you say to her that they're always on about how s shrimpy can't do anything for himself, and it's between emma, it's not between it was al even scott said to me at the beginning oh it's not between me, it's nothing to do with me, it's between emma and scott. +yeah but you say to her that they're always on about how s shrimpy can't do anything for himself, and it's between emma, it's not between it was al even scott said to me at the beginning oh it's not between me, it's nothing to do with me, it's between emma and scott. emma and shrimpy. emma and shrimpy then. -and erm he's been, then he rushes ahead full storm don't he? +and erm he's been, then he rushes ahead full storm don't he? mm. he shouldn't have done that really, he was a bit naughty. -he,sh she ought to learn to sh she's, they was all on about how shrimpy can't stick up for himself, and then flaming emma does exactly the same but worse cos she gets scott to do it for her. +he,sh she ought to learn to sh she's, they was all on about how shrimpy can't stick up for himself, and then flaming emma does exactly the same but worse cos she gets scott to do it for her. she's gonna have to one of these, i'm not being funny but she can't stick up for herself, that girl can't. it's about time she had the courage to do it, herself if she's in a strop. there's no point getting scott, cos what's gonna happen when she finishes with scott? @@ -89905,26 +89837,26 @@ oh as you've probably gathered. oh i need your love babe what's this? -yes i know it's true erm +yes i know it's true erm where's the tape? -hold me love me hold me love me you +hold me love me hold me love me you what was this af what was it after? what's just been on? -hold me love me eight days -what -a week this is love me ain't got nothing but love babe +hold me love me eight days +what +a week this is love me ain't got nothing but love babe it's not on here, eight da oh yeah it is. eight days a week and i love her no i mean i feel fine, ticket to ride and yesterday, oh yes! i like them. -help i need somebody that's on side b. +help i need somebody that's on side b. can we sing the song we're on! yeah alright. we've got you all the time whoa whoa hold me i like daytripper as well. love me -michelle michelle +michelle michelle michelle paperback writer's good as well. eleanor rigby and yellow submar i like all of them really. @@ -89940,12 +89872,12 @@ yeah well you can't expect me to be perfect all the time. no yeah, just follow my example. flipping heck! no. -you was in a right moody the other day when i told you +you was in a right moody the other day when i told you when? when? what? when? -when you showed +when you showed when i went a bit mad . well, stupid fool. he isn't a stupid fool! @@ -89953,8 +89885,8 @@ leave him alone. i'm sticking up for the little bless him. eight days a week well he's done a lot for me really, hasn't he really? -he takes me and picks me up from school and takes us where we wanna go you know, off to the shop, off to here, off to get some get some drink and takes us for a drive and -yeah i mean he's mm he's +he takes me and picks me up from school and takes us where we wanna go you know, off to the shop, off to here, off to get some get some drink and takes us for a drive and +yeah i mean he's mm he's he's a do anything for anybody sort of person isn't he? bless him. i've got a dead itchy back, oh! @@ -89974,7 +89906,7 @@ don't know whether clare's coming or not yet. and having a laugh. well you'd better phone her up. i said phone me if you're coming but don't bother if you're not so it looks like she's not. -oh well if she turns up does she know where you live? +oh well if she turns up does she know where you live? she does doesn't she? well yeah, she can find it. what's this? @@ -89984,17 +89916,17 @@ no. alright then. oh why? -just gone the road with bev! +just gone the road with bev! she said so can we turn it up a bit? no cos it'll drown the microphone. oh! -i feel fine let me flare my nostrils. +i feel fine let me flare my nostrils. unless we can turn it off for a bit. she said so no. no, why not? -i'm in love with her and i feel fine afterwards it's only -i'm so glad that she's my little girl she's so glad she's telling all the world that her baby buys her things you know -so glad that she's my little girl she's so glad she's telling all the world bleagh -he buys her diamond rings you know, she said so +i'm in love with her and i feel fine afterwards it's only +i'm so glad that she's my little girl she's so glad she's telling all the world that her baby buys her things you know +so glad that she's my little girl she's so glad she's telling all the world bleagh +he buys her diamond rings you know, she said so